Episode 309-Legalizing Self Defense in NJ

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Gun Lawyer — Episode 309 Transcript

SUMMARY KEYWORDS

Gun rights, Lawsuit, Self-defense, Second Amendment, New Jersey, Weapon ban, Case law, Bruen case, Legal litigation, Arms ban, Knife rights, Stun guns, Slingshots, Media censorship, Expungement

SPEAKERS

Evan Nappen, Teddy Nappen, Speaker 3

Evan Nappen 00:17

I’m Evan Nappen.

Teddy Nappen 00:20

And I’m Teddy Nappen.

Evan Nappen 00:21

And welcome to Gun Lawyer. Well, I have some very exciting news. There is an extremely important lawsuit that has just recently been brought by the Association of New Jersey Rifle and Pistol Clubs, and with Knife Rights, joining in to sue New Jersey. (https://www.anjrpc.org/page/LawsuitToOverturnNJsSelfDefenseBan) Of course, when you do that, you name the Attorney General (Jennifer) Davenport, and also we have the Superintendent of State Police (Jeanne) Hengemuhle. I don’t know. I’m probably butchering that name up pretty good, but anyway, it’s the Superintendent of State Police.

Evan Nappen 01:16

In this case, this Association case, what is being challenged, and it is something that has been begging to be challenged, is New Jersey’s ban on self-defense. It is a part of, specifically, and I’ll explain why, New Jersey’s ban on everything other than guns. Their garbage can clause of weapons prohibition. The insanity of New Jersey’s weapons ban has, in its foundation, really, what I know you, as our great listeners, will find shocking as to the case law as it currently stands in New Jersey, that we are looking to absolutely put into the garbage can of history, and that’s where it belongs.

Evan Nappen 02:25

Let me go through with you the actual complaint. You know, lots of times when you hear about lawsuits and litigation and these things, you usually hear about it in general terms. You hear about, you know, kind of a summary of what it is. We’re going to get a little more into the weeds here, and I think you’re going to find it interesting and why. I’ll expand your horizons to understanding how incredibly significant this litigation is, and how the stars have actually lined up for us, so we’re of course moving under. When I say we, I mean our side. I did help with this litigation. I’m not counsel of record, of course. That’s my good friend and colleague Dan Schmutter. He does the federal litigation for our state Association, and it’s a fantastic job here that has really laid it out well. Page – 2 – of 10

Evan Nappen 03:43

So, we’re coming from, of course, the Second Amendment, and the Second Amendment, as noted in the Bruen case specifically, of the trifecta, the Bruen case, that the Second Amendment’s plain text presumptively guarantees a right to bear arms in public for self-defense. e all know that in our hearts, and we know this as case law. We know that that is what the Second Amendment does, and Bruen established that self-defense outside the home is a protected right. So, in the New York State Rifle versus Pistol Association, I mean New York State Rifle and Pistol versus Bruen, the court also there found that courts should not be in the business of demanding that citizens use more force for self-defense than they are comfortable wielding.

Evan Nappen 04:55

What does this all mean, and how does this apply to New Jersey? Well, it’s very simple. Let’s accept the initial premise, the Second Amendment is not the right to keep and bear guns. It’s the right to keep and bear arms, and arms are a lot more than guns. Arms are essentially any tool of self-defense, and we have the right for that. And what New Jersey is now going to have to defend is the insanity of where New Jersey wants to keep us defenseless. Absolutely wants to keep us defenseless, and the case law proves it. So, the key case that we’re going to talk about in just a little bit of the existing case law is a case of State v. Kelly.

Evan Nappen 05:58

But before we get to Kelly, let me talk about the specific statute, the specific laws, so you get an understanding of what New Jersey does. New Jersey defines “weapon” as anything readily capable of lethal use or of inflicting serious bodily injury. Then it says the term includes, but is not limited to, and they do a laundry list of weapons, and of the weapons that they list, a lot of them are pretty good ideas. But anyway, it’s all part of it. So, you find that definition under N.J.S. 2C:39-1(r). So, in other words, under New Jersey’s definition of “weapon”, anything can be prohibited as a weapon. Aa baseball bat, a hammer, a screwdriver, a knife, a box cutter, bear spray, a stick, anything, and if you use it as a weapon, even your shoe, then it’s a weapon.

Evan Nappen 07:10

A good example: if you happen to have a baseball bat in your car, but you’re not on the way to a baseball game, you can be arrested, prosecuted, imprisoned for weapon possession. Here’s how it works. Because New Jersey’s prohibition-remember, weapon is just what we talked about in definition-but the prohibition, which you find under N.J.S. 2C:39-5(d), prohibits the possession of any weapon. In other words, any object can be used as a weapon. And here’s right from the statute quote: Under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful uses as it may have, and here’s the kicker: you might think to yourself, “Okay, as long as you have a manifest appropriate use, right, a lawful use, then you should be okay.” Well, here’s a shocker, folks. In State v. Kelly, the court found that preemptively arming yourself for self-defense, to have a weapon for self-defense, is not a lawful use. Let that sink in. You can be prosecuted because you had the nerve to arm yourself with a weapon for self-defense, which is our constitutionally protected right to be able to do. And where do you hear the facts? Page – 3 – of 10

Teddy Nappen 09:01

Go ahead, Teddy. In the complaint, demonstrating that the biggest. I love how they pepper, and you can when you’re reading it, you see they always hammer this point back. Versus State v. Kelly, the single mother.

Evan Nappen 09:15

Well, yeah, I want. Let’s talk. I want to talk about the facts of Kelly. Here’s the facts of Kelly. 1990, Kelly case. A single mother of a young child was convicted of possessing a box cutter after successfully fending off her violent boyfriend, who was in the process of beating her to death. Did you hear that? As far as the charges for her use of the box cutter to save her life and defend herself, child, etc. that was all fine. But she’s convicted of possessing the knife under 39:5(d) because the court makes this decision that essentially finds, back in 1990, and it still, you know, that law is still on the books as case law. It’s been modified slightly, and we’ll get to that in a moment. That having a weapon for self-defense doesn’t fit that “manifest lawful purpose”. It’s crazy. Then from there, a subsequent case, after the decision in Heller and McDonald applying the Second Amendment to back to the state of New Jersey, the courts decided another case called Montalvo. In Montalvo, in that case, a person comes to the door with a machete. Somebody’s banging on the door. He doesn’t know who it is, and it’s law enforcement. Well, he didn’t know that, and he wasn’t threatening them. But when he came to the door with the machete, he’s like, “oh, it’s officers, not a problem. He’s not. Well, there’s like, “Hey, you just preemptively armed yourself with a weapon for self-defense. They charge him in the same manner that Kelly had been charged, but the court here distinguished because they realized they had to under Heller, where you were allowed to have in your home weapons for self-defense. The court there said, well, if you preemptively arm yourself in your home, that’s okay, but not outside your home. So, the current law right now is you can’t preemptively arm yourself with any of these other weapons outside your home.

Evan Nappen 11:53

Now, when it comes to a gun, that’s different. If you have a handgun and that’s a carry permit, and that’s where you’re allowed to, but only a handgun with a carry permit, right? Short of that, with the minor exception of less than three quarters of an ounce of pepper spray, you cannot preemptively arm yourself with any of these things. And if you have something like that, and it’s a weapon, you’re subject to prosecution for a felony level offense, and New Jersey is now going to be put to the mat on this law. The full definition under 39- 1(r) of non-firearm weapon means anything readily capable of lethal use or inflicting serious bodily injury. The term includes, but is not limited to, and of course, it includes firearms. But with firearm licensing, you have the exception.

Evan Nappen 12:55

Then, gravity knives, switchblade knives, daggers, dirks, stilettos, other dangerous knives, whatever the hell that means, billies, which are similar to nightsticks and trudgens, and they’re impact weapons, right? Blackjacks, bludgeons, metal knuckles, sand clubs, slingshots. Oh, slingshots! Cesti or similar leather bands studded with metal filings or razor blades embedded in wood. Like I said, has a lot of good ideas here, but all these weapons, cesti leather wrap, that was famous. You know, the Roman gladiators would wrap their hands in leather wrap, etc. Well, that’s just a list of what it includes, but isn’t limited to. And by the way, in the list of weapon is stun guns and other devices which project, release, Page – 4 – of 10

or emit tear gas. So, the exemption for tear gas or other, you know, pepper spray and all that is less than three quarters of an ounce.

Evan Nappen 14:07

Well, this lawsuit will make it so you can have any size of pepper spray, etc. Stun guns, even though you may have heard about New Jersey saying stun guns are lawful. They’re lawful for possession, but not carrying outside your home. So, winning this lawsuit will make it legal to carry your stun gun or your taser outside the home, and any of these other weapons that you may want to use as a tool of self-defense. This is where it becomes very critical because the 39-5(d) weapon possession charge. Remember, 39-five is where you have the handgun prohibition under B and rifles and shotguns under C. Well, D is “other weapons”, and that says any person who knowingly has possession any other weapon, right?

Evan Nappen 15:11

All the stuff we’ve been talking about, under circumstances not manifestly appropriate for such lawful uses as it may have, is guilty of a crime of the fourth decree carries a year and a half in state’s prison, and the case law is insane, saying that self-defense doesn’t fit the lawful use, and so this is once and for all going to address and end this. And we have, of course, Bruen making it clear we have a right to self-defense even outside the home. The third and final modification, to or second, depending I want to look at it, where Kelly went, where you couldn’t do it at all, and then Montalvo limited to the home. We now need to make it inside and outside the home. You can have weapons, and by doing this, all of these will be freed up to be used as a tool of self-defense. And we will make it clear. Wait, okay. Let me just finish it. We’ll make it clear That self-defense is a lawful purpose permitted by law, and that will have even further implications down the road to other unconstitutional acts that New Jersey forces us to suffer under. Go ahead, Ted.

Teddy Nappen 16:44

Well, in the complaint as well, they take it a step further. They go after the per se ban on specific arms, where they go through that entire list. But look at the thing they hammer home: common use. That is the tool that wins the day for the assault weapon ban, wins the day on the suppressors. That is the key language that we need to show and hammer through the idea of all this is commonly used. So people continue to having it so we’re you know possession of knives. How many people own knives? How many people own these various things? Tasers.

Evan Nappen 17:18

Well, throughout free America, most of just about all these are legal. They’re utilized by different people. They’re out there. I mean, from a nightstick to a billy club, blackjack, etc. These are all the impact weapons. I mean, generally they’re just impact weapons. So, the impact weapon, a club, you know, is probably man’s first weapon, right? I mean, just watch, you know, Space Odyssey, right? What’s the first, you know, the bone as a club, right? Right. So impact weapons are probably the first and most fundamental of all human weapons, and yet Jersey, no, no, you can’t have that for self-defense outside. Well, talk about primary. This is primary, original weapon, we also know that many of these weapons, as in Kelly, are utilized even by domestic violence victims to protect themselves. And interestingly, about Kelly is that was 1990, and you might say the great awakening and awareness of Page – 5 – of 10

domestic violence didn’t occur until after that, somewhat after that, when you saw the ability of in an understanding where domestic violence victims need protection, like restraining orders and other things. It was until 1994 that a domestic violence restraining order even became a gun prohibitor itself on the violent offenders, and so it seems really shocking today that that a bona fide victim of domestic violence would end up being even charged in a situation where they defend themselves, but leave it to New Jersey to turn defenders into victims, and then double down on their victimization with the insane weapon laws that New Jersey has.

Teddy Nappen 19:44

We’ve seen that before, Dad. With Shaneen Allen. They don’t care. Oh, weapon, gun, bad. Doesn’t matter to its oppressor and oppressee. You used a weapon, so obviously you’re an oppressor. That’s just the logic of Marxists. That’s what they always do. Even if it’s a victim of a domestic violence or a single black mom with two kids who only crime was going over the Benjamin Bridge, like these are, it always goes back to that.

Evan Nappen 20:10

Well, let me let me make it clear: whether anybody listening has any desire to carry a blackjack or to carry a knife or do any of that? That’s not what really matters here. Although that’s very important, what really matters here is forcing the State to recognize self-defense as a lawful purpose. That’s really the key to what this case is going to establish, and we’re very happy to have Knife Rights joining in with lawsuit as well. This will also, hopefully it will, put New Jersey with the ranks of the overwhelming majority. There’s only maybe a handful, five or six states left that even prohibit so-called switchblades, what we call automatic knives anymore.

Evan Nappen 21:13

And then, of course, the silliest of the silly, the craziest of the crazy, is the ban on slingshots. I mean, New Jersey makes possession of a slingshot a felony level offense, and so this is there. And yet, the slingshot is even used by the Boy Scouts in their current curriculum for Cub Scouts as an introduction to shooting. So there are Cub Scout camps where slingshots are part of the curriculum, you know, and it’s a good entry even before archery, even before shooting of air guns or any of that, is learning the discipline, and slingshots can play that role. Plus, there are competitive, highly competitive slingshot events that take place all through the nation, but not in New Jersey because they ban slingshots. And so, this is going to be addressed. You know, going to finally get stun guns handled. All these things that become nuisance laws that I also believe go to a bigger agenda, and that agenda is if they can turn us into criminals in any way, even over a slingshot, then they’ve disenfranchised another gun owner from voting and from being able to exercise their Second Amendment rights because if you become convicted of slingshot possession in Jersey, you become, which is essentially felony level offense. Well, you’ve just lost your gun rights for the entire United States because you’re now a convicted felon. So, this is really good work by the state association and Knife Rights, and very excited to see this progress. We’ll be keeping you informed as it does progress.

Evan Nappen 23:14

Hey, I want to tell you all about WeShoot because WeShoot, which is the range where Teddy and I both shoot. Teddy and I both shoot at WeShoot, hence we can say We Shoot there. At WeShoot, they Page – 6 – of 10

have a special deal running on membership. That’s right. WeShoot membership is on sale. You can save $100 on a yearly individual or family membership, and you can save $250 on the signature VIP membership. Check out WeShootUSA. WeShoot memberships are great. This sale is going on until October 18th, so you should move on it now while you can. Let me tell you some of the benefits of membership include unlimited range time, priority lane assignment, 3% instant cash back on all in-store purchases, 5% off accessories, special pricing on ammo and targets, five free guest passes, okay, 50% off rentals, and even more member benefits. So, you can buy it online, or you can go it to the store. The sale ends October 18. Make sure you take advantage of this great sale by WeShoot, and then you’ll have the advantage of being able to shoot there and train there, and you’ll love We Shoot. Teddy and I sure do. Go to WeShootUSA.com.

Evan Nappen 25:02

Let me also shamelessly plug my book, New Jersey Gun Law, the Bible of Jersey Gun Law. It’s over 500 pages and 120 topics, all question and answer. Make sure you get your copy today so you don’t become a GOFU. And given the size and weight of my book, it would qualify as a weapon if used as such under New Jersey law. So, maybe that’s the way they would try to ban books, especially gun law books, to try to keep you from being a GOFU. And if you have that in your car, oh boy, yeah. So, watch out for anything that can be a weapon, but the best weaponization of my book is that you become protected from New Jersey’s insanity that they call gun control laws. Go to EvanNappen.com and get your copy today. Just click on the big orange book and order a copy. You can do that.

Evan Nappen 26:05

Also, I’d like to point out that Nappen Law is always growing. We’re busy, busy, and we’re looking to hire. So, if you know, or if you are an attorney that wants to work in the fascinating area of New Jersey gun law, give me a call. Jump on. Go to EvanNappen.com. Get in touch with me. We’re looking to hire. Teddy, what do you have for us today in Press Checks, which we all know are free?

Teddy Nappen 26:40

Yes, of course. You stole my line. Anyways.

Evan Nappen 26:43

I try.

Teddy Nappen 26:45

No, it’s all right. But doing a little bit more research again, always keeping on the opposition, to see what they’re pushing. I love how desperate they’ve gotten now to where you know we have The Trace. But, of course, Everytown had to create their math mouthpiece as well. So, they’ve created a website called the Smoking Gun. (https://smokinggun.org/report/loaded-content/) The very thing that caught fire on the internet over it was they put out a hit piece on gun tubers. Don’t you know, Dad, that influencers are the problem in the gun and are the pushing for gun violence. It’s the influencers, Dad. That’s the problem. Page – 7 – of 10

Evan Nappen 26:45

Oh, yeah. That’s what we do every day on this show, right? Push for gun violence. As long as the gun violence is proper, because you know there’s good gun violence where you’re using gun violence to save your life or that of a loved one, and so gun violence. They try to make it a pejorative, which is of course their plan.

Teddy Nappen 27:48

Well, that’s from after seeing the last conversation. They don’t care that it’s violence. Oh, therefore bad oppressor, oppressee. It’s always that route. But the thing particularly they are focused on was YouTube, where typically the gun tubers is their term used. The fact that there there’s a huge amounts of sponsorships, a lot of influencers promote a lot of different stuff, a lot of some of the tactical areas, some more political breaking down firearm news, and they’re upset with the fact that YouTube has allowed these guys to grow to massive heights, so I love this whole article that they wrote up from the smoking gun on there. YouTube has provided a long platform for firearm contact videos that the mass shooter in Buffalo and is often referred to as Gun Tube. I love how they always tie that. I want every article to start with the mass shooter who owned a copy of Rage written by Stephen King. I want that to open up. Yeah, continue. Video on GunTube frequently depict dangerous activities and hateful rhetoric, and often sponsored by firearm companies. Oh no, sponsors into 1000s of videos glorifying military.

Evan Nappen 29:04

Well, there’s no other, there’s no other YouTubers that get sponsored by anyone, right?

Teddy Nappen 29:10

I know, right? Not that kind of thing, but they go through this entire article just bashing the various like massive explosiveness of the when it came to YouTube because they point out purchasing banner ads and television spots the organic factors retailers embedded themselves directly in content. Oh, gee, I wonder why? Because they left control most of that media and they wouldn’t allow them to market stuff on the mainstream, so they were forced to go to the internet and YouTube, and then now.

Evan Nappen 29:42

But also, they’re reaching their target market with that. You’re reaching a target market where the people that are listening and watching these shows are people that would have a strong propensity to be interested in the in the. Products, as opposed to some general approach on some general TV show, where so many of the people, if they’re even watching, don’t necessarily have any interest in what you’re selling.

Teddy Nappen 30:15

Yeah, and also it goes back to the fact that they’re upset that the media their grasp on controlling the narrative and controlling where information flows, because YouTube was heavy, heavy amounts of censorship. People are getting demonetized, losing videos, and now they’ve lost that grip, and now they’re crying, wham, wham, that they don’t have the power to control and to subvert the dangerous, violent rhetoric of gun tubers, so and they even highlight the fact that ABC, CBS don’t allow firearm advertising. Google and Meta itself all but prohibited paid gun ads. So that’s their big. That was their big push in that argument. And then you go deeper into the article, and they go into the oh dad, don’t you Page – 8 – of 10

know it’s all Astroturf by the insidious relationship between the gun industry and gun tubers with this group known as Leviathan. It’s literally a it’s an advertising agency where they bring you have a product you want to market said product we have influencers who will market said product.

Teddy Nappen 31:23

You know who also did that? Dylan Mulvaney. That’s how you ended up with him on the Bud Light can because it was a group that promoted transgenders. Like they’re acting like this whole thing is great. No, it’s just a simple market. Oh, we have products that maybe interest these people who watch these tubers? Would you would these tubers be interested in that? And they try to paint it up like it’s a whole like mafia esque where a few like Ian McCollum who does Forgotten Weapons he didn’t want to be he broke off the relationship with Leviathan and then Grand Thumb another big tuber he was one who didn’t want to do the relationship because he wanted to be independent. Which people can do that if they want to talk to their own sponsors and not be beholden to a group. That’s fine. That’s just normal capitalism, not this insidious nature. But they paint it up like it’s the combining of that, and I love this. They combine that with attacking the Gundies, where they act like the Gundies is this recruitment operation to promote and then bring them into the insidious network of the gun lobby and gun manufacturers.

Evan Nappen 32:38

Oh, my G-d! There’s conspiracy around every corner. But of course they’re reaching because they’re losing so badly in the courts. They’re losing so badly under the Trump administration and the changes that have been implemented by regulation and a complete change in attitude by our federal government, even the DOJ prosecuting for violating Second Amendment rights. I mean, it’s a complete, total new day and turnaround. And they know that their days are numbered on their pet issues, especially assault, firearm, and magazines. Come June, when that goes away, what are they going to have? All they have is this kind of stuff, where they have to try to contrive out of you know First Amendment attack because that’s what this is. You know, since the Second Amendment is harder to go at, they’re trying to go at it from go at First Amendment, but they’re going to just be left with ultimately their entire mission will be trying to repeal the Second Amendment. We’ve got to be ready for that fight. Of course, that’s a very difficult road for them to do. But that’s where they’ll end up. That’s the only thing they’ll have left. We just got to repeal that darn Second Amendment and fight for it, and we’ll be fighting against them over that, and that’ll be a great day when the fight has just finally only become that, where the Second Amendment has freed us from all these oppressive gun laws that we’ve suffered under for all these years, turning law-abiding citizens into criminals.

Teddy Nappen 34:22

Yep, and I love how they just like to throw every single word at all the influencers. Like they attack Grand Thumb, like call him, like using transphobic slurs online and decorating his firearms, like in white supremacist not monikers. Like it’s.

Evan Nappen 34:37

Oh, of course, and then just put every. Page – 9 – of 10

Teddy Nappen 34:39

Go after Brandon Herrera, too. You know, the famous gun tuber, the AK guy currently running, where

Evan Nappen 34:47

Yeah, he’s political now.

Teddy Nappen 34:48

Assassinations. Even though he’s showing how the guns work and showing how that works, and then they go after like Colin Noir as well. They going after like part of a like conspiracy. Theorists, all this front, like everything they do on this front, just to go at that. And guess what? The final ending of it. Here are recommend recommendations for YouTube, and you go right to it as YouTube must enforce all firearm policies that are not consistent with community guidelines. YouTube must enforce child safety policies. YouTube must amend its community guidelines, prohibit content that shows viewers maximize their lethality, and demonstrate violence or unsafe firearm handling. What does all that mean? Whatever YouTube decides, what they decide. And they, by the way, they hire these people, these essentially like sensitivity readers from these organizations to come into YouTube, and that’s how people get demonetized and banned. Go back to 2018. That’s how they got. That’s how they banned Crowder. They banned all conservatives through YouTube and demonizing Facebook.

Evan Nappen 35:51

But now there’s competition to YouTube, right? Specifically, Rumble.

Teddy Nappen 35:55

Rumble, Rumble. You have, now you have Kik. You have so many now avenues that because YouTube was losing such of its market share due to censorship, they’ve rolled back a crap. They still will censor people and they’ll still demonetize things, but they knew and saw it, so now they have to.

Evan Nappen 36:13

But it’s a different dynamic because they still have their business interests. If they want to lose, they can go down the road of censorship and oppression, and they’ll lose their market shares. So, that’s what’s at play that makes it a little different today. I understand why the Second Amendment haters are trying to put this out there. You know what’s what they. But this is luckily a somewhat different environment because of competition, which is great. Well, Teddy, I want to thank you for highlighting the attacks on First Amendment gun speech, as well as what we’re dealing with every day on our Second Amendment violations.

Evan Nappen 37:02

I want to tell you about this week’s GOFU, which is the Gun Owner Fuck Up. It’s where gun owners make expensive, costly mistakes that you get to learn for free, so you don’t make them. Let me make this clear. This is about expungement. Now, more than ever, you know, we do lots of expungement where we clear your prior mistakes. You know you get a second chance where you can get a clean slate, and it’s really great to see rights restored for people. Well, if you’ve gotten a New Jersey expungement, the law makes it clear. It says, with an expungement, it is deemed not to have occurred, and you may answer accordingly. Page – 10 – of 10

Evan Nappen 37:52

So, if you’re asked about something that you were expunged, you have a bona fide expungement, then the answer you give is accordingly. In other words, have you ever been convicted of a crime? If that crime has been expunged, your answer is no, legally no, because that’s what expungement does. It restores the rights. It removes the conviction, and it restores you. So, don’t volunteer. Don’t. As a matter of fact, if you’re asked, “Have you ever been convicted of a crime? and can answer accordingly, you’re almost falsifying by saying yes, because it’s been expunged. It’s deemed not to have occurred. Of course, it doesn’t mean you can’t reveal it, but it’s really foolish. And then what happens is that leads to a knowledge where they try to then open expungement, use it on your gun application. Try to mess with you over it, folks. Know your rights. When you get an expungement, make sure if you have any question, talk to your attorney that did the expungement. They will be able to advise you on how you can answer the question. There are some exceptions to expungement law, more about if you’re working in law enforcement or in the judiciary, but there are not that many exceptions at all. It’s pretty much a solid rights restoration and clean slate, and that’s the idea and that’s the purpose behind it. So, make sure that when you get these things, and that you know your rights when it comes to what you’ve just gotten.

Evan Nappen 39:50

This is Evan Nappen and Teddy Nappen reminding you that gun laws do not protect honest citizens from criminals. They protect criminals from honest citizens.

Speaker 3 40:02

Gun Lawyer is a CounterThink Media production. The music used in this broadcast was managed by Cosmo Music, New York, New York. Reach us by emailing Evan@gun.lawyer. The information and opinions in this broadcast do not constitute legal advice. Consult a licensed attorney in your state.