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00:00:06.000Hi, and welcome to Dopamine in Doubt.
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00:00:13.199I'm your host, Rachel, a licensed clinical social worker specializing in ADHD and OCD.
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00:00:23.440On this show, I will be speaking from both my clinical and lived experience as we explore the surprisingly common crossover of ADHD and OCD.
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00:00:29.519Because when we understand which is in the driver's seat, we are better able to know what we need in that moment.
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00:00:36.880Whether you're living right at the intersection of both or navigate life with one of these neurotypes, you're welcome here.
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00:00:41.200As always, please take what is helpful and leave what isn't.
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00:00:48.079Neurodivergence shows up differently for everyone, and there is no one size fits all approach.
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00:00:50.399Okay, let's dive in.
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00:01:10.400Just one more article.
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00:01:12.799One more Reddit thread.
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00:01:15.359One more Google search.
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00:01:18.079One more person to ask.
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00:01:30.000And honestly, sometimes I don't realize I've crossed the line until I've been researching the same question for an embarrassing amount of time.
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00:01:35.040That's one of the hardest parts of the ADHD-OCD overlap.
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00:01:39.040The behavior itself is not always the giveaway.
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00:01:41.519It's the why underneath.
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00:01:53.439In the last episode, I talked about how ADHD hyperfocus and OCD reassurance seeking can look remarkably similar from the outside.
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00:02:01.280So today I want to walk through the framework I use to figure out what to do when I'm stuck in that space.
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00:02:14.879Starting with the ADHD piece, catching the transition into reassurance seeking, and then talking about what to do when you're already in an OCD spiral.
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00:02:19.039You don't have to know exactly where the line was crossed.
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00:02:25.120You just have to notice where you are now and decide what you want to do next.
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00:02:27.439So let's break this down.
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00:02:32.639Phase one, working with the hyperfocus.
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00:02:45.919The goal isn't to force myself out of hyperfocus, it's to create enough interruption that I can have choice about whether I want to stay in it.
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00:02:49.599So first we build intentional breaks.
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00:02:57.680An example would be to experiment with a five-minute movement break every 30 minutes.
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00:03:05.120And that interval can be different because people need different activities and different intervals.
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00:03:07.439So that's just an example.
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00:03:22.159Another intentional break could be getting water or a snack or doing a body check-in, which might mean you need some movement to go ahead and reset your nervous system.
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00:03:27.360These all create exit ramps instead of hard stops.
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00:03:37.199Because I'm sure, as many of you know, if you're deeply absorbed, telling yourself stop now is just not effective.
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00:03:58.719So instead, we can also try alarms, working with a natural stopping point, giving yourself a pause and decide moment, trying a transition activity, having an accountability person or a physical or environmental cue.
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00:04:01.360The point is not that you have to stop.
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00:04:12.000The point is to interrupt long enough to choose and most importantly, meet your body's needs before they are emergencies.
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00:04:18.399We can also put boundaries around the things that you know you'll get stuck on.
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00:04:26.319This is where I use my brick to block apps, have a scheduled hobby time.
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00:04:28.160You can try other apps.
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00:04:29.600There's so many out there.
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00:04:31.839Or diversifying hobbies.
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00:04:34.639So we don't just get stuck in one.
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00:04:39.360I want to be clear, these are not punishments for having ADHD.
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00:04:48.079They are simply external scaffolding for a brain that has trouble noticing when it's time to transition.
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00:04:59.680Essentially, all of these are just meant to give yourself the pause and choice to see if you want to come back to the activity or not, while also taking care of yourself.
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00:05:05.199Because I know we're all good at ignoring those cues sometimes.
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00:05:10.240So then we look at phase two, catch the transition.
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00:05:16.319Once we've made room for the ADHD piece, we can now ask a different question.
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00:05:20.480Am I still learning or am I trying to feel certain?
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00:05:25.519If we've caught the shift early, this is the easiest place to intervene.
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00:05:28.639So we can notice the urgency.
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00:05:32.639Do I suddenly feel like I have to resolve this right now?
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00:05:34.639That's such a tell for me.
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00:05:38.639Ask yourself, what am I actually looking for?
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00:05:43.439Am I looking for information or am I looking for certainty?
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00:05:59.759I will add this to the show notes, but just to synthesize a really helpful sheet, when we're in information seeking, this is different than reassurance seeking.
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00:06:06.160So information seeking says I need to know something so that I can make a decision.
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00:06:09.600When we find it, we accept the answer.
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00:06:16.160We can tolerate that there's some uncertainty and it eventually stops.
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00:06:25.439Reassurance seeking, on the other hand, is more I need to know so I can stop feeling anxious.
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00:06:32.160We keep asking the question or different questions after receiving an answer.
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00:06:37.439We will challenge or rephrase answers.
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00:06:44.399It's a need for increasing certainty, and it never quite feels finished.
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00:06:48.319An example of when we're in reassurance seeking.
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00:06:57.120So the beautiful thing when we ask a friend is they say, Oh no, it's okay, nothing bad's gonna happen.
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00:07:03.120But the problem is, OCD in that moment is not actually looking for information.
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00:07:05.439It's looking for certainty.
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00:07:14.800And no matter how reassuring that kind friend's answer is, OCD is just gonna come back with, are you sure?
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00:07:20.000We want to then identify whether the question is actually answerable.
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00:07:30.079Some questions have answers, some questions have probabilities, and some questions are fundamentally uncertain.
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00:07:39.839If I am demanding certainty from a question that can't provide it, more research is not going to solve that problem.
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00:07:43.199Now, notice the shift.
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00:07:47.759Earlier I was learning, now I'm trying to feel okay.
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00:07:51.360Sometimes the topic doesn't change at all.
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00:07:56.879What has changed is what I am asking the information to do for me.
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00:07:59.199Then we have phase three.
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00:08:01.040I'm already in it.
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00:08:08.879So if we miss the transition, and believe me, I do too, the question changes.
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00:08:13.600We are no longer just trying to accommodate hyper focus.
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00:08:19.199Now we need to ask, is OCD maintaining this behavior?
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00:08:25.920So when we realize, oh no, I'm in the spiral, we can notice a name.
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00:08:32.000I'm noticing the urge to keep researching because I want certainty.
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00:08:35.200Don't solve the uncertainty.
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00:08:38.159We can use uncertainty statements.
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00:08:43.039These are very common in the response prevention plans I make with folks.
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00:08:51.759So this would look like those, maybe, maybe not, but it's possible, and I don't know.
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00:08:55.600We can also delay the compulsion.
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00:09:03.919So try and delay the urge to continue the behavior by five to ten minutes as a starting point.
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00:09:09.279I want to be clear, the delay is not about making the anxiety disappear.
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00:09:17.360It's just about giving yourself enough space to not respond to the urge and practice that skill.
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00:09:22.879And then we can reorient towards something meaningful that we value.
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00:09:27.840What do I actually want to be doing right now if I weren't trying to solve this?
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00:09:34.639The main point here is don't try to out-research OCD, because that's what everyone tries.
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00:09:38.080The urge says one more article.
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00:09:43.279But OCD has never reached certainty because of one more article.
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00:09:47.679It just asks a better question that hooks you back in.
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00:09:52.080We want to celebrate these wins no matter how small.
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00:09:58.000We don't suddenly learn about reassurance seeking and stop doing it completely.
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00:10:03.840It can take a stepped approach and slow reduction in behavior.
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00:10:06.399And these steps matter.
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00:10:12.559One important caveat, because I know those of us listening need to hear it.
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00:10:17.039This is not a new test that you have to get exactly right.
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00:10:28.080If you start repeatedly analyzing whether something is ADHD or OCD, that can become another form of reassurance seeking.
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00:10:31.279The goal is not perfect classification.
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00:10:36.320The goal is noticing enough to make your next choice.
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00:10:41.360If we're in hyperfocus, the goal isn't to stop hyperfocusing.
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00:10:46.159It's to protect this strength while reducing the cost.
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00:10:52.879If we're in information seeking, the goal isn't to stop being curious.
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00:11:00.399It's to recognize when curiosity has shifted into compulsive certainty seeking.
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00:11:03.679We're not trying to eliminate either system.
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00:11:10.720I love the folks I know who enjoy learning and are curious people.
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00:11:17.519We're instead learning to recognize what's happening well enough to make a different choice.
00:11:18.000 -->
00:11:21.759The goal is also not to become someone who never gets stuck.
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00:11:30.639It's to become someone who can notice when we are stuck, increasingly have the freedom to choose what happens next.
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00:11:37.440Okay, so let's slow this down and run through it the way I would do in a session.
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00:11:43.440So let's say you start researching something because you're genuinely curious.
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00:11:44.639Pause.
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00:11:46.799Okay, that's not a problem.
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00:11:47.919You're learning.
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00:11:52.159Then you notice you've been doing it for two hours.
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00:11:55.919So the questions become Have I eaten?
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00:11:57.519Have I moved?
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00:12:00.080Have I had any water?
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00:12:03.759And do I actually want to keep doing this?
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00:12:06.159Maybe the answer is yes.
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00:12:10.639I do want to keep doing this because I'm enjoying myself.
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00:12:11.600Great.
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00:12:15.679That's an ADHD need for accommodation problem.
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00:12:24.480So let's create an exit ramp and get our needs met so we can choose to keep going while taking care of ourselves.
00:12:24.960 -->
00:12:28.240But let's say you get the answer you're looking for.
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00:12:34.720And instead of stopping, you immediately think, okay, but what if?
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00:12:37.200There's our transition point.
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00:12:43.840Now I want to ask, am I looking for information or am I looking for certainty?
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00:12:50.639If I realize I'm looking for certainty, I don't need to figure out exactly when the line was crossed.
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00:12:55.120I can simply practice not answering the next question.
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00:12:57.759Now say we're deep in it.
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00:12:59.840I realize I'm here.
00:13:00.320 -->
00:13:02.000I have been here before.
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00:13:05.120There's nothing to feel ashamed about.
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00:13:06.879I am a human.
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00:13:09.600We make room for the uncertainty.
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00:13:12.480I may or may not find the answer.
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00:13:17.600I'm going to delay and continue for five minutes.
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00:13:23.039Notice again, I didn't have to decide whether this was ADHD or OCD.
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00:13:27.519I just noticed what was happening and chose the intervention that matched.
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00:13:32.000I can now choose what I want to do next that aligns with what I want.
00:13:32.320 -->
00:13:42.960The goal is not to become someone who never hyperfocuses, it is protecting the strengths of hyperfocus while reducing the cost.
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00:13:49.360This means learning when to lean into it and when to gently step away.
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00:13:56.799Similarly, the goal is not to stop being curious or seeking information.
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00:14:05.600It is learning to recognize when curiosity has quietly shifted into compulsive reassurance seeking.
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00:14:12.559That's the moment to practice stepping away from certainty and back toward the life you want to be living.
00:14:12.799 -->
00:14:16.240The goal is not to become someone who never gets stuck.
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00:14:25.039It is to become someone who can notice when you're stuck and increasingly have the freedom to choose what happens next.
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00:14:31.200I hope these strategies give you more freedom to start making that choice.
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00:14:46.639If you are struggling, please reach out to a qualified mental health provider who can work with you directly.
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00:14:51.360What I share here comes from my clinical experience and my own journey.
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00:14:54.080But your situation is unique to you.
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00:15:00.480If you are in crisis, please contact nine eighty eight or go to your nearest emergency room.
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00:15:02.159Thanks for being here.
