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Language: en
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Um, so welcome to our second episode of
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Weird, Wild and Wonderful Illinois. Um,
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today we are talking with Greg Olsen who
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has been on the board of directors for
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the Morgan County Historical Society
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for, you know, about the last 40 years.
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So he knows a little bit about Morgan
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County history. And today we're just
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we're going to learn a little bit more
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about the Morgan County Historical
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Society and some of the weird and wild
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and crazy stories that we might not have
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heard before out of Morgan County. So,
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welcome Greg.
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>> Yeah. Uh good to see you, Miranda. Uh I
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hope uh State Historical Sai viewers en
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enjoy what I have to say. Um, as we had
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previously discussed, uh, something I
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thought I would talk a little bit about,
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not that I'm an expert on this, but one
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of the more bizarre stories in Morgan
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County history um, was the disappearance
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of a man in 1959
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from a motel in Jacksonville.
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>> Okay.
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>> Yeah. So, his name was uh Bruce Campbell
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Senior.
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And in April of 1959,
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he and his wife drove from Northampton,
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Massachusetts
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to Jacksonville to visit their son, who
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was a a chemistry
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uh instructor. I'm not sure if he was a
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professor or not, but he was an in a
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chemistry instructor at McMurray
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College, which is now which is now
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closed.
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>> Yeah.
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But uh they checked into a motel which
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no longer exists out on West Walnut
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Street in the north uh west part of
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Jacksonville.
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>> It was called the Sandman Motel. And the
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story goes that in the night he uh Mr.
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Campbell told his wife that he was
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worried that he hadn't locked their car
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and she talked him out of going to the
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car to check.
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>> Mhm.
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>> But early in the morning, like around
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2:00, 2:15, she woke up and he was gone.
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>> Well, the weird part of the story is
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that
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his car was still there. His car keys
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were still there. his wal his wallet and
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all of his money was still there and he
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walked away in the night in his green
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monogram pajamas
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with and he left his shoes or slippers
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behind
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>> and so um
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the police were called of course I don't
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know they waited 24 hours like they do
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now but the police were informed that he
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disappeared.
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>> So, they spent a week uh state police,
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Illinois State Police, Morgan County
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Sheriff's Deputies, Jacksonville police,
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McMurray College students in and at that
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time, McMurray had just been co-ed for a
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couple of years. So, there were over 200
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Male
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students that helped with the search.
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Um,
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but they never found any trace of him.
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So, back in 2001,
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I wrote a story for the uh Jacksonville
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Journal Courier
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about this disappearance other people
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have written about over the years. In
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fact, it's even been in Reader Digest uh
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with under unexplained mysteries or
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something like that. But um in 2001, I
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talked to um
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uh retired Jacksonville police officer
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and and longtime police chief uh Charles
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Wrl.
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>> Uhhuh.
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>> And he he was um a patrolman back in 19
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no he was a captain on the police force
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in 1959 and soon to be named chief. Mhm.
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>> But he told me there were all sorts of
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theories
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um as to what happened to this this man
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uh including that he may have fallen
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into an abandoned well. Well, okay.
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>> All the all these years later and now
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it's 66
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years have passed.
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>> Mhm.
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>> Um they there's never been any trace of
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him. Even his hometown newspaper back in
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Massachusetts put reporters onto the
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story to see if they could track his
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down his whereabouts. Of course, this is
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long before there was the internet and
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you know other means of trying to track
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people down and
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>> but there was uh there's never been any
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any uh finding of of his remains. Um, so
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they even put a boat, uh, the fire
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department in Jacksonville even took a
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rescue boat to, uh, a rather narrow
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creek that flows,
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uh, it mostly flows uh, from east of
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Jacksonville to the Illinois River. And
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they they took this boat down a
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rainswollen Moistar Creek uh for miles
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looking for his body, thinking he may
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have fallen
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>> into the creek, which the creek from the
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motel was probably
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>> uh maybe a mile away to the north of of
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the motel. But um
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>> yeah, it's an interesting story and and
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as I said, other people have written
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about this. So, uh, and it probably
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has been on national news broadcasts
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over the years, you know, just under
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unexplained, uh,
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>> yeah,
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>> stories, you know, mystery stories. But
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uh I you know I don't know a lot more
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details about it. Um
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but it it it baffled investigators for
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for years and is probably one of the
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more famous um mysteries in Morgan
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County history. Certainly Jacksonville's
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history.
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>> Yeah.
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They uh now
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Morgan County I know Jacksonville just
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celebrated its bicesentennial of you
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know
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>> it was found in 1825.
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>> Um was Morgan County founded before
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after Jacksonville then?
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>> No. Morgan County was founded in 1823.
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>> Okay.
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>> It was separated from Green County.
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>> So
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>> and back then they still had I Scott
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County was part of it. Right. Well, when
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Morgan County was formed in 1823, it it
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included what it the the land which is
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now uh Cass County. All of all of Cass
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County and all of uh Scott County,
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>> right?
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>> Those counties weren't formed until the
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late 1830s.
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>> Cass in 37, 1837, and and Scott County
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was formed in 1839.
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>> Yeah. So, we've got 200 years worth of
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uh history in uh Jacksonville and
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surrounding towns that
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>> Right.
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>> and you know, it just it it
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as far as like, you know, this is a
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disappearance from the 1950s, which we
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feel like, okay, that's kind of a long
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time ago, but it's really really recent
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in Jacksonville
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>> history,
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>> you know. Well, it's kind of hard for me
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to believe that it was 24 years ago I
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almost 25 years ago that I wrote a story
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about it because it doesn't seem that
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long ago.
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So, uh but uh yeah, that's one of the
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more interesting stories. Another one
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that I I had previously mentioned to you
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that
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uh crime stuff always fascinates people.
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Well, I never wrote a lot about crime
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stories, but I did write a story
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>> which uh garnered a lot of attention
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back in 2002. I wrote a piece for the
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Journal Courier, a history feature
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>> about uh jailbreaks.
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>> Okay.
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>> Uh it mainly focused on one particular
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jailbreak uh from the old Morgan County
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Jail, which is long gone. It was torn
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down. It was built in 1864
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in Jacksonville in uh near downtown just
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south of of the square. Uh an Italian8
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style building which also was the
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sheriff's residence uh originally for
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many years. the front part of the
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building. It was a two-story brick
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building um with the decorative corbals
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or or cornice brackets that you know
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people are familiar with.
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>> Um
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>> but over the years in that building
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which was the jail for 120 years. Hard
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to believe. Yeah. especi especially
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given the fact that even as far back as
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the late 1800s
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um that people in the county were
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complaining about the condition of the
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jail and it wasn't suitable for uh for
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prisoners.
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So over the years uh there were a number
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of jailbreaks.
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>> But in 1950
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uh occurred one of the more daring
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escapes where um a handgun had been
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smuggled up to the prisoners. And when
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one of the jailers went to to um place a
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prisoner back into his cell,
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um
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he was struck over the head by another
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prisoner who reached through the bars, I
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guess, and hit him in the head
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>> and and I guess rendered him
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unconscious. I don't remember all of
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those details, but they they uh subdued
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him
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and then they got the jail keys. There
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were four prisoners being held there at
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the time. So, they got the jail keys and
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let out two other prisoners. So, there
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were there were four of them
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>> and they um they three of them went
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they they all left the jail. One of them
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left on foot and separated from the
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other three.
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>> Mhm.
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>> And uh the three of them h they stole a
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car. They stole a 1950 Mercury that was
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in a an alley close to the jail. I don't
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know where it was exactly, but they
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stole it
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>> and um then there was a high-speed chase
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uh through the county. They headed out
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toward Ashland
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>> and um the cops were quickly in pursuit
00:11:40.640 --> 00:11:44.710
and uh they even uh had radio broadcasts
00:11:44.720 --> 00:11:48.470
go out. But uh Charles Wrl, I talked to
00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:50.870
him again and he was a patrolman at that
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point. and he'd just been on the
00:11:52.000 --> 00:11:54.310
Jacksonville police force, but state
00:11:54.320 --> 00:11:58.550
police and uh Morgan County Sheriff's
00:11:58.560 --> 00:11:59.910
deputies,
00:11:59.920 --> 00:12:01.269
>> you know, there wouldn't have been those
00:12:01.279 --> 00:12:03.590
forces at that time. Those police forces
00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:06.790
were pretty small compared to today, but
00:12:06.800 --> 00:12:10.870
they they wound up chasing him or
00:12:10.880 --> 00:12:15.190
chasing the the stolen car and the three
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escape prisoners out and they caught
00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:22.230
him. Uh, I think the car was uh they ran
00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:25.910
it off the road around Illinois routes
00:12:25.920 --> 00:12:28.310
123 and 125.
00:12:28.320 --> 00:12:28.629
>> Okay.
00:12:28.639 --> 00:12:31.110
>> Which is east east of Ashland.
00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:31.590
>> Mhm.
00:12:31.600 --> 00:12:33.590
>> Yeah. Between Ashland and Pleasant
00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:34.949
Plains.
00:12:34.959 --> 00:12:37.430
>> And uh it was in November of the year,
00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:40.310
but they chased him through a cornfield
00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:44.069
on foot and caught them.
00:12:44.079 --> 00:12:46.790
And uh the they caught those three there
00:12:46.800 --> 00:12:48.629
and took him back to the Morgan County
00:12:48.639 --> 00:12:52.150
Jail. And then the fourth guy, he didn't
00:12:52.160 --> 00:12:54.710
get very far and they found him in uh
00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:57.350
down off of East State Street, like
00:12:57.360 --> 00:12:59.910
behind Centinary
00:12:59.920 --> 00:13:01.190
Methodist Church.
00:13:01.200 --> 00:13:01.590
>> Okay.
00:13:01.600 --> 00:13:03.590
>> What what he was doing he didn't get
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very far at all. So none of them got
00:13:05.680 --> 00:13:08.710
very far. But Chief Wrl told me it was
00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:11.110
an exciting time.
00:13:11.120 --> 00:13:14.790
And newspaper accounts in 1950s said
00:13:14.800 --> 00:13:18.470
that it was probably one of even though
00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:20.470
it didn't it only lasted like three
00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:23.590
hours the the manhunt but it it was one
00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:27.350
of the more u extensive manhunts because
00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:29.509
they got you know they the cops had
00:13:29.519 --> 00:13:30.550
radio.
00:13:30.560 --> 00:13:33.750
>> Yeah. uh at that time and they were able
00:13:33.760 --> 00:13:37.110
to to get a broadcast out that
00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:39.590
>> see and part of the reason and that it
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:42.389
was exciting was they when they before
00:13:42.399 --> 00:13:44.870
they left the jail they stole uh
00:13:44.880 --> 00:13:47.190
shotguns and a rifle
00:13:47.200 --> 00:13:50.550
>> so that they were armed and uh but they
00:13:50.560 --> 00:13:52.870
didn't put up a fight.
00:13:52.880 --> 00:13:54.389
>> Um
00:13:54.399 --> 00:13:56.550
but there were other jail escapes over
00:13:56.560 --> 00:13:59.750
the years. There were uh some guys one
00:13:59.760 --> 00:14:02.870
time got up into the attic of the jail
00:14:02.880 --> 00:14:05.269
and they took a knife and cut through
00:14:05.279 --> 00:14:06.949
it. Must have taken them quite a while,
00:14:06.959 --> 00:14:11.350
but they cut through the roof. And u
00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:11.750
Yeah.
00:14:11.760 --> 00:14:16.150
>> Yeah. And took uh blankets and made a
00:14:16.160 --> 00:14:19.750
rope blanket and escaped. And then there
00:14:19.760 --> 00:14:22.790
was another time um I think that was in
00:14:22.800 --> 00:14:27.030
1913. In in 1927, there were five guys
00:14:27.040 --> 00:14:29.829
that escaped, but I was never able to
00:14:29.839 --> 00:14:31.269
find out whether they were ever
00:14:31.279 --> 00:14:32.470
captured.
00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:36.069
>> And they busted a hole through somehow
00:14:36.079 --> 00:14:38.629
they got out of their cells. Oh, I know.
00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:43.350
Those were the guys who fashioned a key
00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:47.509
from a metal frame on a from a bed. They
00:14:47.519 --> 00:14:49.990
were able to fashion something that
00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:52.150
opened a cell door.
00:14:52.160 --> 00:14:52.870
>> Mhm.
00:14:52.880 --> 00:14:55.750
>> And where the jailers were, I have no
00:14:55.760 --> 00:14:58.069
idea. But then they busted a hole
00:14:58.079 --> 00:15:00.870
through a brick wall and they used rope
00:15:00.880 --> 00:15:03.670
blankets, too. But I'm not sure if the
00:15:03.680 --> 00:15:06.069
and that was the largest escape that I
00:15:06.079 --> 00:15:08.389
know about in terms of number of
00:15:08.399 --> 00:15:10.870
prisoners, but uh whether they were ever
00:15:10.880 --> 00:15:13.829
captured, I have no idea. So, and that
00:15:13.839 --> 00:15:17.110
was in 19 Yeah. 27.
00:15:17.120 --> 00:15:20.150
But there were other cases,
00:15:20.160 --> 00:15:23.829
you know, it's amazing that that jail,
00:15:23.839 --> 00:15:27.750
you know, when I was growing up, uh,
00:15:27.760 --> 00:15:30.069
you know, cuz when the jail closed, I
00:15:30.079 --> 00:15:32.310
was like 23 years old,
00:15:32.320 --> 00:15:34.790
>> the old jail closed. And it's amazing
00:15:34.800 --> 00:15:38.150
that having gone through there before
00:15:38.160 --> 00:15:40.550
they tore it down, it's amazing that it
00:15:40.560 --> 00:15:42.470
was suitable for
00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:45.350
>> for any prisoners. Well, it was in such
00:15:45.360 --> 00:15:47.110
deplorable condition.
00:15:47.120 --> 00:15:47.670
>> Yeah.
00:15:47.680 --> 00:15:51.509
>> So, but uh those are two th the
00:15:51.519 --> 00:15:54.629
disappearance of that man in 1959 and
00:15:54.639 --> 00:15:56.069
and
00:15:56.079 --> 00:16:00.150
>> the jailbreak uh story. Those are two of
00:16:00.160 --> 00:16:02.629
the more interesting ones. But, you
00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:04.069
know, over the years there there have
00:16:04.079 --> 00:16:06.389
been a lot of
00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:10.949
interesting stories, you know, and uh
00:16:10.959 --> 00:16:14.310
>> what what is a a myth about Morgan
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:16.870
County or Jacksonville area that people
00:16:16.880 --> 00:16:19.990
still think is true and you keep having
00:16:20.000 --> 00:16:22.629
to say, "No, this didn't really happen.
00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:24.550
No, this, you know, happened differently
00:16:24.560 --> 00:16:26.310
than what you've been told." Is there
00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:28.310
any, you know, prevailing myths out
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:29.350
there that, you know,
00:16:29.360 --> 00:16:31.590
>> Well, I try to dispel some of that
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:35.269
stuff. There's a building on um there's
00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:38.550
a building on South Diamond Street, not
00:16:38.560 --> 00:16:41.269
far from the McDonald's, which was a
00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:44.470
psych a private psychiatric hospital for
00:16:44.480 --> 00:16:46.230
many years, but
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:48.550
>> I've had people argue with me and say it
00:16:48.560 --> 00:16:50.870
was a tuberculosis sanitarium. Well,
00:16:50.880 --> 00:16:53.189
there was a tuberculosis sanitarium in
00:16:53.199 --> 00:16:55.030
Morgan County, but it was out on the
00:16:55.040 --> 00:16:57.430
east edge of town, out off of East
00:16:57.440 --> 00:16:58.790
Morton. Mhm.
00:16:58.800 --> 00:17:01.990
>> Uh that's one of the things people
00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:04.630
and and one thing that I hear over the
00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:08.390
years, people will um
00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:13.029
they'll discover like old coal shoots
00:17:13.039 --> 00:17:16.230
that are off their their 19th century
00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:18.949
house and they'll think that they were
00:17:18.959 --> 00:17:21.350
actually tunnels that
00:17:21.360 --> 00:17:23.669
>> because of the way it's formed, they'll
00:17:23.679 --> 00:17:27.829
say that there were tunnels. Um,
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:30.549
uh, I've heard tunnels more than
00:17:30.559 --> 00:17:33.110
anything over the years that are all
00:17:33.120 --> 00:17:36.150
over Jacksonville. Supposedly there I've
00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:38.310
heard people say there was one from the
00:17:38.320 --> 00:17:39.590
Illinois School for the Deaf
00:17:39.600 --> 00:17:41.430
Superintendent's House to the main
00:17:41.440 --> 00:17:44.150
building, but I've heard people that
00:17:44.160 --> 00:17:48.470
worked at ISD for years say,
00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:50.870
"No, that's not true. Plus, it wouldn't
00:17:50.880 --> 00:17:52.789
have made a lot of sense. Plus, the
00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:54.710
tunnel would have had to have been like
00:17:54.720 --> 00:17:58.710
over a hundred yards long, and
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:01.350
>> why really build it? But I've talked to
00:18:01.360 --> 00:18:03.669
people that lived in that house and they
00:18:03.679 --> 00:18:06.070
were like, we've heard that story, but
00:18:06.080 --> 00:18:08.390
we never saw any indication in our
00:18:08.400 --> 00:18:10.390
foundation that there was a tunnel that
00:18:10.400 --> 00:18:12.710
led, you know,
00:18:12.720 --> 00:18:15.830
>> um it just some of that stuff just
00:18:15.840 --> 00:18:18.789
doesn't make sense. So there were
00:18:18.799 --> 00:18:21.750
tunnels underneath
00:18:21.760 --> 00:18:25.270
or behind the old main building at the
00:18:25.280 --> 00:18:27.270
Jacksonville State Hospital,
00:18:27.280 --> 00:18:29.909
>> the bu the building where Elizabeth
00:18:29.919 --> 00:18:31.830
Packard once lived,
00:18:31.840 --> 00:18:35.270
>> but and those tunnels existed and may
00:18:35.280 --> 00:18:38.390
still be there. I'm not sure, but uh
00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:41.590
they were service tunnels that went to
00:18:41.600 --> 00:18:43.430
other buildings
00:18:43.440 --> 00:18:45.110
>> on the Jacksonville State Hospital
00:18:45.120 --> 00:18:46.630
property,
00:18:46.640 --> 00:18:48.950
which in more recent years before it
00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:50.310
closed, it was the Jacksonville
00:18:50.320 --> 00:18:51.830
Developmental Center.
00:18:51.840 --> 00:18:54.630
>> So, it was a it was a mental hospital
00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:56.549
from 1851
00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:59.430
until 2012. Mhm.
00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:01.029
>> But
00:19:01.039 --> 00:19:03.430
as far as tunnels, like underground
00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:05.990
railroad tunnels,
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:09.350
I those are those are things that I've
00:19:09.360 --> 00:19:11.909
heard over the years that I don't have
00:19:11.919 --> 00:19:14.630
any proof that they existed.
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:19.350
>> And um there were there are or were a
00:19:19.360 --> 00:19:21.750
number of Underground Railroad sites in
00:19:21.760 --> 00:19:24.150
the Jacksonville area that are
00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:27.750
documented. Um there's not a lot of
00:19:27.760 --> 00:19:30.150
documentation, but given the fact that
00:19:30.160 --> 00:19:34.710
they were it was a secretive network, um
00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:35.430
they're
00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:36.549
>> documented.
00:19:36.559 --> 00:19:37.270
>> Sure.
00:19:37.280 --> 00:19:37.750
>> Yeah.
00:19:37.760 --> 00:19:40.870
>> But the tunnels Yeah. That's one thing.
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:43.110
And and the thing about the psychiatric
00:19:43.120 --> 00:19:47.110
hospital being a tuberculosis scent. No,
00:19:47.120 --> 00:19:52.150
I because I've looked into that and uh
00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:53.669
yeah,
00:19:53.679 --> 00:19:55.669
I do know that the Jacksonville State
00:19:55.679 --> 00:19:59.830
Hospital would uh occasionally have they
00:19:59.840 --> 00:20:03.029
would treat tuberculosis patients, but
00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:04.870
you know, for the most part it was a
00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:09.110
mental health facility. Yeah. So,
00:20:09.120 --> 00:20:10.390
>> um,
00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:12.150
>> I'm sure there are other things that
00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:14.070
come up. You know, one thing that's
00:20:14.080 --> 00:20:17.510
interesting to me over the years, in
00:20:17.520 --> 00:20:19.830
more recent years, people have come up
00:20:19.840 --> 00:20:22.470
with uh these ghost stories, which I
00:20:22.480 --> 00:20:24.390
love a good ghost story, but
00:20:24.400 --> 00:20:26.789
>> some of these stories uh that are
00:20:26.799 --> 00:20:30.070
connected to um like Elani College, for
00:20:30.080 --> 00:20:33.990
example, they're easily disproven
00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:36.789
>> because they the the problem with at
00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:38.710
least one of those that I can think of
00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:42.950
is that they mention people that
00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:46.630
uh that were they mention historical
00:20:46.640 --> 00:20:48.870
figures that I know that's not what
00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:52.870
happened to them, you know. So,
00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:57.830
>> uh but no, I don't really know a lot of
00:20:57.840 --> 00:20:59.669
I don't really know of any other
00:20:59.679 --> 00:21:03.510
mysteries or uh that come to mind or or
00:21:03.520 --> 00:21:05.830
myths. I'm sure there are some out
00:21:05.840 --> 00:21:10.390
there, but people make claims that, you
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:13.590
know, they'll make claims about the uh
00:21:13.600 --> 00:21:17.029
the street car line uh like that the the
00:21:17.039 --> 00:21:19.830
the rails were electrified. Well, that's
00:21:19.840 --> 00:21:22.390
not true. It was a trolley system that
00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:22.789
>> yeah,
00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:25.110
>> there were wires that, you know, that
00:21:25.120 --> 00:21:27.590
that provided the electricity that
00:21:27.600 --> 00:21:29.830
powered the the motor.
00:21:29.840 --> 00:21:32.630
>> That's that's one that you'll see.
00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:35.029
that there was a round table on West
00:21:35.039 --> 00:21:36.950
State Street where the cars could turn
00:21:36.960 --> 00:21:38.070
around.
00:21:38.080 --> 00:21:40.310
>> I heard that one. Well, that's not true.
00:21:40.320 --> 00:21:42.870
There was there was a wide spot in the
00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:44.470
road, but that's where the cars could
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:46.390
meet, they could pass each other.
00:21:46.400 --> 00:21:47.190
>> Mhm.
00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:49.669
>> So, it just separated.
00:21:49.679 --> 00:21:52.950
Yeah. And that space that even though
00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:55.190
the street cars haven't run in
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:59.669
Jacksonville since 1930, the the the
00:21:59.679 --> 00:22:03.430
curb is still it's a wider spot in on
00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:05.830
West State Street where they could pass.
00:22:05.840 --> 00:22:07.909
The rails are long gone. But
00:22:07.919 --> 00:22:13.430
>> yeah, now I also know um and I I learned
00:22:13.440 --> 00:22:15.190
about this on your cemetery walk
00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:20.310
actually earlier this year was the uh
00:22:20.320 --> 00:22:23.029
um disputing the fact that Jacksonville
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:25.110
was actually named after Andrew Jackson,
00:22:25.120 --> 00:22:27.750
the president, and he was possibly named
00:22:27.760 --> 00:22:30.870
after a different Andrew Jackson who was
00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:33.430
uh buried there in Jacksonville.
00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:36.950
>> Right. Well, there was a
00:22:36.960 --> 00:22:39.430
a young black man. I don't know if he
00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:43.029
was an indentured servant or slave
00:22:43.039 --> 00:22:46.390
because I'm I don't know the history of
00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:48.789
slavery in Illinois whether it was still
00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:52.230
legal. But in 1825
00:22:52.240 --> 00:22:55.110
when the surveyors were laying out
00:22:55.120 --> 00:22:56.310
Jacksonville
00:22:56.320 --> 00:22:56.870
>> Mhm.
00:22:56.880 --> 00:23:00.390
>> the story goes there was this young uh
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:02.789
African-American
00:23:02.799 --> 00:23:03.750
boy.
00:23:03.760 --> 00:23:04.310
>> Mhm.
00:23:04.320 --> 00:23:08.070
>> I think he was like oh 11 years old or
00:23:08.080 --> 00:23:11.430
something. But he was running an errand
00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:16.310
for his owner or his employer.
00:23:16.320 --> 00:23:19.590
And um I word it that way cuz I'm I'm
00:23:19.600 --> 00:23:21.669
not clear
00:23:21.679 --> 00:23:24.870
as to to what he was. I do believe he
00:23:24.880 --> 00:23:28.870
was a slave at the time. But anyway,
00:23:28.880 --> 00:23:32.230
uh the town was being uh platted,
00:23:32.240 --> 00:23:37.029
surveyed, and um
00:23:37.039 --> 00:23:40.230
he stopped. His name the the the young
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:42.950
African-American was Andrew Jackson and
00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:47.590
he stopped and talked to the surveyors
00:23:47.600 --> 00:23:51.190
and uh they they asked him his name and
00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:53.750
he told them and they said, "Oh, well,
00:23:53.760 --> 00:23:56.230
we we think that's a great name and we
00:23:56.240 --> 00:23:59.190
we're going to name the town after you."
00:23:59.200 --> 00:23:59.750
Mhm.
00:23:59.760 --> 00:24:03.029
>> Well, the problem I have with that, and
00:24:03.039 --> 00:24:06.630
I I it this doesn't
00:24:06.640 --> 00:24:10.230
I don't want to sound racist, but it it
00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:13.190
has more to do with the fact that I
00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:15.669
doubt if the surveyors, first of all,
00:24:15.679 --> 00:24:18.390
named the town. I think the town was
00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:21.269
probably already named. To my knowledge,
00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:24.470
there's no record of whether the
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:27.990
commissioners that uh at the time
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:32.390
whether they um chose the site and the
00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:34.310
name for the town,
00:24:34.320 --> 00:24:38.070
>> but um
00:24:38.080 --> 00:24:40.230
but I think the town had already been
00:24:40.240 --> 00:24:43.750
named but not having any real proof of
00:24:43.760 --> 00:24:47.029
that. So years later after this happened
00:24:47.039 --> 00:24:49.350
in the 1880s there was a book published
00:24:49.360 --> 00:24:53.190
about early Jacksonville which was only
00:24:53.200 --> 00:24:56.470
like 60 years old at that point but
00:24:56.480 --> 00:24:59.190
>> Reverend Jackson was he he became a
00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:02.549
local minister and he told the story for
00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:05.350
the people who were compiling stories
00:25:05.360 --> 00:25:08.070
for the book and he told that story and
00:25:08.080 --> 00:25:10.230
to my knowledge that's the first time it
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.230
ever appeared in print
00:25:12.240 --> 00:25:15.110
>> and was uh readily available to the
00:25:15.120 --> 00:25:21.350
public. Um but um yeah, that's that's a
00:25:21.360 --> 00:25:24.950
problem I have. See, another part of
00:25:24.960 --> 00:25:28.149
that story is that
00:25:28.159 --> 00:25:31.029
despite what is on Wikipedia, which says
00:25:31.039 --> 00:25:32.549
Jacksonville
00:25:32.559 --> 00:25:35.190
was founded by New Englanders, which is
00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:37.990
not true, it was founded by people from
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.190
Tennessee and Kentucky and Virginia.
00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:44.390
mostly people that that settled in
00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:46.470
Morgan County in the early days were
00:25:46.480 --> 00:25:49.990
were Kuckians uh for for the the vast
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:52.549
majority of those people. So those
00:25:52.559 --> 00:25:55.510
people worshiped Andrew Jackson
00:25:55.520 --> 00:25:59.990
>> and uh who was the hero of of War of
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:02.789
1812. He was not
00:26:02.799 --> 00:26:05.029
elected president.
00:26:05.039 --> 00:26:08.390
He he was not president at the time.
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:11.669
I think uh in 1825
00:26:11.679 --> 00:26:14.630
it may have been John Quincy Adams but I
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:18.230
believe it was but but anyway um but
00:26:18.240 --> 00:26:21.029
Jackson was a well-known
00:26:21.039 --> 00:26:25.110
figure and a southerner and uh the
00:26:25.120 --> 00:26:28.230
chances of it being named after
00:26:28.240 --> 00:26:30.390
a boy
00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:31.830
you know
00:26:31.840 --> 00:26:34.789
>> but that's not to disparage him and and
00:26:34.799 --> 00:26:37.990
that young man went on to be very
00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:41.990
well-known prominent uh minister in
00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:45.350
Jacksonville and a Protestant minister.
00:26:45.360 --> 00:26:49.430
I think he was a Baptist minister and uh
00:26:49.440 --> 00:26:52.710
but for many years his grave in
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:55.269
Jacksonville Cemetery was unmarked. So
00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:58.630
back I don't know probably 30 years ago
00:26:58.640 --> 00:27:01.590
a group raised some money including the
00:27:01.600 --> 00:27:04.549
Morton County Historical Society and uh
00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:06.390
put a marker up for him.
00:27:06.400 --> 00:27:09.750
>> Mhm. Uh he was an alderman back I think
00:27:09.760 --> 00:27:12.230
in the 1870s
00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:15.269
uh and is believed to be
00:27:15.279 --> 00:27:17.750
it could be proven that he was the first
00:27:17.760 --> 00:27:19.430
African-American
00:27:19.440 --> 00:27:23.269
alderman in Jacksonville history. Yeah.
00:27:23.279 --> 00:27:26.789
>> So but his name was the same as uh as
00:27:26.799 --> 00:27:29.350
the more famous uh Andrew Jackson,
00:27:29.360 --> 00:27:31.430
President Andrew Jackson. So
00:27:31.440 --> 00:27:34.230
>> So that's that story
00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:36.310
>> in a nutshell.
00:27:36.320 --> 00:27:37.110
So
00:27:37.120 --> 00:27:39.909
>> yeah, there's all kinds of great history
00:27:39.919 --> 00:27:42.630
coming out of Morgan County.
00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:47.269
So um now if people wanted to get a hold
00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:49.110
of the Morgan County Historical Society,
00:27:49.120 --> 00:27:51.190
how can they do that?
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:54.870
>> Well, probably the best way, and I don't
00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:59.110
have a phone number handy, uh is to is
00:27:59.120 --> 00:28:05.430
to contact uh uh Karen Cybert. Um she
00:28:05.440 --> 00:28:08.149
handles uh questions for the historical
00:28:08.159 --> 00:28:09.110
society.
00:28:09.120 --> 00:28:09.669
>> Okay.
00:28:09.679 --> 00:28:11.190
>> Um
00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:15.669
but uh I don't have her email handy and
00:28:15.679 --> 00:28:16.950
>> um
00:28:16.960 --> 00:28:19.830
>> and her number, but uh contacting her
00:28:19.840 --> 00:28:23.269
through uh email would probably be best.
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:23.990
>> Okay.
00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:27.350
>> The historical society doesn't
00:28:27.360 --> 00:28:30.549
uh is not quite as active as it used to
00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:36.070
be. This past year, we we uh or I held
00:28:36.080 --> 00:28:39.269
um three cemetery tours in recognition
00:28:39.279 --> 00:28:42.310
of Jacksonville's 200th anniversary. And
00:28:42.320 --> 00:28:47.029
those were well sponsored by the county
00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:48.230
historical society.
00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:48.549
>> Yeah.
00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:50.950
>> And there's a shiakequa that's held
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:54.870
usually around Labor Day uh every year.
00:28:54.880 --> 00:28:57.029
Uh in recent years, it's been held at
00:28:57.039 --> 00:28:59.350
the Nicholls Park Pavilion. Mhm.
00:28:59.360 --> 00:29:03.029
>> So there'll be speakers and music and uh
00:29:03.039 --> 00:29:07.990
Yeah. So uh that's one of the the main
00:29:08.000 --> 00:29:11.269
things we do is programs. Uh it's a
00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:13.830
membership organization. Mhm.
00:29:13.840 --> 00:29:15.669
>> Um
00:29:15.679 --> 00:29:18.389
but um
00:29:18.399 --> 00:29:20.470
um
00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:22.950
>> yeah, Karen, if if you can get through
00:29:22.960 --> 00:29:25.350
to her
00:29:25.360 --> 00:29:28.630
>> um that's the best that's the best way.
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:31.350
>> All righty. Well, fantastic. Well, thank
00:29:31.360 --> 00:29:32.710
you so much for joining us today.
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:34.789
>> Oh, yeah. No problem. Yeah. Good luck
00:29:34.799 --> 00:29:39.029
with uh the rest of your your vignettes.
00:29:39.039 --> 00:29:39.590
Yes.
00:29:39.600 --> 00:29:43.159
>> Thank you so much.
Kind: captions
Language: en
00:00:11.040 --> 00:00:13.669
Um, so welcome to our second episode of
00:00:13.679 --> 00:00:16.230
Weird, Wild and Wonderful Illinois. Um,
00:00:16.240 --> 00:00:18.790
today we are talking with Greg Olsen who
00:00:18.800 --> 00:00:20.470
has been on the board of directors for
00:00:20.480 --> 00:00:22.710
the Morgan County Historical Society
00:00:22.720 --> 00:00:24.870
for, you know, about the last 40 years.
00:00:24.880 --> 00:00:26.390
So he knows a little bit about Morgan
00:00:26.400 --> 00:00:28.950
County history. And today we're just
00:00:28.960 --> 00:00:30.150
we're going to learn a little bit more
00:00:30.160 --> 00:00:31.589
about the Morgan County Historical
00:00:31.599 --> 00:00:34.470
Society and some of the weird and wild
00:00:34.480 --> 00:00:36.389
and crazy stories that we might not have
00:00:36.399 --> 00:00:38.229
heard before out of Morgan County. So,
00:00:38.239 --> 00:00:39.670
welcome Greg.
00:00:39.680 --> 00:00:43.670
>> Yeah. Uh good to see you, Miranda. Uh I
00:00:43.680 --> 00:00:47.110
hope uh State Historical Sai viewers en
00:00:47.120 --> 00:00:51.270
enjoy what I have to say. Um, as we had
00:00:51.280 --> 00:00:54.389
previously discussed, uh, something I
00:00:54.399 --> 00:00:56.869
thought I would talk a little bit about,
00:00:56.879 --> 00:00:59.430
not that I'm an expert on this, but one
00:00:59.440 --> 00:01:02.549
of the more bizarre stories in Morgan
00:01:02.559 --> 00:01:06.149
County history um, was the disappearance
00:01:06.159 --> 00:01:09.590
of a man in 1959
00:01:09.600 --> 00:01:12.630
from a motel in Jacksonville.
00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:13.750
>> Okay.
00:01:13.760 --> 00:01:16.950
>> Yeah. So, his name was uh Bruce Campbell
00:01:16.960 --> 00:01:18.870
Senior.
00:01:18.880 --> 00:01:22.070
And in April of 1959,
00:01:22.080 --> 00:01:25.990
he and his wife drove from Northampton,
00:01:26.000 --> 00:01:27.590
Massachusetts
00:01:27.600 --> 00:01:30.310
to Jacksonville to visit their son, who
00:01:30.320 --> 00:01:33.030
was a a chemistry
00:01:33.040 --> 00:01:35.270
uh instructor. I'm not sure if he was a
00:01:35.280 --> 00:01:37.990
professor or not, but he was an in a
00:01:38.000 --> 00:01:39.910
chemistry instructor at McMurray
00:01:39.920 --> 00:01:41.990
College, which is now which is now
00:01:42.000 --> 00:01:42.789
closed.
00:01:42.799 --> 00:01:43.749
>> Yeah.
00:01:43.759 --> 00:01:47.190
But uh they checked into a motel which
00:01:47.200 --> 00:01:49.830
no longer exists out on West Walnut
00:01:49.840 --> 00:01:53.190
Street in the north uh west part of
00:01:53.200 --> 00:01:54.710
Jacksonville.
00:01:54.720 --> 00:01:57.910
>> It was called the Sandman Motel. And the
00:01:57.920 --> 00:02:03.590
story goes that in the night he uh Mr.
00:02:03.600 --> 00:02:06.709
Campbell told his wife that he was
00:02:06.719 --> 00:02:09.830
worried that he hadn't locked their car
00:02:09.840 --> 00:02:13.350
and she talked him out of going to the
00:02:13.360 --> 00:02:14.710
car to check.
00:02:14.720 --> 00:02:15.350
>> Mhm.
00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:18.229
>> But early in the morning, like around
00:02:18.239 --> 00:02:24.470
2:00, 2:15, she woke up and he was gone.
00:02:24.480 --> 00:02:27.110
>> Well, the weird part of the story is
00:02:27.120 --> 00:02:28.710
that
00:02:28.720 --> 00:02:31.350
his car was still there. His car keys
00:02:31.360 --> 00:02:34.790
were still there. his wal his wallet and
00:02:34.800 --> 00:02:38.470
all of his money was still there and he
00:02:38.480 --> 00:02:42.630
walked away in the night in his green
00:02:42.640 --> 00:02:45.110
monogram pajamas
00:02:45.120 --> 00:02:48.390
with and he left his shoes or slippers
00:02:48.400 --> 00:02:50.070
behind
00:02:50.080 --> 00:02:53.750
>> and so um
00:02:53.760 --> 00:02:56.790
the police were called of course I don't
00:02:56.800 --> 00:02:59.670
know they waited 24 hours like they do
00:02:59.680 --> 00:03:03.030
now but the police were informed that he
00:03:03.040 --> 00:03:05.030
disappeared.
00:03:05.040 --> 00:03:09.030
>> So, they spent a week uh state police,
00:03:09.040 --> 00:03:11.350
Illinois State Police, Morgan County
00:03:11.360 --> 00:03:14.790
Sheriff's Deputies, Jacksonville police,
00:03:14.800 --> 00:03:18.550
McMurray College students in and at that
00:03:18.560 --> 00:03:22.149
time, McMurray had just been co-ed for a
00:03:22.159 --> 00:03:24.949
couple of years. So, there were over 200
00:03:24.959 --> 00:03:26.470
Male
00:03:26.480 --> 00:03:29.750
students that helped with the search.
00:03:29.760 --> 00:03:31.589
Um,
00:03:31.599 --> 00:03:34.550
but they never found any trace of him.
00:03:34.560 --> 00:03:38.470
So, back in 2001,
00:03:38.480 --> 00:03:42.229
I wrote a story for the uh Jacksonville
00:03:42.239 --> 00:03:44.070
Journal Courier
00:03:44.080 --> 00:03:46.309
about this disappearance other people
00:03:46.319 --> 00:03:47.990
have written about over the years. In
00:03:48.000 --> 00:03:52.390
fact, it's even been in Reader Digest uh
00:03:52.400 --> 00:03:55.910
with under unexplained mysteries or
00:03:55.920 --> 00:04:01.270
something like that. But um in 2001, I
00:04:01.280 --> 00:04:04.869
talked to um
00:04:04.879 --> 00:04:07.670
uh retired Jacksonville police officer
00:04:07.680 --> 00:04:11.990
and and longtime police chief uh Charles
00:04:12.000 --> 00:04:12.949
Wrl.
00:04:12.959 --> 00:04:13.350
>> Uhhuh.
00:04:13.360 --> 00:04:17.749
>> And he he was um a patrolman back in 19
00:04:17.759 --> 00:04:19.670
no he was a captain on the police force
00:04:19.680 --> 00:04:23.270
in 1959 and soon to be named chief. Mhm.
00:04:23.280 --> 00:04:25.430
>> But he told me there were all sorts of
00:04:25.440 --> 00:04:27.030
theories
00:04:27.040 --> 00:04:30.790
um as to what happened to this this man
00:04:30.800 --> 00:04:33.430
uh including that he may have fallen
00:04:33.440 --> 00:04:36.469
into an abandoned well. Well, okay.
00:04:36.479 --> 00:04:39.030
>> All the all these years later and now
00:04:39.040 --> 00:04:41.030
it's 66
00:04:41.040 --> 00:04:42.550
years have passed.
00:04:42.560 --> 00:04:43.270
>> Mhm.
00:04:43.280 --> 00:04:46.150
>> Um they there's never been any trace of
00:04:46.160 --> 00:04:50.629
him. Even his hometown newspaper back in
00:04:50.639 --> 00:04:53.110
Massachusetts put reporters onto the
00:04:53.120 --> 00:04:57.189
story to see if they could track his
00:04:57.199 --> 00:04:59.189
down his whereabouts. Of course, this is
00:04:59.199 --> 00:05:02.790
long before there was the internet and
00:05:02.800 --> 00:05:05.430
you know other means of trying to track
00:05:05.440 --> 00:05:07.350
people down and
00:05:07.360 --> 00:05:10.469
>> but there was uh there's never been any
00:05:10.479 --> 00:05:17.990
any uh finding of of his remains. Um, so
00:05:18.000 --> 00:05:20.550
they even put a boat, uh, the fire
00:05:20.560 --> 00:05:22.790
department in Jacksonville even took a
00:05:22.800 --> 00:05:26.790
rescue boat to, uh, a rather narrow
00:05:26.800 --> 00:05:29.510
creek that flows,
00:05:29.520 --> 00:05:33.510
uh, it mostly flows uh, from east of
00:05:33.520 --> 00:05:35.990
Jacksonville to the Illinois River. And
00:05:36.000 --> 00:05:38.790
they they took this boat down a
00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:43.510
rainswollen Moistar Creek uh for miles
00:05:43.520 --> 00:05:46.469
looking for his body, thinking he may
00:05:46.479 --> 00:05:48.310
have fallen
00:05:48.320 --> 00:05:51.110
>> into the creek, which the creek from the
00:05:51.120 --> 00:05:54.150
motel was probably
00:05:54.160 --> 00:05:57.749
>> uh maybe a mile away to the north of of
00:05:57.759 --> 00:06:00.070
the motel. But um
00:06:00.080 --> 00:06:02.230
>> yeah, it's an interesting story and and
00:06:02.240 --> 00:06:04.150
as I said, other people have written
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:09.029
about this. So, uh, and it probably
00:06:09.039 --> 00:06:11.830
has been on national news broadcasts
00:06:11.840 --> 00:06:14.950
over the years, you know, just under
00:06:14.960 --> 00:06:16.550
unexplained, uh,
00:06:16.560 --> 00:06:17.510
>> yeah,
00:06:17.520 --> 00:06:20.309
>> stories, you know, mystery stories. But
00:06:20.319 --> 00:06:23.510
uh I you know I don't know a lot more
00:06:23.520 --> 00:06:26.309
details about it. Um
00:06:26.319 --> 00:06:30.629
but it it it baffled investigators for
00:06:30.639 --> 00:06:33.749
for years and is probably one of the
00:06:33.759 --> 00:06:39.110
more famous um mysteries in Morgan
00:06:39.120 --> 00:06:41.670
County history. Certainly Jacksonville's
00:06:41.680 --> 00:06:42.230
history.
00:06:42.240 --> 00:06:43.670
>> Yeah.
00:06:43.680 --> 00:06:46.230
They uh now
00:06:46.240 --> 00:06:48.150
Morgan County I know Jacksonville just
00:06:48.160 --> 00:06:51.270
celebrated its bicesentennial of you
00:06:51.280 --> 00:06:51.909
know
00:06:51.919 --> 00:06:54.150
>> it was found in 1825.
00:06:54.160 --> 00:06:56.870
>> Um was Morgan County founded before
00:06:56.880 --> 00:06:58.629
after Jacksonville then?
00:06:58.639 --> 00:07:02.790
>> No. Morgan County was founded in 1823.
00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:03.350
>> Okay.
00:07:03.360 --> 00:07:07.189
>> It was separated from Green County.
00:07:07.199 --> 00:07:07.749
>> So
00:07:07.759 --> 00:07:10.390
>> and back then they still had I Scott
00:07:10.400 --> 00:07:12.950
County was part of it. Right. Well, when
00:07:12.960 --> 00:07:16.870
Morgan County was formed in 1823, it it
00:07:16.880 --> 00:07:19.510
included what it the the land which is
00:07:19.520 --> 00:07:23.589
now uh Cass County. All of all of Cass
00:07:23.599 --> 00:07:26.469
County and all of uh Scott County,
00:07:26.479 --> 00:07:26.950
>> right?
00:07:26.960 --> 00:07:29.270
>> Those counties weren't formed until the
00:07:29.280 --> 00:07:32.230
late 1830s.
00:07:32.240 --> 00:07:36.390
>> Cass in 37, 1837, and and Scott County
00:07:36.400 --> 00:07:39.029
was formed in 1839.
00:07:39.039 --> 00:07:43.430
>> Yeah. So, we've got 200 years worth of
00:07:43.440 --> 00:07:45.990
uh history in uh Jacksonville and
00:07:46.000 --> 00:07:48.070
surrounding towns that
00:07:48.080 --> 00:07:48.790
>> Right.
00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:54.070
>> and you know, it just it it
00:07:54.080 --> 00:07:55.749
as far as like, you know, this is a
00:07:55.759 --> 00:07:58.469
disappearance from the 1950s, which we
00:07:58.479 --> 00:07:59.990
feel like, okay, that's kind of a long
00:08:00.000 --> 00:08:02.390
time ago, but it's really really recent
00:08:02.400 --> 00:08:03.830
in Jacksonville
00:08:03.840 --> 00:08:05.029
>> history,
00:08:05.039 --> 00:08:07.270
>> you know. Well, it's kind of hard for me
00:08:07.280 --> 00:08:10.070
to believe that it was 24 years ago I
00:08:10.080 --> 00:08:12.550
almost 25 years ago that I wrote a story
00:08:12.560 --> 00:08:14.230
about it because it doesn't seem that
00:08:14.240 --> 00:08:16.070
long ago.
00:08:16.080 --> 00:08:20.070
So, uh but uh yeah, that's one of the
00:08:20.080 --> 00:08:22.070
more interesting stories. Another one
00:08:22.080 --> 00:08:25.430
that I I had previously mentioned to you
00:08:25.440 --> 00:08:27.029
that
00:08:27.039 --> 00:08:29.510
uh crime stuff always fascinates people.
00:08:29.520 --> 00:08:31.990
Well, I never wrote a lot about crime
00:08:32.000 --> 00:08:35.110
stories, but I did write a story
00:08:35.120 --> 00:08:37.509
>> which uh garnered a lot of attention
00:08:37.519 --> 00:08:40.550
back in 2002. I wrote a piece for the
00:08:40.560 --> 00:08:43.430
Journal Courier, a history feature
00:08:43.440 --> 00:08:45.829
>> about uh jailbreaks.
00:08:45.839 --> 00:08:46.389
>> Okay.
00:08:46.399 --> 00:08:50.550
>> Uh it mainly focused on one particular
00:08:50.560 --> 00:08:54.070
jailbreak uh from the old Morgan County
00:08:54.080 --> 00:08:56.630
Jail, which is long gone. It was torn
00:08:56.640 --> 00:08:59.829
down. It was built in 1864
00:08:59.839 --> 00:09:04.150
in Jacksonville in uh near downtown just
00:09:04.160 --> 00:09:08.710
south of of the square. Uh an Italian8
00:09:08.720 --> 00:09:11.269
style building which also was the
00:09:11.279 --> 00:09:14.310
sheriff's residence uh originally for
00:09:14.320 --> 00:09:16.070
many years. the front part of the
00:09:16.080 --> 00:09:18.150
building. It was a two-story brick
00:09:18.160 --> 00:09:22.630
building um with the decorative corbals
00:09:22.640 --> 00:09:25.509
or or cornice brackets that you know
00:09:25.519 --> 00:09:27.350
people are familiar with.
00:09:27.360 --> 00:09:29.910
>> Um
00:09:29.920 --> 00:09:34.070
>> but over the years in that building
00:09:34.080 --> 00:09:37.430
which was the jail for 120 years. Hard
00:09:37.440 --> 00:09:39.430
to believe. Yeah. especi especially
00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:42.230
given the fact that even as far back as
00:09:42.240 --> 00:09:45.750
the late 1800s
00:09:45.760 --> 00:09:49.110
um that people in the county were
00:09:49.120 --> 00:09:51.110
complaining about the condition of the
00:09:51.120 --> 00:09:55.670
jail and it wasn't suitable for uh for
00:09:55.680 --> 00:09:57.430
prisoners.
00:09:57.440 --> 00:10:00.710
So over the years uh there were a number
00:10:00.720 --> 00:10:03.110
of jailbreaks.
00:10:03.120 --> 00:10:05.990
>> But in 1950
00:10:06.000 --> 00:10:08.710
uh occurred one of the more daring
00:10:08.720 --> 00:10:14.310
escapes where um a handgun had been
00:10:14.320 --> 00:10:16.949
smuggled up to the prisoners. And when
00:10:16.959 --> 00:10:22.310
one of the jailers went to to um place a
00:10:22.320 --> 00:10:26.230
prisoner back into his cell,
00:10:26.240 --> 00:10:27.990
um
00:10:28.000 --> 00:10:30.389
he was struck over the head by another
00:10:30.399 --> 00:10:32.310
prisoner who reached through the bars, I
00:10:32.320 --> 00:10:34.389
guess, and hit him in the head
00:10:34.399 --> 00:10:36.550
>> and and I guess rendered him
00:10:36.560 --> 00:10:38.310
unconscious. I don't remember all of
00:10:38.320 --> 00:10:41.829
those details, but they they uh subdued
00:10:41.839 --> 00:10:43.430
him
00:10:43.440 --> 00:10:47.030
and then they got the jail keys. There
00:10:47.040 --> 00:10:49.670
were four prisoners being held there at
00:10:49.680 --> 00:10:52.470
the time. So, they got the jail keys and
00:10:52.480 --> 00:10:55.350
let out two other prisoners. So, there
00:10:55.360 --> 00:10:57.750
were there were four of them
00:10:57.760 --> 00:11:03.350
>> and they um they three of them went
00:11:03.360 --> 00:11:05.590
they they all left the jail. One of them
00:11:05.600 --> 00:11:08.310
left on foot and separated from the
00:11:08.320 --> 00:11:09.430
other three.
00:11:09.440 --> 00:11:09.990
>> Mhm.
00:11:10.000 --> 00:11:13.430
>> And uh the three of them h they stole a
00:11:13.440 --> 00:11:16.710
car. They stole a 1950 Mercury that was
00:11:16.720 --> 00:11:20.630
in a an alley close to the jail. I don't
00:11:20.640 --> 00:11:22.870
know where it was exactly, but they
00:11:22.880 --> 00:11:24.230
stole it
00:11:24.240 --> 00:11:29.190
>> and um then there was a high-speed chase
00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:32.069
uh through the county. They headed out
00:11:32.079 --> 00:11:34.150
toward Ashland
00:11:34.160 --> 00:11:40.630
>> and um the cops were quickly in pursuit
00:11:40.640 --> 00:11:44.710
and uh they even uh had radio broadcasts
00:11:44.720 --> 00:11:48.470
go out. But uh Charles Wrl, I talked to
00:11:48.480 --> 00:11:50.870
him again and he was a patrolman at that
00:11:50.880 --> 00:11:51.990
point. and he'd just been on the
00:11:52.000 --> 00:11:54.310
Jacksonville police force, but state
00:11:54.320 --> 00:11:58.550
police and uh Morgan County Sheriff's
00:11:58.560 --> 00:11:59.910
deputies,
00:11:59.920 --> 00:12:01.269
>> you know, there wouldn't have been those
00:12:01.279 --> 00:12:03.590
forces at that time. Those police forces
00:12:03.600 --> 00:12:06.790
were pretty small compared to today, but
00:12:06.800 --> 00:12:10.870
they they wound up chasing him or
00:12:10.880 --> 00:12:15.190
chasing the the stolen car and the three
00:12:15.200 --> 00:12:18.389
escape prisoners out and they caught
00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:22.230
him. Uh, I think the car was uh they ran
00:12:22.240 --> 00:12:25.910
it off the road around Illinois routes
00:12:25.920 --> 00:12:28.310
123 and 125.
00:12:28.320 --> 00:12:28.629
>> Okay.
00:12:28.639 --> 00:12:31.110
>> Which is east east of Ashland.
00:12:31.120 --> 00:12:31.590
>> Mhm.
00:12:31.600 --> 00:12:33.590
>> Yeah. Between Ashland and Pleasant
00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:34.949
Plains.
00:12:34.959 --> 00:12:37.430
>> And uh it was in November of the year,
00:12:37.440 --> 00:12:40.310
but they chased him through a cornfield
00:12:40.320 --> 00:12:44.069
on foot and caught them.
00:12:44.079 --> 00:12:46.790
And uh the they caught those three there
00:12:46.800 --> 00:12:48.629
and took him back to the Morgan County
00:12:48.639 --> 00:12:52.150
Jail. And then the fourth guy, he didn't
00:12:52.160 --> 00:12:54.710
get very far and they found him in uh
00:12:54.720 --> 00:12:57.350
down off of East State Street, like
00:12:57.360 --> 00:12:59.910
behind Centinary
00:12:59.920 --> 00:13:01.190
Methodist Church.
00:13:01.200 --> 00:13:01.590
>> Okay.
00:13:01.600 --> 00:13:03.590
>> What what he was doing he didn't get
00:13:03.600 --> 00:13:05.670
very far at all. So none of them got
00:13:05.680 --> 00:13:08.710
very far. But Chief Wrl told me it was
00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:11.110
an exciting time.
00:13:11.120 --> 00:13:14.790
And newspaper accounts in 1950s said
00:13:14.800 --> 00:13:18.470
that it was probably one of even though
00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:20.470
it didn't it only lasted like three
00:13:20.480 --> 00:13:23.590
hours the the manhunt but it it was one
00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:27.350
of the more u extensive manhunts because
00:13:27.360 --> 00:13:29.509
they got you know they the cops had
00:13:29.519 --> 00:13:30.550
radio.
00:13:30.560 --> 00:13:33.750
>> Yeah. uh at that time and they were able
00:13:33.760 --> 00:13:37.110
to to get a broadcast out that
00:13:37.120 --> 00:13:39.590
>> see and part of the reason and that it
00:13:39.600 --> 00:13:42.389
was exciting was they when they before
00:13:42.399 --> 00:13:44.870
they left the jail they stole uh
00:13:44.880 --> 00:13:47.190
shotguns and a rifle
00:13:47.200 --> 00:13:50.550
>> so that they were armed and uh but they
00:13:50.560 --> 00:13:52.870
didn't put up a fight.
00:13:52.880 --> 00:13:54.389
>> Um
00:13:54.399 --> 00:13:56.550
but there were other jail escapes over
00:13:56.560 --> 00:13:59.750
the years. There were uh some guys one
00:13:59.760 --> 00:14:02.870
time got up into the attic of the jail
00:14:02.880 --> 00:14:05.269
and they took a knife and cut through
00:14:05.279 --> 00:14:06.949
it. Must have taken them quite a while,
00:14:06.959 --> 00:14:11.350
but they cut through the roof. And u
00:14:11.360 --> 00:14:11.750
Yeah.
00:14:11.760 --> 00:14:16.150
>> Yeah. And took uh blankets and made a
00:14:16.160 --> 00:14:19.750
rope blanket and escaped. And then there
00:14:19.760 --> 00:14:22.790
was another time um I think that was in
00:14:22.800 --> 00:14:27.030
1913. In in 1927, there were five guys
00:14:27.040 --> 00:14:29.829
that escaped, but I was never able to
00:14:29.839 --> 00:14:31.269
find out whether they were ever
00:14:31.279 --> 00:14:32.470
captured.
00:14:32.480 --> 00:14:36.069
>> And they busted a hole through somehow
00:14:36.079 --> 00:14:38.629
they got out of their cells. Oh, I know.
00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:43.350
Those were the guys who fashioned a key
00:14:43.360 --> 00:14:47.509
from a metal frame on a from a bed. They
00:14:47.519 --> 00:14:49.990
were able to fashion something that
00:14:50.000 --> 00:14:52.150
opened a cell door.
00:14:52.160 --> 00:14:52.870
>> Mhm.
00:14:52.880 --> 00:14:55.750
>> And where the jailers were, I have no
00:14:55.760 --> 00:14:58.069
idea. But then they busted a hole
00:14:58.079 --> 00:15:00.870
through a brick wall and they used rope
00:15:00.880 --> 00:15:03.670
blankets, too. But I'm not sure if the
00:15:03.680 --> 00:15:06.069
and that was the largest escape that I
00:15:06.079 --> 00:15:08.389
know about in terms of number of
00:15:08.399 --> 00:15:10.870
prisoners, but uh whether they were ever
00:15:10.880 --> 00:15:13.829
captured, I have no idea. So, and that
00:15:13.839 --> 00:15:17.110
was in 19 Yeah. 27.
00:15:17.120 --> 00:15:20.150
But there were other cases,
00:15:20.160 --> 00:15:23.829
you know, it's amazing that that jail,
00:15:23.839 --> 00:15:27.750
you know, when I was growing up, uh,
00:15:27.760 --> 00:15:30.069
you know, cuz when the jail closed, I
00:15:30.079 --> 00:15:32.310
was like 23 years old,
00:15:32.320 --> 00:15:34.790
>> the old jail closed. And it's amazing
00:15:34.800 --> 00:15:38.150
that having gone through there before
00:15:38.160 --> 00:15:40.550
they tore it down, it's amazing that it
00:15:40.560 --> 00:15:42.470
was suitable for
00:15:42.480 --> 00:15:45.350
>> for any prisoners. Well, it was in such
00:15:45.360 --> 00:15:47.110
deplorable condition.
00:15:47.120 --> 00:15:47.670
>> Yeah.
00:15:47.680 --> 00:15:51.509
>> So, but uh those are two th the
00:15:51.519 --> 00:15:54.629
disappearance of that man in 1959 and
00:15:54.639 --> 00:15:56.069
and
00:15:56.079 --> 00:16:00.150
>> the jailbreak uh story. Those are two of
00:16:00.160 --> 00:16:02.629
the more interesting ones. But, you
00:16:02.639 --> 00:16:04.069
know, over the years there there have
00:16:04.079 --> 00:16:06.389
been a lot of
00:16:06.399 --> 00:16:10.949
interesting stories, you know, and uh
00:16:10.959 --> 00:16:14.310
>> what what is a a myth about Morgan
00:16:14.320 --> 00:16:16.870
County or Jacksonville area that people
00:16:16.880 --> 00:16:19.990
still think is true and you keep having
00:16:20.000 --> 00:16:22.629
to say, "No, this didn't really happen.
00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:24.550
No, this, you know, happened differently
00:16:24.560 --> 00:16:26.310
than what you've been told." Is there
00:16:26.320 --> 00:16:28.310
any, you know, prevailing myths out
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:29.350
there that, you know,
00:16:29.360 --> 00:16:31.590
>> Well, I try to dispel some of that
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:35.269
stuff. There's a building on um there's
00:16:35.279 --> 00:16:38.550
a building on South Diamond Street, not
00:16:38.560 --> 00:16:41.269
far from the McDonald's, which was a
00:16:41.279 --> 00:16:44.470
psych a private psychiatric hospital for
00:16:44.480 --> 00:16:46.230
many years, but
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:48.550
>> I've had people argue with me and say it
00:16:48.560 --> 00:16:50.870
was a tuberculosis sanitarium. Well,
00:16:50.880 --> 00:16:53.189
there was a tuberculosis sanitarium in
00:16:53.199 --> 00:16:55.030
Morgan County, but it was out on the
00:16:55.040 --> 00:16:57.430
east edge of town, out off of East
00:16:57.440 --> 00:16:58.790
Morton. Mhm.
00:16:58.800 --> 00:17:01.990
>> Uh that's one of the things people
00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:04.630
and and one thing that I hear over the
00:17:04.640 --> 00:17:08.390
years, people will um
00:17:08.400 --> 00:17:13.029
they'll discover like old coal shoots
00:17:13.039 --> 00:17:16.230
that are off their their 19th century
00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:18.949
house and they'll think that they were
00:17:18.959 --> 00:17:21.350
actually tunnels that
00:17:21.360 --> 00:17:23.669
>> because of the way it's formed, they'll
00:17:23.679 --> 00:17:27.829
say that there were tunnels. Um,
00:17:27.839 --> 00:17:30.549
uh, I've heard tunnels more than
00:17:30.559 --> 00:17:33.110
anything over the years that are all
00:17:33.120 --> 00:17:36.150
over Jacksonville. Supposedly there I've
00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:38.310
heard people say there was one from the
00:17:38.320 --> 00:17:39.590
Illinois School for the Deaf
00:17:39.600 --> 00:17:41.430
Superintendent's House to the main
00:17:41.440 --> 00:17:44.150
building, but I've heard people that
00:17:44.160 --> 00:17:48.470
worked at ISD for years say,
00:17:48.480 --> 00:17:50.870
"No, that's not true. Plus, it wouldn't
00:17:50.880 --> 00:17:52.789
have made a lot of sense. Plus, the
00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:54.710
tunnel would have had to have been like
00:17:54.720 --> 00:17:58.710
over a hundred yards long, and
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:01.350
>> why really build it? But I've talked to
00:18:01.360 --> 00:18:03.669
people that lived in that house and they
00:18:03.679 --> 00:18:06.070
were like, we've heard that story, but
00:18:06.080 --> 00:18:08.390
we never saw any indication in our
00:18:08.400 --> 00:18:10.390
foundation that there was a tunnel that
00:18:10.400 --> 00:18:12.710
led, you know,
00:18:12.720 --> 00:18:15.830
>> um it just some of that stuff just
00:18:15.840 --> 00:18:18.789
doesn't make sense. So there were
00:18:18.799 --> 00:18:21.750
tunnels underneath
00:18:21.760 --> 00:18:25.270
or behind the old main building at the
00:18:25.280 --> 00:18:27.270
Jacksonville State Hospital,
00:18:27.280 --> 00:18:29.909
>> the bu the building where Elizabeth
00:18:29.919 --> 00:18:31.830
Packard once lived,
00:18:31.840 --> 00:18:35.270
>> but and those tunnels existed and may
00:18:35.280 --> 00:18:38.390
still be there. I'm not sure, but uh
00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:41.590
they were service tunnels that went to
00:18:41.600 --> 00:18:43.430
other buildings
00:18:43.440 --> 00:18:45.110
>> on the Jacksonville State Hospital
00:18:45.120 --> 00:18:46.630
property,
00:18:46.640 --> 00:18:48.950
which in more recent years before it
00:18:48.960 --> 00:18:50.310
closed, it was the Jacksonville
00:18:50.320 --> 00:18:51.830
Developmental Center.
00:18:51.840 --> 00:18:54.630
>> So, it was a it was a mental hospital
00:18:54.640 --> 00:18:56.549
from 1851
00:18:56.559 --> 00:18:59.430
until 2012. Mhm.
00:18:59.440 --> 00:19:01.029
>> But
00:19:01.039 --> 00:19:03.430
as far as tunnels, like underground
00:19:03.440 --> 00:19:05.990
railroad tunnels,
00:19:06.000 --> 00:19:09.350
I those are those are things that I've
00:19:09.360 --> 00:19:11.909
heard over the years that I don't have
00:19:11.919 --> 00:19:14.630
any proof that they existed.
00:19:14.640 --> 00:19:19.350
>> And um there were there are or were a
00:19:19.360 --> 00:19:21.750
number of Underground Railroad sites in
00:19:21.760 --> 00:19:24.150
the Jacksonville area that are
00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:27.750
documented. Um there's not a lot of
00:19:27.760 --> 00:19:30.150
documentation, but given the fact that
00:19:30.160 --> 00:19:34.710
they were it was a secretive network, um
00:19:34.720 --> 00:19:35.430
they're
00:19:35.440 --> 00:19:36.549
>> documented.
00:19:36.559 --> 00:19:37.270
>> Sure.
00:19:37.280 --> 00:19:37.750
>> Yeah.
00:19:37.760 --> 00:19:40.870
>> But the tunnels Yeah. That's one thing.
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:43.110
And and the thing about the psychiatric
00:19:43.120 --> 00:19:47.110
hospital being a tuberculosis scent. No,
00:19:47.120 --> 00:19:52.150
I because I've looked into that and uh
00:19:52.160 --> 00:19:53.669
yeah,
00:19:53.679 --> 00:19:55.669
I do know that the Jacksonville State
00:19:55.679 --> 00:19:59.830
Hospital would uh occasionally have they
00:19:59.840 --> 00:20:03.029
would treat tuberculosis patients, but
00:20:03.039 --> 00:20:04.870
you know, for the most part it was a
00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:09.110
mental health facility. Yeah. So,
00:20:09.120 --> 00:20:10.390
>> um,
00:20:10.400 --> 00:20:12.150
>> I'm sure there are other things that
00:20:12.160 --> 00:20:14.070
come up. You know, one thing that's
00:20:14.080 --> 00:20:17.510
interesting to me over the years, in
00:20:17.520 --> 00:20:19.830
more recent years, people have come up
00:20:19.840 --> 00:20:22.470
with uh these ghost stories, which I
00:20:22.480 --> 00:20:24.390
love a good ghost story, but
00:20:24.400 --> 00:20:26.789
>> some of these stories uh that are
00:20:26.799 --> 00:20:30.070
connected to um like Elani College, for
00:20:30.080 --> 00:20:33.990
example, they're easily disproven
00:20:34.000 --> 00:20:36.789
>> because they the the problem with at
00:20:36.799 --> 00:20:38.710
least one of those that I can think of
00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:42.950
is that they mention people that
00:20:42.960 --> 00:20:46.630
uh that were they mention historical
00:20:46.640 --> 00:20:48.870
figures that I know that's not what
00:20:48.880 --> 00:20:52.870
happened to them, you know. So,
00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:57.830
>> uh but no, I don't really know a lot of
00:20:57.840 --> 00:20:59.669
I don't really know of any other
00:20:59.679 --> 00:21:03.510
mysteries or uh that come to mind or or
00:21:03.520 --> 00:21:05.830
myths. I'm sure there are some out
00:21:05.840 --> 00:21:10.390
there, but people make claims that, you
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:13.590
know, they'll make claims about the uh
00:21:13.600 --> 00:21:17.029
the street car line uh like that the the
00:21:17.039 --> 00:21:19.830
the rails were electrified. Well, that's
00:21:19.840 --> 00:21:22.390
not true. It was a trolley system that
00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:22.789
>> yeah,
00:21:22.799 --> 00:21:25.110
>> there were wires that, you know, that
00:21:25.120 --> 00:21:27.590
that provided the electricity that
00:21:27.600 --> 00:21:29.830
powered the the motor.
00:21:29.840 --> 00:21:32.630
>> That's that's one that you'll see.
00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:35.029
that there was a round table on West
00:21:35.039 --> 00:21:36.950
State Street where the cars could turn
00:21:36.960 --> 00:21:38.070
around.
00:21:38.080 --> 00:21:40.310
>> I heard that one. Well, that's not true.
00:21:40.320 --> 00:21:42.870
There was there was a wide spot in the
00:21:42.880 --> 00:21:44.470
road, but that's where the cars could
00:21:44.480 --> 00:21:46.390
meet, they could pass each other.
00:21:46.400 --> 00:21:47.190
>> Mhm.
00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:49.669
>> So, it just separated.
00:21:49.679 --> 00:21:52.950
Yeah. And that space that even though
00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:55.190
the street cars haven't run in
00:21:55.200 --> 00:21:59.669
Jacksonville since 1930, the the the
00:21:59.679 --> 00:22:03.430
curb is still it's a wider spot in on
00:22:03.440 --> 00:22:05.830
West State Street where they could pass.
00:22:05.840 --> 00:22:07.909
The rails are long gone. But
00:22:07.919 --> 00:22:13.430
>> yeah, now I also know um and I I learned
00:22:13.440 --> 00:22:15.190
about this on your cemetery walk
00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:20.310
actually earlier this year was the uh
00:22:20.320 --> 00:22:23.029
um disputing the fact that Jacksonville
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:25.110
was actually named after Andrew Jackson,
00:22:25.120 --> 00:22:27.750
the president, and he was possibly named
00:22:27.760 --> 00:22:30.870
after a different Andrew Jackson who was
00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:33.430
uh buried there in Jacksonville.
00:22:33.440 --> 00:22:36.950
>> Right. Well, there was a
00:22:36.960 --> 00:22:39.430
a young black man. I don't know if he
00:22:39.440 --> 00:22:43.029
was an indentured servant or slave
00:22:43.039 --> 00:22:46.390
because I'm I don't know the history of
00:22:46.400 --> 00:22:48.789
slavery in Illinois whether it was still
00:22:48.799 --> 00:22:52.230
legal. But in 1825
00:22:52.240 --> 00:22:55.110
when the surveyors were laying out
00:22:55.120 --> 00:22:56.310
Jacksonville
00:22:56.320 --> 00:22:56.870
>> Mhm.
00:22:56.880 --> 00:23:00.390
>> the story goes there was this young uh
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:02.789
African-American
00:23:02.799 --> 00:23:03.750
boy.
00:23:03.760 --> 00:23:04.310
>> Mhm.
00:23:04.320 --> 00:23:08.070
>> I think he was like oh 11 years old or
00:23:08.080 --> 00:23:11.430
something. But he was running an errand
00:23:11.440 --> 00:23:16.310
for his owner or his employer.
00:23:16.320 --> 00:23:19.590
And um I word it that way cuz I'm I'm
00:23:19.600 --> 00:23:21.669
not clear
00:23:21.679 --> 00:23:24.870
as to to what he was. I do believe he
00:23:24.880 --> 00:23:28.870
was a slave at the time. But anyway,
00:23:28.880 --> 00:23:32.230
uh the town was being uh platted,
00:23:32.240 --> 00:23:37.029
surveyed, and um
00:23:37.039 --> 00:23:40.230
he stopped. His name the the the young
00:23:40.240 --> 00:23:42.950
African-American was Andrew Jackson and
00:23:42.960 --> 00:23:47.590
he stopped and talked to the surveyors
00:23:47.600 --> 00:23:51.190
and uh they they asked him his name and
00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:53.750
he told them and they said, "Oh, well,
00:23:53.760 --> 00:23:56.230
we we think that's a great name and we
00:23:56.240 --> 00:23:59.190
we're going to name the town after you."
00:23:59.200 --> 00:23:59.750
Mhm.
00:23:59.760 --> 00:24:03.029
>> Well, the problem I have with that, and
00:24:03.039 --> 00:24:06.630
I I it this doesn't
00:24:06.640 --> 00:24:10.230
I don't want to sound racist, but it it
00:24:10.240 --> 00:24:13.190
has more to do with the fact that I
00:24:13.200 --> 00:24:15.669
doubt if the surveyors, first of all,
00:24:15.679 --> 00:24:18.390
named the town. I think the town was
00:24:18.400 --> 00:24:21.269
probably already named. To my knowledge,
00:24:21.279 --> 00:24:24.470
there's no record of whether the
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:27.990
commissioners that uh at the time
00:24:28.000 --> 00:24:32.390
whether they um chose the site and the
00:24:32.400 --> 00:24:34.310
name for the town,
00:24:34.320 --> 00:24:38.070
>> but um
00:24:38.080 --> 00:24:40.230
but I think the town had already been
00:24:40.240 --> 00:24:43.750
named but not having any real proof of
00:24:43.760 --> 00:24:47.029
that. So years later after this happened
00:24:47.039 --> 00:24:49.350
in the 1880s there was a book published
00:24:49.360 --> 00:24:53.190
about early Jacksonville which was only
00:24:53.200 --> 00:24:56.470
like 60 years old at that point but
00:24:56.480 --> 00:24:59.190
>> Reverend Jackson was he he became a
00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:02.549
local minister and he told the story for
00:25:02.559 --> 00:25:05.350
the people who were compiling stories
00:25:05.360 --> 00:25:08.070
for the book and he told that story and
00:25:08.080 --> 00:25:10.230
to my knowledge that's the first time it
00:25:10.240 --> 00:25:12.230
ever appeared in print
00:25:12.240 --> 00:25:15.110
>> and was uh readily available to the
00:25:15.120 --> 00:25:21.350
public. Um but um yeah, that's that's a
00:25:21.360 --> 00:25:24.950
problem I have. See, another part of
00:25:24.960 --> 00:25:28.149
that story is that
00:25:28.159 --> 00:25:31.029
despite what is on Wikipedia, which says
00:25:31.039 --> 00:25:32.549
Jacksonville
00:25:32.559 --> 00:25:35.190
was founded by New Englanders, which is
00:25:35.200 --> 00:25:37.990
not true, it was founded by people from
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.190
Tennessee and Kentucky and Virginia.
00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:44.390
mostly people that that settled in
00:25:44.400 --> 00:25:46.470
Morgan County in the early days were
00:25:46.480 --> 00:25:49.990
were Kuckians uh for for the the vast
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:52.549
majority of those people. So those
00:25:52.559 --> 00:25:55.510
people worshiped Andrew Jackson
00:25:55.520 --> 00:25:59.990
>> and uh who was the hero of of War of
00:26:00.000 --> 00:26:02.789
1812. He was not
00:26:02.799 --> 00:26:05.029
elected president.
00:26:05.039 --> 00:26:08.390
He he was not president at the time.
00:26:08.400 --> 00:26:11.669
I think uh in 1825
00:26:11.679 --> 00:26:14.630
it may have been John Quincy Adams but I
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:18.230
believe it was but but anyway um but
00:26:18.240 --> 00:26:21.029
Jackson was a well-known
00:26:21.039 --> 00:26:25.110
figure and a southerner and uh the
00:26:25.120 --> 00:26:28.230
chances of it being named after
00:26:28.240 --> 00:26:30.390
a boy
00:26:30.400 --> 00:26:31.830
you know
00:26:31.840 --> 00:26:34.789
>> but that's not to disparage him and and
00:26:34.799 --> 00:26:37.990
that young man went on to be very
00:26:38.000 --> 00:26:41.990
well-known prominent uh minister in
00:26:42.000 --> 00:26:45.350
Jacksonville and a Protestant minister.
00:26:45.360 --> 00:26:49.430
I think he was a Baptist minister and uh
00:26:49.440 --> 00:26:52.710
but for many years his grave in
00:26:52.720 --> 00:26:55.269
Jacksonville Cemetery was unmarked. So
00:26:55.279 --> 00:26:58.630
back I don't know probably 30 years ago
00:26:58.640 --> 00:27:01.590
a group raised some money including the
00:27:01.600 --> 00:27:04.549
Morton County Historical Society and uh
00:27:04.559 --> 00:27:06.390
put a marker up for him.
00:27:06.400 --> 00:27:09.750
>> Mhm. Uh he was an alderman back I think
00:27:09.760 --> 00:27:12.230
in the 1870s
00:27:12.240 --> 00:27:15.269
uh and is believed to be
00:27:15.279 --> 00:27:17.750
it could be proven that he was the first
00:27:17.760 --> 00:27:19.430
African-American
00:27:19.440 --> 00:27:23.269
alderman in Jacksonville history. Yeah.
00:27:23.279 --> 00:27:26.789
>> So but his name was the same as uh as
00:27:26.799 --> 00:27:29.350
the more famous uh Andrew Jackson,
00:27:29.360 --> 00:27:31.430
President Andrew Jackson. So
00:27:31.440 --> 00:27:34.230
>> So that's that story
00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:36.310
>> in a nutshell.
00:27:36.320 --> 00:27:37.110
So
00:27:37.120 --> 00:27:39.909
>> yeah, there's all kinds of great history
00:27:39.919 --> 00:27:42.630
coming out of Morgan County.
00:27:42.640 --> 00:27:47.269
So um now if people wanted to get a hold
00:27:47.279 --> 00:27:49.110
of the Morgan County Historical Society,
00:27:49.120 --> 00:27:51.190
how can they do that?
00:27:51.200 --> 00:27:54.870
>> Well, probably the best way, and I don't
00:27:54.880 --> 00:27:59.110
have a phone number handy, uh is to is
00:27:59.120 --> 00:28:05.430
to contact uh uh Karen Cybert. Um she
00:28:05.440 --> 00:28:08.149
handles uh questions for the historical
00:28:08.159 --> 00:28:09.110
society.
00:28:09.120 --> 00:28:09.669
>> Okay.
00:28:09.679 --> 00:28:11.190
>> Um
00:28:11.200 --> 00:28:15.669
but uh I don't have her email handy and
00:28:15.679 --> 00:28:16.950
>> um
00:28:16.960 --> 00:28:19.830
>> and her number, but uh contacting her
00:28:19.840 --> 00:28:23.269
through uh email would probably be best.
00:28:23.279 --> 00:28:23.990
>> Okay.
00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:27.350
>> The historical society doesn't
00:28:27.360 --> 00:28:30.549
uh is not quite as active as it used to
00:28:30.559 --> 00:28:36.070
be. This past year, we we uh or I held
00:28:36.080 --> 00:28:39.269
um three cemetery tours in recognition
00:28:39.279 --> 00:28:42.310
of Jacksonville's 200th anniversary. And
00:28:42.320 --> 00:28:47.029
those were well sponsored by the county
00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:48.230
historical society.
00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:48.549
>> Yeah.
00:28:48.559 --> 00:28:50.950
>> And there's a shiakequa that's held
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:54.870
usually around Labor Day uh every year.
00:28:54.880 --> 00:28:57.029
Uh in recent years, it's been held at
00:28:57.039 --> 00:28:59.350
the Nicholls Park Pavilion. Mhm.
00:28:59.360 --> 00:29:03.029
>> So there'll be speakers and music and uh
00:29:03.039 --> 00:29:07.990
Yeah. So uh that's one of the the main
00:29:08.000 --> 00:29:11.269
things we do is programs. Uh it's a
00:29:11.279 --> 00:29:13.830
membership organization. Mhm.
00:29:13.840 --> 00:29:15.669
>> Um
00:29:15.679 --> 00:29:18.389
but um
00:29:18.399 --> 00:29:20.470
um
00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:22.950
>> yeah, Karen, if if you can get through
00:29:22.960 --> 00:29:25.350
to her
00:29:25.360 --> 00:29:28.630
>> um that's the best that's the best way.
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:31.350
>> All righty. Well, fantastic. Well, thank
00:29:31.360 --> 00:29:32.710
you so much for joining us today.
00:29:32.720 --> 00:29:34.789
>> Oh, yeah. No problem. Yeah. Good luck
00:29:34.799 --> 00:29:39.029
with uh the rest of your your vignettes.
00:29:39.039 --> 00:29:39.590
Yes.
00:29:39.600 --> 00:29:43.159
>> Thank you so much.
