UPA - Sheryl Gottschall

WEBVTT
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M Australia, the sixth largest country
on Earth. An ancient, rugged and
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unforgiving land with abundant animal life,
both beautiful and deadly found within its all
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inspiring landscapes and natural beauty. Exists
a deep history of unexplained mysteries for anyone
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with the courage to investigate them.
Tonight we joined Ben on a journey across
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this vast island continent in search of
answers to events that have reshaped the lives
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of so many that have been exposed
to Unexplained Phenomena Australia with your host Ben
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Hurled. He everyone, and welcome
to another episode of Unexplained Phenomena Australia.
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It's really great back with you again
this week, and I have an absolutely
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great guest joining us for this week's
episode, Cheryl Gottsjawel. Cheryl has had
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a lifelong interest in the paranormal,
which began in her teenage years, but
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in nineteen eighty she began seriously studying
the phenomenon of near death experiences and soon
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after she joined the International Association for
Near Death Studies and in nineteen ninety five
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hosted doctor Ken Ring for the Brisbane
leg of his Australian tour where he presented
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research for his future book Mind Sight, Near Death and Out of Body Experiences
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in the Blind. She also developed
a deep interest in the UFO phenomenon,
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catalyzed by her father in law's interest
after he attended a UFO meeting hosting George
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at Danski That's right, George Adansky
in the nineteen sixties. In nineteen eighty
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eight, she joined the Brisbane based
association UFO Research Queensland and three years later
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took on the role of President.
Then in nineteen ninety two, Cheryl and
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her late husband, doctor Martin Gotschol
established the first close Encounter support group in
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Brisbane. After Bud Hopkins's Australian tour
and doctor Ring's book The Amiga Project,
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Near Death Experiences, UFO Encounters and
the Mind at Large nineteen ninety two ignited
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Cheryl's interest in the connections between UFOs
and near death experiences, which was now
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being cooborated by the witnesses that she
was interviewing, and some years later,
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in two thousand and twelve, Cheryl
established the monthly Afterlife Discussions Group, where
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she continued to find links between UFOs
and the afterlife in the story shared.
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Cheryl was also the Australian representative for
the International Coalition for Extraterrestrial Research were known
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as ISA, the first truly global
international UFO organization that considers what we need
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to prepare for confirmation that the Earth
is being engaged by non human intelligences.
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ISA aims to take this discussion to
the highest levels of governance, including the
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United Nations, and Cheryl has had
many paranormal experiences herself, including an NDE,
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a bylocation experience, out of body
experiences, UFO sightings, a close
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encounter with non human intelligences or et
s, poltergeist activity, automatic writing,
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and other unexplained phenomena, all of
which propel her to continue on her quest
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to understand what it means to be
human. Cheryl's research bridges the afterlife and
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UFO subjects, and wanting to understand
the UFO phenomenon more deeply led her to
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train in shamanism, which she now
teaches. She speaks regularly about the UFO
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phenomenon and the afterlife at public meetings, conferences, community groups, schools,
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libraries, and has given hundreds of
media interviews. She's written articles for many
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UFO and New Age magazines, and
in twenty and eighteen was a regular guest
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on the weekly Spooky Action radio show
and co hosted the Strange Encounters radio show
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in two thousand and nineteen. Currently, she's a regular writer for the UFO
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Research Queensland bimonthly publication UFO Encounter.
Cheryl works as a clinical hypnotherapist, teaches
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raiki art therapy, shamanism, and
launched the Strange Encounters down Under podcast in
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August twenty twenty one. Something that
I know a little bit about as well.
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So it gives me great pleasure to
welcome to the show, Cheryl Gottschaw
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Cheryl, welcome, Hi. Then, thank you very much for having me.
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Yeah, no, it's really really
great. You're one of the most
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fascinating people I know onto the show
so that we can talk about all the
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fantastic things that you've been doing over
a very long time. There's been a
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few that has that has and and
look when I read the intro there,
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it's sort of like there's so much
stuff that you've been doing that you know.
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Obviously an ours not enough to talk
about everything in great detail, but
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we will try and do as best
we can to sort of have a look
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at at what you've been doing.
So going right back to the to the
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early days, you know, just
tell us a little bit more about about
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what sparked that interest for you.
Well, I've always been interested in everything
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unusual. And when I was a
kid, I used to sit outside and
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look at the stars and wonder if
there were other beings out there on other
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planets, looking at planet Earth,
wondering if there's life out there, just
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like I was, you know.
So I guess I was sort of born
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with that in me. And then
by the time I started doing some part
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time work about age fifteen, I
think I was I could afford then gone
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by my own magazines and newstand magazines. And in Australia at that time there
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was really only one, which was
called The Australasian Post. And yeah,
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and in there in there, I
think it was John Pinkney, who's now
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passed, but he's a well known
Australian author who has written quite a few
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books on hauntings and UFOs and mysterious
Australia and things like that. And he
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would publish all sorts of crazy sort
of thing which I thought were crazy when
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I was fifteen, and I would
be fascinated to read all those stories,
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you know, and then you know, life moved on and I got married
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and that's when I met my father
in law who who had been involved with
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you FO researched Queensland and had actually
been to see Georgia Damski in the Brisbane
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Town Hall, which was amazing.
I mean I didn't know about Georgia Damski
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then, right, and he told
me about what a hard time he got
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when he was here, Georgia Damski
that is. And like Brisbane City Hall
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is huge. There's you can fit
hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of people in
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there, and it was packed packed
to the rooms, and they had speakers
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outside, people were standing outside trying
to listen to what was being said,
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etc. And poor old Georgia Daansky
was getting a really hard time with the
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university students who were running around with
paper plates and painted green with alien faces
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on them, and up and down, and I think a few times Georgia
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Damsky walked off the stage and all
that sort of thing. So, and
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anyone who doesn't know who Georgia Damski
is, he was a very early UFO
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contact from the fifties and sixties era, who claimed to have had many UFO
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contacts and wrote about it in his
books. M Yeah, he was quite
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a controversial figure and even to this
day is perhaps still a very controversial figure.
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But he did come out and do
an Australian tour and and it was
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it was it was a really um
people were really fascinated by him, I
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think. Yeah, and UFO Research
Queen's Name, which I'm now the president
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of would actually handled his Australian leg
of that of that world tour. Yeah,
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because that's because the group has been
around a very long time, hasn't
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it. Yep. It was established
in nineteen fifty six. That's going on
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quite a few decades now. Absolutely, it's been continuous all that time.
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Yep. It's the longest running,
continuously running UFO organization in Australia almost the
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world. And he being beaten by
the Cleveland Hire UFO group in the States.
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Wow. So even it's even older
than upon Oh yes, absolutely,
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yeah, yeah, I think the
same age as me nine and sixty eight.
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I think that was the one thing
that that Fond and I had in
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common started in the same year.
Yeah, yeah, And so they must
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be like a huge there must have
over that time. There must be a
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vast amount of records that have come
in over the decades. Oh yeah,
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yeah, I mean I know that
we hold at least five thousand reports in
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our archives, and that's just in
in Queensland, the state that I'm in.
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And unfortunately, over the years,
many other UFO organizations in Australia have
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closed their doors and I'm not sure
where all those records went, but we
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still have out and um, yeah, it's it's like it's really a common
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much more common for people to have
UFO sightings than what the general public realizes.
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It's always been like that, I
think. Yeah. And more importantly,
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people also, more than we realize, more people report close encounters too.
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Yes, yeah, absolutely, it's
it's a it's when you when you're
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even just starting a little bit of
look looking into it, you'll start to
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see that there is a vast amount
of experiences out there. Yeah, so
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you've you and and the UFO researched. Queensland is quite unique in the fact
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that it's still has all those records
and unfortunately, probably in the rest of
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the country a lot of it scattered
to the wind. So that's that's really
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very unfortunate. And that's and that's
why you ever researched. Queensland is such
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a unique and special group in Australia
and if not the entire world as well.
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Yeah, it's really important that we
hold these records because I've always felt
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very um responsible for people stories,
to to be caretakers for them and advocates,
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because an advocate because a lot of
them say, I don't want to
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speak about this, but you're welcome
to to talk about my report or publish
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it with you without my details of
course. And you know, I've had
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people who are who are very ill
and they knew they were going to die,
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and they rang and said, you
know, I need to tell someone
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this before I die. And I
think I just feel so responsible about that.
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Yeah, it is. It is
big and and and I'm trying to
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grab as much old information as i
can. And in Victoria is a lot
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harder because because it's just splinted and
fractured into so many different, um you
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know, different sort of political groups
and all that, and records just sort
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of just disappeared, some of them
got thrown out. It's just you know,
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that unfortunate. But going back to
the beginning again, your your initial
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interest was the near death experiences,
which is fascinating and I'm really curious to
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hear about the connection that you've drawn
with that to the UFO phenomenon. Well,
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actually it's the other way around,
because it was nineteen eighty eight that
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I became actively involved with the UFO
research Quisland. And it was oh no,
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actually was before that, if you're
right, it was about teen years
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before that that I got really seriously
interested in mediath experiences because at the time
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I was I was doing a search
for God. Basically, I was digging
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in deep and drilling down and trying
to understand, you know, what our
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existence meant as a as a young
woman. And so I became a member
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of the International Association Medath Studies,
and I was fascinated by the stories.
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I bought lots of books about it. I read people's stories and remember I
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ends wasn't actually, I mean,
the term needith experiences wasn't even coined until
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nineteen seventy five by doctor Raymond Moody. So and I became involved soon after
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that, about three or four years
after that, became a member. So
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and I just got so drawn into
it because yeah, I just wanted to
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know what was what was going to
be, you know, I wanted to
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know more about our entire existence basically. Yeah, But that was when it
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took me to I started looking into
the Bible. And that was when after
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about three years, because I was
doing a home Bible study course and every
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week I'd get together with a group
and we'd look at the Bible and look
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at this, look at that,
and I was reading the scriptures. And
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after three years of that, I
started to see that these descriptions of angelic
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visitations were more akin to modern day
close encounter reports. And that's what I
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sort of veered off into the UFO
subject. Yes, I sort of sort
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of left the religious aspects of it
that at that intersection. Yeah, yeah,
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yeah, yeah, And that's thinking
about it in a much broader way,
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I suppose, or even at that
time been you know, fairly leading
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the way as well. Yeah.
And you know, when I got involved
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with the UFO subject, to me, I was quite naive. I thinking
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that it was we were dealing with
beings from other planets who were traveling through
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space, and we were seeing their
craft these days all this what is it
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thirty four years later or something,
it's like, no, it's just not
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that simple people, is it's And
I would agree with that too. I
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think that's a very simplistic way to
think about it, you know, the
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old nutting bolting it across space is
sort of that's a very human way of
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thinking about things. Yeah. But
then when when the abduction experiences really came
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to the four during the nineteen nineties
and for that ten year long period of
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consistent reports of these encounter close encounters
with beings who were taking people against their
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will, which was completely opposite to
how I got involved with introduced into the
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UFO subject, which was about the
contacts and that those aliens were they're very
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human looking and they were our space
brothers and all that, and then to
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have all that flipped on its head
with the aiming abduction experiences, it was
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like, wow, what the hell, you know, what's going on?
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Yeah, in the early days,
it was almost like tea on the lawn,
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And then wasn't it you know exactly, that's what it seems to be
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yourself, very gentlemanly sort of interactions
that they had with our space brothers.
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Then by the nineties we've got the
bug eyed creatures that are that are taking
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us from our beds, And let's
face it, you know, I don't
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disregard either of them, no,
right, because I'm now after receiving people's
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reports. They're reporting describing all types
of extraterrestrials. And that was one of
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the things that I noticed. The
difference between Australian reports and the reports coming
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out of the US in that decade
were that the ones from Australia they were
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a wide variety of descriptions, whereas
the ones from the US were very typical,
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the little gray aliens with inverted pear
shape heads, big dark eyes,
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etc. So. But you know, that was when I sort of started
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to realize, and I was hearing
from people too, that there were a
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lot of paranormal things intertwined in the
lives of these people. And after going
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out and interviewing every single report that
came in, which you could in those
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days before the abductions hit, because
we sort of went from forty reports a
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year to like five hundred reports a
year, I'd say, well, have
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you had any other strange experiences,
And not even knowing myself what I was
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asking, they go, well,
yeah, it's not UFO O related.
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But I was sick and I ended
up in hospital and I was out of
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my body, or I had surgery
and I left my body, or ands
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like. After a while, I
sort of thought, you know, wake
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up, Cheryl, these people are
telling you something really important. But I
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didn't know what to do with it, so I just put it on the
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shelf. And it wasn't until quite
a few years down the track, actually,
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I have to say that I suddenly
started to realize that people who report
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close encounters also report new death experiences, seeing apparitions, having politogeese activity,
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spontaneous mediumship, all those wide variety
of other types of strange anomalous experiences.
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And I think the greater UFO community
started to wake up to that too,
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you know. I was sort of
coming to that idea, and then it
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was abound around probably around two thousand
that the UFO community started to in general
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had to have that wake up call
too. And it was when I started
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to see the deeper connections between the
afterlife and close encounter experiences, in that
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people were telling me some very strange
things and I was going, what does
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this mean? And just to give
you an example, one was probably the
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first one was when I owned a
new age center actually when it was all
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very taboo to talk about those things
many years ago, and i'd had I
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had a speaker come along one night
talk about near death experiences, and one
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of the people in the audience was
a woman who came up to me later
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and she told me this story about
what had happened to her where she had
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lost her daughter who was very very
young. Being to the funeral, came
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home extremely distraught and upset and went
into the bedroom laid down, falling full
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of angst, you know. And
the next thing she knows, she's out
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of a body, and she's walking
along a long, sort of wavy path
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with her daughter in her hand.
She gets to what is now known as
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the point of no return, where
people can meet some type of spirit being,
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and they say, you can't come
past here, you know, or
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they'll say if you do, you
won't go back, Or do you want
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to come past here? Do you
want to leave your earth your life behind?
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But there's a sort of like a
delineation of the experience from the current
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reality to another reality, which we
would call the afterlife. So she came
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to that point and the spirit being
says, you can't come past here,
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but I'll take your daughter, which
was really what she thought was the soul
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of a daughter. So after much
angst and crying, she handed over her
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daughter to the spirit being. And
then the woman turned around and started to
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walk back along this windy path,
and as she did, she saw a
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ufo and she she didn't really know, didn't sort of. I don't think
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she fully understood what she was seeing, but she said it was a classic
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spaceship that you would see in the
movies. And the next thing she knows,
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she's inside, she's laying on a
table, she's having these aliens are
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performing some sort of medical or some
sort of examination on her. And remember
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she's not in a physical body,
right. Then she's allowed to get up
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and leave as she was, And
the next thing she knows, she's back
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in her body and wakes up on
the bed and I'm thinking, well,
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what was that that I just heard? Yeah? Yeah, it was that
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the first time you'd heard that?
Or had you been hearing this this type
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of thing many times? No?
That was that was in nineteen ninety five.
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I heard that yet the first time? Yeah, And I thought,
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good grief, what on earth is
that? What Where do I put that?
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Where is there a box that belongs
in there wasn't at the time,
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that really wasn't. Yeah, and
i'd heard other since then. I've heard
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a few other stories like that,
And one was not that long ago actually,
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where a woman who spoke to my
afterlife group. She was too I
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think she was around sixty when she
was speaking telling the story to the group.
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But when she was twelve, she
had to have her tontols removed.
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So she was in hospital and the
anaesthesiologists had gotten the anaesthesia confused or mixed
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up, and she wasn't getting enough
oxygen right. So she's on the table
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and she leaves, the leaves her
body and then what she sees in front
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of her is she's seen a tunnel. She sees a stream of people in
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front of her going towards this bright
light at the end of the tunnel.
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And then she also sees a stream
of people going back in the opposite direction,
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and in that stream of people is
this little being. And she thought,
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oh, poor little thing. It's
because it looked emaciated, had a
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big head, skinny little body,
any about three feet tall, going back
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towards planet where she just comes from
Planet Earth. Anyway, so she comes
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back into her body. And what
happened was some years later she found out
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about our UFO group and she walks
in the door and as she walks in
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the door, someone's talking about aiming
abduction experiences and they've got an image up
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on the screen and it's of one
of these grays. And she said to
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me afterwards, she said, as
soon as I saw that, that's what
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I recognized in my knee death experience. M And I went, oh,
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another one of those strange stories,
right, yeah, yeah, yeah,
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And I really there's a few more, but I really have struggled to understand,
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you know, how that fits into
the UFO narrative basically, and I
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believe it does. I don't just
believe these people and you know, we
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there are I've heard some very strange
stories actually, um which I really scratched
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my head and trying to make sense
of it, trying to get the overall
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picture of but at least me feeling
like we really don't have a handle on
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the UFO subject at all. No, that's right, exactly. Yeah.
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I mean maybe it's a maybe in
some way that you know, when when
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you pass on, perhaps there's you're
going into another into another realm another state.
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Maybe maybe that's et overlaps into that
some here or some of them do
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in some capacity. So yeah,
there's a lot of it. Sorry I
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say, I think that's hardly likely
that the really big picture is that they
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pay play some sort of part,
or some some of them play some sort
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of part in um human beings being
on earth, because I've also heard stories
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about people who've had contact with extraor
what they call extraterrestrial I mean, who
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knows what they really are some of
them, and that these ets, these
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aliens have some how catalyzed out of
body experiences in these people. So they
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obviously have I think a very good
understanding of the part of us that doesn't
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rely on having a physical body.
Human contra sciousness or call it soul cause
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spirit, I really don't know what
it is, but you know, I've
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had a need of experience myself and
out of body experiences, so I know
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firsthand that I don't have to be
in my physical body to be able to
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experience something. And I can have
the same vision as I have, like
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I'm looking at you as clear as
that you know, and so I know
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that those experiences are real. Maybe
if you're in those states. That's it's
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more likely as well. Perhaps,
Yeah, who knows. It's a very
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big story. It's a big story, and we've been we've all been speculating
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about it for an incredibly long period
of time with very few answers. Yeah,
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yeah, I think we'll get them
one day. But yeah, we're
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just sort of a little bit by
a little bit and we have to we
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have to take the steps that when
we find the answers that we can digest
299
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it. Basically, we can't buy
it off more of the apple than what
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we can chew at any one time, right, exactly, a tiny bites
301
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and just because there's a whole pioneering
sort of a feel about about what we're
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sort of discussing. And and when
you sort of started up the the first
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close encounter support group in Brisbane after
Bud Hopkins Australian speak, Um, that's
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that you must have started to see
because that could could have been hardly any
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of that in Australia at the time, that's right. Yeah, And what
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happened was that, um, after
Bud had left and we got to know
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him because I had organized for it, after he spoke at a conference here
308
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in Brisbane, I had invited him
to come to my home to speak to
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a private group. So we had
after the who was a poor man.
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He was exhausted and starving walking the
juries that I really wants to eat,
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So he came to my home.
I have about I think it was about
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a dozen or fifteen people in my
home and we sat and we spent the
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night with Bod Hopkins talking about everything
while they fed him, of course.
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But after he left, people came
out of the woodwork out. We didn't
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know what to do, you know, and I thought, I said,
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we have to start a support group
for these people so they can get because
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they really wanted to talk to other
people, and only other people who'd had
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similar experiences to try and put the
pieces of the jigsaw puzzle together and make
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some sort of sense of it for
themselves. Yeah. Yeah, because this
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is a completely different sport to reporting
a UFO, isn't it. You know,
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Like you can report a to an
organization filling a pro form or sending
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some photos and that's and that's one
aspect of it. But when you're talking
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about that, it's just that rabbit
hole that you dived down and it just
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goes off into you know, never
ending tunnels all over the place. Yeah,
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and I think that, you know, people needed to be with other
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people who'd had those experiences for a
variety of reasons, because they knew they
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wouldn't be rejected. Number one,
we gave him that safe space. They
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knew that the other people would understand
even if they sounded crazy. It's amazing
329
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how many people bring up and say
they recall a UFO potline and go,
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oh, you're going to think I'm
crazy, but I've seen a UFO You've
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just got a UFO hotline. No, I don't think it's crazy, that's
332
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right, the sort of thing.
So they they always felt on the outer
333
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of the UFO community because at that
time, I think was the nineteen ninety
334
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two, I think he was here
that this just wasn't being spoken about that
335
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openly, any deductions. We were
just starting to for it to become global,
336
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globally understood owned if that sounderstood but
I still don't understand it, but
337
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globally known, even though there are
reports coming out as far back as Betty
338
00:30:07.200 --> 00:30:10.480
and Barney Hill and previous to that
as well. Yeah, yeah, that's
339
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right. You can talk about the
whole, the whole abducted by fairies as
340
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being you know, or you know, going right back into medieval times,
341
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that this has not just been happening
since the nineteen nineties. It's been around
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for as long as humanity has been
here. Yeah, but what was happening
343
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in the early days of abduction experiences. It was you you of our researchers
344
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just wanted to stick to the nuts
and bolts through each side of it.
345
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They didn't want to have all these
other weird stuff attached to it, right,
346
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which really holds the subject back.
Yeah, yeah, I think I
347
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think it did. You know.
You know, you can say how big,
348
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how long, how far, how
fast was it going? You know,
349
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that's all. That's all, you
know, interesting mechanics of it.
350
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But the other thing, too is
if you're having a UFO experience, it's
351
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very hard to capture all of that
too, because I want to stand there
352
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like a bit like a stun rabbit
in some ways, you know, looking
353
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at the incredible that is furling in
front of you, not looking at windspeed
354
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and and knowing how high how high
it is, So I understand it really
355
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difficult, it is, but that
that other dimension, it's just where people
356
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don't want to at that time and
even today to a certain extent, still
357
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don't want to go down those those
um you know, looking into those areas,
358
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which is but it is the key
to understand it. And with that,
359
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it's interesting about the near death connection
as well. So yeah, that's
360
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that's a whole other avenue that really
is still mostly untouched. Yeah, nobody
361
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is. Yeah, although you know, there was the book that was written
362
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earlier that did it brings UFOs into
the conversation. Um, what what was
363
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that close book again? Project Mega
Project. Yeah, that was the one,
364
00:31:48.799 --> 00:31:52.559
Yeah, that that sort of started
to bring out the connection between NDEs
365
00:31:52.559 --> 00:31:57.759
and UFOs. Yeah, no,
one's actually picked that up properly and run
366
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with it. I know there's been
a book published by the Free Organization called
367
00:32:06.279 --> 00:32:08.880
Beyond UFOs. I've actually got that, and there's a good collection of people's
368
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encounters in their strange encounters. And
I also know that the International Association of
369
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:24.640
Near Death Studies has now expanded its
umbrella to go beyond just endes and include
370
00:32:24.799 --> 00:32:30.519
spiritually transformative experiences, which of course
can be close encounter experiences too. So
371
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they probably should change their name.
Really, we probably should. They probably
372
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should. The support group were you
getting people who so we basically getting people
373
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who were having that classic alien abduction
experience or we are still getting close encounters
374
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with beings on the ground. Was
how was that in that time? You
375
00:32:52.480 --> 00:32:55.799
know, like so as you like
landed UFO beings around or as opposed to
376
00:32:55.960 --> 00:33:00.079
I was taken in the night.
Yeah, well no, they went walking
377
00:33:00.119 --> 00:33:08.160
into ufo landed UFOs. They were
they were like there was one gentleman who
378
00:33:08.359 --> 00:33:13.519
he reported being taken from when he
was eight years old, I think it
379
00:33:13.680 --> 00:33:19.000
was, and he actually end up
speaking at one of our conferences and um,
380
00:33:20.599 --> 00:33:25.480
he was that was one. He
was taken through a very thick door
381
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of the house. So this is
the other strange thing that comes up in
382
00:33:30.279 --> 00:33:32.799
these experiences. Has happened quite a
lot. Actually, people would be taken
383
00:33:32.799 --> 00:33:37.880
through closed windows and bolted doors,
that sort of thing. And he was
384
00:33:37.920 --> 00:33:44.519
actually taken out to a landed UFO
in the backyard, right, yes,
385
00:33:45.039 --> 00:33:49.400
and he entered there and but he
sort of went in he was taken in
386
00:33:49.400 --> 00:33:54.319
in an altered state of consciousness.
This would always come up actually where he's
387
00:33:54.359 --> 00:33:59.839
sort of be mesmerized to and then
going board and then once he was in
388
00:33:59.839 --> 00:34:02.519
there. In one particular case,
he sort of came to his senses,
389
00:34:02.960 --> 00:34:07.519
if you could say it like that, and realize that there are other people
390
00:34:07.680 --> 00:34:13.199
in the room with him where he
was sitting, and a lot of them
391
00:34:13.239 --> 00:34:19.800
were adults. So by the time
he contacted us, I think by then
392
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he would have been about fifty,
around his fifties, and but it had
393
00:34:28.480 --> 00:34:32.800
taken all that time in years for
him to you to walk around with that
394
00:34:32.920 --> 00:34:38.960
experience rattling around inside of him before
he actually reached out to our organization spoke
395
00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:44.920
to him quite a bit, and
yeah, and he would just see these
396
00:34:45.039 --> 00:34:49.760
human beings in there that would just
be in these altered states of consciousness,
397
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and he didn't know what was happening
to them as a kid, and he'd
398
00:34:52.519 --> 00:34:55.199
know that they would be taken off
into different rooms, etc. And he
399
00:34:55.280 --> 00:35:02.039
actually escaped that what he calls spaceship
because by then it had left lifted off
400
00:35:02.199 --> 00:35:10.559
and gone up into space. And
yeah, but there was one particular experience
401
00:35:10.599 --> 00:35:17.159
where he was in a room where
a brown smoke was fed into the room,
402
00:35:17.760 --> 00:35:24.320
which probably, you know after we
talked, possibly was some sort of
403
00:35:24.480 --> 00:35:30.559
decontamination process, because there was a
lot of that with abductees as well,
404
00:35:30.559 --> 00:35:37.639
where they'd be sprayed down with something
before they could actually go into a craft
405
00:35:37.400 --> 00:35:42.920
or into an underground location or wherever
it was that they were taken. And
406
00:35:43.480 --> 00:35:45.639
there were quite a few stories of
that where they'd be I think even Whitley
407
00:35:45.639 --> 00:35:51.239
Strieber talked about that in one of
his experiences, he was sort of washed
408
00:35:51.280 --> 00:35:54.920
down and immediately dried off or something
like that night. I've spoken to a
409
00:35:54.960 --> 00:35:59.840
woman who had that experience as well, where she was sprayed down with something
410
00:36:00.400 --> 00:36:05.519
and then immediately she was dry.
So what we know now about viruses and
411
00:36:05.599 --> 00:36:10.440
the pandemics and all that sort of
stuff, contamination, you can understand why,
412
00:36:10.840 --> 00:36:13.519
Yeah, you can, yeah,
and you sort of look at it
413
00:36:13.559 --> 00:36:16.719
and go, well, you know, it's just is it just simply watching
414
00:36:16.840 --> 00:36:21.760
or a cleaning, you know,
for as in like they're a biological entity
415
00:36:21.840 --> 00:36:24.440
that can catch COVID from us,
for example, you know that we don't
416
00:36:24.440 --> 00:36:28.480
want to catch their colds, so
therefore we have to we have to treat
417
00:36:28.519 --> 00:36:31.280
them with something or are they being
treated not for that reason though, they're
418
00:36:31.280 --> 00:36:35.519
being treated for the fact that it's
a treatment they need to go through before
419
00:36:35.519 --> 00:36:38.880
they do other other experiments. Who
knows, We don't know, but I
420
00:36:38.920 --> 00:36:45.840
do think that your first suggestion sort
of is a is a strong suggestive evidence
421
00:36:45.920 --> 00:36:51.199
that these beings are as physical as
you and I. Yeah, and they
422
00:36:51.239 --> 00:36:55.960
can catch viruses from us, and
they can be contaminated by these interspecies interaction.
423
00:36:57.960 --> 00:37:00.800
You know, imagine being taken up
and given them a nice stiff cold,
424
00:37:00.360 --> 00:37:05.239
you know that passes through everybody on
the ship. That would be really
425
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:10.400
inconvenient. Would so you need to
you need to isolate them. That's that's
426
00:37:10.440 --> 00:37:15.519
that's for sure. But the other
interesting thing about about abduction is that there's
427
00:37:15.519 --> 00:37:20.840
a lot of similarities, but but
they're not exactly the same, are they.
428
00:37:20.960 --> 00:37:23.599
Like people's stories always seem to vary
a little bit, like you know,
429
00:37:23.719 --> 00:37:27.079
well that's my understanding. You know
more about it than I do.
430
00:37:27.280 --> 00:37:30.079
But like this seems to be that
there are common threads, but each story
431
00:37:30.199 --> 00:37:35.280
is unique and it's hard to get
some two people telling the same story in
432
00:37:35.360 --> 00:37:38.000
exactly the same way. Yeah,
well, you've nailed on the head there,
433
00:37:38.079 --> 00:37:43.760
that's exactly right. That there is
a sort of like a core encounter
434
00:37:44.519 --> 00:37:47.039
which is quite classic, and you
know, people being taken against their will
435
00:37:49.239 --> 00:37:52.920
to a spaceship. So this is
where some of the differences come. Some
436
00:37:52.960 --> 00:37:57.039
of them can be go on to
what there's clearly to them is a craft
437
00:37:58.199 --> 00:38:04.199
on other people taken underground to some
sort of underground location, or they're taken
438
00:38:04.239 --> 00:38:07.599
to some next thing. They know
they're in some sort of circular enclosure,
439
00:38:08.519 --> 00:38:13.639
right, so where they're taken and
let's face it, it could be all
440
00:38:13.679 --> 00:38:16.559
of the all of the above,
or it could be their interpretation of it.
441
00:38:16.599 --> 00:38:23.239
I don't really know. Certainly,
there's instruments that are spoken about and
442
00:38:23.519 --> 00:38:30.599
many examinations on some sort of table. Then some of the stories get a
443
00:38:30.599 --> 00:38:37.760
bit different, Like there were a
series of reports I remember where people would
444
00:38:37.239 --> 00:38:43.599
be then taken around the craft and
they would be shown different things. They'd
445
00:38:43.599 --> 00:38:47.960
be taken into rooms where they could
see other operators on the craft operating the
446
00:38:49.000 --> 00:38:53.119
ship from various different dashboards and operating
equipment, which at the time they had
447
00:38:53.159 --> 00:38:58.159
no clue what that was about,
which what we do now, but you
448
00:38:58.199 --> 00:39:00.679
know, going back in at that
time, they didn't know what that what
449
00:39:00.840 --> 00:39:07.440
that was, you know, so
um yeah, And those descriptions vary,
450
00:39:07.239 --> 00:39:14.519
and the descriptions of the beings vary. Some people would report just dealing with
451
00:39:14.559 --> 00:39:19.239
the little grays. Other people would
report being with the little grays and tall
452
00:39:19.360 --> 00:39:23.440
grays who seem to be in charge. Other people report being with those,
453
00:39:23.920 --> 00:39:30.880
and human beings in military outfits.
Two. So there's a whole lot of
454
00:39:30.920 --> 00:39:36.559
things going on there that really no
one's really unpacked. No, no exactly,
455
00:39:36.599 --> 00:39:38.760
you know. And since the nineties
is kind of like the discovery moment
456
00:39:38.800 --> 00:39:47.559
for this phenomenon. And we've moved
through several decades since you are you getting
457
00:39:47.559 --> 00:39:52.239
these same reports today, like as
we're in the nineties, So are we
458
00:39:52.280 --> 00:39:57.119
getting those reports still and if we
are, are they still the same or
459
00:39:57.159 --> 00:40:00.880
have they evolved again perhaps in the
near death way perhaps as a possibility.
460
00:40:01.320 --> 00:40:07.639
M Well, we're not receiving those
abduction reports today. Yeah, in fact,
461
00:40:07.679 --> 00:40:14.000
we're not receiving the high amount of
UFA reports today. Either. Could
462
00:40:14.039 --> 00:40:17.360
be for a variety of reasons.
Yes, it could be that people are
463
00:40:17.400 --> 00:40:22.440
reporting differently because of all the social
media that's available now. It could be
464
00:40:22.440 --> 00:40:30.440
because the experiences actually aren't taking place. It could be because people are interpreting
465
00:40:30.440 --> 00:40:36.840
it differently, or there's so much
support out there on the internet now that
466
00:40:36.880 --> 00:40:40.440
they don't feel they need to report
it as well. Right and all along,
467
00:40:40.519 --> 00:40:45.719
I've I've always said to people you
know, just imagine how many reports
468
00:40:45.719 --> 00:40:50.800
we'll never hear of because people are
reporting it to their pastor or the local
469
00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:59.000
yes, the priest is yeah exactly, Yeah, in a totally different perspective
470
00:40:59.039 --> 00:41:01.320
of looking at the whole thing,
isn't it. You know? So yeah,
471
00:41:00.079 --> 00:41:05.639
we we, I say we the
paranormal community must be missing out on
472
00:41:05.800 --> 00:41:09.760
a large proportion of that um And
even if you were perhaps in those in
473
00:41:09.800 --> 00:41:13.920
those religious circles, you might you
might not even talk about it because because
474
00:41:13.960 --> 00:41:19.119
there's definitely demons, yeah exactly,
Yeah, and you wouldn't talk about it.
475
00:41:20.480 --> 00:41:22.280
Yeah, be the god squad will
be on my back. I don't
476
00:41:22.280 --> 00:41:28.079
want that. Yeah, that's you
don't want that. You're in a religious
477
00:41:28.079 --> 00:41:30.840
community. You don't want to ruffle
feathers, that's for sure. No,
478
00:41:30.920 --> 00:41:35.320
no, exactly right, exactly.
But it must it must get its fair
479
00:41:35.360 --> 00:41:37.079
share of that of that as well. And I think you nail on the
480
00:41:37.159 --> 00:41:42.360
head when it comes to a couple
of points there. The reports aren't coming
481
00:41:42.360 --> 00:41:44.880
in like they used to. So
you know, I've done a lot of
482
00:41:44.920 --> 00:41:49.400
historical work on UFOs, and the
seventies and the eighties were just a fabulous
483
00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:53.599
time for for UFO encounters. In
Australia, so we're not getting in that
484
00:41:53.639 --> 00:41:57.920
way. And I think that all
those channels that we used to have,
485
00:41:58.159 --> 00:42:04.599
like the groups that existed, that's
been blown apart by the ways you can
486
00:42:04.639 --> 00:42:07.480
report it, you know, like
you join Facebook and there's a thousand UFO
487
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:15.079
groups on groups. I'm trying to
get groups on Facebook, and no one
488
00:42:15.119 --> 00:42:20.320
really does anything in those groups,
but but they are there for people to
489
00:42:20.960 --> 00:42:24.159
go to as a as a as
a reporting mechanism. And so the other
490
00:42:24.199 --> 00:42:27.840
point I want to make is I
think that the level of support is probably
491
00:42:28.239 --> 00:42:30.960
or the level of professional support is
a lot less. Yeah, yeah,
492
00:42:31.000 --> 00:42:36.559
I think so. The people that
have um dedicated to this subject and have
493
00:42:36.679 --> 00:42:40.159
dedicated their lives, they're getting older
and dying out. Um, some have
494
00:42:40.239 --> 00:42:45.880
walked away, but generally I think
it's because they've just passed on. And
495
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:51.480
that's because they came from an era
when the UFO subject was brand spanking new.
496
00:42:51.719 --> 00:42:57.599
That was when their commitment kicked in, you know, And these days
497
00:42:57.719 --> 00:43:00.360
is very hard to get people to
commit to anything thing little only if our
498
00:43:00.440 --> 00:43:09.119
organization, Yeah yeah, thirty on
a Friday night to a public hall is
499
00:43:09.119 --> 00:43:15.559
difficult, yes, exactly. I
think that the social media has done a
500
00:43:15.559 --> 00:43:22.280
lot of damage to the UFO subject, and it's also been created new opportunities.
501
00:43:22.599 --> 00:43:27.519
Unfortunately, when people talk about their
experiences on social media, it's not
502
00:43:27.599 --> 00:43:34.880
documented officially and everything's lost, you
know, so it's just diffused out there
503
00:43:34.880 --> 00:43:38.320
into the community, and you know, maybe the times when people need to
504
00:43:38.880 --> 00:43:44.239
I mean, good goodness, how
much documentation do you need? You know,
505
00:43:44.360 --> 00:43:46.280
like, maybe we've come to the
end of that period in the UFO
506
00:43:46.360 --> 00:43:51.960
community and we're involving into something else, which we are now because you know,
507
00:43:52.199 --> 00:43:57.679
the Pentagon has come out right and
said, well there are UFOs,
508
00:43:57.800 --> 00:44:02.760
they exist, and we've set up
an offers to actually investigate UFOs, which
509
00:44:02.760 --> 00:44:07.000
we believe aren't man made. I
mean, who would have ever thought that
510
00:44:07.000 --> 00:44:09.679
would have happened in our lifetime.
So so I think we're in a new
511
00:44:09.760 --> 00:44:16.159
period with the UFO subject now and
hopefully one day in the not too distant
512
00:44:16.159 --> 00:44:24.440
future that UFO researchers like you and
I won't have anything to do. We've
513
00:44:24.599 --> 00:44:29.639
probably gone on holiday exactly. Yeah, because like you know, once all
514
00:44:29.840 --> 00:44:31.280
all the you know, the the
you know, the tic TAC footage and
515
00:44:31.320 --> 00:44:35.159
all that started coming out, and
the and the US military is opening up
516
00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:37.800
about it, and I started to
feel that, yeah, maybe what we're
517
00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:40.480
doing is, you know, maybe
it's coming to an end. Like,
518
00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:45.679
you know, there's there's enough research, there's enough evidence, there's enough to
519
00:44:45.679 --> 00:44:52.039
to document everything that's gone on over
the years. We're getting government acknowledgment in
520
00:44:52.079 --> 00:44:57.719
some capacity that this is actually a
real phenomena. So then you say,
521
00:44:57.760 --> 00:45:00.400
well, what is there left for
us to do once they come out and
522
00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:06.000
say, yeah, this is a
real thing. You know, they are
523
00:45:06.159 --> 00:45:07.840
real. We all know they're real, you know, no question. But
524
00:45:08.039 --> 00:45:13.239
we're beyond all that. But you
know, but what does the UFO researcher
525
00:45:13.360 --> 00:45:16.719
do once we reach that point where
it's yeah, yeah, it's an actual
526
00:45:16.719 --> 00:45:22.000
phenomenon, it's real, totally real. You know, pots were right all
527
00:45:22.000 --> 00:45:27.840
along, you know, you know
where you put your tinfoil hat away now
528
00:45:29.159 --> 00:45:31.079
away, Yeah exactly. Yeah.
People people will sort of will go,
529
00:45:31.559 --> 00:45:36.280
damn, he wasn't stupid after all. You know. Well, I actually
530
00:45:36.360 --> 00:45:40.239
think that there's still a lot for
us to do because we need to set
531
00:45:40.280 --> 00:45:45.760
aside that way of doing things.
Now that's that's had its day. Yeah,
532
00:45:45.840 --> 00:45:52.079
where I think we're on the threshold
of taking the UFO phenomenon right out
533
00:45:52.079 --> 00:45:59.679
of the nuts and bolts era and
right into the consciousness era, right where
534
00:45:59.679 --> 00:46:07.079
when looking at connections between close encounters
and near death experiences, where we're looking
535
00:46:07.119 --> 00:46:14.320
at um the what I call the
close encounter package, which is where people
536
00:46:14.440 --> 00:46:16.960
see I used to think that people
had a close encounter and all these other
537
00:46:17.000 --> 00:46:22.440
paranormal things happened around it, but
actually no, it's people have lives littered
538
00:46:22.960 --> 00:46:29.039
with anomalous experiences. And I think
the thing now is to understand why does
539
00:46:29.039 --> 00:46:32.480
it happen to some people and not
to others. I think that's the next
540
00:46:32.480 --> 00:46:37.159
step. Yeah, yeah, yeah, And it comes up in every subject,
541
00:46:37.199 --> 00:46:42.360
every paranormal subject, because because the
classic thing is that, you know,
542
00:46:42.559 --> 00:46:46.360
artistic people, philosophical people are the
ones who who have these experiences,
543
00:46:46.400 --> 00:46:50.920
you know, and and the guy
who who works on the roads is not
544
00:46:51.000 --> 00:46:53.280
going to have have any type of
encounter, you know. I think that's
545
00:46:53.320 --> 00:46:57.840
you know, like if you if
you're musical or artistic, then there's intrinsically
546
00:46:57.920 --> 00:47:02.119
with that often an interest with you
in Tolkien's books, and you know,
547
00:47:02.239 --> 00:47:06.480
the idea of other worlds. I
think if you're artistic and in that way,
548
00:47:06.480 --> 00:47:09.400
then it's very it's a very natural
leap for you to to to take
549
00:47:09.519 --> 00:47:14.239
that belief in. You know,
so many people I talked about UFOs play
550
00:47:14.320 --> 00:47:16.559
guitar, for example, Like you
know, it's very common that the people
551
00:47:16.599 --> 00:47:21.679
play guitar who the subject and you
sort of go, well, yeah,
552
00:47:21.679 --> 00:47:24.800
that sort of indicates that. But
but this other these other people in society,
553
00:47:24.880 --> 00:47:29.519
the road workers and the you know, the everyone like that, who
554
00:47:29.599 --> 00:47:35.320
who lead very straightforward lifestyles, you
know, don't have this connection to it,
555
00:47:35.320 --> 00:47:37.880
don't have this, don't have it, and when they do have an
556
00:47:37.920 --> 00:47:44.079
experience, it blows their world completely
apart. You know, the roadworker who
557
00:47:44.199 --> 00:47:47.599
has some incredible experience, Um,
he doesn't know what to do with it.
558
00:47:47.599 --> 00:47:51.519
He doesn't doesn't have to cope with
it. So perhaps that still exists
559
00:47:51.519 --> 00:47:55.440
for us in some capacity of support, being in some sort of support capacity.
560
00:47:55.800 --> 00:48:00.719
But yeah, but taking it to
that next level of where who were
561
00:48:00.840 --> 00:48:04.079
why and why some do and why
some don't, that's that's that's got to
562
00:48:04.079 --> 00:48:07.920
be answered for sure. Well,
I would take a right turn on what
563
00:48:07.960 --> 00:48:15.480
you just said because my experience is
that people who and this isn't the same
564
00:48:15.480 --> 00:48:24.000
for everybody, but people who report
close encounters typically do how could I say
565
00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:35.320
it? Jobs that are they work
below their capacity? Right, So they're
566
00:48:35.400 --> 00:48:38.079
quite intelligent people. They could do
more, but they choose not to.
567
00:48:38.559 --> 00:48:45.559
Okay, so sorry, it's an
interesting statement. Yeah. So my experience
568
00:48:45.760 --> 00:48:52.199
is that I've seen a demographic in
those reports of people who will work on
569
00:48:52.400 --> 00:48:57.000
roads, for example, but it's
what they do in their spare time.
570
00:48:58.280 --> 00:49:00.119
And that was my question to them, So what are you do in your
571
00:49:00.119 --> 00:49:07.639
spare time? When we actually used
to have a show on commercial radio in
572
00:49:07.679 --> 00:49:10.639
Brisbane, we used to run the
Panel Paranormal Panel for seventeen years, a
573
00:49:10.719 --> 00:49:15.960
weekly show, and I would say
to people. I wasn't on there for
574
00:49:15.000 --> 00:49:17.679
seventeen years, but I would say
to people initially, so what do you
575
00:49:17.719 --> 00:49:23.639
do in your spare time? And
they tell me they would make samurai swords,
576
00:49:23.800 --> 00:49:30.400
or they would paint, they would
carve, they would do welded artistic
577
00:49:30.559 --> 00:49:37.599
things. So they may work in
retail, but it's their other side there,
578
00:49:37.639 --> 00:49:40.079
the side that they don't show to
the public, which is the more
579
00:49:40.159 --> 00:49:47.639
important. So and that's how I
found That's how I came to find out
580
00:49:49.360 --> 00:49:52.559
that these people were like just exactly
like you said, they were highly artistic
581
00:49:53.039 --> 00:50:00.239
beyond statistical probability in our society that
ninety five percent at least of people who
582
00:50:00.280 --> 00:50:08.840
reported close encounters were creative people,
highly created people, or they had an
583
00:50:08.880 --> 00:50:15.119
interest in in healing, right,
so, and they might go off and
584
00:50:15.159 --> 00:50:21.719
study something like raiki or shamanism,
or they might be interested in traditional healing.
585
00:50:21.800 --> 00:50:27.079
There was less of that, more
into the alternative modalities, but they
586
00:50:27.079 --> 00:50:30.639
were. They became after a while, they became spiritually engaged. So they
587
00:50:30.679 --> 00:50:37.079
looked at the deeper issues in their
life a bit like I did actually going
588
00:50:37.079 --> 00:50:39.480
on a search for God. You
know, I thought I did it the
589
00:50:39.519 --> 00:50:43.880
other way around, did that first
and then had the experience. So um
590
00:50:44.800 --> 00:50:51.199
yeah. And they were also I
found that they were the letter writers,
591
00:50:51.840 --> 00:50:57.639
the committee members, they were the
social actives. They were people who got
592
00:50:57.679 --> 00:51:04.239
involved in their community, who if
they they ring up talkback radio shows and
593
00:51:04.280 --> 00:51:07.119
give their opinion about something, you
know, that sort of thing, they
594
00:51:07.119 --> 00:51:14.280
would be bothered about it. And
I also found they're highly critical of their
595
00:51:14.320 --> 00:51:19.880
own society, highly critical. They're
the first people who will say, oh,
596
00:51:19.920 --> 00:51:22.159
what's going on in the world,
This is crazy, you know,
597
00:51:22.159 --> 00:51:24.199
like that sort of thing. Everyone
does that to every now and then.
598
00:51:24.679 --> 00:51:30.280
But they're the first people who will
actually speak out and say it. Yeah,
599
00:51:30.400 --> 00:51:34.559
maybe a more concentrated, regular kind
of a way. Yeah. Yeah,
600
00:51:34.639 --> 00:51:39.599
So they're the advocates for a better
life, I would say, you
601
00:51:39.639 --> 00:51:45.280
know. And and the Roper Report
which was published in nineteen ninety one by
602
00:51:45.360 --> 00:51:55.000
the oh I can't remember the name
now, um yeah, anyway, pass,
603
00:51:55.360 --> 00:52:00.320
but it was they found that they
were that the people who poured it
604
00:52:00.360 --> 00:52:06.000
close in counters and had unusual experiences. They were these, um, the
605
00:52:06.079 --> 00:52:13.280
trend setters in society, and trend
setters often go against what's current. They'll
606
00:52:13.280 --> 00:52:15.159
always look for the next the next
thing and the next thing, you know.
607
00:52:15.239 --> 00:52:21.920
So they were the trend setters and
the and the social influences m which
608
00:52:21.960 --> 00:52:30.119
is very interesting in a different way
to what that term means. Now,
609
00:52:24.559 --> 00:52:35.039
you know, that's that's not what
we're that's not what we're talking about in
610
00:52:35.119 --> 00:52:38.320
terms of social influencer, you know. And we're not talking about the workpeople
611
00:52:38.360 --> 00:52:43.119
either or the selfies and all that
sort of stuff. You know, it's
612
00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:49.760
the people who are actually looking at
change change in society rather than you know,
613
00:52:49.880 --> 00:52:53.280
the red sunglasses you know. So
yeah, I would I would actually
614
00:52:53.360 --> 00:52:59.079
describe them as the change artists m
M that's a way to put it.
615
00:52:59.440 --> 00:53:04.639
M Yeah. Yeah, that's the
you know, the people who shake who
616
00:53:04.639 --> 00:53:07.360
shake it up, and the troubadors
and the you know, that's that's sort
617
00:53:07.360 --> 00:53:14.559
of very interesting, very very interesting. So yeah, who knows, you
618
00:53:14.559 --> 00:53:16.119
know, where it's all going to
end. And there's just so much that
619
00:53:16.119 --> 00:53:22.159
that that this all unpacks, doesn't
it. You know, like there's a
620
00:53:22.199 --> 00:53:24.840
lot to unpack. There's a lot
too unpack. Yeah, exactly, you
621
00:53:24.840 --> 00:53:29.440
know, And I really do hope
that in our lifetimes that we do get
622
00:53:29.519 --> 00:53:32.440
some of these answers coming out,
so that we so that us as humanity
623
00:53:32.480 --> 00:53:37.119
and people who are around living now
have those answers. And I obviously feel
624
00:53:37.119 --> 00:53:40.760
for any of the researchers who are
passing away who never had those answers to
625
00:53:40.800 --> 00:53:45.519
those to those burning questions that we
all have. Mm. Well, we
626
00:53:45.559 --> 00:53:51.760
all play a part in the because
it's such a long story. It goes
627
00:53:51.800 --> 00:53:54.639
out the eons, you know,
so, um, we're just playing our
628
00:53:54.800 --> 00:53:59.599
current part now in you know,
in this particular time period, and then
629
00:54:00.039 --> 00:54:05.280
the next generation of paranormal people or
UFO researchers will come forward and they'll play
630
00:54:05.320 --> 00:54:08.920
their part in the times they live
in. Yeah. Oh, absolutely all
631
00:54:08.920 --> 00:54:14.840
of It's exciting. Now for listeners
who have been totally absorbed by our conversation,
632
00:54:15.239 --> 00:54:20.960
how can they follow you? Where
can you be contacted to discuss this
633
00:54:21.079 --> 00:54:24.239
or what channels? Can people you
know join in on what Cheryl is doing?
634
00:54:24.800 --> 00:54:30.639
Sure, well they can. They
can contact me through UFO Research Queensland
635
00:54:30.760 --> 00:54:37.039
through the website so let's google that. They can also find me and you
636
00:54:37.719 --> 00:54:43.480
on Strange Encounters down under Facebook page. Yes, and Ben and I actually
637
00:54:43.559 --> 00:54:52.320
do a podcast called Strange Encounters down
Under Fortnightly one, so um and um,
638
00:54:52.719 --> 00:54:59.480
and you can find me on Facebook
and Instagram and my name and yeah
639
00:54:59.519 --> 00:55:04.800
and say hi, yeah, any
strange experience I would love to hear about
640
00:55:04.800 --> 00:55:07.679
it, absolutely exactly when it comes
through, it's gold, isn't it When
641
00:55:07.679 --> 00:55:10.599
you get something that's that's um that
someone wants to share with you, and
642
00:55:10.679 --> 00:55:15.360
and privilege that they're sharing it with
you as well. Yes, yeah,
643
00:55:15.400 --> 00:55:21.480
thank you so much for joining us
Cheryl on this week's episode of Unexplained Phenomenal
644
00:55:21.559 --> 00:55:24.039
Australia. It's been fascinating and every
time you and I have a conversation I
645
00:55:24.159 --> 00:55:30.480
go away and think about it.
Probably you know, the next the next
646
00:55:30.519 --> 00:55:34.559
all overnight. You know, it's
just so much that's that that you know,
647
00:55:34.639 --> 00:55:38.000
that that stimulates the thought. So
yes, so um yeah, so
648
00:55:38.039 --> 00:55:43.440
thank you very much, thank you
for having Yeah, I better play the
649
00:55:43.480 --> 00:56:15.360
show closer. Okay,