00:00:06
Speaker 1: Hi everybody, welcome to another edition of Packers Unscripted from Packers.com. I am Mike Spofford, joined as always by my trusted colleague Wes Hodkowitz. We're coming to you here from the Pottawatomie Sportsbook studio inside the walls of Lambeau Field. And Wes, it feels like a long time ago, but what we have to talk about is a Thursday night football victory by the Green Bay Packers. The final was 27-19 over the Carolina Panthers, and I think credit to some efficient offense in the middle of the game, and some stingy defense really throughout the game. The final score of this one didn't really reflect, I think, how the Packers were in command of this football game. It was a pretty good home victory.
00:00:45
Speaker 2: For Green Bay. Yeah, it does feel like there's been a few of those this season where it's like they're just the margin of the score didn't really indicate just how much I think Green Bay, in this particular case, dominated this matchup. It felt like especially... Once you got to that middle of the second quarter and Green Bay started to extend a little bit, they were in firm control of it. The situation was not going to be too much at question. I think, again, what this game underscored was two things that have been, on the positive side, the most consistent things for Green Bay to this point of the season. Jordan Love is playing at a Pro Bowl level. And when this team needs him to make a play, he's making those plays. And defensively, every single week, I am blown away by what Jonathan Gannon is cooking up for his players. Now, Gannon will be the first one to say players, not plays. But One week, Mike, we'll go and cover these games, and it's the safeties that are pressuring the quarterback. It's Keyshawn Nixon coming across the edge. In this one, it was six different guys getting the quarterback. All four of the Packers' edge rushers, active 53-man roster edge rushers, all registered a sack. And when it was a question of whether or not Carolina could potentially make a comeback in the fourth quarter, Jonathan Gannon's group just completely shut the door.
00:02:13
Speaker 1: Yeah absolutely and in this case the Packers needed Gannon's group to shut the door because the offense that had been cooking pretty well through the second and third quarters kind of stalled out and wasn't really able to put the game away offensively which we've seen at other times this year as well but Gannon's defense was there to to answer the bell and what impresses me the most about what this defense is doing is You mentioned, you know, the different looks and the different pressure packages and the amount of aggression that Jonathan Gannon is using as he calls the game and the way his players are playing it out on the field. A lot of times that aggression is going to lead to, you know, some leaks and some explosive plays and this and that, and this defense has found a way to play very aggressively, but yet limit the explosive plays because the only play And Carolina came into this game, I believe they were ranked second in the league in explosive pass plays.
00:03:13
Speaker 2: Which I could not believe after watching that.
00:03:15
Speaker 1: Yeah. The only, if I'm not mistaken, the only play that the Panthers had that gained 20 or more yards in this game was the fourth and three in the fourth quarter. A couple of missed tackles that ruptured into a 26-yard touchdown, which is what gave Carolina that faint hope that maybe they had a shot at the comeback. But that was it. That was the only explosive play of consequence that Gannon's defense allowed. And you just don't see it very often where you can play the game as aggressively as Gannon is calling it and yet not get burned by these really good quarterbacks. And Bryce Young is becoming a good quarterback. but he was just under siege in this game. His front line could not protect him.
00:04:00
Speaker 2: No, and the Packers made it very clear from the beginning they are going to pressure him. You know, there's a lot of times we'll talk about the simulated pressures, right, where you have seven guys up on the line of scrimmage, three are dropping, four are rushing, and it's actually an even man rush. This game... Gannon said, pooey with that. We're just going to send everybody. And how many instances were there, Mike, where they had six lined up and they engaged six? They had seven lined up and they engaged seven. They were basically putting it on Bryce Young to find his hot read and make a play. In a few cases, Young did. There was a reason why the three longest pass plays for Carolina all happened on third and fourth down, including the touchdown pass to Coker. But in a lot of those cases, the protection couldn't hold up to it. Young could not get on the same page with his receivers to make those quick completions, and Green Bay just controlled the tempo. But I will say this, too. I thought it was really interesting what Tyron Hopper said, and Hopper had a phenomenal game once again.
00:04:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to talk more about him for sure.
00:05:00
Speaker 2: But he said afterwards, he's like, we knew the score going into this, and it's no disrespect to Bryce Young, but Bryce Young is a smaller quarterback. He is a shorter quarterback. Green Bay used their height, they used their size, and that's one of the things that sort of enabled them to have the success that they did.
00:05:14
Speaker 1: Well, as far as an individual on defense, the guy to talk about from this game is definitely Tyron Hopper. He had, I believe it was three pass breakups. One of those was a pass that he deflected to himself for an interception, which really was the turning point in the game because at that moment, the Packers are ahead 13 to 10. The Panthers are approaching midfield on their drive. He deflects the pass, intercepts it, and the offense takes over in Carolina territory. And The Packers go down and score a touchdown, and it's 20-10. And from that point in the second quarter until very late in the game, the Packers had a multi-score lead the entire way. But, boy, Tyron Hopper, I'm not going to say that he's making Packers fans forget about Edger and Cooper because Edger and Cooper was, you talk about guys playing at a Pro Bowl level. My goodness, Edger and Cooper was really doing some special things out there. But Tyron Hopper, I think, has... mitigated the loss of Edger and Cooper maybe more than a lot of people anticipated outside of those guys in the locker room and the coaching staff who kind of knew that this guy's got something to show.
00:06:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, how many times have I kind of talked your ear off on the show, and you and I have gone back and forth about this over the last three years. Green Bay has had an embarrassment of riches at linebacker beyond anything that I experienced during my first few years covering the team when it was a lot of outside linebackers moving inside linebacker. They were struggling to find those playmakers in the middle of the field. That has not been an issue for them over the last four years. And the one thing that is very clear, you want to have your mic, you want to have the quarterback, you want to have that guy that's communicating the defense. But that will spot has been such an essential playmaking position in the Jeff Halfley era and now into this Jonathan Gannon era. And the tough thing for Hopper is that He was drafted one round after Edron Cooper, and Edron Cooper ended up being a PFWA all-rookie team player. He's a guy that was a burgeoning star on this defense. That was the guy that was stepping up in the absence of Micah Parsons in that first month of the season. And for that reason, you can't take him off the field. But then you also have Zaire Franklin is calling your defense. He's the guy that's making sure that everybody's in the right spot. So you don't have those breakdowns. So you don't have... the missed tackles. You don't have the ruptures for explosive plays. So Hopper for the last two years for bulk of it has been sort of relegated to special teams. But if you talk to Javon Bullard and you talk to these guys in the locker room, they've known for a long time that this guy can make some plays in how many plays Hopper has made in short stints, these brief relief appearances. It shouldn't be a surprise that he goes in there and has Matt LaFleur talk to the guys about it after the game. I mean, his stat line is something that hasn't been replicated by any linebacker since 2000 in terms of having that many pass deflections, an interception, a sack. And the only other player to even top that has been Charles Woodson. I mean, that's elite company. So for Hopper to step up the way they did when you talk about draft and develop, this is what it's all about.
00:08:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. And This Packers defense as a whole, up to 15 takeaways I believe is the number now, which is already halfway through this year has surpassed the total number of takeaways that the Packers had defensively last year. That's playing a massive part in things here. I want to switch back to the offense for a minute because we also have to talk about Christian Watson. Now, he coughs up the ball after a short reception early in the game. fumbles it. And this early in the game, the Packers offense, just, you know, there was an early, there was kind of an ugly three and out early. Then Watson fumbles the ball, unfortunately. Then the offense kind of gets clicking, partly because Watson makes a great leaping catch deep down the field, 50 plus yard reception, but he lands on the football and he needs to be taken off the field into an ambulance off to a local hospital to get a scan because it was They needed more than an x-ray because they do have an x-ray at the stadium. He doesn't need to leave the stadium for that. But lo and behold, the ambulance returns with Christian Watson in full uniform and number nine gets back out there and finishes the game. I mean, I've never seen in all of my years covering Green Bay Packers football, I have never seen a player go to the hospital and And return to the football game.
00:09:43
Speaker 2: Well, like I said in Insider Inbox too, being in Green Bay, Wisconsin has its perks on game day. It's pretty easy to get around these streets and obviously you have an ambulance that helps, but I'm guessing they weren't, there wasn't a lot of traffic that was flowing in their direction on the way over to St. Jensen.
00:09:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, you might not even need to put the sirens on. to speed your way to the hospital.
00:10:03
Speaker 2: But I'll tell you this, Michael. Here's the cool part about this, is that Christian Watson is doing what we saw with Devontae Adams. He's doing what we saw with Jordy Nelson. He's doing what we saw from Randall Cobb in 2014. He's been a really good player for a long time, and now he is becoming the focal point of this offense. He's becoming a complete receiver, a complete route runner. Yes, he had the 53-yard reception, but I mean, talk about those intermediate routes across the field. I mean, he's running drags. He's running crossers. He's doing stop routes. He's on out routes. I mean, this guy can do everything now at this point, and it's cool to see that. My heart sunk. seeing him get injured. One, you worry about the person, but also professionally, it's like, my goodness, nothing other than a few drops here and there. But in terms of the physical aspects of this position, nothing has gone wrong for him to this point. And then it's like, oh my goodness, what could this mean? Now he did say he broke a rib. That's something he's going to have to deal with. They got the molded padded flak jacket on him. So he'll have to adapt to that. That's something that's not going to heal overnight. But the fact he came back in, he ended up making a very clutch third down, catch down the stretch, um, Packers have a lot of things that they're still working through on offense. But my goodness, when you need something to hang your hat on, it's been number nine.
00:11:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. And it's funny because we talk about it. And Jordan Love, I go to his post-game press conferences all the time while you're interviewing players in the locker room. And I'm not saying this as a criticism, but Jordan Love is starting to sound like a broken record at the podium because he continues to say, there's so much more out there for this offense. There's so much more out there. He says it over and over again. And I leaned over to you in the press box, I believe it was late in the second quarter. And I said, Wes, these guys had a terrible three and out and a fumble on the early possessions of the game. And here we are going into halftime and they've got 20 points on the board. Like, how does that happen? It just, it, it speaks to the, and it's the overused word, right? But it speaks to the potential of of what this offense can do if they can get it all figured out. And that means limiting the negative plays. It means getting the running game going somehow. It means not having that, you know, sort of one turnover type of mistake, you know, love throws the interception, you know, late in this game in the fourth quarter when the offense had a chance to put it away. Those types of things, it's all right there for them. 27 points is not a bad day offensively. But then you look at the opportunities that they let get away from them and you're going, they should have had 37 or maybe 41 points on the board in this game. And so it's still out there for this offense. There's so much that they're doing well, but there's also so much they can still do better. And they need to find it because as we're going to talk about here in a little bit, They're in the toughest division in football. This NFC North is absolutely loaded and the playoff chase is on already.
00:13:01
Speaker 2: When you hear a team, and we'll talk about it in a minute here, with the Minnesota Vikings talking about whether or not they should bench their starting quarterback and they just lost their first game.
00:13:08
Speaker 1: In week eight.
00:13:09
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, that shows you how high these stakes are right now in the North. Nobody wants to give up any quarter. Nobody wants to give up any room. The Chicago Bears handing it to the Seattle Seahawks on Monday Night Football. Okay. Put that away for a second. Look strictly at the Green Bay Packers. To get to 5-3 and to have the issues they've had on the offensive line with their run game, the drops, all these things that you're talking about defensively, mostly predicated on just injuries more than anything else. The guys that have stepped up have stepped up in a big way, but it just seems like Green Bay's had a litany of injuries in the front. Obviously, you don't have Micah Parsons back. To be at 5-3, I think, is a major achievement. But the reality is that puts you in fourth place of the NFC North right now. So I hear what Jordan's saying when he talks about that because what is one of the big issues for the three and outs? What's some of the big issues for the negative yardage plays? It goes back to the ground game and the inability to establish that because now that Green Bay's finally started to play a few home games here and the schedule actually does line up really well for them down the stretch with having that many at home, but they've had to be on the road this often. I've actually been impressed by how Green Bay has sort of curtailed some of the penalty issues here in recent weeks. but the run game is still where things are falling stagnant. Now there were positives in this game. I thought they did a better job in third and short, you know, credit to Josh Jacobs with that. Obviously they punched it in the end zone a couple of times, but being able to just get some more four and five yard runs, it's not always about the 60 yard runs. Yeah. but Green Bay needs to find some explosive plays in the run game. Savion Williams gave them one, but that wasn't enough.
00:14:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And things are still not entirely settled on the offensive line, right? Because in this game, Aaron Banks comes back after missing five games with his injury issues. He gets plugged in at left guard. Lakin Tomlinson was playing well enough, and Matt LaFleur described him as the most consistent performer on the offensive line. So Banks is coming back in Tomlinson's spot, but they decide, okay, we're going to flip Tomlinson from left guard over to right guard, and it sounds, you know, for the most part, things went well, but obviously, you know, Aaron Banks had missed five games, and he missed a whole bunch of time in training camp and everything else, so there's going to be still, you know, some ramp up and, you know, acclimation going on there, and Kevin Zeitler is still waiting in the wings, and he hasn't played yet, and is he going to fit into the mix somewhere, so The Packers are still figuring all that out. They need to settle on something. Other injuries can always crop up, right? But if the Packers can decide these are our five guys and these are the guys that we want to play in those spots every single week and practice together every single week, that's what's going to start hopefully to turn things around. Josh Jacobs now has a couple of games under his belt and I know Matt LaFleur said, you know, this NFL investigation into the past allegations against Josh Jacobs, the Packers are going to let that play out. LaFleur says that Josh Jacobs is still going to be a member of the Green Bay Packers. So there's a lot to figure out here still halfway through the season with regard to the running game. But boy, as you said, if they can just find a way to get more consistently just the four-yard carries, the five-yard carries, it's going to, it's going to open up that call sheet of Matt LaFleur's to where, you know, everything with this offense, whatever they want to do with Savion Williams, what they want to do with Matthew Golden and Christian Watson and the different route concepts, it all comes into play if they don't have to be a one-dimensional offense.
00:16:49
Speaker 2: Well, and think too, I mean, how close, you know, one of the other topics that came up when we were talking with assistants and also with Matt LaFleur on Monday was, you know, Tucker Kraft and trying to get him going yards after the catch. They were very close to it in that game. against Carolina, but unfortunately having a legal man downfield, legal blocker downfield, and that brings it back.
00:17:05
Speaker 1: And there are actually two guys that were.
00:17:07
Speaker 2: Two guys, right.
00:17:08
Speaker 1: Legal men. They called it on one, but there were actually two guys who could have been flagged for that penalty in that moment.
00:17:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's like, it just shows you that the yards are there, the production's there, the playmakers are there, but can you, you know, sort of create that road for yourself? I think the one thing we've learned when you talk about how this offensive line has settled down, unfortunately... a difficult situation at center. You know, John Williams is having to learn that spot now and make that his own here while they don't have Sean Ryan. Although Sean Ryan was not put on injured reserve yet. I thought that was really interesting.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: That is interesting because it is a signal that maybe they think he can be back in less than four weeks.
00:17:45
Speaker 2: Yeah. Cause I mean the Packers, I mean, you look at what they did with Savion, you look at what they did with Sky Moore. Those guys went on IR right away to get that clock going on the designation to return. They didn't go that route yet with Sean, but be that as it may, he's not out there right now. So John Williams has had to man that spot. One thing that I thought was very interesting, as Matt LeFleur handled several questions on Monday about the offensive line, it's very clear that they want Lakin Tomlinson in the starting five in some shape or form. The fact that he made his first start at right guard in 10 years, that wasn't an indictment on the offensive line behind him. It wasn't an indictment on Zeitler, who Luke Buck has said at some point believes will help them. they like what they saw from Lincoln-Thompson, but now you got Aaron Banks back. So how do you shuffle that out? I think that's going to be something to your point. They're going to have to settle here quickly. They're going to have to figure out exactly how they want to proceed because if you're going to get guys healthy and keep them healthy, you now want them playing as a unit. You want to get them in unison. You want to get them synchronized. And there's only one way to do that, and it's to give them some playing time, which Green Bay has not had up until this point.
00:18:46
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, the other bit of news before we go to a quick break, on the defensive side of the ball, it sounds like The plan is at some point this week that Micah Parsons will be returning to practice. At whatever point he does return to practice, that will open the 21-day window in which he can practice without being on the 53-man roster. And within that 21 days, then the Packers would have to activate him to the 53 in order to insert him into a football game. And Matt LaFleur said if he were a betting man, gambling remains illegal at Bushwood, he would bet that it's going to be more on towards the back end of the 21 days rather than the front end in terms of when Micah Parsons would actually be activated. So still a bit of unknown there and a lot of uncertainty, but things are headed in the direction of sometime here soon seeing Micah Parsons on the practice field.
00:19:45
Speaker 2: And I just think the way that that image and that player is just going to you know, elevate this entire roster is going to be fun to watch because defensively that's been Green Bay's best face and they've done it without their best player. And then they've done it without their second best player. They did it without Javon Hargrave. They've done it with all these guys being injured and banged up and having to, you know, kind of play around with different variations of pass rush and different scheme. Well, Micah Parsons is almost back in the fold again. And I'm just excited to see how that raises the level of that room and it raises the level of the pass rush because I commend Green Bay. I mean, they've, you know, I know a lot of people say, well, you know, in terms of this traditional four-man rush, they had to kind of get away from it again. They had to do some different things. But, you know, Lucas Van Ness has four and a half sacks here at the midway point. I think he's taken a jump. He's up, he already has more quarterback hits than he had all last season and the year before that, I think he's already had a career high. Um, then you have Brenton Cox Jr. Who's been just getting closer and closer. He finally got home last week. Baron Sorrell got his first, uh, solo sack of the season and deny Dennis Sutton has been a real spark. I think for this defense, it's still stuff to clean up there. Um, but when, when he's right and he's in the spot that he needs to be in, he's just so long, lengthy and powerful. It looks like Green Bay's found a real player there in the fourth round. So if you have these guys that have all had half a season now of seasoning and being able to learn their positions and their responsibilities within this defense, and then you infuse a Micah Parsons back into it, I just think, again, injuries are always going to happen. There's going to be somebody that's going to go into the lineup. There'll be somebody that'll return. But by and large, if Green Bay can keep most of the men on the ship, I just think the possibilities are really going to be endless there for this defense.
00:21:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. It's going to be fun to watch as... as the second half of this season unfolds. But for the moment, we have some bills to pay, so we need to hear a quick word from our sponsors. Sirius XM NFL Radio delivers hard-hitting analysis and up-to-the-minute NFL news that true football fanatics need 24-7, 365. Did you know Lambeau Field is just one of our state's many wonders? Start making unforgettable memories on your next vacation. Discover the Apostle Islands and more today. at travelwisconsin.com slash wonders. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. All right, Wes, we touched on it earlier, and we can go into it in more detail now, but the NFC North is loaded, my friend, and this is where things stand at the moment. The Minnesota Vikings are on top at 6-1. The Chicago Bears coming off of an impressive road victory at Seattle in Monday Night Football. They are 6-2. The Detroit Lions, who... have really done exactly what they needed to do, where they had the early bye week. They came out of the bye, had home games back-to-back against the Packers and the Vikings, two big division home games back-to-back. They took care of both of them.
00:22:37
Speaker 2: Shout out Alex Moore.
00:22:38
Speaker 1: The Lions are now 5-2, and the Green Bay Packers at 5-3. So every team in the NFC North is at least two games above 500. But the Packers at five and three right now sitting on the bottom looking up at everybody else. And this is really, this is the most impressive thing about it because I've done the math and hopefully I've done the math correctly. So the division as a whole has eight losses. Four of those are division games in which they played each other. So outside the division, the NFC North is 18 and four so far this season. 18 and four outside, outside the division.
00:23:21
Speaker 2: Not too bad.
00:23:22
Speaker 1: Not too, not too shabby. Um, but this is, uh, um, this is going to be a battle. Um, and there are certainly plenty of division games left. Um, you know, the Packers have home games with both the Vikings and the Lions by the end of the year. And then of course the Christmas game at Chicago. So Green Bay is, is halfway through its, its division slate, but, um, the Lions have actually not played, um, I'm sorry, the Lions are the only team that does not have a division loss yet. Their two losses are both outside the division. So this is wide open. And as you said, the team that's sitting on top right now that was 6-0 and just fell to 6-1, a tough loss at Detroit, the Minnesota Vikings are still trying to figure out what to do at quarterback because their offense is not– producing at the level that, uh, um, that it needs to over the long haul. So they've got questions to answer and they're talking about maybe it's a hamstring injury with Kyler Murray, or do they go to Carson Wentz? And, and I don't know, but, um, but yeah, the, the, the Vikings are six and one and not really feeling all that good about it, I guess is the best way to put it right now.
00:24:35
Speaker 2: Yeah. I, I, so here's my thought and you tell me what you think here. I usually, I don't really coach up other teams in the national football league, but I think it is time to go to Carson Wentz. I just think he fits the offense better.
00:24:49
Speaker 1: I was texting with my father during the Lions-Vikings game on Sunday.
00:24:54
Speaker 2: Pospoff.
00:24:54
Speaker 1: Pospoff. And I texted him at halftime and I said, they have to go to Carson Wentz here. I mean, what was going on with Kyler Murray? I just, I didn't get it. And yet they still stuck with Murray. But yeah, when you've got a guy, when you have a quarterback... on your bench who has won as many games in this league as Carson Wentz has, and you're watching your number one quarterback struggle as much as Kyler Murray is struggling. I don't know how you don't make that move right now.
00:25:27
Speaker 2: I just, and it has nothing, I don't want to get into the whole, hey, is Kyler Murray washed or how is he doing? I just think when I watched the Minnesota Vikings and we saw him up front and personal, I just think the way that Kevin O'Connell wants to call his offense is Carson Wentz fits that vision better. Now, that's not to say that Kyler Merrill can't have value for you. Carson Wentz has been hurt a lot, and you don't know what's going to happen over the course of the season. If it comes to December and you have to turn to Murray, he's a guy that's been there, done that, and then some. I just think if the goal is really to win this season and then try to figure out something afterwards as far as trying to solve this quarterback issue that has sort of lingered on for them, that Wentz gives them their best shot. Um, every, every team in the North still has questions I feel like, and I understand there's a lot, I mean, you look at the defense, I mean, we can talk all we want about Kyler Murray, but we learned something. Well, we knew this, but we definitely saw it. Um, what's the best way to break down a, a Brian Flores defense run directly at it. Yeah. And Jameer Gibbs completely changed the complexion of that game. and swung that momentum over into the Lions' favor.
00:26:33
Speaker 1: As well as Vocky, the backup run. I mean, that essentially what became the game-winning drive for the Lions. They started handing the ball off to their two running backs, and it was 10 yards of crack. Bing, bing, bing, bing, 10 yards of crack all the way down the field, and then, oh, first and goal play action touchdown, which is classic Jared Goff. I mean, yeah, if you can run the ball against the Minnesota Vikings, that is the greatest neutralizer to this blitz-crazy... all out, you know, coming after the quarterback defense that Brian Flores wants to play. They can't play that if they can't stop the run. So, you know, but there aren't a whole lot of teams that can run the ball like Jameer Gibbs and the Detroit Lions.
00:27:12
Speaker 2: No, I mean, 230 rushing yards. They almost had more rushing yards on the ground than Minnesota had total yards in this game. And they did it with only the longest carry of 30. even Vaki, I think his only longest carry was like 12. They just did it by just continually beating them down play after play. It wasn't one explosive drive. I will say this too, because I actually followed quite a bit of the Bears game. And then I was watching a good friend of the show, Tom Grossi's stream as he was discussing it too. Jeffrey Simmons is the best player on the Chicago Bears and he just got there and it's not particularly close. Um, The way that Caleb Williams plays the quarterback position is dangerous. I've always said this. He reminds me of a complete in-the-middle mesh of Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith. I don't think he takes enough chances. That's more the Alex Smith realm. But his ball skills, his accuracy, his footwork, and then his ability to protect the football is all there. Pure Aaron Rodgers. But they struggled to run the ball in this game. They still have some, I mean, I think this stretch has showed, I mean, how important Kyle Menunga is to their run game. Yeah. And they don't have him right now.
00:28:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, they've missed him for a handful of games now.
00:28:23
Speaker 2: I think there are major holes on that defense, but you have a guy like Jeffrey Simmons who just basically shows up on a Friday or whatever it was and completely wrecked that game for the Seattle Seahawks. Um, again, because it's the NFL questionable push off on a JSN, but.
00:28:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was, uh, that was, that was a key moment in the ballgame.
00:28:42
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I don't know how you throw that flag in that position. I mean, it was the side judge. I mean, he is right there. He's, he saw whatever the push off was. He deemed it that, that it was enough, but, um, All that considered, I mean, Sam Darnold did not play well. They could not run the ball, and the Chicago Bears took it to the Seahawks for pretty much all four quarters.
00:29:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, and now the defending Super Bowl champion Seahawks, who were coming off of a very impressive win over the Kansas City Chiefs, and everybody thought, okay, here come the Super Bowl champs, you know, and then now they stumble at home against the Bears in a primetime game, and the Seattle Seahawks are 4-4, and they're looking up at the one loss San Francisco 49ers on top of that division with, uh, you know, with the Rams, of course, in that mix as well. So, um, this is, I mean, this is just getting started. I mean, um, you know, you've, you've got everything from what's going on in the NFC North to, uh, the Carolina Panthers sitting at 3-4 and are in first place in the NFC South. Watch out, here come the Tampa Bay Buccaneers who now have Baker Mayfield back, although they won a game and got a shutout without Baker Mayfield even completing a pass in the rain down in Tampa and they rush for 300 plus yards and go 0 for 3 on their passing and just cruise to a 16-0 victory over the Falcons as Michael Penix throws four interceptions. I mean, you know, we say it all the time, Wes, it's a week-to-week league, right? All this stuff can change. The Packers have a big one coming up here on Sunday against the New England Patriots, the defending AFC champs. The Packers have to go to Foxborough. you know, Fox is playing this up because Tom Brady's going to be in the booth and this is, you know, Brady's return to Foxborough, et cetera, et cetera. So, and yeah, and oh, by the way, then the Packers are going to turn around and you've got a big game, big home game in the division against the Minnesota Vikings right after that. So week to week league and, and every single one from here, considering the position the Packers are in is going to be incredibly important.
00:30:52
Speaker 2: And we'll break all that down and more. On Thursday's edition of Packers Unscripted, before I get to that though, before we sign off on this thing, I will say the last thing to say about this Carolina Panthers game, what I was most impressed with, an adversity-filled matchup against the Detroit Lions. The way that that thing ended, then to be on the short week. Travis Glover, who was the starting right guard for the last three games, he's not available. Green Bay ends up having an injury update on Thursday that Keyshawn Nixon's dealing with the shoulder. Brenton Cox Jr. was added to the injury report with a quad injury. All these different things were happening. Packers were on a short week mentally, physically, all these things that were challenging them, that were testing them. And lo and behold, they came out and they still won that football game. So definitely the right response. But at 5-3, you need more victories. And that quest continues on Sunday. In Foxborough.
00:31:39
Speaker 1: Yep. And we will break down that Packers-Patriots matchup on our next show. But for now, we'll call it a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team on Packers.com. For Wes, I'm Mike. Thank you for tuning in, everybody. We will see you next time.
Speaker 1: Hi everybody, welcome to another edition of Packers Unscripted from Packers.com. I am Mike Spofford, joined as always by my trusted colleague Wes Hodkowitz. We're coming to you here from the Pottawatomie Sportsbook studio inside the walls of Lambeau Field. And Wes, it feels like a long time ago, but what we have to talk about is a Thursday night football victory by the Green Bay Packers. The final was 27-19 over the Carolina Panthers, and I think credit to some efficient offense in the middle of the game, and some stingy defense really throughout the game. The final score of this one didn't really reflect, I think, how the Packers were in command of this football game. It was a pretty good home victory.
00:00:45
Speaker 2: For Green Bay. Yeah, it does feel like there's been a few of those this season where it's like they're just the margin of the score didn't really indicate just how much I think Green Bay, in this particular case, dominated this matchup. It felt like especially... Once you got to that middle of the second quarter and Green Bay started to extend a little bit, they were in firm control of it. The situation was not going to be too much at question. I think, again, what this game underscored was two things that have been, on the positive side, the most consistent things for Green Bay to this point of the season. Jordan Love is playing at a Pro Bowl level. And when this team needs him to make a play, he's making those plays. And defensively, every single week, I am blown away by what Jonathan Gannon is cooking up for his players. Now, Gannon will be the first one to say players, not plays. But One week, Mike, we'll go and cover these games, and it's the safeties that are pressuring the quarterback. It's Keyshawn Nixon coming across the edge. In this one, it was six different guys getting the quarterback. All four of the Packers' edge rushers, active 53-man roster edge rushers, all registered a sack. And when it was a question of whether or not Carolina could potentially make a comeback in the fourth quarter, Jonathan Gannon's group just completely shut the door.
00:02:13
Speaker 1: Yeah absolutely and in this case the Packers needed Gannon's group to shut the door because the offense that had been cooking pretty well through the second and third quarters kind of stalled out and wasn't really able to put the game away offensively which we've seen at other times this year as well but Gannon's defense was there to to answer the bell and what impresses me the most about what this defense is doing is You mentioned, you know, the different looks and the different pressure packages and the amount of aggression that Jonathan Gannon is using as he calls the game and the way his players are playing it out on the field. A lot of times that aggression is going to lead to, you know, some leaks and some explosive plays and this and that, and this defense has found a way to play very aggressively, but yet limit the explosive plays because the only play And Carolina came into this game, I believe they were ranked second in the league in explosive pass plays.
00:03:13
Speaker 2: Which I could not believe after watching that.
00:03:15
Speaker 1: Yeah. The only, if I'm not mistaken, the only play that the Panthers had that gained 20 or more yards in this game was the fourth and three in the fourth quarter. A couple of missed tackles that ruptured into a 26-yard touchdown, which is what gave Carolina that faint hope that maybe they had a shot at the comeback. But that was it. That was the only explosive play of consequence that Gannon's defense allowed. And you just don't see it very often where you can play the game as aggressively as Gannon is calling it and yet not get burned by these really good quarterbacks. And Bryce Young is becoming a good quarterback. but he was just under siege in this game. His front line could not protect him.
00:04:00
Speaker 2: No, and the Packers made it very clear from the beginning they are going to pressure him. You know, there's a lot of times we'll talk about the simulated pressures, right, where you have seven guys up on the line of scrimmage, three are dropping, four are rushing, and it's actually an even man rush. This game... Gannon said, pooey with that. We're just going to send everybody. And how many instances were there, Mike, where they had six lined up and they engaged six? They had seven lined up and they engaged seven. They were basically putting it on Bryce Young to find his hot read and make a play. In a few cases, Young did. There was a reason why the three longest pass plays for Carolina all happened on third and fourth down, including the touchdown pass to Coker. But in a lot of those cases, the protection couldn't hold up to it. Young could not get on the same page with his receivers to make those quick completions, and Green Bay just controlled the tempo. But I will say this, too. I thought it was really interesting what Tyron Hopper said, and Hopper had a phenomenal game once again.
00:04:59
Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to talk more about him for sure.
00:05:00
Speaker 2: But he said afterwards, he's like, we knew the score going into this, and it's no disrespect to Bryce Young, but Bryce Young is a smaller quarterback. He is a shorter quarterback. Green Bay used their height, they used their size, and that's one of the things that sort of enabled them to have the success that they did.
00:05:14
Speaker 1: Well, as far as an individual on defense, the guy to talk about from this game is definitely Tyron Hopper. He had, I believe it was three pass breakups. One of those was a pass that he deflected to himself for an interception, which really was the turning point in the game because at that moment, the Packers are ahead 13 to 10. The Panthers are approaching midfield on their drive. He deflects the pass, intercepts it, and the offense takes over in Carolina territory. And The Packers go down and score a touchdown, and it's 20-10. And from that point in the second quarter until very late in the game, the Packers had a multi-score lead the entire way. But, boy, Tyron Hopper, I'm not going to say that he's making Packers fans forget about Edger and Cooper because Edger and Cooper was, you talk about guys playing at a Pro Bowl level. My goodness, Edger and Cooper was really doing some special things out there. But Tyron Hopper, I think, has... mitigated the loss of Edger and Cooper maybe more than a lot of people anticipated outside of those guys in the locker room and the coaching staff who kind of knew that this guy's got something to show.
00:06:24
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, how many times have I kind of talked your ear off on the show, and you and I have gone back and forth about this over the last three years. Green Bay has had an embarrassment of riches at linebacker beyond anything that I experienced during my first few years covering the team when it was a lot of outside linebackers moving inside linebacker. They were struggling to find those playmakers in the middle of the field. That has not been an issue for them over the last four years. And the one thing that is very clear, you want to have your mic, you want to have the quarterback, you want to have that guy that's communicating the defense. But that will spot has been such an essential playmaking position in the Jeff Halfley era and now into this Jonathan Gannon era. And the tough thing for Hopper is that He was drafted one round after Edron Cooper, and Edron Cooper ended up being a PFWA all-rookie team player. He's a guy that was a burgeoning star on this defense. That was the guy that was stepping up in the absence of Micah Parsons in that first month of the season. And for that reason, you can't take him off the field. But then you also have Zaire Franklin is calling your defense. He's the guy that's making sure that everybody's in the right spot. So you don't have those breakdowns. So you don't have... the missed tackles. You don't have the ruptures for explosive plays. So Hopper for the last two years for bulk of it has been sort of relegated to special teams. But if you talk to Javon Bullard and you talk to these guys in the locker room, they've known for a long time that this guy can make some plays in how many plays Hopper has made in short stints, these brief relief appearances. It shouldn't be a surprise that he goes in there and has Matt LaFleur talk to the guys about it after the game. I mean, his stat line is something that hasn't been replicated by any linebacker since 2000 in terms of having that many pass deflections, an interception, a sack. And the only other player to even top that has been Charles Woodson. I mean, that's elite company. So for Hopper to step up the way they did when you talk about draft and develop, this is what it's all about.
00:08:16
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. And This Packers defense as a whole, up to 15 takeaways I believe is the number now, which is already halfway through this year has surpassed the total number of takeaways that the Packers had defensively last year. That's playing a massive part in things here. I want to switch back to the offense for a minute because we also have to talk about Christian Watson. Now, he coughs up the ball after a short reception early in the game. fumbles it. And this early in the game, the Packers offense, just, you know, there was an early, there was kind of an ugly three and out early. Then Watson fumbles the ball, unfortunately. Then the offense kind of gets clicking, partly because Watson makes a great leaping catch deep down the field, 50 plus yard reception, but he lands on the football and he needs to be taken off the field into an ambulance off to a local hospital to get a scan because it was They needed more than an x-ray because they do have an x-ray at the stadium. He doesn't need to leave the stadium for that. But lo and behold, the ambulance returns with Christian Watson in full uniform and number nine gets back out there and finishes the game. I mean, I've never seen in all of my years covering Green Bay Packers football, I have never seen a player go to the hospital and And return to the football game.
00:09:43
Speaker 2: Well, like I said in Insider Inbox too, being in Green Bay, Wisconsin has its perks on game day. It's pretty easy to get around these streets and obviously you have an ambulance that helps, but I'm guessing they weren't, there wasn't a lot of traffic that was flowing in their direction on the way over to St. Jensen.
00:09:58
Speaker 1: Yeah, you might not even need to put the sirens on. to speed your way to the hospital.
00:10:03
Speaker 2: But I'll tell you this, Michael. Here's the cool part about this, is that Christian Watson is doing what we saw with Devontae Adams. He's doing what we saw with Jordy Nelson. He's doing what we saw from Randall Cobb in 2014. He's been a really good player for a long time, and now he is becoming the focal point of this offense. He's becoming a complete receiver, a complete route runner. Yes, he had the 53-yard reception, but I mean, talk about those intermediate routes across the field. I mean, he's running drags. He's running crossers. He's doing stop routes. He's on out routes. I mean, this guy can do everything now at this point, and it's cool to see that. My heart sunk. seeing him get injured. One, you worry about the person, but also professionally, it's like, my goodness, nothing other than a few drops here and there. But in terms of the physical aspects of this position, nothing has gone wrong for him to this point. And then it's like, oh my goodness, what could this mean? Now he did say he broke a rib. That's something he's going to have to deal with. They got the molded padded flak jacket on him. So he'll have to adapt to that. That's something that's not going to heal overnight. But the fact he came back in, he ended up making a very clutch third down, catch down the stretch, um, Packers have a lot of things that they're still working through on offense. But my goodness, when you need something to hang your hat on, it's been number nine.
00:11:18
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. And it's funny because we talk about it. And Jordan Love, I go to his post-game press conferences all the time while you're interviewing players in the locker room. And I'm not saying this as a criticism, but Jordan Love is starting to sound like a broken record at the podium because he continues to say, there's so much more out there for this offense. There's so much more out there. He says it over and over again. And I leaned over to you in the press box, I believe it was late in the second quarter. And I said, Wes, these guys had a terrible three and out and a fumble on the early possessions of the game. And here we are going into halftime and they've got 20 points on the board. Like, how does that happen? It just, it, it speaks to the, and it's the overused word, right? But it speaks to the potential of of what this offense can do if they can get it all figured out. And that means limiting the negative plays. It means getting the running game going somehow. It means not having that, you know, sort of one turnover type of mistake, you know, love throws the interception, you know, late in this game in the fourth quarter when the offense had a chance to put it away. Those types of things, it's all right there for them. 27 points is not a bad day offensively. But then you look at the opportunities that they let get away from them and you're going, they should have had 37 or maybe 41 points on the board in this game. And so it's still out there for this offense. There's so much that they're doing well, but there's also so much they can still do better. And they need to find it because as we're going to talk about here in a little bit, They're in the toughest division in football. This NFC North is absolutely loaded and the playoff chase is on already.
00:13:01
Speaker 2: When you hear a team, and we'll talk about it in a minute here, with the Minnesota Vikings talking about whether or not they should bench their starting quarterback and they just lost their first game.
00:13:08
Speaker 1: In week eight.
00:13:09
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, that shows you how high these stakes are right now in the North. Nobody wants to give up any quarter. Nobody wants to give up any room. The Chicago Bears handing it to the Seattle Seahawks on Monday Night Football. Okay. Put that away for a second. Look strictly at the Green Bay Packers. To get to 5-3 and to have the issues they've had on the offensive line with their run game, the drops, all these things that you're talking about defensively, mostly predicated on just injuries more than anything else. The guys that have stepped up have stepped up in a big way, but it just seems like Green Bay's had a litany of injuries in the front. Obviously, you don't have Micah Parsons back. To be at 5-3, I think, is a major achievement. But the reality is that puts you in fourth place of the NFC North right now. So I hear what Jordan's saying when he talks about that because what is one of the big issues for the three and outs? What's some of the big issues for the negative yardage plays? It goes back to the ground game and the inability to establish that because now that Green Bay's finally started to play a few home games here and the schedule actually does line up really well for them down the stretch with having that many at home, but they've had to be on the road this often. I've actually been impressed by how Green Bay has sort of curtailed some of the penalty issues here in recent weeks. but the run game is still where things are falling stagnant. Now there were positives in this game. I thought they did a better job in third and short, you know, credit to Josh Jacobs with that. Obviously they punched it in the end zone a couple of times, but being able to just get some more four and five yard runs, it's not always about the 60 yard runs. Yeah. but Green Bay needs to find some explosive plays in the run game. Savion Williams gave them one, but that wasn't enough.
00:14:43
Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. And things are still not entirely settled on the offensive line, right? Because in this game, Aaron Banks comes back after missing five games with his injury issues. He gets plugged in at left guard. Lakin Tomlinson was playing well enough, and Matt LaFleur described him as the most consistent performer on the offensive line. So Banks is coming back in Tomlinson's spot, but they decide, okay, we're going to flip Tomlinson from left guard over to right guard, and it sounds, you know, for the most part, things went well, but obviously, you know, Aaron Banks had missed five games, and he missed a whole bunch of time in training camp and everything else, so there's going to be still, you know, some ramp up and, you know, acclimation going on there, and Kevin Zeitler is still waiting in the wings, and he hasn't played yet, and is he going to fit into the mix somewhere, so The Packers are still figuring all that out. They need to settle on something. Other injuries can always crop up, right? But if the Packers can decide these are our five guys and these are the guys that we want to play in those spots every single week and practice together every single week, that's what's going to start hopefully to turn things around. Josh Jacobs now has a couple of games under his belt and I know Matt LaFleur said, you know, this NFL investigation into the past allegations against Josh Jacobs, the Packers are going to let that play out. LaFleur says that Josh Jacobs is still going to be a member of the Green Bay Packers. So there's a lot to figure out here still halfway through the season with regard to the running game. But boy, as you said, if they can just find a way to get more consistently just the four-yard carries, the five-yard carries, it's going to, it's going to open up that call sheet of Matt LaFleur's to where, you know, everything with this offense, whatever they want to do with Savion Williams, what they want to do with Matthew Golden and Christian Watson and the different route concepts, it all comes into play if they don't have to be a one-dimensional offense.
00:16:49
Speaker 2: Well, and think too, I mean, how close, you know, one of the other topics that came up when we were talking with assistants and also with Matt LaFleur on Monday was, you know, Tucker Kraft and trying to get him going yards after the catch. They were very close to it in that game. against Carolina, but unfortunately having a legal man downfield, legal blocker downfield, and that brings it back.
00:17:05
Speaker 1: And there are actually two guys that were.
00:17:07
Speaker 2: Two guys, right.
00:17:08
Speaker 1: Legal men. They called it on one, but there were actually two guys who could have been flagged for that penalty in that moment.
00:17:14
Speaker 2: Yeah, so it's like, it just shows you that the yards are there, the production's there, the playmakers are there, but can you, you know, sort of create that road for yourself? I think the one thing we've learned when you talk about how this offensive line has settled down, unfortunately... a difficult situation at center. You know, John Williams is having to learn that spot now and make that his own here while they don't have Sean Ryan. Although Sean Ryan was not put on injured reserve yet. I thought that was really interesting.
00:17:39
Speaker 1: That is interesting because it is a signal that maybe they think he can be back in less than four weeks.
00:17:45
Speaker 2: Yeah. Cause I mean the Packers, I mean, you look at what they did with Savion, you look at what they did with Sky Moore. Those guys went on IR right away to get that clock going on the designation to return. They didn't go that route yet with Sean, but be that as it may, he's not out there right now. So John Williams has had to man that spot. One thing that I thought was very interesting, as Matt LeFleur handled several questions on Monday about the offensive line, it's very clear that they want Lakin Tomlinson in the starting five in some shape or form. The fact that he made his first start at right guard in 10 years, that wasn't an indictment on the offensive line behind him. It wasn't an indictment on Zeitler, who Luke Buck has said at some point believes will help them. they like what they saw from Lincoln-Thompson, but now you got Aaron Banks back. So how do you shuffle that out? I think that's going to be something to your point. They're going to have to settle here quickly. They're going to have to figure out exactly how they want to proceed because if you're going to get guys healthy and keep them healthy, you now want them playing as a unit. You want to get them in unison. You want to get them synchronized. And there's only one way to do that, and it's to give them some playing time, which Green Bay has not had up until this point.
00:18:46
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, the other bit of news before we go to a quick break, on the defensive side of the ball, it sounds like The plan is at some point this week that Micah Parsons will be returning to practice. At whatever point he does return to practice, that will open the 21-day window in which he can practice without being on the 53-man roster. And within that 21 days, then the Packers would have to activate him to the 53 in order to insert him into a football game. And Matt LaFleur said if he were a betting man, gambling remains illegal at Bushwood, he would bet that it's going to be more on towards the back end of the 21 days rather than the front end in terms of when Micah Parsons would actually be activated. So still a bit of unknown there and a lot of uncertainty, but things are headed in the direction of sometime here soon seeing Micah Parsons on the practice field.
00:19:45
Speaker 2: And I just think the way that that image and that player is just going to you know, elevate this entire roster is going to be fun to watch because defensively that's been Green Bay's best face and they've done it without their best player. And then they've done it without their second best player. They did it without Javon Hargrave. They've done it with all these guys being injured and banged up and having to, you know, kind of play around with different variations of pass rush and different scheme. Well, Micah Parsons is almost back in the fold again. And I'm just excited to see how that raises the level of that room and it raises the level of the pass rush because I commend Green Bay. I mean, they've, you know, I know a lot of people say, well, you know, in terms of this traditional four-man rush, they had to kind of get away from it again. They had to do some different things. But, you know, Lucas Van Ness has four and a half sacks here at the midway point. I think he's taken a jump. He's up, he already has more quarterback hits than he had all last season and the year before that, I think he's already had a career high. Um, then you have Brenton Cox Jr. Who's been just getting closer and closer. He finally got home last week. Baron Sorrell got his first, uh, solo sack of the season and deny Dennis Sutton has been a real spark. I think for this defense, it's still stuff to clean up there. Um, but when, when he's right and he's in the spot that he needs to be in, he's just so long, lengthy and powerful. It looks like Green Bay's found a real player there in the fourth round. So if you have these guys that have all had half a season now of seasoning and being able to learn their positions and their responsibilities within this defense, and then you infuse a Micah Parsons back into it, I just think, again, injuries are always going to happen. There's going to be somebody that's going to go into the lineup. There'll be somebody that'll return. But by and large, if Green Bay can keep most of the men on the ship, I just think the possibilities are really going to be endless there for this defense.
00:21:26
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely. It's going to be fun to watch as... as the second half of this season unfolds. But for the moment, we have some bills to pay, so we need to hear a quick word from our sponsors. Sirius XM NFL Radio delivers hard-hitting analysis and up-to-the-minute NFL news that true football fanatics need 24-7, 365. Did you know Lambeau Field is just one of our state's many wonders? Start making unforgettable memories on your next vacation. Discover the Apostle Islands and more today. at travelwisconsin.com slash wonders. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. All right, Wes, we touched on it earlier, and we can go into it in more detail now, but the NFC North is loaded, my friend, and this is where things stand at the moment. The Minnesota Vikings are on top at 6-1. The Chicago Bears coming off of an impressive road victory at Seattle in Monday Night Football. They are 6-2. The Detroit Lions, who... have really done exactly what they needed to do, where they had the early bye week. They came out of the bye, had home games back-to-back against the Packers and the Vikings, two big division home games back-to-back. They took care of both of them.
00:22:37
Speaker 2: Shout out Alex Moore.
00:22:38
Speaker 1: The Lions are now 5-2, and the Green Bay Packers at 5-3. So every team in the NFC North is at least two games above 500. But the Packers at five and three right now sitting on the bottom looking up at everybody else. And this is really, this is the most impressive thing about it because I've done the math and hopefully I've done the math correctly. So the division as a whole has eight losses. Four of those are division games in which they played each other. So outside the division, the NFC North is 18 and four so far this season. 18 and four outside, outside the division.
00:23:21
Speaker 2: Not too bad.
00:23:22
Speaker 1: Not too, not too shabby. Um, but this is, uh, um, this is going to be a battle. Um, and there are certainly plenty of division games left. Um, you know, the Packers have home games with both the Vikings and the Lions by the end of the year. And then of course the Christmas game at Chicago. So Green Bay is, is halfway through its, its division slate, but, um, the Lions have actually not played, um, I'm sorry, the Lions are the only team that does not have a division loss yet. Their two losses are both outside the division. So this is wide open. And as you said, the team that's sitting on top right now that was 6-0 and just fell to 6-1, a tough loss at Detroit, the Minnesota Vikings are still trying to figure out what to do at quarterback because their offense is not– producing at the level that, uh, um, that it needs to over the long haul. So they've got questions to answer and they're talking about maybe it's a hamstring injury with Kyler Murray, or do they go to Carson Wentz? And, and I don't know, but, um, but yeah, the, the, the Vikings are six and one and not really feeling all that good about it, I guess is the best way to put it right now.
00:24:35
Speaker 2: Yeah. I, I, so here's my thought and you tell me what you think here. I usually, I don't really coach up other teams in the national football league, but I think it is time to go to Carson Wentz. I just think he fits the offense better.
00:24:49
Speaker 1: I was texting with my father during the Lions-Vikings game on Sunday.
00:24:54
Speaker 2: Pospoff.
00:24:54
Speaker 1: Pospoff. And I texted him at halftime and I said, they have to go to Carson Wentz here. I mean, what was going on with Kyler Murray? I just, I didn't get it. And yet they still stuck with Murray. But yeah, when you've got a guy, when you have a quarterback... on your bench who has won as many games in this league as Carson Wentz has, and you're watching your number one quarterback struggle as much as Kyler Murray is struggling. I don't know how you don't make that move right now.
00:25:27
Speaker 2: I just, and it has nothing, I don't want to get into the whole, hey, is Kyler Murray washed or how is he doing? I just think when I watched the Minnesota Vikings and we saw him up front and personal, I just think the way that Kevin O'Connell wants to call his offense is Carson Wentz fits that vision better. Now, that's not to say that Kyler Merrill can't have value for you. Carson Wentz has been hurt a lot, and you don't know what's going to happen over the course of the season. If it comes to December and you have to turn to Murray, he's a guy that's been there, done that, and then some. I just think if the goal is really to win this season and then try to figure out something afterwards as far as trying to solve this quarterback issue that has sort of lingered on for them, that Wentz gives them their best shot. Um, every, every team in the North still has questions I feel like, and I understand there's a lot, I mean, you look at the defense, I mean, we can talk all we want about Kyler Murray, but we learned something. Well, we knew this, but we definitely saw it. Um, what's the best way to break down a, a Brian Flores defense run directly at it. Yeah. And Jameer Gibbs completely changed the complexion of that game. and swung that momentum over into the Lions' favor.
00:26:33
Speaker 1: As well as Vocky, the backup run. I mean, that essentially what became the game-winning drive for the Lions. They started handing the ball off to their two running backs, and it was 10 yards of crack. Bing, bing, bing, bing, 10 yards of crack all the way down the field, and then, oh, first and goal play action touchdown, which is classic Jared Goff. I mean, yeah, if you can run the ball against the Minnesota Vikings, that is the greatest neutralizer to this blitz-crazy... all out, you know, coming after the quarterback defense that Brian Flores wants to play. They can't play that if they can't stop the run. So, you know, but there aren't a whole lot of teams that can run the ball like Jameer Gibbs and the Detroit Lions.
00:27:12
Speaker 2: No, I mean, 230 rushing yards. They almost had more rushing yards on the ground than Minnesota had total yards in this game. And they did it with only the longest carry of 30. even Vaki, I think his only longest carry was like 12. They just did it by just continually beating them down play after play. It wasn't one explosive drive. I will say this too, because I actually followed quite a bit of the Bears game. And then I was watching a good friend of the show, Tom Grossi's stream as he was discussing it too. Jeffrey Simmons is the best player on the Chicago Bears and he just got there and it's not particularly close. Um, The way that Caleb Williams plays the quarterback position is dangerous. I've always said this. He reminds me of a complete in-the-middle mesh of Aaron Rodgers and Alex Smith. I don't think he takes enough chances. That's more the Alex Smith realm. But his ball skills, his accuracy, his footwork, and then his ability to protect the football is all there. Pure Aaron Rodgers. But they struggled to run the ball in this game. They still have some, I mean, I think this stretch has showed, I mean, how important Kyle Menunga is to their run game. Yeah. And they don't have him right now.
00:28:21
Speaker 1: Yeah, they've missed him for a handful of games now.
00:28:23
Speaker 2: I think there are major holes on that defense, but you have a guy like Jeffrey Simmons who just basically shows up on a Friday or whatever it was and completely wrecked that game for the Seattle Seahawks. Um, again, because it's the NFL questionable push off on a JSN, but.
00:28:39
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was, uh, that was, that was a key moment in the ballgame.
00:28:42
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, I don't know how you throw that flag in that position. I mean, it was the side judge. I mean, he is right there. He's, he saw whatever the push off was. He deemed it that, that it was enough, but, um, All that considered, I mean, Sam Darnold did not play well. They could not run the ball, and the Chicago Bears took it to the Seahawks for pretty much all four quarters.
00:29:00
Speaker 1: Yeah, absolutely, and now the defending Super Bowl champion Seahawks, who were coming off of a very impressive win over the Kansas City Chiefs, and everybody thought, okay, here come the Super Bowl champs, you know, and then now they stumble at home against the Bears in a primetime game, and the Seattle Seahawks are 4-4, and they're looking up at the one loss San Francisco 49ers on top of that division with, uh, you know, with the Rams, of course, in that mix as well. So, um, this is, I mean, this is just getting started. I mean, um, you know, you've, you've got everything from what's going on in the NFC North to, uh, the Carolina Panthers sitting at 3-4 and are in first place in the NFC South. Watch out, here come the Tampa Bay Buccaneers who now have Baker Mayfield back, although they won a game and got a shutout without Baker Mayfield even completing a pass in the rain down in Tampa and they rush for 300 plus yards and go 0 for 3 on their passing and just cruise to a 16-0 victory over the Falcons as Michael Penix throws four interceptions. I mean, you know, we say it all the time, Wes, it's a week-to-week league, right? All this stuff can change. The Packers have a big one coming up here on Sunday against the New England Patriots, the defending AFC champs. The Packers have to go to Foxborough. you know, Fox is playing this up because Tom Brady's going to be in the booth and this is, you know, Brady's return to Foxborough, et cetera, et cetera. So, and yeah, and oh, by the way, then the Packers are going to turn around and you've got a big game, big home game in the division against the Minnesota Vikings right after that. So week to week league and, and every single one from here, considering the position the Packers are in is going to be incredibly important.
00:30:52
Speaker 2: And we'll break all that down and more. On Thursday's edition of Packers Unscripted, before I get to that though, before we sign off on this thing, I will say the last thing to say about this Carolina Panthers game, what I was most impressed with, an adversity-filled matchup against the Detroit Lions. The way that that thing ended, then to be on the short week. Travis Glover, who was the starting right guard for the last three games, he's not available. Green Bay ends up having an injury update on Thursday that Keyshawn Nixon's dealing with the shoulder. Brenton Cox Jr. was added to the injury report with a quad injury. All these different things were happening. Packers were on a short week mentally, physically, all these things that were challenging them, that were testing them. And lo and behold, they came out and they still won that football game. So definitely the right response. But at 5-3, you need more victories. And that quest continues on Sunday. In Foxborough.
00:31:39
Speaker 1: Yep. And we will break down that Packers-Patriots matchup on our next show. But for now, we'll call it a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team on Packers.com. For Wes, I'm Mike. Thank you for tuning in, everybody. We will see you next time.
