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Hello, my book butterflies, and welcome to this next episode of the Made Chapter Podcast.
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My name is Rihanna.
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And if you haven't already, please be sure to like and subscribe so we can continue going and starting our love of books of the entire world.
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I just kept done interviewing my friend Katie, who is in Dark Romance.
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She literally has 8,000 followers on Instagram for her dark romance anymore.
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And the reason why I wanted to do this is I did not interview any dark romance author or really talking about either on YouTube.
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The reason I cannot universally read those books.
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I know they are important to do so many people, and there's a huge energy for them.
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So why I cannot give a dark romance author the interview they deserve because I read the book before talking to someone.
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I just don't want to have like a dark romance interview.
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It is a great interview for dark romance for people who just might be curious about the genre.
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We talk about the authors, plot point, intro, Katie's personal journey with dark romance.
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Two girls having fun.
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We also talk about contemporary romance as well.
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Of course, we do it's main chapter after all.
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And I do want to disclaim that I've lost my computer headphones.
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I could not find them before the interview.
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I don't think you'll hear anything, but if you hear any background noise on my end, I apologize and ask you to please overlook it.
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And let's go ahead and roll our conversation.
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Well, Katie, welcome to main chapter.
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Everyone, Katie was my former, of course, my former TMZ co-worker.
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We met through a mutual friend, Paige, who was supposed to be here today, but she's sick.
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So get well soon, Paige.
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We miss you.
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And we really bonded over books.
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But Katie and I have quite different tastes when it comes to books.
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She is a hardcore dark romance girly.
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She actually has an Instagram account, Morally Gray Katie, that has, I think, over 7,500 followers, right?
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And you're like, yeah, is dark romance.
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So Katie, if you want to give a little intro to yourself, anything I didn't didn't cover.
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Sure.
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I am mainly, like you said, dark romance, mafia romance.
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Um, I'm also really into classics and I do read like cutesy romance, but my main genre is dark stuff.
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Um, and yeah, I have my Instagram page, I have my TikTok, which is just KDB1013, but most of my stuff goes on Instagram.
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Yes, and I will link all her socials, add little texts and headers to them so you can follow her, especially if you're already a dark romance reader or you want to get into dark romance.
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One of the main reasons I wanted to have this conversation is actually a few months ago, I like put out a feeler on threads about people who would be interested in getting interviewed.
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And a lot of them were actually dark romance readers or authors, and I felt so bad because I cannot read dark romance.
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Like every time I like tried or like read the back of the book, I'm like, oh, this I don't feel comfortable with this.
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And I read every book before I interview an author because I really want to try to give like a thoughtful interview.
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I can't give a dark romance author the interview they deserve, but I'm still curious about the genre.
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So I really wanted to like pick your brain and learn about it.
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For those who don't know what dark romance is, like I know my mom watches this and she's probably watching dark romance.
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Oh my god so according to Google, dark romance is a subgenre of romance that explores taboo topics, intense power dynamics, and morally ambiguous behaviors or characters and behaviors that are toxic in real life, like stalking, captivity, and extreme violence.
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Does that about cover it, Katie?
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Yes, I think it's a little gratuitous.
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Like I think there's a lot more that goes into it, but that's a good like outline of it if you kind of want to scare someone away.
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Like, I like there is, of course, there is all those elements, but there's so much more to the genre and to the book than than that, I guess.
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Okay, very nice.
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So we're we're gonna get we're gonna get into it.
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So my first question for you is what got you into like dark romance?
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Like, take me back to the beginning.
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Um, so I went from a year of just reading classics to discovering romance books in the beginning of last year.
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And then I became friends with you, Paige, and our friend Chantal.
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When I went to the Rip Bodice with Chantal, she dragged me to the like erotic section, which is basically dark romance, and like pulled out a book and said, You have to read this.
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And it was hooked by Emily McIntyre, and I was like pretty scared of it.
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And I um I like went home and I was like, okay, I'm gonna put it on my TBR and I'm never gonna actually read it.
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So I just put it on my TBR and I like read the description and I was like, okay.
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And then I like went back to what I was reading, and then all of a sudden I found myself back at the description again, and then I went back to what I was reading, and then I found myself back and I was like, okay, I have to at least try it.
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Like it's only like 300 something pages.
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So um, luckily it was free on Kindle.
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So I grabbed it and I read it in under 24 hours.
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I didn't go to sleep that night, and I realized that that was my genre.
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It was very, very quickly, really, really quickly realized that that is exactly what I wanted to read.
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Um, so it's all Chantal's fault.
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I didn't realize that it was Chantal who got you into dark romance.
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I thought you guys were just like mutually bonded over your love for dark.
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No, no, she she was scaring me with stuff, and I was like, no, and then I finally did it, and it was amazing.
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I guess I didn't realize that you've only been reading dark romance for about a year.
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Like I thought this was like year-long obsession.
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I think it started like March of last year.
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That's it.
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And you read so many books, guys.
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Katie's my hero when it comes to her reading speech.
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She reads like over a hundred books a year.
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How many did you read last year?
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So last year it was 122, I think.
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This year I'm on track for much less.
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I feel like I'm on shark take.
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I'm like, this year I'm on track for it.
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But um, but yeah, so this this year I'm reading a lot slower, which we can get into why I'm doing that later.
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But um, but yeah, I I kind of eat eat them very quickly.
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Yeah, I mean, I'm lucky if I get 50 books in a year.
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So that's still that's still insane to me.
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So we talked about how you like first picked up that book hooked by Emily McIntyre.
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But what actually was the appeal for dark romance for you?
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Like, what made you realize, oh my gosh, this is my genre?
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I think like a lot of people are like, oh, yearning.
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I love yearning.
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Like, you don't know yearning until you find a dark romance because those men will kill, steal, they'll do anything for you.
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They will burn the world down for you.
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So I think it's for people who, and I have there's like I have it embroidered.
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There's a just there's like a dedication in the beginning of one of Gabrielle Sam's books that says, to all the girls who gave too much and asked for too little, no wonder you prefer the villain who tells you to be selfish while he burns the world to keep you.
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So it's very much like a genre for women who have never been like really taken care of and like doted on by a man.
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Like these men will literally do any.
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They will they will put a GPS tracker in your thumb.
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And like it's the most romantic thing you've ever heard of.
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But like in real life, you obviously don't want someone to do that.
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But um, but yeah, so it's just it's it's the like power that these men have that they're just obsessed with these women.
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See, that's like so terrifying to me.
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Like the idea of like a GPS being put in your thumb.
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Like, I don't know if I would like want to read about that, or like obviously you wouldn't want that to happen in real life.
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So when you're like reading something and you're like, oh, okay, like this definitely wouldn't be okay in real life, but like what makes you hot when you're reading a book like that?
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It's just the extreme that they that they're going through for these women.
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Like, he's not putting a GPS tracker in her to like catch her at her boyfriend's house, he's keeping it because like if the Bratma comes and takes her, like he needs to find you once you're kidnapped by the other people.
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So it's like it's very different than like if a man put a tracker on me now, it's to see like, did I really go out with my friends or am I like seeing someone else?
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So, like, this is all about her safety, and it just has a very different vibe in the books, right?
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So your specialty is like mafia romance and mafia dark romance.
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Was this I'm not familiar with Hooked, was Hooked a Mafia Dark Romance?
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It was, it was, and I didn't know it until later when I started reading a lot of mafia, and I was like, actually, hold on, because he is like Hook was like the guy.
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Um he runs like all these clubs, and he's like uh a um a businessman and all those things that like when if you if you aren't looking for mafia, it doesn't feel like it.
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But then once you actually because they don't, she doesn't like write it out for you in it.
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Um, but yeah, it's like slightly a mafia book, I guess.
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It's a nice little intro to it.
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I didn't, it literally took me like five months to realize that it was a mafia book.
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Oh my gosh.
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And so do you like basically of the dark romance, is it is explicitly mafia or do you ever go into like other subgenres of mafia or of dark romance?
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Um, I don't love a lot of them.
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Um like even mafia-wise, there's like certain stuff that it maybe it's more authors that I don't touch.
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Um yeah, I'm trying to think of like other types of dark romance because like I can't do stalker and I can't do the absolute worst trope to me is um consensual non-consent, which is basically rape play.
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So yeah, that one, that one I don't love.
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Yeah, that's I think was like what's like the hardest sometimes for me to get into like dark romance or pick up the dark romance books because they call it like C and C, like C and Click so it's not and it's not it's not that common.
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Like I I've read like last year I read like a hundred, let's let's say a hundred of them were probably dark romance.
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I would say two of the books had consensual non-consent.
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And I like I don't read the trigger warnings because to me it like to my people, it's a menu.
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Like it's what's coming up, and I don't want to know, like I don't want to know if someone's gonna get pregnant.
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Hopefully not.
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I don't want to know, like, there's certain things I don't want to know, so I never know when it's coming.
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And when it does, I just kind of get through it, but it puts me off of like the character, the author, like it's just I it's one of the reasons like that mixed with like bully is why I like won't do Rena Kent anymore.
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Because it's like a lot of that stuff, like Katie Robert, I love, but she does a lot of consensual non-consent from what I've read so far of hers.
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And it's just not cute to me.
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Um, those kind of tropes.
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Yeah.
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So what do you think is like the craziest thing you've like read in a dark romance?
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Um I guess like I'll tell you the one thing that made me DNF a dark romance, and I've never d and like I I don't DNF, like I I go through it.
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Um I was reading this book.
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I won't say the author because like she's really nice, but um there was it was stalker, and at the this was my first stalker read, and I like hadn't really like I've done like mafia, mafia stalker is different.
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That's like your I don't know, it's it's a little different.
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This one, it was like a guy who was obsessed with this girl, and he got to the point where he was so obsessed with her that he went on the internet and found a picture of her as a child, printed it out, framed it, and put it on his desk.
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And I DNF'd, I was like, I can't, I can't like that that just brings me into like a whole nother territory that I just am not prepared for.
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So that that's like an absolute that that was a no for me.
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Yeah, that was just insane.
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That feels a little icky, and I feel like especially with a lot of times like dark things and they happen in like the office, so I couldn't even like imagine like a thing.
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It's I'm like, yeah, I'm I know too much about the world to be like okay with something like that.
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I guess like I just don't find it cute.
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Um, so yeah, that was probably the craziest thing.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I feel like I like never like want to like yuck someone's like yum, because I know like these books are like really important for people, or escapism, or like the author is a way for them to like help with their mental health or get their creative juices out.
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But they're like things I see where I'm like, oh my gosh, like I can't read this.
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I like read the back of the book a few months ago where like the main thing was like using icicles as like inanimate objects and like the scenes and everything.
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And I was like, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Like sharp ones too, it was like gory.
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I was like, I I love I love that you have an outlet for this, but unfortunately, I cannot, I cannot read this.
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It's definitely like a fan, it's more like fantasy reading than like anything because it's again, it's not you never want to actually meet these men.
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Yeah, but in the books, I'm like obsessed with that.
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So are there like tropes that like on the other end where you're like, oh, I'll never get tired of this.
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Like, I want this in every book that I um marriage of convenience, I will never get tired of, especially in Mafia.
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Like when the dad drags her up the aisle and says she has to marry him, like, yes, a hundred times, yes.
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Um kidnapping, I will never get over.
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Just like I just love it.
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Kidnapping bodyguard romance.
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I love bodyguard romance.
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Um I think those are like the main ones that I I will like eat up every single time.
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Yeah, I feel like definitely bodyguard.
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Bodyguard.
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I haven't read a bodyguard romance, but I've like seen like more like cutesy contemporary like romances where like there's the bodyguard probe, it's usually like she's like a pop star or like a celebrity, not like a mafia.
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Right.
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Mafia, it's like her dad's the dawn, and then he puts someone in charge of it, and like it's like that kind of that kind of world.
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Yeah, or like even in the more like I don't know if I wouldn't call it contemporary, but like the twisted series.
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I don't did you I did read the twisted series, or the twisted series considered dark romance?
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No, but the second book is definitely a bodyguard romance, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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Okay, oh wait, so that's never in a bodyguard romance, never mind.
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But that and like that was and she was just like rich, I think, right?
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I don't think she was a princess.
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Oh, she was a princess, yeah.
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She was a princess.
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So, like, yeah, that I never finished the series.
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I read that one and I was like, this is my favorite one of the series.
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I don't even care about the other ones.
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So, yeah, so there's there's some good bodyguard stuff out there, but yeah, I think that those are my favorites.
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Yeah, I can also bond with you over marriage of convenience because same thing in like a contemporary romance, like uh cutesy books.
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I do love uh like a fake dating or a marriage of convenience, one of my favorite books ever.
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And people say it's like a Disney adult book, I don't care, is Terms and Conditions.
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Um where that's a marriage of convenience to like help him get his will and CEO position.
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I love that.
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Is that the third one?
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It's the second one, it's the second one.
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Okay, I read I think I only read the first one.
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The fine one and I hated it, yeah.
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But I think I would like the other two if I went back.
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The fine, apparently I liked it, but then I loved Terms and Conditions, and I haven't read it in years, and I I still I still talk about it.
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But let's see, I'm thinking about all the other things I wanted to talk about.
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I know specifically with Mafia Romance, you're very into Michelle Marone.
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Is that how you say his name?
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It's Michele Marone.
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Are you kidding me?
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And the only the only reason I'm not me completely butchering that.
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Oh my god.
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No, everybody does the only reason I know how to pronounce it is because of Chantal, and she's Italian, but it's Michele Marone, and you have to like roll your R's.
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Um, yeah, he's the love of my life.
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Let's like talk about that obsession because he's in 365 days, correct?
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Yes, yes, and so is that where your obsession started with him?
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Yeah.
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No, it was that because that's kind of all we have as mafia girls.
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There is no other no other movies or TV shows have been made.
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That is all that we have.
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So that is our only man that we've seen like on screen.
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So that's our mafia man.
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Like, I even made a TikTok that was like it no matter how you describe the main character, like if I'm reading a mafia romance, this is who I see, and like it it popped off because that's all anyone sees.
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So it's definitely just because like we've never been given anything else.
00:16:32.000 --> 00:16:35.120
Um, so that's that's our only man that we have.
00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:46.399
Do you think there are other like books that could be adapted like for screen that could have like the same like response or popularity that 365 days does or did?
00:16:46.639 --> 00:16:58.559
Um, yeah, I think there's I think there could be better because like I've watched that movie so many times, so many times, and like it's so bad, but like I love it, but like it's so bad.
00:16:58.639 --> 00:16:59.919
Like, and he's a horrible actor.
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:02.000
I just love him, but like he he can't act.
00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:13.359
So if they brought an actual like good script in, or like a good book, I don't know of how the books were, I never read them, but if you brought in a better book and like a better actor and all this, I mean you could really make something good.
00:17:13.440 --> 00:17:16.000
There's like a huge audience for it, and I don't know why.
00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:26.240
I think the closest we've gotten is like those those like short, those companies that are making those really short dramas now that are like really bad.
00:17:26.319 --> 00:17:43.279
Like it's almost like watching porn, like the acting is so bad, and they've tried to do a few like Cora Riley books, which are mafia romance, and it's just like they they did so well the first episode, like everyone watched it except for I couldn't do it, and then no one watched it the rest of it because it was so bad.
00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:46.400
So it's like if you put the right team behind it, you could make something good.
00:17:46.559 --> 00:17:48.480
So I was like a mafia romance expert.
00:17:48.559 --> 00:17:51.839
Like, what book do you think should have its time on the screen?
00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:58.480
Um I think oh, that's good.
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:07.039
I think the best series, and it's only a four-part series, so it'd only have to be like four, is the um JT Geisinger's.
00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:11.440
I don't know if I'm saying her last name right, but her mafia series, it's so good.
00:18:11.599 --> 00:18:20.559
And like the first book is like fine, but the man in the second book and the man in the third book and the man in the fourth book, they are all so good.
00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:26.480
And like all the characters are so well developed and so like over the top, um, like fun and sexy.
00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:27.920
And I think that would be the best.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.000
And I think she has like a huge fan base.
00:18:30.240 --> 00:18:36.160
She, I don't know if you've heard of pen pal, but she wrote that and like got a huge it's you all you wouldn't want to read that one.
00:18:37.119 --> 00:18:39.440
But it's like I don't know.
00:18:39.519 --> 00:18:41.599
He like, I think it's like a prison pen pale.
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:46.160
So I haven't read it, but yeah, it's like a prison pen pale romance.
00:18:46.319 --> 00:18:48.960
But she so she has a huge following.
00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:50.400
Um, yeah.
00:18:50.720 --> 00:18:53.920
I mean, prison pen pals are more common than people think.
00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:56.640
So that's really our incredibly there.
00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:58.400
You know how many times I've gotten so close.
00:18:58.559 --> 00:19:10.160
Like Instagram will like Instagram like gives me like it's suggested stuff, is like men in prison being like, I need a pen, and they're so hot, and I'm like, oh, but I can't do it.
00:19:10.400 --> 00:19:11.359
Please don't, please don't.
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.400
The only person I've written to is Luigi, writing to no one else.
00:19:14.559 --> 00:19:14.880
Luigi.
00:19:15.279 --> 00:19:15.680
Luigi.
00:19:17.759 --> 00:19:18.240
All right.
00:19:18.480 --> 00:19:36.000
So I do want to talk about contemporary romance, but before we transition to that part, I do want to ask, just because I'm curious, like I've read like some pretty erotic authors like Anna Huang and uh like for the twisted series and then terms and conditions has like a lot of spicy scenes.
00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:39.359
Well, what is like the smut like in these mafia romances?
00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:43.759
Are they like more extreme than like other contemporary romances?
00:19:44.799 --> 00:20:03.920
Yeah, although I get really surprised when I read a contemporary romance that is like as dirty because I always think that they're the that they're the the dirtiest, but then I'll read something like I read um not that kind of proposal, which comes out soon, and that it's like contemporary romance and it is filthy.
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:10.160
So yeah, but like but in the mafia books, it's like the descriptions are insane.
00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:21.839
Like I think one of the first pages in Hooked was like this hook threatening to like take the virginity of this guy's daughter on top of his bloody corpse.
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:22.960
Like it's shit like that.
00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:27.759
That's like, and like it doesn't happen, but it's like it's like how they threaten and stuff like that.
00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:34.880
So yeah, it's like pretty filthy, and like there are there's a lot of knife play, there's a lot of gun play.
00:20:35.200 --> 00:20:38.079
Um, you know, there's anything can go up there.
00:20:39.200 --> 00:20:41.519
So you never know what's you never know.
00:20:41.680 --> 00:20:46.559
Oh my gosh, my mouth will open that whole time.
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:59.279
So I feel like those scenes and those tropes, kinks, if you call them, are like a lot of the reasons why people like will immediately write out or like not want to entertain dark romance.
00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:03.839
But as someone who's kind of like in it, you have like a pretty like good following with it.
00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:07.279
What do you think is the most like misunderstood thing about the genre?
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:20.640
Um, I think it's kind of how I think it's the description that you gave in the beginning is like like, yeah, that's what it is, you know, it's this dark, violent, erotic, whatever.
00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:28.079
But there's like, like I said, there's just so much more to it, and there's so much like romance in it that you would have never thought.
00:21:28.319 --> 00:21:32.720
Um, so I I just think it's like mischaracterized as just something that's just dark and odd.
00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:38.720
Like I have one friend who is she's like kind of wants to try it, but she's a little scared.
00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:46.559
And like we both read Alchemized, and like Alchemized is like it's it's a different type of violent, but it's so violent because it's war.
00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:53.920
And it's like if you can go through that, then you should be able to go through like a guy killing like the shitty dad of this girl that he's in love with.
00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:54.559
Like, I don't know.
00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:59.759
There's just so to me, it's like I think everybody should just at least try.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:03.440
It but if it's not your type, then it's not your thing.
00:22:03.519 --> 00:22:04.480
But that's fair.
00:22:04.640 --> 00:22:14.720
So for anyone who's like listening or watching and is like maybe curious about getting into these dark romances, do you have any like beginner-friendly?
00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:18.079
I remember the last time I asked you for a beginner-friendly dark romance.
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:22.640
Like the back of the book talked about like the guy choking his cousin out and like killing him.
00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:25.680
But yeah, that's that is tame.
00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:36.160
That is um, I think, and back when you asked me, I hadn't read a lot more, although I still don't, I still can't think of anything to recommend for you.
00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:39.920
But because like there's gonna choking is like nothing.
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:46.480
But um, my absolute favorite series is Gabrielle Sands books.
00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:48.000
There's like four of them.
00:22:48.240 --> 00:22:54.480
Um, it starts with uh let's see, I have starts with where is it, where is it, where is it?
00:22:54.799 --> 00:23:00.319
When she unravels, and then there's like a few more, but those are those are everyone's read them.
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:01.440
They're really easy reads.
00:23:01.519 --> 00:23:03.680
She tells a good story, but they are violent.
00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:07.839
Um, so yeah, I think those are a good place to start, probably.
00:23:08.400 --> 00:23:08.720
Okay.
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:13.119
Well, and I know you've been experimenting yourself a little bit with your readings.
00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:13.359
Yes.
00:23:13.759 --> 00:23:17.039
You just did your first alien romance.
00:23:17.200 --> 00:23:18.079
How is that?
00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:19.759
That was a wild ride.
00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:28.160
Um, so every it's kind of like a a rite of passage for readers, especially dark romance readers, I think.
00:23:28.400 --> 00:23:31.759
And um, it's the Ice Planet Barbarian store series.
00:23:32.079 --> 00:23:38.799
And Chantal told me to read it, and then it's kind of just like hooked where like every once in a while I'd go back and I'd read about it, and I'd be like, okay, maybe.
00:23:38.960 --> 00:23:45.279
And like on Instagram, I put it on my like TBR, my like monthly TBR for like the past few months, and I finally did it.
00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:46.960
It's like under 200 pages.
00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:48.640
It's wild.
00:23:48.880 --> 00:23:56.079
Like I'm so attracted to these giant blue men with tails, and it's like, why like why?
00:23:56.240 --> 00:24:36.319
But it's so it's so weird, and like you'll forget about the tail, and like the rest, like the horns are kind of fine, and like the rest of them is like pretty human, like, but the tail kind of throws me every single time, and like they're built so like so like romance readery, where like they have like their junk is built a specific way where it's like a rabbit vibrator, like it has an extra part to it, so it's like it's just so insane that I'm like, and they speak like a different language, and like what when he like oh, I can't even, I don't want to like get into any spoilers, but they're just like these insanely sexual alien beings, and they're so good.
00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:37.599
I'm on the second book right now.
00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:41.920
So I read the first book all day yesterday, and now I'm on the second one.
00:24:42.240 --> 00:24:46.799
Um, but yeah, that's another thing where I kept being like, I'll never do it, I'll never do it, I'll never do it.
00:24:46.880 --> 00:24:51.119
And then one day I was like, this year, I'm I'm really like I'm back in the fluffy romance.
00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:53.440
I'm trying to like trying my hand at different things.
00:24:53.519 --> 00:24:55.359
So I was like, this is the time to do it.
00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:57.599
Um, it's great.
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:06.000
I'm happy you found another thing to feel like that's another thing that's gonna be a little bit of a pass for me.
00:25:06.079 --> 00:25:08.559
I mean, never for now pass.
00:25:08.960 --> 00:25:15.920
I feel like, especially on threads, I've seen so many different types of like romances that I didn't even know were a thing.
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:18.000
Like, of course, I knew about alien romance.
00:25:18.240 --> 00:25:21.359
I actually learned about shifter fiction romance.
00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:22.240
Oh, yeah.
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:29.599
The author had talked about how she has a book where the guys turn into cheese during the day.
00:25:30.160 --> 00:25:34.000
Yeah, I think there's like a there's like a produce one, there's like a vegetable one.
00:25:34.079 --> 00:25:37.519
And I think I'll cover it also has an eggplant one, and I'm like, they're cheese.
00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:39.680
Yeah, but they're men and night.
00:25:39.920 --> 00:25:42.640
No, I'll never be able to get, I don't think I could ever get into that.
00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:50.880
Unless there's like an if there's one if if there's one that's like everyone needs to read this, it's so good you'll you don't even remember that they're cheese.
00:25:51.200 --> 00:25:51.599
Sure.
00:25:51.839 --> 00:25:56.400
But like I don't think I've ever seen one of those where people are like, this is so good, you have to just put everything aside.
00:25:56.559 --> 00:25:58.720
Like I can't, I can't put it aside.
00:25:59.119 --> 00:26:02.240
So yeah, that's that's gonna be a no for me for now.
00:26:02.480 --> 00:26:07.680
For now, for now, like never, never say never, never say never, especially when it comes to books.
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:09.759
Exactly, exactly.
00:26:09.920 --> 00:26:20.799
So I feel like we kind of have exhausted the dark romance topics, but with our time left, we do, I do want to talk about contemporary because you said you've been reading some of the fluffy romances, and that's that is my specialty.
00:26:20.880 --> 00:26:25.759
I do love fluffy romances, and I just want to talk also about like reading as a whole.
00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:29.920
Like, I know you've told me like reading has like helped you through some like super hard times.
00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:31.599
It's like your number one hobby.
00:26:31.759 --> 00:26:34.160
What does what does reading mean to you?
00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:37.759
Uh to me, it's a form of escapism.
00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:50.240
And kind of like I said at the beginning of the episode, I've been reading a lot less this year, and it's because last year I was in a like eight-month depressive episode, and I kept telling my therapists, like, I think I'm reading too much.
00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:51.839
Like I'm reading too much, it's all I'm doing.
00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:52.880
All I'm doing is reading.
00:26:53.039 --> 00:26:55.519
And everyone was like, no, it's a great way to escape.
00:26:55.680 --> 00:27:00.160
But I think like 122 books was insane.
00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:05.039
Like it, it was that's how much I wanted to be not in my life.
00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:07.680
Like how badly I needed to like escape into another one.
00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:09.839
And it's so it's a really great outlet for that.
00:27:09.920 --> 00:27:22.799
But I do think that like this year, even though I'm feeling better, there's still like ups and downs, and it's more important to like feel it and kind of go through it than like be on the like ice planet banging an alien.
00:27:23.119 --> 00:27:32.319
So, like, uh, so yeah, to me, it it it's a form of escapism, but it's kind of a slippery slope if you get like addicted to it.
00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:35.279
Um, it almost felt like it was like a drug at that point.
00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:38.400
So, so yeah, this year we're taking it easy.
00:27:38.799 --> 00:27:44.799
But it's good that you have that balance and it's fun that you have different genres to kind of explore and escape to.
00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:46.640
I get what you mean about like the mental health.
00:27:46.720 --> 00:27:52.960
I feel like I use reading as escapism, and I also read like a lot more books depending on like what stage I am in my life.
00:27:53.039 --> 00:27:58.720
So, like the times that I'm like unemployed or like in between jobs, like my health takes up so much.
00:27:58.799 --> 00:28:06.000
I think not only is it because of the time, but I just need like to my brain to escape from that, like, oh my gosh, like what am I doing with my life kind of thing?
00:28:06.079 --> 00:28:10.160
I mean, I'm unemployed and I started a book podcast, so that shows you where I am.
00:28:10.480 --> 00:28:11.119
Exactly.
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:13.200
Might as well, might as well.
00:28:13.359 --> 00:28:21.599
And so I know that uh you just did the first time caller series, and you are so obsessed with those characters.
00:28:21.759 --> 00:28:27.440
I was when you are choosing like a contemporary romance, like you're coming out of like your mafia romance bubble.
00:28:27.519 --> 00:28:30.000
Like, what makes you pick up a contemporary romance book?
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:31.359
What draws you to it?
00:28:31.680 --> 00:28:34.000
Um, why did I choose that?
00:28:34.079 --> 00:28:38.960
I think I I finally like went back to Libby because all mafia romances on KU.
00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:41.279
So like I wasn't on Libby for like a whole year.
00:28:41.440 --> 00:28:45.200
So I went back on Libby and I started just like reserving popular books.
00:28:45.359 --> 00:28:50.880
I wanted to kind of get back in with something that like I know is enough people liked it that it's gotta hit.
00:28:51.119 --> 00:28:53.920
So then the second one came out and I saw how well it was doing.
00:28:54.000 --> 00:28:57.039
So I was like, okay, so when First Time Color got available, I read it immediately.
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:09.839
And it was just so I don't know if it's actually as amazing as I thought it was, or if it's just like because I haven't had that breath of fresh air in so long that it just like was so nice to have in that moment.
00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:15.680
And that's another one of those books where it's like most of the book is not filthy, but when it gets filthy, it's like filthy.
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:17.920
So that like so I was like, oh, this is right.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:18.960
My alley.
00:29:19.519 --> 00:29:24.160
Um, and even the second book is like it took forever, but like it got really, really dirty.
00:29:24.400 --> 00:29:27.519
So um, yeah, I I was obsessed with those books.
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:28.480
I can't wait for the third.
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:36.319
But I think I mostly look for what if I want to make sure I'm I'm getting a five-star read, I have to see what like everybody loves.
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:39.200
And it won't always hit, but like that one hit.
00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:42.799
Yeah, I read First Time Collar over to summer last year.
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:45.920
It was like my summer read balls in Europe, and I loved it.
00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:59.200
And I feel like I don't love like excessive smut, I like shorter bouts of it that are like well done, and I feel like that's like a very good like proportion of like plot to like a good smut scene, and then I can like keep going um with life.
00:29:59.279 --> 00:30:00.880
So I really, really enjoy that book.
00:30:01.119 --> 00:30:11.519
I also read In Back to You, but I feel like I wasn't in a good mental state when reading In Back to You because it was like like during and like right after like my accident, which happened in like the snow.
00:30:11.599 --> 00:30:12.079
Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:30:12.160 --> 00:30:16.079
And you're like in the freaking snow like the whole time, and I'm like, I can't do this.
00:30:16.160 --> 00:30:17.519
But I'm not a good one.
00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:24.799
I don't like pause and I don't DNF books, so I just kind of like powered through it, and then I was like, everyone loves this book, but I really struggled through it.
00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:36.559
I was like, I'm probably the problem here, but I definitely liked the first one better, and I'm still like gonna read the series, but I wish I had like that like euphoric high that you and Paige were like talking about when doing um now back to you.
00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:37.920
Oh my god, I know.
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:50.240
And I think like the between the first and the second, too, like on first time caller, it's more I wouldn't say realistic, but it is more realistic than like a snowstorm and then they're going to a random cabin.
00:30:50.400 --> 00:30:54.160
Like it's just it it was like so forced, but I loved it, but it was forced.
00:30:54.319 --> 00:30:57.599
So I think there's that too, which made first time caller a lot better.
00:30:57.839 --> 00:30:59.119
That's true, that's true.
00:30:59.200 --> 00:31:04.079
So when you are there like any tropes that you like love specifically in contemporary romance?
00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:06.000
Because I love call it cliche.
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:18.160
I love like a good C CEO, workaholic, like guy who has like lots of money, like trope character who's like usually a little grumpy, but are there like things that you look for besides that like, oh, it just has like all five-star reads?
00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:24.640
Um, I actually hate billionaire romance, which is weird because I love mafia romances.
00:31:26.720 --> 00:31:36.400
I know, but it's different because like they're like badass and they're killing people, but like these guys are just like in suits and have a ton of money and they're kind of just assholes.
00:31:36.640 --> 00:31:37.680
So like I don't know.
00:31:37.839 --> 00:31:42.400
And like I don't, I'm very much like non-capitalism.
00:31:42.559 --> 00:31:46.240
Like, I don't, I don't need a lot of money, I don't need to be with a man with a lot of money.
00:31:46.400 --> 00:31:53.039
So like to me, it doesn't really I don't know, it just doesn't like feel and I don't really love grumpy sunshine either.
00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:55.200
But I do what I I'll talk about what I do love.
00:31:55.279 --> 00:32:06.160
I do love um, I love enemies to lovers, I love friends to lovers, I like um marriage of convenience, I love fake dating.
00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:12.799
I think those are probably like the best ones for me, but like enemies to lovers is always the best.
00:32:13.039 --> 00:32:14.960
Yeah, I like enemies to lovers.
00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:16.400
Fake dating's my favorite trope.
00:32:16.559 --> 00:32:24.319
Maybe that's why is good the millionaire tropes sometimes, because it's like they usually have to fake date someone for like their image or work event.
00:32:24.480 --> 00:32:27.440
So I think that like attracts me to them as well.
00:32:27.519 --> 00:32:28.480
But that's so interesting.
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:29.119
I didn't know.
00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:30.079
I find that so funny.
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:33.519
You're like, it's okay if they have money through killing people, but capital are killed.
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:34.799
That's where I draw the line.
00:32:35.440 --> 00:32:51.839
Well, and a lot of the times with the mafia men, they don't like they don't it sounds so I feel like I'm so stupid because in real life they flaunt their money, but like I feel like they don't really flaunt their money in the books that much because they're so focused on like doing other things.
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:58.240
I don't know, I don't know, but it never comes across to me the same as like billionaire for some reason.
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:02.480
Oh, and I also love like best friend's brother and brother's best friend.
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:09.680
I love those, and like I love like Carly Fortune books, like those are like that to me is like Chef's Kiss.
00:33:09.839 --> 00:33:13.680
I don't know what it is about it, but I love her books.
00:33:13.920 --> 00:33:21.039
Yeah, I she like on my TBR because does she have like an adaptation coming out to she does and I'm prime and I'm scared.
00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:24.799
I don't like adaptations of things that I've read, so we'll see.
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:25.519
You know what?
00:33:25.599 --> 00:33:27.200
Like, that's my hot take too.
00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:29.920
I really struggle with it, but they usually have to win me over.
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:32.559
If we had more time, I would definitely talk about adaptations.
00:33:32.640 --> 00:33:39.200
Maybe we'll do a part two website so we can break down adaptations, especially because I think this is a good adaptation.
00:33:39.680 --> 00:33:44.240
I think she reads a lot of things that are adapted for filament that's TV.
00:33:44.640 --> 00:33:47.920
And I do as well, but she's always like more enthusiastic about it than I am.
00:33:48.319 --> 00:33:49.519
Yeah, yeah.
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:54.960
But those were all my questions, or all the questions we have time for.
00:33:55.119 --> 00:34:00.640
I had so much fun talking about dark romance before we say goodbye to everyone.
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:06.319
Is there anything that you want readers to know about yourself or listeners to know about yourself or dark romance?
00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:13.679
I'm obviously gonna include your social channels, but I don't think so.
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:15.679
I think we hit pretty much everything.
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:17.440
Yeah, I think that's it.
00:34:17.920 --> 00:34:18.320
Amazing.
00:34:18.400 --> 00:34:19.840
Well, this was so fun.
00:34:20.239 --> 00:34:20.719
This is fun.
00:34:21.440 --> 00:34:22.800
Thank you so much for listening.
00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:24.000
I hope you enjoyed that.
00:34:24.320 --> 00:34:35.760
Be sure to follow Katie on Instagram and TikTok and keep up with what she is reading from alien romance to dark mafia romance to contemporary romance, is quite the variety next week.
00:34:35.920 --> 00:34:37.840
I'm going back to author interviews.
00:34:37.920 --> 00:34:40.000
I'm interviewing Alexa Martin.
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:43.760
Her new book, I the beauty chat.
00:34:44.079 --> 00:34:45.360
I'm obsessed with this cover.
00:34:45.440 --> 00:34:46.719
I think it's so beautiful.
00:34:46.960 --> 00:34:51.679
And it's also exciting for me because it's my first time really reading a cowboy romance.
00:34:52.000 --> 00:34:58.880
So we are gonna dive into it, talk about the characters, talk about the representation, talk about the inspiration.
00:34:59.119 --> 00:35:00.159
I'm so excited.
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:04.159
I hope you come back for it, and I hope you have a great week my book butterflies.
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:05.519
I'll see you next time.
00:00:01.679 --> 00:00:05.919
Hello, my book butterflies, and welcome to this next episode of the Made Chapter Podcast.
00:00:06.320 --> 00:00:07.200
My name is Rihanna.
00:00:07.360 --> 00:00:14.160
And if you haven't already, please be sure to like and subscribe so we can continue going and starting our love of books of the entire world.
00:00:14.480 --> 00:00:19.039
I just kept done interviewing my friend Katie, who is in Dark Romance.
00:00:20.079 --> 00:00:25.679
She literally has 8,000 followers on Instagram for her dark romance anymore.
00:00:25.920 --> 00:00:33.200
And the reason why I wanted to do this is I did not interview any dark romance author or really talking about either on YouTube.
00:00:33.920 --> 00:00:37.439
The reason I cannot universally read those books.
00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:42.159
I know they are important to do so many people, and there's a huge energy for them.
00:00:44.640 --> 00:00:51.280
So why I cannot give a dark romance author the interview they deserve because I read the book before talking to someone.
00:00:51.520 --> 00:00:55.200
I just don't want to have like a dark romance interview.
00:00:55.439 --> 00:01:00.560
It is a great interview for dark romance for people who just might be curious about the genre.
00:01:02.799 --> 00:01:08.560
We talk about the authors, plot point, intro, Katie's personal journey with dark romance.
00:01:10.799 --> 00:01:12.239
Two girls having fun.
00:01:12.640 --> 00:01:15.359
We also talk about contemporary romance as well.
00:01:15.599 --> 00:01:18.400
Of course, we do it's main chapter after all.
00:01:18.640 --> 00:01:22.000
And I do want to disclaim that I've lost my computer headphones.
00:01:22.400 --> 00:01:24.879
I could not find them before the interview.
00:01:25.200 --> 00:01:32.560
I don't think you'll hear anything, but if you hear any background noise on my end, I apologize and ask you to please overlook it.
00:01:32.640 --> 00:01:34.959
And let's go ahead and roll our conversation.
00:01:35.120 --> 00:01:38.159
Well, Katie, welcome to main chapter.
00:01:38.319 --> 00:01:44.079
Everyone, Katie was my former, of course, my former TMZ co-worker.
00:01:44.239 --> 00:01:48.400
We met through a mutual friend, Paige, who was supposed to be here today, but she's sick.
00:01:48.480 --> 00:01:50.079
So get well soon, Paige.
00:01:50.319 --> 00:01:51.200
We miss you.
00:01:51.439 --> 00:01:54.079
And we really bonded over books.
00:01:54.239 --> 00:01:59.120
But Katie and I have quite different tastes when it comes to books.
00:01:59.439 --> 00:02:02.719
She is a hardcore dark romance girly.
00:02:03.280 --> 00:02:08.960
She actually has an Instagram account, Morally Gray Katie, that has, I think, over 7,500 followers, right?
00:02:09.039 --> 00:02:12.000
And you're like, yeah, is dark romance.
00:02:12.080 --> 00:02:16.240
So Katie, if you want to give a little intro to yourself, anything I didn't didn't cover.
00:02:16.560 --> 00:02:16.879
Sure.
00:02:17.039 --> 00:02:21.199
I am mainly, like you said, dark romance, mafia romance.
00:02:21.439 --> 00:02:28.879
Um, I'm also really into classics and I do read like cutesy romance, but my main genre is dark stuff.
00:02:29.280 --> 00:02:36.639
Um, and yeah, I have my Instagram page, I have my TikTok, which is just KDB1013, but most of my stuff goes on Instagram.
00:02:36.879 --> 00:02:48.159
Yes, and I will link all her socials, add little texts and headers to them so you can follow her, especially if you're already a dark romance reader or you want to get into dark romance.
00:02:48.319 --> 00:02:58.639
One of the main reasons I wanted to have this conversation is actually a few months ago, I like put out a feeler on threads about people who would be interested in getting interviewed.
00:02:58.879 --> 00:03:06.719
And a lot of them were actually dark romance readers or authors, and I felt so bad because I cannot read dark romance.
00:03:06.879 --> 00:03:11.520
Like every time I like tried or like read the back of the book, I'm like, oh, this I don't feel comfortable with this.
00:03:11.599 --> 00:03:17.280
And I read every book before I interview an author because I really want to try to give like a thoughtful interview.
00:03:17.520 --> 00:03:23.360
I can't give a dark romance author the interview they deserve, but I'm still curious about the genre.
00:03:23.599 --> 00:03:27.039
So I really wanted to like pick your brain and learn about it.
00:03:27.199 --> 00:03:33.599
For those who don't know what dark romance is, like I know my mom watches this and she's probably watching dark romance.
00:03:33.759 --> 00:03:50.240
Oh my god so according to Google, dark romance is a subgenre of romance that explores taboo topics, intense power dynamics, and morally ambiguous behaviors or characters and behaviors that are toxic in real life, like stalking, captivity, and extreme violence.
00:03:50.400 --> 00:03:52.080
Does that about cover it, Katie?
00:03:52.639 --> 00:03:56.719
Yes, I think it's a little gratuitous.
00:03:56.800 --> 00:04:03.199
Like I think there's a lot more that goes into it, but that's a good like outline of it if you kind of want to scare someone away.
00:04:04.240 --> 00:04:12.560
Like, I like there is, of course, there is all those elements, but there's so much more to the genre and to the book than than that, I guess.
00:04:12.879 --> 00:04:13.680
Okay, very nice.
00:04:13.759 --> 00:04:15.520
So we're we're gonna get we're gonna get into it.
00:04:15.599 --> 00:04:20.079
So my first question for you is what got you into like dark romance?
00:04:20.160 --> 00:04:22.160
Like, take me back to the beginning.
00:04:22.480 --> 00:04:30.480
Um, so I went from a year of just reading classics to discovering romance books in the beginning of last year.
00:04:30.720 --> 00:04:35.360
And then I became friends with you, Paige, and our friend Chantal.
00:04:35.600 --> 00:04:45.519
When I went to the Rip Bodice with Chantal, she dragged me to the like erotic section, which is basically dark romance, and like pulled out a book and said, You have to read this.
00:04:45.600 --> 00:04:49.680
And it was hooked by Emily McIntyre, and I was like pretty scared of it.
00:04:50.160 --> 00:04:55.439
And I um I like went home and I was like, okay, I'm gonna put it on my TBR and I'm never gonna actually read it.
00:04:55.519 --> 00:04:59.439
So I just put it on my TBR and I like read the description and I was like, okay.
00:04:59.600 --> 00:05:08.319
And then I like went back to what I was reading, and then all of a sudden I found myself back at the description again, and then I went back to what I was reading, and then I found myself back and I was like, okay, I have to at least try it.
00:05:08.399 --> 00:05:10.720
Like it's only like 300 something pages.
00:05:10.959 --> 00:05:14.000
So um, luckily it was free on Kindle.
00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:17.519
So I grabbed it and I read it in under 24 hours.
00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:22.240
I didn't go to sleep that night, and I realized that that was my genre.
00:05:22.879 --> 00:05:27.839
It was very, very quickly, really, really quickly realized that that is exactly what I wanted to read.
00:05:27.920 --> 00:05:29.600
Um, so it's all Chantal's fault.
00:05:30.240 --> 00:05:33.759
I didn't realize that it was Chantal who got you into dark romance.
00:05:34.000 --> 00:05:37.600
I thought you guys were just like mutually bonded over your love for dark.
00:05:38.240 --> 00:05:45.040
No, no, she she was scaring me with stuff, and I was like, no, and then I finally did it, and it was amazing.
00:05:45.759 --> 00:05:48.959
I guess I didn't realize that you've only been reading dark romance for about a year.
00:05:49.040 --> 00:05:52.399
Like I thought this was like year-long obsession.
00:05:52.879 --> 00:05:54.959
I think it started like March of last year.
00:05:55.120 --> 00:05:55.680
That's it.
00:05:56.000 --> 00:05:57.600
And you read so many books, guys.
00:05:57.680 --> 00:06:00.240
Katie's my hero when it comes to her reading speech.
00:06:00.319 --> 00:06:02.319
She reads like over a hundred books a year.
00:06:02.399 --> 00:06:03.839
How many did you read last year?
00:06:04.160 --> 00:06:06.720
So last year it was 122, I think.
00:06:07.279 --> 00:06:08.720
This year I'm on track for much less.
00:06:08.800 --> 00:06:09.920
I feel like I'm on shark take.
00:06:10.000 --> 00:06:11.600
I'm like, this year I'm on track for it.
00:06:11.839 --> 00:06:19.519
But um, but yeah, so this this year I'm reading a lot slower, which we can get into why I'm doing that later.
00:06:19.680 --> 00:06:23.439
But um, but yeah, I I kind of eat eat them very quickly.
00:06:23.680 --> 00:06:27.279
Yeah, I mean, I'm lucky if I get 50 books in a year.
00:06:27.519 --> 00:06:30.319
So that's still that's still insane to me.
00:06:30.480 --> 00:06:35.199
So we talked about how you like first picked up that book hooked by Emily McIntyre.
00:06:35.279 --> 00:06:38.079
But what actually was the appeal for dark romance for you?
00:06:38.160 --> 00:06:40.800
Like, what made you realize, oh my gosh, this is my genre?
00:06:41.120 --> 00:06:43.279
I think like a lot of people are like, oh, yearning.
00:06:43.360 --> 00:06:44.000
I love yearning.
00:06:44.079 --> 00:06:52.720
Like, you don't know yearning until you find a dark romance because those men will kill, steal, they'll do anything for you.
00:06:52.879 --> 00:06:54.480
They will burn the world down for you.
00:06:54.800 --> 00:07:01.360
So I think it's for people who, and I have there's like I have it embroidered.
00:07:01.519 --> 00:07:12.639
There's a just there's like a dedication in the beginning of one of Gabrielle Sam's books that says, to all the girls who gave too much and asked for too little, no wonder you prefer the villain who tells you to be selfish while he burns the world to keep you.
00:07:12.800 --> 00:07:20.319
So it's very much like a genre for women who have never been like really taken care of and like doted on by a man.
00:07:20.480 --> 00:07:22.240
Like these men will literally do any.
00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:26.079
They will they will put a GPS tracker in your thumb.
00:07:26.160 --> 00:07:28.720
And like it's the most romantic thing you've ever heard of.
00:07:28.879 --> 00:07:32.240
But like in real life, you obviously don't want someone to do that.
00:07:32.560 --> 00:07:40.319
But um, but yeah, so it's just it's it's the like power that these men have that they're just obsessed with these women.
00:07:40.639 --> 00:07:42.399
See, that's like so terrifying to me.
00:07:42.480 --> 00:07:45.680
Like the idea of like a GPS being put in your thumb.
00:07:45.839 --> 00:07:51.519
Like, I don't know if I would like want to read about that, or like obviously you wouldn't want that to happen in real life.
00:07:51.680 --> 00:07:59.120
So when you're like reading something and you're like, oh, okay, like this definitely wouldn't be okay in real life, but like what makes you hot when you're reading a book like that?
00:07:59.439 --> 00:08:02.879
It's just the extreme that they that they're going through for these women.
00:08:02.959 --> 00:08:13.279
Like, he's not putting a GPS tracker in her to like catch her at her boyfriend's house, he's keeping it because like if the Bratma comes and takes her, like he needs to find you once you're kidnapped by the other people.
00:08:13.360 --> 00:08:20.079
So it's like it's very different than like if a man put a tracker on me now, it's to see like, did I really go out with my friends or am I like seeing someone else?
00:08:20.240 --> 00:08:25.199
So, like, this is all about her safety, and it just has a very different vibe in the books, right?
00:08:25.279 --> 00:08:31.120
So your specialty is like mafia romance and mafia dark romance.
00:08:31.279 --> 00:08:35.120
Was this I'm not familiar with Hooked, was Hooked a Mafia Dark Romance?
00:08:35.360 --> 00:08:45.600
It was, it was, and I didn't know it until later when I started reading a lot of mafia, and I was like, actually, hold on, because he is like Hook was like the guy.
00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:57.840
Um he runs like all these clubs, and he's like uh a um a businessman and all those things that like when if you if you aren't looking for mafia, it doesn't feel like it.
00:08:58.080 --> 00:09:03.200
But then once you actually because they don't, she doesn't like write it out for you in it.
00:09:03.360 --> 00:09:07.519
Um, but yeah, it's like slightly a mafia book, I guess.
00:09:07.840 --> 00:09:09.120
It's a nice little intro to it.
00:09:09.279 --> 00:09:12.480
I didn't, it literally took me like five months to realize that it was a mafia book.
00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:13.440
Oh my gosh.
00:09:13.600 --> 00:09:21.759
And so do you like basically of the dark romance, is it is explicitly mafia or do you ever go into like other subgenres of mafia or of dark romance?
00:09:22.159 --> 00:09:25.440
Um, I don't love a lot of them.
00:09:25.919 --> 00:09:33.840
Um like even mafia-wise, there's like certain stuff that it maybe it's more authors that I don't touch.
00:09:34.080 --> 00:09:50.320
Um yeah, I'm trying to think of like other types of dark romance because like I can't do stalker and I can't do the absolute worst trope to me is um consensual non-consent, which is basically rape play.
00:09:51.360 --> 00:09:54.720
So yeah, that one, that one I don't love.
00:09:55.039 --> 00:10:07.039
Yeah, that's I think was like what's like the hardest sometimes for me to get into like dark romance or pick up the dark romance books because they call it like C and C, like C and Click so it's not and it's not it's not that common.
00:10:07.200 --> 00:10:13.120
Like I I've read like last year I read like a hundred, let's let's say a hundred of them were probably dark romance.
00:10:13.360 --> 00:10:16.879
I would say two of the books had consensual non-consent.
00:10:17.200 --> 00:10:23.440
And I like I don't read the trigger warnings because to me it like to my people, it's a menu.
00:10:23.519 --> 00:10:27.519
Like it's what's coming up, and I don't want to know, like I don't want to know if someone's gonna get pregnant.
00:10:27.600 --> 00:10:28.080
Hopefully not.
00:10:28.159 --> 00:10:31.840
I don't want to know, like, there's certain things I don't want to know, so I never know when it's coming.
00:10:32.000 --> 00:10:44.559
And when it does, I just kind of get through it, but it puts me off of like the character, the author, like it's just I it's one of the reasons like that mixed with like bully is why I like won't do Rena Kent anymore.
00:10:44.720 --> 00:10:51.360
Because it's like a lot of that stuff, like Katie Robert, I love, but she does a lot of consensual non-consent from what I've read so far of hers.
00:10:51.600 --> 00:10:53.440
And it's just not cute to me.
00:10:53.600 --> 00:10:55.279
Um, those kind of tropes.
00:10:55.440 --> 00:10:55.679
Yeah.
00:10:55.840 --> 00:11:00.480
So what do you think is like the craziest thing you've like read in a dark romance?
00:11:02.159 --> 00:11:14.639
Um I guess like I'll tell you the one thing that made me DNF a dark romance, and I've never d and like I I don't DNF, like I I go through it.
00:11:14.879 --> 00:11:17.840
Um I was reading this book.
00:11:17.919 --> 00:11:30.559
I won't say the author because like she's really nice, but um there was it was stalker, and at the this was my first stalker read, and I like hadn't really like I've done like mafia, mafia stalker is different.
00:11:30.639 --> 00:11:33.120
That's like your I don't know, it's it's a little different.
00:11:33.440 --> 00:11:45.360
This one, it was like a guy who was obsessed with this girl, and he got to the point where he was so obsessed with her that he went on the internet and found a picture of her as a child, printed it out, framed it, and put it on his desk.
00:11:45.440 --> 00:11:54.399
And I DNF'd, I was like, I can't, I can't like that that just brings me into like a whole nother territory that I just am not prepared for.
00:11:54.879 --> 00:11:58.159
So that that's like an absolute that that was a no for me.
00:11:58.240 --> 00:11:59.679
Yeah, that was just insane.
00:12:00.000 --> 00:12:08.879
That feels a little icky, and I feel like especially with a lot of times like dark things and they happen in like the office, so I couldn't even like imagine like a thing.
00:12:09.200 --> 00:12:15.120
It's I'm like, yeah, I'm I know too much about the world to be like okay with something like that.
00:12:15.200 --> 00:12:17.200
I guess like I just don't find it cute.
00:12:17.440 --> 00:12:21.600
Um, so yeah, that was probably the craziest thing.
00:12:21.840 --> 00:12:22.480
Yeah.
00:12:22.879 --> 00:12:23.279
Yeah.
00:12:23.519 --> 00:12:34.879
I feel like I like never like want to like yuck someone's like yum, because I know like these books are like really important for people, or escapism, or like the author is a way for them to like help with their mental health or get their creative juices out.
00:12:35.120 --> 00:12:37.919
But they're like things I see where I'm like, oh my gosh, like I can't read this.
00:12:38.080 --> 00:12:46.000
I like read the back of the book a few months ago where like the main thing was like using icicles as like inanimate objects and like the scenes and everything.
00:12:46.080 --> 00:12:48.080
And I was like, Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:12:48.639 --> 00:12:50.639
Like sharp ones too, it was like gory.
00:12:50.799 --> 00:12:57.919
I was like, I I love I love that you have an outlet for this, but unfortunately, I cannot, I cannot read this.
00:12:58.480 --> 00:13:06.720
It's definitely like a fan, it's more like fantasy reading than like anything because it's again, it's not you never want to actually meet these men.
00:13:06.879 --> 00:13:09.039
Yeah, but in the books, I'm like obsessed with that.
00:13:10.240 --> 00:13:15.440
So are there like tropes that like on the other end where you're like, oh, I'll never get tired of this.
00:13:15.519 --> 00:13:20.960
Like, I want this in every book that I um marriage of convenience, I will never get tired of, especially in Mafia.
00:13:21.039 --> 00:13:26.080
Like when the dad drags her up the aisle and says she has to marry him, like, yes, a hundred times, yes.
00:13:26.399 --> 00:13:29.840
Um kidnapping, I will never get over.
00:13:30.000 --> 00:13:31.759
Just like I just love it.
00:13:31.919 --> 00:13:33.440
Kidnapping bodyguard romance.
00:13:33.519 --> 00:13:34.799
I love bodyguard romance.
00:13:35.279 --> 00:13:40.799
Um I think those are like the main ones that I I will like eat up every single time.
00:13:41.039 --> 00:13:43.200
Yeah, I feel like definitely bodyguard.
00:13:43.440 --> 00:13:44.159
Bodyguard.
00:13:44.240 --> 00:13:56.720
I haven't read a bodyguard romance, but I've like seen like more like cutesy contemporary like romances where like there's the bodyguard probe, it's usually like she's like a pop star or like a celebrity, not like a mafia.
00:13:56.960 --> 00:13:57.200
Right.
00:13:57.360 --> 00:14:04.879
Mafia, it's like her dad's the dawn, and then he puts someone in charge of it, and like it's like that kind of that kind of world.
00:14:04.960 --> 00:14:10.240
Yeah, or like even in the more like I don't know if I wouldn't call it contemporary, but like the twisted series.
00:14:10.799 --> 00:14:15.279
I don't did you I did read the twisted series, or the twisted series considered dark romance?
00:14:15.440 --> 00:14:18.320
No, but the second book is definitely a bodyguard romance, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:14:18.399 --> 00:14:20.559
Okay, oh wait, so that's never in a bodyguard romance, never mind.
00:14:20.799 --> 00:14:23.360
But that and like that was and she was just like rich, I think, right?
00:14:23.440 --> 00:14:24.720
I don't think she was a princess.
00:14:25.120 --> 00:14:26.320
Oh, she was a princess, yeah.
00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:27.039
She was a princess.
00:14:27.120 --> 00:14:29.120
So, like, yeah, that I never finished the series.
00:14:29.200 --> 00:14:31.279
I read that one and I was like, this is my favorite one of the series.
00:14:31.360 --> 00:14:32.720
I don't even care about the other ones.
00:14:33.519 --> 00:14:39.120
So, yeah, so there's there's some good bodyguard stuff out there, but yeah, I think that those are my favorites.
00:14:39.279 --> 00:14:46.799
Yeah, I can also bond with you over marriage of convenience because same thing in like a contemporary romance, like uh cutesy books.
00:14:46.879 --> 00:14:51.360
I do love uh like a fake dating or a marriage of convenience, one of my favorite books ever.
00:14:51.519 --> 00:14:56.320
And people say it's like a Disney adult book, I don't care, is Terms and Conditions.
00:14:56.559 --> 00:15:03.440
Um where that's a marriage of convenience to like help him get his will and CEO position.
00:15:03.600 --> 00:15:04.240
I love that.
00:15:04.320 --> 00:15:05.279
Is that the third one?
00:15:05.440 --> 00:15:07.200
It's the second one, it's the second one.
00:15:07.360 --> 00:15:10.799
Okay, I read I think I only read the first one.
00:15:11.120 --> 00:15:13.279
The fine one and I hated it, yeah.
00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:15.679
But I think I would like the other two if I went back.
00:15:16.000 --> 00:15:23.360
The fine, apparently I liked it, but then I loved Terms and Conditions, and I haven't read it in years, and I I still I still talk about it.
00:15:23.679 --> 00:15:28.000
But let's see, I'm thinking about all the other things I wanted to talk about.
00:15:28.080 --> 00:15:32.480
I know specifically with Mafia Romance, you're very into Michelle Marone.
00:15:32.559 --> 00:15:33.440
Is that how you say his name?
00:15:33.679 --> 00:15:35.039
It's Michele Marone.
00:15:35.120 --> 00:15:35.759
Are you kidding me?
00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:38.720
And the only the only reason I'm not me completely butchering that.
00:15:38.799 --> 00:15:39.279
Oh my god.
00:15:39.519 --> 00:15:46.799
No, everybody does the only reason I know how to pronounce it is because of Chantal, and she's Italian, but it's Michele Marone, and you have to like roll your R's.
00:15:47.039 --> 00:15:49.360
Um, yeah, he's the love of my life.
00:15:49.600 --> 00:15:55.039
Let's like talk about that obsession because he's in 365 days, correct?
00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:59.039
Yes, yes, and so is that where your obsession started with him?
00:15:59.200 --> 00:15:59.279
Yeah.
00:16:00.799 --> 00:16:06.960
No, it was that because that's kind of all we have as mafia girls.
00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:10.960
There is no other no other movies or TV shows have been made.
00:16:11.039 --> 00:16:12.240
That is all that we have.
00:16:12.480 --> 00:16:16.799
So that is our only man that we've seen like on screen.
00:16:16.960 --> 00:16:18.320
So that's our mafia man.
00:16:18.399 --> 00:16:28.240
Like, I even made a TikTok that was like it no matter how you describe the main character, like if I'm reading a mafia romance, this is who I see, and like it it popped off because that's all anyone sees.
00:16:28.399 --> 00:16:31.759
So it's definitely just because like we've never been given anything else.
00:16:32.000 --> 00:16:35.120
Um, so that's that's our only man that we have.
00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:46.399
Do you think there are other like books that could be adapted like for screen that could have like the same like response or popularity that 365 days does or did?
00:16:46.639 --> 00:16:58.559
Um, yeah, I think there's I think there could be better because like I've watched that movie so many times, so many times, and like it's so bad, but like I love it, but like it's so bad.
00:16:58.639 --> 00:16:59.919
Like, and he's a horrible actor.
00:17:00.080 --> 00:17:02.000
I just love him, but like he he can't act.
00:17:02.159 --> 00:17:13.359
So if they brought an actual like good script in, or like a good book, I don't know of how the books were, I never read them, but if you brought in a better book and like a better actor and all this, I mean you could really make something good.
00:17:13.440 --> 00:17:16.000
There's like a huge audience for it, and I don't know why.
00:17:16.240 --> 00:17:26.240
I think the closest we've gotten is like those those like short, those companies that are making those really short dramas now that are like really bad.
00:17:26.319 --> 00:17:43.279
Like it's almost like watching porn, like the acting is so bad, and they've tried to do a few like Cora Riley books, which are mafia romance, and it's just like they they did so well the first episode, like everyone watched it except for I couldn't do it, and then no one watched it the rest of it because it was so bad.
00:17:43.440 --> 00:17:46.400
So it's like if you put the right team behind it, you could make something good.
00:17:46.559 --> 00:17:48.480
So I was like a mafia romance expert.
00:17:48.559 --> 00:17:51.839
Like, what book do you think should have its time on the screen?
00:17:52.799 --> 00:17:58.480
Um I think oh, that's good.
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:07.039
I think the best series, and it's only a four-part series, so it'd only have to be like four, is the um JT Geisinger's.
00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:11.440
I don't know if I'm saying her last name right, but her mafia series, it's so good.
00:18:11.599 --> 00:18:20.559
And like the first book is like fine, but the man in the second book and the man in the third book and the man in the fourth book, they are all so good.
00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:26.480
And like all the characters are so well developed and so like over the top, um, like fun and sexy.
00:18:26.559 --> 00:18:27.920
And I think that would be the best.
00:18:28.000 --> 00:18:30.000
And I think she has like a huge fan base.
00:18:30.240 --> 00:18:36.160
She, I don't know if you've heard of pen pal, but she wrote that and like got a huge it's you all you wouldn't want to read that one.
00:18:37.119 --> 00:18:39.440
But it's like I don't know.
00:18:39.519 --> 00:18:41.599
He like, I think it's like a prison pen pale.
00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:46.160
So I haven't read it, but yeah, it's like a prison pen pale romance.
00:18:46.319 --> 00:18:48.960
But she so she has a huge following.
00:18:49.200 --> 00:18:50.400
Um, yeah.
00:18:50.720 --> 00:18:53.920
I mean, prison pen pals are more common than people think.
00:18:54.000 --> 00:18:56.640
So that's really our incredibly there.
00:18:56.799 --> 00:18:58.400
You know how many times I've gotten so close.
00:18:58.559 --> 00:19:10.160
Like Instagram will like Instagram like gives me like it's suggested stuff, is like men in prison being like, I need a pen, and they're so hot, and I'm like, oh, but I can't do it.
00:19:10.400 --> 00:19:11.359
Please don't, please don't.
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:14.400
The only person I've written to is Luigi, writing to no one else.
00:19:14.559 --> 00:19:14.880
Luigi.
00:19:15.279 --> 00:19:15.680
Luigi.
00:19:17.759 --> 00:19:18.240
All right.
00:19:18.480 --> 00:19:36.000
So I do want to talk about contemporary romance, but before we transition to that part, I do want to ask, just because I'm curious, like I've read like some pretty erotic authors like Anna Huang and uh like for the twisted series and then terms and conditions has like a lot of spicy scenes.
00:19:36.079 --> 00:19:39.359
Well, what is like the smut like in these mafia romances?
00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:43.759
Are they like more extreme than like other contemporary romances?
00:19:44.799 --> 00:20:03.920
Yeah, although I get really surprised when I read a contemporary romance that is like as dirty because I always think that they're the that they're the the dirtiest, but then I'll read something like I read um not that kind of proposal, which comes out soon, and that it's like contemporary romance and it is filthy.
00:20:04.000 --> 00:20:10.160
So yeah, but like but in the mafia books, it's like the descriptions are insane.
00:20:10.319 --> 00:20:21.839
Like I think one of the first pages in Hooked was like this hook threatening to like take the virginity of this guy's daughter on top of his bloody corpse.
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:22.960
Like it's shit like that.
00:20:23.039 --> 00:20:27.759
That's like, and like it doesn't happen, but it's like it's like how they threaten and stuff like that.
00:20:27.920 --> 00:20:34.880
So yeah, it's like pretty filthy, and like there are there's a lot of knife play, there's a lot of gun play.
00:20:35.200 --> 00:20:38.079
Um, you know, there's anything can go up there.
00:20:39.200 --> 00:20:41.519
So you never know what's you never know.
00:20:41.680 --> 00:20:46.559
Oh my gosh, my mouth will open that whole time.
00:20:46.799 --> 00:20:59.279
So I feel like those scenes and those tropes, kinks, if you call them, are like a lot of the reasons why people like will immediately write out or like not want to entertain dark romance.
00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:03.839
But as someone who's kind of like in it, you have like a pretty like good following with it.
00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:07.279
What do you think is the most like misunderstood thing about the genre?
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:20.640
Um, I think it's kind of how I think it's the description that you gave in the beginning is like like, yeah, that's what it is, you know, it's this dark, violent, erotic, whatever.
00:21:20.880 --> 00:21:28.079
But there's like, like I said, there's just so much more to it, and there's so much like romance in it that you would have never thought.
00:21:28.319 --> 00:21:32.720
Um, so I I just think it's like mischaracterized as just something that's just dark and odd.
00:21:32.960 --> 00:21:38.720
Like I have one friend who is she's like kind of wants to try it, but she's a little scared.
00:21:38.880 --> 00:21:46.559
And like we both read Alchemized, and like Alchemized is like it's it's a different type of violent, but it's so violent because it's war.
00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:53.920
And it's like if you can go through that, then you should be able to go through like a guy killing like the shitty dad of this girl that he's in love with.
00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:54.559
Like, I don't know.
00:21:54.640 --> 00:21:59.759
There's just so to me, it's like I think everybody should just at least try.
00:22:00.240 --> 00:22:03.440
It but if it's not your type, then it's not your thing.
00:22:03.519 --> 00:22:04.480
But that's fair.
00:22:04.640 --> 00:22:14.720
So for anyone who's like listening or watching and is like maybe curious about getting into these dark romances, do you have any like beginner-friendly?
00:22:14.960 --> 00:22:18.079
I remember the last time I asked you for a beginner-friendly dark romance.
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:22.640
Like the back of the book talked about like the guy choking his cousin out and like killing him.
00:22:22.799 --> 00:22:25.680
But yeah, that's that is tame.
00:22:25.839 --> 00:22:36.160
That is um, I think, and back when you asked me, I hadn't read a lot more, although I still don't, I still can't think of anything to recommend for you.
00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:39.920
But because like there's gonna choking is like nothing.
00:22:40.400 --> 00:22:46.480
But um, my absolute favorite series is Gabrielle Sands books.
00:22:46.640 --> 00:22:48.000
There's like four of them.
00:22:48.240 --> 00:22:54.480
Um, it starts with uh let's see, I have starts with where is it, where is it, where is it?
00:22:54.799 --> 00:23:00.319
When she unravels, and then there's like a few more, but those are those are everyone's read them.
00:23:00.400 --> 00:23:01.440
They're really easy reads.
00:23:01.519 --> 00:23:03.680
She tells a good story, but they are violent.
00:23:03.920 --> 00:23:07.839
Um, so yeah, I think those are a good place to start, probably.
00:23:08.400 --> 00:23:08.720
Okay.
00:23:08.880 --> 00:23:13.119
Well, and I know you've been experimenting yourself a little bit with your readings.
00:23:13.200 --> 00:23:13.359
Yes.
00:23:13.759 --> 00:23:17.039
You just did your first alien romance.
00:23:17.200 --> 00:23:18.079
How is that?
00:23:18.559 --> 00:23:19.759
That was a wild ride.
00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:28.160
Um, so every it's kind of like a a rite of passage for readers, especially dark romance readers, I think.
00:23:28.400 --> 00:23:31.759
And um, it's the Ice Planet Barbarian store series.
00:23:32.079 --> 00:23:38.799
And Chantal told me to read it, and then it's kind of just like hooked where like every once in a while I'd go back and I'd read about it, and I'd be like, okay, maybe.
00:23:38.960 --> 00:23:45.279
And like on Instagram, I put it on my like TBR, my like monthly TBR for like the past few months, and I finally did it.
00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:46.960
It's like under 200 pages.
00:23:47.279 --> 00:23:48.640
It's wild.
00:23:48.880 --> 00:23:56.079
Like I'm so attracted to these giant blue men with tails, and it's like, why like why?
00:23:56.240 --> 00:24:36.319
But it's so it's so weird, and like you'll forget about the tail, and like the rest, like the horns are kind of fine, and like the rest of them is like pretty human, like, but the tail kind of throws me every single time, and like they're built so like so like romance readery, where like they have like their junk is built a specific way where it's like a rabbit vibrator, like it has an extra part to it, so it's like it's just so insane that I'm like, and they speak like a different language, and like what when he like oh, I can't even, I don't want to like get into any spoilers, but they're just like these insanely sexual alien beings, and they're so good.
00:24:36.400 --> 00:24:37.599
I'm on the second book right now.
00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:41.920
So I read the first book all day yesterday, and now I'm on the second one.
00:24:42.240 --> 00:24:46.799
Um, but yeah, that's another thing where I kept being like, I'll never do it, I'll never do it, I'll never do it.
00:24:46.880 --> 00:24:51.119
And then one day I was like, this year, I'm I'm really like I'm back in the fluffy romance.
00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:53.440
I'm trying to like trying my hand at different things.
00:24:53.519 --> 00:24:55.359
So I was like, this is the time to do it.
00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:57.599
Um, it's great.
00:24:58.799 --> 00:25:06.000
I'm happy you found another thing to feel like that's another thing that's gonna be a little bit of a pass for me.
00:25:06.079 --> 00:25:08.559
I mean, never for now pass.
00:25:08.960 --> 00:25:15.920
I feel like, especially on threads, I've seen so many different types of like romances that I didn't even know were a thing.
00:25:16.000 --> 00:25:18.000
Like, of course, I knew about alien romance.
00:25:18.240 --> 00:25:21.359
I actually learned about shifter fiction romance.
00:25:21.920 --> 00:25:22.240
Oh, yeah.
00:25:22.559 --> 00:25:29.599
The author had talked about how she has a book where the guys turn into cheese during the day.
00:25:30.160 --> 00:25:34.000
Yeah, I think there's like a there's like a produce one, there's like a vegetable one.
00:25:34.079 --> 00:25:37.519
And I think I'll cover it also has an eggplant one, and I'm like, they're cheese.
00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:39.680
Yeah, but they're men and night.
00:25:39.920 --> 00:25:42.640
No, I'll never be able to get, I don't think I could ever get into that.
00:25:42.799 --> 00:25:50.880
Unless there's like an if there's one if if there's one that's like everyone needs to read this, it's so good you'll you don't even remember that they're cheese.
00:25:51.200 --> 00:25:51.599
Sure.
00:25:51.839 --> 00:25:56.400
But like I don't think I've ever seen one of those where people are like, this is so good, you have to just put everything aside.
00:25:56.559 --> 00:25:58.720
Like I can't, I can't put it aside.
00:25:59.119 --> 00:26:02.240
So yeah, that's that's gonna be a no for me for now.
00:26:02.480 --> 00:26:07.680
For now, for now, like never, never say never, never say never, especially when it comes to books.
00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:09.759
Exactly, exactly.
00:26:09.920 --> 00:26:20.799
So I feel like we kind of have exhausted the dark romance topics, but with our time left, we do, I do want to talk about contemporary because you said you've been reading some of the fluffy romances, and that's that is my specialty.
00:26:20.880 --> 00:26:25.759
I do love fluffy romances, and I just want to talk also about like reading as a whole.
00:26:25.839 --> 00:26:29.920
Like, I know you've told me like reading has like helped you through some like super hard times.
00:26:30.000 --> 00:26:31.599
It's like your number one hobby.
00:26:31.759 --> 00:26:34.160
What does what does reading mean to you?
00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:37.759
Uh to me, it's a form of escapism.
00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:50.240
And kind of like I said at the beginning of the episode, I've been reading a lot less this year, and it's because last year I was in a like eight-month depressive episode, and I kept telling my therapists, like, I think I'm reading too much.
00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:51.839
Like I'm reading too much, it's all I'm doing.
00:26:51.920 --> 00:26:52.880
All I'm doing is reading.
00:26:53.039 --> 00:26:55.519
And everyone was like, no, it's a great way to escape.
00:26:55.680 --> 00:27:00.160
But I think like 122 books was insane.
00:27:00.400 --> 00:27:05.039
Like it, it was that's how much I wanted to be not in my life.
00:27:05.200 --> 00:27:07.680
Like how badly I needed to like escape into another one.
00:27:07.759 --> 00:27:09.839
And it's so it's a really great outlet for that.
00:27:09.920 --> 00:27:22.799
But I do think that like this year, even though I'm feeling better, there's still like ups and downs, and it's more important to like feel it and kind of go through it than like be on the like ice planet banging an alien.
00:27:23.119 --> 00:27:32.319
So, like, uh, so yeah, to me, it it it's a form of escapism, but it's kind of a slippery slope if you get like addicted to it.
00:27:32.559 --> 00:27:35.279
Um, it almost felt like it was like a drug at that point.
00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:38.400
So, so yeah, this year we're taking it easy.
00:27:38.799 --> 00:27:44.799
But it's good that you have that balance and it's fun that you have different genres to kind of explore and escape to.
00:27:44.960 --> 00:27:46.640
I get what you mean about like the mental health.
00:27:46.720 --> 00:27:52.960
I feel like I use reading as escapism, and I also read like a lot more books depending on like what stage I am in my life.
00:27:53.039 --> 00:27:58.720
So, like the times that I'm like unemployed or like in between jobs, like my health takes up so much.
00:27:58.799 --> 00:28:06.000
I think not only is it because of the time, but I just need like to my brain to escape from that, like, oh my gosh, like what am I doing with my life kind of thing?
00:28:06.079 --> 00:28:10.160
I mean, I'm unemployed and I started a book podcast, so that shows you where I am.
00:28:10.480 --> 00:28:11.119
Exactly.
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:13.200
Might as well, might as well.
00:28:13.359 --> 00:28:21.599
And so I know that uh you just did the first time caller series, and you are so obsessed with those characters.
00:28:21.759 --> 00:28:27.440
I was when you are choosing like a contemporary romance, like you're coming out of like your mafia romance bubble.
00:28:27.519 --> 00:28:30.000
Like, what makes you pick up a contemporary romance book?
00:28:30.160 --> 00:28:31.359
What draws you to it?
00:28:31.680 --> 00:28:34.000
Um, why did I choose that?
00:28:34.079 --> 00:28:38.960
I think I I finally like went back to Libby because all mafia romances on KU.
00:28:39.039 --> 00:28:41.279
So like I wasn't on Libby for like a whole year.
00:28:41.440 --> 00:28:45.200
So I went back on Libby and I started just like reserving popular books.
00:28:45.359 --> 00:28:50.880
I wanted to kind of get back in with something that like I know is enough people liked it that it's gotta hit.
00:28:51.119 --> 00:28:53.920
So then the second one came out and I saw how well it was doing.
00:28:54.000 --> 00:28:57.039
So I was like, okay, so when First Time Color got available, I read it immediately.
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:09.839
And it was just so I don't know if it's actually as amazing as I thought it was, or if it's just like because I haven't had that breath of fresh air in so long that it just like was so nice to have in that moment.
00:29:10.000 --> 00:29:15.680
And that's another one of those books where it's like most of the book is not filthy, but when it gets filthy, it's like filthy.
00:29:15.839 --> 00:29:17.920
So that like so I was like, oh, this is right.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:18.960
My alley.
00:29:19.519 --> 00:29:24.160
Um, and even the second book is like it took forever, but like it got really, really dirty.
00:29:24.400 --> 00:29:27.519
So um, yeah, I I was obsessed with those books.
00:29:27.599 --> 00:29:28.480
I can't wait for the third.
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:36.319
But I think I mostly look for what if I want to make sure I'm I'm getting a five-star read, I have to see what like everybody loves.
00:29:36.559 --> 00:29:39.200
And it won't always hit, but like that one hit.
00:29:39.599 --> 00:29:42.799
Yeah, I read First Time Collar over to summer last year.
00:29:42.880 --> 00:29:45.920
It was like my summer read balls in Europe, and I loved it.
00:29:46.000 --> 00:29:59.200
And I feel like I don't love like excessive smut, I like shorter bouts of it that are like well done, and I feel like that's like a very good like proportion of like plot to like a good smut scene, and then I can like keep going um with life.
00:29:59.279 --> 00:30:00.880
So I really, really enjoy that book.
00:30:01.119 --> 00:30:11.519
I also read In Back to You, but I feel like I wasn't in a good mental state when reading In Back to You because it was like like during and like right after like my accident, which happened in like the snow.
00:30:11.599 --> 00:30:12.079
Oh, yeah, yeah.
00:30:12.160 --> 00:30:16.079
And you're like in the freaking snow like the whole time, and I'm like, I can't do this.
00:30:16.160 --> 00:30:17.519
But I'm not a good one.
00:30:17.759 --> 00:30:24.799
I don't like pause and I don't DNF books, so I just kind of like powered through it, and then I was like, everyone loves this book, but I really struggled through it.
00:30:24.880 --> 00:30:36.559
I was like, I'm probably the problem here, but I definitely liked the first one better, and I'm still like gonna read the series, but I wish I had like that like euphoric high that you and Paige were like talking about when doing um now back to you.
00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:37.920
Oh my god, I know.
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:50.240
And I think like the between the first and the second, too, like on first time caller, it's more I wouldn't say realistic, but it is more realistic than like a snowstorm and then they're going to a random cabin.
00:30:50.400 --> 00:30:54.160
Like it's just it it was like so forced, but I loved it, but it was forced.
00:30:54.319 --> 00:30:57.599
So I think there's that too, which made first time caller a lot better.
00:30:57.839 --> 00:30:59.119
That's true, that's true.
00:30:59.200 --> 00:31:04.079
So when you are there like any tropes that you like love specifically in contemporary romance?
00:31:04.240 --> 00:31:06.000
Because I love call it cliche.
00:31:06.400 --> 00:31:18.160
I love like a good C CEO, workaholic, like guy who has like lots of money, like trope character who's like usually a little grumpy, but are there like things that you look for besides that like, oh, it just has like all five-star reads?
00:31:18.480 --> 00:31:24.640
Um, I actually hate billionaire romance, which is weird because I love mafia romances.
00:31:26.720 --> 00:31:36.400
I know, but it's different because like they're like badass and they're killing people, but like these guys are just like in suits and have a ton of money and they're kind of just assholes.
00:31:36.640 --> 00:31:37.680
So like I don't know.
00:31:37.839 --> 00:31:42.400
And like I don't, I'm very much like non-capitalism.
00:31:42.559 --> 00:31:46.240
Like, I don't, I don't need a lot of money, I don't need to be with a man with a lot of money.
00:31:46.400 --> 00:31:53.039
So like to me, it doesn't really I don't know, it just doesn't like feel and I don't really love grumpy sunshine either.
00:31:53.279 --> 00:31:55.200
But I do what I I'll talk about what I do love.
00:31:55.279 --> 00:32:06.160
I do love um, I love enemies to lovers, I love friends to lovers, I like um marriage of convenience, I love fake dating.
00:32:06.640 --> 00:32:12.799
I think those are probably like the best ones for me, but like enemies to lovers is always the best.
00:32:13.039 --> 00:32:14.960
Yeah, I like enemies to lovers.
00:32:15.039 --> 00:32:16.400
Fake dating's my favorite trope.
00:32:16.559 --> 00:32:24.319
Maybe that's why is good the millionaire tropes sometimes, because it's like they usually have to fake date someone for like their image or work event.
00:32:24.480 --> 00:32:27.440
So I think that like attracts me to them as well.
00:32:27.519 --> 00:32:28.480
But that's so interesting.
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:29.119
I didn't know.
00:32:29.279 --> 00:32:30.079
I find that so funny.
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:33.519
You're like, it's okay if they have money through killing people, but capital are killed.
00:32:33.759 --> 00:32:34.799
That's where I draw the line.
00:32:35.440 --> 00:32:51.839
Well, and a lot of the times with the mafia men, they don't like they don't it sounds so I feel like I'm so stupid because in real life they flaunt their money, but like I feel like they don't really flaunt their money in the books that much because they're so focused on like doing other things.
00:32:52.160 --> 00:32:58.240
I don't know, I don't know, but it never comes across to me the same as like billionaire for some reason.
00:32:58.400 --> 00:33:02.480
Oh, and I also love like best friend's brother and brother's best friend.
00:33:02.960 --> 00:33:09.680
I love those, and like I love like Carly Fortune books, like those are like that to me is like Chef's Kiss.
00:33:09.839 --> 00:33:13.680
I don't know what it is about it, but I love her books.
00:33:13.920 --> 00:33:21.039
Yeah, I she like on my TBR because does she have like an adaptation coming out to she does and I'm prime and I'm scared.
00:33:21.200 --> 00:33:24.799
I don't like adaptations of things that I've read, so we'll see.
00:33:25.119 --> 00:33:25.519
You know what?
00:33:25.599 --> 00:33:27.200
Like, that's my hot take too.
00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:29.920
I really struggle with it, but they usually have to win me over.
00:33:30.000 --> 00:33:32.559
If we had more time, I would definitely talk about adaptations.
00:33:32.640 --> 00:33:39.200
Maybe we'll do a part two website so we can break down adaptations, especially because I think this is a good adaptation.
00:33:39.680 --> 00:33:44.240
I think she reads a lot of things that are adapted for filament that's TV.
00:33:44.640 --> 00:33:47.920
And I do as well, but she's always like more enthusiastic about it than I am.
00:33:48.319 --> 00:33:49.519
Yeah, yeah.
00:33:50.160 --> 00:33:54.960
But those were all my questions, or all the questions we have time for.
00:33:55.119 --> 00:34:00.640
I had so much fun talking about dark romance before we say goodbye to everyone.
00:34:00.720 --> 00:34:06.319
Is there anything that you want readers to know about yourself or listeners to know about yourself or dark romance?
00:34:06.480 --> 00:34:13.679
I'm obviously gonna include your social channels, but I don't think so.
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:15.679
I think we hit pretty much everything.
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:17.440
Yeah, I think that's it.
00:34:17.920 --> 00:34:18.320
Amazing.
00:34:18.400 --> 00:34:19.840
Well, this was so fun.
00:34:20.239 --> 00:34:20.719
This is fun.
00:34:21.440 --> 00:34:22.800
Thank you so much for listening.
00:34:22.960 --> 00:34:24.000
I hope you enjoyed that.
00:34:24.320 --> 00:34:35.760
Be sure to follow Katie on Instagram and TikTok and keep up with what she is reading from alien romance to dark mafia romance to contemporary romance, is quite the variety next week.
00:34:35.920 --> 00:34:37.840
I'm going back to author interviews.
00:34:37.920 --> 00:34:40.000
I'm interviewing Alexa Martin.
00:34:41.679 --> 00:34:43.760
Her new book, I the beauty chat.
00:34:44.079 --> 00:34:45.360
I'm obsessed with this cover.
00:34:45.440 --> 00:34:46.719
I think it's so beautiful.
00:34:46.960 --> 00:34:51.679
And it's also exciting for me because it's my first time really reading a cowboy romance.
00:34:52.000 --> 00:34:58.880
So we are gonna dive into it, talk about the characters, talk about the representation, talk about the inspiration.
00:34:59.119 --> 00:35:00.159
I'm so excited.
00:35:00.320 --> 00:35:04.159
I hope you come back for it, and I hope you have a great week my book butterflies.
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:05.519
I'll see you next time.
