[00:00:00] Keaton: When it comes to the world of food, chef George Duran is a powerhouse as a chef, entertainer, and author. George is known for his food network show Ham on the Street, as well as for hosting TLC's Ultimate kickoff as a guest. He's appeared on NBC's Today Show, CBS this Morning, the Wendy Williams Show.
The Dr. Oz Show. The Nate Berker Show, and many others.
Today we're thrilled to have George join us. He decodes the cultural and culinary barriers that Americans face when it comes to harnessing the power of seafood in our diets
and touches on how to make easy and delicious dishes as he covers everything
from selecting the right seafood to how to cook it Welcome to the show, George.
[00:00:38] George: Thanks for having me on.
[00:00:40] Keaton: This is a totally different interview than a lot of the people we've, talked with because you are a public figure and you use, I don't know if it's cursed language, but the, the, the moniker of celebrity chef and.
You've been attached to that moniker before, I feel like you kind of dipped in your toes into that world. Is that a title you want to be known as, or who is George Duran?
[00:01:00] George: Yeah. You know, I've learned in this career that you need a, platform to really get your voice out.
You need a really good mechanism to get your voice out. So there are certainly a lot of times there where I have to use the term celebrity chef. Yeah. What is a celebrity chef at the end of the day? All right. You know, on television for. Food network, all these things create these celebrity chefs. There is no way on earth that my wife would ever imagine that would be a celebrity or am a celebrity or ever will be a celebrity for that matter.
Like, that humbles me and grounds me for sure. But at times you have to use the whole doctor Mister Your Highness to get through the door. And once you do get through that door, you're able to use that as a magnification of your voice and be able to use that to do what you want to do. If it's entertained, great.
if it's educate even better, in my opinion. So that's why I have used that as a way to get through the door and now be able to kind of inspire people to do what I love to do, which is cook.
[00:01:54] Keaton: I am just fascinated by your your background and your story. It's not linear and I think it speaks to why.
You're a great personality, but also a really interesting chef between growing up in Venezuela from Armenian parents and then growing up spending a lot of time in New York City getting classically trained in, in Paris, if I'm correct. Yeah. you have all these influences and I think that's really to your advantage.
Do you, do you agree that that kind. , multi-layered cultural experience has kind of formed how you see food.
[00:02:29] George: It's not just about food, it's about culture. It's about pretty much everything. When you have a more objective perspective on. Anything in life it broadens your mind and you're able to empathize with others more. And I can easily come in as a Venezuelan and walk in and say, you're doing that wrong or as a French person and say, your cuisine sucks.
And it's the complete opposite for me personally, because I have a multicultural point of view because I've traveled but lived other cultures.
And I can look at the . American consumer, or I can look at the American family and look at the American palette and have, that perspective and say, I understand why Americans don't like fish.
I understand why they only want white fish, and I understand why they do want, they don't wanna see the head of the fish when they go to the market and they will never purchase fish that has bones in it. I understand that. I don't agree with it maybe, but I don't understand that. And with that understanding, with that perspective, I'm able to now perhaps inspire them to start accepting more of the fishier fish or as I call it, ocean flavored fish and their diet and, and, and, and cook with it.
And maybe that will expand their palate and inspire. I mean, that's kind of what I really want to do at the end of the day, is really just inspire and instigate new flavors in their
[00:03:44] Keaton: palate.
can you put your finger on
On why American eaters don't want to see the head of a fish. Why? They don't want to have the bones in. this is a country that, that's been settled by a lot of Italian Americans, there's a lot of, Mediterranean Americans.
There's a lot of Americans. And so what, what happens when we come across that ocean?
[00:04:05] George: Well, it's multifaceted. You can first of all say that we're a very young culture to start with. if you're competing against the Europeans, thousands and thousands of years of. Culinary experience working from the land that's already ingrained in their culture. People look at the French and they say, how are they so skinny when they can eat all those cheeses?
Yeah. But in their culture is ingrained to cook bread from scratch twice a day. So when you go into the lingerie, there is fresh bread constantly that has not been processed, has not been added or whatever they're doing. It can actually not live outside of the bakery or the refrigerated aisle. So now we come to the United States and we've industrialized food.
we're working in a, capitalistic country and everybody needs quick, fast, and we know we live here to work. And it's the complete other way on. Every other culture, including the poorest cultures in the world. So we're a young country, we've industrialized food and our palate has conformed to those aspects in life by achieving this like,
[00:05:04] Keaton: like
[00:05:05] George: need to eat the processed quick fast food.
It is cheaper for me to go to buy a frozen pie than to learn how to make dough from scratch and make an exquisite pizza from scratch. Americans would prefer to have pink tasteless tomatoes all year long than wait till summertime when the. Amazing, sweet, gorgeous tomatoes are available for you.
It's changing. It's not changing fast enough for me, but it's changing. But quite often I, I leave restaurants in this country relatively angry. I sit down and I say, I just got ripped off for $45 on this dish that I.
costs them pennies to make. I know that the consumers don't know that, and the problem is that the American consumer is just not educated enough to . Demand quality food with quality ingredients because they're not educated.
It's not in our culture, it's not not in our veins. And it's, it's kind of sad. It's a little bit sad.
[00:06:01] Keaton: I honestly really appreciate your passion here. It, it's something I, I'm equally passionate about. you hear the term foodie or food snob thrown around and it's funny because I, I don't know if that would just be a term that you see in, in North America,
Because. in Europe, that would just be someone who has a developed palette, right?
Or just someone who's, a European that's respecting a lot of food traditions. But then you come over here and Oh, you're a foodie, you're a food snob. do you see yourself as being like a torch bear or someone who's really passionate about advocating for a higher standard Of just respectability within what we're putting on our plates and what we're paying for. do you see yourself playing a role in, in trying to change the tide here in the states with that?
[00:06:41] George: man, if when you start putting labels like food, snob, foodie, you know, connoisseur, you, you're now segregating the majority of the population.
And it's something I absolutely do not want to ever do. even using the word dumbing down. The recipes. When you do watch celebrity chefs on TV making extraordinary dishes chances are nobody's gonna recreate that at home. And that's because it's very intimidating for your average consumer to be able to go home and recreate it or want to make anything like that.
Instead, it's just easier to pop in the frozen thing and let it do what it has to do.
I personally, again, have that perspective that I, I understand I have an American wife who has that American palette and she just grounds me and makes me understand. What it is about the American palette that doesn't translate to someone who is perhaps considered a foodie in this country.
So the moment I stepped foot in, in France to go to culinary school, I genuinely thought I know everything. What are these French people gonna teach me? I'm gonna culinary school in France, and I'm like, it's. Ah, I know everything. I'm just gonna get my certification and come back to the United States.
First day of culinary school, I go in there and they throw a dead chicken with the head and the guts are all inside and they say, cut it up. Cut it up into pieces. And I am there essentially massacring this dead chicken with the head and the eyes and the thing and saying, I don't know
shit, man. I don't know anything.
I don't know what I have been doing all this time. And it's only because this culture. hasn't absorbed that into their psyche. And it's nobody's fault, per se. I mean, you can't just pinpoint and say, you suck, you suck, you suck. The Europeans have the government to protect the citizens from adding preservatives and the colors and this and that.
They have standards that the people, the farmers have to have to. Follow the wine. Girls have to follow the center, or it's not called French food. Organic label means nothing there because everything is organic there. Even though they have some organic labels, the people are educated enough to say it's all organic.
Of course it is because your standards are so high. Yeah, so there's multifaceted reasons why Americans don't have that in this country. It starts with accountability, not with just the industry, but our government. And then eventually it should trickle down to the education process that we have here, educating the Americans and their pallets.
Every school should be educating children, how to eat, how to cook, how to absorb food, and the nutritious part about it. And heck yeah, you want fried chicken. Make it the best
damn fried chicken and make it proper, sustainable, whatever it is, but make it the best in the world. And it's something I constantly try to teach my kids.
And I even struggle doing that as a parent who's a chef, who understands how the world works. I have difficulty teaching that to my American kids growing up in this country.
[00:09:20] Keaton: Wow. thank you for not filtering yourself. Thank you for not coming in here and,
[00:09:23] George: I have nothing to hide, nothing to sell. This is genuinely who I am. I, I am struggling, like a lot of Americans are struggling as well. I'm struggling when they walk into a supermarket to have the knowledge and find out what is right, what isn't.
And even here at the Seafood Expo, You know, there was a lot of things that I learned immensely. One of the biggest problems is terms that are being just thrown out to the consumer and the consumers.
[00:09:45] Keaton: just
[00:09:45] George: Doesn't know who to believe and what is right When someone says farm raised versus wild caught, why is the word verses have to be in there?
What is wrong with farm raised? You know, and, and the consumer just doesn't know and doesn't know who to trust. So I think we, we have to again, Rethink the way we're educating the American palette. And then, and then showcasing and showing them why it is and why it's so important to eat cleaner food.
The word clean is what they understand, and if you could just show to them that clean fish will taste better and is better for you I think it will just kind of start rolling from there. My kids love salmon, and then the only reason they started loving it is because they. Salmon sashimi, salmon sushi, but they hated to cook salmon.
And when I told them that that raw salmon is this cooked salmon, they were blown away by that fact. And now they start eating cooked salmon because of that.
[00:10:37] Keaton: Are you able to define clean fish for us?
[00:10:40] George: Yes. I think of it, I tell this to my kids all the time. I said, imagine yourself in the dirtiest pool water and swimming inside of there, and how you feel when you come out of there versus the cleanest pool water when you swim in there and it's fresh and nice and clear and you come out of there.
Think of where this living being. Is actually living and, and sleeping and eating and Breathing. And, and apply that to fish itself. And that's where I think the word clean is gonna apply very well to fish as well, where that fish is happy living. And same thing with chicken and beef and all these things, the roaming, walking and happy and strutting and getting fat on the land.
You're gonna apply the same thing with fish as well with seafood as well. And you're gonna see that flavor is. So different than the highly processed or the dirty waters, wherever other fish come from around this world.
[00:11:27] Keaton: H how do you look for clean fish in the grocery store if you're a consumer?
[00:11:31] George: with my eyes, unfortunately.
And the only way to
[00:11:34] Keaton: They need your eyes
[00:11:35] George: with my eyes and also with my nose. It's very important when I walk into a fish monger. And one of the cuts of fish that I absolutely adore is skate. It's hard to find, and a lot of Americans know it. It's a essentially a stingray practically.
And is the texture's amazing? But it goes bad very quickly. So you have ammonia flavor if you don't cook it soon enough. So it has to be very fresh. And so when I do go in specialty fish shops or fish monger or the farmer's market and there is stingray or, or in this case skate I always ask to smell it.
I look at it, I always ask to smell it, and it's such a bizarre concept for Americas to think like, can I smell that fish
before I buy it? Absolutely. I'm not touching it. I'm not poking it. I'm not doing anything with it. I tell the guy, pick it up cuz I am paying for this. I have the right to know if that fish is fresh right off the bat.
Also look at the gills. If the has a head. look at the color, look at the sheen. There are a lot of different components to looking at it and quite often I go in there and I tell the monger, These fish look kind of sad, you know? And, and that's the word I like to use, is sad. I mean, it's, it's, it's really, they call it whatever, the steelhead or whatever it is, and it's practically gray.
And I'm seeing fellow consumers, customers walking in and buying that piece of fish, and I'm dying to grab them and say, no, no. Look at it. Look at the color. Look at what you're, look what what this is. It's not gonna taste good, but the education process, it's just gonna take. Time for them to understand a good fish or a clean fish versus a not clean fish.
[00:12:59] Keaton: Part of why we're doing this is just education, awareness raising the, the appreciation for, for seafood culture. For cuisine, the history, reminding people about the, the beautiful history from wherever, whatever lineage you have. some, seaside, there's some lake, there's some river stories, right?
So I think it's just about reminding people about, Clean fish. We're talking about that. What, what regions do you like, do you gravitate towards certain bodies of water that you, you're like, yeah, that, that one I, I love that says it's a good region.
[00:13:30] George: The Mediterranean, without a doubt, . It has the, I mean, of course my parents were born and raised in Lebanon and they brought their love of fish home when we, when they moved to Venezuela.
Obviously the Caribbean has extraordinary fish as well. It's so weird when you travel around the world and there's an Oceanside or a Lakeside, the one thing that you don't see is this embrace of what's coming out of the ocean right off the coast of where they are here in the United States.
We are a country that will search for pizza on the coast of Maine I'm just like, no, no, no. There has gotta be fish here. And we just don't have that. Again, ingrained in our culture. When I go to a big body of a lake here in the United States, all I can think is like, what's the trout like here?
But you go there and suddenly there's, you know, calamari fried calamari, and I'm like, there's no calamari here, man. Like, why are you serving me this? I want what's coming out of this ocean. And what I hear most of the time is, oh yeah, we fish that. Export it. We get it outta here and you know, the people locally don't want it.
So we have to change that. Eat where you are living, see what, what is being best there. And that's what the Europeans have just destroyed us with, is that they see that the grass is green and the pastures lush while they're gonna throw some cows in there. And now those happy milk and cream giving cows are gonna produce the best cheese from that land that that's offering.
And the same thing goes with the ocean Mediterranean. Oh man. A good sardine in the Mediterranean, man. Nothing, nothing beats that.
[00:14:57] Keaton: Yeah. Big thing that we wanted to chat about as well, when it comes to what we eat, and you're talking about this, Americans have a world of choice of food, or at least they think they do. there's a lot of food available, but why should they be choosing
[00:15:09] George: seafood?
I've only met very few vegetarians in my life that tell me that they also don't eat fish. It says a lot, you know. Are you vegetarian? I'm vegetarian. Oh, do you eat? Oh yeah. Yeah. I, I certainly eat fish. Okay. You're a pesca vegetarian. That's interesting. It says a lot that that even vegetarians will make an exception for protein like fish and that, I think says that the protein content in fish, the fat content in fish, the good fat content in fish It is like the miracle protein that we're all missing out on. and the biggest reason I believe that Americans donate enough fish in this country is because unfortunately they do not know how to cook it.
And it's overcooked at all times. And when you overcook something as delicate as. Fish. it's ruined . It's really ruined. You're ruining pretty much the flavor of it. Fish should melt in your mouth. It's the reason why sushi is enormous in this country, because you're eating it raw and it's gonna melt in your mouth.
Now imagine slightly cooking it, it's still gonna taste as good differently, but as good. So I tell people, don't be afraid to undercook fish and then taste it. And if it still needs a little more cooking, bring it back in there. The worst thing you could do is overcook fish.
[00:16:22] Keaton: This is the question that I was most excited about to ask you because I just really value your worldly experiences how you've experienced the world, the way you see things.
I, I just, I really like your perspective. What have you been seeing other people? Other kitchens doing with seafood that just simply Americans are missing out on. And I think the angle that we're both kind of in common with here is the romanticism around it. Like how can Americans fall in love with how they interact with seafood in the kitchen we're seeing in other thriving countries and cultures that that isn't happening.
[00:16:55] George: I think finding a good fish purveyor and, and not just, you know, a, a real fish market or a fish monger. I'm talking about your favorite supermarket that may carry the right quality fish is really important. And sticking to that there are Large, you know, wholesale markets like Costco, BJ's Sand Club, all these places that will give you affordability.
But will they give you quality? That's up to you to go and check it out. And I think Americans aren't doing Enough legwork living in New York City there are only relatively few supermarkets or markets that I can go. But I know specifically that those markets specialize in giving me salmon, for example, like, lidle or little, however you wanna pronounce it here, Lidle, the, the German ones.
I know that their salmon is exquisite at all times, all the time. Even Trader Joe's, I like their salmon, but I don't, I'm not crazy about their tilapia, for example. So if, if you look for the sources of that fish I think. there's a good chance that you're gonna be able to bring that into your home and, and appreciate it because fishes can be really tricky and very intimidating to a lot of Americans.
The other thing I think that we're missing out on is, good shrimp in this country. And, and I'm only seeing that because, When I first arrived here I was shocked to see that the head on the shrimp is gone, and that is where all the flavor is. And you're removing the head of the shrimp, you're removing the flavor of the shrimp.
And I was like, that is, you're taking the best part of the shrimp away from me. That is where the best sauces come from. That is where all the flavor is. what I'm seeing is brine shrimp, folds frozen. That tastes way too salty and. People can differentiate is the fishy taste versus the taste of the ocean when it comes to shrimp and a lot of other seafood.
And what you wanna look for is the, taste of the ocean versus a fishy smell. And with shrimp, it's relatively particular. And what I tell people, and this is the biggest takeaway from this, is that buy frozen shrimp. Always and not thaw shrimp from your fish, mongoro your fish market or supermarket at all times because they are thawing that frozen shrimp for you and leaving it there on the ice.
And think about it, it's protein and it's already starting to degrade in quality and consistency. Instead, you buy it frozen and chances are That shrimp has already been refrozen from the boat the moment they catch it. And now guarantees that when you're ready to use that shrimp, it's gonna be the best quality, even better than the raw shrimp that is over there.
[00:19:17] Keaton: I never would've known that. I had no, no clue. Like it just someone growing up here, it just. absolutely have no, I had no clue the correlation between the head on the flavor what are some characteristics or some differentiators between that ammonia or that fishy Yeah.
Taste or smell those senses and what's the difference between that and something that's got that ocean flavor. How, how could you contrast that for someone listening?
[00:19:42] George: the one seafood that will give you that true ocean flavor is raw oysters. I think , it just brings you, I mean, when I eat oysters, my eyes are always closed because it.
Brings me back to the days of going to the beach in Venezuela growing up. It's the moment you set foot on the sands of any beach and you can taste, smell the ocean because it's being, aerosolized, you know, the ocean right in front of you. That's what you want to smell when you taste fish or even when you walk into the supermarket and, and you have them smell it in front of you.
Unfortunately we don't have the luxury of having. Fish mongers or fish isles in the supermarket open and having it smelled. So a lot of it will be vacuum sealed, which is perfectly fine. Actually. A lot of this vacuum sealing technology is extraordinary and thank God for it because this way you wouldn't be able to transport it in this massive country that we have.
So it works, I think vacuum ceiling and all these other technologies adding whatever, nitrogen and all for potato chip bags, you know. It naturally conserves the protein or the food, or the chips, whatever you want. So, if you can't access that, then you have to go with your eyes. So I start, start with your smell, then go with your eyes When it comes to purchasing fish, you want bright.
Colors. You wanna also feel the fish if you can, in that package and make sure it's plump. And it's, you know, it doesn't kind of, it doesn't look sad , it doesn't feel sad on your hands. And, and those are kind of the little tips that I give a lot of people on how to shop when it comes to seafood, however, And I mean, shrimp and lobster meat and all these things frozen will, you'll most probably never go wrong with frozen if you want to.
Calamari, frozen is, for me, is the way to go. And not only kills any kind of bacteria that it may or may not have, chances are it doesn't. But also you can keep it in your freezer until you absolutely need it. And chances are it was frozen in that, in that boat when it first got caught. And you know, it's at its freshest.
[00:21:30] Keaton: This is super insightful. Even just for myself as a, as a consumer. I'm a proud Canadian the East Coast PI specifically with Canadian PI oysters. Just exactly it. I can understand now what you're saying.
I was trying to visualize that. , they, they call it the Meir, like, you know, instead of the terroir. But the quintessential fresh ocean flavor is definitely encapsulated in your main oysters or, you know, within Massachusetts and oysters. You can get around Maryland. Like it's, there's, they're all the unique Meir and unique regionality taste.
[00:22:04] George: but
[00:22:04] Keaton: there's something special. Having that fresh, delicious oyster that's, that's really connects you to the ocean. I do wanna make sure that we hit on why you're here. You've created some exclusive recipes for moi. Could you just tell us a little bit about the partnership and why you felt it was a good fit?
And then we can unpack the recipes?
[00:22:21] George: Yeah. Honestly. when Moe first approached me and asked me to come up with some recipes and, showcase them what I loved about this partnership wasn't necessarily about like, Hey, here's a chef. Here's some recipes you can make, take some photos and be done with it.
Their main goal was to educate the American consumer, and it's exactly the platform. I wanted a, I love fish and salmon and, and I love their sustainability efforts. Those are things that are super important. But most paramount was that they wanted to educate um, no matter what. And it wasn't just about like, Hey, say Moe 10 times before you cook this dish.
what I loved about it. It was this genuine need to educate the consumer on. The consumption, the cooking process, and how to absorb more of the seafood in their life. And again, it, it would come back to it. our American culture doesn't have that unfortunately, because it's just not who we are.
We're a very young culture. And if they could use me as mouth, their voice for that I've come to the pinnacle of my career in terms of. Being able to showcase what I love most. I've worked with the most industrialized companies in this country and showcased and made recipes.
But you should have seen me when the box of MOI salmon came to my door, it was beyond. Christmas for me, it was opening this package with tons of fresh Atlantic salmon and I've never been happier. And I was so close to calling and saying, you can pay me in salmon. As this is how happy I am. My wife rolled her eyes of course, and she said, hell no.
I was so happy. It was like, A kid being paid in marshmallows. It was like that. I was like, this is it. This is all I want is to work with fresh seafood because I am so passionate about it. But more importantly, I'm really passionate in teaching and inspiring others to cook it.
[00:24:05] Keaton: And that, that's why I think we're really excited.
It's, it's such a good fit. your energy is authentic and it's through your experience that has made you this passionate and there's a clear goal. You're not just out here to throw your name around to make as much money as possible. Partnering with different brands like you care about as like specific end goal here.
You care about people eating well, eating great Americans, advancing their palate and understanding like it's A great way to do it is by eating seafood. And that's a huge reason why, we want people to be tuning into this. Is there a specific dish out of the five that you've created that like, that was really sick or one or two dishes that you're like, yeah, I really like that one.
There's
[00:24:45] George: the one dish that is making me a superstar here at the Seafood Expo. I mean, a superstar, people, strangers, Everyone is stopping me
[00:24:51] Keaton: about
[00:24:52] George: they want me to come to their home and cook for that. and it's a dish from Venezuela. It's, it's a sauce from Venezuela that is served usually at steakhouses or in the rotisserie restaurants.
It has the worst name imaginable, the mo least appetizing name on earth. But the flavor is the complete polar opposite, and it's called Gu akaka. And who on earth would ever think that a sauce so damn good would have a terrible name like Gu Akaka. So, GU Akaka is a very simple sauce that, again, is served in steakhouse most of the time lends itself perfectly to fish.
In this case salmon. And it's very simple. It's essentially in a food processor, you're gonna add vidalia, onions, green peppers, parsley, cilantro. White distilled vinegar. You want the acidity in there, and then an avocado, a little bit of salt, olive oil. just process it until it's smooth sauce.
If you make the sauce, if you make my guag, especially cuz sometimes people put garlic and tomatoes. But my, if you make my guag and you bring it to a potluck dinner, a potluck barbecue, particularly, you will be the king or the queen of that barbecue. You will be the most popular person. Do not bring hotdogs, do not bring hamburgers.
Do not even bring. Bring my GU sauce and you're gonna be a superhero And today I was able to cook uh, their new lightly smoked salmon I never thought that would be so much innovation with seafood. I mean, seafood is seafood. How much more innovation could you have? I was coming to the seafood export and I'm looking like, oh, what's new?
What's different? And I'm like, it's seafood. How much more innovative? Could you be with seafood? Well, the guys at Moe had duck trap, figured it out, and they made this thing called. Lightly smoked. And it's essentially a combination of cold smoked salmon, like the salmon, you put it on cream cheese and bagels and raw atlantic filet salmon, which is that marbled beautiful salmon filet.
It's a combination of the both. So you have this kind of raw atlantic salmon that has that seriously deep wood smoked flavor inside of it. Pre-B, pre smoke. All fresh and now you have this really kind of salty, smoky salmon that you're able to marry with something that's a little bit fresher. Like my gu akaka sauce.
Do a Google search for George Duran Gu Akaka. That recipe is huge and popular, and people have, I'm walking around. I am a gua superstar at this place, dude, just trust me. Do a.
[00:27:08] Keaton: You mentioned over cooking earlier, overcooking It's funny, right? we love our sushi, but then somehow along the way, you know, the overcooking process happens. Well, are there any other common mistakes that you, you, you find people are making when they're cooking seafood and, and what are some easy ways to avoid those?
[00:27:26] George: Yeah, I think one of the ones is, That Americans, again tend to overcook the seafoods. I've said that already, especially like something like shrimp.
Please don't overcook the shrimp. I think the method that people are cooking, it is all wrong. You don't need to fry fish. Let's talk just salmon and tilapia and all these classic cod and what Americans really love to eat. There's no need to saute, there's no need to fry it. Even you don't need to fry fish.
Fish is already good enough and yes, okay, good fish and chips is fantastic. Let the restaurants do that for you so you don't have to oil up your entire house. And. Make it smelly. That's the one thing, one of the reasons my mother never fried fish in our home is because it smelled the whole house up.
Every American, almost every American has this one tool that will lend itself to the best fish and they are underutilizing it and not knowing that they can cook with it. And it's called an air fryer. An air fryer is essentially a small encapsulated convection oven that is on your tabletop and it's right there and it's beyond just for french fries and chicken nuggets.
It is for cooking. In a heartbeat, the first thing you have to do is put a little bit of aluminum foil in the bottom, a little non six spray if you have to place that salmon right on top of it. And now air fry that salmon in a matter between six and 10 minutes, depending how thick your salmon is, how cold the salmon is when you pop it in there in six to eight minutes.
You have a salmon that has been crisped up on all sides, that has browned up, created that ARD reaction. So you have a little bit of caramelization. You can put any sort of rub on it, you can marinate it beforehand. But the air fryer is an underutilized tool for seafood in this country. And we all have that tool on our house.
Air frying or broiling. Two big things that Americans are missing out on when it comes to cooking
[00:29:03] Keaton: fish.
Talk about a, a, a cooking hack, right? what do you have? You don't have to buy anything else. What do you have in your kitchen?
And how can you, how can you fall in love with this? Right?
Yep.
culturally, I can see that, that lining up, that, that makes sense. That's a, that's a logical step. You're not making people have to purchase new equipment and, and, you know, learn a new language. It's. The language of the, the air fryer is ubiquitous
[00:29:27] George: you don't even have to spray oil on the salmon, for example.
The oil is already inside of it. You have all that marbling, beautiful marbling on an Atlantic filet salmon. There's no need to spray beforehand. Just pop it in there. I guarantee you it's the easiest and fastest way to cook salmon.
[00:29:40] Keaton: That's awesome. You, you said you, you have a couple kids?
[00:29:43] George: I do. I have a six and 11 year old boys.
[00:29:45] Keaton: This is something that I also want us to be hitting on as we go along with this podcast, but it's the concept of getting kids on board and, and feeling more confident in the kitchen with seafood. And there is a lot of parallels with a lot of the people we've spoken to and how they got into aquaculture seafood is they had a, watershed.
Where they either grew up on the water, some punted body of water, and they were really connected to, to seafood and it really inspired them to be in the role within this industry that they're in now. So it's a formative time in your childhood to get those positive exposures to to seafood. What does that look like, like for you?
How do, how does, how do we get this younger, under 10 kids that are under 10 on board with, with cooking seafood?
[00:30:31] George: It's hell on earth.
I have two boys. I'm not gonna lie, I'm not gonna, you know, it, it's hell to get my kids to eat anything new and different because that's how their pallets are and their pallets are going to grow. But the one thing that I can tell you is that every kid is different. And I know that because I have two kids and I could tell how different they are palate wise.
My older kid will eat raw peppers. every single day, all day long, no problem. But God forbid you cook that pepper and you put it in a dish or just cook it, he will not touch it. So right away, I can read my child, that child, and I can say, Hey, Bodhi likes the fresher, crisper things in his mouth, the fresh cucumber.
But God forbid it's a pickle. And then I look at my other younger son, Quinn, and you you can see that obviously he, he appreciates something like simpler seasonings, for example, and his favorite seasoning. What is a Quinn salt? Okay, now we have a recipe here and a guidance for us, and, and it's the one thing you have to see is what do your kids like, what do they gravitate towards?
If your kid likes fried food, by all means fry that fish. It doesn't matter how, unhealthy that fish may be when you fry it with a batter or whatever it is, by all means fried because even those little gesture. conforming the fish to their palate are gonna start that reaction and their digestive system in their mouth with their saliva and getting accustomed to it.
So that slowly as they grow up and their palate expands, they'll say, man, that fried cod that I used to have. I get the same flavor here with this roasted cod that from this restaurant. It's exactly like that and I don't feel heavier. It doesn't feel oily and it kind of is like this vehicle to instigate the kids to eat fish.
So if they like crunchy fried stuff, fried calamari all the way, if they like salt more than anything else. Load that salt up and roast it with a little bit of butter in there too. Don't be afraid my kid will eat. It has salted butter on top of it. We shouldn't be afraid to look at what our, kids prefer and adapt that preference to the fish that we're gonna introduce to them for the first
[00:32:32] Keaton: time.
Yeah. And that, that actually really depicts, I came from a family that were white Anglo-Saxon, you know, and it was just like a lot of roast beefs, a lot of chicken sometimes pork but not a lot of fish.
And so it took me a long time. I'm 31 now. It took me, a long time, not until recently to really develop a proper pallet for seafood. And, and not because it's not delicious, because I didn't have that exposure to it in positive ways I was younger. So I think you explaining that if I had those positive experiences and, if I was tasting different types of white fish or fish that was cooked the same way I wanted my chicken nuggets or my french fries, maybe that would've a bit of been.
further along within this, this journey. So
[00:33:13] George: the problem is that the parents don't want it either.
That's the, that's one of the biggest hurdles that we have in this country, is that if the parents don't want it, why are they gonna make the kids eat it? And often what parents do is they think that eating fish or a lot of the adult consumers, it's like, I'm eating fish only because it's healthy. No, you need to eat fish because it's delicious.
The healthy, that's a little icing on, on top, Fish is delicious and can be delicious. You prepare it properly, season it properly, the kids will absolutely love it. Start mild and then grow from there. And don't forget the butter.
[00:33:45] Keaton: I love it, George. Really my final question is we wanted just to, you're here, you're here in Boston, you're here at the Seafood Expo.
Have you been here before
What, what's it been like for you? what's the experience been like?
[00:33:56] George: First, I didn't know there was a seafood expo. I, I go to a lot of expo. In fact, I just came from Expo West. I go to I D B A, nra, all these like, trade shows for food.
And it was Heaven on Earth Fish. I think one of the things that I've taken away is that there's really a big push for true sustainability when it comes to fish and. it's given me a glimmer of hope of where we're going in this country with seafood in the, in the fish industry. Because I tend to be a pessimist here in this country with, a lot with the food industry because I, I literally know how the sausage is made.
But with something like fish, you can't cheat it. It's alive and it's coming from one source. may be farmed or wild and you cannot cheat that you.
[00:34:35] Keaton: process
[00:34:36] George: it in a laboratory and stamp it and market it. Fish is fish at the end of the day. And what's given me a lot of hope at the Seafood Expo is that there are truly a lot of companies and buyers and industry innovators that are pushing that sustainability part about fish.
And it gives me hope. I'm, I'm really excited about that cuz that's gonna translate to delicious tasting fish inside of our cuisine, inside of our homes every day. For all of.
[00:35:00] Keaton: Was there a certain, connection point, a conversation someone who is displaying something while you've been here that really stuck out to
[00:35:08] George: you?
I had a few people come up to me who, who were very excited about my demo, the cooking demo that I did.
And one of them particularly was interesting. He was, he's a crawfish farmer down in Louisiana. And it's so funny he's having the same problem as.
[00:35:21] Keaton: as
[00:35:21] George: A lot of fish farmers or a lot of the food purveyors here. And his problem is that people associate crawfish, for example, with just a crawfish boil and nothing more than that.
And so he really wanted to keep picking my head on that. Because crawfish is delicious and crawfish boil is wonderful, but not everybody's gonna make a crawfish boil. You're just gonna have a crawfish boil when you go down to Louisiana, new Orleans, and that's it. But crawfish is like, The magic cousin of the shrimp and crawfish has a head on it, almost always
So there we go back to the head of the shrimp, So, those are very interesting conversations to have with these smaller artisan farmers with specific seafood ingredients. Again, it gave me hope that we are going to expand our pallets here when it comes to seafood.
In terms of tasting things, I was able to walk around a lot and the best thing I probably ate besides my gu sauce obviously somebody was making truffled crab rangoon from scratch, like literally truffled crab rangoon, and it was the best thing I ever ate for no
[00:36:19] Keaton: doubt. We did sample that too.
[00:36:20] George: You did, wasn't it fantastic?
And he was proud about his little um, dough rappers. And he's like, we make these from scratch.
And I'm just, yeah, exactly. And I'm just like, you had me at truffle man, like crab, rangoon truffle. I'm in. So I love the creativity that a lot of people have when it comes to seafood. There it is again.
Like, can you get some American who doesn't like seafood to heat? Crab Rangoon. Yeah, you fry it. Put a truffle in. They'll eat it. Not a problem, you know, but at least you're starting to eat the seafood and that'll get that pallet rolling with the next time they have another type of seafood, hopefully.
[00:36:51] Keaton: Hey. Amen, brother. George, thank you so much for talking with us today. If our listeners want to find out more about you and try out your recipes, where they, where should they be going?
[00:36:59] George: Yeah. On all social media. You can find me at Chef George Duran or go to george duran.com. I'm always there and I'm always happy to interact with people.
I, I met a toker that I was I was following already. Not a very big toker, but he was all about sustainability and talking and it was amazing that as I was scrolling yesterday through TikTok, he was here and then I contacted them and I said, dude, come on down. Let's talk. And we spent half an hour talking about his endeavors with seafood.
So, Social media is truly a fantastic tool. Not just to inspire people about anything but also to meet interesting people cuz people are more approachable when you reach to them directly. So reach out to me, chef George Duran on TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, everywhere, I'm more than happy to converse like I'm co conversing with you cuz um, man, let's talk after
[00:37:43] Keaton: this.
Yeah,
seriously. I was just thinking that like, I really, really, George, I, I, I really appreciate your passion. I, I'm also a passionate individual.
Yeah. Kindred spirit for sure. And I, I really value your experience and that you, you want to make a difference in this world through great eating and, and, and helping people fall in love with, with seafood. And, thank you for your time. You're a busy man. You could say yes to a lot of things.
You said yes to this. So thank you for your yes to this and just for your knowledge. thank you for the listener. Thank you so much for listening and helping us decode seafood here today.
The Dr. Oz Show. The Nate Berker Show, and many others.
Today we're thrilled to have George join us. He decodes the cultural and culinary barriers that Americans face when it comes to harnessing the power of seafood in our diets
and touches on how to make easy and delicious dishes as he covers everything
from selecting the right seafood to how to cook it Welcome to the show, George.
[00:00:38] George: Thanks for having me on.
[00:00:40] Keaton: This is a totally different interview than a lot of the people we've, talked with because you are a public figure and you use, I don't know if it's cursed language, but the, the, the moniker of celebrity chef and.
You've been attached to that moniker before, I feel like you kind of dipped in your toes into that world. Is that a title you want to be known as, or who is George Duran?
[00:01:00] George: Yeah. You know, I've learned in this career that you need a, platform to really get your voice out.
You need a really good mechanism to get your voice out. So there are certainly a lot of times there where I have to use the term celebrity chef. Yeah. What is a celebrity chef at the end of the day? All right. You know, on television for. Food network, all these things create these celebrity chefs. There is no way on earth that my wife would ever imagine that would be a celebrity or am a celebrity or ever will be a celebrity for that matter.
Like, that humbles me and grounds me for sure. But at times you have to use the whole doctor Mister Your Highness to get through the door. And once you do get through that door, you're able to use that as a magnification of your voice and be able to use that to do what you want to do. If it's entertained, great.
if it's educate even better, in my opinion. So that's why I have used that as a way to get through the door and now be able to kind of inspire people to do what I love to do, which is cook.
[00:01:54] Keaton: I am just fascinated by your your background and your story. It's not linear and I think it speaks to why.
You're a great personality, but also a really interesting chef between growing up in Venezuela from Armenian parents and then growing up spending a lot of time in New York City getting classically trained in, in Paris, if I'm correct. Yeah. you have all these influences and I think that's really to your advantage.
Do you, do you agree that that kind. , multi-layered cultural experience has kind of formed how you see food.
[00:02:29] George: It's not just about food, it's about culture. It's about pretty much everything. When you have a more objective perspective on. Anything in life it broadens your mind and you're able to empathize with others more. And I can easily come in as a Venezuelan and walk in and say, you're doing that wrong or as a French person and say, your cuisine sucks.
And it's the complete opposite for me personally, because I have a multicultural point of view because I've traveled but lived other cultures.
And I can look at the . American consumer, or I can look at the American family and look at the American palette and have, that perspective and say, I understand why Americans don't like fish.
I understand why they only want white fish, and I understand why they do want, they don't wanna see the head of the fish when they go to the market and they will never purchase fish that has bones in it. I understand that. I don't agree with it maybe, but I don't understand that. And with that understanding, with that perspective, I'm able to now perhaps inspire them to start accepting more of the fishier fish or as I call it, ocean flavored fish and their diet and, and, and, and cook with it.
And maybe that will expand their palate and inspire. I mean, that's kind of what I really want to do at the end of the day, is really just inspire and instigate new flavors in their
[00:03:44] Keaton: palate.
can you put your finger on
On why American eaters don't want to see the head of a fish. Why? They don't want to have the bones in. this is a country that, that's been settled by a lot of Italian Americans, there's a lot of, Mediterranean Americans.
There's a lot of Americans. And so what, what happens when we come across that ocean?
[00:04:05] George: Well, it's multifaceted. You can first of all say that we're a very young culture to start with. if you're competing against the Europeans, thousands and thousands of years of. Culinary experience working from the land that's already ingrained in their culture. People look at the French and they say, how are they so skinny when they can eat all those cheeses?
Yeah. But in their culture is ingrained to cook bread from scratch twice a day. So when you go into the lingerie, there is fresh bread constantly that has not been processed, has not been added or whatever they're doing. It can actually not live outside of the bakery or the refrigerated aisle. So now we come to the United States and we've industrialized food.
we're working in a, capitalistic country and everybody needs quick, fast, and we know we live here to work. And it's the complete other way on. Every other culture, including the poorest cultures in the world. So we're a young country, we've industrialized food and our palate has conformed to those aspects in life by achieving this like,
[00:05:04] Keaton: like
[00:05:05] George: need to eat the processed quick fast food.
It is cheaper for me to go to buy a frozen pie than to learn how to make dough from scratch and make an exquisite pizza from scratch. Americans would prefer to have pink tasteless tomatoes all year long than wait till summertime when the. Amazing, sweet, gorgeous tomatoes are available for you.
It's changing. It's not changing fast enough for me, but it's changing. But quite often I, I leave restaurants in this country relatively angry. I sit down and I say, I just got ripped off for $45 on this dish that I.
costs them pennies to make. I know that the consumers don't know that, and the problem is that the American consumer is just not educated enough to . Demand quality food with quality ingredients because they're not educated.
It's not in our culture, it's not not in our veins. And it's, it's kind of sad. It's a little bit sad.
[00:06:01] Keaton: I honestly really appreciate your passion here. It, it's something I, I'm equally passionate about. you hear the term foodie or food snob thrown around and it's funny because I, I don't know if that would just be a term that you see in, in North America,
Because. in Europe, that would just be someone who has a developed palette, right?
Or just someone who's, a European that's respecting a lot of food traditions. But then you come over here and Oh, you're a foodie, you're a food snob. do you see yourself as being like a torch bear or someone who's really passionate about advocating for a higher standard Of just respectability within what we're putting on our plates and what we're paying for. do you see yourself playing a role in, in trying to change the tide here in the states with that?
[00:06:41] George: man, if when you start putting labels like food, snob, foodie, you know, connoisseur, you, you're now segregating the majority of the population.
And it's something I absolutely do not want to ever do. even using the word dumbing down. The recipes. When you do watch celebrity chefs on TV making extraordinary dishes chances are nobody's gonna recreate that at home. And that's because it's very intimidating for your average consumer to be able to go home and recreate it or want to make anything like that.
Instead, it's just easier to pop in the frozen thing and let it do what it has to do.
I personally, again, have that perspective that I, I understand I have an American wife who has that American palette and she just grounds me and makes me understand. What it is about the American palette that doesn't translate to someone who is perhaps considered a foodie in this country.
So the moment I stepped foot in, in France to go to culinary school, I genuinely thought I know everything. What are these French people gonna teach me? I'm gonna culinary school in France, and I'm like, it's. Ah, I know everything. I'm just gonna get my certification and come back to the United States.
First day of culinary school, I go in there and they throw a dead chicken with the head and the guts are all inside and they say, cut it up. Cut it up into pieces. And I am there essentially massacring this dead chicken with the head and the eyes and the thing and saying, I don't know
shit, man. I don't know anything.
I don't know what I have been doing all this time. And it's only because this culture. hasn't absorbed that into their psyche. And it's nobody's fault, per se. I mean, you can't just pinpoint and say, you suck, you suck, you suck. The Europeans have the government to protect the citizens from adding preservatives and the colors and this and that.
They have standards that the people, the farmers have to have to. Follow the wine. Girls have to follow the center, or it's not called French food. Organic label means nothing there because everything is organic there. Even though they have some organic labels, the people are educated enough to say it's all organic.
Of course it is because your standards are so high. Yeah, so there's multifaceted reasons why Americans don't have that in this country. It starts with accountability, not with just the industry, but our government. And then eventually it should trickle down to the education process that we have here, educating the Americans and their pallets.
Every school should be educating children, how to eat, how to cook, how to absorb food, and the nutritious part about it. And heck yeah, you want fried chicken. Make it the best
damn fried chicken and make it proper, sustainable, whatever it is, but make it the best in the world. And it's something I constantly try to teach my kids.
And I even struggle doing that as a parent who's a chef, who understands how the world works. I have difficulty teaching that to my American kids growing up in this country.
[00:09:20] Keaton: Wow. thank you for not filtering yourself. Thank you for not coming in here and,
[00:09:23] George: I have nothing to hide, nothing to sell. This is genuinely who I am. I, I am struggling, like a lot of Americans are struggling as well. I'm struggling when they walk into a supermarket to have the knowledge and find out what is right, what isn't.
And even here at the Seafood Expo, You know, there was a lot of things that I learned immensely. One of the biggest problems is terms that are being just thrown out to the consumer and the consumers.
[00:09:45] Keaton: just
[00:09:45] George: Doesn't know who to believe and what is right When someone says farm raised versus wild caught, why is the word verses have to be in there?
What is wrong with farm raised? You know, and, and the consumer just doesn't know and doesn't know who to trust. So I think we, we have to again, Rethink the way we're educating the American palette. And then, and then showcasing and showing them why it is and why it's so important to eat cleaner food.
The word clean is what they understand, and if you could just show to them that clean fish will taste better and is better for you I think it will just kind of start rolling from there. My kids love salmon, and then the only reason they started loving it is because they. Salmon sashimi, salmon sushi, but they hated to cook salmon.
And when I told them that that raw salmon is this cooked salmon, they were blown away by that fact. And now they start eating cooked salmon because of that.
[00:10:37] Keaton: Are you able to define clean fish for us?
[00:10:40] George: Yes. I think of it, I tell this to my kids all the time. I said, imagine yourself in the dirtiest pool water and swimming inside of there, and how you feel when you come out of there versus the cleanest pool water when you swim in there and it's fresh and nice and clear and you come out of there.
Think of where this living being. Is actually living and, and sleeping and eating and Breathing. And, and apply that to fish itself. And that's where I think the word clean is gonna apply very well to fish as well, where that fish is happy living. And same thing with chicken and beef and all these things, the roaming, walking and happy and strutting and getting fat on the land.
You're gonna apply the same thing with fish as well with seafood as well. And you're gonna see that flavor is. So different than the highly processed or the dirty waters, wherever other fish come from around this world.
[00:11:27] Keaton: H how do you look for clean fish in the grocery store if you're a consumer?
[00:11:31] George: with my eyes, unfortunately.
And the only way to
[00:11:34] Keaton: They need your eyes
[00:11:35] George: with my eyes and also with my nose. It's very important when I walk into a fish monger. And one of the cuts of fish that I absolutely adore is skate. It's hard to find, and a lot of Americans know it. It's a essentially a stingray practically.
And is the texture's amazing? But it goes bad very quickly. So you have ammonia flavor if you don't cook it soon enough. So it has to be very fresh. And so when I do go in specialty fish shops or fish monger or the farmer's market and there is stingray or, or in this case skate I always ask to smell it.
I look at it, I always ask to smell it, and it's such a bizarre concept for Americas to think like, can I smell that fish
before I buy it? Absolutely. I'm not touching it. I'm not poking it. I'm not doing anything with it. I tell the guy, pick it up cuz I am paying for this. I have the right to know if that fish is fresh right off the bat.
Also look at the gills. If the has a head. look at the color, look at the sheen. There are a lot of different components to looking at it and quite often I go in there and I tell the monger, These fish look kind of sad, you know? And, and that's the word I like to use, is sad. I mean, it's, it's, it's really, they call it whatever, the steelhead or whatever it is, and it's practically gray.
And I'm seeing fellow consumers, customers walking in and buying that piece of fish, and I'm dying to grab them and say, no, no. Look at it. Look at the color. Look at what you're, look what what this is. It's not gonna taste good, but the education process, it's just gonna take. Time for them to understand a good fish or a clean fish versus a not clean fish.
[00:12:59] Keaton: Part of why we're doing this is just education, awareness raising the, the appreciation for, for seafood culture. For cuisine, the history, reminding people about the, the beautiful history from wherever, whatever lineage you have. some, seaside, there's some lake, there's some river stories, right?
So I think it's just about reminding people about, Clean fish. We're talking about that. What, what regions do you like, do you gravitate towards certain bodies of water that you, you're like, yeah, that, that one I, I love that says it's a good region.
[00:13:30] George: The Mediterranean, without a doubt, . It has the, I mean, of course my parents were born and raised in Lebanon and they brought their love of fish home when we, when they moved to Venezuela.
Obviously the Caribbean has extraordinary fish as well. It's so weird when you travel around the world and there's an Oceanside or a Lakeside, the one thing that you don't see is this embrace of what's coming out of the ocean right off the coast of where they are here in the United States.
We are a country that will search for pizza on the coast of Maine I'm just like, no, no, no. There has gotta be fish here. And we just don't have that. Again, ingrained in our culture. When I go to a big body of a lake here in the United States, all I can think is like, what's the trout like here?
But you go there and suddenly there's, you know, calamari fried calamari, and I'm like, there's no calamari here, man. Like, why are you serving me this? I want what's coming out of this ocean. And what I hear most of the time is, oh yeah, we fish that. Export it. We get it outta here and you know, the people locally don't want it.
So we have to change that. Eat where you are living, see what, what is being best there. And that's what the Europeans have just destroyed us with, is that they see that the grass is green and the pastures lush while they're gonna throw some cows in there. And now those happy milk and cream giving cows are gonna produce the best cheese from that land that that's offering.
And the same thing goes with the ocean Mediterranean. Oh man. A good sardine in the Mediterranean, man. Nothing, nothing beats that.
[00:14:57] Keaton: Yeah. Big thing that we wanted to chat about as well, when it comes to what we eat, and you're talking about this, Americans have a world of choice of food, or at least they think they do. there's a lot of food available, but why should they be choosing
[00:15:09] George: seafood?
I've only met very few vegetarians in my life that tell me that they also don't eat fish. It says a lot, you know. Are you vegetarian? I'm vegetarian. Oh, do you eat? Oh yeah. Yeah. I, I certainly eat fish. Okay. You're a pesca vegetarian. That's interesting. It says a lot that that even vegetarians will make an exception for protein like fish and that, I think says that the protein content in fish, the fat content in fish, the good fat content in fish It is like the miracle protein that we're all missing out on. and the biggest reason I believe that Americans donate enough fish in this country is because unfortunately they do not know how to cook it.
And it's overcooked at all times. And when you overcook something as delicate as. Fish. it's ruined . It's really ruined. You're ruining pretty much the flavor of it. Fish should melt in your mouth. It's the reason why sushi is enormous in this country, because you're eating it raw and it's gonna melt in your mouth.
Now imagine slightly cooking it, it's still gonna taste as good differently, but as good. So I tell people, don't be afraid to undercook fish and then taste it. And if it still needs a little more cooking, bring it back in there. The worst thing you could do is overcook fish.
[00:16:22] Keaton: This is the question that I was most excited about to ask you because I just really value your worldly experiences how you've experienced the world, the way you see things.
I, I just, I really like your perspective. What have you been seeing other people? Other kitchens doing with seafood that just simply Americans are missing out on. And I think the angle that we're both kind of in common with here is the romanticism around it. Like how can Americans fall in love with how they interact with seafood in the kitchen we're seeing in other thriving countries and cultures that that isn't happening.
[00:16:55] George: I think finding a good fish purveyor and, and not just, you know, a, a real fish market or a fish monger. I'm talking about your favorite supermarket that may carry the right quality fish is really important. And sticking to that there are Large, you know, wholesale markets like Costco, BJ's Sand Club, all these places that will give you affordability.
But will they give you quality? That's up to you to go and check it out. And I think Americans aren't doing Enough legwork living in New York City there are only relatively few supermarkets or markets that I can go. But I know specifically that those markets specialize in giving me salmon, for example, like, lidle or little, however you wanna pronounce it here, Lidle, the, the German ones.
I know that their salmon is exquisite at all times, all the time. Even Trader Joe's, I like their salmon, but I don't, I'm not crazy about their tilapia, for example. So if, if you look for the sources of that fish I think. there's a good chance that you're gonna be able to bring that into your home and, and appreciate it because fishes can be really tricky and very intimidating to a lot of Americans.
The other thing I think that we're missing out on is, good shrimp in this country. And, and I'm only seeing that because, When I first arrived here I was shocked to see that the head on the shrimp is gone, and that is where all the flavor is. And you're removing the head of the shrimp, you're removing the flavor of the shrimp.
And I was like, that is, you're taking the best part of the shrimp away from me. That is where the best sauces come from. That is where all the flavor is. what I'm seeing is brine shrimp, folds frozen. That tastes way too salty and. People can differentiate is the fishy taste versus the taste of the ocean when it comes to shrimp and a lot of other seafood.
And what you wanna look for is the, taste of the ocean versus a fishy smell. And with shrimp, it's relatively particular. And what I tell people, and this is the biggest takeaway from this, is that buy frozen shrimp. Always and not thaw shrimp from your fish, mongoro your fish market or supermarket at all times because they are thawing that frozen shrimp for you and leaving it there on the ice.
And think about it, it's protein and it's already starting to degrade in quality and consistency. Instead, you buy it frozen and chances are That shrimp has already been refrozen from the boat the moment they catch it. And now guarantees that when you're ready to use that shrimp, it's gonna be the best quality, even better than the raw shrimp that is over there.
[00:19:17] Keaton: I never would've known that. I had no, no clue. Like it just someone growing up here, it just. absolutely have no, I had no clue the correlation between the head on the flavor what are some characteristics or some differentiators between that ammonia or that fishy Yeah.
Taste or smell those senses and what's the difference between that and something that's got that ocean flavor. How, how could you contrast that for someone listening?
[00:19:42] George: the one seafood that will give you that true ocean flavor is raw oysters. I think , it just brings you, I mean, when I eat oysters, my eyes are always closed because it.
Brings me back to the days of going to the beach in Venezuela growing up. It's the moment you set foot on the sands of any beach and you can taste, smell the ocean because it's being, aerosolized, you know, the ocean right in front of you. That's what you want to smell when you taste fish or even when you walk into the supermarket and, and you have them smell it in front of you.
Unfortunately we don't have the luxury of having. Fish mongers or fish isles in the supermarket open and having it smelled. So a lot of it will be vacuum sealed, which is perfectly fine. Actually. A lot of this vacuum sealing technology is extraordinary and thank God for it because this way you wouldn't be able to transport it in this massive country that we have.
So it works, I think vacuum ceiling and all these other technologies adding whatever, nitrogen and all for potato chip bags, you know. It naturally conserves the protein or the food, or the chips, whatever you want. So, if you can't access that, then you have to go with your eyes. So I start, start with your smell, then go with your eyes When it comes to purchasing fish, you want bright.
Colors. You wanna also feel the fish if you can, in that package and make sure it's plump. And it's, you know, it doesn't kind of, it doesn't look sad , it doesn't feel sad on your hands. And, and those are kind of the little tips that I give a lot of people on how to shop when it comes to seafood, however, And I mean, shrimp and lobster meat and all these things frozen will, you'll most probably never go wrong with frozen if you want to.
Calamari, frozen is, for me, is the way to go. And not only kills any kind of bacteria that it may or may not have, chances are it doesn't. But also you can keep it in your freezer until you absolutely need it. And chances are it was frozen in that, in that boat when it first got caught. And you know, it's at its freshest.
[00:21:30] Keaton: This is super insightful. Even just for myself as a, as a consumer. I'm a proud Canadian the East Coast PI specifically with Canadian PI oysters. Just exactly it. I can understand now what you're saying.
I was trying to visualize that. , they, they call it the Meir, like, you know, instead of the terroir. But the quintessential fresh ocean flavor is definitely encapsulated in your main oysters or, you know, within Massachusetts and oysters. You can get around Maryland. Like it's, there's, they're all the unique Meir and unique regionality taste.
[00:22:04] George: but
[00:22:04] Keaton: there's something special. Having that fresh, delicious oyster that's, that's really connects you to the ocean. I do wanna make sure that we hit on why you're here. You've created some exclusive recipes for moi. Could you just tell us a little bit about the partnership and why you felt it was a good fit?
And then we can unpack the recipes?
[00:22:21] George: Yeah. Honestly. when Moe first approached me and asked me to come up with some recipes and, showcase them what I loved about this partnership wasn't necessarily about like, Hey, here's a chef. Here's some recipes you can make, take some photos and be done with it.
Their main goal was to educate the American consumer, and it's exactly the platform. I wanted a, I love fish and salmon and, and I love their sustainability efforts. Those are things that are super important. But most paramount was that they wanted to educate um, no matter what. And it wasn't just about like, Hey, say Moe 10 times before you cook this dish.
what I loved about it. It was this genuine need to educate the consumer on. The consumption, the cooking process, and how to absorb more of the seafood in their life. And again, it, it would come back to it. our American culture doesn't have that unfortunately, because it's just not who we are.
We're a very young culture. And if they could use me as mouth, their voice for that I've come to the pinnacle of my career in terms of. Being able to showcase what I love most. I've worked with the most industrialized companies in this country and showcased and made recipes.
But you should have seen me when the box of MOI salmon came to my door, it was beyond. Christmas for me, it was opening this package with tons of fresh Atlantic salmon and I've never been happier. And I was so close to calling and saying, you can pay me in salmon. As this is how happy I am. My wife rolled her eyes of course, and she said, hell no.
I was so happy. It was like, A kid being paid in marshmallows. It was like that. I was like, this is it. This is all I want is to work with fresh seafood because I am so passionate about it. But more importantly, I'm really passionate in teaching and inspiring others to cook it.
[00:24:05] Keaton: And that, that's why I think we're really excited.
It's, it's such a good fit. your energy is authentic and it's through your experience that has made you this passionate and there's a clear goal. You're not just out here to throw your name around to make as much money as possible. Partnering with different brands like you care about as like specific end goal here.
You care about people eating well, eating great Americans, advancing their palate and understanding like it's A great way to do it is by eating seafood. And that's a huge reason why, we want people to be tuning into this. Is there a specific dish out of the five that you've created that like, that was really sick or one or two dishes that you're like, yeah, I really like that one.
There's
[00:24:45] George: the one dish that is making me a superstar here at the Seafood Expo. I mean, a superstar, people, strangers, Everyone is stopping me
[00:24:51] Keaton: about
[00:24:52] George: they want me to come to their home and cook for that. and it's a dish from Venezuela. It's, it's a sauce from Venezuela that is served usually at steakhouses or in the rotisserie restaurants.
It has the worst name imaginable, the mo least appetizing name on earth. But the flavor is the complete polar opposite, and it's called Gu akaka. And who on earth would ever think that a sauce so damn good would have a terrible name like Gu Akaka. So, GU Akaka is a very simple sauce that, again, is served in steakhouse most of the time lends itself perfectly to fish.
In this case salmon. And it's very simple. It's essentially in a food processor, you're gonna add vidalia, onions, green peppers, parsley, cilantro. White distilled vinegar. You want the acidity in there, and then an avocado, a little bit of salt, olive oil. just process it until it's smooth sauce.
If you make the sauce, if you make my guag, especially cuz sometimes people put garlic and tomatoes. But my, if you make my guag and you bring it to a potluck dinner, a potluck barbecue, particularly, you will be the king or the queen of that barbecue. You will be the most popular person. Do not bring hotdogs, do not bring hamburgers.
Do not even bring. Bring my GU sauce and you're gonna be a superhero And today I was able to cook uh, their new lightly smoked salmon I never thought that would be so much innovation with seafood. I mean, seafood is seafood. How much more innovation could you have? I was coming to the seafood export and I'm looking like, oh, what's new?
What's different? And I'm like, it's seafood. How much more innovative? Could you be with seafood? Well, the guys at Moe had duck trap, figured it out, and they made this thing called. Lightly smoked. And it's essentially a combination of cold smoked salmon, like the salmon, you put it on cream cheese and bagels and raw atlantic filet salmon, which is that marbled beautiful salmon filet.
It's a combination of the both. So you have this kind of raw atlantic salmon that has that seriously deep wood smoked flavor inside of it. Pre-B, pre smoke. All fresh and now you have this really kind of salty, smoky salmon that you're able to marry with something that's a little bit fresher. Like my gu akaka sauce.
Do a Google search for George Duran Gu Akaka. That recipe is huge and popular, and people have, I'm walking around. I am a gua superstar at this place, dude, just trust me. Do a.
[00:27:08] Keaton: You mentioned over cooking earlier, overcooking It's funny, right? we love our sushi, but then somehow along the way, you know, the overcooking process happens. Well, are there any other common mistakes that you, you, you find people are making when they're cooking seafood and, and what are some easy ways to avoid those?
[00:27:26] George: Yeah, I think one of the ones is, That Americans, again tend to overcook the seafoods. I've said that already, especially like something like shrimp.
Please don't overcook the shrimp. I think the method that people are cooking, it is all wrong. You don't need to fry fish. Let's talk just salmon and tilapia and all these classic cod and what Americans really love to eat. There's no need to saute, there's no need to fry it. Even you don't need to fry fish.
Fish is already good enough and yes, okay, good fish and chips is fantastic. Let the restaurants do that for you so you don't have to oil up your entire house. And. Make it smelly. That's the one thing, one of the reasons my mother never fried fish in our home is because it smelled the whole house up.
Every American, almost every American has this one tool that will lend itself to the best fish and they are underutilizing it and not knowing that they can cook with it. And it's called an air fryer. An air fryer is essentially a small encapsulated convection oven that is on your tabletop and it's right there and it's beyond just for french fries and chicken nuggets.
It is for cooking. In a heartbeat, the first thing you have to do is put a little bit of aluminum foil in the bottom, a little non six spray if you have to place that salmon right on top of it. And now air fry that salmon in a matter between six and 10 minutes, depending how thick your salmon is, how cold the salmon is when you pop it in there in six to eight minutes.
You have a salmon that has been crisped up on all sides, that has browned up, created that ARD reaction. So you have a little bit of caramelization. You can put any sort of rub on it, you can marinate it beforehand. But the air fryer is an underutilized tool for seafood in this country. And we all have that tool on our house.
Air frying or broiling. Two big things that Americans are missing out on when it comes to cooking
[00:29:03] Keaton: fish.
Talk about a, a, a cooking hack, right? what do you have? You don't have to buy anything else. What do you have in your kitchen?
And how can you, how can you fall in love with this? Right?
Yep.
culturally, I can see that, that lining up, that, that makes sense. That's a, that's a logical step. You're not making people have to purchase new equipment and, and, you know, learn a new language. It's. The language of the, the air fryer is ubiquitous
[00:29:27] George: you don't even have to spray oil on the salmon, for example.
The oil is already inside of it. You have all that marbling, beautiful marbling on an Atlantic filet salmon. There's no need to spray beforehand. Just pop it in there. I guarantee you it's the easiest and fastest way to cook salmon.
[00:29:40] Keaton: That's awesome. You, you said you, you have a couple kids?
[00:29:43] George: I do. I have a six and 11 year old boys.
[00:29:45] Keaton: This is something that I also want us to be hitting on as we go along with this podcast, but it's the concept of getting kids on board and, and feeling more confident in the kitchen with seafood. And there is a lot of parallels with a lot of the people we've spoken to and how they got into aquaculture seafood is they had a, watershed.
Where they either grew up on the water, some punted body of water, and they were really connected to, to seafood and it really inspired them to be in the role within this industry that they're in now. So it's a formative time in your childhood to get those positive exposures to to seafood. What does that look like, like for you?
How do, how does, how do we get this younger, under 10 kids that are under 10 on board with, with cooking seafood?
[00:30:31] George: It's hell on earth.
I have two boys. I'm not gonna lie, I'm not gonna, you know, it, it's hell to get my kids to eat anything new and different because that's how their pallets are and their pallets are going to grow. But the one thing that I can tell you is that every kid is different. And I know that because I have two kids and I could tell how different they are palate wise.
My older kid will eat raw peppers. every single day, all day long, no problem. But God forbid you cook that pepper and you put it in a dish or just cook it, he will not touch it. So right away, I can read my child, that child, and I can say, Hey, Bodhi likes the fresher, crisper things in his mouth, the fresh cucumber.
But God forbid it's a pickle. And then I look at my other younger son, Quinn, and you you can see that obviously he, he appreciates something like simpler seasonings, for example, and his favorite seasoning. What is a Quinn salt? Okay, now we have a recipe here and a guidance for us, and, and it's the one thing you have to see is what do your kids like, what do they gravitate towards?
If your kid likes fried food, by all means fry that fish. It doesn't matter how, unhealthy that fish may be when you fry it with a batter or whatever it is, by all means fried because even those little gesture. conforming the fish to their palate are gonna start that reaction and their digestive system in their mouth with their saliva and getting accustomed to it.
So that slowly as they grow up and their palate expands, they'll say, man, that fried cod that I used to have. I get the same flavor here with this roasted cod that from this restaurant. It's exactly like that and I don't feel heavier. It doesn't feel oily and it kind of is like this vehicle to instigate the kids to eat fish.
So if they like crunchy fried stuff, fried calamari all the way, if they like salt more than anything else. Load that salt up and roast it with a little bit of butter in there too. Don't be afraid my kid will eat. It has salted butter on top of it. We shouldn't be afraid to look at what our, kids prefer and adapt that preference to the fish that we're gonna introduce to them for the first
[00:32:32] Keaton: time.
Yeah. And that, that actually really depicts, I came from a family that were white Anglo-Saxon, you know, and it was just like a lot of roast beefs, a lot of chicken sometimes pork but not a lot of fish.
And so it took me a long time. I'm 31 now. It took me, a long time, not until recently to really develop a proper pallet for seafood. And, and not because it's not delicious, because I didn't have that exposure to it in positive ways I was younger. So I think you explaining that if I had those positive experiences and, if I was tasting different types of white fish or fish that was cooked the same way I wanted my chicken nuggets or my french fries, maybe that would've a bit of been.
further along within this, this journey. So
[00:33:13] George: the problem is that the parents don't want it either.
That's the, that's one of the biggest hurdles that we have in this country, is that if the parents don't want it, why are they gonna make the kids eat it? And often what parents do is they think that eating fish or a lot of the adult consumers, it's like, I'm eating fish only because it's healthy. No, you need to eat fish because it's delicious.
The healthy, that's a little icing on, on top, Fish is delicious and can be delicious. You prepare it properly, season it properly, the kids will absolutely love it. Start mild and then grow from there. And don't forget the butter.
[00:33:45] Keaton: I love it, George. Really my final question is we wanted just to, you're here, you're here in Boston, you're here at the Seafood Expo.
Have you been here before
What, what's it been like for you? what's the experience been like?
[00:33:56] George: First, I didn't know there was a seafood expo. I, I go to a lot of expo. In fact, I just came from Expo West. I go to I D B A, nra, all these like, trade shows for food.
And it was Heaven on Earth Fish. I think one of the things that I've taken away is that there's really a big push for true sustainability when it comes to fish and. it's given me a glimmer of hope of where we're going in this country with seafood in the, in the fish industry. Because I tend to be a pessimist here in this country with, a lot with the food industry because I, I literally know how the sausage is made.
But with something like fish, you can't cheat it. It's alive and it's coming from one source. may be farmed or wild and you cannot cheat that you.
[00:34:35] Keaton: process
[00:34:36] George: it in a laboratory and stamp it and market it. Fish is fish at the end of the day. And what's given me a lot of hope at the Seafood Expo is that there are truly a lot of companies and buyers and industry innovators that are pushing that sustainability part about fish.
And it gives me hope. I'm, I'm really excited about that cuz that's gonna translate to delicious tasting fish inside of our cuisine, inside of our homes every day. For all of.
[00:35:00] Keaton: Was there a certain, connection point, a conversation someone who is displaying something while you've been here that really stuck out to
[00:35:08] George: you?
I had a few people come up to me who, who were very excited about my demo, the cooking demo that I did.
And one of them particularly was interesting. He was, he's a crawfish farmer down in Louisiana. And it's so funny he's having the same problem as.
[00:35:21] Keaton: as
[00:35:21] George: A lot of fish farmers or a lot of the food purveyors here. And his problem is that people associate crawfish, for example, with just a crawfish boil and nothing more than that.
And so he really wanted to keep picking my head on that. Because crawfish is delicious and crawfish boil is wonderful, but not everybody's gonna make a crawfish boil. You're just gonna have a crawfish boil when you go down to Louisiana, new Orleans, and that's it. But crawfish is like, The magic cousin of the shrimp and crawfish has a head on it, almost always
So there we go back to the head of the shrimp, So, those are very interesting conversations to have with these smaller artisan farmers with specific seafood ingredients. Again, it gave me hope that we are going to expand our pallets here when it comes to seafood.
In terms of tasting things, I was able to walk around a lot and the best thing I probably ate besides my gu sauce obviously somebody was making truffled crab rangoon from scratch, like literally truffled crab rangoon, and it was the best thing I ever ate for no
[00:36:19] Keaton: doubt. We did sample that too.
[00:36:20] George: You did, wasn't it fantastic?
And he was proud about his little um, dough rappers. And he's like, we make these from scratch.
And I'm just, yeah, exactly. And I'm just like, you had me at truffle man, like crab, rangoon truffle. I'm in. So I love the creativity that a lot of people have when it comes to seafood. There it is again.
Like, can you get some American who doesn't like seafood to heat? Crab Rangoon. Yeah, you fry it. Put a truffle in. They'll eat it. Not a problem, you know, but at least you're starting to eat the seafood and that'll get that pallet rolling with the next time they have another type of seafood, hopefully.
[00:36:51] Keaton: Hey. Amen, brother. George, thank you so much for talking with us today. If our listeners want to find out more about you and try out your recipes, where they, where should they be going?
[00:36:59] George: Yeah. On all social media. You can find me at Chef George Duran or go to george duran.com. I'm always there and I'm always happy to interact with people.
I, I met a toker that I was I was following already. Not a very big toker, but he was all about sustainability and talking and it was amazing that as I was scrolling yesterday through TikTok, he was here and then I contacted them and I said, dude, come on down. Let's talk. And we spent half an hour talking about his endeavors with seafood.
So, Social media is truly a fantastic tool. Not just to inspire people about anything but also to meet interesting people cuz people are more approachable when you reach to them directly. So reach out to me, chef George Duran on TikTok, Instagram, Facebook, everywhere, I'm more than happy to converse like I'm co conversing with you cuz um, man, let's talk after
[00:37:43] Keaton: this.
Yeah,
seriously. I was just thinking that like, I really, really, George, I, I, I really appreciate your passion. I, I'm also a passionate individual.
Yeah. Kindred spirit for sure. And I, I really value your experience and that you, you want to make a difference in this world through great eating and, and, and helping people fall in love with, with seafood. And, thank you for your time. You're a busy man. You could say yes to a lot of things.
You said yes to this. So thank you for your yes to this and just for your knowledge. thank you for the listener. Thank you so much for listening and helping us decode seafood here today.
