WEBVTT
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And Sunday was the Super Bowl.
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And Ricky Minor said, I have an orchestra for you tomorrow morning at 10 a.m.
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And I was just about to go to bed.
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It was like 11 p.m.
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on Friday.
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Um I stay up all night and finished that America the Beautiful at 9 a.m.
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And I walked into the studio at 10 a.m.
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and we recorded it.
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Chris Walden's credits include the Oscars, the Super Bowl, Michael Boblet, Rihanna, Paul McCartney, and many more.
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He also founded the Pacific Jazz Orchestra in LA.
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You know this guy's got stories.
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He's done everything.
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Today we discussed the snowstorm that stranded a conductor and suddenly put Chris in front of the orchestra.
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Then there was that producer who asked for a few test scenes, but young Chris had a better idea.
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And then there's the absurd reason Chris once had to conduct the entire night with his arms over his head.
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There's not enough time to think about the pressure.
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You just do it.
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I'm Von Veneer.
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This is Chris Walden, and you're listening to Beyond the Notes.
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Chris, welcome to the show.
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Well, thank you for having me, Von.
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My pleasure.
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So you're a Grammy nominated composer and arranger, and you've worked across film and television and uh done a whole lot of concerts and projects with Rihanna and Michael Bublet and the Oscars and Paul McCartney, uh, and you founded the um the Pacific Jazz Orchestra in LA.
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With uh with projects like the Oscars or um or things that are just super high stake, like the stakes like the Super Bowl, how do you navigate that in particular?
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And is the the approach different?
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And how does the the collaboration there work in practice for you?
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Well, that's I mean it's uh the the two that you just mentioned, Oscars and Super Bowl, is of very different animals and very different shows.
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I mean the Super Bowl I've only done twice, which is fairly simple, and there's no uh there's not a lot of interaction or collaboration for that show.
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I just get asked, write the national anthem for this singer and this key.
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Then I do it, then I deliver it, and I re-record it, and then I'm done with it.
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So this is a fairly cut-and-dry process, and it's there's not a lot of back and forth.
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I mean, once in a while, I think with Faith Hill, she had, I think, one note, and then I did a little change, and that was it.
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So with the Oscars, it's that is more a collaborative process, especially with the producers and the music director.
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Mind you, I'm not the music director at the Oscars, I'm the lead arranger.
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Having said that, I still write the majority on the music in the show, but also I do a lot of the work myself before we before I collaborate with others.
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I do all the research of the music that we use as a winner play on for all the for all the nominated films, which means I research all the scores of the nominated films, select what excerpts we're gonna play, and then um I either myself I arrange most of it, but also have some other arrangers working with me on that show.
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Then I assign arrangements who's arranging what, and then I oversee all the arranging process of all the arrangers, make comments, and then and then we record that in the studio, and then and then I collaborate with either the performing artists and the music director for the special performances in the show, and then I collaborate also with the producers on on special segments like the in memoriam, which is what we're currently working on right now for the upcoming show.
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So the producers there are sort of involved in what they want to hear as far as music.
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So but again, this is this is just the Oscars, and other shows just let me do my thing.
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So it's it varies from project to project.
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Yeah.
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Well, first of all, uh you I I think it's worth mentioning you sort of glossed over it, but um uh phrases like did the Super Bowl only two times, and and that it's not such a such a big deal.
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I think that that speaks a lot already to to what you do, and it's it's it's very inspiring.
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So um especially like with the Oscars, um, you know, obviously what very widely publicized, uh, very high stakes, as I said earlier.
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Uh, and as you mentioned, there are different expectations from different people, like the producers and everyone else, as to what uh needs to happen.
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So, like how how do you balance that and make sure everything sort of comes together and and works for everyone?
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Well, I think I I serve, I mean, I serve at their pleasure.
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So I don't really care what my vision is.
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I s I try to fulfill their vision as best as I can.
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Because it's not my show, it's their show.
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It's different with the Pacific Jazz Orchestra.
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That's my vision.
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So there I'm the boss, and there I can fulfill my own vision.
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Yeah.
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But in general, with arranging and in orchestration, yeah, the approach is is more uh working with someone else's vision.
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Yeah, exactly.
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As a as a composer myself who who's young and uh just sort of starting out in many ways, uh it's it's inspiring to see people uh who are farther along in the uh farther along the path.
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And so I was curious to know uh in your bio, for instance, it says, you know, you you did high school, uh started doing some arrangements and some orchestration there, and and throughout uh your time in in uh the Germany uh national youth jazz orchestra and throughout college and your masters, and so you you had a strong educational background, but from there, how do you how do you branch out and get credits like Michael Bublet and and get to collaborate with all these cool people and and go from being in a a very sort of uh you know structured educational environment to being in the real world?
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Well, uh first of all, I have to say I did go to a music school in Cologne, um and without really talking bad about the school or about schools its itself or in general, I have to say, and mind you, the time that I went to music school was in the in the late 80s, early 90s, um, and I was in the jazz program in the music school in Cologne.
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But I have to say, nothing that I and I had a classical composition teacher, my composition major in composition was Carlin Stockhausen then, and nothing that he taught or was trying to teach was useful for what I wanted to do.
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So I have to say that I didn't learn anything at music school that was useful for me.
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I learned sort of on the job.
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I so yes, I do hold two master's degrees, but they're not really, they didn't do anything for me to in in in my work that I'm doing now.
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So I learned for what I'm doing now and what I've always wanted to do.
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I learned by studying scores and listening to to composers and arrangers that I like and doing takedowns.
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This is where I learned the most, doing takedowns of stuff that I like.
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And this that was my school, not the building I went to.
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And that was that was the the music school in Cologne was a good network opportunity to to play in bands and and and network with other musicians and so.
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But the curriculum really didn't help me at all.
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Having said that, how do since your question was, how do I emigrated from being a student or being in school then to actually get work for hire?
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I also have to admit that when I went, I started music school in my so we also still in Germany at the time we still had a draft, so I had to do my service.
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Um but I started working as a professional musician in my late teens in about 16, 17.
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I started playing trumpet in wedding bands and on the weekends.
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So I was already making a living as a musician by the time I got to the music school.
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And in in our my composition and arranging class, I was the only one already working full-time as an arranger because I got hired as a staff arranger by the Hamburg Radio Big Band before I actually went to music school.
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So I established myself as an arranger already be regardless of the school.
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So so then when I finished school, I was already working, and I just got passed around from this one radio big band to the next radio big band in Germany.
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And the leader of this of this um National Youth Big Band Orchestra that I was a part of, I joined when I was 19.
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He was an arranger, and he kind of took me under his wing and sort of became a mentor and let me assist on his arrangements for his uh uh radio projects, and then also assigned me my own arrangements.
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So he was much more instrumental on getting me going than the school was.
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So he jumpstarted my career, kind of mentoring me.
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And he was not really a teacher, he never sat down with me and gave me a lesson.
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He just put me in front of the challenges at the right time in the right moment.
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Um, so that was what what the his mentorship looked like to me.
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And then from there on, I just like by referral, I got to refer to this and to this and to this, and by the time, and then uh I had a pretty good career in Germany through my 20s um as a composer and arranger, an arranger for radio orchestras and radio big bands, and then also for film and television.
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And but that by the time I was 29, I discovered in Germany that I had everything I had already done everything there is to do.
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I had conducted every Radio Symphony Orchestra there is in Germany and written for these radio big bands and and done television and movie scores in Germany.
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And I was only 29, I thought, well, this can't be it.
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So I I wanted to write lush orchestral Hollywood type of film score music, and that at the time, mind you, that was the mid-90s, was not really asked for in Germany.
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Producers and directors in Germany wanted minimalistic music that doesn't show too much emotions because Germans have a problem with showing emotions anyway.
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And and so that's when I decided, well, then I'm at the wrong place here.
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I have to go to a place where this kind of music that I want to write and want to learn how to write is asked for.
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And this was Los Angeles at the time.
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So that at the age of 29, I asked my then girlfriend if she would come with me to move to Los Angeles, and we did.
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And then we got married and had kids, and now that's 30 years ago.
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And so, but I basically had to start my career from scratch again in Hollywood in Hollywood and Los Angeles.
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Nobody knew who I was, so I had to build a whole new network and um I had left the network, my professional network in Germany behind, and started again from zero in Los Angeles.
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What what were the biggest steps, both I guess in in Germany and getting your name out there and and have you know being able to conduct and work with every orchestra there and also in in LA, what were the biggest steps and the most important um sort of moments for you in advancing and getting your name known?
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The great arranger Semi Nessico once told me, a break in a career always happens when preparation meets opportunity.
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And in my case, that proved to be true.
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I was not really conducting much in Germany.
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I was writing for symphony orchestras, and and my mentor, this guy Peter Herbertheimer, as I mentioned, he um had me write some arrangements for a Radio Symphony Orchestra, and and uh it was in the middle of the winter, there was a heavy snowstorm.
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I showed up at the for the for the recording date on time, but he got stuck in a snowstorm with his car.
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And and um I think I was 22 at the time.
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So the producer of this this recording project came up to me and said, Hey, Peter Herbal time, he's gonna be he's not gonna be here for hours.
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Uh let's start with your arrangements and you're up, kid.
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You're gonna conduct.
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So I had to stand in front of the orchestra and I was 22, I looked like 17, and um and prove myself.
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And um, and yeah, it went fairly well.
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And then they saw, oh, actually, this kid can actually conduct.
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So I got referred to the next one.
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So it's as I said, when you but I was prepared for it.
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I I I I know I knew what I was doing, and I was I was ready for it.
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And then this guy's sometimes sometimes it takes something like this, like the other guy being stuck in a snowstorm.
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And then the same thing when in Los Angeles.
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Um when I I didn't know anyone um when I came to LA in '96, and I had a referral to a producer for TV movies through a friend in Germany, and um, and I paid him a visit.
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I called him up and he said, Yeah, you can't come to my office.
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So I visited him in his office, and he said, Well, you have this movie here.
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Um uh this TV movie.
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Um I already have a score.
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The composer is already done with this with his work, but take this movie home, and if you want, score a couple of scenes so I can see how you work.
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And um and I did, and that was at the time it was already a MIDI score, so it was I had all these synth and samplers at home, and so I but instead of just scoring a couple of scenes, I scored the whole film, knowing he didn't need the score.
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He already had a composer for it.
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So I brought that back to him, and he was so impressed by this that he didn't pick me for this film, but for his next film, he um hired me to compose his next film instead of his composer of his previous movie.
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And so that got me started with um in my first year in LA scoring two television movies, one for CBS and one for ABC.
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Um and and I thought it's gonna take a few years to get the foot in the door in LA, and there was in my first year scoring two TV movies.
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But having said that, um then um along came reality television, and that killed the TV movie business.
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And suddenly there were no TV movies anymore.
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And that producer that hired me for these two movies was my only contact so far, and he quit the business and went into real estate, I think.
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And then I had four years of no work in LA whatsoever.
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I uh I still had uh my German television shows that I was scoring from LA and sending back the music.
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Um so that kept us afloat for the next three or four years, and then slowly I got to the the word got around I had um some extra money from some reruns in Germany, and instead of pouring that money into, I don't know, buying a bigger house or bigger car, I um I uh had my own, I started my own Big Band in LA and we recorded an album.
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And this album, although it's never gonna recoup the money that it cost to make, but it it did get nominated for a couple of Grammys, and that kind of people got note of it.
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And um and then um I had a gig where David Foster came to to the show and he asked me during the break, hey, do you write for strings?
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And I thought, yes, I do write for strings.
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So he hired me um to write um some string arrangements um for an artist he was producing at the time.
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And uh but again, it doesn't always go in a straight upward trajectory because I thought, oh great, I'm working for David Foster now.
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But then he didn't call for two years.
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And it's not because he he didn't like what I did, it's just because he had all these other great arrangers that that he would call, like Jeremy Lubbock and Johnny Mandel, though he didn't really need me.
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So um so after I think two or three years ago, he called again and had some little string arrangement again for me.
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And then he didn't call for two years again.
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It was not until he called me to write some arrangements for Michael Bublis Christmas record that I became from then on, I became more one of his regular arrangers.
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But it really takes some time and building your reputation and being consistent to to establish your reputation.
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Do you have any stories or remember anything vividly of uh some of the most intimidating sort of uh jumps up that you had to make in uh in your career where you were suddenly giving given a project or a task that was uh you know, unlike anything you'd done before and was is kind of scary in that way?
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Music leading um yeah, I mean a lot of the projects are music lead.
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It's something that I've I don't know.
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I mean it's but not nothing really jarring.
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I mean, every challenge I'm confronted with, I feel confident and taking on.
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Sometimes it's other things that has nothing to do with music that are more challenging than the music part.
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Um I don't know, the singer can't really sing or or you're uh uh expected to write under a cr on a under a possible deadline or so.
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Musically the challenges are sometimes not as as hard as as as the logistic challenges or or other stuff that you're sometimes confronted with.
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Can you can you speak to that for a moment and how you navigate those types of things?
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I remember sometimes I uh one I had to do one show where it was a PBS show.
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Actually, that had to do with David Foster um with this with this uh girl singer, her name is Jackie Ivanko.
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He was she I think she was 11 or 12 at the time.
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And we did a full concert with her in Florida.
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I had a I had a whole orchestra, I was conducting.
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But so that I don't, as a conductor, I was kind of sort of in the eyeside of the camera.
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I obstruct- I was as a conductor obstructing the eyeliner of the camera to the to the girl, to the to the singer, and so the stage setup was kind of funny and not optimal, so they decided to lower me, usually the as you know, the conductor is a little bit higher, so everybody in the orchestra can see it, but they did the reverse.
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They put me lower than everyone else as a conductor.
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So I had to conduct with my arms really high up here.
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So for the whole night, I was conducting like this.
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So those are kind of the unexpected challenges they have to deal with.
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So the music is not the problem, it's just me conducting this way all night.
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Uh-huh.
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So were you able to it it you literally I had really sore arms after that night.
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Wow.
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Uh-huh.
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Do you have any anything else like that that you remember vividly is maybe not, you know, logistic like physically demanding and kind of weird like that, but uh anything like logistically that uh posed a challenge that was you know unusual for you?
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I can't uh oh yeah, I I remember one of the Super Bowl stories, for example, was um I've I've done the arrangement for of the national anthem for Jennifer Hudson in I think in 2011 for this Super Bowl pre-show.
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We recorded that a week in advance, and and then Jennifer Hudson went to the rehearsal in Tampa, Florida to rehearse it at the stadium.
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And that was a day before the Super Bowl, I think.
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And but Faith Hill was singing America the Beautiful, was supposed to sing America the Beautiful before Jennifer Hudson was singing the national anthem.
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And she had a track prepared as well, which I had never heard.
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But after she heard Jennifer Hudson's um national anthem that I did at the stadium, I think it was two days before the show, um, she wasn't happy about her track, and she felt her track fell short of Jennifer Hudson's track that I did.
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So I g Ricky Minor was a music director, and he Ricky called me and said, Hey Jennifer uh Faith Hill wants you to arrange her America the Beautiful as well.
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And we had just finished, I think it was I got this call 10 Friday evening at 10 p.m.
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And Sunday was the Super Bowl and I and Ricky Minor said, I have an orchestra for you tomorrow morning at 10 a.m.
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And um there you go.
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So and I was just about to go to bed, it was like 11 p.m.
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on Friday.
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So I did not go to bed.
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Um I stay up all night and finished that America of the Beautiful at 9 a.m.
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And I walked into the studio at 10 a.m.
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and we recorded it.
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Do you like w wh when you have a a situation like that uh where I'd imagine it probably felt like a a huge amount of pressure, you know, it's the Super Bowl, everyone's watching.
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What did you feel at 11 p.m.?
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when nothing really.
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I just okay, well I guess I don't go to bed, I'll just do it.
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That's a that's a whole thing.
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I don't really think about the pressure or the I I just do it.
00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:53.680
It's just there's not enough time to worry about that stuff.
00:21:53.759 --> 00:21:57.279
Uh there's not enough time to think about the pressure.
00:21:57.440 --> 00:21:59.359
You just you just like do it.
00:22:00.559 --> 00:22:22.880
That I think I think that story also for me raises another question, uh, which is personally I I find myself, maybe this is just because I'm younger and and a lot less experienced, uh spending spending more time in general on on compositions, and I probably couldn't finish something in 10 hours.
00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:34.880
Um do you and considering your you know 1500 projects and collaborations, how have you learned to write quickly and in situations where it's 11 p.m.
00:22:35.039 --> 00:22:37.039
and you need something by 9 a.m.
00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:47.200
to be able to get it done and write something that's you know, I've I've learned that I trust my instinct and usually and my first idea is usually the best.
00:22:47.359 --> 00:23:02.799
And I even if I do have time and I'm starting to second guess myself and erasing something or abandoning it or doing something else, usually by the end I come to the conclusion actually the first idea was the best.
00:23:03.440 --> 00:23:08.319
And if writing under time pressure, you you have to go with your first idea.
00:23:08.559 --> 00:23:09.839
And it's the best anyway.
00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:11.839
So yeah.
00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:27.119
But when when you And I also, I mean, I've talked to other people that deal with writer's block, and and and we all get writer's block, but I have I developed certain techniques to get around writer's block and um um or deal with it at least.
00:23:27.279 --> 00:23:43.519
So for example, if I'm stuck in a certain section, um then I I go to a different section of the chart, then I then I write the ending or the the 2D section in the middle, and then I can come back to this later, or very often would like an intro.
00:23:43.599 --> 00:23:45.519
I don't know how to do the song.
00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:52.400
I I very often leave the intro to to write last because then I know what to introduce.
00:23:54.160 --> 00:24:00.000
When I've written the body of the song, and then I write the intro later because I can then reference of what comings later.
00:24:00.079 --> 00:24:01.759
I can reference that in the introduction.
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:04.880
Sometimes I have an idea for an intro right away, sometimes I don't.
00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:19.440
Do you how did you get um initially into uh or or just get the idea originally for in a type of orchestra that would sort of combine classical and jazz music?
00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:26.799
Well, um we don't really combine classical and jazz music per se.
00:24:26.880 --> 00:24:36.400
I'm just what I'm what I created with the Pacific Jazz Orchestra as a combination, the instrumentation is a combination of classical and and jazz.
00:24:36.559 --> 00:24:54.640
And there is there is um an orchestra in Holland called the Metropole Orchestra, which is a sort of a radio orchestra, and they've been in existence for more than 50 years, and that is a big band plus a string section and extra percussion and a horn and two woodwinds.
00:24:54.799 --> 00:25:06.079
And I've been a guest conductor with this orchestra a few times over the last few years, and um and that is the only one of its kind in in Europe.
00:25:07.039 --> 00:25:13.119
And I thought, and I got inspired by this, and I thought we should have something like this in LA.
00:25:13.279 --> 00:25:23.519
And this that was sort of the idea, and that was the start, and and and so far I'm proud to say this orchestra is sort of the the only one of its kind in the US.
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:33.119
And it's and um, yeah, and it's I wanted to build this for Los Angeles, and so to bring kind of these concerts to different neighborhoods in Los Angeles.
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:41.680
So we put on a concert season, an annual concert season with four or five concert projects that present in different venues throughout Los Angeles.
00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:44.799
Is it a dream come true as a composer?
00:25:45.519 --> 00:25:49.839
That's my I think it's the most meaningful thing I've done in my career to start this orchestra.
00:25:52.559 --> 00:26:01.920
Personally, I so I meant um as a composer in almost a selfish way, uh, beyond the meaning of it, which I'm I'm sure there's a lot of meaning.
00:26:02.079 --> 00:26:16.079
But is it do you feel almost a greater creative freedom or uh just something lighter about about having you know an or uh a good orchestra that can play your music at any time?
00:26:16.400 --> 00:26:17.200
Yeah, absolutely.
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:21.200
There's a there's a great freedom that comes with it, artistically at least.
00:26:21.519 --> 00:26:34.880
Um and because I've been writing music for other people for 35 years or more, and and fulfilling their musical vision and and had fun doing it and have been doing gladly.
00:26:35.039 --> 00:26:37.200
Um because I learned a lot about it.
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:47.119
And and very often the producer's vision would align with my own vision or what what would be my own vision for a project, especially when I worked with David Foster.
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:49.119
I just like, yeah, I would have done the same way.
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:51.599
So it's but I'm still fulfilling his vision.
00:26:51.839 --> 00:27:00.240
But after having done that for 35 years, I I enjoy having my own orchestra where I can fulfill my own musical vision.
00:27:00.319 --> 00:27:01.839
So that's that's that's a great part.
00:27:02.240 --> 00:27:06.480
By writing the music, but also by selecting the guest artists.
00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:08.400
That's also that I do for this orchestra.
00:27:08.480 --> 00:27:26.160
I select the guest artists that we that we work with, and there are often people that I always wanted to work with or that interest me, or new talent that comes along that that um that somebody points me to, or or my daughter who's my production manager, she said, we should work with this person.
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.240
I she brings someone to me and said, Oh yeah, this is a fantastic idea.
00:27:30.400 --> 00:27:38.160
By the way, this is I spend 80% of my time, the Pacific Jazz Orchestra, with non-music related work.
00:27:39.920 --> 00:27:42.240
20% is music, that's the easy part.
00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:46.319
80% is running a nonprofit organization.
00:27:47.759 --> 00:28:10.240
I I guess though, at this point for you, uh you know, if you've scored uh done music for the Super Bowl twice and and worked with a lot of big names that I you can come to expect more than earlier in your career, a bit of a bit more consistency when it comes to uh avoiding train wrecks and things like that.
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:11.119
I don't think so, yeah.
00:28:11.680 --> 00:28:12.079
Yeah.
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:34.240
Do you uh do you do you think that's the the the work is continues to be as interesting when there's uh uh more predictability or do you do you um still still see areas for growth just in terms of what's on the horizon for you?
00:28:34.559 --> 00:28:35.440
Yeah, absolutely.
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:44.400
I mean it's I think artistic growth is like is like climbing onto a tower.
00:28:44.640 --> 00:28:49.359
The higher you get, the the more you see how far the horizon is.
00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:58.079
So the more I learn and the better I get as a composer, the more I realize what I don't know and what I still have to learn.
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:08.720
Um Yeah, so there's there's still a lot of music I I still want to learn and how to write and yeah.
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:13.839
That's that uh the the climbing the tower thing is is deep.
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:15.359
Did you just come up with that now?
00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:18.480
Or I thought of this before, but it's something I came up with.
00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:19.759
Yeah, this analogy, yeah.
00:29:20.079 --> 00:29:23.279
Well Chris, do you have any final advice for me?
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:39.359
Is uh we're running out of time here, but for for me or for anyone else who's early in the early in the game and hoping to uh create a career full of uh interesting opportunities and and uh possibilities add?
00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:45.839
Yeah, I think uh an advice that I often give is we're all not starting from scratch as far as the musical language.
00:29:45.920 --> 00:29:49.839
And so we're all building on someone else's musical language.
00:29:50.079 --> 00:30:02.880
And the best way to form your own musical language is to learn about the musical language of others and how they wrote music, and then form your own style and your own language.
00:30:02.960 --> 00:30:15.680
And the best way of doing that is not only listen to to other arrangers or composers that you like and that you admire their work, but analyzing of what they actually do, how do they do that?
00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:28.240
And the best way to do this is one way is to buy the study score, um, but the more efficient way is not to buy the study score, is do it to do a transcription.
00:30:28.799 --> 00:30:38.880
And to re to really get behind the music that you want to learn about is do a takedown, do a transcription, write what you hear.
00:30:39.359 --> 00:30:44.720
This is the best way to learn about um other composers' work.
00:30:45.200 --> 00:30:54.400
But when I hear something by I don't know, Stravinsky or so I don't buy the study score, I sit down and have a moment and and write it down.
00:30:55.200 --> 00:30:58.400
Even with orc orchestral things, you just handwrite everything.
00:30:58.640 --> 00:30:59.039
Yeah.
00:30:59.440 --> 00:30:59.920
Wow.
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:01.680
It's amazing.
00:31:02.480 --> 00:31:05.759
And and you you really you think that's the best way to learn it.
00:31:05.839 --> 00:31:14.319
You I I imagine you Yeah, I mean it can the writing down part can be either in in Sibelius or Dorico or with pencil and paper.
00:31:14.480 --> 00:31:27.279
But my time my point is that write down what you hear in what form and what in what way I'm very I will I will absolutely keep that in mind.
00:31:27.359 --> 00:31:34.480
And I think the idea of if transcribing it sounds like an incredible way just to soak it in like a sponge.
00:31:34.720 --> 00:31:34.960
Yeah.
00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:59.119
Um and yeah, and yeah, and another advice I always give as well is um, especially now with the help of computers and everything that we since we're writing now music and computers, is the best way to learn if your own music makes sense and how your own music sounds is having it played by live musicians.
00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:05.119
Because especially now with the help of notation software or sequencer, you can program anything.
00:32:05.200 --> 00:32:10.319
The computer will play back anything without question and without complaining.
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:15.440
And will also but it will also give you a distorted view of what works and what doesn't.
00:32:15.680 --> 00:32:25.759
And you only learn from what will not work if you hear it played by real musicians and they give you the feedback and say, hey, this is really not playable.
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:26.799
We have to change this.
00:32:26.880 --> 00:32:28.480
And then you learn from this, oh okay.
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:32.319
So the clarinet drill C to C sharp does not working soon.
00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:34.720
Because on the computer you don't find that out.
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:36.559
Computer plays back anything.
00:32:36.720 --> 00:32:39.680
So you need that experience having music played.
00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:43.200
And this is how I learned having music played by a lot of musicians.
00:32:43.519 --> 00:32:47.440
Because I I kind of developed an approach.
00:32:47.599 --> 00:33:00.400
I would always, especially when I was younger, I would write what I knew worked and what I to be safe, and because I had I had to learn on the real on the on the real job.
00:33:00.559 --> 00:33:12.160
I was writing it when my my mentor took me under his wing and assigned me to write arrangements for for radio broadcast productions, and I was 19 or 20 at a time.
00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:16.000
Um I uh I failure was not an option.
00:33:16.160 --> 00:33:20.319
So I I had to write what was safe, otherwise it would be fired.
00:33:20.480 --> 00:33:25.680
So I I wrote what I knew was working, and then I tried a little bit further next time.
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:26.480
That worked as well.
00:33:26.640 --> 00:33:30.799
Okay, now I can try a little bit further, that still worked the last the next time.
00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:33.119
So I I learned writing that way.
00:33:33.759 --> 00:33:38.559
And if something doesn't work, you hear it right away and then you're able to fix it.
00:33:38.880 --> 00:33:49.279
Um but you have to have your music played by live instruments to learn if if what you write is good and if your what you write actually works and how it sounds live.
00:33:49.440 --> 00:33:51.279
Your com the computer will never tell you that.
00:33:51.440 --> 00:34:02.160
For example, if you if you write an alter flute solo accompanied by four trombones, might sound great in a computer, but in the real world, the alter flute will be buried by the trombones.
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:02.880
Yeah.
00:34:04.079 --> 00:34:11.119
That's for example, uh uh something that that that you only learn when your piece is being played by live instruments.
00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:26.880
Well, it it as I said earlier, it's been I I've learned a lot through through our conversation, and it's it's been a joy, and I can absolutely tell through just uh a few of the stories you told that there's there's a lot more.
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:36.000
And it you've had a you've had a rich and and very interesting uh career, and and one that's been uh exciting and and inspiring for me to learn from.
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:38.480
So thank you so much again for being on today.
00:34:38.719 --> 00:34:39.920
Well, thanks for having me, Vaughn.
00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:40.960
It was a pleasure.
00:00:00.640 --> 00:00:02.240
And Sunday was the Super Bowl.
00:00:02.319 --> 00:00:07.599
And Ricky Minor said, I have an orchestra for you tomorrow morning at 10 a.m.
00:00:08.000 --> 00:00:09.759
And I was just about to go to bed.
00:00:09.919 --> 00:00:11.279
It was like 11 p.m.
00:00:11.439 --> 00:00:12.240
on Friday.
00:00:12.400 --> 00:00:18.320
Um I stay up all night and finished that America the Beautiful at 9 a.m.
00:00:18.800 --> 00:00:20.640
And I walked into the studio at 10 a.m.
00:00:20.879 --> 00:00:21.839
and we recorded it.
00:00:22.160 --> 00:00:30.160
Chris Walden's credits include the Oscars, the Super Bowl, Michael Boblet, Rihanna, Paul McCartney, and many more.
00:00:30.399 --> 00:00:33.759
He also founded the Pacific Jazz Orchestra in LA.
00:00:34.000 --> 00:00:36.159
You know this guy's got stories.
00:00:36.320 --> 00:00:37.600
He's done everything.
00:00:37.840 --> 00:00:44.000
Today we discussed the snowstorm that stranded a conductor and suddenly put Chris in front of the orchestra.
00:00:44.240 --> 00:00:49.679
Then there was that producer who asked for a few test scenes, but young Chris had a better idea.
00:00:49.920 --> 00:00:55.920
And then there's the absurd reason Chris once had to conduct the entire night with his arms over his head.
00:00:56.240 --> 00:00:59.439
There's not enough time to think about the pressure.
00:00:59.600 --> 00:01:01.200
You just do it.
00:01:01.679 --> 00:01:03.119
I'm Von Veneer.
00:01:03.280 --> 00:01:07.120
This is Chris Walden, and you're listening to Beyond the Notes.
00:01:07.280 --> 00:01:08.719
Chris, welcome to the show.
00:01:09.280 --> 00:01:10.640
Well, thank you for having me, Von.
00:01:10.719 --> 00:01:11.680
My pleasure.
00:01:12.079 --> 00:01:31.920
So you're a Grammy nominated composer and arranger, and you've worked across film and television and uh done a whole lot of concerts and projects with Rihanna and Michael Bublet and the Oscars and Paul McCartney, uh, and you founded the um the Pacific Jazz Orchestra in LA.
00:01:32.159 --> 00:01:42.000
With uh with projects like the Oscars or um or things that are just super high stake, like the stakes like the Super Bowl, how do you navigate that in particular?
00:01:42.079 --> 00:01:43.760
And is the the approach different?
00:01:43.920 --> 00:01:48.000
And how does the the collaboration there work in practice for you?
00:01:48.799 --> 00:01:58.079
Well, that's I mean it's uh the the two that you just mentioned, Oscars and Super Bowl, is of very different animals and very different shows.
00:01:58.239 --> 00:02:09.520
I mean the Super Bowl I've only done twice, which is fairly simple, and there's no uh there's not a lot of interaction or collaboration for that show.
00:02:09.599 --> 00:02:13.520
I just get asked, write the national anthem for this singer and this key.
00:02:13.759 --> 00:02:18.560
Then I do it, then I deliver it, and I re-record it, and then I'm done with it.
00:02:18.719 --> 00:02:24.080
So this is a fairly cut-and-dry process, and it's there's not a lot of back and forth.
00:02:24.159 --> 00:02:31.759
I mean, once in a while, I think with Faith Hill, she had, I think, one note, and then I did a little change, and that was it.
00:02:31.919 --> 00:02:40.240
So with the Oscars, it's that is more a collaborative process, especially with the producers and the music director.
00:02:40.400 --> 00:02:43.680
Mind you, I'm not the music director at the Oscars, I'm the lead arranger.
00:02:43.919 --> 00:02:54.080
Having said that, I still write the majority on the music in the show, but also I do a lot of the work myself before we before I collaborate with others.
00:02:54.240 --> 00:03:15.759
I do all the research of the music that we use as a winner play on for all the for all the nominated films, which means I research all the scores of the nominated films, select what excerpts we're gonna play, and then um I either myself I arrange most of it, but also have some other arrangers working with me on that show.
00:03:15.919 --> 00:03:41.439
Then I assign arrangements who's arranging what, and then I oversee all the arranging process of all the arrangers, make comments, and then and then we record that in the studio, and then and then I collaborate with either the performing artists and the music director for the special performances in the show, and then I collaborate also with the producers on on special segments like the in memoriam, which is what we're currently working on right now for the upcoming show.
00:03:41.680 --> 00:03:47.039
So the producers there are sort of involved in what they want to hear as far as music.
00:03:47.199 --> 00:03:51.680
So but again, this is this is just the Oscars, and other shows just let me do my thing.
00:03:51.759 --> 00:03:53.919
So it's it varies from project to project.
00:03:54.240 --> 00:03:54.639
Yeah.
00:03:54.879 --> 00:04:07.840
Well, first of all, uh you I I think it's worth mentioning you sort of glossed over it, but um uh phrases like did the Super Bowl only two times, and and that it's not such a such a big deal.
00:04:08.319 --> 00:04:13.759
I think that that speaks a lot already to to what you do, and it's it's it's very inspiring.
00:04:14.000 --> 00:04:25.680
So um especially like with the Oscars, um, you know, obviously what very widely publicized, uh, very high stakes, as I said earlier.
00:04:25.839 --> 00:04:34.720
Uh, and as you mentioned, there are different expectations from different people, like the producers and everyone else, as to what uh needs to happen.
00:04:34.879 --> 00:04:42.000
So, like how how do you balance that and make sure everything sort of comes together and and works for everyone?
00:04:42.800 --> 00:04:47.360
Well, I think I I serve, I mean, I serve at their pleasure.
00:04:47.519 --> 00:04:49.920
So I don't really care what my vision is.
00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:53.360
I s I try to fulfill their vision as best as I can.
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Because it's not my show, it's their show.
00:04:55.759 --> 00:04:57.680
It's different with the Pacific Jazz Orchestra.
00:04:57.759 --> 00:04:58.319
That's my vision.
00:04:58.399 --> 00:05:01.120
So there I'm the boss, and there I can fulfill my own vision.
00:05:01.439 --> 00:05:01.920
Yeah.
00:05:02.240 --> 00:05:10.480
But in general, with arranging and in orchestration, yeah, the approach is is more uh working with someone else's vision.
00:05:11.040 --> 00:05:12.000
Yeah, exactly.
00:05:12.399 --> 00:05:26.800
As a as a composer myself who who's young and uh just sort of starting out in many ways, uh it's it's inspiring to see people uh who are farther along in the uh farther along the path.
00:05:26.959 --> 00:06:11.360
And so I was curious to know uh in your bio, for instance, it says, you know, you you did high school, uh started doing some arrangements and some orchestration there, and and throughout uh your time in in uh the Germany uh national youth jazz orchestra and throughout college and your masters, and so you you had a strong educational background, but from there, how do you how do you branch out and get credits like Michael Bublet and and get to collaborate with all these cool people and and go from being in a a very sort of uh you know structured educational environment to being in the real world?
00:06:11.920 --> 00:06:40.240
Well, uh first of all, I have to say I did go to a music school in Cologne, um and without really talking bad about the school or about schools its itself or in general, I have to say, and mind you, the time that I went to music school was in the in the late 80s, early 90s, um, and I was in the jazz program in the music school in Cologne.
00:06:40.319 --> 00:06:56.240
But I have to say, nothing that I and I had a classical composition teacher, my composition major in composition was Carlin Stockhausen then, and nothing that he taught or was trying to teach was useful for what I wanted to do.
00:06:56.480 --> 00:07:02.879
So I have to say that I didn't learn anything at music school that was useful for me.
00:07:03.040 --> 00:07:05.199
I learned sort of on the job.
00:07:05.360 --> 00:07:13.759
I so yes, I do hold two master's degrees, but they're not really, they didn't do anything for me to in in in my work that I'm doing now.
00:07:14.000 --> 00:07:18.720
So I learned for what I'm doing now and what I've always wanted to do.
00:07:18.879 --> 00:07:25.680
I learned by studying scores and listening to to composers and arrangers that I like and doing takedowns.
00:07:25.839 --> 00:07:29.920
This is where I learned the most, doing takedowns of stuff that I like.
00:07:30.000 --> 00:07:33.519
And this that was my school, not the building I went to.
00:07:33.600 --> 00:07:43.920
And that was that was the the music school in Cologne was a good network opportunity to to play in bands and and and network with other musicians and so.
00:07:44.480 --> 00:07:47.519
But the curriculum really didn't help me at all.
00:07:48.000 --> 00:07:57.839
Having said that, how do since your question was, how do I emigrated from being a student or being in school then to actually get work for hire?
00:07:58.480 --> 00:08:07.680
I also have to admit that when I went, I started music school in my so we also still in Germany at the time we still had a draft, so I had to do my service.
00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:15.439
Um but I started working as a professional musician in my late teens in about 16, 17.
00:08:15.600 --> 00:08:18.639
I started playing trumpet in wedding bands and on the weekends.
00:08:18.879 --> 00:08:23.759
So I was already making a living as a musician by the time I got to the music school.
00:08:24.000 --> 00:08:36.960
And in in our my composition and arranging class, I was the only one already working full-time as an arranger because I got hired as a staff arranger by the Hamburg Radio Big Band before I actually went to music school.
00:08:37.279 --> 00:08:41.759
So I established myself as an arranger already be regardless of the school.
00:08:42.000 --> 00:08:52.879
So so then when I finished school, I was already working, and I just got passed around from this one radio big band to the next radio big band in Germany.
00:08:52.960 --> 00:08:59.600
And the leader of this of this um National Youth Big Band Orchestra that I was a part of, I joined when I was 19.
00:08:59.759 --> 00:09:12.559
He was an arranger, and he kind of took me under his wing and sort of became a mentor and let me assist on his arrangements for his uh uh radio projects, and then also assigned me my own arrangements.
00:09:12.720 --> 00:09:17.039
So he was much more instrumental on getting me going than the school was.
00:09:17.360 --> 00:09:20.399
So he jumpstarted my career, kind of mentoring me.
00:09:20.559 --> 00:09:24.639
And he was not really a teacher, he never sat down with me and gave me a lesson.
00:09:24.879 --> 00:09:29.759
He just put me in front of the challenges at the right time in the right moment.
00:09:29.919 --> 00:09:33.759
Um, so that was what what the his mentorship looked like to me.
00:09:33.840 --> 00:09:52.080
And then from there on, I just like by referral, I got to refer to this and to this and to this, and by the time, and then uh I had a pretty good career in Germany through my 20s um as a composer and arranger, an arranger for radio orchestras and radio big bands, and then also for film and television.
00:09:52.240 --> 00:10:01.120
And but that by the time I was 29, I discovered in Germany that I had everything I had already done everything there is to do.
00:10:01.279 --> 00:10:11.600
I had conducted every Radio Symphony Orchestra there is in Germany and written for these radio big bands and and done television and movie scores in Germany.
00:10:11.759 --> 00:10:14.159
And I was only 29, I thought, well, this can't be it.
00:10:14.399 --> 00:10:25.919
So I I wanted to write lush orchestral Hollywood type of film score music, and that at the time, mind you, that was the mid-90s, was not really asked for in Germany.
00:10:26.080 --> 00:10:34.240
Producers and directors in Germany wanted minimalistic music that doesn't show too much emotions because Germans have a problem with showing emotions anyway.
00:10:34.320 --> 00:10:38.960
And and so that's when I decided, well, then I'm at the wrong place here.
00:10:39.039 --> 00:10:45.279
I have to go to a place where this kind of music that I want to write and want to learn how to write is asked for.
00:10:45.360 --> 00:10:47.440
And this was Los Angeles at the time.
00:10:47.519 --> 00:10:53.919
So that at the age of 29, I asked my then girlfriend if she would come with me to move to Los Angeles, and we did.
00:10:54.000 --> 00:10:57.600
And then we got married and had kids, and now that's 30 years ago.
00:10:57.679 --> 00:11:02.799
And so, but I basically had to start my career from scratch again in Hollywood in Hollywood and Los Angeles.
00:11:02.879 --> 00:11:15.200
Nobody knew who I was, so I had to build a whole new network and um I had left the network, my professional network in Germany behind, and started again from zero in Los Angeles.
00:11:16.720 --> 00:11:40.960
What what were the biggest steps, both I guess in in Germany and getting your name out there and and have you know being able to conduct and work with every orchestra there and also in in LA, what were the biggest steps and the most important um sort of moments for you in advancing and getting your name known?
00:11:41.440 --> 00:11:48.480
The great arranger Semi Nessico once told me, a break in a career always happens when preparation meets opportunity.
00:11:48.799 --> 00:11:51.120
And in my case, that proved to be true.
00:11:51.279 --> 00:11:53.519
I was not really conducting much in Germany.
00:11:53.600 --> 00:12:08.399
I was writing for symphony orchestras, and and my mentor, this guy Peter Herbertheimer, as I mentioned, he um had me write some arrangements for a Radio Symphony Orchestra, and and uh it was in the middle of the winter, there was a heavy snowstorm.
00:12:08.559 --> 00:12:15.679
I showed up at the for the for the recording date on time, but he got stuck in a snowstorm with his car.
00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:19.840
And and um I think I was 22 at the time.
00:12:20.159 --> 00:12:30.240
So the producer of this this recording project came up to me and said, Hey, Peter Herbal time, he's gonna be he's not gonna be here for hours.
00:12:30.399 --> 00:12:33.440
Uh let's start with your arrangements and you're up, kid.
00:12:33.600 --> 00:12:35.120
You're gonna conduct.
00:12:35.440 --> 00:12:42.240
So I had to stand in front of the orchestra and I was 22, I looked like 17, and um and prove myself.
00:12:42.480 --> 00:12:44.720
And um, and yeah, it went fairly well.
00:12:44.799 --> 00:12:47.519
And then they saw, oh, actually, this kid can actually conduct.
00:12:47.600 --> 00:12:49.039
So I got referred to the next one.
00:12:49.200 --> 00:12:52.720
So it's as I said, when you but I was prepared for it.
00:12:52.799 --> 00:12:57.440
I I I I know I knew what I was doing, and I was I was ready for it.
00:12:57.519 --> 00:13:04.080
And then this guy's sometimes sometimes it takes something like this, like the other guy being stuck in a snowstorm.
00:13:04.480 --> 00:13:07.279
And then the same thing when in Los Angeles.
00:13:08.399 --> 00:13:23.440
Um when I I didn't know anyone um when I came to LA in '96, and I had a referral to a producer for TV movies through a friend in Germany, and um, and I paid him a visit.
00:13:23.519 --> 00:13:26.480
I called him up and he said, Yeah, you can't come to my office.
00:13:26.559 --> 00:13:31.279
So I visited him in his office, and he said, Well, you have this movie here.
00:13:32.000 --> 00:13:34.320
Um uh this TV movie.
00:13:34.480 --> 00:13:36.000
Um I already have a score.
00:13:36.080 --> 00:13:43.840
The composer is already done with this with his work, but take this movie home, and if you want, score a couple of scenes so I can see how you work.
00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:58.320
And um and I did, and that was at the time it was already a MIDI score, so it was I had all these synth and samplers at home, and so I but instead of just scoring a couple of scenes, I scored the whole film, knowing he didn't need the score.
00:13:58.480 --> 00:14:00.799
He already had a composer for it.
00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:13.840
So I brought that back to him, and he was so impressed by this that he didn't pick me for this film, but for his next film, he um hired me to compose his next film instead of his composer of his previous movie.
00:14:13.919 --> 00:14:21.600
And so that got me started with um in my first year in LA scoring two television movies, one for CBS and one for ABC.
00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:30.080
Um and and I thought it's gonna take a few years to get the foot in the door in LA, and there was in my first year scoring two TV movies.
00:14:30.240 --> 00:14:38.480
But having said that, um then um along came reality television, and that killed the TV movie business.
00:14:38.639 --> 00:14:40.799
And suddenly there were no TV movies anymore.
00:14:40.879 --> 00:14:48.799
And that producer that hired me for these two movies was my only contact so far, and he quit the business and went into real estate, I think.
00:14:48.879 --> 00:14:52.799
And then I had four years of no work in LA whatsoever.
00:14:53.120 --> 00:15:00.399
I uh I still had uh my German television shows that I was scoring from LA and sending back the music.
00:15:00.639 --> 00:15:21.679
Um so that kept us afloat for the next three or four years, and then slowly I got to the the word got around I had um some extra money from some reruns in Germany, and instead of pouring that money into, I don't know, buying a bigger house or bigger car, I um I uh had my own, I started my own Big Band in LA and we recorded an album.
00:15:21.759 --> 00:15:32.799
And this album, although it's never gonna recoup the money that it cost to make, but it it did get nominated for a couple of Grammys, and that kind of people got note of it.
00:15:32.879 --> 00:15:41.279
And um and then um I had a gig where David Foster came to to the show and he asked me during the break, hey, do you write for strings?
00:15:41.440 --> 00:15:43.120
And I thought, yes, I do write for strings.
00:15:43.279 --> 00:15:50.080
So he hired me um to write um some string arrangements um for an artist he was producing at the time.
00:15:50.159 --> 00:15:58.000
And uh but again, it doesn't always go in a straight upward trajectory because I thought, oh great, I'm working for David Foster now.
00:15:58.159 --> 00:16:00.000
But then he didn't call for two years.
00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:10.320
And it's not because he he didn't like what I did, it's just because he had all these other great arrangers that that he would call, like Jeremy Lubbock and Johnny Mandel, though he didn't really need me.
00:16:10.480 --> 00:16:17.279
So um so after I think two or three years ago, he called again and had some little string arrangement again for me.
00:16:17.360 --> 00:16:19.039
And then he didn't call for two years again.
00:16:19.200 --> 00:16:31.919
It was not until he called me to write some arrangements for Michael Bublis Christmas record that I became from then on, I became more one of his regular arrangers.
00:16:32.080 --> 00:16:39.120
But it really takes some time and building your reputation and being consistent to to establish your reputation.
00:16:40.399 --> 00:17:00.559
Do you have any stories or remember anything vividly of uh some of the most intimidating sort of uh jumps up that you had to make in uh in your career where you were suddenly giving given a project or a task that was uh you know, unlike anything you'd done before and was is kind of scary in that way?
00:17:00.960 --> 00:17:04.240
Music leading um yeah, I mean a lot of the projects are music lead.
00:17:04.400 --> 00:17:06.319
It's something that I've I don't know.
00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:10.559
I mean it's but not nothing really jarring.
00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:14.960
I mean, every challenge I'm confronted with, I feel confident and taking on.
00:17:15.279 --> 00:17:22.000
Sometimes it's other things that has nothing to do with music that are more challenging than the music part.
00:17:22.880 --> 00:17:32.400
Um I don't know, the singer can't really sing or or you're uh uh expected to write under a cr on a under a possible deadline or so.
00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:41.759
Musically the challenges are sometimes not as as hard as as as the logistic challenges or or other stuff that you're sometimes confronted with.
00:17:43.039 --> 00:17:47.440
Can you can you speak to that for a moment and how you navigate those types of things?
00:17:47.759 --> 00:17:53.200
I remember sometimes I uh one I had to do one show where it was a PBS show.
00:17:53.440 --> 00:18:05.279
Actually, that had to do with David Foster um with this with this uh girl singer, her name is Jackie Ivanko.
00:18:05.359 --> 00:18:07.759
He was she I think she was 11 or 12 at the time.
00:18:07.920 --> 00:18:10.559
And we did a full concert with her in Florida.
00:18:10.720 --> 00:18:13.920
I had a I had a whole orchestra, I was conducting.
00:18:14.319 --> 00:18:19.680
But so that I don't, as a conductor, I was kind of sort of in the eyeside of the camera.
00:18:20.240 --> 00:18:37.759
I obstruct- I was as a conductor obstructing the eyeliner of the camera to the to the girl, to the to the singer, and so the stage setup was kind of funny and not optimal, so they decided to lower me, usually the as you know, the conductor is a little bit higher, so everybody in the orchestra can see it, but they did the reverse.
00:18:37.839 --> 00:18:40.960
They put me lower than everyone else as a conductor.
00:18:41.039 --> 00:18:44.160
So I had to conduct with my arms really high up here.
00:18:44.960 --> 00:18:47.759
So for the whole night, I was conducting like this.
00:18:47.920 --> 00:18:50.720
So those are kind of the unexpected challenges they have to deal with.
00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:53.920
So the music is not the problem, it's just me conducting this way all night.
00:18:54.160 --> 00:18:54.640
Uh-huh.
00:18:55.279 --> 00:19:00.559
So were you able to it it you literally I had really sore arms after that night.
00:19:01.839 --> 00:19:02.400
Wow.
00:19:02.559 --> 00:19:03.039
Uh-huh.
00:19:04.640 --> 00:19:20.720
Do you have any anything else like that that you remember vividly is maybe not, you know, logistic like physically demanding and kind of weird like that, but uh anything like logistically that uh posed a challenge that was you know unusual for you?
00:19:21.119 --> 00:19:38.480
I can't uh oh yeah, I I remember one of the Super Bowl stories, for example, was um I've I've done the arrangement for of the national anthem for Jennifer Hudson in I think in 2011 for this Super Bowl pre-show.
00:19:39.440 --> 00:19:48.960
We recorded that a week in advance, and and then Jennifer Hudson went to the rehearsal in Tampa, Florida to rehearse it at the stadium.
00:19:49.279 --> 00:19:53.200
And that was a day before the Super Bowl, I think.
00:19:54.240 --> 00:20:07.680
And but Faith Hill was singing America the Beautiful, was supposed to sing America the Beautiful before Jennifer Hudson was singing the national anthem.
00:20:08.160 --> 00:20:12.720
And she had a track prepared as well, which I had never heard.
00:20:13.200 --> 00:20:31.359
But after she heard Jennifer Hudson's um national anthem that I did at the stadium, I think it was two days before the show, um, she wasn't happy about her track, and she felt her track fell short of Jennifer Hudson's track that I did.
00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:42.079
So I g Ricky Minor was a music director, and he Ricky called me and said, Hey Jennifer uh Faith Hill wants you to arrange her America the Beautiful as well.
00:20:42.400 --> 00:20:51.680
And we had just finished, I think it was I got this call 10 Friday evening at 10 p.m.
00:20:52.400 --> 00:21:01.279
And Sunday was the Super Bowl and I and Ricky Minor said, I have an orchestra for you tomorrow morning at 10 a.m.
00:21:02.240 --> 00:21:04.880
And um there you go.
00:21:05.119 --> 00:21:08.720
So and I was just about to go to bed, it was like 11 p.m.
00:21:08.960 --> 00:21:09.839
on Friday.
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:12.000
So I did not go to bed.
00:21:12.240 --> 00:21:18.240
Um I stay up all night and finished that America of the Beautiful at 9 a.m.
00:21:18.720 --> 00:21:20.559
And I walked into the studio at 10 a.m.
00:21:20.720 --> 00:21:22.000
and we recorded it.
00:21:24.240 --> 00:21:38.000
Do you like w wh when you have a a situation like that uh where I'd imagine it probably felt like a a huge amount of pressure, you know, it's the Super Bowl, everyone's watching.
00:21:38.480 --> 00:21:40.559
What did you feel at 11 p.m.?
00:21:40.720 --> 00:21:41.839
when nothing really.
00:21:42.079 --> 00:21:44.720
I just okay, well I guess I don't go to bed, I'll just do it.
00:21:45.039 --> 00:21:46.079
That's a that's a whole thing.
00:21:46.160 --> 00:21:50.559
I don't really think about the pressure or the I I just do it.
00:21:50.799 --> 00:21:53.680
It's just there's not enough time to worry about that stuff.
00:21:53.759 --> 00:21:57.279
Uh there's not enough time to think about the pressure.
00:21:57.440 --> 00:21:59.359
You just you just like do it.
00:22:00.559 --> 00:22:22.880
That I think I think that story also for me raises another question, uh, which is personally I I find myself, maybe this is just because I'm younger and and a lot less experienced, uh spending spending more time in general on on compositions, and I probably couldn't finish something in 10 hours.
00:22:23.119 --> 00:22:34.880
Um do you and considering your you know 1500 projects and collaborations, how have you learned to write quickly and in situations where it's 11 p.m.
00:22:35.039 --> 00:22:37.039
and you need something by 9 a.m.
00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:47.200
to be able to get it done and write something that's you know, I've I've learned that I trust my instinct and usually and my first idea is usually the best.
00:22:47.359 --> 00:23:02.799
And I even if I do have time and I'm starting to second guess myself and erasing something or abandoning it or doing something else, usually by the end I come to the conclusion actually the first idea was the best.
00:23:03.440 --> 00:23:08.319
And if writing under time pressure, you you have to go with your first idea.
00:23:08.559 --> 00:23:09.839
And it's the best anyway.
00:23:10.000 --> 00:23:11.839
So yeah.
00:23:12.079 --> 00:23:27.119
But when when you And I also, I mean, I've talked to other people that deal with writer's block, and and and we all get writer's block, but I have I developed certain techniques to get around writer's block and um um or deal with it at least.
00:23:27.279 --> 00:23:43.519
So for example, if I'm stuck in a certain section, um then I I go to a different section of the chart, then I then I write the ending or the the 2D section in the middle, and then I can come back to this later, or very often would like an intro.
00:23:43.599 --> 00:23:45.519
I don't know how to do the song.
00:23:45.599 --> 00:23:52.400
I I very often leave the intro to to write last because then I know what to introduce.
00:23:54.160 --> 00:24:00.000
When I've written the body of the song, and then I write the intro later because I can then reference of what comings later.
00:24:00.079 --> 00:24:01.759
I can reference that in the introduction.
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:04.880
Sometimes I have an idea for an intro right away, sometimes I don't.
00:24:05.279 --> 00:24:19.440
Do you how did you get um initially into uh or or just get the idea originally for in a type of orchestra that would sort of combine classical and jazz music?
00:24:20.160 --> 00:24:26.799
Well, um we don't really combine classical and jazz music per se.
00:24:26.880 --> 00:24:36.400
I'm just what I'm what I created with the Pacific Jazz Orchestra as a combination, the instrumentation is a combination of classical and and jazz.
00:24:36.559 --> 00:24:54.640
And there is there is um an orchestra in Holland called the Metropole Orchestra, which is a sort of a radio orchestra, and they've been in existence for more than 50 years, and that is a big band plus a string section and extra percussion and a horn and two woodwinds.
00:24:54.799 --> 00:25:06.079
And I've been a guest conductor with this orchestra a few times over the last few years, and um and that is the only one of its kind in in Europe.
00:25:07.039 --> 00:25:13.119
And I thought, and I got inspired by this, and I thought we should have something like this in LA.
00:25:13.279 --> 00:25:23.519
And this that was sort of the idea, and that was the start, and and and so far I'm proud to say this orchestra is sort of the the only one of its kind in the US.
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:33.119
And it's and um, yeah, and it's I wanted to build this for Los Angeles, and so to bring kind of these concerts to different neighborhoods in Los Angeles.
00:25:33.200 --> 00:25:41.680
So we put on a concert season, an annual concert season with four or five concert projects that present in different venues throughout Los Angeles.
00:25:42.720 --> 00:25:44.799
Is it a dream come true as a composer?
00:25:45.519 --> 00:25:49.839
That's my I think it's the most meaningful thing I've done in my career to start this orchestra.
00:25:52.559 --> 00:26:01.920
Personally, I so I meant um as a composer in almost a selfish way, uh, beyond the meaning of it, which I'm I'm sure there's a lot of meaning.
00:26:02.079 --> 00:26:16.079
But is it do you feel almost a greater creative freedom or uh just something lighter about about having you know an or uh a good orchestra that can play your music at any time?
00:26:16.400 --> 00:26:17.200
Yeah, absolutely.
00:26:17.279 --> 00:26:21.200
There's a there's a great freedom that comes with it, artistically at least.
00:26:21.519 --> 00:26:34.880
Um and because I've been writing music for other people for 35 years or more, and and fulfilling their musical vision and and had fun doing it and have been doing gladly.
00:26:35.039 --> 00:26:37.200
Um because I learned a lot about it.
00:26:37.279 --> 00:26:47.119
And and very often the producer's vision would align with my own vision or what what would be my own vision for a project, especially when I worked with David Foster.
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:49.119
I just like, yeah, I would have done the same way.
00:26:49.200 --> 00:26:51.599
So it's but I'm still fulfilling his vision.
00:26:51.839 --> 00:27:00.240
But after having done that for 35 years, I I enjoy having my own orchestra where I can fulfill my own musical vision.
00:27:00.319 --> 00:27:01.839
So that's that's that's a great part.
00:27:02.240 --> 00:27:06.480
By writing the music, but also by selecting the guest artists.
00:27:06.559 --> 00:27:08.400
That's also that I do for this orchestra.
00:27:08.480 --> 00:27:26.160
I select the guest artists that we that we work with, and there are often people that I always wanted to work with or that interest me, or new talent that comes along that that um that somebody points me to, or or my daughter who's my production manager, she said, we should work with this person.
00:27:26.319 --> 00:27:30.240
I she brings someone to me and said, Oh yeah, this is a fantastic idea.
00:27:30.400 --> 00:27:38.160
By the way, this is I spend 80% of my time, the Pacific Jazz Orchestra, with non-music related work.
00:27:39.920 --> 00:27:42.240
20% is music, that's the easy part.
00:27:42.799 --> 00:27:46.319
80% is running a nonprofit organization.
00:27:47.759 --> 00:28:10.240
I I guess though, at this point for you, uh you know, if you've scored uh done music for the Super Bowl twice and and worked with a lot of big names that I you can come to expect more than earlier in your career, a bit of a bit more consistency when it comes to uh avoiding train wrecks and things like that.
00:28:10.400 --> 00:28:11.119
I don't think so, yeah.
00:28:11.680 --> 00:28:12.079
Yeah.
00:28:12.400 --> 00:28:34.240
Do you uh do you do you think that's the the the work is continues to be as interesting when there's uh uh more predictability or do you do you um still still see areas for growth just in terms of what's on the horizon for you?
00:28:34.559 --> 00:28:35.440
Yeah, absolutely.
00:28:35.599 --> 00:28:44.400
I mean it's I think artistic growth is like is like climbing onto a tower.
00:28:44.640 --> 00:28:49.359
The higher you get, the the more you see how far the horizon is.
00:28:50.160 --> 00:28:58.079
So the more I learn and the better I get as a composer, the more I realize what I don't know and what I still have to learn.
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:08.720
Um Yeah, so there's there's still a lot of music I I still want to learn and how to write and yeah.
00:29:09.519 --> 00:29:13.839
That's that uh the the climbing the tower thing is is deep.
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:15.359
Did you just come up with that now?
00:29:15.440 --> 00:29:18.480
Or I thought of this before, but it's something I came up with.
00:29:18.559 --> 00:29:19.759
Yeah, this analogy, yeah.
00:29:20.079 --> 00:29:23.279
Well Chris, do you have any final advice for me?
00:29:23.359 --> 00:29:39.359
Is uh we're running out of time here, but for for me or for anyone else who's early in the early in the game and hoping to uh create a career full of uh interesting opportunities and and uh possibilities add?
00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:45.839
Yeah, I think uh an advice that I often give is we're all not starting from scratch as far as the musical language.
00:29:45.920 --> 00:29:49.839
And so we're all building on someone else's musical language.
00:29:50.079 --> 00:30:02.880
And the best way to form your own musical language is to learn about the musical language of others and how they wrote music, and then form your own style and your own language.
00:30:02.960 --> 00:30:15.680
And the best way of doing that is not only listen to to other arrangers or composers that you like and that you admire their work, but analyzing of what they actually do, how do they do that?
00:30:15.839 --> 00:30:28.240
And the best way to do this is one way is to buy the study score, um, but the more efficient way is not to buy the study score, is do it to do a transcription.
00:30:28.799 --> 00:30:38.880
And to re to really get behind the music that you want to learn about is do a takedown, do a transcription, write what you hear.
00:30:39.359 --> 00:30:44.720
This is the best way to learn about um other composers' work.
00:30:45.200 --> 00:30:54.400
But when I hear something by I don't know, Stravinsky or so I don't buy the study score, I sit down and have a moment and and write it down.
00:30:55.200 --> 00:30:58.400
Even with orc orchestral things, you just handwrite everything.
00:30:58.640 --> 00:30:59.039
Yeah.
00:30:59.440 --> 00:30:59.920
Wow.
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:01.680
It's amazing.
00:31:02.480 --> 00:31:05.759
And and you you really you think that's the best way to learn it.
00:31:05.839 --> 00:31:14.319
You I I imagine you Yeah, I mean it can the writing down part can be either in in Sibelius or Dorico or with pencil and paper.
00:31:14.480 --> 00:31:27.279
But my time my point is that write down what you hear in what form and what in what way I'm very I will I will absolutely keep that in mind.
00:31:27.359 --> 00:31:34.480
And I think the idea of if transcribing it sounds like an incredible way just to soak it in like a sponge.
00:31:34.720 --> 00:31:34.960
Yeah.
00:31:35.119 --> 00:31:59.119
Um and yeah, and yeah, and another advice I always give as well is um, especially now with the help of computers and everything that we since we're writing now music and computers, is the best way to learn if your own music makes sense and how your own music sounds is having it played by live musicians.
00:31:59.359 --> 00:32:05.119
Because especially now with the help of notation software or sequencer, you can program anything.
00:32:05.200 --> 00:32:10.319
The computer will play back anything without question and without complaining.
00:32:10.559 --> 00:32:15.440
And will also but it will also give you a distorted view of what works and what doesn't.
00:32:15.680 --> 00:32:25.759
And you only learn from what will not work if you hear it played by real musicians and they give you the feedback and say, hey, this is really not playable.
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:26.799
We have to change this.
00:32:26.880 --> 00:32:28.480
And then you learn from this, oh okay.
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:32.319
So the clarinet drill C to C sharp does not working soon.
00:32:32.720 --> 00:32:34.720
Because on the computer you don't find that out.
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:36.559
Computer plays back anything.
00:32:36.720 --> 00:32:39.680
So you need that experience having music played.
00:32:39.839 --> 00:32:43.200
And this is how I learned having music played by a lot of musicians.
00:32:43.519 --> 00:32:47.440
Because I I kind of developed an approach.
00:32:47.599 --> 00:33:00.400
I would always, especially when I was younger, I would write what I knew worked and what I to be safe, and because I had I had to learn on the real on the on the real job.
00:33:00.559 --> 00:33:12.160
I was writing it when my my mentor took me under his wing and assigned me to write arrangements for for radio broadcast productions, and I was 19 or 20 at a time.
00:33:12.400 --> 00:33:16.000
Um I uh I failure was not an option.
00:33:16.160 --> 00:33:20.319
So I I had to write what was safe, otherwise it would be fired.
00:33:20.480 --> 00:33:25.680
So I I wrote what I knew was working, and then I tried a little bit further next time.
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:26.480
That worked as well.
00:33:26.640 --> 00:33:30.799
Okay, now I can try a little bit further, that still worked the last the next time.
00:33:30.960 --> 00:33:33.119
So I I learned writing that way.
00:33:33.759 --> 00:33:38.559
And if something doesn't work, you hear it right away and then you're able to fix it.
00:33:38.880 --> 00:33:49.279
Um but you have to have your music played by live instruments to learn if if what you write is good and if your what you write actually works and how it sounds live.
00:33:49.440 --> 00:33:51.279
Your com the computer will never tell you that.
00:33:51.440 --> 00:34:02.160
For example, if you if you write an alter flute solo accompanied by four trombones, might sound great in a computer, but in the real world, the alter flute will be buried by the trombones.
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:02.880
Yeah.
00:34:04.079 --> 00:34:11.119
That's for example, uh uh something that that that you only learn when your piece is being played by live instruments.
00:34:11.280 --> 00:34:26.880
Well, it it as I said earlier, it's been I I've learned a lot through through our conversation, and it's it's been a joy, and I can absolutely tell through just uh a few of the stories you told that there's there's a lot more.
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:36.000
And it you've had a you've had a rich and and very interesting uh career, and and one that's been uh exciting and and inspiring for me to learn from.
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:38.480
So thank you so much again for being on today.
00:34:38.719 --> 00:34:39.920
Well, thanks for having me, Vaughn.
00:34:40.000 --> 00:34:40.960
It was a pleasure.
