Breaking the Silence: Miscarriage, Grief, and Finding Community

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All Things Conceivable, a surrogacy podcast with Nazca Fontes.
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Hi, everyone. My name is Kristy Miller, and I have the incredible honor today
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of stepping in for Nazca Fontes as your host for this episode of All Things Conceivable.
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I'm the manager of the mental health team at ConceiveAbilities,
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and I work with surrogates and intended parents, navigating the emotional complexities
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of family building, including infertility, pregnancy loss, and grief.
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Because October is Pregnancy and Infant Loss Awareness Month,
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today we wanted to make space for an important conversation that touches so
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many families but doesn't always get the attention it deserves.
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I am joined by Jenn Sinrich, a longtime parenting and health journalist,
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mom of three, and founder of the Mother Chapter and Miscarriage Movement.
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After experiencing pregnancy loss herself, Jenn created a platform to help others
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feel less alone and find support, information, and community.
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Jenn, thank you so much for being here and for sharing your perspective with
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us. Thank you so much for having me and truly making space for this kind of
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a conversation, especially this time of year.
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Absolutely. We're honored to have you.
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And Jenn, for listeners who may not know you yet, can you please tell us a little
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bit about yourself, your family, and your career? Of course. I'm a journalist.
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I got my start working in New York City at parenting and pregnancy magazines.
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I was a very young 20-something with no parenting experience,
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but for some reason I was just very drawn to that space, creating life and the
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journey that it takes to get there.
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And I learned very quickly that it's not a linear process for most people.
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And I was at What to Expect When You're Expecting, Parents Magazine,
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Fit Pregnancy, American Baby.
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And then I became a mom myself.
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And I learned even more about how you can spend a career writing about everything
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having to do with creating a family and the road to get there,
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but know nothing when it comes to your time.
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So after I had my first daughter, I actually had two miscarriages back to back,
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which was a really devastating time where I felt incredibly isolated and alone
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despite having a wonderful husband and family.
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Supporting me the best that they could, I felt that there were very limited
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resources during the process.
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And that's really what inspired me to create Miscarriage Movement
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as a space to give voice to the experiences of women who've gone through loss
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in all different shapes and forms so that other women going through it like I was.
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Did not feel so alone.
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Absolutely. And I'm so sorry that you've had that experience of loss yourself. Yeah.
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Can you share a little bit more about the mother chapter and miscarriage movement?
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What are the differences between those platforms? And tell a little bit more
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about how you see those affecting and impacting the people involved.
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On the outset, you might think that they are completely different topics.
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Miscarriage movement focuses on infertility and pregnancy loss,
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while the mother chapter focuses on the identity changes that come along with the matricence.
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Of becoming a mother in the postpartum period, which we always like to say is forever.
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I'm not limited to a year or anything numerical.
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So what is so similar about the two platforms is that it all comes back to wanting
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the person going through the process to feel understood in an experience that
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can be incredibly lonely.
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Miscarriage is very lonely, of course. It seems a little bit more understanding
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to feel that pain and that isolation from people in your life who don't seem
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to understand what you're going through.
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But postpartum is very similar to that isolation experience and to not know
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what to expect while you're going through it.
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And so both of the platforms really come from a place of trying to give women
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a voice during a process where it can be incredibly difficult. Okay, absolutely.
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Well, you know, it's October. That's one of the reasons Since we're having this
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conversation here today just to honor Pregnancy and Infant Loss Awareness Month.
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How do you feel about having this time of year to focus on this topic?
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And why do you feel it's important to dedicate this time to recognizing experiences of loss?
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I think having a month that focuses on pregnancy and infant loss,
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it creates an opening for something that people really often don't know how to bring up.
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Not only do they not know how to bring it up, but they don't know the right wording.
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To speak about something so unique and individual and personalized.
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And that wording matters so much for somebody going through pregnancy loss.
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For someone who's experienced loss herself, seeing it acknowledged publicly
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is so meaningful, especially if the people around, you know,
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you haven't really recognized it.
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They might not know what to say or what to do or how to support you.
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But for example, on October 15th, there's the wave of light where you can light
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a candle in honor of a pregnancy loss or an infant loss.
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And that is a simple way to come together and show that you're remembering the
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pregnancy or the baby loss.
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It's also an opportunity to help people really better understand miscarriage
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and stillbirth and infant loss and that their distinct experiences and that
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even people with similar kinds of losses, they may feel very differently and
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they may grieve the process very differently.
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Absolutely, absolutely. It's common, and yet there are differences in how people
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experience those losses.
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Why do you think that there is still such a silence around loss and what needs
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to change? What would be helpful in changing that?
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Yeah, as painful it is when someone doesn't seem to understand how it feels.
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It really does come from a place of just being uncomfortable of not knowing
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how to fix something that can be fixed.
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I think that whether it's, you know, your partner, your friend,
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your parent, colleague, you
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know, they want to be able to offer something that could make it better.
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And sometimes, especially when it comes down to loss, there's just nothing that
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can be said or done to make the situation any different or better.
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But to the person going through it, sometimes silence can just feel like their
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loss doesn't matter or that they need to get over it or that they need to move on.
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There's also this expectation that you should keep an early pregnancy private
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in case something goes wrong, which I don't see how that serves anybody but
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the society and the people around that person.
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It's not helping the person grieving a pregnancy that might not be going right
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or knowing that they're having a loss.
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Privacy can be someone's choice, absolutely. And I think there's nothing wrong
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with keeping an early pregnancy private.
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But I also don't think it should feel like it's an obligation to keep it private
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to protect everyone else from difficult news.
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So we need to make talking about law something that's more possible and okay
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and open without making it like a disclosure or another expectation.
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People deserve support, whether or not they share it publicly. Absolutely.
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If you're comfortable sharing, would you be open to telling us a little more about.
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Your own experiences of loss and what did help and maybe what didn't help when
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you were going through those intense times of grief?
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Yeah. With my first pregnancy loss, you know, I was very excited.
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I found out I was pregnant and surprised my husband with a little card, and we were so excited.
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And we did what we felt like we were supposed to do, which was to not share
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our news with our family right away. And even though we were so excited to do
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it, we started planning out when we're going to tell them.
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And unfortunately, we got some very bad news, our second ultrasound,
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that there was no longer a heartbeat.
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And then telling our family and our friends at that point, it was so painful.
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I remember telling a friend, so I need to talk to you.
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I was pregnant. And then she's like, congratulations. And I said,
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no, no, no, no, I had a pregnancy loss. And it was just a very difficult way
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to express what had happened to me.
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And I started to think, you know, if I want to share this news with these people
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in my life, why did I feel that I had to wait.
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To share that with them until a certain amount of weeks had gone by,
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which anyone who's experienced a later loss knows that there's never a guaranteed
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time where you can share news to ensure that nothing can go wrong.
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So I really started to realize that That rule of not sharing that news really
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doesn't serve anyone but society as a whole in this blanket treatment of how
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it's expected that a person should deal with pregnancy loss.
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Yeah, absolutely. And I can imagine that was incredibly difficult to have to
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share all of that news at once.
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And you talked about, you know, people have different experiences and make different
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choices about what they share, when they share things, and the impact of grief,
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of course, can affect people differently.
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What have you learned from people who have found their way to miscarriage movement
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about, you know, what they may need most and what are some different ways that that can look?
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I always come back to is the importance of believing a person about what that
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experience might feel like and mean to them.
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There's all of these sayings people love to offer up like, oh,
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well, at least, you know, you can get pregnant or at least it was early or whatever
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it is. First of all, if it starts with at least just hold back and don't say anything at all.
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The best way to support is to send a message or say out loud,
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you know, I'm thinking of you. I am here for you.
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How are you handling everything? It just gives somebody an opening without having a period at the end.
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Leaving it with a question mark leaves it in the person's hands that's going
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through the process. You also shouldn't have to explain why you're grieving
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or convince somebody that, you know, your loss was big enough or worthy enough to deserve support.
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So I'm also careful not to assume that everybody like needs the same thing.
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Might want to tell their whole story in detail. They might want to write an
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essay about it and somebody else might want nobody to ever know.
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And there's nothing wrong with either. But the bottom line is that both individuals
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with different preferences on how they want to share or if they want to share
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should feel supported in the decision to or to not. Absolutely. Absolutely.
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Pregnancy loss, of course, can be part of a longer fertility journey.
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And we see this a lot at Conceivabilities with intended parents who have maybe
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experienced loss on their path to choosing surrogacy. So there's often...
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Uncertainty, some fear, some anxiety about those next steps and trying again.
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Could you share a little about your own experience with trying again after loss?
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And what would you say, you know, any advice for better supporting others facing
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that same uncertainty about whether or how they'll become parents?
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I think that it is very individualized as most of this this process of grieving
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and coping and pushing forward is.
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But for me, what was most helpful after going through, you know,
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back-to-back losses, each pregnancy loss gave me almost less hope at first.
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At first, it just felt so devastating. How could this happen? This isn't normal.
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Pregnancy loss, despite it happening to one in four pregnancies,
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and that's not one in four people. That's one in four pregnancies.
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It's obviously very incredibly common, but back-to-back losses are a lot less common.
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They happen to about 1% to 2% of people conceiving. And so after that process,
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I felt in the beginning, like, how could this be happening to me?
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But I sought out fertility treatment to do what I could to optimize my chances
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of hopefully not having another pregnancy loss.
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And what helped me most mentally was to remind myself what was in and what was not in my control.
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There's so much when it comes to fertility that we like to take on as a burden
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emotionally and physically and mentally.
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But so little is really in our control when you look at the research,
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whether or not you drink one or two cups of coffee, whether you have a glass
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of wine, Whether you don't, whether you exercise, whether you exercise too much.
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I started digging into every little detail. Maybe I'm running too much.
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Maybe I'm running too fast. Maybe I should just walk.
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All of these things. And when I finally just kind of said to myself,
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you know what, this is not your fault.
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That was so freeing. And I think that was the one thing, if anything, that really helped me.
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When I finally got pregnant with my third child, I was at first,
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you know, incredibly scared.
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Like, how do I make sure that this isn't my third pregnancy loss in a row?
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But I remember walking into that ultrasound room and giving myself a mantra
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of, this is not in your control. This is not in your control.
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And that was just very freeing because I felt like no matter what happens,
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it's not my fault. It's not something I did or didn't do.
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Absolutely. I think that's such an important reminder.
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And I know a lot of our surrogates and intended parents feel that so intensely,
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just that desire to control things in this process that we can't ultimately control.
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So always a great reminder there.
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And in your experience, Jenn, you know, working with a fertility clinic and in
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others in your own platforms, you know, what role do you believe that fertility
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specialists, mental health professionals,
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other family building organizations can play in helping people feel supported
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as they're exploring their own family building options?
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I think they have a pivotal role and a giant responsibility to support the,
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hopeful or expecting parent in ways that I think a lot of times, you know, the.
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Patient doesn't experience the most emotional support.
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And I think that what I mean by that is just because a fertility clinic,
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for example, might be offering the service of here's,
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how we look at your blood work. Here's how we analyze your statistics, your chances.
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Here's what we recommend and here's why we recommend it. It's very science-based a lot of times.
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And I think that the number one need is that emotional layer of support.
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That's what I think is so wonderful about Conceivabilities is that Conceivabilities
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provides that layer of emotional support alongside other types of support.
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So without that emotional layer, It just is not sufficient enough, in my opinion.
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So I think that ensuring that fertility clinics especially are able to offer
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that as well, I think would significantly improve,
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the experience for patients. Okay, yeah, absolutely.
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I know the path to parenthood doesn't look the same for everyone.
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And within your platforms, can you talk a little bit about, you know,
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different family building paths you've seen others take?
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And how do you and how can we all create more open conversations about these
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different paths to family building without making options about what someone
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should choose or what's best or, you know, those preconceived notions?
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I think it starts with asking whether someone wants to talk about their situation
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and about their options before offering up opinions.
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Those unsolicited comments seem to come at all stages of life.
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And for some reason, the path to parenthood is one where there seems to be no,
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you know, no boundaries. So a person sharing their pain and their experience
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isn't necessarily asking the other person to, you know, solve it for them.
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And we also need to be incredibly careful with the word just.
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Just do IVF. Just use a surrogate.
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Because it makes something so personal and so incredibly complicated that,
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sounds so simple and so and that the other person knows what they're talking
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about which 99.99% of the time they really don't.
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So I think being open about the different paths is,
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it means making room for people's choices which might and very well possibly
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does include choices that we wouldn't make for ourselves so someone might want
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to explore treatment they might want to explore egg donation or surrogacy and
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they may need to take a break or decide you know not to pursue one path or another.
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And so the bottom line, though, is that they really deserve the respect without
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having to defend that decision to every single person in their life.
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Absolutely. What do you feel is important for people to understand about navigating
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some of those transitions, whether it's,
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you know, going from trying on your own to pursuing fertility treatment to considering
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egg donation or surrogacy?
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What have you learned just from your own work? I think you owe nobody an explanation.
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You don't have to explain why you're doing something, why you're not doing something.
00:18:02.181 --> 00:18:07.181
You don't have to explain your timeline. You don't have to explain even something
00:18:07.181 --> 00:18:09.361
so simple as, you know, if you,
00:18:09.881 --> 00:18:15.231
when you want to have another child or have your, have a child or what do you
00:18:15.231 --> 00:18:18.401
think about the, you know, you don't have to explain anything.
00:18:18.401 --> 00:18:22.051
And one piece of advice that I love from Dr.
00:18:22.051 --> 00:18:26.041
Laura Shaheen, who's an endocrinologist, fertility expert, is she always says
00:18:26.041 --> 00:18:33.573
that, she says, you can just say my, it is not up for discussion to disgust.
00:18:34.668 --> 00:18:39.608
And I think that's so powerful because it might sound kind of firm and harsh,
00:18:39.608 --> 00:18:43.088
but the questions that people are asking you, you know, maybe at Thanksgiving
00:18:43.088 --> 00:18:45.218
or Christmas, they are very personal.
00:18:45.218 --> 00:18:50.768
And so, therefore, I think that providing a very firm, boundary-setting answer,
00:18:51.368 --> 00:18:53.612
is powerful and sometimes necessary.
00:18:53.798 --> 00:18:58.848
Okay, so one of my favorite fertility experts is Dr.
00:18:58.848 --> 00:19:04.608
Laura Shaheen. She's a reproductive endocrinologist, and she speaks about how,
00:19:04.608 --> 00:19:09.428
you know, the casual questions that are often asked at Thanksgiving or Christmas are,
00:19:09.948 --> 00:19:16.775
very about, you know, family planning are incredibly invasive and oftentimes very inappropriate.
00:19:17.164 --> 00:19:21.005
And so I do love her suggestion of kind of how to handle it.
00:19:21.455 --> 00:19:28.176
And the way that she prefers to say it is, you know, reproduction is not small talk.
00:19:28.350 --> 00:19:31.619
And you can just end it there. You don't have to continue.
00:19:31.984 --> 00:19:34.958
I think they should get the memo at that point. And it's not,
00:19:34.958 --> 00:19:36.612
you know, being rude or anything.
00:19:36.943 --> 00:19:40.118
In fact, it's, you know, you're answering a very rude question in the first
00:19:40.118 --> 00:19:44.908
place. So I think that's important to lean into. And you do not owe anybody
00:19:44.908 --> 00:19:49.028
an explanation of your choices or even, you know, what you're going through
00:19:49.028 --> 00:19:50.748
unless you want to talk about it.
00:19:51.826 --> 00:19:57.078
Absolutely. I think it can be empowering to set those kinds of boundaries and
00:19:57.078 --> 00:20:01.708
to have something simple like that to say to shift the conversation,
00:20:01.708 --> 00:20:03.355
I think, is incredibly powerful.
00:20:04.651 --> 00:20:08.858
Jenn, since launching the miscarriage movement, can you talk about,
00:20:08.858 --> 00:20:13.968
you know, any shifts that you've noticed in how openly people might be discussing
00:20:13.968 --> 00:20:17.908
pregnancy loss and where might you say that we still have work to do?
00:20:18.348 --> 00:20:21.868
So I think that there's so much more work to do as a society.
00:20:22.208 --> 00:20:28.798
In the miscarriage space, we think we're being very loud and encouraging to
00:20:28.798 --> 00:20:34.943
be open and to provide resources for people going through pregnancy loss and infertility as well.
00:20:35.233 --> 00:20:38.496
But I think that as a society, there needs to be a shift.
00:20:38.809 --> 00:20:44.008
There needs to be so that your boss at work knows how to handle you saying,
00:20:44.008 --> 00:20:46.938
I need time off because I just gone through a pregnancy loss.
00:20:46.938 --> 00:20:50.028
And it should be inappropriate for you to share that if you'd like to share
00:20:50.028 --> 00:20:54.588
that. It's a human experience, just like, you know, someone in your family passing away.
00:20:54.948 --> 00:20:59.388
It's a type of grief that should be honored and respected on a society level.
00:20:59.661 --> 00:21:05.308
So I think that until we're at the place where that is as acceptable as any
00:21:05.308 --> 00:21:10.005
other kind of loss that occurs, you know, in life, then I think there's still work to be done.
00:21:10.516 --> 00:21:12.484
Right. I 100% agree.
00:21:13.024 --> 00:21:18.308
What would you say to someone listening who has experienced a loss but maybe
00:21:18.308 --> 00:21:22.067
hasn't felt comfortable sharing their story or is...
00:21:22.670 --> 00:21:26.409
Looking for resources but maybe isn't sure where to begin?
00:21:26.856 --> 00:21:31.169
First of all, you don't owe anyone your story in order for your loss to matter.
00:21:31.378 --> 00:21:35.401
If you keep it to yourself, it's just as important as if you decide to share
00:21:35.401 --> 00:21:40.973
it, as if you decide to tell, you know, your friends to post about it on social media.
00:21:41.333 --> 00:21:45.786
But you don't have to post about it or to, you know, to find some bigger purpose in it.
00:21:46.146 --> 00:21:49.501
So keeping it private doesn't mean that you're doing anything wrong or you're
00:21:49.501 --> 00:21:51.643
handling it wrong or that you're grieving wrong.
00:21:52.044 --> 00:21:55.911
If there's a part of you that wants support, but you don't know like where to
00:21:55.911 --> 00:22:00.811
begin, you can always just start small by telling someone in your life,
00:22:00.811 --> 00:22:05.111
you know, something happened that I'm having a hard time with and I don't want advice.
00:22:05.111 --> 00:22:08.506
I just want to be able to tell you what's going on and I'd like you to listen.
00:22:08.970 --> 00:22:12.421
But if you're also, if you're not ready to talk about it, I think that's completely
00:22:12.421 --> 00:22:19.470
okay. And my hope is simply that more people know that there are support.
00:22:20.241 --> 00:22:24.026
Organizations out there, their support platforms like Miscarriage Movement,
00:22:24.276 --> 00:22:29.053
and that there are people who do take that experience incredibly seriously whenever
00:22:29.251 --> 00:22:33.598
that person might be ready to reach out for support. That's great. That's great to hear.
00:22:34.214 --> 00:22:39.809
What are some meaningful ways that you've seen people recognize Pregnancy and
00:22:39.809 --> 00:22:44.029
Infant Loss Awareness Month or support others they care about?
00:22:44.029 --> 00:22:47.426
And how have you recognized this time of year?
00:22:47.728 --> 00:22:52.645
I've checked in with my friends and family who I know have had a loss.
00:22:52.772 --> 00:22:57.669
I honor my own pregnancy losses as well. As I mentioned, October 15th with a
00:22:57.669 --> 00:23:02.719
wave of light. I think that's a very simple and uniting way for everybody who's
00:23:02.719 --> 00:23:07.325
experienced a pregnancy loss to kind of come together and honor that experience.
00:23:07.540 --> 00:23:12.209
If you know someone who's experienced a loss, checking in in a private,
00:23:12.209 --> 00:23:18.179
thoughtful way can be so much more meaningful than a generic like awareness
00:23:18.179 --> 00:23:20.269
post you could say something like i,
00:23:20.769 --> 00:23:25.759
i know this month might bring up a lot for you i'm thinking of you you don't
00:23:25.759 --> 00:23:30.936
have to respond if if they shared a name or maybe something more specific like a date.
00:23:31.711 --> 00:23:35.729
It's important for you to remember that information i think if they're sharing
00:23:35.729 --> 00:23:40.146
it because it's so important to them so keeping track of it like in your calendar app
00:23:40.587 --> 00:23:44.279
and just sending a text message or a call giving them a call and just saying,
00:23:44.279 --> 00:23:47.036
you know, I know this day brings up a lot for you. I'm here for you.
00:23:47.464 --> 00:23:50.851
And follow their lead on whether or not they do want to talk about something.
00:23:51.263 --> 00:23:53.469
Those are great, great pieces of advice there.
00:23:54.729 --> 00:23:59.119
I know sometimes remembering those dates, there can be some fear,
00:23:59.119 --> 00:24:03.145
I think, in reaching out, you know, not wanting to bring up something that might,
00:24:03.986 --> 00:24:08.969
cause discomfort or cause more grief and I think that's probably also a misconception
00:24:08.969 --> 00:24:13.584
that you have seen too just that bringing it up might.
00:24:14.289 --> 00:24:16.469
Bring up harder feelings when
00:24:16.829 --> 00:24:20.786
when that grief is there and so recognizing it can actually be the more,
00:24:21.378 --> 00:24:26.749
meaningful choice rather than avoiding talking about it yes absolutely and the
00:24:26.749 --> 00:24:30.519
goal I think is to just to help somebody feel like they're being thought of
00:24:30.519 --> 00:24:35.432
and their experience is being honored and remembered without like putting them on the spot.
00:24:35.757 --> 00:24:38.409
And if you're, you know, if you're sharing awareness content,
00:24:38.409 --> 00:24:42.419
always be careful to not reveal someone else's experience without making sure
00:24:42.419 --> 00:24:46.879
that they give you permission to do so. Absolutely. Absolutely.
00:24:47.402 --> 00:24:52.419
Well, Jenn, is there anything more that you would like to share about the mother
00:24:52.419 --> 00:24:59.145
chapter or the miscarriage movement just in how you support others through those platforms.
00:24:59.758 --> 00:25:05.069
Yeah, I mean, you can find us on Instagram. We also have our own websites, both.
00:25:05.369 --> 00:25:08.309
So it's themotherchapter.com and miscarriage.com.
00:25:08.674 --> 00:25:15.054
And on both platforms, we publish essays from real women going through,
00:25:15.606 --> 00:25:19.629
you know, miscarriage, surrogacy, pregnancy loss.
00:25:19.629 --> 00:25:23.929
And we're always looking for, you know, more people to come forward with their
00:25:23.929 --> 00:25:26.649
stories, and they can do so anonymously.
00:25:26.649 --> 00:25:31.129
They absolutely do not have to share their story with, you know, using their name.
00:25:31.129 --> 00:25:33.559
They can use a, you know, a different name if they would like,
00:25:33.559 --> 00:25:36.899
but these stories serve such an important purpose.
00:25:36.899 --> 00:25:42.209
Not only is it so therapeutic as any, you know, windows to journal and to write,
00:25:42.209 --> 00:25:46.395
but also to provide proof to someone.
00:25:47.049 --> 00:25:51.269
Searching that they're not alone, that my experience is here for you to read
00:25:51.269 --> 00:25:55.573
because I don't want you to go through something similar and feel like you're the only one.
00:25:56.183 --> 00:26:00.639
And so across both platforms, my hope is that someone reads something and thinks,
00:26:00.842 --> 00:26:02.996
wow, that's what I've been trying to say.
00:26:04.165 --> 00:26:07.520
But also, you don't have to share your experience to be part of our community.
00:26:07.520 --> 00:26:13.060
So please, you know, reach out, even if it's just to share something. That's great.
00:26:13.640 --> 00:26:19.440
I can completely understand that in the midst of grief or experiencing an unexpected
00:26:19.440 --> 00:26:24.700
blast, that reading someone else's story and about how they've processed that
00:26:24.700 --> 00:26:26.400
and sought support, that that can.
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:30.909
Help someone feel less isolated in that experience.
00:26:31.780 --> 00:26:38.260
So thank you for creating these platforms and facilitating this community to
00:26:38.260 --> 00:26:39.924
help people feel less alone.
00:26:40.371 --> 00:26:44.940
Is there anything else, Jenn, that you would like to share or any other thoughts
00:26:44.940 --> 00:26:51.383
about your own experience or words of wisdom for anyone else who may have experienced loss?
00:26:51.935 --> 00:26:58.600
Yeah, I would just say that, you know, life can be very difficult and pregnancy
00:26:58.600 --> 00:27:04.691
loss and infertility is one of the most painful journeys to go through.
00:27:05.178 --> 00:27:09.410
And there's no guarantee that you're going to come out on the right side of
00:27:09.410 --> 00:27:13.079
it at the end, which is also incredibly painful to experience.
00:27:13.543 --> 00:27:18.310
But, you know, miracles happen every day. Throughout the process,
00:27:18.310 --> 00:27:22.880
you reaching out to support platforms and hearing stories,
00:27:23.650 --> 00:27:29.013
of success is a wonderful way to keep your spirits up and to remind you that,
00:27:29.339 --> 00:27:32.444
you know, as arduous as the journey is, there's always,
00:27:33.200 --> 00:27:39.550
you know, another day to put the rifle forward mentally and provide yourself
00:27:39.550 --> 00:27:42.410
with that, you know, positive attitude and support.
00:27:42.410 --> 00:27:44.530
That can help you carry through.
00:27:44.768 --> 00:27:50.020
That's wonderful. Thank you so much for sharing your story and helping us make
00:27:50.020 --> 00:27:53.927
room for a conversation that definitely should happen more often.
00:27:54.810 --> 00:28:00.526
And just in closing, I want to share that pregnancy and infant loss and infertility,
00:28:00.526 --> 00:28:03.267
the many different paths people take to build their families,
00:28:03.726 --> 00:28:07.916
are obviously very deeply personal experiences that can be very emotional.
00:28:07.916 --> 00:28:13.560
So everyone deserves compassion, understanding, and support wherever they are in their journey.
00:28:13.914 --> 00:28:18.336
And Jenn, you've definitely shed light on so many different aspects of all of
00:28:18.336 --> 00:28:22.343
that in our conversation today. So thank you again for your time.
00:28:22.801 --> 00:28:27.576
Thank you so much for having me. It means so much to be able to talk about pregnancy
00:28:27.576 --> 00:28:31.786
loss and my own experience. And I also hope that someone listening can feel
00:28:31.786 --> 00:28:34.713
a little less alone because of it. Absolutely.
00:28:34.910 --> 00:28:36.309
Thank you so much again, Jenn.
00:28:36.675 --> 00:28:41.256
Nazca always shares an aha moment at the end of each podcast episode that she
00:28:41.256 --> 00:28:45.197
does. And I wanted to share my own today after my conversation with Jenn.
00:28:45.905 --> 00:28:53.036
I think it's incredible to hear just how important community has been in Jenn's
00:28:53.036 --> 00:28:58.236
own journey and experiences with loss where she has sought that out.
00:28:58.236 --> 00:29:05.118
She's created that for others to help people feel less of their experiences of loss.
00:29:05.478 --> 00:29:08.436
So I just want to highlight that.
00:29:09.156 --> 00:29:14.726
And also highlight that great advice she shared about kind of letting go of
00:29:14.726 --> 00:29:21.425
that need to control things in the process and accepting that we don't often have control,
00:29:22.136 --> 00:29:24.236
in our family building and fertility journeys.
00:29:24.236 --> 00:29:28.676
And yet there is still hope, there is still community.
00:29:29.116 --> 00:29:34.046
There are others who've been through what we're going through who are there
00:29:34.046 --> 00:29:37.261
to help us if we know how to look in the right places.
00:29:37.760 --> 00:29:43.926
And I hope that those listening will seek out Jenn and her platforms if needed
00:29:43.926 --> 00:29:46.947
for that extra support along their own journeys.
00:29:47.493 --> 00:29:50.012
So again, thank you so much, everyone, for listening today.
00:29:52.364 --> 00:29:57.207
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