Mark Stice - San Isabel National Forest - Colorado

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Thousands of people have mysteriously vanished in america's wilderness join
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us as we dive into the deep end of the
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unexplainable and try to piece together what happened you are
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listening to locations unknown.
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Thank you.
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What's up, everybody, and welcome back to another episode of
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Locations Unknown.
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I'm your co-host, Joey.
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Rottling with me, as always, is a guy who loves
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recording on Saturdays because of new babies and being tired,
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Mike Vandebogard.
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Oh, thank you, Joe, and thank you to all of
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our amazing listeners for tuning in.
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Joe and I are happy to be back.
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We're recording on a Saturday morning, something new for us,
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not late night during the week when we're tired. It's
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very weird. Yeah, hopefully you notice a little more pep
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in our step today. Yeah. Before we get going, I'd
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like to get some Patreon shout outs. It's been a
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bit of time since we recorded last. So thank you
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to Jen Deming, Kathleen Robers, Dawn Parker, Cody Welsh, and
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Yaffa Chudnow, if that is.
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Your real name. Yaffa Chudnow.
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I'm going to do a little research on that while
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we're also doing research on the show.
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So you want to call the show. You can leave
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a voicemail. You can text the show. Just call 208-391-6913.
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We're probably due for another voicemail episode here soon. So
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stay on the lookout for that and become a Patreon
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member or a YouTube member if you'd like to listen
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to that type of episode. We've got some other cool
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podcasts on the network, Off the Trails, Who Runs This Park,
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Crime Off the Grid, and Relish. And Joe and I
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are meeting some other people. Maybe there might be some
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new additions to the network here in the coming weeks.
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We also can't talk really about it, but something we
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had thought might happen years ago, all of a sudden,
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out of nowhere, is back on.
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It would be really big for us. That's all I'm
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going to tease it right now.
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Maybe we'll mention more of it in a Patreon episode,
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but it could be a big thing.
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We should talk about it in a Patreon episode, and
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then if you want to hear about it, you've got
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to become a Patreon member.
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Why don't we talk about it in a patron episode?
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Because this has been on the back burner for years now. Yeah,
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why not just say what it is? Because it doesn't
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matter anymore.
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Yeah.
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If it happens, it'll be really big for us. If
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it doesn't, nothing changes.
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It doesn't want to keep doing what we're doing. But
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if you want to hear about that, you're going to
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have to join Patreon.
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Yeah. Sorry.
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At the.
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a hundred dollar a month tier no just kidding i
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don't think we have that tier we do not have
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that we should make a tier like that and just
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offer ridiculous stuff right like we'll fly to your house
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and do an episode after six months like we'll do
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a we'll do a ten thousand dollar tier where we
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will fly.
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Joe and i will fly all of our studio to
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your house and record an episode live in your living room.
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For 10 grand yeah I feel like we'd lose money. Probably.
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Shipping all this stuff. We'd lose money. We're like, damn it.
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We can't even do that, right? We can't even do it.
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Outside of that, what's been going on? I follow you
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on Instagram. You've been all over at music festivals. Music festivals, Italy.
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Italy?
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Yeah, I've been everywhere. It's been a very busy last
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few months. Joe's had a much more exciting month and
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a half than I have.
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I had like all my babies in my 20s. Yes.
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And I had six like in a row.
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So yeah, I'll just briefly, for those of you that
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don't know, we were off a little longer than we
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expected because my wife gave birth to our third child,
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a boy. Only problem was he was about three months early.
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So he, he wanted his location known now.
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Yes. Sooner than later. He did not give you his itinerary. No.
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So he has been in the NICU will remain in
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the NICU, hopefully no longer than Halloween, but he's doing
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really good.
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So probably come home sooner than that, but we.
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Were off a little longer, just, While all that happened
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and Joe was busy doing other stuff anyways, having fun.
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Yeah, yeah. I don't even want to talk about it.
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What were you doing? Well, I was in Venice and
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Pompeii and Rome. What were you doing? In the emergency room.
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It's all good, though. Other than that, not much going on. Nope, nope.
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All righty, everybody.
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Let's gear up and get out to explore Locations Unknown.
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September 17, 2013. Experienced Colorado hiker sets out alone on
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a five-day backpacking trip into Southern Colony Basin. He was
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prepared to climb some of the rugged 14ers of the
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Crestone group. He leaves no detailed itinerary, carries no cell
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phone or emergency beacon, and never returns home. Searchers find
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his vehicle at the trailhead and locate his camps. After
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a grueling eight-day through snow, ice, and dangerous alpine terrain,
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they suspended the search. Join us this week as we
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investigate the disappearance of Mark Stice.
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I'm sloppy editing there. No, it's missing a word. No, no, no, no, no. Oh,
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that one, yes. After a grueling... But then I did.
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No, it says after a grueling eight days through snow,
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and I just left off the S because I can't read.
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Well, you left off the search part. After an eight...
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After a.
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Grueling eight days of search. No, a grueling eight days
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through snow, ice, and dangerous alpine terrain, they suspended the search.
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If I just said days instead of eight day.
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Oh, okay. I guess that's why like, and it's there.
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It's right. I just can't read. It's been too long. Oh,
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my God.
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Every time I make a mistake and I have to finish,
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it's so mental. Because I'm just like, oh, I don't
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want to rerecord. I mean, yeah, we've never rerecorded.
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But we did one. Oh, we did one. One time
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it was so awful. Yeah. It was so awful we
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couldn't use it. And for those listening, you know the
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bar is very low. The bar is so low. It
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was really bad.
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It was like not even funny. It was just like, okay, this, no.
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Just start over. Just throw it in the garbage.
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Yeah, that was a one time. And it was only
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one minute in. And that one I don't even think
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was the summary. It was the intro.
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Yeah. So like we literally like, all right, just reset.
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This isn't even starting over. Absolutely. Okay.
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Anyway, this location today is San Isabel National Forest in
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Southern Colorado. The sublocations are the Sangre de Cristo Wilderness.
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And some interesting facts about this area. It means blood
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in Christ in Spanish. Named in 1719 by the Spanish
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explorer Antonio Valverde, Cosio reportedly moved by red alpine glow
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on snow-covered summits at sunrise. The Crestones were the last
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major Colorado 14ers to be climbed. Albert Ellingwood made the
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first ascents of Crestone Peak, Crestone Needle, and Kit Carson
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Peak in 1916. The Ellingwood Arte on Crestone Needle bears
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his name. and is one of the deadliest routes in
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the CCSAR mission statistics. The helicopters that flew the Stice
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search came from the HAATS in Gypsum, Colorado, the U.S.
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Army's only high-altitude helicopter training school. So that's kind of nice.
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That is like right nearby where you go missing.
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Every U.S.
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Military helicopter pilot who deploys to Afghanistan or other high-altitude
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theaters typically trains there. The pilots searching for Mark were
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among the world's most experienced high-altitude rotary wing crews.
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So, like, he had everything working in his favor.
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Yeah.
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The hydrological divide between the Arkansas River watershed and Rio
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Grande watershed runs right through Crestone Peak Summit. Water from
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the east side flows to the Gulf of Mexico via
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the Mississippi. Water from the west side flows to the
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Gulf of Mexico via Rio Grande through New Mexico and Texas.
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That's really funny. It's, like, dead right in the center. Yeah,
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right in the middle.
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A little in-depth description of the climate. The high Sangre
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de Cristo range sits at the meeting point of two
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very different weather regimens. Dry high desert air pushing up
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out of the San Luis Valley from the west and
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moisture continental air spilling in from the plains to the
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east in the peaks themselves are the wall that those
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systems collide against, which is why the range generates its
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own weather with almost no warnings. The climate above 12,000
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feet is alpine and unforgiving in every season. Summers are
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brief and cool, winters are long and severe, and even
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in the warmest months overnight, temperatures at the lakes and
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above can fall below freezing. Summer days are typically clear
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and calm through mid-morning, but give way to violent afternoon thunderstorms,
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which build over the peaks almost daily and in July
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and August and drive climbers off the summits with lightning, hail,
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and sudden temperature drops. By mid-September, when Mark was on
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the mountain, the range is in its shoulder season, or
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straddle season. The daily thunderstorm pattern is fading, but the
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first true winter storm of the year begins to sweep
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in from the northwest, and that transition from summer to
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winter can happen in a single afternoon.
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That would be really annoying. Yeah, it would.
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This is a big argument in my household. I don't
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like fall.
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Oh, really? I don't. I don't.
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I understand why people like fall, but I love summer storms.
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So much. It's just the end of summer to me. Okay.
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So spring is one of my favorite straddle seasons. Yeah. See, I,
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I like the beginning of fall.
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So like fall in Wisconsin still sometimes feels like an
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extension of summer, but it's like less humid.
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See, that's the end of spring. Ah, spring seems more
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rainy and cold. It's all new life.
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Yeah.
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I do like, uh, hoodie weather though.
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Yeah.
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That's fall. Yeah.
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And like, you know, like football is just starting and
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I don't care about October fest.
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I don't really care about October fest either. I just,
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I just, I just want to be in here. Are
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there any cool music fests that start in the fall?
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Uh, no, they all go down where it's warm. People
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want to be outside and dance. All right.
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Anyway, so you're wrong.
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Do you remember anyway, did you ever, when I lived
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in Bayview, they used to have a festival in January
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called Mitten Fest.
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Yeah. You know, I never went to that because it's
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outside and it's stupid.
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I went to it one year and it was the
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most miserable thing I've ever done in my life. It
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was like two degrees out and like everything was outside
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and it was just dumb. The only way to not
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get cold was to just get super drunk and just
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not feel the cold.
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Yeah.
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That's why we drink so much because it's so terrible
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here for six months out of the year.
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Yes. And taxes are high.
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Snow is possible in any month at any altitude at
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that altitude. And by mid to late September, fresh snow
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on the summits is expected rather than surprising. The peaks
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can pick up several inches to a foot of snow
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from a single early season storm, glazing the rock with
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ice and turning routine scrambling into technical hazardous ground. I
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bet people are going to think we cut there because
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I just so abruptly changed back to the script.
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Yeah, right. I was just over talking about it because
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it made me sad. Yeah.
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Above treeline, the wind is nearly constant and often severe.
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30 to 50 mile an hour gusts are routine on
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the ridges and a system moving through can bring sustained
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hurricane force wind at the summits, driving wind chills down
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even when the thermometer reads well above freezing.
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That just sounds awful. Yeah.
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Once the weather closes in on the terrain, visibility can
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collapse to a few feet in minutes. Snow, cloud, and
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blowing rhyme obscuring the trail markers and the route-finding landmarks
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that a climber depends on to descend safely, which in
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the Crestones is exactly the moment when wrong turns become
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a fatal one.
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Mark Stice.
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disappeared in the Sangre de Cristo range of Southern Colorado.
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It's one of the narrowest and most abrupt mountain ranges
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in the lower 48. Oh, real quickly.
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Yes.
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00:12:30.929 --> 00:12:33.070
We just had a new term that probably people haven't
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heard of or most rhyme.
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Rhyme. So rhyme is there any reason for it?
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It's a white rough layer of ice that forms when
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super cooled below freezing water droplets and fog or cloud
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freeze instantly upon contact with cold objects.
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Oh, it sounds awful. There is a reason for it.
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There is. It's so bad. That's your new fact for
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the day, listeners.
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Rhyme. We need something on the soundboard for when we
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00:12:57.769 --> 00:12:58.409
learn something new.
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00:12:58.690 --> 00:13:00.629
The more you know. Yeah, something like that.
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00:13:02.049 --> 00:13:05.110
So a wall of rock that rises nearly 7,000 vertical
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00:13:05.169 --> 00:13:08.250
feet and only two to three horizontal miles above the
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valley floor.
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00:13:08.769 --> 00:13:11.490
So that's basically a wall mountain. A wall of rock.
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00:13:11.610 --> 00:13:12.350
A wall of rock.
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00:13:14.620 --> 00:13:17.419
The heart of the search area is a deep glacially
264
00:13:17.500 --> 00:13:21.240
carved alpine basin ringed on three sides by 14,000 foot peaks.
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00:13:22.759 --> 00:13:25.620
with two icy alpine lakes at its head and a
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00:13:25.799 --> 00:13:29.610
thin sub-alpine forest thinning into open tundra as the ground
267
00:13:29.669 --> 00:13:33.629
climbs towards the summit. Above about 12,000 feet, the country
268
00:13:33.649 --> 00:13:37.370
becomes entirely treeless. Bare rock, tundra, scattered talus with no
269
00:13:37.450 --> 00:13:40.389
cover for weather, no shelter, nothing to break line of
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00:13:40.450 --> 00:13:43.450
sight or slow a person losing their way in a whiteout.
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So that's where you just got to hunker down when
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you can't see or you're going to miss all the cairns.
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Or just turn around.
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00:13:49.000 --> 00:13:53.100
Yeah. The peaks surrounding him are steep, cliff-broken, and cut
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00:13:53.139 --> 00:13:55.899
by narrow gullies and exposed ridges, the kind of terrain
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00:13:55.919 --> 00:13:59.139
that requires scrambling and careful route-finding rather than simple hiking,
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00:13:59.299 --> 00:14:01.779
where a wrong turn or on a descent can cliff
278
00:14:01.820 --> 00:14:05.750
a climber out onto unsurvivable ground. The rock itself is
279
00:14:05.789 --> 00:14:09.549
a rare, knobby conglomerate found almost nowhere else in Colorado,
280
00:14:09.629 --> 00:14:12.789
riddled with slots, chimneys, and hidden voids between embedded boulders
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00:14:12.830 --> 00:14:15.889
that can swallow a fallen body and conceal it within
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00:14:16.009 --> 00:14:20.450
feet of searchers. Established trails and reconstructed summit routes exist
283
00:14:20.549 --> 00:14:23.500
in Southern Colony Basin, but upper climbing routes can still
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00:14:23.539 --> 00:14:28.200
require exposed scrambling and difficult navigation. Cell phone reception is unreliable,
285
00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:31.559
so hikers should not depend on cell phone connection. And
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00:14:31.779 --> 00:14:35.080
overlaying all of it is the weather. Snow, freezing temperatures,
287
00:14:35.120 --> 00:14:38.200
and violent storms are possible any month at this altitude,
288
00:14:38.320 --> 00:14:40.700
and mid-September, when Mark was on the mountain, is exactly
289
00:14:40.740 --> 00:14:42.700
the season when the first serious winter storms of the
290
00:14:42.720 --> 00:14:44.039
year begin to sweep through the range.
291
00:14:44.750 --> 00:14:45.309
There's always a.
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00:14:46.100 --> 00:14:48.500
every one of these disappearances, if you're a long time
293
00:14:48.539 --> 00:14:51.279
listening to the show, it really, a lot of it
294
00:14:51.299 --> 00:14:54.679
boils down to someone hiking or climbing in a location
295
00:14:54.759 --> 00:14:56.019
really at the wrong time of the year.
296
00:14:56.100 --> 00:14:57.700
Yeah. It's like perfect storm stuff. Yeah.
297
00:14:57.759 --> 00:15:00.830
Like I, whatever about this location, I would just say
298
00:15:00.889 --> 00:15:04.610
that maybe like June or July would be a better
299
00:15:04.889 --> 00:15:06.610
month to hike it or just.
300
00:15:06.529 --> 00:15:10.149
Go into the, the, the seasons that aren't treacherous. Yeah.
301
00:15:10.230 --> 00:15:12.899
Obviously snow can happen anytime at that high up, but
302
00:15:13.480 --> 00:15:15.779
why risk a major winter storm?
303
00:15:16.730 --> 00:15:18.309
If you could just do it a month earlier.
304
00:15:18.330 --> 00:15:18.409
Yeah.
305
00:15:19.250 --> 00:15:21.750
That's just my thought on it. Well, we'll find out,
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00:15:21.789 --> 00:15:22.110
I'm sure.
307
00:15:22.750 --> 00:15:22.929
Why?
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00:15:22.950 --> 00:15:26.049
Because I sometimes am a sucker for making things a
309
00:15:26.070 --> 00:15:27.220
little bit more difficult to.
310
00:15:27.169 --> 00:15:30.159
Go through them. I mean, this sounds difficult enough in
311
00:15:30.220 --> 00:15:34.299
clear blue sky. Yeah. Why add a terrible winter storm
312
00:15:34.360 --> 00:15:36.690
onto it? You know what, Mike?
313
00:15:36.789 --> 00:15:39.950
It brings up an even larger philosophical question. Why climb
314
00:15:39.990 --> 00:15:41.129
mountains at all?
315
00:15:41.190 --> 00:15:41.570
You're right.
316
00:15:42.649 --> 00:15:45.059
Like there's really, if you break it down, it might
317
00:15:45.100 --> 00:15:47.580
upset people. There's zero need to do that anymore.
318
00:15:47.899 --> 00:15:50.039
Yeah. Like for any reason.
319
00:15:50.460 --> 00:15:53.000
I can't think of a real good reason why. I mean,
320
00:15:53.580 --> 00:15:55.419
I know why I like going hiking.
321
00:15:55.710 --> 00:15:57.490
Oh, yeah. I love it. And I'm going to continue
322
00:15:57.509 --> 00:15:59.909
to do it. It's a way to recharge and disconnect.
323
00:16:00.009 --> 00:16:03.919
But yeah, you're right. I mean... some people just are
324
00:16:03.940 --> 00:16:04.600
thrill seekers.
325
00:16:04.820 --> 00:16:04.940
Yeah.
326
00:16:04.960 --> 00:16:06.279
And like the rush of climbing.
327
00:16:06.299 --> 00:16:09.730
Yeah. And some people love climbing in treacherous conditions, probably
328
00:16:09.769 --> 00:16:13.009
just like hiking and backpacking deep into a park is
329
00:16:13.309 --> 00:16:15.460
more of like a meditation type thing.
330
00:16:15.820 --> 00:16:18.220
It clears your mind. Yeah, I do.
331
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:18.700
I know.
332
00:16:19.100 --> 00:16:20.820
That's why I can speak on how dumb it is.
333
00:16:21.100 --> 00:16:22.850
Cause I'm like, you get up there and I'm so excited.
334
00:16:22.870 --> 00:16:25.139
I'm like, I did it! Yeah, I mean, I like
335
00:16:25.159 --> 00:16:28.409
the hikes we did that were more technical and treacherous. Yeah.
336
00:16:28.490 --> 00:16:31.649
That was fun. I'm not saying I don't enjoy that feeling,
337
00:16:31.690 --> 00:16:32.669
especially once you're done.
338
00:16:33.129 --> 00:16:36.009
Yes. That you, like, can kick back, like, ah, I
339
00:16:36.029 --> 00:16:38.450
did it. Yep, exactly. That is a good feeling. It's
340
00:16:38.470 --> 00:16:39.509
bragging rights. Yes.
341
00:16:40.210 --> 00:16:42.789
So I'll get a tattoo for doing Kilimanjaro.
342
00:16:42.809 --> 00:16:44.590
I don't know what. I might just do, like, the coordinates.
343
00:16:45.210 --> 00:16:46.950
There you go. I don't know. Or I just won't
344
00:16:46.970 --> 00:16:49.889
do anything. Right on your forehead. A QR code. Yeah,
345
00:16:49.909 --> 00:16:54.730
a QR code on my face. Yeah. For $ 10 billion,
346
00:16:54.769 --> 00:16:55.850
I'll do that. $ 10 billion?
347
00:16:55.970 --> 00:16:57.769
Yep, $ 10 billion. If you give me $ 10 billion, I'll
348
00:16:57.789 --> 00:16:59.190
put a QR code on my face. Because then if
349
00:16:59.230 --> 00:17:00.570
anyone makes fun of me, they'll be like, you know what?
350
00:17:01.009 --> 00:17:03.429
I got $ 10 billion for this. And it'll be a
351
00:17:03.509 --> 00:17:05.690
link to a website of how I'm spending my money.
352
00:17:05.710 --> 00:17:07.410
Hey, after you get the $ 10 billion, just pay to
353
00:17:07.430 --> 00:17:08.289
have the tattoo removed.
354
00:17:08.970 --> 00:17:10.869
I would even, if the stipulation was you have to
355
00:17:10.890 --> 00:17:13.069
leave it on forever, like, okay. I don't ever have
356
00:17:13.109 --> 00:17:14.930
to work or do anything ever again.
357
00:17:15.269 --> 00:17:17.329
Not to go too far down this tangent, but what
358
00:17:17.490 --> 00:17:20.309
if the requirement was your entire face had to be
359
00:17:20.329 --> 00:17:24.069
the QR code? So like even eyelids, like when you're closed,
360
00:17:24.150 --> 00:17:25.390
would be part of the QR code.
361
00:17:26.089 --> 00:17:28.880
Lips, nose. There is a dollar amount. Yeah.
362
00:17:30.079 --> 00:17:32.700
Because I would look at that like taking a hit
363
00:17:32.779 --> 00:17:34.119
for generational wealth.
364
00:17:34.279 --> 00:17:37.059
Yeah. Like, I don't know. Like you are going to
365
00:17:37.160 --> 00:17:40.009
look ridiculous to the day you die. But like $ 500 billion.
366
00:17:40.029 --> 00:17:40.150
Okay.
367
00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:44.599
And then like the year later, AI takes over. There's
368
00:17:44.660 --> 00:17:45.279
no economy.
369
00:17:45.299 --> 00:17:49.369
And it was pointless.
370
00:17:49.410 --> 00:17:52.509
Money's not worth anything. That would happen to me. I'd
371
00:17:52.549 --> 00:17:55.190
be like, all right. I somehow tricked everyone to give
372
00:17:55.230 --> 00:17:57.480
me all this money. That's not worthless. And then the
373
00:17:57.579 --> 00:18:00.380
economy just flips over and no one needs money anymore.
374
00:18:01.079 --> 00:18:03.339
Well, hopefully the technology would be there to have it removed.
375
00:18:03.380 --> 00:18:06.180
Yeah, it probably wouldn't. All right. You want to tell
376
00:18:06.220 --> 00:18:08.750
us about Mark, Mike, Mark? Okay. You don't want to
377
00:18:08.769 --> 00:18:11.170
know how to travel safely. Oh, did I skip that?
378
00:18:11.369 --> 00:18:13.119
We don't have to do it. Let's skip it.
379
00:18:13.309 --> 00:18:16.269
Just leave an itinerary. Let people know where you are.
380
00:18:16.329 --> 00:18:17.069
Don't go off trail.
381
00:18:17.309 --> 00:18:22.410
Okay. There you go. That's pretty much what it is.
382
00:18:22.750 --> 00:18:25.009
Listen to one of our previous episodes. Yeah, carry a beacon.
383
00:18:25.529 --> 00:18:26.210
Just rent one.
384
00:18:26.410 --> 00:18:29.089
Carry a personal locator beacon, a satellite phone.
385
00:18:29.490 --> 00:18:31.630
Know how to use a map and compass. Tell someone
386
00:18:31.650 --> 00:18:32.230
where you're going.
387
00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:35.779
Listen to all previous of our episodes. Sign the trail registers.
388
00:18:36.359 --> 00:18:38.700
Stay on trail. If the weather's bad, turn around.
389
00:18:38.960 --> 00:18:39.440
There you go.
390
00:18:39.500 --> 00:18:41.400
We should have a button where we record how to
391
00:18:41.880 --> 00:18:43.480
do it safely and just hit it and sit back.
392
00:18:43.759 --> 00:18:46.619
Right. That's the same thing every time. Yes. All right, Mike,
393
00:18:46.640 --> 00:18:47.940
tell us about Mark. Okay.
394
00:18:48.359 --> 00:18:53.450
Our subject of tonight's case is Mark Samuel Albert Stice.
395
00:18:53.589 --> 00:18:58.500
He was born April 15th of 1977. The date missing's
396
00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:02.460
a little unsure because he didn't really leave an itinerary.
397
00:19:03.480 --> 00:19:05.559
The date a lot of people use is September 17th
398
00:19:05.579 --> 00:19:08.220
of 2013. This was the last known date that he
399
00:19:08.259 --> 00:19:10.930
was going to be entering South Colony Basin, and he
400
00:19:10.950 --> 00:19:15.430
was due home on the 21st, and obviously reported overdue
401
00:19:15.730 --> 00:19:18.210
the 22nd. Remains have not been found. He was a
402
00:19:18.509 --> 00:19:22.329
male age 36, he was six foot two, roughly about
403
00:19:22.329 --> 00:19:28.029
220 pounds. He had brown hair, brown eyes, other characteristics.
404
00:19:28.069 --> 00:19:31.650
He typically wore glasses, which a coworker had pointed out
405
00:19:31.730 --> 00:19:35.799
later in the search and rescue operation. No other really
406
00:19:35.990 --> 00:19:39.539
reported distinguishing marks like tattoos or scars or QR codes
407
00:19:39.619 --> 00:19:42.500
on his face. Pretty just normal looking guy. We got
408
00:19:42.519 --> 00:19:44.059
a picture of him up on the big screen here.
409
00:19:44.079 --> 00:19:48.059
If you're watching the video, pretty typical 36 year old male.
410
00:19:48.079 --> 00:19:48.180
Yeah.
411
00:19:49.799 --> 00:19:49.910
So.
412
00:19:50.400 --> 00:19:52.700
Nothing wrong with that clothing and gear.
413
00:19:52.720 --> 00:19:55.059
He was last seen in his mother said that he
414
00:19:55.099 --> 00:19:57.140
may have been wearing a blue jacket and carrying a
415
00:19:57.200 --> 00:20:00.750
dark blue backpack. The earliest bulletins from the search and
416
00:20:00.789 --> 00:20:05.150
rescue operation said he may have been carrying a rope, which,
417
00:20:05.730 --> 00:20:08.480
you know, would have been kind of an unusual item
418
00:20:08.519 --> 00:20:11.640
for a solo trip to this area. So that may
419
00:20:11.680 --> 00:20:14.700
have suggested he was planning on doing some rappelling, but
420
00:20:15.359 --> 00:20:18.200
to tell you the truth, almost every hike I've gone on,
421
00:20:18.319 --> 00:20:22.309
I've brought some rope with, because you never know if
422
00:20:22.390 --> 00:20:24.029
something goes south, you might need that.
423
00:20:24.210 --> 00:20:26.230
That's where like, This is the thing that we was
424
00:20:26.269 --> 00:20:27.619
talking about. Like we get made for like, you don't
425
00:20:27.650 --> 00:20:27.890
need that.
426
00:20:27.910 --> 00:20:29.039
It's like, yeah, you're right. I don't.
427
00:20:29.519 --> 00:20:29.680
Yeah.
428
00:20:29.700 --> 00:20:31.720
And you like, don't need to wear a seatbelt either,
429
00:20:32.460 --> 00:20:34.119
but you know, when you do need it, when you
430
00:20:34.140 --> 00:20:34.880
get in an accident.
431
00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:35.200
Yeah.
432
00:20:35.279 --> 00:20:38.400
So if I ever had gone lost and they found
433
00:20:38.420 --> 00:20:40.549
my backpack, they would find all kinds of stuff in
434
00:20:40.569 --> 00:20:42.849
it that, Oh, this guy must've planned on doing this.
435
00:20:42.930 --> 00:20:45.549
But a lot of times it's just in case. Yeah.
436
00:20:45.910 --> 00:20:47.970
And rope is one of those things. Bring it.
437
00:20:47.970 --> 00:20:49.750
I'm not saying bring like a hundred feet of line
438
00:20:49.789 --> 00:20:52.579
with you, but maybe have 15 feet of rope.
439
00:20:52.650 --> 00:20:53.380
Just, just something.
440
00:20:53.579 --> 00:20:56.099
There's been hikes where we've been on where, You can
441
00:20:56.140 --> 00:20:58.559
get up the part of the hike you need to
442
00:20:58.579 --> 00:21:01.859
go without any technical ability, but it would have been
443
00:21:01.900 --> 00:21:03.869
nearly impossible to do with a backpack on. You get
444
00:21:03.900 --> 00:21:05.640
to the top, and if you have 15 feet of rope,
445
00:21:05.700 --> 00:21:07.029
you can tie your bag to it and then just
446
00:21:07.069 --> 00:21:07.750
pull your bag up.
447
00:21:07.869 --> 00:21:10.490
Yeah. And now you're not risking falling and getting hurt.
448
00:21:11.150 --> 00:21:11.450
Word.
449
00:21:11.750 --> 00:21:12.049
Word.
450
00:21:12.369 --> 00:21:14.190
So, you know, he was believed to be carrying a
451
00:21:14.230 --> 00:21:18.650
standard multi-day backpack with the appropriate gear for late summer,
452
00:21:18.730 --> 00:21:22.809
early fall conditions. Rescuers later concluded he was probably not
453
00:21:22.950 --> 00:21:26.950
adequately prepared for the rapidly changing weather. Like Joe mentioned earlier,
454
00:21:27.029 --> 00:21:30.130
he carried no cell phone and no emergency locator beacon.
455
00:21:30.670 --> 00:21:33.819
That's a big no-no for locations unknown. At a minimum,
456
00:21:34.339 --> 00:21:36.680
have your cell phone with you because Joe and I
457
00:21:36.700 --> 00:21:39.880
have both been hiking in remote, random places, and once
458
00:21:39.920 --> 00:21:41.059
in a while you pick up a signal.
459
00:21:42.059 --> 00:21:44.440
That could be life or death if you're lost. Yeah, absolutely.
460
00:21:44.769 --> 00:21:46.569
I've been on summits, and all of a sudden I
461
00:21:46.589 --> 00:21:49.289
get a bar, and I'll send a text to Cassie
462
00:21:49.329 --> 00:21:51.029
and be like, I made it. I was on Mount Rainier,
463
00:21:51.049 --> 00:21:54.410
and I had full service. And I had service at Kilimanjaro.
464
00:21:54.430 --> 00:21:55.589
Like literally I did.
465
00:21:55.609 --> 00:21:56.259
I don't know how.
466
00:21:56.380 --> 00:21:58.150
And then I'd get back home and at my house,
467
00:21:58.259 --> 00:22:00.700
I'd have no bars. So explain that one to me.
468
00:22:01.680 --> 00:22:05.680
So his vehicle, a 1995 white Chevy Suburban.
469
00:22:06.240 --> 00:22:08.839
Explain that one to me, cell phone. Cell phone.
470
00:22:10.099 --> 00:22:12.279
Was found parked at the lower gate of the South
471
00:22:12.500 --> 00:22:17.380
Colony Road. That was on September 22nd. Personality wise. So
472
00:22:17.440 --> 00:22:20.680
his mother. described him as a very experienced outdoorsman who
473
00:22:20.700 --> 00:22:23.819
had been hiking since he was a Boy Scout. Coworker
474
00:22:23.880 --> 00:22:28.759
posted under the username Beezer11 described Mark as resourceful during
475
00:22:28.799 --> 00:22:32.359
the search. He was described by many as a devoted
476
00:22:32.460 --> 00:22:37.359
family man, father of two young daughters, and his mother's
477
00:22:37.440 --> 00:22:40.579
public words during the search were, how do you explain
478
00:22:40.640 --> 00:22:43.559
to a three and five-year-old where daddy is? So, you know,
479
00:22:44.000 --> 00:22:47.450
very difficult situation. I can't even imagine how that would
480
00:22:47.849 --> 00:22:51.250
play out. He was a self-directed and independent. He was
481
00:22:51.289 --> 00:22:55.039
very comfortable with multi-day solo backpacking trips hitting 13 of
482
00:22:55.079 --> 00:22:58.759
Colorado's 54 14ers in the 18 months before he disappeared.
483
00:22:58.819 --> 00:23:04.940
So as Joe knows, as a person who's attempted multiple 14ers,
484
00:23:05.019 --> 00:23:07.019
it's not an easy adventure.
485
00:23:07.279 --> 00:23:07.400
No.
486
00:23:07.960 --> 00:23:10.079
So he did 13 of them in the 18 months
487
00:23:10.160 --> 00:23:13.039
prior to his disappearance. Yeah. That's, that's, he's going. Now
488
00:23:13.079 --> 00:23:14.940
it helps that he lived out there. Yeah.
489
00:23:15.099 --> 00:23:16.859
I mean, if you lived out in Denver, you would
490
00:23:16.900 --> 00:23:18.819
probably have done a lot more 14 years. I would
491
00:23:18.859 --> 00:23:20.779
try and do all of them in like a year
492
00:23:20.839 --> 00:23:21.119
or two.
493
00:23:21.240 --> 00:23:22.180
Yeah. Just get it done.
494
00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:24.220
Well, just to see if I can, because there's people
495
00:23:24.240 --> 00:23:26.210
that do it all within like a certain, like in
496
00:23:26.230 --> 00:23:27.410
the summer season or something.
497
00:23:27.589 --> 00:23:27.730
Yeah.
498
00:23:27.789 --> 00:23:28.710
I'm going to look that up. Just to make sure
499
00:23:28.730 --> 00:23:29.190
I'm not lying.
500
00:23:29.369 --> 00:23:30.789
But either way, 13 of the 54 14 years and
501
00:23:30.789 --> 00:23:36.759
18 months is a pretty amazing accomplishment. Um, He was
502
00:23:36.779 --> 00:23:39.339
an ambitious as a hiker, but he was described as
503
00:23:39.420 --> 00:23:43.299
not reckless in the public record. His objectives progressed from
504
00:23:43.440 --> 00:23:47.109
easier 14ers to harder. So that's a good thing. So
505
00:23:47.150 --> 00:23:49.250
if I was starting out on my 14er journey, I
506
00:23:49.269 --> 00:23:51.529
wouldn't pick the hardest one. I would start with the
507
00:23:51.609 --> 00:23:55.150
easiest one and work my way up. The one you tried,
508
00:23:55.170 --> 00:23:57.339
the one with the hypothermia story, which we don't have
509
00:23:57.359 --> 00:23:59.980
to tell. Yeah, I won't tell it. Do you know
510
00:24:00.039 --> 00:24:03.160
where that one ranks in the difficulty of the 54?
511
00:24:03.160 --> 00:24:07.089
Honestly, it's, it's relatively simple. Yeah. It was just weather
512
00:24:07.119 --> 00:24:07.720
pushed us off.
513
00:24:08.269 --> 00:24:10.849
So like, it's, I mean, it's dangerous, but like more
514
00:24:10.930 --> 00:24:12.730
people do that one than, than a lot of the
515
00:24:12.750 --> 00:24:13.049
other ones.
516
00:24:13.210 --> 00:24:13.329
Yep.
517
00:24:14.559 --> 00:24:17.619
So I'm like double checking this, but it looks like
518
00:24:17.660 --> 00:24:20.910
the fastest someone climbed all of Colorado's 14,000 peaks was
519
00:24:21.049 --> 00:24:23.309
nine days, 21 hours and 51 minutes.
520
00:24:23.329 --> 00:24:24.990
That doesn't sound correct at all.
521
00:24:25.529 --> 00:24:28.009
Go to that article. There's like 52 of them. Read
522
00:24:28.049 --> 00:24:31.970
that article. 58, 14 years and 14 days. Holy crap.
523
00:24:32.309 --> 00:24:32.609
Okay.
524
00:24:33.029 --> 00:24:35.470
Well, read that article while I'm going through this because
525
00:24:35.539 --> 00:24:37.420
I'm curious about that.
526
00:24:38.299 --> 00:24:42.079
That's pretty wild. It's apparently like this other.
527
00:24:42.279 --> 00:24:45.039
I'm seeing different names doing it in like 14 days,
528
00:24:45.039 --> 00:24:46.029
16 days.
529
00:24:46.049 --> 00:24:49.660
Yeah. Holy crap. All right. So also.
530
00:24:50.220 --> 00:24:53.660
Outside of hiking and climbing, he was a craft beer enthusiast,
531
00:24:53.720 --> 00:24:56.200
which makes sense for the time period of the case.
532
00:24:56.380 --> 00:24:59.259
Remember the early 20 teens, like craft beer was like
533
00:24:59.359 --> 00:24:59.940
all the rage.
534
00:25:00.099 --> 00:25:02.740
Yes. There were new craft breweries popping up like every
535
00:25:02.759 --> 00:25:03.500
other day. Yeah.
536
00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:07.079
I think Seattle is built on just craft breweries. And
537
00:25:07.140 --> 00:25:09.660
he had recently began brewing his own beer. Another thing
538
00:25:09.680 --> 00:25:11.180
that lots of people were doing at the time.
539
00:25:11.299 --> 00:25:11.880
Yeah.
540
00:25:11.960 --> 00:25:14.529
Everyone I knew was like, they're going to be the
541
00:25:14.589 --> 00:25:17.750
next like big brewer, but- He was believed to have
542
00:25:17.769 --> 00:25:21.910
habitually descended 14ers by different routes than he ascended, which
543
00:25:22.430 --> 00:25:28.420
search and rescue flagged as potential risk factor. Medical issues,
544
00:25:29.000 --> 00:25:33.900
nothing that I could find that would be a leading
545
00:25:34.119 --> 00:25:37.480
driver for him going missing. Obviously, he was at a
546
00:25:37.640 --> 00:25:40.980
very good fitness level if he'd done 13 14ers in
547
00:25:40.980 --> 00:25:41.299
18 months.
548
00:25:41.700 --> 00:25:41.960
Yeah.
549
00:25:42.140 --> 00:25:45.559
So you can't, you know. You can't be a weekend
550
00:25:45.599 --> 00:25:47.359
warrior and do that. You got to be in pretty
551
00:25:47.400 --> 00:25:48.420
good physical condition.
552
00:25:50.180 --> 00:25:55.220
Andrew Hamilton in 2015, nine days, 21 hours and 51 minutes.
553
00:25:55.240 --> 00:25:59.859
He climbed 58 14ers. Wow. That's wild. That is wild. Yeah.
554
00:26:00.039 --> 00:26:04.140
I'm lazy as crap. We all are by that metric.
555
00:26:04.740 --> 00:26:05.809
Occupation hobby.
556
00:26:05.869 --> 00:26:09.309
So his day job was a dispatch supervisor for UPS,
557
00:26:09.970 --> 00:26:12.190
which he started at in 2001.
558
00:26:12.190 --> 00:26:13.690
His supervisory role was.
559
00:26:14.509 --> 00:26:17.789
inadvertently confirmed during the search when a forum poster wrote
560
00:26:17.890 --> 00:26:23.779
that Stice was my boyfriend's boss. Education, he graduated from
561
00:26:23.859 --> 00:26:27.059
North High School in Denver in 1995 and then earned
562
00:26:27.119 --> 00:26:30.180
his Bachelor of Science in Business Administration from College America
563
00:26:30.200 --> 00:26:38.240
in 2005. His hobbies were obviously mountaineering, doing the 14ers, backpacking, camping, fishing.
564
00:26:39.119 --> 00:26:42.009
So anyone I would love to live out west, that
565
00:26:42.049 --> 00:26:44.890
would be my hobbies too, just hiking and backpacking and
566
00:26:45.730 --> 00:26:47.490
I'd be up in the mountains every weekend I could.
567
00:26:47.650 --> 00:26:50.019
Yeah, at least their cold has mountains with it. Yes.
568
00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:52.220
Experience in the wilderness.
569
00:26:52.279 --> 00:26:55.259
So he was, I would say, a serious weekend mountainer
570
00:26:55.319 --> 00:26:59.940
with roughly two years of experience in Colorado's 14ers. He,
571
00:27:00.140 --> 00:27:03.720
like I said, he climbed 13 of them in 18 months,
572
00:27:03.880 --> 00:27:06.250
a pace that placed him among the state's most committed
573
00:27:06.329 --> 00:27:11.589
weekend high altitude hikers. Recent summits included Humboldt Peak at 14,064 feet.
574
00:27:13.440 --> 00:27:16.289
the eastern rim of South Colony Lakes Basin in May.
575
00:27:17.069 --> 00:27:23.309
Long's Peak, 14,259 with his brother Brian in early September 2013.
576
00:27:23.309 --> 00:27:26.369
Multi-day solo backpacking was a part of his established practice,
577
00:27:27.339 --> 00:27:29.200
and this trip was no different. It was going to
578
00:27:29.220 --> 00:27:33.960
be a five-day plan, which was not unusually ambitious for him.
579
00:27:35.019 --> 00:27:39.359
So experience in that location. Stice had summited Humboldt Peak
580
00:27:39.420 --> 00:27:42.349
in May 2013, the easiest 14er in the Crestone group.
581
00:27:42.970 --> 00:27:45.339
and the one that shares South Colony Basin as its
582
00:27:45.460 --> 00:27:48.720
access point. So he had been to the basin before,
583
00:27:48.779 --> 00:27:52.559
but not only in spring conditions, but only in spring
584
00:27:52.599 --> 00:27:56.220
conditions and only for the group's easiest peak. Custer Search
585
00:27:56.240 --> 00:27:59.319
and Rescue explicitly stated that he was not known to
586
00:27:59.380 --> 00:28:02.579
have any local knowledge of the technical challenges that he
587
00:28:02.599 --> 00:28:05.279
might encounter on a more difficult peak in the area.
588
00:28:05.339 --> 00:28:08.000
So meaning Crestone Peak at 14,294 feet, Crestone Needle, 14,197 feet,
589
00:28:12.190 --> 00:28:17.630
Kit Carson Peak at 14,165 feet and Challenger Point at 14,081 feet.
590
00:28:17.710 --> 00:28:20.670
And here's a little image for those watching of just
591
00:28:21.309 --> 00:28:22.430
rugged and otherworldly.
592
00:28:22.730 --> 00:28:25.480
Yeah. It was. This is from the search and rescue,
593
00:28:25.539 --> 00:28:28.599
one of the images. Okay, cool. Yeah, that's gnarly. It
594
00:28:28.700 --> 00:28:29.220
is gnarly.
595
00:28:29.960 --> 00:28:32.140
So like I said, there was no records that indicate
596
00:28:32.160 --> 00:28:34.940
he ever climbed any of those peaks before this trip.
597
00:28:35.440 --> 00:28:39.099
And also he did not sign the trail register and
598
00:28:39.160 --> 00:28:43.450
summit register anywhere in the Sangre de Cristo range during
599
00:28:43.549 --> 00:28:48.809
his September trip. He also unfortunately left no itinerary. He
600
00:28:48.849 --> 00:28:50.690
just told his wife only that he was going to
601
00:28:50.730 --> 00:28:54.230
hike in the Crestone Peak area. So it is unknown
602
00:28:54.309 --> 00:28:57.210
which peaks he attempted or even what order.
603
00:28:57.519 --> 00:29:00.720
Or by what routes. So that is so sad.
604
00:29:01.079 --> 00:29:04.579
That's really what hampers the search. We've said it a
605
00:29:04.619 --> 00:29:09.779
thousand times. At a minimum, at least tell somebody what
606
00:29:09.799 --> 00:29:12.720
your plan is. Because in the unfortunate event you do
607
00:29:12.759 --> 00:29:17.519
go missing, that gives search and rescue a spot to
608
00:29:17.559 --> 00:29:23.460
start because in conditions like this, every hour matters. The
609
00:29:23.519 --> 00:29:27.900
longer he's up there, the longer there's a risk of
610
00:29:27.940 --> 00:29:30.250
a bad situation happening. So if you tell someone where
611
00:29:30.289 --> 00:29:33.650
you are, they can zero in right away on the
612
00:29:33.750 --> 00:29:35.970
route they think you might be on and you might
613
00:29:36.009 --> 00:29:38.670
get found. So always tell someone.
614
00:29:38.430 --> 00:29:38.970
Where you're going.
615
00:29:38.990 --> 00:29:42.640
All right, let's get in the timeline here. We're starting
616
00:29:42.799 --> 00:29:47.920
off September 17th to the 21st of 2013. So Mark
617
00:29:47.980 --> 00:29:51.240
sets out alone on a five-day backpacking trip in the
618
00:29:51.339 --> 00:29:57.079
South Colony Basin in the San Isabel National Forest. And
619
00:29:57.160 --> 00:30:00.299
he was intending to climb some or all of the 14ers.
620
00:30:00.799 --> 00:30:02.839
We just don't know because there was no itinerary left.
621
00:30:03.500 --> 00:30:05.460
Like I said, he simply told his wife he was
622
00:30:05.519 --> 00:30:08.029
heading to this area to do some of the 14ers.
623
00:30:08.880 --> 00:30:12.490
And again, like I said, he left no itinerary with family, friends, coworkers.
624
00:30:13.109 --> 00:30:15.250
So no one knew which peaks he was going to
625
00:30:15.269 --> 00:30:18.529
be trying to summit. They could have been some or
626
00:30:18.690 --> 00:30:21.769
all of these. So Humboldt Peak, Creststone Needle, Creststone Peak,
627
00:30:21.789 --> 00:30:23.349
Kit Carson Peak, or Challenger Point.
628
00:30:23.470 --> 00:30:24.539
We just don't know which one.
629
00:30:25.349 --> 00:30:28.619
To make things even more difficult, he carried no cell
630
00:30:28.640 --> 00:30:32.539
phone or any type of emergency locator beacon. And like
631
00:30:32.599 --> 00:30:34.920
I just had stated, he signed no trail registers.
632
00:30:35.619 --> 00:30:38.079
Which now we've learned about, they can do that pop-up
633
00:30:38.220 --> 00:30:42.009
mobile cell phone thing, which I can't believe I haven't
634
00:30:42.029 --> 00:30:44.849
heard more about with more people having cell phones. But
635
00:30:44.869 --> 00:30:47.109
that's just another reason to bring one with you, is
636
00:30:47.150 --> 00:30:48.589
if you get lost, you can turn it on.
637
00:30:48.869 --> 00:30:50.650
Maybe it's just so common now, a lot of the
638
00:30:51.180 --> 00:30:54.799
Western search and rescue teams use it. Rescuers later concluded
639
00:30:54.859 --> 00:30:57.900
that he was probably not equipped for the rapidly changing weather.
640
00:30:57.920 --> 00:30:58.859
I mentioned that earlier.
641
00:30:59.900 --> 00:31:03.069
And this judgment was sharpened by rescuers by the fact
642
00:31:03.130 --> 00:31:06.390
that without the known route, searchers would eventually face 10
643
00:31:06.390 --> 00:31:09.170
to 20 more square miles of wilderness with no place
644
00:31:09.210 --> 00:31:13.650
to start searching. Obviously, during this trip, the weather turned
645
00:31:13.730 --> 00:31:17.640
very quickly. An early autumn snowstorm struck that range over
646
00:31:17.680 --> 00:31:21.299
the weekend of the 21st and 22nd. It dumped snow
647
00:31:21.359 --> 00:31:24.900
on the peaks before clearing early the following week. His
648
00:31:24.960 --> 00:31:28.470
mother later pinpointed the same storm. She was quoted saying
649
00:31:28.490 --> 00:31:32.630
it was Sunday night when he had already gone missing
650
00:31:32.670 --> 00:31:33.289
that it snowed.
651
00:31:33.730 --> 00:31:35.730
This is what has hindered the search.
652
00:31:36.470 --> 00:31:40.420
And overnight temperatures near the Crestone Peak fell roughly 10
653
00:31:40.420 --> 00:31:44.339
degrees Fahrenheit that week as well. The 21st came and
654
00:31:44.400 --> 00:31:48.319
went with no word from him. It's now September 22nd
655
00:31:48.339 --> 00:31:49.579
of 2013.
656
00:31:49.579 --> 00:31:52.490
For those watching, I'm just going to follow Crestone Peak,
657
00:31:52.650 --> 00:31:55.109
assuming just a given since we don't know exactly where.
658
00:31:55.390 --> 00:31:56.910
At least I'm going to look at like reviews and
659
00:31:56.930 --> 00:31:58.730
I'll bring that up from this one. But that's what
660
00:31:58.750 --> 00:32:00.450
I'm basing this off of just going forward.
661
00:32:00.630 --> 00:32:00.829
Cool.
662
00:32:00.930 --> 00:32:03.589
So for the fact checkers in the audience, we know
663
00:32:03.630 --> 00:32:07.670
it's unknown. I'm picking this one. Yes, we're picking that one.
664
00:32:07.789 --> 00:32:08.029
Yes.
665
00:32:08.490 --> 00:32:12.390
So like I said, it's now September 22nd of 2013.
666
00:32:12.390 --> 00:32:15.849
Michelle Stice reported her husband overdue at this time. Deputies
667
00:32:15.970 --> 00:32:18.930
and searchers very quickly found his vehicle that same day
668
00:32:19.049 --> 00:32:22.559
parked at the South Colony Trailhead, specifically at the lower
669
00:32:22.599 --> 00:32:27.000
gate on the South Colony Road southwest of Westcliff. Because
670
00:32:27.039 --> 00:32:30.140
the road above the gate is closed to ordinary vehicles,
671
00:32:30.940 --> 00:32:34.180
the car's position really implies that he had walked on
672
00:32:34.279 --> 00:32:38.950
foot from there, and the Custer County authorities initially estimated
673
00:32:38.990 --> 00:32:41.769
he could have hiked another 10 miles to reach the
674
00:32:41.829 --> 00:32:45.950
Crestone Peak area. So Just based on the initial search
675
00:32:45.990 --> 00:32:49.190
where they found his car, looking at Crestone Peak first
676
00:32:49.470 --> 00:32:53.519
made the most sense because based on all of that
677
00:32:53.579 --> 00:32:56.140
would be likely maybe the first peak he would have hit.
678
00:32:56.740 --> 00:32:58.339
That night at 1.08 a.m.
679
00:32:58.839 --> 00:33:02.930
On the 23rd, a poster identified as Alpine Rescue Team
680
00:33:03.009 --> 00:33:07.430
put out an appeal on the 14ers. com climbing forum. They wrote,
681
00:33:08.029 --> 00:33:12.259
we currently have a 37-year-old male solo climber hiker that
682
00:33:12.319 --> 00:33:15.299
took a five-day trip into the South Colony Basin to
683
00:33:15.359 --> 00:33:19.019
climb some or all of the 14-foot peaks in that
684
00:33:19.119 --> 00:33:22.859
area last Tuesday, 9-17. His vehicle was located at Lower
685
00:33:22.900 --> 00:33:25.980
Gate on the South Colony Road today. Again, just a
686
00:33:26.019 --> 00:33:28.940
slight note, the age was, there's some discrepancy online about
687
00:33:28.980 --> 00:33:32.279
his age. Some say 37, some say 36, so just
688
00:33:32.299 --> 00:33:33.000
keep that in mind.
689
00:33:33.680 --> 00:33:37.019
So if you can see here, here is the trailhead.
690
00:33:37.839 --> 00:33:41.119
So this is why it's so difficult. the same trailhead
691
00:33:41.160 --> 00:33:44.319
breaks off in either Humboldt Peak, Crestone Needle, or Crestone Peak.
692
00:33:44.480 --> 00:33:47.200
Okay. So you can really hit all three of them.
693
00:33:47.329 --> 00:33:49.390
You can hit all three of them. From the same trail.
694
00:33:50.049 --> 00:33:51.910
But it's like such a huge area for searching.
695
00:33:51.950 --> 00:33:53.630
So if you knew for sure which ones he was
696
00:33:53.650 --> 00:33:55.609
going to do and when, you could at least go,
697
00:33:55.630 --> 00:33:57.109
you could focus in that area. And that could be,
698
00:33:57.430 --> 00:34:00.089
I mean, in this condition, life and death. If you
699
00:34:00.130 --> 00:34:01.089
can shave off days.
700
00:34:01.279 --> 00:34:07.059
Yeah. Or 20 square miles of searching. Yeah, exactly. So. Yeah,
701
00:34:07.420 --> 00:34:09.900
and these types of trails too. I'll see if I
702
00:34:09.920 --> 00:34:13.559
can do 3D. It's so difficult to go off trail
703
00:34:13.619 --> 00:34:16.480
too far because you're in the mountains. Let's see if
704
00:34:16.500 --> 00:34:17.340
I can rotate this.
705
00:34:17.800 --> 00:34:20.510
But look at you, like in that little basin. Like
706
00:34:20.530 --> 00:34:22.269
you're not going to go up each side of this mountain.
707
00:34:22.289 --> 00:34:25.130
No, the trail already is kind of following the easiest
708
00:34:25.190 --> 00:34:26.349
path up. Exactly.
709
00:34:26.369 --> 00:34:29.130
Why would you deviate and add work to your summit?
710
00:34:29.289 --> 00:34:31.170
It's not going to benefit you at all. It's not
711
00:34:31.190 --> 00:34:33.269
going to be faster even if you're better. I wish
712
00:34:33.309 --> 00:34:34.610
I could rotate like in Google Maps.
713
00:34:35.550 --> 00:34:38.230
It's almost probably like if there was no trail there,
714
00:34:38.269 --> 00:34:39.360
that would be the natural.
715
00:34:40.230 --> 00:34:42.130
way you would go up because it would be the easiest.
716
00:34:42.150 --> 00:34:44.050
It's like how the water cut down the valley.
717
00:34:44.230 --> 00:34:44.409
Yeah.
718
00:34:44.989 --> 00:34:48.070
So if they knew what mountain, they could go along
719
00:34:48.230 --> 00:34:50.570
that trail in that order and it would be much
720
00:34:50.630 --> 00:34:52.010
easier to potentially find that person.
721
00:34:52.070 --> 00:34:54.230
So please leave your itinerary. Yes.
722
00:34:55.280 --> 00:34:59.199
At this time, an early Denver television report on September
723
00:34:59.380 --> 00:35:03.400
24th framed the ambiguity that would define the search with
724
00:35:03.440 --> 00:35:06.880
the car at the South Colony Trailhead. Stice could have
725
00:35:06.920 --> 00:35:10.619
been hiking, like Joe said, Humboldt Peak, Crestone, Or the
726
00:35:10.679 --> 00:35:12.409
other peak that Joe mentioned. I can't remember what you
727
00:35:12.429 --> 00:35:12.929
said now.
728
00:35:13.070 --> 00:35:17.070
Humble Peak, East Crestone Peak, or Crestone Needle. Those are
729
00:35:17.090 --> 00:35:19.510
the only 14ers because all the other ones are 13.
730
00:35:19.510 --> 00:35:20.110
Yeah, okay.
731
00:35:20.730 --> 00:35:22.789
So the search really kicked in the high gear between
732
00:35:22.849 --> 00:35:28.489
September 22nd and the 29th of 2013. The search ran
733
00:35:28.550 --> 00:35:34.139
for eight days. Volunteer teams came from all over Colorado, Custer, Fremont,
734
00:35:34.300 --> 00:35:39.119
Douglas counties, plus Vail Mountain Rescue Group and Western State.
735
00:35:39.730 --> 00:35:42.449
They were coordinated with the Colorado Search and Rescue Board,
736
00:35:42.469 --> 00:35:46.780
which arranged aviation support, a Lakota, and a Blackhawk helicopter
737
00:35:46.820 --> 00:35:50.760
from the High Altitude Army National Guard Aviation Training Site,
738
00:35:50.800 --> 00:35:55.340
known as HATS, at Gypsum Helped. And roughly 800 volunteer
739
00:35:55.380 --> 00:35:58.699
man hours went into those eight days. So the one
740
00:35:58.780 --> 00:36:02.559
positive you can come away with for this disappearance is
741
00:36:03.280 --> 00:36:09.539
there's probably no better search apparatus than in Colorado. for
742
00:36:09.579 --> 00:36:12.239
search like Alpine search and rescue. I mean, maybe I'm
743
00:36:12.280 --> 00:36:15.449
sure there are, but these people have to, these people
744
00:36:15.489 --> 00:36:18.429
are some of the best trained search and rescue people
745
00:36:18.469 --> 00:36:18.949
in the world.
746
00:36:18.969 --> 00:36:22.070
I would say with, you know, yeah, I agree.
747
00:36:22.530 --> 00:36:24.849
Not only that, one of our original shows we met with,
748
00:36:25.010 --> 00:36:25.829
I'm forgetting his name.
749
00:36:25.849 --> 00:36:26.429
Was it Paul?
750
00:36:26.809 --> 00:36:27.050
No.
751
00:36:27.110 --> 00:36:28.880
From the, from the rescue place. I know what you're
752
00:36:28.900 --> 00:36:29.260
talking about.
753
00:36:29.300 --> 00:36:29.420
Yeah.
754
00:36:29.440 --> 00:36:30.099
I can't remember.
755
00:36:30.360 --> 00:36:33.179
And he was so good and he was a volunteer,
756
00:36:33.300 --> 00:36:35.760
but like the professionalism and like, okay, you know your stuff.
757
00:36:35.800 --> 00:36:37.820
And he worked at a cell phone store most of
758
00:36:37.840 --> 00:36:40.230
the time. So they have their stuff together.
759
00:36:40.250 --> 00:36:42.969
So yeah, not only the search apparatus, but they also
760
00:36:43.030 --> 00:36:46.530
have that Army helicopter training school there where you've got
761
00:36:46.570 --> 00:36:49.630
some of the best Alpine helicopter pilots in the world
762
00:36:49.750 --> 00:36:51.909
also helping out on the aerial part of it. If
763
00:36:51.929 --> 00:36:54.980
you're going to go missing, I guess Colorado, pick Colorado
764
00:36:55.000 --> 00:36:57.599
because I think they've probably got one of the strongest
765
00:36:57.760 --> 00:37:02.079
overall search apparatus. So all the different searchers, the coordination
766
00:37:02.119 --> 00:37:06.800
between them, the technology, the skill required. So that's just my...
767
00:37:07.440 --> 00:37:09.619
opinion after doing a lot of these cases. I'm not
768
00:37:09.940 --> 00:37:14.250
downgrading the searching prowess of any other region or location,
769
00:37:14.289 --> 00:37:17.929
but I would say Colorado probably, if it isn't up there,
770
00:37:17.989 --> 00:37:21.590
it's probably one of the better overall areas for search
771
00:37:21.610 --> 00:37:24.659
and rescue. I'll probably get a lot of comments like,
772
00:37:24.699 --> 00:37:26.559
Oh yeah, all the search and rescue people from not
773
00:37:26.599 --> 00:37:27.739
in Colorado are like, what are.
774
00:37:27.699 --> 00:37:28.320
You talking about?
775
00:37:28.900 --> 00:37:33.949
So the hazards during the search were unusually severe. For
776
00:37:33.969 --> 00:37:37.730
a September search, they had difficult terrain, significant snowfall, ice,
777
00:37:38.409 --> 00:37:43.309
crusted rock, rock falls, ice falls, daily freeze and thaw cycles.
778
00:37:44.170 --> 00:37:47.960
Ron Varney of the Custer County Incident Command described the
779
00:37:47.980 --> 00:37:49.239
conditions bluntly at the time.
780
00:37:49.260 --> 00:37:50.159
This is his quote.
781
00:37:50.619 --> 00:37:52.980
It's still pretty dicey out there as far as getting
782
00:37:53.099 --> 00:37:55.900
up into the real high country, but with snow and ice, yes.
783
00:37:56.780 --> 00:38:00.619
And added the sentence that has since become the case's
784
00:38:00.900 --> 00:38:03.610
kind of slogan. There are places up there that a
785
00:38:03.639 --> 00:38:05.550
person can get in trouble and we may not be
786
00:38:05.570 --> 00:38:07.769
able to find them for a long time. The first
787
00:38:08.090 --> 00:38:12.090
physical trace of him being in this area came pretty
788
00:38:12.170 --> 00:38:15.650
early in the search, though exactly when it became known
789
00:38:15.690 --> 00:38:20.469
to searchers is disputed. Denver's CBS4 reported that Cruz found
790
00:38:20.530 --> 00:38:24.530
his tent, sleeping bag, and fishing pole on Sunday. So
791
00:38:25.300 --> 00:38:27.920
pretty early on in the search, Custer County Search and
792
00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:31.500
Rescue's own account is more precise and different. So they
793
00:38:31.539 --> 00:38:34.429
went The vehicle was found on September 22nd, but his
794
00:38:34.469 --> 00:38:36.650
campsite was not located until the 24th.
795
00:38:37.210 --> 00:38:39.090
Both statements can stand together.
796
00:38:39.110 --> 00:38:44.460
Did they say exactly where it was or roughly? The
797
00:38:44.500 --> 00:38:46.900
early find of scattered gear reported to the press and
798
00:38:46.920 --> 00:38:51.960
a formally located catalog campsite was then announced. Either way,
799
00:38:52.000 --> 00:38:56.260
the campsite confirmed Stice had reached the basin, established a base,
800
00:38:56.409 --> 00:38:59.730
and left it to climb. He had carried a fishing
801
00:38:59.809 --> 00:39:03.150
tackle as well as climbing gear to the basin. It's
802
00:39:03.210 --> 00:39:06.630
now September 24th. This would be the largest single day
803
00:39:06.670 --> 00:39:09.400
of the search. A hiker who summited Humboldt Peak that
804
00:39:09.440 --> 00:39:13.139
morning up at 4.30 a.m. climbing two days after the
805
00:39:13.179 --> 00:39:17.179
storm recorded seeing an Army National Guard helicopter circling the
806
00:39:17.219 --> 00:39:20.920
Crestones looking for a missing climber, which then he said
807
00:39:20.960 --> 00:39:23.690
it buzzed him for the rest of the descent. And,
808
00:39:24.409 --> 00:39:26.530
you know, he was passing ground search teams on the
809
00:39:26.570 --> 00:39:30.880
way down. Primary search area was Crestones. Peak and Kit
810
00:39:30.889 --> 00:39:34.340
Carson Peak, with the total area of interest reaching as
811
00:39:34.420 --> 00:39:38.159
much as 50 square miles and technical climbing teams working
812
00:39:38.300 --> 00:39:43.880
three separate 14ers. By September 25th, a lot of forum
813
00:39:44.099 --> 00:39:47.420
members on it, you know, like 14ers. com and stuff were
814
00:39:47.480 --> 00:39:50.019
circulating what they believe to be a photograph of Stice
815
00:39:50.139 --> 00:39:54.980
found through open web searching. And since people are asking,
816
00:39:55.059 --> 00:39:58.079
so this was a quote from one of the forum members,
817
00:39:58.139 --> 00:40:00.349
since people are asking for a photo of this missing hiker,
818
00:40:00.409 --> 00:40:02.889
I did a little searching and may have found a
819
00:40:03.369 --> 00:40:06.309
picture of him. He writes, hopefully if this is him,
820
00:40:06.429 --> 00:40:08.989
someone who is up there over the weekend will recognize
821
00:40:09.050 --> 00:40:10.929
him and be able to help SAR in their search.
822
00:40:11.909 --> 00:40:15.670
And then there was, on the 25th, a co-worker actually
823
00:40:16.309 --> 00:40:20.190
confirmed that the picture was Mark.
824
00:40:20.969 --> 00:40:23.309
Oh, so somebody actually had a picture of him.
825
00:40:23.329 --> 00:40:26.719
Well, I think a co-worker, yeah, forum members found just
826
00:40:26.739 --> 00:40:29.719
by searching the internet. Towards the end of this period,
827
00:40:29.800 --> 00:40:34.539
rumors had started to circulate that the search had been
828
00:40:34.579 --> 00:40:38.300
called off. And those were corrected in real time on
829
00:40:38.320 --> 00:40:42.320
the 26th and 27th. A member relayed the incident commander's
830
00:40:42.400 --> 00:40:45.440
word directly. They wrote, I just got off the phone
831
00:40:45.599 --> 00:40:47.559
with the SAR team and they have not suspended the
832
00:40:47.599 --> 00:40:51.170
search and will continue searching this week. And another poster
833
00:40:51.210 --> 00:40:55.929
with contact inside the operation added the crucial nuance here.
834
00:40:56.150 --> 00:40:59.949
So they wrote, the search remark has not yet been suspended,
835
00:41:00.030 --> 00:41:02.780
but it has been scaled back. There have been teams
836
00:41:02.840 --> 00:41:05.079
in the field for five straight days as of today
837
00:41:05.579 --> 00:41:10.440
with a monumental effort given this past Tuesday. And finally, sadly,
838
00:41:10.639 --> 00:41:14.000
crews were wrapping up the search on the 28th with
839
00:41:14.780 --> 00:41:18.199
nothing new, and they returned to the mountain for one
840
00:41:18.239 --> 00:41:21.639
more day. By the 29th, this would be the last
841
00:41:21.699 --> 00:41:26.260
day of the search. Janice Stice's wife, speaking to CBS4
842
00:41:26.510 --> 00:41:29.409
as the searchers worked above her, described the train as
843
00:41:29.530 --> 00:41:32.909
mind-boggling and said the family had been told Custer County
844
00:41:32.949 --> 00:41:35.349
Search and Rescue had assured us that they will search
845
00:41:35.449 --> 00:41:38.769
as long as they can until the snow gets too deep. So.
846
00:41:39.840 --> 00:41:42.139
So this is the basin. So it does cut off
847
00:41:42.239 --> 00:41:44.800
the approach. Yeah. So if you had tackle, I bet
848
00:41:44.820 --> 00:41:46.639
he set up camp somewhere around the lakes. Yeah.
849
00:41:46.820 --> 00:41:50.239
But that's still two different ways you can go. And
850
00:41:50.280 --> 00:41:52.300
then you'd break off here to go to Crestone Needle
851
00:41:52.380 --> 00:41:55.260
or Crestone Peak. So it's a smaller search area than this.
852
00:41:55.619 --> 00:41:57.960
Yeah. But it's still three different 14,000 foot.
853
00:41:58.610 --> 00:42:01.150
Well, and this is why you see the search radius
854
00:42:01.349 --> 00:42:05.349
up to 50 square miles, because there's just really, they
855
00:42:05.389 --> 00:42:05.690
don't know.
856
00:42:06.190 --> 00:42:07.349
Yeah, and look at that.
857
00:42:07.550 --> 00:42:10.550
In that terrain, 50 square miles is so much to search.
858
00:42:11.309 --> 00:42:15.050
I mean, even with an incredibly massive search team, you're
859
00:42:15.090 --> 00:42:16.050
not going to get everything.
860
00:42:16.250 --> 00:42:19.369
Yeah, so here's the three 14ers. Crescent Peak, Needle, and
861
00:42:19.409 --> 00:42:21.630
Humboldt Peak. So it's somewhere in this.
862
00:42:22.030 --> 00:42:24.449
That seems really cool, though, that they have trails to
863
00:42:24.510 --> 00:42:28.269
all those because an experienced hiker-climber could probably knock those
864
00:42:28.349 --> 00:42:29.230
out in a day or two.
865
00:42:29.369 --> 00:42:30.090
Oh, yeah.
866
00:42:30.300 --> 00:42:33.139
That's the one time I did four 14ers in a
867
00:42:33.159 --> 00:42:35.550
day is because they're just all... You didn't have to
868
00:42:35.590 --> 00:42:37.809
climb down each time. You'd go summit to summit along
869
00:42:37.829 --> 00:42:38.289
the saddles.
870
00:42:38.409 --> 00:42:41.010
Yeah. Or the straddles. The straddles.
871
00:42:42.949 --> 00:42:46.570
The search is winding down. People are sad that this
872
00:42:46.690 --> 00:42:50.219
is happening, but we see it every search. They can't
873
00:42:50.280 --> 00:42:53.000
keep it going forever. A lot of times it shuts
874
00:42:53.039 --> 00:42:55.880
down because of weather. And if they kept going, they'd
875
00:42:55.900 --> 00:42:59.199
put the searchers in just as much danger. So the
876
00:42:59.219 --> 00:43:02.559
immediate aftermath of this search, so we're talking September 30th
877
00:43:02.599 --> 00:43:07.250
to December of 2013. Word of the suspension reached the
878
00:43:07.269 --> 00:43:11.449
climbing community on the 30th from a woman whose partner
879
00:43:11.510 --> 00:43:15.070
worked under Stice UPS. She wrote, they've suspended the search.
880
00:43:15.130 --> 00:43:17.829
They did find his campsite, but have not found him.
881
00:43:18.389 --> 00:43:20.630
In the same thread, another member wrote that many were
882
00:43:20.670 --> 00:43:24.389
thinking the mystery of it is just manning. A lot
883
00:43:24.409 --> 00:43:28.409
of people ask, how could experienced hikers just disappear into
884
00:43:28.449 --> 00:43:29.170
thin air like this?
885
00:43:29.230 --> 00:43:30.409
We ask this all the time.
886
00:43:31.090 --> 00:43:34.730
This was right around the time that another experienced climber
887
00:43:34.949 --> 00:43:37.489
went missing in the maroon bells and we did a
888
00:43:37.510 --> 00:43:40.349
case on him i can't think of his name now
889
00:43:40.469 --> 00:43:45.829
but so this area has seen some other disappearances i
890
00:43:45.849 --> 00:43:47.150
don't know if i'll try and look it up while
891
00:43:47.170 --> 00:43:49.409
you're going i can't think of his name it was
892
00:43:49.630 --> 00:43:51.289
we did the episode quite a while.
893
00:43:51.110 --> 00:43:53.449
Ago yeah i'll figure out you can keep going.
894
00:43:53.650 --> 00:43:57.269
There was michelle vanik i think she disappeared in this
895
00:43:57.389 --> 00:43:59.659
area i can't remember exactly where and then there was
896
00:43:59.699 --> 00:44:03.809
a gentleman that also disappeared climbing climbing the Maroon Bells.
897
00:44:04.570 --> 00:44:08.949
So you can... Oh, there we go. Dave Cook. That's
898
00:44:08.969 --> 00:44:11.769
what I'm hoping with the search things. So when did
899
00:44:11.809 --> 00:44:15.719
he go missing? 2016. Okay.
900
00:44:15.739 --> 00:44:19.280
Maroon Bells, peaks located, Maroon Bells, Snowmass Wilderness. So yeah,
901
00:44:19.360 --> 00:44:22.880
Dave Cook was... Episode 60. Yeah, a few years later
902
00:44:22.920 --> 00:44:26.699
than Stice, but same... And maybe once you're done here,
903
00:44:26.760 --> 00:44:29.059
see how far away Maroon Bells is from this area.
904
00:44:29.079 --> 00:44:29.739
I can do that right now.
905
00:44:30.690 --> 00:44:32.829
And then I'm just curious now, you've got me thinking
906
00:44:32.849 --> 00:44:34.409
while you're doing that, Michelle Vanik.
907
00:44:35.340 --> 00:44:38.920
That was a case we covered. Vanik. We'll do a
908
00:44:38.960 --> 00:44:42.880
live fly right here. Here we go. Other side. Not
909
00:44:42.900 --> 00:44:46.349
that close. No, not that close. Yeah. Other side of
910
00:44:46.369 --> 00:44:49.630
the state. Yeah, he's down here. Maroon Bell's up there. Okay.
911
00:44:50.289 --> 00:44:52.750
I think maybe what posters are getting at is just
912
00:44:52.789 --> 00:44:56.190
kind of another experienced climber just vanished.
913
00:44:56.320 --> 00:44:57.880
Michelle Vanik went missing yesterday.
914
00:44:58.829 --> 00:45:04.989
In the Mount of the Holy Cross area in 2005.
915
00:45:04.989 --> 00:45:10.250
So. That's closer. That's closer. Yeah.
916
00:45:12.230 --> 00:45:15.570
So it's not shocking that people go missing in these
917
00:45:15.610 --> 00:45:18.449
locations because they're very rugged and remote.
918
00:45:19.070 --> 00:45:20.599
Actually, I just saw this. These are the ones I did.
919
00:45:21.119 --> 00:45:24.400
Democrat, Lincoln, Bross, and there's one other small one that's
920
00:45:24.460 --> 00:45:27.380
technically a. Ross is on private land. You're not supposed
921
00:45:27.400 --> 00:45:29.969
to go there, but everybody does. There's some other peak
922
00:45:30.010 --> 00:45:31.869
that like people argue if it's a peak or not.
923
00:45:32.010 --> 00:45:32.250
Yeah.
924
00:45:32.590 --> 00:45:34.070
And right in here, but you can do all these
925
00:45:34.110 --> 00:45:36.010
just by you can't, you can't down here.
926
00:45:36.030 --> 00:45:39.750
Yeah. Go up and just do like a big circle. Cool.
927
00:45:39.769 --> 00:45:41.619
It was really, it was relatively simple to do.
928
00:45:41.760 --> 00:45:42.820
It was a lot of fun. Like I'd bring my
929
00:45:42.860 --> 00:45:43.480
kids to do that.
930
00:45:44.300 --> 00:45:44.539
Cool.
931
00:45:44.940 --> 00:45:48.460
So, so yeah, like I said, word spread of the,
932
00:45:48.599 --> 00:45:52.690
the search being canceled pretty quickly. especially through the climbing
933
00:45:52.710 --> 00:45:55.309
community and people were just talking for, for years, I've
934
00:45:55.329 --> 00:45:58.030
been talking about the various like experienced people that have
935
00:45:58.050 --> 00:46:01.150
gone missing in this region, in Maroon Bells, Mount of
936
00:46:01.170 --> 00:46:01.849
the Holy Cross.
937
00:46:02.769 --> 00:46:03.309
It's rugged.
938
00:46:03.449 --> 00:46:06.699
This range actually is part of another case we covered
939
00:46:07.530 --> 00:46:10.900
in the Great Sand Dune National Park. If you zoom out,
940
00:46:11.719 --> 00:46:15.960
how far away is that? So it'd be Southwest. So
941
00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:17.840
it's gotta be down there. That's it, right?
942
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:20.820
I'm going too crazy. This stuff?
943
00:46:21.380 --> 00:46:25.840
No, it's further over. I think it's over there. Well,
944
00:46:25.860 --> 00:46:28.909
that's Moab, so that's Utah. So here's the state line.
945
00:46:29.809 --> 00:46:32.809
Okay. You know what I'm going to do? Look it up. Yeah,
946
00:46:32.829 --> 00:46:38.349
maybe just use this amazing tool called Google. There we go. Look,
947
00:46:38.369 --> 00:46:40.530
it's saved because we've been there. Oh, it's down there. Yeah,
948
00:46:40.550 --> 00:46:43.889
we're in the wrong spot. Wrong spot. So now where
949
00:46:44.030 --> 00:46:48.429
is our case? It's further north. Our case is right here, Crestone, yeah.
950
00:46:48.449 --> 00:46:50.389
So actually, this is really close. Yeah, right there.
951
00:46:51.179 --> 00:46:54.300
To the guy that went missing twice in Great Sand Dunes.
952
00:46:54.480 --> 00:46:54.739
Yeah.
953
00:46:55.480 --> 00:46:57.960
Because this mountain range, when I was researching this, like, oh,
954
00:46:57.980 --> 00:47:00.760
that's familiar. We've covered it before. I think it helps
955
00:47:00.840 --> 00:47:04.530
create the Great Sand Dunes, it looks like. So, yeah, just,
956
00:47:04.909 --> 00:47:07.949
you know, the days after the search, statewide coverage confirmed
957
00:47:07.969 --> 00:47:11.309
the same day that the search had been suspended. They
958
00:47:11.349 --> 00:47:13.989
said he was still missing. They mentioned where his car
959
00:47:14.010 --> 00:47:16.489
was found, some of the gear was found, things that
960
00:47:16.510 --> 00:47:17.409
he didn't take with him.
961
00:47:18.190 --> 00:47:19.369
There was a follow-up published.
962
00:47:20.519 --> 00:47:23.880
On October 1st, that mentioned the search was called off
963
00:47:23.960 --> 00:47:28.099
eight days after he went missing. Through October, hikers still
964
00:47:28.139 --> 00:47:30.719
moved through the Crestones and treated the case as closed.
965
00:47:30.780 --> 00:47:34.380
In fact, if not on paper, a trip report published
966
00:47:34.440 --> 00:47:37.440
October 14th added a note at the end that missing
967
00:47:37.480 --> 00:47:40.139
climber search and rescue team was looking for Mark Stice.
968
00:47:40.159 --> 00:47:43.800
To my knowledge, has still not been found. In late November,
969
00:47:43.840 --> 00:47:47.090
the family made the decision to actually hold a memorial
970
00:47:47.130 --> 00:47:50.920
service without his body. and obituaries ran in the Denver
971
00:47:50.960 --> 00:47:56.300
Post on November 24th of 2013. The family's own words
972
00:47:56.400 --> 00:47:59.639
closed the notice, said, while we believe he will someday
973
00:47:59.679 --> 00:48:02.309
be found, the time has now come to remember him
974
00:48:02.389 --> 00:48:05.769
and celebrate his life. The obituary listed his date of
975
00:48:05.809 --> 00:48:09.469
death as September 18th of 2013, one day after he.
976
00:48:09.409 --> 00:48:10.190
Entered the basin.
977
00:48:11.010 --> 00:48:14.469
And obviously, this date has no source to substantiate it
978
00:48:14.659 --> 00:48:17.300
as the actual day he passed away. It's just what
979
00:48:17.320 --> 00:48:22.289
they used for the memorial. And since this disappearance, there's
980
00:48:22.349 --> 00:48:28.010
been no recovery, no remains, and no new physical evidence reported.
981
00:48:29.070 --> 00:48:34.530
And what happened to him out in that mountain? In 2014,
982
00:48:34.530 --> 00:48:39.340
a Colorado Mountaineering Fatality Review published a listing that showed
983
00:48:39.400 --> 00:48:43.800
Stice among the unresolved 2013 incidents and said his body
984
00:48:43.820 --> 00:48:48.349
had never been found after the search ended. In 2015,
985
00:48:48.349 --> 00:48:50.190
I'd love to get this guy on the show.
986
00:48:50.829 --> 00:48:51.530
Kevin G.
987
00:48:51.610 --> 00:48:55.769
Wright, an English teacher and longtime volunteer with the Alamosa
988
00:48:55.809 --> 00:48:59.570
Volunteers Search and Rescue, published Search and Rescue in Colorado's
989
00:48:59.639 --> 00:49:03.559
Sangre de Cristos through Big Earth Publishing in 2015. And
990
00:49:03.860 --> 00:49:08.380
one of his chapters was devoted to Stice. And, you know,
991
00:49:09.019 --> 00:49:11.760
it said Mark Stice backpacked in the Crestone group and
992
00:49:11.820 --> 00:49:16.590
was never heard from again. October 6th of 2017, There
993
00:49:16.610 --> 00:49:20.780
was a revision to the 2014 Mountaineering Review. and it
994
00:49:20.860 --> 00:49:24.420
still described Stice's body as never been found and the
995
00:49:24.719 --> 00:49:28.659
cause unknown. It didn't list any new clues in the case.
996
00:49:30.099 --> 00:49:33.260
And the 2022, there's really not a ton of information
997
00:49:33.280 --> 00:49:38.130
available on this case and definitely not a lot of
998
00:49:38.210 --> 00:49:41.489
new information. There wasn't really any case specific public updates.
999
00:49:42.269 --> 00:49:45.929
There wasn't any renewed large searches that I could find.
1000
00:49:46.869 --> 00:49:52.429
Their community forums, Reddit, podcasts, YouTube, public Facebook searches really
1001
00:49:52.469 --> 00:49:57.130
didn't produce much of anything on the case. And it's
1002
00:49:57.190 --> 00:50:00.710
kind of one of those lesser known cases. So one
1003
00:50:00.730 --> 00:50:02.349
of the reasons why I thought it would be interesting
1004
00:50:02.389 --> 00:50:06.289
to do and It's kind of one of those cases
1005
00:50:06.369 --> 00:50:10.239
where he will go into theories now, but like the
1006
00:50:10.300 --> 00:50:13.019
forum members, like he just kind of vanished. Now the
1007
00:50:13.059 --> 00:50:16.599
bad weather, the treacherous terrain, the lack of an itinerary,
1008
00:50:17.780 --> 00:50:22.760
all contributed. And the theories I have here are ranked
1009
00:50:22.840 --> 00:50:24.559
from Mike's probability.
1010
00:50:24.579 --> 00:50:26.719
High to low. All right.
1011
00:50:27.289 --> 00:50:30.769
So number one theory that I rank the highest is
1012
00:50:31.650 --> 00:50:35.119
he had some type of fatal off route fall on
1013
00:50:35.159 --> 00:50:39.019
descent in the Crestone group. So this is kind of
1014
00:50:39.059 --> 00:50:41.960
an umbrella theory. It could cover all of those peaks
1015
00:50:42.000 --> 00:50:45.239
you were showing, not just any of the peaks he
1016
00:50:45.260 --> 00:50:45.900
would have gone on.
1017
00:50:45.920 --> 00:50:46.320
Sure.
1018
00:50:46.780 --> 00:50:48.889
And this is actually one of the only theories that
1019
00:50:48.929 --> 00:50:52.409
the Custer County search and rescues own public language, like
1020
00:50:52.510 --> 00:50:56.329
in their releases, they explicitly said Stice was reported to
1021
00:50:56.389 --> 00:50:59.550
frequently descend off route and had no local knowledge of
1022
00:50:59.610 --> 00:51:02.739
the technical challenges that on the harder Crestone group peaks,
1023
00:51:02.800 --> 00:51:08.860
despite having summited Humboldt earlier that year. And another CCSAR
1024
00:51:08.960 --> 00:51:15.150
partner GIS study of the Crestone group missions between 2015
1025
00:51:15.150 --> 00:51:19.710
and 2021 found that Crestone Needle alone accounted for almost
1026
00:51:19.710 --> 00:51:24.210
49% of the missions, and 16 of the 24 Needle
1027
00:51:24.230 --> 00:51:27.440
missions occurred on descent, and that 12 of those were
1028
00:51:27.460 --> 00:51:33.139
climbers off-route on the south face below 13,400 feet. And
1029
00:51:33.179 --> 00:51:37.849
then an independent compilation identified 57 deaths on Colorado's 14ers
1030
00:51:37.929 --> 00:51:43.329
from 2010 to 2017, including 38 falls. The elk range
1031
00:51:43.570 --> 00:51:47.440
led with 18 recorded fatalities, followed by this range with
1032
00:51:47.440 --> 00:51:51.360
14 and the fort range with 13. So Stice, a
1033
00:51:51.480 --> 00:51:55.679
solo hiker, male, age 36, his first visit to a
1034
00:51:55.719 --> 00:51:59.440
technical peak, Based on what I read, he was known
1035
00:51:59.519 --> 00:52:02.639
to go off route when descending. This kind of fits
1036
00:52:03.039 --> 00:52:08.300
precisely into those statistics that those studies released about where
1037
00:52:08.340 --> 00:52:12.610
the most fatalities occur in these ranges. So that's why
1038
00:52:12.710 --> 00:52:17.159
I rank that as the most likely case. reason for
1039
00:52:17.199 --> 00:52:20.239
what happened to him yeah next i give this a
1040
00:52:20.260 --> 00:52:24.630
medium on mike's probability score weather driven exposure hypothermia we're.
1041
00:52:24.550 --> 00:52:26.949
Gonna have to come up with visuals for this we
1042
00:52:26.969 --> 00:52:28.570
will and i can like put them up on the.
1043
00:52:28.510 --> 00:52:31.030
Screen yeah i'm rolling out the yeah the mike's probability
1044
00:52:31.110 --> 00:52:35.590
i love it yeah so this is a no-brainer significant
1045
00:52:35.630 --> 00:52:40.110
early autumn snowstorm hits the range that night and it's
1046
00:52:40.590 --> 00:52:43.389
The Center for Snow and Avalanche Studies logged seven inches
1047
00:52:43.409 --> 00:52:45.650
of snow on the ground at that time at 11,000 feet.
1048
00:52:45.690 --> 00:52:46.670
So that's a lot of snow.
1049
00:52:47.760 --> 00:52:52.619
And overnight temperatures near Crestone Peak fell to 10 degrees Fahrenheit.
1050
00:52:53.820 --> 00:52:56.639
And a lot of people in the case, his own
1051
00:52:56.679 --> 00:52:59.900
wife said the weather just got crazy around that time.
1052
00:53:02.409 --> 00:53:06.269
But the storm's real role in his disappearance is probably not,
1053
00:53:06.789 --> 00:53:10.760
it probably didn't like cause the disappearance. But it definitely
1054
00:53:10.800 --> 00:53:13.309
concealed the evidence of where he was.
1055
00:53:13.570 --> 00:53:13.789
Yeah.
1056
00:53:14.469 --> 00:53:17.530
So he may have still fallen, but the terrible weather
1057
00:53:17.570 --> 00:53:20.389
and tons of snow coming down just covered up any
1058
00:53:20.610 --> 00:53:23.570
tracks of him, any gear he might have dropped, anything
1059
00:53:23.610 --> 00:53:27.289
like that. So it just makes the search even more hard.
1060
00:53:27.690 --> 00:53:31.389
Yep, I agree. I mean, that's just going to obscure
1061
00:53:31.489 --> 00:53:32.300
everything you're trying to do.
1062
00:53:32.820 --> 00:53:37.019
Yeah, and now kind of melting into this theory, my probability,
1063
00:53:37.280 --> 00:53:39.619
this would be a medium for why he wasn't found. Again,
1064
00:53:39.679 --> 00:53:42.920
goes back to the snow-concealed terrain trap, so fall into
1065
00:53:43.000 --> 00:53:47.750
a snow-filled void or moat or anything like that. The freeze, thaw, ice,
1066
00:53:47.889 --> 00:53:52.150
and encrusted rock throughout the eight-day search created concealment conditions.
1067
00:53:52.289 --> 00:53:56.329
A climber who summited Humboldt on September 24th described the
1068
00:53:56.349 --> 00:54:00.960
whole creek as a snowfest with calf-deep drifts. The Crestones
1069
00:54:01.260 --> 00:54:06.579
are conglomerate. Joe talked about the terrain. It's riddled with slots, chimneys, gullies,
1070
00:54:07.480 --> 00:54:10.460
and the range does hold semi-permanent ice on the north
1071
00:54:10.519 --> 00:54:15.079
face facing ground, including on Kit Carson and in Crestones Peak.
1072
00:54:15.699 --> 00:54:20.159
So it's very easy that maybe he didn't fall and
1073
00:54:20.199 --> 00:54:24.559
it started snowing and one of these areas was concealed
1074
00:54:24.579 --> 00:54:27.909
and he just fell into it. And the searchers just
1075
00:54:27.949 --> 00:54:30.539
aren't going to find it. So I could see that
1076
00:54:30.699 --> 00:54:31.579
unfortunately happening.
1077
00:54:31.820 --> 00:54:32.099
Yeah.
1078
00:54:32.400 --> 00:54:35.710
Next theory, which is on my Mike's probability score of
1079
00:54:35.769 --> 00:54:39.969
medium to low is off route deviation into rarely traveled drainage.
1080
00:54:40.050 --> 00:54:43.909
So this theory goes, the standard Crestone peak route already
1081
00:54:43.969 --> 00:54:46.869
leaves the South colony base and over broken hand pass
1082
00:54:46.929 --> 00:54:50.630
and drops into Cottonwood lake. From that point, I lost
1083
00:54:50.769 --> 00:54:55.030
climbers downhill instinct leads west away from camp cars and searchers.
1084
00:54:55.590 --> 00:54:59.309
Cottonwood Creek below the lake has no continuous trail. only
1085
00:54:59.369 --> 00:55:05.809
Cairns with waterfalls and glacier-polished slabs and many opportunities to
1086
00:55:06.130 --> 00:55:09.570
cliff out. So if he went west via Spanish Creek,
1087
00:55:10.550 --> 00:55:13.820
bailing west via Spanish Creek is an option for only
1088
00:55:13.880 --> 00:55:18.599
the truly desperate requiring an ascent above South Colony, the
1089
00:55:18.619 --> 00:55:23.420
Bear's Playground Crossing, then a rough burn area descent. So
1090
00:55:23.860 --> 00:55:26.880
east toward the West Mountain Valley is the least plausible option,
1091
00:55:27.500 --> 00:55:32.000
A hiker walking east downhill emerges into Ranchland Roads and
1092
00:55:32.360 --> 00:55:36.019
the town of Westcliff. People don't think this was the
1093
00:55:36.039 --> 00:55:39.909
case that he traveled out of. The search area was
1094
00:55:39.969 --> 00:55:43.449
so big anyways that he's probably up on one.
1095
00:55:43.389 --> 00:55:45.769
Of those peaks somewhere. I think so.
1096
00:55:45.989 --> 00:55:48.730
Yeah, his intention was to hike that area. Why would
1097
00:55:48.769 --> 00:55:53.610
he leave the search area? Do they say, and correct.
1098
00:55:53.389 --> 00:55:54.969
Me if I missed it because I was searching through
1099
00:55:54.989 --> 00:55:57.710
the map, like the weather did come in when he
1100
00:55:57.750 --> 00:55:59.710
was expected to be up there during that period?
1101
00:55:59.730 --> 00:56:01.789
Yeah, there was a bad snowstorm that came in. So
1102
00:56:02.489 --> 00:56:04.800
is it my turn to guess? Oh, I'm almost done. Okay,
1103
00:56:04.840 --> 00:56:06.940
I'm sorry. A few more theories. I'm getting really excited.
1104
00:56:07.460 --> 00:56:10.119
Sudden medical event on Mike's probability score. This is low.
1105
00:56:10.460 --> 00:56:13.139
So we cover these all the time. It's mainly like
1106
00:56:13.179 --> 00:56:17.619
a cardiac event. He was very physically fit. He did
1107
00:56:17.639 --> 00:56:21.960
a lot of 14ers. I put this as... A 36-years-old,
1108
00:56:22.019 --> 00:56:24.219
he had no known conditions. He's done a lot of
1109
00:56:24.239 --> 00:56:29.239
these 14ers, lives in Colorado. It's a low probability. Another
1110
00:56:29.480 --> 00:56:33.710
low probability is drowning in South Colony Cottonwood or Willow Lake.
1111
00:56:34.409 --> 00:56:38.909
He did carry fishing tackle into the basin, and they
1112
00:56:38.989 --> 00:56:44.250
recovered the fishing pole at his campsite. But I believe
1113
00:56:44.269 --> 00:56:46.510
the lakes were searched, and they didn't find any evidence
1114
00:56:46.590 --> 00:56:48.880
of it. I don't know that he would have been
1115
00:56:48.900 --> 00:56:49.440
going swimming there.
1116
00:56:50.980 --> 00:56:53.800
In those lakes. No. I don't see how, why he
1117
00:56:53.820 --> 00:56:55.909
would even be out there if he's, I mean, he's fishing.
1118
00:56:55.969 --> 00:56:58.170
Absolutely not. I'm sure he's fishing for food maybe. Yeah.
1119
00:56:58.250 --> 00:56:58.809
Or for fun.
1120
00:56:59.269 --> 00:57:03.550
Another low is just animal attack. Colorado has recorded roughly
1121
00:57:03.610 --> 00:57:07.010
four mountain lion linked human fatalities in its entire history
1122
00:57:07.550 --> 00:57:11.940
with about 28 attacks total since 1990. Only four fatal
1123
00:57:12.000 --> 00:57:15.440
black bear maulings have occurred in Colorado since record keeping
1124
00:57:15.480 --> 00:57:20.739
began in 1960. And the campsite, Was not disturbed. There
1125
00:57:20.780 --> 00:57:23.920
was no torn gear, no blood. Probably was not an
1126
00:57:24.019 --> 00:57:29.519
animal attack. Now, could there have been scavenging post-accident? That
1127
00:57:29.539 --> 00:57:33.519
could be a medium probability. So he fell, and then
1128
00:57:34.300 --> 00:57:37.840
over the course of several days, weeks, animals sadly will
1129
00:57:38.460 --> 00:57:43.039
disperse the remains. I wonder if it's that big at
1130
00:57:43.079 --> 00:57:47.840
that altitude. Probably down in the basin, there's maybe animal activity.
1131
00:57:47.860 --> 00:57:49.739
Yeah, down in the basin. Not up at Elk. I
1132
00:57:49.820 --> 00:57:51.780
was going to say, I think if he's gone missing,
1133
00:57:51.820 --> 00:57:52.699
he's above the tree line.
1134
00:57:52.780 --> 00:57:54.469
Yeah, the black bears aren't going to go above the
1135
00:57:54.510 --> 00:57:59.090
tree line. But yeah, if something happened down at camp,
1136
00:57:59.150 --> 00:58:02.170
that could possibly happen. But still, that's only a medium,
1137
00:58:02.349 --> 00:58:06.889
and an actual attack, I think, is low. Finally, very
1138
00:58:06.929 --> 00:58:11.909
low probability of voluntary disappearance. Nothing in his life indicated
1139
00:58:11.989 --> 00:58:15.320
that he... was going to do something like this.
1140
00:58:15.980 --> 00:58:19.260
What's wrong? I'm just making sure I didn't unplug something important. Oh,
1141
00:58:19.739 --> 00:58:22.780
I think we're good. Okay, good. I'm just, I'm just looking.
1142
00:58:22.840 --> 00:58:25.539
Everything's fine. Keep going. Another low probability foul play.
1143
00:58:26.000 --> 00:58:30.730
Just, there was nothing that investigators could point to, to
1144
00:58:30.929 --> 00:58:34.429
indicate any type of foul play missing four one, one,
1145
00:58:34.869 --> 00:58:38.170
very low probability. Our boy, David politis hasn't even talked
1146
00:58:38.190 --> 00:58:42.530
about this guy. So if he hasn't, brought up the
1147
00:58:42.550 --> 00:58:44.530
case yet, it's definitely not Bigfoot.
1148
00:58:45.150 --> 00:58:47.800
Yeah. Because he's all.
1149
00:58:47.739 --> 00:58:49.739
Over the cases where he can link Bigfoot to it.
1150
00:58:49.900 --> 00:58:50.139
Yes.
1151
00:58:50.480 --> 00:58:54.500
So yeah, he's never appeared in any of his books.
1152
00:58:54.900 --> 00:58:57.619
I haven't read any of the recent book, but any
1153
00:58:57.639 --> 00:59:01.739
of his older works, usually once politis gets wind of
1154
00:59:01.780 --> 00:59:04.710
a story, then some of the more off the deep
1155
00:59:04.769 --> 00:59:05.989
end theories come out of the woodwork.
1156
00:59:06.090 --> 00:59:07.659
So those are all the things. What do you think?
1157
00:59:08.380 --> 00:59:11.679
I don't, um, I think it's just a simple add out.
1158
00:59:11.760 --> 00:59:13.139
This is like my guess. Yeah.
1159
00:59:13.699 --> 00:59:16.780
He was at altitude. Storm comes in, goes off track.
1160
00:59:17.360 --> 00:59:20.059
If he was already descending and he was known to
1161
00:59:20.099 --> 00:59:22.940
descend down different pathways that maybe he thought was easier.
1162
00:59:22.980 --> 00:59:24.260
If you get hit with a storm and get lost.
1163
00:59:24.380 --> 00:59:24.619
Yeah.
1164
00:59:24.960 --> 00:59:29.099
I think he either cliffed out or got stuck somewhere,
1165
00:59:29.219 --> 00:59:32.699
fell somewhere, injured and succumbed to the elements.
1166
00:59:33.059 --> 00:59:37.880
And then that storm came in and concealed whatever evidence
1167
00:59:37.920 --> 00:59:38.579
there might've been.
1168
00:59:38.739 --> 00:59:39.780
Well, and it's so rocky.
1169
00:59:39.800 --> 00:59:41.400
And the thing that stuck out to me is they have,
1170
00:59:41.440 --> 00:59:43.760
and I've been climbing in mountains where you have like
1171
00:59:44.260 --> 00:59:46.619
large boulders mixed with small stuff and you can fall
1172
00:59:46.639 --> 00:59:49.739
and slip between them. So if you're in whiteout conditions walking,
1173
00:59:49.780 --> 00:59:52.190
you slip into like some, I don't know what it
1174
00:59:52.210 --> 00:59:53.889
would call, but between rocks and you kind of get,
1175
00:59:54.050 --> 00:59:57.769
then you're going to get buried by, Maybe not buried, like, completely,
1176
00:59:57.789 --> 01:00:00.449
but if the hole's covered up now by light snow,
1177
01:00:01.110 --> 01:00:01.449
I don't know.
1178
01:00:01.630 --> 01:00:03.690
That seems, like, over the top, but... Yeah.
1179
01:00:04.070 --> 01:00:06.940
No, I mean, I think that theory is the most likely. Yeah,
1180
01:00:07.539 --> 01:00:09.519
I think he just got lost in some kind of elements.
1181
01:00:09.539 --> 01:00:11.780
I think his remains are in that range somewhere.
1182
01:00:11.800 --> 01:00:15.420
Yeah. Probably within that three-peak area. I'm sure, yeah. But
1183
01:00:15.539 --> 01:00:17.230
it's so large. I mean, like we read.
1184
01:00:17.250 --> 01:00:21.070
It may never be found. 50-square-mile search radius. Maybe someday
1185
01:00:21.429 --> 01:00:24.650
something will be found. You never can say never because we...
1186
01:00:25.349 --> 01:00:27.090
once in a while we'll hear of a case we
1187
01:00:27.110 --> 01:00:29.989
covered in like a bone fragment or something was found.
1188
01:00:30.880 --> 01:00:32.940
So you never know, but we know he was out
1189
01:00:32.980 --> 01:00:36.920
there because they found his gear and his car. And
1190
01:00:37.099 --> 01:00:39.639
it's likely that he sadly passed away on one of
1191
01:00:39.679 --> 01:00:45.260
those peaks, either ascending or descending, probably descending. And most
1192
01:00:45.360 --> 01:00:47.480
likely during that storm.
1193
01:00:47.840 --> 01:00:51.079
Yeah. Probably when it happened and then it was buried. Yep.
1194
01:00:51.619 --> 01:00:53.119
That's what I think. I think that's most likely. I
1195
01:00:53.139 --> 01:00:55.500
don't even have a off the deep end. No, I
1196
01:00:55.539 --> 01:00:57.989
don't have an audience. There's nothing there that would point
1197
01:00:58.050 --> 01:01:00.969
as out of the ordinary. Nope.
1198
01:01:01.670 --> 01:01:06.130
All right. Well, thanks again for tuning in to Locations Unknown.
1199
01:01:06.170 --> 01:01:08.769
We appreciate you all for listening and sharing the show
1200
01:01:08.809 --> 01:01:10.769
with your friends and family. Be sure to like and
1201
01:01:10.809 --> 01:01:13.030
follow us on Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, and YouTube, where you
1202
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can find videos of each episode. Also, if you'd like
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to support the show monetarily, please visit our website or
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Facebook store to buy some sweet, sweet swag. You can
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subscribe to our Patreon account, YouTube, Apple subscriptions, anywhere where
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you can subscribe to have access to special events, additional
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shows for paid customers only. And lastly, when enjoying the
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beauty of nature, whether backpacking, camping, or simply taking a walk,
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always remember to leave no trace. Thanks, and we will
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see you all next time. Thank you.