Understanding Your Medicare Options

Pam Dunwald: [00:00:00] Welcome back to Healthcare Redefined, advocating for aging adults and their families. We're continuing our season two conversation on getting your affairs in order, because planning ahead can make such a big difference for aging adults and the people who love them.

Linda Kritikos: [00:00:15] Yeah, that's really correct. Planning ahead is so important in being proactive, especially with this topic we're covering today. It's really important. So in this episode, we're going to talk about Medicare coverage and insurance choices and why this topic can feel so stressful for families who are already juggling work, caregiving, and worry. I'm Linda Kritikos.

Pam Dunwald: [00:00:37] Hi, and I'm Pam Dunwald. If you've ever felt that knot in the pit of your stomach when a medical bill shows up, or you've wondered, are we on the right plan? Or you're afraid of making a decision that could cost your parents thousands? This episode is for you. We know this is a real feeling for our community. We had a daughter just recently of a client push back this last annual enrollment period push back on changing her mom's Medicare insurance because even though the premium was less money, she worried about the coverage and if her mom was going to get stuck with bills. So we know this is a really confusing and sensitive topic for families.

Linda Kritikos: [00:01:15] Yes, our health care system has become extremely complex and so has Medicare. Medicare, it can feel like a maze, confusing letters, deadlines, different types of plan changes, and a lot of fine print. And when you're trying to protect an aged loved one, it's not just paperwork, it's peace of mind. And knowing that you've gotten and made the right decisions for their health care.

Pam Dunwald: [00:01:39] Today our goal is that you'll walk away with a clear understanding of how Medicare works, learn some important terminology that that you need to know to be able to be informed what families should pay attention to when comparing coverage, and also how to avoid some common mistakes that might lead to surprise costs or worse, gaps in care.

Linda Kritikos: [00:02:00] So today, Pam and I are both honored to be joined by Kevin Maguire, owner of Tailored Health Designs. Kevin has eight years of experience as a Medicare agent, including six years as an independent broker. And that terminology is very important when you're looking for someone to help you with your health insurance, being independent. And he spent nine plus years before that in medical clinics and billing settings. That combination gives him a real world view of both insurance choices and how healthcare billing plays out for families, which is really, really important. Kevin became a broker because he wanted to be able to compare options across multiple companies and confidently answer the questions he heard all the time. Is this the plan you put your grandparents on? His goal is to help people find value and security with their health coverage planning. You know, before we get started, we always have to mention to the quick reminder that today's conversation is for educational purposes only. It's not insurance or financial advice. Every family and every situation is really different, so please reach out to a qualified professional for guidance based on your own specific needs. And be sure to check the show notes for resources related to this episode. Kevin, welcome to Healthcare Redefined. We're really glad you're here.

Kevin Maguire: [00:03:24] Thank you guys. I'm really excited to be here. I've enjoyed catching up on some episodes here in preparation to talk with you guys today.

Pam Dunwald: [00:03:30] Well, awesome. And just to kind of get us kicked off, Kevin, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and how you ended up where you are today?

Kevin Maguire: [00:03:39] Yeah, absolutely. My name is Kevin. I live in Chicago now. I started my business in Green Bay, Wisconsin. So most of my base and most of where I operate is kind of long. A lot of my friends call it the East coast of Wisconsin through the now and now down through the Chicago area. Personally, I'm married to Jen. We have about a year and a half run around the house. So that's been fun and exciting adventures. And yeah, about my business. So you guys mentioned, I've been doing this now for these six years. Scary to think about how quick that goes. And yeah, I work with Medicare obviously as a topic today, but I also help families if they're not 65 or not dealing with disability, where things like the ACA or the Affordable Care Act come into play and other types of lines. So thanks.

Pam Dunwald: [00:04:27] Awesome. Well, you know, Kevin, we had talked a little bit before that, you know, is this the plan you'd put your grandparents on? Why is that question so common? And what does it say about how families feel?

Kevin Maguire: [00:04:40] Yeah. Well, first off, I'm glad that people are still asking about my grandparents. I'm pushing for. I think a lot of it just has to do with the way that Medicare is marketed, really, I mean, if you're at home during the day and happen to have the TV on, I mean, that's every other commercial you see. It's everything talking about you're not getting enough benefits. Are you asking about these benefits? Let us take a look at your benefits. Give us this information. We'll tell you more. So I think, you know, just from the way that outreach has happened from brokers or other types of people that do insurance or health agents, I think that's kind of led to that question. It seems like people sense that it's a competitive market. And I think that when they're talking to somebody, it's easy to, especially in something where you're dealing with a big change to be a little mistrustful or a little worried about making a change like that. And I think that's really where it kind of comes from, just seeing how many people out there have an interest in wanting to talk to you about different plans, and then making these types of changes, the feelings that people have about their health.

Pam Dunwald: [00:05:54] Linda brought up a point that I just want to touch on, and that was the fact that you're an independent broker, your advisor. And I think that's really important because you mentioned all the commercials that come on and they're annoying. But it's insurance companies. It's more often than not, it's an individual insurance company that's promoting their Medicare product. And the nice thing about you and what they'll get in using someone like you is that you can compare plans. You're not having one insurance company tell you that they've got the best of the best, and you need to go with us. You can actually look at them side by side and learn what benefits they need, what they don't need, and who has the best plans suited for them. So I really want to point that out because I, I, I think that's a really, really important factor for families when considering a Medicare plan. So I'm going to move. Oh go ahead Kevin, did you have something.

Kevin Maguire: [00:06:52] Yeah. And honestly, there's just one thing. This is a little inside baseball and behind the scenes here. But I think even these days it's an important step to ask, you know, if you're going to work with an independent agent or any type of agent, are you willing to talk to me about plans that you won't make a commission on these days? There are options like that out there. And, you know, that's something that an agent has to weigh, you know, compensation versus your fiduciary duty to a client and to that person. So, you know, when you're talking about that stuff, make sure that you are getting all the options and not what somebody is trying to present to you these days.

Pam Dunwald: [00:07:29] So, you know, and, and that's a good point because some people don't understand that and correct me if I'm wrong, but more often than not, there is not a financial. You don't bill your clients to put these plans together. You're more often than not reimbursed by the insurance companies. But as you said, some of the insurance companies now are not even reimbursing the agents. So there's really no way for you to financially benefit from this. But as you said, being a fiduciary and looking out for the best interests of your clients, you want to put them in the plan that works best for them. So thank you for your transparency there and being honest about that.

Kevin Maguire: [00:08:05] And just real quick, I mean, just because even you may think, if you go online to some of these certain carriers, I won't name check them. That's not fair. But like Linda and I have had an example where you're only being presented the options that are commissionable to an agent at that place. So even when you're independently looking, it's important to do that extra layer of diligence. That's where somebody like me or somebody that has the same philosophy can be really important.

Pam Dunwald: [00:08:31] And that's really, really important nuggets to know. So Kevin, my last question before we move on to Linda is what do you see families, what are they most afraid of when they're trying to choose or change a Medicare plan?

Kevin Maguire: [00:08:46] Yeah. You know, it's really the fear of the unknown. I go back to that a lot more times than not, you think about health insurance. We think about the status of the health industry in our nation. And that's something that's very unstable. It's something that's a very wrong decision, you know, I would hesitate to call it life or death, but I mean, it can cause a lot of financial stress. It can cause delays in care, which I know we'll kind of talk about later. And I think it's about making sure that when you're going through this process, you're lining up the steps, you're taking the diligence to, to review your options and make a measured decision on that. I think it's being afraid of missing that maybe I would say it kind of plays into that as well. You know, just making sure that because I've had times with clients you go through 20 medications with somebody, which is why I'm excited that I partner with you guys a little bit and have the opportunity to talk to some of my clients. 20 medications seems crazy, but, you know, we've gotten in trouble because we didn't do 21.

Pam Dunwald: [00:09:53] And so, Kevin, I'm going to turn it over to Linda so that we can start breaking this whole process down. Linda. Go ahead.

Linda Kritikos: [00:10:03] Yeah. So Kevin, you know, you and I both have worked on a lot of this stuff and a lot of the things that we hear from some of the clients that, you know, I've worked with and that Pam's worked with and I'm sure you have, is in regards to Medicare, they all think Medicare is all the same thing. They don't realize that there's common parts of Medicare that they're eligible for or they're not eligible for, which is the parts A and B and what that covers, and part C and part D, and what is Medigap? What is Medicare Advantage? What's the difference? It's very confusing to a lot of individuals, all of these different terms because when they were growing up or when they were working, these things were not part of their whole life cycle. So I want to kind of delve into when people say to you, I'm on Medicare, what could that mean? What does that mean? And how do you piece that together when they talk to you about the fact that they're on Medicare?

Kevin Maguire: [00:11:05] Sure, absolutely. So when somebody leads with I'm on Medicare, that's a pretty safe assumption that I know that they're on both A and B, and that's going to be everybody who would use Medicare as their primary insurance, whether you're on a supplement or advantage. I think that's a little bit of a misconception that's out there. We'll talk a little bit here about Medicare Advantage, but you don't lose your eligibility for original Medicare. It's just a little bit of a different arrangement with Medicare and the insurance company. So I know you're an older person or somebody who is a little age I should probably use older might be mean, or he might be somebody who's disabled as well, and that's, I think that's an important segment of the population that maybe doesn't talk about their insurance as much and maybe misses out on a lot of benefits. If you're somebody who's disabled, particularly SSDI, that's an important distinction. You become Medicare eligible after two years, 24 months of continual disability. And a lot of people don't understand what happens when they start getting these letters and messages that a new card shows up. All of a sudden they get automatically put on a prescription drug plan. That can take a lot of people by surprise. So, you know, it's, it's a little bit more of a broader thing than people might even realize.

Linda Kritikos: [00:12:29] So to clarify, SSDI, Social Security Disability Insurance, which they are only eligible for if they have been disabled for a certain period of time and they have to apply for it just as if they were applying for Medicare. Can you just go in through the things that Medicare Part A covers, part B covers, and what Medicare Part C and D are?

Kevin Maguire: [00:12:52] Sure, absolutely. So part A, the easiest way to break that down is you're staying in a facility. Part A is going to cover costs related to inpatient care, whether that's a hospitalization, whether that's a rehab, anything of that ilk. Your part B then is going to cover the rest of those outpatient types of things. So if you're going and getting labs or visiting your specialist, even having a day surgery or observation, which I know we've talked about in the past, those can be things that are covered under your part B. Once we get into C, that's a Medicare Advantage plan. And a Medicare Advantage plan will combine your part A and part B for sure, but then it's really an arrangement with Medicare that's more akin to what, like a group insurance. Medicare plays the role of your employer just to kind of follow this analogy. And the Medicare Advantage Company is whatever company, you know, you choose to actually administer your Medicare benefit. So your Medicare premiums, some additional funds from Medicare, they go to these different insurance companies when you pick a Medicare Advantage plan. And that is how that's handled. They actually do all the administration of it for you versus, pardon me, regular Medicare itself. That's actually that would actually handle your claims and all that type of stuff.

Pam Dunwald: [00:14:14] Kind of like commercial insurance if you were still employed. One thing I just want to add to that is the Medicare Part A also covers Medicare home health. If they needed home health and also hospice. So I do know that those things are covered under that part A benefit. And you're right, part B is everything outpatient, including physical therapy, occupational therapy, all of the therapy types of things, anything that has to do with an outpatient.

Pam Dunwald: [00:14:41] So yeah. And that observation is quite confusing and very upsetting for a lot of people that are in the hospital. And they have to sign a moon form, that they are on observation, but they don't understand that that really impacts, you know, their bill and, and what's covered. Kevin, before we move on, I just as we're going through the distinctions of the different Medicare plans or parts of Medicare, could you just explain what we've talked about, basically what Medicare covers, but why would someone want their Medicare benefits managed by an insurance company rather than to just stay on straight Medicare? Is Medicare designed to be an all inclusive insurance or not?

Linda Kritikos: [00:15:30] Sure. No, that's a great question. So first off, that goes to part D. That's the last part of the alphabet soup. I didn't get there with my answer about part C, but that's Medicare prescription drug coverage. That didn't even exist for the first, you know, 50 years of the program. It wasn't until 2006 when that was first implemented. So that's been traditionally a huge gap in Medicare coverage. And without seeking out a part D or credible other coverage, that can continue to be a gap and a costly one with penalties on top of just not having help paying for some of these medications. But to get your question about why somebody would choose that, I think a lot of it has to come down with the costs. I mean, I can tell you pragmatically, it's what a lot of the business that I've written since I've been an independent agent has been these Medicare Advantage plans. I think the reason for that has a lot to do with the type of insurance that people have been used to. I thought Linda brought up a great point about how things have changed so much over the decades and how when we think about your parents' generation or people that they got a plan. They paid for everything through their job. And it was a relatively affordable thing for them. So when I think when you see these older people on Medicare, people are more into their kind of 80s, later 70s, 80s now, that was the insurance they were used to when they were really working.

Kevin Maguire: [00:16:56] And so a supplement tends to be something they're more gravitated to because of the fact that it has that type of certainty in a way that they're used to. Conversely, nowadays, you can get a Humana or UnitedHealthCare plan through your job. When you get through your job, that plan is going to have a medical deductible. A lot of these part C Medicare Advantage plans don't, that's a huge consideration for people. If you would even be looking at just a Medicare Advantage plan versus original Medicare hospitalization is over $1,600 on original part A if you only have original Medicare without any type of additional coverage on that, it takes a week in the hospital. Most of these Medicare Advantage plans actually hit that amount. So that's some things you can consider. It's also a zero cost way to get prescription drug coverage, helps you stay compliant and avoid future penalties for that. So, I think it covers a lot of utility for somebody that's on Medicare. And like I said, frankly, I just think it's what people are more kind of used to these days.

Linda Kritikos: [00:18:06] Mhm. I also think it has to do a lot with cost, because I think there's a large percentage of our population throughout the United States on these advantage plans. And I think because of that, the volume has decreased a lot of the cost on these plans and these plans. They do offer a lot of bells and whistles that some people are very much enticed with. But I think delving into what they actually need for if they have frequent hospitalizations, if they see their doctor quite frequently. That may help determine whether an advantage plan or supplement or Medigap coverage is more appropriate for them than an advantage plan. But I do think the cost does have a lot to do with it. If there's no deductible. And a lot of times there's no extra cost after they're hospitalized. The thing that, as Pam brought up, the observation status is more prominent in an advantage plan. So and I think but they have ways around that now with different programs. So I just feel that you're right. It has to do with a lot more people being more used to it. It looks like a regular insurance plan. You have to go through the same type of authorizations that anybody else would. So it is something that they're more comfortable with. And I also think the cost isn't as prohibitive to a large portion of the population versus Medigap coverage.

Kevin Maguire: [00:19:33] Yeah, I think Oh, sorry. Well, we're kind of on the topic. You know, I think cost is a really I think kind of a misconception that people have about premium even if you're expecting higher quality necessarily with paying a premium. I want, when I'm advising people, I kind of flip that on its head. It's a lot. I'm like, you know, let's look at this from the other perspective. Your only fixed cost is premium. That's the only 100% thing that you're going to have with your insurance plan. Everything else, like technically, I mean, I'm not advising people, change your medications, change your doctors, do this, do that, but when you're looking at, when you're in a health insurance plan, the only thing that's not going to change, you're not, that's not going to reduce your premium. So I think that an important part of our decision making is how much are you going to invest in your health care all the time, and how much value are you going to actually extract out of that?

Pam Dunwald: [00:20:30] You know, that reminded me my mom has a Medicare Advantage plan, and I was putting her medications in for her to get a mail order service. And me being the nurse. I mean, we come from I know it's come full circle, but when Linda and I were first nursing, it was a lot about the brand names of the drugs versus the generic. And now it's kind of switched. Well, now they talk generically. Well, I was putting in her mail order and I put in the word Lasix, the brand name for the water pill furosemide. And, you know, I looked at what her co-pay was going to be and I'm like, holy buckets. I said, I just messed up. I went back in and I put furosemide in and it ended up being no co-pay, you know, versus 20 bucks. So it's these little things that really can throw you off.

Kevin Maguire: [00:21:18] Oh no doubt. Yeah. Brand brand names of medications, especially when you're, when you're somebody that's clinical. I think that's a little bit of a divide from somebody that's a health insurance agent. I know in your notes and stuff will say the brands and stuff. And that's the way that you refer to it. And like you might tell somebody that's a little green behind the ears. Lasix. And I've no idea what you're talking about.

Linda Kritikos: [00:21:40] So let's get on to this next question here which talks about medication. Thanks for bringing that up, Pam, so where does prescription coverage fit in and why do people get surprised by their medication costs when it comes to their insurance plans?

Kevin Maguire: [00:21:54] Yeah. So since 2006, having some type of prescription drug coverage isn't required. You know, by the words you are required to have it. It's more of the carrot approach. Take it and we won't find you in the future or won't penalize you in the future. So the rules do state, though, that you have to have what they call creditable drug coverage. So you can get that either through Medicare Part D, because obviously those are, you know, the private companies that are contracted with Medicare, or if you have coverage that Medicare deems similar enough to a part D program, you are allowed to keep that. So where that can kind of come into play is like if you're turning 65 and maybe feel like you got a few more years left at work, people often worry, well, what happens if I don't take Medicare right away? I hear I'm going to have penalties. Well, as long as you maintain your other creditable insurance, your work insurance, that would be okay. Or like when we're talking specifically about prescriptions in Wisconsin, I don't know where you guys are based or I do a lot of business.

Kevin Maguire: [00:23:06] You can also have a credible alternative to prescription drug coverage through Wisconsin Senior Care, which is a really cool thing. And that's a program that I love. I wish I had it here in Illinois. It's a great tool to help people with their flexibility. If you don't take medications at the time we're doing an application, I can put you on to senior care. And if six months down the road, you find out you need to be on whatever type of medication we can choose then, and kind of focus your medications in more at that time versus having a little bit of a less complete picture. So I mean, having it and making sure it's creditable or important. I think one thing I would, you know, especially nowadays where I think we're a little more used to shopping around for stuff and kind of piecing things together. If you're open minded on that and have somebody working with you or have a good knowledge of these programs, you can really take advantage of ways to keep your costs down overall.

Linda Kritikos: [00:24:00] Each state, each state actually may be very different like here we have that program. But you know, as you said, Illinois doesn't have it. So I think other states may have other things. So people will need to investigate that with, you know, their insurance, you know, the insurance agent that they used or the associate that they use to ask to see if there's any specialized program to help with their medication, especially if they're on a lot of different medications.

Pam Dunwald: [00:24:28] Kevin, can you just briefly while we were on the subject, the medications, you know, in the last couple of years, I think I believe this is the second year they're doing it now for people that are on maybe high dollar medications or there's now, can you talk a little bit about the gap and how Medicare can help someone maybe make payments throughout the year for those medications?

Kevin Maguire: [00:24:47] Yeah, that's great because that has changed a lot. I mean, frankly, you've seen a lot of people see increases in their medication prices on Medicare over the last couple of years. So last year, so going into 2025 was the first year that Medicare had a hard cap on what people on part D could pay for prescriptions out of pocket for prescriptions. And not only was it the first time, it was a hard cap, it was the first time it was also significantly reduced from the soft cap. So you used to have, so in 2024 and beyond, you used to have to pay 9000 plus dollars out of your own pocket before you paid, you know, like 5% of what that medication cost. In 2025 moving forward, if you were one of those consumers who used to pay $10,000 for your medications, all of a sudden you were going to be capped at $2,000. So the way that you saw the insurance companies kind of work around that was you kind of saw a flattening. So in addition to the cap, they also made some changes to the stages of prescription drug coverage. I won't get too technical behind the scenes, but basically there used to be a deductible phase, an initial phase, a donut hole that everyone knows about a coverage gap, and then your catastrophic phase. Starting last year, they technically got rid of the donut hole. However, I kind of throw that technically in front of there because the now standard benefit for Medicare prescription drugs is the 25% that you would have paid in the donut hole after your deductible. So it's kind of interesting. So that doesn't mean that you're going to see 25% copays on all or even most of your medications on a prescription drug plan. But technically, the standard benefit now is what the donut hole used to be.

Pam Dunwald: [00:27:04] Yeah. I mean, I have a client who has chronic obstructive pulmonary disease and she's on a very expensive medication called Trelegy. And that was one of the concerns when she was changing Medicare plan advantage plans is that she 's the only thing, the only drug now that works for her, that really keeps her out of the hospital for months and months at a time. So she was really concerned about that. But then when she could spread the cost of that Trelegy with her other medications over a 12 month period, it became more affordable for her.

Kevin Maguire: [00:27:34] Yeah. And that's been the last kind of cherry on the top of things that have come with those big. Well, there's two things that have also come out of that change. So the first is the Medicare prescription payment program that really is very helpful for a lot of people because kind of like what I said, they kind of flat things out a little bit. A lot more plans in the last couple of years actually have a prescription deductible now on even up to tier three medications that were starting to go away. Like I'll name check them. It doesn't matter. It's not available anymore. But like two years ago, UnitedHealthCare didn't have in Wisconsin, didn't have a prescription deductible on any of their plans, any tier. And now you're seeing some companies even go back to a deductible on tier two medications. So prescription, the Medicare prescription payment program allows you to take what would be a big initial hit when you're in that deductible phase and kind of spread that out over 12 months, and then it's kind of an ongoing thing based off of what medications you're picking up and stuff.

Kevin Maguire: [00:28:31] Medication changes your monthly bill to essentially make sure you're zeroed out at the end of the year. Um, and then the last thing that was the big change actually deals with the affordability and medications along with all those changes. One thing that Medicare did to kind of help the insurance companies was they actually took over negotiating the prices for. It started with a list of ten medications. Hopefully that picks up again here in the next couple of years. But a lot of very common, a lot of very common prescriptions that have been high dollar for Medicare recipients were actually reduced in price because the Medicare negotiated rate is a fraction, sometimes a quarter or a third of what the retail or old price had been on some of these medications. So Eliquis is a great example. One of those medications I don't remember all the top, I don't remember the ten of them off the top of my head. But that's something that hopefully we'll see expanded on in the next few years as well when it comes to drug coverage.

Pam Dunwald: [00:29:29] We want to just focus on some practical first steps for listeners. So as we're talking about where they should start, what they should, you know, bring when they meet with an advisor, you know, how do you, if you could kind of walk us through, how do you determine or how do you help a family determine whether or not Medicare, you know, with a supplement is best for them or Medicare with an advantage plan? Do they travel? What impact does a, say, a Medicare Advantage plan, say on someone who is a snowbird? So how do you determine, first of all, before choosing the exact plan, how do you go about choosing what would be a better fit for their lifestyle?

Kevin Maguire: [00:30:12] Yeah, absolutely. I think a lot of it kind of comes down to an individual's personal philosophy on how they want to protect themselves. And then there's caveats and maybe practicalities that kind of come into the equation from there. There's some people where, you know, the cost of having a supplement, you know, doesn't, doesn't deter them. They just like the idea that Medicare doesn't have as many hoops to jump through in terms of getting different stuff approved, they like the fact that after a few couple hundred dollars, they don't have to worry about pulling out their checkbook anymore. They like the idea that they don't have to worry as much about a network. And, you know, you deliver that for those people. Because at the end of the day, it's about your personal comfort, you know? But you know, from there, you know, you start to look at some of the practicalities of the matter. You know, a budget is a huge matter of it. You know, if you're investing a couple hundred bucks a month in a premium, where is that? Where is that money coming from when you're on a fixed income, you know, from there, it starts to come into then, if you're kind of starting to look at more of an advantage plan, who are your doctors? Who are the people that you absolutely would want to keep versus maybe who are the people that, if you can get a much lower co-pay or if you can get a much better benefit in another area that you might need more, where are you willing to sacrifice some of those benefits? What are your medications? You know, one thing that I would never suggest, you know, that's a conversation between you and your doctor is changing meds.

Kevin Maguire: [00:31:44] You know, I don't like to sell that way. I don't like to push people to do that. But that's something you need to factor in. You know, what's going to be the impact. Every plan is required to cover all prescription drug categories that are Medicare approved, which does not include weight loss, by the way. Important for a lot of listeners these days, but they don't necessarily require the same brand. So that can be a change that when you're experiencing that you experience, if you're looking at a different company, whether you're looking at a prescription drug plan or a Medicare Advantage.

Pam Dunwald: [00:32:16] If we can just break this down very simply. So if we can just briefly, Kevin, compare Medicare, Medicare with a supplement and a Medicare Advantage, look at the average costs. And why someone might choose one over the other. I know we briefly. But if we can just do, like side by side, kind of quick so people understand the pros and cons of each one of those types of choices.

Kevin Maguire: [00:32:43] Yeah. So that's a great question. So the reason why people don't just go with traditional Medicare by itself very often is a number of reasons. A, it does include prescription drug coverage. So Definitionally at minimum, you need a part D plan of some type, whether that comes in a Medicare Advantage or not. When you're choosing a supplement from that, then you're choosing something that's going to put a cap on that cost, it's going to become a very predictable cost. It's higher, but it's predictable. You know pretty much exactly what you're going to spend. Maybe if you're a healthy person, you don't you don't hit yourself out of. You know, you don't hit the part B deductible that year. You never went to the doctor. You know, that's really the difference though. It might be a couple hundred dollars. With an advantage plan, you're going to see a little bit more of a wide variety. If you only go a couple times a year for your medication, an annual review, you're going to have, you know, next to zero when it comes to that cost, you could theoretically have $0 for an entire year on a Medicare Advantage plan.

Kevin Maguire: [00:33:57] If you're on little or very cheap generic meds, or if you're only going to see your primary doctor on a plan that has $0 labs and all that type of stuff. On the flip side, you could hit your out-of-pocket maximum on an advantage plan, which is, especially early on when you're first getting onto Medicare, that can be 2 to 3 times the cost of your annual premium payments for a supplement plan. So when we're considering why we go one way or the other, what way do we choose, we think about, how do you want to handle your money? Are you comfortable with setting aside, let's just look at a five year period. You're probably putting down six, $7,000 in premiums over a supplement over that time on an advantage plan. You need to have cancer a couple times. You need to be in and out of the hospital 15 or 20 times. You know, it's like, these are some hot, are these things that you are at high risk of hitting? Are these things, you know, so, you know, it goes down to those types of things.

Pam Dunwald: [00:35:01] And Kevin, can you just touch base like with a Medicare Advantage plan? What are the challenges? Say, if you're a snowbird, if you spend part of the time in one state and then you maybe go south or go west for a part of the year.

Kevin Maguire: [00:35:13] Yeah. So I mean, you're dealing with networks when you're dealing with an advantage plan, like a commercial or private insurance plan. And that can be challenging. You know, if having a PPO in those instances is obviously something that can help ease the friction or kind of grease the skids a little bit for being in a little bit of a different area. You get out of network benefits, though they might not not always be the most functional out of network benefits, but what you are finding to help people who are choosing Medicare Advantage plans is even on HMOs, companies will oftentimes have out of area networks, basically. So if you're going down to Florida, company X will have a list of doctors that participate in your Wisconsin plan, even though you're spending that time in Florida. So, I mean, those are things that you need to bring to the table when you're coming up. And that can mean the difference between a supplement advantage. That can mean the difference between an HMO advantage versus a PPO advantage.

Pam Dunwald: [00:36:19] And that leads right into my next question. So when someone is going to come and meet with their Medicare insurance advisor, what do they need with or what I mean, what do they need to know or share with you or bring with you when they're going to try and choose a plan?

Linda Kritikos: [00:36:35] Yeah, absolutely. There's the really practical things. There's your doctor list, there's your medications, there's the ways that you anticipate using the plan. And then if it's the first time conversation, just kind of of a thing that I like, it'd be helpful if people thought about, but a thought about it a little bit before they came, as you know, philosophically, are you the type of person that wants to have the security of a cost certainty with your Medicare coverage and pay a little bit more? Because, I mean, frankly, the cost of a supplement, I know I probably sound a little bit more lean advantage right now. The cost of a supplement for many people is still very still very competitive compared to what they would have paid if they were on the open market, on an ACA plan or even through or even through an employer. So, I mean, you know, being on Medicare overall is still cheaper for a lot of people than it is on some of these private insurance plans. But obviously, there can be a wide difference between the different type of product that you choose. I think bringing those to the table, double checking that, making sure that everything's in there so things don't get messed up. I think those are really it, just gathering anything that would be a concern of yours and anything that you want to make sure that someone's factoring into that plan for you.

Pam Dunwald: [00:37:52] Kevin, I just have one last question in this section. And I just want to say, do you see are there any common mistakes that you see people make when they're choosing a plan quickly or based solely on the monthly premiums? Any words of advice for that?

Kevin Maguire: [00:38:09] Yeah, absolutely. Devils are in the details with a lot of stuff, and especially if you're in like Chicago and Illinois is a great example of how thin this line can be, especially if you're looking at something like an HMO. A doctor can be in network at 101 Main Street, but not in network at 202 Smith Street. So when you're doing the shopping yourself, or if you're having somebody look with you, it's important to know that location when you're reviewing these things because that could be it. Something like with prescriptions, it's important when you're going through that stuff, you don't want to assume that you're a parent or a loved one or yourself, you don't want to just put in a capsule when you're taking a tablet. If you ever just do that for fun on some of these websites, the cost can be hundreds or thousands of dollars. Even though you're thinking this is the exact same thing, it's really making sure that you're paying attention to those good details, I would say. And then, we kind of talked a little bit about my philosophy on things like basing it off of a monthly premium. I think it's one of the biggest factors that needs to play. But you know, that balances out compared to what you can actually afford and what might be the best solution.

Pam Dunwald: [00:39:33] You know, and before I turn over, Linda, I just want to say that, I have a client right now in Minnesota and she has an advantage plan and she's in a very small town. She doesn't drive. So transportation is an issue with her. And she needed to have a radiology, she needed to have a special X-ray done that they don't do at the clinic and the hospital. The local hospital in her town is not a network. The clinic is, but the hospital is not. So you're absolutely right. I mean, people need to be aware of these little intricacies sometimes.

Linda Kritikos: [00:40:06] Yeah, just a couple things I just wanted to add to some of the previous comments that were made is that some of these advantage plans now actually cover international coverage to a certain level. If you're traveling, if you're one of these people that actually don't snowbird to Florida, but maybe snowbird to Germany or to Japan or wherever you're going. They will have international coverage. You just need to ask for the specifics of that plan. But I do know that there are a few plans now that are starting to cover international coverage for people who are traveling to Europe or to Asia. One of the other things is in regards to what you were saying in regards to these hidden costs, or Doctor Smith, this doctor not covered on Smith Street but covered on Main Street. I think that's one of the gotchas that people don't really get when they're looking at these plans and supplement plans just as any other plan goes up as you age, such as even with the advantageous plans. And one of the things that also goes up with it is the medication costs. If they're not part of that network or pharmacy, even knowing where your pharmacy is. I do know that I have a client right now that uses CVS. Well, under the new plan, CVS isn't a network, so they have to now go to another pharmacy and transfer everything over in order for it to be covered under the plan.

Linda Kritikos: [00:41:33] So it's very important that a lot of these things. It is truly the devil is in the details because you've got to have been prepared with all of the all of your documents, your pharmacy. So when they meet with someone like you can actually give them the best advice in regards to, where are your pharmacies that you choose? Where are the medications coming from, especially if it's compounded medication, which is a medication that is made specially, but only certain pharmacies actually do it. So those things need to be taken into account. As you look for things that are within your network. Network being the actual contracts that they have with these entities under the insurance plan. So can you give us a little more about these common gotchas or these unexpected bills, especially when they're managing chronic conditions? Like chronic conditions are so difficult and they have exacerbations of the disease, which means the disease gets worse, and then it gets better, and then it gets worse again. So can you give us a little of the gotchas that lead to some of these unexpected bills? And I think we talked about one of them being the observation status in a hospital.

Linda Kritikos: [00:42:49] Yeah, I think especially these days, that's probably one of the biggest. I think another thing you're just kind of seeing is generally just kind of how, how facilities are allowed to bill for some of these things. I mean, this is something we all see now. I mean, I remember when I was a kid, like when you went for your annual physical and stuff, that was $0. You got labs, they did their exam and then you didn't pay for that. I know the last couple times that I've had my annual physical, now I get a bill for my co-pay for the labs all of a sudden. So like, you know, I think that is something that's starting to come into play a little bit more. And that would obviously be, again, more on your Medicare Advantage plan than a supplement, because the supplement is just that gap plan you're paying to, to not see the bill. You know, when things change with your with your treatment plan, that can be kind of a gotcha, I guess, you know, if we kind of put together a plan based off of, you know, path A, and then all of a sudden we kind of need to veer off from that path.

Kevin Maguire: [00:43:51] They want to try a different type of medication. You know, they want to try a different facility or different doctor for that. You know, that can be some of those areas. You know, overall, I would still say generally, I still kind of lean towards using the information we have now and planning for the things we can plan for. Because between special election periods, between just the fact that you have the ability to change your plan every year annually, there's ways to get around things that come up along the way. And generally, you know, you're probably still ahead if you, if you took care of the stuff that you knew you needed to take care of, because a lot of that time doesn't go away either. That's still part of the equation. It's just some other things that have come along.

Linda Kritikos: [00:44:33] Yeah, and in addition to that, I have another question for you in regards to an individual that you look at and say, well, what do I need? What do I need a Medigap coverage for? I have straight, I have Medicare, why do I need this? What, why do I need this? And then all of a sudden they get this bill.

Kevin Maguire: [00:44:52] So yeah.

Linda Kritikos: [00:44:53] Because they don't have it. And am I clear on this that a Medigap coverage only covers that hospitalization? It doesn't cover their drugs, doesn't have vision care, or dental care. They need to have separate plans for all of those things. So can you kind of go into a little bit about that, why someone would need that Medigap coverage and what that deductible for Medicare is?

Kevin Maguire: [00:45:17] Yeah, absolutely. So, so yeah, so yeah, I mean, there's also just kind of really, as a funny aside, there's some things that just Medicare itself doesn't like flat out pay for like the first three pints field leaders. I never remember which, uh, which unit of measure it is, but your first three units of a blood transfusion are not covered by Medicare. So four through infinity are, but not the first three. So like any other type, whether you're doing part C or a supplement, though, that's going to be covered as part of that thing. So any type of supplement, but more specifically a supplement, it's going to fill in those weird kinds of persnickety things that can kind of come up with original Medicare. Or going back to our original point about part A, it's a $1,600 deductible, not only for a night or ten nights in the hospital. It's a $1,600 deductible, more than likely if you went to the hospital on Tuesday and then were readmitted three weeks from then. If it's not the exact same, if it's not for the exact same reason, that's a totally new set of things.

Kevin Maguire: [00:46:30] So you either have your Medigap plan, your supplement where part A is covered at 100%. On a lot of those plans, you can choose 50% coverage toward the part A deductible as well. Most people, in my opinion, when they're going that supplement route, choose the 100% though. Pardon me. Sorry. And you know, obviously we talked about how the advantage plans were done, break that up just by having, you know, a 3 or 4 or $500 per night copay. Um, so it's important to supplement that just because, you know, there are those gaps. There's no out of pocket maximum on original Medicare. So if you really have a year, you know, where you're dealing with cancer and you have a couple million dollars worth of treatments, say you like you're responsible for 20% of that. And that can be a lot, a lot of money. So that's the reason why it's ideal to have something versus nothing on top of that. Part A and part B.

Linda Kritikos: [00:47:25] On top of that, if you're hospitalized, that deductible each time you go into the hospital, that's considered a new benefit or a new episode of care. Mhm.

Kevin Maguire: [00:47:34] Yeah, it's a very, very narrow band where it's considered readmission for your prior issue.

Linda Kritikos: [00:47:40] Mhm. Okay. Well, that'll make people think money wise, you know. Especially with the, with the cost of everything in healthcare costing such, so being so expensive.

Kevin Maguire: [00:47:51] I used to tell people, I don't, I don't see as many of those people in my practice today. But when I was on, when I was in a call center, you know, getting people from all over the country, all over different walks, you know, everything. Like I get those people. And my advice to those is just, you know, you clearly don't go to the doctor. You clearly don't have strong opinions on this stuff. Get a Medicare Advantage plan because maybe you then want because then you maybe you decide you do want to have your teeth checked out, or you do want to get in and get your glasses checked. Or maybe part of the reason you're so healthy is because you've been going to the YMCA. Like plans will pay for those. Yeah. So if you're that type of, if you're that type of person, that's kind of level, like something like a Medicare Advantage plan is perfect for you. But the insurance company loves making those choices for you.

Linda Kritikos: [00:48:35] So okay, so going into that, so how does prior authorization, you know, in simple terms, because I mean, it can be just like mind blowing in itself. So explain prior authorization and why does it matter? I mean, because I do know that there's some, there was something out there that was stating that some of these supplements were now going to require that they never required them before, but now are going to require prior authorization for certain procedures, which they didn't need to get prior authorization for before. So tell me a little bit about who requires it, why? What is it and why is it important?

Kevin Maguire: [00:49:11] Yeah, sure. So prior authorization is a part of a process where your providers are having things they want to do to you, basically reviewed by the insurance company. It's important, you know, at least the reason why it's put in place is to help prevent fraud, waste and abuse. Unfortunately, there's a lot of very prominent cases of Medicare fraud out there. So, I mean, there is a practical purpose to it. But obviously, the time when we hear it, you know, it's about the horror stories. You know, something just came across my social media feed the other day. You know, a cancer or an insurance company denied an authorization for a cancer treatment for somebody and they died. There's definitely a layer of protection that cuts both ways. But the idea behind it mostly is just to make sure that something that doctors recommend makes sense for your situation, I guess.

Linda Kritikos: [00:50:11] Mhm. So how do out-of-pocket maximums fit into all that?

Kevin Maguire: [00:50:15] Yeah. So and this is a good I'm going to, I'm going to throw this in and kind of compare it to a deductible as well. Because I hear those terms used interchangeably a lot. And I think it's just we're conditioned to form high deductible plans, but that's not necessarily the case. So the out-of-pocket maximum on a plan is the most money that you can personally spend out of pocket in a calendar year or on, on your health covered health related needs. Before that, you can have a deductible where you're responsible for 100% of the contracted cost of that. So a deductible is a period where you're responsible for the total cost of something. And then what was deducted is an out of pocket maximum when you just don't have to pay any money more towards that covered care.

Linda Kritikos: [00:51:06] Okay. All right, Pam, I'm going to hand this back to you now that he's answered my questions.

Pam Dunwald: [00:51:11] Yeah. And as we start to wind down, wind down. Kevin, I just want to make a comment. You know, we were my mom was a victim of one of those horror stories she had, and I won't mention the name, but she had a Medicare Advantage plan that denied a simple back surgery. They denied it based on the fact that they said it was not a Medicare covered procedure. And in our research, it was several years ago, and fortunately, we were in a annual enrollment period. So we changed advantage plans. And that took effect January 1st. By March, she had her surgery, no questions asked. So, you know, there are differences. And it's, it's, it's, it's difficult. There's a lot of variety. So what I want to do is I want to try and bring it back to, you know, our families and the aging adults that are choosing these Medicare plans. And what would you say to someone or a family or an aging adult that's terrified of making the wrong choice? Is there any, any times that they can change or what? What do you tell them when they're afraid, if they make a wrong decision?

Kevin Maguire: [00:52:16] Yeah, absolutely. I bring it up a lot more during the open enrollment period than I do during, during other times of the year, during annual enrollment, you have the most flexibility that you ever have when you're doing something. So when it's that annual time to shop, it doesn't hurt to shop. And in my opinion, it doesn't even hurt to try. If you even have an inkling that it's something that you might want to change. The reason for that is there's a runway, right? During most times of the year, you pick a plan and it starts the first of that next month, it could be a whole month. You could have time to think about these other questions. It could be the next day and then all of a sudden you're on your plan. So it's a time where, you know, if you have other if other things come to your mind, other questions pop up. There's a lot of time to fix it. Especially if you're on a Medicare Advantage plan. It's also the easiest time to go back in and change your mind. So you have an annual enrollment period, which is between October 15th and December 7th. And then for people that have Medicare Advantage plans, you also have Medicare Advantage Open enrollment, which starts on January 1st and goes through March 31st.

Kevin Maguire: [00:53:28] So that's like I said, I always encourage people to hop in and get that plan review, especially during the annual enrollment period, because that's when you have the most flexibility to make that change. I will say beyond that, then it doesn't necessarily mean that all hope is lost, as if eventually you do change and all of a sudden it's June, right? You don't have that open enrollment period. There's a lot of special life events that can impact your ability to change coverage. If you move into a nursing home or move out of a nursing home, for example, that's a reason to be able to change your coverage. Um, if you enroll in Wisconsin Senior Care, that can be a way to help you change your, you know, that can be a, that can give you flexibility down the line to change your coverage. If you move, if you, you know, if you may find out you have a loss of income and all of a sudden you may qualify for extended benefits. If you do qualify for something like Medicaid or low income assistance, you have the opportunity then to change a plan that can be in line with that as well.

Pam Dunwald: [00:54:30] Thanks. And before I pass that on to Linda, to wrap things up, I have one last question. So we like to give our listeners some action items, things that they can, you know, do after they listen to one of our episodes. But what might be one small step a listener can take this week to feel like they're more in control?

Kevin Maguire: [00:54:50] Yeah, absolutely. You know, the first thing I would think about is, you know, when was the last time you actually had an insurance review? We've talked about the kind of flux in the prescription drug part D market. We've seen that through a lot of different plans across a lot of different sections. I even just Medicare, even as individual shoppers. So I mean, the benefit that you had three years ago might have been very competitive with other things that are in the area, but that might not be competitive now. It's important to kind of think about that mindset. You know, there are a lot of options. There's a lot of choices. There's a lot of factors that can go into things going wrong being on an individual market. But on the other side, on the flip side, you have a lot of choices that can make things better. So if especially if fear or the fear of the unknown has been something that's held you back, like it, don't let don't let that you know. Don't let that cause you to potentially be paying more or not have coverage for anything you need. Um, you know, once you've kind of made up your mind that you're going to have that review, you know, start thinking about how you're actually using the doctor if you haven't used that. Because when we're doing our, when we're doing our review and we're talking about, you know, how, how we're going to allocate, you know, what we're going to prioritize, you know, chronic issues. If you're seeing your specialist, you know, every quarter or six times a year, that's important. Like we want to make sure that, you know, a specialist co-pay is something we're focusing on a little bit more. If, you know, if you go ahead.

Pam Dunwald: [00:56:24] No, I was just going to say just how they would go about getting a review if they've, you know.

Kevin Maguire: [00:56:29] Oh, sure. Yeah. So everyone's always welcome to call me. Of course, I'm happy to do it, but there's a lot of local representatives in your area all across the country. Ask a friend. You know, the thing that's cool about this, about this industry. And the thing I really love is the, is the connections that I make with people, you know, find somebody that you have a good that you have a good fit with somebody that you really feel like you can trust that has a track record and, you know, or maybe that doesn't, it just needs that shot. But you know, that, you know, that is being upfront and open and honest with you. Shop around, get a couple of different opinions on what's best for you, you know, ask the questions too. Are you an independent broker? Are you again, are you willing to look at noncommissioned plans for me?

Pam Dunwald: [00:57:13] That's a great point. And also, I just want to point out, too, that in every county in every state of the United States, there is an aging and disability center, resource center, or a government agency that supports aging. And I know a lot of them also have advisors where they could come in, at least answer questions and help clarify things for them. So that would be another resource for that. So, Linda, I'm going to go ahead and turn it over to you to wrap it up.

Linda Kritikos: [00:57:37] Okay. One question that I have before we close out a lot of stuff is, you know, we just talked about, you know, an annual, what does an annual Medicare checkup really look like, and who would consider who should consider doing one?

Kevin Maguire: [00:57:52] Yeah. I mean, everybody who's on Medicare should work with either themselves if they manage their health insurance stuff or whoever in their family to make sure that this is getting looked at every year. And nothing at a minimum is just to know what's changing with your plan. Because like I said, especially over the last three years or so, like it's there's been a lot of change. And like, you know, your plan that used to be very good on, you know, name the benefit, maybe scans, maybe need to have a Pet scan or something every year. Like your plan that used to be really good, that might not be the best of that anymore. And if that's where you're spending a lot of your health care money, you at least need to know where that fits in. So I, you know, it's, it's a good practice to get into. It's a great way to. Uh, it's a great way to know your health, plan the best, and really empower you to be able to make the most out of it. I mean, even some of my own clients, you know, I'll get something where like, we'll go over in our annual review and like, you never told me that. I'm like, of course I did. We go over this every year.

Linda Kritikos: [00:58:59] So essentially what you're saying is that, you know, everyone should really take a look at this. And a lot of it will be based on are they having elective surgeries this next year? What is your overall health status? Has it changed from last year? You know, has your income status changed from last year? Are you planning to travel or have your lifestyle circumstances changed in regards to. So that's all part of this annual Medicare check up that you would review with them. Yeah.

Kevin Maguire: [00:59:26] And I would even say, if you're sorry, just real quick, like if you're somebody that doesn't use the, the, like the medical doctor a whole lot and stuff, maybe you're somebody that knows that you need to have a decent amount of, you know, work done on your teeth, or maybe you want to have a high amount because you want nice glasses, like you're outside a lot. You need someone to hold up, you know? Like, these are the types of things you can shop on. And it can be, you know, it's I know the power, the a little bit of fear of choice and, and change can kind of lead people to not doing it. But I think if you kind of flip it around your head, it can be really empowering and you can feel, you know, you can, you can feel great that you're, that you're getting everything you can out of, out of this. And then that people tend to feel helpless in, you know?

Pam Dunwald: [01:00:08] Yeah, it gives more control. Absolutely.

Linda Kritikos: [01:00:10] Yeah. So, you know, I mean, you've given us a lot of golden nuggets and some action plans for people to, to actually start doing, especially when it comes to this annual Medicare checkup, which, you know, we should all do or anybody that's on Medicare straight Medicare Advantage plan. But what would be one strong takeaway that you would want someone to really look at or know about what we've done in, in your, you know, and from your history and from your experience, what would be one takeaway from all this that you would want someone to to know?

Kevin Maguire: [01:00:47] I think the biggest thing was, I worked in operations and, and helping customer service and that type of stuff for a lot of years. It's my, my first boss's favorite expression for our clients was don't suffer in silence. I think that is probably the takeaway that I would have for people like, you know, everybody's got their friends who have been on Medicare for a while and they become the experts in our lives because, because they have the experience with it. But, you know, like they haven't traveled the same path as you and they maybe haven't had the same struggle that you're having with something. So like, even though it's, you know, April 15th when we're recording this and we're not in an obvious open enrollment period, like we, there might be things we can do in the meantime to help alleviate that. And if nothing else, you know, you can be assured that you have somebody that's going to fight like heck to make sure that it's not a problem for you again.

Linda Kritikos: [01:01:44] So in saying that, where can listeners learn more to get help when they're comparing options in a way that, you know, that helps with their situation? Where can they go for this? And we'll actually put some of this information in our show notes and, and provide them with some information to connect with, with individuals with resources. But where would you suggest listeners learn from and get comparing options that fits their situation?

Kevin Maguire: [01:02:15] Yeah, absolutely. People are always more than welcome to contact me. We'll make sure that my contact information is in there for you to reach out. The Adrc went to Pam's point earlier. They will often provide lists of local representatives for you. I think that's a great approach to take because they're the people that, that go through and do the annual certifications and licensing to make sure that they're, they're up to date on, on what these Medicare Advantage plans are and and different options for supplements to, you know, they can reach out to your friends, you know, who are you using for this? Is this somebody that you trust? Do you feel like they're attentive to you? Do you get a call every year to make sure that you're going over stuff? You know, be proactive in that stuff and, and don't it's, it's just, it's so easy to just because it is, I mean, there's a lot of areas where it does feel very powerless in, in healthcare related stuff. But this is one area where you can do everything you can to, to help minimize the potential for that. And I think it's really, really important.

Linda Kritikos: [01:03:16] And you're licensed in multiple states, am I correct?

Kevin Maguire: [01:03:19] Yeah. Yep. I am licensed in, I want to say eight of them right now, especially. It's mostly a focus on the Midwest. So you're looking at your Michigan, your Minnesota, your Wisconsin, your, your Illinois or Iowa. Yeah. But two other places as well.

Linda Kritikos: [01:03:34] Okay. All right. Well.

Pam Dunwald: [01:03:37] Kevin. Yeah. I just want to thank you so much for joining us today and, and for bringing really clarity to a topic that can feel so overwhelming for families.

Kevin Maguire: [01:03:47] Yeah, no, thank you guys. I really appreciate the opportunity. It's fun to hop on with you guys.

Linda Kritikos: [01:03:51] Well thank you Kevin. I mean, when you're caring for an aging parent, these insurance decisions, as you know, as I know, just from my own personal experience with my parents, they don't like paperwork, but they need the protection and it is protection. When they get the right plan and they get something that they're comfortable with and know it's going to provide them with and meet their needs. It is true protection and having the right information can reduce so much fear and stress on multiple levels with family members, with the individuals themselves. So it's a great opportunity to do that annual Medicare checkup and work with someone who's actually going to look at the whole picture, not just one specific arena.

Pam Dunwald: [01:04:36] You know, again, we have to just always mention this to and just to remind our listeners and that today's episode was shared for just educational purposes only and is not insurance or financial advice. And every situation is different. So please connect with a qualified professional to address your specific needs.

Linda Kritikos: [01:04:55] And don't forget to check our show notes for resources related to this episode.

Pam Dunwald: [01:05:00] You know, and if this conversation has helped you, please share it with a friend, a sibling, or a caregiver who's trying to figure out Medicare coverage for someone that they love.

Linda Kritikos: [01:05:09] And be sure to subscribe to Healthcare Redefined advocating for aging adults and their families so you don't miss a season anymore of season two.

Pam Dunwald: [01:05:19] So we're really glad you're here with us. Take care.

Linda Kritikos: [01:05:22] Until next time, take care of yourself and the ones you love.