Figure Eights (A Music Podcast) Episode 74 w_ Jon Wurster (Bob Mould / Superchunk / the Mountain Goats)

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You are listening to the Figure eights podcast. I'm your
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host Nick Leet from the band High on Stress so
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out of Minneapolis, Minnesota. And today's guest is fucking John Worster.
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Yeah. John Worster's on this show. How cool is that
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one of.
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The great greatest drummer sits out there today. You know
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him as the drummer for the Bob Mold band, Super Chunk,
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the Mountain Goats. He's appeared on Puless Records. He's you know, uh,
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He's performed with Ben Gibbert from Dead Gab for Cutie
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Rocket from the Crypts.
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He's played with R. E. M.
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S Tommy, and he's also a comedy guy.
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He's appeared on.
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The Best Show with Tom Sharpling. So big time guests today,
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great conversation with John. Fantastic warm guy, easy to talk
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to you.
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So I think you're gonna dig this one.
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So without further ado, I bring you drum Wizard John Worster.
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Black good just uh, you know, crunch time getting ready
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for these the R. E. M. Thing and and a
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Bob moldtour.
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So yeah, yeah, So when you hit the road, like
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next week Tuesday, Tuesday, fly to Chicago, and uh, we're
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kind of based there.
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Everybody but but John Stearrett and myself are are Illinois dudes. Uh,
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so that's where we meet. We rehearse for a day
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and then we head out west. Nice.
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How many shows? This is the rin thing you're doing
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on this tour, right?
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Yeah? With Michael Shannon. Yeah, so it's it's Michael Shannon,
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me Jason on guitar. Dog our friend Dog is playing guitar.
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He plays in a band called POI Dog Pondering Okay, yeah,
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and John Starrett on bass, our friend but Jay on keyboards,
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and and it's gonna be fun. It's a hell of
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a lineup.
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Pretty cool. Did you do the last one as well?
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I know this is the okay, yeah, because you were
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here for then for the first Avenue one that they did,
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which I wasn't there.
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I'm in Minneapolis. Okay. Oh that was a great one too.
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That was great. I heard it was fantastic. Yeah.
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Did you do the Dylan thing recently in Oklahoma?
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No, No, I was. I was on a recording gig
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during that, so that was just Jason and h and Michael.
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But I've been to the the Dylan Center a few
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times and oh, it's so much fun, it's so great. Yeah.
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Do they explain why it's there and not in Minnesota
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or New York?
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Yeah? Yeah, And I think he might have even specified
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that that's where it should be.
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Leave it to Dylan to be mysterious, like what so.
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Weird, so weird? And Uh, my understanding is you know
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he he's already played this. Uh they're going to start
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the next tour in Tulsa, and the theater where they
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play is I mean, it's I feel like it's two
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blocks from the place, and I don't think he came
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last time. I'm wondering if because they're starting there on
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this tour, maybe maybe he's gonna slip in that's like
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at two am the night before or something. Who knows.
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Are you from North Carolina originally? No, I'm from outside Philadelphia.
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I grew up in a town called Harleysville, which is God.
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It seemed like it was a world away from the
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city back then, but it was only thirty five miles.
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But it was when you're a kid, that's a lot. Yeah. Yeah.
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And it was farmlands, you know, menon night kind of turf,
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so it was it wasn't at all happening any music
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there at all. Just no in the records. No one's
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really playing no, no, there were no bands. But I
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was really I was really lucky. When I was fourteen,
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I got in this band. Uh so, this is nineteen
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eighty one. There's really not a lot of new waiver punk,
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you know, in my area. But I found some guys
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who are into it. They were all way older than me.
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So we had a band called Hair Club for Men,
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and we would play shows with this other band that
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just was happened to be in our area who was
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also kind of in the same but it was a
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duo called Narthex, and the drummer for Narthex went on
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to become the drummer in The Dead Milkmen, Dean Clean. Yes,
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so so so he They kind of took me under
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their wing when they they were forming The Dead Milkmen.
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So so through them, I got to inch my way
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closer to the city every year, you know what I mean.
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So by by the time I was like eighteen or something,
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I felt like I was kind of freeing.
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I could do things in the city. Now, did you
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say Philly was the closest big city? Yeah, yeah, okay, gotcha.
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When did you start playing drums. I started taking lessons
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when I was ten. But when you're a kid, you know,
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it's you want a drum set and you just want
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to bash on a drum set and they give you
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a little pat and yeah yeah. So you know, it
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was so not fun for a ten year old that
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I ended up stopping and then started up again a
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few years later, and my parents got me a drum kit,
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and thank god they were so cool about me play.
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It's the worst instrument for a parent, you know, so
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absolutely yeah. So so I just started playing along with
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records and then this band hair Club for Men formed,
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so I was in a band and so that that's
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kind of how I started.
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What what were you playing along to or some of
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those records?
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Well, it's funny. The first record I when I realized
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I could put headphones on and play along and you know,
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still here was Squeezing Out Sparks by Graham Parker and
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the rumor Wow, And I had this while I've told
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this story before, but I think I think it's worth telling.
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So the Mountain Goats, this UH band I play in.
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We we were doing this kind of residency at one
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of these what's it called the UH they have them
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all over the country. Now it's it's a like a
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sit down, seated club. And I'm spacing on the name. Uh,
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somebody will chime in. But anyway, So we were doing
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three nights at this place in New York, and during
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sound check on the final day, they brought these kids
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in to like ask us questions about being in a
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band and things, and and one kid asked me, you know, uh,
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that very question, what was the first record I played
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along with? And I told him it was this Grand
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Parker and the Rumor record. And so that was the
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final day of Oh City Winery.
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That's what those clubs are called, the city.
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Sorry. Yeah. So next day I'm leaving for the first
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show of a Bob moldtour and it was it was
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in Madison, Wisconsin. So I connected there in Chicago and
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so I come out of my little you know, my
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into the into the waiting gate area off my plane.
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First two people I see standing there Graham Parker and
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I'm facally this damn guitar player Brinsley Swarz, who played
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guitar and the Rumor and and I was so I
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was so excited. I just ran up to them and
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started talking. I just said, oh my god, the first
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record I've ever played. And they're like whoa and uh
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and they're like, who are you? You look familiar and
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I said, I'm out there, but but uh, you know,
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blah blah blah. And it turned out they were at
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the the Bob Mults show two days later at First Avenue.
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Really yeah, yeah, I guess they were playing. And it
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was the day Prince died.
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Oh what a crazy day that was.
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Oh my god, that was oh yeah, god. But I
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will say that was an amazing night. We we heard
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the news on the drive in from Madison and and
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we couldn't believe it, but then you know, it was confirmed,
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so it was it was it was just me and
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Bob and and Bob's partner, huh Don. And so you know,
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we're just listening to all these reports come in and
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we get there and by chance, Bob Starr at First
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Ave is right next to Princes so so you know,
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so we were staying like two blocks away, and I
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wandered over and there were already people, you know, putting
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flowers down, and you know, CNN's there, and and that
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night they must have just done this, you know, on
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the fly they put a show together. Yeah, outside of
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First Avenue, I guess it was a lot of people
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that played, you know with him over the years, local people,
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and it was just amazing and like every time I hear,
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what's the song damp but dah da, I want to
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be your lover? Yeah, like that that was blasting just
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in the city, Like it was crazy. All the lights
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were purple like on the buildings and I couldn't go,
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couldn't bring myself to do it. I should have. It
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was so sad, but it was also like, wow, this
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is the importance of music.
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Well did you hear why they had permission to do that?
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No? No, okay, Well this is a fun story.
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So if Prince laur Prince must have been two thousand
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and seven, you know he had the thing with seven,
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so it was seven seven oh seven.
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He did.
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At Macy's Downtown, he played like a show, and then
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later that night he played at the Target Center, and
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then later that night he played at First Avenue And
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the First Avenue show started late and the cops broke
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it up because it was past bar close and they
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shut the show down, which is insane, Like come so
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what they did and this is kind of kind of amazing.
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And how it all panned out is they they put
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together legislature that said basically, bar closes bar clothes unless
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we have the Prince Rule.
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Wow. And the Prince.
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Rule was put into effect so that they could do
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that that night outside. Otherwise it would have happened, but
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it was because they shut that last showdown and they
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had a Prince rule in Minneapolis.
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Oh oh my god. I always sympathize with people like
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Michael Bland, you know, his his drummer, just like you
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have to play three shows a day on that tour,
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you know from I mean you're you're playing drums or
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whatever from you know, from two pm to two am.
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And it's not like Bland hit soft like I'm sure
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he's worn out.
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Yeah yeah, oh my god. So crazy. Oh yeah, that's crazy.
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But that's that's why that happened. So pretty cool, pretty cool.
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That's tomorrow's rock and roll weirdness. Oh there you go.
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Yeah, I'm sure you could find some stories online about
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it too. But it's uh so, as were you a
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Prince fan as a kid, then it sounds like it
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was early eighties, so it's probably prime. There's a little
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outside of your scope at that point.
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Well, I was really into you know, like punk rock
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and new wave and stuff. But but he was kind
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of in that too, Like I like I he I
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liked like I remember having controversy as a kid, and
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and and but I don't think I was aware of
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like the first record, but but I remember, yeah, really
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liking that, and and his videos were great too, and
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because so like I mean, he was almost punk you know,
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in his own way. So so yeah, that kind of
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filtered in my world a little bit, but not not
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a whole lot. But I I totally you know, I
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appreciate and then I loved, you know, all the hits
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that came to and just his his work ethic too
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is insane. Yeah, and it's general weirdness. Yeah.
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Yeah, did you have you played the Armory in Minneapolis?
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I can't remember if I've no, but uh, Bob.
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Mole tells the story of I think Hooskers opened for
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the Dead Kennedys there.
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Okay, okay, because that's where the nineteen ninety nine Prince
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video was shot too.
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Yep. Yeah, well and I think they started having shows
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again there is that correct.
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A great And I was wondering because I've seen the
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Mountain Goats with you in it. I couldn't remember if
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it was their first have or the Palace, but.
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I think it might have been the Palace. Yeah, that's
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where we last played, gotcha? That was that was probably
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last time. I said.
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And I've seen you with Bob Colinos college.
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Yeah. Cool? Cool?
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So when did you When did you leave that small town?
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Well, it's an interesting story. I was I was nineteen,
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so this is nineteen. This is early eighty six, I
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think like January of eighty six, and I was in
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a band that played in UH Base in Philadelphia. I
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was still living at home in the Farmlands, and our
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band was called Psychotic Norman and we were like a
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weird It was like a weird cross between the Minutemen,
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The Fall, the Ramones and some some and our singers
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sounded like, uh, the guy in Canned Heat who sings
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going up the country, you gotta do good. That's very
243
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specific voice. Al al Fisher Is that his name? Al
244
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Al something? Anyway, So that band was kind I felt
245
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like I was the only one in the band that
246
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had like a real work ethic, you know what I mean. Like,
247
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so the the Final Straw, the Final Straw, I don't
248
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know how true this is, but my memory is that
249
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our bassist whose house we practiced in, uh, had gone
250
00:13:55.080 --> 00:13:58.919
to New York to see the replacements or something, and
251
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he didn't come back in time to rehearse on Sunday
252
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at his own house, and so I was upset about that. Uh.
253
00:14:07.080 --> 00:14:10.600
And by chance, that night my my brother called. And
254
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by this point, my older brother was on a track
255
00:14:13.960 --> 00:14:17.440
scholarship at wake Forest University in Winston Salem, n C.
256
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So uh, And at this point I loved all that
257
00:14:20.919 --> 00:14:24.000
North Carolina jangle stuff that's active and the dbs and
258
00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:28.039
the ram stuff so great. Yeah. So by chance, one
259
00:14:28.080 --> 00:14:30.799
of these bands who I liked, whose record I sent
260
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away for in high school, this band called the Right Profile.
261
00:14:33.840 --> 00:14:38.480
You've never heard of them, although one of our main
262
00:14:38.840 --> 00:14:47.200
singers went on to co write the Freakonomics book Stephen J. Dubner. Wow. Yeah.
263
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So anyway, so he was in the band and it
264
00:14:49.519 --> 00:14:53.000
was like a roots rock band. And my brother calls
265
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that night of the no show at our our practice
266
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in Philly and says, I saw these guys today, you know,
267
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and he kind of knew them, and said their drummer
268
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just left, and would you want to try out, So
269
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I was like, yeah, like I'd.
270
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Like something more stables. Yeah, that was your Dave Grohl moment. Yeah,
271
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like oh falling apart at the right time.
272
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Yeah. So, uh my dad gave me probably one hundred
273
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bucks to fly down and uh brother picked me up
274
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or a friend of his picked me up and went
275
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to the band house. And at this point I'd only
276
00:15:26.559 --> 00:15:30.240
corresponded with him via via writing, and uh, we just
277
00:15:30.799 --> 00:15:32.480
we all hit it off. They were a little older
278
00:15:32.519 --> 00:15:35.440
than me, and uh, I tried out and I got
279
00:15:35.519 --> 00:15:37.799
in the band. And four months later we're in Clive
280
00:15:37.919 --> 00:15:41.960
Davis's office at Ariston and he signed us. WHOA what
281
00:15:42.080 --> 00:15:43.600
a trip? Oh my god?
282
00:15:43.679 --> 00:15:45.320
Yeah, four months after the no show.
283
00:15:46.399 --> 00:15:49.840
Yeah, I mean it all went downhill from there, like
284
00:15:49.879 --> 00:15:53.360
we need signed and does. But but we got got
285
00:15:53.399 --> 00:15:56.519
to work with some cool producers Pete Pete Anderson who
286
00:15:56.559 --> 00:16:00.279
did the the Dwight Yoakum records. Uh, and we got
287
00:16:00.279 --> 00:16:02.840
halfway into a record at art in Memphis with Jim
288
00:16:02.840 --> 00:16:06.639
Dickinson just after pleased to meet me. But it just
289
00:16:06.679 --> 00:16:09.120
it was the eighties and he was second guessing his
290
00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:11.759
own way of doing stuff. So it just was it
291
00:16:11.799 --> 00:16:14.159
was sounding too slick and it wasn't his fault. So
292
00:16:14.759 --> 00:16:17.919
we cut bait and we ended up, you know, going
293
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into the hell that all bands go into, and that
294
00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:23.039
dragged on until like ninety one.
295
00:16:23.240 --> 00:16:24.240
Did the record come out?
296
00:16:24.399 --> 00:16:26.159
No? No, never finished it.
297
00:16:26.600 --> 00:16:29.320
Oh and that was the only record that you were
298
00:16:30.000 --> 00:16:33.879
That was the first record for the label. Yep, wow,
299
00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:36.679
so what happened there? They just lose an A and
300
00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:38.559
R guy.
301
00:16:38.799 --> 00:16:43.639
Oh well, this is amazing. So maybe a year or
302
00:16:43.720 --> 00:16:46.200
two into this into our signing, things were, you know,
303
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:48.320
things were just like it, you know, going at the
304
00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:51.799
speed of molasses. Everything is. So that's why I was
305
00:16:51.799 --> 00:16:53.840
so excited to getting super Chunk. Afterwards, I was like,
306
00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:56.240
I thought, oh yeah, you can put your own records out,
307
00:16:56.320 --> 00:16:58.720
you know, and do it on your own. Yeah. So,
308
00:16:58.840 --> 00:17:02.519
like the major label thing was was awful, but oh
309
00:17:02.679 --> 00:17:06.640
so so so then a friend of mine from Philly said, oh, yeah,
310
00:17:06.680 --> 00:17:10.920
I heard that you you guys were a revenge signing.
311
00:17:11.400 --> 00:17:16.759
So basically there was an A and R guy at
312
00:17:16.799 --> 00:17:20.720
Arista who wanted to sign us and Clive didn't want
313
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to sign us, and then that guy left to another
314
00:17:23.039 --> 00:17:25.960
label and then Clive signed us, so which I don't
315
00:17:26.000 --> 00:17:31.039
doubt who knows. Wow, the politics.
316
00:17:31.400 --> 00:17:33.519
Okay, So then you went on to so it was
317
00:17:33.559 --> 00:17:34.880
super Chunk right after that.
318
00:17:34.960 --> 00:17:42.440
Then, yeah, I that band. We ended up getting a
319
00:17:42.480 --> 00:17:46.720
publishing deal with this company, and through the publishing deal,
320
00:17:46.839 --> 00:17:50.000
we got to do a session with Steve Jordan, the
321
00:17:50.039 --> 00:17:51.920
drummer who's now in the Rolling Stones.
322
00:17:52.440 --> 00:17:58.319
Yep, just did the new Soul Asylum record, the new one.
323
00:17:58.440 --> 00:18:01.920
Oh my god, he did. He did them after he
324
00:18:02.640 --> 00:18:07.039
did the session I'm about to talk about. Nice. Yeah,
325
00:18:07.079 --> 00:18:12.279
So the woman that signed us to that publishing deal said,
326
00:18:12.559 --> 00:18:14.799
I think you guys should record with Steve Jordan. And
327
00:18:14.839 --> 00:18:17.839
by this point Steve was, uh, he might have been
328
00:18:18.119 --> 00:18:20.680
out of the Letterman band by this point, I guess,
329
00:18:20.839 --> 00:18:26.039
but he was. He was producing stuff and Soul Asylum
330
00:18:26.119 --> 00:18:28.519
was an early one, and I remember him telling the
331
00:18:28.519 --> 00:18:33.200
story of going to First Avenue Too to see them play.
332
00:18:33.759 --> 00:18:37.440
So this would have been eighty eight maybe or something,
333
00:18:37.480 --> 00:18:40.839
and and my memory is he ended up just hanging
334
00:18:40.839 --> 00:18:48.599
out with eleanor Mondale all night. So but anyway, so
335
00:18:49.240 --> 00:18:53.799
we ended up doing a recording session with Steve at
336
00:18:53.799 --> 00:18:58.680
this place called the Hit Factory in Times Square and
337
00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:04.119
it was just the most transformative musical event for me
338
00:19:04.279 --> 00:19:09.079
in my life. It was just amazing. He Uh, I
339
00:19:09.160 --> 00:19:11.640
learned so much from him in just a week, without
340
00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:13.759
him ever really telling me what to do. I was
341
00:19:13.799 --> 00:19:16.680
just sort of absorbed his thing, and and you know
342
00:19:16.720 --> 00:19:18.839
what he did and what he didn't do, and and
343
00:19:20.039 --> 00:19:23.799
it just kind of changed my life. And and uh
344
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:33.640
so not long after that, I moved to Chapel Hill
345
00:19:33.680 --> 00:19:38.839
from Winston Salem and I ended up joining Super Chunk.
346
00:19:39.720 --> 00:19:40.640
How did that come about?
347
00:19:40.880 --> 00:19:44.559
Well, it was a band I knew of, and I
348
00:19:44.680 --> 00:19:47.480
knew Mac the singer for a little bit. I was
349
00:19:47.519 --> 00:19:52.160
living in northern New Jersey with the right profile guys
350
00:19:52.480 --> 00:19:56.759
when Mac was in at Columbia University, so I would
351
00:19:56.799 --> 00:19:59.880
see him at shows at Maxwell. It's like soul Asylum
352
00:20:00.240 --> 00:20:03.519
or whoever. And so I knew him a little bit
353
00:20:03.599 --> 00:20:05.240
through that. And then when I moved to town, I
354
00:20:05.279 --> 00:20:08.559
got a job as a window washer here in Chapel Hill,
355
00:20:09.559 --> 00:20:13.839
and one of our accounts was school Kids Records, where
356
00:20:13.880 --> 00:20:20.519
he worked. And so I came back from this really
357
00:20:20.799 --> 00:20:25.960
rough tour by that band that Steve Jordan produced, and
358
00:20:26.039 --> 00:20:27.400
we went all the way out west to try to
359
00:20:27.400 --> 00:20:29.319
get a record deal. So now it's like summer of
360
00:20:29.400 --> 00:20:32.680
ninety one and nothing happened. It was terrible. And the
361
00:20:32.799 --> 00:20:34.839
day I get back, I go stop in at my
362
00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:37.880
brother's office here in Chapel Hill and he goes, hey,
363
00:20:37.920 --> 00:20:41.240
Matt called, and I was like, please be what I
364
00:20:41.279 --> 00:20:46.799
hope it is. And so I went to the store
365
00:20:46.880 --> 00:20:51.440
and we talked and basically they were having trouble with
366
00:20:51.480 --> 00:20:54.440
their drummer and they had one tour that they were
367
00:20:54.440 --> 00:20:56.839
going to do with mud Honey opening for mud Honey,
368
00:20:57.000 --> 00:21:00.640
and he said, you know, if things don't work out,
369
00:21:00.680 --> 00:21:03.839
would you want to come in? And I was like, yeah, sure.
370
00:21:03.920 --> 00:21:06.519
So for the next like two weeks or three, I
371
00:21:06.880 --> 00:21:10.240
went on on washing windows and listening to their their
372
00:21:10.440 --> 00:21:14.000
second record, which was about to come out. So and
373
00:21:14.039 --> 00:21:20.200
then I got in. Yeah, and that was it for
374
00:21:20.240 --> 00:21:21.759
the next eleven years or so.
375
00:21:22.359 --> 00:21:23.440
No more window washing.
376
00:21:24.400 --> 00:21:26.480
I'm sure I had I'm sure I'm sure I had
377
00:21:26.480 --> 00:21:28.480
to come back at some point, but eventually it was.
378
00:21:28.519 --> 00:21:30.000
It was a great day when I didn't have to.
379
00:21:30.599 --> 00:21:33.920
Yeah, so, how were these like giant buildings? Were you
380
00:21:33.960 --> 00:21:36.079
like one of those window washers that are or is
381
00:21:36.119 --> 00:21:40.880
this just you're doing some office buildings, office and residential? Okay,
382
00:21:40.920 --> 00:21:42.960
so none of those crazy skyscrapers.
383
00:21:43.079 --> 00:21:45.400
No, the first day though, these assholes who who I
384
00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:48.079
worked with, they did like send me up on the
385
00:21:48.200 --> 00:21:51.200
ladder like to do a skylight is I guess that
386
00:21:51.279 --> 00:21:54.319
must have been the yeah, you know, to see if
387
00:21:54.319 --> 00:21:56.359
you could hang. Yeah, but they were all right, like,
388
00:21:56.640 --> 00:21:59.480
we would don't tell anyone we would. We would definitely
389
00:21:59.519 --> 00:22:02.240
ditch work and go watch TV at one of the
390
00:22:02.240 --> 00:22:03.440
guy's houses during the day.
391
00:22:03.480 --> 00:22:07.799
So that's hilarious. Yeah, I've always wondered about window washers.
392
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:09.960
I'm like, I don't, like, I don't think I would
393
00:22:10.000 --> 00:22:10.640
enjoy that much.
394
00:22:11.160 --> 00:22:11.920
So awesome.
395
00:22:11.960 --> 00:22:15.000
So so you joined Super Chunk, So you weren't on
396
00:22:15.039 --> 00:22:16.680
that tour they were on the mud honey, but you
397
00:22:16.759 --> 00:22:18.880
joined after Is that kind of it didn't pan out?
398
00:22:19.119 --> 00:22:22.119
Okay? Yeah, and then we did a huge European tour
399
00:22:22.160 --> 00:22:24.960
with them maybe four months later.
400
00:22:25.319 --> 00:22:27.799
Okay, so you were kind of on the second f
401
00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:30.279
So they came back and they're like, yes, this is
402
00:22:30.319 --> 00:22:31.240
definitely not work.
403
00:22:31.759 --> 00:22:34.240
Yeah, yeah, it's being in a van. Will sometimes do
404
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:38.680
to people. And he's great. The guy I took over
405
00:22:38.759 --> 00:22:40.400
from is you know, oh my god, it took me
406
00:22:40.480 --> 00:22:44.440
forever to kind of even approach duplicating. He's super great
407
00:22:44.440 --> 00:22:47.559
at these fast rolls on and which I was never
408
00:22:47.599 --> 00:22:50.279
great at, but so it took me years to come
409
00:22:50.359 --> 00:22:52.400
up to speed on that.
410
00:22:53.759 --> 00:22:58.160
So how you were in super Chunk forever until somewhat recently?
411
00:22:58.279 --> 00:23:00.839
Right your year two go? Maybe I can't keep tragging
412
00:23:00.880 --> 00:23:01.279
time anymore?
413
00:23:01.440 --> 00:23:01.960
Probably two?
414
00:23:02.680 --> 00:23:05.680
Okay, So how long was that was that you say
415
00:23:05.759 --> 00:23:06.319
ninety one?
416
00:23:06.519 --> 00:23:11.039
I joined in? Uh, it's funny, I joined. I feel
417
00:23:11.079 --> 00:23:15.759
like I I met Laura and maybe Jim the guitar
418
00:23:15.799 --> 00:23:23.839
player at a Nirvana show. It would have been right
419
00:23:23.880 --> 00:23:26.680
when Nevermind came out, So I feel I have a
420
00:23:26.680 --> 00:23:29.440
memory of meeting the two of them that night, and
421
00:23:29.519 --> 00:23:31.200
I think I was in the I think we rehearsed
422
00:23:31.200 --> 00:23:34.640
a few days later, so like late from yeah, yeah,
423
00:23:34.880 --> 00:23:39.880
followup ninety one? Yeah, gotcha? And I I retired, Uh
424
00:23:40.839 --> 00:23:44.319
probably January of maybe two years ago. I think, Yeah,
425
00:23:44.519 --> 00:23:46.240
did they give you a watch or anything? That's a
426
00:23:46.279 --> 00:23:49.960
long time nothing? No, not even a gold watch. Laura
427
00:23:50.039 --> 00:23:52.079
did make that joke though, Laura said, I think we
428
00:23:52.079 --> 00:23:53.400
should give you a watch or something.
429
00:23:54.000 --> 00:23:57.599
Well, good, it's not just me then, no, No, that's hilarious.
430
00:23:57.880 --> 00:23:58.240
Yeah.
431
00:23:58.279 --> 00:23:59.920
So were you just doing a lot of session where
432
00:24:00.279 --> 00:24:02.680
or playing other bands too? When you're a good drummer,
433
00:24:02.759 --> 00:24:04.359
you end up in a lot of bands. That's kind
434
00:24:04.400 --> 00:24:04.759
of the thing.
435
00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:07.400
Yeah, good saying drummers are not easy to find. I think.
436
00:24:08.160 --> 00:24:13.400
So like that River City High record that came through
437
00:24:13.480 --> 00:24:17.359
Brian Paulson, who produced some Super Chunk records, and of
438
00:24:17.400 --> 00:24:22.000
course the Wilco and Sunbolt stuff and awesome. Yeah he's
439
00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:24.680
great and uh so he he brought me and I
440
00:24:24.720 --> 00:24:27.960
had never I hadn't met them before uh that day,
441
00:24:28.079 --> 00:24:30.359
and we did it at this cool stage studio that
442
00:24:31.519 --> 00:24:35.880
David Lowry had in uh in Richmond called the Sound
443
00:24:35.960 --> 00:24:39.720
of Music. Okay, yeah, nice. Nice.
444
00:24:40.039 --> 00:24:42.480
So were you just uh were you playing in any
445
00:24:42.559 --> 00:24:44.440
other bands during this time or was it just.
446
00:24:44.680 --> 00:24:47.559
That's all during super Chunk, all of it, that's all
447
00:24:47.640 --> 00:24:50.839
during Super Chunk. Yeah, so I think that's how people
448
00:24:50.880 --> 00:24:54.119
would find out about me or or you know, uh yeah,
449
00:24:54.119 --> 00:24:56.799
so all kinds of stuff like that, and and you know,
450
00:24:56.920 --> 00:24:59.240
as time went on, I was in the right place
451
00:24:59.279 --> 00:25:03.400
at right time a lot like I mean, he's he's
452
00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:09.759
canceled now, but but but but yeah, yeah, I was
453
00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:12.759
in a bar in Manhattan. God, this would have been
454
00:25:13.319 --> 00:25:15.599
this would have been like spring of ninety eight, I
455
00:25:15.640 --> 00:25:20.359
think and Ryan Adams comes in and and I knew
456
00:25:20.440 --> 00:25:23.240
him because his band would open for a band I
457
00:25:23.240 --> 00:25:27.240
would play in sometimes around here. And and he goes, oh, man,
458
00:25:27.400 --> 00:25:30.759
and like he was looking like this, I'm looking for
459
00:25:30.799 --> 00:25:34.160
a drummer, like a specific like a guy, a specific guy.
460
00:25:34.200 --> 00:25:38.559
And I go, I'm a drummer. And and so I
461
00:25:38.599 --> 00:25:41.920
was leaving town the next day, and he goes, well,
462
00:25:41.960 --> 00:25:47.279
I'm doing this recording session and help oken tomorrow, you know,
463
00:25:47.359 --> 00:25:49.400
play on it. I was like, great, but I didn't
464
00:25:49.480 --> 00:25:52.119
quite trust him, so I said, I'm leave. I'm leaving
465
00:25:52.119 --> 00:25:55.079
at I'm leaving at ten am tomorrow. If I don't
466
00:25:55.119 --> 00:25:57.680
hear from you, I'm gonna go called at nine point thirty,
467
00:25:58.480 --> 00:26:00.559
and and we did it, and I I ended up
468
00:26:00.559 --> 00:26:04.759
playing in Whiskeytown UH on a John Fogerty tour the
469
00:26:04.799 --> 00:26:06.200
next that summer.
470
00:26:06.319 --> 00:26:09.039
Wow, did you record it? You recorded some stuff as well?
471
00:26:09.799 --> 00:26:11.680
Was that on pneumonia or was it just.
472
00:26:12.039 --> 00:26:15.319
Any any anything came out? But so we kind of ended,
473
00:26:15.519 --> 00:26:18.920
you know, acrimoniously, as as as you do. And and
474
00:26:18.960 --> 00:26:22.039
then and then a year later or so, he calls me,
475
00:26:22.240 --> 00:26:24.599
and I was at UH at my job at a
476
00:26:25.240 --> 00:26:28.319
used bookstore here and he wanted me to play on
477
00:26:29.200 --> 00:26:33.440
what would be Pneumonia. Yeah, and so he came down
478
00:26:33.559 --> 00:26:40.880
and and uh, the band was me, him, James E.
479
00:26:41.039 --> 00:26:46.559
Haff from the Smashing Pumpkins as you will, uh, and
480
00:26:46.720 --> 00:26:49.680
a couple of her great local guys who were in
481
00:26:49.680 --> 00:26:52.480
Whiskeytown when I played in Whiskeytown. And it was produced
482
00:26:52.480 --> 00:26:56.839
by by Ethan John's who's Glenn John's son experience, Well
483
00:26:56.880 --> 00:27:00.000
it was and then so we rehearsed and that was great.
484
00:27:00.160 --> 00:27:02.400
It was really fun. None of these songs, as far
485
00:27:02.400 --> 00:27:08.200
as I know, ever made it onto anything. And Ethan's
486
00:27:08.200 --> 00:27:11.039
final words to me the day he left for I
487
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:13.160
can't wait to do it. You know what kind of
488
00:27:13.200 --> 00:27:15.279
drums do you like? I said, I'm sure anything would
489
00:27:15.279 --> 00:27:17.039
be great, you know, I'm sure we'll find something great.
490
00:27:17.279 --> 00:27:23.279
Never heard a word from anybody again again. And Ethan
491
00:27:23.359 --> 00:27:26.599
ended up playing the drums on it. And so yeah,
492
00:27:26.640 --> 00:27:29.240
So all that to say, I was in the right
493
00:27:29.279 --> 00:27:31.920
place at the right time there and that's happened all
494
00:27:31.920 --> 00:27:34.960
my life, like got to play, got to record with
495
00:27:35.039 --> 00:27:41.160
Nick Cave, being the pretenders for a night, Bob Bob
496
00:27:41.240 --> 00:27:45.920
mold stuff, you know, all of it. It's just never never, uh,
497
00:27:46.440 --> 00:27:47.680
never rule anything out.
498
00:27:48.279 --> 00:27:51.119
Yeah, and you never heard from Ryan Adams again after that.
499
00:27:51.599 --> 00:27:53.640
I'm sure I saw him over the years, and we
500
00:27:53.720 --> 00:27:58.000
kind of did reconnect just a year before everything went
501
00:27:58.039 --> 00:28:01.079
down again. So yeah, yeah, yeah, I.
502
00:28:01.920 --> 00:28:05.640
Think he's a really great songwriter, and uh, you know,
503
00:28:05.759 --> 00:28:07.880
I think he got away with a lot of poor
504
00:28:07.920 --> 00:28:10.039
behavior for a long time based on that, but I
505
00:28:10.079 --> 00:28:11.799
think that was a step too.
506
00:28:11.640 --> 00:28:14.880
Far right at the at the time I played with him,
507
00:28:14.920 --> 00:28:20.839
he was the most natural musician I'd ever played with. Wow, yeah, yeah, yeah.
508
00:28:20.960 --> 00:28:23.920
I had Phil Launcher on. Oh yeah, Oh my god,
509
00:28:24.000 --> 00:28:24.319
like Phil?
510
00:28:24.359 --> 00:28:27.359
Yeah, Phil, Oh my god. Phil is hilarious. And he
511
00:28:27.400 --> 00:28:29.880
told many of a fine story. Oh I bet yeah,
512
00:28:29.920 --> 00:28:31.920
Oh poor Phil what he had to deal with.
513
00:28:32.000 --> 00:28:34.559
Oh my god. Oh yeah, he's a trip.
514
00:28:34.960 --> 00:28:38.240
So so when does when does Bob come around? Then?
515
00:28:38.240 --> 00:28:40.960
Obviously you grew up being a fan of Bob as
516
00:28:41.079 --> 00:28:42.440
most people did.
517
00:28:42.839 --> 00:28:45.039
Yeah, a huge Husker fan.
518
00:28:45.079 --> 00:28:45.359
For me.
519
00:28:45.480 --> 00:28:47.319
The you know, it's it's so funny. I got I
520
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:51.599
got to play with all these people. Now. My friend DeWitt,
521
00:28:51.599 --> 00:28:54.680
who is who has been Ram's longtime equipment guy forever,
522
00:28:55.759 --> 00:28:57.960
we met before he got that gig, and and we
523
00:28:58.119 --> 00:29:02.400
joke about the Holy Trinity for us is replacements Hoosker
524
00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:06.119
Do and and R E. M. And so sounds like
525
00:29:06.160 --> 00:29:09.799
you need to move to Minneapolis, right Yeah? Yeah? So
526
00:29:10.079 --> 00:29:11.759
you know, yeah, I was a huge Bob fan my
527
00:29:12.160 --> 00:29:14.240
entire life. I think I probably saw every tour, like
528
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:17.599
every solo tour, all of it. And I got to
529
00:29:17.680 --> 00:29:20.400
interview him for the Uh it was a tour he
530
00:29:20.480 --> 00:29:23.519
was doing this very kind of controversial tour in terms
531
00:29:23.519 --> 00:29:25.160
of his career. It was the one where he was
532
00:29:25.160 --> 00:29:30.039
playing you know, with backup stuff and all that modulate
533
00:29:30.240 --> 00:29:32.759
I think is the album people weiing, Oh my god.
534
00:29:32.839 --> 00:29:36.680
Yeah yeah, and there were there were like lasting ramifications
535
00:29:36.720 --> 00:29:39.079
from that too, which which was really sad that you know,
536
00:29:39.119 --> 00:29:44.039
people were you know, when I joined, it was very
537
00:29:44.119 --> 00:29:49.039
much you know, digging back out, you know in terms
538
00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:50.720
of like no I play rock and roll. You know
539
00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:53.079
this that was a that was a sliver of my
540
00:29:54.240 --> 00:29:56.839
of my of my thing. And now you all think
541
00:29:56.839 --> 00:29:59.400
I'm share or something, right, you know, so let it
542
00:29:59.480 --> 00:30:04.119
let an art, Yeah exactly, exactly. Yeah. So and I'm
543
00:30:04.119 --> 00:30:06.119
sure if he did that today, no, we would nobody
544
00:30:06.119 --> 00:30:08.039
would bat an eye, you know, it would just be, oh,
545
00:30:08.039 --> 00:30:10.559
this is what this guy's doing now? But in whatever
546
00:30:10.640 --> 00:30:13.640
two thousand whenever that was, that was, that was wild.
547
00:30:13.759 --> 00:30:17.319
So I interviewed him for the Weekly here in Chapel
548
00:30:17.359 --> 00:30:21.160
Hill about that and had a great talk. And then,
549
00:30:21.279 --> 00:30:26.160
you know, fast forward years. Uh, my ex Angie, she
550
00:30:26.519 --> 00:30:29.680
was Bob's publicist when he put out one record on
551
00:30:29.720 --> 00:30:32.960
this label here in Chapel Hill called YEP Rock, And
552
00:30:33.039 --> 00:30:35.319
so I remember going to the record release party in
553
00:30:35.400 --> 00:30:37.440
d C when he was living there and had a
554
00:30:37.480 --> 00:30:40.079
nice talk with him. And so fast forward a few
555
00:30:40.079 --> 00:30:45.319
more years, Brendan Canty is playing drums with him and yeah,
556
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.279
and so Brendan couldn't do this tour that they they
557
00:30:48.319 --> 00:30:51.680
had lined up. Uh. And by this point I was
558
00:30:51.799 --> 00:30:56.759
friends with Jason Rduci. Uh. Jason Rducy Uh plays bass
559
00:30:56.839 --> 00:30:59.200
with uh with the Bob Molevant and he's the co
560
00:30:59.480 --> 00:31:03.039
headliner of this Michael Shannon rim tour we're doing. So
561
00:31:04.400 --> 00:31:09.480
I first played with Jason in the Robert Pollard band. Uh. Yeah.
562
00:31:09.519 --> 00:31:12.799
So when when Bob Pollard went solo in I don't
563
00:31:12.799 --> 00:31:14.960
know when that was oh five or something or six,
564
00:31:16.559 --> 00:31:20.039
I was in his band with Jason. So fast forward
565
00:31:20.079 --> 00:31:24.000
to this Bob moldtour. Jason calls me asked if I
566
00:31:24.039 --> 00:31:25.519
can do it, and I was in the Mountain Goats
567
00:31:25.519 --> 00:31:27.440
at this point, we had a lot of touring, and
568
00:31:27.480 --> 00:31:29.240
I said, I can't believe I'm about to say this,
569
00:31:29.319 --> 00:31:33.240
but I can't do it. And so then maybe just
570
00:31:33.519 --> 00:31:36.359
like a few weeks later, a month later, I get
571
00:31:36.400 --> 00:31:38.240
a call again from Jason and I'm on tour with
572
00:31:38.240 --> 00:31:40.119
the Mountain Goes. We have two more shows to go
573
00:31:40.799 --> 00:31:45.039
and I'm in I'm in Philly, and he goes, would
574
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:49.160
you be able to do this this European tour that's
575
00:31:49.200 --> 00:31:50.920
coming up in May and I think it's probably like
576
00:31:51.000 --> 00:31:56.359
March now, and I said, yeah, yeah, I will, and
577
00:31:56.400 --> 00:31:57.960
so we're all excited. And then he called back the
578
00:31:58.000 --> 00:32:00.079
next day it was like, can you finish out this
579
00:32:00.119 --> 00:32:03.759
tour we're on right now? Like the drummer, it was
580
00:32:03.799 --> 00:32:05.839
just the wrong guy for it, yeah, you know, And
581
00:32:05.880 --> 00:32:13.319
so I think they they realized, no, the tour was happening. Yeah.
582
00:32:12.759 --> 00:32:16.000
So they had a little break and by chance, we
583
00:32:16.160 --> 00:32:18.960
had to cancel this Mountain Goes tour of Australia that day.
584
00:32:19.559 --> 00:32:21.920
Your timing is strange, it was insane. Yeah. So I
585
00:32:22.200 --> 00:32:25.440
called Jason and I say, I'm feeling lucky let's do it.
586
00:32:25.839 --> 00:32:29.480
And so final show in DC, they dropped me off.
587
00:32:29.519 --> 00:32:31.039
I was staying at my parents' house. I didn't have
588
00:32:31.039 --> 00:32:33.839
a place yet. I had just separated from my girlfriend.
589
00:32:33.880 --> 00:32:37.119
And uh, I showered and I went to the airport
590
00:32:37.160 --> 00:32:39.119
and flew out to l A and they picked me
591
00:32:39.200 --> 00:32:42.119
up and we played the next night in San Diego.
592
00:32:42.759 --> 00:32:43.920
Didn't rehearse, so.
593
00:32:45.119 --> 00:32:47.759
Just winging it, that was it. Yeah, but I suppose
594
00:32:47.839 --> 00:32:51.200
the old songs you had so you could yeah.
595
00:32:51.319 --> 00:32:53.440
Yeah, And and you know it was like Chuck Berry.
596
00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:56.559
A lot of it was just like watch watch Bob's
597
00:32:56.599 --> 00:32:59.640
foot when it when it goes, when he stomps it down,
598
00:33:00.240 --> 00:33:03.119
that's it's over. That's the end. And it's it's still
599
00:33:03.160 --> 00:33:04.160
like that. Yeah.
600
00:33:04.400 --> 00:33:08.559
I was gonna say, I can actually picture his movements. Yeah,
601
00:33:08.759 --> 00:33:12.839
that's hilarious. So what that was like twenty years ago? No,
602
00:33:13.039 --> 00:33:20.400
that was gosh, that was probably early nine. Okay, So yeah, okay,
603
00:33:21.000 --> 00:33:23.880
so you're fifteen years in. You're gonna get another gold
604
00:33:23.920 --> 00:33:24.319
watch here.
605
00:33:24.480 --> 00:33:27.200
You know. That's great, and we have we have a
606
00:33:27.200 --> 00:33:31.039
great new record coming out. It's really good. God.
607
00:33:31.480 --> 00:33:35.599
Last time I saw you was actually at the State
608
00:33:35.680 --> 00:33:38.880
Fair with Lifter Pole or Lifter with Old Steady.
609
00:33:38.640 --> 00:33:41.160
And who else was on that?
610
00:33:41.240 --> 00:33:44.839
It was the uh D four. Yes, they were great.
611
00:33:45.039 --> 00:33:47.160
H yeah, that was a that was a fun night.
612
00:33:47.799 --> 00:33:51.000
And uh so you you played with Tommy Kean as well,
613
00:33:51.039 --> 00:33:51.279
didn't you?
614
00:33:51.359 --> 00:33:54.599
At some point with uh with Pollard? Right, Tommy was
615
00:33:54.640 --> 00:33:56.200
in our band. I had a poster right here, let
616
00:33:56.200 --> 00:33:59.799
me see it was, uh, Tommy Kean, me Jason and
617
00:34:00.000 --> 00:34:03.000
and it's a great guy who also passed on David
618
00:34:03.039 --> 00:34:08.320
Phillips And I met David. He's an Athens guy, played guitar. Yeah,
619
00:34:08.440 --> 00:34:10.639
he played guitar in it. And he was the guitar player.
620
00:34:10.639 --> 00:34:15.280
And Jack Logan Jack Logan in a liquor cabinet. Jack
621
00:34:15.400 --> 00:34:18.079
is probably maybe best known for doing the artwork for
622
00:34:18.320 --> 00:34:22.599
Tommy Stinson's Perfect EP or what that was? Was that
623
00:34:22.599 --> 00:34:27.119
the with the squirrel? Yeah? Yeah, gotcha? Yeah? And uh
624
00:34:27.199 --> 00:34:31.559
and David also played with Frank Black a lot during
625
00:34:31.559 --> 00:34:34.480
his stuff. That was our band. And Tommy Keane was
626
00:34:34.519 --> 00:34:38.000
one of my favorite songwriters. So great, just so great, amazing.
627
00:34:38.239 --> 00:34:40.639
Yeah, my band used to open for him when he
628
00:34:40.639 --> 00:34:41.119
would come.
629
00:34:41.000 --> 00:34:42.119
From Oh yeah, awesome.
630
00:34:42.119 --> 00:34:45.360
What's your band called High on Stress? It's called YEP.
631
00:34:46.199 --> 00:34:48.800
I've it's possible I've heard the name.
632
00:34:48.719 --> 00:34:52.760
Right, probably sat online at some point, I'm sure, but yeah, yeah,
633
00:34:52.800 --> 00:34:54.800
we would play with with Tommy when he would come
634
00:34:54.800 --> 00:34:57.320
from so great, great guy.
635
00:34:58.679 --> 00:35:02.760
Super funny. I remember I remember describing him to someone
636
00:35:02.960 --> 00:35:06.639
like and and Tommy Keane's playing too. He he's just
637
00:35:06.719 --> 00:35:08.519
like us. He hates all the right stuff.
638
00:35:11.360 --> 00:35:14.800
So Mark uh Mark, the drummer of High on Stress.
639
00:35:14.840 --> 00:35:18.199
I think you actually played a show with Mark. I
640
00:35:18.199 --> 00:35:20.480
can't remember what the event was. He's in another as
641
00:35:20.519 --> 00:35:22.079
we were talking about earlier, if you're a good drummer,
642
00:35:22.079 --> 00:35:24.719
you're playing in multiple bands. He plays in a band.
643
00:35:24.960 --> 00:35:26.920
I think it was his band, Whiskey Rock and Roll Club.
644
00:35:28.239 --> 00:35:31.199
Played with Super Chunk at some event here in Minneapolis.
645
00:35:31.199 --> 00:35:32.360
Think it was Grumpies or something.
646
00:35:32.440 --> 00:35:35.679
Oh yes, yes, I remember. I didn't get to see
647
00:35:35.679 --> 00:35:36.960
a lot of the bands, but that that was That
648
00:35:37.000 --> 00:35:38.360
was the last time I think I played with Super
649
00:35:38.440 --> 00:35:40.960
Chunk up there, and that that was a fun day.
650
00:35:41.760 --> 00:35:45.239
I remember Mac brought his son with him, and his son.
651
00:35:45.639 --> 00:35:47.239
His son's like a hip kid, but you know, he
652
00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:52.039
was probably twelve or something. And just seeing the backstage
653
00:35:52.119 --> 00:35:55.639
was was Tom hazel Meyer's office, I guess, and just
654
00:35:55.679 --> 00:35:58.480
seeing Tom and a child interact was was very fun
655
00:35:59.199 --> 00:36:02.400
and and Max Son going through the records and like saying,
656
00:36:02.440 --> 00:36:04.639
you know, it's all not like that tough guy stuff,
657
00:36:04.719 --> 00:36:07.000
you know, yeah, you know, but it was hilarious. Yeah,
658
00:36:07.039 --> 00:36:08.039
that hilarious. Yeah.
659
00:36:08.079 --> 00:36:12.880
So Mark the drummer and I went to Tommy's that
660
00:36:13.199 --> 00:36:16.760
kind of life Yeah in La So Mark and I
661
00:36:16.800 --> 00:36:20.239
went out to that and that's great. Ronnie Ronnie from
662
00:36:20.280 --> 00:36:22.719
the Muffs, Yeah, I had agree. He got up at
663
00:36:22.760 --> 00:36:26.239
one point and he said, I just want everyone in
664
00:36:26.239 --> 00:36:28.920
this room to know that Tommy talks shit about you
665
00:36:29.199 --> 00:36:30.079
at least once.
666
00:36:30.760 --> 00:36:35.920
Oh my god. Yeah. Everybody roared, Oh so true, Like yeah,
667
00:36:36.360 --> 00:36:38.800
I'm just so I'm happy that he said that, because yeah,
668
00:36:38.840 --> 00:36:42.960
that's that's that's always been in there too. So funny.
669
00:36:43.440 --> 00:36:47.840
Yeah, it's just his ability to know everyone. Like anytime,
670
00:36:47.960 --> 00:36:50.519
like you'd be standing next to him and random people
671
00:36:50.519 --> 00:36:52.840
would come up, but you know to say hi, who
672
00:36:52.960 --> 00:36:55.320
just go to his shows and he would know everybody.
673
00:36:55.760 --> 00:36:58.400
It's like, how do you remember that? Right? He has
674
00:36:58.400 --> 00:37:07.400
this amazing story of so uh so Peter Jasperson you know,
675
00:37:07.599 --> 00:37:12.639
uh local legend. Uh back in the day he was
676
00:37:12.719 --> 00:37:17.039
he was tour managing the replacements and he U gets
677
00:37:17.079 --> 00:37:21.360
an offer to tour with RM, so so he leaves
678
00:37:21.360 --> 00:37:23.679
the replacements for a little bit and and goes out
679
00:37:23.679 --> 00:37:25.199
with R. E. M. And you know, it comes back
680
00:37:25.239 --> 00:37:28.039
to places. But anyway, so during this Rim tour, which
681
00:37:28.079 --> 00:37:31.719
happened to be several of these big shows with the police,
682
00:37:32.920 --> 00:37:34.559
one of which I saw the first time I saw
683
00:37:34.679 --> 00:37:40.039
Rim so Summer of eighty three, and so Arim apparently
684
00:37:40.280 --> 00:37:45.079
no no real interaction with the police at all, and
685
00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:48.199
possibly to the point of annoyance maybe, you know. And
686
00:37:48.280 --> 00:37:53.599
so the story that Tommy tells is, uh, Rim are
687
00:37:53.639 --> 00:37:56.280
about to go on stage, maybe at Shay Stadium and
688
00:37:56.440 --> 00:38:00.960
uh and they're walking out and Tommy is there, Tommy's
689
00:38:01.039 --> 00:38:06.679
like visiting Ram or Peter whoever, and and out pop
690
00:38:06.800 --> 00:38:11.840
Sting like for the first time, and Sting looks right
691
00:38:11.840 --> 00:38:13.400
at Tommy and goes have a great.
692
00:38:13.239 --> 00:38:21.760
Show, showing you how much he was paying attention. Oh god,
693
00:38:22.000 --> 00:38:27.880
that's hilarious. That's hilarious. So with your your tour dates,
694
00:38:27.960 --> 00:38:31.679
obviously you've been out constantly, right, because well, how do
695
00:38:31.719 --> 00:38:35.079
you manage first of all, your tour schedules with all
696
00:38:35.119 --> 00:38:37.119
of these bands You just I suppose you just kind
697
00:38:37.119 --> 00:38:40.239
of have to coordinate with everybody and say I'm unavailable
698
00:38:40.320 --> 00:38:40.880
here to hear.
699
00:38:41.280 --> 00:38:43.360
Yeah, it's all it's all booked in advance, and you know,
700
00:38:43.400 --> 00:38:48.800
it causes me me great guilt, but it all works out. Uh,
701
00:38:49.719 --> 00:38:51.519
no personal life, so I'm able to do it all.
702
00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:55.039
Well, I suppose it probably becomes it.
703
00:38:55.159 --> 00:38:55.280
Right.
704
00:38:55.320 --> 00:38:57.320
You're out on the road with your friends and hanging
705
00:38:57.360 --> 00:39:00.280
out and doing the things. So well, that's that's cool.
706
00:39:00.360 --> 00:39:03.760
So what are you know you mentioned early on kind
707
00:39:03.760 --> 00:39:05.719
of some of the stuff that you were into. You know,
708
00:39:05.760 --> 00:39:07.840
what are some of your favorite records today when you
709
00:39:07.840 --> 00:39:10.159
look back, the stuff that really holds up that you're like,
710
00:39:10.280 --> 00:39:11.280
this is this is.
711
00:39:11.239 --> 00:39:15.400
The Holy Grail? Here the first one that comes to mind. Uh,
712
00:39:15.960 --> 00:39:18.199
that was the biggest, had the biggest impact on me
713
00:39:18.239 --> 00:39:20.840
as as a kid with London calling by the Clash,
714
00:39:21.320 --> 00:39:25.719
I just remember just loving it and and I just
715
00:39:25.800 --> 00:39:28.679
I really liked you know, you never really know these
716
00:39:28.679 --> 00:39:31.800
people as people, but I just thought these guys seem cool.
717
00:39:31.960 --> 00:39:35.000
And I went to go see that movie Rude Boy
718
00:39:35.199 --> 00:39:38.360
at the Tower Theater with my friends and and it's funny.
719
00:39:38.400 --> 00:39:41.719
I saw it twice. It played played here in the theater,
720
00:39:41.960 --> 00:39:46.119
uh last weekend, so I went both nights and uh yeah,
721
00:39:46.159 --> 00:39:48.599
so that was a big, a big record. What else
722
00:39:48.639 --> 00:39:52.880
I loved them, uh you know, talking about like punk.
723
00:39:52.880 --> 00:39:57.360
I loved the minor threat stuff out of uh you know,
724
00:39:57.440 --> 00:40:02.440
out of Step and uh uh Zen Arcade, flip your wig,
725
00:40:02.480 --> 00:40:04.920
I love to let it Be and pleased to meet
726
00:40:05.000 --> 00:40:08.880
me and uh, you know the first three r M
727
00:40:09.000 --> 00:40:13.960
records I love and uh all that all that stuff,
728
00:40:14.000 --> 00:40:16.119
you know, and like Soul Asylum. Soul Asylum was one
729
00:40:16.159 --> 00:40:18.239
of the best live bands I ever saw. I saw
730
00:40:18.280 --> 00:40:21.199
them twice on on on hangtime at a little club
731
00:40:21.239 --> 00:40:25.039
here and just incredible band.
732
00:40:25.800 --> 00:40:28.599
Yeah lie, like you know, I would say that like
733
00:40:28.719 --> 00:40:30.960
people would you know, people liked him, some people didn't
734
00:40:31.000 --> 00:40:32.360
like the band, and I would tell the people that
735
00:40:32.400 --> 00:40:35.760
didn't like the band, go see the band because they
736
00:40:35.800 --> 00:40:37.599
were incredible, so good.
737
00:40:37.400 --> 00:40:41.960
And and and and great songs. Like I've honestly not
738
00:40:42.079 --> 00:40:46.800
followed them, probably since you know, uh when Sterling Campbell joined,
739
00:40:46.840 --> 00:40:52.239
no offense to him, but but uh, great songs. I mean,
740
00:40:52.320 --> 00:40:55.320
he's a great songwriter. And then and Danny had you know,
741
00:40:56.119 --> 00:40:58.000
I feel like Danny had one song, but he made
742
00:40:58.000 --> 00:41:00.519
it count that song cartoon Man.
743
00:41:00.239 --> 00:41:02.840
Oh my god, that could very well be my favorite
744
00:41:02.960 --> 00:41:05.360
solo Asylum song. If not, it's in the top few
745
00:41:05.679 --> 00:41:09.679
like and and honestly this is after Sterling. But he
746
00:41:09.719 --> 00:41:11.599
wrote Promises Broken too, which was a hit.
747
00:41:11.639 --> 00:41:12.559
Oh I don't know that one.
748
00:41:12.800 --> 00:41:15.000
Yeah, that was a dim light shine I think o
749
00:41:15.639 --> 00:41:17.920
that Butcher Big did that one. I can't remember, I
750
00:41:17.960 --> 00:41:20.639
think so yeah, yeah, but yeah, so it's like like
751
00:41:20.679 --> 00:41:23.960
you said, he made it count here you go. Yeah,
752
00:41:24.000 --> 00:41:27.519
he's a great guy. I just played with him last
753
00:41:28.199 --> 00:41:29.800
week at this thing here in Minneapolis.
754
00:41:29.840 --> 00:41:33.079
He played guitar with me. Oh great, great, awesome he
755
00:41:32.880 --> 00:41:36.000
he He was very kind helping me with stuff for this.
756
00:41:38.000 --> 00:41:45.639
These liner notes I did for while you were out. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
757
00:41:45.679 --> 00:41:50.039
so I did. Yeah. I can't remember how that came about.
758
00:41:50.039 --> 00:41:55.280
Maybe maybe Jefferson suggested me or something, but they signed
759
00:41:55.280 --> 00:41:58.679
off on them, so they must have thought they were okay, nice. Nice.
760
00:41:59.039 --> 00:42:01.639
So looking at your career now, you've been at this
761
00:42:01.719 --> 00:42:04.800
for a long time, You've you've seen many of a
762
00:42:04.840 --> 00:42:08.599
place looking back, I know this is a hard question,
763
00:42:08.639 --> 00:42:11.800
but first thing that comes to mind, what album or
764
00:42:11.960 --> 00:42:13.400
song are you most proud of?
765
00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:18.280
Well, the song that that comes to mind immediately, the
766
00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:20.679
song I've listened to the most for Pleasure that I've
767
00:42:20.679 --> 00:42:25.800
played on is a song on Silver Rage, a Bob
768
00:42:25.840 --> 00:42:30.440
Mold album, and the song is called The Dissent. I
769
00:42:30.519 --> 00:42:33.280
just think it's it's a fabulous song. It's got Yeah,
770
00:42:33.280 --> 00:42:36.920
it's just amazing. I just remember listening to that all
771
00:42:36.960 --> 00:42:39.480
the time. And I rarely listen to stuff I play on.
772
00:42:40.679 --> 00:42:42.360
But do you have a hard time listening to it
773
00:42:42.400 --> 00:42:45.519
because you're nitpicking it or what's the Yeah, that's typically
774
00:42:45.559 --> 00:42:48.000
the thing, right, I could have done this differently.
775
00:42:48.159 --> 00:42:51.119
Yeah, there's a great you know, he's not full of
776
00:42:51.159 --> 00:42:54.320
great quotes, but but there's a Gene Simmons quote where
777
00:42:54.320 --> 00:42:58.039
someone asked him why why they have producers, Like why
778
00:42:58.119 --> 00:43:02.199
you have an outside producer? And he said, because when
779
00:43:02.239 --> 00:43:04.719
I listen to something I've done, I only hear the mistakes.
780
00:43:05.320 --> 00:43:10.719
And you know, you need that objective observer yep.
781
00:43:11.039 --> 00:43:12.920
To need that extra person in the room too that
782
00:43:13.559 --> 00:43:15.159
maybe doesn't have the ego attached.
783
00:43:15.280 --> 00:43:17.800
Yeah. Yeah, but then it's fun it's funny, like I
784
00:43:17.880 --> 00:43:20.840
find that like, like I remember thinking I played so
785
00:43:21.159 --> 00:43:26.199
terribly on this record Foolish by Super Chunk, and people
786
00:43:26.280 --> 00:43:28.559
love that record. But yeah, and then like like five
787
00:43:28.639 --> 00:43:30.880
years later, I listened to it and like, oh, I
788
00:43:30.920 --> 00:43:32.719
don't hear any of the things that I thought were
789
00:43:32.719 --> 00:43:36.639
so terrible like back then. So it's all just sort
790
00:43:36.679 --> 00:43:39.239
of you know, you have to kind of pull back
791
00:43:39.320 --> 00:43:42.679
and just you know, accept it for what it is.
792
00:43:42.719 --> 00:43:44.800
And then by that point you're not you don't hear
793
00:43:44.800 --> 00:43:46.760
it anymore. You don't hear what you what bothered you
794
00:43:46.800 --> 00:43:47.519
so much before?
795
00:43:47.920 --> 00:43:50.079
Yeah, listening to your own stuff for pleasure as a
796
00:43:50.079 --> 00:43:50.800
poor choice.
797
00:43:51.000 --> 00:43:54.679
Oh yeah, terrible, Yeah, but no less it's a like
798
00:43:54.679 --> 00:43:56.880
it's an incredible song like that, like the Bob Old
799
00:43:56.960 --> 00:43:59.920
song I mentioned, is it's that sort of how great
800
00:44:00.079 --> 00:44:04.280
the song is, cancels out any sort of you know, problems,
801
00:44:04.320 --> 00:44:08.840
Like pretty much any of my favorite songs, there's there's
802
00:44:08.920 --> 00:44:12.360
mistakes happening in there, but because you're in the moment
803
00:44:12.480 --> 00:44:14.199
you love the song, you don't hear it, or if
804
00:44:14.239 --> 00:44:15.440
you do hear it, it doesn't matter.
805
00:44:15.679 --> 00:44:18.559
Yeah, And it's funny because sometimes it's the mistakes that
806
00:44:18.679 --> 00:44:21.599
the people who are listening to like what you did
807
00:44:21.639 --> 00:44:23.880
that was really cool kind of a thing, and you're like, yeah,
808
00:44:23.920 --> 00:44:24.639
that was a mistake.
809
00:44:26.400 --> 00:44:30.119
Start me up. Rolling Stones Charlie comes in like upside
810
00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:32.840
down for the first couple of measures and it's brilliant.
811
00:44:33.119 --> 00:44:35.840
Was it a mistake? Who knows? Probably? It's my favorite
812
00:44:35.880 --> 00:44:36.480
part of the song.
813
00:44:36.599 --> 00:44:41.440
Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's hilarious. So the next thing I
814
00:44:41.440 --> 00:44:43.679
want to ask too, you've been you were just stunned
815
00:44:43.679 --> 00:44:46.360
the Tonight Show a few weeks ago, I think, yeah,
816
00:44:46.519 --> 00:44:48.320
And you've been on Lightermen. I remember the one you
817
00:44:48.320 --> 00:44:49.840
were knocking the dust off the ceiling.
818
00:44:49.880 --> 00:44:50.400
I remember that.
819
00:44:50.599 --> 00:44:53.880
Oh right, Yeah, so you've done all of these things.
820
00:44:53.880 --> 00:44:57.920
You're constantly touring. Sort of a show that comes to
821
00:44:57.960 --> 00:45:01.559
mind is kind of that you know, magical show that
822
00:45:01.599 --> 00:45:03.000
you were like, I can't believe we did that.
823
00:45:03.280 --> 00:45:06.880
Yeah, there's a bunch for Super Chunk. We we did
824
00:45:06.880 --> 00:45:11.320
a Lollapalooza tour, so it would have been ninety five. Uh,
825
00:45:11.360 --> 00:45:14.719
And we ended in in Raleigh, you know, our our closest,
826
00:45:15.159 --> 00:45:20.880
closest big town, and we played you know outside, we
827
00:45:20.880 --> 00:45:22.360
were we were kind of on the you know, the
828
00:45:22.400 --> 00:45:24.840
second stage. But it was an incredible bill. It was
829
00:45:25.559 --> 00:45:34.880
on our stage. It was Moby Mike watt Us, one
830
00:45:34.880 --> 00:45:36.400
of the Wu Tang guys. Who would it have been
831
00:45:37.719 --> 00:45:43.079
Old Bastard is is redman in you in in Wu
832
00:45:43.159 --> 00:45:45.280
tang or is he not? He might not be. I've
833
00:45:45.280 --> 00:45:48.079
actually seen that man. Okay, it was red Man. It
834
00:45:48.119 --> 00:45:51.039
was red Man. It was red Man and uh yeah,
835
00:45:51.079 --> 00:45:54.920
and it was just an incredible night. It was you know,
836
00:45:54.920 --> 00:45:58.559
it was like it was Golden hour, sun was going down. Uh.
837
00:45:58.679 --> 00:46:00.159
It was our last show of the tour or a
838
00:46:00.239 --> 00:46:05.440
great crowd. I remember that being really nice. Great show
839
00:46:05.480 --> 00:46:10.480
at Shepherd's Bush Empire with Bob Mold probably ten years ago.
840
00:46:10.480 --> 00:46:14.800
That was really great. There's all kinds of Mountain Goats
841
00:46:15.039 --> 00:46:18.440
have had these great New York shows recently at this
842
00:46:18.559 --> 00:46:21.840
uh this place that's on top of a building, holds
843
00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:25.119
about three thousand people, but you're playing you know, the
844
00:46:25.159 --> 00:46:29.079
bridges are in the background. Just beautiful place. So there's
845
00:46:29.119 --> 00:46:31.000
there's all all kinds of shows like that that come
846
00:46:31.039 --> 00:46:32.679
to mind, you know, that are like, oh, well, and
847
00:46:32.719 --> 00:46:35.000
it has to do a lot with the setting too, you.
848
00:46:34.960 --> 00:46:38.559
Know, right, yeah, because there I suppose it's the setting
849
00:46:38.719 --> 00:46:40.480
and the response of the crowd.
850
00:46:40.599 --> 00:46:42.280
Yeah, exactly, you know, because it's.
851
00:46:42.280 --> 00:46:44.840
You know, you're usually playing similar songs each night, with
852
00:46:44.920 --> 00:46:47.159
maybe some stuff kind of jumping in and out.
853
00:46:47.280 --> 00:46:51.840
So yeah, but oh but this this show that we
854
00:46:51.880 --> 00:46:55.280
did with our with the r M Band with Michael
855
00:46:55.320 --> 00:46:58.360
Shannon and Jason. We did a show at the forty
856
00:46:58.360 --> 00:47:01.440
one in Athens last last was it last year? Was
857
00:47:01.480 --> 00:47:03.519
it too? I can't remember when it was. I think
858
00:47:03.559 --> 00:47:06.400
it was last year. But so all the guys came,
859
00:47:06.599 --> 00:47:09.840
all four guys came, and and they got up on
860
00:47:09.920 --> 00:47:12.480
stage and they and they they had words to say,
861
00:47:12.519 --> 00:47:14.760
and Peter played with us, and Bill did, and Mike
862
00:47:14.880 --> 00:47:18.199
and Mike sang and that that was the top five
863
00:47:18.320 --> 00:47:18.719
night too.
864
00:47:19.400 --> 00:47:21.679
Did you did you know ari em prior to that?
865
00:47:21.920 --> 00:47:25.440
Yeah? Yeah, yeah, I've known them for a good while.
866
00:47:25.480 --> 00:47:28.719
And I I've played with Peter a lot over the years,
867
00:47:28.760 --> 00:47:31.800
and and Mike and I were the rhythm section on
868
00:47:32.039 --> 00:47:37.519
Jason Arduci is one of his h solo records. So yeah, yeah, yeah,
869
00:47:37.639 --> 00:47:40.679
And and I've become friends with Bill, which is which
870
00:47:40.760 --> 00:47:42.920
is a whole trip. And he's great and he seems
871
00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:45.599
like a great dude, like just full of heart, Like
872
00:47:45.679 --> 00:47:47.559
every time you see him interviewed, you're like, oh, this
873
00:47:47.599 --> 00:47:50.119
guy's just awesome. Oh yeah, yeah, it means it's important
874
00:47:50.239 --> 00:47:52.840
and it's important to all the all those guys and
875
00:47:52.840 --> 00:47:59.400
and yeah, yeah they're they feel it. That's awesome. Awesome.
876
00:47:59.480 --> 00:48:01.760
What what I'm most proud of? We're kind of getting
877
00:48:01.760 --> 00:48:02.920
here at the time. I want to let you go
878
00:48:03.000 --> 00:48:03.519
go pack.
879
00:48:04.079 --> 00:48:08.000
It's funny. I I'd love to be, you know, remembered
880
00:48:08.039 --> 00:48:10.400
for my music, but I think in terms of, like,
881
00:48:11.639 --> 00:48:13.519
maybe if I could be remembered for one thing, it
882
00:48:13.519 --> 00:48:16.800
would be this this box set that Tom Sharpling and
883
00:48:16.840 --> 00:48:20.719
I put out of of Our like a best of
884
00:48:21.079 --> 00:48:23.960
what we did on the Best Show for about ten years.
885
00:48:24.000 --> 00:48:27.320
And Numero Group put a box set out of God.
886
00:48:27.360 --> 00:48:30.320
It's probably like eight hours of material. We've got so
887
00:48:30.440 --> 00:48:32.760
much in there. But uh so, I think in terms
888
00:48:32.800 --> 00:48:37.440
of like a creative legacy, that's what That's what maybe
889
00:48:37.440 --> 00:48:41.159
I'm most proud of just become Yeah yeah, I mean
890
00:48:41.159 --> 00:48:42.840
I love the music and I'll you know, I'll do
891
00:48:42.880 --> 00:48:44.840
it till death and it's my main thing. But but
892
00:48:45.480 --> 00:48:48.760
in terms of like something that's just like one hundred
893
00:48:48.760 --> 00:48:52.880
percent or whatever me in terms of like my creativity,
894
00:48:53.000 --> 00:48:54.480
that's that's it. I think.
895
00:48:54.760 --> 00:48:56.800
Do you have any favorite comedians?
896
00:48:57.119 --> 00:49:02.039
Oh? Yeah, but you know, I I love shows and
897
00:49:02.159 --> 00:49:06.320
movies more than actual comedians, Like, like my favorite TV
898
00:49:06.440 --> 00:49:13.800
show ever is Veepe Deep Yeah, oh yeah, And I
899
00:49:13.840 --> 00:49:15.760
just love that like, I could watch I probably watched
900
00:49:15.760 --> 00:49:19.159
every episode at least fifteen times. I just love it.
901
00:49:19.159 --> 00:49:22.760
It's like soothing to me. So things like that. Tom
902
00:49:22.800 --> 00:49:24.800
Sharply and I had. The first thing we bonded over
903
00:49:25.039 --> 00:49:30.840
was Chris Elliott's program Get a Life. Okay, I didn't
904
00:49:30.840 --> 00:49:32.719
know that. I remember him though, Yeah, yeah he had.
905
00:49:33.760 --> 00:49:36.880
Oh he's so good. Yeah, all those people. And but
906
00:49:36.960 --> 00:49:47.039
like comedians, I love Todd Barry, Sarah Silverman's, great Andy Kindler,
907
00:49:47.159 --> 00:49:48.599
all kinds of people. Yeah.
908
00:49:48.679 --> 00:49:51.199
Nice, nice, Yeah, it's funny. I have a theory, and
909
00:49:51.280 --> 00:49:52.679
I think a lot of people have this theory that
910
00:49:52.800 --> 00:49:55.719
musicians want to be comedians and comedians want to be musicians,
911
00:49:56.320 --> 00:49:58.079
and it's somehow you did them both.
912
00:49:58.320 --> 00:50:02.719
Somehow, But it's funny. I well, it's odd. I was
913
00:50:02.760 --> 00:50:07.559
talking to Matt Walsh, who plays Mike on Veep the
914
00:50:07.599 --> 00:50:13.000
other day. We were talking and I told him I
915
00:50:13.039 --> 00:50:15.239
came in comedy through the back door. Like I've never
916
00:50:15.280 --> 00:50:20.000
had any aspirations to do comedy. I always loved it,
917
00:50:20.039 --> 00:50:22.000
but I never saw myself doing it. And somehow I
918
00:50:22.039 --> 00:50:25.840
met Tom Sharpling and it was two guys that don't
919
00:50:25.880 --> 00:50:30.119
really love to be in the spotlight much so we're
920
00:50:30.159 --> 00:50:32.760
able to like build this thing just on the phone.
921
00:50:32.920 --> 00:50:35.559
So I basically I call into his show every I've
922
00:50:35.559 --> 00:50:38.920
been doing it for today's our twenty fifth anniversary of
923
00:50:38.960 --> 00:50:45.199
doing it. But so somehow that's how I got into
924
00:50:45.239 --> 00:50:49.440
the comedy world, just by writing these funny calls with Tom,
925
00:50:49.480 --> 00:50:52.719
And that's how I got in. Everything I ever did
926
00:50:52.760 --> 00:50:55.440
in comedy kind of came from that right place at
927
00:50:55.480 --> 00:50:58.760
the right time. Yeah, totally, totally. What do you attribute
928
00:50:58.800 --> 00:50:59.039
that to?
929
00:50:59.159 --> 00:51:01.159
How are you the guy that's in the right place
930
00:51:01.199 --> 00:51:03.280
at the right time. Is it just luck card you
931
00:51:03.280 --> 00:51:05.880
feel like you're putting yourself out there to have stuff
932
00:51:05.960 --> 00:51:06.719
happen or what do you.
933
00:51:06.960 --> 00:51:09.000
I'll tell you. And I don't talk about this a lot,
934
00:51:09.039 --> 00:51:12.079
but I believe in all the law of attraction stuff,
935
00:51:12.159 --> 00:51:14.559
and I think I think there are there are certain
936
00:51:14.679 --> 00:51:17.159
rules that like that are just sort of in the
937
00:51:17.159 --> 00:51:22.119
ephemera where I had such a hard time getting stuff
938
00:51:22.159 --> 00:51:25.960
going between, like when Super Chunk went on hiatus in
939
00:51:26.079 --> 00:51:30.280
like one and probably till like two thousand and eight
940
00:51:30.400 --> 00:51:33.079
or something, because I was trying so hard, like I
941
00:51:33.159 --> 00:51:36.559
was just like hammering, just trying to get breaks. And
942
00:51:36.599 --> 00:51:40.320
when I stopped hammering, That's when everything came and I
943
00:51:40.360 --> 00:51:42.159
haven't hammered hammered since.
944
00:51:51.519 --> 00:51:57.360
John Worster, that was a blast, right good guy, great story,
945
00:51:57.440 --> 00:52:01.679
accomplished so much and literally one of the best rock
946
00:52:01.760 --> 00:52:06.039
drummers around today. So big thanks to John for being
947
00:52:06.320 --> 00:52:11.559
on the episode, and good luck and say travels on
948
00:52:12.079 --> 00:52:15.880
all of the upcoming tours. We'll be back with more
949
00:52:15.920 --> 00:52:20.199
episodes soon, but in the meantime, thanks for listening.
950
00:52:21.320 --> 00:52:22.800
From a studio twenty four.
951
00:52:23.519 --> 00:53:22.199
This has been the Figure eight podcast.
952
00:53:00.360 --> 00:53:01.559
Because I'm running.
953
00:53:01.400 --> 00:53:08.320
Down long, You're weird.
954
00:53:08.719 --> 00:53:14.639
Because I'm running out long. I can't imagine its sport,
955
00:53:17.000 --> 00:53:19.920
but I brought it out. Weird