The Everything House: Materiality in Architecture and Pushing Boundaries

WEBVTT
00:00:13.914 --> 00:00:22.108
it's good listening into radio dombrowski uh, cool, all right so what's on the agenda today?
00:00:22.949 --> 00:00:23.589
Should we crack into it?
00:00:23.589 --> 00:00:23.731
What?
00:00:23.971 --> 00:00:24.632
have you got for us?
00:00:24.672 --> 00:00:26.614
What yarns Are we spinning?
00:00:27.983 --> 00:00:32.366
Well, before we get into the nitty-gritty, a bit of a hiatus for the DPP.
00:00:32.366 --> 00:00:38.969
A few life things have been going on Ben's shifted, shifted islands no islands.
00:00:38.969 --> 00:00:40.972
Up island To the big schmoke.
00:00:40.972 --> 00:00:48.283
To the big schmoke, gerard's been building cool shit.
00:00:48.283 --> 00:00:53.970
I don't know if it's supposed to be on the D-low or not, and I've had another kid, so we've been a bit preoccupied.
00:00:53.970 --> 00:00:57.274
But we're back better than ever and with a bit of a new take.
00:00:57.274 --> 00:01:25.608
We enjoyed our interview series but trying to delve deeper into some design concepts coming up, and the first one of the days, something that I've been thinking about, it's kind of been on my mind for a while and it's a concept that I call the everything house, sort of focusing on materiality, watch out and it's a design idea where everything in the house is made from one material.
00:01:27.170 --> 00:01:30.254
So this let's take concrete spark.
00:01:30.540 --> 00:01:56.703
What sparked that on for you, sam I think it's a use, like us using sips a lot, and it's an incredible like it's a very wooden interior when it's exposed, yeah, but it's like it's, it's a, it's a veneer ultimately right like the actual, like the inside of the wall is not all wood and ice cream sandwich you know this the slab.
00:01:56.944 --> 00:01:59.072
If it's on a slab, you know obviously that's not wood.
00:01:59.072 --> 00:02:02.522
But so I was like what happens if everything is wood?
00:02:02.522 --> 00:02:13.550
You know you're your framing, your lining, your insulation, your furniture, your Everything, your plumbing, plumbing yeah, why?
00:02:13.570 --> 00:02:17.810
not you may as well exclude plumbing and electrical.
00:02:17.810 --> 00:02:21.067
I don't know how the electrical I mean electrical, probably not.
00:02:21.479 --> 00:02:23.848
I think there's some points you're going to have to draw the line.
00:02:23.848 --> 00:02:25.042
You're not getting a good current.
00:02:25.102 --> 00:02:28.867
Yeah, I don't know man.
00:02:28.967 --> 00:02:35.991
I'm all for an extreme concept and forego the realities but I, yeah, I I mean, well, that's the thing, right, gerard?
00:02:35.991 --> 00:02:38.641
Like you don't have to, it doesn't necessarily even have to be livable.
00:02:38.641 --> 00:02:44.213
I mean, I I've jotted down a couple of examples for you guys to check out.
00:02:44.213 --> 00:02:45.645
I don't know if you had a look at them at all.
00:02:46.039 --> 00:02:51.387
Probably the most yeah, I was going to say the most radical of them is the Robert Bruno house.
00:02:51.387 --> 00:02:53.225
I don't know if anyone's seen that.
00:02:53.225 --> 00:02:58.610
I'll put a link to it in the show notes, but that is a proof of concept.
00:02:59.580 --> 00:03:27.953
One thing that blew my mind, actually when I was doing some research on this, is the amount of quite well renowned architects who have actually attempted this I guess, probably like when you are working with material like concrete, then it's just kind of like makes sense to make it, oh you know, fully, fully concrete concrete roof, concrete structure and yeah like today.
00:03:28.013 --> 00:03:34.971
I was a great example, so concrete is definitely the obvious choice of material.
00:03:34.971 --> 00:03:41.572
Also probably a lot easier to achieve in some of those foreign countries.
00:03:41.572 --> 00:03:46.706
As opposed to new zealand, I don't know how it would work trying to like meet the New Zealand building code.
00:03:48.623 --> 00:03:58.445
Well, I think that's the thing right, like this idea is not something that's necessarily going to be even functional, but I think it's just like it's a folly concept.
00:03:58.445 --> 00:04:06.616
A pavilion, yeah, really exciting to explore, and that's that Westerpunt by Studio Marta, really exciting to explore, and that's that westerpunt by studio mata.
00:04:06.616 --> 00:04:16.733
You know, that's that sort of helix, um concrete, uh, what uh like viewing platform is what it kind of is.
00:04:16.733 --> 00:04:22.286
You know, that is that's the sort of idea that I'm getting to the entire thing.
00:04:23.488 --> 00:04:26.973
Yeah, it is a epic object.
00:04:27.415 --> 00:04:30.125
Yes, but that's quite cool because you know it's concrete.
00:04:30.125 --> 00:04:30.987
But it's so.
00:04:30.987 --> 00:04:45.994
It's so dynamic and so fluid and it sort of really belies that you know the, the nature or the you know the physical nature of concrete, because it looks like water the gnarliness of that is probably building it in the waves.
00:04:46.675 --> 00:04:56.598
Like it's, it's lapped by the waves yeah which that must have some horrendous foundations but you're right.
00:04:56.899 --> 00:05:09.074
Going back to the, you know, like today or ando concepts and stuff, you know there's definitely architects there that champion a material you know, and kundig's one who I, you know.
00:05:09.093 --> 00:05:24.425
That comes springs to mind maybe not necessarily, like you know, giving himself over to one material in its entirety, but, like his, the honesty of the materials that he uses, like everything is sort of warts and all it's raw.
00:05:24.425 --> 00:05:29.113
It's you raw, it's sort of in its natural state, which I quite like as well.
00:05:29.113 --> 00:05:37.788
I feel like there's so much gloss and ornamentation, almost like the disguising of the reality of materials in the stuff that we do, which I find kind of disappointing.
00:05:38.550 --> 00:05:43.612
Yeah Well, I think he's good at following his aesthetic concept.
00:05:43.612 --> 00:05:47.829
It's clearly industrial and pushes it all the way.
00:05:47.829 --> 00:06:02.821
I think, like, for example, this Robert Bruno house big steel sort of animalistic creature thing from the outside is epic but on the inside they kind of fall down.
00:06:02.821 --> 00:06:09.494
Like the looks like laminate flooring in this super industrial steel building.
00:06:09.494 --> 00:06:11.605
You're so close.
00:06:12.339 --> 00:06:16.228
Yeah, I kind of feel like You're not quite taking the concept far enough.
00:06:16.228 --> 00:06:18.867
Well, I almost think it's kind of posters death.
00:06:18.867 --> 00:06:24.211
You know, the people that have bought it have tried to turn it into something a bit real and I think you can stay there now.
00:06:25.139 --> 00:06:27.490
Yeah, it's an Airbnb, I think, by the looks of it.
00:06:28.041 --> 00:06:35.771
Yeah, but it's kind of sad in a way because it's going against what I think his original concept was, which was for it to be completely steel.
00:06:35.771 --> 00:06:53.273
Yeah, and I really like the story in a way, the sustainable nature of it and the fact that all the steel he used was salvaged and then he, over decades, developed it iteratively.
00:06:53.273 --> 00:07:10.011
But he'd like chop bits out and then reuse them somewhere else and like be like I want to cut a window here and then like weld it onto somewhere else and they'd be like oh, I don't like that and you know, I kind of like that ability to meld and sort of like manipulate the material because it is all the same.
00:07:10.600 --> 00:07:14.346
You know you couldn't really do that if there was, you know there was a timber nature there.
00:07:15.380 --> 00:07:32.127
If I was to I would definitely go with timber as a material if I was to attempt this, I think just because it comes in so many like such a variety of different forms, so you can already have some sort of timber cladding, timber flooring, timber structure.
00:07:32.127 --> 00:07:33.603
Is it the potato?
00:07:34.665 --> 00:07:37.706
of building materials the potato of building materials.
00:07:37.725 --> 00:07:38.427
That's brilliant.
00:07:38.427 --> 00:07:41.302
Probably is.
00:07:41.302 --> 00:07:44.252
That's perfect.
00:07:44.252 --> 00:07:46.389
You can what fries mash.
00:07:46.932 --> 00:07:56.870
Yeah, exactly Chips, and it's so good, boiled, baked and sustainable, I guess Goes in the ground Architecture school does that like chair cardboard thing.
00:07:58.079 --> 00:08:00.810
They should do potatoes, potato architecture.
00:08:03.283 --> 00:08:11.384
Yeah, timber's cool and I don't know if you guys ever looked at and I think it's something that's actually probably been almost proven, particularly in the past.
00:08:11.384 --> 00:08:14.449
You know, have you looked at those Norwegians?
00:08:14.449 --> 00:08:16.827
Is it stave or starve churches?
00:08:18.060 --> 00:08:19.987
They're the ones that are all black generally.
00:08:20.067 --> 00:08:27.625
Yeah, but they are like timber-fram timber framed like timber, everything the timber shingle.
00:08:27.625 --> 00:08:33.326
I have a feeling they use like sawdust for insulation or something crazy like that as well.
00:08:33.326 --> 00:08:35.648
The concept of that is pretty cool.
00:08:37.524 --> 00:08:38.989
Absolute fire death trap.
00:08:38.989 --> 00:08:40.707
They look like witch houses.
00:08:41.542 --> 00:08:45.384
Yeah, they do look like witch houses, but you know, I little witch hats.
00:08:45.625 --> 00:08:48.729
Is the black stained or is it charred Because?
00:08:48.729 --> 00:08:50.966
You know, charring is a natural fireproofing.
00:08:51.941 --> 00:08:52.783
I think they're pretty old.
00:08:52.783 --> 00:08:54.363
It's probably just like patina.
00:08:54.363 --> 00:08:56.403
It might even be like you know lichens.
00:08:56.423 --> 00:08:57.365
They just haven't washed it.
00:08:58.208 --> 00:09:01.508
Yeah, that's what my outdoor furniture looks like.
00:09:09.000 --> 00:09:19.350
There's a good history of all timber buildings around the world, like the old japanese temples and stuff yeah, where they use like timber nails and yeah, yeah just that sort of stuff.
00:09:19.370 --> 00:09:20.413
I think that's, that's the.
00:09:20.533 --> 00:09:32.768
That's sort of the level of detail that I'd love to take this concept yeah, those all of the joints are kind of like slotted perfectly into position and it's so satisfying to watch.
00:09:33.301 --> 00:09:45.763
It's kind of funny how we have all these initiatives to make buildings reusable and design them so they can come apart, and people have already mastered that, mastered it.
00:09:45.884 --> 00:09:52.705
Yeah, it just takes a little bit longer yeah, it's the labour aspect, really, isn't it?
00:09:53.761 --> 00:09:54.905
and the craftsmanship.
00:09:54.946 --> 00:10:02.919
There's no way you're getting a chippy in New Zealand to build in a Japanese manner.
00:10:03.765 --> 00:10:12.918
I've spent a large period of my life watching Japanese YouTube clips on timber construction.
00:10:12.918 --> 00:10:24.346
Nothing better than their chisels and their tools are just all so cool the handsaw and everything it's like oh my god do you reckon you could build like that?
00:10:26.220 --> 00:10:40.922
a lot of it is like patience, and I guess you would probably want to go and learn from one of those masters for a period of time, because there's a lot to it, like the way that they do their set outs and everything is just.
00:10:40.922 --> 00:10:42.870
It's just phenomenal really.
00:10:42.870 --> 00:10:49.754
It's just completely different and it's all hand-drawn and hand-calculated and measured and cut.
00:10:49.754 --> 00:10:50.779
It's craftsmanship really, isn't it?
00:10:50.779 --> 00:10:52.005
Yeah, it's craftsmanship.
00:10:52.005 --> 00:10:53.625
It's building a bit of joinery.
00:10:53.625 --> 00:10:58.331
It's far more like joinery than it is construction.
00:10:58.331 --> 00:11:00.869
So you'd probably want a bit of training.
00:11:00.869 --> 00:11:02.986
You'd attempt it and you'd probably pull off something half.
00:11:02.986 --> 00:11:05.298
Okay, I find it interesting that a bit of training, you'd attempt it and you'd probably pull off something.
00:11:05.317 --> 00:11:13.374
I find it interesting that a lot of the newer ones they still have the same structure, um, but they're all kind of hidden.
00:11:13.374 --> 00:11:16.552
Ultimately, by the end of the project you don't see any of them.
00:11:16.552 --> 00:11:20.943
Yeah, whereas it's kind of interesting to put so much time in care.
00:11:20.964 --> 00:11:22.586
They're still building, like actually you don't see.
00:11:23.589 --> 00:11:24.350
Yeah, what's it?
00:11:25.052 --> 00:11:26.153
are they still building like that?
00:11:26.153 --> 00:11:28.445
Yeah, yeah, definitely shit cool.
00:11:28.465 --> 00:11:31.792
Yeah, the ones that I like go on the youtube rabbit holes.
00:11:31.792 --> 00:11:37.450
It's like literally, like they cut the logs down, they select some trees.
00:11:37.450 --> 00:11:38.613
That's where they start.
00:11:38.613 --> 00:11:47.335
They start by like cutting down the trees and milling the timber and storing it in the yard for a year, and it's pretty insane.
00:11:47.659 --> 00:11:49.025
I mean that's sustainable right.
00:11:49.025 --> 00:11:54.418
That's the true description of vernacular.
00:11:54.918 --> 00:12:23.312
Yeah, the use of the immediate their spec home essentially is still like the big 150 by 150 microframe timber posts everywhere, everywhere, all slotting, but it's just like cnc'd yeah, it's all done on a grid, but it's still still put together the same way yeah which is just epic that they hold on to that rather than doing what the rest of us are doing.
00:12:25.403 --> 00:12:30.491
rather than doing what the rest of us are doing, try and marry up as many foreign materials as humanly possible.
00:12:30.491 --> 00:12:32.294
I feel like that's the way we build.
00:12:33.399 --> 00:12:55.214
Yeah, it is, and I guess the whole point of it is like, well, the whole point of an every hat thing house would be to expose like the raw structure and you know, like it tells the story about how it was built and how long it's been there and the man hours uh it took to kind of assemble where the material.
00:12:55.214 --> 00:13:00.371
You can even like kind of understand a lot more about where the materials come from and and what it is.
00:13:00.371 --> 00:13:17.910
And I think so, if you, if you're gonna, you know, I guess that's what's amazing about those houses is it really does kind of uh, it's all pretty obvious when you walk in those spaces that you understand exactly how it was built and designed and everything.
00:13:17.910 --> 00:13:19.354
That's a.
00:13:19.495 --> 00:13:23.893
I think it's the honesty right, it's, it's the honesty of the building, I feel like.
00:13:23.893 --> 00:13:26.240
So much what's interesting.
00:13:26.240 --> 00:13:35.384
I saw a comment about sort of something about materiality and and is it something that we as architects or designers really consider?
00:13:35.384 --> 00:13:36.808
And I think that that it is.
00:13:36.808 --> 00:13:51.197
I mean, it's a you know, it's a pretty common buzz term that we use all the time, and I think we really do think about materiality when we're designing but is it something that users appreciate and interact on a same, on a similar level?
00:13:51.557 --> 00:13:52.739
I don't think so.
00:13:52.739 --> 00:14:01.842
You know, I don't think that they go and look at that westerpunt, you know, look out and go, holy shit, this whole thing's made out of concrete.
00:14:01.842 --> 00:14:04.888
It's like cantilevering on this, like helix form.
00:14:04.888 --> 00:14:06.711
How did they form this out of concrete?
00:14:06.711 --> 00:14:08.575
Like they're not really looking at it that way.
00:14:08.575 --> 00:14:29.485
But back to your point being a, you know, if something's really pushed, you know, like if they are experiencing and everything else, then they have no, but no choice but to appreciate and interact with it, and I think that's quite a nice way of getting users and the consumers of buildings to kind of appreciate materiality a bit more.
00:14:31.061 --> 00:14:35.110
Yeah, so exposing the materials as opposed to covering them up?
00:14:35.851 --> 00:14:44.908
Yeah, architecture is so often peripheral, like by design is something that's in the back of your mind.
00:14:44.908 --> 00:14:49.250
It has to be pretty gnarly to come front of mind.
00:14:49.980 --> 00:14:59.587
Yeah, it has to punch you in the face a little bit for you to take note as like not a common, you know, not a casual sort of appreciator.
00:14:59.587 --> 00:15:08.350
I mean, I'd say that a lot of listeners and us all as architects, you know, I distinctly remember when we were at architecture school as well.
00:15:08.350 --> 00:15:11.687
You know you walk around with your head in the sky because you're just looking up at buildings all the time.
00:15:11.687 --> 00:15:21.067
Most people don't do that, but you know if something really is quite sensational or spectacular or interesting, then it, you know it draws in the general public.
00:15:21.067 --> 00:15:28.173
You know you're not going to have somebody come into a spec house in New Zealand and go oh wow, look at this beautiful use of a plasterboard.
00:15:28.293 --> 00:15:28.774
That's crazy.
00:15:28.774 --> 00:15:30.607
I've never seen it before.
00:15:30.607 --> 00:15:32.948
Yeah, that beautiful jib board.
00:15:32.948 --> 00:15:34.245
What a unique use of jib board.
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:38.927
Literally no one has ever seen that.
00:15:38.927 --> 00:15:40.504
That's so funny.
00:15:43.182 --> 00:15:44.447
Could you do a plasterboard house?
00:15:45.279 --> 00:15:47.898
Yeah, I guess, if you laminated enough plasterboard together, it would become.
00:15:48.782 --> 00:15:57.148
It would just melt in the rain, I mean hey, if you can do a cardboard cathedral, you can do a plasterboard house, surely?
00:15:58.201 --> 00:16:00.168
Yeah, actually that's a really good proof.
00:16:00.168 --> 00:16:01.855
That's a really good kind of everything.
00:16:01.855 --> 00:16:06.149
Material is you know Shigeru Ban's use of cardboard?
00:16:06.169 --> 00:16:08.985
Yeah, that's a guy who knows how to run a concept.
00:16:09.687 --> 00:16:10.129
Yeah, yeah.
00:16:10.861 --> 00:16:11.826
Often running a concept.
00:16:11.826 --> 00:16:19.316
He just scales up his models and you have to like pull everything back to make sure you follow that.
00:16:19.316 --> 00:16:24.072
The issue is when you start cutting corners and letting other materials come in.
00:16:24.072 --> 00:16:28.565
Yeah, issue is when you start cutting corners and letting other materials come in.
00:16:28.565 --> 00:16:38.014
Yeah, so, like the, the ice hotel is probably a really blatant example of like a successful single material project yep, because in that, all the beds, all the furniture, everything's carved out of ice, correct?
00:16:39.182 --> 00:16:46.187
yeah, yeah, cold slate but people, people go from lots of places over the world to stay in one of those, don't they?
00:16:47.721 --> 00:16:48.662
How long do they last?
00:16:48.662 --> 00:16:48.701
I?
00:16:50.404 --> 00:16:53.750
don't know A couple of months, the heart of winter.
00:16:55.433 --> 00:16:56.154
What about a tree?
00:16:56.154 --> 00:17:02.644
I guess there's a lot of tree hut architecture on Airbnb and that sort of thing.
00:17:03.748 --> 00:17:06.047
Yeah, people respond well to novelties.
00:17:06.047 --> 00:17:12.113
I think, well, maybe we, just as humans, need novelty to more novelty, architecture cut through.
00:17:12.192 --> 00:17:16.872
I think it's because everything else is so benign, right, yeah?
00:17:17.432 --> 00:17:28.153
and so few people are willing to follow a concept to the degree that is required to make something really impactful what we should be doing is.
00:17:28.555 --> 00:17:41.132
One way to design like this would be to probably do what shakira barn does and make a physical model of your or whatever it is cathedral or house or whatever and literally just scale it up.
00:17:41.132 --> 00:17:47.384
Yeah, I'm using the same material and everything yeah, shit.
00:17:47.404 --> 00:17:48.448
Yeah, I mean, I used.
00:17:48.448 --> 00:17:51.979
I used heaps of plaster when I was at uni for modeling.
00:17:52.038 --> 00:17:57.291
I don't there you go, but that's your job house yeah, well, that, exactly that's the past.
00:18:00.746 --> 00:18:01.988
I've already done it nice.
00:18:02.348 --> 00:18:03.150
yeah, exactly.
00:18:03.150 --> 00:18:08.839
Well, it's a good way to like use the inherent qualities of a material.
00:18:08.839 --> 00:18:17.690
Like, if you're a ceramic house, like I don't know, you're probably going to need some archways and shit going on, yeah, yeah.
00:18:18.039 --> 00:18:20.406
Understanding the limitations of your medium.
00:18:20.406 --> 00:18:22.432
You know that's quite interesting.
00:18:22.432 --> 00:18:38.702
Like how does I was just going to say, gerard like for you, particularly with all your steel work, like you'd have you'd have a far better relationship or understanding of that than we probably do like, how does that sort of transform into your, into your art and your sculpture making and stuff?
00:18:39.183 --> 00:18:50.070
well, a lot of my stuff's designed around the process of making it, so I don't hydroform things.
00:18:50.070 --> 00:18:54.559
You set your parameters and then you hydroform and you kind of get what you're given Right.
00:18:54.559 --> 00:18:55.121
To me.
00:18:55.121 --> 00:18:56.366
It's the beauty of the process.
00:18:57.660 --> 00:19:00.329
Are you ever going to attempt a hydroformed house?
00:19:00.329 --> 00:19:01.805
That would be pretty epic.
00:19:02.205 --> 00:19:13.097
Yeah, yeah, I've been trying to weigh it up whether I make a little hydroformed uh office like a little, just a little studio, like a backyard office.
00:19:13.097 --> 00:19:22.984
If anybody out there wants a hydroformed office, let me go I do obviously but I just want to hydroform, like I was thinking to start off small, but it's still a fuckload of water.
00:19:22.984 --> 00:19:29.434
I like the size of the bed in my unit or something like 2.4 by 1.8.
00:19:29.434 --> 00:19:36.507
But just a comically house-like shape, you know the gable and a door and a window.
00:19:37.161 --> 00:19:38.420
Traditional, like kid's drawing.
00:19:38.619 --> 00:19:39.384
Yeah, kid's drawing.
00:19:39.384 --> 00:19:42.720
But then you fill it up with water and figure it out.
00:19:43.984 --> 00:20:00.625
Or and just hear me out you literally go and buy like a bouncy castle and you just pull it apart so you can use that as your template, and then just wow, wow that all together and blow that up a stainless steel bouncy castle would be pretty epic does it only work with stainless?
00:20:01.586 --> 00:20:02.228
nah, nah.
00:20:02.228 --> 00:20:04.050
I've just been starting to use stainless a lot.
00:20:04.050 --> 00:20:07.394
It's kind of nice to work with.
00:20:07.414 --> 00:20:09.385
Can you weld stainless as good?
00:20:09.385 --> 00:20:13.165
Yeah, I mean you personally.
00:20:13.165 --> 00:20:14.068
Nah, just kidding.
00:20:15.401 --> 00:20:16.989
Can you weld stainless?
00:20:17.520 --> 00:20:19.367
I've welded twice before.
00:20:22.163 --> 00:20:23.188
I like working with stainless.
00:20:23.188 --> 00:20:30.326
The colour feedback is quite nice, Like you can tell if your welds are going good on how colourful your weld is.
00:20:30.326 --> 00:20:45.483
Yeah, but yeah, I think, like you said before, like people, architects generally have an idea of materiality, but you maybe.
00:20:45.483 --> 00:20:55.890
Sometimes we apply materials to a face, versus like using the inherent qualities of material to make the wall and the I don't know what's left.
00:20:55.890 --> 00:20:58.320
Is the outcome like like a log cabin perhaps?
00:20:58.320 --> 00:21:01.005
Is like a true example?
00:21:02.046 --> 00:21:04.068
yeah, it's so true, I'd say that.
00:21:04.068 --> 00:21:12.269
I'd say that 99% of what we do and you know to your point is essentially like facadeism.
00:21:12.730 --> 00:21:15.726
Yeah, we're decorating cakes to a large degree, totally.
00:21:15.766 --> 00:21:16.106
Yeah.
00:21:16.287 --> 00:21:22.671
I don't know, I'm just quite seduced by process-based outcomes.
00:21:22.671 --> 00:21:26.209
That sucks, so the more I can.
00:21:26.209 --> 00:21:31.846
You can kind of trick yourself into unknown outcomes that way as well but how?
00:21:31.885 --> 00:21:35.615
so what's the design process other than like hydroforming?
00:21:35.615 --> 00:21:41.470
I kind of get, but what are some other ways you can achieve that, that design, that unknown design process?
00:21:42.050 --> 00:21:49.614
melting stuff, yeah like yeah, yeah like melting plastics or even melting metals.
00:21:49.614 --> 00:21:51.988
Let it cool around a form I don't know.
00:21:53.241 --> 00:21:56.087
But you're not going to do that on a house size scale.
00:21:56.970 --> 00:22:00.724
Well, you know maybe Could you, yeah, but could you?
00:22:00.724 --> 00:22:05.632
But if not, then why not on an elemental scale?
00:22:05.632 --> 00:22:08.548
You know, like you could do that for furniture.
00:22:08.548 --> 00:22:14.780
To begin with, you know, start small and then you can start to move it up to okay, can we do like building elements as part of it?
00:22:14.780 --> 00:22:20.090
Or, you know, does it become part of, like, generation of form?
00:22:20.090 --> 00:22:21.794
You know what I mean.
00:22:21.794 --> 00:22:24.984
Like I think that's quite an interesting way of looking at it.
00:22:24.984 --> 00:22:27.128
You know, it's like I guess it's a it's quite an interesting way of looking at it.
00:22:27.128 --> 00:22:47.291
You know, it's like I guess it's a matter of probably changing the state of material, right, you know, because the majority of stuff that we deal with is solid and in its solid state it's rather limiting, but it's a matter of trying to take it to a, like a more liquid, or I don't know.
00:22:47.291 --> 00:22:51.217
Even can you turn something into a gas that then generates form?
00:22:51.217 --> 00:22:51.618
I don't know.
00:22:52.200 --> 00:22:52.661
You know, like.
00:22:53.083 --> 00:23:02.247
I think it's changing the actual, like natural state of it to generate something new, but it's still like it's the process, but it's still super honest, if you know what I mean.
00:23:02.508 --> 00:23:11.851
Yeah, there's like those dome projects where they inflate like a bubble, like a canvas, yeah, and then pour concrete over it with rebar.
00:23:11.872 --> 00:23:13.965
There you go, that's gas.
00:23:13.965 --> 00:23:14.448
Inspired.
00:23:15.359 --> 00:23:15.622
There's.
00:23:15.622 --> 00:23:16.384
Who?
00:23:16.384 --> 00:23:18.561
Is it One of them?
00:23:18.561 --> 00:23:18.923
Maybe?
00:23:18.923 --> 00:23:23.403
Oh, I can't remember Renzo Piano, I can't remember.
00:23:23.403 --> 00:23:33.428
But how they basically, like, made that log cabin and then formed the concrete around it, then burnt the timber oh cool, oh um for chapel.
00:23:33.428 --> 00:23:36.252
Yeah, I actually visited in germany once.
00:23:36.333 --> 00:23:41.566
It's pretty yeah like stuff like that is just so processed like the.
00:23:41.566 --> 00:23:46.792
Yeah, that's like what interests me, a shite load.
00:23:47.835 --> 00:23:48.075
Yeah.
00:23:53.883 --> 00:23:56.558
That Zumthal one's pretty cool because it's sort of like it's the everything house times two.
00:23:56.558 --> 00:24:06.450
It's been completely built out of timber, yeah, and then completely built out of concrete, but it's the same building, but it's two very different.
00:24:06.450 --> 00:24:18.263
It would have been quite interesting to have had the timber form sort of there for let's say, a decade and the experience that people kind of have in using that for that period of time.
00:24:18.263 --> 00:24:24.799
And then all of a sudden he's like, oh, I'm going to encase it in concrete, burn it, and then it's the same building, but it's a completely different experience.
00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:26.989
It's a completely different internal environment.
00:24:28.300 --> 00:24:33.222
That's quite a cool concept there's something interesting there about like a really long time frame.
00:24:33.222 --> 00:24:46.813
So, like I don't know, you're pouring in a meter of concrete a year or something into like a something that fills up well, I'm building a house out of house.
00:24:46.813 --> 00:24:55.519
House is more of a, the construction of it's, more of like a drawn-out spectacle yeah, they're probably even using like sculpture or not, is it topiary?
00:24:55.699 --> 00:25:05.817
you know, like growing trees, you know you can grow trees to sort of like be in and around things yeah, controlling the growth of a tree to create form, or you know something like that.
00:25:05.836 --> 00:25:09.287
It's quite quite cool there's a pleached cathedral somewhere in the world.
00:25:09.287 --> 00:25:10.411
I've seen pictures of.
00:25:11.519 --> 00:25:12.804
What's it called Jura pleaching?
00:25:12.804 --> 00:25:13.827
Is that the method?
00:25:14.249 --> 00:25:16.224
Yeah, you just train them to grow.
00:25:16.224 --> 00:25:24.670
In certain ways you can pleach chairs and stuff if you just grow a tree and bend it.
00:25:29.442 --> 00:25:30.184
I want to find this now.
00:25:30.204 --> 00:25:34.944
There's another epic process, one I remember on Arc Daily back in the day.
00:25:34.944 --> 00:25:41.785
They had another little single room but it was like straw bales stacked on top of each other.
00:25:41.785 --> 00:25:47.670
Then they encased it in concrete and then let the cows just eat the straw out.
00:25:47.670 --> 00:25:50.480
Really nice concrete.
00:25:50.480 --> 00:25:52.964
And then let the cows just eat the straw out really nice.
00:25:52.964 --> 00:26:01.103
Yeah, that's quite like a beautiful messy form, I think, with like a real sharp window face yeah that's quite cool.
00:26:01.143 --> 00:26:10.702
And then we've got old uh ishigami's restaurant house ishigami's I was gonna say that before where dig holes, yeah, and fill that full of concrete.
00:26:10.702 --> 00:26:19.527
I guess the common theme is just using either the material or the negative, or using the actual negative, the inverse, the inverse, yeah.
00:26:22.564 --> 00:26:27.705
I'm going to start experimenting with steel as concrete formwork.
00:26:27.705 --> 00:26:33.270
Oh yeah, Just got a chair, sort of like a stool commission at the moment.
00:26:33.270 --> 00:26:43.172
So just like, maybe just playing with the thickness of your steel to see how much natural I guess it's high-swelling but with concrete.
00:26:43.973 --> 00:26:52.412
Right, and so is the final product going to be concrete, but you're not really controlling how precise it would be.
00:26:52.412 --> 00:26:53.574
No, is that the idea?
00:26:53.779 --> 00:27:04.211
I guess it'd be like a box frame and then you'd pick the thickness of the steel as to how, and then the weight of the concrete, how much that would bow out.
00:27:05.161 --> 00:27:06.164
But, wouldn't, you be able to.
00:27:07.663 --> 00:27:12.968
Long time ago, with a very subtle movement in his moulds.
00:27:13.710 --> 00:27:18.547
Yeah, would you hydroform it first and then fill it full of concrete.
00:27:19.099 --> 00:27:19.403
What's that?
00:27:20.290 --> 00:27:25.487
You could hydroform it first if you wanted even more bulge.
00:27:26.529 --> 00:27:48.606
Yeah, in theory yes, but I'm probably more interested in, like the, the story of the process yeah, and and I like your idea of subtlety there as well, gerard I think, like everything we've sort of talked to so far all of the solutions, all of the results of these processes it'll be quite abrupt, but something like that.
00:27:48.606 --> 00:27:55.710
You kind of know that it's not the natural way that that material is supposed to be, but you're not quite sure why, you know.
00:27:55.710 --> 00:27:59.268
Yeah, I like that nature of subtlety to it.
00:28:00.029 --> 00:28:00.351
I don't know.
00:28:00.351 --> 00:28:01.665
I'm on the fence about that one.
00:28:01.665 --> 00:28:04.228
I'd need to be proven that.
00:28:04.228 --> 00:28:08.670
I guess the subtlety if done, done poorly, could just look like a mistake.
00:28:09.853 --> 00:28:10.032
Yeah.
00:28:10.940 --> 00:28:23.992
You potentially need to concept explain Someone's boxing wasn't built properly and blew out a little bit in this corner 100%.
00:28:24.361 --> 00:28:25.646
I've had a few of those before.
00:28:25.646 --> 00:28:27.845
They're never mistakes.
00:28:27.845 --> 00:28:28.813
They're never mistakes.
00:28:28.953 --> 00:28:31.244
They're never mistakes, they're just design iterations.
00:28:31.244 --> 00:28:32.931
You know, experimentation.
00:28:34.500 --> 00:28:39.209
How much shit have people passed off as like intentional, when it's been just a giant mistake?
00:28:39.740 --> 00:28:42.891
Isn't that what we do as a profession post-rationalization?
00:28:43.200 --> 00:28:45.669
Yeah, it's like oh shit, I forgot to tell you a door.
00:28:46.723 --> 00:28:47.887
Oh no it's about enclosure.
00:28:50.279 --> 00:28:51.686
It's tough oh shit, I forgot to tell you a door.
00:28:51.707 --> 00:28:52.853
Oh, now it's about enclosure.
00:28:52.893 --> 00:28:53.536
It's tough live decorating cakes.
00:28:53.536 --> 00:28:54.259
I forgot to give you a window.
00:28:54.259 --> 00:28:55.625
Oh no, this room's the cave.
00:28:55.625 --> 00:28:57.626
It's the narrative of the space.
00:28:58.101 --> 00:29:03.905
This is your gimp den, but it's on the top floor.
00:29:03.905 --> 00:29:06.386
I'm sure that was in the brief.
00:29:06.587 --> 00:29:17.833
No, oh, my bad genius they don't go super hard on the single material.
00:29:17.833 --> 00:29:36.529
But you know the tree hotel and somewhere in scandinavia where they have just a bunch of real elaborate um, I guess hotel structures floating around in the bush, yeah, yeah, there's like a mirror one which is like just a mirror cube on a single tree.
00:29:37.211 --> 00:29:38.353
Oh yeah, I know the one.
00:29:38.353 --> 00:29:39.013
That's pretty cool.
00:29:40.601 --> 00:29:46.690
It's like full mirror outside, full timber inside, and then you sort of see the trunk coming through the space.
00:29:47.859 --> 00:29:53.651
I'll say one material we haven't discussed which I think has a lot of potential is bamboo as well.
00:29:53.651 --> 00:29:55.727
For that, everything use.
00:29:56.279 --> 00:29:59.126
I knew you were going to bring up bamboo, the bamboo man.
00:29:59.587 --> 00:30:00.829
Come on, I thought it had to be.
00:30:00.890 --> 00:30:01.310
It's good.
00:30:01.310 --> 00:30:02.334
Yeah, it has to be done.
00:30:02.334 --> 00:30:06.451
I mean like in theory, that's what my thesis was.
00:30:07.422 --> 00:30:08.529
It's what it started.
00:30:08.529 --> 00:30:12.547
Yeah, the concept started around that and then sort of it evolved out a little bit.
00:30:12.547 --> 00:30:22.493
But then I had that I designed that house in nepal which was all bamboos, sands, the concrete footings, and which was pretty.
00:30:22.493 --> 00:30:23.194
That was that.
00:30:23.194 --> 00:30:24.442
I guess that was a proof of concept.
00:30:24.442 --> 00:30:32.124
Like all the windows, doors, the furniture structure, everything was all bamboo, bamboo pins.
00:30:32.124 --> 00:30:35.651
The only thing that was plumbing material, isn't it?
00:30:36.271 --> 00:30:36.952
bamboo plumbing?
00:30:36.952 --> 00:30:39.066
Yeah, the only thing wasn't was electrical.
00:30:39.066 --> 00:30:39.749
You can't.
00:30:39.749 --> 00:30:44.501
You can't run a charge through bamboo unless someone else someone knows how to.
00:30:44.501 --> 00:30:47.446
You'll crack code, maybe run it through your pipe.
00:30:48.188 --> 00:30:48.688
What was that?
00:30:48.688 --> 00:30:50.009
You run it through your pipes?
00:30:50.009 --> 00:30:51.353
Yeah, you could do.
00:30:51.353 --> 00:30:53.275
Yeah, water conducting.
00:30:54.201 --> 00:30:55.123
Yeah, water conducting.
00:30:56.748 --> 00:30:57.269
I've cracked it.
00:30:57.269 --> 00:30:58.050
That's another one.
00:30:58.050 --> 00:31:06.372
One thing that we haven't talked about is maybe shifting from that idea of maybe material so much, but still in that vein of the everything house.
00:31:06.539 --> 00:31:12.192
Ben, you've got a note here on color well, yeah, the everything, the all, one color house.
00:31:12.192 --> 00:31:14.376
This reminds me of the.
00:31:14.376 --> 00:31:17.845
Gerard dombrowski attempted this once, didn't you, gerard?
00:31:17.845 --> 00:31:18.907
How'd that work out?
00:31:20.451 --> 00:31:27.608
well, I moved jobs halfway through that project so I wasn't there to drive the train.
00:31:27.608 --> 00:31:28.770
What color?
00:31:28.790 --> 00:31:29.712
were you going for gerard?
00:31:30.000 --> 00:31:35.769
full yellow it was a yellow yellow but everything being yellow, so it's pretty epic.
00:31:37.212 --> 00:31:45.289
The problem that the thing that happened was just finding a urine yellow toilet is was just too.
00:31:46.151 --> 00:31:47.393
Wait, wait, wait.
00:31:47.393 --> 00:31:48.875
Did you say urine yellow?
00:31:48.875 --> 00:31:51.528
Was that the entire concept?
00:31:53.701 --> 00:31:54.405
Yes, it was.
00:31:55.366 --> 00:31:59.971
It had like yellow tiles, yellow floor tiles, yellow everything.
00:32:00.294 --> 00:32:02.074
A little bit soft yellow room.
00:32:02.074 --> 00:32:03.365
Oh yeah, nice.
00:32:03.365 --> 00:32:10.191
I mean, I think that's a great concept and maybe it's not done to that extreme.
00:32:10.191 --> 00:32:16.173
But you know, have you seen that project, that Seven Colourful Little Houses project in Christchurch?
00:32:18.342 --> 00:32:19.646
Is that a recent one?
00:32:20.442 --> 00:32:21.286
Recently completed one.
00:32:21.286 --> 00:32:23.826
I mean, that's sort of of that ilk.
00:32:24.690 --> 00:32:25.030
Oh yes.
00:32:25.079 --> 00:32:27.429
The designs are all exactly the same.
00:32:27.429 --> 00:32:35.431
I think they may be pivoted about 90 degrees to sight, but the only thing that differentiates them is the colour.
00:32:35.431 --> 00:32:37.607
But they've been true to the colour selection.
00:32:37.607 --> 00:32:50.390
So the entire facade or the entire exterior is one colour, and then that's brought through into the interior, I think in the kitchen and in the joinery, and I really like that, because what they've taken is something that could be incredibly benign.
00:32:50.390 --> 00:33:05.511
You know, it's very much a spec house, yeah, but with just one yeah, kind of like yeah, one design decision that's made it such a successful project, and so, yeah, it looks like it was well executed as well.
00:33:05.551 --> 00:33:13.769
I think it's because it's's quite well designed and they've used quite good products internally, so I think they've pulled it off really well.
00:33:15.500 --> 00:33:16.766
Yeah, I love it.
00:33:16.766 --> 00:33:17.628
I think it's really cool.
00:33:17.628 --> 00:33:19.767
Also, good colour selections.
00:33:19.767 --> 00:33:27.333
I think you could kind of it could be less successful if you're a bit too garish with your colour choice.
00:33:28.242 --> 00:33:29.025
M-V-R-DDV.
00:33:29.025 --> 00:33:30.148
The Dutch office.
00:33:30.148 --> 00:33:33.508
Yeah, they are surely the kings of colour.
00:33:33.508 --> 00:33:47.609
Lots of like massive, monotone projects, just massive colour-blocking entire buildings, and I like that because I think we shy, particularly in new zealand.
00:33:48.442 --> 00:34:01.922
Fuck, just getting back from central otago like there is no blandish color palette yeah, yeah, this color palette in the world, it's all so similar I mean we're so terrified of the use of color here.
00:34:01.922 --> 00:34:02.864
It's, you know, it's.
00:34:02.864 --> 00:34:05.028
Yeah, it's shocking, I think.
00:34:05.028 --> 00:34:12.931
I think I mean we've talked about it several times on the podcast, but I think it's because in general, we're pretty plain and boring.
00:34:14.260 --> 00:34:21.184
Isn't it crazy that all it takes is like a building to be one full colour for it to stand out.
00:34:21.184 --> 00:34:22.704
How is that a thing?
00:34:23.306 --> 00:34:32.186
That's crazy, but it's also commitment to the bit, and I think this is the same with the everything house and in terms of materiality as well.
00:34:32.186 --> 00:34:34.652
You, you can't half-ass a concept like this.
00:34:34.652 --> 00:34:42.208
You know like you can't go, I'm gonna do an everything else out of timber, but there's gonna be, like you know, elements of other materials.
00:34:42.208 --> 00:34:43.672
It's just not gonna work.
00:34:43.672 --> 00:34:48.851
Like, if you want this to be truly successful and it's exactly the same with color is commit wholeheartedly.
00:34:48.851 --> 00:34:54.728
You know like, if you're like I want a splash of color, then all you're doing is you've got like a feature wall or some bullshit.
00:34:54.728 --> 00:34:58.027
You know like, what you really need is like full commitment.
00:34:58.027 --> 00:35:00.804
Like, like Gerard, like your full piss yellow house.
00:35:03.311 --> 00:35:03.911
You're in yellow.
00:35:04.199 --> 00:35:04.541
You're in yellow.
00:35:04.561 --> 00:35:12.708
You're not sorry, sorry we had yellow perspex light up ceiling as well yeah, I think so.
00:35:12.748 --> 00:35:14.472
Yeah, all right, at least that got done.
00:35:14.472 --> 00:35:17.547
Did this get built?
00:35:17.547 --> 00:35:18.648
Yeah, it got built.
00:35:18.648 --> 00:35:19.490
Yeah, we built it.
00:35:19.490 --> 00:35:24.266
That's all I know about it because I built the thing oh cool.
00:35:24.847 --> 00:35:26.811
The kitchen joinery unit was pretty epic.
00:35:26.811 --> 00:35:30.329
It was like particle board joinery.
00:35:30.329 --> 00:35:37.726
The idea was you go inside the joinery and then it's like the womb, entirely yellow mass.
00:35:37.726 --> 00:35:42.407
Then I went inside of my brain rehab centre.
00:35:44.255 --> 00:35:50.300
It's complex wow, yeah, the toilet got cold, unfortunately.
00:35:50.400 --> 00:35:55.385
I was going to say did they commit 100% or were there aspects of too hard basket?
00:35:55.971 --> 00:36:07.867
yeah, the toilet was that, it there's always ways around these things, like if you did like a we were going to paint it, but Gerard did leave like a resin uricryl lasts a long time on that.
00:36:07.867 --> 00:36:11.588
But you could also like re-fire it, you could glaze it.
00:36:11.588 --> 00:36:18.570
Yeah, all of these things like require you to go a little bit further, or quite a bit further, to like re-glaze a whole toilet.
00:36:19.380 --> 00:36:24.568
Another option is coming back to our sort of you know things generating over time.
00:36:24.568 --> 00:36:25.744
You could just never clean it.
00:36:26.326 --> 00:36:26.989
Yeah, exactly.
00:36:29.021 --> 00:36:43.780
It's probably yellow now let it naturally patina no, you're not wrong that was the idea right and I wanted to get all like the taps sandblasted and repowder coated.
00:36:43.780 --> 00:36:50.146
Oh, would have been amazing yeah well you just got to do it again.
00:36:50.507 --> 00:36:52.911
Try and pull it off, pull it off properly.
00:36:53.030 --> 00:36:57.615
It's funny, I mean it awes me clients that are willing to commit to that.
00:36:57.615 --> 00:37:01.487
I think it's the hardest thing is finding people.
00:37:01.487 --> 00:37:03.139
You know, gerard, you're talking about doing hydroforming, a studio.
00:37:03.139 --> 00:37:06.688
I mean you can do that because you can kind of do it for yourself.
00:37:06.688 --> 00:37:16.927
But it's finding someone that's as committed to the bit or as committed to the concept as as you is the tricky part, right yeah, you do need brave people.
00:37:16.967 --> 00:37:20.876
When those guys were were brave, yeah, so nice.
00:37:20.876 --> 00:37:26.585
The stars do need to align sometimes, but it goes both ways.
00:37:26.585 --> 00:37:30.112
Isn it Like you have to exude confidence for the bit?
00:37:31.193 --> 00:37:32.014
Oh, absolutely.
00:37:32.034 --> 00:37:36.748
It's got to be believable If you're half-assing your side, then there's no way you're ever going to sell the idea.
00:37:38.141 --> 00:37:57.161
I think that's the hard part as designers, in particular in New Zealand, is we're sort of ultimately pigeonholed into a lane, whether that be by the people that we work for or the clients that we have or the design guidelines or you know covenants or anything like that.
00:37:57.161 --> 00:38:22.228
You know there's, there's definitely scope, like you definitely can push it and you can do this crazy shit, but I think like too often we don't think that way because you know, the benign is so prevalent I personally think that I just struggle to think that way and so, like coming up with the actual concepts, the hardest part I guess.
00:38:22.268 --> 00:38:31.025
Like and it takes a while to like, gerard, you're just amazing at it you've got like the I want to push it to the extreme, let's test this.
00:38:31.025 --> 00:38:35.983
And then all of a sudden, after you know a small period of time, you've got this concept.
00:38:35.983 --> 00:38:43.951
That's kind of like exploring your ideas, which is this is something we've talked about numerous times before in the pod.
00:38:43.951 --> 00:38:51.505
But actually, like coming to those conclusions, like I'm constantly asking myself what do I want to test?
00:38:51.505 --> 00:38:53.208
Like what is it I want to test, what is?
00:38:53.208 --> 00:39:02.463
So coming to those, answering those questions and coming to those conclusions is probably the hardest part yeah, I think it's all.
00:39:02.704 --> 00:39:10.318
It is a muscle, like all design thinking, I think, is muscle the more you like.
00:39:10.318 --> 00:39:23.324
I've actively tried to trick myself into coming up with weird ideas constantly for years yeah yeah I think you're, you're well trained at it.
00:39:23.545 --> 00:40:01.702
But I also think back to your point, ben is and I've struggled with this as well as you want to come up with ideas, but I also I often find you sort of limit yourself because you, because you're not confident enough to just go fuck it, I'm just gonna do so, I'm just gonna do it, whereas like drad, I think, like you're a little bit more, I'll just do it and I'll just test it out yeah, like you're probably less, correct me if I'm wrong, but I kind of feel like you're maybe less afraid of the concept failing, then I think maybe I am and maybe you are ben well, I think like the building side.
00:40:02.643 --> 00:40:09.295
maybe I'm just a little bit too practical sometimes, so I'm always thinking about like the best way to build something.
00:40:09.295 --> 00:40:24.728
And that best way to build something is always like comes back to what you can actually get built in this country, based on my current knowledge, so I don't actually other than like different ways to put something together.
00:40:24.728 --> 00:40:35.688
It always sits within the same kind of parameter, whereas Gerard's just like let's just give something completely different to go, which I think is epic, and yeah.
00:40:35.688 --> 00:40:41.192
Yeah, still got to get shit built, though, don't we?
00:40:42.063 --> 00:40:51.452
it's all about making other models to me, the making part is architecture.
00:40:51.452 --> 00:41:00.485
To me, like um, I don't know, everyone can have mean ideas, but if you can't get it built, it's like how much is that render worth?
00:41:01.527 --> 00:41:02.409
yeah, well, that's it right.
00:41:02.409 --> 00:41:07.489
Like paper architecture, I mean to be fair, there's there's very much a realm of architecture that is purely paper.
00:41:07.489 --> 00:41:12.661
You know, there's some people that have kind of pegged their entire career on paper architecture.
00:41:12.661 --> 00:41:23.804
But realizing it, I think, is the true uh success of of an architectural concept yeah, like old zaha, I guess 10 years of.
00:41:23.804 --> 00:41:25.367
Yeah.
00:41:26.027 --> 00:41:30.333
But if your old man runs an oil company.
00:41:30.333 --> 00:41:30.934
It's probably.
00:41:32.041 --> 00:41:33.405
You've got a bit of financial backing.
00:41:34.347 --> 00:41:34.989
Financial backing.
00:41:35.922 --> 00:41:44.929
A biaga was like that Years and years of competition, entries and concepts and just ideas, but full confidence in those ideas.
00:41:45.349 --> 00:41:45.570
Yeah.
00:41:45.699 --> 00:41:49.463
Full confidence and belief in your ability and it just and it pays off.
00:41:49.463 --> 00:42:01.873
But I think it takes a special person to kind of yeah, you know, not negatively, but carry an ego for that long without, like, an actual success or without an actual result.
00:42:01.873 --> 00:42:05.206
I reckon pretty hard yeah, I remember.
00:42:05.246 --> 00:42:13.181
I remember a friend a painting friend saying that persistence will always win, that they can't get rid of us.
00:42:13.181 --> 00:42:14.846
If they tried, we're weeds.
00:42:14.865 --> 00:42:27.849
I don't know, sometimes it feels like it's just going to be easier to own the oil company and build your own architecture.
00:42:28.731 --> 00:42:29.972
Yeah, I'm sorry.
00:42:29.972 --> 00:42:31.594
Definitely definitely probably the easier.
00:42:31.594 --> 00:42:33.461
Easier way to go about things.
00:42:34.784 --> 00:42:41.231
That's one option, yeah, all right, let's start drooling yeah.
00:42:41.231 --> 00:42:42.653
Where's?
00:42:42.673 --> 00:42:43.355
your property sale.
00:42:43.414 --> 00:42:44.315
Digging for gold.
00:42:44.315 --> 00:42:45.623
Can we do an oil?
00:42:45.664 --> 00:42:47.737
house, let's open up those old quarries.
00:42:47.684 --> 00:42:47.925
Can we do an oil house?
00:42:47.925 --> 00:42:51.528
Let's open up those old quarries Because lots of stuff derived from oil.
00:42:51.528 --> 00:42:54.186
How far can you stretch this concept?
00:42:54.586 --> 00:42:57.713
Yeah, wow, Rammed earth right.
00:42:57.713 --> 00:43:04.507
Do a rammed earth house Somehow Good at insulation values as well.
00:43:06.601 --> 00:43:08.766
Yeah, they'll straw, bale, lime, lime.
00:43:08.766 --> 00:43:10.891
Well, just a very earth house.
00:43:10.891 --> 00:43:18.501
You know, just yeah why lots of people go down the the, I guess earth ship that's that one uses, it's a whole movement.
00:43:18.742 --> 00:43:21.110
You know, like that's, that's a whole proven thing.
00:43:22.514 --> 00:43:31.164
So there's yeah, everyone, I guess, angle towards these things, but then at some point they might drift away yeah, it's.
00:43:31.686 --> 00:43:41.911
I mean, and I think what the reason that you drift away is back to what you're saying, ben is reality has to come into it a little bit, you know, and that's you know.
00:43:41.911 --> 00:43:50.126
Back to that, you know, you kind of drift away from your idea because you're like I actually have to build this thing or I have to make it real or something.
00:43:50.126 --> 00:43:58.168
And that's why I like that Robert Bruno house, because I don't think he cared about it being functional or even like a real realisation.
00:43:58.168 --> 00:44:04.590
He just kept welding shit on top of other stuff until he came up with a form you know.
00:44:04.599 --> 00:44:17.762
It's amazing how consistent the aesthetic is like for such a large structure like, like, right down to the the smaller details handrails, and like window mullions yeah like all the lines.
00:44:20.045 --> 00:44:30.844
Yeah, exactly the same as if you saw the building from 100, 100 meters away yeah, seeing it from 100 meters versus seeing it from like, yeah, a meter, it's the same same form.
00:44:30.844 --> 00:44:31.706
Is that we're getting it?
00:44:31.947 --> 00:44:35.239
yeah, yeah, like the design language is super consistent.
00:44:35.239 --> 00:44:36.722
Yeah, I like that.
00:44:36.922 --> 00:45:00.170
It's just how these new owners in their overlay flooring how can we, how can we get someone to pay us to build, or at least pay for the building of, like a pavilion or something, so we can actually like experiment with some of these ideas, the, the, everything house, the, all one material and all the same color, I mean the brick bay.
00:45:00.250 --> 00:45:03.063
Folly is sort of like like that in a way, isn't it?
00:45:03.063 --> 00:45:12.682
It's sort of a a mechanism to to true, to you know, to test things out and to do something.
00:45:12.704 --> 00:45:13.485
Yeah, do something.
00:45:13.485 --> 00:45:14.788
Should we enter?
00:45:14.907 --> 00:45:24.702
one started to look the same yeah, it would be cool if there was more, I mean, but I guess there's the risk of it becoming too sculptural, though you know at what point is.
00:45:24.702 --> 00:45:26.646
Is it a sculpture and is?
00:45:26.706 --> 00:45:26.847
is it?
00:45:26.927 --> 00:45:27.487
architecture.
00:45:27.487 --> 00:45:42.275
Well, but I I'm but you know what I mean like not to say that sculpture can't be architecture, but, like you know, is it just a form that's not necessarily habitable, like, or how do you?
00:45:42.275 --> 00:45:50.094
I mean shit, this is a conversation, definitely for another time, like we need to draw the line at sculpture, at sculpture versus architecture what is habitable?
00:45:50.215 --> 00:45:51.500
can you crawl through your hallway?
00:45:54.186 --> 00:45:55.952
your giants, your giant stick man.
00:45:55.952 --> 00:45:57.034
Can you crawl through those?
00:45:57.034 --> 00:45:58.378
Do you have to stand upright?
00:45:58.458 --> 00:46:04.309
through a room, definitely not well pod.
00:46:05.070 --> 00:46:07.574
I grew up in a bedroom that I couldn't stand up and it was great.
00:46:07.833 --> 00:46:14.431
Yeah, I guess lots of little loft, tiny house loft, not standing up in that this is.
00:46:14.471 --> 00:46:19.086
This is a good segue, actually, for are we going to test our new, new little segment?
00:46:19.086 --> 00:46:19.869
Hated or love it?
00:46:19.869 --> 00:46:22.014
Yeah, all right.
00:46:22.014 --> 00:46:37.072
Well, if anyone else I don't know if you guys have got any ideas, but I was thinking that, similar to the sculpture I hated or love it, the the arcade, like decorative architectural elements.
00:46:37.072 --> 00:46:39.501
Is that a hate or a love?
00:46:39.501 --> 00:46:43.128
I mean, like, look around, looking around you're talking classical moment.
00:46:43.128 --> 00:46:45.643
Yeah, but it doesn't need to be classical.
00:46:45.643 --> 00:46:48.050
It can be like a modern interpretation.
00:46:48.070 --> 00:46:59.809
There's just there's just no decorative elements in buildings these days yeah I think it's really I think, yeah, I'm all for the hate it do we just hate?
00:47:00.110 --> 00:47:01.853
do we hate decorative elements now?
00:47:02.240 --> 00:47:05.050
well, I think people have been taught to hate.
00:47:05.050 --> 00:47:08.061
Well, architects, particularly, have been taught by universities to.
00:47:08.061 --> 00:47:11.519
Modernist is the direction, whereas maybe we're all bullied into it.
00:47:11.619 --> 00:47:14.489
We were literally just talking about exposing the structure.
00:47:14.489 --> 00:47:16.606
It's hard to backtrack.
00:47:19.342 --> 00:47:22.871
I am actually all for complexity.
00:47:22.871 --> 00:47:32.088
Thomas Heatherwick's book where he's yarning about general people respond better to like older buildings that have like rhythm.
00:47:32.228 --> 00:47:33.931
Ornamentation yeah.
00:47:34.253 --> 00:47:37.570
Yeah, it comes with like super intricate stone relief.
00:47:38.400 --> 00:47:44.474
Do you think that's because it's easier to appreciate, like the craftsmanship and the workmanship?
00:47:45.701 --> 00:48:07.284
No, I think they're like digestible, like right sheer rhythm, but then the complexity like is like just a nice thing to look at, like your brain needs an element of complexity to like focus in on, whereas a purely glass box is, you know, might have some fancy detailing, but but nobody can see it.
00:48:08.025 --> 00:48:14.494
Yeah right, so we're really talking about when you say decorative elements, it's ornamentation, it's ornamentation?
00:48:16.121 --> 00:48:31.362
Yeah, it is, and there's some amazing examples of exactly what Gerard was talking about, where it is more of an intricate, a sculptural, whatever decorative element, but it's also like a part of the, the structure itself.
00:48:31.362 --> 00:48:45.090
So you can kind of combine those two things, I guess, like steel's probably, and even timber, if done well, uh is amazing at that sort of net, has that natural beauty, uh.
00:48:45.090 --> 00:48:45.791
But it's just.
00:48:45.791 --> 00:49:01.981
It feels like it's like a bit of a lost art that back in the day it was just the norm so everyone had it everywhere, even like the old school villas, you know, and now it's just not even a part of the process, so no one is willing to pay for it interestingly.
00:49:02.041 --> 00:49:07.393
I think, though, if you know when we're thinking of, like, hot or not, love it or hate it.
00:49:07.393 --> 00:49:14.619
I would hate ornamentation on modern day architecture though, because it would feel too forced.
00:49:14.920 --> 00:49:18.030
But would the architecture be different if it had ornamentation?
00:49:18.030 --> 00:49:19.780
You know it'd be designed with it integrated.
00:49:20.842 --> 00:49:23.771
It could have been if we'd thought about this, you know, generations ago.
00:49:23.771 --> 00:49:35.161
But if we're thinking about, like, implementing this now, you know how could this evolve, moving forward, the entire architectural style would need to change to to support it.
00:49:35.161 --> 00:49:45.376
You know, because I think everything now is designed to look so simple and basic that to design that out, you'd have to completely, like, come up with a new design language.
00:49:46.318 --> 00:49:50.945
You know what I mean you know it's not like you're coming around and throwing up Corinthian columns everywhere.
00:49:51.547 --> 00:49:53.692
No, well, that'd be nice.
00:49:53.692 --> 00:49:56.407
I wish I was.
00:49:58.043 --> 00:50:01.925
I guess postmodern was a literal reusing of some of those objects.
00:50:01.925 --> 00:50:09.012
But there's a middle ground where you can reference these shapes and forms, but postmodernism looked at it on.
00:50:09.032 --> 00:50:17.751
There's a middle ground where you can reference these shapes and forms, but postmodernism looked at it on more of a building scale rather than like an elemental ornamentation type scale, really, didn't it?
00:50:17.751 --> 00:50:21.891
I mean, art Nouveau would be a good description of pure ornamentation.
00:50:22.353 --> 00:50:24.681
Yeah yeah.
00:50:24.681 --> 00:50:34.789
Art Nouveau is probably an example of something that, in my mind, still holds a lot of weight, and you could run that aesthetic now and it would be just as awesome.
00:50:34.969 --> 00:50:41.945
Like yeah, that's who's who's, who's bold enough to, I'll give it a go.
00:50:43.067 --> 00:51:15.311
Well, I mean yeah, my example of like modern um automation, I guess, is maybe, maybe just in people's use of brick, which you see a lot in australia, like, yeah, like malbright and john wattle, yeah, like all using quite more complex different layers like john wattle did a proposal, or was it for the world expo or remember as a lecture a while ago, but super complex, cast bricks and then just repeating that mold over and over again.
00:51:15.311 --> 00:51:29.391
So it's still making a brick in the same way, just sending them some molds yeah, well, another example a super complex, but it's then it's like it's quite readable because it's over like a whole face.
00:51:29.592 --> 00:51:47.291
So it brings that, I guess, modernist aesthetic, but bringing some real gnarly complexity yeah, another example I was thinking of is actually another one from you, gerard, this project that we're working on together at the moment, and we had a huge discussion.
00:51:47.291 --> 00:51:56.224
I was totally against these steel eyelids that you really wanted to put on and I was like there's no way, there's no way we're putting these eyelids on.
00:51:56.224 --> 00:52:07.972
They're basically like curved steel with, like you know, a little bit of I wouldn't say call them complex, but a nice rhythm, and I was against it.
00:52:07.972 --> 00:52:13.489
And then I was like, nah, let me model it, let me put it on there, and now I'm like I can't see the building without it.
00:52:13.931 --> 00:52:15.342
It's just what was your?
00:52:15.342 --> 00:52:19.972
Intricate part to back to the the loving and hating ornamentation.
00:52:19.972 --> 00:52:22.103
What was your aversion to it like?
00:52:22.103 --> 00:52:23.686
Why did you dislike it to begin with?
00:52:24.068 --> 00:52:26.940
because I the the parts where the islands are, the actual building itself has set back quite a bit.
00:52:26.940 --> 00:52:31.563
And I just wanted it to begin with because I the the parts where the eyelids are, the actual building itself is set back quite a bit and I just wanted it to disappear.
00:52:31.563 --> 00:52:42.994
But gerard wanted it to read as one full object and so hence the eyelids, and now that the eyelids are on there, like, yeah, 100 agree.
00:52:42.994 --> 00:52:45.925
So I don't know, that's just another example.
00:52:45.925 --> 00:52:57.594
I'm actually, I'm actually have been not into any kind of decorative architecture pretty much my whole career until now.
00:52:57.655 --> 00:53:00.548
I'm becoming more yeah, I'm becoming more and more.
00:53:00.548 --> 00:53:10.586
I just think like there's some it's a bit of a lost beauty and yeah, I see my neighbor out there spending a week painting is nice picket fence.
00:53:10.586 --> 00:53:21.429
I'm like, okay, well, look, you know, if there's a bit more you know beauty and you're you're a bit more proud of your, your buildings, then maybe you'd spend a bit more time looking after it as well.
00:53:21.429 --> 00:53:21.811
I don't know.
00:53:23.561 --> 00:53:34.608
So I think for me, like I appreciate ornamentation and its context and history, but I don't unless it's done incredibly well, I don't really like it.
00:53:34.608 --> 00:53:36.947
Now, I don't like eaves.
00:53:36.947 --> 00:53:40.289
I find eaves too much ornamentation.
00:53:40.980 --> 00:53:41.280
Yeah.
00:53:41.280 --> 00:53:43.949
I didn't like eaves, but eaves are definitely back in.
00:53:43.949 --> 00:53:46.367
For me, that's a good one, actually.
00:53:46.367 --> 00:53:47.434
We'll bring that on up in there.
00:53:48.081 --> 00:53:48.965
I love a really big eave.
00:53:50.159 --> 00:53:51.105
Yeah, I love a big eave?
00:53:52.141 --> 00:53:57.550
I don't think I like any medium-sized eaves, but I really like no eave or really big eave.
00:54:01.286 --> 00:54:03.150
Have you owned a house without an eave?
00:54:03.150 --> 00:54:04.273
It kind of scares me.
00:54:04.719 --> 00:54:06.724
My last house had no eaves and I was like, ah, it's impervious, it kind of scares me.
00:54:06.744 --> 00:54:08.969
My last house had no eaves and I was like, ah, it's impervious, it's impervious.
00:54:08.969 --> 00:54:18.860
But, when you get really bad rain, there's just something like a little bit satisfying about a roof that actually just kicks the water right off your walls.
00:54:18.960 --> 00:54:21.208
Ah, you're just being grossy, no no no.
00:54:23.322 --> 00:54:26.570
It'll probably last an extra 50 years.
00:54:26.570 --> 00:54:28.112
So I don't know.
00:54:28.112 --> 00:54:29.766
We've got two now.
00:54:29.766 --> 00:54:30.148
We've got two.
00:54:30.148 --> 00:54:33.925
Where do we stand on decorations?
00:54:33.925 --> 00:54:38.827
I am pro, pro and Sam's no.
00:54:39.282 --> 00:54:42.347
I'm no yeah better luck next time.
00:54:42.347 --> 00:54:51.871
You are the weakest link and as your punishment you have to put ornamentation in your next project, all right.
00:54:52.485 --> 00:54:53.579
Hate it or love it Eves.
00:54:53.800 --> 00:54:55.045
Eves somehow slipped in there.
00:54:55.045 --> 00:54:57.527
Needs more discussion, but pro Eves.
00:54:58.329 --> 00:54:58.530
Pro.
00:54:58.530 --> 00:55:00.025
I'm anti as well.
00:55:00.025 --> 00:55:04.576
I'm 0-2.
00:55:04.576 --> 00:55:07.347
Damn, it'd be boring if we agreed on all of these.
00:55:09.202 --> 00:55:09.465
That's great.
00:55:09.465 --> 00:55:26.766
Just to dig into the eaves quickly, I think eaves without spouting is awesome, like if you deal with your rainwater at the ground, gravel trap or something Zunthor's serpentine, the photos of it in the rain, where it's like square waterfall.
00:55:26.766 --> 00:55:28.052
It's like just like square waterfall.
00:55:28.052 --> 00:55:29.402
Where it's like all bucking down.
00:55:29.402 --> 00:55:31.947
It's just just moody.
00:55:32.869 --> 00:55:51.951
You wouldn't want it somewhere where you're walking under, but the vibes, it's like a fireplace nice nice, oh well, that's, that's good pod, yeah, and I'm looking forward to hearing some results about what the audience thinks are pro decorations or pro eaves.
00:55:51.951 --> 00:55:53.382
We'll find out.
00:55:54.405 --> 00:55:55.650
All right Is that the pod.
00:55:55.650 --> 00:55:57.043
Catch you next time.
00:55:57.043 --> 00:56:02.938
Ka-chow Ka-chow, ka-chow Ka-chow.