Gary George

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Music Music Josh, why do we do this?
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I think we do this because theatre is preserving.
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A lot of just basic etiquette. What are you talking about? Cinema.
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Cinema etiquette is dying.
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I went for a session in the Odyssey the other day,
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and two grown people, two adult people, were talking in
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the cinema.
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That's a sin reserved for the 10th circle of hell.
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What did you do? I told them to shut the
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f * * * up. Grumpy Uncle Josh. I'm not
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Grumpy Uncle Josh.
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You're right.
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Welcome back!
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Welcome back! I'm so excited to be with you once again.
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Oh, thank you, Lee.
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You know what, Josh?
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I just look at you and then I look down
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and I just go... Don't!
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We talked about this. I have litigation planned. What do
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you mean you've got a litigation planned? Just, goddammit. Well,
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I've got a litigation planned too.
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Welcome back to Why Do We Do This? A podcast
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about amateur theatre and nothing else. Anyway, what episode are
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we up to?
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We are up to... We've churned through a few. Oh,
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we actually have. Yeah. Like, I think we're kind of
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towards the back end of the end of Act 2. Really, actually.
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I think, yeah. Yeah.
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Very good. Very good.
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And we've saved some of the.
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Best to last.
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We've kept our cards close to our chest.
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We have.
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So we're very lucky because we have a fantastic actor.
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Not only an actor, but a wonderful gentleman as well.
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And a fantastic gentleman, a... has been a member of
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so many companies and done so much work. And I've
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done so much work with him. You've done so much
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work with him.
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Look, let's just get into it. It's Gary George. Gary
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George is here. Hello, gentlemen. Hello, Gary. Welcome.
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Thank you very much for having me.
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How are you feeling?
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Yeah, not too bad. Not too bad, thank you.
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Good, good, good. So we always start. Where did it start? Well, actually,
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I grew up.
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With theatre in my life from a very early age
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because my mum and dad were founding members of the
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Loxton Drama Group and I grew up in a little
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country town in the Riverland called Loxton.
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And so.
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One of my very early memories of discovering what the
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hell theatre is and was, I have no idea how
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old I was, probably five or six, and I heard
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mum and dad talking having a blazing row in the lounge.
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I burst in in absolute tears and suddenly the argument
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stopped and they went, no, no, it's a play. We're
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just acting and they were showing me scripts and they
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were explaining how they were playing roles and they weren't
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really angry with each other and it was all just
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a play. And so, yeah, so that was my first
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sort of like.
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So trauma. Trauma. Trauma. What was the theatre company?
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It's called Loxton Drama Group.
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Okay.
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Yeah, they went for quite a few years. I think
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they finished in about 1976, I think, something like that. But, like,
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we had a shed. We lived on a fruit rock. Yeah.
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One of the sheds on our fruit block was the
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prop store. All of the sets and props and stuff
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like that were in there. And as a kid, whenever
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they were doing a new play, they would open up
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that shed and you'd get in. It was just like
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Aladdin's cave full of all these amazing things. Old telephones.
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And giant spiders.
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Oh, yeah, probably.
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But spiders never really bothered me. Yeah.
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So that was my first sort of introduction to it.
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And they were both actors? Dad was the actor predominantly.
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Mum did quite a bit of acting, but she mostly directed.
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Uh-huh.
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And they also worked on, like, because mum also, because
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apart from the drama group, mum was also a schoolteacher.
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And she was teaching at Loxton High. And Loxton High
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has had a, I don't know if it still does,
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but it always had a reputation for putting on, every
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year they would do the Loxton High School musical. And
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mum would direct quite a few of those.
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Wow.
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So, and I think she didn't, the first bit of
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acting I ever did was in a Loxton High School musical,
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but mum didn't direct that one. Do you remember what
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part it was?
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Yes, I do.
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I'd been doing, even from primary school, I'd been coming
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in and working on the musicals because I played cello.
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really badly because i because i never never practice instrument
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too it's a beautiful instrument but i just never i
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never practiced so i never did it justice okay sadly
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and um so then yeah so i knew of the
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musicals and i was there when mum was directing them
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and i always thought they were great and then i
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think right towards the end of high school i went
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to hell with this i think i'm going to audition
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yeah and so i auditioned for my fair lady and
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got the role of colonel pickering Oh, who makes the bet?
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Colonel Pickering is, what's his name? Yeah, Henry Higgins' best
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mate who's there with them together. Yeah, makes the bet
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with him and is the one who actually treats Eliza
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as doesn't, you know, treat her like she's, you know,
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pond scum but like a real person right from the start.
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And that was an amazing revelation for me because that
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was when I think I first, you know, got up
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on stage and found that, I could make people laugh
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and stuff like that.
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Was that the drug that got you? The laughing one or?
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No, funnily enough, because even, I absolutely loved that, but my,
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my interest was not, but even so, I think maybe
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possibly because I'd done, been, it had been around me
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so long as a kid that I kind of was like,
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oh yeah, there's that. But I was far more interested
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in film and that was, so my intent after I
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finished high school was to go to, go and come
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up to town and, get into film. And I was
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really into, and I wanted behind the camera film. I
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wanted to, you know, create film and do the special
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effects and stuff like that. That was my first love.
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And I remember me and my mate Shane, like we
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actually made a, we actually made a film while we
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were still in high school, Mad Bruce, which was a
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take on Mad Max. And it was terrible, but it got,
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it was fun. And we even had explosives in it
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that were, Yeah, anyway.
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Statue of limitations. Yeah, we're probably.
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Safe, yeah.
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We sort of freaked out some parents when they saw
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the film and we actually blew up a car in
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the film.
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Oh, my God, a real car?
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Yeah, well, a ruined car, a wrecked car, but we
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created explosives.
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To be fair, I mean, Mad Max's original budget, they
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were basically doing that.
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It's true.
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Yeah, so then.
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So I came down to, I got into McGill Uni.
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I think it was an SACAE then. And I was,
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my focus was film and television. I was going to
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be doing a communications course. which was focusing on that.
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And then to fill one of my sort of elective things,
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I did an improvisation class.
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Oh, wow.
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Which I was having fun in. And then right there
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in my first semester, Rosemary Nursey Bray, who was the
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lecturer for that course, was doing Charlie and the Chocolate
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Factory with her students. And their Augustus Gloop pulled out.
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And so she came in and said, will you... take
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over this part. And so I came in and played
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Augustus Gloop.
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And how old were you then?
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Oh, 18, 19, something like that.
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Yes. I guess.
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And then that was it. I was, I was completely
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hooked from then on.
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Wow.
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And then just my whole three years of my communications degree, uh,
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all I did was theater. Um, basically that was where
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I met Warwick Cooper. Um, and so I was doing
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shows with Warwick. So I was doing shows with him
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and some with Rosemary, um, but doing shows with him
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for the uni, but also doing shows with his theatre company,
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Theatre Exchange. So I was basically jumping every semester I'd
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do whatever show it was that they were doing that semester.
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And then in between that and the next one, I'd
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be doing a Theatre Exchange or two shows. So I basically,
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for three years, I just lived and breathed theatre. Well,
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how many shows did you do a year? They were doing,
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from memory, they were doing, I was doing sort of
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like four.
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Shows a year, two, two, two.
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What was it? More than that.
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Because you've done like over 70 shows or even more, maybe.
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Yeah, I did a lot. I did a lot back then.
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And yeah, I'm stupid. I mean, it's crazy.
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It is. I know. I'm very old.
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But you love it. Like clearly.
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Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it's amazing. It is, yeah. It's incredible.
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And with Warwick, it was kind of a throw you
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in at the deep end, off you go, throw you
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on stage and just see how you went, which was
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kind of intimidating and terrifying. But also you learnt an
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incredible amount very, very quickly.
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Where did you rehearse when you were doing all this?
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We were rehearsing in the theatre out at McGill, the
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playhouse there at McGill. We would rehearse there. Sometimes we
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would rehearse in various classrooms and stuff like that if
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we couldn't get into the theatre.
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I just recall Warwick rehearsing a lot in his shed.
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It was later on.
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Yeah, later on.
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And also with Theatre Exchange, we did a lot of
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rehearsals in his shed. I remember when he revealed this
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amazing shed that he had all the costumes and everything
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there and this beautiful rehearsal space and, yeah.
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These were the early days.
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I'm trying to think how far back we're talking. Late 80s,
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I'd say.
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Who is this person?
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Warwick has been around forever. He was a lecturer out
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at McGill.
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Is he still alive?
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Yes, he is.
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He's been in his 80s now.
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I think he's just in his early 80s.
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And he's a lovely man. He's an amazing man. He
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has just... His last Guild show was... Nomadland. Nomadland, yeah.
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The Pinter.
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Yeah, with Michael Baldwin. Yeah, amazing show.
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And John Edge.
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Yeah, and... Matt Houston. And Matt Houston was in it.
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Yeah.
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No, he's an incredible, incredible brain, Batman. His knowledge of
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theatre is... And he has a wonderful habit of assuming
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you know every reference he's throwing at you.
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Yeah, okay.
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Kind of like Josh, really.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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It's quite incredible how much he knows and you just, yeah.
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I don't know. We're nerds. So, all right. So, in
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that time, you're going through all these, you know, like,
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as you said, thrown in the deep end.
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You're building your skills as well as actually being taught.
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What were some of the more important lessons in those
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earlier days, do you think, that really stuck with you?
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We did a lot of, I think the vocal work
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that we did, the working on vocals was really important.
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And one of the things that Warwick would really excelled
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at and working with us on those things. And also
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we did a lot, we did a lot of stage craft.
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So no, nobody would go in there and just act.
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You would also, even if, even though I ended up
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acting in every show, I did the light, we did
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the lights, we did the sound, we did, um, We
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assistant directed. We stage managed. We did all. Everybody got
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to try just about everything. I was even a musical
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director for one bloody show, which is completely farcical. Yeah,
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so just.
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And you love musicals.
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Oh, yeah.
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I'm such a big fan. Can you dance? Well, you
251
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saw me in Ink. I was stunning.
252
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No. Everyone was great in that. The whole dancing thing
253
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was good.
254
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I can do it if I have to.
255
00:11:36.659 --> 00:11:37.139
Yeah, yeah.
256
00:11:37.179 --> 00:11:38.350
I mean, you know from Blue Skies.
257
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I can't, so you do it with me. I would
258
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say no, I am not a dancer.
259
00:11:42.990 --> 00:11:45.309
If it's blue sky, only the front row is seeing
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00:11:45.389 --> 00:11:45.830
our feet.
261
00:11:46.110 --> 00:11:48.409
That's true. Very true.
262
00:11:48.809 --> 00:11:52.029
Very true. Partly I think it was just the fact
263
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that it was so intense because it became your entire
264
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life and it was just one show to.
265
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The next show to the next show.
266
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But you're also seeing every single perspective of the craft.
267
00:12:02.409 --> 00:12:04.549
Absolutely, yeah, because we were up in the lighting.
268
00:12:04.570 --> 00:12:07.629
So it's almost like you've got a three-dimensional... kind of idea,
269
00:12:07.769 --> 00:12:11.049
like while you're acting, you know that that person's thinking
270
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this while I'm doing this. I think that's a great idea.
271
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Yeah, that's true. I think that's true. And the other
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thing I think I learned from Warwick and from those
273
00:12:19.259 --> 00:12:24.179
times was discipline. When it came to rehearsals, if it
274
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was a 7 o'clock rehearsal, you were there at quarter
275
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to 7 and you were ready to start at 7.
276
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And if you were not there at 7, you would
277
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get there and find that the doors were locked. And
278
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if you did not get a message through and you
279
00:12:37.389 --> 00:12:39.610
couldn't text back in them days, you had to be
280
00:12:39.649 --> 00:12:41.909
able to let them know that you were not going
281
00:12:41.929 --> 00:12:43.070
to be able to be there or you were going
282
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to be a bit late well enough in advance because
283
00:12:46.019 --> 00:12:48.299
if it was, I can't remember what it was, but
284
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it was something like if you were late three times
285
00:12:50.080 --> 00:12:52.769
in a row, you'd be replaced. It was that strict.
286
00:12:52.970 --> 00:12:56.159
So you just knew you never came late to rehearsal
287
00:12:56.320 --> 00:12:58.559
and you always had a pencil and you always had
288
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an eraser and you always had your script and you
289
00:13:01.159 --> 00:13:04.200
knew exactly what you were doing. And it's just something
290
00:13:04.220 --> 00:13:07.279
that I now have very well drummed into me and
291
00:13:07.299 --> 00:13:10.730
there's a lot of these little and there's theatre etiquette
292
00:13:10.769 --> 00:13:12.830
things that I have learnt over the years that I
293
00:13:12.970 --> 00:13:15.710
find that I get very annoyed when other people don't
294
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adhere to.
295
00:13:16.740 --> 00:13:17.960
What are some of those examples?
296
00:13:18.159 --> 00:13:20.340
I think one of my chief one is every time
297
00:13:20.360 --> 00:13:22.679
your stage manager comes into the dressing room and tells
298
00:13:22.740 --> 00:13:26.799
you you have 15 minutes, you say, thank you, Heather.
299
00:13:26.879 --> 00:13:28.600
If it's Heather, of course, which most of the time
300
00:13:28.620 --> 00:13:31.379
it's Heather. You say, thank you, Heather, so that the
301
00:13:31.419 --> 00:13:33.519
stage manager knows you heard them.
302
00:13:34.059 --> 00:13:36.519
Yeah. So they can go away knowing. It's like a
303
00:13:36.570 --> 00:13:38.269
Roger that. It is exactly that.
304
00:13:38.289 --> 00:13:41.370
It's like, you know you've got 15 minutes and I
305
00:13:41.429 --> 00:13:44.649
know that you know. Whereas quite often people having chats,
306
00:13:44.710 --> 00:13:46.549
it's in the dressing room, you're getting ready, people are
307
00:13:46.570 --> 00:13:49.570
getting prepared for their thing and they won't necessarily take
308
00:13:49.610 --> 00:13:51.330
that little tiny moment to just turn and say, thank.
309
00:13:51.250 --> 00:13:51.490
You, Heather.
310
00:13:51.509 --> 00:13:53.009
What I'm getting at is these young people.
311
00:13:54.730 --> 00:13:59.110
I think it's also changed. There's something more, not casual,
312
00:13:59.289 --> 00:14:01.250
it's kind of, I still remember doing shows where you'd
313
00:14:01.269 --> 00:14:03.129
be in the green room and it would be like
314
00:14:03.409 --> 00:14:05.720
Mr Cook, 10 minutes to you're.
315
00:14:05.620 --> 00:14:08.039
On stage, kind of like that throughout the whole show.
316
00:14:08.059 --> 00:14:08.659
Like you kind of.
317
00:14:09.340 --> 00:14:10.899
But I guess things just, I don't know.
318
00:14:11.039 --> 00:14:11.299
Mr.
319
00:14:11.340 --> 00:14:12.799
Cook, they're improvising right now.
320
00:14:14.779 --> 00:14:17.080
Mr. Cook, where are you? Yes.
321
00:14:18.120 --> 00:14:18.419
Yeah.
322
00:14:18.519 --> 00:14:19.179
Well, that's good.
323
00:14:19.220 --> 00:14:22.000
Well, I mean, those habits make the machine work a
324
00:14:22.019 --> 00:14:22.899
lot more efficiently.
325
00:14:23.299 --> 00:14:25.720
And it is a machine. Like, let's be honest. It's
326
00:14:25.759 --> 00:14:26.980
a creative pursuit.
327
00:14:27.039 --> 00:14:28.840
But at the end of the day, you're a team
328
00:14:28.879 --> 00:14:30.600
of people trying to work something out.
329
00:14:30.860 --> 00:14:33.179
Yeah. And it's a respect thing, too. It's a showing
330
00:14:33.220 --> 00:14:34.179
respect to that role.
331
00:14:34.279 --> 00:14:36.620
I'm an old man yells at cloud kind of guy, but.
332
00:14:37.080 --> 00:14:39.120
People rocking up late shits me to tears.
333
00:14:39.539 --> 00:14:40.200
Yeah. Yeah.
334
00:14:40.519 --> 00:14:41.039
It just does.
335
00:14:41.460 --> 00:14:42.480
Yeah. Always will.
336
00:14:42.799 --> 00:14:46.399
Yeah. I can remember where I, I can't remember the play.
337
00:14:46.419 --> 00:14:48.769
It was a guild show and I woke up and
338
00:14:48.809 --> 00:14:51.110
I was convinced in my head that the first read
339
00:14:51.149 --> 00:14:54.990
started at 11 and I got there and discovered that
340
00:14:55.049 --> 00:14:57.649
it had started at half past 10 and I spent
341
00:14:57.850 --> 00:15:00.620
the next, I don't know how many weeks apologising because
342
00:15:00.720 --> 00:15:05.230
I was devastated that I had behaved so poorly. to
343
00:15:05.289 --> 00:15:07.009
not know what time I was supposed to be there
344
00:15:07.049 --> 00:15:08.750
and be there. And I just, I, cause I walked
345
00:15:08.789 --> 00:15:10.129
in and they were already going and I was just like,
346
00:15:10.200 --> 00:15:11.120
Oh my God, I'm so sorry.
347
00:15:11.149 --> 00:15:14.519
I'm so sorry. I get anxious, like not being there
348
00:15:14.559 --> 00:15:17.639
an hour beforehand. Like I just, all these things that
349
00:15:17.659 --> 00:15:19.059
could go wrong before I get there.
350
00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:19.159
Yeah.
351
00:15:20.019 --> 00:15:23.460
Yeah. So having done it for so long, is there
352
00:15:23.500 --> 00:15:28.320
been massive noticeable changes that you've seen in theatre? Yes.
353
00:15:28.559 --> 00:15:31.659
Like is it discipline? Is it choices of shows?
354
00:15:31.679 --> 00:15:33.750
Is it, Oh, that is a good question.
355
00:15:33.970 --> 00:15:39.190
Generally, it has not changed. I find that I am
356
00:15:39.230 --> 00:15:41.169
meeting the same kinds of people and I'm having the
357
00:15:41.220 --> 00:15:44.720
same kinds of experience that I had back, you know,
358
00:15:45.080 --> 00:15:45.879
however many years ago.
359
00:15:45.899 --> 00:15:49.320
I don't want to say how many. When Sophocles was writing. Yeah, exactly.
360
00:15:49.360 --> 00:15:52.460
When they had to hand you the new stone tablet.
361
00:15:53.419 --> 00:15:59.110
I do feel that there's... Say it. You can say it, Gary.
362
00:15:59.370 --> 00:16:00.529
I feel like there's a bit.
363
00:16:00.450 --> 00:16:04.740
Of an increase in the, not the diva thing, but
364
00:16:04.820 --> 00:16:07.139
in the it's all about me.
365
00:16:07.240 --> 00:16:09.899
Main character syndrome. That's what I call it. Kind of, yeah.
366
00:16:09.940 --> 00:16:10.529
Where there are.
367
00:16:12.090 --> 00:16:14.529
To me, as you say, it's a team thing. You
368
00:16:14.649 --> 00:16:17.090
all work together. It doesn't matter if you're a walk-on
369
00:16:17.590 --> 00:16:20.889
person with two lines or the lead character, you're all
370
00:16:20.970 --> 00:16:23.379
working together. And then there are some people who are,
371
00:16:24.139 --> 00:16:26.320
I think there's just, and there's a very small number
372
00:16:26.539 --> 00:16:29.100
and they've always been there, but I don't know. They
373
00:16:29.139 --> 00:16:31.100
just seem to have been coming up in my life
374
00:16:31.659 --> 00:16:32.139
here and there.
375
00:16:32.639 --> 00:16:34.990
And how do you deal with that dynamic in the
376
00:16:35.000 --> 00:16:36.840
rehearsal rooms? Generally, like.
377
00:16:36.980 --> 00:16:41.240
Because you're one of the most affable guys. I'm not
378
00:16:41.259 --> 00:16:43.200
going to... No, the only time I will actually... I
379
00:16:44.419 --> 00:16:46.600
don't know, were you there? I have lost my shit
380
00:16:46.820 --> 00:16:49.220
once or twice. Really? It is very, very brief. It
381
00:16:49.259 --> 00:16:51.120
is very, very explosive and it usually scares the shit
382
00:16:51.159 --> 00:16:51.519
out of people.
383
00:16:52.899 --> 00:16:58.169
It probably was my fault. It might have even been... Well,
384
00:16:58.190 --> 00:16:59.809
I'm not sure. It was a Shakespeare. I know it
385
00:16:59.830 --> 00:17:01.049
was a Shakespeare and.
386
00:17:01.649 --> 00:17:02.730
I feel like this one is my fault.
387
00:17:02.750 --> 00:17:03.220
There was....
388
00:17:04.529 --> 00:17:07.470
It was basically that I was on stage. It might
389
00:17:07.490 --> 00:17:08.809
have even been Much Ado About Nothing.
390
00:17:08.829 --> 00:17:09.450
Yeah, I don't know.
391
00:17:09.490 --> 00:17:10.390
And we were on stage.
392
00:17:10.410 --> 00:17:12.250
We are narrowing it down to me. And I think, like,
393
00:17:12.529 --> 00:17:16.109
Adam had a big... Adam Chewerman had a big speech,
394
00:17:16.329 --> 00:17:18.589
and it was a toughie. And we were on stage
395
00:17:18.670 --> 00:17:21.190
trying to work this speech, and there were people in
396
00:17:21.230 --> 00:17:24.180
the wings who were just having a big, loud conversation,
397
00:17:24.440 --> 00:17:26.230
and it went on and on and on.
398
00:17:26.259 --> 00:17:26.799
That wasn't me.
399
00:17:27.180 --> 00:17:31.029
That was not you. And I... hit the roof, and
400
00:17:31.130 --> 00:17:33.890
I just screamed my head off to them to shut
401
00:17:33.970 --> 00:17:35.190
the fuck up and have some.
402
00:17:35.009 --> 00:17:36.960
Respect for the people on stage. That was because.
403
00:17:36.630 --> 00:17:38.400
You were looking after him, though.
404
00:17:38.700 --> 00:17:42.819
Yeah. Yeah, that's lovely. Well, it's– but that's the team thing.
405
00:17:42.880 --> 00:17:43.319
It's like.
406
00:17:44.839 --> 00:17:48.319
That's the problem idea. Whenever there's somebody who sort of
407
00:17:48.380 --> 00:17:50.829
puts themselves ahead of everybody else, I have a problem
408
00:17:50.849 --> 00:17:55.309
with that because it's– but I'm not going to confront
409
00:17:55.410 --> 00:17:58.160
because generally speaking confronting– Doesn't often help.
410
00:17:58.339 --> 00:17:58.740
Yeah, yeah.
411
00:17:58.759 --> 00:18:00.809
And it's also, if I'm just acting, it's not my place.
412
00:18:02.460 --> 00:18:04.990
If that sort of stuff is happening, it is actually
413
00:18:05.029 --> 00:18:07.009
the director's role to come and have a word with
414
00:18:07.049 --> 00:18:07.630
that person.
415
00:18:07.690 --> 00:18:11.009
I guess if they're not doing that, though, then it's, yeah,
416
00:18:11.029 --> 00:18:11.950
it's a bit more challenging.
417
00:18:11.990 --> 00:18:14.130
And the other thing is everyone's here to have fun
418
00:18:14.190 --> 00:18:17.410
with these things. Even though I love a professional atmosphere
419
00:18:17.430 --> 00:18:20.500
and I like people to behave professionally... It's not a
420
00:18:20.539 --> 00:18:23.319
professional show. They are amateur shows.
421
00:18:23.400 --> 00:18:25.960
It's a social exercise as well.
422
00:18:26.180 --> 00:18:27.700
And so people are there to have fun.
423
00:18:27.740 --> 00:18:30.380
But I get what you're saying.
424
00:18:31.059 --> 00:18:32.819
For some reason, I don't know what it is, but
425
00:18:32.880 --> 00:18:35.440
I can hear everything behind me when I'm acting.
426
00:18:35.779 --> 00:18:36.059
Yeah.
427
00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:37.599
Not in front of me.
428
00:18:37.759 --> 00:18:37.960
Yeah.
429
00:18:38.740 --> 00:18:42.720
And you just hear every single bit from what's happening.
430
00:18:42.740 --> 00:18:44.880
From offstage. Yeah, yeah. Do you find that?
431
00:18:45.240 --> 00:18:48.619
Distracting as well. And when you're struggling for lines, particularly
432
00:18:48.660 --> 00:18:50.480
in the early days when you're just off book and
433
00:18:50.500 --> 00:18:53.500
stuff like that, it's incredibly frustrating. It is hard because
434
00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:55.460
you're trying to get through that muscle memory part where
435
00:18:55.509 --> 00:18:57.549
you're kind of like saying the lines when you're moving
436
00:18:57.589 --> 00:18:58.170
and it's just.
437
00:18:58.230 --> 00:19:01.170
When you're swearing at yourself, you're beating yourself up and.
438
00:19:01.950 --> 00:19:04.269
Yes, we're all pretty good at that. Yeah, yeah. What
439
00:19:04.289 --> 00:19:09.529
do you think you're most, like, you're better at? As in, like,
440
00:19:10.069 --> 00:19:16.069
the part of the process, what do you... Oh, my favourite.
441
00:19:15.630 --> 00:19:18.900
Part of doing theatre is exploring the script.
442
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:23.740
But that's because you're a writer, right? Like, that's all about... Hey, maybe, maybe.
443
00:19:23.779 --> 00:19:25.099
It's the words, but it's stuff like that.
444
00:19:25.740 --> 00:19:28.940
In some ways, there are times where, and I'm sure
445
00:19:28.980 --> 00:19:31.299
I've said this to you before, Josh... I would rather
446
00:19:31.400 --> 00:19:34.740
just rehearse forever and never bother putting it up in
447
00:19:34.789 --> 00:19:37.630
front of an audience because that's where you're playing and
448
00:19:37.670 --> 00:19:38.809
that's where you're discovering.
449
00:19:38.829 --> 00:19:40.789
I think we're all in that boat. I'm like, let's
450
00:19:40.849 --> 00:19:43.430
just keep rehearsing. Who gives a shit about.
451
00:19:43.250 --> 00:19:45.730
These other people? Oh, wait, we need their money. Yeah,
452
00:19:45.910 --> 00:19:46.750
there is that.
453
00:19:46.990 --> 00:19:48.430
And, you know, once you get the end of the
454
00:19:48.450 --> 00:19:50.640
show up there in front of an audience, it's magic.
455
00:19:51.180 --> 00:19:54.240
But there is something really special about... There's always something
456
00:19:54.359 --> 00:19:57.359
sad when you go into bump-in, isn't there? Yeah, it's
457
00:19:57.400 --> 00:19:58.599
kind of the end of play.
458
00:19:58.720 --> 00:19:58.980
Yeah.
459
00:19:59.099 --> 00:20:00.160
And you have to start working.
460
00:20:00.359 --> 00:20:03.059
Which is why Gary and I have done the last, what,
461
00:20:03.200 --> 00:20:04.759
eight shows together?
462
00:20:05.400 --> 00:20:06.079
But I just love.
463
00:20:06.440 --> 00:20:06.799
I love.
464
00:20:07.690 --> 00:20:09.410
finding things in the script when you're in the middle
465
00:20:09.430 --> 00:20:12.769
of rehearsal at some point and you go, oh, my God,
466
00:20:12.809 --> 00:20:14.670
that's what he's saying in Act 1.
467
00:20:14.670 --> 00:20:17.400
This bit, this refers to that. And it all.
468
00:20:17.279 --> 00:20:18.900
Falls into place. It's just all there. I don't get
469
00:20:18.920 --> 00:20:19.839
that because I don't read the script.
470
00:20:19.859 --> 00:20:21.759
You don't read the whole thing. No, I do read.
471
00:20:21.819 --> 00:20:24.539
It's like an ongoing joke, but it's true. I do
472
00:20:24.579 --> 00:20:25.960
read the script, you know.
473
00:20:26.380 --> 00:20:27.380
Sorry, your line.
474
00:20:27.480 --> 00:20:32.289
Oh, you do? So being a writer, when you look
475
00:20:32.309 --> 00:20:34.670
at a script, What are the cues or the social
476
00:20:34.710 --> 00:20:37.509
things or any of those social things, what are the
477
00:20:37.849 --> 00:20:40.369
bits that you're looking for in a script? Like what
478
00:20:40.410 --> 00:20:43.650
are the ones that give you, are you very specific about, say,
479
00:20:43.690 --> 00:20:47.210
where commas are and stuff like that, being a writer.
480
00:20:46.990 --> 00:20:50.230
And then looking at someone else's medium that they've written?
481
00:20:50.769 --> 00:20:53.019
You know what I'm asking, right?
482
00:20:53.079 --> 00:20:54.019
I do, I do.
483
00:20:54.339 --> 00:20:57.420
I need Shakespeare as a good example for me.
484
00:20:57.480 --> 00:20:57.680
Yep.
485
00:20:58.099 --> 00:20:59.579
I love Shakespeare.
486
00:20:59.599 --> 00:20:59.680
Yeah.
487
00:21:00.160 --> 00:21:04.279
I love the words, I love the language, but what
488
00:21:04.319 --> 00:21:06.759
I need to be able to do is find exactly
489
00:21:06.799 --> 00:21:07.880
the meaning of every line.
490
00:21:08.940 --> 00:21:10.660
And in a modern context.
491
00:21:10.680 --> 00:21:12.920
It doesn't always work, yeah.
492
00:21:13.279 --> 00:21:16.240
To make that line make sense, you have to find,
493
00:21:16.259 --> 00:21:19.240
you have to understand it and then find the way
494
00:21:19.299 --> 00:21:23.089
to say it that will make it make sense to
495
00:21:23.160 --> 00:21:23.869
a modern audience.
496
00:21:23.880 --> 00:21:25.950
This is about the laws of marriage in the 1500s, like.
497
00:21:27.670 --> 00:21:31.480
Or it's like audiences who are completely used to iambic
498
00:21:31.539 --> 00:21:35.339
pentameter and would understand that there was this poetry thing
499
00:21:35.380 --> 00:21:38.049
and when the poetry breaks, that's the moment where this happens.
500
00:21:38.180 --> 00:21:42.849
Do you use that, though? No. Well... You go off metre.
501
00:21:43.009 --> 00:21:45.529
I do go off metre. I intentionally go off metre
502
00:21:45.569 --> 00:21:51.089
because I think nothing will... put a modern audience to
503
00:21:51.109 --> 00:21:55.109
sleep faster than dum-de-dum-de-dum-de-dum. What you need to do is
504
00:21:55.329 --> 00:21:57.809
use that, because I remember having an argument with Brant
505
00:21:57.869 --> 00:21:59.109
Eustace about this years ago.
506
00:21:59.130 --> 00:22:01.329
I think you're still having that argument.
507
00:22:01.349 --> 00:22:04.690
I probably still am. He pointed out that you can
508
00:22:04.890 --> 00:22:08.630
use the iambic pentameter to find the meaning, and it's true.
509
00:22:08.890 --> 00:22:11.359
You can use that and go, okay, he's stressing this.
510
00:22:11.799 --> 00:22:14.440
Shakespeare's written it like this. He's stressing this point. He's
511
00:22:14.480 --> 00:22:18.099
stressing this point. And now he's broken. And so there's
512
00:22:18.119 --> 00:22:21.839
all this stuff. Do you think he was actually writing
513
00:22:21.900 --> 00:22:22.799
it to that point?
514
00:22:23.000 --> 00:22:23.680
Yeah, he was.
515
00:22:23.779 --> 00:22:25.460
Or do you think he was just trying to make
516
00:22:25.509 --> 00:22:25.829
it rhyme?
517
00:22:25.910 --> 00:22:27.789
And when he writes prose, you can really tell.
518
00:22:28.730 --> 00:22:29.250
And there are.
519
00:22:29.210 --> 00:22:32.670
Times where he chooses to switch from poetry to prose
520
00:22:32.710 --> 00:22:33.250
and stuff like that.
521
00:22:33.289 --> 00:22:34.410
Not to be too wanker.
522
00:22:34.730 --> 00:22:38.230
But my thing is to not be locked into that.
523
00:22:38.609 --> 00:22:41.470
But to take that, use that to find the meaning,
524
00:22:41.730 --> 00:22:44.750
because the only way you can make a modern audience
525
00:22:44.809 --> 00:22:48.599
enjoy Shakespeare is if they can understand it. And they
526
00:22:48.700 --> 00:22:51.720
only understand it if the person who's speaking it knows
527
00:22:51.819 --> 00:22:55.490
exactly what they're saying and the true sense of what
528
00:22:55.529 --> 00:22:57.750
they're saying. In the same way that sometimes you can
529
00:22:57.789 --> 00:22:59.769
go and see a play in another language and you
530
00:22:59.829 --> 00:23:02.440
know what's going on because of the way the people
531
00:23:02.519 --> 00:23:05.420
are acting it. Shakespeare is similar, but it's so much
532
00:23:05.480 --> 00:23:07.529
easier because it's got all those... It is English.
533
00:23:07.970 --> 00:23:10.289
I watched King Lear in Belarus.
534
00:23:10.930 --> 00:23:13.710
Oh, wow, like the Belarusian company was doing it. And
535
00:23:13.769 --> 00:23:15.349
I was like, I know exactly.
536
00:23:15.029 --> 00:23:15.710
What's going on.
537
00:23:16.170 --> 00:23:18.680
I guess, you know, if you know the play, it helps. But, like,
538
00:23:19.099 --> 00:23:21.359
I knew exactly what scene it was and I knew
539
00:23:21.420 --> 00:23:23.500
exactly what they were feeling and I knew which light could.
540
00:23:23.519 --> 00:23:25.279
I was like, yeah, you guys know. Is that the
541
00:23:25.339 --> 00:23:29.480
hardest thing about Shakespeare is getting that message across to
542
00:23:29.519 --> 00:23:30.980
the audience and conveying that?
543
00:23:31.609 --> 00:23:36.650
If your actors don't truly understand what they're saying, your
544
00:23:36.730 --> 00:23:39.230
audience has no hope in hell of understanding what it's about.
545
00:23:39.309 --> 00:23:41.730
And when doing a Shakespeare.
546
00:23:41.130 --> 00:23:44.559
Show, you don't have a connection with the audience.
547
00:23:44.680 --> 00:23:46.259
It is so fundamental. And that was one of the
548
00:23:46.279 --> 00:23:48.380
things that I loved when we were doing Shakespeare with
549
00:23:48.420 --> 00:23:52.460
Brandt back in the day when we did Antony and
550
00:23:52.480 --> 00:23:54.059
Cleo and a couple of other things.
551
00:23:54.079 --> 00:23:55.319
Julius Caesar. Julius Caesar.
552
00:23:56.079 --> 00:23:59.319
Before we ever got it on stage, we would be like, okay,
553
00:23:59.339 --> 00:24:00.720
we're going to work on Act 1, Scene 1. And
554
00:24:00.740 --> 00:24:02.559
you would sit around a table in Act 1, Scene
555
00:24:02.559 --> 00:24:04.910
1 and you would just go through the script. And
556
00:24:04.930 --> 00:24:06.450
you go, what the hell does this mean?
557
00:24:07.049 --> 00:24:09.789
So all the directors you've worked with in Shakespeare, because
558
00:24:09.829 --> 00:24:11.589
you worked with a couple, do they all do that?
559
00:24:12.529 --> 00:24:14.650
A fair bit. A fair bit. Some more than others.
560
00:24:14.710 --> 00:24:16.609
Some will sort of find those.
561
00:24:16.630 --> 00:24:17.710
Megan did it. She did, yeah.
562
00:24:17.730 --> 00:24:21.170
We would always have a session of sitting around and
563
00:24:21.190 --> 00:24:21.990
pulling apart.
564
00:24:22.059 --> 00:24:25.779
And also you would find those moments during rehearsal where
565
00:24:26.119 --> 00:24:28.420
you would just go, I don't know what I'm saying
566
00:24:28.460 --> 00:24:32.160
right here, and then you would work towards finding out
567
00:24:32.220 --> 00:24:34.240
what that meant. And generally for me that's just get
568
00:24:34.259 --> 00:24:39.329
yourself an Oxford Shakespeare or any good annotated Shakespeare.
569
00:24:39.349 --> 00:24:41.769
It didn't make any sense. You just cut the damn thing.
570
00:24:41.789 --> 00:24:43.390
You either cut it or you find a way to
571
00:24:43.430 --> 00:24:45.690
just go, well, how can I turn this into something
572
00:24:46.210 --> 00:24:47.069
that's just a bit funny?
573
00:24:47.089 --> 00:24:50.490
So you're not precious about cutting Shakespeare or cutting bits out?
574
00:24:50.509 --> 00:24:51.509
Not really. It depends.
575
00:24:52.130 --> 00:24:54.230
Do you want to sit through three and a half
576
00:24:54.269 --> 00:24:55.109
hours of Shakespeare?
577
00:24:55.769 --> 00:24:57.829
I've made people sit through an eight-hour show, so I
578
00:24:57.869 --> 00:25:00.849
can't really judge. I'm not. No, I'm not.
579
00:25:01.569 --> 00:25:05.539
But you... I am smidgenly precious about it. Like, you
580
00:25:05.579 --> 00:25:06.920
have to have a good reason for cutting it.
581
00:25:07.319 --> 00:25:08.809
Yeah. And, yeah.
582
00:25:09.400 --> 00:25:12.230
Because if you can find the meaning and you can
583
00:25:12.269 --> 00:25:16.789
make it make sense for the audience, then keep it in. Unless,
584
00:25:16.829 --> 00:25:19.009
of course, you just like.
585
00:25:18.829 --> 00:25:19.109
What we wrote.
586
00:25:19.650 --> 00:25:22.009
Find some of the more problematic stuff.
587
00:25:22.609 --> 00:25:24.450
Yeah. I mean, two gentlemen.
588
00:25:24.670 --> 00:25:25.970
Oh, yes, two gentlemen of Verona.
589
00:25:26.009 --> 00:25:27.910
That was challenging.
590
00:25:28.069 --> 00:25:30.750
But that was also fun. Yeah, yeah.
591
00:25:32.559 --> 00:25:37.660
Generally speaking, I don't love it when people impose stuff
592
00:25:37.759 --> 00:25:44.569
on a script, where they'll shoehorn something in. However, with
593
00:25:44.990 --> 00:25:48.539
some of the more problematic Shakespeare's, like Two Gentlemen, which...
594
00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:52.009
big spoilers for people who haven't seen it, has an
595
00:25:52.049 --> 00:25:54.769
attempt at rape by one of the heroes in the
596
00:25:54.789 --> 00:25:57.630
play attempts to rape one of the heroines at the
597
00:25:57.690 --> 00:26:01.529
very tail end of the play. Then all of the
598
00:26:01.569 --> 00:26:04.170
lovers meet together and everybody's happy and the king says,
599
00:26:04.190 --> 00:26:06.029
that's great, let's all go off and get married and
600
00:26:06.109 --> 00:26:07.670
everybody leaves and everybody's happy.
601
00:26:07.690 --> 00:26:09.450
Does she marry the guy that she's chosen?
602
00:26:09.529 --> 00:26:11.809
No, because it's the best mate. It's his best mate
603
00:26:11.849 --> 00:26:13.829
who tries to rape her. But he goes off with
604
00:26:13.849 --> 00:26:15.349
the other girl when he finds the other girl who's
605
00:26:15.369 --> 00:26:16.730
supposed to be in love with and they all go
606
00:26:16.779 --> 00:26:21.299
off happily ever after. For that, you can't play it
607
00:26:21.380 --> 00:26:23.009
like that today.
608
00:26:22.960 --> 00:26:24.029
And make it land.
609
00:26:24.309 --> 00:26:25.630
There's got to be a sombre note.
610
00:26:25.869 --> 00:26:27.250
Basic, yeah.
611
00:26:27.329 --> 00:26:30.029
When I got to... Trying to bring down the mood.
612
00:26:30.130 --> 00:26:33.269
When I got to direct that with the lovely Angela Short,
613
00:26:33.869 --> 00:26:35.869
that was the big thing of how are we going
614
00:26:35.910 --> 00:26:40.450
to deal with this and we've had people comment on
615
00:26:40.490 --> 00:26:41.710
the moment. You were joint directors.
616
00:26:42.339 --> 00:26:44.900
Yeah, we co-directed. So you've got a female voice in
617
00:26:44.920 --> 00:26:47.259
there as well, which is really strong. So that's great.
618
00:26:47.279 --> 00:26:49.480
So how did you solve that? Basically, we got to
619
00:26:49.500 --> 00:26:51.819
the end of the play. The blokes all did their big, yeah,
620
00:26:51.839 --> 00:26:53.740
isn't this great? Let's all go off and get married.
621
00:26:54.099 --> 00:26:56.829
And they all left and we just kept the two
622
00:26:56.950 --> 00:27:01.630
female leads on stage in silence looking at each other
623
00:27:01.970 --> 00:27:04.400
and then we dropped the lights. So we basically had.
624
00:27:04.410 --> 00:27:05.990
Oh, you kind of left it on a cliffhanger. Are
625
00:27:06.009 --> 00:27:07.190
they going to... What are they going to do?
626
00:27:08.809 --> 00:27:12.440
It's... And it was a really lovely moment. I mean,
627
00:27:12.460 --> 00:27:14.099
working with the people that we were working with really helped.
628
00:27:14.119 --> 00:27:17.519
But Diesel was in it. And Diesel was gorgeous. Jan
629
00:27:17.539 --> 00:27:18.579
Farr's beautiful dog, Diesel.
630
00:27:18.599 --> 00:27:19.900
Jan Farr's beautiful Diesel.
631
00:27:20.160 --> 00:27:21.549
He was a gorgeous puppy.
632
00:27:21.970 --> 00:27:24.769
No, I'm sorry I brought that up. No, no, no, absolutely.
633
00:27:24.789 --> 00:27:28.150
It draws to our point of there are some times
634
00:27:28.329 --> 00:27:32.750
with some of the more Shakespeare's not ancient. But there
635
00:27:32.789 --> 00:27:35.119
are some problematic things. There is plenty of that.
636
00:27:35.240 --> 00:27:37.420
And there's stuff... It's not ancient. Is that what you
637
00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:37.759
just said?
638
00:27:38.059 --> 00:27:39.279
It's not that ancient.
639
00:27:39.319 --> 00:27:39.900
It's not that ancient.
640
00:27:39.920 --> 00:27:40.519
You can't say ancient.
641
00:27:40.579 --> 00:27:45.410
It's not Odysseus. Well, true, but... Like hundreds of years old. That's... But.
642
00:27:45.609 --> 00:27:45.769
Yeah.
643
00:27:46.029 --> 00:27:48.210
But it's... But there's even stuff from the 6th.
644
00:27:48.210 --> 00:27:48.740
I'm older than you.
645
00:27:48.829 --> 00:27:49.170
There are.
646
00:27:50.559 --> 00:27:53.160
There are plays from the 60s and the 50s and
647
00:27:53.359 --> 00:27:55.640
even later than that that are just as problematic.
648
00:27:55.660 --> 00:27:56.369
Benny Hill.
649
00:27:57.549 --> 00:28:01.269
You have to find some way to highlight that, I think,
650
00:28:01.490 --> 00:28:04.950
and to make it– to point out how wrong that
651
00:28:05.019 --> 00:28:09.559
crap is but still make the play work in a
652
00:28:09.579 --> 00:28:10.299
modern context.
653
00:28:10.359 --> 00:28:13.660
I don't think– yeah, you don't make– I think there
654
00:28:13.700 --> 00:28:15.640
are certain plays– What's the point?
655
00:28:15.740 --> 00:28:17.069
What are we actually saying? Yes.
656
00:28:17.230 --> 00:28:19.509
There are some that probably need to be retired and
657
00:28:19.529 --> 00:28:21.049
put away where you go, yeah, that was a great
658
00:28:21.089 --> 00:28:22.329
play of its time.
659
00:28:22.349 --> 00:28:25.279
But I will still go and watch Julius Caesar hands down.
660
00:28:25.839 --> 00:28:26.799
I know that's going to be.
661
00:28:26.799 --> 00:28:29.559
There are not many Shakespeare's that I find. There's a
662
00:28:29.819 --> 00:28:30.900
couple that are pretty.
663
00:28:30.940 --> 00:28:31.720
Measure for measure.
664
00:28:32.990 --> 00:28:35.130
Yeah, well, again, you have to find those.
665
00:28:35.150 --> 00:28:36.170
We're alienating, Lee.
666
00:28:36.339 --> 00:28:36.650
Sorry, Lee.
667
00:28:36.670 --> 00:28:37.490
No, no, no.
668
00:28:37.539 --> 00:28:42.539
Well, I was just thinking, having directed but predominantly being
669
00:28:42.579 --> 00:28:45.000
an actor, do you think having directed made you a
670
00:28:45.019 --> 00:28:45.559
better actor?
671
00:28:47.839 --> 00:28:50.890
Yes, I think it does. Because, I mean, when I
672
00:28:51.049 --> 00:28:55.170
was doing children's theatre, it was all sports. self-directed like
673
00:28:55.809 --> 00:29:00.049
when it was Ricochet with Andy Packer and Emily Branford.
674
00:29:00.329 --> 00:29:00.970
What a team.
675
00:29:01.589 --> 00:29:04.799
And prior to that, Bronnie James and the wonderful Kate Fryer,
676
00:29:04.819 --> 00:29:07.740
who's an amazing acrobat, I think in Melbourne now. She
677
00:29:07.779 --> 00:29:11.119
just runs her own company. Working with those people, we
678
00:29:11.140 --> 00:29:14.140
were sort of building, we were writing the shows, we
679
00:29:14.180 --> 00:29:17.799
were creating the shows, we were performing them, we were
680
00:29:17.859 --> 00:29:21.799
co-directing them and finding the moments that worked and finding
681
00:29:21.900 --> 00:29:26.930
out what, finding out how you entertain children without boring
682
00:29:26.970 --> 00:29:29.839
yourself or the people who actually book the show, the teachers,
683
00:29:30.640 --> 00:29:33.900
and through that sort of thing and then getting to direct,
684
00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:38.950
I do think it does change your view of acting
685
00:29:38.990 --> 00:29:39.529
a tiny bit.
686
00:29:39.579 --> 00:29:41.400
And I think it gives you a bit more, a.
687
00:29:43.119 --> 00:29:45.799
Better overview, obviously, because you're the director and you're having
688
00:29:45.839 --> 00:29:49.250
to control everything. And I think it's also a really
689
00:29:49.269 --> 00:29:51.430
good thing for my own discipline because there are those
690
00:29:51.470 --> 00:29:53.230
moments where you're on stage and you're like, well, why
691
00:29:53.269 --> 00:29:55.470
is my character doing this?
692
00:29:55.559 --> 00:29:58.460
And you're like, you know what? Your director is dealing.
693
00:29:58.220 --> 00:30:01.579
With 17, 20, however many actors, and they all want
694
00:30:01.619 --> 00:30:03.920
to know why they're doing this. And it's kind of like,
695
00:30:04.000 --> 00:30:06.380
I just need you to stand there so you're in
696
00:30:06.400 --> 00:30:08.720
the light and say your fucking line and make it
697
00:30:08.740 --> 00:30:10.329
make sense so we can get on with the rest
698
00:30:10.369 --> 00:30:15.210
of the show. That's a massive, like, generalization and an
699
00:30:15.250 --> 00:30:17.789
exaggeration but it does do you think it made you
700
00:30:17.809 --> 00:30:20.569
a better i think it's like now it's again it
701
00:30:20.609 --> 00:30:22.349
comes back to that discipline it's another one of those
702
00:30:22.390 --> 00:30:25.109
discipline things where you sit at the end of rehearsal
703
00:30:25.269 --> 00:30:28.059
and you get notes and you are given a note
704
00:30:28.319 --> 00:30:30.880
and you go thank you and you shut the fuck
705
00:30:30.940 --> 00:30:33.059
up and you take your note and then later on
706
00:30:33.339 --> 00:30:36.299
when you're not holding up the entire cast and crew
707
00:30:36.359 --> 00:30:38.420
from going home you go to the director and say
708
00:30:38.460 --> 00:30:41.240
i don't really understand what you meant by this or
709
00:30:41.579 --> 00:30:43.279
do you think maybe my character can do this and
710
00:30:43.299 --> 00:30:44.619
you approach it differently but.
711
00:30:44.579 --> 00:30:46.059
You don't hate it when you don't get notes at
712
00:30:46.099 --> 00:30:48.650
the end oh that yes that's drives me crazy like
713
00:30:48.670 --> 00:30:50.890
it's like i want to know just before we jump
714
00:30:50.930 --> 00:30:53.289
into the next rehearsal i want to know now so
715
00:30:53.309 --> 00:30:55.430
that i can think about it for two days and
716
00:30:55.490 --> 00:30:56.589
process it and go how do.
717
00:30:56.569 --> 00:30:58.049
I make it work i just want like a tick
718
00:30:58.250 --> 00:31:01.430
like or just some some sort of acknowledgement good do
719
00:31:01.470 --> 00:31:04.549
that dave sims is brilliant yeah dave sims will never
720
00:31:04.589 --> 00:31:07.740
leave you hanging he always lets you know what's really good,
721
00:31:07.880 --> 00:31:09.519
and then we'll give you that little bit of constructive
722
00:31:09.869 --> 00:31:12.289
criticism to help you with the next performance. Do you find, like,
723
00:31:12.410 --> 00:31:14.380
if you do something that you weren't even aware of,
724
00:31:14.990 --> 00:31:18.329
and then they're like, Josh, do that again. And then
725
00:31:18.390 --> 00:31:19.250
you're like, I.
726
00:31:19.250 --> 00:31:22.160
Don't know what that was. And now I'm thinking about it.
727
00:31:22.950 --> 00:31:27.480
All the time. But many, many times I've been in
728
00:31:27.500 --> 00:31:30.809
shows where, you are told if your director doesn't say
729
00:31:30.849 --> 00:31:32.609
anything to you, it means you're doing okay.
730
00:31:32.829 --> 00:31:35.430
Yeah. And you have to kind of suck it up
731
00:31:35.509 --> 00:31:38.109
and leave with that going. Was it okay? Yeah. Yeah.
732
00:31:38.410 --> 00:31:40.059
Yeah. Especially when you have somebody.
733
00:31:40.079 --> 00:31:41.519
I guess we are a little insecure at the end
734
00:31:41.539 --> 00:31:42.299
of the day.
735
00:31:42.339 --> 00:31:43.420
Very. Yeah.
736
00:31:43.640 --> 00:31:47.359
Absolute king of that. Would you direct anytime soon?
737
00:31:47.859 --> 00:31:49.519
Yes. Yes. Yeah.
738
00:31:49.640 --> 00:31:53.369
Yes. I'd love to co-direct with Angela again because that
739
00:31:53.390 --> 00:31:55.730
was a joy. We worked really well together. We were
740
00:31:55.750 --> 00:31:57.019
really good at balancing each other.
741
00:31:57.039 --> 00:31:58.950
And you were good with young actors too.
742
00:31:59.619 --> 00:32:02.420
It was lovely, that show, because there's so many people
743
00:32:02.480 --> 00:32:07.299
that are now all over the theatre in Adelaide. That
744
00:32:07.339 --> 00:32:10.339
was the first time I came across them, like Matt Chapman,
745
00:32:11.220 --> 00:32:16.640
like Bonnie McAllister, like Annie Matsouliadis, Olivia Jane Parker, all
746
00:32:16.660 --> 00:32:20.720
these people who are now really so passionate embedded in
747
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:24.279
Adelaide Theatre and are just so great and bring so
748
00:32:24.319 --> 00:32:27.450
much to it. And getting to be on the ground
749
00:32:27.529 --> 00:32:30.609
floor of where they started. I think that's what I
750
00:32:30.650 --> 00:32:33.410
love about the Guild sometimes. I mean, you're on the
751
00:32:33.450 --> 00:32:34.170
board with the Guild.
752
00:32:34.470 --> 00:32:34.890
Yes.
753
00:32:35.289 --> 00:32:39.539
Because that's where I started. And it is a place where... Because,
754
00:32:39.640 --> 00:32:42.720
I mean, you've got a catchment of university students that
755
00:32:42.779 --> 00:32:44.059
are keen about theatre.
756
00:32:44.299 --> 00:32:44.519
Yeah.
757
00:32:44.759 --> 00:32:47.059
And you just get to work with people and then
758
00:32:47.099 --> 00:32:48.500
you grow up with, basically.
759
00:32:48.660 --> 00:32:51.109
Yeah. In 10 years' time, you're still working together.
760
00:32:51.119 --> 00:32:53.450
But jumping back to, like, doing joint directing.
761
00:32:53.769 --> 00:32:56.430
Yeah. How do you get on the same page as that?
762
00:32:56.450 --> 00:33:00.210
Because if you're differing on a certain scene or a
763
00:33:00.289 --> 00:33:01.589
casting or whatever, how do you.
764
00:33:01.750 --> 00:33:03.609
I mean, Angela's amazing, right?
765
00:33:03.650 --> 00:33:06.529
Beautiful, lovely. So that's going to be very easy. But
766
00:33:06.549 --> 00:33:10.549
it could also be... Very fraught with... Well, it was
767
00:33:10.589 --> 00:33:14.160
never fraught with us. It was funny. I mean, we did.
768
00:33:14.059 --> 00:33:18.559
Actually spend, I think, a solid year getting together either
769
00:33:18.579 --> 00:33:20.319
at her place or my place with the script and
770
00:33:20.339 --> 00:33:23.250
pulling it apart and coming to our decisions about what
771
00:33:23.289 --> 00:33:24.769
we wanted and how we were going to go. But
772
00:33:24.829 --> 00:33:27.470
once you actually get into rehearsal, yes, things would change.
773
00:33:27.950 --> 00:33:28.089
And.
774
00:33:28.769 --> 00:33:32.329
like suggestions would get made and it turned into almost
775
00:33:32.349 --> 00:33:35.470
like this weird comedy routine where Angela would say, oh,
776
00:33:35.630 --> 00:33:37.339
we can do this. And I'd go, oh yeah, let's
777
00:33:37.359 --> 00:33:38.690
try that. And then she'd go, oh, and we can
778
00:33:38.710 --> 00:33:40.420
do this. And we'd go, oh yeah, we could try that.
779
00:33:40.440 --> 00:33:41.819
And then it'd be, oh, and we can try.
780
00:33:41.839 --> 00:33:42.720
And then I'd just go, no.
781
00:33:43.140 --> 00:33:43.299
Yeah.
782
00:33:43.400 --> 00:33:45.180
Because it would just be like, she would push it
783
00:33:45.220 --> 00:33:46.579
and push it and push it. And then I would
784
00:33:46.599 --> 00:33:49.099
be the one who had to say, that's one step
785
00:33:49.140 --> 00:33:51.480
too far. Let's come back. And then we'd find this lovely,
786
00:33:51.519 --> 00:33:53.920
happy medium. But we just had a ball working together.
787
00:33:53.980 --> 00:33:54.460
It was really.
788
00:33:54.519 --> 00:33:57.289
How do you know when enough is enough for a scene? That,
789
00:33:57.390 --> 00:34:01.730
for me, is purely instinctual. It's like when I go
790
00:34:01.769 --> 00:34:03.549
and see a piece of theatre or stuff like that,
791
00:34:04.309 --> 00:34:08.230
I will have a moment where my brain just goes, yeah,
792
00:34:08.269 --> 00:34:12.210
that last one was too much. The last, what's the
793
00:34:12.369 --> 00:34:15.329
three gag rule? You do get the joke three times.
794
00:34:16.030 --> 00:34:18.010
If it turns up a fourth or a fifth time,
795
00:34:18.070 --> 00:34:20.260
it's like, it's not funny.
796
00:34:20.280 --> 00:34:23.059
It can't be fourth or fifth. If it's 100, it's
797
00:34:23.139 --> 00:34:24.579
hilarious on the last one.
798
00:34:24.760 --> 00:34:24.980
Yeah.
799
00:34:25.019 --> 00:34:28.530
But you've got to slog your way through.
800
00:34:28.550 --> 00:34:30.829
You've really got to get through that. And there are
801
00:34:30.869 --> 00:34:32.789
other things where I would just go, no, I wouldn't
802
00:34:32.809 --> 00:34:36.349
have done that. And that's just, it's instinct and it's taste.
803
00:34:36.429 --> 00:34:36.949
And it's taste.
804
00:34:36.969 --> 00:34:37.650
It's my taste.
805
00:34:37.710 --> 00:34:41.590
It's authenticity, isn't it? There's that too. Yeah. Yeah.
806
00:34:42.630 --> 00:34:45.050
Real is important.
807
00:34:45.170 --> 00:34:46.469
Would a human say that?
808
00:34:46.989 --> 00:34:52.300
Yeah. Yeah. And that's, yeah. I will actually turn down
809
00:34:52.360 --> 00:34:54.750
plays if I read plays and I don't like the dialogue.
810
00:34:55.679 --> 00:35:00.780
Well, you're a very sought-after actor. Are you someone who
811
00:35:00.880 --> 00:35:03.420
has to read the script first or do you.
812
00:35:03.860 --> 00:35:04.739
Oh, almost.
813
00:35:05.139 --> 00:35:06.960
Yeah, okay. I still....
814
00:35:08.059 --> 00:35:10.260
For a long time, it was basically, oh, I know
815
00:35:10.300 --> 00:35:12.619
who these people are. I love working with these people.
816
00:35:12.639 --> 00:35:13.000
I'll do it.
817
00:35:13.039 --> 00:35:15.239
And I'm still easily sucked in.
818
00:35:15.500 --> 00:35:15.739
Yes.
819
00:35:16.179 --> 00:35:19.380
We've sucked you in a few times.
820
00:35:19.460 --> 00:35:21.820
Yes, and that will probably continue to happen. But there
821
00:35:21.860 --> 00:35:24.409
are other times where I'll have somebody say... okay, here's
822
00:35:24.449 --> 00:35:27.269
a show and I'll be like, right, I would like to, yes,
823
00:35:27.309 --> 00:35:28.789
I would love to read that script and I'll sit
824
00:35:28.809 --> 00:35:31.280
down and I'll read the script. What are you looking for?
825
00:35:31.699 --> 00:35:35.380
I've either got to find the character that I can
826
00:35:35.460 --> 00:35:37.000
find a character in there and I go, oh, yes,
827
00:35:37.059 --> 00:35:38.949
I can play that and I can do something really
828
00:35:39.030 --> 00:35:39.610
nice with that.
829
00:35:40.429 --> 00:35:43.739
But at the same time... I was asked to be
830
00:35:43.960 --> 00:35:44.820
in a show.
831
00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:46.980
I won't say who it is or anything. It's a
832
00:35:47.019 --> 00:35:48.260
person I highly respect.
833
00:35:48.300 --> 00:35:50.659
Come on, tell me. Let's talk about it.
834
00:35:51.219 --> 00:35:53.050
It's a company that I've worked with before and I
835
00:35:53.269 --> 00:35:56.210
absolutely love their work and I knew I would be
836
00:35:56.250 --> 00:35:58.369
working with a bunch of people that I really would
837
00:35:58.630 --> 00:36:00.869
love working with and I sat down and I read
838
00:36:00.889 --> 00:36:02.250
the script and I got to the end of the
839
00:36:02.289 --> 00:36:04.250
script and I just went, This is not for me.
840
00:36:04.469 --> 00:36:07.050
This does not. I'm like, where is, there's got to
841
00:36:07.070 --> 00:36:07.809
be something.
842
00:36:08.250 --> 00:36:10.690
And I have, I look forward to going and seeing
843
00:36:10.730 --> 00:36:14.179
this production when it actually happens and seeing what the
844
00:36:14.219 --> 00:36:18.400
director does with it. But on first read, I was
845
00:36:18.480 --> 00:36:21.699
like this, for me, it didn't say anything. It wasn't
846
00:36:21.800 --> 00:36:25.329
going anywhere. And I'll be fascinated to know what, can
847
00:36:25.369 --> 00:36:27.170
be brought out of it. You just hope it's not
848
00:36:27.210 --> 00:36:28.650
one of those moments where you see it and go, oh,
849
00:36:28.670 --> 00:36:29.780
my God, it's fucking amazing.
850
00:36:29.820 --> 00:36:31.880
I should have been in this show.
851
00:36:31.940 --> 00:36:34.420
I'd actually be wrapped if that happened. I'd be really happy.
852
00:36:34.500 --> 00:36:36.230
I would not be disappointed that I wasn't in it.
853
00:36:36.280 --> 00:36:38.579
I'd be really happy that they were able to take this,
854
00:36:38.619 --> 00:36:40.780
what I think is a very clunky script, and turn
855
00:36:40.800 --> 00:36:42.679
it into something special. That would be awesome.
856
00:36:42.980 --> 00:36:45.739
You're watering me.
857
00:36:46.349 --> 00:36:49.269
Is there a certain type of role you think you
858
00:36:49.289 --> 00:36:53.059
tend to get? I used to be, certainly in the
859
00:36:53.139 --> 00:36:54.099
early days, they used.
860
00:36:54.000 --> 00:36:56.159
To go, oh, Gary does comedy. Gary's really good at comedy.
861
00:36:56.199 --> 00:36:56.909
I'll throw Gary into that.
862
00:36:56.949 --> 00:36:58.849
You are really good at comedy.
863
00:36:59.050 --> 00:37:04.929
And for a long time, it was kind of the
864
00:37:04.949 --> 00:37:07.309
go-to thing for most people was Gary George, give him
865
00:37:07.329 --> 00:37:11.070
a good big funny role, he'll nail it. I very
866
00:37:11.150 --> 00:37:16.690
quickly discovered that that is rapidly diminishing returns for my audience.
867
00:37:17.030 --> 00:37:17.909
My point of view, yes, I.
868
00:37:17.849 --> 00:37:18.329
Can make it.
869
00:37:18.349 --> 00:37:19.230
What does that mean?
870
00:37:19.510 --> 00:37:20.190
Where's the challenge?
871
00:37:20.670 --> 00:37:25.070
Yeah, there's no challenge, and it's like once you've got
872
00:37:25.090 --> 00:37:27.329
your comic timing and you find where the jokes land,
873
00:37:27.610 --> 00:37:29.510
you kind of, with a lot of stuff, I find
874
00:37:29.539 --> 00:37:33.460
that sometimes there's not much else to do with the character. Mm-hmm.
875
00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:36.619
But I did a show, very early on I was
876
00:37:36.659 --> 00:37:38.420
given a show that would.
877
00:37:38.320 --> 00:37:41.099
Be a combination of that, right? That would be a
878
00:37:41.139 --> 00:37:43.980
role that you played in both.
879
00:37:43.960 --> 00:37:46.579
The comic and the... But it's completely.
880
00:37:46.619 --> 00:37:48.380
The comedy was in the fact that you were playing
881
00:37:48.420 --> 00:37:49.579
it dead straight.
882
00:37:49.760 --> 00:37:54.440
Yeah. That was because for the main character in The Goat.
883
00:37:54.500 --> 00:37:57.179
For those who don't know Sylvia or The Goat, it's
884
00:37:57.219 --> 00:37:58.360
about a guy that fucks a goat.
885
00:37:59.949 --> 00:38:03.760
And for him... Party.
886
00:38:05.579 --> 00:38:09.219
But I played that the way, and that was exactly
887
00:38:09.280 --> 00:38:14.760
what Matt Houston, the director, wanted, is everything in that
888
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:19.719
play was played 100% for real. So for me, my
889
00:38:19.780 --> 00:38:24.269
character was completely convinced that he had fallen in love
890
00:38:24.289 --> 00:38:26.469
with a goat and that this goat was fully in
891
00:38:26.510 --> 00:38:28.460
love with him. He still loved his wife.
892
00:38:28.639 --> 00:38:33.360
You're the one fucking the goat. Exactly. Dirty bit. But
893
00:38:33.400 --> 00:38:36.739
the way that was funny and funny.
894
00:38:36.579 --> 00:38:40.139
To a point, because, you know, Albie, it's like twist funny,
895
00:38:40.739 --> 00:38:42.949
is that it was played completely real.
896
00:38:42.969 --> 00:38:46.570
As opposed to big, funny comedy where you are just
897
00:38:46.630 --> 00:38:47.190
playing for laughs.
898
00:38:47.210 --> 00:38:49.789
I laugh harder when people play it straight in a
899
00:38:49.889 --> 00:38:51.150
completely absurd.
900
00:38:50.829 --> 00:38:51.690
Situation, I think.
901
00:38:52.579 --> 00:38:55.090
I get more, I love playing comedy and I love
902
00:38:55.750 --> 00:38:59.110
doing comedy, but I get a lot more satisfaction as
903
00:38:59.130 --> 00:38:59.789
an actor.
904
00:38:59.590 --> 00:39:01.969
From a straight role. Yeah, me too.
905
00:39:02.110 --> 00:39:05.179
What's been your favourite drama role that you've played?
906
00:39:06.579 --> 00:39:08.059
Because you did Speaking in Tongues.
907
00:39:08.199 --> 00:39:12.460
Speaking in Tongues was amazing. But that was Jeff, working
908
00:39:12.480 --> 00:39:15.840
with Jeff up at Stirling and like the most amazing cast.
909
00:39:16.480 --> 00:39:18.300
Cast of four. Who else is with you now?
910
00:39:18.340 --> 00:39:19.030
Georgia Stockham.
911
00:39:19.489 --> 00:39:20.309
Great actress.
912
00:39:20.389 --> 00:39:21.969
Nikki Rutte. She's okay.
913
00:39:21.989 --> 00:39:25.949
Tim Williams. Yeah, Nikki's all right.
914
00:39:26.150 --> 00:39:29.510
That was a beautiful, beautiful play, and the way that
915
00:39:29.610 --> 00:39:31.860
Jeff did it. it and the lighting and everything, it
916
00:39:31.880 --> 00:39:35.579
was just so fantastic. Everyone played multiple roles and it
917
00:39:35.619 --> 00:39:37.280
was just the overlapping dialogue.
918
00:39:37.300 --> 00:39:37.880
It was hell.
919
00:39:37.940 --> 00:39:38.940
How was that to learn?
920
00:39:39.199 --> 00:39:41.530
It was nightmare. It was an absolute nightmare.
921
00:39:41.550 --> 00:39:45.590
It was incredibly difficult. And we were coming in. We
922
00:39:45.610 --> 00:39:47.800
were coming in like an hour or two before rehearsals
923
00:39:48.139 --> 00:39:51.039
just to go over the lines. That's one big scene,
924
00:39:51.099 --> 00:39:55.019
isn't it, in the show? The opening scene is particularly.
925
00:39:55.039 --> 00:39:56.409
It's grueling.
926
00:39:56.570 --> 00:40:01.050
It's murderous because you're saying things at the same time
927
00:40:01.110 --> 00:40:03.929
as other people but then with a tiny.
928
00:40:03.849 --> 00:40:05.929
Slight difference at certain points.
929
00:40:06.190 --> 00:40:06.860
And, yeah, that was.
930
00:40:07.539 --> 00:40:09.659
But if you get that kind of stuff right, you've
931
00:40:09.679 --> 00:40:12.000
just got the audience, right? Like the first half hour,
932
00:40:12.019 --> 00:40:13.940
you bang, everyone's like, wow.
933
00:40:14.219 --> 00:40:18.760
My favourite role of yours was Bull Garkov in Collaborators.
934
00:40:19.179 --> 00:40:22.119
I have mixed feelings about that show. I absolutely loved
935
00:40:22.159 --> 00:40:24.099
that show because it was a glorious cast. I loved
936
00:40:24.139 --> 00:40:26.000
working again at Sterling and with Megan.
937
00:40:26.039 --> 00:40:27.219
That was one of my favourite shows.
938
00:40:27.300 --> 00:40:30.710
It was a beautiful show, but... I was never off stage.
939
00:40:30.869 --> 00:40:34.219
I was on stage from start to finish. And so
940
00:40:34.239 --> 00:40:35.949
it was like all these people were having these wonderful
941
00:40:35.989 --> 00:40:38.139
conversations about the great fun they're having in the dressing room.
942
00:40:38.179 --> 00:40:39.219
I'm like, what fun?
943
00:40:39.400 --> 00:40:41.019
I put my costume on. I went on stage and
944
00:40:41.039 --> 00:40:43.139
that was it. Was that the first time you did
945
00:40:43.159 --> 00:40:43.900
a role like that?
946
00:40:43.920 --> 00:40:46.559
I think that was probably the biggest.
947
00:40:46.639 --> 00:40:51.159
No, I shouldn't say that. That's silly. Because in 1991,
948
00:40:51.159 --> 00:40:53.019
I did Goethe's Faust.
949
00:40:53.059 --> 00:40:54.199
Good Lord.
950
00:40:54.559 --> 00:40:56.059
And we did the entire play.
951
00:40:56.420 --> 00:40:57.000
We learned.
952
00:40:58.070 --> 00:41:01.239
The entire play uncut, and then just before we went on,
953
00:41:01.570 --> 00:41:03.519
it took out like an hour and a half of
954
00:41:03.579 --> 00:41:04.320
stuff or something.
955
00:41:04.340 --> 00:41:04.619
What?
956
00:41:04.920 --> 00:41:07.329
And then we went, yeah, like weeks before we went on.
957
00:41:07.380 --> 00:41:08.079
Why? Who did that?
958
00:41:08.239 --> 00:41:11.059
Because the play ran for.
959
00:41:10.099 --> 00:41:11.519
Three hours on the rest. Why ruin it if they're
960
00:41:11.539 --> 00:41:12.159
just going to cut it?
961
00:41:12.900 --> 00:41:15.239
Crap happens. Who was the director?
962
00:41:15.260 --> 00:41:15.329
Who?
963
00:41:17.989 --> 00:41:19.670
It was Warwick Cooper directed it and he had very
964
00:41:19.710 --> 00:41:22.969
good reasons for cutting it. But it was very hard
965
00:41:23.010 --> 00:41:24.380
on some of the actors who lost some of their
966
00:41:25.219 --> 00:41:27.780
scenes that they'd been working on. But it was the
967
00:41:27.860 --> 00:41:31.750
nature of it and it was such a massively epic show.
968
00:41:32.199 --> 00:41:36.159
We had three different actors playing Gretchen, the sort of
969
00:41:36.199 --> 00:41:40.019
lead female role. There were two different actors playing Mephistopheles,
970
00:41:40.420 --> 00:41:41.639
and there was me playing Faust.
971
00:41:41.860 --> 00:41:43.989
Why were they two?
972
00:41:44.070 --> 00:41:47.090
To give everyone a break. And to let them have
973
00:41:48.369 --> 00:41:52.469
to play. And also because it was also a joint
974
00:41:52.510 --> 00:41:56.280
production between McGill Uni and.
975
00:41:57.639 --> 00:42:00.099
And there was a second director who was involved as well.
976
00:42:00.139 --> 00:42:02.769
Oh, God, this sounds really kind of complicated. And so
977
00:42:02.809 --> 00:42:05.769
there was, like, there were two different Gretchens and then
978
00:42:05.809 --> 00:42:09.170
there became a third and then there were two different Mephistopheles.
979
00:42:09.389 --> 00:42:10.550
So they were each taking their half.
980
00:42:10.570 --> 00:42:13.070
You would have had your preferences. You don't have to
981
00:42:13.090 --> 00:42:14.949
name names, but you definitely would have had my favourites.
982
00:42:14.969 --> 00:42:15.280
I didn't.
983
00:42:15.300 --> 00:42:16.469
There was, like, I.
984
00:42:17.360 --> 00:42:18.300
I didn't really.
985
00:42:18.360 --> 00:42:21.980
Come on. You're trying for your scoop here.
986
00:42:22.079 --> 00:42:24.559
I had three different Gretchen's and there were things I
987
00:42:24.860 --> 00:42:27.599
really liked and things I didn't like about working with
988
00:42:27.739 --> 00:42:28.179
each of them.
989
00:42:28.500 --> 00:42:29.099
Well, poor them.
990
00:42:29.119 --> 00:42:31.579
They only got one of you. And it was awful too.
991
00:42:31.760 --> 00:42:32.360
It was really.
992
00:42:32.619 --> 00:42:34.079
That's a translated play.
993
00:42:34.159 --> 00:42:37.159
So the dialogue, even after being translated.
994
00:42:37.179 --> 00:42:38.440
It was like learning a phone book.
995
00:42:38.559 --> 00:42:41.340
And I actually got to the point in that show
996
00:42:41.900 --> 00:42:46.030
where I could learn an entire page of dialogue in
997
00:42:46.070 --> 00:42:46.349
an hour.
998
00:42:47.110 --> 00:42:47.409
Really?
999
00:42:47.429 --> 00:42:50.190
I could pour it into my brain. I could just go.
1000
00:42:50.530 --> 00:42:52.639
This is why we should do Marlowe's Dr.
1001
00:42:52.679 --> 00:42:53.219
Faustus.
1002
00:42:53.320 --> 00:42:54.340
It's much shorter.
1003
00:42:55.739 --> 00:43:00.130
What's the show about? Basically, Faust is a morality tale.
1004
00:43:00.630 --> 00:43:02.190
He sells his soul to the devil.
1005
00:43:02.289 --> 00:43:06.380
Yeah, he's an academic who's lived his entire life and
1006
00:43:06.389 --> 00:43:10.119
he's getting old, but he feels he's never actually experienced
1007
00:43:10.179 --> 00:43:13.280
life and along rocks up the devil and says, well, hey,
1008
00:43:13.340 --> 00:43:15.139
I'll make you young and I'll give you all the things.
1009
00:43:15.000 --> 00:43:16.340
You really want. All you've got to do is give
1010
00:43:16.360 --> 00:43:17.019
me your soul.
1011
00:43:17.239 --> 00:43:20.380
And so off he goes and experiences all this stuff
1012
00:43:20.400 --> 00:43:22.900
while the devil's having this bargain with God and God's like, no,
1013
00:43:22.940 --> 00:43:23.380
it's mine now.
1014
00:43:23.400 --> 00:43:27.070
So having done the show, if you were given the same... Opportunity,
1015
00:43:27.090 --> 00:43:27.730
what would you do?
1016
00:43:27.750 --> 00:43:31.739
I think I would say no now.
1017
00:43:32.099 --> 00:43:32.280
No.
1018
00:43:32.300 --> 00:43:34.019
Purely because that was.
1019
00:43:35.440 --> 00:43:37.719
I can't learn a page of dialogue an hour now.
1020
00:43:37.840 --> 00:43:39.840
No, no, I'm talking about the actual would you give
1021
00:43:39.880 --> 00:43:42.250
your soul... Oh, would I give my soul to the
1022
00:43:42.289 --> 00:43:44.070
devil to have more fun? Yeah.
1023
00:43:44.389 --> 00:43:48.170
Well, this took a turn. Well, I'll draw up a contract.
1024
00:43:48.190 --> 00:43:48.449
Hang on.
1025
00:43:49.469 --> 00:43:52.710
Being a lifelong atheist, I'd first be very, very surprised
1026
00:43:53.369 --> 00:43:56.610
if the devil turned up and offered me something. I think, however,
1027
00:43:56.730 --> 00:43:59.889
having done the play and just yet, and no, I
1028
00:43:59.909 --> 00:44:00.550
think I'd say no.
1029
00:44:00.889 --> 00:44:01.150
Okay.
1030
00:44:01.309 --> 00:44:03.860
I think I'd say no. It's like, you know, fine
1031
00:44:03.889 --> 00:44:05.570
if there is nothing afterwards and you might as well
1032
00:44:05.590 --> 00:44:07.539
have fun now. But generally speaking, it was to the
1033
00:44:07.599 --> 00:44:09.940
detriment of other people and that takes the gloss off
1034
00:44:09.980 --> 00:44:10.679
immediately for me.
1035
00:44:11.329 --> 00:44:14.199
Right, okay. And then you'd have to die immensely, right? Well,
1036
00:44:14.219 --> 00:44:15.199
of course, you still have to die.
1037
00:44:15.280 --> 00:44:16.320
And then go to hell.
1038
00:44:16.780 --> 00:44:18.960
Yeah, and suffer for eternity. So, you know.
1039
00:44:19.420 --> 00:44:20.880
It's Germany's favourite play.
1040
00:44:22.320 --> 00:44:27.400
I'm not alone. How is that measured, though? How is
1041
00:44:27.420 --> 00:44:27.860
that measured?
1042
00:44:27.940 --> 00:44:29.050
Is that their favourite place?
1043
00:44:29.090 --> 00:44:31.210
No, no, no. It's like everyone in Germany, they say,
1044
00:44:31.230 --> 00:44:32.670
what's your favourite place?
1045
00:44:33.309 --> 00:44:37.050
It's one of the most famous German works in German literature.
1046
00:44:37.210 --> 00:44:38.110
I've never heard of it.
1047
00:44:38.190 --> 00:44:38.530
Really?
1048
00:44:38.820 --> 00:44:41.039
Yeah, but I'm not as intellectual as you two.
1049
00:44:41.179 --> 00:44:41.280
Okay.
1050
00:44:41.300 --> 00:44:41.960
Yeah, yeah.
1051
00:44:42.099 --> 00:44:42.340
All right.
1052
00:44:42.659 --> 00:44:45.610
Well, let's... What else have you got?
1053
00:44:46.780 --> 00:44:49.650
Well, I want to know how did you meet Eleanor?
1054
00:44:50.329 --> 00:44:52.690
Oh, yes. Oh, my God, doesn't everybody know this story?
1055
00:44:52.829 --> 00:44:54.210
Yeah, but we haven't recorded it.
1056
00:44:54.230 --> 00:44:56.070
But this is for posterity.
1057
00:44:56.429 --> 00:44:58.590
Back in the day, this was back when I was
1058
00:44:58.610 --> 00:45:02.250
doing children's CSR and I was working with Ricochet.
1059
00:45:02.309 --> 00:45:04.750
Oh, my God, she wasn't one of the kids, was she? Oh, please.
1060
00:45:08.489 --> 00:45:14.110
And basically my phone number was the theatre company's phone number.
1061
00:45:14.780 --> 00:45:19.380
And we were doing, like, touring in Victoria, in South Australia,
1062
00:45:19.420 --> 00:45:23.320
in Queensland. It was constant. And at the same time,
1063
00:45:23.340 --> 00:45:25.219
I was doing guild shows as well. So I was
1064
00:45:25.260 --> 00:45:28.280
rehearsing in the evenings and doing this craziness. And I
1065
00:45:28.539 --> 00:45:30.920
was just going a bit mental.
1066
00:45:31.519 --> 00:45:34.440
And my beautiful mum and my sister. What are their names?
1067
00:45:35.619 --> 00:45:36.320
Mum was Beryl.
1068
00:45:37.079 --> 00:45:39.400
And this was my sister, Karen. I also have another
1069
00:45:39.440 --> 00:45:40.400
lovely sister, Sanya.
1070
00:45:41.079 --> 00:45:42.800
But both Karen and mum.
1071
00:45:44.070 --> 00:45:46.489
Were really concerned about me and they were saying, you
1072
00:45:46.530 --> 00:45:48.610
need to take a break, you need a holiday. And
1073
00:45:49.090 --> 00:45:51.230
it just happened that there was a Doctor Who convention
1074
00:45:51.590 --> 00:45:55.690
in Sydney and the wonderful actress Elizabeth Slayton, who plays
1075
00:45:55.750 --> 00:45:59.409
my favourite companion in the show, Sarah Jane Smith, was
1076
00:45:59.469 --> 00:46:01.929
coming to Australia. And so it was like, all right,
1077
00:46:02.099 --> 00:46:03.639
I'll take a break, I'll go to Sydney and I'll
1078
00:46:03.679 --> 00:46:05.380
go to this, I've never been to a convention before,
1079
00:46:05.420 --> 00:46:08.019
I'll go to a convention and I'll meet Elizabeth Slayton.
1080
00:46:08.039 --> 00:46:08.980
Doctor Who convention.
1081
00:46:09.059 --> 00:46:09.800
Doctor Who convention.
1082
00:46:10.559 --> 00:46:11.920
Did I know you were such a geek?
1083
00:46:12.199 --> 00:46:13.199
I'm a total geek, mate.
1084
00:46:13.239 --> 00:46:16.139
Oh, my God. Have you met Gary? Yeah, but like.
1085
00:46:16.409 --> 00:46:18.230
Don't you see my T-shirts?
1086
00:46:19.630 --> 00:46:22.530
And yeah, so I went over to Sydney. I flew
1087
00:46:22.550 --> 00:46:25.170
over to Sydney and I went to this convention and
1088
00:46:25.230 --> 00:46:27.989
there were. all sorts there as you can imagine yeah
1089
00:46:28.090 --> 00:46:29.710
it would be fun it would be pretty cool it
1090
00:46:29.730 --> 00:46:31.989
was fun but it was really intimidating.
1091
00:46:31.349 --> 00:46:33.670
For me this thing would be over simulating.
1092
00:46:33.230 --> 00:46:34.750
It was kind of it's cool when you're sort of
1093
00:46:34.789 --> 00:46:36.389
walking into a hotel and you find you're in a
1094
00:46:36.449 --> 00:46:39.969
foyer full of daleks yeah this is awesome and but
1095
00:46:40.369 --> 00:46:42.429
there was also a whole bunch everybody knew each other
1096
00:46:42.469 --> 00:46:44.590
because they were all from the various fan clubs and
1097
00:46:44.610 --> 00:46:46.289
they all knew each other and i didn't know anyone
1098
00:46:46.719 --> 00:46:49.000
And there were like, there were people, people in costume
1099
00:46:49.039 --> 00:46:50.699
and I'm like a bit freaked out. And there was,
1100
00:46:50.860 --> 00:46:52.800
there was even a lady there who would never cut
1101
00:46:52.960 --> 00:46:54.280
the fingernails on one hand.
1102
00:46:54.539 --> 00:46:55.119
Oh God.
1103
00:46:55.139 --> 00:46:58.769
Just like these weird curly, curly things. And I'm just like, man,
1104
00:46:58.809 --> 00:47:00.130
this place is full of strength.
1105
00:47:00.190 --> 00:47:03.329
Did you dress up? No, I didn't. Um, and then, uh,
1106
00:47:03.349 --> 00:47:06.269
the first, the first thing in an unholy.
1107
00:47:05.829 --> 00:47:09.789
Land, the first, the first, um, the very first thing
1108
00:47:09.849 --> 00:47:12.630
of the, of the convention was a trivia night. And
1109
00:47:12.710 --> 00:47:14.590
so they were all having their tables and all the
1110
00:47:14.610 --> 00:47:16.210
people who knew each other were gathering at the tables.
1111
00:47:16.710 --> 00:47:18.090
And I was just like, oh, God, where am I
1112
00:47:18.110 --> 00:47:19.130
going to sit? Where am I going to sit? And
1113
00:47:19.150 --> 00:47:22.389
I went, she looks nice. And I sat down next
1114
00:47:22.409 --> 00:47:26.829
to Eleanor. Did you get on the first night? We
1115
00:47:29.150 --> 00:47:30.639
got on very well on the first night.
1116
00:47:30.679 --> 00:47:34.079
Good boy. Thank you, fool.
1117
00:47:34.300 --> 00:47:38.539
But no, basically she bumped knees with me and her
1118
00:47:38.599 --> 00:47:40.559
jokes were hilarious and we.
1119
00:47:40.480 --> 00:47:43.349
Seemed to have a similar sense of humour and Yeah,
1120
00:47:43.630 --> 00:47:47.469
then basically it was a ridiculous long-distance relationship for a
1121
00:47:47.510 --> 00:47:51.659
number of years before she eventually moved to South Australia. Yeah. Yeah.
1122
00:47:51.840 --> 00:47:55.699
And now is working for the library at the university.
1123
00:47:55.880 --> 00:47:55.980
Yep.
1124
00:47:56.429 --> 00:47:59.489
Is responsible for a lot of theatre tickets being sold.
1125
00:48:00.449 --> 00:48:03.110
Is this true?
1126
00:48:03.159 --> 00:48:04.840
She sees every single show?
1127
00:48:04.860 --> 00:48:08.679
No, no, no. This is crazy behaviour, right? She is
1128
00:48:09.099 --> 00:48:10.059
the most.
1129
00:48:09.900 --> 00:48:13.969
Supportive partner you could possibly imagine when it comes to theatre.
1130
00:48:14.530 --> 00:48:17.849
And I even browbeat her into joining the board of
1131
00:48:17.869 --> 00:48:20.449
the Guild. Purely because I would come home from guild
1132
00:48:20.469 --> 00:48:23.090
board meetings and have a whinge and she would give
1133
00:48:23.110 --> 00:48:24.760
me this list of things that I had to take
1134
00:48:24.780 --> 00:48:27.599
to the next meeting. She might as well just be there, right?
1135
00:48:28.019 --> 00:48:30.380
If you want that said, you come to the meetings.
1136
00:48:31.000 --> 00:48:34.079
And so now she's a very good influence on us
1137
00:48:34.139 --> 00:48:37.050
because she's not. She's not a theatre person, so she
1138
00:48:37.150 --> 00:48:38.949
has a much more realistic view of the world.
1139
00:48:38.969 --> 00:48:40.309
But she brings rows of people.
1140
00:48:40.590 --> 00:48:43.349
She does. She really does, yeah, to shows. And how much,
1141
00:48:43.530 --> 00:48:44.090
I mean, it's.
1142
00:48:43.969 --> 00:48:46.409
So beautiful to watch how much you both adore each other. Like,
1143
00:48:46.489 --> 00:48:48.210
it just really just, you know.
1144
00:48:48.329 --> 00:48:50.369
It's one of those relationships you aspire to be, right?
1145
00:48:50.389 --> 00:48:52.309
Like, except without seeing all the shows.
1146
00:48:52.650 --> 00:48:55.170
I cannot believe I'm as lucky as I am.
1147
00:48:55.610 --> 00:48:58.340
Well, she's lucky too, mate. You are a very, very,
1148
00:48:58.480 --> 00:48:59.300
very lovely bloke.
1149
00:49:00.059 --> 00:49:00.960
Thank you. That's very kind.
1150
00:49:01.099 --> 00:49:02.260
Well, you're kind of handsome too.
1151
00:49:03.320 --> 00:49:03.969
Pivo, right.
1152
00:49:04.539 --> 00:49:07.260
Oh, okay. It's that time.
1153
00:49:07.400 --> 00:49:07.920
Sorry, Luke.
1154
00:49:08.119 --> 00:49:12.820
Okay. It always sneaks up. You hand me your... Again? Yeah,
1155
00:49:13.019 --> 00:49:15.510
I didn't bring mine. Why don't you just come prepared?
1156
00:49:16.050 --> 00:49:19.570
Because I was teaching children how to act today and
1157
00:49:19.610 --> 00:49:21.780
they weren't... Okay, here we go.
1158
00:49:22.639 --> 00:49:23.360
I wasn't actually.
1159
00:49:23.460 --> 00:49:24.679
I was acting with them.
1160
00:49:25.510 --> 00:49:29.000
I haven't got notes, but this is naturally rattling around
1161
00:49:29.059 --> 00:49:29.480
in my head.
1162
00:49:29.500 --> 00:49:33.679
This is literally... It's not... This is back to your classes,
1163
00:49:33.719 --> 00:49:38.679
your improv classes. Off the cuff is best. Yeah, no worries.
1164
00:49:38.699 --> 00:49:40.519
And don't worry about the questions if they sound... And
1165
00:49:40.559 --> 00:49:43.320
just don't go Mad Bruce on us. All right, here's the...
1166
00:49:44.059 --> 00:49:44.619
Mad Bruce.
1167
00:49:44.940 --> 00:49:47.360
Man, that was a brilliant film. We should have been millionaires.
1168
00:49:47.559 --> 00:49:48.579
Do you still have it?
1169
00:49:48.760 --> 00:49:50.320
I do have a copy of it, I think.
1170
00:49:50.500 --> 00:49:51.880
VHS, it's pretty hilarious. I want to watch that.
1171
00:49:51.900 --> 00:49:53.699
Especially when I rip Shane's arm off and beat him
1172
00:49:53.719 --> 00:49:56.639
to death with a stump. But anyway, we're going to
1173
00:49:56.679 --> 00:49:57.380
have to watch this one.
1174
00:49:57.400 --> 00:49:58.980
We're going to have to watch that.
1175
00:49:59.460 --> 00:50:01.079
Gary George, what is your favourite word?
1176
00:50:01.619 --> 00:50:03.989
I have a feeling that people have said this before,
1177
00:50:04.030 --> 00:50:05.010
but it's serendipity.
1178
00:50:05.469 --> 00:50:08.190
Yeah. That's a nice word. I don't know if anyone has.
1179
00:50:08.250 --> 00:50:09.150
I think you're the first one.
1180
00:50:09.250 --> 00:50:11.969
I don't know. It's just such a beautiful word.
1181
00:50:12.070 --> 00:50:14.449
And mostly because of the, A, it's a beautiful word,
1182
00:50:14.469 --> 00:50:15.429
and B, its meaning.
1183
00:50:15.789 --> 00:50:17.030
Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
1184
00:50:17.210 --> 00:50:19.610
Because a lot of what, I mean, a lot of
1185
00:50:19.630 --> 00:50:22.210
what's happened to us has been purely serendipity.
1186
00:50:22.250 --> 00:50:25.050
Me meeting Eleanor, me falling into theatre, it's all... Us
1187
00:50:25.070 --> 00:50:25.769
meeting each other.
1188
00:50:26.030 --> 00:50:27.510
Yeah.
1189
00:50:27.590 --> 00:50:28.969
What is your least favourite word?
1190
00:50:29.699 --> 00:50:35.079
Influencer. Oh, why? The very concept.
1191
00:50:34.320 --> 00:50:38.000
Just makes my skin crawl because very, very rarely do
1192
00:50:38.019 --> 00:50:42.400
you find an influencer whose intent is to improve things
1193
00:50:42.679 --> 00:50:43.579
for people, it seems to me.
1194
00:50:43.579 --> 00:50:44.110
And they lie.
1195
00:50:44.409 --> 00:50:45.769
They use false information.
1196
00:50:45.849 --> 00:50:49.989
And it's like... Why can your influence not be from
1197
00:50:50.070 --> 00:50:53.860
books and film and friends and all that? Why do
1198
00:50:53.900 --> 00:50:54.619
you need something?
1199
00:50:54.639 --> 00:50:56.360
A lot of my kids, that's what they want to
1200
00:50:56.400 --> 00:50:57.280
do for their careers.
1201
00:50:57.420 --> 00:50:57.719
Yeah.
1202
00:50:57.940 --> 00:50:58.239
Really?
1203
00:50:58.260 --> 00:50:59.900
How is that a career?
1204
00:51:00.300 --> 00:51:02.420
This is where I feel the world's going down the toilet.
1205
00:51:02.619 --> 00:51:04.099
Not really, but some of them.
1206
00:51:04.760 --> 00:51:05.780
I hope they're joking.
1207
00:51:05.800 --> 00:51:07.519
It's a great way to make food or money without
1208
00:51:07.579 --> 00:51:08.179
doing any work.
1209
00:51:08.980 --> 00:51:12.900
What turns you on creatively, spiritually or emotionally?
1210
00:51:13.360 --> 00:51:16.039
Empathy. That is such a great answer.
1211
00:51:16.889 --> 00:51:21.820
It's... It's so important for actors, I think. Sometimes it's
1212
00:51:21.840 --> 00:51:23.219
detrimental because it can be too much.
1213
00:51:23.440 --> 00:51:26.519
And you need to find a balance between empathy and compassion.
1214
00:51:26.039 --> 00:51:26.260
And the.
1215
00:51:33.119 --> 00:51:36.320
But I think even just that word, empathy, right, there
1216
00:51:36.340 --> 00:51:39.469
says so many things. It says be kind. It says
1217
00:51:39.849 --> 00:51:43.690
be balanced, like listen. It's got these beautiful words that
1218
00:51:43.730 --> 00:51:47.590
are associated with just that one powerful, strong word.
1219
00:51:47.650 --> 00:51:49.869
I mean, yeah, that's a great answer.
1220
00:51:50.050 --> 00:51:51.449
What turns you off? Bullies.
1221
00:51:51.880 --> 00:51:52.780
Yeah, the opposite.
1222
00:51:53.219 --> 00:51:58.340
Yeah, any form of completely unnecessary cruelty. Were you bullied
1223
00:51:58.409 --> 00:51:59.489
at school? Horrifically.
1224
00:51:59.510 --> 00:52:00.690
Me too, yeah.
1225
00:52:00.849 --> 00:52:05.409
In primary school, it was physical, really atrocious violence.
1226
00:52:06.969 --> 00:52:08.170
Shit, Gary, that's horrible.
1227
00:52:08.210 --> 00:52:10.010
Yeah, it was shocking.
1228
00:52:10.650 --> 00:52:13.670
Yeah. Has any of them tried to reach out to
1229
00:52:13.710 --> 00:52:16.860
you in adult life? No.
1230
00:52:18.139 --> 00:52:21.869
I remember when my last year of primary school, because I.
1231
00:52:25.519 --> 00:52:27.539
I found that you could, I think it's possibly where
1232
00:52:27.639 --> 00:52:29.559
part of the acting comes from. One of the ways
1233
00:52:29.619 --> 00:52:33.039
to deflect the violence was to be funny and to
1234
00:52:33.059 --> 00:52:37.909
make them laugh. And then I had a weird, I
1235
00:52:37.949 --> 00:52:39.550
can't believe I'm talking about this. I had a weird
1236
00:52:39.570 --> 00:52:44.590
situation where one of the chief really nasty bullies had
1237
00:52:45.670 --> 00:52:47.650
fallen over in the playground or something and he'd cut
1238
00:52:47.690 --> 00:52:51.110
his head and there was like blood, absolutely gushing out
1239
00:52:51.130 --> 00:52:53.250
of his head. And it had happened to me at
1240
00:52:53.269 --> 00:52:56.090
a previous time. And I basically picked him up and
1241
00:52:56.190 --> 00:52:57.630
put a thing on his head. And I said, don't
1242
00:52:57.650 --> 00:52:58.789
worry about it. I know there's a lot of blood,
1243
00:52:59.070 --> 00:53:00.949
but that's what heads do. It'll be okay. I'll take
1244
00:53:00.989 --> 00:53:03.010
you to the teacher aides. They'll look after you. And
1245
00:53:03.050 --> 00:53:04.969
I was sort of walking this guy who'd beat the
1246
00:53:05.010 --> 00:53:07.579
shit out of me for God knows how many years.
1247
00:53:08.000 --> 00:53:10.639
And he just sort of said something like, you're all right, Gary,
1248
00:53:11.139 --> 00:53:11.900
or something deep like that.
1249
00:53:11.920 --> 00:53:13.059
And did he leave you alone after that?
1250
00:53:13.500 --> 00:53:15.039
I think I was, I think by that time I
1251
00:53:15.059 --> 00:53:19.340
was kind of had passed the easy pickings stage, uh,
1252
00:53:19.860 --> 00:53:21.619
I'd gotten bigger and taller.
1253
00:53:21.639 --> 00:53:26.070
Yeah, because you're a tall bloke. Yeah, so, yeah. High school.
1254
00:53:26.210 --> 00:53:27.250
I'm sorry that happened to you.
1255
00:53:27.289 --> 00:53:27.909
No, no, that's all right.
1256
00:53:27.929 --> 00:53:30.610
School's going to be brutal. High school was.
1257
00:53:30.849 --> 00:53:32.250
I mean, we.
1258
00:53:32.230 --> 00:53:35.769
Wouldn't be doing theatre if we had normal high school experiences.
1259
00:53:35.789 --> 00:53:37.449
I think the annual people peaked in high school, for
1260
00:53:37.489 --> 00:53:40.480
Christ's sakes. Like, whatever. Yeah. High school was better.
1261
00:53:40.500 --> 00:53:41.199
High school was better.
1262
00:53:41.219 --> 00:53:41.519
Yeah.
1263
00:53:41.579 --> 00:53:44.739
High school got better. Primary school was appalling. Was letting
1264
00:53:44.780 --> 00:53:45.360
him bleed.
1265
00:53:45.929 --> 00:53:49.050
By himself ever an option for you? Jesus Christ.
1266
00:53:49.150 --> 00:53:51.769
I don't think so. I don't think I could do that.
1267
00:53:51.809 --> 00:53:53.730
I don't think so.
1268
00:53:54.289 --> 00:53:55.429
That goes back to empathy.
1269
00:53:55.489 --> 00:54:00.159
As much as you watch a movie and the bad
1270
00:54:00.199 --> 00:54:02.820
guy gets his comeuppance and you go, yeah, you deserve that,
1271
00:54:02.860 --> 00:54:05.179
you creep, at the same time in real life, I
1272
00:54:05.219 --> 00:54:08.119
don't think I would react that way when that happened.
1273
00:54:08.199 --> 00:54:12.619
I would think I would try to help them even though. No, no,
1274
00:54:12.739 --> 00:54:14.320
I mean, I think I would too.
1275
00:54:14.409 --> 00:54:16.449
But I think, you know, what kind of gives me
1276
00:54:16.510 --> 00:54:20.070
solace is hopefully they look back on that moment and
1277
00:54:20.150 --> 00:54:23.110
realise how much of an amazing guy you are and go, oh,
1278
00:54:23.130 --> 00:54:26.429
he's a good person. That would be nice. Or fuck him.
1279
00:54:27.050 --> 00:54:32.019
That's actually a better attitude probably in order to deal
1280
00:54:32.059 --> 00:54:33.559
with the way the world currently is.
1281
00:54:33.559 --> 00:54:34.760
People beat me up.
1282
00:54:34.840 --> 00:54:35.219
Fuck you.
1283
00:54:35.239 --> 00:54:38.699
I don't care about you anymore. No, I remember I
1284
00:54:39.360 --> 00:54:42.019
used to get, like, heavily bullied at school as well.
1285
00:54:42.179 --> 00:54:45.530
I wonder why. And I remember I was working in, like,
1286
00:54:45.550 --> 00:54:48.769
a bar and one of the bullies, like, a notorious bully,
1287
00:54:48.809 --> 00:54:51.469
came up, oh, Lee, how you going, mate? And I
1288
00:54:51.469 --> 00:54:54.059
was like... I'm not shaking your hand, thank you. And
1289
00:54:54.079 --> 00:54:54.800
I just walked off.
1290
00:54:54.900 --> 00:54:56.280
I was like, somebody else didn't serve you, mate. Like,
1291
00:54:56.320 --> 00:54:57.250
I'm not available.
1292
00:54:57.329 --> 00:54:58.369
No. That is complete lack of.
1293
00:54:58.369 --> 00:55:00.789
What, we finished school now and we can be friends?
1294
00:55:00.829 --> 00:55:03.949
That is a complete lack of empathy for having absolutely
1295
00:55:04.150 --> 00:55:06.090
no idea of the hell that they put you through.
1296
00:55:06.110 --> 00:55:06.269
Yeah.
1297
00:55:06.710 --> 00:55:09.210
And thinking that that was fine and normal.
1298
00:55:09.409 --> 00:55:11.380
And I'd like to apologise to all the people that
1299
00:55:11.440 --> 00:55:16.059
I bullied. Did you bully people? No. Well, I was
1300
00:55:16.079 --> 00:55:18.530
way in between the whole... You were, yeah. I....
1301
00:55:20.099 --> 00:55:20.760
You're a lovely man.
1302
00:55:20.780 --> 00:55:24.409
I survived. Um, okay.
1303
00:55:25.210 --> 00:55:26.670
Fuck influencers and bullies.
1304
00:55:26.769 --> 00:55:29.909
All right. What is your favorite curse word, Gary?
1305
00:55:30.570 --> 00:55:30.849
Okay.
1306
00:55:31.190 --> 00:55:35.030
Mine. Fuck. Yeah. No brainer. That's the easiest.
1307
00:55:35.070 --> 00:55:36.929
That's the way you go. It's just there. It's on
1308
00:55:37.230 --> 00:55:38.429
what I, but it's a gift.
1309
00:55:38.469 --> 00:55:39.130
It's a gift of a word.
1310
00:55:39.170 --> 00:55:43.260
My favorite is actually my mother-in-law's because my mother-in-law has been,
1311
00:55:43.420 --> 00:55:44.760
I was brought up in an era where you did
1312
00:55:44.780 --> 00:55:46.280
not swear. And when I'm around Mrs.
1313
00:55:46.300 --> 00:55:50.630
T I'm, Don't swear. She is... I love.
1314
00:55:50.789 --> 00:55:52.289
She just says, sugar.
1315
00:55:52.909 --> 00:55:53.969
And it's brilliant.
1316
00:55:54.010 --> 00:55:54.630
That's her swear word.
1317
00:55:54.650 --> 00:55:56.309
But it still has all the gravity.
1318
00:55:56.329 --> 00:55:57.869
The worst thing in the world can happen to her
1319
00:55:57.909 --> 00:56:00.130
and she'll just say, sugar. And it's brilliant.
1320
00:56:00.210 --> 00:56:00.559
I love it.
1321
00:56:00.869 --> 00:56:02.809
That is actually... We've all got to start using that,
1322
00:56:02.849 --> 00:56:05.289
I think. It's really cool. So that's my favourite, but
1323
00:56:05.309 --> 00:56:05.889
I'll never use it.
1324
00:56:05.969 --> 00:56:06.889
I always just say fuck.
1325
00:56:07.590 --> 00:56:09.349
What sound or noise do you love?
1326
00:56:09.869 --> 00:56:14.010
We have now one of the few gardens left in
1327
00:56:14.070 --> 00:56:14.570
our neighbourhood.
1328
00:56:15.139 --> 00:56:15.889
Oh, yeah. So.
1329
00:56:16.679 --> 00:56:20.090
All the magpies seem to come to our place and there.
1330
00:56:19.949 --> 00:56:24.000
Is nothing more beautiful than the warbling of magpies.
1331
00:56:24.039 --> 00:56:26.099
I love it when you mow the lawn.
1332
00:56:27.010 --> 00:56:29.050
And then they all just rock up on the fence
1333
00:56:29.070 --> 00:56:32.869
because they're like, the bugs are coming out, boys. You
1334
00:56:32.889 --> 00:56:34.969
just turn around and go, all right, get in there.
1335
00:56:34.989 --> 00:56:36.829
And just, you know, you can sit out there and
1336
00:56:36.849 --> 00:56:38.469
they'll just be there and you just sit and listen
1337
00:56:38.489 --> 00:56:40.139
to them warble. It's the best sound ever.
1338
00:56:40.239 --> 00:56:42.960
Or like the little Murray magpies that just play around
1339
00:56:42.980 --> 00:56:43.260
with you.
1340
00:56:43.300 --> 00:56:43.579
Yeah.
1341
00:56:43.940 --> 00:56:44.639
No, that's awesome.
1342
00:56:44.719 --> 00:56:49.219
I love that. Yeah. I fully love that. Yeah.
1343
00:56:49.380 --> 00:56:50.860
What sound or noise do you hate?
1344
00:56:52.550 --> 00:56:54.869
Chewing. I have an issue.
1345
00:56:55.050 --> 00:56:58.679
I think it's called misophonia or something like that, which
1346
00:56:58.739 --> 00:57:02.320
is actually where you have a physical reaction that sound
1347
00:57:02.440 --> 00:57:05.440
that if I have somebody near me who's eating with
1348
00:57:05.460 --> 00:57:10.960
their mouth open and you get that, oh, that just absolutely.
1349
00:57:11.340 --> 00:57:12.420
Oh, God, don't get a dog.
1350
00:57:12.460 --> 00:57:13.699
Sugars with my.
1351
00:57:14.059 --> 00:57:15.510
Oh, dogs, no. It won't bother me with a dog.
1352
00:57:15.519 --> 00:57:17.420
When she eats or goes downstairs for a bit of
1353
00:57:17.440 --> 00:57:19.619
a lick, she's like. It's people.
1354
00:57:19.980 --> 00:57:21.099
It goes on forever.
1355
00:57:21.139 --> 00:57:22.280
Yeah, I hate that sound.
1356
00:57:23.139 --> 00:57:25.000
You'll be happy to know if one of my students
1357
00:57:25.019 --> 00:57:25.420
has gum.
1358
00:57:25.440 --> 00:57:27.699
Oh, yeah.
1359
00:57:27.719 --> 00:57:28.400
Spitting that out.
1360
00:57:30.920 --> 00:57:33.599
What profession, other than your own, would you like to attempt?
1361
00:57:34.500 --> 00:57:42.099
I think, because everything I've done is very sort of mind-based,
1362
00:57:43.159 --> 00:57:47.519
writing history, all that sort of stuff, building something.
1363
00:57:47.840 --> 00:57:48.519
So either a.
1364
00:57:48.679 --> 00:57:50.679
Builder, but.
1365
00:57:51.780 --> 00:57:53.679
Also, I think actually going back to when I was a.
1366
00:57:53.659 --> 00:58:00.210
Kid and it would be creating practical special effects, building spaceships, creating. Well,
1367
00:58:00.250 --> 00:58:03.309
it goes back to Mad Bruce. It does indeed go
1368
00:58:03.349 --> 00:58:04.250
back to Mad Bruce. Yes.
1369
00:58:04.269 --> 00:58:09.349
Because you're a professional writer. Is that right? Writer, historian,
1370
00:58:10.889 --> 00:58:17.679
editor predominantly. Yeah. Archivalist. Part of history. Well, I fell
1371
00:58:17.800 --> 00:58:20.059
into history because my sister is a historian.
1372
00:58:20.610 --> 00:58:23.309
And I would edit the things that she was working on.
1373
00:58:23.949 --> 00:58:26.610
And she was working on an amazing piece of work
1374
00:58:26.809 --> 00:58:33.760
for Stolen Generations. She was creating a book called Finding
1375
00:58:33.800 --> 00:58:37.000
Your Own Way for South Australian Aboriginal people who'd been
1376
00:58:37.039 --> 00:58:40.780
taken away from their families, which gave a brief history
1377
00:58:41.420 --> 00:58:47.650
of every children's home and orphanage in South Australia and
1378
00:58:47.769 --> 00:58:52.440
showed where they could find their records, and I was
1379
00:58:52.500 --> 00:58:57.550
brought in to edit that. So in the process of that,
1380
00:58:57.610 --> 00:59:05.329
when that came out, the government-funded project called Find and
1381
00:59:05.369 --> 00:59:10.579
Connect was started in Melbourne with Melbourne University and the
1382
00:59:10.639 --> 00:59:17.050
Australian Catholic University where they decided to create a website
1383
00:59:17.690 --> 00:59:20.739
for the whole of Australia. that did the same thing
1384
00:59:20.820 --> 00:59:24.099
for Stolen Generations and Care and any children who were
1385
00:59:24.159 --> 00:59:26.940
in care where they could find out their history and
1386
00:59:27.000 --> 00:59:29.780
find out how to find records. And so for several years,
1387
00:59:29.889 --> 00:59:33.929
I worked in conjunction with my sister as the state-based
1388
00:59:33.969 --> 00:59:37.590
historian for both South Australia and the Northern Territory. And
1389
00:59:37.630 --> 00:59:40.030
we basically had to find the histories of.
1390
00:59:40.269 --> 00:59:41.570
Oh, Gary, what wonderful work.
1391
00:59:42.170 --> 00:59:44.469
Wonderful work, but did that not get gut-wrenching?
1392
00:59:44.530 --> 00:59:47.190
Like, I would... It is, it is.
1393
00:59:47.389 --> 00:59:48.929
I don't know how my sister does it because she
1394
00:59:48.969 --> 00:59:52.940
deals with social welfare history for so much of her career.
1395
00:59:53.280 --> 00:59:56.500
And I did that for.
1396
00:59:56.719 --> 00:59:56.960
I've.
1397
00:59:56.860 --> 00:59:59.679
Done that off and on over a sort of, I
1398
00:59:59.679 --> 01:00:02.079
don't know, five or so years or more. And I
1399
01:00:02.320 --> 01:00:05.460
reached a point where I... was finding it very difficult
1400
01:00:05.559 --> 01:00:09.090
to deal with the horror stories that come up.
1401
01:00:09.119 --> 01:00:09.610
Good Lord.
1402
01:00:10.050 --> 01:00:13.110
Incredible. And, yeah, we just kept finding more places that
1403
01:00:13.150 --> 01:00:15.170
children were sent that they should never have been sent to.
1404
01:00:16.389 --> 01:00:18.909
It's actually quite a disturbing part of history. But the
1405
01:00:18.949 --> 01:00:22.449
Find and Connect website is still there, and anybody who's
1406
01:00:22.469 --> 01:00:24.590
been in care and wants to know about their records
1407
01:00:24.630 --> 01:00:26.110
or the history of the places that they were in,
1408
01:00:26.190 --> 01:00:28.989
go to the Find and Connect website, the web resource.
1409
01:00:29.230 --> 01:00:33.449
It's an amazing resource for anybody who was in care
1410
01:00:34.039 --> 01:00:37.119
or was of the Stolen Generations to find, it's a
1411
01:00:37.659 --> 01:00:40.039
perfect first stop to find information about.
1412
01:00:40.300 --> 01:00:41.320
Wow, thank you. Great work.
1413
01:00:41.360 --> 01:00:44.010
I'll probably put the link in the description.
1414
01:00:44.050 --> 01:00:45.030
Yeah, that would be great.
1415
01:00:45.110 --> 01:00:47.150
That would be terrific. Thank you for that.
1416
01:00:47.369 --> 01:00:48.469
That's quite all right. I know.
1417
01:00:48.809 --> 01:00:52.090
I know that's amazing work, but having dealt in that,
1418
01:00:53.429 --> 01:00:55.530
I'm not heavily, but it.
1419
01:00:55.590 --> 01:01:00.480
But no, yeah. Anyway, what profession would you not like
1420
01:01:00.539 --> 01:01:02.340
to do? I would be.
1421
01:01:03.090 --> 01:01:08.199
Utterly useless as a vet nurse. My niece, my niece
1422
01:01:08.280 --> 01:01:12.039
Anisha is amazing. She's a vet nurse and what she
1423
01:01:12.099 --> 01:01:14.570
deals with on a daily basis does my head in.
1424
01:01:15.440 --> 01:01:17.500
I love animals so much, I just would not cope.
1425
01:01:17.559 --> 01:01:20.309
Is it the animals or is it the owners of
1426
01:01:20.349 --> 01:01:20.829
the animals?
1427
01:01:20.949 --> 01:01:23.389
I'm sure the... Yeah, I've heard some horror stories from
1428
01:01:23.429 --> 01:01:26.849
Anisha about some pretty atrocious owners, but no, I would
1429
01:01:26.949 --> 01:01:28.050
not cope with animals in pain.
1430
01:01:28.070 --> 01:01:29.579
It's just animals in pain. Animals in pain.
1431
01:01:29.780 --> 01:01:31.820
And that's what you're seeing. People don't bring their animals
1432
01:01:31.860 --> 01:01:34.139
to say, hey, isn't Fluffy cute? They bring it because
1433
01:01:34.239 --> 01:01:36.460
Fluffy's got a broken leg or Fluffy's in pain or.
1434
01:01:36.380 --> 01:01:38.570
Fluffy's going to die. I cannot.
1435
01:01:39.070 --> 01:01:40.130
I would not deal with that.
1436
01:01:40.510 --> 01:01:42.449
I think it's also hard, too, because animals can't tell
1437
01:01:42.489 --> 01:01:44.449
you when they're sick or when there's something wrong. I'm
1438
01:01:44.489 --> 01:01:44.630
a mess.
1439
01:01:44.650 --> 01:01:47.610
You're looking for actual. I'm a mess when my cat
1440
01:01:47.630 --> 01:01:48.289
is not well.
1441
01:01:48.630 --> 01:01:48.949
Yeah.
1442
01:01:49.369 --> 01:01:50.190
I'm useless.
1443
01:01:50.250 --> 01:01:52.489
Because sometimes by the time they change behaviour, because that's
1444
01:01:52.510 --> 01:01:55.460
what you're looking for is changes in behaviour. Yeah. Most
1445
01:01:55.480 --> 01:01:57.239
of the time. And then you go, oh, shit, like
1446
01:01:57.280 --> 01:01:59.000
it's worse than I thought it was going to be,
1447
01:01:59.019 --> 01:02:01.840
you know. Yeah. And they just give you so much
1448
01:02:01.880 --> 01:02:05.099
love and joy. All right.
1449
01:02:05.659 --> 01:02:06.610
I know you're an atheist.
1450
01:02:06.619 --> 01:02:07.230
Yeah.
1451
01:02:08.110 --> 01:02:10.650
But if heaven exists, what would you like to hear
1452
01:02:10.730 --> 01:02:12.929
God say when you arrive at the pearly gates?
1453
01:02:13.070 --> 01:02:16.610
Well, after apologising to them for denigrating their existence for
1454
01:02:16.650 --> 01:02:17.190
such a long time.
1455
01:02:17.210 --> 01:02:17.969
It could be any God.
1456
01:02:17.989 --> 01:02:18.820
It could be a pretty cool God.
1457
01:02:18.829 --> 01:02:23.260
Yeah, that's true. I think I would like them to say,
1458
01:02:23.739 --> 01:02:26.039
you did okay. Now, come in and have a cup
1459
01:02:26.079 --> 01:02:26.320
of tea.
1460
01:02:26.360 --> 01:02:30.639
Everyone's waiting. Yeah. I think that's what most of us want, really. Yeah, yeah.
1461
01:02:30.940 --> 01:02:32.760
To be welcomed. That's been the most common answer.
1462
01:02:33.010 --> 01:02:33.219
Yeah.
1463
01:02:33.239 --> 01:02:33.800
You did all right.
1464
01:02:34.090 --> 01:02:35.550
Yeah. Some of your friends are here.
1465
01:02:35.630 --> 01:02:42.420
Yeah, yeah, absolutely. And the big one, Gary George. Why
1466
01:02:42.460 --> 01:02:43.619
do you do this? Okay.
1467
01:02:44.179 --> 01:02:45.340
I know I'm supposed to be off the cuff, but
1468
01:02:45.360 --> 01:02:47.309
this has been rattling in my head ever since you
1469
01:02:47.329 --> 01:02:49.869
guys asked me to do it. So I have two, unfortunately.
1470
01:02:50.230 --> 01:02:50.469
Great.
1471
01:02:50.570 --> 01:02:50.949
Hit us with that.
1472
01:02:50.969 --> 01:02:51.309
Okay.
1473
01:02:51.969 --> 01:02:56.190
The first is harder to explain. It's the moment.
1474
01:02:57.590 --> 01:02:59.550
And it happens. It can happen on stage. It can
1475
01:02:59.570 --> 01:03:03.050
be that moment where you hit something. just the right
1476
01:03:03.110 --> 01:03:05.590
note and you will hear the audience will just go
1477
01:03:05.650 --> 01:03:10.449
completely silent and you know you've absolutely nailed that emotional beat.
1478
01:03:10.829 --> 01:03:13.590
Or it can be you have just the right amount
1479
01:03:13.610 --> 01:03:16.070
of a pause before you drop the gag line and
1480
01:03:16.139 --> 01:03:19.900
the whole audience goes ballistic. Or it can be that
1481
01:03:19.960 --> 01:03:23.500
moment when you're in rehearsal and you find that perfect
1482
01:03:23.579 --> 01:03:26.320
thing that explains the play. So it's that.
1483
01:03:26.219 --> 01:03:27.199
Little nugget of emotion.
1484
01:03:29.789 --> 01:03:32.250
And I think that's what makes really good theatre for
1485
01:03:32.289 --> 01:03:34.710
me is where you find each of those moments and
1486
01:03:34.730 --> 01:03:36.309
then you string them together into a play.
1487
01:03:36.329 --> 01:03:39.760
Yes, that's a perfect way of putting it.
1488
01:03:40.389 --> 01:03:43.110
And we're all chasing that.
1489
01:03:43.199 --> 01:03:46.519
Yeah. Yeah, because it's that feeling both on stage and
1490
01:03:46.599 --> 01:03:48.800
off stage with cast members and crew and all of
1491
01:03:48.820 --> 01:03:52.739
that and just making, yeah, finding those little nuggets of amazingness.
1492
01:03:53.739 --> 01:03:56.340
And the other one is what everybody says, but it's
1493
01:03:56.380 --> 01:03:59.789
basically when, because I had a strange relationship with my
1494
01:03:59.829 --> 01:04:05.010
dad because he, you know, he went through the Navy
1495
01:04:05.090 --> 01:04:07.530
and World War II and then he bought a, he
1496
01:04:07.570 --> 01:04:11.769
got a, say, a soldier settler property in Loxton and
1497
01:04:11.809 --> 01:04:14.650
he created this amazing block and then he got a
1498
01:04:14.760 --> 01:04:16.599
further career and he had this other property and it
1499
01:04:16.639 --> 01:04:19.840
was like his hope would be that, you know, I
1500
01:04:19.880 --> 01:04:21.480
would take over the business and all of this sort
1501
01:04:21.519 --> 01:04:23.800
of stuff. He'd come from the city and gone to
1502
01:04:23.820 --> 01:04:25.820
the country and fallen in love with growing things and
1503
01:04:25.840 --> 01:04:26.599
all this sort of stuff.
1504
01:04:27.599 --> 01:04:29.760
And I went straight back to the city.
1505
01:04:30.300 --> 01:04:33.039
And I had no interest in... He was a sporting,
1506
01:04:33.139 --> 01:04:42.389
amazing sporting guy. And so he's... I was not sporty. He, however,
1507
01:04:43.409 --> 01:04:47.929
loved theatre. So when I got into theatre... We finally
1508
01:04:47.969 --> 01:04:53.309
found a really lovely common ground. And I remember him
1509
01:04:53.369 --> 01:04:55.170
coming and seeing me in the crucible and I made
1510
01:04:55.190 --> 01:04:56.889
him cry. And that was one of the most amazing
1511
01:04:56.949 --> 01:04:59.599
moments of my entire life. But he said to me,
1512
01:05:00.400 --> 01:05:03.260
very early on when I started getting into theatre, he said, Gary,
1513
01:05:03.920 --> 01:05:06.980
the friends you make in theatre are the best friends
1514
01:05:07.000 --> 01:05:08.570
you're ever going to make.
1515
01:05:09.769 --> 01:05:11.949
And... That's it.
1516
01:05:12.110 --> 01:05:15.719
The people in theatre are glorious. I love them and
1517
01:05:15.780 --> 01:05:18.019
I love you guys. And so that's why I do it.
1518
01:05:18.019 --> 01:05:22.550
I love you too, Gary. Well, thank you so much
1519
01:05:22.570 --> 01:05:23.110
for coming in.
1520
01:05:23.320 --> 01:05:23.670
Thank you.
1521
01:05:23.750 --> 01:05:25.510
And thank you for sharing a lot of stuff.
1522
01:05:26.409 --> 01:05:27.090
Possibly too much.
1523
01:05:27.110 --> 01:05:29.230
I could tell that it was a bit hard, actually.
1524
01:05:30.070 --> 01:05:33.329
But I really, I think we appreciate your openness.
1525
01:05:33.780 --> 01:05:37.079
Not yet, but it has potential. Definitely.
1526
01:05:37.719 --> 01:05:39.800
What? Thanks. Keep going.
1527
01:05:39.860 --> 01:05:42.929
I was trying to say something actually serious for once,
1528
01:05:43.349 --> 01:05:44.610
and you shut me down.
1529
01:05:45.570 --> 01:05:48.889
You're all right. All right. Thank you, Gary George, for
1530
01:05:48.929 --> 01:05:51.920
coming in. Thank you, Gary. Thank you to Set Me Studio.
1531
01:05:51.980 --> 01:05:54.579
I'm sorry. I'm finished. Thank you. Thanks, Lee. And you
1532
01:05:54.639 --> 01:05:56.300
are definitely one of those guests that we could- I
1533
01:05:56.300 --> 01:06:01.679
was trying to have a heartfelt moment. We can definitely
1534
01:06:01.719 --> 01:06:03.590
sit down for another, oh, wow.
1535
01:06:03.670 --> 01:06:05.070
I feel like we've not touched on anything.
1536
01:06:05.090 --> 01:06:06.849
I hope I haven't gone on too long. Oh, my God,
1537
01:06:06.889 --> 01:06:07.949
you've been great. No, no, no.
1538
01:06:08.130 --> 01:06:12.289
No, we really appreciate it. We appreciate our confines. Thanks
1539
01:06:12.329 --> 01:06:15.590
to Cooper again for setting this up for us. And
1540
01:06:15.639 --> 01:06:20.539
we will be back with guests that you have organised
1541
01:06:21.039 --> 01:06:22.019
and I've probably not.
1542
01:06:21.940 --> 01:06:22.820
Paid attention to.
1543
01:06:23.409 --> 01:06:23.829
Correct.
1544
01:06:23.969 --> 01:06:29.099
Yeah. See you then. I promise I'll be prepared. Thanks. Cool. Bye.
1545
01:06:29.260 --> 01:06:29.519
All right.
1546
01:06:30.000 --> 01:06:30.900
Chook is all. Cheers.