0:00
There's a great scene in Spanish. She goes, cuando pieves Tu lengua, pieves tu patria. You lose your tongue, you lose your country. When was it the moment that you knew that that was what you wanted to do with your life? Oh, my God, what do you want me to start? I mean, when a human right immigrates the United States, there's an assimilation that happens, and there's a change. So it would only be natural that the same thing would happen with food if you weren't going to be a chef, a little birdie told me that you wanted to be a mariachi singer. Is that true? May consider
0:29
this evening, the reason why
0:34
I wanted to do this podcast a lot was to talk to immigrants. Obviously, because we all like talking to each other and learning about each other, but also to everyone else. It's like, we're all really immigrants. Life will never be perfect, but it can be purposeful. You know, it's like, if you play soccer, if you play soccer, you're gonna make a friend or an enemy anywhere in the world, but if you cook, you're gonna make a friend. Well, salud, you
1:03
welcome to interviews with immigrants, the podcast where we celebrate the positive side of immigration by cutting through the politics and sharing the real stories, the heart, the humor and the humanity behind every journey. I'm Andrea Shev, your host, and trust me, you picked a great episode to join us. We're exploring how one man's love for food became a powerful way to honor his roots. They say food can highlight history, be a window to the world and, of course, tell delicious stories. And today, this guest has made it his mission to do just that. He's a chef, a TV personality, author, entrepreneur, and proud Mexican American who believes preserving one's culture is an essential part of the immigrant story. You've seen him as a judge on Master Chef, a fan favorite on chopped and in his own culinary travel show, taco trip. He's also stars in Hulu's talking sabor, where food meets heritage in the most personal way. But today, we're diving deeper into this journey and his roots that have shaped him, and we're gonna drink a little tequila along the way. Please welcome the brilliant chef. Aaron Sanchez, I am so delighted to be here with you. You have no idea I am a fan. I you know what? You're the person that just tackles great topics. And I'm just saying how delighted and honored I am to be here. Thank you so much for spending the time with us, and I can't wait to jump in, but before we get in, we got to start with a little bit of tequila. So I already poured mine
2:29
tequila. I have all of them here, but I'm going to just do the BLANCO Right now. So I just wanted to before we start into your life, I wanted to give you time, to give you a perspective on tequila and the Mexican identity. Where is the connection between tequila and Mexican identity? Well, I mean, you know, it's funny, because our family, our family has, you know, in Chihuahua and Sonora, you know, my family are ganaderos, which means cattle ranchers and manage candle but, you know, up in the north, tequila, yes, is drank, yes it's yes, it's celebrated. But you know, we have other other spirits that are derived from agave and others and other things, like so toll and bacanora and all these other different things. But when you argue about what is the most Mexican state of all Mexican states, you're talking 3232 states. We're, you know, you know, my dear comparing here Manny, you know, nowadays kind of designated some places of Mexico City as their own states, but 32 to be clear, and then with a little bit of sort of wiggle room, but you know, Jalisco is the birthplace of mariachi. It's the birthplace of tequila. It's the birthplace of like the enchiladas, the birria, like all of these unbelievable, iconic elements of Mexican culture that are just, they're just frozen there. And you can't deny it. It just permeates every element of Mexican culture, you know, so and tequila, I really believe, has that, has that the presence of it. You know what I'm saying? Like, like the OG status and like, when you think of Mexicans, you think maybe, yeah, you think of taco them, air, guacamole, but you when it comes to spirit, you know what I mean? Well, salud, it's
4:08
a
4:09
good way to start the Absolutely, yeah. And you know what they say? Like, when you drink a little bit in the morning, like sommeliers like to drink at 1110, in the morning. Oh, then I am like, right, right on time. I'm like, perfect then all day long, because it's like your palate is more more astute at that time. So all right, let's jump in. Let's start with your early years of your life. I know you were born in El Paso Texas, was right near the border of Mexico. So how was it growing up in a little city? Well, it's not that little, but near such, close to Mexico, you know, it's a very good question. My mom was born in Agua Prieta, in Sonora, and my dad was born in Okinawa, kind of down on the on the shore, down the valley, but, like, moved to Valentine, Texas, and kind of grew up in the valley back in the, you know, in the early days. And, yeah, so, you know.
5:00
The best thing I can describe is that I've had two feet in two different cultures, you know. So, you know, for Spanish is my first language is the month, to be very honest, it's the most, the most I feel most comfortable in at times. And, you know, growing up in El Paso Texas, you know, you know, till my daddy was still alive, it was always going to Mexico in the summers and visiting with my cousins at the ranch in Mexico. And they would give me, you know, a bunch of crap about being a city slicker and all that kind of stuff. So it was very much by culture, but we, we always spoke Spanish. And there's a gay there's a great scene in Spanish, because when the pieves to lengua, pieves to patria, and you lose your tongue, you lose your country, and it's so important, and I'm so grateful that all of my family instilled those virtues about, you know, connecting with the language, because it just it allowed me to connect, and allowed me to stay in touch. Yeah, and then it was good, you know, I felt very Mexican, but when we moved to New York, it was like a very different vibe. So two things I want to hit on. The whole thing about the language is so important. I know I'm married to an Argentinian. When I met him, he forced me to learn Spanish, and it was a torture, of course, but thank God I learned it right, because when I went to Argentina all the times, I was able to connect with his grandparents, I was able to connect with his friends. And you lose that connection if you don't have the language, because it only goes so far, right? I mean, you only can communicate so much and be connected to your heritage if you don't have the ability to communicate. Yeah, absolutely. And then if you want to even think about it, just on a personal level, imagine my son. You know, my son is 14 now, you know, and I did the best I could to put him in immersion school very early on in his life and make that, make that a very big priority. But, you know, at the same time, you know, they lose interest. And you know how I got goals, but you know, I just try to surround them as much around Spanish as possible. Because also remember this all the parents out there that have kids, you know, of our same similar story. You know, you also expose other different business opportunity if you're bilingual, you know, I'm saying my twin brother had an opportunity to go to Santiago, Chile when he got out of law school and, like, literally go out there and do his thing, because he spoke Spanish, you know, I'm saying, so there's a lot of opportunity just about the culture, yeah, and there's a lot of places you can go in the world If you speak Spanish, especially Spanish, that you can have connection with the people that you would never have if you don't have that second language. So language is key. The big question is, you know, when you move from El Paso to New York, but the big question to me and probably a lot of people that are listening to the show, because this show is called interviews with immigrants, but technically, you're really not an immigrant, right? I mean, technically, you were born in the United States, in El Paso Texas. So really, you're not an immigrant. But I argue that's not really the case. And there's so so many people in this country that are in your position that were born here but grew up in their bubble, right of a Mexican family or Italian family or a Cuban family, whatever it is, and then at one point, usually when you're very little, and you start kindergarten or something, you exit your bubble and you enter the world. And in my opinion, that's a moment of immigration. So for you, I would argue maybe the moment of immigration is when you left with your mom from El Paso and you moved to New York. Yeah, you know, it's very interesting, Andrea, that you bring that up, because I do feel my mom says I'm bringing up my boys Mexican. And what that means is a whole series of
8:26
cultural behavior. There's a whole series of manners. There's a whole series of the way you address people, what we eat. I mean, it just permeates every aspect of your life, and it just, it just, you can't deny it. So, so, you know, the fact that that that was my particular narrative. I thought was really interesting. But, you know, for me, I'll give you an example. When we got there originally, we I was put in bilingual school. I was like, in first grade, I mean, in bilingual school, and I'm like, Man, I think my English is pretty good, you know? I mean, like, so I'm like, What's going on here?
8:59
So, I mean, just to give you an idea of the time in the early 80s and what was going on. But like, you know, it was very hard for school systems and people in general, just in New York to kind of classify kids, I guess. But you know, it all made me stronger. At the end of the day, it all really did make me stronger. That was in El Paso, they did it too. Or in New York, no, they say no, in New York, in New York, in New York. When I got there originally? Oh, wow, when we got there originally? Yeah. So yeah, I was probably no right after kindergarten, you know, kind of first grade, second grade kind of pay off. I wonder when people asked you when you were little, let's say, you know, 910, 11 years old. I wonder if they asked you if you were Mexican or American, what you would have said? That's a great question, because it's like, you know, that bi cultural feeling of like, I know people I don't know. I'm sure you've heard this, or you've even said this yourself, that it's like I'm too I'm not American enough for the North, but I'm not Mexican enough for the South. It's like I'm kind of neither here nor there. And I know a lot of that generation is like that, because they feel that pull to their culture, to their heritage, but they don't. They're not really born there. So it's.
10:00
It's a struggle. And to your beautiful, you know, driving force behind your podcast is the idea is that the immigrants, right? And but it's not just Mexicans or Latinos that go through this. It's everybody. You know, imagine all the Korean have a lot of Korean American friends, and they're it's the same deal with them. So everyone's kind of navigating these waters. And I think the word authentic and keeping it real, and what that really means is such a broad term, you know, I'm saying, like we now. I mean, how do you define that? I mean, you know what I'm saying, and I really, you know, I struggle at times. The reason why I wanted to do this podcast a lot was to talk to immigrants, obviously, because we all like talking to each other and learning about each other, but also to everyone else. It's like we're all really immigrants. I mean, it just goes. It's really a technicality of how many generations have you really been in this country? But I've been here for a very long time, but I am an immigrant. I mean, in so many words, because my family was not from here. They were from Eastern Europe. So it's like all of us have come from somewhere. So it's being able to be sensitive to the fact that we're all in the same boat, more or less. We all came together through immigration on some level at some time in our lives. So it's, it's, it's fascinating. And I think it's really beautiful to recognize that Andrea, and I just think like, you know, you think about, you know, the African influence in France, for instance, you know when, when the when the wars broke out and French was fighting, guess who's fighting alongside them? Africans, Algerians, all these other people, like, they're right there and they're waving the French flag. So, you know, I'm saying, and they're not necessarily spun there. And it just, I just think it's, I just think it's very important to like, you know, kind of understand, you know, people can adopt their own home. You can still be an immigrant and adopt a new home, Absolutely, in fact, with that being said, I read your book. I have it here, this amazing book. It's so good. It's called where I come from and life lessons of a Latino chef. And it's really good. I was like, enthralled with it, because I'm an immigration attorney and I've been doing this forever, and I love the story, and I love the story of the struggle, of the accomplishments, of the lessons. But there's a few quotes in there I have to tell you that I actually wrote down because I wanted to talk to you about them. I know I couldn't resist, because it's like some of them are so in line with what this is about and about immigrants in general, that I have to share them and I want to talk to you about them. So one goes exactly with what you just said. This is what you said about the people in the kitchens where you're working. In your book, it says we were justifying our existence in what was for a lot of the team, an adopted country, one that was not always hospitable. We weren't just cooking. We were improving the value of our very culture. How powerful is that quote? I mean, with you working in the kitchens for all these years. I'm sure you've seen so many immigrants and what, what kind of struggles Did you see them go through? Oh, my God, I What do you want me to start? I mean, you know, let's look at any policy, anything else. Obviously, we're not talking about that, but it's more about all I know is I saw young Mexican guys ladies coming to me and said, I want an opportunity. And that's all. And I mean, I can tell you very strongly that the connection, the cultural connection, was very powerful. I remember I would have a young kid come to me and said, Look, I want to work. And he was recommended by somebody else. And then they would work, you know, they would live, you know, six, eight guys into an apartment, a two bedroom apartment, and they would work in shifts, you know, I'm saying so they two so two guys, two guys shared the same bed, basically, right? So one guy would work in the morning, one guy would work at night. He they cleaned the bed and then, like that. And that was kind of like, like, a big part of it. And, you know, especially in New York, you know, the big joke is that the majority of Mexicans that immigrate to New York are are from Puebla, right from the state of Puebla. So they the big joke is called Pueblo York. And said, Whoever York? So it's called Puebla York. And then it got to a point so much that where they had a direct flight from JFK to just because it
13:59
was like, that powerful. You know what I mean? And this is just beating candid like shit. I remember we opened for brunch one time at one of my restaurants, and I told the boys, I'm like, Hey man, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna work hard Saturday, but I need everybody here early on Sunday, because we're gonna lunch, lunch, brunch or whatever. And then I, you know, I always give the guys beers at night after they're done with their shift or whatever, and all that good stuff. And then I came in. I told to be there at eight. And of course, I came in at 630 to try to check on everybody and just make sure. And then the boys are all in the prep in the prep room, on cardboard boxes, sleeping because they had too much to drink, and they just didn't want to miss the shift. They didn't want to miss the ship. You know what? I'm serious. It's responsible. How can I get mad at him? I can't get mad. I'm like, Okay, guys, just here's a little bit of soup or whatever. We'll go, we're gonna get through the day. Yeah, and I'm sure you ran into other other than Mexicans in the Latin community in New York was huge, right? I mean, I can imagine it's like the whole world is sitting in New York, especially the whole Latin world is sitting in New York. So I'm sure you, you ran into tons.
15:00
And tons of people, absolutely, and like, you know. So I went to junior high school in a school called Booker T Washington, 107th and Columbus, which is in, you know, Harlem, kind of like the beginning part of Harlem. And at that time, there was very few Mexicans in New York in general. But so all people I went to school with was Cuban, Dominican, Puerto Rican, you know, I mean, but I played basketball so, so all my friends were African American, so it was like, kind of like, this weird it was like, kind of this weird thing, you know, I mean, where I was just like, I played ball, and, you know, my buddies were this and that, whatever it was great, you know. And growing up in New York City, it's like, I got to know, you know, quirky Jewish writers. I got to know really cool uptown smooth jazz musicians. I got to, you know, I'm saying so I got to see the gamut. And I don't think I'd be the man I am today. Have I not been exposed to that diversity? Yeah, like a melting pot that translated into the kitchens also and into the food and also? Yeah, there's one more quote before we move on, that I need to do, which this one actually put the hair on the back of my neck. It stood up a little bit. It's a powerful thing to taste food associated with a personal memory, and it's eye opening when it comes from someone's past. Eating a cook's food is like reading a memoir. It's a window into another world, another culture, another history, another soul. I mean, I couldn't say and you know what it reminded me of? I don't remind me of ratatouille. Remember the movie, of course, my favorite, sitting at the table and he drink, and he eats the ratatouille the critic, and it takes him back to his mom's table when he was a little boy. He was queer. And I just think, as such an incredible chef and been doing this for so long, I would love to get your, you know, kind of your take on this quote from your book, and also the idea of, like, how food is kind of an immigrant in itself, right? Because food immigrates with the people. And I think we really lose sight of that, that we wouldn't have Indian food and Italian food and Chinese food and Mexican food, we wouldn't have all this if we didn't have the people that brought it here? Yeah, absolutely. Well, I wouldn't recommend everybody a great book. Okay, right now, where you spoke, where you spoke to Andrew? I'm sure you're a reader like I am, but there's a book called near 1000 tables, and it's from an author named Felipe permestone. And I've never met the man. I just want a fan, but he talks about something very interesting about the idea of the Columbus Exchange, which is like, the idea of like ingredients migrating from place to place, right? And how sometimes it has religious
17:30
indications or indications, and it has, you know, and other other sort of, you know, reasoning behind it. But the like, the one thing I'll give you an example, you know, tomatoes are from the New World, right? But they're allowed to proliferate in Italy, right? But if you look at a map, they're the same at the same latitude. So the idea is that,
17:51
the idea is that the the actual weather patterns are similar, the soil content might be similar. Oh, you know, etc, etc. So, you know, it's interesting. Why do you think they have in Napa Bordeaux blends, because we're saying, you know, I'm saying, like, all that kind of thing, but tomatoes, like, when I go to other countries and I eat a tomato and, like, let's say, you know, Argentina, because I go there a lot, it's not the same tomato as the tomato I eat in the States. I do. It does not taste the same. And I'm not, don't want to be mean to the United States, but I will tell you, I'd rather eat a tomato in in Argentina than I would here. But so when the food immigrates to the US, right? With everybody this, the taste can't be the same, right? Yeah. Well, you know, also, there's a lot of old school things that we do in those in other countries instead of America, like, I'll give you an example, tomatoes should never be refrigerated. Me refrigerate tomatoes here. They should be left out. That's why that Argentinian tomato you had is probably perfect. Eggs, another example, and you go to any other country, usually eggs are outside. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, these kind of things as a chef perspective, is why that food is so ephemeral. Another term I love is like, you know, your life will never be perfect, but it can be purposeful. You know, it's like, if you play soccer, if you play soccer, you're gonna make a friend or an enemy anywhere in the world, but if you cook, you're gonna make a friend. You know I'm saying, and it's just like, and I encourage everybody that's watching this beautiful podcast is just to be like, look you like you said, we're all immigrants. But if you have an old person that or older elder person said, Sure, I'm gonna get my asking. But if you have an elder person living in your language, exactly, if you have an elder person living at home, interview them,
19:31
watch them quote and have that catalog. Because I promise you, when they leave this world and you see them again, they can be like, Hey, how come the hell you didn't, you know, video me making my favorite soup, yeah? Because it's like, in that quote you had from your book, it's like, that's where the story comes through, sometimes, just through the food. No, it's absolutely, yeah. The other thing related to food is
19:55
the idea of, when you go, for example, Mexico, you know, every.
20:00
State in Mexico has a different flavor, has a different type of food. Sonora or Sinaloa is different than Mexico City. And it's funny, because in the United States, a lot of what we we identify is everything's the same, right? All Mexico, we're gonna go eat Mexican tonight. We're gonna go eat Italian tonight. We're gonna eat Chinese tonight. It's not really this idea of that specific food from specific places, I will tell you. And I'm sure you know way better than I know that there are little holes in the walls all over the US that you know have food from Sinaloa. You know someone who's from Sinaloa, cooking Sinaloa and food, but most of the time it's kind of lumped absolutely you're brilliant and you're doing your research, because it's the truth. You know, I hate, I hate, I hate the idea of like, oh, what's the next trend? And, you know, I talked to my comparing
20:44
Manny about this all the time, you know, he's Chilango. So I hate to say it, but you know, the chilangos are, you know, what the word Fresa means for us. Like, when you're like, kind of highfalutin, you're like, you know. So everyone from Mexico City, you know. But that's like, more like, like, rich people. Benny's not rich because he's rich in France and
21:07
he's rich in love and best one of the things that's very interesting is, like, you know, when you have somebody like a compadre, you should have a commodity. I'm sure you have a commodity, right? So your competitor is like, a double best friend. It's like your brother. But like, you know, I mean, so when I say my compa, everyone knows what's up. You know me, it's like next. We've gone to another level of like protection and care and love so but when it comes to that, I get asked all the time, what's next, fans? And the one trend I say, there's gonna be a regionality of Mexican food. There's going to be specific spots that are going to dedicate to certain regions of Mexico. I mean, we're seeing it with the birria quesadilla and all that kind of shit. And that's just like a bar snack in Mexico, to be honest. Like, like, Manny and I will go to Mexico Jalisco. We're never gonna go and say, Oh, mentor, stay una biria. No, we're gonna go to Palenque and get a proper birya. That's what we're gonna go do. Or we're gonna get a porta huara, you know, I'm saying nice and sloppy. We're going to do all of that good stuff. So it's just like, it's very interesting to say that. But go to Mexico City. I will tell you this. If you want to get a breadth of all the regional food in Mexico, go to Mexico City, because you'll find it all there. So we know you're a chef, we know you're incredible. We know you're on TV. We know all these things, but give me, I mean, I know you've been asked this 1000 times, but when was the moment, and I kind of know from your book, but I want the listeners to really hear your story, when was it the moment that you knew that that was what you wanted to do with your life? I mean, it was a gradual beginning as an adolescent, but I think, you know, in the opening passage of the book, I'm pretty sure I referred to that moment I had, and diodos muertos, where I just, like, you know, to be that young and to understand the importance of death, you know, food and mole and all these beautiful things. At one moment, I knew it was important, like I knew that this was not something that was going to be fleeting or something that was not going to have a purpose. So I wanted to make sure that I can pay homage. And I'll tell you, really honestly, I didn't tackle Mexican food very early in my career, because I was like my mama told me she was, you need to be learned on this food, son, you need to be learned. And I said, Okay, so I started doing nuevo Latino. I started doing all of that stuff, like, kind of an amalgamation of, like, Latin cultures. And then when I felt that I was studied enough, then I opened a Mexico in Australia. Is that when you opened centrico, when you Yes, when I always had homage to Mexico, yeah. And how did it feel to finally do that after all those years? Well, you know, it's interesting my mom and, you know, Sarah Martinez, a great pioneer Mexican cuisine in New York City, and just the doyen and, you know, the woman my hero, but the idea of her being so critical with me and giving me tough love about the food, and then we got reviewed in the New York Times at the same time, which was insane. She lost stars. I gained stars. It was like, oh, crazy. Shit. You know, I'm like, wow, so. But I felt like, I bet it was time. You know, it was 2003 2004 I mean, that's 20 years ago, you know? I mean, so I thought that was ready. And did you have competition with your mom? Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely she would she like, I'll give you an example. She brought me to what you doing? I go
24:18
like, I know I'm scared. Like, told her at the restaurant. She was VI, two restaurant, boy, go to your restaurant. Why are you at your restaurant? I go, Mom, I'm down the street. I'm gonna get fish at wild edibles or something like that. And she go to the restaurant. Now. So which of your restaurants do you think would be the most significant out of all the restaurants? Oh, my God, my baby. My baby. It was everything, you know, every chef should have their first, their first restaurant where they, like, they'd cut their teeth
24:47
and just be
24:49
on, you know, not bashful, and just speak to speak to food that talks to you. You know, I'm saying, and I was very blessed. And I would literally, like, get whatever I mean, like.
25:00
Before I would go to the farmer's market in Union Square, I would pick up ingredients, and I would make a menu and a chalkboard, me and three and three immigrants, four immigrants and myself included, and we would just roll. We would roll. And it was when, you know, New York was and the Lower East Side was popping. It was busy, like we never thought we were not going to be busy, you know, I'm saying, and it was just like we were always jammed. And it was just great. It was like a electric field every day when I walked in that roof, in that building, you know, I was like, What
25:32
and Why did that? Why did that story end? Why did that? Why did you close that restaurant? Because, you know what ends up happening, Andrew, I mean, it's like just a corporatization of restaurants. Sadly, what ends up happening is, and it just, you know, I'll give an example, if I was a sous chef working for me, or whatever, somebody else and they want to go out and venture on their own. Absolutely, I support you 100% but what, normally, what you would do is you would assume another restaurant that was fledgling, and you would do something called key money. You would offer the money to assume their lease and anything inside, and you start again, a little refurbished, blah, blah, rename it la, la, la. But now that happens is now all the old school restaurants in New York are being a Chase Bank, Dwayne Reed, a CDs bank, you know, I'm saying so for a young person to strive out and go on their own, you need enormous amount of capital. That's a shame, you know. And I really encourage everyone that's listening to this shepherd in the culinary world is, you know, think about other markets. You know. Don't go to the big boys necessarily. You can be, you know, and a really full set well, I don't say secondary city, but another city where you can have a great family life and you can also do well. So you're known as, like, almost an ambassador to Mexican food, right? Do you feel pressure for holding that kind of title? Absolutely. And Adam there, I'm sorry. Andrea, and to everyone that's watching, you know, you go to a Latin you go to a French restaurant, Italian restaurant.
26:59
Who do you think? Who do you think is in the kitchen cooking your pasta, your Italian pasta? It's usually a Latino. I'm sorry, you know, so it's like, so when I walk into a damn restaurant, everyone comes out and they're like,
27:12
you know, that's our own. That's our guy. So I would present every Cook, every immigrant in the kitchen, and then in some short way that they're like, that's our guy. Well, they're very lucky to have you, that's for sure, because to have the face and and what you're doing for the community and everything is incredible. And one reason why I wanted to have you on this show, because I watch, I see what's going on out there. As immigration attorney, I see a lot, and, you know, I really it's very I'm sure they're very happy to have you in that position. The idea being, is that you on the front lines. My twin brother is a lawyer. I understand how hard it is, you know, and you do. You're doing God's work. And it just, it's a really beautiful thing, Andrew, and that's the reason I wanted to come on the show, because I'm just a guy. I understand exactly what you're facing, because I've dealt with it in kitchen, and I've seen policy change. I've seen I've been, I donated, you know, I've fronted kids money to go back to Mexico to see their families. I've done all of that. Yeah, I think it's, it's so important for us to all celebrate the immigration and try not to let TV and politicians, dictate what we believe immigrant is. I mean, that's really what it is. But I know I'm going to lose you soon, so I'm going to ask you a couple of other things. I'm dying to know, if you weren't going to be a chef, a little birdie told me that you wanted to be a mariachi singer. Is that true? Me consider,
28:38
regardless,
28:40
in your skin, I'm angry. Well, I'd hire you. I'd hire you so you're good. You have your future set. So if you lose your chef, if you're not gonna be a chef anymore, you'll do that. Oh no, of course. There's something about tight stretchy pants. If
28:56
I give you a little more tequila, I'll get more. I don't know. I know. No, I'm gonna bite you to the house, and we'll go, you're your husband, or whatever. We'll bring the whole crew over, and we'll have a good time. When we visit, definitely, New Orleans, we will be going to that restaurant. That's for sure. I love that. I love that. Well, first of all, before I let you go, there's two things I want to a final note, but I also want to ask about your tattoos really quick, because you are covered, from what I understand from here down, in tattoos. And what is the fascination with tattoos, and also chefs, many, many chefs. I mean, they have so many tattoos. Well, the idea is, like, I guess it was like, kind of going to the Anthony Bourdain thing of being pirates in the kitchen and doing all that kind of stuff. And tattoos kind of go align with that. I just think nowadays it's kind of got a little bit, you know, you know, I own tattoo chef in New York City called Daredevil. So if you guys ever want to come and get a tattoo, come see us later. Oh yeah, you know me, it looks like I'll be there getting tattoos. I just think, I think it goes in line a little bit with that. I, you know, to be very honest, the tattoo and the pain is kind of therapeutic for me. It sounds like cathartic, you know. And some people feel that way as well, you know. So.
30:00
So I guess it's kind of representing the culture of Magdalene dove, perfect. Okay, you're a first generation immigrant, right? That's why I'm going to label you, and you already kind of said it. But if you were to give anyone out there who is a first generation immigrant any advice of you've already given us a lot, but anything else that you can kind of leave the podcast with a thought about what you could give them and their families, who are first generation, you know, they just arrived here, about how to, you know, branch out, and how to become ambassador for their own culture. Again, venture to the country of origin of your family, absolutely do that for sure, and don't go to damn Disneyland. And make it a point, I'm sorry, and find out the cool things down there, and figure out what aspects of your family's culture that speak to you, whether it's the music, whether it's the art, whether it's the food, there's so many things I can touch to you, and I really encourage all of our parents, or Latino parents, immigrant parents as A whole, to do it young. Don't find excuses. You know, I'm saying because that's I made the mistake. You know, I'm saying I'm a flaw to you, man, like everybody else. But you know, I know how to go back. Also, keep the language, keep the language and check and always love grandma's food. Grandma's food's always the best, because grandma's food's never in a rush. Always remember that that food has all day to cook. Okay, so checkbook, when I'm on Excellent. Well, thank you so much. Aaron, so much. Thank you for coming on. And we'll have to do this again, because I have so much more to talk about. Exactly. Andrea, I promise you, I'll be back. I need to leave it to just a little taste. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Thank you. You
31:40
you.
There's a great scene in Spanish. She goes, cuando pieves Tu lengua, pieves tu patria. You lose your tongue, you lose your country. When was it the moment that you knew that that was what you wanted to do with your life? Oh, my God, what do you want me to start? I mean, when a human right immigrates the United States, there's an assimilation that happens, and there's a change. So it would only be natural that the same thing would happen with food if you weren't going to be a chef, a little birdie told me that you wanted to be a mariachi singer. Is that true? May consider
0:29
this evening, the reason why
0:34
I wanted to do this podcast a lot was to talk to immigrants. Obviously, because we all like talking to each other and learning about each other, but also to everyone else. It's like, we're all really immigrants. Life will never be perfect, but it can be purposeful. You know, it's like, if you play soccer, if you play soccer, you're gonna make a friend or an enemy anywhere in the world, but if you cook, you're gonna make a friend. Well, salud, you
1:03
welcome to interviews with immigrants, the podcast where we celebrate the positive side of immigration by cutting through the politics and sharing the real stories, the heart, the humor and the humanity behind every journey. I'm Andrea Shev, your host, and trust me, you picked a great episode to join us. We're exploring how one man's love for food became a powerful way to honor his roots. They say food can highlight history, be a window to the world and, of course, tell delicious stories. And today, this guest has made it his mission to do just that. He's a chef, a TV personality, author, entrepreneur, and proud Mexican American who believes preserving one's culture is an essential part of the immigrant story. You've seen him as a judge on Master Chef, a fan favorite on chopped and in his own culinary travel show, taco trip. He's also stars in Hulu's talking sabor, where food meets heritage in the most personal way. But today, we're diving deeper into this journey and his roots that have shaped him, and we're gonna drink a little tequila along the way. Please welcome the brilliant chef. Aaron Sanchez, I am so delighted to be here with you. You have no idea I am a fan. I you know what? You're the person that just tackles great topics. And I'm just saying how delighted and honored I am to be here. Thank you so much for spending the time with us, and I can't wait to jump in, but before we get in, we got to start with a little bit of tequila. So I already poured mine
2:29
tequila. I have all of them here, but I'm going to just do the BLANCO Right now. So I just wanted to before we start into your life, I wanted to give you time, to give you a perspective on tequila and the Mexican identity. Where is the connection between tequila and Mexican identity? Well, I mean, you know, it's funny, because our family, our family has, you know, in Chihuahua and Sonora, you know, my family are ganaderos, which means cattle ranchers and manage candle but, you know, up in the north, tequila, yes, is drank, yes it's yes, it's celebrated. But you know, we have other other spirits that are derived from agave and others and other things, like so toll and bacanora and all these other different things. But when you argue about what is the most Mexican state of all Mexican states, you're talking 3232 states. We're, you know, you know, my dear comparing here Manny, you know, nowadays kind of designated some places of Mexico City as their own states, but 32 to be clear, and then with a little bit of sort of wiggle room, but you know, Jalisco is the birthplace of mariachi. It's the birthplace of tequila. It's the birthplace of like the enchiladas, the birria, like all of these unbelievable, iconic elements of Mexican culture that are just, they're just frozen there. And you can't deny it. It just permeates every element of Mexican culture, you know, so and tequila, I really believe, has that, has that the presence of it. You know what I'm saying? Like, like the OG status and like, when you think of Mexicans, you think maybe, yeah, you think of taco them, air, guacamole, but you when it comes to spirit, you know what I mean? Well, salud, it's
4:08
a
4:09
good way to start the Absolutely, yeah. And you know what they say? Like, when you drink a little bit in the morning, like sommeliers like to drink at 1110, in the morning. Oh, then I am like, right, right on time. I'm like, perfect then all day long, because it's like your palate is more more astute at that time. So all right, let's jump in. Let's start with your early years of your life. I know you were born in El Paso Texas, was right near the border of Mexico. So how was it growing up in a little city? Well, it's not that little, but near such, close to Mexico, you know, it's a very good question. My mom was born in Agua Prieta, in Sonora, and my dad was born in Okinawa, kind of down on the on the shore, down the valley, but, like, moved to Valentine, Texas, and kind of grew up in the valley back in the, you know, in the early days. And, yeah, so, you know.
5:00
The best thing I can describe is that I've had two feet in two different cultures, you know. So, you know, for Spanish is my first language is the month, to be very honest, it's the most, the most I feel most comfortable in at times. And, you know, growing up in El Paso Texas, you know, you know, till my daddy was still alive, it was always going to Mexico in the summers and visiting with my cousins at the ranch in Mexico. And they would give me, you know, a bunch of crap about being a city slicker and all that kind of stuff. So it was very much by culture, but we, we always spoke Spanish. And there's a gay there's a great scene in Spanish, because when the pieves to lengua, pieves to patria, and you lose your tongue, you lose your country, and it's so important, and I'm so grateful that all of my family instilled those virtues about, you know, connecting with the language, because it just it allowed me to connect, and allowed me to stay in touch. Yeah, and then it was good, you know, I felt very Mexican, but when we moved to New York, it was like a very different vibe. So two things I want to hit on. The whole thing about the language is so important. I know I'm married to an Argentinian. When I met him, he forced me to learn Spanish, and it was a torture, of course, but thank God I learned it right, because when I went to Argentina all the times, I was able to connect with his grandparents, I was able to connect with his friends. And you lose that connection if you don't have the language, because it only goes so far, right? I mean, you only can communicate so much and be connected to your heritage if you don't have the ability to communicate. Yeah, absolutely. And then if you want to even think about it, just on a personal level, imagine my son. You know, my son is 14 now, you know, and I did the best I could to put him in immersion school very early on in his life and make that, make that a very big priority. But, you know, at the same time, you know, they lose interest. And you know how I got goals, but you know, I just try to surround them as much around Spanish as possible. Because also remember this all the parents out there that have kids, you know, of our same similar story. You know, you also expose other different business opportunity if you're bilingual, you know, I'm saying my twin brother had an opportunity to go to Santiago, Chile when he got out of law school and, like, literally go out there and do his thing, because he spoke Spanish, you know, I'm saying, so there's a lot of opportunity just about the culture, yeah, and there's a lot of places you can go in the world If you speak Spanish, especially Spanish, that you can have connection with the people that you would never have if you don't have that second language. So language is key. The big question is, you know, when you move from El Paso to New York, but the big question to me and probably a lot of people that are listening to the show, because this show is called interviews with immigrants, but technically, you're really not an immigrant, right? I mean, technically, you were born in the United States, in El Paso Texas. So really, you're not an immigrant. But I argue that's not really the case. And there's so so many people in this country that are in your position that were born here but grew up in their bubble, right of a Mexican family or Italian family or a Cuban family, whatever it is, and then at one point, usually when you're very little, and you start kindergarten or something, you exit your bubble and you enter the world. And in my opinion, that's a moment of immigration. So for you, I would argue maybe the moment of immigration is when you left with your mom from El Paso and you moved to New York. Yeah, you know, it's very interesting, Andrea, that you bring that up, because I do feel my mom says I'm bringing up my boys Mexican. And what that means is a whole series of
8:26
cultural behavior. There's a whole series of manners. There's a whole series of the way you address people, what we eat. I mean, it just permeates every aspect of your life, and it just, it just, you can't deny it. So, so, you know, the fact that that that was my particular narrative. I thought was really interesting. But, you know, for me, I'll give you an example. When we got there originally, we I was put in bilingual school. I was like, in first grade, I mean, in bilingual school, and I'm like, Man, I think my English is pretty good, you know? I mean, like, so I'm like, What's going on here?
8:59
So, I mean, just to give you an idea of the time in the early 80s and what was going on. But like, you know, it was very hard for school systems and people in general, just in New York to kind of classify kids, I guess. But you know, it all made me stronger. At the end of the day, it all really did make me stronger. That was in El Paso, they did it too. Or in New York, no, they say no, in New York, in New York, in New York. When I got there originally? Oh, wow, when we got there originally? Yeah. So yeah, I was probably no right after kindergarten, you know, kind of first grade, second grade kind of pay off. I wonder when people asked you when you were little, let's say, you know, 910, 11 years old. I wonder if they asked you if you were Mexican or American, what you would have said? That's a great question, because it's like, you know, that bi cultural feeling of like, I know people I don't know. I'm sure you've heard this, or you've even said this yourself, that it's like I'm too I'm not American enough for the North, but I'm not Mexican enough for the South. It's like I'm kind of neither here nor there. And I know a lot of that generation is like that, because they feel that pull to their culture, to their heritage, but they don't. They're not really born there. So it's.
10:00
It's a struggle. And to your beautiful, you know, driving force behind your podcast is the idea is that the immigrants, right? And but it's not just Mexicans or Latinos that go through this. It's everybody. You know, imagine all the Korean have a lot of Korean American friends, and they're it's the same deal with them. So everyone's kind of navigating these waters. And I think the word authentic and keeping it real, and what that really means is such a broad term, you know, I'm saying, like we now. I mean, how do you define that? I mean, you know what I'm saying, and I really, you know, I struggle at times. The reason why I wanted to do this podcast a lot was to talk to immigrants, obviously, because we all like talking to each other and learning about each other, but also to everyone else. It's like we're all really immigrants. I mean, it just goes. It's really a technicality of how many generations have you really been in this country? But I've been here for a very long time, but I am an immigrant. I mean, in so many words, because my family was not from here. They were from Eastern Europe. So it's like all of us have come from somewhere. So it's being able to be sensitive to the fact that we're all in the same boat, more or less. We all came together through immigration on some level at some time in our lives. So it's, it's, it's fascinating. And I think it's really beautiful to recognize that Andrea, and I just think like, you know, you think about, you know, the African influence in France, for instance, you know when, when the when the wars broke out and French was fighting, guess who's fighting alongside them? Africans, Algerians, all these other people, like, they're right there and they're waving the French flag. So, you know, I'm saying, and they're not necessarily spun there. And it just, I just think it's, I just think it's very important to like, you know, kind of understand, you know, people can adopt their own home. You can still be an immigrant and adopt a new home, Absolutely, in fact, with that being said, I read your book. I have it here, this amazing book. It's so good. It's called where I come from and life lessons of a Latino chef. And it's really good. I was like, enthralled with it, because I'm an immigration attorney and I've been doing this forever, and I love the story, and I love the story of the struggle, of the accomplishments, of the lessons. But there's a few quotes in there I have to tell you that I actually wrote down because I wanted to talk to you about them. I know I couldn't resist, because it's like some of them are so in line with what this is about and about immigrants in general, that I have to share them and I want to talk to you about them. So one goes exactly with what you just said. This is what you said about the people in the kitchens where you're working. In your book, it says we were justifying our existence in what was for a lot of the team, an adopted country, one that was not always hospitable. We weren't just cooking. We were improving the value of our very culture. How powerful is that quote? I mean, with you working in the kitchens for all these years. I'm sure you've seen so many immigrants and what, what kind of struggles Did you see them go through? Oh, my God, I What do you want me to start? I mean, you know, let's look at any policy, anything else. Obviously, we're not talking about that, but it's more about all I know is I saw young Mexican guys ladies coming to me and said, I want an opportunity. And that's all. And I mean, I can tell you very strongly that the connection, the cultural connection, was very powerful. I remember I would have a young kid come to me and said, Look, I want to work. And he was recommended by somebody else. And then they would work, you know, they would live, you know, six, eight guys into an apartment, a two bedroom apartment, and they would work in shifts, you know, I'm saying so they two so two guys, two guys shared the same bed, basically, right? So one guy would work in the morning, one guy would work at night. He they cleaned the bed and then, like that. And that was kind of like, like, a big part of it. And, you know, especially in New York, you know, the big joke is that the majority of Mexicans that immigrate to New York are are from Puebla, right from the state of Puebla. So they the big joke is called Pueblo York. And said, Whoever York? So it's called Puebla York. And then it got to a point so much that where they had a direct flight from JFK to just because it
13:59
was like, that powerful. You know what I mean? And this is just beating candid like shit. I remember we opened for brunch one time at one of my restaurants, and I told the boys, I'm like, Hey man, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna, we're gonna work hard Saturday, but I need everybody here early on Sunday, because we're gonna lunch, lunch, brunch or whatever. And then I, you know, I always give the guys beers at night after they're done with their shift or whatever, and all that good stuff. And then I came in. I told to be there at eight. And of course, I came in at 630 to try to check on everybody and just make sure. And then the boys are all in the prep in the prep room, on cardboard boxes, sleeping because they had too much to drink, and they just didn't want to miss the shift. They didn't want to miss the ship. You know what? I'm serious. It's responsible. How can I get mad at him? I can't get mad. I'm like, Okay, guys, just here's a little bit of soup or whatever. We'll go, we're gonna get through the day. Yeah, and I'm sure you ran into other other than Mexicans in the Latin community in New York was huge, right? I mean, I can imagine it's like the whole world is sitting in New York, especially the whole Latin world is sitting in New York. So I'm sure you, you ran into tons.
15:00
And tons of people, absolutely, and like, you know. So I went to junior high school in a school called Booker T Washington, 107th and Columbus, which is in, you know, Harlem, kind of like the beginning part of Harlem. And at that time, there was very few Mexicans in New York in general. But so all people I went to school with was Cuban, Dominican, Puerto Rican, you know, I mean, but I played basketball so, so all my friends were African American, so it was like, kind of like, this weird it was like, kind of this weird thing, you know, I mean, where I was just like, I played ball, and, you know, my buddies were this and that, whatever it was great, you know. And growing up in New York City, it's like, I got to know, you know, quirky Jewish writers. I got to know really cool uptown smooth jazz musicians. I got to, you know, I'm saying so I got to see the gamut. And I don't think I'd be the man I am today. Have I not been exposed to that diversity? Yeah, like a melting pot that translated into the kitchens also and into the food and also? Yeah, there's one more quote before we move on, that I need to do, which this one actually put the hair on the back of my neck. It stood up a little bit. It's a powerful thing to taste food associated with a personal memory, and it's eye opening when it comes from someone's past. Eating a cook's food is like reading a memoir. It's a window into another world, another culture, another history, another soul. I mean, I couldn't say and you know what it reminded me of? I don't remind me of ratatouille. Remember the movie, of course, my favorite, sitting at the table and he drink, and he eats the ratatouille the critic, and it takes him back to his mom's table when he was a little boy. He was queer. And I just think, as such an incredible chef and been doing this for so long, I would love to get your, you know, kind of your take on this quote from your book, and also the idea of, like, how food is kind of an immigrant in itself, right? Because food immigrates with the people. And I think we really lose sight of that, that we wouldn't have Indian food and Italian food and Chinese food and Mexican food, we wouldn't have all this if we didn't have the people that brought it here? Yeah, absolutely. Well, I wouldn't recommend everybody a great book. Okay, right now, where you spoke, where you spoke to Andrew? I'm sure you're a reader like I am, but there's a book called near 1000 tables, and it's from an author named Felipe permestone. And I've never met the man. I just want a fan, but he talks about something very interesting about the idea of the Columbus Exchange, which is like, the idea of like ingredients migrating from place to place, right? And how sometimes it has religious
17:30
indications or indications, and it has, you know, and other other sort of, you know, reasoning behind it. But the like, the one thing I'll give you an example, you know, tomatoes are from the New World, right? But they're allowed to proliferate in Italy, right? But if you look at a map, they're the same at the same latitude. So the idea is that,
17:51
the idea is that the the actual weather patterns are similar, the soil content might be similar. Oh, you know, etc, etc. So, you know, it's interesting. Why do you think they have in Napa Bordeaux blends, because we're saying, you know, I'm saying, like, all that kind of thing, but tomatoes, like, when I go to other countries and I eat a tomato and, like, let's say, you know, Argentina, because I go there a lot, it's not the same tomato as the tomato I eat in the States. I do. It does not taste the same. And I'm not, don't want to be mean to the United States, but I will tell you, I'd rather eat a tomato in in Argentina than I would here. But so when the food immigrates to the US, right? With everybody this, the taste can't be the same, right? Yeah. Well, you know, also, there's a lot of old school things that we do in those in other countries instead of America, like, I'll give you an example, tomatoes should never be refrigerated. Me refrigerate tomatoes here. They should be left out. That's why that Argentinian tomato you had is probably perfect. Eggs, another example, and you go to any other country, usually eggs are outside. You know what I'm saying? Like, yeah, these kind of things as a chef perspective, is why that food is so ephemeral. Another term I love is like, you know, your life will never be perfect, but it can be purposeful. You know, it's like, if you play soccer, if you play soccer, you're gonna make a friend or an enemy anywhere in the world, but if you cook, you're gonna make a friend. You know I'm saying, and it's just like, and I encourage everybody that's watching this beautiful podcast is just to be like, look you like you said, we're all immigrants. But if you have an old person that or older elder person said, Sure, I'm gonna get my asking. But if you have an elder person living in your language, exactly, if you have an elder person living at home, interview them,
19:31
watch them quote and have that catalog. Because I promise you, when they leave this world and you see them again, they can be like, Hey, how come the hell you didn't, you know, video me making my favorite soup, yeah? Because it's like, in that quote you had from your book, it's like, that's where the story comes through, sometimes, just through the food. No, it's absolutely, yeah. The other thing related to food is
19:55
the idea of, when you go, for example, Mexico, you know, every.
20:00
State in Mexico has a different flavor, has a different type of food. Sonora or Sinaloa is different than Mexico City. And it's funny, because in the United States, a lot of what we we identify is everything's the same, right? All Mexico, we're gonna go eat Mexican tonight. We're gonna go eat Italian tonight. We're gonna eat Chinese tonight. It's not really this idea of that specific food from specific places, I will tell you. And I'm sure you know way better than I know that there are little holes in the walls all over the US that you know have food from Sinaloa. You know someone who's from Sinaloa, cooking Sinaloa and food, but most of the time it's kind of lumped absolutely you're brilliant and you're doing your research, because it's the truth. You know, I hate, I hate, I hate the idea of like, oh, what's the next trend? And, you know, I talked to my comparing
20:44
Manny about this all the time, you know, he's Chilango. So I hate to say it, but you know, the chilangos are, you know, what the word Fresa means for us. Like, when you're like, kind of highfalutin, you're like, you know. So everyone from Mexico City, you know. But that's like, more like, like, rich people. Benny's not rich because he's rich in France and
21:07
he's rich in love and best one of the things that's very interesting is, like, you know, when you have somebody like a compadre, you should have a commodity. I'm sure you have a commodity, right? So your competitor is like, a double best friend. It's like your brother. But like, you know, I mean, so when I say my compa, everyone knows what's up. You know me, it's like next. We've gone to another level of like protection and care and love so but when it comes to that, I get asked all the time, what's next, fans? And the one trend I say, there's gonna be a regionality of Mexican food. There's going to be specific spots that are going to dedicate to certain regions of Mexico. I mean, we're seeing it with the birria quesadilla and all that kind of shit. And that's just like a bar snack in Mexico, to be honest. Like, like, Manny and I will go to Mexico Jalisco. We're never gonna go and say, Oh, mentor, stay una biria. No, we're gonna go to Palenque and get a proper birya. That's what we're gonna go do. Or we're gonna get a porta huara, you know, I'm saying nice and sloppy. We're going to do all of that good stuff. So it's just like, it's very interesting to say that. But go to Mexico City. I will tell you this. If you want to get a breadth of all the regional food in Mexico, go to Mexico City, because you'll find it all there. So we know you're a chef, we know you're incredible. We know you're on TV. We know all these things, but give me, I mean, I know you've been asked this 1000 times, but when was the moment, and I kind of know from your book, but I want the listeners to really hear your story, when was it the moment that you knew that that was what you wanted to do with your life? I mean, it was a gradual beginning as an adolescent, but I think, you know, in the opening passage of the book, I'm pretty sure I referred to that moment I had, and diodos muertos, where I just, like, you know, to be that young and to understand the importance of death, you know, food and mole and all these beautiful things. At one moment, I knew it was important, like I knew that this was not something that was going to be fleeting or something that was not going to have a purpose. So I wanted to make sure that I can pay homage. And I'll tell you, really honestly, I didn't tackle Mexican food very early in my career, because I was like my mama told me she was, you need to be learned on this food, son, you need to be learned. And I said, Okay, so I started doing nuevo Latino. I started doing all of that stuff, like, kind of an amalgamation of, like, Latin cultures. And then when I felt that I was studied enough, then I opened a Mexico in Australia. Is that when you opened centrico, when you Yes, when I always had homage to Mexico, yeah. And how did it feel to finally do that after all those years? Well, you know, it's interesting my mom and, you know, Sarah Martinez, a great pioneer Mexican cuisine in New York City, and just the doyen and, you know, the woman my hero, but the idea of her being so critical with me and giving me tough love about the food, and then we got reviewed in the New York Times at the same time, which was insane. She lost stars. I gained stars. It was like, oh, crazy. Shit. You know, I'm like, wow, so. But I felt like, I bet it was time. You know, it was 2003 2004 I mean, that's 20 years ago, you know? I mean, so I thought that was ready. And did you have competition with your mom? Absolutely, absolutely, absolutely she would she like, I'll give you an example. She brought me to what you doing? I go
24:18
like, I know I'm scared. Like, told her at the restaurant. She was VI, two restaurant, boy, go to your restaurant. Why are you at your restaurant? I go, Mom, I'm down the street. I'm gonna get fish at wild edibles or something like that. And she go to the restaurant. Now. So which of your restaurants do you think would be the most significant out of all the restaurants? Oh, my God, my baby. My baby. It was everything, you know, every chef should have their first, their first restaurant where they, like, they'd cut their teeth
24:47
and just be
24:49
on, you know, not bashful, and just speak to speak to food that talks to you. You know, I'm saying, and I was very blessed. And I would literally, like, get whatever I mean, like.
25:00
Before I would go to the farmer's market in Union Square, I would pick up ingredients, and I would make a menu and a chalkboard, me and three and three immigrants, four immigrants and myself included, and we would just roll. We would roll. And it was when, you know, New York was and the Lower East Side was popping. It was busy, like we never thought we were not going to be busy, you know, I'm saying, and it was just like we were always jammed. And it was just great. It was like a electric field every day when I walked in that roof, in that building, you know, I was like, What
25:32
and Why did that? Why did that story end? Why did that? Why did you close that restaurant? Because, you know what ends up happening, Andrew, I mean, it's like just a corporatization of restaurants. Sadly, what ends up happening is, and it just, you know, I'll give an example, if I was a sous chef working for me, or whatever, somebody else and they want to go out and venture on their own. Absolutely, I support you 100% but what, normally, what you would do is you would assume another restaurant that was fledgling, and you would do something called key money. You would offer the money to assume their lease and anything inside, and you start again, a little refurbished, blah, blah, rename it la, la, la. But now that happens is now all the old school restaurants in New York are being a Chase Bank, Dwayne Reed, a CDs bank, you know, I'm saying so for a young person to strive out and go on their own, you need enormous amount of capital. That's a shame, you know. And I really encourage everyone that's listening to this shepherd in the culinary world is, you know, think about other markets. You know. Don't go to the big boys necessarily. You can be, you know, and a really full set well, I don't say secondary city, but another city where you can have a great family life and you can also do well. So you're known as, like, almost an ambassador to Mexican food, right? Do you feel pressure for holding that kind of title? Absolutely. And Adam there, I'm sorry. Andrea, and to everyone that's watching, you know, you go to a Latin you go to a French restaurant, Italian restaurant.
26:59
Who do you think? Who do you think is in the kitchen cooking your pasta, your Italian pasta? It's usually a Latino. I'm sorry, you know, so it's like, so when I walk into a damn restaurant, everyone comes out and they're like,
27:12
you know, that's our own. That's our guy. So I would present every Cook, every immigrant in the kitchen, and then in some short way that they're like, that's our guy. Well, they're very lucky to have you, that's for sure, because to have the face and and what you're doing for the community and everything is incredible. And one reason why I wanted to have you on this show, because I watch, I see what's going on out there. As immigration attorney, I see a lot, and, you know, I really it's very I'm sure they're very happy to have you in that position. The idea being, is that you on the front lines. My twin brother is a lawyer. I understand how hard it is, you know, and you do. You're doing God's work. And it just, it's a really beautiful thing, Andrew, and that's the reason I wanted to come on the show, because I'm just a guy. I understand exactly what you're facing, because I've dealt with it in kitchen, and I've seen policy change. I've seen I've been, I donated, you know, I've fronted kids money to go back to Mexico to see their families. I've done all of that. Yeah, I think it's, it's so important for us to all celebrate the immigration and try not to let TV and politicians, dictate what we believe immigrant is. I mean, that's really what it is. But I know I'm going to lose you soon, so I'm going to ask you a couple of other things. I'm dying to know, if you weren't going to be a chef, a little birdie told me that you wanted to be a mariachi singer. Is that true? Me consider,
28:38
regardless,
28:40
in your skin, I'm angry. Well, I'd hire you. I'd hire you so you're good. You have your future set. So if you lose your chef, if you're not gonna be a chef anymore, you'll do that. Oh no, of course. There's something about tight stretchy pants. If
28:56
I give you a little more tequila, I'll get more. I don't know. I know. No, I'm gonna bite you to the house, and we'll go, you're your husband, or whatever. We'll bring the whole crew over, and we'll have a good time. When we visit, definitely, New Orleans, we will be going to that restaurant. That's for sure. I love that. I love that. Well, first of all, before I let you go, there's two things I want to a final note, but I also want to ask about your tattoos really quick, because you are covered, from what I understand from here down, in tattoos. And what is the fascination with tattoos, and also chefs, many, many chefs. I mean, they have so many tattoos. Well, the idea is, like, I guess it was like, kind of going to the Anthony Bourdain thing of being pirates in the kitchen and doing all that kind of stuff. And tattoos kind of go align with that. I just think nowadays it's kind of got a little bit, you know, you know, I own tattoo chef in New York City called Daredevil. So if you guys ever want to come and get a tattoo, come see us later. Oh yeah, you know me, it looks like I'll be there getting tattoos. I just think, I think it goes in line a little bit with that. I, you know, to be very honest, the tattoo and the pain is kind of therapeutic for me. It sounds like cathartic, you know. And some people feel that way as well, you know. So.
30:00
So I guess it's kind of representing the culture of Magdalene dove, perfect. Okay, you're a first generation immigrant, right? That's why I'm going to label you, and you already kind of said it. But if you were to give anyone out there who is a first generation immigrant any advice of you've already given us a lot, but anything else that you can kind of leave the podcast with a thought about what you could give them and their families, who are first generation, you know, they just arrived here, about how to, you know, branch out, and how to become ambassador for their own culture. Again, venture to the country of origin of your family, absolutely do that for sure, and don't go to damn Disneyland. And make it a point, I'm sorry, and find out the cool things down there, and figure out what aspects of your family's culture that speak to you, whether it's the music, whether it's the art, whether it's the food, there's so many things I can touch to you, and I really encourage all of our parents, or Latino parents, immigrant parents as A whole, to do it young. Don't find excuses. You know, I'm saying because that's I made the mistake. You know, I'm saying I'm a flaw to you, man, like everybody else. But you know, I know how to go back. Also, keep the language, keep the language and check and always love grandma's food. Grandma's food's always the best, because grandma's food's never in a rush. Always remember that that food has all day to cook. Okay, so checkbook, when I'm on Excellent. Well, thank you so much. Aaron, so much. Thank you for coming on. And we'll have to do this again, because I have so much more to talk about. Exactly. Andrea, I promise you, I'll be back. I need to leave it to just a little taste. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Thank you. You
31:40
you.
