Tyona Vallejo: Hello and welcome to Enough In Evolving Podcast. I'm your host, Tyona Vallejo, master certified life coach and mindfulness expert, helping you reclaim confidence, break through unhelpful patterns and manifest the relationships and life you desire. Now let's get started. Hey friends, so glad you've joined me on the podcast today. In this episode, I am sharing an interview with my colleague and friend Audra, founder of Mama Audra, and we are having a powerful conversation about what happens when the beliefs and identities we've inherited no longer feel aligned. Have you ever realized that the beliefs guiding your life may not actually belong to you? You know, the ones shaping your decisions, your relationships, even how you see yourself. That was my guess today. And if you have or are currently navigating a major identity shift, relationship change, career transition, or a new chapter of some sort. Stay tuned as Audra shares how she moved through guilt, fear, and uncertainty after a major life change. one of my favorite moments in our conversation is a simple story Audra shares about making an apple pie that revealed just how disconnected she became from what she wanted. And I think so many women. will relate to this. Now let's dive in.
speaker-0: Welcome, Audra. I'm so excited to have you on the podcast today. I'm joined with Audra, who is the founder of Mama Audra. She helps moms unravel the web of old beliefs after leaving the LDS church to discover their own identity as a woman and a mom with over. 15 years of experience in international education and coaching, she discovered her passion in supporting moms grappling with grief, mom guilt, and identity loss after a faith crisis. Audra began her career as a high school biology teacher, was raised in the church, and then moved overseas with her family to work in international schools. When she finally made the life-altering decision to leave the church, she found herself sinking in uncertainty, lonelier than she'd ever been before, and constantly feeling like she was failing her children. Through years of self-discovery and coaching, she has walked the path to uncovering beliefs that resonate, building relationships with her children based on love and trust, and navigating the loneliness that comes from starting all over again. It is so nice to have you here today, Audra. I'm excited about our conversation about really leaning into some Deeper self-trust and when you're going through a huge change in life, whether it's religious or whether it's a divorce or just a big life-altering change, maybe loss of a loved one. I'd love to kind of pick your brain here and figure out what are some of the things that have really helped you along your journey.
speaker-1: Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm really I'm happy to be here and dive into all the things.
speaker-0: So when did you first realize that some of the beliefs you had inherited no longer felt true or aligned with you?
speaker-1: I would say the first time I consciously realized it was when we moved overseas. And I really became aware of a much broader worldview. And what that did for me was it gave me physical separation from, you know, the the way that I was raised, from the cult monoculture that I was in, from the daily minutiae of it that kept me really busy. Yeah. It gave me that physical separation. And now I was being exposed and making friends with people of all different beliefs and nationalities and cultures. And it I was seeing some contradictions. Yeah. From what I would t what I was told that that would be like. But so that was the first time I think I consciously was like, I could make a different choice. But subconsciously I questioned for many years. Before that, but didn't recognize it for what it was until after.
speaker-0: Hmm. You said something that really stood out to me right now, and it was that you consciously realized you had a choice. And I find that that's a big awakening moment with most people in whatever life journey they're in, is when they awaken to, whoa, I have other choices here. It's kind of just like, such an expansive moment. It really just opens up possibility.
speaker-1: Yeah, absolutely. I think for a lot of us, whether you know, n not only people who were raised in a high demand religion, but a lot of us, you know, we were raised in a certain way with the beliefs and idea of parents and society and the culture around us. And sometimes it seems everything seems very dichotomous, right? Like right or wrong. Yes. In or out, all or nothing. And so it feels like there's really only one right way or one right choice because the other option is a as dramatic as eternal damnation, right? Yeah.
speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh-huh.
speaker-1: And so then it it doesn't really feel like a choice. It feels like you're constantly looking for the one right choice.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: And like as I started to step back from my own life and look at things objectively and start talking to people of different beliefs who were also happy but doing things totally different than how I was doing it. Like, so a choice that's different from the one I'm making now does not mean automatically wrong. you know, and heavy and evil and dark. Like there's all you know, all of these beliefs in between and all can be equally right.
speaker-0: Yes, I so agree. again, when I'm working with clients, that tends to be one of the first things that we have to kind of pick apart is this attachment to their conditioning thinking of this particular thing is right and this particular thing is wrong. Yeah. And then it's just like, wait a minute, step back. Honestly, things are completely neutral. And we've just been programmed to believe something in particular about these things. Yes. And so yeah, that's that's kind of wild, right? To
speaker-1: Is wild. And I think it takes it takes away the fear. I think there's a lot of fear of making the wrong choice. Fear of doing something wrong. And then you go go automatically to like, I I made a bad choice. I'm a bad person. Like it just go it just spirals downwards so quickly. And so there's a lot of fear. And you know, one of the things that I love now, like when I'm talking to my kids, my kids are now adults, and so you know, they're They make a lot of big life decisions now because they're young adults and they're not quite sure what to do. Like I remember when my son was trying to choose which university to go to, you know, he had he was try he narrowed it down to two and he just couldn't decide. And I said to him, What if neither was the wrong choice? And it just kind of took the fear away.
speaker-0: Uh-huh.
speaker-1: And then it made it easier for him to see it almost non emotionally and make a decision, you know?
speaker-0: that's so good. I love that question. What if neither are the wrong choice? Yeah. my gosh, you just create so much freedom with that question. That's so beautiful. What a gift you gave him. Yeah. That's so fun.
speaker-1: It just starts to take the fear away. Right. You know, 'cause there's a fear of, Okay, this is what I want, but if I make the wrong choice I'm not gonna get that and then I'm gonna you know, but if you can if you can start if you can face the fear head on,
speaker-0: Yeah. There's and that's where most people get stuck tr truly is just that fear of failing, right? That fear of making making a mistake, making the wrong quote unquote wrong choice. And really that's so, you know, made up in our own minds, right? That's an illusion that it's wrong. It's like you're either going to learn from it or it's gonna move you. closer to where you wanna go. Either way, it's it's perfect.
speaker-1: Yeah, exactly. And I but I think that that's a really hard place to get to. Right. It is being able to face the fear and take a step anyway, because many of us were raised with one right way, one w one right path, the alternative is wrong. And like as I started to, you know, learn from different people of different beliefs and different faiths and different cultures. And I also started to see that, well, they have a lifestyle that's totally different from mine, yet they actually seem happier than I've ever been. You know? that was that was a really huge shift. And I I thought I started to see that there's this diversity of beliefs and there's a beautiful diversity of beliefs. And so one of the conclusions I've come to is, you know, there's eight billion people on this planet. Why can't there be eight billion right ways to do life?
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: 'Cause it's so personal and everyone's lived experience is different. the stories that we tell ourselves based on our past, based on what we know, based on what has been brought to our consciousness. It's different for everybody.
speaker-0: Yeah, that's a beautiful thought. Yeah, because everyone has a unique journey. It's like what worked for me may not work for you. Some of the things might, but some of the things might not. And so you'll need to find your own perfect combination of steps, you know, in whatever's been planted in your heart and what you desire. Cause what you desire is going to be different from what I desire, right?
speaker-1: Yeah. And that's that's difficult for especially for women for many of us who have spent our whole life giving, serving, sacrificing, you know, on these these these beliefs and expectations that were given to us on what would make us a good mom and what would make us a good wife and what would make us a good person. And we feel this responsibility for everyone else's happiness to the point where we actually no longer know what would make us happy. You know? And when I had that realization, I I had left the church eight years prior. So I left the church when I was 35. And it was eight years of me kind of just throwing darts in the dark, like not really not really knowing how to work with the emotions that I was feeling. And I remember this is a simple story, but I think it really illustrates something that a lot of women experience. not just women who have left a high control religion, but there's a moment. So I was making Thanksgiving dinner for the family. And I still had all of that conditioning of like, you know, it has to be perfect. It has to be made from scratch. I have to predict everybody's wants before they even know what their wants are. And if they're not happy, I'm responsible for it. And it needs to just be this amazing experience for everyone, or else I've failed. But
speaker-0: Right.
speaker-1: I still had some of those beliefs and I'm in the kitchen and I'm making apple pie. And it's, you know, I'm making the crust the night before from scratch. And then the next day I'm cutting up the apples and I'm finding myself feeling really resentful. While I'm in the kitchen cutting up these apples. And I'm like, okay, why am I feeling so resentful right now? Well, I'm doing all this work and nobody's helping and I'm making apple pie and I don't even like apple pie. Like, okay. Well, if I don't like apple pie, then why am I making apple pie? Well, I make it because it's my husband's favorite. But he's never actually asked me to make it. I just have this belief that I have to provide everybody with their favorites and that will make me, you know, a good wife and a good mom. So it's like, well, okay, then I'm gonna make my favorite kind of pie. And I stood there, my mind went blank. Here I am in my early forties and I have no idea what my favorite kind of pie is for Thanksgiving. I could tell you my kids, each one of my kids' favorite, I could tell you my husband's favorite, I could tell you my parents' favorite, my uncle's favorite. I didn't even know my own favorite kind of pie. Wow. Yeah. I had spent I had spent more than forty years giving, serving, making sure everyone else was taken care of.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: I couldn't even answer such a simple question.
speaker-0: Wow.
speaker-1: So then it was like it sent me down this deep dark rabbit hole of like, if I can't even name my favorite kind of pie, how am I going to to go through this process of healing and make decisions about what my life is gonna look like now? And you know, it just it opens it's really scary because you don't know how to listen to yourself when you spent your whole life giving and socrifice makes
speaker-0: Right, right. That connection isn't even there to what you desire. Yeah. Right. so good. Yeah.
speaker-1: Do it.
speaker-0: Yes. Yes. I do definitely resonate with that story. I remember specific moments as well that completely shifted my perspective in how I was showing up. you know, trying to please everyone else and not even putting my needs on the table. Yeah. Not even like recognizing my needs, right? Yeah.
speaker-1: Because you haven't done it since you were a small child. Yeah. You know? And
speaker-0: And especially when you're a small child and you're told it's self centered. It's you're you're being selfish when you're thinking ab about yourself, when you're always asking for your own needs.
speaker-1: It's wrong to be selfish. You need to think of others first, you know, and you know, take the religious conditioning that I had, layer that on top of that as well. It was like, you know, it that's that's a sin to think of yourself first, and you're letting Satan into your heart. Right. You just need to obey and it's like so much shame. Yes.
speaker-0: Yes. So how did you go from all of that programming and shame to turning around and like figuring out your own needs and desires and getting in touch with yourself? what are some of the things that someone that might be going through the same thing you know, she's dealing with a lot of maybe mom guilt or people pleasing. And she wants to understand how she lets go of that and starts to put herself on the list there. what were some of the things that you
speaker-1: I think that's a lifelong process. I you know, I think that that that's the evolution of all of us is is coming to that, coming through that and throughout our life. the first thing I I tell women when I start working with them is let's start listening to your body. Let's because we've yeah,
speaker-0: Speak my language.
speaker-1: we've learned to distrust it. Yeah. Right. We've learned to push it down. And you know, now so I worked in schools for many years. I was a teacher and then I was a school administrator. And there we would do like child protection, child safety lessons with the kids. And one of the lessons is how do you identify a dangerous situation? And we would teach the kids the first sign is your body.
speaker-0: Mm inter
speaker-1: if you're in a situation and you feel uneasy and you feel a tightness in your chest and you feel a lump in your throat, that's a sign that you're in an unsafe situation.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: And this was not training I received as a kid. Mm-hmm.
speaker-0: Wow, I know. I didn't receive that either.
speaker-1: I didn't either. So when I'm teaching this lesson to children, when I was working in schools, I was like, this is amazing that we are giving these kids these tools to listen to your body. Because when you feel constriction and you feel like something's heavy and you can't get a deep breath, yeah, that's a sign that there's something there that doesn't align with who you are. And that's no. That's a I don't agree with this. But many times we push that down because we were trained not to be selfish, not to speak up, especially as girls, make sure everyone else is happy and just do it anyway.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: So we learn to ignore ourselves. So the first step is learning how to listen to your body, but that's difficult because you haven't done it for a long time. Right. So it has to start really small because you have to start. Training your brain of what a yes feels like and then acting on it. So your brain now has evidence of you acting on those good feelings. So like I'll give you an example. You you go out to a restaurant, you ask a man what he wants to eat, and he'll be like, I'll have the hamburger. Like he knows right away. You ask a woman what she wants, and she'll say, I don't know, what are you having? Yeah. I mean, how many times have we all done that? Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. So like start small. So when you catch yourself going, gosh, well, what is everybody else doing? You know, what when you catch yourself doing that, take a moment and like really, I'm not even kidding. Like look at the like two options on the menu. Yeah. Which one feels like, yeah, that feels good. I can take a breath. That feels light. Then that's the one you're gonna choose. And now act on it.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: Right? that's so good. Yeah. The more you do that, then your your this becomes a familiar pattern. Your brain knows what it's like to choose what is a yes in your body and you can start to trust yourself again.
speaker-0: Yes, yes. I love that. That is such a great example of taking inspired action is just, you know, creating that new pattern, that new neuropathway by just pausing before you act in the habitual way that, you know, is what is everybody else doing? I remember early on in my journey of healing through you know that type of resentment in my marriage and all of that, I noticed that I would always reach out to other people for their, validation about a choice that I was making, a decision I was trying to get to. And so I would, you know, call my friends, I'd call my mom, I'd, what do you think? Da-da-da-da. And I was like, why, why in the world am I not just Choosing and trusting myself. It was so bizarre when I noticed it. Like it was so excessive. It was just like that's always how I, decided things. It was yeah. Crazy.
speaker-1: We're always defaulting to other people. Right. And like, you know, I just recently have noticed that like when I'm traveling with my family or with my husband, my first question in the morning will be to them, what do you guys want to do today? What do you want to do today? But what if I figured out what I wanted to do today first and then I just presented it? Yeah. I mean that so that's kind of a newer one for me now. But I I think Also, in that we have to learn how to make these decisions from a place where we're more emotionally available. You know, because if we're, you know, like you mentioned ear earlier, you know, when you're feeling guilt and shame, and how do you move forward from that? Don't you don't want to be making decisions from this place of these lower feeling emotions that feel hard and heavy. Yeah. You need to you need to slowly get yourself to a better feeling emotion so you're making decisions from a place of peace and you can really hear what your body is saying.
speaker-0: Yes. So what I hear you're talking about is really just regulating yourself, regulating your nervous system, taking off any internal judgment and guilt or shame. So just like creating a sense of safety in yourself. And then once you've established that, then you can Take the steps forward to making that change. Can you give any examples of ways that you've been able to do that for yourself, create that sense of safety when you felt that those lower vibrations, those lower emotions?
speaker-1: Yeah. the first thing is to acknowledge it, right? And to be aware that it's happening. Yes. And sometimes that's the hardest because you're just caught in the well worn pattern. Right. Caught in that in that your brain knows where to go. And so you're just automatically headed there. so being being aware of what's happening first and then being able to sit and go, Okay, what's the emotion that I'm feeling here? And where is it residing in my body? And just observe it at first. Yeah. Because if you push it down, it's gonna get stuck. Yeah. Right. And you need to kind of move it through. And so you need to sit. I journal a lot. I do a ton of journaling because that's for me, that's really powerful. If I can just write it out and take the time to write it out. Like, what is this emotion? Where is this coming from? And then you know, I can do some different like emotional or nervous system regulation techniques like EFT tapping meditations are really helpful or breath work is really helpful. Just for my body to realize that I'm feeling this resentment or whatever emotion it might be, but I'm still safe.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Right. I'm still safe in this emotion. So then you don't have the fight or flight anymore. And once you can start to feel safe in the emotion, you can start to go, okay, you know, what w why am I feeling this way? What's the trigger? And what else could this mean? Because usually the trigger is based on a story that you're telling yourself. Like for example, I'll give you a personal example. So several months ago I had gotten a text message with a picture of like a family gathering. From a family member. And like I didn't know about this family gathering. I wasn't invited to this family gathering. So my automatic pattern was I don't belong. They don't want me there. I must not be loved. This is because I left the church. I'm no longer welcome. Right. That was my automatic response. And it was painful. And so I sat with it for a while And then I thought, okay, that could be true. That could be true that I wasn't wanted and I wasn't included. And what else could be true that maybe my brain is is not bringing to my awareness right now? What else could be true that's gonna feel just even one step better? Like I don't need to feel joy about getting this picture. But if I can go up from resentment to maybe worry or frustration. Right. Then that's gonna feel a little bit better. Yes. And so I sat there and I thought, well, okay, it could be true that their intention was to make me feel included by sending this picture.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: And that feels better in my body. And I don't know if it's true or not, but I don't know if my other version was true or not either. Right. And so I'm gonna choose the one that feels a little bit better. So many times it it's it's it's walking through what do I feel now and how can I feel just one step better.
speaker-0: Yeah. What does self-trust feel like in your body compared to fear and guilt?
speaker-1: For me, fear and guilt feels panicky. It feels like my heart is beating really fast. If I get flushed, it feels heavy. And self-trust feels light and expansive. Like I'm just I'm just wide open. And I feel safe in that openness.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: but that has often that's not a familiar feeling. And so, you know, that's why I say start small. What are some small things that you can do to feel that feeling of self-trust and then make decisions from that place rather from that heavy feeling?
speaker-0: yeah, I love that. And so with the clients you work with, what are some of the the steps or the framework that you use to help them lean into more self-trust?
speaker-1: one of the things we do is we start to kind of uncover some old beliefs that are there. You know, your so the type of coaching that I do is NLP, which stands for neurolinguistic programming. So it's the language of your subconscious. And your subconscious is where your identity and your beliefs and your values reside. Yep. And those inform The story that your conscious mind is telling you, your thoughts, your behaviors, and your emotions. So if we can make some change at the subconscious level, we've got to dive into i t identity and beliefs. But we have to be aware of them first because so many of them were just given to us as children from many different sources, teachers, parents, whoever.
speaker-0: Right. Yeah.
speaker-1: So, you know, the one of the things We become aware of is those beliefs that are there. Right. So you pay attention to how your body feels, you notice that constrictive feeling. You name the emotion that's attached to it. And then you can go the next step further and go, okay, what is the belief I have that is giving me this emotion right now? And this emotion feels constrictive. So there's a belief there that's not, it's not really mine, but it's still there running the show in the background. ground.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Right. Yeah. And many times it has to do with our definition of a good mom, wife, person, whatever that's given to us. And so if you have a belief that is a good mom always sacrifices and serves herself last. Right. But that feels constrictive in your body. Then let's start poking holes in that belief because your subconscious mind thinks that that belief is absolute. It thinks it's always true a hundred percent of the time. Right. And it's looking for evidence of that belief all the time. It's self-confirming, right? So let's start po poking holes in that and go and figure out where it came from. Okay, well, when did I decide that that was true? That I have to put myself last.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Who gave me that belief? Yeah. Usually it's something from your childhood, right? And it doesn't, it usually, if it's constrictive, it didn't come from you.
speaker-0: Right.
speaker-1: And then, okay, is this belief always true? Is there ever a time that this belief is not true? Do I know of a mom who doesn't put herself last, who takes care of herself and then is and then is really present for her kids? And I still consider her a good mom. So look for evidence. Yeah. That that belief is not true. Yeah. And then your brain starts to go, my gosh, this is not true. We could come up with a new belief. You're starting to dismantle that wiring. Right. And this is a process that I mean you can't just do it as quickly as I'm explaining it. Right. I mean it's it's a long process, but that that's one of the biggest things is being aware of those beliefs that are running the show in the background. Absolutely.
speaker-0: So
speaker-1: Determining your thoughts, behaviors, and emotions. Once you're aware of them, it's like, you know, I I say and I love that I think you talked about this in one of your podcasts too about affirmations. Like the affirmations, the new beliefs, but you have to clean out the old belief first, It's like an an affirmation without cleaning out the old belief is like pouring coffee in a dirty coffee mug.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: Yeah. You have to clean out the Dirty coffee mug first. Mm-hmm. Dismantle that old belief. Show your brain that there's another pathway that can also be true. And then those affirmations are going, then they're going to be helpful because you're just confirming a new belief. You've cleaned out that coffee cup first.
speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. You said something that I always talking about on the podcast and with clients is that awareness is key. Awareness is the number one place we always have to come back to. without the awareness, you can't make any of this change or transformation or you know, start to really look at the old beliefs that you have been. programmed with. You wouldn't even recognize that that is what is truly holding you back. That's what's keeping you stuck and apart from the happiness that you're really wanting or the freedom that you're really wanting. So I love that you you talked about that that is the first first place that we need to start is the awareness. And definitely that there's so much power in our beliefs and what is set in our subconscious mind and so I love that. NLP is another way to help people kind of navigate through that and completely change their beliefs.
speaker-1: Yeah.
speaker-0: So As we wrap up our conversation today, I have one more question for you that I love to ask guests that come on the show because the name is enough and evolving. And so the question is what What does being enough and evolving mean to you in this season of your life?
speaker-1: Hmm. Enough and evolving is like two truths. I can be enough for myself as I am and I can be reaching for more.
speaker-0: Hmm. So good. I love that. Audra, thank you so much for being on today. This was such a fun conversation. what an incredible journey you've been through. And it's so beautiful to hear all the stories. about your transformation. Thank you so much for taking time with us today. And where can listeners learn more about you and the work that you're doing in the world through Mama Audra?
speaker-1: So you can go to my website, which is mamaadra.com. Or on all the socials as Mama Audra. Except on Instagram. That was taken, unfortunately. So Mama Audra Official on Instagram.
speaker-0: Nice. Okay. Well, thank you again. And thank you to the listeners for joining us today. We'll see you next time.
speaker-1: Thanks for having me.
Tyona Vallejo: If you're listening to this and you're recognizing yourself in these patterns, this is exactly the work I do inside my coaching. This isn't something you have to figure out alone. If you're ready to feel more confident, grounded, and self-trusting, I'd love to support you. Check out the show notes to book a consultation coaching call today.
speaker-0: Welcome, Audra. I'm so excited to have you on the podcast today. I'm joined with Audra, who is the founder of Mama Audra. She helps moms unravel the web of old beliefs after leaving the LDS church to discover their own identity as a woman and a mom with over. 15 years of experience in international education and coaching, she discovered her passion in supporting moms grappling with grief, mom guilt, and identity loss after a faith crisis. Audra began her career as a high school biology teacher, was raised in the church, and then moved overseas with her family to work in international schools. When she finally made the life-altering decision to leave the church, she found herself sinking in uncertainty, lonelier than she'd ever been before, and constantly feeling like she was failing her children. Through years of self-discovery and coaching, she has walked the path to uncovering beliefs that resonate, building relationships with her children based on love and trust, and navigating the loneliness that comes from starting all over again. It is so nice to have you here today, Audra. I'm excited about our conversation about really leaning into some Deeper self-trust and when you're going through a huge change in life, whether it's religious or whether it's a divorce or just a big life-altering change, maybe loss of a loved one. I'd love to kind of pick your brain here and figure out what are some of the things that have really helped you along your journey.
speaker-1: Yeah, thanks for having me. I'm really I'm happy to be here and dive into all the things.
speaker-0: So when did you first realize that some of the beliefs you had inherited no longer felt true or aligned with you?
speaker-1: I would say the first time I consciously realized it was when we moved overseas. And I really became aware of a much broader worldview. And what that did for me was it gave me physical separation from, you know, the the way that I was raised, from the cult monoculture that I was in, from the daily minutiae of it that kept me really busy. Yeah. It gave me that physical separation. And now I was being exposed and making friends with people of all different beliefs and nationalities and cultures. And it I was seeing some contradictions. Yeah. From what I would t what I was told that that would be like. But so that was the first time I think I consciously was like, I could make a different choice. But subconsciously I questioned for many years. Before that, but didn't recognize it for what it was until after.
speaker-0: Hmm. You said something that really stood out to me right now, and it was that you consciously realized you had a choice. And I find that that's a big awakening moment with most people in whatever life journey they're in, is when they awaken to, whoa, I have other choices here. It's kind of just like, such an expansive moment. It really just opens up possibility.
speaker-1: Yeah, absolutely. I think for a lot of us, whether you know, n not only people who were raised in a high demand religion, but a lot of us, you know, we were raised in a certain way with the beliefs and idea of parents and society and the culture around us. And sometimes it seems everything seems very dichotomous, right? Like right or wrong. Yes. In or out, all or nothing. And so it feels like there's really only one right way or one right choice because the other option is a as dramatic as eternal damnation, right? Yeah.
speaker-0: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh-huh.
speaker-1: And so then it it doesn't really feel like a choice. It feels like you're constantly looking for the one right choice.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: And like as I started to step back from my own life and look at things objectively and start talking to people of different beliefs who were also happy but doing things totally different than how I was doing it. Like, so a choice that's different from the one I'm making now does not mean automatically wrong. you know, and heavy and evil and dark. Like there's all you know, all of these beliefs in between and all can be equally right.
speaker-0: Yes, I so agree. again, when I'm working with clients, that tends to be one of the first things that we have to kind of pick apart is this attachment to their conditioning thinking of this particular thing is right and this particular thing is wrong. Yeah. And then it's just like, wait a minute, step back. Honestly, things are completely neutral. And we've just been programmed to believe something in particular about these things. Yes. And so yeah, that's that's kind of wild, right? To
speaker-1: Is wild. And I think it takes it takes away the fear. I think there's a lot of fear of making the wrong choice. Fear of doing something wrong. And then you go go automatically to like, I I made a bad choice. I'm a bad person. Like it just go it just spirals downwards so quickly. And so there's a lot of fear. And you know, one of the things that I love now, like when I'm talking to my kids, my kids are now adults, and so you know, they're They make a lot of big life decisions now because they're young adults and they're not quite sure what to do. Like I remember when my son was trying to choose which university to go to, you know, he had he was try he narrowed it down to two and he just couldn't decide. And I said to him, What if neither was the wrong choice? And it just kind of took the fear away.
speaker-0: Uh-huh.
speaker-1: And then it made it easier for him to see it almost non emotionally and make a decision, you know?
speaker-0: that's so good. I love that question. What if neither are the wrong choice? Yeah. my gosh, you just create so much freedom with that question. That's so beautiful. What a gift you gave him. Yeah. That's so fun.
speaker-1: It just starts to take the fear away. Right. You know, 'cause there's a fear of, Okay, this is what I want, but if I make the wrong choice I'm not gonna get that and then I'm gonna you know, but if you can if you can start if you can face the fear head on,
speaker-0: Yeah. There's and that's where most people get stuck tr truly is just that fear of failing, right? That fear of making making a mistake, making the wrong quote unquote wrong choice. And really that's so, you know, made up in our own minds, right? That's an illusion that it's wrong. It's like you're either going to learn from it or it's gonna move you. closer to where you wanna go. Either way, it's it's perfect.
speaker-1: Yeah, exactly. And I but I think that that's a really hard place to get to. Right. It is being able to face the fear and take a step anyway, because many of us were raised with one right way, one w one right path, the alternative is wrong. And like as I started to, you know, learn from different people of different beliefs and different faiths and different cultures. And I also started to see that, well, they have a lifestyle that's totally different from mine, yet they actually seem happier than I've ever been. You know? that was that was a really huge shift. And I I thought I started to see that there's this diversity of beliefs and there's a beautiful diversity of beliefs. And so one of the conclusions I've come to is, you know, there's eight billion people on this planet. Why can't there be eight billion right ways to do life?
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: 'Cause it's so personal and everyone's lived experience is different. the stories that we tell ourselves based on our past, based on what we know, based on what has been brought to our consciousness. It's different for everybody.
speaker-0: Yeah, that's a beautiful thought. Yeah, because everyone has a unique journey. It's like what worked for me may not work for you. Some of the things might, but some of the things might not. And so you'll need to find your own perfect combination of steps, you know, in whatever's been planted in your heart and what you desire. Cause what you desire is going to be different from what I desire, right?
speaker-1: Yeah. And that's that's difficult for especially for women for many of us who have spent our whole life giving, serving, sacrificing, you know, on these these these beliefs and expectations that were given to us on what would make us a good mom and what would make us a good wife and what would make us a good person. And we feel this responsibility for everyone else's happiness to the point where we actually no longer know what would make us happy. You know? And when I had that realization, I I had left the church eight years prior. So I left the church when I was 35. And it was eight years of me kind of just throwing darts in the dark, like not really not really knowing how to work with the emotions that I was feeling. And I remember this is a simple story, but I think it really illustrates something that a lot of women experience. not just women who have left a high control religion, but there's a moment. So I was making Thanksgiving dinner for the family. And I still had all of that conditioning of like, you know, it has to be perfect. It has to be made from scratch. I have to predict everybody's wants before they even know what their wants are. And if they're not happy, I'm responsible for it. And it needs to just be this amazing experience for everyone, or else I've failed. But
speaker-0: Right.
speaker-1: I still had some of those beliefs and I'm in the kitchen and I'm making apple pie. And it's, you know, I'm making the crust the night before from scratch. And then the next day I'm cutting up the apples and I'm finding myself feeling really resentful. While I'm in the kitchen cutting up these apples. And I'm like, okay, why am I feeling so resentful right now? Well, I'm doing all this work and nobody's helping and I'm making apple pie and I don't even like apple pie. Like, okay. Well, if I don't like apple pie, then why am I making apple pie? Well, I make it because it's my husband's favorite. But he's never actually asked me to make it. I just have this belief that I have to provide everybody with their favorites and that will make me, you know, a good wife and a good mom. So it's like, well, okay, then I'm gonna make my favorite kind of pie. And I stood there, my mind went blank. Here I am in my early forties and I have no idea what my favorite kind of pie is for Thanksgiving. I could tell you my kids, each one of my kids' favorite, I could tell you my husband's favorite, I could tell you my parents' favorite, my uncle's favorite. I didn't even know my own favorite kind of pie. Wow. Yeah. I had spent I had spent more than forty years giving, serving, making sure everyone else was taken care of.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: I couldn't even answer such a simple question.
speaker-0: Wow.
speaker-1: So then it was like it sent me down this deep dark rabbit hole of like, if I can't even name my favorite kind of pie, how am I going to to go through this process of healing and make decisions about what my life is gonna look like now? And you know, it just it opens it's really scary because you don't know how to listen to yourself when you spent your whole life giving and socrifice makes
speaker-0: Right, right. That connection isn't even there to what you desire. Yeah. Right. so good. Yeah.
speaker-1: Do it.
speaker-0: Yes. Yes. I do definitely resonate with that story. I remember specific moments as well that completely shifted my perspective in how I was showing up. you know, trying to please everyone else and not even putting my needs on the table. Yeah. Not even like recognizing my needs, right? Yeah.
speaker-1: Because you haven't done it since you were a small child. Yeah. You know? And
speaker-0: And especially when you're a small child and you're told it's self centered. It's you're you're being selfish when you're thinking ab about yourself, when you're always asking for your own needs.
speaker-1: It's wrong to be selfish. You need to think of others first, you know, and you know, take the religious conditioning that I had, layer that on top of that as well. It was like, you know, it that's that's a sin to think of yourself first, and you're letting Satan into your heart. Right. You just need to obey and it's like so much shame. Yes.
speaker-0: Yes. So how did you go from all of that programming and shame to turning around and like figuring out your own needs and desires and getting in touch with yourself? what are some of the things that someone that might be going through the same thing you know, she's dealing with a lot of maybe mom guilt or people pleasing. And she wants to understand how she lets go of that and starts to put herself on the list there. what were some of the things that you
speaker-1: I think that's a lifelong process. I you know, I think that that that's the evolution of all of us is is coming to that, coming through that and throughout our life. the first thing I I tell women when I start working with them is let's start listening to your body. Let's because we've yeah,
speaker-0: Speak my language.
speaker-1: we've learned to distrust it. Yeah. Right. We've learned to push it down. And you know, now so I worked in schools for many years. I was a teacher and then I was a school administrator. And there we would do like child protection, child safety lessons with the kids. And one of the lessons is how do you identify a dangerous situation? And we would teach the kids the first sign is your body.
speaker-0: Mm inter
speaker-1: if you're in a situation and you feel uneasy and you feel a tightness in your chest and you feel a lump in your throat, that's a sign that you're in an unsafe situation.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: And this was not training I received as a kid. Mm-hmm.
speaker-0: Wow, I know. I didn't receive that either.
speaker-1: I didn't either. So when I'm teaching this lesson to children, when I was working in schools, I was like, this is amazing that we are giving these kids these tools to listen to your body. Because when you feel constriction and you feel like something's heavy and you can't get a deep breath, yeah, that's a sign that there's something there that doesn't align with who you are. And that's no. That's a I don't agree with this. But many times we push that down because we were trained not to be selfish, not to speak up, especially as girls, make sure everyone else is happy and just do it anyway.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: So we learn to ignore ourselves. So the first step is learning how to listen to your body, but that's difficult because you haven't done it for a long time. Right. So it has to start really small because you have to start. Training your brain of what a yes feels like and then acting on it. So your brain now has evidence of you acting on those good feelings. So like I'll give you an example. You you go out to a restaurant, you ask a man what he wants to eat, and he'll be like, I'll have the hamburger. Like he knows right away. You ask a woman what she wants, and she'll say, I don't know, what are you having? Yeah. I mean, how many times have we all done that? Yeah. You know what I mean? Yeah. So like start small. So when you catch yourself going, gosh, well, what is everybody else doing? You know, what when you catch yourself doing that, take a moment and like really, I'm not even kidding. Like look at the like two options on the menu. Yeah. Which one feels like, yeah, that feels good. I can take a breath. That feels light. Then that's the one you're gonna choose. And now act on it.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: Right? that's so good. Yeah. The more you do that, then your your this becomes a familiar pattern. Your brain knows what it's like to choose what is a yes in your body and you can start to trust yourself again.
speaker-0: Yes, yes. I love that. That is such a great example of taking inspired action is just, you know, creating that new pattern, that new neuropathway by just pausing before you act in the habitual way that, you know, is what is everybody else doing? I remember early on in my journey of healing through you know that type of resentment in my marriage and all of that, I noticed that I would always reach out to other people for their, validation about a choice that I was making, a decision I was trying to get to. And so I would, you know, call my friends, I'd call my mom, I'd, what do you think? Da-da-da-da. And I was like, why, why in the world am I not just Choosing and trusting myself. It was so bizarre when I noticed it. Like it was so excessive. It was just like that's always how I, decided things. It was yeah. Crazy.
speaker-1: We're always defaulting to other people. Right. And like, you know, I just recently have noticed that like when I'm traveling with my family or with my husband, my first question in the morning will be to them, what do you guys want to do today? What do you want to do today? But what if I figured out what I wanted to do today first and then I just presented it? Yeah. I mean that so that's kind of a newer one for me now. But I I think Also, in that we have to learn how to make these decisions from a place where we're more emotionally available. You know, because if we're, you know, like you mentioned ear earlier, you know, when you're feeling guilt and shame, and how do you move forward from that? Don't you don't want to be making decisions from this place of these lower feeling emotions that feel hard and heavy. Yeah. You need to you need to slowly get yourself to a better feeling emotion so you're making decisions from a place of peace and you can really hear what your body is saying.
speaker-0: Yes. So what I hear you're talking about is really just regulating yourself, regulating your nervous system, taking off any internal judgment and guilt or shame. So just like creating a sense of safety in yourself. And then once you've established that, then you can Take the steps forward to making that change. Can you give any examples of ways that you've been able to do that for yourself, create that sense of safety when you felt that those lower vibrations, those lower emotions?
speaker-1: Yeah. the first thing is to acknowledge it, right? And to be aware that it's happening. Yes. And sometimes that's the hardest because you're just caught in the well worn pattern. Right. Caught in that in that your brain knows where to go. And so you're just automatically headed there. so being being aware of what's happening first and then being able to sit and go, Okay, what's the emotion that I'm feeling here? And where is it residing in my body? And just observe it at first. Yeah. Because if you push it down, it's gonna get stuck. Yeah. Right. And you need to kind of move it through. And so you need to sit. I journal a lot. I do a ton of journaling because that's for me, that's really powerful. If I can just write it out and take the time to write it out. Like, what is this emotion? Where is this coming from? And then you know, I can do some different like emotional or nervous system regulation techniques like EFT tapping meditations are really helpful or breath work is really helpful. Just for my body to realize that I'm feeling this resentment or whatever emotion it might be, but I'm still safe.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Right. I'm still safe in this emotion. So then you don't have the fight or flight anymore. And once you can start to feel safe in the emotion, you can start to go, okay, you know, what w why am I feeling this way? What's the trigger? And what else could this mean? Because usually the trigger is based on a story that you're telling yourself. Like for example, I'll give you a personal example. So several months ago I had gotten a text message with a picture of like a family gathering. From a family member. And like I didn't know about this family gathering. I wasn't invited to this family gathering. So my automatic pattern was I don't belong. They don't want me there. I must not be loved. This is because I left the church. I'm no longer welcome. Right. That was my automatic response. And it was painful. And so I sat with it for a while And then I thought, okay, that could be true. That could be true that I wasn't wanted and I wasn't included. And what else could be true that maybe my brain is is not bringing to my awareness right now? What else could be true that's gonna feel just even one step better? Like I don't need to feel joy about getting this picture. But if I can go up from resentment to maybe worry or frustration. Right. Then that's gonna feel a little bit better. Yes. And so I sat there and I thought, well, okay, it could be true that their intention was to make me feel included by sending this picture.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: And that feels better in my body. And I don't know if it's true or not, but I don't know if my other version was true or not either. Right. And so I'm gonna choose the one that feels a little bit better. So many times it it's it's it's walking through what do I feel now and how can I feel just one step better.
speaker-0: Yeah. What does self-trust feel like in your body compared to fear and guilt?
speaker-1: For me, fear and guilt feels panicky. It feels like my heart is beating really fast. If I get flushed, it feels heavy. And self-trust feels light and expansive. Like I'm just I'm just wide open. And I feel safe in that openness.
speaker-0: Mm-hmm.
speaker-1: but that has often that's not a familiar feeling. And so, you know, that's why I say start small. What are some small things that you can do to feel that feeling of self-trust and then make decisions from that place rather from that heavy feeling?
speaker-0: yeah, I love that. And so with the clients you work with, what are some of the the steps or the framework that you use to help them lean into more self-trust?
speaker-1: one of the things we do is we start to kind of uncover some old beliefs that are there. You know, your so the type of coaching that I do is NLP, which stands for neurolinguistic programming. So it's the language of your subconscious. And your subconscious is where your identity and your beliefs and your values reside. Yep. And those inform The story that your conscious mind is telling you, your thoughts, your behaviors, and your emotions. So if we can make some change at the subconscious level, we've got to dive into i t identity and beliefs. But we have to be aware of them first because so many of them were just given to us as children from many different sources, teachers, parents, whoever.
speaker-0: Right. Yeah.
speaker-1: So, you know, the one of the things We become aware of is those beliefs that are there. Right. So you pay attention to how your body feels, you notice that constrictive feeling. You name the emotion that's attached to it. And then you can go the next step further and go, okay, what is the belief I have that is giving me this emotion right now? And this emotion feels constrictive. So there's a belief there that's not, it's not really mine, but it's still there running the show in the background. ground.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Right. Yeah. And many times it has to do with our definition of a good mom, wife, person, whatever that's given to us. And so if you have a belief that is a good mom always sacrifices and serves herself last. Right. But that feels constrictive in your body. Then let's start poking holes in that belief because your subconscious mind thinks that that belief is absolute. It thinks it's always true a hundred percent of the time. Right. And it's looking for evidence of that belief all the time. It's self-confirming, right? So let's start po poking holes in that and go and figure out where it came from. Okay, well, when did I decide that that was true? That I have to put myself last.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Who gave me that belief? Yeah. Usually it's something from your childhood, right? And it doesn't, it usually, if it's constrictive, it didn't come from you.
speaker-0: Right.
speaker-1: And then, okay, is this belief always true? Is there ever a time that this belief is not true? Do I know of a mom who doesn't put herself last, who takes care of herself and then is and then is really present for her kids? And I still consider her a good mom. So look for evidence. Yeah. That that belief is not true. Yeah. And then your brain starts to go, my gosh, this is not true. We could come up with a new belief. You're starting to dismantle that wiring. Right. And this is a process that I mean you can't just do it as quickly as I'm explaining it. Right. I mean it's it's a long process, but that that's one of the biggest things is being aware of those beliefs that are running the show in the background. Absolutely.
speaker-0: So
speaker-1: Determining your thoughts, behaviors, and emotions. Once you're aware of them, it's like, you know, I I say and I love that I think you talked about this in one of your podcasts too about affirmations. Like the affirmations, the new beliefs, but you have to clean out the old belief first, It's like an an affirmation without cleaning out the old belief is like pouring coffee in a dirty coffee mug.
speaker-0: Mm.
speaker-1: Yeah. You have to clean out the Dirty coffee mug first. Mm-hmm. Dismantle that old belief. Show your brain that there's another pathway that can also be true. And then those affirmations are going, then they're going to be helpful because you're just confirming a new belief. You've cleaned out that coffee cup first.
speaker-0: Yeah. Yeah. You said something that I always talking about on the podcast and with clients is that awareness is key. Awareness is the number one place we always have to come back to. without the awareness, you can't make any of this change or transformation or you know, start to really look at the old beliefs that you have been. programmed with. You wouldn't even recognize that that is what is truly holding you back. That's what's keeping you stuck and apart from the happiness that you're really wanting or the freedom that you're really wanting. So I love that you you talked about that that is the first first place that we need to start is the awareness. And definitely that there's so much power in our beliefs and what is set in our subconscious mind and so I love that. NLP is another way to help people kind of navigate through that and completely change their beliefs.
speaker-1: Yeah.
speaker-0: So As we wrap up our conversation today, I have one more question for you that I love to ask guests that come on the show because the name is enough and evolving. And so the question is what What does being enough and evolving mean to you in this season of your life?
speaker-1: Hmm. Enough and evolving is like two truths. I can be enough for myself as I am and I can be reaching for more.
speaker-0: Hmm. So good. I love that. Audra, thank you so much for being on today. This was such a fun conversation. what an incredible journey you've been through. And it's so beautiful to hear all the stories. about your transformation. Thank you so much for taking time with us today. And where can listeners learn more about you and the work that you're doing in the world through Mama Audra?
speaker-1: So you can go to my website, which is mamaadra.com. Or on all the socials as Mama Audra. Except on Instagram. That was taken, unfortunately. So Mama Audra Official on Instagram.
speaker-0: Nice. Okay. Well, thank you again. And thank you to the listeners for joining us today. We'll see you next time.
speaker-1: Thanks for having me.
Tyona Vallejo: If you're listening to this and you're recognizing yourself in these patterns, this is exactly the work I do inside my coaching. This isn't something you have to figure out alone. If you're ready to feel more confident, grounded, and self-trusting, I'd love to support you. Check out the show notes to book a consultation coaching call today.
