WEBVTT
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And now what you have with AI, you have you know what's called surveillance pricing.
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So based on what you order and what you buy and where you go, the prices, the price of a product will vary.
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Same product, identical circumstances, but you will pay less or more than than another person who ordered the same product because they built a profile up on you.
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With us, with pre search, you can't profile.
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Tim, uh, the first question always is uh why don't you do a little intro of yourself?
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You've got an interesting background.
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It seems like you've been doing a lot of different things.
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And uh why don't we start out there?
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Well, I I guess as I like to say, I'm over-educated.
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I've got five degrees, uh, speak four languages, do all kinds of other stuff.
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I lived outside the U.S.
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for a long time, uh, came back about 10 years ago to San Diego because everybody said how nice it was, and I could agree with them.
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I got involved in digital assets in 2013, where I managed the first fund in the crypto space.
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The next year I launched a trading fund, which was, as far as anybody knows, the first trading fund in the crypto space.
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And I've kept my pardon me, I've kept my foot in two different camps, right?
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In the fiat camp.
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Until two years ago, I was the CIO, the chief investment officer of a nine, almost 10-digit family office that did no crypto.
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And I grew that by 350% in nine years.
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About two years while running uh at the end of that running pre-search, while running my fund, and I created another organization which is not really relevant to this, but it's doing very well.
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And about two years ago, I I stopped the CAO gig to focus on uh digital assets and have been really, really happy um since then.
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Awesome.
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I I was not aware that you had started into crypto that early.
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Like that's amazing that uh to be aware of at that point in 2013.
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And and so, and I think a lot of people also like back.
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My first question is it's also kind of all over the point.
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What a language.
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Languages, French, uh, my French and Russian are both near native.
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I've appeared in the media uh several times, especially with Russian, and my German is call it solid convert conversational, and my English is terrible.
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All right, incredible, incredible.
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That's uh that's amazing.
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Yeah, I wish I I wish I knew more languages.
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So, all right, so with that said, we'll move on to the next topic, which is to talk about pre-search.com.
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This is I'm always looking for solutions for people that help keep them secure as well as and research.com seems like such an important no um why don't you talk about sort of your journey the quickly about the journal?
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Yep, and so how did you hang on a second?
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You're you're really you were really breaking up, and that may be because of my I've got a lot of windows open in Chrome, so I'm killing Chrome.
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Okay, yeah, something was downloading there.
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I don't know what that was.
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Okay, so uh would you mind asking that question again?
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Yeah, all right.
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So that was all awesome information, and uh, and with that said, we'll move on to the next topic, which is uh to talk about presearch.com.
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And before we do talk about actually the the actual product and service, um I'd like to understand about your journey.
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You've you've done some interesting things, and all of a sudden preesearch.com came along.
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So, what was your journey into getting into pre-search.com?
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Well, the one of the funds I founded, uh trading fund, invested in pre-search and I way back when, 2017.
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And I got asked by CNBC to give my opinion on three different tokens.
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And they wanted all what were then well-known, call them blue chip tokens.
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And I said, look, I'll give you one blue chip, one mid-cap, and one small cap, and we'll uh I'll give you that description because those recommendations because crypto is so much more even in 2017 than the top 10 or 20, and ended up having to convince the editor of CNBC Asia that there were actually mid-caps and small caps and digital assets.
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And so she let me do that.
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The small cap one I recommended in the interview was pre-search.
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And because we had we had uh, and I disclosed this, obviously, we'd invested in it, blah, blah, blah some tokens.
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Anyway, they invited me.
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Uh, the guy who ran at the time invited me to become an advisor.
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Uh, I did, I did that for four years, but especially the last two years, the team just wasn't executing.
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The the guy that ran it was just not doing a good job.
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And so I resigned as manage as advisor, outside advisor, and started being sort of a constructive critic criticizer of the product from the outside.
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Uh, it was run really badly, and about three years ago, the uh the same manager called me up and said, Tim, would you take this over?
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You're the only guy that understands the project well enough and has the business skills to be able to do it.
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And I'm not not that wasn't necessarily the case.
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I've got the business skills.
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I think other people could have climbed the learning curve quite quickly, but I didn't have a learning curve to climb.
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So I agreed to take it over, and we set up a new company in the U.S., uh, had my team, we kept about half of the old team, and for the last three years, I've been well, first year and a half or so was fixing problems that had arose, had arisen over what, six, seven years?
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And since then, we've been building, building, building, and really have the search engine in a nice place at this point in time.
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All right, awesome.
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Well, uh, as I said kind of early on, I really love anything that helps make people private.
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So um, let's talk exactly about what pre search.com is because it is a search engine.
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Yes, well, Google searches.
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It's it is when we took over, it was a meta search engine, so it would uh conglomerate results from various search engines.
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Now we have our own proprietary search engine, and so it's a it's a mix of both.
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And I actually really, really like the results.
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Now we don't have any results that come from that come from Google.
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The the beautiful thing about it, about pre-search, and this is hard to monetize this for reasons we'll I'm sure we'll get into, and that is it's not that as DuckDuckGo say advertises, we don't sell your data.
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Because even in the case of DuckDuckGo, you could have individuals within the company that have access to your data, law enforcement can easily get access to your data, regulatory authorities can get access to your data, hackers can, and the list the list goes on and on.
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We are so much pre search.
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Presearch.com is so much more secure than that because we don't collect any data.
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No data.
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To the point where the monetization issue, people have pop-up ads and all sorts of other ads, and we have ads too.
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But we literally had to design our own format so there are no trackers, no pixels, no cookies.
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You never get asked about that on pre-search pages because we don't have the data.
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We actually get requests periodically from out of Europe, because it's an international product, and people say, hey, look, under the European Act here, I'm on this is my name, this is where I live, I live in a EU country, I'm entitled to get all the information that you have on me.
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And we have a stock response, and that is as we had only, if we have that, even an email address that was provided.
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And you don't, if you register, you don't have to register.
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And that's all we have.
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I said, of all the information that we have, 90% of the information we have on you, everything except your email address was in the query that you asked us.
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So you disclosed more information to us in asking a question than we have.
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And by controlling the ad, not the content, because everyone will tell you they're private and they they embed pixels.
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Everyone will tell you they're private and they have cookies.
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We're completely private.
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We have none of that, and it's just fabulous.
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It is absolutely the safest, most secure, most private search experience available any place in the world today.
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Yeah, certainly one of the best ways to keep people private is to not have any of their data, to not store it.
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And uh and so that and that matches Afani's philosophy.
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Like if somebody came with a subpoena and said, Hey, Afani, can you give us all the data on that?
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It'd be great.
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Here, this is like three bits of information.
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We have no we have no other concept.
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Right.
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Uh so these are the kind of things that I like to hear.
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And and so, and and and not having a backdoor, like the best way to prevent uh you know, government intrusion is to um you know design it in a way that there's no backdoor that they could even uh you know really get into if you're not collecting the data, anyways.
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Exactly.
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And we we literally collect no data from anybody if they want to register and earn tokens as they search, we need an email address.
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That's it.
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Because we have to communicate with them somehow.
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But that's completely voluntary.
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Only about one-third of the users of pre-search have provided their email address.
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For all the rest, we have nothing.
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And the beauty of it is nobody else can figure out anything about you as a pre-search user as well.
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If you do a whole bunch of searches at home on particular Google or but even privacy browsers, they know your URL.
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They're storing your searches.
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They will develop an entire profile about you.
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Because we're a decentralized search engine.
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We've got and we've had up to 80,000, we really didn't need that many nodes, so we're about 15,000 now.
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15,000 nodes all over the world.
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You do one search right now, it goes through Norway.
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You do another search in a minute, it goes through Australia.
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Search 10 minutes from now, it goes through Bolivia.
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And so there's no profiling of you at all.
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It's literally impossible.
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And now what you have with AI, you have you know what's called surveillance pricing.
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So based on what you order and what you buy and where you go, the prices, the price of a product will vary.
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Same product, identical circumstances, but you will pay less or more than than another person who ordered the same product because they've built a profile up on you.
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With us, with pre-search, you can't profile because even these, if you did 20 different searches, they went through 20 different countries, and there's nothing to trace all those searches back to any individual user.
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So it's it's privacy and steroids.
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That's why I say there is nobody who is anywhere near us in terms of privacy, even if someone, another browser, were out there that didn't collect any data, and we don't know of anyone that does, but they're probably one or two out there, they won't have the decentralized network.
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So profiling and surveillance, uh, surveillance pricing and any other types of uses of profiling data can't do it with us.
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Literally, it's impossible.
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Now, is there if somebody's using pre-search, is there an advantage to then even having a VPN on top of pre-search, or is pre-search also masking the IP?
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It's an interesting question.
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We aren't we don't bill ourselves as an EP as a VPN, but effectively we are.
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Oh no, no, I'm in Bangladesh, right?
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It's static.
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With us, it's bouncing all around.
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But if you add an EP a VPN to that, on the other side of the VPN, your searches will still bounce all around.
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So you can say, okay, I'm gonna do my searches today out of Paraguay.
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And even then, you'll still every search you do will be in a different country, different continent.
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Okay, yeah, that sounds awesome.
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Sounds awesome.
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Now, in terms of the let's talk about the user perspective, how easy this is to use.
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And so I just went to my browser and I I try and stay on Brave as much as I can.
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So, for example, I just went to Brave and I typed in pre search.com, a little search comes up, it's got a little alien and a panda, I think.
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I don't know.
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That's our AI.
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Yeah.
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And and so is there is that the primary way people use it, or is there a pre-search app as well, like they can download to um you know, like a Mac or something?
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If you had used it, actually a search, you would have been prompted for an extension.
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And so the easiest way, in the way most people use it as an extension in their browser on uh uh a laptop or a desktop, there is uh an app both for Android and for iOS.
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Um, and so you know it's it's like any other browser, you can access it the whole range of different ways.
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Okay, so I did a couple searches on it, and you're right, the the that request came up, and I just haven't done it yet.
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And so uh I'll do I'll do that a little bit later today.
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But that's how easy it was for me to use.
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I just went to presearch.com, the little search window pops up, and so now what you're saying is all they have to do is do a search and look for that extension option.
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It's a little it's an innocuous little prompt on the upper upper right hand side.
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And and once you do that, then it's becomes your your default browser.
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You can turn it off anytime you want and go back to what your uh historical browser was.
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Most people here, um, like the entire team uses pre search as their default, and it's great because you know it's not often you get it's sometimes hard to get feedback from the product you have, but we're all drinking the Kool-Aid here.
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So we provide you know instant feedback.
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We have telegram channels, people provide a lot of feedback.
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Uh, and we implemented, we've probably done 80 or 90 tweaks in the last two months uh to the search engine.
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Uh developing something that a lot of any product, any uh you know, app, any electronic product, browser-based product that that you develop for general use, it's never done, right?
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It's always evolving.
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There are always changes.
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Uh the browsers themselves make changes, so if nothing else, you have to update your code periodically.
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It's it's a constant con I won't say battle, but it's a constant effort to make things relevant and interesting and look nice.
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We get comments on that all the time.
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And sometimes we've actually gotten several times, we've gotten really good comments in the morning.
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We just didn't think about it.
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By the afternoon, it's implemented.
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The execution skills of the pre-search team are just incredible.
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Yeah, one of my favorite things about it was I did a couple searches on it and I didn't have to modify behavior.
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I didn't have to think about it.
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I just basically used it as a search tool, and it just works.
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And then it's doing all these benefits that you're talking about, taking me through all these different nodes around the world.
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And to me, a real security and a privacy for it to actually work, it has to be that way.
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It has to be something where you don't really have to think about it.
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Exactly.
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You don't want major latency and everything else.
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One of the very interesting things is when you use Google as a browser and bring up YouTube or a number of other programs.
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So YouTube is the one where you're apps where you really see it, you always have ads to watch.
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We have ad-free YouTube because of the way we distribute our searches.
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So if nothing else, I mean uh it's so frustrating.
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I watch with my daughter, I'm an 11-year-old, and we watch, we're looking up something, want to see it, and she's got she's got, where does she have it where she doesn't have she's got some device, I forget which, where she hasn't installed YouTube.
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And it's like, Stacey, look, the ads that you're seeing here, because sometimes now it's a minute worth of ads, it's just frustrating.
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There's a really good reason for you to change over.
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And I don't force her, I don't deal, I don't, you know, take over her her hardware, but um it's you really see the difference.
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You get spoiled on pre-search because suddenly you're getting um you're getting ads in YouTube, you're getting targeted ads.
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Oh, this is the thing I hate.
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I do some search, and then you look at the ads, say um CNN or whatever news you watch, and the the the ads that you see are very closely related to the term you just searched on.
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I hate that.
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That means that my my uh interests are being stored someplace, and they're literal literally manipulating me to pay more attention to whatever the heck it is they're selling.
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I detest that.
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With pre search, absolutely none of that.
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You're they have no idea who you are.
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They have no idea that you're the same guy that signed into Bloomberg or whatever you did.
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It's just beautiful.
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Yeah, that's awesome.
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Yeah, so if anyone's watching this, it is definitely easy.
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You should go check it out.
00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:14.880
Now, you've you talked about a couple other interesting things that I think would raise questions with people watching this.
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Is you're talking about these 15,000 plus nodes.
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And now, are those 15,000 plus nodes just regular people like me and other people who um wanted to be part of the pre-search, I guess, backbone per se platform, and and they've set up servers and they're earning tokens.
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Is that how that works?
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Kind of, mostly correct.
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They don't set up servers.
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I mean, I'm talking to you on my you know, standard old Dell laptop, and I could easily run a node out of it.
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And every once in a while, you know, several times an hour, searches will bang through that node.
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We don't, you don't, it doesn't really put much weight, processing weight, on the computer because it's not many searches an hour.
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With uh we're at about half a million searches a day, really trying to grow that now because from our perspective, we've hit a real critical mass in terms of having a product that is really good, can stand on its own.
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We had introduced, you know, um what we call pre-GPT, so our own generative AI aspect to search.
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And we have a really nice follow-up menu.
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So if you if you're doing an AI search, you generally have to start over again for the next one.
00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:38.640
We've got a little chat bot that appears, and then you just build on that search and it and it searches, it amends what you what you searched before, which is a really, really nice, really, really nice feature.
00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:48.160
And the the when you use the search engine, you just feel much more comfortable with what you're doing and how your data is being used.
00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:48.960
Okay.
00:19:49.440 --> 00:20:04.160
So if I have a say I have an old laptop, I never get rid of my computer, so I have a stack, you know, probably four or five sitting on the the desk behind me, but I can pull one of those out and I could turn one of those into a pre-search node per se.
00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:05.599
Absolutely.
00:20:05.839 --> 00:20:11.279
If you're familiar with digital assets, you can earn pre-tokens by doing that.
00:20:11.440 --> 00:20:17.599
We have a lot of people that just have it running in the background on on uh, in your case, an old computer.
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:31.440
For the pre-GPT, because of the the various requirements of of uh generative AI, you need a GPU, and it can't be like a super old GPU, but we have other aspects.
00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:34.799
We have a we have three, four different flavors, if you will, of nodes.
00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:38.400
Some of them are CPU-based, which would be ideal for what you're doing.
00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:53.839
And those are simply where a search is, say, redirected, you know, you're it'll somebody will be in Norway, they'll search, and that search will go through your computer in the United States, and their next search will go through, you know, Zimbabwe, whatever it happens to be.
00:20:54.000 --> 00:21:01.920
Those sort of computers have very, very low power requirements, and the earnings are correspondingly reasonably small.
00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:07.839
But you know, you you pull out your tokens and sell them or do whatever once every three, four months, whatever you want to do.
00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:10.640
Some people just run them because they want to support the project.
00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:15.759
And then other people have fairly high-tech gear, fairly new gear, good GPUs.
00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:23.599
They are earning some serious tokens on a daily basis because they're providing you know serious support to the project.
00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:25.839
Okay, awesome.
00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:33.200
And and anyone listening, if you're not into digital assets, if you're not into sort of the the techie stuff like I am, I'm into both of those.
00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:35.759
But if you're not, it's that's it doesn't matter.
00:21:35.839 --> 00:21:42.559
You can you still use pre search.com, use the extension, have the and have the added privacy, and you don't have to do that.
00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:42.960
Absolutely.
00:21:43.440 --> 00:21:50.079
If you don't want to do something, the anything extra, you just want to have a private search, you don't have to register, you don't do anything.
00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:57.599
Pick up, you know, put go to presearch.com, then uh please install the extension, and nothing else of your life changes.
00:21:57.759 --> 00:21:59.839
It's really hard to get people to change their behavior.
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:02.319
We don't ask people to change their behavior.
00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:07.440
Do the same thing you're doing now, but just do it in a way that is insanely private.
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:09.920
And and still free.
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:11.200
And still free.
00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:11.680
Absolutely.
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:12.400
That's the people.
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:13.119
Yeah.
00:22:13.359 --> 00:22:28.480
Now, are there are there like maybe two or three questions that you get asked all the time, like um where you wish you had it recorded so that you know people can watch the recording a thousand times, ten thousand times?
00:22:28.640 --> 00:22:30.319
Like, what would be like an example?
00:22:30.400 --> 00:22:39.119
Is there any QA type question that you can think of that I had that I haven't asked that uh you would love to be able to answer on a mass scale?
00:22:39.519 --> 00:22:46.480
Well, the the biggest question, you haven't asked it quite this way, but I think we've answered, and that is why switch?
00:22:46.960 --> 00:23:13.359
And you know, somewhere in the various questions that we've talked about, I think it's come out, if you summarize it, it's total privacy, uh, no profiling, no surveillance pricing, um, ad-free YouTube, which is a small thing to some people, huge to others, and an ability to um earn rewards if you want by either searching, we have search staking, or by running a note.
00:23:13.599 --> 00:23:22.000
But the most important thing, you get really, really good search results that are based on just your search and not profiling you.
00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:23.839
I guess there's one thing we haven't really talked about.
00:23:23.920 --> 00:23:57.039
When you accumulate a lot of searches, the and you're using Google, eventually Google develops a profile of you and will actually change the search results to based on who you are and what they think you want to see, which is honestly the opposite of what you want, because if you're in a bubble already and you have all these opinions, and those opinions aren't necessarily not aren't necessarily all correct, you know, factually speaking, you're gonna get stuff that reinforces those incorrect, factually incorrect or your current opinions.
00:23:57.279 --> 00:24:20.319
Doesn't show you new stuff, it doesn't expand your mind, it reinforces your current biases, it's just not a positive experience, and it can lead to the sort of extremism you're seeing in in US politics, as opposed to if you just do a search and you get really objective results from across the board, it's better for you, it's a better search result.
00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:24.640
You're not being profiled, you're not being targeted with ads or pricing or whatever.
00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:29.119
It's just altogether a better and more reassuring experience.
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:35.279
Yeah, I don't people don't realize all the browser fingerprinting, what's called canvas fingerprinting as well.
00:24:35.359 --> 00:24:41.519
And I actually wrote a tool to actually validate basically do an analysis on different browsers.
00:24:41.680 --> 00:24:45.200
And you know, like in Chrome, it's pretty much wide open.
00:24:46.799 --> 00:25:00.400
But that's it's actually so Google knows you as sort of rectangle on the front angle, and we all have like a hash mark for those people that are using Chrome and other weak browsers.
00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:04.240
You literally have Hashmark tag your token help.
00:25:04.319 --> 00:25:09.279
So you go use something else if they'll use something to the website.
00:25:09.359 --> 00:25:14.079
They know they know who's coming to their website based on Hashmark.
00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:19.680
And uh a lot of people think that you know they're private, but they're not.
00:25:19.839 --> 00:25:23.279
And so it's one of the reasons why I love solutions like this.
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:37.680
Mark, I can't tell you how many advertisement advertisers and effectively advertising agencies have told us, oh no, no, no, we're completely private, we're completely consistent with your privacy policies.
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.759
And then you look at what they're doing, and it's insane.
00:25:41.839 --> 00:25:45.039
It's the most least private stuff you can come across.
00:25:45.200 --> 00:26:01.519
And just for your for your viewers, your listeners, the most shocking thing is I don't remember even what advertiser it was, but we looked at the tool they used to advertise or to monitor, surveil, if you will, their advertisements.
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:11.039
They had not only a screenshot of what every user where those ads appeared was looking at, they even tracked the cursor movement.
00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:18.319
Now it wasn't in real time, so you know, as you with old films, 24 frames a second or 36 frames a second.
00:26:18.480 --> 00:26:25.279
It was like a snapshot of every half a second, and it was low resolution, but you could see exactly what site they were looking at.
00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:32.880
You could see where the cursor was going, you could see what their interests were, and you monitor absolutely everything.
00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:35.839
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:26:35.920 --> 00:26:40.480
We played around with those kind of tools, and uh it's kind of scary.
00:26:40.880 --> 00:26:42.720
Hang on, just one, hang on just one second.
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:43.119
Sorry.
00:26:43.279 --> 00:26:44.799
Hey Mark, I'm on a podcast.
00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:45.920
Something urgent?
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:47.519
Okay.
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:49.920
I'll call you afterwards.
00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:51.200
Thank you, bye-bye.
00:26:51.440 --> 00:26:55.200
Sorry, it's my CFO, so I didn't know if the sky was falling.
00:26:57.359 --> 00:26:58.480
I know how that feels.
00:26:58.559 --> 00:27:02.400
So there's a couple people when they call me, it's like, oh, I gotta I gotta take it.
00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:07.279
Um I'm trying to think if there's really anything that I've left off the table at this point.
00:27:07.599 --> 00:27:12.799
Um, you know, it's been it's been really interesting, and and again, this is a very simple tool.
00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:14.000
It is.
00:27:14.319 --> 00:27:26.880
It's not it has to be, Mark, it has to be because if you have something that's too complex, too sophisticated, and as you said, change you know you said earlier, it's very, very easy to use.
00:27:27.039 --> 00:27:32.880
If you ask people to change their behavior, some will, of course, but the vast majority of people will not.
00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:33.920
It's just too different.
00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:49.039
Well, also, there's that tendency of a lot of people will work harder at trying to get around security and privacy than actually you know use the privacy, like they see it as a problem, and therefore they try and get around it, and with this solution, you don't need to.
00:27:49.359 --> 00:27:49.519
Right.
00:27:49.839 --> 00:28:16.880
Um, I think I did remember one of the questions um that I have for you, and and this is really more of a personal thing, but do you allow companies to I wouldn't call it white label, but can is your product built in a way that they could actually integrate it into like if they have a mobile app, for example, and they want they want to put safe search outside of a has anyone ever tried to do that?
00:28:17.359 --> 00:28:23.279
Yes, we actually have a search API, and we can send it through two ways.
00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:41.200
One is without ads, at which point in time they have to pay on a CPM basis, you know, a cost per mill or or uh uh cost per mill, which is how many uh impressions, how many times it's used per thousand, and it's it's extremely inexpensive.
00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:46.000
And then if they allow the ads to pass through, then it's free.
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:47.680
Okay.
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:49.359
It's interesting.
00:28:49.680 --> 00:28:50.319
All right.
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:56.160
I may have a I may have to follow up with you on a couple days here now because uh because I'm working on something right now.
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:02.000
Let me throw out one more thing about the ads that we have.
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.720
We had we developed what we call a background ad, like a wallpaper ad.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:09.759
We call it a PTA, a pre-search takeover ad.
00:29:09.920 --> 00:29:13.279
And we control everything on that, so it's just an image.
00:29:13.519 --> 00:29:17.920
There's no nothing at all tracking anything, it's just impossible.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:25.440
And we, and as far as we know, we were the first ones in the world, there are a couple imitators now, to develop that.
00:29:25.519 --> 00:29:29.359
So the ad formats that everyone was using, they didn't work.
00:29:29.440 --> 00:29:34.960
We didn't like them, so we invented our own and used that, and that's how we do a lot of our monetization now.
00:29:35.119 --> 00:29:42.960
So if you don't want to look in the what's behind the text and everything that you see in the search results, you know, you don't have to.
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:52.000
But our CTR, what's called the click-through rate, is higher than the average because we try to have really good curated ads.
00:29:52.079 --> 00:29:55.680
You can't automatically post them because if you can, you get all kinds of crap.
00:29:55.839 --> 00:30:06.960
So we work with each and every advertiser to keep a really high quality experience, not only on the search side, but also so that people aren't distracted by garbage ads or whatever.
00:30:07.279 --> 00:30:07.680
Yeah.
00:30:07.839 --> 00:30:20.240
You know, you you also reminded me of uh my experience with the privacy and like dark web monitoring base is you know, they claim they're keeping you private, that'll delete your data, but they'll warn you.
00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:25.039
And I've tested this with probably 15 other say, oh, that's great.
00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:36.799
You can uh um also we're interested in buying you know 10,000 names of high income, you know, con not names, but like contacting, oh yeah, we can do that.
00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:38.240
Let's put a price on.
00:30:39.440 --> 00:30:43.440
And it's like, okay, well, these these are the not the people that we want to do business with.
00:30:43.519 --> 00:30:48.559
And it's one of the ways that we selecters on on who we on who we support.
00:30:48.799 --> 00:30:53.599
Because there's a lot of uh data privacy companies that are playing both sides.
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:55.519
Well, absolutely.
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:56.319
Absolutely.
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:08.160
We find it I don't now a little bit you can find you can find companies that are in the advertising sector that don't want to collect massive amounts of data.
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:16.880
They they like that particular niche, but most people in the sector are lying through their teeth in terms of what they say they don't do.
00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:20.799
Yeah, I would agree with that.
00:31:21.279 --> 00:31:32.480
And it muddies the water sometimes when you're trying to compete with uh with with other people and and you know you know what they're collecting, and uh, but that's just the the I guess the industry we're in.
00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:42.480
Well, I think that's probably you know, a lot uh that's I feel like this is so perfect that um I don't want to extend it and kind of dilute it.
00:31:42.559 --> 00:31:45.920
It's I think all I think uh there are a lot of great information here.
00:31:46.160 --> 00:31:50.720
And before we close out, just to let you could, if you could just hang out for a couple minutes afterwards.
00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:53.759
So the upload, okay, says the upload is slow.
00:31:54.640 --> 00:32:05.599
Um, but with that said, uh Tim, I really appreciate you investing your time to come on here, allowing us to educate people on uh ways to stay private and secure.
00:32:05.759 --> 00:32:12.160
I'm gonna I'm I talk to a lot of cybersecurity type uh privacy forums and things like that.
00:32:12.400 --> 00:32:15.920
So um I'll ask if anyone wants you know an introduction with you.
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:31.519
And and uh I don't know if you do many podcasts, but uh yeah, especially especially something like this, because I really like your approach, but where we can get out to more people, get the word out to more people, because it's really it's it's not easy.
00:32:31.599 --> 00:32:35.039
I mean, we do have to change people's behavior to some degree, right?
00:32:35.359 --> 00:32:44.079
And so if you do, I mean, we've tried all sorts of things, um people trying to focus privacy forum and stuff for and stuff like that.
00:32:44.240 --> 00:32:47.119
But we're the new kid on the block, we're outsiders.
00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:50.319
So what you're talking about is effectively a warm intro.
00:32:50.400 --> 00:32:57.119
Uh would be absolutely beautiful, would uh more be more than happy to to appear on other people's podcasts as well.
00:32:57.759 --> 00:33:02.400
And not just me, we have other team members that are more photogenic than I am.
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:06.880
All right, well, uh Tim, thanks a lot.
00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:08.079
Again, hang out.
00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:16.079
I'm gonna cut cut the recording here and hang out for a couple of minutes and uh very good.
00:00:00.080 --> 00:00:04.080
And now what you have with AI, you have you know what's called surveillance pricing.
00:00:04.240 --> 00:00:10.560
So based on what you order and what you buy and where you go, the prices, the price of a product will vary.
00:00:10.720 --> 00:00:22.160
Same product, identical circumstances, but you will pay less or more than than another person who ordered the same product because they built a profile up on you.
00:00:22.800 --> 00:00:26.640
With us, with pre search, you can't profile.
00:00:45.439 --> 00:00:49.520
Tim, uh, the first question always is uh why don't you do a little intro of yourself?
00:00:49.600 --> 00:00:50.960
You've got an interesting background.
00:00:51.039 --> 00:00:53.600
It seems like you've been doing a lot of different things.
00:00:53.840 --> 00:00:55.840
And uh why don't we start out there?
00:00:56.640 --> 00:00:59.439
Well, I I guess as I like to say, I'm over-educated.
00:00:59.759 --> 00:01:04.239
I've got five degrees, uh, speak four languages, do all kinds of other stuff.
00:01:04.400 --> 00:01:06.079
I lived outside the U.S.
00:01:06.159 --> 00:01:14.239
for a long time, uh, came back about 10 years ago to San Diego because everybody said how nice it was, and I could agree with them.
00:01:14.400 --> 00:01:21.359
I got involved in digital assets in 2013, where I managed the first fund in the crypto space.
00:01:21.519 --> 00:01:27.920
The next year I launched a trading fund, which was, as far as anybody knows, the first trading fund in the crypto space.
00:01:28.159 --> 00:01:33.280
And I've kept my pardon me, I've kept my foot in two different camps, right?
00:01:33.359 --> 00:01:34.640
In the fiat camp.
00:01:34.799 --> 00:01:44.480
Until two years ago, I was the CIO, the chief investment officer of a nine, almost 10-digit family office that did no crypto.
00:01:44.879 --> 00:01:48.959
And I grew that by 350% in nine years.
00:01:49.200 --> 00:01:59.200
About two years while running uh at the end of that running pre-search, while running my fund, and I created another organization which is not really relevant to this, but it's doing very well.
00:01:59.519 --> 00:02:10.240
And about two years ago, I I stopped the CAO gig to focus on uh digital assets and have been really, really happy um since then.
00:02:10.960 --> 00:02:11.599
Awesome.
00:02:11.680 --> 00:02:15.599
I I was not aware that you had started into crypto that early.
00:02:15.680 --> 00:02:20.560
Like that's amazing that uh to be aware of at that point in 2013.
00:02:20.639 --> 00:02:23.520
And and so, and I think a lot of people also like back.
00:02:23.680 --> 00:02:26.879
My first question is it's also kind of all over the point.
00:02:27.280 --> 00:02:28.240
What a language.
00:02:30.080 --> 00:02:34.639
Languages, French, uh, my French and Russian are both near native.
00:02:34.719 --> 00:02:45.360
I've appeared in the media uh several times, especially with Russian, and my German is call it solid convert conversational, and my English is terrible.
00:02:45.840 --> 00:02:47.360
All right, incredible, incredible.
00:02:47.439 --> 00:02:48.400
That's uh that's amazing.
00:02:48.479 --> 00:02:50.400
Yeah, I wish I I wish I knew more languages.
00:02:50.560 --> 00:02:56.879
So, all right, so with that said, we'll move on to the next topic, which is to talk about pre-search.com.
00:02:56.960 --> 00:03:14.719
This is I'm always looking for solutions for people that help keep them secure as well as and research.com seems like such an important no um why don't you talk about sort of your journey the quickly about the journal?
00:03:15.759 --> 00:03:21.199
Yep, and so how did you hang on a second?
00:03:21.360 --> 00:03:30.400
You're you're really you were really breaking up, and that may be because of my I've got a lot of windows open in Chrome, so I'm killing Chrome.
00:03:31.039 --> 00:03:33.039
Okay, yeah, something was downloading there.
00:03:33.120 --> 00:03:34.080
I don't know what that was.
00:03:34.319 --> 00:03:38.719
Okay, so uh would you mind asking that question again?
00:03:39.039 --> 00:03:40.879
Yeah, all right.
00:03:40.960 --> 00:03:49.439
So that was all awesome information, and uh, and with that said, we'll move on to the next topic, which is uh to talk about presearch.com.
00:03:49.520 --> 00:03:57.039
And before we do talk about actually the the actual product and service, um I'd like to understand about your journey.
00:03:57.120 --> 00:04:00.719
You've you've done some interesting things, and all of a sudden preesearch.com came along.
00:04:00.800 --> 00:04:05.039
So, what was your journey into getting into pre-search.com?
00:04:05.840 --> 00:04:14.719
Well, the one of the funds I founded, uh trading fund, invested in pre-search and I way back when, 2017.
00:04:15.439 --> 00:04:21.519
And I got asked by CNBC to give my opinion on three different tokens.
00:04:21.680 --> 00:04:26.560
And they wanted all what were then well-known, call them blue chip tokens.
00:04:26.639 --> 00:04:49.199
And I said, look, I'll give you one blue chip, one mid-cap, and one small cap, and we'll uh I'll give you that description because those recommendations because crypto is so much more even in 2017 than the top 10 or 20, and ended up having to convince the editor of CNBC Asia that there were actually mid-caps and small caps and digital assets.
00:04:49.279 --> 00:04:50.480
And so she let me do that.
00:04:50.720 --> 00:04:54.639
The small cap one I recommended in the interview was pre-search.
00:04:54.800 --> 00:05:00.879
And because we had we had uh, and I disclosed this, obviously, we'd invested in it, blah, blah, blah some tokens.
00:05:01.040 --> 00:05:02.720
Anyway, they invited me.
00:05:02.800 --> 00:05:06.319
Uh, the guy who ran at the time invited me to become an advisor.
00:05:06.480 --> 00:05:15.279
Uh, I did, I did that for four years, but especially the last two years, the team just wasn't executing.
00:05:15.360 --> 00:05:18.160
The the guy that ran it was just not doing a good job.
00:05:18.399 --> 00:05:31.120
And so I resigned as manage as advisor, outside advisor, and started being sort of a constructive critic criticizer of the product from the outside.
00:05:31.279 --> 00:05:38.079
Uh, it was run really badly, and about three years ago, the uh the same manager called me up and said, Tim, would you take this over?
00:05:38.160 --> 00:05:42.959
You're the only guy that understands the project well enough and has the business skills to be able to do it.
00:05:43.279 --> 00:05:46.399
And I'm not not that wasn't necessarily the case.
00:05:46.480 --> 00:05:47.759
I've got the business skills.
00:05:47.920 --> 00:05:52.160
I think other people could have climbed the learning curve quite quickly, but I didn't have a learning curve to climb.
00:05:52.319 --> 00:06:09.360
So I agreed to take it over, and we set up a new company in the U.S., uh, had my team, we kept about half of the old team, and for the last three years, I've been well, first year and a half or so was fixing problems that had arose, had arisen over what, six, seven years?
00:06:09.519 --> 00:06:16.879
And since then, we've been building, building, building, and really have the search engine in a nice place at this point in time.
00:06:17.680 --> 00:06:18.800
All right, awesome.
00:06:18.959 --> 00:06:24.720
Well, uh, as I said kind of early on, I really love anything that helps make people private.
00:06:24.879 --> 00:06:30.240
So um, let's talk exactly about what pre search.com is because it is a search engine.
00:06:31.519 --> 00:06:34.240
Yes, well, Google searches.
00:06:34.319 --> 00:06:44.160
It's it is when we took over, it was a meta search engine, so it would uh conglomerate results from various search engines.
00:06:44.319 --> 00:06:49.199
Now we have our own proprietary search engine, and so it's a it's a mix of both.
00:06:49.279 --> 00:06:51.439
And I actually really, really like the results.
00:06:51.600 --> 00:06:55.920
Now we don't have any results that come from that come from Google.
00:06:56.160 --> 00:07:09.439
The the beautiful thing about it, about pre-search, and this is hard to monetize this for reasons we'll I'm sure we'll get into, and that is it's not that as DuckDuckGo say advertises, we don't sell your data.
00:07:09.600 --> 00:07:24.560
Because even in the case of DuckDuckGo, you could have individuals within the company that have access to your data, law enforcement can easily get access to your data, regulatory authorities can get access to your data, hackers can, and the list the list goes on and on.
00:07:24.879 --> 00:07:26.399
We are so much pre search.
00:07:26.800 --> 00:07:32.480
Presearch.com is so much more secure than that because we don't collect any data.
00:07:32.800 --> 00:07:33.680
No data.
00:07:33.920 --> 00:07:40.079
To the point where the monetization issue, people have pop-up ads and all sorts of other ads, and we have ads too.
00:07:40.319 --> 00:07:46.879
But we literally had to design our own format so there are no trackers, no pixels, no cookies.
00:07:47.040 --> 00:07:52.720
You never get asked about that on pre-search pages because we don't have the data.
00:07:52.879 --> 00:08:07.680
We actually get requests periodically from out of Europe, because it's an international product, and people say, hey, look, under the European Act here, I'm on this is my name, this is where I live, I live in a EU country, I'm entitled to get all the information that you have on me.
00:08:08.160 --> 00:08:16.959
And we have a stock response, and that is as we had only, if we have that, even an email address that was provided.
00:08:17.040 --> 00:08:19.920
And you don't, if you register, you don't have to register.
00:08:20.079 --> 00:08:21.040
And that's all we have.
00:08:21.199 --> 00:08:30.800
I said, of all the information that we have, 90% of the information we have on you, everything except your email address was in the query that you asked us.
00:08:30.879 --> 00:08:36.320
So you disclosed more information to us in asking a question than we have.
00:08:36.799 --> 00:08:43.919
And by controlling the ad, not the content, because everyone will tell you they're private and they they embed pixels.
00:08:44.000 --> 00:08:46.159
Everyone will tell you they're private and they have cookies.
00:08:46.399 --> 00:08:47.840
We're completely private.
00:08:47.919 --> 00:08:51.039
We have none of that, and it's just fabulous.
00:08:51.200 --> 00:09:00.799
It is absolutely the safest, most secure, most private search experience available any place in the world today.
00:09:01.200 --> 00:09:08.159
Yeah, certainly one of the best ways to keep people private is to not have any of their data, to not store it.
00:09:08.399 --> 00:09:12.159
And uh and so that and that matches Afani's philosophy.
00:09:12.240 --> 00:09:16.480
Like if somebody came with a subpoena and said, Hey, Afani, can you give us all the data on that?
00:09:16.559 --> 00:09:17.039
It'd be great.
00:09:17.120 --> 00:09:18.960
Here, this is like three bits of information.
00:09:19.120 --> 00:09:20.960
We have no we have no other concept.
00:09:21.200 --> 00:09:21.440
Right.
00:09:21.679 --> 00:09:24.960
Uh so these are the kind of things that I like to hear.
00:09:25.200 --> 00:09:41.759
And and so, and and and not having a backdoor, like the best way to prevent uh you know, government intrusion is to um you know design it in a way that there's no backdoor that they could even uh you know really get into if you're not collecting the data, anyways.
00:09:42.320 --> 00:09:42.799
Exactly.
00:09:42.960 --> 00:09:53.840
And we we literally collect no data from anybody if they want to register and earn tokens as they search, we need an email address.
00:09:54.080 --> 00:09:54.720
That's it.
00:09:55.120 --> 00:09:57.120
Because we have to communicate with them somehow.
00:09:57.200 --> 00:09:59.919
But that's completely voluntary.
00:10:00.080 --> 00:10:05.600
Only about one-third of the users of pre-search have provided their email address.
00:10:05.679 --> 00:10:08.000
For all the rest, we have nothing.
00:10:08.240 --> 00:10:14.720
And the beauty of it is nobody else can figure out anything about you as a pre-search user as well.
00:10:14.960 --> 00:10:22.240
If you do a whole bunch of searches at home on particular Google or but even privacy browsers, they know your URL.
00:10:22.480 --> 00:10:24.159
They're storing your searches.
00:10:24.320 --> 00:10:27.679
They will develop an entire profile about you.
00:10:28.080 --> 00:10:30.240
Because we're a decentralized search engine.
00:10:30.320 --> 00:10:36.080
We've got and we've had up to 80,000, we really didn't need that many nodes, so we're about 15,000 now.
00:10:36.320 --> 00:10:38.879
15,000 nodes all over the world.
00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:41.840
You do one search right now, it goes through Norway.
00:10:42.000 --> 00:10:44.559
You do another search in a minute, it goes through Australia.
00:10:44.799 --> 00:10:47.679
Search 10 minutes from now, it goes through Bolivia.
00:10:47.919 --> 00:10:51.279
And so there's no profiling of you at all.
00:10:51.440 --> 00:10:53.600
It's literally impossible.
00:10:53.759 --> 00:10:57.919
And now what you have with AI, you have you know what's called surveillance pricing.
00:10:58.080 --> 00:11:04.399
So based on what you order and what you buy and where you go, the prices, the price of a product will vary.
00:11:04.559 --> 00:11:16.000
Same product, identical circumstances, but you will pay less or more than than another person who ordered the same product because they've built a profile up on you.
00:11:16.639 --> 00:11:28.960
With us, with pre-search, you can't profile because even these, if you did 20 different searches, they went through 20 different countries, and there's nothing to trace all those searches back to any individual user.
00:11:29.200 --> 00:11:31.840
So it's it's privacy and steroids.
00:11:31.919 --> 00:11:47.679
That's why I say there is nobody who is anywhere near us in terms of privacy, even if someone, another browser, were out there that didn't collect any data, and we don't know of anyone that does, but they're probably one or two out there, they won't have the decentralized network.
00:11:47.759 --> 00:11:56.559
So profiling and surveillance, uh, surveillance pricing and any other types of uses of profiling data can't do it with us.
00:11:56.720 --> 00:11:58.000
Literally, it's impossible.
00:11:58.720 --> 00:12:10.960
Now, is there if somebody's using pre-search, is there an advantage to then even having a VPN on top of pre-search, or is pre-search also masking the IP?
00:12:13.279 --> 00:12:14.720
It's an interesting question.
00:12:14.960 --> 00:12:20.080
We aren't we don't bill ourselves as an EP as a VPN, but effectively we are.
00:12:38.480 --> 00:12:41.120
Oh no, no, I'm in Bangladesh, right?
00:12:41.360 --> 00:12:42.480
It's static.
00:12:42.639 --> 00:12:44.559
With us, it's bouncing all around.
00:12:44.639 --> 00:12:50.559
But if you add an EP a VPN to that, on the other side of the VPN, your searches will still bounce all around.
00:12:50.639 --> 00:12:54.000
So you can say, okay, I'm gonna do my searches today out of Paraguay.
00:12:54.720 --> 00:13:00.559
And even then, you'll still every search you do will be in a different country, different continent.
00:13:02.080 --> 00:13:03.840
Okay, yeah, that sounds awesome.
00:13:04.080 --> 00:13:04.879
Sounds awesome.
00:13:05.120 --> 00:13:09.919
Now, in terms of the let's talk about the user perspective, how easy this is to use.
00:13:10.159 --> 00:13:16.000
And so I just went to my browser and I I try and stay on Brave as much as I can.
00:13:16.320 --> 00:13:25.120
So, for example, I just went to Brave and I typed in pre search.com, a little search comes up, it's got a little alien and a panda, I think.
00:13:25.360 --> 00:13:25.840
I don't know.
00:13:27.519 --> 00:13:28.480
That's our AI.
00:13:29.600 --> 00:13:30.159
Yeah.
00:13:30.399 --> 00:13:41.759
And and so is there is that the primary way people use it, or is there a pre-search app as well, like they can download to um you know, like a Mac or something?
00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:47.440
If you had used it, actually a search, you would have been prompted for an extension.
00:13:47.759 --> 00:14:00.879
And so the easiest way, in the way most people use it as an extension in their browser on uh uh a laptop or a desktop, there is uh an app both for Android and for iOS.
00:14:01.120 --> 00:14:06.879
Um, and so you know it's it's like any other browser, you can access it the whole range of different ways.
00:14:07.200 --> 00:14:13.200
Okay, so I did a couple searches on it, and you're right, the the that request came up, and I just haven't done it yet.
00:14:13.279 --> 00:14:16.639
And so uh I'll do I'll do that a little bit later today.
00:14:16.799 --> 00:14:18.559
But that's how easy it was for me to use.
00:14:18.639 --> 00:14:31.440
I just went to presearch.com, the little search window pops up, and so now what you're saying is all they have to do is do a search and look for that extension option.
00:14:32.159 --> 00:14:36.399
It's a little it's an innocuous little prompt on the upper upper right hand side.
00:14:36.559 --> 00:14:41.200
And and once you do that, then it's becomes your your default browser.
00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:46.399
You can turn it off anytime you want and go back to what your uh historical browser was.
00:14:46.720 --> 00:15:00.879
Most people here, um, like the entire team uses pre search as their default, and it's great because you know it's not often you get it's sometimes hard to get feedback from the product you have, but we're all drinking the Kool-Aid here.
00:15:00.960 --> 00:15:03.360
So we provide you know instant feedback.
00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:06.799
We have telegram channels, people provide a lot of feedback.
00:15:06.879 --> 00:15:15.600
Uh, and we implemented, we've probably done 80 or 90 tweaks in the last two months uh to the search engine.
00:15:15.759 --> 00:15:27.360
Uh developing something that a lot of any product, any uh you know, app, any electronic product, browser-based product that that you develop for general use, it's never done, right?
00:15:27.440 --> 00:15:28.559
It's always evolving.
00:15:28.639 --> 00:15:30.080
There are always changes.
00:15:30.240 --> 00:15:34.879
Uh the browsers themselves make changes, so if nothing else, you have to update your code periodically.
00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:42.720
It's it's a constant con I won't say battle, but it's a constant effort to make things relevant and interesting and look nice.
00:15:42.879 --> 00:15:44.799
We get comments on that all the time.
00:15:45.039 --> 00:15:49.440
And sometimes we've actually gotten several times, we've gotten really good comments in the morning.
00:15:49.519 --> 00:15:50.559
We just didn't think about it.
00:15:50.720 --> 00:15:52.320
By the afternoon, it's implemented.
00:15:52.480 --> 00:15:56.000
The execution skills of the pre-search team are just incredible.
00:15:56.320 --> 00:16:02.320
Yeah, one of my favorite things about it was I did a couple searches on it and I didn't have to modify behavior.
00:16:02.399 --> 00:16:03.519
I didn't have to think about it.
00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:06.960
I just basically used it as a search tool, and it just works.
00:16:07.279 --> 00:16:12.799
And then it's doing all these benefits that you're talking about, taking me through all these different nodes around the world.
00:16:12.960 --> 00:16:18.480
And to me, a real security and a privacy for it to actually work, it has to be that way.
00:16:18.559 --> 00:16:20.960
It has to be something where you don't really have to think about it.
00:16:21.440 --> 00:16:21.919
Exactly.
00:16:22.159 --> 00:16:24.799
You don't want major latency and everything else.
00:16:24.960 --> 00:16:33.440
One of the very interesting things is when you use Google as a browser and bring up YouTube or a number of other programs.
00:16:33.519 --> 00:16:38.559
So YouTube is the one where you're apps where you really see it, you always have ads to watch.
00:16:38.720 --> 00:16:43.519
We have ad-free YouTube because of the way we distribute our searches.
00:16:43.679 --> 00:16:47.039
So if nothing else, I mean uh it's so frustrating.
00:16:47.120 --> 00:17:00.399
I watch with my daughter, I'm an 11-year-old, and we watch, we're looking up something, want to see it, and she's got she's got, where does she have it where she doesn't have she's got some device, I forget which, where she hasn't installed YouTube.
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:07.440
And it's like, Stacey, look, the ads that you're seeing here, because sometimes now it's a minute worth of ads, it's just frustrating.
00:17:07.839 --> 00:17:10.319
There's a really good reason for you to change over.
00:17:10.480 --> 00:17:17.839
And I don't force her, I don't deal, I don't, you know, take over her her hardware, but um it's you really see the difference.
00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:24.480
You get spoiled on pre-search because suddenly you're getting um you're getting ads in YouTube, you're getting targeted ads.
00:17:24.559 --> 00:17:26.000
Oh, this is the thing I hate.
00:17:26.079 --> 00:17:38.880
I do some search, and then you look at the ads, say um CNN or whatever news you watch, and the the the ads that you see are very closely related to the term you just searched on.
00:17:39.039 --> 00:17:39.680
I hate that.
00:17:39.839 --> 00:17:51.599
That means that my my uh interests are being stored someplace, and they're literal literally manipulating me to pay more attention to whatever the heck it is they're selling.
00:17:51.759 --> 00:17:52.960
I detest that.
00:17:53.119 --> 00:17:55.599
With pre search, absolutely none of that.
00:17:55.759 --> 00:17:57.279
You're they have no idea who you are.
00:17:57.359 --> 00:18:01.680
They have no idea that you're the same guy that signed into Bloomberg or whatever you did.
00:18:01.839 --> 00:18:03.200
It's just beautiful.
00:18:03.519 --> 00:18:04.559
Yeah, that's awesome.
00:18:04.720 --> 00:18:08.400
Yeah, so if anyone's watching this, it is definitely easy.
00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:09.440
You should go check it out.
00:18:09.599 --> 00:18:14.880
Now, you've you talked about a couple other interesting things that I think would raise questions with people watching this.
00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:17.759
Is you're talking about these 15,000 plus nodes.
00:18:18.559 --> 00:18:32.960
And now, are those 15,000 plus nodes just regular people like me and other people who um wanted to be part of the pre-search, I guess, backbone per se platform, and and they've set up servers and they're earning tokens.
00:18:33.119 --> 00:18:34.559
Is that how that works?
00:18:35.279 --> 00:18:36.960
Kind of, mostly correct.
00:18:37.119 --> 00:18:38.319
They don't set up servers.
00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:44.960
I mean, I'm talking to you on my you know, standard old Dell laptop, and I could easily run a node out of it.
00:18:45.440 --> 00:18:51.039
And every once in a while, you know, several times an hour, searches will bang through that node.
00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:58.480
We don't, you don't, it doesn't really put much weight, processing weight, on the computer because it's not many searches an hour.
00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:11.680
With uh we're at about half a million searches a day, really trying to grow that now because from our perspective, we've hit a real critical mass in terms of having a product that is really good, can stand on its own.
00:19:11.839 --> 00:19:19.440
We had introduced, you know, um what we call pre-GPT, so our own generative AI aspect to search.
00:19:19.599 --> 00:19:21.839
And we have a really nice follow-up menu.
00:19:22.000 --> 00:19:26.319
So if you if you're doing an AI search, you generally have to start over again for the next one.
00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:38.640
We've got a little chat bot that appears, and then you just build on that search and it and it searches, it amends what you what you searched before, which is a really, really nice, really, really nice feature.
00:19:38.960 --> 00:19:48.160
And the the when you use the search engine, you just feel much more comfortable with what you're doing and how your data is being used.
00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:48.960
Okay.
00:19:49.440 --> 00:20:04.160
So if I have a say I have an old laptop, I never get rid of my computer, so I have a stack, you know, probably four or five sitting on the the desk behind me, but I can pull one of those out and I could turn one of those into a pre-search node per se.
00:20:04.799 --> 00:20:05.599
Absolutely.
00:20:05.839 --> 00:20:11.279
If you're familiar with digital assets, you can earn pre-tokens by doing that.
00:20:11.440 --> 00:20:17.599
We have a lot of people that just have it running in the background on on uh, in your case, an old computer.
00:20:17.839 --> 00:20:31.440
For the pre-GPT, because of the the various requirements of of uh generative AI, you need a GPU, and it can't be like a super old GPU, but we have other aspects.
00:20:31.519 --> 00:20:34.799
We have a we have three, four different flavors, if you will, of nodes.
00:20:34.960 --> 00:20:38.400
Some of them are CPU-based, which would be ideal for what you're doing.
00:20:38.480 --> 00:20:53.839
And those are simply where a search is, say, redirected, you know, you're it'll somebody will be in Norway, they'll search, and that search will go through your computer in the United States, and their next search will go through, you know, Zimbabwe, whatever it happens to be.
00:20:54.000 --> 00:21:01.920
Those sort of computers have very, very low power requirements, and the earnings are correspondingly reasonably small.
00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:07.839
But you know, you you pull out your tokens and sell them or do whatever once every three, four months, whatever you want to do.
00:21:08.000 --> 00:21:10.640
Some people just run them because they want to support the project.
00:21:10.720 --> 00:21:15.759
And then other people have fairly high-tech gear, fairly new gear, good GPUs.
00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:23.599
They are earning some serious tokens on a daily basis because they're providing you know serious support to the project.
00:21:24.480 --> 00:21:25.839
Okay, awesome.
00:21:26.079 --> 00:21:33.200
And and anyone listening, if you're not into digital assets, if you're not into sort of the the techie stuff like I am, I'm into both of those.
00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:35.759
But if you're not, it's that's it doesn't matter.
00:21:35.839 --> 00:21:42.559
You can you still use pre search.com, use the extension, have the and have the added privacy, and you don't have to do that.
00:21:42.720 --> 00:21:42.960
Absolutely.
00:21:43.440 --> 00:21:50.079
If you don't want to do something, the anything extra, you just want to have a private search, you don't have to register, you don't do anything.
00:21:50.240 --> 00:21:57.599
Pick up, you know, put go to presearch.com, then uh please install the extension, and nothing else of your life changes.
00:21:57.759 --> 00:21:59.839
It's really hard to get people to change their behavior.
00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:02.319
We don't ask people to change their behavior.
00:22:02.480 --> 00:22:07.440
Do the same thing you're doing now, but just do it in a way that is insanely private.
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:09.920
And and still free.
00:22:10.400 --> 00:22:11.200
And still free.
00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:11.680
Absolutely.
00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:12.400
That's the people.
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:13.119
Yeah.
00:22:13.359 --> 00:22:28.480
Now, are there are there like maybe two or three questions that you get asked all the time, like um where you wish you had it recorded so that you know people can watch the recording a thousand times, ten thousand times?
00:22:28.640 --> 00:22:30.319
Like, what would be like an example?
00:22:30.400 --> 00:22:39.119
Is there any QA type question that you can think of that I had that I haven't asked that uh you would love to be able to answer on a mass scale?
00:22:39.519 --> 00:22:46.480
Well, the the biggest question, you haven't asked it quite this way, but I think we've answered, and that is why switch?
00:22:46.960 --> 00:23:13.359
And you know, somewhere in the various questions that we've talked about, I think it's come out, if you summarize it, it's total privacy, uh, no profiling, no surveillance pricing, um, ad-free YouTube, which is a small thing to some people, huge to others, and an ability to um earn rewards if you want by either searching, we have search staking, or by running a note.
00:23:13.599 --> 00:23:22.000
But the most important thing, you get really, really good search results that are based on just your search and not profiling you.
00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:23.839
I guess there's one thing we haven't really talked about.
00:23:23.920 --> 00:23:57.039
When you accumulate a lot of searches, the and you're using Google, eventually Google develops a profile of you and will actually change the search results to based on who you are and what they think you want to see, which is honestly the opposite of what you want, because if you're in a bubble already and you have all these opinions, and those opinions aren't necessarily not aren't necessarily all correct, you know, factually speaking, you're gonna get stuff that reinforces those incorrect, factually incorrect or your current opinions.
00:23:57.279 --> 00:24:20.319
Doesn't show you new stuff, it doesn't expand your mind, it reinforces your current biases, it's just not a positive experience, and it can lead to the sort of extremism you're seeing in in US politics, as opposed to if you just do a search and you get really objective results from across the board, it's better for you, it's a better search result.
00:24:20.559 --> 00:24:24.640
You're not being profiled, you're not being targeted with ads or pricing or whatever.
00:24:24.799 --> 00:24:29.119
It's just altogether a better and more reassuring experience.
00:24:29.440 --> 00:24:35.279
Yeah, I don't people don't realize all the browser fingerprinting, what's called canvas fingerprinting as well.
00:24:35.359 --> 00:24:41.519
And I actually wrote a tool to actually validate basically do an analysis on different browsers.
00:24:41.680 --> 00:24:45.200
And you know, like in Chrome, it's pretty much wide open.
00:24:46.799 --> 00:25:00.400
But that's it's actually so Google knows you as sort of rectangle on the front angle, and we all have like a hash mark for those people that are using Chrome and other weak browsers.
00:25:00.720 --> 00:25:04.240
You literally have Hashmark tag your token help.
00:25:04.319 --> 00:25:09.279
So you go use something else if they'll use something to the website.
00:25:09.359 --> 00:25:14.079
They know they know who's coming to their website based on Hashmark.
00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:19.680
And uh a lot of people think that you know they're private, but they're not.
00:25:19.839 --> 00:25:23.279
And so it's one of the reasons why I love solutions like this.
00:25:24.000 --> 00:25:37.680
Mark, I can't tell you how many advertisement advertisers and effectively advertising agencies have told us, oh no, no, no, we're completely private, we're completely consistent with your privacy policies.
00:25:38.000 --> 00:25:41.759
And then you look at what they're doing, and it's insane.
00:25:41.839 --> 00:25:45.039
It's the most least private stuff you can come across.
00:25:45.200 --> 00:26:01.519
And just for your for your viewers, your listeners, the most shocking thing is I don't remember even what advertiser it was, but we looked at the tool they used to advertise or to monitor, surveil, if you will, their advertisements.
00:26:01.759 --> 00:26:11.039
They had not only a screenshot of what every user where those ads appeared was looking at, they even tracked the cursor movement.
00:26:11.119 --> 00:26:18.319
Now it wasn't in real time, so you know, as you with old films, 24 frames a second or 36 frames a second.
00:26:18.480 --> 00:26:25.279
It was like a snapshot of every half a second, and it was low resolution, but you could see exactly what site they were looking at.
00:26:25.359 --> 00:26:32.880
You could see where the cursor was going, you could see what their interests were, and you monitor absolutely everything.
00:26:34.720 --> 00:26:35.839
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:26:35.920 --> 00:26:40.480
We played around with those kind of tools, and uh it's kind of scary.
00:26:40.880 --> 00:26:42.720
Hang on, just one, hang on just one second.
00:26:42.880 --> 00:26:43.119
Sorry.
00:26:43.279 --> 00:26:44.799
Hey Mark, I'm on a podcast.
00:26:44.960 --> 00:26:45.920
Something urgent?
00:26:47.200 --> 00:26:47.519
Okay.
00:26:48.480 --> 00:26:49.920
I'll call you afterwards.
00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:51.200
Thank you, bye-bye.
00:26:51.440 --> 00:26:55.200
Sorry, it's my CFO, so I didn't know if the sky was falling.
00:26:57.359 --> 00:26:58.480
I know how that feels.
00:26:58.559 --> 00:27:02.400
So there's a couple people when they call me, it's like, oh, I gotta I gotta take it.
00:27:02.640 --> 00:27:07.279
Um I'm trying to think if there's really anything that I've left off the table at this point.
00:27:07.599 --> 00:27:12.799
Um, you know, it's been it's been really interesting, and and again, this is a very simple tool.
00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:14.000
It is.
00:27:14.319 --> 00:27:26.880
It's not it has to be, Mark, it has to be because if you have something that's too complex, too sophisticated, and as you said, change you know you said earlier, it's very, very easy to use.
00:27:27.039 --> 00:27:32.880
If you ask people to change their behavior, some will, of course, but the vast majority of people will not.
00:27:33.119 --> 00:27:33.920
It's just too different.
00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:49.039
Well, also, there's that tendency of a lot of people will work harder at trying to get around security and privacy than actually you know use the privacy, like they see it as a problem, and therefore they try and get around it, and with this solution, you don't need to.
00:27:49.359 --> 00:27:49.519
Right.
00:27:49.839 --> 00:28:16.880
Um, I think I did remember one of the questions um that I have for you, and and this is really more of a personal thing, but do you allow companies to I wouldn't call it white label, but can is your product built in a way that they could actually integrate it into like if they have a mobile app, for example, and they want they want to put safe search outside of a has anyone ever tried to do that?
00:28:17.359 --> 00:28:23.279
Yes, we actually have a search API, and we can send it through two ways.
00:28:23.519 --> 00:28:41.200
One is without ads, at which point in time they have to pay on a CPM basis, you know, a cost per mill or or uh uh cost per mill, which is how many uh impressions, how many times it's used per thousand, and it's it's extremely inexpensive.
00:28:41.359 --> 00:28:46.000
And then if they allow the ads to pass through, then it's free.
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:47.680
Okay.
00:28:48.079 --> 00:28:49.359
It's interesting.
00:28:49.680 --> 00:28:50.319
All right.
00:28:50.960 --> 00:28:56.160
I may have a I may have to follow up with you on a couple days here now because uh because I'm working on something right now.
00:28:59.119 --> 00:29:02.000
Let me throw out one more thing about the ads that we have.
00:29:02.240 --> 00:29:06.720
We had we developed what we call a background ad, like a wallpaper ad.
00:29:06.799 --> 00:29:09.759
We call it a PTA, a pre-search takeover ad.
00:29:09.920 --> 00:29:13.279
And we control everything on that, so it's just an image.
00:29:13.519 --> 00:29:17.920
There's no nothing at all tracking anything, it's just impossible.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:25.440
And we, and as far as we know, we were the first ones in the world, there are a couple imitators now, to develop that.
00:29:25.519 --> 00:29:29.359
So the ad formats that everyone was using, they didn't work.
00:29:29.440 --> 00:29:34.960
We didn't like them, so we invented our own and used that, and that's how we do a lot of our monetization now.
00:29:35.119 --> 00:29:42.960
So if you don't want to look in the what's behind the text and everything that you see in the search results, you know, you don't have to.
00:29:43.200 --> 00:29:52.000
But our CTR, what's called the click-through rate, is higher than the average because we try to have really good curated ads.
00:29:52.079 --> 00:29:55.680
You can't automatically post them because if you can, you get all kinds of crap.
00:29:55.839 --> 00:30:06.960
So we work with each and every advertiser to keep a really high quality experience, not only on the search side, but also so that people aren't distracted by garbage ads or whatever.
00:30:07.279 --> 00:30:07.680
Yeah.
00:30:07.839 --> 00:30:20.240
You know, you you also reminded me of uh my experience with the privacy and like dark web monitoring base is you know, they claim they're keeping you private, that'll delete your data, but they'll warn you.
00:30:20.400 --> 00:30:25.039
And I've tested this with probably 15 other say, oh, that's great.
00:30:25.680 --> 00:30:36.799
You can uh um also we're interested in buying you know 10,000 names of high income, you know, con not names, but like contacting, oh yeah, we can do that.
00:30:36.960 --> 00:30:38.240
Let's put a price on.
00:30:39.440 --> 00:30:43.440
And it's like, okay, well, these these are the not the people that we want to do business with.
00:30:43.519 --> 00:30:48.559
And it's one of the ways that we selecters on on who we on who we support.
00:30:48.799 --> 00:30:53.599
Because there's a lot of uh data privacy companies that are playing both sides.
00:30:54.640 --> 00:30:55.519
Well, absolutely.
00:30:55.920 --> 00:30:56.319
Absolutely.
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:08.160
We find it I don't now a little bit you can find you can find companies that are in the advertising sector that don't want to collect massive amounts of data.
00:31:08.319 --> 00:31:16.880
They they like that particular niche, but most people in the sector are lying through their teeth in terms of what they say they don't do.
00:31:18.400 --> 00:31:20.799
Yeah, I would agree with that.
00:31:21.279 --> 00:31:32.480
And it muddies the water sometimes when you're trying to compete with uh with with other people and and you know you know what they're collecting, and uh, but that's just the the I guess the industry we're in.
00:31:32.880 --> 00:31:42.480
Well, I think that's probably you know, a lot uh that's I feel like this is so perfect that um I don't want to extend it and kind of dilute it.
00:31:42.559 --> 00:31:45.920
It's I think all I think uh there are a lot of great information here.
00:31:46.160 --> 00:31:50.720
And before we close out, just to let you could, if you could just hang out for a couple minutes afterwards.
00:31:50.880 --> 00:31:53.759
So the upload, okay, says the upload is slow.
00:31:54.640 --> 00:32:05.599
Um, but with that said, uh Tim, I really appreciate you investing your time to come on here, allowing us to educate people on uh ways to stay private and secure.
00:32:05.759 --> 00:32:12.160
I'm gonna I'm I talk to a lot of cybersecurity type uh privacy forums and things like that.
00:32:12.400 --> 00:32:15.920
So um I'll ask if anyone wants you know an introduction with you.
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:31.519
And and uh I don't know if you do many podcasts, but uh yeah, especially especially something like this, because I really like your approach, but where we can get out to more people, get the word out to more people, because it's really it's it's not easy.
00:32:31.599 --> 00:32:35.039
I mean, we do have to change people's behavior to some degree, right?
00:32:35.359 --> 00:32:44.079
And so if you do, I mean, we've tried all sorts of things, um people trying to focus privacy forum and stuff for and stuff like that.
00:32:44.240 --> 00:32:47.119
But we're the new kid on the block, we're outsiders.
00:32:47.200 --> 00:32:50.319
So what you're talking about is effectively a warm intro.
00:32:50.400 --> 00:32:57.119
Uh would be absolutely beautiful, would uh more be more than happy to to appear on other people's podcasts as well.
00:32:57.759 --> 00:33:02.400
And not just me, we have other team members that are more photogenic than I am.
00:33:04.480 --> 00:33:06.880
All right, well, uh Tim, thanks a lot.
00:33:07.279 --> 00:33:08.079
Again, hang out.
00:33:08.160 --> 00:33:16.079
I'm gonna cut cut the recording here and hang out for a couple of minutes and uh very good.
