Two Massive Stellar Partnerships!🚀CEO INTERVIEW Denelle Dixon🚨$XLM

WEBVTT
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Major institutional adoption and breaking news around Stellar and many
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of their partnerships. We wanted to dive in, so we're
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going to bring in Danelle Dixon to.
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Talk about that today.
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To get started, I want to bring in Danelle Dixon,
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who is coming in from the Stellar Foundation.
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Danell, how are you great?
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How are you so nice to be here?
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Thank you for having me.
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Nice to have you. So we've been watching a lot
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of the announcements. I am intrigued, skeptical, but also interested
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in how you guys are pulling.
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All of this together. We'll get into all of that.
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The first thing I want to jump to, of course,
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is the MoneyGram announcement right here introducing MGUSD. So that's
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Moneygram's US dollar which is going to be running natively
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on Stellar. So big news when you look at money
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Gram right now, essentially this is running within USDC on Stellar.
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How many people are using this today, Gosh, I don't
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know in.
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Terms of the retail side of it because so many
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different things. MoneyGram has a wallet that they actually have
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built on Stellar, and so that wallet is released and
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I think five countries at this point, so they.
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Actually have their user count from that standpoint.
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But the other piece that we started with MoneyGram on
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way back when and I started working with them in
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twenty nineteen was they're opening up their ramps so that
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one of the things I saw when I came to
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crypto is that there was no way to get on
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to a network unless you had Crypto already. And so
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they have the ramps product which allows wallets that are
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connected to Stellar to also be able to use their
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on and off ramps, and so there's at least like
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thirty wallets that are on Stellar that are able to
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do that, and then they have their retail users on
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the edge.
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Okay, so money gram, I know, is a large network.
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I guess the real question is how many of their
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users are starting to divert into digital assets within the
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wallet itself and use it going forward. We'll have to
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check that out for you guys, because I think that
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will be a good indicator as to how well this
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will accelerate in terms of use.
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What is your anticipation.
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What is Stellar's expectations from this partnership.
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Well, we've been partnering with Moneygrams since early days, so
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twenty nineteen really when I came into the Stellar Development Foundation,
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and part of it for me was just being able
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to take this traditional financial institution and really integrate it
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into this technology stack and for it to be able
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to use it. Now they're using it for their own
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internal treasury. So that's part of what MGUSD will do
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as well, so that you can be able to on
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an off ramp, and that's a really important piece of
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it as well for sure.
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Well, and there's going to be I think huge adoption
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curves in a lot of these kinds of services. We've
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seen it within PayPal. We'll talk about that in a
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little bit money Gram course, I think just going into
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a lot of countries that you know, need the ability
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to be able to get access to these kinds of funds.
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So this, this may change the way it's used in
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the future. I was listening, and I travel and across
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X often and typically what I'm looking for is craziness
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that's going on, And of course if I want to
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follow that, I usually just jump over to you'v all
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Rus's account and he's of course hitting on this right
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here because he's in disbelief, I believe, of the partnership
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that's going on between the DTCC and Stellar. He's talking
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a little bit about this of Canton going live in October.
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First of all, when do you guys plan to launch
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test net right now?
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So the DTCC is launching its own.
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Test net in July, and for us, it's one of
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those things where there's different you know, when you work
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with a large institution, you have to be able to
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meet a lot of their internal challenges but also the
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integration pieces. And so they have told us that it's
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the first half of next year. We don't have a
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specific date on that for them, but I suspect, given
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how much attention that they put to this and how
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important that this is to them, that they actually are
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moving to an open public network, that it'll be that
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they'll have those dates in the new term.
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But it is really exciting to us.
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I mean, when I think about the fact that we're
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moving this large institution and integrating it into a platform
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that is open and public and available to everyone all
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over the world, that's a pretty remarkable thing.
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Okay, So that would be to his statement right here,
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I'm willing to bet that whatever deployment is happening on
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Stellar is permissioned.
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So that is the question. I guess you're saying, no, No,
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that's not going to no.
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I mean, that's the value you have an open public network.
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I'm not sure how you could permission it.
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They actually have because of the way that Steller has
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built and we've built Stellar from the ground up, meaning
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that you as an institution can choose to be able
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to when u KYC what kinds of compliance tools you're
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going to leverage. Those are all built into the base
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layer of the tech steck Onstellar, so you can bolt
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on a smart contract to be able to do all
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of this.
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But all of these tools, the.
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Clawback functionality, the ability to do KYC when you want
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to and when you feel like it's appropriate, those are
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all natively on the network. And so that's the value
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of this tech stack, and they've known that for a
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really long time.
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All right, So what you're saying in terms of limitations
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KYC is an opt in is that the way I'm
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hearing it.
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Now for KYC.
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For them, they can choose to do it either at
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the time of the issue when the individual receives the
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asset or when the individual individual offerings the asset, and
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so they get to make these choices about how they're
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going to set their compliance at every asset issuer does
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on Stellar. So it's something that we built this for institutions.
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The claudup functionality is something that asset issuers can choose
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to enable and choose not to enable. But these are
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all things that it's programmable. That's the beauty of it.
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They can decide what they want, when they want it,
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and when they're going to use it.
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Yeah, okay, so twenty four to five. This has been
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the announcement.
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You know.
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The argument I have is, you know, the markets are
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twenty four to seven, Why wouldn't we see this really
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accelerating to the rest of what we have seen on
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the open architecture of blockchain that is twenty four to seven.
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Why not that So much of this is about the
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regulators and about their comfort level.
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When I think about even.
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The first issuance of a money market fund on an
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open public network, that was Franklin Templeton who issued Onstellar.
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They started that process, by the way, on their own
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they came to Stellar. We did not even know they
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were building Onstellar until we saw public announcements of it.
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But they you have to meet with the regulators and
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go through all the processes about, you know, the things
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that they're comfortable with. And even in the Franklin Templeton case,
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they had training wheels, right, they had to do both
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at the same time so they could prove the value
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of what blockchain had to offer from a transfer agent standpoint.
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So I think that when you get to a regulatory
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environment that allows twenty four to seven, I think that
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we'll be able to see that happen At this point,
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what we see is that the regulators are comfortable with
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the twenty four to five and you can still do
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things with these assets on the weekends.
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But it's just I.
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Think it's what it's moving traditional finance to the world
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where you can have real time settle on twenty four
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hours a day.
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Yeah, yeah, I think that's the question. Well, it may happen, though,
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I think maybe a pressure from the market in general
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is going to kind of move it to that. Do
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you think institutions really care about chains where there's not
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retail users and kind of the vice versa. What is
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your position on that.
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I think institutions care about distribution, and I think it's
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going to be whether that's to the retail or to
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SMEs or other institutions. So from my standpoint, what the
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whole tokenizing these assets is crucial in terms of using
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the text tag for what it's valuable for and valuable
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to the actual funds themselves. Because it's cheaper, it's instant,
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it makes it easier for the funds to be able
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to get out there. Distribution is key, and I think
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that these institutions care about how, how and who it's
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going to be distributed to. I think global distribution is
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an aim for everyone, and I think that reaching people
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all over the world is really what people want to
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be able to do. But again, that takes time with
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respect to making sure that the regulators are comfortable with it.
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But I see that that is the world we're moving to,
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and you have to go through step changes to be
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able to make that happen.
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So it's just a matter of time before we see
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that kind of really acceptance into more retail use based
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chains that would kind of move a lot of where
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this finance market is heading, because this really changes a
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lot about how not only institutional works, but maybe even
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potentially how retail is going to be integrated with institutional
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very soon, for sure.
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I think that the distribution part and not thinking of
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these funds as different than the traditional funds that exist
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in databases and thinking about how and who you can
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distribute to, I think is the end game here and
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it makes me really excited. And I think about the
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fact that we have eight billion people in the world,
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and many of those billions do not have access to
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these types of assets, and they can now get access
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to those assets when it's tokenized and sort of orderless,
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particularly on open public networks that you have retail usage,
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you have institutional usage, you have all of that opportunity,
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but you need to focus on distribution, and you need
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to make it simple, and you need to make it
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so that the user doesn't have to figure out which
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chain where the user is just using the best piece
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of software that they can get for them to be
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able to reach the assets that they want.
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So in this new kind of this new evolution, users
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are essentially going to want to start moving into other
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chains that usually involves bridges to get access to platforms.
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Like Morpho et cetera.
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How does that play out within what you are building
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right now along with these partnerships.
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Well, I think it's important that I don't know that
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users really care about the chain so much is what
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you just mentioned, which is the product that's available throughout them.
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I'd love to say.
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That everyone wants to build Unstellar and the Stellars amazing
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from a retail side, but the truth of the matter is.
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What they care about is ease of use.
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And so when you think about being on an open
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public network that anybody can integrate with anywhere in the
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world anytime, whether that be a platform, a wallet, or
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the retail side being able to leverage those tools. I
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think that users are going to care about that. I've
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always been a big believer.
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In having it be that you can connect up to
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all the different chains that exist.
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I think they'll end up being some top five chains
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that are going to have different uses on those chains,
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and that people are going to want to get access
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to interoperability. I come from the early days of the
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Web when that was such an important part of how
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we built web technologies, and I think that this is
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the Internet of money, and you want to be able
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to have that interoperability. I think right now what we're
249
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seeing is that we do see bridges, but I think
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from the traditional financial side of things, a lot of
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the interoperability sits at the entity that's issuing the asset,
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and so we're going to see that kind of interoperability
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through those entities first until we get comfortable that these
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assets can flow through bridges very easily and we don't
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get worried about whether bridges can be hacked.
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Okay, So Morpho has continued to grow dramatically in terms
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of the market, the capacity of being able to get
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your assets within Morpho that's going to be critical. Is
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this something that you guys are planning on eventually migrating
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or building too. What's kind of the future there for
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that we would like to.
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Be able to build and to migrate, to make it
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so that you can get any asset on Stellar and
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you can take it where you need to get to.
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So we are constantly looking for these types of partnerships
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to be able to make it so that not just
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that Stellar has that opportunity in terms of this text
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act showing its strength, but it's that every institution and
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every asset that's building on Stellar can get to the
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place and the people that they want to get to.
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So when I think about the future, I think about
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again interoperability.
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Is being here. Yeah, how long, Danielle? How long?
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Because I've listened to so many of these chains tell
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you it's coming, Paul, it's coming, it's coming, and then
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it takes here's something to.
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Say called here's what I need to say.
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All right.
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When you think when I was in the.
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Early days of the web, when we were barely walking,
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we were crawling at the time, to really figure out
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how web technologies were going to be used, things happen
283
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so quickly, and there's a lot of like this really
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amazing stuff that comes in, some stuff that doesn't stick.
285
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Right.
286
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That's what happened in the early days of the web
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and the boom there. We're in our adolescence in terms
288
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of this tech stack and in terms of how it
289
00:12:23.000 --> 00:12:26.840
can actually come together. But right now, with regulatory clarity,
290
00:12:26.919 --> 00:12:30.559
with institutions seeing the value of it, with retail users
291
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being able to access this kind of these kinds of
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things globally, I say that it's not too far off.
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I say in the next three to five years, we're
294
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going to see that this is just mainstream. It's hard
295
00:12:40.200 --> 00:12:42.159
to judge where we are today if you just look
296
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at where we came from. I think you all need
297
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to look at it as this is going to be
298
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like this vertical rise that keeps happening and happening, and
299
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sometimes it takes time.
300
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But honestly, I'd rather get it right than get it quick.
301
00:12:53.159 --> 00:12:56.240
Okay, So timing right now twenty twenty seven is kind
302
00:12:56.240 --> 00:12:59.519
of the plan here. Between this partnership with DCCC. You
303
00:12:59.559 --> 00:13:02.159
look at some of the other market makers that are
304
00:13:02.240 --> 00:13:04.639
out there. I saw schwab is getting ready to open
305
00:13:04.720 --> 00:13:08.799
up spot to orias also in twenty twenty seven, I
306
00:13:08.799 --> 00:13:12.200
would think that's going to put some demand on these
307
00:13:12.279 --> 00:13:15.279
kinds of products where you would have to have that portability,
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that ability to be able to move into platforms like that.
309
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So twenty twenty seven sounds like a very busy year,
310
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twenty twenty.
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Seven, but it actually has to all happen in twenty
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twenty six because when you think about what is the
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one thing that we need to get right this year,
314
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and that we're already moving in this direction, privacy, institutional privacy,
315
00:13:33.000 --> 00:13:36.039
and then ultimately retail privacy has to be something that is.
316
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Really simple on chain.
317
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We've built that in again at the base layer, so
318
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that you can actually configure whatever privacy tools that you
319
00:13:42.879 --> 00:13:45.320
want on top of that. But when we get that
320
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privacy piece right, institutional privacy, ultimately retail privacy, which I
321
00:13:49.519 --> 00:13:51.279
think is going to happen in the next few months.
322
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We've already built a lot of this ourselves on Stellar
323
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and now people are leveraging.
324
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It and making it happen for them.
325
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When you get that right, then in twenty twenty seven,
326
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I think you can take this to the next level.
327
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If you think about what also just happened on Stellar.
328
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We had a billion in our WA volume in at
329
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the end.
330
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Of the year.
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In the last four months, four and a half months,
332
00:14:10.360 --> 00:14:12.759
we've seen two billion get added to that, so we're
333
00:14:12.759 --> 00:14:15.240
at three billion in token I star WA's on Stellar.
334
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That's the kind of growth that we're seeing in twenty
335
00:14:17.759 --> 00:14:20.080
twenty six. So I just look at that, and I
336
00:14:20.120 --> 00:14:22.759
think with the partnership with DTCC, with all of these
337
00:14:22.799 --> 00:14:25.240
really amazing things that are happening in our space, with
338
00:14:25.399 --> 00:14:28.320
institutions coming now which we've been waiting for for a
339
00:14:28.320 --> 00:14:30.879
really long time, you're going to see this move very quickly.
340
00:14:30.960 --> 00:14:33.840
I'm looking at you mentioned Franklin Templeton. There's the Benji
341
00:14:34.320 --> 00:14:37.759
platform right there, their investments and obviously Stellar within this.
342
00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:39.679
If you look at.
343
00:14:39.639 --> 00:14:42.600
These, you'll see that there has been some growth here,
344
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primarily in Ibnji, which is the one that has started
345
00:14:45.639 --> 00:14:48.360
to move here. If you look further into this and
346
00:14:48.399 --> 00:14:51.879
look at ib that's been primarily driving within ethan B
347
00:14:52.000 --> 00:14:55.320
and B. Stellar of course is in the traditional asset
348
00:14:55.480 --> 00:14:58.279
right there. Why not Why are we not seeing growth
349
00:14:58.480 --> 00:14:59.919
there for Stellar?
350
00:15:00.200 --> 00:15:00.360
Oh?
351
00:15:00.360 --> 00:15:02.000
I think that we are seeing growth in terms of it,
352
00:15:02.000 --> 00:15:04.919
and we're also seeing usage the retail users are the
353
00:15:04.919 --> 00:15:08.440
ones that are sitting on Benji, they're on Stellar and
354
00:15:08.759 --> 00:15:11.320
the amount that they're doing peer to peer exchanges, because
355
00:15:11.320 --> 00:15:13.639
that's what Benji allows now with respect to this asset,
356
00:15:14.320 --> 00:15:16.240
and the SEC has allowed them to be able.
357
00:15:16.159 --> 00:15:16.519
To do that.
358
00:15:16.799 --> 00:15:18.799
And the amount of volume that we're seeing there isn't
359
00:15:18.799 --> 00:15:21.360
just volume that's sitting, it's volume that's being used day
360
00:15:21.399 --> 00:15:24.080
to day. And I think that's the important indicator. So
361
00:15:24.120 --> 00:15:26.360
many times that we just focus on volume and these
362
00:15:26.360 --> 00:15:28.960
assets just sit in places and don't do anything that's
363
00:15:29.000 --> 00:15:31.919
actually not really showing the utility of the asset and
364
00:15:31.919 --> 00:15:34.519
the utility of the networks. That's what I see is
365
00:15:34.519 --> 00:15:35.759
happening with Benji right now.
366
00:15:35.919 --> 00:15:39.039
What would you say down the road that looks like
367
00:15:39.080 --> 00:15:41.519
I'm just looking at the league table here on our
368
00:15:41.559 --> 00:15:46.480
Toba's for Franklin Templeton. You've got ethan seller kind of
369
00:15:46.480 --> 00:15:48.000
holding the top two positions right here.
370
00:15:48.039 --> 00:15:51.399
What does this look like in say, twelve months, I.
371
00:15:51.360 --> 00:15:53.519
Think that we're going to see that distribution is the
372
00:15:53.600 --> 00:15:54.080
key thing.
373
00:15:54.320 --> 00:15:56.960
You can't take an asset and tokenize it and then
374
00:15:57.000 --> 00:15:59.480
think that it'll just have its own sort of army
375
00:15:59.519 --> 00:16:01.759
behind it to be able to make that distribution happen.
376
00:16:01.840 --> 00:16:04.320
You need to treat that asset very similarly to the
377
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:07.399
way that you treated your traditional assets. And so distribution
378
00:16:07.519 --> 00:16:09.799
is something that I know Franklin Templeton is very focused
379
00:16:09.840 --> 00:16:12.960
on at the moment distribution to SMEs, to institutions, but
380
00:16:13.000 --> 00:16:15.039
also to the retail side. And I think that we're
381
00:16:15.039 --> 00:16:17.039
going to see a lot of that growth happen the
382
00:16:17.279 --> 00:16:19.320
tail end of this year and into next year, because
383
00:16:19.320 --> 00:16:22.879
that's their key focus area is getting that distribution. And Frankly,
384
00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:24.600
that is a big part of what we need to
385
00:16:24.639 --> 00:16:26.720
do is bring those partnerships to the network so you
386
00:16:26.720 --> 00:16:29.159
can see that distribution not just in Bengi, but in
387
00:16:29.240 --> 00:16:31.240
all of the assets that are tokenized on Stellar, and
388
00:16:31.279 --> 00:16:33.159
there are so many, and so I think that that's
389
00:16:33.200 --> 00:16:35.399
something that I think that if you build it, they
390
00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:37.879
will come as sort of not the thing that works here.
391
00:16:38.080 --> 00:16:40.320
You need to build it and then demonstrate that there
392
00:16:40.440 --> 00:16:42.159
is the market for it, and I think the market
393
00:16:42.200 --> 00:16:44.960
is now really taking life for that and moving forward
394
00:16:44.960 --> 00:16:48.440
with it. But tokenizing something is amazing. Getting it into
395
00:16:48.440 --> 00:16:49.759
the hands of real users is what.
396
00:16:49.759 --> 00:16:50.320
You really want.
397
00:16:50.480 --> 00:16:53.039
Yeah, Well, and you speak of distribution, You're talking about
398
00:16:53.039 --> 00:16:56.159
this a lot I'm looking at just at USDC right
399
00:16:56.200 --> 00:16:58.720
here right now, you can kind of see mostly writing
400
00:16:58.759 --> 00:17:02.759
out there on E to a certain extent Stellar, very
401
00:17:02.799 --> 00:17:06.119
small amount right now. You could also compare that to
402
00:17:06.799 --> 00:17:11.559
PayPal USD kind of in the same thing. Also not
403
00:17:11.839 --> 00:17:16.160
large amounts, so distribution access this of course would affect
404
00:17:16.200 --> 00:17:18.559
this pretty heavily. What's it going to take to be
405
00:17:18.599 --> 00:17:19.400
able to do that?
406
00:17:19.519 --> 00:17:21.920
For you, guys? What do you think needs to happen
407
00:17:22.000 --> 00:17:23.000
next for more of that?
408
00:17:23.559 --> 00:17:25.880
So I think you're also looking at volume charts there.
409
00:17:26.039 --> 00:17:27.960
One of the things that's really important is the number
410
00:17:28.000 --> 00:17:30.720
of times that USDC changes hands on stellars, far more
411
00:17:30.759 --> 00:17:33.319
than on the other chains, and so we really focus
412
00:17:33.359 --> 00:17:35.039
on the utility piece of it. We want to get
413
00:17:35.039 --> 00:17:36.799
into the hands of the users who are going to
414
00:17:36.880 --> 00:17:38.720
use it. We could also put a bunch of our
415
00:17:38.759 --> 00:17:40.400
treasury on chain and just hold it there.
416
00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:42.519
And make the volume go up. That's not the end
417
00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:43.160
game for US.
418
00:17:43.200 --> 00:17:45.000
The end game for US is to make sure that
419
00:17:45.079 --> 00:17:47.839
you have velocity, that you have usage, and the same
420
00:17:47.920 --> 00:17:51.400
is true for PYUSD. You need velocity and you need usage,
421
00:17:51.519 --> 00:17:53.839
and that what they find is the market to do
422
00:17:53.880 --> 00:17:56.440
that is on Stellar and so We're not trying to
423
00:17:56.480 --> 00:17:58.720
prop up these numbers to make it look like there's
424
00:17:58.799 --> 00:18:01.359
all this volume that's sitting there, because what we care
425
00:18:01.400 --> 00:18:04.799
about is how many people are using this asset, is
426
00:18:04.799 --> 00:18:06.400
this asset a strong asset for them?
427
00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:09.000
And does it work? And where's the distribution focused on.
428
00:18:09.519 --> 00:18:12.799
So again, I think that these numbers sometimes don't tell
429
00:18:12.799 --> 00:18:14.400
the full story until you dig into them.
430
00:18:14.720 --> 00:18:18.759
You mentioned privacy earlier. Obviously money gram, what's going on
431
00:18:18.839 --> 00:18:22.680
within the DTCC, what we'll see beyond this, especially with
432
00:18:22.759 --> 00:18:25.559
most of these requiring KYC at some point, I'm assuming
433
00:18:25.599 --> 00:18:29.000
they're selecting that KYC does have to occur. If that
434
00:18:29.200 --> 00:18:34.319
is the fact, then is privacy kind of a moot point.
435
00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:37.400
At that situation. If KYC is being implemented.
436
00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:39.559
Well, institutional privacy is never going to be a moot
437
00:18:39.559 --> 00:18:42.200
point because these institutions want to be able to protect
438
00:18:42.240 --> 00:18:44.960
the value of what they're doing and make it so
439
00:18:45.039 --> 00:18:47.359
that they can not have their competitors know everything that's
440
00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:51.000
happening from the institutional side. So institutional privacy is the
441
00:18:51.079 --> 00:18:53.440
key focus area for twenty twenty six, and you're going
442
00:18:53.480 --> 00:18:56.960
to see that just turn up. I think privacy from
443
00:18:57.000 --> 00:18:59.279
the retail side, I think is still really important. It's
444
00:18:59.279 --> 00:19:01.400
one of the things that I fought for fifteen years
445
00:19:01.400 --> 00:19:03.039
on the content side of the web to make sure
446
00:19:03.079 --> 00:19:06.200
that privacy was something that users got to make choices.
447
00:19:06.319 --> 00:19:08.480
Users had to make decisions about how and when to
448
00:19:08.480 --> 00:19:09.400
share their information.
449
00:19:09.920 --> 00:19:11.079
We didn't always win it there.
450
00:19:11.200 --> 00:19:14.079
It wasn't the right place sometimes to be able to
451
00:19:14.119 --> 00:19:17.240
and we probably didn't do the right fights in the end,
452
00:19:17.279 --> 00:19:19.559
like we could have made different choices by integrating and
453
00:19:19.559 --> 00:19:23.200
working with regulators. What I see now is that institutional
454
00:19:23.200 --> 00:19:26.079
privacy will take first step, But then when retail users
455
00:19:26.119 --> 00:19:27.759
are using this, they're going to want to see that
456
00:19:27.799 --> 00:19:30.680
some of their information is protected too, and so I
457
00:19:30.720 --> 00:19:33.160
think that that is the next sort of layer. I
458
00:19:33.200 --> 00:19:36.599
think it's important. Privacy is always something that we cannot ignore.
459
00:19:36.839 --> 00:19:38.480
We need to put it at the forefront, and that's what
460
00:19:38.519 --> 00:19:39.039
we've done.
461
00:19:39.279 --> 00:19:43.640
So Okay, so institutions, yes, privacy. We know that that's
462
00:19:43.640 --> 00:19:45.599
going to happen if we're going to see institutional adoption.
463
00:19:45.720 --> 00:19:48.519
But I think on the retail front, retail is so
464
00:19:48.680 --> 00:19:52.000
fed up with banks, and banks have of course put
465
00:19:52.039 --> 00:19:55.680
so much KYC on us as well as diving into
466
00:19:55.920 --> 00:19:59.440
situations where we get even unbanked. That's something that I
467
00:19:59.440 --> 00:20:01.559
think a lot of detail people, and to a certain extent,
468
00:20:01.599 --> 00:20:04.839
maybe even business owners that are starting to look at this,
469
00:20:05.240 --> 00:20:07.559
they're much more discerning around this.
470
00:20:07.720 --> 00:20:11.200
But what you're saying isn't necessarily privacy. It's the movement
471
00:20:11.279 --> 00:20:13.759
of value without having to do all of the things
472
00:20:13.759 --> 00:20:15.839
that you needed to do from a regular story standpoint
473
00:20:15.880 --> 00:20:19.240
with the banks, I am a big believer in assets
474
00:20:19.279 --> 00:20:23.599
and assets being open and not having those restrictions. That's
475
00:20:23.640 --> 00:20:25.400
not what we're going to see when you have sec
476
00:20:25.519 --> 00:20:27.559
improved assets. They're going to need to have some kind
477
00:20:27.599 --> 00:20:31.839
of KYC probably at the outset, but that is something
478
00:20:31.839 --> 00:20:33.319
that the asset.
479
00:20:33.039 --> 00:20:34.960
Issuers need to be able to address themselves.
480
00:20:35.240 --> 00:20:38.279
I think of privacy as something that's different from KYC
481
00:20:38.720 --> 00:20:41.799
because the KYC requirement is a regulatory requirement to be
482
00:20:41.799 --> 00:20:44.599
able to make sure that there's not the AML requirements
483
00:20:44.599 --> 00:20:46.839
are met and you're not doing money laundering or fraud
484
00:20:46.920 --> 00:20:49.319
or any of those things are happening. But what privacy
485
00:20:49.400 --> 00:20:52.240
is about, from my standpoint, is that if you are
486
00:20:52.279 --> 00:20:57.279
receiving your weekly, your monthly paycheck into your account, you
487
00:20:57.319 --> 00:21:00.519
don't necessarily want someone to know that that count Number
488
00:21:00.519 --> 00:21:03.200
one two, three, four, five is yours. So that is
489
00:21:03.240 --> 00:21:05.880
the privacy from a retail side that I'm focused on.
490
00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:07.799
It's not the movement of the value.
491
00:21:07.839 --> 00:21:10.079
I'm one hundred percent in alignment with you and with
492
00:21:10.119 --> 00:21:12.160
lots of people out there in the world, because, as
493
00:21:12.160 --> 00:21:14.240
I mentioned, we have eight billion people in the world,
494
00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:16.839
and not all of those people have access to all
495
00:21:16.880 --> 00:21:18.880
of these tools that sometimes in the West we take
496
00:21:18.920 --> 00:21:21.799
for granted. And I am a big supporter of being
497
00:21:21.799 --> 00:21:24.839
able to move this value simply and easily and not
498
00:21:25.000 --> 00:21:28.759
having those same requirements that the institutional side has to have.
499
00:21:28.799 --> 00:21:31.160
From times, Yeah, well, I think the argument that a
500
00:21:31.160 --> 00:21:33.519
lot of business owners and even hind now with individuals
501
00:21:33.519 --> 00:21:35.920
would say is, hey, listen, we've had the cash system,
502
00:21:35.960 --> 00:21:40.720
which is completely permissionless forever. We have been using privacy,
503
00:21:41.119 --> 00:21:43.680
and all of a sudden, we're moving into the blockchain era,
504
00:21:43.880 --> 00:21:47.000
and now what we thought was private is now being
505
00:21:47.720 --> 00:21:52.039
essentially circumvented because of these KYC rules that have been
506
00:21:52.079 --> 00:21:55.519
implemented mostly on the institutional and the banking side, which
507
00:21:55.559 --> 00:21:58.400
is now challenging the retail side, which is the whole point.
508
00:21:58.400 --> 00:22:00.079
If I want to pay somebody one hundred dollars to
509
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:02.440
do a job on the weekend. I can do that
510
00:22:02.920 --> 00:22:06.839
with full privacy. But if I go into a permissioned,
511
00:22:07.279 --> 00:22:10.839
a true permissioned ecosystem on crypto, that disappears.
512
00:22:10.839 --> 00:22:12.400
Are you at all worried about that?
513
00:22:12.799 --> 00:22:13.039
Oh?
514
00:22:13.119 --> 00:22:15.200
I'm a big proponent, as I said, of the movement
515
00:22:15.200 --> 00:22:17.279
of value. I don't want to go into a permission system.
516
00:22:17.319 --> 00:22:19.759
Which is why I'm sitting here at the forefront of
517
00:22:19.839 --> 00:22:23.359
an open public network really pushing that openness, because.
518
00:22:23.319 --> 00:22:25.680
I think, not only do the requirements.
519
00:22:25.680 --> 00:22:28.279
Again, I don't necessarily believe that it's privacy as much
520
00:22:28.319 --> 00:22:32.000
as it is the ability to be anonymous sometimes, which
521
00:22:32.039 --> 00:22:34.400
is not necessarily the privacy focused piece, and it's not
522
00:22:34.400 --> 00:22:37.279
necessarily the KYC piece, But it's the ability to be
523
00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:39.440
able to do these things with the value that you have.
524
00:22:39.920 --> 00:22:41.839
I am a big believer of that, and this.
525
00:22:41.880 --> 00:22:43.839
Is something that I fought for a really long time
526
00:22:43.880 --> 00:22:45.440
on the content side of the web to be able
527
00:22:45.480 --> 00:22:47.440
to protect and maintain. But there are going to be
528
00:22:47.519 --> 00:22:50.079
those instances where, again when you're off ramping, that you're
529
00:22:50.079 --> 00:22:50.400
going to.
530
00:22:50.319 --> 00:22:51.240
Need to be able to do that.
531
00:22:51.480 --> 00:22:53.039
But the movement of value on a day to day
532
00:22:53.079 --> 00:22:55.000
basis is something that you should be able to do.
533
00:22:55.400 --> 00:22:59.839
I like open, permissionless assets that can move around the world.
534
00:23:00.240 --> 00:23:02.400
I don't want us to go into walled gardens.
535
00:23:02.480 --> 00:23:04.359
That's what happened on the content side of the web,
536
00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:06.960
and we all know that there are five entities that
537
00:23:07.039 --> 00:23:09.200
owned most of the stuff on the content side. It
538
00:23:09.240 --> 00:23:11.799
created lots of barriers. We don't want those barriers. We
539
00:23:11.839 --> 00:23:14.240
want the ease of movement of these assets.
540
00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:16.599
Where do you stand on Clarity right now, Daniell?
541
00:23:16.920 --> 00:23:20.200
So, here's where I say this. Clarity has been through
542
00:23:20.359 --> 00:23:21.440
so many iterations.
543
00:23:21.480 --> 00:23:25.400
We've been working very closely with the policymakers on this
544
00:23:25.880 --> 00:23:30.240
for years. I think I testified before the Senate Agricultural
545
00:23:30.240 --> 00:23:33.039
Committee like four years ago or three years ago on
546
00:23:33.079 --> 00:23:36.200
the first iteration of Clarity. I think what Clarity does
547
00:23:36.519 --> 00:23:39.720
for this ecosystem is what Genius did for stable coins.
548
00:23:40.000 --> 00:23:45.359
It just brings regulatory optimism to our ecosystem and allows
549
00:23:45.400 --> 00:23:48.920
people to feel more comfortable issuing assets doing different things,
550
00:23:48.960 --> 00:23:50.920
being integrating this tech stack.
551
00:23:51.240 --> 00:23:54.119
I love that. In terms of so I would love
552
00:23:54.160 --> 00:23:55.279
to see Clarity pass.
553
00:23:55.480 --> 00:23:57.799
There are obviously things in Clarity that I would love
554
00:23:57.839 --> 00:24:00.680
to be able to change and to make the way
555
00:24:00.720 --> 00:24:02.440
that I perfectly want to see them. But I am
556
00:24:02.440 --> 00:24:04.839
not a believer in letting the perfect be the enemy
557
00:24:04.839 --> 00:24:07.400
of the good, and I think that this is good. Now,
558
00:24:07.559 --> 00:24:09.440
what I'll tell you is I'm not convinced it's going
559
00:24:09.480 --> 00:24:10.960
to happen in the timeframe that it should.
560
00:24:10.960 --> 00:24:12.039
Okay, nice, there you go.
561
00:24:13.279 --> 00:24:17.000
So let's assume it doesn't happen we go into the midterms.
562
00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:20.480
It's likely, with all the macro environment involved right now,
563
00:24:21.200 --> 00:24:24.960
the Republicans lose the Senate. So now we have essentially
564
00:24:25.000 --> 00:24:29.319
a compromised government of nobody making decisions and we're in
565
00:24:29.319 --> 00:24:31.720
a position now where we still need this to go through.
566
00:24:31.759 --> 00:24:34.400
Do you think the Democrats can pull it through?
567
00:24:34.920 --> 00:24:36.599
I'm just going to say that when I worry that
568
00:24:36.720 --> 00:24:40.559
happens in an administration, when we have don't have clarity
569
00:24:40.599 --> 00:24:45.759
through and we have a flipped house, I get worried
570
00:24:45.759 --> 00:24:48.640
about investigations that happen and all of those things sort
571
00:24:48.680 --> 00:24:51.920
of take over instead of really focusing on getting some
572
00:24:52.000 --> 00:24:54.799
real regulatory clarity out there. And that's what makes me nervous,
573
00:24:54.799 --> 00:24:56.480
which is why i'd like to see it go through
574
00:24:56.799 --> 00:24:57.519
before July.
575
00:24:58.279 --> 00:25:01.359
Okay, a couple questions before we end up here, purpose
576
00:25:01.400 --> 00:25:04.440
and prediction markets, When would we see something like that
577
00:25:04.640 --> 00:25:05.839
on the Stellar blockchain.
578
00:25:06.119 --> 00:25:08.240
There are entities that are starting already.
579
00:25:08.240 --> 00:25:10.279
We have what's called the Stellar Community Fund, and we
580
00:25:10.359 --> 00:25:13.160
have some of the community decides that they want to
581
00:25:13.200 --> 00:25:15.319
fund these things, and we see perps coming into that,
582
00:25:15.359 --> 00:25:18.359
we see prediction markets coming into that. I say probably
583
00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:20.160
by the end of the year, you'll see something like
584
00:25:20.160 --> 00:25:22.039
that on Stellar. We already see small ones, but I
585
00:25:22.079 --> 00:25:24.599
think once a real value you'll be able to see.
586
00:25:24.640 --> 00:25:26.680
I think it's again, it's one of those things that
587
00:25:26.920 --> 00:25:29.920
while it doesn't get to the traditional financial infrastructure, it's
588
00:25:29.920 --> 00:25:31.640
important to be able to have these tools sort of
589
00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:32.720
available for everybody.
590
00:25:32.960 --> 00:25:33.200
Listen.
591
00:25:33.279 --> 00:25:36.039
The other area that I track a lot is payments,
592
00:25:36.759 --> 00:25:40.319
and one of the areas I'm very passionate about is
593
00:25:40.400 --> 00:25:43.839
retail payments. And there's a few companies out there that
594
00:25:43.960 --> 00:25:46.279
kind of control the retail sector. One of them is
595
00:25:46.279 --> 00:25:49.640
a company called Toast, and I was scaring through some
596
00:25:49.680 --> 00:25:54.519
of their stuff here, and they're going into a potential here.
597
00:25:54.599 --> 00:25:57.000
Imagine a Toast branded stable point. If you guys don't
598
00:25:57.000 --> 00:25:59.000
know what Toast is, it's a publicly traded point of
599
00:25:59.119 --> 00:26:04.200
sale company that pretty much runs all of retail services.
600
00:26:04.200 --> 00:26:06.400
When you look at hotels, restaurants.
601
00:26:05.960 --> 00:26:06.400
Et cetera.
602
00:26:07.240 --> 00:26:10.759
What about a TOAST partnership with Teller. I mean this
603
00:26:10.839 --> 00:26:15.279
would be the perfect angle for you guys. Is retail payments, Yeah, I.
604
00:26:15.240 --> 00:26:17.680
Mean it's TOAST, And then there are several others, like
605
00:26:17.680 --> 00:26:18.359
we already.
606
00:26:18.079 --> 00:26:20.319
Have partnerships with Strength, which works on the other side,
607
00:26:20.319 --> 00:26:22.720
from the merchant's side, and so these are all things
608
00:26:22.720 --> 00:26:22.880
that I.
609
00:26:22.920 --> 00:26:24.440
Think that's more co commerce.
610
00:26:24.519 --> 00:26:28.480
Yes, yeah, yes, commers ultimately getting to payments on the edge.
611
00:26:28.519 --> 00:26:32.039
But I think that TOAST partnerships would be amazing, And
612
00:26:32.079 --> 00:26:34.119
there are others that we've already are pursuing that I
613
00:26:34.160 --> 00:26:36.920
think would be really valuable to Stellar. Payments and asset
614
00:26:36.920 --> 00:26:40.000
issuance is where Stellar started, and it's the backbone, I
615
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:42.680
think of the movement of value, but also the backbone
616
00:26:42.680 --> 00:26:44.759
of where the world all these eight billion people in
617
00:26:44.799 --> 00:26:47.319
the world want and need to be able to have simplicity,
618
00:26:47.680 --> 00:26:49.680
and so those partnerships are really important to us.
619
00:26:50.079 --> 00:26:52.279
Dinial, Do you think we'll get to a point where
620
00:26:52.319 --> 00:26:54.119
retail because this is a kind of a pet peeve
621
00:26:54.160 --> 00:26:59.680
of mind, where retail merchants can utilize blockchain technologies and
622
00:26:59.799 --> 00:27:03.640
avoid these merchant fees that are coming in from places
623
00:27:03.680 --> 00:27:06.880
like Visa, MasterCard, etc. I mean, because it costs nothing
624
00:27:06.960 --> 00:27:09.279
to move this stuff right now, I don't have. I've got,
625
00:27:09.480 --> 00:27:12.799
you know, basically immediate settlement rather than T plus one.
626
00:27:12.839 --> 00:27:13.519
Two or three.
627
00:27:13.599 --> 00:27:16.839
In some cases, these are large fees that are paid
628
00:27:16.880 --> 00:27:19.079
out to a lot of retailers, which usually translate in
629
00:27:19.160 --> 00:27:20.559
prices back to a consumer.
630
00:27:21.079 --> 00:27:22.880
Do you think that's a future or not?
631
00:27:23.400 --> 00:27:25.960
Oh? Absolutely, I think it's a future. From your lips
632
00:27:25.960 --> 00:27:28.160
to the universe's ears. We need to make this happen.
633
00:27:28.559 --> 00:27:31.599
I think we're already seeing. We just Bermuda is issuing
634
00:27:31.720 --> 00:27:34.880
it's a US dollar on in Stellar for it to
635
00:27:34.920 --> 00:27:36.839
be able to do exactly.
636
00:27:36.400 --> 00:27:38.680
That with the merchants, so the merchants can actually.
637
00:27:38.319 --> 00:27:41.039
Just take the stable asset, settle with the stable asset,
638
00:27:41.039 --> 00:27:43.240
and never have to actually convert into local currency.
639
00:27:43.559 --> 00:27:46.200
And it actually says so much for the end consumer.
640
00:27:46.279 --> 00:27:48.720
I mean, that's the goal of it, and I see
641
00:27:48.759 --> 00:27:49.319
this happening.
642
00:27:49.400 --> 00:27:53.599
It'll probably start, quite honestly, Paul, in smaller regions, because
643
00:27:53.680 --> 00:27:55.839
there's not the pressure that you have from these large
644
00:27:55.880 --> 00:27:58.359
institutions in those smaller countries to be able to make
645
00:27:58.359 --> 00:28:00.759
this happen. But we're here for it, and we're pushing
646
00:28:00.759 --> 00:28:03.400
it as much as we can. That is the end
647
00:28:03.440 --> 00:28:05.799
state dream for me. I didn't get into this space
648
00:28:05.839 --> 00:28:08.960
because I wanted to be focused on like the crypto assets.
649
00:28:09.000 --> 00:28:11.039
I wanted to get into this space because I wanted
650
00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:14.599
to take financial services and make it available to everyone,
651
00:28:15.000 --> 00:28:18.160
and to reduce fees, to reduce cross border payments, to
652
00:28:18.200 --> 00:28:20.599
reduce all of those things so that we could actually
653
00:28:20.599 --> 00:28:23.319
make the world a much more borderless.
654
00:28:22.839 --> 00:28:23.599
And friendly place.
655
00:28:23.880 --> 00:28:24.079
Yeah.
656
00:28:24.160 --> 00:28:25.200
So that those are the.
657
00:28:25.200 --> 00:28:27.279
Exact kinds of things that I focus on on a
658
00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:28.519
daily basis, And I think, so.
659
00:28:28.640 --> 00:28:30.519
Do you do you think we're going to see? Okay?
660
00:28:30.519 --> 00:28:32.400
Because one of the things I think that holds back
661
00:28:32.440 --> 00:28:35.799
a lot of consumers from using crypto because I talk
662
00:28:35.839 --> 00:28:37.359
to people all the time and say, hey, just let
663
00:28:37.400 --> 00:28:39.920
me send USDC to you right now. You know, it's
664
00:28:39.960 --> 00:28:42.319
that simple, it'd be right there in your wallet. You know,
665
00:28:42.359 --> 00:28:46.279
they're very sensitive to it because they think it's too complicated. Okay,
666
00:28:46.960 --> 00:28:51.519
it's not like Venmo or zell or even PayPal. Yet,
667
00:28:51.960 --> 00:28:55.720
how long before we get to that level of consumer
668
00:28:55.799 --> 00:28:59.319
confidence where crypto would be looked at to something like
669
00:28:59.319 --> 00:29:01.839
a zel payment coming across even those Zell's pretty much
670
00:29:01.880 --> 00:29:04.319
run by the banks. But the point is, you know
671
00:29:04.400 --> 00:29:06.559
something that doesn't involve complexity.
672
00:29:06.839 --> 00:29:08.519
I don't think it's very far off. You know, when
673
00:29:08.559 --> 00:29:10.799
I started in this space so seven years ago.
674
00:29:10.960 --> 00:29:14.160
We actually didn't have the UX designers and the builders
675
00:29:14.160 --> 00:29:16.119
to think about it from the standpoint of ease of use.
676
00:29:16.480 --> 00:29:17.920
It used to be very complicated.
677
00:29:18.279 --> 00:29:20.799
When I think about where we came from seven years
678
00:29:20.839 --> 00:29:24.240
ago to where we are today, it's dramatic difference. We
679
00:29:24.359 --> 00:29:27.039
have those UX designers, those people that care about the
680
00:29:27.079 --> 00:29:29.880
product for the product's sake, and I don't want you
681
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:32.960
to ever have to say I'm sending you USDC. I
682
00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:34.440
want you just to say I'm going to send you
683
00:29:34.480 --> 00:29:36.839
some money, and then it's just going to be ease
684
00:29:36.880 --> 00:29:37.200
of use.
685
00:29:37.240 --> 00:29:39.240
So for me, that tech stack, as much as I
686
00:29:39.319 --> 00:29:40.920
love the tech stack and I love.
687
00:29:40.759 --> 00:29:43.440
The technology and how that has the impacts that it
688
00:29:43.440 --> 00:29:45.759
can make, we shouldn't ever have to talk about it.
689
00:29:46.079 --> 00:29:47.839
I think all the time about back in the days
690
00:29:47.880 --> 00:29:51.119
when I was at Mozilla and really focusing on bringing
691
00:29:51.240 --> 00:29:55.799
HTTPS to the browser into the web. It wasn't something
692
00:29:55.839 --> 00:29:58.519
that the retail side had to understand. I wanted them
693
00:29:58.599 --> 00:30:01.279
just to be compusing it. And that is the world
694
00:30:01.319 --> 00:30:02.839
that I want to get to here. That is my
695
00:30:03.039 --> 00:30:05.279
dream and the aim that we have at Stellar, and
696
00:30:05.319 --> 00:30:07.880
certainly that I think most folks in Blockchaine.
697
00:30:07.920 --> 00:30:11.160
You Yeah, good to know Danelle Dixon. Thanks so much
698
00:30:11.160 --> 00:30:14.000
for coming in today. We appreciate your time, such a pleasure.
699
00:30:14.039 --> 00:30:20.400
Thank you.
700
00:30:21.359 --> 00:30:23.920
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701
00:30:23.920 --> 00:30:27.519
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702
00:30:27.799 --> 00:30:28.920
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