Is Magic Cool or Cringe? 10 Brutally Honest Debates #216

WEBVTT
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They're guys. They do magic. They are the Magic Guys.
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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to episode 216 of the Magic Guys.
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To my left, I got Nick Kay.
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That's right, I'm Nick Kay, and joining us this week is Daddy Doug,
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all the way from his new movie series, Hangover 5.
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That's my life lately.
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What's up, y'all? Good to be back. Good to be back. I am suffering from a Las
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Vegas hangover. This is my life now.
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Now you're with us in that it's morning for you as well in America as it is for us in Australia.
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We knew moving to Vegas would get you into the Australian rhythm of time.
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And now you're nocturnal. So this is perfect.
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I'm still adapting. Everyone here is like, don't wake me up before 2 p.m. I'm like, okay.
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You know what i'm excited about i'm excited about the
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idea of being a plus one ordinarily someone is
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always my plus one when i go to events or or have
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tickets to something or whatever it might be there's an
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opportunity that you might actually need a plus two when we come to visit doug
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because like you know josh and i go and be in town and we
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need to figure out what we're gonna do no doubt
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yeah it's it's coming
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up soon my goodness i would be
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happy to go back to the let's talk about matt franco's show
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which i just saw last night here at the link well
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you know what that'll that'll come up perfectly because our episode
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is is magic cool or cringe and you just saw what i would say is one of the pretty
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cool magicians of our time so i think that'll come in pretty well i think great
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to see everyone here live in the chat by the way one of you sent in a speak
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pipe so i thought we would give our audience the floor to begin today's episode.
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With a question on it so we're going to throw it over to aj
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and see what he's up to first off love
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the podcasts listen religiously so thank
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you for that i have 90 seconds here so i'm gonna try to get my
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question out because it's a little bit long-winded but i am
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an avid connoisseur of magic books and
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material i'm constantly learning but with
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that i keep finding myself getting new
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material like constantly and so I'll end
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up performing you know some things for
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a week or two weeks and then I move on and next thing I know I'm you know half
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a year year year and a half later I look back at some notes that I took and
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at tricks that I once performed that are fantastic and I've forgotten them.
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So I guess my question is, how do you dial in material that you know you want
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to consistently perform? Because I'm always...
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Learning more more material trying to
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improve but i'm finding it somewhat detrimental because i'm not i don't have
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like a steadfast repertoire if that makes sense okay so how do you pick kind
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of your staples maybe that's a better way to put it like how do you pick your staples and then.
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Create kind of sets based off of
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that uh anyway thanks again
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love the show appreciate it okay firstly like
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really good thought process that he has there trying to understand that
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like you do set as you perform and so forth can i
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take point on this one fellas right please do
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start yeah because this is kind of just like reminiscent of what i talk about
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in my my bible lecture which stands for basic instructions for being a leading
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entertainer so it's the very first lecture i ever wrote and this is going to
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be a benefit to you so as far as learning stuff all the time by all means do that. I do it myself.
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I'm actually part of a book club where we buy a book every month and we go through the book.
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We just finished doing a Steve Mayhew's book, which I read and skipped through
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a lot of it just because everything was, you produce the four aces and then
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you produce the four aces and then, and I was just like, I don't need any more four ace tricks.
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I know this is great. I know where it comes from. That's great.
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But like, I don't, I don't care for this.
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I don't want to add it to my repertoire or I read through it and I go,
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that's nice that I learned that, but I'm never going to add that to my repertoire.
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So don't feel bad about adding knowledge to your mindset is the first thing I want to say.
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Now, when it comes to what routines you keep in your repertoire,
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I think it comes down to the audience.
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And the audience, if you want to give them the best experience,
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they'll give you that feedback.
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So by all means, test out new material in between doing stuff.
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We call that hammocking, in
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which you'll do a really good routine that you know is very well strong.
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You'll hammock in between that a routine you're working on and then close with
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the routine that you're really, really strong with.
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So by all means, you still have opportunities to try stuff.
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But I think that to long story short, this let your like try stuff,
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learn it, test it on your audience, but let them dictate it.
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Because I think that if you want to give them the best time,
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that's what you want to do.
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Said like a true legend. That was fantastic.
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And the only thing I would sprinkle on top of that is I saw a clip of Ozzy Wynn
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talking to Ben Earle the other day.
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And Ozzy Wynn said it pretty well.
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He's talking about there's a difference between being an entertainer and an artist.
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But in this world, the entertainer is what is going to perform to the masses.
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And he says an entertainer is a professional surveyor.
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They conduct surveys by throwing out lots of different routines and they get
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the results back of which ones the audience like.
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And then that's what they then serve to them.
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So just in a shorter sentence of what Nick's saying, try lots of stuff.
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Just remember the stuff that gets a good reaction.
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Listen to your people. Don't quit playing, though.
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We can always play in the in the sandbox
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right and learn new things but you want to keep that solid 10 routines you know
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however yeah there's there's something to be said right about purely you can't
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purely listen to the audience because we know if we just went out there with you know the five best.
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Gimmicked effects that will slay like
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they will do really well but then we might not
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have any soul after a few years of doing well this is the
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difference between craft and art if
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you do if you're mimicking things you've seen if you're all
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your repertoire is all store-bought magic tricks and you're
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doing the pattern that was in the instructions you're just a
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craftsman or a surveyor right the
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artist is the one who has the unique point of view and develops
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those tricks and the unique presentations and probably changes
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the magic moments to better benefit his
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audience yeah let me show some of the back of that
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because i was jamming with my mentor and good friend who you
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know also doc andrew and we were talking about
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this he's working my residencies are these holy moly's for me now and he was
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showing me this coins across that he does and there was a final phase that he
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did in which he was holding the coins palm up because you had it in a particular
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type of clip that was like super duper angle-y and holding it to like his stomach.
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And it looks so weird to hold his hands in this fashion, especially when he's
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wearing this beautiful suit and looks a million bucks.
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But then he's standing like he's arthritic. It just didn't seem right.
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And gentlemanly now we worked on it, right?
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Now the routine was there, but through different learnings, we ended up polishing
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these routines further and further.
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He ended up calling me the week after we had this jam session and said,
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oh my God, thank you so much for sharing that trick with me.
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If I hadn't experienced that little bit of knowledge, I couldn't have proved
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upon it. So you can always learn stuff and improve on what you already have.
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And once you have it, you don't have to bury it. You don't have to make this
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decision that you never want to do it again.
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Like it's always just going to be stuff that's in your pocket.
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Like, or when I mean that, I mean metaphorically, in the back of your mind,
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when you need it, you do it.
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But yo, that's some good advice. Get some extra eyeballs on the material you're developing.
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Maybe not always a magician, you know, maybe they should be lower down.
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But, you know, you can find a venue to perform this stuff over and over.
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That's your best bet, right? That in the notebook.
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Yeah yeah yeah aj thanks for
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the question my friend please guys send them in the speak pipes the
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link is in the description speakpipe.com forward
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slash the magic guys drop us a line and aj
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just you know try it's so hard as as a
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hobbyist magician even a pro to not get sucked into the
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ever-flowing churn of new effects
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coming out you know that's that's tough but better than
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not doing magic you know so you'll you'll probably some people just
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do that let's not make those people feel lesser it's perfectly
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fine to just do nothing but learn magic your
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whole life you never even have to do a trick you can
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enjoy magic that way it's fine some some
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would say that's probably more like the better way to
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enjoy magic i mean that's the student's approach it's magic
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is the ultimate studious endeavor because
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it's endless right the rabbit hole is so deep
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can i also say at the back of that
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how envious are we as like professionals
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who perform for a living i don't know about you guys
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but i'll speak on my behalf that as professional i so envy
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people who have this opportunity to just constantly be learning stuff like all
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the time like yeah i'm so envious but like as a professional when you've got
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your staples and your reputation makers you've got to make sure that you stay
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on point and that they're always so perfect and you really put the effort into them.
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And it upsets me because I'm,
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trying to stay sharper and sharper, but in the same breath, sort of envious
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of the people who just go, I'm just learning stuff all the time and I perform it.
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And if it's right or wrong, or if it's not perfect, it doesn't matter.
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But it's just like, I envy those guys.
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You're still doing that. You're just finding the moments within the magic you
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already do to improve that.
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And that is so much a part of being a great magician, right?
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You know, am I standing this way or am I standing this way when I do the,
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you know, whatever you're doing? You know what?
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Very good. Yeah, very good point. Because I was pretty jealous of your friend
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Chihan when we were at the assembly convention.
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Isn't he like a really successful lawyer? Is that his profession?
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That's exactly what he is. Yeah. So Chihan Yeo is an amazing cardsmith who by
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day is a property lawyer handling deals that are upwards of hundreds of millions of dollars.
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And then you see him sit down with a pack of cards and he's like, the guy's got hands.
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He has yeah i'm just seeing him i'm just seeing i'm just watching him do second
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deals as we're chatting and i'm like i got no time to effing work on second
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deals like i gotta make sure i can.
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Get to my do my gigs and like you know
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win over this crowd and da da da da and you're
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just here you know making tons of cash not even
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with magic and then you can just enjoy learning good
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magic but to what dog's saying like
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it's really fun doing shows and we'll
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do two shows a night and in each show I'll tweak a different
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way of revealing a thing like for ages I was trying to find the best way to
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reveal the Rubik's Cube to the audience and after so many different little nuanced
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tries I finally found a way where just taking a Rubik's Cube out of a thing
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gets a laugh when that should never have been a moment so those little tweaks are really fun.
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One more. I'm flushing back as we talk about one of my mentors,
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Cellini, and he talked about his first lesson with Slydini.
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Now, imagine you've ponied up a few blocks to go study with the great one, Slydini.
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You're in New York, you go to the studio, and you're ready to learn some Slydini
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magic. Where do we start?
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You know where Slydini started? I remember two things Cellini talked about.
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One of them was this, how to walk onto a stage.
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You know so that was lesson one enter
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the stage how are you how are you doing that
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and then another one was how to accept applause you
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know when people are being generous with their
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you know how do you acknowledge that it wasn't
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how to laugh it wasn't you know how the impasse or any of that it was you know
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professional moments that will make your magic better these are the kind of
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things we can work on plus the tricks so yeah that's so cool that's so cool
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that's yeah even how to you know professionally take cards out of a box without looking.
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I'm wondering how many magicians out there have thought about how they walk onto a stage,
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a good book for that is yeah another good book for that is steve cohen's winning
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the crowd he talks about that as well he's like if you're behind curtains start
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walking 10 steps before you get to the stage so you're already at full speed
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instead of seeing the audience see you slowly start walking out what about williamson's
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approach this is the williamson.
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Doug is just tearing open a deck
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like a banana ripping the books apart taking out
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the goods inside hell yeah so then
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there's the williamson approach yeah i mean i've never seen anyone just be
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out of with the thumb just break the seal like that yeah it's pretty
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dope i was going to casino in biloxi and then one of
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the pit bosses was doing that i was like where did you learn that
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he's like look dude you gotta open 800 boxes a night
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you'd learn it too crap sure
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yeah and you know what these are the things that
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you start focusing on when you want to kind of be in that top one
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percent of awesome magicians okay like these are the this
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is the difference that it like i always talk about like it's formula
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one because there's milliseconds between you and 10th place like like the time
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from the person in first place is like 0.64 seconds you know between that and
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last So you've really got to start peeling off milliseconds and just doing little
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things to get better and better and polish and polish.
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And it comes in so many different formats, which we're coming down a rabbit
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hole, which is probably a little bit further away from what the question was.
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But these are the sorts of things we think about as we go along.
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So we should probably do that at some point, have a big chat about like,
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how do you get into the top?
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Echelon. Yeah. I mean, and even just for winning over an audience,
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like there's like milliseconds between you seeming cool and you seeming cringe.
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Oh yeah. You know, you know what I'm saying?
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Right into this episode's theme.
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Can we just segue? Yeah. I, I was meant to hit the air horn,
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but instead I changed my voice, but we roll with it. You know what I'm saying?
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So today's episode we've called it.
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Yeah. I'm mad. I'm magicians. Cool. or are they cringe?
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There's 10 questions we're going to debate and just riff on here.
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And we'd love to hear your thoughts in the chat, in the live chat as well.
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Starting with number 10, which is about our attire, our costume.
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So it's titled Fedora or for pass?
00:15:08.868 --> 00:15:15.168
Is what we wear outdated stage fashion that screams being try hard or should
00:15:15.168 --> 00:15:20.268
magicians dress like real humans or could it be stylized if owned with confidence?
00:15:20.868 --> 00:15:26.388
I'm going to throw it over to Doug first. He's seen many magician's attire over the time.
00:15:27.448 --> 00:15:30.888
What say you? That actually looked really good.
00:15:31.348 --> 00:15:35.288
Actually, that was, you know, fedoras are cool if they're worn by Doug Kahn,
00:15:35.408 --> 00:15:37.508
100%. But should they be like a staple?
00:15:37.688 --> 00:15:44.188
Like, okay, I'm a magician now. I should buy my fedora and buy my bow tie and buy my coattails.
00:15:45.588 --> 00:15:51.688
Yeah, well, you know, I think in the modern age, we can wear what we want.
00:15:52.568 --> 00:15:57.088
Like, I think this kind of started with David Blaine, you know,
00:15:57.168 --> 00:15:58.908
when he decided a t-shirt was cool.
00:15:59.228 --> 00:16:03.368
But really, it's Robert Houdin who changed it back in the 1800s when he put
00:16:03.368 --> 00:16:06.628
on a tuxedo instead of a wizard robe with a dunce hat.
00:16:07.404 --> 00:16:10.524
Uh yeah i you know i think it all boils down to character right it's
00:16:10.524 --> 00:16:13.624
like what image are you trying to portray your audience and what
00:16:13.624 --> 00:16:17.364
you know what costume does does
00:16:17.364 --> 00:16:20.204
that best yeah also does it does
00:16:20.204 --> 00:16:23.284
serve a purpose in some routines i mean i use a
00:16:23.284 --> 00:16:26.104
bowler's hat in in in
00:16:26.104 --> 00:16:29.164
my cups and balls routine and as a result i made it part of my
00:16:29.164 --> 00:16:32.284
my character and my costume and everything
00:16:32.284 --> 00:16:35.584
else you know nowadays i don't i've shied
00:16:35.584 --> 00:16:38.404
away from that as much but whenever i do that routine the hat
00:16:38.404 --> 00:16:41.284
comes out you know and i tell them the mythology of the routine
00:16:41.284 --> 00:16:44.424
and how long i've been doing it for and whatever else so yeah and.
00:16:44.424 --> 00:16:48.464
I think if you're going to do something or if it's going to be part of your costume
00:16:48.464 --> 00:16:52.684
like if you were going to be like the punk rock magician and
00:16:52.684 --> 00:16:55.584
that your jacket was covered in like bobby pins then
00:16:55.584 --> 00:16:58.444
use the bobby pins and do like a pin link
00:16:58.444 --> 00:17:01.564
type thing you know what i mean like i think things that
00:17:01.564 --> 00:17:05.424
are indigenous to your location and to your person doug
00:17:05.424 --> 00:17:08.244
do you remember what kind of attire matt
00:17:08.244 --> 00:17:11.264
franco was wearing at his show matt was
00:17:11.264 --> 00:17:14.144
in black suit the black suit had some
00:17:14.144 --> 00:17:16.944
white stripes on the arms which i didn't really like but you
00:17:16.944 --> 00:17:19.804
know it's a creative choice that i guess because he does a lot of slight hand
00:17:19.804 --> 00:17:22.924
in the show it draws attention to that body part all
00:17:22.924 --> 00:17:26.184
black and then just white stripe along the
00:17:26.184 --> 00:17:29.224
lower part it wasn't even like everywhere just
00:17:29.224 --> 00:17:32.344
that single feature he did do a costume
00:17:32.344 --> 00:17:39.024
change midway like this that's this that's it that's so that so for example
00:17:39.024 --> 00:17:42.664
i guess this is a good starting point he so what i'm noticing is he's wearing
00:17:42.664 --> 00:17:49.824
a t-shirt under his yeah right yeah very casual yeah he had on like a simple jewelry you know and.
00:17:50.678 --> 00:17:55.178
He changed his boots once during the show to a maroon jacket.
00:17:55.918 --> 00:17:59.558
I'm looking at David Copperfield, and I don't know.
00:18:00.138 --> 00:18:03.618
I'm seeing two different versions of Copperfield on stage.
00:18:03.798 --> 00:18:09.698
One is him in a suit, but he has no tie or anything. It's an open shirt,
00:18:09.738 --> 00:18:11.358
so he can show a bit of the chest.
00:18:11.558 --> 00:18:16.878
And then the other version, which in my memory, this is how I see Copperfield a lot.
00:18:16.878 --> 00:18:19.618
And it's the version where he has a white t-shirt and then like
00:18:19.618 --> 00:18:22.778
a long-sleeved unbuttoned uh blue blue
00:18:22.778 --> 00:18:25.818
shirt and you know that's
00:18:25.818 --> 00:18:30.198
not your classic suited up three-piece um
00:18:30.198 --> 00:18:33.638
magician at all and uh and then you got david blaine always
00:18:33.638 --> 00:18:36.718
rocking t-shirts ozzy wind one of my favorite magicians wears
00:18:36.718 --> 00:18:39.558
a t-shirt and then it as this show right here
00:18:39.558 --> 00:18:42.558
this las vegas late night late night magic show
00:18:42.558 --> 00:18:45.578
is a great example of how you can portray magic in
00:18:45.578 --> 00:18:48.478
many characters one of them is a wrestling character he
00:18:48.478 --> 00:18:52.278
wears a wrestling mask the shocker greg now get
00:18:52.278 --> 00:18:58.938
the name right the the mc is a boisterous comedian and comic book jacket you
00:18:58.938 --> 00:19:03.058
know bizarro is his everybody knows bizarro he's got his own thing going on
00:19:03.058 --> 00:19:08.478
the female magician was sexy and a little bit scantily clad so you know And
00:19:08.478 --> 00:19:12.198
all of them were killing it with their own point of view,
00:19:12.478 --> 00:19:15.178
using the costuming that fits their character.
00:19:15.738 --> 00:19:20.658
I think you nailed it, Doug. I think it's bringing your point of view is maybe
00:19:20.658 --> 00:19:21.918
the more important thing.
00:19:22.158 --> 00:19:28.478
Because now that I'm looking at all of the top magicians that the layman might
00:19:28.478 --> 00:19:33.278
know of, none of them are really rocking a three-piece suit that we're used
00:19:33.278 --> 00:19:36.518
to wearing to a corporate gig where we need to match the audience and stuff.
00:19:36.518 --> 00:19:39.218
But it's something to consider it doesn't have to
00:19:39.218 --> 00:19:42.018
be your go-to more importantly it's got
00:19:42.018 --> 00:19:47.858
to be your character and i love that i don't know why i took so long to like
00:19:47.858 --> 00:19:51.718
stop wearing a tie to gigs for me personally because i would never normally
00:19:51.718 --> 00:19:58.238
wear them and yeah yeah back in the 90s i was table hopping a brunch in a three-piece
00:19:58.238 --> 00:20:01.158
tuxedo you know fucking whole nine yards tails
00:20:01.418 --> 00:20:04.718
i'm in tails in the 90s baby i had
00:20:04.718 --> 00:20:07.858
to grow out of that i think you should look you should
00:20:07.858 --> 00:20:10.858
look like you have something better to be is what i figured that
00:20:10.858 --> 00:20:13.838
out about eight months into that gig i'm like i gotta get rid of this thing
00:20:13.838 --> 00:20:18.578
this is horrible and then uh blue blazer it's kind of my go-to sense you know
00:20:18.578 --> 00:20:23.558
yeah no i think you work a lot with costuming and and some of your stuff is
00:20:23.558 --> 00:20:29.478
is required for some of your teamings and stuff so well yeah what are your thoughts man dude i think,
00:20:30.078 --> 00:20:35.038
stuff I do is costume dependent and I've got tuxedos, I've got sports jackets,
00:20:35.278 --> 00:20:38.878
I've got all types of clothes to suit what I need to wear and they're all built
00:20:38.878 --> 00:20:42.418
for different purposes but I think there needs to be a level of.
00:20:43.333 --> 00:20:47.433
Is it genuine you got to be genuine to some degree you know what i mean so i
00:20:47.433 --> 00:20:51.233
think that works really well a lot of people try to portray themselves with
00:20:51.233 --> 00:20:54.193
something that they're not and it kind of shows through if they haven't developed
00:20:54.193 --> 00:20:56.433
their character because i think your character,
00:20:57.073 --> 00:20:59.813
should be a higher version of yourself and not like a
00:20:59.813 --> 00:21:02.913
totally left of center version of yourself you know i had
00:21:02.913 --> 00:21:05.853
a conversation recently with a good friend lewis we were
00:21:05.853 --> 00:21:08.653
jamming with him at the assembly if you don't recall
00:21:08.653 --> 00:21:11.493
who he is and you know he was talking about this routine where like you
00:21:11.493 --> 00:21:14.213
got to do it like crazy confident like super egotistical blah and
00:21:14.213 --> 00:21:17.753
i'm like but you're not that guy you're a sweetheart and you're quite shy this
00:21:17.753 --> 00:21:21.973
isn't gonna work if you do it this way you know so but
00:21:21.973 --> 00:21:25.793
yeah costume wise purpose built also the
00:21:25.793 --> 00:21:28.693
weather far out man like yeah i think
00:21:28.693 --> 00:21:31.593
we're going away from fedora hats and talking about costuming it
00:21:31.593 --> 00:21:34.533
might be worth pressing on podcast is going to be what to wear
00:21:34.533 --> 00:21:37.373
as a magician yeah exactly let's change
00:21:37.373 --> 00:21:40.113
the title let's press on a number nine so we
00:21:40.113 --> 00:21:43.033
don't get a whole 10 minutes let's go
00:21:43.033 --> 00:21:46.593
good like the thing is all of these questions could be there an episode you
00:21:46.593 --> 00:21:51.593
know so you're really getting the goods jam-packed yeah number nine number nine
00:21:51.593 --> 00:21:57.753
is saying pick a card cringe now and then the notes on this are is it overused
00:21:57.753 --> 00:22:02.013
and just unimaginative or is it a classic line that sets up the effect clearly,
00:22:02.613 --> 00:22:06.113
Can you reinvent the line creatively for yourself?
00:22:07.353 --> 00:22:11.653
Okay, so sometimes I've seen guys spread the deck to the spectators and just
00:22:11.653 --> 00:22:15.213
go, okay, do the thing, do the thing. Come on, do the thing.
00:22:15.953 --> 00:22:18.833
And it's like, you know what to do, do the thing. That's right.
00:22:19.173 --> 00:22:22.773
That's kind of interesting because you're playing on the fact that they know,
00:22:23.636 --> 00:22:26.876
what you would say yeah like and i
00:22:26.876 --> 00:22:29.716
think there's nothing wrong with saying this trick starts like all card
00:22:29.716 --> 00:22:32.456
tricks do pick a card pick any card i think
00:22:32.456 --> 00:22:35.436
there's nothing wrong with that i think that it's it's got
00:22:35.436 --> 00:22:40.496
a nice ring to it i would suggest this not only is there not any not anything
00:22:40.496 --> 00:22:45.776
wrong with it but that people want that experience from a magician a close-up
00:22:45.776 --> 00:22:48.896
you don't have to give it to them and there's reasons not to and that's fine
00:22:48.896 --> 00:22:53.616
but people love to be the person that gets to pick a card, any card.
00:22:54.256 --> 00:22:58.256
It is unfortunate that removing a selection from the pack is generally a dumb
00:22:58.256 --> 00:23:00.376
idea, but we'll talk about that another day.
00:23:00.896 --> 00:23:06.536
Yeah, I mean, I guess the question is probably because you get some people that
00:23:06.536 --> 00:23:09.176
are like, I've seen this one, you know, because they're like,
00:23:10.216 --> 00:23:14.236
oh, the same card trick is probably what you're going to do. Which, you know.
00:23:15.176 --> 00:23:18.696
Alluding, I do it that way. I say I have to do this at least once a show,
00:23:18.936 --> 00:23:21.836
sir, go ahead, pick a card, any card.
00:23:22.236 --> 00:23:26.636
And it's a nice moment, you know, people can relate to that and they have,
00:23:26.696 --> 00:23:31.756
it's a good grounding point and a great experience for the person that's into picking cards.
00:23:32.836 --> 00:23:36.236
So before we decide whether it's cringe or not, I have one thing I'd like to
00:23:36.236 --> 00:23:40.276
add, which is I typically don't let anyone choose a card with,
00:23:40.276 --> 00:23:44.396
with the way I perform just because I'm everyone's drinking and cards get wet
00:23:44.396 --> 00:23:46.956
and tables are wet and their hands are wet from holding drinks, et cetera.
00:23:46.956 --> 00:23:50.376
So I just do a lot of like say stop and I'll
00:23:50.376 --> 00:23:53.596
dribble I'll dribble cards or I'll riffle through cards
00:23:53.596 --> 00:23:56.396
I do a lot of like and the idea is is that when if I'm dribbling
00:23:56.396 --> 00:23:59.996
cards from hand to hand whenever they say stop you stop the dribble and then
00:23:59.996 --> 00:24:02.956
you've got a nice clear visual indicator of everyone's seeing it and you can
00:24:02.956 --> 00:24:07.156
engage with every single person in that moment as opposed to asking someone
00:24:07.156 --> 00:24:10.176
to take the card and show everyone because sometimes that person's a dickhead
00:24:10.176 --> 00:24:15.056
and they don't actually show everyone they just look at themselves and they and they hide it and and
00:24:15.436 --> 00:24:18.196
And then you have to put the card back once it's out.
00:24:18.356 --> 00:24:21.056
That's my problem with it. Once it's in the wild, now what happens?
00:24:21.236 --> 00:24:23.356
Do they put it back? Do you grab the card back?
00:24:23.676 --> 00:24:28.696
And it's just not efficient in a working environment.
00:24:29.396 --> 00:24:33.876
And it keeps all eyes on you and it allows you to connect with every single
00:24:33.876 --> 00:24:37.256
person participating. Because you might see somebody just looking over their
00:24:37.256 --> 00:24:40.236
shoulder, but, oh, come closer, friends, so you can see it. Can you see better now? Come and join us.
00:24:40.356 --> 00:24:43.816
You can now welcome people into your circle that you were entertaining at this
00:24:43.816 --> 00:24:44.876
corporate event, for example.
00:24:45.056 --> 00:24:47.876
And then, you know, you put in your hand, everyone saw the card,
00:24:48.036 --> 00:24:49.976
say yes, great. And you can get into the routine.
00:24:50.276 --> 00:24:55.236
So is it cringe? I'm going to say no, it's classic.
00:24:56.136 --> 00:24:57.336
Thoughts? Okay.
00:24:58.356 --> 00:25:03.936
I'm going to play the advocate here and say it's a little cringe because we
00:25:03.936 --> 00:25:08.476
could be more artistic about our routines than saying pick a card.
00:25:08.616 --> 00:25:09.536
Because then we could vary.
00:25:09.776 --> 00:25:13.316
We could do three card routines and them all feel different.
00:25:13.316 --> 00:25:18.536
But they'll feel the same if we every time go, now pick a card. Ah, now you pick a card.
00:25:19.432 --> 00:25:23.792
And that's something to think about is one of the main reasons why I learn a stack.
00:25:24.012 --> 00:25:28.192
So I can just say to someone, name any card. And now I've skipped the entire
00:25:28.192 --> 00:25:30.532
process of pick one, put it back in.
00:25:30.752 --> 00:25:33.712
They just named it. And now I can do something with it.
00:25:33.792 --> 00:25:37.432
Even if it's whatever card trick you're thinking of right now at home,
00:25:37.612 --> 00:25:41.212
listening to this, I could now still go into it. Okay.
00:25:41.592 --> 00:25:47.712
So there is one for not cringe, one for a little cringe, the deciding vote.
00:25:47.912 --> 00:25:52.172
Doug, is it cringe or not? I say, own the cringe.
00:25:56.232 --> 00:26:03.512
You're going to say it. Bang the gavel, that is cringe. Let's move to number eight. Hell yeah.
00:26:04.092 --> 00:26:09.132
Number eight. Are magic conventions cool or cult-like?
00:26:09.332 --> 00:26:17.092
Do they echo chambers and the everyone's a star vibe?
00:26:17.092 --> 00:26:20.432
Or are they cool community building and inspiring
00:26:20.432 --> 00:26:23.392
do conventions help push magic
00:26:23.392 --> 00:26:27.512
forward question mark thug uh
00:26:27.512 --> 00:26:30.492
i could say yes to all those things man
00:26:30.492 --> 00:26:33.312
what is this multi-prong question that we're doing
00:26:33.312 --> 00:26:37.172
another episode now i know magic magic
00:26:37.172 --> 00:26:39.972
conventions are the best they're all the above man great
00:26:39.972 --> 00:26:42.872
place to connect with the community great place to learn stuff
00:26:42.872 --> 00:26:45.812
and yeah if you're an egotistic jerk off great place
00:26:45.812 --> 00:26:48.952
to be a show off everyone will watch you do your thing and they'll talk
00:26:48.952 --> 00:26:52.472
about you like i am right now but go ahead worst thing
00:26:52.472 --> 00:26:55.532
in magic is an egotistical magician i see
00:26:55.532 --> 00:27:00.972
you i see you watching me right now yeah i
00:27:00.972 --> 00:27:04.512
think it's well yeah whatever you want the convention to be it will be that
00:27:04.512 --> 00:27:09.932
it's probably what it is yeah but i love them essentially we need them like
00:27:09.932 --> 00:27:13.932
yeah it's the one place Eric Leclerc when he came on it's he's like it's the
00:27:13.932 --> 00:27:17.172
one place where you can still go and see the
00:27:17.578 --> 00:27:22.918
like brick and mortar effect, like an actual setup of magic effects to buy. It's not online.
00:27:23.158 --> 00:27:27.558
You know, it's so rare that we get to be around other performers that much.
00:27:28.038 --> 00:27:33.398
Yeah. But then, yeah, you will see the show-offs or the people that are there
00:27:33.398 --> 00:27:35.138
because they want you to see them there.
00:27:35.518 --> 00:27:40.878
It's all those things, but it's essentially, it's great. So my vote would be, it's cool.
00:27:41.558 --> 00:27:44.578
It's a cool cult, you know, join. What do you say?
00:27:44.798 --> 00:27:48.658
Yeah, look, I think it's cool because, you know, anything that's going to help
00:27:48.658 --> 00:27:51.918
propagate forward in a good way is obviously very important.
00:27:52.058 --> 00:27:55.238
When you're at a convention, you're in the dealer's room, you're seeing all
00:27:55.238 --> 00:27:57.638
these products, most possibly for the first time.
00:27:57.778 --> 00:28:01.918
And then you have this beautiful opportunity to like purchase them months,
00:28:01.918 --> 00:28:05.818
if not sometimes a year before they actually hit the shelves of every other brick and mortar.
00:28:05.998 --> 00:28:09.418
So that's a really good place to be. You also get to sit in on the lectures,
00:28:09.638 --> 00:28:15.078
which I think are very valuable and be part of the panels and ask questions and,
00:28:15.078 --> 00:28:18.538
you know shake hands with a hero you know like we wouldn't have the pleasure
00:28:18.538 --> 00:28:22.318
of setting up so many friendships and you know like there's nothing more wonderful
00:28:22.318 --> 00:28:24.858
than getting in an elevator and someone turns to you and goes hey man aren't
00:28:24.858 --> 00:28:28.298
you in a band and I go oh I listen you know.
00:28:29.098 --> 00:28:34.698
You know so I think that that's important and community in magic is important
00:28:34.698 --> 00:28:38.498
because it helps keep us in check and I also think that there's probably some
00:28:38.498 --> 00:28:42.958
very small and I it's almost unnoticeable, but there are some,
00:28:43.678 --> 00:28:47.138
groups within the magic community that are really just themselves.
00:28:47.738 --> 00:28:51.898
Like, there's a lot of ways to enjoy magic conventions as part of a cult.
00:28:52.038 --> 00:28:55.898
For example, you might be a kid's performer and go to a kid's magic convention,
00:28:55.898 --> 00:29:02.178
or this week in Las Vegas, Trick Supply is exhibiting at the Magic Collector's Summit.
00:29:02.478 --> 00:29:06.678
It's a convention at the Orleans Hotel where the Magic Live is,
00:29:06.778 --> 00:29:08.638
but this is for people who collect magic.
00:29:08.978 --> 00:29:13.818
So, you know, And if you're into collectibles, well, there's your convention.
00:29:13.838 --> 00:29:17.038
If you're into close-up magic, you might go to trips, you know,
00:29:17.138 --> 00:29:18.378
in Charlotte, North Carolina.
00:29:19.578 --> 00:29:24.298
Yeah. So you can find your own cult to enjoy. It is cultish.
00:29:24.738 --> 00:29:31.758
Yeah. And so say if it's cool or cringe, I'm going to say conventions are cool. Josh. Cool. Cool.
00:29:32.518 --> 00:29:34.618
They're cool. Hey.
00:29:36.578 --> 00:29:38.378
Number seven. You guys know that?
00:29:39.283 --> 00:29:45.763
Oh, no. Doug's cringe. He just left the chat. He'll be back, I'm sure.
00:29:46.183 --> 00:29:49.263
Oh, geez. Well, we'll keep it moving until he gets back here.
00:29:49.783 --> 00:29:52.523
Because actually, probably good, too, that he's not here for this one.
00:29:52.683 --> 00:29:56.763
Number seven, are Invisible Decks and Spongeballs just lazy?
00:29:57.123 --> 00:30:02.003
Are they overused beginner props, or are they still strong when performed with intention?
00:30:02.723 --> 00:30:07.443
The question is, do classics deserve more respect or retirement?
00:30:08.963 --> 00:30:15.583
Whoo lots of loaded ammo here jeez we did have a chat one time about retiring,
00:30:16.283 --> 00:30:18.963
magic old magic remember that was a really
00:30:18.963 --> 00:30:21.843
fun episode we did not talk about the
00:30:21.843 --> 00:30:25.843
invisible deck in that episode no ha when
00:30:25.843 --> 00:30:28.723
was the last time nick you would have performed with the
00:30:28.723 --> 00:30:31.563
classic invisible deck gimmick itself i know
00:30:31.563 --> 00:30:34.403
you have your own beautiful version which is what maybe an artist should
00:30:34.403 --> 00:30:37.723
do but when did you last use an invisible deck honestly i
00:30:37.723 --> 00:30:41.183
bought one in the first year of me doing magic and
00:30:41.183 --> 00:30:44.783
i never performed it ever right okay
00:30:44.783 --> 00:30:47.823
um yep myself i
00:30:47.823 --> 00:30:51.183
have one invisible deck i own it's a bicycle deck and
00:30:51.183 --> 00:30:56.183
it's the box is getting so tattered because it just lives in a box somewhere
00:30:56.183 --> 00:31:01.923
that i can get if i need to yeah but don't use okay when was the last time you
00:31:01.923 --> 00:31:09.023
did a classic sponge ball routine I do not do sponge interesting I also,
00:31:09.683 --> 00:31:12.223
couldn't tell you where my sponge balls are right now.
00:31:13.403 --> 00:31:22.423
When I would do gigs I used to keep them just in my back pocket in case there was kids there yep and,
00:31:22.989 --> 00:31:26.429
That was before I got my hands on the lucky ladybug.
00:31:26.929 --> 00:31:29.809
And now that's my preference if there are kids there.
00:31:30.029 --> 00:31:34.789
Or if there were just overly drunk people or people from a different country
00:31:34.789 --> 00:31:36.409
that I couldn't communicate with.
00:31:36.569 --> 00:31:41.749
Spongeballs is an easy way to show them something in a particular environment.
00:31:41.909 --> 00:31:44.709
But yeah, I don't perform spongeballs either.
00:31:45.009 --> 00:31:51.949
So the question is, without Doug here to explain why they should not be cringe,
00:31:51.949 --> 00:31:54.869
i think maybe to us they're for us
00:31:54.869 --> 00:31:57.689
they're they're cringe wow okay can i all
00:31:57.689 --> 00:32:00.769
right they let me say something in defense of
00:32:00.769 --> 00:32:04.489
that then just for the sake of indifference of this conversation yeah
00:32:04.489 --> 00:32:07.469
the reason why i will never slander the
00:32:07.469 --> 00:32:11.609
invisible deck is because it is probably the
00:32:11.609 --> 00:32:15.589
best car trick ever made okay like name
00:32:15.589 --> 00:32:18.589
a car trick better than that probably you know we'd be
00:32:18.589 --> 00:32:21.349
like a personal preference of saying nothing beats a con
00:32:21.349 --> 00:32:24.169
that's the most magical card shit you can ever do and like you're right that
00:32:24.169 --> 00:32:26.989
is probably the most magical card stuff you can do i
00:32:26.989 --> 00:32:30.109
agree with that yeah but i'm always reminded
00:32:30.109 --> 00:32:33.389
of what i heard in the mark mason lecture when because as
00:32:33.389 --> 00:32:37.129
he he produces products and the first thing they said to him was mark.
00:32:37.129 --> 00:32:40.589
I have an idea for a trick he says is it
00:32:40.589 --> 00:32:43.649
better than invisible deck and if the answer is no he's like
00:32:43.649 --> 00:32:47.149
don't talk to me so and
00:32:47.149 --> 00:32:50.009
so that if we go to the chat real quick
00:32:50.009 --> 00:32:53.249
too we got alex saying if it ain't broke you know
00:32:53.249 --> 00:32:56.489
why why change what you're doing we got tim saying it's
00:32:56.489 --> 00:33:00.149
all about the performance which i very strongly like
00:33:00.149 --> 00:33:03.249
that comment scott link is saying it depends
00:33:03.249 --> 00:33:06.209
on this i like you know what this might be why you
00:33:06.209 --> 00:33:09.069
and i don't do these two effects it depends on
00:33:09.069 --> 00:33:12.629
statistically if they've ever seen many magicians
00:33:12.629 --> 00:33:15.389
live and that's something i do try and
00:33:15.389 --> 00:33:18.509
avoid i try and avoid mainstream effects so
00:33:18.509 --> 00:33:21.269
that someone can happily watch me do
00:33:21.269 --> 00:33:24.609
magic and then when they see someone else they can
00:33:24.609 --> 00:33:27.589
still enjoy that mainstream effect if they're
00:33:27.589 --> 00:33:30.569
doing it you know if they there's a
00:33:30.569 --> 00:33:33.809
problem if an audience is always seeing
00:33:33.809 --> 00:33:36.669
every magician do invisible deck and double
00:33:36.669 --> 00:33:39.569
cross you know that's a problem so i
00:33:39.569 --> 00:33:43.309
think that's a great one it depends how much magic the audience is is seeing
00:33:43.309 --> 00:33:48.089
alex is then saying because then you have to ask this about professor's nightmare.
00:33:48.089 --> 00:33:54.829
Cut restored row matrix book tests fair enough okay so yeah great great questions
00:33:54.829 --> 00:33:57.269
here i think if we were to reframe the question,
00:33:58.233 --> 00:34:01.893
Let's just, let's just, is it fair in saying the question wasn't more so about
00:34:01.893 --> 00:34:04.613
those two props, but more so about classics?
00:34:04.653 --> 00:34:06.693
Is that fair to sort of synopsisize that?
00:34:07.313 --> 00:34:12.113
The end question is, yeah, do classics deserve more respect or retirement?
00:34:12.513 --> 00:34:16.033
I believe the classics are classics for a reason.
00:34:16.893 --> 00:34:21.693
Never should anybody retire something like, what's a classic song?
00:34:22.033 --> 00:34:25.673
My Way by Sinatra, written by Paul Anka.
00:34:25.673 --> 00:34:28.433
That song will should never ever be retired and never
00:34:28.433 --> 00:34:31.213
sung again okay like that is an absolute banger and it
00:34:31.213 --> 00:34:34.673
needs to be around forever candle in the wind by elton
00:34:34.673 --> 00:34:37.473
john needs to be around forever whatever from the
00:34:37.473 --> 00:34:40.373
beatles like classics are classics for
00:34:40.373 --> 00:34:46.233
a reason man they've got to they've got to stick around for because they are
00:34:46.233 --> 00:34:49.933
classics one and like imagine saying to someone that like you can't watch the
00:34:49.933 --> 00:34:54.433
matrix you know like that's a that's a classic film now you know what i mean
00:34:54.433 --> 00:34:58.713
You've got to watch The Matrix or Die Hard. Like, come on.
00:34:59.473 --> 00:35:04.713
Classics are classics for a reason. They're not cringe and they need to stick around.
00:35:05.733 --> 00:35:08.193
All right. Hear, hear. Agreed.
00:35:09.253 --> 00:35:13.153
This is going well. I would say they're a little cringe if everyone's doing just that.
00:35:13.253 --> 00:35:17.393
I think it's the difference between being the entertainer and the artist.
00:35:17.553 --> 00:35:20.033
The artist should learn them, use them for when they need to,
00:35:20.153 --> 00:35:23.913
but then quickly try to come with your own versions that...
00:35:24.433 --> 00:35:27.353
You know, help you stand out. Yeah, like Snow White.
00:35:27.613 --> 00:35:31.013
You know what I mean? Like when they did Snow White again. Exactly like Snow
00:35:31.013 --> 00:35:34.933
White. Yeah. So much. They should not have picked her. It was so much better.
00:35:37.753 --> 00:35:41.153
That's funny. All right, here we go. Number six, counting down.
00:35:42.113 --> 00:35:45.773
Oof. Is magician voice a crime?
00:35:46.133 --> 00:35:53.753
The tones and fake mystery and fake elegance cringe, or is the vocal control
00:35:53.753 --> 00:35:57.213
and presence that magicians use, does it elevate the act?
00:35:57.593 --> 00:36:03.533
And then the challenge is, can you perform in your natural voice and still command
00:36:03.533 --> 00:36:05.873
the room? And we welcome back Doug.
00:36:06.493 --> 00:36:11.233
Welcome back, Doug. To this chat. Check one thing. I'm on the phone. How do I sound? Okay?
00:36:11.973 --> 00:36:15.833
Sound great, bud. You're sounding great. Good stuff. All right, cool. Back to normal.
00:36:16.293 --> 00:36:21.933
Just a reminder, everyone, this is the Magic Guys Live. The Magic Guys Live.
00:36:22.033 --> 00:36:24.633
This is unreheathed, unedited.
00:36:24.893 --> 00:36:26.773
This is just straight up raw dogging.
00:36:27.393 --> 00:36:31.753
Heck yeah. Yeah. So we're kind of glad you weren't here for the last question,
00:36:31.833 --> 00:36:34.613
Doug, because we're talking about Invisible Deck and Sponge Balls.
00:36:34.713 --> 00:36:36.133
But now we're on to question six.
00:36:36.333 --> 00:36:38.653
Worst tricks ever. Excellent.
00:36:40.053 --> 00:36:44.033
So we're talking about the magician voice, the voice that magicians put on when
00:36:44.033 --> 00:36:48.533
they go on stage to like, you know, create mystery and, you know,
00:36:48.533 --> 00:36:52.753
have this sort of elegance to their way they speak. And the question is,
00:36:53.471 --> 00:36:57.631
Is that cringe or is that elevating the act?
00:36:57.911 --> 00:37:02.071
And then the underlying challenge is, can we perform in our natural voice and
00:37:02.071 --> 00:37:05.051
it still commands the room? Dun, dun, dun.
00:37:05.691 --> 00:37:08.791
You want to go first, Doug? Because I have very strong opinions about this.
00:37:09.391 --> 00:37:13.791
I'll briefly say, we've kind of mentioned this already, it's be an exaggerated
00:37:13.791 --> 00:37:18.771
version of yourself. That would include speaking in a more exaggerated version
00:37:18.771 --> 00:37:21.651
and probably louder. That's my thought.
00:37:22.471 --> 00:37:23.991
Well said. Hmm.
00:37:24.911 --> 00:37:28.371
Well said. I think it's funny.
00:37:28.571 --> 00:37:34.451
I'm trying to think of, there was this time where I was chatting to a guy who
00:37:34.451 --> 00:37:40.311
did magic part-time and we're chatting like Aussies.
00:37:40.451 --> 00:37:43.291
We're like, yeah, mate, yeah, blah, blah, blah. And this, that, and the other.
00:37:43.591 --> 00:37:46.151
And oh yeah, I love that effect and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like,
00:37:46.211 --> 00:37:47.331
oh, can you show me a trick?
00:37:47.471 --> 00:37:50.451
And he's like, oh yeah, there is one I know.
00:37:50.571 --> 00:37:52.811
Here we go. And my girlfriend's next to me. He's like, all right,
00:37:52.811 --> 00:37:58.831
here we go man could you take out any three cars you want okay now please do
00:37:58.831 --> 00:38:03.611
not let me see them and you know what and he went into the weirdest performance
00:38:03.611 --> 00:38:05.871
of my freaking life you know.
00:38:06.951 --> 00:38:09.831
I'm gonna can i show you a trick absolutely all right
00:38:09.831 --> 00:38:18.671
yeah like man it was so weird like it was so weird and i was like bro none of
00:38:18.671 --> 00:38:23.011
this is authentic like you don't talk like that i've just spent 10 minutes with
00:38:23.011 --> 00:38:28.331
you as a bogan you can't now switch to to um derren brown you know.
00:38:28.951 --> 00:38:33.151
So yeah that was a bit let me throw it at you carissa hendrix
00:38:33.151 --> 00:38:36.811
plays a character called lucy darling and her accent that she's developed over
00:38:36.811 --> 00:38:41.711
the years like it doesn't exist she's purposely done an amalgamation of several
00:38:41.711 --> 00:38:45.471
characters and we should bring her on the show to talk about this to make this
00:38:45.471 --> 00:38:50.011
particular accent and no one knows where she's from she could be dutch she could be
00:38:50.051 --> 00:38:53.491
french it could be so many different things you would never know but it
00:38:53.491 --> 00:38:56.911
works and it's this beautiful accent that's
00:38:56.911 --> 00:38:59.671
like everyone should be able to
00:38:59.671 --> 00:39:04.071
identify with it in some capacity or another so i
00:39:04.071 --> 00:39:07.631
you know it needs to be done
00:39:07.631 --> 00:39:10.331
well i got a friend of mine
00:39:10.331 --> 00:39:13.331
called davide kaufman and he's
00:39:13.331 --> 00:39:16.211
that's what he calls himself but he's he's italian his italian is
00:39:16.211 --> 00:39:20.031
all get out like he was performing and
00:39:20.031 --> 00:39:23.171
somebody talks it's very like you know everything's
00:39:23.171 --> 00:39:25.991
like i must pay for the tosti or pick a card
00:39:25.991 --> 00:39:28.771
like it's like this thing he finished his
00:39:28.771 --> 00:39:31.551
set and they were like i really liked your show but like i
00:39:31.551 --> 00:39:35.571
think that you're lay off the accent it's a bit racist and he's like but this
00:39:35.571 --> 00:39:43.731
is how i talk what do you mean it was just being himself so that's funny so
00:39:43.731 --> 00:39:47.151
that being said it's obviously the audience can be perceiving things in such
00:39:47.151 --> 00:39:51.331
a way and i think this wouldn't be a problem if we went so upset about, you know.
00:39:52.193 --> 00:39:55.593
Social warrior type folk, you know, pronouns, the whole hamburger,
00:39:55.833 --> 00:39:59.453
like this is all stuff that now has come into the equation of us addressing audiences.
00:39:59.633 --> 00:40:02.773
You can never, it's almost very scary to say, may I have your name miss?
00:40:03.133 --> 00:40:07.033
You know, I, I don't gender, I gender nobody, bro.
00:40:07.273 --> 00:40:10.453
I just go, and what's your name friend? And if I call a woman,
00:40:10.653 --> 00:40:12.093
anything, I call her your majesty.
00:40:12.673 --> 00:40:16.113
What's your name, your majesty? Because that could be either or, right?
00:40:16.273 --> 00:40:19.913
But it's just the, the means of me setting a status in which saying that like,
00:40:19.993 --> 00:40:24.353
I'm here to serve you, your majesty this is my job i'm just a jester and you
00:40:24.353 --> 00:40:28.073
call anyone that they go okay cool like we've created a standard here he's sort
00:40:28.073 --> 00:40:30.573
of acknowledging me that's the important thing.
00:40:31.073 --> 00:40:34.173
I've heard of scenarios where a friend
00:40:34.173 --> 00:40:37.333
of mine who does tim ellis tim ellis does a routine but he
00:40:37.333 --> 00:40:39.993
opens his show he he's a mad hatter and he's
00:40:39.993 --> 00:40:42.853
an amazing mad hatter and he gets on stage good evening
00:40:42.853 --> 00:40:45.873
boys and girls boys and girls men women
00:40:45.873 --> 00:40:49.893
blah blah and beautiful creatures of all denominations right
00:40:49.893 --> 00:40:52.993
it's like this really cute long thing and the
00:40:52.993 --> 00:40:56.513
sound tech was like queer and
00:40:56.513 --> 00:40:59.553
said thank you for making me feel included then i had another friend
00:40:59.553 --> 00:41:02.453
who was queer who said don't say
00:41:02.453 --> 00:41:06.293
that it's the rugatry and it makes us third class citizens because
00:41:06.293 --> 00:41:09.213
you mentioned because you mentioned us last and it's like
00:41:09.213 --> 00:41:12.733
i right for real child are
00:41:12.733 --> 00:41:15.433
you for real and the kid was young you know what i mean i just said
00:41:15.433 --> 00:41:18.233
like come on child come on come on like yeah you're at.
00:41:18.233 --> 00:41:21.193
A magic show kid like yeah but look
00:41:21.193 --> 00:41:25.133
did not deter too much away from the the question
00:41:25.133 --> 00:41:27.773
of cringe or not cringe let me let me
00:41:27.773 --> 00:41:30.813
finish my point right so the point
00:41:30.813 --> 00:41:34.273
is that erroneous of like how
00:41:34.273 --> 00:41:37.093
you say it right i think it's okay to
00:41:37.093 --> 00:41:40.593
have a different tone when you do say things i have
00:41:40.593 --> 00:41:43.413
many years of vocal training because i used to be in a
00:41:43.413 --> 00:41:48.013
band hey it's been
00:41:48.013 --> 00:41:51.673
a while i don't have any i didn't even
00:41:51.673 --> 00:41:56.813
prepare a shot for that one now because of that when i when i'm on stage my
00:41:56.813 --> 00:42:00.553
voice booms a lot more and i speak a certain way but when i'm in a close-up
00:42:00.553 --> 00:42:04.433
setting talking to a kid what's your name little one oh this is evie everyone
00:42:04.433 --> 00:42:08.673
say hi evie you know it's polite it's the same way that I'll get on the phone.
00:42:08.733 --> 00:42:10.133
I'll be like, all right, shut up, shut up, shut up.
00:42:10.713 --> 00:42:14.073
Honeyk speaking, you know, and I have a different tone for when I speak.
00:42:14.213 --> 00:42:17.913
So I don't think it's wrong to change your delivery.
00:42:19.155 --> 00:42:25.015
But if you're going to have a script that you speak to, you know, like, I don't know.
00:42:25.395 --> 00:42:28.555
Yeah, I think it is cool. I think play with your voice.
00:42:29.135 --> 00:42:35.375
Absolutely. Don't be inauthentic if you're still playing yourself on stage.
00:42:35.515 --> 00:42:36.815
If you're playing a character, great.
00:42:37.175 --> 00:42:42.455
Like, by the way, how have we not had Carissa Hendricks on here yet?
00:42:42.535 --> 00:42:45.495
I'm making that this week's task.
00:42:45.715 --> 00:42:48.835
But I think it's cool. What do you guys think? yeah
00:42:48.835 --> 00:42:51.575
so i'm going to finish by saying that i don't think it's cringe and i think that
00:42:51.575 --> 00:42:54.635
you should adjust to your audience when i perform for high
00:42:54.635 --> 00:42:57.455
society my vernacular is very
00:42:57.455 --> 00:43:02.535
different because it's my job to be a professional communicator and to approach
00:43:02.535 --> 00:43:07.075
him in that way when i perform for all the guys who are tradies and the plumbers
00:43:07.075 --> 00:43:11.855
and the guys building our tunnels i'm definitely yeah none yeah nah definitely
00:43:11.855 --> 00:43:16.535
yeah nah yeah nah for sure bloke yeah come on bloke choose a car bloke you know go mate.
00:43:17.715 --> 00:43:25.235
Be dynamic love it not cringe I'm gonna switch to that helium voice Norbido's
00:43:25.235 --> 00:43:34.415
been using that's my new well if you use my Amazon link and purchase the Rodecaster Pro 2,
00:43:35.135 --> 00:43:42.415
what you you too can sound like this alright that's a good one it is a good
00:43:42.415 --> 00:43:45.675
one hey I like it alright it's a good one It's cool.
00:43:45.975 --> 00:43:50.715
Number five, do TikTok magicians make magic look lame?
00:43:51.015 --> 00:43:55.895
Are they using an overuse of cuts, stooges, and acting shocked?
00:43:56.115 --> 00:43:59.435
Or is it the new platform, new audiences, and fresh creativity?
00:43:59.735 --> 00:44:03.315
The debate is, are viral tricks good for the art?
00:44:04.275 --> 00:44:08.855
Perfect timing for Doug to be on here for this. I'm going to just say one thing.
00:44:08.855 --> 00:44:14.535
I don't know if it's good for the art, but I do think it's good for the scene. you,
00:44:15.203 --> 00:44:19.463
Doug, I can see a whole episode here in his head right now. Yeah.
00:44:21.083 --> 00:44:24.443
I don't, you know, yeah, I don't think it's good for the art.
00:44:24.683 --> 00:44:30.063
I think most of the content that's even popular is very cringe.
00:44:31.083 --> 00:44:38.523
I don't know. Yeah, it's like the ones that's viral aren't the ones that we
00:44:38.523 --> 00:44:40.023
would go and watch at a show.
00:44:40.023 --> 00:44:43.923
Like i don't feel like the right top
00:44:43.923 --> 00:44:46.803
artists are the ones becoming like the super
00:44:46.803 --> 00:44:50.043
super viral it's what like i don't know it's it's i'm
00:44:50.043 --> 00:44:53.463
thinking like pete firman right now is making some great content that goes viral
00:44:53.463 --> 00:44:57.443
pretty regularly and it could be like it could be cringe but he transcends it
00:44:57.443 --> 00:45:01.103
a little bit plays it out i would think anyone watching one of his videos would
00:45:01.103 --> 00:45:05.623
be happy actually that's a great point yeah he's the right person for doing
00:45:05.623 --> 00:45:08.263
magic well on tiktok and in person And obviously,
00:45:08.483 --> 00:45:13.243
you've had great success as well, building off TikTok and off YouTube.
00:45:13.723 --> 00:45:19.403
And also this, honestly, timing was great, you know, and I guess part of the
00:45:19.403 --> 00:45:23.263
deal is you got to know when the timing's right. And if you want something, go get it when it is.
00:45:23.463 --> 00:45:26.103
But like the content that I put out, mostly cringe.
00:45:26.323 --> 00:45:29.623
Like I can't even stand to watch most of that crap. So, yeah.
00:45:32.119 --> 00:45:36.359
Well, throwing to our audience, I mean, Alex has said, Alex Lamb has said,
00:45:36.499 --> 00:45:41.479
based on those parameters, no Stooges, fake hot girlfriend, reactions and edits,
00:45:41.759 --> 00:45:43.159
that stuff equals cringe.
00:45:44.099 --> 00:45:48.119
Yeah. Yeah. Genuine content. Like, Josh, you post a lot of it.
00:45:48.239 --> 00:45:51.499
You're doing material in the real world. You showcase those moments.
00:45:51.659 --> 00:45:57.159
Carissa is blowing up doing the same thing with, you know, clips of her audience work.
00:45:57.319 --> 00:46:00.399
And this is a great way to share your magic.
00:46:01.959 --> 00:46:06.479
As though people would be seeing it in the wild. It's really hard to say,
00:46:06.579 --> 00:46:10.319
I'm going to be a TikTok magician and make a magic trick for the camera.
00:46:10.819 --> 00:46:14.059
Usually it's just like... Would you agree?
00:46:14.219 --> 00:46:19.539
It's like, it's good for the art if you're just betraying your art form and
00:46:19.539 --> 00:46:26.559
not trying to mold to what might go viral with the overreactions and the... Yeah, it's good.
00:46:26.859 --> 00:46:29.779
Always good to be true to yourself and try to make good
00:46:29.779 --> 00:46:32.699
creative stuff yeah the other
00:46:32.699 --> 00:46:35.679
thing that's annoying too is the clips of
00:46:35.679 --> 00:46:41.039
mine that will go viral are not they're the ones that like show a little bit
00:46:41.039 --> 00:46:46.159
of maybe i can see some of the method like they're they're not the ones that
00:46:46.159 --> 00:46:49.859
are just like really entertaining it's always the ones that are like i slipped
00:46:49.859 --> 00:46:54.759
up a tiny bit and then boom half a million views i'm like I think in general,
00:46:54.819 --> 00:46:58.399
on social media or even online viewing like YouTube,
00:46:58.679 --> 00:47:01.459
people want education. So that's part of that alert.
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:04.899
They're going to learn something that benefits the viewer. They share it with
00:47:04.899 --> 00:47:06.679
a friend because it benefits them.
00:47:07.019 --> 00:47:11.099
And rarely, I think, do the people making these videos approach it with that
00:47:11.099 --> 00:47:14.699
frame of mind. Like, I'm going to give my viewer something to take away from this.
00:47:15.979 --> 00:47:18.339
Besides how great I am at the back post.
00:47:19.003 --> 00:47:25.043
Maybe, and maybe the last thing I'll say to this is the new FISM category for online content.
00:47:25.343 --> 00:47:29.483
Maybe that helps in some way with giving a direction for doing,
00:47:29.483 --> 00:47:32.263
you know, good content, as Doug would say.
00:47:32.903 --> 00:47:37.483
Yeah. You know, Tim Askin just referenced Jackie Yu. And I think Jackie does
00:47:37.483 --> 00:47:39.023
some of the best stuff you've ever seen.
00:47:39.223 --> 00:47:45.103
So do I think that, look, everyone can do something wrong, right?
00:47:45.323 --> 00:47:48.023
Like everyone can be like, I'm going to open a restaurant and be like,
00:47:48.103 --> 00:47:51.543
this food is awful. Okay. I'm going to do magic. You're doing it awful.
00:47:51.903 --> 00:47:56.003
I, I don't think it should be stopped. I don't think it's entirely bad,
00:47:56.003 --> 00:48:01.843
but I think that because it's in its adolescence that hopefully that it doesn't get worse.
00:48:01.983 --> 00:48:06.143
And hopefully with things like FISM and like amazing people who create stuff
00:48:06.143 --> 00:48:10.343
like the Jackie use of the world, the, the Alex Boyer, Jesus Christ,
00:48:10.503 --> 00:48:14.263
his stuff, Dennis, Liam, sorry.
00:48:14.843 --> 00:48:18.343
Yes. Sorry. I misbroke. Uh, Dennis came like his thing with the mirror.
00:48:18.823 --> 00:48:22.183
Jesus christ like it is that stuff yeah like
00:48:22.183 --> 00:48:25.103
i watched that and i think to myself like where do you even read that where
00:48:25.103 --> 00:48:29.083
do you even read that stuff to come up with it like that is so good it hurts
00:48:29.083 --> 00:48:36.663
me so that stuff as far as the art form goes i'm gonna say hell yeah and then
00:48:36.663 --> 00:48:40.803
all the stuff to do with exposure and all that malakia i'm gonna say cringe
00:48:40.803 --> 00:48:43.863
and agree with alex lamb on that one.
00:48:44.003 --> 00:48:47.583
I think this, let me say, even if you're producing cringe content,
00:48:47.843 --> 00:48:49.823
the process of doing so is beneficial
00:48:49.823 --> 00:48:52.683
because you're going to try a little harder to get this thing right.
00:48:52.823 --> 00:48:56.363
I don't know that a lot of magicians even try that hard to get it past the mirror.
00:48:56.603 --> 00:48:59.123
You watch yourself in the mirror, you say it looks pretty good,
00:48:59.143 --> 00:49:01.843
but if you actually go to the links that you're going to put something on video
00:49:01.843 --> 00:49:04.843
for social media, you're probably going to rehearse it a little more.
00:49:04.963 --> 00:49:08.103
And so, you know, if you like doing it, maybe one day you'll be really
00:49:08.103 --> 00:49:10.723
good at it and just become a better magician in the
00:49:10.723 --> 00:49:13.583
process so i think that's okay and it's
00:49:13.583 --> 00:49:16.883
not harming anything because no one's going to see those bad videos you know
00:49:16.883 --> 00:49:21.723
a couple hundred people might see them it's not going to matter although i i
00:49:21.723 --> 00:49:26.623
just had one that i hate my hate my first million as far as a real goes did
00:49:26.623 --> 00:49:33.563
you know i did yeah yeah what's what did it what's the banger you know what it was,
00:49:34.303 --> 00:49:39.763
exposure do scullers lucky ladybug that was it that's the video.
00:49:40.863 --> 00:49:44.303
I thought it was your coins across that was going
00:49:44.303 --> 00:49:49.343
to hit a mil that did half a mil I think what the
00:49:49.343 --> 00:49:52.243
actual shout out to do scullers lucky ladybug it
00:49:52.243 --> 00:49:57.083
got me a million views doing it at a local lady it's a live performance of an
00:49:57.083 --> 00:50:01.943
effect where I'm sure the person is reacting wonderfully to the trick and that's
00:50:01.943 --> 00:50:05.623
what I'm talking about Everything I've done where I'm to screen and I've really
00:50:05.623 --> 00:50:08.603
polished it up and I've set my lights properly and I've spent half a day trying
00:50:08.603 --> 00:50:10.443
to get it right and worked on it for weeks.
00:50:11.261 --> 00:50:14.401
Couple of thousand views something where somebody who
00:50:14.401 --> 00:50:17.821
who's damn near has parkinson's and can't even hold the camera straight and
00:50:17.821 --> 00:50:21.521
shake shake shake they're polite enough to film it and send it to my socials
00:50:21.521 --> 00:50:26.781
which i then repost and it gets a million views so is this on tiktok you're
00:50:26.781 --> 00:50:28.301
referring to i'm talking about
00:50:28.301 --> 00:50:32.021
instagram because i'm looking on instagram and your lucky ladybug has,
00:50:32.681 --> 00:50:35.501
4 000 views at least the one with the kid at tom but
00:50:35.501 --> 00:50:38.341
the one million viewed video is the one
00:50:38.341 --> 00:50:41.201
that's oh my mistake my mistake
00:50:41.201 --> 00:50:44.081
i'm seeing it now i'm with the lady oh this
00:50:44.081 --> 00:50:48.081
one here yeah okay okay wow lucky
00:50:48.081 --> 00:50:51.121
ladybug at a corporate event boom a million
00:50:51.121 --> 00:50:57.121
views congrats man that's do scale of magic.com go there buy it and then buy
00:50:57.121 --> 00:51:02.661
everything else their whole catalog is great yeah real good far out that's crazy
00:51:02.661 --> 00:51:07.181
something to be said as well about you doing something that viewers wouldn't
00:51:07.181 --> 00:51:10.401
have seen on a video probably before.
00:51:11.341 --> 00:51:20.441
Love it. Number four. Is it cool to pretend you have magic powers, like real powers?
00:51:21.001 --> 00:51:26.301
And the debates here, do the viewers roll their eyes at the fake mysticism or
00:51:26.301 --> 00:51:28.821
when presented as theater, is it powerful?
00:51:29.121 --> 00:51:33.841
And then the question is, how do you walk the line between mystery and make
00:51:33.841 --> 00:51:37.881
believe it's not cool there i said it.
00:51:40.341 --> 00:51:43.481
Dude it's it's interesting because you know
00:51:43.481 --> 00:51:46.381
you you see someone like copperfield and you go this is
00:51:46.381 --> 00:51:49.361
this is magic this is real magic like you know it's like
00:51:49.361 --> 00:51:53.441
yeah it's like this is crazy i
00:51:53.441 --> 00:51:56.381
don't know beauty beauty is in the eye of the beholder as
00:51:56.381 --> 00:51:59.381
i was talking with my wife last night she can't stand
00:51:59.381 --> 00:52:02.021
the goat where i was
00:52:02.021 --> 00:52:06.301
like you want to go see copperfield instead of that she's like no yeah
00:52:06.301 --> 00:52:10.181
i can't stand the way he does magic yeah i
00:52:10.181 --> 00:52:17.401
had a friend who's not a magician at all and went to vegas saw copperfield saw
00:52:17.401 --> 00:52:23.321
chris angel and could not stop raving enough about angel and his wife got bored
00:52:23.321 --> 00:52:27.761
of copperfield they're like what is this this is a kid this is kitty like,
00:52:27.941 --> 00:52:28.801
you know, the way he's like.
00:52:29.341 --> 00:52:33.761
And so, yeah, you're right. Eye of the beholder. He's sort of legendary status now.
00:52:33.881 --> 00:52:37.721
So we, I feel like we see a show because of, you know, all the stuff he's done
00:52:37.721 --> 00:52:39.441
before. Because he's still going...
00:52:40.131 --> 00:52:43.551
The magic in that
00:52:43.551 --> 00:52:47.011
show speaks for itself so like the
00:52:47.011 --> 00:52:50.491
performance okay you might have a good night might have a bad one you're gonna
00:52:50.491 --> 00:52:56.611
love the magic though yeah and here's the thing i think that there is like i
00:52:56.611 --> 00:53:00.771
saw chris angel show too and i became a fan after watching it like this is many
00:53:00.771 --> 00:53:06.511
years ago now i thought it was unbelievable and it was david penn who told me to to see it he goes
00:53:06.571 --> 00:53:09.491
the best show there the reason i liked chris angel
00:53:09.491 --> 00:53:12.531
show so much is because there was a huge level of personality in
00:53:12.531 --> 00:53:15.691
it which added to the already amazing
00:53:15.691 --> 00:53:18.651
magic which i thought was really good so for
00:53:18.651 --> 00:53:21.291
me that level was great and there's a
00:53:21.291 --> 00:53:24.151
little there's something wonderful about when you experience a
00:53:24.151 --> 00:53:27.411
show for example i've i've done
00:53:27.411 --> 00:53:32.011
a bunch of gigs in which we've had to entertain the vips of large-scale concerts
00:53:32.011 --> 00:53:38.271
so we have bands like queen katie perry pink we did a whole tour from and then
00:53:38.271 --> 00:53:42.991
you see their shows live and what i took away from watching these people that
00:53:42.991 --> 00:53:45.531
you know especially something like katie perry which i was not a fan of but
00:53:45.531 --> 00:53:46.451
then you go watch their show.
00:53:47.011 --> 00:53:50.811
And all of a sudden you're like you're a fan because they're so cool and they're
00:53:50.811 --> 00:53:54.931
so lovable and they're so lovely like on the stage and to their audience and
00:53:54.931 --> 00:53:58.931
everything else so all of a sudden I go like, I think Katy Perry's cool.
00:53:59.231 --> 00:54:03.871
Then she comes back from planet, you know, from a little planet of operation.
00:54:04.251 --> 00:54:09.051
And it's, and all the reports now say that her show is, is, is awful.
00:54:09.571 --> 00:54:13.131
And, and then no one should go and watch it. Like her performance is so bad.
00:54:13.251 --> 00:54:17.691
And I'm like, how did that happen in the space of three years? You know? So yeah.
00:54:18.427 --> 00:54:21.547
I think what is coming to mind right now,
00:54:21.627 --> 00:54:25.067
and I'm just going to end with my opinion by saying that there's nice when there's
00:54:25.067 --> 00:54:32.127
a level of genuine personality injected into your routines and a bit where they
00:54:32.127 --> 00:54:37.827
see you perform and they can tell the type of person who you are and they like who that person is.
00:54:37.827 --> 00:54:40.787
So I think that that's a nice place to be if you're
00:54:40.787 --> 00:54:44.187
going to be a performer so the whole fake
00:54:44.187 --> 00:54:46.987
bravado and I've met so many people who
00:54:46.987 --> 00:54:49.907
aren't this but then tell me I want
00:54:49.907 --> 00:54:52.627
to be the debonair type magician and I
00:54:52.627 --> 00:54:55.547
want to wear the expensive suit and be able to talk very
00:54:55.547 --> 00:54:58.647
eloquently and it's like you can barely string together a sentence nor
00:54:58.647 --> 00:55:01.927
have you ever read a book it's so disingenuous I
00:55:01.927 --> 00:55:04.827
just don't think that's going to be your character but give
00:55:04.827 --> 00:55:08.267
it a crack it'll take you a while to get that character right but it's.
00:55:08.267 --> 00:55:12.127
Going to be cringe for a long long time unless you reach carissa
00:55:12.127 --> 00:55:15.287
hendrix levels of character building so i'm
00:55:15.287 --> 00:55:18.727
gonna end by saying cringe and after
00:55:18.727 --> 00:55:21.587
nick gave me that advice i've been trying hard ever since
00:55:21.587 --> 00:55:25.427
yeah let
00:55:25.427 --> 00:55:28.307
me say this 99 cringe but the
00:55:28.307 --> 00:55:31.207
one percent doing it right are the best performers in
00:55:31.207 --> 00:55:34.947
our art well said yeah amazing
00:55:34.947 --> 00:55:37.607
amazing so look we're almost out of
00:55:37.607 --> 00:55:42.767
time so what i'm what i'll do is on instagram i'll put up a poll in our stories
00:55:42.767 --> 00:55:46.267
for each of the the full 10 questions so you can see the other three questions
00:55:46.267 --> 00:55:52.347
on there as well and you can vote yes or no is it cringe because the underlying
00:55:52.347 --> 00:55:56.187
overall factor is is magic cool or cringe at the end of the day,
00:55:56.347 --> 00:55:58.727
all these questions we're saying is sort of alluding to that.
00:55:59.507 --> 00:56:03.727
And I mean, Doug kind of nailed it. Like a lot of it can be cringe,
00:56:03.867 --> 00:56:06.707
but the ones that are doing it right can make it seem cool.
00:56:07.227 --> 00:56:10.507
But overall verdict, is magic cool or cringe?
00:56:11.207 --> 00:56:15.887
I would say if I had to really put it in a category, I wouldn't give it the
00:56:15.887 --> 00:56:20.627
cool category, but I also wouldn't give it the cringe category. I would give it like.
00:56:21.452 --> 00:56:28.092
As a person walking into a party and being a magician, I would call it the quirky fun category.
00:56:28.372 --> 00:56:33.892
It's like quirky cool. It's like how nerds are cool now.
00:56:34.372 --> 00:56:38.012
It's like sort of in that realm, like we're doing really odd,
00:56:38.292 --> 00:56:42.312
fun things that people love us for it, but it's not like we're cool,
00:56:42.612 --> 00:56:44.312
you know, at least not for my character.
00:56:44.512 --> 00:56:50.892
And so I would say in my world, magic comes across as very quirky and fun.
00:56:51.632 --> 00:56:53.192
That's what I'll put down to for me.
00:56:53.972 --> 00:56:57.532
Doug, what would you say in the land of magic? Yeah, you know,
00:56:57.652 --> 00:57:02.212
I would kind of lean towards cringe for the average, you know, joke.
00:57:02.632 --> 00:57:06.512
If this were a worldwide poll, I would think most people would be like, magic, huh?
00:57:07.692 --> 00:57:09.892
But yeah, I think you're right. We're nerdy cool.
00:57:12.392 --> 00:57:16.332
Yeah. What do you think, Nick? I'm going to tell you two quick stories.
00:57:16.332 --> 00:57:19.652
I remember going to my mechanic one time and he
00:57:19.652 --> 00:57:22.432
saw a deck of cards on the dashboard and he
00:57:22.432 --> 00:57:25.652
was like what's the deal with that and I said I'm a magician showed him
00:57:25.652 --> 00:57:31.832
a trick at the end of it he said I was having the worst day the worst day and
00:57:31.832 --> 00:57:37.992
now I can't stop smiling I think that's pretty cool 15 years ago I was performing
00:57:37.992 --> 00:57:44.472
and this dude watched my show on the street and he says I'm suffering from depression.
00:57:44.812 --> 00:57:47.352
And this is the first smile I've had in eight months.
00:57:48.172 --> 00:57:51.472
That's pretty cool. Magic is cool.
00:57:53.792 --> 00:57:57.892
Thanks for listening. It's time for us to disappear now.
00:57:59.212 --> 00:58:03.752
But we'll see you again on the next episode of The Magic Guys.