WEBVTT
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Hi friend.
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One of the things that has helped me figure out the ways I need to grow as a person in my career and in relationships is really being self-aware.
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This is why I love assessment.
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I feel like you cannot really know what needs improvement if you don't have a deep understanding of what makes you tick.
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In the next couple of minutes, I get the pleasure of chatting with Jackie Brewster.
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She's the host of the podcast Enneagram with JB, where she coaches leaders in the church and in business, couples and individuals how to uncover the best version of themselves using the insights and wisdom from the Enneagram.
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If you don't know about the Enneagram, hang tight because you're about to get a crash course.
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And also listen along as Jackie coaches me through it.
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Let's go.
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All right.
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Hi, Jackie.
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Thank you so much for being here.
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Oh, thank you so much for having me.
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Yes, yes.
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It's so nice to meet you.
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We're meeting for the first time.
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Yes.
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But I don't feel like we are, because I've listened to your podcast.
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Yes, and followed you on Instagram.
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And you talk about the Enneagram in such a great way.
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And I just cannot wait to dive into it today.
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But before we get started, I wanted to say, Jackie, that I love the way that you show up online.
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I think you teach the Enneagram, which is a helpful tool, I believe, for you know, doing the inner work of self-growth and development, but you do it in such a way that it resonates with people.
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And I guess that's because you connect it with everyday life.
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Things that people are already thinking and doing, and that shows up in the content and the way it's received.
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And I find that very inspiring.
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Thank you so much.
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Yes, yes.
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I wanted to mention that because as someone who also creates content, I'm always looking for inspiration.
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How do I, you know, do this so that it connects, you know, with people and all that.
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So that's great.
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All right.
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So we're just gonna dive into it.
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Right.
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I I am a self-proclaimed assessment junkie.
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Okay.
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I love taking personality tests, assessments, all of it.
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Like what type of work person you are, the themes, the colors, the letters, and all of that.
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I love it.
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But set me straight, Jackie.
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Is this healthy?
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When is it too much?
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When is it too much?
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Right.
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Oh my gosh, what a great question.
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When is it too much?
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I always say that information is not transformation until you activate it.
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So we can become very knowledgeable yet have no practical application of the information that we're taking in.
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So at some point, you've got to put the books down, you've got to put the assessments down, you've got to put everything down and begin to activate that information if you want this to be life change.
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So if it's just about gathering information because you want to be, you know, heady, you know, knowledgeable about things, that's one thing.
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If you're looking for these tools to help you with life change, then you've got to be able to pause the information to be able to use it for transformation.
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And I was just talking about this with a friend yesterday at the pool, and she's like, I'm doing all the things.
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I'm doing, I've been doing all the things for like all these years.
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And I'm like, stop doing the things.
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Just stop, stop seeking more counsel.
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Stop.
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And and I I say that carefully, but it's like at some point we have to be able to use the information if we want, if we want to see the change happen.
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That's powerful.
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Information is not transformation because what we're seeking is transformation.
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You know, if we're doing things correctly, we should be seeking transformation.
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I want to be better than I was yesterday.
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I want to, you know, be the kind of person I need to be to achieve my goals, whatever it is that, you know, is in front of us.
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So that's that's powerful.
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That's powerful.
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Thank you for sharing that.
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In episode seven of my podcast, I shared my experience with personality tests.
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You know how I said I really love them.
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You know, how I see them, how I've used them in the past.
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And I also attempted to sort of counter the perspective that assessments like these are just like labels that do no good because some people feel like, no, I don't want to label myself, you know, and all of that.
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And but that's before I had actually taken the the Enneagram, even though I'd heard about it for a while, but I hadn't taken it.
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So I talked briefly about wanting to take the test.
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I eventually took the test, and we'll talk about my results today.
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But before we do that, can you give us a brief expose, so to speak, into what the Enneagram is?
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Just the brief how to think about it, you know, the Enneagram.
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Yes.
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What a great question.
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So the Enneagram is a personality typing system.
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It is, and it does have ancient roots.
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You know, it's really interesting.
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Different people have adapted it to different ways, different thoughts, different things like that.
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So it's used in a lot of different ways.
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But the way that I choose to use it and in the teaching that I've sat under as far as using this tool is it's a tool for growth.
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So it is, it is a personality typing system that gives you a GPS of yourself, an internal view of yourself.
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It's different than all other tests because this system does not want to put you in a box.
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It is not labeling you.
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It is not telling you this is who you are.
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Now go act this way.
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It's saying something quite a bit different.
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It's saying, hey, this is how you're presenting to the world.
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This is the things that we're seeing in your personality type.
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It would do you well to get curious as to why, because no change can occur without the acknowledgement of the behaviors.
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And so you've got to get below the surface to the motivation.
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So the Enneagram offers insight into what you're doing.
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So when you start taking a test, you know, you answer the questions, you read the results, and you're like, how can this, how would how did that test know that I like to shop on sale?
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Like that as a seven, I'm like, how would that know that about me?
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Yeah.
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But if if we go deeper into it, so it gives you like the basic of that.
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And then when you get deeper into it, we're not looking at behavior, we're looking at motivation.
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Why are you doing it in the first place?
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So the roots within the Enneagram system go back to early childhood.
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It is those patterns of behavior that get developed as early as the age of two, and we're seeking three specific things all throughout our life from cradle to grave.
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How do I keep myself safe?
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How do I get love?
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And how do I get my needs met?
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And so this particular system offers insight into how you as a human are doing this.
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And then we want to help you grow out of some of those personality traits that would be considered, you know, as an Enneagram seven, like one of those traits for me is like scattered and, you know, I don't finish what I start and all those things.
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So I don't want that to be true about me, but I have to acknowledge it, see where it comes from if I want to be able to change it.
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So that's, you know, when we use this particular tool, it gives us the ability to begin to ask ourselves hard questions to see where we get stuck, to see where worry and afraid come in.
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Why are we doing what we're doing?
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And then we can choose to pivot towards growth.
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So it's an excellent tool for self-awareness that does position us towards growth if we choose to do the work.
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I love that because that's the transformation you're talking about.
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But then the question I kind of have just from what you said right now is so you're an Enneagram seven.
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Yeah.
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And then these the maybe are the character traits that maybe you want to grow out of, you want to change, you know, and all of that.
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Do you still remain a seven, even when you have, you know, dealt with those things and it's not different?
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You still remain a seven.
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You still remain a seven.
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So your number never changes.
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So people say, like, well, when I tested earlier, I got this.
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When I tested now, I got this, you know.
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So as a coach, I work a lot with numbers and in this kind of ebb and flow.
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But what we're looking at is the core motivations.
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And so these messages, early childhood messagings that impact the behavior, that doesn't change.
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So as an Enneagram seven, you know, like my heart longing is to know I'm gonna be taken care of.
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It's that doesn't go away.
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I want to know I'm gonna be taken care of.
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I want to know emotionally that my partner's gonna show up for me, that the people I surround myself with actually care about me, that I'm gonna have what I need to survive, all those things.
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It doesn't change.
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How I do it changes how I do it.
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So before, you know, it would be crazy, you guys, chaotic, crazy.
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Like it would be like fast-paced, whatever.
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I just want to feel happy, like all the things.
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And now that I know this about myself, I can kind of settle into it.
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So my motivation does not change, but the way that I I seek to get what I want and need does change.
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I love that.
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I love that.
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That's insightful.
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So I listened to this episode, a podcast episode with Susan Stabil, where she talked about the fact that she doesn't see the Energram as like a like a personality test the way the others are, because it does more and it goes deeper than other personality tests, which is what you've mentioned today.
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And I'm beginning to see that now because the way that I saw the other test, I'm like, yeah, this is me, but then what do I do with that information, right?
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So she she and she said that part of it is because the Enneagram shows you the part of it, it shows you like the best part of you could also be the worst part of you.
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And how do you do, you know, be self-aware, you know, and do the inner work and all that.
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So I I I really love all of this intrigue.
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So I am an Enneagram one.
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Yes.
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Based on my results with wings two and nine.
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What does this mean for me?
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Okay.
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So the Enneagram one is that reformer, we'll hear it called reformer, we'll hear it called moral perfectionists.
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Like it really depends on what feels right to you when it comes to the the labeling, right?
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Because everybody's different inside of that one.
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You know, there's a couple different ways that the one shows up.
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So there's one type of one that is very focused on perfecting themselves and making sure that they're that what they, you know, that they're above board, that they usually, if if it's a self-preservation one, there's usually very health conscious.
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There's gonna be a lot of vitamins on board.
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There's gonna be a lot of a lot of things about making themselves perfect and whatever that looks like.
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Okay.
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So it's not necessarily that their home has to have everything in order and things like that.
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It doesn't mean that.
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So not everyone is like perfectionistic in every area of their lives.
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It's not.
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It's not, it's usually, yeah, it's usually more specific, you know?
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And so with the with one type of one, it's like, I want to perfect myself.
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So I'm gonna work really hard on that.
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The there's another type of one that is like, I want to be the teacher.
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I know, so I want to help you do it better.
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So I want to teach you how to do these things that I think are great or really work, right?
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So there's that type of one.
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And then there's there's another type of one that's much more fiery, can also oftentimes get mistyped as an eight.
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And so they're not really thinking about perfecting themselves or necessarily people.
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They they are more thinking about the bigger picture, taking on a cause and making something like in the world better.
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And so very, you know, singular lane.
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It's it just doesn't look like that for any type.
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So when we look at this for the one, so that's kind of the, you know, the base of the one could fit in any of those categories.
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Then we've got the wings, which are the numbers to the right and to the left of the dominant number.
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Okay.
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And I say this all the time that the wings have to be attached to the bird.
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So we cannot be an Enneagram one with a wing of seven.
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Nope, you can't be that.
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So it's an N-gram one with a wing of two and a wing of nine.
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Typically, we've got one wing, one of these numbers to the right, to the left of us is more dominant.
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And then one that is oftentimes suppressed, or maybe you maybe you don't even recognize it at all.
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Or as you get older, usually after 40, we see the less dominant wing come on board.
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And for some people, they might feel like they are equal in the wings, like they can feel both parts of it.
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For some people, say they don't feel any part of it.
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So it's really different for everybody.
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When we are talking about these numbers to the right and to the left, if you we use them to help really get what we need.
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So we're gonna, it's like kind of reaching into that basket to help us get what we need in life, like help us to cope.
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So it's gonna be strategies that we've we've learned.
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So with the Enneagram nine, uh one wing nine, the idealist, they're gonna look cooler, more relaxed, introverted, objective, detached, even in some ways.
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So this type of Enneagram one is idealistic.
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It does not wish to get involved in the dirty work that brings about change.
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So they they kind of want to sit above it.
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They see it, but they don't necessarily want to have to be in it.
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And if the Enneagram nine is the peacemaker, so they don't like conflict and confusion.
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So you can see why if you lean more into this, this nine wing as a one, that it would be like, I see it, but I don't want to have to bring all that into my world.
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Like, I'm good.
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I'm I I'll give you the, I'll give you like the bullet points and what you can do to fix it.
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But I don't necessarily know.
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Yeah, like I don't want to do it.
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So they're more focused on long-range concerns and big picture.
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There is that introverted withdrawn, seeking relief from chaos and crowds.
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They particularly they prefer quiet environments that are peaceful.
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They oftentimes enjoy nature and animals.
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So this one looks quite a bit different than the two.
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So if you would be an Enneagram one with a two, this one is known as the advocate.
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So this is warm and helpful, vocal, and there is some fiery tendency to this one.
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Sensitive, action-oriented.
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You might feel a little bit more control from this one-wing too.
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This type is compassionate, empathetic.
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They are very action-oriented and outgoing and at times may forcefully try to get their point across about what they think needs to change.
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So there's more of a drive there.
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They desire to improve themselves in the world around them, and they're not afraid of the hard work it will take.
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So they are more willing to get their hands dirty.
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So very different than the nine.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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This is interesting because I'm trying to kind of place myself in this.
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And according to the test that I did, I'm more of a two than a nine.
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However, there are so many parts of the, maybe not so many, but there are parts of the two that I really don't identify with.
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Yeah.
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And then there are parts of the nine that are more, you know, but I'm more of a two than a nine.
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So for instance, the the vocal, kind of, you know, when I'm really passionate about something, yeah.
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I will speak up about it.
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Action-oriented, yes, you know, and all of that.
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But then the nine, the cooler, the more relaxed.
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I feel like that's what I aspire to.
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Yeah.
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Because I tell people that I want to be, I truly want to be a peaceful person.
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You know, not just like outwardly, but also inside of me.
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Right.
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And one thing that really kind of spoke to me when I read this, I was like, at first I was confused because I was like, the core emotion for once is anger.
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Right.
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And I didn't at first on the surface, I did not connect with that.
00:14:26.799 --> 00:14:29.440
I'm like, I don't see myself as that at all.
00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:38.159
But then I read that it doesn't necessarily mean that you like you display that anger all the time, or maybe you try to suppress it.
00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:38.639
Right.
00:14:39.120 --> 00:14:52.159
So I had to do a lot of thinking and I had to be willing to be open to the fact that something about me may not be right because again, as a one, I'm coming to realize that we don't like to be seen as not good.
00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:55.200
Like there's something about you that is not, and I had to deal with that.
00:14:55.440 --> 00:15:00.399
I say that to say the anger emotion, I had to really think about it.
00:15:00.559 --> 00:15:02.399
And I realize it is true.
00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:08.080
And unfortunately, it's the people that are closest to me that feel that, you know, that's suppressed anger.
00:15:08.320 --> 00:15:09.600
You know, absolutely.
00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:15.039
There, there, the people closest to us are gonna see the parts of ourselves that we don't show the rest of the world.
00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:15.440
Okay.
00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:21.120
So when we feel safe enough with our people, they're gonna see the the not so pretty side.
00:15:21.279 --> 00:15:22.879
You know, we can't be perfect all the time.
00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:23.840
We can't hold it together.
00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:25.919
We can't suppress all of our feelings all the time.
00:15:26.159 --> 00:15:29.039
And I think you're right on with this one around anger.
00:15:29.279 --> 00:15:38.000
So anger is a suppressed or even repressed emotion for the Enneagram one, uh, meaning it's conscious or unconscious that we're that we're holding it down.
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:47.679
We don't even oftentimes know the Enneagram one would have been conditioned early on, whether they've conditioned themselves or their family environment would have conditioned them to not show that.
00:15:47.840 --> 00:15:55.440
That's not an appropriate emotion, or we don't do that, we don't act like that, we don't have big emotion, like expressions of emotion in that way.
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:58.960
So you would have learned early on, like, that is not good.
00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:00.320
We're not gonna do that one.
00:16:00.559 --> 00:16:00.879
Okay.
00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:04.240
And so therefore it gets held down.
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:09.039
But what happens with anger for the Enneagram one is that it turns into judgment.
00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:09.440
Yeah.
00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:16.399
So what happens, bitterness, judgment, it it's like, it's like quiet, quiet judgment, I'm gonna say.
00:16:16.559 --> 00:16:21.600
It's like you internally look and be like, I can't believe that they would do that, or why would they think that's okay?
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:27.679
Or you're not saying this out loud, but in your head and even your body, you're like, oh, I don't know.
00:16:27.919 --> 00:16:37.919
And so, you know, I oftentimes say, like, we judge the things that we don't feel permissioned to to do, or we judge the things that make us uncomfortable.
00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:46.159
And so with the Enneagram one, if you saw somebody else have a big reaction with anger, you would probably judge that as like they need to get their self together.
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:52.080
Together, like that is not appropriate because you don't give yourself permission to display an emotion like that.
00:16:52.320 --> 00:17:06.480
So it's deep, it's really deep, and it's masked for the Enneagram one and and other behaviors that you're trying to keep it away from you because oftentimes the Enneagram one feels like anger is not appropriate.
00:17:06.559 --> 00:17:08.559
It it makes me look bad or it is bad.
00:17:08.799 --> 00:17:09.119
Yeah.
00:17:09.279 --> 00:17:09.519
Yeah.
00:17:09.759 --> 00:17:14.160
I I feel it mostly connected to like doing things the right way.
00:17:14.319 --> 00:17:18.319
And I I guess that that's where the kind of like the judgment will come from.
00:17:18.559 --> 00:17:29.519
Because in a way, I see that maybe things should be done this way, or almost the idea of even the idea of drive and being goal-oriented and action-oriented.
00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:36.000
And if the person beside me or around me is not in, you know, that way, it's like what why?
00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:36.880
What is wrong with that?
00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:38.079
What is what is happening?
00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:40.079
You know, how come they don't care about this?
00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:40.400
Yeah.
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:43.920
How can they go through life and like how can they be satisfied with that?
00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:55.440
How can I, again, in wanting to be peaceful inside of myself and that's also part of the like not judging other people's decisions or the out out outlook in life?
00:17:55.599 --> 00:17:57.519
Like, how how can it work for me?
00:19:08.059 --> 00:19:16.779
So we work on this with the Enneagram one or I do in sessions, and it's recognizing what causes you to feel these feelings in the first place.
00:19:17.019 --> 00:19:21.339
So I always say it's you know, it starts with self-word starts with acknowledging.
00:19:21.660 --> 00:19:24.940
You've got to acknowledge what's happening for there to be change.
00:19:25.019 --> 00:19:27.259
So you can't change what you're unwilling to acknowledge.
00:19:27.500 --> 00:19:31.740
So the self-awareness piece is key to then move to acknowledgement.
00:19:31.819 --> 00:19:42.860
So I've got to become self-aware, then I've got to acknowledge, and then I've got to be willing to see what's working and what's not working in order for me to make a move towards growth, like the pivot towards growth.
00:19:43.019 --> 00:19:47.579
And so with my Enneagram ones, we look at the judgment piece.
00:19:47.900 --> 00:19:51.259
And oftentimes there needs to be more play.
00:19:51.420 --> 00:19:54.779
There needs to be more fun in my Enneagram ones' lives.
00:19:54.940 --> 00:20:01.900
And so we we kind of infuse, we want to infuse a little bit more play and a little bit more fun.
00:20:02.059 --> 00:20:05.019
And as we do that, you guys tend to relax a little bit.
00:20:05.180 --> 00:20:18.220
And some of the feelings and the pressure you put on yourself that you project onto other people, it starts to diminish a little bit because you're like, oh, I don't have to be this hard on me.
00:20:18.380 --> 00:20:21.500
And therefore, I'm I'm not that hard on them.
00:20:21.660 --> 00:20:27.579
So it's it, you know, it's the personal work first, but it is like catching those thoughts when they're happening.
00:20:27.819 --> 00:20:31.740
So say you look at somebody and you're like, I can't believe that they would be satisfied with that.
00:20:31.900 --> 00:20:33.980
Like I see so much more potential in them.
00:20:34.220 --> 00:20:40.299
Why don't they just work a little bit harder and they'd probably get where they want to go or where I think that they should go?
00:20:40.539 --> 00:20:42.140
It's probably more like it, right?
00:20:42.380 --> 00:20:43.980
Where I think that they should go.
00:20:44.140 --> 00:20:46.779
You catch it, you're like, oh my gosh, here I am again.
00:20:46.940 --> 00:20:48.460
Runaway training my brain.
00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:50.059
Like, here we are, right?
00:20:50.299 --> 00:20:51.819
You catch it, you pull it down.
00:20:51.980 --> 00:20:53.259
Why am I thinking this?
00:20:53.500 --> 00:20:57.099
And sometimes it's like, no, I really want them, I want better for them.
00:20:57.420 --> 00:21:06.299
I was about to ask that because for some of the things that I do, like right now, I'm about to go into like a mentorship program with a group of about seven ladies.
00:21:06.460 --> 00:21:06.620
Yeah.
00:21:06.860 --> 00:21:09.500
How do I like I want them to be better?
00:21:09.660 --> 00:21:12.860
They've come to me because, you know, they need to work through that.
00:21:12.940 --> 00:21:20.940
Like, how does that square with me not having to like be like, oh, you have to do this, or you know, but wanting them to be able to do that.
00:21:21.019 --> 00:21:21.259
Yeah.
00:21:21.579 --> 00:21:21.819
Yes.
00:21:21.980 --> 00:21:23.500
I so you pull it down, right?
00:21:23.660 --> 00:21:25.900
You think about it, and then you think through the perspective.
00:21:26.059 --> 00:21:28.299
Like, okay, I see potential in them.
00:21:28.460 --> 00:21:33.500
And then it's their individual responsibility to go after potential.
00:21:33.740 --> 00:21:49.420
So we release ourselves from the responsibility to change another person, even if they're paying us, even if they're part of our mentorship or they're part of our coaching, whatever this is, because we are not uh responsible for somebody else's decisions at all.
00:21:49.579 --> 00:21:51.660
We can only be responsible for us.
00:21:51.819 --> 00:21:53.019
We can only change us.
00:21:53.180 --> 00:21:59.259
We can present possibilities, we can present strategies, we can, we can do all of those things, right?
00:21:59.579 --> 00:22:06.220
So keeping yourself kind of in that check where because I I'm a coach like you, so I I see potential.
00:22:06.380 --> 00:22:07.579
Like I see potential.
00:22:07.740 --> 00:22:09.019
I want people to grow.
00:22:09.180 --> 00:22:10.700
I want that for them too.
00:22:10.940 --> 00:22:15.180
So I can I can offer insight, but they have to do the work.
00:22:15.900 --> 00:22:27.259
And if I keep myself in check in this, then I don't have a like I I give people work to do, and if they come back to me and they didn't do the work, I'm not mad because it's not my work to do.
00:22:27.740 --> 00:22:28.779
It's not my work to do.
00:22:28.940 --> 00:22:40.220
So, but I can recognize where we're at in session to session to session, and that where I could see we could go from a one to a 10 if if the steps were done, we could get there.
00:22:40.460 --> 00:22:52.700
But the willingness on the work is not coming in at the same level, then I'm gonna, I'm gonna readjust my expectation and be like, okay, then we might get from a one to a four, and they might be satisfied with that.
00:22:52.860 --> 00:22:54.380
And I'm gonna have to let that go.
00:22:54.620 --> 00:22:59.819
So it's really removing yourself, so to speak, from like just the the process itself.
00:22:59.900 --> 00:23:01.900
Like it's not contingent on you.
00:23:02.220 --> 00:23:08.059
It's not contingent on you and and their growth, their work is not a reflection of you.
00:23:08.299 --> 00:23:08.940
That's a good one.
00:23:09.259 --> 00:23:09.740
That is hard.
00:23:10.220 --> 00:23:10.860
That's hard.
00:23:11.019 --> 00:23:17.180
Because it feels great when people do the work and you can see the growth and they're like, I was part of this and this is what it feels great.
00:23:17.420 --> 00:23:17.660
Right.
00:23:18.140 --> 00:23:26.860
But at the same point, we want to keep going back to the the person where it's not, it doesn't come back to us necessarily.
00:23:27.019 --> 00:23:28.140
It goes back to them.
00:23:28.380 --> 00:23:30.220
Like, I see potential in you.
00:23:30.380 --> 00:23:31.579
I can see this in you.
00:23:31.900 --> 00:23:36.940
Let's go back and look at this step that, you know, in part of that work that that we were working on.
00:23:37.180 --> 00:23:40.620
Let's revisit this because I see potential in this.
00:23:40.779 --> 00:23:42.779
So it's that I think it's the wording.
00:23:42.860 --> 00:23:43.900
I think it's how we do it.
00:23:44.059 --> 00:23:46.220
I think it's all nine personality types.
00:23:46.299 --> 00:23:53.579
You know, inside of that, there's 27 personality types within the Enneagram system because there's subtypes, which I broke down a little bit at the beginning with that one.
00:23:53.819 --> 00:23:56.380
If we look at that, everybody's approach is different.
00:23:56.539 --> 00:23:59.500
So you as an Enneagram one, you're like, you are linear.
00:23:59.579 --> 00:24:01.259
You're like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
00:24:01.339 --> 00:24:02.940
You'd be like, Jackie, come on, girl.
00:24:03.099 --> 00:24:09.259
And I'd be like, I am over here like on six and then back to two, and then I got distracted.
00:24:09.420 --> 00:24:15.259
And so it really is knowing the people that you're working with.
00:24:15.420 --> 00:24:25.259
I mean, I the Enneagram is such a helpful tool for anybody that's helping anybody because it gives you insight to to understand kind of like where they're coming from and what their focus is.
00:24:25.420 --> 00:24:32.860
Because if you've got an Enneagram three that you're coaching, success, succeed, drive, man, you're gonna be like, yes, yes, and yes.
00:24:33.019 --> 00:24:33.180
Right.
00:24:33.579 --> 00:24:34.539
Model students.
00:24:34.779 --> 00:24:35.259
Yes.
00:24:35.500 --> 00:24:44.779
You've got an Enneagram nine that is like getting there, getting there, getting there, but their pace is gonna probably be slower.
00:24:44.940 --> 00:24:50.380
They want to do the work, but it's gonna be slower because that that's just how they process information.
00:24:50.539 --> 00:24:53.259
There's nothing wrong with them at all in in how they do it.
00:24:53.339 --> 00:24:54.539
They just do it different than you.
00:24:54.779 --> 00:24:56.620
Yeah, there's so many different aspects of this.
00:24:56.700 --> 00:25:00.860
I could talk about, oh my gosh, but I'll try to stick to just the questions you're giving me.
00:25:01.099 --> 00:25:04.140
So all right, let's talk about the more play and the more fun.
00:25:04.380 --> 00:25:08.059
So I know that I think you were going through, I may have cut you off a little bit there, and I apologize.
00:25:08.140 --> 00:25:11.579
I think you were going through like a list of things that I could think about as an Inigram one.
00:25:11.900 --> 00:25:16.539
And I think the first one that um I remember that you mentioned is more play and more fun, right?
00:25:16.700 --> 00:25:17.180
Yes, yes.
00:25:17.660 --> 00:25:21.660
Already thinking like scheduling, like scheduling, because I agree.
00:25:21.740 --> 00:25:25.500
I I don't, I'm a very serious person, and it takes a lot for me to be.
00:25:25.740 --> 00:25:32.539
I remember as a child, I think I was in, because I grew up in Nigeria, I went to secondary school there, and I remember my friends were playing.
00:25:32.620 --> 00:25:35.019
They were playing lawn tennis, and and they were like, Come play.
00:25:35.180 --> 00:25:36.539
And I'm like, I don't know how to play.
00:25:36.620 --> 00:25:37.579
That's exactly what I said.
00:25:37.740 --> 00:25:38.779
I don't know how to play.
00:25:38.940 --> 00:25:40.940
And it's funny because it's it's it's true.
00:25:41.099 --> 00:25:46.460
Like I'm very just serious, and I want to be more like now that I have a child, like you know.
00:25:46.700 --> 00:25:50.220
So I'm already thinking, scheduling the place, scheduling the fun.
00:25:50.380 --> 00:25:51.660
I guess that works, right?
00:25:51.900 --> 00:26:03.019
It does, you know what at the at the beginning I do think that that's wise for the ones, especially if they're pretty rigid and kind of set in like in in you know, your your systems or your schedule, whatever this looks like.
00:26:03.259 --> 00:26:09.099
And as a seven, I know that I'm like, and the seven is the enthusiast, so like all over the place and fun.
00:26:09.259 --> 00:26:14.779
I'm lean into the one pretty heavily though, in my stress point, but I get to the high side of it too.
00:26:14.940 --> 00:26:19.339
And so I can be really rigid, like I am very structured.
00:26:19.660 --> 00:26:24.539
So I do think scheduling fun could be really beneficial for you as an India grandma.
00:26:24.700 --> 00:26:28.460
Um, I think that that that's one part of it, fun, play.
00:26:28.700 --> 00:26:38.860
Another part of it is even though the dishes need to be done, we're gonna, we're gonna like not for for 30 minutes and do something different.
00:26:39.099 --> 00:26:41.980
So anything that you do is going to be uncomfortable.
00:26:42.140 --> 00:26:44.220
Any change that you make is gonna be uncomfortable.
00:26:44.380 --> 00:26:44.539
Oh.
00:26:45.019 --> 00:26:45.180
Okay.
00:26:45.339 --> 00:26:47.900
So it's gonna be like, oh my gosh, I really should be doing the dishes.
00:26:48.059 --> 00:26:49.420
I should not be watching this documentary.
00:26:49.500 --> 00:26:50.940
I should really be doing the dishes.
00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:51.500
Okay.
00:26:51.740 --> 00:26:54.460
But I'm gonna, I said I would give myself 30 minutes.
00:26:54.620 --> 00:26:56.059
I'm gonna give myself 30 minutes.
00:26:56.220 --> 00:27:03.019
And so what you're gonna find is that you gave yourself 30 minutes, you enjoyed a documentary or a book, whatever, I don't know, play cards, whatever you're doing, right?
00:27:03.180 --> 00:27:04.460
And then you go back to the dishes.
00:27:04.620 --> 00:27:05.500
They didn't go anywhere.
00:27:05.740 --> 00:27:06.620
They didn't go anywhere.
00:27:06.779 --> 00:27:17.660
So then you do them and you're like, okay, I the more that you give yourself freedom, flexibility inside of that, the the easier it's gonna get over time.
00:27:17.900 --> 00:27:25.019
The more rigid you build your life, the harder it's gonna be for there to be flexibility.
00:27:25.180 --> 00:27:30.779
So, and I'm not talking about throw caution to the wind and do all the things because that's not gonna be your personality.
00:27:31.099 --> 00:27:34.940
But it is, it is like, okay, I need to loosen up a little bit.
00:27:35.099 --> 00:27:38.620
These are the areas that I tend to get really laser focused.
00:27:38.779 --> 00:27:55.579
How do I shift this just a little bit, knowing it's gonna be uncomfortable and I'm gonna have to do it several times, a lot of times, until I don't feel uncomfortable or that I'm doing something bad, but uh that I'm, you know, that that chore piece is usually where my Enneagram ones get stuck.
00:27:55.660 --> 00:27:59.019
They're like, I can't relax, I can't have fun until everything on my list is done.
00:27:59.339 --> 00:27:59.660
Done.
00:27:59.819 --> 00:28:04.299
I do, I do that that makes sense to me because that's that's essentially me.
00:28:04.380 --> 00:28:08.140
You know, I have my times and like nothing changes those times.
00:28:08.299 --> 00:28:17.980
Like I have to be at my desk at the stem doing this at that time because it just helps me, it helps me not feel overwhelmed with life, you know, because I have structure, I feel safe within the structure.
00:28:18.140 --> 00:28:23.420
But also, like you said, learning to kind of put some flexibility into that because I really do want it.
00:28:23.660 --> 00:28:24.460
I really do want it.
00:28:24.539 --> 00:28:27.019
I don't want to be like, you know, yeah, rigid all my life.
00:28:27.099 --> 00:28:28.220
So that's definitely helpful.
00:28:28.539 --> 00:28:30.779
Well, children help us with this.
00:28:30.940 --> 00:28:31.579
Yes, they do.
00:28:32.460 --> 00:28:35.259
I have four of them, they help us with this.
00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:36.220
Yes, yes.
00:28:36.460 --> 00:28:42.220
They probably helped me become more structured, where they might help you become a little less structured.
00:28:42.380 --> 00:28:47.180
Oh, but for me, I was like, the only way I'm gonna survive this is to put everybody on a schedule, you know?
00:28:47.420 --> 00:28:53.259
And then inside of that, I found I did find freedom inside of the boundaries that created.
00:28:53.420 --> 00:28:55.180
And I am a huge believer in that.
00:28:55.339 --> 00:29:00.539
Like it's not, it's not like I wake up and my whole day is whatever and I just feel free.
00:29:00.700 --> 00:29:02.620
That is not typically healthy.
00:29:02.860 --> 00:29:08.059
We having some predictability allows our central nervous system to calm down.
00:29:08.299 --> 00:29:15.819
We know when we know what to expect, then there is this we can that calm that you're that you're like, I just want to feel calm and at peace.
00:29:16.059 --> 00:29:19.339
Well, you learned how to do that by creating this rhythm.
00:29:19.660 --> 00:29:22.059
So there's beauty inside of that rhythm.
00:29:22.460 --> 00:29:29.980
We just need to schedule in maybe a little bit of flexibility to for there to be free time or play or whatever.
00:29:30.220 --> 00:29:33.980
But yeah, I don't, even as a one, I'm not like, I don't want to rewrite you.
00:29:34.140 --> 00:29:48.620
Gosh, I would I I'm like, no, there's so many great things about your ability to stay focused on tasks, to complete projects that I want you to see those things as gifts that you have that you bring into the world, not as things that are holding you back.
00:29:48.940 --> 00:29:49.500
They're gifts.
00:29:49.740 --> 00:29:50.220
I love that.
00:29:50.380 --> 00:29:51.579
This is freeing for me.
00:29:51.740 --> 00:29:52.380
Thank you so much.
00:29:52.539 --> 00:29:53.980
And I I will keep doing the work.
00:29:54.140 --> 00:29:59.339
I will keep doing the work and keep leaning into this because like you said, transformation is what we're seeking.
00:29:59.420 --> 00:30:02.940
And I I do want to experience that, you know, I want to keep experiencing that.
00:30:03.019 --> 00:30:03.740
So that's awesome.
00:30:03.900 --> 00:30:04.380
Thank you so much.
00:30:04.460 --> 00:30:06.140
You've given me a lot to think about, Jackie.
00:30:06.220 --> 00:30:18.539
So for the sake of our friends listening, what kind of I know we've talked about some of it, but just holistically, what kind of transformations can people expect to experience when they really dig deep into the Enneagram?
00:30:18.779 --> 00:30:22.380
What have you witnessed, you know, in going through this with people, organizations, teams?
00:30:22.539 --> 00:30:24.140
What kind of transformations have you seen?
00:30:24.380 --> 00:30:26.220
Yeah, so it's been beautiful.
00:30:26.380 --> 00:30:27.339
That's what I've seen.
00:30:27.579 --> 00:30:28.940
Absolutely beautiful.
00:30:29.180 --> 00:30:33.819
I have one client that I've been seeing for the past couple of years, and she came to me.
00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:40.620
Um, actually, her husband came to me first, and then I asked if I could, if she could join about six months in.
00:30:40.700 --> 00:30:45.819
I was like, I'd love for her to join and be a part of this because it just felt like it would sink, you know?
00:30:46.059 --> 00:30:52.220
So she joined, she was an Enneagram, she is an Enneagram nine, and she she just felt kind of stuck.
00:30:52.380 --> 00:30:57.900
And she she just was like, I feel overwhelmed, I feel stuck, I hear him, he's an Enneagram one.
00:30:58.059 --> 00:30:59.900
And so she's like, I hear him.
00:31:00.140 --> 00:31:02.700
And I he thinks like it's not that hard.
00:31:02.860 --> 00:31:03.980
Like, this is not that hard.
00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:07.420
If I just do this, this, this, this, this, it's all gonna come together.
00:31:07.500 --> 00:31:09.579
And she's like, I cannot get myself to move.
00:31:09.740 --> 00:31:17.579
And so week after week, month after month, we just started to to dig into like what are the messages that sit below the surface?
00:31:17.740 --> 00:31:18.620
Why are we stuck?
00:31:18.700 --> 00:31:20.140
What is holding us back?
00:31:20.380 --> 00:31:23.099
And I saw her shed uh so much.
00:31:23.339 --> 00:31:31.339
Like I just saw uh layer after layer after layer come off and this freedom and this brightness and this joy come back into her life.
00:31:31.500 --> 00:31:33.500
She started her own clothing line.
00:31:33.740 --> 00:31:36.620
She is uh she looks like a completely different person.
00:31:37.180 --> 00:31:39.259
She's like, she has joy, she has peace.
00:31:39.420 --> 00:31:42.940
Her and her husband have a thriving marriage where they can communicate.
00:31:43.099 --> 00:31:46.380
She doesn't back away from the hard conversations anymore.
00:31:46.460 --> 00:31:48.140
She she's willing to come into it.
00:31:48.220 --> 00:31:50.620
And he is like the way that they can do it together.
00:31:50.779 --> 00:31:53.500
It's like he sees her showing up and he meets her there.
00:31:53.660 --> 00:31:58.380
So there's a ton of transformation that happens with all of my clients that I work with.
00:31:58.539 --> 00:32:06.220
A lot of when I I do a lot with people in leadership, so one-on-one, or even with teams in leadership.
00:32:06.380 --> 00:32:09.740
And so when it comes to that, it's helping them understand themselves better.
00:32:09.819 --> 00:32:11.900
And it is like light bulb moments happening.
00:32:12.059 --> 00:32:16.299
They're like, oh, oh, oh, that's why I'm doing this, or that's where I'm stuck.
00:32:16.460 --> 00:32:19.819
Or I, you know, though sometimes it's like, hey, I need a session this week.
00:32:19.980 --> 00:32:23.500
And they have, you know, they're spiraling out about something.
00:32:23.740 --> 00:32:26.700
And it's like, okay, fear and worry have entered the picture.
00:32:26.860 --> 00:32:30.620
So if fear and worry are here, what what's happening inside of you?
00:32:30.779 --> 00:32:37.660
Like what, you know, we're gonna go back to coping strategies in different ways to try to figure out how to get our needs met in the world.
00:32:37.819 --> 00:32:39.180
And they can see it.
00:32:39.420 --> 00:32:50.620
So they they are able to witness themselves acting in ways that they don't want to, whether it's from leading from a place of control and and drive and like everybody needs to do this.
00:32:50.700 --> 00:32:51.660
And it's like, why?
00:32:51.819 --> 00:32:54.299
They feel afraid about something, you know.
00:32:54.460 --> 00:33:05.180
So um, there's a lot of information that that they receive that then they make sense into their own lives, you know, how it's showing up that usually they can kind of pull down.
00:33:05.259 --> 00:33:07.420
Like I said, like you pull it down, like what's going on?
00:33:07.579 --> 00:33:11.819
They get curious around it, and then they they're able to see change.
00:33:11.980 --> 00:33:14.779
I was at an organization back in May.
00:33:14.940 --> 00:33:15.579
Like, when was that?
00:33:15.740 --> 00:33:16.059
Back in May.
00:33:16.140 --> 00:33:21.339
I was at an organization back in May, and I work with the the senior leader there and uh his team was around.
00:33:21.420 --> 00:33:31.019
I was just there, just in the office doing something, and the team was around and they started to talk about the change that they've seen happen in him over the past year and a half.
00:33:31.180 --> 00:33:31.980
He's a different person.
00:33:32.059 --> 00:33:33.339
The way that he leads is different.
00:33:33.500 --> 00:33:39.420
Part of that, too, when I'm when I'm working with a leader is I'm also able to help them see the team if they know Enneagram types.
00:33:39.660 --> 00:33:42.860
So they understand what's happening in the team and that what the team needs.
00:33:43.019 --> 00:33:45.500
And so it's not just their their way or the highway.
00:33:45.579 --> 00:33:49.660
It's like collectively they can see how this team's functioning together.
00:33:49.819 --> 00:33:51.579
So it is life-changing.
00:33:51.740 --> 00:33:54.860
I promise the work is worth worth it, you know.
00:33:55.099 --> 00:33:56.220
Doing the work is worth it.
00:33:56.380 --> 00:33:56.940
I promise.
00:33:57.259 --> 00:33:58.059
But it's slow.
00:33:58.220 --> 00:33:59.339
I will say it's slow.
00:33:59.500 --> 00:34:00.940
You know, it takes time to change.
00:34:01.099 --> 00:34:04.380
We don't go to the gym and and you know, get abs in a day.
00:34:04.460 --> 00:34:08.940
Yeah, you know, all those things like I ate a salad, did I lose, you know, the 10 pounds?
00:34:09.179 --> 00:34:09.659
I wish.
00:34:09.819 --> 00:34:10.860
I wish that was true.
00:34:11.099 --> 00:34:11.500
Right?
00:34:11.659 --> 00:34:12.940
It just doesn't happen like that.
00:34:13.099 --> 00:34:14.219
So change takes time.
00:34:14.380 --> 00:34:17.739
Be patient, get curious, be kind to yourself.
00:34:17.980 --> 00:34:21.179
Oh my gosh, kindness is key to this transformation.
00:34:21.420 --> 00:34:21.980
I love it.
00:34:22.059 --> 00:34:22.539
I love it.
00:34:22.619 --> 00:34:28.380
I think one thing I kind of take from everything you've said is just like you mentioned before, the involvement of the people you're working with.
00:34:28.699 --> 00:34:32.460
You know, I feel like sometimes a lot of people and reflection is a huge part of it.
00:34:32.539 --> 00:34:40.059
I feel like you need to be able to reflect and which is what you're helping your clients do, really think through the process, you know, bring it down, break it down.
00:34:40.219 --> 00:34:41.420
Why am I feeling this way?
00:34:41.500 --> 00:34:42.860
All of that is reflection.
00:34:43.019 --> 00:34:46.940
And I I noticed that a lot of people find it difficult to do it, you know.
00:34:47.099 --> 00:34:48.460
I feel like they need help to do it.
00:34:48.539 --> 00:34:48.699
Right.
00:34:49.019 --> 00:34:52.699
Find it difficult to do it on your own to just reflect and kind of piece things together.
00:34:52.860 --> 00:34:54.539
So this is really, this is really powerful.
00:34:54.699 --> 00:34:55.819
Thank you so much for sharing that.
00:34:55.900 --> 00:35:00.539
So you've mentioned that you work with individuals, coaches, teams, organizations, and all that.
00:35:00.619 --> 00:35:03.019
And you also have a book, The Enneagram and Your Marriage.
00:35:03.179 --> 00:35:03.500
I do.
00:35:03.659 --> 00:35:03.739
Yes.
00:35:04.860 --> 00:35:05.819
Yeah, I have a couple out.
00:35:05.900 --> 00:35:06.059
Yeah.
00:35:06.299 --> 00:35:07.420
The Enneagram and your average.
00:35:07.500 --> 00:35:12.219
I have Enneagram Essentials, which is a card deck that is like if you're like, huh, what is this thing?
00:35:12.299 --> 00:35:13.500
I want to know more about this thing.
00:35:13.659 --> 00:35:17.980
And you like, you like like a Instagram kind of reel, you like that kind of stuff?
00:35:18.219 --> 00:35:23.500
Enneagram essentials is a card deck and it's all nine types and it goes from like basics to deep dive.
00:35:23.659 --> 00:35:26.860
And then I have uh Hearing God Speak, which is a devotional that I wrote.
00:35:27.019 --> 00:35:27.820
That was my first book.
00:35:27.980 --> 00:35:28.380
But yeah.
00:35:28.619 --> 00:35:29.099
That's awesome.
00:35:29.179 --> 00:35:29.420
Yeah.
00:35:29.500 --> 00:35:35.579
So I'm gonna put links to all of Jackie's books and stuff in the show notes so you can check it out, everyone.
00:35:35.659 --> 00:35:39.980
Okay, so what are the offerings do you have at this time and how can people find you and work with you?
00:35:40.219 --> 00:35:42.699
I do um individual coaching over Zoom.
00:35:42.780 --> 00:35:44.619
So I see clients from all over the world.
00:35:44.780 --> 00:35:52.860
And so uh if you are like, I want to learn more about this and you're interested in doing some coaching, I would be happy to have a conversation with you about that.
00:35:52.940 --> 00:35:58.780
Um and you guys can you can find me on Instagram, Enneagram with JB, you can DM me there, and we can get it moving that way.
00:35:59.019 --> 00:36:02.380
Like my I think my um email is linked to that as well.
00:36:02.539 --> 00:36:07.019
And so um my assistant will help you get plugged in if that's what you want to do.
00:36:07.260 --> 00:36:08.380
I do work with teams.
00:36:08.539 --> 00:36:15.420
I come in and I do speaking engagements and um and team building exercises, whether it's one day or a couple days, things like that.
00:36:15.659 --> 00:36:16.780
Thank you so much, Jackie.
00:36:16.860 --> 00:36:17.820
This has been amazing.
00:36:18.139 --> 00:36:18.940
Thanks for having me.
00:36:19.099 --> 00:36:19.740
This has been great.
00:36:19.980 --> 00:36:22.860
It's been so great to meet you and all this wonderful insights.
00:36:23.340 --> 00:36:23.980
Appreciate it.
00:36:24.380 --> 00:36:24.940
Thank you.
00:00:01.040 --> 00:00:02.080
Hi friend.
00:00:02.240 --> 00:00:09.119
One of the things that has helped me figure out the ways I need to grow as a person in my career and in relationships is really being self-aware.
00:00:09.279 --> 00:00:10.800
This is why I love assessment.
00:00:10.960 --> 00:00:16.239
I feel like you cannot really know what needs improvement if you don't have a deep understanding of what makes you tick.
00:00:16.480 --> 00:00:20.000
In the next couple of minutes, I get the pleasure of chatting with Jackie Brewster.
00:00:20.239 --> 00:00:31.120
She's the host of the podcast Enneagram with JB, where she coaches leaders in the church and in business, couples and individuals how to uncover the best version of themselves using the insights and wisdom from the Enneagram.
00:00:31.280 --> 00:00:35.679
If you don't know about the Enneagram, hang tight because you're about to get a crash course.
00:00:35.840 --> 00:00:38.880
And also listen along as Jackie coaches me through it.
00:00:39.119 --> 00:00:40.079
Let's go.
00:00:44.479 --> 00:00:44.960
All right.
00:00:45.039 --> 00:00:45.840
Hi, Jackie.
00:00:45.920 --> 00:00:47.119
Thank you so much for being here.
00:00:47.359 --> 00:00:48.880
Oh, thank you so much for having me.
00:00:49.119 --> 00:00:49.759
Yes, yes.
00:00:49.840 --> 00:00:50.799
It's so nice to meet you.
00:00:50.960 --> 00:00:52.000
We're meeting for the first time.
00:00:52.159 --> 00:00:52.399
Yes.
00:00:52.719 --> 00:00:55.600
But I don't feel like we are, because I've listened to your podcast.
00:00:55.759 --> 00:00:57.439
Yes, and followed you on Instagram.
00:00:57.600 --> 00:00:59.759
And you talk about the Enneagram in such a great way.
00:00:59.840 --> 00:01:01.840
And I just cannot wait to dive into it today.
00:01:02.000 --> 00:01:06.879
But before we get started, I wanted to say, Jackie, that I love the way that you show up online.
00:01:07.120 --> 00:01:16.799
I think you teach the Enneagram, which is a helpful tool, I believe, for you know, doing the inner work of self-growth and development, but you do it in such a way that it resonates with people.
00:01:16.959 --> 00:01:19.359
And I guess that's because you connect it with everyday life.
00:01:19.519 --> 00:01:25.680
Things that people are already thinking and doing, and that shows up in the content and the way it's received.
00:01:25.840 --> 00:01:27.519
And I find that very inspiring.
00:01:28.000 --> 00:01:28.719
Thank you so much.
00:01:28.959 --> 00:01:29.519
Yes, yes.
00:01:29.599 --> 00:01:34.239
I wanted to mention that because as someone who also creates content, I'm always looking for inspiration.
00:01:34.319 --> 00:01:38.319
How do I, you know, do this so that it connects, you know, with people and all that.
00:01:38.400 --> 00:01:38.959
So that's great.
00:01:39.040 --> 00:01:39.359
All right.
00:01:39.439 --> 00:01:40.640
So we're just gonna dive into it.
00:01:40.799 --> 00:01:40.959
Right.
00:01:41.200 --> 00:01:44.319
I I am a self-proclaimed assessment junkie.
00:01:44.640 --> 00:01:44.879
Okay.
00:01:45.200 --> 00:01:48.799
I love taking personality tests, assessments, all of it.
00:01:48.879 --> 00:01:53.840
Like what type of work person you are, the themes, the colors, the letters, and all of that.
00:01:53.920 --> 00:01:54.400
I love it.
00:01:54.480 --> 00:01:55.840
But set me straight, Jackie.
00:01:55.920 --> 00:01:56.480
Is this healthy?
00:01:56.560 --> 00:01:57.280
When is it too much?
00:01:57.359 --> 00:01:57.920
When is it too much?
00:01:58.079 --> 00:01:58.159
Right.
00:01:58.799 --> 00:02:00.079
Oh my gosh, what a great question.
00:02:00.159 --> 00:02:01.200
When is it too much?
00:02:01.439 --> 00:02:05.680
I always say that information is not transformation until you activate it.
00:02:05.840 --> 00:02:15.680
So we can become very knowledgeable yet have no practical application of the information that we're taking in.
00:02:15.840 --> 00:02:25.759
So at some point, you've got to put the books down, you've got to put the assessments down, you've got to put everything down and begin to activate that information if you want this to be life change.
00:02:26.000 --> 00:02:32.319
So if it's just about gathering information because you want to be, you know, heady, you know, knowledgeable about things, that's one thing.
00:02:32.479 --> 00:02:45.439
If you're looking for these tools to help you with life change, then you've got to be able to pause the information to be able to use it for transformation.
00:02:45.599 --> 00:02:50.000
And I was just talking about this with a friend yesterday at the pool, and she's like, I'm doing all the things.
00:02:50.080 --> 00:02:52.240
I'm doing, I've been doing all the things for like all these years.
00:02:52.319 --> 00:02:54.000
And I'm like, stop doing the things.
00:02:54.240 --> 00:02:57.680
Just stop, stop seeking more counsel.
00:02:57.759 --> 00:02:58.000
Stop.
00:02:58.080 --> 00:03:06.400
And and I I say that carefully, but it's like at some point we have to be able to use the information if we want, if we want to see the change happen.
00:03:06.800 --> 00:03:07.520
That's powerful.
00:03:07.759 --> 00:03:11.360
Information is not transformation because what we're seeking is transformation.
00:03:11.599 --> 00:03:15.039
You know, if we're doing things correctly, we should be seeking transformation.
00:03:15.199 --> 00:03:17.280
I want to be better than I was yesterday.
00:03:17.360 --> 00:03:23.439
I want to, you know, be the kind of person I need to be to achieve my goals, whatever it is that, you know, is in front of us.
00:03:23.599 --> 00:03:24.800
So that's that's powerful.
00:03:25.039 --> 00:03:25.599
That's powerful.
00:03:25.759 --> 00:03:26.639
Thank you for sharing that.
00:03:26.879 --> 00:03:30.960
In episode seven of my podcast, I shared my experience with personality tests.
00:03:31.039 --> 00:03:32.240
You know how I said I really love them.
00:03:32.400 --> 00:03:34.400
You know, how I see them, how I've used them in the past.
00:03:34.560 --> 00:03:45.280
And I also attempted to sort of counter the perspective that assessments like these are just like labels that do no good because some people feel like, no, I don't want to label myself, you know, and all of that.
00:03:45.439 --> 00:03:51.280
And but that's before I had actually taken the the Enneagram, even though I'd heard about it for a while, but I hadn't taken it.
00:03:51.360 --> 00:03:53.520
So I talked briefly about wanting to take the test.
00:03:53.599 --> 00:03:56.800
I eventually took the test, and we'll talk about my results today.
00:03:56.960 --> 00:04:02.080
But before we do that, can you give us a brief expose, so to speak, into what the Enneagram is?
00:04:02.240 --> 00:04:05.039
Just the brief how to think about it, you know, the Enneagram.
00:04:05.199 --> 00:04:05.520
Yes.
00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:06.639
What a great question.
00:04:06.800 --> 00:04:09.120
So the Enneagram is a personality typing system.
00:04:09.199 --> 00:04:10.960
It is, and it does have ancient roots.
00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:12.240
You know, it's really interesting.
00:04:12.400 --> 00:04:16.639
Different people have adapted it to different ways, different thoughts, different things like that.
00:04:16.720 --> 00:04:18.160
So it's used in a lot of different ways.
00:04:18.319 --> 00:04:25.759
But the way that I choose to use it and in the teaching that I've sat under as far as using this tool is it's a tool for growth.
00:04:25.920 --> 00:04:33.120
So it is, it is a personality typing system that gives you a GPS of yourself, an internal view of yourself.
00:04:33.279 --> 00:04:39.680
It's different than all other tests because this system does not want to put you in a box.
00:04:39.759 --> 00:04:41.519
It is not labeling you.
00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:43.759
It is not telling you this is who you are.
00:04:43.839 --> 00:04:45.360
Now go act this way.
00:04:45.519 --> 00:04:47.759
It's saying something quite a bit different.
00:04:47.920 --> 00:04:51.360
It's saying, hey, this is how you're presenting to the world.
00:04:51.519 --> 00:04:54.160
This is the things that we're seeing in your personality type.
00:04:54.319 --> 00:05:02.160
It would do you well to get curious as to why, because no change can occur without the acknowledgement of the behaviors.
00:05:02.319 --> 00:05:04.800
And so you've got to get below the surface to the motivation.
00:05:04.959 --> 00:05:09.439
So the Enneagram offers insight into what you're doing.
00:05:09.600 --> 00:05:18.079
So when you start taking a test, you know, you answer the questions, you read the results, and you're like, how can this, how would how did that test know that I like to shop on sale?
00:05:18.240 --> 00:05:21.279
Like that as a seven, I'm like, how would that know that about me?
00:05:21.439 --> 00:05:21.600
Yeah.
00:05:21.759 --> 00:05:25.759
But if if we go deeper into it, so it gives you like the basic of that.
00:05:25.839 --> 00:05:29.839
And then when you get deeper into it, we're not looking at behavior, we're looking at motivation.
00:05:30.000 --> 00:05:31.920
Why are you doing it in the first place?
00:05:32.160 --> 00:05:35.680
So the roots within the Enneagram system go back to early childhood.
00:05:35.839 --> 00:05:44.240
It is those patterns of behavior that get developed as early as the age of two, and we're seeking three specific things all throughout our life from cradle to grave.
00:05:44.399 --> 00:05:45.680
How do I keep myself safe?
00:05:45.839 --> 00:05:46.959
How do I get love?
00:05:47.040 --> 00:05:48.639
And how do I get my needs met?
00:05:48.800 --> 00:05:56.720
And so this particular system offers insight into how you as a human are doing this.
00:05:56.879 --> 00:06:11.839
And then we want to help you grow out of some of those personality traits that would be considered, you know, as an Enneagram seven, like one of those traits for me is like scattered and, you know, I don't finish what I start and all those things.
00:06:12.000 --> 00:06:18.879
So I don't want that to be true about me, but I have to acknowledge it, see where it comes from if I want to be able to change it.
00:06:19.120 --> 00:06:28.399
So that's, you know, when we use this particular tool, it gives us the ability to begin to ask ourselves hard questions to see where we get stuck, to see where worry and afraid come in.
00:06:28.639 --> 00:06:30.000
Why are we doing what we're doing?
00:06:30.160 --> 00:06:31.920
And then we can choose to pivot towards growth.
00:06:32.000 --> 00:06:37.759
So it's an excellent tool for self-awareness that does position us towards growth if we choose to do the work.
00:06:38.000 --> 00:06:40.480
I love that because that's the transformation you're talking about.
00:06:40.720 --> 00:06:45.680
But then the question I kind of have just from what you said right now is so you're an Enneagram seven.
00:06:45.759 --> 00:06:45.920
Yeah.
00:06:46.079 --> 00:06:51.759
And then these the maybe are the character traits that maybe you want to grow out of, you want to change, you know, and all of that.
00:06:52.000 --> 00:06:57.040
Do you still remain a seven, even when you have, you know, dealt with those things and it's not different?
00:06:57.199 --> 00:06:57.920
You still remain a seven.
00:06:58.079 --> 00:06:58.959
You still remain a seven.
00:06:59.040 --> 00:07:00.079
So your number never changes.
00:07:00.160 --> 00:07:02.720
So people say, like, well, when I tested earlier, I got this.
00:07:02.879 --> 00:07:04.480
When I tested now, I got this, you know.
00:07:04.560 --> 00:07:09.279
So as a coach, I work a lot with numbers and in this kind of ebb and flow.
00:07:09.519 --> 00:07:12.160
But what we're looking at is the core motivations.
00:07:12.319 --> 00:07:17.600
And so these messages, early childhood messagings that impact the behavior, that doesn't change.
00:07:17.759 --> 00:07:24.000
So as an Enneagram seven, you know, like my heart longing is to know I'm gonna be taken care of.
00:07:24.079 --> 00:07:25.120
It's that doesn't go away.
00:07:25.279 --> 00:07:26.480
I want to know I'm gonna be taken care of.
00:07:26.560 --> 00:07:35.279
I want to know emotionally that my partner's gonna show up for me, that the people I surround myself with actually care about me, that I'm gonna have what I need to survive, all those things.
00:07:35.439 --> 00:07:36.399
It doesn't change.
00:07:36.639 --> 00:07:39.120
How I do it changes how I do it.
00:07:39.279 --> 00:07:44.160
So before, you know, it would be crazy, you guys, chaotic, crazy.
00:07:44.399 --> 00:07:46.639
Like it would be like fast-paced, whatever.
00:07:46.720 --> 00:07:48.800
I just want to feel happy, like all the things.
00:07:49.040 --> 00:07:53.120
And now that I know this about myself, I can kind of settle into it.
00:07:53.360 --> 00:08:00.800
So my motivation does not change, but the way that I I seek to get what I want and need does change.
00:08:01.040 --> 00:08:01.600
I love that.
00:08:01.680 --> 00:08:02.079
I love that.
00:08:02.160 --> 00:08:02.959
That's insightful.
00:08:03.120 --> 00:08:18.879
So I listened to this episode, a podcast episode with Susan Stabil, where she talked about the fact that she doesn't see the Energram as like a like a personality test the way the others are, because it does more and it goes deeper than other personality tests, which is what you've mentioned today.
00:08:18.959 --> 00:08:26.079
And I'm beginning to see that now because the way that I saw the other test, I'm like, yeah, this is me, but then what do I do with that information, right?
00:08:26.399 --> 00:08:34.639
So she she and she said that part of it is because the Enneagram shows you the part of it, it shows you like the best part of you could also be the worst part of you.
00:08:34.799 --> 00:08:39.200
And how do you do, you know, be self-aware, you know, and do the inner work and all that.
00:08:39.440 --> 00:08:42.159
So I I I really love all of this intrigue.
00:08:42.960 --> 00:08:45.039
So I am an Enneagram one.
00:08:45.360 --> 00:08:45.679
Yes.
00:08:45.919 --> 00:08:48.720
Based on my results with wings two and nine.
00:08:48.960 --> 00:08:49.919
What does this mean for me?
00:08:50.159 --> 00:08:50.399
Okay.
00:08:50.639 --> 00:08:57.600
So the Enneagram one is that reformer, we'll hear it called reformer, we'll hear it called moral perfectionists.
00:08:57.759 --> 00:09:02.320
Like it really depends on what feels right to you when it comes to the the labeling, right?
00:09:02.480 --> 00:09:04.399
Because everybody's different inside of that one.
00:09:04.559 --> 00:09:06.879
You know, there's a couple different ways that the one shows up.
00:09:06.960 --> 00:09:20.559
So there's one type of one that is very focused on perfecting themselves and making sure that they're that what they, you know, that they're above board, that they usually, if if it's a self-preservation one, there's usually very health conscious.
00:09:20.799 --> 00:09:22.399
There's gonna be a lot of vitamins on board.
00:09:22.559 --> 00:09:27.919
There's gonna be a lot of a lot of things about making themselves perfect and whatever that looks like.
00:09:28.080 --> 00:09:28.399
Okay.
00:09:28.559 --> 00:09:32.320
So it's not necessarily that their home has to have everything in order and things like that.
00:09:32.480 --> 00:09:33.440
It doesn't mean that.
00:09:33.600 --> 00:09:38.080
So not everyone is like perfectionistic in every area of their lives.
00:09:38.480 --> 00:09:39.039
It's not.
00:09:39.279 --> 00:09:42.639
It's not, it's usually, yeah, it's usually more specific, you know?
00:09:42.879 --> 00:09:46.799
And so with the with one type of one, it's like, I want to perfect myself.
00:09:46.879 --> 00:09:48.240
So I'm gonna work really hard on that.
00:09:48.480 --> 00:09:51.919
The there's another type of one that is like, I want to be the teacher.
00:09:52.080 --> 00:09:54.159
I know, so I want to help you do it better.
00:09:54.320 --> 00:09:59.919
So I want to teach you how to do these things that I think are great or really work, right?
00:10:00.159 --> 00:10:01.279
So there's that type of one.
00:10:01.440 --> 00:10:07.279
And then there's there's another type of one that's much more fiery, can also oftentimes get mistyped as an eight.
00:10:07.440 --> 00:10:13.919
And so they're not really thinking about perfecting themselves or necessarily people.
00:10:14.240 --> 00:10:21.759
They they are more thinking about the bigger picture, taking on a cause and making something like in the world better.
00:10:21.919 --> 00:10:24.799
And so very, you know, singular lane.
00:10:24.879 --> 00:10:26.720
It's it just doesn't look like that for any type.
00:10:26.879 --> 00:10:33.600
So when we look at this for the one, so that's kind of the, you know, the base of the one could fit in any of those categories.
00:10:33.840 --> 00:10:38.639
Then we've got the wings, which are the numbers to the right and to the left of the dominant number.
00:10:38.799 --> 00:10:39.120
Okay.
00:10:39.360 --> 00:10:43.039
And I say this all the time that the wings have to be attached to the bird.
00:10:43.200 --> 00:10:46.559
So we cannot be an Enneagram one with a wing of seven.
00:10:46.799 --> 00:10:47.840
Nope, you can't be that.
00:10:47.919 --> 00:10:50.799
So it's an N-gram one with a wing of two and a wing of nine.
00:10:51.039 --> 00:10:56.799
Typically, we've got one wing, one of these numbers to the right, to the left of us is more dominant.
00:10:56.960 --> 00:11:02.320
And then one that is oftentimes suppressed, or maybe you maybe you don't even recognize it at all.
00:11:02.559 --> 00:11:07.919
Or as you get older, usually after 40, we see the less dominant wing come on board.
00:11:08.080 --> 00:11:15.039
And for some people, they might feel like they are equal in the wings, like they can feel both parts of it.
00:11:15.279 --> 00:11:17.759
For some people, say they don't feel any part of it.
00:11:18.000 --> 00:11:20.799
So it's really different for everybody.
00:11:21.039 --> 00:11:28.159
When we are talking about these numbers to the right and to the left, if you we use them to help really get what we need.
00:11:28.320 --> 00:11:35.679
So we're gonna, it's like kind of reaching into that basket to help us get what we need in life, like help us to cope.
00:11:35.840 --> 00:11:38.240
So it's gonna be strategies that we've we've learned.
00:11:38.399 --> 00:11:49.440
So with the Enneagram nine, uh one wing nine, the idealist, they're gonna look cooler, more relaxed, introverted, objective, detached, even in some ways.
00:11:49.679 --> 00:11:52.399
So this type of Enneagram one is idealistic.
00:11:52.559 --> 00:11:56.480
It does not wish to get involved in the dirty work that brings about change.
00:11:56.639 --> 00:11:59.200
So they they kind of want to sit above it.
00:11:59.279 --> 00:12:02.320
They see it, but they don't necessarily want to have to be in it.
00:12:02.399 --> 00:12:07.120
And if the Enneagram nine is the peacemaker, so they don't like conflict and confusion.
00:12:07.279 --> 00:12:17.919
So you can see why if you lean more into this, this nine wing as a one, that it would be like, I see it, but I don't want to have to bring all that into my world.
00:12:18.159 --> 00:12:19.200
Like, I'm good.
00:12:19.279 --> 00:12:24.240
I'm I I'll give you the, I'll give you like the bullet points and what you can do to fix it.
00:12:24.399 --> 00:12:26.240
But I don't necessarily know.
00:12:26.559 --> 00:12:28.000
Yeah, like I don't want to do it.
00:12:28.159 --> 00:12:31.759
So they're more focused on long-range concerns and big picture.
00:12:32.000 --> 00:12:36.480
There is that introverted withdrawn, seeking relief from chaos and crowds.
00:12:36.639 --> 00:12:41.039
They particularly they prefer quiet environments that are peaceful.
00:12:41.200 --> 00:12:44.080
They oftentimes enjoy nature and animals.
00:12:44.320 --> 00:12:47.519
So this one looks quite a bit different than the two.
00:12:47.759 --> 00:12:53.840
So if you would be an Enneagram one with a two, this one is known as the advocate.
00:12:53.919 --> 00:12:59.840
So this is warm and helpful, vocal, and there is some fiery tendency to this one.
00:13:00.240 --> 00:13:02.159
Sensitive, action-oriented.
00:13:02.399 --> 00:13:05.759
You might feel a little bit more control from this one-wing too.
00:13:05.919 --> 00:13:08.879
This type is compassionate, empathetic.
00:13:09.120 --> 00:13:16.720
They are very action-oriented and outgoing and at times may forcefully try to get their point across about what they think needs to change.
00:13:16.879 --> 00:13:18.320
So there's more of a drive there.
00:13:18.480 --> 00:13:22.960
They desire to improve themselves in the world around them, and they're not afraid of the hard work it will take.
00:13:23.039 --> 00:13:25.039
So they are more willing to get their hands dirty.
00:13:25.360 --> 00:13:28.159
So very different than the nine.
00:13:28.559 --> 00:13:28.720
Yeah.
00:13:28.879 --> 00:13:29.039
Yeah.
00:13:29.440 --> 00:13:33.279
This is interesting because I'm trying to kind of place myself in this.
00:13:33.440 --> 00:13:37.039
And according to the test that I did, I'm more of a two than a nine.
00:13:37.200 --> 00:13:44.240
However, there are so many parts of the, maybe not so many, but there are parts of the two that I really don't identify with.
00:13:44.320 --> 00:13:44.480
Yeah.
00:13:44.639 --> 00:13:48.559
And then there are parts of the nine that are more, you know, but I'm more of a two than a nine.
00:13:48.720 --> 00:13:54.879
So for instance, the the vocal, kind of, you know, when I'm really passionate about something, yeah.
00:13:55.120 --> 00:13:56.000
I will speak up about it.
00:13:56.159 --> 00:13:58.799
Action-oriented, yes, you know, and all of that.
00:13:58.960 --> 00:14:02.000
But then the nine, the cooler, the more relaxed.
00:14:02.080 --> 00:14:04.080
I feel like that's what I aspire to.
00:14:04.399 --> 00:14:04.799
Yeah.
00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:10.159
Because I tell people that I want to be, I truly want to be a peaceful person.
00:14:10.320 --> 00:14:12.960
You know, not just like outwardly, but also inside of me.
00:14:13.120 --> 00:14:13.279
Right.
00:14:13.759 --> 00:14:22.480
And one thing that really kind of spoke to me when I read this, I was like, at first I was confused because I was like, the core emotion for once is anger.
00:14:22.720 --> 00:14:22.960
Right.
00:14:23.120 --> 00:14:26.720
And I didn't at first on the surface, I did not connect with that.
00:14:26.799 --> 00:14:29.440
I'm like, I don't see myself as that at all.
00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:38.159
But then I read that it doesn't necessarily mean that you like you display that anger all the time, or maybe you try to suppress it.
00:14:38.480 --> 00:14:38.639
Right.
00:14:39.120 --> 00:14:52.159
So I had to do a lot of thinking and I had to be willing to be open to the fact that something about me may not be right because again, as a one, I'm coming to realize that we don't like to be seen as not good.
00:14:52.320 --> 00:14:55.200
Like there's something about you that is not, and I had to deal with that.
00:14:55.440 --> 00:15:00.399
I say that to say the anger emotion, I had to really think about it.
00:15:00.559 --> 00:15:02.399
And I realize it is true.
00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:08.080
And unfortunately, it's the people that are closest to me that feel that, you know, that's suppressed anger.
00:15:08.320 --> 00:15:09.600
You know, absolutely.
00:15:10.000 --> 00:15:15.039
There, there, the people closest to us are gonna see the parts of ourselves that we don't show the rest of the world.
00:15:15.200 --> 00:15:15.440
Okay.
00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:21.120
So when we feel safe enough with our people, they're gonna see the the not so pretty side.
00:15:21.279 --> 00:15:22.879
You know, we can't be perfect all the time.
00:15:22.960 --> 00:15:23.840
We can't hold it together.
00:15:24.000 --> 00:15:25.919
We can't suppress all of our feelings all the time.
00:15:26.159 --> 00:15:29.039
And I think you're right on with this one around anger.
00:15:29.279 --> 00:15:38.000
So anger is a suppressed or even repressed emotion for the Enneagram one, uh, meaning it's conscious or unconscious that we're that we're holding it down.
00:15:38.159 --> 00:15:47.679
We don't even oftentimes know the Enneagram one would have been conditioned early on, whether they've conditioned themselves or their family environment would have conditioned them to not show that.
00:15:47.840 --> 00:15:55.440
That's not an appropriate emotion, or we don't do that, we don't act like that, we don't have big emotion, like expressions of emotion in that way.
00:15:55.679 --> 00:15:58.960
So you would have learned early on, like, that is not good.
00:15:59.120 --> 00:16:00.320
We're not gonna do that one.
00:16:00.559 --> 00:16:00.879
Okay.
00:16:01.120 --> 00:16:04.240
And so therefore it gets held down.
00:16:04.320 --> 00:16:09.039
But what happens with anger for the Enneagram one is that it turns into judgment.
00:16:09.200 --> 00:16:09.440
Yeah.
00:16:09.600 --> 00:16:16.399
So what happens, bitterness, judgment, it it's like, it's like quiet, quiet judgment, I'm gonna say.
00:16:16.559 --> 00:16:21.600
It's like you internally look and be like, I can't believe that they would do that, or why would they think that's okay?
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:27.679
Or you're not saying this out loud, but in your head and even your body, you're like, oh, I don't know.
00:16:27.919 --> 00:16:37.919
And so, you know, I oftentimes say, like, we judge the things that we don't feel permissioned to to do, or we judge the things that make us uncomfortable.
00:16:38.159 --> 00:16:46.159
And so with the Enneagram one, if you saw somebody else have a big reaction with anger, you would probably judge that as like they need to get their self together.
00:16:46.240 --> 00:16:52.080
Together, like that is not appropriate because you don't give yourself permission to display an emotion like that.
00:16:52.320 --> 00:17:06.480
So it's deep, it's really deep, and it's masked for the Enneagram one and and other behaviors that you're trying to keep it away from you because oftentimes the Enneagram one feels like anger is not appropriate.
00:17:06.559 --> 00:17:08.559
It it makes me look bad or it is bad.
00:17:08.799 --> 00:17:09.119
Yeah.
00:17:09.279 --> 00:17:09.519
Yeah.
00:17:09.759 --> 00:17:14.160
I I feel it mostly connected to like doing things the right way.
00:17:14.319 --> 00:17:18.319
And I I guess that that's where the kind of like the judgment will come from.
00:17:18.559 --> 00:17:29.519
Because in a way, I see that maybe things should be done this way, or almost the idea of even the idea of drive and being goal-oriented and action-oriented.
00:17:29.759 --> 00:17:36.000
And if the person beside me or around me is not in, you know, that way, it's like what why?
00:17:36.240 --> 00:17:36.880
What is wrong with that?
00:17:37.039 --> 00:17:38.079
What is what is happening?
00:17:38.400 --> 00:17:40.079
You know, how come they don't care about this?
00:17:40.240 --> 00:17:40.400
Yeah.
00:17:40.559 --> 00:17:43.920
How can they go through life and like how can they be satisfied with that?
00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:55.440
How can I, again, in wanting to be peaceful inside of myself and that's also part of the like not judging other people's decisions or the out out outlook in life?
00:17:55.599 --> 00:17:57.519
Like, how how can it work for me?
00:19:08.059 --> 00:19:16.779
So we work on this with the Enneagram one or I do in sessions, and it's recognizing what causes you to feel these feelings in the first place.
00:19:17.019 --> 00:19:21.339
So I always say it's you know, it starts with self-word starts with acknowledging.
00:19:21.660 --> 00:19:24.940
You've got to acknowledge what's happening for there to be change.
00:19:25.019 --> 00:19:27.259
So you can't change what you're unwilling to acknowledge.
00:19:27.500 --> 00:19:31.740
So the self-awareness piece is key to then move to acknowledgement.
00:19:31.819 --> 00:19:42.860
So I've got to become self-aware, then I've got to acknowledge, and then I've got to be willing to see what's working and what's not working in order for me to make a move towards growth, like the pivot towards growth.
00:19:43.019 --> 00:19:47.579
And so with my Enneagram ones, we look at the judgment piece.
00:19:47.900 --> 00:19:51.259
And oftentimes there needs to be more play.
00:19:51.420 --> 00:19:54.779
There needs to be more fun in my Enneagram ones' lives.
00:19:54.940 --> 00:20:01.900
And so we we kind of infuse, we want to infuse a little bit more play and a little bit more fun.
00:20:02.059 --> 00:20:05.019
And as we do that, you guys tend to relax a little bit.
00:20:05.180 --> 00:20:18.220
And some of the feelings and the pressure you put on yourself that you project onto other people, it starts to diminish a little bit because you're like, oh, I don't have to be this hard on me.
00:20:18.380 --> 00:20:21.500
And therefore, I'm I'm not that hard on them.
00:20:21.660 --> 00:20:27.579
So it's it, you know, it's the personal work first, but it is like catching those thoughts when they're happening.
00:20:27.819 --> 00:20:31.740
So say you look at somebody and you're like, I can't believe that they would be satisfied with that.
00:20:31.900 --> 00:20:33.980
Like I see so much more potential in them.
00:20:34.220 --> 00:20:40.299
Why don't they just work a little bit harder and they'd probably get where they want to go or where I think that they should go?
00:20:40.539 --> 00:20:42.140
It's probably more like it, right?
00:20:42.380 --> 00:20:43.980
Where I think that they should go.
00:20:44.140 --> 00:20:46.779
You catch it, you're like, oh my gosh, here I am again.
00:20:46.940 --> 00:20:48.460
Runaway training my brain.
00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:50.059
Like, here we are, right?
00:20:50.299 --> 00:20:51.819
You catch it, you pull it down.
00:20:51.980 --> 00:20:53.259
Why am I thinking this?
00:20:53.500 --> 00:20:57.099
And sometimes it's like, no, I really want them, I want better for them.
00:20:57.420 --> 00:21:06.299
I was about to ask that because for some of the things that I do, like right now, I'm about to go into like a mentorship program with a group of about seven ladies.
00:21:06.460 --> 00:21:06.620
Yeah.
00:21:06.860 --> 00:21:09.500
How do I like I want them to be better?
00:21:09.660 --> 00:21:12.860
They've come to me because, you know, they need to work through that.
00:21:12.940 --> 00:21:20.940
Like, how does that square with me not having to like be like, oh, you have to do this, or you know, but wanting them to be able to do that.
00:21:21.019 --> 00:21:21.259
Yeah.
00:21:21.579 --> 00:21:21.819
Yes.
00:21:21.980 --> 00:21:23.500
I so you pull it down, right?
00:21:23.660 --> 00:21:25.900
You think about it, and then you think through the perspective.
00:21:26.059 --> 00:21:28.299
Like, okay, I see potential in them.
00:21:28.460 --> 00:21:33.500
And then it's their individual responsibility to go after potential.
00:21:33.740 --> 00:21:49.420
So we release ourselves from the responsibility to change another person, even if they're paying us, even if they're part of our mentorship or they're part of our coaching, whatever this is, because we are not uh responsible for somebody else's decisions at all.
00:21:49.579 --> 00:21:51.660
We can only be responsible for us.
00:21:51.819 --> 00:21:53.019
We can only change us.
00:21:53.180 --> 00:21:59.259
We can present possibilities, we can present strategies, we can, we can do all of those things, right?
00:21:59.579 --> 00:22:06.220
So keeping yourself kind of in that check where because I I'm a coach like you, so I I see potential.
00:22:06.380 --> 00:22:07.579
Like I see potential.
00:22:07.740 --> 00:22:09.019
I want people to grow.
00:22:09.180 --> 00:22:10.700
I want that for them too.
00:22:10.940 --> 00:22:15.180
So I can I can offer insight, but they have to do the work.
00:22:15.900 --> 00:22:27.259
And if I keep myself in check in this, then I don't have a like I I give people work to do, and if they come back to me and they didn't do the work, I'm not mad because it's not my work to do.
00:22:27.740 --> 00:22:28.779
It's not my work to do.
00:22:28.940 --> 00:22:40.220
So, but I can recognize where we're at in session to session to session, and that where I could see we could go from a one to a 10 if if the steps were done, we could get there.
00:22:40.460 --> 00:22:52.700
But the willingness on the work is not coming in at the same level, then I'm gonna, I'm gonna readjust my expectation and be like, okay, then we might get from a one to a four, and they might be satisfied with that.
00:22:52.860 --> 00:22:54.380
And I'm gonna have to let that go.
00:22:54.620 --> 00:22:59.819
So it's really removing yourself, so to speak, from like just the the process itself.
00:22:59.900 --> 00:23:01.900
Like it's not contingent on you.
00:23:02.220 --> 00:23:08.059
It's not contingent on you and and their growth, their work is not a reflection of you.
00:23:08.299 --> 00:23:08.940
That's a good one.
00:23:09.259 --> 00:23:09.740
That is hard.
00:23:10.220 --> 00:23:10.860
That's hard.
00:23:11.019 --> 00:23:17.180
Because it feels great when people do the work and you can see the growth and they're like, I was part of this and this is what it feels great.
00:23:17.420 --> 00:23:17.660
Right.
00:23:18.140 --> 00:23:26.860
But at the same point, we want to keep going back to the the person where it's not, it doesn't come back to us necessarily.
00:23:27.019 --> 00:23:28.140
It goes back to them.
00:23:28.380 --> 00:23:30.220
Like, I see potential in you.
00:23:30.380 --> 00:23:31.579
I can see this in you.
00:23:31.900 --> 00:23:36.940
Let's go back and look at this step that, you know, in part of that work that that we were working on.
00:23:37.180 --> 00:23:40.620
Let's revisit this because I see potential in this.
00:23:40.779 --> 00:23:42.779
So it's that I think it's the wording.
00:23:42.860 --> 00:23:43.900
I think it's how we do it.
00:23:44.059 --> 00:23:46.220
I think it's all nine personality types.
00:23:46.299 --> 00:23:53.579
You know, inside of that, there's 27 personality types within the Enneagram system because there's subtypes, which I broke down a little bit at the beginning with that one.
00:23:53.819 --> 00:23:56.380
If we look at that, everybody's approach is different.
00:23:56.539 --> 00:23:59.500
So you as an Enneagram one, you're like, you are linear.
00:23:59.579 --> 00:24:01.259
You're like boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
00:24:01.339 --> 00:24:02.940
You'd be like, Jackie, come on, girl.
00:24:03.099 --> 00:24:09.259
And I'd be like, I am over here like on six and then back to two, and then I got distracted.
00:24:09.420 --> 00:24:15.259
And so it really is knowing the people that you're working with.
00:24:15.420 --> 00:24:25.259
I mean, I the Enneagram is such a helpful tool for anybody that's helping anybody because it gives you insight to to understand kind of like where they're coming from and what their focus is.
00:24:25.420 --> 00:24:32.860
Because if you've got an Enneagram three that you're coaching, success, succeed, drive, man, you're gonna be like, yes, yes, and yes.
00:24:33.019 --> 00:24:33.180
Right.
00:24:33.579 --> 00:24:34.539
Model students.
00:24:34.779 --> 00:24:35.259
Yes.
00:24:35.500 --> 00:24:44.779
You've got an Enneagram nine that is like getting there, getting there, getting there, but their pace is gonna probably be slower.
00:24:44.940 --> 00:24:50.380
They want to do the work, but it's gonna be slower because that that's just how they process information.
00:24:50.539 --> 00:24:53.259
There's nothing wrong with them at all in in how they do it.
00:24:53.339 --> 00:24:54.539
They just do it different than you.
00:24:54.779 --> 00:24:56.620
Yeah, there's so many different aspects of this.
00:24:56.700 --> 00:25:00.860
I could talk about, oh my gosh, but I'll try to stick to just the questions you're giving me.
00:25:01.099 --> 00:25:04.140
So all right, let's talk about the more play and the more fun.
00:25:04.380 --> 00:25:08.059
So I know that I think you were going through, I may have cut you off a little bit there, and I apologize.
00:25:08.140 --> 00:25:11.579
I think you were going through like a list of things that I could think about as an Inigram one.
00:25:11.900 --> 00:25:16.539
And I think the first one that um I remember that you mentioned is more play and more fun, right?
00:25:16.700 --> 00:25:17.180
Yes, yes.
00:25:17.660 --> 00:25:21.660
Already thinking like scheduling, like scheduling, because I agree.
00:25:21.740 --> 00:25:25.500
I I don't, I'm a very serious person, and it takes a lot for me to be.
00:25:25.740 --> 00:25:32.539
I remember as a child, I think I was in, because I grew up in Nigeria, I went to secondary school there, and I remember my friends were playing.
00:25:32.620 --> 00:25:35.019
They were playing lawn tennis, and and they were like, Come play.
00:25:35.180 --> 00:25:36.539
And I'm like, I don't know how to play.
00:25:36.620 --> 00:25:37.579
That's exactly what I said.
00:25:37.740 --> 00:25:38.779
I don't know how to play.
00:25:38.940 --> 00:25:40.940
And it's funny because it's it's it's true.
00:25:41.099 --> 00:25:46.460
Like I'm very just serious, and I want to be more like now that I have a child, like you know.
00:25:46.700 --> 00:25:50.220
So I'm already thinking, scheduling the place, scheduling the fun.
00:25:50.380 --> 00:25:51.660
I guess that works, right?
00:25:51.900 --> 00:26:03.019
It does, you know what at the at the beginning I do think that that's wise for the ones, especially if they're pretty rigid and kind of set in like in in you know, your your systems or your schedule, whatever this looks like.
00:26:03.259 --> 00:26:09.099
And as a seven, I know that I'm like, and the seven is the enthusiast, so like all over the place and fun.
00:26:09.259 --> 00:26:14.779
I'm lean into the one pretty heavily though, in my stress point, but I get to the high side of it too.
00:26:14.940 --> 00:26:19.339
And so I can be really rigid, like I am very structured.
00:26:19.660 --> 00:26:24.539
So I do think scheduling fun could be really beneficial for you as an India grandma.
00:26:24.700 --> 00:26:28.460
Um, I think that that that's one part of it, fun, play.
00:26:28.700 --> 00:26:38.860
Another part of it is even though the dishes need to be done, we're gonna, we're gonna like not for for 30 minutes and do something different.
00:26:39.099 --> 00:26:41.980
So anything that you do is going to be uncomfortable.
00:26:42.140 --> 00:26:44.220
Any change that you make is gonna be uncomfortable.
00:26:44.380 --> 00:26:44.539
Oh.
00:26:45.019 --> 00:26:45.180
Okay.
00:26:45.339 --> 00:26:47.900
So it's gonna be like, oh my gosh, I really should be doing the dishes.
00:26:48.059 --> 00:26:49.420
I should not be watching this documentary.
00:26:49.500 --> 00:26:50.940
I should really be doing the dishes.
00:26:51.180 --> 00:26:51.500
Okay.
00:26:51.740 --> 00:26:54.460
But I'm gonna, I said I would give myself 30 minutes.
00:26:54.620 --> 00:26:56.059
I'm gonna give myself 30 minutes.
00:26:56.220 --> 00:27:03.019
And so what you're gonna find is that you gave yourself 30 minutes, you enjoyed a documentary or a book, whatever, I don't know, play cards, whatever you're doing, right?
00:27:03.180 --> 00:27:04.460
And then you go back to the dishes.
00:27:04.620 --> 00:27:05.500
They didn't go anywhere.
00:27:05.740 --> 00:27:06.620
They didn't go anywhere.
00:27:06.779 --> 00:27:17.660
So then you do them and you're like, okay, I the more that you give yourself freedom, flexibility inside of that, the the easier it's gonna get over time.
00:27:17.900 --> 00:27:25.019
The more rigid you build your life, the harder it's gonna be for there to be flexibility.
00:27:25.180 --> 00:27:30.779
So, and I'm not talking about throw caution to the wind and do all the things because that's not gonna be your personality.
00:27:31.099 --> 00:27:34.940
But it is, it is like, okay, I need to loosen up a little bit.
00:27:35.099 --> 00:27:38.620
These are the areas that I tend to get really laser focused.
00:27:38.779 --> 00:27:55.579
How do I shift this just a little bit, knowing it's gonna be uncomfortable and I'm gonna have to do it several times, a lot of times, until I don't feel uncomfortable or that I'm doing something bad, but uh that I'm, you know, that that chore piece is usually where my Enneagram ones get stuck.
00:27:55.660 --> 00:27:59.019
They're like, I can't relax, I can't have fun until everything on my list is done.
00:27:59.339 --> 00:27:59.660
Done.
00:27:59.819 --> 00:28:04.299
I do, I do that that makes sense to me because that's that's essentially me.
00:28:04.380 --> 00:28:08.140
You know, I have my times and like nothing changes those times.
00:28:08.299 --> 00:28:17.980
Like I have to be at my desk at the stem doing this at that time because it just helps me, it helps me not feel overwhelmed with life, you know, because I have structure, I feel safe within the structure.
00:28:18.140 --> 00:28:23.420
But also, like you said, learning to kind of put some flexibility into that because I really do want it.
00:28:23.660 --> 00:28:24.460
I really do want it.
00:28:24.539 --> 00:28:27.019
I don't want to be like, you know, yeah, rigid all my life.
00:28:27.099 --> 00:28:28.220
So that's definitely helpful.
00:28:28.539 --> 00:28:30.779
Well, children help us with this.
00:28:30.940 --> 00:28:31.579
Yes, they do.
00:28:32.460 --> 00:28:35.259
I have four of them, they help us with this.
00:28:35.500 --> 00:28:36.220
Yes, yes.
00:28:36.460 --> 00:28:42.220
They probably helped me become more structured, where they might help you become a little less structured.
00:28:42.380 --> 00:28:47.180
Oh, but for me, I was like, the only way I'm gonna survive this is to put everybody on a schedule, you know?
00:28:47.420 --> 00:28:53.259
And then inside of that, I found I did find freedom inside of the boundaries that created.
00:28:53.420 --> 00:28:55.180
And I am a huge believer in that.
00:28:55.339 --> 00:29:00.539
Like it's not, it's not like I wake up and my whole day is whatever and I just feel free.
00:29:00.700 --> 00:29:02.620
That is not typically healthy.
00:29:02.860 --> 00:29:08.059
We having some predictability allows our central nervous system to calm down.
00:29:08.299 --> 00:29:15.819
We know when we know what to expect, then there is this we can that calm that you're that you're like, I just want to feel calm and at peace.
00:29:16.059 --> 00:29:19.339
Well, you learned how to do that by creating this rhythm.
00:29:19.660 --> 00:29:22.059
So there's beauty inside of that rhythm.
00:29:22.460 --> 00:29:29.980
We just need to schedule in maybe a little bit of flexibility to for there to be free time or play or whatever.
00:29:30.220 --> 00:29:33.980
But yeah, I don't, even as a one, I'm not like, I don't want to rewrite you.
00:29:34.140 --> 00:29:48.620
Gosh, I would I I'm like, no, there's so many great things about your ability to stay focused on tasks, to complete projects that I want you to see those things as gifts that you have that you bring into the world, not as things that are holding you back.
00:29:48.940 --> 00:29:49.500
They're gifts.
00:29:49.740 --> 00:29:50.220
I love that.
00:29:50.380 --> 00:29:51.579
This is freeing for me.
00:29:51.740 --> 00:29:52.380
Thank you so much.
00:29:52.539 --> 00:29:53.980
And I I will keep doing the work.
00:29:54.140 --> 00:29:59.339
I will keep doing the work and keep leaning into this because like you said, transformation is what we're seeking.
00:29:59.420 --> 00:30:02.940
And I I do want to experience that, you know, I want to keep experiencing that.
00:30:03.019 --> 00:30:03.740
So that's awesome.
00:30:03.900 --> 00:30:04.380
Thank you so much.
00:30:04.460 --> 00:30:06.140
You've given me a lot to think about, Jackie.
00:30:06.220 --> 00:30:18.539
So for the sake of our friends listening, what kind of I know we've talked about some of it, but just holistically, what kind of transformations can people expect to experience when they really dig deep into the Enneagram?
00:30:18.779 --> 00:30:22.380
What have you witnessed, you know, in going through this with people, organizations, teams?
00:30:22.539 --> 00:30:24.140
What kind of transformations have you seen?
00:30:24.380 --> 00:30:26.220
Yeah, so it's been beautiful.
00:30:26.380 --> 00:30:27.339
That's what I've seen.
00:30:27.579 --> 00:30:28.940
Absolutely beautiful.
00:30:29.180 --> 00:30:33.819
I have one client that I've been seeing for the past couple of years, and she came to me.
00:30:33.900 --> 00:30:40.620
Um, actually, her husband came to me first, and then I asked if I could, if she could join about six months in.
00:30:40.700 --> 00:30:45.819
I was like, I'd love for her to join and be a part of this because it just felt like it would sink, you know?
00:30:46.059 --> 00:30:52.220
So she joined, she was an Enneagram, she is an Enneagram nine, and she she just felt kind of stuck.
00:30:52.380 --> 00:30:57.900
And she she just was like, I feel overwhelmed, I feel stuck, I hear him, he's an Enneagram one.
00:30:58.059 --> 00:30:59.900
And so she's like, I hear him.
00:31:00.140 --> 00:31:02.700
And I he thinks like it's not that hard.
00:31:02.860 --> 00:31:03.980
Like, this is not that hard.
00:31:04.140 --> 00:31:07.420
If I just do this, this, this, this, this, it's all gonna come together.
00:31:07.500 --> 00:31:09.579
And she's like, I cannot get myself to move.
00:31:09.740 --> 00:31:17.579
And so week after week, month after month, we just started to to dig into like what are the messages that sit below the surface?
00:31:17.740 --> 00:31:18.620
Why are we stuck?
00:31:18.700 --> 00:31:20.140
What is holding us back?
00:31:20.380 --> 00:31:23.099
And I saw her shed uh so much.
00:31:23.339 --> 00:31:31.339
Like I just saw uh layer after layer after layer come off and this freedom and this brightness and this joy come back into her life.
00:31:31.500 --> 00:31:33.500
She started her own clothing line.
00:31:33.740 --> 00:31:36.620
She is uh she looks like a completely different person.
00:31:37.180 --> 00:31:39.259
She's like, she has joy, she has peace.
00:31:39.420 --> 00:31:42.940
Her and her husband have a thriving marriage where they can communicate.
00:31:43.099 --> 00:31:46.380
She doesn't back away from the hard conversations anymore.
00:31:46.460 --> 00:31:48.140
She she's willing to come into it.
00:31:48.220 --> 00:31:50.620
And he is like the way that they can do it together.
00:31:50.779 --> 00:31:53.500
It's like he sees her showing up and he meets her there.
00:31:53.660 --> 00:31:58.380
So there's a ton of transformation that happens with all of my clients that I work with.
00:31:58.539 --> 00:32:06.220
A lot of when I I do a lot with people in leadership, so one-on-one, or even with teams in leadership.
00:32:06.380 --> 00:32:09.740
And so when it comes to that, it's helping them understand themselves better.
00:32:09.819 --> 00:32:11.900
And it is like light bulb moments happening.
00:32:12.059 --> 00:32:16.299
They're like, oh, oh, oh, that's why I'm doing this, or that's where I'm stuck.
00:32:16.460 --> 00:32:19.819
Or I, you know, though sometimes it's like, hey, I need a session this week.
00:32:19.980 --> 00:32:23.500
And they have, you know, they're spiraling out about something.
00:32:23.740 --> 00:32:26.700
And it's like, okay, fear and worry have entered the picture.
00:32:26.860 --> 00:32:30.620
So if fear and worry are here, what what's happening inside of you?
00:32:30.779 --> 00:32:37.660
Like what, you know, we're gonna go back to coping strategies in different ways to try to figure out how to get our needs met in the world.
00:32:37.819 --> 00:32:39.180
And they can see it.
00:32:39.420 --> 00:32:50.620
So they they are able to witness themselves acting in ways that they don't want to, whether it's from leading from a place of control and and drive and like everybody needs to do this.
00:32:50.700 --> 00:32:51.660
And it's like, why?
00:32:51.819 --> 00:32:54.299
They feel afraid about something, you know.
00:32:54.460 --> 00:33:05.180
So um, there's a lot of information that that they receive that then they make sense into their own lives, you know, how it's showing up that usually they can kind of pull down.
00:33:05.259 --> 00:33:07.420
Like I said, like you pull it down, like what's going on?
00:33:07.579 --> 00:33:11.819
They get curious around it, and then they they're able to see change.
00:33:11.980 --> 00:33:14.779
I was at an organization back in May.
00:33:14.940 --> 00:33:15.579
Like, when was that?
00:33:15.740 --> 00:33:16.059
Back in May.
00:33:16.140 --> 00:33:21.339
I was at an organization back in May, and I work with the the senior leader there and uh his team was around.
00:33:21.420 --> 00:33:31.019
I was just there, just in the office doing something, and the team was around and they started to talk about the change that they've seen happen in him over the past year and a half.
00:33:31.180 --> 00:33:31.980
He's a different person.
00:33:32.059 --> 00:33:33.339
The way that he leads is different.
00:33:33.500 --> 00:33:39.420
Part of that, too, when I'm when I'm working with a leader is I'm also able to help them see the team if they know Enneagram types.
00:33:39.660 --> 00:33:42.860
So they understand what's happening in the team and that what the team needs.
00:33:43.019 --> 00:33:45.500
And so it's not just their their way or the highway.
00:33:45.579 --> 00:33:49.660
It's like collectively they can see how this team's functioning together.
00:33:49.819 --> 00:33:51.579
So it is life-changing.
00:33:51.740 --> 00:33:54.860
I promise the work is worth worth it, you know.
00:33:55.099 --> 00:33:56.220
Doing the work is worth it.
00:33:56.380 --> 00:33:56.940
I promise.
00:33:57.259 --> 00:33:58.059
But it's slow.
00:33:58.220 --> 00:33:59.339
I will say it's slow.
00:33:59.500 --> 00:34:00.940
You know, it takes time to change.
00:34:01.099 --> 00:34:04.380
We don't go to the gym and and you know, get abs in a day.
00:34:04.460 --> 00:34:08.940
Yeah, you know, all those things like I ate a salad, did I lose, you know, the 10 pounds?
00:34:09.179 --> 00:34:09.659
I wish.
00:34:09.819 --> 00:34:10.860
I wish that was true.
00:34:11.099 --> 00:34:11.500
Right?
00:34:11.659 --> 00:34:12.940
It just doesn't happen like that.
00:34:13.099 --> 00:34:14.219
So change takes time.
00:34:14.380 --> 00:34:17.739
Be patient, get curious, be kind to yourself.
00:34:17.980 --> 00:34:21.179
Oh my gosh, kindness is key to this transformation.
00:34:21.420 --> 00:34:21.980
I love it.
00:34:22.059 --> 00:34:22.539
I love it.
00:34:22.619 --> 00:34:28.380
I think one thing I kind of take from everything you've said is just like you mentioned before, the involvement of the people you're working with.
00:34:28.699 --> 00:34:32.460
You know, I feel like sometimes a lot of people and reflection is a huge part of it.
00:34:32.539 --> 00:34:40.059
I feel like you need to be able to reflect and which is what you're helping your clients do, really think through the process, you know, bring it down, break it down.
00:34:40.219 --> 00:34:41.420
Why am I feeling this way?
00:34:41.500 --> 00:34:42.860
All of that is reflection.
00:34:43.019 --> 00:34:46.940
And I I noticed that a lot of people find it difficult to do it, you know.
00:34:47.099 --> 00:34:48.460
I feel like they need help to do it.
00:34:48.539 --> 00:34:48.699
Right.
00:34:49.019 --> 00:34:52.699
Find it difficult to do it on your own to just reflect and kind of piece things together.
00:34:52.860 --> 00:34:54.539
So this is really, this is really powerful.
00:34:54.699 --> 00:34:55.819
Thank you so much for sharing that.
00:34:55.900 --> 00:35:00.539
So you've mentioned that you work with individuals, coaches, teams, organizations, and all that.
00:35:00.619 --> 00:35:03.019
And you also have a book, The Enneagram and Your Marriage.
00:35:03.179 --> 00:35:03.500
I do.
00:35:03.659 --> 00:35:03.739
Yes.
00:35:04.860 --> 00:35:05.819
Yeah, I have a couple out.
00:35:05.900 --> 00:35:06.059
Yeah.
00:35:06.299 --> 00:35:07.420
The Enneagram and your average.
00:35:07.500 --> 00:35:12.219
I have Enneagram Essentials, which is a card deck that is like if you're like, huh, what is this thing?
00:35:12.299 --> 00:35:13.500
I want to know more about this thing.
00:35:13.659 --> 00:35:17.980
And you like, you like like a Instagram kind of reel, you like that kind of stuff?
00:35:18.219 --> 00:35:23.500
Enneagram essentials is a card deck and it's all nine types and it goes from like basics to deep dive.
00:35:23.659 --> 00:35:26.860
And then I have uh Hearing God Speak, which is a devotional that I wrote.
00:35:27.019 --> 00:35:27.820
That was my first book.
00:35:27.980 --> 00:35:28.380
But yeah.
00:35:28.619 --> 00:35:29.099
That's awesome.
00:35:29.179 --> 00:35:29.420
Yeah.
00:35:29.500 --> 00:35:35.579
So I'm gonna put links to all of Jackie's books and stuff in the show notes so you can check it out, everyone.
00:35:35.659 --> 00:35:39.980
Okay, so what are the offerings do you have at this time and how can people find you and work with you?
00:35:40.219 --> 00:35:42.699
I do um individual coaching over Zoom.
00:35:42.780 --> 00:35:44.619
So I see clients from all over the world.
00:35:44.780 --> 00:35:52.860
And so uh if you are like, I want to learn more about this and you're interested in doing some coaching, I would be happy to have a conversation with you about that.
00:35:52.940 --> 00:35:58.780
Um and you guys can you can find me on Instagram, Enneagram with JB, you can DM me there, and we can get it moving that way.
00:35:59.019 --> 00:36:02.380
Like my I think my um email is linked to that as well.
00:36:02.539 --> 00:36:07.019
And so um my assistant will help you get plugged in if that's what you want to do.
00:36:07.260 --> 00:36:08.380
I do work with teams.
00:36:08.539 --> 00:36:15.420
I come in and I do speaking engagements and um and team building exercises, whether it's one day or a couple days, things like that.
00:36:15.659 --> 00:36:16.780
Thank you so much, Jackie.
00:36:16.860 --> 00:36:17.820
This has been amazing.
00:36:18.139 --> 00:36:18.940
Thanks for having me.
00:36:19.099 --> 00:36:19.740
This has been great.
00:36:19.980 --> 00:36:22.860
It's been so great to meet you and all this wonderful insights.
00:36:23.340 --> 00:36:23.980
Appreciate it.
00:36:24.380 --> 00:36:24.940
Thank you.
