The Transformative Power of Suffering: Self-Growth, Finding Purpose & Navigating Life | Terry Tucker

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And you look at him, you're like, "I know you could kill me with the eraser of a pencil,
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15 different ways."
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And the seals kind of have this, they call it the 40% rule, which basically says that if
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you're done, if you're at the end of your row, if you can't go on, that you're only
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at 40% of your maximum, and you still have another 60% left in reserve to give to yourself.
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40%, I'm not even, I'm not even in half of my capability, but it's our brains that
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tell us, "Hey, this hurts.
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It's uncultible, knock it off, and we listen to our brains."
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But the only way you're going to grow.
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Welcome to the Quantum Theory Podcast.
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Today we are joined by Terry Tucker, a former D1 college basketball player, police officer,
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squat hostage negotiator, and cancer warrior.
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He's now an acclaimed author and speaker on topics such as personal excellence and purpose,
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with his most recent book being Sustainable Excellence, which will be a large focus of
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today's conversation.
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But without further ado, Terry, thank you so much for coming on the podcast today.
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Well, Jared, thanks for having me on, I'm really looking forward to talking with you today.
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Awesome, likewise.
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So I love the kick things off, speaking of excellence.
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One of the things that really caught my eye and it kind of start off a little abstract here
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and to get some ideas on some kind of basic principles.
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One of the things that was really interesting was you compared excellence to beauty and the
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sense that it is relative, similar to beauty being that of the eye of the beholder.
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And I thought that was interesting because I think the common connotation of excellence
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is a very hard line benchmark and standard that we all kind of feel is this kind of rigid.
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So I'd kind of lay some fundamentals here.
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Kind of get to the bottom of the nature of purpose and it's kind of relative property if you
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will.
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Sure.
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So you know, you read book called Sustainable Excellence and people will, you know, ask you
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what excellence means and you're like, well, I don't know.
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It's like, what do you mean?
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Road to play?
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How could you not?
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How could you not know what an excellence is?
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But to me, excellence is in the eye of the beholder.
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You and I may look at a sports team or a piece of music or a piece of art or something
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like that and you may say, man, I think that's excellent.
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And I may look at it and say, yeah, I think it's good, but I just don't think it's excellent.
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So I think we, we have to decide for ourselves what excellence means.
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And that kind of leads us to what is our purpose in life.
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And I, you know, we all have a different purpose.
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We all have a different calling, I guess, a, a Y mission, whatever you want to, you want
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to, however you want to define it.
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But so many people I think never, ever think about what it means to be great at something
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purposeful in life.
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We just kind of muddle through and I'll give you a quick story.
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There's a, there's an entrepreneur by the name of Ed Mylett.
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And in 2023, USA Today, Joe's is the author of the year.
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You know it.
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Okay.
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Yeah.
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And he talks about the four types of people in the world.
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And when I first heard him say this, I'm like, all right, I don't know if this is true.
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I don't know if I believe this.
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Let me think about it.
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But let me just tell you what he talks about.
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So the first group are the unmotivated.
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And he said, that's the vast majority of people you will encounter in your life.
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The second group he talks about are the motivated where it's kind of a carrot and stick approach
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to life.
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If I do this, I will get that.
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He says this kind of low level works for a lot of people that have very happy and successful
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light.
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The third group he talks about are the inspirational people, the word inspiration coming from two
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words in spirit.
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So if you're an inspirational person, you move people with your energy.
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And then the last group he talks about are the aspirational people where people aspire to
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be like you.
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That's a given a talk or something like that.
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And depending on the audience, I'll tell that story.
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I'll be like, I show a hand.
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How many people are unmotivated?
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And nobody ever raises their hand.
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Right.
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It feels like all of that category.
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But I think so many people do, which then leads to people that if you have just a little bit
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of grit, it's amazing what you can do with your life.
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Wow.
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I love that.
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Yes.
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And I am familiar with Ed Mylet and his whole max out mantra.
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I love all of his work as well.
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You know, it's super applicable.
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And I think kind of segueing on the idea of purpose.
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You know, one of the things that I recall you mentioning the book as well is living by
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purpose and not living by job or by career.
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And you know, one of the things I think that's so challenging is, you know, really figuring
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out a way to structure our lives around purpose.
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So let's say that, you know, we do understand that, you know, this certain thing, helping other
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people in this one way is really our calling.
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But I think there's so many challenges that come up along the way like paying the bills
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and staying financially afloat and so many, you know, taking care of the family and, you
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know, I'd love to get some insight on how you kind of maybe have even suggestions or insights
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or even words of wisdom for how people can, you know, surmount those challenges and really
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create a life by design in that way.
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Sure.
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So I guess, let me go back just for a second and talk about, I think a lot of times we'd
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look at purpose as a singular thing.
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There's one thing I'm supposed to do.
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And I can't speak for anybody else, but I can speak for myself.
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For me, that word is "pen plural."
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It's been "purposes."
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I think when I was younger, my purpose was to be an athlete.
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I played college basketball.
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And then as I got to be an adult, I always felt my purpose was to be in law enforcement.
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I had other jobs, but I always felt my purpose was law enforcement.
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And now, in all honesty, as I'm probably coming towards the end of my life, I think my purpose
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has shifted again to put as much goodness, positivity, motivation, love back into the world
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with whatever time I have left.
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So how do you find your purpose?
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I think you look at what your unique gifts and talents are.
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We all have, I mean, if you told me Terry, you're going to be an accountant and you're going
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to work with numbers, Jared, I would fail miserably.
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And I would probably be miserable at that job.
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That's not my forte.
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That's not what I work at.
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Or that's something I'm good at.
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So I would suggest people find what they're good at.
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And the other thing I'll say is this, we're not successful in a vacuum.
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Nobody does this by themselves.
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I would suggest if, if nobody remembers anything else I say for this entire podcast, remember
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this.
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This I think is incredibly important.
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It's more important who you work with and who you work for than it is the work that
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you do.
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Find people that care about you, find people that are willing to invest in you, find people
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that want to see you succeed, hit your wagon to those people and climb your mountains together.
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So find like-minded people.
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If you're hanging around smart people, you're going to be smarter.
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If you're hanging around wealthy people, you're going to be wealthier.
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Conversely, if you're hanging around people with drama and it's all about them, that's
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what you're going to end up being.
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And good people emulate what they're doing.
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Use your unique gifts and talents and I think you're well on your way to finding your purpose.
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Hmm.
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So bridging that, you know, given that we're kind of starting from a foundation of unique
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gifts and talents, do you think that we are somewhat endowed with certain gifts that
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are- we're supposed to discover which is our purpose?
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Do you think that those gifts that we have is kind of even one and the same with our
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purpose and it's kind of our even job to discern how we can even use those towards- towards
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a positive benefit because it sounds like really the foundation is what you are kind
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of naturally gifted with, if you will.
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I would absolutely agree with that statement.
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I think if you look at somebody like Victor Frankl who wrote man search, remaining was a Holocaust
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survivor during World War II, he talks about how we should not look at our life in the
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abstract that every one of us has a purpose, has a reason that we were put on the face of
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this earth and almost goes so far as to say we have a moral obligation to find that purpose
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in life and to live it.
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So I would absolutely say, you know, we're just- you're just not here kind of skipping
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around, you know, and seeing how it goes.
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But the other thing I'll say about that is this and I heard this story, Jesse Itzler, I
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don't know if he still is, but he was.
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He's an entrepreneur at one point in his own part of the Atlanta Hawks and the National
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Basketball Association.
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And he's married to a woman by the name of Sarah Blakely and Sarah Blakely started a woman's
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undergarment company called Spacks and tells the story.
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He said when she started that company, she had one prototype and $5,000.
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She had been a door to door facsimile salesman, a fac salesperson.
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We use facs as any more.
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That's how I'm going to go that was.
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But his point was she really didn't know anything about marketing, about human resources,
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about legal, about manufacturing, about distribution.
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But his comment was, if she would have waited until she understood every single thing along
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that journey, he said I guarantee you somebody else would have come up with that idea and
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would have run with it.
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So his point was wherever you are in trying to figure out your purpose, don't hold back
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and say, oh, you know, when I get this or when I understand that, then I'll do it.
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Jump in right now and figure it out as you go along.
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I love that.
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Yeah, it's the kind of the old adage that the conditions will never be perfect.
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And it's the journey itself, which is the gift.
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That is the process of what creates you into that person.
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And that gets to a point that you mentioned in the sense that suffering is one of life's
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greatest teachers.
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And on that path, there will invariably be a lot of suffering.
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As you don't know, legal and accounting and building these types of partnerships and you
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know that you're going to lose a bunch of money probably several times.
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You might even get closer, actually go out of business and have to try again, right?
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And in that journey is such immense suffering.
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But as you mentioned, it's one of life's greatest teachers.
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And I think that's even a perennial philosophy, even look at Buddhism.
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Their whole thing is, you know, life is essentially suffering, not in like a morbid way, but
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you know, in a constructive way.
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And I want to quote you from the book here, because I really felt that this was profound.
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You said, quote, I lost 50 pounds during my interferon therapy.
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I was always nauseous, fatigued and chilled.
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My ability to taste food diminished and my body continually ate.
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This misery went on for 1,660 days.
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Wow.
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And I'm sure you can track the number of days because each one was that distinctly
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challenging.
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And obviously that is a magnitude of suffering that most including myself can't even wrap
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her heads around.
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But I would love to just to hear your perspective given that background and what you've
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surmounted, what you gained out of suffering through such intense trials and tribulations.
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Sure.
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So 2012, I was diagnosed with this very rare form of cancer, rare form of melanoma and
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was told one appeared on the bottom of my foot.
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And they removed the part in my foot and they all removed all my left nose.
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And then my doctor said, you'll probably be dead in two years because we have nothing
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to offer you other than surgery.
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If it's somewhere we can cut it out, cut it out.
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If it's not, well, sorry, there's nothing we can do for it.
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So in the interim, she put me on this drug called interferon.
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And I took a weekly interferon injection and it gave me terrible flu-like symptoms for
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two to three days every week after each injection.
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And during that time, I literally, I was so sick of being sick that I prayed to die.
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It was like, okay, God, I kind of felt there were two camps.
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There was the living and there was the not dying.
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And I was definitely in the not dying.
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I was really living.
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I was just not dying.
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I wasn't contributing to my family or at least I didn't feel I was.
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I wasn't contributing to my friends.
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Sometimes a good day was literally, I'm going to get out of bed and I'm going to make
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it to the sofa.
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That's a good day.
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And you think about that.
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That's really not living.
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And so I have a very strong faith in God.
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So it was like, okay, God, just take me down.
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Let me die.
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Let my family get on with their life.
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But God didn't do that for me, Jared.
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But He did give me the strength to continue to go on day after day after day.
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And today, I believe my purpose going kind of back to what we're talking about.
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I believe my purpose is to use my infirmity, to use my malignancy to show people God's love,
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his mercy, his kindness, his peace, his healing.
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That's what I'm here for.
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I should have died a long time, several times during this journey.
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And I did.
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And I think he's using me at this point.
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As far as I'm concerned, I don't care when I die, I don't care how I die.
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What I care about is am I doing my purpose right now.
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Wow.
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Wow.
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And I definitely resonate with what I call seeing in retrospect.
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It's seeing how things from the past create this, I guess, connection to what your future
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trajectory is.
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And how should we use those things and transmute those experiences to give back as gifts to
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others?
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And that's kind of connected to suffering.
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It's you are sort of gaining something to experience which you can then go give back to others.
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And I love the aspect of your thought process around God really being really involved in
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that situation.
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And I think one of the things that you talked about as well, even when you're going to go
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quit your basketball team and you got that letter from your dad, I mean, literally on
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the way to quit and you said you never got the letter from him before ever.
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And on the walk there, you stopped by and got it and just completely altered the course
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of your life.
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You know, I'm curious to hear your thoughts and I feel like I might know somewhat of the
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answer, but how involved do you think that God or creator, however you want to conceptualize
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that creator or that force?
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How intimately involved do you think that God is in our lives in that way?
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I mean, for me, I think he's very involved.
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I think he wants to be as involved as a showleta.
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You know, I mean, we always think we've got a search for God.
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I don't think you have a search for him.
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I think he's already here.
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You just got one of him.
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You know, it's kind of like that.
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Right.
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No, it's like, hey, I'm here.
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We let that in.
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And so, yeah, I think it was really divine intervention.
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I mean, I was going to give up a full college scholarship and go home with no plan, no
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nothing.
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I never quit anything in my life.
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I was going to quit this and then I get this seven page letter, handwritten letter from my
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father that basically said, I love you.
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I am proud of you, but pull your head out of your butt is basically what he said to me.
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You know, you can do this.
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I was homesick when I went into the army, you know, back in the 1950s and things like that.
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Everybody's been through this.
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You're not unique.
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You are so in your head right now that you think the whole world revolves around you.
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It doesn't.
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He said, he didn't tell me.
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He said, you called home seven times since you've been at college and now one, since you
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are asked, how are my brothers doing?
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How's my mom doing?
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How my grandparents doing?
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How's my girlfriend doing?
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You've never asked anything.
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You are so into you.
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So that was really the first time that I kind of felt that God was like, yeah, hey, I put
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this out there and then I turn this into my book.
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You know, it's like, I never expected to write a book to you.
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Never wanted to write a book.
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There's kind of an old joke that says, but we talk to God.
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It's called prayer.
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When God talks to us, it's called schizophrenia.
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So God loves that.
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You know, but I think as I said, what God did with the book is he put enough people in
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my path that said, Terry, you should write a book.
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Terry, you should write a book.
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Terry, you should write a book.
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And I think I'm older now, wiser, more understanding that when these things happen, it's God's way
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of saying, what?
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I want you to do this.
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You're free, well, you can say no, you know what?
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I don't want to write a book.
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I don't want to do that.
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I'm going to quit college.
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I'm going to do whatever I want.
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I'm telling you what I'd like you to do.
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Will you do that for me?
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So, you know, it's happened more than once in my life and the older I get, the more I
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pay attention to it.
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Absolutely.
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And I think really, you know, these messages, I think you've even said this in the book as
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well, you they come as whispers, right?
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Not as these calamities and shouts, right?
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It's only in those moments of stillness and where you're really receptive and open to
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that is where you can then really get that insight or get that guidance, would be aware
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of even what's being what's being shown to you.
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So no, I totally, I totally resonate with that.
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And I think one thing you mentioned too is about the idea of being so self centered and
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that state you're in.
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And one thing in the book, you mentioned is the importance of being part of something
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bigger than yourself.
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Now, you need to quote you as well before I move on to the point, as you said, quote, "And
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true love is sacrificing self for others and is the most important thing in the world."
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And the idea of that we are here as a collective and it's about not just the self.
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And would you even say that purpose is inexorably connected to the broader whole or being part
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of something?
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Can you have purpose uneven individual level or is it de facto something of service
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to a broader whole of that makes sense?
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It does make sense.
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And I, yes, I think it is.
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I am of the generation who kind of grew up with Fred Rogers, Mr. Rogers, Mr. Rogers,
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and I never heard.
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Yeah.
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And there's a great story about Fred Rogers when he died.
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I mean, he educated so many young people on public television, including me when I was
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grown up.
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And when he died in 2003, his family was going through his effects and they found his wallet.
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And inside his wallet was a scrap piece of paper, which Mr. Rogers had written four simple
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words.
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And those words were life is for service.
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I think that is so important.
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That's what life is about.
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There's a great, there's a great, I'll call it a fable.
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I don't think it actually happened.
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But it's a great fable about Alexander the great, about how probably the biggest conqueror,
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the biggest megalomaniac in the world of all times was die.
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And he calls his counselors together and he says, hey, I want you to carry out my final
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through with wishes.
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He said, my first wish is I want only my doctors to carry my coffin to the great.
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My second wish is I want the road to the cemetery paved with gold and silver and precious stones.
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And my third wish is that my hands be hanging out of my coffin.
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And one of his counselors stepped up and said, excuse me, you're Alexander the great.
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You're the most powerful man in the known world.
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Those don't seem like really big grandiose wishes.
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Why did you come up with these wishes?
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He said, well, number one, I want my doctors to carry my coffin to the great because I
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want people to understand that no doctor heals anybody.
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They just help the body to heal itself.
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So people should pay attention to how they're treating their body, what they're putting
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in it, even their mind.
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You know, the mind is part of what are you putting in?
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You putting good food in your body.
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You get good stuff out.
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You put good stuff in your mind.
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You get good stuff out.
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He said, my second wish is that I spent my entire life conquering people, getting money,
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power, importance, influence.
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And yet none of that is going with me beyond the grave.
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And then he said, the third part of my hands hanging out of my coffin is I want people
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to understand that I came into this world empty handed and I leave it the same way.
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So Jared, I would say life is not about what you can get.
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It's about what you can give in your life with your unique gifts and talents.
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And that's an incredible story and analogy.
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It's unfortunate that it takes many people to get to the very, very, very end of the line
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to then realize that their efforts were an entirely futile because it does no bearing on
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the hereafter or it was just a purely selfish, you know, many, many cases material pursuit.
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And I think the sooner people can snap out of it and enter a purpose driven type of path
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is is where that course is completely altered.
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We don't end up like Alexander the great sitting there saying, well, I just wasted eight
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or nine decades, you know, or however long you lived in my life.
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That was pointless, right?
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And even back to a little bit, would you even say that sort of the equation of purpose is
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how you can use your gifts to positively affect others?
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Could it be to set the still down that simply?
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I honestly think it can't.
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And I know I've seen this and I bet you have to in your life that so many people out there
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kind of feel that they're born empty and that when they get out of school and get into
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life, whatever that looks like from them, that they feel their job then is to fill up that
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empty cell.
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I've got to make the one who drive the nicest car, living the nicest house, you know, have
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all the latest gadgets and gizmos.
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And honestly, Jared, what I found is it's just the opposite.
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We're not born empty.
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We're born full with whatever we need to be successful.
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However, you define that word in your life already inside us.
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We just need to find it, pull it out and use it for our benefit.
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So our job in life should not be to fill ourselves out.
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Our job in life should be to empty ourselves out.
400
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Certainly, you know, with our unique gifts and tout, certainly for our benefit, but also
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for the benefit of our families, of our friends and of our communities.
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00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:47,920
And when you make that paradigm shift in your life, especially in today's society where,
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you know, all kinds of advertisements are telling you, you know, if you have this car, if you drink
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00:22:51,800 --> 00:22:56,280
this drinker, if you eat this food, you're going to be important, special, influential,
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whatever.
406
00:22:57,280 --> 00:22:58,880
None of that matters.
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None of that matters.
408
00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:04,400
You look at the greatest person in the world who I think is Jesus Christ.
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It was all about giving.
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He was poor.
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He didn't have a lot of things.
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But yet, he was the ultimate as far as I'm concerned.
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He made this.
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He made all of us.
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And he's saying, love each other, care for each other.
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And you mentioned it.
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00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:20,240
You know, we talk, guys don't talk about love.
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You know, it's not right.
419
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We don't talk about love.
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But I'm not talking about romantic love.
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I'm talking about love in willing the good of the other.
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00:23:29,360 --> 00:23:31,080
Jared, I want what's best for you.
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00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:35,760
I want what you think is best for you and what God thinks is best for you.
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That's what love is all about.
425
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,400
And how often do we ever do that?
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Right.
427
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No, 100% and that kind of gets my physics mind fired up.
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Other side of my platform because love is one of the highest frequency emotional states
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that we have.
430
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:56,760
If you're familiar with any of that type of research in terms of that realm, but it connects
431
00:23:56,760 --> 00:23:59,760
directly, I think our core essence is love.
432
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And when you operate from that space, that's really the true nature.
433
00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:06,040
Everything else is a lack.
434
00:24:06,040 --> 00:24:07,440
You don't have this.
435
00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:08,440
You don't have that.
436
00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:10,160
You're not good enough for this.
437
00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,440
And that's the consumer, as you were just saying, the consumer culture, it's everything
438
00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:20,920
is outside of you versus you being entirely full and just overflowing in a sense of service.
439
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:25,360
So I fully, I fully agree where you're coming from with that.
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And one of the things I think would be useful to even discuss too, just for maybe even like
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00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:32,840
the young men and women out there listening and trying to find their purpose.
442
00:24:32,840 --> 00:24:37,480
And they definitely have a similar challenge on many people to what you experience, which
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is when you are getting out of college and going into the work world, you want to be
444
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a police officer.
445
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You knew it your bones.
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00:24:44,760 --> 00:24:51,640
It was unquestionable, but it's so hard to overcome that parental, even potentially
447
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father figure sort of control or even just knowing that they want what's best for you
448
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and that they love you.
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And who am I?
450
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To just completely side swipe that, but you know something's there.
451
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What kind of advice would you give to even the younger folks about how to kind of navigate
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those waters and there's a conflict between what they know in their heart versus kind of
453
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,480
what the top down pressure against that kind of passion is?
454
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:19,480
Sure.
455
00:25:19,480 --> 00:25:22,960
So for people that don't really kind of understand my story.
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00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:26,200
If you look at my resume, it kind of looks like a super ball went off in the room.
457
00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:28,560
You know, it's just got a whole lot of watch.
458
00:25:28,560 --> 00:25:30,280
But there is a backstory.
459
00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:33,320
If you understand the backstory, the resume makes more sense.
460
00:25:33,320 --> 00:25:38,400
My grandfather, my paternal grandfather, my dad's dad was a Chicago police officer from
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00:25:38,400 --> 00:25:41,240
1924 to 1954.
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And in 1933, when my dad was one year old, my grandfather was shot in the line of duty with
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his own guns, not a serious injury, but shot in the ankle.
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00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:55,080
But my dad always remembered the story is growing up that my grandmother told of that knock
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on the door of Mrs. Tucker Grab your son come with us, your husband spent shot.
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00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:03,920
So you can imagine when I expressed an interest in sort of following in my grandfather's footsteps,
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00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,520
my dad was absolutely, you're going to college, you're going to major in business, you're
468
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:11,120
going to get out, you're going to get a great job, get married, have 2.4 kids and live happily
469
00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:12,120
or after.
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Right.
471
00:26:13,120 --> 00:26:15,400
That's the life my father wanted me to live.
472
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:19,080
That's not the life I felt I was supposed to live.
473
00:26:19,080 --> 00:26:25,920
And I guess what I would say to young people today and I am so proud that I did this in
474
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:30,200
my life is never let your dream die.
475
00:26:30,200 --> 00:26:33,680
When I mentioned when I graduated from college, my father was dying of cancer.
476
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:34,680
So I had a choice.
477
00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:36,200
I could have said, "Hey dad, know your dying.
478
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:37,200
Sorry about that.
479
00:26:37,200 --> 00:26:39,840
I'm going to go blaze my own trail."
480
00:26:39,840 --> 00:26:44,800
Or out of love and respect for you, I will do what you want me to do.
481
00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:48,560
So I had my first two jobs in business because that's what my dad wanted me to do.
482
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,320
And I started to judge her and I did whatever good son did away until my dad passed away and
483
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:53,960
I followed my own dreams.
484
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:58,560
But I am so proud that I never settled for what I was supposed to do.
485
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:00,000
I knew I was supposed to do this.
486
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:04,200
I didn't know when I was going to do it, but I knew at some point in time I was going to
487
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:05,360
do it.
488
00:27:05,360 --> 00:27:07,200
And I did it when I was 37 years old.
489
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:11,840
And 37 years old is pretty old to be getting into law enforcement to get into that kind
490
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,160
of work.
491
00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:14,160
It's incredible.
492
00:27:14,160 --> 00:27:17,080
You just hung on to that for so long.
493
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:19,960
And I think that's just a testament to what purpose is.
494
00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:22,080
It's almost inescapable to an extent.
495
00:27:22,080 --> 00:27:25,240
You may not have never act on it, but it'll always be there.
496
00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:28,680
And I think that's almost a feature of purpose.
497
00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:30,200
It's almost a signal.
498
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:34,680
If you've been decades down the road and you can't let something go, you need to pay attention
499
00:27:34,680 --> 00:27:35,680
to that.
500
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:36,680
And you got to investigate that.
501
00:27:36,680 --> 00:27:38,680
And you're new.
502
00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,800
So you're a certain case, even those that are less certain.
503
00:27:41,800 --> 00:27:46,080
It's listen to that just constant chirping like, "Hey, I love this.
504
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:47,080
Really love to do this.
505
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:48,080
Really can help people with this.
506
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:49,880
Really inspired by this."
507
00:27:49,880 --> 00:27:53,680
And it's just something you constantly kind of come back to here and there.
508
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:57,680
I think it's just more encouraging for people to kind of take heed from that and kind
509
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:02,680
of see some texture to what that kind of looks like in their life.
510
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:03,680
Yeah.
511
00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:10,720
I mean, like you said, my dad didn't do that for me or to me because he didn't like me.
512
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:12,920
I mean, my dad was my hero.
513
00:28:12,920 --> 00:28:16,520
He died when he was in his 50s right after I graduated from college.
514
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:18,000
And it killed me.
515
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:23,080
But he did this because he wanted what he believed was something better.
516
00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:27,480
So if you're out there and you've got those parents or those aunts and uncles or brothers
517
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,000
or sisters or whatever, you should do this.
518
00:28:31,000 --> 00:28:36,120
I guess I would look at them and say, "What makes you say that?"
519
00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:38,680
And see what they're actually.
520
00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:39,760
They don't live in your body.
521
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:41,600
They don't know the thoughts in your mind.
522
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:42,600
They don't know the talents.
523
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:43,840
Well, some of them do, I guess.
524
00:28:43,840 --> 00:28:50,000
You know, the talents that you have and it's hard for people you love that are older, that
525
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:53,080
want your best interests in mind to kind of go against them.
526
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:58,920
But if that's what you believe is in your heart, is in your soul, I would tell you to pursue
527
00:28:58,920 --> 00:28:59,920
it.
528
00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:02,840
You know, maybe not today and maybe not tomorrow, maybe not even in the month.
529
00:29:02,840 --> 00:29:05,720
But at some point, don't let the dream die.
530
00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:07,320
That's why you're here.
531
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,960
I would hate to get up in front of my creator at the end of my life and say, "Yeah, you
532
00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,680
gave me these unique gifts and talents and I felt that tug in my heart that said I should
533
00:29:14,680 --> 00:29:17,640
do this and I ignored.
534
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:21,480
I can't imagine standing in front of my creator and saying that."
535
00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:29,840
We are irreplicable and each unique and will never be in the same exact form ever again.
536
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:34,040
We are one of one like a snowflake, literally.
537
00:29:34,040 --> 00:29:37,560
And it's to disregard that.
538
00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:42,360
You are literally an embodiment of the creator.
539
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:46,520
And that's, I kind of go back to physics a little bit because the holographic principle
540
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:48,520
and we are a fractals.
541
00:29:48,520 --> 00:29:53,160
We have all the attributes of the creator because we're kind of a piece of that.
542
00:29:53,160 --> 00:30:01,080
And so we have these endowed gifts and it's the biggest travesty to completely sideswiped
543
00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:07,480
those and opt for a life of just the basics or as Edmai Lett said, that the unmotive
544
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:14,120
created or even maybe motivated at best and when the potential is just so massive because
545
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:18,760
the real potential in your life comes from a result of acting on purpose because that's
546
00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:20,920
the path I believe that's laid out for you.
547
00:30:20,920 --> 00:30:25,240
Your real path is the one where you follow the purpose and that's where the goal on the
548
00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:30,640
other side of the tunnel is in every type of category, monetary, spiritual, relationship,
549
00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:31,800
wise, all of that.
550
00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:35,680
And I think that free will, I think you touched on this as well.
551
00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:41,240
It's not that there's just this infinite choice but it's that there are different versions
552
00:30:41,240 --> 00:30:45,720
that we can choose and each decision brings new possibilities and new decisions.
553
00:30:45,720 --> 00:30:51,520
And I think our free will is, are we going to recognize those things and then take action
554
00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:54,960
on those because that's really where the prize is.
555
00:30:54,960 --> 00:30:59,160
Or are we going to opt for just these lower levels of existence?
556
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:03,680
Yeah, I mean, small minds and weak people.
557
00:31:03,680 --> 00:31:06,640
I think kill big dreams.
558
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:12,040
You know, going back to people you don't ever think about what it needs to be great at something
559
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:13,800
purposeful in their life.
560
00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:16,440
Well, a lot of times I talk to young people.
561
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:19,400
It's like, whatever you're thinking, think bigger.
562
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:20,400
Think bigger.
563
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:21,400
Think bigger.
564
00:31:21,400 --> 00:31:26,680
You know, I mean, we like to say, okay, this is good and it's comfortable.
565
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:28,120
And so I'm good with it.
566
00:31:28,120 --> 00:31:31,040
But if you thought bigger, oh yeah, that's kind of scary.
567
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:35,160
But I'll tell you right now at the end of your life, if there is something in your heart,
568
00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:39,960
something in your soul, if you believe you're supposed to do, but it scares you, I'm going
569
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:43,160
to sit here and tell you, go ahead and do it.
570
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:46,960
Because at the end of your life, the things you're going to regret are not going to be those
571
00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:48,360
things you did.
572
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:50,600
They're going to be those things you didn't do.
573
00:31:50,600 --> 00:31:53,640
And by then it's going to be too late to go back and do it.
574
00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:55,640
100% well said.
575
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,600
I'd love to kind of now, you know, shift gears a little bit.
576
00:31:58,600 --> 00:32:02,280
Because I know you've been just straight into the philosophy, which I love.
577
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:07,280
I'd love this to get, you know, a little bit of kind of a narrative from your end about
578
00:32:07,280 --> 00:32:09,240
kind of because we touched on the police force.
579
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:13,440
I want to give people a little better idea on, you know, you came back around to that
580
00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:14,440
purpose.
581
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:18,400
You know, what did that process look like of, you know, entering that path that you
582
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:24,080
had put on, put off, excuse me for so long and kind of what was that process like?
583
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:25,080
Sure.
584
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:31,600
Number one, I took a whole lot more tile and all on the police academy than my younger counterparts.
585
00:32:31,600 --> 00:32:36,880
So my wife and I were living in California and then this is kind of how it started and we
586
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,840
were living in Santa Barbara and I got a, there was a circular that came in the mail for Santa
587
00:32:40,840 --> 00:32:42,240
Barbara City College.
588
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,160
And Jared, I never looked at those sticks.
589
00:32:44,160 --> 00:32:45,440
They always went in the recycling.
590
00:32:45,440 --> 00:32:46,440
Right.
591
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:47,440
I'd lunch one day.
592
00:32:47,440 --> 00:32:48,480
I'm sitting, I'm kind of leaving through it.
593
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:52,240
And there's a class and the class is like, you pass the class and you can apply to be a
594
00:32:52,240 --> 00:32:56,480
reserve police officer with any agency within the state.
595
00:32:56,480 --> 00:33:00,480
So I, I'm sitting at dinner with my wife one that night and I'm like, hey, what do you think
596
00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:01,800
about this class?
597
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:02,800
So what do you think about?
598
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:06,880
I said, I'd like to take, I'd like to try and see if I can pass it and see where we go
599
00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:07,880
from there.
600
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:08,880
She said, what are they going to do?
601
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:09,880
You know, I will support you.
602
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:10,880
Absolutely.
603
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:11,880
Go do that.
604
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:12,880
So was a night class.
605
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:16,840
I was a customer service manager at the time for an academic, academic publishing company.
606
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:18,360
Well, I passed the class.
607
00:33:18,360 --> 00:33:22,680
I applied to Santa Barbara PD and they took, so I was a reserve police officer.
608
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:25,320
I'd worked my customer service job all week.
609
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:29,880
Fronnie and I would come home and I would put on my uniform and I'd go to roll call and
610
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:32,760
I'd work from seven and at nine till seven in the morning.
611
00:33:32,760 --> 00:33:34,720
And my wife tells the story better than I do.
612
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:39,320
She said, you would come in Saturday morning, exhausted because I hadn't slept in well over
613
00:33:39,320 --> 00:33:40,320
24 hours.
614
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:41,320
Geez.
615
00:33:41,320 --> 00:33:43,760
With this big smile on your face.
616
00:33:43,760 --> 00:33:48,080
And she said, I knew that that was what you were supposed to do.
617
00:33:48,080 --> 00:33:49,880
And shortly after that, our daughter was born.
618
00:33:49,880 --> 00:33:54,960
We moved to Cincinnati, Ohio and I said to her again, I said, look, I want to do this full
619
00:33:54,960 --> 00:33:55,960
time.
620
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:56,960
I want to go to the police academy.
621
00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,000
I want to, you know, be a sworn officer and all that.
622
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,920
Well, you support me.
623
00:34:01,920 --> 00:34:02,920
Absolutely.
624
00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:03,920
Go ahead and do it.
625
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:07,440
And that started, you know, I mean, I was an undercover drug cop.
626
00:34:07,440 --> 00:34:09,120
I was on the SWAT team.
627
00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:13,920
It was, I couldn't get enough of this is what I was supposed to do.
628
00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:15,720
And it had been 37 years.
629
00:34:15,720 --> 00:34:17,600
And now I'm finally getting this opportunity to do it.
630
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:18,600
I'm so excited.
631
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:20,080
I was like a kidney candy store.
632
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:21,080
Right.
633
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:27,720
What's the support of my family that really grounded me, that allowed me to do that?
634
00:34:27,720 --> 00:34:30,800
And you know, there were a lot of times it's like, come on, we're going out to the bar after,
635
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,040
you know, a shift or after a SWAT call.
636
00:34:33,040 --> 00:34:35,040
It's like, no, I love you guys.
637
00:34:35,040 --> 00:34:38,880
I would lay down my life for you, but I'm going home.
638
00:34:38,880 --> 00:34:40,640
Because that was my sanctuary.
639
00:34:40,640 --> 00:34:43,440
That was where I recharged the batteries.
640
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:45,480
Those are the people that love me unconditionally.
641
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:48,280
So that answers your question, but that's kind of it.
642
00:34:48,280 --> 00:34:49,280
It does.
643
00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:50,280
No, absolutely.
644
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,600
And I think that's a great segue as well.
645
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:58,480
And how important the people around you are when it comes to being able to enact your
646
00:34:58,480 --> 00:34:59,480
purpose.
647
00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:04,320
There was one actually quote that you said, quote, I would argue that peace, simplicity,
648
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:09,280
and serenity of your life, provide you the fostering backdrop to lead your uncommon and extraordinary
649
00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:10,280
life.
650
00:35:10,280 --> 00:35:14,320
And it's interesting because so many parallels I've found in my own personal journey is,
651
00:35:14,320 --> 00:35:16,520
like the fertile soil, right?
652
00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:21,760
If you have people and your immediate realities, even like your home life who don't believe in
653
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:28,080
you or say, get your regular job or, you know, that, you know, whatever the situation might
654
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:33,640
be, how critical that that support structure is to be able to kind of have all variables
655
00:35:33,640 --> 00:35:34,880
isolated.
656
00:35:34,880 --> 00:35:41,160
So your energy is not being pulled and leaked and down in different directions so you can
657
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,320
really propel forward in that purpose.
658
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:49,160
I'd love to, in this instance, kind of here in your experience, how crucial your partner
659
00:35:49,160 --> 00:35:54,040
is specifically when it comes to being able to step into your purpose.
660
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:59,160
Yeah, for me, and it was, it was absolutely important.
661
00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:02,200
I mean, when we lived in California, we had no family out there.
662
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:03,560
It was just she and I.
663
00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:06,640
And then she got pregnant and we had our daughter.
664
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:11,280
And that was really the impetus to move back to the Midwest because we had no support system
665
00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:13,000
when we were in California.
666
00:36:13,000 --> 00:36:14,920
But she did support me.
667
00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:18,640
I mean, so when I was on SWAT and, you know, sometimes it was hard.
668
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:22,240
I worked the night shift my entire career.
669
00:36:22,240 --> 00:36:24,600
And we would sit down Sunday night.
670
00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:28,080
She'd make a nice meal and your daughter and I would sit down.
671
00:36:28,080 --> 00:36:30,880
And when we were on SWAT, we carried pagers.
672
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:34,160
That's how long ago this was and the pager would go off.
673
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:37,320
And you could just, you could just look in her eyes like seriously.
674
00:36:37,320 --> 00:36:41,440
I would, they'd make this nice meal and you got to go.
675
00:36:41,440 --> 00:36:44,520
Yeah, I kind of do.
676
00:36:44,520 --> 00:36:48,200
You know, it was like with SWAT or when I was in the drug unit.
677
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:49,480
I just didn't sign up for that.
678
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:52,440
It was like, look, this is an opportunity.
679
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:53,600
Will you support me in this?
680
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,880
You understand, you know, this may be a little more dangerous and things like that.
681
00:36:56,880 --> 00:36:58,760
Yes, I will support you.
682
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:04,160
And when it came time for me to get out of law enforcement, it was because she lost her
683
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:08,520
job in Cincinnati and found another one in Houston.
684
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,120
And so it was you supported me through all this.
685
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:15,560
Now it's my turn to support you and say, okay, it's time for us to move on.
686
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:17,320
It's time for me to find something else.
687
00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,920
So our whole life has been about, I will support you.
688
00:37:20,920 --> 00:37:22,600
I will be there for you.
689
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:26,600
And the other thing I will say about this is we have one child, a daughter.
690
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:31,720
And I can tell you, and this probably wasn't really smart, but my family was always number
691
00:37:31,720 --> 00:37:32,720
one.
692
00:37:32,720 --> 00:37:36,440
I love being a cop, but they, you know, my faith, my family and my friends always before
693
00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:38,160
what I did for a living.
694
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:41,800
And there were times where it's like, I'm going to my daughter's piano recital.
695
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:44,240
I'm going to her, you know, third grade play.
696
00:37:44,240 --> 00:37:50,680
I'm even though I'm working nights, I'm going to give up sleep because that's how important
697
00:37:50,680 --> 00:37:52,120
this is to me.
698
00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:55,480
And there were many nights I would go to work, not many, but enough nights that I would go
699
00:37:55,480 --> 00:38:00,720
to work, you know, on four hours of sleep and I'm carrying a gun and I'm making decisions
700
00:38:00,720 --> 00:38:04,600
about what other people's lives might look like and fix like that.
701
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:08,960
So you've got a balance, it's a balancing act.
702
00:38:08,960 --> 00:38:14,680
And without my wife, I would not have been happy being a cop and being married and not have
703
00:38:14,680 --> 00:38:15,680
her support.
704
00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,080
It wouldn't have been fun.
705
00:38:17,080 --> 00:38:22,560
Well, yeah, I think I can absolutely see how critical that is because if the person that's
706
00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:27,240
the closest to you isn't all in, you're not going to get very far.
707
00:38:27,240 --> 00:38:29,200
You know, and it's actually the opposite.
708
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,320
Not only do you get further, you get probably exponentially further.
709
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,320
I think that the sum's greater than its parts in that way when you truly have a partner
710
00:38:36,320 --> 00:38:38,080
that is fully in support of your mission.
711
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:43,360
I think it does something even greater in terms of your fervor towards that mission.
712
00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:47,920
And I think one thing too I wanted to touch on, I think it's important for people to kind
713
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:50,920
of understand is, you know, purpose is messy.
714
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:55,920
I think people expect like this divine light to hit them and say like, this is what you're
715
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:58,480
supposed to do with your life, you know.
716
00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:03,120
And, you know, as you were explaining, I mean, you're 24 hours no sleep.
717
00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:05,920
You're doing the night classes, you know, you're working your job.
718
00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:11,560
You're making all this happen because you're creating a life that can be centered around
719
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:12,560
your purpose.
720
00:39:12,560 --> 00:39:16,760
And I think, you know, it's important for people to understand that it's, it's, it's
721
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:18,320
some, a lot of times not pretty.
722
00:39:18,320 --> 00:39:19,320
It is hard.
723
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,920
You know, it's, it's not going to be some, you know, golden road just, you know, paved
724
00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:23,920
out front of you.
725
00:39:23,920 --> 00:39:27,840
You know, God or the creator is going to, is going to put you in the position and say,
726
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:31,680
hey, here is your pamphlet, you know, as you received to the mail, here you go.
727
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:34,800
And now it's up to you to, to do that work and to make it happen.
728
00:39:34,800 --> 00:39:38,800
So I think it's just kind of understanding, understanding that dynamic if you agree with
729
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:39,800
that statement.
730
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:42,040
Oh, I absolutely what.
731
00:39:42,040 --> 00:39:45,000
And, you know, we, we like to think.
732
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:46,800
And this is so not true.
733
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,480
We like to think that our life is linear.
734
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:54,000
You know, we started a, and we work and we work and we work and we get to see whatever
735
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:55,000
that ends up in.
736
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:56,000
But life isn't linear.
737
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:59,120
I mean, you know, you work hard and then you plateau.
738
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:03,440
And I, and I learned this in basketball early, you know, you work really hard, but then you
739
00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:04,440
like stagnate.
740
00:40:04,440 --> 00:40:07,240
You know, it's like, I'm working my butt off, but I'm not getting any better.
741
00:40:07,240 --> 00:40:08,640
And then you keep working harder.
742
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:09,640
And then you worse.
743
00:40:09,640 --> 00:40:10,640
And you're like, what am I doing?
744
00:40:10,640 --> 00:40:12,480
How can I get that worse?
745
00:40:12,480 --> 00:40:16,120
You know, but then you keep working and maybe you get a little better and then you plateau
746
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:17,480
again and then you get worse.
747
00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:20,520
But the direction is always positive.
748
00:40:20,520 --> 00:40:26,200
It may not always be positive, but you're moving where you're supposed to be.
749
00:40:26,200 --> 00:40:27,640
It's just not a straight line.
750
00:40:27,640 --> 00:40:32,400
It's up, down, up, down, up, down plateau, up, down, up, up, up, plateau, plateau, up,
751
00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:33,400
down.
752
00:40:33,400 --> 00:40:37,680
But as long as you keep working at it, you will eventually get to where you want to
753
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:38,680
be.
754
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:39,680
I think you mentioned that earlier.
755
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:41,720
It's, it's not the destination.
756
00:40:41,720 --> 00:40:45,160
It's everything in between where you start and the destination.
757
00:40:45,160 --> 00:40:47,360
It's really what life is about.
758
00:40:47,360 --> 00:40:48,720
Absolutely.
759
00:40:48,720 --> 00:40:50,840
And that gets one of your key points to as well.
760
00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:56,100
And the book is about this mental toughness and not being so emotionally discouraged by
761
00:40:56,100 --> 00:40:57,100
failure.
762
00:40:57,100 --> 00:41:02,080
And reality failure is just a clue of where of getting closer to the right answer, right?
763
00:41:02,080 --> 00:41:06,500
And it's our perception of that that makes us quit and makes us think we are judged as
764
00:41:06,500 --> 00:41:09,960
losers or perceived in whatever which way.
765
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:12,800
And I love you to as well touch on that was at the Navy CEO.
766
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,040
Like I don't want to misspeak the 6040 rule.
767
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,160
If you don't mind jumping in on that.
768
00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:18,160
Sure.
769
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:19,160
That's not a rule.
770
00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:24,520
So there's a young man who works with my wife as a former Navy CEO and he will contact me
771
00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:26,760
on my off week's of treatment just to check up on me.
772
00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:27,760
Hey, how's it going?
773
00:41:27,760 --> 00:41:28,760
Things like that.
774
00:41:28,760 --> 00:41:30,800
And we talk a lot about what it means.
775
00:41:30,800 --> 00:41:35,800
I mean, this guy was in Iraq and Afghanistan and has been decorated for valor and you would
776
00:41:35,800 --> 00:41:36,800
never know it.
777
00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:41,280
He's the most humble, most gracious, most loving human being in the world.
778
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:44,960
And you look at him, you're like, I know you could kill me with the eraser of a pencil
779
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:46,280
15 different ways.
780
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:47,280
You know.
781
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:49,960
He's just he's that kind of a guy.
782
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:56,200
And the seals kind of have this they call it the 40% rule, which basically says that if you're
783
00:41:56,200 --> 00:42:02,040
done, if you're at the end of your row, if you can't go on, that you're only at 40% of
784
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:08,000
your maximum and you still have another 60% left in reserve to give to yourself.
785
00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:09,520
So and we know this is true.
786
00:42:09,520 --> 00:42:11,640
I mean, you think about marathon runners.
787
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:16,600
We know marathon runners kind of hit that wall and they're like, if you can keep going,
788
00:42:16,600 --> 00:42:20,320
if you can just keep putting one foot in front of the other, eventually you'll get that second
789
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:22,880
wind and you'll be able to finish the race.
790
00:42:22,880 --> 00:42:26,840
So you know, it's true this 60, 40, this 40%.
791
00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:33,480
I'm not even I'm not even at half of my capability, but it's our brains that tell us, hey, this
792
00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:34,480
hurts.
793
00:42:34,480 --> 00:42:35,480
It's uncomfortable.
794
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:36,480
Knock it off.
795
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:39,280
And we listen to our brains because it's trying to protect us.
796
00:42:39,280 --> 00:42:42,400
It's that mammalian brain that, you know, don't do anything.
797
00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:45,920
You know, it's like if you got up this morning, Jared said, I'm going to go sky down.
798
00:42:45,920 --> 00:42:47,920
Your brain would have been like, you need a minute, Jared.
799
00:42:47,920 --> 00:42:50,680
We might crash the parachute being on open.
800
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:52,760
No, no, no, you're not doing that.
801
00:42:52,760 --> 00:42:55,160
Very few people get, yeah, go ahead, Jared.
802
00:42:55,160 --> 00:42:56,160
Do that.
803
00:42:56,160 --> 00:43:00,400
It's it's your brain protecting you from all the adverse things that might happen.
804
00:43:00,400 --> 00:43:04,000
And you're like, but the only way you're going to grow is to get into those adverse things
805
00:43:04,000 --> 00:43:05,400
and see what happens.
806
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:06,400
Absolutely.
807
00:43:06,400 --> 00:43:11,100
And this gets maybe a little bit on a philosophical angle, but it's something I'm always interested
808
00:43:11,100 --> 00:43:14,560
in discussing and seeing and hearing people's perspectives.
809
00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,880
You know, because the way you describe that is like we are separate from the mind is that,
810
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:24,840
you know, maybe would you say that we perhaps are a soul in a body and we have dominion over
811
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:29,320
that mind is the way that you position it is that we are not the mind and we can hear
812
00:43:29,320 --> 00:43:32,520
that mammalian brain and say, I'm not listening to you.
813
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:36,200
You're trying to help me survive, but I'm in charge here.
814
00:43:36,200 --> 00:43:39,360
And what's what's who is I in that instance?
815
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:40,360
Yeah.
816
00:43:40,360 --> 00:43:45,480
I mean, I think so many of us think we're a body that has a soul and I agree with you.
817
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:49,680
I think we're a soul that just happens to be in a body.
818
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:54,680
And you know, I've seen so many people in my life and I'm not saying you shouldn't do it.
819
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:56,960
You know, we're going to get enough rest.
820
00:43:56,960 --> 00:43:57,960
We're going to exercise.
821
00:43:57,960 --> 00:43:58,960
We're going to eat right.
822
00:43:58,960 --> 00:44:04,120
We're going to do all these things to protect and to enhance our physical body.
823
00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:05,120
And that's great.
824
00:44:05,120 --> 00:44:06,360
I'm not telling you you shouldn't do that.
825
00:44:06,360 --> 00:44:13,360
So what I am suggesting is maybe every day work on who you really are, which is your heart,
826
00:44:13,360 --> 00:44:15,080
your mind and your soul.
827
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:19,960
We don't spend nearly as much time working on our heart, mind and soul as we do our physical
828
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:25,320
body, but we also know that at some time, you know, the, it's still what do you get for
829
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:26,520
living, loving and laughing?
830
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:27,520
You get death.
831
00:44:27,520 --> 00:44:29,520
That's the ultimate outcome of death.
832
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:31,000
We know this body is going to die.
833
00:44:31,000 --> 00:44:32,000
It's going to decay.
834
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:33,000
It's going to go away.
835
00:44:33,000 --> 00:44:38,280
But your heart, your mind and your soul, those things are eternal, those things live on.
836
00:44:38,280 --> 00:44:41,360
And I just don't think we spend enough time working on them.
837
00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:42,360
So absolutely.
838
00:44:42,360 --> 00:44:49,840
I think we're a conglomerate of a heart, a mind and a soul and a body that houses that.
839
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:50,840
But we think, look at me.
840
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:51,840
I'm going to jump off.
841
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:52,840
You know, I'm going to pop off.
842
00:44:52,840 --> 00:44:53,840
You know, that's great.
843
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:54,840
I get news.
844
00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:55,840
Sorry.
845
00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:56,840
I have 40 years after you're dead.
846
00:44:56,840 --> 00:44:57,840
You ain't going to look that good.
847
00:44:57,840 --> 00:44:58,840
I can promise.
848
00:44:58,840 --> 00:45:00,240
You spend a lot of time working on it.
849
00:45:00,240 --> 00:45:05,680
How much time do you spend working on your mind, working on your spirit, working on your
850
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:08,320
heart and helping other people and things like that?
851
00:45:08,320 --> 00:45:10,880
That to me, that's what life is about.
852
00:45:10,880 --> 00:45:11,880
Don't give me your eye.
853
00:45:11,880 --> 00:45:14,960
I spent a lot of time working on my body, being a college athlete and things like that.
854
00:45:14,960 --> 00:45:15,960
For sure.
855
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:16,960
Getting to that.
856
00:45:16,960 --> 00:45:17,960
And that's important.
857
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:22,160
I'm not saying you should abuse your body, but I'm also saying you should probably find
858
00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:25,720
the balance between your body and your spirit.
859
00:45:25,720 --> 00:45:29,880
I love that distinction, very, very well put.
860
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:34,480
And maybe we could change gears a little bit now because you have, you know, I'm always so
861
00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:39,440
fascinated by people that have lived fascinating experiences and getting their perspective.
862
00:45:39,440 --> 00:45:43,760
So fascinated by perspective and kind of human nature.
863
00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:48,000
And so I'd love to kind of learn maybe firstly, if you want to kind of share with the audience
864
00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:49,880
how you pivoted to SWAT.
865
00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:53,880
And then second, I'll kind of ask my questions from there on.
866
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:57,200
But yeah, if you don't mind, kind of give us kind of the next step in the narrative there.
867
00:45:57,200 --> 00:45:58,200
Sure.
868
00:45:58,200 --> 00:46:03,280
So I was already a police officer in Cincinnati and I always wanted to be the best at whatever
869
00:46:03,280 --> 00:46:04,520
I did in my life.
870
00:46:04,520 --> 00:46:09,760
And SWAT, they're usually the best officers with the best training and the best equipment.
871
00:46:09,760 --> 00:46:14,760
So when there was an opening on the negotiating team and I guess I should back up for saying
872
00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:17,120
SWAT is usually kind of broken down into two groups.
873
00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:20,720
There's the tactical team, the tactical unit and the negotiators.
874
00:46:20,720 --> 00:46:23,600
And we used to joke with the tactical team that if we did our job right, you didn't get
875
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:27,160
to use all the little toys that you have as part team.
876
00:46:27,160 --> 00:46:30,320
But those are the men, women that surround the house that have to go in and things like
877
00:46:30,320 --> 00:46:31,320
that.
878
00:46:31,320 --> 00:46:35,280
And so there was when there was an opening on the SWAT team, it was, you know, you had to
879
00:46:35,280 --> 00:46:36,520
do the physical fitness partially.
880
00:46:36,520 --> 00:46:39,400
You had to do a mile after unpush-ups and sit-ups.
881
00:46:39,400 --> 00:46:43,000
You had to meet with the psychologist, you had to meet with the command staff.
882
00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:44,680
And then you had to meet with the team.
883
00:46:44,680 --> 00:46:46,800
And the team, it was all or nothing.
884
00:46:46,800 --> 00:46:50,760
I mean, if one person said, hey, I've worked with Terry before he's kind of hard to work
885
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:53,160
with or is difficult to work with, you didn't get out.
886
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:59,440
And so I was lucky to get a thumbs up from everybody on the team and become part of that.
887
00:46:59,440 --> 00:47:02,240
So it was like, great, I'm going to get all this cool training.
888
00:47:02,240 --> 00:47:04,480
I'm going to learn all this stuff.
889
00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:07,560
And I'm sure you're going to have questions that I'll be able to tell you kind of what a
890
00:47:07,560 --> 00:47:10,120
knucklehead I was when I first started out doing this.
891
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:12,280
So that's how I got into it.
892
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:13,280
Okay.
893
00:47:13,280 --> 00:47:14,280
Awesome.
894
00:47:14,280 --> 00:47:15,280
Very cool.
895
00:47:15,280 --> 00:47:17,920
Well, you know, one thing I'm really interested to learn is, you know, what's the number
896
00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:22,160
one thing you learned about human nature?
897
00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:27,880
Through these experiences, through hostage negotiations and these, you know, real unfortunate circumstances,
898
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:34,200
you know, what would you say is your number one takeaway just from the experiences that
899
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:36,000
you had in that role?
900
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:39,000
That's a great question.
901
00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:47,040
I mean, I learned so much, but I guess I would say this every, every relationship.
902
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:49,400
And again, you know, we're negotiating with people.
903
00:47:49,400 --> 00:47:52,600
Well, let's be honest, if you're talking to me and your house is surrounded by the police,
904
00:47:52,600 --> 00:47:56,640
you're probably having the worst day of your life up to this point.
905
00:47:56,640 --> 00:48:00,800
So we're trying to negotiate with somebody that's having a horrible day that we've never
906
00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:05,920
met, that we have no idea many times why we're even there, what got them to do, what they
907
00:48:05,920 --> 00:48:06,920
do.
908
00:48:06,920 --> 00:48:09,040
So what are we trying to do?
909
00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:14,880
We're trying to develop trust because any good relationship, whether it's husband, wife,
910
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:20,000
parent, child, boss, subordinate, you don't have trust in that relationship.
911
00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:24,080
It is not a good relationship, it very well may be a toxic relationship.
912
00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:29,440
So we're trying to develop trust with the human being we've never met before.
913
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:34,520
And that was all the learning, the training, the techniques that we've learned through
914
00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:38,360
that that got us to be able to do that.
915
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:39,360
Wow.
916
00:48:39,360 --> 00:48:40,360
Very cool.
917
00:48:40,360 --> 00:48:46,880
Yeah, I'm sure that learning just how quintessential trust is in life.
918
00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:53,280
I mean, because if you can go to something to the extremity of a hostage negotiation and
919
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:59,000
be able to have even successful outcomes, I believe you said, was it about 80% of the time?
920
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:03,280
It might be about 90% of the time we were, wow, just looking at the person out.
921
00:49:03,280 --> 00:49:04,280
Wow, that's incredible.
922
00:49:04,280 --> 00:49:05,600
And just the power of trust.
923
00:49:05,600 --> 00:49:09,520
I mean, you think you can get like your boyfriend or girlfriend or whoever to trust you,
924
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:13,600
but just the power of, I think underlying that is love.
925
00:49:13,600 --> 00:49:19,600
I think there's a sense of goodwill and caring for that person, that's sensed.
926
00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:23,400
I think even on a deeper level, if you had agreed to speak to him, the power of as you
927
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:26,560
were saying is the primacy of love.
928
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:27,560
It was.
929
00:49:27,560 --> 00:49:29,480
I mean, we wouldn't negotiate with somebody.
930
00:49:29,480 --> 00:49:35,800
It wouldn't be, we wouldn't start out with, hey, I'm officer Tucker, I'm sergeant
931
00:49:35,800 --> 00:49:37,520
Tucker or something, or I'm a police.
932
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:41,120
We would, it would be, hi, I'm Terry, what's your name?
933
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:46,400
And a lot of times you don't need to know, okay, what would you like me to call you?
934
00:49:46,400 --> 00:49:48,160
And so it would start with that.
935
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:52,600
And like I said, a lot of times we had no idea why we were there, what, what kicked this
936
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:54,840
off, why this person did what they did.
937
00:49:54,840 --> 00:49:58,440
And so we would use what was called tactical empathy.
938
00:49:58,440 --> 00:50:03,960
I think you can get rid of the word tactical and just talk about empathy.
939
00:50:03,960 --> 00:50:09,640
Help me to understand where you're coming from, what's going on, however you wanted to
940
00:50:09,640 --> 00:50:10,720
phrase it.
941
00:50:10,720 --> 00:50:13,560
And the key word there is understand.
942
00:50:13,560 --> 00:50:17,600
If you were a homicide suspect that just murdered three people, I was not going to be like,
943
00:50:17,600 --> 00:50:21,200
oh yeah, totally understood why you did, I totally agree that you did that.
944
00:50:21,200 --> 00:50:24,800
So it was, help me to understand where you're coming from.
945
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:30,320
Because understanding builds trust and trust gets me to a point where I can get you
946
00:50:30,320 --> 00:50:32,320
potentially out safely.
947
00:50:32,320 --> 00:50:36,040
So that was the whole, so how do you do that?
948
00:50:36,040 --> 00:50:37,240
A couple of ways.
949
00:50:37,240 --> 00:50:42,000
One, we never used why questions.
950
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:45,960
Because think about Jared when you were growing up, you know, you did something wrong, what's
951
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:46,960
your parents do?
952
00:50:46,960 --> 00:50:48,960
Jared, why did you do that?
953
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:52,720
You know, why questions sound accusatory?
954
00:50:52,720 --> 00:50:54,920
You know, Jared, why, why don't you wear that tie?
955
00:50:54,920 --> 00:50:57,160
Oh, wait a minute, it's just Terry not like the tie that I'm wearing.
956
00:50:57,160 --> 00:50:58,160
You know, it's so big.
957
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:00,000
It's almost like an accusation.
958
00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:05,040
I can get to the same answer by saying, hey, Jared, what, what makes you sign where that
959
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:06,040
tie to that?
960
00:51:06,040 --> 00:51:08,920
It's lots, it lay in softer.
961
00:51:08,920 --> 00:51:13,360
So we would use how and what questions we would stay away from why questions.
962
00:51:13,360 --> 00:51:16,160
We would do mirroring or parody.
963
00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:20,800
In other words, whatever you said, we would take either the most important words or the last
964
00:51:20,800 --> 00:51:22,280
two or three words.
965
00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:26,320
And we would just basically take it back at you with kind of a curious tone.
966
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:27,760
We're always taught to be curious.
967
00:51:27,760 --> 00:51:31,440
So you don't think you could do that, Jared?
968
00:51:31,440 --> 00:51:35,360
And then we would go silent because we don't like silence.
969
00:51:35,360 --> 00:51:37,520
And you'll get the other person to start talking again.
970
00:51:37,520 --> 00:51:38,800
So we would do that.
971
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:44,120
And the other thing and the reason hostage negotiation was so exhausting is you had to get
972
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:46,320
down in the weeds with these people.
973
00:51:46,320 --> 00:51:50,920
So somebody's yelling and screaming and ranting and raving about their mother.
974
00:51:50,920 --> 00:51:55,800
And you say something like, oh, you, you seem like you're a little upset with your mother.
975
00:51:55,800 --> 00:51:58,720
No, you're totally missed what that person was saying.
976
00:51:58,720 --> 00:52:02,480
You have to, man, you are pissed as hell at your mother.
977
00:52:02,480 --> 00:52:03,480
Are you?
978
00:52:03,480 --> 00:52:05,280
Yeah, I am.
979
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:07,720
Because again, the person's like Terry gets me.
980
00:52:07,720 --> 00:52:09,040
He understands me.
981
00:52:09,040 --> 00:52:11,520
Again, we're back to understanding, understand, he builds trust.
982
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:12,520
Trust him.
983
00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:13,520
We give you out.
984
00:52:13,520 --> 00:52:18,200
So that whole part of that situation, we were taught to be curious.
985
00:52:18,200 --> 00:52:21,320
And I'll give you something that was, it's really kind of funny.
986
00:52:21,320 --> 00:52:23,120
We were taught to smile.
987
00:52:23,120 --> 00:52:24,120
And we smile.
988
00:52:24,120 --> 00:52:27,000
We're two blocks away talking on the phone with this guy.
989
00:52:27,000 --> 00:52:28,000
What do you mean, smile?
990
00:52:28,000 --> 00:52:29,000
You're nuts.
991
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:30,000
No.
992
00:52:30,000 --> 00:52:36,680
When you smile on the phone or at somebody, we have mirror neurons in our brain.
993
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:40,120
If I were to smile at you, your mirror neurons would engage.
994
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:44,120
And without even knowing it, there's a good chance you would smile back at that.
995
00:52:44,120 --> 00:52:45,120
Right.
996
00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:47,960
That smile comes through on the other end.
997
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:49,960
And I'll end with this.
998
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:55,560
The reason negotiations took so long is because we needed people to burn off a lot of that emotional
999
00:52:55,560 --> 00:53:00,120
energy because we don't make good decisions with our emotional brain.
1000
00:53:00,120 --> 00:53:02,680
We make better decisions with our rational brain.
1001
00:53:02,680 --> 00:53:06,440
And the last thing I'll say about this is this, we never lied to people.
1002
00:53:06,440 --> 00:53:09,360
And people would say to us, well, I'll put the gun down and let the hostage go.
1003
00:53:09,360 --> 00:53:12,600
I'll come out, but you got to promise me I'm not going to go to jail.
1004
00:53:12,600 --> 00:53:14,880
And we would have to say something like, really?
1005
00:53:14,880 --> 00:53:16,760
We've been talking for five hours.
1006
00:53:16,760 --> 00:53:17,880
I've been honest with you.
1007
00:53:17,880 --> 00:53:19,200
I haven't lied to you.
1008
00:53:19,200 --> 00:53:22,160
Now you want me to lie to you?
1009
00:53:22,160 --> 00:53:23,760
You know, when you come out, you're going to go to jail.
1010
00:53:23,760 --> 00:53:27,960
I mean, we try to deflect the conversation to something that was more palatable that they
1011
00:53:27,960 --> 00:53:29,800
could sort of hang their hat on.
1012
00:53:29,800 --> 00:53:31,800
So I know I give you a lot there, but that's kind of--
1013
00:53:31,800 --> 00:53:32,800
Oh, yeah.
1014
00:53:32,800 --> 00:53:33,800
Really good.
1015
00:53:33,800 --> 00:53:35,200
Yeah, that's really great stuff.
1016
00:53:35,200 --> 00:53:38,520
And it ties in well with your, you know, kind of the aspect of your book we were talking
1017
00:53:38,520 --> 00:53:40,520
about.
1018
00:53:40,520 --> 00:53:43,520
You're number one listening more than you talk.
1019
00:53:43,520 --> 00:53:48,840
But not listening to respond, but listening to understand.
1020
00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:54,480
And the power of that communication skill and how that much in your story as well, like
1021
00:53:54,480 --> 00:53:56,680
shifted your life as well.
1022
00:53:56,680 --> 00:54:03,360
So I think even in that situation, it's just an exacerbated example, but even shows how
1023
00:54:03,360 --> 00:54:10,480
powerful those tenets are of listening to understand and mirroring and really help people
1024
00:54:10,480 --> 00:54:12,040
understand that you understand.
1025
00:54:12,040 --> 00:54:15,920
I think it's such a foundation of communication.
1026
00:54:15,920 --> 00:54:17,920
It really is.
1027
00:54:17,920 --> 00:54:22,880
And I'm going to give you this because this was the very first thing we got as negotiator
1028
00:54:22,880 --> 00:54:25,880
was how we as human beings communicate.
1029
00:54:25,880 --> 00:54:26,880
And this works for anybody.
1030
00:54:26,880 --> 00:54:30,880
Doesn't have to be cop or bad guys or just you and me talking.
1031
00:54:30,880 --> 00:54:34,640
The formula they gave us was 738.55.
1032
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:39,280
So 7% of how we communicate a message with another person are the words that we use.
1033
00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:42,400
And think how many times you've said something and be like, "Eeeh, I wish I had to set that
1034
00:54:42,400 --> 00:54:43,400
up.
1035
00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:44,400
I wish I would have set it different."
1036
00:54:44,400 --> 00:54:47,400
That's only 7% of how that message comes across.
1037
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:51,080
38% is the tonal voice that you use.
1038
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:54,320
Are you really excited and you can't wait to tell the person what's going on or are you
1039
00:54:54,320 --> 00:54:55,320
kind of e-horish?
1040
00:54:55,320 --> 00:54:57,920
You know, things are bad.
1041
00:54:57,920 --> 00:54:58,920
It's not.
1042
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:01,120
Or you know, you're like that.
1043
00:55:01,120 --> 00:55:07,280
38% and 55% some more than half of how you communicate a message is your body language
1044
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:09,360
and your facial expressions.
1045
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:13,400
And they gave us that formula to let us know that, like I said, if you're barricaded
1046
00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:16,760
in a room with a gun, I'm not in the room with you.
1047
00:55:16,760 --> 00:55:18,680
That's not, that would not be safe.
1048
00:55:18,680 --> 00:55:21,480
So we didn't have that 55%.
1049
00:55:21,480 --> 00:55:25,600
We didn't have the luxury of saying something to somebody and see them kind of roll their
1050
00:55:25,600 --> 00:55:27,440
eyes like, "Huh, what an idiot.
1051
00:55:27,440 --> 00:55:29,440
I can't believe Terry sent that to me."
1052
00:55:29,440 --> 00:55:31,080
So we had to get good.
1053
00:55:31,080 --> 00:55:36,760
Certainly, based on what people were saying, but also what they weren't saying and how they
1054
00:55:36,760 --> 00:55:38,760
were saying it.
1055
00:55:38,760 --> 00:55:39,760
Mmm.
1056
00:55:39,760 --> 00:55:41,760
Very, very interesting nuance there.
1057
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:43,480
Yeah, thank you for breaking that down.
1058
00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:46,320
I think that's going to be really valuable just for anyone.
1059
00:55:46,320 --> 00:55:51,920
Looking to improve communication terms, love ones, friends, relationships, even business
1060
00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:52,920
relationships.
1061
00:55:52,920 --> 00:55:59,600
I'm like, I have a sales background and this very much applies to sales, mirroring.
1062
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:03,040
These are sort of perennial types of concepts.
1063
00:56:03,040 --> 00:56:07,640
So it's very interesting to see even those applied to situations extreme as possible
1064
00:56:07,640 --> 00:56:13,000
negotiations and see they're still equally as valid and successful and just shows really
1065
00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:18,680
how constant those types of attributes of our human nature and our minds are.
1066
00:56:18,680 --> 00:56:19,680
Absolutely.
1067
00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:29,500
Now, one of the other things to switch gears a little bit is I think from a side of
1068
00:56:29,500 --> 00:56:36,440
even manifestation, if you will, on one of the key tendencies embodying that highest
1069
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:42,520
version of yourself to attract the outcomes that are vibrationally proportionate to that
1070
00:56:42,520 --> 00:56:46,920
frequency you're on and you embodying that highest version of yourself and one of your
1071
00:56:46,920 --> 00:56:51,440
tenets was you are the person that you are looking to become.
1072
00:56:51,440 --> 00:56:56,820
And it's so resonant with me because it really feels that way and it's I think everything
1073
00:56:56,820 --> 00:56:57,980
has a vice, right?
1074
00:56:57,980 --> 00:57:03,280
I think us humans are really good at making good things and devices and what I mean by that,
1075
00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:08,240
you know, we can make anything of us, you know, it can even be like prayer, you know,
1076
00:57:08,240 --> 00:57:09,240
we can.
1077
00:57:09,240 --> 00:57:16,200
So, you know, I think something as as spiritual and as positive as self development and manifestation
1078
00:57:16,200 --> 00:57:21,520
turns into a whole other externalization, which is that version of me is over there.
1079
00:57:21,520 --> 00:57:24,640
Just like I need that car over there to be valid.
1080
00:57:24,640 --> 00:57:29,040
Now all of the sudden, the best version of yourself is also outside of you and it's
1081
00:57:29,040 --> 00:57:30,040
like this wake up.
1082
00:57:30,040 --> 00:57:31,440
It's like, well, it's still you.
1083
00:57:31,440 --> 00:57:33,720
You know, you are the person.
1084
00:57:33,720 --> 00:57:38,520
I'd love to disagree your elaboration on that point, since this is your tenet.
1085
00:57:38,520 --> 00:57:42,240
And that goes back to, you know, kind of what we were talking about before, you know, I was
1086
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:45,960
in these roles in business and, you know, hospital administration.
1087
00:57:45,960 --> 00:57:51,040
I worked for Wendy's when I got out of college in their marketing department and I always
1088
00:57:51,040 --> 00:57:54,080
felt I was a police officer.
1089
00:57:54,080 --> 00:57:57,840
And so it was I was the person I was looking to become.
1090
00:57:57,840 --> 00:57:59,240
I knew I was going to become that person.
1091
00:57:59,240 --> 00:58:02,040
Somebody didn't know when, but I was that person.
1092
00:58:02,040 --> 00:58:09,560
So I was conducting myself in a way, sometimes not in a good way, because I was immature and
1093
00:58:09,560 --> 00:58:12,240
I didn't understand and I was yelling at things like that.
1094
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,320
But did I was, I knew I was going to be that person.
1095
00:58:15,320 --> 00:58:16,920
How would that person act?
1096
00:58:16,920 --> 00:58:22,200
How do I manifest that in my life as a marketing person, as a hospital administrator?
1097
00:58:22,200 --> 00:58:23,520
What qualities do I have?
1098
00:58:23,520 --> 00:58:25,800
You know, how, how buttoned down I am?
1099
00:58:25,800 --> 00:58:27,560
How curious am I?
1100
00:58:27,560 --> 00:58:29,960
How, how do I learn how to talk to people?
1101
00:58:29,960 --> 00:58:35,920
And I think those opportunities to be in business made me a better police officer.
1102
00:58:35,920 --> 00:58:38,120
They allowed me to talk to people.
1103
00:58:38,120 --> 00:58:44,080
Law enforcement I think today is not necessarily a field that a lot of people want to get into.
1104
00:58:44,080 --> 00:58:47,960
But every now and then, somebody will reach out and they'll be like, what do you recommend
1105
00:58:47,960 --> 00:58:50,760
for me if I want to be good as a police officer?
1106
00:58:50,760 --> 00:58:53,560
And this is what I tell everybody.
1107
00:58:53,560 --> 00:58:59,520
Put your devices down and go out on the street and talk to the homeless guy and go up to
1108
00:58:59,520 --> 00:59:02,400
the penthouse and talk to that person.
1109
00:59:02,400 --> 00:59:07,640
Because if you can talk to a variety of people, you can be good at that.
1110
00:59:07,640 --> 00:59:12,280
If the only way you can communicate is on that little box going like this, you'll be miserable
1111
00:59:12,280 --> 00:59:13,520
as a cop.
1112
00:59:13,520 --> 00:59:15,600
So that was something I learned.
1113
00:59:15,600 --> 00:59:21,240
I took up to all kinds of people when I was in, in the hospital, when I was in Wendy's
1114
00:59:21,240 --> 00:59:22,240
things like that.
1115
00:59:22,240 --> 00:59:24,320
And I just think that led me.
1116
00:59:24,320 --> 00:59:28,400
And I don't think, I don't think I realized it at the time.
1117
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:32,640
But that led me to be a better communicator and I think a better hostage to go shader is
1118
00:59:32,640 --> 00:59:33,640
what?
1119
00:59:33,640 --> 00:59:34,640
Sure.
1120
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:38,560
And I think in that same kind of seeing in retrospect concept, you could almost even
1121
00:59:38,560 --> 00:59:41,840
argue for yourself that maybe those things were supposed to happen.
1122
00:59:41,840 --> 00:59:47,520
So that because your destiny was law enforcement, you're just being prepared to be that effective
1123
00:59:47,520 --> 00:59:51,400
as you were with those skills that you would gain beforehand, even potentially as an
1124
00:59:51,400 --> 00:59:54,840
angle to look at it if you thought of it that way as well.
1125
00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:55,840
Yeah.
1126
00:59:55,840 --> 01:00:01,200
But I mean, I always felt that whatever I was doing was leading me to where I was supposed
1127
01:00:01,200 --> 01:00:02,200
to be.
1128
01:00:02,200 --> 01:00:07,800
It was like, okay, did I look in the morning and go in the work at Wendy's?
1129
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:08,960
No disrespect to Wendy's.
1130
01:00:08,960 --> 01:00:09,960
No, I didn't.
1131
01:00:09,960 --> 01:00:13,840
I mean, I couldn't wait to get out of bed to go be cop.
1132
01:00:13,840 --> 01:00:18,040
And if you want to know what your purpose is, if you can't wait to get out of bed and go
1133
01:00:18,040 --> 01:00:21,960
do something, then you might want to think that that might be your purpose of life.
1134
01:00:21,960 --> 01:00:26,400
But it was also, you know, you kind of have two handles in life.
1135
01:00:26,400 --> 01:00:29,880
Do I have to or do I get to?
1136
01:00:29,880 --> 01:00:35,160
And, you know, I have to go to work to have to get out or do I get to go to work?
1137
01:00:35,160 --> 01:00:36,760
Do I get to go?
1138
01:00:36,760 --> 01:00:37,760
And I'm not going to lie to you.
1139
01:00:37,760 --> 01:00:40,280
I wasn't always the I get to.
1140
01:00:40,280 --> 01:00:43,280
It was like, oh gosh, do I really have to get out of bed and go to work today?
1141
01:00:43,280 --> 01:00:46,640
But there were a lot of times where it was like, I get to go do this.
1142
01:00:46,640 --> 01:00:48,160
I'm going to learn something new.
1143
01:00:48,160 --> 01:00:49,640
This is outside my comfort zones.
1144
01:00:49,640 --> 01:00:51,600
I'm kind of pushing the envelope here a little bit.
1145
01:00:51,600 --> 01:00:52,600
I don't know about this.
1146
01:00:52,600 --> 01:00:54,400
I, you know, I don't know if I'm going to be any good at this.
1147
01:00:54,400 --> 01:00:55,960
I don't know if I'm going to like it.
1148
01:00:55,960 --> 01:01:03,120
But all of that was leading, I think leading me to you're going to use these skills in some
1149
01:01:03,120 --> 01:01:06,560
way, shape or form in being in law enforcement.
1150
01:01:06,560 --> 01:01:07,560
Very cool.
1151
01:01:07,560 --> 01:01:14,600
Yes, I love tracing people's stories as well and seeing the divine sort of blueprint of
1152
01:01:14,600 --> 01:01:15,800
how that kind of came to fruition.
1153
01:01:15,800 --> 01:01:18,160
So that's so inspiring to hear.
1154
01:01:18,160 --> 01:01:22,040
And I think that gets kind of the wrap round to another tenant as well, this kind of late
1155
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:26,880
to I think was principal eight, which is fail often, especially when you're a young, is
1156
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:29,840
you're saying it's, you know, you may not have all the experience.
1157
01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:33,040
You may be going into something just you know what's your passion, but you're going to
1158
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:38,280
hit a hundred roadblocks along the way, you know, in one of the quotes used, which I was
1159
01:01:38,280 --> 01:01:41,840
in love with, which was Thomas Edison saying, I've not failed.
1160
01:01:41,840 --> 01:01:44,280
I've just found 10,000 ways that don't work.
1161
01:01:44,280 --> 01:01:48,240
And it's such a powerful paradigm flip, right?
1162
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:55,880
And I've seen, I've seen failures as steps closer to a goal as opposed to in actual loss.
1163
01:01:55,880 --> 01:02:01,400
So I'd, I'd love to kind of hear your perspective on kind of the concept of failing often as
1164
01:02:01,400 --> 01:02:02,400
you wrote in here.
1165
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:03,400
Sure.
1166
01:02:03,400 --> 01:02:05,480
So I guess let me tell you this story.
1167
01:02:05,480 --> 01:02:10,040
This is a guy with a name of Jeff Wetzler wrote a book called Ask.
1168
01:02:10,040 --> 01:02:12,760
And I wish I would have known this when I was younger.
1169
01:02:12,760 --> 01:02:17,120
Because, and maybe you did this, Jared, you know, we could have put these arbitrary mile
1170
01:02:17,120 --> 01:02:21,320
posts out there where we say, okay, by the time I'm 28, I want to make it 100, and I'm just
1171
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:23,360
making this up, making $100,000 a year.
1172
01:02:23,360 --> 01:02:26,920
By the time I'm 34, I want to be married and have a family.
1173
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:32,720
And when those, those mile posts come and go and we're not there, we tend to look at
1174
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:35,240
ourselves as, I'm failing.
1175
01:02:35,240 --> 01:02:37,960
I'm not, I'm not getting where I am.
1176
01:02:37,960 --> 01:02:38,960
And what's certain?
1177
01:02:38,960 --> 01:02:41,160
And he said, look at your life differently.
1178
01:02:41,160 --> 01:02:42,680
Look at your life like this.
1179
01:02:42,680 --> 01:02:45,120
He said, look at your life in decades.
1180
01:02:45,120 --> 01:02:52,960
So in your 20s, do anything that interests you at all professionally, spiritually, emotionally,
1181
01:02:52,960 --> 01:02:57,200
you know, I want to play the sport, I want to go listen to this music, whatever it is.
1182
01:02:57,200 --> 01:03:01,240
And mess up, fail often.
1183
01:03:01,240 --> 01:03:06,560
Not for the sake of failing, but for what you learn, for the lessons that failing when
1184
01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:08,400
you did certain things taught you.
1185
01:03:08,400 --> 01:03:15,520
And then it says in your 30s, find those two or three things that really speak to you and
1186
01:03:15,520 --> 01:03:17,720
dig into them a little bit.
1187
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:21,440
And then he says in your 40s, when you're more mature, you understand how life works, maybe
1188
01:03:21,440 --> 01:03:27,240
you're more financially set, find that one thing, that one thing that you're supposed to
1189
01:03:27,240 --> 01:03:28,960
do and dig into it.
1190
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:33,440
And then it says in your 50s and your 60s and beyond, you can reap the benefits.
1191
01:03:33,440 --> 01:03:37,960
You can reap the rewards of living your life in decades.
1192
01:03:37,960 --> 01:03:41,520
And when I heard this, man, I wish it would have known that when I was young, you know, because
1193
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,880
I was doing these arbitrary mouthless, well, I'm not there.
1194
01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:50,200
So I must be feeling like Nelson Mandela had a great quote, Nelson Mandela is the former
1195
01:03:50,200 --> 01:03:51,400
president of South Africa.
1196
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:56,080
And he said this, he said, I never lose.
1197
01:03:56,080 --> 01:03:59,560
I either win or I've learned.
1198
01:03:59,560 --> 01:04:02,120
Even if you lose, what did you learn from that lesson?
1199
01:04:02,120 --> 01:04:06,360
You're not a failure unless you start blaming other people in life.
1200
01:04:06,360 --> 01:04:11,000
Take the lessons you're supposed to learn from your mistakes, apply them to a new business,
1201
01:04:11,000 --> 01:04:14,680
a new venture, whatever it is, and move forward in your life.
1202
01:04:14,680 --> 01:04:15,920
Failure is a part of life.
1203
01:04:15,920 --> 01:04:19,400
The road to success is paged with failure.
1204
01:04:19,400 --> 01:04:20,400
Some people don't think that.
1205
01:04:20,400 --> 01:04:24,920
They look at Taylor Swift like, look at, she's a billionaire and she's done all this, I
1206
01:04:24,920 --> 01:04:30,040
guarantee you, Taylor Swift has written some dog songs that she probably be like, these
1207
01:04:30,040 --> 01:04:31,320
things are terrible.
1208
01:04:31,320 --> 01:04:32,320
She's failed in her life.
1209
01:04:32,320 --> 01:04:33,920
I can promise you that.
1210
01:04:33,920 --> 01:04:34,920
Absolutely.
1211
01:04:34,920 --> 01:04:37,800
I think that's something that's so lost.
1212
01:04:37,800 --> 01:04:40,000
The social media is the highlight reel.
1213
01:04:40,000 --> 01:04:43,720
You're getting everyone's highlight reel.
1214
01:04:43,720 --> 01:04:48,200
It almost be strange to have success without having some type of tribulation and be kind of
1215
01:04:48,200 --> 01:04:52,280
strange if someone just became a multi-millionaire and never had a single problem.
1216
01:04:52,280 --> 01:04:53,960
It's like, well, you should be studying.
1217
01:04:53,960 --> 01:04:56,160
You know, you never is.
1218
01:04:56,160 --> 01:05:01,040
You know, there is a single problem like, wow, you know, you're a different level of genius,
1219
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:02,040
I guess.
1220
01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:04,520
It's almost like, yeah.
1221
01:05:04,520 --> 01:05:06,120
It's almost like common sense.
1222
01:05:06,120 --> 01:05:07,840
Of course there's going to be failure.
1223
01:05:07,840 --> 01:05:13,240
And I think the sooner you can internalize that and see it as information, I kind of think
1224
01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:16,280
of it almost like an AI, right?
1225
01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:21,240
If you are an AI and you just collect data, your point, your whole goal is to get closer
1226
01:05:21,240 --> 01:05:22,320
to a goal.
1227
01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:23,320
You succeed.
1228
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:24,480
Do more of that.
1229
01:05:24,480 --> 01:05:25,480
You fail.
1230
01:05:25,480 --> 01:05:27,000
That's not a solution.
1231
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:30,440
And you start cutting out things that don't work and start honing in on things that do
1232
01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:36,160
work and you just collectively get closer and the parameters get tighter around the solution
1233
01:05:36,160 --> 01:05:38,040
and you eventually find the solution.
1234
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:45,280
And it's the emotion of the failure, quote-unquote, that colors it into something other than
1235
01:05:45,280 --> 01:05:48,800
just information that's taking you closer to the goal.
1236
01:05:48,800 --> 01:05:54,400
And I think that's what people quit is they can't see it as just a step closer.
1237
01:05:54,400 --> 01:05:57,160
They look it as a step further, if you will.
1238
01:05:57,160 --> 01:06:01,880
I do and I've never even thought about what you just said about AI and kind of cutting out
1239
01:06:01,880 --> 01:06:02,880
the bad.
1240
01:06:02,880 --> 01:06:06,600
That's a great way of looking at it.
1241
01:06:06,600 --> 01:06:12,880
But I think that's because people they care about what other people think.
1242
01:06:12,880 --> 01:06:18,800
And I always, especially with your people, I was telling why do you care what somebody else
1243
01:06:18,800 --> 01:06:26,160
thinks of you when those people have never even tried what you failed that, not alone
1244
01:06:26,160 --> 01:06:28,080
succeeded at in your life.
1245
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:29,480
Why do you care what those people fit?
1246
01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:32,000
I mean, it's a rhetorical question, especially when you're young.
1247
01:06:32,000 --> 01:06:33,200
You want to be part of the in-group.
1248
01:06:33,200 --> 01:06:37,080
You want to feel like you're part of the group and all that stuff.
1249
01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:42,760
But if you look at it that way, it's like, why do you care what somebody says about how
1250
01:06:42,760 --> 01:06:46,440
you wear your hair, why you wore the schooled out day or anything like that?
1251
01:06:46,440 --> 01:06:48,680
None of that matters in your life.
1252
01:06:48,680 --> 01:06:55,280
And the interesting about social media is it allows you to say things to people, I'm going
1253
01:06:55,280 --> 01:06:59,480
to say anonymously or kind of behind the scenes, that you wouldn't say to them if you were
1254
01:06:59,480 --> 01:07:01,200
standing right in front of them.
1255
01:07:01,200 --> 01:07:06,000
So anything that's said about me on social media, and I mean, if people haven't liked sustainable
1256
01:07:06,000 --> 01:07:08,000
excellence, that's okay.
1257
01:07:08,000 --> 01:07:12,440
I mean, nobody's totally bashed it, but at the same time, it was like, not everybody's
1258
01:07:12,440 --> 01:07:13,960
going to like everything you do.
1259
01:07:13,960 --> 01:07:15,800
Not everything's going to be successful in life.
1260
01:07:15,800 --> 01:07:16,800
That's okay.
1261
01:07:16,800 --> 01:07:17,800
It doesn't make you a failure.
1262
01:07:17,800 --> 01:07:19,520
It just means you've learned something.
1263
01:07:19,520 --> 01:07:21,000
Use that, apply it, and move on.
1264
01:07:21,000 --> 01:07:26,560
And I think it also means you're being rude because like that being authenticity is inherently
1265
01:07:26,560 --> 01:07:27,880
polar.
1266
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:32,480
You're going to have on the side that like you, the side that doesn't like you and the
1267
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:34,560
entire spectrum in between.
1268
01:07:34,560 --> 01:07:39,000
It's when we're living in a state of people pleasing as you end up just great.
1269
01:07:39,000 --> 01:07:40,000
You're flat.
1270
01:07:40,000 --> 01:07:44,600
You don't even anything unique because you're trying to, you're, you come million for
1271
01:07:44,600 --> 01:07:48,360
what this person likes and you come million for what that person likes.
1272
01:07:48,360 --> 01:07:49,680
And then you're not even anyone.
1273
01:07:49,680 --> 01:07:53,840
You're just basically a mime, you know, that's just, you know, based on the parameters of
1274
01:07:53,840 --> 01:07:54,840
the moment.
1275
01:07:54,840 --> 01:07:59,040
And so I think it's for people to understand just as you are saying is like, if people don't
1276
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:02,520
like something about you or something that you've done, but you're acting in love and
1277
01:08:02,520 --> 01:08:05,640
you're doing something that you think is positive and service oriented.
1278
01:08:05,640 --> 01:08:06,640
So doesn't like it.
1279
01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:10,440
That means you're just really operating in your authenticity because you're going to divide
1280
01:08:10,440 --> 01:08:12,000
the waters, you know, to some extent.
1281
01:08:12,000 --> 01:08:14,120
That's the kind of the way I kind of conceptualize it.
1282
01:08:14,120 --> 01:08:16,520
It's like a good sign in a certain way.
1283
01:08:16,520 --> 01:08:20,920
It is. And if people aren't mad at you or, or, you know, putting you down or something like
1284
01:08:20,920 --> 01:08:25,120
that, then you're probably not doing anything important or anything special.
1285
01:08:25,120 --> 01:08:26,120
Right.
1286
01:08:26,120 --> 01:08:29,480
You think that anybody's looking at it's, it's, you, and you've got to have that thick skin.
1287
01:08:29,480 --> 01:08:32,600
You've got to be like, I'm going to do this because I know it's my purpose.
1288
01:08:32,600 --> 01:08:36,360
You know, I mean, my own mother, you know, my, my dad had died, but when I became a police
1289
01:08:36,360 --> 01:08:42,160
officer, my mother was, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, you can, you can make more money.
1290
01:08:42,160 --> 01:08:43,400
You can, yeah, you're right, Bob.
1291
01:08:43,400 --> 01:08:44,600
I can make more money.
1292
01:08:44,600 --> 01:08:49,220
But I'm not doing this because I mean, anybody gets a law enforcement, try to make money
1293
01:08:49,220 --> 01:08:53,960
is, is an idiot because you're just not going to make that, but you're going to make a difference
1294
01:08:53,960 --> 01:08:55,720
or you can make a difference.
1295
01:08:55,720 --> 01:08:59,640
And if you look at that, what's important in my life, the, the money part, I mean, you
1296
01:08:59,640 --> 01:09:00,640
can make a good living.
1297
01:09:00,640 --> 01:09:04,120
Don't get me wrong, but at the same time, you know, you're, you're not going to have, you
1298
01:09:04,120 --> 01:09:07,480
know, your, your trust or anything like that being a cop.
1299
01:09:07,480 --> 01:09:09,440
So, but what's important in life?
1300
01:09:09,440 --> 01:09:11,760
And again, going back to the Alexander the Great story.
1301
01:09:11,760 --> 01:09:15,760
I mean, there's, there's the richest man, most important man in the world who's like, yeah,
1302
01:09:15,760 --> 01:09:20,040
I've realized too late to none of this matters.
1303
01:09:20,040 --> 01:09:21,040
Absolutely.
1304
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:22,040
Very well said.
1305
01:09:22,040 --> 01:09:27,240
Yeah, I think it's a matter of, you know, getting your needs met and then kind of fitting
1306
01:09:27,240 --> 01:09:28,880
the, the, the afterburners.
1307
01:09:28,880 --> 01:09:30,520
I think people get stuck in that.
1308
01:09:30,520 --> 01:09:36,440
It's just so, I think people in my observation like to assign control over their lives to
1309
01:09:36,440 --> 01:09:37,440
others.
1310
01:09:37,440 --> 01:09:41,520
It's like, whether it's the company, the company is, is my, you know, pseudo dad.
1311
01:09:41,520 --> 01:09:42,840
It pays my bills.
1312
01:09:42,840 --> 01:09:45,640
You know, it has the rules that it's very, I don't have any risk.
1313
01:09:45,640 --> 01:09:50,400
I don't have any, you know, any type of, you know, difficulty in terms of like, is the
1314
01:09:50,400 --> 01:09:55,000
business going to go out of business or, you know, new competitors or legal and, you
1315
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:57,160
just get your, you know, your check and you're good.
1316
01:09:57,160 --> 01:09:59,600
And it's like it, it's a state of comfort.
1317
01:09:59,600 --> 01:10:01,520
And I think people get lost in that.
1318
01:10:01,520 --> 01:10:07,560
And it's just so much easier just to give away the agency of, of your own life.
1319
01:10:07,560 --> 01:10:09,960
And I think people get stuck at that step.
1320
01:10:09,960 --> 01:10:12,040
It's like you, you know, you have to pay your bills.
1321
01:10:12,040 --> 01:10:16,280
You have to be responsible in a, you know, self-reliant individual.
1322
01:10:16,280 --> 01:10:21,560
But, you know, but that's, but that's when you've achieved the ability in the space to now
1323
01:10:21,560 --> 01:10:26,240
enter that, that, that purpose into, into now really, really step into that.
1324
01:10:26,240 --> 01:10:29,200
You know, that, that's kind of how I conceptualize it at least.
1325
01:10:29,200 --> 01:10:30,200
Yeah.
1326
01:10:30,200 --> 01:10:32,000
And, you know, I can apply that to Kate.
1327
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:33,480
You know, I've, I've got a doctor.
1328
01:10:33,480 --> 01:10:36,040
He's telling me you're going to be dead in two years.
1329
01:10:36,040 --> 01:10:38,920
But I always looked at doctors kind of like bookies and big.
1330
01:10:38,920 --> 01:10:42,800
You know, they look at you and say, all right, based on your age, your overall health and
1331
01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:46,000
the stage of your cancer, you're going to live X.
1332
01:10:46,000 --> 01:10:50,720
But what the doctors don't know is you want to see your child graduate from high school.
1333
01:10:50,720 --> 01:10:53,120
You want to see your daughter graduate from college.
1334
01:10:53,120 --> 01:10:54,200
You want to walk her down the aisle.
1335
01:10:54,200 --> 01:10:55,680
You want to play with your grandkids.
1336
01:10:55,680 --> 01:11:00,200
And having something to look forward to, something that you're excited to get up and go
1337
01:11:00,200 --> 01:11:03,000
do is incredibly important.
1338
01:11:03,000 --> 01:11:05,040
And I've also seen the reverse of that.
1339
01:11:05,040 --> 01:11:06,520
And it's just what you said, Jared.
1340
01:11:06,520 --> 01:11:08,880
I've seen people or doctors said, hey, you're going to be dead.
1341
01:11:08,880 --> 01:11:10,320
You're going to be dead in two years.
1342
01:11:10,320 --> 01:11:15,640
And literally on the anniversary of those that second year, they're dead.
1343
01:11:15,640 --> 01:11:20,760
I've always wanted my life to be based on the decisions that I made, not on the ones I
1344
01:11:20,760 --> 01:11:23,640
didn't make or that somebody else made for me.
1345
01:11:23,640 --> 01:11:27,280
So I wasn't about to roll over and say, well, I'm going to be dead in two years.
1346
01:11:27,280 --> 01:11:29,560
It's like, no, that's not up to me.
1347
01:11:29,560 --> 01:11:32,320
Some bigger than bigger than me is going to make that decision.
1348
01:11:32,320 --> 01:11:35,080
I'm going to figure out what this is supposed to teach me.
1349
01:11:35,080 --> 01:11:37,960
And then I'm going to try to live that purpose.
1350
01:11:37,960 --> 01:11:40,840
That's a real war your mindset.
1351
01:11:40,840 --> 01:11:42,880
That's really incredible.
1352
01:11:42,880 --> 01:11:46,760
And on a side note, what do you make of the placebo effect?
1353
01:11:46,760 --> 01:11:52,520
Because that two years, and I trust that, and I put my intention and energy into that,
1354
01:11:52,520 --> 01:11:58,520
because you know how much even the mind even affects DNA now through epigenetics.
1355
01:11:58,520 --> 01:12:03,960
You set that timer in a way, as you said, on the day, that would unfortunately happen
1356
01:12:03,960 --> 01:12:07,960
with some of those people who they told two years of a doctor, they gave that agent COA,
1357
01:12:07,960 --> 01:12:14,800
and they basically told themselves in their body, in their DNA, in their being, that that's
1358
01:12:14,800 --> 01:12:15,800
what it was.
1359
01:12:15,800 --> 01:12:18,920
And it even ended that way in some cases.
1360
01:12:18,920 --> 01:12:23,760
So I'm curious if you have even a perspective on the placebo effect in kind of your journey.
1361
01:12:23,760 --> 01:12:24,760
I do.
1362
01:12:24,760 --> 01:12:28,160
And I wish I could remember the name of the book.
1363
01:12:28,160 --> 01:12:30,040
They're something supernatural.
1364
01:12:30,040 --> 01:12:31,040
No.
1365
01:12:31,040 --> 01:12:33,040
Or the placebo effect by Dr. Joseph Benza.
1366
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:34,040
No, it's not that.
1367
01:12:34,040 --> 01:12:35,040
It's a newer book.
1368
01:12:35,040 --> 01:12:41,400
And it talks about the placebo effect, but it's research done into the brain that is saying
1369
01:12:41,400 --> 01:12:49,600
that our brain is more of a predictive, than it is an organ.
1370
01:12:49,600 --> 01:12:53,600
And the reason I say that is because you and I may see a band robbery.
1371
01:12:53,600 --> 01:12:55,120
And the police may call us apart.
1372
01:12:55,120 --> 01:12:59,480
And I was like, okay, the guy had on an angry blue shirt and blue jeans and black sneakers.
1373
01:12:59,480 --> 01:13:04,160
And you may say the guy had on a green shirt and khaki pants and dress shoes.
1374
01:13:04,160 --> 01:13:06,840
It's like, wait a minute, you saw the same thing.
1375
01:13:06,840 --> 01:13:12,800
What they're finding is that your brain will predict what it expects you to see.
1376
01:13:12,800 --> 01:13:16,040
So you may see it, but your brain won't give you what you saw.
1377
01:13:16,040 --> 01:13:17,960
Your brain will give you what it predicts.
1378
01:13:17,960 --> 01:13:23,680
And that same thing applies, they talk about that in the book, the placebo effect of giving
1379
01:13:23,680 --> 01:13:31,480
people medicine or saying, okay, we're going to bring you in and we're going to do an experiment,
1380
01:13:31,480 --> 01:13:32,480
a test.
1381
01:13:32,480 --> 01:13:33,720
We're going to give you a shot.
1382
01:13:33,720 --> 01:13:35,480
We're going to give you a little bit of an allergen.
1383
01:13:35,480 --> 01:13:38,760
You've got a little bump on your arm.
1384
01:13:38,760 --> 01:13:41,040
And they're going to ask you to sit for 20 minutes.
1385
01:13:41,040 --> 01:13:43,400
And it's going to be a control group and another group.
1386
01:13:43,400 --> 01:13:48,280
And the control group is the people who check on you are not going to say a word.
1387
01:13:48,280 --> 01:13:53,200
But the other group, the people that check on you are going to say, hey, you'll be fine.
1388
01:13:53,200 --> 01:13:58,400
They'll go down in a few minutes and they find that the people who were told that it'll
1389
01:13:58,400 --> 01:14:00,400
go down in a few minutes, that it'll be fine.
1390
01:14:00,400 --> 01:14:02,080
It does go down and they're better.
1391
01:14:02,080 --> 01:14:03,920
And the other people, it's still there.
1392
01:14:03,920 --> 01:14:06,240
It doesn't, because so that that's the same.
1393
01:14:06,240 --> 01:14:08,040
They got the same thing.
1394
01:14:08,040 --> 01:14:11,280
But somebody told you, so now your brain is like, this is going to work.
1395
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:14,240
I'm going to feel better in a few minutes because somebody told me that I was going to
1396
01:14:14,240 --> 01:14:15,240
do right.
1397
01:14:15,240 --> 01:14:18,480
So yeah, I absolutely believe in the placebo effect.
1398
01:14:18,480 --> 01:14:25,160
Wow. Yeah, I even read studies a while ago, it was about the certain type of tumor.
1399
01:14:25,160 --> 01:14:32,480
And they basically told the individual that it was basically the most latest, like leading
1400
01:14:32,480 --> 01:14:39,040
edge, like super high powered, most like newest, greatest, most effective drug ever.
1401
01:14:39,040 --> 01:14:41,040
And it was, you know, placebo.
1402
01:14:41,040 --> 01:14:43,880
And the tumor literally shrunk.
1403
01:14:43,880 --> 01:14:46,240
Like it was, I think it was terminal.
1404
01:14:46,240 --> 01:14:48,960
I mean, I mean, it almost disappeared.
1405
01:14:48,960 --> 01:14:50,800
It was almost gone.
1406
01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:59,280
And then I believe I don't want to mistake the study, but she realized that it was a placebo.
1407
01:14:59,280 --> 01:15:01,040
And it came back.
1408
01:15:01,040 --> 01:15:07,160
And so I think it's just even further towards just the power of our tension.
1409
01:15:07,160 --> 01:15:09,800
I mean, I think we're just so undersell.
1410
01:15:09,800 --> 01:15:14,240
I mean, even in modern medicine, I mean, I just wish it wasn't so deterministic.
1411
01:15:14,240 --> 01:15:20,360
I wish there's more of a state of, you know, possibilities and ability to really have that,
1412
01:15:20,360 --> 01:15:24,360
you know, dominion over yourself and your life and your past.
1413
01:15:24,360 --> 01:15:25,680
But you do.
1414
01:15:25,680 --> 01:15:26,920
And that's, and that's your sick.
1415
01:15:26,920 --> 01:15:31,440
But, you know, like, like it was just talking, people look at somebody in a white coat with
1416
01:15:31,440 --> 01:15:34,160
a bunch of initials after their name and say, well, they know what they're talking about.
1417
01:15:34,160 --> 01:15:37,640
So if they said I'm going to die in two years, I'm going to die in two years.
1418
01:15:37,640 --> 01:15:41,160
But we know that our bodies can cure themselves.
1419
01:15:41,160 --> 01:15:46,440
Our bodies can come up with what it needs to kill cancer, to starve it, to get rid of the
1420
01:15:46,440 --> 01:15:47,440
blood flow to it.
1421
01:15:47,440 --> 01:15:49,280
Our bodies can do that.
1422
01:15:49,280 --> 01:15:52,320
We just don't, we don't delve into that enough.
1423
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:57,160
We don't use our brains to control our bodies.
1424
01:15:57,160 --> 01:15:59,520
And I am, I'm a thorough believer.
1425
01:15:59,520 --> 01:16:03,880
Like I said, you know, I had something to look forward to in my life.
1426
01:16:03,880 --> 01:16:04,880
Think about that.
1427
01:16:04,880 --> 01:16:06,480
I've got two years to live.
1428
01:16:06,480 --> 01:16:08,480
And I'm thinking about my grandkids.
1429
01:16:08,480 --> 01:16:09,720
My daughter's at high school.
1430
01:16:09,720 --> 01:16:13,200
I mean, you know, think how far that is down the line.
1431
01:16:13,200 --> 01:16:17,120
But my body's got something, my brain's got something to live for.
1432
01:16:17,120 --> 01:16:20,080
Something to move forward, something I want to do.
1433
01:16:20,080 --> 01:16:25,520
And that, that alone is incredibly powerful in keeping you going.
1434
01:16:25,520 --> 01:16:27,000
And like I said, I still have cancer.
1435
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:31,440
I still have two of my lungs, but I'm doing a whole lot better.
1436
01:16:31,440 --> 01:16:35,800
Everybody who started this clinical trial drug that I've been on is dead.
1437
01:16:35,800 --> 01:16:37,400
I'm still here.
1438
01:16:37,400 --> 01:16:38,680
And I'm still fighting.
1439
01:16:38,680 --> 01:16:43,280
And I use, you know, my doctor said, your body understands how to use this medicine.
1440
01:16:43,280 --> 01:16:46,560
And I have terrible side effects when I get it.
1441
01:16:46,560 --> 01:16:51,520
But every time I hurt and I'm throwing up and I'm shaking, I'm like, it's working.
1442
01:16:51,520 --> 01:16:52,520
It's doing well.
1443
01:16:52,520 --> 01:16:53,520
It's out to do.
1444
01:16:53,520 --> 01:16:57,120
So that is so inspirational.
1445
01:16:57,120 --> 01:16:58,920
Wow.
1446
01:16:58,920 --> 01:16:59,920
Just so incredible.
1447
01:16:59,920 --> 01:17:02,000
So thank you, thank you for sharing that.
1448
01:17:02,000 --> 01:17:08,040
I think to wrap up here, you know, I think a good kind of period on the sentence here
1449
01:17:08,040 --> 01:17:10,360
is, you know, the role of God in our lives.
1450
01:17:10,360 --> 01:17:12,080
I know we've touched on it.
1451
01:17:12,080 --> 01:17:13,880
Definitely a lot throughout the conversation.
1452
01:17:13,880 --> 01:17:20,160
But, you know, really how quintessential that is in your experience through your life journey.
1453
01:17:20,160 --> 01:17:23,960
And I think another thing, I like to ask most people who are spiritual, depending on no
1454
01:17:23,960 --> 01:17:25,800
matter where they come from.
1455
01:17:25,800 --> 01:17:29,800
And I really respect the way that you handle things in your book when you talked about it.
1456
01:17:29,800 --> 01:17:34,280
I believe it was high school where you had the religious organization and you would,
1457
01:17:34,280 --> 01:17:38,000
when you went out of town, you wouldn't let your vice president.
1458
01:17:38,000 --> 01:17:40,560
Do the meetings because you know, was sorry.
1459
01:17:40,560 --> 01:17:41,560
It was in college.
1460
01:17:41,560 --> 01:17:42,560
It was in college.
1461
01:17:42,560 --> 01:17:43,560
Sorry.
1462
01:17:43,560 --> 01:17:46,840
And you wouldn't let it brought the meetings because, you know, he would get on to other denominations
1463
01:17:46,840 --> 01:17:48,240
of Christian or other religions.
1464
01:17:48,240 --> 01:17:54,160
And your whole thing was just a non-interference, let people believe and have the faith that they
1465
01:17:54,160 --> 01:17:55,160
have.
1466
01:17:55,160 --> 01:17:57,200
And I really resonate with that philosophy.
1467
01:17:57,200 --> 01:18:02,520
You know, I'm just curious, you know, number one, of course, just the importance of God
1468
01:18:02,520 --> 01:18:04,920
conceptually, you know, in our lives.
1469
01:18:04,920 --> 01:18:12,000
And secondarily, do you believe that everyone can have sort of a, if everyone can get the
1470
01:18:12,000 --> 01:18:17,360
same type of benefit or connection through different channels, whether that is through Islam,
1471
01:18:17,360 --> 01:18:21,120
whether that is, there are even different denominations of Christianity or through Judaism
1472
01:18:21,120 --> 01:18:26,520
or, you know, Hinduism, you know, can they achieve a similar effect in their lives coming
1473
01:18:26,520 --> 01:18:28,520
to most different angles?
1474
01:18:28,520 --> 01:18:30,240
I would like to say yes.
1475
01:18:30,240 --> 01:18:35,080
Now, I wish I could remember who I had said this.
1476
01:18:35,080 --> 01:18:40,360
So if somebody knocked on your door and said, "Hey, Jared, you don't know.
1477
01:18:40,360 --> 01:18:41,360
I'm a total stranger.
1478
01:18:41,360 --> 01:18:42,360
Hey, I want to come in.
1479
01:18:42,360 --> 01:18:43,600
I want to use your shower.
1480
01:18:43,600 --> 01:18:45,760
I want you to make me a meal.
1481
01:18:45,760 --> 01:18:48,680
You know, I want to sleep, you know, in your guest bedroom.
1482
01:18:48,680 --> 01:18:49,880
You're good with that, right?
1483
01:18:49,880 --> 01:18:51,200
What would you say?
1484
01:18:51,200 --> 01:18:52,200
Who are you?
1485
01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:55,960
He said, you like, "No, absolutely not."
1486
01:18:55,960 --> 01:19:03,200
I mean, you know, there's nothing all to risk here, but I would like the same thing works
1487
01:19:03,200 --> 01:19:04,200
with God.
1488
01:19:04,200 --> 01:19:11,480
You know, if you're the kind of person, I think denominations, you know, I don't think
1489
01:19:11,480 --> 01:19:12,480
you should believe in the denominations.
1490
01:19:12,480 --> 01:19:13,680
I don't think you should believe in words.
1491
01:19:13,680 --> 01:19:14,680
I'm Catholic.
1492
01:19:14,680 --> 01:19:15,960
I believe that it works for me.
1493
01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:24,240
But I think it's just like if you were to knock on heaven's gates and say, "I am here."
1494
01:19:24,240 --> 01:19:29,800
And you had totally discot and totally not been, you know, God was never a part of your life
1495
01:19:29,800 --> 01:19:30,800
growing up.
1496
01:19:30,800 --> 01:19:33,240
You think God's going to say, "Yes, you're coming in."
1497
01:19:33,240 --> 01:19:35,240
Yeah, it's like it's going to be the same thing.
1498
01:19:35,240 --> 01:19:36,240
The water is fine.
1499
01:19:36,240 --> 01:19:37,240
Yeah.
1500
01:19:37,240 --> 01:19:40,200
I mean, you know, I was never a part of your life when you were on earth.
1501
01:19:40,200 --> 01:19:44,920
So why do you think you're going to be part of heaven at this point in time?
1502
01:19:44,920 --> 01:19:50,800
So I think, and I think this just goes back, we all should be part of something that's
1503
01:19:50,800 --> 01:19:52,440
bigger than ourselves.
1504
01:19:52,440 --> 01:19:54,480
And for me, that's God.
1505
01:19:54,480 --> 01:19:57,280
Like I said, when I die, where I die, how I die?
1506
01:19:57,280 --> 01:19:58,280
Way above my pay grade.
1507
01:19:58,280 --> 01:20:00,760
I don't spend much time worrying about that.
1508
01:20:00,760 --> 01:20:04,240
And I heard a Native American black foot proverb years ago that I absolutely love and it
1509
01:20:04,240 --> 01:20:06,000
goes like this.
1510
01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:12,040
When you were born, you cried in the world rejoiced.
1511
01:20:12,040 --> 01:20:13,520
Live your life in such a way.
1512
01:20:13,520 --> 01:20:15,200
And that doesn't mean important words.
1513
01:20:15,200 --> 01:20:22,120
Live your life in such a way so that when you die, the world crouched and you rejoice.
1514
01:20:22,120 --> 01:20:23,120
That's what I want.
1515
01:20:23,120 --> 01:20:24,680
That's what I'm looking for.
1516
01:20:24,680 --> 01:20:25,680
Wow.
1517
01:20:25,680 --> 01:20:29,960
And with that, a serious mic drop, I think we will conclude today.
1518
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:32,680
But Terry, it has been such a pleasure chatting with you.
1519
01:20:32,680 --> 01:20:35,320
Thank you so much for your insights and wisdom.
1520
01:20:35,320 --> 01:20:37,720
I know I have learned a lot in Gainland.
1521
01:20:37,720 --> 01:20:40,560
I'm sure the audience has as well.
1522
01:20:40,560 --> 01:20:44,640
Before we wrap up here, I'd love to say a quick second to share where they can find
1523
01:20:44,640 --> 01:20:46,240
you, where they can find your work.
1524
01:20:46,240 --> 01:20:48,920
And of course, we'll link everything in the description for everyone.
1525
01:20:48,920 --> 01:20:50,680
But just a quick second if you want to share.
1526
01:20:50,680 --> 01:20:54,800
Sure, this is a way to find me to get an old name, leave me a message.
1527
01:20:54,800 --> 01:20:55,800
It's motivationalcheck.com.
1528
01:20:55,800 --> 01:20:58,280
It's my blog and website.
1529
01:20:58,280 --> 01:20:59,640
My social media links are on there.
1530
01:20:59,640 --> 01:21:00,640
I get recommended.
1531
01:21:00,640 --> 01:21:03,400
Recommendations, books to read, videos to watch.
1532
01:21:03,400 --> 01:21:05,640
You can reach out to me motivationalcheck.com.
1533
01:21:05,640 --> 01:21:06,640
Awesome.
1534
01:21:06,640 --> 01:21:08,280
Well, thank you so much, Terry.
1535
01:21:08,280 --> 01:21:10,160
Really appreciate your time once again.
1536
01:21:10,160 --> 01:21:11,160
Thank you, Jared.
1537
01:21:11,160 --> 01:21:12,160
I really enjoyed this.
1538
01:21:12,160 --> 01:21:13,160
Awesome.
1539
01:21:13,160 --> 01:21:14,160
Take care, Terry.
1540
01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:15,160
Bye-bye.
1541
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:19,560
Thank you for tuning into this episode of the Quantum Theory Podcast.
1542
01:21:19,560 --> 01:21:25,380
If you desire to embark on the path of self-mastery, visit Quantum Theory Podcasts.com to join a
1543
01:21:25,380 --> 01:21:29,000
like-minded community of purpose seekers committed to personal growth.