Steve Muncaster: What It Takes to Be a World Touring Drum Tech | Ep. 16

Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Funks.
Steve: Yes sir the JB What's happening?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: man, how are you, brother?
Steve: Good, my man, how are you?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I am delightful. Where are you at in the world now?
Steve: So yeah, I'm actually home. I'm in Sheffield in England. God my Glack is driving me crazy on the reflection.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's how long are you home for? I feel like you're never home.
Steve: Right, this summer's been crazy. I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, even killing it.
Steve: I think like at the top of the year I kinda didn't have any gigs, so then I really filled the summer with loads of stuff, and then
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right.
Steve: now it's like busy at the tail end of the year and I'm I'm definitely not complaining, but I'm kinda like,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: I wish I'd have had some more time at home. But but no
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's how always goes.
Steve: But I don't really, you know, I love it. but no, it's been good. I've been doing kind of more more like band world stuff rather than pop world stuff or session player stuff, I guess.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Steve: which has been really fun. Kind of that's where I started out, so it's kind of same, same but different, right? Fun.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Feels like home for you again in a way.
Steve: Kinda it's it's just more chill, I think. Like, you know,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: I I we're kinda you know, we're rolling around one bus, everyone's on the same bus, it's yeah, it's it's different vibes, it's fun. Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. It's just different. Right. So you get a chance to kinda like see the c some of the people you grew up with, some of those like, you know, yeah. That's a vibe.
Steve: Yeah, exactly. And it's funny 'cause it's everyone's like we're all old now. Right? So it's like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Right. Yeah.
Steve: it's funny the same human beings where we used to be more mischievous than maybe we are now, let's say, you know, like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I feel like those are the moments though where you get a chance to like reconnect and you don't drop a beat. It's like you almost were hanging. Yeah. Those are the fun moments.
Steve: Yeah, of course. Exactly. Except the difference is it's like now you'll have, you know, a nice glass of red wine instead of going and drinking eighteen beers in the Irish bar, you know?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Them trying to take the the pub away from you is blasphemy though.
Steve: Don't don't listen. I didn't say take it away. Relax, come on.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: monks isn't taking any gig. If you get if you can't hit the pub, forget about it.
Steve: Dude, God, imagine it'd be you know those gigs where it's like I think is it Mor Morrissey, like the super vegan. I like good for you, if you want to be vegan, good for you. I don't care, but like, well you're
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right.
Steve: if you work there, you you're vegan as well. like I could probably deal with that to be honest, but if you try to tell me no pup, I'm staying home. Keep that
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No golf, no pubs, no drums. Monks is at the crib. Forget about it.
Steve: Keep Look after them drums yourself, brother. You got us. Here's a key. I'll post you a key. Good luck. Here's some polish.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I always tell people I'm like, Bugs needs three things. Give him some drugs, give him a nice cold beer, and give him some golf clubs, an honorable mention now as lady. He's happy.
Steve: Listen, I'm a simple what's wrong with that? Life ain't that deep. You know what I mean? It's good. Find me find what you like and
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Not at all, man. But I think
Steve: enjoy it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I think once I learned that about you, I was like, this is about be so easy. Like, just make sure
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: this is done and he's the happiest person in the whole world.
Steve: Right. I was just gonna say remember when we when I first got hired to work on that on tape with you,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: we'd like we'd never met. I guess we hadn't really heard of each other either, to be fair. And I remember the first phone call that we had, and it was you'd been doing more more like playbacky stuff, right? In in that
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: period rather than and kind and more teching rather than playing
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: quite so much. I remember on this phone call you were like so horizontal about it, you know. Man was so chilled about these drums and I was like, I don't I like, does this guy like need this do it? Like what's what's the vibe here? Like am I gonna be like is this gonna be
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, yeah.
Steve: annoying for this guy or or what? And then and then we we hung out, got on really well and then as soon as we started working, I was like, okay, cool. So he does actually need stuff, but it's just it as long as it's right, we're chilling. You know, and it's it was a different thing 'cause at first I was like, I don't know if this guy even wants to have a tech, you know.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I'm just not hard to please, man. I'm like, look, this make sure it's right. Whatever your method is, sounds good to me. I don't care. Like as
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: long as we get to here, who the hell am I to tell
Steve: Yeah, right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: you how to do it? Like I
Steve: Yeah, I agree. I like that. That's good.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I'm like this guy clearly got the job for a reason, so let me just let him do his job and then if we need to talk about something, we'll talk about it. If we don't then what am I talking about?
Steve: No news is good news, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, man. But I wanted to talk to you, man, 'cause you you have a skill set that a lot of people don't know exist, right? Like we know obviously in the in the music world we know it exists, but a lot of people don't even know that you can look after the musicians and make a living and see the world and and do all the right stuff. And I'm like, I I gotta talk to this guy, one 'cause you're s the man, but you have like no one has a bad thing to say about you. Right. And that's a testimony to who you are as a person, number one. But also your abilities, like you you just get it. So
Steve: Mm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I know I know you started as a player though, right? Like your primary thing was playing.
Steve: When I was a kid, you know, I think I started playing when I was like eleven or twelve, maybe. It was like the first year of what we call high school, which is I don't is that middle school for you guys? Maybe? I don't know. So we're
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: What what grade? Is it like eighth?
Steve: you're like you're like ten or eleven?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: How? So like elementary school is what they call it, yeah. It's like basic.
Steve: Sure, it's like yeah, I don't know, whatever. I was like eleven, that age. I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay.
Steve: don't yeah, I don't know. Didn't do well at school.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I was young. Yeah.
Steve: Drums, dude.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: so yeah, I mean I started playing. My dad played.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay. Right.
Steve: and then so I sort of naturally wanted to just play drums a bit and then I c I kinda got good, like quick.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: You know, like not gr not world class, but you know, the first time I sat down at the kit I could play a groove, you know, and it was like,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, for sure.
Steve: maybe this is a thing. and then I I I sort of chased that. I went to I was doing I was studying what was it? English language, philosophy, psychology and business at college. And right? Like you know me. You know me, so you're like, okay.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: What? Okay, I'm with it. Yeah, let's do this. Yeah. That's a choice.
Steve: but naturally What happened though was that reaction is correct because it was like, What am I doing? And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: every day I was looking at music schools online. so I I dro I dropped out of college, which my mum was not stoked about. But I told her because it I'd s I'd seen this course on a music school in London that if I started it before I was eighteen, it was free, but it was like three hundred quid for the year. But then all the kind of degree courses were thousands and thousands of dollars.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure.
Steve: So I was like, I might as well just take a shot. So at 18 I upped and left Preston, which is my hometown, and and moved to London, which was pretty bald to be fair. I think I'd only been to London a couple of times.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, absolutely.
Steve: and I kinda went down there, chased the playing thing for a little bit. I was doing all right, getting some session work and studios and stuff, and you know, playing some gigs, but never I was never really in the scene of that. And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: I I didn't know how to get into it. and then and truth be told, I pfft, I mean I I wasn't good enough actually, and that's fine. Cause I think
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, sure.
Steve: once you get cause well in Preston I was a top player, right? I was really good, but then you get to get to somewhere like London, you're like, sh shit, like these guys are serious serious, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah. It's a whole different world, yeah, absolutely.
Steve: Yeah, but and that's great because you then you've got a moment to be like, right What do I do it? Am I gonna put the work in to try and be that good? Or do I look elsewhere, right? 'Cause
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure.
Steve: and that depends on your situation sort of financially and with time, I guess, you know, if you're if you have to work a million hours a week to pay rent in a major city, then you can't play drums for a million hours a week, you know? That's is
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: that's that's that. And or you dedicate the time to the drums and live in a different way where I don't know, you don't eat food as well. You know or whatever.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right, right. Absolutely.
Steve: and then so the playing sort of took a backseat. and then I I sort of I kind of fell into Tekken to be truthful. I didn't really even know that it was a job. Well I c I I did, but I didn't realise it could be a career, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure, sure. Yep.
Steve: I remember I lived in a like a big shared house in the middle of London. We had a driveway, which is uncommon. in town. and all these bands like I knew a guy who was a tour manager, and all these bands that were kind of small bands at the time from the US would come to the UK and tour in a splitter.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Hmm.
Steve: We had a driveway, so and this big shared house, so like we had couches and floor space, you know, and it was that whole thing, people sleeping on the floor and a sleeping bag. Which, you know, I've
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Wow. Okay.
Steve: gone that in the van is it's fun, but it's hard.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, it's a struggle.
Steve: But I had these these really nice Gretsch drums. and to try and help a couple of the bands out, I would lend them my kit so they didn't have to hire something from a backline company.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, yeah.
Steve: And then I would go out and, you know, and help out, maybe do a bit of merch or something. But because they were playing my drums, I looked after them because they were the most expensive thing I owned and I loved them. And then
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah. Yep.
Steve: all of a sudden and then fuck no, twenty years later I'm still a drum tech. I don't know what happened.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: All of a sudden you're you're in a career field, you're like, I okay.
Steve: Okay, yeah, cool. Sorry, yes. I'm I'm how old now? What
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, this works. So that was the segue for you. It was like by default
Steve: Seriously.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: of just being a good person. You're just like
Steve: I mean it I find in that situation, right, if you're a music fan and in that it was in like the alternative world of music, you know, like bands and stuff. So I think as a fan you wanna facilitate people who are in that same boat, right? And if if they're
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: trying to do something and you've got the space to be able to do that to help out, do it. And then it also works for me because I wanna go to like Wembley Arena and see Mike Drumkit on the stage, you know? As this
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: right eyed bushy tailed nineteen year old. I'm going, This is sick. Well it is there.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: 'Cause it is. Like that is sick. Yeah. That's very hip. So then once you kinda shifted y you really didn't even make a conscious decision. It was just by default.
Steve: Well, I sort of, but then once I started touring like that, then I did make the call. I was like, right, cool, I can this is a great career path because I'm not I can't be asked being in a band because it's so much work and money and
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: just tight and it's and it's hard and I was starting getting a bit older. I don't wanna be sleeping on the floor of people's houses, like strangers' houses. And it it's amazing that people offer their spaces, of course. But I'm
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: also like I just don't wanna be doing that. So And then I wasn't good enough really to get the big session gig. So I was like, right, here we go. I've always wanted to work with drums. This is your this is your opportunity. So then I I chased it that way.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's sick though. So now it's you now you're one of the best techs in the world and you can't say it. I will. you know, but you're you're one of the calls that even when there's two things that has happened since you and I've met, right? People have been calling and like, hey, do you know anybody, you know anybody? And you're the easiest call for me to be like, Yeah, you can you can use monks, but you can't have them.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I think I've told so many people that I'm like, use him. But you can't have him. Or or or I hear. Yeah, I got I
Steve: You're like loaning me out? Hang on, I'm just gonna close the screen, it's so bright. there we go.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I gotta p pimp you out a little bit.
Steve: Ha ha.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: but it's but also I hear the other one of how's your experience working with him? Because his name keeps coming up. Fucking phenomenal. Like it it's the easiest thing. And I always tell people, I'm like, I set my drums up one time, I tune them once. After that, it's been perfect ever since. And then, you know, we might make a little adjustment or, you know, whatever. And then whatever, right? That's just the nature of being on the beast and, you know, working with a friend of the house. But
Steve: Mm-hmm. Of course. Okay.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: once I set it up once, it was over. You know, it there
Steve: Well that's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: was no more of that.
Steve: that's the that's the whole point, right? Is in for me it's listen, anybody can set up a memory logged drunk kit, I'm not gonna lie. Like any once it's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: once it's in, like if you're if you're messing that up, then you know, tr work harder or or do something else. I know that's harsh, but it's true. 'Cause I mean a bit you will make mistakes, of course, but Generally speaking, that's the easy part. But the idea is that you don't need to worry about that. Like you've got other stuff to do. Like you're trying other businesses on the side. You're making people's, you know, programming tracks with people. You're mentoring people on the internet. You're giving lessons over Zoom, whatever, you know. Like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: when you roll into a venue that day, you don't need to be worrying about your drums being right. Because that's literally what I'm there to do, right? Is facilitate
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: your needs for. for the concert, for the artist. Not even just for you.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: It's for to like to make sure that they have the best show because you're chilling.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. Yeah. Absolutely. How did you get to that philosophy though? Because I I've noticed that a lot of people in general are just not really and this is no knock to anybody, but the bar seems to be pretty average right now. Right.
Steve: Mm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's almost like the good enough mentality. You have never taken that approach when it comes down to drums. Like you've always taken the approach of like it has to be right. Other up until like you the the we'll use the orange kit because everyone knows you for that one. And For the record, majority of that build guys was monks. Like I hit him,
Steve: Right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: was like, we were like throwing around ideas. I was like, I just kind of wanted it to look this way. How we get there, enjoy, you know, like whatever, you
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: know, whatever you want to do. But you have a system, right? Your your systems make sure that every single day it's perfect. So was that a lot of trial and error for you? Was that just being a drummer? So you kind of knew what a drummer would expect. So you naturally kind of went to that realm. Like Or did you just come out the gate like I'm just fucking killing and this is what it is? Cause
Steve: I mean,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: that's real too.
Steve: I still I mean, I still I just I still think I'm just a drum tech, right? Like truth be told I like I'm thinking I'm good, of course, I but I have to be good.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: I I think I don't it's an interesting question, 'cause I don't think too much about it is the truth. I know that sounds like a bit
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: of a cop-out, but f if so okay, let's go to that orange kit, right? So you said you wanna You wanna add this, you want these sizes, you wanna do this, and then I'm like, right, cool. I've worked with you before, I know what you're gonna like. Cause I'm just trying to think about I'm trying to think your brain, but with my how am I gonna deal with that on the daily.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right, right, right.
Steve: So I'm like, cool. I know that this guy wants everything to be symmetrical. So when it comes to boom arms, I'm gonna want this amount of shit on each side, right? And then we I know that you don't want any Like mics or clamps on any of you of the drum hardware. So it's like, okay, so we need the bar across the bottom, but I need to have that on both sides because then it looks the same. And then some of the arms that we had were black and some were chrome. And it was like, well, the black ones have got to go. So so
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: and you know, I mean we were in a fortunate position where it sort of financially and with the support from Pearl and stuff, it w it wasn't too much of an issue to create that. And I, you know, I know there's situations where You can't have it exactly perfect. And and we had that with like rental kits in in Latin America, right? You remember I mean
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Steve: it was we're using, excuse me, like individual stands for hardware instead of instead
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: of a rack. And it kinda i it's a pain in the ass, but it is what it is. But then that's where I'll go. Like I had a spreadsheet that I put on my laptop that I've got Like the measurement from the center of your snare to your hi-hat rod, and then from from the center of your snare to that crash, and to that crash, and to crash, and to that crash, and then the distance between the wing nuts of all of them. And I'll be out there with a tape measure. So when you sit down,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Wow. See?
Steve: it's not gonna be perfect, but it it's gonna be as close as you can get it. And it might look weird,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, it's really close.
Steve: like with the stands, it might look weird, but the symbol is where it was meant to be. And I know that because
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right.
Steve: I've got a tape measure, and you like science ain't lying.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, exactly. Yep. Yeah.
Steve: Right? And I and I I think for me that attention to detail is important because how lucky am I? I get paid to go around the world and work with some of the best musicians and look after drums. It's not that b you know it's not a bad deal, right? So
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, yeah, absolutely.
Steve: So if you know, if it takes me an extra forty five minutes to faff around with a tape measure one day, then so be it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. I think that's where we're missing though, that extra attention and details you're saying. And then what when you do stuff like that, are you thinking ahead of time, I'm probably gonna be in a situation where something might break, or I have to be in a situation where, you know, the truck got to me late. So I have to figure out a system now where if I have to tell three other, you know, stage hands, do this, do this and this, they know
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: where to do it because you designed it that way. Is that something that you're
Steve: A hundred a hundred percent it's that because it's always about trying to streamline the process. Because on a tour like the size of that mispossessive tour, what were we looking at? 23 trucks, I it was. It was a lot of stuff, you know.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It was a lot, yeah.
Steve: And there's a lot of moving parts with limited time for every department to do their bit. So I would get the kit on the stage late some days, and that just happens because there's so much other stuff happening.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Yep.
Steve: so I've got a I've got to know exactly where everything is in every single case, exactly how it's gonna come out, because of how I put it in last night, or how I got someone else to put it in last night.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: And then you and then it just becomes a routine. It's like anything. If you know, when you when you wake up you brush your teeth.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: And then whatever like whatever your routine is in any walk of life, that's you're always trying to just sort of streamline everything to make it as easy as possible and as consistent as possible.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Is that always your your workflow though? So when I know when we first got connected, we decided to hop on a call first. Is that something you always typically try to do? Is like you
Steve: Mm-hmm. Always.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay. Why why do you always feel the need to do that?
Steve: I think for me, as a tech, I I liken I I've used this analogy a lot. You've probably heard me say this. I liken being a tech to being a caddy for a golfer.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Hmm.
Steve: Right? So you're it's as much about looking after the gear as it is the person. So I wanna know who am I dealing with, not just what am I dealing with. I've worked with I've
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yes, yes.
Steve: worked with thousands of drums and thousands of cymbals, but what's a person like? What it like How do they communicate? Are they what is what are they what are the things that they love and more importantly, what are the things that they hate?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, sure.
Steve: You know, and sometimes people don't really know and that's fine.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: But as long as we've had the conversations to try and get that rolling a little bit, just so just to give yourself a head start. It's you know, I'd love to say it was like selfless, but it isn't because it hel it's helping me as well. It's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, one hundred percent.
Steve: it's a working relationship and I think to just to take twenty minutes of your time or or an hour, you know. before you go on the road with somebody, call How not not difficult. Because you're
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. It's pretty simple.
Steve: gonna be speaking to every day. You might as well start now. What are you gonna do? Just ignore I'm scared of this guy till then. Don't talk to me.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No, but I loved it. I I thought it was so great that you initiate the conversation. You know, you
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: initiated wanting to connect and kind of chop it up a little bit. And I think it you're right. It gave us an opportunity to kind of figure out who we were, temperaments, kind of that vibe.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: And, you know, it you we always rehash that first conversation because I was coming from a different place and it was pretty uncommon probably for that conversation to have gone that way of like, I don't know. I don't care that deep about this thing. You know, I
Steve: Ha ha ha.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: was like, yeah, I'm happy to be here, but certain things that just weren't that serious to me.
Steve: Sure.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: but then also to your point, there are certain nuances that I do know. Like logos have to be facing upright. You know,
Steve: Of course.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: symmetric, like symmetry was big. But for me, I'm like, you also have to do a job. You know,
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I it matters to me that. you want to set this thing up or it's it's done away in a way that you don't feel like your hands were, you know, tied up and you're like, I gotta do this thing again. It's like, no, I don't really care. So when
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: you have that first conversation, sorry, go ahead.
Steve: I was gonna say just kind of I was just thinking about more the f the the the first conversation. I think another good reason to do it is to find out, especially if you're working with session players, like what what gear are you using and do you have endorsements with anybody?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: Like if you don't, would you like to? Cause
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: I'm like I'm fortunate I know people at all these big drum companies and I can't just get everybody free stuff or but I can Help facilitate that conversation if somebody wants to have the conversation, whether it goes anywhere or not is none none of my business to be frank. But but then you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure. And that's real. Cause you got me all of mine.
Steve: well except but that was the thing, right? I was like, what do you play?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: And then what heads do you use, what sticks do you use, what symbols do you use, and then within like twelve hours you add them all, but that was the lucky. But
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, right. We were we were checked off pretty quickly.
Steve: but that but that's the point, right? It's I'm I'm there to try and facilitate you. So
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: by having a conversation, like everything, if you talk about something, you can make something happen. If you don't talk about it, it ain't gonna happen. It's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: we're not it's n it's not magic, you know? It's it's there's no smoke
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: and mirrors. It's it's straight up you have a conversation and then stuff happens or it doesn't.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: For sure. Now as a tech though, 'cause you brought up endorsements, you're the one that's handling the conversations between drum artists and their companies, right? With terms of like ordering, what do they need? Is that all you that handles that conversation?
Steve: that depends on the person that I'm working with, 'cause some people like to be really involved with that. Some guys really can't be asked with the admin. So they'll just send me a like you know, or th or they don't even know. Like if they're gonna run out of sticks, they have no idea how many sticks are in the bag if we have spare symbols or if we have heads. And that's fine.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's me. That's literally me. I'm like, Well yeah, get whatever you need, but I guess.
Steve: But that's fine, you know, and that that is part of it. But then other people really want to be 'cause I with endorsements, it's it's about having a working relationship as well, isn't it? It's not you give me free stuff and then thanks kind of f you know, it it's there's levels to that. There's it's a deal for a reason. so some people wanna be involved and I know What I tend to do if people aren't that interested is just keep off copy until it's ordered and then I'll bring them in just so that there's still your name, for example, is still on the on the email thread. So this the artist relation person isn't just like, Who is this put like, why am I sending them all this stuff? And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: then they're not even they don't even say hi kind of thing, you know?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. That's important though. It's good that you you at least know to make that bridge still be connected. You know, it doesn't go down that way. Do you
Steve: Yeah. Well, because it isn't about me.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: do you have a preference of if
Steve: Sure, I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: someone's more engaged? Do you like do you do you prefer if someone like a drummer is more engaged in the conversation versus not?
Steve: Mm, not really. Honestly,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay.
Steve: not really. At sometimes It depends how involved, I suppose, because sometimes you're
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Ha ha.
Steve: trying to if I work a certain way. It is consistency again. If someone is always that involved, great. But if like one week they wanna know absolutely everything and are on top of everything, but then the next time they go quiet, I can I just deal with it then? You know? So it's if
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. Yeah.
Steve: as long as it's consistent, I don't really give a shit, to be honest.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: But that's fair though. I mean, it I think it's good to know that. You know, I think those are the types of things that for me I've noticed with people is like if you don't know those little nuances in them, it that could be the annoyance, right? Like if you if you really did have a preference of look, I'm your tech, I got you. If I need you, I'll be there. If that was your preference, and it's almost like all hands on, I'd be like, like you're micromanaging me again. But you're saying
Steve: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: it doesn't really matter. Like if you want to be involved, be involved, but just be consistent across the board and all.
Steve: Exactly. 'Cause it this is the thing though, 'cause it it isn't my deal to negotiate, right? So if someone wants to be involved, of course be involved. Like it's your it's your deal, your your gig, you know. But then if
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure. I love the idea of letting people do their thing. You know
Steve: Well, ex that's the that's the whole thing, I keep saying it. I'm there to facilitate. So whatever you want to do, that's what we'll do. I'll go about it on
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, yeah.
Steve: my way, you know, on the when it when I'm at the truck at eight in the morning. I don't want to be hearing you telling me how to move the box, but after that, you know.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Do you How do you guys get involved in the teching space? Right. I know how I I've gotten gigs and I did the the not traditional route just because I was trying to get in the room where literally was like, I know all the drummers.
Steve: What did you do then?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Well, I knew all the drummers, right? I I didn't have any gigs, I didn't have any work playing, but I knew all
Steve: Mm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: the drummers. So I just sent a text. I was like, hey guys, I'm teching now. If you guys need anybody to do blah blah blah, I'll do for free. You know, I really just kind of wanted to get involved because no one knew who I was.
Steve: Sure. Was this in LA
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: And then, you know, Deshaun Allen had
Steve: or when you were still home?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, back in LA, when I was home, I I was like you. I was kinda like a big fish in a very small pond.
Steve: Sure. Yeah, okay.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: But the real arena was out here. You know, now shit got
Steve: Full reactor dude, I hear ya I hear ya. And London is
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: London ain't LA either, so like I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I was like, okay, everybody out here is not just good. They're they're phenomenal. They're already connected. You know, they have the endorsements. Like they already had everything I was trying to obtain. And I was like, I I'm so far behind right now. I just need
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: to figure out a way to get in the room. So that was kind of my way, you know, until pandemic, and then learned playback. But that was kind of my route. So I'm just curious, like as a tech or things like that, is there a more traditional route for you? Is it More word of mouth or is it typically a production company? Like how does that
Steve: It's pretty much all been word of mouth since the day I started, to be honest.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Wow.
Steve: there's been there's been a few where I've had to write a a resume of sorts, which I always which I find really weird 'cause I'm crap at stuff like that. But but I mean in the in reality, all that's usually for management. It's not for the production manager, 'cause they normally know who you are. And if they don't, the person that's linked you with will trust, you know.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure, sure.
Steve: We'll trust that rec 'cause no one in a quite a competitive world where it's in you know, your recommendation holds so much worth you don't want to send somebody who's crap.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, agreed.
Steve: and I so when it yeah, if I have to write a resume, it's usually for management, you know, like upper management sort of office management rather than road management.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: But usually y you write, you know, you Unfortunately, I've been doing it for a long time, so the C V is pretty good. But you you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: know, as long as you write some little blurb about yourself, but I hate doing these things because it's just like Hello, I'm Steve. I know how to look after just shut up. You know? I'm punctual, hard working, shut up, bruv. Like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: what are you talking about? So it's just like a list of artists, and then they go, this guy's good.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. Okay. So the if you were to start over now, how would you do it? Right? Because that's you're in a whole different space.
Steve: How would I do it? That's a great question.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: This is the fun one because it's like we we've been doing it so long and at a different time of really
Steve: Right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: no social media, like there was no
Steve: Right. That true, yeah, 'cause do you know what? So I what's been crazy the last couple of years, I'm digressing a little bit while I try and think of the my answer here, so
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Go for it. Yeah, wink, wink.
Steve: but what's been really interesting about the social media thing is over the last few years, spending more time in Los Angeles with you, and you know, DJ and the gang, it's it the amount of people that I speak to on social media now that I would never have thought, you know, I would have been able to have these conversations with. Like, I've been talking to some guys this week, you know, who are out on massive gigs looking after unbelievable players and musicians and artists. And I'm
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: like, yeah, this is a different world now. I mean that comes because I've worked hard and and you know, tried to be good and a decent person. So, you know, you kind of earn the respects of your peers in that way. But but the opportunities are so vast now versus before. Cause you just if you think before you had to know someone who was local to you, right? You had to kind of get
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: involved in your local scene. Whereas now you can you can kind of go out on your first tour with an artist from a different part of the world or a different part of the country at least, you know. Because
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Yep.
Steve: it's as long as you you know y you might have to punish someone online a little bit. Hey, me again, just trying to, you know I'm still still grinding. Need any help? We'd love to help.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Yeah, still here. Yeah.
Steve: I think that's I would probably because I do love it, I like I don't want to play. I'm not bothered about playing. I play for fun sometimes, but I I love being a tech, I truly do. And I think i if it's it's kind of difficult because it it's hard to imagine, but if if I knew that it did what I wanted to do for certain, but had no experience. I think I would probably I'd probably do local crew and stuff. And then just try and try and make connections with the touring heads that came through that way.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: and then and get a gig in a back line s shop, you know, at somewhere like S I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay.
Steve: R or Centre Station or whatever, you any of them in Like your whatever your local version of that is. 'cause then
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Got it. That actually makes sense.
Steve: you end up getting s you know, you might get sent out on some corporate gigs or something doing that. You know. or or you're providing backline for a festival stage for the weekend and you've got f five drum kits in the back of a truck and a load of amps and some guitars and, you know, stuff.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that
Steve: I think that would be That would probably be how I approached it and seems to be the best option.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Have you noticed since we're talking about social media and and you're not like you're you're saying you don't really want to be a player, you love being a tech, and he does, by the way. Like you you 100% love this. But you've seen and you got a chance and you're getting more opportunities to work with the best of the best when it comes down to players, right? But we're seeing a a shift in social media with how people are approaching it, what people are gravitating towards on social media versus real applications on the gig. You're not sitting in the seat, but it's just cool because you get a first hand view of what's going on. Have you noticed a shift? And I'm gonna challenge you a little bit. Is there a hybrid of s maybe some of the stuff that you've seen on social media that's really cool? But stuff that you see that it's like if you do that on a gig though, that's
Steve: Yeah, is It's an interesting one for me 'cause I it I'm not hiring any of these people, so it can't you do whatever you want. Right. So for me,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure, sure, sure. Right, right, right.
Steve: I'm purely a I'm a consumer in that realm, I suppose. Like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, yes, yes.
Steve: I'm not it i whatever you do online is your business because it I'm I'm not I'm not paying your bills or hiring you. But I think there's two the kind of When sort of YouTube drumming became a thing, you know, like it was all crazy chops and just like really wild out there. So you know, like the guitar center drum off type videos, all that, and it was fucking amazing. We have my friend, but like it was unbelievable to watch. You're just going
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, sick, yeah.
Steve: like what was that? You know, because no one has seen it really, unless you were in the room. No one's seen people play drums like that before. Or especially not here. Especially
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's facts. Yep.
Steve: not over here. And then That sort of now there's there's so many people who've got these just outrageous chops, just mind blowing levels of technical ability.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: And but then you see the videos of a lot of these guys that are playing that can play this really crazy shit and what you see on the videos. You know what I mean? And that's and then I'm going,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: that's what I want to listen to. Right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep. Yep, yep, yep.
Steve: Someone's just like dialed. And then, you know, it's and then it's often what they don't play, right? That's what that's what gets ma gets me going. I'm like, what was that hold? You know? It's like look like it's gonna hit it,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. Yeah that what was that space right there?
Steve: doesn't and then
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: but then there's the I think the side of social like social media drumming that I don't like is there's a lot of people who are they've got these really well produced videos, they look great, but it you everything's triggered, you can hear it. And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: like I can see your arms moving and that backbeat ain't that consistent. There's no way it sounds like that.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: It just doesn't sound like that. I can see
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: the double on your foot and that beater ain't moving the same twice, so it didn't sound like that.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes, I understand.
Steve: And that
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Got it.
Steve: is a smoke and mirrors thing because people are you know, it's really easy to produce this unbelievable looking content at home for cheap now, versus before, you know, you would have had to hire a ridiculous studio and have all this crazy gear. But you can I mean you can make drum sound good with Yamaha E day E A D ten. Sounds sick, right? Well what for
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, very true. It's so cool though.
Steve: like six hundred bucks or something? Maybe a bit more, I don't know what they are, but
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: And like and a and a couple of lights and a GoPro and you're off.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You're good to go. Yep.
Steve: Right? And that's it's cool, but I don't know. I just think if but I guess there's also a a world in where that is the job, right? Where they're not trying to get the gigs. Like you make the money by doing them videos, and that's the gig. So I guess who th who am I to say it's shit? Because it's not, obviously. not shit, what's wrong with
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. It's just the application.
Steve: I would never say it's shit because I y you can tell that someone can still play. I just think that the end product is a bit more fabricated than is necessarily being shown.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I agree. I think there's there's an application for them both. You know, there's
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: and there's a space where you can go, go, go and showcase all this stuff, and there is a market for it.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: and there's a market for the people that may be on the other side of it, like myself. Like I that's not something I'm always into as a player. You know, that that's not naturally where I go to. I go to placement, I like proper precision
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: of certain things. I want to make sure that. Artist is comfortable, right? But my my vision of it is different. But they both work. I
Steve: Mm-hmm. Of course.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: think we get we get a little dicey sometimes when people like myself try to go to their social media realm and it's like, what you doing? And then they try to do the same thing over here. It's like, hey man, that's a lot. That's a
Steve: Yeah. Hey hey, hey, hey. But it's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: lot of notes.
Steve: I think th the reality of it though, f tell me if I'm wrong, but I think these days you've got to be able to do both, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: It's gotta be in there to play to to hold it back or absolutely send it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: And and you see that all the time on the you know the great pop arrangements like the MD, generally speaking, as a drummer, and they're like, there's gonna be sixteen bars somewhere for you to just go skit. Like it's coming somewhere. You've got to a
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Gotta go for it. Gotta go for it. Yep.
Steve: but you've got to be prepared for that bit to just send it to the moon. But also do it in a way that is interesting and not just the same shit that everybody else has just played, right? It's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: it's a world that just baffles my like I don't know how you guys come up with this stuff to be honest.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's it's listening, you know, that that that
Steve: Sure.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: that level of listening into what's there and I think it also depends on the room size. You know, some of
Steve: Mm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: the stuff that we were doing on the first round at the amphitheater stuff, I wouldn't take into the arena space. You know, the faster, quicker chops don't necessarily resonate when I got twenty thousand people
Steve: Well yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: here. You know, like
Steve: I mean if the backbeat from like the snare in real life hasn't finished reverberating at the back end of the arena and you've already played another fourteen notes, then forget about it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You're never gonna hear them. Is this let me make things easier? And I'm always so curious because you get a chance to see the best of the best like in real time. Like you're you're not through a screen, you're right next to me. You know, like I I can I can
Steve: Yeah. the best of the best.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Not not myself. All the rest of the great people you get a chance to
Steve: I was waiting I knew I was gonna get you somewhere, I was waiting for it, I was I was ready, I was like a cat, I was pouncing on something. Dude
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I g I you gotta watch monks. Monks pays attention. Nah.
Steve: God, you're looking
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's
Steve: at we ain't texting 'cause I'd have said something way worse if we were texting, bro
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No, our our text message should never be seen to the world ever.
Steve: No. Sorry, you sorry, go on.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No, but it it's it's I wanted your opinion on it because you do get a chance to see so many drummers of so many variations, right? Going from like warp
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: tours all the way up to major pop performances, you get a chance to see it all and you can see what resonates all the way up to if I'm saying to you, yo, monks, I want to go more of a dead sound, you typically have a head choice based off of what shells I'm using in size, and like you know.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: the s the wide range of things. So I would assume the same thing for as an observation. A tech you're seeing people who can go for it and then people who are a little more reserved or they might focus on just the parts. You know, like so I'm just always so curious to see what that observation is.
Steve: Yeah, I yeah, I don't know. It's interesting. It's not something I'd ever really thought about too too much, but now you made me think about it. I'm like, well yeah. 'Cause it
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: it is fun to watch. So what is cool when if you if you're on a gig and then someone has to get a dep in, it's fun to watch how somebody else approaches the same thing because you're trying to keep it as true to what what the artist is used to hearing. But
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: also like And it's usually those moments where there's like a lick or something that will just get played differently. The hits still gonna be the same, like the stab is still there, but the notes in between that might mix it up a little bit.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: you know, in like in a dance break or something where you can kind of take off, but as long as the hits are right so that the choreo's still kicking off, you know. And that that's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: where it's interesting to watch because people's approach is yeah, is just different. And that is really fun. 'Cause it You're watching the human brain in real time make very
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: conscious decisions that another human brain would just never have thought of. And that's all
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. That's the fun part. I think that's the that's the cuisine, right? We all love food, right? But now we're talking
Steve: Sure. Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: about the specific cuisine. Like, do I want Italian? Do I want Mexicans? Like they're still great.
Steve: Yeah. But it's the ingredients to create that type of Italian food though, right? Like is it a Sicilian pizza,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: is it a Napalese pizza or whatever, you know? Isn't Pizza Ranger's pizza?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bingo. That's the fun part.
Steve: Is it a New York pizza, you know?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: But I think that's the same thing about being a a
Steve: I'm hungry, huh?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: tech. I know, right? I'm starving right now. But that I think that's the same thing about being a tech, right? Like for you, there there's tons of different techs. If I take anyone that's like your your peer and you, you guys have a different way of approaching it, right? We can still
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: get to the end result. But do you find that maybe the guys that haven't gotten to your level yet, are you seeing like nuances? You're like, if you guys pay more attention to this kind of stuff. It would help.
Steve: I think so, but I but not necessarily through any fault of their own. I think that just comes with experience, right? You're just learning. Cause you know
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: even I'm constantly evolving with it. You know, I've I've not had this sort of like blueprint or framework that I've been doing the same every day for however many years it's been. It's like you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: just y you And that and it also changes again with the person that you're working with and the production that you're working with. You know, because you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: you have to you have to mix it up a bit because you it's if I was going to my studio and setting up my kit in my space on my own every day, then it's then you can have it exactly the same. But the reality of it is you're in in a space of many moving parts.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: but I think The only thing that I think younger people who are who are sort of coming through a lot of people want to hang out with the band, right? They want to be there to be seen kind of thing. And it's there's nothing wrong with hanging out with the band.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right, right.
Steve: If you get along with the band. But like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: but you ain't that guy. So like know your like know your role and and You know, if if if you can't drink five beers the night before and get up and not be a piece of shit, don't drink five beers the night before. Right? Like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure. Yeah.
Steve: get up on time, be at work and do a good job. And then you can start hanging out and you know, like I don't know, then because naturally you will, then you'll do stuff on days off together. You'll go out for the dinner, you'll go ride the roller coaster, whatever you know, whatever it is, you know,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: you you'll get invited to the You know, mom's in town, come for dinner. Nice to meet her, you know. Like sick, but
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: but if if your first thing is trying to be the cool guy, like at the end of the show, the first thing you do is go and give the set list out to the crowd, get over it. Like, come on, do the job. Do the job. And then you can do the cool shit that comes with it. Cause there is cool stuff that comes with it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I that's
Steve: You know, you we you are fortunate, you do get paid to go around the world and you know, I'm my thing is playing golf. It's no secret. But I'm fortunate that because I take work seriously, I can then go and play a really nice golf course on my day off. But I'm not there for the golf course. Right. I'm I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: without doing the good work, I don't get to play the golf course.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. That's the focus.
Steve: Is and I think that's the that would that should be the thing. It's like take it seriously because It it isn't that difficult, really. I said this earlier, like anybody could set up a memory lock drum kit. Tuning them's a different conversation entirely, but and like we're not even gonna go there right in a second, but but generally speaking, it's n you know you're not curing cancer, you know.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, yeah, I'm I'm totally with you. Yep.
Steve: So get that right and really concentrate, but and just be aware of your surroundings. Look at what what are other people doing? And and what you what will happen when you're on tour is that you will hear people complaining about what other people are doing all the time. Roadies love moaning about stuff. So if someone's always moaning about someone doing something, this person's always asleep in the crew room sofa. Someone's bag's always on the table. Don't put your bag on the table. Don't sleep in that chair through the day, go the bus. You know, like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: Learn those things that are gonna make people not resent being around you. Do all of that.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: You know, learn the the kind of the stupid nuancey bits as well.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I think that's important though, right? Because that's what that's what keeps people like you working for 20, 30 years. It's like it it's it you're able to
Steve: Very strong, come on.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: listen, man. I'm not saying you're old, but come on. No, no, but but that's what keeps us us, that keeps us working for for
Steve: Damn Yeah, I deserve that. One more
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: so long is that when someone throws your name out. They can trust that you have that awareness, right? They they they know that you're respectful to the pyro team. And if you are delayed 15 minutes of getting your kid on there, you're not gonna throw a hissy fit. You know, you you're
Steve: No, no.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: respectful to understanding that, okay, stage got built late, so that means kit can't get set up because what am I building it on? And you're not gonna cause a problem. That matters.
Steve: Well that's where I would always again, this is communication, right? Because if there's a delay, you can see it coming, like there's gonna be a delay. So the first thing I do is I'm texting you and I'm texting Zach, right? I set up a WhatsApp route, just the three of us. Doesn't need to be a big deal. Morning boys, if you're out for a run, carry on running. You know,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah. Yep.
Steve: like if you're out for lunch, don't don't rush because this is happening. I'm like, I'll have
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: it ready as quick as I can. This is a realistic time frame, keep you posted. Easy as that. Not difficult to do, and you're not going to turn around and be like, you know, like all pissed off with me about it, because you know that I can't. And if you are pissed off with me about it, good for you, because there's nothing I can do about it. Right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: There's nothing you can do, right.
Steve: So but as long as you're being transparent and honest and and up front, then that's kind of all it is, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. I've never worried I I've said this on another podcast about you though. It's like I've never worried about that. Like even when you would text or something like that, I'm like, if you're seeing that's gonna take a second, it's taking a second. It's not because you didn't care. It's not because you were out drinking late last night and wasn't capable. Like
Steve: Right, right, exactly.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Nope. It's because something else is going on right now. Thanks so much, man. If you need help with something, let us know. You're like, that's literally how that conversation goes, but To your point, I think that's a testimony to who you are and also why it's just so easy to refer you and just be around you.
Steve: But I think that was it that would be my kind of best advice really to anybody who's doing it. Even you know,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, okay.
Steve: at any level starting out all who's really b experienced, it's like just Try and see a bigger picture and know your bit of that and just be really, really good at that bit. You don't need to like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I love that.
Steve: I don't need to be worrying about whether the PA sounds good.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Now you're concerned.
Steve: You know what I mean? Like I don't I don't care if those fixtures are in the right place for lights. I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: don't I don't care. Good for you. But but they are because someone else feels that way about their bit. I'm not I'm not
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. Right. Yes, exactly.
Steve: disrespecting the lights or anything, just it's not my fucking job.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's not my job and everybody here is supposed to be a professional, so why do I need to care? Yep. I agree.
Steve: Yeah. Do your bit and then and then reap the rewards of that.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. Now I have to ask you the the nerdy stuff because people are gonna get pissed off if I don't. let's talk about tuning, man. Because that is a massive part about being a tech, right? You're tuning guitars, you're tuning drums, but I'm gonna talk about drums. Everyone compliments how great my kits have sounded. And every time I respond, I'm like, it's not me, it's monks.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Like I don't I didn't tune this. He tuned it.
Steve: Ha ha ha.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: What's your tuning methodology, right? Like where where are you starting? Are you having a conversation with the drummer first and seeing what they're looking for? And then are you choosing the heads with them? Like
Steve: Yeah. Always.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: what's what's your workflow today?
Steve: Always. it's always talk to the drummer. Find out what they 'cause find out what they do use and what they're trying to achieve. So if someone's trying to if someone is trying to have big sounding rock drums and they're using an eight, ten, twelve and a fourteen by twelve, we're already struggling here. So, you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: know, like but then I'm gonna but my did you see the shadow of that?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No.
Steve: Dude, a bird just flew so close to hitting the windows. Sorry. I go, holy my goodness.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Careful over there.
Steve: wow. That's from it right, I thought I saying. yeah, so if someone's using a certain size drum and they want a big rock sound, or a or a vintage sound, but they've got really modern small drums, I'm going, right, well, we can't buy a new kit, so what are we looking at here? So, okay, have you tried putting a coated head on the bottom?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: Go coated on the top and use something thicker for both of them so that they're gonna get a bit more warmth, you know. And it's like, what can I do to manipulate the equipment we have to try and create closer to this? Okay, you're not gonna get it right every time. It's not it's not quite as easy as that. But then if and if someone's saying, like for you, you basically wanted everything to be to be popping but dying, right? So it's so
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep. In and out.
Steve: it goes. I'll always when I'm tuning a kit, I always start with the biggest drum first, apart from the kick, obviously like but the biggest tom first and then go backwards. From there. Because what what generally what you're looking for is kind of the lowest fundamental note from the lowest drum. Generally speaking. In
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay.
Steve: in a in a pop or rock world, is that's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Got it.
Steve: in my experience, obviously that's not every single gig, because if like a jazz or your floor tom like Bing.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Like like a twelve, yeah, one hundred percent.
Steve: But but like okay, you you might I think when I came in what did you have you have like vintage emperors on the f on the floors maybe?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, I think we had I think we were vintage members all the way around the black kit and then we changed it for
Steve: Yeah. And then so but then so you're going so with the no resolhead on it and we just want it to be like low, deep but fast. So it goes, I go, why don't we try a P four? 'Cause it's a bit thicker, right? And then it's got the the extra mill around the edge, which is going to control that sound even more. So it's just it'll just kill it a bit quicker. And then you throw forty five moon gels on it like you like to do. But without the moon gel already, it's it's getting closer to that sound that That you're thinking of.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: Right? And then I think people people are obsessed with having the same head on every drum. And it's like, well, you don't need to to do that. You can put a P4 on an 18 inch floor tom and then have whatever. You can have a pinstripe on the 16 and have like an emperor on the 12 and an ambassador on the 10 if you want. Right? Because
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah.
Steve: you might be able to get that 10 to go a little bit. Because if you haven't got an eight, but you want the 10 to go a bit higher, put something thinner on it, it's gonna go there.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. So you're you're always
Steve: And then
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: thinking about the metric of what we're trying to achieve. And then
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: the e how did you learn
Steve: Thanks.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: the dynamics of how these heads resonate with each other though? Because that's a that's a very unique skill, right? That's
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: not as simple as like a single
Steve: Think just
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: ply head, a double ply. Like they all they're not all made different. He said do it.
Steve: think just doing it. Well honestly, I know that sounds like such a crap answer, but it is just experience, right? But I have worked with a lot of kids and I used to this is so lame and I'm gonna sell myself out here, but when I was younger, I used to love taking my drums to bits. Like I would take the screws out of them I was cleaning the the screws from the like the lug boxes with a toothbrush and then just like whatever heads I could find, new or old, put them on. And put them on the wrong way, you know, like put the pinstripe on the bottom
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: and just see what happened. And that that that was it, it's just purely trial and error. And you you know you're not always gonna be able to have the luxury of having loads of heads lying around, but if you do, j just try it. You try and create a sound and cause you find when you go into like studios to do records. Drums, they so some of them sound so crap in the room.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: But because of what that you're trying to translate into the the arrangement of the music, it actually sounds great. You know, it works, but if you heard the drum on its own, you go fug. But that's but
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, what is that?
Steve: I think that's and that's the kind of the wizardry of tuning the drums, isn't it? Because it's not i when you're tuning a guitar, it's either E A D G B well you know, like it says E and then it's you know, the light goes green.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right, right, right, right, right.
Steve: But i yeah, so it's just experimenting and then it Yeah, I don't know. You just kind of learn and you can you can do all the research. You can read about what what would resonates in a certain way and what what the bearing edge does with where it touches the drum head, you know, and what what's a die cast hoop gonna do versus You know, a triple flying super whatever. You all that stuff's out there to re and that will be so boring to talk about, so we're not doing
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: But it's so, but it is so important though, because I even learned that, right? Going from like I'll give a real example since we're we're talking about it. The black kit, which is a reference pure kit, and then the orange kit, which is a reference one kit, feels very different. And they
Steve: Does it?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: they feel different because of the hoop. The shells are technically the same, the heads were exactly the same. It was the dang hoop, and I'm like. What is this? Like I'm talking to Q, I'm talking to you about it. I'm trying to f I'm calling all of my other pro homies, talking to John. I'm like, what is this difference? And they're like, it's the hoop. Why? Like
Steve: It was wild 'cause they wouldn't go. I remember the first time taking that kit out of the box. I mean it were great, but it just wouldn't go up there, would it?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It wouldn't do it. It just w
Steve: Versus versus the black kit. It was and it was wild, but it is. It's the hoop. That's exactly what it is.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I I didn't even know that, but I'm like, I should know that and I'm glad I'm learning that. But there were so many things of when we were going back and forth and trying to figure out what heads to use because the drums weren't responding the right way. You were able to throw out so many suggestions and I'm like, let's just do it. Let's just find out the right way to figure it out. Cause we don't know right now. Let's just get a bunch of heads. Like you went and picked them up. You know, we were we were making calls back and forth. You know, the remote is just trying to figure out what we can do, it can't do.
Steve: But that's why like w we were lucky in that situation 'cause Roger Arimo, absolute superstar, you know, he
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Superstar.
Steve: he linked us in with Tina and they, you know, they put us a bunch of heads aside for me to drive to the thing and go get him but 'cause they don't really do that. And that's where I mean we were lucky there. But that you know what? That's another reason to try try and just be really good at what you do because then when you make that call, someone will do you a favour. We're like, fuck, we're going out in couple of days. Like we really need to figure this out. Can you do me a solid? Yeah, man.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's but it's that's relationships and that's the power of just being a good person, man. So it's it's you.
Steve: yeah, sorry, I I wasn't I don't mean the only reason that I am nice is because I want something bad. That's not at all what I'm saying.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No, I know that. Yeah. And fuck anybody who tries to say something different. That's that's not your spirit. You know, you you don't have a hidden agenda that way. You your only focus is the show. You know, it's like I want the show to be right, and part of that job for
Steve: And I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: you is make sure the drums are right.
Steve: Course. But it's that's where it's it's really fun and and important to have the conversation with you and this is where it's important to have that relationship with your artist because when it wasn't quite working I could have easily just turned around and gone I don't know, what do want?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: Like well this is what they sound like, you know, like I can tune this way, but that drum doesn't change because of what it's made out of. What do you want me to fucking do about it? But instead
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: it's like, No, let's We have we are fortunate. We have these rehearsal days. We have this time. And the dancers and everybody else can go home, but we can stay here all night if you want. You know what we paid for.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: Like we can do that. Or we can come in early tomorrow. Like we're in a really
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. But we
Steve: fortunate position to be able to do that. So let's utilize that. And it's no secret. I hate being in rehearsal. You know that.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, it's boring it's boring for you.
Steve: Because it it is, but if there's stuff to be doing, I'll stay there till the sun comes up. You know, like
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bingo.
Steve: and that's that's the whole point. And that and that's where you can have some fun, because you can experiment with the stuff and get your hands on on different types of equipment and you know channel that and fulfill that nerd. Right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. Now you don't just I mean, yeah, but that's the that's the gate though. Like you're able to when you care, you're okay spending another thirty minutes, an hour, two hours, five if
Steve: Yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: we need to, to make sure it's right. You know, but once it's right, you're like, Okay, great, we we have it dialed in and lock in.
Steve: Mm-hmm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Every single night. But I think that's the testimony to that level of care. That's what I was talking about initially, where I was, where is the youth into you? Right? The people up and coming, it doesn't have to be youth. It's people that just might be a little more green to the the industry. And you, I'm like, that's the level of care that I noticed. Like
Steve: Mm-hmm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I I didn't worry. It was just something that was just very comforting about how you were approaching them. I'm like, well, that's Where did he learn that? You know, why is that the thing? And you're like, bro, I I just love doing this. Like it's it's you genuinely love doing it.
Steve: And it is that though. It is actually that. And it's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: and I think I just I don't see the point in doing if you don't care about what's the point. And but there's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: listen, man, there's days where I wake up and I can't be asked. Of course, like everyone has shitty days, and that's fine. But it's when the shitty
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes, that's fine.
Steve: days are when the shitty days become shitty weeks, or it's like, this guy's having a good day, that's when it's a problem, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. that's we can even talk about that too, because that's that's touring, right? We we're literally living with strangers at first. Like everyone just gets a random call and is like, show up at this place at this time.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: And you're like, all right, I guess. And then you show up and you you gotta figure it out. But once we get on the road, that's when you start seeing, like, okay, you had an argument with your girl, you had an argument with your boyfriend, or maybe you lost the dog on the road. Like, Or great stuff happens, right? Like you gotta figure out a way to almost like stay at the medium in the
Steve: Mm-hmm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: extremes. I think you're great at that. You know, you're able to navigate those spaces.
Steve: What you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: And how did you even develop that? Right? Was that through trial and error? Was that kind of just observation? Because
Steve: Yeah, trial and error. I think more error than tr than trial. Like when I was
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: when I was younger and kind of starting out touring, I mean I partied a lot more than I do, but I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: and I but I was I would just be I was grumpy dude. Like I used to get I had kind of small man syndrome a little bit, you know. I was like I was a a small fish in a big pond trying to, you know, trying to make a point. I I was starting doing bits of stage managing and stuff like that and I'm you know in charge of these big dudes who were carrying all this heavy shit. So I was trying to make a point of trying to fuck it, you know, like be really
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Steve: big bollocks and I'm and I'm and I'm not looking you know what I mean? and I my attitude was Pretty shocking on some days, I won't lie. It was but one thing that I did always have going for me, if I was ever a piece of shit to somebody, I will always go and apologise. Always. Because in the moment, it generally it's never personal. It's just it's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: a it's a reaction that I've had to teach myself to be better at not reacting in a certain way because I was I was kind of an arsehole to be honest. But never
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: not no, I wasn't an arsehole because it wasn't on purpose, but I would I would make poor decisions that would lead to uncomfortable conversations and unnecessary confrontations. Right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: And then in term from from learning how to sort of take a beat before I flip my shit is that's just helped me going like, you know, growing as a person and at work to to try and Try and stay in that middle bit. Because and then I think the thing is though, if you then when you do have that moment, people go, like, there must be a reason for this, right? 'Cause he I've never seen him do that before. Whereas if you're losing
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Yes. Right. Yes.
Steve: losing your mind every time, you know every time someone moves moves a fly case, then it's you you're da y it's gotta be a long day.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Very long time. I think that's the power though, right? Is like it understanding that most people around you right now are probably trying their best. You know, and and and that goes for something. And and doesn't mean they get an excuse to fuck off, but it does mean that, hey, I don't need to fire off at you with such harsh words, or it doesn't need to be as sharp. But also sometimes I need you to be a little more professional too, and realize like me saying something very direct is not mean.
Steve: C there's a difference there and and I think learning that is so important and that is something that I have learnt because there's a difference between being straight up and being aggressive. That's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: it's not the same.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I agree with you. That's that's touring, man. That that's learning that massively because people will people will refer you or not refer you based off how you made them feel.
Steve: Correct. Well, 'cause no one wants to be you no one wants to live in a right, let's look at it like this. You would never put twelve to fourteen people in an apartment that size. Like a tall bus.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bingo. Yes.
Steve: You like that can you imagine? And and
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That'd be crazy.
Steve: and then 90% of them peop people are also strangers. This is like the weirdest TV show ever. It's like Big Brother on steroids, right? Like the TV like regular, like you guys can't do this shit. You guys are insane. Like they would get shut down so
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It it's so true. So true.
Steve: fast. We're like, nah, that's not all right. So y no one wants to live with in those in those quarters, like close quarters like that, with someone who's like not cool to be around or or
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: is you know has really terrible hygiene, you know, like no one wants to sit on a flight to Australia for twenty four hours next to someone who's kind of an arsehole. Right? Like you just don't. It's and
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's all that.
Steve: and it's y yeah, you've got to be really good at the job, but And this isn't news, like we all say the same shit. Every single one of us that works in this industry says this. You've got to
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: be good, but it's more about your personality.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep. Yep. I'm noticing that people take that I'm noticing that they're taking it too literal though. And people are focusing on go ahead, yeah, you're about to Yes. The
Steve: Right. That as well, so this is but this is what I'm saying, you've got to be good at the job though. That's what I'm saying. Cause it isn't just about being a good hanger.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: People are falling too heavily on, they're super fun. You don't
Steve: Mm.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: want to be the person that starts off the conversation saying, they're a good person.
Steve: my god.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: And I know it sounds bad. It sounds bad, but everybody knows what I'm saying. It's like, I don't know, like they're really nice. shit.
Steve: You tell a bat you see a band playing in a local bar like, yo, you guys look like you're having fun up there.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right. It's that type of response. it's so true. It's like, dang, we we just led with the antics and we led with the per, but we're here to do a job. Nope. Okay. But that I'm
Steve: man, that's all Yeah. That's funny.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: glad you're you're saying that in everybody, like you're saying, everybody that's been on the show has all said that, by the way. It's it's yes, be a good hang, be fun to be around, be able to. Can we have a conversation about like, how's your girl? You know, what how's your kids? Are you
Steve: Yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: you know, be be able to be personable if someone's like, hey man, my son's calling, like it's a bad thing going on. Can I step outside? Yeah, 100%, man. Do your thing. But can
Steve: Of course. But you shouldn't be having that conversation until someone trusts you with the job part of it. That's what I'm saying before.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes.
Steve: Like, don't come in and just try and be everyone's best friend if you ain't good at the job, because there's no po like no one's there to make friends. If you make friends while you're out, good, like cool, that works out. But if if not, like you still have a job to do. The same as every other person in the world who has to go to work.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep. I that's that's a perfect way of saying that. Now you also do a bunch of other stuff too. we've just mainly talked about teching, but you do stage managing. I've s you were running playback or something, you you you hopped in
Steve: Yeah, I mean running playback is strong. I've I've plugged it in
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: HAHHH
Steve: up once, you know what I mean? Like I was I wasn't programming nothing. it's just like I wouldn't be putting
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I text him, I'm like, well, what's going on right now?
Steve: it in going on the C V as that, you know what I mean? Like Yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Copy that. But that's dope. Do you have a preference of what you do? Do you do you have a lane you feel more strongly? Are you just
Steve: Yeah, I mean I love being a drunk tech dude. I I enjoy stage management as well. I truly do. It's great fun. the and the like I because I like the puzzle of that. You know,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: when you've got you know, you've got a bunch of trucks. I mean the biggest level I've done it at was kind of like arenas, but not but not on a production like we had. It was, you know, I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Okay.
Steve: think I think I I think it was six or seven trucks. So it's still a good amount of shit, but not
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: St Yeah.
Steve: Still no joke, but it's n it wasn't like twenty odd, you know. And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: I and I like it 'cause I enjoy the yeah, the puzzle and I like the the sort of the sense of achievement at the end of the day. Like when you go in and it's a bit of a pig of a loading or something 'cause the docks a bit crap or the floor's uneven or the storage is not great. And then, you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: know eight of the local hands haven't shown up and and or one of the trucks crashed on the way, you're going, right.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: How do we do this then? You know. And then you you you have to adapt in the moment quickly and try and just try and figure out a new way to facilitate this thing that needs to be the exact same as last night. And I and I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: really enjoy that. But in the same breath, you know this is it depends on on on y you, I suppose, because you're the person who has to negotiate your rate. But I just find like I'm not a lazy person, but the amount of extra hours f for verse for financial reward, it ain't
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: worth it. On d for me at least. On but it depends on the gig, you know, 'cause it
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, that's fair.
Steve: if if it's a smaller gig and it's like if you're out on a theatre thing and you've got like one or two trucks, then it's a different story 'cause you're can still be done by midnight, half twelve, you know? But it's like if you're faffing about with
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure.
Steve: twenty hour trucks till three o'clock in the morning and then you're back in at five or six, I'm like I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: I mean, I'm getting old. I can't you know, I can do it for a
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Brutal.
Steve: weekend, but I can't be going on doing that for
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's a
Steve: months.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's a tough schedule. That's a very tough schedule.
Steve: Yes, my it's not. And so much respect to the guys that do it. But they but the people doing it at that level are so good at their job that they've got it down to an art. They've got their routine. They know in the afternoon they're gonna, you know, like they'll have the trucks ticked by eleven o'clock, whatever, midday, and then they know that they're gonna get that sleep in. Because I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. They gotta go to sleep.
Steve: was kind of still learning that I just wasn't getting the sleep, but it's big I didn't have the routine. I wasn't good at it yet.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: I was good at the people side of it, but I was shit at the the sort of managing it for myself, I guess.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, but that's a bat that's a massive part of that is like this the self-soothing part of it because you're not always gonna have your best friend or you're not gonna find someone you're always gonna be able to mesh with and be able to vent with, but
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: you still gotta know like you travel with your suitcase, one, and your golf clubs. You know, like you're but but this is a testament to cause you know you are. Like you need to find a course, like you need to go play. And I noticed. You're you come back a lot more here. And not that you were like ever crazy, but you like that, right? Like you going out, taking a truck or renting a car and then going out to the mountains or going out. You love that. That's your thing.
Steve: Yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You know, that that's like home for you. That's a big part of touring. Like I'm a I'm an introvert.
Steve: Yeah. Close it, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I no one really sees me when on off days, right? That I but I need that. I tried to do
Steve: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You know, I tried to do the outings and things like that, but I realized the next day I was miserable. Like I never got
Steve: Yeah, yeah. Well you
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: that reset.
Steve: no one like you're never seeing me at a big group dinner on a talk. And it's not because I don't like people, I'm just not doing it. I can't but that whole environment stresses me out. And that's a me problem. So I just I make it
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: clear that it isn't you guys. This is me. I don't
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: like going to the restaurant with a big group of people where someone's gonna not be able to have the thing that they want, and then getting the bill is gonna be a pain in the arse, and we have to split or I'm well I've no, I'll meet you at the bar afterwards. I'm not coming. Because
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: that's because of me. I'm not
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: It's not because I wanna hang out with y'all, it's because I'm gonna be a piece of shit in that situation. It's gonna annoy me, which is gonna then make
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: me it's gonna make you uncomfortable, which is gonna then make me uncomfortable again. Why am I gonna be No, keep that. I'm good. See you later.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's the name of the game, though, is knowing that. Once you know it, you just all right, I'm I'm gonna see you guys later. I'll I'll see you guys tomorrow or whatever. That's
Steve: Yeah, yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: that's touring. That's part of being successful at touring for so long, is knowing that that right there is important because you'll fuck around and get put in that situation and feel like you have to do it, otherwise you're fired or you're not a cool person.
Steve: Yes, or fan.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's not a thing. Go live your life.
Steve: And if it is, you're in the wrong group of people. Do you know what I mean? Like you no one's dictating how you should like doing your free time, shut up.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Last thing I wanted to ask you, man, was do you have any just like pieces of advice for people who are maybe musicians but maybe might be stronger at something else like stage managing or you know being a tech or doing something else and maybe fighting that because you know, you originally want to be a player, but then I think you had the realization of I kinda enjoy this. I'm able to get in faster here and like I'm still kinda this is fun. Do you have any advice in that sense of like how to maybe
Steve: I I think you've just gotta be honest with yourself. Maybe set like a timeline. So like if you're it depends on your age and your situation,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: but like if you're saying, Right, if I'm I wanna be a session player, I'm gonna move move to London or move to LA or to Nashville or you know, whatever, if in 18 months or two years I haven't got this amount of consistent gigs, then I'm gonna try something else. This and I
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right.
Steve: this is going to be the backup, whichever way around you want to do it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: Like, and you know, obviously make your own parameters within that, but I would say that that's probably a smart thing. And I I think from a tech in point of view, what I have seen a lot of, and this really, really bugs me, is there's a lot of people who are techs who want to be the guy, brother. Like I I I worked, I'm not gonna name any names, but I worked with a a great metal player a couple of years ago, a few years ago now. And
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm-hmm.
Steve: you know, I went in, I didn't know this guy. I knew a couple of people on the team, I didn't know this guy, great player. and he told you know, we're just hanging out. It's the same thing, like I had the phone call with him. So
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Steve: I had the phone with him. One of the first things he told me, right, the last tech that he had, the like on the first day, told him that he knew how to play all the parts. I was like, why are you I was like, who was that? And I said this to the drummer, I was like, tell me who that is so that I never recommend this guy for anything. I don't want to be associated with people like that. Like,
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, right, right, right. Yeah.
Steve: you're allowed to want to play, but you're not allowed to want to play that gig.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Ooh.
Steve: Because if you want to play that gig, go and fucking audition for that gig.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: Right? You you can't nah. And there will be times where may if you've been there for a minute where you you they might ask you to do a favor, you know what I mean? Like last minute, hop up. I've done it, but I never wanted
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah. Yep.
Steve: to I never wanted it.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That wasn't your intention.
Steve: N no, of course not. But you'll do it in a moment. And I'm like, I can get through it, but it's not gonna be the same. But if you know, if we need
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: to make a gig app and whatever. But like, yeah, you can you're allowed to want to play, but you're not allowed to want to play that gig. And if you do, get out of because you're the thing, you're lying to yourself as well, and you're not gonna enjoy it because you're gonna resent the person that you're looking after. You're not gonna do a good job, and you're not
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: gonna be happy. So what's the point? You might like I can't think of anything worse than touring and not being happy. Like go home. Like get a normal job. Have your partner. Have the dog. You know, like go to Pilates every
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, do it all.
Steve: Tuesday, whatever. It you know, like eat
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah, seriously.
Steve: your home food. Like you don't need to be spending sixty bucks on a Shake Shack every day for dinner, you know, like on Uber Eats or some shit. Like Do you know what I mean though? Like if
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: It's so true, so true.
Steve: It's like yeah, that that's my biggest advice if you if you wanna do commit to either one of them. Right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yeah.
Steve: Or or if you commit to both. Separate Like just
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You have to do that.
Steve: just own it. Like, like when you're being a playback guy, you're the playback guy, you're not the drummer. When I'm the tech, I'm the tech. When I'm you know, when I'm the stage manager, I'm the stage manager. And you know, when I so when I the last stage managing gig that I did properly, well, no, not last. But a few ago, I was the drum tech on that before.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Mm.
Steve: And then I got the stage managing gig and the drum tech that came in. Like I knew them and they're really nice, but I think they were a bit like nervous is probably too strong, but they were aware that I was the tech for a minute, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Sure, sure.
Steve: So then they were asking me for advice and stuff, and I was like, Yeah, I'll tell you anything you want to know about the player and you know, all these things. But then like on the show day, this tech was asking me, like, how does the kit sound? And I'm like, I don't I don't care. Cause it's not my job, right? Like, ask your player, ask your front house engineer. What does it sound like to
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Doesn't matter, yeah. Right. Right.
Steve: them? I don't care this isn't my realm. No disrespect. But like this
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's what you're hired to do. Yeah.
Steve: exactly. And that's and I think that's it. So whatever part you play from you know, whatever I'm I don't want to list it 'cause I don't want to make it seem like anything's in any kind of order, but any job or all within a production, do your bit and do it well. And you you can't go wrong, really. Play to that, I think.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep. I think that's a that's a I mean, but that's a golden nugget though.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I think everybody struggles with that one sometimes, man. And it it looks like sometimes like a lot of guys can can do both, right? They they can play and they can play or they they play back and the important thing though.
Steve: And that's fine, good for you.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Right, but it it's it's like a great example is like could I MD something? Sure. But if I wasn't hired to MD, my opinion doesn't matter.
Steve: Right. Unless you're if you're but if your home is with the MD and then they ask you for a a creative imp or an opinion, then yeah, of course. But don't
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: B yes.
Steve: be going into a gig with the MD going, I wanna be the MD, because you're not. And the MD isn't higher in the MD, funny enough.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: You're not and that's that gets dicey. Right. That is so dude, yes. Case in point right there, man. Done.
Steve: I'm not sure.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: So what's next for you, man? What where what do you go off to next that you can or can't talk about?
Steve: no I'm I've got what am I doing? I've got a few shows left with this UK band, the Wombats, like indie band. Super fun gig and I do
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Which is sick. So sick.
Steve: I do drums, bass and playback on that. Playback, I plug it in. But like drums and bass. I s
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I'm putting it on your resume for you.
Steve: but it's super fun, man. It's a three piece band, they've been at it for twenty odd years, like it's very chill. It's it's
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: That's great.
Steve: yeah, I mean you gotta still take it seriously, but it's it's a very relaxed atmosphere. Like so I do that, last few shows of the summer with them, and then I go out with an Irish boy band called Westlife.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Ooh.
Steve: who they is it they s like their twenty fifth anniversary, maybe or something, twenty twenty fifth anniversary, but they they like in the nineties or like late early two thousands, they were it was like the Backstreet Boys but Irish. They're like massive, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: sick. Yeah, okay.
Steve: so I've been out I did that a few years back. I was looking after this guy Julian Brown. Unbelievable player. Yeah, he's such a sicko.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Let's go.
Steve: so we go out on that and that runs from it's like August well we have rehearsals at the tail end of August. And then it takes us through to like twenty-seventh of November, so it's a good old stint, and that's just UK and Europe.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Wow.
Steve: Yeah, it's a lot of shows. I think we're in obviously with them being Irish, I think I think we do 14 nights in the arena in Dublin.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: is it fourteen consecutive?
Steve: There's like it's some days off but we n I don't think we have to take it out, so that's nice.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: No lo douta or you win. You win.
Steve: I don't know if we do. I mean if we do, there's only a few gaps, so if we do then it's not. But yeah, I mean I'll be I'll be playing some golf.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bro, that that right there is a touring dream. It's like get to be stationary for two weeks at least.
Steve: Brother. I know. Well it's actually longer. I think we're there like Ye with the days off, I think it's three weeks that we're there. I know. And then and then we do the rest of UK and then a couple of weeks in Europe at the end of it. and then and then it's December and I am going on vacation. And if anybody calls me, no you didn't.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Ha ha ha ha.
Steve: Respectfully. Right, call me in
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yep.
Steve: January. I'm out. I'm I just I'm tired.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bro, I'm so pumped for you, man. I'm excited to see all the rigs and all the good stuff of all the great shit you do, man.
Steve: Thanks you, sir. I think we've got a new rig coming for this Westlife thing actually. he Jules alluded to that the other day. I don't know what it is, so that's that'll be fun. Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: I'm excited. I'm so excited. I'm more excited for our next kit build because people keep asking me when the next one is. They were like, When's
Steve: Yes, sir. my god.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: our next video? I'm like, I gotta get the kit first. And then I also need monks. So I I can't do this.
Steve: Yeah.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: This is simple, guys, but man, I just want to say thank you for for being you.
Steve: Thank you, brother.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Thank you for taking the time. I know this wasn't easy, especially being you're in a
Steve: No man.
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: whole different space in time in the world right now. but bro, thank you, man. I I love you so much and
Steve: thank you, man. It's been an honor. I like like I've watched all these the names of people that are on this. I was like this guy wants to talk to me about it. Like this is sick. Truly it's an honor. So thank you. Like and you know and you're my
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Yes. Easy. Well, thanks.
Steve: point. So it makes it super fun. It's just like hanging out, right?
Jarvis 'Jeb' Barnes: Bro. That's it. You're like, what we gotta prep anything? Nope. Just come talk to me. That's it. We'll we'll get through all the shit we gotta get through, but it it's easy to chat with you. It's easy just to be around my homie, man. So love you, man. And thanks everybody for listening.
Steve: Much love.