WEBVTT
00:00.271 --> 00:14.221
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to be very passive aggressive, very judgmental, had a lot of challenges in silence, had a hard time expressing myself, really didn't love confrontational situations or things like that.
00:15.181 --> 00:21.306
[SPEAKER_01]: I just started practicing figuring this out and that's then when I started writing about what I was
00:21.946 --> 00:25.430
[SPEAKER_01]: seeing change because the way that I was communicating was changing.
00:25.951 --> 00:28.975
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was becoming way more intentional with my language.
00:29.736 --> 00:37.224
[SPEAKER_01]: Usually we want the other person in this moment to validate us and make us feel better and say, oh, I totally understand, right?
00:37.285 --> 00:38.146
[SPEAKER_01]: But we don't get that.
00:38.226 --> 00:41.530
[SPEAKER_01]: So in the moment our work is, can we own our own discomfort?
00:42.010 --> 00:50.040
[SPEAKER_01]: The possible really helps because what it does is it makes it so that you become more human in these moments, right?
00:50.640 --> 00:59.771
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of us who think we're just setting our ways and it really is possible to learn a new way of connecting with yourself and other people.
01:01.820 --> 01:06.841
[SPEAKER_00]: What if you could handle workplace conflict without shutting down, blowing up, or backing away?
01:06.861 --> 01:17.164
[SPEAKER_00]: Today, we're diving into a hidden crisis in the workplace, poor communication, which is a leading cause of corporate errors costing companies hundreds of thousands each year.
01:17.184 --> 01:24.626
[SPEAKER_00]: In today's episode, renowned communication experts Cynthia Kane joins me to share insights from her new book, The Pause Principle.
01:25.066 --> 01:34.893
[SPEAKER_00]: She opens up about her personal journey and how it shaped her approach to mindful communication tools that can transform not only professional dynamics, but also personal relationships.
01:35.273 --> 01:41.297
[SPEAKER_00]: So even if you're not currently in a workplace setting, the strategies that Cynthia discusses here are incredibly beneficial.
01:41.777 --> 01:45.800
[SPEAKER_00]: But before we get there, I quickly want to encourage you to leave a rating and review for the podcast.
01:46.320 --> 01:47.961
[SPEAKER_00]: If you've yet to do this, pause the episode.
01:48.001 --> 01:52.624
[SPEAKER_00]: It takes thirty seconds or less and it is the best way to help others continue to find the show.
01:52.984 --> 01:55.805
[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you so much in advance to those of you who choose to do that today.
01:55.825 --> 01:59.968
[SPEAKER_00]: And with that, let's get to the conversation with Cynthia.
01:59.988 --> 02:08.332
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, it's so great to talk with you.
02:08.372 --> 02:10.293
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so glad that we're able to make this happen today.
02:10.313 --> 02:11.434
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean too.
02:11.694 --> 02:13.035
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm very excited to connect.
02:13.930 --> 02:17.192
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm certainly so you have this book, The Pause Principle.
02:17.913 --> 02:28.900
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that this is specifically written for the workplace, but we can use a lot of the principles that we'll be talking about today, not just in the workplace, but in our homes with our spouses, with our friends, with our children.
02:29.000 --> 02:34.544
[SPEAKER_00]: So I would say that even for listeners that aren't necessarily working outside of the home that these tools can absolutely be used.
02:34.944 --> 02:38.767
[SPEAKER_00]: So before we get into that conversation, why don't you go ahead and briefly introduce yourself.
02:38.807 --> 02:40.388
[SPEAKER_00]: Tell me how you became an author.
02:40.908 --> 02:41.208
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:41.469 --> 02:43.190
[SPEAKER_01]: So my name is Cynthia.
02:44.759 --> 02:50.402
[SPEAKER_01]: And I got into my work in a very roundabout way.
02:50.883 --> 02:55.106
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to be very passive aggressive, very judgmental.
02:57.127 --> 03:06.293
[SPEAKER_01]: Had a lot of challenges in silence, had a hard time expressing myself, really didn't love confrontational situations or things like that.
03:07.214 --> 03:07.494
[SPEAKER_01]: And I
03:09.475 --> 03:16.038
[SPEAKER_01]: didn't notice at the time how the way that I was interacting was affecting my relationships necessarily.
03:16.378 --> 03:17.478
[SPEAKER_01]: I had no awareness of it.
03:17.878 --> 03:26.742
[SPEAKER_01]: I just thought like, okay, this is just how I am and you know, I would always see other people interacting very differently, but I just thought this was my lot here.
03:27.242 --> 03:34.025
[SPEAKER_01]: So I didn't notice any of that though until I lost my first love unexpectedly and my whole world just
03:35.413 --> 03:37.635
[SPEAKER_01]: completely went blank at that period of my life.
03:37.975 --> 03:41.478
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was trying to figure out how to feel better in the world.
03:42.499 --> 03:50.005
[SPEAKER_01]: And no matter how many people were there to love and support me, it just was that moment where I realized I had to figure it out on my own.
03:50.705 --> 03:56.269
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that's when I started reading a lot of books and going to courses and seminars and
03:57.090 --> 03:59.231
[SPEAKER_01]: trying really everything in anything.
03:59.251 --> 04:07.855
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of my friends had suggested going to the Shambales Center when I lived in New York and it was a writing and meditation weekend.
04:08.395 --> 04:11.436
[SPEAKER_01]: And writing had always been a love of mine.
04:11.516 --> 04:12.857
[SPEAKER_01]: It was definitely something that
04:14.130 --> 04:19.375
[SPEAKER_01]: was how I expressed myself even when I was a little writing poetry and things like that.
04:20.196 --> 04:25.261
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought, OK, this would be a good opportunity, maybe, to work through what I was going through.
04:25.381 --> 04:29.325
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's when I was really introduced to meditation.
04:29.345 --> 04:37.493
[SPEAKER_01]: That was when I really, for the first time ever, was really allowing myself to feel everything that I was feeling during that situation enrollment.
04:38.394 --> 04:41.739
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also learned elements of right speech and Buddhism.
04:41.940 --> 04:46.146
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's when while I was going through kind of all this stuff.
04:47.320 --> 04:49.841
[SPEAKER_01]: I was figuring out communication was such a big part of it.
04:50.481 --> 04:55.562
[SPEAKER_01]: And how I was communicating really was affecting the way that I was living in the world.
04:56.402 --> 05:02.664
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when I learned the elements of speech and Buddhism, which were tell the truth, don't exaggerate, use helpful language and don't gossip.
05:02.704 --> 05:04.485
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought, OK, this is it.
05:04.545 --> 05:06.405
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I can figure this out.
05:06.685 --> 05:09.326
[SPEAKER_01]: I really want to be able to speak in a kind of honest and helpful way.
05:10.346 --> 05:13.927
[SPEAKER_01]: And I woke up the next day being like, how in the world do you actually do it, right?
05:14.567 --> 05:18.468
[SPEAKER_01]: So I just started practicing figuring this out.
05:18.728 --> 05:26.030
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's then when I started writing about what I was seeing change because the way that I was communicating was changing.
05:26.550 --> 05:34.852
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was becoming way more intentional with my language and how I was interacting with myself and how I was interacting with other people.
05:35.733 --> 05:37.133
[SPEAKER_01]: And everything from there,
05:38.353 --> 05:40.335
[SPEAKER_01]: seem to just kind of blossom.
05:40.355 --> 05:45.600
[SPEAKER_01]: That's when I wrote my first book, how to communicate like a Buddhist and talk to yourself like a Buddhist and how to meditate like a Buddhist.
05:45.640 --> 05:49.723
[SPEAKER_01]: And then this last book, the pause principle really came out of the
05:51.530 --> 06:04.945
[SPEAKER_01]: the feeling that we get into these challenging situations a lot or difficult moments a lot and they can be very unexpected and how do we access ourselves in that moment to be able to show up in a way that we really want to, right?
06:05.345 --> 06:09.129
[SPEAKER_01]: So that we're not kind of going back in our heads and set it how we
06:09.770 --> 06:21.783
[SPEAKER_01]: Express ourselves or didn't say something and just seeing the need for the space between that stimulus and the response and what do we do to expand that discomfort that we feel like that's sneezed.
06:22.623 --> 06:22.924
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
06:23.741 --> 06:24.041
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
06:24.562 --> 06:26.784
[SPEAKER_00]: So how long would you say, do it take you?
06:26.864 --> 06:28.125
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, a couple of questions.
06:28.145 --> 06:29.166
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess a two-part question.
06:29.586 --> 06:36.713
[SPEAKER_00]: When you first started studying this approach, again, it goes back to the elements of the Buddhist practice that you're implementing here.
06:37.113 --> 06:42.959
[SPEAKER_00]: But it really that comes down to mindfulness and tapping into the prefrontal cortex to not be as reactive.
06:43.439 --> 06:50.464
[SPEAKER_00]: So from when you started pursuing that knowledge to when you really felt like it started taking effect, how long was that?
06:50.624 --> 06:56.668
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I guess the second part of the question is, do you still have moments where you forget to apply these principles?
06:57.509 --> 06:58.850
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yes, one hundred percent.
06:58.970 --> 07:01.011
[SPEAKER_01]: I have moments where I forget to apply the principles.
07:01.432 --> 07:04.193
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that also that to me is a part of the practice, right?
07:05.094 --> 07:12.801
[SPEAKER_01]: the idea of remembering to be present for getting to be present in the discipline of noticing and just re engaging and refocusing.
07:13.342 --> 07:20.408
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, you know, I started practicing this work in twenty twelve, twenty eleven, twenty twelve.
07:21.189 --> 07:26.954
[SPEAKER_01]: And I would say that I really started noticing changes in the way that I was connecting with myself.
07:27.895 --> 07:36.766
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably, I mean, within twenty-twelve, definitely, after, you know, just a few months, three, four months, um, started noticing chefs and changes.
07:36.786 --> 07:38.147
[SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't really figure out why.
07:39.361 --> 07:58.056
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, or what was really happening, but then, you know, what's lovely now is so many studies have come out around mindfulness and meditation that really show that my brain was actually changing, you know, parts of my brain and the prefrontal cortex and moving out of the limbic system and all of that.
07:58.597 --> 07:58.837
[SPEAKER_01]: So,
08:00.498 --> 08:20.066
[SPEAKER_01]: I would say about four months where I really started to notice a difference in how I was living in the world and then it became just daily practice, falling off, getting back on, understanding that that is really a part of coming back into recommitting to living more intentionally.
08:20.677 --> 08:26.802
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely, so in your book, the pause principle, you introduce the softened practice for handling these conversations.
08:26.882 --> 08:31.786
[SPEAKER_00]: So can you walk me through what softened stands for and how it can transform workplace communication?
08:32.186 --> 08:36.489
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so soften is usually in those challenging moments.
08:36.589 --> 08:37.210
[SPEAKER_01]: We tense up.
08:37.290 --> 08:40.973
[SPEAKER_01]: We get really hard and, you know, it makes it really challenging.
08:41.673 --> 08:44.015
[SPEAKER_01]: And so our work is to do the opposite of that.
08:44.055 --> 08:48.839
[SPEAKER_01]: Can we actually soften in ground in the moment so that we can choose our direction?
08:49.359 --> 08:50.140
[SPEAKER_01]: So soften
08:50.900 --> 08:52.761
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the practice of softening.
08:53.282 --> 08:58.045
[SPEAKER_01]: So, as stands for sensation, and that's really the prerequisite for everything, right?
08:58.105 --> 09:06.310
[SPEAKER_01]: In mindfulness, the idea of really becoming aware of in this situation, like what is happening within you in these difficult moments.
09:06.830 --> 09:14.092
[SPEAKER_01]: So we all have a sensation that's happening in us and sometimes we feel it, sometimes we don't feel it, sometimes we ignore it, sometimes we push it away.
09:14.572 --> 09:21.194
[SPEAKER_01]: And sensation means more like maybe your jaw gets tight or you feel nauseous or your heart starts beating faster.
09:21.234 --> 09:27.596
[SPEAKER_01]: You start sweating like mine is just like I just feel tons of heat and it's like this balloon that's like arising into my face.
09:28.303 --> 09:31.184
[SPEAKER_01]: So we all have some sensation that happens.
09:31.744 --> 09:33.865
[SPEAKER_01]: We start paying attention to the discomfort.
09:34.365 --> 09:36.806
[SPEAKER_01]: When we notice the discomfort, that's like the cue.
09:37.426 --> 09:38.687
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, here I am.
09:38.847 --> 09:41.868
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to probably react in the same way that I always react.
09:43.314 --> 09:53.722
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, because I'm feeling the sensation, I can bring in a practice, I can bring in a tool to help me soften in the moment so that then I can interact in a kind of medicine helpful way.
09:54.323 --> 09:58.226
[SPEAKER_01]: So sensation is the first piece, then the rest are different practices.
09:58.747 --> 10:01.489
[SPEAKER_01]: So O stands for own your own discomfort.
10:02.269 --> 10:08.735
[SPEAKER_01]: Usually we want the other person in this moment to validate us and make us feel better and say, oh, I totally understand.
10:09.555 --> 10:10.436
[SPEAKER_01]: But we don't get that.
10:10.496 --> 10:13.839
[SPEAKER_01]: So in the moment our work is, can we own our own discomfort?
10:14.300 --> 10:19.504
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's different practices we can do to help ourselves feel seen by ourselves in that moment.
10:20.565 --> 10:24.409
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the F stands for focus on the present moment.
10:25.009 --> 10:27.850
[SPEAKER_01]: So usually we are caught up in the language of the other person.
10:27.910 --> 10:29.291
[SPEAKER_01]: We get very distracted.
10:29.411 --> 10:30.772
[SPEAKER_01]: We start fighting with words.
10:31.312 --> 10:40.477
[SPEAKER_01]: So this practice is really, you feel the sensation and then you maybe start labeling what you see around you or you start asking, what are my hands doing?
10:40.837 --> 10:41.737
[SPEAKER_01]: What's my feet doing?
10:42.037 --> 10:43.398
[SPEAKER_01]: What are my, what's my belly doing?
10:43.878 --> 10:47.580
[SPEAKER_01]: And it just sits that moment to distance yourself, right?
10:48.000 --> 10:51.142
[SPEAKER_01]: And we engage with the present moment so that then you can come back.
10:52.042 --> 11:19.080
[SPEAKER_01]: T is take a breath we've all heard that one before like just take a breath before you say something or think before you say something and it's so I mean it sounds so simple but it's very difficult to implement so in this regard it's more you feel that temptation and then yes you can take a breath but I also feel like breath patterns are really great so you can just inhale for five holds for five exhale for five right and then the E is eyes toward another
11:20.200 --> 11:26.326
[SPEAKER_01]: And usually we turn the other person into the enemy in challenging moments.
11:26.726 --> 11:28.788
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that we want to do that.
11:28.848 --> 11:30.290
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just naturally what happens.
11:30.330 --> 11:35.735
[SPEAKER_01]: They become more of the thing that is making us feel attacked or threatened in some way.
11:36.396 --> 11:40.399
[SPEAKER_01]: So our work in that moment is can I see that person through friendly eyes?
11:41.260 --> 11:43.360
[SPEAKER_01]: And so there's lots of practices you can do for that.
11:43.521 --> 11:53.183
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the last one is N, which is need to say, and usually we are so focused in moments of like what we need to say to the other person, right?
11:53.343 --> 12:00.164
[SPEAKER_01]: And we always think if we just had the right words, there wouldn't be any reaction from the other person, which is not possible, by the way, right?
12:00.724 --> 12:08.806
[SPEAKER_01]: Our work in the moment is what do we need to say to ourselves so that our body feels calm, we feel
12:09.682 --> 12:22.427
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, safe in that moment because it's really about us feeling that rest in the moment of chaos so that we can talk in a calm, compassionate and concise and clear way.
12:22.707 --> 12:24.208
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what softness.
12:24.748 --> 12:26.029
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, that's so, so good.
12:26.089 --> 12:32.011
[SPEAKER_00]: And like we said at the beginning, this can be applied to all the relationships in our life, not just ones.
12:32.632 --> 12:32.932
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
12:33.232 --> 12:33.532
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
12:33.982 --> 12:44.486
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I do want to touch on the workplace here because corporate miscommunication can often cost organizations thousands of dollars per employee when this gets messy.
12:44.506 --> 12:47.107
[SPEAKER_00]: HR nightmares, just what I'm imagining.
12:47.988 --> 12:50.989
[SPEAKER_00]: So what are some of the most common communication pitfalls that you see?
12:51.029 --> 12:52.290
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe just give a few examples.
12:52.790 --> 12:55.931
[SPEAKER_00]: And then how can the pause principle help avoid those?
12:56.151 --> 12:56.311
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:58.052 --> 13:23.900
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of challenges, especially for those who are in like more managerial positions or people within HR conversations that have to happen with others around just giving feedback, general feedback on performance, whether it's maybe having to let somebody go from a team, maybe it's having to deal with personal issues,
13:24.660 --> 13:30.701
[SPEAKER_01]: that are coming up that maybe are, you know, distracting others from doing their work.
13:31.161 --> 13:34.402
[SPEAKER_01]: Really a lot of times what happens is difficult conversations.
13:34.482 --> 13:39.783
[SPEAKER_01]: People will avoid having difficult conversations because they're really nervous for the other person's reaction.
13:40.083 --> 13:47.045
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's also a lot of guilt associated too because we have a lot of personal relationships with the people that we work with, right?
13:48.185 --> 13:50.566
[SPEAKER_01]: And so we're going to have to continue to work with them.
13:51.106 --> 13:53.486
[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of people will just ignore it.
13:53.966 --> 13:57.527
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it will end up blowing up, you know, however many months later.
13:58.167 --> 14:02.848
[SPEAKER_01]: And the result is way worse than if it was handled directly in the beginning.
14:03.229 --> 14:07.850
[SPEAKER_01]: The other piece too, I think that happened is we think of these kinds of conversations as really big.
14:08.410 --> 14:17.552
[SPEAKER_01]: And they don't have to be there much bigger in our minds than when we actually start to work on really what we want to talk to or what needs to be said.
14:18.432 --> 14:25.878
[SPEAKER_01]: The possible really helps because what it does is it makes it so that you become more human in these moments.
14:26.499 --> 14:40.370
[SPEAKER_01]: You're able to access yourself to connect with the other person that you're talking to so that you're able to listen to what they have to say and then you're also able to express yourself in a way that isn't heightened, right?
14:40.390 --> 14:46.415
[SPEAKER_01]: Because a lot of workplace interactions, the tone, the volume, like all of that gets
14:47.195 --> 14:48.836
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, swung in different directions.
14:49.817 --> 15:11.733
[SPEAKER_01]: And so really what it helps us do is it helps us create more of a space for engagement, for creativity, for collaboration, for people to feel seen and heard productivity really increases because people are way more engaged with what they're doing because they feel, they feel really, you know, well taken care of.
15:27.161 --> 15:29.922
[SPEAKER_00]: I used to work with someone and it wasn't a corporate setting.
15:29.962 --> 15:30.603
[SPEAKER_00]: I was a server.
15:31.303 --> 15:35.705
[SPEAKER_00]: But I had to not so great experience with someone.
15:36.646 --> 15:38.787
[SPEAKER_00]: And it really hurt my feelings at that point.
15:39.227 --> 15:46.690
[SPEAKER_00]: And as I started observing this person in the weeks following, I was like, oh, it's not just you that he treats this way.
15:46.730 --> 15:48.371
[SPEAKER_00]: This was like very early on working there.
15:48.951 --> 15:51.112
[SPEAKER_00]: But I started viewing him through a certain lens.
15:51.233 --> 15:55.014
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, it was just coming back to that mindfulness of saying, I towards the other.
15:56.555 --> 16:05.779
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, need to say is also important here because I didn't necessarily need to say everything I was thinking, but just observing him through that lens and saying, okay, maybe he's going through something.
16:05.899 --> 16:16.483
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know why he's behaving this way, but it's not worth me when getting so emotionally invested and to possibly erupting at him and losing my job.
16:17.764 --> 16:26.870
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that could be really hard in a corporate setting, especially maybe generalizing men when he go and having that one upmanship.
16:26.950 --> 16:31.813
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think these tools could be very valuable if you can just learn to practice them.
16:32.134 --> 16:32.314
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
16:32.594 --> 16:34.375
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it is all about practicing.
16:34.395 --> 16:35.336
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
16:35.896 --> 16:37.517
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't take very long to do.
16:37.577 --> 16:43.741
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's just taking one or two of these practices and implementing it in conversation and just seeing what works.
16:43.802 --> 16:45.523
[SPEAKER_01]: And then once you find the one that works,
16:46.290 --> 16:48.491
[SPEAKER_01]: than it becomes more of a go-to, right?
16:48.951 --> 17:02.999
[SPEAKER_00]: In talking about practicing and what practicing looks like for you practically, how are you practicing this and even going back to, when you first started being interested in this, what did that practically look like in your daily life?
17:03.319 --> 17:03.599
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, so,
17:05.780 --> 17:19.517
[SPEAKER_01]: what it looks like in twenty twelve and what it looks like now is really different because since twenty twelve i've gotten married i've had two babies i mean they're not babies anymore they're five and seven maybe they still are babies but so my practice in the way
17:21.038 --> 17:22.359
[SPEAKER_01]: has unfolded has changed.
17:22.880 --> 17:29.745
[SPEAKER_01]: I think in the beginning in twenty twelve, I definitely made it a point to meditate at least like twice a day, right?
17:30.246 --> 17:39.073
[SPEAKER_01]: Because meditation is really important outside of conversation to be able to start getting really comfortable in that quiet space, right?
17:39.873 --> 17:43.516
[SPEAKER_01]: And changing your relationship to yourself and your thoughts in that moment.
17:44.397 --> 17:48.780
[SPEAKER_01]: Because it really does kind of the way we are in meditation is the way we are in communication.
17:48.820 --> 17:49.781
[SPEAKER_01]: We get distracted.
17:49.861 --> 17:51.442
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we notice our distractions.
17:51.482 --> 17:56.125
[SPEAKER_01]: We come back to the person that we're talking to and we be in again, it's that same idea.
17:56.145 --> 17:56.305
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
17:56.906 --> 18:00.028
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it became more in the morning.
18:00.708 --> 18:03.150
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, I usually set an intention, right?
18:03.230 --> 18:05.372
[SPEAKER_01]: My intention for my communication for that day.
18:05.792 --> 18:07.033
[SPEAKER_01]: I still do this to this day.
18:07.173 --> 18:20.022
[SPEAKER_01]: My daily practice now is more I have an intention that I want to, you know, be more patient with my children today or my intention is to be very clear and compassionate with those I'm connecting with today.
18:20.563 --> 18:26.467
[SPEAKER_01]: My intention is to talk to somebody that I've never spoken to before and see if I can learn something about them, right?
18:27.890 --> 18:37.932
[SPEAKER_01]: my intention really sets kind of my direction for the day and direction for me is really important because that is what keeps me mindful, right?
18:38.452 --> 18:40.913
[SPEAKER_01]: I have something that I am aware of.
18:41.433 --> 18:49.955
[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing that I do also just in my day-to-day practices, there's specific things that are mindful objects for me, right?
18:50.195 --> 18:57.257
[SPEAKER_01]: So whether it's on my desk and it's this little cap that my daughter gave me, I see that and it reminds me to
18:58.257 --> 19:01.999
[SPEAKER_01]: pay attention to what my feet are doing, what my hands are doing to bring me into the present moment.
19:02.639 --> 19:08.321
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's really in my conversations where I'm using these practices pretty much all the time, right?
19:08.401 --> 19:11.462
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm paying attention to what's happening within my body.
19:11.482 --> 19:15.964
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm reminding myself of what I appreciate about the person that I'm talking to.
19:15.984 --> 19:24.887
[SPEAKER_01]: I am really paying attention to making sure that I am listening in the moment and allowing the other person to have a reaction and
19:26.928 --> 19:38.612
[SPEAKER_01]: really trying to practice what I teach because, I mean, everything came out of my personal experience and, I mean, I can't not do this work in my daily life anymore.
19:38.672 --> 19:42.474
[SPEAKER_01]: I just, it's not possible to go back to how things were, you know.
19:43.014 --> 19:46.055
[SPEAKER_01]: And now I only meditate about fifteen minutes a day.
19:46.595 --> 19:51.017
[SPEAKER_01]: Most of, like most of my practice comes from interacting with my children.
19:51.457 --> 19:56.359
[SPEAKER_01]: My husband, those I work with, you know, all the interactions we have daily.
19:57.018 --> 20:01.402
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I heard something interesting recently about meditation.
20:01.422 --> 20:06.967
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a Christian, and so I used it, not necessarily what I'm looking for.
20:06.987 --> 20:10.249
[SPEAKER_00]: I was going to say as a prayer, like I used that text prayer.
20:10.269 --> 20:13.432
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I was listening to a podcast in this man had said,
20:14.493 --> 20:38.342
[SPEAKER_00]: We so often go into that time asking or kind of spewing and really if you are just quieting the mind and listening to God or listening to what your higher power is, allowing for the quiet to tap into that listening, I think that can help drive those intentions from the day and it becomes less about us in the self-centered thing and more about
20:38.982 --> 20:40.665
[SPEAKER_00]: something greater for the greater good.
20:40.685 --> 20:47.915
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that in general, when we get our eyes off the focus of ourselves, we are just better for it.
20:47.955 --> 20:51.660
[SPEAKER_00]: And we can go into our workplace or again, fill in the blank where your day leads you.
20:51.680 --> 20:52.721
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, much better.
20:52.741 --> 20:53.402
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
20:53.442 --> 20:54.944
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also think that it is in that
20:55.445 --> 21:00.989
[SPEAKER_01]: that was space where you get to ask, you know, what is that higher power?
21:01.009 --> 21:12.018
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you know, like, can I have some of that piece that you have that, you know, like the wisdom that you have, right, to be able to understand what's happening in my life in those types of things?
21:12.138 --> 21:14.880
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's, it's a beautiful time, quiet space.
21:15.405 --> 21:26.114
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, again, just kind of setting up the intention for what is something I'm not even noticing, but I need here and it's only when I find silence that I'm able to listen.
21:26.134 --> 21:31.578
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think with meditation, it can be tricky because we just we can spiral so easily.
21:31.658 --> 21:35.141
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, that's what going back to your practice and doing that daily.
21:35.161 --> 21:37.763
[SPEAKER_00]: I love the idea of setting a daily intention.
21:37.823 --> 21:40.285
[SPEAKER_00]: I really need to get better about doing that because I think
21:40.745 --> 21:44.208
[SPEAKER_00]: When you just remind yourself of that, oh, I'm starting to lose my temper with my child.
21:44.489 --> 21:46.671
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, this guy worked that usually irritates me.
21:46.731 --> 21:47.872
[SPEAKER_00]: It started to creep in.
21:48.212 --> 21:50.674
[SPEAKER_00]: We just go back to what the intention is for the day.
21:50.694 --> 21:52.115
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if fill in the blank.
21:52.456 --> 21:54.257
[SPEAKER_00]: I, yeah, powerful tool.
21:54.998 --> 21:57.300
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I liken it to like a thesis statement.
21:57.520 --> 22:01.444
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you're constantly, you have something to come back to in each day.
22:01.864 --> 22:02.985
[SPEAKER_01]: You choose something different.
22:03.465 --> 22:06.969
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're not trying to do nine hundred and twenty-one things, right?
22:07.129 --> 22:17.218
[SPEAKER_01]: It's one task for the day is to see, like, what can my day look like if I put my attention on this intention, right?
22:17.479 --> 22:28.329
[SPEAKER_01]: Because again, it takes your attention off of those things that are distracting or unhelpful, or the remaining, and it brings your attention back to something that is more helpful and connected.
22:29.045 --> 22:29.866
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so good.
22:30.266 --> 22:34.449
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, was there anything that we didn't touch on that you wanted to make sure that you shared with Lesnar's before we wrap up?
22:35.609 --> 22:41.333
[SPEAKER_01]: I think one piece is more just, this is like a learned practice.
22:42.794 --> 22:47.397
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not something that any of us, I think, know how to do or about.
22:47.697 --> 22:55.122
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's something that we want to remember that it can be done at any time, right?
22:56.116 --> 23:00.320
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of us who think we're just setting our ways.
23:01.320 --> 23:05.884
[SPEAKER_01]: And it really is possible to learn a new way of connecting with yourself and other people.
23:06.785 --> 23:08.906
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really just a practicing, you know.
23:08.926 --> 23:10.668
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I think that would be it.
23:11.448 --> 23:21.450
[SPEAKER_00]: I do think that we live in a time where it is more of a challenge to tap into silence and quiet because there's just many things vying for our attention.
23:21.650 --> 23:24.731
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm definitely in VS of previous generations for that.
23:25.011 --> 23:25.271
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
23:25.571 --> 23:28.452
[SPEAKER_01]: I look at old photos of like my grandparents.
23:28.812 --> 23:29.712
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:29.732 --> 23:34.573
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just remember how much quiet there was in my life growing up, right?
23:35.633 --> 23:38.235
[SPEAKER_01]: like TVs were not on the time, there were no.
23:38.395 --> 23:39.796
[SPEAKER_01]: There were not a lot of distractions.
23:39.856 --> 23:44.639
[SPEAKER_01]: It was really such a more, it was really more of an intentional space.
23:45.099 --> 23:48.261
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything was done really with a lot of care and thought.
23:48.561 --> 23:58.046
[SPEAKER_00]: Even with, I mean, you could say this in the workplace or if you're waiting in line for the grocery store or it's something as silly as going to the bathroom, we take our phone with us to all of these places.
23:58.487 --> 24:03.450
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're not observing, we're not noticing, which I think observation and noticing helps us
24:04.430 --> 24:11.791
[SPEAKER_00]: maybe gain insight or empathy for people different than us if we're like in the grocery store line and we're observing a mom that seems to have a challenging day.
24:11.831 --> 24:14.412
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, oh, what could I do to be more empathetic?
24:14.452 --> 24:15.972
[SPEAKER_00]: How can I put that into my practice?
24:16.152 --> 24:19.953
[SPEAKER_00]: How I seeing that she's acting towards her kids that I don't want to act that way.
24:20.553 --> 24:21.733
[SPEAKER_00]: You just distract ourselves.
24:21.793 --> 24:24.534
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think there's a lot of the human experience that we're not.
24:24.554 --> 24:27.914
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I do think we're worse for it, unfortunately.
24:27.934 --> 24:29.115
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.
24:29.475 --> 24:29.755
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
24:30.215 --> 24:30.395
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:31.275 --> 24:36.178
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, where can listeners connect with you online or grab a copy of your book if they want to hear more?
24:36.198 --> 24:42.723
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so you can go to CynthiaKane.com, or you can check me out on Instagram at SiLyKaneOne.
24:42.743 --> 24:44.124
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm on YouTube as well.
24:45.044 --> 24:47.466
[SPEAKER_01]: And for my book, you can get it anywhere.
24:48.487 --> 24:49.147
[SPEAKER_01]: Books are sold.
24:49.767 --> 24:50.008
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
24:50.208 --> 24:53.450
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be sure to link all of that in the show notes for list, so they have an easy way to connect.
24:53.830 --> 24:56.632
[SPEAKER_00]: But as we wrap things up here, I want to ask you the final question.
24:56.692 --> 24:59.874
[SPEAKER_00]: And it is, what does it mean to you to live a life with clear intentions?
25:02.318 --> 25:03.938
[SPEAKER_01]: to live a life with clear intentions.
25:04.908 --> 25:06.709
[SPEAKER_01]: what it means to me is congruency.
25:07.290 --> 25:14.114
[SPEAKER_01]: It means that what is happening within the inside of me is also within the outside of me, right?
25:14.174 --> 25:17.997
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're aligned with going on within and outside.
25:18.417 --> 25:19.318
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what it means to me.
25:19.558 --> 25:20.418
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's so good.
25:20.438 --> 25:28.584
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I say something similar about people living out their values versus what they're making priority in their life, just writing down, what have I been making priority?
25:28.644 --> 25:31.406
[SPEAKER_00]: And then writing down their values and saying, like, is there a alignment here?
25:31.466 --> 25:32.466
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's what you're saying.
25:32.486 --> 25:32.566
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:33.627 --> 25:35.108
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, I'd like that.
25:35.609 --> 25:39.912
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, thank you so much for joining me today for bringing this information to us.
25:40.152 --> 25:44.716
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to walk away from this really trying to implement that idea of an intention every day.
25:44.776 --> 25:46.017
[SPEAKER_00]: So I thank you personally.
25:46.037 --> 25:46.437
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:46.497 --> 25:47.578
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you being here?
25:47.938 --> 25:48.799
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, thanks so much.
25:48.839 --> 25:50.440
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm happy we got this chance to connect.
25:52.726 --> 25:53.947
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you think of the episode?
25:53.967 --> 25:55.808
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you enjoyed the conversation.
25:55.828 --> 26:04.013
[SPEAKER_00]: To learn more about today's guests, including links or resources related to everything discussed today, check out the show notes in your podcast window.
26:05.594 --> 26:14.580
[SPEAKER_00]: If you'd like to support the podcast, the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is subscribe to the show on iTunes, Spotify, or YouTube, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
26:15.912 --> 26:18.374
[SPEAKER_00]: and leave a rating or review of your favorite episode.
26:18.995 --> 26:27.602
[SPEAKER_00]: Lastly, sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is so helpful and will encourage others as they set out to pursue a life with clear intentions.
00:00.271 --> 00:14.221
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to be very passive aggressive, very judgmental, had a lot of challenges in silence, had a hard time expressing myself, really didn't love confrontational situations or things like that.
00:15.181 --> 00:21.306
[SPEAKER_01]: I just started practicing figuring this out and that's then when I started writing about what I was
00:21.946 --> 00:25.430
[SPEAKER_01]: seeing change because the way that I was communicating was changing.
00:25.951 --> 00:28.975
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was becoming way more intentional with my language.
00:29.736 --> 00:37.224
[SPEAKER_01]: Usually we want the other person in this moment to validate us and make us feel better and say, oh, I totally understand, right?
00:37.285 --> 00:38.146
[SPEAKER_01]: But we don't get that.
00:38.226 --> 00:41.530
[SPEAKER_01]: So in the moment our work is, can we own our own discomfort?
00:42.010 --> 00:50.040
[SPEAKER_01]: The possible really helps because what it does is it makes it so that you become more human in these moments, right?
00:50.640 --> 00:59.771
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of us who think we're just setting our ways and it really is possible to learn a new way of connecting with yourself and other people.
01:01.820 --> 01:06.841
[SPEAKER_00]: What if you could handle workplace conflict without shutting down, blowing up, or backing away?
01:06.861 --> 01:17.164
[SPEAKER_00]: Today, we're diving into a hidden crisis in the workplace, poor communication, which is a leading cause of corporate errors costing companies hundreds of thousands each year.
01:17.184 --> 01:24.626
[SPEAKER_00]: In today's episode, renowned communication experts Cynthia Kane joins me to share insights from her new book, The Pause Principle.
01:25.066 --> 01:34.893
[SPEAKER_00]: She opens up about her personal journey and how it shaped her approach to mindful communication tools that can transform not only professional dynamics, but also personal relationships.
01:35.273 --> 01:41.297
[SPEAKER_00]: So even if you're not currently in a workplace setting, the strategies that Cynthia discusses here are incredibly beneficial.
01:41.777 --> 01:45.800
[SPEAKER_00]: But before we get there, I quickly want to encourage you to leave a rating and review for the podcast.
01:46.320 --> 01:47.961
[SPEAKER_00]: If you've yet to do this, pause the episode.
01:48.001 --> 01:52.624
[SPEAKER_00]: It takes thirty seconds or less and it is the best way to help others continue to find the show.
01:52.984 --> 01:55.805
[SPEAKER_00]: So thank you so much in advance to those of you who choose to do that today.
01:55.825 --> 01:59.968
[SPEAKER_00]: And with that, let's get to the conversation with Cynthia.
01:59.988 --> 02:08.332
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, it's so great to talk with you.
02:08.372 --> 02:10.293
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm so glad that we're able to make this happen today.
02:10.313 --> 02:11.434
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean too.
02:11.694 --> 02:13.035
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm very excited to connect.
02:13.930 --> 02:17.192
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm certainly so you have this book, The Pause Principle.
02:17.913 --> 02:28.900
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that this is specifically written for the workplace, but we can use a lot of the principles that we'll be talking about today, not just in the workplace, but in our homes with our spouses, with our friends, with our children.
02:29.000 --> 02:34.544
[SPEAKER_00]: So I would say that even for listeners that aren't necessarily working outside of the home that these tools can absolutely be used.
02:34.944 --> 02:38.767
[SPEAKER_00]: So before we get into that conversation, why don't you go ahead and briefly introduce yourself.
02:38.807 --> 02:40.388
[SPEAKER_00]: Tell me how you became an author.
02:40.908 --> 02:41.208
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
02:41.469 --> 02:43.190
[SPEAKER_01]: So my name is Cynthia.
02:44.759 --> 02:50.402
[SPEAKER_01]: And I got into my work in a very roundabout way.
02:50.883 --> 02:55.106
[SPEAKER_01]: I used to be very passive aggressive, very judgmental.
02:57.127 --> 03:06.293
[SPEAKER_01]: Had a lot of challenges in silence, had a hard time expressing myself, really didn't love confrontational situations or things like that.
03:07.214 --> 03:07.494
[SPEAKER_01]: And I
03:09.475 --> 03:16.038
[SPEAKER_01]: didn't notice at the time how the way that I was interacting was affecting my relationships necessarily.
03:16.378 --> 03:17.478
[SPEAKER_01]: I had no awareness of it.
03:17.878 --> 03:26.742
[SPEAKER_01]: I just thought like, okay, this is just how I am and you know, I would always see other people interacting very differently, but I just thought this was my lot here.
03:27.242 --> 03:34.025
[SPEAKER_01]: So I didn't notice any of that though until I lost my first love unexpectedly and my whole world just
03:35.413 --> 03:37.635
[SPEAKER_01]: completely went blank at that period of my life.
03:37.975 --> 03:41.478
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was trying to figure out how to feel better in the world.
03:42.499 --> 03:50.005
[SPEAKER_01]: And no matter how many people were there to love and support me, it just was that moment where I realized I had to figure it out on my own.
03:50.705 --> 03:56.269
[SPEAKER_01]: And so that's when I started reading a lot of books and going to courses and seminars and
03:57.090 --> 03:59.231
[SPEAKER_01]: trying really everything in anything.
03:59.251 --> 04:07.855
[SPEAKER_01]: And one of my friends had suggested going to the Shambales Center when I lived in New York and it was a writing and meditation weekend.
04:08.395 --> 04:11.436
[SPEAKER_01]: And writing had always been a love of mine.
04:11.516 --> 04:12.857
[SPEAKER_01]: It was definitely something that
04:14.130 --> 04:19.375
[SPEAKER_01]: was how I expressed myself even when I was a little writing poetry and things like that.
04:20.196 --> 04:25.261
[SPEAKER_01]: And I thought, OK, this would be a good opportunity, maybe, to work through what I was going through.
04:25.381 --> 04:29.325
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's when I was really introduced to meditation.
04:29.345 --> 04:37.493
[SPEAKER_01]: That was when I really, for the first time ever, was really allowing myself to feel everything that I was feeling during that situation enrollment.
04:38.394 --> 04:41.739
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also learned elements of right speech and Buddhism.
04:41.940 --> 04:46.146
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's when while I was going through kind of all this stuff.
04:47.320 --> 04:49.841
[SPEAKER_01]: I was figuring out communication was such a big part of it.
04:50.481 --> 04:55.562
[SPEAKER_01]: And how I was communicating really was affecting the way that I was living in the world.
04:56.402 --> 05:02.664
[SPEAKER_01]: And so when I learned the elements of speech and Buddhism, which were tell the truth, don't exaggerate, use helpful language and don't gossip.
05:02.704 --> 05:04.485
[SPEAKER_01]: I thought, OK, this is it.
05:04.545 --> 05:06.405
[SPEAKER_01]: Like I can figure this out.
05:06.685 --> 05:09.326
[SPEAKER_01]: I really want to be able to speak in a kind of honest and helpful way.
05:10.346 --> 05:13.927
[SPEAKER_01]: And I woke up the next day being like, how in the world do you actually do it, right?
05:14.567 --> 05:18.468
[SPEAKER_01]: So I just started practicing figuring this out.
05:18.728 --> 05:26.030
[SPEAKER_01]: And that's then when I started writing about what I was seeing change because the way that I was communicating was changing.
05:26.550 --> 05:34.852
[SPEAKER_01]: And I was becoming way more intentional with my language and how I was interacting with myself and how I was interacting with other people.
05:35.733 --> 05:37.133
[SPEAKER_01]: And everything from there,
05:38.353 --> 05:40.335
[SPEAKER_01]: seem to just kind of blossom.
05:40.355 --> 05:45.600
[SPEAKER_01]: That's when I wrote my first book, how to communicate like a Buddhist and talk to yourself like a Buddhist and how to meditate like a Buddhist.
05:45.640 --> 05:49.723
[SPEAKER_01]: And then this last book, the pause principle really came out of the
05:51.530 --> 06:04.945
[SPEAKER_01]: the feeling that we get into these challenging situations a lot or difficult moments a lot and they can be very unexpected and how do we access ourselves in that moment to be able to show up in a way that we really want to, right?
06:05.345 --> 06:09.129
[SPEAKER_01]: So that we're not kind of going back in our heads and set it how we
06:09.770 --> 06:21.783
[SPEAKER_01]: Express ourselves or didn't say something and just seeing the need for the space between that stimulus and the response and what do we do to expand that discomfort that we feel like that's sneezed.
06:22.623 --> 06:22.924
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah.
06:23.741 --> 06:24.041
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
06:24.562 --> 06:26.784
[SPEAKER_00]: So how long would you say, do it take you?
06:26.864 --> 06:28.125
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, a couple of questions.
06:28.145 --> 06:29.166
[SPEAKER_00]: I guess a two-part question.
06:29.586 --> 06:36.713
[SPEAKER_00]: When you first started studying this approach, again, it goes back to the elements of the Buddhist practice that you're implementing here.
06:37.113 --> 06:42.959
[SPEAKER_00]: But it really that comes down to mindfulness and tapping into the prefrontal cortex to not be as reactive.
06:43.439 --> 06:50.464
[SPEAKER_00]: So from when you started pursuing that knowledge to when you really felt like it started taking effect, how long was that?
06:50.624 --> 06:56.668
[SPEAKER_00]: And then I guess the second part of the question is, do you still have moments where you forget to apply these principles?
06:57.509 --> 06:58.850
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, yes, one hundred percent.
06:58.970 --> 07:01.011
[SPEAKER_01]: I have moments where I forget to apply the principles.
07:01.432 --> 07:04.193
[SPEAKER_01]: I think that also that to me is a part of the practice, right?
07:05.094 --> 07:12.801
[SPEAKER_01]: the idea of remembering to be present for getting to be present in the discipline of noticing and just re engaging and refocusing.
07:13.342 --> 07:20.408
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, you know, I started practicing this work in twenty twelve, twenty eleven, twenty twelve.
07:21.189 --> 07:26.954
[SPEAKER_01]: And I would say that I really started noticing changes in the way that I was connecting with myself.
07:27.895 --> 07:36.766
[SPEAKER_01]: Probably, I mean, within twenty-twelve, definitely, after, you know, just a few months, three, four months, um, started noticing chefs and changes.
07:36.786 --> 07:38.147
[SPEAKER_01]: I couldn't really figure out why.
07:39.361 --> 07:58.056
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, or what was really happening, but then, you know, what's lovely now is so many studies have come out around mindfulness and meditation that really show that my brain was actually changing, you know, parts of my brain and the prefrontal cortex and moving out of the limbic system and all of that.
07:58.597 --> 07:58.837
[SPEAKER_01]: So,
08:00.498 --> 08:20.066
[SPEAKER_01]: I would say about four months where I really started to notice a difference in how I was living in the world and then it became just daily practice, falling off, getting back on, understanding that that is really a part of coming back into recommitting to living more intentionally.
08:20.677 --> 08:26.802
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely, so in your book, the pause principle, you introduce the softened practice for handling these conversations.
08:26.882 --> 08:31.786
[SPEAKER_00]: So can you walk me through what softened stands for and how it can transform workplace communication?
08:32.186 --> 08:36.489
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so soften is usually in those challenging moments.
08:36.589 --> 08:37.210
[SPEAKER_01]: We tense up.
08:37.290 --> 08:40.973
[SPEAKER_01]: We get really hard and, you know, it makes it really challenging.
08:41.673 --> 08:44.015
[SPEAKER_01]: And so our work is to do the opposite of that.
08:44.055 --> 08:48.839
[SPEAKER_01]: Can we actually soften in ground in the moment so that we can choose our direction?
08:49.359 --> 08:50.140
[SPEAKER_01]: So soften
08:50.900 --> 08:52.761
[SPEAKER_01]: It's the practice of softening.
08:53.282 --> 08:58.045
[SPEAKER_01]: So, as stands for sensation, and that's really the prerequisite for everything, right?
08:58.105 --> 09:06.310
[SPEAKER_01]: In mindfulness, the idea of really becoming aware of in this situation, like what is happening within you in these difficult moments.
09:06.830 --> 09:14.092
[SPEAKER_01]: So we all have a sensation that's happening in us and sometimes we feel it, sometimes we don't feel it, sometimes we ignore it, sometimes we push it away.
09:14.572 --> 09:21.194
[SPEAKER_01]: And sensation means more like maybe your jaw gets tight or you feel nauseous or your heart starts beating faster.
09:21.234 --> 09:27.596
[SPEAKER_01]: You start sweating like mine is just like I just feel tons of heat and it's like this balloon that's like arising into my face.
09:28.303 --> 09:31.184
[SPEAKER_01]: So we all have some sensation that happens.
09:31.744 --> 09:33.865
[SPEAKER_01]: We start paying attention to the discomfort.
09:34.365 --> 09:36.806
[SPEAKER_01]: When we notice the discomfort, that's like the cue.
09:37.426 --> 09:38.687
[SPEAKER_01]: Okay, here I am.
09:38.847 --> 09:41.868
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm going to probably react in the same way that I always react.
09:43.314 --> 09:53.722
[SPEAKER_01]: Now, because I'm feeling the sensation, I can bring in a practice, I can bring in a tool to help me soften in the moment so that then I can interact in a kind of medicine helpful way.
09:54.323 --> 09:58.226
[SPEAKER_01]: So sensation is the first piece, then the rest are different practices.
09:58.747 --> 10:01.489
[SPEAKER_01]: So O stands for own your own discomfort.
10:02.269 --> 10:08.735
[SPEAKER_01]: Usually we want the other person in this moment to validate us and make us feel better and say, oh, I totally understand.
10:09.555 --> 10:10.436
[SPEAKER_01]: But we don't get that.
10:10.496 --> 10:13.839
[SPEAKER_01]: So in the moment our work is, can we own our own discomfort?
10:14.300 --> 10:19.504
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's different practices we can do to help ourselves feel seen by ourselves in that moment.
10:20.565 --> 10:24.409
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the F stands for focus on the present moment.
10:25.009 --> 10:27.850
[SPEAKER_01]: So usually we are caught up in the language of the other person.
10:27.910 --> 10:29.291
[SPEAKER_01]: We get very distracted.
10:29.411 --> 10:30.772
[SPEAKER_01]: We start fighting with words.
10:31.312 --> 10:40.477
[SPEAKER_01]: So this practice is really, you feel the sensation and then you maybe start labeling what you see around you or you start asking, what are my hands doing?
10:40.837 --> 10:41.737
[SPEAKER_01]: What's my feet doing?
10:42.037 --> 10:43.398
[SPEAKER_01]: What are my, what's my belly doing?
10:43.878 --> 10:47.580
[SPEAKER_01]: And it just sits that moment to distance yourself, right?
10:48.000 --> 10:51.142
[SPEAKER_01]: And we engage with the present moment so that then you can come back.
10:52.042 --> 11:19.080
[SPEAKER_01]: T is take a breath we've all heard that one before like just take a breath before you say something or think before you say something and it's so I mean it sounds so simple but it's very difficult to implement so in this regard it's more you feel that temptation and then yes you can take a breath but I also feel like breath patterns are really great so you can just inhale for five holds for five exhale for five right and then the E is eyes toward another
11:20.200 --> 11:26.326
[SPEAKER_01]: And usually we turn the other person into the enemy in challenging moments.
11:26.726 --> 11:28.788
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not that we want to do that.
11:28.848 --> 11:30.290
[SPEAKER_01]: It's just naturally what happens.
11:30.330 --> 11:35.735
[SPEAKER_01]: They become more of the thing that is making us feel attacked or threatened in some way.
11:36.396 --> 11:40.399
[SPEAKER_01]: So our work in that moment is can I see that person through friendly eyes?
11:41.260 --> 11:43.360
[SPEAKER_01]: And so there's lots of practices you can do for that.
11:43.521 --> 11:53.183
[SPEAKER_01]: And then the last one is N, which is need to say, and usually we are so focused in moments of like what we need to say to the other person, right?
11:53.343 --> 12:00.164
[SPEAKER_01]: And we always think if we just had the right words, there wouldn't be any reaction from the other person, which is not possible, by the way, right?
12:00.724 --> 12:08.806
[SPEAKER_01]: Our work in the moment is what do we need to say to ourselves so that our body feels calm, we feel
12:09.682 --> 12:22.427
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, safe in that moment because it's really about us feeling that rest in the moment of chaos so that we can talk in a calm, compassionate and concise and clear way.
12:22.707 --> 12:24.208
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what softness.
12:24.748 --> 12:26.029
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no, that's so, so good.
12:26.089 --> 12:32.011
[SPEAKER_00]: And like we said at the beginning, this can be applied to all the relationships in our life, not just ones.
12:32.632 --> 12:32.932
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.
12:33.232 --> 12:33.532
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, yeah.
12:33.982 --> 12:44.486
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I do want to touch on the workplace here because corporate miscommunication can often cost organizations thousands of dollars per employee when this gets messy.
12:44.506 --> 12:47.107
[SPEAKER_00]: HR nightmares, just what I'm imagining.
12:47.988 --> 12:50.989
[SPEAKER_00]: So what are some of the most common communication pitfalls that you see?
12:51.029 --> 12:52.290
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe just give a few examples.
12:52.790 --> 12:55.931
[SPEAKER_00]: And then how can the pause principle help avoid those?
12:56.151 --> 12:56.311
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
12:58.052 --> 13:23.900
[SPEAKER_01]: There's a lot of challenges, especially for those who are in like more managerial positions or people within HR conversations that have to happen with others around just giving feedback, general feedback on performance, whether it's maybe having to let somebody go from a team, maybe it's having to deal with personal issues,
13:24.660 --> 13:30.701
[SPEAKER_01]: that are coming up that maybe are, you know, distracting others from doing their work.
13:31.161 --> 13:34.402
[SPEAKER_01]: Really a lot of times what happens is difficult conversations.
13:34.482 --> 13:39.783
[SPEAKER_01]: People will avoid having difficult conversations because they're really nervous for the other person's reaction.
13:40.083 --> 13:47.045
[SPEAKER_01]: And there's also a lot of guilt associated too because we have a lot of personal relationships with the people that we work with, right?
13:48.185 --> 13:50.566
[SPEAKER_01]: And so we're going to have to continue to work with them.
13:51.106 --> 13:53.486
[SPEAKER_01]: So a lot of people will just ignore it.
13:53.966 --> 13:57.527
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it will end up blowing up, you know, however many months later.
13:58.167 --> 14:02.848
[SPEAKER_01]: And the result is way worse than if it was handled directly in the beginning.
14:03.229 --> 14:07.850
[SPEAKER_01]: The other piece too, I think that happened is we think of these kinds of conversations as really big.
14:08.410 --> 14:17.552
[SPEAKER_01]: And they don't have to be there much bigger in our minds than when we actually start to work on really what we want to talk to or what needs to be said.
14:18.432 --> 14:25.878
[SPEAKER_01]: The possible really helps because what it does is it makes it so that you become more human in these moments.
14:26.499 --> 14:40.370
[SPEAKER_01]: You're able to access yourself to connect with the other person that you're talking to so that you're able to listen to what they have to say and then you're also able to express yourself in a way that isn't heightened, right?
14:40.390 --> 14:46.415
[SPEAKER_01]: Because a lot of workplace interactions, the tone, the volume, like all of that gets
14:47.195 --> 14:48.836
[SPEAKER_01]: you know, swung in different directions.
14:49.817 --> 15:11.733
[SPEAKER_01]: And so really what it helps us do is it helps us create more of a space for engagement, for creativity, for collaboration, for people to feel seen and heard productivity really increases because people are way more engaged with what they're doing because they feel, they feel really, you know, well taken care of.
15:27.161 --> 15:29.922
[SPEAKER_00]: I used to work with someone and it wasn't a corporate setting.
15:29.962 --> 15:30.603
[SPEAKER_00]: I was a server.
15:31.303 --> 15:35.705
[SPEAKER_00]: But I had to not so great experience with someone.
15:36.646 --> 15:38.787
[SPEAKER_00]: And it really hurt my feelings at that point.
15:39.227 --> 15:46.690
[SPEAKER_00]: And as I started observing this person in the weeks following, I was like, oh, it's not just you that he treats this way.
15:46.730 --> 15:48.371
[SPEAKER_00]: This was like very early on working there.
15:48.951 --> 15:51.112
[SPEAKER_00]: But I started viewing him through a certain lens.
15:51.233 --> 15:55.014
[SPEAKER_00]: And again, it was just coming back to that mindfulness of saying, I towards the other.
15:56.555 --> 16:05.779
[SPEAKER_00]: Again, need to say is also important here because I didn't necessarily need to say everything I was thinking, but just observing him through that lens and saying, okay, maybe he's going through something.
16:05.899 --> 16:16.483
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know why he's behaving this way, but it's not worth me when getting so emotionally invested and to possibly erupting at him and losing my job.
16:17.764 --> 16:26.870
[SPEAKER_00]: I think that could be really hard in a corporate setting, especially maybe generalizing men when he go and having that one upmanship.
16:26.950 --> 16:31.813
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think these tools could be very valuable if you can just learn to practice them.
16:32.134 --> 16:32.314
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
16:32.594 --> 16:34.375
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it is all about practicing.
16:34.395 --> 16:35.336
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
16:35.896 --> 16:37.517
[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't take very long to do.
16:37.577 --> 16:43.741
[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, it's just taking one or two of these practices and implementing it in conversation and just seeing what works.
16:43.802 --> 16:45.523
[SPEAKER_01]: And then once you find the one that works,
16:46.290 --> 16:48.491
[SPEAKER_01]: than it becomes more of a go-to, right?
16:48.951 --> 17:02.999
[SPEAKER_00]: In talking about practicing and what practicing looks like for you practically, how are you practicing this and even going back to, when you first started being interested in this, what did that practically look like in your daily life?
17:03.319 --> 17:03.599
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, so,
17:05.780 --> 17:19.517
[SPEAKER_01]: what it looks like in twenty twelve and what it looks like now is really different because since twenty twelve i've gotten married i've had two babies i mean they're not babies anymore they're five and seven maybe they still are babies but so my practice in the way
17:21.038 --> 17:22.359
[SPEAKER_01]: has unfolded has changed.
17:22.880 --> 17:29.745
[SPEAKER_01]: I think in the beginning in twenty twelve, I definitely made it a point to meditate at least like twice a day, right?
17:30.246 --> 17:39.073
[SPEAKER_01]: Because meditation is really important outside of conversation to be able to start getting really comfortable in that quiet space, right?
17:39.873 --> 17:43.516
[SPEAKER_01]: And changing your relationship to yourself and your thoughts in that moment.
17:44.397 --> 17:48.780
[SPEAKER_01]: Because it really does kind of the way we are in meditation is the way we are in communication.
17:48.820 --> 17:49.781
[SPEAKER_01]: We get distracted.
17:49.861 --> 17:51.442
[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we notice our distractions.
17:51.482 --> 17:56.125
[SPEAKER_01]: We come back to the person that we're talking to and we be in again, it's that same idea.
17:56.145 --> 17:56.305
[SPEAKER_01]: Right.
17:56.906 --> 18:00.028
[SPEAKER_01]: And then it became more in the morning.
18:00.708 --> 18:03.150
[SPEAKER_01]: For me, I usually set an intention, right?
18:03.230 --> 18:05.372
[SPEAKER_01]: My intention for my communication for that day.
18:05.792 --> 18:07.033
[SPEAKER_01]: I still do this to this day.
18:07.173 --> 18:20.022
[SPEAKER_01]: My daily practice now is more I have an intention that I want to, you know, be more patient with my children today or my intention is to be very clear and compassionate with those I'm connecting with today.
18:20.563 --> 18:26.467
[SPEAKER_01]: My intention is to talk to somebody that I've never spoken to before and see if I can learn something about them, right?
18:27.890 --> 18:37.932
[SPEAKER_01]: my intention really sets kind of my direction for the day and direction for me is really important because that is what keeps me mindful, right?
18:38.452 --> 18:40.913
[SPEAKER_01]: I have something that I am aware of.
18:41.433 --> 18:49.955
[SPEAKER_01]: The other thing that I do also just in my day-to-day practices, there's specific things that are mindful objects for me, right?
18:50.195 --> 18:57.257
[SPEAKER_01]: So whether it's on my desk and it's this little cap that my daughter gave me, I see that and it reminds me to
18:58.257 --> 19:01.999
[SPEAKER_01]: pay attention to what my feet are doing, what my hands are doing to bring me into the present moment.
19:02.639 --> 19:08.321
[SPEAKER_01]: But it's really in my conversations where I'm using these practices pretty much all the time, right?
19:08.401 --> 19:11.462
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm paying attention to what's happening within my body.
19:11.482 --> 19:15.964
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm reminding myself of what I appreciate about the person that I'm talking to.
19:15.984 --> 19:24.887
[SPEAKER_01]: I am really paying attention to making sure that I am listening in the moment and allowing the other person to have a reaction and
19:26.928 --> 19:38.612
[SPEAKER_01]: really trying to practice what I teach because, I mean, everything came out of my personal experience and, I mean, I can't not do this work in my daily life anymore.
19:38.672 --> 19:42.474
[SPEAKER_01]: I just, it's not possible to go back to how things were, you know.
19:43.014 --> 19:46.055
[SPEAKER_01]: And now I only meditate about fifteen minutes a day.
19:46.595 --> 19:51.017
[SPEAKER_01]: Most of, like most of my practice comes from interacting with my children.
19:51.457 --> 19:56.359
[SPEAKER_01]: My husband, those I work with, you know, all the interactions we have daily.
19:57.018 --> 20:01.402
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I heard something interesting recently about meditation.
20:01.422 --> 20:06.967
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm a Christian, and so I used it, not necessarily what I'm looking for.
20:06.987 --> 20:10.249
[SPEAKER_00]: I was going to say as a prayer, like I used that text prayer.
20:10.269 --> 20:13.432
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but I was listening to a podcast in this man had said,
20:14.493 --> 20:38.342
[SPEAKER_00]: We so often go into that time asking or kind of spewing and really if you are just quieting the mind and listening to God or listening to what your higher power is, allowing for the quiet to tap into that listening, I think that can help drive those intentions from the day and it becomes less about us in the self-centered thing and more about
20:38.982 --> 20:40.665
[SPEAKER_00]: something greater for the greater good.
20:40.685 --> 20:47.915
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think that in general, when we get our eyes off the focus of ourselves, we are just better for it.
20:47.955 --> 20:51.660
[SPEAKER_00]: And we can go into our workplace or again, fill in the blank where your day leads you.
20:51.680 --> 20:52.721
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, much better.
20:52.741 --> 20:53.402
[SPEAKER_01]: I agree.
20:53.442 --> 20:54.944
[SPEAKER_01]: And I also think that it is in that
20:55.445 --> 21:00.989
[SPEAKER_01]: that was space where you get to ask, you know, what is that higher power?
21:01.009 --> 21:12.018
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, you know, like, can I have some of that piece that you have that, you know, like the wisdom that you have, right, to be able to understand what's happening in my life in those types of things?
21:12.138 --> 21:14.880
[SPEAKER_01]: I think it's, it's a beautiful time, quiet space.
21:15.405 --> 21:26.114
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, again, just kind of setting up the intention for what is something I'm not even noticing, but I need here and it's only when I find silence that I'm able to listen.
21:26.134 --> 21:31.578
[SPEAKER_00]: And I think with meditation, it can be tricky because we just we can spiral so easily.
21:31.658 --> 21:35.141
[SPEAKER_00]: But again, that's what going back to your practice and doing that daily.
21:35.161 --> 21:37.763
[SPEAKER_00]: I love the idea of setting a daily intention.
21:37.823 --> 21:40.285
[SPEAKER_00]: I really need to get better about doing that because I think
21:40.745 --> 21:44.208
[SPEAKER_00]: When you just remind yourself of that, oh, I'm starting to lose my temper with my child.
21:44.489 --> 21:46.671
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, this guy worked that usually irritates me.
21:46.731 --> 21:47.872
[SPEAKER_00]: It started to creep in.
21:48.212 --> 21:50.674
[SPEAKER_00]: We just go back to what the intention is for the day.
21:50.694 --> 21:52.115
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if fill in the blank.
21:52.456 --> 21:54.257
[SPEAKER_00]: I, yeah, powerful tool.
21:54.998 --> 21:57.300
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I liken it to like a thesis statement.
21:57.520 --> 22:01.444
[SPEAKER_01]: You know, you're constantly, you have something to come back to in each day.
22:01.864 --> 22:02.985
[SPEAKER_01]: You choose something different.
22:03.465 --> 22:06.969
[SPEAKER_01]: And you're not trying to do nine hundred and twenty-one things, right?
22:07.129 --> 22:17.218
[SPEAKER_01]: It's one task for the day is to see, like, what can my day look like if I put my attention on this intention, right?
22:17.479 --> 22:28.329
[SPEAKER_01]: Because again, it takes your attention off of those things that are distracting or unhelpful, or the remaining, and it brings your attention back to something that is more helpful and connected.
22:29.045 --> 22:29.866
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so good.
22:30.266 --> 22:34.449
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, was there anything that we didn't touch on that you wanted to make sure that you shared with Lesnar's before we wrap up?
22:35.609 --> 22:41.333
[SPEAKER_01]: I think one piece is more just, this is like a learned practice.
22:42.794 --> 22:47.397
[SPEAKER_01]: It's not something that any of us, I think, know how to do or about.
22:47.697 --> 22:55.122
[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's something that we want to remember that it can be done at any time, right?
22:56.116 --> 23:00.320
[SPEAKER_01]: So there's a lot of us who think we're just setting our ways.
23:01.320 --> 23:05.884
[SPEAKER_01]: And it really is possible to learn a new way of connecting with yourself and other people.
23:06.785 --> 23:08.906
[SPEAKER_01]: It's really just a practicing, you know.
23:08.926 --> 23:10.668
[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, I think that would be it.
23:11.448 --> 23:21.450
[SPEAKER_00]: I do think that we live in a time where it is more of a challenge to tap into silence and quiet because there's just many things vying for our attention.
23:21.650 --> 23:24.731
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm definitely in VS of previous generations for that.
23:25.011 --> 23:25.271
[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.
23:25.571 --> 23:28.452
[SPEAKER_01]: I look at old photos of like my grandparents.
23:28.812 --> 23:29.712
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
23:29.732 --> 23:34.573
[SPEAKER_01]: And I just remember how much quiet there was in my life growing up, right?
23:35.633 --> 23:38.235
[SPEAKER_01]: like TVs were not on the time, there were no.
23:38.395 --> 23:39.796
[SPEAKER_01]: There were not a lot of distractions.
23:39.856 --> 23:44.639
[SPEAKER_01]: It was really such a more, it was really more of an intentional space.
23:45.099 --> 23:48.261
[SPEAKER_01]: Everything was done really with a lot of care and thought.
23:48.561 --> 23:58.046
[SPEAKER_00]: Even with, I mean, you could say this in the workplace or if you're waiting in line for the grocery store or it's something as silly as going to the bathroom, we take our phone with us to all of these places.
23:58.487 --> 24:03.450
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're not observing, we're not noticing, which I think observation and noticing helps us
24:04.430 --> 24:11.791
[SPEAKER_00]: maybe gain insight or empathy for people different than us if we're like in the grocery store line and we're observing a mom that seems to have a challenging day.
24:11.831 --> 24:14.412
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like, oh, what could I do to be more empathetic?
24:14.452 --> 24:15.972
[SPEAKER_00]: How can I put that into my practice?
24:16.152 --> 24:19.953
[SPEAKER_00]: How I seeing that she's acting towards her kids that I don't want to act that way.
24:20.553 --> 24:21.733
[SPEAKER_00]: You just distract ourselves.
24:21.793 --> 24:24.534
[SPEAKER_00]: And so I think there's a lot of the human experience that we're not.
24:24.554 --> 24:27.914
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I do think we're worse for it, unfortunately.
24:27.934 --> 24:29.115
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree.
24:29.475 --> 24:29.755
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
24:30.215 --> 24:30.395
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.
24:31.275 --> 24:36.178
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, where can listeners connect with you online or grab a copy of your book if they want to hear more?
24:36.198 --> 24:42.723
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so you can go to CynthiaKane.com, or you can check me out on Instagram at SiLyKaneOne.
24:42.743 --> 24:44.124
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm on YouTube as well.
24:45.044 --> 24:47.466
[SPEAKER_01]: And for my book, you can get it anywhere.
24:48.487 --> 24:49.147
[SPEAKER_01]: Books are sold.
24:49.767 --> 24:50.008
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.
24:50.208 --> 24:53.450
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll be sure to link all of that in the show notes for list, so they have an easy way to connect.
24:53.830 --> 24:56.632
[SPEAKER_00]: But as we wrap things up here, I want to ask you the final question.
24:56.692 --> 24:59.874
[SPEAKER_00]: And it is, what does it mean to you to live a life with clear intentions?
25:02.318 --> 25:03.938
[SPEAKER_01]: to live a life with clear intentions.
25:04.908 --> 25:06.709
[SPEAKER_01]: what it means to me is congruency.
25:07.290 --> 25:14.114
[SPEAKER_01]: It means that what is happening within the inside of me is also within the outside of me, right?
25:14.174 --> 25:17.997
[SPEAKER_01]: So they're aligned with going on within and outside.
25:18.417 --> 25:19.318
[SPEAKER_01]: That's what it means to me.
25:19.558 --> 25:20.418
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, that's so good.
25:20.438 --> 25:28.584
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I say something similar about people living out their values versus what they're making priority in their life, just writing down, what have I been making priority?
25:28.644 --> 25:31.406
[SPEAKER_00]: And then writing down their values and saying, like, is there a alignment here?
25:31.466 --> 25:32.466
[SPEAKER_00]: So I think that's what you're saying.
25:32.486 --> 25:32.566
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:33.627 --> 25:35.108
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, yeah, I'd like that.
25:35.609 --> 25:39.912
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, Cynthia, thank you so much for joining me today for bringing this information to us.
25:40.152 --> 25:44.716
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to walk away from this really trying to implement that idea of an intention every day.
25:44.776 --> 25:46.017
[SPEAKER_00]: So I thank you personally.
25:46.037 --> 25:46.437
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.
25:46.497 --> 25:47.578
[SPEAKER_00]: Are you being here?
25:47.938 --> 25:48.799
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, thanks so much.
25:48.839 --> 25:50.440
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm happy we got this chance to connect.
25:52.726 --> 25:53.947
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you think of the episode?
25:53.967 --> 25:55.808
[SPEAKER_00]: I hope you enjoyed the conversation.
25:55.828 --> 26:04.013
[SPEAKER_00]: To learn more about today's guests, including links or resources related to everything discussed today, check out the show notes in your podcast window.
26:05.594 --> 26:14.580
[SPEAKER_00]: If you'd like to support the podcast, the easiest and most impactful thing you can do is subscribe to the show on iTunes, Spotify, or YouTube, or wherever you listen to podcasts.
26:15.912 --> 26:18.374
[SPEAKER_00]: and leave a rating or review of your favorite episode.
26:18.995 --> 26:27.602
[SPEAKER_00]: Lastly, sharing the show or your favorite episode with friends or on social media is so helpful and will encourage others as they set out to pursue a life with clear intentions.
