Vick Green: Today's conversation is one that I know you're gonna enjoy. It is with Terry Pierce. He's the lead pastor of Connect Church in Tupelo, Mississippi. And if you've been with Terry, if you know his story, then you have been inspired by him and by what God is doing through his church. What I love is that Terry is a perfect example of so many principles that we talk about about leading a disciple making movement.
Making Disciples with Replicate: Hey church leader, I hope these podcast episodes and the Movement Ready Church book that Robbie and I have written are helping you get disciple making started in your church. What I'm excited for in the next season is that we're taking the Movement Ready Church book to your church. We're doing one day workshops where myself or one of the navigators on our replicate team come on site to your church and work with your staff and leaders to take the principles of this book and to put it into action.
Vick Green: Man, so excited for our conversation today with the one and only Terry Pierce. And so what's funny is I've actually already heard Terry passionately tell me all about God, what God's doing in his church. We just forgot to hit the record button. And so Terry is an unbelievable friend ⁓ and he is an incredible pastor in Tupelo.
Terry Pierce: You Hahaha.
Vick Green: ⁓ And so we have been able to really go through so much together, Terry. So I'm excited for us to have the conversation today, bring others into it. Our biggest, ⁓ I guess, blemish on Terry's reputation is that he is a Duke Blue Devils fan. And so he's got his Duke. Yeah, there it is. He's already ready to rock. So we're going to avoid that and jump to all the good things that Terry is about, which is about Jesus, disciple making. And so let's jump in, Terry. And what's fun is he has a 25 year story at his church. And it's one of the best stories around a couple of things that I think will be beneficial for you. One, on changing culture. Two, on what it looks like to have a grit for disciple making and enduring spiritual warfare, setbacks and hardship as you lead a movement. And then talking about the importance of organizational clarity as it spreads disciple making beyond just
Terry Pierce: Men, men.
Making Disciples with Replicate: What I love about this workshop is that we're not going to do just trainings from the book, but we are actually going to help you create something personal for your church. We're going to give every one of your leaders some essential training to grow as disciple makers and to be a developer of leaders.
Terry Pierce: Absolutely certain.
Making Disciples with Replicate: Secondly, we're going to give you a personalized assessment of your disciple making culture. And then thirdly, we're going to create a one year focus and a first step to get started so that you can see your movement begin. So all you have to do is go to movementreadytraining.com to get more information and to get started. You'll see it's pretty simple. Let's jump on a call together. Let's create a personalized training day for your church and then let's
Vick Green: his own influence. And so he's an incredible story that I know you'll be inspired by. And there'll be so many things that you resonate and connect with that hope gives you hope and confidence for the days ahead with your movement. So let's jump in to this conversation today. We, I want you to bring us back. What I love about your story is I think over the next 40 minutes, I'd love to take our listeners on what has really been a, I don't know, has it been 20, 30 years? How long has this kind of journey been going for you?
Terry Pierce: Yeah, coming up on August will be 25 years that we've been here in Tupelo, man.
Vick Green: Wow. Okay, so years. Here's, I think the power of the conversation we get to have today is most people don't stay in ministry long enough. They don't stay at a church long enough. And as I think your story shows, they don't persevere through the resistance, through the spiritual warfare that comes on the early years of leading a disciple making movement long enough to see the blessings that you are getting to. And so what I love is I want to take our listeners that 25 year journey that you've been on.
Making Disciples with Replicate: our team take care of the rest and we will bring the Movement Ready Church to your church. So just go to MovementReadyChurchTraining.com and let's get your movement started. Now let's get back to our conversation together.
Vick Green: I just wanna kinda show how God's been at work and show what you're experiencing now. So take us back 25 years this August to when you first arrived ⁓ in Tupelo. What was the church name at the time?
Terry Pierce: It was Tupelo Freewill ⁓ and a very historic, successful church in many ways, as far as that it was well known and had a lot of great pastors and in the movement, the free will movement, legendary pastors until they got me. And so, but yeah, so good, things, you know, solid church and had produced a lot of good leadership.
Vick Green: And I'm just curious, even 25 years ago was the Terry I know now, when I think free will, when I think Terry, I like, mean, you are casually right now and you're make disciples, ⁓ you know, hoodie, you're probably wearing shorts. You're usually like pushing that. Yeah. You're wearing shorts. You're usually pushing and being like, okay, like, like Terry push it a little too far there. He's joking a little too much. Like, and so
Terry Pierce: Yeah. Okay, now we go home. I am. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ Yeah, yeah.
Vick Green: Has that always been you or 25 years ago were you very different?
Terry Pierce: I've got, for sure, I've got, who's the Senator from Pennsylvania? So that's why I got that whole look going on today. yeah, so yeah, got the hoodie thing going on. Now, yeah, it was a very, you know, wore ⁓ dress slacks and if you even know what dress slacks, you got to be older. So, you know, did the whole thing. I didn't wear a tie every day, but it was very much, you you had the pastor uniform.
Vick Green: That's fair.
Terry Pierce: And one of the things that you would teach me is you would come here and do the consultation with us a couple of years ago, is that you really helped me ⁓ really put the understanding of what our history was like. And one of the terms that you helped us coin was sort of a pedestal pastor. And, you know, that was a term that you really fell in love with. It really marked that era. It marked our community, certainly marked our church, is that a pedestal pastor is one that...
Vick Green: Yeah.
Terry Pierce: We like that role of being the guy that looked different in the community. We had the dress-up business model and that our people loved looking up to the pastor. Really, we did that because we loved to knock them off. So when we had the faults and things, our church had been through numerous pastoral changes. I think the average tenure was about every five or six years. And then sometimes what would happen is power families would like, okay, you know...
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: We've done enough of that guy's programming. And so we had tried to live up to please people and ⁓ we had to change that culture of, and then I had to change too because if we're honest, we love being on the pedestal. It was about us getting attention into people like us, to people like me and my leadership. So you're just always constantly trying to please people rather than the vision that God had for those people.
Vick Green: That's right. Yeah. Yeah. I still, I love that. We, we jokingly said maybe that your calling was burning pedestals. ⁓ that was a pretty extreme way of getting at it, but that was very on brand for you guys. But it was this, pedadal pedestal pastor. What I remember was there's an authenticity about you now. There's an authenticity about your culture. We're just everyday people and like, and, you come bring your mess, you come bring like whatever you're struggling with.
Terry Pierce: Yeah. ⁓ Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yes.
Vick Green: And like, when I listened to Terry preach, Terry just feels like the same Terry that's in my backyard. That's like, we're just having fun together. That's who I know you to be now. And I think it bring it in that 25 years ago when you're in that pedestal pastor kind of culture, that history, those are the expectations of the people. Just what it was disciple making like in that season when you first got there, was it even on the radar for the church?
Terry Pierce: Yeah, that was good. Yeah, for sure. It was not No, heck no. And so, absolutely, you know, as we would develop again through the consultation with you guys, is that everyday people connecting others to the freedom we have in Christ. And almost none of that was who we were then. And so, as we would realize that, you know, if we did any kind of discipleship, and you have to, fairness, have to remember this is before your time, but, you know, there was no discussion like today's world. Pastors today, you know, we get the culture and everybody's talking.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: about it. Now, we're not doing it well, but we're talking about it at least. And that's what this is about here today, is we want to help you do this because you can't. And so that's the exciting part. so what we were trying to do is we didn't even know those terms, unfortunately. so if there any discipleship happening, Vick, and it was minimal in those days, this is 2001, It was literally the pastor did it all and that was the whole emphasis the whole impetus behind the pedestal pastor mentality was and I hate to do this on podcast, but it's just reality because you me at this point You know, you just got to call it like it is but our our colleges our seminaries We were we were propagating this dude. It was you know, the the pastor has to be sort of this iconic
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: you know, figure that, you know, only he can teach the word, only he's qualified. We all have to have a seminary education because you can't trust your people. ⁓ They're going to lead us astray. And I get it that we'd come out of my generation out of the 70s and 80s and we'd seen a lot of liberal movements. But what we did is we so emphasized ⁓ that almost that we became like the priesthood of pastors, you know, that only we could teach because we were so worried about
Vick Green: Mm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: you know, going off in a liberal way that we owe what we did is we forgot how in the heart of discipleship, and this is, if you guys are listening to this, you're pastoring a church, you're going through the struggle, you need to hear me on this. The difference is, and this is what we teach, we have it replicate the box in the circle. And the whole difference is, is talking about programming versus empowerment of your people. And our people did not know how to make disciples. I didn't even know how to make disciples because we were so busy running programs that we had to teach you how to not go astray. And the shift today of moving off the pedestal, everyday people connecting others to the freedom that we have in Christ, it empowers your people to live on mission and to move from, you know, what we call attending church.
Vick Green: Mm. Okay. Mmm. Mmm. It's good.
Terry Pierce: to finding their calling in light. And if that's what you're dreaming about, dude, I'm telling you, after 25 years living in the box, you know, only in programs to moving to, and that's important. It's a piece of this, you know, don't get me wrong. We still do the box. We had our biggest day ever in the history of our church last weekend. So we still believe in all that, but it's moving into where my people are becoming the empowered army of God and they're making a difference. So yeah, it's life changing.
Vick Green: Yeah. Mmm. Yeah, man, I love that. And you can hear the disciple making passion from you. You can see the vision that you have. Where did you first, where did that first start? Like when did you first start realizing coming back to the early 2000s, you start realizing, man, disciple making is what we're missing. Cause it wasn't even a term you said that your people used or knew of. So where did that start?
Terry Pierce: You Yeah. ⁓ no. And let's be honest, we didn't have it in those days, even in, you know, the pastors and our training seminary, any of that stuff. so ⁓ the real passion became as about 10 years into this, we're doing programs really well. Our church is solid, it's got a great history, but there was a remnant of the congregation. We would walk through some hard seasons that, you know, there was people that wanted me gone. And, you know, there was that six-year mark where we got rid of pastors in the history of our church. And then I was just too dumb enough to leave. so we had this connect. And so I was like, you know, and I've got, and by the way, I think Robbie says this a lot. And so hear me pastors that are watching this or anybody that's watching this.
Vick Green: Hahaha
Terry Pierce: To be a discipleship maker, this is what Jesus taught though. It takes grit. I mean, there's gotta be where you gotta just roll up your sleeves and go, you know what? I'm not gonna let anybody, you know, push me to that point. This is just gonna take fortitude. When you look at the New Testament, the disciples, would, when Paul, so Paul would travel, dude, there was grit involved when he would go from sitting up and preaching through the book of Acts. Dude, there was just some toughness that had to be there.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: that only comes from God, know, that, listen, this is a conviction, dude, that God has called to do this. And if I get fired, I get fired, but man, I'm in. And I'm in, dude, and whatever it costs. And so that point came to that point, that tipping point was about 10 years, ⁓ 10 years in, yeah.
Vick Green: Good. That's right. Yeah, this is six, seven years in context, just 10 years in, the church is roughly what size at that time.
Terry Pierce: We're still, we went from about 170 to about 220.
Vick Green: Okay, 10 years in, keep going and you're at that tipping point.
Terry Pierce: So we've had some good marks, there wasn't discipleship happening. We would gain, and every pastor that's listening to this knows what I'm saying. You would gain a little bit, it's like three steps forward and two steps back, people constantly coming in and out of this thing. And so when my three sons, who are now teenagers about 18 to 15 at this point, when they no longer wanted to really go to our church,
Vick Green: Mm-hmm.
Terry Pierce: When they were tired of the legalism, they were tired of just performance-based, know, stuff like, you know, people were still coming up to my wife and you have to understand this was in the early 2000s and some of the guys will understand this. They were still coming up to her and going, you know, people are not dressing appropriately to my wife every Sunday. And they were like telling her, you need to, you know, say something. We were still worried about our appearance. We were still worried about who came to our church. And if we were honest,
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: We wanted somebody white with three kids that would, know, now that people, and I've heard people say this, that couple will help our church. And you realize how unbiblical that is, how unholy that is, that, and you know, and that that was the mentality of our church. And we even had groups of people meeting to discuss, we need to get rid of Brother Terry because he really doesn't take care of us. He, you know, he's only worried about new people. That was their biggest criticism of me that,
Vick Green: Hmm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: You know, we're the, and what they were saying, they didn't say it, but what they were really saying is, is we're the paying customer.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: And what we really need is somebody that takes care of us. when my three sons ⁓ that this was just not an environment that their friends wanted to come to, ⁓ ⁓ really did something radical, Vick, ⁓ I didn't try to come up with a new program. I didn't try to be hip and cool because it's just not in me. So I'm ⁓ Federman I'm wearing this sweatshirt today. But ⁓ I did is I got along with God for a year. and I fasted and I prayed and God's there's got to be a better way to do this. And God would lead me into discovering what biblical discipleship and going back to scripture was really. So this is not a program. This is me going back to scripture. This is going back to church history, digging into Wesley and Bonhoeffer and, and you know, all of these dudes and just figuring out, you know, what it was in the whole.
Vick Green: Mmm. Try. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: catalyst for all of this really became about, there's a quote by Bonhoeffer, and so I need the guys to hear this. Those, and this would summarize what I've been taught, if I'm honest, and those who love their dream of a Christian community more than they love the Christian community itself become destroyers of that Christian community, even though their personal intentions may be ever so honest, and I was, earnest, and I was, and sacrificial.
Vick Green: Hmm.
Terry Pierce: but no actual church can live up to the wish stream or the ideal church. So people give up. And that's what many of us were living. We got to embrace the people in our church. We got to learn how to love them, live with them, commit to live with them in community and practice the faith. Bonhoeffer said this in the 40s. This isn't some radical idea. This is what I said, all right, how do I fall in love with my kids? I began to disciple my kids at home. I began to just...
Vick Green: Mmm. Mmm. Mm.
Terry Pierce: you know, literally teach them how to follow Jesus. And through that, my sons would become discipleship makers. All three of them today are serving and following Jesus. They plug back into our church. They got their friends involved in our church. And now 15 years later, our church is filled with their generation. Those very students who didn't want to go to our church in 2010 now make up the heartbeat of who our church is because discipleship works.
Vick Green: Mmm. Mmm. ⁓ that's good. That's so good. I love it. I love it. And I think you can hear just in that story, there's just a massive culture change. And what I love too, your story, and it mirrors so much of what ⁓ Robbie's story is, what we share in our recent book. It's just that idea that spiritual renewal is what starts the movement. There has to be the desperation in me.
Terry Pierce: Sorry, I didn't mean to preach. Yes. Yeah. Movement ready church, dude. Dude, that's it.
Vick Green: That's it. And that was your journey. And then it moved to disciple making culture. I got to not worry about just protecting the community or the paying customers, not just make a run in programs, but how are we life on life making disciples? How are we sharing with the community? How are we growing them in their faith? And that's what then shapes that movement. And so like love those principles and you see it in your life. I think that's what I love of seeing kind of that 25 year arc for you.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yeah. Yes, yes. Sure.
Vick Green: Tell it a little bit, because you and I have had some great conversations around a fire pit or on, we did the church bus, went and got lunch. I've heard so many of these. know. And so we've had so many of these when you were trying to change the culture to disciple making. You had this vision of a different type of church than you were in today. And you started to try to change the culture towards those disciple making ends.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ You even came on my back porch of my house and we talked, so yes. Yes.
Vick Green: You started to, you experienced some intense spiritual warfare and some just like, man, ⁓ politics and church just, I mean, no other way to say it than church crap, you know, that you're just like, this stinks. And so share just a little bit of some of those and how did you keep going despite those setbacks?
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yeah, yeah, it was, was for sure. Yeah, so it was a season that God would break me. And so I think the biggest way to do that is I realized that ⁓ everything that I've been taught, you know, we meant well, but it's that whole thing about what Bonhoeffer says, when we love the ideal of church more than we do the people. And so when you get broken for God, I had to become hungry for God. And what I relied on was what I knew and I love the ideal of church. Man, that's all I've ever been. I can't fix, I'm not a mechanic. ⁓ I'm really good at basketball. But outside of those other things is that I really, can't make a living on that because I'm 6'1". So anyway, ⁓ but I love church and I love being a shepherd and a pastor, but it's falling in love with the people and it's rolling up your, a shepherd smells like his sheep. And when you follow God, how do you become that discipleship culture? So season of my life of ⁓ that will become desperate for God. ⁓ And three things that Robbie you guys and Vick and you've helped him ⁓ organize. But Replicate, if become a part of this network and you follow this plan, ⁓ this is what different than every other plan out there, is it begins with spiritual renewal. You've got to get the book Movement Ready Church. And that is the title. because I sit at Sunday, it's Easter Sunday, we had the largest day the history of our church. God's good. And after all these years, largest day, historical church, ⁓ because ⁓ begins with a movement, and I said, ⁓ no longer just a church, Vick. And this is what I said ⁓ is I said, we're no longer just a church, this is a movement. This is what replicates it, this is a movement. ⁓ do we get ourselves ready for that? Number one, we begin with spiritual renewal. And that's where you cannot shortchange this. This is not another program. Man, I've lived through the 80s, 90s, and 2000s of the pastor. I've heard them all. Spiritual renewal happens into you. Then you move to that place where you're creating discipleship-making culture in your church. And guys, this takes time. I get so frustrated with guys that are like, how do we get this silver bullet? This just takes maturation time. It's a crop. ⁓ You know, you have to allow God to work your people to realize and they want to be empowered by the calling. And then, you know, what you guys would do, and we'll get to that in a second, but bring in, and I'll say that, but the organizational clarity. But back to the spiritual renewal. In that spiritual renewal season of God breaking my heart and watching us change the name of our church to connect, watching us build a new campus, and again, I'm not a carpenter Jesus was, but I'm not. And so what God would do, is he would lead me into that process of just getting alone with him. And as I would just, literally in my story of sitting on my back porch, of God breaking Terry of me, the problem was me, Vick. And that's what our guys are not willing to pay the price for, the spiritual renewal. I love that whole section of the book that begins with this, because you're never gonna get to the rest of this discipleship stuff until you let God help you get out of the way. But then he restored me with confidence. And I have discovered that this is who my Heavenly Father is. You know the story of my dad passing away, all this. I would have five deacons in 2020 die. Just out of nowhere, different stuff. I would be in a car wreck that they would have to do the jaws of life and pull me out of. All this in 2020. We're just in a new campus. COVID hits and we don't know if we're ever going to have church again. We've got a brand new campus six months in with a $3 million debt. And I'm going, Lord, what are you doing? ⁓ We've got ⁓ a worldwide epidemic. Five deacons passed away just suddenly. ⁓ best friend gets cancer and dies within three months. have to a heart ablation. have to go in and shock me. The same year, all of this happens in the same year. And then I wind up with a spinal fusion. They go through my throat. I may never speak again. Two months after the spinal fusion, I'm in a car wreck.
Vick Green: Wow.
Terry Pierce: And all the while, God would take our church and we would move from that 200 to all of a sudden we're breaking 300. And now we're, but we did not decline when everybody else did. God would take us through that season and it would begin a revival of watching a hundred. been here 20 years at that point. And we grew more in that year than we had the first 20.
Vick Green: Mmm. Wow.
Terry Pierce: Because it was God just showing us if you will trust me spiritual renewal will be a game changer
Vick Green: Mm. That's so good. What I love too in 2020, because we saw something similar as well. like for most churches in 2020, like COVID was this nationwide disciple making test. If you take away the church's programming, will the people own the mission? And most churches flop it. Most churches experience a decline in that. And a lot of it, are people like the people who were in the church doors every time they were open.
Terry Pierce: Yes. That was so good. Mm-hmm. Yep.
Vick Green: The moment those doors couldn't open, they didn't know how to have their own personal faith, how to own it. And so, but when that disciple making culture takes place, you see churches that despite that, there's still growth. That, you know, I look in my neighborhood in 2020 and we saw actually our whole neighborhood, all the believers that we had relationship with that we knew in our neighborhood got in D groups in an 18 month span, they multiplied. And then we started sharing our faith with people who were not going to church.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Amen. Yes. That's so good.
Vick Green: And it's just, you know, so I think that's such a great testament. Again, that's 2001 you come in, 20.
Terry Pierce: It was the catalyst. It was the catalyst, what you just said, you say it so better. That was the catalyst for our whole discipleship moving, going from addition to multiplication because God forced us to go out because we couldn't do it any other way.
Vick Green: Yes. That's good. Well, and I'd say there, that's where now the pedestal season of the pastors, the one who does ministry has now fully closed. And now we're really starting to live into, that is, it's good.
Terry Pierce: Hmm? Yeah. It died, it died with COVID, dude. It died in COVID. We got off the pedestal and we became everyday people connecting others to the freedom in Christ, amen.
Vick Green: Yes, dude, that's so good. And so you see 2020, I think for everybody, it was a new season. But for you guys, it's almost like y'all were preparing and it was really a stepping into the best next season for you guys. and I think too, you know, one, one more, a couple of things there too, that just to capture that, those two decades, I think what you embody so well, Terry, and now we'll get to all the
Terry Pierce: It was. Amen. It really was.
Vick Green: great stuff that's happening in this season. But I think you embodied two really powerful principles. One you already said is it's not if you have a passion for disciple making, it's if you have the grit for it. I mean, all that you just said around friends dying, disgruntled people wanting you fired, all of those things, like it'd been so easy to give up. And pure passion alone would not have been enough. That spiritual renewal, giving you that grit there.
Terry Pierce: Yeah, that's it. Mmm, yeah. Sure.
Vick Green: The second is people want the power of multiplication but won't be patient with the pace of multiplication. And I think you live that so well.
Terry Pierce: No, that's so good. the discipline, this is this is what Get the Movement Ready book, because the discipline is the way we access power. Spiritual discipline is a way that we, ⁓ not just your own power. This is the key. This is what Comer talks about in his book called Practicing the Way. And he says this, though a kind of resistance training of your will and power, but it's also God's power. Spiritual disciplines are Jesus's designed way of offering yourself to God so that you can draw on his appropriate grace the empowerment presence of the Holy Spirit. would become the catalyst and the game changer. So let me just say a word to pastors here today about this issue, about grit and sticking with it. So I got a quick story on this. You know, I don't love to tell stories. And so whenever I was growing up, Vick, I don't even know if you know this part about me, but I was six foot tall in the eighth grade. So dude, I became a legendary. But the problem was, is I peaked in the eighth grade. And so, ⁓ we had 24 minute basketball quarters, mean, 24 minute games in those days. So four quarters, 24 minutes, six minute quarters. And I was averaging 21 points a game, eighth grade year, you know, made the all-star teams and all that stuff. But here's the thing, to become a legendary basketball player in my county. in Illinois and peaked at eighth grade. to do that, ⁓ I had to do is it wasn't the performance ⁓ those games, Vick. This is where, and it wasn't, and we keep thinking that we have to practice this stuff and we got to do this. Here's the difference between discipline and spiritual discipline. ⁓ would go the camps and I would learn the skills. But the that I got so good at basketball was, is that ⁓ I had ⁓ literally I had to go and spin up till midnight. I would stay out all hours of the, what I did is I fell in love with the discipline of playing basketball big to become a good basketball player. wasn't about trying harder. It was about learning to train hard. And that's what our guys have got to get down. The spiritual discipline is the training hard. It's not about what you perform on Sunday and it's not about you trying hard. It's about you training harder and allowing God to open up the doors. so, ⁓ you know, the, what would happen would be genetics would catch up with me and that's where my story breaks down. know, I would not be, I would ⁓ not go on and pursue that career in college and get to Duke. ⁓ but, but, ⁓ says, again, I peaked in eighth grade, but, ⁓ but the thing is I did score 50 in a church league game once, but anyway,
Vick Green: That's good. That's good. That's good. There you go. It wouldn't be an interview with you if we didn't do a little bit of basketball talk.
Terry Pierce: No, we didn't. Yeah, so, you know, my other buddy here in Tupelo, Will Rambo so yeah, just, man, just tore him up. anyway, ⁓ ⁓ learning to practice that discipline of just knowing ⁓ has to be something that becomes a conviction and it's a calling in your life. And so that brings the discipline to sit with God. And now, know, what Todd Kaunitz teaches about,
Vick Green: That's It's good. Mm, yeah.
Terry Pierce: end of the prayer, that just meeting with God and getting along with Him, the confidence that it brings. The reason I became so good at basketball is because I spent all those nights training hard because I loved it. And the reason you can get up and do what God does through me on Sundays now is you can tell it's not my preaching, you know, has really changed as much as you can tell that Terry's been with God.
Vick Green: Mm. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: Dude, you cannot have discipleship until there's spiritual renew in your life, until you get out of the way. now, what we pray this Easter Sunday with the largest crowd we've ever had is we pray before whatever priest. I said, Lord, help. And we ask our congregation, Lord, I'm here today not to hear Terry, not to hear Tanner do the music. I'm here to hear from you. And because none of that matters until we get hungry for God.
Vick Green: Let's go. Let's go. Mmm. Okay. And a of things there that Terry said, Todd Kaunitz he was on our podcast just a couple of episodes ago. So you can definitely ⁓ listen to His pastor, prayer ⁓ and then Robbie story as well in, the movement ready church, you'll see so much connections to what Terry's story is here. Let's, let's fast forward ⁓ to when you I started to get, work together and spend time together because here's what I loved about that with you ⁓ at this point, you've the corner.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ my gosh, it's such a good episode. Phenomenal. Yeah. Absolutely.
Vick Green: Disciple making has taken root. You've gone from 200, you're now seeing over 300. This is the, know, and for pretty much everybody in your church, like these are the best days of Connect Church at this point. And I think what would have been very easy and the temptation is to get to that point and say, we've arrived. We've finally overcome all of this. And I think what I, and I remember in our conversations, there was different people in your leadership team and you were trying to say, there's more, we need more.
Terry Pierce: is. Yes.
Vick Green: we're stuck, there's kind of a ceiling that we're at. And I think there are lot of people that were content with like, hey, we got disciple making. That's like, you brought that to us and we don't struggle with the pedestal pastor culture anymore. But you had a vision of man, what is next? And so tell me a little, share it a little bit about that moment of what ceiling were you kind of feeling? And then what did you know that you were missing that you needed?
Terry Pierce: Yeah. Yeah, and so just by the fact that by the time we get to this point, we're realizing that the folks in our church, yeah, we're okay. JD Greer says it this way, the place where you experience God's power most is in our failure. Ironically, the place where we lose Him the fastest is in our success.
Vick Green: Hmm
Terry Pierce: And so at that point I had to digest that truth. And so I met with the leadership and I said, I really believe the Holy Spirit is telling me to bring this Vick guy in. And they go, who's this Vick guy? so ⁓ bring him in and ⁓ interview with our deacon board and they're like, yeah, we weren't that impressed with his thing. And I sit with his initial thing and I go, I wasn't either, ⁓ I'm telling you the ⁓ Holy has said, ⁓ listen, got these markers and he loves to use markers and whiteboards. ⁓ At that point, it became a conviction. I hope the pastors are hearing me on this. I knew that God was saying, I didn't understand it. after we brought in and you would walk us through, you know, just helping us understand the box in the circle ⁓ and understanding that ⁓ only does spiritual renewal, ⁓ you know, help you ⁓ start and sustain a movement, but it's understanding the disciple making culture. What your church is missing, guys, is the liberation that happens when you move to discipleship-making culture in your church. Then it just changes all the metrics. I mean, you teach us this all the wealth. We begin to measure things differently because now we're wanting to empower our people. So when we started the empowerment of our people, we hit this plateau. And so how do we do this second and third generation? And so there's going to be a lot of guys listening to this. This is where we moved them into understanding the circle is about understanding how to coach your people. first of all, they got to recognize their calling. Help your people understand they are called. Then you coach them. So what you did is you came in and taught us how to coach our people. This is what replicate does. This is what movement ready church is about so that they are commissioned by God. Now they're discovering their personal commissioning. God calls them. We coach them up in leadership training and then they answer the call that they're going out at work, home and play and making disciples where they're at. And that becomes, you know, that what we needed with you was organizational clarity. We had the discipleship making culture. But what I didn't have was to be able to articulate hand off to my people in booklet form ⁓ you know, sort of, not a manual, you know, as we think of it, just a program, but a resource. That's a better term. I love that term is we brought organizational clarity. ⁓ now ⁓ spreads the movement. We are becoming a movement ready church where people are now coming every week, Vick, because they sense. It's not just a church. This is a movement that God is doing. And the younger generation doesn't want to just do church the way we did it, They want to make a difference. We're blasting and criticizing, and I get it, Gen Z's and all this. They're coming to our church and flocking to our church because those that get it, man, they want to make a difference. And if we teach them discipleship, how to fall in love with Jesus, that's the empowerment. that's gonna change our community.
Vick Green: So good. So good. I love that. And I think you've actually now, even as you've gone, you shared your mission statement of just everyday people connecting people to the freedom in Jesus.
Terry Pierce: Yes. It's in almost every sermon, everything that we do, dude, it just bleeds into everything. We tell the stories every Sunday. How cool is that? We're preaching through the book of Acts. We're telling the stories, not of my stories, not what Pastor Pedestal Pastor Terry's doing. It's the stories from the congregation. You're telling the stories of life change of your people. They're doing ministry better than I am.
Vick Green: That's so good. That's right. That's right. Well, and think that's huge right there because because 20 years ago it's the pedestal pastor who makes disciples that connects people. That's exactly right. And now it's in your mission. So I remember when we named it, we said we're going to name it everyday people because it was that authenticity. It's just the like casual friend Terry, the back porch, Terry, not the pedestal pastor Terry. And then to talk about, man, that's it's disciple makings for all of us.
Terry Pierce: Yeah. And you're worn out and you're tired and you're. Yeah, that's it. Love it. Yep.
Vick Green: And think the other thing that's fun is you have your dream disciple roles.
Terry Pierce: Yes, yes.
Vick Green: which I think embody you guys so well and embody you. What are your dream disciple roles?
Terry Pierce: Yes. Now, that's so cool. So, ⁓ our dream disciple here at Connect Church is to be a Spirit-led disciple. Everything that God is doing at Connect Church is Holy Spirit-led. And coming out of the Baptist world, that whole third part of the Trinity, by the way, historic Christianity, ⁓ I could give you quotes from St. Benedict, Augustine, all these guys were doing discipleship. We shifted away from church history.
Vick Green: Mm. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: Spirit-led discipleship, authentic friends. You know, that's in our statement. People today, it's all about authenticity, dude. The younger generation smells of phony, they hate fake religion, authentic friendships, passionate storytelling. You cannot come to church with Terry Pearson, not understand. I had a guy tell me this Sunday, don't know him, we had so many new people, he walked up to me ⁓ and he walked up and he goes, dude,
Vick Green: That's right.
Terry Pierce: He goes, I don't know for sure I'm total believer, but I know you believe this. And so I said, that's cool, man. I take that as a huge compliment, passionate storyteller. We want our people to be passionate enough of dead boring Christianity and just doing this because we're checking a box, dude. Dude, Jesus died on a cross for our sins.
Vick Green: That's exactly right. Mm.
Terry Pierce: Dude, he rose again on the third day. If you can't get passionate about that, dude, we get passionate about LSU. I don't know why we get passionate about Duke basketball. Why in the world can we not get passionate about the story of going from hell to heaven, dude? I'm just telling you. and number four is a humble guide. People are tired of Christianity, of pedestal Christianity and what they relate to.
Vick Green: Hahaha Mm. Mm.
Terry Pierce: I had a person call me and said, you know, I think you're sometimes you use a little bit too common language in the in your preaching. And I said, I can't get away from it. The difference between Jesus in the New Testament and what we've talked about in the church world is Jesus did not impress the Pharisees. Jesus was a different rabbi than they'd ever seen before. He was a humble guide to everyday people. Everyday people will work as a statement.
Vick Green: Mm. Mm. So good. That's so good. It's so good. I love it. Passionate storyteller always connects so much as you even listed a tear here. But like, and I love just seeing you. You had the foresight to say, yes, we've started something good, but God wants to do even more. And and what's wild is I think after 20 years, you can say, man, God's done something great. But you said, man, there's even more. And what happened because you got to that point, you said,
Terry Pierce: Yes, yes. Yes. Amen.
Vick Green: we don't have the organizational clarity for it to spread beyond you. And so you were making disciples, the people that were directly connected, being coached by you, but it hadn't spread beyond you. And so now as your church, you're in that growth barrier, 250 is that growth barrier. And as you start getting on the other side, you're like, whoa, what used to work doesn't work now. And you guys went to it. And so just a cool celebration. Give an update of where Connect Church is today.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yes. Right. ⁓ is ⁓ God be the glory. So, all these pastors that are listening to this today, ⁓ in that range, you know, of maybe you're at a hundred or you're at 200. ⁓ I'm telling you, ⁓ you allow God to do ⁓ and I know I've repeated myself, but it's spiritual renewal. It's a discipleship-making culture and it's organizational clarity. When these three components come in that Replicate will help you with, I'm telling you, you're gonna empower your people and have the grit, take the time to be there. We can't get past this process. This takes time. But once you get there, so I'm not just giving you motivational speech. This takes years. This takes a while, but... In the last, we're watching this multiply now. And this is gonna go a lot faster for you guys. Man, this was back in the day, COVID changed everything. Everything has intensified. It's accelerated all of this process. So this can happen much quicker now. But now today, ⁓ just to give God the glory, watching my people get excited, the atmosphere in the church, the discipleship making culture happens when people at the parking lot. The people at the front door are not just friendly. What people say is, These people genuinely care. These people believe what they're preaching. And that goes from the greeters, that grows from the coffee bar, that goes to the nursery, the children's church ministry. And we're watching God now take us from 300 in 2019 to now we're averaging over 600 in just seven years. We just did our second building program. We had to double the size of our auditorium. And now we're at to the point that we had over a thousand. people here in our campus last Sunday and watching God begin to just, and we're moving from 36 discipleship groups, our goal by the end of this year strategically is going to be at 50 discipleship groups with over 200 people involved in D. It's not just about counting how many D groups, it's about literally watching the whole Reformation. ⁓ of doing evangelism groups to neighborhood groups. It's no longer just in about one cookie cutter discipleship model. What Replicate has helped me do is realize discipleship happens at work. We've got guys doing different Bible studies, all of us centered around the Word of God. But man, they're doing different books of the Bible. They're doing it different ways. We've got moms that are literally doing discipleship in their neighborhood with moms who have babies. They don't have the formal de-grips like I do them, but man, they're meeting every other week with moms and they're just talking about life problems and then they bring scripture and Jesus into it and ⁓ she's literally discipling ⁓ all these moms in her neighborhood with babies. ⁓ so, because they rally around that point, you're empowering people to let God ⁓ open up doors that you could never do on your own.
Vick Green: So good. So good. Yeah, what I love, I think you are such a great testament of just of grit, of perseverance ⁓ and of faith of just saying, God, I'm trusting that you're going to move. I'm trusting that you're going to work even when today doesn't feel like it. And so what would be your final word as we close here? What would be to the pastor who is in year five of your journey, year 10, you know, who is who isn't seeing the fruit yet and is maybe
Terry Pierce: Ew. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Vick Green: considering giving up, what would be your encouragement to them?
Terry Pierce: Okay, my first word is to them, this is gonna be a little bit negative, but guys, you have to consider the cost of non-discipleship. what is it gonna, it's gonna, yeah, it's gonna cost you to go down this road, but the cost of non-discipleship is gonna cost you a lot more. And so man, that has to drive you to say, listen, ⁓ I believe that God has called us to do this. It always involves people. And it's just, you know, I think it was Augustine or Benedict one that said, ⁓ we need to understand that life is designed by God to be in community. And so I would just say to the guys, this is God's plan. It is, Jesus gave us, we know this, but to go and make disciples who make disciples. And so it's living in this community of faith. It's understanding that it is the journey that God will bring you through spiritually in the disciplines of learning to just trust in the power of God and know the confidence that I now have, not in myself, but yes, it brings that back around. It's like, let's go do this. because God is showing me, He called me to do this. And you remember the calling that you guys had when He first started doing this and people and programs will wear you out. I get to say at this age, at 61, these are the greatest days of my ministry. This is the days where me and my wife are enjoying our relationship. I got three kids that didn't want to go to my church.
Vick Green: Hmm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: One's pastoring the disciple making movement. Another one's a youth pastor making disciples in Atlanta. The other one's in North Carolina. And my third one is running a business involved in making disciples with a teen program. Dude, if that's it, at the end of the day, my boys are making disciples. They're gonna do greater things than I've ever dreamed of. This church, the day that Terry Pierce walks out of here is just going to begin to see what it can do going forward because discipleship making is not a program. It is the plan. There is no plan B, dude. Let's go. Let's go get this. ⁓ Let's go, baby. Let's do it.
Vick Green: Mmm. God, come on. I love it. Welcome to every conversation with Terry Pierce. You're ready to run through a wall, passionate storyteller. I am so grateful, not just for the passion storyteller that you are, but your life that is a testimony to so many of these principles that we get to help churches with.
Terry Pierce: Thank you. Amen.
Vick Green: Terry is an unbelievable leader. He's unbelievable friend. You need to know Terry. You need to connect with Terry. Terry also leads a replicate huddle for us with other pastors. And so he's a guy that you want to learn from, be equipped by. And so Terry, if anybody wants to get connected with you, what's the best way to connect with Terry Pierce?
Terry Pierce: Thank you. Amen. Yeah, just email me at terry at triconnect.church. And I think that Amanda has some of my social media stuff that she's going to put in the feeders. So Amanda's going to take care of all that stuff. yeah, terry at triconnect.church, or you can just go to www.triconnect.church in Tupelo, Mississippi. And man, I love pastors and I love talking to discipleship. Get the book Movement Ready, guys. I'm telling you, it's a game changer.
Vick Green: Okay, yep. Appreciate that.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ What Vick is doing, he loves markers and you know, I feel sorry for his wife and kids because everything. But what these guys have that's different is the spiritual renewal piece of Robbie's heart and what they're doing. But they're going to help you understand it's just this simple create discipleship making culture and your people propel this. ⁓ then thirdly, what replicate does so well is they bring the organizational clarity into this.
Vick Green: Hmm.
Terry Pierce: help your people answer the call so that they can, it's not either or, but it's box and circle. Let's learn how to put both of them together and watch God grow your church.
Vick Green: Well, Sam, and so grateful for you. Thanks for taking the time today and look forward to it when we get to hang soon.
Making Disciples with Replicate: Hey church leader, I hope these podcast episodes and the Movement Ready Church book that Robbie and I have written are helping you get disciple making started in your church. What I'm excited for in the next season is that we're taking the Movement Ready Church book to your church. We're doing one day workshops where myself or one of the navigators on our replicate team come on site to your church and work with your staff and leaders to take the principles of this book and to put it into action.
Vick Green: Man, so excited for our conversation today with the one and only Terry Pierce. And so what's funny is I've actually already heard Terry passionately tell me all about God, what God's doing in his church. We just forgot to hit the record button. And so Terry is an unbelievable friend ⁓ and he is an incredible pastor in Tupelo.
Terry Pierce: You Hahaha.
Vick Green: ⁓ And so we have been able to really go through so much together, Terry. So I'm excited for us to have the conversation today, bring others into it. Our biggest, ⁓ I guess, blemish on Terry's reputation is that he is a Duke Blue Devils fan. And so he's got his Duke. Yeah, there it is. He's already ready to rock. So we're going to avoid that and jump to all the good things that Terry is about, which is about Jesus, disciple making. And so let's jump in, Terry. And what's fun is he has a 25 year story at his church. And it's one of the best stories around a couple of things that I think will be beneficial for you. One, on changing culture. Two, on what it looks like to have a grit for disciple making and enduring spiritual warfare, setbacks and hardship as you lead a movement. And then talking about the importance of organizational clarity as it spreads disciple making beyond just
Terry Pierce: Men, men.
Making Disciples with Replicate: What I love about this workshop is that we're not going to do just trainings from the book, but we are actually going to help you create something personal for your church. We're going to give every one of your leaders some essential training to grow as disciple makers and to be a developer of leaders.
Terry Pierce: Absolutely certain.
Making Disciples with Replicate: Secondly, we're going to give you a personalized assessment of your disciple making culture. And then thirdly, we're going to create a one year focus and a first step to get started so that you can see your movement begin. So all you have to do is go to movementreadytraining.com to get more information and to get started. You'll see it's pretty simple. Let's jump on a call together. Let's create a personalized training day for your church and then let's
Vick Green: his own influence. And so he's an incredible story that I know you'll be inspired by. And there'll be so many things that you resonate and connect with that hope gives you hope and confidence for the days ahead with your movement. So let's jump in to this conversation today. We, I want you to bring us back. What I love about your story is I think over the next 40 minutes, I'd love to take our listeners on what has really been a, I don't know, has it been 20, 30 years? How long has this kind of journey been going for you?
Terry Pierce: Yeah, coming up on August will be 25 years that we've been here in Tupelo, man.
Vick Green: Wow. Okay, so years. Here's, I think the power of the conversation we get to have today is most people don't stay in ministry long enough. They don't stay at a church long enough. And as I think your story shows, they don't persevere through the resistance, through the spiritual warfare that comes on the early years of leading a disciple making movement long enough to see the blessings that you are getting to. And so what I love is I want to take our listeners that 25 year journey that you've been on.
Making Disciples with Replicate: our team take care of the rest and we will bring the Movement Ready Church to your church. So just go to MovementReadyChurchTraining.com and let's get your movement started. Now let's get back to our conversation together.
Vick Green: I just wanna kinda show how God's been at work and show what you're experiencing now. So take us back 25 years this August to when you first arrived ⁓ in Tupelo. What was the church name at the time?
Terry Pierce: It was Tupelo Freewill ⁓ and a very historic, successful church in many ways, as far as that it was well known and had a lot of great pastors and in the movement, the free will movement, legendary pastors until they got me. And so, but yeah, so good, things, you know, solid church and had produced a lot of good leadership.
Vick Green: And I'm just curious, even 25 years ago was the Terry I know now, when I think free will, when I think Terry, I like, mean, you are casually right now and you're make disciples, ⁓ you know, hoodie, you're probably wearing shorts. You're usually like pushing that. Yeah. You're wearing shorts. You're usually pushing and being like, okay, like, like Terry push it a little too far there. He's joking a little too much. Like, and so
Terry Pierce: Yeah. Okay, now we go home. I am. ⁓ yeah. ⁓ Yeah, yeah.
Vick Green: Has that always been you or 25 years ago were you very different?
Terry Pierce: I've got, for sure, I've got, who's the Senator from Pennsylvania? So that's why I got that whole look going on today. yeah, so yeah, got the hoodie thing going on. Now, yeah, it was a very, you know, wore ⁓ dress slacks and if you even know what dress slacks, you got to be older. So, you know, did the whole thing. I didn't wear a tie every day, but it was very much, you you had the pastor uniform.
Vick Green: That's fair.
Terry Pierce: And one of the things that you would teach me is you would come here and do the consultation with us a couple of years ago, is that you really helped me ⁓ really put the understanding of what our history was like. And one of the terms that you helped us coin was sort of a pedestal pastor. And, you know, that was a term that you really fell in love with. It really marked that era. It marked our community, certainly marked our church, is that a pedestal pastor is one that...
Vick Green: Yeah.
Terry Pierce: We like that role of being the guy that looked different in the community. We had the dress-up business model and that our people loved looking up to the pastor. Really, we did that because we loved to knock them off. So when we had the faults and things, our church had been through numerous pastoral changes. I think the average tenure was about every five or six years. And then sometimes what would happen is power families would like, okay, you know...
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: We've done enough of that guy's programming. And so we had tried to live up to please people and ⁓ we had to change that culture of, and then I had to change too because if we're honest, we love being on the pedestal. It was about us getting attention into people like us, to people like me and my leadership. So you're just always constantly trying to please people rather than the vision that God had for those people.
Vick Green: That's right. Yeah. Yeah. I still, I love that. We, we jokingly said maybe that your calling was burning pedestals. ⁓ that was a pretty extreme way of getting at it, but that was very on brand for you guys. But it was this, pedadal pedestal pastor. What I remember was there's an authenticity about you now. There's an authenticity about your culture. We're just everyday people and like, and, you come bring your mess, you come bring like whatever you're struggling with.
Terry Pierce: Yeah. ⁓ Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Yes.
Vick Green: And like, when I listened to Terry preach, Terry just feels like the same Terry that's in my backyard. That's like, we're just having fun together. That's who I know you to be now. And I think it bring it in that 25 years ago when you're in that pedestal pastor kind of culture, that history, those are the expectations of the people. Just what it was disciple making like in that season when you first got there, was it even on the radar for the church?
Terry Pierce: Yeah, that was good. Yeah, for sure. It was not No, heck no. And so, absolutely, you know, as we would develop again through the consultation with you guys, is that everyday people connecting others to the freedom we have in Christ. And almost none of that was who we were then. And so, as we would realize that, you know, if we did any kind of discipleship, and you have to, fairness, have to remember this is before your time, but, you know, there was no discussion like today's world. Pastors today, you know, we get the culture and everybody's talking.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: about it. Now, we're not doing it well, but we're talking about it at least. And that's what this is about here today, is we want to help you do this because you can't. And so that's the exciting part. so what we were trying to do is we didn't even know those terms, unfortunately. so if there any discipleship happening, Vick, and it was minimal in those days, this is 2001, It was literally the pastor did it all and that was the whole emphasis the whole impetus behind the pedestal pastor mentality was and I hate to do this on podcast, but it's just reality because you me at this point You know, you just got to call it like it is but our our colleges our seminaries We were we were propagating this dude. It was you know, the the pastor has to be sort of this iconic
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: you know, figure that, you know, only he can teach the word, only he's qualified. We all have to have a seminary education because you can't trust your people. ⁓ They're going to lead us astray. And I get it that we'd come out of my generation out of the 70s and 80s and we'd seen a lot of liberal movements. But what we did is we so emphasized ⁓ that almost that we became like the priesthood of pastors, you know, that only we could teach because we were so worried about
Vick Green: Mm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: you know, going off in a liberal way that we owe what we did is we forgot how in the heart of discipleship, and this is, if you guys are listening to this, you're pastoring a church, you're going through the struggle, you need to hear me on this. The difference is, and this is what we teach, we have it replicate the box in the circle. And the whole difference is, is talking about programming versus empowerment of your people. And our people did not know how to make disciples. I didn't even know how to make disciples because we were so busy running programs that we had to teach you how to not go astray. And the shift today of moving off the pedestal, everyday people connecting others to the freedom that we have in Christ, it empowers your people to live on mission and to move from, you know, what we call attending church.
Vick Green: Mm. Okay. Mmm. Mmm. It's good.
Terry Pierce: to finding their calling in light. And if that's what you're dreaming about, dude, I'm telling you, after 25 years living in the box, you know, only in programs to moving to, and that's important. It's a piece of this, you know, don't get me wrong. We still do the box. We had our biggest day ever in the history of our church last weekend. So we still believe in all that, but it's moving into where my people are becoming the empowered army of God and they're making a difference. So yeah, it's life changing.
Vick Green: Yeah. Mmm. Yeah, man, I love that. And you can hear the disciple making passion from you. You can see the vision that you have. Where did you first, where did that first start? Like when did you first start realizing coming back to the early 2000s, you start realizing, man, disciple making is what we're missing. Cause it wasn't even a term you said that your people used or knew of. So where did that start?
Terry Pierce: You Yeah. ⁓ no. And let's be honest, we didn't have it in those days, even in, you know, the pastors and our training seminary, any of that stuff. so ⁓ the real passion became as about 10 years into this, we're doing programs really well. Our church is solid, it's got a great history, but there was a remnant of the congregation. We would walk through some hard seasons that, you know, there was people that wanted me gone. And, you know, there was that six-year mark where we got rid of pastors in the history of our church. And then I was just too dumb enough to leave. so we had this connect. And so I was like, you know, and I've got, and by the way, I think Robbie says this a lot. And so hear me pastors that are watching this or anybody that's watching this.
Vick Green: Hahaha
Terry Pierce: To be a discipleship maker, this is what Jesus taught though. It takes grit. I mean, there's gotta be where you gotta just roll up your sleeves and go, you know what? I'm not gonna let anybody, you know, push me to that point. This is just gonna take fortitude. When you look at the New Testament, the disciples, would, when Paul, so Paul would travel, dude, there was grit involved when he would go from sitting up and preaching through the book of Acts. Dude, there was just some toughness that had to be there.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: that only comes from God, know, that, listen, this is a conviction, dude, that God has called to do this. And if I get fired, I get fired, but man, I'm in. And I'm in, dude, and whatever it costs. And so that point came to that point, that tipping point was about 10 years, ⁓ 10 years in, yeah.
Vick Green: Good. That's right. Yeah, this is six, seven years in context, just 10 years in, the church is roughly what size at that time.
Terry Pierce: We're still, we went from about 170 to about 220.
Vick Green: Okay, 10 years in, keep going and you're at that tipping point.
Terry Pierce: So we've had some good marks, there wasn't discipleship happening. We would gain, and every pastor that's listening to this knows what I'm saying. You would gain a little bit, it's like three steps forward and two steps back, people constantly coming in and out of this thing. And so when my three sons, who are now teenagers about 18 to 15 at this point, when they no longer wanted to really go to our church,
Vick Green: Mm-hmm.
Terry Pierce: When they were tired of the legalism, they were tired of just performance-based, know, stuff like, you know, people were still coming up to my wife and you have to understand this was in the early 2000s and some of the guys will understand this. They were still coming up to her and going, you know, people are not dressing appropriately to my wife every Sunday. And they were like telling her, you need to, you know, say something. We were still worried about our appearance. We were still worried about who came to our church. And if we were honest,
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: We wanted somebody white with three kids that would, know, now that people, and I've heard people say this, that couple will help our church. And you realize how unbiblical that is, how unholy that is, that, and you know, and that that was the mentality of our church. And we even had groups of people meeting to discuss, we need to get rid of Brother Terry because he really doesn't take care of us. He, you know, he's only worried about new people. That was their biggest criticism of me that,
Vick Green: Hmm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: You know, we're the, and what they were saying, they didn't say it, but what they were really saying is, is we're the paying customer.
Vick Green: Mm.
Terry Pierce: And what we really need is somebody that takes care of us. when my three sons ⁓ that this was just not an environment that their friends wanted to come to, ⁓ ⁓ really did something radical, Vick, ⁓ I didn't try to come up with a new program. I didn't try to be hip and cool because it's just not in me. So I'm ⁓ Federman I'm wearing this sweatshirt today. But ⁓ I did is I got along with God for a year. and I fasted and I prayed and God's there's got to be a better way to do this. And God would lead me into discovering what biblical discipleship and going back to scripture was really. So this is not a program. This is me going back to scripture. This is going back to church history, digging into Wesley and Bonhoeffer and, and you know, all of these dudes and just figuring out, you know, what it was in the whole.
Vick Green: Mmm. Try. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: catalyst for all of this really became about, there's a quote by Bonhoeffer, and so I need the guys to hear this. Those, and this would summarize what I've been taught, if I'm honest, and those who love their dream of a Christian community more than they love the Christian community itself become destroyers of that Christian community, even though their personal intentions may be ever so honest, and I was, earnest, and I was, and sacrificial.
Vick Green: Hmm.
Terry Pierce: but no actual church can live up to the wish stream or the ideal church. So people give up. And that's what many of us were living. We got to embrace the people in our church. We got to learn how to love them, live with them, commit to live with them in community and practice the faith. Bonhoeffer said this in the 40s. This isn't some radical idea. This is what I said, all right, how do I fall in love with my kids? I began to disciple my kids at home. I began to just...
Vick Green: Mmm. Mmm. Mm.
Terry Pierce: you know, literally teach them how to follow Jesus. And through that, my sons would become discipleship makers. All three of them today are serving and following Jesus. They plug back into our church. They got their friends involved in our church. And now 15 years later, our church is filled with their generation. Those very students who didn't want to go to our church in 2010 now make up the heartbeat of who our church is because discipleship works.
Vick Green: Mmm. Mmm. ⁓ that's good. That's so good. I love it. I love it. And I think you can hear just in that story, there's just a massive culture change. And what I love too, your story, and it mirrors so much of what ⁓ Robbie's story is, what we share in our recent book. It's just that idea that spiritual renewal is what starts the movement. There has to be the desperation in me.
Terry Pierce: Sorry, I didn't mean to preach. Yes. Yeah. Movement ready church, dude. Dude, that's it.
Vick Green: That's it. And that was your journey. And then it moved to disciple making culture. I got to not worry about just protecting the community or the paying customers, not just make a run in programs, but how are we life on life making disciples? How are we sharing with the community? How are we growing them in their faith? And that's what then shapes that movement. And so like love those principles and you see it in your life. I think that's what I love of seeing kind of that 25 year arc for you.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yeah. Yes, yes. Sure.
Vick Green: Tell it a little bit, because you and I have had some great conversations around a fire pit or on, we did the church bus, went and got lunch. I've heard so many of these. know. And so we've had so many of these when you were trying to change the culture to disciple making. You had this vision of a different type of church than you were in today. And you started to try to change the culture towards those disciple making ends.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ You even came on my back porch of my house and we talked, so yes. Yes.
Vick Green: You started to, you experienced some intense spiritual warfare and some just like, man, ⁓ politics and church just, I mean, no other way to say it than church crap, you know, that you're just like, this stinks. And so share just a little bit of some of those and how did you keep going despite those setbacks?
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yeah, yeah, it was, was for sure. Yeah, so it was a season that God would break me. And so I think the biggest way to do that is I realized that ⁓ everything that I've been taught, you know, we meant well, but it's that whole thing about what Bonhoeffer says, when we love the ideal of church more than we do the people. And so when you get broken for God, I had to become hungry for God. And what I relied on was what I knew and I love the ideal of church. Man, that's all I've ever been. I can't fix, I'm not a mechanic. ⁓ I'm really good at basketball. But outside of those other things is that I really, can't make a living on that because I'm 6'1". So anyway, ⁓ but I love church and I love being a shepherd and a pastor, but it's falling in love with the people and it's rolling up your, a shepherd smells like his sheep. And when you follow God, how do you become that discipleship culture? So season of my life of ⁓ that will become desperate for God. ⁓ And three things that Robbie you guys and Vick and you've helped him ⁓ organize. But Replicate, if become a part of this network and you follow this plan, ⁓ this is what different than every other plan out there, is it begins with spiritual renewal. You've got to get the book Movement Ready Church. And that is the title. because I sit at Sunday, it's Easter Sunday, we had the largest day the history of our church. God's good. And after all these years, largest day, historical church, ⁓ because ⁓ begins with a movement, and I said, ⁓ no longer just a church, Vick. And this is what I said ⁓ is I said, we're no longer just a church, this is a movement. This is what replicates it, this is a movement. ⁓ do we get ourselves ready for that? Number one, we begin with spiritual renewal. And that's where you cannot shortchange this. This is not another program. Man, I've lived through the 80s, 90s, and 2000s of the pastor. I've heard them all. Spiritual renewal happens into you. Then you move to that place where you're creating discipleship-making culture in your church. And guys, this takes time. I get so frustrated with guys that are like, how do we get this silver bullet? This just takes maturation time. It's a crop. ⁓ You know, you have to allow God to work your people to realize and they want to be empowered by the calling. And then, you know, what you guys would do, and we'll get to that in a second, but bring in, and I'll say that, but the organizational clarity. But back to the spiritual renewal. In that spiritual renewal season of God breaking my heart and watching us change the name of our church to connect, watching us build a new campus, and again, I'm not a carpenter Jesus was, but I'm not. And so what God would do, is he would lead me into that process of just getting alone with him. And as I would just, literally in my story of sitting on my back porch, of God breaking Terry of me, the problem was me, Vick. And that's what our guys are not willing to pay the price for, the spiritual renewal. I love that whole section of the book that begins with this, because you're never gonna get to the rest of this discipleship stuff until you let God help you get out of the way. But then he restored me with confidence. And I have discovered that this is who my Heavenly Father is. You know the story of my dad passing away, all this. I would have five deacons in 2020 die. Just out of nowhere, different stuff. I would be in a car wreck that they would have to do the jaws of life and pull me out of. All this in 2020. We're just in a new campus. COVID hits and we don't know if we're ever going to have church again. We've got a brand new campus six months in with a $3 million debt. And I'm going, Lord, what are you doing? ⁓ We've got ⁓ a worldwide epidemic. Five deacons passed away just suddenly. ⁓ best friend gets cancer and dies within three months. have to a heart ablation. have to go in and shock me. The same year, all of this happens in the same year. And then I wind up with a spinal fusion. They go through my throat. I may never speak again. Two months after the spinal fusion, I'm in a car wreck.
Vick Green: Wow.
Terry Pierce: And all the while, God would take our church and we would move from that 200 to all of a sudden we're breaking 300. And now we're, but we did not decline when everybody else did. God would take us through that season and it would begin a revival of watching a hundred. been here 20 years at that point. And we grew more in that year than we had the first 20.
Vick Green: Mmm. Wow.
Terry Pierce: Because it was God just showing us if you will trust me spiritual renewal will be a game changer
Vick Green: Mm. That's so good. What I love too in 2020, because we saw something similar as well. like for most churches in 2020, like COVID was this nationwide disciple making test. If you take away the church's programming, will the people own the mission? And most churches flop it. Most churches experience a decline in that. And a lot of it, are people like the people who were in the church doors every time they were open.
Terry Pierce: Yes. That was so good. Mm-hmm. Yep.
Vick Green: The moment those doors couldn't open, they didn't know how to have their own personal faith, how to own it. And so, but when that disciple making culture takes place, you see churches that despite that, there's still growth. That, you know, I look in my neighborhood in 2020 and we saw actually our whole neighborhood, all the believers that we had relationship with that we knew in our neighborhood got in D groups in an 18 month span, they multiplied. And then we started sharing our faith with people who were not going to church.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Amen. Yes. That's so good.
Vick Green: And it's just, you know, so I think that's such a great testament. Again, that's 2001 you come in, 20.
Terry Pierce: It was the catalyst. It was the catalyst, what you just said, you say it so better. That was the catalyst for our whole discipleship moving, going from addition to multiplication because God forced us to go out because we couldn't do it any other way.
Vick Green: Yes. That's good. Well, and I'd say there, that's where now the pedestal season of the pastors, the one who does ministry has now fully closed. And now we're really starting to live into, that is, it's good.
Terry Pierce: Hmm? Yeah. It died, it died with COVID, dude. It died in COVID. We got off the pedestal and we became everyday people connecting others to the freedom in Christ, amen.
Vick Green: Yes, dude, that's so good. And so you see 2020, I think for everybody, it was a new season. But for you guys, it's almost like y'all were preparing and it was really a stepping into the best next season for you guys. and I think too, you know, one, one more, a couple of things there too, that just to capture that, those two decades, I think what you embody so well, Terry, and now we'll get to all the
Terry Pierce: It was. Amen. It really was.
Vick Green: great stuff that's happening in this season. But I think you embodied two really powerful principles. One you already said is it's not if you have a passion for disciple making, it's if you have the grit for it. I mean, all that you just said around friends dying, disgruntled people wanting you fired, all of those things, like it'd been so easy to give up. And pure passion alone would not have been enough. That spiritual renewal, giving you that grit there.
Terry Pierce: Yeah, that's it. Mmm, yeah. Sure.
Vick Green: The second is people want the power of multiplication but won't be patient with the pace of multiplication. And I think you live that so well.
Terry Pierce: No, that's so good. the discipline, this is this is what Get the Movement Ready book, because the discipline is the way we access power. Spiritual discipline is a way that we, ⁓ not just your own power. This is the key. This is what Comer talks about in his book called Practicing the Way. And he says this, though a kind of resistance training of your will and power, but it's also God's power. Spiritual disciplines are Jesus's designed way of offering yourself to God so that you can draw on his appropriate grace the empowerment presence of the Holy Spirit. would become the catalyst and the game changer. So let me just say a word to pastors here today about this issue, about grit and sticking with it. So I got a quick story on this. You know, I don't love to tell stories. And so whenever I was growing up, Vick, I don't even know if you know this part about me, but I was six foot tall in the eighth grade. So dude, I became a legendary. But the problem was, is I peaked in the eighth grade. And so, ⁓ we had 24 minute basketball quarters, mean, 24 minute games in those days. So four quarters, 24 minutes, six minute quarters. And I was averaging 21 points a game, eighth grade year, you know, made the all-star teams and all that stuff. But here's the thing, to become a legendary basketball player in my county. in Illinois and peaked at eighth grade. to do that, ⁓ I had to do is it wasn't the performance ⁓ those games, Vick. This is where, and it wasn't, and we keep thinking that we have to practice this stuff and we got to do this. Here's the difference between discipline and spiritual discipline. ⁓ would go the camps and I would learn the skills. But the that I got so good at basketball was, is that ⁓ I had ⁓ literally I had to go and spin up till midnight. I would stay out all hours of the, what I did is I fell in love with the discipline of playing basketball big to become a good basketball player. wasn't about trying harder. It was about learning to train hard. And that's what our guys have got to get down. The spiritual discipline is the training hard. It's not about what you perform on Sunday and it's not about you trying hard. It's about you training harder and allowing God to open up the doors. so, ⁓ you know, the, what would happen would be genetics would catch up with me and that's where my story breaks down. know, I would not be, I would ⁓ not go on and pursue that career in college and get to Duke. ⁓ but, but, ⁓ says, again, I peaked in eighth grade, but, ⁓ but the thing is I did score 50 in a church league game once, but anyway,
Vick Green: That's good. That's good. That's good. There you go. It wouldn't be an interview with you if we didn't do a little bit of basketball talk.
Terry Pierce: No, we didn't. Yeah, so, you know, my other buddy here in Tupelo, Will Rambo so yeah, just, man, just tore him up. anyway, ⁓ ⁓ learning to practice that discipline of just knowing ⁓ has to be something that becomes a conviction and it's a calling in your life. And so that brings the discipline to sit with God. And now, know, what Todd Kaunitz teaches about,
Vick Green: That's It's good. Mm, yeah.
Terry Pierce: end of the prayer, that just meeting with God and getting along with Him, the confidence that it brings. The reason I became so good at basketball is because I spent all those nights training hard because I loved it. And the reason you can get up and do what God does through me on Sundays now is you can tell it's not my preaching, you know, has really changed as much as you can tell that Terry's been with God.
Vick Green: Mm. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: Dude, you cannot have discipleship until there's spiritual renew in your life, until you get out of the way. now, what we pray this Easter Sunday with the largest crowd we've ever had is we pray before whatever priest. I said, Lord, help. And we ask our congregation, Lord, I'm here today not to hear Terry, not to hear Tanner do the music. I'm here to hear from you. And because none of that matters until we get hungry for God.
Vick Green: Let's go. Let's go. Mmm. Okay. And a of things there that Terry said, Todd Kaunitz he was on our podcast just a couple of episodes ago. So you can definitely ⁓ listen to His pastor, prayer ⁓ and then Robbie story as well in, the movement ready church, you'll see so much connections to what Terry's story is here. Let's, let's fast forward ⁓ to when you I started to get, work together and spend time together because here's what I loved about that with you ⁓ at this point, you've the corner.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ my gosh, it's such a good episode. Phenomenal. Yeah. Absolutely.
Vick Green: Disciple making has taken root. You've gone from 200, you're now seeing over 300. This is the, know, and for pretty much everybody in your church, like these are the best days of Connect Church at this point. And I think what would have been very easy and the temptation is to get to that point and say, we've arrived. We've finally overcome all of this. And I think what I, and I remember in our conversations, there was different people in your leadership team and you were trying to say, there's more, we need more.
Terry Pierce: is. Yes.
Vick Green: we're stuck, there's kind of a ceiling that we're at. And I think there are lot of people that were content with like, hey, we got disciple making. That's like, you brought that to us and we don't struggle with the pedestal pastor culture anymore. But you had a vision of man, what is next? And so tell me a little, share it a little bit about that moment of what ceiling were you kind of feeling? And then what did you know that you were missing that you needed?
Terry Pierce: Yeah. Yeah, and so just by the fact that by the time we get to this point, we're realizing that the folks in our church, yeah, we're okay. JD Greer says it this way, the place where you experience God's power most is in our failure. Ironically, the place where we lose Him the fastest is in our success.
Vick Green: Hmm
Terry Pierce: And so at that point I had to digest that truth. And so I met with the leadership and I said, I really believe the Holy Spirit is telling me to bring this Vick guy in. And they go, who's this Vick guy? so ⁓ bring him in and ⁓ interview with our deacon board and they're like, yeah, we weren't that impressed with his thing. And I sit with his initial thing and I go, I wasn't either, ⁓ I'm telling you the ⁓ Holy has said, ⁓ listen, got these markers and he loves to use markers and whiteboards. ⁓ At that point, it became a conviction. I hope the pastors are hearing me on this. I knew that God was saying, I didn't understand it. after we brought in and you would walk us through, you know, just helping us understand the box in the circle ⁓ and understanding that ⁓ only does spiritual renewal, ⁓ you know, help you ⁓ start and sustain a movement, but it's understanding the disciple making culture. What your church is missing, guys, is the liberation that happens when you move to discipleship-making culture in your church. Then it just changes all the metrics. I mean, you teach us this all the wealth. We begin to measure things differently because now we're wanting to empower our people. So when we started the empowerment of our people, we hit this plateau. And so how do we do this second and third generation? And so there's going to be a lot of guys listening to this. This is where we moved them into understanding the circle is about understanding how to coach your people. first of all, they got to recognize their calling. Help your people understand they are called. Then you coach them. So what you did is you came in and taught us how to coach our people. This is what replicate does. This is what movement ready church is about so that they are commissioned by God. Now they're discovering their personal commissioning. God calls them. We coach them up in leadership training and then they answer the call that they're going out at work, home and play and making disciples where they're at. And that becomes, you know, that what we needed with you was organizational clarity. We had the discipleship making culture. But what I didn't have was to be able to articulate hand off to my people in booklet form ⁓ you know, sort of, not a manual, you know, as we think of it, just a program, but a resource. That's a better term. I love that term is we brought organizational clarity. ⁓ now ⁓ spreads the movement. We are becoming a movement ready church where people are now coming every week, Vick, because they sense. It's not just a church. This is a movement that God is doing. And the younger generation doesn't want to just do church the way we did it, They want to make a difference. We're blasting and criticizing, and I get it, Gen Z's and all this. They're coming to our church and flocking to our church because those that get it, man, they want to make a difference. And if we teach them discipleship, how to fall in love with Jesus, that's the empowerment. that's gonna change our community.
Vick Green: So good. So good. I love that. And I think you've actually now, even as you've gone, you shared your mission statement of just everyday people connecting people to the freedom in Jesus.
Terry Pierce: Yes. It's in almost every sermon, everything that we do, dude, it just bleeds into everything. We tell the stories every Sunday. How cool is that? We're preaching through the book of Acts. We're telling the stories, not of my stories, not what Pastor Pedestal Pastor Terry's doing. It's the stories from the congregation. You're telling the stories of life change of your people. They're doing ministry better than I am.
Vick Green: That's so good. That's right. That's right. Well, and think that's huge right there because because 20 years ago it's the pedestal pastor who makes disciples that connects people. That's exactly right. And now it's in your mission. So I remember when we named it, we said we're going to name it everyday people because it was that authenticity. It's just the like casual friend Terry, the back porch, Terry, not the pedestal pastor Terry. And then to talk about, man, that's it's disciple makings for all of us.
Terry Pierce: Yeah. And you're worn out and you're tired and you're. Yeah, that's it. Love it. Yep.
Vick Green: And think the other thing that's fun is you have your dream disciple roles.
Terry Pierce: Yes, yes.
Vick Green: which I think embody you guys so well and embody you. What are your dream disciple roles?
Terry Pierce: Yes. Now, that's so cool. So, ⁓ our dream disciple here at Connect Church is to be a Spirit-led disciple. Everything that God is doing at Connect Church is Holy Spirit-led. And coming out of the Baptist world, that whole third part of the Trinity, by the way, historic Christianity, ⁓ I could give you quotes from St. Benedict, Augustine, all these guys were doing discipleship. We shifted away from church history.
Vick Green: Mm. Yeah.
Terry Pierce: Spirit-led discipleship, authentic friends. You know, that's in our statement. People today, it's all about authenticity, dude. The younger generation smells of phony, they hate fake religion, authentic friendships, passionate storytelling. You cannot come to church with Terry Pearson, not understand. I had a guy tell me this Sunday, don't know him, we had so many new people, he walked up to me ⁓ and he walked up and he goes, dude,
Vick Green: That's right.
Terry Pierce: He goes, I don't know for sure I'm total believer, but I know you believe this. And so I said, that's cool, man. I take that as a huge compliment, passionate storyteller. We want our people to be passionate enough of dead boring Christianity and just doing this because we're checking a box, dude. Dude, Jesus died on a cross for our sins.
Vick Green: That's exactly right. Mm.
Terry Pierce: Dude, he rose again on the third day. If you can't get passionate about that, dude, we get passionate about LSU. I don't know why we get passionate about Duke basketball. Why in the world can we not get passionate about the story of going from hell to heaven, dude? I'm just telling you. and number four is a humble guide. People are tired of Christianity, of pedestal Christianity and what they relate to.
Vick Green: Hahaha Mm. Mm.
Terry Pierce: I had a person call me and said, you know, I think you're sometimes you use a little bit too common language in the in your preaching. And I said, I can't get away from it. The difference between Jesus in the New Testament and what we've talked about in the church world is Jesus did not impress the Pharisees. Jesus was a different rabbi than they'd ever seen before. He was a humble guide to everyday people. Everyday people will work as a statement.
Vick Green: Mm. Mm. So good. That's so good. It's so good. I love it. Passionate storyteller always connects so much as you even listed a tear here. But like, and I love just seeing you. You had the foresight to say, yes, we've started something good, but God wants to do even more. And and what's wild is I think after 20 years, you can say, man, God's done something great. But you said, man, there's even more. And what happened because you got to that point, you said,
Terry Pierce: Yes, yes. Yes. Amen.
Vick Green: we don't have the organizational clarity for it to spread beyond you. And so you were making disciples, the people that were directly connected, being coached by you, but it hadn't spread beyond you. And so now as your church, you're in that growth barrier, 250 is that growth barrier. And as you start getting on the other side, you're like, whoa, what used to work doesn't work now. And you guys went to it. And so just a cool celebration. Give an update of where Connect Church is today.
Terry Pierce: Yes. Yes. Right. ⁓ is ⁓ God be the glory. So, all these pastors that are listening to this today, ⁓ in that range, you know, of maybe you're at a hundred or you're at 200. ⁓ I'm telling you, ⁓ you allow God to do ⁓ and I know I've repeated myself, but it's spiritual renewal. It's a discipleship-making culture and it's organizational clarity. When these three components come in that Replicate will help you with, I'm telling you, you're gonna empower your people and have the grit, take the time to be there. We can't get past this process. This takes time. But once you get there, so I'm not just giving you motivational speech. This takes years. This takes a while, but... In the last, we're watching this multiply now. And this is gonna go a lot faster for you guys. Man, this was back in the day, COVID changed everything. Everything has intensified. It's accelerated all of this process. So this can happen much quicker now. But now today, ⁓ just to give God the glory, watching my people get excited, the atmosphere in the church, the discipleship making culture happens when people at the parking lot. The people at the front door are not just friendly. What people say is, These people genuinely care. These people believe what they're preaching. And that goes from the greeters, that grows from the coffee bar, that goes to the nursery, the children's church ministry. And we're watching God now take us from 300 in 2019 to now we're averaging over 600 in just seven years. We just did our second building program. We had to double the size of our auditorium. And now we're at to the point that we had over a thousand. people here in our campus last Sunday and watching God begin to just, and we're moving from 36 discipleship groups, our goal by the end of this year strategically is going to be at 50 discipleship groups with over 200 people involved in D. It's not just about counting how many D groups, it's about literally watching the whole Reformation. ⁓ of doing evangelism groups to neighborhood groups. It's no longer just in about one cookie cutter discipleship model. What Replicate has helped me do is realize discipleship happens at work. We've got guys doing different Bible studies, all of us centered around the Word of God. But man, they're doing different books of the Bible. They're doing it different ways. We've got moms that are literally doing discipleship in their neighborhood with moms who have babies. They don't have the formal de-grips like I do them, but man, they're meeting every other week with moms and they're just talking about life problems and then they bring scripture and Jesus into it and ⁓ she's literally discipling ⁓ all these moms in her neighborhood with babies. ⁓ so, because they rally around that point, you're empowering people to let God ⁓ open up doors that you could never do on your own.
Vick Green: So good. So good. Yeah, what I love, I think you are such a great testament of just of grit, of perseverance ⁓ and of faith of just saying, God, I'm trusting that you're going to move. I'm trusting that you're going to work even when today doesn't feel like it. And so what would be your final word as we close here? What would be to the pastor who is in year five of your journey, year 10, you know, who is who isn't seeing the fruit yet and is maybe
Terry Pierce: Ew. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Vick Green: considering giving up, what would be your encouragement to them?
Terry Pierce: Okay, my first word is to them, this is gonna be a little bit negative, but guys, you have to consider the cost of non-discipleship. what is it gonna, it's gonna, yeah, it's gonna cost you to go down this road, but the cost of non-discipleship is gonna cost you a lot more. And so man, that has to drive you to say, listen, ⁓ I believe that God has called us to do this. It always involves people. And it's just, you know, I think it was Augustine or Benedict one that said, ⁓ we need to understand that life is designed by God to be in community. And so I would just say to the guys, this is God's plan. It is, Jesus gave us, we know this, but to go and make disciples who make disciples. And so it's living in this community of faith. It's understanding that it is the journey that God will bring you through spiritually in the disciplines of learning to just trust in the power of God and know the confidence that I now have, not in myself, but yes, it brings that back around. It's like, let's go do this. because God is showing me, He called me to do this. And you remember the calling that you guys had when He first started doing this and people and programs will wear you out. I get to say at this age, at 61, these are the greatest days of my ministry. This is the days where me and my wife are enjoying our relationship. I got three kids that didn't want to go to my church.
Vick Green: Hmm. Mmm.
Terry Pierce: One's pastoring the disciple making movement. Another one's a youth pastor making disciples in Atlanta. The other one's in North Carolina. And my third one is running a business involved in making disciples with a teen program. Dude, if that's it, at the end of the day, my boys are making disciples. They're gonna do greater things than I've ever dreamed of. This church, the day that Terry Pierce walks out of here is just going to begin to see what it can do going forward because discipleship making is not a program. It is the plan. There is no plan B, dude. Let's go. Let's go get this. ⁓ Let's go, baby. Let's do it.
Vick Green: Mmm. God, come on. I love it. Welcome to every conversation with Terry Pierce. You're ready to run through a wall, passionate storyteller. I am so grateful, not just for the passion storyteller that you are, but your life that is a testimony to so many of these principles that we get to help churches with.
Terry Pierce: Thank you. Amen.
Vick Green: Terry is an unbelievable leader. He's unbelievable friend. You need to know Terry. You need to connect with Terry. Terry also leads a replicate huddle for us with other pastors. And so he's a guy that you want to learn from, be equipped by. And so Terry, if anybody wants to get connected with you, what's the best way to connect with Terry Pierce?
Terry Pierce: Thank you. Amen. Yeah, just email me at terry at triconnect.church. And I think that Amanda has some of my social media stuff that she's going to put in the feeders. So Amanda's going to take care of all that stuff. yeah, terry at triconnect.church, or you can just go to www.triconnect.church in Tupelo, Mississippi. And man, I love pastors and I love talking to discipleship. Get the book Movement Ready, guys. I'm telling you, it's a game changer.
Vick Green: Okay, yep. Appreciate that.
Terry Pierce: ⁓ What Vick is doing, he loves markers and you know, I feel sorry for his wife and kids because everything. But what these guys have that's different is the spiritual renewal piece of Robbie's heart and what they're doing. But they're going to help you understand it's just this simple create discipleship making culture and your people propel this. ⁓ then thirdly, what replicate does so well is they bring the organizational clarity into this.
Vick Green: Hmm.
Terry Pierce: help your people answer the call so that they can, it's not either or, but it's box and circle. Let's learn how to put both of them together and watch God grow your church.
Vick Green: Well, Sam, and so grateful for you. Thanks for taking the time today and look forward to it when we get to hang soon.
