Over the Garden Wall - Complete 2014 Series Review + 2013 Pilot: Tome of the Unknown - With Sarah North

WEBVTT
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Hey everyone, it's Jonathan, and today we are
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talking about the Cartoon Network miniseries
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Over the Garden Wall. Sarah and I recorded this
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podcast several years ago for iHeart Animation,
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but I recently re -edited it for my new podcast,
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The John Cass Rewind, and then earlier this year,
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Rachel Wagner suggested that I cover Over the
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Garden Wall as part of my Kids Lost in the Woods
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fairytale series. I didn't end up using it at
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that time, but I figured, it's fall, I'm doing
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this grab bag series, it's the perfect time to
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share this here as well. Sarah and I both love
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this show. I first saw it around the time it
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originally aired. I've always tried to keep up
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with animation news, so I was very aware that
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this was coming, and I had no idea what it was,
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but I loved the vibe of what I'd seen, and I
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was really looking forward to it. Though, if
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I remember right, I think I waited until the
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whole series was out so I could watch it all
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at once, or in as few sittings as possible. And
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then, obviously, I loved it, and I think my brother
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gave me the DVD for Christmas a year or two later,
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and I started showing it to other people. I think
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I watched it with both of Sarah's sisters, but
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for whatever reason, I just assumed Sarah wouldn't
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like it, and I don't think I even mentioned it
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to her until several years later. It may have
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been after we started podcasting together, and
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we realized how much our tastes were evolving.
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But whether or not she would have liked it back
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in 2014, Sarah does have a particular interest
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in a lot of things in this show, especially the
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historical significance of the places visited
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in the episodes, not to mention the Americana
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of the whole thing, so it definitely makes sense
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that she would like it now. And in the years
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since, it has basically become a fall tradition.
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Sarah detects the first chill in the air. Oh,
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almost time for Over the Garden Wall again! By
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the time I started prepping this episode, we've
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already watched it this year. When we decided
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to record this episode back in 2020, we really
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wanted to make sure to take our time and we wanted
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to thoroughly dissect the whole series, every
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episode from beginning to end. But at the time,
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it didn't occur to us to cover the original unaired
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pilot, and I'm not even sure I'd watched it at
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that time. So a couple years later, we did a
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vlog -slash -review of the pilot, Tome of the
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Unknown. The original version of that follow
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-up was a video for my YouTube channel. It also
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included a walk to a historic cemetery near our
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farm, but the audio on the vlog part of the video
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was not very podcast -friendly. A lot of wind
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and crunching as we walked in the field, so I
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cut that part. And I'm including the review of
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Tome of the Unknown as part of this episode.
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But if you're interested, I do recommend watching
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it on YouTube. It's probably a niche audience,
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but if you're interested in extremely obscure
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regional Iowa history, you might like it. Okay,
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I think that's all I've got to say to set this
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up. Let's get into our discussion of the seasonal
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autumn classic, Patrick McHale's Over the Garden
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Wall. I'm excited about this one. Me too. More
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than usual. There's just something about this
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series that I really like, and I was... pleasantly
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surprised that you liked it as much as you did.
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Kind of like the checklist of Lockheed and Alice
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or whatever. Well, that one I would say is more
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of a surprise than this. Yeah, that is surprising.
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But still, either way, I really liked this one
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and I'm glad you did too. I think it's when you
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look at it from the perspective of history because
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that's what lures me in the most and there is
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so there are so many little nuggets yeah and
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it's a weird dreamy mashup of nuggets and whimsy
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and so when you have whimsy history humor i mean
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yeah okay okay so for those who don't know but
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if you're listening to this i would hope you
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know over the garden wall is about two boys who
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are lost in the woods, a woods called The Unknown,
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which we don't know a whole lot about. You kind
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of discover as the series goes on. It's from
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2014, so it's not that old. And the boys are
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played by Elijah Wood and Colin Dean, and I don't
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know a whole lot about Colin Dean. He's a lot
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younger, but Elijah Wood, of course, Frodo. Colin
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Dean being an absolutely adorable. voice on here
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now this series was written by Patrick McHale
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I believe that's his name and looking at him
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I'd have to dig a little bit deeper but I feel
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like he's kind of the darker side of a kindred
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spirit for me like he probably likes some darker
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stuff than I do but man the Americana in here
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the I yeah we'll get into it we'll get into it
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Well, I guess we could go episode by episode
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and talk about things as they come up. I think
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it's a good idea. And also, if you haven't watched
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this series and you don't want to know what happens,
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you need to stop listening because we're going
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to talk it over, pick it apart, and have fun
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with it. And if you like Zero Surprises, listen.
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But even with as much as we're going to pick
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it apart, you'll probably find stuff yourself
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if you keep re -watching because it's just so
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loaded with things. Every time I watch this,
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I notice either something that I'd forgotten
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about or something that I didn't notice before.
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There's just so much hidden in this show. In
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the beginning episode, something that I didn't
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really think about was that it starts with all
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of these little vignettes of characters that
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come up later, which are clues to what's going
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on. it's so layered it's it's one of those things
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the beginning especially where if you watch it
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again after you've already watched it yes then
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then you'll then you'll see what the significance
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is or at least some more of the significance
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yeah and while this montage is happening you
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have the frog singing a song and i think this
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happens in just about every episode the frog
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sings the opening song And I don't know who this
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is specifically, but Jack Jones, I believe is
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his name, is the voice of the frog. He was like
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a staple of like 60s and 70s variety shows, including
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the Carol Burnett show. What, like doing some
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of the music? Yeah, just the music. Which his
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voice has that sound. Yeah, I love the voice
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of the frog. It's great. Which I thought maybe
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he was the son of a famous Welsh singer. Like,
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no, I don't think that's the case. He's a different
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Jones. You have the two kids, Wirt and Greg,
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lost in the woods, and it starts with a recurring
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joke with Greg trying to name his frog, except
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at the beginning, he's listing off the worst
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names that you could name the frog, which I thought
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was hilarious. This kid has the greatest sense
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of humor. I love Greg's look on life, on everything.
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He's just so... random and funny and i love him
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he's too calm for a normal human being but you
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just have to accept it i guess yeah he is extremely
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calm with all the stuff that they go through
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it doesn't really seem to affect him at all mr
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magoo so they're wandering through the woods
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greg is leaving a candy trail and they come across
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a woodsman and this woodsman is kind of Creepy
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-ish. He's voiced by Christopher Lloyd. He's
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a great voice for that part. Yes, perfect. And
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he's warning them about the beast. The beast
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is in the woods and they need to be aware of
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the beast. Trying to protect them by taking them
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to the mill where he is living. Now here's an
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important point. When they come up to the mill,
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the woodsman himself says, I found this place
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abandoned and I'm using it for, you know, my
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purposes. So that's not his house. And I think
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that's important later on. Like, he thinks, is
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it okay for me to go into the lantern right away?
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Or do we need to wait till the episode? Well,
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he talks about the lantern a little bit. You
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don't get into too much right here, but whatever
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you want to say, go ahead. Okay. Well, right
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off the bat. He thinks that the soul of his daughter
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is in that lantern and to keep his daughter alive
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he has to keep burning the Edelwood in it. And
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later on the Beast is like, do you really want
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to go back to that empty house? So the indication
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would be that he doesn't realize that... Like
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he hasn't been back to the house to see whether
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his daughter is actually there. I'm wondering
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if I didn't even think about that. So I wonder
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if he went out looking for her, was encountered
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by the beast who said this is where she is and
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gave him the option of looking after her, quote
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unquote, because at the end. Spoiler, spoiler,
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spoiler. When he goes back to his house, she
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just comes out of the house. Yeah. So this is
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what makes sense of like, oh. She was probably
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fine the whole time. He probably went out looking
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for her and got totally deceived and decided,
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I'm going to, here's this gristmill, I'll use
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this to help keep her alive and maybe traumatize
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not wanting to go back to the empty house. Yeah.
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So, yeah. I didn't even think about that. That's
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a really good point. But it's easy to miss at
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the beginning. You just assume, okay, this is
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where this guy lives. Unless you're paying attention
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to, oh, you found this place? Yeah. Yeah. And
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he's probably put in even more dire straits,
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at least in his mind, when it gets wrecked, which
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is what is about to happen. Yes. They encounter
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a beast, not the beast, because something has
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been following their candy trail. Yes. A giant,
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hideous wolf with glowing eyes. And this is another
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point where Greg's look on life is it's the perfect
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break from what would be a terrifying scene absolutely
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horrifying like horror movie worthy the the wolf
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is he's like opening his mouth he's like he's
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gonna eat him in this barrel and greg looks up
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at him you have beautiful eyes like that's going
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to stop like you have beautiful eyes i just love
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the way he thinks about things kind of makes
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me think of that one movie with Amy Adams. It's
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not ever after. It's the one where the homeless
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guy comes up to him and is like, you have a really
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nice smile. You are not a very nice old man.
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Anyway. But no, everything's getting wrecked
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and how do they fix it? They didn't really fix
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it. Well, not the gristmill, the dog. They end
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up climbing up onto the roof and the wolf burst
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through the ceiling onto the roof after them
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and i don't remember exactly how it happened
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but the wolf ends up falling down off the roof
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into the wheel of the mill you see greg had put
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a piece of candy in his candy trail on top of
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a black turtle the black turtles can have a bad
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effect the dog ate the black turtle turned into
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this hideous beast but when the dog falls the
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turtle gets spewed out and he's returned to a
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normal dog which Another thing, if you're not
00:11:23.789 --> 00:11:27.909
paying attention, you'll miss that this is Beatrice's
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dog. And we'll get to who Beatrice is. Technically,
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Beatrice was in this episode very briefly, because
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she meets them right before they meet the woodsman.
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Okay, right. She flies away. Right, yes. But
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she has a proper introduction in the next episode.
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Okay, and so the woodsman is distressed over
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the state of his repurposed gristmill. And sends
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them off to find a village to get help. He was
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trying to help them, but they're kind of left
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on their own in the dark. Yeah. Well, we could
00:12:07.149 --> 00:12:10.509
be hard on the woodsman for that, but he's probably
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not in his right mind. He's kind of traumatized
00:12:13.529 --> 00:12:17.639
himself. He may not have felt like he could properly
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keep them safe. I don't know. I don't know what
00:12:20.399 --> 00:12:23.450
all was going on there. But this is also a dreamlike
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state where people could question whether all
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of this was real or a dream, too. Yeah. And dreams
00:12:30.330 --> 00:12:33.090
don't have to make total sense. That's another
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thing. Okay. We're going to get to this later.
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But there is a possibility that throughout this
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whole thing, Greg and Wirt are basically drowning
00:12:44.309 --> 00:12:47.429
in a pond and fighting for life. And this whole
00:12:47.429 --> 00:12:50.610
dreamlike state is... I don't know, either a
00:12:50.610 --> 00:12:54.389
reality or a metaphor or some kind of purgatory,
00:12:54.590 --> 00:12:57.950
quote unquote. And that would kind of make sense
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as to making decisions as to whether they are
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going to keep hope and survive. But I totally
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want to think of this as its own reality as well.
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So people can go crazy with however they want
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to interpret that. Okay. So moving on to episode
00:13:19.470 --> 00:13:22.789
two. Which is called Hard Times at the Huskin
00:13:22.789 --> 00:13:27.419
Bee. Husking corn, if you're wondering what a
00:13:27.419 --> 00:13:32.080
huskin bee is. You have Wirt and Greg. This is
00:13:32.080 --> 00:13:34.860
where they meet Beatrice. That's another thing.
00:13:35.460 --> 00:13:36.879
This is one of those things where it depends
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on whether you want to infuse meaning into it
00:13:38.440 --> 00:13:43.200
or not. Beatrice was the name of somebody who
00:13:43.200 --> 00:13:49.019
was a guide for Dante through heaven. Like in
00:13:49.019 --> 00:13:52.899
Dante's Inferno, I believe. Oh, okay. So she
00:13:52.899 --> 00:13:57.080
acts as their guide, and her name is Beatrice.
00:13:57.120 --> 00:13:59.379
So whether you want to make anything of that
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or not, you can, which would also help to back
00:14:02.360 --> 00:14:05.860
up the whole, you know, fighting with death type
00:14:05.860 --> 00:14:09.480
thing. Anyway. That makes sense. Even if it's
00:14:09.480 --> 00:14:11.620
not supposed to be a total meaning, it's definitely
00:14:11.620 --> 00:14:13.759
a reference. It has to be a reference to that.
00:14:14.000 --> 00:14:19.129
Good chance. Yeah. Anyways, Beatrice is freed
00:14:19.129 --> 00:14:23.820
from a bush and she says that she owes them a
00:14:23.820 --> 00:14:26.240
favor. Which honestly, I bet she just stuck herself
00:14:26.240 --> 00:14:29.840
in that bush. Yes, that's what I think. She wants
00:14:29.840 --> 00:14:33.220
to lead them to Adelaide, who is the good woman
00:14:33.220 --> 00:14:35.720
of the forest or the good woman of the woods
00:14:35.720 --> 00:14:40.080
or something like that. She's supposed to be
00:14:40.080 --> 00:14:42.519
someone who can help them. So they're going to
00:14:42.519 --> 00:14:45.330
go find Adelaide, but they end up... finding
00:14:45.330 --> 00:14:49.730
this village called Pottsfield. And in this village,
00:14:49.889 --> 00:14:52.389
there are lots of people dressed as pumpkins
00:14:52.389 --> 00:14:56.529
dancing around this giant pumpkin maypole thing.
00:14:56.870 --> 00:15:00.870
We've got to talk about turkeys. There are turkeys
00:15:00.870 --> 00:15:05.970
in this episode. See, this episode, they infuse
00:15:05.970 --> 00:15:08.769
humor, but honestly, it's pretty dark. Yeah.
00:15:09.269 --> 00:15:14.789
One of the inspirations... that the creator of
00:15:14.789 --> 00:15:17.409
this series used which is also another kindred
00:15:17.409 --> 00:15:22.090
spirit type thing were vintage postcards so when
00:15:22.090 --> 00:15:24.610
i was that makes perfect sense i've seen a lot
00:15:24.610 --> 00:15:28.230
of weird vintage postcards so when i was researching
00:15:28.230 --> 00:15:33.250
this series i looked up halloween postcards and
00:15:33.250 --> 00:15:35.570
there were not only jack -o' -lanterns there
00:15:35.570 --> 00:15:38.389
were pumpkin people in this episode it's loaded
00:15:38.389 --> 00:15:43.350
with pumpkin people And lots of black cats. You
00:15:43.350 --> 00:15:45.629
find out later, and sort of at the beginning,
00:15:45.850 --> 00:15:48.909
that there is a black cat involved. Black cats
00:15:48.909 --> 00:15:52.809
can also be said, I think, to be guides of the
00:15:52.809 --> 00:15:56.529
dead. So if you want to go for that dark reference,
00:15:56.789 --> 00:15:59.289
please, people, adopt black cats. They need love.
00:15:59.889 --> 00:16:03.429
I think that too many inappropriate references.
00:16:04.009 --> 00:16:06.090
And, of course, if I had seven black cats, people
00:16:06.090 --> 00:16:08.309
might judge me. So, you know, I don't know. I
00:16:08.309 --> 00:16:11.059
don't know. People need to, anyway, there is
00:16:11.059 --> 00:16:15.200
a Black Cat Day that encourages adoption of black
00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:22.309
cats. Little side note. But, so okay, great,
00:16:22.429 --> 00:16:26.389
fine. That makes sense as far as references go.
00:16:26.710 --> 00:16:29.269
But what about the turkeys? People didn't talk
00:16:29.269 --> 00:16:31.429
that much about the turkeys. In this episode,
00:16:31.570 --> 00:16:34.870
you have a turkey who's like asleep on a table,
00:16:34.990 --> 00:16:39.200
practically. In a weird way. He just looks at
00:16:39.200 --> 00:16:41.799
them and he makes sort of weird jiggly fleshy
00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:46.620
noises. But my weird, my, but my favorite thing,
00:16:46.820 --> 00:16:49.139
one of my favorite things in this whole series
00:16:49.139 --> 00:16:52.360
is the turkey carriage. That is so whimsical
00:16:52.360 --> 00:16:54.820
and fun. A little carriage being pulled by two
00:16:54.820 --> 00:16:57.139
turkeys. And people don't really want to talk
00:16:57.139 --> 00:16:59.340
about this. They don't want to infuse some weird
00:16:59.340 --> 00:17:02.019
or probably inaccurate meaning into the turkeys.
00:17:02.139 --> 00:17:04.839
Why does no one seem to care that much about
00:17:04.839 --> 00:17:07.720
the turkeys? I mean, some people are probably
00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:12.500
like, oh, yay, turkeys. And just, I love turkeys.
00:17:13.339 --> 00:17:17.759
They're a really cool American symbol. And America
00:17:17.759 --> 00:17:22.990
or no America, they're amazing birds. So I already
00:17:22.990 --> 00:17:27.369
came in biased. And I wasn't finding that much.
00:17:27.710 --> 00:17:32.230
Until I decided to Google turkey, vintage turkey
00:17:32.230 --> 00:17:36.490
postcards. Once again, all of a sudden. I'm seeing
00:17:36.490 --> 00:17:40.490
turkeys not only pulling carriages. There was
00:17:40.490 --> 00:17:43.609
one where they were driving a motor car. There
00:17:43.609 --> 00:17:48.069
are ones where they're pulling a pumpkin on wheels.
00:17:49.150 --> 00:17:52.210
One or more where there is, I think at least
00:17:52.210 --> 00:17:54.910
a couple I saw, were sort of a little pumpkin
00:17:54.910 --> 00:17:57.250
carriage filled with bounty. One of them had
00:17:57.250 --> 00:18:00.029
not only bounty, but an American flag and a little
00:18:00.029 --> 00:18:04.049
boy holding a football. So he had to have gotten
00:18:04.049 --> 00:18:08.609
his imagery. also from postcards for this episode
00:18:08.609 --> 00:18:12.589
and it's almost like this interesting mashup
00:18:12.589 --> 00:18:16.750
of both thanksgiving and halloween postcards
00:18:16.750 --> 00:18:22.839
so it was this little aha yeah that makes perfect
00:18:22.839 --> 00:18:25.160
sense so you could almost call this the postcard
00:18:25.160 --> 00:18:29.299
episode yeah absolutely one of my favorite things
00:18:29.299 --> 00:18:33.460
the little turkey carriage so so fun and not
00:18:33.980 --> 00:18:36.960
A totally fresh idea from them. They were merely
00:18:36.960 --> 00:18:39.599
bringing back something really cool. From like
00:18:39.599 --> 00:18:44.160
a hundred years ago. There you go. There's probably.
00:18:44.279 --> 00:18:47.140
There's a lot of things in this. Where it's probably
00:18:47.140 --> 00:18:49.660
not a fresh idea. But they're reusing it. And
00:18:49.660 --> 00:18:53.019
refreshing ideas. They're bringing back something
00:18:53.019 --> 00:18:58.319
cool. For us to think about. This episode also.
00:18:58.460 --> 00:19:01.079
It has autumn leaves. It shows the geese flying.
00:19:01.200 --> 00:19:04.230
It has a little cricket chirping. These things
00:19:04.230 --> 00:19:07.369
that are so easy for people to take for granted,
00:19:07.430 --> 00:19:10.069
but when you focus in on them, it's so cozy.
00:19:10.589 --> 00:19:15.730
It's so autumnal. And one of his inspirations
00:19:15.730 --> 00:19:20.650
was, you know, autumn in New England. So, yeah,
00:19:20.670 --> 00:19:22.829
make sure to relax and enjoy that part of the
00:19:22.829 --> 00:19:25.869
episode before you're maybe thoroughly creeped
00:19:25.869 --> 00:19:30.509
out. Yeah, once they're with the pumpkin people,
00:19:30.690 --> 00:19:33.369
they start saying some weird things like, aren't
00:19:33.369 --> 00:19:36.250
you here a little bit too early? Which I appreciate
00:19:36.250 --> 00:19:39.849
that instead of making it like, you are here
00:19:39.849 --> 00:19:43.529
in our grasp, it's like, this is the fun place
00:19:43.529 --> 00:19:46.509
for the dead people. What are you doing here?
00:19:47.440 --> 00:19:50.380
Yeah, you don't quite know what they're talking
00:19:50.380 --> 00:19:53.720
about at first. No, no. But then they are...
00:19:54.109 --> 00:19:56.970
I guess, tried and sentenced. And it seems really
00:19:56.970 --> 00:19:58.869
creepy and scary at first because you have this
00:19:58.869 --> 00:20:02.109
giant pumpkin maypole thing that's alive. And
00:20:02.109 --> 00:20:03.970
all of these ribbons that they've been tying
00:20:03.970 --> 00:20:06.309
around it are acting like arms. So it's kind
00:20:06.309 --> 00:20:11.089
of like a pumpkin octopus monster thing. And
00:20:11.089 --> 00:20:14.369
he's talking like they've committed some grave
00:20:14.369 --> 00:20:17.690
sin by trespassing and crushing some pumpkins
00:20:17.690 --> 00:20:21.190
by accident. Absolutely wonderful voice actor.
00:20:21.690 --> 00:20:26.559
He's a singer. Chris Isaac, I believe. He has
00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:31.920
the most wonderful bass voice. Come in here and
00:20:31.920 --> 00:20:37.490
you trample our crops. Yeah. Yeah, he has a really
00:20:37.490 --> 00:20:40.930
great, memorable, perfect voice for this giant
00:20:40.930 --> 00:20:44.029
pumpkin creature. And so they're sentenced to
00:20:44.029 --> 00:20:46.609
manual labor and have their little shackle on
00:20:46.609 --> 00:20:50.730
their feet. Even the bird, which does not make
00:20:50.730 --> 00:20:53.700
sense and is very cute. They're supposed to be
00:20:53.700 --> 00:20:55.720
digging up this field, and they don't really
00:20:55.720 --> 00:20:58.019
know why. But they did other work before that,
00:20:58.039 --> 00:21:01.380
too, like harvesting. Oh, that's true. But I
00:21:01.380 --> 00:21:02.980
guess their last thing of the day is digging
00:21:02.980 --> 00:21:06.220
up this field. And Beatrice suggests that they're...
00:21:06.220 --> 00:21:08.559
doesn't she suggest that they're digging their
00:21:08.559 --> 00:21:11.700
own graves? Yes. But here's another reference.
00:21:11.819 --> 00:21:14.279
Okay, before you totally find out that these
00:21:14.279 --> 00:21:19.140
are dead people, they're in Pottsfield, which...
00:21:19.470 --> 00:21:21.890
if you go into the fandom or whatever they'll
00:21:21.890 --> 00:21:24.910
say this is a reference to potter's field where
00:21:24.910 --> 00:21:28.950
people were poor people were buried in mass sometimes
00:21:28.950 --> 00:21:32.750
tens of thousands of people in fields because
00:21:32.750 --> 00:21:35.490
they couldn't afford a proper burial so it makes
00:21:35.490 --> 00:21:38.609
sense that they're out in a field digging up
00:21:38.609 --> 00:21:43.559
unmarked graves yeah I've heard a sum of that,
00:21:43.599 --> 00:21:45.920
but I never really looked into it too much beyond
00:21:45.920 --> 00:21:48.460
just the reference to the name Potter's Field.
00:21:48.539 --> 00:21:51.839
Which, on that note, it's actually, like, this
00:21:51.839 --> 00:21:56.180
is not how the afterlife works. But it's kind
00:21:56.180 --> 00:21:59.920
of sweet in that all these people knew who these
00:21:59.920 --> 00:22:03.640
people were. So even though the graves were unmarked
00:22:03.640 --> 00:22:07.759
and they were poor people, they're being rejoined
00:22:07.759 --> 00:22:12.789
in the afterlife. Happily rejoined. Yeah, because
00:22:12.789 --> 00:22:16.150
Greg digs up a skeleton, then they all freak
00:22:16.150 --> 00:22:18.470
out. I don't think Greg freaks out that much.
00:22:18.470 --> 00:22:21.130
I don't know that Greg even noticed. He was more
00:22:21.130 --> 00:22:23.390
excited about finding buried treasure, which
00:22:23.390 --> 00:22:25.910
that's what he thinks the skeleton is. So, yeah,
00:22:25.970 --> 00:22:27.630
did he realize that he dug? He probably realized
00:22:27.630 --> 00:22:29.289
that he dug up a skeleton, but I think he took
00:22:29.289 --> 00:22:33.150
off before it rose up, or did he? The pumpkin
00:22:33.150 --> 00:22:37.759
people come in and start talking to him. Wirt
00:22:37.759 --> 00:22:40.240
is freaking out. Beatrice frees them, but Wirt
00:22:40.240 --> 00:22:42.740
doesn't realize that he's free. And then Beatrice
00:22:42.740 --> 00:22:47.019
and Greg run off while Wirt is still there. And
00:22:47.019 --> 00:22:49.539
that's when you find out that these skeletons
00:22:49.539 --> 00:22:52.079
that they've dug up, they're coming back to life
00:22:52.079 --> 00:22:54.039
and they're being welcomed into the community.
00:22:54.279 --> 00:22:57.839
And it's not a terrifying situation. Dressed
00:22:57.839 --> 00:23:01.259
in vegetables. Yes. And he's free to go, whereas
00:23:01.259 --> 00:23:04.359
he thinks that he's being held prisoner. And
00:23:04.359 --> 00:23:07.829
they're happy to have him stay, but... Off they
00:23:07.829 --> 00:23:10.650
go. Mm -hmm. And they bid them for a while. I
00:23:10.650 --> 00:23:12.529
think they say something like, you'll join us
00:23:12.529 --> 00:23:17.200
someday. Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm. Enoch also may have
00:23:17.200 --> 00:23:19.500
had some significance, but it's one of those
00:23:19.500 --> 00:23:21.900
things where you can put significance to Enoch
00:23:21.900 --> 00:23:24.420
or just take it as an old -timey name. Mm -hmm.
00:23:25.240 --> 00:23:27.539
Next, we come to one of my favorite episodes.
00:23:27.779 --> 00:23:29.940
I'm sure it's one of your favorites, too, because,
00:23:30.000 --> 00:23:34.259
at least for the music, Schooltown Follies. Uh,
00:23:34.559 --> 00:23:39.630
I haven't... I have not thoroughly analyzed which
00:23:39.630 --> 00:23:43.829
one is my favorite, but this has lovable elements,
00:23:43.990 --> 00:23:46.849
definitely. This is one we reference a lot. That's
00:23:46.849 --> 00:23:47.289
why I was thinking it was one of our favorites.
00:23:47.289 --> 00:23:50.829
Yeah, it's very catchy. Yes, the music is so
00:23:50.829 --> 00:23:53.730
great. So they're still wandering through the
00:23:53.730 --> 00:23:56.710
woods, and they come across a school full of
00:23:56.710 --> 00:24:02.150
animals. And this teacher, Miss Langtree, who
00:24:02.150 --> 00:24:07.470
seems to have some emotional issues. This episode,
00:24:07.490 --> 00:24:13.349
it seems very, the costuming seems very early
00:24:13.349 --> 00:24:18.470
1900s to 19 -teens. So there are all these different
00:24:18.470 --> 00:24:23.130
sort of historical settings, whereas the episodes
00:24:23.130 --> 00:24:28.069
before this seem far more 17 or 1800s. This one
00:24:28.069 --> 00:24:32.690
seems more early 1900s. And what about the animal
00:24:32.690 --> 00:24:35.210
designs? Were they... Did you find out if they
00:24:35.210 --> 00:24:36.869
were specifically based on anything? Because
00:24:36.869 --> 00:24:40.190
I had theories, but I don't know. I would say
00:24:40.190 --> 00:24:43.789
that, too, at the latest, maybe 20s or 30s. But
00:24:43.789 --> 00:24:48.150
for Miss Langtry, she has sort of a cottage loaf
00:24:48.150 --> 00:24:53.910
hairstyle, which is, you know, and shirt waist,
00:24:54.190 --> 00:24:56.329
you know, like the white shirt and the skirt.
00:24:56.410 --> 00:25:00.890
So that's very early 1900s and 19 -teens. And
00:25:00.890 --> 00:25:04.279
then, of course, her boyfriend. that keeps coming
00:25:04.279 --> 00:25:11.119
up, has one of those mustaches that would be
00:25:11.119 --> 00:25:14.160
classic to that period of time. I was wondering
00:25:14.160 --> 00:25:16.420
if the animals were partly inspired by any of
00:25:16.420 --> 00:25:19.000
those old postcards that you'd mentioned. Because
00:25:19.000 --> 00:25:21.160
I know there's animals in clothes in a lot of,
00:25:21.279 --> 00:25:24.359
not just postcards, but people would dress up
00:25:24.359 --> 00:25:27.240
taxidermied animals in little clothes. I didn't
00:25:27.240 --> 00:25:31.259
know that! Oh my goodness. That's a little weird.
00:25:31.900 --> 00:25:34.359
The main thing, though, I was thinking that they
00:25:34.359 --> 00:25:38.519
looked like, not exactly, but they reminded me
00:25:38.519 --> 00:25:41.859
of Beatrix Potter characters. Oh, sure. I'd have
00:25:41.859 --> 00:25:44.799
to look again. I remember one of them, one or
00:25:44.799 --> 00:25:46.500
more of them, I think having a little cap that
00:25:46.500 --> 00:25:51.819
looks kind of 1920s. But no, it's very whimsical
00:25:51.819 --> 00:25:55.660
because she's supposed to be teaching these animals
00:25:55.660 --> 00:25:58.779
to read and write and doing a good turn. And
00:25:58.779 --> 00:26:02.440
it's adorable. But she's having trouble focusing
00:26:02.440 --> 00:26:06.019
because she's lamenting the fact that her boyfriend,
00:26:06.420 --> 00:26:11.240
Jimmy Brown, has disappeared. And there's a gorilla
00:26:11.240 --> 00:26:13.660
on the loose. Yes, there's a gorilla on the loose.
00:26:13.779 --> 00:26:16.720
It's such random problems that she's so upset
00:26:16.720 --> 00:26:20.960
about. The problems are not equal in scope, but
00:26:20.960 --> 00:26:24.480
she's lamenting them all equally. It's just so...
00:26:24.700 --> 00:26:27.299
funny. Talking about the school might get closed,
00:26:27.500 --> 00:26:29.839
Jimmy Brown's run off, there's a gorilla on the
00:26:29.839 --> 00:26:34.559
loose. It doesn't rain, but it pours. But the
00:26:34.559 --> 00:26:36.799
song that she's singing while she's all upset
00:26:36.799 --> 00:26:41.160
is just so catchy. And if you watch the episode,
00:26:41.339 --> 00:26:43.559
you don't get a whole lot of it, but you can
00:26:43.559 --> 00:26:46.359
find the full song on YouTube, and it is great.
00:26:46.579 --> 00:26:49.779
It's long. She goes through the whole alphabet
00:26:49.779 --> 00:26:54.190
and then into some numbers. It's so great. If
00:26:54.190 --> 00:26:56.470
you haven't, you need to look up that song because
00:26:56.470 --> 00:26:59.309
it's so much fun. Starts A is for the apple that
00:26:59.309 --> 00:27:02.549
he gave to me, but I found a worm inside. B is
00:27:02.549 --> 00:27:05.210
for beloved that I called to him before he said
00:27:05.210 --> 00:27:07.890
goodbye. Something like that. And C, see what
00:27:07.890 --> 00:27:12.069
he did to me. See what he did, that's D, did
00:27:12.069 --> 00:27:14.829
it to poor old me. Why must I be such an emotional
00:27:14.829 --> 00:27:20.130
fool? F is for the gentleman I thought he was.
00:27:21.009 --> 00:27:23.410
Anyway, yeah, it goes on and on. It's a great
00:27:23.410 --> 00:27:27.069
song. I love it. And that style, there are different
00:27:27.069 --> 00:27:30.029
musical styles throughout this, all based off
00:27:30.029 --> 00:27:35.130
of old -timey music. They didn't try and infuse
00:27:35.130 --> 00:27:38.109
pop music into this whole setting. No, I love
00:27:38.109 --> 00:27:41.289
that they did that, because it sets it apart
00:27:41.289 --> 00:27:43.470
from other more modern cartoons. It gives it
00:27:43.470 --> 00:27:48.069
its own feel. I love the musical choices in this.
00:27:48.640 --> 00:27:54.039
Even if it's not music that you listen to on
00:27:54.039 --> 00:27:57.799
a day -to -day basis, it's a nod to a lot of
00:27:57.799 --> 00:28:02.440
Americana. And it is historically interesting.
00:28:02.700 --> 00:28:08.420
And the main people in charge of the music were
00:28:08.420 --> 00:28:11.240
the Blasting Company. And if you look them up
00:28:11.240 --> 00:28:14.900
and you read about what music inspires them or
00:28:14.900 --> 00:28:17.240
that they like, you can see those influences.
00:28:18.190 --> 00:28:21.829
running throughout and it comes from a place
00:28:21.829 --> 00:28:28.210
of of knowledge and love for old things that
00:28:28.210 --> 00:28:32.750
aside back to miss langtry yes well meanwhile
00:28:32.750 --> 00:28:36.630
while she's inside lamenting this you see that
00:28:36.630 --> 00:28:39.630
there's actually a gorilla outside a very ugly
00:28:39.630 --> 00:28:47.329
not realistic looking gorilla and it's chasing
00:28:47.329 --> 00:28:50.549
Greg and some other little animals around because
00:28:50.549 --> 00:28:53.230
only Wirt is inside because he's being stubborn
00:28:53.230 --> 00:28:55.910
to try and prove a point to Beatrice who told
00:28:55.910 --> 00:28:58.569
him that he just does whatever anybody tells
00:28:58.569 --> 00:29:02.450
him to do. So he's trying to prove a point to
00:29:02.450 --> 00:29:04.710
her by sticking around and doing whatever the
00:29:04.710 --> 00:29:08.029
teacher tells him to do. And at some point Greg
00:29:08.029 --> 00:29:10.869
makes his way inside and it's mealtime where
00:29:10.869 --> 00:29:14.849
you get another great song. Potatoes and molasses.
00:29:15.029 --> 00:29:17.670
Like if there's only one song that you remember
00:29:17.670 --> 00:29:21.170
from this, not because it's the most poetic,
00:29:21.230 --> 00:29:22.890
but because it's the most catchy. This might
00:29:22.890 --> 00:29:26.630
be the one that you go away singing. Yes. The
00:29:26.630 --> 00:29:29.130
thought of putting molasses on potatoes sounds
00:29:29.130 --> 00:29:34.009
horrible to me, but I love this song. It's very
00:29:34.009 --> 00:29:37.549
cute. And then you have the animals playing instruments,
00:29:37.950 --> 00:29:41.470
which the school teacher's father comes in and
00:29:41.470 --> 00:29:44.170
this is just not. This isn't what the school
00:29:44.170 --> 00:29:46.809
was for. He takes away the instruments, and he
00:29:46.809 --> 00:29:49.309
seems like the bad guy, but he's really not,
00:29:49.569 --> 00:29:52.930
as you find out later. Yes, they're all sent
00:29:52.930 --> 00:29:55.470
to bed, but they sneak out in the middle of the
00:29:55.470 --> 00:29:59.109
night, and the old man Langtry is in the woods
00:29:59.109 --> 00:30:02.490
lamenting everything that's going on. And he's
00:30:02.490 --> 00:30:04.390
wearing this giant coat. Like, he's really skinny,
00:30:04.529 --> 00:30:08.069
but he looks enormous because of this coat. I
00:30:08.069 --> 00:30:10.130
don't know why they did that. It's just one of
00:30:10.130 --> 00:30:13.069
his standout features to me. Probably to make
00:30:13.069 --> 00:30:15.089
him look intimidating at first, but then to realize
00:30:15.089 --> 00:30:18.910
that he's not. He's really a vulnerable person.
00:30:19.609 --> 00:30:22.869
And it's all this plot exposition of like, no,
00:30:23.009 --> 00:30:24.509
he has to, you know, he's talking to himself.
00:30:24.630 --> 00:30:27.089
He has to sell these instruments to keep the
00:30:27.089 --> 00:30:30.549
school going. And then there's Jimmy Brown and
00:30:30.549 --> 00:30:33.250
the gorilla. And they're not having a good time.
00:30:34.250 --> 00:30:37.930
But Greg. Has his own plan. He says, let's go
00:30:37.930 --> 00:30:43.079
steal his stuff. But he had a good purpose for
00:30:43.079 --> 00:30:46.119
it. Yes. Because he gets up a benefit concert
00:30:46.119 --> 00:30:48.380
with the animals, so the animals get to keep
00:30:48.380 --> 00:30:52.680
their music and the school. And in the middle
00:30:52.680 --> 00:30:55.700
of this concert, the gorilla attacks, but it
00:30:55.700 --> 00:30:58.500
falls over and the head falls off. And it's Jimmy
00:30:58.500 --> 00:31:02.049
Brown. He's been stuck inside a gorilla costume
00:31:02.049 --> 00:31:05.730
for I don't know how long. Because he got a job
00:31:05.730 --> 00:31:07.710
in the circus so he could buy a wedding ring.
00:31:08.049 --> 00:31:11.289
For Miss Langtree. Yes. Which, that is one of
00:31:11.289 --> 00:31:13.910
the beginning vignettes. You see a circus and
00:31:13.910 --> 00:31:16.750
you see a gorilla in the circus. So just know
00:31:16.750 --> 00:31:20.470
that that's what's happening there. And it all
00:31:20.470 --> 00:31:23.130
works out. This is one of the most positive episodes,
00:31:23.309 --> 00:31:27.059
really. Because, I mean, they're all... positive
00:31:27.059 --> 00:31:33.039
i guess in their own way but with this one it's
00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:35.259
almost its own little story within the story
00:31:35.259 --> 00:31:38.160
where yeah you can almost set it apart wherever
00:31:38.160 --> 00:31:41.240
you have you have the dilemma and it works out
00:31:41.240 --> 00:31:45.259
and they're happy very quickly within about 11
00:31:45.259 --> 00:31:49.579
minutes yeah these episodes are all pretty short
00:31:49.579 --> 00:31:51.779
but when you watch them all together it feels
00:31:51.779 --> 00:31:56.740
like a long movie made up of shorter scenes Something
00:31:56.740 --> 00:31:59.019
like that. Doesn't really feel like that long
00:31:59.019 --> 00:32:03.170
of a movie either, but... Probably... Probably
00:32:03.170 --> 00:32:06.289
about 110 minutes, eh? Yeah, probably. Because
00:32:06.289 --> 00:32:09.869
there's 10 episodes. Yeah. So, not quite two
00:32:09.869 --> 00:32:14.109
hours. Oh, and did you have more to say about
00:32:14.109 --> 00:32:18.690
episode three? No. Okay. Episode four, I have
00:32:18.690 --> 00:32:22.789
stuff to say about this one. I think this one's
00:32:22.789 --> 00:32:25.509
called Songs of the Dark Lantern, or Song of
00:32:25.509 --> 00:32:28.559
the Dark Lantern. This is when they come to this
00:32:28.559 --> 00:32:33.299
inn. The beast is upon me! They've stowed away
00:32:33.299 --> 00:32:36.400
in a cart. Yes. And the guy driving it is freaking
00:32:36.400 --> 00:32:38.759
out because he says the beast is upon him, which
00:32:38.759 --> 00:32:40.940
you find out later probably is totally accurate.
00:32:41.880 --> 00:32:46.259
And they fall out of this cart at this creepy
00:32:46.259 --> 00:32:50.660
tavern or inn or bar or whatever you want to
00:32:50.660 --> 00:32:55.089
call it. And it's full of... People who remind
00:32:55.089 --> 00:32:58.789
me of early animated characters. Especially one
00:32:58.789 --> 00:33:01.609
in particular. Here's the catch, though. This
00:33:01.609 --> 00:33:07.349
is so colonial. Like, the building looks like
00:33:07.349 --> 00:33:12.529
a New England, old New England building. And
00:33:12.529 --> 00:33:15.450
the way the people are dressed, presented inside
00:33:15.450 --> 00:33:18.970
of that building, is very colonial. But then
00:33:18.970 --> 00:33:22.789
you get a very interesting 1930s mashup with...
00:33:23.140 --> 00:33:27.480
colonial days or i don't know probably extend
00:33:27.480 --> 00:33:31.920
into maybe 1700s if you want to just distinguish
00:33:31.920 --> 00:33:36.359
well i don't know if they would have had maybe
00:33:36.359 --> 00:33:39.480
yeah maybe put it at 1700s maybe for this one
00:33:39.480 --> 00:33:46.740
somewhere in there go ahead i was just gonna
00:33:46.740 --> 00:33:49.319
say the the one that stands out to me the most
00:33:49.319 --> 00:33:54.799
is the main innkeeper the one who She looks like
00:33:54.799 --> 00:33:57.900
Betty Boop. Yeah, her eyelashes look like Betty
00:33:57.900 --> 00:34:00.200
Boop. She looks like a colonial version of Betty
00:34:00.200 --> 00:34:03.960
Boop. She talks and sings like Betty Boop. I
00:34:03.960 --> 00:34:07.619
have another weird clinky dink for you. Go along
00:34:07.619 --> 00:34:11.139
with that. Which is probably a stretch, but I
00:34:11.139 --> 00:34:14.320
kind of want it to be a thing. Okay. You know
00:34:14.320 --> 00:34:18.329
the highwayman. In this scene, there is a highwayman
00:34:18.329 --> 00:34:21.090
who sings this creepy song and does this weird
00:34:21.090 --> 00:34:24.230
dance about how, you know, basically what a bad
00:34:24.230 --> 00:34:29.590
guy he is. How he makes ends meet. Okay, maybe
00:34:29.590 --> 00:34:34.050
this is not based off of that, but somebody was
00:34:34.050 --> 00:34:39.889
likening the highwayman's song and dance to a
00:34:39.889 --> 00:34:46.920
1933 Betty Boop cartoon where Coco the Clown
00:34:46.920 --> 00:34:55.980
sings and dances. Okay, stick with me. The Highwayman,
00:34:56.219 --> 00:35:01.260
his song sounds a little bit to me like Louis
00:35:01.260 --> 00:35:04.079
Armstrong. This is where I'm adding my own stuff
00:35:04.079 --> 00:35:09.500
because Louis Armstrong did a song in 1928 called
00:35:09.500 --> 00:35:13.840
St. James Infirmary Blues. which has its own
00:35:13.840 --> 00:35:17.079
long history and didn't really originate with
00:35:17.079 --> 00:35:19.900
Louis Armstrong. The Highwaymen singing style
00:35:19.900 --> 00:35:23.780
sounds more like Louis Armstrong to me. But this
00:35:23.780 --> 00:35:27.480
1933 Betty Boop cartoon where it's it's Snow
00:35:27.480 --> 00:35:32.500
White but weird Betty Boop Snow White. They have
00:35:32.500 --> 00:35:36.019
a part where Coco the Clown is following behind
00:35:36.019 --> 00:35:38.500
Betty Boop frozen in a block of ice basically
00:35:38.500 --> 00:35:42.159
sleeping like Snow White. Yes it's weird. Snow
00:35:42.159 --> 00:35:47.820
White is weird. They rotoscoped Cab Calloway,
00:35:47.820 --> 00:35:49.320
which if you don't know who that is, he's like
00:35:49.320 --> 00:35:56.340
super famous, dancing and he sang St. James Infirmary
00:35:56.340 --> 00:36:01.119
Blues for this cartoon. So somebody felt that
00:36:01.119 --> 00:36:04.780
The Highwayman was based off of this cartoon
00:36:04.780 --> 00:36:09.250
where Coco was. Which makes the connection even
00:36:09.250 --> 00:36:12.130
stronger for inspiration if you have this Betty
00:36:12.130 --> 00:36:15.710
Boop character along with this other Betty Boop
00:36:15.710 --> 00:36:20.150
character. It's weird. Maybe they didn't have
00:36:20.150 --> 00:36:22.730
that in mind, but they probably did. I wouldn't
00:36:22.730 --> 00:36:25.070
be surprised. It's just this very strange mashup
00:36:25.070 --> 00:36:30.309
of jazz age slash cartoon influence along with
00:36:30.309 --> 00:36:35.760
1700s. But yeah, just keep it in mind. And I
00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:37.579
have not watched the whole Betty Boop cartoon,
00:36:37.719 --> 00:36:42.039
but I have watched the scene with Cab Calloway.
00:36:42.099 --> 00:36:46.000
It is bizarre and interesting at the same time.
00:36:47.360 --> 00:36:49.199
You could say that about a lot of Betty Boop
00:36:49.199 --> 00:36:51.500
cartoons. There's some bizarre stuff in Betty
00:36:51.500 --> 00:36:55.880
Boop. Yeah. Somebody could write a book, The
00:36:55.880 --> 00:37:01.150
Messed Up History of Betty Boop. Anyway, the
00:37:01.150 --> 00:37:05.369
main plot of this episode is... Who cares? Let's
00:37:05.369 --> 00:37:07.889
just talk about Betty Boop. Anyway, the main
00:37:07.889 --> 00:37:12.389
plot. All these townspeople that are in this
00:37:12.389 --> 00:37:16.010
tavern want to know who they are. So they all
00:37:16.010 --> 00:37:18.630
introduce themselves as the butcher, the midwife,
00:37:18.889 --> 00:37:21.949
the master and apprentice. And they want to know
00:37:21.949 --> 00:37:26.090
who Wirt and Greg are. The type of person that
00:37:26.090 --> 00:37:27.869
they are. Which I think is really interesting.
00:37:28.130 --> 00:37:31.059
How much emphasis was put... in this episode
00:37:31.059 --> 00:37:36.320
on identity. That was one of the main points.
00:37:36.739 --> 00:37:40.699
And trying to figure out specifically who Wirt
00:37:40.699 --> 00:37:44.159
was, what his part in life was. I think that's
00:37:44.159 --> 00:37:46.880
a thread that sort of is in the background of
00:37:46.880 --> 00:37:50.960
the whole series. Wirt trying to figure out in
00:37:50.960 --> 00:37:54.630
the grand scheme of things who he is. First they
00:37:54.630 --> 00:37:56.929
want to have him as the young lover because he's
00:37:56.929 --> 00:38:00.289
trying to get to Adelaide's. Which they don't
00:38:00.289 --> 00:38:02.889
even know who Adelaide is, but they hear the
00:38:02.889 --> 00:38:04.909
name Adelaide, it's like, oh, a girl's name.
00:38:05.150 --> 00:38:07.869
You must like a girl. And one of your favorite
00:38:07.869 --> 00:38:12.190
songs is sung at this point. It's very catchy.
00:38:12.449 --> 00:38:16.110
The one about, what is it, little boys going
00:38:16.110 --> 00:38:20.829
courting or something? Oh. I wouldn't say that's
00:38:20.829 --> 00:38:22.989
one of my favorite songs, but that specific line
00:38:22.989 --> 00:38:27.429
about the wedding day does pop through my head
00:38:27.429 --> 00:38:31.099
more than... It's catchy. Yeah. And it's sung
00:38:31.099 --> 00:38:35.760
in a really weird style. Yes. Not creepy, just
00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:40.510
funny and silly. Mm -hmm. But he's trying to
00:38:40.510 --> 00:38:44.010
explain that, no, that's not the case. He needs
00:38:44.010 --> 00:38:45.409
help. They're trying to figure out where to go.
00:38:45.789 --> 00:38:49.550
And they now think that he's a pilgrim. He sort
00:38:49.550 --> 00:38:54.090
of is, but not really. Yeah. If you want to infuse
00:38:54.090 --> 00:38:58.079
lots of extra meaning into it, you could. Somewhere
00:38:58.079 --> 00:39:00.119
in here, he mentions the woodsman and the beast,
00:39:00.320 --> 00:39:02.880
and they all freak out. And then there's a song
00:39:02.880 --> 00:39:05.820
about the beast. And you kind of get some more
00:39:05.820 --> 00:39:08.940
backstory on the beast here. And this is where
00:39:08.940 --> 00:39:13.099
you find out about the lantern. The beast turns
00:39:13.099 --> 00:39:15.820
people into trees so that they can be made into
00:39:15.820 --> 00:39:17.900
oil so that they can be burnt in the lantern.
00:39:18.179 --> 00:39:20.699
Which the woodsman, I don't think, realizes.
00:39:21.780 --> 00:39:24.900
I don't know that anybody fully understands the
00:39:24.900 --> 00:39:29.199
beast or the woodsman. But now that they have
00:39:29.199 --> 00:39:31.440
this connection in their head, they think that
00:39:31.440 --> 00:39:35.920
the woodsman is the beast. Which is not so. So
00:39:35.920 --> 00:39:39.539
they're leaving. And meanwhile, while all this
00:39:39.539 --> 00:39:43.300
is happening, Beatrice has met a horse, Fred
00:39:43.300 --> 00:39:46.619
the Horse, voiced by Fred Stahler. I don't know
00:39:46.619 --> 00:39:48.380
if they named the horse after the voice actors
00:39:48.380 --> 00:39:51.980
or what. But he has a very distinct voice. So
00:39:51.980 --> 00:39:56.860
they flee when they see the woodsman. Once they
00:39:56.860 --> 00:40:00.119
have fled, you have the beast appearing to the
00:40:00.119 --> 00:40:03.039
woodsman, and he says, be sure to keep the lantern
00:40:03.039 --> 00:40:06.480
lit, or your daughter's flame will go out. But
00:40:06.480 --> 00:40:11.039
I think it's also in this episode where the woodsman
00:40:11.039 --> 00:40:15.739
is trying to warn the boys about, what, does
00:40:15.739 --> 00:40:19.019
the beast feed on those that lose hope? There's
00:40:19.019 --> 00:40:22.980
this really poetic type, intense warning that
00:40:22.980 --> 00:40:24.679
he's trying to give to the boys, but they get
00:40:24.679 --> 00:40:28.019
away from him. And it helps to set up this idea
00:40:28.019 --> 00:40:32.079
that the beast, I suppose he could be described
00:40:32.079 --> 00:40:39.039
as lost hope and despair personified. And it's
00:40:39.039 --> 00:40:41.539
only when people lose hope and despair that he
00:40:41.539 --> 00:40:45.780
can consume them. So it's really rather deep.
00:40:47.639 --> 00:40:51.400
keeps making me think of Pilgrim's Progress because
00:40:51.400 --> 00:40:55.780
there's this part where Christian, and I think
00:40:55.780 --> 00:40:59.860
he's with Hopeful at the time, accidentally end
00:40:59.860 --> 00:41:06.340
up as prisoners in Doubting Castle under the
00:41:06.340 --> 00:41:11.900
oppression of Giant Despair. And Giant Despair
00:41:11.900 --> 00:41:15.199
has a nasty wife. I can't remember what her metaphor
00:41:15.199 --> 00:41:20.750
was. And just how they have to try and bear up
00:41:20.750 --> 00:41:24.130
and not be crushed by despair and how they finally
00:41:24.130 --> 00:41:28.590
make their escape. And it's very, you know, allegorical,
00:41:28.670 --> 00:41:32.130
metaphorical. But the beast makes me think of
00:41:32.130 --> 00:41:35.429
that scenario of needing to keep up hope and
00:41:35.429 --> 00:41:40.409
escape despair. Yeah. A little companion reading
00:41:40.409 --> 00:41:44.010
if you want to check that out. Very, very good.
00:41:45.090 --> 00:41:50.750
It's not the same thing, but it's from the 1600s,
00:41:50.750 --> 00:41:55.590
so it could kind of be loosely tied in. It could
00:41:55.590 --> 00:41:57.670
have been something that was maybe a vague inspiration,
00:41:57.989 --> 00:42:00.369
maybe something that they had to read in school
00:42:00.369 --> 00:42:02.889
that stuck in the back of their mind. I kind
00:42:02.889 --> 00:42:05.190
of doubt it, but I like making the connection.
00:42:07.739 --> 00:42:10.219
But it is an important point, as far as the beast
00:42:10.219 --> 00:42:13.059
is concerned, because those who keep hope are
00:42:13.059 --> 00:42:16.639
not consumed by him. So that's the end of that
00:42:16.639 --> 00:42:19.400
episode. And the next episode is called Mad Love.
00:42:19.860 --> 00:42:23.219
And here we're introduced to Quincy Endicott.
00:42:23.500 --> 00:42:26.900
Oh, which I believe one of the tombstones in
00:42:26.900 --> 00:42:29.820
the graveyard later on, when you have a flashback,
00:42:29.820 --> 00:42:35.420
is Endicott. So that's weird. He's voiced by
00:42:35.420 --> 00:42:38.980
John Cleese. Which is awesome! John Cleese does
00:42:38.980 --> 00:42:43.920
such a wonderful job on this episode. He's just...
00:42:44.739 --> 00:42:48.320
And it's child -friendly -ish, you know, if they're
00:42:48.320 --> 00:42:51.900
not scared. But, you know, John Cleese isn't
00:42:51.900 --> 00:42:55.519
always child -friendly. But on here, he's so
00:42:55.519 --> 00:42:59.599
great. And one thing I noticed about this, like
00:42:59.599 --> 00:43:02.920
you noticed with the turkeys in Hard Times of
00:43:02.920 --> 00:43:05.639
the Huskenby, there's a lot of peacocks in this
00:43:05.639 --> 00:43:09.460
episode. Which I would think would be a reference
00:43:09.460 --> 00:43:16.099
to... Probably British influence wealthy people
00:43:16.099 --> 00:43:18.840
owning peacocks. I think that was a thing of
00:43:18.840 --> 00:43:21.280
wealthy people owning peacocks. I feel like on,
00:43:21.400 --> 00:43:23.980
it's one of those sounds, if you're watching
00:43:23.980 --> 00:43:28.420
a period drama and, you know, the English people
00:43:28.420 --> 00:43:30.380
on their estate or whatever, you might hear this
00:43:30.380 --> 00:43:34.949
little in the background. If you hear that weird
00:43:34.949 --> 00:43:39.250
call, that's a peacock. I have been woken up
00:43:39.250 --> 00:43:42.849
by one at a B &B at who knows what hour in the
00:43:42.849 --> 00:43:45.409
morning. Not sure that I'm dying to own those,
00:43:45.510 --> 00:43:49.130
but they're gorgeous. If you wake at 5 .30 naturally,
00:43:49.409 --> 00:43:52.469
you'll be up before the peacock obnoxiously wakes
00:43:52.469 --> 00:43:55.449
you up. So, you know, something to consider before
00:43:55.449 --> 00:43:59.650
purchasing your peacocks. But no, they're gorgeous.
00:44:00.289 --> 00:44:03.750
And yes, they are the turkeys of this episode.
00:44:04.409 --> 00:44:06.530
But I don't think that that was a postcard reference.
00:44:06.630 --> 00:44:10.250
I think that that was an English -influenced
00:44:10.250 --> 00:44:15.360
wealth reference. Like a state reference. That
00:44:15.360 --> 00:44:18.219
makes sense because I feel like I've seen peacocks
00:44:18.219 --> 00:44:22.000
in other cartoons owned by rich people. Like
00:44:22.000 --> 00:44:24.199
they're not like a point in the episode, but
00:44:24.199 --> 00:44:26.300
like you see them in the background. Sure. Like
00:44:26.300 --> 00:44:28.739
I'm pretty sure that the wealthy family in Gravity
00:44:28.739 --> 00:44:32.420
Falls had some peacocks. Sure, it's a running
00:44:32.420 --> 00:44:35.880
thing. Yeah, it must be. But I believe it is
00:44:35.880 --> 00:44:39.320
based in reality, yes. So they've made their
00:44:39.320 --> 00:44:42.880
way to this mansion in the middle of this forest.
00:44:43.320 --> 00:44:46.219
And they're pretending that they are the nephews
00:44:46.219 --> 00:44:50.579
of this Quincy Endicott. And I love Greg. He
00:44:50.579 --> 00:44:53.460
calls him Unky Endicott for the whole episode.
00:44:53.460 --> 00:45:01.659
Why not? Somebody likened this episode to having
00:45:01.659 --> 00:45:06.349
inspiration or being like. The Turn of the Screw,
00:45:06.670 --> 00:45:11.969
which is an 1898 ghost story. Because as you
00:45:11.969 --> 00:45:14.510
progress, this sort of turns into a ghost story.
00:45:14.670 --> 00:45:18.050
And it's not the same thing, but maybe there
00:45:18.050 --> 00:45:23.280
was some inspiration. Who knows? Their main goal
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:26.639
here is that they need two cents to take the
00:45:26.639 --> 00:45:30.829
ferry to Adelaide. So Beatrice, I guess... She
00:45:30.829 --> 00:45:34.570
wants to straight up scam this guy. Yes. Even
00:45:34.570 --> 00:45:36.929
though it's only two cents. They can just ask
00:45:36.929 --> 00:45:39.750
for two cents. And Wirt's not having it until
00:45:39.750 --> 00:45:42.329
he starts realizing this guy is really, really
00:45:42.329 --> 00:45:48.170
rich. The one thing that I thought was hilarious
00:45:48.170 --> 00:45:52.550
was that once Fred the horse gets wind of this,
00:45:52.690 --> 00:45:58.579
he says, I want to steal. Just randomly. He wants
00:45:58.579 --> 00:46:04.179
to steal. Oh dear. But Quincy is telling them
00:46:04.179 --> 00:46:07.539
about, this is why you mentioned the ghost story,
00:46:07.659 --> 00:46:11.440
he's seen something. It's like there's this part
00:46:11.440 --> 00:46:13.699
of his house that he doesn't remember building
00:46:13.699 --> 00:46:16.420
and this painting of this beautiful woman and
00:46:16.420 --> 00:46:19.199
this ghost woman and he's in love with her and
00:46:19.199 --> 00:46:22.340
he's afraid to go back and look in case he's
00:46:22.340 --> 00:46:27.429
crazy and it's not real. Greg really wants to
00:46:27.429 --> 00:46:31.250
see a ghost. So meanwhile, Beatrice and Wirt
00:46:31.250 --> 00:46:34.190
are trying to find money and the rest of them
00:46:34.190 --> 00:46:38.389
are off trying to find this ghost. And Endicott
00:46:38.389 --> 00:46:41.349
and the ghost see each other and they both faint
00:46:41.349 --> 00:46:43.630
and all might have been lost except for there
00:46:43.630 --> 00:46:45.610
were still people who were conscious who were
00:46:45.610 --> 00:46:47.989
able to connect the dots that this was not a
00:46:47.989 --> 00:46:51.530
bad situation. These were real people. They were
00:46:51.530 --> 00:46:55.190
two people whose houses had... I guess maybe
00:46:55.190 --> 00:46:57.250
they just kept building and then eventually they
00:46:57.250 --> 00:46:59.309
got connected and then never knew that they were
00:46:59.309 --> 00:47:01.610
connected. And they each had a plaque with their
00:47:01.610 --> 00:47:05.010
own name in the greenhouse. They are both tea
00:47:05.010 --> 00:47:08.110
barons. And here's another history reference,
00:47:08.230 --> 00:47:11.929
which totally escaped me when I was watching
00:47:11.929 --> 00:47:17.869
it. This points to pre -revolutionary war times.
00:47:18.030 --> 00:47:21.079
They're both tea growers. And one of them is
00:47:21.079 --> 00:47:24.300
super British. One of them is French. The Louisiana
00:47:24.300 --> 00:47:28.619
Purchase didn't happen until 1803. So it's like
00:47:28.619 --> 00:47:32.280
this nod to the presence of the French and the
00:47:32.280 --> 00:47:38.440
English in old -time America, but a not -ghost
00:47:38.440 --> 00:47:45.480
love story. And a very cute one at that. So John
00:47:45.480 --> 00:47:48.579
Cleese playing that part makes even more sense.
00:47:49.239 --> 00:47:51.179
under that light i didn't i just didn't really
00:47:51.179 --> 00:47:53.420
question it when i was watching it i didn't think
00:47:53.420 --> 00:47:56.280
that deeply and i didn't think about the tea
00:47:56.280 --> 00:48:01.239
thing it's like oh and it's not coffee it's tea
00:48:01.239 --> 00:48:06.079
yeah um and were people even growing tea in america
00:48:06.079 --> 00:48:09.820
probably but if we were importing it okay just
00:48:09.820 --> 00:48:13.880
stop thinking sir i mean even if you don't know
00:48:13.880 --> 00:48:16.059
for sure it's still an interesting connection
00:48:16.739 --> 00:48:20.619
Yes, and should be noted of just the French and
00:48:20.619 --> 00:48:24.579
English in old -time America. Somewhere in here
00:48:24.579 --> 00:48:27.980
there was a mention from Beatrice about she used
00:48:27.980 --> 00:48:32.190
to be human. Right, they were confessing, she
00:48:32.190 --> 00:48:34.570
and Wirt were confessing their dark secrets to
00:48:34.570 --> 00:48:37.150
each other with Wirt. It's that he has a crush
00:48:37.150 --> 00:48:39.989
on a girl and he recites poetry and plays the
00:48:39.989 --> 00:48:43.230
clarinet and she thinks maybe the poetry part's
00:48:43.230 --> 00:48:46.449
a little weird, which if you're going back to...
00:48:47.099 --> 00:48:49.320
What time period she's set in, that probably
00:48:49.320 --> 00:48:52.019
wouldn't be as weird, but who knows? Anyway,
00:48:52.139 --> 00:48:56.199
she's a talking bird. And she's been turned into
00:48:56.199 --> 00:48:59.840
a bluebird because she threw a rock at a bluebird.
00:48:59.860 --> 00:49:03.860
And her whole family are bluebirds now. Now,
00:49:03.860 --> 00:49:06.980
when you look back to the opening vignette where
00:49:06.980 --> 00:49:09.880
Beatrice is with her dog, did we ever explain
00:49:09.880 --> 00:49:13.000
that the dog... Yeah, I did. When you look back
00:49:13.000 --> 00:49:15.019
to the opening vignette with Beatrice and her
00:49:15.019 --> 00:49:18.210
dog... You hear, I think, bird noises and her
00:49:18.210 --> 00:49:20.329
looking slightly agitated. So it's probably right
00:49:20.329 --> 00:49:22.610
before she threw... I didn't even think about
00:49:22.610 --> 00:49:26.949
that. I rewatched it. Probably right before she
00:49:26.949 --> 00:49:32.010
threw the rock and messed up their lives. Okay.
00:49:33.860 --> 00:49:36.619
There was also a line in here where they started
00:49:36.619 --> 00:49:39.480
figuring out that there were two houses that
00:49:39.480 --> 00:49:42.820
cracked me up. I think Hort said something about...
00:49:43.250 --> 00:49:46.550
This French Rococo style. Oh, yeah. With Endicott's
00:49:46.550 --> 00:49:49.469
Georgian sensibilities. Which is awesome that
00:49:49.469 --> 00:49:52.449
they threw that in there, showing how, well,
00:49:52.510 --> 00:49:55.170
A, talking about different types of architecture
00:49:55.170 --> 00:49:58.809
and interior design, and B, showing what a smart
00:49:58.809 --> 00:50:03.650
kid Wirt really is. He may have a little bit
00:50:03.650 --> 00:50:07.130
of, he has some issues going on, but he's not
00:50:07.130 --> 00:50:12.519
a bad guy. And obviously, he's a good nerd. Anyway,
00:50:12.559 --> 00:50:14.750
that's... about all for the episode. You have
00:50:14.750 --> 00:50:17.690
the two T -Bairns, once business competitors,
00:50:17.849 --> 00:50:22.170
now in love. But they get the two cents. Oh,
00:50:22.170 --> 00:50:26.769
yes. And Greg throws it in the fountain and says,
00:50:26.849 --> 00:50:29.170
Endicott had them pinned all wrong. He's got
00:50:29.170 --> 00:50:33.269
no cents, no cents at all. Which could, I've
00:50:33.269 --> 00:50:36.130
heard them say, okay, I've read, you know, this
00:50:36.130 --> 00:50:39.550
sounds like it's straight out of 1950s detective
00:50:39.550 --> 00:50:43.139
show or something. I can't remember. But an interesting
00:50:43.139 --> 00:50:46.579
theory that goes along with this in the world
00:50:46.579 --> 00:50:50.739
of over -the -garden -wall theories is that in
00:50:50.739 --> 00:50:56.179
mythology, to cross the river Styx, you had to
00:50:56.179 --> 00:50:59.079
pay the ferryman. And they would actually put
00:50:59.079 --> 00:51:03.519
coins on people's eyes, I believe in real life,
00:51:03.739 --> 00:51:06.639
to help them cross over into the afterlife. I
00:51:06.639 --> 00:51:09.239
don't know if two cents would have been enough
00:51:09.239 --> 00:51:11.409
or whether they just... or whether they both
00:51:11.409 --> 00:51:14.309
would have needed to or whether that's somebody
00:51:14.309 --> 00:51:18.230
stretching the theory but it's also brought into
00:51:18.230 --> 00:51:23.170
light that they may be denying or you could maybe
00:51:23.170 --> 00:51:26.429
say cheating death when he gets rid of the coins
00:51:26.429 --> 00:51:29.309
like they're not actually going to go into the
00:51:29.309 --> 00:51:32.539
afterlife if you want to throw that theory away
00:51:32.539 --> 00:51:34.880
you can but it's something interesting to think
00:51:34.880 --> 00:51:38.300
about that they may be if they are suspended
00:51:38.300 --> 00:51:40.320
between life and death in a pond or whatever
00:51:40.320 --> 00:51:45.500
that this this could be a denial of of dying
00:51:45.500 --> 00:51:50.000
at that moment a fight against dying it could
00:51:50.000 --> 00:51:53.340
be and the fairy that they take in the next episode
00:51:53.340 --> 00:51:55.780
i believe they didn't don't they say they sneak
00:51:55.780 --> 00:51:58.099
onto it oh yeah that's why the that's why the
00:51:58.099 --> 00:52:03.059
frog police are after them yeah so the next one
00:52:03.059 --> 00:52:06.309
is called lullaby in frog land which It is very
00:52:06.309 --> 00:52:10.730
interesting. The ferry that they've been trying
00:52:10.730 --> 00:52:14.530
to get to is a ferry run by frogs. And this is
00:52:14.530 --> 00:52:18.409
a very particular time period they're set in.
00:52:18.429 --> 00:52:19.789
I don't know the exact time period, I'm sure
00:52:19.789 --> 00:52:22.969
you will, but it's the riverboats. The riverboats,
00:52:22.969 --> 00:52:27.550
think Mark Twain, think, it's going to be a broader
00:52:27.550 --> 00:52:31.789
period than this, but think maybe 1840s. Okay.
00:52:32.409 --> 00:52:34.710
And this riverboat that they're on is gorgeous.
00:52:34.969 --> 00:52:38.489
I want to go on a gorgeous riverboat. I've been
00:52:38.489 --> 00:52:40.570
on a riverboat, but I haven't been on one that
00:52:40.570 --> 00:52:43.750
was, like, really old. This one is beautifully
00:52:43.750 --> 00:52:47.610
painted. It's a paddleboat. You have all the
00:52:47.610 --> 00:52:52.250
frogs dressed in 1800s clothing. They don't seem
00:52:52.250 --> 00:52:57.789
to speak English. They speak frog. And it's sunset
00:52:57.789 --> 00:53:02.710
time. It's just beautiful. beautiful and bizarre
00:53:02.710 --> 00:53:04.969
at the same time it's lovely it's over the garden
00:53:04.969 --> 00:53:08.309
wall there's a lot of music here too because
00:53:08.309 --> 00:53:10.130
the frogs have this little band and they put
00:53:10.130 --> 00:53:14.090
together their own little show or whatever yes
00:53:14.090 --> 00:53:17.110
disrupt well they're trying to evade the frog
00:53:17.110 --> 00:53:21.070
police and so they're trying to hide in the band
00:53:21.070 --> 00:53:25.050
and that's when they discover that greg's frog
00:53:25.690 --> 00:53:30.530
has a crooner voice and sings the frog lullaby,
00:53:30.610 --> 00:53:33.309
which basically gets them out of trouble with
00:53:33.309 --> 00:53:36.510
the cops. I really like the song. I think it's
00:53:36.510 --> 00:53:38.949
the theme song for the show, but like the full
00:53:38.949 --> 00:53:43.369
version of it. Really? Pretty sure. Well, I could
00:53:43.369 --> 00:53:45.730
kind of see that. It has over the garden wall
00:53:45.730 --> 00:53:54.059
in it. But the lyrics are so poetic. So if you're
00:53:54.059 --> 00:53:57.420
watching it. Listen to the lyrics. Try and listen
00:53:57.420 --> 00:53:59.500
to the lyrics. I know it's going to be distracting.
00:53:59.679 --> 00:54:02.119
On your third time watching it, listen to the
00:54:02.119 --> 00:54:07.440
lyrics. And as the song ends, you know, they're
00:54:07.440 --> 00:54:13.219
just paddling off into the sunset. And it's so
00:54:13.219 --> 00:54:17.300
peaceful. And at this point, Beatrice and Wirt,
00:54:17.500 --> 00:54:20.019
probably between the last episode and this episode,
00:54:20.340 --> 00:54:23.219
they're starting to learn to appreciate each
00:54:23.219 --> 00:54:28.989
other. And Beatrice is, she basically doesn't
00:54:28.989 --> 00:54:31.110
want to take them to Adelaide's anymore because
00:54:31.110 --> 00:54:35.889
it's a trap. They disembark from this ferry and
00:54:35.889 --> 00:54:38.949
it's nighttime and all the frogs go and hibernate
00:54:38.949 --> 00:54:40.969
in the mud, all wearing their clothes still.
00:54:41.349 --> 00:54:43.949
Greg wants to hibernate with them, at least sleep
00:54:43.949 --> 00:54:46.889
there for the night in the mud. And they want
00:54:46.889 --> 00:54:50.730
to give Greg's frog a contract because he's such
00:54:50.730 --> 00:54:57.889
a good singer. Oh, looping back. These frog people,
00:54:58.070 --> 00:55:01.989
they added some really fun elements into them
00:55:01.989 --> 00:55:06.349
on the boat. Because you have like a little boy
00:55:06.349 --> 00:55:11.349
frog who has a lollipop with a bug in it. And
00:55:11.349 --> 00:55:15.329
they're smoking bubble pipes. I think frogs may
00:55:15.329 --> 00:55:19.289
have been racing on water beetles. And not only
00:55:19.289 --> 00:55:21.670
is the boat... beautifully painted and everything
00:55:21.670 --> 00:55:25.250
but the whistle on the boat looks like a throwback
00:55:25.250 --> 00:55:30.469
to 1920s and maybe even 30s cartoons with the
00:55:30.469 --> 00:55:34.829
way whistles were designed so be on the lookout
00:55:34.829 --> 00:55:38.530
for those fun elements as well but now on land
00:55:38.530 --> 00:55:41.730
things don't seem to be going well for the boys
00:55:41.730 --> 00:55:44.130
anyway because greg thinks that he's losing his
00:55:44.130 --> 00:55:48.690
frog and wart sees beatrice fly off without them
00:55:49.179 --> 00:55:54.679
Yes, so they follow her, and she's going to Adelaide
00:55:54.679 --> 00:55:58.460
by herself to try and get out of this deal that
00:55:58.460 --> 00:56:01.079
she's made. She doesn't want to hand over the
00:56:01.079 --> 00:56:05.340
boys. Adelaide's not having that. She wants a
00:56:05.340 --> 00:56:09.699
child servant, and Adelaide is also voiced by
00:56:09.699 --> 00:56:15.099
John Cleese. Yes, which is great. It's better
00:56:15.099 --> 00:56:17.320
that they have that element of humor in there.
00:56:18.829 --> 00:56:24.130
So the boys break into this and Wirt doesn't
00:56:24.130 --> 00:56:27.250
realize that, I don't think he realizes that
00:56:27.250 --> 00:56:30.889
Beatrice doesn't want to harm them anymore and
00:56:30.889 --> 00:56:37.619
just feels betrayed. And Adelaide tightens these
00:56:37.619 --> 00:56:42.760
ropes and captures the boys. What should be noted
00:56:42.760 --> 00:56:46.840
that I didn't notice is that Adelaide's shawl
00:56:46.840 --> 00:56:49.329
has a black widow pattern. on the back of it,
00:56:49.389 --> 00:56:52.570
and the ropes are like a spider's web that the
00:56:52.570 --> 00:56:54.869
boys are being caught in. And actually one of
00:56:54.869 --> 00:56:59.429
the models for her character had extra limbs
00:56:59.429 --> 00:57:02.150
like a spider, but they thought that was too
00:57:02.150 --> 00:57:06.880
distracting and got rid of it. Interesting. So
00:57:06.880 --> 00:57:10.260
yeah, I never made the spider connection. It
00:57:10.260 --> 00:57:12.460
was just like she was into needlework and had
00:57:12.460 --> 00:57:17.159
a weird rope trap. She has these... Scissors,
00:57:17.159 --> 00:57:20.900
though, that Beatrice needs to turn her family
00:57:20.900 --> 00:57:26.079
back into people. They're shaped like a bird.
00:57:26.599 --> 00:57:28.699
Those scissors are like a real thing, though,
00:57:28.719 --> 00:57:32.500
because I've seen them in craft stores. And I
00:57:32.500 --> 00:57:34.619
don't think that they're based on Over the Garden
00:57:34.619 --> 00:57:36.119
Wall. I think Over the Garden Wall is based on
00:57:36.119 --> 00:57:40.639
some old antique scissors. Right. I don't know
00:57:40.639 --> 00:57:43.599
what year those were made. I would have to research
00:57:43.599 --> 00:57:47.690
that. But they're very cool scissors. I thought
00:57:47.690 --> 00:57:49.829
about buying some when I saw them, but they're
00:57:49.829 --> 00:57:55.909
expensive. And the boys manage to escape. You
00:57:55.909 --> 00:57:59.389
find out later that Wirt managed to somehow get
00:57:59.389 --> 00:58:02.369
a hold of these scissors. Or was it Greg? Either
00:58:02.369 --> 00:58:03.929
way, Wirt had the scissors. I think Wirt had
00:58:03.929 --> 00:58:08.190
them. Yes, it's good that he had them. Who knows
00:58:08.190 --> 00:58:10.070
what Greg might have done with them if he had
00:58:10.070 --> 00:58:14.449
them. But Beatrice opens a window, and for some
00:58:14.449 --> 00:58:18.269
reason, This makes Adelaide melt. Yes, the fresh
00:58:18.269 --> 00:58:21.989
air. She says, the night air is poisonous. I
00:58:21.989 --> 00:58:23.349
don't know if that's supposed to be a reference
00:58:23.349 --> 00:58:26.070
to something or what, but... But didn't she say
00:58:26.070 --> 00:58:28.289
something about it being, it's so fresh, or something
00:58:28.289 --> 00:58:33.230
like that? She might have. I don't know. And
00:58:33.230 --> 00:58:37.789
Beatrice is like, breathe it in, lady. So the
00:58:37.789 --> 00:58:41.289
boys should have had an idea that she was on
00:58:41.289 --> 00:58:44.590
their side, but that didn't seem to translate.
00:58:45.320 --> 00:58:47.800
Very well, either that or it was just so ticked
00:58:47.800 --> 00:58:51.500
that he had been deceived to begin with. Sometimes,
00:58:51.880 --> 00:58:54.960
yeah, there's that temptation to punish people
00:58:54.960 --> 00:58:59.679
that we're mad at. Or maybe he felt like he couldn't
00:58:59.679 --> 00:59:02.239
trust her after that, I don't know. And if you
00:59:02.239 --> 00:59:06.039
notice, there's this music when she is being
00:59:06.039 --> 00:59:10.000
taken down that... A lot of this music seems
00:59:10.000 --> 00:59:13.000
to be played on an old upright piano, which has
00:59:13.000 --> 00:59:15.699
such a distinct sound. And there's this sort
00:59:15.699 --> 00:59:18.380
of scattered music where she's being taken out
00:59:18.380 --> 00:59:22.320
or where there's this point of conflict. And
00:59:22.320 --> 00:59:24.519
if you listen to the soundtrack, I believe that
00:59:24.519 --> 00:59:28.000
was the part on its own that sounds quite creepy
00:59:28.000 --> 00:59:31.820
and unsettling. But in the context of this episode,
00:59:32.079 --> 00:59:35.820
it fits perfectly and you're not paying as close
00:59:35.820 --> 00:59:38.860
of attention. It just... enhances what is happening
00:59:38.860 --> 00:59:42.199
with the story okay i think that's the one that
00:59:42.199 --> 00:59:45.500
set the dogs off barking so much yeah we were
00:59:45.500 --> 00:59:47.500
listening that's what we were we were watching
00:59:47.500 --> 00:59:50.099
a silent movie and we put on this the soundtrack
00:59:50.099 --> 00:59:52.940
because the music with the with the silent movie
00:59:52.940 --> 00:59:57.960
was rubbish and uh over the garden wall was far
00:59:57.960 --> 01:00:00.699
more entertaining as far as background it kind
01:00:00.699 --> 01:00:05.280
of fit with yeah it fit very It oddly fit. Anyway.
01:00:05.539 --> 01:00:07.760
But we were watching this outside because it
01:00:07.760 --> 01:00:10.840
was the middle of summer and it was just nicer
01:00:10.840 --> 01:00:13.619
outside at night. You got to the creepy part
01:00:13.619 --> 01:00:16.679
of the soundtrack and my dogs were like, this
01:00:16.679 --> 01:00:19.860
is a bad deal. What's going on? Yeah. It's something
01:00:19.860 --> 01:00:22.440
about it just set them off. Yeah. Which if you
01:00:22.440 --> 01:00:25.119
do listen to it by itself, it's pretty, it's
01:00:25.119 --> 01:00:28.079
unsettling, but it fits perfectly with the story
01:00:28.079 --> 01:00:33.170
here. And in the next episode, we move on to
01:00:33.170 --> 01:00:37.449
her sister. Yes, this episode is The Ringing
01:00:37.449 --> 01:00:41.050
of the Bell, and it stars Tim Curry as Auntie
01:00:41.050 --> 01:00:46.610
Whispers. If you don't know Tim Curry, he is
01:00:46.610 --> 01:00:52.630
the Prince of Ham. I don't know if you would
01:00:52.630 --> 01:00:54.489
like that. He probably would like me calling
01:00:54.489 --> 01:00:57.469
him that. I don't know. He's British, and he
01:00:57.469 --> 01:01:04.210
is just so good. at playing exaggerated, overly
01:01:04.210 --> 01:01:08.949
dramatic, hammy -type characters, but yet you
01:01:08.949 --> 01:01:12.849
kind of like it. You know, it's not like, oh,
01:01:12.909 --> 01:01:19.130
stop it, Tim. He's just, he's so good. But with
01:01:19.130 --> 01:01:25.409
this one, he is beyond understated, but it's
01:01:25.599 --> 01:01:29.360
just... It kind of needed to be Tim Curry. If
01:01:29.360 --> 01:01:33.500
they had done creepy witches' voices to go along
01:01:33.500 --> 01:01:38.239
with these witch sisters, it would make these
01:01:38.239 --> 01:01:41.659
episodes harder than what they already are. Well,
01:01:41.820 --> 01:01:44.860
this one especially. The one before it with Adelaide,
01:01:44.860 --> 01:01:47.780
that's not that bad. It could have been made
01:01:47.780 --> 01:01:50.539
probably pretty disturbing if she had been creepier
01:01:50.539 --> 01:01:54.480
than she was. But with Auntie Whispers, she...
01:01:55.280 --> 01:02:02.239
is so gross. She's so... She's hideous. She's
01:02:02.239 --> 01:02:08.260
basically a monstrous looking being. She's humanoid,
01:02:08.360 --> 01:02:10.820
but she has a giant head and, I don't know, maybe
01:02:10.820 --> 01:02:16.989
seven black nubs for teeth. And so to have her
01:02:16.989 --> 01:02:22.559
voiced by Tim Curry helps to offset how disturbing...
01:02:23.920 --> 01:02:27.440
she is it kind of adds an element of humor even
01:02:27.440 --> 01:02:30.340
though it's not technically humorous it is like
01:02:30.340 --> 01:02:35.960
i just love it yeah but okay and here's another
01:02:35.960 --> 01:02:44.389
thing with this show there are those who want
01:02:44.389 --> 01:02:47.809
to layer in like i was reading like when you
01:02:47.809 --> 01:02:49.769
start going down the rabbit hole of people's
01:02:49.769 --> 01:02:53.650
theories about over the garden wall i've read
01:02:53.650 --> 01:02:56.530
where they wanted to like Turn Greg into a Jesus
01:02:56.530 --> 01:03:00.090
figure? Come on, people. Come on, he's a cute
01:03:00.090 --> 01:03:05.699
little boy. Let's not put things where they aren't.
01:03:05.900 --> 01:03:10.840
So people want to infuse, at least one writer
01:03:10.840 --> 01:03:17.579
did, infuse religious meaning into these. Strangely
01:03:17.579 --> 01:03:22.519
for me, this episode feels like the most religious.
01:03:23.000 --> 01:03:27.519
For more than one reason. because all of a sudden
01:03:27.519 --> 01:03:31.179
we're back in colonial, what seems like Puritan
01:03:31.179 --> 01:03:34.119
times, because of the way they are dressed. Maybe
01:03:34.119 --> 01:03:38.340
I am mistyping their period dress. Feel free
01:03:38.340 --> 01:03:41.039
to correct me and tell me what period I should
01:03:41.039 --> 01:03:43.719
be looking at. You know, you have Auntie Whispers,
01:03:43.960 --> 01:03:45.880
which I thought this was also a very interesting
01:03:45.880 --> 01:03:49.380
choice. She has a long black cloak, which has
01:03:49.380 --> 01:03:51.920
gotten muddied. which I think is pretty historically
01:03:51.920 --> 01:03:53.900
accurate if you're wearing a long black cloak
01:03:53.900 --> 01:03:57.320
and you're going through New England dirt. And
01:03:57.320 --> 01:04:02.760
she's wearing a white cap, and her servant girl...
01:04:02.760 --> 01:04:07.500
Lorna. Lorna is wearing the white cap, and she
01:04:07.500 --> 01:04:11.239
has, I believe, the wide white collar. Their
01:04:11.239 --> 01:04:18.920
garb looks rather 1600s to me. And she... Well,
01:04:18.980 --> 01:04:21.239
let's talk about how the episode unfolds, and
01:04:21.239 --> 01:04:25.139
I'll try and weave that into this. I don't know
01:04:25.139 --> 01:04:26.800
how important it is, but to me it's something
01:04:26.800 --> 01:04:30.260
that I think about. Well, it starts out with
01:04:30.260 --> 01:04:32.119
them wandering through the woods. I think they
01:04:32.119 --> 01:04:34.219
see the woodsman again, warning them again about
01:04:34.219 --> 01:04:37.840
the beast. But the beast is, like, in the background,
01:04:38.079 --> 01:04:42.849
watching. And they find this old shack. Didn't
01:04:42.849 --> 01:04:45.909
Greg not want to go there and Wirt did? It was
01:04:45.909 --> 01:04:48.519
like... greg was having a moment of sense where
01:04:48.519 --> 01:04:53.659
work wasn't but they went anyway whereas a lot
01:04:53.659 --> 01:04:55.960
of times work like greg wanted to charge ahead
01:04:55.960 --> 01:04:58.920
into things and then greg was like oh boy about
01:04:58.920 --> 01:05:04.880
this i don't know re -watch or not this is an
01:05:04.880 --> 01:05:07.539
episode that i could totally skip like i was
01:05:07.539 --> 01:05:09.559
lying awake last night feeling creeped out over
01:05:09.559 --> 01:05:14.670
it and we didn't even watch it last night I don't
01:05:14.670 --> 01:05:15.969
know that I would want to skip it just because
01:05:15.969 --> 01:05:19.190
I really like Tim Curry as all the misters. You
01:05:19.190 --> 01:05:24.539
have a higher creepy tolerance than I do. Anyway,
01:05:24.639 --> 01:05:26.980
they find this basket full of black turtles in
01:05:26.980 --> 01:05:29.059
the house. And if you'll remember, the black
01:05:29.059 --> 01:05:32.619
turtles did something to that dog. They're bad
01:05:32.619 --> 01:05:35.559
news. Which when I tried to figure out what's
01:05:35.559 --> 01:05:38.239
with the black turtles, the creator of this series
01:05:38.239 --> 01:05:42.099
said it's an imperfection in the quilt. Which...
01:05:42.489 --> 01:05:45.929
In my mind, it's a reference to Native American
01:05:45.929 --> 01:05:49.510
art where they purposely put in an imperfection
01:05:49.510 --> 01:05:52.090
that might be an incorrect interpretation. Either
01:05:52.090 --> 01:05:53.949
way, it did not answer my question. I'm guessing
01:05:53.949 --> 01:05:55.809
that he put them in there because he wanted to
01:05:55.809 --> 01:05:58.730
put them in there. Kind of like a red herring,
01:05:58.730 --> 01:06:01.550
just as something for people to speculate on
01:06:01.550 --> 01:06:05.190
that don't actually have any solid meaning. He
01:06:05.190 --> 01:06:08.590
described Adelaide as a red herring, but anyway.
01:06:10.159 --> 01:06:12.989
I could see that. Because in the end, she was
01:06:12.989 --> 01:06:14.809
not important to the story, even though she was,
01:06:14.869 --> 01:06:16.989
like, the whole point of the quest for having
01:06:16.989 --> 01:06:21.869
the show. That makes perfect sense, yeah. Another
01:06:21.869 --> 01:06:25.050
thing, more Americana, there's, like, this apple
01:06:25.050 --> 01:06:27.929
tree at the beginning of this episode, I think,
01:06:28.010 --> 01:06:34.110
and rain, and it's just more lovely New England
01:06:34.110 --> 01:06:40.019
American art. Anyway, on to the creepy turtles.
01:06:41.059 --> 01:06:46.260
Yeah, so they meet this girl inside Lorna, and
01:06:46.260 --> 01:06:49.280
she tells them that they need to hide because
01:06:49.280 --> 01:06:53.780
Auntie Whispers is coming. And Auntie Whispers
01:06:53.780 --> 01:06:59.360
comes in, I can smell the children. Yeah, she
01:06:59.360 --> 01:07:04.039
seems so messed up. Yes, the way she's talking,
01:07:04.219 --> 01:07:08.320
you think that she eats children. Yes. And then
01:07:08.320 --> 01:07:12.119
it turns out that she eats turtles. Yes, she
01:07:12.119 --> 01:07:14.079
thinks that it's just the turtles that she's
01:07:14.079 --> 01:07:17.860
been smelling. Well, Auntie Whispers eats a turtle.
01:07:19.409 --> 01:07:23.050
Yes, and it sort of sounds like she's kind of
01:07:23.050 --> 01:07:24.610
crunching on it, but I think she just sucked
01:07:24.610 --> 01:07:26.949
it out of its shell. She gets rid of the shell,
01:07:27.070 --> 01:07:32.070
yeah. It's like a pistachio. She orders Lorna
01:07:32.070 --> 01:07:37.289
to do one more thing. And she talks like Lorna
01:07:37.289 --> 01:07:40.409
is ill, like there's something wrong with her.
01:07:41.039 --> 01:07:43.739
She says something like, keeping you busy is
01:07:43.739 --> 01:07:46.059
the only way to keep the evil spirits from driving
01:07:46.059 --> 01:07:49.820
you to wickedness. And the way she's talking,
01:07:49.920 --> 01:07:53.599
it sounds like she's some sort of zealot. Like,
01:07:53.599 --> 01:07:56.519
idle hands with the devil's workshop, but taking
01:07:56.519 --> 01:07:59.960
it to an extreme level. Like, forcing her into
01:07:59.960 --> 01:08:03.920
servitude because she's going to be evil. But
01:08:03.920 --> 01:08:08.179
it turns out, she was being literal. So here's
01:08:08.179 --> 01:08:10.659
the thing. Here's one of the things that feels
01:08:10.659 --> 01:08:15.260
so religious about this, because she, well, and
01:08:15.260 --> 01:08:17.479
you're bringing this up. and it's probably partly
01:08:17.479 --> 01:08:19.500
why it's stuck in my head, I think more than
01:08:19.500 --> 01:08:22.979
once she talks about wickedness. Trying to keep
01:08:22.979 --> 01:08:26.300
you from wickedness. Maybe also the fact that
01:08:26.300 --> 01:08:28.800
she's like, don't lie to me. But especially the
01:08:28.800 --> 01:08:32.380
wickedness part, along with the black and white
01:08:32.380 --> 01:08:36.659
clothing, it feels very Puritan, very colonial,
01:08:37.060 --> 01:08:39.920
very religious. But at the same time, she seems
01:08:39.920 --> 01:08:43.199
like... A witch. Because she has this bell. This
01:08:43.199 --> 01:08:47.140
magical bell. Where she is controlling Lorna.
01:08:47.260 --> 01:08:50.640
Make of that what you will. But that's just.
01:08:50.739 --> 01:08:53.600
To me. That was one of the. That along with the
01:08:53.600 --> 01:08:59.000
fact. That Lorna is demon possessed. That's what
01:08:59.000 --> 01:09:03.510
makes this episode feel so religious to me. There
01:09:03.510 --> 01:09:06.430
you go. Yeah. I guess I never thought about it
01:09:06.430 --> 01:09:09.909
too closely. Except for the fact. That one line.
01:09:10.050 --> 01:09:12.710
That I mentioned. where she wants to keep the
01:09:12.710 --> 01:09:15.510
evil spirit from driving you to wickedness. That
01:09:15.510 --> 01:09:18.350
felt religious, but I never thought about it
01:09:18.350 --> 01:09:21.550
too much because once you realize that it was
01:09:21.550 --> 01:09:23.729
literal, like for her it wasn't like a religious
01:09:23.729 --> 01:09:25.869
thing, like she read some verse that said you
01:09:25.869 --> 01:09:27.649
got to keep busy or you're going to be evil.
01:09:28.779 --> 01:09:32.810
There's like a literal evil spirit in this girl
01:09:32.810 --> 01:09:36.149
that can come out if she's not told to do something
01:09:36.149 --> 01:09:41.010
with this magic bell. Wirt basically sees this
01:09:41.010 --> 01:09:44.640
situation. as Lorna being enslaved by a creepy
01:09:44.640 --> 01:09:48.279
people eater. And from an outside context, this
01:09:48.279 --> 01:09:52.199
really looks like she is being controlled in
01:09:52.199 --> 01:09:56.500
a very bad way. And he wants to help her escape.
01:09:56.600 --> 01:09:58.720
And she thinks that maybe this time it could
01:09:58.720 --> 01:10:04.039
be different. So Greg goes where he shouldn't,
01:10:04.039 --> 01:10:07.760
or where he should, and disrupts Auntie Whispers.
01:10:08.619 --> 01:10:11.460
And it looks like they're in major trouble with
01:10:11.460 --> 01:10:14.859
Auntie Whispers. But she's really just trying
01:10:14.859 --> 01:10:19.989
to protect them. And the frog eats the magic
01:10:19.989 --> 01:10:24.979
bell. They help her escape, and like you said,
01:10:25.199 --> 01:10:28.640
Auntie Whispers has been disrupted. But she tries
01:10:28.640 --> 01:10:31.960
to stop her with the bell, and she doesn't have
01:10:31.960 --> 01:10:34.659
the bell anymore. All of a sudden, the bell is
01:10:34.659 --> 01:10:38.810
in the frog. But the thing that... At least for
01:10:38.810 --> 01:10:41.590
me, it's hilarious, is the way she says, no.
01:10:42.430 --> 01:10:46.550
Yes. Also, Greg's line, where I think Auntie
01:10:46.550 --> 01:10:48.189
Whispers wants to know what they're doing there,
01:10:48.270 --> 01:10:51.210
and Greg is like, we've come to burgle your turds.
01:10:53.229 --> 01:10:57.750
Yes. Greg has so many good lines. I love that
01:10:57.750 --> 01:11:01.039
kid. So they think that they're doing a great
01:11:01.039 --> 01:11:04.880
thing, escaping, and this is the part where I
01:11:04.880 --> 01:11:08.109
needed to look away. Yeah, I think Anti -Whisperer
01:11:08.109 --> 01:11:10.970
says something like, she will devour you. And
01:11:10.970 --> 01:11:14.810
it turns out that Lorna is the one who eats people,
01:11:14.949 --> 01:11:17.909
not Anti -Whisperer. Because she's possessed
01:11:17.909 --> 01:11:20.770
of an evil spirit and she turns into this horrible
01:11:20.770 --> 01:11:25.619
demon beast. And like you said, the frog ate
01:11:25.619 --> 01:11:29.220
the bell. So they ring the bell inside the frog
01:11:29.220 --> 01:11:34.119
and they say to her, go away and never come back.
01:11:34.689 --> 01:11:37.010
And apparently that's all that needed to happen.
01:11:37.210 --> 01:11:39.789
He's basically telling the evil spirit to go
01:11:39.789 --> 01:11:45.369
away. Yes. So it flies away, and she's free.
01:11:45.970 --> 01:11:48.329
And I was thinking, why didn't Auntie Whispers
01:11:48.329 --> 01:11:53.369
try that? Maybe she didn't think about it. Let's
01:11:53.369 --> 01:11:56.289
just assume that this was not a codependent situation.
01:11:57.329 --> 01:12:00.310
Auntie Whispers is sad, though, that she's not
01:12:00.310 --> 01:12:05.779
needed anymore. At the same time, I think she's
01:12:05.779 --> 01:12:08.500
nice enough that if she had thought of it, she
01:12:08.500 --> 01:12:11.619
would have helped her to begin with instead of
01:12:11.619 --> 01:12:14.720
having that whole situation. Yeah. This is another
01:12:14.720 --> 01:12:17.939
thing where at the beginning you have a little
01:12:17.939 --> 01:12:21.300
vignette of Lorna in, you could probably call
01:12:21.300 --> 01:12:24.260
it a crypt, but it's probably not a crypt, of
01:12:24.260 --> 01:12:29.420
very meticulously stacked bones. Yeah, I saw
01:12:29.420 --> 01:12:32.859
that. It reminded me of that place in... I think
01:12:32.859 --> 01:12:38.340
there's more than one place like that. And there
01:12:38.340 --> 01:12:42.680
are references to, like, before they try to escape,
01:12:42.859 --> 01:12:46.100
I think Auntie asking her, did you finish, or
01:12:46.100 --> 01:12:49.460
I want you to finish stacking or sorting the
01:12:49.460 --> 01:12:54.760
bones. Yeah. Yeah, so it's very dark. Yes. If
01:12:54.760 --> 01:12:56.340
you think back to the vignette at the beginning,
01:12:56.479 --> 01:12:58.699
there were a lot of bones. Like, what are they
01:12:58.699 --> 01:13:01.460
next to a highway? Like, how long have they been
01:13:01.460 --> 01:13:04.000
here? How many people has she eaten here? This
01:13:04.000 --> 01:13:06.279
is, this is a, like, she looked like she took
01:13:06.279 --> 01:13:12.289
out a village. So, that's really dark. Yeah,
01:13:12.449 --> 01:13:15.529
no, if I were to skip one episode, it would be
01:13:15.529 --> 01:13:19.090
this episode. And if you're showing this to children,
01:13:19.229 --> 01:13:21.289
first off, you need to be careful which children
01:13:21.289 --> 01:13:24.899
you show this series to, period. But be very
01:13:24.899 --> 01:13:28.359
careful about sharing this episode. This cartoon
01:13:28.359 --> 01:13:30.779
is almost like for people in their 20s. I don't
01:13:30.779 --> 01:13:37.020
know. Starting age is 17. I don't know. But no,
01:13:37.180 --> 01:13:43.340
Lorna is thankful to Auntie Whispers for taking
01:13:43.340 --> 01:13:47.479
care of her, I believe. And it's like they're
01:13:47.479 --> 01:13:49.460
family, even though they're not family. And Lorna
01:13:49.460 --> 01:13:53.859
stays with her. And they're happy. So at this
01:13:53.859 --> 01:13:56.800
point, maybe Lorna is the caregiver? I don't
01:13:56.800 --> 01:14:02.239
know. Auntie Whispers looks pretty old. And when
01:14:02.239 --> 01:14:05.659
they're leaving, she says that they need to beware
01:14:05.659 --> 01:14:08.899
of her sister Adelaide. A little late, but thanks.
01:14:11.319 --> 01:14:15.220
So now they're lost in the woods again, and the
01:14:15.220 --> 01:14:18.159
beast is watching and kind of taunting the woodsmen
01:14:18.159 --> 01:14:20.579
as well. And I think that's where that one ends.
01:14:22.500 --> 01:14:25.100
Then we get to the next episode called Babes
01:14:25.100 --> 01:14:28.760
in the Wood. This is another great one. I like
01:14:28.760 --> 01:14:30.840
the music. There's a lot of references to old
01:14:30.840 --> 01:14:34.380
animation in here. Wirt is basically starting
01:14:34.380 --> 01:14:38.659
to give up hope, but Greg hasn't. And Greg at
01:14:38.659 --> 01:14:41.180
some point starts to feel like, oh, he needs
01:14:41.180 --> 01:14:45.140
to figure out how to fix this. And so it's like
01:14:45.140 --> 01:14:48.800
in his dream, he's trying to figure out what
01:14:48.800 --> 01:14:52.329
to do. He's looking for guidance. It starts out
01:14:52.329 --> 01:14:56.140
there boating down the river, and you have this
01:14:56.140 --> 01:14:58.739
fish that is fishing in the background. Which
01:14:58.739 --> 01:15:01.800
is a recurring thing, which is not, like, it's
01:15:01.800 --> 01:15:03.420
probably, who knows, maybe that's a postcard,
01:15:03.439 --> 01:15:06.239
too. It could be. It probably is. That does seem
01:15:06.239 --> 01:15:08.279
like something that would be on an old postcard.
01:15:09.000 --> 01:15:11.260
But I like the fact that it looked kind of disturbed
01:15:11.260 --> 01:15:14.619
at them, when they should be the ones being disturbed
01:15:14.619 --> 01:15:17.750
by this fish fishing. I didn't notice that. But
01:15:17.750 --> 01:15:19.970
you also have the beast singing in the background.
01:15:21.020 --> 01:15:23.600
And I don't know if we mentioned it at the beginning.
01:15:23.600 --> 01:15:27.460
We haven't yet. But the Beast is voiced by an
01:15:27.460 --> 01:15:32.439
opera singer. Samuel Ramey. Yes. Who, okay, just
01:15:32.439 --> 01:15:35.960
pat them on the back for getting Samuel Ramey
01:15:35.960 --> 01:15:41.560
to play a character for this cartoon. Like, oh
01:15:41.560 --> 01:15:45.720
my goodness, this man is one of the best. He
01:15:45.720 --> 01:15:48.659
has a great voice. Perfect for this character.
01:15:49.289 --> 01:15:52.510
I feel like I have seen him on PBS or something.
01:15:52.810 --> 01:15:56.470
Probably. And he's, you know, he's not a three
01:15:56.470 --> 01:15:58.949
tenor level of where everybody's going to know
01:15:58.949 --> 01:16:02.210
about him, but he's worth knowing about. And
01:16:02.210 --> 01:16:07.840
he's, he was just, I'm proud of them for getting
01:16:07.840 --> 01:16:10.960
this guy to play this character. This was wonderful.
01:16:11.420 --> 01:16:14.539
Yes. I love when the Beast is singing in the
01:16:14.539 --> 01:16:16.600
background. You don't really know it's him right
01:16:16.600 --> 01:16:20.159
away, but I love his voice just in the background.
01:16:20.159 --> 01:16:23.180
But there's also, in the beginning episode, you
01:16:23.180 --> 01:16:26.520
have the woodsman sort of sing talking, talking
01:16:26.520 --> 01:16:29.579
about the Beast and how he goes through the woods
01:16:29.579 --> 01:16:34.760
singing his mournful song. So they start out
01:16:34.760 --> 01:16:38.699
the reference early, but Samuel Remy has a lovely
01:16:38.699 --> 01:16:41.909
speaking voice as well as an operatic. Singing
01:16:41.909 --> 01:16:46.649
voice. So rich. So lovely. And yes, I will stop
01:16:46.649 --> 01:16:49.170
getting excited about that at the moment and
01:16:49.170 --> 01:16:52.229
move on. But I'm so happy about that. And there
01:16:52.229 --> 01:16:54.890
was another operatic voice in this episode. Yes.
01:16:55.109 --> 01:16:57.210
I don't know who it was, but it was a woman.
01:16:57.369 --> 01:16:59.869
I wrote it down. Deborah Voight. Where's she
01:16:59.869 --> 01:17:02.569
from? Know anything? I don't know what else she
01:17:02.569 --> 01:17:04.850
would have played other than just being in operas.
01:17:04.989 --> 01:17:09.850
I meant country, but that's okay. I didn't write
01:17:09.850 --> 01:17:14.199
that down. Talk about gathering all kinds of
01:17:14.199 --> 01:17:20.300
people to sing for this. Yeah, that was another
01:17:20.300 --> 01:17:23.960
thing. The Blasting Company, there's a song in
01:17:23.960 --> 01:17:28.000
here where they had to have been influenced by
01:17:28.000 --> 01:17:30.479
another famous singer. We'll get to that. Well,
01:17:30.600 --> 01:17:34.680
at this point, I think they come to land. And
01:17:34.680 --> 01:17:37.420
this is where Wirt is pretty much starting to
01:17:37.420 --> 01:17:39.979
lose hope. He's blaming Greg for getting them.
01:17:40.510 --> 01:17:44.590
Into this mess. And I think Greg has a line here
01:17:44.590 --> 01:17:46.109
that says something like, you can do anything
01:17:46.109 --> 01:17:47.970
if you set your mind to it. That's what the old
01:17:47.970 --> 01:17:52.329
people say. So Wirt tells Greg to figure out
01:17:52.329 --> 01:17:55.050
what to do. And they go to sleep under a tree.
01:17:55.170 --> 01:17:57.329
And this is where you have all the references
01:17:57.329 --> 01:18:01.329
to old animation. Which somebody said that this
01:18:01.329 --> 01:18:03.869
was, I don't know if all of them were creepy.
01:18:04.470 --> 01:18:06.970
Honestly, you're probably going to be less creeped
01:18:06.970 --> 01:18:09.829
out. Far less creeped out watching this episode
01:18:09.829 --> 01:18:14.270
than a lot of the original 1930s cartoons. 1930s
01:18:14.270 --> 01:18:17.850
cartoons can be... There's something unsettling
01:18:17.850 --> 01:18:21.250
about a lot of what went down then. This one,
01:18:21.289 --> 01:18:24.750
they kept a lot of it pretty cute. Weird. Very
01:18:24.750 --> 01:18:27.430
weird. Like you have floating heads with wings
01:18:27.430 --> 01:18:32.250
that come to take Wurtz... Not Wurtz. Greg's
01:18:32.250 --> 01:18:36.199
spirit off to dreamland. somewhere he ends up
01:18:36.199 --> 01:18:40.399
in like a little magical donkey cart which was
01:18:40.399 --> 01:18:44.180
cute and there's lots of old -ish sounding music
01:18:44.180 --> 01:18:47.239
here another catchy song everything is nice and
01:18:47.239 --> 01:18:50.340
fine which was very interesting how they did
01:18:50.340 --> 01:18:53.560
that because it has that old not i'm not going
01:18:53.560 --> 01:18:56.640
to classify it as big band but old band old jazz
01:18:56.640 --> 01:19:00.380
band style but It was like they got all their
01:19:00.380 --> 01:19:03.939
little child voice actors to sing the song, not
01:19:03.939 --> 01:19:08.699
perfectly, but in that style. And it was a very
01:19:08.699 --> 01:19:11.699
interesting choice. Yeah, it added something
01:19:11.699 --> 01:19:15.199
more to it than if it had been totally perfect.
01:19:15.479 --> 01:19:20.159
It was like, yeah, I don't know. It felt more
01:19:20.159 --> 01:19:24.399
true to the era they were going for. Maybe. It's
01:19:24.399 --> 01:19:27.859
over the garden wall. They did it their way.
01:19:28.619 --> 01:19:32.760
And the old way. You like the scene with the
01:19:32.760 --> 01:19:36.060
greeting committees up in Cloud City. It reminded
01:19:36.060 --> 01:19:39.159
me of the Munchkin greeting committee or whatever
01:19:39.159 --> 01:19:41.720
you want to call them in Wizard of Oz. Except
01:19:41.720 --> 01:19:44.760
it went on for longer. Well, maybe not longer.
01:19:44.880 --> 01:19:47.039
But it was different. But just the fact that
01:19:47.039 --> 01:19:49.859
they had so many people coming to greet the character.
01:19:50.159 --> 01:19:53.439
In this case, Greg. In that case, Dorothy. I
01:19:53.439 --> 01:19:56.449
like that they had... They threw in the women's
01:19:56.449 --> 01:19:58.829
greeting committee and they made it a little
01:19:58.829 --> 01:20:02.850
fancy. Like, where's the auxiliary greeting committee?
01:20:03.909 --> 01:20:06.829
And Craig wants to know if there are any more.
01:20:06.930 --> 01:20:09.369
And all of a sudden there's just this really
01:20:09.369 --> 01:20:12.369
unhappy dog with a rain cloud looking slightly
01:20:12.369 --> 01:20:18.460
crazed. It's like, well, that's enough. I love
01:20:18.460 --> 01:20:25.279
that. And this is very, very 1930s cartoon. Like,
01:20:25.279 --> 01:20:28.779
if you missed any other references to old cartoons,
01:20:29.060 --> 01:20:31.500
if you can't get it in this one, then you've
01:20:31.500 --> 01:20:34.420
never seen an old cartoon in your life, probably.
01:20:34.720 --> 01:20:37.579
Yeah, no, this is just like, all the animation
01:20:37.579 --> 01:20:41.579
is straight up 1930s animation. The way they
01:20:41.579 --> 01:20:47.399
ran, the way, it's just, at some point, and this
01:20:47.399 --> 01:20:50.359
has its own plotline within the plotline. Because
01:20:50.359 --> 01:20:53.560
there's a dilemma, there's a bad guy, and Greg
01:20:53.560 --> 01:20:56.159
defeats the bad guy. Because they accidentally
01:20:56.159 --> 01:21:00.239
release the North Wind. And they kind of tie
01:21:00.239 --> 01:21:02.720
it back to the real world, too, because the old
01:21:02.720 --> 01:21:05.619
North Wind is blowing, and it goes back to the
01:21:05.619 --> 01:21:08.439
real world, under the tree, shivering, as the
01:21:08.439 --> 01:21:10.500
wind is picking up. Almost like an Alice thing
01:21:10.500 --> 01:21:14.020
of how much is reality influencing the dream.
01:21:14.359 --> 01:21:17.659
And here's the part where the song for the old
01:21:17.659 --> 01:21:21.050
North Wind... not only does it sound like old
01:21:21.050 --> 01:21:24.109
jazz but the way the blasting company sang it
01:21:24.109 --> 01:21:27.770
sounded so much like randy newman like you've
01:21:27.770 --> 01:21:30.609
got a friend in me randy newman yeah but when
01:21:30.609 --> 01:21:33.529
i try to research it i don't think he sang it
01:21:33.529 --> 01:21:37.029
but i do believe that that band enjoys listening
01:21:37.029 --> 01:21:42.289
to randy newman and somehow they managed to make
01:21:42.289 --> 01:21:45.529
it sound so much like him that it wants to play
01:21:45.529 --> 01:21:50.920
mind games with you so That was a thing. But,
01:21:51.000 --> 01:21:53.960
yeah, you have this little cartoon fight in a
01:21:53.960 --> 01:21:59.340
cloud cottage. And Greg emerges with the North
01:21:59.340 --> 01:22:04.210
Wind in a bottle that says Old Windbag. And he,
01:22:04.329 --> 01:22:09.390
for his valiant effort, is granted a wish by...
01:22:09.390 --> 01:22:12.189
What did she call herself? Did they call her
01:22:12.189 --> 01:22:14.489
anything? I don't remember, but she was credited
01:22:14.489 --> 01:22:17.659
as the Queen of the Clouds, I believe. Yes. Not
01:22:17.659 --> 01:22:19.659
to be confused with the Queen of Heaven. So if
01:22:19.659 --> 01:22:21.619
you want to start making religious references,
01:22:21.819 --> 01:22:26.409
don't necessarily do that here. Greg is wanting
01:22:26.409 --> 01:22:29.390
to, I think he wants to get Wirt, but the Queen
01:22:29.390 --> 01:22:31.409
says something like the Beast had already claimed
01:22:31.409 --> 01:22:34.420
him. And then Greg says that he knows what he
01:22:34.420 --> 01:22:37.520
wants to wish for. And I think he whispers in
01:22:37.520 --> 01:22:41.159
her ear and then goes back to the real world
01:22:41.159 --> 01:22:45.039
under the tree. And Greg is saying to Wirt, who
01:22:45.039 --> 01:22:47.109
is still asleep. that he's sorry that he got
01:22:47.109 --> 01:22:50.789
us lost, and he leaves with the beast. Which
01:22:50.789 --> 01:22:52.989
this is the part where I think they want to make
01:22:52.989 --> 01:22:55.390
a Jesus connection, but please don't do that.
01:22:56.350 --> 01:22:58.909
Greg's a nice little boy trying to save his brother.
01:22:59.649 --> 01:23:02.430
I don't know that I would see a Jesus connection.
01:23:02.449 --> 01:23:05.229
I think that's too much of a stretch. Yeah. It
01:23:05.229 --> 01:23:08.829
doesn't seem appropriate for... But just look
01:23:08.829 --> 01:23:12.149
at Greg as a good little boy who wants to help
01:23:12.149 --> 01:23:14.600
his brother. Mm -hmm. I think they even wanted
01:23:14.600 --> 01:23:16.739
to make that connection with Wirt. It's like,
01:23:16.840 --> 01:23:19.739
no. Definitely not Wirt. I could see it more
01:23:19.739 --> 01:23:21.560
with Greg. Even though I don't see it with Greg,
01:23:21.600 --> 01:23:25.300
I could see it more for Greg. Either way, he's
01:23:25.300 --> 01:23:28.319
this innocent little boy who goes off to try
01:23:28.319 --> 01:23:31.359
and make things right, even though it's not really
01:23:31.359 --> 01:23:36.770
his fault or his problem. Yeah. So Wirt wakes
01:23:36.770 --> 01:23:40.050
up and freaks out. He ends up falling into the
01:23:40.050 --> 01:23:43.640
water. And he's rescued by Beatrice and that
01:23:43.640 --> 01:23:47.310
fish we saw at the beginning. Good fish. And
01:23:47.310 --> 01:23:51.140
that's the end of the episode. And then we come
01:23:51.140 --> 01:23:54.060
to Into the Unknown, which is where you find
01:23:54.060 --> 01:23:57.000
out the big twist, which I always forget is a
01:23:57.000 --> 01:23:58.779
twist because I'm so used to the story now, but
01:23:58.779 --> 01:24:01.119
the first time you watch it, you don't realize
01:24:01.119 --> 01:24:06.100
that there's a big twist here in that... These
01:24:06.100 --> 01:24:08.680
are kids from a modern world. And I don't know
01:24:08.680 --> 01:24:11.340
exactly the year. I want to guess like 80s or
01:24:11.340 --> 01:24:15.119
90s. I read somewhere 80s, which I would prefer
01:24:15.119 --> 01:24:19.920
that people reference it as the 80s. Like, yeah,
01:24:20.000 --> 01:24:22.720
he's running around with a cassette tape. So
01:24:22.720 --> 01:24:27.859
either he's a hipster kid or this is the 80s.
01:24:27.859 --> 01:24:30.600
But somebody said that it was similar to movies
01:24:30.600 --> 01:24:33.800
in the 80s, too. It wasn't surprising to me.
01:24:33.840 --> 01:24:37.140
The way they designed it. let's kill with that
01:24:37.140 --> 01:24:44.520
yeah so it's halloween and he has worked has
01:24:44.520 --> 01:24:47.859
a tape that says for sarah which this is the
01:24:47.859 --> 01:24:50.779
girl that he'd referenced in a previous episode
01:24:50.779 --> 01:24:55.220
as having a crush on and this is where you find
01:24:55.220 --> 01:24:56.920
out that these clothes that they've been wearing
01:24:56.920 --> 01:24:58.899
we never really talked about it but they have
01:24:58.899 --> 01:25:01.250
been wearing throughout the whole series, some
01:25:01.250 --> 01:25:03.930
rather strange clothes. But the series is so
01:25:03.930 --> 01:25:05.930
strange that there's only so much you're probably
01:25:05.930 --> 01:25:08.050
going to think about it. I didn't think about
01:25:08.050 --> 01:25:10.270
it at all until we got to this episode the first
01:25:10.270 --> 01:25:12.850
time I watched it. Basically, Burt sort of looks
01:25:12.850 --> 01:25:14.890
like he's dressed as a garden gnome with no beard,
01:25:15.010 --> 01:25:18.810
and Greg has a teapot upside down on his head.
01:25:19.380 --> 01:25:21.619
But in this episode, you find out that the reason
01:25:21.619 --> 01:25:23.699
that he's wearing an upside -down teapot on his
01:25:23.699 --> 01:25:25.960
head is because he's supposed to be dressed like
01:25:25.960 --> 01:25:29.180
an elephant. Which is probably his creative solution
01:25:29.180 --> 01:25:31.819
to a costume. Yes, and I thought that was great
01:25:31.819 --> 01:25:34.319
because it's such a little kid thing to see a
01:25:34.319 --> 01:25:37.100
teapot and think, I could be an elephant if I
01:25:37.100 --> 01:25:42.460
put that on my head. And Wirt was just trying
01:25:42.460 --> 01:25:45.979
to make do with how it was like a sand hat that
01:25:45.979 --> 01:25:49.550
he cut the fluff off of. and part of a Civil
01:25:49.550 --> 01:25:52.850
War outfit, which is where his cape came from.
01:25:52.989 --> 01:25:55.170
Which you also see, this is so great, because
01:25:55.170 --> 01:25:57.189
he's standing in front of a mirror at one point
01:25:57.189 --> 01:26:00.090
with his cape blowing because he has a fan turned
01:26:00.090 --> 01:26:04.210
on himself, like he wants to look epic. And this
01:26:04.210 --> 01:26:08.949
is an aside, but I remember this comedian talking
01:26:08.949 --> 01:26:11.529
about, and this is not true for all men, but
01:26:11.529 --> 01:26:15.289
talking about how... Men needed women to tell
01:26:15.289 --> 01:26:17.449
them what to wear because if it was up to men,
01:26:17.569 --> 01:26:20.930
we'd all be wearing capes. You know how much
01:26:20.930 --> 01:26:23.210
he loved capes and being, you know, he wanted
01:26:23.210 --> 01:26:25.970
to be able to flip it around. It was so cute.
01:26:26.109 --> 01:26:28.850
But you can edit that out if you need to. That
01:26:28.850 --> 01:26:34.270
scene made me think of that. At some point in
01:26:34.270 --> 01:26:37.989
here, Wirt has told Greg about the tape and Greg
01:26:37.989 --> 01:26:40.149
decides that he's going to give it to Sarah for
01:26:40.149 --> 01:26:44.250
him. And he runs off with it to... deliver it
01:26:44.250 --> 01:26:48.390
they're sort of intercepted by these girls which
01:26:48.390 --> 01:26:50.750
aren't mean girls they're just regular high school
01:26:50.750 --> 01:26:54.350
girls that want to tease him about it and what
01:26:54.350 --> 01:26:57.810
that he has to hurry up because they think jason
01:26:57.810 --> 01:27:02.100
funderberger funderberger is gonna Yes, he's
01:27:02.100 --> 01:27:05.359
so worried about this Jason Funderburker, who,
01:27:05.479 --> 01:27:08.720
the way he's describing it, you just assume that
01:27:08.720 --> 01:27:11.319
it's going to be this buff, muscly jock. Football
01:27:11.319 --> 01:27:15.100
jock. And it's this really awkward boy. It's
01:27:15.100 --> 01:27:18.079
this tiny little guy who has a kind of nerdy,
01:27:18.079 --> 01:27:24.260
whiny voice. And he's very awkward. Jason seems
01:27:24.260 --> 01:27:26.560
to have his own fan club. That one other girl
01:27:26.560 --> 01:27:30.409
who's like, you can hold my hand. So nobody's
01:27:30.409 --> 01:27:33.890
really left out. It's not as dramatic as Wirt
01:27:33.890 --> 01:27:37.350
thinks it is, but he just has, you know, he's
01:27:37.350 --> 01:27:41.810
insecure. So at some point, this tape ends up
01:27:41.810 --> 01:27:44.869
in Sarah's jacket, which she still doesn't know
01:27:44.869 --> 01:27:49.029
about it. And they're trying to get it back.
01:27:49.609 --> 01:27:53.270
And there's one little part in here that it wasn't,
01:27:53.270 --> 01:27:56.380
like, essential to the story. There's a policeman
01:27:56.380 --> 01:27:59.319
in a car watching all these kids. Well, it is.
01:27:59.840 --> 01:28:03.359
Well, he does turn up later, but he's watching
01:28:03.359 --> 01:28:05.479
these kids crossing the street, and there's two
01:28:05.479 --> 01:28:08.699
kids dressed like robbers, and he uses his police
01:28:08.699 --> 01:28:11.619
microphone. He's like, hey, kids, you're under
01:28:11.619 --> 01:28:13.399
arrest. No, I'm just kidding. Happy Halloween.
01:28:15.170 --> 01:28:17.689
And what was the other one? Stop running in the
01:28:17.689 --> 01:28:21.050
street. Just kidding. Happy Halloween. I like
01:28:21.050 --> 01:28:23.189
to believe so. The cop is in a good mood and
01:28:23.189 --> 01:28:25.909
he feels like having fun with the kids, which
01:28:25.909 --> 01:28:30.510
backfires later. Yeah. I didn't really even think
01:28:30.510 --> 01:28:33.170
about it. That does backfire on him. That is
01:28:33.170 --> 01:28:35.890
kind of the reason that everything happens. Yeah.
01:28:36.250 --> 01:28:40.710
So it sets it up. Yeah. So eventually they're
01:28:40.710 --> 01:28:44.210
going to have this party in a graveyard and they
01:28:44.210 --> 01:28:46.369
talk about they're going to be drinking age appropriate
01:28:46.369 --> 01:28:50.500
drinks. This is where you see the grave that
01:28:50.500 --> 01:28:54.899
says Quincy Endicott. And I don't know that Wirt
01:28:54.899 --> 01:28:57.699
and Greg, they're like sort of following and
01:28:57.699 --> 01:29:00.119
hiding. They're trying to find a way to get the
01:29:00.119 --> 01:29:02.720
tape back. Sarah wanted him to come, but instead
01:29:02.720 --> 01:29:04.939
of coming straight out, he's trying to sneak
01:29:04.939 --> 01:29:08.600
there and get the tape back. And Greg blows his
01:29:08.600 --> 01:29:12.039
cover. It's just this silly, awkward teenage
01:29:12.039 --> 01:29:14.479
moment. It was such a teenage moment. Like, we
01:29:14.479 --> 01:29:18.619
can see you. And Funderburker's trying to tell
01:29:18.619 --> 01:29:21.640
a scary story and hold Sarah's hand. Like, you
01:29:21.640 --> 01:29:23.760
can stop holding my hand now. And the other girl,
01:29:23.779 --> 01:29:27.979
you can hold my hand. But eventually their party
01:29:27.979 --> 01:29:31.819
is broken up by the police, sort of. But he's
01:29:31.819 --> 01:29:33.699
kidding again. Yeah, he's like, what is this,
01:29:33.739 --> 01:29:35.920
some kind of witch's gathering? Just kidding.
01:29:36.220 --> 01:29:39.140
But they're all freaking out. And he wants them
01:29:39.140 --> 01:29:41.739
to calm down and not get hurt and not climb up
01:29:41.739 --> 01:29:45.109
on the wall. Because he and Greg. are climbing
01:29:45.109 --> 01:29:47.329
this wall. Whereas the others I think have scattered
01:29:47.329 --> 01:29:49.970
in a different direction, but they're all scattering.
01:29:50.050 --> 01:29:53.350
Like it's, it's an irrational, Oh, probably hyped
01:29:53.350 --> 01:29:57.350
up group Halloween setting of like, ah, everybody
01:29:57.350 --> 01:30:00.550
run. It's the cop. Even though they're not in
01:30:00.550 --> 01:30:05.109
trouble, but they end up over the wall. And here's,
01:30:05.109 --> 01:30:08.289
here's the thing. The whole thing of where does
01:30:08.289 --> 01:30:10.670
over the garden wall come from? You can try,
01:30:10.729 --> 01:30:13.789
like, think about it. It's not a garden wall.
01:30:14.489 --> 01:30:18.229
But the gate to the cemetery says Eternal Garden.
01:30:19.729 --> 01:30:22.949
I didn't notice that. I saw a still of it. I
01:30:22.949 --> 01:30:24.689
don't know that I noticed. I may have noticed
01:30:24.689 --> 01:30:26.930
the first time that we watched it. Because we
01:30:26.930 --> 01:30:30.789
watched this series a couple of times now. But
01:30:30.789 --> 01:30:33.970
as far as I know, you can double check. But the
01:30:33.970 --> 01:30:37.270
gateway says Eternal Garden. So over the garden
01:30:37.270 --> 01:30:41.050
wall, all of a sudden, it's pretty dark. Yeah.
01:30:42.569 --> 01:30:45.270
I suppose they meant for that to be nice when
01:30:45.270 --> 01:30:47.630
they set up, if anybody has set up a cemetery
01:30:47.630 --> 01:30:50.090
that way, they probably meant for it to be nice,
01:30:50.229 --> 01:30:53.050
but it sounds rather dark. And I think that that
01:30:53.050 --> 01:30:55.649
makes the most sense as far as over the garden
01:30:55.649 --> 01:30:59.649
wall. Yeah. Well, that is a very good theory
01:30:59.649 --> 01:31:03.430
and probably true. But as far as like over the
01:31:03.430 --> 01:31:05.670
garden wall being where all the dead people are,
01:31:05.750 --> 01:31:08.250
over the garden wall in this case, they're outside
01:31:08.250 --> 01:31:10.890
the cemetery because they leave. Well, they had
01:31:10.890 --> 01:31:13.850
to go. over the garden wall that was the eternal
01:31:13.850 --> 01:31:17.550
garden. Yeah. So either way it works. Yeah, but
01:31:17.550 --> 01:31:19.649
I just mean, like, as far as, like, if they're
01:31:19.649 --> 01:31:21.850
meeting dead people in their journey, they're
01:31:21.850 --> 01:31:24.390
on the outside of the cemetery at this point.
01:31:24.789 --> 01:31:28.090
Yeah, there's room for theorizing. Yes, there's
01:31:28.090 --> 01:31:31.029
a lot of room for theorizing. Here's another
01:31:31.029 --> 01:31:35.470
thing that's cool. Before they fall into the
01:31:35.470 --> 01:31:40.409
pond, they are on train tracks. Mm -hmm. So...
01:31:40.989 --> 01:31:46.310
already this train it's not a modern train think
01:31:46.430 --> 01:31:51.199
about it it was like a steam engine so as far
01:31:51.199 --> 01:31:53.159
as hovering between life and death in the pond
01:31:53.159 --> 01:31:55.880
it's almost like they are already in an alternate
01:31:55.880 --> 01:31:59.770
reality as soon as they hopped the wall because
01:31:59.770 --> 01:32:03.989
it could have been you know just a train left
01:32:03.989 --> 01:32:08.449
over but that's not super likely and another
01:32:08.449 --> 01:32:11.529
thing if you're not paying attention or if you
01:32:11.529 --> 01:32:15.770
don't know the song that is sung at this time
01:32:15.770 --> 01:32:21.810
about the train the style of it sounds so 20s
01:32:21.810 --> 01:32:25.470
or 30s to me it sounds so much like say woody
01:32:25.470 --> 01:32:30.270
guthrie and there's this whole i don't know train
01:32:30.270 --> 01:32:34.770
hobo culture whatever in music back at that time
01:32:34.770 --> 01:32:37.829
so that's another historical cultural reference
01:32:37.829 --> 01:32:42.439
and i believe that Either the blasting company
01:32:42.439 --> 01:32:44.979
or the creator of the series or both of them
01:32:44.979 --> 01:32:48.260
were into Woody Guthrie. So I think there's some
01:32:48.260 --> 01:32:50.579
of that. There has to be some of that influence
01:32:50.579 --> 01:32:52.939
coming through in that song. And I've listened
01:32:52.939 --> 01:32:56.600
to that type of music from that period. So to
01:32:56.600 --> 01:33:00.920
me, that kind of stuck to me as well. Just, yeah.
01:33:01.380 --> 01:33:06.060
But then they fall into the pond. So were they
01:33:06.060 --> 01:33:08.319
already in an alternate reality or were they
01:33:08.319 --> 01:33:10.640
hovering between life and death in a pond? You
01:33:10.640 --> 01:33:14.520
decide. And that's basically the end, except
01:33:14.520 --> 01:33:18.140
you pick up where the previous episode left off
01:33:18.140 --> 01:33:21.479
with Wirt waking up after falling in this other
01:33:21.479 --> 01:33:26.479
pond. And he's now in a bluebird's nest. And
01:33:26.479 --> 01:33:30.680
he sees this bluebird and says, Beatrice? And
01:33:30.680 --> 01:33:32.439
she says, you know my daughter? Where is she?
01:33:32.819 --> 01:33:37.159
So this is Beatrice's family. And I don't know
01:33:37.159 --> 01:33:39.829
if you noticed or if you read. But Beatrice's
01:33:39.829 --> 01:33:43.750
mother is played by Shirley Jones. Really? Yes.
01:33:44.470 --> 01:33:48.310
Cool. And how did he end up in that nest? Did
01:33:48.310 --> 01:33:50.310
she drop him off outside of the tree? It's not
01:33:50.310 --> 01:33:51.810
like she could lift him into the tree. There
01:33:51.810 --> 01:33:53.770
were so many bluebirds, maybe they dragged him
01:33:53.770 --> 01:33:55.970
in there, but that doesn't fully make sense.
01:33:56.649 --> 01:33:58.609
Well, this fish could sit in a boat and fish,
01:33:58.689 --> 01:34:02.109
so maybe he could somehow hop away. We may just
01:34:02.109 --> 01:34:05.069
have to accept it as part of that universe. Yeah.
01:34:05.550 --> 01:34:08.050
Either way, it's a very nurturing family trying
01:34:08.050 --> 01:34:10.729
to take care of Wirt. And obviously Beatrice
01:34:10.729 --> 01:34:12.869
has left him there. She has this thing of she
01:34:12.869 --> 01:34:15.289
has to be able to turn her family back into people
01:34:15.289 --> 01:34:17.710
before she's going to face them again. I don't
01:34:17.710 --> 01:34:20.989
think they feel that way about her. But she's
01:34:20.989 --> 01:34:26.050
on this quest. So hence her family not seeing
01:34:26.050 --> 01:34:28.529
Beatrice but being left with Wirt to take care
01:34:28.529 --> 01:34:33.770
of him. But then Wirt leaves and the bluebirds
01:34:33.770 --> 01:34:37.000
are... They're trying to tell him to wait, wait
01:34:37.000 --> 01:34:38.640
until the storm dies down, because at this point
01:34:38.640 --> 01:34:42.500
I think it's like a blizzard. And I think she
01:34:42.500 --> 01:34:44.239
says, you'll be no good to your brother dead.
01:34:44.800 --> 01:34:47.119
And he says, I was never any good to him alive
01:34:47.119 --> 01:34:52.300
either. And then he leaves. So that's one of
01:34:52.300 --> 01:34:55.960
the things. The woodsman tried to rebuke him
01:34:55.960 --> 01:34:58.220
at the beginning, saying that he was the elder
01:34:58.220 --> 01:34:59.920
brother and that he was responsible. And that's
01:34:59.920 --> 01:35:03.020
kind of a recurring theme kind of throughout
01:35:03.020 --> 01:35:06.920
this. of Wirt taking responsibility for taking
01:35:06.920 --> 01:35:10.039
care of Greg. And at this point, he's prepared
01:35:10.039 --> 01:35:16.699
to do that. And I think maybe there's not like
01:35:16.699 --> 01:35:19.680
intense hatred, but some animosity and agitation.
01:35:19.899 --> 01:35:26.199
They're stepbrothers. And Greg and Wirt's stepdad
01:35:26.199 --> 01:35:29.079
have tried to convince him to join the band.
01:35:29.199 --> 01:35:31.319
It doesn't sound like they're trying to do anything.
01:35:32.420 --> 01:35:35.500
To hurt him or anything bad like that. It's just
01:35:35.500 --> 01:35:39.220
that he's having a hard time adjusting. I don't
01:35:39.220 --> 01:35:42.720
know. Just having a hard time with his current
01:35:42.720 --> 01:35:46.600
reality and growing up and everything. But now
01:35:46.600 --> 01:35:50.619
he does care enough about Greg and about being
01:35:50.619 --> 01:35:54.770
responsible that he's willing to go and risk
01:35:54.770 --> 01:35:59.649
his own well -being to take care of him. Good
01:35:59.649 --> 01:36:05.149
maturing in the story. Yes. So now it's the final
01:36:05.149 --> 01:36:09.090
episode titled The Unknown. And here you have
01:36:09.090 --> 01:36:13.810
the Beast making Greg run errands for him. Just
01:36:13.810 --> 01:36:17.529
random weird errands. Like he wants him to get
01:36:17.529 --> 01:36:20.649
the sun, but it's a riddle because he gives him
01:36:20.649 --> 01:36:24.569
a teacup. So he figures out the problem by putting
01:36:24.569 --> 01:36:28.130
the teacup on a stump and then situating himself.
01:36:28.869 --> 01:36:31.470
In such a way that if you sit there long enough,
01:36:31.550 --> 01:36:33.850
it'll look like the sun is setting into the teacup.
01:36:34.069 --> 01:36:38.180
Mm -hmm. Clever. Yes. So he's just basically
01:36:38.180 --> 01:36:40.920
giving him weird little errands like that. I'm
01:36:40.920 --> 01:36:43.739
not sure exactly why. But it's like Greg never
01:36:43.739 --> 01:36:46.739
loses hope, but at the same time, he's probably
01:36:46.739 --> 01:36:49.560
going to freeze to death. Yeah, and you can tell
01:36:49.560 --> 01:36:53.140
he's exhausted. So at that point, I suppose the
01:36:53.140 --> 01:36:56.020
idea is for him just to freeze to death so that
01:36:56.020 --> 01:36:59.590
he can die and turn into... Because I don't know
01:36:59.590 --> 01:37:01.390
if you completely have to lose hope. You may
01:37:01.390 --> 01:37:04.689
just have to be lost. I don't know. That doesn't
01:37:04.689 --> 01:37:07.710
fully make sense to me. Because Greg shouldn't...
01:37:07.899 --> 01:37:09.859
Well, maybe he's just trying to force him to
01:37:09.859 --> 01:37:11.800
do so many chores that he's going to eventually
01:37:11.800 --> 01:37:13.760
lose hope. That he's assuming that Greg will
01:37:13.760 --> 01:37:16.390
lose hope. I don't know. Because he doesn't really
01:37:16.390 --> 01:37:18.529
know Greg. He doesn't know how much of an eternal
01:37:18.529 --> 01:37:21.149
optimist that he is. I don't know. But either
01:37:21.149 --> 01:37:27.579
way, he was turning into a tree. Yeah, because
01:37:27.869 --> 01:37:30.029
you have that line about... There's already leaves
01:37:30.029 --> 01:37:33.109
growing inside him. No, I was just eating leaves.
01:37:33.609 --> 01:37:42.779
I forgot that. He's probably hungry. I know when
01:37:42.779 --> 01:37:46.960
Wirt does find Greg again, he has wood growing
01:37:46.960 --> 01:37:50.319
around him. He is becoming an Edelwood tree.
01:37:50.840 --> 01:37:53.819
And here's a revelation for the woodsman, because
01:37:53.819 --> 01:37:58.479
the woodsman never realized that the trees were
01:37:58.479 --> 01:38:04.579
people. that he was chopping up to feed this
01:38:04.579 --> 01:38:12.090
beast of lost hope so he poor guy is a very very
01:38:12.090 --> 01:38:15.890
deceived character he's well -meaning character
01:38:15.890 --> 01:38:21.970
but he has a lot of grief going on when work
01:38:21.970 --> 01:38:25.270
goes out searching for greg he and beatrice literally
01:38:25.270 --> 01:38:28.430
run into each other yeah in the storm and at
01:38:28.430 --> 01:38:30.750
some point they make their way to the mill and
01:38:31.100 --> 01:38:33.979
To me, it looks like it's kind of fixed. Like,
01:38:34.000 --> 01:38:36.560
it didn't look as in shambles as it was when
01:38:36.560 --> 01:38:39.619
they were last there. But the woodsman was getting
01:38:39.619 --> 01:38:43.079
desperate for wood. He found the two sticks that
01:38:43.079 --> 01:38:45.340
he had initially tossed aside in the beginning
01:38:45.340 --> 01:38:48.460
episode. And it's like he's just trying to get
01:38:48.460 --> 01:38:52.460
by. Like, he's running out of this wood. So the
01:38:52.460 --> 01:38:55.640
beast is probably even more desperate to have
01:38:55.640 --> 01:39:00.159
these boys turn into trees. One thing that I
01:39:00.159 --> 01:39:01.859
was going to ask you, and I forgot to ask at
01:39:01.859 --> 01:39:05.020
the beginning, all this talk about the Edelwood
01:39:05.020 --> 01:39:07.520
trees. Is an Edelwood tree a thing? Is that a
01:39:07.520 --> 01:39:10.659
real plant? I believe so. I didn't know if it
01:39:10.659 --> 01:39:12.720
was something they made up for this or if it
01:39:12.720 --> 01:39:14.939
might mean like whitewood or valiant wood or
01:39:14.939 --> 01:39:18.079
something. Can you Google it real quick? Yeah,
01:39:18.159 --> 01:39:19.760
it's kind of like an important part of the story.
01:39:20.319 --> 01:39:22.260
I might have researched that a little bit more.
01:39:28.590 --> 01:39:31.229
Everything that is coming up is over -the -garden
01:39:31.229 --> 01:39:35.270
-wall related. Okay, so Edelwood trees don't
01:39:35.270 --> 01:39:36.930
seem like they're a real thing. If they are,
01:39:37.069 --> 01:39:40.210
please tell us that they are. But there's a speculation
01:39:40.210 --> 01:39:43.170
that the Edelwood trees mean noble wood trees,
01:39:43.310 --> 01:39:47.409
but there are no Edelwood trees in reality. It's
01:39:47.409 --> 01:39:51.289
for the series. Make of it what you will. But
01:39:51.289 --> 01:39:53.050
either way, the woodsman seems to be running
01:39:53.050 --> 01:39:58.750
low. And at some point... The woodsman is figuring
01:39:58.750 --> 01:40:01.710
out what has actually been going on, and he never
01:40:01.710 --> 01:40:05.449
meant to be chopping up trees made out of humans.
01:40:06.609 --> 01:40:11.659
He's not happy about this, and he doesn't want
01:40:11.659 --> 01:40:14.739
anything to happen to the boys. Where in there
01:40:14.739 --> 01:40:17.600
is he like, his daughter wouldn't have wanted
01:40:17.600 --> 01:40:22.479
this? Well, when Wirt finds Greg, Greg, it seems
01:40:22.479 --> 01:40:25.760
like he's falling asleep, like he's succumbing
01:40:25.760 --> 01:40:30.689
to the beast. And one thing we didn't mention
01:40:30.689 --> 01:40:33.670
is he's also been carrying around this rock that
01:40:33.670 --> 01:40:36.270
he's been using to say rock facts, which is basically
01:40:36.270 --> 01:40:40.449
made up facts that he thinks are funny. And he
01:40:40.449 --> 01:40:43.289
took it in the previous episode. He took this
01:40:43.289 --> 01:40:47.250
rock out of this old lady's garden. So now that
01:40:47.250 --> 01:40:51.050
he's basically dying, he's upset that he has
01:40:51.050 --> 01:40:53.350
stolen this rock and he's wanting work to give
01:40:53.350 --> 01:40:58.649
it back for him. Wirt is trying to keep him from
01:40:58.649 --> 01:41:02.590
going to sleep, and the beast says that he can
01:41:02.590 --> 01:41:06.029
put his spirit in the lantern. I think at this
01:41:06.029 --> 01:41:09.170
point, the woodsman is probably seeming somewhat
01:41:09.170 --> 01:41:13.529
uncooperative, and the beast is probably looking
01:41:13.529 --> 01:41:18.649
for a more vulnerable lantern keeper. Yeah. So
01:41:18.649 --> 01:41:21.409
he tells him that as long as the lamp stays lit,
01:41:21.489 --> 01:41:25.710
his soul will live on. And then... At first it
01:41:25.710 --> 01:41:27.689
seems like he's buying this and he says, wait,
01:41:27.869 --> 01:41:32.250
that's dumb. And then he's figured it out. He
01:41:32.250 --> 01:41:34.810
says, it's almost like your soul is in the lantern.
01:41:35.449 --> 01:41:39.090
And he gives the lamp back to the woodsman and
01:41:39.090 --> 01:41:42.949
they leave. And this is the point where the woodsman
01:41:42.949 --> 01:41:46.649
now realizes that all this time he's been tricked.
01:41:47.250 --> 01:41:51.189
And you basically realize that this is the end
01:41:51.189 --> 01:41:53.680
of their... agreement or whatever because he
01:41:53.680 --> 01:41:57.100
blows out the lantern flame which took courage
01:41:57.100 --> 01:41:59.640
on his part which wouldn't have really been possible
01:41:59.640 --> 01:42:03.520
if it hadn't been for knowing the boys and and
01:42:03.520 --> 01:42:08.359
having them show what was really going on but
01:42:08.460 --> 01:42:13.680
then when they're leaving wort gives the scissors
01:42:13.680 --> 01:42:17.760
from adelaide's to beatrice because apparently
01:42:17.760 --> 01:42:21.060
in all the confusion he had somehow been able
01:42:21.060 --> 01:42:24.119
to take them and they probably cut themselves
01:42:24.119 --> 01:42:27.479
free too yeah he's she's like why didn't you
01:42:27.479 --> 01:42:29.840
give them to me before he's like well i was mad
01:42:29.840 --> 01:42:35.659
at you before exactly exactly but then they end
01:42:35.659 --> 01:42:38.000
up waking up in the real world they're in the
01:42:38.000 --> 01:42:41.359
hospital and but i think it shows them doesn't
01:42:41.359 --> 01:42:45.069
it show them being pulled out of the pond i believe
01:42:45.069 --> 01:42:48.579
so but i think it's more like images And then
01:42:48.579 --> 01:42:52.000
the ride to the hospital, Cyrid going. Yeah,
01:42:52.100 --> 01:42:55.539
because there's that song playing. So they're
01:42:55.539 --> 01:42:59.020
back in the real world, but they still have the
01:42:59.020 --> 01:43:02.880
frog, and the frog still has the bell. Mm -hmm.
01:43:03.000 --> 01:43:07.159
So there's even more of a question of... It was
01:43:07.159 --> 01:43:10.500
totally real. Yeah. It has to be real, because
01:43:10.500 --> 01:43:15.289
they go back into the unknown. And you see that
01:43:15.289 --> 01:43:19.109
the woodsman has regained his courage to go home.
01:43:19.430 --> 01:43:21.890
He's on the front porch. It's like a prologue
01:43:21.890 --> 01:43:24.329
where it's like a montage of all the different
01:43:24.329 --> 01:43:27.010
characters. Right. Which the woodsman, I think,
01:43:27.010 --> 01:43:28.729
is probably the most important out of all of
01:43:28.729 --> 01:43:32.130
them. Because he's sitting on his porch and all
01:43:32.130 --> 01:43:33.710
of a sudden his daughter comes out of the house.
01:43:33.829 --> 01:43:36.350
And I think really all he needed all along was
01:43:36.350 --> 01:43:40.649
the courage to go back home. And then you see,
01:43:40.789 --> 01:43:44.789
what do they have for Endicott? Are they just...
01:43:44.789 --> 01:43:50.750
I think it was him and the other tea baron. Oh,
01:43:50.750 --> 01:43:56.239
Marguerite Grey. Sounds like Earl Grey tea. Yeah,
01:43:56.279 --> 01:43:58.699
so you basically get happy endings for everybody
01:43:58.699 --> 01:44:02.020
because you get them and then you have Beatrice
01:44:02.020 --> 01:44:06.340
with the dog that was the wolf. I think there's
01:44:06.340 --> 01:44:08.640
a little bit with Auntie Whispers and Lorna.
01:44:08.779 --> 01:44:11.399
They're sitting at a table. A bit at the circus.
01:44:11.500 --> 01:44:15.359
And then... You get another quick little revelation
01:44:15.359 --> 01:44:19.560
all the way back to hard times at the Huskenby.
01:44:20.500 --> 01:44:24.460
Enoch the Giant Pumpkin Man was actually a cat.
01:44:24.800 --> 01:44:27.859
A little black cat popped out of the top. Yes.
01:44:28.520 --> 01:44:34.180
Hence my reference to black cats and potentially,
01:44:34.279 --> 01:44:36.460
you know, being thought of as, I think, guides
01:44:36.460 --> 01:44:39.880
for the dead. But it's a very cute little black
01:44:39.880 --> 01:44:44.079
cat. I love that. I love that they have this
01:44:44.079 --> 01:44:47.100
giant foreboding pumpkin. It was just this little
01:44:47.100 --> 01:44:50.880
kitten inside. Yeah, if you take away whatever,
01:44:51.199 --> 01:44:53.760
if you don't layer the other meaning onto it,
01:44:53.800 --> 01:44:56.840
or even if you do, I don't know, it's an adorable
01:44:56.840 --> 01:44:59.779
cat. And it helps to make that pumpkin far less
01:44:59.779 --> 01:45:03.840
creepy to know that there was a cat in there.
01:45:04.600 --> 01:45:11.479
Yeah, I love that. So yeah, that's Over the Garden
01:45:11.479 --> 01:45:19.000
Wall. Yes, and who... So you have people who
01:45:19.000 --> 01:45:22.220
put all kinds of meaning into it, and the creator
01:45:22.220 --> 01:45:25.619
of it said that basically people done a pretty
01:45:25.619 --> 01:45:28.039
good job of finding all of the meanings that
01:45:28.039 --> 01:45:31.560
they had infused into it, and some that I think
01:45:31.560 --> 01:45:33.100
he said that they hadn't thought of but wished
01:45:33.100 --> 01:45:37.020
that they had. One of the things that we haven't
01:45:37.020 --> 01:45:40.100
mentioned, which is kind of an aside, is just
01:45:40.100 --> 01:45:44.319
the beginning title cards. for each episode look
01:45:44.319 --> 01:45:47.779
like these really strange wood cuttings or something.
01:45:48.000 --> 01:45:53.279
And they're so old timey and artistic and strange,
01:45:53.420 --> 01:45:57.619
almost like a tombstone or something. So for
01:45:57.619 --> 01:45:59.899
me, that's one of the, actually one of the most
01:45:59.899 --> 01:46:02.100
interesting things about the series aesthetically.
01:46:03.020 --> 01:46:08.579
He also, the creator said that he got inspiration
01:46:08.579 --> 01:46:12.630
from trade cards and chromolithographs as well
01:46:12.630 --> 01:46:17.529
as uh the postcards and ottoman new england and
01:46:17.529 --> 01:46:21.729
general americana and so i guess the overall
01:46:21.729 --> 01:46:25.250
theme besides it just being confusing and bizarre
01:46:25.250 --> 01:46:29.869
and everything is that there's so much i i wish
01:46:29.869 --> 01:46:31.789
you know i'd be nice to have a dollar for every
01:46:31.789 --> 01:46:35.550
time i've said americana in this episode it's
01:46:35.550 --> 01:46:40.960
one of those shows where it is a show Watching
01:46:40.960 --> 01:46:43.859
it this time, I didn't feel this way when we
01:46:43.859 --> 01:46:47.560
watched it maybe a few years ago. It makes me
01:46:47.560 --> 01:46:51.119
want to be proud of America. It makes me want
01:46:51.119 --> 01:46:56.079
to find more of the interesting history and more
01:46:56.079 --> 01:47:01.100
of the goodness and more of the coziness of America.
01:47:01.720 --> 01:47:06.720
Right now, I feel like there's this push to not
01:47:06.720 --> 01:47:12.579
be proud of America. where we live and like we
01:47:12.579 --> 01:47:16.739
were discussing the other day if if every country
01:47:16.739 --> 01:47:21.460
was held to this litmus test of if they did bad
01:47:21.460 --> 01:47:23.600
things not being proud of them like would anybody
01:47:23.600 --> 01:47:26.420
left would anybody be left besides switzerland
01:47:26.420 --> 01:47:31.600
who could be proud of their country and i realized
01:47:31.600 --> 01:47:36.970
that there have been injustices but there's also
01:47:36.970 --> 01:47:42.010
this interesting past that's worth knowing about
01:47:42.010 --> 01:47:46.210
and not just being so hyper focused on the present
01:47:46.210 --> 01:47:50.050
that we miss all the interesting things that
01:47:50.050 --> 01:47:54.649
happened in the past and people haven't changed
01:47:54.649 --> 01:47:57.710
as much as we think they've changed so there
01:47:57.710 --> 01:48:01.229
will be recurring things of human behavior good
01:48:01.229 --> 01:48:05.779
and bad throughout our history including the
01:48:05.779 --> 01:48:10.619
present Anyway. It's one of those things where
01:48:10.619 --> 01:48:13.359
you have to take the bad with the good and choose
01:48:13.359 --> 01:48:16.779
what you're going to put more focus on. But if
01:48:16.779 --> 01:48:20.060
you do watch this cartoon, please let it inspire
01:48:20.060 --> 01:48:25.479
you to get out of the present and research the
01:48:25.479 --> 01:48:30.199
past and know more of... Really, that's one of
01:48:30.199 --> 01:48:32.699
the things. It's not just the people. The landscape
01:48:32.699 --> 01:48:37.119
in this cartoon points to the beauty of America.
01:48:38.449 --> 01:48:41.930
And, you know, let that make you think about
01:48:41.930 --> 01:48:46.189
the diversity and beauty of America. And even
01:48:46.189 --> 01:48:49.430
if you don't agree with a single human being
01:48:49.430 --> 01:48:55.010
in the country, you can still enjoy the precious
01:48:55.010 --> 01:49:00.350
land that you live on. Yeah. There you go. My
01:49:00.350 --> 01:49:03.319
little sermonette. We've got to figure out some
01:49:03.319 --> 01:49:06.479
way to wrap up this podcast. Might as well do
01:49:06.479 --> 01:49:26.039
it with soapboxing. Okay, well, I don't think
01:49:26.039 --> 01:49:28.600
I'd actually watched this before today. Really?
01:49:28.920 --> 01:49:31.939
I thought I had, but as we were watching, I was
01:49:31.939 --> 01:49:33.920
like, this doesn't seem familiar. And then when
01:49:33.920 --> 01:49:35.880
an alligator came out of the cornfield and started
01:49:35.880 --> 01:49:37.899
eating their car, I was like, I would have remembered
01:49:37.899 --> 01:49:39.880
an alligator coming out of the cornfield and
01:49:39.880 --> 01:49:43.939
eating their car. You know what? I just watched
01:49:43.939 --> 01:49:48.739
it either this year or last year. and i don't
01:49:48.739 --> 01:49:52.220
know if it came up because i was listening to
01:49:52.220 --> 01:49:55.420
music from the movie or if we had talked about
01:49:55.420 --> 01:50:02.359
it but i really enjoyed it then i feel like it
01:50:02.489 --> 01:50:05.069
should if it's not on my dvd it should have been
01:50:05.069 --> 01:50:07.289
i can't believe i have not seen this and honestly
01:50:07.289 --> 01:50:10.329
i feel like i've watched it at least twice before
01:50:10.329 --> 01:50:14.569
we watched it today okay it's short and it's
01:50:14.920 --> 01:50:18.289
comforting i don't know Well, this was made in
01:50:18.289 --> 01:50:22.670
2013, the year before the series, and this was
01:50:22.670 --> 01:50:25.670
the pilot. I was actually just listening to a
01:50:25.670 --> 01:50:29.710
podcast with Patrick McHale yesterday, so I was
01:50:29.710 --> 01:50:32.170
hearing about some of this stuff. This is kind
01:50:32.170 --> 01:50:34.329
of a coincidence that we ended up talking about
01:50:34.329 --> 01:50:36.109
this, because this was not a planned episode.
01:50:36.710 --> 01:50:39.949
This is nuts that it's that old, but I didn't
01:50:39.949 --> 01:50:44.710
watch it when it first came out. I watched the
01:50:44.710 --> 01:50:48.979
series when it first came out. I mean the series.
01:50:49.119 --> 01:50:51.680
I didn't watch that when it first came out. I
01:50:51.680 --> 01:50:55.159
think Sasha and I watched it soon after it came
01:50:55.159 --> 01:50:57.239
out. Little do I realize it's been a long time
01:50:57.239 --> 01:51:00.340
since I first saw this and I'm just blocking
01:51:00.340 --> 01:51:06.100
that out. But today is our day to re -watch the
01:51:06.100 --> 01:51:09.539
series. And this is kind of the perfect way to
01:51:09.539 --> 01:51:13.000
kick it off with a walk to an old Pioneer Cemetery
01:51:13.000 --> 01:51:18.250
and watching the pilot for the show. Yeah. The
01:51:18.250 --> 01:51:21.949
series and the pilot actually started out when
01:51:21.949 --> 01:51:25.770
I think Patrick was like just out of school and
01:51:25.770 --> 01:51:28.710
he wrote up a pitch because he had an idea for
01:51:28.710 --> 01:51:32.489
a three season series first, which was Tome of
01:51:32.489 --> 01:51:35.949
the Unknown and what became Over the Garden Wall.
01:51:36.710 --> 01:51:39.470
Let's explain what a tome is, because when I
01:51:39.470 --> 01:51:42.850
first watched this, I had to look it up. Oh,
01:51:43.010 --> 01:51:47.229
it's a big book. I don't know why I know that,
01:51:47.350 --> 01:51:49.789
but I've known that because... But is it supposed
01:51:49.789 --> 01:51:52.529
to have secrets or is it just a big book? Any
01:51:52.529 --> 01:51:56.850
big book. It can be a tome. But this tome does
01:51:56.850 --> 01:51:59.130
have secrets because in the voiceover at the
01:51:59.130 --> 01:52:03.449
beginning, it says that the book contains everything
01:52:03.449 --> 01:52:06.750
that has ever been forgotten or something like
01:52:06.750 --> 01:52:10.279
that. Which is maybe less ambiguous than what
01:52:10.279 --> 01:52:13.779
the show turned out to be. Yes, that idea ended
01:52:13.779 --> 01:52:16.260
up getting scrapped when they... put the show
01:52:16.260 --> 01:52:18.760
together as a mini series but you see so much
01:52:18.760 --> 01:52:21.659
of the flavor of the show that came afterwards
01:52:21.659 --> 01:52:26.079
in this yeah he had a lot of the ideas already
01:52:26.079 --> 01:52:30.479
that it morphed into but yeah like i said he
01:52:30.479 --> 01:52:33.720
started with a series pitch and they at the time
01:52:33.720 --> 01:52:36.859
like the stuff that i learned in this podcast
01:52:36.859 --> 01:52:40.479
at the time they were cartoon network was trying
01:52:40.479 --> 01:52:44.050
to put together a film division because I think
01:52:44.050 --> 01:52:47.949
they do do some made for TV movies but I think
01:52:47.949 --> 01:52:50.630
it's probably the same mostly the same teams
01:52:50.630 --> 01:52:52.210
that work on the shows that put those together
01:52:52.210 --> 01:52:55.109
but I think they were trying to start an actual
01:52:55.109 --> 01:52:57.750
film division and that ended up never happening
01:52:57.750 --> 01:53:00.289
but they wanted him to rework this into a film
01:53:00.289 --> 01:53:03.970
but he was like this is too episodic I don't
01:53:03.970 --> 01:53:07.250
think I can and then he ended up moving on to
01:53:07.250 --> 01:53:10.470
work on Adventure Time and then After he'd been
01:53:10.470 --> 01:53:12.250
there for a few years, they asked him to do another
01:53:12.250 --> 01:53:17.130
pitch, and he pitched this again, but as a miniseries,
01:53:17.130 --> 01:53:19.949
which they didn't make miniseries at that time.
01:53:20.569 --> 01:53:25.149
And they liked the idea. It's kind of perfect
01:53:25.149 --> 01:53:28.930
as a miniseries. It is, yeah. So they greenlit
01:53:28.930 --> 01:53:31.829
the pilot, and they made this first before they
01:53:31.829 --> 01:53:34.829
started work on the actual series. This was like
01:53:34.829 --> 01:53:38.550
the proof of concept. They liked this pilot enough
01:53:38.550 --> 01:53:43.569
to make the series. And why wouldn't they? But
01:53:43.569 --> 01:53:46.810
kudos to them because it is different. Yeah.
01:53:46.970 --> 01:53:50.529
It's very different. It's very, the charm is
01:53:50.529 --> 01:53:57.590
already there. And maybe the flavor of the humor
01:53:57.590 --> 01:54:04.970
is already there. But thank you for doing something
01:54:04.970 --> 01:54:10.680
different like this. Yeah. But this short has
01:54:10.680 --> 01:54:14.840
the same cast. Elijah Wood is still Wirt. I kind
01:54:14.840 --> 01:54:16.460
of figured when we started watching, I was like,
01:54:16.500 --> 01:54:17.960
it's probably going to be a different cast. Because
01:54:17.960 --> 01:54:22.119
a lot of times when studios make a pilot, they
01:54:22.119 --> 01:54:25.359
just have like a temporary voice track. And they
01:54:25.359 --> 01:54:28.039
get like other people that they know or people
01:54:28.039 --> 01:54:29.880
that work in the studio to just do temporary
01:54:29.880 --> 01:54:32.460
voices. Was the bird the same voice though? No.
01:54:32.520 --> 01:54:35.399
Okay. That was the one big difference. The bird
01:54:35.399 --> 01:54:38.689
and the short. was voiced by natasha leggero
01:54:38.689 --> 01:54:41.569
and melanie linsky is who did her voice in the
01:54:41.569 --> 01:54:43.609
show and i could tell right away that the voice
01:54:43.609 --> 01:54:45.609
was different because they're very different
01:54:45.609 --> 01:54:48.630
voices but that's the that's the only big difference
01:54:48.630 --> 01:54:50.850
the other two characters were the same and then
01:54:50.850 --> 01:54:53.270
the other character that was in was a totally
01:54:53.270 --> 01:54:55.210
new character who wasn't in this it was probably
01:54:55.210 --> 01:54:57.670
helpful to have that little boy's voice on there
01:54:59.039 --> 01:55:03.060
i love his voice he is so great remind me his
01:55:03.060 --> 01:55:06.880
name again colin dean i believe because i didn't
01:55:06.880 --> 01:55:09.899
write that down that sounds right and yeah he
01:55:09.899 --> 01:55:15.199
was just so adorable in the series and of course
01:55:15.199 --> 01:55:19.899
is adorable and charming in the pilot he's probably
01:55:19.899 --> 01:55:23.560
in middle school or high school now probably
01:55:23.560 --> 01:55:28.300
time flies when Either way, whether you're having
01:55:28.300 --> 01:55:32.199
fun or not. I mean, like, there's so many times
01:55:32.199 --> 01:55:34.380
where it's like, oh, I remember that kid from
01:55:34.380 --> 01:55:37.039
that thing. And then you look up, oh, they're
01:55:37.039 --> 01:55:46.069
an adult now. With twins now. And a beard. He's
01:55:46.069 --> 01:55:48.510
probably not that old, but he's probably at least
01:55:48.510 --> 01:55:50.350
a teenager. He's probably getting a little shadow
01:55:50.350 --> 01:55:51.829
on the upper lip or something. I don't know.
01:55:53.460 --> 01:55:56.819
Anyway. I don't know if I mentioned this in the
01:55:56.819 --> 01:55:59.920
original. But this is something else that I heard
01:55:59.920 --> 01:56:02.960
on the podcast when he was talking about why
01:56:02.960 --> 01:56:05.380
they got Elijah Wood. They were auditioning so
01:56:05.380 --> 01:56:08.159
many people and nobody seemed right. And he was
01:56:08.159 --> 01:56:10.619
trying to explain to the casting director what
01:56:10.619 --> 01:56:14.239
he wanted. And he was like, like an Elijah Wood
01:56:14.239 --> 01:56:17.979
type voice. And the casting director said to
01:56:17.979 --> 01:56:20.600
him, like, well, why don't we just ask Elijah
01:56:20.600 --> 01:56:28.130
Wood? He asked her like, we can do that. Are
01:56:28.130 --> 01:56:31.529
we fancy enough to ask Elijah Wood to do that?
01:56:31.989 --> 01:56:37.670
And Elijah Wood really loved this show. Yeah.
01:56:37.670 --> 01:56:43.119
So it worked out. Yeah. Cool. Yeah, that sounds
01:56:43.119 --> 01:56:45.939
like a type of reaction that one of us might
01:56:45.939 --> 01:56:47.840
have. Like, really? We're going to reach for
01:56:47.840 --> 01:56:54.909
the moon on this? Yeah, I love that. But yeah,
01:56:54.989 --> 01:56:58.369
the point of the short is they're wandering through
01:56:58.369 --> 01:57:00.710
the woods looking for the tome of the unknown.
01:57:01.050 --> 01:57:04.949
And you end up in this lovely, charming garden
01:57:04.949 --> 01:57:08.729
with a vegetable car, a vegetable man, and a
01:57:08.729 --> 01:57:11.930
cat that is crying over the singing of the vegetable
01:57:11.930 --> 01:57:14.350
man. I was wondering what was up with that cat.
01:57:14.409 --> 01:57:17.109
Why is he so sad? I think it was just because
01:57:17.109 --> 01:57:21.619
the song was sad. Okay. I loved how they got
01:57:21.619 --> 01:57:24.920
there, because Greg, the younger brother, he
01:57:24.920 --> 01:57:28.399
wants to find a goose for them to ride, because
01:57:28.399 --> 01:57:31.119
they're walking for so long, and then he disappears,
01:57:31.460 --> 01:57:34.859
and then you hear screaming, and Wirt runs to
01:57:34.859 --> 01:57:38.340
find him, and he's screaming because he found
01:57:38.340 --> 01:57:40.640
a bunch of vegetables shaped like a car, and
01:57:40.640 --> 01:57:43.220
he says, we're one step closer to finding a goose!
01:57:46.220 --> 01:57:48.180
I don't know where he got that from finding a
01:57:48.180 --> 01:57:52.279
vegetable garden, but I love the way his strange
01:57:52.279 --> 01:57:58.500
little mind works. Cute. One of the things that's
01:57:58.500 --> 01:58:01.800
fun about this short is that when you listen
01:58:01.800 --> 01:58:04.659
to the soundtrack for Over the Garden Wall...
01:58:04.859 --> 01:58:07.739
You're going to hear songs that weren't in the
01:58:07.739 --> 01:58:11.039
series, and a couple of them are in this short.
01:58:11.279 --> 01:58:13.760
Now, also in the soundtrack, I don't think that
01:58:13.760 --> 01:58:18.899
you have the accompaniment on the one song. I
01:58:18.899 --> 01:58:21.800
think both of them are just the one guy singing.
01:58:22.220 --> 01:58:25.640
But when you watch this, you'll probably recognize,
01:58:26.000 --> 01:58:31.359
like, oh, that's where that's from. And the era
01:58:31.359 --> 01:58:34.949
that they... basically set this pilot in his
01:58:34.949 --> 01:58:41.539
early 1900s from the style of his, oh, I think
01:58:41.539 --> 01:58:43.819
his little necktie and his hat and just the way
01:58:43.819 --> 01:58:49.699
everybody was done up and the era of the music
01:58:49.699 --> 01:58:55.470
to, I'm not sure this song that he sings in the
01:58:55.470 --> 01:58:58.670
garden is probably an old song that has slipped
01:58:58.670 --> 01:59:01.350
through the cracks for me and I don't know when
01:59:01.350 --> 01:59:04.979
it's from. But later on, he sings Shine on Harvest
01:59:04.979 --> 01:59:08.880
Moon. And that's what I even recognize. So that's
01:59:08.880 --> 01:59:11.800
right. More famous. Right. So just think of that
01:59:11.800 --> 01:59:17.640
era. And his name is John Crops. And he's such
01:59:17.640 --> 01:59:22.949
a cute character that's just humble and kind
01:59:22.949 --> 01:59:26.130
of lonely with like. to have somebody in his
01:59:26.130 --> 01:59:29.329
life and so they head off to the big city together
01:59:29.329 --> 01:59:34.590
which is not a big city it's more like a hamlet
01:59:34.590 --> 01:59:37.909
of i don't know it was a gazebo with a barn nearby
01:59:37.909 --> 01:59:41.369
yeah and and some of the community had gathered
01:59:41.369 --> 01:59:45.829
for music and dancing and a potato man was drinking
01:59:45.829 --> 01:59:50.029
out of a a watering can but it was like it was
01:59:50.029 --> 01:59:55.109
a flask because he was hiding it yes I do want
01:59:55.109 --> 01:59:57.970
to mention one other thing. One of my other favorite
01:59:57.970 --> 02:00:01.789
lines. Go ahead. When they're riding towards
02:00:01.789 --> 02:00:06.090
the big city, Wirt asks John Crops, do you have,
02:00:06.090 --> 02:00:09.649
like, internal organs? Well, I don't rightly
02:00:09.649 --> 02:00:12.810
know. And then what is he like in the front?
02:00:12.909 --> 02:00:18.729
Oh, okay. Like, let's just drop this. Not going
02:00:18.729 --> 02:00:23.939
to cut open your melon body and find out. Oh,
02:00:23.979 --> 02:00:27.739
we didn't even say the name, C .W. Stoneking.
02:00:28.779 --> 02:00:32.779
Yes, John Crops is voiced by C .W. Stoneking,
02:00:32.979 --> 02:00:35.739
who, this is his only acting credit, apparently.
02:00:35.819 --> 02:00:40.399
He's actually an Australian blues artist. Which
02:00:40.399 --> 02:00:44.300
I'm thinking is not the only... person they sourced
02:00:44.300 --> 02:00:46.899
who wasn't who didn't do this for a living but
02:00:46.899 --> 02:00:50.819
was basically a music genre that called yeah
02:00:50.819 --> 02:00:55.060
in the series later they also have a lot of musicians
02:00:55.060 --> 02:01:00.319
do voices not just voice actors and celebrities
02:01:00.510 --> 02:01:06.020
and why not so kudos to them for that too and
02:01:08.199 --> 02:01:10.159
I mean, we probably shouldn't give away all the
02:01:10.159 --> 02:01:11.800
details because people need to go watch this
02:01:11.800 --> 02:01:18.960
nine minute blip. But in the end, after the crows
02:01:18.960 --> 02:01:22.000
have and the turkeys have descended and been
02:01:22.000 --> 02:01:26.220
scared away after a whole debacle with a scarecrow.
02:01:27.340 --> 02:01:31.060
The scarecrow apparently is all that is keeping
02:01:31.060 --> 02:01:33.159
these people safe from being attacked by birds.
02:01:33.579 --> 02:01:37.039
Because as soon as the scarecrow is gone. the
02:01:37.039 --> 02:01:41.159
birds descend. But John Crofts is so busy singing
02:01:41.159 --> 02:01:44.000
to the crowd and singing with a beautiful cabbage
02:01:44.000 --> 02:01:46.800
lady that he doesn't care about the chaos around
02:01:46.800 --> 02:01:50.079
him. I have to mention one of my favorite lines
02:01:50.079 --> 02:01:53.760
was when the turkeys come out of the... Beatrice
02:01:53.760 --> 02:01:56.199
screams, punch it in the face! And Wart says,
02:01:56.380 --> 02:01:59.619
oh, heck no, and drives away. Just as delivery
02:01:59.619 --> 02:02:04.020
on that line, oh, heck no. The way most people
02:02:04.020 --> 02:02:06.300
would feel in that situation, probably. Like,
02:02:06.319 --> 02:02:13.340
let's just go. Let's go. And so there, the boys
02:02:13.340 --> 02:02:17.239
and Beatrice are getting away from this chaos.
02:02:18.829 --> 02:02:21.409
And next thing you know, the birds are attacking
02:02:21.409 --> 02:02:26.369
the vehicle. And an alligator. And Gregory. I
02:02:26.369 --> 02:02:28.189
don't know what was up with that, but why not?
02:02:28.689 --> 02:02:30.630
Gregory runs off, and next thing you know, you
02:02:30.630 --> 02:02:33.470
have the screaming all over again, and so they're
02:02:33.470 --> 02:02:36.189
hurrying, trying to find out what's wrong, and
02:02:36.189 --> 02:02:39.710
he's found a beautiful giant goose with a ribbon
02:02:39.710 --> 02:02:42.510
around its neck, perfect for a fairy tale. It
02:02:42.510 --> 02:02:44.569
looked like one of those geese that was, like,
02:02:44.569 --> 02:02:47.250
super popular in the 80s. How much you want to
02:02:47.250 --> 02:02:49.329
bet it was, like, some throwback to his childhood?
02:02:49.569 --> 02:02:52.010
Probably, because I can't imagine he's that much
02:02:52.010 --> 02:02:55.350
older than we are. Why not? Why not? Like we
02:02:55.350 --> 02:02:58.350
even had that pattern on like a little, it probably
02:02:58.350 --> 02:03:00.210
wasn't a shot glass, but it was about the size
02:03:00.210 --> 02:03:02.449
of a shot glass. I used it as like a little juice
02:03:02.449 --> 02:03:05.250
glass when I was a kid. It was like that specific
02:03:05.250 --> 02:03:08.569
goose with that ribbon. And sometimes the hat
02:03:08.569 --> 02:03:10.850
is very recognizable. It's a beautiful goose.
02:03:10.869 --> 02:03:13.689
It's probably nicer than about any goose that
02:03:13.689 --> 02:03:19.100
exists in real life. I don't know. So. They're
02:03:19.100 --> 02:03:21.539
going to go off and continue their journey. And
02:03:21.539 --> 02:03:24.159
John Crops goes back to the country with his
02:03:24.159 --> 02:03:27.859
newfound love. And one of my favorite, favorite
02:03:27.859 --> 02:03:33.159
parts is he holds his hat in front of them and
02:03:33.159 --> 02:03:36.979
gets a little kiss. And I think both the cabbage
02:03:36.979 --> 02:03:39.979
lady and the cat who was on her lap are blushing.
02:03:39.979 --> 02:03:47.439
And it's so cute and innocent and sweet. If you're
02:03:47.439 --> 02:03:50.359
a fan of Over the Garden Wall, check out the
02:03:50.359 --> 02:03:54.880
pilot. It's basically the shot over the bow of
02:03:54.880 --> 02:03:58.060
something good is coming. Yeah. And it's good
02:03:58.060 --> 02:04:00.640
on its own, too. Sometimes you'll get a pilot
02:04:00.640 --> 02:04:03.699
that you can tell that it has good ideas, but
02:04:03.699 --> 02:04:07.079
it's not that standalone. Like, you kind of need
02:04:07.079 --> 02:04:11.079
more. And while this, you want more, it is a
02:04:11.079 --> 02:04:14.260
good little short by itself. So fix the cup of
02:04:14.260 --> 02:04:18.199
hot chocolate or cider on... this fall or winter
02:04:18.199 --> 02:04:21.340
day whenever you happen to be watching it and
02:04:21.340 --> 02:04:24.560
check out the pilot for over the garden wall
02:04:24.560 --> 02:04:27.239
it's on youtube it's not like you have to do
02:04:27.239 --> 02:04:30.140
anything special to find it tome of the unknown
02:04:30.140 --> 02:04:37.720
thanks for listening to every version ever if
02:04:37.720 --> 02:04:39.560
you enjoyed this episode make sure to subscribe
02:04:39.560 --> 02:04:42.279
and follow my co -hosts as well all of our links
02:04:42.279 --> 02:04:44.340
will be in the description below if you'd like
02:04:44.340 --> 02:04:46.460
more podcasts like this one all of our shows
02:04:46.460 --> 02:04:48.760
are available on youtube as well as most podcast
02:04:48.760 --> 02:04:51.199
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02:04:51.260 --> 02:04:53.920
check out JohnCastMedia on Patreon for everything
02:04:53.920 --> 02:04:56.520
here, plus bonus and extended episodes you won't
02:04:56.520 --> 02:04:58.819
find anywhere else. We'll be back soon with another
02:04:58.819 --> 02:05:01.039
brand new episode, so thanks for listening, and
02:05:01.039 --> 02:05:01.920
we'll see you next time.