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00:00:49.960Hi everyone, welcome to this week's episode of Epic Entrepreneurs.
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00:00:58.280I am Cliff McCray with Action Coach Business Growth Partners, where we work with local business owners who turn big ideas into real scalable growth.
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00:01:01.880Today I'm excited to be joined by Rich Cock uh Rich Coke.
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00:01:02.439I'm sorry.
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00:01:03.880Let me do that again.
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00:01:05.479I knew I was gonna do that.
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00:01:06.520I knew I was gonna do that.
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00:01:07.640All right, let me do it again.
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00:01:08.280Let me do it again.
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00:01:09.159All right, give me a second.
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00:01:10.359I'm gonna put some dead air.
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00:01:11.640Make a note.
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00:01:13.000Cook.
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00:01:14.920Cook, yeah.
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00:01:21.960Today I'm excited to be joined by Rich Cook with Kocon Construction.
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00:01:23.400Rich, how are you doing today?
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00:01:24.200I'm doing well.
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00:01:25.159How about yourself?
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00:01:26.759Yeah, I'm doing great, man.
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00:01:28.359Hey, I'm really, really doing great.
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00:01:32.039Really excited to have you on and learn more about uh Kokon construction.
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00:01:34.439So, yeah, man, if you don't mind, let's go ahead and jump right into it.
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00:01:35.719Yeah, sounds great, man.
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00:01:36.280Thanks.
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00:01:37.000All right.
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00:01:40.439So, you know, kind of tell me a little bit about what you got going on.
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00:01:43.319You know, what's Kocon Construction and what do you provide for the community?
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00:01:48.680So, Kokon Construction, we are a remodeling and renovation company.
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00:01:55.159As we speak now, we're progressing into building and development in the upcoming years.
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00:02:07.000So we provide high-end carpentry and remodeling down to trim work, fine details, helping, you know, plan a whole build or additions to houses and whatnot.
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00:02:09.879So that we're we're kind of in the market.
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00:02:12.759Like I said, we I just got my building license and whatnot.
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00:02:16.680So we're gonna start progressing into doing full development and builds.
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00:02:21.560So as of now, we're kind of in our niche for the remodel and renovation side right now.
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00:02:22.039Okay.
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00:02:23.879And who is Rich Cook as a person?
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00:02:25.319What do you got going on in your personal life?
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00:02:26.599Any hobbies or anything?
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00:02:28.599I'm a big sports fanatic.
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00:02:30.919I guess my hobbies now are my kids.
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00:02:32.120My kids are my life.
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00:02:37.240I coach baseball, my son's baseball team, my daughter, she's in the gymnastics and everything.
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00:02:40.040So my hobbies now are more consumed with my kids.
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00:02:41.480I do like to golf occasionally.
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00:02:49.800I don't get to do it as much as I like, but I'd say between the kids and golf and you know, family trips and vacations, that's kind of what I live for nowadays.
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00:02:52.360Hey, good deal, good deal.
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00:02:55.480Now, kind of get into it, and you know, kind of your business a little bit, you know.
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00:03:02.120Rich, you have been you have more than 15 years into trades and launch COCON in you know, 2019, was it right?
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00:03:03.800Yep, yep, that's correct.
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00:03:04.439Yeah.
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00:03:09.560So what finally made you decide to build the company under your your own name and standards?
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00:03:11.640So it was a long time coming.
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00:03:24.760I always wanted to be a business owner, but I had been working with companies and didn't see much like, you know, growth within the companies and was kind of you know doing a lot of the manual labor for people that were never on site.
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00:03:29.319And I was like, took took to myself to like, you know, I could run these jobs and and do it.
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00:03:34.920And so, you know, my when my fiance got pregnant was when I was like, you know what, it's either now or never.
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00:03:36.120Let's take the leap of faith.
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00:03:38.200So I was like, I'm gonna try my hand.
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00:03:39.560So jumped off.
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00:03:41.879I got my you know business license and everything.
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00:03:51.640I was kind of, you know, at the bottom of the total pole trying to figure out how I'm gonna get all this work and come in since I just like turned out, like walked away from my other jobs.
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00:03:54.840And then of course, like COVID hit right, right when it happened.
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00:04:02.920So that was a really nerve-wracking time, but it was actually a blessing in disguise because we were essential employees at the time.
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00:04:09.640So it actually helped my helped me launch the business, and and we've been taking off ever since COVID.
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00:04:11.319Nice, nice.
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00:04:13.879That's a nice redemption story there, especially with COVID.
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00:04:15.800COVID was you know very negative, obviously.
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00:04:18.439So that's cool that you made something positive out of it.
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00:04:19.079You know.
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00:04:25.240So, Rich, what type of project best represents what Coca Conn does at its highest level, would you say?
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00:04:41.079I would say custom carpentry, like you know, for we love doing woodwork and things, cabinetry, uh, really converting people's houses and giving them the top-notch quality and craftsmanship they're looking for.
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00:04:46.120You know, a lot of people struggle with finding the right people or people cutting corners and whatnot.
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00:04:59.879And we take a lot of pride and doing it the right way and you know, planning from the start to finish with the designers and everything to make a project be exactly what a client wants and bring it to life.
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00:05:13.480So, yeah, that my my ideal is really just start to start to finish planning and doing a renovation or bringing whatever needs a client wants to their forever home exactly how they picture it with a smooth transaction.
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00:05:15.319Nice, nice.
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00:05:21.480Now, home remodeling can get emotional because you are inside someone's biggest investment, right?
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00:05:22.120Yes.
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00:05:27.400So, what have you learned about managing expectations as much as managing construction?
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00:05:44.600So I've learned it really communicating and and and having a real expectation on timelines, breaking it down to the simplest form for a client because some people don't understand what goes down on the back end of things or the timing and the planning that goes into it.
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00:05:55.959So I like to bring the customers in and let them experience that and really see how it how it all comes together instead of just I want this, and your expectations are oh, the next day it's gonna happen.
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00:05:57.160Doesn't really work that way.
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00:06:04.600So we we were really thoughtful and try to plan things out accordingly and make everybody understand and all come together on the ideas.
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00:06:13.800That's that's gone a long way for helping, you know, meet the expectations and and clients understanding how what to expect.
00:06:15.639 -->
00:06:20.040Now I know customers often fear delays and surprise costs a lot of times.
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00:06:27.319So how do you think about communication and change orders so customers still trust the process when something unexpected happens?
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00:06:38.600I'd I try, and you know, you can't always be perfect, but I try to be realistic and let those things that could possibly come about be up front with them and then be open.
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00:06:45.000And and you know, you never know if you open up a wall and termites have gotten in there, or you know, you got a leak or something in the wall.
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00:06:47.240Those are just some things you can't expect.
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00:06:51.319So I I try to tell clients to just be open-minded.
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00:06:58.680I try to, you know, explain that this could be this and just leave that option open so that they're not startled when something comes about.
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00:07:02.439And really, I take integrity on doing the right thing.
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00:07:10.199So even if I have to take a loss or or don't make as much money on a job by doing it the right way, I still do it the right way.
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00:07:11.079You know what I mean?
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00:07:16.680Just because they hired they hired me to do the job the right way and they want it done the right way.
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00:07:24.600So regardless if I accounted for that or not, and you know, the expenses there, we we try to make them understand everything up front.
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00:07:32.439And if unforeseeable things come about, we we just we make them understand that uh we're gonna do everything we can to get that right for them.
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00:07:33.079Okay.
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00:07:35.319Now, how often do you see that happen?
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00:07:40.840I mean, it's it's like I said, there's there's unforeseeable things when you start, especially a home remodel.
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00:07:42.120So it's pretty frequent.
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00:07:48.360So we always have that discussion in the contract before signing contracts and everything, that these things can happen.
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00:07:59.639You know, being having the experience that I have in all the trades, it's not as frequent as as you'd expect, but there's always, you know, the unknowing that I can't predict.
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00:08:02.280I don't have x-ray vision, can't see through the wall.
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00:08:06.920So, you know, I really try to, you know, let them open their mind to that.
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00:08:10.360And everybody's been pretty understanding from that sake.
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00:08:17.319But I I'd say it's it's very not not very often that that happens because we try to tackle everything ahead of time.
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00:08:19.400Okay, okay.
00:08:19.959 -->
00:08:26.439Now, I don't know if I told you this, but we have a pretty large, you know, small entrepreneurship audience that listens to the podcast with us every week.
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00:08:30.840So you'll need to be, you know, we're gonna get into now kind of the harder, harder hitting questions here.
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00:08:38.120Uh, because you know, everything's not sunshine and rainbows, you know, everybody kind of wants to hear, you know, kind of the real stuff of what's going on, especially in this economic climate.
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00:08:43.559So, you know, what would you say is the biggest challenge co-construct construction is dealing with right now?
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00:08:57.319Honestly, I'd say the the biggest challenge is employment and having, you know, the good people that want to work and and carry our standard and craftsmanship.
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00:09:01.879I think that's the biggest thing probably with any business is finding the right employees.
00:09:01.959 -->
00:09:11.879And like for me, it was putting the hammer down and having other people run the business for me, like delegating my time where I'm not on site every day.
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00:09:20.359And that that was the hardest thing for me, is because I meet with these clients and they know the expectation or I know their expectations and what I bring to the table.
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00:09:27.479It's trusting your workers and building a good team to see that through for your clients.
00:09:27.719 -->
00:09:32.679So that was the toughest thing, is it just setting, stepping back and putting the tool belt down.
00:09:32.839 -->
00:09:40.359And then on on hindsight, another thing with that is, you know, I always thought running a bit a construction business was swinging a hammer.
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00:09:40.839It's not.
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00:09:47.319You really gotta, you know, it's estimating insurance, you know, subcontractors, scheduling.
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00:09:53.399A lot more comes into it that you, you know, you don't realize when you're first starting it out, and when I did when I was younger.
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00:09:58.359So those are the hurdles that I had to, you know, work through to get where I'm at.
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00:10:04.039But I would say my number one thing is, you know, finding the right people to help you run the business.
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00:10:05.159Yeah, yeah.
00:10:05.399 -->
00:10:07.319And people don't realize how big that is, right?
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00:10:08.439I I hear that a lot.
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00:10:12.039That uh now do you think that's just uh is it a time thing?
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00:10:13.399Is it a generation thing?
00:10:13.559 -->
00:10:15.799What do you think is the issue with finding good employees right now?
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00:10:18.120I think it's uh a little bit of both.
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00:10:22.839I I definitely, I'd hate to say it, the generation now, it's a lot more tech savvy.
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00:10:32.120So people are more prone to being on phones and you know, with AI and everything now, jobs are a little easier and being behind a computer at our desk.
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00:10:39.479There's not many, at least for my trade, that want to be hands-on, you know, in the field doing manual labor.
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00:10:49.079And I feel like that's kind of where we we've kind of blown up and we got we're like a little niche there because not many people want to do it anymore.
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00:10:56.759And we do the quality old school craftsman style of you know, craftsmanship and whatnot, and not many people want to do that anymore.
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00:11:04.199So I I think it's it has to do with the generation and how times are changing, like with the technology and what and whatnot.
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00:11:05.159Yeah, yeah.
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00:11:06.519No, I I totally agree.
00:11:06.599 -->
00:11:13.799And and then not only that, like you said, but I think everybody and everybody wants to be a TikToker or YouTuber, exactly, streamer or something like that.
00:11:13.879 -->
00:11:15.239You know, not everybody's gonna make it from there.
00:11:15.719 -->
00:11:18.919There's only like a select few spots for everybody to to do that.
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00:11:22.599But uh, it seems like all the kids now they want to, you know, you ask them what they want to do when they're kids.
00:11:22.679 -->
00:11:23.719Like, because I got some nephews.
00:11:23.799 -->
00:11:27.159I don't have any kids myself, but I got some nephews, and I ask them, hey, what do you want to be when you grow up?
00:11:27.239 -->
00:11:31.159You know, I used to say when I was a kid, doctor, basketball player, or something like that.
00:11:31.559 -->
00:11:35.559These kids nowadays, oh, I want to be a streamer, I want to be a TikToker, I want to be a YouTuber.
00:11:35.719 -->
00:11:39.079It's like, no, that's gotta have some realistic goals.
00:11:39.719 -->
00:11:41.319Not everybody's gonna be able to do that.
00:11:41.639 -->
00:11:44.439There's only so many spots, so you gotta have a realistic goal.
00:11:44.599 -->
00:11:48.279You know, you can you can actually go to school and become a police officer.
00:11:48.359 -->
00:11:50.759You can actually go to school and become a tradesman.
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00:11:52.199Those are things you can actually do.
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00:11:56.439And I'm not saying you can't be a TikTok or YouTuber, but it's just a lot, it's a lot harder.
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00:11:57.399Exactly.
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00:11:58.439Exactly.
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00:11:59.639Yeah, I agree.
00:12:00.439 -->
00:12:01.479You say you're a big sports guy.
00:12:01.559 -->
00:12:02.359What's your sports team?
00:12:02.919 -->
00:12:05.000Oh man, let's not get started on that.
00:12:05.159 -->
00:12:07.559I'm a big time Raiders fan, unfortunately.
00:12:07.719 -->
00:12:13.239Oh hopefully, hopefully we got some we we've been saying we're rebuilding every year.
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00:12:19.159Hopefully, uh we see that through with our our new quarterback we got, but I don't get hot hopes.
00:12:19.719 -->
00:12:20.759Yeah, Mendoza.
00:12:20.839 -->
00:12:22.519I mean, he looks, you know, he looks all right, you know.
00:12:22.679 -->
00:12:23.559He does, he does.
00:12:23.639 -->
00:12:28.519I think he's gonna be all right, but we got still got some growing pain, growing pains to get over.
00:12:28.599 -->
00:12:33.399I think a couple years from now we might be all right, but uh yeah, not much to cheer for there.
00:12:33.479 -->
00:12:40.679And then, you know, I got my son being a Raiders fan now, and he hasn't got to really cheer for much, so I feel bad for him on that.
00:12:41.399 -->
00:12:53.399But we're big Crosby fans, so he uh he's all about his Max Crosby got jerseys and everything, so yeah, our Raiders haven't given me much pleasure the last over the last decade.
00:12:53.639 -->
00:12:55.639Yeah, at least he got Crosby though.
00:12:55.719 -->
00:12:58.199I mean, you know, I was scared that he was gonna get traded there for a while.
00:12:58.439 -->
00:13:03.639Well, he did, and then he just fell back in our lap, so you know, some things happened for a reason.
00:13:03.959 -->
00:13:06.439Yeah, yeah, because they tried to trade him when they was it to the Ravens?
00:13:06.519 -->
00:13:07.079Was it yeah?
00:13:07.159 -->
00:13:07.799The Ravens, yeah.
00:13:07.879 -->
00:13:11.959They had him, and I guess he failed a physical, and then they they sent him back.
00:13:12.039 -->
00:13:13.559So hey, we're happy to have him.
00:13:13.639 -->
00:13:14.519Don't get me wrong.
00:13:14.759 -->
00:13:16.759Yeah, probably the best player on the team overall.
00:13:17.000 -->
00:13:17.879For sure, for sure.
00:13:18.120 -->
00:13:18.359100%.
00:13:19.399 -->
00:13:19.959Yeah, yeah.
00:13:20.199 -->
00:13:21.559But yeah, kind of getting back into this.
00:13:21.639 -->
00:13:28.439What you know, what is what have you noticed is kind of the recurring frustration that takes more of your time or energy than it should when running your business.
00:13:28.839 -->
00:13:30.599Honestly, man, all the back end work.
00:13:30.679 -->
00:13:39.319I guess it goes back to me wanting to be more hands-on with everything, but uh I I've learned over the last two year or two that like I'm wearing too many hats.
00:13:39.399 -->
00:13:49.239So the frustration is like just all the billing, all the keeping up with the insurances, you know, scheduling and all that.
00:13:49.399 -->
00:13:59.639So, you know, like I say, delegating time and like really uh hiring like assistants and whatnot to step in to do these roles, those would be the been the big biggest frustrations for me.
00:14:00.519 -->
00:14:05.799Now, about how many hours a week are you personally running the business or working on the business right now, would you say?
00:14:06.039 -->
00:14:11.559Um, I would say I mean easily 40 hours a week, if not more.
00:14:11.799 -->
00:14:16.120Just because I like I said, I I run multiple at least four or five jobs a week.
00:14:16.199 -->
00:14:24.759So I'm, you know, constantly meeting with clients, my project managers, you know, doing the back end stuff, you know, the invoicing and all that.
00:14:24.839 -->
00:14:34.599So I still treat it as like a 40, 40-hour a week job, you know, but I do have my freedom to where, you know, I can pull off and be with my kids and do those things.
00:14:34.759 -->
00:14:45.719That was that was that was my big reasoning on starting the business was, you know, I I I didn't grow up with a father figure around and I wanted to be everything to my kids.
00:14:45.959 -->
00:14:47.639My father wasn't, you know.
00:14:47.879 -->
00:14:53.719So to give the financial freedom and time, that's kind of why I started the business.
00:14:53.799 -->
00:14:54.439Yeah.
00:14:54.919 -->
00:15:03.239So I still have that freedom, but I still try to treat it like a for 30 to 40 hour week because my employee, your employees are only as good as you treat them.
00:15:03.319 -->
00:15:10.519And I set high expectations for them and I try to let them know that like I'm not asking you to do anything more than I wouldn't do, you know.
00:15:10.759 -->
00:15:17.479So being out there, being hands-on and showing these guys like this is the right way, just just showing a work ethic, you know.
00:15:17.639 -->
00:15:22.279I feel like that's a big thing for you know a lot of companies, especially in the construction industry.
00:15:22.759 -->
00:15:25.000Yeah, no, I definitely agree with you on that.
00:15:25.239 -->
00:15:35.959Now, you know, and I kind of want you to be a little bit, you know, you gotta be a little bit transparent, a little bit vulnerable here, but you know, because this is kind of a good question to ask, but it's kind of one of those where you're looking from the outside in, right?
00:15:36.519 -->
00:15:39.239So, you know, how many employees do you have working for you right now?
00:15:39.399 -->
00:15:43.000Uh I have six in-house employees currently working for me now.
00:15:43.559 -->
00:15:44.919Six employees, okay.
00:15:45.239 -->
00:15:51.719So, you know, let's kind of let's kind of say that we kind of hypothetically sat down with some of your some of your employees, right?
00:15:51.799 -->
00:15:59.479And we did an anonymous type of survey and we asked them straight up, you know, hey, what do you believe is, you know, Rich's greatest strength as a leader?
00:15:59.799 -->
00:16:01.000What do you think they would say?
00:16:01.799 -->
00:16:03.159I'm a leader of men.
00:16:03.399 -->
00:16:06.839I I treat everybody fairly and evenly.
00:16:07.000 -->
00:16:19.479I don't I don't underestimate any of them, and I think they would truthfully say I'm a leader of men, and that's why they staying behind me and and and do the quality work and work as hard as I do.
00:16:20.599 -->
00:16:21.639Okay, okay.
00:16:21.879 -->
00:16:28.439Now getting into that a little bit more, kind of, you know, I know because then I know what your employees think of you is different than what you actually think.
00:16:28.599 -->
00:16:31.639Then what do you think is your greatest strength as a business owner?
00:16:32.679 -->
00:16:34.199Is it the same or does it change?
00:16:34.599 -->
00:16:47.399I mean, it was it's the same, but I I just think just being genuine and you know, as a business owner, just being a big thing is like communication and how you present yourself.
00:16:47.719 -->
00:16:53.000And I just I carry a high standard on, you know, I don't do a lot of marketing within the business.
00:16:53.079 -->
00:17:00.279I a lot of it's word of mouth, so I try to grow customer relationships and that's what keeps our business thriving.
00:17:00.759 -->
00:17:05.079So I think that communication thing is a big thing for me that I take a lot of pride in.
00:17:05.480 -->
00:17:06.599Okay, okay.
00:17:06.839 -->
00:17:09.079Now we're gonna go to the other end of that spectrum, right?
00:17:09.160 -->
00:17:17.559Let's say if we sat down with your employees and and asked them, you know, what's one leadership or business skill that Rich still needs to try to improve on right now?
00:17:17.799 -->
00:17:19.720What do you think we would hear from them then?
00:17:21.240 -->
00:17:22.680That's a good question.
00:17:23.319 -->
00:17:24.039Nobody's perfect.
00:17:24.519 -->
00:17:26.120Yeah, yeah, nobody's perfect.
00:17:26.200 -->
00:17:40.279I'd say, you know, everybody would say a little bit more on like maybe management side of things because we have so much going on at one time, it's kind of hard to oversee everything.
00:17:40.519 -->
00:17:49.400So I do kind of put a little more on my project manager's, you know, plate to kind of run the jobs a little more smoothly.
00:17:49.640 -->
00:18:00.279But I mean, I honestly, like, like I said, nobody's perfect, but I feel like I do a very good job of accommodating and being realistic, and the expectations aren't too much for these guys to handle.
00:18:00.360 -->
00:18:04.759So, you know, I'd really I'd like to know what that answer would be for my guys, truthfully.
00:18:06.039 -->
00:18:07.320Yeah, no, that's always good.
00:18:07.400 -->
00:18:10.200It's always like, it's like, man, what what what do you think about, you know?
00:18:10.279 -->
00:18:13.000Because, you know, there's I'm sure they're always thinking about something.
00:18:13.080 -->
00:18:14.039I mean, that's just how it is.
00:18:14.120 -->
00:18:15.320Nobody's perfect, like you said.
00:18:15.480 -->
00:18:20.519So so, you know, kind of walk me through your handoff from estimate to production.
00:18:20.840 -->
00:18:25.320Where have you had to create systems so jobs do not live only in your head?
00:18:25.720 -->
00:18:33.799So I actually have so I work uh so a lot of mine, I do a lot of kitchen and bath designing and stuff.
00:18:33.880 -->
00:18:39.799So I have a design team with some of the vendors that I work with and purchase cabinetry or my trim work through.
00:18:39.960 -->
00:18:43.880So I, you know, from the estimate side, I get an estimate together.
00:18:44.039 -->
00:18:55.160I have my clients, I'll pass it over to my team that will draw the through 2D renderings for them so that they can get a visual of things before the project even starts or change anything.
00:18:55.320 -->
00:19:00.519And then from there, you know, I put it in my assistant's lap to communicate.
00:19:00.840 -->
00:19:19.560We have a text system uh House Paul Pro that they will send out text messages to clients, you know, when when our scheduled date is to be there with the plans, and every day with that system, we upload pictures into it, and our clients can get real feedback.
00:19:19.720 -->
00:19:25.000Say if they're not living in the house at the time and they want progress pictures, they get the progress pictures to there.
00:19:25.080 -->
00:19:27.400So it helps keep everything, each job.
00:19:27.720 -->
00:19:30.039Like I said, I run you know multiple jobs weekly.
00:19:30.120 -->
00:19:33.560It helps keep everything organized in that aspect.
00:19:33.880 -->
00:19:35.640Okay, good deal, good deal.
00:19:35.880 -->
00:19:39.720Now let's kind of, you know, where do most of your customers come from right now?
00:19:39.880 -->
00:19:42.519Is it from word of mouth, Google, you know, online ads?
00:19:43.640 -->
00:19:45.560Majority of it is is word of mouth.
00:19:45.640 -->
00:19:54.279That's why I say we we we take a lot of pride in our craftsmanship and making, you know, solid um connections with people in the areas.
00:19:54.519 -->
00:20:01.160We've we've I worked with a lot of realtors, I work with interior designers because we do the high-end trim work.
00:20:01.640 -->
00:20:04.279And then, you know, like I said, the word of mouth.
00:20:04.360 -->
00:20:14.600Like I do have, you know, a website and we upload uh Instagram and Facebook weekly, but there's not many ads we we s we go on.
00:20:14.680 -->
00:20:30.680It's really like the realtors, designers, you know, we got some local builders around the area that we we work for that, you know, when some of their recent clients or something need a need a renovation or a remodel because they don't, because the market's in a crazy position right now with interest rates.
00:20:30.759 -->
00:20:32.920They don't want to buy a new house, they want to remodel.
00:20:33.000 -->
00:20:40.360So they'll send them, you know, my way to you know, uh help them plan that project out and see that through.
00:20:40.440 -->
00:20:42.360But a lot of it is word of mouth.
00:20:42.680 -->
00:20:43.000Yeah.
00:20:43.240 -->
00:20:44.200Okay, okay.
00:20:44.440 -->
00:20:46.680Now let's get into your competitors a little bit here.
00:20:46.759 -->
00:20:49.720You know, let's let's say if I'm talking with a couple of different places, right?
00:20:49.799 -->
00:20:54.519I'm talking with Carlos over here, and I'm talking with Jonathan over at this other company.
00:20:54.759 -->
00:20:59.880Why would uh why would someone want to choose your organization instead of the alternatives available to that?
00:21:00.200 -->
00:21:09.240I would say because we are very thorough, we we we communicate well, you always have a point of contact, whether it's me or one of my project managers.
00:21:09.480 -->
00:21:17.960We give you real up-to-date progression and updates on your project with the app that I was just speaking about.
00:21:18.279 -->
00:21:20.279We have a design team.
00:21:20.519 -->
00:21:25.160We've we've been in the industry for years, we're we're well spoken for.
00:21:26.120 -->
00:21:30.279And I'd say that sets us apart because of the integrity as well.
00:21:31.320 -->
00:21:34.920We just we've we take a lot of pride in doing things the right way.
00:21:35.080 -->
00:21:49.880And like I said earlier, whether if it costs us a little bit more on the back end, it uh it's better to do it right the right way now because it takes a while to build your reputation, but it takes one one bad mistake to ruin it.
00:21:50.200 -->
00:21:52.440Yeah, no, yeah, no doubt about that.
00:21:52.920 -->
00:21:57.480Now, you know, what is your biggest, you know, tell us about the team kind of supporting you today.
00:21:57.560 -->
00:22:03.720You said you have uh six other employees, kind of you know, what what pieces and who are the key people and what responsibilities do they own?
00:22:04.039 -->
00:22:07.160So the key guys, I've got, well, it's it's pretty cool.
00:22:07.240 -->
00:22:08.200My brother works for me.
00:22:08.279 -->
00:22:11.320He's one of my my lead guys, he's one of the project managers.
00:22:11.480 -->
00:22:13.720So that alone has been awesome.
00:22:13.880 -->
00:22:23.160He, you know, he he runs jobs, he coordinates with my subcontractors, keeps them on schedule, just kind of keeps my jobs running smooth.
00:22:23.400 -->
00:22:26.440My fiance works in office to help with the schedule.
00:22:26.840 -->
00:22:32.279Scheduling, keep everything organized, does some of the billing, helps with estimating and whatnot.
00:22:32.519 -->
00:22:35.560Another employee is Chad, he's been my lead guy.
00:22:35.720 -->
00:22:40.039He he he actually got on with me the month after I started my business.
00:22:40.200 -->
00:22:42.279And he, I mean, he's been amazing.
00:22:42.360 -->
00:22:44.440He he's another project manager.
00:22:44.600 -->
00:22:54.519So he kind of does a lot of things that Trevor does, helps, you know, keep keep the project moving around along on schedule, coordinating the subcontractors and whatnot.
00:22:54.680 -->
00:22:56.600And then, you know, I've got Aaron.
00:22:56.680 -->
00:22:58.440He's been with me for Aaron Cheeks.
00:22:58.600 -->
00:23:01.080He's been with me for going on four years now.
00:23:01.240 -->
00:23:05.960And he's another one of my lead guys that, you know, helps helps run the job smoothly.
00:23:06.120 -->
00:23:11.960So those are the three top project managers and my fiance that help keep everything flowing.
00:23:12.360 -->
00:23:13.160Nice, nice.
00:23:13.320 -->
00:23:14.440That's awesome.
00:23:14.759 -->
00:23:18.120Now, uh, and now we're gonna go ahead and head into what's called the this or that round.
00:23:18.200 -->
00:23:20.680Uh, so how this works is I'm gonna give you this or that.
00:23:20.759 -->
00:23:24.039And I want you to choose one of them and then kind of give me the reason why you chose it.
00:23:24.120 -->
00:23:29.720It's kind of kind of a breakaway from all the business talk here to get somebody into your personal personal life a little bit.
00:23:30.120 -->
00:23:30.759All right.
00:23:31.480 -->
00:23:34.360So, mountains or beach and why?
00:23:34.759 -->
00:23:35.400Beach.
00:23:35.799 -->
00:23:38.120I've I've always lived in the beach area.
00:23:38.200 -->
00:23:44.200There's nothing better than going and chilling on a beach on a nice hot day, having a nice drink, you know.
00:23:44.440 -->
00:23:47.960I used to like skin boarding and and surfing a little bit.
00:23:48.120 -->
00:23:49.799Can't beat a beach day.
00:23:50.440 -->
00:23:50.759Okay.
00:23:51.320 -->
00:23:52.759Early bird or not out?
00:23:53.640 -->
00:23:54.920I'm an early bird.
00:23:55.080 -->
00:23:56.200I'm an early bird.
00:23:56.440 -->
00:23:58.200Feel like the early bird gets the worm.
00:23:58.360 -->
00:23:59.400I was the first one up.
00:23:59.480 -->
00:24:05.240I I tackle half of my on my task before some people wake up every morning.
00:24:05.320 -->
00:24:09.160So I just feel like I'm ahead of the head of the curve every morning, every day.
00:24:09.480 -->
00:24:09.799Okay.
00:24:10.759 -->
00:24:12.519Cook at home or eat out?
00:24:13.000 -->
00:24:14.120Ooh, ooh.
00:24:14.360 -->
00:24:15.960I'm a I'm an eat out guy.
00:24:16.039 -->
00:24:17.000I'm not a great cook.
00:24:17.160 -->
00:24:21.480My fiance is a is an amazing cook, but we're on the go so much.
00:24:21.640 -->
00:24:27.160And with two kids and our work schedules and whatnot, I'm a more uh eat out type of guy.
00:24:27.480 -->
00:24:29.480Yeah, I got too much going on right now.
00:24:30.360 -->
00:24:31.960Spend it or saving?
00:24:32.600 -->
00:24:33.320Saving.
00:24:33.480 -->
00:24:34.680I'm big on saving.
00:24:34.759 -->
00:24:36.279I always like to have a fallback.
00:24:36.360 -->
00:24:40.200You never know what can happen, so I always like to have a reserve there.
00:24:40.840 -->
00:24:41.240Nice.
00:24:41.400 -->
00:24:41.880I like that.
00:24:41.960 -->
00:24:42.840I agree.
00:24:43.480 -->
00:24:44.840Netflix or YouTube?
00:24:46.680 -->
00:24:48.120I'm a Netflix guy.
00:24:48.200 -->
00:24:49.720Now, my son would hate me saying that.
00:24:49.799 -->
00:24:52.039He's all about YouTube, but I I go Netflix.
00:24:52.120 -->
00:24:54.360I like to get into documentaries and shows.
00:24:54.600 -->
00:24:57.400And so yeah, I definitely go Netflix on that one.
00:24:58.039 -->
00:24:59.240Okay, okay.
00:24:59.799 -->
00:25:02.680Have a personal chef or a high or a housekeeper?
00:25:04.680 -->
00:25:05.799Personal chef.
00:25:06.039 -->
00:25:06.680Personal chef.
00:25:06.840 -->
00:25:10.759Like I said, I don't cook, so if I could have somebody cooking for me, I could eat at home more.
00:25:11.799 -->
00:25:14.279He's like, I wouldn't go out so much if I had somebody cook it for me.
00:25:15.480 -->
00:25:17.000That's basically what you're paying out for, right?
00:25:17.080 -->
00:25:18.039You pay for somebody to cook it for.
00:25:18.279 -->
00:25:18.440Yeah.
00:25:20.519 -->
00:25:22.840Dream home or dream vacation?
00:25:25.000 -->
00:25:25.880Dream home.
00:25:26.039 -->
00:25:26.920Dream home.
00:25:27.080 -->
00:25:27.560Yeah.
00:25:27.799 -->
00:25:32.360Just because you can always go on a vacation and you plan if you save enough.
00:25:32.519 -->
00:25:35.240Now dream home is a once in a lifetime thing.
00:25:35.560 -->
00:25:35.799Yeah.
00:25:36.600 -->
00:25:37.320That's very true.
00:25:37.480 -->
00:25:38.680Very, very true.
00:25:39.480 -->
00:25:42.120Would you like to, let's see how I can put this.
00:25:42.360 -->
00:25:49.320Would you rather live a would you rather have dinner with your future self or relive a great day from your past?
00:25:52.600 -->
00:25:54.200I would say future self.
00:25:54.600 -->
00:25:55.480Future self.
00:25:56.039 -->
00:25:59.080Future self is probably gonna be a little more knowledgeable than I am now.
00:25:59.160 -->
00:26:01.560I've probably learned a lot from that from that person.
00:26:02.200 -->
00:26:04.519So yeah, I'd I'd go with future self.
00:26:05.480 -->
00:26:06.759Okay, okay.
00:26:07.480 -->
00:26:10.920And uh give up your phone for a month or give up TV for a year?
00:26:14.759 -->
00:26:16.600Give up phone for a month.
00:26:16.840 -->
00:26:20.759You know, my phone never stops, so it would be nice to have a breather from that.
00:26:20.840 -->
00:26:26.920And the distraction from scrolling on social media and all that would be nice.
00:26:27.320 -->
00:26:29.080Yeah, I agree.
00:26:29.400 -->
00:26:32.039Unlimited money or unlimited vacation time?
00:26:32.920 -->
00:26:36.039Unlimited money, because then you can do all the vacations you want.
00:26:36.680 -->
00:26:39.080Yeah, that's I mean, that's pretty easy.
00:26:39.400 -->
00:26:42.920Would you rather hire for experience or hire for attitude?
00:26:43.160 -->
00:26:44.200It's always a good one.
00:26:44.360 -->
00:26:45.640Ooh, that's a good one.
00:26:45.799 -->
00:26:47.000That's a good one.
00:26:49.640 -->
00:26:58.200Ooh, you know, experience is always great, but I feel like a good attitude, I can I I'm a very coachable person, and if you have a good attitude, you'd be willing to learn.
00:26:58.279 -->
00:27:02.120And you know, that I feel like that trait would go a lot a long way.
00:27:03.640 -->
00:27:09.560Yeah, and and plus if I can't, if I don't, if I can't stand working with you, then it's not gonna work out.
00:27:09.640 -->
00:27:10.840Yeah, it's not gonna work out.
00:27:11.000 -->
00:27:21.720So I I I brought on people with experience, and some people just, you know, I have a certain way about going about things, and they have certain ways, and sometimes we just don't click, it doesn't work out sometimes, you know.
00:27:21.960 -->
00:27:22.920Yep, yeah, yep.
00:27:23.000 -->
00:27:30.840And then yeah, I've been in that too, where you just you, you know, they're very good at what they do, they're amazing at what they do, but then I I have to stand on pins and needles when I go talk to you.
00:27:31.000 -->
00:27:34.440Exactly because you know, you got this attitude or you got this, you know, whatever.
00:27:34.759 -->
00:27:49.400I feel like I'm coming at you wrong by telling you a different way to do something, and it's you know, so yeah, I I definitely attitude would be a big one because I feel like if you have a good attitude, you'd be willing to learn, you'd be coachable, and and and we would we'd be able to get you the experience as needed.
00:27:49.640 -->
00:27:50.279Yeah.
00:27:50.600 -->
00:27:52.600Grow fast or grow steady?
00:27:53.320 -->
00:27:54.759I'm a grow steady guy.
00:27:54.840 -->
00:28:02.840You don't want to grow too fast because you know, if you don't have the right infrastructure for five jobs, then you definitely won't for 15.
00:28:03.000 -->
00:28:10.600So I think grow steady, grow a good structure and foundation, and that that's the that's the key to a successful business.
00:28:10.920 -->
00:28:12.519Yeah, totally agree.
00:28:13.400 -->
00:28:15.560Take the risk or play it safe?
00:28:16.360 -->
00:28:17.960I'm a I'm a risk guy.
00:28:18.039 -->
00:28:19.320I'm a I'm a risk guy.
00:28:19.640 -->
00:28:21.000You gotta risk it for the biscuit.
00:28:21.080 -->
00:28:22.279You never know unless you try.
00:28:22.360 -->
00:28:30.039You know, I I I am conservative, I play play, play ball safely, but I probably wouldn't be in the position I'm at now if I didn't take a risk.
00:28:30.279 -->
00:28:36.360So let's see here, and work from home or work from the office?
00:28:40.840 -->
00:28:44.279I'd have to say office because too many distractions at home.
00:28:44.680 -->
00:28:46.360Office is a busy work together.
00:28:48.279 -->
00:28:51.560And build a huge company or build one that runs without you?
00:28:52.200 -->
00:28:53.240That's the last one.
00:28:56.120 -->
00:28:58.920Build one that ha, that's a tough one.
00:28:59.240 -->
00:29:04.120I like to be hands-on, but I would say build one that runs without me.
00:29:04.360 -->
00:29:04.600Okay.
00:29:04.759 -->
00:29:06.840And why do you and why would you choose that?
00:29:07.320 -->
00:29:14.759Because if you can build a successful business that doesn't require all your attention, you have more free time or other opportunities to start another business.
00:29:16.200 -->
00:29:22.039So yeah, I I I'd and more more freedom with my family, uh I'd say.
00:29:22.279 -->
00:29:22.680Yeah.
00:29:23.560 -->
00:29:24.360Yeah, that's true.
00:29:24.519 -->
00:29:25.000That's true.
00:29:25.160 -->
00:29:29.480And that and those are times that you that you definitely want, you know, because you can't get those days back, right?
00:29:29.640 -->
00:29:29.880Exactly.
00:29:30.120 -->
00:29:33.400I don't think I don't think anybody ever said on their deathbed, hey man, I wish I worked a lot more.
00:29:34.279 -->
00:29:34.680Exactly.
00:29:35.000 -->
00:29:35.240Exactly.
00:29:35.480 -->
00:29:41.000They always say they always, it's always, you know, I wish I spent more time with this person or spent more time with this person, so on and so forth.
00:29:41.160 -->
00:29:42.039So yeah, man.
00:29:42.120 -->
00:29:43.880So all right, I appreciate that, this or that.
00:29:44.039 -->
00:29:46.279So, you know, a couple last things here, you know.
00:29:46.440 -->
00:29:53.400So what would you say kind of is your, you know, limits growth more for a contractor like Cochon right now?
00:29:53.560 -->
00:30:01.000You know, would it be qualified labor, lead quality, estimating quality, uh capacity, cash flow, or project management?
00:30:01.320 -->
00:30:09.160I would say, hmm, I would say uh more skilled labor, honestly.
00:30:09.240 -->
00:30:11.320And then you said something about estimating.
00:30:11.400 -->
00:30:32.840That's another big one that I've been really trying to get into because a lot of my time is getting consumed into you know meeting with clients and doing that end of things, where I've I've actually been looking into trying to hire somebody for that position because it would take it would give me like back to the delegate your time, you know, delegating time to where I could handle other things.
00:30:33.000 -->
00:30:41.320So those would be the two main for me would be you know skilled laborers and finding somebody that could help estimate estimates.
00:30:41.640 -->
00:30:43.000Okay, okay.
00:30:43.640 -->
00:30:44.039All right.
00:30:44.200 -->
00:30:46.279So what's next for uh CoCon construction?
00:30:46.360 -->
00:30:48.759What should people be excited about coming up in the near future?
00:30:49.080 -->
00:30:50.600So what's next for us?
00:30:50.680 -->
00:30:55.960I think I said it earlier in our conversation that you know I just got my class A building license.
00:30:56.039 -->
00:31:01.480So we've kind of been just doing our custom carpentry and you know, remodels and whatnot.
00:31:01.560 -->
00:31:06.519But now that I've got my builder's license, we're gonna be building new homes within the next year or two.
00:31:06.680 -->
00:31:18.120And then, you know, I'm slowly gonna start getting into the development side of things so we can kind of develop whole, you know, new communities and whatnot, and then then do the new construction as well.
00:31:18.360 -->
00:31:22.519So that's uh the next next three three or five year plan for us.
00:31:23.240 -->
00:31:25.240Okay, good deal, good deal.
00:31:25.560 -->
00:31:38.600And uh, and and with this, you know, I you know, I kind of need you to be as candid and as honest as you can, but let's say if you know, if a business owner, small entrepreneurs listening to the podcast episode with you today, like I said, we have a pretty good sized audience of entrepreneurs that listen.
00:31:38.759 -->
00:31:43.320You know, let's say we're having an entrepreneur that's listening today and they're just feeling stuck or overwhelmed.
00:31:43.480 -->
00:31:45.4002026 has just not been their year.
00:31:45.480 -->
00:31:52.360They unfortunately had to lay one of their best techs off because, you know, these, you know, cost of labor is just too much, or cost of materials is just too much.
00:31:52.600 -->
00:31:56.120What's a piece of advice you'd give to that small entrepreneur today?
00:31:56.519 -->
00:32:01.880I would say, you know, it it'll all come back around.
00:32:02.039 -->
00:32:02.759Stay patient.
00:32:02.920 -->
00:32:06.519Not uh, you know, not everything's perfect at the at the same time.
00:32:06.600 -->
00:32:09.000You know those are growing pains within a business.
00:32:09.240 -->
00:32:18.600Stay consistent to your values and how you want or your vision for your company, and everything will fall into place as long as you stay consistent.
00:32:19.880 -->
00:32:21.160Okay, okay.
00:32:21.560 -->
00:32:24.759And we're recording this around you know the end of August here.
00:32:24.920 -->
00:32:29.240So, you know, this next question here would put us at about Thanksgiving, roughly.
00:32:29.400 -->
00:32:36.200So, you know, if there was one meaningful thing you could change in the next 90 days or by Thanksgiving, what would it be and why?
00:32:36.440 -->
00:32:39.799What would what would be one thing you would change about by the business in the next 90 days?
00:32:40.440 -->
00:32:42.519What I would change about the business.
00:32:44.680 -->
00:32:45.799Man, I love the business.
00:32:45.880 -->
00:32:47.400What I would change though?
00:32:47.560 -->
00:32:48.840That's a tough question.
00:32:49.720 -->
00:32:50.039Really?
00:32:50.120 -->
00:32:52.519That's a uh I don't really have a great answer for that.
00:32:52.600 -->
00:32:54.920I kind of like what we what we got going on here.
00:32:55.160 -->
00:33:01.480Like I say, I just want to I'd like to see just steady growth and consistency on how we've been operating.
00:33:01.960 -->
00:33:05.080I don't see much, uh I I don't want to change much, honestly.
00:33:05.480 -->
00:33:06.440I don't want to change much.
00:33:06.680 -->
00:33:06.840Okay.
00:33:07.240 -->
00:33:13.880So, you know, as far as like you know, no, no hypothetical one, there's really nothing you would you would change at all.
00:33:14.680 -->
00:33:15.960First time we've gotten that.
00:33:17.720 -->
00:33:21.320I mean not honestly, no.
00:33:21.480 -->
00:33:24.920I mean, I don't I don't not nothing that rings like like really sets out to me.
00:33:25.000 -->
00:33:31.560Like I like I said, I've got a family uh ran business and we're we're doing very well and heading in the right direction.
00:33:31.799 -->
00:33:40.440And you know, the only thing that I would possibly change is I don't I honestly I don't have an answer for that.
00:33:40.759 -->
00:33:42.200Because I think we're doing well.
00:33:42.519 -->
00:33:43.000Yeah, yeah.
00:33:43.080 -->
00:33:45.240Now now kind of get into what you talked about earlier, right?
00:33:45.320 -->
00:33:48.680You say quote, one of the big things was you know, finding good employees a lot of time.
00:33:48.840 -->
00:33:53.000Would you would you you know maybe hire maybe maybe if like the perfect candidate came on your lap.
00:33:53.400 -->
00:33:55.000Yeah, well, yeah, in that aspect, yeah.
00:33:55.080 -->
00:34:03.640So I guess yeah, what I would change is you know, finding, you know, more employees to help, you know, with my vision to help help build the company more.
00:34:03.720 -->
00:34:09.320You know, I want to see growth, but like, you know, I I'd like to see change in that aspect of things.
00:34:09.480 -->
00:34:19.799But yeah, I I'd say the employment, getting the right employees, people in position for my vision and how we want to see this in the next couple of years would be the biggest thing.
00:34:20.039 -->
00:34:20.360Okay.
00:34:20.679 -->
00:34:21.639Gotcha, gotcha.
00:34:21.799 -->
00:34:22.920All right, perfect, man.
00:34:23.079 -->
00:34:23.400All right.
00:34:23.480 -->
00:34:28.679Well, Rich, thank you so much for joining us and sharing your behind-the-scenes story of building KOCON construction.
00:34:28.840 -->
00:34:36.039Uh, to everyone listening, be sure to connect with Rich and follow Epic Entrepreneurs for more conversations with the people building businesses and communities every day.
00:34:36.279 -->
00:34:39.319So, Rich, before we go ahead and sign off, man, any final words for the audience?
00:34:39.559 -->
00:34:41.079Oh, thanks for having me, man.
00:34:41.159 -->
00:34:43.719Um, and uh, any entrepreneurs, man, don't give up.
00:34:43.799 -->
00:34:45.559It's never gonna be perfect to start off.
00:34:45.639 -->
00:34:47.000Don't wait till it's perfect.
00:34:47.159 -->
00:34:49.480Just take the risk and see where it takes you.
00:34:49.719 -->
00:34:51.000Yeah, no, he's definitely right.
00:34:51.159 -->
00:34:54.679So, yeah, appreciate your your your well words, your wise words here.
00:34:54.759 -->
00:34:59.639And yeah, everybody, this is Cliff McCray with Action Coach Business Growth Partners, and we'll see you next time.
00:34:59.879 -->
00:35:00.359Thank you.
