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Yvonne and Rafael are so excited (and you can tell!). Yvonne declares she's Sandy's biggest fan! And honestly? After listening to this conversation, you'll understand why. Sandy Avina has figured out something our industry has been struggling with for over 100 years: how to make workers' compensation accessible, engaging, and even fun.
Sandy Avina, MBA, is a Claim Services Manager with California Schools JPA, a self-insured public risk pool that serves K-12 school districts, community colleges, and regional occupational programs throughout San Bernardino County, California.
What we get into:
📱 An Industry Image Problem — Workers' comp has been around for over a century, but most people don't understand it. Why? We talk about it amongst ourselves, but not so much outside the industry. Meanwhile, the plaintiff's bar, applicant attorneys, and others are actively shaping the narrative on social media, podcasts, and elsewhere. We're not telling our own story — so someone else is telling it for us. The result? High litigation rates and misaligned employee expectations.
🎬 Creativity Is the Default — Sandy unpacks the "curse of knowledge" — the more you become an expert in something, the harder it is to teach beginners. But here's the thing: creativity is our human default. Kids are naturally creative. We train it out of ourselves. Sandy decided to flip that and use humor, trending music, and creative storytelling to make insurance approachable. Videos like her "Bon Jovi unit of measurement" (halfway there!) explain complex claims concepts in a fun and memorable way.
🏫 JPAs and Public Risk Management — Working with school districts across San Bernardino County (the largest county geographically in the US), Sandy manages the complexity of serving districts from the mountains to the desert. Every district has different challenges, no budget for risk management, and someone wearing a "hat on top of a hat" trying to figure it all out. This is the real-world landscape most of our industry works in.
💡 The Real Disconnect — Insurance is marketed as a commodity ("buy our insurance because we're cheap!") when it's actually a contractual promise. We don't teach kids about insurance in school. We don't train managers on the basics. We don't talk about it until a claim is filed. And then we wonder why our image suffers. The fix? Start education earlier, communicate more clearly, and invest in your people.
💼 What We Could Be Doing Better — Two big opportunities: (1) Train your managers. Over one hundred years in, people still struggle with the concept of a no-fault system. Managers are the first point of contact for injured workers — they need to understand the basics and know that there's no retaliation. (2) Look beyond statutory benefits. A person's life is impacted in many ways outside workers' comp. For example, Sandy says TPAs and carriers could easily provide links to helpful resources, such as posting videos that explain to injured workers how to perform functional tasks with modifications, and adaptive living tips, as well as resources like the Kind Souls Foundation for people who are struggling and need a warm line for support. These are small actions to show we actually care about patient outcomes. And it often costs nothing.
📚 Riskfetti Is Here — Sandy (with Angel Guerra) has just released a book called Riskfetti: Risk Management for the Rest of Us. Sandy said, it's intentionally not the War and Peace of risk management — it's the "Go Dog Go" version. Aimed at people in small to mid-sized organizations who have risk responsibilities but no background in insurance. No jargon. No overwhelm. Just what you need to know.
Sandy's closing wisdom: > "Creativity is the default for everyone. We just need to remember that."
Off the clock: Sandy runs what her husband calls "Birdtown USA" (she's the mayor!) in her backyard — complete with feeders, cameras, and app alerts. She's currently trying to befriend the crows in her neighborhood. Did you know crows are very intelligent and have a structured schedule? When she retires, Sandy says, she's going to be a birder. 🐦
Resources Sandy mentioned:
Pollack Peacebuilding Systems (a consulting practice)
A book called Peaceful Leadership (Available on Amazon)
Find Sandy:
- LinkedIn: Sandy Avina, MBA
- TikTok: @riskinfluencer
- Website: riskinfluencer.org
- Book: Riskfetti: Risk Management for the Rest of Us (Available on Amazon)
¡Muchas Gracias! Thank you for listening. We would appreciate you sharing our podcast with your friends on social media. Find Yvonne and Rafael on Linked In or follow us on Twitter @deconstructcomp
