BALLISTIC: ECKS VS. SEVER (2002) The Worst Reviewed Movie on Rotten Tomatoes Paired with Maligned Wines

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Take a dry cleaner in Hollywood who parlays his starched collar success into an equally successful and popular nightclub.
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Then add the guy who was almost cast as Luke Skywalker.
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Then add the guy who produced JVCD's Double Impact in the 80s, and you have the makings of a potentially significant new film studio that would quickly produce the greatest films of all time.
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And By greatest, we mean films that would become the worst ranked on Rotten Tomatoes to this day, thereby making them the greatest badly reviewed movies of all time.
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One of these films that Baith uh both Dave and I love and absolutely adore myself at least, even though I've only seen it one time, two now, we saw it in theaters uh at the time of its release, and yes, that is in spite of, or perhaps because of.
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its occasional use of martial arts choreography.
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But just listen to some of the reviews.
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One, if you must see X vs Sever, just go bang your head against the wall for an hour and a half.
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It would be the same effect.
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Two, Bandera smopes through this hideous and unintelligible enterprise like a bloodhound with a hangover.
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That's my favorite, by the way.
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Uh the backyard battles you stage with your green plastic army men were more exciting and almost certainly made more sense.
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Next, it's a deluge of bullets and chop socky madness devoid of style or purpose.
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And my second favorite, very simple, very simply, efficiently put, efficiently put, non stop, actively terrible.
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I I'm not sure this very it is it really is.
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It's a honestly it's a perfect review of this film sometimes.
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But I'm not sure this is inspiring to anyone listening or is is going to inspire anyone get to keep listening, except that this is the internet era where a train wreck garners more clicks, views, likes, and subscribes than any masterpiece.
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So all right, you're definitely hooked, we know.
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Uh, so let's go ahead and run that intro and dig into this movie virtually no one else has covered ever in the history of the world, and earn your following forevermore.
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Run that beautiful bean intro day.
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Are you not finished?
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He's Dave, and I'm Dallas, and this is Ventertainment.
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We have opinions on just about everything.
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Sometimes those opinions are spot on.
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Sometimes they go down easier with a glass of wine.
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This is Ventertainment, the Wine and Entertainment Pairing Podcast.
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Welcome back to Ventertainment.
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This is the podcast where we pair wine with entertainment.
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It's as simple as that.
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And today's guest will be a familiar face to watchers and a familiar voice to listeners, and is once again dialing in all the way from Melbourne, Australia.
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He joined us for our Miracle Mile episode a few months back, which you definitely should go check out.
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It has been one of our most listened to episodes.
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He is considered letterbox royalty by those with no taste and has a lot to say about lots of things.
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He's also a big collector of music as well, most ic mostly extreme metal CDs, of which he has over twelve hundred.
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I briefly name dropped Metallica in a Discord chat we were having, and he just about threw up.
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So he's very discerning when it comes to his metal music.
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Now, Nick and I, we know each other from Letterboxd.
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We've both been on and off members of a group called the Collab, a Letterbox club that watches one movie per week, typically movies that aim to get us out of our comfort zones and explore new corners, heights, and depths like today of cinema.
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Members take turns putting together themed polls and we do rank choice voting for which movie wins every week.
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In fact, I just took over as moderator, slash, I suppose you could call it fearless leader of the Collab just this.
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Week, just in time for my birthday.
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I turned a stupidly old age this week, took on this new responsibility, as one does as you get older.
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And if you'd like to check out my The Collab on Letterboxed and perhaps join us, we'll have a link to that in the description of this episode.
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And now, without further ado, everyone, please give a warm welcome back to Nick Langdon! Thank you.
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I'm gonna demand that all of my entrances be accompanied by recorded applause from now on.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
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We just discovered it last week, so you're welcome.
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We're professionals around here.
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Oh I'm getting more professional by the minute.
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There you go, there you go.
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It only took us three years.
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Yeah.
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Yeah, so um I mean my wine taste might be basic, but I was sort of getting one back on Dave with his basic music taste as well.
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And I can't disagree.
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Trust me, I can't disagree with that.
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The number of Carly Ray Jepsen albums we have covered on this podcast because of me.
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Yeah.
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that for Dallas has his face in his hands and not without cause.
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yeah, so congratulations on your elevation to um leadership of the uh Collab Film Club.
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And I'm I'm not I have to say I'm not just an on and off member.
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I've watched three hundred and thirty or which is every theatrical release since June of twenty nineteen.
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Wow.
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So uh that's a lot of dedication to some Nick dedicated.
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I'm on and off.
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Nick is dedicated.
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Now I'm dedicated too.
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That's the thing.
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I have now flipped that switch and have become officially dedicated with this new thing.
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Um, but now, Nick, go ahead because you are here to talk about a very specific movie that came up during a collab poll that I put together not too long ago.
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And go ahead and tell the people what you chose for today's movie, read them the log line, and then tell us why, God, why, you chose it.
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Alright, well the movie that we're covering, which everybody knows because they've already seen the description of the episode in their podcast app of choice, or uh the post on your Substack of Entertainment, um is 2002's Ballistic X vs Sever, a title we will come back to that's both terrible and inaccurate.
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Um, but I'm actually not the one who's r entirely responsible for this.
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This is largely on you, Dave, because you put together a poll about great duels in movies.
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And the winning poll for our film club was the two thousand Hong Kong film called The Duel, the Andy Lao film.
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This was one of the losers, and then you and I were talking on Discord about our interest in sort of mediocre action movies of the two thousands and then we decided to that we'd love to cover this one and that's how we're here on the podcast.
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So I'll I'll take partial blame for this, but not all the blame for this.
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Or all the credit, depending on how much Dallas loves this movie.
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Well well here's I I will take I will take you a step back further, actually.
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This is one of the things Dave and I mentioned in a conversation.
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But yeah, Dave and I, probably fifteen years ago now, uh, bonded over this dumb film that I was in a bit of a haze about because I had no idea that anyone else hated this film.
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I thought it was fantastic.
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And Dave and I bonded over it.
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No, so over the years we've been trying to find a way to work it into this damn show.
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And You know, you came along with this uh this guy's with this poll and um here we are.
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So Yeah.
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Well and we discovered that we'd both seen it in the theater and never since.
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And we both thought it was wonderful.
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We thought we had fond, fond memories.
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We walked out of the theater as young twenty somethings being like, Fuck yeah.
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That was amazing.
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And then I looked it up You must have walked out of a I gonna say you must have walked out of a pretty empty theatre based on this movie's box office receipts.
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Yeah.
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This is true.
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This is true.
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Now I probably wasn't paying any attention at that age.
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I was just like, I'm the is great.
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I probably went opening night because I saw the trailer and I thought it just looked amazing.
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And I then, you know, I knew this movie did not have a great rep.
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But when I looked it up, looked it up, I was like, my God.
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Zero.
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Yeah.
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Zero.
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With it is one of the only zero movies that has one, I think, 117 reviews on Rotten Tomatoes.
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So I'm saying apparently it's up to now.
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Yeah.
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So nobody seems to like this movie.
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And we had these the fact that Dallas had the exact same fond memory blew my mind.
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So I was like, All right, we have to cover this sometime.
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And when you expressed interest too, I was like, F it, it's time.
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Let's see how this movie holds up or Yeah, buddy.
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Yeah, so like um as as with Dallas' intro there, I too first heard about this movie.
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I didn't go see it in the theatres, but I heard about it through its terrible reputation through those reviews.
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Uh let me cut quickly mention a couple of other of my favorite descriptions, which it was described at the time as quote, a picture for idiots, boring to an amazing degree, a fine achievement in stupidity and dullness, giving new meaning to the word incoherent And one critic suggested an alternative title would be Simplistic Bullets versus Humans, while the Washington Post summed it up by saying, you could run this film backwards, soundtrack included, and it would make no less sense.
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So all valid, but also all kind of interesting, because you sort of go, okay, how bad can it possibly be?
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And the answer, I think, not to spoil everything in advance, is not nowhere near that bad.
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But a lot of that ties into how actually bad Rotten Tomatoes is.
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I think most people who know movies know this, but just really quickly, they have a very they have an absolutely binary approach.
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Either something is good or bad, what they call fresh or rotten.
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So that n if it's something's bad, they'll it doesn't matter if it's yeah, you know, there was something going on here but it didn't quite work, or this movie is total dog shit.
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That is the same.
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Right.
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And the same with the positive reviews.
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They'll could a movie can be, it's okay, versus five star masterpiece.
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That's still the same with Rotten Tomatoes.
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That's why you'll see some mediocre superhero movie, ninety eight percent fresh on Rotten Tomatoes, but that then again, ninety eight percent of those reviews could be meh, it was alright.
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And that's how that's why Rotten Tomatoes is most people consider it a net negative for online film criticism.
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I do agree with that.
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Um, I usually always if there's an audience score, I try to look at both together and kind of see like, okay, and especially because audiences are much more forgiving than critics more often than not.
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I think cinema score is usually the one that can be a bit more on point in terms of like crowds and like the people who actually went to go see the movies who aren't professionals.
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But that said, this movie is pretty friggin' low on the audience score too.
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Like everyone seems to have drunk the cool.
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Universally, seriously.
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Right, right, right.
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So even even taking that into consideration, I don't know like we'll get into it here in just a moment, but yeah, this movie is not as actively wretched as its reputation seems to let on.
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And or at least I didn't think so.
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And I wonder how much of this is just the snowball effect of like when something hits these depths, this rock bottom percentage, everyone's gotta kind of like jump on that train and be like, yeah, my God.
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Because it's not, it's not a masterpiece.
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Let's let's be honest about that too.
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And so the fact that it isn't amazing and has this reputation means that, you know, instead of the meh, people just dog pile onto the yeah, this is absolute dog shit.
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And I'm like, but is it?
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But is it?
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Yeah, and I think i it the corollary of that is some films that sometimes I think people don't feel that they particularly respond to, but there is that sort of herd mentality that you can't criticize this.
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It's Martin Scorsese or whoever the, you know, invoge Jordan Peel, whoever the in vogue director of the time is.
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There's sort of a there's a sort of cultural pressure or group thing to go along and say this is a masterpiece when people you read sometimes the reviews and they're they're kinda like, Yeah, I I I think I liked it You're like, Okay, there's something else going on.
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It's odd.
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It's it's weird because for me with with uh this site, uh, there is that bandwagon effect that you guys are talking about, but it's a social there's a social media component to where if something is really low, people seem to do their best to keep it as low as possible.
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It is a a weird thing.
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I I I've seen it with a number of films and um a few years ago there was this site that was an offshoot of um Or working in comparison in relationship with Rotten Tomatoes.
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And they sent out a couple of calls for some short film stuff.
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And so it was in that fray.
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And a lot of the people we were talking to were like constant, constant posters on Rotten Tomatoes.
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And there was this sort of sentiment to kind of punished punish things that seemed to be universally bad.
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And I I Still don't understand that.
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I'm I'm still trying to wrap my head around it, but it does kind of mirror exactly what you guys are saying.
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But uh Rotten Tomatoes is a curious place and I like to steer clear of it as much as possible.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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And and again, I I completely agree.
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There like this pile on effect, like two fairly recent no not that recent, but films that I really noticed it happening with was Batman versus Superman Dawn of Justice and the remake of Hellboy.
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Now I'm not gonna say either of those two films are masterpieces either, but if you think those are the worst films of all time, my friend, you've not seen bad films.
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True.
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I I mostly agree with the Hellboy one.
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Batman versus Superman, I've that is definitely one of the I really I really struggled with that one.
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I was God no, God no.
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I I it wasn't the f it was I wasn't struggling because I needed more story.
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I was struggling with everything that was there in front of me, and I'm like, none of this is interesting or Uh something I wanna spend more minutes with and there were so many minutes in the non director's cut to begin with.
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So that one I mean, is it one of the most ever made no directors?
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Does actually feel shorter because it makes sense, but any I agree.
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I suppose.
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Um, but yeah, Snyder, I know for a fact that like I don't like three hundred.
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Like, I do not like Snyder.
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He really rubs me the wrong way in in all his style, his voice, his aesthetic.
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I just do the only movie of his I have ever liked is his Dawn of the Dead remake.
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I think that is actually an authentically well done movie.
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And starting with 300, I almost turned 300 off.
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I was just like, God, I can't get through these movies.
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And Everything he's done made sense has been like three hundred plus and just leaning into that style like more and more and I'm like, Okay, not for me.
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I just think I can't get into him, yeah.
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My problem with Snyder is he seems to, and you see it in 300 and the Don film, but he seems to take every moment and make it as precious as possible.
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Uh and he does it in different ways, either slowing down the action, of course, or this sort of laborious kind of like shot on shot on shot, different perspective of the same fucking shot.
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And it's just after a certain point, you're like No, we got that.
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We got that the first time you did it.
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You don't need to slow it down.
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You don't need to it just is so Yeah.
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Yeah, but he he gets Yeah.
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Yeah, he gets that from his inspirations like Tony Scott and Michael Bay, who deliver that maximalist every shot has to be the most spectacular in the movie kind of thing.
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But you know, you can't criticize a lot of slow mo in this movie while praising Ballistic X versus Sever in any way.
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Hey, calm down, buddy.
00:16:20.025 --> 00:16:21.948
Hey, go watch Hey now.
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How dare you?
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How dare you?
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Let's work.
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Just just just to give just to give the log line on this film, which appositely enough doesn't really describe it, but here we go.
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Tasked with destroying each other, an FBI agent and a rogue DIA agent soon discover that a much bigger enemy is at work.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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That's a and honestly, that is the setup kind of like it minus all the details, but yeah, it's it's the setup.
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It's the setup.
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is a bare bones log line which doesn't give you any of the sort of nonsensical minuti minutia of of you know of this f film sometimes, which again I still love it.
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uh you know, I'll I won't bury the lead on that.
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I still fucking love it.
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Um but yeah, that log line is empty and full at the same time.
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And now it's time for the wine trivia question of the week.
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As the first great traders of wine exporting from their Levantine, by the way, I love that word, um, ports, the Phoenicians, present-date Lebanon, seem to have protected their wine from oxidation with a layer of olive oil, followed by a seal of pine wood and resin.
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As a result, This Mediterranean wine is said to have been created during this and these journeys.
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Is it A Vermut?
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B Retsina, C Vermentino, or D Mosho Filero.
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Your options are A Vermut, B Retsina, C Vermentino, and D Moscho Filero.
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All right, I do know the answer to this one, Nick.
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It's gonna be super easy for me.
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the only thing I will I even paired this type of wine with Under the Skin, the Scarlet Johansson movie.
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Um by I'm forgetting the director, the birth director.
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What's his name?
00:18:33.311 --> 00:18:33.603
Yes.
00:18:33.603 --> 00:18:36.653
aah Glosser.
00:18:36.653 --> 00:18:38.021
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:18:38.924 --> 00:18:50.895
and because it was like this type of wine tastes like what if you gave a description of wine to an alien and they tried to replicate it, this is probably what you would get.
00:18:51.978 --> 00:18:52.458
Yes.
00:18:52.458 --> 00:18:56.321
It it's like it's very off putting and it's it's woo, it's out there.
00:18:56.321 --> 00:19:05.372
Um so what I'll I'll go ahead and give you a second and and then I'll Actually there's there's a hint in the penunction in the pana pana in the pronunciation of the word, honestly.
00:19:05.372 --> 00:19:08.676
There's a very near sort of, you know, clue.
00:19:08.884 --> 00:19:14.941
so it y you can't be talking about my beloved Vermentinos then, so I'm gonna guess B and guess Retzina.
00:19:14.955 --> 00:19:16.007
There we are.
00:19:16.007 --> 00:19:18.368
That is correct.
00:19:18.368 --> 00:19:19.380
It is Rethina.
00:19:19.380 --> 00:19:21.800
Pew Pew Pew.
00:19:21.800 --> 00:19:23.093
That's right, Rethina.
00:19:23.093 --> 00:19:23.913
Um as you know.
00:19:23.913 --> 00:19:25.233
Dave, tell us about Rethina.
00:19:25.233 --> 00:19:30.104
Uh as far as I know, it is a Greek uh sort of permutation.
00:19:30.104 --> 00:19:41.124
So the the pine resin, when you seal the top of the pine resin, it you know, they didn't have a lot of good options for keeping uh wine away from oxygen at the time to actually give it an airtight seal.
00:19:41.124 --> 00:19:45.557
So they used the pine resin, it would seep through like where they had put it.
00:19:45.557 --> 00:19:48.290
The air wouldn't get to it, but the pine resin would.
00:19:48.290 --> 00:19:51.153
And so that would actually soak into the wine.
00:19:51.153 --> 00:19:56.897
It would give it this piney, like very car air freshener quality.
00:19:56.950 --> 00:20:00.133
And it is it takes a little getting used to.
00:20:00.133 --> 00:20:11.792
Um I was working at one at a at the blending lab, one of the wineries I used to work at, and this Greek lady came in and she one, she corrected all my pronunciations of everything like as we were talking.
00:20:11.792 --> 00:20:14.846
So I knew about Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:20:14.846 --> 00:20:16.448
She was like, No, no, she's like, What?
00:20:16.448 --> 00:20:21.501
And I'm like, I'm and I try again and she's like, and then she'd pr and then she'd like try and school me.
00:20:21.501 --> 00:20:23.339
Like she wouldn't wait until I got it right.
00:20:23.339 --> 00:20:24.510
I was like, damn, okay.
00:20:24.510 --> 00:20:30.453
Um, but she was also when I brought up Retsina, I'm like, you I just had my first Ritsina, I just paired it with under the skin.
00:20:30.453 --> 00:20:34.046
And I mean, she was like, she was like, ugh.
00:20:34.046 --> 00:20:43.961
She's like, that's what you drink when you're a college kid and you're broke, and like you get, you know, drunk to the point of throwing up in the street, and like we all have terrible memories of it afterwards in our adulthood.
00:20:43.961 --> 00:20:48.723
So that is Retsina in the modern day Greece, apparently, if you grow up there.
00:20:48.723 --> 00:20:52.221
But there are some quote unquote fine wine ritinas.
00:20:52.221 --> 00:20:56.294
That at least in American wine shops they're selling for like twenty to thirty dollars.
00:20:56.294 --> 00:20:57.285
So they're they ain't cheap.
00:20:57.285 --> 00:20:58.105
They ain't cheap, cheap.
00:20:58.105 --> 00:21:01.047
Um, and yeah, that is Ret Cena.
00:21:01.047 --> 00:21:01.886
That is.
00:21:01.886 --> 00:21:02.967
Yum.
00:21:03.008 --> 00:21:03.627
All right.
00:21:03.627 --> 00:21:12.011
Now, before we get to our movie, everybody, everybody listening, please don't forget to follow us and subscribe to this pod if you love what we do here.
00:21:12.011 --> 00:21:14.093
We watch films like X vs.
00:21:14.093 --> 00:21:16.698
Sever for You.
00:21:16.698 --> 00:21:18.270
We get nothing out of that.
00:21:18.270 --> 00:21:19.082
All right.
00:21:19.082 --> 00:21:23.928
And we figure out how best to get drunk while watching such films.
00:21:23.928 --> 00:21:25.738
For you.
00:21:25.738 --> 00:21:28.554
We absolutely get nothing out of that.
00:21:28.554 --> 00:21:31.207
This is a service and you're welcome.
00:21:31.207 --> 00:21:34.251
So You might as well subscribe and get a whole bunch more of this.
00:21:34.251 --> 00:21:35.782
And while you're at it, leave a review.
00:21:35.782 --> 00:21:37.294
We love reading them.
00:21:37.294 --> 00:21:47.602
It is a especially if that review is particularly insightful, interesting, or just a good ol' fluffer of a review, we will probably read it on the pod like about the show?
00:21:47.602 --> 00:21:48.152
Exactly.
00:21:48.152 --> 00:21:48.952
We love some fluffin.
00:21:48.952 --> 00:21:50.089
What do you like about the show?
00:21:50.089 --> 00:21:54.537
Uh what would you add or subtract or otherwise change if you could have us change something?
00:21:54.537 --> 00:21:57.568
Post that review and we would love to hear the feedback.
00:21:57.568 --> 00:22:10.815
And lastly Don't forget, we have a substack, Vintertainment Studios.com, where you can interact with us, find bonus wine and movie pairings, and also make sure to check out Wine Cellar Cinema, our new microcinema built inside a wine shop here in mid-city Los Angeles.
00:22:10.815 --> 00:22:16.247
Our first night of short films paired with wine went swimmingly back in June on Juneteenth.
00:22:16.247 --> 00:22:21.509
And we plan to keep that happening once per month with your support and attendance, of course.
00:22:21.509 --> 00:22:27.137
So check for updates there oh on wine cellarcinema.substack.com, ventertainmentstudios.com.
00:22:27.137 --> 00:22:28.617
wine cellarcinema.substack.com.
00:22:28.617 --> 00:22:33.079
All right, now it's time for the Elevage section.
00:22:33.079 --> 00:22:41.282
Elevage refers to the crucial post-fermentation period when wine undergoes development, maturation, and refinement before release.
00:22:41.282 --> 00:22:48.005
So some brief elevage on the making of ballistic X versus Sever.
00:22:48.566 --> 00:22:53.365
When you own a dry cleaner, In the middle of Hollywood, you make lots of celebrity connections.
00:22:53.365 --> 00:22:57.588
And if you're enterprising, you turn these connections into business ventures.
00:22:57.588 --> 00:23:06.116
Like an incredibly popular Hollywood nightclub, The Roxbury, forever immortalized in the SNL feature film A Night at the Roxbury.
00:23:06.116 --> 00:23:25.182
Then, once you're bored, you could, again, if you're enterprising, turn that very popular nightclub into a film studio, which you built out with the partnership of Of actor Andrew Stevens, who was almost cast as Luke Skywalker, that's that guy, and Ashok Amtraj, who produced Double Impact a few years earlier.
00:23:25.182 --> 00:23:29.224
And you would call that studio Franchise Pictures.
00:23:29.224 --> 00:23:35.647
In nineteen ninety seven, Lebanese American Ellie Samaha, I have no idea if I'm pronouncing that right, but I think that I think so.
00:23:35.647 --> 00:23:38.598
Elie Eli Eli or Ellie, it's E L I E.
00:23:38.598 --> 00:23:40.589
I'm I wanna kinda think.
00:23:40.854 --> 00:23:43.444
Zell so I'm gonna I'm gonna it's Oh, okay.
00:23:43.444 --> 00:23:44.454
So let's do Eli.
00:23:44.454 --> 00:23:52.281
So let's say Eli Samaha created a film studio which would become known for producing projects that major studios often passed on.
00:23:52.281 --> 00:23:55.163
So they were basically Netflix before there was streaming.
00:23:55.163 --> 00:24:02.089
In 1998, franchise signed a deal with Morgan Creek Productions and Warner Brothers Pictures for distribution in the US and UK.
00:24:02.089 --> 00:24:07.653
Their first film under this agreement was 1998's A Murder of Crows, starring Cuba Gooding Jr.
00:24:07.653 --> 00:24:09.076
and Tom Berenger.
00:24:09.076 --> 00:24:12.395
Don't forget in 1998, those were both still major stars.
00:24:12.395 --> 00:24:34.738
And all signs pointed to a potentially successful outlook with 1999's Boondock Saints, another fan favorite of mine I have not seen since I originally rented it way back in the day, and I fear for how well that actually holds up, and 2000s, The Whole Nine Yards, and Git Carter being critically acclaimed and financially successful productions.
00:24:34.738 --> 00:24:39.492
But that Not get Carter, that was a that was everybody hated it and it was a massive bomb.
00:24:39.973 --> 00:24:41.314
not in America?
00:24:41.836 --> 00:24:42.766
I don't think so.
00:24:42.766 --> 00:24:43.558
wait, wait, wait.
00:24:43.558 --> 00:24:45.181
I'm thinking get shorty, aren't I?
00:24:45.181 --> 00:24:45.521
Fudge.
00:24:45.521 --> 00:24:46.522
fudge, I'm thinking get shorty.
00:24:46.522 --> 00:24:46.784
Okay.
00:24:46.784 --> 00:24:48.226
Not a suc not a success.
00:24:48.226 --> 00:24:56.248
Wait, not oh was good what was good get Carter?
00:24:56.248 --> 00:25:05.807
The nineteen seventy one Get Carter was with Michael Caine, and it's just absolutely one of the most brutally cold, bleak crime revenge movies ever made.
00:25:05.807 --> 00:25:11.394
And then Stallone remade it as an ego stroking project in two thousand one and it was a flop and everybody hated it.
00:25:11.394 --> 00:25:15.417
Get Shorty is a much beloved classic from nineteen ninety two.
00:25:15.458 --> 00:25:29.673
We are we are we are wiping out that so to rephrase this question or to repeat this question with that excluded, 1999's Boondock Saints and 2000s, the whole nine yards being critically acclaimed in financially successful productions.
00:25:29.673 --> 00:25:34.203
But this proved to be a classic case of things going all too well all too soon.
00:25:34.203 --> 00:25:40.607
Their first major flop in terms of how much they spent versus how much they made was on the horizon.
00:25:40.607 --> 00:25:43.759
Now let's jump back in time a bit.
00:25:43.901 --> 00:25:44.181
L.
00:25:44.181 --> 00:26:01.977
Ron Hubbard, the founder of Scientology, had written a late career science fiction book entitled Battlefield Earth, published in 1982 after the American Psychological Association passed a resolution stating that claims in his earlier book, Dianetics, were not supported by empirical evidence.
00:26:01.977 --> 00:26:16.840
Battlefield was also written with the hope that a young Hollywood it boy named John Travolta Who had already been recruited into the organization would play the lead and turn it into a mega franchise building movie.
00:26:16.840 --> 00:26:18.162
That's a big ask.
00:26:18.162 --> 00:26:24.227
uh Note that Scientology's approach to recruiting celebrities had always been a part of its makeup.
00:26:24.227 --> 00:26:37.877
Hubbard is on record as having stated that people listened to movie stars more than scientists, and had laid out a plan early in Scientology's existence to make certain the church recruited them in numbers.
00:26:38.132 --> 00:26:46.910
Unfortunately, Travolta's star power was waning at the time, and the cost involved to make a science fiction epic was not then possible.
00:26:46.910 --> 00:27:00.303
Fast forward to nineteen ninety four, and thanks to Quentin Tarantino's chestnut pulp fiction, John Travolta found himself an A-lister again and ready to put his energy behind a big passion project.
00:27:00.303 --> 00:27:03.513
Reenter Battlefield Earth.
00:27:03.513 --> 00:27:06.625
Don't forget a successful turn in in get shorty.
00:27:06.625 --> 00:27:09.778
Again, it's a very successful turn in yet, Shorty.
00:27:09.778 --> 00:27:10.746
This is very true.
00:27:10.746 --> 00:27:13.732
Uh it all it's all it's full circle, Hill.
00:27:13.732 --> 00:27:21.450
After a few preliminary deals with MGM and Fox, the word on the street was that the film was too risky on a number of fronts.
00:27:21.450 --> 00:27:31.713
One, the budget too high, two, the themes outdated, and three, the Scientology factor was far, far too unpopular.
00:27:31.713 --> 00:27:37.257
The film was dead in the water, and even Travolta's middle-aged swinging hips couldn't save it.
00:27:37.257 --> 00:27:41.940
But this was all chum in the water for franchise pictures.
00:27:41.940 --> 00:27:53.746
After learning of the Battlefield Earth project via Cassian Elways, William Moore's super agent and brother of actor Carrie Elways, our former dry cleaner Samaha approached Travolta.
00:27:53.746 --> 00:27:56.468
A deal was struck, and we all know the story.
00:27:56.468 --> 00:28:00.430
Battlefield Earth became an epic miss.
00:28:00.531 --> 00:28:12.378
Eager to move beyond the fiasco and hoping to capitalize on the success of the Matrix, franchise pictures set their sights on their latest project, which would eventually become ballistic.
00:28:12.378 --> 00:28:14.882
X vs Sever.
00:28:14.882 --> 00:28:17.063
The script had more than a few iterations.
00:28:17.063 --> 00:28:19.393
In 1986, screenwriter Alan B.
00:28:19.393 --> 00:28:24.692
McElroy, the writer of Spawn, which is another movie that we have covered on this podcast.
00:28:24.692 --> 00:28:26.346
If you want to hear a little bit more about Alan B.
00:28:26.346 --> 00:28:31.636
McElroy and how he came to Spawn, he wrote both the feature film and the HBO animated show.
00:28:31.636 --> 00:28:35.637
So uh go take a listen to that to hear a little bit more about him.
00:28:35.637 --> 00:28:38.588
We're not gonna cover too much of his backstory in this one.
00:28:38.588 --> 00:28:39.289
But Alan B.
00:28:39.289 --> 00:28:40.599
McElroy wrote a spec.
00:28:40.599 --> 00:28:49.317
Titled Legion, about an ex-cop who's called in to help track down a rogue CIA agent named Legion who's accused of a killing spree.
00:28:49.317 --> 00:28:57.324
The script was put on the shelf as McElroy went on with partner Dwight Little to make Halloween 4, the return of Michael Myers in 1988.
00:28:57.324 --> 00:29:09.844
But once their Halloween venture was done, they returned to the Legion script and retitled it Gunner, with Dolph Lundgren hot off of Rocky IV, attached to Starr, though this iteration also failed to see the light of day.
00:29:10.082 --> 00:29:15.384
Then, a full decade later, a film materialized after the script was given to writer Peter M.
00:29:15.384 --> 00:29:34.416
Lenkov, one of the writers on Demolition Man, the writer of the abysmal Universal Soldier 2 and 3 TV sequel, and the man who successfully rebooted Hawaii 5-0, MacIver, and Magnum PI before he was fired for fostering a toxic worse workplace environment at CBS.
00:29:34.477 --> 00:29:36.064
Lenkov rewrote the script.
00:29:36.064 --> 00:29:51.836
Adding bigger action sequences and more matrixy nanotech themes, Lenkov did not ultimately get writing credit on the final film, even though the original writer McElroy, the sole credited writer, has said the script that was shot bears little resemblance to his original.
00:29:51.874 --> 00:29:56.636
So yes, this is kind of the franchise pictures model as well, too.
00:29:56.636 --> 00:30:06.422
So the way that they tended to do business was that they got these movie stars to ha bring their pet projects that they couldn't get funded elsewhere, as mentioned before.
00:30:06.422 --> 00:30:14.286
And how they would do this would be basically say that we'll not give you much or if any money up front, but we'll make the pictures that no one else will.
00:30:14.286 --> 00:30:24.571
So like you were just mentioning with um Battlefield Earth, no other studio in town wanted to touch that, because even in the late nineties Elron Hubbard and and Scientology were pretty radioactive.
00:30:24.652 --> 00:30:31.529
And of course, uh another Sylvester Stallone classic that got made at franchise was Driven, his indie car racing film.
00:30:31.529 --> 00:30:38.816
Uh if you're a fan of uh sort of fat period uh Stephen Segal, Half Past Dead is another iconic franchise.
00:30:38.816 --> 00:30:41.076
I mean franchise seems to be like the new Canon.
00:30:41.076 --> 00:30:43.015
Or or or Golan and Globus or Canon?
00:30:43.015 --> 00:30:44.066
Which one am I thinking of there?
00:30:44.066 --> 00:30:44.701
Canonic.
00:30:44.701 --> 00:30:45.402
Cannon, yeah.
00:30:45.402 --> 00:30:46.605
It wa it was kinda like that.
00:30:46.605 --> 00:30:53.523
Except remember Canon went bankrupt because they paid Sylvester Stallone fifteen million up front to make over the top the famous armor stuff.
00:30:56.470 --> 00:31:09.182
So um the uh the budget for um ballistic X vs Sevo is listed at w originally was listed at seventy million, but has been revised down s since then to um thirty five million.
00:31:09.182 --> 00:31:11.944
And this was ultimately what brought down franchise.
00:31:11.944 --> 00:31:15.458
uh our friend Samara, how do you say his name?
00:31:15.458 --> 00:31:15.798
Ellie.
00:31:15.798 --> 00:31:16.368
Eli, yeah.
00:31:16.368 --> 00:31:16.699
Eli.
00:31:16.699 --> 00:31:18.738
Um he Yeah, yeah.
00:31:18.738 --> 00:31:31.102
He financed these films with partnering with this German company called Entertainment AG, and then they would contribute a fixed proportion of the film's production budget in exchange for distribution rights in certain territories.
00:31:31.102 --> 00:31:37.324
And then what our hero would do was inflate the production budget so this percentage would go up.
00:31:37.324 --> 00:31:46.284
So for example, if a film actually cost forty million dollars to make, then franchise would tell its investment partner it costs sixty million dollars to make.
00:31:46.284 --> 00:31:54.720
So that forty-seven percent of the budget would go from eighteen million to twenty-eight million and franchise got to pocket the difference.
00:31:54.721 --> 00:32:02.186
And so in two thousand and four, he was found guilty of massive fraud and the company was shut down and he was ordered to repay the people he ripped.
00:32:02.186 --> 00:32:09.152
And they they had to repay a certain amount and he was personally liable a big chunk of it as well.
00:32:09.152 --> 00:32:10.584
'cause he that's right.
00:32:10.584 --> 00:32:12.807
He he he was running this scam as well.
00:32:12.807 --> 00:32:25.240
Uh he really should have stuck to the celebrity dry cleaning industry, an industry that could only ever He should have just done the basic Hollywood accounting and not not gone quite as overboard with the fraud as he did, but yeah.
00:32:25.240 --> 00:32:26.771
That's right.
00:32:26.771 --> 00:32:42.969
Regular count So I don't know the full backstory here, but this is how the Thai director Witch Chaosa Yanata aka Chaos C Yeah.
00:32:43.111 --> 00:32:43.893
Say ananda.
00:32:43.893 --> 00:32:46.500
Um Sayananda.
00:32:46.500 --> 00:32:46.800
Yes.
00:32:46.800 --> 00:32:48.395
They are Sayananda.
00:32:48.395 --> 00:32:51.886
I can see why he abbreviated his name to Chaos for the benefit of us.
00:32:53.107 --> 00:33:32.586
Anyway, he was um the he was a Thai as director, but he apparently was a rich kid who'd bought his way into the Thai film industry, which is how he got to make his directorial debut in nineteen ninety-eight with a film called Fa at the age of just twenty four, which was at the time apparently the biggest budgeted film in Thailand's history, costing about nine hundred and sixty thousand US dollars at time and starring two of the biggest Thai actors at the time and an an American who I've not heard of, Don Ty, who went on to be a re reputable stunt man working for the John Wick stunt group 87 Eleven.
00:33:32.766 --> 00:33:46.690
So that film was a box office failure in but because seemingly he had money and connections, that's how he ended up over in the US with franchise pictures trying to uh do something different with this script.
00:33:47.231 --> 00:33:57.348
originally written by Witch or Chaos himself, um, but uh heavily criticized for being weak with characters acting illogically and inconsistently to say the very least.
00:33:57.490 --> 00:34:02.893
And of course then, as you just mentioned, rewritten to the point of incoherence by several other people.
00:34:02.893 --> 00:34:07.096
Then the film was edited to the point of incoherence and so on and so on and so on.
00:34:07.836 --> 00:34:22.983
So that's kind of the interestingly like the yeah interestingly background of this dodgy company and how this they recruited this kid basically from Thailand to come over and helm a fairly big budget action picture.
00:34:22.983 --> 00:34:33.230
Yeah, even even if the budget was not seventy million, but thirty five million, and according to which it was um roughly sixteen million as an actual production budget.
00:34:33.230 --> 00:34:35.134
So everything else went to above the line.
00:34:35.134 --> 00:34:35.905
Yeah.
00:34:35.905 --> 00:34:36.358
Right, right.
00:34:36.358 --> 00:34:38.411
And most of that was spent on pyrotechnics.
00:34:39.880 --> 00:34:41.936
So yeah, he he his the idea.
00:34:41.936 --> 00:34:48.407
Every dollar of it was worth You y y you can't say the money's not there on screen, it's all blowing up in front of you.
00:34:48.407 --> 00:34:54.434
Can I say when we get to act three of this movie, I I think my literal plot synopsis is everything explodes.
00:34:54.597 --> 00:34:55.514
Everything.
00:34:55.514 --> 00:34:56.085
Yeah.
00:34:56.085 --> 00:35:00.617
There's not a there's not an intact train left in Vancouver by the end of Act Three of this film.
00:35:01.257 --> 00:35:12.326
So yeah, originally he his pitch for this was uh the nineteen sixty eight Steve McQueen film Bullet, although you'd you'd have to get a scanning electron microscope to find any of Bullet's DNA left in ballistic.
00:35:12.326 --> 00:35:12.746
Yes.
00:35:12.746 --> 00:35:15.648
Um so that was kind of his idea with that.
00:35:15.648 --> 00:35:23.096
Um and yes, he wanted Chow Yun Fat and Jean Renault in the lead roles, two sort of nineties action heroes.
00:35:23.096 --> 00:35:25.688
He wanted as the killer versus the professional.
00:35:25.688 --> 00:35:30.992
Um, and then of course the studio I don't think could afford those actors.
00:35:30.992 --> 00:35:34.485
Um and then they went through sort of Wesley Snipes and Jack.
00:35:37.592 --> 00:35:38.094
Yeah.
00:35:38.094 --> 00:35:48.657
Before even going down to like Sylvester Stallone and Vin Diesel, lesser names, but in the case of Stallone, especially one who already had an association with franchise pictures.
00:35:49.476 --> 00:35:59.039
So uh which claims that it was his idea to make Sever a woman, uh, and there was a Hong Kong actress that he wanted but never named, uh, who apparently turned the role down.
00:35:59.039 --> 00:36:07.307
The producers wanted Michelle Yo, since Crouching Tiger Hidden Dragon had just been released and was a massive international hit, but either she didn't work out.
00:36:07.307 --> 00:36:16.965
And you can imagine Maggie Chung or others such as Xu Chi or Zhao Wei in the lead role, and I'm sure Dave could name a dozen other Hong Kong action badasses of the time.
00:36:17.425 --> 00:36:26.806
And of course, he also then had ended up with Antonio Banderas, uh, who was apparently suggested by Lucy Liu, who ended up playing the role, who was pretty whole.
00:36:26.806 --> 00:36:29.213
suggested Lucy Lu actually, the opposite.
00:36:29.400 --> 00:36:29.817
Yeah.
00:36:29.817 --> 00:36:31.068
it was him, was it?
00:36:31.559 --> 00:36:32.010
yeah.
00:36:32.010 --> 00:36:35.376
So they cast him first and then they were like, We want a woman.
00:36:35.376 --> 00:36:38.059
All our other attempts like failed.
00:36:38.059 --> 00:36:43.585
And then uh yeah, appar according to the director, it was Antonio Benderas that suggested her.
00:36:43.585 --> 00:36:51.681
Yeah, and it's really interesting too because Lucy Liu was not known as an action star for the early quite for the most of her career.
00:36:51.681 --> 00:37:00.175
She'd broken out on T V in Allie McBeal and then she didn't do an action film until two thousand when she was in both Charlie's Angels and Shanghai Noon.
00:37:00.175 --> 00:37:06.900
And then later she did Kill Bill and sort of got this more of a reputation of being like an action movie star, but she really wasn't at the time.
00:37:06.900 --> 00:37:13.853
Whereas of course Antonio Banderas was pretty hot off Desperado and um the Mask of Zorro.
00:37:13.853 --> 00:37:16.757
Zoro, yes, yes, yes, yes.
00:37:16.757 --> 00:37:25.668
And then beyond Antonio Banderas and Lucy Loom, the film additionally stars Talesa Soto, uh Hot Off of the Mortal Kombat franchise, Ray Park.
00:37:25.668 --> 00:37:27.603
Dave would s only Dave would say hot.
00:37:28.889 --> 00:37:29.831
I say hot.
00:37:29.831 --> 00:37:41.538
Ray Park, who honestly, his role as Darth Maul in the Star Wars the Phantom Menace, he it did put him I was a martial arts aficionado, movie aficionado, so that did put him on my radar because of that.
00:37:41.538 --> 00:37:49.320
Can I just say though that not quite to the mainstream, 'cause I was a Star Wars fan as a kid, but I don't think the majority of the public knew who Ray Park was.
00:37:49.320 --> 00:37:53.916
I think hardcore fans and wasn't a Star Wars fan, so I think that's the difference.
00:37:53.916 --> 00:37:55.557
I was just the martial arts fan.
00:37:55.557 --> 00:38:03.503
And so when I h heard that he was in this and that he was making the lightsaber battles like so much cooler, and I was like, Ooh.
00:38:03.503 --> 00:38:06.344
And then I saw and like, did I like the Phantom Menace?
00:38:06.344 --> 00:38:07.436
Not really.
00:38:07.436 --> 00:38:10.358
Did I really love his lightsaber battles?
00:38:10.358 --> 00:38:11.438
Fuck yeah.
00:38:11.438 --> 00:38:12.530
Just like this movie, right?
00:38:12.530 --> 00:38:16.315
It was like I had a very fuck yeah uh r response to things like that.
00:38:16.315 --> 00:38:23.302
Um so Ray Park, I was very I don't know, I don't think I recognized he was in this movie when I saw it in the theater.
00:38:23.302 --> 00:38:26.005
I think that is like a a truth as well.
00:38:26.005 --> 00:38:27.342
It's like he was under a grip.
00:38:27.342 --> 00:38:28.831
Wearing the Darth Maul makeup.
00:38:28.831 --> 00:38:29.681
Exactly.
00:38:29.681 --> 00:38:31.893
So it's like, would I recognize Ray Park?
00:38:31.893 --> 00:38:36.228
But this time, when I watched it, the moment he came on screen, I'm like, fuck, that's Ray Park.
00:38:36.228 --> 00:38:44.054
I was like, okay, so we are gonna get some like at least one and sure enough, we get like one fight, martial arts fight near the end with Ray Park and Lucy Lou.
00:38:44.054 --> 00:38:58.601
Um, and then it also stars Miguel Sandoval, hot off of Airbud World Pup, which everyone would say that film's a masterpiece, and stock Hollywood Bad Guy for Hire, Greg Henry as the main villain, Robert Gantt.
00:38:58.601 --> 00:38:59.717
Now production.
00:38:59.717 --> 00:39:00.710
Oh yeah.
00:39:00.885 --> 00:39:07.041
I just gonna say shout out to my letterbox friend Odie who I convinced to work his way through all of the Airbud movies.
00:39:07.237 --> 00:39:07.449
man.
00:39:07.449 --> 00:39:09.101
Never, never.
00:39:09.945 --> 00:39:12.429
It's gotta like what, eight of those now, right?
00:39:12.429 --> 00:39:16.795
I think there's like five in the main sequence and then there was like a spin off universe as well.
00:39:16.795 --> 00:39:21.347
Um and they're actually just rebooting it this year, so I mean for me, only World Pup.
00:39:21.347 --> 00:39:22.471
That's the only me no, I'm just kidding.
00:39:22.471 --> 00:39:25.989
I have to be Ha ha ha.
00:39:26.141 --> 00:39:31.373
The production occurred primarily in Vancouver, and according to which it was a total blast.
00:39:31.373 --> 00:39:34.583
But production, post-production, was hell.
00:39:34.583 --> 00:39:44.186
The producers took the edit away from him, removed the original composer, replaced it with an electronic soundtrack, and Witch never saw the final movie until it was released.
00:39:44.186 --> 00:39:48.188
He claims it's not the movie he set out to make.
00:39:48.327 --> 00:39:55.266
Even though, and I will say, I actually you cannot find his original Fa movie with subtitles.
00:39:55.266 --> 00:39:58.728
But you can find it on YouTube without subtitles.
00:39:59.208 --> 00:40:02.030
And I did kind of skip through the whole thing.
00:40:02.030 --> 00:40:06.715
And man, I gotta tell you, all the DNA of this movie is right there.
00:40:06.715 --> 00:40:12.007
It's kind of hard not to see it, to unsee it once you've seen it.
00:40:12.007 --> 00:40:14.349
So he definitely shot every shot.
00:40:14.349 --> 00:40:18.422
Now, maybe the edit, maybe the story, maybe how it barely makes any sense.
00:40:18.422 --> 00:40:22.773
Maybe that's something because he said that his original, we we mentioned before.
00:40:22.773 --> 00:40:27.005
It was a bit really the script was terrible in his original movie, and even he recognized that.
00:40:27.005 --> 00:40:28.456
He's like, Yeah, I was young.
00:40:28.456 --> 00:40:31.918
And even according to him in interviews, he's like, The script sucks.
00:40:31.918 --> 00:40:33.659
Like it's it was not good.
00:40:33.659 --> 00:40:38.521
So maybe he really wanted to do a better job with this one and he was really disappointed with how the edit turned out.
00:40:38.521 --> 00:40:39.373
That I don't know.
00:40:39.373 --> 00:40:43.204
But according to him, not the movie he set out to make.
00:40:43.235 --> 00:40:52.882
and this is where, of course, Franchise Pictures got into legal trouble, was sued, and had to declare bankruptcy in on August eighteenth, two thousand four.
00:40:52.882 --> 00:41:02.045
The rights to ballistic are today primarily held by the German company MHF Zweit Academy Film, the parent group to the funds used to finance the movie.
00:41:02.045 --> 00:41:05.586
And unfortunately, this film is difficult to come by.
00:41:05.586 --> 00:41:08.297
If not, it's not currently streaming on any platform.
00:41:08.297 --> 00:41:12.469
Uh, it has not been re-released on physical media in decades.
00:41:12.469 --> 00:41:20.373
So good luck out there if you want to dig up this masterpiece after listening to everything we have to say about it.
00:41:20.452 --> 00:41:21.889
but also we have to know.
00:41:21.889 --> 00:41:24.911
There were two video games.
00:41:24.971 --> 00:41:40.094
And no matter what we're about to say regarding the movie, the two X vs Sever video games released as first person shooters for the Game Boy Advance, the first was titled Just X vs Sever, was released before the movie in November 2001.
00:41:40.094 --> 00:41:50.007
It is based on an earlier draft of the movie script, and the game, unlike the film, consistently scores high with critics with an average rating of nine out of ten.
00:41:50.007 --> 00:41:51.210
Absolutely.
00:41:51.273 --> 00:42:09.619
The sequel game, with the full title Ballistic X vs Sever, or X vs Sever to Ballistic in the UK, follows the film's plotline much more closely and once again received positive reviews, and both are considered to be two of the best first person shooters for the Game Boy Advance ever released.
00:42:09.820 --> 00:42:14.326
Thus endeth the Elevage of X vs Sever.
00:42:14.326 --> 00:42:16.025
Just really quickly though, people have pointed that out.
00:42:16.025 --> 00:42:23.489
They actually called the movie a sp uh like a an adaptation of the games or a spin-off from the games because the games were so much better um liked.
00:42:23.489 --> 00:42:26.909
And it is so strange that it came out, was it ten months ahead of the movie?
00:42:26.909 --> 00:42:36.425
Like I remember people made jokes about before Goldeneye Double O seven was released on the N sixty four because it came out in nineteen ninety seven, two years after Goldeneye the film.
00:42:36.425 --> 00:42:38.802
And everyone's like, Who cares about a two year old movie?
00:42:38.802 --> 00:42:41.996
And then of course it turned out to be one of the best first person shooters ever made.
00:42:41.996 --> 00:42:42.786
Great video games.
00:42:42.786 --> 00:42:50.878
By the way, if you want some real entertainment, go into any of the sort of sh chat rooms or if chatrooms are still a thing, uh discussing this film.
00:42:50.878 --> 00:42:58.068
You'll find people who uh were introduced to the IP via the video game and then went back and watched the film.
00:42:58.148 --> 00:43:01.248
Some You gotta you gotta upgrade your lingo there, Dallas.
00:43:01.248 --> 00:43:06.157
They're not chat risks Yeah, your young chatrooms.
00:43:06.349 --> 00:43:15.838
It's funny too because the usual the usual thing is that there's a gr there's a good movie and then they pay some studio like rock bottom prices to knock out a shitty game just to tie it in.
00:43:15.838 --> 00:43:20.231
It's so rare to have a good game tied into what's considered a shitty movie.
00:43:20.333 --> 00:43:38.289
And now we enter the section where we break down the movie into three acts and discuss both our thoughts on the movie and how they evolved act by act, and also how our wine pairing thoughts evolved on top of that, ending with our respective perfect wine pairings for the movie.
00:43:38.289 --> 00:43:54.034
For X for a ballistic X vs Sever, Act One is spoiler free, but Act Two is stupidly plot twisty, so Don't venture beyond Act One if you don't want to know the Impossible 90s style plot twist in advance.
00:43:54.036 --> 00:43:55.336
And here we go.
00:43:55.336 --> 00:43:56.378
Act one.
00:44:11.447 --> 00:44:20.880
Driving home, Vin, played by Talesa Soto, is stopped by agents from the Defense Intelligence Agency, or the DIA, and they take her son Michael.
00:44:20.880 --> 00:44:27.983
On the orders of Michael's father and Vin's ex husband, DIA director Robert Gant, played by Greg Henry.
00:44:27.983 --> 00:44:30.483
Vin is furious, but can't stop them.
00:44:30.483 --> 00:44:37.715
Then, on the way to Gantt, the group is ambushed by Sever, played by Lucy Liu, who kidnaps Michael.
00:44:37.885 --> 00:44:48.010
Elsewhere, FBI agent Jeremiah X, played by Antonio Banderas, drinks in a bar and mourns his wife, who died many, many years ago.
00:44:48.010 --> 00:45:02.335
His old boss, Julia Martin, played by Miguel Sandoval, asks him to return to investigate the Gantt case in exchange for information on his wife, Rain, who he claims is in fact still alive.
00:45:02.335 --> 00:45:06.597
But he won't reveal more information until X finishes the assignment.
00:45:06.931 --> 00:45:25.496
X agrees and begins to hunt sever, realizing she must be one of the orphan Chinese girls, female babies who weren't wanted by families during China's one-child policy and so adopted by the DIA and trained for assassin work, violence being the only thing they've ever known.
00:45:25.516 --> 00:45:33.353
Meanwhile, Gant executes the only surviving member of Michael's entourage for having lost his son before ordering his elite agents.
00:45:33.353 --> 00:45:40.358
led by his right hand man Ross, played by Ray Park, to pursue Sever and rescue Michael.
00:45:40.579 --> 00:45:55.251
The first major set piece occurs in a public space, with Gant's agents cornering Sever, but seemingly only because she lets them, and proceeds to wipe the floor with them while causing maximum collateral damage to Vancouver's infrastructure.
00:45:55.251 --> 00:45:57.483
X and Julio soon arrive.
00:45:57.483 --> 00:46:04.940
Sever shoots Julio, who possibly uh dies, uh tells X that Sever knows where his wife is.
00:46:04.940 --> 00:46:06.411
So X gives chase.
00:46:06.411 --> 00:46:17.706
While Sever is methodical and precise, X is a pure brawler, surviving by the skin of his teeth, but virtually fearless in his pursuit of a suspect.
00:46:17.706 --> 00:46:24.509
Sever escapes, but takes note that X demanded information about his wife.
00:46:24.509 --> 00:46:26.126
Alright, what are we thinking here, boys?
00:46:26.126 --> 00:46:27.501
That's roughly the first thirty minutes.
00:46:27.501 --> 00:46:28.355
What are we thinking?
00:46:28.355 --> 00:46:31.117
Nick, what did you think when you started this movie?
00:46:31.117 --> 00:46:41.932
I'm just gonna say that I think Dallas has done very, very well there because uh I asked um ChatGPT to summarize the plot of Ballistic X vs Server, and this is the verbatim response I got.
00:46:41.932 --> 00:46:48.240
Quote, This may be the first time you've given me a task where the correct response begins, I can try, but no promises.
00:46:55.197 --> 00:46:57.996
I love everything about this movie, by the way.
00:46:58.550 --> 00:46:59.010
I know.
00:46:59.010 --> 00:47:07.653
Now famously the the the fact that this film went through multiple rewrites with a script originating in the nineteen eighties.
00:47:07.893 --> 00:47:15.978
Then I think also possibly because not to be uncharitable, but you're dealing with a writer director who English is not his first language.
00:47:15.978 --> 00:47:25.382
And then of course the film was taken away from him and recut o against his wishes in post production, rendering the end result fairly incoherent.
00:47:25.748 --> 00:47:33.427
Even exclud including, for example, why this is all happening in Vancouver when the DIA and FBI are two US domestic agencies.
00:47:33.427 --> 00:47:37.708
Like why are they having this fight in a foreign country and why aren't the Mounties intervening?
00:47:37.708 --> 00:47:38.961
Never explained.
00:47:39.583 --> 00:47:43.639
Well I mean it's shot in Vancouver, but it's like you know you don't have to tell us that.
00:47:43.639 --> 00:47:44.396
Yeah.
00:47:44.396 --> 00:47:45.291
Yeah.
00:47:49.213 --> 00:48:07.514
Yeah, as you know, like a lot of Hollywood movies are shot in Vancouver, but they usually at least try and pretend it's Portland or Seattle or the Pacific Northwest or sometimes they try and pretend it's LA and or New York and just, you know, comp compose in the skylines that you know into the background very unconvincingly 'cause it still looks like rainy Vancouver.
00:48:07.514 --> 00:48:07.856
Right.
00:48:07.856 --> 00:48:17.505
But anyway, they they just said, fuck it, let's just set it in Vancouver So this is actually a great film to show off Vancouver if you've been there.
00:48:17.505 --> 00:48:20.128
But it doesn't make any sense for the story.
00:48:20.128 --> 00:48:20.418
No.
00:48:20.418 --> 00:48:32.737
And so just the other thing too is that the the biggest problem with the film and why people have so much trouble connecting with it, especially during this first act, is that the film seems determined to withhold information as long as possible.
00:48:32.777 --> 00:48:39.771
And this is something that a screenplay really needs to get right, the pace at which crucial information for the plot is revealed.
00:48:39.903 --> 00:48:48.416
In sort of any film, if the characters are too far behind the audience, it's very frustrating watching them slowly try and put the pieces together.
00:48:48.416 --> 00:48:54.717
But if they're too far ahead of the audience, then the that audience is gets confused and disengaged.
00:48:54.717 --> 00:49:01.440
And then you sort of need your regular Christopher Nolan style exposition dumps to bring the people, everybody sort of up to speed.
00:49:01.440 --> 00:49:08.108
So the pace at which information is revealed is usually the marker of a really good screenplay and a really good film.
00:49:08.108 --> 00:49:09.548
And that's where this one suffers.
00:49:09.548 --> 00:49:24.027
And I do mostly not so much blame the script, but the editing, where a lot of times if a movie tests poorly, what they'll do is that they'll cut all the as man much of the talking as they can, but leave in all the action, all the money shots.
00:49:24.027 --> 00:49:27.322
And you can't cla say that this film doesn't deliver on the action.
00:49:27.322 --> 00:49:28.489
It absolutely does.
00:49:28.489 --> 00:49:36.563
But it really feels like there's about 15 minutes of exposition and backstory establishing who all these people are, their interrelations.
00:49:36.619 --> 00:49:42.001
And the stakes of the situation and why she's They get from anywhere to anywhere else?
00:49:42.001 --> 00:49:43.121
What the hell?
00:49:43.121 --> 00:49:47.516
They are literally like in one place and then it's just like, and now we're here.
00:49:47.516 --> 00:49:49.719
And I'm like, whoa, why are you there?
00:49:49.719 --> 00:49:51.650
Well, give us something.
00:49:51.731 --> 00:49:55.525
So, Dallas, how much did you still like this movie?
00:49:55.525 --> 00:49:57.476
Uh and just go with the first act.
00:49:57.476 --> 00:49:58.851
Just go with the Okay, first act.
00:49:58.851 --> 00:49:59.983
Let's start with first act.
00:49:59.983 --> 00:50:00.983
So here's the thing.
00:50:00.983 --> 00:50:14.610
um When we rewatch movies here that I haven't seen in a while, and I am a guy who will, if it's something I really enjoy, I I actively only watch it oh once because I want it to remain good in my memory.
00:50:14.610 --> 00:50:26.538
um And approaching this for the second time, Act One, the opening sequence was fantastic to me.
00:50:26.538 --> 00:50:30.346
It was You know, I I wasn't expecting cinema.
00:50:30.346 --> 00:50:38.842
I was not expecting uh a you know a treatise on any sort of true human experience.
00:50:38.842 --> 00:50:40.304
I I I wasn't.
00:50:40.304 --> 00:50:50.811
I was expecting to see something that felt like an 80s blockbuster, mid-80s blockbuster film done with late 90s tech.
00:50:50.913 --> 00:50:53.414
And that's precisely what I got.
00:50:53.414 --> 00:50:57.739
It felt like a terrestrial matrix, if that makes sense, right?
00:50:57.739 --> 00:51:05.074
So The Matrix was so CGI heavy and so glossy and so slick and so patent leather, everything about it.
00:51:05.074 --> 00:51:06.385
The whites were crisp, everything.
00:51:06.385 --> 00:51:10.898
It's just sort of it's clearly a com a computer sort of uh endeavor.
00:51:10.898 --> 00:51:18.101
This film, Act One, felt like a terrestrial treatment on a similar concept.
00:51:18.101 --> 00:51:22.864
And I fucking loved it.
00:51:23.804 --> 00:51:27.306
Act one is just The perfect onboarding to me.
00:51:27.306 --> 00:51:32.871
I I was sitting here going, huh, I wonder why everyone hates this, because I think this is great.
00:51:32.871 --> 00:51:34.913
Is the storytelled is the script fantastic?
00:51:34.913 --> 00:51:35.893
Absolutely not.
00:51:35.893 --> 00:51:48.782
But it gives you s there's so many sort of holes in plot and at the same time so many so much exposition and Well but in Act One there's no holes yet, to be fair.
00:51:48.782 --> 00:51:52.608
Well they're holes in the sense that in the su what I'm saying, they're holes.
00:51:52.608 --> 00:51:54.054
There's no plateau yet.
00:51:54.054 --> 00:51:57.721
The whole like act one basically makes total sense.
00:51:58.030 --> 00:51:58.795
Well that's my point.
00:51:58.795 --> 00:52:04.811
So all all the dialogue is a series of cryptic statements alluding to events that will never be explained.
00:52:04.811 --> 00:52:05.463
Precisely.
00:52:05.463 --> 00:52:06.764
So those are the holes I'm referencing.
00:52:06.764 --> 00:52:10.090
It's like it's just these sort of like okay, that's those are words.
00:52:10.090 --> 00:52:10.550
interesting.
00:52:10.550 --> 00:52:11.032
Okay.
00:52:11.032 --> 00:52:12.829
So so I'm gonna push back.
00:52:12.829 --> 00:52:21.954
I'm gonna push back on that a little bit because I think everything in Act One actually, and I'm not saying this to defend the movie because it drops the ball big time on all of these weird plot twists.
00:52:21.954 --> 00:52:29.708
But in act one, it is setting everything up properly, I do think, in like the first 30 minutes, where it's like, I lost my wife.
00:52:29.708 --> 00:52:30.829
She might still be alive.
00:52:30.829 --> 00:52:32.239
Do we know anything about this wife?
00:52:32.239 --> 00:52:33.530
No, that's a little weird.
00:52:33.530 --> 00:52:36.954
But like we don't see flashbacks, we don't see anything, right?
00:52:36.954 --> 00:52:39.052
And normally that's what you'd get.
00:52:39.052 --> 00:52:41.373
But you understand what the assignment is.
00:52:41.373 --> 00:52:44.586
It's like he li his wife he thought she was dead.
00:52:44.586 --> 00:52:45.728
She might be alive.
00:52:45.728 --> 00:52:49.351
The fact that they're not showing you anything, you know, is meaningful.
00:52:49.351 --> 00:52:52.914
You know they can't show you anything because that would give something away.
00:52:52.914 --> 00:52:56.936
Or at least hopefully so because that's the only reason they should not be showing us anything.
00:52:56.936 --> 00:52:57.347
Right.
00:52:57.347 --> 00:53:01.800
You're like, okay, that there's a reason they're not showing us that, and that's intriguing.
00:53:01.800 --> 00:53:07.994
I found myself once again falling in, getting absorbed by the weirdness.
00:53:07.994 --> 00:53:09.338
of the narrative.
00:53:09.338 --> 00:53:12.909
And at least at this point, it does make sense.
00:53:12.909 --> 00:53:16.262
It's just weird how it's being executed.
00:53:16.262 --> 00:53:17.864
All right.
00:53:17.864 --> 00:53:25.101
I think the reality I think I think we land between someplace between weird and and and plot hole for sure.
00:53:25.101 --> 00:53:27.418
But you know But I agree.
00:53:27.418 --> 00:53:28.023
I agree.
00:53:28.023 --> 00:53:39.635
Act one for me, um, and I keep coming back to this sort of like terrestrial version of The Matrix because I do remember when this film came out, I'm not sure if I saw it.
00:53:40.202 --> 00:53:45.557
in order to kind of reject the matrix concept, because that's kind of my personality sometimes.
00:53:46.282 --> 00:53:47.871
it was like I'm not gonna see that.
00:53:47.871 --> 00:53:49.592
Everyone's gonna I'm gonna see this, you know.
00:53:49.592 --> 00:53:53.978
Uh but it just it felt so accessible.
00:53:53.978 --> 00:53:55.980
It felt so accessible.
00:53:55.980 --> 00:53:58.632
Act one, um, there's great mystery.
00:53:58.632 --> 00:54:00.545
Like you said, we get the go ahead.
00:54:00.545 --> 00:54:11.918
We're gonna No, I was just gonna say, yeah, I mean, it until you learn until the high tech element is introduced, which is somewhere, I think it's basically act two that that gets introduced, like and and is mentioned in specific.
00:54:11.918 --> 00:54:14.880
This is like there's not there's no high concept to this.
00:54:14.880 --> 00:54:19.193
It's very plain and straightforward.
00:54:19.193 --> 00:54:29.813
Um, it's only later that I realize because you're trying to give I think in act in any act one, you're kind of giving this the story the benefit of the doubt in terms of like you're gonna lead me somewhere.
00:54:29.974 --> 00:54:36.927
So I don't know what's going on exactly, but that's okay because you're you're like Nick said, it's all cryptic.
00:54:36.927 --> 00:54:38.969
Like plainly it's meant to be mysterious.
00:54:38.969 --> 00:54:43.862
So okay, let's go where you're taking me and you'll reveal the mystery when we get there.
00:54:43.862 --> 00:54:56.869
But there are some problems with the narrative in terms of only later was I like, you know, one, they never really establish like Talisa Soto and Gant.
00:54:56.922 --> 00:54:58.282
I'm like, are they married?
00:54:58.282 --> 00:54:59.182
Are they divorced?
00:54:59.182 --> 00:55:00.222
Are they estranged?
00:55:00.222 --> 00:55:03.695
Like, what is their where even are they in their relationship?
00:55:03.695 --> 00:55:09.827
And it's they just sort of jump from one thing where he's taking her son out of the car like a custody battle.
00:55:09.827 --> 00:55:13.804
But then when the son's missing, it's like they're living together again.
00:55:13.804 --> 00:55:15.789
And I'm like, wait, are you living together?
00:55:15.789 --> 00:55:20.331
And the the script never comes out and says one thing or another.
00:55:20.331 --> 00:55:25.826
So the audience doesn't actually know what these two characters are.
00:55:25.826 --> 00:55:30.358
Yeah, that's That's what I'm that's the sort of thing I'm driving at, what Dave's talking about there.
00:55:30.358 --> 00:55:36.811
It's like we need to know this relationship better between, you know, the major characters.
00:55:36.811 --> 00:55:41.733
Like, for example, why what's the relationship between Gant and Sever?
00:55:41.733 --> 00:55:42.373
Right.
00:55:42.373 --> 00:55:45.614
Why is X recruited when he's moping in a bar?
00:55:45.614 --> 00:55:50.487
Weren't there more active non alcoholic agents who could be recruited to do this job?
00:55:50.487 --> 00:55:50.978
Right.
00:55:50.978 --> 00:55:52.213
Who weren't still moping.
00:55:52.213 --> 00:55:52.795
What was the quote?
00:55:52.795 --> 00:55:53.980
Who weren't still moping?
00:55:53.980 --> 00:55:57.516
you have no other he's like you're our only hope, you're the only one that can do this.
00:55:57.516 --> 00:56:00.710
And I'm like you have no one else as good as this guy?
00:56:00.710 --> 00:56:01.240
Yeah.
00:56:01.240 --> 00:56:02.853
He's still moving at a bar.
00:56:02.853 --> 00:56:03.295
Right.
00:56:03.295 --> 00:56:03.675
Right.
00:56:03.675 --> 00:56:04.735
Eight years later.
00:56:04.735 --> 00:56:09.327
So there is a thing with like movies where you don't have to explain everything straight up.
00:56:09.327 --> 00:56:15.931
It's okay for inexplicable things to happen, but the expectation the audience has is that they will eventually be addressed.
00:56:15.931 --> 00:56:22.974
When they're not eventually addressed, that retroactively weakens that mystery mystery setup.
00:56:23.393 --> 00:56:28.456
So in you wanna gotta get to the movie at the end and go, that's what everything meant.
00:56:28.456 --> 00:56:39.880
Whereas if you in the movie still with a lot of questions, that's when it feels like the narrative will be unsatisfying even if in many other cases, like the action, the cinematography, that really d does satisfy.
00:56:39.882 --> 00:56:46.157
Yeah, there's very little work done here in sort of making the audience care about these kids.
00:56:46.157 --> 00:56:49.157
uh Yeah.
00:56:49.706 --> 00:56:59.117
Yeah and for example, like for Sever Lu sorry, just you talk about the end of Act One, Lucy Lut or Sever doesn't have a line of dialogue until about thirty minutes into the movie.
00:56:59.117 --> 00:57:03.632
And you go, Okay, they're playing her as this strong silent type, but it's also there's no character there.
00:57:03.632 --> 00:57:06.525
It's like why do we need to care about Agent Sever?
00:57:06.525 --> 00:57:08.887
Like we at least we know X has got a dead wife.
00:57:08.887 --> 00:57:11.429
You know, the classic Christopher Nolan motivation.
00:57:11.487 --> 00:57:11.878
Right.
00:57:11.878 --> 00:57:16.887
And he's drinking himself silly and but is still competent even when drunk.
00:57:16.887 --> 00:57:17.539
Right.
00:57:17.539 --> 00:57:23.083
can still take down other FBI agents with dru Right, he's the only guy who can get the job done still.
00:57:23.327 --> 00:57:33.577
I was talking with Nick on Discord right before we started, shortly before we started recording, and we basically mentioned the fact that like this movie, like the plot twists are the plot.
00:57:33.577 --> 00:57:36.920
Like there is ostensibly no other plot to this movie.
00:57:37.360 --> 00:57:37.661
Right.
00:57:37.661 --> 00:57:41.465
It's just the plot twists, and same thing with the characterization.
00:57:41.465 --> 00:57:46.123
The characterization is entirely embedded in the plot.
00:57:46.123 --> 00:57:51.340
The past that we they think they're peppering with us and the plot twist, and there's nothing in between.
00:57:51.340 --> 00:57:56.724
No one even bot like we mentioned, no one even bothers to tell us what is the current status of these two people.
00:57:56.724 --> 00:57:58.195
And they're like, Who cares?
00:57:58.197 --> 00:58:03.039
This is what I was saying about the editing, because like I agree with what you just said, Dave, that it's all twists.
00:58:03.039 --> 00:58:17.764
But for example, if you set up, say that um Gantt was Sever's mentor and they had this sort of mentor mentee relationship, but then he turns out that he's a villain and he's with this high technology and he's just in it for the money, that would be like a shocking betrayal.
00:58:17.764 --> 00:58:22.324
But because we don't know what their relationship is, we can't feel this betrayal.
00:58:22.324 --> 00:58:27.259
So if you edit out all of the actual plot and just leave in the twists.
00:58:27.259 --> 00:58:27.559
Yeah.
00:58:27.559 --> 00:58:27.802
Yes.
00:58:27.802 --> 00:58:29.655
You've kind of got nothing there.
00:58:29.655 --> 00:58:31.927
There's no emotional propulsion at all.
00:58:31.927 --> 00:58:36.242
Like these characters are not on any sort of emotional trajectory in relation to one another.
00:58:36.242 --> 00:58:43.956
It's all just sort of And there are parts to the twists that are dropped in the weird like we'll get to act three when we get to act three.
00:58:43.956 --> 00:58:51.820
But at the very end, it's kind of mentioned that like Gantt faked his death and became under a new name.
00:58:51.820 --> 00:58:54.800
And I'm like, wait, when the fuck did that happen?
00:58:54.800 --> 00:59:00.684
And it's like some things are revealed at these weird you can tell something was edited out.
00:59:00.684 --> 00:59:02.585
And then someone mentions it.
00:59:02.585 --> 00:59:05.545
And sometimes the plot twist, like the mention of it.
00:59:05.568 --> 00:59:06.938
Is not a momentous moment.
00:59:06.938 --> 00:59:09.579
Like the momentous moment was something else they took out.
00:59:09.579 --> 00:59:12.681
And then we're just getting it's getting repeated later.
00:59:12.681 --> 00:59:15.193
And you're like, wait, when did we find out that?
00:59:15.193 --> 00:59:17.945
That makes that almost makes no sense.
00:59:17.945 --> 00:59:26.469
Um, and we'll get to the dead wife part in act two here, but it's it's a doozy and is also handled bizarrely.
00:59:26.469 --> 00:59:31.952
Even though I I had to stop the movie and rewind because I was like, Did I miss something?
00:59:31.952 --> 00:59:33.932
And no, I didn't miss anything.
00:59:33.932 --> 00:59:35.065
We had literally come.
00:59:35.065 --> 00:59:35.829
It's against the rules.
00:59:35.829 --> 00:59:36.601
No rewinding.
00:59:36.601 --> 00:59:37.813
No rewinding.
00:59:37.822 --> 00:59:39.961
And I was like I was like, wow.
00:59:39.961 --> 00:59:43.454
I I and again, I kind of was like, Well, let's see where the movie goes with this.
00:59:43.454 --> 00:59:45.463
Maybe they'll give us more information.
00:59:45.503 --> 00:59:48.045
Kinda a little, but not nearly enough.
00:59:48.045 --> 00:59:49.724
So I'm I do agree with Nick.
00:59:49.724 --> 00:59:52.155
Um I will w it's interesting, Dallas.
00:59:52.155 --> 00:59:54.206
I actually hated the opening action scene.
00:59:54.206 --> 00:59:59.527
Um I thought it was ver I thought it was the style was kind of there, but I'm like, this is poorly done.
00:59:59.527 --> 01:00:07.922
There's this one scene where she drives the giant trash truck out and just into this car, and I'm like I thought it was the car everyone was in.
01:00:07.922 --> 01:00:10.664
Why else would you just drive it into this car like that?
01:00:10.664 --> 01:00:15.865
And no, it's just some other random and I mean they spend a lot of time on how she's driving into this car and destroying it.
01:00:15.865 --> 01:00:20.277
And then the other guy and the people are just like in their car watching it happen.
01:00:20.277 --> 01:00:22.188
They don't get out, they're just like, What?
01:00:22.188 --> 01:00:31.472
And after this extended period of destruction, they're finally like, maybe we should get out of our and she drops smoke bombs and then all the smoke is up.
01:00:31.472 --> 01:00:33.293
And then they decide to get out of the car.
01:00:33.293 --> 01:00:50.619
And I'm like Even just before that just before that date before that date, there's a great bit where X and another guy are in a car in another part of the city and they hear on the police radio there's a woman shooting and he goes They teleport directly to that location.
01:00:50.619 --> 01:00:53.280
Like they could have been on the other side of the city, but it doesn't matter.
01:00:53.280 --> 01:00:55.159
They they get there in in ten seconds.
01:00:55.159 --> 01:01:05.393
To wrap this up, we we do have to talk about real quickly why notions, but just to wrap this up, um the first action, but the section we're almost there.
01:01:05.393 --> 01:01:06.164
We're almost there, Nick.
01:01:06.164 --> 01:01:09.134
He that's one he's he gets to read, so we're gonna get there.
01:01:09.614 --> 01:01:13.356
but I did want to mention the second action set piece, the one that wraps up act one.
01:01:13.356 --> 01:01:15.036
That's when the movie hooked me.
01:01:15.036 --> 01:01:19.458
That was so over the top and so outlandish and so extended.
01:01:19.458 --> 01:01:22.132
And I'm like We are one third into this movie.
01:01:22.132 --> 01:01:23.021
This is amazing.
01:01:23.021 --> 01:01:24.402
I wonder what's coming next.
01:01:24.402 --> 01:01:27.735
And so that's where I was ultimately sold.
01:01:27.846 --> 01:01:29.157
now, wine thoughts.
01:01:29.157 --> 01:01:29.934
Go go ahead.
01:01:29.934 --> 01:01:32.025
I was just gonna say really quickly that I agree with you.
01:01:32.025 --> 01:01:38.436
And and when Dallas used the word propulsive, I think the action is propulsive, the narrative is inert.
01:01:38.436 --> 01:01:46.634
And that's the thing is that when you take out that exposition, you don't cut down on the talking scenes, you just render the talking scenes you've got left irrelevant.
01:01:46.634 --> 01:01:49.159
You sort of you do need that connective tissue.
01:01:49.159 --> 01:01:57.112
But when we get to the action and some of those very matrix-inspired slow-mo with long trench coats and sunglasses and bullet casings falling.
01:01:57.112 --> 01:02:01.293
But especially that one shot with the guy falling off the roof onto the the car.
01:02:01.293 --> 01:02:04.239
I'm like, oh why this guy was hired.
01:02:04.239 --> 01:02:09.789
He's he action wise he's really delivering the appropriately chaos.
01:02:09.789 --> 01:02:10.150
Right.
01:02:10.150 --> 01:02:11.052
It is ballistic.
01:02:11.052 --> 01:02:13.244
The film is ballistic.
01:02:13.244 --> 01:02:18.128
Like it truly does live up to that term in my the narrative is weirdly it's funny.
01:02:18.128 --> 01:02:22.530
I was thinking today about passive voice versus active voice in writing, right?
01:02:22.530 --> 01:02:35.574
And you're always supposed to like you can use passive voice uh ar artistically sometimes, but you're supposed to adhere mostly to active voice because otherwise there's no life to what you're describing to like the actions people are taking or why they're taking them.
01:02:35.574 --> 01:02:39.474
You're talking about it in a way that keeps the audience kind of distant.
01:02:39.474 --> 01:02:43.541
And the narrative in this movie is like all the backstory.
01:02:43.541 --> 01:02:47.407
All even what people are doing and what they're discovering, it's all passive voice.
01:02:47.407 --> 01:02:50.041
Like from a filmic standpoint.
01:02:50.041 --> 01:02:53.797
It's all like they just sort of show up, but they're not taking action.
01:02:53.797 --> 01:02:57.407
They're just sort of showing up and the thing is revealed because Yeah.
01:02:57.407 --> 01:03:04.757
Because when you when you take away that that character motivation, it's no longer X does this, Sever does this, it's this happens.
01:03:04.757 --> 01:03:05.557
Right.
01:03:07.137 --> 01:03:08.302
That happens, yes.
01:03:08.632 --> 01:03:08.891
Right.
01:03:08.891 --> 01:03:09.382
Yes.
01:03:09.382 --> 01:03:10.322
Exactly.
01:03:10.322 --> 01:03:10.813
All right.
01:03:10.813 --> 01:03:12.735
So, wine thoughts, guys.
01:03:12.735 --> 01:03:14.126
I'll kick us off here.
01:03:14.126 --> 01:03:24.914
You know, the style of this movie, it's slick, it's it's ballistic, it's cool, it's blacks and blues and steel colors, slow-mo, wire work galore, explosions.
01:03:24.914 --> 01:03:30.150
Um, it's interesting because Equilibrium came out the same year, Underworld the next year.
01:03:30.150 --> 01:03:31.641
Like this is where we were.
01:03:31.641 --> 01:03:34.443
um in action film.
01:03:34.443 --> 01:03:35.744
Boondock Saints.
01:03:35.744 --> 01:03:36.585
Yes.
01:03:36.585 --> 01:03:37.094
Right.
01:03:37.094 --> 01:03:37.565
Yeah.
01:03:37.565 --> 01:03:41.311
So I was thinking this is a maligned movie.
01:03:41.311 --> 01:03:44.211
So maybe a maligned grape.
01:03:44.211 --> 01:03:46.882
Something that like wine snobs turn their nose up at.
01:03:46.882 --> 01:03:48.313
Like it's rarely great.
01:03:48.313 --> 01:03:53.536
It's something that you're like, ah, you know, if you're if you really know what you're talking about, wine, you're not gonna drink that grape.
01:03:53.536 --> 01:03:55.856
Like it's just it's just not good enough.
01:03:55.856 --> 01:04:00.278
So maybe something considered silly, unserious, just like this movie.
01:04:00.278 --> 01:04:07.751
And something definitely, no matter what the maligned grape was, I was thinking something dark, style over substance, not.
01:04:08.686 --> 01:04:17.088
deep in in in richness and color, maybe, but not complex, convoluted, but not necessarily complex.
01:04:17.088 --> 01:04:18.148
It's got a lot going on.
01:04:18.148 --> 01:04:31.413
It's got a lot in it, but it's, you know, that's where it's that's where it's not taken that seriously is the complexity, the elegance, that nuance, those missing scenes that could have made this all complex rather than convoluted are is missing.
01:04:31.413 --> 01:04:33.554
So something of that nature.
01:04:33.554 --> 01:04:35.083
Dallas, what were you thinking?
01:15:20.637 --> 01:15:22.961
That's that's that's uh yeah.
01:15:22.961 --> 01:15:24.162
That's an understatement.
01:15:24.162 --> 01:15:27.521
Um yeah, that is an understatement.
01:15:27.521 --> 01:15:36.416
But I do agree, th this book this this film is so comic boogie so comic booky, it is so comic booky from the beginning.
01:15:36.416 --> 01:15:39.789
And so you're right, I am X severus.
01:15:39.789 --> 01:15:44.247
uh I'm like, Jesus Christ, could you be more nineties comic book?
01:15:44.247 --> 01:15:46.055
Right, just I mean animals.
01:15:46.055 --> 01:15:48.047
isn't it is it it's Jeremiah X.
01:15:48.047 --> 01:15:50.872
He gets a first name, but Sever never gets a first name.
01:15:50.872 --> 01:15:52.225
She's just Sever.
01:15:52.225 --> 01:15:54.639
She is literally like a comic book character.
01:15:54.639 --> 01:15:55.958
She just has one.
01:15:55.958 --> 01:16:11.778
I think that's the that's the origin of her a uh China what's it the the the Well I wonder I I wonder if she ever had a full name because they took her as a kid and just probably gave her a code name.
01:16:11.778 --> 01:16:12.248
That's what I'm saying.
01:16:12.248 --> 01:16:13.661
That's probably just a cold name, right?
01:16:13.661 --> 01:16:25.622
But you know maybe in uh once I start this petition for the sequel uh for Lucy Lou and uh Antonio Banderas to team up again, we'll get some backstory on.
01:16:25.622 --> 01:16:29.212
I doubt they would ever want to team up for a sequel to this.
01:16:29.212 --> 01:16:32.154
got a team up for you got a team, you got it.
01:16:32.154 --> 01:16:36.206
everyone is trying to forget this movie to the best of their ability.
01:16:36.206 --> 01:16:37.949
I'm gonna stay I'm gonna die on this hill.
01:16:37.949 --> 01:16:44.149
We if we're gonna do relaunches, rebrandings, or remakes, do them of bad films and make them good.
01:16:44.149 --> 01:16:49.971
Yeah, this is something like uh yeah, Dallas is a he's making a point that I often go on like, Don't remake good films.
01:16:49.971 --> 01:16:53.194
Remake bad films and do a better job of them.
01:16:53.194 --> 01:17:00.426
Escape from a remake you're never gonna do a better version of Escape from New York.
01:17:00.426 --> 01:17:01.176
Stop bothering.
01:17:01.176 --> 01:17:03.177
Pick a bad movie and try and do a better job.
01:17:03.177 --> 01:17:03.833
Dick's time.
01:17:03.833 --> 01:17:06.067
know what you're also never gonna make a better uh job?
01:17:06.067 --> 01:17:07.668
Jurassic Park, stop making sequels.
01:17:07.668 --> 01:17:09.761
Just stop It's done.
01:17:09.761 --> 01:17:10.463
We did it.
01:17:10.463 --> 01:17:12.278
It it's amazing, it still holds up.
01:17:12.278 --> 01:17:17.037
speaking of comic books, like like Marvel has spent the last twenty years trying to remake Blade.
01:17:17.037 --> 01:17:19.962
It's like you're not gonna do a better version of Blade than the Wesley Snipes one.
01:17:19.962 --> 01:17:21.068
Just give it away.
01:17:21.068 --> 01:17:24.471
It still holds up ever it just fucking still holds up anyway.
01:17:24.471 --> 01:17:24.761
Yeah, yeah.
01:17:24.761 --> 01:17:25.703
And that's the problem with that.
01:17:25.703 --> 01:17:30.824
I will say in Act Two, this scene where he shows up at the aquarium, that's the scene I had to rewind.
01:17:30.921 --> 01:17:32.587
And you're like, wait.
01:17:33.547 --> 01:17:42.171
Like, cause he just shows up and it's like, how did right, X gave him the note that she was gonna be there or or that she was gonna be at the house and then he follows her there.
01:17:42.252 --> 01:17:51.368
But then she looks at him and just knows who it is, and I'm like uh again, the film to Nick's point, the film does a shitty, shitty job.
01:17:51.583 --> 01:17:55.255
Of setting you up to understand what's happening in any given scene.
01:17:55.255 --> 01:17:59.824
So he shows up, she recognizes him and is like, my God, Jeremiah.
01:17:59.824 --> 01:18:09.078
And I'm like, What why you I thought maybe you had memory loss or something, and that's why you married someone else, and whatever.
01:18:09.078 --> 01:18:11.590
But then she recognized him like, then why were you with this?
01:18:11.590 --> 01:18:20.002
And then of course, finally in act three, there were revealed uh that there was uh both death, they faked his death.
01:18:20.002 --> 01:18:22.761
To her and they faked her death to him.
01:18:22.761 --> 01:18:23.135
Okay.
01:18:23.135 --> 01:18:23.573
Yeah.
01:18:23.573 --> 01:18:25.095
Okay, we gotta discuss that.
01:18:25.095 --> 01:18:29.310
Okay, and neither of them neither of them investigated any further, apparently.
01:18:29.310 --> 01:18:29.761
Right.
01:18:29.761 --> 01:18:34.962
The investigator didn't even investigate further.
01:18:35.202 --> 01:18:39.396
This is it's your w you had one job as an FBI or a C D I, I can't remember.
01:18:39.396 --> 01:18:42.454
Uh Eastern To fair, they don't know they're in a movie, right?
01:18:42.454 --> 01:18:47.731
So it's it is that thing where it's like when people die in real life, nobody investigates.
01:18:47.731 --> 01:18:48.363
Not really.
01:18:48.363 --> 01:19:02.729
oh But but also he's also the one guy who could crack this crazy fucking case.
01:19:02.729 --> 01:19:05.134
And he didn't investigate any further.
01:19:05.134 --> 01:19:08.386
I'm with the movie that he was too sad to it.
01:19:08.502 --> 01:19:09.984
Okay, alright.
01:19:11.221 --> 01:19:16.765
Yeah, I actually quite liked the scene in the aquarium because it was one of the few moments that were quiet and emotional.
01:19:16.765 --> 01:19:26.390
But again, the problem is that the depriv backstory that explains the emotional stakes and how everybody got to that place, both physically and emotionally.
01:19:26.390 --> 01:19:26.930
Yes.
01:19:26.930 --> 01:19:29.322
The scene doesn't deliver as it should.
01:19:29.322 --> 01:19:36.015
In a in a in the what in the original, I don't know, a hundred and fifteen minute cut of this film, that could have been a really moving scene.
01:19:36.015 --> 01:19:39.318
But at the time it's a bit confusing, but there's pretty shots of fish.
01:19:39.391 --> 01:19:40.242
Yes.
01:19:40.381 --> 01:19:44.123
And a different color scheme for like a hot couple minutes.
01:19:46.225 --> 01:19:47.104
Exactly.
01:19:47.104 --> 01:19:48.046
It's something.
01:19:48.046 --> 01:19:48.735
It's a color.
01:19:48.735 --> 01:19:50.365
It's an actual color.
01:19:51.587 --> 01:19:53.505
so yeah, I and I agree with you on that.
01:19:53.505 --> 01:19:59.076
Like that scene w like it's a good scene, but I it was more the transition that I had to rewind.
01:19:59.076 --> 01:20:08.913
Well like I felt like I looked away for thirty seconds and then I went back and I was like, Oh, no.
01:20:09.055 --> 01:20:10.770
Nope, they just showed up at the aquarium.
01:20:10.770 --> 01:20:11.851
Okay, cool.
01:20:12.735 --> 01:20:13.417
And here we are.
01:20:13.417 --> 01:20:16.832
All right, Dallas, you gotta tell us something about your wine.
01:20:16.832 --> 01:20:45.739
So here's what I meant the last time, and I'll give you more detail now about being of two minds, because there's one experience with this film, it is pure enjoyment, it is sort of hedonistic, you don't need to ask questions about logic or you know, or great plot or uh, you know, characters having motivation because they're almost unnecessary because this film is just about the explosions.
01:20:45.774 --> 01:20:51.298
Yeah, it's just the fucking explosions, and they are so satisfying and delicious.
01:20:51.298 --> 01:21:02.525
Um, and on top of that, the nonsense in the script, in the characters, in this sort of you know, the you know, the the the the screenplay, I suppose, if you can call it that.
01:21:03.328 --> 01:21:09.472
it's sort of it's absurd enough that it does kind of add a layer of sweetness.
01:21:09.472 --> 01:21:14.106
I'm not really upset by any of the nonsense that happens in this film.
01:21:14.106 --> 01:21:15.573
It kind of makes me chuckle.
01:21:15.573 --> 01:21:20.167
If it were a bit a better film that you know attempted to do something grander, I'd be upset.
01:21:20.167 --> 01:21:26.478
But when it's X versus Sever, it makes me think of purely enjoyment.
01:21:26.478 --> 01:21:28.064
Well, pure enjoyment when it comes to wine.
01:21:28.064 --> 01:21:31.728
So something like a wine cordial, even.
01:21:31.728 --> 01:21:34.871
ah Something like a mold wine.
01:21:34.871 --> 01:21:41.655
But on the other end, it's bold, it is uh bloody, it is acidic.
01:21:41.655 --> 01:21:43.117
I'm thinking.
01:21:43.511 --> 01:21:47.752
Something that kinda stands up in the middle of the road like a cab soft.
01:21:47.752 --> 01:21:50.911
So I'm I'm I'm between those two right now.
01:21:50.911 --> 01:21:51.692
Okay.
01:21:51.721 --> 01:21:52.503
All right.
01:21:52.503 --> 01:21:59.979
And yeah, for me, I mean, I'm still on that whole, you know, it's gotta be something silly, crazy, over the top.
01:22:00.402 --> 01:22:02.725
Something that, you know, this movie.
01:22:04.716 --> 01:22:08.528
This movie is especially in Act Two with the plot twists.
01:22:08.528 --> 01:22:13.859
Like the action, there's still a lot of action, but it actually takes a it dials down a little bit in Act Two.
01:22:13.859 --> 01:22:16.220
It it's almost nothing but action in Act Three.
01:22:16.220 --> 01:22:16.990
Yeah.
01:22:16.990 --> 01:22:19.652
And then they try to give us some story.
01:22:19.652 --> 01:22:23.453
And I mean, it's all just mind numbingly batshit.
01:22:23.453 --> 01:22:29.350
It's all like, you know, this was i i one of my favorite plot twists in a movie back then.
01:22:29.350 --> 01:22:33.318
I have no idea how well this holds up either, but was Wolfgang Peterson's Shattered.
01:22:33.514 --> 01:22:37.345
I saw that in the theater back in the day, and I fucking loved that ending.
01:22:37.345 --> 01:22:45.837
It it that one and Dedigin were like the two that I was like, whoa my God, I didn't know you and I love those plot twists.
01:22:46.458 --> 01:22:56.212
And this was one of those movies where uh act two is like constantly trying to throw that type of plot twist at you and it it's not earned.
01:22:56.398 --> 01:22:56.757
Right.
01:22:56.757 --> 01:22:58.519
We haven't actually gotten there yet.
01:22:58.519 --> 01:23:01.091
We haven't been on the journey with these characters for long enough.
01:23:01.091 --> 01:23:03.542
We've mostly been sidetracked with the action.
01:23:03.542 --> 01:23:11.155
But nevertheless, even though those moments aren't earned and this is silly and over the top, it fuck me, it kind of works.
01:23:11.155 --> 01:23:11.666
Yes.
01:23:11.666 --> 01:23:15.247
It all kind of works as what this movie is.
01:23:15.247 --> 01:23:18.250
Is it great writing, great cinema?
01:23:18.250 --> 01:23:19.109
No.
01:23:19.109 --> 01:23:25.912
But it really does entertain in a way that you're like, I mean, you can nitpick it.
01:23:25.912 --> 01:23:30.333
But at the same time, you're like, okay, I mean, I'm I am following it more or less.
01:23:30.333 --> 01:23:33.185
I'm questioning how we get to where we're getting.
01:23:33.185 --> 01:23:38.838
But once the movie spends five minutes there, you're like, I mean, that basically makes sense, I guess.
01:23:38.838 --> 01:23:41.610
Okay, we didn't set it up, but okay, sure, keep going.
01:23:41.610 --> 01:23:42.890
So I was thinking a wine.
01:23:42.890 --> 01:23:49.354
The wine needs to be hedonistic, like this movie, like something big over the top, uh, but authentically enjoyable.
01:23:49.354 --> 01:23:54.850
So it won't be everyone's style, much like this movie, but it should be a wine that.
01:23:54.850 --> 01:23:57.672
does work on its own terms.
01:23:57.672 --> 01:24:01.865
So everything I said before, but something honestly, it's good.
01:24:01.865 --> 01:24:02.646
It's enjoyable.
01:24:02.646 --> 01:24:05.298
So that's where I was there.
01:24:06.140 --> 01:24:07.440
All right, folks.
01:24:07.542 --> 01:24:12.065
Act three, the all action third act.
01:24:12.065 --> 01:24:17.006
This is gonna be cool I can't believe that s that someone mentioned two Tom Berenger p movies in one podcast.
01:24:17.006 --> 01:24:17.958
That's what we do here, buddy.
01:24:17.958 --> 01:24:19.051
That's what we do here.
01:24:19.051 --> 01:24:22.145
Like I said, he was an A lister in the nineties.
01:24:22.145 --> 01:24:22.894
Okay.
01:24:22.894 --> 01:24:24.889
He made a lot of it.
01:24:25.690 --> 01:24:28.387
Well, well, Sniper, Shattered.
01:24:28.387 --> 01:24:30.346
I mean these the Shattered was nineties, right?
01:24:30.346 --> 01:24:31.948
It was early nineties, but Yeah.
01:24:31.948 --> 01:24:34.847
It's still like a bit of an eight eighties hangover.
01:24:34.847 --> 01:24:35.421
All right.
01:24:35.421 --> 01:25:13.716
uh X, Rain, and Server go to Server's secret underground bunker in an abandoned train yard where they are besieged by Gantt and his minions.
01:25:13.716 --> 01:25:15.838
Everything explodes.
01:25:15.838 --> 01:25:17.119
Everything.
01:25:17.119 --> 01:25:23.485
Doesn't matter if it's tied down, doesn't matter if there's literally nothing that could make the damn thing explode, it all still explodes.
01:25:23.485 --> 01:25:27.810
Ross, Ray Park, and Sever have a decent martial arts hand-to-hand fight.
01:25:27.810 --> 01:25:33.061
This fight would have been, you pre-vised and given more time for the actress to practice in the modern era.
01:25:33.061 --> 01:25:39.712
Like if this was truly 87 Eleven nowadays, this would have been so much more, but we were not that picky in the 2000s, let me tell you.
01:25:39.712 --> 01:25:40.634
Not us Westerners.
01:25:40.634 --> 01:25:43.564
So I was pretty happy with this fight.
01:25:43.564 --> 01:25:46.649
I'm like, yeah, I know, I know this thrilled me back in the day.
01:25:46.649 --> 01:26:01.162
X and Sever eventually gained the upper hand, resulting in Gantt attempting to retrieve the soft kill from his son's arm, or the X's son's arm, but he's surprised to find that it isn't there anymore.
01:26:01.162 --> 01:26:05.337
Sever then kills Gant using a soft kill loaded bullet.
01:26:05.337 --> 01:26:06.881
I mean that's it.
01:26:06.881 --> 01:26:08.631
It's basically one long action sequence.
01:26:08.631 --> 01:26:09.886
There's nothing else to say.
01:26:09.886 --> 01:26:20.471
There's twenty minutes of explosion, some of them incredibly dangerous, one that almost hit Antonio Banderas after which he joked that he was ready to play the Phantom of the Opera if it had gone off a second earlier.
01:26:20.471 --> 01:26:21.502
Yeah, yeah.
01:26:24.046 --> 01:26:35.948
Yeah, and you can yeah and it's all in slow mo so you can see it's like that um that famous shot in Hard Boiled where Chao Yun Fat is literally running from all the pyrotechnics that were blowing up right behind him and you can see the genuine terror on his face.
01:26:35.948 --> 01:26:40.014
It's an amazing part of the movie, but apparently he was very unhappy with John Woo after that.
01:26:40.014 --> 01:26:44.301
ah Yeah, and to be fair, even that I was like, whoa.
01:26:44.301 --> 01:26:46.243
I wondered 'cause you can see it's him.
01:26:46.243 --> 01:26:50.326
He the You can see the explosion sort of fire goes over him, yeah.
01:26:50.326 --> 01:26:50.685
Yeah.
01:26:50.685 --> 01:26:52.226
And the fire definitely hits him.
01:26:52.226 --> 01:26:57.532
And then in like pretty much the same shot, like the pipes all land on him.
01:26:57.532 --> 01:26:58.743
And I'm like, wow.
01:26:58.743 --> 01:27:01.395
That was that was intense and impressive.
01:27:01.395 --> 01:27:07.010
Um, it's one of the things that I kind of like about uh X versus Sever.
01:27:07.010 --> 01:27:13.786
When I mentioned earlier in, or when the uh summary mentioned earlier here in Act One, that he's like a brawler.
01:27:13.786 --> 01:27:15.686
He gets out by the skin of his teeth.
01:27:15.686 --> 01:27:18.239
Whereas Sever is very methodical, she's very precise.
01:27:18.239 --> 01:27:24.103
She's like I only put myself in certain date ways of danger that I know I can get out of.
01:27:24.103 --> 01:27:26.154
That's kind of her MO.
01:27:26.175 --> 01:27:32.559
And he's the guy who just steps on a landmine and is like, Yeah, yeah, okay, this is what we're gonna do.
01:27:32.559 --> 01:27:35.841
And it's like, you can't get out of the way.
01:27:35.841 --> 01:27:38.671
It's like, dude, you're the one standing on it.
01:27:38.671 --> 01:27:41.503
How are they gonna getting out of the way and you're getting out of the way?
01:27:41.503 --> 01:27:44.265
But he's like, here we go, and just runs.
01:27:44.265 --> 01:27:49.856
And you're saying, d what you're saying, Dave, is that eighty minutes into this ninety minute movie we're getting some important character backstory.
01:27:49.856 --> 01:27:50.770
Final.
01:27:52.036 --> 01:27:52.655
Exactly.
01:27:52.655 --> 01:27:54.256
Some characterization.
01:27:54.256 --> 01:27:58.541
Uh some some uh minutia between the two of them.
01:27:58.541 --> 01:28:08.248
But you know, this final five like it starts all roughly one hour, just a little over the one hour mark, so you know there's a full 30 minutes left of this movie.
01:28:08.248 --> 01:28:15.673
Now, it actually only runs about 14 minutes, because I did the action junkie score that I do on Letterboxd and I I clocked all the time on these things.
01:28:15.673 --> 01:28:18.731
So it was like fourteen minutes with six minutes of denouis.
01:28:18.731 --> 01:28:20.962
And then of course all the credits and blah blah blah.
01:28:20.962 --> 01:28:27.676
So it's not that long, but the final act really is this 14 minutes of just non-stop action.
01:28:27.676 --> 01:28:31.947
And I didn't count all the stuff with Gant and his son because there's no real action going on there.
01:28:31.947 --> 01:28:35.798
It's all, you know, the the um wrapping it up.
01:28:35.798 --> 01:28:37.979
And there's just she fires one shot and he's out.
01:28:37.979 --> 01:28:38.560
He's done.
01:28:38.560 --> 01:28:39.871
So it's like that's not action.
01:28:39.871 --> 01:28:40.770
That's that doesn't count.
01:28:40.770 --> 01:28:48.524
Um, but when you include that plus a little bit of denouis at the very end, yeah, this was a satisfying wrap-up.
01:28:48.618 --> 01:28:55.457
No matter what other no matter what you can say about the story leading up to it, like this does kind of pull it all together.
01:28:55.457 --> 01:29:00.981
Even if you're even if you're kind of like like at the end I was like, wait, were they married?
01:29:00.981 --> 01:29:02.167
Does it that doesn't matter.
01:29:02.167 --> 01:29:03.006
Don't ask us.
01:29:03.006 --> 01:29:09.409
yeah, yeah, I I had to ask these questions because I'm like, I don't think the movie ever really specified half these things.
01:29:09.409 --> 01:29:12.011
But it doesn't kinda matter.
01:29:12.011 --> 01:29:13.103
You can just keep going.
01:29:13.103 --> 01:29:15.442
So Nick, your thoughts on the big wrap-up?
01:29:15.442 --> 01:29:23.792
Yeah, so a lot of that like the the train thing where they'd hidden five hundred extra guns around the train yard, that was like there were some good explosions there.
01:29:23.792 --> 01:29:34.796
But I did actually like what you were just saying about the the final sort of the Ray Park versus Lucy Liu showdown, that was definitely um a big a big a good a satisfying climax to the film.
01:29:34.796 --> 01:29:43.546
Now, as you said, if it this had been a modern eighty seven eleven film, they would have spent six months training her up like they did with Shalea Sherron before, like Atomic Blonde or something like that.
01:29:43.546 --> 01:29:50.345
It was pretty good for what it was, considering you've got a veteran martial artist in Ray Park and like I was saying, an actress City Cream Lady.
01:29:50.345 --> 01:29:51.711
Or or Allie McGeal.
01:29:51.711 --> 01:29:53.417
Yeah, yeah, uh yeah.
01:29:53.417 --> 01:29:56.819
Don't demean her by saying she was on Sex in the City.
01:29:57.198 --> 01:30:04.161
But yeah, someone who's who's had a background in more like comedies and dramas, not she'd only just recently sort of made the transition to becoming like an action star.
01:30:04.161 --> 01:30:07.180
But that delivered a sort of emotional satisfaction there.
01:30:07.180 --> 01:30:07.641
Yes.
01:30:07.641 --> 01:30:10.533
Um and so the the film kind of comes together at the end.
01:30:10.533 --> 01:30:20.164
But once again, the problem with the writing and the editing is that you shouldn't need to wait till like the end before like you really start to understand and feel the stakes.
01:30:20.164 --> 01:30:26.131
I felt the ending was it ended strong, but You y we needed more earlier in the movie as well.
01:30:26.131 --> 01:30:32.155
So it it we finished strongly, it started very weak and confusingly, at least plot and emotionally stakeswise.
01:30:32.243 --> 01:30:32.534
Yeah.
01:30:32.534 --> 01:30:32.775
Agree.
01:30:32.775 --> 01:30:33.931
Dallas, anything bad?
01:30:33.931 --> 01:30:37.283
Act three is just um it's the perfect wrap-up.
01:30:37.283 --> 01:30:39.182
It's the perfect punctuation.
01:30:39.503 --> 01:30:45.244
It makes uh almost slightly more sense than the previous acts.
01:30:45.324 --> 01:30:50.947
And because it's still kind of in that specter, uh, it's satisfying.
01:30:50.947 --> 01:30:52.466
I keep coming back to satisfying.
01:30:52.466 --> 01:30:55.507
It just everything works about it.
01:30:56.148 --> 01:31:10.345
the my favorite thing is Lucy Liu, and I didn't write down the time signature, uh, but she delivers a Comical karate chop at one point that I had to stop.
01:31:10.345 --> 01:31:12.896
Actually, I'll I'll go ahead and confess, Dave.
01:31:12.896 --> 01:31:29.037
I too rewound this film to see if I saw Lucy Lou give an unapologetic, comical karate chop to someone's neck, and they immediately fell down.
01:31:29.037 --> 01:31:30.939
I was like, yeah, that that was the moment.
01:31:30.939 --> 01:31:33.161
It was a the beginning of Act Three, Act Three.
01:31:33.161 --> 01:31:36.422
But that was the moment when I was like, Yeah, no, I love this film.
01:31:36.422 --> 01:31:37.443
I love this film.
01:31:37.443 --> 01:31:38.243
I love this film.
01:31:38.243 --> 01:31:45.519
I'm no longer looking for anything to make sense or logic or any script to sort of you know, the uh economy of the script to come through.
01:31:45.519 --> 01:31:47.760
No, this film is just fantastic.
01:31:47.760 --> 01:31:53.917
Act three is exactly what it needs to be, and it sets up the sequel very nicely.
01:31:53.917 --> 01:31:56.610
Kind of you're pitching around Hollywood, are you dumb?
01:31:56.610 --> 01:31:57.666
yes.
01:31:58.170 --> 01:32:04.832
I mean I I will still kind of say that like the movie does ultimately it does make sense.
01:32:04.832 --> 01:32:14.337
Like there's nothing that's just like glaringly we just the the gaps in getting there are huge leaps.
01:32:14.337 --> 01:32:17.139
So they're leaps in logic, they're leaps in narrative.
01:32:17.139 --> 01:32:18.689
They don't not make sense.
01:32:18.689 --> 01:32:24.862
They're just like uh the payoff is weird because we just sort of show up there.
01:32:24.862 --> 01:32:27.881
And it's like, yeah, the here here's here's here's a twist.
01:32:27.881 --> 01:32:29.345
And you're like, Thanks.
01:32:29.345 --> 01:32:37.847
Um, it's it's I mean, it th is there's nothing about it that couldn't be true, but okay, you know.
01:32:37.847 --> 01:32:43.595
That's a lot of that's a lot of acrobatics to but I mean nothing doesn't make sense.
01:32:43.595 --> 01:32:55.765
I feel like we're using that phrase too loosey-goosey, like as as an as a catch-all, to be like things that are wrong with the plot uh in terms of it being effective, but that's not the same as it not making sense.
01:32:55.765 --> 01:33:06.693
There it's just not an effective narrative emotion again to Nick's more specific points, like to emotionally and narratively, there's a lot missing from this.
01:33:06.693 --> 01:33:12.671
But it but not to the point has structural problems, but it it's not that it it it's completely incoherent.
01:33:12.671 --> 01:33:16.238
Yeah, no, not not completely incoherent, but it is.
01:33:16.951 --> 01:33:19.762
There's damning with faint price.
01:33:19.762 --> 01:33:26.649
No, it's more the fact that again, you have to sort of get to the end and then sort of look back and kind of fill in the gaps yourself.
01:33:26.649 --> 01:33:38.130
Like I was saying before, like what why did even after she thought her husband was dead, why did X's wife marry Gantt?
01:33:38.130 --> 01:33:39.851
What's their relationship there?
01:33:39.851 --> 01:33:49.569
I said, what's that relationship between Gant and She did have one line that she married him because she thought she could protect them and that that was necessary.
01:33:49.569 --> 01:33:53.485
She doesn't really extrapolate on that, but she does have that one line.
01:33:53.485 --> 01:34:00.490
Yeah, she's not much of a character, and as I said, like I don't think it's the best thing to play Sever as this b almost mute.
01:34:00.490 --> 01:34:11.377
But but when you get to the end, I said I think that it it finishes strong, you feel like you know who the characters are by then and that there is a bit of catharsis there at the end.
01:34:11.814 --> 01:34:13.662
you heard it here first, by the way, guys.
01:34:13.662 --> 01:34:16.951
Uh Nick said, watch act three first.
01:34:17.756 --> 01:34:18.533
No.
01:34:20.298 --> 01:34:24.118
It won't make sense if you just w that's like editing it down even further.
01:34:24.118 --> 01:34:26.283
That that that's not that's not helpful.
01:34:26.283 --> 01:34:30.546
W we started off talking about those reviews and it was just like a comical pylon.
01:34:30.546 --> 01:34:35.658
Like who could who could damn this film with the most, you know, cruel and cutting epithets?
01:34:35.658 --> 01:34:36.198
Right.
01:34:36.198 --> 01:34:39.719
And again, I don't think it's a masterpiece, but I don't think it's actually that bad.
01:34:39.719 --> 01:34:46.613
And if you think this is a terrible film that doesn't make sense, count yourself blessed you've not seen many truly terrible films that don't make sense.
01:34:46.613 --> 01:34:47.954
That's very true.
01:34:47.990 --> 01:34:49.703
There's so many more hair pulling movies.
01:34:49.703 --> 01:34:52.854
And this one, and again, it delivers on certain fronts for sure.
01:34:52.854 --> 01:34:55.868
Uh the action front, the style front, all that fun stuff.
01:34:55.868 --> 01:35:08.930
Which if you're looking for an early OOs movie that's just like kind of a rollickin' good time with Antonio Banderas and Lucy Lou like strutting their stuff, like leaning into the absurdity of their characters.
01:35:08.930 --> 01:35:09.822
Like Yeah.
01:35:09.822 --> 01:35:11.884
Here's a comparison that'll Dave will appreciate.
01:35:11.884 --> 01:35:19.988
Here's a good early someone I think Dallas mentioned equilibrium before, but Dave, how about Corey Yoon's So Close from two thousand and two?
01:35:21.069 --> 01:35:22.189
If yeah, I know you do.
01:35:22.189 --> 01:35:30.194
If you can get into that that incredibly of the moment early two thousands idea of cool, there's a lot to enjoy.
01:35:30.194 --> 01:35:34.597
Like the music in this, I think it's gone all the way around and I actually really liked it.
01:35:35.340 --> 01:35:35.560
Yeah.
01:35:35.560 --> 01:35:41.858
Probably technically terrible, but I really liked that combination of electronica and bad rock and rail.
01:35:42.599 --> 01:35:46.213
So but it that's what that's we were all alive in two thousand and two.
01:35:46.213 --> 01:35:48.206
That's what it sounded like.
01:35:48.993 --> 01:35:49.756
Yeah.
01:35:49.756 --> 01:36:00.981
And and another sort of uh matrixy comparison, you know, the matrix soundtrack was so popular, uh you know at also hired Don Davis, the composer of The Matrix, to to score this film.
01:36:00.981 --> 01:36:01.462
Right.
01:36:01.462 --> 01:36:02.926
And that's that was that was my next point.
01:36:02.926 --> 01:36:05.777
It's the idea that's all good.
01:36:05.837 --> 01:36:08.333
That was the guy they let go, they got rid of, right?
01:36:08.333 --> 01:36:09.255
Yes.
01:36:09.259 --> 01:36:10.119
Yes.
01:36:10.440 --> 01:36:20.051
Um for Well once again, the thing is that when you edit re edit a film, like like there probably was like a one hundred and a fifteen minute original cut that he would have scored.
01:36:20.051 --> 01:36:23.483
But when you recut a film, the music is timed to the cut.
01:36:23.483 --> 01:36:27.065
So you have to get rid of the music as long with along with that version of the movie.
01:36:27.065 --> 01:36:27.542
Yeah.
01:36:27.542 --> 01:36:28.641
Yeah, that's true.
01:36:28.641 --> 01:36:33.724
I there I I I remember there was an interview with the composer of The Abyss, the James Cameron movie.
01:36:33.724 --> 01:36:36.255
And uh there it was that Horner?
01:36:36.255 --> 01:36:37.904
I can't remember who it was.
01:36:38.864 --> 01:36:39.886
It was Horner.
01:36:39.886 --> 01:36:48.188
And Horner was like, it was one of those things where they almost had a huge falling out because James Cameron would not stop editing the fucking thing.
01:36:48.188 --> 01:36:50.529
And Horner was like, You have to stop.
01:36:50.529 --> 01:36:52.659
You can't keep sending me new edits.
01:36:52.659 --> 01:37:00.930
Like it's like I can't And Cameron apparently like he like did not really he's like, I it's not ready, like I have to keep working on it.
01:37:00.930 --> 01:37:02.288
You have to just keep changing.
01:37:02.288 --> 01:37:07.844
And it's like it's not just changing one thing, like the all the music has to change with it.
01:37:07.844 --> 01:37:12.206
Like you can't send me completely new edits of a of a scene.
01:37:12.206 --> 01:37:16.367
It's like that I'm starting almost essentially from scratch when you do that.
01:37:16.367 --> 01:37:20.029
So but yeah, there's directors don't always understand that.
01:37:20.029 --> 01:37:22.613
Whether it's producers re editing it or directors.
01:37:22.613 --> 01:37:25.621
But I mean that's the case of a director who had still had final cut.
01:37:25.621 --> 01:37:29.770
He's just fa you know, James Cameron is famously not that sensitive about other people.
01:37:29.770 --> 01:37:33.717
He's a genius, but he's got some sensitivity issues.
01:37:34.539 --> 01:37:35.920
Yes, one hundred percent.
01:37:35.920 --> 01:37:36.952
All right, Dallas.
01:37:36.952 --> 01:37:39.413
Final wine thoughts after act three.
01:37:39.413 --> 01:37:42.345
And actually, guys, every listener, one, you heard it here first.
01:37:42.345 --> 01:37:45.738
Ballistic X versus Sever may be worth your time.
01:37:45.738 --> 01:37:47.881
It's not that bad.
01:37:47.881 --> 01:37:51.884
That is high praise for the lowest ranked movie on Rotten Tomatoes.
01:37:51.884 --> 01:37:57.307
And two of us at least, me and Dallas actually really enjoy watching this.
01:37:57.309 --> 01:38:03.894
Nick, how much on on a scale of one to ten, where would you put your enjoyment levels of what of having seen this?
01:38:04.002 --> 01:38:11.568
Yeah, I mean when I write my reviews on Letterboxd, I do I I acknowledge that I'm only ever um subjective.
01:38:11.568 --> 01:38:14.470
But I try and look at things a little bit objectively.
01:38:14.470 --> 01:38:17.271
And objectively this film has a lot of problems.
01:38:17.271 --> 01:38:20.594
But subjectively, I have to say I had a good time watching it.
01:38:22.154 --> 01:38:24.247
Was it entertaining as a movie?
01:38:24.247 --> 01:38:25.318
Yes it was.
01:38:25.318 --> 01:38:29.220
Was it well written, constructed, and directed and no.
01:38:30.220 --> 01:38:32.324
Again is this is the happen so.
01:38:32.324 --> 01:38:33.206
Yeah.
01:38:33.631 --> 01:38:40.027
And so that's the whole thing about why ratings can sometimes be a bit misleading.
01:38:40.027 --> 01:38:44.371
So if I rate something two and a half stars, it's not that I hated it, right.
01:38:44.371 --> 01:38:49.184
I might have really enjoyed it, but I'm also saying beware, this film's not for everybody.
01:38:49.184 --> 01:38:53.963
This isn't exactly like the t the you know, the matrix here.
01:38:53.963 --> 01:38:54.774
Yeah.
01:38:55.194 --> 01:38:55.835
All right.
01:38:55.835 --> 01:38:57.975
So let's get into some wine here.
01:38:57.975 --> 01:39:00.077
Um, as I said, I'm of two minds.
01:39:00.077 --> 01:39:16.766
And to pick up uh with what Nick was saying, it is on one one hand, it is wonderfully enjoyable and satisfying, and it's explosive, it's ballistic, it gives you all the sort of, you know, middle of the road things of a great action film.
01:39:16.766 --> 01:39:29.931
Uh on top of that, the action set pieces themselves are Really well done when you consider how much uh explosive content there really is in this film.
01:39:29.931 --> 01:39:34.592
There is a lot of explosive content in this film.
01:39:34.592 --> 01:39:37.823
Um, it is kinetic when they are fighting.
01:39:37.823 --> 01:39:40.164
Sure, you get the occasional karate chop.
01:39:40.164 --> 01:39:41.335
Yeah, okay.
01:39:41.335 --> 01:39:47.016
But as Dave was saying, there is a comic book sort of nature uh underlying this film.
01:39:47.016 --> 01:39:51.318
Um it is a fully sort of in-your-face film.
01:39:51.518 --> 01:39:53.149
Uh it is is a little dark.
01:39:53.149 --> 01:39:54.439
It's kind of acidic to me.
01:39:54.439 --> 01:39:57.962
Um it doesn't necessarily require a whole lot of chewing.
01:39:57.962 --> 01:40:01.604
There isn't a whole lot to chew on in terms of the script.
01:40:02.604 --> 01:40:09.467
so uh on one hand I'm thinking cabsaw, then that was eventually my pairing.
01:40:10.149 --> 01:40:19.134
it is it's it's got some hearts, even though you kind of have to wait until act three to see it.
01:40:20.104 --> 01:40:21.537
it so it kind of opens up.
01:40:21.537 --> 01:40:23.211
It requires a little time.
01:40:24.154 --> 01:40:29.436
and You gotta have faith in the story.
01:40:29.436 --> 01:40:31.583
You just gotta see where it takes you.
01:40:32.078 --> 01:40:32.618
What's the problem?
01:40:32.618 --> 01:40:38.818
I don't know if it's faith in the story, cause I don't know the story re i invites a lot of faith uh in acting.
01:40:38.818 --> 01:40:41.381
It doesn't it doesn't that's why you have to have faith.
01:40:41.381 --> 01:40:46.710
uh If someone doesn't invite it, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:40:46.710 --> 01:40:47.980
Yeah, you gotta stick to the ride.
01:40:47.980 --> 01:40:49.731
You know.
01:40:49.972 --> 01:40:53.246
Because it's a ride and it's it's satisfying once it gets there.
01:40:53.246 --> 01:41:00.002
Um so anyway, I went with uh the uh precision uh cab save.
01:41:00.542 --> 01:41:04.805
it is uh all the things you expect from a cab, from a saw.
01:41:04.805 --> 01:41:18.197
It's uh bold, it is this one's highly acidic, and I think this film's kind of acidic too, because um, as we discussed, there isn't These characters kind of interact with very little conversation.
01:41:18.197 --> 01:41:24.881
It's all just very sharp slaps and stabs and you know it's it's just uh a cute in that way.
01:41:24.881 --> 01:41:28.623
And yeah, it's a cab saw for me.
01:41:28.623 --> 01:41:42.993
I will say it was going to be a mulled wine, a Danish mulled wine, in fact, uh, because it has everything in the glass and none of it should make sense together, but it's fucking fantastic.
01:41:43.369 --> 01:41:47.774
so I went with the twenty twenty three Precision Cab Saw.
01:41:49.057 --> 01:41:54.923
And that is you can find it actually right now, um, just about anywhere, but it's a Napa cab.
01:41:55.305 --> 01:41:55.990
Yeah.
01:41:55.990 --> 01:41:56.421
All right.
01:41:56.421 --> 01:41:58.423
And we will have I'll I'll look up the price point.
01:41:58.423 --> 01:42:09.243
We'll have a a go an AI free Google search link in the description of this episode so you can click it conscience free and uh see if you can find it anywhere near you.
01:42:09.243 --> 01:42:09.753
All right.
01:42:09.753 --> 01:42:11.975
Nick, what do you have for us tonight?
01:42:12.442 --> 01:42:15.712
Alright, so the wine I selected is a St.
01:42:15.712 --> 01:42:25.305
Hallet's Faith Shiraz, and this is a winery from the Barossa Valley, which, as I'm sure you guys know, is Australia's oldest and most prestigious wine region.
01:42:25.485 --> 01:42:30.667
St Hallet's was founded in 1944, and they do specialise in Shiraz.
01:42:30.747 --> 01:42:36.050
Faith, it's a classic dry Shiraz with all the usual cherry and spice notes that you'd expect.
01:42:36.050 --> 01:42:46.465
However What is different is that this is not a maligned grape, like Dave was talking about earlier, but a maligned packaging.
01:42:46.605 --> 01:42:55.777
Yes, gentlemen, this fine wine is available as a cask, or as some no doubt highly paid marketing guru has dubbed it, a bagnum.
01:42:55.777 --> 01:42:56.833
uh Yeah.
01:42:56.833 --> 01:43:01.463
Nice bag numb num, is it one point five liters?
01:43:01.703 --> 01:43:03.014
Is, that's right.
01:43:03.014 --> 01:43:15.177
So as you guys also know, for better or for worse, one of Australia's contributions to the world of wine was the invention of the cask, commonly known here as goon or chateau cardboard.
01:43:15.177 --> 01:43:25.981
Um this was invented back in 1964, although only after WINS invented the cask with a built-in tap in 1971 did it really take off.
01:43:26.028 --> 01:43:32.622
The inventor Thomas Angrove was inspired by the wineskins of ancient times, which were made with animal skins.
01:43:32.622 --> 01:43:44.769
And since all Dave, I believe you were talking earlier about using pine resin to steal ancient wine jars, or amphora, if you will, a modern approach to the same sort of thinking was how to keep wine fresh.
01:43:45.009 --> 01:43:50.252
Now, over the decades, Goon has developed a bad reputation as a cheap low-quality booze.
01:43:50.252 --> 01:43:50.882
Cheap goon.
01:43:50.882 --> 01:43:57.831
While con while connoisseurs will always prefer I'm not Oh you this is a very Australian term, goon.
01:44:00.572 --> 01:44:10.550
There's a lot of cultural negative cultural associations with it being a drink for students, hence the very popular game Goon of Fortune, which you may or may not have heard of.
01:44:11.210 --> 01:44:20.179
Well that's when you attach a bunch of goon bags to a rotary clothes line or Hill's hoist and spin them around and whoever it lands on has to drink for a certain Drink it nice, yeah.
01:44:20.179 --> 01:44:21.020
Nice.
01:44:21.020 --> 01:44:26.734
Going back to the to the Red Cena thing, that's what all the college kids, they were cheap, cheap shitty wine there too.
01:44:26.734 --> 01:44:27.478
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
01:44:27.478 --> 01:44:30.944
And and in Australia cheap university students drink goon.
01:44:30.944 --> 01:44:37.587
And of course the other good thing about goon is that once you've drunk it, you can inflate the bag with Aaron uses it as a pillow when you crashed out on the floor.
01:44:37.641 --> 01:44:39.207
Fantastic.
01:44:40.782 --> 01:44:41.072
Right.
01:44:41.072 --> 01:44:41.823
That's right.
01:44:41.823 --> 01:44:42.993
It's the Australian ingenuity.
01:44:42.993 --> 01:44:54.373
So there have been attempts in recent years to salvage the reputation of cask wine and uh so this actually the stuff I've got here, this Hall of Space Giraze, it's exactly the same as you can get in the bottle.
01:44:54.373 --> 01:44:57.095
And they they they're very keen to emphasise that.
01:44:57.115 --> 01:45:09.886
When I sort of first broke the seal I could taste a little metallic bit to it, which I think obviously comes from the fact that it's not in glass, it's in you know yeah aluminium, whatever it is in there.
01:45:09.912 --> 01:45:11.412
But overall, it is actually very drinkable.
01:45:11.412 --> 01:45:17.667
And of course, the trade-off is the convenience, because you can enjoy a glass of two and keep it fresh for several weeks as well.
01:45:17.929 --> 01:45:28.036
So I wanted to find out that like this movie, something that has a terrible reputation, goon, could be, if not entirely great, then not as bad as its reputation suggests.
01:45:28.056 --> 01:45:34.863
So once again, I'm not going to say X vs Sever was an entirely successful movie, but it was entertaining and it was fun to talk about.
01:45:34.863 --> 01:45:39.305
And I'm not going to say that cask wine is as good as bottled wine, I don't think it is.
01:45:39.319 --> 01:45:41.304
But it's not bad, very drinkable.
01:45:41.304 --> 01:45:45.192
For a lot of palates, it will be more than satisfactory, and you can have a great time doing it.
01:45:45.707 --> 01:46:00.533
I will say uh in possible defense of of the goon, um, they did a study, it was with aluminum cans, but they finally did an age study with the same wine in a bottle and the same wine in an aluminum can.
01:46:00.533 --> 01:46:09.728
And I think they did six months and a year, and there was no discernible difference between the wines anymore, between one or the other.
01:46:09.728 --> 01:46:15.400
And what might be possible though when you said you had a metallic taste, is the metallic taste are you still tasting it?
01:46:15.400 --> 01:46:18.192
Uh No, I think it might have gone away it's gone away.
01:46:18.192 --> 01:46:25.134
It was just like the first couple of sips were quite metallic and I wonder if that was the the seal or if it was I'm not sure.
01:46:25.134 --> 01:46:28.576
Because it's too well preserved in the bag.
01:46:28.576 --> 01:46:29.697
Unlike the cork.
01:46:29.697 --> 01:46:32.127
Does it exactly?
01:46:32.127 --> 01:46:34.578
So the cork, of course, allows that to some degree.
01:46:34.578 --> 01:46:37.501
So the the gases in there are constantly getting out.
01:46:37.501 --> 01:46:53.590
Um whereas in a can or in a bag where or even a screw top, if it's the type of screw top that lets nothing in and out, those can be too well preserved, at which point there will be some kind of like weird stuff going on with the wine initially, but then it blows off pretty quickly.
01:46:53.590 --> 01:46:59.689
So Of course that was a big thing when they they replaced or the the the industry started moving away from corks to screw tops.
01:46:59.689 --> 01:47:06.363
They brought in all these big wine connoisseurs slash wankers and asked them to taste the difference if they could between screw top and cork.
01:47:06.363 --> 01:47:08.574
And of they couldn't or they said the screw top tasted better.
01:47:08.574 --> 01:47:13.908
But having drunk a lot of screw top wines, I've never had that metallic kind of taste that I've got with this one.
01:47:13.908 --> 01:47:18.956
But it does seem to have gone away now that I've had it for a couple of days and taken a few glasses out of it.
01:47:18.956 --> 01:47:24.162
So the lesson here is guys is even if you get your wine in a bag, let it breathe a little bit.
01:47:24.162 --> 01:47:30.195
Well, and depending on when you had the screw tops or when the test was done too, screw tops these days do allow air in and out.
01:47:30.195 --> 01:47:36.309
Like they have a technology in them now that so it's it's not like it used to be, uh, in in in the early days.
01:47:36.309 --> 01:47:37.429
All right.
01:47:37.529 --> 01:47:42.162
So I think for me, there were a number of wines that could have fit the bill for ballistics.
01:47:42.162 --> 01:47:44.884
Something obviously maligned by wine snobs.
01:47:44.884 --> 01:47:45.755
There's a lot of them.
01:47:45.755 --> 01:47:49.877
Um, considered bad, rarely great or complex as a wine.
01:47:49.877 --> 01:47:51.967
There are grapes, two of my favorites.
01:47:52.065 --> 01:47:53.987
or actually, let's take a white grape first.
01:47:53.987 --> 01:47:55.828
So like Semillon Blanc would be a great one.
01:47:55.828 --> 01:48:01.420
Um, which if it's grown outside of France, most wine snobs kind of stick their nose up to it.
01:48:01.420 --> 01:48:09.194
So like New Zealand Semillon Blanc is often considered too one note, and California Savillon Blanc, way too fruity and tropical and unbalanced.
01:48:09.194 --> 01:48:12.500
Like most wine snobs like, it's New World, it's California.
01:48:12.500 --> 01:48:13.975
It's just it's not the same thing.
01:48:13.975 --> 01:48:18.274
So Semillon Blanc could have worked if I wanted a white wine, but my god, did I not want a white wine?
01:48:18.274 --> 01:48:18.963
With this movie.
01:48:18.963 --> 01:48:20.994
I wanted something big, dark, bold.
01:48:20.994 --> 01:48:24.655
Two of my favorite grapes out there, Pinotage and Petite Syrah.
01:48:24.676 --> 01:48:26.697
Either of those could have been perfect.
01:48:26.697 --> 01:48:32.239
I'm actually drinking a Petite Syrah right now, and it's what I drank at the end of the movie.
01:48:32.239 --> 01:48:34.451
Um, and it it's beautiful.
01:48:34.451 --> 01:48:37.261
Petit Syrah is it's a thick-skinned, dark grape.
01:48:37.261 --> 01:48:42.623
It makes bold ink black wines with an intensity of fruit, tannins, bittersweetness.
01:48:42.623 --> 01:48:47.554
Um, and if it's from, and this is the best part, because we were doing this with Nick today.
01:48:47.554 --> 01:48:52.216
Petit Sarah, California and Australia make most of the world's pizza rah.
01:48:52.216 --> 01:48:55.555
So um, and Israel apparently is number three.
01:48:55.555 --> 01:48:57.137
So those are the three places.
01:48:57.137 --> 01:49:00.658
Yay! Those are the three places right now.
01:49:00.658 --> 01:49:07.362
Um California makes eighty percent of the world's petits rah these days, with Australia leading in number two.
01:49:07.362 --> 01:49:09.055
They call it Durath.
01:49:09.055 --> 01:49:12.247
Over there, more than petite serrah, more often than petite serrah.
01:49:12.247 --> 01:49:16.828
That was actually the wine trivia question of the week, if you remember that, Nick, from back when you actually got that one.
01:49:16.828 --> 01:49:18.193
Yeah, yeah, from Miracle Mile.
01:49:18.193 --> 01:49:26.639
Um, and most of California Petit Syrah has been uh genetically traced back to being the Durif version of Petite Syrah from Australia.
01:49:26.639 --> 01:49:32.903
So you we brought it over from you guys and got all of our petite syrah from that, almost all of our petitesrah that.
01:49:33.484 --> 01:49:36.064
Yeah, even though the whole thing comes from the Rhone.
01:49:36.064 --> 01:49:38.734
So it's like, but they barely grow it anymore over there.
01:49:38.734 --> 01:49:40.614
So it's not really a thing.
01:49:40.614 --> 01:49:45.105
So, guys, if you want to go find a petitsrah to pair with this movie, I'm not gonna stop you.
01:49:45.105 --> 01:49:46.136
I think it would be perfect.
01:49:46.136 --> 01:49:52.417
Whether it's an Australian Durif, whether it's Cali Cali Petitsrah, any of them, I think would match Ballistic X vs.
01:49:52.417 --> 01:49:52.748
Sever.
01:49:52.748 --> 01:50:02.081
But I think there is an easier wine to get your hands on and one that leans more heavily into the hedonistic element of the film.
01:50:02.081 --> 01:50:04.462
So let's talk Zenfandel.
01:50:04.841 --> 01:50:08.190
And You could do a Cali's Infandel, that would work well.
01:50:08.190 --> 01:50:13.733
Turley out of Paso Robles is known for some of the best Infandel in the world, though they have a price point that proves it.
01:50:13.733 --> 01:50:17.694
You know, nothing crazy, but we're talking like forty, sixty bucks a bottle, so it ain't cheap.
01:50:17.694 --> 01:50:20.675
Um, but I think you go old world.
01:50:20.675 --> 01:50:25.376
I think you do Italian Zinfandel, which they call Primitivo.
01:50:26.037 --> 01:50:28.898
Primitivo is predominantly from Puglia.
01:50:29.018 --> 01:50:29.934
Puglia.
01:50:29.934 --> 01:50:30.623
Puglia.
01:50:30.623 --> 01:50:31.984
This a very pugilistic film.
01:50:31.984 --> 01:50:35.578
So Puglia, whatever you want to have your pronounce.
01:50:35.578 --> 01:50:44.765
Find yourself a Puglia Primitivo, fruity, ripe, slightly herbaceous, as most most old world wine is going to be compared to New World wine.
01:50:44.765 --> 01:50:51.510
Likely higher in ABV, because Zinfandel and Primitivo, it grows ripe super fast.
01:50:51.510 --> 01:50:54.311
Puglia is a hot climate for Italy.
01:50:54.311 --> 01:50:56.444
um But there's a way to take this.
01:50:56.444 --> 01:50:57.974
So any Puglia Primitivo.
01:50:57.974 --> 01:51:04.760
If you find that, I think that's going to work really well with this movie, but there's a way to take it to yet the next level, even then.
01:51:05.220 --> 01:51:17.811
Trader Joe's has a Puglia Primitivo that's a Passamento, quote unquote, in style, meaning partially dehydrated or partially raisined grapes are what they use to make the wine.
01:51:17.811 --> 01:51:24.728
This concentrates the flavors and the sugars for an even riper, jammier.
01:51:24.728 --> 01:51:32.279
bolder and higher ABV than normal fucking Zinfandel, which is already at the top of all those things.
01:51:32.279 --> 01:51:42.243
So this is the Patroferno Apassamento Puglia Primitivo for $12.99 at Trader Joe's.
01:51:42.243 --> 01:51:46.844
And this motherfucker clocks in at 15% ABV, nice and high.
01:51:46.864 --> 01:51:51.706
It's hedonism in a glass as far as fine red wine goes.
01:51:51.869 --> 01:51:56.952
And it's style i it is style as substance, just like this movie.
01:51:56.952 --> 01:52:01.493
Um and this is without question my perfect pairing for X vs Sever.
01:52:01.493 --> 01:52:05.954
Puglia Primitivo or a Passamento Puglia Primitivo or Petit Sarah.
01:52:05.954 --> 01:52:09.376
Get yourself a nice big bold red like Dallas's and whatnot.
01:52:09.376 --> 01:52:14.358
Even like Nick's, I'm betting that's not super light or easy as a red Nick.
01:52:14.358 --> 01:52:19.027
How would you No, no, it's it's a very unsubtle Shiraz, but subtle Shiraz.
01:52:19.027 --> 01:52:23.828
Probably the higher volume of alcohol, the more you'll enjoy Ballistic X versus Sever.
01:52:23.954 --> 01:52:24.837
Can't disagree.
01:52:24.837 --> 01:52:26.140
Can't disagree.
01:52:27.078 --> 01:52:29.926
And thanks so much for joining us once again, Nick.
01:52:29.926 --> 01:52:31.259
And thank you for joining us for this one.
01:52:31.259 --> 01:52:34.742
This meant a lot to us because we we wanted to watch this movie.
01:52:34.742 --> 01:52:37.162
We may tell her Go ahead go ahead.
01:52:37.162 --> 01:52:37.682
No, no, no.
01:52:37.682 --> 01:52:38.493
wrapping up.
01:52:38.493 --> 01:52:49.341
It's it's it's it's also like I mean, I I can enjoy writing reviews of bad movies, but I I think it I love the fact that there are people who are gonna champion what is critically maligned.
01:52:49.341 --> 01:52:57.095
And it was great to get a chance to watch this zero percent film on Rotten Tomatoes and and only reaffirm all my prejudices that Rotten Tomatoes is full of shit.
01:52:57.439 --> 01:52:59.451
I agree.
01:52:59.511 --> 01:53:00.391
you heard that?
01:53:00.391 --> 01:53:05.896
eh All right.
01:53:05.896 --> 01:53:08.609
Nick, tell our listeners where can they find you?
01:53:08.609 --> 01:53:14.222
We're gonna have the collab uh club link down below, guys, if you wanna join our letterbox club that we're a part of together.
01:53:14.222 --> 01:53:16.295
And where else should they look for you?
01:53:16.295 --> 01:53:18.028
Or is Letterbox place?
01:53:18.242 --> 01:53:23.475
Letterbox absolutely the place, although I'm a roving itinerant podcast guest as well, too.
01:53:23.475 --> 01:53:33.569
So i in in a in a week or so I'm gonna be recording the third of our unloved James Bond series with Caliber Nine from Out of Space.
01:53:33.569 --> 01:53:39.329
So we're ch like we're championing the the Bond films that at least the Letterboxd community has has Yeah.
01:53:39.329 --> 01:53:50.037
Which This time we're doing On Her Majesty's Secret Service, which was hated for decades but then had a bit of a critical turnaround and of course many people still struggle with George Lazenby.
01:53:50.037 --> 01:53:54.252
And then we're going to the most unloved Bond of them all, which is Roger Moore.
01:53:54.252 --> 01:53:59.413
Uh and this time we're covering Octopussy, the stupidest bond title of all time.
01:53:59.413 --> 01:54:01.094
Justice for Roger Moore, man.
01:54:01.094 --> 01:54:02.188
Justice for Roger Moore.
01:54:02.188 --> 01:54:06.033
Also the most memorable Bond title of all time, let's just be honest.
01:54:06.033 --> 01:54:07.220
That's a fact.
01:54:07.481 --> 01:54:11.654
And we we love Roger Moore too, so we're gonna talk up um at least Octopussy as well.
01:54:11.654 --> 01:54:18.630
I remember struggling a bit with Ono Majesty Secret Service last time I saw it, but it's not been a few it's been a few years, so I'll be interested to return to that one.
01:54:18.988 --> 01:54:27.943
And I will say, Nick, when you turned me on to uh Man from Hong Kong, um with Lazn B and that he's so good in that movie.
01:54:27.943 --> 01:54:33.220
And I struggle I remember struggling with Her Majesty's Secret Service, but he was very young when he made that one.
01:54:33.220 --> 01:54:33.569
was.
01:54:33.569 --> 01:54:47.761
And you know the other s interesting story about George Lazenby is that on the day of his death, George Lazenby was in Hong Kong to meet Bruce Lee, and they were due to have dinner together because he was in discussion about according to him, and he's not he's a guy who's been known to embellish his life story.
01:54:47.761 --> 01:54:52.284
He says that he was in discussion to play one of the antagonists in Game of Death.
01:54:53.506 --> 01:54:58.039
As Bruce had completed three of the fight scenes before he died, but he'd planned on five.
01:54:58.039 --> 01:55:09.081
So And having seen them go against Jimmy Wang Yu and Man from Hong Kong, like yeah, that would have And he was a student of Jeet Kundeau, so he actually could he's not an expert, but he could fight a bit, so He could, he could.
01:55:09.081 --> 01:55:10.280
I was impressed.
01:55:10.365 --> 01:55:11.613
Interesting.
01:55:11.921 --> 01:55:13.587
That's the dive seal of approval.
01:55:13.698 --> 01:55:14.537
There you go.
01:55:14.537 --> 01:55:15.880
All right, guys.
01:55:15.880 --> 01:55:26.356
Now to wrap this up, many thanks to our sponsor, the place where our wine cellar cinema that we mentioned earlier takes place, the micro cinema inside a wine shop, curated wine shop.
01:55:26.356 --> 01:55:28.628
No idea where to begin finding a wine that pairs with your movie.
01:55:28.628 --> 01:55:29.229
That's okay.
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Almost literally no one does, but curated is here to help.
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They accept every vendortainment-inspired challenge and will curate the selection to match your palette.
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Just tell them what you're trying to pair with, your budget, your preferences, and they will show you the way.
01:55:42.082 --> 01:55:51.029
Curated is, as I said before, a boutique wine shop on Libre Avenue, mid-city Los Angeles, founded and operated by Peeps currently and previously part of the entertainment ecosystem.
01:55:51.029 --> 01:55:53.331
Johnny, Kelly, Allison, and Mia.
01:55:53.331 --> 01:55:54.612
Right now it's me too.
01:55:54.612 --> 01:55:57.033
I've actually been working two weeks there behind the counter.
01:55:57.033 --> 01:56:00.296
So I've been my time has been weird lately.
01:56:00.296 --> 01:56:03.337
I've been Allison is in Europe and I've been working behind the counter.
01:56:03.337 --> 01:56:04.479
So who knows?
01:56:04.479 --> 01:56:05.409
Maybe me too.
01:56:05.409 --> 01:56:08.467
We're gonna find out, at least for cure for wine cellar cinema.
01:56:08.467 --> 01:56:10.630
Maybe I'm behind the counter there too going forward.
01:56:10.630 --> 01:56:11.490
We're gonna find out.
01:56:11.490 --> 01:56:12.502
Go meet them.
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They carry an ever-changing, wide-ranging selection of small artisanal wines from the known and comforting to the completely unique reds, whites, roses, oranges, sparklings, dry wines, sweet wines, and everything in between.
01:56:22.713 --> 01:56:24.545
Go check them out if you're in the LA area.
01:56:24.545 --> 01:56:26.877
You can find them online at curated-wines.com.
01:56:26.877 --> 01:56:27.569
They do ships.
01:56:27.569 --> 01:56:28.840
You can find them and have them ship.
01:56:28.840 --> 01:56:30.180
Well, they ship within the US.
01:56:30.180 --> 01:56:31.141
I don't think so.
01:56:31.586 --> 01:56:32.115
That's right.
01:56:32.115 --> 01:56:34.768
I don't think you want them to ship you wine overseas.
01:56:34.768 --> 01:56:35.889
It's a bad idea, guys.
01:56:35.889 --> 01:56:36.890
Just don't do that.
01:56:36.890 --> 01:56:46.615
but find them curated-wines dot com uh and vinetertainmentstudios.com for us vintertainment bros and wine cellar cinema dot substack.com for all things wine cellar cinema.
01:56:46.615 --> 01:56:48.327
Thank you so much for listening, everybody.
01:56:48.327 --> 01:56:53.770
We will be back in one week with one more wine and entertainment pairing for your vintertainment.
01:56:53.770 --> 01:56:58.104
And then we're taking a one month break while we actually stockpile some of these recordings.
01:56:58.104 --> 01:57:01.006
We're gonna get ahead of ourselves for once and take a little bit of a summer break.
01:57:01.006 --> 01:57:07.862
But we have one last film coming next week where we take a $7,000 film that has really been hitting a pig on the festival circuit.
01:57:07.862 --> 01:57:11.335
And we are going to cover that next week before we take a brief hiatus.
01:57:11.335 --> 01:57:12.537
So join us then.
01:57:12.537 --> 01:57:13.577
We'll check you then.
01:57:13.577 --> 01:57:14.645
Ciao for now.
01:57:14.645 --> 01:57:15.746
Later it does.