SOBRE ESTE EPISÓDIO
In this episode of The Magic Guys, hosts Nick Kay, Doug Conn, and the ever-curious Josh unravel the complexities of modern magic. Broadcasting from time-zone-defying locations, they dive deep into the intricate world of magic, debating its perception as either cringe-worthy or cool.
Join the conversation as our hosts analyze the nuances of magic attire, its evolution from classic suits to contemporary casual styles influenced by magic legends like Copperfield and Blaine. Do traditional props like the Invisible Deck or Sponge Balls still hold their allure, or are they more a sign of laziness? The trio eagerly dissects these iconic tools and the importance of creativity and originality in keeping magic fresh.
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The Podcast where Professional Magicians, Josh Norbido, Doug Conn & Nick Kay take on the important questions of life (Mainly from our youtube subscribers) and deliver answers from a Magicians point of view. Come hang out with us while we chat about our lives as Magicians and the ups and downs that go with it.
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TRANSCRIÇÃO 🔗
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They're guys. They do magic. They are the Magic Guys.
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Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to episode 216 of the Magic Guys.
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To my left, I got Nick Kay.
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That's right, I'm Nick Kay, and joining us this week is Daddy Doug,
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all the way from his new movie series, Hangover 5.
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That's my life lately.
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What's up, y'all? Good to be back. Good to be back. I am suffering from a Las
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Vegas hangover. This is my life now.
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Now you're with us in that it's morning for you as well in America as it is for us in Australia.
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We knew moving to Vegas would get you into the Australian rhythm of time.
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And now you're nocturnal. So this is perfect.
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I'm still adapting. Everyone here is like, don't wake me up before 2 p.m. I'm like, okay.
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You know what i'm excited about i'm excited about the
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idea of being a plus one ordinarily someone is
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always my plus one when i go to events or or have
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tickets to something or whatever it might be there's an
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opportunity that you might actually need a plus two when we come to visit doug
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because like you know josh and i go and be in town and we
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need to figure out what we're gonna do no doubt
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yeah it's it's coming
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up soon my goodness i would be
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happy to go back to the let's talk about matt franco's show
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which i just saw last night here at the link well
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you know what that'll that'll come up perfectly because our episode
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is is magic cool or cringe and you just saw what i would say is one of the pretty
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cool magicians of our time so i think that'll come in pretty well i think great
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to see everyone here live in the chat by the way one of you sent in a speak
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pipe so i thought we would give our audience the floor to begin today's episode.
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With a question on it so we're going to throw it over to aj
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and see what he's up to first off love
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the podcasts listen religiously so thank
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you for that i have 90 seconds here so i'm gonna try to get my
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question out because it's a little bit long-winded but i am
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an avid connoisseur of magic books and
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material i'm constantly learning but with
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that i keep finding myself getting new
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material like constantly and so I'll end
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up performing you know some things for
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a week or two weeks and then I move on and next thing I know I'm you know half
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a year year year and a half later I look back at some notes that I took and
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at tricks that I once performed that are fantastic and I've forgotten them.
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So I guess my question is, how do you dial in material that you know you want
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to consistently perform? Because I'm always...
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Learning more more material trying to
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improve but i'm finding it somewhat detrimental because i'm not i don't have
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like a steadfast repertoire if that makes sense okay so how do you pick kind
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of your staples maybe that's a better way to put it like how do you pick your staples and then.
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Create kind of sets based off of
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that uh anyway thanks again
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love the show appreciate it okay firstly like
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really good thought process that he has there trying to understand that
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like you do set as you perform and so forth can i
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take point on this one fellas right please do
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start yeah because this is kind of just like reminiscent of what i talk about
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in my my bible lecture which stands for basic instructions for being a leading
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entertainer so it's the very first lecture i ever wrote and this is going to
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be a benefit to you so as far as learning stuff all the time by all means do that. I do it myself.
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I'm actually part of a book club where we buy a book every month and we go through the book.
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We just finished doing a Steve Mayhew's book, which I read and skipped through
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a lot of it just because everything was, you produce the four aces and then
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you produce the four aces and then, and I was just like, I don't need any more four ace tricks.
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I know this is great. I know where it comes from. That's great.
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But like, I don't, I don't care for this.
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I don't want to add it to my repertoire or I read through it and I go,
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that's nice that I learned that, but I'm never going to add that to my repertoire.
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So don't feel bad about adding knowledge to your mindset is the first thing I want to say.
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Now, when it comes to what routines you keep in your repertoire,
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I think it comes down to the audience.
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And the audience, if you want to give them the best experience,
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they'll give you that feedback.
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So by all means, test out new material in between doing stuff.
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We call that hammocking, in
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which you'll do a really good routine that you know is very well strong.
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You'll hammock in between that a routine you're working on and then close with
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the routine that you're really, really strong with.
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So by all means, you still have opportunities to try stuff.
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But I think that to long story short, this let your like try stuff,
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learn it, test it on your audience, but let them dictate it.
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Because I think that if you want to give them the best time,
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that's what you want to do.
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Said like a true legend. That was fantastic.
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And the only thing I would sprinkle on top of that is I saw a clip of Ozzy Wynn
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talking to Ben Earle the other day.
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And Ozzy Wynn said it pretty well.
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He's talking about there's a difference between being an entertainer and an artist.
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But in this world, the entertainer is what is going to perform to the masses.
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And he says an entertainer is a professional surveyor.
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They conduct surveys by throwing out lots of different routines and they get
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the results back of which ones the audience like.
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And then that's what they then serve to them.
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So just in a shorter sentence of what Nick's saying, try lots of stuff.
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Just remember the stuff that gets a good reaction.
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Listen to your people. Don't quit playing, though.
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We can always play in the in the sandbox
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right and learn new things but you want to keep that solid 10 routines you know
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however yeah there's there's something to be said right about purely you can't
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purely listen to the audience because we know if we just went out there with you know the five best.
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Gimmicked effects that will slay like
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they will do really well but then we might not
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have any soul after a few years of doing well this is the
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difference between craft and art if
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you do if you're mimicking things you've seen if you're all
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your repertoire is all store-bought magic tricks and you're
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doing the pattern that was in the instructions you're just a
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craftsman or a surveyor right the
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artist is the one who has the unique point of view and develops
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those tricks and the unique presentations and probably changes
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the magic moments to better benefit his
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audience yeah let me show some of the back of that
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because i was jamming with my mentor and good friend who you
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know also doc andrew and we were talking about
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this he's working my residencies are these holy moly's for me now and he was
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showing me this coins across that he does and there was a final phase that he
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did in which he was holding the coins palm up because you had it in a particular
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type of clip that was like super duper angle-y and holding it to like his stomach.
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And it looks so weird to hold his hands in this fashion, especially when he's
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wearing this beautiful suit and looks a million bucks.
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But then he's standing like he's arthritic. It just didn't seem right.
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And gentlemanly now we worked on it, right?
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Now the routine was there, but through different learnings, we ended up polishing
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these routines further and further.
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He ended up calling me the week after we had this jam session and said,
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oh my God, thank you so much for sharing that trick with me.
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If I hadn't experienced that little bit of knowledge, I couldn't have proved
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upon it. So you can always learn stuff and improve on what you already have.
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And once you have it, you don't have to bury it. You don't have to make this
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decision that you never want to do it again.
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Like it's always just going to be stuff that's in your pocket.
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Like, or when I mean that, I mean metaphorically, in the back of your mind,
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when you need it, you do it.
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But yo, that's some good advice. Get some extra eyeballs on the material you're developing.
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Maybe not always a magician, you know, maybe they should be lower down.
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But, you know, you can find a venue to perform this stuff over and over.
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That's your best bet, right? That in the notebook.
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Yeah yeah yeah aj thanks for
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the question my friend please guys send them in the speak pipes the
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link is in the description speakpipe.com forward
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slash the magic guys drop us a line and aj
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just you know try it's so hard as as a
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hobbyist magician even a pro to not get sucked into the
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ever-flowing churn of new effects
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coming out you know that's that's tough but better than
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not doing magic you know so you'll you'll probably some people just
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do that let's not make those people feel lesser it's perfectly
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fine to just do nothing but learn magic your
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whole life you never even have to do a trick you can
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enjoy magic that way it's fine some some
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would say that's probably more like the better way to
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enjoy magic i mean that's the student's approach it's magic
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is the ultimate studious endeavor because
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it's endless right the rabbit hole is so deep
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can i also say at the back of that
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how envious are we as like professionals
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who perform for a living i don't know about you guys
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but i'll speak on my behalf that as professional i so envy
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people who have this opportunity to just constantly be learning stuff like all
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the time like yeah i'm so envious but like as a professional when you've got
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your staples and your reputation makers you've got to make sure that you stay
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on point and that they're always so perfect and you really put the effort into them.
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And it upsets me because I'm,
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trying to stay sharper and sharper, but in the same breath, sort of envious
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of the people who just go, I'm just learning stuff all the time and I perform it.
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And if it's right or wrong, or if it's not perfect, it doesn't matter.
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But it's just like, I envy those guys.
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You're still doing that. You're just finding the moments within the magic you
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already do to improve that.
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And that is so much a part of being a great magician, right?
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You know, am I standing this way or am I standing this way when I do the,
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you know, whatever you're doing? You know what?
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Very good. Yeah, very good point. Because I was pretty jealous of your friend
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Chihan when we were at the assembly convention.
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Isn't he like a really successful lawyer? Is that his profession?
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That's exactly what he is. Yeah. So Chihan Yeo is an amazing cardsmith who by
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day is a property lawyer handling deals that are upwards of hundreds of millions of dollars.
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And then you see him sit down with a pack of cards and he's like, the guy's got hands.
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He has yeah i'm just seeing him i'm just seeing i'm just watching him do second
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deals as we're chatting and i'm like i got no time to effing work on second
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deals like i gotta make sure i can.
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Get to my do my gigs and like you know
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win over this crowd and da da da da and you're
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just here you know making tons of cash not even
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with magic and then you can just enjoy learning good
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magic but to what dog's saying like
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it's really fun doing shows and we'll
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do two shows a night and in each show I'll tweak a different
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way of revealing a thing like for ages I was trying to find the best way to
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reveal the Rubik's Cube to the audience and after so many different little nuanced
00:11:28.492 --> 00:11:33.392
tries I finally found a way where just taking a Rubik's Cube out of a thing
00:11:33.392 --> 00:11:38.112
gets a laugh when that should never have been a moment so those little tweaks are really fun.
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One more. I'm flushing back as we talk about one of my mentors,
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Cellini, and he talked about his first lesson with Slydini.
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Now, imagine you've ponied up a few blocks to go study with the great one, Slydini.
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You're in New York, you go to the studio, and you're ready to learn some Slydini
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magic. Where do we start?
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You know where Slydini started? I remember two things Cellini talked about.
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One of them was this, how to walk onto a stage.
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You know so that was lesson one enter
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the stage how are you how are you doing that
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and then another one was how to accept applause you
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know when people are being generous with their
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you know how do you acknowledge that it wasn't
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how to laugh it wasn't you know how the impasse or any of that it was you know
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professional moments that will make your magic better these are the kind of
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things we can work on plus the tricks so yeah that's so cool that's so cool
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that's yeah even how to you know professionally take cards out of a box without looking.
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I'm wondering how many magicians out there have thought about how they walk onto a stage,
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a good book for that is yeah another good book for that is steve cohen's winning
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the crowd he talks about that as well he's like if you're behind curtains start
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walking 10 steps before you get to the stage so you're already at full speed
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instead of seeing the audience see you slowly start walking out what about williamson's
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approach this is the williamson.
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Doug is just tearing open a deck
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like a banana ripping the books apart taking out
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the goods inside hell yeah so then
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there's the williamson approach yeah i mean i've never seen anyone just be
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out of with the thumb just break the seal like that yeah it's pretty
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dope i was going to casino in biloxi and then one of
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the pit bosses was doing that i was like where did you learn that
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he's like look dude you gotta open 800 boxes a night
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you'd learn it too crap sure
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yeah and you know what these are the things that
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you start focusing on when you want to kind of be in that top one
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percent of awesome magicians okay like these are the this
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is the difference that it like i always talk about like it's formula
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one because there's milliseconds between you and 10th place like like the time
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from the person in first place is like 0.64 seconds you know between that and
00:14:00.539 --> 00:14:05.659
last So you've really got to start peeling off milliseconds and just doing little
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things to get better and better and polish and polish.
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And it comes in so many different formats, which we're coming down a rabbit
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hole, which is probably a little bit further away from what the question was.
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But these are the sorts of things we think about as we go along.
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So we should probably do that at some point, have a big chat about like,
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how do you get into the top?
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Echelon. Yeah. I mean, and even just for winning over an audience,
00:14:27.328 --> 00:14:32.488
like there's like milliseconds between you seeming cool and you seeming cringe.
00:14:32.828 --> 00:14:36.488
Oh yeah. You know, you know what I'm saying?
00:14:37.008 --> 00:14:38.728
Right into this episode's theme.
00:14:39.748 --> 00:14:44.088
Can we just segue? Yeah. I, I was meant to hit the air horn,
00:14:44.168 --> 00:14:47.368
but instead I changed my voice, but we roll with it. You know what I'm saying?
00:14:47.608 --> 00:14:49.628
So today's episode we've called it.
00:14:49.928 --> 00:14:53.248
Yeah. I'm mad. I'm magicians. Cool. or are they cringe?
00:14:53.448 --> 00:14:56.288
There's 10 questions we're going to debate and just riff on here.
00:14:56.388 --> 00:14:59.888
And we'd love to hear your thoughts in the chat, in the live chat as well.
00:15:00.528 --> 00:15:05.108
Starting with number 10, which is about our attire, our costume.
00:15:05.408 --> 00:15:08.168
So it's titled Fedora or for pass?
00:15:08.868 --> 00:15:15.168
Is what we wear outdated stage fashion that screams being try hard or should
00:15:15.168 --> 00:15:20.268
magicians dress like real humans or could it be stylized if owned with confidence?
00:15:20.868 --> 00:15:26.388
I'm going to throw it over to Doug first. He's seen many magician's attire over the time.
00:15:27.448 --> 00:15:30.888
What say you? That actually looked really good.
00:15:31.348 --> 00:15:35.288
Actually, that was, you know, fedoras are cool if they're worn by Doug Kahn,
00:15:35.408 --> 00:15:37.508
100%. But should they be like a staple?
00:15:37.688 --> 00:15:44.188
Like, okay, I'm a magician now. I should buy my fedora and buy my bow tie and buy my coattails.
00:15:45.588 --> 00:15:51.688
Yeah, well, you know, I think in the modern age, we can wear what we want.
00:15:52.568 --> 00:15:57.088
Like, I think this kind of started with David Blaine, you know,
00:15:57.168 --> 00:15:58.908
when he decided a t-shirt was cool.
00:15:59.228 --> 00:16:03.368
But really, it's Robert Houdin who changed it back in the 1800s when he put
00:16:03.368 --> 00:16:06.628
on a tuxedo instead of a wizard robe with a dunce hat.
00:16:07.404 --> 00:16:10.524
Uh yeah i you know i think it all boils down to character right it's
00:16:10.524 --> 00:16:13.624
like what image are you trying to portray your audience and what
00:16:13.624 --> 00:16:17.364
you know what costume does does
00:16:17.364 --> 00:16:20.204
that best yeah also does it does
00:16:20.204 --> 00:16:23.284
serve a purpose in some routines i mean i use a
00:16:23.284 --> 00:16:26.104
bowler's hat in in in
00:16:26.104 --> 00:16:29.164
my cups and balls routine and as a result i made it part of my
00:16:29.164 --> 00:16:32.284
my character and my costume and everything
00:16:32.284 --> 00:16:35.584
else you know nowadays i don't i've shied
00:16:35.584 --> 00:16:38.404
away from that as much but whenever i do that routine the hat
00:16:38.404 --> 00:16:41.284
comes out you know and i tell them the mythology of the routine
00:16:41.284 --> 00:16:44.424
and how long i've been doing it for and whatever else so yeah and.
00:16:44.424 --> 00:16:48.464
I think if you're going to do something or if it's going to be part of your costume
00:16:48.464 --> 00:16:52.684
like if you were going to be like the punk rock magician and
00:16:52.684 --> 00:16:55.584
that your jacket was covered in like bobby pins then
00:16:55.584 --> 00:16:58.444
use the bobby pins and do like a pin link
00:16:58.444 --> 00:17:01.564
type thing you know what i mean like i think things that
00:17:01.564 --> 00:17:05.424
are indigenous to your location and to your person doug
00:17:05.424 --> 00:17:08.244
do you remember what kind of attire matt
00:17:08.244 --> 00:17:11.264
franco was wearing at his show matt was
00:17:11.264 --> 00:17:14.144
in black suit the black suit had some
00:17:14.144 --> 00:17:16.944
white stripes on the arms which i didn't really like but you
00:17:16.944 --> 00:17:19.804
know it's a creative choice that i guess because he does a lot of slight hand
00:17:19.804 --> 00:17:22.924
in the show it draws attention to that body part all
00:17:22.924 --> 00:17:26.184
black and then just white stripe along the
00:17:26.184 --> 00:17:29.224
lower part it wasn't even like everywhere just
00:17:29.224 --> 00:17:32.344
that single feature he did do a costume
00:17:32.344 --> 00:17:39.024
change midway like this that's this that's it that's so that so for example
00:17:39.024 --> 00:17:42.664
i guess this is a good starting point he so what i'm noticing is he's wearing
00:17:42.664 --> 00:17:49.824
a t-shirt under his yeah right yeah very casual yeah he had on like a simple jewelry you know and.
00:17:50.678 --> 00:17:55.178
He changed his boots once during the show to a maroon jacket.
00:17:55.918 --> 00:17:59.558
I'm looking at David Copperfield, and I don't know.
00:18:00.138 --> 00:18:03.618
I'm seeing two different versions of Copperfield on stage.
00:18:03.798 --> 00:18:09.698
One is him in a suit, but he has no tie or anything. It's an open shirt,
00:18:09.738 --> 00:18:11.358
so he can show a bit of the chest.
00:18:11.558 --> 00:18:16.878
And then the other version, which in my memory, this is how I see Copperfield a lot.
00:18:16.878 --> 00:18:19.618
And it's the version where he has a white t-shirt and then like
00:18:19.618 --> 00:18:22.778
a long-sleeved unbuttoned uh blue blue
00:18:22.778 --> 00:18:25.818
shirt and you know that's
00:18:25.818 --> 00:18:30.198
not your classic suited up three-piece um
00:18:30.198 --> 00:18:33.638
magician at all and uh and then you got david blaine always
00:18:33.638 --> 00:18:36.718
rocking t-shirts ozzy wind one of my favorite magicians wears
00:18:36.718 --> 00:18:39.558
a t-shirt and then it as this show right here
00:18:39.558 --> 00:18:42.558
this las vegas late night late night magic show
00:18:42.558 --> 00:18:45.578
is a great example of how you can portray magic in
00:18:45.578 --> 00:18:48.478
many characters one of them is a wrestling character he
00:18:48.478 --> 00:18:52.278
wears a wrestling mask the shocker greg now get
00:18:52.278 --> 00:18:58.938
the name right the the mc is a boisterous comedian and comic book jacket you
00:18:58.938 --> 00:19:03.058
know bizarro is his everybody knows bizarro he's got his own thing going on
00:19:03.058 --> 00:19:08.478
the female magician was sexy and a little bit scantily clad so you know And
00:19:08.478 --> 00:19:12.198
all of them were killing it with their own point of view,
00:19:12.478 --> 00:19:15.178
using the costuming that fits their character.
00:19:15.738 --> 00:19:20.658
I think you nailed it, Doug. I think it's bringing your point of view is maybe
00:19:20.658 --> 00:19:21.918
the more important thing.
00:19:22.158 --> 00:19:28.478
Because now that I'm looking at all of the top magicians that the layman might
00:19:28.478 --> 00:19:33.278
know of, none of them are really rocking a three-piece suit that we're used
00:19:33.278 --> 00:19:36.518
to wearing to a corporate gig where we need to match the audience and stuff.
00:19:36.518 --> 00:19:39.218
But it's something to consider it doesn't have to
00:19:39.218 --> 00:19:42.018
be your go-to more importantly it's got
00:19:42.018 --> 00:19:47.858
to be your character and i love that i don't know why i took so long to like
00:19:47.858 --> 00:19:51.718
stop wearing a tie to gigs for me personally because i would never normally
00:19:51.718 --> 00:19:58.238
wear them and yeah yeah back in the 90s i was table hopping a brunch in a three-piece
00:19:58.238 --> 00:20:01.158
tuxedo you know fucking whole nine yards tails
00:20:01.418 --> 00:20:04.718
i'm in tails in the 90s baby i had
00:20:04.718 --> 00:20:07.858
to grow out of that i think you should look you should
00:20:07.858 --> 00:20:10.858
look like you have something better to be is what i figured that
00:20:10.858 --> 00:20:13.838
out about eight months into that gig i'm like i gotta get rid of this thing
00:20:13.838 --> 00:20:18.578
this is horrible and then uh blue blazer it's kind of my go-to sense you know
00:20:18.578 --> 00:20:23.558
yeah no i think you work a lot with costuming and and some of your stuff is
00:20:23.558 --> 00:20:29.478
is required for some of your teamings and stuff so well yeah what are your thoughts man dude i think,
00:20:30.078 --> 00:20:35.038
stuff I do is costume dependent and I've got tuxedos, I've got sports jackets,
00:20:35.278 --> 00:20:38.878
I've got all types of clothes to suit what I need to wear and they're all built
00:20:38.878 --> 00:20:42.418
for different purposes but I think there needs to be a level of.
00:20:43.333 --> 00:20:47.433
Is it genuine you got to be genuine to some degree you know what i mean so i
00:20:47.433 --> 00:20:51.233
think that works really well a lot of people try to portray themselves with
00:20:51.233 --> 00:20:54.193
something that they're not and it kind of shows through if they haven't developed
00:20:54.193 --> 00:20:56.433
their character because i think your character,
00:20:57.073 --> 00:20:59.813
should be a higher version of yourself and not like a
00:20:59.813 --> 00:21:02.913
totally left of center version of yourself you know i had
00:21:02.913 --> 00:21:05.853
a conversation recently with a good friend lewis we were
00:21:05.853 --> 00:21:08.653
jamming with him at the assembly if you don't recall
00:21:08.653 --> 00:21:11.493
who he is and you know he was talking about this routine where like you
00:21:11.493 --> 00:21:14.213
got to do it like crazy confident like super egotistical blah and
00:21:14.213 --> 00:21:17.753
i'm like but you're not that guy you're a sweetheart and you're quite shy this
00:21:17.753 --> 00:21:21.973
isn't gonna work if you do it this way you know so but
00:21:21.973 --> 00:21:25.793
yeah costume wise purpose built also the
00:21:25.793 --> 00:21:28.693
weather far out man like yeah i think
00:21:28.693 --> 00:21:31.593
we're going away from fedora hats and talking about costuming it
00:21:31.593 --> 00:21:34.533
might be worth pressing on podcast is going to be what to wear
00:21:34.533 --> 00:21:37.373
as a magician yeah exactly let's change
00:21:37.373 --> 00:21:40.113
the title let's press on a number nine so we
00:21:40.113 --> 00:21:43.033
don't get a whole 10 minutes let's go
00:21:43.033 --> 00:21:46.593
good like the thing is all of these questions could be there an episode you
00:21:46.593 --> 00:21:51.593
know so you're really getting the goods jam-packed yeah number nine number nine
00:21:51.593 --> 00:21:57.753
is saying pick a card cringe now and then the notes on this are is it overused
00:21:57.753 --> 00:22:02.013
and just unimaginative or is it a classic line that sets up the effect clearly,
00:22:02.613 --> 00:22:06.113
Can you reinvent the line creatively for yourself?
00:22:07.353 --> 00:22:11.653
Okay, so sometimes I've seen guys spread the deck to the spectators and just
00:22:11.653 --> 00:22:15.213
go, okay, do the thing, do the thing. Come on, do the thing.
00:22:15.953 --> 00:22:18.833
And it's like, you know what to do, do the thing. That's right.
00:22:19.173 --> 00:22:22.773
That's kind of interesting because you're playing on the fact that they know,
00:22:23.636 --> 00:22:26.876
what you would say yeah like and i
00:22:26.876 --> 00:22:29.716
think there's nothing wrong with saying this trick starts like all card
00:22:29.716 --> 00:22:32.456
tricks do pick a card pick any card i think
00:22:32.456 --> 00:22:35.436
there's nothing wrong with that i think that it's it's got
00:22:35.436 --> 00:22:40.496
a nice ring to it i would suggest this not only is there not any not anything
00:22:40.496 --> 00:22:45.776
wrong with it but that people want that experience from a magician a close-up
00:22:45.776 --> 00:22:48.896
you don't have to give it to them and there's reasons not to and that's fine
00:22:48.896 --> 00:22:53.616
but people love to be the person that gets to pick a card, any card.
00:22:54.256 --> 00:22:58.256
It is unfortunate that removing a selection from the pack is generally a dumb
00:22:58.256 --> 00:23:00.376
idea, but we'll talk about that another day.
00:23:00.896 --> 00:23:06.536
Yeah, I mean, I guess the question is probably because you get some people that
00:23:06.536 --> 00:23:09.176
are like, I've seen this one, you know, because they're like,
00:23:10.216 --> 00:23:14.236
oh, the same card trick is probably what you're going to do. Which, you know.
00:23:15.176 --> 00:23:18.696
Alluding, I do it that way. I say I have to do this at least once a show,
00:23:18.936 --> 00:23:21.836
sir, go ahead, pick a card, any card.
00:23:22.236 --> 00:23:26.636
And it's a nice moment, you know, people can relate to that and they have,
00:23:26.696 --> 00:23:31.756
it's a good grounding point and a great experience for the person that's into picking cards.
00:23:32.836 --> 00:23:36.236
So before we decide whether it's cringe or not, I have one thing I'd like to
00:23:36.236 --> 00:23:40.276
add, which is I typically don't let anyone choose a card with,
00:23:40.276 --> 00:23:44.396
with the way I perform just because I'm everyone's drinking and cards get wet
00:23:44.396 --> 00:23:46.956
and tables are wet and their hands are wet from holding drinks, et cetera.
00:23:46.956 --> 00:23:50.376
So I just do a lot of like say stop and I'll
00:23:50.376 --> 00:23:53.596
dribble I'll dribble cards or I'll riffle through cards
00:23:53.596 --> 00:23:56.396
I do a lot of like and the idea is is that when if I'm dribbling
00:23:56.396 --> 00:23:59.996
cards from hand to hand whenever they say stop you stop the dribble and then
00:23:59.996 --> 00:24:02.956
you've got a nice clear visual indicator of everyone's seeing it and you can
00:24:02.956 --> 00:24:07.156
engage with every single person in that moment as opposed to asking someone
00:24:07.156 --> 00:24:10.176
to take the card and show everyone because sometimes that person's a dickhead
00:24:10.176 --> 00:24:15.056
and they don't actually show everyone they just look at themselves and they and they hide it and and
00:24:15.436 --> 00:24:18.196
And then you have to put the card back once it's out.
00:24:18.356 --> 00:24:21.056
That's my problem with it. Once it's in the wild, now what happens?
00:24:21.236 --> 00:24:23.356
Do they put it back? Do you grab the card back?
00:24:23.676 --> 00:24:28.696
And it's just not efficient in a working environment.
00:24:29.396 --> 00:24:33.876
And it keeps all eyes on you and it allows you to connect with every single
00:24:33.876 --> 00:24:37.256
person participating. Because you might see somebody just looking over their
00:24:37.256 --> 00:24:40.236
shoulder, but, oh, come closer, friends, so you can see it. Can you see better now? Come and join us.
00:24:40.356 --> 00:24:43.816
You can now welcome people into your circle that you were entertaining at this
00:24:43.816 --> 00:24:44.876
corporate event, for example.
00:24:45.056 --> 00:24:47.876
And then, you know, you put in your hand, everyone saw the card,
00:24:48.036 --> 00:24:49.976
say yes, great. And you can get into the routine.
00:24:50.276 --> 00:24:55.236
So is it cringe? I'm going to say no, it's classic.
00:24:56.136 --> 00:24:57.336
Thoughts? Okay.
00:24:58.356 --> 00:25:03.936
I'm going to play the advocate here and say it's a little cringe because we
00:25:03.936 --> 00:25:08.476
could be more artistic about our routines than saying pick a card.
00:25:08.616 --> 00:25:09.536
Because then we could vary.
00:25:09.776 --> 00:25:13.316
We could do three card routines and them all feel different.
00:25:13.316 --> 00:25:18.536
But they'll feel the same if we every time go, now pick a card. Ah, now you pick a card.
00:25:19.432 --> 00:25:23.792
And that's something to think about is one of the main reasons why I learn a stack.
00:25:24.012 --> 00:25:28.192
So I can just say to someone, name any card. And now I've skipped the entire
00:25:28.192 --> 00:25:30.532
process of pick one, put it back in.
00:25:30.752 --> 00:25:33.712
They just named it. And now I can do something with it.
00:25:33.792 --> 00:25:37.432
Even if it's whatever card trick you're thinking of right now at home,
00:25:37.612 --> 00:25:41.212
listening to this, I could now still go into it. Okay.
00:25:41.592 --> 00:25:47.712
So there is one for not cringe, one for a little cringe, the deciding vote.
00:25:47.912 --> 00:25:52.172
Doug, is it cringe or not? I say, own the cringe.
00:25:56.232 --> 00:26:03.512
You're going to say it. Bang the gavel, that is cringe. Let's move to number eight. Hell yeah.
00:26:04.092 --> 00:26:09.132
Number eight. Are magic conventions cool or cult-like?
00:26:09.332 --> 00:26:17.092
Do they echo chambers and the everyone's a star vibe?
00:26:17.092 --> 00:26:20.432
Or are they cool community building and inspiring
00:26:20.432 --> 00:26:23.392
do conventions help push magic
00:26:23.392 --> 00:26:27.512
forward question mark thug uh
00:26:27.512 --> 00:26:30.492
i could say yes to all those things man
00:26:30.492 --> 00:26:33.312
what is this multi-prong question that we're doing
00:26:33.312 --> 00:26:37.172
another episode now i know magic magic
00:26:37.172 --> 00:26:39.972
conventions are the best they're all the above man great
00:26:39.972 --> 00:26:42.872
place to connect with the community great place to learn stuff
00:26:42.872 --> 00:26:45.812
and yeah if you're an egotistic jerk off great place
00:26:45.812 --> 00:26:48.952
to be a show off everyone will watch you do your thing and they'll talk
00:26:48.952 --> 00:26:52.472
about you like i am right now but go ahead worst thing
00:26:52.472 --> 00:26:55.532
in magic is an egotistical magician i see
00:26:55.532 --> 00:27:00.972
you i see you watching me right now yeah i
00:27:00.972 --> 00:27:04.512
think it's well yeah whatever you want the convention to be it will be that
00:27:04.512 --> 00:27:09.932
it's probably what it is yeah but i love them essentially we need them like
00:27:09.932 --> 00:27:13.932
yeah it's the one place Eric Leclerc when he came on it's he's like it's the
00:27:13.932 --> 00:27:17.172
one place where you can still go and see the
00:27:17.578 --> 00:27:22.918
like brick and mortar effect, like an actual setup of magic effects to buy. It's not online.
00:27:23.158 --> 00:27:27.558
You know, it's so rare that we get to be around other performers that much.
00:27:28.038 --> 00:27:33.398
Yeah. But then, yeah, you will see the show-offs or the people that are there
00:27:33.398 --> 00:27:35.138
because they want you to see them there.
00:27:35.518 --> 00:27:40.878
It's all those things, but it's essentially, it's great. So my vote would be, it's cool.
00:27:41.558 --> 00:27:44.578
It's a cool cult, you know, join. What do you say?
00:27:44.798 --> 00:27:48.658
Yeah, look, I think it's cool because, you know, anything that's going to help
00:27:48.658 --> 00:27:51.918
propagate forward in a good way is obviously very important.
00:27:52.058 --> 00:27:55.238
When you're at a convention, you're in the dealer's room, you're seeing all
00:27:55.238 --> 00:27:57.638
these products, most possibly for the first time.
00:27:57.778 --> 00:28:01.918
And then you have this beautiful opportunity to like purchase them months,
00:28:01.918 --> 00:28:05.818
if not sometimes a year before they actually hit the shelves of every other brick and mortar.
00:28:05.998 --> 00:28:09.418
So that's a really good place to be. You also get to sit in on the lectures,
00:28:09.638 --> 00:28:15.078
which I think are very valuable and be part of the panels and ask questions and,
00:28:15.078 --> 00:28:18.538
you know shake hands with a hero you know like we wouldn't have the pleasure
00:28:18.538 --> 00:28:22.318
of setting up so many friendships and you know like there's nothing more wonderful
00:28:22.318 --> 00:28:24.858
than getting in an elevator and someone turns to you and goes hey man aren't
00:28:24.858 --> 00:28:28.298
you in a band and I go oh I listen you know.
00:28:29.098 --> 00:28:34.698
You know so I think that that's important and community in magic is important
00:28:34.698 --> 00:28:38.498
because it helps keep us in check and I also think that there's probably some
00:28:38.498 --> 00:28:42.958
very small and I it's almost unnoticeable, but there are some,
00:28:43.678 --> 00:28:47.138
groups within the magic community that are really just themselves.
00:28:47.738 --> 00:28:51.898
Like, there's a lot of ways to enjoy magic conventions as part of a cult.
00:28:52.038 --> 00:28:55.898
For example, you might be a kid's performer and go to a kid's magic convention,
00:28:55.898 --> 00:29:02.178
or this week in Las Vegas, Trick Supply is exhibiting at the Magic Collector's Summit.
00:29:02.478 --> 00:29:06.678
It's a convention at the Orleans Hotel where the Magic Live is,
00:29:06.778 --> 00:29:08.638
but this is for people who collect magic.
00:29:08.978 --> 00:29:13.818
So, you know, And if you're into collectibles, well, there's your convention.
00:29:13.838 --> 00:29:17.038
If you're into close-up magic, you might go to trips, you know,
00:29:17.138 --> 00:29:18.378
in Charlotte, North Carolina.
00:29:19.578 --> 00:29:24.298
Yeah. So you can find your own cult to enjoy. It is cultish.
00:29:24.738 --> 00:29:31.758
Yeah. And so say if it's cool or cringe, I'm going to say conventions are cool. Josh. Cool. Cool.
00:29:32.518 --> 00:29:34.618
They're cool. Hey.
00:29:36.578 --> 00:29:38.378
Number seven. You guys know that?
00:29:39.283 --> 00:29:45.763
Oh, no. Doug's cringe. He just left the chat. He'll be back, I'm sure.
00:29:46.183 --> 00:29:49.263
Oh, geez. Well, we'll keep it moving until he gets back here.
00:29:49.783 --> 00:29:52.523
Because actually, probably good, too, that he's not here for this one.
00:29:52.683 --> 00:29:56.763
Number seven, are Invisible Decks and Spongeballs just lazy?
00:29:57.123 --> 00:30:02.003
Are they overused beginner props, or are they still strong when performed with intention?
00:30:02.723 --> 00:30:07.443
The question is, do classics deserve more respect or retirement?
00:30:08.963 --> 00:30:15.583
Whoo lots of loaded ammo here jeez we did have a chat one time about retiring,
00:30:16.283 --> 00:30:18.963
magic old magic remember that was a really
00:30:18.963 --> 00:30:21.843
fun episode we did not talk about the
00:30:21.843 --> 00:30:25.843
invisible deck in that episode no ha when
00:30:25.843 --> 00:30:28.723
was the last time nick you would have performed with the
00:30:28.723 --> 00:30:31.563
classic invisible deck gimmick itself i know
00:30:31.563 --> 00:30:34.403
you have your own beautiful version which is what maybe an artist should
00:30:34.403 --> 00:30:37.723
do but when did you last use an invisible deck honestly i
00:30:37.723 --> 00:30:41.183
bought one in the first year of me doing magic and
00:30:41.183 --> 00:30:44.783
i never performed it ever right okay
00:30:44.783 --> 00:30:47.823
um yep myself i
00:30:47.823 --> 00:30:51.183
have one invisible deck i own it's a bicycle deck and
00:30:51.183 --> 00:30:56.183
it's the box is getting so tattered because it just lives in a box somewhere
00:30:56.183 --> 00:31:01.923
that i can get if i need to yeah but don't use okay when was the last time you
00:31:01.923 --> 00:31:09.023
did a classic sponge ball routine I do not do sponge interesting I also,
00:31:09.683 --> 00:31:12.223
couldn't tell you where my sponge balls are right now.
00:31:13.403 --> 00:31:22.423
When I would do gigs I used to keep them just in my back pocket in case there was kids there yep and,
00:31:22.989 --> 00:31:26.429
That was before I got my hands on the lucky ladybug.
00:31:26.929 --> 00:31:29.809
And now that's my preference if there are kids there.
00:31:30.029 --> 00:31:34.789
Or if there were just overly drunk people or people from a different country
00:31:34.789 --> 00:31:36.409
that I couldn't communicate with.
00:31:36.569 --> 00:31:41.749
Spongeballs is an easy way to show them something in a particular environment.
00:31:41.909 --> 00:31:44.709
But yeah, I don't perform spongeballs either.
00:31:45.009 --> 00:31:51.949
So the question is, without Doug here to explain why they should not be cringe,
00:31:51.949 --> 00:31:54.869
i think maybe to us they're for us
00:31:54.869 --> 00:31:57.689
they're they're cringe wow okay can i all
00:31:57.689 --> 00:32:00.769
right they let me say something in defense of
00:32:00.769 --> 00:32:04.489
that then just for the sake of indifference of this conversation yeah
00:32:04.489 --> 00:32:07.469
the reason why i will never slander the
00:32:07.469 --> 00:32:11.609
invisible deck is because it is probably the
00:32:11.609 --> 00:32:15.589
best car trick ever made okay like name
00:32:15.589 --> 00:32:18.589
a car trick better than that probably you know we'd be
00:32:18.589 --> 00:32:21.349
like a personal preference of saying nothing beats a con
00:32:21.349 --> 00:32:24.169
that's the most magical card shit you can ever do and like you're right that
00:32:24.169 --> 00:32:26.989
is probably the most magical card stuff you can do i
00:32:26.989 --> 00:32:30.109
agree with that yeah but i'm always reminded
00:32:30.109 --> 00:32:33.389
of what i heard in the mark mason lecture when because as
00:32:33.389 --> 00:32:37.129
he he produces products and the first thing they said to him was mark.
00:32:37.129 --> 00:32:40.589
I have an idea for a trick he says is it
00:32:40.589 --> 00:32:43.649
better than invisible deck and if the answer is no he's like
00:32:43.649 --> 00:32:47.149
don't talk to me so and
00:32:47.149 --> 00:32:50.009
so that if we go to the chat real quick
00:32:50.009 --> 00:32:53.249
too we got alex saying if it ain't broke you know
00:32:53.249 --> 00:32:56.489
why why change what you're doing we got tim saying it's
00:32:56.489 --> 00:33:00.149
all about the performance which i very strongly like
00:33:00.149 --> 00:33:03.249
that comment scott link is saying it depends
00:33:03.249 --> 00:33:06.209
on this i like you know what this might be why you
00:33:06.209 --> 00:33:09.069
and i don't do these two effects it depends on
00:33:09.069 --> 00:33:12.629
statistically if they've ever seen many magicians
00:33:12.629 --> 00:33:15.389
live and that's something i do try and
00:33:15.389 --> 00:33:18.509
avoid i try and avoid mainstream effects so
00:33:18.509 --> 00:33:21.269
that someone can happily watch me do
00:33:21.269 --> 00:33:24.609
magic and then when they see someone else they can
00:33:24.609 --> 00:33:27.589
still enjoy that mainstream effect if they're
00:33:27.589 --> 00:33:30.569
doing it you know if they there's a
00:33:30.569 --> 00:33:33.809
problem if an audience is always seeing
00:33:33.809 --> 00:33:36.669
every magician do invisible deck and double
00:33:36.669 --> 00:33:39.569
cross you know that's a problem so i
00:33:39.569 --> 00:33:43.309
think that's a great one it depends how much magic the audience is is seeing
00:33:43.309 --> 00:33:48.089
alex is then saying because then you have to ask this about professor's nightmare.
00:33:48.089 --> 00:33:54.829
Cut restored row matrix book tests fair enough okay so yeah great great questions
00:33:54.829 --> 00:33:57.269
here i think if we were to reframe the question,
00:33:58.233 --> 00:34:01.893
Let's just, let's just, is it fair in saying the question wasn't more so about
00:34:01.893 --> 00:34:04.613
those two props, but more so about classics?
00:34:04.653 --> 00:34:06.693
Is that fair to sort of synopsisize that?
00:34:07.313 --> 00:34:12.113
The end question is, yeah, do classics deserve more respect or retirement?
00:34:12.513 --> 00:34:16.033
I believe the classics are classics for a reason.
00:34:16.893 --> 00:34:21.693
Never should anybody retire something like, what's a classic song?
00:34:22.033 --> 00:34:25.673
My Way by Sinatra, written by Paul Anka.
00:34:25.673 --> 00:34:28.433
That song will should never ever be retired and never
00:34:28.433 --> 00:34:31.213
sung again okay like that is an absolute banger and it
00:34:31.213 --> 00:34:34.673
needs to be around forever candle in the wind by elton
00:34:34.673 --> 00:34:37.473
john needs to be around forever whatever from the
00:34:37.473 --> 00:34:40.373
beatles like classics are classics for
00:34:40.373 --> 00:34:46.233
a reason man they've got to they've got to stick around for because they are
00:34:46.233 --> 00:34:49.933
classics one and like imagine saying to someone that like you can't watch the
00:34:49.933 --> 00:34:54.433
matrix you know like that's a that's a classic film now you know what i mean
00:34:54.433 --> 00:34:58.713
You've got to watch The Matrix or Die Hard. Like, come on.
00:34:59.473 --> 00:35:04.713
Classics are classics for a reason. They're not cringe and they need to stick around.
00:35:05.733 --> 00:35:08.193
All right. Hear, hear. Agreed.
00:35:09.253 --> 00:35:13.153
This is going well. I would say they're a little cringe if everyone's doing just that.
00:35:13.253 --> 00:35:17.393
I think it's the difference between being the entertainer and the artist.
00:35:17.553 --> 00:35:20.033
The artist should learn them, use them for when they need to,
00:35:20.153 --> 00:35:23.913
but then quickly try to come with your own versions that...
00:35:24.433 --> 00:35:27.353
You know, help you stand out. Yeah, like Snow White.
00:35:27.613 --> 00:35:31.013
You know what I mean? Like when they did Snow White again. Exactly like Snow
00:35:31.013 --> 00:35:34.933
White. Yeah. So much. They should not have picked her. It was so much better.
00:35:37.753 --> 00:35:41.153
That's funny. All right, here we go. Number six, counting down.
00:35:42.113 --> 00:35:45.773
Oof. Is magician voice a crime?
00:35:46.133 --> 00:35:53.753
The tones and fake mystery and fake elegance cringe, or is the vocal control
00:35:53.753 --> 00:35:57.213
and presence that magicians use, does it elevate the act?
00:35:57.593 --> 00:36:03.533
And then the challenge is, can you perform in your natural voice and still command
00:36:03.533 --> 00:36:05.873
the room? And we welcome back Doug.
00:36:06.493 --> 00:36:11.233
Welcome back, Doug. To this chat. Check one thing. I'm on the phone. How do I sound? Okay?
00:36:11.973 --> 00:36:15.833
Sound great, bud. You're sounding great. Good stuff. All right, cool. Back to normal.
00:36:16.293 --> 00:36:21.933
Just a reminder, everyone, this is the Magic Guys Live. The Magic Guys Live.
00:36:22.033 --> 00:36:24.633
This is unreheathed, unedited.
00:36:24.893 --> 00:36:26.773
This is just straight up raw dogging.
00:36:27.393 --> 00:36:31.753
Heck yeah. Yeah. So we're kind of glad you weren't here for the last question,
00:36:31.833 --> 00:36:34.613
Doug, because we're talking about Invisible Deck and Sponge Balls.
00:36:34.713 --> 00:36:36.133
But now we're on to question six.
00:36:36.333 --> 00:36:38.653
Worst tricks ever. Excellent.
00:36:40.053 --> 00:36:44.033
So we're talking about the magician voice, the voice that magicians put on when
00:36:44.033 --> 00:36:48.533
they go on stage to like, you know, create mystery and, you know,
00:36:48.533 --> 00:36:52.753
have this sort of elegance to their way they speak. And the question is,
00:36:53.471 --> 00:36:57.631
Is that cringe or is that elevating the act?
00:36:57.911 --> 00:37:02.071
And then the underlying challenge is, can we perform in our natural voice and
00:37:02.071 --> 00:37:05.051
it still commands the room? Dun, dun, dun.
00:37:05.691 --> 00:37:08.791
You want to go first, Doug? Because I have very strong opinions about this.
00:37:09.391 --> 00:37:13.791
I'll briefly say, we've kind of mentioned this already, it's be an exaggerated
00:37:13.791 --> 00:37:18.771
version of yourself. That would include speaking in a more exaggerated version
00:37:18.771 --> 00:37:21.651
and probably louder. That's my thought.
00:37:22.471 --> 00:37:23.991
Well said. Hmm.
00:37:24.911 --> 00:37:28.371
Well said. I think it's funny.
00:37:28.571 --> 00:37:34.451
I'm trying to think of, there was this time where I was chatting to a guy who
00:37:34.451 --> 00:37:40.311
did magic part-time and we're chatting like Aussies.
00:37:40.451 --> 00:37:43.291
We're like, yeah, mate, yeah, blah, blah, blah. And this, that, and the other.
00:37:43.591 --> 00:37:46.151
And oh yeah, I love that effect and blah, blah, blah. And I'm like,
00:37:46.211 --> 00:37:47.331
oh, can you show me a trick?
00:37:47.471 --> 00:37:50.451
And he's like, oh yeah, there is one I know.
00:37:50.571 --> 00:37:52.811
Here we go. And my girlfriend's next to me. He's like, all right,
00:37:52.811 --> 00:37:58.831
here we go man could you take out any three cars you want okay now please do
00:37:58.831 --> 00:38:03.611
not let me see them and you know what and he went into the weirdest performance
00:38:03.611 --> 00:38:05.871
of my freaking life you know.
00:38:06.951 --> 00:38:09.831
I'm gonna can i show you a trick absolutely all right
00:38:09.831 --> 00:38:18.671
yeah like man it was so weird like it was so weird and i was like bro none of
00:38:18.671 --> 00:38:23.011
this is authentic like you don't talk like that i've just spent 10 minutes with
00:38:23.011 --> 00:38:28.331
you as a bogan you can't now switch to to um derren brown you know.
00:38:28.951 --> 00:38:33.151
So yeah that was a bit let me throw it at you carissa hendrix
00:38:33.151 --> 00:38:36.811
plays a character called lucy darling and her accent that she's developed over
00:38:36.811 --> 00:38:41.711
the years like it doesn't exist she's purposely done an amalgamation of several
00:38:41.711 --> 00:38:45.471
characters and we should bring her on the show to talk about this to make this
00:38:45.471 --> 00:38:50.011
particular accent and no one knows where she's from she could be dutch she could be
00:38:50.051 --> 00:38:53.491
french it could be so many different things you would never know but it
00:38:53.491 --> 00:38:56.911
works and it's this beautiful accent that's
00:38:56.911 --> 00:38:59.671
like everyone should be able to
00:38:59.671 --> 00:39:04.071
identify with it in some capacity or another so i
00:39:04.071 --> 00:39:07.631
you know it needs to be done
00:39:07.631 --> 00:39:10.331
well i got a friend of mine
00:39:10.331 --> 00:39:13.331
called davide kaufman and he's
00:39:13.331 --> 00:39:16.211
that's what he calls himself but he's he's italian his italian is
00:39:16.211 --> 00:39:20.031
all get out like he was performing and
00:39:20.031 --> 00:39:23.171
somebody talks it's very like you know everything's
00:39:23.171 --> 00:39:25.991
like i must pay for the tosti or pick a card
00:39:25.991 --> 00:39:28.771
like it's like this thing he finished his
00:39:28.771 --> 00:39:31.551
set and they were like i really liked your show but like i
00:39:31.551 --> 00:39:35.571
think that you're lay off the accent it's a bit racist and he's like but this
00:39:35.571 --> 00:39:43.731
is how i talk what do you mean it was just being himself so that's funny so
00:39:43.731 --> 00:39:47.151
that being said it's obviously the audience can be perceiving things in such
00:39:47.151 --> 00:39:51.331
a way and i think this wouldn't be a problem if we went so upset about, you know.
00:39:52.193 --> 00:39:55.593
Social warrior type folk, you know, pronouns, the whole hamburger,
00:39:55.833 --> 00:39:59.453
like this is all stuff that now has come into the equation of us addressing audiences.
00:39:59.633 --> 00:40:02.773
You can never, it's almost very scary to say, may I have your name miss?
00:40:03.133 --> 00:40:07.033
You know, I, I don't gender, I gender nobody, bro.
00:40:07.273 --> 00:40:10.453
I just go, and what's your name friend? And if I call a woman,
00:40:10.653 --> 00:40:12.093
anything, I call her your majesty.
00:40:12.673 --> 00:40:16.113
What's your name, your majesty? Because that could be either or, right?
00:40:16.273 --> 00:40:19.913
But it's just the, the means of me setting a status in which saying that like,
00:40:19.993 --> 00:40:24.353
I'm here to serve you, your majesty this is my job i'm just a jester and you
00:40:24.353 --> 00:40:28.073
call anyone that they go okay cool like we've created a standard here he's sort
00:40:28.073 --> 00:40:30.573
of acknowledging me that's the important thing.
00:40:31.073 --> 00:40:34.173
I've heard of scenarios where a friend
00:40:34.173 --> 00:40:37.333
of mine who does tim ellis tim ellis does a routine but he
00:40:37.333 --> 00:40:39.993
opens his show he he's a mad hatter and he's
00:40:39.993 --> 00:40:42.853
an amazing mad hatter and he gets on stage good evening
00:40:42.853 --> 00:40:45.873
boys and girls boys and girls men women
00:40:45.873 --> 00:40:49.893
blah blah and beautiful creatures of all denominations right
00:40:49.893 --> 00:40:52.993
it's like this really cute long thing and the
00:40:52.993 --> 00:40:56.513
sound tech was like queer and
00:40:56.513 --> 00:40:59.553
said thank you for making me feel included then i had another friend
00:40:59.553 --> 00:41:02.453
who was queer who said don't say
00:41:02.453 --> 00:41:06.293
that it's the rugatry and it makes us third class citizens because
00:41:06.293 --> 00:41:09.213
you mentioned because you mentioned us last and it's like
00:41:09.213 --> 00:41:12.733
i right for real child are
00:41:12.733 --> 00:41:15.433
you for real and the kid was young you know what i mean i just said
00:41:15.433 --> 00:41:18.233
like come on child come on come on like yeah you're at.
00:41:18.233 --> 00:41:21.193
A magic show kid like yeah but look
00:41:21.193 --> 00:41:25.133
did not deter too much away from the the question
00:41:25.133 --> 00:41:27.773
of cringe or not cringe let me let me
00:41:27.773 --> 00:41:30.813
finish my point right so the point
00:41:30.813 --> 00:41:34.273
is that erroneous of like how
00:41:34.273 --> 00:41:37.093
you say it right i think it's okay to
00:41:37.093 --> 00:41:40.593
have a different tone when you do say things i have
00:41:40.593 --> 00:41:43.413
many years of vocal training because i used to be in a
00:41:43.413 --> 00:41:48.013
band hey it's been
00:41:48.013 --> 00:41:51.673
a while i don't have any i didn't even
00:41:51.673 --> 00:41:56.813
prepare a shot for that one now because of that when i when i'm on stage my
00:41:56.813 --> 00:42:00.553
voice booms a lot more and i speak a certain way but when i'm in a close-up
00:42:00.553 --> 00:42:04.433
setting talking to a kid what's your name little one oh this is evie everyone
00:42:04.433 --> 00:42:08.673
say hi evie you know it's polite it's the same way that I'll get on the phone.
00:42:08.733 --> 00:42:10.133
I'll be like, all right, shut up, shut up, shut up.
00:42:10.713 --> 00:42:14.073
Honeyk speaking, you know, and I have a different tone for when I speak.
00:42:14.213 --> 00:42:17.913
So I don't think it's wrong to change your delivery.
00:42:19.155 --> 00:42:25.015
But if you're going to have a script that you speak to, you know, like, I don't know.
00:42:25.395 --> 00:42:28.555
Yeah, I think it is cool. I think play with your voice.
00:42:29.135 --> 00:42:35.375
Absolutely. Don't be inauthentic if you're still playing yourself on stage.
00:42:35.515 --> 00:42:36.815
If you're playing a character, great.
00:42:37.175 --> 00:42:42.455
Like, by the way, how have we not had Carissa Hendricks on here yet?
00:42:42.535 --> 00:42:45.495
I'm making that this week's task.
00:42:45.715 --> 00:42:48.835
But I think it's cool. What do you guys think? yeah
00:42:48.835 --> 00:42:51.575
so i'm going to finish by saying that i don't think it's cringe and i think that
00:42:51.575 --> 00:42:54.635
you should adjust to your audience when i perform for high
00:42:54.635 --> 00:42:57.455
society my vernacular is very
00:42:57.455 --> 00:43:02.535
different because it's my job to be a professional communicator and to approach
00:43:02.535 --> 00:43:07.075
him in that way when i perform for all the guys who are tradies and the plumbers
00:43:07.075 --> 00:43:11.855
and the guys building our tunnels i'm definitely yeah none yeah nah definitely
00:43:11.855 --> 00:43:16.535
yeah nah yeah nah for sure bloke yeah come on bloke choose a car bloke you know go mate.
00:43:17.715 --> 00:43:25.235
Be dynamic love it not cringe I'm gonna switch to that helium voice Norbido's
00:43:25.235 --> 00:43:34.415
been using that's my new well if you use my Amazon link and purchase the Rodecaster Pro 2,
00:43:35.135 --> 00:43:42.415
what you you too can sound like this alright that's a good one it is a good
00:43:42.415 --> 00:43:45.675
one hey I like it alright it's a good one It's cool.
00:43:45.975 --> 00:43:50.715
Number five, do TikTok magicians make magic look lame?
00:43:51.015 --> 00:43:55.895
Are they using an overuse of cuts, stooges, and acting shocked?
00:43:56.115 --> 00:43:59.435
Or is it the new platform, new audiences, and fresh creativity?
00:43:59.735 --> 00:44:03.315
The debate is, are viral tricks good for the art?
00:44:04.275 --> 00:44:08.855
Perfect timing for Doug to be on here for this. I'm going to just say one thing.
00:44:08.855 --> 00:44:14.535
I don't know if it's good for the art, but I do think it's good for the scene. you,
00:44:15.203 --> 00:44:19.463
Doug, I can see a whole episode here in his head right now. Yeah.
00:44:21.083 --> 00:44:24.443
I don't, you know, yeah, I don't think it's good for the art.
00:44:24.683 --> 00:44:30.063
I think most of the content that's even popular is very cringe.
00:44:31.083 --> 00:44:38.523
I don't know. Yeah, it's like the ones that's viral aren't the ones that we
00:44:38.523 --> 00:44:40.023
would go and watch at a show.
00:44:40.023 --> 00:44:43.923
Like i don't feel like the right top
00:44:43.923 --> 00:44:46.803
artists are the ones becoming like the super
00:44:46.803 --> 00:44:50.043
super viral it's what like i don't know it's it's i'm
00:44:50.043 --> 00:44:53.463
thinking like pete firman right now is making some great content that goes viral
00:44:53.463 --> 00:44:57.443
pretty regularly and it could be like it could be cringe but he transcends it
00:44:57.443 --> 00:45:01.103
a little bit plays it out i would think anyone watching one of his videos would
00:45:01.103 --> 00:45:05.623
be happy actually that's a great point yeah he's the right person for doing
00:45:05.623 --> 00:45:08.263
magic well on tiktok and in person And obviously,
00:45:08.483 --> 00:45:13.243
you've had great success as well, building off TikTok and off YouTube.
00:45:13.723 --> 00:45:19.403
And also this, honestly, timing was great, you know, and I guess part of the
00:45:19.403 --> 00:45:23.263
deal is you got to know when the timing's right. And if you want something, go get it when it is.
00:45:23.463 --> 00:45:26.103
But like the content that I put out, mostly cringe.
00:45:26.323 --> 00:45:29.623
Like I can't even stand to watch most of that crap. So, yeah.
00:45:32.119 --> 00:45:36.359
Well, throwing to our audience, I mean, Alex has said, Alex Lamb has said,
00:45:36.499 --> 00:45:41.479
based on those parameters, no Stooges, fake hot girlfriend, reactions and edits,
00:45:41.759 --> 00:45:43.159
that stuff equals cringe.
00:45:44.099 --> 00:45:48.119
Yeah. Yeah. Genuine content. Like, Josh, you post a lot of it.
00:45:48.239 --> 00:45:51.499
You're doing material in the real world. You showcase those moments.
00:45:51.659 --> 00:45:57.159
Carissa is blowing up doing the same thing with, you know, clips of her audience work.
00:45:57.319 --> 00:46:00.399
And this is a great way to share your magic.
00:46:01.959 --> 00:46:06.479
As though people would be seeing it in the wild. It's really hard to say,
00:46:06.579 --> 00:46:10.319
I'm going to be a TikTok magician and make a magic trick for the camera.
00:46:10.819 --> 00:46:14.059
Usually it's just like... Would you agree?
00:46:14.219 --> 00:46:19.539
It's like, it's good for the art if you're just betraying your art form and
00:46:19.539 --> 00:46:26.559
not trying to mold to what might go viral with the overreactions and the... Yeah, it's good.
00:46:26.859 --> 00:46:29.779
Always good to be true to yourself and try to make good
00:46:29.779 --> 00:46:32.699
creative stuff yeah the other
00:46:32.699 --> 00:46:35.679
thing that's annoying too is the clips of
00:46:35.679 --> 00:46:41.039
mine that will go viral are not they're the ones that like show a little bit
00:46:41.039 --> 00:46:46.159
of maybe i can see some of the method like they're they're not the ones that
00:46:46.159 --> 00:46:49.859
are just like really entertaining it's always the ones that are like i slipped
00:46:49.859 --> 00:46:54.759
up a tiny bit and then boom half a million views i'm like I think in general,
00:46:54.819 --> 00:46:58.399
on social media or even online viewing like YouTube,
00:46:58.679 --> 00:47:01.459
people want education. So that's part of that alert.
00:47:01.679 --> 00:47:04.899
They're going to learn something that benefits the viewer. They share it with
00:47:04.899 --> 00:47:06.679
a friend because it benefits them.
00:47:07.019 --> 00:47:11.099
And rarely, I think, do the people making these videos approach it with that
00:47:11.099 --> 00:47:14.699
frame of mind. Like, I'm going to give my viewer something to take away from this.
00:47:15.979 --> 00:47:18.339
Besides how great I am at the back post.
00:47:19.003 --> 00:47:25.043
Maybe, and maybe the last thing I'll say to this is the new FISM category for online content.
00:47:25.343 --> 00:47:29.483
Maybe that helps in some way with giving a direction for doing,
00:47:29.483 --> 00:47:32.263
you know, good content, as Doug would say.
00:47:32.903 --> 00:47:37.483
Yeah. You know, Tim Askin just referenced Jackie Yu. And I think Jackie does
00:47:37.483 --> 00:47:39.023
some of the best stuff you've ever seen.
00:47:39.223 --> 00:47:45.103
So do I think that, look, everyone can do something wrong, right?
00:47:45.323 --> 00:47:48.023
Like everyone can be like, I'm going to open a restaurant and be like,
00:47:48.103 --> 00:47:51.543
this food is awful. Okay. I'm going to do magic. You're doing it awful.
00:47:51.903 --> 00:47:56.003
I, I don't think it should be stopped. I don't think it's entirely bad,
00:47:56.003 --> 00:48:01.843
but I think that because it's in its adolescence that hopefully that it doesn't get worse.
00:48:01.983 --> 00:48:06.143
And hopefully with things like FISM and like amazing people who create stuff
00:48:06.143 --> 00:48:10.343
like the Jackie use of the world, the, the Alex Boyer, Jesus Christ,
00:48:10.503 --> 00:48:14.263
his stuff, Dennis, Liam, sorry.
00:48:14.843 --> 00:48:18.343
Yes. Sorry. I misbroke. Uh, Dennis came like his thing with the mirror.
00:48:18.823 --> 00:48:22.183
Jesus christ like it is that stuff yeah like
00:48:22.183 --> 00:48:25.103
i watched that and i think to myself like where do you even read that where
00:48:25.103 --> 00:48:29.083
do you even read that stuff to come up with it like that is so good it hurts
00:48:29.083 --> 00:48:36.663
me so that stuff as far as the art form goes i'm gonna say hell yeah and then
00:48:36.663 --> 00:48:40.803
all the stuff to do with exposure and all that malakia i'm gonna say cringe
00:48:40.803 --> 00:48:43.863
and agree with alex lamb on that one.
00:48:44.003 --> 00:48:47.583
I think this, let me say, even if you're producing cringe content,
00:48:47.843 --> 00:48:49.823
the process of doing so is beneficial
00:48:49.823 --> 00:48:52.683
because you're going to try a little harder to get this thing right.
00:48:52.823 --> 00:48:56.363
I don't know that a lot of magicians even try that hard to get it past the mirror.
00:48:56.603 --> 00:48:59.123
You watch yourself in the mirror, you say it looks pretty good,
00:48:59.143 --> 00:49:01.843
but if you actually go to the links that you're going to put something on video
00:49:01.843 --> 00:49:04.843
for social media, you're probably going to rehearse it a little more.
00:49:04.963 --> 00:49:08.103
And so, you know, if you like doing it, maybe one day you'll be really
00:49:08.103 --> 00:49:10.723
good at it and just become a better magician in the
00:49:10.723 --> 00:49:13.583
process so i think that's okay and it's
00:49:13.583 --> 00:49:16.883
not harming anything because no one's going to see those bad videos you know
00:49:16.883 --> 00:49:21.723
a couple hundred people might see them it's not going to matter although i i
00:49:21.723 --> 00:49:26.623
just had one that i hate my hate my first million as far as a real goes did
00:49:26.623 --> 00:49:33.563
you know i did yeah yeah what's what did it what's the banger you know what it was,
00:49:34.303 --> 00:49:39.763
exposure do scullers lucky ladybug that was it that's the video.
00:49:40.863 --> 00:49:44.303
I thought it was your coins across that was going
00:49:44.303 --> 00:49:49.343
to hit a mil that did half a mil I think what the
00:49:49.343 --> 00:49:52.243
actual shout out to do scullers lucky ladybug it
00:49:52.243 --> 00:49:57.083
got me a million views doing it at a local lady it's a live performance of an
00:49:57.083 --> 00:50:01.943
effect where I'm sure the person is reacting wonderfully to the trick and that's
00:50:01.943 --> 00:50:05.623
what I'm talking about Everything I've done where I'm to screen and I've really
00:50:05.623 --> 00:50:08.603
polished it up and I've set my lights properly and I've spent half a day trying
00:50:08.603 --> 00:50:10.443
to get it right and worked on it for weeks.
00:50:11.261 --> 00:50:14.401
Couple of thousand views something where somebody who
00:50:14.401 --> 00:50:17.821
who's damn near has parkinson's and can't even hold the camera straight and
00:50:17.821 --> 00:50:21.521
shake shake shake they're polite enough to film it and send it to my socials
00:50:21.521 --> 00:50:26.781
which i then repost and it gets a million views so is this on tiktok you're
00:50:26.781 --> 00:50:28.301
referring to i'm talking about
00:50:28.301 --> 00:50:32.021
instagram because i'm looking on instagram and your lucky ladybug has,
00:50:32.681 --> 00:50:35.501
4 000 views at least the one with the kid at tom but
00:50:35.501 --> 00:50:38.341
the one million viewed video is the one
00:50:38.341 --> 00:50:41.201
that's oh my mistake my mistake
00:50:41.201 --> 00:50:44.081
i'm seeing it now i'm with the lady oh this
00:50:44.081 --> 00:50:48.081
one here yeah okay okay wow lucky
00:50:48.081 --> 00:50:51.121
ladybug at a corporate event boom a million
00:50:51.121 --> 00:50:57.121
views congrats man that's do scale of magic.com go there buy it and then buy
00:50:57.121 --> 00:51:02.661
everything else their whole catalog is great yeah real good far out that's crazy
00:51:02.661 --> 00:51:07.181
something to be said as well about you doing something that viewers wouldn't
00:51:07.181 --> 00:51:10.401
have seen on a video probably before.
00:51:11.341 --> 00:51:20.441
Love it. Number four. Is it cool to pretend you have magic powers, like real powers?
00:51:21.001 --> 00:51:26.301
And the debates here, do the viewers roll their eyes at the fake mysticism or
00:51:26.301 --> 00:51:28.821
when presented as theater, is it powerful?
00:51:29.121 --> 00:51:33.841
And then the question is, how do you walk the line between mystery and make
00:51:33.841 --> 00:51:37.881
believe it's not cool there i said it.
00:51:40.341 --> 00:51:43.481
Dude it's it's interesting because you know
00:51:43.481 --> 00:51:46.381
you you see someone like copperfield and you go this is
00:51:46.381 --> 00:51:49.361
this is magic this is real magic like you know it's like
00:51:49.361 --> 00:51:53.441
yeah it's like this is crazy i
00:51:53.441 --> 00:51:56.381
don't know beauty beauty is in the eye of the beholder as
00:51:56.381 --> 00:51:59.381
i was talking with my wife last night she can't stand
00:51:59.381 --> 00:52:02.021
the goat where i was
00:52:02.021 --> 00:52:06.301
like you want to go see copperfield instead of that she's like no yeah
00:52:06.301 --> 00:52:10.181
i can't stand the way he does magic yeah i
00:52:10.181 --> 00:52:17.401
had a friend who's not a magician at all and went to vegas saw copperfield saw
00:52:17.401 --> 00:52:23.321
chris angel and could not stop raving enough about angel and his wife got bored
00:52:23.321 --> 00:52:27.761
of copperfield they're like what is this this is a kid this is kitty like,
00:52:27.941 --> 00:52:28.801
you know, the way he's like.
00:52:29.341 --> 00:52:33.761
And so, yeah, you're right. Eye of the beholder. He's sort of legendary status now.
00:52:33.881 --> 00:52:37.721
So we, I feel like we see a show because of, you know, all the stuff he's done
00:52:37.721 --> 00:52:39.441
before. Because he's still going...
00:52:40.131 --> 00:52:43.551
The magic in that
00:52:43.551 --> 00:52:47.011
show speaks for itself so like the
00:52:47.011 --> 00:52:50.491
performance okay you might have a good night might have a bad one you're gonna
00:52:50.491 --> 00:52:56.611
love the magic though yeah and here's the thing i think that there is like i
00:52:56.611 --> 00:53:00.771
saw chris angel show too and i became a fan after watching it like this is many
00:53:00.771 --> 00:53:06.511
years ago now i thought it was unbelievable and it was david penn who told me to to see it he goes
00:53:06.571 --> 00:53:09.491
the best show there the reason i liked chris angel
00:53:09.491 --> 00:53:12.531
show so much is because there was a huge level of personality in
00:53:12.531 --> 00:53:15.691
it which added to the already amazing
00:53:15.691 --> 00:53:18.651
magic which i thought was really good so for
00:53:18.651 --> 00:53:21.291
me that level was great and there's a
00:53:21.291 --> 00:53:24.151
little there's something wonderful about when you experience a
00:53:24.151 --> 00:53:27.411
show for example i've i've done
00:53:27.411 --> 00:53:32.011
a bunch of gigs in which we've had to entertain the vips of large-scale concerts
00:53:32.011 --> 00:53:38.271
so we have bands like queen katie perry pink we did a whole tour from and then
00:53:38.271 --> 00:53:42.991
you see their shows live and what i took away from watching these people that
00:53:42.991 --> 00:53:45.531
you know especially something like katie perry which i was not a fan of but
00:53:45.531 --> 00:53:46.451
then you go watch their show.
00:53:47.011 --> 00:53:50.811
And all of a sudden you're like you're a fan because they're so cool and they're
00:53:50.811 --> 00:53:54.931
so lovable and they're so lovely like on the stage and to their audience and
00:53:54.931 --> 00:53:58.931
everything else so all of a sudden I go like, I think Katy Perry's cool.
00:53:59.231 --> 00:54:03.871
Then she comes back from planet, you know, from a little planet of operation.
00:54:04.251 --> 00:54:09.051
And it's, and all the reports now say that her show is, is, is awful.
00:54:09.571 --> 00:54:13.131
And, and then no one should go and watch it. Like her performance is so bad.
00:54:13.251 --> 00:54:17.691
And I'm like, how did that happen in the space of three years? You know? So yeah.
00:54:18.427 --> 00:54:21.547
I think what is coming to mind right now,
00:54:21.627 --> 00:54:25.067
and I'm just going to end with my opinion by saying that there's nice when there's
00:54:25.067 --> 00:54:32.127
a level of genuine personality injected into your routines and a bit where they
00:54:32.127 --> 00:54:37.827
see you perform and they can tell the type of person who you are and they like who that person is.
00:54:37.827 --> 00:54:40.787
So I think that that's a nice place to be if you're
00:54:40.787 --> 00:54:44.187
going to be a performer so the whole fake
00:54:44.187 --> 00:54:46.987
bravado and I've met so many people who
00:54:46.987 --> 00:54:49.907
aren't this but then tell me I want
00:54:49.907 --> 00:54:52.627
to be the debonair type magician and I
00:54:52.627 --> 00:54:55.547
want to wear the expensive suit and be able to talk very
00:54:55.547 --> 00:54:58.647
eloquently and it's like you can barely string together a sentence nor
00:54:58.647 --> 00:55:01.927
have you ever read a book it's so disingenuous I
00:55:01.927 --> 00:55:04.827
just don't think that's going to be your character but give
00:55:04.827 --> 00:55:08.267
it a crack it'll take you a while to get that character right but it's.
00:55:08.267 --> 00:55:12.127
Going to be cringe for a long long time unless you reach carissa
00:55:12.127 --> 00:55:15.287
hendrix levels of character building so i'm
00:55:15.287 --> 00:55:18.727
gonna end by saying cringe and after
00:55:18.727 --> 00:55:21.587
nick gave me that advice i've been trying hard ever since
00:55:21.587 --> 00:55:25.427
yeah let
00:55:25.427 --> 00:55:28.307
me say this 99 cringe but the
00:55:28.307 --> 00:55:31.207
one percent doing it right are the best performers in
00:55:31.207 --> 00:55:34.947
our art well said yeah amazing
00:55:34.947 --> 00:55:37.607
amazing so look we're almost out of
00:55:37.607 --> 00:55:42.767
time so what i'm what i'll do is on instagram i'll put up a poll in our stories
00:55:42.767 --> 00:55:46.267
for each of the the full 10 questions so you can see the other three questions
00:55:46.267 --> 00:55:52.347
on there as well and you can vote yes or no is it cringe because the underlying
00:55:52.347 --> 00:55:56.187
overall factor is is magic cool or cringe at the end of the day,
00:55:56.347 --> 00:55:58.727
all these questions we're saying is sort of alluding to that.
00:55:59.507 --> 00:56:03.727
And I mean, Doug kind of nailed it. Like a lot of it can be cringe,
00:56:03.867 --> 00:56:06.707
but the ones that are doing it right can make it seem cool.
00:56:07.227 --> 00:56:10.507
But overall verdict, is magic cool or cringe?
00:56:11.207 --> 00:56:15.887
I would say if I had to really put it in a category, I wouldn't give it the
00:56:15.887 --> 00:56:20.627
cool category, but I also wouldn't give it the cringe category. I would give it like.
00:56:21.452 --> 00:56:28.092
As a person walking into a party and being a magician, I would call it the quirky fun category.
00:56:28.372 --> 00:56:33.892
It's like quirky cool. It's like how nerds are cool now.
00:56:34.372 --> 00:56:38.012
It's like sort of in that realm, like we're doing really odd,
00:56:38.292 --> 00:56:42.312
fun things that people love us for it, but it's not like we're cool,
00:56:42.612 --> 00:56:44.312
you know, at least not for my character.
00:56:44.512 --> 00:56:50.892
And so I would say in my world, magic comes across as very quirky and fun.
00:56:51.632 --> 00:56:53.192
That's what I'll put down to for me.
00:56:53.972 --> 00:56:57.532
Doug, what would you say in the land of magic? Yeah, you know,
00:56:57.652 --> 00:57:02.212
I would kind of lean towards cringe for the average, you know, joke.
00:57:02.632 --> 00:57:06.512
If this were a worldwide poll, I would think most people would be like, magic, huh?
00:57:07.692 --> 00:57:09.892
But yeah, I think you're right. We're nerdy cool.
00:57:12.392 --> 00:57:16.332
Yeah. What do you think, Nick? I'm going to tell you two quick stories.
00:57:16.332 --> 00:57:19.652
I remember going to my mechanic one time and he
00:57:19.652 --> 00:57:22.432
saw a deck of cards on the dashboard and he
00:57:22.432 --> 00:57:25.652
was like what's the deal with that and I said I'm a magician showed him
00:57:25.652 --> 00:57:31.832
a trick at the end of it he said I was having the worst day the worst day and
00:57:31.832 --> 00:57:37.992
now I can't stop smiling I think that's pretty cool 15 years ago I was performing
00:57:37.992 --> 00:57:44.472
and this dude watched my show on the street and he says I'm suffering from depression.
00:57:44.812 --> 00:57:47.352
And this is the first smile I've had in eight months.
00:57:48.172 --> 00:57:51.472
That's pretty cool. Magic is cool.
00:57:53.792 --> 00:57:57.892
Thanks for listening. It's time for us to disappear now.
00:57:59.212 --> 00:58:03.752
But we'll see you again on the next episode of The Magic Guys.