WEBVTT
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Welcome to You Vive Live.
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I'm Christina Cook.
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And I'm Adam Lyons.
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And we just had an awesome guest, Kristen Van Horn.
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She's the program coordinator for the uh problem gambling help network of West Virginia.
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I mean fantastic conversation.
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Her and I are very aligned on recovery and recovery views, and it just I could literally see I could see the heart emojis like circling your head as she was talking several times during the conversation.
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I mean, yeah, you guys are cut from the same cloth, and I mean that as a compliment to both of you.
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Like it's awesome.
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She was she was great.
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I and I love how like one of the amazing things about West Virginia.
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I mean, wonderful people, wonderful country.
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Um, but the amount of resources, they have a very comprehensive resource program.
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I mean, financial counseling, peer support, treatment, and all like even additional, if you need blockers, things like that, like they are very comp comprehensive on how they they offer help, and it's at no cost.
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And that's yeah, pretty amazing.
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No, and I think you know, talking to Kristen in Nashville and talking to her today, and also, you know, shout out to Mariselle and Nick.
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You know, the thing I love about this team is that they're looking for solutions, right?
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They're keeping it positive, they're looking to move forward.
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And I'm guilty, we all know, I'm guilty of, you know, getting hung up on where we can do better or where we're struggling.
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But I just I love the energy that they put out, which is that this is what we do, here's where we could get better, but like let's let's keep going.
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Let's keep going.
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Let's not get hung up on that.
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And and I think that that is so important, and it literally needs to be injected into the veins of every single person working in this space right now.
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Absolutely, absolutely, and and you're right.
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Sometimes we can focus and you know, prioritize what what we aren't doing right or where we're lacking in something, and we don't put enough focus on what's in front of us, what is working, where are the supports?
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This is happening, you know.
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So exactly fantastic conversation to kind of bring it back in.
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Totally.
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So let's get to it.
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Here is our conversation with Kristen Van Horn.
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Hello, everyone, welcome to another episode of EVOV Live.
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My name is Adam Lines.
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I'm here with Christina Cook, and our guest today, along with being an amazing karaoke singer, she is the program coordinator for the Problem Gambling Help Network of West Virginia.
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Please welcome to evive live, Kristen Van Horn.
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Kristen, hello.
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Hey, hello, welcome.
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Welcome to me, I guess.
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Great to have you.
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Yes, the honor, honor.
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This is such an honor to be here and get to speak with you guys today.
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Oh, come on, come on.
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Love that though.
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Um, so yeah, tell us um, tell us who you are, tell us what you do.
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Let's start there.
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Yeah.
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So um you you nailed it um minus the karaoke, but uh, but uh, so my name is Kristen, of course, and I'm the program coordinator for the Problem Gambling Health Network of West Virginia.
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And that is a mouthful, but it is something that I have loved doing.
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Uh, been with the program, it'll be five years in September.
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So uh interesting enough, I joined five years ago after I was working in foster care.
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I did that for about six years and loved it, was in leadership, had some really great experiences, but I was experiencing severe burnout.
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And that's also a lot of the story that I share with others and in the community.
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But I needed to get away because it was taking away my life, my energy, my soul.
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So I thought I still want to do something that helps people, but I wanted that nine to five kind of vibe.
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And so I wanted to come in, go out, be done.
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And so I started for the Problem Gambling Help Network after Jennifer, Davis Walton, Lisa Lewis, and Mariselle Bernardo, who are incredible women within the program, took a chance on me and said, Hey, you know, let's let's see what you got.
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And so I started answering the lines.
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That was my my first job as the helpline coordinator.
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And I always say, although I joined as a way to figure out where I wanted to go with my life, the joke was on me that I found exactly what I wanted to do with my life because it was very quick when I realized how much I resonated with our callers, how much I understood that chaos is comfort, stuck in a cycle, stuck in a loop.
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And so it just grew a passion and a purpose for my own self, I'm gonna say, a little selfishly, because it was some intrinsic rewards within that.
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But more than anything, outwardly of just knowing how unserved underserved the community is for those who are experiencing gambling-related harm can be.
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And so I just fell in love with the program, with the mission.
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And so last year, just so happens a coordinator position opened up and I felt I was ready to take that step.
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And Marisol was crazy enough to say, yeah, let's do it.
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So it's been a fantastic journey that has just grown that passion and then admiration and love ever since.
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Love that.
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Now, you you describe yourself as um, you know, a person in recovery.
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So, how did your own recovery journey play a role in pursuing this current position you have?
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That I think is a pretty layered question in a sense of there's a several different avenues that kind of led into that.
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So I mentioned kind of experiencing burnout and really struggling with identity and who I was.
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I was actively attending AA meetings.
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So I am in recovery from alcohol, but I was still kind of struggling with a sense of identity outside of that, outside of my recovery, outside of my job, right?
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Because at the time I was working 80, 90 hours a week.
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It really just depended.
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And so I knew that that needed to be focused on a little bit more.
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And so before I even applied for the coordinator position for problem gambling, I'm grateful that I had enough mindset to know something is not going right up here.
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And I was losing all sense of self and identity.
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And so while I was going to AA, I was also trying to find a therapist, which I eventually found.
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But I knew I at the core of who I was, I was a helper.
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I feel that that is something that I have been ever since I can remember.
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And so while I was looking for an alternative job, I knew I still wanted to help people.
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And one of the things that I really felt led to do as well was just be surrounded by people who understood without having to explain.
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And that was something in my previous career, um, alcohol was very much a big part of our events, which is fine.
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You know, I'm in my own recovery, the world doesn't stop because I have a problem, right?
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And so if I were at events, I had to constantly explain myself.
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And so I wanted to be around people to where I did that wasn't a thing, in a sense of I didn't want to have a story, I didn't want to explain myself, I didn't want people to look at me like I was crazy or weird.
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And so I knew when I was trying to figure out, you know, where is the future for me, I wanted to be in a community that got it.
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Even if it wasn't the same journey, we still understood what that journey felt like and what that journey entailed.
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And so I wanted to just be supported.
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And so that also led to First Choice Services, which is our parent company where the Problem Gambling Help Network is housed.
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We're a second chance employer.
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So there are all kinds of kinds.
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And I think within the first week, I'm not exaggerating, I felt like I could truly be my authentic self for the first time in my entire life.
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Because I was surrounded.
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Yeah, I was surrounded by people who had stories that pain to purpose stories.
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And I realized I'm not alone, which is a feeling a lot of us have felt in active addiction addiction, especially in the recovery community, um, but also in the gambling community, right?
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It's a hidden addiction.
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And so I just felt that I was finally in the space to where I could exist without explanation, but also exist with purpose.
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And that was really what spearheaded, you know, just sticking with where I'm at.
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And as I always say, I hope I I hope to die on this hill because it's just it's done a lot of things for me personally, but also professionally.
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That's amazing.
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And I I love the the you know, the second chance movement.
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I've got a friend who kind of founded a movement that she's working on in Florida about, you know, advocating for people coming out of the prison systems.
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And um, you know, because it becomes a second sentence a lot of times.
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And I'm sorry, I'm just pulling on that thread a little bit because I think it's it's a beautiful thing when when somebody can get a second chance and make a livable wage and be able to have a good job that that maybe they're passionate about, help others who are in the same situation, and also be able to pay their court fines and and things like that that a lot of people don't think about when you come out of prison and you still have restitution or court fines, especially in the gambling space, right?
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And you have to find a livable wage to be able to support yourself, but also pay that money back.
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And they're just met with so many obstacles.
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So it becomes the second sentence.
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You know, you've already served your first sentence, right?
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And then to have to navigate all that.
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So I'm very, very passionate about the space and love that you you shared that piece.
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Um, so kind of bringing it back to what gambling looks like in your community, what what you're engaging in.
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You're uh I imagine a lot of West Virginia is rural.
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What does gambling look like in your state, and especially in those rural areas?
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Yeah, so definitely a lot of rural areas that we are seeing our state is hit by addiction in every aspect.
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We were hit heavily, you know, with the opioid addiction.
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And we're just now, I think, starting to see some light in that, although it's still very rampant, and it's rampant everywhere, right?
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We're no uh exception to to what is happening around the world.
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But um with specifically with gambling, what we're seeing is while a lot of other states, I think, are seeing sports betting being a primary issue, we're still seeing the online gambling being a primary issue.
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So not specifically sports betting, but online gambling slots, cards.
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And so I I will say the trend that we're seeing within the last two to three years is definitely within that lower age range, the mid to early or early to mid-20s.
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But when we first started, we for several years, we were seeing middle-aged women who were contacting our helpline.
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And I, for me personally, I don't want to speak for the entire helpline.
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We have tons of data on that, that we're actually wrapping up our previous fiscal year and getting numbers for that as we speak.
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But I will tell you, in the last five years since I have joined the team, I am noticing a trend of we're going back to that middle age to retirement age of callers.
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So we are seeing a lot of individuals who don't have health insurance, who are really maybe living on social security, very limited income, and so also limited time in the community, right?
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So what else are you gonna do?
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And there's this misconception that it's the older generation or you know, the 40-year-olds to 60, 80, 90 year olds that don't know how to do online.
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That's not the case, right?
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We're seeing that that's quite the opposite.
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And so I've seen a lot of callers who are experiencing whether they're taking care of their parents or they're taking care of their spouses, they're empty nesting, maybe they've recently lost a job, some kind of significant life change that has led to either online gambling or even the hotspots or the VLTs are very, very popular.
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I make a joke, it's not a joke, but I say if there's a Dollar General, there's at least two or three hotspots right beside it.
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And so they're everywhere here in West Virginia.
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And that I think, while I can say we do see online gambling, especially with sports betting, the online gambling with slots and casinos are a big trend.
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We still see that typical, you know, mid to early 30s um and and mid-20s and age range, but we're starting to see an uptick of the 40s and 60-year-olds, and plus, especially in the retirement community.
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Yeah.
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And and you mentioned these callers.
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Um, in my research for this, no big deal.
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I did a little bit of research.
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Um, I read an article where it said that the calls to your helpline in West Virginia are up like 150% over the past three years.
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What do you think is driving that?
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And are you actually kind of take us through what the helpline like who's answering it?
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Is it because I, you know, having gone to NCPG last year in Columbus and hearing how convoluted some of these helplines are, where, you know, if you're if you're calling from this state, you might answer you might get an answer from someone in another state.
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So break us, break it down.
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What is the helpline exactly like in West Virginia?
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What role do you and your team play?
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And why is it up so much in the last three years, you think?
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Sure.
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And I'm really glad that you asked that specifically and like what our team looks like because it's one of the things that I am most proud of to be a part of.
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So, first and foremost, our team is, I think we have about 14 team members total, and that includes admin, so myself, Nick, my counterpart of the program coordinator, and Maricel, our director.
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Shout out to Nick and Marisel.
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They're awesome.
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Shout out to Nick and Marisel, absolutely incredible.
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But um, we also have shift leads, and then we have individuals who answer the lines 24-7.
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I will tell you every single person out of the 14, every single one of us are either in recovery ourselves or we are a loved one, and we've been impacted by addiction in one way or another.
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Love that.
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Not a lot of people can say that.
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And so I say that as a humble brag, but also as an important note.
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Another thing, too, we have this uh logo right now, no bots, just humans.
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And that to me is incredibly important right now in a world where everything is so technologically based, and we're very focused on AI, which you'd not gonna go anywhere within that statement.
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It has a place and a purpose at times.
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But we understand, especially in West Virginia, right?
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Appalachia, like we are very much rural Appalachian mindset.
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We need to let people know that there are real people that are answering the lines.
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And so I say that to say that when someone is answering our helpline, you are someone's going to speak with somebody who's either been in recovery, maybe not specifically for gambling addiction, but they're in recovery themselves, who is we do have one team member, Beth.
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She's very open and Beth.
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Shout out to Beth, very vocal and oh, absolutely.
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She's incredible.
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She's I don't know Beth.
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Who's Beth?
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You know, um, Beth?
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Beth.
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I'm bringing her to Chicago.
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She'll come to Chicago next year.
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I'm bringing her.
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I should have brought her this year.
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Like she she is an amazing advocate.
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She's in the BGS, she's a mod.
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She's she's she's incredibly amazing.
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And she's very, she's very honest, very hungry to learn and grow and be and help, right?
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And so she is in recovery from from gambling addiction, and she has done incredible for our team and our callers.
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But so our helpline is specifically 24-7.
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So we are, if it's two in the morning, we're gonna answer.
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If it's two in the afternoon, we're gonna answer.
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And we still go by the 1-800 gambler number, and and I know that there's a lot of confusion within that.
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So I'm I don't want to delve too much into that, but just specifically to go on your question, individuals who contact our helpline, they're gonna get support.
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Even if, let's say, we all 12 of our team members are in some catastrophic event and they're all sick or whatever, Nick Marisol and myself will answer.
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So that's another thing that I love is that I absolutely still answer the helpline regardless.
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And it's a core of what we do and who I am as a person.
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So you had mentioned that sometimes it can get a little confusing if if individuals from a different state are contacting, trying to get to their state's helpline, they might get sent to a different state.
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But for us specifically, even if you live in Louisiana or if you live in California and you somehow have gotten to us, we're gonna help you and we're gonna figure out a way to get you where you need to go.
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So, but for our West Virginia callers, right?
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So if you're contacting our helpline, whether it's call, chat, or text, we're there, we're answering and we're supporting.
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We do have questions that we ask.
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You know, every helpline does.
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There's data, there's information that you have to have, regulations and guidelines you have to meet.
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But within those questions, we're not just saying, what type of gambling are you are you experiencing?
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We're saying, how long has this been going on?
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And you mentioned this has been going on for two, three months now.
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What happened two, three months ago that led you to really start to gamble online every day?
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And we're trying to not just get more information, but just provide support, a little bit of that motivational interviewing kind of aspect, but more than anything to just validate, right?
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Because most of the time, the callers or help seekers that are contacting our helpline have never talked about what they're going through.
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And so we are the first line of help for individuals.
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And that's an incredible honor and incredible responsibility to have.
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And so we're walking them through, we're getting them support, we're connecting them to resources.
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The beautiful thing about our program is that we provide funding for treatment, right?
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So we provide the cost of treatment if somebody's looking to get some help.
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We provide costs for collect credit and financial counseling.
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We provide access to Gambin or other blocking apps that can help.
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We do peer support.
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We have two peers right now, which is not a lot, but it's it's a lot for us.
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We're we're slowly growing.
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:17.680
And so we're always doing everything that we can to connect our help seekers to the support that best fits their need.
00:19:18.319 --> 00:19:23.839
And another thing that is incredibly beautiful about our network and what we do is we do follow-ups.
00:19:24.000 --> 00:19:29.039
So it's not that you're just calling our helpline, talking to a stranger, getting that support, and then you're done.
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:33.359
You're gonna call us, and then with your permission, we're gonna check in on you as time goes.
00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:36.960
We're gonna check on you in a week, we're gonna check on you in three months, six months.
00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:45.279
If you need us to call you for the next two pay periods, we're gonna give you a call to say, hey, you know, you I know you're supposed to get paid today.
00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:46.240
What are your plans?
00:19:46.480 --> 00:19:57.599
And it's just that that extra little support that we provide that we have seen statistically provide help in long-term recovery for our callers.
00:19:57.759 --> 00:20:03.119
So it's a lot of linkage, a lot of referral, more than anything, human connection and support.
00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:06.000
Now, this is probably a question for both of you.
00:20:06.559 --> 00:20:15.279
Is there any other state in the country right now who does such a detailed uh program for a helpline?
00:20:15.599 --> 00:20:18.880
Oh, yeah, there's a lot of states that do a lot of support.
00:20:19.119 --> 00:20:19.839
I don't know about the other thing.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:25.920
Maybe not as extensive, maybe not as extensive of a program, but like Connecticut has an amazing program.
00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:28.000
Um, New York has an amazing program.
00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:32.720
There are a few states that do generally, they have like specific gambling peers.
00:20:32.880 --> 00:20:39.279
Like I know, for instance, Connecticut, they have like the peer um clinician kind of combo.
00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:43.039
Uh New York, very similar, pay for for treatments and things like that.
00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:46.160
So there are states that have different programs.
00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:50.720
But like in Oklahoma, I'm the only gambling-specific peer in the state.
00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:59.279
And we have no like direct, like, yeah, I I do peer in the state, but it's we don't have like this direct program of it.
00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:07.920
And um, but and I think a majority of states are probably in that category that they don't have peers or peer specific to gambling.
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:23.200
Um, and they don't have the combination of like resources where they can send somebody to Gamfin or work with a program that's, you know, in their state that does financial counseling or those types of things.
00:21:23.279 --> 00:21:30.960
So this is a very, very robust program and and very up there compared to a lot of the other states.
00:21:31.680 --> 00:21:40.079
So you've got you're doing all these things, you're offering all these things at no cost to the citizens of West Virginia who are impacted.
00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:47.119
What uh, if any, gaps are you seeing in in the support that you do offer?
00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:57.519
Is there things that you see that hopefully you'll be able to provide for, or do you feel like you're pretty comp comprehensively providing the resources for people calling?
00:21:58.559 --> 00:21:59.759
I feel like
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:01.359
It it is, it is.
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:03.759
And and it's one that I'm always proud of.
00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:08.319
And and our team, you know, we're all d we just love what we do, right?
00:22:08.799 --> 00:22:21.279
But I think that question kind of has that radical acceptance answer in a sense of we can recognize how incredibly blessed we are while also understanding how much work we still have to do.
00:22:21.519 --> 00:22:30.960
So in West Virginia, our funding, while it is great in some areas, it is not as much as what a lot of other states.
00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:38.400
I I hear other states, you know, they'll have 15 million or 10 million or$8 million budgets.
00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:40.960
And then there's other states who have 400,000, right?
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:56.319
So I think the biggest thing right now, the gap that I will say is across the board is just the connection between, oh my goodness, gambling addiction and other addictions, right?
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:57.519
Comorbidity.
00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:22.240
We have a lack of real support in the treatment facilities in our state, which we're actively working on because the amount of individuals that we have talked to who have been in treatment facilities who have openly discussed gambling while at those facilities, or individuals who have contacted our helpline and have said verbatim, it was easier to stop heroin than it is to stop gambling.
00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:26.319
And that is something I hear more often than than ever.
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:35.759
And so there is a big gap in really providing support and understanding for gambling addiction, specifically in treatment facilities.
00:23:36.079 --> 00:23:44.000
Another thing that I have kind of been on my soapbox is the fact that we don't ask about gambling addiction while we're at our well visits.
00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:52.240
And that's something that we're working on trying to change over time because I can go to my well visit and my doctor will ask me about my alcohol use.
00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:54.880
And, you know, with pride, I'm like, zero, you know, I did it.
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:56.240
But not gambling.
00:23:56.480 --> 00:23:59.920
And so we that is another area.
00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:03.279
But funding, funding will always be a significant gap.
00:24:03.519 --> 00:24:10.640
Marisol can tell you, I can tell you, we have gone over historically in our treatment budget every single year.
00:24:10.799 --> 00:24:18.480
And so what that means is every year we're upping our treatment budget, but then something else has to change, which I would rather, right?
00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:22.160
Like I don't have to go to these conferences, I don't have to do these things.
00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:31.599
I would much rather make sure that our callers have the support that they need at no cost, no worry for the rest of my career than I would ever go to another conference.
00:24:31.680 --> 00:24:40.960
And so there's just a gap of just getting the appropriate funding and getting the appropriate people on board and understanding the impact of gambling addiction.
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:46.720
And West Virginia, we're one of the few states that has every single form of gambling that you can think of.
00:24:46.880 --> 00:24:47.200
Yeah.
00:24:47.759 --> 00:25:01.680
And while that can bring in great revenue, we're also seeing the significant impact that that is having at a very catastrophic amount of impact that it's having on our callers and our people.
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:09.200
And this is just the people that we know are contacting our helpline and that not the people that aren't contacting our helpline.
00:25:09.359 --> 00:25:12.640
So there's a lot of gaps, a lot of room to grow.
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:22.400
And I just know that every day we recognize those and continuously to do what we do to kind of bridge those gaps and make those connections and provide further support.
00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:50.160
I mean, this is why these conversations are so important because I mean, hand up, I gotta admit, you know, I'm probably been a prisoner of the moment lately, also working for a digital health app and also hearing horror stories from other states' helplines where you're you're rewiring my brain right now, where I'm realizing that there are some states out there who have these amazing programs where the helpline is working.
00:25:50.240 --> 00:26:06.880
And to your point, it's West Virginia, no offense, love West Virginia, go Mountaineers, but they might they might uh the helpline or the phone might be the route that they want to take rather than downloading an app.
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:08.240
And that's okay, right?
00:26:08.319 --> 00:26:12.559
Like we there's there's plenty of recovery to go around, there's plenty of resources to go around for everybody.
00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:14.319
So yeah, I just I don't know.
00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:24.559
I I uh I think that these are the types of conversations that you know that happen at these conferences, but they need to happen after the conference is over, like we are right now, right?
00:26:24.720 --> 00:26:34.400
Because the next time someone on e Vive comes from West Virginia, which I just looked, we've we've had about 40 people in the last six months download eVive in West Virginia, which is awesome.
00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:37.119
That's with zero marketing, zero anything.
00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:44.400
But I'm now gonna say, like, hey, um, they have an amazing uh, you know, helpline network.
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:45.680
Like, here's here's Kristen's email.
00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:46.559
You know what I mean?
00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:47.599
Like, so I love that.
00:26:47.680 --> 00:26:51.839
And that that could that could literally send that person down the right path.
00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:52.720
You know what I mean?
00:26:52.880 --> 00:26:53.920
Yeah, absolutely.
00:26:54.079 --> 00:27:09.599
And that's one of the reasons why I really love our slogan, no bots, just humans, because it hones in on, you know, at the conference, there were several fantastic companies that were talking about their app and AI and technology, and all of those are great tools to have.
00:27:09.759 --> 00:27:15.440
But we are forgetting the most important part of getting help, and it's that human connection.
00:27:16.000 --> 00:27:21.759
I can know that I have absolutely used AI to kind of get something out of my brain for a second.
00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:25.039
But I also rely more so on my community, right?
00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:31.440
My husband, my friends, my family, that human connection to remind me that I'm not alone.
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:53.359
And that's something that people need to know, especially within gambling addiction or gambling harm or disorder, is the fact that not only are you not alone, but there's going to be a real human on that other end that's not just going to listen and not just gonna ask you questions, but going to make sure we kind of cherry pick what we think can really help, but also let you know of other resources, GA meetings.
00:27:53.599 --> 00:27:58.799
I know, Adam, we we met with you not too long ago about the modern meeting and the fantastic work that that does.
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:07.680
And it's just constantly making sure that people know that while they can contact us for resources, they can also contact us when they have nowhere else to go.
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:14.240
Well, and that was gonna be my next question, and you just pretty much answered it for me, which is that you know, it's great that you guys have this resource.
00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:18.400
It's great that you guys make this initial connection with them, but then what?
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:18.720
Right?
00:28:18.799 --> 00:28:24.240
Like that because you know, as someone in recovery, eventually we need to find our tribe.
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:35.119
Like the most of the time, 99% of the time, we need to find our tribe, we need to find a group, we need to find that human connection that we can that we can keep coming back to every week.
00:28:35.279 --> 00:28:39.759
There's a few people that are able to just do it through one-on-one counseling, but most people need that group.
00:28:39.839 --> 00:28:46.559
So, like you said, you are how many GA meetings or how many just in-person meetings in general are there in West Virginia?
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:47.119
Do you know?
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:48.960
Yeah, so talk about gaps.
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:49.759
This is another one.
00:28:49.920 --> 00:28:54.400
Unfortunately, we only have three GA meetings in the entire state of West Virginia.
00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:56.880
That's not that's not enough, right?
00:28:57.039 --> 00:29:03.839
I can go on the corner in downtown Charleston and find three AA meetings and three NA meetings.
00:29:04.079 --> 00:29:10.000
But GA, we have one in Parkersburg, one in Wheeling, and one in Morgantown.
00:29:10.160 --> 00:29:14.079
And those are very few, like those are very spaced out, right?
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:20.960
So not only are there three, but they're so spaced out that geographically it's just not feasible for a lot of our callers.
00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:29.680
And, you know, that is something that another gap that we're trying to work on is trying to find people who want to lead GA meetings.
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:36.799
But in the in the process of that, we'll always make sure that they have access to virtual meetings or other online support groups.
00:29:37.119 --> 00:29:42.160
And speaking of tribe, I think that is incredibly true, right?
00:29:42.480 --> 00:29:50.000
We need to make sure that we are getting connected with people who who get it, who've been there, who've done it, who can support us along the way.
00:29:50.160 --> 00:29:59.839
But I will also tell you one of the most interesting things that I have heard from I I would roughly estimate at least five callers since January.
00:29:59.920 --> 00:30:03.119
So I know that may not seem a lot, but it's enough for my brain to pick it up.
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:06.720
That, and these are just people that I've spoken to, right?
00:30:06.799 --> 00:30:08.400
Not our callers in general.
00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:20.480
But we have to find that tribe, but we have also got to find our own purpose outside of recovery and our our passion, our goals, our dreams.
00:30:20.720 --> 00:30:21.920
What are we like?
00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:30.160
You know, for me, I my whole life was based around comfort or chaos before I chose recovery.
00:30:30.400 --> 00:30:33.680
And I learned how to escape at a very, very young age.
00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:37.279
And that led to significant difficulty in self-identity.
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:39.359
Who am I outside of chaos?
00:30:39.599 --> 00:30:41.920
Who am I outside of survival?
00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:49.279
And that led to really having difficult problems with alcohol and abusing alcohol as a way to escape and figure that out.
00:30:49.359 --> 00:30:56.240
And this false idea that I was fun and exuberant and full of life, and really it was quite the opposite.
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:02.720
And so I've spoken to a lot of callers or several callers that have kind of alluded to that same thing, right?
00:31:02.880 --> 00:31:11.359
Individuals who have taken care of everybody their entire life, or who have lived in the existence of someone else their entire life.
00:31:11.519 --> 00:31:17.279
So of course they're going to experience some type of gambling addiction because that's their escape.
00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:25.119
That's the only moment that they can just decompress and plug away and just be in a moment for themselves.
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:30.160
And so I spoke to one caller specifically who said, I don't know how to dream.
00:31:30.480 --> 00:31:37.759
And that was incredibly heartbreaking because I did not know how to dream myself, right?
00:31:38.079 --> 00:31:41.440
So I hated the question of what did you want to be when you grew up?
00:31:41.519 --> 00:31:42.559
Because I did not know.
00:31:43.200 --> 00:31:45.359
I I don't know.
00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:49.119
I I hate, and to this day, I hate that question.
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:59.279
Because as a child, I that wasn't a dream that was nurtured as much as you know, typical um childhood dreams can be.
00:31:59.599 --> 00:32:17.279
And so that's something else that we're seeing with I think people seeking help within the gambling community, but other addictions as well, that these are people who did not have typical experiences and who don't know what their what their interests are, what their hobbies are.
00:32:17.440 --> 00:32:25.759
Um, I know when I started to go into recovery, I started to figure that out myself in a sense of I've got to figure out who is Kristen, right?
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:31.119
I know I'm in recovery, I know I'm sober now, but who am I outside of my childhood and all of that?
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:34.559
And so it led to I started playing ukulele.
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:39.759
And my husband, bless his soul, I'll never forget the first time I ever bought ukulele.
00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:45.920
We were on a road trip in North Carolina, and here he is driving and me like trying to learn how to play this instrument.
00:32:46.000 --> 00:32:48.240
And it was awful, it was god awful.
00:32:48.480 --> 00:32:55.920
But he knew that there was so much joy in trying to figure that out that he let me play terribly the whole time.
00:32:56.079 --> 00:32:58.319
I know he was like, I wish I brought my headphones.
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:05.839
But that led to over the years doing songs for the Glow Walkers, Suicide Awareness Walk in Jackson County every year.
00:33:06.079 --> 00:33:08.079
That also led to hand embroidery.
00:33:08.240 --> 00:33:11.039
I realized over the years I love doing hand embroidery.
00:33:11.200 --> 00:33:31.519
And so that's an aspect, too, that I think we really should hone in on in recovery and support as well is connecting people to these resources, connecting them to communities and tribes, but also connecting them to people that can help them grow who they are, their true sense of self, not just in recovery, right?
00:33:31.599 --> 00:33:33.759
We are much more than our stories.
00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:41.680
We are our creations, our dreams, our stories, our art, our music, whatever the situation may be.
00:33:41.839 --> 00:34:00.960
And so that's something that I'm trying, I've tried really hard to hone in on a lot more within our team and our callers, and even Marcel in talking about what we can do for future events and connections to really make sure that that is also something we discuss and bring up when we're supporting our callers.
00:34:01.359 --> 00:34:02.240
I absolutely love that.
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:03.440
It's like speaking my language.
00:34:03.519 --> 00:34:06.640
I'm sure Adam's like, man, it's like two people speaking the same thing.
00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:08.480
Thanks because I'm very much glad.
00:34:08.800 --> 00:34:13.440
I'm very, very much about like, yeah, we need to do the work of recovery, right?
00:34:13.519 --> 00:34:17.920
We need to work with a clinician and work with peers and people who understand.
00:34:18.079 --> 00:34:24.960
We need to have those real conversations with real humans who have real experiences to kind of help navigate.
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:37.280
But and I certainly don't want to say anything that that is, you know, harmful in any way, but it's just like we are so much more than what we experienced.
00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:42.239
We are, you know, using that experience is what continues to build us, but we've got to grow beyond it.
00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:47.760
And it's like, yeah, it's a part of our story and it's an important part because it helped change our lives.
00:34:48.079 --> 00:35:02.079
But I know for me, like even before addiction came into my my life or my story, I felt a lot of things you talked about of like not ever really having an identity and or being in the shadow of somebody else's identity and not really knowing who Christina was.
00:35:02.719 --> 00:35:05.199
But I did like hobbies and things like that.
00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:06.800
And then the addiction kind of took in.
00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:10.559
And then it was like nothing was excess exciting anymore.
00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:12.159
Nothing like I didn't know what I liked.
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:13.760
Like I'd lost myself so much.
00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:36.320
And so much of my recovery was relearning who I am, what I enjoy doing, you know, what I can do as a person, and just blowing that lid off of the box that I lived in, and you know, exploring what recovery was doing for me, but also just living and you know, finding new things.
00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:38.800
So that's very much my philosophy as well.
00:35:38.960 --> 00:35:48.559
We are just so much more than this chapter of our lives, but but always carrying this chapter with us, you know, kind of very, very similar.
00:35:48.719 --> 00:35:54.639
And so I I love that you were talking about that because it it is just so much bigger.
00:35:54.880 --> 00:35:55.280
Yeah.
00:35:55.519 --> 00:36:04.079
And I think um, just a little bit more to broaden on that, um, I have a little conspiracy theory that I you can ask Mariselle, I do not shut up about.
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:31.440
But I I talked about burnout uh just a you know a little bit ago, but I also think that that plays a role into what we're seeing with people in recovery and long-term in recovery relapsing because that sense of identity is, and and you're right, I want to be very mindful because meetings are so important, um, support groups are so important, uh, routine, consistency, all of this we know is crucial and important to recovery.
00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:41.840
But what I've seen in speaking with people who've been in long-term recovery, who have recently relapsed, is that it is that is the only focus that they're having.
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.679
There's no sense of identity outside of that.
00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:52.320
It's like they they go to meetings, they do peer support, they do this, they do that, they go home, wash, rent, repeat.
00:36:52.480 --> 00:36:52.880
Yeah.
00:36:53.119 --> 00:37:14.159
And so that is something that I think, and I think too, with those of us in recovery, and I've kind of experienced this as well, where we're so open about our stories that talking about when we're not doing our best is impossible or it feels more impossible because everybody knows our story.
00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:20.880
And then if we say something about, you know, hey, I'm not doing the greatest, people are typically gonna be like, oh no, are you okay?
00:37:21.039 --> 00:37:21.679
Have you used?
00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:22.400
Are you gonna relapse?
00:37:22.480 --> 00:37:23.199
Are you gonna gamble?
00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:24.159
Do you have your support?
00:37:24.239 --> 00:37:25.360
Have you gone to meetings?
00:37:25.599 --> 00:37:27.920
And you know, people, we mean well when we do that.
00:37:30.800 --> 00:37:31.760
We mean well.
00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:33.920
We mean well when we do that, right?
00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.760
But we forget to say, hey, okay, what's what's been going on, right?
00:37:37.840 --> 00:37:38.800
We can have problems.
00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:41.679
I know that I can have a really difficult time.
00:37:41.920 --> 00:37:43.679
That doesn't mean I'm gonna go and drink.
00:37:43.920 --> 00:37:44.480
Yeah, right.
00:37:44.639 --> 00:37:44.960
Exactly.
00:37:45.679 --> 00:37:48.800
I can have a difficult time and I can vent about it.
00:37:49.039 --> 00:37:54.480
And thankfully I have that support system that's not going to mean we'd be like, well, our when's the last AA meeting?
00:37:54.559 --> 00:37:55.920
When's your therapy appointment, right?
00:37:56.000 --> 00:37:59.679
Like, I'm just getting this yucky stuff out of my brain because it needs out.
00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:14.960
So that is a big part of it, too, of why I think people in long-term recovery really need we need to more have more conversations about finding who we are outside of recovery, and in addition to our recovery, right?
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:17.679
Yeah, that that's not a conspiracy theory.
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:24.800
That is a beautifully articulate way to describe a serious problem that we are having right now in this space.
00:38:25.039 --> 00:38:26.159
Because you're you're 100% right.
00:38:26.239 --> 00:38:37.519
I I talk about all the time in my meetings where I say I'm gonna have balance, and then a month later I'm still doing the same shit, and I haven't seen my friends, or I haven't done anything social besides recovery.
00:38:37.599 --> 00:38:38.800
Like you you nailed it.
00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:40.880
Like it's it's so true.
00:38:41.039 --> 00:38:41.679
It's so true.
00:38:41.760 --> 00:38:42.480
We're so concerned with it.
00:38:42.880 --> 00:38:43.840
Like stages of it.
00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:44.480
Yeah, right?
00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:49.119
Yeah, like like we're so concerned with the people that are, you know, a year or less.
00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:59.039
And I know Christina, we talked about this on a previous episode where it's like we still need to check in on the people that have five, 10, 15, 20 years for this exact reason.
00:38:59.360 --> 00:38:59.760
Yeah.
00:39:00.159 --> 00:39:02.320
Because life doesn't stop being lifey, right?
00:39:02.480 --> 00:39:06.400
Like even as we early recovery is a challenge, right?
00:39:06.480 --> 00:39:11.039
That's when habit building and going to meetings and building those tools are so, so important.
00:39:11.199 --> 00:39:22.559
Those first few years of recovery, you're what you're doing is you're just you're learning a new way of living and you're you're using the resources like therapy and and meetings and community and all of those things.
00:39:22.639 --> 00:39:26.239
And and I'm somebody who will be in a community for years to come.
00:39:26.480 --> 00:39:30.800
Um I started one, so I've got to stay committed to it.
00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:35.199
But right, it but only, you know, I have true passion and purpose in this space.
00:39:35.360 --> 00:39:46.400
But, you know, all the things you were saying of like being so out there and and you know, having a bad day, it's sometimes my bad days show up in the community because I'm like, why are you guys being so mean?
00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:48.639
And then I just like let them all have it.
00:39:48.880 --> 00:40:03.119
But at the, you know, the side of it, everything that I'm doing is to to help me engage in life on a broader level and bigger growth, you know, really better understanding who I am as a person and how I need to navigate life in a healthy way.
00:40:03.280 --> 00:40:05.440
And then I go and I navigate life, right?
00:40:05.679 --> 00:40:07.360
Bad day doesn't mean I'm gonna gamble.
00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:08.400
You know what I mean?
00:40:08.559 --> 00:40:16.960
But a bunch of bad days without the proper tools and resources and community are gonna get me to that spot a lot quicker.
00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:18.800
Or maybe not, it may not even look like gambling.
00:40:18.880 --> 00:40:22.000
It may look like drinking, it may look like something else, right?
00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:25.119
It's because I'm I'm not handling or coping well.
00:40:25.280 --> 00:40:33.599
And so, you know, there's there's just so much around the work of recovery, but there's so much around building this life that you don't want to escape from.
00:40:33.679 --> 00:40:35.280
And that's what I say all the time, right?
00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:39.760
So it's it's gotta look like so much more than that.
00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:46.400
Did you have a I wish well before before Adam, sorry, that that pinged something else too.
00:40:46.559 --> 00:40:47.360
I wish that.
00:40:47.440 --> 00:40:49.119
So think about the conference, right?
00:40:49.280 --> 00:41:00.719
How much conversation was centered around work or addiction or recovery, and how little conversations were about everything else outside of that.
00:41:00.960 --> 00:41:09.199
And that's why I really appreciated those karaoke nights because nobody was like that, we were not there for work in those nights, right?
00:41:09.440 --> 00:41:11.199
We were there to decompress and have fun.
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:17.039
Yeah, we might have still interacted and connected, but it was focused on outside of that.
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:31.360
And I wish we had more of that and more moments of just real human conversations and connections, then we you just all in on these just one center focus.
00:41:31.440 --> 00:41:32.400
And it's important, right?
00:41:32.480 --> 00:41:36.000
I will talk about this every single day for the rest of my life, Lord willing.
00:41:36.159 --> 00:41:38.480
But I'll also talk about other aspects too.
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:48.239
No, and and it's you just pinged something in me where it's like if I had to hear the word calci one more time at that conference, I was gonna jump out the window, right?
00:41:48.400 --> 00:41:55.519
It's like, you know, yes, we need that social time to just kind of let loose and get to know each other.
00:41:55.679 --> 00:42:04.079
But then when we are talking business, can we just can we talk about solutions and positivity and not just the negative and not, did you hear that they did this?
00:42:04.239 --> 00:42:05.679
Did you hear that they lost funding to this?
00:42:05.840 --> 00:42:07.679
We lost this grant, blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:08.880
What does that do?
00:42:09.039 --> 00:42:10.960
What does that do for the people who are struggling?
00:42:11.360 --> 00:42:17.199
And we often glamor glamorize the problem, and we never grant glamorize the solution.
00:42:17.360 --> 00:42:23.679
So, like that is something that is mainstream across all levels of I hope you're all hearing this.
00:42:23.840 --> 00:42:29.039
I love you all, but we need to, we need to, you know, let's stop and smell the roses once in a while.
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:30.719
Just a little, just like a little bit.
00:42:30.800 --> 00:42:37.760
And my daughter is uh, she's she'll be four, and she genuinely stops and smells any flower that we see.
00:42:38.079 --> 00:42:38.400
I love it.
00:42:38.719 --> 00:42:45.840
And it's the sweetest thing, but if it doesn't like that visual reminder of, yeah, stop and smell the roses.
00:42:46.079 --> 00:42:55.119
Like things are gonna be chaotic, things are gonna be crazy, we're gonna get angry, things are never gonna work, not never, but things will not always work in our favor, right?
00:42:55.199 --> 00:42:57.679
We're not always gonna be happy with decisions that are made.
00:42:57.920 --> 00:43:00.559
But we do have some control, right?
00:43:00.719 --> 00:43:08.639
You know, I'm just in West Virginia and in in, you know, just a coordinator in a position with with limited control, but I still have some control, right?
00:43:08.800 --> 00:43:14.159
So I can't control what's happening outside, but I can control the support our callers are getting right now.
00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:16.000
And so I'm gonna focus on that.
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:22.719
I'm gonna smell those roses while still recognizing the harm and the issues that are at hand and figuring out what my role is as I go.
00:43:24.239 --> 00:43:33.280
So as we're kind of winding down this episode and a great conversation and just appreciate you how you're showing up and and sharing with us.
00:43:33.679 --> 00:43:37.039
What gives you hope in the space and in life?
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:39.760
Like, what gives you hope going forward?
00:43:40.000 --> 00:43:40.320
Okay.
00:43:40.960 --> 00:43:45.840
Ooh, that's um I'm gonna try not to be too emotional on this one.
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:48.320
So oh, we love emotion, we love emotion.
00:43:48.559 --> 00:43:55.280
I mean, the minute the tears come, Adam starts, like it's it becomes this whole thing, and then we all end up just being so much.
00:43:55.920 --> 00:43:59.119
It's very contagious, but uh no shame in my game though.
00:43:59.199 --> 00:44:01.440
I'm I'm I'm an Emotional being and I love it.
00:44:01.599 --> 00:44:06.400
But I will say that is that there's two parts to that answer.
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:08.320
The first part is time.
00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:17.360
Um, because as long as I am still here, um, those that I love are still here, there is still time for change.
00:44:17.519 --> 00:44:24.079
Uh I know I've talked a little bit about my experience with with alcohol and being in recovery, but I'm also a loved one.
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:29.599
And I have a sister that I think about and love every day.
00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:33.679
And she is right now in in the depths of her own addiction.
00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:40.639
And so every moment that she responds to my message or every moment I know she's still here, there's time, right?
00:44:40.880 --> 00:44:55.679
So for me, it's just time in general that as long as our callers are still contacting our helpline, as long as our message is still getting out there, there's still time for change, for hope, recovery, life, anything and everything in between.
00:44:55.920 --> 00:44:59.760
And I will also say the people I'm surrounded by.
00:44:59.920 --> 00:45:17.679
I mentioned first choice being a second chance employer and the amount of incredible stories of pain to purpose and just the drive and the mission and the passion that they have just gives me hope that there's there is good in the world, right?
00:45:17.840 --> 00:45:28.239
We can see the bad and the negativity and the frustration, but these are people day in and day out that are just proving what good is and how good can still be used.
00:45:28.480 --> 00:45:38.719
And you know, even at the conference, getting to speak with so many people, you know, and meeting Adam and Christina, I think you and us briefly spoke for a second in our love and admiration of Beth.
00:45:38.800 --> 00:45:42.159
And the you guys are also a part of that, right?
00:45:42.320 --> 00:45:51.199
Um, the the same passion, human also, but that same passion of knowing that we'll we'll figure it out one way or another.
00:45:51.360 --> 00:45:54.079
We're gonna keep doing what we're doing and we're gonna figure it out as we go.
00:45:54.239 --> 00:45:59.119
So just time and community are my biggest facets of hope for sure.
00:45:59.440 --> 00:46:06.719
We've asked that question to I think 18 people now, and uh no one has ever said time, and I love it.
00:46:06.880 --> 00:46:09.360
I love it, I love that so much.
00:46:09.679 --> 00:46:10.320
Thank you.
00:46:11.599 --> 00:46:13.039
It's it's been an honor.
00:46:13.199 --> 00:46:17.360
I could tell you, I could I'm a yapper, so I could, I'm like, we could keep going.
00:46:17.440 --> 00:46:17.920
I wish.
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:19.039
We could keep going.
00:46:20.000 --> 00:46:35.440
It's just been an honor and a privilege to really uh sit with you guys and and speak about our program, but also just see the passion that you guys have and share that and and just be in a space where we can kind of schmooze and and love and advocate at the same time.
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:37.440
So thank you more than anything for this.
00:46:38.000 --> 00:46:38.239
Thank you.
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:56.719
And I mean, the minute the minute I met you, so you know, we were on the Zoom call, but then once I met you in person, I think I might have texted Christina and said, Okay, I found, I've definitely found, you know, because I I'm not gonna lie, like when I meet people, it's like, ooh, they'd be great for the podcast, or ooh, they'd be great for e Vive Live, they'd be great for the modern meeting.
00:46:56.800 --> 00:47:00.719
But for you, I was like, we gotta get her on something because she's just you just have that energy.
00:47:00.800 --> 00:47:11.519
And I and I could I could tell that like you know, you're just um you align with a lot of what Christina and I are trying to trying to accomplish.
00:47:11.679 --> 00:47:21.280
And you know, obviously what a lot of others in the space are, but no, you you guys are you guys are doing great things in West Virginia, and uh yeah, just really appreciate you coming on.
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:22.079
This was awesome.
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:24.639
Yeah, no, thank you guys, and thank you for all you do.
00:47:24.719 --> 00:47:33.440
You guys are a big voice for for a lot of people, and I know we're we're leading our callers to you know your guys' podcast and and just support in general.
00:47:33.519 --> 00:47:35.199
So it takes a village, right?
00:47:36.159 --> 00:47:36.719
Thank you.
00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:37.840
Thank you so much for the time.
00:47:38.239 --> 00:47:39.280
Thank you guys, of course.
00:47:39.679 --> 00:47:40.079
Thank you.
00:00:00.320 --> 00:00:01.600
Welcome to You Vive Live.
00:00:01.679 --> 00:00:02.560
I'm Christina Cook.
00:00:02.879 --> 00:00:04.080
And I'm Adam Lyons.
00:00:04.160 --> 00:00:07.200
And we just had an awesome guest, Kristen Van Horn.
00:00:07.360 --> 00:00:12.880
She's the program coordinator for the uh problem gambling help network of West Virginia.
00:00:13.279 --> 00:00:15.279
I mean fantastic conversation.
00:00:15.839 --> 00:00:26.800
Her and I are very aligned on recovery and recovery views, and it just I could literally see I could see the heart emojis like circling your head as she was talking several times during the conversation.
00:00:27.120 --> 00:00:32.479
I mean, yeah, you guys are cut from the same cloth, and I mean that as a compliment to both of you.
00:00:32.560 --> 00:00:33.280
Like it's awesome.
00:00:33.439 --> 00:00:34.880
She was she was great.
00:00:35.359 --> 00:00:40.000
I and I love how like one of the amazing things about West Virginia.
00:00:40.159 --> 00:00:42.719
I mean, wonderful people, wonderful country.
00:00:42.960 --> 00:00:49.920
Um, but the amount of resources, they have a very comprehensive resource program.
00:00:50.079 --> 00:01:05.760
I mean, financial counseling, peer support, treatment, and all like even additional, if you need blockers, things like that, like they are very comp comprehensive on how they they offer help, and it's at no cost.
00:01:05.920 --> 00:01:08.159
And that's yeah, pretty amazing.
00:01:08.480 --> 00:01:17.359
No, and I think you know, talking to Kristen in Nashville and talking to her today, and also, you know, shout out to Mariselle and Nick.
00:01:17.599 --> 00:01:24.640
You know, the thing I love about this team is that they're looking for solutions, right?
00:01:24.719 --> 00:01:27.760
They're keeping it positive, they're looking to move forward.
00:01:27.920 --> 00:01:36.879
And I'm guilty, we all know, I'm guilty of, you know, getting hung up on where we can do better or where we're struggling.
00:01:37.120 --> 00:01:47.840
But I just I love the energy that they put out, which is that this is what we do, here's where we could get better, but like let's let's keep going.
00:01:47.920 --> 00:01:48.480
Let's keep going.
00:01:48.560 --> 00:01:49.599
Let's not get hung up on that.
00:01:49.760 --> 00:01:58.480
And and I think that that is so important, and it literally needs to be injected into the veins of every single person working in this space right now.
00:01:58.799 --> 00:02:01.280
Absolutely, absolutely, and and you're right.
00:02:01.359 --> 00:02:15.439
Sometimes we can focus and you know, prioritize what what we aren't doing right or where we're lacking in something, and we don't put enough focus on what's in front of us, what is working, where are the supports?
00:02:15.599 --> 00:02:17.120
This is happening, you know.
00:02:17.199 --> 00:02:20.719
So exactly fantastic conversation to kind of bring it back in.
00:02:20.960 --> 00:02:21.360
Totally.
00:02:21.520 --> 00:02:22.400
So let's get to it.
00:02:22.479 --> 00:02:25.680
Here is our conversation with Kristen Van Horn.
00:02:28.719 --> 00:02:31.840
Hello, everyone, welcome to another episode of EVOV Live.
00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:33.039
My name is Adam Lines.
00:02:33.199 --> 00:02:44.319
I'm here with Christina Cook, and our guest today, along with being an amazing karaoke singer, she is the program coordinator for the Problem Gambling Help Network of West Virginia.
00:02:44.560 --> 00:02:47.759
Please welcome to evive live, Kristen Van Horn.
00:02:48.000 --> 00:02:48.800
Kristen, hello.
00:02:49.039 --> 00:02:50.719
Hey, hello, welcome.
00:02:50.960 --> 00:02:52.800
Welcome to me, I guess.
00:02:55.039 --> 00:02:56.000
Great to have you.
00:02:56.240 --> 00:02:57.759
Yes, the honor, honor.
00:02:57.840 --> 00:03:01.039
This is such an honor to be here and get to speak with you guys today.
00:03:01.360 --> 00:03:02.719
Oh, come on, come on.
00:03:03.039 --> 00:03:03.919
Love that though.
00:03:04.080 --> 00:03:07.840
Um, so yeah, tell us um, tell us who you are, tell us what you do.
00:03:07.919 --> 00:03:08.479
Let's start there.
00:03:08.800 --> 00:03:09.039
Yeah.
00:03:09.280 --> 00:03:19.360
So um you you nailed it um minus the karaoke, but uh, but uh, so my name is Kristen, of course, and I'm the program coordinator for the Problem Gambling Health Network of West Virginia.
00:03:19.680 --> 00:03:24.960
And that is a mouthful, but it is something that I have loved doing.
00:03:25.120 --> 00:03:28.879
Uh, been with the program, it'll be five years in September.
00:03:29.280 --> 00:03:36.240
So uh interesting enough, I joined five years ago after I was working in foster care.
00:03:36.400 --> 00:03:44.240
I did that for about six years and loved it, was in leadership, had some really great experiences, but I was experiencing severe burnout.
00:03:44.400 --> 00:03:49.360
And that's also a lot of the story that I share with others and in the community.
00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:55.439
But I needed to get away because it was taking away my life, my energy, my soul.
00:03:55.680 --> 00:04:02.960
So I thought I still want to do something that helps people, but I wanted that nine to five kind of vibe.
00:04:03.199 --> 00:04:05.520
And so I wanted to come in, go out, be done.
00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:19.279
And so I started for the Problem Gambling Help Network after Jennifer, Davis Walton, Lisa Lewis, and Mariselle Bernardo, who are incredible women within the program, took a chance on me and said, Hey, you know, let's let's see what you got.
00:04:19.360 --> 00:04:20.959
And so I started answering the lines.
00:04:21.120 --> 00:04:24.079
That was my my first job as the helpline coordinator.
00:04:24.399 --> 00:04:46.879
And I always say, although I joined as a way to figure out where I wanted to go with my life, the joke was on me that I found exactly what I wanted to do with my life because it was very quick when I realized how much I resonated with our callers, how much I understood that chaos is comfort, stuck in a cycle, stuck in a loop.
00:04:47.120 --> 00:04:56.639
And so it just grew a passion and a purpose for my own self, I'm gonna say, a little selfishly, because it was some intrinsic rewards within that.
00:04:56.879 --> 00:05:07.279
But more than anything, outwardly of just knowing how unserved underserved the community is for those who are experiencing gambling-related harm can be.
00:05:07.680 --> 00:05:11.839
And so I just fell in love with the program, with the mission.
00:05:12.079 --> 00:05:18.319
And so last year, just so happens a coordinator position opened up and I felt I was ready to take that step.
00:05:18.480 --> 00:05:21.680
And Marisol was crazy enough to say, yeah, let's do it.
00:05:21.839 --> 00:05:29.519
So it's been a fantastic journey that has just grown that passion and then admiration and love ever since.
00:05:29.920 --> 00:05:30.480
Love that.
00:05:30.720 --> 00:05:35.199
Now, you you describe yourself as um, you know, a person in recovery.
00:05:35.839 --> 00:05:42.160
So, how did your own recovery journey play a role in pursuing this current position you have?
00:05:43.600 --> 00:05:52.160
That I think is a pretty layered question in a sense of there's a several different avenues that kind of led into that.
00:05:52.319 --> 00:05:58.399
So I mentioned kind of experiencing burnout and really struggling with identity and who I was.
00:05:58.560 --> 00:06:00.959
I was actively attending AA meetings.
00:06:01.120 --> 00:06:12.800
So I am in recovery from alcohol, but I was still kind of struggling with a sense of identity outside of that, outside of my recovery, outside of my job, right?
00:06:12.879 --> 00:06:15.839
Because at the time I was working 80, 90 hours a week.
00:06:15.920 --> 00:06:17.040
It really just depended.
00:06:17.120 --> 00:06:23.680
And so I knew that that needed to be focused on a little bit more.
00:06:23.839 --> 00:06:33.920
And so before I even applied for the coordinator position for problem gambling, I'm grateful that I had enough mindset to know something is not going right up here.
00:06:34.160 --> 00:06:38.000
And I was losing all sense of self and identity.
00:06:38.319 --> 00:06:44.160
And so while I was going to AA, I was also trying to find a therapist, which I eventually found.
00:06:44.480 --> 00:06:48.240
But I knew I at the core of who I was, I was a helper.
00:06:48.480 --> 00:06:52.800
I feel that that is something that I have been ever since I can remember.
00:06:53.120 --> 00:06:59.120
And so while I was looking for an alternative job, I knew I still wanted to help people.
00:06:59.279 --> 00:07:10.160
And one of the things that I really felt led to do as well was just be surrounded by people who understood without having to explain.
00:07:10.399 --> 00:07:18.000
And that was something in my previous career, um, alcohol was very much a big part of our events, which is fine.
00:07:18.079 --> 00:07:22.160
You know, I'm in my own recovery, the world doesn't stop because I have a problem, right?
00:07:22.560 --> 00:07:28.160
And so if I were at events, I had to constantly explain myself.
00:07:28.240 --> 00:07:37.920
And so I wanted to be around people to where I did that wasn't a thing, in a sense of I didn't want to have a story, I didn't want to explain myself, I didn't want people to look at me like I was crazy or weird.
00:07:38.079 --> 00:07:45.439
And so I knew when I was trying to figure out, you know, where is the future for me, I wanted to be in a community that got it.
00:07:45.600 --> 00:07:52.639
Even if it wasn't the same journey, we still understood what that journey felt like and what that journey entailed.
00:07:52.720 --> 00:07:55.439
And so I wanted to just be supported.
00:07:55.600 --> 00:08:02.720
And so that also led to First Choice Services, which is our parent company where the Problem Gambling Help Network is housed.
00:08:02.879 --> 00:08:04.720
We're a second chance employer.
00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:07.920
So there are all kinds of kinds.
00:08:08.079 --> 00:08:16.560
And I think within the first week, I'm not exaggerating, I felt like I could truly be my authentic self for the first time in my entire life.
00:08:17.920 --> 00:08:19.199
Because I was surrounded.
00:08:19.360 --> 00:08:25.759
Yeah, I was surrounded by people who had stories that pain to purpose stories.
00:08:26.160 --> 00:08:37.519
And I realized I'm not alone, which is a feeling a lot of us have felt in active addiction addiction, especially in the recovery community, um, but also in the gambling community, right?
00:08:37.600 --> 00:08:38.799
It's a hidden addiction.
00:08:39.039 --> 00:08:48.080
And so I just felt that I was finally in the space to where I could exist without explanation, but also exist with purpose.
00:08:48.320 --> 00:08:52.480
And that was really what spearheaded, you know, just sticking with where I'm at.
00:08:52.559 --> 00:09:00.559
And as I always say, I hope I I hope to die on this hill because it's just it's done a lot of things for me personally, but also professionally.
00:09:01.679 --> 00:09:02.399
That's amazing.
00:09:02.559 --> 00:09:07.200
And I I love the the you know, the second chance movement.
00:09:07.360 --> 00:09:19.120
I've got a friend who kind of founded a movement that she's working on in Florida about, you know, advocating for people coming out of the prison systems.
00:09:19.279 --> 00:09:23.679
And um, you know, because it becomes a second sentence a lot of times.
00:09:23.840 --> 00:09:52.000
And I'm sorry, I'm just pulling on that thread a little bit because I think it's it's a beautiful thing when when somebody can get a second chance and make a livable wage and be able to have a good job that that maybe they're passionate about, help others who are in the same situation, and also be able to pay their court fines and and things like that that a lot of people don't think about when you come out of prison and you still have restitution or court fines, especially in the gambling space, right?
00:09:52.559 --> 00:09:58.879
And you have to find a livable wage to be able to support yourself, but also pay that money back.
00:09:59.039 --> 00:10:01.519
And they're just met with so many obstacles.
00:10:01.600 --> 00:10:03.279
So it becomes the second sentence.
00:10:03.360 --> 00:10:05.440
You know, you've already served your first sentence, right?
00:10:05.519 --> 00:10:07.679
And then to have to navigate all that.
00:10:07.840 --> 00:10:12.559
So I'm very, very passionate about the space and love that you you shared that piece.
00:10:12.720 --> 00:10:19.200
Um, so kind of bringing it back to what gambling looks like in your community, what what you're engaging in.
00:10:19.360 --> 00:10:23.120
You're uh I imagine a lot of West Virginia is rural.
00:10:23.200 --> 00:10:27.200
What does gambling look like in your state, and especially in those rural areas?
00:10:27.519 --> 00:10:36.000
Yeah, so definitely a lot of rural areas that we are seeing our state is hit by addiction in every aspect.
00:10:36.480 --> 00:10:40.399
We were hit heavily, you know, with the opioid addiction.
00:10:40.720 --> 00:10:48.799
And we're just now, I think, starting to see some light in that, although it's still very rampant, and it's rampant everywhere, right?
00:10:48.879 --> 00:10:53.840
We're no uh exception to to what is happening around the world.
00:10:54.000 --> 00:11:09.679
But um with specifically with gambling, what we're seeing is while a lot of other states, I think, are seeing sports betting being a primary issue, we're still seeing the online gambling being a primary issue.
00:11:09.840 --> 00:11:14.480
So not specifically sports betting, but online gambling slots, cards.
00:11:14.720 --> 00:11:26.799
And so I I will say the trend that we're seeing within the last two to three years is definitely within that lower age range, the mid to early or early to mid-20s.
00:11:26.960 --> 00:11:34.480
But when we first started, we for several years, we were seeing middle-aged women who were contacting our helpline.
00:11:34.799 --> 00:11:38.240
And I, for me personally, I don't want to speak for the entire helpline.
00:11:38.480 --> 00:11:45.279
We have tons of data on that, that we're actually wrapping up our previous fiscal year and getting numbers for that as we speak.
00:11:45.600 --> 00:11:56.799
But I will tell you, in the last five years since I have joined the team, I am noticing a trend of we're going back to that middle age to retirement age of callers.
00:11:57.120 --> 00:12:12.799
So we are seeing a lot of individuals who don't have health insurance, who are really maybe living on social security, very limited income, and so also limited time in the community, right?
00:12:12.879 --> 00:12:14.240
So what else are you gonna do?
00:12:14.480 --> 00:12:23.039
And there's this misconception that it's the older generation or you know, the 40-year-olds to 60, 80, 90 year olds that don't know how to do online.
00:12:23.519 --> 00:12:24.960
That's not the case, right?
00:12:25.039 --> 00:12:27.120
We're seeing that that's quite the opposite.
00:12:27.360 --> 00:12:50.240
And so I've seen a lot of callers who are experiencing whether they're taking care of their parents or they're taking care of their spouses, they're empty nesting, maybe they've recently lost a job, some kind of significant life change that has led to either online gambling or even the hotspots or the VLTs are very, very popular.
00:12:50.399 --> 00:12:56.000
I make a joke, it's not a joke, but I say if there's a Dollar General, there's at least two or three hotspots right beside it.
00:12:56.240 --> 00:12:59.519
And so they're everywhere here in West Virginia.
00:12:59.840 --> 00:13:09.759
And that I think, while I can say we do see online gambling, especially with sports betting, the online gambling with slots and casinos are a big trend.
00:13:10.000 --> 00:13:24.080
We still see that typical, you know, mid to early 30s um and and mid-20s and age range, but we're starting to see an uptick of the 40s and 60-year-olds, and plus, especially in the retirement community.
00:13:24.399 --> 00:13:24.639
Yeah.
00:13:24.799 --> 00:13:27.519
And and you mentioned these callers.
00:13:28.240 --> 00:13:30.799
Um, in my research for this, no big deal.
00:13:30.879 --> 00:13:32.159
I did a little bit of research.
00:13:32.320 --> 00:13:44.240
Um, I read an article where it said that the calls to your helpline in West Virginia are up like 150% over the past three years.
00:13:44.559 --> 00:13:46.480
What do you think is driving that?
00:13:46.639 --> 00:13:54.399
And are you actually kind of take us through what the helpline like who's answering it?
00:13:54.480 --> 00:14:06.399
Is it because I, you know, having gone to NCPG last year in Columbus and hearing how convoluted some of these helplines are, where, you know, if you're if you're calling from this state, you might answer you might get an answer from someone in another state.
00:14:06.639 --> 00:14:08.720
So break us, break it down.
00:14:08.879 --> 00:14:11.600
What is the helpline exactly like in West Virginia?
00:14:11.759 --> 00:14:14.000
What role do you and your team play?
00:14:14.320 --> 00:14:17.440
And why is it up so much in the last three years, you think?
00:14:17.840 --> 00:14:18.240
Sure.
00:14:18.480 --> 00:14:26.799
And I'm really glad that you asked that specifically and like what our team looks like because it's one of the things that I am most proud of to be a part of.
00:14:27.200 --> 00:14:38.720
So, first and foremost, our team is, I think we have about 14 team members total, and that includes admin, so myself, Nick, my counterpart of the program coordinator, and Maricel, our director.
00:14:39.360 --> 00:14:40.399
Shout out to Nick and Marisel.
00:14:40.559 --> 00:14:40.879
They're awesome.
00:14:41.120 --> 00:14:43.840
Shout out to Nick and Marisel, absolutely incredible.
00:14:44.159 --> 00:14:50.080
But um, we also have shift leads, and then we have individuals who answer the lines 24-7.
00:14:50.879 --> 00:15:02.240
I will tell you every single person out of the 14, every single one of us are either in recovery ourselves or we are a loved one, and we've been impacted by addiction in one way or another.
00:15:02.639 --> 00:15:03.200
Love that.
00:15:03.519 --> 00:15:05.279
Not a lot of people can say that.
00:15:05.440 --> 00:15:10.320
And so I say that as a humble brag, but also as an important note.
00:15:10.879 --> 00:15:16.320
Another thing, too, we have this uh logo right now, no bots, just humans.
00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:29.440
And that to me is incredibly important right now in a world where everything is so technologically based, and we're very focused on AI, which you'd not gonna go anywhere within that statement.
00:15:29.679 --> 00:15:31.919
It has a place and a purpose at times.
00:15:32.159 --> 00:15:34.720
But we understand, especially in West Virginia, right?
00:15:34.960 --> 00:15:39.360
Appalachia, like we are very much rural Appalachian mindset.
00:15:39.600 --> 00:15:43.679
We need to let people know that there are real people that are answering the lines.
00:15:43.919 --> 00:16:00.879
And so I say that to say that when someone is answering our helpline, you are someone's going to speak with somebody who's either been in recovery, maybe not specifically for gambling addiction, but they're in recovery themselves, who is we do have one team member, Beth.
00:16:00.960 --> 00:16:02.480
She's very open and Beth.
00:16:02.720 --> 00:16:06.000
Shout out to Beth, very vocal and oh, absolutely.
00:16:06.159 --> 00:16:06.960
She's incredible.
00:16:07.120 --> 00:16:08.240
She's I don't know Beth.
00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:08.799
Who's Beth?
00:16:09.039 --> 00:16:10.080
You know, um, Beth?
00:16:10.399 --> 00:16:10.879
Beth.
00:16:11.759 --> 00:16:12.879
I'm bringing her to Chicago.
00:16:13.039 --> 00:16:14.480
She'll come to Chicago next year.
00:16:14.799 --> 00:16:15.440
I'm bringing her.
00:16:15.679 --> 00:16:17.039
I should have brought her this year.
00:16:17.200 --> 00:16:19.679
Like she she is an amazing advocate.
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:21.440
She's in the BGS, she's a mod.
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:24.000
She's she's she's incredibly amazing.
00:16:24.240 --> 00:16:31.440
And she's very, she's very honest, very hungry to learn and grow and be and help, right?
00:16:31.759 --> 00:16:38.320
And so she is in recovery from from gambling addiction, and she has done incredible for our team and our callers.
00:16:38.720 --> 00:16:42.480
But so our helpline is specifically 24-7.
00:16:42.960 --> 00:16:45.279
So we are, if it's two in the morning, we're gonna answer.
00:16:45.360 --> 00:16:47.440
If it's two in the afternoon, we're gonna answer.
00:16:47.679 --> 00:16:53.440
And we still go by the 1-800 gambler number, and and I know that there's a lot of confusion within that.
00:16:53.679 --> 00:17:02.159
So I'm I don't want to delve too much into that, but just specifically to go on your question, individuals who contact our helpline, they're gonna get support.
00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:10.480
Even if, let's say, we all 12 of our team members are in some catastrophic event and they're all sick or whatever, Nick Marisol and myself will answer.
00:17:10.720 --> 00:17:16.640
So that's another thing that I love is that I absolutely still answer the helpline regardless.
00:17:16.799 --> 00:17:20.720
And it's a core of what we do and who I am as a person.
00:17:21.279 --> 00:17:32.319
So you had mentioned that sometimes it can get a little confusing if if individuals from a different state are contacting, trying to get to their state's helpline, they might get sent to a different state.
00:17:32.480 --> 00:17:41.680
But for us specifically, even if you live in Louisiana or if you live in California and you somehow have gotten to us, we're gonna help you and we're gonna figure out a way to get you where you need to go.
00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:44.319
So, but for our West Virginia callers, right?
00:17:44.400 --> 00:17:50.240
So if you're contacting our helpline, whether it's call, chat, or text, we're there, we're answering and we're supporting.
00:17:50.880 --> 00:17:52.720
We do have questions that we ask.
00:17:52.880 --> 00:17:54.160
You know, every helpline does.
00:17:54.240 --> 00:17:59.279
There's data, there's information that you have to have, regulations and guidelines you have to meet.
00:17:59.519 --> 00:18:04.160
But within those questions, we're not just saying, what type of gambling are you are you experiencing?
00:18:04.319 --> 00:18:06.079
We're saying, how long has this been going on?
00:18:06.240 --> 00:18:09.359
And you mentioned this has been going on for two, three months now.
00:18:09.440 --> 00:18:14.960
What happened two, three months ago that led you to really start to gamble online every day?
00:18:15.200 --> 00:18:24.880
And we're trying to not just get more information, but just provide support, a little bit of that motivational interviewing kind of aspect, but more than anything to just validate, right?
00:18:25.039 --> 00:18:32.400
Because most of the time, the callers or help seekers that are contacting our helpline have never talked about what they're going through.
00:18:32.799 --> 00:18:36.480
And so we are the first line of help for individuals.
00:18:36.559 --> 00:18:41.119
And that's an incredible honor and incredible responsibility to have.
00:18:41.440 --> 00:18:48.160
And so we're walking them through, we're getting them support, we're connecting them to resources.
00:18:48.400 --> 00:18:52.720
The beautiful thing about our program is that we provide funding for treatment, right?
00:18:52.880 --> 00:18:56.160
So we provide the cost of treatment if somebody's looking to get some help.
00:18:56.319 --> 00:18:59.680
We provide costs for collect credit and financial counseling.
00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:04.240
We provide access to Gambin or other blocking apps that can help.
00:19:04.480 --> 00:19:05.680
We do peer support.
00:19:05.839 --> 00:19:09.680
We have two peers right now, which is not a lot, but it's it's a lot for us.
00:19:09.839 --> 00:19:11.519
We're we're slowly growing.
00:19:11.759 --> 00:19:17.680
And so we're always doing everything that we can to connect our help seekers to the support that best fits their need.
00:19:18.319 --> 00:19:23.839
And another thing that is incredibly beautiful about our network and what we do is we do follow-ups.
00:19:24.000 --> 00:19:29.039
So it's not that you're just calling our helpline, talking to a stranger, getting that support, and then you're done.
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:33.359
You're gonna call us, and then with your permission, we're gonna check in on you as time goes.
00:19:33.519 --> 00:19:36.960
We're gonna check on you in a week, we're gonna check on you in three months, six months.
00:19:37.200 --> 00:19:45.279
If you need us to call you for the next two pay periods, we're gonna give you a call to say, hey, you know, you I know you're supposed to get paid today.
00:19:45.359 --> 00:19:46.240
What are your plans?
00:19:46.480 --> 00:19:57.599
And it's just that that extra little support that we provide that we have seen statistically provide help in long-term recovery for our callers.
00:19:57.759 --> 00:20:03.119
So it's a lot of linkage, a lot of referral, more than anything, human connection and support.
00:20:03.440 --> 00:20:06.000
Now, this is probably a question for both of you.
00:20:06.559 --> 00:20:15.279
Is there any other state in the country right now who does such a detailed uh program for a helpline?
00:20:15.599 --> 00:20:18.880
Oh, yeah, there's a lot of states that do a lot of support.
00:20:19.119 --> 00:20:19.839
I don't know about the other thing.
00:20:20.240 --> 00:20:25.920
Maybe not as extensive, maybe not as extensive of a program, but like Connecticut has an amazing program.
00:20:26.079 --> 00:20:28.000
Um, New York has an amazing program.
00:20:28.160 --> 00:20:32.720
There are a few states that do generally, they have like specific gambling peers.
00:20:32.880 --> 00:20:39.279
Like I know, for instance, Connecticut, they have like the peer um clinician kind of combo.
00:20:39.599 --> 00:20:43.039
Uh New York, very similar, pay for for treatments and things like that.
00:20:43.200 --> 00:20:46.160
So there are states that have different programs.
00:20:46.319 --> 00:20:50.720
But like in Oklahoma, I'm the only gambling-specific peer in the state.
00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:59.279
And we have no like direct, like, yeah, I I do peer in the state, but it's we don't have like this direct program of it.
00:20:59.440 --> 00:21:07.920
And um, but and I think a majority of states are probably in that category that they don't have peers or peer specific to gambling.
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:23.200
Um, and they don't have the combination of like resources where they can send somebody to Gamfin or work with a program that's, you know, in their state that does financial counseling or those types of things.
00:21:23.279 --> 00:21:30.960
So this is a very, very robust program and and very up there compared to a lot of the other states.
00:21:31.680 --> 00:21:40.079
So you've got you're doing all these things, you're offering all these things at no cost to the citizens of West Virginia who are impacted.
00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:47.119
What uh, if any, gaps are you seeing in in the support that you do offer?
00:21:47.200 --> 00:21:57.519
Is there things that you see that hopefully you'll be able to provide for, or do you feel like you're pretty comp comprehensively providing the resources for people calling?
00:21:58.559 --> 00:21:59.759
I feel like
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:01.359
It it is, it is.
00:22:01.440 --> 00:22:03.759
And and it's one that I'm always proud of.
00:22:03.839 --> 00:22:08.319
And and our team, you know, we're all d we just love what we do, right?
00:22:08.799 --> 00:22:21.279
But I think that question kind of has that radical acceptance answer in a sense of we can recognize how incredibly blessed we are while also understanding how much work we still have to do.
00:22:21.519 --> 00:22:30.960
So in West Virginia, our funding, while it is great in some areas, it is not as much as what a lot of other states.
00:22:31.359 --> 00:22:38.400
I I hear other states, you know, they'll have 15 million or 10 million or$8 million budgets.
00:22:38.480 --> 00:22:40.960
And then there's other states who have 400,000, right?
00:22:41.200 --> 00:22:56.319
So I think the biggest thing right now, the gap that I will say is across the board is just the connection between, oh my goodness, gambling addiction and other addictions, right?
00:22:56.480 --> 00:22:57.519
Comorbidity.
00:22:57.759 --> 00:23:22.240
We have a lack of real support in the treatment facilities in our state, which we're actively working on because the amount of individuals that we have talked to who have been in treatment facilities who have openly discussed gambling while at those facilities, or individuals who have contacted our helpline and have said verbatim, it was easier to stop heroin than it is to stop gambling.
00:23:22.480 --> 00:23:26.319
And that is something I hear more often than than ever.
00:23:26.799 --> 00:23:35.759
And so there is a big gap in really providing support and understanding for gambling addiction, specifically in treatment facilities.
00:23:36.079 --> 00:23:44.000
Another thing that I have kind of been on my soapbox is the fact that we don't ask about gambling addiction while we're at our well visits.
00:23:44.240 --> 00:23:52.240
And that's something that we're working on trying to change over time because I can go to my well visit and my doctor will ask me about my alcohol use.
00:23:52.319 --> 00:23:54.880
And, you know, with pride, I'm like, zero, you know, I did it.
00:23:55.119 --> 00:23:56.240
But not gambling.
00:23:56.480 --> 00:23:59.920
And so we that is another area.
00:24:00.160 --> 00:24:03.279
But funding, funding will always be a significant gap.
00:24:03.519 --> 00:24:10.640
Marisol can tell you, I can tell you, we have gone over historically in our treatment budget every single year.
00:24:10.799 --> 00:24:18.480
And so what that means is every year we're upping our treatment budget, but then something else has to change, which I would rather, right?
00:24:18.559 --> 00:24:22.160
Like I don't have to go to these conferences, I don't have to do these things.
00:24:22.400 --> 00:24:31.599
I would much rather make sure that our callers have the support that they need at no cost, no worry for the rest of my career than I would ever go to another conference.
00:24:31.680 --> 00:24:40.960
And so there's just a gap of just getting the appropriate funding and getting the appropriate people on board and understanding the impact of gambling addiction.
00:24:41.200 --> 00:24:46.720
And West Virginia, we're one of the few states that has every single form of gambling that you can think of.
00:24:46.880 --> 00:24:47.200
Yeah.
00:24:47.759 --> 00:25:01.680
And while that can bring in great revenue, we're also seeing the significant impact that that is having at a very catastrophic amount of impact that it's having on our callers and our people.
00:25:02.000 --> 00:25:09.200
And this is just the people that we know are contacting our helpline and that not the people that aren't contacting our helpline.
00:25:09.359 --> 00:25:12.640
So there's a lot of gaps, a lot of room to grow.
00:25:12.880 --> 00:25:22.400
And I just know that every day we recognize those and continuously to do what we do to kind of bridge those gaps and make those connections and provide further support.
00:25:22.720 --> 00:25:50.160
I mean, this is why these conversations are so important because I mean, hand up, I gotta admit, you know, I'm probably been a prisoner of the moment lately, also working for a digital health app and also hearing horror stories from other states' helplines where you're you're rewiring my brain right now, where I'm realizing that there are some states out there who have these amazing programs where the helpline is working.
00:25:50.240 --> 00:26:06.880
And to your point, it's West Virginia, no offense, love West Virginia, go Mountaineers, but they might they might uh the helpline or the phone might be the route that they want to take rather than downloading an app.
00:26:07.119 --> 00:26:08.240
And that's okay, right?
00:26:08.319 --> 00:26:12.559
Like we there's there's plenty of recovery to go around, there's plenty of resources to go around for everybody.
00:26:12.720 --> 00:26:14.319
So yeah, I just I don't know.
00:26:14.480 --> 00:26:24.559
I I uh I think that these are the types of conversations that you know that happen at these conferences, but they need to happen after the conference is over, like we are right now, right?
00:26:24.720 --> 00:26:34.400
Because the next time someone on e Vive comes from West Virginia, which I just looked, we've we've had about 40 people in the last six months download eVive in West Virginia, which is awesome.
00:26:34.480 --> 00:26:37.119
That's with zero marketing, zero anything.
00:26:37.440 --> 00:26:44.400
But I'm now gonna say, like, hey, um, they have an amazing uh, you know, helpline network.
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:45.680
Like, here's here's Kristen's email.
00:26:46.000 --> 00:26:46.559
You know what I mean?
00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:47.599
Like, so I love that.
00:26:47.680 --> 00:26:51.839
And that that could that could literally send that person down the right path.
00:26:52.000 --> 00:26:52.720
You know what I mean?
00:26:52.880 --> 00:26:53.920
Yeah, absolutely.
00:26:54.079 --> 00:27:09.599
And that's one of the reasons why I really love our slogan, no bots, just humans, because it hones in on, you know, at the conference, there were several fantastic companies that were talking about their app and AI and technology, and all of those are great tools to have.
00:27:09.759 --> 00:27:15.440
But we are forgetting the most important part of getting help, and it's that human connection.
00:27:16.000 --> 00:27:21.759
I can know that I have absolutely used AI to kind of get something out of my brain for a second.
00:27:22.000 --> 00:27:25.039
But I also rely more so on my community, right?
00:27:25.200 --> 00:27:31.440
My husband, my friends, my family, that human connection to remind me that I'm not alone.
00:27:31.680 --> 00:27:53.359
And that's something that people need to know, especially within gambling addiction or gambling harm or disorder, is the fact that not only are you not alone, but there's going to be a real human on that other end that's not just going to listen and not just gonna ask you questions, but going to make sure we kind of cherry pick what we think can really help, but also let you know of other resources, GA meetings.
00:27:53.599 --> 00:27:58.799
I know, Adam, we we met with you not too long ago about the modern meeting and the fantastic work that that does.
00:27:59.039 --> 00:28:07.680
And it's just constantly making sure that people know that while they can contact us for resources, they can also contact us when they have nowhere else to go.
00:28:08.000 --> 00:28:14.240
Well, and that was gonna be my next question, and you just pretty much answered it for me, which is that you know, it's great that you guys have this resource.
00:28:14.400 --> 00:28:18.400
It's great that you guys make this initial connection with them, but then what?
00:28:18.480 --> 00:28:18.720
Right?
00:28:18.799 --> 00:28:24.240
Like that because you know, as someone in recovery, eventually we need to find our tribe.
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:35.119
Like the most of the time, 99% of the time, we need to find our tribe, we need to find a group, we need to find that human connection that we can that we can keep coming back to every week.
00:28:35.279 --> 00:28:39.759
There's a few people that are able to just do it through one-on-one counseling, but most people need that group.
00:28:39.839 --> 00:28:46.559
So, like you said, you are how many GA meetings or how many just in-person meetings in general are there in West Virginia?
00:28:46.640 --> 00:28:47.119
Do you know?
00:28:47.359 --> 00:28:48.960
Yeah, so talk about gaps.
00:28:49.039 --> 00:28:49.759
This is another one.
00:28:49.920 --> 00:28:54.400
Unfortunately, we only have three GA meetings in the entire state of West Virginia.
00:28:54.640 --> 00:28:56.880
That's not that's not enough, right?
00:28:57.039 --> 00:29:03.839
I can go on the corner in downtown Charleston and find three AA meetings and three NA meetings.
00:29:04.079 --> 00:29:10.000
But GA, we have one in Parkersburg, one in Wheeling, and one in Morgantown.
00:29:10.160 --> 00:29:14.079
And those are very few, like those are very spaced out, right?
00:29:14.240 --> 00:29:20.960
So not only are there three, but they're so spaced out that geographically it's just not feasible for a lot of our callers.
00:29:21.440 --> 00:29:29.680
And, you know, that is something that another gap that we're trying to work on is trying to find people who want to lead GA meetings.
00:29:29.920 --> 00:29:36.799
But in the in the process of that, we'll always make sure that they have access to virtual meetings or other online support groups.
00:29:37.119 --> 00:29:42.160
And speaking of tribe, I think that is incredibly true, right?
00:29:42.480 --> 00:29:50.000
We need to make sure that we are getting connected with people who who get it, who've been there, who've done it, who can support us along the way.
00:29:50.160 --> 00:29:59.839
But I will also tell you one of the most interesting things that I have heard from I I would roughly estimate at least five callers since January.
00:29:59.920 --> 00:30:03.119
So I know that may not seem a lot, but it's enough for my brain to pick it up.
00:30:03.759 --> 00:30:06.720
That, and these are just people that I've spoken to, right?
00:30:06.799 --> 00:30:08.400
Not our callers in general.
00:30:08.720 --> 00:30:20.480
But we have to find that tribe, but we have also got to find our own purpose outside of recovery and our our passion, our goals, our dreams.
00:30:20.720 --> 00:30:21.920
What are we like?
00:30:22.240 --> 00:30:30.160
You know, for me, I my whole life was based around comfort or chaos before I chose recovery.
00:30:30.400 --> 00:30:33.680
And I learned how to escape at a very, very young age.
00:30:33.920 --> 00:30:37.279
And that led to significant difficulty in self-identity.
00:30:37.440 --> 00:30:39.359
Who am I outside of chaos?
00:30:39.599 --> 00:30:41.920
Who am I outside of survival?
00:30:42.160 --> 00:30:49.279
And that led to really having difficult problems with alcohol and abusing alcohol as a way to escape and figure that out.
00:30:49.359 --> 00:30:56.240
And this false idea that I was fun and exuberant and full of life, and really it was quite the opposite.
00:30:56.400 --> 00:31:02.720
And so I've spoken to a lot of callers or several callers that have kind of alluded to that same thing, right?
00:31:02.880 --> 00:31:11.359
Individuals who have taken care of everybody their entire life, or who have lived in the existence of someone else their entire life.
00:31:11.519 --> 00:31:17.279
So of course they're going to experience some type of gambling addiction because that's their escape.
00:31:17.359 --> 00:31:25.119
That's the only moment that they can just decompress and plug away and just be in a moment for themselves.
00:31:25.359 --> 00:31:30.160
And so I spoke to one caller specifically who said, I don't know how to dream.
00:31:30.480 --> 00:31:37.759
And that was incredibly heartbreaking because I did not know how to dream myself, right?
00:31:38.079 --> 00:31:41.440
So I hated the question of what did you want to be when you grew up?
00:31:41.519 --> 00:31:42.559
Because I did not know.
00:31:43.200 --> 00:31:45.359
I I don't know.
00:31:45.519 --> 00:31:49.119
I I hate, and to this day, I hate that question.
00:31:49.440 --> 00:31:59.279
Because as a child, I that wasn't a dream that was nurtured as much as you know, typical um childhood dreams can be.
00:31:59.599 --> 00:32:17.279
And so that's something else that we're seeing with I think people seeking help within the gambling community, but other addictions as well, that these are people who did not have typical experiences and who don't know what their what their interests are, what their hobbies are.
00:32:17.440 --> 00:32:25.759
Um, I know when I started to go into recovery, I started to figure that out myself in a sense of I've got to figure out who is Kristen, right?
00:32:25.920 --> 00:32:31.119
I know I'm in recovery, I know I'm sober now, but who am I outside of my childhood and all of that?
00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:34.559
And so it led to I started playing ukulele.
00:32:34.960 --> 00:32:39.759
And my husband, bless his soul, I'll never forget the first time I ever bought ukulele.
00:32:40.000 --> 00:32:45.920
We were on a road trip in North Carolina, and here he is driving and me like trying to learn how to play this instrument.
00:32:46.000 --> 00:32:48.240
And it was awful, it was god awful.
00:32:48.480 --> 00:32:55.920
But he knew that there was so much joy in trying to figure that out that he let me play terribly the whole time.
00:32:56.079 --> 00:32:58.319
I know he was like, I wish I brought my headphones.
00:32:58.640 --> 00:33:05.839
But that led to over the years doing songs for the Glow Walkers, Suicide Awareness Walk in Jackson County every year.
00:33:06.079 --> 00:33:08.079
That also led to hand embroidery.
00:33:08.240 --> 00:33:11.039
I realized over the years I love doing hand embroidery.
00:33:11.200 --> 00:33:31.519
And so that's an aspect, too, that I think we really should hone in on in recovery and support as well is connecting people to these resources, connecting them to communities and tribes, but also connecting them to people that can help them grow who they are, their true sense of self, not just in recovery, right?
00:33:31.599 --> 00:33:33.759
We are much more than our stories.
00:33:34.000 --> 00:33:41.680
We are our creations, our dreams, our stories, our art, our music, whatever the situation may be.
00:33:41.839 --> 00:34:00.960
And so that's something that I'm trying, I've tried really hard to hone in on a lot more within our team and our callers, and even Marcel in talking about what we can do for future events and connections to really make sure that that is also something we discuss and bring up when we're supporting our callers.
00:34:01.359 --> 00:34:02.240
I absolutely love that.
00:34:02.319 --> 00:34:03.440
It's like speaking my language.
00:34:03.519 --> 00:34:06.640
I'm sure Adam's like, man, it's like two people speaking the same thing.
00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:08.480
Thanks because I'm very much glad.
00:34:08.800 --> 00:34:13.440
I'm very, very much about like, yeah, we need to do the work of recovery, right?
00:34:13.519 --> 00:34:17.920
We need to work with a clinician and work with peers and people who understand.
00:34:18.079 --> 00:34:24.960
We need to have those real conversations with real humans who have real experiences to kind of help navigate.
00:34:25.199 --> 00:34:37.280
But and I certainly don't want to say anything that that is, you know, harmful in any way, but it's just like we are so much more than what we experienced.
00:34:37.519 --> 00:34:42.239
We are, you know, using that experience is what continues to build us, but we've got to grow beyond it.
00:34:42.400 --> 00:34:47.760
And it's like, yeah, it's a part of our story and it's an important part because it helped change our lives.
00:34:48.079 --> 00:35:02.079
But I know for me, like even before addiction came into my my life or my story, I felt a lot of things you talked about of like not ever really having an identity and or being in the shadow of somebody else's identity and not really knowing who Christina was.
00:35:02.719 --> 00:35:05.199
But I did like hobbies and things like that.
00:35:05.280 --> 00:35:06.800
And then the addiction kind of took in.
00:35:06.880 --> 00:35:10.559
And then it was like nothing was excess exciting anymore.
00:35:10.639 --> 00:35:12.159
Nothing like I didn't know what I liked.
00:35:12.239 --> 00:35:13.760
Like I'd lost myself so much.
00:35:13.920 --> 00:35:36.320
And so much of my recovery was relearning who I am, what I enjoy doing, you know, what I can do as a person, and just blowing that lid off of the box that I lived in, and you know, exploring what recovery was doing for me, but also just living and you know, finding new things.
00:35:36.480 --> 00:35:38.800
So that's very much my philosophy as well.
00:35:38.960 --> 00:35:48.559
We are just so much more than this chapter of our lives, but but always carrying this chapter with us, you know, kind of very, very similar.
00:35:48.719 --> 00:35:54.639
And so I I love that you were talking about that because it it is just so much bigger.
00:35:54.880 --> 00:35:55.280
Yeah.
00:35:55.519 --> 00:36:04.079
And I think um, just a little bit more to broaden on that, um, I have a little conspiracy theory that I you can ask Mariselle, I do not shut up about.
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:31.440
But I I talked about burnout uh just a you know a little bit ago, but I also think that that plays a role into what we're seeing with people in recovery and long-term in recovery relapsing because that sense of identity is, and and you're right, I want to be very mindful because meetings are so important, um, support groups are so important, uh, routine, consistency, all of this we know is crucial and important to recovery.
00:36:31.599 --> 00:36:41.840
But what I've seen in speaking with people who've been in long-term recovery, who have recently relapsed, is that it is that is the only focus that they're having.
00:36:42.000 --> 00:36:45.679
There's no sense of identity outside of that.
00:36:45.840 --> 00:36:52.320
It's like they they go to meetings, they do peer support, they do this, they do that, they go home, wash, rent, repeat.
00:36:52.480 --> 00:36:52.880
Yeah.
00:36:53.119 --> 00:37:14.159
And so that is something that I think, and I think too, with those of us in recovery, and I've kind of experienced this as well, where we're so open about our stories that talking about when we're not doing our best is impossible or it feels more impossible because everybody knows our story.
00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:20.880
And then if we say something about, you know, hey, I'm not doing the greatest, people are typically gonna be like, oh no, are you okay?
00:37:21.039 --> 00:37:21.679
Have you used?
00:37:21.760 --> 00:37:22.400
Are you gonna relapse?
00:37:22.480 --> 00:37:23.199
Are you gonna gamble?
00:37:23.440 --> 00:37:24.159
Do you have your support?
00:37:24.239 --> 00:37:25.360
Have you gone to meetings?
00:37:25.599 --> 00:37:27.920
And you know, people, we mean well when we do that.
00:37:30.800 --> 00:37:31.760
We mean well.
00:37:32.000 --> 00:37:33.920
We mean well when we do that, right?
00:37:34.079 --> 00:37:37.760
But we forget to say, hey, okay, what's what's been going on, right?
00:37:37.840 --> 00:37:38.800
We can have problems.
00:37:38.960 --> 00:37:41.679
I know that I can have a really difficult time.
00:37:41.920 --> 00:37:43.679
That doesn't mean I'm gonna go and drink.
00:37:43.920 --> 00:37:44.480
Yeah, right.
00:37:44.639 --> 00:37:44.960
Exactly.
00:37:45.679 --> 00:37:48.800
I can have a difficult time and I can vent about it.
00:37:49.039 --> 00:37:54.480
And thankfully I have that support system that's not going to mean we'd be like, well, our when's the last AA meeting?
00:37:54.559 --> 00:37:55.920
When's your therapy appointment, right?
00:37:56.000 --> 00:37:59.679
Like, I'm just getting this yucky stuff out of my brain because it needs out.
00:38:00.000 --> 00:38:14.960
So that is a big part of it, too, of why I think people in long-term recovery really need we need to more have more conversations about finding who we are outside of recovery, and in addition to our recovery, right?
00:38:15.199 --> 00:38:17.679
Yeah, that that's not a conspiracy theory.
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:24.800
That is a beautifully articulate way to describe a serious problem that we are having right now in this space.
00:38:25.039 --> 00:38:26.159
Because you're you're 100% right.
00:38:26.239 --> 00:38:37.519
I I talk about all the time in my meetings where I say I'm gonna have balance, and then a month later I'm still doing the same shit, and I haven't seen my friends, or I haven't done anything social besides recovery.
00:38:37.599 --> 00:38:38.800
Like you you nailed it.
00:38:38.880 --> 00:38:40.880
Like it's it's so true.
00:38:41.039 --> 00:38:41.679
It's so true.
00:38:41.760 --> 00:38:42.480
We're so concerned with it.
00:38:42.880 --> 00:38:43.840
Like stages of it.
00:38:44.000 --> 00:38:44.480
Yeah, right?
00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:49.119
Yeah, like like we're so concerned with the people that are, you know, a year or less.
00:38:49.280 --> 00:38:59.039
And I know Christina, we talked about this on a previous episode where it's like we still need to check in on the people that have five, 10, 15, 20 years for this exact reason.
00:38:59.360 --> 00:38:59.760
Yeah.
00:39:00.159 --> 00:39:02.320
Because life doesn't stop being lifey, right?
00:39:02.480 --> 00:39:06.400
Like even as we early recovery is a challenge, right?
00:39:06.480 --> 00:39:11.039
That's when habit building and going to meetings and building those tools are so, so important.
00:39:11.199 --> 00:39:22.559
Those first few years of recovery, you're what you're doing is you're just you're learning a new way of living and you're you're using the resources like therapy and and meetings and community and all of those things.
00:39:22.639 --> 00:39:26.239
And and I'm somebody who will be in a community for years to come.
00:39:26.480 --> 00:39:30.800
Um I started one, so I've got to stay committed to it.
00:39:30.880 --> 00:39:35.199
But right, it but only, you know, I have true passion and purpose in this space.
00:39:35.360 --> 00:39:46.400
But, you know, all the things you were saying of like being so out there and and you know, having a bad day, it's sometimes my bad days show up in the community because I'm like, why are you guys being so mean?
00:39:46.559 --> 00:39:48.639
And then I just like let them all have it.
00:39:48.880 --> 00:40:03.119
But at the, you know, the side of it, everything that I'm doing is to to help me engage in life on a broader level and bigger growth, you know, really better understanding who I am as a person and how I need to navigate life in a healthy way.
00:40:03.280 --> 00:40:05.440
And then I go and I navigate life, right?
00:40:05.679 --> 00:40:07.360
Bad day doesn't mean I'm gonna gamble.
00:40:07.599 --> 00:40:08.400
You know what I mean?
00:40:08.559 --> 00:40:16.960
But a bunch of bad days without the proper tools and resources and community are gonna get me to that spot a lot quicker.
00:40:17.039 --> 00:40:18.800
Or maybe not, it may not even look like gambling.
00:40:18.880 --> 00:40:22.000
It may look like drinking, it may look like something else, right?
00:40:22.079 --> 00:40:25.119
It's because I'm I'm not handling or coping well.
00:40:25.280 --> 00:40:33.599
And so, you know, there's there's just so much around the work of recovery, but there's so much around building this life that you don't want to escape from.
00:40:33.679 --> 00:40:35.280
And that's what I say all the time, right?
00:40:35.360 --> 00:40:39.760
So it's it's gotta look like so much more than that.
00:40:40.000 --> 00:40:46.400
Did you have a I wish well before before Adam, sorry, that that pinged something else too.
00:40:46.559 --> 00:40:47.360
I wish that.
00:40:47.440 --> 00:40:49.119
So think about the conference, right?
00:40:49.280 --> 00:41:00.719
How much conversation was centered around work or addiction or recovery, and how little conversations were about everything else outside of that.
00:41:00.960 --> 00:41:09.199
And that's why I really appreciated those karaoke nights because nobody was like that, we were not there for work in those nights, right?
00:41:09.440 --> 00:41:11.199
We were there to decompress and have fun.
00:41:11.280 --> 00:41:17.039
Yeah, we might have still interacted and connected, but it was focused on outside of that.
00:41:17.199 --> 00:41:31.360
And I wish we had more of that and more moments of just real human conversations and connections, then we you just all in on these just one center focus.
00:41:31.440 --> 00:41:32.400
And it's important, right?
00:41:32.480 --> 00:41:36.000
I will talk about this every single day for the rest of my life, Lord willing.
00:41:36.159 --> 00:41:38.480
But I'll also talk about other aspects too.
00:41:38.800 --> 00:41:48.239
No, and and it's you just pinged something in me where it's like if I had to hear the word calci one more time at that conference, I was gonna jump out the window, right?
00:41:48.400 --> 00:41:55.519
It's like, you know, yes, we need that social time to just kind of let loose and get to know each other.
00:41:55.679 --> 00:42:04.079
But then when we are talking business, can we just can we talk about solutions and positivity and not just the negative and not, did you hear that they did this?
00:42:04.239 --> 00:42:05.679
Did you hear that they lost funding to this?
00:42:05.840 --> 00:42:07.679
We lost this grant, blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:42:08.000 --> 00:42:08.880
What does that do?
00:42:09.039 --> 00:42:10.960
What does that do for the people who are struggling?
00:42:11.360 --> 00:42:17.199
And we often glamor glamorize the problem, and we never grant glamorize the solution.
00:42:17.360 --> 00:42:23.679
So, like that is something that is mainstream across all levels of I hope you're all hearing this.
00:42:23.840 --> 00:42:29.039
I love you all, but we need to, we need to, you know, let's stop and smell the roses once in a while.
00:42:29.280 --> 00:42:30.719
Just a little, just like a little bit.
00:42:30.800 --> 00:42:37.760
And my daughter is uh, she's she'll be four, and she genuinely stops and smells any flower that we see.
00:42:38.079 --> 00:42:38.400
I love it.
00:42:38.719 --> 00:42:45.840
And it's the sweetest thing, but if it doesn't like that visual reminder of, yeah, stop and smell the roses.
00:42:46.079 --> 00:42:55.119
Like things are gonna be chaotic, things are gonna be crazy, we're gonna get angry, things are never gonna work, not never, but things will not always work in our favor, right?
00:42:55.199 --> 00:42:57.679
We're not always gonna be happy with decisions that are made.
00:42:57.920 --> 00:43:00.559
But we do have some control, right?
00:43:00.719 --> 00:43:08.639
You know, I'm just in West Virginia and in in, you know, just a coordinator in a position with with limited control, but I still have some control, right?
00:43:08.800 --> 00:43:14.159
So I can't control what's happening outside, but I can control the support our callers are getting right now.
00:43:14.480 --> 00:43:16.000
And so I'm gonna focus on that.
00:43:16.159 --> 00:43:22.719
I'm gonna smell those roses while still recognizing the harm and the issues that are at hand and figuring out what my role is as I go.
00:43:24.239 --> 00:43:33.280
So as we're kind of winding down this episode and a great conversation and just appreciate you how you're showing up and and sharing with us.
00:43:33.679 --> 00:43:37.039
What gives you hope in the space and in life?
00:43:37.199 --> 00:43:39.760
Like, what gives you hope going forward?
00:43:40.000 --> 00:43:40.320
Okay.
00:43:40.960 --> 00:43:45.840
Ooh, that's um I'm gonna try not to be too emotional on this one.
00:43:46.000 --> 00:43:48.320
So oh, we love emotion, we love emotion.
00:43:48.559 --> 00:43:55.280
I mean, the minute the tears come, Adam starts, like it's it becomes this whole thing, and then we all end up just being so much.
00:43:55.920 --> 00:43:59.119
It's very contagious, but uh no shame in my game though.
00:43:59.199 --> 00:44:01.440
I'm I'm I'm an Emotional being and I love it.
00:44:01.599 --> 00:44:06.400
But I will say that is that there's two parts to that answer.
00:44:06.719 --> 00:44:08.320
The first part is time.
00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:17.360
Um, because as long as I am still here, um, those that I love are still here, there is still time for change.
00:44:17.519 --> 00:44:24.079
Uh I know I've talked a little bit about my experience with with alcohol and being in recovery, but I'm also a loved one.
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:29.599
And I have a sister that I think about and love every day.
00:44:29.679 --> 00:44:33.679
And she is right now in in the depths of her own addiction.
00:44:33.840 --> 00:44:40.639
And so every moment that she responds to my message or every moment I know she's still here, there's time, right?
00:44:40.880 --> 00:44:55.679
So for me, it's just time in general that as long as our callers are still contacting our helpline, as long as our message is still getting out there, there's still time for change, for hope, recovery, life, anything and everything in between.
00:44:55.920 --> 00:44:59.760
And I will also say the people I'm surrounded by.
00:44:59.920 --> 00:45:17.679
I mentioned first choice being a second chance employer and the amount of incredible stories of pain to purpose and just the drive and the mission and the passion that they have just gives me hope that there's there is good in the world, right?
00:45:17.840 --> 00:45:28.239
We can see the bad and the negativity and the frustration, but these are people day in and day out that are just proving what good is and how good can still be used.
00:45:28.480 --> 00:45:38.719
And you know, even at the conference, getting to speak with so many people, you know, and meeting Adam and Christina, I think you and us briefly spoke for a second in our love and admiration of Beth.
00:45:38.800 --> 00:45:42.159
And the you guys are also a part of that, right?
00:45:42.320 --> 00:45:51.199
Um, the the same passion, human also, but that same passion of knowing that we'll we'll figure it out one way or another.
00:45:51.360 --> 00:45:54.079
We're gonna keep doing what we're doing and we're gonna figure it out as we go.
00:45:54.239 --> 00:45:59.119
So just time and community are my biggest facets of hope for sure.
00:45:59.440 --> 00:46:06.719
We've asked that question to I think 18 people now, and uh no one has ever said time, and I love it.
00:46:06.880 --> 00:46:09.360
I love it, I love that so much.
00:46:09.679 --> 00:46:10.320
Thank you.
00:46:11.599 --> 00:46:13.039
It's it's been an honor.
00:46:13.199 --> 00:46:17.360
I could tell you, I could I'm a yapper, so I could, I'm like, we could keep going.
00:46:17.440 --> 00:46:17.920
I wish.
00:46:18.239 --> 00:46:19.039
We could keep going.
00:46:20.000 --> 00:46:35.440
It's just been an honor and a privilege to really uh sit with you guys and and speak about our program, but also just see the passion that you guys have and share that and and just be in a space where we can kind of schmooze and and love and advocate at the same time.
00:46:35.599 --> 00:46:37.440
So thank you more than anything for this.
00:46:38.000 --> 00:46:38.239
Thank you.
00:46:38.400 --> 00:46:56.719
And I mean, the minute the minute I met you, so you know, we were on the Zoom call, but then once I met you in person, I think I might have texted Christina and said, Okay, I found, I've definitely found, you know, because I I'm not gonna lie, like when I meet people, it's like, ooh, they'd be great for the podcast, or ooh, they'd be great for e Vive Live, they'd be great for the modern meeting.
00:46:56.800 --> 00:47:00.719
But for you, I was like, we gotta get her on something because she's just you just have that energy.
00:47:00.800 --> 00:47:11.519
And I and I could I could tell that like you know, you're just um you align with a lot of what Christina and I are trying to trying to accomplish.
00:47:11.679 --> 00:47:21.280
And you know, obviously what a lot of others in the space are, but no, you you guys are you guys are doing great things in West Virginia, and uh yeah, just really appreciate you coming on.
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:22.079
This was awesome.
00:47:22.320 --> 00:47:24.639
Yeah, no, thank you guys, and thank you for all you do.
00:47:24.719 --> 00:47:33.440
You guys are a big voice for for a lot of people, and I know we're we're leading our callers to you know your guys' podcast and and just support in general.
00:47:33.519 --> 00:47:35.199
So it takes a village, right?
00:47:36.159 --> 00:47:36.719
Thank you.
00:47:36.880 --> 00:47:37.840
Thank you so much for the time.
00:47:38.239 --> 00:47:39.280
Thank you guys, of course.
00:47:39.679 --> 00:47:40.079
Thank you.
