WEBVTT
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.640
Years ago I'm at a wedding.
00:00:02.959 --> 00:00:04.959
It's my girlfriend's sister.
00:00:05.280 --> 00:00:14.320
And at some point during the reception people start finding us, grabbing us by the arms, pulling us close, saying some version of the same thing.
00:00:14.640 --> 00:00:22.480
You two are next and every time someone said it, I kind of shuddered.
00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:25.760
Because I already knew the relationship was over.
00:00:25.839 --> 00:00:37.920
I'd I'd known for a while I'd just been too immature to conflict averse too bad at endings to do anything about it.
00:00:38.079 --> 00:00:48.960
So instead of breaking up with her, I pulled away slowly over time until she finally ended it herself, which was which was cowardice.
00:00:49.520 --> 00:00:55.679
And I knew it at the time, but here's what I understand now that I didn't understand then.
00:00:55.920 --> 00:01:02.880
It wasn't weakness, I was trying to protect something that I couldn't name.
00:01:04.079 --> 00:01:09.359
It's not a character flaw, that's a need running in the background without your permission.
00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:12.239
And today I want to talk about six of those needs.
00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:21.519
Today we're talking about six needs that are running more of your life than you probably realize, and most of the time you can't see them.
00:01:21.680 --> 00:01:35.280
And by the way, I learned this framework that explains all of this decades ago from a very large man with unnaturally white teeth on a VHS tape I bought at 3 a.m.
00:01:35.439 --> 00:01:44.799
during a bout of insomnia in the early 90s, right in between the Ginsu knives and the hand hammered walk.
00:01:45.040 --> 00:01:46.560
We'll get to him in a minute.
00:01:46.799 --> 00:02:03.599
Don't call it a comeback! Hi, I'm Steve Gertchik, and this is your third third.
00:02:04.159 --> 00:02:14.639
This show is for people who have done the work, built the thing, and now shrugging our shoulders, wondering what all of it was actually for.
00:02:14.879 --> 00:02:20.159
Today we're talking about six needs that are running our lives whether we know it or not.
00:02:20.400 --> 00:02:27.039
Not wants, not goals, not preferences, needs.
00:02:27.520 --> 00:02:36.719
The stuff underneath every choice that we make, every reaction that we have, every time you look back and think, I genuinely didn't know why I did that.
00:02:36.960 --> 00:02:40.960
If the show's useful to you, please subscribe wherever you're listening.
00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:46.800
I write every week on Substack also, and there's a TikTok situation developing.
00:02:47.120 --> 00:02:50.319
If you use TikTok, you can find me at your third third there.
00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:53.120
I'm still adjusting to using that.
00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:59.919
Anyway, the person who organized these needs into a working framework is Tony Robbins.
00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:10.879
Robbins popularized a version of this that's actually pretty useful, and a lot of it lines up with real behavioral science, from Maslow to self-determination theory.
00:03:11.039 --> 00:03:26.080
He called them the six human needs, and I'm gonna give you a shorthand for them, something you can actually hold on to, and then we're gonna spend most of our time on what they mean specifically for where you are right now as we think about our third third.
00:03:26.159 --> 00:03:28.000
So here's the shorthand.
00:03:28.159 --> 00:03:31.680
I call it scalar, like you're scaling a mountain.
00:03:32.240 --> 00:03:42.159
Scaler, significance, certainty, adventure, love, expansion, and then return.
00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:44.400
We're always climbing something.
00:03:44.560 --> 00:03:47.439
The question is do we know what it is?
00:03:47.759 --> 00:03:49.439
So keep that in your back pocket.
00:03:49.599 --> 00:03:50.879
I'll come back to it.
00:03:51.120 --> 00:03:54.560
Right now let me start with what matters about it.
00:03:54.960 --> 00:03:58.159
Here's how a lot of people think about motivation.
00:03:58.719 --> 00:04:16.000
You set a goal, you make a commitment, you use discipline, and if you fall short, the story you tell yourself is that you lacked willpower or focus or some other quality that a better morning routine would probably fix.
00:04:16.319 --> 00:04:18.240
That framework is clean.
00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.680
It's also mostly wrong.
00:04:22.319 --> 00:04:33.040
What behavioral science actually shows, and this goes back to Maslow and runs through decades of research since, is that motivation is largely about need fulfillment.
00:04:33.279 --> 00:04:38.399
Not what you think you should want, what you actually need, often without knowing it.
00:04:38.720 --> 00:04:42.720
We move toward what satisfies us at a deep level.
00:04:42.959 --> 00:04:49.040
We move away from what doesn't, and most of the time we're not even aware that the need is there.
00:04:49.600 --> 00:04:53.920
And here's why this gets especially interesting in the third third of life.
00:04:54.079 --> 00:04:58.079
In your first and second third, a lot of structures do the work for you.
00:04:58.319 --> 00:05:06.879
Your job delivers meaning and certainty and significance and connection, more or less packaged together.
00:05:07.199 --> 00:05:14.000
You don't have to consciously tend to those needs because institutions are meeting them on your behalf.
00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:15.279
And then that changes.
00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:20.639
The job ends or shifts, or stops being the center of gravity it once was.
00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:26.319
The social infrastructure that used to just show up now requires effort on your part.
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:31.120
And now you're suddenly responsible for meeting needs that used to be handled by systems.
00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:34.319
Systems that we barely notice are even there.
00:05:34.720 --> 00:05:48.000
And that's what this episode's really about, not six abstract psychological categories, really the specific shape of what happens when the structure kind of comes down, and now you have to figure out what you actually need.
00:05:48.319 --> 00:05:54.480
Let's start with the two most fundamental ones, because understanding these changes how you read almost everything else.
00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:59.040
Certainty is the need to feel safe, stable.
00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:02.319
Like the ground under us is solid.
00:06:02.480 --> 00:06:05.920
This is old wiring, deep wiring.
00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:12.399
When certainty drops, the whole system kind of goes into threat mode.
00:06:12.639 --> 00:06:16.639
And it becomes very hard to think clearly about anything else.
00:06:16.879 --> 00:06:24.800
You can't build meaning when you're worried about your health or your finances or whether the relationship you're in is going to hold.
00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:26.959
But here's the thing that trips people up.
00:06:27.120 --> 00:06:30.720
If you get too much certainty, you get bored.
00:06:31.199 --> 00:06:37.040
And not regular bored, something more hollow than that.
00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:41.120
A kind of restlessness that doesn't have an obvious cause.
00:06:41.439 --> 00:06:45.680
That's adventure, the need for novelty, change.
00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:49.920
Something that doesn't have a guaranteed outcome.
00:06:50.240 --> 00:07:02.480
And it's in permanent tension with certainty, which is which is why it can be sitting in a completely stable, objectively fine life, and still feel like something's missing.
00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:10.959
Many people interpret that feeling as a problem, like they're ungrateful or not built for peace.
00:07:11.120 --> 00:07:13.199
I don't think that's some character flaw.
00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:21.120
They're trying to meet two real needs at the same time, and that takes rhythm, not some permanent resolution.
00:07:21.360 --> 00:07:26.319
Periods of stability, periods of change, and then back again.
00:07:26.720 --> 00:07:29.759
In the third third, that rhythm often breaks down.
00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:39.279
For a lot of people, work was providing the adventure for years, decades, new projects, new challenges, something uncertain to navigate.
00:07:39.519 --> 00:07:47.360
And then work ends or changes, and you have all the certainty in the world, and the adventure just stops.
00:07:47.920 --> 00:07:54.639
And then you either fade into the stability or you start making erratic choices, trying to manufacture the feeling back.
00:07:54.800 --> 00:08:03.920
And what you actually need is to build that rhythm intentionally for the first time, rather than having an institution build it for you.
00:08:04.720 --> 00:08:06.240
Next is significance.
00:08:06.639 --> 00:08:22.879
Significance is the need to matter, to feel important, seen, respected, to have your presence register, and this is where things get interesting, because significance itself isn't the problem.
00:08:23.120 --> 00:08:26.800
The need is real and legitimate.
00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:30.480
But the strategies for meeting it vary enormously.
00:08:30.720 --> 00:08:35.600
See, you can meet significance through achievement or contribution.
00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:37.600
That's one of my favorites.
00:08:38.240 --> 00:08:40.399
Mastery of some new skill.
00:08:41.200 --> 00:08:47.120
Through becoming genuinely good at something, through doing work that helps.
00:08:47.360 --> 00:08:48.720
Those are healthy strategies.
00:08:48.799 --> 00:08:52.080
They tend to produce meaning as a side effect.
00:08:53.120 --> 00:09:03.919
Or you can meet it through conflict, through being right at any cost, through drama, through making yourself the problem everyone else has to manage.
00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:08.720
Same need, very different outcomes for the people around you.
00:09:10.159 --> 00:09:22.960
There's a family member that I love, sharp guy, interesting life he's had, genuinely good company in a lot of ways, but there's a pattern that I've noticed over the years.
00:09:23.200 --> 00:09:40.000
When someone else is telling a story at the dinner table, he'll often interrupt, not not rudely exactly, more excitedly, like he hears something in what you're saying that reminds him of something about himself, and that thing can't wait.
00:09:40.320 --> 00:09:45.440
So in he barges with his story, his experience, his version.
00:09:45.919 --> 00:09:53.200
And the person who is talking kind of trails off and the attention shifts, and he's in the spotlight again.
00:09:53.440 --> 00:09:55.360
I don't think he does it to be selfish.
00:09:55.440 --> 00:09:59.519
I honestly don't think he even knows that he's doing it.
00:09:59.679 --> 00:10:03.919
What I've come to understand is that he's meeting a need, a real one.
00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:11.679
The need to matter, to be interesting, to have his presence register in the room, significance.
00:10:12.960 --> 00:10:20.639
Thing is, the strategy is really working against him because over time people stop bringing their full stories to the table.
00:10:20.960 --> 00:10:25.120
They give him the short version or they wait for a moment when he's not there.
00:10:25.440 --> 00:10:33.519
The very thing that he's reaching for, genuine connection and attention from people he loves, gets a little harder to find each time.
00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:36.960
That's not a character judgment, by the way.
00:10:37.039 --> 00:10:42.799
That's what happens when a real need runs on an old strategy that stopped working.
00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:47.279
And the fix isn't to tell someone like that to stop interrupting.
00:10:47.519 --> 00:10:50.159
That just asks them to feel insignificant.
00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:52.240
Nobody wants that.
00:10:52.480 --> 00:11:04.320
The fix is to find a context where their need for significance gets met in a way that doesn't require taking the floor from someone else, where they're contributing, not competing.
00:11:04.639 --> 00:11:08.080
And that's a solvable problem, but you have to see that need first.
00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:11.360
The next is love and connection.
00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:17.360
This one gets described as the most important need, and at a biological level that probably tracks.
00:11:17.679 --> 00:11:22.399
Loneliness, as I've talked about before, is genuinely bad for you.
00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:28.480
Not in a soft, you know, self-help way, but in a measurable health outcome kind of way.
00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:33.279
But there's a distinction here that I think is worth considering.
00:11:33.759 --> 00:11:35.840
Most people want connection.
00:11:36.399 --> 00:11:39.600
A lot of people settle for attention.
00:11:40.159 --> 00:11:42.080
Attention is easier.
00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:54.799
You can get attention by being loud, by being dramatic, by sharing something provocative, by being the person who always has a story that tops yours.
00:11:55.600 --> 00:12:02.080
You don't have to be vulnerable, you don't have to risk anything, you just have to be noticed, you know?
00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:04.399
Connection is harder.
00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:07.600
It requires actually being seen.
00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:09.360
Maybe being vulnerable.
00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:14.639
The parts you're still working out, the parts that don't reflect well on you.
00:12:15.440 --> 00:12:23.200
It requires the risk that someone will see all of that, not be particularly interested.
00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:30.399
You know, we live in a world that's gotten extremely good at handing out attention and calling it connection.
00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:38.799
You know, you can have thousands of people following your life on social media and still eat dinner alone most nights.
00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:48.879
That becomes a real problem in our third third because a lot of the structures that used to deliver a connection automatically have changed or disappeared.
00:12:49.360 --> 00:12:55.600
Work friendships which felt deep because they were consistent often don't survive the end of the job.
00:12:55.919 --> 00:13:03.279
Parenting networks dissolve, the social infrastructure takes effort to maintain in a way it didn't before.
00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:07.919
None of that means connection is unavailable.
00:13:08.399 --> 00:13:16.960
It means now something you have to build intentionally rather than something that arrives as a byproduct of your schedule.
00:13:18.320 --> 00:13:21.840
The next two are expansion and return.
00:13:22.159 --> 00:13:37.919
And these last two are where I think the third third gets genuinely interesting because these are the needs most strongly associated with what actually feels like a meaningful life as opposed to just a uh just a functioning one.
00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:50.639
Expansion is the need to grow, to learn something new, develop a new capability, face yourself honestly, and come out the other side.
00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:52.399
A little different.
00:13:53.039 --> 00:14:00.720
When this need goes unmet, people describe it as depression, emptiness, a loss of purpose.
00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:06.399
What they're often really describing is what happens when growth stops.
00:14:06.799 --> 00:14:10.159
And they didn't realize that they needed to go find more of it.
00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:15.600
And then that pressure disappears, and growth becomes optional over time.
00:14:15.679 --> 00:14:20.159
And optional for most people means it stops happening.
00:14:21.120 --> 00:14:28.480
Return is different, and I think it's the most underrated need on this list.
00:14:29.200 --> 00:14:31.919
Return is about giving back what you've accumulated.
00:14:32.080 --> 00:14:37.519
Mentorship, teaching, creating something that other people can actually use.
00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:47.519
Here's what I'm noticing, and this isn't a motivational observation, it's something I've watched happen repeatedly as I'm interviewing people in their third third.
00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:53.279
Meaning doesn't arrive during accumulation, the second third.
00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:56.559
It arrives during distribution.
00:14:57.440 --> 00:15:07.279
You can achieve the thing, own the thing, be recognized for the thing, and still feel this the word is hollow about it.
00:15:07.840 --> 00:15:20.080
But the moment you teach someone else what you know, or you create something that helps, or you step into the role of the person who's been where someone else is trying to go, something shifts.
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:23.679
And it's not sentimental, it's a need getting met.
00:15:23.840 --> 00:15:33.279
And for a lot of people in the third-third, return is the need they've been deferring for decades, telling themselves they'll get to it.
00:15:33.440 --> 00:15:36.159
You know, once things settle down.
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:39.360
This is the settle down.
00:15:39.919 --> 00:15:47.200
This is the part where it becomes available, or at least more available than it was before.
00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:50.879
I want to talk about the dark side, you know, the shadow.
00:15:51.360 --> 00:15:54.720
I've been learning a lot about shadow work.
00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:59.519
I want you to hold on to this because it reframes a lot, has for me.
00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:03.440
Every behavior you have is meeting a need.
00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:11.200
Every single one, including the ones you don't like, including the ones you've been trying to change for years.
00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:14.879
Control meets certainty.
00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:19.440
Makes you feel safe even when it exhausts everyone around you.
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.799
Chaos meets adventure.
00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:29.279
It makes you feel alive even when it destabilizes everything you've built.
00:16:30.240 --> 00:16:32.399
Conflict meets significance.
00:16:33.200 --> 00:16:37.759
Makes you feel important even when it burns your relationships.
00:16:38.240 --> 00:16:40.720
Approval seeking meets connection.
00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:46.399
It feels like belonging even when it's really empty calories.
00:16:46.720 --> 00:16:48.720
Overwork meets expansion.
00:16:48.879 --> 00:16:53.679
It feels like growth, even when it's mainly just activity.
00:16:54.399 --> 00:16:56.080
Sacrifice meets return.
00:16:56.240 --> 00:16:59.360
It feels like contribution.
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:06.319
Even when it's really resentment, wearing a convincing disguise.
00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:09.680
I think this is why change is genuinely hard.
00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:17.680
Not because people lack willpower, because the behavior is doing something real, it's meeting a real need.
00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:24.720
And if you try to remove it without replacing what it was providing, the need still doesn't go away.
00:17:25.039 --> 00:17:26.640
It wants to be met.
00:17:27.279 --> 00:17:34.319
Usually goes looking for another strategy, and this time it's worse.
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:42.079
So when you're stuck in a pattern you don't like, the productive question isn't why can't I stop doing this over and over?
00:17:42.400 --> 00:17:45.920
It's what need is this meeting?
00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:48.319
And is there a better way to meet it?
00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:50.799
Those are different questions.
00:17:51.440 --> 00:17:53.279
Helpful questions, I think.
00:17:53.839 --> 00:17:57.839
Because the first one leads to shame, you know?
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:02.480
Making yourself small, curling up into a ball.
00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:06.400
The second one leads to somewhere useful.
00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:09.119
Alright, so here's how to actually use this.
00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:21.839
Next time you feel stuck or reactive, or find yourself doing something you know you'll regret, try pausing long enough to ask, what need am I meeting right now?
00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.400
Or trying to meet right now?
00:18:24.640 --> 00:18:26.319
Not what's wrong with me.
00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:27.519
What need?
00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:28.960
Is it certainty?
00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:32.240
Am I trying to feel safe or in control?
00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:34.640
Is it significance?
00:18:34.799 --> 00:18:40.000
Am I trying to matter in a room where I feel invisible?
00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:41.359
Is it connection?
00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:48.799
Am I reaching for attention because real connection feels too risky right now?
00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:50.640
Or I feel incompetent.
00:18:50.880 --> 00:18:53.440
Quick example someone invites you to a party.
00:18:53.599 --> 00:18:58.160
You don't really want to go, you're tired, it's going to be small talk conversation.
00:18:58.319 --> 00:19:03.440
You'd rather stay home and watch something with subtitles and no discernible plot.
00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:08.400
Nothing wrong with that call, but let's run it through the framework for a second.
00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:17.359
If what you're protecting is certainty, the party feels unpredictable, and you'd rather stay in a controlled environment.
00:19:17.680 --> 00:19:21.839
But maybe you go for 30 minutes and give yourself permission to leave.
00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:26.160
Small dose of novelty, no obligation to stay.
00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:31.119
If what you're protecting is expansion, maybe the party is genuinely the wrong call.
00:19:31.359 --> 00:19:36.240
And the book you want to read, or the documentary is actually the better use of that evening.
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:39.680
That's a legitimate choice, not avoidance.
00:19:39.920 --> 00:19:47.519
If once underneath it is significance, maybe the real problem is that you've been feeling invisible lately, and this particular party isn't going to fix that.
00:19:47.920 --> 00:19:57.920
Maybe what you actually need is one real conversation with one person who sees you, and not a room full of small talk.
00:19:58.079 --> 00:20:01.200
Pick one person, have some large talk.
00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:08.480
The point isn't the party, the point is that you made a conscious choice instead of a driven one.
00:20:08.880 --> 00:20:10.319
You made the choice.
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:12.720
The need didn't make it for you.
00:20:12.880 --> 00:20:14.480
That's the whole game really.
00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:19.920
Not eliminating your needs, you can't start to sound preachy.
00:20:20.400 --> 00:20:26.000
But you can't really eliminate a need or override them with discipline.
00:20:26.319 --> 00:20:28.720
You have to work with them consciously.
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:31.200
Because they're gonna run anyway.
00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:42.079
You're always climbing something significance, certainty, adventure, love, expansion, return scalar.
00:20:42.799 --> 00:20:45.359
I like that handle for it for myself.
00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:46.960
Climbing the mountain.
00:20:47.279 --> 00:20:53.519
Six needs, one question, are you meeting them on purpose or just reacting to them?
00:20:54.720 --> 00:21:09.839
You know, I think what makes this third third so interesting is that it might be the first time in our lives when we finally have enough perspective to really see these patterns and enough freedom to do something about them.
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:11.599
So I'll leave you with this.
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:18.640
Which one of these six needs is running more of your life than you'd like to right now?
00:21:18.799 --> 00:21:25.039
And what's one thing you could do differently this week to meet it in a way that actually serves you?
00:21:25.359 --> 00:21:26.319
Sit with that.
00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:27.599
See what comes up.
00:21:27.759 --> 00:21:35.039
Pick one behavior you've been trying to change, something reactive, something you keep doing even though you know better.
00:21:35.279 --> 00:21:37.599
And ask yourself what need is this meeting?
00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:39.039
Work through the list.
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:47.839
Significance, certainty, adventure, connection, expansion, return.
00:21:48.480 --> 00:21:49.759
One of them fits.
00:21:50.160 --> 00:21:55.680
Once you have identified the need, ask Is there a better strategy for meeting it?
00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:57.599
You don't have to implement anything.
00:21:57.839 --> 00:21:59.759
Seeing the need clearly is a better.
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:02.400
Big part of the work has been for me.
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:06.240
If you do this exercise, I'd genuinely like to hear what you found.
00:22:06.400 --> 00:22:09.839
Email me at steve at your third third.com.
00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:12.240
You can subscribe to my Substack.
00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:13.920
I write every week.
00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:16.720
I'm still trying to podcast every week.
00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:22.799
If you like it, give me a rating wherever you download your podcasts and help spread the word.
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:29.920
Trying to build a community of other people who want to go into the third third with mindfulness and intention.
00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:31.200
Talk to you next time.
00:22:31.440 --> 00:22:32.559
Bye for now.
00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:02.640
Years ago I'm at a wedding.
00:00:02.959 --> 00:00:04.959
It's my girlfriend's sister.
00:00:05.280 --> 00:00:14.320
And at some point during the reception people start finding us, grabbing us by the arms, pulling us close, saying some version of the same thing.
00:00:14.640 --> 00:00:22.480
You two are next and every time someone said it, I kind of shuddered.
00:00:23.199 --> 00:00:25.760
Because I already knew the relationship was over.
00:00:25.839 --> 00:00:37.920
I'd I'd known for a while I'd just been too immature to conflict averse too bad at endings to do anything about it.
00:00:38.079 --> 00:00:48.960
So instead of breaking up with her, I pulled away slowly over time until she finally ended it herself, which was which was cowardice.
00:00:49.520 --> 00:00:55.679
And I knew it at the time, but here's what I understand now that I didn't understand then.
00:00:55.920 --> 00:01:02.880
It wasn't weakness, I was trying to protect something that I couldn't name.
00:01:04.079 --> 00:01:09.359
It's not a character flaw, that's a need running in the background without your permission.
00:01:09.519 --> 00:01:12.239
And today I want to talk about six of those needs.
00:01:12.400 --> 00:01:21.519
Today we're talking about six needs that are running more of your life than you probably realize, and most of the time you can't see them.
00:01:21.680 --> 00:01:35.280
And by the way, I learned this framework that explains all of this decades ago from a very large man with unnaturally white teeth on a VHS tape I bought at 3 a.m.
00:01:35.439 --> 00:01:44.799
during a bout of insomnia in the early 90s, right in between the Ginsu knives and the hand hammered walk.
00:01:45.040 --> 00:01:46.560
We'll get to him in a minute.
00:01:46.799 --> 00:02:03.599
Don't call it a comeback! Hi, I'm Steve Gertchik, and this is your third third.
00:02:04.159 --> 00:02:14.639
This show is for people who have done the work, built the thing, and now shrugging our shoulders, wondering what all of it was actually for.
00:02:14.879 --> 00:02:20.159
Today we're talking about six needs that are running our lives whether we know it or not.
00:02:20.400 --> 00:02:27.039
Not wants, not goals, not preferences, needs.
00:02:27.520 --> 00:02:36.719
The stuff underneath every choice that we make, every reaction that we have, every time you look back and think, I genuinely didn't know why I did that.
00:02:36.960 --> 00:02:40.960
If the show's useful to you, please subscribe wherever you're listening.
00:02:41.120 --> 00:02:46.800
I write every week on Substack also, and there's a TikTok situation developing.
00:02:47.120 --> 00:02:50.319
If you use TikTok, you can find me at your third third there.
00:02:50.400 --> 00:02:53.120
I'm still adjusting to using that.
00:02:53.360 --> 00:02:59.919
Anyway, the person who organized these needs into a working framework is Tony Robbins.
00:03:00.400 --> 00:03:10.879
Robbins popularized a version of this that's actually pretty useful, and a lot of it lines up with real behavioral science, from Maslow to self-determination theory.
00:03:11.039 --> 00:03:26.080
He called them the six human needs, and I'm gonna give you a shorthand for them, something you can actually hold on to, and then we're gonna spend most of our time on what they mean specifically for where you are right now as we think about our third third.
00:03:26.159 --> 00:03:28.000
So here's the shorthand.
00:03:28.159 --> 00:03:31.680
I call it scalar, like you're scaling a mountain.
00:03:32.240 --> 00:03:42.159
Scaler, significance, certainty, adventure, love, expansion, and then return.
00:03:42.719 --> 00:03:44.400
We're always climbing something.
00:03:44.560 --> 00:03:47.439
The question is do we know what it is?
00:03:47.759 --> 00:03:49.439
So keep that in your back pocket.
00:03:49.599 --> 00:03:50.879
I'll come back to it.
00:03:51.120 --> 00:03:54.560
Right now let me start with what matters about it.
00:03:54.960 --> 00:03:58.159
Here's how a lot of people think about motivation.
00:03:58.719 --> 00:04:16.000
You set a goal, you make a commitment, you use discipline, and if you fall short, the story you tell yourself is that you lacked willpower or focus or some other quality that a better morning routine would probably fix.
00:04:16.319 --> 00:04:18.240
That framework is clean.
00:04:18.560 --> 00:04:21.680
It's also mostly wrong.
00:04:22.319 --> 00:04:33.040
What behavioral science actually shows, and this goes back to Maslow and runs through decades of research since, is that motivation is largely about need fulfillment.
00:04:33.279 --> 00:04:38.399
Not what you think you should want, what you actually need, often without knowing it.
00:04:38.720 --> 00:04:42.720
We move toward what satisfies us at a deep level.
00:04:42.959 --> 00:04:49.040
We move away from what doesn't, and most of the time we're not even aware that the need is there.
00:04:49.600 --> 00:04:53.920
And here's why this gets especially interesting in the third third of life.
00:04:54.079 --> 00:04:58.079
In your first and second third, a lot of structures do the work for you.
00:04:58.319 --> 00:05:06.879
Your job delivers meaning and certainty and significance and connection, more or less packaged together.
00:05:07.199 --> 00:05:14.000
You don't have to consciously tend to those needs because institutions are meeting them on your behalf.
00:05:14.160 --> 00:05:15.279
And then that changes.
00:05:15.439 --> 00:05:20.639
The job ends or shifts, or stops being the center of gravity it once was.
00:05:21.040 --> 00:05:26.319
The social infrastructure that used to just show up now requires effort on your part.
00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:31.120
And now you're suddenly responsible for meeting needs that used to be handled by systems.
00:05:31.600 --> 00:05:34.319
Systems that we barely notice are even there.
00:05:34.720 --> 00:05:48.000
And that's what this episode's really about, not six abstract psychological categories, really the specific shape of what happens when the structure kind of comes down, and now you have to figure out what you actually need.
00:05:48.319 --> 00:05:54.480
Let's start with the two most fundamental ones, because understanding these changes how you read almost everything else.
00:05:54.800 --> 00:05:59.040
Certainty is the need to feel safe, stable.
00:06:00.000 --> 00:06:02.319
Like the ground under us is solid.
00:06:02.480 --> 00:06:05.920
This is old wiring, deep wiring.
00:06:06.399 --> 00:06:12.399
When certainty drops, the whole system kind of goes into threat mode.
00:06:12.639 --> 00:06:16.639
And it becomes very hard to think clearly about anything else.
00:06:16.879 --> 00:06:24.800
You can't build meaning when you're worried about your health or your finances or whether the relationship you're in is going to hold.
00:06:25.040 --> 00:06:26.959
But here's the thing that trips people up.
00:06:27.120 --> 00:06:30.720
If you get too much certainty, you get bored.
00:06:31.199 --> 00:06:37.040
And not regular bored, something more hollow than that.
00:06:37.360 --> 00:06:41.120
A kind of restlessness that doesn't have an obvious cause.
00:06:41.439 --> 00:06:45.680
That's adventure, the need for novelty, change.
00:06:46.879 --> 00:06:49.920
Something that doesn't have a guaranteed outcome.
00:06:50.240 --> 00:07:02.480
And it's in permanent tension with certainty, which is which is why it can be sitting in a completely stable, objectively fine life, and still feel like something's missing.
00:07:02.800 --> 00:07:10.959
Many people interpret that feeling as a problem, like they're ungrateful or not built for peace.
00:07:11.120 --> 00:07:13.199
I don't think that's some character flaw.
00:07:13.360 --> 00:07:21.120
They're trying to meet two real needs at the same time, and that takes rhythm, not some permanent resolution.
00:07:21.360 --> 00:07:26.319
Periods of stability, periods of change, and then back again.
00:07:26.720 --> 00:07:29.759
In the third third, that rhythm often breaks down.
00:07:29.920 --> 00:07:39.279
For a lot of people, work was providing the adventure for years, decades, new projects, new challenges, something uncertain to navigate.
00:07:39.519 --> 00:07:47.360
And then work ends or changes, and you have all the certainty in the world, and the adventure just stops.
00:07:47.920 --> 00:07:54.639
And then you either fade into the stability or you start making erratic choices, trying to manufacture the feeling back.
00:07:54.800 --> 00:08:03.920
And what you actually need is to build that rhythm intentionally for the first time, rather than having an institution build it for you.
00:08:04.720 --> 00:08:06.240
Next is significance.
00:08:06.639 --> 00:08:22.879
Significance is the need to matter, to feel important, seen, respected, to have your presence register, and this is where things get interesting, because significance itself isn't the problem.
00:08:23.120 --> 00:08:26.800
The need is real and legitimate.
00:08:27.600 --> 00:08:30.480
But the strategies for meeting it vary enormously.
00:08:30.720 --> 00:08:35.600
See, you can meet significance through achievement or contribution.
00:08:35.919 --> 00:08:37.600
That's one of my favorites.
00:08:38.240 --> 00:08:40.399
Mastery of some new skill.
00:08:41.200 --> 00:08:47.120
Through becoming genuinely good at something, through doing work that helps.
00:08:47.360 --> 00:08:48.720
Those are healthy strategies.
00:08:48.799 --> 00:08:52.080
They tend to produce meaning as a side effect.
00:08:53.120 --> 00:09:03.919
Or you can meet it through conflict, through being right at any cost, through drama, through making yourself the problem everyone else has to manage.
00:09:04.080 --> 00:09:08.720
Same need, very different outcomes for the people around you.
00:09:10.159 --> 00:09:22.960
There's a family member that I love, sharp guy, interesting life he's had, genuinely good company in a lot of ways, but there's a pattern that I've noticed over the years.
00:09:23.200 --> 00:09:40.000
When someone else is telling a story at the dinner table, he'll often interrupt, not not rudely exactly, more excitedly, like he hears something in what you're saying that reminds him of something about himself, and that thing can't wait.
00:09:40.320 --> 00:09:45.440
So in he barges with his story, his experience, his version.
00:09:45.919 --> 00:09:53.200
And the person who is talking kind of trails off and the attention shifts, and he's in the spotlight again.
00:09:53.440 --> 00:09:55.360
I don't think he does it to be selfish.
00:09:55.440 --> 00:09:59.519
I honestly don't think he even knows that he's doing it.
00:09:59.679 --> 00:10:03.919
What I've come to understand is that he's meeting a need, a real one.
00:10:04.799 --> 00:10:11.679
The need to matter, to be interesting, to have his presence register in the room, significance.
00:10:12.960 --> 00:10:20.639
Thing is, the strategy is really working against him because over time people stop bringing their full stories to the table.
00:10:20.960 --> 00:10:25.120
They give him the short version or they wait for a moment when he's not there.
00:10:25.440 --> 00:10:33.519
The very thing that he's reaching for, genuine connection and attention from people he loves, gets a little harder to find each time.
00:10:34.799 --> 00:10:36.960
That's not a character judgment, by the way.
00:10:37.039 --> 00:10:42.799
That's what happens when a real need runs on an old strategy that stopped working.
00:10:43.039 --> 00:10:47.279
And the fix isn't to tell someone like that to stop interrupting.
00:10:47.519 --> 00:10:50.159
That just asks them to feel insignificant.
00:10:50.399 --> 00:10:52.240
Nobody wants that.
00:10:52.480 --> 00:11:04.320
The fix is to find a context where their need for significance gets met in a way that doesn't require taking the floor from someone else, where they're contributing, not competing.
00:11:04.639 --> 00:11:08.080
And that's a solvable problem, but you have to see that need first.
00:11:09.279 --> 00:11:11.360
The next is love and connection.
00:11:11.519 --> 00:11:17.360
This one gets described as the most important need, and at a biological level that probably tracks.
00:11:17.679 --> 00:11:22.399
Loneliness, as I've talked about before, is genuinely bad for you.
00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:28.480
Not in a soft, you know, self-help way, but in a measurable health outcome kind of way.
00:11:28.559 --> 00:11:33.279
But there's a distinction here that I think is worth considering.
00:11:33.759 --> 00:11:35.840
Most people want connection.
00:11:36.399 --> 00:11:39.600
A lot of people settle for attention.
00:11:40.159 --> 00:11:42.080
Attention is easier.
00:11:42.399 --> 00:11:54.799
You can get attention by being loud, by being dramatic, by sharing something provocative, by being the person who always has a story that tops yours.
00:11:55.600 --> 00:12:02.080
You don't have to be vulnerable, you don't have to risk anything, you just have to be noticed, you know?
00:12:02.639 --> 00:12:04.399
Connection is harder.
00:12:04.799 --> 00:12:07.600
It requires actually being seen.
00:12:07.919 --> 00:12:09.360
Maybe being vulnerable.
00:12:09.600 --> 00:12:14.639
The parts you're still working out, the parts that don't reflect well on you.
00:12:15.440 --> 00:12:23.200
It requires the risk that someone will see all of that, not be particularly interested.
00:12:24.720 --> 00:12:30.399
You know, we live in a world that's gotten extremely good at handing out attention and calling it connection.
00:12:30.480 --> 00:12:38.799
You know, you can have thousands of people following your life on social media and still eat dinner alone most nights.
00:12:39.039 --> 00:12:48.879
That becomes a real problem in our third third because a lot of the structures that used to deliver a connection automatically have changed or disappeared.
00:12:49.360 --> 00:12:55.600
Work friendships which felt deep because they were consistent often don't survive the end of the job.
00:12:55.919 --> 00:13:03.279
Parenting networks dissolve, the social infrastructure takes effort to maintain in a way it didn't before.
00:13:03.519 --> 00:13:07.919
None of that means connection is unavailable.
00:13:08.399 --> 00:13:16.960
It means now something you have to build intentionally rather than something that arrives as a byproduct of your schedule.
00:13:18.320 --> 00:13:21.840
The next two are expansion and return.
00:13:22.159 --> 00:13:37.919
And these last two are where I think the third third gets genuinely interesting because these are the needs most strongly associated with what actually feels like a meaningful life as opposed to just a uh just a functioning one.
00:13:38.480 --> 00:13:50.639
Expansion is the need to grow, to learn something new, develop a new capability, face yourself honestly, and come out the other side.
00:13:50.960 --> 00:13:52.399
A little different.
00:13:53.039 --> 00:14:00.720
When this need goes unmet, people describe it as depression, emptiness, a loss of purpose.
00:14:01.039 --> 00:14:06.399
What they're often really describing is what happens when growth stops.
00:14:06.799 --> 00:14:10.159
And they didn't realize that they needed to go find more of it.
00:14:10.480 --> 00:14:15.600
And then that pressure disappears, and growth becomes optional over time.
00:14:15.679 --> 00:14:20.159
And optional for most people means it stops happening.
00:14:21.120 --> 00:14:28.480
Return is different, and I think it's the most underrated need on this list.
00:14:29.200 --> 00:14:31.919
Return is about giving back what you've accumulated.
00:14:32.080 --> 00:14:37.519
Mentorship, teaching, creating something that other people can actually use.
00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:47.519
Here's what I'm noticing, and this isn't a motivational observation, it's something I've watched happen repeatedly as I'm interviewing people in their third third.
00:14:47.840 --> 00:14:53.279
Meaning doesn't arrive during accumulation, the second third.
00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:56.559
It arrives during distribution.
00:14:57.440 --> 00:15:07.279
You can achieve the thing, own the thing, be recognized for the thing, and still feel this the word is hollow about it.
00:15:07.840 --> 00:15:20.080
But the moment you teach someone else what you know, or you create something that helps, or you step into the role of the person who's been where someone else is trying to go, something shifts.
00:15:20.480 --> 00:15:23.679
And it's not sentimental, it's a need getting met.
00:15:23.840 --> 00:15:33.279
And for a lot of people in the third-third, return is the need they've been deferring for decades, telling themselves they'll get to it.
00:15:33.440 --> 00:15:36.159
You know, once things settle down.
00:15:37.600 --> 00:15:39.360
This is the settle down.
00:15:39.919 --> 00:15:47.200
This is the part where it becomes available, or at least more available than it was before.
00:15:47.600 --> 00:15:50.879
I want to talk about the dark side, you know, the shadow.
00:15:51.360 --> 00:15:54.720
I've been learning a lot about shadow work.
00:15:55.279 --> 00:15:59.519
I want you to hold on to this because it reframes a lot, has for me.
00:16:00.240 --> 00:16:03.440
Every behavior you have is meeting a need.
00:16:03.600 --> 00:16:11.200
Every single one, including the ones you don't like, including the ones you've been trying to change for years.
00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:14.879
Control meets certainty.
00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:19.440
Makes you feel safe even when it exhausts everyone around you.
00:16:19.759 --> 00:16:22.799
Chaos meets adventure.
00:16:23.360 --> 00:16:29.279
It makes you feel alive even when it destabilizes everything you've built.
00:16:30.240 --> 00:16:32.399
Conflict meets significance.
00:16:33.200 --> 00:16:37.759
Makes you feel important even when it burns your relationships.
00:16:38.240 --> 00:16:40.720
Approval seeking meets connection.
00:16:41.360 --> 00:16:46.399
It feels like belonging even when it's really empty calories.
00:16:46.720 --> 00:16:48.720
Overwork meets expansion.
00:16:48.879 --> 00:16:53.679
It feels like growth, even when it's mainly just activity.
00:16:54.399 --> 00:16:56.080
Sacrifice meets return.
00:16:56.240 --> 00:16:59.360
It feels like contribution.
00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:06.319
Even when it's really resentment, wearing a convincing disguise.
00:17:06.720 --> 00:17:09.680
I think this is why change is genuinely hard.
00:17:09.920 --> 00:17:17.680
Not because people lack willpower, because the behavior is doing something real, it's meeting a real need.
00:17:17.920 --> 00:17:24.720
And if you try to remove it without replacing what it was providing, the need still doesn't go away.
00:17:25.039 --> 00:17:26.640
It wants to be met.
00:17:27.279 --> 00:17:34.319
Usually goes looking for another strategy, and this time it's worse.
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:42.079
So when you're stuck in a pattern you don't like, the productive question isn't why can't I stop doing this over and over?
00:17:42.400 --> 00:17:45.920
It's what need is this meeting?
00:17:46.319 --> 00:17:48.319
And is there a better way to meet it?
00:17:49.039 --> 00:17:50.799
Those are different questions.
00:17:51.440 --> 00:17:53.279
Helpful questions, I think.
00:17:53.839 --> 00:17:57.839
Because the first one leads to shame, you know?
00:17:58.720 --> 00:18:02.480
Making yourself small, curling up into a ball.
00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:06.400
The second one leads to somewhere useful.
00:18:06.960 --> 00:18:09.119
Alright, so here's how to actually use this.
00:18:09.279 --> 00:18:21.839
Next time you feel stuck or reactive, or find yourself doing something you know you'll regret, try pausing long enough to ask, what need am I meeting right now?
00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:24.400
Or trying to meet right now?
00:18:24.640 --> 00:18:26.319
Not what's wrong with me.
00:18:26.640 --> 00:18:27.519
What need?
00:18:27.920 --> 00:18:28.960
Is it certainty?
00:18:29.119 --> 00:18:32.240
Am I trying to feel safe or in control?
00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:34.640
Is it significance?
00:18:34.799 --> 00:18:40.000
Am I trying to matter in a room where I feel invisible?
00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:41.359
Is it connection?
00:18:41.519 --> 00:18:48.799
Am I reaching for attention because real connection feels too risky right now?
00:18:49.039 --> 00:18:50.640
Or I feel incompetent.
00:18:50.880 --> 00:18:53.440
Quick example someone invites you to a party.
00:18:53.599 --> 00:18:58.160
You don't really want to go, you're tired, it's going to be small talk conversation.
00:18:58.319 --> 00:19:03.440
You'd rather stay home and watch something with subtitles and no discernible plot.
00:19:03.599 --> 00:19:08.400
Nothing wrong with that call, but let's run it through the framework for a second.
00:19:08.720 --> 00:19:17.359
If what you're protecting is certainty, the party feels unpredictable, and you'd rather stay in a controlled environment.
00:19:17.680 --> 00:19:21.839
But maybe you go for 30 minutes and give yourself permission to leave.
00:19:22.480 --> 00:19:26.160
Small dose of novelty, no obligation to stay.
00:19:26.480 --> 00:19:31.119
If what you're protecting is expansion, maybe the party is genuinely the wrong call.
00:19:31.359 --> 00:19:36.240
And the book you want to read, or the documentary is actually the better use of that evening.
00:19:36.319 --> 00:19:39.680
That's a legitimate choice, not avoidance.
00:19:39.920 --> 00:19:47.519
If once underneath it is significance, maybe the real problem is that you've been feeling invisible lately, and this particular party isn't going to fix that.
00:19:47.920 --> 00:19:57.920
Maybe what you actually need is one real conversation with one person who sees you, and not a room full of small talk.
00:19:58.079 --> 00:20:01.200
Pick one person, have some large talk.
00:20:01.440 --> 00:20:08.480
The point isn't the party, the point is that you made a conscious choice instead of a driven one.
00:20:08.880 --> 00:20:10.319
You made the choice.
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:12.720
The need didn't make it for you.
00:20:12.880 --> 00:20:14.480
That's the whole game really.
00:20:15.119 --> 00:20:19.920
Not eliminating your needs, you can't start to sound preachy.
00:20:20.400 --> 00:20:26.000
But you can't really eliminate a need or override them with discipline.
00:20:26.319 --> 00:20:28.720
You have to work with them consciously.
00:20:28.960 --> 00:20:31.200
Because they're gonna run anyway.
00:20:31.599 --> 00:20:42.079
You're always climbing something significance, certainty, adventure, love, expansion, return scalar.
00:20:42.799 --> 00:20:45.359
I like that handle for it for myself.
00:20:45.680 --> 00:20:46.960
Climbing the mountain.
00:20:47.279 --> 00:20:53.519
Six needs, one question, are you meeting them on purpose or just reacting to them?
00:20:54.720 --> 00:21:09.839
You know, I think what makes this third third so interesting is that it might be the first time in our lives when we finally have enough perspective to really see these patterns and enough freedom to do something about them.
00:21:10.079 --> 00:21:11.599
So I'll leave you with this.
00:21:11.839 --> 00:21:18.640
Which one of these six needs is running more of your life than you'd like to right now?
00:21:18.799 --> 00:21:25.039
And what's one thing you could do differently this week to meet it in a way that actually serves you?
00:21:25.359 --> 00:21:26.319
Sit with that.
00:21:26.559 --> 00:21:27.599
See what comes up.
00:21:27.759 --> 00:21:35.039
Pick one behavior you've been trying to change, something reactive, something you keep doing even though you know better.
00:21:35.279 --> 00:21:37.599
And ask yourself what need is this meeting?
00:21:37.759 --> 00:21:39.039
Work through the list.
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:47.839
Significance, certainty, adventure, connection, expansion, return.
00:21:48.480 --> 00:21:49.759
One of them fits.
00:21:50.160 --> 00:21:55.680
Once you have identified the need, ask Is there a better strategy for meeting it?
00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:57.599
You don't have to implement anything.
00:21:57.839 --> 00:21:59.759
Seeing the need clearly is a better.
00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:02.400
Big part of the work has been for me.
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:06.240
If you do this exercise, I'd genuinely like to hear what you found.
00:22:06.400 --> 00:22:09.839
Email me at steve at your third third.com.
00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:12.240
You can subscribe to my Substack.
00:22:12.319 --> 00:22:13.920
I write every week.
00:22:14.319 --> 00:22:16.720
I'm still trying to podcast every week.
00:22:16.960 --> 00:22:22.799
If you like it, give me a rating wherever you download your podcasts and help spread the word.
00:22:23.039 --> 00:22:29.920
Trying to build a community of other people who want to go into the third third with mindfulness and intention.
00:22:30.079 --> 00:22:31.200
Talk to you next time.
00:22:31.440 --> 00:22:32.559
Bye for now.
