Amanda Reagan Full EP 2
Amanda Reagan: Welcome to while you Adventures in Life and Legacy Planning.
Kevin Rosenquist: Welcome back to while you can Adventures in life and Legacy Planning with Amanda Reagan, a Florida estate and succession planning attorney who helps professionals, property owners and business leaders build thoughtful legal plans for every stage of life. My name is Kevin Rosenquist, and today we're exploring some of the most infamous estate planning feats, as well as failures from legendary musicians to heads of state, and what we can all learn from their mistakes. Amanda, welcome back.
Amanda Reagan: Hi, Kevin. Good to be here.
Kevin Rosenquist: Yeah, I'm excited for this topic. This is, this is definitely an interesting one. you know, you've used example examples like Abraham Lincoln and George Washington to talk about planning ahead. Why do you find stories from history so effective in making a state law relatable?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So I feel like it just, if, if they can fumble, maybe we feel a little less, overwhelmed by the process and we can actually have less dread and procrastination and move forward with our planning. That's one reason. And then it's just kind of fun to look back and see who got it right, for their circumstances. And then, you know, how, the head scratchers, so, yeah, there, that's. I think it's always kind of interesting to see what, what did these folks do and, and what can we learn from them?
Kevin Rosenquist: You know, Abraham Lincoln, George Washington, Prince, the, the, the, the artist, the musical artist who passed away. Obviously not. There's one that's a little different than the other. The other two for sure here. But what do you think?
Amanda Reagan: Definitely in outfits.
Kevin Rosenquist: Yeah.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah.
Kevin Rosenquist: Well, Lincoln was known for. No, I'm just. What, what can we learn from these, from these, these stories.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah. So if we look at, you know, I, I always ask. I do speaking engagements and you know, just kind of, maybe I'm not the best, most fun person at a cocktail party. But I like to quiz people. If you had pro President Lincoln and George Washington and you knew one didn't have a plan when they died, and the other one had, somewhat advanced plan for their time, who would you say had the plan? And I think a lot of folks know Washington was, known as, being successful on the battlefield. And people know that President Lincoln, obviously Honest Abe is what, what he's known as, but he also was a trained lawyer. So I would say just gut reaction, I would say it would have been Lincoln. So when I learned that it was actually the other way around that Lincoln passed away. President Lincoln passed without a plan, despite having children, multiple different types of assets and interests. Across state lines, really was shocking to me. And then on the other hand, Washington, this. This battle General, he had a revolutionary plan, pun intended. He, he had a trust that he had set up. He didn't have, perhaps a traditional family for his era. He had some stepchildren, some step grandchildren, some extended family. And he provided for the Mount Vernon estate to be managed by a trust. And you can still learn about how this management, is underway today as we sit here. So it is kind of interesting, I guess, the, juxtaposition between those two very different presidents in terms of what they're known for and, and comparing what they actually did before they died while they could. How.
Kevin Rosenquist: How on earth does. Did Abraham Lincoln not have a plan? And it's also interesting too, because Washington was obviously so much longer ago too. You would think, like, people would get better at that as time went on, but that. That's surprising to me for sure.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah. Yeah. So it just, it really invited. By Lincoln not having a plan, it invited strife and disharmony in his family. His. His estate was ultimately carried out in the court system where his son Robert took positions opposite his mother about what, what belonged to whom. And because he died without a will, it was. His estate was subject in part to the Illinois intestacy laws and would have under that law be divvied up equally among his two sons and his widow. But there were complicating factors because he had real estate and
00:05:00
Amanda Reagan: other assets in different states. He had some Items in Washington, D.C. there were also some personal effects that maybe my personal notes that I write to myself or some draft letters that never got sent. Nobody is going to care when I die. But when you're Abe Lincoln, honest Abe, people care. And so his widow claimed ownership of those papers, and his son Robert argued that they belonged instead to the estate and should be divvied up accordingly. So this went on for years. And I think that President Lincoln would not have wanted that level of discontent in his family. I think he would have liked to have avoided that. Obviously he would have liked to. Avoided his untimely death as well. But that's why we make a plan while we can.
Kevin Rosenquist: And. And moving on to the third member of our example, Prince, who died unexpectedly at the age of 57. But it was very, very public in the news, the battle over his estate. Can you. Can you kind of talk about what happened there?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, I mean, it did become a public spectacle. And I think that there were parts of Prince's life that were Very out there in the public eye. And then there were other parts of his Prince personality that were more private and reserved. So to have this become such a public spectacle and perhaps embarrassment even, you know, I think it would have not been what he wanted to happen, without a will or trust. his estate was subject to a long and costly legal process that took several years and really a lot of millions of dollars to settle. He had a sister and some half, several half siblings that took equal shares. And he had substantial estate taxes. So when you pass away with assets exceeding the threshold that there are some states that have estate, taxes. Florida does not. The federal government does have some very high thresholds currently, but a few decades ago it was much lower, definitely less than a million. So now we're several million dollars, before you get to a taxable estate. But someone with Prince's level of wealth could have done a plan likely would have involved some trusts or entities or other advanced techniques such as charitable giving or, or advanced giving while he was alive. There are a lot of different techniques that really, in opportunities that went unseized, with Prince. And it's somewhat unfortunate to see the way that things played out so publicly and so expensively and for so long.
Kevin Rosenquist: I remember that dragging on for a really long time. So what happens in Florida if someone passes away without a plan?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So that's what's known as dying intestate. We kind of touched on it a bit with President Lincoln and the Illinois intestacy. But Here, Florida Today, 2025, we have Florida intestacy statutes that apply. And that just means they died without a will. And the statute says what happens in that circumstance. It dictates who inherits. It's not quite as straightforward or simple as it might sound. It's because there's usually, well, there is court involvement, and you have to do, usually with the help of a lawyer, you have to do an inventory of assets, debts, creditors, heirs, and you have to provide notice and vetting of heirs and creditors, which you can imagine may pose a significant challenge, an expensive challenge. If non credible claims are brought against the estate or a family later on says, oh, here's this will that so and so made before they died. And then you have to vet, you know, is it really a legitimate will? Was it executed properly? And while there are some summary, it's called summary administration in Florida, there are some summary procedures that are supposed to be more straightforward and streamlined and they can be deployed for very narrow situations such as a very small estate or when it involves some, exempt estate assets, such as a homestead, the length and expense of such court process should be less. But it can always vary just as much as someone's family types and dynamics or the types of their
00:10:00
Amanda Reagan: assets can vary.
Kevin Rosenquist: So, a story that I, I'm curious about, that I've heard before, is that Aretha Franklin hand wrote her will. Is that, is that true? And, and how did, how did that go?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, the Queen of Soul, she had a unique and very risky plan. She was not a Floridian that I'm aware of. So this was, this was in the Motown area and, in Michigan. And she passed away with the, with about $80 million her estate was worth. She did have a will, and many thought that she died without a will. in fact, she didn't just have one will, she had two dueling wills. So there were differences and conflict arose. so they were found months after she had passed away. So this is just a little nice segue to point out that when you do in a plan, an estate plan, it's great to be proactive. It's also great to notify those who are going to be there to pick up the pieces when you pass away and let them know, hey, I do have a will, or I do have this trust or this planning document in place. So when tragedy strikes, it's not a treasure hunt. Okay. For Aretha Franklin, her plan was risky because it ended up being litigated for more than five years. And think of the lawyer's bills, just alone. Not to mention the time and the distraction and strain on the family relationships. Her latest will was from 2014. it was in between her couch cushions. And so when you have the dueling wills, you have to obviously look at the latest one, the most recent one. And you, you just can't even imagine. This is stranger than what you would imagine in between the couch cushions. She did not have a formal will. It was, as you mentioned, handwritten and no witnesses to it. That's known as a holographic will. And no, it's not shiny and three dimensional, just has a fancy name. And they are not enforceable. In Florida. In Florida, you have to have witnesses to a will. you also need, you can also have a self proving affidavit, which we do for all the wills that I create. And you have an affidavit that's notarized, saying, yes, I just signed my will in the presence of these witnesses. And then those witnesses attest to the same. So what can we learn from the queen of soul. we should have some resp ct for ourselves and our loved ones and have a plan. Have a proactive plan. Have one that is legally enforceable in the state that we reside and where our assets are. Keep it up to date and do not hold on to old wills without clear indication that they have been revoked. I think that would have saved at least some months off of the whole ordeal. and then really just where it was kept. just kind of a head scratcher.
Kevin Rosenquist: By the way, props for the, respct reference, there. I like that. That was great. yeah, yeah, the couch cushions that seem so insane, like, you can't help but go, like, how did that happen? But either way, I mean, you said you'd like to talk about this when you do speaking engagements. I imagine this segues into why it is so important to store estate planning documents somewhere secure and accessible, correct?
Amanda Reagan: Absolutely. So that can be a number of things. Again, it is tailored to the client. some clients in certain locations especially have aversions to keeping things at a bank, and they choose to keep it in a fireproof safe at home and let their loved ones, whom they trust have access to that. And that's. There's nothing wrong with that. I find many people, though, do feel very comfortable with having their original stored in a safety deposit box and having those that they trust, have access to that safety deposit box. I've heard things about keeping it in a waterproof bag in the bottom of their freezer because that's not somewhere a thief would look. the in between couch cushions is interesting. certainly for me, that would be embarrassing to have someone rooting around my couch looking for important documents. It's not where I store them. if anything, they might find some dust and some dog hair.
Kevin Rosenquist: A lot of dog hair in my house, that's for sure. No doubt. How does proactive planning help avoid the court drama
00:15:00
Kevin Rosenquist: or family tension that we've been discussing with some of these, celebrity estates?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So you're planning ahead. You are conveying in a legally enforceable way what your wishes are. What are your assets? Who are they going to. You don't want to leave this up to speculation and then an all in out hunt for where are Kevin's assets? Oh, I thought he had this. Oh, he thought he had that. Who's getting this? You don't want it to be a knockdown drag out. Well, Kevin liked me more than you. That is not a legacy that a lot of people if anybody would like to leave behind. So what do you do? You create legally enforceable document that clearly expresses who gets what and who's in charge of, you know, administering the estate. for example, in will you select a personal representative in Florida? that's what we call it. Oftentimes people refer to them as an executor. And I think that's just a very smart way to create family harmony through estate planning.
Kevin Rosenquist: We talked in the last episode, in our intro episode, about people who, you know, don't. Don't do an estate plan for whatever reason. One of them was just the, I'll take care of that tomorrow. But, you know, you've said tomorrow isn't guaranteed. How do you help people overcome that mindset?
Amanda Reagan: Again, I think it lends itself to kind of proactive measures being better than reactive, especially in the estate planning world. it's just the most cost efficient, time efficient way of handling these things. While you have clear mindset, you're not facing down some terminal illness at the time, that you're scrambling to think of everything at one time, if you even have time like that to address. So you do it while you can. And that's why, yes, we can always say, I'll think about that tomorrow. that's all nice and maybe that works for a while, but eventually tomorrow comes and either you're not here or you don't have capacity to sign those documents. So, I would say let's not kick the can down the road. Let's have some resp ct. for what you've worked hard to set up for yourself and your loved ones and create a tailored plan that's right for you?
Kevin Rosenquist: Last question for today before we finish up. What's one practical step that someone listening right now can take today to avoid going down these. The path of what we've been talking about, of, making these mistakes?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, I mean, really just take stock, take inventory of what your wishes are, what your assets are, who do you trust to carry out your wishes? Who do you want to get what from you when you pass? Just really simple concepts, but just carving out that time to, to think through that in a meaningful way, it can really save thousands of dollars in the future, it can save years of family strife in the future, and if you have some advanced planning needs, it can even save in taxes. So really, my message is very simple. Just please create a, tailored plan while you can.
Kevin Rosenquist: I think it's a great message. All right, well, thanks for listening to our show. Today. If this episode gave you a new perspective on why having a plan matters, share it with someone who might still be putting it off. And as always, you can connect with Amanda and take that first step towards your own custom plan@aeregan.com don't forget to subscribe to our channel. Leave us a review. We very much appreciate it. Amanda, I always appreciate your time. Thanks so much for being here.
Amanda Reagan: Thank you. Thanks for watching. Be sure to hit that like and subscribe button and leave us a review in the comments.
00:19:05
Amanda Reagan: Welcome to while you Adventures in Life and Legacy Planning.
Kevin Rosenquist: Welcome back to while you can Adventures in life and Legacy Planning with Amanda Reagan, a Florida estate and succession planning attorney who helps professionals, property owners and business leaders build thoughtful legal plans for every stage of life. My name is Kevin Rosenquist, and today we're exploring some of the most infamous estate planning feats, as well as failures from legendary musicians to heads of state, and what we can all learn from their mistakes. Amanda, welcome back.
Amanda Reagan: Hi, Kevin. Good to be here.
Kevin Rosenquist: Yeah, I'm excited for this topic. This is, this is definitely an interesting one. you know, you've used example examples like Abraham Lincoln and George Washington to talk about planning ahead. Why do you find stories from history so effective in making a state law relatable?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So I feel like it just, if, if they can fumble, maybe we feel a little less, overwhelmed by the process and we can actually have less dread and procrastination and move forward with our planning. That's one reason. And then it's just kind of fun to look back and see who got it right, for their circumstances. And then, you know, how, the head scratchers, so, yeah, there, that's. I think it's always kind of interesting to see what, what did these folks do and, and what can we learn from them?
Kevin Rosenquist: You know, Abraham Lincoln, George Washington, Prince, the, the, the, the artist, the musical artist who passed away. Obviously not. There's one that's a little different than the other. The other two for sure here. But what do you think?
Amanda Reagan: Definitely in outfits.
Kevin Rosenquist: Yeah.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah.
Kevin Rosenquist: Well, Lincoln was known for. No, I'm just. What, what can we learn from these, from these, these stories.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah. So if we look at, you know, I, I always ask. I do speaking engagements and you know, just kind of, maybe I'm not the best, most fun person at a cocktail party. But I like to quiz people. If you had pro President Lincoln and George Washington and you knew one didn't have a plan when they died, and the other one had, somewhat advanced plan for their time, who would you say had the plan? And I think a lot of folks know Washington was, known as, being successful on the battlefield. And people know that President Lincoln, obviously Honest Abe is what, what he's known as, but he also was a trained lawyer. So I would say just gut reaction, I would say it would have been Lincoln. So when I learned that it was actually the other way around that Lincoln passed away. President Lincoln passed without a plan, despite having children, multiple different types of assets and interests. Across state lines, really was shocking to me. And then on the other hand, Washington, this. This battle General, he had a revolutionary plan, pun intended. He, he had a trust that he had set up. He didn't have, perhaps a traditional family for his era. He had some stepchildren, some step grandchildren, some extended family. And he provided for the Mount Vernon estate to be managed by a trust. And you can still learn about how this management, is underway today as we sit here. So it is kind of interesting, I guess, the, juxtaposition between those two very different presidents in terms of what they're known for and, and comparing what they actually did before they died while they could. How.
Kevin Rosenquist: How on earth does. Did Abraham Lincoln not have a plan? And it's also interesting too, because Washington was obviously so much longer ago too. You would think, like, people would get better at that as time went on, but that. That's surprising to me for sure.
Amanda Reagan: Yeah. Yeah. So it just, it really invited. By Lincoln not having a plan, it invited strife and disharmony in his family. His. His estate was ultimately carried out in the court system where his son Robert took positions opposite his mother about what, what belonged to whom. And because he died without a will, it was. His estate was subject in part to the Illinois intestacy laws and would have under that law be divvied up equally among his two sons and his widow. But there were complicating factors because he had real estate and
00:05:00
Amanda Reagan: other assets in different states. He had some Items in Washington, D.C. there were also some personal effects that maybe my personal notes that I write to myself or some draft letters that never got sent. Nobody is going to care when I die. But when you're Abe Lincoln, honest Abe, people care. And so his widow claimed ownership of those papers, and his son Robert argued that they belonged instead to the estate and should be divvied up accordingly. So this went on for years. And I think that President Lincoln would not have wanted that level of discontent in his family. I think he would have liked to have avoided that. Obviously he would have liked to. Avoided his untimely death as well. But that's why we make a plan while we can.
Kevin Rosenquist: And. And moving on to the third member of our example, Prince, who died unexpectedly at the age of 57. But it was very, very public in the news, the battle over his estate. Can you. Can you kind of talk about what happened there?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, I mean, it did become a public spectacle. And I think that there were parts of Prince's life that were Very out there in the public eye. And then there were other parts of his Prince personality that were more private and reserved. So to have this become such a public spectacle and perhaps embarrassment even, you know, I think it would have not been what he wanted to happen, without a will or trust. his estate was subject to a long and costly legal process that took several years and really a lot of millions of dollars to settle. He had a sister and some half, several half siblings that took equal shares. And he had substantial estate taxes. So when you pass away with assets exceeding the threshold that there are some states that have estate, taxes. Florida does not. The federal government does have some very high thresholds currently, but a few decades ago it was much lower, definitely less than a million. So now we're several million dollars, before you get to a taxable estate. But someone with Prince's level of wealth could have done a plan likely would have involved some trusts or entities or other advanced techniques such as charitable giving or, or advanced giving while he was alive. There are a lot of different techniques that really, in opportunities that went unseized, with Prince. And it's somewhat unfortunate to see the way that things played out so publicly and so expensively and for so long.
Kevin Rosenquist: I remember that dragging on for a really long time. So what happens in Florida if someone passes away without a plan?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So that's what's known as dying intestate. We kind of touched on it a bit with President Lincoln and the Illinois intestacy. But Here, Florida Today, 2025, we have Florida intestacy statutes that apply. And that just means they died without a will. And the statute says what happens in that circumstance. It dictates who inherits. It's not quite as straightforward or simple as it might sound. It's because there's usually, well, there is court involvement, and you have to do, usually with the help of a lawyer, you have to do an inventory of assets, debts, creditors, heirs, and you have to provide notice and vetting of heirs and creditors, which you can imagine may pose a significant challenge, an expensive challenge. If non credible claims are brought against the estate or a family later on says, oh, here's this will that so and so made before they died. And then you have to vet, you know, is it really a legitimate will? Was it executed properly? And while there are some summary, it's called summary administration in Florida, there are some summary procedures that are supposed to be more straightforward and streamlined and they can be deployed for very narrow situations such as a very small estate or when it involves some, exempt estate assets, such as a homestead, the length and expense of such court process should be less. But it can always vary just as much as someone's family types and dynamics or the types of their
00:10:00
Amanda Reagan: assets can vary.
Kevin Rosenquist: So, a story that I, I'm curious about, that I've heard before, is that Aretha Franklin hand wrote her will. Is that, is that true? And, and how did, how did that go?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, the Queen of Soul, she had a unique and very risky plan. She was not a Floridian that I'm aware of. So this was, this was in the Motown area and, in Michigan. And she passed away with the, with about $80 million her estate was worth. She did have a will, and many thought that she died without a will. in fact, she didn't just have one will, she had two dueling wills. So there were differences and conflict arose. so they were found months after she had passed away. So this is just a little nice segue to point out that when you do in a plan, an estate plan, it's great to be proactive. It's also great to notify those who are going to be there to pick up the pieces when you pass away and let them know, hey, I do have a will, or I do have this trust or this planning document in place. So when tragedy strikes, it's not a treasure hunt. Okay. For Aretha Franklin, her plan was risky because it ended up being litigated for more than five years. And think of the lawyer's bills, just alone. Not to mention the time and the distraction and strain on the family relationships. Her latest will was from 2014. it was in between her couch cushions. And so when you have the dueling wills, you have to obviously look at the latest one, the most recent one. And you, you just can't even imagine. This is stranger than what you would imagine in between the couch cushions. She did not have a formal will. It was, as you mentioned, handwritten and no witnesses to it. That's known as a holographic will. And no, it's not shiny and three dimensional, just has a fancy name. And they are not enforceable. In Florida. In Florida, you have to have witnesses to a will. you also need, you can also have a self proving affidavit, which we do for all the wills that I create. And you have an affidavit that's notarized, saying, yes, I just signed my will in the presence of these witnesses. And then those witnesses attest to the same. So what can we learn from the queen of soul. we should have some resp ct for ourselves and our loved ones and have a plan. Have a proactive plan. Have one that is legally enforceable in the state that we reside and where our assets are. Keep it up to date and do not hold on to old wills without clear indication that they have been revoked. I think that would have saved at least some months off of the whole ordeal. and then really just where it was kept. just kind of a head scratcher.
Kevin Rosenquist: By the way, props for the, respct reference, there. I like that. That was great. yeah, yeah, the couch cushions that seem so insane, like, you can't help but go, like, how did that happen? But either way, I mean, you said you'd like to talk about this when you do speaking engagements. I imagine this segues into why it is so important to store estate planning documents somewhere secure and accessible, correct?
Amanda Reagan: Absolutely. So that can be a number of things. Again, it is tailored to the client. some clients in certain locations especially have aversions to keeping things at a bank, and they choose to keep it in a fireproof safe at home and let their loved ones, whom they trust have access to that. And that's. There's nothing wrong with that. I find many people, though, do feel very comfortable with having their original stored in a safety deposit box and having those that they trust, have access to that safety deposit box. I've heard things about keeping it in a waterproof bag in the bottom of their freezer because that's not somewhere a thief would look. the in between couch cushions is interesting. certainly for me, that would be embarrassing to have someone rooting around my couch looking for important documents. It's not where I store them. if anything, they might find some dust and some dog hair.
Kevin Rosenquist: A lot of dog hair in my house, that's for sure. No doubt. How does proactive planning help avoid the court drama
00:15:00
Kevin Rosenquist: or family tension that we've been discussing with some of these, celebrity estates?
Amanda Reagan: Sure. So you're planning ahead. You are conveying in a legally enforceable way what your wishes are. What are your assets? Who are they going to. You don't want to leave this up to speculation and then an all in out hunt for where are Kevin's assets? Oh, I thought he had this. Oh, he thought he had that. Who's getting this? You don't want it to be a knockdown drag out. Well, Kevin liked me more than you. That is not a legacy that a lot of people if anybody would like to leave behind. So what do you do? You create legally enforceable document that clearly expresses who gets what and who's in charge of, you know, administering the estate. for example, in will you select a personal representative in Florida? that's what we call it. Oftentimes people refer to them as an executor. And I think that's just a very smart way to create family harmony through estate planning.
Kevin Rosenquist: We talked in the last episode, in our intro episode, about people who, you know, don't. Don't do an estate plan for whatever reason. One of them was just the, I'll take care of that tomorrow. But, you know, you've said tomorrow isn't guaranteed. How do you help people overcome that mindset?
Amanda Reagan: Again, I think it lends itself to kind of proactive measures being better than reactive, especially in the estate planning world. it's just the most cost efficient, time efficient way of handling these things. While you have clear mindset, you're not facing down some terminal illness at the time, that you're scrambling to think of everything at one time, if you even have time like that to address. So you do it while you can. And that's why, yes, we can always say, I'll think about that tomorrow. that's all nice and maybe that works for a while, but eventually tomorrow comes and either you're not here or you don't have capacity to sign those documents. So, I would say let's not kick the can down the road. Let's have some resp ct. for what you've worked hard to set up for yourself and your loved ones and create a tailored plan that's right for you?
Kevin Rosenquist: Last question for today before we finish up. What's one practical step that someone listening right now can take today to avoid going down these. The path of what we've been talking about, of, making these mistakes?
Amanda Reagan: Yeah, I mean, really just take stock, take inventory of what your wishes are, what your assets are, who do you trust to carry out your wishes? Who do you want to get what from you when you pass? Just really simple concepts, but just carving out that time to, to think through that in a meaningful way, it can really save thousands of dollars in the future, it can save years of family strife in the future, and if you have some advanced planning needs, it can even save in taxes. So really, my message is very simple. Just please create a, tailored plan while you can.
Kevin Rosenquist: I think it's a great message. All right, well, thanks for listening to our show. Today. If this episode gave you a new perspective on why having a plan matters, share it with someone who might still be putting it off. And as always, you can connect with Amanda and take that first step towards your own custom plan@aeregan.com don't forget to subscribe to our channel. Leave us a review. We very much appreciate it. Amanda, I always appreciate your time. Thanks so much for being here.
Amanda Reagan: Thank you. Thanks for watching. Be sure to hit that like and subscribe button and leave us a review in the comments.
00:19:05
