Episode 2: Maybe We Can Meet 4 Lunch

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Episode one was was new.
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It was new, and you know, we're finding that rhythm.
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Yeah.
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And you know, giving them the audience the time to latch on and and and experience.
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Well experience us.
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Yes.
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One thing you'll learn or remember or get to continue to know about me and Craig is that we're very honest and open, and it is what it is.
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So you're gonna get what you're gonna get.
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Right.
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Behind the scenes.
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There are no behind the scenes.
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This is behind the scenes in this podcast.
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Um, so here we go.
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But wait a minute, every episode, we're flipping the hourglass.
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Yes.
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You have us for an hour.
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When the sand runs out, the episode is over.
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When the sand runs out, the conversation is done.
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That's right.
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Um, what's in your glass?
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This is that um it's spilling out.
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That's where the ice was it melted.
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Thanks.
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It's a fabulous glass though.
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From South Africa.
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Where in South Africa?
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From the um, I saw it at the um Mandela house.
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They had it there.
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It was the boutique, it's the one that where he lived when he was president, and now it's a boutique hotel.
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Yeah.
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They have a bar inside, and they served us drinks out of this.
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And I said, Oh my god, I love this glass.
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Where can I get it?
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I went there and they did not serve me drinks out of this.
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They served it, and it was a nice fancy cocktail.
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And um They had a jazz band playing the day that I went.
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We I actually I went, I think it was the day that I was leaving.
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Really?
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And they had a jazz band.
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So yeah, so I got this glass.
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Well, I didn't get the glass from there.
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I saw it there, and then I was like, where can I get it?
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So they put me in touch with you know where I could get it.
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So I ended up buying a bunch of them and I brought them back with me.
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I didn't ship them because, of course, customs, and because, you know, it's just been too expensive shipping them back.
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So I packed them up, I had them packed them up very nicely, individually wrapped, and I brought them back.
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In your in a bag.
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In my suitcase, yeah.
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I bought two extra suitcases.
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You did oh, so you checked those.
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You didn't bring those on.
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I've child, I would have tried to bring uh um these back on the plane with me.
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I know.
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I bought some art when I was there.
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And that art, I carried that on the plane.
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I brought that platter that those lemons and limes are in.
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Oh, yes.
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I brought that back.
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I brought a bunch of stuff, two lamps, three lamps.
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Can you believe after all of these years that we've been friends, I don't think we have not been down on the we've never well think we've ever been on a trip.
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He's where are you going for your 50th?
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Honolulu.
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A bitch didn't know.
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Well, it's okay.
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I don't know.
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I be because you know what it is.
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A friend of mine turned 50 last year, and she invited like 17 of her friends.
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I was one of them.
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Oh, I remember.
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We went to the Amalfi Coast, and it was such a chore because she she nominated me and one of her friends to help her coordinate it all, and it was such a task, and so I said, Oh, I think I want to do that, you know, do this for my birthday when it comes around.
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But then as I got closer to my birthday, I was like, Yeah, I don't really want to do that.
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No, I get it.
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The planning, listen, I you know I don't feel no way because I would have told you.
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First of all, I would have booked my flight if I could go.
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I would have been like, I don't care whether I was invited or not.
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Right, right, right, right.
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I'm coming.
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Right.
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Um, I shouldn't say whether I was invited, whether I knew about it, because I believe that the invitation would have been there.
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Right.
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Um, I totally understand because I'm planning my 50th birthday.
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It's gonna be out of town.
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I know you'll be on tour with talk.
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I was thinking to myself, like, I don't want to do all of that.
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I don't want to, and that's why I'm picking, I'm finding someplace that we could just kick it.
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It's all inclusive.
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We just be there for the day, for the days that we're there.
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I don't need to be all over.
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You know, there's a difference between a trip and a vacation.
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Yes.
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There's a vacation.
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Yeah, come kick your feet up, lay back, have a good time.
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We're gonna laugh all day, all night, eat.
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And and you don't even have to have anything planned in particular.
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Yeah, you know what I mean?
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You're just there, yeah.
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And that's kind of how I like to travel.
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I don't really feel like I have to have an itinerary every single day, every hour.
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You got something planned.
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Yeah, I want to have like a skeleton plan, yeah, but I don't have to have something every moment of every day.
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Like I want to just enjoy the city or the country, whatever it is, you know, for what it is.
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Like I don't have to try to see all of the sites on this trip.
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Right.
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You know what I mean?
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Like, especially like when I travel like that first day, I don't really want to do anything except for go to the property.
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Like if it's a resort, I want to get to the property, check in, eat, yeah, right there on the property, maybe take a nap or lay out at the pool or right there at the beach if it's on a beach.
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Mm-hmm.
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And then I want to explore.
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It's comfortable.
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Mm-hmm.
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Okay.
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And then I want to explore like the next day.
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Mm-hmm.
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Yeah.
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Like I don't have to go out the very first day that I get there.
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You know what I mean?
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Like chill out.
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Yeah, and I've always been like that.
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Well, this year is kind of already planned out for you.
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Mm-hmm.
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Um, but should we commit that before the end of the first quarter of 2027?
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That we'll go on a trip someplace?
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Because next year is 2027, isn't it?
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Yeah, that's what I'm saying.
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Because you already said you you're basically booked through the end of the year.
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Yeah.
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So well, I was kind of waiting for you for Ghana.
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Oh, because you know I love Ghana.
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I've never been.
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Yeah, we could do Ghana.
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But I don't, but you know, I've never been during the December, all of that.
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That's when the Americans go, right?
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Yeah.
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Well I mean, I mean, we're Americans.
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I was gonna say don't pull with them like that.
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But I'm just saying, I don't really have to go when the Americans go, is what I'm saying.
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Because I think that it's that's just a whole nother thing.
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I don't know if it's as rooted in Yeah, you want to just go to go.
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Yeah, I don't want to go when it's opening up for the Americans.
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You know what I mean?
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Where everything is just set up and it's too touristy, if you will.
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I just want to go when it's just uh Yeah.
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Uh yeah, the Ghanaians.
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Yeah.
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Um, oh we could we could do Ghana.
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Or or whatever, but you know.
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Yeah.
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I loved South Africa.
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I did too.
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I enjoyed it.
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But you were there for like a month.
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I was there for all of December, yeah.
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Wow.
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I think I went for 11 days.
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Yeah, it was amazing.
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With friends, very good friends, Stacy and Isaiah.
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We had an amazing time.
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Um that's another thing about friendship is traveling.
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I love to travel with some friends.
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Yes, and that's how you know if you have a good, solid friendship too, if you can travel together.
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How you travel.
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That is very true.
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Yeah, that's very true.
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They say that about relationships, but then again, like we said, friendships are like, friendships are relationships, yes.
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What are we calling this episode?
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This episode, maybe we can meet for lunch.
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Maybe we can meet for lunch.
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And how did we come up with that?
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How how was that?
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I know it was born out of the conversation we had last night.
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Yeah.
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But you know, when you said it just now, my heart kind of sank because when a friendship gets to a point that you're saying maybe we could meet for lunch.
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That's different than, hey, what you doing?
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Let's go get something to eat, or we're gonna be.
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Maybe we can meet for lunch.
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Maybe we can meet for lunch is giving it suggests we need to talk.
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We need to talk.
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Some time has passed, some distance has separated us.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And um, I think we were saying that because a friend of ours who we were talking to last night, she mentioned that I think she said that.
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Like, and then it was like, Yeah, well, maybe we can meet for lunch or something.
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And we were like, damn.
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Because that's that's a point when you when you get to that point in a I had a um maybe we could go maybe we can go to lunch, dinner.
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Well, just to give them some context, she said maybe we could meet for lunch because she had had a falling out with a group of her friends and some time had passed, and then they all, because we all went to college together, they saw each other at the homecoming, and one of them said, We had and they flew ended up flying back home together, and one of them said, Oh my god, we had such a great time this weekend, maybe we should meet for lunch.
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But there was this distance between them leading up to the homecoming.
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Yeah, and then they went and had lunch and they had the come to Jesus conversation.
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Yeah.
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Yeah.
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I had a come to Jesus conversation one time with a friend over dinner.
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I was blown away.
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Um I think the friendship started falling apart maybe in February.
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This year?
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No, this is a couple of years ago.
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In February of that year.
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We had the dinner in like July.
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Or June.
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And some things were revealed in June that I said, had you told me that in January, we would be in a different place right now.
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I kind of struggle with friendships like that.
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Like when someone is upset with you and you don't know that they're upset or they're upset about something and they haven't voiced it for whatever reason.
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Yeah.
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Um I like to think sometimes it's because a lack of emotional maturity to say you hurt my feelings, or you know, you did this thing that upset me.
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Or an inability to communicate.
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Yeah, a lack of communication skills.
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Everybody, a lack of communication skills.
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Everybody is not a communicator.
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Everybody doesn't want to communicate.
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There are people And some people are afraid of that vulnerability that comes with communicating.
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Because it requires you to to get naked.
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Yeah.
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It requires that.
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If you're if you're willing to get naked.
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And some people are not.
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Some people are not.
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And some people will shut your shut you out.
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They will shut you out and tell you they don't want to talk to you, and they will throw it all away.
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Or they may not even say that they don't want to talk to you, they'll just stop talking to you.
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I had somebody say to me once, they weren't really a good friend.
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They were somebody that I knew.
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And they said, and that's why I wasn't talking to you.
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After they explained everything, and they said, That's why I wasn't talking to you.
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And I said, I didn't know you weren't talking to me.
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That's the truth.
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I mean, I know it sounds like like but but that goes to the whole idea that you're people walking around with an attitude, you're upset with people, you're str you know, you're carrying this anger, harboring this anger and resentment.
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And people are going on with their life.
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They didn't even know you were upset.
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My uncle Gerald says it best all the time.
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He says that anger is like urinating on yourself.
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Nobody feels it but you.
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Nobody.
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It's true.
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I mean, so um, yeah, I mean, it was very interesting because I I was you know, I was told like I wasn't there for them and all of this stuff, and I was just completely taken aback.
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Well, something you said to me years ago, and I think it applies here.
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A part of taking care of yourself is telling people what you need.
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And if you haven't told me what you need, I can't be responsible for that.
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Friendship requires safety.
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I have to feel I have to feel like we are in a space where I can be myself freely, completely, honestly, and I will not be judged.
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And I won't be on some yes man shit either.
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Right.
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It's okay for you to disagree.
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To disagree, to hold me accountable, to say something to me.
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And if you don't, that's on you.
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Right.
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And that ain't really friendship.
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It's been too many times in my life where people are like, oh, we we don't hold her accountable.
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Well, whose fault is that?
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If you haven't come to me and said something to me about it, then why is that my fault that you haven't said anything to me?
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And the thing that I would But you've said something to everybody else.
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Right.
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And the thing that I would add to that is if I can't be honest with you, then I can't really be your friend.
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A hundred percent.
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I don't really think that that's friendship.
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But then, you know, there are people who will say they want, I want real people around me.
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I just want people that's gonna keep it a hundred, da da da.
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But then when people come to you don't mean that.
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They don't really mean that.
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They don't really mean that.
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They don't really.
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Their feelings are hurt right away, no matter how tactful you are when you say it, no matter how um how much you considered them, the circumstance, the time, the place, the moment, they they don't want to hear it.
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So it didn't matter what the conditions were or the circumstances were, they weren't gonna receive it anyway.
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I think um, you know, there was something else that was said last night that like put a knot in my throat.
00:14:33.200 --> 00:14:39.200
Um, and it was it feels weird being a part.
00:14:39.440 --> 00:14:43.360
It feels weird not being a part of your life at this time.
00:14:44.159 --> 00:14:46.240
Because at one point you were just so close.
00:14:46.480 --> 00:14:47.120
Yes.
00:14:48.000 --> 00:14:52.799
Recently I had a fr you know, someone that I used to be very, very, very close with.
00:14:53.440 --> 00:14:55.840
Um, and life just happens.
00:14:56.000 --> 00:15:04.080
We didn't we didn't fall out when we see each other, it's all love, like, but life happens, you know.
00:15:04.240 --> 00:15:10.080
We we um we live different lives, like you know what I'm saying?
00:15:10.720 --> 00:15:16.000
Uh and their parent passed away recently.
00:15:17.279 --> 00:15:27.360
And when I got the the text, first of all, there was a time when it wouldn't have been a text, it would have been a call.
00:15:28.960 --> 00:15:38.720
The same way that I said to you, like I I wanted to get here in the last episode when I said to you I couldn't wait to get to you to be there for you when Gladys passed away.
00:15:39.440 --> 00:15:47.039
It just it felt so weird not being not being a part of her life at this time.
00:15:47.840 --> 00:15:51.120
I wanted I wanted to be her friend.
00:15:51.279 --> 00:15:57.840
I wanted to friend on her, I wanted to love on her, I wanted to and I didn't know what to do.
00:15:59.200 --> 00:16:04.639
And the desire for that type of friendship wasn't there from her.
00:16:05.039 --> 00:16:09.679
And I and I'm not making this about me, her mother passed away by any means.
00:16:09.840 --> 00:16:18.399
I'm just saying that it was recognizable for me that I was so sad obviously for her and for me.
00:16:18.480 --> 00:16:35.600
I I loved her mom, but for her and her family, and I wanted to be able to because I'm a giver, I'm a doer, I wanted to be a friend, and I didn't know what to do, and it just felt weird not being able to be there for her, and to be learning about it through a text.
00:16:35.840 --> 00:17:07.359
But I mean, I get it, like you know, that that that is that's the world that we live in right now, and I get it, like you said earlier um on the last episode when you were speaking about Gladys, and you said um I can't remember how you phrase it, but you were saying that your mom passing away, like there was nothing else like that.
00:17:07.519 --> 00:17:08.640
That that pain.
00:17:09.119 --> 00:17:18.000
I'm not so selfish and self-centered that in the midst of all of that, I was thinking, why would you send a text?
00:17:18.559 --> 00:17:20.480
No, no, no, I didn't mean it in that context.
00:17:20.640 --> 00:17:26.559
I meant in the sense that at a time when you all were still very close, it probably wouldn't have been a text.
00:17:26.640 --> 00:17:33.680
Yeah, it probably would have been a phone call, but because that the text speaks to the distance and the friendship too.
00:17:34.000 --> 00:17:34.319
Yeah.
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:44.960
Um but yeah, like it's it's interesting how uh dynamics shift and and relationships shift.
00:17:45.039 --> 00:17:45.599
You know what I mean?
00:17:45.680 --> 00:17:52.480
Like you just you sometimes don't expect to grow apart from certain people, you know what I'm saying?
00:17:52.640 --> 00:18:05.599
Because I remember I remember graduating from Hampton and I remember the very first card that someone gave me that caused me to cry was from a friend's mom.
00:18:05.759 --> 00:18:13.039
And um I actually write about it in my first book, and her mom had only met me in person, I think twice.
00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:15.759
Twice.
00:18:16.400 --> 00:18:24.240
But we were we would interact with each other because I was always at her daughter's apartment, right?
00:18:25.039 --> 00:18:28.799
And whenever her mom would call, I would be, hey, how you doing?
00:18:28.880 --> 00:18:31.839
I would I would answer the phone sometimes.
00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:34.319
And then sometimes she was like, Oh, is Craig there?
00:18:34.400 --> 00:18:35.039
How's Craig doing?
00:18:35.119 --> 00:18:36.480
Oh, she used to tell him I said hi.
00:18:37.039 --> 00:18:38.079
You know, that kind of thing.
00:18:38.240 --> 00:18:46.720
But I remember she came down for Parents' Weekend, and I just saw them walking by campus, and that was the first time that I saw her.
00:18:47.039 --> 00:18:48.160
And I said, Hey, how you doing?
00:18:48.240 --> 00:18:49.279
Nice to meet you, da-da-da.
00:18:49.440 --> 00:18:50.240
That was that.
00:18:50.559 --> 00:18:54.240
The next time, which was the second time I saw her, was when we graduated.
00:18:54.720 --> 00:18:59.920
And she said, Don't forget to come over to the apartment before you leave.
00:19:00.000 --> 00:19:07.680
Because once we graduated, once the ceremony was over, me and my family, we were getting on the road to go back to Maryland because I was moving to Atlanta two days later.
00:19:07.839 --> 00:19:14.960
And so her mom kept saying to me, do not leave here, excuse me, without giving me giving you this card.
00:19:15.039 --> 00:19:15.200
Yeah.
00:19:15.440 --> 00:19:17.200
And I was just like, okay, okay.
00:19:17.440 --> 00:19:22.000
And so I went over to the apartment and she said, Oh my god, you're here.
00:19:22.079 --> 00:19:23.200
She said, Stay right here.
00:19:23.279 --> 00:19:27.200
I have, she ran to the back, to the room, got the card.
00:19:27.279 --> 00:19:29.200
She came back, she said, it is the perfect card.
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:32.400
She held it, she said, This is the perfect card for you.
00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:37.039
She said, I had to, every single word had to fit you.
00:19:37.359 --> 00:19:44.000
And then, of course, her daughter said, Yeah, Craig, she she she studies a card, like it has to be the perfect card.
00:19:44.640 --> 00:19:48.640
So they were all over in the living room and they were watching something on TV.
00:19:48.799 --> 00:19:54.720
And um, and I was standing over by the kitchen and I opened up the card, and I described this in the first book, right?
00:19:54.880 --> 00:19:59.920
And it was a card, and it was like, it was like hundreds of candles on the front of the card.
00:20:00.000 --> 00:20:04.480
They were like yellow candles, and they were they were burning.
00:20:04.880 --> 00:20:14.240
And the the writing was in the soot, like the the black smoke that comes from the candle, the fire.
00:20:14.400 --> 00:20:16.000
So the writing was in that.
00:20:16.160 --> 00:20:28.160
And basically the card went on to say um, life is really hard, life is really challenging, but do not let life extinguish or burn your flame out.
00:20:28.240 --> 00:20:35.119
Don't let it flicker and fade away because of challenges, because of whatever, because the world needs your light.
00:20:35.359 --> 00:20:36.799
That was how the card ended.
00:20:36.960 --> 00:20:45.599
When I tell you before it was all said and done, I was backed in the corner up against that refrigerator in tears.
00:20:45.759 --> 00:20:48.559
And they looked, they said, Oh my god, he's crying.
00:20:49.200 --> 00:20:50.720
The first time that it ever happened to me.
00:20:50.880 --> 00:21:02.480
But I tailed it to say those tears were symbolic of yes, this woman who had only seen me twice in her entire life, thought this much of me.
00:21:02.640 --> 00:21:04.559
Like she saw something in me.
00:21:04.799 --> 00:21:08.640
And then over the years, you know, her daughter would say to me, My mother just loves you.
00:21:08.720 --> 00:21:11.119
She always says, You watch him, you better stay close to him.
00:21:11.200 --> 00:21:13.359
He's gonna be somebody, he's gonna make something of himself.
00:21:13.440 --> 00:21:15.519
She used to say that consistently.
00:21:15.759 --> 00:21:23.599
But it was it was the words in the card that this lady thought so much of me and she saw something in me after only meeting me twice.
00:21:23.759 --> 00:21:31.119
But then the other thought was the reality sunk in, it settled in.
00:21:31.200 --> 00:21:38.480
And it was just like, you're moving to Georgia, they're going back to New York, you got other friends who are going wherever they're going.
00:21:38.720 --> 00:21:40.720
You may never see these people again.
00:21:40.880 --> 00:21:41.519
Yeah.
00:21:42.000 --> 00:21:59.759
Because life happens, and you just never know what road life is gonna take you down, and and so those tears were for that too, because as close as we all were at Hampton and and and and and as as much as we promised that we were gonna stay in.
00:22:00.079 --> 00:22:05.519
Touch just like I said in the last episode, there were people who I was really close to in Hampton that I haven't talked to in years.
00:22:05.680 --> 00:22:07.839
I probably haven't talked to them since the last time I was at Homecoming.
00:22:08.000 --> 00:22:09.359
I haven't been at Homecoming in years.
00:22:09.519 --> 00:22:10.000
Yeah.
00:22:10.319 --> 00:22:14.400
But you you want that to be the case, but it just doesn't happen that way.
00:22:14.799 --> 00:22:16.559
I mean the promise of friendship, right?
00:22:16.720 --> 00:22:24.880
And there are some you know, that's why I told you I I I don't know if you remember.
00:22:25.039 --> 00:22:35.440
Well, I'm sure you remember that time when we had that disagreement where um I mean, I might as well go ahead and tell them the story.
00:22:35.680 --> 00:22:37.599
So Craig was coming to New York.
00:22:37.839 --> 00:22:41.039
Oh he um asked if he could stay at my house.
00:22:41.920 --> 00:22:43.279
Was I doing a signing or something?
00:22:43.519 --> 00:22:44.319
Or was I just coming?
00:22:44.400 --> 00:22:44.880
I can't remember.
00:22:45.039 --> 00:22:48.799
I can't remember, but I know that I was in a relationship at the time.
00:22:48.960 --> 00:22:52.079
The relationship was doing poorly.
00:22:52.240 --> 00:22:52.480
Uh-huh.
00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:53.519
We were struggling.
00:22:53.680 --> 00:22:54.000
Uh-huh.
00:22:54.319 --> 00:22:54.880
I lived.
00:22:55.200 --> 00:22:56.000
And y'all were living together.
00:22:56.160 --> 00:22:56.640
We were living together.
00:22:56.960 --> 00:22:57.599
He was living with you.
00:22:57.839 --> 00:22:58.480
Yes.
00:22:59.359 --> 00:23:01.359
Um because that matters.
00:23:01.839 --> 00:23:03.759
No, it does.
00:23:07.039 --> 00:23:08.160
She wasn't ready for that.
00:23:09.200 --> 00:23:09.839
But go ahead.
00:23:10.079 --> 00:23:11.599
He was living with me.
00:23:14.559 --> 00:23:19.839
Um, and you know, we were in a challenging place in our relationship.
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:25.599
And I, while I have a duplex apartment, my downstairs isn't really ready for company.
00:23:25.839 --> 00:23:26.799
For somebody's staying.
00:23:26.960 --> 00:23:27.359
Yeah.
00:23:27.599 --> 00:23:38.319
And so it would have literally been Craig like in my living room and me in my bedroom, and the way my house is set up, it wasn't conducive for somebody staying there.
00:23:38.720 --> 00:23:42.000
But I did say to Craig, but you can stay at my mother's house, right?
00:23:42.160 --> 00:23:46.000
And I was like, My mother will take you, like this, that, and the third, da-da-da.
00:23:46.400 --> 00:23:52.559
Anyway, Craig goes to a barbecue where some of my other friends are, and I wasn't there.
00:23:52.799 --> 00:23:57.839
And my understanding is that one of my friends proceeds to hold court on how to.
00:23:58.240 --> 00:23:59.759
And mind you, I had let it go.
00:23:59.839 --> 00:24:01.839
I I wasn't even thinking that deeply into it.
00:24:01.920 --> 00:24:04.079
I was like, well, listen, long as I had somewhere to stay.
00:24:04.400 --> 00:24:18.160
Well, I they proceeded to say basically the long and short of it was that I wasn't shit for not letting Craig stay at my house, and that I, that as close as Craig and I are, it's messed up that I didn't let him stay there.
00:24:18.319 --> 00:24:20.319
And that's only because of the boyfriend.
00:24:20.880 --> 00:24:26.240
Because of my guy that I wasn't gonna let him come over, and this, that, and the third.
00:24:26.319 --> 00:24:28.319
And they had all of this stuff to say about me.
00:24:28.480 --> 00:24:34.720
Then it led to other things about me that they felt like they hadn't held me accountable for years prior.
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:36.079
All of this stuff.
00:24:36.240 --> 00:24:38.799
Things that nobody had ever said to me.
00:24:39.599 --> 00:24:44.000
Nobody had ever said that they were upset with me about X, Y, or Z.
00:24:44.319 --> 00:24:44.880
But they used that word.
00:24:45.279 --> 00:24:49.519
Nor did they say that they thought it was foul that I didn't let Craig stay at my house.
00:24:49.759 --> 00:24:54.799
Nor did they know that I had also offered for you to stay at my mom's house and all of that shit.
00:24:55.839 --> 00:25:08.880
When I found out about this court that was being held on my behalf when I wasn't there, Craig and I had a very interesting conversation about it.
00:25:09.119 --> 00:25:21.599
And I said to him, in the future, anything that goes on between me and you, we're gonna talk about before we go to anybody else to have conversations about it.
00:25:21.759 --> 00:25:24.559
If you got an issue with me, we're talking about it.
00:25:24.640 --> 00:25:27.519
And I believe that that saves friendships.
00:25:28.480 --> 00:25:37.279
Why the fuck am I talking to a hundred uh a hundred other people about something that I got going on with you before I talk to you?
00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:39.200
That's not friendship to me.
00:25:40.000 --> 00:25:41.200
It's not now.
00:25:41.680 --> 00:25:54.240
If it's something that us as a collective friend Because the caveat is there are instances where friends talk amongst themselves about another friend where it's not gossip.
00:25:54.400 --> 00:25:54.720
Yes.
00:25:54.960 --> 00:25:57.839
Where it's like, I'm really concerned about such and such, such and such.
00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:05.680
It requires you to have conversations behind someone's back for their benefit.
00:26:05.839 --> 00:26:06.160
Yes.
00:26:06.400 --> 00:26:10.559
Which also came up in the conversation that we had um before.
00:26:10.880 --> 00:26:16.960
Yeah, about um the intervention that our other friend experienced with her friends.
00:26:17.200 --> 00:26:19.119
Um, but yeah, but go ahead.
00:26:19.359 --> 00:26:23.680
Yeah, so I think that um what's that thing say right there?
00:26:23.839 --> 00:26:24.799
Um communication.
00:26:25.119 --> 00:26:27.200
Communication is our partner, clarity is our friend.
00:26:27.359 --> 00:26:31.839
Yes, and I believe it, I believe in communication and clarity.
00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:40.240
I I think that the four agreements, which you will I will reference that probably once an episode, but the four agreements is a book that changed my life.
00:26:40.559 --> 00:26:45.920
And I believe that it's okay to ask questions of people.
00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:49.119
Assumptions will ruin everyone.
00:26:49.440 --> 00:26:50.240
That's one of the four agreements.
00:26:50.319 --> 00:26:50.799
Don't make assumptions.
00:26:51.039 --> 00:26:52.000
Don't make assumptions.
00:26:52.240 --> 00:27:00.160
And so I believe that at any point in any relationship, you should make room for clarifying questions.
00:27:00.720 --> 00:27:03.279
Some people be like, oh, you ask me, I'm just clarifying.
00:27:03.519 --> 00:27:05.759
I just want to make sure I'm understanding this correctly.
00:27:05.839 --> 00:27:07.920
Yeah like what is really happening here?
00:27:08.079 --> 00:27:09.039
What are you really saying?
00:27:09.200 --> 00:27:10.480
What is really the issue?
00:27:11.119 --> 00:27:13.680
And some people don't want to have those conversations.
00:27:13.759 --> 00:27:14.079
Yeah.
00:27:14.480 --> 00:27:26.000
And I'm not willing to lose you over something that could have been clarified through a conversation and a and a question.
00:27:26.480 --> 00:27:27.359
Yeah, yeah.
00:27:28.240 --> 00:27:36.880
It's interesting because when you were saying that, it made me think about like disputes or disagreements that I've had with Madison.
00:27:37.440 --> 00:27:42.160
Um, and we talked about this one um in one of our live shows recently.
00:27:44.160 --> 00:27:55.039
Um this was during the Cowboy Carter concert because of course she was on Renaissance on that album, on that song Cozy.
00:27:55.759 --> 00:28:08.720
And so um Beyoncé Parkwood, they invited her to Renaissance, and then when the Cowboy Carter tour came rolling around, they of course reached out to her and invited her to that.
00:28:08.960 --> 00:28:22.079
Well, concurrently, someone who works close to Beyonce is a fan of Fag Talk, loves me, reached out to me through some other people and were like, Is Craig coming to the show?
00:28:22.160 --> 00:28:23.279
I want him there.
00:28:24.400 --> 00:28:30.960
And so I said, Oh, sure, I I I hadn't planned on going, you know, but I will be in town, da-da-da-da.
00:28:31.440 --> 00:28:34.160
And so they they were arranging to get those tickets.
00:28:34.400 --> 00:28:35.680
Keep talking, I'm just trying to get comfortable.
00:28:35.920 --> 00:28:38.319
Yeah, they were arranging those tickets for me to come.
00:28:38.559 --> 00:28:43.359
Well, then Madison said, Hey, um, you gonna be back?
00:28:43.440 --> 00:28:45.279
Because I was out of the country, I was in Mexico.
00:28:45.359 --> 00:28:47.599
And so she was like, Are you gonna be back on Monday?
00:28:47.680 --> 00:28:50.640
I said, Yeah, I'll be back on Monday, I'll come back on Sunday, whatever day it was.
00:28:50.799 --> 00:28:52.079
I said, But I'll be back.
00:28:52.240 --> 00:28:54.000
And she said, You want to go to the show?
00:28:54.160 --> 00:29:00.880
Um, you know, but the way that she presented it, it was like, I got tickets, do you want to come?
00:29:01.039 --> 00:29:07.200
It wasn't like, oh, they reached out, because they reached out through somebody I know, but they also told her, we want Craig to come.
00:29:07.359 --> 00:29:11.119
But the way that she reached out to me was to say, Hey, I have tickets, do you want to come?
00:29:11.440 --> 00:29:13.680
She didn't present it like, oh, they asked for you.
00:29:13.839 --> 00:29:14.480
Yeah.
00:29:15.359 --> 00:29:16.799
So I said, Yeah, that's cool.
00:29:16.960 --> 00:29:17.680
Da-da-da-da.
00:29:18.240 --> 00:29:19.119
I'll come.
00:29:19.279 --> 00:29:24.240
So Madison says, Well, meet me at my house at 4.30.
00:29:24.319 --> 00:29:26.880
Now, mind you, the show ain't till 9 o'clock.
00:29:28.640 --> 00:29:30.799
Why I got to be at your house at 4.30?
00:29:31.519 --> 00:29:33.759
She said, because they're sending a car.
00:29:34.319 --> 00:29:56.640
And they were gonna bring us through the back, and there was somebody who was gonna meet us, and they were gonna put us in the um, it was some um uh suite, not where you're gonna watch the concert, but it was like a suite where she she was gonna have food and her drink, um, Sir David, they were gonna have like they wanna have Miss Cocktail, that kind of stuff.
00:29:56.799 --> 00:29:59.839
Like her guests were gonna be in this specific area.
00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:01.519
So I said, okay.
00:30:02.400 --> 00:30:04.960
But I'm like, but why I got to be there at 4 30?
00:30:05.359 --> 00:30:09.759
So anyway, I said to Madison, this is before I moved.
00:30:10.000 --> 00:30:13.920
I said to Madison, well, do you and this is before I knew that they were sending a car.
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:15.279
Let me let me backtrack.
00:30:15.599 --> 00:30:18.400
So I said, well, you have to pass my.
00:30:18.720 --> 00:30:20.319
I thought she was just gonna get a car and go.
00:30:20.480 --> 00:30:23.839
And I said, Well, how about I chip in with you for the car?
00:30:24.079 --> 00:30:26.240
Do you mind on the way?
00:30:26.400 --> 00:30:28.559
Because you she literally got to pass my house.
00:30:29.200 --> 00:30:31.119
That other house is right off the highway.
00:30:31.279 --> 00:30:32.240
You gotta pass that.
00:30:32.319 --> 00:30:36.079
There's no way she can get from her house to that venue without passing my house.
00:30:36.319 --> 00:30:39.839
And so I said, Well, do you mind scooping me up on the way?
00:30:40.000 --> 00:30:46.960
Because it doesn't really make sense for me to come outside of the city, yeah, only to pass my house and go downtown.
00:30:47.039 --> 00:30:47.359
Right.
00:30:47.599 --> 00:30:53.039
And then the show is over at 12, 1 o'clock at night, pass my house again to go home.
00:30:53.279 --> 00:31:00.880
I mean, go back, you know, get go go home, go to your house, get in my car, and then come back to the city.
00:31:01.119 --> 00:31:05.599
And so she was like, No, um, they're sending the car from me.
00:31:05.680 --> 00:31:08.960
I mean, it was just this whole thing, it was just like this barrage of text messages.
00:31:09.119 --> 00:31:15.519
I found out the other day that she wasn't actually sending the text, that it was Jaya, the one who does her hair.
00:31:15.680 --> 00:31:18.799
But the bottom line is, again, it was too much to fucking text.
00:31:18.960 --> 00:31:20.480
You should have just picked up the phone.
00:31:20.720 --> 00:31:36.640
So, anyway, long story short, we kind of got into it because I felt like in that moment, you were trying to make this thing about your invitation as if these people hadn't said, Oh, well, we want him to come too.
00:31:36.799 --> 00:31:39.920
And it was like, Well, they sent for me, then da-da-da-da.
00:31:40.400 --> 00:31:47.200
Because she said all of that, whether it was Jaya typing or not, she narrated or she uh dictated what the text should be.
00:31:47.359 --> 00:31:47.759
Yeah.
00:31:48.000 --> 00:31:50.240
And so um it was just this whole thing.
00:31:50.319 --> 00:31:53.839
And so I said, you know what, Madison, I don't have to go.
00:31:54.160 --> 00:31:55.279
I'm not going.
00:31:55.519 --> 00:32:00.720
And I laid my ass down at my house because I had just come back from out of the country the day before.
00:32:00.960 --> 00:32:06.559
And so I was in the bed, and then I had even said at that point, I said, you know what?
00:32:06.720 --> 00:32:08.799
I really think that we should just stop doing fag talk.
00:32:08.880 --> 00:32:17.200
I said, because I had just gotten to a point where it was just so many instances, but this is really, again, this is a conversation about friendship.
00:32:18.000 --> 00:32:29.519
I had really gotten to a point where I felt like there were so many instances where she wanted to center herself, and I just was tired.
00:32:29.599 --> 00:32:35.680
I I was tired, going back to that last episode, I was just tired of what's the phrase I said.
00:32:35.920 --> 00:32:36.720
Trying to get past it.
00:32:36.960 --> 00:32:39.839
I was tired of trying to get past stuff.
00:32:40.640 --> 00:32:48.799
And so, for example, when we first started Fag Talk, she'd be sitting in the center of the desk.
00:32:48.960 --> 00:32:52.480
And these are all small things that I'm I don't really give a damn about.
00:32:52.720 --> 00:32:53.920
And I'm sitting to the side.
00:32:54.000 --> 00:32:57.119
Now, mind you, the audience, they commenting, why is Craig sitting to the side?
00:32:57.680 --> 00:32:58.880
Why don't you move over?
00:32:58.960 --> 00:33:00.559
We can't even really see him.
00:33:01.119 --> 00:33:02.400
So there was that.
00:33:02.559 --> 00:33:11.759
And then when Fag's talk started, it was um, I was she was introducing me and I will come out, and da da da.
00:33:12.480 --> 00:33:14.720
And now it's oh well, introduce me.
00:33:14.960 --> 00:33:16.000
So it was that.
00:33:16.240 --> 00:33:20.400
And then it was it was just so many things that just kept accumulating.
00:33:20.559 --> 00:33:20.720
Right.
00:33:21.279 --> 00:33:22.480
Eventually y'all talked about it.
00:33:22.720 --> 00:33:25.680
Eventually we talked about it, but it wasn't until this car cowboy Carter.
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:30.160
So it was it was the cowboy carter thing that happened that provoked the conversation.
00:33:30.720 --> 00:33:35.119
And so why did it take you so long to say something?
00:33:35.359 --> 00:33:40.960
Well, because in my mind, like we said in the last episode, we make excuses and we and we rationalize for the other person.
00:33:41.119 --> 00:33:47.599
Well, you know, she's the star, she's used to doing things on her own, she's not used to being online with other people.
00:33:47.759 --> 00:33:59.359
So I'm I'm just gonna give her time to kind of get used to, she's not used to somebody coming online with her and the fans of the show loving somebody else too.
00:33:59.519 --> 00:34:02.079
She's used to getting all of the adoration.
00:34:02.480 --> 00:34:05.839
So I just kept excusing all of this behavior.
00:34:06.079 --> 00:34:10.719
And then it just got to the point where I was fucking tired of it, and it was this fucking cowboy carter shit that did it.
00:34:11.119 --> 00:34:12.719
And I said, you know what, Madison?
00:34:13.360 --> 00:34:15.119
You go to the Cowboy Carter show.
00:34:15.199 --> 00:34:16.320
I'ma stay my ass home.
00:34:16.400 --> 00:34:17.199
I don't have to go.
00:34:18.159 --> 00:34:20.239
And I said, and I'm not doing fag talk anymore.
00:34:20.320 --> 00:34:26.880
I said, we can go ahead and finish these last few shows that we, because we already had shows scheduled to do live shows.
00:34:27.039 --> 00:34:29.679
And I said, we'll do those shows, and and that's gonna be that.
00:34:29.760 --> 00:34:33.039
I said, because I am really tired of your shit.
00:34:33.199 --> 00:34:33.840
Oh, okay.
00:34:33.920 --> 00:34:34.880
You were tired of her show.
00:34:35.119 --> 00:34:35.599
I was tired of it.
00:34:36.079 --> 00:34:36.960
Yeah, like the show.
00:34:37.360 --> 00:34:39.679
I was tired, yeah, I wasn't tired of fag talk.
00:34:39.760 --> 00:34:45.280
I was tired of the shit that came with me having to work with her to do fag talk.
00:34:45.440 --> 00:34:53.519
Because it was just so, so centered on her and what you know, it was just so much, and I'm just like, okay, I I yeah, this is a lot.
00:34:54.480 --> 00:34:58.400
So she called me.
00:34:58.559 --> 00:35:00.559
But she didn't respond to the text.
00:35:01.599 --> 00:35:08.000
And then like two hours later, she sent me a she she she sent me a text and said, okay, whatever you think is best.
00:35:08.719 --> 00:35:10.079
And I didn't respond.
00:35:10.400 --> 00:35:12.239
And my red receipts are on.
00:35:12.719 --> 00:35:14.079
So she knew I saw it.
00:35:15.199 --> 00:35:20.320
So then she called me on FaceTime, and I'm in the bed, I'm laid out, I'm about to take a nap.
00:35:21.440 --> 00:35:33.679
And she said, Um, okay, so um I know, and she kept repeating this part, and so I knew that she was trying to find the words to to get to, are you sure this is what you want to do?
00:35:33.760 --> 00:35:33.920
Yeah.
00:35:34.159 --> 00:35:36.480
Because she was like, Because she's a Libra.
00:35:36.639 --> 00:35:36.880
Yes.
00:35:37.119 --> 00:35:38.960
And you're a stubborn fucking Taurus.
00:35:39.519 --> 00:35:40.880
And so are the Libras.
00:35:41.360 --> 00:35:42.320
It shows differently.
00:35:43.440 --> 00:35:44.639
She's a Libra.
00:35:44.880 --> 00:35:50.639
Um, and so she kept saying, Okay, well, if this is what you want, um, I think we need to make an announcement.
00:35:50.800 --> 00:35:53.360
We need to let the fans know that we're going our separate ways.
00:35:54.719 --> 00:35:56.960
I said, Okay, that's fine, we can do that.
00:35:58.000 --> 00:35:59.440
And then I was silent.
00:35:59.679 --> 00:36:01.039
And she repeated it again.
00:36:01.199 --> 00:36:03.119
Yeah, you know, so we can go ahead and do that.
00:36:03.199 --> 00:36:07.599
And so she just kept saying, I said, okay, well, and she said, I think we should go ahead and finish out the shows that we have.
00:36:07.679 --> 00:36:09.039
I said, Yeah, we can do that too.
00:36:09.119 --> 00:36:10.639
I'm I'm okay with that.
00:36:12.079 --> 00:36:14.079
And then she kind of repeated again.
00:36:14.239 --> 00:36:17.280
She said, so so you're not, you, you don't want to go to the show anymore?
00:36:17.360 --> 00:36:21.039
You don't want to do, you don't want to do fag talk anymore, and da-da-da-da.
00:36:21.440 --> 00:36:26.960
I said, Madison, and that's when I just it was like it just, it just, I, it, I combusted.
00:36:27.599 --> 00:36:29.119
And I just, I went off.
00:36:29.199 --> 00:36:31.679
And I said, I am sick of your shit.
00:36:31.840 --> 00:36:35.199
I said, I'm so sick of everything having to be about you.
00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:38.400
You know, I said, you don't know how to be a friend to me.
00:36:38.559 --> 00:36:40.480
I said, I am a friend to you.
00:36:40.719 --> 00:36:42.320
And I said, I'm so tired of making it.
00:36:42.719 --> 00:36:44.480
And she was just sitting there looking at me, stunned.
00:36:44.719 --> 00:36:47.679
Like her mouth was like literally oh, because I went off.
00:36:47.840 --> 00:36:49.280
Like I was on 3,000.
00:36:49.519 --> 00:36:51.840
Like I was, I was angry.
00:36:52.000 --> 00:36:58.960
Like I was at that point where I was so pissed that I could have cried because I was just that pissed.
00:36:59.280 --> 00:37:02.639
And I said, and the fact that you don't see it, you don't even get it.
00:37:02.800 --> 00:37:06.960
I said, you don't even recognize you that that I'm a friend to you.
00:37:07.119 --> 00:37:08.400
I said, I've been a friend to you.
00:37:08.480 --> 00:37:10.079
You haven't been a friend to me.
00:37:10.480 --> 00:37:13.840
And so, um, and I gave her a bunch of examples.
00:37:14.719 --> 00:37:26.159
And so then she finally, I paused, and she she she paused, and then she said, I craig, I mean, you know, she says myrtle.
00:37:26.400 --> 00:37:29.360
Like, myrtle is her little term of endearment for everybody.
00:37:29.440 --> 00:37:30.880
So she said, Myrtle.
00:37:31.199 --> 00:37:34.480
Like, I know I'm fucked up.
00:37:34.639 --> 00:37:44.320
And she said, and I but but the way that I show my appreciation and and my how I love you, and is by helping you put money in your pocket.
00:37:44.480 --> 00:37:46.159
And she said, and I know that might be fucked up.
00:37:46.239 --> 00:37:48.400
I said, but some it's not always about that for me.
00:37:48.639 --> 00:37:52.320
Yeah, but this goes back to what you said before, and I don't know why this is making me emotional.
00:37:52.800 --> 00:37:53.840
I see your eyes tearing up.
00:37:54.079 --> 00:37:59.760
This goes back to what you said before about sometimes we have to teach people how to treat us.
00:38:00.079 --> 00:38:00.639
Yes.
00:38:00.880 --> 00:38:02.079
And my Angela.
00:38:02.400 --> 00:38:04.239
We only we only know what we know.
00:38:04.480 --> 00:38:05.280
Yes, right?
00:38:05.440 --> 00:38:07.199
And until you know more.
00:38:07.440 --> 00:38:07.760
Yeah.
00:38:08.159 --> 00:38:14.559
And that is that's a grace that each of you gave each other as you were as you are developing.
00:38:15.119 --> 00:38:16.239
And figuring the friendship out.
00:38:16.400 --> 00:38:16.559
Yes.
00:38:16.800 --> 00:38:17.440
Yeah, yeah.
00:38:17.760 --> 00:38:28.880
And so, you know, I mean, you know, when you said that she was like Myrtle, because that to me, that means that she was in a place of love.
00:38:28.960 --> 00:38:31.440
She was like, She was trying to get me back, she was trying to pull me back.
00:38:31.519 --> 00:38:32.400
Because I'm telling you, I was up here.
00:38:32.800 --> 00:38:37.119
Yeah, she and and she was so busy being her and living, doing her.
00:38:37.519 --> 00:38:44.400
She had no idea that what you were that she was landing on you the way that she was landing on you.
00:38:44.719 --> 00:38:46.719
Because intent and impact are two different things.
00:38:46.880 --> 00:38:47.679
Two different things.
00:38:48.000 --> 00:38:57.360
I have that conversation all the time in my friends, in some of my friendships, about the importance of understanding your intent might be one thing, but the impact is something completely different.
00:38:57.760 --> 00:39:07.519
Because I even you gotta remember this reaches all the way back to when I was the show runner for her show, Queen Supreme Court.
00:39:07.599 --> 00:39:07.920
Yeah.
00:39:08.159 --> 00:39:10.239
Before I was in front of the camera.
00:39:10.719 --> 00:39:15.280
And so it was just like years of me feeling like you just dogpiling.
00:39:16.159 --> 00:39:20.079
And I told her in that conversation, I said, you give a fuck about this celebrity fame shit.
00:39:20.159 --> 00:39:21.440
I don't give a fuck about none of that.
00:39:22.239 --> 00:39:23.840
I have never cared about that.
00:39:24.000 --> 00:39:25.840
I said, that's what you care about.
00:39:26.079 --> 00:39:27.360
You wanted to be a star.
00:39:27.519 --> 00:39:29.360
Like she grew up wanting to be a star.
00:39:29.440 --> 00:39:31.519
I said, that was never my aspiration.
00:39:32.159 --> 00:39:39.920
And so I think she heard me for the first time, and I said, and you've never even recognized that I've been a friend to you.
00:39:40.159 --> 00:39:46.159
I said, like, you've just, you, you, you just, you just do these things and you say these things, and then you just go.
00:39:46.320 --> 00:39:49.199
And I said, and I've just been a consistent friend to you.
00:39:49.760 --> 00:39:56.880
And so she apologized, and so um, she said, so are you coming to the show?
00:39:57.119 --> 00:39:58.960
And I said, Oh my god.
00:39:59.679 --> 00:40:06.239
And then she's and then she explained, that's when she explained, Myrtle, they're sending the car here.
00:40:06.400 --> 00:40:08.320
She said, I don't want to put those people through no trouble.
00:40:08.400 --> 00:40:10.159
I don't want to be like, well, hey, can we stop here?
00:40:10.320 --> 00:40:12.159
I said, that's all the fuck you had to say.
00:40:12.639 --> 00:40:17.360
I said, from my perspective, you were getting in a car and we were going to the show.
00:40:18.159 --> 00:40:22.480
I I didn't know that they had assigned a car, had a driver coming to get you, da-da-da.
00:40:22.719 --> 00:40:23.440
I didn't know all of that.
00:40:23.519 --> 00:40:24.639
I said, you could have said that.
00:40:24.719 --> 00:40:28.480
Her thing, I didn't have to explain that because this is my situation.
00:40:29.679 --> 00:40:32.639
I said, but because we're friends, you should have explained it.
00:40:32.800 --> 00:40:33.679
Well, that's the thing.
00:40:33.760 --> 00:40:40.400
That's and I said to her, because we're friends, I said, because again, yes, they invited you, but they also invited me.
00:40:40.559 --> 00:40:42.000
I could have just met you there.
00:40:42.559 --> 00:40:44.159
If it was all, you know what I'm saying?
00:40:44.239 --> 00:40:48.000
I said, but it was the fact that you felt like you were explaining yourself to me.
00:40:48.079 --> 00:40:50.800
I said, you weren't explaining, you were having a conversation with your friend.
00:40:50.960 --> 00:40:52.800
What part of that don't you get?
00:40:53.119 --> 00:41:01.280
So it was just, you know, but again, as friendship, friends, you have to have the tough conversations.
00:41:01.440 --> 00:41:03.440
And I think a lot of people avoid the tough conversations.
00:41:03.679 --> 00:41:06.880
And there are friends that will will tell you, I don't want to talk about that.
00:41:07.039 --> 00:41:07.360
Exactly.
00:41:07.440 --> 00:41:09.440
And then they won't talk about it for months.
00:41:09.679 --> 00:41:10.159
Or ever.
00:41:10.559 --> 00:41:12.480
And then what happens during all that time?
00:41:12.639 --> 00:41:18.639
You make up all these stories in your mind about the way things are or why you said something, and da-da-da-da-da, and this, that, and the third.
00:41:18.719 --> 00:41:19.280
I had a friend tell me.
00:41:19.599 --> 00:41:21.360
And the friendship becomes fragmented.
00:41:21.679 --> 00:41:22.559
Fragmented.
00:41:22.719 --> 00:41:24.400
But you had a friend that tells you what?
00:41:25.119 --> 00:41:29.280
I was asking some questions about some business stuff, and I was told don't nickel and dime me.
00:41:29.360 --> 00:41:29.840
And I was like.
00:41:30.079 --> 00:41:31.599
I remember you telling me that.
00:41:32.239 --> 00:41:36.079
First of all, if anybody knows me, I am not a nickel and dime type of friend.
00:41:36.719 --> 00:41:38.320
I I I'm just not.
00:41:39.840 --> 00:41:44.800
And I was so I was hurt by that.
00:41:45.519 --> 00:41:58.559
You know, and then there were other things that were said and done, and I um said to my friend.
00:41:59.760 --> 00:42:01.360
I don't feel safe.
00:42:03.280 --> 00:42:17.760
Like, I don't feel safe in this friendship that I can be a hundred percent me with you and not be judged for it or be accused of doing something else, or you know, like this is not a safe space for me.
00:42:18.480 --> 00:42:20.400
And they didn't like that.
00:42:20.800 --> 00:42:22.239
But that was the truth.
00:42:22.639 --> 00:42:24.400
And it was also the mirror.
00:42:25.519 --> 00:42:37.280
Well, I think that we should be able to have honest conversations with our friends, and we should be able to try and get past it.
00:42:38.320 --> 00:42:50.719
And um Because I think sometimes those hard conversations, not sometimes, those hard conversations are benchmarks that are designed to either um buttress the relationship or break it.
00:42:52.400 --> 00:42:53.599
One or the other.
00:42:53.920 --> 00:42:56.880
It's either designed to strengthen it or break it.
00:42:57.920 --> 00:43:12.800
I mean, sometimes you sit back and look back and you realize that so many things have happened, that you're tired of trying to get past it.
00:43:13.360 --> 00:43:20.639
Well, you know, in the last episode I kind of glossed over this, but just so you know the time has run out.
00:43:21.920 --> 00:43:23.920
Well, I have a few more things I want to say.
00:43:27.760 --> 00:43:33.440
Wait, I gotta tell y'all that when he says he got a few more things he wants to say, he has a few more things he wants to say.
00:43:33.599 --> 00:43:38.400
But just as I was saying in the last episode, I was like, oh, I'm kind of like getting comfortable with being in front of the camera.
00:43:38.480 --> 00:43:39.199
I'm not used to it.
00:43:39.519 --> 00:43:43.199
This man has been practicing for the camera for as long as I've known him.
00:43:43.360 --> 00:43:44.719
And that goes all the way back to Hampton.
00:43:45.119 --> 00:43:52.079
I mean, he has practiced his wording, his diction, his posture, you know, his posing.
00:43:52.400 --> 00:43:59.840
And and you know, and to that point, because I just said a moment ago, I've never wanted uh celebrities starting them, any of that.
00:44:01.360 --> 00:44:09.519
But the fact that I've been preparing in front of the camera, it wasn't for that though, it was for I always knew that I was gonna I was gonna be interviewed.
00:44:10.159 --> 00:44:12.480
I was gonna be interviewed, I was gonna become an opera's kid.
00:44:12.719 --> 00:44:14.639
I always knew you were going to have something to say.
00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:15.039
Yeah.
00:44:15.440 --> 00:44:15.760
Yes.
00:44:16.000 --> 00:44:16.239
Yeah.
00:44:16.480 --> 00:44:18.320
You knew you would be speaking somewhere.
00:44:18.480 --> 00:44:19.039
Somewhere.
00:44:19.199 --> 00:44:19.599
Yeah.
00:44:19.760 --> 00:44:20.400
About something.
00:44:20.800 --> 00:44:21.280
About something.
00:44:21.679 --> 00:44:22.159
To somebody.
00:44:22.239 --> 00:44:22.960
I don't know how many people.
00:44:24.719 --> 00:44:25.840
It was the opera's couch.
00:44:26.079 --> 00:44:27.360
It was over the couch.
00:44:27.519 --> 00:44:27.760
Right.
00:44:27.840 --> 00:44:28.320
Yes.
00:44:28.559 --> 00:44:32.559
But so in the last episode, I kind of hinted to it, but I didn't really go into it.
00:44:32.800 --> 00:44:36.719
So I have uh a friend.
00:44:37.599 --> 00:44:39.360
I'm just gonna tell one of the stories.
00:44:39.519 --> 00:44:44.159
I have a friend that I had been friends with for a very, very long, all the way back to 99.
00:44:44.320 --> 00:44:45.840
Yeah, just go ahead and turn that over.
00:44:46.079 --> 00:44:47.920
All the way back to 99.
00:44:48.559 --> 00:44:55.679
And I admired him because he was a writer for this little magazine that used to exist.
00:44:56.000 --> 00:44:59.039
It was a little magazine that used to circulate in the gay community.
00:44:59.199 --> 00:45:01.280
And he was a writer in this magazine.
00:45:02.000 --> 00:45:05.360
And I read this article that just kind of resonated with me at the time.
00:45:05.440 --> 00:45:08.079
That's when I was dating the guy who was HIV positive.
00:45:08.239 --> 00:45:09.760
I write about it in my first book.
00:45:09.920 --> 00:45:26.000
But I was writing, I was dealing with, I was dating him at the time, and this friend of mine had written this article about being HIV positive and how when he was coming up, um, they used to laugh at people that they suspected were HIV positive, and they used to call it the giggles.
00:45:26.079 --> 00:45:29.360
And they was like, Oh, she likes she got the giggles, and they would just bust out laughing.
00:45:29.519 --> 00:45:31.599
And the way that the article people are so mean.
00:45:31.760 --> 00:45:38.159
Right, and the way that the article ended, he said, and now here I sit with the giggles, and nobody's laughing because nothing's funny.
00:45:38.719 --> 00:45:41.599
And so that art, because you know, again, we have a love for words.
00:45:41.920 --> 00:45:45.440
So, and then I ended up becoming friends with him.
00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:47.519
And I said, Oh my god, that article that you wrote.
00:45:47.599 --> 00:45:51.280
Because again, it resonated with me because I was dating somebody who was positive at the time.
00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:56.400
And so we became friends and we were friends for a long time.
00:45:56.559 --> 00:45:59.440
He's a beautiful person, thoughtful person.
00:45:59.599 --> 00:46:27.599
When my mother passed away in October 2024, he sent out a group text to our friends, or mostly my friends, it was people he knows as well, but to my friends and said, Hey, I think it would be a good idea if we um all chip in, get some groceries for Craig, send the money to Jack, because Jack cooks for me and she's a chef, and he was like, She can go and get the stuff because she knows what Craig eats.
00:46:28.400 --> 00:46:30.880
And so um, what do you guys think about that?
00:46:31.039 --> 00:46:35.760
So that when he comes home from Baltimore, oh I remember that.
00:46:36.000 --> 00:46:38.800
He can focus on grieving and not have to worry about going to the grocery store.
00:46:39.519 --> 00:46:41.679
I thought that was a beautiful thing, right?
00:46:41.840 --> 00:46:43.440
So that's the kind of person he is.
00:46:43.519 --> 00:46:45.360
He's just a beautiful, thoughtful person.
00:46:45.599 --> 00:46:46.079
Sure, excuse me.
00:46:46.320 --> 00:46:46.559
Bless you.
00:46:47.119 --> 00:46:47.840
Thank you.
00:46:48.239 --> 00:46:54.159
Well, Rewind, I don't know, 15 years ago.
00:46:54.400 --> 00:46:59.280
Um, we were living in different places.
00:46:59.440 --> 00:47:03.920
He was living here in Atlanta, but we were in a space where we used to talk consistently on the phone.
00:47:04.239 --> 00:47:06.480
And one day I had called him.
00:47:06.719 --> 00:47:10.719
Now it might you this is like 15, maybe 20 years ago now.
00:47:11.039 --> 00:47:17.119
I called him one day, and I don't think FaceTime existed.
00:47:17.599 --> 00:47:21.039
I'm sure FaceTime didn't exist, and Uber didn't exist.
00:47:21.360 --> 00:47:25.199
I called his phone and he didn't answer.
00:47:25.519 --> 00:47:27.199
And so I was like, oh, okay.
00:47:27.360 --> 00:47:28.559
So I walked away from the phone.
00:47:28.639 --> 00:47:30.000
He called right back.
00:47:30.400 --> 00:47:32.159
I picked up the phone.
00:47:32.480 --> 00:47:34.239
I said, hey, he said, hello?
00:47:34.639 --> 00:47:36.079
I said, hey, what's going on?
00:47:36.239 --> 00:47:39.119
I'm in DC, I'm trying to trying to hail a cab.
00:47:39.199 --> 00:47:40.159
What's going on?
00:47:40.400 --> 00:47:41.599
I said, oh nothing.
00:47:41.679 --> 00:47:44.639
I was just, mind you, we were in communication all the time.
00:47:44.719 --> 00:47:48.480
We would talk on the phone, but I hadn't talked to him in a few days, so I just reached out and gave him a call.
00:47:48.559 --> 00:47:50.000
I didn't know he was going to DC.
00:47:50.559 --> 00:47:53.760
And I called and he answered and was like, I'm in, I'm trying to catch a cab.
00:47:54.000 --> 00:47:54.480
What's going on?
00:47:54.559 --> 00:47:55.119
I said, oh nothing.
00:47:55.199 --> 00:47:55.679
I was just calling.
00:47:55.840 --> 00:47:57.360
Okay, well, I'll call you when I get back to Atlanta.
00:47:57.519 --> 00:47:59.280
He hung, he was so nasty.
00:48:00.480 --> 00:48:03.199
And so he hung up and he never called me back.
00:48:03.360 --> 00:48:07.679
He never called back when he came back to Atlanta, and I never called him because he was so nasty.
00:48:09.440 --> 00:48:14.639
Fast forward, he moved out of the city, moved somewhere else, came back to Atlanta.
00:48:14.960 --> 00:48:17.519
Now I'm at the other house.
00:48:17.599 --> 00:48:20.639
I just bought the other house in the app next door.
00:48:22.000 --> 00:48:25.599
I'd logged into next door, and that was not my new neighborhood.
00:48:25.679 --> 00:48:31.599
And so anybody on the app who lives in that neighborhood will see this person now lives in your neighborhood.
00:48:31.679 --> 00:48:34.960
So he saw that I lived in that neighborhood and he lived right around the corner.
00:48:35.119 --> 00:48:38.800
So he reached out to one of our friends and said, I think Craig lives in my neighborhood now.
00:48:38.960 --> 00:48:39.519
Oh, uh.
00:48:39.920 --> 00:48:40.079
Yes.
00:48:40.239 --> 00:48:43.440
And so the other friend said, Oh, yeah, he just bought a house over there, da-da-da-da.
00:48:43.840 --> 00:48:46.159
Now, my number has been the same since 1999.
00:48:46.239 --> 00:48:47.280
I told you about that in the last episode.
00:48:48.480 --> 00:48:51.199
I told them that in the last episode, because I need them to be clear.
00:48:51.440 --> 00:48:55.039
Instead of him reaching out to me over the phone or text, he sent you a DM.
00:48:55.199 --> 00:48:56.880
He sends me a DM on Instagram.
00:48:57.119 --> 00:49:03.280
Hey, um, I don't remember what he said, but it was something like, hey neighbor, I think you're, you know, I think you live in my neighborhood, or something like that.
00:49:03.360 --> 00:49:04.559
I ignored it.
00:49:05.280 --> 00:49:06.480
He's so particular.
00:49:06.639 --> 00:49:08.079
The man reached out.
00:49:08.400 --> 00:49:13.199
Because my thing is, even if you didn't have my number any longer, you reached out to a mutual friend of ours.
00:49:13.280 --> 00:49:14.239
You knew he had it.
00:49:14.400 --> 00:49:16.960
You could have said, Oh, give me, give me Greg's number.
00:49:17.199 --> 00:49:18.880
Craig, maybe he was just thinking about you.
00:49:18.960 --> 00:49:19.920
I mean, here I go making it.
00:49:20.159 --> 00:49:20.320
Go ahead.
00:49:20.639 --> 00:49:21.840
Yeah, that's that passive aggressive shit.
00:49:21.920 --> 00:49:23.199
Now I'm not, I'm not gonna do all of that.
00:49:23.360 --> 00:49:24.320
Is that passive aggressive?
00:49:24.559 --> 00:49:25.119
It's something.
00:49:25.280 --> 00:49:26.239
Because he didn't call you.
00:49:26.480 --> 00:49:28.719
No, because he didn't just he could have sent me a text.
00:49:28.960 --> 00:49:30.480
But what's the difference between okay?
00:49:30.880 --> 00:49:32.880
Because who's to say I'm gonna see that DM?
00:49:34.320 --> 00:49:34.639
Okay.
00:49:36.400 --> 00:49:38.320
But what are you saying right now?
00:49:38.559 --> 00:49:41.119
He should have motherfucking used my cellular device.
00:49:41.360 --> 00:49:46.800
So anyway, I think I responded to him like days later or something.
00:49:47.039 --> 00:49:50.400
And so then at some point we reunited.
00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:53.599
Now we're seeing each other all the time because we live around the corner from each other.
00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:57.599
I'm having things at my house, he has things at his house, we're going back and forth.
00:49:57.840 --> 00:50:02.719
Um he helped me plant a tree in the yard over there at the other house.
00:50:02.800 --> 00:50:03.920
Like we're in touch.
00:50:04.079 --> 00:50:12.480
And then, like I said, moving up to when my mom passed, he reached out to the friends and said, Hey, let's do this for Craig, let's get these groceries.
00:50:12.880 --> 00:50:27.280
And so, like coming up to the holidays, like around November, another mutual friend of ours and I were running around getting furniture and stuff for this house.
00:50:27.519 --> 00:50:32.239
And so he had been trying to get in touch with her, apparently.
00:50:32.719 --> 00:50:34.480
And I don't know if she missed his call.
00:50:34.559 --> 00:50:35.760
I don't know what happened with that.
00:50:35.920 --> 00:50:40.800
All I know is she relayed to me that she had been trying to get in touch with him.
00:50:40.960 --> 00:50:43.440
He had not returned any of her calls or texts.
00:50:43.599 --> 00:50:49.440
This went on for like a week or two, and he never responded.
00:50:49.519 --> 00:50:57.679
And she was getting alarmed because he has, I think, two suicide attempts in his history.
00:50:57.920 --> 00:51:02.880
And so she was starting to panic, thinking, well, and he suffers from seasonal depression.
00:51:02.960 --> 00:51:04.480
So, like I said, this is around November.
00:51:04.559 --> 00:51:06.559
So she's like, okay, well, is something going on with him?
00:51:06.719 --> 00:51:10.559
Like she's really nervous, you know, and mind she lives 45 minutes away.
00:51:10.719 --> 00:51:14.000
So it wasn't like, well, let me just go around the corner and knock on his door.
00:51:14.159 --> 00:51:16.960
So she's thinking something is happening.
00:51:17.280 --> 00:51:28.400
Well, he's upset because he said to her, Well, you didn't have time to answer my call because you were too busy running around town with Craig and your friend up in New York.
00:51:29.199 --> 00:51:30.800
And she's like, Wait, what?
00:51:31.599 --> 00:51:38.719
And so then at some point when I came back from Africa, because I was in Africa all of December, when I came back from Africa, I reached out to him.
00:51:38.800 --> 00:51:40.639
I went, I gave him a call.
00:51:41.039 --> 00:51:43.039
Because that didn't have anything to do with me.
00:51:43.119 --> 00:51:51.199
So I went on and gave him a call, just jumping back into the routine to see how his holidays were and tell him how my holiday was.
00:51:51.679 --> 00:51:54.960
And you know how you know somebody sends you the voicemail?
00:51:55.760 --> 00:51:57.840
And then went straight to that voicemail.
00:51:58.000 --> 00:52:01.519
And so I said, Oh, I guess he's upset with me too.
00:52:01.760 --> 00:52:05.760
And I invited him to my housewarming, I invited him to the luau.
00:52:06.000 --> 00:52:10.639
He hasn't responded to any of those messages, he hasn't returned any call, and I just haven't To this day.
00:52:10.880 --> 00:52:12.159
To this day.
00:52:12.559 --> 00:52:21.039
And because of what we went through 15, 20 years ago, plus this, I just don't have it in me to be trying to.
00:52:21.280 --> 00:52:22.480
I'm just tired, I'm tired.
00:52:22.639 --> 00:52:23.760
I wonder what's going on.
00:52:23.920 --> 00:52:24.559
I don't know.
00:52:24.719 --> 00:52:25.360
You don't wonder.
00:52:25.519 --> 00:52:26.719
You overwondering.
00:52:26.960 --> 00:52:30.480
I am overwondering because he's answered other friends' calls.
00:52:31.119 --> 00:52:32.480
He has anybody asked him?
00:52:32.719 --> 00:52:37.039
Torrance reached out to him, Ryan has reached out to him, he's answered their calls, responded to this.
00:52:37.280 --> 00:52:39.920
Has anybody asked him what's going on with you and Craig?
00:52:41.119 --> 00:52:41.440
No.
00:52:41.760 --> 00:52:45.840
Because they're over, they're tired of trying to get past it too, for the both of you.
00:52:46.159 --> 00:52:46.719
Maybe so.
00:52:46.880 --> 00:52:48.400
But there's nothing going on between us.
00:52:48.480 --> 00:52:51.199
I mean There's nothing going on on your side.
00:52:51.440 --> 00:52:53.039
There's something going on on his side.
00:52:53.280 --> 00:52:53.840
Right.
00:52:54.079 --> 00:52:59.679
And so it's just been this cycle of this, and and not just a cycle with hey friend, give him a call.
00:52:59.920 --> 00:53:01.920
And not just a cycle with me.
00:53:02.880 --> 00:53:08.480
This is a cycle and a pattern that's happened with several of his friends, and I just don't want to be a part of that anymore.
00:53:08.559 --> 00:53:10.639
Like, I want easy friends in my life at this point.
00:53:10.880 --> 00:53:15.840
Well, I'm gonna tell you this real quick, and then we definitely have to go because the time has run out, we're gonna flip the thing back over.
00:53:16.000 --> 00:53:17.119
I want to say this.
00:53:18.079 --> 00:53:23.840
I have a friend who I love and adore.
00:53:26.000 --> 00:53:36.639
Um we I reached out to her in uh last year.
00:53:37.599 --> 00:53:39.440
You know, just regular whatever.
00:53:39.519 --> 00:53:42.559
Oh, when I got my new job, I let her know, oh hey, because we work in the same industry.
00:53:42.639 --> 00:53:46.800
I'm like, hey, I got a new job, da da, everything's good, this, that, that, great.
00:53:47.039 --> 00:53:49.679
She sent me a birthday, my birthday's in October.
00:53:50.000 --> 00:53:51.519
Happy birthday, Danny, whatever.
00:53:51.599 --> 00:53:53.840
I wrote back, thanks so much, happy birthday.
00:53:55.519 --> 00:54:03.840
New Year's, I think I sent her New Year's Eve, or New Year's Day, I sent her Happy New Year, like you say, Happy New Year.
00:54:04.400 --> 00:54:05.679
She never responded.
00:54:06.159 --> 00:54:06.880
That was this year.
00:54:07.360 --> 00:54:07.760
This year.
00:54:08.639 --> 00:54:12.320
Founders Day, I'm a member of Alpha Cap Alpha, somebody incorporated.
00:54:12.719 --> 00:54:17.119
Founders Day, I sent her Happy Founders Day, no response.
00:54:20.239 --> 00:54:23.199
We know we have friends in common.
00:54:23.760 --> 00:54:28.559
Um somebody anyway, I sent a note out to somebody like, hey, is she okay?
00:54:28.719 --> 00:54:28.880
Yeah.
00:54:29.199 --> 00:54:29.519
Everything going?
00:54:29.760 --> 00:54:30.719
They're like, Yeah, why girl?
00:54:30.800 --> 00:54:31.360
Like, she's okay.
00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:32.800
Oh, see, then I would have been done.
00:54:33.039 --> 00:54:38.320
And I was like, Well, I reached out to her and I haven't had, and they were like, I'll let her know.
00:54:38.400 --> 00:54:41.039
Like, once I verified through somebody else that she was okay.
00:54:41.440 --> 00:54:41.760
Yeah.
00:54:41.920 --> 00:54:51.760
So I'm like, so then because you know who I am, I sent a text saying, Hey, I hope everything is okay with you, and I hope everything is okay with us.
00:54:51.920 --> 00:54:53.599
This is unlike you, I haven't heard from you.
00:54:55.599 --> 00:54:56.320
Nothing.
00:54:56.559 --> 00:54:58.320
Nothing, not a peep.
00:54:58.559 --> 00:55:02.400
Then somebody saw her and said to her, Danny's trying to get in touch with you.
00:55:02.559 --> 00:55:05.360
She said, Oh yeah, I gotta get, I gotta call her back.
00:55:06.400 --> 00:55:07.360
You don't have to call me back.
00:55:07.519 --> 00:55:08.480
I still haven't heard from her.
00:55:08.639 --> 00:55:09.280
You don't have to call me.
00:55:09.599 --> 00:55:11.599
I'm gonna tell you what a friend of mine said to me.
00:55:12.000 --> 00:55:15.519
If this is how she's treating you, something must have happened.
00:55:15.679 --> 00:55:19.440
Somebody told her something, there's a reason why she's not reaching out to you.
00:55:21.360 --> 00:55:27.679
But she hasn't reached out to you to talk about it, which means y'all wasn't really friends to begin with.
00:55:27.920 --> 00:55:30.719
If you don't because you were, you're not friends any longer.
00:55:31.760 --> 00:55:42.719
I can't imagine, I have not done anything to her that's so scathing that I haven't I know that I have not done or said anything about this, because I don't get down like that.
00:55:42.800 --> 00:55:44.880
Anything I say behind your back, I'll say to your face.
00:55:44.960 --> 00:55:45.920
That's how I rock.
00:55:47.280 --> 00:55:54.559
I can't fathom what she heard or what I have done that warrants this type of behavior from her.
00:55:54.880 --> 00:56:15.760
And what really helped me out in this is that as much as I appreciate and love her as a person and a friend, she obviously doesn't have that same respect for me because she doesn't think enough of our friendship or me to get on the phone with me and say, yo, would I what I heard?
00:56:15.920 --> 00:56:16.880
Is this true?
00:56:17.119 --> 00:56:20.559
Or the clarify we started this off talking about clarifying questions.
00:56:20.719 --> 00:56:24.559
There's a lot of assumptions being made, and there's been no clarifying question.
00:56:24.800 --> 00:56:27.679
Now, especially now that I know that everything is okay.
00:56:28.079 --> 00:56:28.880
You know what I'm saying?
00:56:28.960 --> 00:56:31.840
Like, you never, you're good.
00:56:34.639 --> 00:56:35.760
So I'm good.
00:56:36.159 --> 00:56:38.880
We gotta go ahead and end this because I need to know who this is.