Diving Deep on Doughnuts, with Fany Gerson

WEBVTT
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This episode is sponsored by Broaden Taylor, helping more people bake bread, gather around the table, and share something made by hand.
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It's a game.
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It is.
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It's a game with hot oil.
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You're playing with literal fire.
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Uh and good luck.
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From King Arthur Baking Company, this is Things Bakers Know.
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I'm Jessica Battalana, King Arthur's staff editor.
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And I'm David Tamarkin, King Arthur's editorial director.
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And today, it's our donut episode.
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Donut time coming.
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Yeah.
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Donut day.
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Is there a donut day?
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I think there is a.
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No, there's definitely a donut day.
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There are multiple donut days.
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And today is one of them.
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And I'm going to start today's episode with a little story time.
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Gather around, children.
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Oh, I'm here.
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So there is a family story about donuts that I thought was like a nice.
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It's another one of them.
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Battle on a family story.
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Yeah, a battle on a family story.
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It's another one that's like, is it funny or is it sad?
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I'll let you decide.
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But kind of like my car crash one in the Chinatown Bakes.
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If people haven't heard that, they can go back and hear about that.
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Okay.
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Yes.
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Um, so a similar story.
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So listeners of this podcast and you know that I grew up not far from King Arthur headquarters in rural Vermont.
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And I was probably like eight or maybe 10 years old.
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And it was a snowy winter day.
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And I got a call from a friend inviting me to come for a play date.
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I waited for that call.
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Never took a couple.
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So, you know, I browbeat my parents into taking me to my friend's house.
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We at that time had an old Pontiac station wagon, you know, the kind with a wood panel.
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Yeah.
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Or the wood panel.
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I'm using quotes because it was not really wood.
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And so I beg my dad, and my dad sets off to my friend's house, which is like up a you know, windy dirt road, as many houses in rural Vermont are.
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And we get like part way up the road, and my the car will not.
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Like if the tires are spinning, like we can't get up the hill.
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No traction.
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And I'm desperate to go to this play date.
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I probably like you, like they were probably few and far between.
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And so I was bound and determined to go to this play date.
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So I said to my dad, it's fine.
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Their house is just around the bend.
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I'll walk.
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That tracks for you.
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Mean knowing who you are.
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Independent child.
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And my dad was like, okay.
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So he drops me off and he goes, I think, to work.
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He slides down the hill, backs up, he leaves me on this road.
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I start walking and I round the bend, and it's the strangest thing, but the house is not there.
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And I think, oh, I must have just misremembered.
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Okay.
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So I keep walking alone on this dirt road.
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And it starts snowing like a little harder now.
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And I'm walking and I'm walking and I'm walking.
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And you know, this is like pre-cell phone, pre-meanwhile, the family that I was supposed to have the play day has like called my mother and said, like, your daughter has not shown up.
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Oh no.
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Oh my gosh.
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And then this car drives up.
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Okay, I would run.
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I know.
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Because this was like peak 80s stranger danger.
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Like, do not talk to strangers, do not get in a car with strangers.
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No.
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And this older man.
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Actually, not in the dark, snow, snowy woods of and he leans out the car window and he's like, Are you lost?
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And I at that point was like, yeah, I'm lost.
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Like, I I don't, you know, like I shouldn't get in the car with this, but also like I can't keep walking forever.
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And so he says, like, what it's gonna end badly either way.
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Like, choose your poison.
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So he's like, get in the car and I'll drive you to my house and you can call your parents.
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I did.
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I did.
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I got in the car.
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The story has a happy ending though.
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And we drive a couple of miles down the road to his old farmhouse.
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Wait, I'm waiting for the donuts to show up.
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The donuts are about to show up.
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We go into his house.
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His wife is there.
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They're quite elderly.
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And she is frying donuts in their house.
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Wow.
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Just for like an afternoon snack.
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Oh, wonderful.
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And I was like, actually, this like worked out all right for me.
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Like I was so cold.
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I come in from the cold, and it's just like that smell of like a freshly fried donut.
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It's like Hansel and Gretel, a little bit, you know?
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Oh, uh a little bit, yeah.
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A lot.
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Anyway, all's well that ends well.
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They call my parents.
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My parents have to borrow somebody else's car, like a truck, to come rescue me.
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And they're like, Your daughter's safe here eating donuts.
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My parents showed up.
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They sent us home with like a half dozen freshly cooked cake donuts.
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And I live to tell the tale.
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So You know what?
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For a minute I thought the story was gonna be like, and I decided to stay.
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And that family became my family.
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But I think I mean I tell you that story because obviously it ties into donuts, but there was a time in my childhood, and I think probably for other kids that grew up in rural areas where people did make donuts at home.
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I think it was more common.
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It was more common.
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Back in the day.
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Back in the day.
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Uh but still it felt like a pretty extraordinary thing to wander in from the woods to discover.
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Yeah.
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Anyway, donuts, the topic of today's episode Were the donuts good?
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They were great.
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And were they questions?
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Here we go.
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Were they I think I know the answer.
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Were they cake donuts or were they yeasted donuts?
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They were cake donuts.
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Yes.
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And to this day.
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I mean, I'm already going to tip my hand early here and say that I love a cake donut.
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I mean, I I like a yeast donut too.
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But for me, when you say like what is your like perfect donut, it's gonna be a cake donut.
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It's really uh who are you at your core question.
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I think it is.
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Yeah.
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Are you fluffy and in insubstantial but sweet?
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Are you uh right.
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Yeah, I think that's is that what you were gonna say?
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No.
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But uh but I like that.
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Uh I mean donuts are people made donuts, you know.
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I think people made donuts at home prior to donut chains being ubiquitous, which they are now.
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But donuts are a uniquely well, I don't know if that's fair to say.
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They are an American bake.
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You know, we've talked about biscuits.
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Donuts, the round donut that we think of, I think is.
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Is but it of course has you know, it originates as all things do with something else, which is, you know, Americans were not the first people to fry dough in hot fat.
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I mean, and you know the credit is given to the Dutch for, you know, the today, the modern day donut that we think of as a yeasted or, you know, cake donut fried in oil is a descendant of the something called olibolen or oil balls, which were just balls of fried dough.
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So that's like, you know, I mean, I think that has roots anywhere there was I've said this before, I feel like anywhere where there was hot oil and dough, like of course people tried to fry it.
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Yeah, why not?
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Yeah.
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But the modern donut.
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Right.
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The modern but that donut that you're talking about that was brought to America by immigrants, European immigrants.
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Like you said, it was like either donut hole, or maybe it was a little bit bigger, but it did not have a hole in the middle.
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A hole in the center.
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It was a it was a round of dough that had been fried and maybe put, you know, tossed with sugar.
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The hole, I think, is an American invention.
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Okay.
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And it's an interesting story, because in doing research for this episode, came across a really great uh article from Smithsonian magazine, which we'll put in the show notes and in our Substack.
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Subscribe to the Substack about how the hole came to the donut.
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And the legend is, and uh this is true.
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Yeah.
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But the legend is there's a woman named Elizabeth Gregory who was the mother of a ship captain, and she was a fan of you know making fried dough.
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She used his spices from his travel.
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So that's where you know the uh nutmeg and cinnamon came into came into play.
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Um and she being worried that the middle of the dough would not cook.
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Oh wow.
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Which of course is what somebody will get to, which is really a a key thing in frying in frying everything, but donuts especially.
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Yeah.
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Um she put nuts, like hazelnuts and walnuts, in the middle of the dough.
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She wrapped the dough around the nuts and dropped them into the oil so that the dough would fry around it.
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Aaron Ross Powell, Were the nuts in their shells?
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That's an absurd question.
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Well, I have no idea.
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Okay.
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But that's where you get the name donut.
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Doughnut.
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Yeah.
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Who knows?
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Is that true?
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Who knows?
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But I love that story.
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It's almost as good as me being kidnapped.
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But ending in donuts.
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Um But that's where the but that's the you know, the origin story of the whole.
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And then, of course, later the whole was done mechanically.
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Now I love this story too.
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The first machine that made donuts, you know, that dropped the donuts into hot oil, was a phenomenon.
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And people lined up in Manhattan to see this first machine in action at donut shops.
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Um and what's funny about that is that today in Manhattan, I mean, I could tell you just like a week ago, in the middle of Times Square is an enormous crispy cream where people line up outside the windows and inside, of course, too, but like to watch donuts being made.
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I mean, it's just so it's donut donut theater, it's a great word for it.
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Yeah.
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It's mesmerizing.
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Um I think actually all a lot of Krispy Kreme locations have that element of that voyeuristic element.
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They they they show the donuts on the smart uh like conveyor belt kind of thing.
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Getting covered in glaze.
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Yeah, the glaze waterfall.
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Um but it's an entire it's a it's an entrancing thing because donuts are very they have a pool, right?
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Yeah.
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They have a deep pull on people, sort of like what we were talking about with croissants in a previous episode, where it's the type of thing that you know, a lot of people are not eating every day.
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A lot of people are not making them at home, although I would argue that they're much, much easier to make at home than a croissant.
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Yes.
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Um and so there's a decadence and sort of extravagance to it that I think is very appealing and really draws people to, you know, to want to watch them be made.
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You know, I mean, uh do donuts have the nostalgia factor, but they also, I mean, they have like deep cultural roots.
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Yeah, you know, I mean, the Jewish tradition, we have talked about this before, suscaniot.
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Yeah.
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Um, you know, also in the Christian tradition, like donuts are traditionally made um, you know, for Fat Tuesday, the idea of being like you're using up like your eggs, your butter, your sugar, your frying oil as this indulgent treat before, you know, the sort of Lenten abstinence.
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Yeah.
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If you're in the Midwest, it's a whole day around that Ponchke Day, which is the donut day.
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People line up all over for Ponchke.
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Also, I want to say that our test kitchen just developed a Ponchkey recipe.
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And somehow, I don't know how, I missed every single testing and retesting.
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I did too.
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And I am, but I I actually think I'm gonna make those pretty soon because I just they look so good.
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Um I'm just struggling to I need to find a day when I will have something to do with a dozen donuts.
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Yeah, other than sit on the couch and eat them.
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And those the the ponchki are traditionally jelly-filled, like the soufganio.
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Yeah, like soufganio.
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Yeah, a jelly donut, yeah, as you said, has many different names.
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A lot of them are just the same thing, and they have a lot of them have significance.
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You know, and one interesting sort of piece of donut trivia that you and I were reading about in getting ready for this episode was about donut lassies.
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And these were women who volunteered during World War I and II to fry donuts for soldiers.
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To fry donuts for soldiers in France to give them, you know, sustenance to, you know, and to motivate them, but also to give them something, you know, that tasted a little bit like home.
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Right, right.
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At that point, they were called it's interesting.
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I mean, you you like the etymology is sort of cool to think about, but they were calling those soldiers doughboys, but not because they were eating these dough nuts.
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No.
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Maybe, maybe we went the other way around.
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They're like, well, they're doughboys, so we're gonna get what else do you feed a doughboy?
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That's what they say.
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They say that that like that term dough uh that term doughboy actually dates back to the Civil War.
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And it was like, you know, I guess for sort of lame soldiers, it's such a name because like, I don't know, the buttons on their uniforms looked like balls of dough.
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Who knows?
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Who knows if this is real?
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But the the term doughboy preceded the serving of donuts to troops in France.
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But um I mean, you know, in some ways that's a kind of a cute term of endearment.
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In other ways, I don't know if I want to be called a doughboy.
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You know?
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I'm like, I served this country by going to war and you're calling me a doughboy.
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You're calling me a doughboy?
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I don't know if I love it.
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I mean, but I will take the donut.
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Yeah, yeah.
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And donut lassie, on the other hand, like I mean, that's kind of charming.
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I'm surprised nobody has taken that name for like a chain yet.
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Oh.
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This could be our second act.
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Here we go.
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Third act.
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I don't know.
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King Arthur's donut donut lassie.
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So when's the last time you made donuts at home, if I may ask?
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That's a good question.
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It's been it's been a few years.
00:13:09.039 --> 00:13:13.759
Um, and I think I've only made yeast donuts at home.
00:13:14.240 --> 00:13:19.759
And one thing that I love is that I mean, you really can fry a lot of yeasted dough.
00:13:20.000 --> 00:13:34.960
And so I don't think like frying the dough for like a loaf of white bread is gonna be a particularly delicious donut, but I've fried um savory donuts out of focaccia with like rosemary in them and like rolled them in in in salt and rose and chopped rosemary.
00:13:35.120 --> 00:13:35.440
I looked at it.
00:13:36.639 --> 00:13:37.440
Yeah, yeah, look at me.
00:13:37.519 --> 00:13:39.279
Like, when did I have time to do that?
00:13:39.440 --> 00:13:40.000
But I did that.
00:13:40.320 --> 00:13:44.159
I mean, we messed around with frying the uh a pizza dough for the book of pizza.
00:13:44.559 --> 00:13:46.879
That's basically a which is a beignet, which is a donut.
00:13:47.200 --> 00:13:48.960
I mean, you know, by any other name.
00:13:49.120 --> 00:13:49.440
Yeah.
00:13:49.600 --> 00:13:52.720
Um I think I've had more success with yeasted donuts at home.
00:13:52.879 --> 00:13:54.320
I don't know, I don't know why.
00:13:54.399 --> 00:13:56.799
I uh cake them so it's certainly faster.
00:13:57.120 --> 00:13:58.639
I know why, but we'll talk about that later.
00:13:58.879 --> 00:13:59.919
I have theories about why.
00:14:00.159 --> 00:14:00.399
Okay.
00:14:00.480 --> 00:14:00.639
Yeah.
00:14:00.799 --> 00:14:02.320
Um how about you?
00:14:02.799 --> 00:14:03.919
Oh, it's been a long time.
00:14:04.159 --> 00:14:04.399
Yeah.
00:14:04.559 --> 00:14:05.919
I've I talk about it a lot.
00:14:06.240 --> 00:14:11.600
Because I, unlike most Americans, have no fear of frying at home.
00:14:11.840 --> 00:14:12.000
Yeah.
00:14:12.159 --> 00:14:13.120
I'm always frying.
00:14:13.279 --> 00:14:15.759
It's like I just always have a kettle of oil on.
00:14:15.919 --> 00:14:17.120
Who knows what's gonna go in there?
00:14:17.440 --> 00:14:19.440
Because you never know when the lost child's gonna show up.
00:14:20.000 --> 00:14:20.240
Exactly.
00:14:20.399 --> 00:14:23.360
And I'll have to feed them freshly fried some donuts for them.
00:14:23.519 --> 00:14:29.039
Um, I do think the frying at home is a pain point for people, and we're gonna talk about that because I want to get everyone over the hump.
00:14:29.679 --> 00:14:33.919
Um, but I mean, I think there is like there is a there's another option.
00:14:34.080 --> 00:14:43.279
There's you know, the big chains, Krispy Kreme, Duncan, yeah, Tim Hortons, maybe, if you're you know in a certain part of the world.
00:14:43.679 --> 00:14:53.919
Um but there are a lot of I mean, I I am shuddering at the word artisanal, but there are a lot of artisanal donut makers now.
00:14:54.159 --> 00:14:54.399
Yeah.
00:14:54.639 --> 00:14:56.159
Which is like the third place, right?
00:14:56.240 --> 00:15:03.360
Like if you're not making them at home and you don't want to go to a chain, like there has been there have been a lot of donut disruptors who have cropped up.
00:15:03.440 --> 00:15:08.000
And one of our very favorite is the guest on today's episode, Fanny Gerson.
00:15:08.480 --> 00:15:08.639
Yeah.
00:15:08.879 --> 00:15:09.679
I love Fanny.
00:15:09.759 --> 00:15:10.159
She's great.
00:15:10.559 --> 00:15:11.759
Fanny, friend of the brand.
00:15:12.080 --> 00:15:25.360
And her donut shop is not necessarily a you know, a Mexican donut shop, but it's got some, you know, I'm got some canela in there and some other Mexican flavors, and she's just like they're like big, puffy yeast resin donuts.
00:15:25.600 --> 00:15:26.240
Very delicious.
00:15:26.399 --> 00:15:27.360
Worth going to Brooklyn for.
00:15:30.720 --> 00:15:36.720
But like a lot of things that we see, um, you know, like people are putting innovative spins on it.
00:15:36.799 --> 00:15:47.200
And I think Fanny is, you know, very smart about interesting like new flavor combinations or like old flavor combinations applied to donuts in a new way.
00:15:47.360 --> 00:15:49.840
Um just like really creative and interesting.
00:15:50.000 --> 00:15:51.679
And um and she's terrific.
00:15:51.759 --> 00:15:53.200
So we're gonna talk to her about donuts.
00:15:55.440 --> 00:15:59.519
Fanny Gerson, thank you so much for joining us here on Things Makers Know.
00:15:59.679 --> 00:16:10.000
Um, for anyone who doesn't know you, um, you are the author of three cookbooks, and you also have three different establishments in New York City, right?
00:16:10.080 --> 00:16:21.679
You have a Paleta um spot, uh, you have a sort of casual Mexican restaurant, and then you have fan fan donuts, which is why we wanted to get you on the show here today.
00:16:21.919 --> 00:16:22.240
Yes.
00:16:22.399 --> 00:16:24.080
Well, thank you so much for having me.
00:16:24.720 --> 00:16:42.240
What strikes me about fan fan donuts is that you know, you sort of apply all of your training, like your culinary institute degree, your years working at fine dining restaurants, like your rigorous pastry background to a form that is like I think really familiar to a lot of Americans.
00:16:42.320 --> 00:16:49.919
So it's like something that resonates with so many people that people have like a lot of nostalgia for, but you have tweaked it.
00:16:50.080 --> 00:16:59.120
So let's talk about that and sort of like your inspiration for because these are not the donuts you're making, it's not like your regular glazed or buttercrunch or jelly filled.
00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:01.679
Like they are definitely donuts 2.0.
00:17:02.000 --> 00:17:02.320
Yeah.
00:17:02.559 --> 00:17:03.279
Well, thank you.
00:17:03.440 --> 00:17:05.920
Thank you so much for the the kind words.
00:17:06.640 --> 00:17:22.559
Um, yeah, like to me, the the donut, I I grew up in Mexico City, so uh of course I had donuts, you know, growing up, but they weren't, you know, it's not a quintessential treat the way that it is in the in the States.
00:17:22.720 --> 00:17:29.599
And so when I started making donuts, I came from sort of an an immigrant point of view.
00:17:29.920 --> 00:17:45.359
And so uh I like to, you know, sort of I said, because I'm not trying to recreate something from my childhood or, you know, and people have very strong um you know, feelings and memories linked to something like donuts.
00:17:45.680 --> 00:17:48.240
And so I want to kind of honor and respect that.
00:17:48.319 --> 00:17:56.880
And so I said, well, it's it's sort of my approach, bringing everything that I have done so far in my career, but also how I see the world.
00:17:57.039 --> 00:18:08.240
And I use the donut as a canvas to explore different cultures, um, different flavors that excite me that are, you know, make up New York.
00:18:08.480 --> 00:18:11.839
Uh, but also I wanted to do it in an approachable way.
00:18:12.000 --> 00:18:24.799
So my intention is when people come to the shop, they can right away see or feel that it's not your average, you know, or your typical flavors, not your average, your typical flavors.
00:18:24.880 --> 00:18:29.119
There's something special, but it's also approachable because it's still a donut, you know.
00:18:29.200 --> 00:18:32.000
There's uh I don't want it to be precious.
00:18:32.160 --> 00:18:39.440
Um we make everything from scratch in-house, no colorings, no flavorings, including the sprinkles.
00:18:39.680 --> 00:18:40.079
Wow.
00:18:40.400 --> 00:19:03.359
I mean, and that is that is very, very uh unusual, I would say, because I think most people might not know, like if you take your sort of run-of-the-mill donut shop, um, you know, often they're making the the dough itself from a mix, or if they're making the dough, you know, from scratch, then like the cream filling is from a can, the jelly is from a bag, you know, the glaze is perhaps pre-mixed.
00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:10.559
Like it's, you know, I would say the exception to find a donut shop these days where every element is made from scratch.
00:19:10.960 --> 00:19:17.039
You make what, like a dozen varieties on a weekday and then like a couple dozen different varieties on the weekends?
00:19:17.200 --> 00:19:24.720
Is that we usually have at least uh like I'm gonna say 16 flavors on a weekday.
00:19:25.039 --> 00:19:39.359
Uh we have certain ones, I think about nine that we always try to have, like our classics, what we call our classics, uh, which are the flavors, what what you think of uh classic flavors, but also what have we have been around since we opened.
00:19:39.599 --> 00:19:46.319
Um but I always want to make sure that we have, you know, uh like the classics.
00:19:46.480 --> 00:19:57.920
You know, we have a really, you know, one of my favorites is our cinnamon sugar, and we take whole Mexican cinnamon um uh and grind it and you know, uh to make it.
00:19:58.240 --> 00:20:04.160
And it has like this beautiful floral uh taste from from that cinnamon and the classic glazed.
00:20:04.319 --> 00:20:19.759
So we always like to be inventive, but for me it's always uh important to have something for the more sort of curious or adventurous, and um, you know, but but it thinks that regardless of what they are, like there's a reason sometimes people come and apologize.
00:20:19.920 --> 00:20:20.640
Like, I'm so sorry.
00:20:20.720 --> 00:20:21.920
I just want to plain glazed.
00:20:22.000 --> 00:20:23.599
I'm like, no, don't apologize.
00:20:23.759 --> 00:20:25.119
There's a reason they're classics.
00:20:25.440 --> 00:20:27.599
Yeah, I mean it's kind of like an ice cream parlor in that way.
00:20:27.680 --> 00:20:36.720
It's like you expect to find chocolate, vanilla, strawberry, you know, and then they might have wild ones, but you kind of want to have those anchors for people that are like to me, a donut is this.
00:20:36.960 --> 00:20:44.400
I had read something about uh speaking of cinnamon, that you use some sort of cinnamon tea to flavor the dough.
00:20:44.480 --> 00:20:45.200
Is that okay?
00:20:45.359 --> 00:20:46.000
Tell us about that.
00:20:46.079 --> 00:21:00.799
Yeah, so when I did my uh research for my first cookbook, My Sweet Mexico, and I learned to make churros uh from this guy in the state of Tabasco in the market, and they were very unusual, and they was there was something different about them.
00:21:00.880 --> 00:21:09.440
And I've had I've had quite a bit of quite a lot of churros in my life, and there was something about them, like a kind of and I couldn't place it.
00:21:09.680 --> 00:21:12.799
And he was kind enough to let me see how he made it.
00:21:12.880 --> 00:21:22.160
And he made the uh a cinnamon tea, uh, and that's what the the liquid, and it adds some kind of seasoning to it.
00:21:22.319 --> 00:21:38.880
It doesn't, it's but it's kind of the way that when you when you put salt and pepper to a steak, you know, you don't necessarily, unless it's a lot, you don't necessarily like if uh if it has just salt, you don't necessarily taste the salt, but it brings out all these other flavors.
00:21:39.200 --> 00:21:45.279
So uh at at La Nierquina, uh when we make the churros, I started making them like that.
00:21:45.440 --> 00:21:45.599
Okay.
00:21:45.839 --> 00:21:54.319
And so when I started at Fan Fan, I said, I'm gonna when I was developing the recipe, I tested with water, with milk, with a combination.
00:21:54.799 --> 00:22:01.839
Uh and then one day I said, hmm, I wonder if the if doing the Cinnamon tea does anything to it.
00:22:02.640 --> 00:22:06.559
And then um, and then I was like, I think it does.
00:22:06.640 --> 00:22:11.279
But I was I thought, maybe is it is it just me or you know what I mean?
00:22:11.359 --> 00:22:15.279
I like the idea of it because I you know, sort of the story romantic yeah.
00:22:15.519 --> 00:22:16.000
Yes.
00:22:17.119 --> 00:22:23.359
And um so then I did sort of blind tastings with uh friends and family.
00:22:23.519 --> 00:22:26.480
My my husband was a very willing guinea pig.
00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:37.279
Um uh compared like the recipe once I had it, uh it was gonna be like water-based as a liquid, but side by side, you know, literally.
00:22:37.519 --> 00:22:52.240
And there was something that it did to it, like again, a kind of seasoning, but it also, I think some of the natural again, I'm not a chemist at all, but I feel like some of the natural oils also do something to it.
00:22:52.400 --> 00:23:03.200
Uh so we make like big batches of the of whole uh Mexican cinnamon tea, and that's what we use, but we also use fresh ground nutmeg that we grind uh ourselves.
00:23:03.680 --> 00:23:08.480
I'm sure there are a million desserts that you could kind of mine as potential donut flavors.
00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:13.440
So tell me about the process of like creating a new donut flavor for the shop.
00:23:13.519 --> 00:23:17.680
Is it like you see a dessert and you think like, oh, can I donut donut ify that?
00:23:17.759 --> 00:23:19.599
Or how does that how does it happen?
00:23:20.000 --> 00:23:24.559
I think my my creative, I I'm just a naturally creative person.
00:23:24.640 --> 00:23:26.160
Like my mind can't stop.
00:23:27.119 --> 00:23:29.440
And I suffer from insomnia.
00:23:29.759 --> 00:23:34.079
So uh I often my ideas come at four in the morning.
00:23:34.319 --> 00:23:34.640
Sure.
00:23:34.880 --> 00:23:40.880
Uh and it's just it's not, it's actually rarely influenced by a dessert.
00:23:41.599 --> 00:24:05.599
It's uh usually it can be anything from, you know, went to the farmer's market and I saw this, or there was an element in something savory that I tried, whether it was like a part of a garnish, or you know, a crunchy element, or you know, a book that I'm reading, or I love art, or sometimes even music.
00:24:05.839 --> 00:24:09.200
You know, a lot of flavors are rooted in nostalgia for sure.
00:24:09.599 --> 00:24:19.519
Um, but I also love to do a lot of collaborations, and that's that's I really it's a lot of work because but it's a work that I create for myself.
00:24:19.759 --> 00:24:25.039
So I do like uh this would be the fourth year, I think.
00:24:25.200 --> 00:24:28.400
Uh I'm uh I'm gonna do like an AAPI box.
00:24:28.559 --> 00:24:35.440
And then I also I love to have the the little details, you know, but nothing, nothing with tweezers.
00:24:35.839 --> 00:24:37.839
You know, we're making we're nothing against.
00:24:38.079 --> 00:24:39.920
Like I don't want I don't want to I don't know.
00:24:40.000 --> 00:24:42.240
Yeah, it's maybe not the spirit of a donut shop, right?
00:24:42.319 --> 00:24:43.359
To make it like too fussy.
00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:45.839
No, like it's still it's still a it's still a donut.
00:24:46.079 --> 00:24:50.559
It's still we try to be consistent, but it's the the beauty's in the imperfection.
00:24:51.119 --> 00:24:56.480
You know, it's in the in the not exactly round always.
00:24:56.720 --> 00:25:01.839
Like sometimes it's a little bit, you know, um more oval shaped.
00:25:01.920 --> 00:25:08.799
Sometimes it drips a little more, sometimes it drips a little less, but it's consistently delicious.
00:25:09.039 --> 00:25:16.160
And I have to say, I know you didn't ask me this, but there's something really amazing about people going into a donut shop.
00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:20.720
Like it's adults, it's like you get the kid in them comes out.
00:25:21.440 --> 00:25:26.799
It's just exciting to be there, and so to be able to bring joy.
00:25:26.880 --> 00:25:28.640
Uh, and I get to do that for a living.
00:25:28.880 --> 00:25:31.359
But FanFan Donuts is an extraordinary place.
00:25:31.440 --> 00:25:32.720
You're an extraordinary baker.
00:25:32.799 --> 00:25:49.839
Um done so much for the city of New York with all of your businesses, and I just um I love the way that you, you know, you sort of honor the tradition of donut making, you honor your own heritage, but you're just pushing forward in all these exciting and creative ways.
00:25:50.000 --> 00:25:51.440
So thank you for joining us.
00:25:52.079 --> 00:25:54.319
And thank you so much for having me.
00:26:25.470 --> 00:26:27.710
This episode is sponsored by Broaden Taylor.
00:26:27.789 --> 00:26:38.269
Broaden Taylor is an independent family-owned company that builds tools for all bread makers at every level to transform complex baking challenges into simple pleasures.
00:26:38.750 --> 00:26:42.190
Broaden Taylor, I mean, they are so passionate about bread and baking.
00:26:42.349 --> 00:26:46.109
When I talk to those folks, it really feels like I'm talking to someone at King Arthur 2.
00:26:46.190 --> 00:26:48.589
There's that synergy there because we only have one thing on our minds.
00:26:48.669 --> 00:26:50.190
It's baking, baking, baking.
00:26:51.629 --> 00:26:52.829
I love their tools.
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They really truly are an asset for every home baker, and you and I both have quite a few of them in our own kitchens.
00:26:59.470 --> 00:27:03.230
You know, my favorite, I think, is the uh countertop proofer.
00:27:03.389 --> 00:27:07.069
I don't know, you're into the baking steel, but they have a lot of great tools.
00:27:07.230 --> 00:27:14.349
Whether you're a first-time baker or you're like in deep like us, there's something for you at broadandtailor.com.
00:27:14.429 --> 00:27:19.230
That's B-R-O-D-A-N-D-T-A-Y-L-O-R.com.
00:27:19.789 --> 00:27:22.269
This episode is brought to you by Supernatural.
00:27:22.429 --> 00:27:31.629
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00:27:31.950 --> 00:27:38.509
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00:27:38.589 --> 00:27:43.149
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00:28:07.230 --> 00:28:09.710
It's time for our next segment, Ask the Bakers.
00:28:09.869 --> 00:28:12.190
For Ask the Bakers, we want to hear from you.
00:28:12.429 --> 00:28:19.869
If you have a baking question for us, head to KingArthurBaking.com slash podcast to record a voice message, and we may end up using it on the show.
00:28:19.950 --> 00:28:22.669
That's KingArthurbaking.com slash podcast.
00:28:22.909 --> 00:28:26.669
But you know, sometimes you just can't wait three months for us to answer your question.
00:28:26.750 --> 00:28:28.029
And in those circumstances.
00:28:28.349 --> 00:28:30.029
In those circumstances, get some patience.
00:28:30.269 --> 00:28:30.909
Get some patience.
00:28:31.069 --> 00:28:32.269
You know, learn some patience.
00:28:32.429 --> 00:28:33.869
Sit down, read a book, but wait.
00:28:34.029 --> 00:28:36.669
I mean, maybe the answer is on our website.
00:28:37.149 --> 00:28:49.549
But if not, you can also go to kingarthurbaking.com forward slash bakers dash hotline, and a real live person will answer your question via phone, email, chat.
00:28:49.869 --> 00:28:50.109
Yep.
00:28:50.190 --> 00:28:50.829
It's kind of like.
00:28:51.069 --> 00:28:57.789
You can also call 855-371-2253-2253 as in bake.
00:28:58.109 --> 00:28:58.669
We're here for you.
00:28:58.909 --> 00:29:00.029
It's a beautiful thing.
00:29:00.269 --> 00:29:02.429
Now let's hear our questions.
00:29:04.190 --> 00:29:10.269
What's the secret to getting perfectly light and fluffy yeast-raised donuts?
00:29:10.829 --> 00:29:11.149
Okay.
00:29:12.190 --> 00:29:12.509
Yeah.
00:29:13.629 --> 00:29:14.029
What is the secret?
00:29:14.509 --> 00:29:16.589
I mean, there are the thing is there are lots of secrets, right?
00:29:16.909 --> 00:29:23.309
Yeah, I mean, I think the well, we were talking earlier very briefly, and I said we would revisit this idea.
00:29:23.389 --> 00:29:32.909
And the idea that I wanted to revisit is, you know, this question of you know, really what we're getting down to is like how to prevent a dense donut, right?
00:29:33.149 --> 00:29:35.309
Whether it's a cake donut or a yeast raised donut.
00:29:35.389 --> 00:29:39.069
So we'll start with yeast raise since that was a question that was asked of us.
00:29:39.309 --> 00:29:43.230
But I think with a yeast raised donut, like you've got to take a little bit more care with the dough.
00:29:43.789 --> 00:29:49.789
So you want to proof it so that it's, you know, well-proofed before it goes in the oil, right?
00:29:50.029 --> 00:30:00.190
So minding the temperature, mining the time of that proof or that second rise is gonna go a long way towards having a light and fluffy donut.
00:30:00.669 --> 00:30:01.470
Not rushing it.
00:30:01.789 --> 00:30:02.429
Not rushing it.
00:30:03.069 --> 00:30:12.109
But I think once you know, supposing you've done all that right, here's where it comes down to the frying.
00:30:12.269 --> 00:30:15.230
And this is true whether it's a cake donut or a yeast donut.
00:30:15.549 --> 00:30:18.990
You have got to get the temperature of your oil right.
00:30:19.149 --> 00:30:24.029
And in order to get the temperature of your oil right, you also need to be frying in enough oil, right?
00:30:24.190 --> 00:30:29.069
Because it's really hard to maintain temperature if you're like have some rinky dink little pot of oil.
00:30:29.230 --> 00:30:30.750
Like you need a good amount of oil.
00:30:30.829 --> 00:30:31.309
Yeah.
00:30:31.710 --> 00:30:35.950
You need to be monitoring the temperature of that oil with a you know deep frying thermometer.
00:30:36.269 --> 00:30:38.829
And then you can't crowd the pot.
00:30:39.069 --> 00:30:39.230
Right.
00:30:39.549 --> 00:30:50.909
Because if you add, you know, a donut, whether it's cake donut or a yeast donut, to oil that's not the right temperature, either too cold, it's gonna soak up oil like a sponge.
00:30:51.309 --> 00:30:51.950
Gross.
00:30:52.349 --> 00:30:58.909
Too hot, it's gonna burn on the outside and be raw on the inside, like you know, which is the whole point of having a hole in there.
00:30:59.069 --> 00:31:01.789
So you're trying to avoid raw dough in the center.
00:31:02.029 --> 00:31:02.109
Right.
00:31:02.269 --> 00:31:04.750
And you know, and there are plenty of donuts that do not have holes.
00:31:04.829 --> 00:31:08.190
In fact, there's some of my favorites, the jellyfill, the cream fill, the bismark.
00:31:08.349 --> 00:31:08.669
No, yes.
00:31:08.909 --> 00:31:10.750
We've not talked about the bismark donut.
00:31:11.069 --> 00:31:15.629
We haven't requires that you really cook that thing all the way through.
00:31:15.869 --> 00:31:31.230
So you're never going to know if it's cooked all the way through unless your temperature is correct and you're following the recipe for the time, because the time given in a recipe is conditional on the oil temperature being on point.
00:31:31.470 --> 00:31:32.750
I mean, and I've done it both ways.
00:31:32.829 --> 00:31:34.349
Like I have messed up in both directions.
00:31:34.589 --> 00:31:36.109
Too cold, too hot, you know.
00:31:36.190 --> 00:31:37.950
So I, you know, I know what I speak.
00:31:38.109 --> 00:31:47.470
And I also think, you know, I I said uh when I started answering this question, like, you want to make sure you've proofed your dough right, but I didn't really tell people like what to be looking for, right?
00:31:47.710 --> 00:31:54.990
So I think that is if you have your, you know, your cut-out yeasted donuts, they're rising nicely.
00:31:55.230 --> 00:32:00.029
You go and you take your your floured fingertip and you press it into one of them gently.
00:32:00.109 --> 00:32:01.389
You know, you're not stabbing it.
00:32:01.629 --> 00:32:06.190
It should like spring back and fill in that indentation slowly.
00:32:06.429 --> 00:32:09.470
And then you know, like if it sticks in all the way, not great.
00:32:09.629 --> 00:32:11.470
If it pops back immediately, not great.
00:32:11.629 --> 00:32:16.269
So you want to kind of slowly fill in that indentation, and then you know that it's properly proof, just like bread.
00:32:16.349 --> 00:32:19.710
I mean, it's the same, you know, sort of test for for proof.
00:32:19.950 --> 00:32:24.109
Um I think those tips will be helpful.
00:32:24.429 --> 00:32:24.589
Yeah.
00:32:24.750 --> 00:32:24.909
Yeah.
00:32:25.230 --> 00:32:28.029
And you're really speaking to me.
00:32:28.990 --> 00:32:33.309
And bakers like me who are like, uh, I don't want to use all this oil.
00:32:33.549 --> 00:32:35.710
I don't want to like waste all this oil.
00:32:36.029 --> 00:32:38.349
So I don't want to, you know, I'm gonna try it in a smaller pan.
00:32:38.589 --> 00:32:40.429
But you're right, that's just a fool's errand.
00:32:40.589 --> 00:32:49.069
Um, and it is a very good point and a reminder to people that the minute you put anything in a vat of bubbling oil, the temperature goes down.
00:32:49.309 --> 00:32:50.109
Yeah, it goes down dramatically.
00:32:50.349 --> 00:32:52.269
And so the more donors you put in there, the more it's gonna go down.
00:32:52.509 --> 00:32:53.950
So you really it's it's it's a game.
00:32:54.109 --> 00:32:54.429
It is.
00:32:54.669 --> 00:32:56.990
It's a game with hot oil.
00:32:57.230 --> 00:33:00.109
You're playing with literal fire.
00:33:00.589 --> 00:33:02.349
Uh and good luck.
00:33:02.589 --> 00:33:03.309
Yeah, good luck.
00:33:03.869 --> 00:33:04.589
It's worth it.
00:33:04.750 --> 00:33:05.309
It is worth it.
00:33:05.389 --> 00:33:06.589
It's totally worth it.
00:33:06.750 --> 00:33:08.589
Um, let's go to our next question.
00:33:09.309 --> 00:33:11.869
I hate wasting all that oil when I fry.
00:33:12.109 --> 00:33:13.549
Can I reuse it?
00:33:14.190 --> 00:33:14.990
Speak of the devil.
00:33:15.069 --> 00:33:15.230
Yeah.
00:33:15.470 --> 00:33:15.869
That was mean.
00:33:16.190 --> 00:33:17.309
I don't know if you recognize it, of course.
00:33:17.470 --> 00:33:18.750
I was that was mean.
00:33:19.069 --> 00:33:20.589
I mean, this is the thing.
00:33:20.829 --> 00:33:23.869
This is the whole thing that gets people down.
00:33:24.029 --> 00:33:24.509
Yeah.
00:33:24.750 --> 00:33:27.309
Uh they have oil anxiety.
00:33:27.470 --> 00:33:34.109
First of all, I just want to say in the grand scheme of things, a giant jug of oil, not expensive.
00:33:34.990 --> 00:33:40.990
You know, because you're good, you're using, you know, canola oil, vegetable oil, not, you know, not expensive.
00:33:41.069 --> 00:33:43.149
You can't buy just a yes, it is a good point.
00:33:43.389 --> 00:33:46.190
Do not do not fry your donuts and olive oil.
00:33:46.429 --> 00:33:47.230
No, you don't need olive oil.
00:33:47.629 --> 00:33:48.990
That's also not gonna taste very good at all.
00:33:50.109 --> 00:33:50.429
Yeah.
00:33:50.669 --> 00:34:00.669
So, um, but still it doesn't change the fact that like you then have this vat of, you know, like if you're frying, I like to fry in a high like high-sided deep pot, like a Dutch oven, something like that.
00:34:00.829 --> 00:34:03.869
So like it's six cups of oil, eight cups of oil.
00:34:05.869 --> 00:34:07.309
So, okay.
00:34:07.629 --> 00:34:09.950
You can go in one direction and not the other.
00:34:10.110 --> 00:34:11.389
You know where I'm going with this.
00:34:11.550 --> 00:34:22.909
Like, you can presumably fry your donuts, let the oil cool, strain it, put it back in, you know, back in the bottle or back in storage containers.
00:34:23.309 --> 00:34:25.309
You're gonna strain it uh through cheesecloth.
00:34:25.550 --> 00:34:26.829
Yeah, or a fine mesh sieve.
00:34:26.990 --> 00:34:28.110
Oh, fine, okay, right.
00:34:28.670 --> 00:34:35.710
Because you're trying to get all all the little burned bits, because otherwise that's gonna flavor your oil and make it go random.
00:34:35.869 --> 00:34:38.750
But also if you heat it up against it's gonna burn immediately.
00:34:38.909 --> 00:34:39.630
So yes.
00:34:39.789 --> 00:34:44.590
So then you could go, say, from donuts to you could probably get a couple batches of donuts.
00:34:45.710 --> 00:34:45.949
You know?
00:34:46.349 --> 00:34:47.150
Is that what you do?
00:34:47.389 --> 00:34:47.630
Yeah.
00:34:47.949 --> 00:34:51.949
Or I'll do donuts and then French fries.
00:34:52.269 --> 00:34:52.670
French fries.
00:34:52.909 --> 00:34:55.869
I like to do fish and then donuts.
00:34:56.110 --> 00:34:59.389
Because I just I love that savory element in my donuts, you know.
00:34:59.710 --> 00:35:03.389
Also, I think people are sometimes like, well, how many times I can use the oil?
00:35:03.549 --> 00:35:06.509
Like, this is where the old nose comes into play.
00:35:06.750 --> 00:35:11.309
Like, if you smell your oil and it smells rancid, it's going to taste gross.
00:35:11.869 --> 00:35:13.230
So give it a sniff.
00:35:13.309 --> 00:35:14.429
You'll know if it can be used again.
00:35:14.829 --> 00:35:17.549
Also, a good rule of thumb for anything that smells rancid.
00:35:17.789 --> 00:35:17.949
Yeah.
00:35:18.110 --> 00:35:20.750
Just like if it smells off, don't reuse it.
00:35:20.829 --> 00:35:23.230
But I find I can usually get a couple of rounds.
00:35:23.389 --> 00:35:31.949
And I, so I strain my cooled oil, store it in like cork containers in my pantry where it's like a cool dark place, and you can come back to it.
00:35:32.110 --> 00:35:38.509
Um, and I would say like, yes, you can come back to it for donuts, but in reality, people aren't making like a batch of donuts every weekend.
00:35:38.590 --> 00:35:40.670
I mean, I wish I was, but um.
00:35:41.549 --> 00:35:47.630
So the other thing that is annoying for people is like what do you like?
00:35:47.710 --> 00:35:51.549
Okay, once the oil has run its course, it's like then what do you do?
00:35:52.190 --> 00:35:53.630
Not down the drain.
00:35:53.869 --> 00:35:58.750
Um, you know, you can compost used oil in a lot of places, cooled used oil, so that's great.
00:35:58.829 --> 00:36:07.230
But if you don't have a compost, and even if you do, so there's this product, and I've already evangelized about this product when we were talking about sufgana yot last season.
00:36:07.389 --> 00:36:08.509
It's called fryaway.
00:36:08.829 --> 00:36:10.429
Why were we talking about soufgana yot?
00:36:10.590 --> 00:36:12.269
Why weren't we talking about holiday baking, baby?
00:36:12.590 --> 00:36:13.869
Okay, yeah, holiday baking, right?
00:36:13.949 --> 00:36:14.110
Yeah.
00:36:14.590 --> 00:36:18.269
So because we just love to talk about fried dough, we just can't get enough.
00:36:18.509 --> 00:36:25.389
But fry away, for anyone who didn't hear me talk about in that last episode, is it's like a powder that you sprinkle on your cooled oil.
00:36:25.469 --> 00:36:31.070
You gotta cool your oil, and then you sprinkle it on and and it turns your oil into like a solid disc.
00:36:31.549 --> 00:36:32.110
It's so cool.
00:36:32.269 --> 00:36:33.070
It's so cool.
00:36:33.230 --> 00:36:34.590
I mean, it's amazing.
00:36:34.829 --> 00:36:37.869
So And then you cut that up and you can spread it on toast.
00:36:38.110 --> 00:36:38.909
Right, you spread it on right.
00:36:38.989 --> 00:36:40.349
You you're like, dinner's served.
00:36:40.670 --> 00:36:41.710
Close the circle.
00:36:41.869 --> 00:36:44.989
Um, then it's obviously much easier to discard like a solid disc.
00:36:45.070 --> 00:36:47.070
Like you can go in your trash, you can go in your compost.
00:36:47.150 --> 00:36:50.269
It's not like the greasy volume that you'd have.
00:36:50.670 --> 00:36:52.670
Um but it's not that hard.
00:36:52.750 --> 00:36:54.269
You know, people do hard things all the time.
00:36:54.509 --> 00:36:55.150
It's not that hard.
00:36:55.389 --> 00:36:57.630
Oil is not something to be feared.
00:36:57.789 --> 00:37:03.949
No, it's something to be embraced because at the end of that oily rainbow is a freshly fried donut.
00:37:04.269 --> 00:37:08.269
And I think I haven't, I don't can't believe I haven't said this already in this episode.
00:37:08.429 --> 00:37:22.829
But when you get a donut, for me it's a cake donut, fresh out of the oil, and it's like craggy on the outside and like a little crispy, and then you bite through and then you have that like nutmeggy, soft interior.
00:37:23.150 --> 00:37:25.949
I mean, like, what's the point of living if you're not doing that?
00:37:26.349 --> 00:37:29.150
It'll make you reject your parents and move in with some strangers.
00:37:32.110 --> 00:37:32.590
Truly.
00:37:32.909 --> 00:37:34.909
Um It's true, it's so worth it.
00:37:35.070 --> 00:37:46.349
And I just want to note that you know, I think people have this idea that this jug of oil that you've you know, if you strain it and you know, put in a container and put it somewhere, and that you have to use it again en masse.
00:37:46.509 --> 00:37:47.230
But you don't.
00:37:47.549 --> 00:37:52.190
You can you can use that oil to like fry some potato pancakes or to fry some buttons.
00:37:52.269 --> 00:37:53.469
I mean, do any frying you need.
00:37:53.710 --> 00:37:54.750
You can parcel that out.
00:37:55.150 --> 00:37:57.070
There's no reason you have to use it in bulk.
00:37:57.469 --> 00:37:57.869
That's so true.
00:37:57.949 --> 00:37:58.349
That's so true.
00:37:58.590 --> 00:37:59.549
So just think about that.
00:37:59.789 --> 00:38:00.029
Yeah.
00:38:00.190 --> 00:38:00.829
Think about that.
00:38:01.070 --> 00:38:03.469
Just think about it when you're trying to go to sleep tonight.
00:38:03.710 --> 00:38:05.389
Think about all that beautiful oil.
00:38:05.710 --> 00:38:08.029
I think we have one more question.
00:38:08.909 --> 00:38:11.469
I love donuts, but hate frying.
00:38:11.710 --> 00:38:15.150
Is it possible to make great baked donuts that rival fries?
00:38:15.710 --> 00:38:15.869
No.
00:38:16.190 --> 00:38:18.909
Well, see, people see I mean, here we go again.
00:38:18.989 --> 00:38:20.110
People, the sphere of frying.
00:38:20.829 --> 00:38:22.909
No, I mean, is it possible to make a baked donut?
00:38:23.070 --> 00:38:23.549
Yes.
00:38:24.029 --> 00:38:25.789
A baked donut is a different thing, though.
00:38:26.110 --> 00:38:28.909
Like if you if you love donuts, what you love is a fried donut.
00:38:28.989 --> 00:38:29.469
I imagine.
00:38:29.549 --> 00:38:30.429
You don't love a baked donut.
00:38:30.590 --> 00:38:32.429
Nobody's like, oh, I'm really craving a baked donut.
00:38:32.590 --> 00:38:35.150
Like a baked donut is what you have because you've given up.
00:38:39.789 --> 00:38:40.509
Good night.
00:38:40.829 --> 00:38:42.349
Good night and good luck.
00:38:43.070 --> 00:38:45.070
I think a baked donut is a different thing.
00:38:45.389 --> 00:38:46.190
It's a much different thing.
00:38:46.349 --> 00:38:46.670
It's cake.
00:38:46.750 --> 00:38:47.549
It's cake in a ring.
00:38:47.630 --> 00:38:49.549
It's a cake and it's like a little bunt cake or something.
00:38:49.869 --> 00:38:51.230
And you know, they can be very delicious.
00:38:51.549 --> 00:38:58.989
And we have some baked donut mixes and we have the pans, and obviously, it's a lot less fuss, you know, to make a baked donut.
00:38:59.230 --> 00:38:59.389
Yeah.
00:38:59.630 --> 00:39:01.869
Um but it's not a donut, I don't know.
00:39:02.110 --> 00:39:02.909
It's much less fuss.
00:39:03.070 --> 00:39:05.949
And honestly, a cake donut is pretty fast to make.
00:39:06.029 --> 00:39:09.070
You there's no, unlike a yeast donut, there's no rise time.
00:39:09.230 --> 00:39:09.389
Yeah.
00:39:09.549 --> 00:39:13.710
The dough for a cake donut, I don't know if people know this, but like it's pretty quick.
00:39:13.789 --> 00:39:17.150
I mean, I think you use a lot of recipes, you have to like give it a little chill.
00:39:18.509 --> 00:39:20.509
You can make them in a morning, you know.
00:39:20.909 --> 00:39:21.070
Yeah.
00:39:21.150 --> 00:39:35.070
And you know what I would say for the this person who's asking, I think there is another thing you could make, which is the donut muffin, which is not a donut in shape, you know, it's uh like a vanilla muffin, nutmeg scented vanilla muffin.
00:39:35.230 --> 00:39:43.630
Um and when it comes out of the oven, you dip it in melted butter and then you roll it in uh cinnamon sugar.
00:39:44.269 --> 00:39:45.389
It is donut-ish.
00:39:45.789 --> 00:39:47.549
It is not a donut, but they are very good.
00:39:47.789 --> 00:39:48.989
And I would say they're even easier.
00:39:49.309 --> 00:39:51.389
Wait, are you you're rolling it wait, you said this right?
00:39:51.630 --> 00:39:52.269
I mean melted butter.
00:39:52.429 --> 00:39:52.670
Right, right.
00:39:52.829 --> 00:39:53.789
I mean, yeah, yeah, it's really good.
00:39:54.029 --> 00:39:59.949
I mean, and that's nice too, because you get a little bit, like you get a little extra fat and you get a little crispiness from that.
00:40:00.110 --> 00:40:06.269
Um and then you can, you know, they're coated fully in cinnamon sugar, so that gives it a donut like quality.
00:40:06.429 --> 00:40:06.989
Is it a donut?
00:40:07.230 --> 00:40:10.750
No, but I think it's a I think it's a good second thing.
00:40:10.989 --> 00:40:14.429
And also particularly nice if you don't own a baked donut pan.
00:40:14.509 --> 00:40:18.989
Like maybe you don't want to have like you know, you don't want to get a custom pan just for baked donuts.
00:40:19.070 --> 00:40:21.549
I think donut muffin is great.
00:40:22.029 --> 00:40:23.070
Put that recipe in the show notes.
00:40:23.469 --> 00:40:35.469
I think the donut muffin is emulating donuts perhaps better than some other baked donuts do because it's giving you that textural element on the outside.
00:40:35.869 --> 00:40:43.549
Um and that's what you're gonna forego if you decide to bake your cake uh donuts instead of fry them.
00:40:44.029 --> 00:40:52.989
You're never gonna get that you know, kind of crispy textural contrast in a baked donut that you get in a fried.
00:40:53.469 --> 00:40:54.110
Right, right, right.
00:40:54.190 --> 00:40:54.349
Yeah.
00:40:54.829 --> 00:40:55.949
So, you know, you make your choice.
00:40:56.110 --> 00:40:56.829
Yeah, you make your choice.
00:40:57.070 --> 00:40:59.549
You know, you make your choice, and you have to live with them, you know.
00:41:01.070 --> 00:41:01.869
Um, okay.
00:41:02.029 --> 00:41:05.230
Well, in the interim, I'm gonna share an opinion with you.
00:41:05.630 --> 00:41:09.070
Well, first, don't cut me out.
00:41:10.029 --> 00:41:11.070
I gotta do my interim.
00:41:11.230 --> 00:41:11.869
I gotta set you up.
00:41:12.110 --> 00:41:13.230
Okay, all right, set me up.
00:41:13.469 --> 00:41:19.070
Every episode, we like to talk to Jessica and see what wildly surprising and full-throated opinions are in her head.
00:41:19.150 --> 00:41:22.989
Although I gotta say, these are becoming less and less surprising, like what we're now expecting them from you.
00:41:23.309 --> 00:41:24.670
Well, you know me so well now.
00:41:25.150 --> 00:41:42.750
It's a segment we lovingly call just opinions, and Jessica is dying to give her donut just opinion, which is Well, I think there is one thing that you should do whatever donut shop you go into, like there which is that you should always order an old-fashioned.
00:41:43.230 --> 00:41:43.469
Oh.
00:41:44.029 --> 00:41:49.710
Because I think an old-fashioned donut is like the barometer by which I measure a donut shop.
00:41:50.269 --> 00:41:50.590
Nice.
00:41:50.909 --> 00:41:57.230
Like I I just feel like it's the simplest, but it tells you a lot about like, you know, how well are they frying things?
00:41:57.389 --> 00:41:58.590
Like, is the oil fresh?
00:41:58.750 --> 00:42:00.110
Like, is the temperature right?
00:42:00.349 --> 00:42:04.029
Like, you know, I mean, I think it's stripped away, right?
00:42:04.110 --> 00:42:12.269
Like anything's gonna taste pretty good if it's covered in sugary glaze or like those floor sweepings or stuffed with jelly or like with pastry cream inside of it and dunked in chocolate.
00:42:12.349 --> 00:42:13.869
Like that sort of obscures.
00:42:14.349 --> 00:42:17.869
But if you just have an old-fashioned donut, nowhere to hide.
00:42:18.190 --> 00:42:18.509
Huh.
00:42:18.909 --> 00:42:20.429
So I always will get one.
00:42:20.829 --> 00:42:23.469
But an old-fashioned donut is glazed, though.
00:42:23.869 --> 00:42:25.630
No, not always, David.
00:42:25.789 --> 00:42:26.750
Sometimes.
00:42:27.230 --> 00:42:30.909
But it's but you're talking about a plain old-fashioned donut.
00:42:31.150 --> 00:42:33.070
So you just want a craggy, I do.
00:42:33.630 --> 00:42:38.670
Unglazed, not rolled in sugar, just a plain, just a plain ass donut.
00:42:38.989 --> 00:42:40.190
Yeah, just a plain ass donut.
00:42:40.590 --> 00:42:41.469
You really are for New England.
00:42:41.549 --> 00:42:45.549
You've got that New England like people are like, is she 40?
00:42:45.630 --> 00:42:46.190
Is she a hundred?
00:42:46.509 --> 00:42:47.070
We don't know.
00:42:47.789 --> 00:42:49.150
We can't tell.
00:42:50.110 --> 00:42:51.230
But I think it's worth doing.
00:42:51.309 --> 00:42:57.949
Like, even if you think you're gonna get other donuts, like I will often get other donuts, but I will always get an old-fashioned.
00:42:58.429 --> 00:43:01.710
Wait, so do you go to a donut shop and you're like, uh now wait, your family wants to?
00:43:01.949 --> 00:43:02.750
You're like, oh hold on.
00:43:02.829 --> 00:43:05.869
I gotta order it, I gotta see if this donut place is worth it.
00:43:06.029 --> 00:43:06.190
No.
00:43:06.429 --> 00:43:06.909
You order this.
00:43:07.150 --> 00:43:09.710
No, I mean we'll just order all of them, but we we'll always order.
00:43:09.949 --> 00:43:17.469
Okay, got I also think this is less of an opinion, but I'm just gonna add it on here that the best time to eat donuts is actually for dessert.
00:43:17.949 --> 00:43:18.670
Oh, God.
00:43:18.829 --> 00:43:19.549
No, no.
00:43:20.829 --> 00:43:22.110
Don't give me that.
00:43:22.429 --> 00:43:22.829
I do.
00:43:22.909 --> 00:43:25.949
I mean, I like sweet things in the morning, but they are cake.
00:43:26.190 --> 00:43:30.190
You know, these people who are like, who are like, oh, I don't like a sugary breakfast.
00:43:30.269 --> 00:43:31.630
I'm like, get over it.
00:43:31.869 --> 00:43:32.349
You know?
00:43:32.590 --> 00:43:33.789
You know what they eat in Europe?
00:43:33.869 --> 00:43:37.949
You know what they eat in in Italy, everywhere, it's so many places around the world, like a sugary breakfast.
00:43:38.029 --> 00:43:38.190
Yeah.
00:43:38.269 --> 00:43:38.829
And I'm one of them.
00:43:39.070 --> 00:43:39.549
You're one of them.
00:43:39.710 --> 00:43:42.029
I'm one of the countries in this world that loves a sugary breakfast.
00:43:43.389 --> 00:43:45.630
I support a donut first thing in the morning.
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Why not crash out immediately?
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You know?
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Why wait to the end of the day?
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Why wait?
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Why wait?
00:43:51.549 --> 00:43:53.949
Yeah, I like to wake up and go right back to bed.
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All right, we did it.
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Here we are.
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Are you baking donuts at home this week?
00:43:58.829 --> 00:44:01.150
No, I'm not gonna bake donuts this week.
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I am going to, what am I gonna do?
00:44:04.670 --> 00:44:07.469
I'm gonna, so we're working, believe it or not.
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I mean, we've we're talking about our pizza book, which just came out.
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Right.
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And yet we are working on another book, a baking book that will come out in the fall of 2027.
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And because there's some room on the shelf.
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There's some room on the shelf, and there has been lots of exciting development.
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Um but one of the recipes that we started developing for that book, we decided.
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Actually, it was not going to go in the book, but it was such a good recipe that we were going to put it on the site right away.
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And it's for these cream cheese chocolate chip cookies.
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It's wild.
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I know what these people are thinking.
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Like, does the world need another chocolate chip cookie?
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I was thinking, does the world need another cream cheese cookie?
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But these are really quite distinctive.
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They're very rich.
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They're just, they're a really great chocolate chip cookie.
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And if you're a person that likes chocolate chip cookies the way that I like them, which is that I always want to try a new one, this is one worth trying.
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Sarah Jampel developed this recipe.
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Um, and spoiler, not spoiler, but it is not the chocolate chip cookie that is going in our new book.
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That one is even more groundbreaking.
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Yes, that one's choice.
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But this one's truly, truly mind-blowing.
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But this in the interim, we give you this little teaser of these cream cheese chocolate chip cookies that are really very good.
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So it's not that wild to have cream cheese in a cookie.
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I mean, rugula has cream cheese in the dough, and you can have chocolate rugula.
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So that's a I like that combination of that kind of tangy dairy tender with chocolate.
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Uh to fermented is cream cheese fermented?
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No.
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No, cultured.
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Cultured, yeah.
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So it's a little bit fermented.
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It's a tiny bit.
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So chocolate's fermented product.
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I think there's a synergy there.
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I like chocolate.
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I've always liked chocolate with yogurt.
00:45:46.110 --> 00:45:46.590
Oh, interesting.
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There's a fermented sisterhood there.
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The fermented sisterhood.
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The fermented sisterhood.
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Uh anyway, so this is not, I mean, it sounds kind of weird, but actually, I think I can see how it would be congruous.
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Yeah, I want people to I want people to give them a shot, you know.
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Nice.
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Uh well, I'm also not making donuts, but I am making something close because we've been talking.
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Jelly donut cake.
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You just said you think jelly, you think donuts are good for dessert.
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I wholeheartedly disagree with that.
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But speaking of Sarah Jampel, she did develop a cake based on a jelly donut.
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And it is really charming and really crazy.
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Uh again, it's got that nutmeg in it, which like that donut muffin we talked about earlier.
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That's kind of what gives it that je ne sais quoi of a donut.
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Um and it's got a ripple of jam through it.
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So giving you that.
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And crucially, it is baked in a sugar-dusted pan.
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Yeah.
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So you get like a that sugary crust on the outside.
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And then I might you didn't even mention the best part about that cake.
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What?
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The jelly buttons.
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I don't do that.
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Oh, you don't that's too much work.
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But you yeah.
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If you have if you want to do some piping, you can pipe a little jelly button on every like all around.
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So everyone gets one.
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Yeah, so then it really looks like a jelly donut.
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Yeah.
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Um I'm I'm no fuss.
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Oh, really?
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Yeah.
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Um yeah, those are both, those are both good recipes.
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So hopefully people will try those.
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In addition.
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Double the donuts on our site.
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I mean, yeah, all the donuts on our site, just and get over your fear of frying.
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We're here for you.
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If you have questions, we still have a good YouTube video of Claire Safet's sour cream donut walkthrough on our site.
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And because she's Claire, she went deep.
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I think that video was like 40 minutes long.
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Yeah.
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It's basically like a masterclass on donuts.
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So if we didn't, you know, get you all the way convinced, watch that video on our YouTube channel.
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That'll put you there.
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Yeah, totally.
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Um, as ever, we appreciate everyone tuning in and listening to us here on Things Bakers Know.
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Remember to like and subscribe on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, Spotify, Amazon Music, or wherever you listen to podcasts so you know when the next episode and the next season drops.
00:47:54.989 --> 00:48:02.670
Leave us a review and specifically leave us the name of your favorite, you know, small town donut shop or big town donut shop.
00:48:02.829 --> 00:48:03.230
I want to know.
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I'm just I'm I like to just keep a list.
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Yeah, go to our Substack actually and leave a comment there.
00:48:07.710 --> 00:48:08.750
Well we will have a post.
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We have a new post up now all about donuts.
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So put that in the notes.
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Let's get a debate started.
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Yeah, let's let's get a list going.
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That's what we need.
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Yeah, and folks, while you're doing all that, just remember, always, especially when you're frying, follow the recipe.
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Things Bakers Know is hosted and executive produced by me, David Timorkin.
00:48:28.829 --> 00:48:30.190
And me, Jessica Battalana.
00:48:30.349 --> 00:48:36.110
Rossi Anastapulo is our senior producer, Chatch and I is our producer, and Marcus Bagala is our engineer.
00:48:36.349 --> 00:48:38.670
Original music by Megan and Marcus Bagala.
00:48:39.230 --> 00:48:42.429
And what a treat it was to have Fanny Gerson talk donuts with us.
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Fanny, of course, is the owner of FanFan Donuts in New York City.
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She is also the author of many cookbooks and just a buddy of ours.
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And she has also starred in quite a few of our videos on our YouTube channel.
00:48:56.190 --> 00:49:00.190
Things Bakers Know is a King Arthur Baking Company podcast.
00:49:04.269 --> 00:49:09.789
This episode is brought to you by a new collaboration between King Arthur and Supernatural.
00:49:09.949 --> 00:49:19.150
Supernatural, of course, is the maker of America's brightest dye-free sprinkles, and we are putting those sprinkles in our new confetti cake mix and confetti sugar cookie mix.
00:49:19.309 --> 00:49:20.269
Let me tell you something.
00:49:24.429 --> 00:49:25.230
It was gorgeous.
00:49:25.389 --> 00:49:26.429
It was celebratory.
00:49:26.590 --> 00:49:28.829
It was like my birthday, but it wasn't even my birthday.
00:49:29.070 --> 00:49:35.309
Find both mixes at Target, Target.com, and of course at KingArthurBaking.com.