00:01:55Annie's Struggles and Group Dynamics
00:16:51Union Involvement and Farewell Gesture
ABOUT THIS EPISODE
Today's episode begins Thanksgiving Day three years after I became entangled with the Sullivanians a seemingly benign group that supported creativity but would morph into the singular cult that remained undetected on Manhattan Upper West Side.
Annie was my roommate and friend, but I on that day I began to realize her ardent belief in the Sullivanians as the vanguard party that would would soon shape the world's future was all encompassing. On that frigid day we found our way to a Greenwich Village cafe where Annie also openly discussed wrestling with the presence of her mother in the group. I'd often thought of Maria as an older sister and Annie as the younger but going forward, her declaration left me in the murky waters of uncertainty.
The episode doesn't end at the café, though. Learn why I was referred to a fourth therapist in three years and how I wind up at Reliable Lists, Inc and how I'm guided by Stan Arnold, my new therapist, to become part of that office's union drive.
The episode culminates in an emotionally charged farewell,, as Maria Alena departs for Sierra Leone. This episode carries you little further along my intertwining personal path, that eventually carved a way for me out of the Sullivanian cult and towards a new beginning.
The complete documentary Through a BlueWindow can be seen on my youtube channel shellfein1. I would love to hear your thoughts.
Thank you
English
United States
SHOW NOTES 🔗
TRANSCRIPT 🔗
WEBVTT
00:01:55.572 --> 00:02:00.983
It was Thanksgiving Day and Annie and I were going to Macy's Thanksgiving Day parade.
00:02:00.983 --> 00:02:10.257
Unlike the balmy weather that had carried me across the park three years before, the temperature this day was in the single digits.
00:02:10.257 --> 00:02:18.043
But even so, annie and I had decided to brave the cold and was scurrying around the apartment getting dressed.
00:02:18.043 --> 00:02:20.615
Hurry, we don't want to miss Bowenkel.
00:02:20.615 --> 00:02:23.621
I yelled, pulling on a scratchy pair of long johns.
00:02:23.621 --> 00:02:27.352
I'll be ready in a minute, annie screamed back.
00:02:27.352 --> 00:02:29.478
I'm looking for my heavy wool socks.
00:02:30.949 --> 00:02:37.122
The days, frigid, cold, made short drift of our multiple layers and took our breath away.
00:02:37.122 --> 00:02:45.336
And soon after underdog had slowly drifted by, we headed downtown to Greenwich Village in search of warmth and hot chocolate.
00:02:45.336 --> 00:02:51.866
We exited at West Forth and Waverly Placed, walked east and found a small cafe.
00:02:51.866 --> 00:02:58.000
Its windows fogged over with steam, just like the frothy cappuccino we were seeking.
00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:09.980
The cinnamon-laced air was a clear indication that we'd chosen well, and we sat at a round marble table near the window to people watch and began the task of undressing.
00:03:09.980 --> 00:03:13.637
With all this morestheed, I feel like I'm going to spawn.
00:03:13.637 --> 00:03:16.050
I said, removing my last sweater.
00:03:17.569 --> 00:03:26.216
We ordered and after a few minutes of silence I said to Annie it must have been grotesque to see your mother at the party on Saturday night.
00:03:26.216 --> 00:03:29.173
It's always creepy.
00:03:29.173 --> 00:03:34.661
I thought I was over her being around, but I guess I'm not.
00:03:34.661 --> 00:03:38.396
It's not knowing whether she's going to show up at a party or not.
00:03:38.396 --> 00:03:39.459
That's the problem.
00:03:39.459 --> 00:03:45.639
So I've always wondered why did you come back to Sullivanian therapy?
00:03:45.639 --> 00:03:49.151
I'd thought this.
00:03:49.151 --> 00:03:56.257
After hearing Annie's history, I think it would be the last place you'd want to be.
00:03:56.257 --> 00:04:04.216
I wanted to go to school in New York and I'd heard about the training program and thought it sounded very exciting.
00:04:04.216 --> 00:04:10.221
I believe in Lewin and Getty's theories and I believe we are the Vanguard party.
00:04:11.410 --> 00:04:14.536
I tried to tune my mother out.
00:04:14.536 --> 00:04:17.100
Unfortunately I don't always succeed.
00:04:17.100 --> 00:04:24.254
Annie was nervously folding a paper napkin, twisting the bottom into what looked like the stem of a flower.
00:04:24.254 --> 00:04:32.362
I never saw Ron for therapy again, but he did refer me to Beverly and for that I'm grateful.
00:04:32.362 --> 00:04:37.499
She told me about Lainey looking for roommates and I guess you know the rest.
00:04:39.430 --> 00:04:46.939
After the waiter brought our hot chocolate, I slipped the flask from my jacket and poured some of the amber liquid through the creamy folds of whipped cream.
00:04:46.939 --> 00:04:52.778
Mmm, drink up, it'll warm you up and take the bitter taste of your mother away.
00:04:52.778 --> 00:04:55.016
Impossible, annie said.
00:04:55.016 --> 00:04:57.658
Well, now that you asked.
00:04:57.658 --> 00:05:02.755
I said with some irony so sorry, sorry, I'll step out of whatever it is.
00:05:02.755 --> 00:05:04.973
This is what did you want to say?
00:05:05.194 --> 00:05:14.875
Annie responded For me, thanksgiving is hard enough day, but this year, with my mother's death, I'm having a doubly hard time.
00:05:14.875 --> 00:05:17.918
I just can't wrap my head around it.
00:05:17.918 --> 00:05:21.737
Honestly, it's difficult for me to relate to that.
00:05:21.737 --> 00:05:26.259
Annie said my mother is alive, but I wish she wasn't here.
00:05:26.259 --> 00:05:27.932
I get that.
00:05:27.932 --> 00:05:31.161
Do you ever think about not being in the group?
00:05:31.161 --> 00:05:32.326
No".
00:05:32.326 --> 00:05:34.875
Annie answered without hesitation.
00:05:34.875 --> 00:05:42.278
I believe what I said about us being the Vanguard Party and we are going to help shape the future.
00:05:42.278 --> 00:05:45.072
I think Seth is a visionary.
00:05:45.072 --> 00:05:47.430
And what about the future?
00:05:47.430 --> 00:05:49.430
Do you think about having children?
00:05:49.430 --> 00:05:50.793
Not really.
00:05:50.793 --> 00:05:53.391
My mother hasn't been the greatest role model.
00:05:53.391 --> 00:06:03.454
I took note of Annie's fanatical devotion to the group, remembering her attitude towards Serena's individualism, and tucked it away.
00:06:03.454 --> 00:06:08.254
But I think that was when I began to distrust her just a little.
00:06:08.254 --> 00:06:16.626
On that day I thought of Maria as an older sister and Annie as the youngest, and I loved her.
00:06:16.626 --> 00:06:26.872
On that day it would have been impossible for me to imagine Annie as my nemesis and perpetrator of my expulsion from the group.
00:06:29.225 --> 00:06:39.716
Howard finally got out that Seth had been slowly disbanding the original trainee program because the Institute had come under scrutiny by the New York State Office of Mental Health.
00:06:39.716 --> 00:06:46.357
Going forward, new trainees had to have at the very least a college degree.
00:06:46.357 --> 00:06:58.816
Seth's conspiracy theories and paranoia intensified, and the therapist reinforced the importance of safeguarding the Institute and the trainee program in each session.
00:06:58.816 --> 00:07:01.911
I continued to abide for a while.
00:07:01.911 --> 00:07:13.074
College and graduate school are times to build future alliances, but I made few friends at school or work because those relationships were tainted with distrust.
00:07:13.074 --> 00:07:17.472
What if word got out about the group to the wrong people?
00:07:17.472 --> 00:07:25.790
Debbie eventually left the Institute too, because she'd been both Maria and my therapist.
00:07:25.790 --> 00:07:28.696
We were both upset, but for different reasons.
00:07:28.696 --> 00:07:33.334
Debbie had been Maria's therapist for the five years she'd been in the group.
00:07:33.334 --> 00:07:39.627
She was leaving for Sierra Leone soon and didn't want to change therapist before she left.
00:07:39.627 --> 00:07:44.875
And as for me, this would be my fourth therapist in less than three years.
00:07:46.064 --> 00:07:47.088
Annie was the lucky one.
00:07:47.088 --> 00:07:49.509
Beverly had a college degree.
00:07:49.509 --> 00:07:56.415
Annie was the only one home in the apartment after I was given the news.
00:07:56.415 --> 00:07:59.951
She was at the kitchen table surrounded by textbooks.
00:07:59.951 --> 00:08:06.614
When I blasted in announcing the news, I'm so angry I could put my fist through the wall.
00:08:06.614 --> 00:08:08.528
I said you are hysterical.
00:08:09.050 --> 00:08:10.374
Annie responded, looking up.
00:08:10.374 --> 00:08:14.735
Listen, I have finals coming up and I can't deal with this right now.
00:08:14.735 --> 00:08:18.331
I'm getting moved around like a relative.
00:08:18.331 --> 00:08:22.107
Nobody wants, I said, ignoring her being a moment.
00:08:22.107 --> 00:08:25.471
She asked so who were you referred to?
00:08:26.585 --> 00:08:28.071
Fucking Stan Arnold.
00:08:28.071 --> 00:08:30.550
He's a history teacher, for God's sake.
00:08:30.550 --> 00:08:31.434
What did he become?
00:08:31.434 --> 00:08:32.990
When did he become a trainee?
00:08:32.990 --> 00:08:35.412
What does he know about being a therapist?
00:08:35.412 --> 00:08:37.090
He looks like a fucking corpse.
00:08:37.090 --> 00:08:40.331
Try and calm down, honey.
00:08:40.331 --> 00:08:44.789
I know it's upsetting, but he must have something.
00:08:44.789 --> 00:08:46.494
They wouldn't have asked him.
00:08:46.494 --> 00:08:52.537
Besides, you know, it doesn't really matter who we're in therapy with, as long as we continue.
00:08:52.537 --> 00:09:00.351
Oh, for a second I thought you were showing some sympathy, annie, but here comes the party line.
00:09:00.351 --> 00:09:04.754
Do you truly believe that it doesn't matter who we see?
00:09:04.754 --> 00:09:09.473
I think the connection with our therapist is important.
00:09:09.473 --> 00:09:12.231
Wouldn't you be upset if Beverly left?
00:09:12.231 --> 00:09:15.874
Sure, but I'd go on just like you should.
00:09:16.804 --> 00:09:21.346
My stomach ached and I suddenly began to cry, embarrassed.
00:09:21.346 --> 00:09:22.329
I turned away.
00:09:22.329 --> 00:09:30.707
It's stupid and irrational, I know, but Debbie was my therapist when my mother died and I still feel guilty.
00:09:30.707 --> 00:09:32.151
I didn't go to the funeral.
00:09:32.151 --> 00:09:42.910
Annie finally walked to my side and put her arms around my shoulders, and then we heard the front door slam, I bet that's Maria, I said.
00:09:42.910 --> 00:09:45.807
Looking up she had the session after mine.
00:09:45.807 --> 00:09:48.952
Debbie's been her therapist since she got here.
00:09:48.952 --> 00:09:52.824
A moment later, maria walked into the kitchen.
00:09:52.824 --> 00:09:56.203
Her eyes were red and her expression told it all.
00:09:56.203 --> 00:09:58.981
She'd been referred to Stan Arnold too.
00:09:58.981 --> 00:10:01.136
You know.
00:10:01.136 --> 00:10:07.135
This just makes leaving for Sierra Leone so much easier, she said, pouring herself a drink.
00:10:09.794 --> 00:10:19.645
A few months later, it was rumored that Debbie had left the Institute because she couldn't function as a therapist anymore and had had a psychotic break.
00:10:19.645 --> 00:10:31.343
Teams of men from the group were supposedly sent out to find her and they did, on the street soliciting, and she was placed in psychiatric care.
00:10:31.343 --> 00:10:48.536
If I picture my time in the group as a bell curve, with my mother's death at the apex, it was my referral to Stan Arnold, a man I didn't respect as the push towards the downward slope.
00:10:48.536 --> 00:10:52.501
I was 25 when my mother died.
00:10:52.501 --> 00:11:00.761
I never had the opportunity to develop an adult relationship with her, one where I could hold different ideas but still love her.
00:11:00.761 --> 00:11:07.929
Instead, the Syllevanians reinforced her perceived Medusa-like power over me.
00:11:07.929 --> 00:11:17.959
One look and I'd be turned to stone, and panic would walk across my chest like a cat each time I thought of her even after death.
00:11:17.959 --> 00:11:22.964
I waited three weeks to call, but in the end I succumbed.
00:11:22.964 --> 00:11:30.006
I wasn't ready to leave the Syllevanians, but my contempt for Stan continued unabated.
00:11:30.006 --> 00:11:49.997
There was his bald head, his parchment paper skin and his array of polyester short-sleeve shirts pistachio green, dentist blue and anemic yellow all with the two middle buttons inevitably undone In the session.
00:11:49.997 --> 00:11:56.942
As he continued talking, he was unaware that his words were drowning in a murky pool surrounding him.
00:11:56.942 --> 00:12:12.086
I separated my physical self, which continued to nod as he spoke, from my magical self, much as I had done as a child, and flew from his dark basement room to circle the stars.
00:12:13.995 --> 00:12:23.579
In June 1976 I graduated from college and that fall I would begin the MFA Evening Program at Brooklyn College.
00:12:23.579 --> 00:12:29.996
I'd found a great waitress job working the lunch shift at the Bullen Bayer on Rector Street.
00:12:29.996 --> 00:12:40.921
The tips alone would pay for my summer share in Amagansett, not to mention the additional money from my long-time cleaning jobs.
00:12:40.921 --> 00:12:52.985
But as I was racing back to the apartment to share the news, I took a wide berth around a passing taxi and missteps slipping off my high-wetched corkies.
00:12:52.985 --> 00:12:59.044
I'd heard a snap like the crack of a wishbone and crumpled to the ground.
00:12:59.044 --> 00:13:04.363
I'd broken the fifth martyre-tarsle of my right foot.
00:13:05.774 --> 00:13:16.565
I stayed in Amagansett for the summer, but I had to rely on others to get around, and since the summer was all about partying, I was shunted to the sidelines.
00:13:16.565 --> 00:13:21.024
When school started, I was still hobbling around on crutches.
00:13:21.024 --> 00:13:32.102
I'd lost the waitress job and when Stan told me I'd sabotaged the job to comply with my mother's jealousy and belief, I couldn't be self-sufficient.
00:13:32.102 --> 00:13:34.165
The words rang hollow.
00:13:34.165 --> 00:13:48.784
He suggested I call around and borrow money in advance of my student loans a common practice in the group but even that would only stretch so far and I would eventually have to pay the money back.
00:13:49.875 --> 00:13:51.740
I desperately needed a job.
00:13:51.740 --> 00:14:03.240
The orthopedist had vetoed cleaning and waitressing and since the MF program was in the evening, all that was left was an office job.
00:14:03.240 --> 00:14:11.147
In one interview after another, I was told either you're overqualified or underqualified.
00:14:11.147 --> 00:14:18.106
And then I came across the ad for a reliable list, incorporated the best, in direct mail.
00:14:18.106 --> 00:14:30.343
I was employed as an account assistant and instructed not to mention my $160 a week's income to any of the other 15 assistants.
00:14:30.343 --> 00:14:36.966
We were merely glorified clerks who never directly interacted with the clients.
00:14:36.966 --> 00:14:47.716
The account executives role was to oversee us Laborious tasks we completed for them from inside their glass-enclosed offices.
00:14:47.716 --> 00:14:57.370
The intense scrutiny by the sales managers was only made bearable by the camaraderie among the young assistants.
00:14:57.370 --> 00:15:06.306
We were drones in a glass hive and I gradually began to realize this paralleled my function in the group.
00:15:07.984 --> 00:15:16.389
When Ken Rosenzweig, one of the assistants, invited me to lunch, I accepted, hoping it wasn't an overture to a real date.
00:15:16.389 --> 00:15:19.716
But I soon found out the real reason.
00:15:19.716 --> 00:15:31.413
I'm a member of District 65, a union that represents colorical work, as he explained, and I've been asking the account assistants to sign this card.
00:15:31.413 --> 00:15:36.572
And then he slid a white index card face down across the tabletop.
00:15:36.572 --> 00:15:40.413
I picked it up and began to read the fine print.
00:15:40.413 --> 00:15:48.110
I can summarize it for you, he said in a nutshell it says you want to be represented at reliable by the union.
00:15:48.110 --> 00:15:55.266
Among other things, it will give us the power to bargain and set up a salary and promotional schedule.
00:15:55.266 --> 00:16:02.529
The reason I asked you to lunch is because we're not permitted to recruit on the premises except during breaks.
00:16:02.529 --> 00:16:06.452
You're keeping it under wraps until a majority have signed.
00:16:07.944 --> 00:16:11.846
You were told by management not to share your salami, am I right?
00:16:11.846 --> 00:16:16.232
He continued we all were, but that's to polarize us.
00:16:16.232 --> 00:16:21.954
Listen, I make one hundred and ten dollars and I know Diane makes one hundred and forty.
00:16:21.954 --> 00:16:23.277
Think about it.
00:16:23.277 --> 00:16:30.407
Do you see any legitimate reason for keeping your salary a secret, other than creating suspicion between us?
00:16:30.407 --> 00:16:33.750
I make one hundred and sixty dollars.
00:16:33.750 --> 00:16:38.732
I immediately responded You're right, we all do the same shit work.
00:16:38.732 --> 00:16:40.628
He laughed at that.
00:16:40.628 --> 00:16:44.014
Right, we all have the same responsibilities.
00:16:44.014 --> 00:16:45.828
You shouldn't work for less.
00:16:45.828 --> 00:16:46.911
None of us should.
00:16:46.911 --> 00:16:50.111
The union would ask for uniform salaries.
00:16:51.584 --> 00:16:59.750
He wasn't the baby-faced kid he appeared to be, with dark brown hand, intelligent eyes and cheeks smoother than mine.
00:16:59.750 --> 00:17:03.232
I was intrigued but ignorant.
00:17:03.232 --> 00:17:06.373
My first thought was that the union was illegal.
00:17:06.373 --> 00:17:11.991
But this was the one area where Stan proved himself to be invaluable.
00:17:11.991 --> 00:17:15.492
His knowledge of labor history was impressive.
00:17:15.492 --> 00:17:20.535
He explained how unions had formed the United States' democracy.
00:17:20.535 --> 00:17:30.594
He was in his element and urged me to sign and, to my surprise, I became involved with the union meetings, recruitment and strategy planning.
00:17:30.594 --> 00:17:42.713
Unfortunately, stan hadn't been prescient enough to realize that the conflict might arise between my loyalty to the group and my newfound interest in the union.
00:17:44.825 --> 00:17:54.354
I soon learned that there were only four valid, rigorously enforced reasons for an account assistant to get up from their desk during the workday.
00:17:54.354 --> 00:17:57.852
The first was checking on a list availability.
00:17:57.852 --> 00:18:08.426
Then there was the allotted ten-minute break at three o'clock, going to the bathroom and finally getting coffee, and at reliable lists.
00:18:08.426 --> 00:18:13.734
Its employees were supplied with unlimited amounts of free coffee.
00:18:13.734 --> 00:18:19.794
Maria Elena left for Sierra Leone in early March.
00:18:19.794 --> 00:18:31.635
It was still bitterly cold and Sandra and I stood in the wind-battered airline terminal with Maria and her other friends, icicles hanging from our air-tipped words.
00:18:31.635 --> 00:18:44.728
Annie had fought with Maria for weeks before her departure, paratastic rages of feeling abandoned, her therapist had said, and Annie wouldn't come to the airport.
00:18:44.728 --> 00:18:54.788
When they finally announced her flight, maria took off her heavy blue coat and handed it to me Keep warm.
00:18:54.788 --> 00:18:59.394
We hugged and she whispered I love you, quora.
00:18:59.394 --> 00:19:02.091
I think I'm going to miss you most of all.
00:19:02.091 --> 00:19:06.733
Then, louder, she said to everyone else please write, please write.
00:19:06.733 --> 00:19:09.588
To quick hugs all around.
00:19:09.588 --> 00:19:14.461
She was gone like a genie, summoned back into the bottle.
00:01:55.572 --> 00:02:00.983
It was Thanksgiving Day and Annie and I were going to Macy's Thanksgiving Day parade.
00:02:00.983 --> 00:02:10.257
Unlike the balmy weather that had carried me across the park three years before, the temperature this day was in the single digits.
00:02:10.257 --> 00:02:18.043
But even so, annie and I had decided to brave the cold and was scurrying around the apartment getting dressed.
00:02:18.043 --> 00:02:20.615
Hurry, we don't want to miss Bowenkel.
00:02:20.615 --> 00:02:23.621
I yelled, pulling on a scratchy pair of long johns.
00:02:23.621 --> 00:02:27.352
I'll be ready in a minute, annie screamed back.
00:02:27.352 --> 00:02:29.478
I'm looking for my heavy wool socks.
00:02:30.949 --> 00:02:37.122
The days, frigid, cold, made short drift of our multiple layers and took our breath away.
00:02:37.122 --> 00:02:45.336
And soon after underdog had slowly drifted by, we headed downtown to Greenwich Village in search of warmth and hot chocolate.
00:02:45.336 --> 00:02:51.866
We exited at West Forth and Waverly Placed, walked east and found a small cafe.
00:02:51.866 --> 00:02:58.000
Its windows fogged over with steam, just like the frothy cappuccino we were seeking.
00:02:58.000 --> 00:03:09.980
The cinnamon-laced air was a clear indication that we'd chosen well, and we sat at a round marble table near the window to people watch and began the task of undressing.
00:03:09.980 --> 00:03:13.637
With all this morestheed, I feel like I'm going to spawn.
00:03:13.637 --> 00:03:16.050
I said, removing my last sweater.
00:03:17.569 --> 00:03:26.216
We ordered and after a few minutes of silence I said to Annie it must have been grotesque to see your mother at the party on Saturday night.
00:03:26.216 --> 00:03:29.173
It's always creepy.
00:03:29.173 --> 00:03:34.661
I thought I was over her being around, but I guess I'm not.
00:03:34.661 --> 00:03:38.396
It's not knowing whether she's going to show up at a party or not.
00:03:38.396 --> 00:03:39.459
That's the problem.
00:03:39.459 --> 00:03:45.639
So I've always wondered why did you come back to Sullivanian therapy?
00:03:45.639 --> 00:03:49.151
I'd thought this.
00:03:49.151 --> 00:03:56.257
After hearing Annie's history, I think it would be the last place you'd want to be.
00:03:56.257 --> 00:04:04.216
I wanted to go to school in New York and I'd heard about the training program and thought it sounded very exciting.
00:04:04.216 --> 00:04:10.221
I believe in Lewin and Getty's theories and I believe we are the Vanguard party.
00:04:11.410 --> 00:04:14.536
I tried to tune my mother out.
00:04:14.536 --> 00:04:17.100
Unfortunately I don't always succeed.
00:04:17.100 --> 00:04:24.254
Annie was nervously folding a paper napkin, twisting the bottom into what looked like the stem of a flower.
00:04:24.254 --> 00:04:32.362
I never saw Ron for therapy again, but he did refer me to Beverly and for that I'm grateful.
00:04:32.362 --> 00:04:37.499
She told me about Lainey looking for roommates and I guess you know the rest.
00:04:39.430 --> 00:04:46.939
After the waiter brought our hot chocolate, I slipped the flask from my jacket and poured some of the amber liquid through the creamy folds of whipped cream.
00:04:46.939 --> 00:04:52.778
Mmm, drink up, it'll warm you up and take the bitter taste of your mother away.
00:04:52.778 --> 00:04:55.016
Impossible, annie said.
00:04:55.016 --> 00:04:57.658
Well, now that you asked.
00:04:57.658 --> 00:05:02.755
I said with some irony so sorry, sorry, I'll step out of whatever it is.
00:05:02.755 --> 00:05:04.973
This is what did you want to say?
00:05:05.194 --> 00:05:14.875
Annie responded For me, thanksgiving is hard enough day, but this year, with my mother's death, I'm having a doubly hard time.
00:05:14.875 --> 00:05:17.918
I just can't wrap my head around it.
00:05:17.918 --> 00:05:21.737
Honestly, it's difficult for me to relate to that.
00:05:21.737 --> 00:05:26.259
Annie said my mother is alive, but I wish she wasn't here.
00:05:26.259 --> 00:05:27.932
I get that.
00:05:27.932 --> 00:05:31.161
Do you ever think about not being in the group?
00:05:31.161 --> 00:05:32.326
No".
00:05:32.326 --> 00:05:34.875
Annie answered without hesitation.
00:05:34.875 --> 00:05:42.278
I believe what I said about us being the Vanguard Party and we are going to help shape the future.
00:05:42.278 --> 00:05:45.072
I think Seth is a visionary.
00:05:45.072 --> 00:05:47.430
And what about the future?
00:05:47.430 --> 00:05:49.430
Do you think about having children?
00:05:49.430 --> 00:05:50.793
Not really.
00:05:50.793 --> 00:05:53.391
My mother hasn't been the greatest role model.
00:05:53.391 --> 00:06:03.454
I took note of Annie's fanatical devotion to the group, remembering her attitude towards Serena's individualism, and tucked it away.
00:06:03.454 --> 00:06:08.254
But I think that was when I began to distrust her just a little.
00:06:08.254 --> 00:06:16.626
On that day I thought of Maria as an older sister and Annie as the youngest, and I loved her.
00:06:16.626 --> 00:06:26.872
On that day it would have been impossible for me to imagine Annie as my nemesis and perpetrator of my expulsion from the group.
00:06:29.225 --> 00:06:39.716
Howard finally got out that Seth had been slowly disbanding the original trainee program because the Institute had come under scrutiny by the New York State Office of Mental Health.
00:06:39.716 --> 00:06:46.357
Going forward, new trainees had to have at the very least a college degree.
00:06:46.357 --> 00:06:58.816
Seth's conspiracy theories and paranoia intensified, and the therapist reinforced the importance of safeguarding the Institute and the trainee program in each session.
00:06:58.816 --> 00:07:01.911
I continued to abide for a while.
00:07:01.911 --> 00:07:13.074
College and graduate school are times to build future alliances, but I made few friends at school or work because those relationships were tainted with distrust.
00:07:13.074 --> 00:07:17.472
What if word got out about the group to the wrong people?
00:07:17.472 --> 00:07:25.790
Debbie eventually left the Institute too, because she'd been both Maria and my therapist.
00:07:25.790 --> 00:07:28.696
We were both upset, but for different reasons.
00:07:28.696 --> 00:07:33.334
Debbie had been Maria's therapist for the five years she'd been in the group.
00:07:33.334 --> 00:07:39.627
She was leaving for Sierra Leone soon and didn't want to change therapist before she left.
00:07:39.627 --> 00:07:44.875
And as for me, this would be my fourth therapist in less than three years.
00:07:46.064 --> 00:07:47.088
Annie was the lucky one.
00:07:47.088 --> 00:07:49.509
Beverly had a college degree.
00:07:49.509 --> 00:07:56.415
Annie was the only one home in the apartment after I was given the news.
00:07:56.415 --> 00:07:59.951
She was at the kitchen table surrounded by textbooks.
00:07:59.951 --> 00:08:06.614
When I blasted in announcing the news, I'm so angry I could put my fist through the wall.
00:08:06.614 --> 00:08:08.528
I said you are hysterical.
00:08:09.050 --> 00:08:10.374
Annie responded, looking up.
00:08:10.374 --> 00:08:14.735
Listen, I have finals coming up and I can't deal with this right now.
00:08:14.735 --> 00:08:18.331
I'm getting moved around like a relative.
00:08:18.331 --> 00:08:22.107
Nobody wants, I said, ignoring her being a moment.
00:08:22.107 --> 00:08:25.471
She asked so who were you referred to?
00:08:26.585 --> 00:08:28.071
Fucking Stan Arnold.
00:08:28.071 --> 00:08:30.550
He's a history teacher, for God's sake.
00:08:30.550 --> 00:08:31.434
What did he become?
00:08:31.434 --> 00:08:32.990
When did he become a trainee?
00:08:32.990 --> 00:08:35.412
What does he know about being a therapist?
00:08:35.412 --> 00:08:37.090
He looks like a fucking corpse.
00:08:37.090 --> 00:08:40.331
Try and calm down, honey.
00:08:40.331 --> 00:08:44.789
I know it's upsetting, but he must have something.
00:08:44.789 --> 00:08:46.494
They wouldn't have asked him.
00:08:46.494 --> 00:08:52.537
Besides, you know, it doesn't really matter who we're in therapy with, as long as we continue.
00:08:52.537 --> 00:09:00.351
Oh, for a second I thought you were showing some sympathy, annie, but here comes the party line.
00:09:00.351 --> 00:09:04.754
Do you truly believe that it doesn't matter who we see?
00:09:04.754 --> 00:09:09.473
I think the connection with our therapist is important.
00:09:09.473 --> 00:09:12.231
Wouldn't you be upset if Beverly left?
00:09:12.231 --> 00:09:15.874
Sure, but I'd go on just like you should.
00:09:16.804 --> 00:09:21.346
My stomach ached and I suddenly began to cry, embarrassed.
00:09:21.346 --> 00:09:22.329
I turned away.
00:09:22.329 --> 00:09:30.707
It's stupid and irrational, I know, but Debbie was my therapist when my mother died and I still feel guilty.
00:09:30.707 --> 00:09:32.151
I didn't go to the funeral.
00:09:32.151 --> 00:09:42.910
Annie finally walked to my side and put her arms around my shoulders, and then we heard the front door slam, I bet that's Maria, I said.
00:09:42.910 --> 00:09:45.807
Looking up she had the session after mine.
00:09:45.807 --> 00:09:48.952
Debbie's been her therapist since she got here.
00:09:48.952 --> 00:09:52.824
A moment later, maria walked into the kitchen.
00:09:52.824 --> 00:09:56.203
Her eyes were red and her expression told it all.
00:09:56.203 --> 00:09:58.981
She'd been referred to Stan Arnold too.
00:09:58.981 --> 00:10:01.136
You know.
00:10:01.136 --> 00:10:07.135
This just makes leaving for Sierra Leone so much easier, she said, pouring herself a drink.
00:10:09.794 --> 00:10:19.645
A few months later, it was rumored that Debbie had left the Institute because she couldn't function as a therapist anymore and had had a psychotic break.
00:10:19.645 --> 00:10:31.343
Teams of men from the group were supposedly sent out to find her and they did, on the street soliciting, and she was placed in psychiatric care.
00:10:31.343 --> 00:10:48.536
If I picture my time in the group as a bell curve, with my mother's death at the apex, it was my referral to Stan Arnold, a man I didn't respect as the push towards the downward slope.
00:10:48.536 --> 00:10:52.501
I was 25 when my mother died.
00:10:52.501 --> 00:11:00.761
I never had the opportunity to develop an adult relationship with her, one where I could hold different ideas but still love her.
00:11:00.761 --> 00:11:07.929
Instead, the Syllevanians reinforced her perceived Medusa-like power over me.
00:11:07.929 --> 00:11:17.959
One look and I'd be turned to stone, and panic would walk across my chest like a cat each time I thought of her even after death.
00:11:17.959 --> 00:11:22.964
I waited three weeks to call, but in the end I succumbed.
00:11:22.964 --> 00:11:30.006
I wasn't ready to leave the Syllevanians, but my contempt for Stan continued unabated.
00:11:30.006 --> 00:11:49.997
There was his bald head, his parchment paper skin and his array of polyester short-sleeve shirts pistachio green, dentist blue and anemic yellow all with the two middle buttons inevitably undone In the session.
00:11:49.997 --> 00:11:56.942
As he continued talking, he was unaware that his words were drowning in a murky pool surrounding him.
00:11:56.942 --> 00:12:12.086
I separated my physical self, which continued to nod as he spoke, from my magical self, much as I had done as a child, and flew from his dark basement room to circle the stars.
00:12:13.995 --> 00:12:23.579
In June 1976 I graduated from college and that fall I would begin the MFA Evening Program at Brooklyn College.
00:12:23.579 --> 00:12:29.996
I'd found a great waitress job working the lunch shift at the Bullen Bayer on Rector Street.
00:12:29.996 --> 00:12:40.921
The tips alone would pay for my summer share in Amagansett, not to mention the additional money from my long-time cleaning jobs.
00:12:40.921 --> 00:12:52.985
But as I was racing back to the apartment to share the news, I took a wide berth around a passing taxi and missteps slipping off my high-wetched corkies.
00:12:52.985 --> 00:12:59.044
I'd heard a snap like the crack of a wishbone and crumpled to the ground.
00:12:59.044 --> 00:13:04.363
I'd broken the fifth martyre-tarsle of my right foot.
00:13:05.774 --> 00:13:16.565
I stayed in Amagansett for the summer, but I had to rely on others to get around, and since the summer was all about partying, I was shunted to the sidelines.
00:13:16.565 --> 00:13:21.024
When school started, I was still hobbling around on crutches.
00:13:21.024 --> 00:13:32.102
I'd lost the waitress job and when Stan told me I'd sabotaged the job to comply with my mother's jealousy and belief, I couldn't be self-sufficient.
00:13:32.102 --> 00:13:34.165
The words rang hollow.
00:13:34.165 --> 00:13:48.784
He suggested I call around and borrow money in advance of my student loans a common practice in the group but even that would only stretch so far and I would eventually have to pay the money back.
00:13:49.875 --> 00:13:51.740
I desperately needed a job.
00:13:51.740 --> 00:14:03.240
The orthopedist had vetoed cleaning and waitressing and since the MF program was in the evening, all that was left was an office job.
00:14:03.240 --> 00:14:11.147
In one interview after another, I was told either you're overqualified or underqualified.
00:14:11.147 --> 00:14:18.106
And then I came across the ad for a reliable list, incorporated the best, in direct mail.
00:14:18.106 --> 00:14:30.343
I was employed as an account assistant and instructed not to mention my $160 a week's income to any of the other 15 assistants.
00:14:30.343 --> 00:14:36.966
We were merely glorified clerks who never directly interacted with the clients.
00:14:36.966 --> 00:14:47.716
The account executives role was to oversee us Laborious tasks we completed for them from inside their glass-enclosed offices.
00:14:47.716 --> 00:14:57.370
The intense scrutiny by the sales managers was only made bearable by the camaraderie among the young assistants.
00:14:57.370 --> 00:15:06.306
We were drones in a glass hive and I gradually began to realize this paralleled my function in the group.
00:15:07.984 --> 00:15:16.389
When Ken Rosenzweig, one of the assistants, invited me to lunch, I accepted, hoping it wasn't an overture to a real date.
00:15:16.389 --> 00:15:19.716
But I soon found out the real reason.
00:15:19.716 --> 00:15:31.413
I'm a member of District 65, a union that represents colorical work, as he explained, and I've been asking the account assistants to sign this card.
00:15:31.413 --> 00:15:36.572
And then he slid a white index card face down across the tabletop.
00:15:36.572 --> 00:15:40.413
I picked it up and began to read the fine print.
00:15:40.413 --> 00:15:48.110
I can summarize it for you, he said in a nutshell it says you want to be represented at reliable by the union.
00:15:48.110 --> 00:15:55.266
Among other things, it will give us the power to bargain and set up a salary and promotional schedule.
00:15:55.266 --> 00:16:02.529
The reason I asked you to lunch is because we're not permitted to recruit on the premises except during breaks.
00:16:02.529 --> 00:16:06.452
You're keeping it under wraps until a majority have signed.
00:16:07.944 --> 00:16:11.846
You were told by management not to share your salami, am I right?
00:16:11.846 --> 00:16:16.232
He continued we all were, but that's to polarize us.
00:16:16.232 --> 00:16:21.954
Listen, I make one hundred and ten dollars and I know Diane makes one hundred and forty.
00:16:21.954 --> 00:16:23.277
Think about it.
00:16:23.277 --> 00:16:30.407
Do you see any legitimate reason for keeping your salary a secret, other than creating suspicion between us?
00:16:30.407 --> 00:16:33.750
I make one hundred and sixty dollars.
00:16:33.750 --> 00:16:38.732
I immediately responded You're right, we all do the same shit work.
00:16:38.732 --> 00:16:40.628
He laughed at that.
00:16:40.628 --> 00:16:44.014
Right, we all have the same responsibilities.
00:16:44.014 --> 00:16:45.828
You shouldn't work for less.
00:16:45.828 --> 00:16:46.911
None of us should.
00:16:46.911 --> 00:16:50.111
The union would ask for uniform salaries.
00:16:51.584 --> 00:16:59.750
He wasn't the baby-faced kid he appeared to be, with dark brown hand, intelligent eyes and cheeks smoother than mine.
00:16:59.750 --> 00:17:03.232
I was intrigued but ignorant.
00:17:03.232 --> 00:17:06.373
My first thought was that the union was illegal.
00:17:06.373 --> 00:17:11.991
But this was the one area where Stan proved himself to be invaluable.
00:17:11.991 --> 00:17:15.492
His knowledge of labor history was impressive.
00:17:15.492 --> 00:17:20.535
He explained how unions had formed the United States' democracy.
00:17:20.535 --> 00:17:30.594
He was in his element and urged me to sign and, to my surprise, I became involved with the union meetings, recruitment and strategy planning.
00:17:30.594 --> 00:17:42.713
Unfortunately, stan hadn't been prescient enough to realize that the conflict might arise between my loyalty to the group and my newfound interest in the union.
00:17:44.825 --> 00:17:54.354
I soon learned that there were only four valid, rigorously enforced reasons for an account assistant to get up from their desk during the workday.
00:17:54.354 --> 00:17:57.852
The first was checking on a list availability.
00:17:57.852 --> 00:18:08.426
Then there was the allotted ten-minute break at three o'clock, going to the bathroom and finally getting coffee, and at reliable lists.
00:18:08.426 --> 00:18:13.734
Its employees were supplied with unlimited amounts of free coffee.
00:18:13.734 --> 00:18:19.794
Maria Elena left for Sierra Leone in early March.
00:18:19.794 --> 00:18:31.635
It was still bitterly cold and Sandra and I stood in the wind-battered airline terminal with Maria and her other friends, icicles hanging from our air-tipped words.
00:18:31.635 --> 00:18:44.728
Annie had fought with Maria for weeks before her departure, paratastic rages of feeling abandoned, her therapist had said, and Annie wouldn't come to the airport.
00:18:44.728 --> 00:18:54.788
When they finally announced her flight, maria took off her heavy blue coat and handed it to me Keep warm.
00:18:54.788 --> 00:18:59.394
We hugged and she whispered I love you, quora.
00:18:59.394 --> 00:19:02.091
I think I'm going to miss you most of all.
00:19:02.091 --> 00:19:06.733
Then, louder, she said to everyone else please write, please write.
00:19:06.733 --> 00:19:09.588
To quick hugs all around.
00:19:09.588 --> 00:19:14.461
She was gone like a genie, summoned back into the bottle.
SEARCH PAST EPISODES
Search past episodes of The Sullivanians:Through a Blue Window ((c) 2019 shelley feinerman's Podcast.
Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from shelley feinerman, which is the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Listen Notes, Inc.
EDIT
Thank you for helping to keep the podcast database up to date.
