Discovering Self-Assured Motherhood with Rachel Nielson, Host of 3 in 30 Takeaways for Moms

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Music.
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Oh, and this doesn't, it doesn't give us the cool countdown. Like, I don't get a 5, 4, 3, 2, 1. So we are recording, Rachel.
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Oh, why, thank you. I'm glad to be here.
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I would have counted you down. I do also have to tell you, you can set it up to have the countdown.
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Can you really?
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Yes. Squadcast has that capability. I feel like if we wanted to run this on both my virtual couch and my Waking Up to Narcissism podcast, what I should say to you right now is, I think you're wrong. I don't think it's, I don't think you can do that.
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I can gaslight you, even though I have no idea, and you know that you can do it.
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But I'm saying, I don't think so, Rachel.
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Yeah, well, I'm pretty sure, Tony, because I haven't set up that way on my podcast, but whatever, okay.
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If you don't believe me. Okay, now watch this, then I will move right on and ignore everything you said,
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because that's what a true emotionally immature person does when they may be wrong, because they can't be wrong.
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But I digress.
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Welcome to a very, very special episode of The Virtual Couch.
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This is my guest, Rachel Nielsen. Rachel is host of three and 30 podcasts for moms.
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And one of my favorite people, well, because I think I was just saying,
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I may have even said it in an episode recently where this will probably be,
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I don't even know, 390 something episode.
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And you were so kind to have me on when I was but a podcasting neophyte,
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and you have solid takeaways on your episodes.
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And if I remember correctly, you can tell me, you were saying, okay, so I need three takeaways.
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And I was kind of saying, I don't really do that, Rachel.
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I just kind of talk and, is that what you remember?
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Yeah, but we're a good team because you would talk and then I would say, so that's your takeaway, right, Tony?
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And you'd say, oh, that is my takeaway.
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So together we make a good team. I can bring you back to the takeaways and you provide all the wisdom.
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Exactly, but what I think is, and I'm being so serious about this,
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is the takeaway is homework.
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And I think people really, I believe people actually do like homework
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and my therapist brain gets in the way so often
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And I'm used to then sitting with somebody each week, and you give them the homework, they don't do the homework,
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they come back, and then they feel bad about it to the point where then at some point
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they maybe don't even come back, or you know they're making up an excuse of,
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man, I meant to do it, but then all these things happen.
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And I've even gotten to the point where I wanna say, oh, it's okay if you don't.
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I mean, you're human, things get in the way.
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And so I think that you're in my relational frame, if I wanna get all nerdy in psychology,
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of when I think about giving homework, I even think about, I feel like that's what your takeaways
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do is it gives people these actionable items to take away from the podcast.
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And I think that's really.
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Necessary. So I appreciate that. Well, thanks. Yeah. I have found that busy moms have busy brains
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and they need some takeaways. Otherwise it's like they listen to the whole conversation.
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They're like, that was great. But do I remember anything that I learned? No. And in fact,
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I even recapped the three takeaways at the end. And I have had so many moms tell me how grateful
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they are for that because they're listening and then they get interrupted by a kid and then to
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to just have that quick recap at the end.
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They're like, okay, I can maybe actually remember something from what I just learned.
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Yeah. Well, and I think you're teeing us up very well talking about moms and I'm gonna be so intentional
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that we were having a conversation a week or so ago just asking you what you're up to lately,
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and you were talking about a course that you are about to, what's the way that, what do the kids say these days?
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Drop, start, launch. I don't know, I say launch.
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Launch, okay. But I'm not a kid. Okay. OK, so of course, you're about to launch.
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And this is time sensitive.
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So I just wanted to get you on here and talk about it. Because I really, really appreciate the work
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you do with busy moms.
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A large percentage of the population of people I work with and that listen to the virtual couch
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are busy moms. And so my heart goes out to the busy mom and not even trying to be humorous.
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But I mean, I can honestly say I've never been a busy mom.
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So as much as I try to provide help and content, you live the life of a busy mom.
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And so kind of take it away. I mean, tell me about the course and tell me about dates
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that people need to know. And let's just start talking about what you're offering.
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Yeah. So this is my Self-Assured Motherhood program. It is like my signature program that only opens once a year.
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So when I told you that, it's like a 10-day to 10-day enrollment period.
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And you were like, let's get you on the podcast. So thank you very much for being willing to bring me on.
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It is a nine-month long program, which I know for a lot of people seems like, whoa,
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I don't know how I can commit to that.
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But honestly, real change requires slow, steady work. It does. It really does.
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And for most of us, we aren't going to do that kind of slow, steady work
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without some sort of outside accountability.
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And so having this weekly class that moms can attend, it's 60 minutes long.
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You can either attend it live on Zoom or just listen to the replay that's on a private podcast feed.
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If you can just fit in 60 minutes a week, and then there's a corresponding homework assignment
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that'll take you about 20, most of us have 90 minutes a week that we could carve out if we needed to.
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And over the course of nine months, we covered nine different principles
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of becoming a more self-assured mom, a month per principal.
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And the transformation that women have seen in this program is incredible.
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And it's so humbling for me as the creator of it. Every time I end a session and I read the reviews
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and I hear from women saying how much it's impacted their life, I'm just like, whoa.
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But it's not obviously not just me. It's also the work that these women are putting in,
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learning how to know themselves better and bring the best of themselves to their lives.
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So I had no idea. I knew that was the nine months, but I didn't know the reason behind that. But you're so right.
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And I love talking about implicit memory, what it feels like to be you is formed by
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the slow residue of lived experience.
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So you're so right that people want that change, you know, the old three week to a change myth,
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that is so, I think it does more damage than good, but if somebody can settle in for nine
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months, that's amazing.
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Do you have people that, do they feel like a tribe, a community, a group?
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I mean, do people get to know each other really well?
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Yeah, absolutely. I think the women who really take it seriously and show up and they get
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to know each other and you just feel a real sense of camaraderie with other people that
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are doing the same kind of work as you, that are sort of values aligned, that care about
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the type of intentional parenting that you care about, that are going through the ups
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and downs. And I'm always very open and share my highs and my lows. I mean, I'm honest about
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my lows in motherhood. And I think that that really bonds a group together when we can
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also share. I lost it this week. I really messed up. And how are we going to rally?
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And it's a really special, special place for women to be a part of. So I'm grateful to
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you for helping me get the word out about it.
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So it's interesting you say that too. I have in my notes that if we ran out of things to
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talk about, which I'm not worried about, but that I wanted to even talk to you about. I
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love following you online or on social media and how open you are about everything. I mean,
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I think even back during all times political, you'd made some comments that I loved and and then your own.
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Faith journey and and just parenting challenges and I mean if somebody is not following you I
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think there's so much gold there but then to have an opportunity to work with you in a group
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is really neat too. Yeah and I'd say I'm even more vulnerable in that group because I can be like
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there's some things especially now that my kids are getting a little bit older I feel like I can't
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share all of the ups and downs of parenting because it's their life to it's their business
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to my kids. But I do feel like in this private group, I can be more honest about some of the
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hard stuff. I know they know me. They know my kids. They come to love my kids over the course
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of this program, you know? And so it really is a special place for me to share my heart. And I
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think that that makes other women feel comfortable sharing too. I made the joke earlier, we can get
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this over on the Waking Up to Narcissism podcast. But what's fascinating about that one is I do get
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get more feedback on that podcast than I think I ever anticipated. And it's so many people
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sharing their stories and, and that formerly felt like they were alone or nobody else understood.
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And then I've got this private Facebook group where it just that camaraderie, I think people
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just really want that sense of community and sense of purpose. So, so I, I love the fact
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that you're bringing a lot of people together that probably do feel like they're, they're.
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Pretty isolated or alone. Do you get that, that vibe from people that come into the course?
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Oh, yeah. I mean, I've had women say that they had no idea that there were other mothers
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that felt like they do, that felt lost and a little unmoored in motherhood, or who yelled.
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They didn't know other moms yelled at their kids sometimes. They didn't know that other
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moms were missing a sense of purpose until they got in this community and looked around
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and said, oh my gosh, I'm not like a weirdo. There's a lot of people who feel the way I
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I feel. And of course, there's different iterations of people's experiences, but there's a commonality
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of the experience of parenting that is pretty universal when you really get to the heart
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of it. And I think that comes through in this course.
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I love it. I love it because all the cliches, there is no instruction manual and that sort
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of thing are true. But then when I start getting into the therapeutic modality, I love acceptance
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and commitment therapy. Now let's even bring in there all the variables that come into
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play from what you saw with your your parents and what you didn't see and what you know and what you
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don't know and what you don't know that you don't know. And I had a lady on last week, an amazing
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therapist, Diana. She's talking about postpartum depression and she was talking about postpartum
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rage and how so many people are not familiar that those feelings can exist and then especially not
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wanting to share those. So I mean, do you when you get into your course, what are some of the
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things that people do talk about? What are is it? Is it anything and everything?
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Yeah, well, I mean, we have, like I said, we have the nine units, the nine principles
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that really create the framework for our discussion.
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So it's not like I'm just shooting off the hip every week of what we're going to talk
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about. And then within those nine principles, we have the nine principles that we're going principles.
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There's, we really dive deep. So, to sort of explain how it's set up, it's three trimesters,
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and honestly, I didn't intend for it to be like a pregnancy metaphor. When I very first created it,
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it was just nine principles I came up with. We made it a nine-month program,
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and then women started saying, oh, nine months, like this is a meaningful number to mothers.
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And it is broken into trimesters, which is kind of crazy. But in the first trimester,
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the pillar that we're focusing on is know yourself. Okay.
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Talk about that. Yeah. You have the pillars. Three months. Yeah. The first three months are all the foundational work of getting to
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know yourself. So it's not like we're just jumping straight to parenting strategies,
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which I think so many of some of the like online courses you might see for parenting,
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they're kind of like hacks and strategies for scripts you can use with your kid. And that's,
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that's fine and useful at times. But I feel like what makes this program special
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is that we're starting with the foundation of knowing yourself,
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that we're not even going to talk about really parenting strategies until the
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third trimester, the last trimester, because first you have to know yourself,
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then you have to honor your needs, and that's the second trimester.
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And then the third trimester is love your people.
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So after you know yourself and honor your needs, that's when you can bring the best of yourself.
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You can be centered and stable as you go into a unit learning about how to love
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your people. And obviously, you're not going to wait and be like, for the next six months, I'm not going to love my little.
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You're going to continue doing the best you can, but you're going to be learning about yourself all along the way. And
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little by little, it builds up and you're going to notice that you have a lot more self confidence, trust in yourself,
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that you feel more grounded, you feel more boundaried around your kids, you're not as overstimulated all the time. And
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you're ready to really for those parenting strategies to actually stick by the time we get to that last trimester because you've spent so much time building
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the foundation of really learning how to know and love yourself first.
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So Rachel, first of all, a quick round of jokes. So first trimester, are people more nauseous during that time or do they no longer like
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Oreo shakes after they throw up or...
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Yes, we can do it. I made I may even delete those out myself.
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No, I love it, actually, because I've never thought of that. But
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yeah, maybe that first trimester is the hardest part for some women. Because it's not that sometimes it's not that fun to
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get to know yourself. Sometimes you like, look, you don't want to look at yourself and look at what's really underneath all of
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that. And some the first trimester, the three units are
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first voice your values. Okay, which I know you'll be a huge I love it. Yes. Yes. You do so much work with values in acceptance and commitment there.
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Yeah. So we spend the whole month helping women figure out what their top five values are,
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and how can you really build a parenting life around your values, not the shoulds that
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everybody else is saying, but your values. Then the next unit is celebrate your strengths.
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Okay. So we're really focusing in on helping women identify their unique strengths to stop
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focusing so much on their weaknesses and all the things that they think they can't do or somebody
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else does better to really own those strengths. And then the next unit is study your story.
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And that's where we ask women to kind of look back a little at their childhood, at their past,
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their context. And maybe there's a reason why you are the way you are. Like looking at your story
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and saying, okay, that's my story and I'm going to acknowledge it and I'm going to heal from it.
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But what do I want my story going forward to be?
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Like, what story do I choose for now?
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And I think that that study your story unit is often hard. Like, that's probably the nauseous unit.
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People are like, I don't really want to look at that.
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And obviously, you have to pace yourself and go as much as you're comfortable with.
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But sometimes it's hard to look at your past and acknowledge some of the reasons
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why you are the way you are.
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But I have found it's almost like clearing out an infection.
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Like if you have stuff that you've kind of tried to put aside that's hard in your past,
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but it's like a festering thing, once you've acknowledged it and kind of gotten it out,
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then it can actually heal and then you can move forward.
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Rachel, there's so much good there. And I'm not even I set the jokes aside, but that was gold that you would be sick while you're starting to to self-evaluate,
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because I think that that is a tough place to be.
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But to get to that place of acceptance of, oh, all those things happened, so give myself grace.
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And now I can just be based off of that data. But I love that when you said earlier that some other parenting...
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Classes are more of these hacks. I do feel like that's the thing where if you're handing somebody just a checklist of items to do,
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they're really not invested. And so then if that does, if it works, they still beat themselves up and saying, okay, well,
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I had to pay somebody to get the hack or the checklist. And if it doesn't work, we get to say, what's wrong with me?
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I can't make this work. So I really like that that changed from within.
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But if you don't know who you are, what you stand for, what that purpose is,
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I really feel like, yeah, where you came from, and I feel like people are just still asking everybody else, well, who do you think I am? And that's a, that's a, what do you think I should do? Yeah, and that's handing that person power. And I, you know, I keep referring back to this, the waking up the narcissism podcast. And I mean, that's, that's a way to grow if you're together in a healthy relationship where people go from enmeshment to then differentiated, but then in an emotionally immature or, you know, heaven
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forbid, abusive or manipulative relationship, handing that other
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person the, what do you think? It's, it can be really dangerous.
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And so I feel like this course would be really helpful for people just to be able to figure out who they are and stop
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listening to those other voices around them that are saying,
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well, I think you need to be this. Because if that's used in
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a, in a way, a manipulative way, then that, that is really where somebody starts to lose their sense of self.
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Absolutely. Yeah. And okay. So now after you've, you aren't as nauseous.
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So now we move into the second trimester.
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Second trimester. So you, so first trimester, know yourself,
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second trimester honor your needs.
00:16:45.180 --> 00:16:52.484
And the three principles that we discuss, the three monthly topics are first bolster your boundaries. Second,
00:16:52.755 --> 00:16:57.409
sanctify your soul care and third, pursue your purpose.
00:16:57.796 --> 00:17:04.200
And so we dive into each of those talking about how your needs matter, and boundaries
00:17:04.200 --> 00:17:11.785
help you to protect and honor your needs, and soul care or self-care helps you to care,
00:17:12.260 --> 00:17:17.420
for yourself to the same level that you would care for someone else you love, like your child.
00:17:17.420 --> 00:17:23.056
And then last, with purpose, I truly believe that living your purpose is a need.
00:17:23.551 --> 00:17:27.601
It's not like an extra something to fit in if you have time.
00:17:27.601 --> 00:17:31.321
I think that your purpose can look different in every season,
00:17:31.321 --> 00:17:35.441
depending on the ages of your children and the capacity that you have.
00:17:35.441 --> 00:17:41.281
But if you have fully put aside your own sense of purpose, you're going to start withering inside.
00:17:41.394 --> 00:17:46.321
And I can say that from personal experience, because that is how I felt at the beginning of my motherhood.
00:17:46.321 --> 00:17:51.494
And it wasn't until I really stepped back into my purpose, which I believe my purpose is teaching,
00:17:51.836 --> 00:17:58.721
that I felt so much new life and excitement that I was then able to bring to my family.
00:17:58.721 --> 00:18:01.064
It didn't harm my family by me living my purpose.
00:18:01.321 --> 00:18:05.161
It only blessed them. So those are the three units within that trimester.
00:18:05.161 --> 00:18:08.527
Bolster your boundaries, sanctify your soul care, and pursue your purpose.
00:18:08.905 --> 00:18:12.161
Okay, well, and those, we could break each one of those apart too,
00:18:12.161 --> 00:18:17.441
and I wanna throw my therapeutic lens over them, which sounds so, like I think I've got it all figured out,
00:18:17.441 --> 00:18:21.841
and I'm really not saying that, But it's so important because the boundaries alone,
00:18:22.075 --> 00:18:23.398
even in a healthy relationship,
00:18:23.866 --> 00:18:25.981
we fall into these patterns over the years.
00:18:25.981 --> 00:18:31.203
And so then when people start to set boundaries and say, okay, this is something I need,
00:18:31.301 --> 00:18:34.831
and if they can even get past the feeling of guilt for expressing a need,
00:18:35.227 --> 00:18:39.755
that then it isn't like everybody around them says, yay, mom's setting a boundary.
00:18:39.827 --> 00:18:43.212
If mom plays a certain role in the family dynamic and then she sets the boundary,
00:18:43.641 --> 00:18:46.341
I always say that's where then people start to push bigger buttons
00:18:46.341 --> 00:18:48.821
because they need mom to go back into the role
00:18:49.010 --> 00:18:51.981
that they need her in to satisfy their own needs.
00:18:52.449 --> 00:18:55.101
And that's it, right? But then that's part of that,
00:18:55.101 --> 00:18:58.101
what can destroy mom's sense of self or sense of purpose.
00:18:58.101 --> 00:19:02.387
So do you find that boundary setting is a difficult task for people in the group.
00:19:02.981 --> 00:19:09.391
Yeah, definitely. I think that I've realized that it does largely depend on personality.
00:19:09.445 --> 00:19:14.751
I mean, boundaries were, before I started going to therapy, boundaries were incredibly
00:19:14.751 --> 00:19:20.031
difficult for me. So I think that I always assume that they're difficult for all women,
00:19:20.031 --> 00:19:24.231
and I don't think that's necessarily true. I am an Enneagram too. I know that you have
00:19:24.231 --> 00:19:30.051
recently started looking into the Enneagram. I'm a people pleaser. I want to be like the
00:19:30.051 --> 00:19:35.443
helper in every situation. And so boundaries are hard for me and I think hard for a lot of women,
00:19:35.642 --> 00:19:39.571
but not all women. And so that's been interesting for me to see some women really.
00:19:40.211 --> 00:19:46.723
Really need this unit and really like it's feel so freeing to them to be given permission to have
00:19:46.931 --> 00:19:50.691
some boundaries. Whereas other women kind of, kind of sail through it because they're pretty
00:19:50.691 --> 00:19:54.267
good at this in their, in their day to day life. Well, I think it's interesting that,
00:19:54.312 --> 00:19:59.091
first of all, when I, yeah, I had this amazing digital author, Mackenzie on my podcast,
00:19:59.091 --> 00:20:02.531
we talked about the Enneagram and then I jumped over in this podcast I'm hosting with one of my
00:20:02.531 --> 00:20:05.971
daughters, The Mind, The Mirror, Me, we were talking about Enneagrams and I said,
00:20:05.971 --> 00:20:10.851
Hey, Mackie, what are you? And she said, Enneagram 2, the Peacekeeper. And she said,
00:20:10.851 --> 00:20:16.131
also known as the Pushover. And I just, you know, I just laugh. Is that what that is known as?
00:20:16.131 --> 00:20:22.931
Oh, and that. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. The Giver, I think. The Giver. Okay. I like that one better. I like that one better.
00:20:23.696 --> 00:20:30.051
And I do feel like as I have, I mean, I've done so much therapy, Tony, as you know, I,
00:20:30.168 --> 00:20:34.723
I feel like I have become a much healthier version of an Enneagram too.
00:20:34.921 --> 00:20:38.371
I don't feel like I'm a pushover anymore. I'll always be a giver.
00:20:38.371 --> 00:20:43.051
Like that's who I am at my, in my heart, but I have learned to have boundaries and to honor
00:20:43.051 --> 00:20:46.571
my needs and that actually boundaries are compassionate.
00:20:47.399 --> 00:20:52.406
They're compassionate to other people, to have good boundaries.
00:20:52.602 --> 00:20:55.466
Because one of my favorite things I've ever learned about boundaries is that they're not
00:20:55.466 --> 00:20:58.726
just protective, they're also containing.
00:20:58.726 --> 00:21:04.575
And so you're protecting yourself from someone taking advantage of you, but you're also containing.
00:21:05.006 --> 00:21:07.706
The worst of you from lashing out at other people.
00:21:07.706 --> 00:21:14.726
Because when you have no boundaries, then you get resentful and you simmer and then you explode.
00:21:14.726 --> 00:21:19.606
And so you didn't protect other people from you because you didn't have boundaries.
00:21:19.606 --> 00:21:24.488
And how many of us have said yes to something and then resented it the whole time,
00:21:24.578 --> 00:21:28.350
and it's actually not kind because it's kind of lying.
00:21:28.606 --> 00:21:33.086
It's two-faced. It's acting like, oh, yeah, it's fine. I'll totally take that on.
00:21:33.086 --> 00:21:37.646
And behind that person's back, you're like, I can't believe they did this to me, blah, blah, blah.
00:21:37.646 --> 00:21:42.610
It is not compassionate to have a two-faced life going on.
00:21:42.691 --> 00:21:48.546
But it's easy for someone with my temperament to think that the kind thing is to always say yes,
00:21:48.546 --> 00:21:51.906
when really the kind thing is to be honest.
00:21:51.906 --> 00:21:55.226
And you're making such, I mean, that's worth it alone right there.
00:21:55.226 --> 00:21:59.186
Because I like what you said about, and I go back to this private women's Facebook group
00:21:59.186 --> 00:22:02.626
where I talk about people that end up in the narcissistic or emotionally immature
00:22:02.626 --> 00:22:06.682
relationship are often what we call the pathologically kind.
00:22:06.772 --> 00:22:11.498
That is a wonderful trait to have. And part of that awakening is that how dare somebody
00:22:11.867 --> 00:22:16.854
take that thing that you is part of your core and then turn it into a negative
00:22:16.906 --> 00:22:19.726
because a lot of times the people, the women will say.
00:22:20.131 --> 00:22:23.006
Okay, I guess I can't do that anymore because look where it got me.
00:22:23.006 --> 00:22:25.586
And it's like, oh no, we need to figure out the healthy way for you to still be
00:22:25.586 --> 00:22:30.146
that compassionate person, the giver. I love that you're saying that.
00:22:30.146 --> 00:22:34.226
So, because I think a lot of people feel like, well, there isn't a way just because they've been in this relationship
00:22:34.226 --> 00:22:37.433
where that has been, they almost feel like taken from them or destroyed.
00:22:37.758 --> 00:22:41.952
But if that's who you are at your core, then I can only imagine what that would feel like,
00:22:42.066 --> 00:22:49.361
working with these women and then watching them rediscover that healthy version of the giver or that peacekeeper.
00:22:50.466 --> 00:22:56.779
Yeah. And I will say, Tony, that I, the first time I ever taught this unit on boundaries,
00:22:56.866 --> 00:23:03.026
I had the whole thing outlined and then had a really special, intimate experience
00:23:03.026 --> 00:23:05.241
supporting a woman in my community,
00:23:05.346 --> 00:23:11.306
that in my real life community, that was in a really emotionally abusive relationship.
00:23:11.306 --> 00:23:14.901
And it was the first time that I'd ever been that up close and personal with it.
00:23:15.189 --> 00:23:23.306
I thought that I understood emotional abuse until I was, it was actually like talking to this person and hearing about the situation and
00:23:23.306 --> 00:23:24.146
everything.
00:23:24.506 --> 00:23:30.511
I actually went back to my unit on boundaries and added, and added a couple of slides about.
00:23:31.132 --> 00:23:36.982
The ideal with having healthy boundaries. So I started out my boundaries unit by giving
00:23:36.982 --> 00:23:42.422
illustrations of different types of structure or homes. And I say a lot of people think when
00:23:42.422 --> 00:23:48.422
they hear of the topic boundaries, they think of this. And I show like a fortress with cement walls
00:23:48.422 --> 00:23:55.382
and, and you know, what are the fence, the barbed wire. Yeah. And so of course they don't want to
00:23:55.382 --> 00:23:59.702
have boundaries because they don't want to be like an unapproachable fortress to people.
00:23:59.885 --> 00:24:04.287
But that's rigid boundaries. That's harsh boundaries. That's a little too far for most
00:24:04.662 --> 00:24:10.463
relationships. You don't need to be a fortress. And then I show a picture of a house that's like
00:24:10.841 --> 00:24:15.782
broken down because it's had no boundaries. And so it's like exhausted and the roof is caving in
00:24:15.782 --> 00:24:20.982
and everybody's junk is all over the lawn. And I said, this is kind of a picture of what it
00:24:20.982 --> 00:24:24.662
might look like to have no boundaries or loose boundaries, porous boundaries that
00:24:24.662 --> 00:24:28.008
that, you know, you've gotten completely broken down
00:24:28.142 --> 00:24:33.422
because you haven't had any protection around you or any barriers around you.
00:24:33.422 --> 00:24:40.422
And then I show a picture of a beautiful white painted house with a picket fence and flowers and say,
00:24:40.503 --> 00:24:44.005
this is what it looks like to have healthy boundaries.
00:24:44.182 --> 00:24:52.302
Like, in this metaphor, people look at this house and they know that is somebody who respects themselves,
00:24:52.548 --> 00:24:53.989
takes care of themselves.
00:24:54.062 --> 00:24:59.345
I'm going to be respectful when I enter that property because there's this beautiful boundary.
00:24:59.786 --> 00:25:03.222
But it's not uninviting. It's actually very inviting.
00:25:03.222 --> 00:25:06.259
That people in our life who we know have good boundaries
00:25:06.304 --> 00:25:10.571
are often the people that we feel the safest around because we know that they'll be honest with us.
00:25:10.662 --> 00:25:15.621
And they'll tell us no if they can't. And I try to give this visual to the women of like,
00:25:16.022 --> 00:25:20.608
you don't want to be on either extreme. You want to be this house with a picket fence
00:25:20.782 --> 00:25:22.436
that people know they can approach.
00:25:23.147 --> 00:25:32.182
And then I also added, unless the person approaching you is emotionally abusive or has narcissistic personality
00:25:32.182 --> 00:25:38.022
disorder, and I gave them the link to thehotline.org, which is a site that's all about emotional abuse,
00:25:38.316 --> 00:25:39.102
and it kind of breaks down.
00:25:39.102 --> 00:25:43.843
If you're not sure, if you're in an emotionally abusive relationship, you can kind of read over these.
00:25:43.942 --> 00:25:49.506
I said, if that is true, then you actually have to have fortress boundaries.
00:25:49.650 --> 00:25:56.742
You have to, in some cases, if possible, remove that person from your life if they are emotionally
00:25:56.742 --> 00:26:01.782
abusing you and put up the fortress boundaries. And it's so funny, I'm kind of going off on a rant
00:26:01.782 --> 00:26:07.702
here, but I'm passionate about this. So I was, after having this experience with this woman,
00:26:07.702 --> 00:26:09.725
I was sitting in a trampoline park.
00:26:10.643 --> 00:26:15.954
And the song came on over the radio that probably a lot of us have heard before.
00:26:16.155 --> 00:26:18.286
Now You're Just Somebody That I Used to Know.
00:26:18.439 --> 00:26:23.768
It's that song that's like, you didn't have to cut me off.
00:26:24.135 --> 00:26:28.215
And it's this guy singing about how this girl just cut him out of her life.
00:26:28.215 --> 00:26:32.113
And now I'm just somebody that you used to know. And how could you have done that to me?
00:26:32.655 --> 00:26:38.335
And I was with my sister and I said, you know, but maybe she needed to do that because he
00:26:38.335 --> 00:26:43.415
was emotionally abusive. And my sister was like, what are you talking about? And I was
00:26:43.415 --> 00:26:48.903
like, in the song, like maybe she had to cut him out and make it like it never happened.
00:26:49.255 --> 00:26:52.575
And now he's just somebody that she used to know because the minute she lets him in at
00:26:52.575 --> 00:26:57.335
all, you know, he comes back and is abusing her. And my sister's like, wow, you are taking
00:26:57.335 --> 00:27:03.635
this way too seriously. But I just feel like I, after having that up close and personal
00:27:03.635 --> 00:27:10.515
experience realized that advice on boundaries, typical advice on boundaries works in healthy
00:27:10.515 --> 00:27:15.450
relationships. Yes. Absolutely. If you're not in a healthy relationship, your boundaries need to
00:27:15.795 --> 00:27:20.879
look different than what like a typical person might say is good to have for boundaries.
00:27:21.075 --> 00:27:24.858
So many thoughts. One of them is that song. I was actually that woman's therapist.
00:27:25.029 --> 00:27:29.555
So I told her to never talk to him again. Oh yeah. I'm sure. Yeah. Yeah. Right. Yeah.
00:27:29.755 --> 00:27:33.855
Yeah, yeah. I love that. It's so good. Were you really?
00:27:33.855 --> 00:27:37.389
And then I was like, oh, this is Tony. He's making a joke.
00:27:37.555 --> 00:27:40.755
But it's such a good joke though, because I know that song well, and I can't lie.
00:27:40.755 --> 00:27:43.384
I've honestly thought before, well, I bet he was kind of a jerk.
00:27:43.755 --> 00:27:46.655
I mean, it's so funny that you've said that, because I know that one so well.
00:27:46.655 --> 00:27:49.398
But then I really, I'm grateful that you're bringing this up,
00:27:49.455 --> 00:27:53.530
because I do think that there could be people that might listen to something like this course
00:27:53.855 --> 00:27:54.925
or hear what we're saying.
00:27:55.055 --> 00:27:59.967
And if they are in one of those, an unhealthy relationship, they're dying to take something like this.
00:28:00.579 --> 00:28:04.749
But I know, because I work with this population where women are saying, but it's my situation
00:28:04.749 --> 00:28:09.878
is different. I mean, I can't even have my own thought how more or less I'm going to do this.
00:28:10.069 --> 00:28:14.029
But that's where I feel like these kind of things are absolutely necessary, even just
00:28:14.029 --> 00:28:18.789
to have a semblance of what normal even could look like.
00:28:18.789 --> 00:28:23.229
And what I do in my work a lot of times is I might start with a couple and introduce
00:28:23.229 --> 00:28:25.509
them to my four pillars of a connected conversation.
00:28:25.983 --> 00:28:29.389
And then instead of it becoming this amazing tool that they didn't know what they didn't
00:28:29.389 --> 00:28:34.598
know, one person now sees that the more emotionally immature partner can't use the tool, but they,
00:28:35.069 --> 00:28:39.029
still are going to use it as a weapon. And so then, and I love how anything like your
00:28:39.118 --> 00:28:42.829
course or setting a boundary or understanding what that would look like to somebody in that
00:28:42.829 --> 00:28:48.309
kind of a relationship starts to help them understand that they do deserve to be able
00:28:48.309 --> 00:28:53.549
to have healthy conversations or to be able to grow and explore with partner or to be
00:28:53.549 --> 00:28:58.629
able to have curiosity about their opinions and not have to defend everything. And so
00:28:58.629 --> 00:29:03.749
I love that you're, you're implementing those kinds of things into a course like this, because
00:29:03.749 --> 00:29:07.898
I often say that, you know, my four pillars work with a little asterisk of in case there's
00:29:08.149 --> 00:29:12.469
extreme emotional immaturity, or setting a boundary ends up being a really not easy,
00:29:12.469 --> 00:29:17.029
but an empowering thing with a little asterisk of, but it can be difficult in emotionally
00:29:17.029 --> 00:29:19.349
immature relationships. So yeah.
00:29:19.808 --> 00:29:23.349
Yeah. What else did you, what else? Yeah. Oh, yeah.
00:29:23.349 --> 00:29:27.709
Oh, a quote that I, that I use in that unit is by Dr. Cloud, who wrote the book boundaries.
00:29:27.709 --> 00:29:32.349
And he says, a good relationship test is how a person responds to the word no.
00:29:32.349 --> 00:29:34.751
Love respects no, control does not.
00:29:35.670 --> 00:29:41.980
And so I tell women that in the group, this will actually, putting boundaries will strengthen your relationships.
00:29:41.980 --> 00:29:46.080
It'll sift out your relationships because you'll see the people that can handle your
00:29:46.080 --> 00:29:50.920
no and you'll see that they still love you and you will love them more than ever for
00:29:51.240 --> 00:29:53.953
respecting your boundary. It will draw you closer.
00:29:54.320 --> 00:29:59.160
But the people who can't handle your no, who won't take no for an answer and just keep
00:29:59.160 --> 00:30:03.208
trying to control you and trying to get you to change your no and change your mind, that's
00:30:03.520 --> 00:30:09.480
a really good clue that that person doesn't actually love you, they just want to control you.
00:30:09.563 --> 00:30:13.300
And it may be a time to step back from that relationship a little bit.
00:30:13.300 --> 00:30:16.640
So it helps you to sift those things out as you start to set those boundaries.
00:30:16.640 --> 00:30:21.200
Yeah. No, it's perfect. I like to say you can have love or control in an adult relationship, not both.
00:30:21.200 --> 00:30:23.472
And sometimes it can just be that, that simple.
00:30:24.000 --> 00:30:28.100
And I love and talk about simple is when somebody gets in a healthy relationship, if they've
00:30:28.100 --> 00:30:32.060
been in an unhealthy one, there's almost, there's a concept where let's say that they,
00:30:32.060 --> 00:30:36.624
they were in a relationship and the person is the more narcissistic or more emotionally immature,
00:30:36.741 --> 00:30:41.220
and then they are the lesser emotionally immature, but now all of a sudden, they get out of that relationship
00:30:41.530 --> 00:30:45.780
and in a healthy relationship, and now somebody says, hey, I'm gonna go hang out with my friends,
00:30:45.780 --> 00:30:48.660
and now the person that came out of the really emotionally immature relationship says,
00:30:49.140 --> 00:30:50.902
okay, what do you mean, what's your angle?
00:30:51.060 --> 00:30:55.900
And so it can really leave you still feeling like the crazy one when you get in a healthy relationship,
00:30:55.900 --> 00:31:01.900
and that's where I've found people that will say things like, and then he said no, or I said I don't want to, And he said, okay.
00:31:01.900 --> 00:31:09.260
And I think, okay, when's the, yeah, what's right. Yeah. And that that's this, I really appreciate what you're saying.
00:31:09.260 --> 00:31:11.823
Cause that is not part of a healthy relationship.
00:31:12.228 --> 00:31:16.740
Hey, what I wanted to ask any other insights, I mean, even in that experience you had with
00:31:17.062 --> 00:31:23.103
this person that you were, you know, seeing what that emotional manipulation was firsthand.
00:31:23.274 --> 00:31:27.500
I mean, so many insights that I don't even know where to begin.
00:31:27.500 --> 00:31:33.900
I just feel like, like I said, I thought that I understood emotional abuse.
00:31:33.900 --> 00:31:38.137
And I think that that's true of a lot of experiences in life where...
00:31:39.118 --> 00:31:45.788
Nobody really understands until they understand. And that can either be from they themselves going through it,
00:31:45.923 --> 00:31:49.921
or it can also be somebody that they are very close to going through it.
00:31:49.993 --> 00:31:54.017
I've gone through infertility and adoption and IVF.
00:31:54.116 --> 00:32:00.248
And my sisters have said that, like, we thought that we knew what infertility was like until we
00:32:00.248 --> 00:32:03.348
walked with you through infertility. And so it doesn't necessarily mean
00:32:03.348 --> 00:32:07.232
you personally have to go through every hard thing in order to get it.
00:32:07.304 --> 00:32:12.120
But I think that when someone you love goes through it, you get it to a whole new level.
00:32:12.528 --> 00:32:18.488
One thing that really struck me about this woman that I tried to help was that she had
00:32:18.488 --> 00:32:25.568
a really long pattern of not, of since childhood, of not being treated well.
00:32:25.876 --> 00:32:31.708
And I never realized just how much that impacts your life forever.
00:32:31.708 --> 00:32:38.628
And that makes me really even more passionate about the work that I do because supporting
00:32:38.628 --> 00:32:45.008
parents so that they can love their children well is setting the foundation for the rest
00:32:45.008 --> 00:32:52.228
of their children's lives, for how their children relate to other people in all of their relationships forever.
00:32:52.228 --> 00:32:57.968
Like if you can learn how to love your children in an emotionally mature way, you are giving
00:32:57.968 --> 00:33:03.788
them such a gift because they will never put up with emotional abuse or things like that
00:33:03.788 --> 00:33:12.148
if they have experienced what it feels like to be truly loved in unconditional ways by their parents.
00:33:12.327 --> 00:33:18.548
I mean, I guess I can never say never, but they're much less likely to ever step into
00:33:18.548 --> 00:33:24.868
a relationship like that. And so the work that we're doing as parents is incredibly important, as well as especially
00:33:24.868 --> 00:33:25.137
Lee.
00:33:25.597 --> 00:33:30.247
The work that people are doing who did not have that kind of parenting modeled
00:33:30.247 --> 00:33:36.832
for them and that they're breaking that cycle. Parenting really matters and that's why I'm grateful to do the work that I do.
00:33:37.367 --> 00:33:44.393
And I honestly, Rachel, I can even edit this out if that would be easier, but I know we we traded texts around
00:33:44.438 --> 00:33:48.007
when you were helping that person and I even created a couple of episodes that
00:33:48.093 --> 00:33:52.487
were trying to go a little bit deeper into some of the things you were concerned about.
00:33:52.487 --> 00:34:21.321
Yeah, is that okay to talk about or the reason? Okay, because the reason I'm saying that is what I was so and I so when you just said that you implemented some of those things, even in this course with the boundaries, that was what I really appreciated. You had such curiosity about how to help this person. And it wasn't because I talked to people every day that are in those relationships are trying to help somebody in a relationship like that. And it's still so easy for us to say, well, how do I how do I get them to think or how do I get them to understand?
00:34:21.681 --> 00:34:25.407
And so just knowing who you are as a person, and we could pull up the text,
00:34:25.407 --> 00:34:28.090
I mean, there was none of that. It was, this is so difficult.
00:34:28.207 --> 00:34:33.294
You know, do you have any ways to, any thoughts about or ways to better communicate or,
00:34:33.727 --> 00:34:36.927
and I really appreciated that because I think that I would imagine that then
00:34:36.927 --> 00:34:39.147
is through the vibe through your entire course.
00:34:39.667 --> 00:34:42.327
Was that it was put together, not just with a, here's what you do,
00:34:42.327 --> 00:34:46.967
but with that curiosity of just motherhood in general as you develop the course.
00:34:46.967 --> 00:34:55.167
Because honestly, and this is where I get all nerdy talk about what I appreciate about healthy relationships, whether you and this person
00:34:55.167 --> 00:35:00.427
or you and me, or hopefully in a marital relationship, that concept of differentiation is you can
00:35:00.427 --> 00:35:04.247
offer something to me and I can offer something to you, and we're not trying to tell the other
00:35:04.247 --> 00:35:08.527
person they're wrong, or I didn't feel like I have to defend myself or tell you that you're
00:35:08.527 --> 00:35:12.747
wrong, and you are offering me some really unique insight into this person that you're
00:35:12.747 --> 00:35:18.134
close with. And then I was able to take that in, and then I wanted to create more content
00:35:18.215 --> 00:35:23.447
based on the things I knew that I knew, and now this new information to try to just continually
00:35:23.779 --> 00:35:24.589
put things out there to help.
00:35:25.012 --> 00:35:30.764
So I love hearing that that was part of what you're implementing things into your course from that too.
00:35:30.962 --> 00:35:37.183
Yeah, yeah. And it's been really beautiful for me to walk with this friend and to realize that everybody
00:35:37.570 --> 00:35:43.527
has their own path and that my job is not to, I mean, I told you I'm the Enneagram too,
00:35:43.737 --> 00:35:48.727
And so my instinct is to save, to jump in and fix it.
00:35:49.489 --> 00:35:53.767
And instead to be able to walk with someone and say, this is your journey and I am here
00:35:53.767 --> 00:35:57.546
to support you, whatever you decide for your life.
00:35:57.879 --> 00:35:58.464
I can't.
00:35:59.139 --> 00:36:04.429
Make this decision for you. I can't force you or pressure you into something that you're not ready
00:36:04.429 --> 00:36:11.464
to do or that you don't feel good about. All I can do is offer sound advice, a listening ear,
00:36:11.709 --> 00:36:18.509
lots of encouragement, lots of love, and then allow you to decide what you think is best for
00:36:18.509 --> 00:36:25.469
your life. And it's made me a better friend and mother, I think. I think that will play out
00:36:25.570 --> 00:36:30.429
throughout my parenting journey of, like, I can think I know what's best for my kids' lives,
00:36:30.429 --> 00:36:34.669
but ultimately, if I'm shoving that down their throats, they're not going to want to be in
00:36:34.669 --> 00:36:40.865
relationship with me. And I have to walk beside them and honor their path and say,
00:36:41.072 --> 00:36:46.734
and I mean it, whatever you choose, I'm still right here. And you don't have to ever be embarrassed
00:36:47.085 --> 00:36:52.589
to call me and say you were right, or I should have, and I don't care. Like this advice comes
00:36:52.589 --> 00:36:57.549
with no strings attached. Like, it's just because I love you and whatever you decide, I'm here for.
00:36:58.356 --> 00:37:02.109
That's beautiful, Rachel, because then, and I believe that too, and I feel like my job as a
00:37:02.109 --> 00:37:07.872
therapist is being there with the client, and it really is. It is unconditional love, in a sense,
00:37:08.223 --> 00:37:13.629
and we need a space like that. Now, if something comes up in me and I've established that trust or
00:37:13.629 --> 00:37:18.109
that relationship with somebody, I, yeah, I can express myself of, man, this is really difficult,
00:37:18.109 --> 00:37:23.389
but that's still a me issue. What is that bringing up in me? I'm really frustrated because I just,
00:37:23.389 --> 00:37:28.509
I hate seeing you hurt or it is hard for me because I just want to help. But that's a me
00:37:28.509 --> 00:37:34.212
issue, you know? And so, but I'm here for you. And that's a completely different vibe than the
00:37:34.437 --> 00:37:38.349
controlling one about, look, you need to do something about this because I'm kind of tired
00:37:38.349 --> 00:37:42.429
of hearing about it. And I think that a lot of people get to that point with their friendships
00:37:42.429 --> 00:37:46.429
when they're in these emotionally abusive or unhealthy relationships. And that is, boy,
00:37:46.429 --> 00:37:48.229
boy, it's just the last thing that person needs.
00:37:48.509 --> 00:37:52.869
It's the last thing they need. Yeah. I don't even remember what trimester.
00:37:52.869 --> 00:37:57.069
I think I took you on a tangent with the boundaries, but now I think we're feeling the little guy kick now.
00:37:57.069 --> 00:37:59.968
So are we heading into the third trimester?
00:38:00.031 --> 00:38:07.389
Yeah. Yeah. So honor your needs. We spend a lot of time there learning about who we are
00:38:07.389 --> 00:38:10.629
and how to honor who we are. And then we head into our last trimester,
00:38:10.629 --> 00:38:12.328
which is love your people.
00:38:12.429 --> 00:38:19.043
And that's when we really bring the best of what we've learned about ourselves into our parenting.
00:38:19.149 --> 00:38:27.245
And the three principles that we dive into in that trimester are gather the good, communicate for connection.
00:38:27.789 --> 00:38:30.368
And support their struggles.
00:38:31.149 --> 00:38:32.943
And so you can see a lot of.
00:38:33.636 --> 00:38:38.606
A lot of what we learned in the first two units really do come into play in how we are interacting
00:38:38.606 --> 00:38:43.166
with and guiding and supporting our children without trying to control them. And I had to
00:38:43.166 --> 00:38:48.046
tell you, Tony, that first unit we do on gather the good, we talk a lot about positive based
00:38:48.121 --> 00:38:54.286
parenting, like looking for the good. And we, you are the celebrity in that unit because we listen,
00:38:54.404 --> 00:38:58.846
we listen to, as part of the curriculum, we listened to the episode that you did on my show
00:38:58.846 --> 00:39:06.526
years ago about the nurtured heart approach and sort of the different tactics for ignoring
00:39:06.526 --> 00:39:11.446
the bad and praising the good. I think we titled that episode like how to praise your
00:39:11.446 --> 00:39:18.926
kids when there's nothing to praise. And so we do a deep dive into that, that how building
00:39:18.926 --> 00:39:24.566
on what's good about them and what's good in what they're doing is going to propel their
00:39:24.566 --> 00:39:29.766
behavior forward in a much more positive, better way than harping on the negative.
00:39:29.766 --> 00:39:36.726
So I have to thank you for that. I mean, you're the main, you're the main act in that unit of gathering the good.
00:39:36.726 --> 00:39:40.406
Well, it makes me laugh because I mean, it's, it is so incredible.
00:39:40.406 --> 00:39:43.886
That whole nurtured heart approach changed my entire life with parenting.
00:39:43.886 --> 00:39:48.686
I think at the time I learned it, my kids were nine, seven, five, and three, and now
00:39:48.686 --> 00:39:54.216
they're 19, 21, 23, and 25. And let me just speak to your people.
00:39:54.476 --> 00:39:58.486
I have a relationship, a healthy, wonderful relationship with all of my adult kids.
00:39:58.834 --> 00:40:04.406
And it blows my mind, Rachel. I mean, tonight I'm recording a podcast with one of my daughters, Murder on the Couch.
00:40:04.406 --> 00:40:07.566
And then tomorrow night, I'm recording another episode of My Mirror Me.
00:40:08.086 --> 00:40:14.246
And we go to movies with my youngest son and his girlfriend and my daughter, Alex, and her husband, Mitch.
00:40:14.246 --> 00:40:18.926
We were talking to them yesterday, and we're going to go fly out there for her graduation ceremony.
00:40:18.926 --> 00:40:24.926
And I cannot even tell you how amazing that is. And I know that that comes from that just building
00:40:24.926 --> 00:40:29.246
that inner wealth. And kids get their sense of self from external validation.
00:40:29.246 --> 00:40:33.326
And so when you are giving that external validation positivity.
00:40:32.655 --> 00:40:40.005
And it doesn't mean you're just rolling over as a pushover, but you know, you can't be the punisher and the rewarder at the same time.
00:40:40.005 --> 00:40:46.672
And so, and expect them to come to you with their deep emotions and challenges if they are afraid that you will react.
00:40:46.888 --> 00:40:50.805
You'll be, I mean, not even, I mean, you can still have emotions, but that you will react impulsively.
00:40:50.966 --> 00:40:55.005
And it's just, so that's, I'm very honored to hear that, that, uh, that's in there.
00:40:55.476 --> 00:41:01.876
Yeah. And there's another, I mean, you did another episode on my show about how to get your teenagers to talk to you and it starts when they're young.
00:41:01.930 --> 00:41:08.151
And it was a similar concept of you have to learn how not to react, how to just keep a,
00:41:08.705 --> 00:41:10.265
straight face and listen.
00:41:10.265 --> 00:41:16.825
Tell me more about that. And it's beautiful for me to hear about the type of relationship you have with your grown
00:41:16.825 --> 00:41:17.486
kids.
00:41:18.360 --> 00:41:22.265
And it's not, your grown kids have all taken their own paths and you've supported them.
00:41:22.265 --> 00:41:26.905
Like it's, they aren't, they didn't follow some cookie cutter plan of exactly what you
00:41:26.905 --> 00:41:30.825
thought would be best for their lives and, but they are so close to you.
00:41:30.825 --> 00:41:35.625
I know you told me once that you do like a Nintendo Switch night with all your kids.
00:41:35.625 --> 00:41:38.025
You got to, you got to share this because I think it's the cutest thing ever.
00:41:38.025 --> 00:41:44.065
No, it's, we, we do it so often. We play Mario Kart and it's wherever people are in the country, the world.
00:41:44.065 --> 00:41:48.505
And we jump on and we pull up a group FaceTime and we talk trash to each other and we play
00:41:48.505 --> 00:41:52.839
Mario Kart and we just, and it's like, it's, you know, at some points it's two or three times a week.
00:41:53.145 --> 00:41:57.265
And as a matter of fact, you know, tonight I already feel pressure that when I'm recording
00:41:57.265 --> 00:42:00.665
Murder on the Couch with my daughter, Sid, that we have such a fun time and she's got
00:42:00.665 --> 00:42:03.725
such a crazy case that we're gonna be talking about tonight that I'm already
00:42:03.725 --> 00:42:07.575
worried will go long and I might miss a little bit of Mario Kart and yeah I know
00:42:08.005 --> 00:42:13.535
for the record too I won some cup last Sunday night and I don't ever win and
00:42:13.832 --> 00:42:19.765
and my kids they dismissed me so quickly that I have in a funny way because I was
00:42:20.007 --> 00:42:23.805
like you guys that I have never won and then like oh okay dad making it all
00:42:23.805 --> 00:42:26.685
about you I thought you were pretty much the narcissist guy right you know they
00:42:26.685 --> 00:42:28.460
They were, it was the best.
00:42:28.919 --> 00:42:35.310
I love it. Yeah. Yeah. Those family relationships. And I think that that really speaks to those first two units that we do.
00:42:35.510 --> 00:42:38.210
Yeah. We gather the good and communicate for connection.
00:42:38.615 --> 00:42:41.950
The in the communicate for connection unit, we talk about emotion coaching,
00:42:42.072 --> 00:42:49.710
what that looks like, how to diffuse, you know, when your kid's flipping out or when they're really starting to.
00:42:50.350 --> 00:42:53.150
Everything's starting to get escalated. Like, what do you do?
00:42:53.150 --> 00:42:56.450
What are the skills that you can bring into that conversation?
00:42:56.450 --> 00:42:59.850
And that's really based on a lot of John Gottman's work around emotion coaching
00:42:59.850 --> 00:43:03.335
that we bring in during that unit. And then in that last unit,
00:43:03.488 --> 00:43:07.440
support their struggles. I tell the women in the group that, you know.
00:43:07.890 --> 00:43:11.930
I, all of these unit titles are alliterative, as you may have noticed,
00:43:11.930 --> 00:43:15.490
they all have the, you know, I'm a former English teacher, so support,
00:43:15.730 --> 00:43:22.970
support their struggles. So when I was naming them, I was trying to think of just the right verb to capture what I wanted,
00:43:22.970 --> 00:43:29.523
but it had to start with an S. And I thought, I purposely did not name this unit
00:43:29.610 --> 00:43:31.485
Save Them From Their Struggles.
00:43:31.818 --> 00:43:38.050
Oh. You know, like there's a name. That's good. Support Their Struggles is very different from Save Them
00:43:38.050 --> 00:43:39.010
From Their Struggles.
00:43:39.010 --> 00:43:44.650
And yet, as parents, we often feel like our job is to save them from their struggles.
00:43:44.650 --> 00:43:51.803
So we talk a lot about how their struggles are part of their process of becoming who they need to be.
00:43:51.894 --> 00:43:59.293
And we shouldn't be saving them from their struggles, but how do we support them in a way that's loving, that's actionable?
00:43:59.680 --> 00:44:03.790
What do you do when your kid has this huge struggle that you don't even know where to begin?
00:44:03.790 --> 00:44:08.295
We kind of talk through a process of that, really with the emphasis around being,
00:44:08.701 --> 00:44:13.913
walking beside them and supporting them and not trying to dictate who they become
00:44:14.336 --> 00:44:18.610
and how they move through the world.
00:44:17.523 --> 00:44:20.733
Oh, it's brilliant. It is. And can I ask you just a couple of quick things too?
00:44:20.733 --> 00:44:25.053
Because from your framework and your three pillars, the part about honoring your needs,
00:44:25.053 --> 00:44:30.973
knowing yourself, do you find a challenge in people in the moms putting their needs first,
00:44:30.973 --> 00:44:34.173
that they do feel like they're being selfish, that they felt like they're being prideful,
00:44:34.173 --> 00:44:36.173
they feel like they're, I mean, do you see a lot of that?
00:44:37.613 --> 00:44:44.333
For sure. Yes. Yeah. I think coming into it, I have to do some work with them around even being
00:44:44.333 --> 00:44:46.333
willing to sign up for a program like this.
00:44:46.333 --> 00:44:53.533
That's where I was going with this. Yeah. Yeah, because they're like, invest that kind of time that invest that money in myself.
00:44:53.658 --> 00:44:59.950
And so we have to talk a lot about having how having a sense of self is not selfish.
00:45:00.093 --> 00:45:00.725
Not at all.
00:45:00.973 --> 00:45:04.973
I've heard Jennifer Finlayson Fife say that she doesn't really like the word selfless,
00:45:05.658 --> 00:45:08.733
because it's that is almost like without a self.
00:45:09.457 --> 00:45:16.333
Yeah, I could see that. you know, she says, if you do things that may be called selfless service to others and being
00:45:16.333 --> 00:45:22.813
generous to others that people may call selfless, that should actually be an act of self. It should
00:45:22.813 --> 00:45:28.093
be you choosing to do those things because you have a self, because you're giving the best of
00:45:28.093 --> 00:45:34.493
yourself to others, not because you're selfless, meaning without self. And I just love that kind
00:45:34.493 --> 00:45:39.309
of reframe and I'll sort of present that to them and talk to them about how important it is to be
00:45:39.533 --> 00:45:44.733
centered in themselves. Self-centered, but let's flip that around. Centered and
00:45:44.733 --> 00:45:49.220
grounded in who you are and what you bring to the world so that you can bring,
00:45:49.813 --> 00:45:51.677
the best of yourself to the world.
00:45:52.416 --> 00:46:19.909
I agree. I feel like then it's more of this grounding that you can operate from instead of just being pushed around and and I will throw out this on the way in today. Actually, I was listening to a podcast and I do not know. I cannot wait to look more into this. It was a psychologist that was talking about. He said that up to 75% accuracy and you can determine almost someone's level of depression by how much they are speaking about themselves. But in that that negative way, I'm so bad. I can't believe I said that I never should have said that. What's wrong with me?
00:46:20.287 --> 00:46:32.647
And he was talking about how the act of gratitude, or the act of service, but then to make it become an action, that you have to come from a place of, exactly what you're saying, knowing yourself.
00:46:32.791 --> 00:46:47.194
And I just thought, man, that just, when you hear those messages, it's the people that need to, I feel like need to hear it the most, are the ones that I don't know if they hear that and think, okay, but that sounds, that's going to take a lot of time, and that's time that I need to take care of other people.
00:46:47.573 --> 00:46:50.946
But so I think this is a lot of that people not knowing what they don't know about what
00:46:50.946 --> 00:46:55.226
that would feel like to then operate from this place of a sense of self and confidence
00:46:55.226 --> 00:46:57.286
and purpose. And I think that would be amazing.
00:46:57.546 --> 00:47:01.949
So yeah, what are the dates? I mean, do people need to get on this quick?
00:47:02.066 --> 00:47:02.840
This is going to go out.
00:47:03.186 --> 00:47:06.906
People listening are listening on a Tuesday. The I never do specific days.
00:47:06.906 --> 00:47:09.746
This will be fun, though. What the 12th and then what happens next?
00:47:09.746 --> 00:47:15.466
Where do people go? What do they do? So enrollment will be open until Thursday, September 21st.
00:47:15.885 --> 00:47:22.051
Okay. So depending on when people listen, you can go to selfassuredmotherhood.com, one word,
00:47:22.286 --> 00:47:27.146
or 3in30podcast.com slash Sam, which stands for Self-Assured Motherhood.
00:47:27.146 --> 00:47:29.271
That's sort of my shorthand, Sam. I like it.
00:47:30.361 --> 00:47:36.730
And if they need a little more of a taste before jumping into the full program,
00:47:36.730 --> 00:47:41.610
because I understand it's a commitment, I am teaching a few free classes this month
00:47:41.610 --> 00:47:45.130
to kind of give people a taste of the content.
00:47:45.130 --> 00:47:49.463
And those can be found at 3in30podcast.com slash free class.
00:47:49.970 --> 00:47:56.116
So I would love to see anybody either in the free class or joining up for the program.
00:47:56.431 --> 00:48:01.184
It is an investment of time and money. And it is so incredibly worth it.
00:48:01.290 --> 00:48:05.690
And I can say that with confidence now that I have taught over 200 women.
00:48:05.690 --> 00:48:07.630
This is my third year doing it.
00:48:07.729 --> 00:48:11.770
And just seeing the change in these women, like I mentioned,
00:48:11.770 --> 00:48:16.930
is remarkable. And so if you're feeling pulled and called to this,
00:48:16.930 --> 00:48:21.421
I would encourage you to go check it out and find out more at SelfAssuredMotherhood.com.
00:48:21.728 --> 00:48:25.570
OK, and even if that's the yeah, buts, the yeah, but I might not be able to make every week or yeah,
00:48:25.570 --> 00:48:29.990
but I might not do the homework or yeah, But those are all just, I love talking about your, yeah, I like what you said.
00:48:29.990 --> 00:48:33.650
If you felt pulled, that is that dopamine dump of, this is something I need to do.
00:48:34.052 --> 00:48:37.530
And then just know that all the yeah, buts coming next are absolutely normal
00:48:37.617 --> 00:48:40.590
because your brain is actually pretty lazy as much as we give it credit.
00:48:40.704 --> 00:48:43.870
Yeah. Your brain will do it next year. It's like, that sounds hard. Like, I don't know.
00:48:45.304 --> 00:48:51.270
And it's like, no, you do want to change, right? If you are not doing well emotionally, if you do not feel,
00:48:51.777 --> 00:48:54.670
like you're thriving in your motherhood, that you're showing up as the mom you
00:48:54.670 --> 00:48:59.249
want to be, don't let your brain talk you out of it, because this is worth it.
00:49:00.176 --> 00:49:04.586
Okay, I have one very quick thing that this is just unscientific anecdotal research that
00:49:04.586 --> 00:49:09.186
I'm doing and it's based off of what will feel like a stalkery observation of one of
00:49:09.186 --> 00:49:11.186
your stories. I think it was yesterday.
00:49:11.726 --> 00:49:17.546
Are you ready? Okay. Ready. You had posted something about you were just having a good, chill, hangout, relaxed time
00:49:17.546 --> 00:49:19.153
with your dog. Uh-huh.
00:49:19.855 --> 00:49:25.906
Yeah. Okay. So, I'm very curious to know, did you always love your dog or is that something you've come to know?
00:49:25.906 --> 00:49:29.146
Is that something, is that a dog that just Ryan said, I will be having a dog and you
00:49:29.146 --> 00:49:32.386
We're not because I'm finding more and more. I will. Let me get your answer first.
00:49:32.386 --> 00:49:36.491
And I'll tell you the results of my unscientific poll from people that I work with.
00:49:36.698 --> 00:49:46.986
Okay. So this kind of goes back to the class because I, as a child loved animals so much,
00:49:47.132 --> 00:49:52.226
always wanted a dog, could never have a dog because my little sister has severe allergies.
00:49:52.226 --> 00:49:55.639
And it was like the heartbreak of my life that I couldn't have a dog.
00:49:55.927 --> 00:50:03.106
Then I grew up and I got obsessed with productivity and achievement and perfectionism and having
00:50:03.106 --> 00:50:08.881
a dog sounded really inconvenient and like one more thing that I would have to take care of.
00:50:09.133 --> 00:50:15.106
And so my husband, it's like, you know this, Tony, my husband was the one who said a friend
00:50:15.106 --> 00:50:17.026
of mine had puppy, like, I want to do this.
00:50:17.190 --> 00:50:20.866
And at first I was really resistant and I don't think it's the right time and blah,
00:50:20.866 --> 00:50:22.052
blah, blah, blah, blah.
00:50:22.511 --> 00:50:28.766
But decided to do it. And I am obsessed with her. And she, like, it's awakened my inner child.
00:50:28.766 --> 00:50:33.326
Like it's a lot of what I tell women is, like, go back to what you loved as a child.
00:50:33.326 --> 00:50:35.843
Think about who you really are.
00:50:36.086 --> 00:50:41.726
And like, that was something that my childhood self was like, heck yes, you want a dog.
00:50:41.726 --> 00:50:46.133
But my like, kind of adult self was like, I don't know, that sounds inconvenient.
00:50:46.406 --> 00:50:51.586
And so sometimes it's like getting back to yourself, you really find such joy in things
00:50:51.586 --> 00:50:52.245
you weren't expecting.
00:50:53.118 --> 00:50:54.586
You
00:50:53.118 --> 00:51:22.808
I love that answer so I don't even I feel like I don't even want to put this out there because what I find over and over again the therapist in me is somebody it's and I've had it both the guy buys the dog or the wife buys the dog but it's a they bought it and we didn't really talk about it and it was impulsive and I can't believe they did it and then whoever it is that bought it says I will take care of it all the time and I think that's their inner child you know no I'll clean up after it all the time and then they don't so it ends up being the other person but then inevitably there is is love there and
00:51:22.969 --> 00:51:24.849
So, I get asked that often.
00:51:24.849 --> 00:51:29.038
I've done four-pillared entire conversations of marriage therapy sessions where it's about,
00:51:29.409 --> 00:51:32.509
should we get the dog, should we not get the dog? Yeah, and then, and I know,
00:51:32.509 --> 00:51:34.025
I call this one a leading indicator.
00:51:34.349 --> 00:51:39.249
Oh, he's getting that dog, you know? But, you know, he's like, no, fine, I won't.
00:51:39.249 --> 00:51:43.829
You know, kind of goes into a victim stance or whatever. And then I know, okay, what's my over-under
00:51:43.829 --> 00:51:45.170
on when they end up getting the dog?
00:51:45.350 --> 00:51:50.769
And then, do I wait a year before then? I ask the wife if they, now she really loves the dog.
00:51:51.209 --> 00:51:52.129
And it's just inevitable.
00:51:52.129 --> 00:51:57.869
So I'm not trying to advocate one way or the other, but just seeing, I knew that Ryan loved that dog,
00:51:57.869 --> 00:52:02.549
and then I didn't know where you were at with it. And then here's back to back posts of you sleeping with dog
00:52:02.549 --> 00:52:06.509
and then going on a bike ride, adorable dog pulling you like a sled.
00:52:06.766 --> 00:52:15.109
Yes, like a sled. She is just, I just love her. So yes, and that, like I feel like she has reminded me
00:52:15.109 --> 00:52:19.969
that not everything in life has to be about productivity, but sometimes you can just lay on your bed
00:52:19.969 --> 00:52:21.044
with your snuggly dog.
00:52:21.389 --> 00:52:25.709
And that's good for your soul, and that's good for me to remember, as somebody that's
00:52:25.709 --> 00:52:27.967
very productivity-focused a lot of the time.
00:52:28.509 --> 00:52:32.989
I love it. OK, Rachel, I feel like I really do. I'm so thankful for the time, and it's always
00:52:32.989 --> 00:52:36.069
fun to talk to you. But the depth underneath this course, I didn't even,
00:52:36.069 --> 00:52:39.354
I mean, of course it's going to be. It's nine months. It's you putting it together.
00:52:39.787 --> 00:52:43.243
But the journey that the women will go on is, it warms my heart.
00:52:43.288 --> 00:52:45.728
The therapist heart of me, the person that works with people,
00:52:45.962 --> 00:52:51.369
because people need a way to find themselves and know that it's OK to raise, what I call,
00:52:51.369 --> 00:52:55.569
raising their emotional baseline and put themselves in the best position that they can be the best them.
00:52:55.569 --> 00:52:57.969
And it isn't selfish at all.
00:52:58.259 --> 00:53:02.329
But I know how difficult that is. I hope that you get a lot of people coming from Virtual
00:53:02.329 --> 00:53:04.969
Couch, and we'll run it on Waking Up to Narcissism as well.
00:53:05.371 --> 00:53:09.710
Yeah. Well, thank you, Tony. And you've been integral to my journey.
00:53:09.889 --> 00:53:13.409
I think I interviewed you within my first 30 episodes. I can't remember.
00:53:13.409 --> 00:53:16.606
Yeah, I think so. But I mean, I'm over 300 now.
00:53:16.669 --> 00:53:17.650
I mean, women.
00:53:17.929 --> 00:53:20.882
And that's, that was the first we had ever met was when you reached out to me
00:53:21.049 --> 00:53:25.449
about my show and like you've become a dear friend and have really impacted my
00:53:25.449 --> 00:53:28.849
life and my relationships and have even shown up in my course.
00:53:29.254 --> 00:53:33.809
So I'm just so grateful for you and for the time that you allowed me to have
00:53:33.809 --> 00:53:35.849
today to talk about my program. I can't wait.
00:53:35.849 --> 00:53:37.849
So we'll, we'll, we'll make sure that this gets out right away.
00:53:38.094 --> 00:53:39.427
I'll put all the links in the show notes as well.
00:53:40.039 --> 00:53:40.552
But thanks for coming on.
00:53:40.560 --> 00:55:34.817
Music.