Full Transcript for The Things We Do... - Interview with Hallea Jones

reflect on it, but it was realistically, I think, 74 00:04:08,320 --> 00:04:17,840 the time and you know, we're talking season one and your character is fucking annoying. 75 00:04:17,840 --> 00:04:21,960 She is just like the most annoying human. 76 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:24,520 She's very like just in your face. 77 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:25,520 Entitled, in your face. 78 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:27,760 Just thinks that she's hot shit. 79 00:04:27,760 --> 00:04:28,760 Thank you so much. 80 00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:29,760 I appreciate that. 81 00:04:29,760 --> 00:04:33,320 That was like exactly what I was going for. 82 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:38,320 Which I mean, you know, you think about like, for example, Game of Thrones, Joffrey, like 83 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:42,120 that actor, people hated him because he did a good job. 84 00:04:42,120 --> 00:04:46,560 So I've had people say that about my character that they didn't like Eden Hawkins and I'm 85 00:04:46,560 --> 00:04:47,560 like, thank you. 86 00:04:47,560 --> 00:04:51,620 I appreciate that because that's what I was going for. 87 00:04:51,620 --> 00:04:55,920 In season two though, spoilers, but also it's been out long enough. 88 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:56,920 I have no sympathy. 89 00:04:56,920 --> 00:05:00,720 If you haven't watched it now, this is your fault. 90 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:02,520 But go watch it if you want to. 91 00:05:02,520 --> 00:05:06,200 Yeah, in season two, I did kind of turn that. 92 00:05:06,200 --> 00:05:11,760 I tried to turn that a little on its head because of the fact that like, there's always 93 00:05:11,760 --> 00:05:15,400 something you want to make people love about the people they're supposed to hate, like 94 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:18,880 or have some sympathy towards them. 95 00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:24,760 And I don't know if that came across, but for me personally, like I did try to infiltrate 96 00:05:24,760 --> 00:05:31,920 the demon element of Eden with the human element that felt like she was trapped within herself. 97 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:32,920 Yeah. 98 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:35,440 So I don't know if that came across. 99 00:05:35,440 --> 00:05:40,320 I mean, I remember watching it and this is how bad my memory was for three seasons. 100 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:46,200 I forgot that your character got possessed because I was just like, wow, she's done worse. 101 00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:49,200 Like she's like now just really demonic. 102 00:05:49,200 --> 00:05:50,200 Like still. 103 00:05:50,200 --> 00:05:54,960 She's still being low. 104 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:57,760 Like I didn't have that and it took me like an episode in like season two, episode one. 105 00:05:57,760 --> 00:06:00,360 And I was like, at the end I was like, now let me do some research. 106 00:06:00,360 --> 00:06:01,960 Like, oh no, she's possessed. 107 00:06:01,960 --> 00:06:02,960 This one. 108 00:06:02,960 --> 00:06:08,640 I didn't clean, even though the dialogue, like the dialogue sedged, like basically announces 109 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:09,640 she's possessed. 110 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:11,240 Cause she's like suddenly what like. 111 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:12,240 Yeah. 112 00:06:12,240 --> 00:06:16,720 Like Gabe announces that he's going to repurpose me for whispering iron and like boil me down 113 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:17,720 and like what? 114 00:06:17,720 --> 00:06:20,800 He's like, yeah, you know, that's like inside you. 115 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:23,480 I could just like boil you down into this. 116 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:24,960 So like they give way to it. 117 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,760 But if you forget, which I have a horrible memory for these things. 118 00:06:27,760 --> 00:06:32,120 I think it's also like the, the thing about like Netflix series is like, unless you can 119 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:35,320 skip the recap, which is also like the most hilarious thing. 120 00:06:35,320 --> 00:06:36,320 You want to play that game. 121 00:06:36,320 --> 00:06:37,320 And that's what I did. 122 00:06:37,320 --> 00:06:40,640 So I was like, oh yeah, I remember this show very well. 123 00:06:40,640 --> 00:06:45,340 I clearly forgot that your little like that little oil or whatever it was like the digital 124 00:06:45,340 --> 00:06:47,000 like thing goes in you. 125 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,320 It's the, it's a, it's whispering iron. 126 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:56,560 So it's like, it's a demonic like, it just comes from the portal and goes, and then dissolves 127 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:57,560 into my arm. 128 00:06:57,560 --> 00:06:58,560 Yeah. 129 00:06:58,560 --> 00:06:59,560 Yeah. 130 00:06:59,560 --> 00:07:00,560 Which is crazy. 131 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:03,840 I'm actually doing that exact thing of like not doing the recaps with a book I'm reading 132 00:07:03,840 --> 00:07:04,840 right now. 133 00:07:04,840 --> 00:07:09,880 It's called threads of power by V Schwab and I will scream from the rooftops. 134 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,680 Amazing series called a darker shade of magic. 135 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:15,560 And I read this like two, three years ago. 136 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:19,000 I blew through them, literally got me back into reading again, hadn't picked up a book 137 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:23,080 in years and like I start, I'm reading this. 138 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:28,120 I'm like maybe a hundred pages in and I'm like, how did we get here? 139 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:32,040 Cause it's like in the same universe, like the characters are here with new characters 140 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:33,040 and whatever. 141 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:34,360 But I'm like, this is seven years later. 142 00:07:34,360 --> 00:07:35,360 Yeah. 143 00:07:35,360 --> 00:07:37,560 Wait, wait, I don't know what's happening here. 144 00:07:37,560 --> 00:07:39,320 Well, that's kind of like the thing. 145 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:42,840 And I feel like this is also, I don't know, it's maybe it's the attention span of our 146 00:07:42,840 -->

00:07:49,640 generation, which is a little bit appalling, but I do, I remember also like films now and 147 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:53,880 you know, like stories now they are shorter and they are more condensed. 148 00:07:53,880 --> 00:07:58,600 And I don't, I, you know, I was like, um, like, and I think it's also why we, my wife 149 00:07:58,600 --> 00:08:02,640 and I, we watched Rosemary's baby recently, which I was like, Oh, that's a classic film. 150 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,120 I didn't realize how long it was. 151 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:06,480 It's like two hours and 10 minutes. 152 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:07,760 Oh, it's long. 153 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:11,920 I just watched the whole extended director's cut of Lord of the Rings. 154 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:12,920 Yeah. 155 00:08:12,920 --> 00:08:17,160 I had my partner and I watched each one in two parts. 156 00:08:17,160 --> 00:08:22,280 I think we did the return of the king in three, like, because it's like five hours long. 157 00:08:22,280 --> 00:08:27,760 But the thing with those films is there's so like, they also have very specific cut 158 00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:32,600 points or like intermission points, which I don't think you have as much. 159 00:08:32,600 --> 00:08:37,200 Like they have very distinct act one, act two, act three, which makes it easy to cut 160 00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:42,120 or like take a break or whatever and come back, which we don't really have much of anymore. 161 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:44,000 We kind of barrel through things. 162 00:08:44,000 --> 00:08:52,280 Um, but yeah, they're like, my attention was amazing because it was slow. 163 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:55,720 Even though it was, it was, I mean that in the way of like, I think a lot of things right 164 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:59,680 now are edited really quickly where it's just like, I get overwhelmed by it. 165 00:08:59,680 --> 00:09:04,400 And then my attention drifts to other things like doom scrolling, like watching Lord of 166 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:10,240 the Rings, it's like the cuts are longer and it's more like gripping like in other ways. 167 00:09:10,240 --> 00:09:12,240 I think it's, it's, it's the appeal. 168 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:16,840 And I guess like, I'll go a little bit into this why you wanted to become an actor, but 169 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:23,600 you know, like it's, it's the appeal, I guess from like slow driven stories. 170 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:30,120 And I almost feel like we're going in this really weird direction where like TV is trying 171 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:36,040 to up its budget to be like a long format film, but then there's like too long and too convoluted. 172 00:09:36,040 --> 00:09:40,160 Like, and it's really interesting because of Prime example, Harry Potter now going to 173 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:43,960 HBO to do, I think like eight seasons. 174 00:09:43,960 --> 00:09:45,240 Oh my God. 175 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:48,560 Just like there's, there's sorry, I talked to them. 176 00:09:48,560 --> 00:09:53,080 There are so many other IPs out there that could be created. 177 00:09:53,080 --> 00:09:55,600 Like don't give JK more money. 178 00:09:55,600 --> 00:09:56,600 Yeah, literally. 179 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,780 Like, and also just leave a good thing alone. 180 00:09:59,780 --> 00:10:04,520 It was of that time since then, a lot of shits come out that it's just like, why are we, 181 00:10:04,520 --> 00:10:09,560 we can leave those in a little box and just like appreciate them for what they are. 182 00:10:09,560 --> 00:10:14,760 There's so much like, I look at, you know, Greek mythology and like a lot of different 183 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,840 stories that have happened over the millennium. 184 00:10:17,840 --> 00:10:23,960 Like, you know, like it's, there's so much there that we could take from and make new, 185 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:29,760 new ideas from and new shows and new TV shows, movies and whatnot. 186 00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:31,720 And they just go back and back and back. 187 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:35,960 We saw this with Marvel to what sells, but the problem is, I don't know if that's selling 188 00:10:35,960 --> 00:10:39,840 as well anymore because people are kind of bored of it. 189 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:40,840 You know, 190 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:42,100 I will, I will. 191 00:10:42,100 --> 00:10:46,920 Even the biggest diehard fans of Marvel have stopped watching a lot of the content. 192 00:10:46,920 --> 00:10:48,960 Yeah, like take a hint. 193 00:10:48,960 --> 00:10:53,000 And it sucks because like, I know how brilliant those were. 194 00:10:53,000 --> 00:10:59,540 I'm not personally like huge Marvel first fan, but I know how important those were to 195 00:10:59,540 --> 00:11:00,540 people. 196 00:11:00,540 --> 00:11:09,160 And just to see it kind of being like, you know, ground into, into the abyss is a bit 197 00:11:09,160 --> 00:11:15,160 hard to watch because it's like, just there's, you guys have the, the ability to do so much 198 00:11:15,160 --> 00:11:18,680 more than just do this over and over and over and over and over again. 199 00:11:18,680 --> 00:11:19,680 You know, I don't know. 200 00:11:19,680 --> 00:11:23,160 Oh, I, you're like too much going on. 201 00:11:23,160 --> 00:11:27,760 My brain, a neurodivergent. 202 00:11:27,760 --> 00:11:30,240 I mean, like particularly, and we'll go into that. 203 00:11:30,240 --> 00:11:32,320 We're going to go straight into that little can of whelks. 204 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:33,320 Yeah. 205 00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:36,440 When we first started talking about even doing this podcast, we were on a phone for like 206 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:39,520 an hour just talking about what we might talk about. 207 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:42,960 So like, I know we will figure out our way through this. 208 00:11:42,960 --> 00:11:45,920 I love, I love that. 209 00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:51,200 I mean, particularly also, I do want to talk about you being an

actor and also, well, I 210 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:53,720 mean, like particularly, I want to interrogate you about that now. 211 00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:58,000 I like that you're like a bitch in three hours. 212 00:11:58,000 --> 00:11:59,000 How do you play a bitch? 213 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:00,000 How do you do it so well? 214 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,320 But I mean, like what, the two simple questions. 215 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:05,680 How do you do a bitch so well? 216 00:12:05,680 --> 00:12:09,640 No, we're, we're like, why, why acting? 217 00:12:09,640 --> 00:12:14,560 Why, you know, why that particular avenue for you? 218 00:12:14,560 --> 00:12:18,320 Simply I just did not want to go to university. 219 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:19,320 No. 220 00:12:19,320 --> 00:12:26,160 Well, honestly, I ever since I was a kid, I've been an entertainer and I've been really 221 00:12:26,160 --> 00:12:29,920 interested in, in the arts. 222 00:12:29,920 --> 00:12:34,560 And I feel like I've said this so many times in my life, but it really is my villain origin 223 00:12:34,560 --> 00:12:36,940 story. 224 00:12:36,940 --> 00:12:43,880 When I was in high school, I went to Earl Hick secondary school and they have something 225 00:12:43,880 --> 00:12:47,680 called the Claude Watson program, which is like an arts program. 226 00:12:47,680 --> 00:12:51,560 And they have like mini Claude, which is for, you know, middle school kids. 227 00:12:51,560 --> 00:12:53,720 And I auditioned for that, didn't get into that. 228 00:12:53,720 --> 00:12:56,800 So I went to like, you know, a normal person in school. 229 00:12:56,800 --> 00:13:02,440 And then in high school audition for the vocal program for grade nine. 230 00:13:02,440 --> 00:13:03,880 And I was like, Oh, I'll probably get in. 231 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:05,320 Like I'll be a nepo baby here. 232 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:08,920 My dad was part of building this, this arts program, whatever. 233 00:13:08,920 --> 00:13:10,520 It didn't happen for me. 234 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:16,120 So like even my little shred of nepo babyism that I could have used, it was like, no, because 235 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:20,600 I didn't know, I didn't sing classical music and I didn't really do theory. 236 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:22,600 And I also just was shit at school. 237 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:27,360 They're like, we're not going to give you like an extra workload of being in the arts 238 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:28,360 program. 239 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:30,440 Same thing happened in grade, uh, grade 10. 240 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:35,920 I auditioned to do in the, to be in the drama program, didn't get into that. 241 00:13:35,920 --> 00:13:41,600 And so over and over again, I just kept getting beat down about like trying to do arts and 242 00:13:41,600 --> 00:13:48,440 just being turned away because of my academic, academic lack of success. 243 00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:54,080 Because I was undiagnosed ADHD and I just wasn't a good student.

244 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:59,540 So that affected art because it had to be balanced in school and I just wasn't able 245 00:13:59,540 --> 00:14:01,360 to balance it. 246 00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:05,080 So when I graduated high school, I was like, I'm not going to university. 247 00:14:05,080 --> 00:14:06,360 I don't want to do this. 248 00:14:06,360 --> 00:14:09,960 I know I'll be depressed for the next four years. 249 00:14:09,960 --> 00:14:13,840 So I went to Australia and I was an au pair for a bit. 250 00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:20,280 And um, an important part of the story though was in grade 11, Degrassi came to our school 251 00:14:20,280 --> 00:14:27,380 for an open call and the whole hallway was filled with like drama students and people 252 00:14:27,380 --> 00:14:28,380 auditioning. 253 00:14:28,380 --> 00:14:35,080 It was like 500 kids and long story short, I was one of four people who got a call back. 254 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:38,960 And I remember being in that line and a kid asking me what I was doing there. 255 00:14:38,960 --> 00:14:41,280 Like so what, why are you here? 256 00:14:41,280 --> 00:14:45,480 And I'm like, I'm auditioning and they're like, Oh, you know, like that kind of petty 257 00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:49,440 BS and like that really hurt. 258 00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:53,200 But then when I, like, I remember getting the email and it's saying like, you have a 259 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:58,160 call back and going like, fuck you guys. 260 00:14:58,160 --> 00:15:02,620 And it really propelled me forward to just be like, okay, even though these people say 261 00:15:02,620 --> 00:15:07,200 I can't, I can because professionals are taking me seriously. 262 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:09,300 So I went to Australia, I did all that. 263 00:15:09,300 --> 00:15:16,520 And then I, I just kind of started getting involved with like student, student stuff. 264 00:15:16,520 --> 00:15:19,300 My friends were in student programs, film programs. 265 00:15:19,300 --> 00:15:21,280 So I started doing films for them. 266 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:22,640 And then I got an agent. 267 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:25,400 I booked my first audition, which was crazy. 268 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:26,400 It was for working moms. 269 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:27,400 I had no lines. 270 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:29,200 I was just a sassy Pilates teacher. 271 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:32,560 I think that's like season one or no season two. 272 00:15:32,560 --> 00:15:35,720 I don't know where, but you'll, you'll see me. 273 00:15:35,720 --> 00:15:40,560 And then I just like kept on auditioning and I was like, wow, this is easy. 274 00:15:40,560 --> 00:15:42,840 It's not. 275 00:15:42,840 --> 00:15:48,280 And then I booked Lock and Key about a year and a half into, into auditioning, which was 276 00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:49,520 just like huge. 277 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:54,760 I didn't even realize, like I remember saying to my agent, wow, this is cool. 278 00:15:54,760 --> 00:15:58,880 I

guess other like casting directors will see that I booked something like that's good. 279 00:15:58,880 --> 00:15:59,880 I'll get more auditions. 280 00:15:59,880 --> 00:16:03,080 And my agent was like, I think this isn't a different stratosphere, Hylia. 281 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:05,640 Like I don't, I think this is like really big. 282 00:16:05,640 --> 00:16:11,200 This is for Netflix and Netflix was like a thing, but it wasn't like something that was 283 00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:12,720 super on my radar. 284 00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:21,120 It's like, you know, so I got into it mainly because I just kind of, I didn't want to go 285 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:22,440 the traditional route. 286 00:16:22,440 --> 00:16:27,320 I was because I was constantly pushed in that direction by not by my parents ever. 287 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:32,720 They're very supportive, but like a lot of my peers in high school basically saying like 288 00:16:32,720 --> 00:16:35,880 I would amount to nothing if I didn't go to university and I was like, I would approve 289 00:16:35,880 --> 00:16:37,640 you wrong. 290 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:41,880 And now I'm literally like a vocalist, an actor and a painter. 291 00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:45,720 And there's like a visual arts program that I like tried so hard to like impress the visual 292 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:52,200 artists when I was in high school and they were like, you know, I just feel like I kind 293 00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:58,920 of came out the other side successful because of the fact that I just didn't let them get 294 00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:01,440 me down in the long run. 295 00:17:01,440 --> 00:17:05,800 At the time they did for sure, but after a while it was just like, this is what I want 296 00:17:05,800 --> 00:17:06,800 to do more than anything. 297 00:17:06,800 --> 00:17:09,040 I'm just going to go into it and see how it happens. 298 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:15,800 Yeah, which is really, I mean, this kind of like the best result and also like, fuck everyone 299 00:17:15,800 --> 00:17:17,160 who doubts you. 300 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:23,680 I think it's also like the clearly the most ADHD coded story. 301 00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,520 I can't focus on anything more than like a couple of weeks. 302 00:17:26,520 --> 00:17:31,680 So like to have an agent who's consistently like sending me things is great because I'm 303 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:36,640 like, okay, like I have someone, you know, putting me in positions, you know, compared 304 00:17:36,640 --> 00:17:39,600 to going out and doing other things by myself. 305 00:17:39,600 --> 00:17:45,840 I think it's also like, and a lot of my friends who are, you know, like actors in Australia 306 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:47,600 as well, they're the same. 307 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:49,640 They're trying to find agents that will suit them. 308 00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:53,440 Like there's sort of like a weird thing where I think you go through the stage of like you 309 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:55,440 outgrow your agent or you change agents. 310 00:17:55,440 --> 00:18:00,280 Oh, my agent just got a felony charge for stealing $800,000 from their clients. 311 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:01,960 So that's why I outgrew my agent. 312 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:02,960 I left them. 313 00:18:02,960 --> 00:18:04,960 I mean like that's a bit of a, yeah. 314 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:05,960 It's like tea. 315 00:18:05,960 --> 00:18:08,720 And I can say it because it's on like newspapers and stuff. 316 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:09,720 That's amazing. 317 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:11,040 I was top of the roster. 318 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:12,600 I was like friends with them. 319 00:18:12,600 --> 00:18:17,800 Like I, not friends with them, but like, you know, I liked them a lot and then shit hit 320 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:19,160 the fan over a weekend. 321 00:18:19,160 --> 00:18:22,320 And I was like, okay, I got him. 322 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:28,000 And I had luckily been finished locking key at that point, but like, yeah, it was some 323 00:18:28,000 --> 00:18:29,000 tea. 324 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:33,400 That's so, that is also like, and there's a sort of like discussion now, I think on 325 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:38,600 online forums and stuff where it's like a lot of my friends are representing themselves, 326 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:39,600 which is another route. 327 00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:40,600 It's really hard. 328 00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:41,600 It's so hard. 329 00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:43,400 Like I'm not, I'm not saying do it. 330 00:18:43,400 --> 00:18:46,720 My neurodivergent brain could never. 331 00:18:46,720 --> 00:18:53,440 But I do think that like, and a lot of the thing I also think, and my father-in-law asked 332 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,680 me this question because we were watching, we were watching a film and you know, he was 333 00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:58,480 like, how many actors actually make it? 334 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:00,800 And we, we Googled, we did the Google search. 335 00:19:00,800 --> 00:19:05,800 It's like 1% of the whole world become like well-known names. 336 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,360 And you sort of like statistically look at that. 337 00:19:09,360 --> 00:19:12,080 That's horrifying, but it doesn't mean you've never acted in your life. 338 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:19,120 I think the thing that I always love and I think like, I look at everyone's career when 339 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:22,000 you sort of discover names and you go, oh, this person was great in this. 340 00:19:22,000 --> 00:19:26,080 And you know, there's always like milestones that actors go through. 341 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,640 There's like their golden era or like an artist's golden era. 342 00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,500 It's like, there's the dry spell of like, maybe, you know, like I think Daniel Day-Lewis 343 00:19:33,500 --> 00:19:38,320 is the only weird one who is like ever consistent every seven years. 344 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:43,240 He'll

come out of her time and be like, I did Carpentry and now I'm going to go home. 345 00:19:43,240 --> 00:19:47,720 But he, he got to that point through trial and tribulation, right? 346 00:19:47,720 --> 00:19:53,240 I don't know his IMDB that well, but whenever I feel down on myself, excuse me, because 347 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:56,680 I am in a dry spell right now until recently. 348 00:19:56,680 --> 00:20:01,440 And I'm very grateful to be working on something in the, in the new year. 349 00:20:01,440 --> 00:20:04,840 I was not booking anything, like anything. 350 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:06,880 And I came off of Lock and Key hot. 351 00:20:06,880 --> 00:20:09,400 Like I was feeling good about my work. 352 00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:15,120 I was getting really built up with really kind compliments and support and whatnot. 353 00:20:15,120 --> 00:20:16,720 And I was like, this is awesome. 354 00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:18,240 Like I'm going to go and book something. 355 00:20:18,240 --> 00:20:22,280 And this is like, this is going to like, my career is going to take off even more than 356 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:23,280 this. 357 00:20:23,280 --> 00:20:28,160 Like, and I was also like, I was in LA, like looking at billboards on Sunset Avenue with 358 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,520 like Lock and Key on it and being like, holy shit, I'm in that. 359 00:20:31,520 --> 00:20:32,720 Like, wow, I've made it. 360 00:20:32,720 --> 00:20:33,720 I've had my moment. 361 00:20:33,720 --> 00:20:35,160 I've made it. 362 00:20:35,160 --> 00:20:37,000 And that was just the beginning. 363 00:20:37,000 --> 00:20:43,880 It's crazy to think like everything goes and flows and it's like ups and downs and like 364 00:20:43,880 --> 00:20:46,080 finding that way to it. 365 00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:49,680 I don't think you make it until you get to that, like Daniel Day-Lewis point where you 366 00:20:49,680 --> 00:20:54,560 can choose your projects and you can, you can take that time off to do carpentry and 367 00:20:54,560 --> 00:20:55,840 that's fine. 368 00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:56,920 But that takes a long time. 369 00:20:56,920 --> 00:21:02,320 And whenever I get down on myself about going through a dry period, I go to IMDb's. 370 00:21:02,320 --> 00:21:06,560 I go to people's IMDb's and I go, when did they start? 371 00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:09,960 How many years did it take until they got their first notable role? 372 00:21:09,960 --> 00:21:11,800 And most of the time it's 10 years. 373 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,240 I'm only six years in. 374 00:21:14,240 --> 00:21:15,240 So I'm okay. 375 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:21,480 Like, I'm very lucky and I feel very grateful for where I've gotten to so far, but I still 376 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:26,440 have years of work and it will be work after that too to uphold the career that I want 377 00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:27,640 because it's a career. 378 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:33,520 It's something that I'm building constantly and there's no ABC, like it's all over the 379 00:21:33,520 --> 00:21:35,200 place and you never know when it's going to hit. 380 00:21:35,200 --> 00:21:38,160 Like I could get a call today or no, on Monday. 381 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:42,280 That would just like, they don't call on Saturdays unless it's like something really special. 382 00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:46,960 But I mean, like I could get a call on Monday. 383 00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:49,080 That could just completely change my life. 384 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:50,880 And that happened to me a few months ago. 385 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:53,800 Like something I auditioned for in December. 386 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:59,420 I did a call back in January and then in July they were like, Hey, remember that thing you 387 00:21:59,420 --> 00:22:01,560 auditioned for months and months and months ago? 388 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,420 They want you to come to Vancouver for an in-person screen test. 389 00:22:05,420 --> 00:22:06,480 And I'm like, what? 390 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:10,280 I haven't even thought about that in like several months. 391 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:14,720 So it's like the world as an actor is so up and down. 392 00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:18,320 And like anytime I'm down on myself, just go check out IMDb. 393 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:22,880 It's so interesting because some people also have really, really, really amazing periods 394 00:22:22,880 --> 00:22:23,880 and then nothing. 395 00:22:23,880 --> 00:22:27,560 And that could be by choice or it could just be because you like you burn out sometimes. 396 00:22:27,560 --> 00:22:28,560 Yeah. 397 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:33,360 I think, and I think it's also really healthy to kind of like go in ebbs and flows. 398 00:22:33,360 --> 00:22:35,360 I think, I think like I'm with you. 399 00:22:35,360 --> 00:22:36,640 I'm totally with you. 400 00:22:36,640 --> 00:22:43,560 I think it's like when I hit my peak, I then like had a momentary and like a lot of my 401 00:22:43,560 --> 00:22:46,960 projects like the podcast and stuff was self-made. 402 00:22:46,960 --> 00:22:48,880 Like I didn't have like producers or anything. 403 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,000 I think that was like the biggest thing to convince it because I was starting out with 404 00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:56,520 friends and then I was like, okay, well I've got to have a reputable bank of stuff I've 405 00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:57,520 done. 406 00:22:57,520 --> 00:22:59,800 That's the only way you improve your skills. 407 00:22:59,800 --> 00:23:02,400 You keep working, you make more stuff. 408 00:23:02,400 --> 00:23:06,920 And I think particularly it was like, you know, I never thought in a million years that, 409 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:10,840 you know, like I'd sit down with some people and be like, oh God, I get to actually talk 410 00:23:10,840 --> 00:23:16,080 to people who I feel have had a career and not to say some of my friends haven't, they've 411 00:23:16,080 --> 00:23:20,920 had amazing careers, but it did

feel like I was getting more reputable like as a source 412 00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:22,040 of an interviewer. 413 00:23:22,040 --> 00:23:29,120 And I think particularly like during 2023, I was overworking and burning out. 414 00:23:29,120 --> 00:23:32,600 So I had the opposite problem where I was just like, I was doing too much. 415 00:23:32,600 --> 00:23:35,380 So I was like, oh God, I don't have any help. 416 00:23:35,380 --> 00:23:40,920 And that's kind of like the thing that also you need to constantly damage as an artist. 417 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:44,520 Like it's like, and now I'm at the other side where I'm like really excited to do projects 418 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:49,560 again, but that always takes like, I think rejigging your brain because it's like, as 419 00:23:49,560 --> 00:23:54,760 we say, what do we love and why do we keep wanting to do it? 420 00:23:54,760 --> 00:24:00,600 Which I think, you know, like life is too short not to do something you love. 421 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:02,940 And I think that's a really big thing. 422 00:24:02,940 --> 00:24:10,120 And I look at like one of my favorite things is always looking at, you know, careers where 423 00:24:10,120 --> 00:24:15,680 it's like you watch someone's first movie, like their first like Peter Jackson or, you 424 00:24:15,680 --> 00:24:21,320 know, like Alfred Hitchcock or like even Greta Gerwig's like first film, like all of them. 425 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:23,120 I'm sorry, they're all shit. 426 00:24:23,120 --> 00:24:25,160 Like they're just terrible. 427 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:26,160 That's how you learn. 428 00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:32,640 And I mean, Quentin Tarantino has spoken very openly about this, about how if you want to 429 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:36,000 become a filmmaker, don't go to school, go and spend the money you're going to go spend 430 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:41,120 on school and make a shitty film because you are going to learn more making a shitty film 431 00:24:41,120 --> 00:24:43,160 than you are sitting behind a desk. 432 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:47,920 And that's different for everyone because some people really enjoy academics and like, 433 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:51,160 sure, go to school if you want to go to school for that. 434 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:55,160 But I have learned more on set than anything. 435 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,120 But you have to start out doing shitty things in order to learn what's right and what's 436 00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:00,120 wrong. 437 00:25:00,120 --> 00:25:02,280 You know, what works and what doesn't. 438 00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:03,280 Everyone has to do that. 439 00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:09,920 And I think if you start out strong, you're going to you're going to fuck up eventually. 440 00:25:09,920 --> 00:25:13,240 And you're not going to know how to deal with that. 441 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:21,520 And I think with the success of Lock and Key, you know, I'm and I don't know maybe if this 442 00:25:21,520 --> 00:25:27,760 is me justifying like having a hard couple of years, but I think there's also conceptualizing 443 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:37,440 the fact that maybe I needed this time, a down period to recognize how good it can be 444 00:25:37,440 --> 00:25:45,960 and to appreciate the career I'm in and understand how to navigate the low periods because I 445 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:47,320 didn't really have that. 446 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,000 Like Lock and Key hit pretty early on in my career. 447 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:55,000 And if it kept on going up and up and up, I think I probably would have been a dickhead. 448 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:58,480 You know, like I think I needed that. 449 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:04,840 The I needed like the the rose colored glasses to come off to see like this this industry 450 00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:10,320 is difficult and to have like empathy towards people who like everyone who takes time in 451 00:26:10,320 --> 00:26:14,800 this industry to come up because it's not easy. 452 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:21,200 So yeah, like for me, I I discovered that I can paint pet portraits and I can make money 453 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:23,420 doing that when I'm not working. 454 00:26:23,420 --> 00:26:29,520 Even if I'm like, you know, the bank accounts doing OK, like it's good to still have something 455 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:31,960 to rely on. 456 00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:33,200 That's I enjoy. 457 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,740 And I feel very lucky that I've had this time to discover that. 458 00:26:36,740 --> 00:26:39,920 And I'm not, you know, because for so long it was like, oh, well, the only way that I 459 00:26:39,920 --> 00:26:42,340 can make good money is by acting. 460 00:26:42,340 --> 00:26:44,440 And then I would stress about it. 461 00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:50,940 And that would just get me down and it would it made me fight against my joy for acting. 462 00:26:50,940 --> 00:26:59,880 So that time away from acting has been really so full of self growth and discovering self 463 00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:07,360 worth beyond the projects that, you know, could be given to me or not. 464 00:27:07,360 --> 00:27:10,120 Not given to me, but like I could be in and whatnot. 465 00:27:10,120 --> 00:27:12,680 Like I'm more than just an actor. 466 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:19,120 And that this time off has really offered me that opportunity to learn who I am without 467 00:27:19,120 --> 00:27:21,440 being on set, even though I love me when I'm on set. 468 00:27:21,440 --> 00:27:23,200 I'm the happiest being ever. 469 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:25,160 I'm so happy when I'm on set. 470 00:27:25,160 --> 00:27:33,280 Which is so lovely as well, and I love what you say about like having that time off and 471 00:27:33,280 --> 00:27:34,280 at reflection. 472 00:27:34,280 --> 00:27:35,400 I think we all need that. 473 00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:40,440 I think what I might like, you know, and the same thing happened to me. 474 00:27:40,440 -->

00:27:45,080 And I think like even currently, like I've changed, you know, I've now have a mundane 475 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:50,120 nine to five job to kind of fuel income because there was like, and I think I needed it, you 476 00:27:50,120 --> 00:27:54,600 know, like I came to Canada thinking I've got these skillsets that I've had in Australia, 477 00:27:54,600 --> 00:27:57,960 you know, like a really good, I'm going to bring them over here and people are going 478 00:27:57,960 --> 00:27:59,280 to love my work. 479 00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:00,880 And no, it was complete opposite. 480 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:02,400 It was just brick walls. 481 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:03,560 It was nothing. 482 00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:07,200 And I think it was the real, it was kind of like the slap in the face that I needed to 483 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:12,880 be like, okay, well get off your high stool, like get off the pedestal and realize what 484 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:13,880 your strengths are. 485 00:28:13,880 --> 00:28:18,500 And I, one of my friends managed to get me a job at a company she worked at. 486 00:28:18,500 --> 00:28:22,880 And I was like, cool, I'll do this, do it for about a year. 487 00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:23,880 And that's my mental. 488 00:28:23,880 --> 00:28:26,400 I'm like five weeks in, but it's like, it's good money. 489 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:28,440 It's decent money, nine to five, Monday to Friday. 490 00:28:28,440 --> 00:28:30,160 But then outside of that, I get to do fun things. 491 00:28:30,160 --> 00:28:34,320 I'm like, okay, well I've got to remind myself it's not the shift work I was doing before. 492 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:36,560 It was all over the clock and I had no energy. 493 00:28:36,560 --> 00:28:38,180 Like it's normal hours. 494 00:28:38,180 --> 00:28:39,280 I can do that. 495 00:28:39,280 --> 00:28:44,360 And then over time, this does not take away my love and passion for the arts and wanting 496 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:50,480 to make films and lead production companies and you know, actually go back and acting 497 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,400 and do voice acting myself. 498 00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:56,000 Like it's one of those things that I think we sort of steer. 499 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:57,000 We kind of kid ourselves. 500 00:28:57,000 --> 00:29:02,920 We kind of go, oh, I haven't made it by a, so why bother anymore? 501 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,080 And it's like, well, you've got to constantly keep bother because that's the thing it's 502 00:29:06,080 --> 00:29:07,520 like proving. 503 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:11,040 And I think that's such a neurodivergent way of thinking as well. 504 00:29:11,040 --> 00:29:13,000 It's like fucking too true. 505 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:19,920 But I like, and I feel like this is the thing through life, through everyone, the amount 506 00:29:19,920 --> 00:29:26,920 of people that I've met who are like way more like stuck up and difficult and everything. 507 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:31,520

Like who have never, like they've done one film, they've done a short film with their 508 00:29:31,520 --> 00:29:33,480 friend and they go, I'm the best shit. 509 00:29:33,480 --> 00:29:37,800 And I'm like, are you like, you've come straight out of drama school. 510 00:29:37,800 --> 00:29:39,620 You've come straight out of uni. 511 00:29:39,620 --> 00:29:45,280 Like I get that you all want to be filmmakers, but no one's going to be that high horse. 512 00:29:45,280 --> 00:29:49,800 Like, and I think the realisation is film sets are the best place to be. 513 00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:53,640 They are so much fun, but they're also the most grueling time. 514 00:29:53,640 --> 00:29:57,480 And a lot of the time is you've got to switch on and you just got to suddenly everyone's 515 00:29:57,480 --> 00:29:58,480 been like, okay, break's over. 516 00:29:58,480 --> 00:29:59,480 We've got to get back to work. 517 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:01,480 Otherwise we're not going to meet. 518 00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:05,480 The figures, like all these things today, we've got like five scenes to shoot and people 519 00:30:05,480 --> 00:30:07,080 go, oh yeah, no. 520 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:11,040 And I've been on set where like some of my friends films were just like, oh yeah, we'll 521 00:30:11,040 --> 00:30:12,040 take our time. 522 00:30:12,040 --> 00:30:13,040 And like, no, we've got to get that. 523 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:14,040 We've got to get stuff. 524 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:15,040 Time is money. 525 00:30:15,040 --> 00:30:16,040 Yeah. 526 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:17,040 Time is money and cut shots. 527 00:30:17,040 --> 00:30:22,440 There are times where, you know, and that like my favourite of a story was someone who 528 00:30:22,440 --> 00:30:26,280 had never been on a big film set was like, oh, this will never happen on a big film set. 529 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:27,280 I was like, are you kidding me? 530 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,840 Like the amount of times that things go wrong on big film sets and they have to cut scenes, 531 00:30:30,840 --> 00:30:36,680 they have to cut shots, they have to cut like entire hours of the day and then just go, 532 00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:37,800 okay, we're clocking off at five. 533 00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:41,280 We have to do either pick this up tomorrow or we're not doing it at all. 534 00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:44,600 And that's the realisation and the amount of rewrites and everything. 535 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:50,120 And it's so funny that every like, and this is the life I've dealt with as a producer 536 00:30:50,120 --> 00:30:58,880 and I remember one of my friends who entered her amazing short film into like a few Australian 537 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:04,040 film festivals and it went into a couple of international ones and it did really well. 538 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:08,880 She I remember the day we started at 10am, we finished at like 1am. 539 00:31:08,880 --> 00:31:13,840 It was a very long day and we had like probably like

two days. 540 00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:18,300 There was one day she didn't finish till 4am, like she was shooting her own stuff. 541 00:31:18,300 --> 00:31:24,680 And I remember like, I remember the next day, people were like, oh, this would never happen 542 00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:27,760 on like someone who had never, yeah, again, never been on a real set. 543 00:31:27,760 --> 00:31:31,560 I was like, I was like, everything's never, you know, you can be the first AD and the 544 00:31:31,560 --> 00:31:34,000 best first AD, things are going to go over. 545 00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:35,000 Yeah, like it's just reality. 546 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,160 The best ADs are the first ADs. 547 00:31:38,160 --> 00:31:42,680 First of all, I think first ADs are the most important people on sets a lot of the time. 548 00:31:42,680 --> 00:31:45,200 I mean, every single person is important in their own right. 549 00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:50,680 But like a bad first AD, you will feel it through the whole set. 550 00:31:50,680 --> 00:31:55,280 But like they're important, like they're basically steering the ship. 551 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:59,840 Like the director is kind of painting the picture of where you're going and like, you 552 00:31:59,840 --> 00:32:03,880 know, where to go and how to go and like what everyone's, you know. 553 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:09,000 But the first AD is like damage control. 554 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,760 And like they have one of the hardest jobs and I've been on film sets where the first 555 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:17,600 AD was green. 556 00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:23,600 And by the end of the day, I had to take them aside because I was the most well, like I 557 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:28,560 was asked to be on the film because of my resume and like I was the one who had worked 558 00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:33,920 and this was more of like a starter film for the filmmakers. 559 00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:39,640 And I took them aside and I was like, because I knew that they would respect my input because 560 00:32:39,640 --> 00:32:41,820 they wanted that otherwise. 561 00:32:41,820 --> 00:32:45,720 And I was like, when do you guys go into overtime? 562 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:48,800 And they're like 45 minutes ago. 563 00:32:48,800 --> 00:32:53,320 And I'm like, what? 564 00:32:53,320 --> 00:32:56,920 And you want to do one more scene in the other room isn't even set that yet. 565 00:32:56,920 --> 00:32:58,760 Like you need to call it right now. 566 00:32:58,760 --> 00:32:59,840 It's the first day. 567 00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:06,360 You're not going to make half of your days in two weeks if you don't, if the first AD 568 00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:08,000 doesn't have a backbone. 569 00:33:08,000 --> 00:33:15,080 And I was like, you can do it kindly, but don't be nice on like how you do things. 570 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:19,320 You have to be strict about them and say, no, we have to move on. 571 00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:20,320 I'm sorry. 572 00:33:20,320 --> 00:33:22,160 We've got what we can work with. 573 00:33:22,160 --> 00:33:23,540 We have to move on. 574 00:33:23,540 --> 00:33:26,480 Or it just goes all to the shitter. 575 00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:33,360 And everyone gets exhausted from that when you don't have any direction because they're 576 00:33:33,360 --> 00:33:35,920 just waiting around like, what do I do next? 577 00:33:35,920 --> 00:33:36,920 What's next for us? 578 00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:38,840 You know, and like it's just, it's grueling. 579 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:40,760 It can be really, really grueling. 580 00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:41,760 I love it. 581 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:42,760 I've been really, really great. 582 00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:47,800 Like I've had really, really great like experiences on set so far. 583 00:33:47,800 --> 00:33:53,400 So I don't have a lot of horror stories, but like I've seen my fair share of shit. 584 00:33:53,400 --> 00:34:00,040 I think I only ever have like one and it was run by me, but it was the only horror story 585 00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:01,160 I remember. 586 00:34:01,160 --> 00:34:04,920 And like, I think it was self-funded. 587 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:06,560 It was very like low key. 588 00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:08,960 We shot it like just before we left Australia. 589 00:34:08,960 --> 00:34:12,800 And I remember we had 15 people in our house. 590 00:34:12,800 --> 00:34:14,520 Like we were shooting in our own house. 591 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:20,280 We were trying to do a fake trailer for a spoof like idea and everyone was trying to 592 00:34:20,280 --> 00:34:21,840 get like, everyone tried to have their own input. 593 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:22,840 It was really quite funny. 594 00:34:22,840 --> 00:34:24,800 Because they were like, yeah, I know. 595 00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:26,600 It was a lot of that. 596 00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:31,720 But I remember there was one actor who did not like the rest of the actors, which caused 597 00:34:31,720 --> 00:34:33,520 a lot of friction. 598 00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:35,520 And that was also the hardest thing. 599 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:40,040 And I think it was like suddenly, like there was a lot of, you know, people's personal 600 00:34:40,040 --> 00:34:41,320 lives started coming into this. 601 00:34:41,320 --> 00:34:47,080 I was like, I remember we got to the end of the day and my dear wife, who I love very 602 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:48,520 much and she used to be a soundie. 603 00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:52,960 So she was very much like, she was like, I left sound like sets like this because she 604 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:56,080 was like, just people annoyed me. 605 00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:01,480 But I do remember I was talking to my DOP and I, there was something like, I remember 606 00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:07,280 I said to, I said to my first, I was like, oh, can you go and make sure this is set up? 607 00:35:07,280 --> 00:35:09,160 Like the next scene. 608 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:12,800 And she was trying to

get him to move, but he wasn't moving fast enough. 609 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:15,080 Well, I was outside dealing with something else. 610 00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:18,600 And I just realised it was like, it doesn't matter what you do if people are not switched 611 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:25,320 on and like, you know, a lot of, even when the thing is like, sometimes it is down to 612 00:35:25,320 --> 00:35:28,800 the fact that the space is not big enough. 613 00:35:28,800 --> 00:35:32,480 And that is, there's so many hurdles to jump over. 614 00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:36,120 But the one thing I remember, because I was the director and producer, everyone blamed 615 00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:37,960 me for it not being good enough. 616 00:35:37,960 --> 00:35:42,800 And I remember going, I was like, okay, guys, it's not just my fault. 617 00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:44,160 It's everyone's input. 618 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:45,160 Yeah. 619 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:52,120 That's, this is, if one person is to blame, then that's terrible, but it's actually everyone's 620 00:35:52,120 --> 00:35:53,120 responsibility. 621 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:58,040 It's never one person unless someone's specifically being like really difficult to work with. 622 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:04,560 And that's why like on set, I am a firm believer that if you come in with the best attitude 623 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:12,480 and like this curiosity and this desire to, you know, make the best product and in the 624 00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:19,240 best time and, you know, just build a community that's going to have the best end product. 625 00:36:19,240 --> 00:36:23,240 And I think that's why Lock and Key was such a like unicorn set. 626 00:36:23,240 --> 00:36:28,160 Like I had multiple crew members say that Lock and Key was a unicorn set in the way 627 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:30,600 that everyone got along. 628 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:34,600 And of course there was dramas here and there, but like as actors, like didn't really hear 629 00:36:34,600 --> 00:36:35,600 about it. 630 00:36:35,600 --> 00:36:40,640 I only heard about things because like I became friends with makeup artists and like the, 631 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:42,760 the costume artists. 632 00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:50,360 Like so it's, yeah, like it doesn't always happen, but I think when you come into a set 633 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:57,520 with the best intention and with just like hoping to have the best time, that's the best 634 00:36:57,520 --> 00:36:59,760 remedy for a great film. 635 00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:04,520 But like it can still go wrong and it can be an incredible time and it can still be 636 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:05,520 boo-boo. 637 00:37:05,520 --> 00:37:06,520 Oh yeah. 638 00:37:06,520 --> 00:37:12,560 And I think one of the, you know, one of the best like critiques I've ever got as an artist 639 00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:15,760 and also this is very neurodivergent as well. 640 00:37:15,760 --> 00:37:20,120 And one of my friends was like, she was like, you always make gold. 641 00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:25,700 The problem is like, it's just seeing how the lines always line up is like sometimes 642 00:37:25,700 --> 00:37:30,080 watching someone finish half a jigsaw and then you show, cause she's like, your quality 643 00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:32,360 of work is always like up here. 644 00:37:32,360 --> 00:37:36,480 But the problem is like you look at it and people just kind of think it's like, oh, I 645 00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:38,560 guess we're going to hamstring this together. 646 00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:40,880 And it's like, well, that's sometimes the only way. 647 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:46,520 Like sometimes it's just be your crew, like be, I remember particularly prior COVID, actually 648 00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,920 this was like the biggest thing I'd ever tried to work with. 649 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,920 It took me like two, two and a half years. 650 00:37:52,920 --> 00:37:56,360 It's actually getting revitalized soon. 651 00:37:56,360 --> 00:38:00,720 But it was a anthology horror series. 652 00:38:00,720 --> 00:38:05,240 And I remember we had budgeted it and I remember I felt like I was working. 653 00:38:05,240 --> 00:38:08,540 It was the first time I had tried to have a team of like, okay, well I've got a few 654 00:38:08,540 --> 00:38:10,480 friends who are producers and stuff like that. 655 00:38:10,480 --> 00:38:14,400 But I ended up feeling like it was one of those things where I was like, I felt like 656 00:38:14,400 --> 00:38:16,560 I was the only one with a realistic budget in mind. 657 00:38:16,560 --> 00:38:18,880 And everyone else was like, oh, we can cut corners here. 658 00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:21,360 And I was like, there is no way we can cut corners. 659 00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:26,000 There's some things I was like, we, you know, the, this needs to be a real location unless 660 00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,160 we build it or it's going to cost this much. 661 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:30,680 And it just, it was the most hilarious time. 662 00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:36,440 And I think it was kind of great because COVID happened, it got shut down very quickly because 663 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:39,080 we were like, well, we can't shoot it during a pandemic. 664 00:38:39,080 --> 00:38:44,760 And it gave me time to sit down and go, okay, well I had so many opinions coming in. 665 00:38:44,760 --> 00:38:45,760 What do I want to make? 666 00:38:45,760 --> 00:38:48,880 You know, what, what at the end of the day is going to be this product? 667 00:38:48,880 --> 00:38:57,080 And I think that's where I enjoy because COVID really forced me to slow down. 668 00:38:57,080 --> 00:39:03,200 It forced that whole like, you know, as ADHD your brain goes a million miles an hour a 669 00:39:03,200 --> 00:39:06,160 minute and people go, oh, you know, like can't keep up. 670 00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:07,160 It's great. 671 00:39:07,160 --> 00:39:11,600 Like it's the other side

where it's like, oh, I get to focus and really hone my skills 672 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:13,800 and go, well, this is great. 673 00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:16,320 I'm going to inform my knowledge on this. 674 00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:21,560 Like I learned color grading during that COVID period, like learn how to edit audio, learn 675 00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:22,920 how to do a bunch of stuff. 676 00:39:22,920 --> 00:39:28,320 So I felt like I, I didn't have knowledge before that of the full picture of filmmaking, 677 00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:31,080 you know, cause that's, you don't like, you always like. 678 00:39:31,080 --> 00:39:32,680 And that's going back to what we were talking about. 679 00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,920 You've got to make shit before you make gold. 680 00:39:35,920 --> 00:39:39,640 You really have to go through that experience in order to understand what works and what 681 00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:40,640 doesn't work. 682 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,440 And like, now you know that you need to sit down with yourself and say, what do I want 683 00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:50,060 and not take the opinions of like five other people who, unless they have good intentions 684 00:39:50,060 --> 00:39:54,480 or like, you know, they have way more experience than you, then sometimes that is appreciated 685 00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:56,480 because you have a lot to learn still. 686 00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:57,480 All of us do. 687 00:39:57,480 --> 00:40:01,200 Even the best filmmakers still have things to learn. 688 00:40:01,200 --> 00:40:05,240 But it's like that, that willingness to learn is one of the most important things. 689 00:40:05,240 --> 00:40:09,480 And like, whether it's with other people or by yourself, it's like taking that time. 690 00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:14,880 I mean, like, here's a, here's a really in-depth question for you as a narrative urgent person, 691 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:20,400 I mean, like, have you felt that a lot of people kind of like put you into a certain 692 00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:24,640 category because, you know, like you have ADHD or, you know, were you ever kind of like 693 00:40:24,640 --> 00:40:28,640 considered the weird kid or the different kid growing up? 694 00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:36,080 Um, undiagnosed, but I think that was other issues. 695 00:40:36,080 --> 00:40:41,760 So I'm not even going to say, but like, I think nowadays I can look at a lot of things 696 00:40:41,760 --> 00:40:48,120 and like why I struggled with certain friendships or, and I even like understanding my sexuality 697 00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:49,120 too. 698 00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:52,720 Like I, I now I'm like, oh, maybe that's why I struggled with having female friendships 699 00:40:52,720 --> 00:40:53,720 growing up. 700 00:40:53,720 --> 00:40:57,880 Like now looking back on it, like, oh, it was ADHD, it was sexuality, it was this, it 701 00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:04,360 was that, like, you know, like understanding that these things have taken, have been a 702 00:41:04,360 --> 00:41:11,320 part of my life for so long, undiagnosed and to understand now how to navigate them is 703 00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:15,000 like reworking a lot of my brain. 704 00:41:15,000 --> 00:41:20,440 Um, yeah, it's affected so many parts of my life. 705 00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:25,960 I mean, like, do you, do you feel like the milestones of your life have like really then 706 00:41:25,960 --> 00:41:31,320 shifted like, you know, the, the way you sort of see friendships now as an adult? 707 00:41:31,320 --> 00:41:32,320 Totally. 708 00:41:32,320 --> 00:41:37,120 What's really interesting, actually, um, I've recently in the last like several months made 709 00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:43,160 two new girlfriends who like, I met them through their boyfriends, like they are in the music 710 00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:45,240 scene and whatever. 711 00:41:45,240 --> 00:41:55,560 And they, it's so cool to have good girlfriends that like, I feel like I'm a part of something 712 00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:59,080 because like I've always had like one-off girlfriends and like, you know, like my best 713 00:41:59,080 --> 00:42:02,320 friend Michelle, who is on the West coast filming right now. 714 00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:07,840 And like, you know, I've had different close friends that are just like one-offs, but I've 715 00:42:07,840 --> 00:42:11,240 never really felt like I've been a part of a positive group. 716 00:42:11,240 --> 00:42:18,040 Like that I understand now, like growing up I was, and it just wasn't, it didn't work 717 00:42:18,040 --> 00:42:25,000 out well, I think, because I didn't know a lot about myself and I didn't know how to 718 00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:31,760 navigate having ADHD and how that affects relationships because it really, really does. 719 00:42:31,760 --> 00:42:33,800 And I'm still learning that. 720 00:42:33,800 --> 00:42:37,800 But now I'm a lot more honest with myself and a lot more willing to just be like, Ooh, 721 00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:39,320 that didn't come across right. 722 00:42:39,320 --> 00:42:46,000 Or like, you know, I'm trying to figure out how to navigate having those good friendships 723 00:42:46,000 --> 00:42:50,080 and relationships so that my ADHD doesn't affect them. 724 00:42:50,080 --> 00:42:54,180 And like looking back on my childhood, it really did. 725 00:42:54,180 --> 00:43:01,000 And I made mistakes and I did things that I probably like, I didn't even know why, but 726 00:43:01,000 --> 00:43:06,760 it was because I was incredibly neurodivergent and had no support in that realm. 727 00:43:06,760 --> 00:43:09,840 And it's not because my parents were like, no, that doesn't exist. 728 00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:11,320 It was because we didn't know. 729 00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:12,800 We just didn't know. 730 00:43:12,800 --> 00:43:16,680 Like I got tested when I was 10 and they said it could be mild. 731 00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,880 And my mom's like, I would string that guy up. 732 00:43:20,880

--> 00:43:27,880 Like, she's so like, I wish that he had done more thorough testing on you because it wasn't 733 00:43:27,880 --> 00:43:31,040 until I was in grade 12 that I officially got diagnosed and I was already like, I'm 734 00:43:31,040 --> 00:43:33,760 not going to university because I can't pay attention in class. 735 00:43:33,760 --> 00:43:40,080 And like it had already affected my life so negatively that it was so I remember being 736 00:43:40,080 --> 00:43:45,600 mad when I got diagnosed because I didn't know earlier. 737 00:43:45,600 --> 00:43:50,080 And now every time like I learned something new about ADHD, I'm like, wow, would I still 738 00:43:50,080 --> 00:43:54,480 have those friendships if I had known better of myself? 739 00:43:54,480 --> 00:43:56,980 Would I have navigated them more? 740 00:43:56,980 --> 00:44:00,280 Would I have, you know, all of these what ifs, what ifs, what ifs, like those people 741 00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:05,480 aren't in my life now because of a lot of things that I didn't understand about myself. 742 00:44:05,480 --> 00:44:08,120 And I've learned from that since. 743 00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:16,240 So having new friendships now has been so exciting because when things go wrong or like, 744 00:44:16,240 --> 00:44:22,920 you know, when there's hard conversations, I'm so much better at being honest, at being 745 00:44:22,920 --> 00:44:26,960 like, you know, I had a conversation with one of the girls the other day and she's like, 746 00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:28,520 is there something going on between us? 747 00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:30,440 Is there something wrong or whatever? 748 00:44:30,440 --> 00:44:32,240 I'm like, not that I'm aware of. 749 00:44:32,240 --> 00:44:34,880 And she's like, yeah, you just like seem like you're way more quiet. 750 00:44:34,880 --> 00:44:37,360 I'm like, girl, I haven't texted my mom in like a week. 751 00:44:37,360 --> 00:44:41,240 Like I haven't talked to Michelle in like two weeks. 752 00:44:41,240 --> 00:44:42,680 Like it's nothing personal. 753 00:44:42,680 --> 00:44:48,000 It's just that I like time blindness is such a big thing in my life where like I can go 754 00:44:48,000 --> 00:44:50,560 weeks without talking to a friend. 755 00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:55,320 And then we sit at coffee and it's like no time has passed, at least in my mind. 756 00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:59,280 And I don't think that it's necessary to keep up with friends every single day. 757 00:44:59,280 --> 00:45:01,160 Like I don't have long text conversations. 758 00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:05,840 I don't have long phone calls with people like, but if I'm sitting across from them, 759 00:45:05,840 --> 00:45:10,120 that's where I can like really tune in and like connect with that person. 760 00:45:10,120 --> 00:45:15,620 So I think that might've been a part of like growing up and, you know, just not having 761 00:45:15,620 --> 00:45:20,160 that closeness with people because I was so happy to be on my own too. 762 00:45:20,160 --> 00:45:21,160 You know? 763 00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:22,160 So yeah. 764 00:45:22,160 --> 00:45:23,160 I love that. 765 00:45:23,160 --> 00:45:25,960 No, I'm, I'm the same. 766 00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:32,680 I think it's also something that I've grown up and realized as I got older, cause I was 767 00:45:32,680 --> 00:45:40,560 diagnosed at five and like, I think in knowing that I had the opposite problem where my mom 768 00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:46,240 assumed I'd grew out of it and I didn't realize how much it impacted my adulthood as well 769 00:45:46,240 --> 00:45:50,960 because I was getting into situations where I was like, I can't understand why this situation 770 00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:56,680 is like difficult for me or, you know, like, it's not hard for anyone else. 771 00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:58,640 I struggle anyway. 772 00:45:58,640 --> 00:45:59,640 Taxes. 773 00:45:59,640 --> 00:46:02,000 Oh, and there's, there was a great ad. 774 00:46:02,000 --> 00:46:06,680 I remember actually talking about taxes that did talk about like people with, you know, 775 00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:13,480 cause I get great tax ads, but it was talking about people with like, you know, blindness 776 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:15,040 towards due dates and stuff like that. 777 00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:16,040 I have that all the time. 778 00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:17,240 I just forget. 779 00:46:17,240 --> 00:46:18,920 I just kind of like, oh shit. 780 00:46:18,920 --> 00:46:19,920 Fuck. 781 00:46:19,920 --> 00:46:20,920 I have that all in my calendar. 782 00:46:20,920 --> 00:46:21,920 I will forget. 783 00:46:21,920 --> 00:46:27,240 I had to call the CR and be like, girl, I'm so sorry. 784 00:46:27,240 --> 00:46:28,240 I didn't realize. 785 00:46:28,240 --> 00:46:31,800 I still think that we're in January or like of last year. 786 00:46:31,800 --> 00:46:37,160 Like, yeah, she knows me now. 787 00:46:37,160 --> 00:46:42,960 But I do think that's kind of like the thing of like, you know, you come into it now and 788 00:46:42,960 --> 00:46:46,000 you just kind of get like paranoid about it. 789 00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:51,040 I remember particularly like one of my friends, one of my best friends who's known me for 790 00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:58,440 like 14 years now, like I, we met in high school, like, and we became like, like it 791 00:46:58,440 --> 00:47:03,560 was a friendship that also took time because like we were both on the spectrum and both 792 00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:09,800 had ADHD and like, it was one of those things, but I, that kind of worked out and we both 793 00:47:09,800 --> 00:47:15,000 like catch up maybe once every three months, like she lives in Australia. 794 00:47:15,000 --> 00:47:19,640 So it's even when I was there, I would see her maybe once every three or six months, 795 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:20,640 like, and she's my best friend. 796 00:47:20,640 --> 00:47:24,520 And I was like, and some people who I, who I saw as more of

acquaintances, I would see 797 00:47:24,520 --> 00:47:25,520 more regularly. 798 00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:28,360 I wonder why that is because I'm the same. 799 00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:29,360 Yeah. 800 00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:32,960 But I mean, like I kind of, the thing is, and I don't know if you've discovered this 801 00:47:32,960 --> 00:47:41,960 as an adult, which I find I'm more excited by neurodivergent people than I am from neurotypical 802 00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:42,960 people, which is scary. 803 00:47:42,960 --> 00:47:48,920 They've got their life together and that's boring. 804 00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:54,060 It's also like a little bit, and you know, and it was the thing about like my own sexuality 805 00:47:54,060 --> 00:47:55,560 and my own identity. 806 00:47:55,560 --> 00:48:02,120 A lot of that came out of like when I pulled myself out of like just being ADHD and then 807 00:48:02,120 --> 00:48:04,520 I came to appreciate everything. 808 00:48:04,520 --> 00:48:08,200 Cause a lot of it, like a lot of it you don't think of like a lot of it just sits in the 809 00:48:08,200 --> 00:48:09,800 background and just goes, oh. 810 00:48:09,800 --> 00:48:13,320 You're like, why is my life falling apart in all these ways? 811 00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:18,240 And then you learn and you're like, whoa, my God, I could literally just be doing this, 812 00:48:18,240 --> 00:48:23,040 this, this, and you know, maybe get medicated and this, this, you know, whatever. 813 00:48:23,040 --> 00:48:25,960 And like I went on a well butane for depression. 814 00:48:25,960 --> 00:48:26,960 It changed my life. 815 00:48:26,960 --> 00:48:27,960 Oh wow. 816 00:48:27,960 --> 00:48:33,280 And it doesn't work for everyone, but like it's, it's for ADHD a little bit as well. 817 00:48:33,280 --> 00:48:38,800 It's helped with my ADHD and like five ants for my ADHD was horrible for me. 818 00:48:38,800 --> 00:48:44,680 Like I was on like 50 milligrams and I was like buzzed out of my mind or sleeping and 819 00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:46,840 like no in between. 820 00:48:46,840 --> 00:48:48,620 And it just wasn't working for me. 821 00:48:48,620 --> 00:48:54,040 But now I, instead of like focusing on the medication part, I'm like focusing on the 822 00:48:54,040 --> 00:49:01,040 structure part and trying to implement structures into my life that can help me better serve 823 00:49:01,040 --> 00:49:05,760 myself, my purpose and my career and whatnot. 824 00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:06,920 But that doesn't happen every day. 825 00:49:06,920 --> 00:49:11,680 Like, oh my God, I love doom scrolling because it's ADHD, like euphoria. 826 00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:13,400 Oh my God. 827 00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:14,880 It's amazing. 828 00:49:14,880 --> 00:49:16,200 Which is, it sucks. 829 00:49:16,200 --> 00:49:21,580 But yeah, like understanding yourself at a deeper level can like help in so many different 830 00:49:21,580 --> 00:49:24,940 areas of your life and you don't even know it until you start doing it. 831 00:49:24,940 --> 00:49:26,080 And it's hard work. 832 00:49:26,080 --> 00:49:27,080 It's not easy. 833 00:49:27,080 --> 00:49:29,360 It doesn't just like happen overnight. 834 00:49:29,360 --> 00:49:32,280 But I mean, discipline is the worst thing for me. 835 00:49:32,280 --> 00:49:37,360 Like I'm very undisciplined unless I'm like very focused on something, you know, and then 836 00:49:37,360 --> 00:49:38,720 I'm like, don't talk to me. 837 00:49:38,720 --> 00:49:41,800 I'm not doing anything else except for this one thing. 838 00:49:41,800 --> 00:49:44,840 So like that's other thing, like learning, okay, if I'm not going to discipline, how 839 00:49:44,840 --> 00:49:50,400 can I influence myself in other ways to get things done and do this blah, blah, blah. 840 00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:53,040 I think that's very like crucial as well. 841 00:49:53,040 --> 00:50:01,480 And a lot of the thing that makes me laugh, you know, like in terms of my own experiences 842 00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:03,400 with it is like structure. 843 00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:05,400 Like I have a morning routine. 844 00:50:05,400 --> 00:50:08,800 And this was taught to me by like one of my therapists. 845 00:50:08,800 --> 00:50:13,880 But she was like, it's really important when you're on the spectrum, like to have a routine, 846 00:50:13,880 --> 00:50:17,720 like a little, it's so interesting when someone tries to interfere with that routine. 847 00:50:17,720 --> 00:50:22,520 Like every morning I make coffee for myself and I make coffee for my wife. 848 00:50:22,520 --> 00:50:24,680 And that is like, and you know, do that. 849 00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:25,960 And that's my first thing I do. 850 00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,760 Like that's like the general routine. 851 00:50:28,760 --> 00:50:35,720 And we sort of have a routine now, but I remember like some, you know, if something was thrown 852 00:50:35,720 --> 00:50:40,040 off and she knows this now, she knows me so well now, but I remember like once she tried 853 00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:44,400 to like introduce a little change and she was, she just saw me like spiral and get lost 854 00:50:44,400 --> 00:50:45,400 in what I was trying to do. 855 00:50:45,400 --> 00:50:47,680 And I was like, I'm like, it's not your fault. 856 00:50:47,680 --> 00:50:51,160 Like my brain just needs to switch on, get ahead of itself. 857 00:50:51,160 --> 00:50:56,200 And then like, be like, I have tasks I have like, you know, and then I can sit in chaos. 858 00:50:56,200 --> 00:51:02,720 Like I can sit in a messy room working hard on photos or ideas and I'm fine. 859 00:51:02,720 --> 00:51:08,560 But you know, like some people like just can't like, and I, and I particularly, I, I feel 860 00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,920 like during COVID I lived on my own, which was, you know, a really eye opening thing. 861 00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:18,840 Like I feel that was, I went on like, did the whole thing before about wife. 862 00:51:18,840 -->

00:51:22,280 I went on like dating apps and you know, like, I can't put up with them. 863 00:51:22,280 --> 00:51:23,280 I can't do it. 864 00:51:23,280 --> 00:51:25,280 I just can't, I just can't go on. 865 00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:29,200 Well, it's just hilarious to me now because I look back and I just go, well, you know, 866 00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:32,040 it was the most unfriendly place for like, oh my God. 867 00:51:32,040 --> 00:51:33,720 Yeah, for sure. 868 00:51:33,720 --> 00:51:38,560 And but you know, like people go in like, and I feel like during, I don't know, like 869 00:51:38,560 --> 00:51:42,840 I don't know if you noticed this, like post COVID everyone's social skills have gone like 870 00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:46,040 from shit, like completely, no one knows how to interact. 871 00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:49,360 It's cause you can't edit live. 872 00:51:49,360 --> 00:51:53,880 You can't like people are so used to like texting and commenting on social media and 873 00:51:53,880 --> 00:51:55,440 stuff like that. 874 00:51:55,440 --> 00:51:58,240 And like, it's just like, sorry, I'm so far away from this. 875 00:51:58,240 --> 00:52:02,280 Human interaction is so hard now because we've been so disconnected. 876 00:52:02,280 --> 00:52:07,160 I think it might, it will be a pendulum that swings back eventually, but a hundred percent 877 00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:08,160 it's been affected. 878 00:52:08,160 --> 00:52:09,460 Of course. 879 00:52:09,460 --> 00:52:14,840 Do you feel like you're more like social now or less? 880 00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:15,840 Less. 881 00:52:15,840 --> 00:52:16,840 Really? 882 00:52:16,840 --> 00:52:17,840 Yeah. 883 00:52:17,840 --> 00:52:18,840 Don't talk to me. 884 00:52:18,840 --> 00:52:21,840 Literally at podcast. 885 00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:27,240 No, I, I'm not as social. 886 00:52:27,240 --> 00:52:28,360 I'm not as social. 887 00:52:28,360 --> 00:52:31,400 I'm not as like go get them as I used to be. 888 00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:35,000 And I think I'm wondering if that might be part of lock and key as well of coming off 889 00:52:35,000 --> 00:52:36,000 of that. 890 00:52:36,000 --> 00:52:40,800 Like before lock and key, I was like, I hustled way more when it came to like modeling or 891 00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:46,760 acting or like, you know, being in short student films or whatever. 892 00:52:46,760 --> 00:52:58,000 But since COVID specifically, I'm, I also met my partner in 2022. 893 00:52:58,000 --> 00:53:01,640 So like at the tail end of COVID, not really COVID anymore, but like right when I shaved 894 00:53:01,640 --> 00:53:04,560 my head, which was about two years now. 895 00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:11,960 And since moving in with him specifically, like he moved in a year ago, like I, I'm so 896 00:53:11,960 --> 00:53:13,960 happy to stay home. 897 00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:20,040 I don't want to go out and be in a lab room and spend $50 on fruity cocktails and like 898 00:53:20,040 --> 00:53:23,720 yell to people I have no interest in talking to. 899 00:53:23,720 --> 00:53:27,040 Like it's just, and then it'd be like spit in my ear. 900 00:53:27,040 --> 00:53:29,480 Like I just, I can't, I can't do that. 901 00:53:29,480 --> 00:53:31,560 I get so over-stimulated now. 902 00:53:31,560 --> 00:53:33,880 When before I used to like have fun doing that. 903 00:53:33,880 --> 00:53:39,080 Like I especially noticed it at TIFF where I was like, I'm going to show up to be seen, 904 00:53:39,080 --> 00:53:43,840 not to be like, not to stay here for long. 905 00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:47,840 Like it's more so to just be like, I'm still in the world of acting. 906 00:53:47,840 --> 00:53:54,320 Like I'm still here, you know, but it's not a necessity for me to go to every single thing. 907 00:53:54,320 --> 00:53:59,280 Like I'll go to the ones where I'm going to be connecting with people I know, or they 908 00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:05,160 have other people to introduce me to or whatever, but I'm not searching for a party anymore. 909 00:54:05,160 --> 00:54:06,800 I think that's also age too. 910 00:54:06,800 --> 00:54:11,640 I mean, I'm 27 and like, I've never been someone, my mom even said when I was a kid, I didn't 911 00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:14,320 like loud noises and I always knew when to go to bed. 912 00:54:14,320 --> 00:54:18,400 It was always like, I always knew my time and I like that now. 913 00:54:18,400 --> 00:54:21,920 And I think COVID really brought that forward for me. 914 00:54:21,920 --> 00:54:27,640 Like it really taught me that I like going to bed at a specific time. 915 00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:33,920 I like, you know, having my own space and I don't, I know, I don't really feel the need 916 00:54:33,920 --> 00:54:37,240 to go out and socialize every single day anymore. 917 00:54:37,240 --> 00:54:39,360 You know, I like my time. 918 00:54:39,360 --> 00:54:41,000 It's so interesting that you say that as well. 919 00:54:41,000 --> 00:54:42,000 I'm the same. 920 00:54:42,000 --> 00:54:46,280 Like I like, one of my favorite things to do is sit at home and watch a movie with my 921 00:54:46,280 --> 00:54:47,280 wife. 922 00:54:47,280 --> 00:54:50,080 Like, you know, like we, we dedicate almost every night to a movie night. 923 00:54:50,080 --> 00:54:51,960 That's what happens when you live with your best friend. 924 00:54:51,960 --> 00:54:52,960 It's amazing. 925 00:54:52,960 --> 00:54:56,280 I met this guy at a park and now I can't get rid of him. 926 00:54:56,280 --> 00:55:03,040 But I mean, like it's honestly like the best thing and, but it's so funny because, you 927 00:55:03,040 --> 00:55:05,760 know, people go, oh, that could be boring and stuff. 928 00:55:05,760 --> 00:55:08,080 I'm like, you know what though? 929 00:55:08,080 --> 00:55:09,840 It's not like there's nothing about it. 930 00:55:09,840 --> 00:55:10,840 That's boring. 931 00:55:10,840 --> 00:55:11,840 I wouldn't be doing it if it was boring. 932 00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:12,840 No. 933

00:55:12,840 --> 00:55:19,720 And I do think there's sort of like this, I think we get into this sort of like fear 934 00:55:19,720 --> 00:55:26,520 as we get older that, you know, we're, we're surrounded by like, you know, people will 935 00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:31,640 we, you know, but I'm like, I literally talk, talk to my wife every day and she's my best 936 00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:33,520 friend, like out of everyone. 937 00:55:33,520 --> 00:55:35,880 And then like, I talk to all my, all my friends. 938 00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:40,320 Or sometimes I talk to like random people or sometimes I get to, but I'm like, I'm 939 00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:41,320 never bored. 940 00:55:41,320 --> 00:55:43,800 Like, I'll know when I'm bored. 941 00:55:43,800 --> 00:55:50,120 And that's like when I'm, you know, like not stimulated, but that is never a time where 942 00:55:50,120 --> 00:55:55,280 I'm always like, oh, I could go and edit a photo or I could go and do this or, you know, 943 00:55:55,280 --> 00:55:58,920 or could write an idea down or I could go for a walk with my wife or if we could watch 944 00:55:58,920 --> 00:56:00,580 a movie, like all these things. 945 00:56:00,580 --> 00:56:02,040 And then people go, oh, do you want to come out to it? 946 00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:04,520 And I'm like, this is the thing I'd least like to do. 947 00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:06,760 I'm, you know, it's funny now as well. 948 00:56:06,760 --> 00:56:10,320 And this is, I hate parties and I hate crowded rooms. 949 00:56:10,320 --> 00:56:13,560 I would rather hang out with people one-on-one. 950 00:56:13,560 --> 00:56:18,040 That is, I love going for coffee with friends, spending a couple of like going back to that 951 00:56:18,040 --> 00:56:21,360 thing we were saying, it's like, we've always caught up. 952 00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:26,520 There's one friend of mine, I see her probably every three years and I will, and it just, 953 00:56:26,520 --> 00:56:30,760 we always go back to that conversation and just like, no time's changed and just have 954 00:56:30,760 --> 00:56:31,760 coffee. 955 00:56:31,760 --> 00:56:34,680 And she always makes the joke of like, oh, how did we, like, I feel like we've been talking 956 00:56:34,680 --> 00:56:36,200 for 10 minutes, but it's been like two hours. 957 00:56:36,200 --> 00:56:38,840 I'm like, yeah, that's just like standard. 958 00:56:38,840 --> 00:56:42,800 I like, I like house parties with that don't have really loud music. 959 00:56:42,800 --> 00:56:43,800 I don't understand. 960 00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:44,800 Okay. 961 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:45,800 That was very specific. 962 00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:46,800 Stay with me here. 963 00:56:46,800 --> 00:56:47,800 Okay. 964 00:56:47,800 --> 00:56:49,240 I got a bone to pick. 965 00:56:49,240 --> 00:56:53,400 If you're having a house party and like the music is so loud that I'm having to yell 966 00:56:53,400 --> 00:56:58,320 to the person who's standing right beside me, I'm like, dude, this is your house. 967 00:56:58,320 --> 00:56:59,880 Like you can control the levels. 968 00:56:59,880 --> 00:57:03,520 It's not like a DJ trying to like get the speakers out across the whole club or whatever. 969 00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:08,720 Like I'm literally standing in your kitchen and I can't hear the person beside me. 970 00:57:08,720 --> 00:57:11,000 And I just, that drives me crazy. 971 00:57:11,000 --> 00:57:14,360 Cause I'm like, house parties are small and they're intimate. 972 00:57:14,360 --> 00:57:16,480 And I'm like, I'm there to actually talk to people. 973 00:57:16,480 --> 00:57:19,240 Like at a club, you're there to dance and whatever. 974 00:57:19,240 --> 00:57:20,240 I don't know. 975 00:57:20,240 --> 00:57:27,840 I haven't been to a club in a while, but like at a house party, it just feels like, why 976 00:57:27,840 --> 00:57:29,680 are we yelling at each other? 977 00:57:29,680 --> 00:57:31,120 And I don't, I don't like that. 978 00:57:31,120 --> 00:57:35,040 I like one-on-one conversations to a degree. 979 00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:36,040 I need an out. 980 00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:39,960 I need like a timeline that can be movable, but like, you know, I got to do my laundry 981 00:57:39,960 --> 00:57:40,960 in like two hours. 982 00:57:40,960 --> 00:57:48,160 Like, you know, I wouldn't say that because that's just like, that's rude, but you know, 983 00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:52,960 like I don't, I get a little bit anxious over having one-on-one conversations unless I have 984 00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:54,320 something to do with my hands. 985 00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:58,120 Like I'll literally invite a friend over and be like, Hey, I got to clean my living room 986 00:57:58,120 --> 00:58:01,560 or like, I got to fold my laundry or like, I got to paint today. 987 00:58:01,560 --> 00:58:06,920 Like are you down to just bring your, bring your laptop with you and do some work? 988 00:58:06,920 --> 00:58:15,120 And so like, I really, I get anxious, like the concept of going and sitting across from 989 00:58:15,120 --> 00:58:20,880 someone at a coffee or something, because I just fear that like, we're going to, it's 990 00:58:20,880 --> 00:58:22,960 going to dry up and you're not going to know what to say. 991 00:58:22,960 --> 00:58:24,880 And then I'm going to start saying something stupid. 992 00:58:24,880 --> 00:58:25,880 Like I don't know. 993 00:58:25,880 --> 00:58:29,120 Like, and I wasn't, I wasn't like that before COVID. 994 00:58:29,120 --> 00:58:35,000 I don't think I've also noticed that I don't talk to Uber drivers as much anymore, which 995 00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:40,120 has been like a huge change because I used to, I used to have some really interesting 996 00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,440 conversations with Uber drivers. 997 00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:45,560 I mean, a lot of them are now just like on the phone talking to people. 998 00:58:45,560 --> 00:58:49,600 And I just think that that's like, you know, they just are on their

headsets. 999 00:58:49,600 --> 00:58:50,600 I'm like, go off. 1000 00:58:50,600 --> 00:58:52,040 Like you're driving all day. 1001 00:58:52,040 --> 00:58:53,040 That's fine. 1002 00:58:53,040 --> 00:58:56,520 But like, I used to talk to way more people. 1003 00:58:56,520 --> 00:59:00,400 I just think in general out in the world, I used to talk to more people and since COVID 1004 00:59:00,400 --> 00:59:01,840 that's completely changed. 1005 00:59:01,840 --> 00:59:02,840 Yeah. 1006 00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:05,720 I definitely, I definitely tune out a lot more. 1007 00:59:05,720 --> 00:59:10,000 I used to do a lot of like people listening and people watching like pre COVID. 1008 00:59:10,000 --> 00:59:12,480 I used to be like, you know, how I click gather ideas. 1009 00:59:12,480 --> 00:59:16,240 I'd be like, Oh, I listened to this conversation over and you know, write it down, but I do 1010 00:59:16,240 --> 00:59:17,320 a lot less of that. 1011 00:59:17,320 --> 00:59:21,120 I kind of like, sounds really bad. 1012 00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:23,480 But I do feel like I avoid people. 1013 00:59:23,480 --> 00:59:26,400 I also, maybe that's selective. 1014 00:59:26,400 --> 00:59:27,400 Yeah. 1015 00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:30,960 It's like, it depends on the day too. 1016 00:59:30,960 --> 00:59:35,480 You know, some days I wake up and I'm really like, I want to socialize today. 1017 00:59:35,480 --> 00:59:38,620 But like if I make up in my head that I'm socializing, I'm socializing. 1018 00:59:38,620 --> 00:59:43,760 If I make up in my head, like if I'm like sitting in my little, my little closet makeup 1019 00:59:43,760 --> 00:59:50,520 room and I'm debating not going and my brain says you're not going, like I'm not going. 1020 00:59:50,520 --> 00:59:54,280 There is nothing you can tell me to get me out of the, this house. 1021 00:59:54,280 --> 00:59:59,160 But like if I'm hell bent on doing something and like going out and socializing, I'm like, 1022 00:59:59,160 --> 01:00:01,280 okay, this is my dedicated day of the week. 1023 01:00:01,280 --> 01:00:04,520 Okay, I'm going to do this today and whatever. 1024 01:00:04,520 --> 01:00:05,840 I love that though. 1025 01:00:05,840 --> 01:00:12,520 Yeah, cause like with, with painting and like discovering yourself during the COVID years, 1026 01:00:12,520 --> 01:00:17,440 what were the big like discoveries for you during the dark times? 1027 01:00:17,440 --> 01:00:19,760 You know what is really annoying? 1028 01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:23,720 I didn't really have a dark time with painting. 1029 01:00:23,720 --> 01:00:25,840 Which is why is that annoying? 1030 01:00:25,840 --> 01:00:27,680 It's annoying for everyone else for me to say that. 1031 01:00:27,680 --> 01:00:28,680 Okay. 1032 01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:29,680 I totally recognize that. 1033 01:00:29,680 --> 01:00:39,040 I literally, I, so my brother and his now fiance and they just got engaged very slowly. 1034 01:00:39,040 --> 01:00:44,560 She's amazing and they, they just, they, they got two cats, they moved in together and I 1035 01:00:44,560 --> 01:00:47,320 was like, what do I get them for a housewarming present? 1036 01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:50,840 I couldn't really think of anything and I was like, okay, I'll paint their cats because 1037 01:00:50,840 --> 01:00:54,600 they love their cats more than anything and they need some decorations for the new place, 1038 01:00:54,600 --> 01:00:55,600 whatever. 1039 01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:58,240 So I painted their cats and then my neighbors, my neighbor's also an artist. 1040 01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:02,200 I showed him and my other neighbor wanted one and then his sister wanted one of her 1041 01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:03,800 dog who had passed. 1042 01:01:03,800 --> 01:01:06,600 And then I posted it on social media and then more people wanted them. 1043 01:01:06,600 --> 01:01:09,920 And it just started like, I was like, oh, I guess I have a business now. 1044 01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:14,720 And then my, my partner's family dog passed away and I was like, okay, I want to, I want 1045 01:01:14,720 --> 01:01:19,040 to do one that's a little bit more lifelike. 1046 01:01:19,040 --> 01:01:25,480 And it was, it was exciting because I was like, whoa, I kind of just fell into a purpose. 1047 01:01:25,480 --> 01:01:28,440 Like I just fell into something to wake up for in the morning. 1048 01:01:28,440 --> 01:01:31,720 That's not just acting. 1049 01:01:31,720 --> 01:01:32,720 And it's insular. 1050 01:01:32,720 --> 01:01:34,400 I don't have to talk to drunk people. 1051 01:01:34,400 --> 01:01:38,160 Like I don't, you know, as, as a server, I hated serving. 1052 01:01:38,160 --> 01:01:46,120 Like literally at the time that I started painting, I had just been in like two sessions 1053 01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:50,580 of training for a new bartending position. 1054 01:01:50,580 --> 01:01:57,080 And literally after the second bartending training day, I got the call for the screen 1055 01:01:57,080 --> 01:02:00,960 test in Vancouver for this project that I eventually booked. 1056 01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:06,440 And I also had started this pad, like literally the two weeks of that, like just beginning 1057 01:02:06,440 --> 01:02:08,320 that new job. 1058 01:02:08,320 --> 01:02:09,320 And I wrote to the girl. 1059 01:02:09,320 --> 01:02:16,840 I was like, Hey, I can't do this serving job because like I've got, I'm going to Vancouver. 1060 01:02:16,840 --> 01:02:18,220 I'm busy in other places. 1061 01:02:18,220 --> 01:02:22,840 And it was like the biggest breath of fresh air because I was like, wow, I don't have 1062 01:02:22,840 --> 01:02:26,720 to do something I absolutely hate in order to pay the bills because that as a life of 1063 01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:29,080 an actor, you have to do that. 1064 01:02:29,080 --> 01:02:33,680 And it's, it's such a well-known game because it's amazing money for like, you know, you 1065 01:02:33,680 --> 01:02:39,660 can leave and go film for a bit and

come back or whatever, but I just wasn't my thing. 1066 01:02:39,660 --> 01:02:45,640 So painting was something that came into my life at the absolute best time and has been 1067 01:02:45,640 --> 01:02:53,320 like the saving grace for me that's really taught me a lot about myself and how, you 1068 01:02:53,320 --> 01:02:57,280 know, I really like that I'm always doing something new. 1069 01:02:57,280 --> 01:02:59,360 And I mean, that's something I've known for a while. 1070 01:02:59,360 --> 01:03:02,880 Like I get really bored when it's a mundane thing over and over again. 1071 01:03:02,880 --> 01:03:09,800 But yeah, painting has been like this, this awesome little side gig that's, that's come 1072 01:03:09,800 --> 01:03:13,640 and really instilled me with more creative energy. 1073 01:03:13,640 --> 01:03:14,640 I love that. 1074 01:03:14,640 --> 01:03:20,520 I mean, like, and it's really interesting because like you talk about profitability 1075 01:03:20,520 --> 01:03:26,200 and you know, like is it, do you find it's very lucrative or do you find it sort of like, 1076 01:03:26,200 --> 01:03:27,200 really? 1077 01:03:27,200 --> 01:03:28,720 Oh, I don't charge cheap baby. 1078 01:03:28,720 --> 01:03:29,720 Really? 1079 01:03:29,720 --> 01:03:31,680 My time is precious. 1080 01:03:31,680 --> 01:03:37,720 No, and like I only saw at first I started like, I started low because I was like, well, 1081 01:03:37,720 --> 01:03:41,800 I don't want to like, you know, charge too much and it be whatever. 1082 01:03:41,800 --> 01:03:44,160 And then my friend was like quoted me. 1083 01:03:44,160 --> 01:03:48,760 I was like, so how much and he's, he's in the arts, like painting, visual arts. 1084 01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:51,680 I'm like, how much would you charge for this? 1085 01:03:51,680 --> 01:03:58,120 And he quoted me something that was like 10 times more than what I was charging. 1086 01:03:58,120 --> 01:03:59,680 And I was like, no way. 1087 01:03:59,680 --> 01:04:06,320 And I'm still not charging that much, but I started charging about like five times more 1088 01:04:06,320 --> 01:04:11,480 and I'm working my way up because I still feel like I've still got stuff to learn, but 1089 01:04:11,480 --> 01:04:18,880 it's, it is lucrative because I have, I basically looked at how much I was getting paid to work 1090 01:04:18,880 --> 01:04:19,880 as an actor. 1091 01:04:19,880 --> 01:04:22,880 And I said, okay, that's, that's, that's funny money. 1092 01:04:22,880 --> 01:04:29,200 Like that's, that's like in that time, that's only specific, you know, I'm going to take 1093 01:04:29,200 --> 01:04:34,960 at least a bit closer to that of my hourly, like what's my hourly? 1094 01:04:34,960 --> 01:04:37,080 What am I making when I'm working this other job? 1095 01:04:37,080 --> 01:04:45,080 I'm probably working harder as a painter than I was as an actor a lot of the time, um, to 1096 01:04:45,080 --> 01:04:46,080 a degree. 1097 01:04:46,080 --> 01:04:47,080 It depends. 1098 01:04:47,080 --> 01:04:53,840 Some days are like, for example, when eating gets trapped in the glass in season two, that 1099 01:04:53,840 --> 01:04:57,920 was really emotionally and physically taxing. 1100 01:04:57,920 --> 01:05:03,320 Like that, you know, justifies it, but like there's, there's a lot of days that it's, 1101 01:05:03,320 --> 01:05:08,040 it's very grueling to be on set and a lot of days that I'm like, sweet, I love this 1102 01:05:08,040 --> 01:05:09,040 job. 1103 01:05:09,040 --> 01:05:11,400 You know, I get to like hang out and make friends with the crew. 1104 01:05:11,400 --> 01:05:16,280 Um, but for painting, I'm like, if I'm painting straight through for an hour, two hours to 1105 01:05:16,280 --> 01:05:24,200 10 hours plus on a, on a project for one person, I, I need to make it lucrative for myself. 1106 01:05:24,200 --> 01:05:29,480 I have to be able to pay my bills, um, with something that I'm spending that much time 1107 01:05:29,480 --> 01:05:30,480 doing. 1108 01:05:30,480 --> 01:05:32,200 I love that though. 1109 01:05:32,200 --> 01:05:34,600 I think that's really like empowering. 1110 01:05:34,600 --> 01:05:37,920 Um, because yeah, it's, it's funny. 1111 01:05:37,920 --> 01:05:44,520 I think that the thing most artists and I, I definitely know from my, oh, you know, like, 1112 01:05:44,520 --> 01:05:48,880 um, my wife's side of the family, like they're a bunch of artists and that, but you know, 1113 01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:51,240 some of them don't use it as a lucrative business. 1114 01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:52,920 They just go, oh, I like doing this. 1115 01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:53,920 Totally. 1116 01:05:53,920 --> 01:05:58,360 And I, I so support that because I think that actually brings us to a really interesting 1117 01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:03,500 point I've been talking to some people about recently where in COVID there was this perfect 1118 01:06:03,500 --> 01:06:07,280 opportunity for people to do art for the sake of art and not for monetizing. 1119 01:06:07,280 --> 01:06:12,720 And a lot of people took that opportunity and monetized it and lost the joy of art. 1120 01:06:12,720 --> 01:06:18,040 And I think that starts at a young age in school when the talented ones are separated 1121 01:06:18,040 --> 01:06:24,840 from the academic ones and the academic ones who we all started drawing, like, you know, 1122 01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:25,840 with paints and stuff. 1123 01:06:25,840 --> 01:06:30,920 When we were kids, we all started as artists to a degree as kids because we didn't care. 1124 01:06:30,920 --> 01:06:37,080 And there were no, there was no, you know, expectations as artists when we were kids. 1125 01:06:37,080 --> 01:06:41,760 It was just have fun and enjoy your process and find joy and whatever. 1126 01:06:41,760 --> 01:06:43,740 But that it's like, oh, you're good at it. 1127 01:06:43,740 --> 01:06:46,020 So like, let's push you down the artist realm. 1128 01:06:46,020 --> 01:06:47,200

You're not good at it. 1129 01:06:47,200 --> 01:06:49,680 Let's throw you into the academic box. 1130 01:06:49,680 --> 01:06:50,680 Right. 1131 01:06:50,680 --> 01:06:53,400 And in COVID people are like, well, I'm not working right now. 1132 01:06:53,400 --> 01:06:55,320 I'm not doing anything. 1133 01:06:55,320 --> 01:07:00,520 I'm consuming art, which we're like the artist box is giving you. 1134 01:07:00,520 --> 01:07:08,160 But it's like, how can how can the academics were able to experience what art was for the 1135 01:07:08,160 --> 01:07:11,080 first time, which I think was was really cool. 1136 01:07:11,080 --> 01:07:17,560 And that needs to be more of like a thing to just do art for the sake of art. 1137 01:07:17,560 --> 01:07:19,240 You don't have to monetize it. 1138 01:07:19,240 --> 01:07:25,800 I'm monetizing it because as an actor, an actor's life is not lucrative for the majority 1139 01:07:25,800 --> 01:07:27,080 of it. 1140 01:07:27,080 --> 01:07:28,980 It's really not. 1141 01:07:28,980 --> 01:07:34,480 It's hard to make money as an actor because when you make money, you make money, but then 1142 01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:39,220 you have to make it last for potentially years of not working. 1143 01:07:39,220 --> 01:07:44,120 So for a bit I was like, oh, maybe I'm not going to make this into a business. 1144 01:07:44,120 --> 01:07:48,040 And then I was like, no, I enjoy doing this and I can make money from it. 1145 01:07:48,040 --> 01:07:52,960 I'm going to monetize it because I, you know, like, that's amazing. 1146 01:07:52,960 --> 01:07:57,680 But I think that there should always be some kind of like right now, music is that for 1147 01:07:57,680 --> 01:07:58,680 me. 1148 01:07:58,680 --> 01:08:04,240 Like music is is my non lucrative joy of artistic expression. 1149 01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:07,740 But yeah, I think everyone's different when it comes to that. 1150 01:08:07,740 --> 01:08:13,840 And I've just chosen to really like, I'm going to ask for my this amount. 1151 01:08:13,840 --> 01:08:19,560 And if someone my friend said to me, if people aren't fighting you on your prices, you're 1152 01:08:19,560 --> 01:08:20,840 not charging enough. 1153 01:08:20,840 --> 01:08:24,440 And I was like, that kind of feels like a dick move. 1154 01:08:24,440 --> 01:08:28,940 And he was like, no, Haleel, that's because you think that like you have to put value 1155 01:08:28,940 --> 01:08:34,800 behind what you're making because no one else will put value unless you put value on it 1156 01:08:34,800 --> 01:08:36,680 when it comes to art. 1157 01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:37,800 I 100% agree with that. 1158 01:08:37,800 --> 01:08:43,560 I think it's also something that I've really taken a step forward in just being like, you 1159 01:08:43,560 --> 01:08:48,560 know, because I'm very similar to you, you know, like, but with photography, particularly 1160 01:08:48,560 --> 01:08:51,160 that that can be quite lucrative. 1161 01:08:51,160 --> 01:08:56,000 It

can also be not depending on like people's trains and budgets and stuff like that. 1162 01:08:56,000 --> 01:09:02,200 But I think particularly one thing I really believe in and and something I remember, I 1163 01:09:02,200 --> 01:09:07,100 listened to another podcast actually about this, which is, you know, we were talking 1164 01:09:07,100 --> 01:09:11,440 about like a lot of headshot photographers and a lot of like stylistic photographers. 1165 01:09:11,440 --> 01:09:16,160 And the podcast was like, put in your contract and I started doing contracts this year to 1166 01:09:16,160 --> 01:09:20,120 really kind of like sign off and say, this is my style. 1167 01:09:20,120 --> 01:09:21,120 This is what I charge. 1168 01:09:21,120 --> 01:09:23,280 This is what I do. 1169 01:09:23,280 --> 01:09:29,020 And I remember one of the contract elements he was like, put on people need to understand 1170 01:09:29,020 --> 01:09:32,120 your style and they can't ask you to be someone else. 1171 01:09:32,120 --> 01:09:36,660 He was like, very specifically put in your contract say, this is my style. 1172 01:09:36,660 --> 01:09:42,440 I do not, you know, and particularly for me, I don't change like skin tones, like I color 1173 01:09:42,440 --> 01:09:46,800 correct and like make it look nice, but I'm not going to be like, get rid of acne that's 1174 01:09:46,800 --> 01:09:47,800 exist. 1175 01:09:47,800 --> 01:09:51,080 Like I'm like, I'm not I'm not removing something that's physically on you. 1176 01:09:51,080 --> 01:09:54,200 Like that I don't think is a fair like start. 1177 01:09:54,200 --> 01:09:55,200 That's my choice. 1178 01:09:55,200 --> 01:09:56,200 And that's my style. 1179 01:09:56,200 --> 01:10:00,160 I remember particularly like, you know, some people were like, oh, I really want to get 1180 01:10:00,160 --> 01:10:02,320 rid of this like sweat stain. 1181 01:10:02,320 --> 01:10:04,040 I'm like, oh, that's fine. 1182 01:10:04,040 --> 01:10:05,040 I can do that. 1183 01:10:05,040 --> 01:10:10,440 I'm like, I'm not going to completely change your appearance to like make you glow. 1184 01:10:10,440 --> 01:10:15,200 And they were like, oh, and I was like, it clearly says in my contract, like, that's 1185 01:10:15,200 --> 01:10:16,200 just your style. 1186 01:10:16,200 --> 01:10:19,800 That's like what you want to do if you want something different, if you want to change 1187 01:10:19,800 --> 01:10:26,200 your appearance in any way that I think that's the thing is like when you are something they 1188 01:10:26,200 --> 01:10:31,880 want and this is the this the client rather than us as artists, but there's always this 1189 01:10:31,880 --> 01:10:36,680 and is why like, I remember, particularly this year, we were going through my dad's 1190 01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:41,960 affairs and going through one of his boxes I found out like he had a contract which I'd 1191 01:10:41,960 --> 01:10:46,720 never seen before because obviously he had never when he was alive, he never went and 1192 01:10:46,720 --> 01:10:48,240 kind of said, here's all my stuff. 1193 01:10:48,240 --> 01:10:51,120 Like he was very much like, oh, I'll keep my business to myself. 1194 01:10:51,120 --> 01:10:55,360 But I remember he had a contract once when he was doing photos at a beach and he had 1195 01:10:55,360 --> 01:10:58,320 to get people to sign it because he was like, well, you're in the photo. 1196 01:10:58,320 --> 01:10:59,320 Yeah. 1197 01:10:59,320 --> 01:11:01,840 So I have to have your consent to sell it. 1198 01:11:01,840 --> 01:11:06,280 And it stated like this really clear like statement of like what the photo was going 1199 01:11:06,280 --> 01:11:08,760 to be used for, what you know, like so on and so forth. 1200 01:11:08,760 --> 01:11:13,560 And I really thought and I remember like he told me about his career and how like so many 1201 01:11:13,560 --> 01:11:18,920 like I remember he would deal with like PR people and how he hated PR people like he 1202 01:11:18,920 --> 01:11:22,320 thought PR people were the worst. 1203 01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:25,700 And I remember so many times he would tell me this. 1204 01:11:25,700 --> 01:11:30,080 And I actually discovered when I did contracts and stuff, you know, like, and some agents 1205 01:11:30,080 --> 01:11:33,320 hate, you know, certain contracts, they go, oh, I won't sign that. 1206 01:11:33,320 --> 01:11:34,320 I'm like, why? 1207 01:11:34,320 --> 01:11:39,040 It clearly, you know, like this is the most laid out thing. 1208 01:11:39,040 --> 01:11:43,000 And it's the most helpful thing because you and I know the clarity. 1209 01:11:43,000 --> 01:11:49,760 But it's down to, and this is why I think it's so hard to break the industry as a photographer 1210 01:11:49,760 --> 01:11:55,560 and as an artist is because there's always someone who's been doing it for 30 years and 1211 01:11:55,560 --> 01:11:57,120 everyone knows is amazing. 1212 01:11:57,120 --> 01:12:01,080 And they're like, oh, well, they'll go with this person, like, you know, because this 1213 01:12:01,080 --> 01:12:02,400 is the well known one. 1214 01:12:02,400 --> 01:12:05,480 And I'm like, but what about like, I know I'm good. 1215 01:12:05,480 --> 01:12:07,040 So why isn't that? 1216 01:12:07,040 --> 01:12:09,600 Well, we can always ask why not me, right? 1217 01:12:09,600 --> 01:12:15,680 I mean, I can't even tell you how many times I've opened Instagram and I've seen a deadline 1218 01:12:15,680 --> 01:12:22,880 article of, you know, a well known actor got a role that I auditioned for two weeks ago. 1219 01:12:22,880 --> 01:12:25,520 Yeah, often. 1220 01:12:25,520 --> 01:12:29,320 I've seen it a few times where it's been Neppo babies and like to each their own, like if 1221 01:12:29,320 --> 01:12:33,200 a Neppo baby is doing good work, like good work is good work. 1222 01:12:33,200 --> 01:12:34,960 I don't care if they're not doing good work. 1223 01:12:34,960 --> 01:12:39,280 I'm a little bit bitter to

each their own. 1224 01:12:39,280 --> 01:12:40,920 Like they can try what they want to try. 1225 01:12:40,920 --> 01:12:47,160 And like I have a friend whose whose father is very well known in the industry and he's 1226 01:12:47,160 --> 01:12:53,200 really doing well for himself, but he does what he can to just not be seen as that man's 1227 01:12:53,200 --> 01:12:56,960 son, like he because he wants to be known for himself. 1228 01:12:56,960 --> 01:13:00,680 And he's just an amazing person and does amazing work. 1229 01:13:00,680 --> 01:13:11,960 And so for me, like I, I need to like say it's not always going to be me and that's 1230 01:13:11,960 --> 01:13:12,960 okay. 1231 01:13:12,960 --> 01:13:17,200 And like there's so many reasons why not. 1232 01:13:17,200 --> 01:13:23,180 But like for things that I'm comfortable with, like for my paintings, for example, getting 1233 01:13:23,180 --> 01:13:28,920 back into that, like someone asked me to do like a portrait of a person and a dog. 1234 01:13:28,920 --> 01:13:33,000 And I was like, I could try that, but like I don't do people. 1235 01:13:33,000 --> 01:13:34,680 Like that's not what I do. 1236 01:13:34,680 --> 01:13:40,360 But I considered it because I was like, well, I want to like do what they want. 1237 01:13:40,360 --> 01:13:44,720 And I was like, unless you pay me more for this, because it's something that like, this 1238 01:13:44,720 --> 01:13:47,040 is not my typical thing. 1239 01:13:47,040 --> 01:13:49,920 Like it kind of felt like they were expecting me to do it for free. 1240 01:13:49,920 --> 01:13:55,080 And I was like, I'm not going to try, you know, something free for free. 1241 01:13:55,080 --> 01:13:57,640 Like that's not worth my time. 1242 01:13:57,640 --> 01:14:02,040 And I don't have a contract, but that's a contract I have to have for myself of my self 1243 01:14:02,040 --> 01:14:09,580 worth and my value in my time, which is really difficult as artists, because in the essence 1244 01:14:09,580 --> 01:14:13,240 of what value is, it's different for everyone. 1245 01:14:13,240 --> 01:14:14,240 Right. 1246 01:14:14,240 --> 01:14:20,560 Like, you know, if I paint you a pet portrait, it's going to have no value to our sound guy. 1247 01:14:20,560 --> 01:14:27,240 Like it's, you know, I know you're more than a sound guy, but like it's there's value 1248 01:14:27,240 --> 01:14:28,240 for everyone. 1249 01:14:28,240 --> 01:14:29,240 That's different. 1250 01:14:29,240 --> 01:14:30,240 Right. 1251 01:14:30,240 --> 01:14:35,120 And I just have to make that contract with myself that I value my time for this, this, 1252 01:14:35,120 --> 01:14:36,120 this, and this. 1253 01:14:36,120 --> 01:14:38,520 And I'm not going to like, I'm not going to sway on that. 1254 01:14:38,520 --> 01:14:39,520 Yeah. 1255 01:14:39,520 --> 01:14:49,440 Which I, I, I a hundred percent agree and I, I think it's like something like that really 1256 01:14:49,440 --> 01:14:55,920 makes me think, think quite highly of, of the work that I do. 1257 01:14:55,920 --> 01:15:00,000 And as you should, my favorite, my favorite ever. 1258 01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:07,120 I mean, like, you know, it's, I will, I will, you know, edit the photos and one of my favorite 1259 01:15:07,120 --> 01:15:15,320 things is to always like color correct and stuff, but I remember someone, I always think 1260 01:15:15,320 --> 01:15:20,320 what, and I clearly state this to, you know, like when you do a photo shoot, you, before 1261 01:15:20,320 --> 01:15:25,080 we hand over the files, and this is my firm belief that I was like, okay, well, I'm going 1262 01:15:25,080 --> 01:15:30,200 to show you the low res to be like, these are not the final, like high res files. 1263 01:15:30,200 --> 01:15:33,240 You don't get those until like one if pay. 1264 01:15:33,240 --> 01:15:34,240 Yeah. 1265 01:15:34,240 --> 01:15:40,360 And, and some of my friends are also like, if you book me, I get half a deposit. 1266 01:15:40,360 --> 01:15:42,440 And I'm like, oh, that's a great idea. 1267 01:15:42,440 --> 01:15:50,560 And I had someone recently be like, oh, they, they liked my photos, but they didn't like 1268 01:15:50,560 --> 01:15:52,260 how I edited them. 1269 01:15:52,260 --> 01:16:00,360 And so they wanted a refund, but, and I was like, well, no, like I've delivered that's, 1270 01:16:00,360 --> 01:16:01,360 that's my work. 1271 01:16:01,360 --> 01:16:04,160 That's, that's, you know, that, but they were like, well. 1272 01:16:04,160 --> 01:16:05,160 I'm not happy. 1273 01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:08,320 So, you know, like I want to get someone else to edit them. 1274 01:16:08,320 --> 01:16:12,320 And I'm like, I'm like, that's kind of where you go into an icky. 1275 01:16:12,320 --> 01:16:13,320 It's a weird spot. 1276 01:16:13,320 --> 01:16:14,320 Yeah, I know. 1277 01:16:14,320 --> 01:16:21,240 And I'm, I'm always like of the belief of like, don't hire someone or like, um, and 1278 01:16:21,240 --> 01:16:25,200 waiver, you know, like the dollar sign. 1279 01:16:25,200 --> 01:16:30,160 I like this, this, this person was also a friend of mine, so it was a little bit different. 1280 01:16:30,160 --> 01:16:31,160 Yeah. 1281 01:16:31,160 --> 01:16:36,920 And I was like, but I think the complication was originally I was just trying out. 1282 01:16:36,920 --> 01:16:39,000 Like I was not even thinking these were going to be good photos. 1283 01:16:39,000 --> 01:16:42,860 Like I was like, and I had offered the situation, but like, I'm going to do this for nothing. 1284 01:16:42,860 --> 01:16:45,080 And she was like, oh, I kindly want to pay you for your time. 1285 01:16:45,080 --> 01:16:46,080 I was like, that's fine. 1286 01:16:46,080 --> 01:16:49,800 But then she didn't like how they were edited. 1287 01:16:49,800 --> 01:16:54,920 So I was like, well, this is an awkward situation because it's like, I respect you as a, well, 1288 01:16:54,920 --> 01:16:59,120 could you have like, that's when you have to

say, like, how do you, how would you like 1289 01:16:59,120 --> 01:17:04,280 the, if you want to change, like, let's have a discussion rather like a black or white 1290 01:17:04,280 --> 01:17:05,280 situation, right? 1291 01:17:05,280 --> 01:17:06,640 It was very black and white. 1292 01:17:06,640 --> 01:17:10,160 There wasn't like, I said, Hey, let's have a zoom chat or let's have a combo. 1293 01:17:10,160 --> 01:17:11,160 No, none of that. 1294 01:17:11,160 --> 01:17:16,720 So it's very, I mean, like, and I remember thinking about this and going like, there 1295 01:17:16,720 --> 01:17:22,240 are some times, um, like people just, it doesn't matter. 1296 01:17:22,240 --> 01:17:24,480 You know, they just, they're never going to be happy with something. 1297 01:17:24,480 --> 01:17:30,840 Or you, you do the best product, like I remember like another one of my friends had said, had 1298 01:17:30,840 --> 01:17:35,120 done a movie poster for someone had said, this is the amount that I charge. 1299 01:17:35,120 --> 01:17:36,880 And person was like, no worries. 1300 01:17:36,880 --> 01:17:37,880 I'll take it. 1301 01:17:37,880 --> 01:17:41,720 And then got the, you know, the low rise and was like, Oh, I'm not paying that. 1302 01:17:41,720 --> 01:17:44,300 This is only worth this. 1303 01:17:44,300 --> 01:17:48,320 And he was like, no, but that's the thing is like value is different for everyone. 1304 01:17:48,320 --> 01:17:51,320 And that's why you have to stay true to your value. 1305 01:17:51,320 --> 01:17:52,320 Yes. 1306 01:17:52,320 --> 01:17:53,320 Right. 1307 01:17:53,320 --> 01:17:54,520 And you cannot waver on that. 1308 01:17:54,520 --> 01:17:58,720 No, but some people are very like, of course you're going to find bitches everywhere. 1309 01:17:58,720 --> 01:18:02,480 You're going to find so many difficult people. 1310 01:18:02,480 --> 01:18:06,360 And usually the most difficult people are the ones who are trying to get the discount. 1311 01:18:06,360 --> 01:18:09,520 Not the people who are willing to pay full price because they trust that your work is 1312 01:18:09,520 --> 01:18:11,800 going to be exactly what they're looking for. 1313 01:18:11,800 --> 01:18:14,280 And like it's so well known. 1314 01:18:14,280 --> 01:18:21,520 It's so well known in the art and the industry in general that like the people who are looking 1315 01:18:21,520 --> 01:18:26,160 to get that discount are always going to be the most difficult. 1316 01:18:26,160 --> 01:18:28,520 I remember like the best deal I've ever gotten. 1317 01:18:28,520 --> 01:18:34,520 And one of my best friends to this day lives over in LA. 1318 01:18:34,520 --> 01:18:37,200 And recently I got married, which is very exciting for him. 1319 01:18:37,200 --> 01:18:43,680 But I remember he, when we were starting out in the films together, he needed like, he 1320 01:18:43,680 --> 01:18:46,160 was like, Oh, I can't do freebies for you. 1321 01:18:46,160 --> 01:18:48,920 Like, and I was like, okay,

well what's, what's a fair amount? 1322 01:18:48,920 --> 01:18:51,720 And he was like, I can do 50 bucks a day to do sound. 1323 01:18:51,720 --> 01:18:54,080 And I was like, are you sure? 1324 01:18:54,080 --> 01:18:57,760 And he was like, yeah, you know, we've known each other for a couple of years at this point. 1325 01:18:57,760 --> 01:18:58,760 I was like, Oh, okay. 1326 01:18:58,760 --> 01:19:00,120 If you're happy with that, it was a gift. 1327 01:19:00,120 --> 01:19:01,320 You can just swing me 50. 1328 01:19:01,320 --> 01:19:04,280 I was like, that is enough for petrol, food, everything. 1329 01:19:04,280 --> 01:19:05,280 He was happy. 1330 01:19:05,280 --> 01:19:12,280 I remember like now he does dialogue editing for a bunch of shows and stuff like that. 1331 01:19:12,280 --> 01:19:19,000 I remember he was just, he is always like still to this day, been like, Oh, if you need 1332 01:19:19,000 --> 01:19:23,040 something done for like low key or nothing, just be wary. 1333 01:19:23,040 --> 01:19:26,640 Like that if a big project comes up, I need to take that as priority. 1334 01:19:26,640 --> 01:19:28,280 Cause that's like where my money comes from. 1335 01:19:28,280 --> 01:19:30,680 And I'm like, I am not doubting that. 1336 01:19:30,680 --> 01:19:31,680 And that's the thing. 1337 01:19:31,680 --> 01:19:32,760 It's like, it's an open conversation. 1338 01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:35,760 He's not going, Oh, I'm going to screw you around. 1339 01:19:35,760 --> 01:19:39,560 He's like, well, if you don't have a fixed deadline, that kind of makes my life easier. 1340 01:19:39,560 --> 01:19:45,600 And whereas like, you know, if a Netflix show, like he did cowboy and B-pop, I think two 1341 01:19:45,600 --> 01:19:50,560 years ago and he said like, yeah, that took up like so much of his time. 1342 01:19:50,560 --> 01:19:54,320 Well, that's the same with me is that like, I, if I were to make a contract, I would say 1343 01:19:54,320 --> 01:19:59,360 like it's hard because like Christmas season is coming and everyone wants everything. 1344 01:19:59,360 --> 01:20:02,440 And a lot of people aren't even thinking about what they are going to get for Christmas. 1345 01:20:02,440 --> 01:20:06,120 So I'm probably going to get like an influx of messages being like, pay my dog for my 1346 01:20:06,120 --> 01:20:10,280 partner and like, like December 12th. 1347 01:20:10,280 --> 01:20:12,280 And I simply am like, I'm not doing that. 1348 01:20:12,280 --> 01:20:17,880 But if I were to do some kind of contract, it would be like, I can promise you within 1349 01:20:17,880 --> 01:20:22,000 like a month to two month range. 1350 01:20:22,000 --> 01:20:23,640 I can't do them less than that. 1351 01:20:23,640 --> 01:20:27,440 I just, unless there's like an express order, there's a reason you need it within the next 1352 01:20:27,440 --> 01:20:28,440 two weeks. 1353 01:20:28,440 --> 01:20:32,160 But two months is like for me, like, I don't know what's happening in my life. 1354 01:20:32,160 --> 01:20:35,480 Like I can't promise anything. 1355 01:20:35,480 --> 01:20:38,760 If a show comes up, that's priority. 1356 01:20:38,760 --> 01:20:39,760 It is. 1357 01:20:39,760 --> 01:20:44,280 And like, I don't have my dates yet for December for this new project, but like I'm trying 1358 01:20:44,280 --> 01:20:50,140 my hardest to try to get everything done before I potentially get a call saying like, Hey, 1359 01:20:50,140 --> 01:20:54,480 you have to fly out to Vancouver in like four days to start this project. 1360 01:20:54,480 --> 01:20:58,260 And I'm like, Oh, well I have like eight paintings to do. 1361 01:20:58,260 --> 01:21:02,300 So I can't put, I've promised them already. 1362 01:21:02,300 --> 01:21:03,760 It's going to be there by Christmas. 1363 01:21:03,760 --> 01:21:07,360 So like in general, it's like if something else comes up, that's like my main focus in 1364 01:21:07,360 --> 01:21:08,360 my career. 1365 01:21:08,360 --> 01:21:10,900 My number one focus in my career is, is acting. 1366 01:21:10,900 --> 01:21:12,640 It's not painting. 1367 01:21:12,640 --> 01:21:18,320 No, but it's, and I think that's the reason I love that as well. 1368 01:21:18,320 --> 01:21:22,200 It's like, you know, it's, it's lucrative, it's fun for you. 1369 01:21:22,200 --> 01:21:27,100 And then also you've got the music, which is nice little like fun things. 1370 01:21:27,100 --> 01:21:31,160 But then you're like, I would, you know, you'd be kidding yourself to be like, okay, well 1371 01:21:31,160 --> 01:21:36,080 this is all like the, you know, it's like, well I've got this big gig on this movie or 1372 01:21:36,080 --> 01:21:37,080 this show. 1373 01:21:37,080 --> 01:21:38,920 And then just be like, I need to focus on that. 1374 01:21:38,920 --> 01:21:42,780 Like, you know, and the same thing goes for anyone. 1375 01:21:42,780 --> 01:21:48,240 And I think this is really like, this is down to like also just like the type of personality 1376 01:21:48,240 --> 01:21:49,240 you got. 1377 01:21:49,240 --> 01:21:55,200 I think it's, it's very like, you know, structurally when we get excited for things, but then we 1378 01:21:55,200 --> 01:22:01,080 prioritize other things, just being transparent is better than being like, Oh, I'm going 1379 01:22:01,080 --> 01:22:06,160 to, Oh, I, you know, and, but some people, you know, like people going back to bitches 1380 01:22:06,160 --> 01:22:08,360 be bitches kind of thing in the industry. 1381 01:22:08,360 --> 01:22:15,240 Like I think the best people to work with are genuinely the people who are on the same 1382 01:22:15,240 --> 01:22:16,240 page as you. 1383 01:22:16,240 --> 01:22:20,520 They're like, they're like, okay, you know, but it is, there is something to be said about 1384 01:22:20,520 --> 01:22:24,520 people who aren't on the same page, but are willing to flip their own. 1385 01:22:24,520 --> 01:22:25,520 Yeah. 1386 01:22:25,520 --> 01:22:31,600 So you're you being willing to

flip your own in a way to like understand both pages and 1387 01:22:31,600 --> 01:22:37,780 like see how you can learn from their perspective and why they're on a different page from you. 1388 01:22:37,780 --> 01:22:42,760 If they're stubborn enough to never flip that page, then that's not going to be a cohesive 1389 01:22:42,760 --> 01:22:45,200 work environment at all. 1390 01:22:45,200 --> 01:22:50,360 I think it also shows a like the skill set of us as artists though. 1391 01:22:50,360 --> 01:22:57,000 It's like knowing, going back to that value thing and knowing like, um, you know, like 1392 01:22:57,000 --> 01:22:59,360 our worth and our value. 1393 01:22:59,360 --> 01:23:09,600 If someone said to you, Hey, um, you're, you're not like up here, you'd be like, well, fuck, 1394 01:23:09,600 --> 01:23:10,800 I know I am. 1395 01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:16,120 Like I know I'm, I'm, you know, like, I'm not going to believe you because I have like 1396 01:23:16,120 --> 01:23:18,040 goes back to that self value and knowing. 1397 01:23:18,040 --> 01:23:25,480 And I think that comes also from a resilience of ADHD and the neurodiverse like thought 1398 01:23:25,480 --> 01:23:34,800 process because we work in such a way and in such a unique way that is, that is hard. 1399 01:23:34,800 --> 01:23:40,380 Like, and I think going, I've never done anything like under 110%. 1400 01:23:40,380 --> 01:23:44,720 So I get very like, and one of the, one of the things I think that's also thrown around 1401 01:23:44,720 --> 01:23:51,520 like post COVID, uh, is the word like people don't know what the word professional means 1402 01:23:51,520 --> 01:23:58,400 anymore, which I feel is a very like, you know, um, cause the amount of, you know, like 1403 01:23:58,400 --> 01:24:02,880 one of the things I have to deal with is reading a lot of emails in my day job. 1404 01:24:02,880 --> 01:24:07,000 And even outside, like I write a little, you know, like I'll make sure the email sounds 1405 01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:11,080 professional, like all these things, the amount of responses sometimes I get from people who 1406 01:24:11,080 --> 01:24:17,680 are not the most professional response or have sometimes been like really quite badly 1407 01:24:17,680 --> 01:24:24,160 praised or they like, they're, you know, um, they, you know, like, you know, people don't 1408 01:24:24,160 --> 01:24:30,280 like cold emails and you know, sometimes you get rude responses and I'm like reading and 1409 01:24:30,280 --> 01:24:31,960 going, what the fuck? 1410 01:24:31,960 --> 01:24:36,140 Like, you know, like, I'm like, you're, you're meant to have your shit together. 1411 01:24:36,140 --> 01:24:38,080 Like you're meant to be like, here's the thing. 1412 01:24:38,080 --> 01:24:39,080 No one does. 1413 01:24:39,080 --> 01:24:40,280 No, no one does. 1414 01:24:40,280 --> 01:24:41,440 No one has their shit together. 1415 01:24:41,440 --> 01:24:46,240 And anyone who thinks that people, everyone should like,

that's the thing though. 1416 01:24:46,240 --> 01:24:47,840 No one has their shit together. 1417 01:24:47,840 --> 01:24:50,880 That is one thing to like write a proper email. 1418 01:24:50,880 --> 01:24:52,880 But I also think that Gen Z is influencing that. 1419 01:24:52,880 --> 01:24:59,280 And it's just like, you know, they're really, they're really saying it how it's, how it's 1420 01:24:59,280 --> 01:25:07,320 no fluff, you know, but everyone is so uncertain on what they're doing that they're all kind 1421 01:25:07,320 --> 01:25:10,680 of, I feel like a lot of us are just like throwing shit at the wall and seeing what 1422 01:25:10,680 --> 01:25:11,680 sticks. 1423 01:25:11,680 --> 01:25:15,760 Like that's, that's a lot of like so many people's experiences. 1424 01:25:15,760 --> 01:25:23,420 I definitely agree that I think it's also, it's just, it's sort of exciting, exciting 1425 01:25:23,420 --> 01:25:28,120 and also petrifying at the same time, because like the one thing I love, you know, getting 1426 01:25:28,120 --> 01:25:31,600 to do things like this, which is, you know, one of my favorite things to do is sitting 1427 01:25:31,600 --> 01:25:34,480 down and then like, oh, having an open conversation. 1428 01:25:34,480 --> 01:25:37,200 The how that ever develops. 1429 01:25:37,200 --> 01:25:41,120 I mean, like I knew the day we first spoke, I knew it was going to go like a house on 1430 01:25:41,120 --> 01:25:46,000 fire, but I do think that there's, I've definitely had my fair share of like people I'm like, 1431 01:25:46,000 --> 01:25:49,320 I don't know how this is going to pan out or I don't know if this person is going to 1432 01:25:49,320 --> 01:25:50,320 like the experience. 1433 01:25:50,320 --> 01:25:55,800 And that is like, just, just the tumultuous like nature of being an interviewer. 1434 01:25:55,800 --> 01:26:03,280 I remember like, particularly, not that this ever happened to me, but listening to like 1435 01:26:03,280 --> 01:26:07,760 other interviewers, like who have had bad experiences with guests or like stuff like 1436 01:26:07,760 --> 01:26:08,760 that. 1437 01:26:08,760 --> 01:26:12,240 You do hear the horror stories of just like someone going, um, I remember like this was 1438 01:26:12,240 --> 01:26:14,140 when I worked for TV. 1439 01:26:14,140 --> 01:26:19,020 We had like, especially when you're known, this is the funniest thing when you're known 1440 01:26:19,020 --> 01:26:24,400 for something throughout your career that doesn't leave you even when you're 80, like 1441 01:26:24,400 --> 01:26:28,900 your entire career is based upon like this one thing you did when you were 20 and everyone 1442 01:26:28,900 --> 01:26:31,880 wants to talk about that because that's the thing they remember you the highlight of your 1443 01:26:31,880 --> 01:26:36,960 career and my mom once said to me, she was like, you know, maybe locking key was that 1444 01:26:36,960 --> 01:26:37,960 you don't know. 1445 01:26:37,960 --> 01:26:45,040

And I'm like, I refuse to have that come true because she was trying to support me. 1446 01:26:45,040 --> 01:26:49,160 She was like trying to like, you know, because I was like, I mean, I haven't booked anything. 1447 01:26:49,160 --> 01:26:51,160 And this was before I booked this project. 1448 01:26:51,160 --> 01:26:53,640 And like, that was the scariest thing, but continuing. 1449 01:26:53,640 --> 01:26:55,600 I love that. 1450 01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:56,600 But that's my point. 1451 01:26:56,600 --> 01:27:01,560 Like this one artist who had done heaps of stuff and all this interview. 1452 01:27:01,560 --> 01:27:08,320 And it was like with like this really refined journalist and he was like, oh, I just, you 1453 01:27:08,320 --> 01:27:11,880 know, like the guy stormed out and he was like, I don't want to talk about this. 1454 01:27:11,880 --> 01:27:13,200 Like if you don't want to ask me. 1455 01:27:13,200 --> 01:27:17,400 I mean, there are certain things that like if they storm out, like with I think like 1456 01:27:17,400 --> 01:27:21,360 Robert Downey Jr. the guy kept on pushing on something he didn't want to talk about. 1457 01:27:21,360 --> 01:27:22,840 And like that's totally justified. 1458 01:27:22,840 --> 01:27:24,120 Oh, a hundred percent. 1459 01:27:24,120 --> 01:27:28,280 Like if you don't want to talk about but like this was the this was like he had been asked 1460 01:27:28,280 --> 01:27:33,480 by different news channels about this one thing he had done like 50 years ago where 1461 01:27:33,480 --> 01:27:35,400 it was like he was like, I've moved on. 1462 01:27:35,400 --> 01:27:37,640 Like it wasn't it was just like a funny story. 1463 01:27:37,640 --> 01:27:38,640 Yeah. 1464 01:27:38,640 --> 01:27:39,880 And he was like, oh, like a funny role he'd done. 1465 01:27:39,880 --> 01:27:41,920 And everyone was like, oh, we remember you from this film. 1466 01:27:41,920 --> 01:27:45,200 And he was like, why are people still talking about this? 1467 01:27:45,200 --> 01:27:46,880 I've like done heaps since then. 1468 01:27:46,880 --> 01:27:52,960 I mean, that would be annoying though, because, you know, repeating the same things over and 1469 01:27:52,960 --> 01:28:02,200 over again does get taxing because there's not really any other like what other occupation 1470 01:28:02,200 --> 01:28:04,560 has that right. 1471 01:28:04,560 --> 01:28:13,280 And imagine like I've done press calls and press circuits and I haven't done enough of 1472 01:28:13,280 --> 01:28:16,480 them to like hate myself for them. 1473 01:28:16,480 --> 01:28:19,320 You know, like, you know, when it gets to the point where you're like they're checked 1474 01:28:19,320 --> 01:28:20,840 out like you've seen. 1475 01:28:20,840 --> 01:28:25,720 You've all seen press circuit videos of people who are checked out. 1476 01:28:25,720 --> 01:28:28,080 And I'm like, I feel for them. 1477 01:28:28,080 --> 01:28:33,080 I really genuinely do, because I have been in them where like how many times have I been 1478 01:28:33,080 --> 01:28:36,320 asked if you could make a key, what key would you make? 1479 01:28:36,320 --> 01:28:42,960 Like for locking key, like, you know, if you could like and I think that's what I find 1480 01:28:42,960 --> 01:28:51,280 separates good journalism and kind of like pop journalism, where it's like there's a 1481 01:28:51,280 --> 01:28:58,940 lot of like the questions which are just regurgitated or they aren't thought through. 1482 01:28:58,940 --> 01:29:03,800 And then like a journalist comes around and asks you a question you've never been asked. 1483 01:29:03,800 --> 01:29:10,080 And so I understand to counter your point of like of why actors would storm out or I 1484 01:29:10,080 --> 01:29:14,600 mean, storming out is a bit dramatic, but or just like get fed up with it because it's 1485 01:29:14,600 --> 01:29:16,640 like, can someone ask me something else? 1486 01:29:16,640 --> 01:29:20,800 Or like, can someone can we talk about what I'm doing right now, especially if a journalist 1487 01:29:20,800 --> 01:29:26,280 is asking questions about a project that they did like years ago when they're trying to 1488 01:29:26,280 --> 01:29:30,360 promote something new and they're trying to start something new and they're trying to 1489 01:29:30,360 --> 01:29:33,760 like move on from where they were in the past. 1490 01:29:33,760 --> 01:29:37,000 It's like as an actor, you kind of get stuck in that a lot of times. 1491 01:29:37,000 --> 01:29:45,400 And I think that's also a part where I've in my brain kind of justified, not justified, 1492 01:29:45,400 --> 01:29:50,560 but like accepted that Eden gets killed off and like the end of season two. 1493 01:29:50,560 --> 01:29:53,280 And it wasn't like a five, six season thing. 1494 01:29:53,280 --> 01:30:00,960 We only did three seasons, but I'm really glad that Lock and Key was as big as it was. 1495 01:30:00,960 --> 01:30:08,520 And I got the role that I got because I think if it was any bigger and if the role went 1496 01:30:08,520 --> 01:30:13,560 on for any more seasons, that's the character I would be seen as for years. 1497 01:30:13,560 --> 01:30:18,160 And I think Eden was enough of time where I feel like I got my foot in the door. 1498 01:30:18,160 --> 01:30:22,600 I got an opportunity to show what the skills that I have to the world and I got to have 1499 01:30:22,600 --> 01:30:26,000 fun, make connections, you know, do the work. 1500 01:30:26,000 --> 01:30:32,480 But it didn't keep it. I don't think it has a choke hold on me because I think like I 1501 01:30:32,480 --> 01:30:33,480 went and did. 1502 01:30:33,480 --> 01:30:36,960 We forgot to break up by Karen Knox. 1503 01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:42,480 And that was like a small indie production that shot up in North Bay. 1504 01:30:42,480 --> 01:30:43,920 And it was incredible. 1505 01:30:43,920 --> 01:30:46,560 And I had a shaved head dyed manic panic pink. 1506 01:30:46,560 --> 01:30:53,040 Like it was

so cool to be able to do something that was completely the opposite of Eden because 1507 01:30:53,040 --> 01:30:58,800 now it's like I don't think that 20 years from now, I'm only going to be asked about 1508 01:30:58,800 --> 01:30:59,800 Lock and Key. 1509 01:30:59,800 --> 01:31:02,320 Like right now, it makes sense to be asked about Lock and Key. 1510 01:31:02,320 --> 01:31:07,040 I'm not getting on you about that, but like it makes sense because that's the most notable 1511 01:31:07,040 --> 01:31:08,400 thing I've done. 1512 01:31:08,400 --> 01:31:11,280 And I recognize that 100 percent. 1513 01:31:11,280 --> 01:31:15,040 But like I said, at the very beginning of this, like I'm just at the beginning of my 1514 01:31:15,040 --> 01:31:19,920 career and like I think I'm every time I get asked about Lock and Key, I'm happy to talk 1515 01:31:19,920 --> 01:31:20,920 about it. 1516 01:31:20,920 --> 01:31:26,600 But if someone was asking me about it like 20 years later that an interviewer five minutes 1517 01:31:26,600 --> 01:31:32,360 before had also asked me about it, like that'd be freaking annoying, you know, because people 1518 01:31:32,360 --> 01:31:39,760 are ever evolving and to be constantly be brought back into something that you did years 1519 01:31:39,760 --> 01:31:41,200 and years and years ago. 1520 01:31:41,200 --> 01:31:46,080 It kind of stunts evolution of human character because you're constantly being pinned as 1521 01:31:46,080 --> 01:31:47,840 that person at that. 1522 01:31:47,840 --> 01:31:49,920 And people just see you as that. 1523 01:31:49,920 --> 01:31:55,360 Like watching Lord of the Rings and like, you know, I knew Orlando Bloom from Pirates 1524 01:31:55,360 --> 01:31:56,360 of the Caribbean. 1525 01:31:56,360 --> 01:31:57,360 Amazing. 1526 01:31:57,360 --> 01:32:02,720 He also did those within years of each other, like within like two years he was doing Lord 1527 01:32:02,720 --> 01:32:04,960 of the Rings and Pirates of the Caribbean. 1528 01:32:04,960 --> 01:32:08,960 Like man had a great time. 1529 01:32:08,960 --> 01:32:12,840 But like, you know, I don't just see him as Legolas. 1530 01:32:12,840 --> 01:32:18,360 Like I don't see like but he'll be brought up as Legolas because it's an iconic franchise. 1531 01:32:18,360 --> 01:32:22,320 And he's happy to talk about it because it was an amazing experience. 1532 01:32:22,320 --> 01:32:29,080 So there are there's like a scale to which like I think it makes sense that someone would 1533 01:32:29,080 --> 01:32:31,200 be like, oh my god, stop asking me about it. 1534 01:32:31,200 --> 01:32:34,960 But I'm still at the place in my career where I'm like happy to. 1535 01:32:34,960 --> 01:32:36,200 Oh, yeah. 1536 01:32:36,200 --> 01:32:42,760 But I just think that's kind of like the joy of looking back and also like something I 1537 01:32:42,760 --> 01:32:45,920 can't wait, you know, when I'm 70. 1538 01:32:45,920 --> 01:32:49,320 100% and there's so much joy to looking back is just how many times. 1539 01:32:49,320 --> 01:32:50,320 Oh, yeah, 100%. 1540 01:32:50,320 --> 01:32:55,200 And I think I think like to summarize it, I think Hugh Grant did it the best when he 1541 01:32:55,200 --> 01:32:56,840 was promoting Wonka. 1542 01:32:56,840 --> 01:33:02,080 And he said he said like I'm at that stage of my career where I play an umpa umpa and 1543 01:33:02,080 --> 01:33:04,480 that is like it was like I don't care. 1544 01:33:04,480 --> 01:33:07,080 I do weird roles now. 1545 01:33:07,080 --> 01:33:10,240 And he recently did heretic. 1546 01:33:10,240 --> 01:33:13,280 That's the the Mormon girls come to the door, right? 1547 01:33:13,280 --> 01:33:15,160 I don't like scary movies. 1548 01:33:15,160 --> 01:33:16,160 He's brilliant. 1549 01:33:16,160 --> 01:33:17,440 But I know I've seen it. 1550 01:33:17,440 --> 01:33:18,800 I've seen the trailer and stuff. 1551 01:33:18,800 --> 01:33:23,600 It looks freaky, like with the blueberry pie candle and stuff like, oh my god. 1552 01:33:23,600 --> 01:33:26,760 And he's the last person I would have thought to do a horror film. 1553 01:33:26,760 --> 01:33:28,760 But I think that's why he's doing it. 1554 01:33:28,760 --> 01:33:29,760 Yes. 1555 01:33:29,760 --> 01:33:30,760 Yeah. 1556 01:33:30,760 --> 01:33:32,600 And he was the first person I like. 1557 01:33:32,600 --> 01:33:36,640 I watched the press junket that and I was the first person brought on for it. 1558 01:33:36,640 --> 01:33:41,720 And they were like, we need someone good to play the villains that any just like the he 1559 01:33:41,720 --> 01:33:42,720 sells it. 1560 01:33:42,720 --> 01:33:43,720 That's the thing. 1561 01:33:43,720 --> 01:33:47,960 I love that he's gone from like, that's how we redefined his career. 1562 01:33:47,960 --> 01:33:51,600 He's gone from this dashing young, really like he's still dashing. 1563 01:33:51,600 --> 01:33:52,600 Oh, he's still dashing. 1564 01:33:52,600 --> 01:33:53,600 Oh my god. 1565 01:33:53,600 --> 01:33:59,000 Like, like they the best story out of it was, he said in an interview said, oh, with the 1566 01:33:59,000 --> 01:34:03,720 my two co stars, we went out to dinner after we'd shot everything. 1567 01:34:03,720 --> 01:34:07,760 And we were suddenly all out of character, how we dressed like everything. 1568 01:34:07,760 --> 01:34:12,560 And they were just taken aback with how nice he was because he's so manipulative and evil 1569 01:34:12,560 --> 01:34:14,480 in the film. 1570 01:34:14,480 --> 01:34:16,200 But they were like, you're just so lovely. 1571 01:34:16,200 --> 01:34:17,200 Yeah. 1572 01:34:17,200 --> 01:34:21,280 And he was like, oh, you're not as you know, his two co stars grew up Mormon. 1573 01:34:21,280 --> 01:34:26,160 And he was like, oh, you're not as kind of like religious or, you know, you know, like 1574 01:34:26,160 --> 01:34:27,160 a Mormon. 1575 01:34:27,160 --> 01:34:30,560 And it was just so interesting because he talked about it so fondly. 1576

01:34:30,560 --> 01:34:33,840 And he was like, it was the sort of like best experience. 1577 01:34:33,840 --> 01:34:38,400 And that's a set that like you can tell even and this is the thing I always agree with 1578 01:34:38,400 --> 01:34:42,840 and you know, is you can tell when people loved working with each other on set, that 1579 01:34:42,840 --> 01:34:44,920 is a set that everyone just had a blast. 1580 01:34:44,920 --> 01:34:46,960 Like the hours were worth it. 1581 01:34:46,960 --> 01:34:50,160 The film is like a rant about how good that film is. 1582 01:34:50,160 --> 01:34:56,440 But you know, I think there's very certain things that when you look at career milestones 1583 01:34:56,440 --> 01:35:00,640 and some of my, you know, like some things that I've considered my best work are the 1584 01:35:00,640 --> 01:35:05,740 ones where I go, that was a great experience because I felt like everything kind of fell 1585 01:35:05,740 --> 01:35:13,560 into place and it's like this joyous, you know, and I think that's also like maybe why 1586 01:35:13,560 --> 01:35:18,760 there's probably an element for Lock and Key going to stick around for you, which will, 1587 01:35:18,760 --> 01:35:23,960 you know, when you have other roles as well, you might have like a category, like, you 1588 01:35:23,960 --> 01:35:28,760 know, every like, you know, there might be like per decade, but you might be like everyone 1589 01:35:28,760 --> 01:35:33,080 remembers Lock and Key because it was that sort of like time and then everyone remembers 1590 01:35:33,080 --> 01:35:37,920 this other project that I did, you know, when I was, you know, 30 something or, you know, 1591 01:35:37,920 --> 01:35:40,840 40 something or, you know, like wherever you are in your timeline. 1592 01:35:40,840 --> 01:35:44,560 And I think that's really cool because you can kind of be like, it's like those variety 1593 01:35:44,560 --> 01:35:48,720 things where people look back at their career and they go, oh, this is what I did. 1594 01:35:48,720 --> 01:35:49,720 Which is so cool. 1595 01:35:49,720 --> 01:35:50,720 And that's my goal. 1596 01:35:50,720 --> 01:35:54,880 One day I want to be on the variety. 1597 01:35:54,880 --> 01:36:00,000 One day I want to be sitting down in variety going through my life, going through all of 1598 01:36:00,000 --> 01:36:06,640 like the looks, all of the outfits, you know, like I watch those videos and I say, yeah, 1599 01:36:06,640 --> 01:36:07,640 that's my future. 1600 01:36:07,640 --> 01:36:11,440 I just hope I hope because that is so my thing. 1601 01:36:11,440 --> 01:36:15,480 I want to be like because like I outfits for me and I know this is a little bit of like 1602 01:36:15,480 --> 01:36:21,320 a random term, but like outfits for me are like emotions, experiences and even like the 1603 01:36:21,320 --> 01:36:23,200 Lock and Key outfits. 1604 01:36:23,200 --> 01:36:25,560 This is actually an Eden sweater. 1605 01:36:25,560 --> 01:36:31,440 Yeah, who can figure out where it came from? 1606 01:36:31,440 --> 01:36:37,160 But like I can remember why we chose it, how it came to be, like how it felt to wear it 1607 01:36:37,160 --> 01:36:39,040 in that scene and why and blah, blah, blah. 1608 01:36:39,040 --> 01:36:44,720 And like that's kind of the thing where like I look at those variety like interviews and 1609 01:36:44,720 --> 01:36:49,640 I'm like, wow, that's such an important part of life is those different milestones and 1610 01:36:49,640 --> 01:36:54,400 like how you're dressing in that time, at least for me, because clothing, clothing is 1611 01:36:54,400 --> 01:36:56,720 important to me. 1612 01:36:56,720 --> 01:36:59,880 It's just like, wow, those different milestones that you hit through your life. 1613 01:36:59,880 --> 01:37:03,200 But yeah, one day variety. 1614 01:37:03,200 --> 01:37:07,520 Also the roundtable, the, the, oh, the yes, I know the one you're talking about. 1615 01:37:07,520 --> 01:37:09,560 Hollywood reporter roundtable. 1616 01:37:09,560 --> 01:37:11,720 I would, I would, I believe it. 1617 01:37:11,720 --> 01:37:12,720 I believe it. 1618 01:37:12,720 --> 01:37:13,720 I believe it. 1619 01:37:13,720 --> 01:37:14,720 I believe it. 1620 01:37:14,720 --> 01:37:15,720 Thank you. 1621 01:37:15,720 --> 01:37:16,720 I'm going to have to wrap this up though. 1622 01:37:16,720 --> 01:37:20,520 I could like, honestly, I could talk to you all day though. 1623 01:37:20,520 --> 01:37:21,960 Like you're like so much fun. 1624 01:37:21,960 --> 01:37:22,960 I'm a chatter. 1625 01:37:22,960 --> 01:37:24,960 I'm a yapper. 1626 01:37:24,960 --> 01:37:26,120 I like to yap. 1627 01:37:26,120 --> 01:37:28,280 I think that's great. 1628 01:37:28,280 --> 01:37:30,960 My final question for you though is where can people find you on the internet? 1629 01:37:30,960 --> 01:37:31,960 Where can they stalk you? 1630 01:37:31,960 --> 01:37:35,720 I love how you asked that because what else is it? 1631 01:37:35,720 --> 01:37:36,720 You know, I know. 1632 01:37:36,720 --> 01:37:37,720 What else is it? 1633 01:37:37,720 --> 01:37:46,400 Like truly, primarily my Instagram, uh, at Haleah Jones, H-A-L-L-E-A-J-O-N-E-S. 1634 01:37:46,400 --> 01:37:47,840 And primarily all my stories. 1635 01:37:47,840 --> 01:37:49,760 I don't like posting to my main feed a lot. 1636 01:37:49,760 --> 01:37:50,760 It gives me anxiety. 1637 01:37:50,760 --> 01:37:55,560 I just feel like Instagram has taken a really weird turn with Reels. 1638 01:37:55,560 --> 01:38:02,000 Like I started in 2017, 2015 or something and it's just been really, really weird. 1639 01:38:02,000 --> 01:38:04,160 So I like to hide in my stories. 1640 01:38:04,160 --> 01:38:08,680 Um, I guess Twitter doesn't exist anymore. 1641 01:38:08,680 --> 01:38:12,080 And uh, I actually have a threads account, which is, which is cool because it's like 1642 01:38:12,080 --> 01:38:19,920 primarily like females and like, yeah, gals, gals talking about gal things, you know? 1643 01:38:19,920 --> 01:38:20,920 Yeah. 1644 01:38:20,920 --> 01:38:22,360 It's very queer forward. 1645 01:38:22,360 --> 01:38:23,840 It's very like welcoming. 1646 01:38:23,840 --> 01:38:25,760 It's just like, I just love it. 1647 01:38:25,760 --> 01:38:26,760 It's just amazing. 1648 01:38:26,760 --> 01:38:32,360 Um, I get stuck on there a lot as I recently, that's why I say it cause I'm like, I've spent 1649 01:38:32,360 --> 01:38:33,360 too much time. 1650 01:38:33,360 --> 01:38:35,360 Um, but yeah, Instagram's my primary. 1651 01:38:35,360 --> 01:38:36,360 Oh my God. 1652 01:38:36,360 --> 01:38:37,360 I love this. 1653 01:38:37,360 --> 01:38:40,800 Well, everyone go and stalk Haleah. 1654 01:38:40,800 --> 01:38:45,240 If honestly, I have like almost a thousand posts or something. 1655 01:38:45,240 --> 01:38:47,840 If you go down, I've taken out the things that I don't want people to see. 1656 01:38:47,840 --> 01:38:51,480 If you go down, you could see like so many chapters of my life. 1657 01:38:51,480 --> 01:38:54,360 I'm not even kidding. 1658 01:38:54,360 --> 01:38:59,760 Like I'm, I won't even be like weirded out because like I support it because I have so 1659 01:38:59,760 --> 01:39:02,280 much interesting life on my Instagram. 1660 01:39:02,280 --> 01:39:03,280 It's crazy. 1661 01:39:03,280 --> 01:39:04,280 Oh my God. 1662 01:39:04,280 --> 01:39:05,280 So yeah, that's how you can stalk me. 1663 01:39:05,280 --> 01:39:08,280 Just don't be weird about it. 1664 01:39:08,280 --> 01:39:10,000 Well, thank you so much for joining me. 1665 01:39:10,000 --> 01:39:11,000 Thanks for having me. 1666 01:39:11,000 --> 01:39:12,000 This has been so much fun. 1667 01:39:12,000 --> 01:39:13,000 Yeah. 1668 01:39:13,000 --> 01:39:15,520 Um, and if you want to go and check out more episodes of the things we do, you can check 1669 01:39:15,520 --> 01:39:17,120 them out on Apple and Spotify. 1670 01:39:17,120 --> 01:39:20,040 I'll be speaking with another guest next week and I'll speak to you later. 1671 01:39:20,040 --> 01:39:21,040 Goodbye. 1672 01:39:21,040 --> 01:39:48,040 Bye.