Tangled in People-Pleasing, Overthinking & Going Solo (with Bryan Safi)

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Welcome to the Tango with Kyle Ridley.
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Welcome to all my old listeners, and welcome to all the new listeners who joined after last week's epic interview with Rosie O'Donnell.
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That was a huge moment for me, a pinch me moment.
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One of my favorite people of all time.
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And it was so fortunate to be able to speak with her for an hour.
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It was a dream come true.
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And I just am so thankful for everyone who has downloaded the episode and watched the episode and all of the clips.
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I really hope that you will join the ride and stay on this ride with the Tangle because we have so many incredible guests coming up, and also nearly 80 episodes that you can catch up on.
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And I care deeply about every single guest I have on this show.
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I do my research, I take it seriously.
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I'm not trying to make headlines, but I know we did with Rosie this past week.
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And uh yeah, that was my first big taste of a bunch of press uh taking stuff from my show and putting it out there and kind of skewing it along the way.
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The big one being that Rosie was returning to the view or is returning to the view next year for the 30th anniversary.
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A lot of headlines were made about that, but as she said in the interview, just as a guest, just for a day, if they want her, as they invite many of the hosts back, uh, that got blown a bit out of proportion.
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Um, but hopefully she's not mad.
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I actually got to see her last week.
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I went to her one woman show, Common Knowledge, last Thursday in New York City.
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It was a whirlwind trip.
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I had booked it the week prior before interviewing her, and I just drove up there to New Jersey in the morning of with my partner.
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We saw O'Mary with Meg Stalter, the matinee that day, brilliant as I knew it would be.
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I adore her so much.
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And then that evening we saw Rosie O'Donnell and Common Knowledge, and we're in the front row and got to give her a hug afterward and thank her for speaking with me.
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And uh yeah, she did jokingly say that uh she got in a lot of trouble after that interview, but certainly not my intention.
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I was really just fortunate to speak with one of my biggest inspirations and idols, and I know many of you feel the same.
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And then right after going to New York, I jetted to the beach with several of my friends, Roho with Beach for the weekend, and then got back Sunday and just tried to get back in the groove of everything.
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But uh I've been sick.
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Today I woke up sick, went to the doctor, and I have strep.
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Uh, fortunately, I don't sound too bad.
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It's kind of going down.
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It was mainly a bunch of uh achy muscles and swollen lymph nodes and just hard to swallow, but the antibiotics are kicking in.
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So I'm trying to record this and get it out for you tomorrow.
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Uh bear with me.
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But again, I really just appreciate everyone who has subscribed to the show.
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And if you're able to leave a rating or a comment or a like, that goes a long way.
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I'm gonna continue doing this.
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We've been at it for more than a year now, and I already have five or six guests in the pipeline and many that I'm in talks with to interview.
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So you just stay right here and enjoy all the fun ahead.
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You know, every week I talk about what I'm tangled in, and that was such a big tango last week, just that whole rosy interview and everything that exploded out of it, and then going to meet her, it was sort of all-consuming.
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But uh, I did have some sad stuff happen last week.
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If you've listened to this podcast a bit, I don't want to weigh the show down in this intro uh as we get to a very fun guest, especially for all of the new listeners.
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But if you uh stick around for the end of the show, when I talk about uh being tangled in song, what song I'm currently tangled in this week, I want to tell you about um my little boy River, who who I lost uh last week as well.
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So a very uh dichotomous week for sure.
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One thing that I did want to touch on, though, is I was reflecting on Rosie and the Rosie O'Donnell show from the 90s and early 2000s, and just all the hosts that we've had on our screens that have spoken to me over the years.
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Many of them have been LGBTQIA plus hosts, and I've really noticed in the last 10 years or so a big decline in representation in news.
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And I want to sort of stick more to the local level right now.
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I'm sure many people could chime in and say, well, this anchor is gay, and that's fantastic.
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We want as much as we can.
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But uh, just on a personal level, like I live in Washington, D.C., I started in TV in 2016.
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Uh, the newsroom that I started in was very heavily represented by LGBTQIA plus people and specifically gay men, uh, meteorologists, producers, hosts, anchors.
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The news director was gay.
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And uh it heavily dwindled throughout the last decade.
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And by the time I left, there were hardly any, just a couple.
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I also worked at a news station that really hardly had any representation.
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Uh, and if they did, they weren't really out or they were behind the scenes.
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It's it's just a weird place to be in.
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And I know that there's studies done every year about the lack of representation on TV and LGBTQIA plus characters diminishing and reducing their roles and the percentage going further and further down.
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There's so many things that we can be fighting for right now.
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I think right now I would like to get and to get on my soapbox and just say that uh we need more gay people on TV.
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We more need more gay people giving you the news and giving our opinions and speaking to you at home.
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And I know that newsrooms are dwindling and they have a lack of resources, and not many people are even watching local TV or local news.
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But those voices are important.
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And I uh worked side by side with one of the greats.
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Uh, his name is Kiddo's Shea.
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I worked with him at Good Morning Washington over at uh ABC 7 in DC for many years.
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And his desk was right next to mine, and I was his producer, and uh he headed back to Milwaukee a year or two ago.
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And right now in the DMV specifically, LGBTQIA plus hosts are few and far between.
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So um, I'm just encouraging newsrooms, news directors to diversify a little bit.
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And, you know, all the gay hosts that I mentioned in the past, most of them left the industry or the station on their own accord, but those positions aren't really being filled in a diverse way that I'm seeing.
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And share this if you agree, if you're noticing a lack of representation on your screens.
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And also, us gay people, we can do a lot more than sound off on pop culture and celebrity gossip and fashion and style.
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Uh, we're great at that, but uh we are limitless, so don't discount us.
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And uh, on a personal note, I just want to thank Andy Cohen, such a mogul in this industry.
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And I specifically fell in love with him after reading his memoir, Most Talkative, and just reading about all of his past work before going to Bravo and producing and being behind the scenes, and sort of uh I am following in the footsteps a little bit, as much as I can, at least, in this aspect.
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And I have read all of his books and I just adore his humor and his lightheartedness, but also able to land those hard interviews and keep it fun along the way.
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I've just always found him to be a comfort of mine.
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And then also really, really want to thank uh Ross Matthews, who I have been following for decades, ever since his intern days at Jay Leno, and followed him through uh Chelsea Lately and his own talk show and his brilliant podcast that is probably my favorite podcast of all time.
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And uh now he's killing it on the Drew Barrymore show every day, co-hosting with her.
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Uh, I think she has got it right.
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We need a gay sidekick by our sides.
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And I think that him to be on a national level in everyone's living rooms every day, uh, it's a big feat.
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And I think uh Ross Matthews is a pure uh talent survivor, resilient, and uh underrated.
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And uh I just wanted to tip my hat to Ross, also a fantastic author.
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I've read all of his books as well.
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All right.
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Well, speaking of great authors, our guest today is a fantastic author of a one-man show, Are You Mad at Me, which is currently playing off Broadway.
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It's winding down this week.
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His name is Brian Sofie.
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He also hosts two podcasts, Ask Rana and Attitudes.
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You can also catch up on 911 every week.
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He's been going on nine seasons on that show with uh Jennifer Love Hewitt by his side.
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And this was a fantastic conversation.
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I met him about 10 years ago, which you'll hear about.
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A funny story about how we met.
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But I really hope you enjoyed this conversation with Brian Sofie.
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Check out his one-man show if you can.
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Download his podcast and enjoy the brilliant, hysterical, people-pleasing Brian Sofie.
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Well, Brian Sofie, I'm so excited to speak with you and so excited for your one-man show that is in New York right now.
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But before we get to that, do you remember how we met?
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We met almost a decade ago.
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You were doing press in DC.
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You had a Kennedy Center show with your podcast co-host, and I went to the show and it was great, but we had a makeup artist backstage do you before you did our segment.
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And do you remember what she did?
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She essentially gave me, and by the way, I've obsessed, I was obsessed with that makeup.
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It was my favorite.
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She basically gave me like Charlie McCarthy, raggedy Andy, like rouge on the cheeks and made me look a little bit like a marionette and like a living doll.
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And I gotta tell, I mean, it felt like I was in like chitty chitty bang bang or like babes in toyland.
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It was my favorite makeup.
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I looked like a nutcracker.
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Yeah.
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I just remember backstage you were laughing, but you went on with it.
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I think because again, you talk about being a people pleaser with your new show.
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That's right.
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No, that's true.
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I didn't want to hurt her feelings.
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And also, I I had a feeling that she, I don't know, maybe hadn't done a lot of men before or something.
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Because Erin, my co's makeup, was her makeup was stunning.
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And so it was just, I loved it so much.
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It's I still used that picture um for a while, like a while ago when I was on hinge and stuff.
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That was like my main picture, just because I was like, I wonder if anyone will think this is funny.
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Then I realized, no, the joke's on me for real.
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So funny.
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But yeah, I'm obsessed with it.
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So good to see you again all these years later.
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Comedian, writer, producer, podcaster, actor, and now one man show creator.
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Are you mad at me?
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Which is now off starring off Broadway.
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You workshopped it in Scotland at the Edinburgh French Fest.
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What was it like to get on stage in New York that first night, introducing it to this whole new crowd after workshopping it for so long?
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I mean, Scotland was incredible.
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New York's been incredible.
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It Scotland was great because at the festival, because um, every night I went in with such like an unfinished show in a good way.
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Like I went in almost with the first draft.
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And then by the end of that, there are so few chances to perform 30 times in a row.
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I came out with like a completely different show in only wonderful ways that I became obsessed with.
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And because it's so interactive with the audience, it feels like a new show every night.
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So it's always scary to do, but in great ways.
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I really enjoy doing it, but it's always a little bit terrifying.
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But um, but it's great because no show's ever the same.
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We'll get back to the show in a bit, but I do like to start at the beginning.
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So we start with your upbringing in El Paso, Texas.
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I mean, oftentimes we sort of encapsulate, uh, we blanket Texas in one feeling, red, uh conservative.
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Uh, it's certainly not all the case, but your childhood, from what I understand, it was not the most um progressive.
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No.
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And in fact, El Paso is a blue city.
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It really is.
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It's the leaders are typically Democrats, and it's one of the few in Texas that leans that way, except in my home, where it was very conservative, very religious, nothing progressive about it, very stifling in that way.
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And very, like, I mean, from the time we were four, we were told that if we did something bad, we would go to hell, which is wild.
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And so it it was a very listen, it informed everything in my comedy.
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And certainly my family, my parents specifically, have come such a long way in the years since.
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But no, it was a it was a tough childhood and a very, very stifling one for sure.
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I often talk about gay awakenings on this show and the coming out process, and you've described it as disastrous.
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And there was a large family disconnect for for many years, right?
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Do you think that contributed to you always feeling like, as your show says, someone is mad at you or someone is not happy with you?
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I think so.
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I also had a, you know, very religious parents, a mother who was very unpredictable.
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You didn't really know what you were getting when you came home every day.
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And so I think I've always tiptoed around people and their opinions.
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I will say when I did disconnect from my parents for a number of years before we, you know, reunited, I I do think that that gave me, I came to terms with my sexuality in a much more healthy way.
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And I also came to the realization, like, oh, it would be nice to have my parents around, but I no longer need them.
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And I still feel that way.
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I love my parents, but there was some sort of self-sufficiency there that was born out of that.
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Um, that I don't regret.
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I don't regret those years not speaking with them.
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I don't, I don't look back on that and say, oh, the years I missed, I really think the years I gained, you know?
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And um overall, I I do believe was a healthy decision.
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However, yes, I I do think that constantly negotiating your parents' emotions and where what they're feeling about you in any given moment when you just you just don't know what you're walking into definitely has contributed to the constant cycle in my head of, are you mad at me for sure.
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And have they seen the new show?
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Yes.
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They actually no, they've not seen the new show, but I do have a bit, especially about my mom.
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And so before I put that into the show, I just ran through that material with her and said, Are you cool with this?
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And she was like, Yes, I think that's fine.
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But no, they were actually supposed to come to New York to see it, then my mom got sick, so they couldn't make it.
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But um, I do think that they would it really enjoy it.
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Yeah.
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We also talk about gay awakenings.
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We talk about past and current celebrity crushes.
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And I want to talk about your your first crush was an animated character.
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Can you talk about the appeal of Scar from The Lion King?
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Oh my God.
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First of all, the Lion King, I come from a family of overachievers.
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And my brother was one of those people who just got perfect scores, A's, and didn't even have to think about it, you know?
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I was just a star student naturally, would do his homework a minute before it was due and just aced it.
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I was so the opposite of that.
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I was nearly held back twice.
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I just didn't really think like he thought he was such a math and science person.
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I was absolutely not any of those things.
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And so I always first time I saw Lion King, I was like, oh my God, that's me.
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My brother is, you know, a shining star and a calm presence and all of these things.
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And I'm like in the corner, just like plotting my revenge against all this.
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And I related to Scar, certainly not in a pure evil way, but just in a way of like, yeah, second fiddle, but also sophisticated.
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I mean, I really thought I was so sophisticated back then, you know what I mean?
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Just because I liked telephones that looked old-fashioned, like just anything like that.
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Um, and uh, so I fully related to Scar as being a sophisticated and also being kind of the lesser brother.
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So I did have a crush on Scar.
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I thought he was sexy and his voice too.
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Very so.
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There's always been kind of talk that he's been like an evil, he's like an evil gay, right?
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I love, I have to tell you this.
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I love evil gays more than any other trope.
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I think they're so fun.
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I wish there were more of them.
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I hated the period in like the aughts and even in the, you know, the 20 teens of okay, we have to course correct this, and all gay people have to be magical and perfect and nice.
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No, give me a good gay asshole any day of the week.
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I think it's way more fun.
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But yeah, I would say most of the Disney villains are queer.
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Certainly Scar, um, certainly Jafar, you know, uh, I would say even Ursula.
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I mean, they they are.
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They're they're just they didn't get, you know, what they deserved growing up.
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And so they're, you know, experiencing a second adolescence of selfishness and cruelty, which I love.
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And I think Belle's the I forget the guy that she was attracted to before, you know, Beast, but I think he's like a hidden muscle gay.
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Yeah.
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Closeted.
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And his friend, like his best friend, had the most giant crush on him in that movie.
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In fact, I think there was mention of it in the live action Beauty and the Beast movie.
00:16:17.440 --> 00:16:21.679
There was like a scene, I don't remember if they cut it or not, but where the guy essentially says that he's in love with him.
00:16:21.759 --> 00:16:21.919
Yeah.
00:16:22.240 --> 00:16:23.519
Who else did you have crushes on?
00:16:23.600 --> 00:16:25.120
And when did these crushes start?
00:16:25.279 --> 00:16:32.080
I guess when did you realize something, as Joe Dambrowski just had said on my podcast, he had a little glitter in his step.
00:16:32.159 --> 00:16:33.039
When did you realize?
00:16:33.279 --> 00:16:33.600
Okay.
00:16:33.919 --> 00:16:36.639
I also had a crush on Daffy Duck, for sure.
00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:43.360
Um, again, I just thought he was so much smarter than the people that I know he would always get duped, but I just thought he was so much smarter than anyone else in the room.
00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:50.480
In terms of real life people, my first stirrings were probably Mark Paul Gosseler and Saved by the Bell.
00:16:50.559 --> 00:16:52.559
I remember thinking he was such a dreamboat.
00:16:53.360 --> 00:16:54.799
Uh Jason Priestley.
00:16:55.039 --> 00:16:55.600
Yes.
00:16:55.759 --> 00:17:00.399
Uh, I remember from like early 90210 thinking he was so cute.
00:17:00.480 --> 00:17:09.440
But it's funny, I never had like obsessions the way that I think a lot of young kids have on, for instance, Bieber back in the day or whoever it is.
00:17:09.599 --> 00:17:10.960
I never really had that.
00:17:11.359 --> 00:17:17.039
And I think it's because I stopped myself from going all the way there because I knew that something was different about that.
00:17:17.200 --> 00:17:20.960
So I never really dove in in that way.
00:17:21.119 --> 00:17:22.960
But I remember thinking guys were cute.
00:17:23.359 --> 00:17:24.799
Current celebrity crushes?
00:17:25.119 --> 00:17:25.440
Man.
00:17:25.759 --> 00:17:27.680
Um, let me think here.
00:17:27.920 --> 00:17:28.720
Or do you have a type?
00:17:28.799 --> 00:17:33.519
Like when you're on an app, if you know a tribe that you're checking, a tribe?
00:17:33.839 --> 00:17:34.079
Never.
00:17:34.240 --> 00:17:36.160
I've never, ever, ever had a type.
00:17:36.319 --> 00:17:37.680
Um, let me think.
00:17:37.839 --> 00:17:40.160
God, who do I think is cute these days?
00:17:40.319 --> 00:17:42.400
I mean, I guess anyone in the Odyssey.
00:17:42.559 --> 00:17:44.480
Um, I'm trying to think.
00:17:44.720 --> 00:17:49.680
Uh let's say, I mean, the the guys from uh He did Rivalry for sure.
00:17:50.000 --> 00:17:51.680
Uh huh.
00:17:51.839 --> 00:17:52.480
I don't know.
00:17:52.640 --> 00:17:53.920
I guess I just never have crushes.
00:17:54.160 --> 00:17:56.240
Well, I mean, you have a partner, so that's fine.
00:17:56.480 --> 00:17:57.519
Maybe that's why.
00:17:57.759 --> 00:17:59.759
But no, I would still I God, who do I want?
00:18:00.000 --> 00:18:01.839
Melanie Griffith and Working Girl, maybe.
00:18:02.000 --> 00:18:03.759
Um, yeah, I don't know.
00:18:04.160 --> 00:18:06.960
Obviously, you're so multifaceted in the entertainment industry.
00:18:07.119 --> 00:18:09.759
Comedian, writer, producer, podcaster.
00:18:10.000 --> 00:18:13.279
What was your first inkling of wanting to be in the arts?
00:18:13.440 --> 00:18:14.960
Was it acting that you saw?
00:18:15.119 --> 00:18:15.920
Was it stand-up?
00:18:16.079 --> 00:18:17.119
Was it Broadway?
00:18:17.359 --> 00:18:19.519
Yes, it was definitely acting.
00:18:19.680 --> 00:18:22.400
And it was that was the track I was going on.
00:18:22.480 --> 00:18:33.440
And in fact, my first professional job was right after I went to theater school at NYU, and right after I got a season at the Shakespeare Theater in DC, realized, what the hell am I doing here?
00:18:33.599 --> 00:18:37.359
Like I barely understand these words, and classical theater really is not my jam.
00:18:37.599 --> 00:18:40.319
And then after that, started getting writing jobs.
00:18:40.400 --> 00:18:44.960
I took classes at the Upright Citizens Brigade, and that really is when I was like, okay, I want to be in comedy.
00:18:45.119 --> 00:18:47.680
And then was a writer after that.
00:18:47.839 --> 00:18:59.759
And then until I got um a show on Free Forum called Young and Hungry, that I was actually the first acting gig I got after the writing was for a lifetime movie called A Deadly Adoption with Will Farrell and Kristen Wig.
00:19:00.079 --> 00:19:00.799
I knew the writer.
00:19:00.960 --> 00:19:03.440
He was like, there's this part playing Kristen Wig's best friend.
00:19:03.519 --> 00:19:04.880
I get brutally murdered in it.
00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:06.720
And he was like, I think you would be so good at this.
00:19:06.799 --> 00:19:08.240
And I was like, great, I love it.
00:19:08.400 --> 00:19:09.039
So I did that.
00:19:09.119 --> 00:19:13.519
And then I got a series after that that was a multicam, like a sitcom called Young and Hungry.
00:19:13.599 --> 00:19:17.519
And then after that, I auditioned for 911, was supposed to be in two episodes.
00:19:17.599 --> 00:19:21.119
And now I think it's been eight years and like 70 episodes that I've been in.
00:19:21.279 --> 00:19:27.839
So the acting thing, I started with acting, then went into comedy, then ended up on a drama, you know, which is 911.
00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:30.079
It's a campy drama, but it is a drama.
00:19:30.400 --> 00:19:46.240
And through that, was realizing, and I still had my podcast going at the same time, but realizing, like, oh, I really want to get in touch with the comedy side again, which is what this show was born out of just it was during the pandemic, and I wanted to start doing more stand-up, and it just kind of all fell together for me.
00:19:46.480 --> 00:19:46.640
Yeah.
00:19:46.960 --> 00:19:47.680
So well-rounded.
00:19:47.759 --> 00:19:52.720
And I've had uh Kim Whitley on this show, and we talked about Young and Hungry and how she she wishes it was still around.
00:19:52.880 --> 00:19:54.240
She loved working on that show, she said.
00:19:54.480 --> 00:19:55.279
It was so fun.
00:19:55.440 --> 00:20:00.720
She was absolutely genius, hilarious perfection.
00:20:00.799 --> 00:20:02.400
I I love I love Kim Whitley.
00:20:02.640 --> 00:20:09.759
So, what were your sitcoms or movies other than animated that you were really drawn to growing up or that you watch every episode of and can still recite?
00:20:10.079 --> 00:20:15.680
Big business, working girl, uh, saved by the bell, fatal attraction.
00:20:16.079 --> 00:20:20.240
Um, I had an aunt who would take me to see the movies that my parents wouldn't allow me to see.
00:20:20.319 --> 00:20:22.160
So, like The Hand That Rocks the Cradle.
00:20:22.400 --> 00:20:33.680
I mean, you know, strong female leads with a lot of gay coding, which is how I really got into big business, is there is a gay couple in that that they don't say that they're gay, but you kind of realize that they are.
00:20:33.920 --> 00:20:36.960
Um, soap dish was a huge one for me.
00:20:37.519 --> 00:20:44.880
Uh anything with really strong female leads was was my game for sure, because I related to them.
00:20:45.039 --> 00:20:50.640
I mean, all of anytime there's a strong lead female lead in a movie, you they're an underdog in that story, you know?
00:20:50.799 --> 00:20:53.920
And uh who can't relate to that if you're ever been remotely marginalized.
00:20:54.000 --> 00:20:54.480
Aaron Powell Yeah.
00:20:54.559 --> 00:21:01.200
I I've heard people say, like, a girl's gay, and I think that was probably me up until my late 30s, because all my friends were always women.
00:21:01.279 --> 00:21:04.799
It was always female singers, female actors, actresses, female-driven phones.
00:21:05.039 --> 00:21:05.680
So I you relate.
00:21:06.000 --> 00:21:07.839
Because they have to work so much harder.
00:21:08.079 --> 00:21:17.359
And also, I mean, homophobia really is just, I think if you really boil it down some not always, but sometimes it really is just like mis, it's misogyny.
00:21:17.599 --> 00:21:21.920
It's the fear of something feminine and you know, something different coming up.
00:21:22.160 --> 00:21:26.640
And I think the misogyny and homophobia are intrinsically related.
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:35.599
And I think a lot of people, our generation, you know, millennials or elder elder millennials in our 40s, we grew up with just not a lot of representation, uh, especially for for gay people.
00:21:35.680 --> 00:21:36.880
We didn't see ourselves on the screen.
00:21:36.960 --> 00:21:38.240
It was those one-dimensional characters.
00:21:38.640 --> 00:21:39.119
Zero.
00:21:39.440 --> 00:21:39.920
Zero.
00:21:40.480 --> 00:21:46.640
So when you were coming out, did you seek out community right away in the LGBTQ community?
00:21:46.799 --> 00:21:49.119
Or I mean, I didn't until my late 30s.
00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:50.240
I always felt outside of it.
00:21:50.319 --> 00:21:53.839
And then I realized I want to find men to travel with and grow old with.
00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:57.519
When did you find community within the LGBTQ community?
00:21:57.839 --> 00:21:59.599
Pretty quickly, and that had to do really.
00:22:00.480 --> 00:22:03.200
With at the time, things are much better now.
00:22:03.279 --> 00:22:11.839
But at the time when I did like the Upright Citizens Brigade or the Groundlings in LA, which are both comedy programs, there were very few gay performers in that scene, truly.
00:22:12.240 --> 00:22:15.440
Or let me put it this way: gay performers who actually got stage time.
00:22:15.599 --> 00:22:16.720
That was very difficult.
00:22:16.880 --> 00:22:18.640
Those places were very broy.
00:22:18.799 --> 00:22:22.720
The amount, I mean, this was also in the industry at large, too, even higher up.
00:22:22.880 --> 00:22:33.359
But the amount of times I was told that my show was too gay, that this idea was too gay, that the script was too gay, that this pitch was too gay, in a way that no one would talk like that now.
00:22:33.599 --> 00:22:38.240
They might believe it, but they wouldn't necessarily say that any longer.
00:22:38.559 --> 00:22:44.799
So I became fast friends with people like Drew Drogie and Pete Zayas.
00:22:44.880 --> 00:22:49.279
I became good friends with Jeffrey Self and uh Charles Rogers.
00:22:49.440 --> 00:22:59.759
That's how I became to know Guy Branham, Louis Fertell, is that anyone who was actually making any kind of queer content, I guess specifically in my realm, it was, you know, gay men.
00:22:59.920 --> 00:23:08.559
Um, it was just such a small circle to begin with that once I came out and became more and more active in that, those were the people I gravitated toward.
00:23:08.640 --> 00:23:12.000
And they were also always the funniest and smartest people in the rooms.
00:23:12.160 --> 00:23:12.640
Always.
00:23:12.880 --> 00:23:14.960
So it was a, it was an honor.
00:23:15.119 --> 00:23:17.920
It's always been an honor to be in that group, you know?
00:23:18.079 --> 00:23:20.000
And so I actually found it pretty quickly.
00:23:20.160 --> 00:23:24.799
My problem is that as I've grown older, I feel like my social anxiety has gotten worse and worse.
00:23:24.880 --> 00:23:31.039
So, like it is harder for me to keep up with it because um I just want to always go home.
00:23:31.200 --> 00:23:32.000
You know what I mean?
00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:36.640
But they are still the funniest sources for me and the people who are the most inspiring.
00:23:36.799 --> 00:23:46.240
For instance, I wouldn't have written the show without O'Mary, um, without uh bright colors and bold patterns, Drew Drogie's show, without messy white gaze.
00:23:46.319 --> 00:23:52.720
I, you know, I just, it's just such an encouraging time that you can really write the story of your dreams.
00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:56.799
And as long as it's good and captures an audience, that's all that matters.
00:23:56.880 --> 00:24:00.240
It can even be highly produced now, which was not the case years ago.
00:24:00.319 --> 00:24:03.759
I actually think coal was the watershed moment for that in in the modern era, at least.
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:04.799
Brilliant show.
00:24:04.880 --> 00:24:07.039
I'm going to see it next week with Meg Stalter.
00:24:07.200 --> 00:24:10.880
I've seen it once before with Betty Gilpin, who I love, but I have to see it with Meg.
00:24:10.960 --> 00:24:13.839
And then actually I'm gonna go see Rose O'Donnell's One Woman show.
00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:14.319
Yes.
00:24:14.559 --> 00:24:16.559
She was at Edinburgh the same time I was.
00:24:16.720 --> 00:24:17.039
Yeah.
00:24:17.359 --> 00:24:18.240
So you got to meet her?
00:24:18.480 --> 00:24:18.799
No.
00:24:19.200 --> 00:24:22.240
Our shows were, I think, are at the same time.
00:24:22.480 --> 00:24:27.279
Um, and so we never if they I think they were literally playing at like the exact same time or something like that.
00:24:27.359 --> 00:24:31.200
They they they coincided in a way that I couldn't see hers and she, you know, couldn't see mine.
00:24:31.440 --> 00:24:33.519
Well, now your friend Guy Branham is heading to Edinburgh.
00:24:33.599 --> 00:24:37.839
So I'm sure he's picking your brain about where to stay and how to survive those 30 shows.
00:24:37.920 --> 00:24:38.880
So that's exciting, though.
00:24:39.119 --> 00:24:40.079
I wish she'd pick it more.
00:24:40.240 --> 00:24:41.759
I'm here for you, guy, always.
00:24:41.839 --> 00:24:42.799
I'm obsessed with Guy.
00:24:42.880 --> 00:24:44.319
No one's a better interview subject than him.
00:24:44.559 --> 00:24:45.200
He's incredible.
00:24:45.359 --> 00:24:47.519
Uh, back to your show, Are You Mad at Me?
00:24:47.680 --> 00:24:53.279
You it was initially inspired by reflecting on past bullying and gay slurs that you recalled growing up.
00:24:53.440 --> 00:24:54.240
I relate to that.
00:24:54.400 --> 00:25:03.119
It's very painful, but how did you, reflecting on that, see the comedy in it and feel like this could be an inkling, the start of a one-man show?
00:25:03.440 --> 00:25:11.440
Because the when I started reflecting on the sort of the insults hurled my way when I was a kid, some of them were actually, now that I think about it, like really fierce and fresh.
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:13.599
And like they were kind of serving.
00:25:13.759 --> 00:25:18.799
And so the initial thing was like, what if there was a game show called Were They Homophobic or Were They Just Serving?
00:25:18.960 --> 00:25:26.160
And I go through some of the stuff that was said to me and then like pull the audience on like, do you think that was homophobic or do you think that was serving?
00:25:26.319 --> 00:25:37.680
Some of the quotes come from my mom, like a couple, like my, for instance, my mom came to my third grade talent show when I was a kid wearing a floor-length fur coat, and afterward told me that I was too flashy.
00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:45.039
And like reflecting on that now, I'm like, girl, you basically came in a ball gown and a fur fucking coat to my talent show.
00:25:45.119 --> 00:25:46.799
And you're telling me I was too much.
00:25:46.960 --> 00:25:48.000
Like, I live for it.
00:25:48.160 --> 00:25:49.279
I think it's so fresh.
00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:54.160
It's very, you know, um, loose seal on arrested development to me.
00:25:54.319 --> 00:25:58.640
She also said things like, Brian, God makes no mistakes, but he definitely thinks you're a challenge.
00:25:58.720 --> 00:26:00.720
And I'm like, that is fresh as hell.
00:26:00.880 --> 00:26:07.200
Like, so I just love playing this game of turning things on their head and being like, honestly, pretty good.
00:26:07.440 --> 00:26:10.400
So that was the that was the initial like germ of this show.
00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:10.640
Yeah.
00:26:10.799 --> 00:26:15.200
Were you always able to find humor in hard times, or has that come with age?
00:26:15.440 --> 00:26:24.720
I think I've always been able to find it simply because growing up, my mother and her sister, the one that would take me to see like R-rated movies, were always at odds.
00:26:24.799 --> 00:26:27.200
And my aunt was really the very fun one.
00:26:27.279 --> 00:26:39.680
And she used to like really stand up to my mom and also kind of like, she would do impressions of my mom and stuff, and she would really just make me laugh at sort of the shit that I was dealing with.
00:26:39.839 --> 00:26:47.759
She she would and it, I was absolutely captivated by that to the point where it almost was training my brain, like, okay, this messed up thing happened.
00:26:47.839 --> 00:26:57.279
Like, if you stepped away from this objectively, it's so crazy and wild that there's something very funny about this too.
00:26:57.599 --> 00:27:08.000
Um, and so I think she helped me hone that of just the absurd and the awful can occasionally, if you step away from it and spin it, can occasionally be very funny.
00:27:08.160 --> 00:27:15.279
So I I think I, you know, whenever you experience something heartbreaking or sad, you should absolutely live in that moment.
00:27:15.440 --> 00:27:20.400
But I just always think that finding the funny in it is what puts you on top of it.
00:27:20.559 --> 00:27:23.359
It you literally get the last laugh about it, you know.
00:27:23.680 --> 00:27:24.400
Nicely said.
00:27:24.480 --> 00:27:30.559
And the the show digs into your history of people pleasing and spending much of your life thinking people are pissed off at you.
00:27:31.039 --> 00:27:35.359
Has the writing and performing of the show helped heal some of that?
00:27:35.519 --> 00:27:37.200
Has it quelled some of the insecurities?
00:27:37.279 --> 00:27:38.160
Do you find it cathartic?
00:27:38.400 --> 00:27:39.599
I do find it cathartic.
00:27:39.839 --> 00:27:49.440
Also, um, I started calling the show Sleep No More for People Pleasers because it is like I'm actively asking the audience how they're enjoying it, what they've liked.
00:27:49.519 --> 00:27:54.240
I mean, like the it's literally I need the feedback constantly about like how it's going.
00:27:54.400 --> 00:27:57.119
And so the audience plays a big role in it, which is like so fun.
00:27:57.200 --> 00:27:58.720
And it's friendly fire.
00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:01.839
Like, I'm not out insulting people or anything like that.
00:28:01.920 --> 00:28:07.680
But um, it does end up feeling like a very fun kind of group experience in that.
00:28:07.839 --> 00:28:13.839
And so my people pleasing is very activated, even live in the show of being like, Do you like this?
00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:14.799
Do you like me?
00:28:14.960 --> 00:28:16.240
What's been your favorite part?
00:28:16.400 --> 00:28:19.359
Um, so in that way, yes, it is cathartic.
00:28:19.440 --> 00:28:28.960
And frankly, in a truly vile way, it is always cathartic and pure bliss for me to be on a stage.
00:28:29.039 --> 00:28:31.759
And I know that that's very Norma Desmond of me to say.
00:28:31.839 --> 00:28:35.599
Like, I it's a tragic thing to say, but it just is.
00:28:35.680 --> 00:28:36.960
That's when I just feel my best.
00:28:37.279 --> 00:28:42.400
I think there's only good that can come from sharing and expressing stuff that maybe we've repressed in those hard times.
00:28:42.480 --> 00:28:45.519
It's it's we find relatability and connection.
00:28:45.759 --> 00:28:48.160
And uh, you also incorporate music into the show.
00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:50.400
Can you talk about your musical inspirations?
00:28:50.559 --> 00:28:52.240
Were you a a Broadway theater kid?
00:28:52.400 --> 00:28:53.519
It was definitely a theater kid.
00:28:53.599 --> 00:28:57.039
The first show I ever saw was Le Mez when I was very little, quickly became obsessed with it.
00:28:57.119 --> 00:29:08.160
And then Phantom, I saw the big ones, um, you know, and was just blown away and taken away by these experiences.
00:29:08.720 --> 00:29:13.519
Um, and so yes, the musical elements in the show are very sporadic.
00:29:13.599 --> 00:29:15.920
Sometimes it's just one line of a song that I'll sing.
00:29:16.079 --> 00:29:30.480
It did it, it just whenever that, whenever it, I mean, they're choreographed and stuff and there's music set to them, but I opened the show with a torch song version of Cold Hearted Snake because I'm I've always been obsessed with that song by Paul Abdul because it's actually literally about someone cheating on her on Halloween.
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:32.480
And it's wild.
00:29:32.640 --> 00:29:34.079
And I love that song so much.
00:29:34.160 --> 00:29:36.319
And it's just about her being insecure in this thing.
00:29:36.400 --> 00:29:37.279
So I love it.
00:29:37.519 --> 00:29:45.680
Um, I used to fake sick when I was a kid so I could stay home and sing all day while my parents were at work, like Whitney Mariah, Vanessa Williams.
00:29:45.920 --> 00:29:48.319
So save the best for last is a big part of this.
00:29:48.480 --> 00:29:49.839
That's really like my comfort place.
00:29:50.000 --> 00:29:53.039
A poor unfortunate souls plays a big part of the show.
00:29:53.279 --> 00:29:59.039
The song Ursula's, you know, fierce, ferocious song in uh Little Mermaid.
00:29:59.200 --> 00:30:00.880
Um, so some of the songs are original.
00:30:01.039 --> 00:30:05.759
If It Makes You Happy by Cheryl Crowe gets one line sung in this, in this show.
00:30:05.920 --> 00:30:10.640
So they come fast and furious, all the musical elements, and seemingly out of nowhere.
00:30:10.799 --> 00:30:15.920
So it's a fun to watch the audience's reaction because they're like taken aback at first that I'm just singing.
00:30:16.079 --> 00:30:21.680
And then when it ends, in a on a in a flash, they just start laughing because they're like, What the hell just happened?
00:30:21.759 --> 00:30:22.799
Which is so fun for me.
00:30:22.880 --> 00:30:27.279
So yeah, music's definitely always been, especially musical theater, has definitely been like, I don't know.
00:30:27.519 --> 00:30:27.759
Beautiful.
00:30:27.839 --> 00:30:29.119
And you mentioned Vanessa Williams.
00:30:29.200 --> 00:30:32.480
So I I assume you were a fan of Pocahontas Colors of the Wind.
00:30:33.200 --> 00:30:34.079
Of course.
00:30:34.400 --> 00:30:36.240
Not the movie, but yes, of that song.
00:30:36.400 --> 00:30:38.000
That movie could have done better, I have to say.
00:30:38.079 --> 00:30:39.119
I don't think they did her right.
00:30:39.440 --> 00:30:39.920
I'll say it.
00:30:40.319 --> 00:30:40.960
Justice.
00:30:41.200 --> 00:30:42.960
Uh I I found this interesting.
00:30:43.119 --> 00:30:48.880
Can you share a little about how a woman's shirt impacted the show that you saw in a grocery store?
00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:49.519
Yes.
00:30:49.920 --> 00:31:01.759
I was in a grocery store, and there was this lady who was so confidently walking through the store, and she had one of those shirts that had like a lot of words on it.
00:31:02.640 --> 00:31:07.279
And almost seeming like maybe she ironed them on or had it made.
00:31:07.599 --> 00:31:11.839
And I couldn't quite tell what the shirt said, like I couldn't really make it out.
00:31:12.160 --> 00:31:20.240
And as I got closer to her, and I was like sneakily trying to get closer to her, the front of the shirt said, I sure do miss teaching kindergarten, which I thought was so sweet.
00:31:20.400 --> 00:31:23.440
Like she clearly was a retired teacher, all of this.
00:31:23.680 --> 00:31:28.960
And then when I walked past her, I like turned around and there was something written on the back of her shirt.
00:31:29.119 --> 00:31:33.039
And the back of it said, in all caps, oh wait, no, I don't.
00:31:33.200 --> 00:31:34.880
So I sure do miss teaching kindergarten.
00:31:35.039 --> 00:31:36.319
Wait, no, I don't.
00:31:36.799 --> 00:31:43.680
And it really shattered me because I thought, wow, I'm always the front of the shirt.
00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:55.519
I'm always cheerful, palatable, giving people what they want, putting a smile on everything, having coffee with people I can't stand because I feel the responsibility to, smiling through Zoom meetings, through my teeth.
00:31:55.680 --> 00:31:59.599
And this woman is both the front and the back of the shirt.
00:31:59.759 --> 00:32:03.920
And it really becomes the through line for the show of why can't I be both?
00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:05.920
Why can't I express both publicly?
00:32:06.079 --> 00:32:07.839
This world couldn't be in a worse place right now.
00:32:07.920 --> 00:32:09.279
It's time to stop being the front.
00:32:09.440 --> 00:32:15.119
And listen, you can be the front, but you also really need to be the back and be honest about your frustrations here.
00:32:15.279 --> 00:32:18.799
And so that shirt completely inspired me into the kind of person I want to be.
00:32:19.039 --> 00:32:19.680
Beautifully said.
00:32:19.759 --> 00:32:24.799
And I know that you're still a work in progress as far as, you know, not really caring what everyone thinks.
00:32:25.119 --> 00:32:31.440
But we always hear growing up, you just hit an age where you just you don't give a shit what anyone thinks and things just fall off you.
00:32:31.599 --> 00:32:35.920
I know you're not totally there yet, but has it shifted pre and post Are You Mad at Me?
00:32:36.160 --> 00:32:37.680
There has been a shift for sure.
00:32:37.839 --> 00:32:45.599
I I think that it is a myth that when you hit your 40s, everything locks into place and you no longer care about the smallest stuff.
00:32:45.680 --> 00:32:48.240
And I don't think that's entirely true.
00:32:48.400 --> 00:32:55.759
I think you give less of a shit, you know, as you get older, but it's always still there.
00:32:56.000 --> 00:33:04.880
I I, you know, it's like the um the good little boy syndrome for for gay men of just you feel like when you're growing up, you have this flaw.
00:33:04.960 --> 00:33:07.359
And so all you want to do is like make it up to people.
00:33:07.519 --> 00:33:09.680
You want to be the brightest, the shiniest, the best.
00:33:09.920 --> 00:33:28.319
And uh, it's very hard for that to fall away completely, but I do believe that every time I do this show and I'm going through, for instance, the shirt segment or any anything like that, it it does remind me that um there really is no point in trying to censor yourself any longer.
00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:32.319
It just is useless, fruitless, all of these things.
00:33:32.480 --> 00:33:35.039
So I'm constantly having to remind myself of that.
00:33:35.200 --> 00:33:37.599
But um, yes, I think I think it has helped.
00:33:37.680 --> 00:33:48.720
And also I just think, in essence of doing my own show, going at this for an hour and 15 minutes every night, involving the audience, making practically a new experience every single night of the week.
00:33:48.880 --> 00:33:54.160
That has to be there, that has to maybe it comes from insecurity, but it certainly also comes from confidence, you know?
00:33:54.319 --> 00:33:57.519
So it's been nice to step back and try to acknowledge that.
00:33:57.680 --> 00:34:00.240
And a big thing for me is listening to what people are saying.
00:34:00.480 --> 00:34:01.920
People say they like the show.
00:34:02.079 --> 00:34:03.440
I no longer brush that off.
00:34:03.519 --> 00:34:04.160
I take it.
00:34:04.480 --> 00:34:04.640
Great.
00:34:04.720 --> 00:34:05.920
Yeah, no imposter syndrome.
00:34:06.079 --> 00:34:07.359
We all we're always working on that.
00:34:07.519 --> 00:34:08.159
Right.
00:34:08.719 --> 00:34:14.639
And the show is co-produced by the one and only Jennifer Love Hewitt, your longtime co-star on 911.
00:34:14.719 --> 00:34:16.880
But obviously, above all, she's a friend.
00:34:17.119 --> 00:34:19.679
Can you just talk a little about what she means to you?
00:34:20.000 --> 00:34:25.840
She really is, I believe, one of the reasons I've remained on the show for so long.
00:34:26.000 --> 00:34:32.480
The first day I walked in, I play her co-worker on the show, really her bet, you know, her best friend, um, and her boss.
00:34:32.639 --> 00:34:37.760
Um, she the first day said, I when I saw that you were cast, I went and watched a bunch of your things.
00:34:37.840 --> 00:34:38.719
You're so funny.
00:34:38.960 --> 00:34:42.320
Immediately put me at ease because that is a 911 is a giant show.
00:34:42.480 --> 00:34:45.840
You know, it's Jennifer, it's Angela Bassett, it's just huge.
00:34:46.000 --> 00:34:48.159
Ryan Murphy, Tim Manier.
00:34:48.719 --> 00:34:57.679
Um, and she put me at ease absolutely immediately and just really like took me under her wing in such a way that just felt beautiful.
00:34:57.840 --> 00:35:01.199
She's, by the way, a really savvy business person.
00:35:01.440 --> 00:35:04.159
She is a hilarious person.
00:35:04.239 --> 00:35:06.480
She's so funny, so sweet.
00:35:06.639 --> 00:35:10.000
And she just has always had my back, and I've always wanted to have hers.
00:35:10.079 --> 00:35:12.079
And she just believes in me so much.
00:35:12.159 --> 00:35:15.119
And I go to her with everything, frankly.
00:35:15.280 --> 00:35:19.760
I she really has changed my life in many ways, in in in really wonderful ways.
00:35:20.320 --> 00:35:22.079
Sure, she feels the same about you.
00:35:22.159 --> 00:35:27.280
And what was her reaction to seeing this show or seeing the script of this show when you uh approached her?
00:35:27.599 --> 00:35:29.599
You know, I didn't even approach her, is the thing.
00:35:29.679 --> 00:35:31.199
I would never do something like that.
00:35:31.360 --> 00:35:35.599
Um, I would never go up to someone and be like, I need your help, like ever.
00:35:36.159 --> 00:35:39.920
She knew that I was like doing the show and had even heard about it.
00:35:40.079 --> 00:35:47.519
And she approached me and said, I want to be a part of it, which blew me away because it was never, I would have never asked something like that of her.
00:35:47.760 --> 00:35:48.719
Or anyone.
00:35:48.880 --> 00:35:54.639
I'm not, I'm still getting comfortable with asking people for things if I need something, but it was her idea.
00:35:54.800 --> 00:36:00.239
And so I was only blown away with how flattered I was that she wanted to be a part of this.
00:36:00.320 --> 00:36:02.400
And she's been promoting it and pushing it.
00:36:02.480 --> 00:36:04.400
And I mean, I never saw this coming.
00:36:04.559 --> 00:36:07.519
And it it, but it, you know, it also just speaks to her character.
00:36:07.599 --> 00:36:11.119
Like she's a great friend, she's a great ally, she's a great support system.
00:36:11.199 --> 00:36:12.719
It it's just been overwhelming.
00:36:12.960 --> 00:36:17.679
She's an icon, especially for for our age group and everyone who watched those shows in the 90s and early 2000s.
00:36:17.840 --> 00:36:20.960
Do you have a favorite role, not including 911 of hers?
00:36:21.679 --> 00:36:22.480
Oh God.
00:36:22.639 --> 00:36:26.559
I I mean, Party of Five was so my jam growing up.
00:36:26.719 --> 00:36:29.840
I loved it so much, and I loved her on it.
00:36:30.079 --> 00:36:33.840
Um, also the movie Heartbreakers is absolutely brilliant.
00:36:33.920 --> 00:36:37.519
If you've never seen her, it's her and Sigourney Weaver, who are like conning people out of money.
00:36:37.599 --> 00:36:39.440
It's so fun and so good.
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:46.960
Uh yeah, I it's so funny because every gay guy I knew growing up wanted to be friends with her, and every straight guy I knew wanted to be with her.
00:36:47.119 --> 00:36:48.559
She has that thing, you know.
00:36:48.719 --> 00:36:50.559
She was such a such an icon, still is.
00:36:50.800 --> 00:36:52.400
Can't Hardly Wait is mine, yeah.
00:36:52.559 --> 00:36:53.440
Oh my God.
00:36:53.679 --> 00:36:54.159
Best.
00:36:54.400 --> 00:36:57.679
I would say Heathers and Can't Hardly Wait are like the best teen movies ever.
00:36:57.920 --> 00:36:58.639
Brilliant, brilliant.
00:36:58.800 --> 00:36:59.039
All right.
00:36:59.119 --> 00:37:05.360
Well, switching gears, and this is a bit of a hard turn, but I always, you know, we have this in common.
00:37:05.519 --> 00:37:07.280
You've been partnered for a few years now.
00:37:07.360 --> 00:37:11.840
You're bi-coastal, but you were also an alum of gay divorce, as am I.
00:37:12.079 --> 00:37:14.960
And I know that was a while ago, and you were not married for a long time.
00:37:15.119 --> 00:37:20.000
But how has divorce shaped your path forward as far as dating and life goes?
00:37:20.159 --> 00:37:23.519
And how did it impact your people pleasing struggles?
00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:30.079
I believe that it impacted me in the way that I really needed.
00:37:30.239 --> 00:37:32.800
If I wanted to be in a relationship, this is what I learned from it.
00:37:32.960 --> 00:37:36.159
If I wanted to be in a relationship, I had to be in a relationship.
00:37:36.320 --> 00:37:40.400
I had to actually make it a priority and not be so selfish in it.
00:37:40.559 --> 00:37:57.679
Um, I don't even know if my partner, my ex-husband, I guess I'll say, would agree with that assessment, but I I think I realized that that relationship never really had the same level of seriousness as, for instance, me trying to make my career and have my career.
00:37:57.760 --> 00:38:01.920
And I definitely put it on the back burner and I just didn't take it seriously enough.
00:38:02.239 --> 00:38:05.599
And so, um I don't know that I set out necessarily.
00:38:05.760 --> 00:38:07.519
Like I wasn't, it's like every story.
00:38:07.599 --> 00:38:11.280
I wasn't looking for a relationship when I met my now partner.
00:38:11.679 --> 00:38:16.320
Uh in fact, you know, we met on a hookup app and it grew from there.
00:38:16.559 --> 00:38:25.199
But I definitely realized through that I need to be, if I want to actually see someone seriously, I have to take it seriously.
00:38:25.280 --> 00:38:37.840
I have to really be in it and an and a literal partner in this and not be like, oh, I can't do it because I have this thing on my mind, and oh, I can't because I have a, oh, I can't meet your friends tonight because I, you know, uh, I have to get this joke right.
00:38:38.000 --> 00:38:39.840
Like, no, there's time for both.
00:38:40.159 --> 00:38:41.119
Thank you for sharing that.
00:38:41.199 --> 00:38:41.760
I appreciate it.
00:38:41.920 --> 00:38:44.159
And we'll close with some more fun stuff.
00:38:44.400 --> 00:38:48.880
Uh, this show is also really unique because you are on stage by yourself.
00:38:49.039 --> 00:38:55.920
You're not in a TV show with an ensemble, you're not podcasting with your two podcast co-hosts with Ask Rana and Attitudes.
00:38:56.079 --> 00:38:59.760
Did it feel like now was the right time to step out sort of solo into the spotlight?
00:38:59.920 --> 00:39:00.719
How did you know?
00:39:01.039 --> 00:39:04.960
Yes, it did feel like the right time in a few ways.
00:39:05.199 --> 00:39:14.880
I have always been in ensembles or partnerships, and I am so lucky for it because both of those podcasts have made me funnier, have made me quicker.
00:39:15.039 --> 00:39:21.920
It's essentially like doing improv every week, at a at especially because they're so hilarious at a high level.
00:39:22.159 --> 00:39:30.880
So my brain is is at least when I do the podcast, you know, fire, all synapses are firing off, you know, and then the rest of the time I'm in bed and dumb.
00:39:31.119 --> 00:39:33.199
But for those hours every week, I'm not.
00:39:33.360 --> 00:39:39.199
Being a part of an ensemble is the best because that's how you make friends and do all these things.
00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:43.840
But I will say, I was definitely craving doing something solo.
00:39:44.079 --> 00:39:46.000
First of all, to just make sure I could still do it.
00:39:46.159 --> 00:39:57.920
And second of all, um, I just wanted to only rely on myself for something, not have to run jokes past anybody, except an audience, obviously, but not have to, you know, just be uncompromising with what I wanted to do.
00:39:58.159 --> 00:40:05.360
And even saying that out loud, I'm just so happy I did it because the show is uniquely me.
00:40:05.519 --> 00:40:06.559
It is all me.
00:40:06.719 --> 00:40:08.800
Um, it is my sense of humor.
00:40:09.360 --> 00:40:11.199
And I don't know.
00:40:11.280 --> 00:40:14.000
It's been, it's been just a cool process in that way.
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:19.920
But I sort of was just like, uh, I want to do something by myself and for myself, and hopefully people like it.
00:40:20.000 --> 00:40:22.159
But if they don't, at least I did it, you know?
00:40:22.559 --> 00:40:28.079
You're obviously a talented writer and you aren't scared to like dig into your past and be funny and vulnerable.
00:40:28.239 --> 00:40:29.360
Those are my favorite books.
00:40:29.519 --> 00:40:38.480
Do you think that there are more stories to tell where you would possibly do a full-fledged memoir or a book of essays, like your uh co-host Erin Gibson with her feministy book?
00:40:38.719 --> 00:40:40.079
Yeah, oh God, that was such a good book.
00:40:40.239 --> 00:40:42.400
Um, I I think I would like to do that.
00:40:42.559 --> 00:40:47.679
I've always thought it'd be more fun to write a novel, frankly, but I don't think I could ever actually do that.
00:40:47.840 --> 00:40:54.880
I have a friend who's a very successful novelist, and the work she puts it, I'm immediately like, I have my ADHD is way too severe for something like that.
00:40:54.960 --> 00:40:55.679
I I don't know.
00:40:55.840 --> 00:41:03.440
I could maybe do like, yes, a memoir or essays or something, but um I don't know because I also feel like, well, I've already said everything.
00:41:03.599 --> 00:41:05.760
I have a podcast twice a week.
00:41:06.159 --> 00:41:08.480
I am on stage every night.
00:41:08.639 --> 00:41:10.000
I don't know what's left to say.
00:41:10.159 --> 00:41:17.119
I mean, I guess it would be nice for it to be bound in a book, but I don't know that I have any more insights than the ones I've already delivered, you know?
00:41:18.000 --> 00:41:18.800
But you know what?
00:41:18.880 --> 00:41:19.599
I'll take the paycheck.
00:41:19.840 --> 00:41:23.199
Yeah, you'd have to probably cull through a lot of old episodes, but that could be fun.
00:41:23.280 --> 00:41:26.159
I'm sure there's a lot of hidden gems that you've probably forgotten you've even said.
00:41:26.400 --> 00:41:26.800
That's true.
00:41:26.880 --> 00:41:28.480
No, uh, it it would be a lot of fun.
00:41:28.559 --> 00:41:29.519
It would be a lot of fun, yeah.
00:41:29.679 --> 00:41:31.440
Now, you and I love the same people.
00:41:31.599 --> 00:41:35.599
I listen to you all the time whenever you're on Michelle Collins podcast.
00:41:35.760 --> 00:41:36.960
She is like one of my queens.
00:41:37.119 --> 00:41:37.920
I just adore her.
00:41:38.079 --> 00:41:42.000
And then I subscribe to Garbage World with Casey and Danielle.
00:41:42.239 --> 00:41:42.639
Of course.
00:41:42.880 --> 00:41:49.519
Uh can you just describe your comedy community and who you have found kinship with through the years?
00:41:49.840 --> 00:41:55.519
Anyone who makes me belly laugh, Michelle Collins provides that for me.
00:41:55.760 --> 00:42:00.159
Um, we were sort of fans of each other for a very long time.
00:42:00.320 --> 00:42:01.920
She's the funniest person alive.
00:42:02.079 --> 00:42:04.639
I mean, just she is, period.
00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:06.239
She's a joke machine.
00:42:06.400 --> 00:42:07.599
We've traveled together.
00:42:07.760 --> 00:42:10.320
I just love her and she's inspiring.
00:42:10.480 --> 00:42:11.840
I mean, so quick.
00:42:12.000 --> 00:42:13.440
She lays it all out there for you.
00:42:13.599 --> 00:42:21.599
I don't at some point I am sure she will have a daytime show and she will be the next, you know, Wendy Williams, because we are desperately in need of that.
00:42:21.679 --> 00:42:25.360
But she's honest, she's herself, and I I just love everything about her.
00:42:25.440 --> 00:42:26.960
Uh she's the funniest person alive.
00:42:27.119 --> 00:42:32.559
And the bitch sesh ladies, the garbage world ladies, I've known for years through UCB.
00:42:32.639 --> 00:42:34.320
And actually, Casey went to NYU as well.
00:42:34.400 --> 00:42:35.119
Actually, both of them did.
00:42:35.199 --> 00:42:35.840
They went to NYU.
00:42:35.920 --> 00:42:37.840
I didn't know them in school, but they both went there.
00:42:38.000 --> 00:43:01.280
And again, I mean, just hilarious women that I was completely drawn to, which is why I have, I mean, I have always been a housewives fan in that way, because I think some of the best dialogue on television, you get to see these somewhat accomplished women be messy and rude, but also funny and also sweet, and all of these things where I don't know, it's like the reality show Bridesmaids, you know?
00:43:01.519 --> 00:43:02.880
Um, and I love that.
00:43:02.960 --> 00:43:06.880
And I think Casey and Danielle appreciate that too, and also exude that.
00:43:06.960 --> 00:43:17.599
It's it's so funny watching these two incredibly successful women who really are elegant in so many ways, but also be extremely real, raw, and relatable.
00:43:17.760 --> 00:43:19.440
It's my favorite combo.
00:43:19.599 --> 00:43:20.639
So I don't know.
00:43:20.800 --> 00:43:22.079
They're I just think they're brilliant.
00:43:22.320 --> 00:43:22.559
I agree.
00:43:22.639 --> 00:43:28.239
And I agree that Michelle should have her own talk show because she uh did not get a fair shot on the view.
00:43:28.320 --> 00:43:30.159
And I thought she was brilliant on the view.
00:43:30.239 --> 00:43:31.519
And I think we need her voice.
00:43:31.599 --> 00:43:35.199
And I actually, when I um interviewed Rosie, I mentioned Michelle.
00:43:35.360 --> 00:43:44.239
And I don't know if she's spoken with you about this, but Rosie said that they're inviting all the hosts back next year next year for the 30th anniversary and that she's gonna do it.
00:43:44.320 --> 00:43:46.559
And I said, Well, I hope Michelle does.
00:43:47.280 --> 00:43:48.800
Yeah, I do too.
00:43:49.039 --> 00:43:51.440
Michelle to me, Michelle's so brilliant.
00:43:51.599 --> 00:43:53.280
She has to have her own show, I think.
00:43:53.360 --> 00:43:56.159
Like I want, you know, I just want to read her book.
00:43:56.480 --> 00:43:56.880
Yeah.
00:43:57.440 --> 00:43:58.239
Me too.
00:43:58.480 --> 00:43:58.719
All right.
00:43:58.960 --> 00:43:59.199
Me too.
00:43:59.360 --> 00:44:06.719
So This show, The Tangle, I ask all my guests what you're currently tangled in that you're loving, immersing yourself in, binge watching, reading, listening to.
00:44:06.880 --> 00:44:10.159
And then what's something frustrating that you're trying to get untangled from right now?
00:44:10.480 --> 00:44:10.719
Yeah.
00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:14.480
So the things I'm obsessed with right now are pretty basic.
00:44:14.639 --> 00:44:17.840
Uh below deck Mediterranean is something I am completely obsessed with.
00:44:17.920 --> 00:44:23.519
I've never been a low below deck person until this season, which Michelle actually was like, you absolutely have to watch it.
00:44:23.679 --> 00:44:25.280
I mean, my television's gotten so trashy.
00:44:25.360 --> 00:44:27.440
I was obviously, of course, obsessed with Widows Bay.
00:44:27.840 --> 00:44:31.760
Brilliant beyond Katie, anything Katie Dippold touches, I'm in on.
00:44:33.039 --> 00:44:36.320
Oh, ugh, in a really awful way.
00:44:36.800 --> 00:44:41.519
I am very straight bro coded lately because I'm obsessed with Mary Beard.
00:44:41.599 --> 00:44:44.320
She writes all these books about ancient Rome.
00:44:44.639 --> 00:44:45.280
Kill me.
00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:48.239
And I'm obsessed with ancient Rome.
00:44:48.480 --> 00:44:50.559
S PQR, I'm all in on.
00:44:50.719 --> 00:44:53.599
That's one of, you know, that's probably her biggest book that she did.
00:44:53.760 --> 00:44:56.000
I'm reading one right now called The Twelve Caesars.
00:44:56.239 --> 00:45:00.320
I mean, there's something deeply disgusting about me that I'm so interested in this stuff.
00:45:00.480 --> 00:45:04.719
But to me, it is all so campy and draggy, and they're, they were nuts.
00:45:04.880 --> 00:45:18.239
One of the emperors killed um, he had a dinner party for people for people that he wanted dead, and he released literal tons of flower petals from the ceiling, and they got smothered to death by flower petals.
00:45:18.400 --> 00:45:20.400
Like these people were nuts.
00:45:21.280 --> 00:45:22.639
And I can't get enough of it.
00:45:22.880 --> 00:45:28.960
You have a brilliant imagination if because that is a bit uncommon, that that interest, that you're the first person who has said that.
00:45:29.840 --> 00:45:35.760
And they thought that, like, that they thought that like the way they could prove their power was by eating the weirdest things.
00:45:35.920 --> 00:45:39.760
So they would eat like flamingo brains, because that was the most exotic thing they could find.
00:45:39.920 --> 00:45:41.280
Like just weird ass shit.
00:45:41.440 --> 00:45:42.800
So it's that and Bravo.
00:45:43.119 --> 00:45:45.599
And now I've only watched The Housewives the last couple years.
00:45:45.760 --> 00:45:47.360
My best friend gotten in got me into it.
00:45:47.440 --> 00:45:52.559
And I only have seen all of Salt Lake City, which she he was like, that's the number one.
00:45:52.800 --> 00:45:52.960
Great.
00:45:53.119 --> 00:45:57.840
And then I've seen the last couple of Potomac because I used to work with a lot of the Potomac ladies here in DC.
00:45:58.159 --> 00:46:02.000
And then I saw like seasons three through, I think he said 11 of New York.
00:46:02.079 --> 00:46:03.280
He was like, those are the good years.
00:46:03.519 --> 00:46:05.519
Now, will you be watching The Golden Life?
00:46:05.920 --> 00:46:06.800
I don't know.
00:46:06.960 --> 00:46:09.920
I really, I really cannot stand Ramona.
00:46:10.000 --> 00:46:10.960
I just have to say it.
00:46:11.119 --> 00:46:12.559
I cannot stomach her.
00:46:12.800 --> 00:46:14.400
I might, I might take a peek.
00:46:14.480 --> 00:46:15.360
I might take a peek.
00:46:15.519 --> 00:46:18.639
But I'll be watching because I love, for instance, Luann.
00:46:19.360 --> 00:46:20.480
Uh yeah, I'll watch.
00:46:20.559 --> 00:46:21.760
I'll I mean, I don't know.
00:46:21.840 --> 00:46:26.159
That's the New York season on Bravo looks nuts because of all the Epstein stuff.
00:46:26.239 --> 00:46:28.719
And, you know, I'm curious to see how she's gonna handle that.
00:46:28.880 --> 00:46:35.360
Uh, but no, I'll, you know, I'll probably take a peek at Golden Life and maybe I'll see some clicks, clips that Ramona's not in.
00:46:35.440 --> 00:46:38.480
But uh yes, I will probably watch New York on Bravo.
00:46:38.719 --> 00:46:38.800
Yeah.
00:46:38.960 --> 00:46:40.159
What are your thoughts on the Emmys?
00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:43.519
And I've been asking a lot of my guests because we have a lot of this in common.
00:46:43.599 --> 00:46:47.840
The the Gene Smart versus Lisa Coudreau, my favorite show of all time, the comeback.
00:46:47.920 --> 00:46:48.639
It's it's brutal.
00:46:48.880 --> 00:46:49.360
It's brutal.
00:46:49.440 --> 00:46:50.719
To me, it's an easy choice.
00:46:50.880 --> 00:46:52.079
To me, it's Lisa Coudreau.
00:46:52.159 --> 00:46:54.960
I she is absolutely I mean, Gene Smart is brilliant.
00:46:55.039 --> 00:46:57.280
And I don't even mean this in a spread the wealth kind of thing.
00:46:57.360 --> 00:46:59.039
Like Gene Smart has obviously won before.
00:46:59.119 --> 00:47:03.679
I believe that if you gave the best performance of the year, you should win it, no matter how many times you won.
00:47:03.840 --> 00:47:05.440
Gene Smart is a genius.
00:47:05.519 --> 00:47:08.239
Lisa Coudreau does something I've never seen before.
00:47:08.960 --> 00:47:16.960
The way she expresses vulnerability when her eyes go blank and she's smiling, as Valerie Charish, is something I've never seen before.
00:47:17.280 --> 00:47:29.360
The way she truthfully and honestly is trying to figure out wanting to work and also drawing a line on this third season with the AI stuff is captivating.
00:47:29.519 --> 00:47:37.119
When she goes into the office to meet with the execs who want her to take a stand against it, just everything happens on her face.
00:47:37.280 --> 00:47:43.440
An entire conversation happens on Valerie Cherish's face anytime she's asked a question, before she even says a word.
00:47:43.599 --> 00:47:45.199
I've never seen anything like it.
00:47:45.440 --> 00:47:55.199
And that show is it's so funny because it keeps coming back because it is a cult phenomenon, but also yet it still remains very underrated, you know?
00:47:55.360 --> 00:47:56.079
It's wild.
00:47:56.480 --> 00:47:59.360
Only got two Emmy nominations, but she also got nominated for writing.
00:47:59.440 --> 00:48:05.840
And yeah, she's just astounding how her eyes just she'll be making you laugh, and then she has watery eyes all of a sudden, and you like want to cry.
00:48:06.000 --> 00:48:06.719
I I agree.
00:48:06.880 --> 00:48:09.920
Yeah, was there anything frustrating that you're working to get untangled from?
00:48:10.079 --> 00:48:10.960
Anything annoying right now?
00:48:11.199 --> 00:48:12.719
So many annoying things.
00:48:13.039 --> 00:48:17.760
Um, one thing is my my friend just had a baby and her husband was out of town.
00:48:17.840 --> 00:48:18.559
That's annoying.
00:48:18.719 --> 00:48:21.599
And I feel like he should have come to down for it.
00:48:21.840 --> 00:48:23.440
So that's deeply annoying.
00:48:23.760 --> 00:48:34.719
Uh one thing I'd like to get untangled from is um paying for I'm having to fly a lot right now because on my days off in the New York show, I'm flying to LA doing 911.
00:48:35.039 --> 00:48:38.719
So I'm on a plane constantly these days, going from one coast to the next.
00:48:38.880 --> 00:48:45.440
And I have to say, one thing that makes me absolutely furious is you know how there's levels of things that you pay for on planes.
00:48:45.519 --> 00:48:51.840
For instance, like there's obviously first class or business class, then there's uh economy plus, now there's like a premiere option.
00:48:52.079 --> 00:49:00.400
But then there's the part of the cabin that's called preferred, which is just the regular seat that if you basically want an aisle anymore, you have to pay like$80.
00:49:00.880 --> 00:49:04.400
That shit drives me absolutely crazy.
00:49:04.800 --> 00:49:13.920
This whole idea that there's no longer a middle class option on airplanes that will treat you with any respect is so disgusting to me and so upsetting.
00:49:14.079 --> 00:49:14.800
It's awful.
00:49:15.039 --> 00:49:20.079
Like flying really is they just more and more increasingly just want to cater to the rich.
00:49:20.320 --> 00:49:26.880
It's like, for instance, even with the luxury designers now, I mean, they'll charge$3,000 because that's how they make their money and that's who they want to cater to.
00:49:26.960 --> 00:49:34.639
It was like that whole thing when those Christian Dior um tote bags, you found out they were making them for$13 and selling them for$2,500.
00:49:34.800 --> 00:49:35.840
Like it's sick.
00:49:36.000 --> 00:49:36.559
It's sick.
00:49:36.800 --> 00:49:40.239
So I would say price gouging is absolutely nasty these days.
00:49:40.480 --> 00:49:41.679
Glad you got that off your chest.
00:49:41.840 --> 00:49:42.480
Thank you.
00:49:42.719 --> 00:49:43.280
Thank you.
00:49:43.599 --> 00:49:45.360
This has been such a pleasure, Brian.
00:49:45.519 --> 00:49:46.639
I really appreciate your time.
00:49:46.960 --> 00:49:50.559
For me, honestly, thank you for having me on.
00:49:50.719 --> 00:49:51.760
I love your show.
00:49:51.920 --> 00:49:54.800
I love your guests, and I love your interviews, truly.
00:49:56.320 --> 00:49:57.119
Thank you, Brian.
00:49:57.199 --> 00:49:59.519
Make sure to check out his one-man show, Are You Mad at Me?
00:49:59.599 --> 00:50:03.199
And make sure to check out his podcast and his work on 9-1-1 every week.
00:50:03.360 --> 00:50:06.320
He is a delight, and I so enjoyed speaking with him.
00:50:06.559 --> 00:50:18.960
Now, uh, I told you I was gonna share some personal news that I didn't want to bog down the beginning of this episode with because uh we have so many new viewers and we usually keep it light, although I do say we go deep and we go shallow on this show.
00:50:19.199 --> 00:50:31.519
But uh last week I interviewed Rosie on Thursday, and I had known about it for about um probably a week, but I had also known for the past week that I was going to have to put down my dog River.
00:50:32.320 --> 00:50:35.679
Uh he is, I always called him my dream dog.
00:50:35.760 --> 00:50:44.559
He is just um yeah, he's I've had him I had him only six and a half years.
00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:47.280
I got him in January of 2020.
00:50:47.440 --> 00:50:52.960
I met him in September of 2019 when I first went to the rescue league and and saw him.
00:50:53.199 --> 00:51:10.960
And he was kept in, it was a backyard breeder type of situation that had a bunch of dogs that they rescued, and he had he couldn't really walk when I first met him, so that's why it took a few months for me to take him home because he had to have two FHO surgeries on his um hind legs, his hips, where they removed the femur.
00:51:11.119 --> 00:51:16.559
Uh so I ended up getting him in January of 2020, right before the pandemic, and he's been with me ever since.
00:51:16.639 --> 00:51:23.199
And, you know, we went through my divorce then, and he was really my my right-hand boy, and he was probably eight or nine years old.
00:51:23.280 --> 00:51:35.920
He was a pinkese mix with mixed with a poodle, but he looked just was like a gremlin type of dog with a really smushy face and those long, gorgeous ears and big bright eyes, and he had one white paw.
00:51:36.159 --> 00:51:45.119
And uh, I don't want to get too emotional, but you know, I have volunteered with rescue leagues throughout my life.
00:51:45.199 --> 00:51:59.280
I was at VetTech in college, and I actually used to have to hold animals when they were put down, so I know how peaceful of a process it is, but you never, you never know, you know, the that grief, I think, until you lose one of your your own dogs.
00:51:59.519 --> 00:52:02.559
And I just, you know, I have three dogs.
00:52:02.719 --> 00:52:05.440
I I felt like he was the the heart of the house.
00:52:07.280 --> 00:52:14.800
He was just such an a laid-back kind, I don't want to say like pushover, but you could just do whatever you want.
00:52:14.960 --> 00:52:19.199
Any dog could come in and do whatever they want, and he just minded himself and was very loving.
00:52:19.360 --> 00:52:21.760
He was such a calming dog.
00:52:22.000 --> 00:52:23.840
Um so much more than a dog.
00:52:28.559 --> 00:52:35.280
And I know I wanted to speak about him on the show just because I mean I just I don't really have the words.
00:52:36.079 --> 00:52:38.239
He slept in my bed every single night.
00:52:38.480 --> 00:52:43.039
You know, when I worked in TV, I basically lived off naps, so I would come home.
00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:44.320
I'd wake up at 3 a.m.
00:52:44.480 --> 00:52:59.920
and I'd come home around noon or one, and he would take a nap with me every day, and he uh would just always rest his his head on my my my shoulder or my lap, and he would paw at me when he wanted a treat, and he was just the most gentle, sweet, sweet boy.
00:53:00.159 --> 00:53:02.719
And uh he just had a lot of health issues.
00:53:02.800 --> 00:53:26.079
He had thyroid issues, and then he had um neurological issues over the past several months where he just he's lost use of his back leg, so I ended up having to carry him everywhere, and uh he was messing himself and I would have to clean him, and so he was basically dragging himself around and tried a bunch of stuff, but I just knew it wasn't going to uh I knew that it wasn't fair to him.
00:53:26.320 --> 00:53:33.440
So lost him last Monday, and then I obviously my whole phone is just full of photos of him.
00:53:33.679 --> 00:53:49.440
So I put together uh just a a small collage of of some of my favorite photos of him, and I put it on Instagram if you want to see it, uh, with a song attached, and I guess that would lead to my tangled in my tangled in song section.
00:53:49.599 --> 00:53:54.079
And it's a beautiful song, it's called One Moment More, and it's from Mindy Smith.
00:53:55.760 --> 00:54:01.519
Uh and I I I sort of just want you to go listen to it and to get the sentiment.
00:54:01.679 --> 00:54:07.519
The lyrics go, Hold me, even though I know you're leaving, and show me all the reasons you would stay.
00:54:12.480 --> 00:54:16.400
It's just enough to feel your breath on mine to warm my soul and ease my mind.
00:54:16.639 --> 00:54:18.880
You've gotta hold me and show me how.
00:54:21.360 --> 00:54:24.559
Tell me how someday you'll be returning, and maybe I'll believe.
00:54:24.800 --> 00:54:28.079
It's just enough to see a shooting star to know you're never really far.
00:54:28.159 --> 00:54:31.599
It's just enough to see a shooting star to know you're never really gone.
00:54:42.000 --> 00:54:43.360
I'll leave it at that.
00:54:43.679 --> 00:54:48.880
But again, just a whirlwind type of week.
00:54:49.119 --> 00:54:52.880
Just emotionally the ups and downs, and I just he really has my heart in.
00:54:54.880 --> 00:54:58.079
I just feel like a different person, I guess, without him.
00:54:58.639 --> 00:55:07.440
So I would dedicate this episode and that song and so much to uh my little river boy.
00:55:09.920 --> 00:55:11.119
Okay, guys.
00:55:14.320 --> 00:55:15.920
We're gonna be back next week.
00:55:16.079 --> 00:55:17.360
Thank you all for listening.
00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:25.119
Uh, I know all the new listeners, uh, this is my first time really crying crying on the show, so you chose uh an interesting week to join.
00:55:25.199 --> 00:55:27.840
But thank you for sticking around and listening to this.
00:55:28.079 --> 00:55:30.000
We will have a lot more fun next week.
00:55:30.159 --> 00:55:31.280
You take care of yourselves.
00:55:31.440 --> 00:55:34.639
Until then, uh, I will see and speak with you soon.