Ep. 5 - The Mindset That Created a 29-Time Grand Slam Champion (Guest David Wagner)

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Welcome back or welcome to the Serve in the Future show.
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My name is Ryan Redondo, and I'm the co-host with Steve Adamson.
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And we want to thank our producer, Jackson Ginn, for putting this together.
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And we have a very special guest today, David Wagner.
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David Wagner is a very friend uh special friend to Youth Tennis San Diego and the Barnes Tennis Center.
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It's where we're at today.
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Um I don't know if I can even give you an intro.
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I'd just say he's a legend.
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He is a legend.
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And I think that's a good idea.
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I will just give like a five second.
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That's been that's plenty.
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Most importantly, he's he's a great friend of ours.
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Um, but for the context of the show and why um we wanted to have him on and why we're privileged to have him on, is he has won 20 plus grand slams.
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Um he's been meddling in the Paralympics since 2004.
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Yeah.
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Is that your first grand uh goal?
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Yeah, 04.
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04, um, all the way through.
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So when you talk about um the pinnacle, the the top of the iceberg, everything you can talk about, this slippery slope, you've been on it.
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And we want to find out what that feels like, you know, what it's like, how'd you get there, um, and so forth.
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So thank you for being here.
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Yeah, thanks for letting me uh join you guys.
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This is gonna be fun.
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I'm excited.
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Oh, yeah.
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Well, first question.
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We're here at Barnes.
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We're in this Inspire 360 lab.
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I forgot to talk about that.
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Yes, but um when did you first play here?
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Oh boy.
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Um, let's see.
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Barnes Tennis Center used to host the wheelchair US Open.
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Uh it it came from the Racquet Club of Irvine and moved to Barnes and it would have been so I didn't play it in Irvine.
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So my first year here would have been oh one.
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Okay.
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Oh, one?
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Yeah, so I've I've been here training, being now playing out of Barnes since 2001.
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So uh yeah, a long, long time.
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And that's like six years after it opened, right?
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I think we opened in 95 years.
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So yeah.
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So uh you must have been like five years old, right?
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Yeah, yeah.
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I was brand new born baby, toddler.
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Exactly.
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Yeah, well, how'd you know?
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So tell so tell us, all right.
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So 2001, when did you start playing wheelchair tennis?
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So I got injured in '95, and it um took me about four years to find wheelchair tennis.
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Not because I I didn't love tennis or or want to play it, I just really didn't know anything about it.
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Um, and so I started playing ping pong table tennis with my buddies in rehab and really got that competitive itch again, and found a magazine, uh thumbing through a magazine called Sports and Spokes, which is like sports illustrated for disabled athletes.
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And uh saw an ad for a clinic up in Beaverton, Oregon at Twalton Hills Parks and Rec and went there, and that would have been 99, so four years after I got hurt.
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And I learned from uh Randy Snow, the one of the all-time greats in the in the United States, but not just in the States, in the world.
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Yeah.
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Uh Randy Snow is like, I mean, you talk about a legend.
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And uh yeah, great guy, and just learned from the best at the time.
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And then when I hit that first tennis ball, uh ironically, I hit the first tennis ball without strapping the racket to my hand.
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And I thought, there is no way in hell a quadriplegic plays wheelchair tennis.
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Like a paraplegic who can hold the racket, I get it.
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But someone like myself who has a limited grip strength, um, I was like, no way.
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So the racket flew out of my hand.
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They taught me how to then tape the racket to my hand, and then it was a whole nother ball game.
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Now the racket stayed steady, it was strong.
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What's the percentage of um strength or grip strength?
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Yeah, my grip strength runs at about 30% of what I guess you would say the average normal hand strength would be.
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Okay.
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So so I'm I'm very incomplete quadriplegic.
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I just can't um I can't like open them all the way and I can't close them all the way and snap and do do fine intrinsic motor things with my fingers.
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Um but my wrists are pretty strong, so that helps for sure.
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Um uh my shoulders, my arms, all of that.
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It's really the grip strength was was an issue.
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Um so I learned in '99 the sport, and then I was finishing college at Walla Walla University, and I I did finish my last two years there and got my education degree, elementary education degree, and my mom kind of directed me like, do you want to be trying the tennis and see where you can go?
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Or do you want to go get your job and start teaching?
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Let's try tennis.
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You had a you went to university to become a to become a teacher.
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Elementary education.
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Yeah, yeah, yeah.
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So I did my student teaching in third, fourth multi-grade, and uh enjoyed it, but it was challenging.
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Uh I I learned quickly that being in a wheelchair and teaching was a big challenge.
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And and uh I loved the kids.
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I've always loved teaching and being with the kids, but it was it was just a challenge being that I was at their level, first of all, and all day long they're just yapping away, you know, and it's right in your face.
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And and and and it's no offense to the kids, right?
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They're just being kids, but at the end of the day, I would go home and I just wanted to sit in a dark, quiet room because it was it was a lot.
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And um, and then I also realized too that I had a struggle with um how to set up the classroom to be accessible to every child.
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So that that was always a challenge for me.
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So the desk was always in the way, or I couldn't get down one row of desk to get to a child.
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So I I quickly learned that it was a challenge uh that that was a a physical barrier challenge that that really I felt set me back a little bit.
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So the best option I made was a big U shape with the desks, and then I sat in the middle of the U and could relatively get to each kid, but I was on the other side of their desk.
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So I couldn't give them a hug, or you know, I couldn't hide five unless I was reaching across.
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So it was a challenge from that perspective.
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Uh, but but yeah, my mom really encouraged me to go try professional wheelchair tennis.
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And I played my first tournament over in uh Baton Rouge, Louisiana.
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Nice in uh kind of more the recreational level of wheelchair tennis in the United States.
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So we have lettered divisions and it's A, B, C, and D and I and Quad A.
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So I played in the quad A's that that year, played four events and uh uh luckily won all four, made some great friends, made some good doubles partners, and then the following year moved up into the open category.
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Awesome.
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Can can you um just uh make it uh clear for the listeners as far as like the different divisions in the wheelchair tennis?
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Yeah.
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So you had like a the open quad.
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Yeah.
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So so in wheelchair tennis, there really is only two categories based on your disability.
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There's a men's open and a women's open, and then that that category would be for people uh with lower body impairments only.
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Okay, so missing a leg, maybe paralyzed really low from the waist down only, uh, or or maybe mid mid-stomach or or something, but no impairment in their hands or their arms in any way, shape, or form.
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So that would be your men and your women's open based on gender.
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Uh and then the the only category change is for quad open, and that's for quadriplegics or individuals who have impairment in upper body limbs as well as lower body limbs.
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So you still have to qualify for wheelchair tennis in general.
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So you have to have you have to have lower body impairment.
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You couldn't be like uh missing one arm and have completely normal functioning legs and play wheelchair tennis.
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You wouldn't classify for the sport itself.
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Okay.
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So you have to have an impairment that limits your ability to run, walk, move, mobility, standing, basically.
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Uh and so so you get classed into wheelchair tennis as a sport, and then there's a subclass for uh getting into the the quadriplegic division or the quad open division.
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Yeah.
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Okay, got it.
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And did the um did the like the slams, did they always have open and quad, or was that were you part of that?
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Yeah, that's that's a good question.
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That mission to uh make the quad uh an event in the slams.
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I uh I I wish I could say we were always in from the get-go.
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Uh this is this is the 50th year of wheelchair tennis as a as a sport in general.
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2026.
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Yeah, yeah.
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This is the 50-year anniversary.
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I'm surprised.
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Um or maybe not surprised that I didn't know that because of marketing or something.
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I mean genuine.
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You start to see it because we just put out a flyer for the 50 year, and we're doing something here, uh celebratory thing on July 11th, I think it is.
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I know that we're doing that here, but like this is world for tennis.
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Yeah, yeah.
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I mean, that is a huge huge scale.
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Yeah, I mean, it it's impressive, right?
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So 50 years.
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50 years.
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And and think about if you go back and look at the guys playing in the 70s, they're playing in your what you would see as like a traditional hospital wheelchair.
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Without a sports chair, yeah, without and hence, hence why back then the two bounce rule also really was important.
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Um so so wheelchair tennis, we get two bounces if we need it or want it.
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Uh we don't have to take it.
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But back then, you weren't moving a chair like they are now.
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Now it's 90, 95% of the time one bounce tennis at the at the highest, highest levels.
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Um, but back then the reason they went with two was you're pushing a chair that weighs 40, 50 pounds, right?
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And not hard, not good.
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On different surfaces.
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Oh, well, back then mostly hard.
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Yeah, mostly hard, yeah.
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So to get back to your question about the slams, um the the first slam that really kind of started it was uh Australian Open.
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Okay.
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Yeah, they they really pushed hard to get people in, the players in, and it started with the men, then went to the women, and then eventually trickled down to the quads.
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And and uh yeah, unfortunately or fortunately, I was kind of the the the bulldog to like write a bunch of letters and explain we're equal, and you know, just because we have lesser disability, you know, more severe disability doesn't mean we should be excluded.
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And so pushed and pushed and pushed, and then uh the U.S.
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Open did an exhibition in 04 uh for all of wheelchair tennis, including the quads, uh, but it was mostly just the American players, or it was just the American players who had qualified for the Paralympics that year in Athens.
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So I was able to do part of that exhibition.
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Unfortunately, we got rained out, so we got I think we got one match in.
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It's a great story.
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I'll tell you about that.
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That match is hilarious, but um, and so that was 04, 05 the following year.
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The US Open included men and women, and then I believe we got in in 07 to the US Open, and then Australia followed suit, and then it took it took forever for Roland Garros and Wimbledon, and Wimbledon was the the the longest, hardest one to to get into for all categories.
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Um we started with just doubles at Wimbledon because they weren't even sure you could play wheelchair tennis on the grass.
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Single, right?
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I mean just yeah, serve and volley, or not even serve and volley, just serve and return and it's over, right?
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So um, but the guys got stronger, we got more fit, we we changed our chair setup a little bit to to be more uh maneuverable on on grass.
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If it seemed difficult, it's it's tough, it's really tough on c on grass.
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It's hard enough just on the heart.
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Wow.
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Yeah, and so chair chair uh companies like RGK, Sunrise Medical have really changed the game uh because it made lightweight chairs that that roll so quick and so effortlessly.
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And and we it's it's weird to say this, but we almost make it look easy being in the chair.
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And to us it is similar simple, but the chair itself is what kind of makes it simple.
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The chair just, as Ryan knows, you've sat in it a few times.
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It turns on a dime and one push and it just goes.
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Oh my gosh, I'm I get so nauseous.
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You do space.
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I saw you out there with our coach Ivan.
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He did not make it look easy.
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That was uh he was like, oh my gosh, this is impossible.
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Yeah, the thing, the thing with the sports, so so then quickly back back to it when Roland Garrett's jumped on uh and and all the Grand Slams actually jumped on, is draws were really small, really small.
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They were eight draw for the men and the women and a four draw for the quads.
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So we played a round robin, and this is where it's it's such a strange dynamic in the slams for us because the the round robin was you played everybody once, and then the top two people came out of the round robin and played each other again in the final.
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So there are times you could win a slam with two losses, right?
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You you could be one and two in the in the pool play, but have the the percentage of wins and come out and then win the final and have two wins and two losses, which is so different from any other way of winning or going through a grand slam draw.
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So um, but we we just kept pushing and and encouraging and and and showing that that we're building and wanting more, and the slams have moved to all eight for a while, uh, and now we're 16.
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So so slowly getting more and more and more.
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Uh we're 16 in all four slams for men and women.
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Uh U.S.
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and Australia are still are 16 for quads, and Roland Garrett and Wimbledon have stayed at eight for quads.
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Yeah, and and part of that is there's a couple of reasons.
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Uh the the biggest reason at Wimbledon is court space.
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Yeah.
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Uh courtspace is just there's not a lot of space.
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There's yeah, there's no the practice courts, there's no availability for anything.
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As you know, right?
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Yeah, so so you're fighting for courts, practice courts.
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You don't practice on the court you're playing on.
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Yeah, you know, so you guys are going into the second, you're starting second week.
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We're always the second week.
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So so it's a little beat up.
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Oh, yeah, courts beat up, which in grass actually saves us because behind the baseline it's so dirty.
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That's where you can actually generate your speed pushing wise, because it's such a hard-packed dirt, right?
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So you can generate a ton of speed in there, but man, you get up in the net to to play doubles or volley up there, it's like pushing in quicksand.
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I mean, it's ridiculous.
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So um, and then roll, like I said, Roland Garrett kind of jumped on board.
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Um, and they they were a little slower uh to initiate and bring in the quads, uh, but they they now have eight quads uh as well.
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Um yeah, and so it's I mean we're still pushing, right?
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Like I mean, we we're never gonna we're we're thankful and grateful for what we've been offered and given the opportunity to compete at, but let's always ask and move forward and and be progressive on let's keep it going, you know, and and get more more draws.
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And then the beauty was two, three years ago, we made a really big push to get um junior wheelchair tennis.
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Oh, yeah, in the same way.
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That's yeah, and so that's that's awesome.
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That's that's the game changer right there.
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That's uh the USTA has done some really good stuff with collegiate wheelchair tennis.
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Yeah, um, and that's really good because now you're getting kids with disabilities playing a sport for a team at a campus and getting a collegiate, yeah, exactly.
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And so maybe they're not gonna make it on our professional tour, but now they've got an education.
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Yeah, it's amazing, yeah.
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Right, and and and they've been part of a team, as anybody that played at a college team would say.
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How how much camaraderie is that, right?
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Yeah.
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So now you get that with the kids.
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So it's it's the beauty of of what the UST has been pushing is collegiate tennis.
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So it was just a natural fit to go right into juniors in the slams.
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Well, that's great.
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What is the what does the Grand Slams look like for prize money?
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So prize money in the Grand Slams is certainly our largest purse.
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Um Grand Slams, they can kind of set their own rules, so to speak, on the tour.
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So they can they can they do follow ATP, WTA, and and ITF rules somewhat, but they do change a little bit.
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So our for us, uh slams, all four slams offer the largest purse.
00:16:28.639 --> 00:16:31.360
I don't recall which one is the largest right now.
00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:34.320
Um uh because you were just racking them all in.
00:16:34.879 --> 00:16:36.720
I was trying, I was trying to get coming in.
00:16:37.919 --> 00:16:39.039
Just keep them coming.
00:16:39.279 --> 00:16:40.000
I was trying.
00:16:40.240 --> 00:16:41.279
Got harder and harder.
00:16:41.440 --> 00:16:48.000
Um, but but um it's also not just the largest purse, it's also our largest points to be earned on our tour.
00:16:48.240 --> 00:16:56.879
So so we we took their points system and incorporated into ours now, and so now we got our top 10, our best 10 events.
00:16:56.960 --> 00:17:00.559
Uh, and so you could play a hundred events if you wanted to, but your top ten count.
00:17:00.879 --> 00:17:08.559
So grand slams are are huge from a purse perspective, yeah, prize money perspective, and then um uh points for sure.
00:17:08.720 --> 00:17:13.039
And and points are obviously what allow you to get into each subsequent Grand Slam.
00:17:13.200 --> 00:17:22.160
Uh I I'll tell you, when I first won the Australian Open, my first year uh was 10, 2010, I believe it was 10 or 11.
00:17:22.400 --> 00:17:31.359
Um what I won in singles and doubles, I don't even make now if I lose first round singles and doubles in the Grand Slams.
00:17:31.599 --> 00:17:34.400
So the prize money has dramatically increased.
00:17:34.720 --> 00:17:34.880
Okay.
00:17:35.359 --> 00:17:41.359
And and in and in return, what that's done is it's changed the level of play in wheelchair tennis.
00:17:41.440 --> 00:17:41.599
Yeah.
00:17:41.920 --> 00:17:55.440
Before it was quite recreational, even at the highest, highest levels at the open levels, it was still a lot of camaraderie and and partying and celebrating and being around uh like people with disabilities and learning and whatnot.
00:17:55.599 --> 00:18:00.240
And now people are traveling with a team, with a with a coach, a physio, a nutritionist.
00:18:00.400 --> 00:18:02.640
Uh some people could bring a stringer, right?
00:18:02.720 --> 00:18:06.559
I mean, they're actually like making enough that they can do that now.
00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:15.119
I mean, no nowhere near along the lines of what the able body players are making, but still enough that that you can go that route now.
00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:19.440
And and that that has changed the game to become more professional across the board.
00:18:19.599 --> 00:18:33.039
And then you see it, the trickle-down effect is that the the top 20 guys right now who are fighting for those 16 spots are being really professional, but then the next tier below, 20 to 40, 40 to 80, are have to become that professional.
00:18:33.440 --> 00:18:39.599
And and just like able body tennis, the the battle climbing up to get there is is huge.
00:18:39.759 --> 00:18:52.559
Yeah, and so it it's been really amazing to see uh what the slams have done for the sport and really truly uh pushed it further than I think most people thought it would ever get.
00:18:53.279 --> 00:18:58.480
Do you think uh what in your opinion, uh, which slam would be considered the most progressive?
00:18:58.640 --> 00:19:01.680
Which one really pushed the most or the easiest to work with?
00:19:03.119 --> 00:19:05.440
I I personally I would say Australia.
00:19:05.680 --> 00:19:05.839
Okay.
00:19:06.160 --> 00:19:08.640
I mean they're they're you know they're kind of touted as the happy slam.
00:19:08.799 --> 00:19:10.480
Yeah and and it truly is.
00:19:10.559 --> 00:19:12.079
I mean, it is a party.
00:19:12.319 --> 00:19:16.160
I mean, if you've ever been, it's it's a total party there.
00:19:16.240 --> 00:19:19.279
I mean, that it's it's in their summer, first of all.
00:19:19.440 --> 00:19:21.359
It's right in the heart of Melbourne.
00:19:21.599 --> 00:19:23.759
So uh that that helps.
00:19:24.079 --> 00:19:29.039
And not only are the kids off of school, but most parents have summer break for that whole month.
00:19:29.279 --> 00:19:35.440
So I mean it's it's and people will pay the$35,$40 to get in and not even have a ticket to the stadium.
00:19:36.559 --> 00:19:37.200
Just to be on the grounds.
00:19:37.440 --> 00:19:38.240
It looks crazy on TV.
00:19:38.480 --> 00:19:42.640
I mean, it's and then what you see on TV is legitimately what it's like.
00:19:42.799 --> 00:19:44.319
But they they have done so much.
00:19:44.480 --> 00:19:51.119
I mean, I've done Novak Night multiple times, uh, you know, their version of like Kids' Day.
00:19:51.200 --> 00:19:55.599
Yeah, I've done that multiple times down there, and they're they're all about including us.
00:19:55.759 --> 00:20:00.000
And they were the first one I played at final uh on Rod Labor Arena.
00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:06.960
So they were the first slam to put wheelchair tennis on a on a big time show course and and actually tout it with.
00:20:07.039 --> 00:20:16.240
I mean, it helped that they had a player from Australia, but they touted the day, you know, that final prime time is Dylan and David playing each other, and and they did commercials.
00:20:16.319 --> 00:20:18.640
And I mean it it was it was big time.
00:20:19.119 --> 00:20:24.799
I would hope like that would that would be my hope for this year with like a 50-year anniversary that the Grand Slams would do something like that.
00:20:25.119 --> 00:20:28.559
Well, so a lot of them are taking taking note of that.
00:20:28.799 --> 00:20:35.119
Uh dur during uh Roland Garros or Wimbledon, sorry, we don't play on center court.
00:20:35.359 --> 00:20:36.880
I mean that's pretty pristine, right?
00:20:36.960 --> 00:20:43.519
Like don't and not that our chairs do any damage to the to the courts, but um we do play on court one a lot.
00:20:43.680 --> 00:20:48.960
So I've played a doubles final on court one, um, and there's been some singles finals on court one.
00:20:49.279 --> 00:21:01.279
Uh Roland Garros has put us on um Susan Langlin, not not Philippe Chartier uh yet, but I mean Susan Langland is a great beautiful.
00:21:01.359 --> 00:21:19.279
So before we go into the Grand Slams and your let's can I I want to pivot and go back before being in a chair because you must have gotten all of this success from a mindset or something, you know, something in you to be able to handle those pressures and all that stuff.
00:21:19.599 --> 00:21:24.079
Can you tell us can you go back to maybe childhood, like what sports were you in?
00:21:24.400 --> 00:21:33.519
You know, was there something that that triggered you or gave you the mindset really and the character and the values to be able to be who you are today?
00:21:33.839 --> 00:21:34.160
Sure.
00:21:34.400 --> 00:21:34.640
Yeah.
00:21:34.799 --> 00:21:40.079
So like I said, I got hurt in '95 and I was two and a half years old then.
00:21:41.039 --> 00:21:42.799
I was twenty one when I got hurt.
00:21:43.039 --> 00:21:50.720
And uh prior to that, I I played uh sports growing up and every every sport under the sun, as most kids do.
00:21:50.880 --> 00:21:58.559
Uh and in fifth, sixth, seventh grade, I kind of gravitated more to basketball, and that really was my true love of sport.
00:21:58.799 --> 00:22:07.680
Um but I I would Do anything and everything from badminton to basketball to to I used to call it J Ball, and it was like handball basically.
00:22:07.839 --> 00:22:10.400
Uh I mean just any sport, any sport whatsoever.
00:22:10.480 --> 00:22:13.200
But organized sport really hit me with basketball.
00:22:13.359 --> 00:22:15.200
I did some track and field at school.
00:22:15.279 --> 00:22:16.240
I did golf.
00:22:16.480 --> 00:22:17.920
Um you played everything.
00:22:18.240 --> 00:22:20.240
Yeah, pretty pretty much it was a dream.
00:22:20.640 --> 00:22:24.319
Well, my dream was to make it into the NBA, obviously.
00:22:24.559 --> 00:22:27.599
But unfortunately, I I am uh quite short.
00:22:27.839 --> 00:22:33.279
Uh uh I mean I worked hard, but I was uh very short, uh 5'9, 5'10.
00:22:33.519 --> 00:22:40.799
So um, but I did work hard um and and I had a partial scholarship out of high school to Gonzaga University.
00:22:40.960 --> 00:22:41.200
Wow.
00:22:41.359 --> 00:22:42.799
Um but I ended up turning it down.
00:22:43.119 --> 00:22:43.920
Wait, for basketball?
00:22:44.079 --> 00:22:44.559
For basketball.
00:22:45.680 --> 00:22:47.920
Yeah, but this this was before Gonzaga was Gonzaga.
00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:51.599
I'm gonna be honest.
00:22:52.720 --> 00:22:58.160
And I know when I mean when I say a partial, it was like maybe uh a books and books, and that was it, right?
00:22:58.240 --> 00:22:58.960
Like nothing.
00:22:59.119 --> 00:23:04.720
And it wasn't even a guarantee, but it was like, hey, you could try to walk on with this potential scholarship, right?
00:23:04.960 --> 00:23:05.440
That's pretty good.
00:23:05.599 --> 00:23:07.920
And and uh so but I I was a little burned out.
00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:14.880
I had a coach in high school who was who was rough, like really Bobby Knight, tough, like really tough throwing chairs and everything, yeah.
00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:20.319
Chalk and throwing clutches and just just I mean this again, this is early 90s, right?
00:23:20.480 --> 00:23:23.440
So they're different time of of life.
00:23:23.599 --> 00:23:25.119
Um still not acceptable.
00:23:25.200 --> 00:23:25.839
I'm not saying that's a good thing.
00:23:26.079 --> 00:23:28.160
No one threw that on my high school basketball team.
00:23:28.400 --> 00:23:28.960
There's no coach.
00:23:31.680 --> 00:23:36.400
So I just had a like as as most of us on our team, we kind of were burned out, really.
00:23:36.720 --> 00:23:44.480
Um and so I didn't accept the scholarship, but what I ended up doing was staying in Walla Walla where I grew up and went to the community college.
00:23:44.640 --> 00:23:49.359
But I was a I was knowing we with the there's four colleges in Walla Walla.
00:23:49.519 --> 00:24:01.359
There's Walla Walla College, now Walla Walla University, Whitman College, Um, Community College, and Whitworth or Whitman College, Whitman, not Whitworth, Whitman College, and all four have basketball teams.
00:24:01.519 --> 00:24:06.559
So I was able to, when they found out I wasn't leaving, they were like, Can you just come be on our practice squads?
00:24:06.720 --> 00:24:08.559
I'm like, sure, no problem.
00:24:08.799 --> 00:24:12.799
I I don't have to practice like like doing actual plays and all that.
00:24:13.039 --> 00:24:14.079
I just get to play ball.
00:24:14.240 --> 00:24:18.640
So I I got to be on the practice squad for all four colleges, which was great.
00:24:18.799 --> 00:24:19.039
Right.
00:24:19.359 --> 00:24:30.720
So um, but then then my love of tennis hit when um my sophomore year of college, I started to get like a little fatter or a lot fatter.
00:24:30.880 --> 00:24:33.920
And and all of a sudden I was like, Man, I gotta do something.
00:24:34.079 --> 00:24:40.240
And I saw an advertisement for uh uh join the tennis team and get a scholarship at community college.
00:24:40.319 --> 00:24:41.839
I was like, Well, that sounds fun.
00:24:41.920 --> 00:24:44.079
Yeah, I never played tennis in my entire life, right?
00:24:44.319 --> 00:24:46.400
Never even, I mean, I've maybe hit home run balls, right?
00:24:46.640 --> 00:24:47.039
Yeah, yeah.
00:24:47.279 --> 00:24:54.160
And uh so I I went out, tried out, made the team, and I played number two on my team, uh, just just from sheer athleticism.
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:54.559
Wow.
00:24:54.720 --> 00:24:56.720
And the fact that our team was not very good.
00:24:56.960 --> 00:25:01.119
So it was had nothing to do with me being a good tennis player um at all.
00:25:01.279 --> 00:25:03.039
In fact, I lost every single match.
00:25:03.200 --> 00:25:06.160
Um, but I fell in love with the sport, just couldn't get enough of it.
00:25:06.400 --> 00:25:11.599
And that drive and that determination, just where where that stemmed from was my family.
00:25:11.759 --> 00:25:13.200
I mean, no doubt about it.
00:25:13.359 --> 00:25:21.920
My my grandfather was uh in the military, he was a colonel in the marines, and and uh and my my mother was a super athlete.
00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:25.359
She still has swimming records from the state of Florida that haven't been broken.
00:25:25.680 --> 00:25:25.920
Amazing.
00:25:26.079 --> 00:25:27.200
So yeah, I had no idea.
00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:31.839
So like we we had a rich history of of uh athleticism in our family.
00:25:32.000 --> 00:25:32.240
Okay.
00:25:32.400 --> 00:25:38.480
And um, and that drive and that determination just trickled down to me from from my my for sure from my mother.
00:25:38.640 --> 00:25:39.119
Yeah, yeah.
00:25:39.279 --> 00:25:47.119
My mom was my biggest fan and biggest supporter and and just my biggest advocate and and always doing your best and giving it everything you got.
00:25:47.279 --> 00:25:50.400
And if you're not gonna give away everything you got, why are you doing it?
00:25:50.559 --> 00:25:54.880
And and so, yeah, that that's pretty much where that came from for me was from her.
00:25:55.119 --> 00:25:58.400
And my father was athletic, is athletic as well.
00:25:58.640 --> 00:26:00.319
So uh it's kind of funny.
00:26:00.400 --> 00:26:13.519
My my my sister and me are polar opposites, and my mom and dad are both musical and athletic, and my mom and my dad can like basically pick up an instrument, hear a song, and start playing it and sing it and all that.
00:26:13.599 --> 00:26:21.519
And my sister's almost the same way, and me, I I love music, but I am not musical at all.
00:26:21.680 --> 00:26:26.720
And my sister, if you ask her to like throw a ball or catch up something, not gonna happen.
00:26:26.880 --> 00:26:31.920
So, so I got all my parents' athleticism, and she got all their music talent, and we joke about it all the time.
00:26:32.000 --> 00:26:34.000
In fact, she was just down and we joke about it all the time.
00:26:34.079 --> 00:26:35.759
We're like, I would gladly trade that.
00:26:35.839 --> 00:26:39.359
I would give up all my athleticism to be a musician, all of it.
00:26:39.839 --> 00:26:44.480
No, no, no, yeah, no, heck yeah, no, yeah, now, maybe not during your time.
00:26:44.640 --> 00:26:53.680
Yeah, so so yeah, that that that determination and that that that grit and that just fight uh definitely can came from family, family.
00:26:53.839 --> 00:26:56.319
And and you know, I I was the oldest in my family.
00:26:56.480 --> 00:27:04.720
I only had my sister and a couple stepkids, and then I have some half-brothers who came along when I was much older, but I didn't have that like sibling rivalry either.
00:27:04.799 --> 00:27:11.200
So I didn't have like the older brother that was beating up on me or or me beating up on the younger brother, type of thing.
00:27:11.359 --> 00:27:15.680
So it was all about for me, I I just always played at the highest level I could.
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:20.000
So in seventh grade in Walla Walla, I was still playing against the college level guys.
00:27:20.079 --> 00:27:22.240
Okay, uh at the at the Walla Walla college.
00:27:22.400 --> 00:27:28.480
So I was kind of getting that, getting beat up, not physically beat up, but you know, beat up in the competitions.
00:27:28.640 --> 00:27:33.680
And uh, and I think that just encouraged me and pushed me to always strive to be better.
00:27:33.839 --> 00:27:34.160
Yeah.
00:27:34.319 --> 00:27:39.440
So you got injured uh when you were 21, so right out of college?
00:27:39.759 --> 00:27:41.440
So it was my sophomore year of college.
00:27:41.519 --> 00:27:44.079
So when you start when you first started playing tennis, yeah.
00:27:44.160 --> 00:27:47.519
The so I started tennis and 10 months later I had my accident.
00:27:47.680 --> 00:27:48.079
Wow, yeah.
00:27:48.160 --> 00:27:53.839
And I and I and no joke, I I pretty much stopped playing basketball and played only tennis.
00:27:54.160 --> 00:27:55.920
So that that spark of love of tennis.
00:27:56.160 --> 00:27:57.680
Oh man, yeah, at 21 years old.
00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:01.359
At 21 years old, this is this is how naive I was about tennis.
00:28:01.519 --> 00:28:08.160
I was like, oh, I'll finish playing tennis here at the community college and I'll walk on to Eastern Washington's tennis team.
00:28:08.400 --> 00:28:08.960
Yeah, right.
00:28:09.039 --> 00:28:10.960
Like, like, you know, I mean, who am I kidding, right?
00:28:11.039 --> 00:28:13.759
Like now that I know about tennis, I'm like, no way.
00:28:14.079 --> 00:28:16.160
That's amazing though, to think about.
00:28:16.319 --> 00:28:21.519
I mean, to think that you just start playing tennis in junior college.
00:28:21.599 --> 00:28:22.000
Yeah.
00:28:22.240 --> 00:28:22.480
Right?
00:28:22.799 --> 00:28:23.759
Post high school.
00:28:23.920 --> 00:28:24.559
Yeah.
00:28:24.880 --> 00:28:25.839
Knew nothing about it.
00:28:26.640 --> 00:28:35.039
Just have this traumatic injury, yeah, a whole change in life, yeah, and go on to have, you know, live a life and a whole career in the sport.
00:28:35.519 --> 00:28:43.440
You know, it's it's it's it wasn't like you got, you know, you were doing something else and then picked it up later because, oh, this is accessible to me, right?
00:28:43.599 --> 00:28:43.920
Yeah, no, no.
00:28:44.000 --> 00:28:45.759
No, no, this was something that started right before.
00:28:46.240 --> 00:28:51.279
Yeah, those 10 months really set the standard and the stage for me in the sport of tennis.
00:28:51.599 --> 00:28:52.319
It's unbelievable.
00:28:52.400 --> 00:28:56.799
It was almost like it was meant to happen that way, you know.
00:28:56.960 --> 00:28:58.880
And so it was amazing, right?
00:28:58.960 --> 00:29:13.200
And and uh and and I I attribute to you know, a lot of people get injured and they kind of I don't want to say fully throw in the towel, but but lean on drugs, lean on alcohol, lean on lean on other you know, vices to get through.
00:29:13.359 --> 00:29:20.240
And for me, my my family was there for me, treating me exactly the same that that I did that they did before I got hurt.
00:29:20.319 --> 00:29:21.359
I mean, exactly the same.
00:29:21.599 --> 00:29:23.440
This is just another factor, chapter in life.
00:29:23.680 --> 00:29:28.240
Yeah, tell us what so you got injured, yeah, and then what was that next step?
00:29:28.720 --> 00:29:36.400
So for me, when I got injured, I was in Redondo Beach and I got tossed by a wave and just landed wrong, and that snapped my neck and that instantly paralyzed me.
00:29:36.640 --> 00:29:43.119
And I did two weeks in UCLA uh hospital and then transferred up to Spokane, Washington.
00:29:43.279 --> 00:29:48.640
And I transferred there because it was closer to Walla Walla where my family and friends could come visit more more often.
00:29:48.799 --> 00:29:58.000
Yeah, and that that was for me the biggest difference was I had friends and family every day, every weekend there with me through through the rehab.
00:29:58.160 --> 00:30:06.079
And that that allowed me to uh feel normal, feel like, oh, they they think I'm the same person.
00:30:06.240 --> 00:30:09.839
I'm not this fragile, broken individual.
00:30:10.079 --> 00:30:15.440
And so, you know, we'd go out to to dinner or we'd go to the movies or something, and my buddies would be like, get your wallet out, dude.
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:16.000
You're paying.
00:30:16.319 --> 00:30:18.640
Yeah, like we're you know, we're not taking care of you, right?
00:30:18.720 --> 00:30:21.440
Yeah, and so I'm not that's really important, yeah.
00:30:21.519 --> 00:30:21.680
Right?
00:30:21.759 --> 00:30:23.759
Like you're you're just treated the same.
00:30:23.920 --> 00:30:24.880
Yeah, yeah, okay.
00:30:24.960 --> 00:30:30.400
So you're sitting down, or or we got to deal with your chair, or you know, whatever, but you're still the same person, yeah.
00:30:30.559 --> 00:30:45.200
You know, and and that that that mindset from determination and giving it everything you have from the beginning uh uh in competition in life is is truly just carried over for me in the in the realm of life going through this disability.
00:30:45.440 --> 00:30:47.680
And uh not not to say there weren't hard times, right?
00:30:47.759 --> 00:31:04.880
Like, of course, there's challenging times when you're trying to figure out how to brush your tooth teeth again, you know, and you're like, I can't hold the toothbrush, or tie my shoes, or put my socks on, you know, and and so there are a lot of hard times, but you you realize that's what makes you who you are in the long run.
00:31:05.039 --> 00:31:08.640
And getting through those and not giving up makes all the difference in the world.
00:31:08.720 --> 00:31:16.559
And and that's like the mindset I've I always had is like, okay, it is what it is, let's move on and and not throw in the towel and and make it happen.
00:31:16.720 --> 00:31:22.319
So uh, I mean, I remember hearing them talk about we need to get you all this permanent stuff, right?
00:31:22.400 --> 00:31:27.759
Like permanent placard to park your car, a permanent wheelchair, a permanent this and a permanent that.
00:31:27.920 --> 00:31:30.880
And the whole time I'm thinking to myself, well, this isn't permanent.
00:31:30.960 --> 00:31:32.400
I you know, I'm walking out of here, right?
00:31:32.480 --> 00:31:34.799
Like I'm gonna fit, I'm gonna beat this and get out of here.
00:31:34.960 --> 00:31:37.920
And you start to realize, uh, maybe that's not gonna happen.
00:31:38.079 --> 00:31:44.960
Um, and and it's sad, and and the reality of maybe that won't happen is becomes reality.
00:31:45.200 --> 00:31:50.640
But then you start to see doors open and things, opportunities that that are now available to you.
00:31:50.720 --> 00:31:53.279
Yeah, and you're like, man, just just go with it, right?
00:31:53.359 --> 00:31:55.440
Like flow and let it let it go, right?
00:31:55.519 --> 00:31:58.000
Like enjoy your life because you only got one of them.
00:31:58.400 --> 00:31:59.680
And that's that mindset, right?
00:32:00.000 --> 00:32:01.119
Yeah, for me it was, yeah.
00:32:01.599 --> 00:32:04.480
Always thinking positively and what's the next challenge.
00:32:04.559 --> 00:32:16.480
And yeah, what's been throughout our episodes too, one thing that we continue to talk about is environment, like in setting up an environment for a kid or for somebody to develop and and to become their best.
00:32:16.559 --> 00:32:19.200
So it sounds like with family, right?
00:32:19.359 --> 00:32:23.440
You they really put together an environment for you to like you said flow.
00:32:23.519 --> 00:32:29.920
I mean to be able to to like you use like almost acceptance and flow and go with it, you said.
00:32:30.160 --> 00:32:30.960
Yeah, that's powerful.
00:32:31.200 --> 00:32:34.160
Yeah, super, super lucky and fortunate to have a family like that.
00:32:34.319 --> 00:32:47.359
I mean, my mom took a full year off of work when that that year I got hurt, and she had a leave of absence for a full year and and was right there taking me to and from uh rehab, inpatient, outpatient sports camps, right?
00:32:47.440 --> 00:32:52.559
Just taking me everywhere, helping me adjust in that in that moment.
00:32:52.799 --> 00:33:09.039
And uh yeah, I mean, it just just I I think I think the only thing I can think of is is truly like what's the alternative, you know, sitting on a sitting on a couch all day and and doing nothing or or being active and enjoying life and seeing people and being part of you know community.
00:33:09.200 --> 00:33:18.559
Yeah, and and so and then I was surrounded not just by family, but then when I started playing sports, I met some of the coolest people ever, you know, and then that and they were going through what I was going through.
00:33:18.720 --> 00:33:20.640
So I could bounce ideas off of them.
00:33:20.799 --> 00:33:25.839
It's just the community of not just competition, but hey, how do you deal with this?
00:33:25.920 --> 00:33:27.200
How do you go up and down a stair?
00:33:27.279 --> 00:33:28.400
How do you go to the curbs, right?
00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:29.759
How do you put your chair in your car?
00:33:29.920 --> 00:33:36.000
You know, you start learning real ways of doing life from people who are doing life, yeah.
00:33:36.240 --> 00:33:40.000
And and now you realize, wow, this is manageable.
00:33:40.319 --> 00:33:42.559
So yeah, it was it was great.
00:33:43.039 --> 00:33:45.440
That's the value of the community, right?
00:33:45.519 --> 00:33:48.559
Just having those people, the support system is huge.
00:33:48.960 --> 00:33:55.440
Yeah, yeah, because because you know, in in the able body world, you'll you'll have a racket or a string or something, and we'll all share it with everybody.
00:33:55.599 --> 00:33:58.319
Oh, dude, you gotta try this this racket or try this string, right?
00:33:58.559 --> 00:33:59.359
Same with us, man.
00:33:59.440 --> 00:34:02.000
You gotta try this chair or the check out these wheels, right?
00:34:02.079 --> 00:34:03.759
And like or a catheter, right?
00:34:03.839 --> 00:34:05.039
Or whatever it is you need.
00:34:05.200 --> 00:34:06.799
And it's like, check this out.
00:34:06.880 --> 00:34:11.840
And and that's the real world impact is so so much bigger.
00:34:12.239 --> 00:34:15.199
So thanks for sharing that.
00:34:15.360 --> 00:34:19.840
Well, that's a lot of valuable just kind of insight in your life and what happened.
00:34:19.920 --> 00:34:30.960
And so um, let's go through, you know, now you you've done the camps, you've been intro well, not introduced to tennis, uh-huh, you've picked tennis back up in a chair now.
00:34:31.119 --> 00:34:34.400
Yeah, and you started to develop early on.
00:34:34.559 --> 00:34:38.159
Was was there like, okay, I'm gonna now go professional?
00:34:38.559 --> 00:34:42.719
What was tell us about that whole now development into the Grand Slam.
00:34:43.119 --> 00:34:49.519
So obviously starting at uh 21 as an able-bodied person learning tennis is way late in the game.
00:34:49.599 --> 00:34:55.920
I mean, you know, you wouldn't I mean lots of people could do it, but they're never gonna become a professional tennis player starting at 21.
00:34:56.320 --> 00:35:04.559
And uh so then four years later, fast forward four years later, now I'm starting wheelchair tennis and learning it from a whole new perspective.
00:35:04.800 --> 00:35:19.119
It's not a lot of difference in the sport to begin with, but the fact that that I was able to lean on what I had already learned in in the sport and then and then I kind of forgot your question.
00:35:19.679 --> 00:35:23.280
Just we're just in general, talking about development into the sport.
00:35:23.360 --> 00:35:23.599
Yeah, yeah.
00:35:23.840 --> 00:35:29.840
So so for me, part of that mindset of always trying to um give it my all or do my best.
00:35:30.000 --> 00:35:40.559
I a lot of people in wheelchair tennis, because you don't really have a qualification to get into tournaments, it's basically if there's a spot in the draw, you can play basically for for lack of a better term.
00:35:40.719 --> 00:35:43.039
But I didn't play events for the first two years.
00:35:43.199 --> 00:35:47.280
So when I learned tennis in '99, I didn't play my first event until 2001.
00:35:47.360 --> 00:35:49.039
And part of that was I was going to school.
00:35:49.199 --> 00:35:55.840
But the other part was I spent that two-year period just training and learning everything I could about the sport.
00:35:56.079 --> 00:36:00.480
I mean, I probably called Randy a million times, Randy Snow asking, Hey, what about this?
00:36:00.559 --> 00:36:01.039
What about this?
00:36:01.119 --> 00:36:01.679
How about this?
00:36:01.760 --> 00:36:03.599
You know, just like bouncing things off of him.
00:36:03.920 --> 00:36:13.599
And then when I finally went to my first event, then it was like, wow, two years of just hardcore training, like legit hardcore training, uh, paid off.
00:36:13.840 --> 00:36:29.599
And then quickly, when I jumped open three th into the third year, uh moving up the ranks quite quickly, and in 2003, uh April of 2003, jumped into like the top three in the world and then became world number one very, very quickly.
00:36:29.760 --> 00:36:44.719
But it was all I trip I attribute it all to grinding for those first two years, not just going out and competing, but actually training and and doing what uh kids would do to train and then go play an event, not play an event and then come train.
00:36:44.960 --> 00:36:48.320
So and in wheelchair tennis, we tend to just hey, let's just go play.
00:36:48.559 --> 00:36:50.320
Let's get out there and play as soon as we can.
00:36:50.639 --> 00:36:55.280
And so that that that really changed how I did it.
00:36:55.360 --> 00:36:57.840
Um, and now you see more people kind of following that.
00:36:58.000 --> 00:37:01.280
Like we just practice train, train, train, and now we're gonna put you into an event.
00:37:01.599 --> 00:37:08.559
But that this is just a perfect uh this is what our podcast is basically about is where does that motivation come from?
00:37:08.719 --> 00:37:15.920
You had it, you worked super hard, you're just saying that you wanted to learn everything about the sport and you put it in all that training.
00:37:16.079 --> 00:37:18.239
Was that was there somebody pushing you to do that?
00:37:18.320 --> 00:37:20.800
It was just that that inner drive from yourself.
00:37:20.960 --> 00:37:23.519
Was it from playing sports as a young kid?
00:37:23.679 --> 00:37:25.199
Like, where does that come from?
00:37:25.360 --> 00:37:28.079
Because that's what everybody gets that.
00:37:28.639 --> 00:37:28.960
Exactly.
00:37:29.199 --> 00:37:31.199
Yeah, I I don't know to be honest.
00:37:31.280 --> 00:37:32.719
I think can you lose it?
00:37:32.800 --> 00:37:34.320
I I mean, I hope not.
00:37:35.119 --> 00:37:36.719
I certainly hope I never lose it.
00:37:36.800 --> 00:37:39.519
You know, I might carry it over into other aspects of my life.
00:37:39.599 --> 00:37:53.280
Yeah, uh, maybe it won't always be sport or always be tennis, but but I think I will always have that drive to try to be the best that I can be and and and encourage others and and you know get others out there pushing to be the best they can be.
00:37:53.360 --> 00:38:02.159
Um, but but I think for me it just came down to like uh it had nothing to do with, oh man, I can make a living in this sport or or anything.
00:38:02.239 --> 00:38:07.519
It just had something about that mindset of if I'm gonna do it, I'm going to do it fully.
00:38:07.599 --> 00:38:09.760
And just so that was so it was a strategy.
00:38:09.840 --> 00:38:14.639
You're like, I'm gonna I'm gonna strategize here to become the best player I could become.
00:38:14.800 --> 00:38:17.440
Yeah, the best person player on the court I can be.
00:38:17.519 --> 00:38:19.920
Uh and then I'm gonna go see where I land.
00:38:20.159 --> 00:38:20.400
Wow.
00:38:20.480 --> 00:38:21.199
Yeah, yeah.
00:38:21.440 --> 00:38:22.639
And and continue, right?
00:38:22.719 --> 00:38:26.000
And and we know the sport of tennis, like we're always improving.
00:38:26.079 --> 00:38:27.199
There's always something to it.
00:38:27.519 --> 00:38:31.599
So for you, you know, those two years or in general in practice, what does that look like?
00:38:31.679 --> 00:38:37.920
Is it being fed, you know, back in 99, 2000, was it being fed a million balls going side to side?
00:38:38.159 --> 00:38:38.400
Yeah, yeah.
00:38:38.559 --> 00:38:39.199
It was, it was.
00:38:39.360 --> 00:38:49.199
I mean, yeah, the the beauty of wheelchair tennis, as as you guys know, and some of your listeners probably don't know this yet, but it's not a whole lot different than the able body game.
00:38:49.360 --> 00:38:50.000
It's really not.
00:38:50.159 --> 00:38:54.880
You you play an opponent who has a weakness in their backhand, where are you gonna go, right?
00:38:54.960 --> 00:38:57.199
We're gonna pound their backhand all day long, right?
00:38:57.280 --> 00:38:59.119
Yeah, so you gotta be able to hit that shot.
00:38:59.199 --> 00:39:03.840
So you got to be able to slice, topspin, volley, serve, get your ball to where it needs to be.
00:39:04.000 --> 00:39:11.280
So yeah, it was exactly like uh I'm a 25-year-old man training like a 10-year-old junior.
00:39:11.840 --> 00:39:12.320
Repetition.
00:39:12.719 --> 00:39:21.840
Yeah, just repetition, repetition, repetition, learning uh how to get my chair in the right position and strike the ball and put it where I need it to go.
00:39:22.000 --> 00:39:25.920
Um, and it that was endless hours, endless hours of doing that.
00:39:26.239 --> 00:39:28.159
All right, so that's awesome.
00:39:28.320 --> 00:39:31.599
So from there to your first grand slam, let's say, right?
00:39:31.760 --> 00:39:33.199
There's probably some things in between.
00:39:33.519 --> 00:39:33.920
Oh, yeah.
00:39:34.320 --> 00:39:35.840
You know, financially, how'd you get there?
00:39:36.000 --> 00:39:37.519
Did you pocket that yourself?
00:39:37.760 --> 00:39:38.960
Yes, yeah, I did.
00:39:39.119 --> 00:39:39.519
I did.
00:39:39.679 --> 00:39:41.760
So I I was really fortunate.
00:39:41.920 --> 00:39:51.519
Uh, my uncle, who uh had some means, offered me one event to to play, one event that he would cover.
00:39:51.679 --> 00:39:52.000
Wow.
00:39:52.159 --> 00:39:52.719
And that was it.
00:39:52.800 --> 00:39:54.320
Just a one-time shot.
00:39:54.559 --> 00:39:57.679
And uh unfortunately I chose ping pong.
00:39:59.280 --> 00:40:03.840
So so this is pre-tennis, so I used it for ping pong, which has no prize money.
00:40:03.920 --> 00:40:06.159
Yeah, uh, but it's in the Paralympics and and is a great sport.
00:40:06.239 --> 00:40:08.719
But I mean, uh I did really well.
00:40:08.800 --> 00:40:10.559
I I won three national championships.
00:40:11.039 --> 00:40:12.480
No way table wheelchairs.
00:40:12.559 --> 00:40:13.440
Did you know that table tennis?
00:40:13.840 --> 00:40:14.239
No idea.
00:40:14.320 --> 00:40:14.400
Yeah.
00:40:14.880 --> 00:40:15.360
I didn't know that.
00:40:15.760 --> 00:40:16.960
Does Wikipedia know that?
00:40:17.119 --> 00:40:17.840
I I don't know.
00:40:17.920 --> 00:40:18.639
I hope not.
00:40:19.679 --> 00:40:20.159
Come on.
00:40:20.800 --> 00:40:21.840
So I did really well.
00:40:21.920 --> 00:40:37.039
And then I got that that kind of kick-started me and pushed me along, and it got me into learning about the US at the time the US O C, United States Olympic Committee, which is now the US O P C U United States Olympic Paralympic Committee.
00:40:37.119 --> 00:40:39.199
Um, and I was able to travel abroad.
00:40:39.360 --> 00:40:42.239
I went to uh Taipei and played internationally.
00:40:42.320 --> 00:40:44.400
I went to South America for for table tennis.
00:40:44.559 --> 00:40:45.119
For table tennis.
00:40:45.440 --> 00:40:46.239
So this got me started.
00:40:46.480 --> 00:40:48.639
I had no idea he's a legend in that sport too.
00:40:48.800 --> 00:40:52.320
So well, I don't know about that, but it got me started in the competition.
00:40:52.559 --> 00:40:54.000
How was the level of competition then?
00:40:54.239 --> 00:40:55.119
Big, like huge.
00:40:55.280 --> 00:40:55.679
Yeah, really.
00:40:56.079 --> 00:40:58.960
So you weren't just going in there and like I'm just killing everybody.
00:40:59.519 --> 00:41:00.559
No, no, no, yeah, yeah.
00:41:00.639 --> 00:41:07.440
No, I it was the same thing though, is is is I started training table tennis like it was my job.
00:41:07.519 --> 00:41:07.679
Yeah.
00:41:07.840 --> 00:41:09.440
And so I mean it sounds so weird.
00:41:09.679 --> 00:41:18.320
Do you tape into um I I didn't have to tape it, but I have a glove that has kind of like a golf glove that has the the the extra velcro straps.
00:41:18.480 --> 00:41:21.679
So I was able to do the glove with some velcro strapping.
00:41:21.840 --> 00:41:22.000
Okay.
00:41:22.159 --> 00:41:26.320
So so I still don't rotate and switch my grip in the the ping pong either.
00:41:26.480 --> 00:41:29.039
Um Uncle, what's his name?
00:41:29.199 --> 00:41:29.760
Uh David.
00:41:30.000 --> 00:41:32.960
Uncle David gives you one one event.
00:41:33.199 --> 00:41:33.599
One event.
00:41:33.760 --> 00:41:35.199
You take it in in table tennis.
00:41:36.079 --> 00:41:38.800
Now we know you're a legend in that.
00:41:38.960 --> 00:41:42.320
So you take that and you take that all the way into I take that up to 99.
00:41:42.559 --> 00:41:43.039
To 99.
00:41:43.280 --> 00:41:48.400
Then and when I learn about wheelchair tennis, then I I realize, ooh, that's that I love that.
00:41:48.559 --> 00:41:49.199
That's the next challenge.
00:41:49.440 --> 00:41:50.400
Bye-bye table tennis.
00:41:50.480 --> 00:41:50.559
Right.
00:41:50.800 --> 00:41:54.000
Like, sorry guys, you're a great sport, but I'm gonna go play tennis.
00:41:54.239 --> 00:41:57.519
And uh and that was funded pretty much uh on my own.
00:41:57.599 --> 00:41:57.760
Yeah.
00:41:57.920 --> 00:41:58.480
Wow, yeah.
00:41:58.559 --> 00:42:02.159
So so that that also kind of intrinsically motivates you, right?
00:42:02.239 --> 00:42:14.960
Like, like, you know, I didn't have the family support to to go play a hundred tournaments and have it covered, and and we don't get big time endorsements or people wanting to pave our way, right, to to help us get there.
00:42:15.199 --> 00:42:17.679
So it was like I'm showing up at an event.
00:42:17.840 --> 00:42:20.719
I'm not here to socialize and and be recreational.
00:42:20.800 --> 00:42:22.400
I'm here to whoop ass, right?
00:42:22.480 --> 00:42:23.679
Like I want to win this event.
00:42:23.760 --> 00:42:31.199
Yeah, because while the prize money is not big, that twelve hundred dollars is enough that it covers my expenses to get there, right?
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:41.440
So if I can at least maybe get my expenses covered, now maybe the next event I can get to do a little better or or win, make a little more, maybe pocket a little bit, right?
00:42:41.519 --> 00:42:44.719
So it just progressively got bigger and bigger and bigger.
00:42:45.039 --> 00:42:46.559
It just fuels that motivation as well.
00:42:46.800 --> 00:42:47.199
Yeah, it does.
00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:57.519
I mean, you hate to say money is the motivator, but when when you don't have a big sponsorship or a big endorsement that that pushes it out there, so uh there's no other choice.
00:42:57.760 --> 00:42:58.880
Yeah, yeah, you have to.
00:42:59.119 --> 00:42:59.760
You have to, yeah.
00:43:00.000 --> 00:43:02.960
But you didn't have that end in mind of I'm just gonna go make money.
00:43:03.039 --> 00:43:08.639
I mean, you were saying you were training to be the best player you can become, and when you put those things together, right, right.
00:43:08.719 --> 00:43:09.679
And and that's what it was.
00:43:09.840 --> 00:43:12.880
It wasn't about oh, this is oh, look at the prize money's going up.
00:43:12.960 --> 00:43:13.920
I have a chance to make that.
00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:26.960
But but hold on, but that is like we're talking about this in another uh in a previous episode, like talking about uh homeschool versus public school and stuff, and we're talking about like just being at the level you're at.
00:43:27.119 --> 00:43:37.280
And with you, yeah, you trained to become the best player you could to make a decision and say, then say, okay, I'm the best player I can be now, now I'm ready to go compete and make money from this.
00:43:37.679 --> 00:43:38.159
See where I land.
00:43:38.239 --> 00:43:39.039
Yeah, see where I land.
00:43:39.280 --> 00:43:39.679
What did you say?
00:43:39.840 --> 00:43:42.800
Play your play yourself into the opportunity.
00:43:43.039 --> 00:43:44.000
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
00:43:44.079 --> 00:43:45.280
That that was that's perfect.
00:43:45.360 --> 00:43:46.719
I mean, that's exactly what it was.
00:43:46.880 --> 00:43:56.000
And so I mean, a prime example of that would be in 04 when the first Paralympics came around for quad tennis for the first time was in Athens.
00:43:56.239 --> 00:43:58.239
I had no idea what we were getting ourselves into.
00:43:58.320 --> 00:43:59.760
I mean, we we play all around the world.
00:44:00.639 --> 00:44:03.440
And we don't we don't get big draws or big big crowds.
00:44:03.679 --> 00:44:06.239
Like you know, maybe a couple hundred people max.
00:44:06.400 --> 00:44:08.000
And that that's on a good day.
00:44:08.159 --> 00:44:12.480
Uh most of our crowd is the other players who are just sitting around watching.
00:44:12.639 --> 00:44:19.519
Um, so we go to Athens in 04 for the Paralympics, and and I mean this is this kind of some sums up everything you're saying.
00:44:19.679 --> 00:44:23.360
Is like I had no idea what I was getting myself into, none whatsoever.
00:44:23.599 --> 00:44:30.559
And we walk out of the tunnel for opening ceremonies, and we're in the the opening ceremony stadium, and it's packed with 130,000 people.
00:44:30.800 --> 00:44:35.760
I'm like, what am I getting myself into?
00:44:35.840 --> 00:44:36.000
Right.
00:44:36.159 --> 00:44:42.079
And and and then the gravity of the situation really starts to set in, and you're like, holy man, well, this is surreal.
00:44:42.159 --> 00:44:42.559
Yeah, right.
00:44:42.639 --> 00:44:47.199
And you walk out, and and my my brother and my my my best friend is my brother.
00:44:47.280 --> 00:44:57.199
Uh they were there, my mom was there, my aunt was there, and they're like, Yeah, you'll see us, don't worry, we'll be in the crowd, we'll be in like we'll be in like khaki shirts, you know, we'll have a ball cap on, you'll find us.
00:44:57.440 --> 00:44:59.119
This is a walla walla football stadium.
00:44:59.360 --> 00:45:00.559
Yeah, you're like, what?
00:45:00.960 --> 00:45:04.719
And then and then the tennis was full with 15,000 people in the stadium.
00:45:05.599 --> 00:45:07.920
Yeah, so it was a totally different like.
00:45:08.320 --> 00:45:09.760
All right, so wow.
00:45:10.079 --> 00:45:13.920
Tell us about like the you were saying, like, whoa, I don't know what I'm getting myself into.
00:45:14.159 --> 00:45:17.119
Nerves, um, anxiety, yeah.
00:45:17.199 --> 00:45:25.519
But believe it or not, yeah, believe it or not, zero nerves because I really, really didn't quite grasp the gravity of the situation.
00:45:25.679 --> 00:45:27.119
I did not fully get it.
00:45:27.519 --> 00:45:32.559
To be honest, 04 was the best games I've ever been to because there was no pressure.
00:45:32.719 --> 00:45:42.480
There, there was no, like, I didn't really know the realistically, the only pressure I had was I was living with my grandparents at the time, and we were watching the winter games in 2002.
00:45:42.559 --> 00:45:46.079
And we're my my grandma loved the figure skating, loved it.
00:45:46.239 --> 00:45:48.880
And the Americans took silver in that that event.
00:45:49.039 --> 00:45:54.000
And and I remember watching it with my grandma, and I remember saying, Wow, look at that, we got silver, that's so great.
00:45:54.159 --> 00:45:56.719
And she's like, Might as well have been 12th place.
00:45:56.880 --> 00:46:03.039
And I'm like, Holy crap! Like, grandma, so you had that in your mind, only pressure, like in my family back.
00:46:06.239 --> 00:46:07.519
You're like coming home with anything.
00:46:08.400 --> 00:46:10.239
If you weren't first, yeah, you're not coming home.
00:46:10.320 --> 00:46:13.119
And so that was your first gold.
00:46:13.440 --> 00:46:16.559
That was my first gold, and then I made the the single, that was gold, was doubles.
00:46:16.719 --> 00:46:19.519
I made the singles final, and I lost won the silver.
00:46:19.760 --> 00:46:35.199
Um, but from that moment on, then the pressure and the anxiety and the the the realization of what I was starting to go down that road of of like I'm potentially gonna set records and and be at a level.
00:46:35.760 --> 00:46:38.880
Well, did you never did Grima call with that silver in singles?
00:46:40.079 --> 00:46:40.880
I showed her the gold.
00:46:41.679 --> 00:46:43.679
He's like, there was no silver.
00:46:44.400 --> 00:46:45.920
I didn't play single grimacing.
00:46:46.239 --> 00:46:49.760
Yeah, no, of course, you know, when you see it, she's like, oh my gosh.
00:46:50.000 --> 00:46:54.960
But no, and and yeah, but that's when the pressure, when I really felt the pressure was after 04.
00:46:55.360 --> 00:46:56.559
So after the success.
00:46:56.800 --> 00:46:58.320
Yeah, and the pressure sets in the city.
00:46:58.639 --> 00:46:59.280
For me, it was, yeah.
00:46:59.599 --> 00:47:04.559
But it but that was again, it was like I truly didn't know what I was getting myself into.
00:47:04.719 --> 00:47:06.400
The the Paralympics are huge, right?
00:47:06.480 --> 00:47:12.960
They're they're the third largest sporting event behind uh World Cup, Olympics, and then Paralympics in the world, right?
00:47:13.199 --> 00:47:14.559
They're the third largest event.
00:47:14.719 --> 00:47:19.760
But I didn't know what Paralympics were before I got hurt, and most able-bodied people don't.
00:47:20.079 --> 00:47:34.320
The Paralympics are massive for individuals who are disabled from an early onset uh birth disability, or or maybe as a young kid get hurt, and that is all they have to strive for.
00:47:34.480 --> 00:47:37.760
Like I was never striving to be a Paralympian as an able-bodied person, right?
00:47:37.840 --> 00:47:40.559
I wanted to be an Olympian or a pro basketball player.
00:47:40.960 --> 00:47:41.440
Trailblazer.
00:47:41.599 --> 00:47:42.559
Yeah, exactly.
00:47:42.639 --> 00:47:42.719
Right.
00:47:42.960 --> 00:47:43.440
Sonics.
00:47:43.679 --> 00:47:44.639
Sonics, yeah, yeah.
00:47:44.880 --> 00:48:02.079
But yeah, so so for for me, and then playing for for three years leading into that, uh playing in really small uh crowds, I just thought, oh yeah, well, this is just gonna be a cool, fun event that that the USTA or the US OPC pays for, and I don't have to pay for this one event, thank goodness.
00:48:02.320 --> 00:48:07.920
And then the the reality of it set in, and you're just like, oh crap, this is massive, right?
00:48:08.000 --> 00:48:17.199
Because then then you start getting endorsement deals and you start getting like you you become recognizable within the sport.
00:48:17.280 --> 00:48:19.199
Yeah, and that was never my intention.
00:48:19.440 --> 00:48:20.239
Never my intention.
00:48:20.400 --> 00:48:24.639
My intention was literally uh play the sport, get as good as I can be.
00:48:24.880 --> 00:48:30.079
I originally my intention was get good enough to hit tennis balls with my then girlfriend, and that was it.
00:48:30.239 --> 00:48:30.639
That was it.
00:48:30.880 --> 00:48:33.920
But then you start learning about everything else and what what's out there.
00:48:34.480 --> 00:48:36.800
So when when the the pressure came, right?
00:48:36.960 --> 00:48:46.639
Whether whether that was the Grand Slams or the next 08 Olympics, yeah, you know, for our listeners and for us too, like you know, so we can help uh players better.
00:48:46.719 --> 00:48:47.840
Like, how did you handle that?
00:48:48.000 --> 00:48:57.840
What were things or if you can share with us, like what were maybe patterns or rituals that you developed, you know, to be able to handle pressure?
00:48:58.000 --> 00:49:02.079
Because that's at your level, that's a whole different atmosphere.
00:49:02.320 --> 00:49:05.760
But maybe us mortals down here can understand something.
00:49:06.079 --> 00:49:06.880
I don't know about that.
00:49:07.119 --> 00:49:13.119
Uh I mean, look, if if you're striving to be the best at anything, the best CEO, the best coach, right?
00:49:13.440 --> 00:49:16.719
There is the pressure that sometimes is self-imposed, right?
00:49:16.880 --> 00:49:19.039
Self-inflicted pressure that we put on ourselves.
00:49:19.360 --> 00:49:30.719
Uh but but what you the the way you come up come through it for me was again being prepared and being ready was always huge for me.
00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:33.039
If I was underprepared, I knew it.
00:49:33.280 --> 00:49:38.000
And I I I knew I was gonna struggle that that event if I was underprepared.
00:49:38.079 --> 00:49:39.199
And I hated that feeling.
00:49:39.360 --> 00:49:41.679
I just didn't like being underprepared.
00:49:41.840 --> 00:49:44.719
So I wanted to make sure I was prepared to the fullest.
00:49:44.800 --> 00:49:46.480
And and I wasn't gonna win everything.
00:49:46.639 --> 00:49:50.239
I mean, I had a lot of success and won a lot, but but not everything.
00:49:50.480 --> 00:49:52.079
How many grand slimes have you did you win?
00:49:52.239 --> 00:49:53.360
Uh until 29.
00:49:53.679 --> 00:49:54.320
29, okay.
00:49:54.719 --> 00:49:54.960
Yeah.
00:49:55.199 --> 00:49:56.000
I didn't win anything.
00:49:56.239 --> 00:49:56.880
I didn't win everything.
00:49:57.280 --> 00:49:58.960
No, I mean insane.
00:49:59.519 --> 00:50:02.320
I don't know how many I don't know how many I lost either, but yeah.
00:50:02.480 --> 00:50:23.039
So um, but but yeah, so so I I I I used that as like uh, okay, when I lost, we always focus on a little more of the loss and and getting better from the loss, but I also really focused on what I did well to win, you know, and and so I really focused on both sides of it.
00:50:23.199 --> 00:50:26.320
Um what what worked and what didn't work within the win.
00:50:26.400 --> 00:50:27.760
I mean, that's the beauty of tennis, right?
00:50:27.840 --> 00:50:32.079
It's like there's so many facets to the to each match, each game, each point.
00:50:32.559 --> 00:50:32.960
Yeah, exactly.
00:50:33.119 --> 00:50:34.639
All the in-between.
00:50:34.960 --> 00:50:41.360
Yeah, and so so I leaned on coaches, I leaned on other players, uh, always family, always family.
00:50:41.440 --> 00:50:50.719
I mean, I could I could call my mom at any hour, no matter where I was in the world, and explain to her, hey, I lost bad, or hey, I won big, or I I squeaked out a win or whatever.
00:50:50.880 --> 00:50:57.280
And she was always like, okay, well, and and she was so good because she was an athlete herself, and she was like, Okay, so what are we taking from that?
00:50:57.440 --> 00:50:57.840
Yeah, right.
00:50:58.000 --> 00:51:02.639
And she's proud of me, but like, okay, so so what did you do that got you there?
00:51:02.800 --> 00:51:11.119
And the stuff you did before, you can't really uh like you just lean on that when you're in the middle of it, but then in the middle of it, you're like, Well, I don't know what I did.
00:51:11.199 --> 00:51:13.679
So let me ask a coach or let me ask another player, right?
00:51:13.840 --> 00:51:16.000
Somebody who was on my team supporting me.
00:51:16.159 --> 00:51:22.960
Um, and and so I just surrounded myself with very supportive uh individuals, and that that really made a huge difference.
00:51:23.280 --> 00:51:23.599
Got it.
00:51:23.840 --> 00:51:32.639
And and it and the difference too, I think, in our sport is it was individuals that were supporting you, and it felt it felt real.
00:51:32.880 --> 00:51:34.000
I wasn't paying them.
00:51:34.320 --> 00:51:39.920
I wasn't paying a coach to be my PR, you know, hype man, right?
00:51:40.000 --> 00:51:40.719
I wasn't paying somebody.
00:51:42.400 --> 00:51:44.960
It was just it was they wanted me to get better.
00:51:45.039 --> 00:51:46.559
Uh it didn't impact their job.
00:51:46.639 --> 00:51:54.079
They were getting paid from the USTA or the US OPC, regardless of my results, but they really wanted me to get better.
00:51:54.400 --> 00:52:03.760
And when you start seeing that, then regardless of what they were making, it's like, man, this guy and this woman, this this coach really has my best interest.
00:52:04.000 --> 00:52:06.239
And I also don't want to let that person down.
00:52:06.559 --> 00:52:09.119
So I'm gonna work harder and and work together.
00:52:09.199 --> 00:52:18.239
And was there ever a time in your career where you dipped, you know, where it just wasn't all success?
00:52:19.360 --> 00:52:21.599
And if so, how did you handle it?
00:52:22.000 --> 00:52:22.480
Sure.
00:52:22.719 --> 00:52:30.079
Uh the uh the not not the end towards the end of my career, which is still sort of in the end of the career right now.
00:52:30.239 --> 00:52:32.079
I'm still deciding what I'm doing.
00:52:32.239 --> 00:52:47.199
Um but no, I I would say I think I won my last single slam in eight eighteen, maybe seventeen, seventeen or eighteen, I think, and it was the US Open uh in singles, and then I won a twenty-four, I won the the doubles at AO.
00:52:47.920 --> 00:52:59.840
Um but in between that eighteen to twenty-four period, there were there were times that so there were times in the in the career where I was 15 to 18 to 20 tournaments a year that I had won.
00:53:00.159 --> 00:53:06.480
And all of a sudden I'm like dipping down, which sounds terrible to say this, but down to like only six tournaments I won, right?
00:53:06.559 --> 00:53:07.440
And you're like, huh.
00:53:08.159 --> 00:53:11.440
How many I I read it somewhere, how many, how many career titles did you have?
00:53:11.679 --> 00:53:15.599
Oh, in singles, I think I have 170 career titles.
00:53:15.920 --> 00:53:19.199
In doubles in doubles, I think I'm 180, 198.
00:53:19.440 --> 00:53:20.000
Is that the most?
00:53:20.079 --> 00:53:20.800
Is that a record?
00:53:21.039 --> 00:53:22.400
I think it's I think it's gotta be.
00:53:22.880 --> 00:53:23.679
I think it is, yeah.
00:53:23.760 --> 00:53:24.320
I think it is.
00:53:24.480 --> 00:53:29.280
I mean, combined, I don't know what that equates to, but I think I might be second to Martina.
00:53:29.519 --> 00:53:30.320
You're the teacher, man.
00:53:30.480 --> 00:53:32.480
Oh man, hold on math.
00:53:33.760 --> 00:53:34.480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
00:53:34.480 --> 00:53:35.679
I didn't say I taught race.
00:53:36.159 --> 00:53:36.320
Right.
00:53:36.400 --> 00:53:37.760
So go back to that Martina.
00:53:38.079 --> 00:53:43.280
Martina Navartilova, wow, who has obviously singles, doubles, mixed doubles.
00:53:44.000 --> 00:53:44.079
Yeah.
00:53:44.159 --> 00:53:45.440
So that combined all of hers.
00:53:45.519 --> 00:53:46.960
Just like mine, it combines all of mine.
00:53:47.039 --> 00:53:47.280
Yeah.
00:53:47.360 --> 00:53:49.440
Um, so back to back to my question.
00:53:49.599 --> 00:53:51.440
So you're winning just six tournaments.
00:53:51.599 --> 00:53:51.760
Yeah.
00:53:51.920 --> 00:53:53.920
Now it's like a down year, maybe a struggle.
00:53:54.159 --> 00:53:57.119
Yeah, it felt I I was I was also very fortunate.
00:53:57.199 --> 00:54:02.559
I never had injuries until way late in my career when I blew out my shoulders and stuff.
00:54:02.719 --> 00:54:07.119
Um, but I I up until 24-25, I had no injuries.
00:54:07.280 --> 00:54:10.320
So when my I mean I started to practice with you 24-25.
00:54:10.400 --> 00:54:10.800
That was my fault.
00:54:11.199 --> 00:54:11.599
Yeah, right.
00:54:11.760 --> 00:54:12.079
Right.
00:54:12.159 --> 00:54:14.320
This guy blew out my shoulders working me too hard.
00:54:14.400 --> 00:54:16.880
I'm not, I wasn't a spry 24-year-old anymore.
00:54:17.199 --> 00:54:18.239
Back to your basketball coach.
00:54:18.400 --> 00:54:18.800
Yeah, right.
00:54:19.760 --> 00:54:20.079
Yeah.
00:54:20.239 --> 00:54:33.039
Um, no, but but um no, I I just got in a situation where um it it it never tore me down and never made me not want to keep going, but you definitely felt it.
00:54:33.119 --> 00:54:34.719
And then and then you saw the shift.
00:54:34.800 --> 00:54:41.519
And and you guys know in this sport, it's kind of raise them up, chew on them for a while, then spit them out, right?
00:54:41.599 --> 00:54:43.840
Like, like, like on to the next, right?
00:54:44.079 --> 00:54:51.679
And and you know, things changed in the USTA and and my what I thought was support staff through that changed.
00:54:51.840 --> 00:54:56.239
Uh, the dynamic changed, and and I really felt this dip down.
00:54:56.719 --> 00:55:01.199
And I I was super fortunate though to be living out at the Olympic Training Center during this time.
00:55:01.519 --> 00:55:15.840
And I was able to immerse myself not not just in sports psychology, uh, which was super beneficial for me, uh, but I was around other athletes who also were going through a lot of the same issues.
00:55:16.159 --> 00:55:17.280
So back to community you've got to do.
00:55:17.440 --> 00:55:18.480
Yeah, I just had this community.
00:55:18.559 --> 00:55:24.559
And and I wasn't just around disabled athletes at the time, I was around, you know, Ryan Krauser, the the shot put gold medalist, right?
00:55:24.719 --> 00:55:26.800
Like world record holder in Shot Put, right?
00:55:26.880 --> 00:55:32.239
And and I'm struggling to bench that day, and he's over there screaming at me, Wags, push it, push it, right?
00:55:32.320 --> 00:55:33.760
And you're like, Well, I can't let him down.
00:55:33.840 --> 00:55:34.400
Yeah, right.
00:55:34.480 --> 00:55:43.199
So so so there was this extra encouragement from from this community of athletes, not not just disabled athletes.
00:55:43.280 --> 00:55:57.039
And so the the dip was never while it was a big dip to go from 18 to 20 tournaments winning to to five or six, it was never a oh, I'm done, I'm throwing in the towel, it's it's time type of thing.
00:55:57.119 --> 00:55:59.599
It's like, okay, what can I do to get back to there?
00:55:59.760 --> 00:56:05.679
Yeah, you know, and and and what support staff do I find and and who do I go through, right?
00:56:05.840 --> 00:56:12.719
And and that was when you know reached out to you, or you you and I talked, and you're like, dude, train out of here full time, we'll we'll help you and support you.
00:56:12.880 --> 00:56:16.400
And I mean, I had been training out of here, but not full-time, because I had the center.
00:56:16.559 --> 00:56:23.840
And and so you and I trained, and then yeah, in 24 won AO and yeah, and and things started its way back up.
00:56:24.000 --> 00:56:28.079
And uh Yeah, I mean, uh, but I'm not getting younger, right?
00:56:28.159 --> 00:56:30.880
So so so like there's a time that it comes to me.
00:56:31.280 --> 00:56:34.239
Yeah, but if you're to speak to uh, I mean, the show, serving the future.
00:56:34.400 --> 00:56:44.320
If you're to speak to the future of uh uh a young David Wagner or you know, any of the kids in the Steve Adamson Tennis Academy, what would you tell them during that kind of dip?
00:56:44.559 --> 00:56:48.559
I hear community, you know, I'm hearing pushing support system.
00:56:50.000 --> 00:56:54.800
Sounds like your mom was a big backbone to the biggest, yeah, biggest, biggest, biggest.
00:56:54.880 --> 00:56:59.440
I could call her, like I said, any time of day, anywhere in the world, and she'd never not answer.
00:57:00.079 --> 00:57:01.679
That's a huge thing, though, right?
00:57:01.760 --> 00:57:11.440
I think like the for a lot of the tennis players, it's like that one person who you know was it's just that backbone for even these top players, right?
00:57:11.519 --> 00:57:23.920
Like Fetter, in my opinion, if he doesn't have Mirka, it's it's just a different that she was the backbone, she was the one that kept him going, telling him he was great, kept him in line.
00:57:24.320 --> 00:57:40.639
And she he could always trust her, always right, and so like for with your mom, it sounds like she was that person that not only just kept you going through all the adversity, but was you knew that she was in your corner, yeah, and and in such a positive way, yeah.
00:57:40.800 --> 00:57:44.800
Not like she was you know beating you in the corner or anything like that, right?
00:57:45.039 --> 00:57:46.639
Maybe you lost, exactly.
00:57:47.360 --> 00:57:47.760
Exactly.
00:57:47.920 --> 00:57:49.280
Get home now, you're done.
00:57:49.599 --> 00:57:49.920
Yeah, right.
00:57:50.159 --> 00:57:51.440
No, no, yeah, 100%.
00:57:51.840 --> 00:57:53.679
That that that that is what it was.
00:57:53.840 --> 00:58:03.280
And and I I I think what I would say, you know, it's easy to say what I would say to myself because I would say the same thing that I'm doing now to myself that was doing it then, right?
00:58:03.440 --> 00:58:16.880
Just keep plugging away and and have self-belief, you know, and and I think that's huge, that self-belief, um, regardless of what's around you and who others are are trying to bring you down or or yeah, but you have to for self-belief.
00:58:17.119 --> 00:58:21.599
I I strongly believe, like to Steve's point, like you do have to have somebody in your corner.
00:58:21.760 --> 00:58:22.480
Yeah, you have to have it.
00:58:22.559 --> 00:58:32.320
Because you're gonna like you said, regardless of what position you're in, self-imposed pressure and and well, torture is gonna happen.
00:58:32.480 --> 00:58:35.199
I was gonna say for human where you get that self-belief.
00:58:35.280 --> 00:58:35.679
Yeah, right.
00:58:35.760 --> 00:58:40.159
It doesn't just, you don't just pull it out of thin air, you get it from that person.
00:58:40.480 --> 00:58:42.159
And that person for me was my mom.
00:58:42.239 --> 00:58:43.840
Yeah, I could always lean back on her.
00:58:43.920 --> 00:58:52.000
If the USTA was giving pushback to me and and and we were uh going different directions, I didn't use that for self-belief.
00:58:52.079 --> 00:58:52.880
I where did I go?
00:58:53.039 --> 00:58:55.280
I went to the one person that that provided that.
00:58:55.599 --> 00:59:00.880
And then I was always able, even when I dipped, I was always able to fall back on that.
00:59:01.039 --> 00:59:03.920
And then and then I found new people, right?
00:59:04.000 --> 00:59:08.559
Like Brian and I have had multiple talks about stuff, and and that helps.
00:59:08.719 --> 00:59:08.880
Yeah.
00:59:09.119 --> 00:59:16.400
Having that somebody that that understands it and somebody that's kind of been through a little bit of it and can can help you through it.
00:59:16.559 --> 00:59:23.280
And and so I I would say keep the self-belief, but find the person that helps you stay where your self-belief is.
00:59:23.440 --> 00:59:28.639
I mean, obviously, we're not just always gonna be like, oh, screw everybody else, always believe in myself and be the best, right?
00:59:28.800 --> 00:59:32.000
We gotta have a the community or the package or the people in our lives.
00:59:32.239 --> 00:59:32.800
That's amazing.
00:59:33.360 --> 00:59:38.480
And and that's what trickle, you know, the whole impact of getting down and coming back up with those people.
00:59:38.719 --> 00:59:39.920
Yeah, that's crazy.
00:59:40.239 --> 00:59:43.760
I was gonna give a little bit uh just for our audience.
00:59:43.920 --> 00:59:47.199
So you've been around all the slams, right?
00:59:47.519 --> 00:59:53.679
So many of the the players that everybody knows that that the household names, they all love you, right?
00:59:53.920 --> 00:59:59.119
There's gotta be a funny story or two that uh you've had with uh some of those players.
00:59:59.599 --> 01:00:01.199
Oh, yeah, there's a lot to be honest.
01:00:01.519 --> 01:00:04.239
Any that you can actually tell the family show.
01:00:05.599 --> 01:00:06.480
Yes, yes, yes.
01:00:06.719 --> 01:00:19.199
So so the probably probably the the best one was I was doing Arthur S Kids Day, and uh I was on court with Roger, Rafa, Serena, and two like JTCC juniors.
01:00:19.280 --> 01:00:22.480
Okay, right, like like you know, like top, yeah, top level juniors.
01:00:22.559 --> 01:00:24.639
And we're out there trying to hit targets, right?
01:00:24.719 --> 01:00:32.719
And and uh and because I have to get in my wheelchair and tape up, I did it kind of in the blue room before leave getting out onto Arthur Ash Stadium, right?
01:00:32.880 --> 01:00:41.199
And I'm I'm getting in my chair and I'm taping up, and Roger's looking at me, and he's just kind of just watching, and I'm like, Do you want to tape the racket to your hand?
01:00:41.360 --> 01:00:42.800
Like, like, you want to try it?
01:00:43.039 --> 01:00:46.480
He's like and he without even missing the beat, he's like, sure, I could do that.
01:00:46.639 --> 01:00:48.639
And I'm like, I believe you.
01:00:49.599 --> 01:00:49.920
Right?
01:00:50.159 --> 01:01:00.559
And so we wheel out together and on the court, and he's just like, I have a picture, it's beautiful, and and he's just like walking with me and he's looking down, and and I know exactly what I'm telling him and what grip I'm using.
01:01:00.639 --> 01:01:03.039
And he's like, I use an Eastern forehand.
01:01:03.199 --> 01:01:04.960
And I'm like, Yeah, where do you think I learned it from?
01:01:05.039 --> 01:01:12.800
Right, and and so I get out there and I get out there, and and I'm I'm literally like trying to hit targets with Rafa, Serena, and Roger.
01:01:12.960 --> 01:01:15.199
And I'm like, I'm missing, I think I got six.
01:01:15.360 --> 01:01:17.519
And I'm like, I felt good about getting six, right?
01:01:17.599 --> 01:01:20.320
But they get out there and they're like 19 and 20 hits, right?
01:01:20.639 --> 01:01:26.159
And in in for me in wheelchair tennis, I I sliced my backhand more than I hit top spin.
01:01:26.400 --> 01:01:27.280
Because of the eastern grip.
01:01:27.519 --> 01:01:28.480
Because of the eastern grip, yeah.
01:01:28.960 --> 01:01:30.400
You're not changing your grip for anything.
01:01:30.639 --> 01:01:37.920
Yeah, so for me to hit top spin, I have to take the forehand side of the racket, windshield wiper it, and use the same side of the racket.
01:01:38.159 --> 01:01:41.280
So I can't be, I'm not, I don't switching to an eastern backhand, right?
01:01:41.360 --> 01:01:45.679
So I'm not and but for the listeners, for the serve, but also to push.
01:01:45.920 --> 01:01:46.400
For everything, yeah.
01:01:48.719 --> 01:01:50.400
I'm pushing out of it with your racket in it.
01:01:50.639 --> 01:01:56.159
With my racket taped to my hand in an eastern volleys, overheads, back everything.
01:01:56.320 --> 01:02:01.440
I I would just say to like juniors, if your shoulder's a little hurt, yeah, no complaints.
01:02:03.360 --> 01:02:05.119
Let's uh let's let's be realistic here.
01:02:05.440 --> 01:02:07.039
So we're out there and we're mic'd up, right?
01:02:07.119 --> 01:02:09.679
And this is kind of the first time I've been on a court and mic'ed up.
01:02:09.760 --> 01:02:10.960
And and I'll never forget it.
01:02:11.039 --> 01:02:19.519
I'm like, I get done and I hit, and and Serena's giving me a hug, and and Rafa and and Fed are like giving me high fives, and the kids are getting ready to go, and we're all just having a good time.
01:02:19.599 --> 01:02:25.519
And I'm like, I without even skipping a beat thinking I'm mic'd up, I'm like, I guess I'm here just to make you guys look better.
01:02:26.000 --> 01:02:30.320
It goes over the whole wow, like in the whole thing of Arthur Ash, right?
01:02:30.480 --> 01:02:32.320
And you can just hear the crowd like just start laughing.
01:02:32.400 --> 01:02:34.079
That's and I'm like so funny.
01:02:34.400 --> 01:02:35.280
That is so funny.
01:02:35.840 --> 01:02:36.559
Oh, that's good.
01:02:36.719 --> 01:02:40.239
But but I've just been like so fortunate to do so much stuff like that.
01:02:40.400 --> 01:02:49.599
I mean, like, you know, I I've I've played with Novak uh multiple times and and have kindled up like a really beautiful friendship with the guy.
01:02:49.760 --> 01:02:55.519
In fact, he wants to have me come out and do some wheelchair stuff out in in his country and get some stuff started.
01:02:55.599 --> 01:02:57.360
So it's just just a really good people.
01:02:57.519 --> 01:03:08.159
And and the beauty of it is, and I you hear this a lot from like Roger, people that know Roger or Rafa, and it's like once you've met them and they know you, they will almost always stop and say, Hey, how are you?
01:03:08.480 --> 01:03:09.519
And that that's true.
01:03:09.760 --> 01:03:10.480
They literally do.
01:03:10.559 --> 01:03:14.960
If I if I'm at Wimbledon and they're at Wimbledon and we walk by each other, they'll literally stop, hey David, how you been?
01:03:15.119 --> 01:03:15.360
Right.
01:03:15.440 --> 01:03:18.960
And you're just like, Man, like this is Jesus talking to me, right?
01:03:19.119 --> 01:03:20.880
And you're like, Good Lord, right?
01:03:20.960 --> 01:03:23.679
So um, but just beautiful things, you know.
01:03:23.760 --> 01:03:36.239
I I I I was there when Daniel Collins played the final at the Australian Open, and I sat in her player box and and got the router on and just had a blast, and then watched Ash Barty beat her and be part of that environment.
01:03:36.400 --> 01:03:38.000
I mean, just beautiful, right?
01:03:38.079 --> 01:03:43.199
And and and we're in the locker room with them, and so so there's a equal mutual respect too.
01:03:43.440 --> 01:03:45.679
So David, we could probably chat.
01:03:45.840 --> 01:03:50.320
I mean, your career is just amazing, and we can go forever, and and we'd love to have you back.
01:03:50.559 --> 01:03:51.440
Yeah, I'd love to care about it.
01:03:51.679 --> 01:03:53.440
Let's do another episode, yeah, for sure.
01:03:53.760 --> 01:03:57.119
But to kind of wrap things up, you know, what's next?
01:03:57.280 --> 01:03:59.840
I I know you know, uh you're doing camps.
01:04:00.000 --> 01:04:03.679
You want to tell the audience maybe maybe there's somebody out there that would love to join that.
01:04:03.760 --> 01:04:05.119
What do you do with your camps?
01:04:05.519 --> 01:04:08.800
So I I run wheelchair tennis camps all over the world.
01:04:08.880 --> 01:04:10.079
I've done it for years.
01:04:10.239 --> 01:04:12.159
Uh, Egypt, Holland, Germany.
01:04:12.239 --> 01:04:14.639
I've done them everywhere, especially here in the States.
01:04:14.719 --> 01:04:20.239
I'm still doing a couple in the States uh this year and maybe get one here at Barnes one time.
01:04:20.320 --> 01:04:20.559
Yeah.
01:04:20.639 --> 01:04:21.679
Uh get one going.
01:04:21.840 --> 01:04:39.119
Um, but but that's uh kind of kind of what I would like to see myself transition into is some coaching more and helping the the younger generation, uh especially kids who who who maybe want to get into college or maybe get that opportunity to play at the Grand Slam in the junior event.
01:04:39.199 --> 01:04:46.960
Yeah, just like the able-bodied juniors, you might make it to there, but you probably have less of a chance to get into now the main draw.
01:04:47.119 --> 01:04:51.840
So if we can get you in there and and move forward and get you into college or get you somewhere going.
01:04:52.000 --> 01:04:58.719
So um, yeah, doing some one-on-one stuff with some guys here, some some of the juniors here at Barnes and uh in the area.
01:04:58.880 --> 01:05:03.599
So yeah, just kind of giving back to a sport that gave me so so much.
01:05:03.920 --> 01:05:05.199
And uh and I love it, right?
01:05:05.280 --> 01:05:15.440
Like I get to kind of use that teacher mindset again and and get back into it as as you guys know being coaches, how how good that feels and and how how challenging it can be at the same time.
01:05:15.679 --> 01:05:17.280
I went to college and that's what I wanted to do.
01:05:17.360 --> 01:05:18.960
I wanted I went to school to become a teacher.
01:05:19.119 --> 01:05:19.519
So awesome.
01:05:19.920 --> 01:05:24.880
And when I was um finishing my degree, I was also an assistant and I fell in love with coaching.
01:05:25.119 --> 01:05:25.360
Nice.
01:05:25.519 --> 01:05:29.360
But you know, maybe there's something with teaching and coaching and sports.
01:05:29.519 --> 01:05:40.239
So well, and and we also have uh not just junior um uh Grand Slams, we also have junior World Team Cup, which is our equivalent of Billie Jean King Cup and Davis Cup.
01:05:40.480 --> 01:05:44.559
So now we have an event that's exclusive for our juniors from each country.
01:05:44.719 --> 01:05:55.199
And now you have not only an opportunity to play in junior Grand Slams at collegiate tennis, now you get an opportunity to represent your country at an event that's that's the junior Davis Cup, Billie Jean King Cup.
01:05:55.440 --> 01:05:56.239
Well, I would love to see.
01:05:56.320 --> 01:06:06.559
I mean, you're talking about coaching and one on one stuff, but uh I would just think it's so valuable for the future to have somebody like you also, you know, in a chair.
01:06:06.719 --> 01:06:06.880
Right.
01:06:07.039 --> 01:06:08.239
Because you know right.
01:06:08.880 --> 01:06:16.400
For me, when I would practice with you, um, I would have to check myself be like, hey, he's not you know, running from side to side.
01:06:16.480 --> 01:06:17.760
The strategy is a little different.
01:06:18.159 --> 01:06:19.760
The goal sometimes is a little different.
01:06:20.000 --> 01:06:26.400
So I mean, it would be really valuable if you were to continue to mentor and lead the next generation.
01:06:27.119 --> 01:06:27.599
I would love it.
01:06:27.679 --> 01:06:29.679
I mean, that that's what I would love more than anything.
01:06:29.760 --> 01:06:33.440
And and just help, help, help, and support and and be that.
01:06:33.519 --> 01:06:36.880
Like when there's a dip and you need to lean on me, lean on me, right?
01:06:36.960 --> 01:06:37.519
Like I'll be there.
01:06:38.400 --> 01:06:38.719
You know what?
01:06:38.960 --> 01:06:39.199
Right, yeah.
01:06:39.440 --> 01:06:44.079
That's how you can help people when you've been through it, and that's a you'd be a huge mentor for that.
01:06:44.400 --> 01:06:45.760
Yeah, well, I I appreciate that.
01:06:45.840 --> 01:06:49.039
I would I love it and you know, love to do more.
01:06:49.280 --> 01:06:56.079
Yeah, and and to to wrap things up, the last um maybe you want to give us a little uh information about this documentary.
01:06:56.239 --> 01:06:57.519
I've I've been able to see it.
01:06:57.679 --> 01:06:58.480
Can you tell us about it?
01:06:58.800 --> 01:07:12.239
Yeah, so uh I was off uh asked to be part of a documentary, a short series documentaries about 30 minutes, and it was uh put on by um uh a pr a group program called uh Your Everyday Heroes.
01:07:15.119 --> 01:07:15.920
Excuse me.
01:07:16.800 --> 01:07:20.719
And uh we've been to a couple film festivals already.
01:07:20.960 --> 01:07:24.079
Uh we won an award at a film festival, we were audience choice award.
01:07:24.400 --> 01:07:30.400
And it's it's basically just I mean as if it wasn't enough here for this, but it's basically just my life story.
01:07:30.639 --> 01:07:44.079
And uh just sharing that and and showing how it actually showed up at one of my camps and filmed at my camp uh in Virginia and um and then went to a tournament with me.
01:07:44.239 --> 01:07:46.800
Um and and just yeah, it's been really cool.
01:07:47.119 --> 01:07:48.480
Yeah, it's a beautiful fun.
01:07:48.639 --> 01:07:49.280
It's a beautiful story.
01:07:49.360 --> 01:07:49.840
I got to see it.
01:07:50.000 --> 01:07:50.480
Wow, thank you.
01:07:50.639 --> 01:07:51.039
Appreciate it.
01:07:51.280 --> 01:07:58.159
Is it how will it be public for you can you can get it at um uh it's on YouTube now.
01:07:58.400 --> 01:08:00.800
Um it's called Lines of Determination.
01:08:01.039 --> 01:08:02.079
Maybe we can share that.
01:08:04.079 --> 01:08:08.000
And I think you can link through, it's still on the uh your everyday heroes website.
01:08:08.159 --> 01:08:08.320
Okay.
01:08:08.480 --> 01:08:08.719
For sure.
01:08:08.800 --> 01:08:10.079
It'll always be on there.
01:08:10.400 --> 01:08:11.119
Well, that's awesome.
01:08:11.360 --> 01:08:13.280
But it was funny when they they asked me real quick.
01:08:13.360 --> 01:08:18.800
They asked me, like, I got an email from the the director, film guy, the the one guy did it all.
01:08:19.039 --> 01:08:19.439
One guy.
01:08:20.000 --> 01:08:27.760
Producer did his producing part, Albert uh Crane did his, and Alex Del Monte did the the filming and and the editing and everything all by himself.
01:08:27.920 --> 01:08:33.199
Um, and he he he sent me an email and he's like, Hey, hey, Wags, would you mind if we we do a documentary on you?
01:08:33.439 --> 01:08:36.560
And I'm like, I'm like, I don't know.
01:08:36.800 --> 01:08:39.039
Because I'm thinking the guy's just gonna show up with his iPhone, right?
01:08:39.119 --> 01:08:41.119
And like, hey, tell us about your life.
01:08:41.359 --> 01:08:45.119
And this dude shows up with tripods and and a soul setup, right?
01:08:45.279 --> 01:08:53.600
This huge camera and just goes to town, and then he starts telling me, yeah, you know, I do commercials for all state national commercials, and like he's legit.
01:08:53.760 --> 01:08:58.560
And then he shows me just a snippet, and I'm like, Oh, this is gonna be really good, right?
01:08:58.720 --> 01:09:01.920
So I'm like, wow, yeah, keep it going, right?
01:09:02.319 --> 01:09:06.960
So, you know, and one thing I wish, I wish that my mom was still here and she could see it.
01:09:07.039 --> 01:09:12.319
I I think she would love it, and and so um, but yeah, it it's it was I was honored to see it.
01:09:12.479 --> 01:09:19.680
I was honored to to have a 30-minute documentary on me, and now it's in all these film festivals, and I get to go to some of them, so that's fun.
01:09:19.760 --> 01:09:21.840
Yeah, so that's fantastic.
01:09:21.920 --> 01:09:24.239
Well, it's always uh great seeing you out here, Barnes.
01:09:24.479 --> 01:09:26.000
You've always got a smile on your face.
01:09:26.560 --> 01:09:30.239
Every player that's been on the court with you just has the greatest things to say about you.
01:09:30.720 --> 01:09:30.880
Thank you.
01:09:30.960 --> 01:09:31.119
Thank you.
01:09:31.279 --> 01:09:32.560
It's really nice seeing you out there.
01:09:32.720 --> 01:09:33.439
Uh thanks.
01:09:33.600 --> 01:09:39.680
Um nice that you could come and join us and share all of that wisdom of yours with our audience.
01:09:40.000 --> 01:09:42.560
Just experiences, old age experiences.
01:09:42.880 --> 01:09:46.239
But we gotta we gotta do a wheelchair day with the Steve Adams Academy.
01:09:46.560 --> 01:09:46.880
Sounds good.
01:09:47.279 --> 01:09:49.199
We should do it because we've got so many chairs now.
01:09:49.359 --> 01:09:50.399
I'll bring the medals out.
01:09:50.479 --> 01:09:54.079
We'll show that the kids see the medals, get them in the chairs, let them play like a day.
01:09:54.319 --> 01:09:54.720
Let's do it.
01:09:54.800 --> 01:09:55.199
They'll love that.
01:09:55.439 --> 01:09:56.239
Yeah, it'll be super fun.
01:09:56.479 --> 01:09:58.239
It just gives them a whole new perspective, too.
01:09:58.319 --> 01:09:59.279
So that'd be great.
01:09:59.359 --> 01:10:00.159
Yeah, that'd be a blast.
01:10:00.560 --> 01:10:02.399
For our audience, thank you for joining us.
01:10:02.560 --> 01:10:09.760
And if you have questions for David or anything about the episode, put them in the in the comment section and we'll reply.
01:10:09.920 --> 01:10:11.199
And everyday heroes.
01:10:11.439 --> 01:10:15.279
Your everyday heroes will be in the uh in the notes as well.
01:10:15.359 --> 01:10:17.680
So and I I'll give the YouTube link, I think.
01:10:17.920 --> 01:10:18.159
Cool.
01:10:18.239 --> 01:10:19.680
Yeah, well put it out there.
01:10:19.760 --> 01:10:20.000
Thank you.
01:10:20.960 --> 01:10:21.520
Thank you very much.
01:10:22.239 --> 01:10:23.039
This is fun.