Systems Thinking: Using Leverage Points to Fix Bottlenecks with Will Stewart

WEBVTT
1
00:00:00.200 --> 00:00:04.320
Welcome to the Quietly Ambitious Analyst, a podcast about data,
2
00:00:04.360 --> 00:00:08.439
communication and business. I'MSEB Forbes, and in each episode will
3
00:00:08.519 --> 00:00:12.400
unpack what it really takes to influence decisions with data,
4
00:00:12.439 --> 00:00:17.160
from framing business problems to communicating insights with confidence. Because
5
00:00:17.239 --> 00:00:20.039
data alone doesn't drive change.
6
00:00:19.559 --> 00:00:20.000
People do.
7
00:00:26.280 --> 00:00:30.760
Will Stewart, founder of empower Core Solutions and chief Getted
8
00:00:30.760 --> 00:00:36.320
Done Officer helps six and seven figure entrepreneurs escape operational chaos.
9
00:00:36.719 --> 00:00:40.960
A former corporate systems architect, Will once build a revenue
10
00:00:41.000 --> 00:00:45.679
engine that generated over twenty one million dollars. Now he
11
00:00:45.759 --> 00:00:50.960
installs his proprietary ACE system Attract, Convert, and Elevate to
12
00:00:51.039 --> 00:00:56.560
turn hustle businesses into scalable, predictable machines, allowing founders to
13
00:00:56.640 --> 00:01:00.679
stop being the bottleneck and capture their true value when
14
00:01:00.719 --> 00:01:03.799
not building million dollar systems. Will is the dad of
15
00:01:03.799 --> 00:01:07.319
twenty month old twins and is working on his doctoral dissertation.
16
00:01:08.079 --> 00:01:10.040
Thanks so much, Will for joining the show.
17
00:01:10.799 --> 00:01:14.120
Thank you. That was like the best intro one there
18
00:01:14.159 --> 00:01:14.760
very downe for me.
19
00:01:15.120 --> 00:01:17.200
It's a pleasure to have you here. I would love
20
00:01:17.239 --> 00:01:20.439
to kick off this show by talking about systems because
21
00:01:20.920 --> 00:01:23.359
the last time we spoke I was so interested to
22
00:01:23.439 --> 00:01:26.959
learn more about how systems work and what it means
23
00:01:27.000 --> 00:01:30.640
for you. So when was the moment that you realized
24
00:01:30.760 --> 00:01:33.359
that the world is made up of systems and that's
25
00:01:33.400 --> 00:01:35.239
what you want to spend your time focusing on.
26
00:01:36.719 --> 00:01:39.920
It's more for me, it's been like a feeling where
27
00:01:41.359 --> 00:01:45.280
there's a feeling that everything is connected. And so when
28
00:01:45.280 --> 00:01:51.439
you look at systems, like systems explained my feelings, but
29
00:01:51.560 --> 00:01:54.000
systems thinking last what I've discovered a few years ago.
30
00:01:54.480 --> 00:01:56.879
I'm like, oh, yes, this is how I've been feeling
31
00:01:57.519 --> 00:02:01.760
all along. And it was like when you meet somebody
32
00:02:02.519 --> 00:02:05.079
and you're like, oh, this person really gets me, Like
33
00:02:05.400 --> 00:02:08.719
stuff really gets me. She really understands how much I
34
00:02:08.759 --> 00:02:10.840
love dogs because she loves dogs and we love dogs
35
00:02:10.840 --> 00:02:13.080
so much. It was sort of the same relationship with
36
00:02:13.159 --> 00:02:15.680
like systems thinking and we're like, oh, that systems thinking
37
00:02:15.719 --> 00:02:18.520
really gets me, and I really get systems thinking. It's
38
00:02:18.599 --> 00:02:20.639
almost been a lifelong kind of situation.
39
00:02:21.360 --> 00:02:23.080
I can really relate to that feeling.
40
00:02:23.280 --> 00:02:26.520
It's also what I experience with data analytics when I'm
41
00:02:26.680 --> 00:02:29.280
in my own internal world and then I'm able to
42
00:02:29.400 --> 00:02:33.400
actually apply that same thought pattern to something outside. Can
43
00:02:33.439 --> 00:02:37.360
you explain a little bit more about what systems thinking means.
44
00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:42.280
Systems are not like processes. Processes and operations are part
45
00:02:42.280 --> 00:02:47.360
of systems. We're really looking at like how does this
46
00:02:47.479 --> 00:02:51.599
system operate? So, for instance, like my communication system that
47
00:02:51.719 --> 00:02:54.000
can just say my phone and I have a where
48
00:02:54.159 --> 00:02:56.680
it's a system. I'm interfacing with the phone, but I'm
49
00:02:56.719 --> 00:02:59.520
also interfacing with the software and the apps the phone
50
00:02:59.599 --> 00:03:02.560
is interact with, the software is interacting with the hardware
51
00:03:02.719 --> 00:03:06.919
on how all of those things working so that a
52
00:03:07.000 --> 00:03:10.360
repeatable outcome is happening. So I pick up my phone
53
00:03:10.479 --> 00:03:13.400
and I look at LinkedIn or something that is always
54
00:03:13.439 --> 00:03:16.639
sort of operational and functioning, and then it's like, well,
55
00:03:16.919 --> 00:03:23.280
understanding how those interactions are organizing themselves or the disorganized,
56
00:03:23.319 --> 00:03:25.240
And it is also a great way to look at
57
00:03:25.360 --> 00:03:29.879
problem solving. It's about the interactions between the components within
58
00:03:30.120 --> 00:03:31.680
this boundary calling a system.
59
00:03:32.240 --> 00:03:36.159
You mentioned earlier there's a difference between systems and process
60
00:03:36.439 --> 00:03:38.719
Would you mind elaborating on that a little bit more
61
00:03:38.800 --> 00:03:41.879
because I thought that was really interesting and I have
62
00:03:41.960 --> 00:03:45.280
found myself confused at what the difference actually is.
63
00:03:45.800 --> 00:03:51.159
Yeah, So basically, like a process is in general very linear,
64
00:03:51.800 --> 00:03:53.840
like a recipe is a process you know, we have
65
00:03:54.879 --> 00:03:57.520
these ingredients and then we're going to mix it and
66
00:03:57.639 --> 00:03:59.759
put it together and bake it or cook it at
67
00:03:59.759 --> 00:04:01.800
this time. But you're and if you go out of
68
00:04:01.800 --> 00:04:03.759
that process, you can sort of can do it, but
69
00:04:03.800 --> 00:04:07.879
if you don't follow it, then you sort of are
70
00:04:08.039 --> 00:04:11.599
going to get garbage. A system is not linear at all.
71
00:04:11.639 --> 00:04:14.800
It's quite dynamic. It can be two things can be
72
00:04:14.879 --> 00:04:17.079
happening at once, five things can be happening, and once
73
00:04:17.199 --> 00:04:21.000
multiple interfaces can be happening, and so it seems like
74
00:04:21.040 --> 00:04:25.920
it's more chaotic, but the process generally fits within the system.
75
00:04:27.560 --> 00:04:29.279
I hear a lot of times we have systems for
76
00:04:29.360 --> 00:04:33.240
something and then I talk with founders, and generally it's
77
00:04:33.279 --> 00:04:37.279
they have a process for it or step by step directions,
78
00:04:37.439 --> 00:04:41.600
but it's not the actual system. And so when they're
79
00:04:41.639 --> 00:04:44.439
having a problem with their system, it's the only with
80
00:04:44.439 --> 00:04:47.000
their process. But then we look at the other components
81
00:04:47.000 --> 00:04:49.199
that are happening around it, it's generally one of those
82
00:04:49.240 --> 00:04:50.000
other components.
83
00:04:50.079 --> 00:04:51.319
This makes a lot of sense to me.
84
00:04:51.439 --> 00:04:53.959
It's like what you're saying is a process has like
85
00:04:54.040 --> 00:04:56.079
a step by step and then a system.
86
00:04:56.279 --> 00:04:58.839
There's so many other different components.
87
00:04:59.399 --> 00:05:03.000
Yes, it's so if you're making a cake, right, there's
88
00:05:03.079 --> 00:05:05.639
gonna be There is a process to making a cake,
89
00:05:05.720 --> 00:05:09.519
and you can mix the wet and dry ingredients at
90
00:05:09.560 --> 00:05:12.920
different places. It doesn't really matter, but at a point
91
00:05:12.959 --> 00:05:15.480
it all has to flow in a certain way. Well, like,
92
00:05:15.519 --> 00:05:18.800
the system of creating a cake is very different because
93
00:05:18.800 --> 00:05:22.040
then it's the interactions of the person who's making it,
94
00:05:22.879 --> 00:05:29.360
to the stove, the kitchen, the area, the tech, whether
95
00:05:29.399 --> 00:05:33.279
it's day or is it night, do you have power outside,
96
00:05:33.360 --> 00:05:35.600
do you have kids running around? Like so there's a
97
00:05:35.680 --> 00:05:40.040
lot more components that can happen than in that sort
98
00:05:40.040 --> 00:05:42.959
of cake making system or of your culinary prep system,
99
00:05:43.399 --> 00:05:44.680
than just the process.
100
00:05:44.879 --> 00:05:46.160
That's such a good example.
101
00:05:46.519 --> 00:05:49.639
So okay, if we applied that kind of same logic
102
00:05:49.680 --> 00:05:53.199
then to a business. What are some of the different
103
00:05:53.480 --> 00:05:56.879
components or factors that you typically talk with people about
104
00:05:56.959 --> 00:05:58.279
when it comes to systems.
105
00:06:00.160 --> 00:06:02.680
A lot of SaaS founders who have who are like
106
00:06:02.720 --> 00:06:07.199
on LinkedIn and so generally you're looking at it and
107
00:06:07.240 --> 00:06:12.199
trying to pinpoint something that's not going right. So they're saying, like, well,
108
00:06:12.839 --> 00:06:17.079
not making revenue this month. Okay, the fact that you're
109
00:06:17.160 --> 00:06:21.199
not making revenue, your system is doing exactly what it
110
00:06:21.240 --> 00:06:25.120
should be doing. It's not mixing up, it's there's something
111
00:06:25.160 --> 00:06:28.399
in there that's creating this output. So if you're saying
112
00:06:28.399 --> 00:06:32.680
it's not enough, let's go in and investigate what's happening
113
00:06:33.040 --> 00:06:36.319
in your system so we can change that output. So
114
00:06:36.360 --> 00:06:40.519
for instance, maybe they're not they have great content, but
115
00:06:40.600 --> 00:06:43.800
their sales part is not great, like they're not converting
116
00:06:43.800 --> 00:06:46.519
those clients. Maybe it's a software and it's like, well
117
00:06:46.519 --> 00:06:51.120
we have a great software. Well okay, but the reason
118
00:06:51.160 --> 00:06:53.240
why you're not making enough money is it is probably
119
00:06:53.279 --> 00:06:56.639
your conversion or like other places, the CHURND is very
120
00:06:56.680 --> 00:06:59.279
high with the software. So it's exciting because you get
121
00:06:59.319 --> 00:07:02.079
to be like a detective. And that's how I see
122
00:07:02.120 --> 00:07:04.680
it because it's generally not just one thing. Sometimes it
123
00:07:04.720 --> 00:07:07.279
can be, but there's multiple things, and you're saying, how
124
00:07:07.279 --> 00:07:11.519
can I reorganize your system to give to you the
125
00:07:11.519 --> 00:07:12.560
output that you want?
126
00:07:12.839 --> 00:07:15.199
Now, this is a really good explanation because for me
127
00:07:15.240 --> 00:07:19.079
as a data analyst, oftentimes it's not just isolated to
128
00:07:19.240 --> 00:07:20.040
one thing.
129
00:07:20.160 --> 00:07:23.560
Bluely and so there's there are a few like champions
130
00:07:23.600 --> 00:07:25.480
of systems thinking, and one of them is done at
131
00:07:25.480 --> 00:07:29.600
Tello Meadows and one of her big points in principles
132
00:07:29.720 --> 00:07:32.199
is leverage points. So, like you said, there could be
133
00:07:32.279 --> 00:07:35.160
multiple issues going in on one system, but those are
134
00:07:35.240 --> 00:07:39.000
going to have grades of severity. So we want to
135
00:07:39.040 --> 00:07:44.000
look at, obviously, what gives us the most leverage to
136
00:07:44.079 --> 00:07:48.000
fix the system. Is it a boss who doesn't respond
137
00:07:48.079 --> 00:07:51.480
to emails? Is it the lack of the tech that
138
00:07:51.480 --> 00:07:54.120
they're using. Is the tech super old? So there could
139
00:07:54.160 --> 00:07:56.240
be five things that are happening at once, but what
140
00:07:56.519 --> 00:07:59.560
is for systems thinking, We're like, what gives us the
141
00:07:59.600 --> 00:08:03.839
biggest bang for our buck that we can leverage that
142
00:08:03.959 --> 00:08:07.360
one with the minimal sort of minimal effort that makes
143
00:08:07.360 --> 00:08:11.079
the maximum output. Now, sometimes it's not that easy. Sometimes
144
00:08:11.079 --> 00:08:14.560
there's a lot of heavy lifting. Right, It just depends
145
00:08:14.600 --> 00:08:17.519
on what. But we're always looking for like leverage points.
146
00:08:17.839 --> 00:08:21.560
Let's us do data analytics, right, Okay, Well give me
147
00:08:21.600 --> 00:08:24.439
some context. And so as a data analyst, I'm like, well,
148
00:08:24.439 --> 00:08:28.240
what is it about? Well, just run these numbers. Yeah,
149
00:08:28.360 --> 00:08:30.560
it's gonna help me a lot more if you tell
150
00:08:30.600 --> 00:08:32.799
me what this is about, so I can use my
151
00:08:32.879 --> 00:08:37.720
experience to help filter it, because just raw data is
152
00:08:38.480 --> 00:08:41.080
even if you're filtering it through a system, it's still
153
00:08:41.200 --> 00:08:44.039
too much and so really saying what am I looking
154
00:08:44.120 --> 00:08:46.679
at context? And how can I leverage it the best?
155
00:08:47.159 --> 00:08:49.519
That's when for systems thinking, I think it's one of
156
00:08:49.559 --> 00:08:52.639
the strong points is we're looking at that leverage.
157
00:08:52.759 --> 00:08:54.879
Right, how do you actually get to the point of
158
00:08:54.919 --> 00:08:56.200
identifying the leverage.
159
00:08:56.919 --> 00:09:00.440
Let's use that example of that director some who's not
160
00:09:00.519 --> 00:09:03.799
responding to emails. I think it's easy sometimes for us
161
00:09:03.799 --> 00:09:06.200
to like look at tech and these things and processes
162
00:09:06.200 --> 00:09:09.759
and operations. At the end of the day, generally you're
163
00:09:10.399 --> 00:09:15.759
interacting with the human being. So always thinking what's happening
164
00:09:16.000 --> 00:09:18.120
with that human being? Why are they so grumpy? What's
165
00:09:18.120 --> 00:09:21.840
going on? Like nothing ever happens in the vacuum, And
166
00:09:21.879 --> 00:09:25.039
then it's like, Okay, he's not been he or she
167
00:09:25.080 --> 00:09:27.840
have not been answering their emails the last few weeks.
168
00:09:28.679 --> 00:09:35.320
Anything going on, right, something we suspect something is happening,
169
00:09:35.360 --> 00:09:37.879
maybe at home, or we know something's happening home. He's
170
00:09:37.919 --> 00:09:39.919
got a sick kid, the wife is sick, the mother
171
00:09:40.039 --> 00:09:43.559
is the parent is sick. Something's happening. Okay, So it's
172
00:09:43.559 --> 00:09:47.879
not a personality thing. It's a bandwidth thing. So it's
173
00:09:47.960 --> 00:09:52.600
not so that changes how we approach that particular person
174
00:09:53.360 --> 00:09:56.039
because it's not the email system. The email system is
175
00:09:56.080 --> 00:09:58.919
working perfectly because it works to everyone else. Maybe it's
176
00:09:58.919 --> 00:10:01.080
a phone issue. I don't no, but we're thinking, like
177
00:10:01.080 --> 00:10:03.759
we're trying to what's the leverage point that we need
178
00:10:03.799 --> 00:10:07.360
to do, so how do we work with this person
179
00:10:08.440 --> 00:10:11.480
to leverage that? And some if it's the founder, it's like, hey,
180
00:10:11.519 --> 00:10:14.679
we haven't been responding, you need to do that, or
181
00:10:14.799 --> 00:10:16.879
I remember I was at one particular organization, it's like,
182
00:10:17.039 --> 00:10:20.440
can we create something simple like a decision tree, decision
183
00:10:20.440 --> 00:10:24.840
matrix so you're not answering every single thing and you
184
00:10:25.240 --> 00:10:28.440
and they're not waiting for you. If it's this threshold,
185
00:10:28.600 --> 00:10:33.360
say a financial threshold of five thousand dollars, I feel
186
00:10:33.360 --> 00:10:35.879
comfortable with that because your staff can make that decision
187
00:10:35.919 --> 00:10:39.600
on their own. Yes, if it's sent five thousand and
188
00:10:39.799 --> 00:10:42.320
over or whatever, five thousand and one dollars over, the
189
00:10:42.399 --> 00:10:44.919
needs to come to me. So what we found was
190
00:10:44.960 --> 00:10:47.399
that like that person didn't have the bandwidth to deal
191
00:10:47.440 --> 00:10:49.519
with the five thousand dollars less issue, but they certainly
192
00:10:49.519 --> 00:10:51.159
have one to deal with the twenty dollars dollars. They
193
00:10:51.159 --> 00:10:53.360
would get back to them like that. So it's sort
194
00:10:53.360 --> 00:10:56.159
of looking at like how and so the decision matrix,
195
00:10:57.480 --> 00:11:00.440
like we had to but it's such a leverage point
196
00:11:00.440 --> 00:11:02.759
that they were able to hold onto and then of
197
00:11:02.759 --> 00:11:07.000
course everything else flowed. Fine. You know, I'm not a therapist.
198
00:11:07.039 --> 00:11:08.679
I've been like you don't even to see somebody about that.
199
00:11:08.759 --> 00:11:11.720
But we can definitely get matrix a decision matrix for
200
00:11:11.759 --> 00:11:17.759
your company where your subordinates or your employees are making decisions,
201
00:11:18.240 --> 00:11:21.960
and you're okay with that. It's like answering questions and
202
00:11:22.000 --> 00:11:26.759
being detective. But also remember that there are humans behind.
203
00:11:27.799 --> 00:11:30.840
These leverage points too, right, I think that's such an
204
00:11:30.879 --> 00:11:32.600
important distinction to make.
205
00:11:33.559 --> 00:11:36.759
So to get technical, like we always have to change
206
00:11:36.759 --> 00:11:41.200
our our language. But what in sort of system think
207
00:11:41.320 --> 00:11:45.159
is like the interaction between nodes, right, like data nodes,
208
00:11:45.240 --> 00:11:46.759
and so you don't want to call someone a know,
209
00:11:46.919 --> 00:11:48.879
like you don't want to sell like those nodes. But
210
00:11:48.919 --> 00:11:52.039
they're people, right, they're people. But the reality is that
211
00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:55.159
it is interactions between nodes, and no can be a person,
212
00:11:55.240 --> 00:11:57.080
place or thing, and no can be like a person
213
00:11:57.159 --> 00:12:00.159
like the director to their assistant, the assistant to the
214
00:12:00.240 --> 00:12:05.159
VP of operations, the data analysis, the analysis to their computer. Right,
215
00:12:05.440 --> 00:12:07.960
my interaction with my computer is something's wrong with it?
216
00:12:08.039 --> 00:12:09.840
And I remember I had this issue that guy was
217
00:12:10.159 --> 00:12:12.759
running huge data sets and anyone who runs huge data
218
00:12:12.759 --> 00:12:15.159
sets knows that they can't run on eight megabytes RAM
219
00:12:15.240 --> 00:12:18.039
like you need like thirty two's you need something powerful
220
00:12:18.039 --> 00:12:21.360
otherwise you're going to be sitting there wives processing. So
221
00:12:21.559 --> 00:12:25.120
I was having an interaction issue with the node, which
222
00:12:25.279 --> 00:12:28.679
was the computer. So it's like, how are those two
223
00:12:28.879 --> 00:12:32.399
three four nodes interacting? And that's what systems thinking is
224
00:12:32.440 --> 00:12:37.440
saying what is the interaction with that, you know, between
225
00:12:37.519 --> 00:12:40.519
that node, And sometimes you're like, well, is it communication,
226
00:12:40.960 --> 00:12:43.000
is it whatever? But you do have to look at
227
00:12:43.000 --> 00:12:50.000
that node and then understanding that, like people are complex creatures,
228
00:12:51.039 --> 00:12:53.919
that there's more to it. So but it does give
229
00:12:53.960 --> 00:12:56.120
you the human aspect. Like you said, it's easy to
230
00:12:56.159 --> 00:13:00.759
forget with systems thinking that it's it's but yes, it
231
00:13:00.840 --> 00:13:03.879
is very much a powerful tool to say, all right,
232
00:13:03.919 --> 00:13:05.639
well let me just step back and see. Like I
233
00:13:05.639 --> 00:13:08.919
remember when I was becoming a new dad, I was
234
00:13:09.000 --> 00:13:12.519
not like I was nine months ago, a week ago, like,
235
00:13:12.600 --> 00:13:17.759
it was very different. And then all the parental neurochemicals
236
00:13:17.759 --> 00:13:20.279
and things are floating around my brain and you get
237
00:13:20.399 --> 00:13:23.919
parent brain, dead brain mom brain and a real thing.
238
00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:25.840
But you're like, am I stupid? You're like, no, it's
239
00:13:25.879 --> 00:13:29.759
just my physiology is interacting differently with everything. Like I
240
00:13:29.960 --> 00:13:32.159
remember I couldn't remember like a phone number. I'm like,
241
00:13:32.919 --> 00:13:35.440
why can't I remember this? But it was just the
242
00:13:35.480 --> 00:13:38.120
way what So I think it's definitely a good way,
243
00:13:38.159 --> 00:13:41.440
but it's easy to forget, super easy to forget about
244
00:13:41.440 --> 00:13:42.399
that human aspect.
245
00:13:43.000 --> 00:13:46.960
Yeah, that sounds like such a healthy approach to life
246
00:13:47.039 --> 00:13:50.600
in general, whether it's personal or professional. So here's my
247
00:13:50.879 --> 00:13:55.159
next question. Then, when we're thinking about who is responsible
248
00:13:55.200 --> 00:13:59.879
then for maintaining a system ensuring that it's running smoothly,
249
00:14:00.120 --> 00:14:02.320
like is it more of a top down approach like
250
00:14:02.679 --> 00:14:05.399
a CEO or a leader of sorts would be the
251
00:14:05.399 --> 00:14:07.759
person that needs to be implementing these things, or is
252
00:14:07.759 --> 00:14:09.399
it like everyone has.
253
00:14:09.240 --> 00:14:10.120
A role to play.
254
00:14:11.399 --> 00:14:17.159
And I do think everyone, every node, And we can
255
00:14:17.200 --> 00:14:21.000
just maybe say it's a person has some responsibility to
256
00:14:21.039 --> 00:14:26.360
the system in that whether they're giving feedback about it,
257
00:14:26.399 --> 00:14:32.360
whether they're organizing it, whether they're just doing their regular thing. Everyone,
258
00:14:32.679 --> 00:14:35.720
Because the nature of systems, you can't just say I
259
00:14:35.759 --> 00:14:39.480
don't I can't deal that but you're part of it.
260
00:14:38.840 --> 00:14:42.159
Is is it your responsibility you deal this part of
261
00:14:42.200 --> 00:14:47.200
the system. No, but you can't just be like a silo.
262
00:14:47.919 --> 00:14:51.679
It just doesn't work like that. So in the context
263
00:14:51.759 --> 00:14:55.279
of a business in the finances, let's say it's a
264
00:14:55.279 --> 00:14:58.840
medium sized business, the CFO and the CEO, right, but
265
00:14:58.879 --> 00:15:01.120
the CFO is not going to be looking at day
266
00:15:01.120 --> 00:15:03.720
to day, day to day finances. He's gonna rely on
267
00:15:03.720 --> 00:15:06.679
a CFO to say, what's going on. These are what's
268
00:15:06.679 --> 00:15:09.279
happening with this system. Now, this is the data that
269
00:15:09.320 --> 00:15:13.279
we're pulling. My amazing analyst, Seth, set down for twenty
270
00:15:13.320 --> 00:15:16.200
hours and she pulled all the numbers in this regard.
271
00:15:16.919 --> 00:15:19.440
It's not Set's job to make sure that the business
272
00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:21.399
is doing well, but she was You're like, okay, well,
273
00:15:21.440 --> 00:15:24.279
I'm going to analyze this data and use my experience
274
00:15:24.279 --> 00:15:27.720
to give you the great report. So then you can
275
00:15:28.000 --> 00:15:30.799
then take that system and take that information to make
276
00:15:30.840 --> 00:15:33.639
decisions based on you know, the CFOs to take this
277
00:15:33.960 --> 00:15:36.519
up to the CEO. Well, Seth, well, if you tell
278
00:15:36.600 --> 00:15:40.720
them about this, yes, it's important to you and I,
279
00:15:41.240 --> 00:15:42.919
but to him and I or to her and I,
280
00:15:43.000 --> 00:15:45.399
not really important. They don't really care about this part.
281
00:15:45.399 --> 00:15:49.840
They don't care about, I don't know, paper clips expenses,
282
00:15:49.879 --> 00:15:52.480
that's right, you know, they want to know about, you know,
283
00:15:52.799 --> 00:15:55.759
what their our investments are doing. And so you had
284
00:15:55.759 --> 00:15:58.639
to park to play in that responsibility. I think if
285
00:15:58.639 --> 00:16:02.519
we see something wrong, a major part of any systems
286
00:16:02.519 --> 00:16:06.240
are feedback. Loose, whether it's clothes or open, but there
287
00:16:06.279 --> 00:16:10.519
has to be some feedback. You're like, hey, I'm I'm
288
00:16:10.879 --> 00:16:15.240
analyzing this data and I'm seeing some weird things here.
289
00:16:16.360 --> 00:16:18.080
You could be like, I'm not gonna I'm not gonna
290
00:16:18.080 --> 00:16:20.840
say anything. Well, they're like, seth, why didn't you say
291
00:16:20.840 --> 00:16:25.159
anything about there's clearly issues here, Like you didn't say anything, Well,
292
00:16:25.919 --> 00:16:28.960
you didn't ask me to. But so systems break down
293
00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:33.360
when there's lack of feedback or the better feedback, better quality,
294
00:16:33.399 --> 00:16:38.200
the better the system generally does. So there's a responsibility there.
295
00:16:39.120 --> 00:16:43.399
Hopefully it was understood, like not just inherently, but like
296
00:16:43.759 --> 00:16:47.720
your commitment to this company and your responsibility is this
297
00:16:47.799 --> 00:16:51.679
will make sure that you're catching weird things in the data. Okay, great,
298
00:16:52.159 --> 00:16:56.120
And then sometimes people say, oh, yeah, I know you've
299
00:16:56.120 --> 00:16:59.480
done this. You've seen something that maybe wasn't in your
300
00:16:59.559 --> 00:17:03.360
job description, which you're like, as a data analyst, as
301
00:17:03.360 --> 00:17:06.839
a human, this isn't right. I need to go. You
302
00:17:06.880 --> 00:17:09.240
need to know this. And then they're like, oh wow,
303
00:17:09.279 --> 00:17:11.400
we didn't know that, and that data point is especially
304
00:17:11.799 --> 00:17:13.799
thank you for bringing to us. You saved our company
305
00:17:14.400 --> 00:17:15.240
a million bucks.
306
00:17:15.440 --> 00:17:21.000
So there was something that you said a minute ago.
307
00:17:21.720 --> 00:17:24.920
It reminded me of organizational culture and how yes, like
308
00:17:25.039 --> 00:17:28.400
leadership and management could influence the culture of a company,
309
00:17:28.480 --> 00:17:32.519
but how also employees are participants in that atmosphere. And
310
00:17:32.599 --> 00:17:35.599
it made me think about that quote or phrase where
311
00:17:35.640 --> 00:17:40.200
they said, if you like, not responding is also a response.
312
00:17:39.920 --> 00:17:43.799
Like anything else. Those feedback loops have to be healthy,
313
00:17:44.640 --> 00:17:47.759
and when it's silent and it's not supposed to be silent,
314
00:17:48.200 --> 00:17:50.880
then that's when you really start to escalate. And again,
315
00:17:50.920 --> 00:17:54.000
not everything has to be said, I think, or communicated.
316
00:17:54.160 --> 00:18:00.000
And I think that's knowing what the real necessary data
317
00:18:00.319 --> 00:18:03.960
is because you you know and data analysis, you know
318
00:18:04.039 --> 00:18:07.000
that some data is just noise. It's just noise there
319
00:18:07.039 --> 00:18:10.000
and I don't really need this in any regard. I
320
00:18:10.039 --> 00:18:12.920
don't even know why we collect this data, but it's there.
321
00:18:15.160 --> 00:18:17.880
So when when you're talking about feedback loops, I think
322
00:18:17.920 --> 00:18:20.480
of like one on ones with my manager or does
323
00:18:20.519 --> 00:18:22.279
that also fit into systems thinking?
324
00:18:22.680 --> 00:18:28.880
Absolutely any like the the feedback loops with your like
325
00:18:28.920 --> 00:18:31.519
when we I think maybe we both worked corporate and
326
00:18:31.559 --> 00:18:33.440
you walk out of a meeting and you're like, what
327
00:18:33.519 --> 00:18:36.599
was that? What was he talking about? What was she
328
00:18:36.680 --> 00:18:41.079
talking about? Like why were we talking about? Like that's okay,
329
00:18:41.599 --> 00:18:43.440
and so it's like that feedback between the two of
330
00:18:43.480 --> 00:18:47.279
you are like that it's confusion, right, I am. We
331
00:18:47.359 --> 00:18:51.400
are confused as to why this went down. So do
332
00:18:51.480 --> 00:18:53.799
we go back and tell that to our manager, like
333
00:18:53.880 --> 00:18:58.240
we don't really understand that or is it like just
334
00:18:58.279 --> 00:19:00.799
sort of that understood part of the cold of the
335
00:19:00.839 --> 00:19:05.039
company where we don't question it and we just they
336
00:19:05.039 --> 00:19:06.880
said anything to us and we just have to do
337
00:19:07.000 --> 00:19:11.240
it well. That shapes the company culture. And so I
338
00:19:11.240 --> 00:19:14.839
think another super important art of systems, and I have
339
00:19:14.880 --> 00:19:18.480
a framework for it, is like the environment, systems have
340
00:19:18.599 --> 00:19:23.000
boundaries to them. Every system has a boundary where it
341
00:19:23.119 --> 00:19:25.480
just doesn't go there anymore. Like for instance, the human
342
00:19:25.480 --> 00:19:28.720
body has a boundary. It's the skin, right, That's how
343
00:19:28.759 --> 00:19:32.160
we exist in the world. And so we have things
344
00:19:32.160 --> 00:19:36.200
that are happening internally, but there are external forces that
345
00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:39.880
also still affect our system. So there's feedback coming in
346
00:19:40.000 --> 00:19:43.440
from outside of the system too. So I was talking
347
00:19:43.440 --> 00:19:48.880
with someone who was dealing with retail, and this was
348
00:19:48.960 --> 00:19:51.559
months ago when there was the tariffs that were happening
349
00:19:51.720 --> 00:19:57.720
with the United States. So with tariffs, obviously it's not
350
00:19:57.839 --> 00:20:02.240
an internal issue with the businesiness. It's an external feedback
351
00:20:02.279 --> 00:20:04.160
that's happening. It's like you have to take this into
352
00:20:04.200 --> 00:20:08.519
the account, so that affects that is feedback in a way, like, hey,
353
00:20:09.640 --> 00:20:12.279
in a month, that terrifs are going to be fifty
354
00:20:12.319 --> 00:20:15.720
percent higher. So what do we do in the meantime?
355
00:20:15.960 --> 00:20:17.759
What can we what can we start to do? And
356
00:20:17.799 --> 00:20:19.359
then when it hits, then it hits and we have
357
00:20:19.400 --> 00:20:22.279
to adjust our prices. How do we communicate to our
358
00:20:22.440 --> 00:20:25.440
our our our our clients and our customers what's happening.
359
00:20:25.759 --> 00:20:29.720
And so just understanding that that feedback can come internally
360
00:20:29.759 --> 00:20:32.559
from that internal that system itself, work can come from
361
00:20:32.599 --> 00:20:36.400
the external systems or the external forces. People like farmers
362
00:20:36.440 --> 00:20:39.240
have to understand, like the feedback of weather patterns, it's
363
00:20:39.279 --> 00:20:40.839
gonna be hot, it's gonna be oh, it's gonna be this.
364
00:20:40.920 --> 00:20:47.039
And I like systems because you only miss as much
365
00:20:47.039 --> 00:20:50.079
as you don't know, right, But if you're looking at
366
00:20:50.119 --> 00:20:53.400
certain things with the external forces. But if you forget that,
367
00:20:53.559 --> 00:20:55.839
if you're in a business that has I don't know
368
00:20:55.920 --> 00:20:59.799
tech right now, AI is big, Well, what are what
369
00:20:59.839 --> 00:21:01.799
are some of the things that are happening externally that
370
00:21:01.839 --> 00:21:04.839
affect our internal company if you don't take the consideration.
371
00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:06.160
So all though some of the business things that we
372
00:21:06.160 --> 00:21:08.359
talked about, like if you're not taking those into consideration,
373
00:21:09.079 --> 00:21:11.640
you're going to run into issues later like what's the
374
00:21:11.680 --> 00:21:15.880
market telling you? The market's giving you feedback, like not clients,
375
00:21:15.920 --> 00:21:20.079
but the whole market. And if just to indulge me,
376
00:21:20.279 --> 00:21:22.640
like I just wrote a series of posts on LinkedIn
377
00:21:23.400 --> 00:21:26.839
about big company, but one was like Netflix and Blockbuster.
378
00:21:26.960 --> 00:21:29.759
Now that's an old tool one like Blockbuster's old school, right,
379
00:21:29.799 --> 00:21:31.839
And it was like the back in like the nineties
380
00:21:31.839 --> 00:21:33.799
where you would go with your parents or yourself and
381
00:21:33.799 --> 00:21:36.079
you would go and buy you get the videos DVD
382
00:21:36.200 --> 00:21:38.720
or vts whatever, and it was a whole process to it.
383
00:21:38.799 --> 00:21:41.519
You have to leave your house, you got to if
384
00:21:41.599 --> 00:21:44.279
you were late fees, you had to pay late fees.
385
00:21:44.359 --> 00:21:46.240
You could get there and it was the video that
386
00:21:46.279 --> 00:21:48.519
you called about twenty minutes ago is no longer there,
387
00:21:48.519 --> 00:21:50.680
and you're like, oh, it's a lot of friction. Well,
388
00:21:50.759 --> 00:21:55.359
Netflix listened to the market and they came up with
389
00:21:55.720 --> 00:21:59.039
mail order DVDs and it was like a whole thing,
390
00:21:59.039 --> 00:22:00.839
and it took off, and now Netflix is what it
391
00:22:00.920 --> 00:22:04.079
is now. But it's listening to what the market was
392
00:22:04.079 --> 00:22:07.119
saying and the feedback that allowed that allowed Netflix to
393
00:22:07.200 --> 00:22:10.119
pivot and Blockbuster didn't they try it too lately. It's
394
00:22:10.200 --> 00:22:14.079
just this wasn't happening, so that that sort of gets
395
00:22:14.079 --> 00:22:15.680
our closes our feedback.
396
00:22:16.279 --> 00:22:20.279
That's such a good example just thinking about what's happening
397
00:22:20.359 --> 00:22:23.839
around you in the marketplace, what's happening in the economy,
398
00:22:24.079 --> 00:22:26.680
like looking at all of these different external factors and.
399
00:22:26.640 --> 00:22:28.279
Then making your move from there.
400
00:22:28.519 --> 00:22:30.640
This has been thinking a lot about like the type
401
00:22:30.680 --> 00:22:33.119
of people that you work with with your business. What
402
00:22:33.359 --> 00:22:36.319
is some of the biggest challenges or like patterns that
403
00:22:36.359 --> 00:22:37.960
you're finding when you work with people.
404
00:22:38.920 --> 00:22:43.160
So like you, you and I both own our businesses,
405
00:22:43.559 --> 00:22:49.000
and so in general, I would say most entrepreneurs are smart.
406
00:22:49.279 --> 00:22:51.720
They're like smart people like you have to be a
407
00:22:51.759 --> 00:22:54.640
particular kind of person. And I'm not talking about like
408
00:22:54.640 --> 00:22:57.400
academically smart, but you have to be like on your game.
409
00:22:57.480 --> 00:22:59.759
It has to be a certain fire that you have
410
00:23:00.799 --> 00:23:02.680
to say I'm going to go out and start a business,
411
00:23:02.680 --> 00:23:05.079
and from not you know like, okay, great, that's intent.
412
00:23:07.079 --> 00:23:09.599
It's a lot, and you know, we all have our
413
00:23:09.759 --> 00:23:13.839
strengths to weaknesses. What I see a lot is really
414
00:23:13.960 --> 00:23:18.000
smart people starting their business and having to do like
415
00:23:18.119 --> 00:23:25.079
everything marketing, sales, product development, operations. They're writing the emails,
416
00:23:25.119 --> 00:23:28.039
they taking the phone calls, and and what I think
417
00:23:28.119 --> 00:23:30.759
happens is you more likely have to do that initially
418
00:23:30.839 --> 00:23:34.359
unless you're you have a partner who's their operations and
419
00:23:34.400 --> 00:23:39.039
you're the software developer, right, But even then there's other
420
00:23:39.160 --> 00:23:41.079
parts of that. And so I think some of the
421
00:23:41.079 --> 00:23:44.720
issues that I see is founders have created a system
422
00:23:44.720 --> 00:23:49.240
where they organize a system, right, because the traditional thought
423
00:23:49.319 --> 00:23:52.960
is like we don't create systems, we just organize them.
424
00:23:53.279 --> 00:23:56.079
There's levels of or disorganization. They just sort of come
425
00:23:56.119 --> 00:23:59.279
together and they self organize, and then we can sort
426
00:23:59.279 --> 00:24:03.160
of manipulate some of those components. So if you come
427
00:24:03.920 --> 00:24:06.400
to a business and you're saying, Okay, tell me what's
428
00:24:06.440 --> 00:24:10.279
going on, there's a system happening. What I have found
429
00:24:10.359 --> 00:24:13.720
the hardest is to be like, you created this system,
430
00:24:14.359 --> 00:24:17.920
we have to reorganize it, and I didn't do that.
431
00:24:18.920 --> 00:24:20.920
Yet you did do it. You didn't know that you
432
00:24:21.000 --> 00:24:24.359
did it. It's not your fault, Like you're just doing
433
00:24:24.400 --> 00:24:26.599
what you knew how to do, how to organize this
434
00:24:26.720 --> 00:24:29.160
system the way you're that you knew, and there are
435
00:24:29.240 --> 00:24:31.839
different ways to do it. So like, for instance, like
436
00:24:32.119 --> 00:24:35.559
people hate changing their emails, I get it. It's a
437
00:24:35.640 --> 00:24:40.920
pain the butt. Yes, that email system is limiting to you,
438
00:24:41.000 --> 00:24:44.079
Like you're trying to do X amount of campaigns every
439
00:24:44.119 --> 00:24:47.279
month and it's costing you ten times as much if
440
00:24:47.319 --> 00:24:50.319
you go to a different system because you've outgrown it,
441
00:24:50.440 --> 00:24:54.200
you've outgrown that one. No, in your system, you've outgrown it,
442
00:24:54.240 --> 00:24:56.119
so you kind of have to replace it. But then
443
00:24:56.160 --> 00:25:00.240
it's the kind of convincing them that, all right, we
444
00:25:00.279 --> 00:25:03.200
can continue to use this email system. It's going to
445
00:25:03.279 --> 00:25:07.759
cost you thirteen thousand dollars a month, and if you're
446
00:25:07.880 --> 00:25:10.759
okay with that, I'm okay with it. Certainly I wouldn't
447
00:25:10.799 --> 00:25:12.240
choose it for my business, but I'm not it's not
448
00:25:12.359 --> 00:25:14.920
my business. Or we can reorganize it. It's going to
449
00:25:14.960 --> 00:25:17.880
take a little bit of work to redo the system.
450
00:25:18.039 --> 00:25:19.119
But at the end of the day, you're gonna be
451
00:25:19.160 --> 00:25:22.160
saving ten thousand dollars a month. So what do you
452
00:25:22.240 --> 00:25:25.480
want ten thousand more revenue or do you want to
453
00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:28.519
stay where you are? Most times they choose they want
454
00:25:28.519 --> 00:25:31.799
to change, and so it's helping people to recognize the
455
00:25:31.880 --> 00:25:34.599
system that they've created or they've organized, and then helping
456
00:25:34.640 --> 00:25:40.160
them to reorganize it. And that can be That's where
457
00:25:40.160 --> 00:25:43.799
the human component comes in because people don't ever want
458
00:25:43.839 --> 00:25:46.799
to be told that they're wrong. No one wants to
459
00:25:46.799 --> 00:25:49.160
be told they're wrong. Like I was, what's talking to somebody?
460
00:25:49.160 --> 00:25:52.640
They were, like, the place in our brain that determines
461
00:25:53.119 --> 00:25:55.640
makes a choice as the same place that we determine
462
00:25:55.680 --> 00:25:58.079
if we're in love with somebody, So telling them that
463
00:25:58.200 --> 00:26:00.440
they're wrong is almost like tell and then they're not
464
00:26:00.480 --> 00:26:03.599
in love with somebody. It's the same sort of brain systems,
465
00:26:03.599 --> 00:26:05.599
And you're like, Okay. When I learned that, I'm like,
466
00:26:05.599 --> 00:26:08.000
oh wow, I can't tell someone they're wrong because that's
467
00:26:08.039 --> 00:26:09.799
like saying that you're not in love with this person.
468
00:26:10.240 --> 00:26:13.839
So how can I phrase it in that regard so
469
00:26:13.880 --> 00:26:18.440
that I can get around those natural defenses? But I
470
00:26:18.519 --> 00:26:21.279
do have to take consider like, hey, so here's here's
471
00:26:21.359 --> 00:26:24.599
here's the way it's going to play out. And when
472
00:26:24.640 --> 00:26:28.000
you sort of take it to them talking about their
473
00:26:28.039 --> 00:26:30.480
pain but also talking about logic and your son of
474
00:26:30.519 --> 00:26:33.559
sizing up where are they in that space, then you
475
00:26:33.640 --> 00:26:35.440
learn how to communicate them a little bit better. But
476
00:26:35.519 --> 00:26:37.839
I learned that about the Love and the Wrong Thing
477
00:26:38.400 --> 00:26:41.319
maybe fifteen years ago and I've never forgotten it. It
478
00:26:41.359 --> 00:26:44.079
was really powerful mindset change for me.
479
00:26:45.440 --> 00:26:48.880
Yeah, it's all about perception and the way that you're
480
00:26:48.920 --> 00:26:50.119
approaching the interaction.
481
00:26:50.359 --> 00:26:50.559
You know.
482
00:26:50.599 --> 00:26:53.279
I was just thinking about how if you're working with
483
00:26:53.319 --> 00:26:56.480
an entrepreneur, for example, that conversation could be a lot
484
00:26:56.519 --> 00:27:00.279
different if you're trying to kind of persuade them or
485
00:27:00.440 --> 00:27:03.839
that a better way is available to you. But that
486
00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:07.599
process may look different if you're communicating with, you know,
487
00:27:07.720 --> 00:27:09.960
someone who has to manage a team and now.
488
00:27:09.839 --> 00:27:11.640
They have to get other people on the word.
489
00:27:11.759 --> 00:27:14.759
Have you worked with people where you had to find
490
00:27:14.799 --> 00:27:17.359
someone who would advocate for a change in a system,
491
00:27:17.440 --> 00:27:19.720
because that's where it starts getting really complex.
492
00:27:20.279 --> 00:27:22.640
Yeah, it's like a tech thing. Like so I was
493
00:27:22.680 --> 00:27:26.880
a tech implementer for years and when we would have
494
00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:31.200
like a tech implementation, we say something like the biggest
495
00:27:31.279 --> 00:27:34.160
challenge when we have talked with the senior level people,
496
00:27:34.400 --> 00:27:37.960
the biggest challenge that we're going to have is the mindset.
497
00:27:38.000 --> 00:27:42.119
It's a behavioral change, that's what it's gonna be. And
498
00:27:42.440 --> 00:27:45.440
if you're adopting the software and you're using it, and
499
00:27:45.480 --> 00:27:48.839
you're being consistent with using the software, it's gonna come
500
00:27:48.839 --> 00:27:52.200
off much better. If you don't and they see you
501
00:27:52.400 --> 00:27:54.319
sort of not doing it and still using the same
502
00:27:54.319 --> 00:27:56.839
old system that you've been doing, they're not gonna they're
503
00:27:56.880 --> 00:28:00.400
not gonna they're not going to take it seriously. So
504
00:28:00.680 --> 00:28:03.319
the behavior at this place, depending on where you are,
505
00:28:03.480 --> 00:28:06.920
I'm gonna starts from the top. That's just like people
506
00:28:06.960 --> 00:28:12.279
are sort of tribal in nature and they so if there,
507
00:28:12.319 --> 00:28:15.000
if the top is not falling into place, then that
508
00:28:15.039 --> 00:28:17.680
makes it much. It makes it such a hard decision,
509
00:28:18.640 --> 00:28:21.799
a hard change, and there like oh, hey, so again
510
00:28:21.960 --> 00:28:27.079
we took consideration adopters, and then there's just general resistance
511
00:28:27.119 --> 00:28:31.319
to change. Meeting people where they are and understanding like, hey,
512
00:28:31.359 --> 00:28:34.160
who's going to be my champion for this tech. Let's
513
00:28:34.200 --> 00:28:36.480
say the software change. Let's say we're going to use
514
00:28:37.359 --> 00:28:40.519
Tableau or power be out. Who's gonna be my Who
515
00:28:40.559 --> 00:28:42.880
is my person? Seth is my person. She is an
516
00:28:42.880 --> 00:28:46.440
early adopted to tech. She gets it, and the team
517
00:28:46.480 --> 00:28:49.720
trusts her. Let me talk to Seth because I need
518
00:28:49.759 --> 00:28:52.519
to talk to Seth because she understands and they trust
519
00:28:52.559 --> 00:28:54.799
her more than they trust me. And then Seth gets
520
00:28:54.839 --> 00:28:57.000
into it and she's like, hey, guys, I did this
521
00:28:57.039 --> 00:29:00.640
on tableau and it's I never thought we could present
522
00:29:00.759 --> 00:29:04.599
data like this awesome. And so it's just working in
523
00:29:04.640 --> 00:29:06.920
that regard of saying like who can I leverage here?
524
00:29:06.920 --> 00:29:10.440
Who's my leverage point? Well, Seth, to me will be
525
00:29:11.000 --> 00:29:13.880
the best leverage point because she's smart, she gets it,
526
00:29:13.920 --> 00:29:16.119
and people trust her. And I don't have to work
527
00:29:16.160 --> 00:29:19.559
on Johnny, who hates change, who's been in this job
528
00:29:19.559 --> 00:29:22.480
for twenty years and doesn't it really is basically works
529
00:29:22.559 --> 00:29:25.839
off of AOL dot com emails, Right, He's going to
530
00:29:25.880 --> 00:29:28.680
be the hardest person to work with. I want to
531
00:29:28.920 --> 00:29:32.400
work with Seth. And then eventually Johnny, because he likes Seth,
532
00:29:32.680 --> 00:29:35.799
probably will will sort of implement with us. He's going
533
00:29:35.839 --> 00:29:39.400
to be last. And I've been in places where we've
534
00:29:39.400 --> 00:29:42.440
been implemented tech and like, hey, tomorrow's the last day.
535
00:29:42.519 --> 00:29:46.160
We're turning this off tomorrow, and they're still using it,
536
00:29:46.200 --> 00:29:48.039
and you're like, we told you we're going to turn
537
00:29:48.079 --> 00:29:50.839
it off. And so I think that's the way to
538
00:29:51.079 --> 00:29:53.559
at least I've learned to work with people in that regard.
539
00:29:54.720 --> 00:29:57.000
This is what I think a lot of data professionals
540
00:29:57.000 --> 00:29:59.759
could benefit from is having this kind of thinking so
541
00:29:59.799 --> 00:30:04.359
that they can more effectively present the pros the cons,
542
00:30:04.480 --> 00:30:08.079
providing enough information that connects to the stakeholder to be
543
00:30:08.119 --> 00:30:11.079
able to actually get their projects moving forward.
544
00:30:12.160 --> 00:30:18.599
Yes, I didn't exercise two weeks ago, and it basically
545
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.279
asked us like who who are heroes? Or who do
546
00:30:22.359 --> 00:30:24.720
we look up to or something. I'm a big Star
547
00:30:24.799 --> 00:30:28.799
Trek nerd, like I'm off the charts, like I've been
548
00:30:28.839 --> 00:30:31.640
to and I probably have seen that bit episode of
549
00:30:31.640 --> 00:30:35.119
Star Trek all of them and so sort of like
550
00:30:35.119 --> 00:30:38.880
like is Captain Macard or Captain Conkirk or something. So
551
00:30:39.119 --> 00:30:44.200
my like favorite people are mister Data and mister Spock.
552
00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:48.680
We're both smart, they're logical, and they have that's their
553
00:30:48.759 --> 00:30:53.279
that's their character, right. Both of them struggled with the
554
00:30:53.319 --> 00:30:58.400
emotional heart of humans. Mister Spock was half human, but
555
00:30:58.440 --> 00:31:00.440
there was a there was always a struggle. They were
556
00:31:00.480 --> 00:31:04.880
different and I think for me, I see data, I
557
00:31:04.960 --> 00:31:08.319
see the problem, right, and it makes sense to fix
558
00:31:08.359 --> 00:31:13.400
the problem. That's how the data says this, Why are
559
00:31:13.400 --> 00:31:16.880
we not doing this? It's leading us to this place? Okay,
560
00:31:17.200 --> 00:31:21.920
well okay, and then it's frustrating. So you saw mister data,
561
00:31:21.960 --> 00:31:25.000
but he was it was his programming did not accept
562
00:31:25.160 --> 00:31:29.000
some of these human you know, experiences, and mister spot
563
00:31:29.039 --> 00:31:34.480
Bolsto was like, that's not logical. Well, unfortunately, the world
564
00:31:34.680 --> 00:31:39.480
is there are working with emotions and understanding that we
565
00:31:39.599 --> 00:31:43.160
do have to understand who's in front of us and
566
00:31:43.319 --> 00:31:47.319
work with them because while the data may be black
567
00:31:47.359 --> 00:31:51.160
and white, people generally are never operating they're operating shades
568
00:31:51.200 --> 00:31:54.160
of gray. And I think that's the toughest thing because
569
00:31:54.200 --> 00:31:57.200
you want to be logical. The data clearly says something,
570
00:31:57.759 --> 00:32:01.680
it's not like it's irrefutable, and you still have pushback
571
00:32:01.720 --> 00:32:04.720
from leadership stakeholders. You're like, I don't have to tell you.
572
00:32:04.759 --> 00:32:07.279
I don't explain this to you anymore. And that's when
573
00:32:07.359 --> 00:32:12.559
you're like, okay, what what is happening From the stakeholder's
574
00:32:12.559 --> 00:32:17.359
position that I need to take consideration. Maybe there are
575
00:32:17.559 --> 00:32:21.119
terriffs or something. Maybe there's some external forces that are
576
00:32:21.160 --> 00:32:24.160
happening that we're not privy to, and so then you
577
00:32:24.200 --> 00:32:26.519
have to have a little bit of courage. What's really
578
00:32:26.559 --> 00:32:29.960
happening here? What am I not understanding because I'm not
579
00:32:30.039 --> 00:32:32.440
understanding something that's happening that I'm telling you something is
580
00:32:32.480 --> 00:32:35.119
irrefutable to you and you're still not doing it. So
581
00:32:35.720 --> 00:32:38.839
is it's that we can we can work with or
582
00:32:39.680 --> 00:32:43.839
is it is it is it an insurmountable wall. Then,
583
00:32:44.079 --> 00:32:46.599
as a data analyst, I have given you the data,
584
00:32:47.279 --> 00:32:50.160
I have told you my personal opinion experience, as you
585
00:32:50.200 --> 00:32:54.960
have given me this mission. Now it's it's it's it's
586
00:32:55.039 --> 00:32:57.279
up to you to make those decisions. And I think
587
00:32:57.400 --> 00:33:00.680
that's the hardest part for clients. And I've given you
588
00:33:00.720 --> 00:33:02.759
this stuff, this information. I have a lot of clients
589
00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:05.240
who work with clients like a lot of B to B,
590
00:33:05.359 --> 00:33:08.160
but there sometimes B two C. Why don't they do it?
591
00:33:08.200 --> 00:33:12.079
I'm like, they're humans and maybe the pain wasn't great enough,
592
00:33:12.160 --> 00:33:15.079
or there was something externally that was stopping them and
593
00:33:15.079 --> 00:33:17.440
they just couldn't do it. As smart as it is
594
00:33:17.519 --> 00:33:20.400
and much makes sense to us. So like my data
595
00:33:20.400 --> 00:33:24.079
analysts out there. I am with you, I have been
596
00:33:24.119 --> 00:33:29.119
there before, and there's a point we just go I've
597
00:33:29.160 --> 00:33:32.119
done all I've can. I could hear, we've done all
598
00:33:32.119 --> 00:33:32.480
we could.
599
00:33:33.279 --> 00:33:35.440
It is so hard if you're in the data so
600
00:33:35.640 --> 00:33:38.279
much and you see what's happening around you and within
601
00:33:38.319 --> 00:33:41.200
the business, and you can see a better way, and
602
00:33:41.240 --> 00:33:44.160
it looks so clear, like this is the path we
603
00:33:44.240 --> 00:33:47.480
need to take. But oftentimes there's it's more than just
604
00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:50.160
your manager. Maybe your manager approves the idea, but then
605
00:33:50.200 --> 00:33:53.079
there's like five other levels of managers above your.
606
00:33:52.960 --> 00:33:55.400
Manager that they need to agree to it.
607
00:33:55.720 --> 00:33:57.759
And if you don't have the level of influence, or
608
00:33:57.799 --> 00:34:00.599
maybe maybe you don't take all of the all of
609
00:34:00.599 --> 00:34:04.000
the necessary kind of proactive measures that you would need
610
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:07.079
to take in order to actually make that change happen,
611
00:34:07.319 --> 00:34:10.159
whether it's in your control or not. Like it's really hard,
612
00:34:10.719 --> 00:34:13.000
uh to come to terms with you know, when you
613
00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:16.320
were talking about like your mindset and having to get
614
00:34:16.360 --> 00:34:18.679
to the point where you're like, I've done everything I could.
615
00:34:19.159 --> 00:34:23.119
I feel like that's what my perspective has been as well,
616
00:34:23.320 --> 00:34:25.519
is like I'm just going to provide you with everything
617
00:34:25.519 --> 00:34:27.679
that I can. I'm going to give it my best,
618
00:34:27.880 --> 00:34:31.960
my best chance with communication information, thinking through all the
619
00:34:32.000 --> 00:34:35.239
different things that are impacting what we're seeing, and if
620
00:34:35.280 --> 00:34:38.920
that still does not drive the change that in my
621
00:34:39.039 --> 00:34:41.719
mind makes a lot of sense, then it's I can
622
00:34:41.719 --> 00:34:44.800
step back and say I'm still really satisfied with the
623
00:34:44.840 --> 00:34:45.599
work that I've done.
624
00:34:45.679 --> 00:34:53.039
Absolutely, And you know, I I think people who who
625
00:34:53.079 --> 00:34:55.519
are like mister Spot's and the mystery datas of the world,
626
00:34:56.920 --> 00:35:00.960
we we just we just see and we're like, this
627
00:35:01.000 --> 00:35:04.360
is what it is. Now there is a counterpoint here
628
00:35:04.400 --> 00:35:09.639
where I personally am working. So I'm an introvert, right
629
00:35:10.320 --> 00:35:14.079
whether that Let's see where this goes, and so talking
630
00:35:14.079 --> 00:35:17.119
to people can be fairly draining to me, not in
631
00:35:17.159 --> 00:35:18.920
a bad way, it's just it's just the way my
632
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:21.119
body is wir My friend's an extrovert. He gets charged
633
00:35:21.199 --> 00:35:23.719
up talking to people. He really does like he loves it.
634
00:35:25.280 --> 00:35:32.360
There is a There's ways to get your point across.
635
00:35:33.079 --> 00:35:36.039
And there's a book by Dale carneie was like Making
636
00:35:36.079 --> 00:35:39.400
Friends and Winning Influence. I think I'm misquoting it, but
637
00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:43.159
it's it was a really powerful book that if you
638
00:35:43.280 --> 00:35:48.559
can get into the art of persuasion and those soft skills,
639
00:35:49.519 --> 00:35:52.360
right because as a data analyst, you have to have
640
00:35:52.400 --> 00:35:56.320
hard skills, but there's also sort of those soft skills
641
00:35:56.320 --> 00:36:00.960
which I think people like the through datas in spots
642
00:36:00.960 --> 00:36:03.920
of the world we're like, no, I don't don't want
643
00:36:03.920 --> 00:36:06.760
to do that. Well, you don't want to, but it's
644
00:36:06.800 --> 00:36:08.599
part of it, and you have to learn how to
645
00:36:09.119 --> 00:36:12.079
how to talk to people and get them to see
646
00:36:12.480 --> 00:36:16.119
your point of view. And that for me is something
647
00:36:16.159 --> 00:36:18.599
that I'm working on in terms of presenting and how
648
00:36:18.639 --> 00:36:22.360
to really make sure that I'm getting my point across.
649
00:36:23.239 --> 00:36:26.760
It's not manipulation, right, It's just making sure that I
650
00:36:26.880 --> 00:36:30.760
am I am taking my information and.
651
00:36:30.679 --> 00:36:36.360
I am communicating it in the best way because maybe
652
00:36:36.360 --> 00:36:39.880
they have some objections there, and I need to know
653
00:36:39.960 --> 00:36:44.159
how to address those objections because I'm giving you the fact.
654
00:36:44.800 --> 00:36:47.320
But it's not always about the facts. And I think
655
00:36:47.400 --> 00:36:51.519
for my data analysts who are listening, you know understanding
656
00:36:51.840 --> 00:36:54.679
that those sauce skills are just as important to your
657
00:36:54.800 --> 00:36:57.760
job as the hard skills. That took me a long
658
00:36:57.840 --> 00:37:00.960
time and I'm in my forties now still working on it,
659
00:37:01.000 --> 00:37:03.840
and and by far there are people who I who
660
00:37:04.679 --> 00:37:07.320
I'm you seeing, the people who can talk to anybody
661
00:37:07.920 --> 00:37:11.199
or they can talk, they can get they can get
662
00:37:11.239 --> 00:37:13.199
their way, and you're like, how did not even screaming
663
00:37:13.280 --> 00:37:14.639
or holler? And they just know how to talk to me?
664
00:37:15.280 --> 00:37:17.360
And you're like, how did you do that? They do?
665
00:37:18.159 --> 00:37:21.519
And I think that's a skill that if more data
666
00:37:21.559 --> 00:37:25.400
analysts people and sort of tech people can can really
667
00:37:25.519 --> 00:37:30.719
learn the better and then that makes you really sort
668
00:37:30.760 --> 00:37:36.679
of irreplaceable because you're like, well, seth, she she conveyed
669
00:37:36.679 --> 00:37:40.880
a really tough decision to us, but she I trusted
670
00:37:40.920 --> 00:37:43.159
her and I knew that she and she knew how
671
00:37:43.199 --> 00:37:47.280
I felt, and we connected and so I had no
672
00:37:47.320 --> 00:37:48.920
problem at the end of the day. Is obtually their
673
00:37:48.960 --> 00:37:53.559
their their choice. But you have said, hey, I see you,
674
00:37:53.639 --> 00:37:58.400
I hear you, And I think that's something that that
675
00:37:58.400 --> 00:38:01.519
that I would say to any one. You can learn
676
00:38:01.559 --> 00:38:04.280
how to be more persuasive in your communication and be
677
00:38:04.320 --> 00:38:08.239
a better communicator. And I catches if I'm a good communicator, okay, sure,
678
00:38:08.280 --> 00:38:09.880
but I can be a better one. And that's how
679
00:38:09.920 --> 00:38:12.519
where I try to stop myself. I can always get better.
680
00:38:12.559 --> 00:38:13.440
It's always something I can.
681
00:38:13.440 --> 00:38:14.880
Learn, right.
682
00:38:15.000 --> 00:38:17.599
I operate on that same line of thinking too, is
683
00:38:17.639 --> 00:38:20.000
like I can always be getting better and I love
684
00:38:20.039 --> 00:38:22.599
when you talked about persuasion because I just don't think
685
00:38:22.639 --> 00:38:26.199
a lot of people assume that person would have anything
686
00:38:26.239 --> 00:38:29.239
to do with the data world, but it is such
687
00:38:29.239 --> 00:38:32.679
a crucial part of it because it's all based on decisions,
688
00:38:32.719 --> 00:38:35.639
and that's how decisions get made. I had two other
689
00:38:35.760 --> 00:38:38.280
questions for you, will for people who want to change
690
00:38:38.280 --> 00:38:41.920
a system, but they have people in their crew who don't.
691
00:38:42.199 --> 00:38:45.239
They don't believe in it for whatever reason. I just
692
00:38:45.239 --> 00:38:47.400
want to know, like, what do you think the biggest
693
00:38:47.960 --> 00:38:52.480
internal beliefs are that hold people back from saying like, yeah,
694
00:38:52.559 --> 00:38:54.760
let's iterate, let's get better, like let's.
695
00:38:54.599 --> 00:38:59.639
Change in systems thinking they have tried to address this
696
00:39:00.039 --> 00:39:04.159
all the mental models, right, Like what mental model is
697
00:39:04.199 --> 00:39:07.880
this person operating from? Very rarely is it very obvious
698
00:39:07.920 --> 00:39:11.119
what someone's mental model is operating Some people are and
699
00:39:11.159 --> 00:39:14.559
even that if they're loud on whatever, there's something else
700
00:39:14.599 --> 00:39:21.199
behind that mental model. So understanding that people have mental models,
701
00:39:21.679 --> 00:39:25.440
and they can have multiple mental models within and and happening.
702
00:39:25.800 --> 00:39:29.880
For instance, with the change, people don't like change, some
703
00:39:30.119 --> 00:39:32.679
not everybody, Not every everyone gets in change, and even
704
00:39:32.719 --> 00:39:36.239
probably people who are more willing to, we still have
705
00:39:36.480 --> 00:39:39.719
like a knee your grassic ough. I got to change
706
00:39:40.920 --> 00:39:44.480
this email to this email right, a thing like even
707
00:39:44.480 --> 00:39:46.400
with me, I'm like, I got to give you my
708
00:39:46.480 --> 00:39:49.400
new EMIL address and it's a pin the butt. But
709
00:39:49.519 --> 00:39:55.000
it's like, what what fear are we operating from? So
710
00:39:55.159 --> 00:39:58.079
I taught yoga for twenty years and that a lot
711
00:39:58.079 --> 00:40:02.199
of that that wasn't just opposes, but it's what's holding
712
00:40:02.440 --> 00:40:06.840
us back. It's either you're operating from abundance or scarcity.
713
00:40:07.039 --> 00:40:10.039
I mean that seems like it's so simplistic, But at
714
00:40:10.039 --> 00:40:14.039
the same time, I'm like, what are they fearing? And
715
00:40:14.079 --> 00:40:16.440
that's not like people think that fear is like a
716
00:40:16.480 --> 00:40:18.880
bad thing. It's like, no, it's it's like an alarm system.
717
00:40:19.039 --> 00:40:23.280
They're having a fear. Where's I's from? And and those
718
00:40:23.360 --> 00:40:27.559
people sometimes just don't like changing, Like Okay, tell me
719
00:40:27.599 --> 00:40:33.199
what's going on so we can work through it. That's
720
00:40:33.239 --> 00:40:35.119
a tough It's it's not even a tough one. It's
721
00:40:35.280 --> 00:40:37.199
so One thing I was going to add to the
722
00:40:38.280 --> 00:40:42.719
data analysts is that we even even the most logical
723
00:40:42.800 --> 00:40:46.639
data analysts is still an emotional creature. There's still emotions
724
00:40:46.679 --> 00:40:50.440
that are running underneath the surface. There whether the veneer
725
00:40:50.679 --> 00:40:54.679
is stoic or whatever. It's still there and you're still
726
00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:57.800
sort of I have to appeal to this emotions. What
727
00:40:57.840 --> 00:41:01.320
emotions am I appealing to? So fears a really really
728
00:41:01.360 --> 00:41:04.400
powerful one, and it's the one that it can do
729
00:41:04.480 --> 00:41:08.480
a lot of damage. Honestly, so addressing fears and you
730
00:41:08.480 --> 00:41:11.400
don't have to call it fears. You can call it hesitations, objections.
731
00:41:11.400 --> 00:41:13.880
There's probably a lot of ways to color that. One
732
00:41:14.800 --> 00:41:18.400
understanding that and say Okay, I understand your objection, your fear.
733
00:41:19.039 --> 00:41:21.039
Let's walk through it to see if we can solve
734
00:41:21.079 --> 00:41:23.559
it now. Depending on the situations, if it's not one
735
00:41:23.599 --> 00:41:25.920
of those life or deaths, then it's worth a conversation
736
00:41:26.000 --> 00:41:30.679
of saying okay, let's try to work through it. At
737
00:41:30.719 --> 00:41:33.199
the end of the day, I want to make sure
738
00:41:33.199 --> 00:41:36.440
that you can be okay with it. But it's also
739
00:41:36.599 --> 00:41:38.519
like sort of a leader and a team leader managers
740
00:41:38.559 --> 00:41:43.039
like I value your opinion, but we're one's still going
741
00:41:43.079 --> 00:41:45.360
to do this, but I want to make it easy
742
00:41:45.440 --> 00:41:46.920
for you. I want to make sure that you're with
743
00:41:47.000 --> 00:41:49.199
us and then you're part of our team and that
744
00:41:49.280 --> 00:41:52.000
we're addressing your fears up to the place that's professional
745
00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:53.360
and in that boundary.
746
00:41:53.760 --> 00:41:57.079
Yeah, you may not be able to specifically call out
747
00:41:57.119 --> 00:42:00.840
what someone's fears are. There may be hints of it,
748
00:42:01.480 --> 00:42:03.960
things that they say that can kind of be artifacts
749
00:42:04.000 --> 00:42:07.920
to inform the situation, and then you can take that
750
00:42:08.199 --> 00:42:10.079
and meet the person where they're at.
751
00:42:10.880 --> 00:42:13.920
I've got twin boys, right, you don't understand how different
752
00:42:14.000 --> 00:42:16.599
kids are until you have a few or what. But
753
00:42:17.360 --> 00:42:20.239
one boy is like, he's like me. He's like a
754
00:42:20.280 --> 00:42:23.039
problem solver. He wants when we heat, he has to
755
00:42:23.079 --> 00:42:26.159
have his two little toys with him. Don't give him
756
00:42:26.199 --> 00:42:29.920
some comfort whatever, it's a normal developmental thing. My other
757
00:42:30.039 --> 00:42:32.840
kid is actually unbothered by most things. But when he
758
00:42:32.880 --> 00:42:35.920
gets tired, so when he starts to whine, I know
759
00:42:36.039 --> 00:42:39.440
that he's tired. And so I have to understand that
760
00:42:39.599 --> 00:42:42.679
both of my boys are very different. My youngest is
761
00:42:43.159 --> 00:42:48.800
very physical. My oldest is he's like, eh, but that's
762
00:42:48.880 --> 00:42:51.639
what me. Hugging my youngest one is how he gets
763
00:42:51.639 --> 00:42:54.400
safe and secure. It's like the same thing with obviously
764
00:42:54.440 --> 00:42:56.480
with people, it's like how do I work with their
765
00:42:56.519 --> 00:43:01.119
thing to get them secure? Always when I saw a job,
766
00:43:01.280 --> 00:43:03.920
like what's your communication style? What's your management's style? I
767
00:43:03.920 --> 00:43:06.079
want to know what those are, and they're like, no
768
00:43:06.119 --> 00:43:09.519
one's ever asked me that before I'm asking you. I
769
00:43:09.559 --> 00:43:13.800
want to know what you are because then it opens
770
00:43:13.800 --> 00:43:17.079
a conversation up so that I can understand, because they're like, oh,
771
00:43:17.119 --> 00:43:20.199
he wants to wants to understand me. I want to
772
00:43:20.280 --> 00:43:23.559
understand how communic with you? And I think that is
773
00:43:23.960 --> 00:43:26.800
Those are just questions that I learned to ask years
774
00:43:26.840 --> 00:43:30.199
and years ago, but it paid off hues and sometimes
775
00:43:30.199 --> 00:43:32.519
they don't know what it is and it makes them
776
00:43:32.559 --> 00:43:35.280
think a bit and like, Okay, I actually prefer that
777
00:43:35.320 --> 00:43:38.119
you email me, don't text me. Oh I've been texting you.
778
00:43:38.119 --> 00:43:41.400
You're like, oh, yeah, you don't like that. No, And
779
00:43:41.400 --> 00:43:44.360
then often they are responding to your emails. I wish
780
00:43:44.440 --> 00:43:46.679
there was like a course to take, but it's just
781
00:43:46.800 --> 00:43:48.519
sort of how do humans operate.
782
00:43:49.840 --> 00:43:52.559
People are probably going to be very surprised that someone's
783
00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:56.199
actually asking them questions about what they prefer, because it
784
00:43:56.320 --> 00:43:59.239
just doesn't happen that often. But if you can do it,
785
00:43:59.360 --> 00:44:03.880
then it just builds further trust and influence in your role.
786
00:44:04.159 --> 00:44:07.800
Will you have given so many amazing insights on systems?
787
00:44:07.800 --> 00:44:11.440
Thinking what idea about systems? Do you really hope that
788
00:44:11.480 --> 00:44:13.000
people take away from this.
789
00:44:12.920 --> 00:44:20.679
Conversation that systems that we that we can organize. We
790
00:44:20.719 --> 00:44:26.039
don't generally create them, we can, but that we organize them,
791
00:44:26.480 --> 00:44:30.039
and that they're living and breathing in general, that they
792
00:44:30.119 --> 00:44:35.519
that they need attention, that they need they need tendering
793
00:44:35.719 --> 00:44:38.000
and sort of nurturing, and that that sounds sort of
794
00:44:39.559 --> 00:44:42.639
but in a lot of regards, it's like, what is
795
00:44:42.719 --> 00:44:46.480
my system with my work? What is my system with
796
00:44:46.559 --> 00:44:49.639
myself in terms of how I approach work? What's my
797
00:44:49.760 --> 00:44:53.000
system between Seth and I and how we communicate? And
798
00:44:54.760 --> 00:45:00.239
how can we sort of make this work better? And
799
00:45:00.280 --> 00:45:03.760
it may be nothing wrong, it's like, but just being
800
00:45:03.800 --> 00:45:08.280
aware I think about systems and how people interact, how
801
00:45:08.280 --> 00:45:10.960
these nodes are interacting and system with the tech and
802
00:45:11.000 --> 00:45:15.039
the people and the outside world, and just understanding that.
803
00:45:15.119 --> 00:45:19.840
It's like, Okay, I understand that people don't operate in silos,
804
00:45:20.440 --> 00:45:25.159
that things are connected, then I can understand things a
805
00:45:25.239 --> 00:45:28.800
little bit better. I may not uncover all the secrets,
806
00:45:28.960 --> 00:45:32.760
but I can certainly understand a little bit better. And
807
00:45:32.800 --> 00:45:35.599
I think if we sort of understand each other a
808
00:45:35.639 --> 00:45:38.679
little bit better, then we interact, our interaction is going
809
00:45:38.719 --> 00:45:40.639
to just be better. And so I think that's what
810
00:45:40.679 --> 00:45:42.960
I would take away from it. So looking holistically at
811
00:45:43.079 --> 00:45:46.440
you know what sort of goes on, and be willing
812
00:45:46.480 --> 00:45:50.280
to know that it's just the way that sometimes those
813
00:45:50.599 --> 00:45:55.800
systems are organized. You know, great bad on. It helps
814
00:45:55.840 --> 00:45:57.320
you make decisions.
815
00:45:57.400 --> 00:46:00.800
If you're doing that, then you're already one more person
816
00:46:01.280 --> 00:46:05.360
in the space that is showing up yes and putting
817
00:46:05.400 --> 00:46:07.920
your energy to good use. So thank you so much again,
818
00:46:08.000 --> 00:46:10.519
Will for joining the podcast. It really was a pleasure
819
00:46:10.519 --> 00:46:13.239
of having this conversation with you. Really appreciate your time.
820
00:46:13.639 --> 00:46:14.679
Thank you for having me Sam.
821
00:46:15.480 --> 00:46:18.880
Thank you for listening to the quietly ambitious analyst. If
822
00:46:18.880 --> 00:46:21.960
today's episode helped you see data in a new way,
823
00:46:22.519 --> 00:46:25.480
share it with someone who'd appreciate it too, and follow
824
00:46:25.519 --> 00:46:29.320
the show for more lessons on business communication and driving
825
00:46:29.440 --> 00:46:32.760
impact with data. And if you found it helpful, leaving
826
00:46:32.760 --> 00:46:36.199
a quick review really helps this podcast reach more people
827
00:46:36.239 --> 00:46:38.800
who want to grow in the same way. Until next time,
828
00:46:38.960 --> 00:46:41.559
focus only on what you can control and strive to
829
00:46:41.559 --> 00:46:43.079
be one percent better each day.