Episode 23 with Warren Werbitt - The Print Whisperer

speaker-0: Hi there and welcome to season two, episode 23 of The Print Reviews. I'm your host, Colin Sinclair McDermott, aka the online print coach. And today, surprise, surprise, I'm joined by another very special guest. We've been speaking about doing this for quite some time. I was on his podcast earlier this year. Warren Werbitt, the print whisperer. Thank you for joining me today. How are you?
speaker-1: Thanks for having me. It's nice to be a guest and not a host.
speaker-0: It's nice to flip it sometimes, isn't it? Absolutely. I can't imagine many people, certainly in your side of the pond, won't have come across you at some point. But for us over here in the UK and wherever else you're listening from the world, tell us a little bit about what and where. But who are you? Just a kind of brief intro into who you are and what you do.
speaker-1: ⁓ so I'm Warren Werbit, but you got that part already. ⁓ I've been in print most of my life. When I started I had an Afro, no more. I've done all kinds of I'll say everything in print from you know when we started pizzazz with just two little A B dicks. ⁓ I'll skip the twenty-seven year history, but in the end we were fifty-six inch offset UV, forty inch, we were IGEN fives, we were flexo, we were large format, we were mailing. ⁓ basically doing it all and I and and that all came about because as I was building ⁓ you know not to be cliche but I think I was one of the first that started under one roof. Mm-hmm. Like way back in when FSC started. And ⁓ we had done everything along the way and actually what was really cool was the thing that put me on the map in the industry was that video printings alive. I don't know if everyone's seen it or not. Hopefully you have ⁓ never heard one bad Comment. ⁓ actually one person thought I was abusing my son in the video, which was kind of funny. ⁓ his head was so big after the video we couldn't even get him in the house. ⁓ but that that video put me on the map. And then ⁓ from working, I think I I think I was one of the first ⁓ print owners to believe in marketing in that we had a full-time marketing person dedicated in-house. ⁓ everything that I did was about the team, culture. building the business ⁓ and and the marketing. So the marketing, I think for if I've learned anything, marketing is really the most important thing in any business in any industry. Because you need to let people know who you are. And my idea was to let people know that we ⁓ that we existed, that we cared, that we were constantly doing things to push the envelope. Just to give you a couple quick examples, we weren't just FSC certified, we were FSC, P F C S F I. ⁓ twelve thousand dollars a year on ⁓ certifications. I would not recommend anybody do them anymore. You don't need them. ⁓ we constantly did ⁓ our own promos and samples and sending out. Why? Had to give the salespeople something to go with to see customers then. It's harder today, but ⁓ to go have a reason because you could you couldn't then just knock on the door and say, do you have anything to quote? ⁓ although some legacy salespeople still think that that exists. It doesn't. ⁓ in doing we were the first to do Pantone certification in offset large format, digital, and flexo. If you ask Pantone, I think I'm the only one who asked for that. ⁓ why did I ask for that? Not because I cared so much about Pantone and all that other stuff, because we were pretty good. pat on the shoulder, just a little joke. ⁓ but this is the kicker. Everybody on the team works hard. You can't keep asking people to work harder. You know, it it just doesn't work. It backfires. So my thinking was with all these certifications and Pantone was to elevate the level in which we worked and to be able to say to the team, folks, cuddle, you know, team huddle. Everybody's looking at us right now. Because, you know, the video ⁓ was a little loud, ⁓ everyone's looking at us. So I've just found something that will elevate us again and keep it out there and let people know that we care and we're working hard and collar, etc. So you let the team know that you that that the company's great, everyone's looking, everybody will elevate themselves. You're not telling them to that they have to do something. You're not imposing something. Anyway, so all that marketing stuff came about. and ⁓ we just kept moving and grooving. And I just I mean, I happen to love print. So everything and anything about it that I touch ⁓ just became part of me within the business. And at the end of the day, at the end of the day, we were about a $20 million operation. We were about 120 people. ⁓ I will say, ⁓ you know, I I miss having the business. I don't miss having 120 employees ⁓ or patients, whatever you want to call them. but I learned a ⁓ hell of a lot. Today I wear multiple hats, ⁓ which is kind of funny because ⁓ I don't know, I got the attention span of a P sometimes. But ⁓ I act as the print whisper. Funny, I don't whisper, I scream. I put out my book, I have my podcast. ⁓ as the print whisper, I work with some print organizations that want help. I've have no patience to deal with people who just want to talk and don't want to do anything. Keep your money and just leave me to fuck alone. ⁓ I meet people who want action. I'm ⁓ partners with my brother in a label company called Stick2, where we are ⁓ BGS BGC B C G S certified for food at the highest level. ⁓ I would check out Stick 2. ⁓ I just put a video together of the plant. 17 inch ⁓ 12 collar, 10 collars, HP indigos. And again, that company is just about service. I don't work in it day to day because it's just my brother and I as partners, and I love my brother. I don't want to fight with him and end up as enemies. So I strategically help and I work on some of the marketing. And then I help ⁓ another company called Nova Glue, which is part of Felix Bluer, where they've come out with this new ⁓ like C like it's like a CNC machine, but instead of a laser head, it's got hot, cold glue. I got involved with ⁓ JF because two reasons. One, I've never seen anything like it. If I was an owner, I would want it. ⁓ it's something where I'm calling people that I know and don't know. And if the owner can't look at it and figure out the benefit in the ROI, he doesn't deserve or she doesn't deserve to have it. There's no push. ⁓ never really liked the OEMs and how they did ROIs and how they talk to you about your business. This one I'm bringing something to someone which is just total benefit all around. And JF is a 35-year-old guy who I just want to help build with him because I think he's awesome. And I think we as ⁓ elders, I'll I'll say elders. ⁓ just 'cause I paid my grandfather four months ago, which I'm still like, whoa. if we don't do our part to take some people under our wing and help them get further down the road, no one's gonna succeed.
speaker-0: Yeah. Right. I'm going to jump in because I think, I need to rein you in a couple of times and I knew this was going to be tough because you like to talk and I want to let people know that I'm still on the podcast as well. ⁓ I want to touch on the video because small questions. ⁓ I first came across you ⁓ on YouTube actually via that video. And as I said on a LinkedIn post earlier on, fast forward to
speaker-1: Ask me small questions.
speaker-0: 2026 and Here We Are buddies and fellow all stars as well, which we'll come to later. But that video I thought was absolute genius to be honest, before I'd even met you to be honest with you as well. What was the inspiration behind that video? Cause it was really comical and your poor son, he did look like he'd taken a beating that day to be fair, but I just loved it. had everything. that we all feel about the industry but with a kind comical twist as well.
speaker-1: Yeah. So ⁓ it's funny when people ask me. First of all, my son was most happy because he got a day off of school to do it. ⁓ so honestly, what came about with the video was I happened to see another video that was done for the the corrugated industry by this company and I thought, wow, pretty cool video. And then I thought, YouTube is pretty new. What is YouTube? You know, no one really knew.
speaker-0: was by what 2007?
speaker-1: Yeah, I don't even like to say the date because that dates me. But I was a lot ⁓ I was a lot heavier and I didn't look as good as I do now. I've actually aged quite well. But ⁓ yeah, so the idea then was just to have some fun. I mean, I think I was forty or forty two at the time. ⁓ not your typical owner. ⁓ big into the party, big into the rave. The average age in the company was young. Right. and the video was really just for fun. And I thought, hey, maybe ⁓ couple of customers will see it, some friends will see it and what the hell? So I called up a friend of mine who does ⁓ video and different things. ⁓ we came up with a pretty quick script. I read it once. I was like, ⁓ my God, I love it. Yeah. And we just we went we went ahead and did it. And ⁓ you know, if people ⁓ when people ask me today what was my thinking, I tell them I had a vision. But I had no vision. It was a lot
speaker-0: Just wingin'
speaker-1: Like everything else, right? Today, I haven't changed much. And then ⁓ put the video out and I'm sitting there and I see a hundred views. Five hundred views. Now I'm jumping up and down because I don't even know what I'm jumping about, but I'm just seeing the people are watching it. And then the phone rings and it's Reuters News. Reuters somewhere saw it, picked it up, ⁓ called me, wanted an interview on it. I'm like, News is on the phone. Like people I was calling people into the office. I'm like, what the fuck? And ⁓ I did that, and then all of a sudden all the trade magazines in print picked it up. And then I became the video guy. I became like, you know, the next best thing after ⁓ the Gutenberg because I'm gonna say this just point blank. We're an old fucking industry, like really old. And we got a lot of old people, and twenty years ago we had more old people with more old attitudes. So I think it people just embraced it. what I what I would say is. I like to think I follow in some ways along the same lines as Gary Vanderchuk or Gary V. Mm-hmm. ⁓ you should check out I'm Gary Sr., by the way, just 'cause I'm the older version. When I was swearing it wasn't really it was it was frowned upon, he made it okay. Yeah, and I'll tell you what I like about Gary V for anybody who's listening. ⁓ he talked to the younger people.
speaker-0: He made it popular, didn't he?
speaker-1: And you should be listening to Gary Vee, whether you like him or you don't like him, because you want to hear what the younger people are hearing. If you hear what they're hearing and you know what they're thinking, you could better react and respond with them as opposed to just being that old doofus who doesn't know what to do. And you and you can get a little hipper. and yeah, and and it was just the video went out. And then the other thing I learned along the way, I didn't know marketing before. Okay. when I was done school, I had it my degree was AFS.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: Almost finished school. I never made it through university. But I needed a degree on LinkedIn. So I wrote AFS in the years I tried to go to school. ⁓ but I didn't know about marketing, but I learned about marketing. And then the biggest thing I learned about that I only learned that I learned later was about personal branding. I now have fast forward a personal brand. So today, everybody talks about a brand. A brand is really any product. In the old days, a brand was Gucci, Louis Vuitton.
speaker-0: Yeah.
speaker-1: And a higher end. So we've kind of put it in there. So I've just learnt what a brand is and made it just easier to understand ⁓ other other things that go on and how to do things and then it makes it even easier when I talk to people to explain. But I didn't know anything. It's it's it's a school of hard knocks.
speaker-0: For anyone who's not seen the video, go check it out. Search YouTube for the print whisperer. It'll come up fairly quickly. I've also posted about it on LinkedIn this morning as well at the time of recording this. But listen, let's talk about Pissadz because you and I share a very similar story. We both lost businesses. Your business was much bigger than mine. But Pissadz, obviously, you were doing all right. You're 120 staff. 20 million revenue you said. ⁓ So there was definitely success in there. Before we get to the negative stuff, when did you realize that you'd built something really special with Pizzas?
speaker-1: I don't know that I ever realized that I built something special. ⁓ I think ⁓ and I and I really I come from ⁓ nothing. ⁓ when I started, ⁓ my brother and I, we had two rented A B Dick three sixties. I don't know if anyone knows what those are, but they're duplicators. We had a collater, ⁓ we were selling by day, printing at night, delivering and asking for a five percent discount to be paid right away. Right. And then and it's funny, when I sat down, I built a fifteen year plan With a sales projection. But that's all I did. I took an Excel sheet and I went 327, 723, 1050, 1436. Somehow at the end of 15 years, I was at that number, a bit forward and back. ⁓ but yeah, you you just I don't know, you just you just go. There's no plan. And and I don't think I don't think anyone successful truly looks at themselves as being successful in that way. ⁓ when I lost the business. I realize that a lot of people look at success as the wealth that you're left with. I I wasn't left with any wealth at the end, but I was left with a vast amount of experience of places I've been. I've been around the world four times. I have friends in every country. I could pick up the phone and call all kinds of people. Most will take the call, some will hang up. and and really it's ⁓ that's my wealth, not dollars. ⁓ dollars is good. good in in many cases it helps even if you're miserable. but you know when you do it in you know yourself internally and you you're meeting and your learning. ⁓ so I feel good about myself. I don't feel good about my bank account, but at the end of the day, ⁓ it's not the end it's not the end all, right?
speaker-0: No, definitely not. do you, kind of looking, obviously we've both got the benefit of insight into a lot of other printing companies today. What decisions do you think most printing businesses still underestimate?
speaker-1: Sorry, say that again.
speaker-0: What kind of decisions do you think that most printing businesses still underestimate?
speaker-1: That's a tough question. So first of all, there's many different businesses. There's small, medium, and big. There's companies that are well financed, not well financed. There's companies that have good human resources and don't have the good hum human resources. So depending on the company and what they're what availability they have to them to do things, it varies. But ⁓ you know, culture number one to me is most important. ⁓ Anything I'm gonna say right now all starts with the owner or the top of the company or the leadership. If the owner's listening and you're not walking the talk and talking the walk, how dare you expect anyone in your business to be doing any better than you? So look at yourself, question yourself, and then decide how you want the others to be, right? Because you have to lead by example. but ⁓ the culture is one, marketing, marketing in the sense of letting people know that you are there. Letting them know exactly what you do, right? ⁓ i is key. And it and first of all, I'm about to start doing this and I'm gonna be hated by people. I'm about to start ripping apart print websites that are awful shit and show machinery on the front. Our customers don't give a shit about what we run. They don't care, they don't know, they don't wanna know. They wanna know what you're gonna do to help them and what it's gonna look like at the end. So watch out for me because I'm coming after you. ⁓ we have so many amazing print companies in the world that are doing it right. Unfortunately, we don't talk enough about them. We talked about the others. ⁓ my parents never talked about what I did good. They only talked about what I did bad. So I guess that's why we do it. We learned from our parents. ⁓ but yeah, just take an internal look. A lot of companies don't have to do that much to change the dial to to up it a little. And the biggest thing is follow through with what you talk about. Yeah. Make a plan, right?
speaker-0: No, I disagree. And I agree with you. I might not necessarily turn to ripping people's websites to threads, but I'll leave that to you. But, but again, we don't talk enough about, again, I see people posting, we spoke about this in our print mastermind community last week. ⁓ People posting about the new bit of kit they've just invested in and shiny objects. The customers, most customers don't give a damn. They're more interested in what solutions you can solve for them and that's what should be on the front page of the website not the fancy new kind of
speaker-1: I'll tell I'll tell you about the cus I'll tell you about the customers who give a damn. And most of us don't have them. Those are the companies that run high production of their product and they move and they run around the clock and they want to know what you have because they want to know that you're capable of actually sus ⁓ supplying them on the continuous basis. Coca-Cola, the beer companies, the food companies, etc. All of our other customers, the ad agencies and the others. Don't no, don't care. If you think about what we do in our day, we don't have time to care about a lot of shit that we deal with. So just put yourself in your customers' shoes, neither do they. It's pretty simple.
speaker-0: You know, this, I think this might be the first podcast, you're going to get a medal for this when I see you in Vegas next month. This will be the first podcast I've had to actually put for adults only on when I, when I publish it to Spotify. But I didn't expect anything differently today and anyone who knows you knows this is how you are the Gary V of the print industry. But listen, let's talk about the flip side of the success that you had with that business. Where did it go wrong? And I think this is really the golden nugget of this conversation because you and I know this is where the valuable lessons are learned.
speaker-1: So I had a I ha I'll give you I'll take a few minutes just with a a little trail because it it wasn't about in the end it was one thing that was somewhat out of my control, but if I think back earlier, you could control it. So I generally had a pretty good run of the business, building it, starting it, going up. ⁓ everything I made always went back in in two thousand so we started in ninety-two in ⁓ June two thousand, no, in yeah, no, two thousand seven excuse me, is when I started looking at putting in a new press. I did not want to put a 40 inch press in because everyone had one. I decided to put a fifty-six inch KBA UV six color off the ground from point two paper to forty point substrate. Like I my plan was amazing. Small glitch. The day we move in, everything's ready to go, open up the newspaper, and Lehman Mother Lehman Brothers went bust in the US, beginning of the two thousand eight financial crisis, ⁓ which affected everyone, including Canada. Nobody wanted what I had because everyone wanted to pay thirty percent less for what they were doing. Everyone was in panic mode in business. Everyone. Heidelberg Canada filed for protection, all these companies. ⁓ two thousand ten, I ended up having to file for protection. Probably the worst and scariest thing I've ever done in business. ⁓ especially when you're coming off fifteen years of, you know, being the poster boy, so to speak, and doing no wrong. And ⁓ I'm gonna just tell you quickly what happened because how I dealt with it I think helped us after. ⁓ I go to a meeting with the bank. Banks don't give a shit for us no matter what. They just want to make sure that they're protected and covered and they don't even hear what you say. They just look at number, protection, guarantee, number, protection. When they're not good, they go foot. So it was HSBC. ⁓ they call me into a meeting. I go with my lawyer, my accountant, and because I don't know what I am for a $9,000 meeting. and they basically proceed to tell me back then that they are calling my loan. They want me out of the bank. I went from not using my line of credit pretty much ever to going to the maximum two million dollars in 18 months just because of the times. And then this is so when they told me that. ⁓ I kind of lost my marbles a little bit. ⁓ I I left the meeting. I went home. I got drunk because that was the only thing that could separate my feelings at the time. Big mistake getting drunk. Woke up in the morning. Not only did I have to deal with it, but I had a headache. ⁓ what did I do? This is the critical part. I went to the office and I gathered every employee together. 120 people in the lunchroom. Stood in front of them. ⁓ I will tell you for one of the first times I was extremely nervous. I proceeded to tell them what had happened, the bank that I had that I had to do the filing, that ⁓ I'm getting nervous as I say it now, that ⁓ I'm not letting anybody go, that I'm making ⁓ salary adjustments. If you're management, it's 30% and down if you're making under 40, there's no adjustment because you can't take anything away. And the goal will be to get back as soon as possible. I asked everybody if they were okay with it, if anyone was not okay with it. I said, you come up here and you decide who gets fired. Nobody came up. After that, I walked around the plant. I spoke to every single person for 10 minutes one-on-one to make sure they understand. I did not lose one employee. The next thing I did was I then went and I called all my suppliers. My suppliers were freaked out that I called them because they said we never got a call from anyone before getting the letter from the bank. Yeah. I said, listen, I just did an $8 million expansion. I'm not going anywhere. I'll be on COD for a while, but I need you to hear from me the facts. Then I started calling my customers, the big ones, the ones we did a lot of business, because more importantly, they needed to know ⁓ what was up because they're running their own businesses. Yeah. And and at any cost, I could not I could not try to save anything by not informing them and then ⁓ hiccups, right? Yeah. ⁓ when I did that. All of them. All of them were like, No problem, buddy, we appreciate the phone call. We're all business owners. We've been there. One guy I owed thirty grand credit to, he says I'll do two grand a month with you wrong time. Blown away. Completely blown away. I go to
speaker-0: I that transparency and the integrity that you've got there as well.
speaker-1: Well, they see it because no one does that. And I'm shaking like a leaf as I'm doing it. When I was standing in front of the employees, I said to them, I'm so nervous if you I don't want to look down, but I think I wet myself. Right? And then they all kinda ⁓ chuckled. ⁓ this was actually I've got a few touching points in the history, but I went to one of my suppliers, ⁓ who's a big custom no, it's not supplier, big customer, really big. And I went to tell him because we had a mutual customer that we were both working for that put us together. And I told him what happened and what it was up. And he said, You know, what are you gonna do? And I said, Well, I'm out looking for money, ⁓ you know, to keep going. I've got to get an investment. He said, What are you looking for? And I told him, and he wrote a check on the spot at his desk. He had his girl write a check for half of the amount, said, We'll do the paper next week, and he gave it to me. And I walked out of there and I was Speechless. I could not believe that. ⁓ I then had to do all the regular trustee shit with the banks and the the this and that. Did all that. I got out of bankruptcy protection in 51 days in the middle of a recession. ⁓ that was my highlight because at that when you said to me, How do you know you're successful? I didn't think in terms of successful. I thought then in terms of honorable. Because everyone I talked to as a mentor, as someone smarter than me in business were blown away saying that's all because you play it straight. So even with my mouth and doing, I learned it's about being ⁓ straight. Fast forward 2019, when we came to an end, the ending had a double-edged sword on it. So the first thing that happened was 2018 was a little tough. I put all kinds of money back in the business. ⁓ 2019, I had out of 20 million, I had one customer giving us two million dollars. Except the two million dollars was net. They supplied all the media. And on my big press, I'm running like two shifts on a 56 inch press for them. We were one of the largest canvas producers at the time in North America. They were sold to an equity company. I hate you all, unless you're giving me money. ⁓ sold to an equity company that then decided they're going to move the j the the ⁓ production from Montreal to Mexico because they want to squeeze more money out. I won't talk about the issues the company had and the 400 people they let go. ⁓ but you can't replace two million dollars in 12 months. Twelve million two million dollars of print sales regular is probably six million dollars with all you know, buying all the material and doing all of that. ⁓ so ran out ran out of runway. We ⁓ then did a filing, ⁓ People don't remember why you did the first time, even though it was legit and everything. They just remember the second time that you did it the first time. Yeah. ⁓ I a year prior, I bought it, I brought in someone to be president so that I can go back to ⁓ marketing, selling, and doing my thing ⁓ with my minority partner. At the end of the day, when we did the filing, ⁓ the guy I brought in as president basically I believe somehow convinced my minority partner that I was no longer needed. They bid on the equipment at the bank. They won the silent auction, which they were the only bidders. ⁓ I thought the whole time I was working with them to move forward. So I was doing all this work and not going anywhere else or talking to anyone else when they were setting up to bang me out. So they got it. And then I was basically walked to the door of my own business.
speaker-0: My goodness. Yeah, that must have hurt.
speaker-1: ⁓ just a tea weeny bit. Well the funny thing was not only did it hurt, but the guy that I brought in as president had just finished telling me how he worked somewhere for seventeen years, the company was sold, and that president walked him to the door because of the new owners and how he felt. And he obviously didn't learn anything because he did the same thing to me. So yeah, it kinda sucked. My ego was ⁓ was bruised. My email was the only email I ever had was cut off after twenty seven years. ⁓ it took me I had a whole string of bad things that happened after, but it took me and then COVID, blah, blah. So took me a couple of years to roundabout. And ⁓ you know what? Today I'm really good. I'm good in my own skin. I'm good with what I do. I really just really wanna ⁓ help people succeed because I no reason for other people to be in pain if they don't have to. And I do all kinds of stuff. So you just you learn, you go, and ⁓ nothing like a good life coach to get you on track. Right. ⁓ I could tell you I'm five years in I'm five years into her. I speak to her once a month. I'm afraid to let her go.
speaker-0: Yeah, she's doing a good job. She's doing a good job. Yeah. But listen, that's a lot to go through and I appreciate it. Thank you for being so honest as well. ⁓ and you, and you can have the conversation. We can go this way as well. And it actually, as you're speaking, it's bringing back a lot of emotions that I went through. ⁓ again, different, it's tough. It is, but do you know what? It may sound really stupid to say, but I'm actually grateful for the experience that I went through. I don't know if you feel the same. ⁓
speaker-1: It so I'm gonna cut you for a sec. It's not stupid and nothing you do in b nothing you do in business or learn is stupid. Same way your teachers used to say to you, ask questions. There's no no stupid question. ⁓ I was stupid because I was sitting in the back of the class looking out the window, I never asked a question. But what you just said, you know, yeah I'm not happy that it happened. Of course
speaker-0: course not. I I hadn't myself and my wife through the challenges that I did, but I wouldn't be doing what I'm doing just now. And you certainly wouldn't be doing what you're doing just now. And we're helping people. ⁓ I think, do you know what, out of every bad situation, you've got to bring something good. And I think we've both been through an experience there that allows us to go. And we touched on success earlier on, like, And again, this was another conversation we've had in our community recently. Like, how do you define success? I think someone had asked about, ⁓ kind of what are the traits of the successful people in the industry, but success means something completely different to every single individual. ⁓ But what we get to do, and I guess success for me is giving. It's been able to give that knowledge and that experience. And I'm sure you'll agree as well. If I can stop even one person from making one mistake that I made and it helps them get to where they want to be quicker, that's success to me. And I don't know, would you echo that? Is that how you approach things?
speaker-1: Yeah, well y you you know, forget us. I mean, don't forget us because we're important. But in general, ⁓ if you if you if you listen to most people out there that are helping others in whatever capacity it is, what does everybody say? If I make a difference in one person's life, I've done good. Right. And if you've done two persons, ⁓ y listen, I will tell you that ⁓ Consulting wise, I would probably do a lot better if I actually charge more for what I do instead of giving it away. But I can't help it. ⁓ I had a person ⁓ great story. I had a person call me a few years ago and ⁓ when I first started talking to them, they were they wanted to leave their job and look for a new one. So at the time the business person in me said, Hey, I could act as a recruiter now. I'm gonna call five or six companies I know. I'm gonna give offer them This person at half the price of a regular recruiter, right? 'Cause I'm an entrepreneur and a deal maker. And ⁓ in the end, none of them wanted him. but I kept talking to him. And as he's going, other stuff came up. And finally there was something that came up that we discussed and that he took, and and at the end of the day he he sent me a note and he says, like, you know, thanks for your help. You changed my life. Yeah. Goosebumps. Yeah. that's the stuff.
speaker-0: It's ripple effect. It's a ripple effect that these conversations have. And I'm sure we'll both get plenty like that. When you see the impact, not just what it has on the business, but what it has on the people, the people's lives, their personal lives, their wives, their husbands, their kids. You don't just impact that one person. It's the ripple effect that comes with that. And that's why this job is so rewarding. But you need to stop selling yourself short.
speaker-1: Listen, you do it y I do what I do. At the end of the day I sleep okay. Not a great sleeper. ⁓ but I just like to go and and go and do and and and talk and off listen, the other biggest thing I've learnt out there, ⁓ you know, is ⁓ to wear smaller shoes because when I get stuck in my mouth it's easier to get out. But I c but I can look up.
speaker-0: happens.
speaker-1: calls me out on something, I'm learning again. Life is about at the end of the day, ⁓ you know, one point I'm sure I had somewhat of an ego as the business was going up and I'm doing all kinds of stuff. And then you go through that life correction ⁓ and you just see things a little differently. You know, not only do you see things differently, your needs and your wants change as you go. Yeah. Right. ⁓ so it's all good. And today, I mean, as far as the industry goes, I think the industry's great. I I think I could be one of the more passionate print owners out there. ⁓ I think that our industry not only is the best, but no other industry could survive without ours. Yeah. In some form, some way, a direction, ⁓ a direction, an instruction, ⁓ how to manual to put together, not that I ever read those, ⁓ catalog brochure. ⁓ i it so we together and I and I hope I hope that the industry could just, you know, somehow adopt a common path of knowing why we're here, doing what we do.
speaker-0: But that's why these conversations are so important as well. And I think, I think, I think there is a shift happening. There's definitely a shift happening because there's people that you and I and lots of the friends that we have in the industry constantly kind of repeating this and kind of hammering the message home. And I do see change happening. I really do. I hope, hope, I hope we continue to see that. Tell us a little bit. So you've reinvented yourself since COVID, you've come out, you've You're doing consulting as a print whisperer. You've come out of the closet. ⁓ You're doing speaking gigs. You've got your own podcast. You're building that personal brand that we spoke about. You're staying relevant. How difficult was it to start again?
speaker-1: Come out of the closet. ⁓ it's brutal. So yeah, it's brutal. It's ⁓ it it takes a lot of work. And I'll I'll just give you a quick ⁓ a quick thing. So I lost my business. Two months later, my mother passed after a quick illness. Two months after that's okay, thank you. ⁓ two months after that, my ⁓ ex-mother-in-law, she passed. She ⁓ old age. Then I'm thinking, ⁓ shit, what's Warren gonna no? Then I was gonna take the summer off and go fish for six months because it's been 27 years of working. And I go around the corner going to pick up the boat and someone stole my boat and trailer. So that that was probably worse than losing my business. Then I'm thinking, what's Warren gonna do 2.0? I start planning something, and then COVID rolls in and I get wiped out because no one's going anywhere. Then we go into lockdown. And my eight year relationship, she decides she's done, she leaves. So I had 18 months every two months of a world heavy or a life heavy falling on you. ⁓ that's when my ⁓ first wife, only wife, ex wife, I hate ex though, because she's great, ⁓ recommended the life coach. And it took me ⁓ six months before I was good to even talk to myself in my head again. Mm-hmm. Because I went into like total ⁓ lockdown. And it took a couple of years to ⁓ get a little bit of comfort. Right. And then once I did that, you know, I never had a problem talking to people, but ⁓ it's how you carry yourself and how you walk. So I got into a really good place. I learned that I'm responsible for my own doing and my own being. That's it. And ⁓ to this day it's still the work in motion. It it's really ⁓ you know, you try not to get jammed up in ⁓ certain things, which I still do, but then I've learned to dial them back. Yeah. Life is complicated.
speaker-0: I've seen you calm down quite a lot over the last couple of years for sure. You're a lot more mellow and chill than I thought you were going to be when we first met certainly. But ⁓ listen, resonate. Again, our paths are very, very similar. ⁓ And again, probably around similar times on the calendar, I was going through very much the same. And I think I've spoken about this in the podcast before, certainly just before COVID, I kind of went through. know what you were saying there. You don't just get one thing, you get two things, you get three things. I literally could not leave the house. ⁓ couldn't walk the dog, couldn't go to the supermarket. ⁓ Yeah, it wasn't good. Probably for about three or four months anyway, I couldn't leave the house without having a complete meltdown. I was very lucky I managed to get some therapy. ⁓ So not a life coach, I got a therapist for the best part of seven or eight months. ⁓ my goodness, what a relief that was to get some things off your chest and uncover things that I didn't know were a problem.
speaker-1: Well, so everybody ⁓ first of all, there's nothing wrong with having a therapist, kind of like having a print specialist, you know, or print coach. but I'm gonna recommend to everyone that you should go speak get a therapist. A therapist and a therapist doesn't mean a psychiatrist. Psychiatry makes you think crazy. You need a psychologist, you need someone to talk to that understands because then you have your cone of silence. ⁓ kind of like Maxwell Smart, if anyone used to watch Max Smart. and You get I got to a point where I could say anything because if you don't tell the truth, you're just faking yourself and you're never gonna solve your problem. Yeah.
speaker-0: Yeah. And I'll tell you, I uncovered things that were issues for me that I actually had no idea were issues for me, like, without sending cliche and obviously the younger experiences in life and things as well. But, but again, I swear by, we, we spoke about this quite openly. One of the Sheet4Brain sessions over at Dscoop in Denver earlier this year. that whole conversation around having a coach or a therapist, a sounding board, whatever it is to you, can be something different to everyone but...
speaker-1: Friends are not your friend sorry, your friends are not a coach or a therapist. And you don't want to be talking about everything to your friends because they don't know how to re they'll they'll respond to you in a loving, caring way, but it might not be the right response. Yeah.
speaker-0: Yeah. And you know, you and I both know from the consultancy and the coaching side as well, you need someone who's going to push your boundaries, who's going to, who's going to challenge you when you need challenged and say the things that you don't want to hear sometimes and friends don't do that. so yeah, no, I'm a huge advocate for it. And again, from a coaching perspective, I've got, I've got three coaches that I work with now for different areas of my life or my business. and honestly, like you said, can you can't live without them as well. So. Let's come to, we've obviously got to know each other a lot better through the All Stars. We are both printing United Expo All Stars. We kicked that off last year. What was the experience like for you last year? Kind of like, I had a blast.
speaker-1: Well, there's my shirt. It's been up there. It's been up there since I took it off. ⁓ you know it was nice. It was nice to be on a team. It was nice to know that there's a group, an organization that's trying to push it, right? ⁓ some of the organizations in our industry, you know, people have good things to say, bad things to say. If you take the politics and the bullshit out of it, ⁓ the hardcore are good people trying to promote a great industry. And trying to spread the the love of print in any form. And ⁓ honestly, it was great. ⁓ aside from making 14 new friends that all love print, ⁓ you know, it it's just it's pr it's a movement. Yeah. Right? It's a good movement. So when you're with the group and you're moving and the excitement's there, kind of like in your company and culture, when the whole team's on board and you have good wins together. You continue this you know, the successes continue. The the stories go.
speaker-0: Yeah, it's pretty special. It's really special. And I love the time that we all, we all spent out there together. Lots of nice memories and we're going to make some more in just a few weeks now. of the time of recording this, we're about what's seven weeks out? Yeah, something like that. Six, seven weeks. ⁓
speaker-1: No fair like that. September September twenty second and ⁓ you can use ⁓ Warren twenty six as a code if you want. No no wanna write if you don't want to write Colin's name down.
speaker-0: You've got to write my codes, you've got to write my codes. But listen, you're speaking this year as well, What are you speaking about?
speaker-1: Yes. Can't tell you. No, I'm ⁓ I'm basically so at the end of the day, I am only about the printer. Right? ⁓ the OEMs don't have to like me. ⁓ like I love the people, but those are corporations that run different ways. I'm about the printer. ⁓ and I am a printer. And I want the OEMs actually to have more empathy for the people that go and put their houses on the line when they make big decisions and investments. But I'm gonna talk about what I really think print owners need to do to run their businesses. ⁓ I don't even know if I'm gonna have any slides because it's a it's a basically it's a business conversation and ⁓ it is what it is. So I wanna I w I'm gonna wanna hear from people what they're doing. I'm gonna he wanna hear what they're not doing, but I'm not going deep into technical shit or programs and apps and all that. I'm going to fundamentals. Yeah right. so one thing I wanna just say because p I I can't say it enough. We talk in this industry about young people, we talk about not having ⁓ finding enough young people, people coming in. And I say to all the owners, like, A, start listening to young people. If you have younger kids, you should be sitting around with them and their friends to hear what they talk about, how they think, how they feel. ⁓ that's number one. But as far as the Printing United is coming, if you're an owner, bring somebody young from your business. Yes, I'm talking to you. Why should you bring them to you to printing united? If you can afford to bring more than one, bring more than one. ⁓ if you tell me that you can't afford one, I'm gonna tell you you're full of shit because you make more mistakes every day. You just probably don't even know where the money goes because you're not running your business that well. ⁓ but if you bring the young person, this is what's happening. They feel recognized. They feel that you're investing in them, which is big because you're spending money. ⁓ they're noticed. Then you're gonna go to the show, and this is where the bigger benefit happens. You, the owner, go to the show, come back, and don't talk to it. person in your whole company about anything. You probably don't even remember what happened at the show because you really weren't listening because you weren't there for the right reasons. The person that you bring is going to go back and tell everybody everything cool that they saw and going to be jumping around as going to get the fire going in some people. Right. The other thing with the ⁓ young people where you should be engaging with them is in your own companies. If your culture's not great, if it is great, ask the young people to manage your social media. Ask them to do your TikToks. Ask them to do your Instagrams. Pay them extra. So what? Guess what? What they're gonna do, you don't have to like their marketing to the people you wanna reach. There is things that are so rudimentary that could be done that we do that people just don't do, and that's the shit that drives me nuts.
speaker-0: No. ⁓ Now, I cannot believe we've been speaking for 45 minutes now. You've not done a shameless plug for your story yet, so I'm going to give you the chance. So two things, obviously you've written a book, which is brilliant. imagine that. It's called Printings Alive. People working together.
speaker-1: I just happen to have it here. First of all, it's a great cover. You see the pink. You don't need a press that has pink as a fifth color. This is done in CMYK. Okay. I had presses with extra three colors and six colors and ten colors and whatever. CMYK sometimes. Pink will be good if you do a lot of flesh tones, and then you Mark Jeeves color logic, but that's enough of his plug. ⁓ the book Printings Alive is available on Amazon. Printing Alive is like the movie, is like the podcast. I I I'm just trying to have everyone thinking the same thing. Yeah. ⁓ the other thing that I that started off just as for fun, but want to try to turn into a real business is I've got a a t-shirt line. It's called printwhisper.shop. It has actually right now it's got print fishing and a few other pickleball AI slogan stuff. I'm about to redo the shop. Printwisper.shop will be strictly for the print industry for us, and I will have 70 different ⁓ variations ⁓ I've had so many people call them, call me. I've had people buy them. great gifts for your employees to show that you care. Don't go knock me off because I'll find you and kill you. they make great gifts for the employees. ⁓ if you're doing embellishment, I have touch me, I'm embellished, you're embellished, whatever. Give them to your customers if you're selling embellishment. I'll even call me, I'll put your name on it if you want, somewhere small, because nobody wants to wear your big brands anywhere. ⁓ and I just wanted stuff. So the real the real thing behind the t-shirts, ⁓ all of them is conversation starters. I'm not going with crazy designs. I have one t-shirt in my mental health section that says my anxiety has anxiety. I've had people buy the shirt and call me and say, Do you know how many people stop me to talk about it? I wear it on a plane, I sit in the aisle like this so that they could read it when they walk down. And then I have ⁓ I won't take them up, but have little cards I give out for discounts to come to the store.
speaker-0: I've seen this happen people, it's real, it's a true story. And I'm sure there's going to be a few, I'm guessing you're going to have plenty with you at Printing United this year as well.
speaker-1: Last sh last show I was changing my t shirt every ninety minutes. In my knapsack, I was walking around. But I'll have T shirts maybe to give out, but I'll have ⁓ some nicer stuff. But and it's
speaker-0: Just make you've got one in Excel for me, buddy. We need to come up with a ⁓ consultant coach kind of style as well. I'll leave that with you to get some inspiration. listen, I know this part is going to be really difficult, but I'm going to try because we do it with every guest. I'm going to do a quick fire round, but this ⁓ is a challenging part is getting Warren to give one word answers. I'll work. I'll try. I'm going to be strict on this one. I'll cut you off.
speaker-1: Absolutely.
speaker-0: Ha ha.
speaker-1: You gotta be fast though, 'cause I could talk
speaker-0: I'm going to be fast, don't you worry. Okay, question one. Biggest mistake.
speaker-1: Ooh, biggest mistake. Not listening to some of my advisors.
speaker-0: Okay. Biggest win.
speaker-1: Biggest win? Getting out of bankruptcy in fifty one days, having eighty five percent of the industry support my decision.
speaker-0: Amazing, my favourite customer over the years.
speaker-1: ⁓ my god. My favorite customer. ⁓ my God, who's my favorite customer? my favorite customer was actually my biggest customer because ⁓ who unfortunately Michael Chainbert passed away. ⁓ he was actually I had some history with him, but I helped him build his company in the sense of what he was printing and how it was done. And then he ended up, you know, selling his company and doing great. So that was the most fun and ⁓ the most fulfilling.
speaker-0: Good. Worst print job you've ever produced.
speaker-1: I don't okay, I don't know about worst in terms of worst, but ⁓ biggest fuck up and costing mistake. We did an eighty thousand dollar book, maybe there was five hundred books, and the cover had a whole bunch of dots. And ⁓ when the book was done and it was put on my desk, I was so excited, it looked amazing. Except on the cover, one of the dots only had half a dot because there was a problem with the plate that nobody noticed. Okay. And ⁓ there was no rerun, redo. Well. Double laminated cover with UV switch. ⁓ yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
speaker-0: It's always a big one. Favorite trade show memory?
speaker-1: So favorite trade show memory, ⁓ Eric Vessels, if you're listening, ⁓ you will remember this. ⁓ we were in Prague, we were out all night, we rolled in, it was around I think five o'clock in the morning, and ⁓ Eric was behind the bar pouring beer from the ⁓ from the draft machine that I guess they didn't close. And then we were going to our rooms, ⁓ we found some guy sleeping in the hallway outside his room.
speaker-0: Behold, beaten death.
speaker-1: I have about twenty of those stories, but yeah.
speaker-0: We'll see what happens in Vegas this year. ⁓ Best mentor you've had over the years.
speaker-1: So I'm gonna tell you ⁓ again, I've just got a goose. I'm gonna tell you a crazy story. Craziest story ever. I get a call, and maybe take a couple minutes. I get a call from a gentleman, ⁓ his name it's the late Aaron Fish. Funny that his last name is Fish. ⁓ very successful individual. Anyway, he called me up because ⁓ he was doing a book. This was ⁓ this was a gentleman who developed ⁓ who wrote ⁓ a lock company way back in the sixties. So Security locks, working with the CIA, the FBI, the RCMP, all that other stuff. Big, big, big. And he called me because he was doing a book for the mus the lock museum that he was created, and he came referred to me through another client. I did a large book. I go into his office, we sit down, and we start talking, and he asks me about the business, and I tell him everything asks. Then I have to quote the book. And he called and he calls me and he says, ⁓ I just want to let you know that your book, your price is fifteen thousand dollars more than the best price I have from China. And I'm like, okay. Anyways, I end up getting the job. Why do I get the job? Because his wife said to him, Aaron, you made your money in North America. You're gonna spend your money in North America. Right? So I got the job. ⁓ it came out great. I told him everything that we did. Then he then he drops on me at some point that he owns a large format company. Mm-hmm. And I'm like, What do mean? And he said, Well, they were a tenant in the building. I bought the company. I didn't want the people to be out of work. I thought my son would want it. In the end, the son didn't want it, so it's for sale. I said, I'm happy to go look at it. I go look at it. I come back, I make him an offer. He says to me, No, your offer's too low. I have others. I'm going away for a month. I said, Okay, great. Can I have last right of refusal? He says, I'll call you. He calls me ⁓ the day he gets back. And I know when he's getting back because it's in my mind. And he calls me and he says, Come to my office. And I go to his office and I'm sitting at the table and I sit down and he's got tea and a little plate full of cookies. The gentleman was in his eighties, old school. And we sit down and he slides me a yellow legal pad. And I'm like, ⁓ okay. He says, ⁓ I'm gonna tell you how the deal is gonna go down. And I have no idea what's going on right now. And I'm just I'm just okay, tell me how the deal is gonna go. He says, I'm gonna loan you five hundred thousand dollars. You're gonna buy the company for two hundred thousand dollars for the the assets. Yeah. You're gonna use a hundred thousand dollars to pay down some of your debt, and you're gonna use the other two hundred for the move and getting set up because if you just buy me, you're gonna be out of business, you won't have any money. And I'm sitting there like this. I I didn't know if I heard what he said. Who's loaning me money? So I said, What did you just say? And he repeats it. And I I'm I I can't talk. Like I I'm really I'm blown away. And I said to him, I said, Can I ask you a question? And I said, Why me? And he said, Why me? Why you? He said, Couple reasons. He says, number one, when I ⁓ was talking to you about business, you didn't hesitate for one second, the good, the bad, the ugly, and you just kept flowing. So I know that you were being straight up. Mm-hmm. He said, and the second reason is everybody needs help at some point. He goes, In my business, when I started, I needed help. Gentleman came in, he put a hundred grand in, and when we sold, he got a hundred million. And this guy does a lot of help, you know, he gives a lot of charity. ⁓ like when he gives money to the hospital, he says, Not only am I gonna give the money, but I'm only giving it if I negotiate the equipment purchases. Yeah. Right? Anyway, so we do the deal. I get in the I leave his office, I get in the car, and I I I call my CFO and I can't talk. I'm in tears. I most humble moment ever. ⁓ I go home, I'm blown away. Next morning I wake up at like four o'clock because I'm pumped, and I send him a thank you note at four thirty in the morning. I get a reply 10 minutes later that says, it's enough already. Let's make this happen. 4 30 in the morning, I'm blown away. Then we talk more. At some point, my machine came up. I had a balloon payment, $2 million with GE. I call him up and I'm talking, I say, hey, Mr. Fish, I have to do this renegotiation. I don't know what to do exactly. This, that. He looks at it. He says, ⁓ he goes, and he doesn't swear, but he was like, fuck them. GE's awful. ⁓ he says, ⁓ I'm gonna loan you the two million dollars. This is the interest, this is what we'll do, twenty-four months, boom, boom, boom. And I paid him off. I did everything and it was like, ⁓ my God. Wow. And for any other business stuff, he would tell me, but I never asked anybody for anything. When he offered that and he offered to sell the company. So I think that doesn't hurt in me wanting to help more and do more and have a little more empathy for other people.
speaker-0: 100%. Yeah, nice story, mate. Thanks for sharing. It wasn't one word, but I think I'm going to let you off of that because it was a really valuable story. Yeah, definitely. Right, we've come to that point in the show.
speaker-1: Art it's art.
speaker-0: I ask everyone the same question. I ask you to share something about yourself that most people don't know about you. Which is going to be tough because again you're an open book.
speaker-1: I I was just gonna say I I ⁓ everybody knows my good, everyone knows my bad, everyone knows the ugly. ⁓ what don't people know about me? Ooh. That's a good one. I don't think there's much. I party hard. I go out. I love my kids. I I'm a well, if you don't know, I became a grandfather four months ago. That would be new. that was cool.
speaker-0: did know that, but congratulations again.
speaker-1: Thank you. Yeah, no, that was cool. No, I think everyone knows I'm I I'm I'm pretty by the book. I I say what I say, I speak what I speak. ⁓ apologize if I make a mistake. I'm not perfect. But ⁓ I don't really have any secrets. I mean I know
speaker-0: business well
speaker-1: ⁓ the fishing is ⁓ I I basically work to go fishing. Travel for fishing's expensive. So ⁓ so okay, so I could tell you one thing, right? 'Cause family doesn't know it. But I've been on a couple when when when we were all together, I would spend more money on a fishing trip myself than I would on a trip for family of four.
speaker-0: Yeah, let's the family outlist into this podcast then.
speaker-1: Now they're all good, they've been taken care of, but still that's that's when the little white lies come into play. It's like, How much was the trip? ⁓ it was four thousand dollars. You know, the airfare was eleven. But it's all good.
speaker-0: Excellent mate. Listen, it's been a pleasure. I'm sorry it's taken us so long to finally officially do this, but we're here now. I've got a feeling it's not going to be the last time we've got you on as well. So, and listen, I really look forward to seeing you ⁓ in several weeks out in Vegas. I know we're going to have a ball. I know we're going to be extremely busy as well, but it's going to be a whole lot of fun.
speaker-1: I I accept your apology. Hopefully you're gonna leave some room for other people to use the podcast room, you know?
speaker-0: I'll maybe free up couple of spots mate, don't you worry.
speaker-1: I'll give I'll give you a couple of bucks for ⁓ priority time. Play the game. Right.
speaker-0: I'm under But no, listen, look forward to seeing you, man. Lastly, before we finish up, if anyone wants to check you out, find out more about you, what's the best way to do so.
speaker-1: You could type in Warren Werbitt and then everything comes up in ⁓ up on Google, including my arrest warrants. No, I don't have any of those. ⁓ paid paid those off. No, ⁓ Warren Werbitt or the Print Whisper. ⁓ by the way, you know how it became the print whisper? I looked up the domain 'cause I was watching the fish whisper and for twenty four bucks the print whisper was available. That just tells you that the bots don't even like our industry because every other whisper was taken. But yeah, you just look up the print whisperer or Warren Werbit or anything print and ⁓ I'm happy to talk to anybody.
speaker-0: Well, I highly recommend you get in touch. This guy's got a lot of knowledge to share. So long as all my clients don't start calling you now because you have to price me. You need to put your prices up as well buddy.
speaker-1: It's only on the first five minutes.
speaker-0: Listen, take care for now, enjoy your weekend and I'll see you very, soon.
speaker-1: Yeah, pleasure. Thanks for having me. And ⁓ you know, everybody keep listening to Colin, 'cause ⁓ really he's the man. Only if you're on the other side of the pond.
speaker-0: Take care my friend, see you soon.