168: Mark Sisson - How To Become A Fat Burning Beast

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Have never softened the stance on sugar, still think sugar
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is pretty damn evil. Now, does that mean I never
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have sugar? No, I have a teaspoon in my coffee
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in the morning. I like my coffee to taste great,
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but I don't drink sodas that have the equivalent of
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20 teaspoons. I don't drink the kinds of wine that
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have the equivalent of 10 or 12 teaspoons of sugar.
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Are leaders born or are they made? Our host, Ryan Hawke,
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believes that leaders can be made through determined, focused work
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on learning the art and science behind the makeup of
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other successful leaders. Now it's time to inhale knowledge and
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exhale success. You're listening to The Learning Leader Show with
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Ryan Hawke.
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Hey, and welcome to the Learning Leader Show. I am
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Ryan Hawk. Thank you so much for being here. This
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is such an important episode dealing with our health and wellness.
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My featured leader is Mark Sisson. Mark started Mark's Daily
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Apple in 2006 to fulfill his personal mission, which is
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to empower people to take full responsibility of their own
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health and and enjoyment of life by investigating, discussing, and
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critically rethinking everything we've assumed to be true about health
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and wellness. You know, I think the greatest leaders in
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the world develop a deep understanding of what it takes
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to be physically fit, active, and healthy for the people
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that they lead. A few of the topics that Mark
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and I discussed. How to become a fat-burning beast, specifically,
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he details it. Then the 10 primal blueprint laws followed
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up by how busy leaders can implement the primal blueprint
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to better their lives. Ladies and gentlemen, this one is
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so important with Mark Sisson. Mark Sisson, man, this is
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a really important conversation that I think is going to
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help a lot of people, both for the individuals listening
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who already know about you and certainly for the ones
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who do not. So I have a question to get
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us going, man, and then we'll get rocking and rolling.
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And that question is around the fact that you've spent
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a great deal of time in your life studying, I
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guess for lack of a better word, how to live
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a healthy and meaningful life. And you spend time around
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others who do the same. You're a researcher. You're a
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curious guy. And you do quite well for yourself. And
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you look great, by the way, physically too. I'm curious
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from your perspective, what are some of the most common
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themes or characteristics in people who you found to be
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the healthiest in the world?
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Well, you know, there are a lot of variables that
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we could look at. probably the single greatest predictor of, well,
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it's a short list. One of the single greatest predictors
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is how you deal with stress. So worldwide, if you
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look at different populations and you look at their lifestyles
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and you look at their diets, and some of them
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have a lot of meat, some of them have no meat,
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some of them are smoking cigarettes every day or cigars
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or stogies that they rolled in the woods. You know,
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some are drinking alcohol, some are not. But the single,
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probably the greatest individual predictor of longevity and health is
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how they deal with stress. You know, literally whether they
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can let the bad stuff roll off them and move on.
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So that's kind of like my own personal pursuit because
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I don't do well with stress, right? I've sort of
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spent much of my life figuring out how I can
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get outside my head and live in the moment and
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not be caught up in what might happen, what bad
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things might happen or regretting the past. So I don't
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want to get too far down that path as the
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first talking point of the show, but that's probably one
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of them. Then if we get into more of the
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hard science that would look at muscle mass. So one
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of the greatest predictors of health and longevity is muscle mass.
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As people get older, they tend to lose strength and
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muscle mass. And when you lose that mass, when you
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lose that living tissue that sort of dictates what all
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the organs in the body need to do to keep
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up with it. In other words, I make a decision
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to go work out. I make a decision to lift
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something heavy. That manifests itself in a stronger muscle. That
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muscle then pulls on the bone and causes the bone
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to get more dense. So I'm not only increasing muscle mass,
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I'm increasing bone density. That decision to activate that muscle
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requires a little bit of a higher heart rate. So
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now my heart is called into play. And my heart
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is being asked to keep up with the demands of
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the body. And maybe the lungs are, it's required that
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you inhale a little bit deeper. So now you've got
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lung volume, you've got heart stroke volume, you've got muscle mass,
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you've got bone density, you might have some liver involved.
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And it's really, it all comes down to how much
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muscle mass you have that dictates your health and strength
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into your 60s, 70s, 80s, and 90s. So there's you know,
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two elements. I mean, one obvious one is don't smoke.
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That's probably, you know, the one that the rest of
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the world thinks or, you know, understands that, um, one
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of the greatest risks for death comes from smoking. So,
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you know, just, just don't smoke. Um, I'll leave it
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at that for now and let you, let you ask
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the fall, whatever follow up question you might want to
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interject here.
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Yeah, there's, there's a lot there. And, and so I, I,
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It came upon your work a few years ago, your blog,
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Mark's Daily Apple, and really I want to talk about
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from the– it's not a diet. It's a lifestyle. It's
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your primal blueprint and the way that you approach life
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from a– well, one, just the way you simply live it,
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which I assume helps to negate some of that stress,
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as well as then what the foods that you decide
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to put in your body because– while some might say
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it's somewhat paleo, you have a different approach than what
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I think. I speak with a lot of people who
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I think are quite intelligent, not necessarily about nutrition, but
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about just business or leadership in general, and they have
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absolutely no clue about what to eat. I'm sure you
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find a lot of these types of people that are
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quite intelligent, but they don't spend any time learning about
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what they should put in their body. And I think
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as a leader, and this is called the Learning Leader Show,
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so you know, nutrition is not, I don't typically speak
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with people like you, Mark, but it's so critical to
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be mentally prepared to lead groups of people to be
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physically able to do it. And some of the greatest
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leaders I've ever seen, they spend a great deal of
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time understanding what they're putting into their body, the type
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of workouts that they do. And so I wanted to
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really focus on that for this conversation so that maybe
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people that are listening are traveling all the time and
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they say, it's so hard to eat healthy when I travel.
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It's so hard to get in the necessary workouts when
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I travel. Or they just have a lot going on
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and this gets put on the back burner even though
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it should never do that. So when somebody, Mark, that
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has never met you before comes up to you and
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asks you and they say, hey, Mark, it's nice to
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meet you. What do you do? How do you respond?
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Well, I mean, I'm not sure I understand the question.
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If we're going off the intro to that question, which
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is how do you eat? How do you orchestrate a
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healthy lifestyle as a business leader? I can tell you that,
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first of all, yeah, you have to understand that business
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performance is no different from sports performance. You need to
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be at your peak to lead, to be able to
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make decisions on the fly. You know, Gary Vee sort
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of famously suggests that CEOs, all they do is wade
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through the crap. You know, all they do is handle
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the negative stuff because the positive stuff just keeps going
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forward without requiring any kind of intervention or decision. So
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you need to be on your game. And if you
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get sick a lot, let's just say you get colds
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and flu because you can't handle the stress and your
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diet sucks and you've compromised your immune system, you know,
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you're in You're off your game. You're in your head.
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You can't identify what the situation is that needs to
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be handled immediately. And that's just colds and flu. What
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about being run down? What about jet lag? The number
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of business leaders that I see who even a three-hour
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time zone change from New York to the West Coast
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can leave them fried for three days because they don't
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know how to handle jet lag. let alone a trip
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to Europe or a trip to China. There are a
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number of people who I find, even when they're on
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their game, need to take a nap. They take a, quote,
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power nap at two or three o'clock in the afternoon
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because they haven't handled their diet appropriately. They don't know
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how to extract the greatest amount of energy from the
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food that they're eating or to burn body fat, which
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is like this gift that we're all born with. You know,
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we are all programmed at birth to be really good
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at burning fat, but we screw it up because we
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start eating these sugar laden diets that kind of shift
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all of our gene expression away from fat burning and
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toward a sugar dependent metabolism. So, you know, there. are
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strategies that I teach in the Primal Blueprint and on
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Mark's Daily Apple that are designed to, number one, get
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you away from a sugar based lifestyle and into a
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fat burning lifestyle. We call it a fat burning beast.
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And and to the extent that you cut the simple
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sugars and the sweetened beverages and and a lot of
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the refined carbohydrate and some of the processed and even
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the whole grains, and reorient your diet toward meat, fish, fowl, eggs, nuts, seeds, vegetables,
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a little bit of fruit, basically the food that we
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evolved to eat over millions of years, you find that
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you become better at burning fat. You're less reliant on sugar. Now,
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how that plays out in your life is that when
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you decrease the amount of sugar that you're required to eat,
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that your body requires, you also enhance your immune system
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because sugar is a huge immune suppressor. Sugar bombs throughout
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the day, whether it's waffles and juice or cereal and
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toast for breakfast and then a sandwich and some chips
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for lunch or a bagel at a snack time or
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spaghetti and pasta and whatever else it is for dinner.
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These things are big carbohydrate insults to the body that
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can raise insulin. And so you get these wild insulin
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swings throughout the day if you're dependent on sugar. which
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can lead to productivity swings, to mood swings. They can
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increase the amount of inflammation. So you literally are more
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sore than you would have been had you dialed your
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diet in. So that's just, and that's by the way, Ryan,
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that's just the diet aspect of it. I suggest, you know,
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to people who are, even if you're in business, I mean,
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figure out a way that you can get Some of
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your conference calls while you're walking on a treadmill or
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walking outside. I mean, I got a billionaire friend of
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mine who does a lot of his conference calls on hikes.
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You know, he has a headset.
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He hikes.
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He gets the work done. Nobody knows what he's doing,
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but he's getting the work done while he's actively being
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involved in business meetings. Get some sun exposure. So many
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business people stay out of the sun because their doctor
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told them to or stay out of the sun just
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because they're desk bound or office bound all day long.
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And yet the lack of sunlight means lack of vitamin
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D for a lot of these people. Vitamin D is
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one of the most important vitamins that actually should be
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more classified as a hormone, but it's involved in the
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immune system. So a lot of people get sick because
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they're low in vitamin D and they wonder, well, maybe
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I should be increasing my vitamin C or I should
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be doing something else to improve my immunity. But in fact,
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it's probably lack of sunlight that's probably the the key
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driver of that. A lot of business people I know
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have that kind of common mantra, which is I'll sleep
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when I'm dead, right? I mean, people brag about getting
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four or five hours of sleep a night and being effective. Well,
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I guarantee you after a certain number of days of
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doing that, you are not effective on four or five
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hours of sleep a night. Sleep is grossly overlooked by
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so many business people. So there are so many ways
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we could take this, Ryan. There are so many So
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many different aspects to peak performance that apply to business
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people who are trying to carve out, make a name
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for themselves in this world or to change the world
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with their new app or their new widget or their
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new technology. But you've got to look out for number
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one first. You can't be an effective leader if you're
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sick or if you're not at your peak.
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How do you become a fat-burning beast?
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Well, so here's the deal. So as I explained a
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little bit earlier, we're born with this genetic recipe that
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wants us to be good at burning fat. It knows
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how to do it because the coding is in the
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genes from millions of years of humans having to fight
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for every morsel of food they ever put in their
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mouths and going some days without eating at all, sometimes weeks,
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and yet being able to maintain muscle mass, maintain energy,
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maintain cognition in the face of this lack of food.
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The body developed these methods of taking fat out of
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storage and burning the fat for fuel and then using
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one of the byproducts of that fat metabolism, we call
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those ketone bodies, as an alternative to glucose. And so
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we have this information deeply coded within us. And all
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we have to do is turn those genes on that
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are ready to to take fat out of storage and
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burn it. We all have this recipe. We all possess it.
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But so many of us spent most of our lives
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with ready access to carbohydrates. And carbohydrates, when you consume them,
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convert to glucose in the body. Yes, the body burns
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glucose quite readily, but it burns it mostly because it's
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toxic in large quantities. So the body wants to burn
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glucose to get rid of it. It also wants to
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try and store it in the muscle cells and more
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insidiously to store it in the fat cells. So to
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the extent that we can cut back on the amount
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of glucose we take in, to the extent that we
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can cut back on the sugars, the sweetened beverages, the desserts,
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the candies, a lot of the things that convert to
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glucose like the pastas, the breads, the cereals, the crackers,
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and eliminate those or cut way back on those and
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just focus on healthy protein, healthy fats, some fruits and vegetables,
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we start to to give the signals to our body that, hey,
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there's not going to be that much glucose available in
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the next couple of days. Let's start burning fat. Let's
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build the metabolic machinery to be better at burning fat
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because maybe we won't be getting that much carbohydrate. So
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over a period of weeks, it doesn't take long, the
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body starts to upregulate all these enzyme systems that are
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involved in taking fat out of storage and burning it
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as fuel. The body starts to build more mitochondria, which
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are these little energy factories in the muscle cells in
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particular where the fat metabolism occurs. So when the body
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gets a signal that there's not going to be much
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glucose and we're going to have to start relying on fat,
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it starts to build more of these furnaces. It's called
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mitochondrial biogenesis. And this is a great thing. It means
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that not only are you burning fat when you're working
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out or when you're under stress, but even when you're
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just sitting around doing nothing, you're mostly burning fat. And
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over time, that you know, we have a pretty much
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unlimited amount of fat on us. I'm 172 pounds. I'm,
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you know, 9% body fat. I still got 40,000 calories
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of fat on me. So I've got a lot of
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fuel that I could be carrying around that I could
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be burning off. And the practical applications of this would be,
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you know, you've got a meeting, it starts at 1030
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in the morning and all of a sudden it gets
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heated and it doesn't, and it keeps going and doesn't
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break for lunch and goes till three o'clock in the
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afternoon and That's no big deal if you're a fat
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burner because your body can take that– get all the
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energy you need. There's no drop in blood sugar because
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your body knows how to take fat out of storage.
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It knows how to skip meals easily without any disruption
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of cognition or energy levels or anything like that. So
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that's the kind of practical application. Or you're on a
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cross-country flight and they don't serve food.
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No big deal.
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In the old days– I had to eat every couple
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of hours because I was caught up in that non-fat-burning
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carbohydrate paradigm. If there was four or five hours where
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I wasn't going to get a meal, I would get hangry,
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as they say now. I would get ready to rip
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someone's head off. Once I developed the skill to become
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the fat-burning beast that I am today, I could skip
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meals all the time with no adverse effect whatsoever. In fact,
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I'll wake up in the morning. I have a cup
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of coffee. We're talking now. I just got back from
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the gym. I did a heavy workout at the gym.
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I haven't eaten yet today. I've got a 1 o'clock lunch.
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That's the first time I'll eat today. So I eat
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in what we call a compressed eating window between 1 p.m.
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and 7 p.m., and then I don't eat outside that window,
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partly because I know it's good for me, partly because
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I'm not hungry. I don't wake up hungry. I say
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to people, look, if you're not hungry, then why eat?
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Just because it's noon— It doesn't mean you have to
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have lunch if you're not hungry. So we teach this
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skill of how to be really good at burning fat,
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accessing your stored body fat. And over time, what happens
327
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is you burn off that stored body fat and you
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trend toward your ideal body composition without having to go
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to the gym and sweat for miles and miles and
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miles on the treadmill or the elliptical or the bike.
331
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Interesting advice. I'm going to use the word they say
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and that type of thing. I think you can understand
333
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what I mean by they. Maybe just things I've heard.
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I think I'm relatively healthy. Played college football a little
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bit after college. Do some triathlon stuff now. Work out
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pretty much every day or most days. Maybe I'm overdoing
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00:19:16.599 --> 00:19:19.349
it actually now that I think about it. A lot
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00:19:19.369 --> 00:19:21.369
of people say you've got to eat breakfast because it
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kickstarts your metabolism. When you hear that, what do you think?
340
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You know, I just think old technology, I think 30-year-old
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mantra that works if you are a sugar burner. So
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here's the deal. If you've been dependent on carbohydrates your
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whole life and you haven't learned how to burn fat,
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then a couple of different physiological reactions happen when you
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don't eat. The brain expects glucose. and you haven't provided
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it because you haven't eaten. And because you haven't become
347
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good at burning fat and you haven't become fat adapted
348
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or keto adapted, the brain doesn't know how to use ketones.
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00:20:00.630 --> 00:20:04.809
So you don't eat for, you skip a meal and
350
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your brain literally starts a process that sends signals to
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the adrenal glands, the stress glands, to go, okay, no glucose,
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a big problem. We got to start doing something about it.
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I know, let's give a pulse of cortisol. And that
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cortisol will then start to figure out ways to create
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glucose for the brain. And one of the ways it
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does that is it literally strips muscle tissue of some
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amino acids that it then sends to the liver to
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be converted into glucose. So the brain can, can function
359
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more clearly. So when you skip a meal, like, you know,
360
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if you're a sugar burner and you wake up and,
361
00:20:46.170 --> 00:20:48.470
and invariably, if you're a sugar burner, you wake up,
362
00:20:48.470 --> 00:20:51.250
you're probably hungry. So, so if you don't eat breakfast,
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00:20:51.269 --> 00:20:54.809
that whole stress process begins and yes, you'll tear down
364
00:20:54.849 --> 00:20:57.690
muscle tissue. You'll start your day off rather poorly and
365
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it'll be a, You know, it'll be a shit show
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from there on. Now, if you're a fat burner and
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00:21:02.980 --> 00:21:05.759
you've learned how to access stored body fat, you wake up,
368
00:21:05.799 --> 00:21:08.240
you're already burning fat in the morning. You don't really
369
00:21:08.259 --> 00:21:11.299
I wake up. I'm never hungry for breakfast. I'm not
370
00:21:11.339 --> 00:21:14.299
even hungry after a hard workout. Sometimes I basically work
371
00:21:14.359 --> 00:21:16.700
out fast and come back and I'm still not hungry.
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00:21:16.720 --> 00:21:18.579
It takes about two hours for the hunger to kick
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00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:22.339
in because I'm so good at burning fat that and
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I'm so good at accessing that fat for energy that
375
00:21:25.740 --> 00:21:29.170
I don't need it. And therefore, my brain doesn't get
376
00:21:29.730 --> 00:21:34.779
kind of frantic and start initiating this stress response to
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00:21:35.099 --> 00:21:39.660
create the adrenals to send out cortisol to strip the
378
00:21:39.680 --> 00:21:42.220
muscle tissue. So all those things that happened when I
379
00:21:42.259 --> 00:21:44.440
was a sugar burner no longer happen because I'm good
380
00:21:44.460 --> 00:21:48.539
at burning fat. So it's almost like, yes, that's true.
381
00:21:48.599 --> 00:21:51.319
If you're still a sugar burner, then breakfast is probably
382
00:21:51.359 --> 00:21:53.299
a good thing. Otherwise, you're going to start the day
383
00:21:53.380 --> 00:21:56.119
off at a disadvantage. But if you're a fat burner,
384
00:21:56.160 --> 00:21:59.180
if you're really good at burning fat, and if you
385
00:21:59.200 --> 00:22:00.980
wake up and you're not hungry, then don't eat. You
386
00:22:01.019 --> 00:22:03.980
don't need to eat. You're proof right there that your
387
00:22:04.000 --> 00:22:06.799
body knows how to get energy from your stored body
388
00:22:06.819 --> 00:22:11.859
fat and doesn't require a meal, an exogenous feeding of
389
00:22:11.900 --> 00:22:14.619
carbohydrate to jumpstart everything. Does that make sense?
390
00:22:14.769 --> 00:22:17.009
It makes a lot of sense. I like to think
391
00:22:17.180 --> 00:22:21.609
I do a moderately good job of avoiding a lot
392
00:22:21.630 --> 00:22:23.609
of the bad food you talk about, although sometimes I'll
393
00:22:23.630 --> 00:22:27.900
eat like Ezekiel bread but stay away from most grains,
394
00:22:27.960 --> 00:22:30.859
don't really eat pasta. This is because I've been looking
395
00:22:30.880 --> 00:22:32.420
at your work over the last few years. I've had
396
00:22:32.500 --> 00:22:36.000
friends who have followed the primal blueprint to a T,
397
00:22:36.039 --> 00:22:39.660
and it's dramatically changed their lives and their family's lives
398
00:22:39.759 --> 00:22:43.009
because they've followed it. They've even developed a love for
399
00:22:43.880 --> 00:22:47.450
cooking and making meals, which is really neat, especially from
400
00:22:47.470 --> 00:22:50.309
someone who's never done that before. And so I think,
401
00:22:51.289 --> 00:22:52.950
but for me, I almost felt like, well, I've got
402
00:22:52.970 --> 00:22:56.170
to eat, even if I'm not hungry for breakfast. And
403
00:22:56.190 --> 00:22:58.589
I usually do a workout in the morning without having
404
00:22:58.769 --> 00:23:01.569
eaten before. I usually just drink water prior to it.
405
00:23:01.609 --> 00:23:03.509
I'm not really a big coffee drinker. I don't like coffee,
406
00:23:03.549 --> 00:23:06.660
but I like some teas. So I think part of
407
00:23:06.700 --> 00:23:09.119
what I want to talk about during this conversation too
408
00:23:09.220 --> 00:23:13.240
is what are some of the specific foods to eat
409
00:23:13.359 --> 00:23:17.160
and what not to eat. And I also secondarily want
410
00:23:17.180 --> 00:23:20.619
to talk about the amount of time, and I believe
411
00:23:20.660 --> 00:23:23.289
it's roughly around 21 days or so based on some
412
00:23:23.309 --> 00:23:25.430
of the things you've written, That it takes to, if
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00:23:25.470 --> 00:23:30.230
somebody right now, let's say they eat pasta, they eat breads,
414
00:23:30.309 --> 00:23:35.980
they eat dessert sometimes, they drink wine, beer, and they're saying, wow,
415
00:23:36.019 --> 00:23:38.799
this is eye-opening to me. I need to really get
416
00:23:38.839 --> 00:23:41.519
a grasp on this. And so those are some of
417
00:23:41.539 --> 00:23:44.119
the broader topics that I want to cover. First, let's
418
00:23:44.140 --> 00:23:46.740
start with some of the basic foods that a lot
419
00:23:46.759 --> 00:23:52.069
of people might believe are actually healthy, but are not. Specifically,
420
00:23:52.430 --> 00:23:57.190
let's talk about grains, maybe fruit, and then certainly sugar
421
00:23:57.230 --> 00:23:59.049
and go from there if you could. Yeah.
422
00:23:59.750 --> 00:24:03.690
So the grain thing, I mean, grains are pervasive in
423
00:24:03.730 --> 00:24:06.920
our society. They're everywhere. They take all sorts of shapes
424
00:24:06.980 --> 00:24:13.970
from cereals to bread, waffles, toast, baguettes, rolls, bagels, and
425
00:24:14.019 --> 00:24:19.220
then pasta. And there's all manifestation of pastas. And so
426
00:24:19.259 --> 00:24:22.000
if you kind of take a look at your, do
427
00:24:22.019 --> 00:24:25.089
an assessment and audit, if you will, of your current diet,
428
00:24:25.109 --> 00:24:26.109
and you find out that there are a lot of
429
00:24:26.170 --> 00:24:30.920
grain foods in there, typically the best that you can
430
00:24:30.980 --> 00:24:33.329
say about grains are that it's kind of like a
431
00:24:33.430 --> 00:24:37.069
beige glop food that needs something on it to taste
432
00:24:37.089 --> 00:24:39.609
good in other words pasta probably needs a great sauce
433
00:24:39.710 --> 00:24:42.190
on it bread probably needs butter or jam or something
434
00:24:42.289 --> 00:24:46.650
on it cereal needs you know sugar and milk and
435
00:24:47.269 --> 00:24:50.500
and uh maybe some some fruits on it so um
436
00:24:50.920 --> 00:24:53.960
basically grains are a convenient way of getting carbohydrates into
437
00:24:53.980 --> 00:24:56.059
the diet and that's the best thing you can say
438
00:24:56.099 --> 00:24:59.539
about grains because a lot of people myself included um
439
00:24:59.640 --> 00:25:06.660
have some severely negative reactions to grains. My life was,
440
00:25:07.380 --> 00:25:11.440
I had irritable bowel syndrome until I was 47. And
441
00:25:11.480 --> 00:25:13.140
it wasn't until I got rid of the grains that
442
00:25:13.180 --> 00:25:17.119
I realized, dang, it wasn't that I was a stressful individual.
443
00:25:17.180 --> 00:25:20.789
It was the freaking grains that was causing this IBS
444
00:25:20.950 --> 00:25:24.390
on a daily basis that basically ran my life. And
445
00:25:24.450 --> 00:25:27.250
when I got rid of the grains, I mean, literally
446
00:25:27.269 --> 00:25:30.730
within 30 days, my life changed forever. And it was
447
00:25:30.829 --> 00:25:35.230
because my gut is really, really sensitive to gluten and
448
00:25:35.289 --> 00:25:38.430
some of the other protein forms that occur not just
449
00:25:38.490 --> 00:25:42.690
in wheat but in barley and rye and millet and
450
00:25:42.730 --> 00:25:46.339
other– and corn to a certain extent. So I think
451
00:25:46.380 --> 00:25:47.460
there are a lot of people– I mean it was
452
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eye-opening for me. I thought, well, here I was, a
453
00:25:50.700 --> 00:25:56.349
researcher– And having already read a lot about how antithetical
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00:25:56.390 --> 00:25:58.529
grains might be to the human diet, I was still
455
00:25:58.569 --> 00:26:01.650
kind of defending my right to eat grains into my 40s.
456
00:26:02.230 --> 00:26:04.529
Like I was not willing to see that that was
457
00:26:04.569 --> 00:26:07.289
an issue. Because I wasn't celiac. I didn't test positive
458
00:26:07.309 --> 00:26:10.809
for celiac disease. But I was falling under that same
459
00:26:10.849 --> 00:26:15.130
assumption that whole grains were healthy. They were heart healthy.
460
00:26:16.740 --> 00:26:19.829
And finally, my wife, who had already given up grains, said, look,
461
00:26:19.869 --> 00:26:21.329
why don't you just give it up for 30 days
462
00:26:21.369 --> 00:26:24.170
and see what happens? Well, it was so transformative for me, life-changing,
463
00:26:24.970 --> 00:26:27.769
that I realized, wow, there must be tens of millions
464
00:26:27.809 --> 00:26:30.710
of people like me who don't know why they have
465
00:26:31.339 --> 00:26:36.000
IBS or polycystic ovarian syndrome or skin issues, rashes or
466
00:26:36.059 --> 00:26:42.119
arthritis or gastroesophageal reflux, you know, that sort of heartburn manifestations,
467
00:26:42.140 --> 00:26:44.299
or they get colds and flu so often. And all
468
00:26:44.319 --> 00:26:47.039
of those things that I had, because I had arthritis
469
00:26:47.079 --> 00:26:50.529
and I had GERD and I had I was getting
470
00:26:50.569 --> 00:26:52.750
upper respiratory tract infection six or eight times a year.
471
00:26:53.509 --> 00:26:56.329
All those things went away when I gave up the grains.
472
00:26:57.049 --> 00:27:01.349
So I've made kind of an anti-grain crusade for the
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00:27:01.390 --> 00:27:05.539
past 10 years. I'm not suggesting that everyone needs to
474
00:27:05.559 --> 00:27:07.910
give up grains forever, but man, if you've got any
475
00:27:07.950 --> 00:27:10.920
sort of health issues, why not go 30 days without
476
00:27:11.900 --> 00:27:17.400
as an experiment and see what happens? So just to recap,
477
00:27:18.380 --> 00:27:20.619
there's that, you know, there's that potential that you could
478
00:27:20.660 --> 00:27:25.000
have some physiological issues that result from the, what we
479
00:27:25.019 --> 00:27:27.859
call the anti-nutrients in grain. And then there's also just
480
00:27:27.880 --> 00:27:30.569
the basic fact that most grains convert to glucose pretty quickly.
481
00:27:30.619 --> 00:27:33.009
So your body doesn't know whether the glucose in your
482
00:27:33.029 --> 00:27:36.809
bloodstream right now came from a bowl of spaghetti or
483
00:27:36.829 --> 00:27:39.970
a bowl of Skittles. Once it's glucose in the body,
484
00:27:40.009 --> 00:27:42.109
the body, you know, the brain registers it the same way.
485
00:27:42.130 --> 00:27:44.990
It's the same glucose molecule, et cetera, et cetera. So
486
00:27:45.039 --> 00:27:49.470
that would be one reason to give up grains. And
487
00:27:49.829 --> 00:27:52.170
then we talk a little bit about giving up legumes.
488
00:27:52.930 --> 00:27:57.339
Some people have issues with the lectins. Again, these are
489
00:27:58.460 --> 00:28:01.299
other anti-nutrients that are in legumes. So these would be
490
00:28:01.339 --> 00:28:04.029
the kidney beans, black beans, lentils, peas, things like that.
491
00:28:04.670 --> 00:28:08.569
I've softened my stance on legumes in the past couple
492
00:28:08.589 --> 00:28:13.680
of years as more and more information about resistant starch
493
00:28:14.180 --> 00:28:17.869
and the requirement to offer some kind of substrate to
494
00:28:17.980 --> 00:28:20.789
all of the hundred trillion healthy bacteria that are living
495
00:28:20.829 --> 00:28:23.029
in your gut and that you want to feed, right?
496
00:28:23.069 --> 00:28:25.829
So we've softened our stance on legumes a little bit.
497
00:28:26.670 --> 00:28:29.250
Have never softened the stance on sugar, still think sugar
498
00:28:29.869 --> 00:28:33.779
is pretty damn evil. Now, does that mean I never
499
00:28:33.819 --> 00:28:36.640
have sugar? No, I have a teaspoon in my coffee
500
00:28:36.660 --> 00:28:39.700
in the morning. I like my coffee to taste great,
501
00:28:40.460 --> 00:28:43.910
but I don't drink sodas that have the equivalent of
502
00:28:43.910 --> 00:28:47.670
20 teaspoons. I don't drink the kinds of wine that
503
00:28:47.710 --> 00:28:50.329
have the equivalent of 10 or 12 teaspoons of sugar.
504
00:28:50.950 --> 00:28:52.990
Most people don't know that about American wines, but a
505
00:28:53.029 --> 00:28:54.970
lot of American wines have a crap load of sugar
506
00:28:55.009 --> 00:28:57.390
in them. I certainly don't eat a lot of, you know,
507
00:28:57.839 --> 00:29:00.039
I don't eat candies and desserts and stuff. I'll have
508
00:29:00.079 --> 00:29:01.480
a bite once in a while. You know, if somebody
509
00:29:01.500 --> 00:29:05.599
made a great triple chocolate cake or some piece of pie,
510
00:29:05.619 --> 00:29:07.319
I'll have a bite or two, but I don't, I'm not,
511
00:29:07.940 --> 00:29:11.930
never compelled to finish what's on my plate. You mentioned
512
00:29:11.950 --> 00:29:13.890
a little bit about the alcohol, the beer I've cut back.
513
00:29:14.390 --> 00:29:16.819
I used to be a huge beer drinker, but with
514
00:29:16.859 --> 00:29:21.440
the grain issues, I cut way back on beers. I
515
00:29:21.480 --> 00:29:25.099
started drinking wines as a substitute for that. Then I
516
00:29:25.140 --> 00:29:26.920
found out that I was drinking two glasses a night
517
00:29:26.940 --> 00:29:30.029
of wine. And while it didn't negatively impact me, and
518
00:29:30.049 --> 00:29:32.049
I was looking at all the research that suggested that
519
00:29:32.089 --> 00:29:35.430
two glasses of wine a night was probably healthy, healthier
520
00:29:35.450 --> 00:29:38.289
than not drinking at all, something in the back of
521
00:29:38.329 --> 00:29:41.730
my brain said, that can't be right. That can't exactly be,
522
00:29:42.230 --> 00:29:46.309
you know, ethanol is still toxic to humans. So I
523
00:29:46.390 --> 00:29:49.299
gave up wine for about a year and a half.
524
00:29:50.339 --> 00:29:53.940
And then I met a guy who was experimenting with
525
00:29:54.259 --> 00:29:57.319
paleo wines. These are wines that have, that are low sugar,
526
00:29:57.380 --> 00:30:02.559
low alcohol wines. old growth vineyards, no additives in them.
527
00:30:03.079 --> 00:30:07.140
And he convinced me that the problem that most people
528
00:30:07.180 --> 00:30:08.619
had had with wines, and I was one of those,
529
00:30:08.759 --> 00:30:11.579
you know, the stuffiness, the headaches, the not being able
530
00:30:11.599 --> 00:30:14.559
to sleep or falling asleep quickly and then waking up
531
00:30:14.579 --> 00:30:16.460
at three o'clock in the morning, all that kind of
532
00:30:16.500 --> 00:30:18.519
went away when I discovered that, yeah, there's some wines
533
00:30:18.539 --> 00:30:23.019
that you can drink that circumvent all of those traditional
534
00:30:23.059 --> 00:30:24.480
problems that we might have with wine. So now I'm
535
00:30:24.500 --> 00:30:27.420
back to having a glass every, one glass every couple
536
00:30:27.480 --> 00:30:30.559
of nights. um because i can and you know my
537
00:30:31.140 --> 00:30:36.579
look ryan my life isn't about some spartan restrictive diet
538
00:30:36.759 --> 00:30:39.789
i love to eat i love to enjoy every bite
539
00:30:39.809 --> 00:30:42.210
of food i put in my mouth i just have
540
00:30:42.769 --> 00:30:45.049
sort of a list of things that i i don't
541
00:30:45.109 --> 00:30:47.650
eat and i and i recommend that people not eat
542
00:30:48.190 --> 00:30:50.279
and then i just got a big long list of
543
00:30:50.319 --> 00:30:52.079
all the things that people can eat and they're great
544
00:30:52.839 --> 00:30:55.380
you know awesome foods if i'm Sitting down to a
545
00:30:55.420 --> 00:30:58.240
ribeye steak with a glass of wine and a big
546
00:30:58.279 --> 00:31:03.200
bowl of butter sauteed mushrooms, do I feel bad that
547
00:31:03.240 --> 00:31:06.349
I didn't eat the bread basket that came before it? No,
548
00:31:06.420 --> 00:31:09.410
not in the least. I'm savoring every bite.
549
00:31:10.710 --> 00:31:14.490
The other aspect of this, Mark, is you'll hear when
550
00:31:14.569 --> 00:31:20.160
people are on some sort of diet– Um, or even
551
00:31:20.240 --> 00:31:22.430
a lifestyle change when it comes to what they eat,
552
00:31:22.490 --> 00:31:25.609
they will have what they call a cheat day or
553
00:31:25.730 --> 00:31:29.769
cheat meal where they will just go crazy. I've, I've had,
554
00:31:29.950 --> 00:31:33.619
I've had systems in place that allowed for this, where
555
00:31:33.720 --> 00:31:37.579
on Saturday there would be pizza and dessert and all
556
00:31:37.599 --> 00:31:40.380
of that type of stuff. Um, I always felt terrible
557
00:31:40.420 --> 00:31:43.119
when I would do it. Um, but, but still that,
558
00:31:43.220 --> 00:31:44.660
that was a part of it. What do you think
559
00:31:45.119 --> 00:31:49.680
from a moderation perspective about the whole thoughts of cheat
560
00:31:49.960 --> 00:31:51.029
meals or days?
561
00:31:52.920 --> 00:31:55.829
I have a, I hope it's a funny analogy, but I,
562
00:31:55.849 --> 00:31:59.109
you know, I, somebody asked me this before and I said, okay,
563
00:31:59.230 --> 00:32:01.720
let's look at it this way. Are you married? He says, yeah,
564
00:32:01.740 --> 00:32:04.970
I'm married. Do you love your wife?
565
00:32:05.049 --> 00:32:05.609
Yeah.
566
00:32:05.910 --> 00:32:07.289
Are you committed to the relationship?
567
00:32:07.329 --> 00:32:07.589
Yeah.
568
00:32:08.109 --> 00:32:11.109
So what's your cheat day? You know? Um, so if
569
00:32:11.150 --> 00:32:15.809
you're committed to this program, then having a cheat day,
570
00:32:16.269 --> 00:32:19.880
you know, isn't really committed. It's just, it's, it's almost like, okay,
571
00:32:19.930 --> 00:32:23.779
I'm being a good boy six days of the week.
572
00:32:23.799 --> 00:32:26.059
So I can be a bad boy on the seventh day.
573
00:32:26.440 --> 00:32:27.059
Right. Right.
574
00:32:27.319 --> 00:32:29.829
And, um, and I understand that, you know, that's how
575
00:32:29.869 --> 00:32:32.670
some people get through this, but this is not, you
576
00:32:32.690 --> 00:32:34.710
have to look at this as, as a lifestyle. This is,
577
00:32:34.769 --> 00:32:36.329
this is what you're going to do for the rest
578
00:32:36.369 --> 00:32:39.069
of your life. And if you can orchestrate it in
579
00:32:39.109 --> 00:32:43.789
a way that's, that, that every day is enjoyable rather
580
00:32:43.829 --> 00:32:46.049
than have a mindset that, well, this is just six
581
00:32:46.089 --> 00:32:47.609
days of hell. And then all of a sudden I
582
00:32:47.630 --> 00:32:49.369
get to go off the wagon for one day. And
583
00:32:49.390 --> 00:32:51.109
by the way, you said you felt like you didn't
584
00:32:51.130 --> 00:32:53.269
feel that great on your cheat days, right? Terrible.
585
00:32:53.309 --> 00:32:55.779
Like even if you like dessert and pizza.
586
00:32:55.819 --> 00:32:58.230
No, I know. So, so it's like, Just like if
587
00:32:58.279 --> 00:32:59.859
you're married and you have a cheat day, I'm sure
588
00:32:59.880 --> 00:33:01.819
you feel terrible after that, but you know, so.
589
00:33:01.819 --> 00:33:02.680
I haven't had one of those yet.
590
00:33:03.299 --> 00:33:03.640
Okay.
591
00:33:03.839 --> 00:33:05.599
No, I shouldn't say yet. I have not had one
592
00:33:05.619 --> 00:33:05.819
of those.
593
00:33:05.839 --> 00:33:06.339
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
594
00:33:06.359 --> 00:33:07.579
That's for sure.
595
00:33:08.220 --> 00:33:11.240
Um, but the, but you know, the point is life
596
00:33:11.319 --> 00:33:15.019
should be about enjoying every possible moment and getting the
597
00:33:15.059 --> 00:33:16.859
most out of it. So figure out a way to
598
00:33:16.920 --> 00:33:20.440
make those six days, the seven days, you know, so
599
00:33:20.500 --> 00:33:22.940
enjoyable that you don't need a cheat day so that
600
00:33:22.960 --> 00:33:26.180
you don't feel compelled to go off the wagon. Now,
601
00:33:26.400 --> 00:33:28.440
now does that mean that everyone's like, look, I just
602
00:33:28.460 --> 00:33:30.779
got back from Italy. I was in Italy, uh, for
603
00:33:30.779 --> 00:33:33.880
10 days. Yeah. You damn straight. I had a bite
604
00:33:33.920 --> 00:33:35.670
of pizza when I was over there, but I didn't
605
00:33:35.690 --> 00:33:37.849
have the whole pizza. Right. I had a, I had
606
00:33:37.869 --> 00:33:39.250
a half a slice. It was great.
607
00:33:39.390 --> 00:33:39.609
Yup.
608
00:33:39.730 --> 00:33:40.059
Got it.
609
00:33:40.150 --> 00:33:42.750
I got what that tastes like. It's pretty cool, but
610
00:33:42.789 --> 00:33:45.660
I wasn't compelled to, to, you know, stuff the whole
611
00:33:45.700 --> 00:33:47.980
thing down my pie hole just because I was in Italy.
612
00:33:48.839 --> 00:33:52.170
I have, again, I, I, try desserts once in a while.
613
00:33:52.250 --> 00:33:55.490
I'm not compelled to eat all 1700 calories of that
614
00:33:55.549 --> 00:33:57.230
big piece of pie there, whatever that was put on
615
00:33:57.269 --> 00:34:01.670
my plate. Because at some point after three or four bites,
616
00:34:02.759 --> 00:34:07.299
the gustatory senses have been satisfied and you don't need
617
00:34:08.559 --> 00:34:12.239
every other, you know, the next 22 bites, right? It's, it's,
618
00:34:12.480 --> 00:34:15.659
it's a matter of, of degree. And it's a matter of, of, uh,
619
00:34:15.780 --> 00:34:19.780
I think mindfulness that says, okay, um, I'm not going
620
00:34:19.800 --> 00:34:23.400
to be draconian about this. I'm not going to say never, never, never.
621
00:34:23.940 --> 00:34:26.369
But I'm also not going to be caught up in
622
00:34:26.909 --> 00:34:29.570
in letting myself, you know, go crazy. And I think
623
00:34:29.610 --> 00:34:35.130
when people get on a program like ours, I want
624
00:34:35.150 --> 00:34:37.570
to say the danger. Well, I was kind of the
625
00:34:37.880 --> 00:34:39.340
danger is that you get so good at it. You
626
00:34:39.360 --> 00:34:41.300
get so clean that then when you do go off
627
00:34:41.320 --> 00:34:44.360
the wagon, like you mentioned, you do feel like crap
628
00:34:44.900 --> 00:34:49.570
because you've you've read. reclaimed a lot of the sensitivity
629
00:34:49.590 --> 00:34:52.860
in your body and you've tuned yourself to energy levels and,
630
00:34:53.099 --> 00:34:56.340
and hormone levels that are, that are, you know, more
631
00:34:56.480 --> 00:34:59.619
normalized because you're eating good, healthy, wholesome food. And then
632
00:34:59.659 --> 00:35:02.659
you have a, a big piece of sugary, whatever it is,
633
00:35:02.679 --> 00:35:05.530
and you get an insulin spike and you get all
634
00:35:05.570 --> 00:35:09.170
sorts of, um, maybe an adrenaline surge and you can't,
635
00:35:09.289 --> 00:35:11.699
you start sweating and you can't sleep at night and,
636
00:35:12.090 --> 00:35:14.769
and you go, Jesus, I did, I'm, I'm going through
637
00:35:14.889 --> 00:35:18.210
five hours of misery and, Just because for two minutes
638
00:35:18.670 --> 00:35:22.670
of some gustatory pleasure, you know, it just, make a
639
00:35:22.710 --> 00:35:26.349
note to self, don't do that again. Right? Yeah.
640
00:35:27.710 --> 00:35:31.659
And I think he noticed too, sugar is seriously maybe
641
00:35:31.679 --> 00:35:34.099
the most addictive drug in the world, man. I feel,
642
00:35:34.139 --> 00:35:36.619
I mean, I haven't tried others, I guess, but so
643
00:35:36.639 --> 00:35:38.719
I am not, I'm not the one to ask about that.
644
00:35:38.760 --> 00:35:43.659
But when you start, it's so easy to keep eating it,
645
00:35:43.730 --> 00:35:46.690
whether it's a Sour Patch Kid or a Donut. or
646
00:35:46.730 --> 00:35:49.090
something terrible. It just is like, it's like, I don't
647
00:35:49.110 --> 00:35:50.789
know what it is. The chemicals, you probably do know
648
00:35:50.809 --> 00:35:53.610
what it is. The, that, that tells you to keep
649
00:35:53.829 --> 00:35:56.670
doing it. And then, and then again, you feel completely
650
00:35:56.789 --> 00:35:58.570
awful when you get done with one of those moments.
651
00:35:58.610 --> 00:36:01.190
And it's like, I'm never doing that again. You know,
652
00:36:01.250 --> 00:36:03.809
until you do it again, until you do it again.
653
00:36:03.949 --> 00:36:06.570
Exactly right. And it, but it's such a, an addictive,
654
00:36:07.170 --> 00:36:10.239
it's almost feels like a dangerous drug too, because it's
655
00:36:10.320 --> 00:36:13.320
hard to stop. And I could see why people, um,
656
00:36:13.559 --> 00:36:16.300
why this, this is an epidemic with, within our country.
657
00:36:17.190 --> 00:36:19.630
Well, it is, and it is addictive, and it's powerfully addictive.
658
00:36:19.829 --> 00:36:23.239
For a lot of people, sugar– look, it's hardwired into
659
00:36:23.340 --> 00:36:26.000
all of us to seek sugar because for millions of
660
00:36:26.059 --> 00:36:29.480
years of evolution prior to the last 10,000 years, sugar
661
00:36:29.519 --> 00:36:32.280
was very rare. And if you came across sugar, you
662
00:36:32.300 --> 00:36:34.989
were sort of compelled to consume a lot of it,
663
00:36:35.150 --> 00:36:38.050
to store it up as calories and store it as fat. Well,
664
00:36:38.070 --> 00:36:40.130
that wiring still exists in a lot of us. So
665
00:36:40.210 --> 00:36:42.650
we still have this feel-good experience when we consume sugar
666
00:36:43.269 --> 00:36:46.840
because– the the body the the coating in the body
667
00:36:46.900 --> 00:36:49.320
says um yeah consume lots of it and store it
668
00:36:49.340 --> 00:36:51.280
as fat because you might not be able to you
669
00:36:51.300 --> 00:36:53.929
might not be eating more uh tomorrow or next week
670
00:36:53.969 --> 00:36:56.650
or next month so um of course the problem is
671
00:36:56.670 --> 00:36:59.349
sugar is everywhere and so we don't have that that
672
00:36:59.429 --> 00:37:02.630
scarcity issue that we had for millions of years um
673
00:37:02.769 --> 00:37:06.610
so there's that hardwiring some people are even more addicted
674
00:37:06.679 --> 00:37:09.360
and have a you know a real issue with it
675
00:37:09.820 --> 00:37:12.019
interestingly you know you look at a lot of the
676
00:37:12.739 --> 00:37:16.460
addictive programs, a lot of people in rehab or out
677
00:37:16.480 --> 00:37:19.000
of rehab or people doing AA, you'll notice they have
678
00:37:19.800 --> 00:37:25.369
donuts and sugary stuff at the meetings because there's a
679
00:37:25.550 --> 00:37:29.190
sense that, okay, I'm not shooting heroin anymore or I'm
680
00:37:29.230 --> 00:37:33.610
not consuming all the alcohol, but I'm replacing part of
681
00:37:33.630 --> 00:37:38.300
that feel-good experience with sugar that's making it easier for
682
00:37:38.340 --> 00:37:41.650
me to to go cold turkey on whatever the hard
683
00:37:41.670 --> 00:37:44.030
stuff that I was using before. But that's not necessarily
684
00:37:44.050 --> 00:37:46.809
a good thing. It just gets you past, it just, again,
685
00:37:46.829 --> 00:37:50.139
it replaces kind of one addiction with another. When you
686
00:37:50.599 --> 00:37:54.659
start to cut back on the carbohydrate load across the board,
687
00:37:54.699 --> 00:37:56.280
when you cut back on the breads and the pastas
688
00:37:56.300 --> 00:37:59.699
and the cereals and the rice, all of which convert
689
00:37:59.739 --> 00:38:03.679
to glucose in the bloodstream, that lower amount of glucose
690
00:38:04.820 --> 00:38:07.179
is telling the brain, hey, you know, there's not a
691
00:38:07.199 --> 00:38:10.239
lot of sugar. Remember what I said, the Skittles and
692
00:38:10.440 --> 00:38:13.860
pasta analogy that once it's in the bloodstream, the brain
693
00:38:13.880 --> 00:38:17.659
doesn't know whether it came from sour patch candies or
694
00:38:17.780 --> 00:38:23.329
from dessert or from some whole grain pasta. So when
695
00:38:23.349 --> 00:38:25.170
you cut the load across the board, whether or not
696
00:38:25.210 --> 00:38:27.949
it's just the sweetened candies or the beverages but you
697
00:38:27.989 --> 00:38:30.750
also start cutting the unsweetened stuff that converts to glucose,
698
00:38:31.449 --> 00:38:33.230
that does reduce the load on the body and it
699
00:38:33.289 --> 00:38:38.460
does start to lower– The cravings, if you will, which
700
00:38:38.500 --> 00:38:40.360
are the big issue that so many people have. I
701
00:38:40.969 --> 00:38:43.090
mean the worst time for a lot of people, particularly
702
00:38:43.210 --> 00:38:47.469
single people, is after 8 o'clock at night if you're
703
00:38:47.489 --> 00:38:48.010
home alone.
704
00:38:48.210 --> 00:38:48.909
Ice cream, yeah.
705
00:38:49.570 --> 00:38:52.750
Yeah, it's just that tendency to reach for something sweet because,
706
00:38:53.570 --> 00:38:55.550
I don't know, there's just that craving, that compulsion.
707
00:38:55.849 --> 00:38:58.489
Did you see the New York Times article that came
708
00:38:58.550 --> 00:39:02.539
out recently where it stated the sugar industry paid scientists
709
00:39:02.559 --> 00:39:05.280
in the 1960s to play down a link between sugar
710
00:39:05.300 --> 00:39:09.099
and heart disease? promote saturated fat as the culprit instead.
711
00:39:09.139 --> 00:39:09.719
Did you see that?
712
00:39:10.219 --> 00:39:16.760
I mean, wow. You know, I think it's a bit
713
00:39:16.820 --> 00:39:18.969
naive to think that that hasn't been happening in every
714
00:39:19.070 --> 00:39:21.050
area of science for the last hundred years.
715
00:39:21.309 --> 00:39:22.110
That's scary.
716
00:39:22.230 --> 00:39:27.969
You know, so much of public policy goes back to
717
00:39:28.750 --> 00:39:33.880
lobbying and to you know, paying off the people at
718
00:39:33.920 --> 00:39:36.239
the level of doing the science. Or maybe it's as
719
00:39:36.280 --> 00:39:39.719
simple as for the longest time, once that saturated fat
720
00:39:40.579 --> 00:39:43.079
being the bad guy, the evil of saturated fat arose,
721
00:39:43.599 --> 00:39:49.960
then any government funding to prove otherwise was turned down.
722
00:39:50.199 --> 00:39:52.579
So the only funding you could get for a study
723
00:39:52.619 --> 00:39:55.619
was to continue to prove that saturated fat was the culprit.
724
00:39:57.019 --> 00:40:01.159
So yeah, I mean, it's, you know, look, I'm a cynic. Okay,
725
00:40:02.099 --> 00:40:03.639
I say I'm a skeptic, it's probably a nicer way
726
00:40:03.659 --> 00:40:05.659
of saying it, but I'm a cynic. I'm pretty cynical
727
00:40:05.699 --> 00:40:09.949
about a lot of stuff in this world. And certainly
728
00:40:09.989 --> 00:40:12.110
when it has to do with public policy and governments
729
00:40:12.829 --> 00:40:16.449
and the links between, you know, big business and their interests,
730
00:40:17.389 --> 00:40:21.090
So I look at everything with kind of a jaundiced eye,
731
00:40:21.789 --> 00:40:24.190
and that's kind of how Mark's Daily Apple arose, and
732
00:40:24.210 --> 00:40:29.110
that's how the Primal Blueprint arose, as trying to poke
733
00:40:29.150 --> 00:40:31.650
a finger in the eye of conventional wisdom and say, hey,
734
00:40:31.670 --> 00:40:33.969
you guys have gotten it all wrong, and here's a
735
00:40:34.010 --> 00:40:34.940
different way of looking at it.
736
00:40:36.139 --> 00:40:38.940
How do you respond to the skeptic right now listening
737
00:40:38.960 --> 00:40:41.559
who's right in the middle of a long car ride,
738
00:40:41.579 --> 00:40:43.800
and they're saying, who is this guy? Who does he
739
00:40:43.840 --> 00:40:46.119
think he is? Where does he get off saying this?
740
00:40:46.920 --> 00:40:49.960
I think I have an understanding on what's good for me.
741
00:40:50.019 --> 00:40:53.219
I'm relatively healthy. I lift weights and I can run
742
00:40:53.730 --> 00:40:58.210
5Ks and I feel okay. And I love to eat
743
00:40:58.510 --> 00:41:02.989
lasagna and key lime pie and have beers. I mean,
744
00:41:03.449 --> 00:41:05.900
what do you say to that? Or maybe you could
745
00:41:05.920 --> 00:41:09.260
share some of your background of where you started from
746
00:41:09.320 --> 00:41:11.820
as an endurance athlete to where you've come today.
747
00:41:12.440 --> 00:41:13.980
Yeah, well, first of all, to that person, I say
748
00:41:14.019 --> 00:41:16.329
go for it, man. If it works for you, I'm
749
00:41:16.349 --> 00:41:19.449
not going to judge your life choices. All we're doing here,
750
00:41:20.170 --> 00:41:22.170
we're having a, you know, we're just, we're doing a
751
00:41:22.190 --> 00:41:24.909
thought experiment and we're suggesting that there might be some
752
00:41:24.989 --> 00:41:29.190
choices out there that would lead to slightly different outcomes.
753
00:41:29.590 --> 00:41:32.809
But I'm not one to go, okay, your life sucks
754
00:41:32.869 --> 00:41:36.840
because you still eat pasta. You know, you're doing 5Ks
755
00:41:36.860 --> 00:41:39.519
and 10Ks and maybe you're not sleeping as well as
756
00:41:39.559 --> 00:41:42.980
you might want to. But hey, if you're digging life
757
00:41:43.610 --> 00:41:46.849
Then go for it. I want some of that. But
758
00:41:46.949 --> 00:41:50.409
what I'm saying is for all those people who have
759
00:41:50.449 --> 00:41:54.050
had– come to a roadblock, who plateaued, who have not
760
00:41:54.090 --> 00:41:56.750
had success, who have been frustrated at the traditional advice
761
00:41:57.170 --> 00:41:59.530
that they've gotten from the medical community. And most people
762
00:41:59.550 --> 00:42:02.130
who come to Mark's Daily Apple– I mean certainly a
763
00:42:02.159 --> 00:42:05.360
majority come because they are frustrated because they've got– they're
764
00:42:05.400 --> 00:42:07.139
overweight and haven't been able to lose the weight or
765
00:42:07.159 --> 00:42:11.219
they feel tired or they've got Hashimoto's. Or they've got
766
00:42:11.260 --> 00:42:13.219
type two diabetes and their doctor told them they're going
767
00:42:13.239 --> 00:42:14.260
to be on meds the rest of their life. They
768
00:42:14.280 --> 00:42:16.599
got polycystic ovarian syndrome or they got arthritis. They got
769
00:42:17.079 --> 00:42:21.349
issues they want to deal with. And none of us
770
00:42:21.389 --> 00:42:24.449
are really compelled to make a change in our lives
771
00:42:24.510 --> 00:42:29.010
if everything's going great, right? So it's really the ones
772
00:42:29.070 --> 00:42:32.469
who are the most frustrated, who are most receptive to
773
00:42:32.510 --> 00:42:36.619
this sort of advice and information. And those are the
774
00:42:36.679 --> 00:42:38.480
people that I talk to on a regular basis. And
775
00:42:38.500 --> 00:42:40.949
those are the people I say, look, again, I'm not
776
00:42:40.969 --> 00:42:44.030
going to tell you that I've got the answer. I
777
00:42:44.050 --> 00:42:47.559
have a choice. I have an option that my research
778
00:42:47.739 --> 00:42:51.719
suggests might get you to your desired goal or your
779
00:42:51.760 --> 00:42:54.900
desired outcome with a little bit more ease and grace
780
00:42:55.139 --> 00:42:59.159
and less discomfort than what you're currently doing. Would you
781
00:42:59.199 --> 00:43:01.860
be willing to try that for 30 days? That's all.
782
00:43:03.230 --> 00:43:06.710
But I've got millions of people who will go, wow,
783
00:43:06.730 --> 00:43:09.090
you changed my life. That's unbelievable. I had no idea.
784
00:43:09.530 --> 00:43:12.920
that this level of health was available to me. You know,
785
00:43:12.940 --> 00:43:14.679
the person you talked about is driving his car and
786
00:43:14.699 --> 00:43:16.679
he's doing 5Ks and he's lifting weights and he's eating
787
00:43:16.719 --> 00:43:19.559
pasta and he drinks beer once in a while. Yeah,
788
00:43:19.619 --> 00:43:24.239
maybe if that person did an audit of his or
789
00:43:24.280 --> 00:43:27.239
her life and said, well, you know, I do have
790
00:43:27.260 --> 00:43:29.730
a little bit of joint pain when I wake up
791
00:43:29.750 --> 00:43:31.929
in the morning. That could be arthritis. I don't know.
792
00:43:31.989 --> 00:43:35.289
I do get heartburn if I eat late at night.
793
00:43:35.349 --> 00:43:39.570
I do get colds and flu. Maybe I'm training– inappropriately
794
00:43:39.670 --> 00:43:42.190
for the rest of my life. You know, I do
795
00:43:42.250 --> 00:43:45.969
feel some stress. You know, it's really, you know, humans
796
00:43:46.050 --> 00:43:49.190
do what we can get away with, right? And if
797
00:43:49.210 --> 00:43:50.670
you're a person who eats a lot of sugar and
798
00:43:50.710 --> 00:43:53.469
doesn't gain weight and you can get away with that,
799
00:43:53.789 --> 00:43:57.260
then you're not going to change. But even when we
800
00:43:57.280 --> 00:43:59.599
do what we can get away with, we sometimes hit
801
00:43:59.639 --> 00:44:02.320
a point where like, uh-oh, I can't get away with
802
00:44:02.360 --> 00:44:04.599
this anymore. You know, I've been gaining four pounds a
803
00:44:04.619 --> 00:44:06.840
year for the last 10 years. I'm 40 pounds overweight now.
804
00:44:07.530 --> 00:44:09.769
I better do something about this. I'm 50. This does
805
00:44:09.829 --> 00:44:11.730
not look good for the next couple of decades if
806
00:44:11.769 --> 00:44:16.690
I don't take charge of it right now. So that's
807
00:44:16.710 --> 00:44:20.110
what I'm here for. I'm here as sort of just
808
00:44:20.269 --> 00:44:25.820
another option, another guy who's making a set of life
809
00:44:26.639 --> 00:44:29.739
choices that you might want to take on if you're
810
00:44:29.820 --> 00:44:33.000
at that point where you're kind of ready to get
811
00:44:33.039 --> 00:44:33.739
to the next level.
812
00:44:34.519 --> 00:44:38.079
Let's– Let's get practical now. I actually had a conversation
813
00:44:38.119 --> 00:44:40.260
like this with Ben Greenfield. I know Ben said you
814
00:44:40.300 --> 00:44:42.159
and him have gotten together a few times and talked.
815
00:44:42.900 --> 00:44:44.579
He was a guest on this podcast, and I saw
816
00:44:44.599 --> 00:44:47.000
him at a conference and had a meal with him, actually.
817
00:44:47.059 --> 00:44:48.960
And this is one of the questions I asked him,
818
00:44:48.980 --> 00:44:52.639
so I'd love to ask it to you. So your lifestyle,
819
00:44:52.659 --> 00:44:55.869
I know you travel some, but you've designed, I think,
820
00:44:55.929 --> 00:44:58.829
a lifestyle to where, correct me if I'm wrong, but
821
00:44:58.889 --> 00:45:00.929
you're not going into an office at 8 in the
822
00:45:00.989 --> 00:45:04.110
morning and having meetings all day with a boss and
823
00:45:04.130 --> 00:45:07.579
things of that nature. However, there's a lot of people
824
00:45:07.639 --> 00:45:09.980
listening who do, or they are in their car in
825
00:45:10.000 --> 00:45:13.940
between appointments. They're traveling on airplanes. They're staying in hotels.
826
00:45:14.579 --> 00:45:19.800
They're very busy. When it comes to their meals, there's
827
00:45:19.820 --> 00:45:22.289
a couple of different things that happen. One, they either
828
00:45:23.090 --> 00:45:26.750
have a very limited amount of time, so they're getting
829
00:45:26.809 --> 00:45:30.489
fast food or whatever, or they're on the road and
830
00:45:30.530 --> 00:45:34.469
it's tough eating in a hotel sometimes with a lot
831
00:45:34.489 --> 00:45:38.389
of appointments and work happening. So I'd love to potentially
832
00:45:38.429 --> 00:45:40.969
help some of those people, Mark. What are some of
833
00:45:40.989 --> 00:45:44.530
the practical tips and advice you would give to the
834
00:45:44.650 --> 00:45:51.159
very busy, constantly in meetings, traveling type of business professional
835
00:45:51.199 --> 00:45:53.679
that's probably listening to this podcast when it comes to
836
00:45:53.760 --> 00:45:59.300
specifically how they prep from a food perspective?
837
00:46:00.570 --> 00:46:03.670
Well, from a food perspective, first of all, spend time
838
00:46:03.730 --> 00:46:06.570
becoming fat-adapted. So get into that space where you're not
839
00:46:06.639 --> 00:46:10.260
carbohydrate dependent. Get fat adapted. When you get fat adapted,
840
00:46:10.440 --> 00:46:12.679
if you do need breakfast or even lunch, you know,
841
00:46:12.860 --> 00:46:17.059
every hotel has a restaurant where you can get an omelet.
842
00:46:17.699 --> 00:46:21.960
So you can always get eggs with some vegetables in them. And,
843
00:46:23.260 --> 00:46:25.619
you know, that's whether or not it was cooked in
844
00:46:27.360 --> 00:46:30.039
ghee or butter is sort of immaterial. You know, you
845
00:46:30.079 --> 00:46:32.800
want to get the best possible solution for where you
846
00:46:32.880 --> 00:46:36.000
are at that time. Every restaurant in every city, I
847
00:46:36.360 --> 00:46:38.280
sort of have a challenge. Like you can't put me
848
00:46:38.300 --> 00:46:41.840
in a restaurant where I can't find something that's either
849
00:46:41.889 --> 00:46:43.199
on the menu or that I can have a chef
850
00:46:43.260 --> 00:46:46.570
make for me really quickly that will satisfy everything. Put
851
00:46:46.590 --> 00:46:49.510
me in a Mexican restaurant with rice and beans and
852
00:46:49.590 --> 00:46:52.650
chips and I'll say give me a double carne asada
853
00:46:52.670 --> 00:46:55.469
with guacamole and a little dollop of sour cream. It
854
00:46:55.510 --> 00:46:57.690
might be the best meal I have that week. And
855
00:46:57.730 --> 00:46:59.550
yet somebody would have said, oh, it's Mexican food. I'm
856
00:46:59.570 --> 00:47:00.690
going to have to go for the beans and the
857
00:47:00.710 --> 00:47:03.389
rice and chips and here goes– my diet has gone
858
00:47:03.409 --> 00:47:08.170
to hell. So there's– it's literally learning how to forage
859
00:47:08.349 --> 00:47:12.769
off of any menu that you encounter and being creative
860
00:47:13.289 --> 00:47:15.659
in the absence of– if it's not on the menu,
861
00:47:15.699 --> 00:47:18.980
just go back to– have the waiter go back and say, hey,
862
00:47:19.000 --> 00:47:22.440
can the chef whip up four eggs with a little
863
00:47:22.460 --> 00:47:25.820
bit of onion and some mushrooms and a little side
864
00:47:25.860 --> 00:47:28.199
of cheese or whatever? Or I'm sure there's a piece
865
00:47:28.219 --> 00:47:30.260
of meat back there that he can cook up for
866
00:47:30.280 --> 00:47:34.900
me with some steamed vegetables. All this stuff– What I
867
00:47:34.980 --> 00:47:37.510
find is that people get into that sort of excuse
868
00:47:37.650 --> 00:47:40.570
of like, well, I'm on the road, so therefore there's
869
00:47:40.610 --> 00:47:45.170
no way I can comply with my otherwise strict diet,
870
00:47:45.210 --> 00:47:47.349
so I'm just going to go to hell. The other
871
00:47:47.369 --> 00:47:49.050
thing about being on the road is I find that
872
00:47:49.070 --> 00:47:50.889
a lot of times when you're on the road, especially
873
00:47:50.909 --> 00:47:52.230
if you're in a city, there's a lot of walking
874
00:47:52.250 --> 00:47:54.889
in the city. Spend time walking. Walk to the meetings.
875
00:47:55.030 --> 00:47:58.489
Plan for that. Walk up the stairs instead of the elevator.
876
00:47:59.739 --> 00:48:03.179
If the hotel you're in has a gym, use the gym.
877
00:48:03.239 --> 00:48:06.070
If it doesn't have a gym— I have this routine
878
00:48:06.130 --> 00:48:11.090
I do that might be 100 push-ups and 200 air
879
00:48:11.130 --> 00:48:14.389
squats in my bedroom while the Today Show is on,
880
00:48:14.730 --> 00:48:17.980
and I'm done. That might have been one of the
881
00:48:18.019 --> 00:48:20.480
better workouts I did. I don't do them consequentially. I
882
00:48:20.500 --> 00:48:26.579
might do five sets of 20 and 40 or something.
883
00:48:26.619 --> 00:48:30.039
By the end of that little seven-minute routine or whatever
884
00:48:30.059 --> 00:48:32.860
it takes, 10-minute routine, I'm good to go, man. I've
885
00:48:32.920 --> 00:48:34.980
done my work. There's nothing more I could do in
886
00:48:35.019 --> 00:48:38.340
a gym that would, um, that would leave me better,
887
00:48:38.780 --> 00:48:41.380
you know, having had a better workout and I don't
888
00:48:41.400 --> 00:48:42.780
have to, I don't have it hanging over my head
889
00:48:42.980 --> 00:48:45.559
the rest of the day or the rest of the trip. Um,
890
00:48:45.619 --> 00:48:47.639
I could even take the next day off and not
891
00:48:47.679 --> 00:48:50.860
feel guilty about not working out. So I just find
892
00:48:50.880 --> 00:48:53.980
that so many business travelers, you know, kind of use
893
00:48:54.019 --> 00:48:55.679
the excuse of, well, I'm on the road. I don't
894
00:48:55.699 --> 00:48:58.219
have the time. I can't do it. And I bet
895
00:48:58.239 --> 00:49:01.199
if we sat down and, and, um, We really looked
896
00:49:01.239 --> 00:49:03.960
at the schedule. There's plenty of time in between.
897
00:49:05.260 --> 00:49:08.260
Yeah, I agree. I was speaking with a CEO recently
898
00:49:08.320 --> 00:49:12.929
who travels literally every week all over the world. This
899
00:49:12.969 --> 00:49:16.409
was a mentor of mine. It wasn't recorded. And I
900
00:49:16.530 --> 00:49:18.730
asked him about this specifically because I knew this was
901
00:49:18.769 --> 00:49:21.599
coming up with you, Mark, this conversation. And this is
902
00:49:21.639 --> 00:49:26.079
a guy who's in incredible shape. And he described the
903
00:49:26.159 --> 00:49:28.500
planning that he puts in place, both from a work,
904
00:49:28.519 --> 00:49:31.050
he's a CrossFit guy, which is even harder to do,
905
00:49:31.130 --> 00:49:35.809
I think, when you travel. The planning of all of
906
00:49:35.869 --> 00:49:39.500
the CrossFit places all over the world literally that he
907
00:49:39.539 --> 00:49:42.440
has mapped out to go to and built relationships with
908
00:49:42.480 --> 00:49:44.719
people there So he could show up at whatever time
909
00:49:44.760 --> 00:49:47.139
he needed to show up as well as the meals
910
00:49:47.179 --> 00:49:50.400
then he needs prepared It was it was quite impressive
911
00:49:50.440 --> 00:49:53.539
because of all people he could have easily given excuses.
912
00:49:53.559 --> 00:49:55.039
I think that's a big part of it So I
913
00:49:55.059 --> 00:49:56.159
appreciate you sharing that.
914
00:49:56.739 --> 00:49:58.320
Well, okay. I'll go you one better on that say
915
00:49:58.340 --> 00:50:02.820
that here's here's a guy who? now he's got sort
916
00:50:02.840 --> 00:50:05.250
of this common theme that whenever he goes to a
917
00:50:05.269 --> 00:50:09.730
new city and He makes friends at a new CrossFit box,
918
00:50:10.010 --> 00:50:13.599
and it's part of– it's an enjoyable part of the
919
00:50:13.639 --> 00:50:18.559
travel for him, not– and it's consistent in that it's
920
00:50:19.079 --> 00:50:23.250
comfortable for him, and it's not something that he's fighting
921
00:50:23.269 --> 00:50:26.150
to make happen. He wants to make it happen. Right.
922
00:50:26.510 --> 00:50:26.889
Exactly.
923
00:50:26.949 --> 00:50:27.610
Right. Yeah.
924
00:50:27.710 --> 00:50:30.639
Yeah. And meeting, meeting people, developing and building relationships along
925
00:50:30.679 --> 00:50:32.360
the way, which is, which is important. I think it's
926
00:50:32.400 --> 00:50:35.659
a healthy part of, uh, of, of living. Um, uh,
927
00:50:35.780 --> 00:50:38.519
another note that I wrote down that I was curious
928
00:50:38.539 --> 00:50:41.360
to get your take on, I've never experimented with being
929
00:50:41.440 --> 00:50:43.980
a vegan. How does that work or what are your
930
00:50:44.019 --> 00:50:47.449
thoughts on, on being a vegan for those who are listening?
931
00:50:48.619 --> 00:50:52.320
Well, I think it's, it's tough. Um, I can't, I'm
932
00:50:52.340 --> 00:50:54.239
not going to say it can't be done in the
933
00:50:54.280 --> 00:50:56.179
context of the primal blueprint. I think there are a
934
00:50:56.199 --> 00:50:59.360
few vegans who are following the primal blueprint. I think
935
00:51:00.159 --> 00:51:04.619
whether you're comparing diets across the board, vegans, pescatarians, vegetarians,
936
00:51:05.139 --> 00:51:09.159
massive carnivores, ancestral leaders, it's really if, and all of
937
00:51:09.199 --> 00:51:11.099
them will argue, oh, we got great results. Well, the
938
00:51:11.300 --> 00:51:13.320
results you got were from what you gave up, what
939
00:51:13.360 --> 00:51:16.190
you're not eating. So you're not eating the industrial seed oils,
940
00:51:16.289 --> 00:51:20.530
processed crap, the sugars. You are eating, you know, whatever
941
00:51:20.590 --> 00:51:22.389
you're eating. And by the way, most or all of
942
00:51:22.409 --> 00:51:24.889
these are still plant-based diet. Even the primal blueprint is
943
00:51:24.909 --> 00:51:29.150
kind of a plant-based diet. It's, it's, it's vegetable heavy, right?
944
00:51:29.190 --> 00:51:31.889
It's vegetable centric. The only issue, the only difference is
945
00:51:31.929 --> 00:51:34.530
where you get your protein from. And to the extent
946
00:51:34.550 --> 00:51:37.889
that a vegan can get protein from some of the new, uh,
947
00:51:37.949 --> 00:51:43.030
vegan protein powders, then there's a, there's ways to maximize
948
00:51:43.050 --> 00:51:45.780
health and optimize health doing that. So, um, I wouldn't,
949
00:51:46.070 --> 00:51:47.980
I would never take somebody to try to convince them
950
00:51:48.000 --> 00:51:50.699
to eat meat if they were vegan. Um, It's also
951
00:51:50.760 --> 00:51:52.320
an impossible task if you've ever talked.
952
00:51:52.179 --> 00:51:57.119
To a vegan. You'll know it if you've talked to one.
953
00:51:57.760 --> 00:52:02.539
I'm curious to get a typical– you don't need to
954
00:52:02.579 --> 00:52:06.469
share the business side because I think, again, the focus
955
00:52:06.489 --> 00:52:10.929
of this conversation is on the moving your body aspect
956
00:52:11.010 --> 00:52:13.159
as well as what you put into your body. So
957
00:52:13.179 --> 00:52:16.760
what is it like for you, Mark, typically on what
958
00:52:16.800 --> 00:52:19.699
time you wake up, what you do, what you eat
959
00:52:19.840 --> 00:52:22.420
at what times, and then what physical activity you like
960
00:52:22.460 --> 00:52:24.599
to incorporate? I know it's not the same every day, obviously,
961
00:52:24.659 --> 00:52:28.090
but curious for you to share so that maybe other
962
00:52:28.110 --> 00:52:29.269
people get some ideas here.
963
00:52:29.829 --> 00:52:32.250
Yeah, well, for me, look, I'm a business owner. I
964
00:52:32.289 --> 00:52:34.590
have a lot of great employees, so I'm a huge
965
00:52:35.489 --> 00:52:38.730
advocate of finding the best possible employees possible. Because that
966
00:52:38.750 --> 00:52:40.929
just unburdens me of a lot of stuff that I
967
00:52:40.929 --> 00:52:42.250
have to do. So I get up in the morning
968
00:52:42.289 --> 00:52:46.190
around 6.30. I have a big cup of coffee. I
969
00:52:46.269 --> 00:52:52.400
read two papers quickly. I do crossword puzzles and pseudocos
970
00:52:52.440 --> 00:52:56.079
and ken-kens. But I do them really quickly. I'm pretty
971
00:52:56.099 --> 00:52:58.460
quick at that stuff. I just get my brain sharpened up.
972
00:52:58.539 --> 00:53:01.340
Then I hit the desk and email and work for
973
00:53:01.380 --> 00:53:05.969
about an hour, hour and a half. Typically break around 9.30.
974
00:53:05.969 --> 00:53:08.050
Today I went to the gym. and did a quick
975
00:53:08.289 --> 00:53:13.590
bunch of push-ups, pull-ups, dips, squats, lunges, bodyweight stuff, mostly
976
00:53:13.610 --> 00:53:15.840
because yesterday I played a hard game of Ultimate, so
977
00:53:15.860 --> 00:53:20.460
I'm not recovered from that yet enough to be doing
978
00:53:20.500 --> 00:53:25.039
any really heavy stuff. Came back, have this conversation with you,
979
00:53:25.659 --> 00:53:29.079
got an 11.30 lunch with an employee for an hour,
980
00:53:29.139 --> 00:53:31.530
got a meeting with a private equity group at 2
981
00:53:31.530 --> 00:53:34.710
o'clock for the rest of the afternoon, and then come
982
00:53:34.750 --> 00:53:38.320
back and do some more emails, maybe write a draft
983
00:53:38.489 --> 00:53:41.769
of another post coming up in the next couple of days.
984
00:53:42.570 --> 00:53:45.630
I typically work until about seven o'clock at night. Uh, my,
985
00:53:45.750 --> 00:53:49.969
my peak, uh, working and creative hours are from five
986
00:53:49.989 --> 00:53:52.750
to seven for some reason. Uh, seven o'clock, typically my
987
00:53:52.789 --> 00:53:54.809
wife says, all right, time to stop working, get out
988
00:53:54.829 --> 00:53:58.590
of there. And, uh, so have, have a nice dinner, uh, that, oh,
989
00:53:58.650 --> 00:54:02.010
so the lunch today will, I guarantee it will be
990
00:54:02.050 --> 00:54:05.090
a piece of salmon, uh, a side of broccoli and
991
00:54:05.150 --> 00:54:08.269
a side of, uh, uh, wild rice. I won't eat
992
00:54:08.289 --> 00:54:09.909
the wild. I won't finish the wild rice, but I'll
993
00:54:09.929 --> 00:54:12.230
have some tastes of it. And just to be real specific,
994
00:54:12.269 --> 00:54:15.630
I'll have a non-alcoholic beer. Um, it's a Beck's non-alcoholic
995
00:54:15.650 --> 00:54:17.090
cause I know the restaurant I'm going to, and that's
996
00:54:17.130 --> 00:54:20.349
what I, that's my go-to go-to kind of meal there.
997
00:54:20.769 --> 00:54:21.909
So that'll be what I'll eat today.
998
00:54:21.929 --> 00:54:23.570
I'll be drinking non-alcoholic beer.
999
00:54:24.340 --> 00:54:29.539
All right. So I don't like water. Um, I don't like,
1000
00:54:30.000 --> 00:54:32.739
I don't like water. Um, I want to get some
1001
00:54:32.840 --> 00:54:36.179
form of hydration. Um, I found– when I went through
1002
00:54:36.199 --> 00:54:39.869
my wine, beer, washout experiment a couple of years ago,
1003
00:54:40.230 --> 00:54:43.269
I needed something that was sort of– had that savory,
1004
00:54:43.449 --> 00:54:48.030
fizzy thing that wasn't a cola or wasn't whatever. And
1005
00:54:48.190 --> 00:54:50.960
so I've got a– so I have a non-alcoholic beer.
1006
00:54:51.000 --> 00:54:51.480
What can I tell you?
1007
00:54:51.500 --> 00:54:53.820
It's just– Isn't that bad from a grains perspective?
1008
00:54:54.239 --> 00:54:57.260
No, it's not. So I found a couple that are
1009
00:54:57.719 --> 00:55:00.219
what you would call– Gluten-free or low-gluten.
1010
00:55:00.440 --> 00:55:00.639
Okay.
1011
00:55:00.800 --> 00:55:03.179
So it fits all of the– I check off all
1012
00:55:03.199 --> 00:55:04.159
the boxes on that one, right?
1013
00:55:04.300 --> 00:55:05.090
Okay.
1014
00:55:05.300 --> 00:55:08.090
Yeah. So then again, back to– I'll go through the
1015
00:55:08.110 --> 00:55:11.889
rest of the afternoon with meetings and whatever. Then around
1016
00:55:11.889 --> 00:55:16.190
7 o'clock, then I'll have a– I've got a nice
1017
00:55:16.230 --> 00:55:20.289
piece of Wagyu short rib that I've thawed out for
1018
00:55:20.349 --> 00:55:25.099
dinner tonight, probably some more steamed vegetables. I might have
1019
00:55:25.139 --> 00:55:28.269
a piece of dark chocolate after that. Uh, I might
1020
00:55:28.309 --> 00:55:31.449
have a glass of one of those paleo wines and
1021
00:55:31.469 --> 00:55:33.210
that's it. Um, one of the things I've noticed over
1022
00:55:33.230 --> 00:55:35.289
the years, I, as I, it takes me fewer calories
1023
00:55:35.329 --> 00:55:37.530
to get through the day. Uh, and that's a good
1024
00:55:37.550 --> 00:55:39.530
thing cause I'm more efficient at, at, at this. And,
1025
00:55:40.050 --> 00:55:42.849
and you know, that works if eating fewer calories throughout
1026
00:55:42.889 --> 00:55:46.280
the day works provided a, you don't lose muscle mass B,
1027
00:55:46.530 --> 00:55:48.260
you keep up your energy. See, you don't get sick.
1028
00:55:48.300 --> 00:55:52.099
And most importantly, you don't get hungry. So I, I've
1029
00:55:52.340 --> 00:55:54.340
really dialed in my hunger over the years. And I,
1030
00:55:54.900 --> 00:55:57.349
I realized that, um, I eat just enough to satisfy
1031
00:55:57.409 --> 00:56:01.670
my hunger, not so much that I'm full. And I
1032
00:56:01.710 --> 00:56:04.969
maintain my mass and my strength and everything on probably
1033
00:56:04.969 --> 00:56:08.039
30% fewer calories now than I did six or seven
1034
00:56:08.059 --> 00:56:08.420
years ago.
1035
00:56:08.579 --> 00:56:11.860
And you're 62, is that right?
1036
00:56:11.860 --> 00:56:12.150
63.
1037
00:56:12.150 --> 00:56:14.800
63, and you are shredded, ripped. People, if you haven't
1038
00:56:14.840 --> 00:56:17.300
seen them, go look online. I'm thinking, how can I
1039
00:56:17.320 --> 00:56:20.889
look like you right now? And I'm in my 30s.
1040
00:56:21.699 --> 00:56:25.349
And so that's why it's like you're living proof of it.
1041
00:56:25.360 --> 00:56:28.400
And then there are Just to try to, this, I guess,
1042
00:56:28.420 --> 00:56:30.519
would have been better earlier in the conversation, but to
1043
00:56:30.539 --> 00:56:34.059
add credibility for the people who maybe are typical fans
1044
00:56:34.099 --> 00:56:37.079
of my show that haven't heard of you yet, but
1045
00:56:37.139 --> 00:56:39.469
will be now, obviously, going to Mark's Daily Apple to
1046
00:56:39.530 --> 00:56:42.710
read more, like I've been doing. But you've helped millions
1047
00:56:42.769 --> 00:56:45.449
upon millions of people, and your goal is to help, what,
1048
00:56:45.449 --> 00:56:46.710
100 million, is that correct?
1049
00:56:47.250 --> 00:56:48.949
It was 10 million. I make a joke that I
1050
00:56:49.250 --> 00:56:49.570
said that.
1051
00:56:49.650 --> 00:56:50.630
It was 10, but now it's 100, right?
1052
00:56:51.210 --> 00:56:52.590
Yeah, and now it's 100, yeah.
1053
00:56:52.610 --> 00:56:54.289
So how do you measure that.
1054
00:56:54.309 --> 00:56:59.880
By the way? Well, I measure it by people coming
1055
00:56:59.940 --> 00:57:02.260
up to me out of the blue and wanting to
1056
00:57:02.280 --> 00:57:05.760
give me a hug for having changed their lives. I
1057
00:57:05.800 --> 00:57:08.449
measure it by, you know, we have 2 million unique
1058
00:57:08.489 --> 00:57:10.309
visitors a month on Mark's Daily Apple.
1059
00:57:10.469 --> 00:57:11.170
Wow.
1060
00:57:11.190 --> 00:57:16.050
So we've got some metrics here. Obviously, you can't really
1061
00:57:16.130 --> 00:57:18.059
measure it, but you can get a sense of it.
1062
00:57:18.449 --> 00:57:21.750
And I can get a sense that the 10 million
1063
00:57:21.829 --> 00:57:25.289
figure was probably too low as a goal. And I'm
1064
00:57:25.329 --> 00:57:27.690
not at 10 million yet, but I'm close. So I
1065
00:57:27.730 --> 00:57:30.289
just decided to add a zero just for shits and giggles, right?
1066
00:57:30.289 --> 00:57:35.099
2 million uniques a month, though. I mean, that's quite
1067
00:57:35.139 --> 00:57:37.400
a number. That's hard to do, especially when it probably
1068
00:57:37.420 --> 00:57:42.260
started from a blog that had one reader, I assume. Oh, dude.
1069
00:57:42.960 --> 00:57:45.139
I blogged every day for a year, and at the
1070
00:57:45.159 --> 00:57:47.070
end of a year, I had 1,000 uniques a day.
1071
00:57:47.320 --> 00:57:49.909
I mean, 1,000 visitors a day. I thought it was
1072
00:57:49.929 --> 00:57:51.750
going to be 100,000 when I started. Oh, this will
1073
00:57:51.769 --> 00:57:56.519
be easy. I'll I'll get an audience. It'll be crazy. Well,
1074
00:57:56.539 --> 00:57:58.119
it wasn't.
1075
00:57:58.139 --> 00:58:00.639
I love that part, Mark, because I think there's a
1076
00:58:00.659 --> 00:58:03.920
lot of people that are maybe thinking about doing this
1077
00:58:04.019 --> 00:58:05.980
and they're saying, oh, well, now it's easy for him
1078
00:58:06.000 --> 00:58:08.139
because he's got this huge audience. Well, yeah, but at
1079
00:58:08.260 --> 00:58:10.880
one point there was an audience of one. And it
1080
00:58:10.900 --> 00:58:13.480
took a solid year before you really even had any
1081
00:58:13.539 --> 00:58:18.099
type of traction. And I think sticking with it, understanding–
1082
00:58:18.489 --> 00:58:20.989
the importance of the message and what you believe in
1083
00:58:21.010 --> 00:58:25.309
and consistently learning and improving yourself, then it shows. And
1084
00:58:25.329 --> 00:58:29.489
now it's helping millions of people, which is incredible. For
1085
00:58:29.510 --> 00:58:35.010
the people who don't maybe understand the primal blueprint laws,
1086
00:58:35.110 --> 00:58:37.030
could you share those with me?
1087
00:58:37.050 --> 00:58:40.769
Yeah, sure. I mean, I just have 10 primal blueprint laws.
1088
00:58:40.809 --> 00:58:43.670
These are laws that govern human evolution for millions of years.
1089
00:58:44.230 --> 00:58:47.889
They also, to this day, govern the expectations of our genes.
1090
00:58:47.929 --> 00:58:49.809
Our genes expect us to do certain things. And if
1091
00:58:49.849 --> 00:58:52.329
we don't do those things, we get into trouble. So
1092
00:58:52.650 --> 00:58:55.789
eat lots of plants and animals. Our genes expect us
1093
00:58:55.809 --> 00:58:58.010
to eat plants and animals, not a lot of crap.
1094
00:58:58.050 --> 00:59:03.579
Avoid poisonous things. So clearly, historically, humans avoided toxic berries
1095
00:59:03.659 --> 00:59:07.260
and rotted meat and things like that. But I'm suggesting
1096
00:59:07.280 --> 00:59:11.679
that we avoid the sugars and the all of the additives,
1097
00:59:12.679 --> 00:59:15.800
the artificial sweeteners and all that stuff. Number three, move
1098
00:59:15.860 --> 00:59:18.840
frequently at a slow pace. Every human for millions of
1099
00:59:18.889 --> 00:59:20.949
years moved around a lot all day long. But they
1100
00:59:21.050 --> 00:59:23.210
didn't go out and train for a marathon because that
1101
00:59:23.230 --> 00:59:25.909
would have been antithetical to their existence. It would have
1102
00:59:26.369 --> 00:59:29.550
sucked through way too much energy. So move around a lot.
1103
00:59:29.909 --> 00:59:34.070
at a slow pace. Then lift heavy things twice a week.
1104
00:59:34.630 --> 00:59:38.710
Ancestral humans lifted, you know, stones to build stuff, climbed
1105
00:59:38.750 --> 00:59:42.110
up trees, carried babies, lifted, brought carcasses back to camp.
1106
00:59:42.489 --> 00:59:45.849
We need to replicate that in the gym if that's
1107
00:59:45.869 --> 00:59:48.860
how it works out or at home. Sprint once in
1108
00:59:48.880 --> 00:59:51.539
a while. So once in a while, our ancestors had
1109
00:59:51.579 --> 00:59:56.610
to run like crazy for their lives. And that sprinting
1110
00:59:56.909 --> 00:59:59.389
resulted in a pulse of growth hormone and testosterone and
1111
00:59:59.409 --> 01:00:04.239
a number of other short-term beneficial acute responses. So I
1112
01:00:04.280 --> 01:00:06.219
suggest people find a way to sprint once in a while,
1113
01:00:06.239 --> 01:00:08.239
whether it's on the roads or whether it's on a
1114
01:00:08.280 --> 01:00:10.159
bike or whether it's on an elliptical or whether it's
1115
01:00:10.179 --> 01:00:14.139
in the pool. Number six, get adequate sleep. Sleep is
1116
01:00:14.480 --> 01:00:18.460
really the most overlooked of all the health variables for
1117
01:00:18.500 --> 01:00:21.309
most people. And I'm a big fan of getting at
1118
01:00:21.349 --> 01:00:23.590
least seven and a half up to nine hours of sleep.
1119
01:00:24.150 --> 01:00:27.269
every night. Uh, it, it just, even for, especially for
1120
01:00:27.289 --> 01:00:29.469
a business person, it manifests itself in a lot more
1121
01:00:29.530 --> 01:00:33.139
creativity and productivity. And, you know, uh, the reality is Ryan,
1122
01:00:33.159 --> 01:00:35.840
you know, most business people get all their stuff done
1123
01:00:36.159 --> 01:00:37.659
in an hour to an hour and a half a day.
1124
01:00:37.699 --> 01:00:39.599
And the rest of it is just filler. I'm sorry.
1125
01:00:39.639 --> 01:00:41.159
I don't, I don't, I don't know who you are
1126
01:00:41.179 --> 01:00:42.980
and I don't care who you are, who's listening, but
1127
01:00:43.199 --> 01:00:45.980
the real creative stuff happens in very, very short periods
1128
01:00:46.019 --> 01:00:49.690
of time. Right. Number six, play the human brain was
1129
01:00:49.730 --> 01:00:53.750
designed to To play not just in in in childhood
1130
01:00:54.030 --> 01:00:58.210
and adolescence, but throughout throughout life. It's part of our
1131
01:00:58.550 --> 01:01:04.239
requirement for Strategizing for orchestrating planning and so, you know
1132
01:01:04.280 --> 01:01:07.519
your business plan acumen may be a result of how
1133
01:01:07.579 --> 01:01:10.900
well you play Number eight get adequate sunlight. We talked
1134
01:01:10.920 --> 01:01:14.480
about that vitamin D Critical so people should get sunlight
1135
01:01:14.519 --> 01:01:16.380
not just for their immune system, but for their mood
1136
01:01:17.139 --> 01:01:20.030
number nine avoid stupid mistakes and That's the sort of
1137
01:01:20.090 --> 01:01:22.329
don't smoke, wear your seatbelt, wear a helmet if you're
1138
01:01:22.349 --> 01:01:30.090
riding a bike. Don't go bungee jumping off– when some
1139
01:01:30.130 --> 01:01:33.860
guy is just getting started in the business. Whatever. Avoid
1140
01:01:33.880 --> 01:01:37.940
stupid mistakes. And number ten, use your brain. Learn a language.
1141
01:01:38.579 --> 01:01:41.780
Play a musical instrument. Do puzzles. That's why I do
1142
01:01:41.820 --> 01:01:46.460
the ken-kens and sudokus and crosswords for 15 to 20
1143
01:01:46.460 --> 01:01:47.119
minutes every morning.
1144
01:01:47.940 --> 01:01:48.420
Use your brain.
1145
01:01:48.840 --> 01:01:51.739
In ways that are outside of that business pattern. And
1146
01:01:51.760 --> 01:01:52.590
there's your 10 laws.
1147
01:01:52.820 --> 01:01:54.369
Love it, man. What do you think of, by the way,
1148
01:01:54.409 --> 01:01:56.869
it just came to mind, a stand-up desk for people
1149
01:01:56.889 --> 01:01:57.809
who sit at a desk all day?
1150
01:01:58.489 --> 01:02:00.449
I'm talking to you right now from a stand-up desk.
1151
01:02:00.489 --> 01:02:04.769
I've had it for eight years. It's wonderful. Everybody at
1152
01:02:04.809 --> 01:02:07.349
my office, all my employees have not only a stand-up desk.
1153
01:02:08.309 --> 01:02:09.789
If they want one, they have a tread desk. They
1154
01:02:09.809 --> 01:02:12.130
have a treadmill under their desk where they can walk
1155
01:02:13.159 --> 01:02:14.860
as much as they want. Some people walk eight miles
1156
01:02:14.920 --> 01:02:17.659
a day at 1.7 miles an hour. Now, at that
1157
01:02:17.760 --> 01:02:20.699
low level of walking, you could be on a phone call.
1158
01:02:20.760 --> 01:02:23.190
Nobody knows what you're doing. You could be writing. You
1159
01:02:23.210 --> 01:02:26.329
could be typing. None of it is disrupted. And yet,
1160
01:02:27.010 --> 01:02:29.210
these people are getting enough movement throughout the day that
1161
01:02:29.230 --> 01:02:31.869
they don't have that workout hanging over their head when
1162
01:02:31.909 --> 01:02:35.559
they get home at night. So this is just figuring
1163
01:02:35.619 --> 01:02:39.059
out ways to incorporate all of this stuff into your
1164
01:02:39.099 --> 01:02:41.860
life With ease and grace and not having it be
1165
01:02:41.940 --> 01:02:43.039
drudgery and sacrifice.
1166
01:02:43.300 --> 01:02:45.579
Love it, man. Thank you so much, Mark, for being here,
1167
01:02:45.659 --> 01:02:49.840
sharing your knowledge. I believe, firm believer, the best leaders
1168
01:02:49.860 --> 01:02:53.349
in the world understand, they take the time to understand
1169
01:02:53.389 --> 01:02:56.579
what they put into their body is... more important than
1170
01:02:56.599 --> 01:02:59.320
just about anything else they're going to do. They understand
1171
01:02:59.360 --> 01:03:01.719
the value of their health and what they can do
1172
01:03:01.800 --> 01:03:04.590
to be as healthy as humanly possible. And this is
1173
01:03:04.610 --> 01:03:07.150
what you do. You study and I appreciate you sharing
1174
01:03:07.610 --> 01:03:11.210
with me, Mark. It certainly has had an impact on
1175
01:03:11.389 --> 01:03:14.650
my life. And I really appreciate it. Where would you
1176
01:03:14.690 --> 01:03:16.929
send my listeners to learn more about you online?
1177
01:03:17.590 --> 01:03:20.210
MarksDailyApple.com. That's the place to start.
1178
01:03:20.530 --> 01:03:24.019
MarksDailyApple.com. Thanks again for being here, man. And I definitely
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want to continue this dialogue as we both progress, man.
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I hope to find a way to look like you someday, man.
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Sure. All right. Keep up the good work, Ryan. Take care.
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Thanks, Mark.
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This episode of The Learning Leader Show is over, but
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we have plenty more to keep you locked in until
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next time. Head over to learningleadershow.com for more information and
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01:03:45.530 --> 01:03:50.480
to request your favorite entrepreneur, CEO, world-class athlete, or anyone else.
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01:03:50.380 --> 01:03:51.219
That inspires you.
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You can also talk to Ryan directly by reaching out
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to him on Twitter at RyanHawk12. Thanks again, and we'll
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see you next time on The Learning Leader Show.