00:00:00
Speaker 1: So, obviously, I don't know if you've seen the party, you know, we started off around the World Cup, but I am the failed footballer. Not you guys. Most of the people that, you know what I mean, know me, know that, like, obviously, it's me and it's nice to get on, like, actually, you know, accomplished footballers onto the show. So, yeah, we appreciate you joining us. Let's kick it off, you know, where you are now, you know, tell us about your life in Japan at the moment. You've made the move from the German League to... the J League. How's that transition been for you?
00:00:31
Speaker 2: It's been great, to be honest. Like it's been kind of everything.
00:00:34
Speaker 3: I wanted it to be a real fresh start, I guess, similar to when I left the UK for Germany. I was in a kind of a moment in my life and career where I was looking for something new. And that definitely gave it to me. And I feel very similar about it here, like a totally different style of football, a new league, a new challenge. um yeah just something really fresh in my life so I've really enjoyed it so far it's super competitive league you know I think on the day anyone can kind of beat anyone which is um makes it super exciting as well.
00:01:10
Speaker 1: And what's the lifestyle like over there it's is it I can see the people are friendly you know what's it like for you yeah I love it in comparison to Germany.
00:01:19
Speaker 3: Yes it's it's different of course like it's a total culture shock and and lifestyle change in a lot of ways but I kind of felt the same way.
00:01:28
Speaker 2: Again when I got to Germany.
00:01:29
Speaker 3: I felt all the details, the differences in everyday life from coming from the UK to there was huge and even more so here. But yeah, it was a real kind of– that also played a role in our decision for me and my wife and like our family.
00:01:46
Speaker 2: It was like a chance.
00:01:48
Speaker 3: To experience something completely new and different as well as the footballing aspect that was– Just it's like, listen, everyday life is not completely different. People still do the same things. They, you know, go to work, go to the shops. It's, you know, it's three meals a day. It's nothing like crazy, but it's just all in the details to find the little things. And I'm enjoying learning about all those things. you know little things every day and and you.
00:02:13
Speaker 1: Know and have you learned any japanese out there.
00:02:15
Speaker 3: Yet just like the absolute bare basics to be honest it's it's hard when you've got like i've got a i've got a translator with me and the thing with japanese is that i'm learning as well it's like you can learn school book japanese but that's not how people actually speak to each other you know what i mean like it varies on.
00:02:33
Speaker 2: Who you're speaking to.
00:02:35
Speaker 3: And the context of the conversation and are you speaking to a colleague or someone in a shop or something like, and then the language changes completely. So you can't even, yeah, I think it would take a good chunk of time to get really off to speed with it.
00:02:48
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:02:48
Speaker 1: I wonder if there's different accents in Japanese, like how there are in English.
00:02:53
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:02:54
Speaker 1: Obviously English is such a wild spoken language that like, if you're speaking to someone who's, from Scotland, they're going to speak English completely different to, you know, someone that is American or whatever. I wonder if it's like that with Japanese where like, you know, there's different accents and dialects.
00:03:06
Speaker 2: There must be. It was the same again, like comparing it to Germany.
00:03:09
Speaker 3: I had no idea that there was like such a huge variation in the way that people speak. Obviously after five years, then I can hear it straight away. But the first like year or so when I was there, I had no idea that there was such different dialects and different parts. I remember when I first got to Germany, we had a game down in a place called Heidenheim and And after the game, we actually– my old coach, he stopped us on the bus on the way back from the game at like a kebab shop, like on the high street of like this town. And we got out and there was this bunch of like kids or fans and stuff came up to our players and just started like chatting to.
00:03:42
Speaker 2: Us and stuff, whatever.
00:03:44
Speaker 3: And they walked away and I just turned to one of the boys and I was like, what did he say?
00:03:47
Speaker 2: And the guy was like, absolutely no idea. And he was German. And he was just like not a clue, mate. He could have said anything to me there. So– it can, there is a big spectrum.
00:03:59
Speaker 1: That's funny, man. I love that. Um, and so I just want to talk about a little bit about the, what would you say the standard of football in comparison to, you know, the J league championship, Bundesliga, how would you compare that to, you know, your, your previous football in Germany?
00:04:15
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say like, obviously the Bundesliga is hard to compare to anything. You know, we're talking about one of the top two or three leagues in the world, but in the second link in, um, the second Bundesliga where obviously I played for for three years as well.
00:04:29
Speaker 2: Um, I would say it's very similar.
00:04:31
Speaker 3: It's, um, probably I would say the technical standard in Japan is probably higher, but maybe the kind of tactical and physical aspect of the game is probably stronger in Europe.
00:04:44
Speaker 2: That's my early kind of impression.
00:04:46
Speaker 3: Like here, I would say almost every player is capable of like taking the ball in tight spaces, being able to play out of pressure. Um, very strong in kind of one against one moments with the ball in particular. But I will say in Germany, I would say the football was probably slightly more structured and players play with a lot more discipline.
00:05:09
Speaker 2: I think that's typical of Germany in a lot of ways as well.
00:05:11
Speaker 3: So that's been like my early kind of impression of the league. But the technical standard especially and the dynamic front players here, the level is extremely high. And it's, you know, when players are left in open spaces and in transition moments and stuff, they're so clinical. And that's what, you know, it's a great league. I think it's an exciting league to watch as well. Lots of goals, lots of these moments because of the individual quality that the players have in the front third.
00:05:39
Speaker 1: And that's interesting because I feel like Japan is kind of one of those countries that, especially from a young age, you definitely see all these clips of these young guys that they're, their ball mastery ability and skills is just off the scale. And that obviously translates to their league where you can see that's something that they focus on from a very, very early age, like ball mastery from when you're like 11.
00:06:03
Speaker 2: 12, 13. Yeah, 100%.
00:06:05
Speaker 3: You can see that there's a production line of a certain level certain qualities. It's actually funny because I think in the UK, there is something similar. We used to always say there was always like that perfect academy footballer that teams would produce.
00:06:21
Speaker 2: But it wasn't.
00:06:22
Speaker 3: Always the guy, that kind of perfect player that wasn't always the one that broke through. It was maybe the one that had one particular quality that stood out above the kind of all-round game.
00:06:34
Speaker 2: And I think that's kind of similar to here in a lot of ways.
00:06:35
Speaker 3: You have a lot of players that can do all the basics of the game at a very, very high level. But maybe like someone like me who comes in with a kind of different energy and dynamic kind of physicality to my game in midfield can kind of, it's just a different skill set, I guess. But I would say, as I said, at a baseline level here in Japan, I think the quality is, that technical quality is extremely high.
00:07:02
Speaker 2: Nice.
00:07:03
Speaker 1: And that leads me on to going back to like Australia, you growing up in Australia. I believe you kind of started in Melbourne victory system. You are Victoria, of course. And then you went over to Celtic and then you were kind of loaned out for a few teams. How did that process come about as a kind of a young Australian, you know, trying to make it in football like that's getting to Europe is like? seems so, so far away.
00:07:30
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:07:31
Speaker 1: Um, how was, how was that? How's your, your journey with that?
00:07:35
Speaker 3: So my pathway was like, for most people was kind of had to find my own path. I guess there wasn't really a laid out pathway for me through the Victorian system. You know, I kind of missed out on state team and, um, the kind of, uh, high, like the kind of elite process of that they had kind of to of identifying players. kind of early doors, I kind of missed out on all that VIS, AIS, like that kind of, none of that kind of happened for me.
00:08:04
Speaker 2: I was just playing.
00:08:06
Speaker 3: In the, in the super, like the super league kind of of the under 14s, 15s. And then it was kind of when I hit 16s that, yeah, I made the step to go to Richmond under 21s who are obviously at the NPL and playing in the reserves there. And I kind of was there for a couple of months and, kind of straight away, I was like sitting on the bench. I was only 16.
00:08:26
Speaker 2: I was young.
00:08:27
Speaker 1: At 16, you were on the bench for first team?
00:08:32
Speaker 2: No, for the 21s. Oh, the 21s, 21s.
00:08:34
Speaker 1: Okay, okay.
00:08:35
Speaker 2: For the reserve.
00:08:36
Speaker 1: I was like, that's pretty good.
00:08:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. So like that was like kind of as, yeah, just 15 turning 16. So I was quite young.
00:08:44
Speaker 3: But then I made the decision to leave there and go to Frankston Pines, which was the kind of catalyst for everything that happened for me going to play I leveled down, but I went straight into the first team and played every game and played a.
00:08:58
Speaker 2: Full season of senior football.
00:09:00
Speaker 3: And it was through my coach, Tommy O'Halloran there, whose contact it was at Celtic that I had the chance to go over there and trial. And, you know, I did, I trained with the Melbourne Victory youth team for kind of three months there. at the end of that season and I got, I played one game as like an emergency signing cause they had a load of injuries and stuff, but I was never in that system either. Like I was never part of the, like, you know, I was never really involved with, with victory or anything like that. I was kind of a trained on player.
00:09:29
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:09:30
Speaker 3: I was kind of a trained on player for a few weeks at the end of the NPL season.
00:09:34
Speaker 2: Um, and then, yeah.
00:09:35
Speaker 3: And then it was again, just a bit of luck, like a contact from a, from my coach there. Um, and yeah, the other thing that, um, you know, that you've got to be blessed with is, you know, a supportive family who were fortunate enough to have the resources to be able to, to take me there, to, to have these trials, you know, I'm, that's not lost on me that that's a lot of, a thing that a lot of kids don't have the opportunity to do.
00:09:57
Speaker 2: So, you know, I'm extremely grateful that and recognize.
00:10:01
Speaker 3: That there was a privilege there that I had to be able to even go and have that trial in.
00:10:04
Speaker 2: The first place.
00:10:05
Speaker 1: Do you think the kind of the Australian system at the moment, you know, you just said, like, you kind of slipped through the cracks a little bit there, you know, you weren't really even picked up by an academy, so to speak. So, Do you think the Australian system, the way it's currently built for young players, does allow players to slip through the cracks and not be noticed?
00:10:25
Speaker 2: It's hard to say.
00:10:26
Speaker 3: Obviously, that was nearly, what's that, 18, 17, 18 years ago now.
00:10:33
Speaker 2: So I've got no doubt that the system's changed a lot.
00:10:37
Speaker 3: At that time, there was no younger age groups beyond the A-League first teams and they'd only just introduced the reserve or under 21 23 league kind of at that maybe first one or two years at that time in the youth leagues so i'm sure there's a totally different system there now but what i will say is that i think in any there is no perfect system i think players will always um especially players probably maybe a little bit similar to myself who maybe.
00:11:08
Speaker 2: Don't stand out for.
00:11:11
Speaker 3: You know, for being the cleanest or, I don't know, like I have a different kind of set of qualities as well. And I think that was probably why my pathway was a little bit more different. But what I will say is, yeah, you've got to, there's got to be a time when players that maybe aren't identified in those systems still get an opportunity to kind of move through later. You know, you see it in England, of course, with like the Vardys and these stories that players can crack into those systems later on. But, you know, it is more difficult with, the limited number of teams and options that we have.
00:11:43
Speaker 1: And I also want to talk about your trial in Southwark. And I know you kind of said, you know, you went over there, you did your thing, you ended up getting signed, but that's, it's a pretty big deal. And it's, you know, how old were you at the time?
00:11:53
Speaker 2: 16, 17. Yeah, 16.
00:11:53
Speaker 1: We spoke to, qual last week um and he kind of said like you know his first trial at the professional level he absolutely screwed up um and he had to go out and get a second chance and for you that at that young age going for a trial you know there might be a 17 18 year old listening to this it's got a trial coming up in a couple weeks um do you do you remember any of the steps you took to to kind of help you perform the best or Did you just go out there and say, I'm just going to play how I play and see how it goes?
00:12:27
Speaker 2: 100%. That was my attitude. It was.
00:12:30
Speaker 3: And I think the reason that it went so well for me at that time in particular was because I probably had such low expectations of what I was kind of doing there. I kind of went in without just treating it as like a challenge. an opportunity to, I don't know, to just experience professional football for, for that. It was only a week, a week's trial. And, you know, I got to play two friendly games and it was just, I was treating it more like, oh, this is just an amazing experience. And I kind of went in very relaxed and, played with kind of my own freedom and my own style.
00:13:07
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:13:07
Speaker 3: I didn't try to do anything different to the way I, you know, show them the player that you are, I guess was, was, was always the, and that's been kind of the way I've always approached football and it's the way I've always played. It's, I know kind of who I am as a player and I've never tried to be anything kind of other than that. And that's kind of always been what's worked for me. And I think it even showed even probably in that week that, okay, you know, this again, very raw, um, But they were very happy that there was going to be something there that they could work with. So again, I had such low expectations going into that week.
00:13:46
Speaker 2: But then just to get that chance, it's just amazing.
00:13:51
Speaker 1: So pretty much just don't think about it and just, you know, hope for the worst and pray for the best.
00:13:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, listen, like the biggest thing with these moments is like anything and you just don't want to let it go by you without also enjoying it because it is amazing to get to experience, you know, something like that and a club like Celtic with that. you know, I love the kind of pressure of everything that they did, even in like a, I played in like a friendly game on like a Tuesday night against Partick Thistle or something, you know, like a reserve friendly game. And, but it's like, you know, and it was December, it was like minus five, you know, in, in, you know, in Glasgow. And I've never, I'd never seen like almost never seen Buddy Snow before.
00:14:32
Speaker 2: And there I am in this.
00:14:33
Speaker 3: And, But even in that moment, like playing as a trialist in a friendly game in this, you're still, it's like you're representing, you've got a Celtic shirt on, you have to go out and you have to win that game and you have to perform because that's like, that was the expectation all the time.
00:14:48
Speaker 2: And I loved it. And, you know, I think that was another part of it.
00:14:51
Speaker 3: I think I had that mentality in me as well that they, that they saw, you know, kind of fitted with the, with what they were trying to do.
00:15:00
Speaker 1: I kind of want to touch on, you know, the Socceroos as well. You've been, obviously a pivotal part for the Socceroos for many, many, many years, as long as I've been in Australia anyway. Do you think Australian football has an identity? And if so, what would you say it is?
00:15:19
Speaker 3: I think there's always the Australian football, well, the Socceroos definitely have our clear eye. Like in my experience as the team, our identity is always in the strength of the team. You know, that's always been our, whether we're playing with, whether that was with Ang or with Graham Arnold or now with the boss, like the football style can change, but the identity of the players and the way that we approach the game and everything kind of stays the same. And it allows us to constantly ask questions and be a difficult team for teams to play against, I guess. And that's always been our, been our way. But of course, as someone who's been a part of the top squad for 12, 13 years, well, I've played in different systems under different coaches with very different styles. And I think one quality I will say of Australian footballers that I've always had and experienced as part of the Socceroos is their ability to adapt and take in information and be coachable. That's something that we do extremely well. And that's been something, as I say, that's always kind of helped us being able to, if that's the instruction and that's what the team is trying to do, we all do it together.
00:16:47
Speaker 2: We don't.
00:16:49
Speaker 3: Go off as individuals and try and do our own thing. We really buy into it and go through it together, like whatever that might look like, as I say, in the different formations, different styles.
00:16:58
Speaker 1: And this current crop of socceroos, you know, you're probably, you're the captain, you're quote unquote one of the older heads. I don't think you're one of the older heads. I think you've still got plenty in you, mate. What's it like playing with this younger group, having to mentor them? there's a lot of talent in there, you know, everyone can see, you know, a lot of players playing in top clubs in Europe. What's it like compared to, you know, other groups that you've kind of played for? Do you feel like this group definitely can do something special, you included?
00:17:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, a hundred percent.
00:17:34
Speaker 3: I think I've always got belief in this, in the team, no matter the, And that's been all the way through whoever, whichever players we've had. But of course, we'll say the level that the young players we've got at the moment that they're hitting it domestically already is something that we haven't seen for a very long time. To have a crop at once who have kind of all taken such a big step in such a short space of time, which is hugely impressive. And it's for them to bring that level to the national team is only going to make the team consistently stronger. It's what we need to have, you know, to be competitive at the top end of Asia and, of course, on the world stage where we want to be at our most competitive. And these players, what I will say, and it's a word I've used over the last probably a few months around the World Cup and, you know, talking about these guys, is just the fearlessness. It's probably their....
00:18:33
Speaker 2: Most identifiable quality as a group of players.
00:18:37
Speaker 3: You know, when I, comparing it to when I came through at that age, at 20, 21, one of my first few camps and even, you know, as a 23, 24 year old going to, you know, 24, 25, going into the Russia World Cup and around that age, I wasn't, definitely wasn't, didn't play with fear, but I will say I definitely had a weight of what, you know, being a Socceroos player meant and being in part of a national team and the players I was there with.
00:19:05
Speaker 2: And I.
00:19:07
Speaker 3: Always kind of, it's, it felt like not again, I don't think the pressure ever affected performance, but I felt it all the time. I felt the, and I feel like not that they don't understand the pressure or the level of what they're at, but I think they do it so naturally and so comfortably already that you can see that there's a freedom in the way that they.
00:19:27
Speaker 2: Express themselves on the pitch that they, They don't feel that.
00:19:32
Speaker 3: And I think that's something that can only be put down to their mentality, which is, as I said, has shown that they can already progress.
00:19:42
Speaker 1: It's such an interesting point. And that fearlessness is, you can definitely see it in the players, you know, Toure, Nestor. Valpar, you can see that they're willing to go out there and take risks and do whatever they can to try and win. That's really cool. I want to just also touch on the World Cup a little bit. Now that the World Cup's finished and you've had a chance to kind of look back at, you know, the great moments you guys had and also the like, you know, the defeat going out. What is your overarching, you know, thought with how the World Cup actually went when you've taken a step back and it's not so fresh?
00:20:22
Speaker 2: For me, it will always.
00:20:23
Speaker 1: Because it's different when you're in it. 100%, 100%.
00:20:25
Speaker 3: And, you know, the raw emotions at the end of it as well, the disappointment and heartbreak that comes in the immediate time after, you know, your tournament comes to an end. it's uh it's such a unique experience the world cup having you know very fortunate enough to have been to three when you you go this through the build-up process and everything that comes with that and the the slow burn of expectation and understanding of the magnitude and gravity of it all and then as i say you you hit this peak as you come through the tournament and then the crash at the end of it. And it doesn't matter how you go out, whether you, you know, in any way, whether you in Russia where you don't win a game and you go out in the group stage or, you know, you take it to the 94th minute against Argentina or if it's on penalties, like the heartbreak, you still have that crash at the end of it.
00:21:18
Speaker 2: Because of the, you know, of what you've invested emotionally. Yeah.
00:21:23
Speaker 1: It's almost like this huge adrenaline build up to for years.
00:21:27
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:21:27
Speaker 1: And then it's like, it's, it's over. And then you'll, you'll, you'll, probably can't actually process that it's finished. Cause it's such a big buildup, you know, and psychologically definitely could take a toll on some players.
00:21:39
Speaker 2: A hundred percent. And it does.
00:21:40
Speaker 3: And I've been, you know, I've had, I've had the physical and emotional crashes and big extremes, you know, after, um, you know, after, uh, Qatar, like I got like the most ill I've ever been in like my whole life, like in like a week or two afterwards, because I think I was just so empty. um you know at the end of it it was just like what you put into it emotionally it just came out and the way that that reaction was was was like a physical one you know like my body just like kind of broke down and and this time around it was definitely more of like an emotional one i remember you know watching as the tournament progressed and and watching games further down the line it really hits you like what you were a part of and yeah we you know it's it doesn't it feels surreal when you're sitting in a in a pub, you know, when you're two weeks off season watching the quarterfinal and, you know, you sit next to a guy and you're talking about the tournament and you're like, it doesn't really make sense in your brain.
00:22:43
Speaker 1: I was literally just there.
00:22:45
Speaker 2: I was just there.
00:22:45
Speaker 3: And, um, but you know, when you do reflect on it, the first thing that will always be pride for me, like I know, those players so intimately well and being in that dressing room and being in that environment I know what they invested and I know what what what it meant and you know there's no as I said there's no easy way to lose a game or to exit a major tournament but the big the big feeling once you have the emotional comedown for me is definitely pride because it was such a we can't of course we all want more.
00:23:24
Speaker 2: We all want more. We all want to see us.
00:23:25
Speaker 3: Go and win that knockout game and go to the next stage and, and keep pushing, you know, the national team further than we've ever gone before. You know, I still want to be a part of a team that pushes us further than we ever can ever go, but you still have to reflect on the achievement of what it was. And for us to be playing knockout football on the world stages is something that, you know, we've only ever done three times and it's, there is something to be very proud of in that as well.
00:23:51
Speaker 1: Definitely something to be proud of. Do you think Australians, and I say this because I cover football when the World Cup's not around. I follow Australian talent locally and abroad as well. Do you think Australians only kind of appreciate the Socceroos when there's a big tournament coming around and everyone tunes in and everyone's cheering you guys on now and it's like, all right, And then as soon as it finishes, everyone's like, oh, well, see you in another four years. Do you think Aussies really appreciate the Socceroos that much? I don't know if they do.
00:24:25
Speaker 3: I think they do probably in a different way to the way we see it in other countries. You know, we love Australians by nature. We love the big stage. You know, we love the Olympics. We love the, you.
00:24:41
Speaker 2: Know, I don't know, the Olympics.
00:24:43
Speaker 3: The Grand Slams, it's all about the big show. I think the biggest thing that we struggle to capture in Australian football is the grind.
00:24:54
Speaker 2: The week-to-week, the suffering.
00:24:57
Speaker 3: Because that's what it is to be a football fan. That's what it is to love a team, to be emotionally invested. It's to suffer. You have to go through that. the hard times, the grind. And I know there was so, you saw it in 05 with that outpour of emotion when we finally got there, because there were so many people who had been through that grind for so long and so much disappointment. And then when you get to experience the moments of joy, it sends them to a different level. And I think it's a tough thing to ask people to always to give you that emotion, to give you that investment. But we need to give them something to invest in. And I'm constantly and always striving to be a part of a group that can inspire that in people. They want to see the best players, of course, but You know, we also want to give them an emotion to capture something within them that makes them come to every qualifier in the first round qualifying when you're playing against low-ranked teams. And, you know, when we need that, you know, we need them out there with us every week. But you can definitely feel as it builds through that four-year cycle when that The fans are there and the feeling is there and they'll always be there on the big stage when we're there.
00:26:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, I definitely think you guys are definitely inspiring the next generation and definitely capturing, you know, when we look back on it, we definitely saw some performances that we were like, wow, you know, there's some players that. Everyone's going to remember for the next four years. Everyone's going to be following for the next four years. And we'll definitely be, you know, along that journey. Also, I wanted to get your thoughts on who do you think the most underrated Australian football player is ever?
00:26:53
Speaker 3: It's like not even, don't even have to think about it.
00:26:57
Speaker 2: He's the most underrated.
00:27:00
Speaker 3: I think it's only been in the last 12 months when he's had a couple of these real individual moments, like scoring the goal against Japan and winning as captain for Melbourne City. But this guy has been doing that non-stop for over a decade. He's been the most reliable player, the most consistent player, in this team.
00:27:27
Speaker 1: And why do you think people kind of might overlook him or not, not overlook him, but underrate him, so to speak, or not notice him because maybe position of the left back or that kind of thing.
00:27:36
Speaker 2: It's not the most fullbacks, not the most glamorous position on the pitch. That's for sure.
00:27:40
Speaker 3: And, um, you know, but his, you know, yeah, I think it's just his tenacity and his, just as I say, his desire to every single game.
00:27:51
Speaker 2: To produce a certain level of performance.
00:27:53
Speaker 3: And I also say, over the last 10 years, the amount of players and competition and things that could easily have pushed a player out of the team, he's fought through and seen through. Asian Cup winner, three World Cups. For me, I think he's fifth or sixth all-time capped soccerer, and I still don't think a lot of people would even put him near an all-time soccerer's 11th. where I think he should go straight into that spot for me. That's, that's why for me, for sure.
00:28:31
Speaker 2: That's, that's him.
00:28:32
Speaker 1: We've got to give him his flowers. Now we're giving him his flowers, man. We'll give him flowers. We'll definitely put this up and give him his flowers for sure. We appreciate that. Uh, just, just to, um, um, cap things off. I'm a, I'm a big fashion guy. Um, and I can see you are too. And I'm just, I'm always, I'm inspired by the kind of the way you dress and like, where you get your teas and it just, it's so cool. Like where, where does that, um, like that fashion kind of come from, um, from you? Is it just being from Melbourne and just swaggy from Melbourne? Is that what it is?
00:29:01
Speaker 2: Uh, definitely not. Um, I definitely wasn't, didn't exist in me when I was young.
00:29:06
Speaker 3: Like, I think I was, I remember actually like when I was about 15, probably literally like 15 or 16, I'm getting invited to like, you know, when you go on like high school parties, um, and stuff like that and my mom literally in my being like to me no like we have to take you shopping like we have to take you to like general pants or something and get you like some jeans because i think i only wore football tops and like shorts like most.
00:29:28
Speaker 1: Of my that's a sign of a ball.
00:29:30
Speaker 3: Like for my whole childhood like up until my teens hundred like really i didn't wear anything else and what i will say it's probably my interest in music that was kind of the catalyst for me finding that combination between football culture, music, the music scene. Um, you can probably like with my hair and my tattoos and the kind of people who've always inspired my kind of style.
00:29:53
Speaker 1: You ran a radio station.
00:29:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. I had a show on a.
00:29:58
Speaker 1: Music radio station. Tell us about that.
00:30:00
Speaker 2: It's cool.
00:30:01
Speaker 3: Yeah. I had a radio show in, um, in Germany for the last couple of years. Um, where basically I get my hour slot once a month and I could play whatever I wanted total. you know, creative freedom, nothing to talk about football, not, you know, just really focus on another passion and play music that I was listening to. If it was like a gig that I'd been at, that a band that I saw or someone I was going to see something, you know, try and have something that was personal that I had a kind of connection to.
00:30:31
Speaker 2: And it was great. And something I still want to keep.
00:30:34
Speaker 3: Doing, you know, luckily now digitally, you can kind of do a lot of things from remotely.
00:30:41
Speaker 2: And I want to keep sharing that side of myself as well.
00:30:45
Speaker 3: Because I think I've connected with so many people and people love having another side of, you know, it connects football to other parts of the community as well. And music's definitely been that side for me when it came to fashion and everything else that comes with it.
00:31:01
Speaker 1: And would you say, like, is that something away from football that is kind of like your passion or your, not your getaway, but just something you can use to escape the footballing world, so to speak? Or, you know, because when you're a footballer, it's football, football, football, football, football, you know? And it's like, I always say you need to find something else that, you can kind of base your self-worth off that isn't just football. Do you know what I mean? Would you say kind of that music fashion is kind of that for you?
00:31:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly what you just said.
00:31:32
Speaker 3: I think the way you described it is how I describe it, which is it's like my balance. It's the thing that offsets everything. everything that I have in the football world. And it's been the same since I was a kid. I've played guitar since I was at school and I played in bands and I probably spent as much time because I wasn't part of elite academies training four or five nights a week. I probably spent as much time playing music that I did playing football kind of through my childhood. And it was always the, yeah, the, the kind of counterweight to the kind of intensity and emotion that football brings out in me, which, you know, a lot of people know I'm very kind of relaxed person, but I kind of, there's a different intensity inside to me that comes from, from football and it's impossible to exist at that, at that, um, in those emotions all the time, you need that something that can, that can offset it. And obviously your family is the first thing that does that for you for it. I'm sure that's the same for everyone, but you need to have your own passions and creative outlets and, music's definitely been that for me throughout my life.
00:32:39
Speaker 1: That's good to know. Thank you for that. I think we'll wrap it up then. We really appreciate you, you know, taking your time out of your day to, you know, speak to us. Hopefully next time you're, you know, I think Socceroos wins the next Socceroos game. They've got one, isn't that one against Brazil? Is that one against Brazil?
00:32:56
Speaker 2: Is that coming up? Yeah.
00:32:57
Speaker 1: We might have to take a trip down there and I think I'll try and come to the game anyway. We might get to see you there.
00:33:02
Speaker 2: Awesome, man. Yeah, fingers crossed there.
00:33:06
Speaker 3: Selection is never a guarantee, but fingers crossed I'll be there in Brisbane next week.
00:33:11
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, no, I think you should be in the squad. We should see you there.
00:33:15
Speaker 2: Never take it for granted.
00:33:16
Speaker 1: You never know.
00:33:17
Speaker 2: Never take it for granted.
00:33:18
Speaker 1: I think there'll be an uproar if you're not in the squad, but no, thank you so much. We appreciate it and we'll continue to follow your journey and wish you all the best.
00:33:28
Speaker 2: Cheers, mate. Appreciate it.
Speaker 1: So, obviously, I don't know if you've seen the party, you know, we started off around the World Cup, but I am the failed footballer. Not you guys. Most of the people that, you know what I mean, know me, know that, like, obviously, it's me and it's nice to get on, like, actually, you know, accomplished footballers onto the show. So, yeah, we appreciate you joining us. Let's kick it off, you know, where you are now, you know, tell us about your life in Japan at the moment. You've made the move from the German League to... the J League. How's that transition been for you?
00:00:31
Speaker 2: It's been great, to be honest. Like it's been kind of everything.
00:00:34
Speaker 3: I wanted it to be a real fresh start, I guess, similar to when I left the UK for Germany. I was in a kind of a moment in my life and career where I was looking for something new. And that definitely gave it to me. And I feel very similar about it here, like a totally different style of football, a new league, a new challenge. um yeah just something really fresh in my life so I've really enjoyed it so far it's super competitive league you know I think on the day anyone can kind of beat anyone which is um makes it super exciting as well.
00:01:10
Speaker 1: And what's the lifestyle like over there it's is it I can see the people are friendly you know what's it like for you yeah I love it in comparison to Germany.
00:01:19
Speaker 3: Yes it's it's different of course like it's a total culture shock and and lifestyle change in a lot of ways but I kind of felt the same way.
00:01:28
Speaker 2: Again when I got to Germany.
00:01:29
Speaker 3: I felt all the details, the differences in everyday life from coming from the UK to there was huge and even more so here. But yeah, it was a real kind of– that also played a role in our decision for me and my wife and like our family.
00:01:46
Speaker 2: It was like a chance.
00:01:48
Speaker 3: To experience something completely new and different as well as the footballing aspect that was– Just it's like, listen, everyday life is not completely different. People still do the same things. They, you know, go to work, go to the shops. It's, you know, it's three meals a day. It's nothing like crazy, but it's just all in the details to find the little things. And I'm enjoying learning about all those things. you know little things every day and and you.
00:02:13
Speaker 1: Know and have you learned any japanese out there.
00:02:15
Speaker 3: Yet just like the absolute bare basics to be honest it's it's hard when you've got like i've got a i've got a translator with me and the thing with japanese is that i'm learning as well it's like you can learn school book japanese but that's not how people actually speak to each other you know what i mean like it varies on.
00:02:33
Speaker 2: Who you're speaking to.
00:02:35
Speaker 3: And the context of the conversation and are you speaking to a colleague or someone in a shop or something like, and then the language changes completely. So you can't even, yeah, I think it would take a good chunk of time to get really off to speed with it.
00:02:48
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:02:48
Speaker 1: I wonder if there's different accents in Japanese, like how there are in English.
00:02:53
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:02:54
Speaker 1: Obviously English is such a wild spoken language that like, if you're speaking to someone who's, from Scotland, they're going to speak English completely different to, you know, someone that is American or whatever. I wonder if it's like that with Japanese where like, you know, there's different accents and dialects.
00:03:06
Speaker 2: There must be. It was the same again, like comparing it to Germany.
00:03:09
Speaker 3: I had no idea that there was like such a huge variation in the way that people speak. Obviously after five years, then I can hear it straight away. But the first like year or so when I was there, I had no idea that there was such different dialects and different parts. I remember when I first got to Germany, we had a game down in a place called Heidenheim and And after the game, we actually– my old coach, he stopped us on the bus on the way back from the game at like a kebab shop, like on the high street of like this town. And we got out and there was this bunch of like kids or fans and stuff came up to our players and just started like chatting to.
00:03:42
Speaker 2: Us and stuff, whatever.
00:03:44
Speaker 3: And they walked away and I just turned to one of the boys and I was like, what did he say?
00:03:47
Speaker 2: And the guy was like, absolutely no idea. And he was German. And he was just like not a clue, mate. He could have said anything to me there. So– it can, there is a big spectrum.
00:03:59
Speaker 1: That's funny, man. I love that. Um, and so I just want to talk about a little bit about the, what would you say the standard of football in comparison to, you know, the J league championship, Bundesliga, how would you compare that to, you know, your, your previous football in Germany?
00:04:15
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say like, obviously the Bundesliga is hard to compare to anything. You know, we're talking about one of the top two or three leagues in the world, but in the second link in, um, the second Bundesliga where obviously I played for for three years as well.
00:04:29
Speaker 2: Um, I would say it's very similar.
00:04:31
Speaker 3: It's, um, probably I would say the technical standard in Japan is probably higher, but maybe the kind of tactical and physical aspect of the game is probably stronger in Europe.
00:04:44
Speaker 2: That's my early kind of impression.
00:04:46
Speaker 3: Like here, I would say almost every player is capable of like taking the ball in tight spaces, being able to play out of pressure. Um, very strong in kind of one against one moments with the ball in particular. But I will say in Germany, I would say the football was probably slightly more structured and players play with a lot more discipline.
00:05:09
Speaker 2: I think that's typical of Germany in a lot of ways as well.
00:05:11
Speaker 3: So that's been like my early kind of impression of the league. But the technical standard especially and the dynamic front players here, the level is extremely high. And it's, you know, when players are left in open spaces and in transition moments and stuff, they're so clinical. And that's what, you know, it's a great league. I think it's an exciting league to watch as well. Lots of goals, lots of these moments because of the individual quality that the players have in the front third.
00:05:39
Speaker 1: And that's interesting because I feel like Japan is kind of one of those countries that, especially from a young age, you definitely see all these clips of these young guys that they're, their ball mastery ability and skills is just off the scale. And that obviously translates to their league where you can see that's something that they focus on from a very, very early age, like ball mastery from when you're like 11.
00:06:03
Speaker 2: 12, 13. Yeah, 100%.
00:06:05
Speaker 3: You can see that there's a production line of a certain level certain qualities. It's actually funny because I think in the UK, there is something similar. We used to always say there was always like that perfect academy footballer that teams would produce.
00:06:21
Speaker 2: But it wasn't.
00:06:22
Speaker 3: Always the guy, that kind of perfect player that wasn't always the one that broke through. It was maybe the one that had one particular quality that stood out above the kind of all-round game.
00:06:34
Speaker 2: And I think that's kind of similar to here in a lot of ways.
00:06:35
Speaker 3: You have a lot of players that can do all the basics of the game at a very, very high level. But maybe like someone like me who comes in with a kind of different energy and dynamic kind of physicality to my game in midfield can kind of, it's just a different skill set, I guess. But I would say, as I said, at a baseline level here in Japan, I think the quality is, that technical quality is extremely high.
00:07:02
Speaker 2: Nice.
00:07:03
Speaker 1: And that leads me on to going back to like Australia, you growing up in Australia. I believe you kind of started in Melbourne victory system. You are Victoria, of course. And then you went over to Celtic and then you were kind of loaned out for a few teams. How did that process come about as a kind of a young Australian, you know, trying to make it in football like that's getting to Europe is like? seems so, so far away.
00:07:30
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:07:31
Speaker 1: Um, how was, how was that? How's your, your journey with that?
00:07:35
Speaker 3: So my pathway was like, for most people was kind of had to find my own path. I guess there wasn't really a laid out pathway for me through the Victorian system. You know, I kind of missed out on state team and, um, the kind of, uh, high, like the kind of elite process of that they had kind of to of identifying players. kind of early doors, I kind of missed out on all that VIS, AIS, like that kind of, none of that kind of happened for me.
00:08:04
Speaker 2: I was just playing.
00:08:06
Speaker 3: In the, in the super, like the super league kind of of the under 14s, 15s. And then it was kind of when I hit 16s that, yeah, I made the step to go to Richmond under 21s who are obviously at the NPL and playing in the reserves there. And I kind of was there for a couple of months and, kind of straight away, I was like sitting on the bench. I was only 16.
00:08:26
Speaker 2: I was young.
00:08:27
Speaker 1: At 16, you were on the bench for first team?
00:08:32
Speaker 2: No, for the 21s. Oh, the 21s, 21s.
00:08:34
Speaker 1: Okay, okay.
00:08:35
Speaker 2: For the reserve.
00:08:36
Speaker 1: I was like, that's pretty good.
00:08:37
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah. So like that was like kind of as, yeah, just 15 turning 16. So I was quite young.
00:08:44
Speaker 3: But then I made the decision to leave there and go to Frankston Pines, which was the kind of catalyst for everything that happened for me going to play I leveled down, but I went straight into the first team and played every game and played a.
00:08:58
Speaker 2: Full season of senior football.
00:09:00
Speaker 3: And it was through my coach, Tommy O'Halloran there, whose contact it was at Celtic that I had the chance to go over there and trial. And, you know, I did, I trained with the Melbourne Victory youth team for kind of three months there. at the end of that season and I got, I played one game as like an emergency signing cause they had a load of injuries and stuff, but I was never in that system either. Like I was never part of the, like, you know, I was never really involved with, with victory or anything like that. I was kind of a trained on player.
00:09:29
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:09:30
Speaker 3: I was kind of a trained on player for a few weeks at the end of the NPL season.
00:09:34
Speaker 2: Um, and then, yeah.
00:09:35
Speaker 3: And then it was again, just a bit of luck, like a contact from a, from my coach there. Um, and yeah, the other thing that, um, you know, that you've got to be blessed with is, you know, a supportive family who were fortunate enough to have the resources to be able to, to take me there, to, to have these trials, you know, I'm, that's not lost on me that that's a lot of, a thing that a lot of kids don't have the opportunity to do.
00:09:57
Speaker 2: So, you know, I'm extremely grateful that and recognize.
00:10:01
Speaker 3: That there was a privilege there that I had to be able to even go and have that trial in.
00:10:04
Speaker 2: The first place.
00:10:05
Speaker 1: Do you think the kind of the Australian system at the moment, you know, you just said, like, you kind of slipped through the cracks a little bit there, you know, you weren't really even picked up by an academy, so to speak. So, Do you think the Australian system, the way it's currently built for young players, does allow players to slip through the cracks and not be noticed?
00:10:25
Speaker 2: It's hard to say.
00:10:26
Speaker 3: Obviously, that was nearly, what's that, 18, 17, 18 years ago now.
00:10:33
Speaker 2: So I've got no doubt that the system's changed a lot.
00:10:37
Speaker 3: At that time, there was no younger age groups beyond the A-League first teams and they'd only just introduced the reserve or under 21 23 league kind of at that maybe first one or two years at that time in the youth leagues so i'm sure there's a totally different system there now but what i will say is that i think in any there is no perfect system i think players will always um especially players probably maybe a little bit similar to myself who maybe.
00:11:08
Speaker 2: Don't stand out for.
00:11:11
Speaker 3: You know, for being the cleanest or, I don't know, like I have a different kind of set of qualities as well. And I think that was probably why my pathway was a little bit more different. But what I will say is, yeah, you've got to, there's got to be a time when players that maybe aren't identified in those systems still get an opportunity to kind of move through later. You know, you see it in England, of course, with like the Vardys and these stories that players can crack into those systems later on. But, you know, it is more difficult with, the limited number of teams and options that we have.
00:11:43
Speaker 1: And I also want to talk about your trial in Southwark. And I know you kind of said, you know, you went over there, you did your thing, you ended up getting signed, but that's, it's a pretty big deal. And it's, you know, how old were you at the time?
00:11:53
Speaker 2: 16, 17. Yeah, 16.
00:11:53
Speaker 1: We spoke to, qual last week um and he kind of said like you know his first trial at the professional level he absolutely screwed up um and he had to go out and get a second chance and for you that at that young age going for a trial you know there might be a 17 18 year old listening to this it's got a trial coming up in a couple weeks um do you do you remember any of the steps you took to to kind of help you perform the best or Did you just go out there and say, I'm just going to play how I play and see how it goes?
00:12:27
Speaker 2: 100%. That was my attitude. It was.
00:12:30
Speaker 3: And I think the reason that it went so well for me at that time in particular was because I probably had such low expectations of what I was kind of doing there. I kind of went in without just treating it as like a challenge. an opportunity to, I don't know, to just experience professional football for, for that. It was only a week, a week's trial. And, you know, I got to play two friendly games and it was just, I was treating it more like, oh, this is just an amazing experience. And I kind of went in very relaxed and, played with kind of my own freedom and my own style.
00:13:07
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:13:07
Speaker 3: I didn't try to do anything different to the way I, you know, show them the player that you are, I guess was, was, was always the, and that's been kind of the way I've always approached football and it's the way I've always played. It's, I know kind of who I am as a player and I've never tried to be anything kind of other than that. And that's kind of always been what's worked for me. And I think it even showed even probably in that week that, okay, you know, this again, very raw, um, But they were very happy that there was going to be something there that they could work with. So again, I had such low expectations going into that week.
00:13:46
Speaker 2: But then just to get that chance, it's just amazing.
00:13:51
Speaker 1: So pretty much just don't think about it and just, you know, hope for the worst and pray for the best.
00:13:56
Speaker 3: Yeah, listen, like the biggest thing with these moments is like anything and you just don't want to let it go by you without also enjoying it because it is amazing to get to experience, you know, something like that and a club like Celtic with that. you know, I love the kind of pressure of everything that they did, even in like a, I played in like a friendly game on like a Tuesday night against Partick Thistle or something, you know, like a reserve friendly game. And, but it's like, you know, and it was December, it was like minus five, you know, in, in, you know, in Glasgow. And I've never, I'd never seen like almost never seen Buddy Snow before.
00:14:32
Speaker 2: And there I am in this.
00:14:33
Speaker 3: And, But even in that moment, like playing as a trialist in a friendly game in this, you're still, it's like you're representing, you've got a Celtic shirt on, you have to go out and you have to win that game and you have to perform because that's like, that was the expectation all the time.
00:14:48
Speaker 2: And I loved it. And, you know, I think that was another part of it.
00:14:51
Speaker 3: I think I had that mentality in me as well that they, that they saw, you know, kind of fitted with the, with what they were trying to do.
00:15:00
Speaker 1: I kind of want to touch on, you know, the Socceroos as well. You've been, obviously a pivotal part for the Socceroos for many, many, many years, as long as I've been in Australia anyway. Do you think Australian football has an identity? And if so, what would you say it is?
00:15:19
Speaker 3: I think there's always the Australian football, well, the Socceroos definitely have our clear eye. Like in my experience as the team, our identity is always in the strength of the team. You know, that's always been our, whether we're playing with, whether that was with Ang or with Graham Arnold or now with the boss, like the football style can change, but the identity of the players and the way that we approach the game and everything kind of stays the same. And it allows us to constantly ask questions and be a difficult team for teams to play against, I guess. And that's always been our, been our way. But of course, as someone who's been a part of the top squad for 12, 13 years, well, I've played in different systems under different coaches with very different styles. And I think one quality I will say of Australian footballers that I've always had and experienced as part of the Socceroos is their ability to adapt and take in information and be coachable. That's something that we do extremely well. And that's been something, as I say, that's always kind of helped us being able to, if that's the instruction and that's what the team is trying to do, we all do it together.
00:16:47
Speaker 2: We don't.
00:16:49
Speaker 3: Go off as individuals and try and do our own thing. We really buy into it and go through it together, like whatever that might look like, as I say, in the different formations, different styles.
00:16:58
Speaker 1: And this current crop of socceroos, you know, you're probably, you're the captain, you're quote unquote one of the older heads. I don't think you're one of the older heads. I think you've still got plenty in you, mate. What's it like playing with this younger group, having to mentor them? there's a lot of talent in there, you know, everyone can see, you know, a lot of players playing in top clubs in Europe. What's it like compared to, you know, other groups that you've kind of played for? Do you feel like this group definitely can do something special, you included?
00:17:33
Speaker 2: Yeah, a hundred percent.
00:17:34
Speaker 3: I think I've always got belief in this, in the team, no matter the, And that's been all the way through whoever, whichever players we've had. But of course, we'll say the level that the young players we've got at the moment that they're hitting it domestically already is something that we haven't seen for a very long time. To have a crop at once who have kind of all taken such a big step in such a short space of time, which is hugely impressive. And it's for them to bring that level to the national team is only going to make the team consistently stronger. It's what we need to have, you know, to be competitive at the top end of Asia and, of course, on the world stage where we want to be at our most competitive. And these players, what I will say, and it's a word I've used over the last probably a few months around the World Cup and, you know, talking about these guys, is just the fearlessness. It's probably their....
00:18:33
Speaker 2: Most identifiable quality as a group of players.
00:18:37
Speaker 3: You know, when I, comparing it to when I came through at that age, at 20, 21, one of my first few camps and even, you know, as a 23, 24 year old going to, you know, 24, 25, going into the Russia World Cup and around that age, I wasn't, definitely wasn't, didn't play with fear, but I will say I definitely had a weight of what, you know, being a Socceroos player meant and being in part of a national team and the players I was there with.
00:19:05
Speaker 2: And I.
00:19:07
Speaker 3: Always kind of, it's, it felt like not again, I don't think the pressure ever affected performance, but I felt it all the time. I felt the, and I feel like not that they don't understand the pressure or the level of what they're at, but I think they do it so naturally and so comfortably already that you can see that there's a freedom in the way that they.
00:19:27
Speaker 2: Express themselves on the pitch that they, They don't feel that.
00:19:32
Speaker 3: And I think that's something that can only be put down to their mentality, which is, as I said, has shown that they can already progress.
00:19:42
Speaker 1: It's such an interesting point. And that fearlessness is, you can definitely see it in the players, you know, Toure, Nestor. Valpar, you can see that they're willing to go out there and take risks and do whatever they can to try and win. That's really cool. I want to just also touch on the World Cup a little bit. Now that the World Cup's finished and you've had a chance to kind of look back at, you know, the great moments you guys had and also the like, you know, the defeat going out. What is your overarching, you know, thought with how the World Cup actually went when you've taken a step back and it's not so fresh?
00:20:22
Speaker 2: For me, it will always.
00:20:23
Speaker 1: Because it's different when you're in it. 100%, 100%.
00:20:25
Speaker 3: And, you know, the raw emotions at the end of it as well, the disappointment and heartbreak that comes in the immediate time after, you know, your tournament comes to an end. it's uh it's such a unique experience the world cup having you know very fortunate enough to have been to three when you you go this through the build-up process and everything that comes with that and the the slow burn of expectation and understanding of the magnitude and gravity of it all and then as i say you you hit this peak as you come through the tournament and then the crash at the end of it. And it doesn't matter how you go out, whether you, you know, in any way, whether you in Russia where you don't win a game and you go out in the group stage or, you know, you take it to the 94th minute against Argentina or if it's on penalties, like the heartbreak, you still have that crash at the end of it.
00:21:18
Speaker 2: Because of the, you know, of what you've invested emotionally. Yeah.
00:21:23
Speaker 1: It's almost like this huge adrenaline build up to for years.
00:21:27
Speaker 2: Yeah.
00:21:27
Speaker 1: And then it's like, it's, it's over. And then you'll, you'll, you'll, probably can't actually process that it's finished. Cause it's such a big buildup, you know, and psychologically definitely could take a toll on some players.
00:21:39
Speaker 2: A hundred percent. And it does.
00:21:40
Speaker 3: And I've been, you know, I've had, I've had the physical and emotional crashes and big extremes, you know, after, um, you know, after, uh, Qatar, like I got like the most ill I've ever been in like my whole life, like in like a week or two afterwards, because I think I was just so empty. um you know at the end of it it was just like what you put into it emotionally it just came out and the way that that reaction was was was like a physical one you know like my body just like kind of broke down and and this time around it was definitely more of like an emotional one i remember you know watching as the tournament progressed and and watching games further down the line it really hits you like what you were a part of and yeah we you know it's it doesn't it feels surreal when you're sitting in a in a pub, you know, when you're two weeks off season watching the quarterfinal and, you know, you sit next to a guy and you're talking about the tournament and you're like, it doesn't really make sense in your brain.
00:22:43
Speaker 1: I was literally just there.
00:22:45
Speaker 2: I was just there.
00:22:45
Speaker 3: And, um, but you know, when you do reflect on it, the first thing that will always be pride for me, like I know, those players so intimately well and being in that dressing room and being in that environment I know what they invested and I know what what what it meant and you know there's no as I said there's no easy way to lose a game or to exit a major tournament but the big the big feeling once you have the emotional comedown for me is definitely pride because it was such a we can't of course we all want more.
00:23:24
Speaker 2: We all want more. We all want to see us.
00:23:25
Speaker 3: Go and win that knockout game and go to the next stage and, and keep pushing, you know, the national team further than we've ever gone before. You know, I still want to be a part of a team that pushes us further than we ever can ever go, but you still have to reflect on the achievement of what it was. And for us to be playing knockout football on the world stages is something that, you know, we've only ever done three times and it's, there is something to be very proud of in that as well.
00:23:51
Speaker 1: Definitely something to be proud of. Do you think Australians, and I say this because I cover football when the World Cup's not around. I follow Australian talent locally and abroad as well. Do you think Australians only kind of appreciate the Socceroos when there's a big tournament coming around and everyone tunes in and everyone's cheering you guys on now and it's like, all right, And then as soon as it finishes, everyone's like, oh, well, see you in another four years. Do you think Aussies really appreciate the Socceroos that much? I don't know if they do.
00:24:25
Speaker 3: I think they do probably in a different way to the way we see it in other countries. You know, we love Australians by nature. We love the big stage. You know, we love the Olympics. We love the, you.
00:24:41
Speaker 2: Know, I don't know, the Olympics.
00:24:43
Speaker 3: The Grand Slams, it's all about the big show. I think the biggest thing that we struggle to capture in Australian football is the grind.
00:24:54
Speaker 2: The week-to-week, the suffering.
00:24:57
Speaker 3: Because that's what it is to be a football fan. That's what it is to love a team, to be emotionally invested. It's to suffer. You have to go through that. the hard times, the grind. And I know there was so, you saw it in 05 with that outpour of emotion when we finally got there, because there were so many people who had been through that grind for so long and so much disappointment. And then when you get to experience the moments of joy, it sends them to a different level. And I think it's a tough thing to ask people to always to give you that emotion, to give you that investment. But we need to give them something to invest in. And I'm constantly and always striving to be a part of a group that can inspire that in people. They want to see the best players, of course, but You know, we also want to give them an emotion to capture something within them that makes them come to every qualifier in the first round qualifying when you're playing against low-ranked teams. And, you know, when we need that, you know, we need them out there with us every week. But you can definitely feel as it builds through that four-year cycle when that The fans are there and the feeling is there and they'll always be there on the big stage when we're there.
00:26:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, I definitely think you guys are definitely inspiring the next generation and definitely capturing, you know, when we look back on it, we definitely saw some performances that we were like, wow, you know, there's some players that. Everyone's going to remember for the next four years. Everyone's going to be following for the next four years. And we'll definitely be, you know, along that journey. Also, I wanted to get your thoughts on who do you think the most underrated Australian football player is ever?
00:26:53
Speaker 3: It's like not even, don't even have to think about it.
00:26:57
Speaker 2: He's the most underrated.
00:27:00
Speaker 3: I think it's only been in the last 12 months when he's had a couple of these real individual moments, like scoring the goal against Japan and winning as captain for Melbourne City. But this guy has been doing that non-stop for over a decade. He's been the most reliable player, the most consistent player, in this team.
00:27:27
Speaker 1: And why do you think people kind of might overlook him or not, not overlook him, but underrate him, so to speak, or not notice him because maybe position of the left back or that kind of thing.
00:27:36
Speaker 2: It's not the most fullbacks, not the most glamorous position on the pitch. That's for sure.
00:27:40
Speaker 3: And, um, you know, but his, you know, yeah, I think it's just his tenacity and his, just as I say, his desire to every single game.
00:27:51
Speaker 2: To produce a certain level of performance.
00:27:53
Speaker 3: And I also say, over the last 10 years, the amount of players and competition and things that could easily have pushed a player out of the team, he's fought through and seen through. Asian Cup winner, three World Cups. For me, I think he's fifth or sixth all-time capped soccerer, and I still don't think a lot of people would even put him near an all-time soccerer's 11th. where I think he should go straight into that spot for me. That's, that's why for me, for sure.
00:28:31
Speaker 2: That's, that's him.
00:28:32
Speaker 1: We've got to give him his flowers. Now we're giving him his flowers, man. We'll give him flowers. We'll definitely put this up and give him his flowers for sure. We appreciate that. Uh, just, just to, um, um, cap things off. I'm a, I'm a big fashion guy. Um, and I can see you are too. And I'm just, I'm always, I'm inspired by the kind of the way you dress and like, where you get your teas and it just, it's so cool. Like where, where does that, um, like that fashion kind of come from, um, from you? Is it just being from Melbourne and just swaggy from Melbourne? Is that what it is?
00:29:01
Speaker 2: Uh, definitely not. Um, I definitely wasn't, didn't exist in me when I was young.
00:29:06
Speaker 3: Like, I think I was, I remember actually like when I was about 15, probably literally like 15 or 16, I'm getting invited to like, you know, when you go on like high school parties, um, and stuff like that and my mom literally in my being like to me no like we have to take you shopping like we have to take you to like general pants or something and get you like some jeans because i think i only wore football tops and like shorts like most.
00:29:28
Speaker 1: Of my that's a sign of a ball.
00:29:30
Speaker 3: Like for my whole childhood like up until my teens hundred like really i didn't wear anything else and what i will say it's probably my interest in music that was kind of the catalyst for me finding that combination between football culture, music, the music scene. Um, you can probably like with my hair and my tattoos and the kind of people who've always inspired my kind of style.
00:29:53
Speaker 1: You ran a radio station.
00:29:56
Speaker 2: Yeah. I had a show on a.
00:29:58
Speaker 1: Music radio station. Tell us about that.
00:30:00
Speaker 2: It's cool.
00:30:01
Speaker 3: Yeah. I had a radio show in, um, in Germany for the last couple of years. Um, where basically I get my hour slot once a month and I could play whatever I wanted total. you know, creative freedom, nothing to talk about football, not, you know, just really focus on another passion and play music that I was listening to. If it was like a gig that I'd been at, that a band that I saw or someone I was going to see something, you know, try and have something that was personal that I had a kind of connection to.
00:30:31
Speaker 2: And it was great. And something I still want to keep.
00:30:34
Speaker 3: Doing, you know, luckily now digitally, you can kind of do a lot of things from remotely.
00:30:41
Speaker 2: And I want to keep sharing that side of myself as well.
00:30:45
Speaker 3: Because I think I've connected with so many people and people love having another side of, you know, it connects football to other parts of the community as well. And music's definitely been that side for me when it came to fashion and everything else that comes with it.
00:31:01
Speaker 1: And would you say, like, is that something away from football that is kind of like your passion or your, not your getaway, but just something you can use to escape the footballing world, so to speak? Or, you know, because when you're a footballer, it's football, football, football, football, football, you know? And it's like, I always say you need to find something else that, you can kind of base your self-worth off that isn't just football. Do you know what I mean? Would you say kind of that music fashion is kind of that for you?
00:31:31
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly what you just said.
00:31:32
Speaker 3: I think the way you described it is how I describe it, which is it's like my balance. It's the thing that offsets everything. everything that I have in the football world. And it's been the same since I was a kid. I've played guitar since I was at school and I played in bands and I probably spent as much time because I wasn't part of elite academies training four or five nights a week. I probably spent as much time playing music that I did playing football kind of through my childhood. And it was always the, yeah, the, the kind of counterweight to the kind of intensity and emotion that football brings out in me, which, you know, a lot of people know I'm very kind of relaxed person, but I kind of, there's a different intensity inside to me that comes from, from football and it's impossible to exist at that, at that, um, in those emotions all the time, you need that something that can, that can offset it. And obviously your family is the first thing that does that for you for it. I'm sure that's the same for everyone, but you need to have your own passions and creative outlets and, music's definitely been that for me throughout my life.
00:32:39
Speaker 1: That's good to know. Thank you for that. I think we'll wrap it up then. We really appreciate you, you know, taking your time out of your day to, you know, speak to us. Hopefully next time you're, you know, I think Socceroos wins the next Socceroos game. They've got one, isn't that one against Brazil? Is that one against Brazil?
00:32:56
Speaker 2: Is that coming up? Yeah.
00:32:57
Speaker 1: We might have to take a trip down there and I think I'll try and come to the game anyway. We might get to see you there.
00:33:02
Speaker 2: Awesome, man. Yeah, fingers crossed there.
00:33:06
Speaker 3: Selection is never a guarantee, but fingers crossed I'll be there in Brisbane next week.
00:33:11
Speaker 1: Oh, yeah, no, I think you should be in the squad. We should see you there.
00:33:15
Speaker 2: Never take it for granted.
00:33:16
Speaker 1: You never know.
00:33:17
Speaker 2: Never take it for granted.
00:33:18
Speaker 1: I think there'll be an uproar if you're not in the squad, but no, thank you so much. We appreciate it and we'll continue to follow your journey and wish you all the best.
00:33:28
Speaker 2: Cheers, mate. Appreciate it.
