Steve Moffat Interview Part 2, AppleTV's "Foundation," Remembering Gene and Majel Roddenberry | episode #104

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Hi, everybuddy. I'm Ryan t Husk.
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He is Ryan t Husk, and I'm Kit Bowen, and
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welcome to the Creation Entertainment Podcast, Episode four.
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What we got on the docket, Ryan, Well, today we
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have part two of the Stephen Moffatt interview. You know
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him as the showrunner for Doctor Who, Netflix's Dracula and Sherlock.
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And on the Pop Culture Cinema Squad.
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Episode, Adam and I talk about the Apple TV series
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Foundation from creators David S.
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Goyer and Josh Freeman. Very sci fi, very intense.
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Tune in.
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And then in the Creation Looks Back segment, Adam and
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Gary continue to talk about the relationship with Jen and
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Major Roddenberry, especially with majorl after Jean's past LUs there
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was a missed opportunity. Well, it's gonna be a great show, right, Ryan.
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I cannot wait.
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Also, I want you all to check out Creation Entertainment's
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Trek Tour. If you love Star Trek, you're gonna love
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our Trek Tour, especially the Las Vegas show in August.
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More information about that a little later, but for now,
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tune in, enjoy the show.
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Welcome back books to part two of my interview with
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Stephen Moffatt, in which we continue to.
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Explore his wonderful work on Doctor.
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Who, Sherlock, Dracula, and some of the other British TV
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series that he's been involved with. Amy Pond, Karen Dyllan's
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character that I love so much? Did you was she
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created for the launch of your your start on the show?
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Yes, that's right, Yeah, yeah. I was in an odd situation.
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I was taking over and both leads were leaving. Catherine
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Tate and David Tennant were both leaving, so I had
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to come up with two new characters. I had to
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come up with a new version of the Doctor and
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someone for him to meet, which is quite awkward if
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you have to do it at the same time, because
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in a way, there was no one for Matt Smith
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to prove he was the doctor too, because little Girl
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only ever knew him as the Doctor. But you know,
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it works out and we launched a movie star, so
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that's okay.
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Tell me a little bit about the genesis of the
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Pandorica and the concept and how you you put together
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So I mean about five or six different time periods two.
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I mean it's sprawling.
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It was sprawling, and I might disappoint you in my
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memory not being as good as it should be. It
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was fifteen years ago. I remember I wanted I wanted
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to do the Pandorica opens episode as as as the
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most massively spectacular thing we could imagine, as big as
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we could make it. Yeah and so, But also I
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thought it'd be great if episode that episode was a
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sequel to every other episode in the in the series
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in that season running up to it. So we have
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a bit of Churchill, we have a bit of Starship UK,
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we have we have all those characters combining to get
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our message to the Doctor, ending with Vincent's painting of
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the Tardists exploding, which which I loved. So I was
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just trying to go all out, all out for epic
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spectacle and then collapse. It all down to a few
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people running around a museum in the Big Bang trying
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to bring the universe back. So yeah, I that as
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best I can remember. I remember it was very exciting
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to write, and I had planned it a long time,
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in particular the sequence when in the Big Bang, when
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Amy summons the Doctor back by remembering the old ride,
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something old, something new, something borrowed, something blue. I was
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very proud of that because that was such a good
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description of the times.
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And you start the story by planting the seed of
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it with that crack on the wall. It becomes sort
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of time itself as a kind of an entity itself,
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sort of menacing. So great how you opened that up.
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You subsequently went on and you did seven seasons? Was
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it as showrunner or.
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Six six edits three with Matt Smith and three with
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Peter Capaldi, who.
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We adore as well. Let's talk about some of the
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Doctor Who legacy monsters that you like.
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Weeping Angels, Well, I obviously love them because I invented them,
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and that's my that's my big claim to fame. As
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I invented the Weeping Angels. There are very very few
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truly iconic Doctor Who monsters. There's the Daleks of the Cybermen,
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and I think the Weeping Angels, honest just below them
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are are just you know, I'm very very proud of
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having invented a great Doctor Who monster. You know, I
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love the Darnets, I love the Cybermen. I used them
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both several times. I think as a kid I liked
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when I was watching it as a child, I liked
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the Cybermen best. I thought they were really scary and
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really sort of grown up in some sort of a way.
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But you know, I mean that you're you're talking about
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my favorite show when I was eight years old. So
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it was good fun to play with all that.
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They all look kind of the same, you know, fifty
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years later, which is which is a good thing. It's
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not a bad thing.
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Yeah, well yeah, yeah, as I proved, you're you're you're
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playing with fire if you try and alter those designs,
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because those dens are really good, you should. I am glow.
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I'm very attached to the Weeping Angels and they scare
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the ship out of me. Actually, they're they're very scary characters,
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and uh, the the whole concept that of kind of
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quantum physics involved with you know, they don't really exist
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unless you look at them. I mean, they're they're they're
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they're very conceptually interesting and uh but the the scary
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payoff on them is fantastic. So uh, I wanted to
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just talk a little bit about a couple of other
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Doctor who thinks I want to save some time for
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Sherlock obviously just doctor who thinks, uh sonic screwdriver as
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a as a tool as a plot to oh, for
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God's sakes really yeah, on my desk. The Tartists, well,
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I mean these are great things.
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I mean, these are some of the best ideas, uh
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in television history. And I can say that because nothing
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to do with me. I didn't invent them. The Tardist
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is an active genius. The most compelling thing to a child,
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I think is the fact that it's bigger on the inside.
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That's just amazing. Outside it's a dusty blue box, and
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inside it's a massive spaceship. I mean, wow, I mean
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really it was kind of a budget cut. They could
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in the old series. They couldn't afford a spaceship, so
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they said, oh, just make it a police telephone box. Brilliant, brilliant.
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The Sonnet Screwdriver I think we've sort of forgotten that's
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kind of a joke. I mean, who makes a screwdriver? Sonny?
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I mean, it's such a collision of ideas. Doctor who's
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got a screwdriver? We can have a screwdriver? Because that's
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a bit mundane for doctor. Who should it be a
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you know, a new kidar screwdriver. Now let's make it
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sonic because that makes absolutely no sense at all. And
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I love it. I just love it. It's one of it.
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And you know the.
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Fact that like a Swiss army knife, so to speak.
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Yes, and it's a Swiss army knife that does everything,
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accept anything useful. That's you know. I mean, it will
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get through any door unless the plot decides you're not
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meant to get through that door, in which case it
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stops working because apparently, according to some deranged old hack
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it doesn't work on wood. That was me. You know,
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there's all sorts of nonsense, and I love it. I
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love it, but it's the craziest idea.
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Talk a little bit about a couple of the doctors
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and just stream of consciousness, whatever you think about them.
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First of all, Matt Matt Smith, people that you worked with.
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Mad Matt got absolutely gorgeous actor. He was about twenty
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six when he was cast as the doctor, and I
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used to say of him that he was like a
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young man constructed by old men from memory. There was
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something genuinely like an old professor. He was really a hot,
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sexy guy, but he was like an old professor the
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way he talks. I thought, well, that's unmissible for docor
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to who He was brilliant, absolutely brilliant. David Tennant David
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Tennant was a very good friend of mine. Some the
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other night, well he made it was like if if
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Matt Smith was Doctor Who as if he were a
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cartoon animal, then I think David Tennant was Doctor Who
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as if he were a screen a screen god, you know,
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a Hollywood leading man. He was the handsome doctor who
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was really really cool and could do all the stuff,
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you know. So I was absolutely brilliant, very very funny too.
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And then Peter Capaldi's such an amazing difference in flavor
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Who cast him me, that was mine incredible casting. Tell
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me about that?
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Well, do you know? The real reason was when I
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first got the when I was first writing Doctor Who
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just for Russell, I met Peter Capaldi, who had never
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met before, and came over to me and I wanted
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to talk to him about the thick of it, the
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brilliant show he does, and he didn't want to talk
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about the thick of it because he wanted to talk
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about Doctor Who, because he was the biggest Doctor Who
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fan you could meet. He absolutely loves Doctor Who. He
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loved it. In fact, historical fact, the very first person
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to congratulate Matt Smith in public for becoming the Doctor
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and telling me was really good? Was Peter Capaldi? He
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bumped into him in the street and said, well done, mate,
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you have done that brilliantly. So anyway, I knew that
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Peter Capaldi was an amazing doctor who fan and I
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thought when Matt had decided to leave, wouldn't it be
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terrible if no one ever asked him one of the
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leading actors in the world, if no one ever asked
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him if he wanted to be doctor who? So I did,
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and wasn't he brilliant? I always think Peter Capaldi as
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the doctor is what the doctor would be like if
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he was a real person. I think that's what the
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doctor would be like. He'd be sort of grumpy bunny,
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a mad dad. You know, he'd just be He'd be
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all those things.
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He's he's sensational. Uh and of course uh Now in
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the latest few years when Russell is back on again
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as the showrunner and you've continue to write for the show,
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which is great. This last season with NIKOUTI is that
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how his name is?
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It's Shooty pronounce shooting shooting, which.
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I thought was a great season and I enjoyed your
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episode Boom very much.
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Yeah, well that was it was slightly mad of me
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to go back. I hadn't done it for years, and
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it was just that when Russell was taking it over again,
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I phoned him up and said, what are you doing,
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you mad thing? Have you forgotten what it's like? Have
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you read your book?
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Uh?
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And he uh? And he just fulminated away by all
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his plans. And I just chatted it to him for
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a while. And eventually, just because we're chatting, I was
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trying to think, what what what new thing? What's the
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only thing I haven't done? And doctor who? And I thought,
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what if he stands on a landmine and you can't
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move or do any of the things he normally does.
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What would that be like? And I I just sort
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of offhand way suggested it to Russell. I emailed and said,
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what if he stands on the landmine for the entire episode? Uh?
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And as I was getting I pressed and I was
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getting up my desk, he emailed straight back within thirty
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seconds to say, yes, that write that now. I thought,
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all right, I'll do one more. I'll do one more
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and then I'll be gone. Then I ended up doing
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Christmas as well, so that was a bit silly.
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Finish finish now well, I think what I love about
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that episode is, uh, these these screwed up war machines
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functioning off of bad algorithms, and it betrays a healthy
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mistrust of you know, AI and machine technology. What's your
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own worldview and where I AI is taking us now
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that it's seems to be slowly closing in.
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As for the kill, well, I mean, I'm gonna be
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very careful what we say about these things. I mean,
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first of all, Boom does not take a clear attitude
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because it's not really the AI's fault in one sense,
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and it's AI. It's an AI that saves the day.
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It's actually not doctor Who at all. It's the kid's
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dad in AI form comes back and saves them. So,
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I mean, I don't know. Look, it's an amazing new tool,
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it's an amazing new invention. It's an incredible thing. I'm
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sure when somebody first discovered fire, somebody else was saying,
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we might all burn to death. Well, yeah, you might,
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some people will, that's true. But there's a good side
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to have discovering fire too. With every single invention and
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every single discovery, there's a good side and a bad side.
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There's a trade off. So there are many things that
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AI will do. I'm prepared to bet that will be
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quite extraordinary. Some of the medical stuff is amazing. It's
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ability to diagnose is slightly more important than any contribution
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it can make to the rather trivial world of entertainment.
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So no, I mean, like, let's wait and see great, great,
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great new inventions like that carry dangers, but we carry
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great benefits too. We have to not be luddites.
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Yes, we're not luddites. However, we just as long as
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our creations don't destroy us, that would be fine. We're
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about to hit onto Sherlock, one of my favorite shows
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of all time, but before we do, just a quick
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note about a couple of the companions whom I love.
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I'm a huge fan of Alex Kingston. M I just wondered,
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you know, you know, working with her and kind of
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incorporating her in some of the stories, how you felt
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about her, and well.
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I know, I just I love, I love Alex. I
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just work with her again on a new show called
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Douglas is Canceled, currently available on BritBox Americans with Karen
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Gillan too. I loved that she first worked with her
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obviously when Russell was running the show, and I wrote
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Silence in the Library, which introduced River, and having seen
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Alex play River, I just thought, okay, well that's too
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much fun and we've got to have her back, and
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so we had her in many adventures. I always love,
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loved writing River song. What a character.
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River is amazing. And I'm a huge fan of Karen
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Gillans too, Amy. I think she's an incredible character and
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incredible actress. And to see where her career went too right.
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Yeah, yeah, well wow, film star, movie star. Also in
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Douglas's canceled on BritBox.
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There you go.
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She came back to television for me.
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All Right, we're moving out to Sherlock.
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But before we do any parting.
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Thoughts about your legacy on Doctor Who in the show itself.
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All for Heaven's sake, all I care about is that
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the show carries on. It's a show made a teflon,
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you know. It discards each of us like scales from
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a dragon. It doesn't matter. So the only legacy I
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cared about was it was still there and someone else's
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taking it on and doing amazing new things with it.
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You know, I don't think you can leave a mark
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on that show. You can't leave a footprint on it
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made a tefla.
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I beg to differ. I think that you are woven
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into the deeply woven into the mosaic of that show,
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and forever enshrined in fan glory, so I have to
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give that to you. Anyway, you had an amazing run
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on that show. Okay, Sherlock, talk about the genesis of
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your working with Mark Addis before we even get to
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the show. How do you and Mark first hook up?
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Or we'd met many many times, usually by accident because
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we knew all the same people, but I think we
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twice went to the theater and discovered we're sitting next
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to each other. Was kind of weird. And then oddly
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enough it was Doctor Who. Because we knew each other
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and got on well, we quite often traveled on the
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train together to Cardiff to go to where Doctor Who
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was made, and because we're both fans and we're both
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working in the show, we would we would talk about
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Doctor Who until we started realizing people were recognizing us,
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but in particular recognizing him, and we start listening to
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what we were saying about Doctor Who, so we thought
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we better change the subject. So we decided to talk
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about Charlock Holmes instead, and from that evolved, you know,
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evolved the idea that we we we we admitted that
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we of all the adaptations we liked best, the Basil Rathbone,
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Nigel Bruce ones that were that were updated, and we
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sort of said to each other, you know, we should
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people should update dtor Who again and update Charlock Holmes
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again and that would be great. And I remember saying
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that to my wife, Sue, my producer wife, and said,
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we'll be really cross when someone does that, because we
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should have done it. And she said, I'll get you
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to a room. You can go into the room and
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discuss how you do it, and when you come out,
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we'll go and picture it. And it went very fast
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after that.
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Uh did Mark always see himself as Mike Croft or
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did he know that he would, you know, wanted to
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act on the show. I mean, isn't that a lot
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to kind of be a co showrunner and also act
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on a show or is that?
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Yeah?
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I mean I think I think it were a bigger
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part if you. I think it'd be pretty much impossible
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to be Charlocke Holmes and a co show runner. I
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think that would be a nightmare. But the well, maybe
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maybe he could, maybe he's clever enough. I wouldn't be,
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but I know it wasn't. Originally he was thinking maybe
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he'd be Moriarty, But then I think it was Steve
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Thompson the other right on the show. He said, why
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don't you, why don't you play? You play Micraft as
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a sort of Peter mandelssoon time, and we lit up
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at that idea, and so he got to be I thought,
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a very brilliant Miecraft.
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He was fabulous.
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And I'm glad I worked out that way because I
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love Andrew Scott, and you know, he was his he
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was so over the top. How did Benedict get cast?
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What was that whole process about? Because I mean, he's
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such he's such a fascinating actor in person.
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He was he was one of the He wasn't famous
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at the time at all. He was a sort of
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very respected actor, and people keept saying of him one
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day that when that boy gets the right part, he'll
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be a star. But that right part hadn't come his
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way yet. And Sue and I were watching the film
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what's it called, Oh It's Gone out my Head? A
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film atonement. We watched the film atonement and we saw
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he said, he looks a bit like Charlot Colmes. He's
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got the Charlot comes look and he's very good. So
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we arranged a meeting with him with you know, me
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and Mark and Sue, and we videoed him playing a
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few scenes and he just said, well, there's really no
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point looking again. This is this is obviously the right guy.
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This is obviously and there's not that many people who
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can play this par and uh so we cast him.
359
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We just cast him on the basis of that. We said.
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We said to the BBC, look, by the way, we
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think we found him, and they looked to the video
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say we agree, he's fantastic, but it's a shame he's not.
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But you did promise that a sexy Sherlock and he's
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Is he really sexy enough? Well, the world soon came
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to a different conclusion on the subject of whether Benedict
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is sexy. So that was that was pretty good.
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I love the the many affectations that he brings to
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the character. But forgive me is the characters as Conan
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Doyle originally conceived that them. Is he on a spectrum?
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Well, I mean it's questionable whether even our version is,
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and I mean, I don't know. It always strikes me
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as pretty insane about his madness. He likes to say
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is madder than he actually is. The he's pretty unrepentant
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about how he is. He's pretty well adjusted about being
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Sherlock Holmes. So I've never quite bought the ideas that
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much of a looney. He just doesn't really mind being different.
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And if you don't mind being different, that's not a problem. Yes,
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he's fairly authentic to the original version of the show,
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given that he's a modern transplant of him, that makes
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him different automatically. He comes from a different culture, so
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he's slightly different. But you know, we were pretty faithful
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to the Doyle version.
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00:21:38.680 --> 00:21:40.960
One of the narrative devices that you use on the
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show that I love so much is Holmes's mind palace.
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Where did you kind of come up with this idea
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and how did you think to visualize it so incredibly?
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00:21:55.799 --> 00:21:57.720
I think it was originally because we had a plot
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point in Hinds of Bus s Goovill which essentially amounted
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00:22:03.119 --> 00:22:06.119
to Charlock Holmes saying, oh, I've just remembered something, and
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00:22:06.160 --> 00:22:08.200
we thought we can't do that. You can't just say oh,
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I've just remembered something. How do we disguise that plot
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00:22:10.839 --> 00:22:13.720
point by making it exotic? So we came up with
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00:22:13.759 --> 00:22:16.359
this scene where he goes into his mind palace to
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remember something. But if you look carefully at the scene,
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all that really happens is he remembers something he'd previously forgotten.
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So it was for that reason, and then we'd rather
397
00:22:25.759 --> 00:22:30.119
liked it. We liked it very much, and we kept
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00:22:30.200 --> 00:22:31.759
using it. It's the kind of thing that it's the
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00:22:31.839 --> 00:22:34.240
kind of mental discipline that Charlotte Holmes would use on
400
00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:34.960
fairly sure.
401
00:22:35.720 --> 00:22:38.160
I think it's a great visual device as well as
402
00:22:38.200 --> 00:22:42.200
a story device. It's a great visual device to sort
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00:22:42.200 --> 00:22:44.960
of show his mind process and how he's sort of
404
00:22:45.519 --> 00:22:49.200
moving through his different ideas and that whole, huge, deep
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00:22:49.319 --> 00:22:52.759
memory that he has. Would he be considered having a
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00:22:52.759 --> 00:22:55.319
photographic memory or no.
407
00:22:55.240 --> 00:22:57.640
Because if you have a photographic memory, as I understand that,
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00:22:57.720 --> 00:22:59.799
you wouldn't need a mind palace. A mind palace is
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00:22:59.839 --> 00:23:03.960
for those of us who don't automatically store all information.
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00:23:04.680 --> 00:23:06.799
And this is a way of storing information which I
411
00:23:06.839 --> 00:23:11.920
can do that leaves it in an imperishable form in your head.
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Most of your memory gets deleted as you know, so
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it's a way of resisting that.
414
00:23:18.240 --> 00:23:26.200
All right. Well, I also adore Martin Freeman. Yes, what
415
00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:28.039
had his casting come about?
416
00:23:28.839 --> 00:23:32.359
Well, we we we sent out for lots of different
417
00:23:32.400 --> 00:23:34.720
Watson's and quite a few came in. He was amongst
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00:23:34.759 --> 00:23:38.519
the ones who in the first round of editions, and
419
00:23:39.400 --> 00:23:42.839
we thought we'll try our best ones with Benedict. So
420
00:23:42.880 --> 00:23:45.400
we got several of them back to audition with Benedict
421
00:23:45.440 --> 00:23:47.880
to see what the chemistry was like. And then he,
422
00:23:48.680 --> 00:23:51.640
Martin and Benedict played a scene together and I and
423
00:23:51.759 --> 00:23:55.039
it was immediately electric. And I leaned over to mart
424
00:23:55.079 --> 00:23:57.400
and said, that's the show. That's the show right there.
425
00:23:58.359 --> 00:24:02.880
So like that, just the ageble story of additioning.
426
00:24:04.119 --> 00:24:07.160
And the rest is history. A couple of other characters
427
00:24:07.160 --> 00:24:09.799
from the show that I love, as I alluded to,
428
00:24:09.880 --> 00:24:13.960
I love Andrew Scott as Moriarity. He's an incredible pick,
429
00:24:14.000 --> 00:24:17.519
and I love the arct that you created with the character. Now,
430
00:24:17.720 --> 00:24:20.119
I do believe he did die at the end of
431
00:24:20.119 --> 00:24:24.160
the second season, even though digital versions of him appear
432
00:24:24.240 --> 00:24:27.039
to manifest themselves throughout the rest of the series. Could
433
00:24:27.039 --> 00:24:29.079
you at least give us as kind of a confirmation
434
00:24:29.839 --> 00:24:33.119
that heat in fact, die definitely dead.
435
00:24:33.200 --> 00:24:36.519
He's definitely dead. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
436
00:24:36.960 --> 00:24:38.680
Just tell us a little bit about Andrew because he
437
00:24:38.759 --> 00:24:41.160
seems like such a gifted actor and he brought so
438
00:24:41.240 --> 00:24:41.880
much to the role.
439
00:24:43.400 --> 00:24:46.920
Well, he's brilliant, obviously, he's When we first did that
440
00:24:46.960 --> 00:24:51.160
script the Great Game, which mocks script, the only original
441
00:24:51.160 --> 00:24:53.400
appearance he would have would be as the character be
442
00:24:53.400 --> 00:24:56.960
called gay Jim who was going out with Molly Hoopa
443
00:24:58.359 --> 00:25:02.519
and originally would never see it as Moriarty in that show.
444
00:25:02.799 --> 00:25:06.559
But that meant we had no addition scene for Moriarty,
445
00:25:07.000 --> 00:25:09.680
so we rustled up a mad scene where he said
446
00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:12.519
had lots of mad dialogue like I will break I
447
00:25:12.519 --> 00:25:15.440
will Burnah out of you and all that nonsense. And
448
00:25:15.880 --> 00:25:18.440
Andrew did it brilliantly, so we thought we'll cast him,
449
00:25:18.559 --> 00:25:20.839
and I tell you what, we thought, it makes no sense,
450
00:25:20.880 --> 00:25:24.440
but we're sticking that scene in the show. So we've
451
00:25:24.559 --> 00:25:27.759
had him actually appear as fully fledged Moriarty in the
452
00:25:27.839 --> 00:25:30.720
last scene of series one for no other reason than
453
00:25:30.759 --> 00:25:33.160
we thought, well we you know, it doesn't actually make sense,
454
00:25:33.160 --> 00:25:37.559
the logic is nuts, but it was just so great
455
00:25:37.599 --> 00:25:39.839
to see him.
456
00:25:40.000 --> 00:25:42.799
There were a couple of other characters from the show
457
00:25:42.839 --> 00:25:45.920
that I love I love when the Stubbs Missus Hudgs,
458
00:25:45.960 --> 00:25:49.680
She's has an important place in the narrative right.
459
00:25:50.799 --> 00:25:53.160
In our version. Yes, I don't think she barely speaks
460
00:25:53.160 --> 00:25:55.359
in the original stories, but we can't. You know who
461
00:25:55.599 --> 00:25:59.279
we've sadly lost since he died a few years ago,
462
00:25:59.400 --> 00:26:03.599
very sadly and in the Stubbs just came along and
463
00:26:03.880 --> 00:26:07.359
will knocked out the park being became incredibly charming and funny.
464
00:26:07.640 --> 00:26:10.480
So I mean, I'll just say it, unequivocally the best
465
00:26:10.480 --> 00:26:14.559
Missus Hudson ever, and she had more to do than
466
00:26:14.640 --> 00:26:17.519
any other Missus Hudson when when when Una died, I
467
00:26:17.559 --> 00:26:19.920
went back and watched allar scenes from Sherlock and was
468
00:26:20.119 --> 00:26:23.880
quite surprised at how many she had. We we we love,
469
00:26:24.079 --> 00:26:26.079
we loved to give loads to do.
470
00:26:27.640 --> 00:26:30.599
I loved her, and I also thought that Rupert Graves
471
00:26:30.920 --> 00:26:35.480
was awesome too. I mean, Lestrada is also another kind
472
00:26:35.480 --> 00:26:38.759
of an important piece to the narrative in Holmes.
473
00:26:40.000 --> 00:26:42.839
Yeah, I mean it's it's quite important. As a home
474
00:26:42.920 --> 00:26:45.799
says of Lestrade and the original that he is the
475
00:26:45.839 --> 00:26:48.480
best of the Scotland yard theres. So we wanted him
476
00:26:48.519 --> 00:26:51.680
to be a good a good cop, a very intelligent
477
00:26:51.759 --> 00:26:54.880
cop who just isn't a smarter Sherlock Holmes. And in
478
00:26:54.920 --> 00:26:57.319
a way, what you need is somebody who looks as
479
00:26:57.359 --> 00:26:59.400
though they could be a leading man on their own show.
480
00:27:00.039 --> 00:27:02.720
It wasn't for Sherlock comes in because Rupert Gregsby, I
481
00:27:02.720 --> 00:27:05.720
think the most handsome man in the world looks like
482
00:27:05.759 --> 00:27:08.319
he should have his own show, so he was perfect
483
00:27:08.400 --> 00:27:10.400
for it. And a lovely act, lovely man.
484
00:27:10.480 --> 00:27:16.960
Wonderful. Now, how do you describe your writing relationship? It's
485
00:27:17.839 --> 00:27:21.160
between you and Mark. You know, it seems like you
486
00:27:21.200 --> 00:27:27.519
write episodes, writes episodes. You write episodes together. How do
487
00:27:27.599 --> 00:27:30.200
you plan out a season and how do you kind
488
00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:32.599
of divide up the writing duties.
489
00:27:33.079 --> 00:27:35.680
Well, generally speaking, what we've done on the shows we've
490
00:27:35.680 --> 00:27:40.000
done together is we'll take an episode each and either
491
00:27:40.160 --> 00:27:42.920
we would get maybe Steve Thompson to write a third one,
492
00:27:43.480 --> 00:27:46.599
or later on we would just collaborate on the third one.
493
00:27:46.720 --> 00:27:49.720
But the truth is we oversee every page of every
494
00:27:49.759 --> 00:27:53.480
script between us. We do, but we've done every version
495
00:27:53.519 --> 00:27:57.759
of writing together. Either we'll submit drafts to each other
496
00:27:57.839 --> 00:28:01.880
for rewrites, or we'll or will sit in the room
497
00:28:01.960 --> 00:28:05.599
and work out together He's the only person I ever
498
00:28:05.640 --> 00:28:08.200
collaborate with. He collaborates with more people than I do,
499
00:28:08.319 --> 00:28:11.519
but Mark is the only person I've actually sat in
500
00:28:11.519 --> 00:28:14.400
the room and written with, So yeah.
501
00:28:15.880 --> 00:28:18.920
A collaboration. I'm just going to touch on a few episodes,
502
00:28:18.920 --> 00:28:22.400
and I know our time is fleeting now. One of
503
00:28:22.400 --> 00:28:27.240
my favorite episodes is a scandal in Bill Gravia. I'm
504
00:28:27.400 --> 00:28:29.400
really kind of have a love affair with Laura Pulver.
505
00:28:29.559 --> 00:28:31.559
I just I just think that Green Adler is such
506
00:28:31.559 --> 00:28:36.200
an incredible character. So just walk us through your recollections
507
00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:39.400
of the episode and the story and your thoughts about her.
508
00:28:39.880 --> 00:28:42.200
Well, it's probably my favorite thing I've ever done, Actually,
509
00:28:42.279 --> 00:28:45.960
scandalon Milgram's probably I probably I remember thinking when I
510
00:28:47.119 --> 00:28:49.160
volunteered to do the Irin Nadler one, I thought, this
511
00:28:49.319 --> 00:28:53.160
is a puzzle box twisted love story. I was born
512
00:28:53.279 --> 00:28:59.440
to write this. I adored it, and I thought it
513
00:28:59.519 --> 00:29:02.359
was I think it's I, in my view, the best
514
00:29:02.359 --> 00:29:05.160
episode of Charlotte that we did. Mark thinks the same
515
00:29:06.400 --> 00:29:09.799
and something everything worked in that one. The brilliant Pall
516
00:29:09.880 --> 00:29:13.119
mcgwigan directed it so beautifully. The design was gorgeous, the
517
00:29:13.240 --> 00:29:17.440
score was amazing. Lara Pulva was heartbreaking. It was just
518
00:29:17.720 --> 00:29:21.319
the show where everything seemed to work perfectly, and I
519
00:29:21.920 --> 00:29:24.960
absolutely adore as I say, it's my favorite thing I've
520
00:29:25.000 --> 00:29:25.519
ever done.
521
00:29:26.039 --> 00:29:28.039
I would dare say that she was the woman in
522
00:29:28.079 --> 00:29:29.119
Sherlock's life.
523
00:29:29.960 --> 00:29:33.440
Yes, I don't. Well, Molly Hooper is doing better than
524
00:29:33.480 --> 00:29:34.279
she knows she's doing.
525
00:29:34.319 --> 00:29:38.480
But yeah, yeah, So we got to the end of
526
00:29:38.599 --> 00:29:42.880
season two with the reichenback fall, and I guess that's
527
00:29:44.440 --> 00:29:51.880
that whole Moriarty and Holmes's death scene together has been
528
00:29:51.920 --> 00:29:54.160
sort of reshaped a few times, and you actually came
529
00:29:54.240 --> 00:29:58.440
back and revisited that later on in the show. But
530
00:30:01.119 --> 00:30:05.240
kind of how did you plan on that construction and
531
00:30:06.079 --> 00:30:09.599
the whole you know, breaking into the Tower of London
532
00:30:09.599 --> 00:30:15.000
and all that. How did you plan to vary that
533
00:30:15.119 --> 00:30:19.119
from sort of the classic Conan Doyle troupe.
534
00:30:21.240 --> 00:30:25.279
Oh, I can't, I don't really remember. I remember we
535
00:30:25.319 --> 00:30:28.359
did a lot of planning on it. I mean wanted
536
00:30:28.359 --> 00:30:31.599
a proper battle between a proper intellectual battle between Moriarty
537
00:30:31.759 --> 00:30:35.559
and Charlock Holmes, and we wanted to end with the
538
00:30:35.640 --> 00:30:37.920
definite death of Charlock Holmes and then revealed that he
539
00:30:38.039 --> 00:30:41.400
was alive. That was our plan from the start, but
540
00:30:41.599 --> 00:30:43.440
you know, the final problem is a great story, and
541
00:30:43.480 --> 00:30:45.000
we were just basically riffing on that.
542
00:30:47.079 --> 00:30:49.839
And then, of course, you know, after waiting two years,
543
00:30:50.160 --> 00:30:52.279
we do finally find out that, of course he did
544
00:30:52.319 --> 00:30:56.279
live in the empty hearse. And I thought the construction
545
00:30:56.359 --> 00:30:58.599
of how he faked his death was pretty incredible.
546
00:30:59.640 --> 00:31:02.480
Yeah, I mean, except if you if you watch carefully,
547
00:31:02.799 --> 00:31:05.079
the absolute fact is Dr Watson never sees the body
548
00:31:05.160 --> 00:31:07.559
hit the ground, so it's fairly obvious something got in
549
00:31:07.599 --> 00:31:09.680
the way. I always thought, come on, there's there's no
550
00:31:09.720 --> 00:31:13.000
other there's no other possible solution. It's a big blue cushion.
551
00:31:13.720 --> 00:31:15.400
But yeah, yeah, it was good. It was great fun
552
00:31:15.480 --> 00:31:17.799
doing that. Everyone was very invested in it. It was
553
00:31:18.079 --> 00:31:18.720
it was a laugh.
554
00:31:19.759 --> 00:31:22.759
And did you plan to all along that you would
555
00:31:22.799 --> 00:31:26.200
be leading up to watch and getting married and that
556
00:31:26.240 --> 00:31:26.720
whole Yeah.
557
00:31:26.759 --> 00:31:29.359
Yeah, we knew we were going to bring in Mary. Yeah,
558
00:31:29.880 --> 00:31:32.279
because Mary's in the stories. She is quite important the story,
559
00:31:32.359 --> 00:31:33.759
so we wanted to do Mary.
560
00:31:34.480 --> 00:31:36.799
So I thought that the sign of three episode was,
561
00:31:36.839 --> 00:31:41.279
you know, an awful lot of fun. And uh, let's
562
00:31:41.279 --> 00:31:44.039
see in a scene where you know you're looking at
563
00:31:44.079 --> 00:31:49.200
the Queen's guard, would you actually film Queen's Guard or
564
00:31:49.240 --> 00:31:51.039
is that because it looked like it.
565
00:31:52.839 --> 00:31:54.599
We did something I can't remember now.
566
00:31:54.920 --> 00:31:57.599
It looked like you're literally were filming with the Queen's
567
00:31:57.599 --> 00:31:58.519
Guard right there.
568
00:31:58.880 --> 00:32:01.279
I think we just had people in costumes. I mean,
569
00:32:01.400 --> 00:32:02.359
you know you can do that.
570
00:32:03.240 --> 00:32:09.319
Uh, it's fantastic. One of my favorite batties was Lars
571
00:32:09.400 --> 00:32:13.920
Michelson as as Magnuson. I thought he was a great villain.
572
00:32:14.880 --> 00:32:19.240
Yes he was, and uh I thought the ending was
573
00:32:19.279 --> 00:32:24.559
fairly shocking that Yeah, you know, Holmes just blew his
574
00:32:24.640 --> 00:32:28.039
head off. I mean, did you make that conscious decision
575
00:32:28.119 --> 00:32:28.480
that you.
576
00:32:28.440 --> 00:32:33.039
Were gonna Yeah, yeah, No, I thought it was uh yeah,
577
00:32:33.160 --> 00:32:35.759
with with all all else failed. I think Charlotte Coombs
578
00:32:35.799 --> 00:32:38.519
just shooting someone was guitte was was a cool thing
579
00:32:38.559 --> 00:32:40.680
to do, and I think he would in those circumstances
580
00:32:40.799 --> 00:32:41.079
do it.
581
00:32:42.920 --> 00:32:43.160
Yeah.
582
00:32:43.960 --> 00:32:44.160
Uh.
583
00:32:44.680 --> 00:32:47.599
For me, it was shocking and a surprise because again
584
00:32:47.640 --> 00:32:50.000
I didn't think that he would step over that line
585
00:32:50.039 --> 00:32:50.920
in that way, but.
586
00:32:53.079 --> 00:32:56.720
Well, you know, needs must. Dr Watson was in trouble.
587
00:32:59.039 --> 00:33:02.720
Another episode that I loved was The Abominable Bride. Yeah,
588
00:33:03.279 --> 00:33:08.240
and I like the fact that you took us back
589
00:33:08.279 --> 00:33:11.799
into sort of the Victorian kind of era. Yeah, yeah,
590
00:33:12.000 --> 00:33:14.599
it gave us the feel for that. What kind of
591
00:33:14.920 --> 00:33:18.240
challenges come with reconstructing that kind of an era. It's
592
00:33:18.240 --> 00:33:21.279
a big production challenge, right, Yeah.
593
00:33:21.319 --> 00:33:23.240
Yeah, it's more expensive, and we had to build a
594
00:33:23.240 --> 00:33:26.240
new version of Too Too won't be He's more expensive.
595
00:33:26.279 --> 00:33:28.079
But we very much wanted to do it because we
596
00:33:28.200 --> 00:33:30.799
wanted a chance to see Martin and Benedict in the
597
00:33:30.839 --> 00:33:35.559
proper gear, in the proper era doing their take on that.
598
00:33:35.799 --> 00:33:38.039
So it was great for me. Had We had a
599
00:33:38.119 --> 00:33:39.240
lovely time doing it.
600
00:33:39.720 --> 00:33:42.799
How about Mark in that fat suit? That was pretty crazy?
601
00:33:43.519 --> 00:33:45.680
Yeah, it was. Yeah, it was very It was a
602
00:33:45.720 --> 00:33:46.720
tough thing to wear.
603
00:33:47.519 --> 00:33:51.519
But it was great to see that. And also focusing
604
00:33:51.599 --> 00:33:56.200
kind of on Holmes's addiction. You allude to it a
605
00:33:56.240 --> 00:33:58.599
little bit earlier in the series, but towards the backside
606
00:33:58.640 --> 00:34:01.480
of the series it really starts to because prevalent it does.
607
00:34:01.559 --> 00:34:04.440
I mean, I'm always a warey of focusing too much
608
00:34:04.480 --> 00:34:06.480
on that, to be honest, because it doesn't really happen
609
00:34:06.559 --> 00:34:09.800
that often in the stories. But we we thought it
610
00:34:09.840 --> 00:34:13.000
was it was a reasonable thing to get into. I
611
00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:14.880
think I think we did it moderately well.
612
00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:18.599
I think he did it very well. Also, of course,
613
00:34:18.639 --> 00:34:23.280
the fact that Mike Croft and Holmes had actually both
614
00:34:23.280 --> 00:34:26.360
a sister and a brother. That mystery kind of was
615
00:34:26.440 --> 00:34:28.440
kept until pretty all much the end of the series.
616
00:34:28.760 --> 00:34:28.960
Yeah.
617
00:34:29.039 --> 00:34:32.079
Yeah, well that's that was our invention. The sister Sherlock
618
00:34:32.119 --> 00:34:36.639
comes is smartest sister. Yeah that was good fun. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
619
00:34:36.719 --> 00:34:39.440
why not? Why shouldn't he have a sister, a mad sister,
620
00:34:39.719 --> 00:34:40.800
mad sister in the attic.
621
00:34:41.760 --> 00:34:43.559
We're almost at the end of our tether. I just
622
00:34:43.599 --> 00:34:46.639
wanted to touch briefly on Dracula the mini series for Netflix,
623
00:34:46.639 --> 00:34:51.920
which was fantastic. Congratulations on that, and again you collaborated
624
00:34:51.920 --> 00:34:52.599
with Mark on that.
625
00:34:53.320 --> 00:34:56.519
Yes, that's right, yes, very much, the Charlote team doing
626
00:34:56.559 --> 00:34:59.760
Dracula very much. So, yes, how.
627
00:34:59.719 --> 00:35:02.559
Did that come about? Did you two guys just get
628
00:35:02.599 --> 00:35:04.480
together and say, you know, let's do a trackular story.
629
00:35:04.559 --> 00:35:09.400
Let's essentially essentially, Yeah, we thought we both loved Dracula
630
00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:11.559
and we just thought let's give it a go. Let's see,
631
00:35:11.679 --> 00:35:14.440
and that our idea was, can we make Dracula the
632
00:35:14.519 --> 00:35:17.639
hero of his own story? Because normally Dracula is actually
633
00:35:17.639 --> 00:35:21.039
in the background and the other characters are more important
634
00:35:21.880 --> 00:35:25.440
in the story. But with this, you know, we thought
635
00:35:25.519 --> 00:35:27.599
we could do that. To be honest with you, I
636
00:35:27.599 --> 00:35:30.079
think sister Agatha ended up being the hero of that
637
00:35:30.159 --> 00:35:33.480
story because she was out with Dolly Wells's sister Ragatha
638
00:35:33.599 --> 00:35:37.119
was such a scene stealer. But yeah, but clays Bang
639
00:35:37.199 --> 00:35:39.880
was a fantastic Dracula and we were we loved doing it.
640
00:35:39.960 --> 00:35:40.599
Was great fun.
641
00:35:41.440 --> 00:35:45.639
Any chance of any more shows or mini series for Netflix,
642
00:35:45.719 --> 00:35:49.320
because you know they do a lot of stuff these days.
643
00:35:49.840 --> 00:35:53.400
Well, we're in talks about various things. But well we'll see,
644
00:35:53.719 --> 00:35:55.079
we'll see if people say yes to.
645
00:35:55.079 --> 00:36:00.639
Us, want to hex anything. We're pretty much at the
646
00:36:00.639 --> 00:36:04.559
benediction of our discussion. But any any other points you
647
00:36:04.599 --> 00:36:07.440
wanted to make, or any thoughts for your fans here
648
00:36:07.440 --> 00:36:09.119
in the US as well as around the world.
649
00:36:09.960 --> 00:36:12.800
Well, I'm delighted to have fans anywhere, and it's and
650
00:36:12.840 --> 00:36:16.440
it's wonderful for us that people in America are watching
651
00:36:16.480 --> 00:36:19.840
these these mad British shows. That's why in return, we
652
00:36:19.880 --> 00:36:22.920
watch mad American shows. So it's a it's a good
653
00:36:22.920 --> 00:36:27.840
cultural exchange. So no, just a huge gratitude for for
654
00:36:28.079 --> 00:36:31.880
all the years of interest. It's it's sustained me in
655
00:36:31.880 --> 00:36:35.440
a very nice life. Thank you, uh, and you know
656
00:36:36.400 --> 00:36:38.719
keep watching, There'll be there will be more tough Doctor
657
00:36:38.719 --> 00:36:40.360
Who Is as a new series of Doctor Who coming
658
00:36:40.400 --> 00:36:43.840
out not involving me at all, this time with Shoot
659
00:36:44.000 --> 00:36:47.039
and Russell, and it will be brilliant, it will be amazing.
660
00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:50.199
Please keep watching and go and watch. Douglas is canceled
661
00:36:50.239 --> 00:36:56.239
on britt Box. Karen Gillan and Alex Kingston from Doctor Who,
662
00:36:56.320 --> 00:37:01.079
and Ben Miles from Coupling, and me from all.
663
00:37:01.119 --> 00:37:05.239
The above, We shall and we thank you so much
664
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:07.440
for your the generous time that you gave us, and
665
00:37:08.159 --> 00:37:09.800
I know I speak on behalf of all of us.
666
00:37:09.800 --> 00:37:12.519
We're wishing you the best in the future and looking
667
00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:16.239
forward to seeing your next projects come to Fruition to
668
00:37:16.440 --> 00:37:19.159
entertainment entertain us as much as you have in the past.
669
00:37:19.880 --> 00:37:24.719
Thank you very much, Steven, Thank you so much, BNA.
670
00:37:43.599 --> 00:37:47.400
Welcome back to the Creation Entertainment Pop Culture Cinema Squad.
671
00:37:47.960 --> 00:37:51.000
I'm Adam Allan and once again joined by my illustrious
672
00:37:51.000 --> 00:37:51.960
colleague Kid Bo.
673
00:37:52.199 --> 00:37:54.159
Hello, how are you good?
674
00:37:54.280 --> 00:37:54.519
Kid?
675
00:37:54.920 --> 00:37:56.760
And today we're going to try and do a deep
676
00:37:56.840 --> 00:37:58.239
dive on foundation.
677
00:37:58.440 --> 00:38:00.880
The TV's going to have to tell me on this one.
678
00:38:00.760 --> 00:38:04.440
Adam, Okay, well, the roots of this actually go back
679
00:38:04.480 --> 00:38:05.840
to creation conventions.
680
00:38:05.880 --> 00:38:08.760
In the nineteen seventies, Gary.
681
00:38:08.480 --> 00:38:11.719
And I started out doing comic conventions in New York City,
682
00:38:12.320 --> 00:38:16.159
and every year the great doctor Isaac Asimwoff used to
683
00:38:16.159 --> 00:38:19.880
attend our shows, which is miraculous in and of itself.
684
00:38:20.599 --> 00:38:23.639
Around that time, I was also becoming a sci fi
685
00:38:24.000 --> 00:38:26.679
literary fan, and of course I read I Robot and
686
00:38:26.719 --> 00:38:30.039
the Foundation series, and I remember saying.
687
00:38:29.800 --> 00:38:32.519
At the time, boy, that's sure making great genius year
688
00:38:32.639 --> 00:38:33.639
he did at the time.
689
00:38:34.039 --> 00:38:41.920
Of course, it's a vast, weeping saga over tens of
690
00:38:41.960 --> 00:38:47.400
thousands of years throughout a galactic spread, and so therefore
691
00:38:48.000 --> 00:38:51.800
something that really could only have been done visually within
692
00:38:51.840 --> 00:38:52.719
the last few years.
693
00:38:52.800 --> 00:38:54.599
Yeah, I mean that is sort of the case for
694
00:38:54.719 --> 00:38:57.519
many of these you know, I mean ahead of their
695
00:38:57.559 --> 00:39:01.679
time kind of books like asimov'sk and won Agan and
696
00:39:01.719 --> 00:39:03.920
things like that. You know, it's by trying to do
697
00:39:03.960 --> 00:39:05.960
them back then it would have been impossible.
698
00:39:05.960 --> 00:39:11.840
But now so thankfully David Goryer, who's such an incredible creator,
699
00:39:11.960 --> 00:39:17.719
and Josh Friedman created the Foundation TV series, And for
700
00:39:17.760 --> 00:39:19.679
those of you that aren't familiar with it, we're going
701
00:39:19.760 --> 00:39:21.880
to try and set up the story for you it's
702
00:39:22.119 --> 00:39:25.639
very sprawling and complicated, but we'll do our best job
703
00:39:26.320 --> 00:39:28.440
to get you up to date on it. And we're
704
00:39:28.480 --> 00:39:32.760
excited because we've been through two seasons so far. Season
705
00:39:32.800 --> 00:39:35.199
three is on its way. We're hoping it's going to
706
00:39:35.239 --> 00:39:36.320
get released this year.
707
00:39:37.039 --> 00:39:39.719
Date yet they don't have a date, but it definitely has.
708
00:39:39.800 --> 00:39:42.400
They finished filming it, so all.
709
00:39:42.360 --> 00:39:44.800
Right, well, let's set the scene. And this is in
710
00:39:44.840 --> 00:39:45.760
the far future.
711
00:39:46.239 --> 00:39:50.280
There's a sprawling galactic empire and as we kind of
712
00:39:50.960 --> 00:39:52.800
based this empire.
713
00:39:54.599 --> 00:39:58.840
Roughly on the Roman but not exactly.
714
00:39:58.480 --> 00:40:05.000
But it's a dynas lastic triumvirate consisting of Emperor Cleon's clones.
715
00:40:05.119 --> 00:40:06.320
It's a clone dynasty.
716
00:40:07.400 --> 00:40:11.519
The ruling clone is Brother Day, played amazingly by Leaving
717
00:40:13.280 --> 00:40:19.800
magnetic personality. He's the Cleon in his crime and his
718
00:40:20.159 --> 00:40:25.639
older clone brother is Brother Dusk, played amazingly by Terence Mann,
719
00:40:26.119 --> 00:40:30.920
a very distinguished actor who is retired and aging. And
720
00:40:30.960 --> 00:40:34.280
then there is Brother Dawn, a young Cleon that's being
721
00:40:34.559 --> 00:40:39.119
trained to succeed Brother Day. And this genetic dynasty has
722
00:40:39.199 --> 00:40:45.400
been surreptitiously administered by the Lady Demerzelle. She's the Emperor's
723
00:40:45.440 --> 00:40:52.199
Majordomo but secretly an ageless humanoid robot and.
724
00:40:52.679 --> 00:40:56.079
That we find out actually in season two.
725
00:40:56.159 --> 00:40:59.199
So obviously there will be some spoilers in this, so
726
00:40:59.320 --> 00:41:00.519
you haven't seen found.
727
00:41:00.280 --> 00:41:01.480
That few spoilers.
728
00:41:01.960 --> 00:41:02.920
Just just know.
729
00:41:02.960 --> 00:41:04.880
That we probably will be spoiling here.
730
00:41:04.719 --> 00:41:07.280
And there, so just just be forewarned on that.
731
00:41:07.679 --> 00:41:13.719
So Demrsel actually is an ancient AAI basically from.
732
00:41:13.519 --> 00:41:16.760
Earth, and there's a reason because well, first of all,
733
00:41:16.760 --> 00:41:20.320
those of you that are familiar with Iogasmwoth's three laws
734
00:41:20.320 --> 00:41:25.360
of AI or robot AI intelligence. One of those is
735
00:41:25.400 --> 00:41:30.199
that robots can do no harm to humans, well take
736
00:41:30.239 --> 00:41:31.360
that and throw it out the window.
737
00:41:33.079 --> 00:41:38.480
But she can be reprogrammed basically, and it's.
738
00:41:38.280 --> 00:41:41.000
Sort of like the same as we're seeing in some other.
739
00:41:40.880 --> 00:41:46.559
Sci fi sagas, like doing prophecy. AI has been outlawed
740
00:41:47.440 --> 00:41:50.920
and it's not a It doesn't give me good confidence
741
00:41:50.920 --> 00:41:53.920
and AI in our real world today, kid.
742
00:41:54.360 --> 00:41:58.079
Well, I always ask people, have you seen the Terminator movies?
743
00:41:58.320 --> 00:41:59.800
Do you know what could happen?
744
00:42:00.159 --> 00:42:06.119
But also in Foundation, intelligent machines have essentially been at lawn,
745
00:42:06.840 --> 00:42:13.519
and especially intelligent humanoid robots. Nonetheless, Lady Demosel is clandestinely
746
00:42:13.559 --> 00:42:16.800
who she's the major domo of the Cleonic Dynasty, and
747
00:42:16.840 --> 00:42:19.679
she's played by Laura Burns.
748
00:42:19.719 --> 00:42:24.000
Fantastic. She is actually an angel Stumunid robot.
749
00:42:24.760 --> 00:42:28.519
Now into the saga is thrust young Gail Dornic played
750
00:42:28.559 --> 00:42:34.679
by Lulabelle and Gail is acomer is a mathematical prodigy,
751
00:42:35.360 --> 00:42:41.760
and she wins a very complex mathematical contest created by
752
00:42:42.159 --> 00:42:49.400
mathematician and psychology professor Harry Selden Jared the Great Jared Harris,
753
00:42:49.400 --> 00:42:51.960
who we we love to hate in some in some
754
00:42:52.079 --> 00:42:55.159
roles and love to love in other way. Yes, And
755
00:42:55.280 --> 00:42:59.880
Harry has essentially been trying to find a protege to
756
00:43:00.119 --> 00:43:07.320
work with him on developing a complex algorithmic system they
757
00:43:07.360 --> 00:43:11.320
will talk about in just a minute. But Gaiale arrives
758
00:43:11.400 --> 00:43:14.880
on Trantor, which is the Empire home world, and she
759
00:43:15.320 --> 00:43:18.800
and Harry are thrust into the center of a conflict
760
00:43:19.159 --> 00:43:24.159
between this Cleonic Dynasty and Selden School regarding the merits
761
00:43:24.199 --> 00:43:31.400
of his theory of psychohistory. Can we explain what psychohistory
762
00:43:31.519 --> 00:43:34.760
is sort of? It's a like the algorithm to end
763
00:43:34.800 --> 00:43:36.519
all algorithms, okay.
764
00:43:36.360 --> 00:43:37.320
To predict.
765
00:43:37.639 --> 00:43:41.639
It predicts that events and actions of large masses of
766
00:43:41.679 --> 00:43:47.119
people across vast timelines thousands of years, that there are
767
00:43:47.159 --> 00:43:52.119
patterns that can be predicted with great accuracy, and he
768
00:43:53.239 --> 00:43:57.000
Gale comes and works with him and validates his findings,
769
00:43:57.639 --> 00:44:02.320
and then they publicly forecast the decay and imminent fall
770
00:44:02.519 --> 00:44:04.719
of the Cleonic Empire.
771
00:44:04.719 --> 00:44:10.000
Which does not thrill the days that especially Day or.
772
00:44:11.519 --> 00:44:13.039
The Brothers, I guess that's what they're called.
773
00:44:13.199 --> 00:44:17.760
However, they predicted that some of this fall or damage
774
00:44:17.840 --> 00:44:21.559
can be mitigated by the creation of a foundation, and
775
00:44:21.639 --> 00:44:26.159
this foundation will preserve the collective knowledge and innovations of humanity,
776
00:44:28.360 --> 00:44:32.519
ostensibly in a location which we'll get into. But the
777
00:44:32.639 --> 00:44:37.480
Cleons initially kind of dismiss this as a sort of
778
00:44:37.519 --> 00:44:41.400
a quaint thing, not really a threat to them. But
779
00:44:42.559 --> 00:44:50.199
in predicting the first crisises they're called, Harry's system proves
780
00:44:50.199 --> 00:44:54.079
to be true, and so the Cleons have no choice
781
00:44:54.079 --> 00:44:57.920
but to recognize that, in fact, his theories are not
782
00:44:57.960 --> 00:45:02.360
only very possible, but also danger to their dynastic rule.
783
00:45:03.519 --> 00:45:09.280
So they agree to place Harry's school and his disciples
784
00:45:09.280 --> 00:45:12.559
and followers on a remote planet at the edge of
785
00:45:12.559 --> 00:45:16.679
the galaxy called Terminus, not to.
786
00:45:16.639 --> 00:45:18.840
Be confused with Terminus from the Walking Deck.
787
00:45:19.320 --> 00:45:20.000
That's correct.
788
00:45:20.599 --> 00:45:23.760
This Terminus is a planet where the Foundation is established.
789
00:45:23.800 --> 00:45:28.519
It's a colony to preserve human knowledge and to predict
790
00:45:29.159 --> 00:45:33.440
the eventual return of civilization to the galaxy after the
791
00:45:33.480 --> 00:45:40.239
predicted's fall of the Galactic Empire, which psycho history is predictive, right, Okay,
792
00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:41.960
so that's kind.
793
00:45:41.760 --> 00:45:42.599
Of an overview.
794
00:45:44.920 --> 00:45:47.880
But each of these characters, I mean, really there's kind
795
00:45:47.920 --> 00:45:50.280
of like three or four different.
796
00:45:51.599 --> 00:45:53.199
Story arcs, right, yes.
797
00:45:53.000 --> 00:45:57.320
But it's all basically a tension between the Empire and
798
00:45:57.679 --> 00:46:04.960
this growing Foundation. And Season two actually jumps about one
799
00:46:05.079 --> 00:46:10.719
hundred years forward or so, and the Foundation has on
800
00:46:10.840 --> 00:46:15.840
Terminus taken on a new almost religious like quality. They've
801
00:46:15.880 --> 00:46:19.440
got sort of brothers and sisters, a sort of quasi
802
00:46:19.519 --> 00:46:24.960
religious figures. But there is the rise of a danger
803
00:46:25.000 --> 00:46:29.639
from a telepathic entity. Of this telepathic entity, tele Bond,
804
00:46:29.719 --> 00:46:34.679
played by the Great Rachel House, one of our Polynesian
805
00:46:35.280 --> 00:46:36.760
actors that we see in.
806
00:46:38.440 --> 00:46:43.079
A lot of New Zealand fair She's fantastic anyway.
807
00:46:43.480 --> 00:46:46.559
She's a member of a group of mentalics who are
808
00:46:47.079 --> 00:46:50.559
ostensibly just trying to live on their own separately, but
809
00:46:50.639 --> 00:46:55.360
who actually will through some of their members, pose a
810
00:46:55.400 --> 00:47:01.039
great threat to both the Empire and the Foundation. Also
811
00:47:01.079 --> 00:47:04.760
in the second season, Gail reunites with her daughter sal
812
00:47:05.280 --> 00:47:07.000
Harden play by Leah Hardy.
813
00:47:06.960 --> 00:47:09.639
Which of course is the weird thing because what ends
814
00:47:09.719 --> 00:47:11.400
up happening is when Gail is.
815
00:47:11.320 --> 00:47:14.239
On Trentor and things go to jet.
816
00:47:14.280 --> 00:47:17.400
Basically she has already had sort of a love interest
817
00:47:17.480 --> 00:47:21.079
this managed she you know, falls in love with him.
818
00:47:21.079 --> 00:47:23.679
Of course, she's pregnant, so when she's put into this
819
00:47:23.800 --> 00:47:26.679
cryo sleep I guess or something like that is shot
820
00:47:26.679 --> 00:47:29.400
off before you know, anything really went wrong. She ends
821
00:47:29.480 --> 00:47:32.039
up having this baby, and or she has the baby
822
00:47:32.039 --> 00:47:32.840
before they.
823
00:47:33.119 --> 00:47:36.400
Yeah, yeah, but has the baby, has the baby.
824
00:47:36.440 --> 00:47:38.079
And that turns out to be a Salve war. So
825
00:47:38.159 --> 00:47:43.400
when they reunite, Gail is still her young self and
826
00:47:43.599 --> 00:47:45.199
Salvor is a grown woman now.
827
00:47:45.239 --> 00:47:46.239
So it's just kind of this.
828
00:47:46.320 --> 00:47:51.679
Weird It's interesting, very interesting because hundred year jobs and.
829
00:47:51.679 --> 00:47:53.960
In the second season we learned that there is a
830
00:47:54.000 --> 00:47:59.400
living second crisis and this crisis will ultimately uh have
831
00:47:59.480 --> 00:47:59.920
a huge.
832
00:48:00.519 --> 00:48:01.679
On the galaxy itself.
833
00:48:02.920 --> 00:48:06.519
Meanwhile, the Cleonic dynasty is continuing to try and assert
834
00:48:06.559 --> 00:48:12.599
its power if they become more paranoid, and Emperor Day
835
00:48:13.760 --> 00:48:19.119
decides that he wants to break the chain of clone
836
00:48:19.920 --> 00:48:24.079
dependence on clones for the continuance of the dynasty, so
837
00:48:24.119 --> 00:48:28.440
he plans to marry a queen and kind of break
838
00:48:28.480 --> 00:48:31.880
the chain of the clones, which causes all sorts of
839
00:48:31.960 --> 00:48:37.119
chaos and also goes against the wishes of his major Delmo.
840
00:48:37.920 --> 00:48:45.840
She's been programmed to follow the original Cleonic plan to
841
00:48:45.920 --> 00:48:48.800
keep the Clone dynasty in place, so she's going to
842
00:48:48.840 --> 00:48:50.000
do everything that she can't.
843
00:48:49.840 --> 00:48:50.480
To subvert that.
844
00:48:50.639 --> 00:48:50.800
Now.
845
00:48:50.840 --> 00:48:54.119
I did really enjoyed in the second season. You do
846
00:48:54.239 --> 00:48:59.079
get to see how she becomes who she is. We
847
00:48:59.119 --> 00:49:03.280
find out her story, and there was just an original Cleon.
848
00:49:04.000 --> 00:49:06.239
His name was Cleon and he was a small child
849
00:49:06.320 --> 00:49:08.800
when he first sees her right and she's sort of
850
00:49:08.960 --> 00:49:12.119
encased in this prison of some sort that she was
851
00:49:12.159 --> 00:49:15.519
placed there by the whoever was before that. I'm not
852
00:49:15.519 --> 00:49:18.400
sure where she gets placed there or who places her name.
853
00:49:18.440 --> 00:49:20.920
Well, they don't say it on the TV series. It's
854
00:49:20.960 --> 00:49:22.920
indicated in the books, but we don't want to get
855
00:49:22.960 --> 00:49:23.719
too much into.
856
00:49:23.519 --> 00:49:25.719
The book on okay, But anyway, it does kind of
857
00:49:25.719 --> 00:49:27.320
give a backstory.
858
00:49:26.719 --> 00:49:29.960
On how and what her priorities were.
859
00:49:29.920 --> 00:49:31.159
So I thought that was fascinating.
860
00:49:31.199 --> 00:49:31.559
I likes that.
861
00:49:32.719 --> 00:49:36.800
The season culminates with Gail Salvor and a digital manifestation
862
00:49:36.880 --> 00:49:42.440
of Harry confronting this mentality, telling Bond who wants to
863
00:49:42.480 --> 00:49:46.639
manipulate their minds and alter the future predicted by psyclohistory.
864
00:49:47.480 --> 00:49:50.320
There then is a kind of a divergence between the
865
00:49:50.480 --> 00:49:54.880
books and the TV series. The books, well, both on
866
00:49:54.920 --> 00:49:58.119
the TV series and the books, they are predicting the
867
00:49:58.119 --> 00:50:04.360
coming of the mule powerful mentalic. In the books, the
868
00:50:04.440 --> 00:50:09.800
mentallic actually cases control of Terminus. However, the fate of
869
00:50:09.880 --> 00:50:14.440
Terminus in the TV series, of course is it's destroyed.
870
00:50:15.000 --> 00:50:19.519
So we'll kind of get into that anyway. The Emperor
871
00:50:19.639 --> 00:50:23.400
and his forces meet with Foundation leadership. They go to
872
00:50:23.400 --> 00:50:27.679
the vault and demand to see Harry, and they asked
873
00:50:27.719 --> 00:50:34.079
that Harry denounces principles. He refuses, and then Emperor Day
874
00:50:34.360 --> 00:50:40.880
orders his imperial flagship, the Invictus, to be crashed into Terminus,
875
00:50:41.280 --> 00:50:44.760
which destroys the planets. And so in that sense there
876
00:50:44.800 --> 00:50:48.719
is a divergence from the books. But I know that
877
00:50:48.920 --> 00:50:53.159
David and Josh and all the writers behind the series
878
00:50:53.519 --> 00:50:56.360
had their reasons for doing that, and that leads us
879
00:50:56.400 --> 00:51:01.239
into series three, which is going to be hopefully coming
880
00:51:01.320 --> 00:51:02.000
later this year.
881
00:51:02.760 --> 00:51:04.480
Well, let me just I mean, this is kind of
882
00:51:04.480 --> 00:51:06.599
a spoiler in the end of season two, but we
883
00:51:06.679 --> 00:51:10.840
do see that the majority of the Foundation is actually
884
00:51:12.440 --> 00:51:17.320
salvaged or or they they survived this crash, the destruction
885
00:51:17.360 --> 00:51:23.239
of their planet. You've got Gail and Selden in this
886
00:51:23.800 --> 00:51:25.960
you know, tropical wherever the heck they are, you know,
887
00:51:26.000 --> 00:51:29.800
with where the telebuan was. Is that where tell them,
888
00:51:29.840 --> 00:51:34.280
tell them bond. So they're there and they are are
889
00:51:34.320 --> 00:51:38.960
put into another crier sleep situation. And then also you've
890
00:51:39.000 --> 00:51:44.519
got uh, the Cleons. Uh, the idea of you know,
891
00:51:44.599 --> 00:51:49.440
perpetuating naturally our next heir to the Cleon empire uh
892
00:51:49.639 --> 00:51:53.800
is actually uh, you're foreseen y or it's actually happens
893
00:51:53.800 --> 00:51:57.440
because young day Dawn. I guess brother Don is a
894
00:51:58.159 --> 00:52:00.360
fathering a child with the princess that was supposed to
895
00:52:00.400 --> 00:52:00.840
be the queen.
896
00:52:01.000 --> 00:52:03.360
So I've got that all three of those things are
897
00:52:03.360 --> 00:52:05.159
going on, and.
898
00:52:05.039 --> 00:52:09.760
Again some divergences from the books as well as some things.
899
00:52:09.559 --> 00:52:12.119
That will mirror the books as we've moved into the
900
00:52:12.159 --> 00:52:12.679
third seison.
901
00:52:12.800 --> 00:52:15.840
Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean tell me, I mean
902
00:52:16.000 --> 00:52:19.760
you being this sort of you know, reading the books
903
00:52:19.800 --> 00:52:21.599
and what I mean, you really enjoyed the series.
904
00:52:21.639 --> 00:52:23.199
Why did you enjoy it so much?
905
00:52:23.480 --> 00:52:25.960
Well, because, for one thing, I think Isaac would have
906
00:52:26.000 --> 00:52:29.119
been very proud to see his creation brought to life
907
00:52:29.519 --> 00:52:30.159
in such a.
908
00:52:32.960 --> 00:52:37.320
Beautifully realized, photorealistic.
909
00:52:37.079 --> 00:52:41.400
Incredible high production take on the future, and where they've
910
00:52:41.519 --> 00:52:45.360
chosen to kind of build their own storyline out of it.
911
00:52:45.639 --> 00:52:49.400
I think they're good creative choices, and so I think
912
00:52:49.519 --> 00:52:52.840
Isaac would approve of it. But where it's heading, we
913
00:52:52.880 --> 00:52:56.719
don't want to get way too many spoilers, but massive
914
00:52:56.800 --> 00:52:57.800
changes coming.
915
00:52:57.599 --> 00:53:01.119
In season three and I can't wait for it to come.
916
00:53:01.199 --> 00:53:03.800
But again, I think Isaac would be very very pleased
917
00:53:04.159 --> 00:53:06.960
to see where the series has gone. And we're curious
918
00:53:06.960 --> 00:53:09.199
to know you know, what you viewers think of the
919
00:53:09.280 --> 00:53:11.960
series so far, So please contact us.
920
00:53:12.000 --> 00:53:14.840
And by the way, how can they contact us to
921
00:53:15.199 --> 00:53:15.480
let us?
922
00:53:15.679 --> 00:53:17.960
They can let us know your in the comments below,
923
00:53:18.679 --> 00:53:21.039
let us know some of your thoughts on Foundation, if
924
00:53:21.079 --> 00:53:23.159
you liked it or didn't like it, and we can
925
00:53:23.199 --> 00:53:26.239
respond to you that way. But yeah, I mean absolutely
926
00:53:26.559 --> 00:53:27.599
let us know what you think.
927
00:53:28.400 --> 00:53:31.000
Anyway, it's really it's a good watch.
928
00:53:31.119 --> 00:53:33.199
So if you haven't, for God's sakes, if you haven't
929
00:53:33.239 --> 00:53:36.559
seen it already, Get behind watching seasons one and two
930
00:53:36.639 --> 00:53:38.079
of Foundation and we'll.
931
00:53:37.920 --> 00:53:39.880
Be looking at stick with it, man, I mean pay
932
00:53:39.920 --> 00:53:42.760
attention because there's a lot going on and you want
933
00:53:42.760 --> 00:53:44.239
to make sure because I had to kind of go
934
00:53:44.360 --> 00:53:47.559
back a few times ago, okay, and then move forward.
935
00:53:47.559 --> 00:53:50.440
So it's one of those those deep thought kind of shows.
936
00:53:50.480 --> 00:53:52.639
If it's too easy of a story, if it's too
937
00:53:52.760 --> 00:53:55.199
easy of a read, if it's too easy of a watch,
938
00:53:55.719 --> 00:53:58.800
then you're not being challenged and.
939
00:53:58.719 --> 00:53:59.760
You must be challenging.
940
00:53:59.800 --> 00:54:04.920
This has to happen anyway, So thanks so much, and
941
00:54:05.199 --> 00:54:07.199
I hope you guys get a chance to see Foundation
942
00:54:07.320 --> 00:54:07.760
on TV.
943
00:54:08.239 --> 00:54:11.360
We'll all eagerly await season three and when it comes out,
944
00:54:11.599 --> 00:54:14.079
I'm sure we'll be talking all about it absolutely.
945
00:54:14.920 --> 00:54:15.920
Thanks thanks kid.
946
00:54:23.480 --> 00:54:25.639
But it was the last episode we were talking about
947
00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:29.519
the turnament. We were forced into using metal detectors for
948
00:54:29.679 --> 00:54:30.800
the Universary.
949
00:54:30.400 --> 00:54:33.000
Star Trek Machine run, and as I had mentioned in
950
00:54:33.039 --> 00:54:35.519
our last segment, there was good reason to do that.
951
00:54:36.280 --> 00:54:38.519
Yeah, there were death threats and so forth, so we
952
00:54:38.519 --> 00:54:39.559
really didn't have any choice.
953
00:54:39.559 --> 00:54:40.960
The government there man there to do.
954
00:54:41.159 --> 00:54:43.440
But in those days, the metal detectors were not good
955
00:54:43.480 --> 00:54:45.800
and everyone was setting it off and running really late.
956
00:54:45.880 --> 00:54:49.119
It was a bad thought and everyone was screaming, Gene, Gene, Gene.
957
00:54:49.239 --> 00:54:53.039
So we covered thanks to Richard Arnold ben Edick stillwell
958
00:54:53.239 --> 00:54:56.360
and then we opened, and I think it was one
959
00:54:56.400 --> 00:54:59.039
of the highlights of our career what happened. Everyone was
960
00:54:59.079 --> 00:55:01.360
really there for Gene, although the rest of the cast
961
00:55:01.519 --> 00:55:04.760
was there, and was Gene ron Berry the first like
962
00:55:04.840 --> 00:55:08.400
producer writer that was really recognized.
963
00:55:07.760 --> 00:55:09.000
In that fandom way.
964
00:55:10.519 --> 00:55:12.719
I say he was certainly one of the first, really,
965
00:55:13.320 --> 00:55:16.320
but I don't think anybody was prepared for when Rachel
966
00:55:16.880 --> 00:55:18.119
rolled to Chene out.
967
00:55:17.920 --> 00:55:19.760
In a wheelchair in front of the audience.
968
00:55:19.800 --> 00:55:23.280
People didn't really know that Gene was already already somewhat
969
00:55:23.320 --> 00:55:27.639
convalescent at that point, and she did bring him out
970
00:55:27.719 --> 00:55:31.639
with rot. Yeah that was great, and you know, it
971
00:55:31.760 --> 00:55:34.559
just took the audience a moment to adjust. But then
972
00:55:34.599 --> 00:55:40.000
of course there was a thunderous standing ovation and Gene
973
00:55:40.079 --> 00:55:43.280
was clearly taken aback, and yeah, it was special. Had
974
00:55:43.320 --> 00:55:46.159
some visionary things to say to the audience, including the
975
00:55:46.199 --> 00:55:51.119
fact that the soul of a writer remains humble even
976
00:55:51.119 --> 00:55:51.400
in the.
977
00:55:51.320 --> 00:55:52.559
Face of agagulation.
978
00:55:52.880 --> 00:55:57.239
Yeah, that was and then professed that the truth of
979
00:55:57.280 --> 00:56:00.519
everything was that he loved everyone to get there, which
980
00:56:00.599 --> 00:56:04.199
which was wonderful. So it was a well deserved moment
981
00:56:04.239 --> 00:56:08.960
for Jeane. Very poignant. But you know, sadly, just a
982
00:56:08.960 --> 00:56:10.880
few months later, Jean passed.
983
00:56:10.559 --> 00:56:13.639
Away, right, I do remember that. But that was the
984
00:56:13.760 --> 00:56:16.360
last time the whole cast appeared with Gene.
985
00:56:17.000 --> 00:56:19.519
Yeah, and it was the last time Jeane appeared on stage.
986
00:56:19.960 --> 00:56:20.400
Correct.
987
00:56:20.400 --> 00:56:22.679
But then we had the whole cast again when we
988
00:56:22.719 --> 00:56:25.559
did that show with Paramount.
989
00:56:25.400 --> 00:56:29.239
Back in the hospital. Yeah, everyone was there, we did,
990
00:56:29.360 --> 00:56:29.760
we did.
991
00:56:29.840 --> 00:56:33.599
But the story, the behind the scenes story of Jean's
992
00:56:33.760 --> 00:56:36.559
passing and then our ongoing.
993
00:56:36.199 --> 00:56:39.719
Work with Majel is that was interesting, like a story itself.
994
00:56:39.880 --> 00:56:40.800
Shall we get into that?
995
00:56:40.880 --> 00:56:42.159
Are saying attle bit now?
996
00:56:42.400 --> 00:56:42.599
Yeah?
997
00:56:42.639 --> 00:56:45.360
Okay, yeah, all right, you were in the middle of that.
998
00:56:45.480 --> 00:56:49.199
Oh and then also during the shrine thing, Uh, there
999
00:56:49.320 --> 00:56:51.719
was a there was a problem with Majel and Nimoy
1000
00:56:51.760 --> 00:56:54.239
if I remember, he was afraid.
1001
00:56:54.639 --> 00:57:03.679
Uh Leonard had some uh grievances with Gene, Okay, and
1002
00:57:04.039 --> 00:57:09.800
uh as did Bill and I mean, you know, without
1003
00:57:09.880 --> 00:57:12.480
dredging up the past, I think that there there had
1004
00:57:12.519 --> 00:57:15.920
been some animosity over some different things that honestly were.
1005
00:57:15.800 --> 00:57:19.639
Water under the bridge. But I think everybody put their
1006
00:57:19.719 --> 00:57:20.519
best face on.
1007
00:57:21.159 --> 00:57:24.079
And yeah, from a fan unattending point of view, I
1008
00:57:24.119 --> 00:57:26.559
think anybody there was. There was stuff going on behind
1009
00:57:26.559 --> 00:57:27.000
the scenes.
1010
00:57:27.119 --> 00:57:30.519
Yeah, I mean, without naming names, I think it was
1011
00:57:30.559 --> 00:57:33.719
determined that the cast was not going to appear on
1012
00:57:33.840 --> 00:57:38.719
stage with Gene and the entire and rather that Gene
1013
00:57:38.719 --> 00:57:40.599
would then come on after the rest of the.
1014
00:57:40.599 --> 00:57:46.199
Cast had appeared. Yes, how what happened is what happened? Okay, Yeah, yeah.
1015
00:57:46.039 --> 00:57:48.079
So there were all this behind the scenes stuff.
1016
00:57:48.480 --> 00:57:51.920
It's still a special moment. It was an amazing moment. Anyway.
1017
00:57:52.119 --> 00:57:55.039
A few months later, Jean passed away, which was horrible
1018
00:57:55.559 --> 00:58:02.960
and not unexpected, and h Major essentially assumed the altar
1019
00:58:03.039 --> 00:58:06.599
of the roden Berry estate, both privately as well as
1020
00:58:06.800 --> 00:58:10.880
at our conventions, continuing to talk a lot about Gene
1021
00:58:11.159 --> 00:58:13.519
and the great work that he had done, as well
1022
00:58:13.559 --> 00:58:16.440
as her own experience in Star Trek. And Major was
1023
00:58:16.679 --> 00:58:17.760
an amazing order.
1024
00:58:18.239 --> 00:58:19.960
Yeah, she was great with speeches.
1025
00:58:20.159 --> 00:58:23.920
And you know, really delivered some some great speeches to
1026
00:58:23.960 --> 00:58:25.320
our audiences. Well.
1027
00:58:25.400 --> 00:58:27.760
During this period, Major.
1028
00:58:27.679 --> 00:58:31.400
And I had gotten quite close, I remember, and Major
1029
00:58:31.519 --> 00:58:34.920
and Jane were living in uh forgive me it's either
1030
00:58:35.079 --> 00:58:37.960
Errol Flynn or Carry Grant, one of those two guys
1031
00:58:38.000 --> 00:58:41.079
in that person's lash and in bel Air. Yeah, very
1032
00:58:41.199 --> 00:58:45.960
historic house that they had renovated beautifully, and you know
1033
00:58:46.000 --> 00:58:47.880
it was it was an amazing place.
1034
00:58:48.039 --> 00:58:49.760
This used to be carry grandsons.
1035
00:58:50.599 --> 00:58:54.039
Yeah, he and Hutton owned it at one time.
1036
00:58:54.239 --> 00:58:57.239
Have you ever had anybody find out where you live
1037
00:58:57.320 --> 00:58:59.159
in We're.
1038
00:58:59.199 --> 00:59:01.920
We're on all those lists. Yeah, people come over here
1039
00:59:01.920 --> 00:59:06.239
and start. The reason is the gates up there went up.
1040
00:59:06.400 --> 00:59:08.079
It was one day I came out the front door
1041
00:59:08.079 --> 00:59:11.159
and there was a there was a bus sitting in
1042
00:59:11.239 --> 00:59:13.239
the driveway, I mean right in front of the door
1043
00:59:13.599 --> 00:59:16.719
with They said later because we called on them, and
1044
00:59:17.360 --> 00:59:20.400
they said later. There were seventy a Japanese businessmen who
1045
00:59:20.679 --> 00:59:21.440
had come.
1046
00:59:21.280 --> 00:59:22.800
Over and wanted to see the house.
1047
00:59:25.639 --> 00:59:27.239
Oh, friendly and nice, but it's frightening.
1048
00:59:27.800 --> 00:59:28.719
It's very frightening.
1049
00:59:29.320 --> 00:59:32.960
Was famous for her parties. I remember that, and I
1050
00:59:33.000 --> 00:59:36.400
would get invited to her parties and which were great
1051
00:59:36.440 --> 00:59:38.840
and she would bring in a sushi chef and a
1052
00:59:38.880 --> 00:59:43.079
lot of the sort of the creative community of Hollywood.
1053
00:59:42.559 --> 00:59:44.880
But old would show an older community.
1054
00:59:45.480 --> 00:59:47.840
Yeah, there were some of the young ones like me.
1055
00:59:48.000 --> 00:59:52.159
I was like fresh behind the ear right. Yeah, it
1056
00:59:52.239 --> 00:59:54.480
was an older guard Yeah, as well as I think
1057
00:59:54.519 --> 00:59:56.400
a lot of their friends quite honestly from the bel
1058
00:59:56.440 --> 00:59:56.920
Air country.
1059
00:59:57.119 --> 00:59:58.719
Yeah well she was.
1060
00:59:59.039 --> 00:59:59.280
Yeah.
1061
00:59:59.519 --> 01:00:00.280
So uh.
1062
01:00:01.159 --> 01:00:05.199
Out of my attending these parties, I discovered that the
1063
01:00:05.360 --> 01:00:09.679
Roddenberry's had a greenhouse, and I, being a horticulturist, uh,
1064
01:00:09.760 --> 01:00:11.760
you know, Major would let me go in there. And
1065
01:00:11.800 --> 01:00:14.679
I discovered that she had an orchid collection. Remember that
1066
01:00:15.239 --> 01:00:18.280
was that was not didn't it was not under good
1067
01:00:18.400 --> 01:00:21.880
upkeep as a gene passing away. So I said, Major,
1068
01:00:22.280 --> 01:00:25.719
let me come in once a month and take care
1069
01:00:25.760 --> 01:00:28.440
of your orchids, you know, because they need help and
1070
01:00:28.480 --> 01:00:29.760
it's an expensive collection.
1071
01:00:30.000 --> 01:00:32.039
She said, that's wonderful to go ahead and do it,
1072
01:00:32.440 --> 01:00:32.920
and I did.
1073
01:00:32.960 --> 01:00:35.880
So I go in there and one day when I'm
1074
01:00:35.920 --> 01:00:38.960
in the Roddenberry State and I'm talking to Majel, I
1075
01:00:39.039 --> 01:00:39.639
look over.
1076
01:00:39.519 --> 01:00:43.840
On the floor there's a pile of scripts like this high.
1077
01:00:43.800 --> 01:00:48.199
Up off the floor right in the greenhouse, no, in
1078
01:00:48.280 --> 01:00:48.880
the rodbery.
1079
01:00:49.760 --> 01:00:51.320
And I said to her, you know what, what are
1080
01:00:51.360 --> 01:00:52.039
the all of scripts?
1081
01:00:52.079 --> 01:00:54.880
She said, oh, those are all those are all scripts
1082
01:00:54.880 --> 01:00:57.480
for projects that Gene never got to develop.
1083
01:00:57.960 --> 01:00:58.199
Yeah.
1084
01:00:58.320 --> 01:01:01.679
Right, So I once I pulled my chin off the floor.
1085
01:01:01.880 --> 01:01:03.440
I said, let me kind of look at those is
1086
01:01:03.679 --> 01:01:04.119
of course.
1087
01:01:04.519 --> 01:01:06.599
So I go over and I start looking, and I
1088
01:01:06.639 --> 01:01:16.199
see development versions of Questar, Est, quest Or and uh
1089
01:01:16.880 --> 01:01:19.960
several different Roddenberry projects that you know had never come
1090
01:01:20.000 --> 01:01:21.239
to fruish we had.
1091
01:01:21.840 --> 01:01:23.960
We had heard of the names of them, right, we
1092
01:01:24.000 --> 01:01:25.760
had heard some of the names, but a lot of
1093
01:01:25.760 --> 01:01:26.840
those we had not heard of.
1094
01:01:28.039 --> 01:01:33.519
And Uh Andromeda and uh Ar Conflict was in there, yes,
1095
01:01:33.960 --> 01:01:38.360
and uh uh one or two other projects.
1096
01:01:38.519 --> 01:01:40.639
So this is another one of these stories you're telling me.
1097
01:01:40.800 --> 01:01:41.800
I have never heard this one.
1098
01:01:42.800 --> 01:01:45.719
I can't believe what well you had to have tangentially
1099
01:01:45.840 --> 01:01:48.840
known this because I said to him at the time
1100
01:01:48.880 --> 01:01:50.360
we were represented.
1101
01:01:49.840 --> 01:01:53.639
By which we were Yeah, and uh no, I know that,
1102
01:01:53.679 --> 01:01:55.599
but you never told me the story about the scripts.
1103
01:01:55.639 --> 01:01:59.079
Oh big part that you never told me. How POW
1104
01:01:59.119 --> 01:02:01.039
did major up at all?
1105
01:02:02.280 --> 01:02:04.559
I said to Angel, I said.
1106
01:02:04.320 --> 01:02:07.559
Angel, you're sitting on a gold mine of these undeveloped
1107
01:02:07.679 --> 01:02:12.960
Rodenberry stories. Let's take them to our agent and maybe
1108
01:02:13.000 --> 01:02:16.079
we can develop something. So we did. We brought them
1109
01:02:16.079 --> 01:02:20.800
to our agents whose name who remain nameless. I don't
1110
01:02:20.840 --> 01:02:22.719
think he's with them anymore. But he was at the
1111
01:02:22.760 --> 01:02:27.920
time and went in and I said, and I brought
1112
01:02:27.920 --> 01:02:31.880
Maje and I said, here's Major Rodenberry, Geen Rodenberry's wife,
1113
01:02:31.920 --> 01:02:39.159
and we have all of these undeveloped Rodenberry intellectual problems. Hey,
1114
01:02:39.159 --> 01:02:42.800
guys said, this is unbelievable. Let's take these and we'll
1115
01:02:42.840 --> 01:02:44.440
develop them. Fulfillment team.
1116
01:02:44.480 --> 01:02:45.280
And you're in the room.
1117
01:02:45.960 --> 01:02:47.840
Yeah no, I mean I was like and so and so.
1118
01:02:47.880 --> 01:02:50.599
He says, all right, I'll get back to you. And
1119
01:02:50.679 --> 01:02:52.880
he comes back to me and he says, listen, we've
1120
01:02:52.920 --> 01:02:57.280
attached Biller and Brancatto, two of the hottest writers in
1121
01:02:57.360 --> 01:03:01.280
Hollywood right now, to work with you and MAJORL to
1122
01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:05.960
develop Specter I think it was called. And he said
1123
01:03:06.039 --> 01:03:09.840
you yeah, yeah, you Creational the executive producers.
1124
01:03:10.239 --> 01:03:13.360
Major will be the broker the deal with Biller and.
1125
01:03:13.679 --> 01:03:16.400
I don't remember having a TV show with Creation Entertainment
1126
01:03:16.400 --> 01:03:17.519
as executive producers.
1127
01:03:17.559 --> 01:03:22.800
Well, that's because it never happened. Why no, Well, so
1128
01:03:24.719 --> 01:03:28.000
the thing started ramping up. Biller and Barncatto wrote a
1129
01:03:28.039 --> 01:03:34.159
treatment and everything was fantastic. And then I started to
1130
01:03:34.239 --> 01:03:42.760
notice a lack of communication and uh tangentially, somehow I
1131
01:03:42.800 --> 01:03:45.679
had heard all of a sudden that there was another
1132
01:03:45.880 --> 01:03:50.800
project by Roden Berry in development, the Earth Final Conflict.
1133
01:03:51.320 --> 01:03:55.360
So I call up our guy. He said, you know what,
1134
01:03:55.360 --> 01:03:58.360
what what happened to Specter? Why am I hearing about
1135
01:03:58.360 --> 01:04:01.519
Earth Final Conflict? He says, well, we're are also developing
1136
01:04:01.599 --> 01:04:04.840
that with Major as well. And I said, well, okay,
1137
01:04:04.880 --> 01:04:08.159
I'm not aware of anything about that. How are we involved?
1138
01:04:08.159 --> 01:04:10.519
And he says, no, you're not involved. This is just
1139
01:04:10.639 --> 01:04:15.960
us working with Major in the Earth Final Well, we
1140
01:04:16.039 --> 01:04:21.320
didn't understand that at the time. But long story short,
1141
01:04:21.400 --> 01:04:23.840
as well, you know, but our viewers don't necessarily know.
1142
01:04:25.079 --> 01:04:27.239
We got a strip. Mind.
1143
01:04:29.079 --> 01:04:33.320
They not only developed their Final Conflict, but also Andromeda
1144
01:04:34.039 --> 01:04:40.280
with Majel and cut us out, and our potential career
1145
01:04:40.440 --> 01:04:45.719
as executive producers and showrunners was cut to a untimely
1146
01:04:45.760 --> 01:04:46.639
and quick death.
1147
01:04:47.320 --> 01:04:49.239
Yeah, that doesn't sound too good now.
1148
01:04:49.440 --> 01:04:52.719
It wasn't good, and and it was a source of
1149
01:04:53.159 --> 01:04:57.880
huge pain and animosity between Major and myself for.
1150
01:04:57.840 --> 01:05:01.360
The rest of our life. Well, I think reconcile and
1151
01:05:01.400 --> 01:05:06.400
I think for years, for years, But as Mangel grew
1152
01:05:06.559 --> 01:05:07.079
old and.
1153
01:05:08.880 --> 01:05:15.559
Elderly and infirm, my sense of affection for her and
1154
01:05:15.639 --> 01:05:17.360
of course for Gene.
1155
01:05:17.960 --> 01:05:19.960
Uh just kind of overrode that.
1156
01:05:20.159 --> 01:05:22.199
And you know, as you're getting towards the end of
1157
01:05:22.239 --> 01:05:28.440
somebody's life, we're really gonna unless it's the most hugest transgression,
1158
01:05:29.079 --> 01:05:31.000
we're gonna really worry about that.
1159
01:05:31.119 --> 01:05:33.840
I I, we had to let it go.
1160
01:05:34.679 --> 01:05:38.920
And the last you know, year or two with Machel,
1161
01:05:39.079 --> 01:05:42.719
you know, I was back to speaking terms with her,
1162
01:05:42.719 --> 01:05:46.000
and she appeared for us, you know, a few more times,
1163
01:05:46.519 --> 01:05:49.840
and then the great Major Rodenberry passed away, which is
1164
01:05:49.920 --> 01:05:56.280
very sad. And Eugene rod had grown up from the
1165
01:05:56.320 --> 01:05:58.760
little boy who slept in a box underneath one of
1166
01:05:58.800 --> 01:06:02.719
our vendor tables show had grown up into a wonderful,
1167
01:06:02.800 --> 01:06:08.559
talented young man who now assumed the Rodenberry mantle, and
1168
01:06:09.280 --> 01:06:17.599
along with his partner Trevor, actually began using the Rodenberry
1169
01:06:18.079 --> 01:06:24.599
cachet to develop any number of projects intellectual properties themselves.
1170
01:06:24.599 --> 01:06:27.400
And I thought that they did a great job sort
1171
01:06:27.400 --> 01:06:30.000
of continuing the Rodenberry legacy.
1172
01:06:30.079 --> 01:06:30.519
Yeah, they did.
1173
01:06:30.559 --> 01:06:32.880
I'm said, they're not part of Vegas anymore, but maybe
1174
01:06:32.880 --> 01:06:33.360
in the future.
1175
01:06:33.719 --> 01:06:35.679
I would hope that we'll see them again in the future.
1176
01:06:35.760 --> 01:06:40.440
But that's sort of the untold story of our relationship
1177
01:06:40.480 --> 01:06:43.480
with Majel after Gene passed. This is the first time
1178
01:06:43.519 --> 01:06:47.599
the story has ever been discussed publicly, and again, I
1179
01:06:47.639 --> 01:06:52.639
think my overall feeling is that I'm always gonna love
1180
01:06:53.280 --> 01:06:56.679
Gene and Machel, but especially Gene. He was a mentor
1181
01:06:56.760 --> 01:07:00.920
to us. He was a wonderful man. He believed in
1182
01:07:01.000 --> 01:07:05.639
Star Trek fans. He believed in the future of humanity,
1183
01:07:06.440 --> 01:07:09.159
and you know, you take a look at society today
1184
01:07:09.199 --> 01:07:11.079
and sometimes you really have to wonder how he could
1185
01:07:11.119 --> 01:07:17.760
have such a humanistic feeling, especially now. Yeah, but Jean's inspiration,
1186
01:07:18.239 --> 01:07:22.440
his enthusiasm, his belief in the good of humanity will
1187
01:07:22.480 --> 01:07:24.760
always be huge inspirations to me.
1188
01:07:25.039 --> 01:07:25.760
And he was willing.
1189
01:07:25.840 --> 01:07:26.039
Yeah.
1190
01:07:26.159 --> 01:07:29.599
No, definitely, that was a great story. Thanks, We'll be
1191
01:07:29.679 --> 01:07:30.440
back next week.
1192
01:07:30.519 --> 01:07:35.519
Okay, Wow, see them off is a very.
1193
01:07:35.320 --> 01:07:37.639
Cool dude, man alive.
1194
01:07:38.000 --> 01:07:40.239
That was one of the best interviews I've ever seen,
1195
01:07:40.320 --> 01:07:44.280
and Gary and Adam never disappointed in their Creation looks
1196
01:07:44.280 --> 01:07:45.760
back segments that I could listen to.
1197
01:07:45.679 --> 01:07:48.760
Those guys for hours, for hours, for hours sometimes I do.
1198
01:07:50.280 --> 01:07:54.119
So what's going on now, what's happening with Creation Entertainments?
1199
01:07:54.159 --> 01:07:57.199
Well, if you love Star Trek like I do, then
1200
01:07:57.280 --> 01:07:59.400
you're pretty cool and I want to know you. Also,
1201
01:08:00.000 --> 01:08:02.119
A great way to know me would be to see
1202
01:08:02.119 --> 01:08:05.079
me and Kit and most of us over at the
1203
01:08:05.159 --> 01:08:08.360
Creation Trek tours. We're all over the country. You can
1204
01:08:08.360 --> 01:08:13.159
find us in Las Vegas, Orlando, New Jersey, Chicago, wherever
1205
01:08:13.199 --> 01:08:17.039
you live. Basically we're close by. But especially I want
1206
01:08:17.079 --> 01:08:19.560
you to check out the show in Las Vegas. That's
1207
01:08:19.600 --> 01:08:23.960
this August. We're going to have Strange Worlds guests, people
1208
01:08:24.039 --> 01:08:26.720
from the Kelvin movies, I mean.
1209
01:08:27.000 --> 01:08:29.439
William Shatner the original series.
1210
01:08:29.279 --> 01:08:31.600
And Walter Conig I know, can't wait.
1211
01:08:31.439 --> 01:08:36.199
For that Deep Space nine Next Generation, all of your
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favorite actors, Lass producers.
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The thirtieth anniversary or Voyager. We have the entire cast.
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I was bearing the lead.
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You're right, the big news is Voyagers thirtieth anniversary. We're
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going to give them a gigantic celebration. We love the show,
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we love the series.
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I know you do. To join us for that. Thank
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you kid, Thank you, and.
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Tune in for our next episode five where we have
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some more great stuff uh to tell you guys at
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a Great New Interviews stage
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A