1
00:00:00,000 -->
00:00:02,220
Can the government take or freeze my Bitcoin?
2
00:00:02,880 -->
00:00:05,420
Memorize 12 words and you can cross that border.
3
00:00:05,680 -->
00:00:07,700
They can strip search you, they can do whatever they want.
4
00:00:08,060 -->
00:00:11,280
You know, try to get across the border with gold, you're going to be sticking them up your ass.
5
00:00:11,540 -->
00:00:18,760
What I'll add to that is that the best way to protect your Bitcoin from the government
6
00:00:18,760 -->
00:00:21,160
is for them to never know that you even had it.
7
00:00:21,500 -->
00:00:24,500
Why is Bitcoin crashing when the stock market is fine?
8
00:00:24,820 -->
00:00:27,720
You are being given a gift at these price points.
9
00:00:27,720 -->
00:00:31,500
What happens to my Bitcoin when I die? Has anyone dealt with this as an executor?
10
00:00:31,940 -->
00:00:34,840
Well, fortunately, I haven't dealt with it as an executor because I'm still alive.
11
00:00:40,220 -->
00:00:44,740
Here we go. Here are the top five questions.
12
00:00:45,140 -->
00:00:48,720
What happens to my Bitcoin when I die? Has anyone dealt with this as an executor?
13
00:00:49,840 -->
00:00:52,760
Well, fortunately, I haven't dealt with it as an executor because I'm still alive.
14
00:00:52,760 -->
00:00:57,380
And I haven't had any friends who had Bitcoin who've died.
15
00:00:57,720 -->
00:01:01,260
You know, look, it depends on where your Bitcoin is held.
16
00:01:01,300 -->
00:01:14,240
As we've discussed in the past, you can, you know, if you have it in your Fidelity account or your Swan account or your Strike account or your, you know, River account, you know, you probably named, you know, it's part of your estate.
17
00:01:14,240 -->
00:01:18,920
And, you know, they've probably got a process whereby they'll get you your either your Bitcoin or your money.
18
00:01:19,100 -->
00:01:22,580
You know, if you're an heir or a descendant or you're entitled to it.
19
00:01:22,580 -->
00:01:33,440
And if you've self-custodied it, I think what most of us who've done who have self-custodied our Bitcoin is we've created a treasure map for, you know, our wife and heirs and others.
20
00:01:33,440 -->
00:01:41,660
And we put that treasure map in a very safe place, maybe a couple of safe places, because I know somebody had the treasure map in the Pacific Palisades fire and it burned away.
21
00:01:41,660 -->
00:01:54,120
I mean, that treasure map represents kind of a how-to for, you know, in my case, my wife or my kids to figure out, you know, what I've got, where it is, what the seed words are.
22
00:01:54,360 -->
00:01:59,700
And, you know, with the help of somebody who knows Bitcoin, they could very easily retrieve that wealth.
23
00:01:59,700 -->
00:02:11,020
And so I think if you self-custody, you know, it's incumbent upon you to be responsible and figure out a way to create multiple copies of your seed words and store them safely.
24
00:02:11,960 -->
00:02:14,320
There are also companies that help you do that.
25
00:02:15,820 -->
00:02:18,460
You know, Unchained Capital does it.
26
00:02:18,840 -->
00:02:22,300
I think OnRamp and there are a few others that are all very good at it.
27
00:02:22,300 -->
00:02:32,600
And so, you know, for people who aren't technically savvy or don't trust themselves to store their own seed words, there are services that will help you provide that and they'll take care of it.
28
00:02:32,640 -->
00:02:36,100
So I think this is a solvable problem, but it is a real problem.
29
00:02:36,220 -->
00:02:41,960
I mean, as anyone who's familiar with Bitcoin knows, if you lose the keys, if you lose your private keys, the money's gone.
30
00:02:42,420 -->
00:02:43,500
There's no do-over.
31
00:02:43,640 -->
00:02:44,700
There's no Federal Reserve.
32
00:02:44,880 -->
00:02:46,320
There's no FDIC.
33
00:02:46,720 -->
00:02:47,880
You know, the money's gone.
34
00:02:47,880 -->
00:02:53,540
And so Bitcoin has to be stored very securely and very safely, and that takes some thought.
35
00:02:54,260 -->
00:02:55,880
But it's not impossible.
36
00:02:56,160 -->
00:02:57,280
I mean, anybody can handle this.
37
00:02:57,340 -->
00:03:01,940
Even if you're not technical, you can get other people to help you handle it, people that you trust.
38
00:03:02,100 -->
00:03:04,280
So that would be my answer to the question.
39
00:03:04,500 -->
00:03:06,120
Self-custody is freedom.
40
00:03:06,780 -->
00:03:08,940
But freedom comes with responsibility.
41
00:03:09,480 -->
00:03:12,360
And that's exactly the gap Swan is trying to close.
42
00:03:12,360 -->
00:03:18,420
With Swan Vault, you get a guided two of three multi-sig setup designed to give you control
43
00:03:18,420 -->
00:03:21,860
of your Bitcoin without having to figure out every piece alone.
44
00:03:22,160 -->
00:03:25,680
You hold the keys, you get expert help setting it up.
45
00:03:25,720 -->
00:03:30,540
Because the goal isn't just to buy Bitcoin, it's to know how you're going to hold it for
46
00:03:30,540 -->
00:03:32,020
the people who come after you.
47
00:03:33,300 -->
00:03:35,060
Swan, Bitcoin, not crypto.
48
00:03:35,880 -->
00:03:37,660
Visit swanbitcoin.com today.
49
00:03:40,320 -->
00:03:41,520
Now, back to the show.
50
00:03:41,1000 -->
00:03:43,580
George, Bob, you want to add to that?
51
00:03:44,100 -->
00:03:47,480
Yeah, this has been a real issue for me, I will tell you right now,
52
00:03:47,520 -->
00:03:50,760
and especially coupled with some of the things we've been discussing.
53
00:03:50,920 -->
00:03:57,820
You know, I'm trying to move myself away from anything that has a counterparty between me and Bitcoin.
54
00:03:57,820 -->
00:04:02,460
And so, you know, my goal in the future is to have more and more Bitcoin in self-custody.
55
00:04:02,840 -->
00:04:07,400
That means in possession and able to move it in peer-to-peer electronic cash.
56
00:04:07,400 -->
00:04:14,100
and the issue, of course, is that there is an asymmetric risk award for criminals regarding
57
00:04:14,100 -->
00:04:19,560
Bitcoin. It's unusual. You know, I used to be a cop and most criminals are stupid. They're dumb
58
00:04:19,560 -->
00:04:25,560
as rocks. I mean, they're just idiots and they're easy to catch. They're easy, whether it's armed
59
00:04:25,560 -->
00:04:31,700
robberies, whatever. They're just stupid. The problem is that even stupid criminals that have
60
00:04:31,700 -->
00:04:37,200
violence behind them are able to have an asymmetric reward in this case if they're able to get the
61
00:04:37,200 -->
00:04:41,980
12 words. And I'm talking about, of course, in this case, wrench attacks. But the other problem
62
00:04:41,980 -->
00:04:47,1000
is with AI on the scene now, we're seeing social engineering attacks that are becoming much more
63
00:04:47,1000 -->
00:04:52,380
sophisticated. I mean, much more. So you're going to have to, in the future, you're going to have to
64
00:04:52,380 -->
00:04:58,580
reevaluate your security situation. For me, what I've done is I've had to geo-disperse my custody.
65
00:04:58,920 -->
00:05:03,480
And if you're not familiar with that, I'm not going to go into how I've done it, but you can
66
00:05:03,480 -->
00:05:06,180
just go into one of the AI agents and say, hey, how can I
67
00:05:06,180 -->
00:05:22,076
geo disperse safely my Bitcoin wallets and still maintain self custody And then you know I used a trusted friend that I can help that I can call in an emergency and that my family can call in an emergency You know
68
00:05:22,576 -->
00:05:27,316
we all expect to be here forever, but, you know, from someone who's come from a very
69
00:05:27,316 -->
00:05:32,396
violent past at times, I can guarantee you that many friends that I had in the morning went out
70
00:05:32,396 -->
00:05:36,376
and they never came back and they were gone. And I just recently lost a friend that way.
71
00:05:36,376 -->
00:05:42,256
so you need to be prepared for this and you need to make sure that the people that are behind you
72
00:05:42,256 -->
00:05:47,976
your loved ones can answer the questions of how do i get to that bitcoin how can i recover that
73
00:05:47,976 -->
00:05:55,636
i'll just add i think you guys covered it well that um the like the unchained on-ramp type
74
00:05:55,636 -->
00:06:01,196
organization especially if you're building a bigger stack you've got a bigger stack you'd
75
00:06:01,196 -->
00:06:05,796
probably seriously consider them because they implement what are called multi-sig solutions,
76
00:06:06,476 -->
00:06:11,816
which means that they're actually in like, for instance, in the case of Unchained, three sets
77
00:06:11,816 -->
00:06:20,636
of keys and you need two of the three to move. And they hold one. So they can't take your Bitcoin
78
00:06:20,636 -->
00:06:26,216
because they only hold one of three and you hold one and you either or you could hold both, but you
79
00:06:26,216 -->
00:06:30,396
could put them in two different locations or as George has, you know, have a trusted friend or
80
00:06:30,396 -->
00:06:36,856
family member that maybe holds it. Um, that's what I, I do a lot of this. Um, a lot of the
81
00:06:36,856 -->
00:06:43,576
Bitcoin hold for myself and for my companies is done in these multi-sigs and, um, the, all three
82
00:06:43,576 -->
00:06:49,056
keys are in three different States across the country. Like they're, they're geographically
83
00:06:49,056 -->
00:06:54,696
dispersed. So whether there's a natural disaster, like the Palisades fires or a tsunami or, you
84
00:06:54,696 -->
00:07:03,156
know whatever um or a wrench attack um or a death like like you can insulate yourself from those so
85
00:07:03,156 -->
00:07:10,256
i think as you're starting out um you know try try self-custody in the traditional manner get
86
00:07:10,256 -->
00:07:17,456
yourself a trezor you know something like that and use those products and then later on um if you
87
00:07:17,456 -->
00:07:21,796
get a bigger stack maybe a bitcoin plus or something like that now start thinking about
88
00:07:21,796 -->
00:07:23,516
having a multi-sig solution.
89
00:07:24,016 -->
00:07:25,096
Okay, thank you.
90
00:07:25,176 -->
00:07:26,156
That was both good answers.
91
00:07:26,516 -->
00:07:27,316
Next question.
92
00:07:28,036 -->
00:07:29,956
Can the government take or freeze my Bitcoin?
93
00:07:31,316 -->
00:07:33,076
And related question prior to this was,
94
00:07:33,196 -->
00:07:34,856
can the government stop Bitcoin?
95
00:07:35,516 -->
00:07:37,716
There was a time when the government actions,
96
00:07:37,936 -->
00:07:40,816
you know, were perhaps a threat to stopping Bitcoin
97
00:07:40,816 -->
00:07:42,836
if they shut down all the exchanges
98
00:07:42,836 -->
00:07:43,956
or taxed the hell out of it.
99
00:07:43,996 -->
00:07:45,776
I think that given what we've seen
100
00:07:45,776 -->
00:07:46,816
with the Trump administration,
101
00:07:47,376 -->
00:07:48,976
you know, the Clarity Act, et cetera,
102
00:07:49,496 -->
00:07:51,256
Genius Act, Clarity Act's not passed yet,
103
00:07:51,256 -->
00:07:52,916
but it's hopefully on the way to being passed.
104
00:07:53,836 -->
00:07:55,616
The government is not going to stop Bitcoin.
105
00:07:55,736 -->
00:07:56,556
They've embraced it.
106
00:07:56,716 -->
00:07:58,276
Big organizations have embraced it
107
00:07:58,276 -->
00:07:59,396
like Fidelity and BlackRock.
108
00:07:59,536 -->
00:08:01,076
I mean, they're not going to stop it.
109
00:08:01,156 -->
00:08:02,716
But can the government take it
110
00:08:02,716 -->
00:08:03,916
is a legitimate question.
111
00:08:04,236 -->
00:08:05,176
And the answer is yes.
112
00:08:05,716 -->
00:08:08,496
And I say that because we have a historical precedent.
113
00:08:08,956 -->
00:08:12,656
In 1933, when they were doing a monetary reset
114
00:08:12,656 -->
00:08:14,456
and we had the Great Depression,
115
00:08:14,956 -->
00:08:17,536
you know, deflation was killing the economy.
116
00:08:18,576 -->
00:08:20,656
President Roosevelt at that point in time said,
117
00:08:20,736 -->
00:08:21,176
you know what?
118
00:08:21,256 -->
00:08:26,236
we've got a problem with this gold standard. We need to grab all the gold. And so he issued
119
00:08:26,236 -->
00:08:32,176
Executive Order 6102, and he confiscated all the citizens' gold. So, you know, now that was a long
120
00:08:32,176 -->
00:08:38,076
time ago, and no one's, and amazingly, rather amazingly, the Supreme Court upheld that, which
121
00:08:38,076 -->
00:08:44,836
was just a travesty, but they did. And because, I guess, you know, he viewed, you know, deflation
122
00:08:44,836 -->
00:08:48,836
as an existential threat to the country, and therefore he was justified in taking this action.
123
00:08:48,836 -->
00:08:56,476
um you know um a blue administration in the future that thinks that sound money and gold
124
00:08:56,476 -->
00:09:01,656
and silver and bitcoin are destroying their beautiful keynesian system um and recognizes
125
00:09:01,656 -->
00:09:06,496
that the monetary system is falling apart and the dollar is failing uh could reach the same
126
00:09:06,496 -->
00:09:11,176
conclusion and say it's those damn bitcoiners and gold guys that have done it we got to confiscate
127
00:09:11,176 -->
00:09:18,096
all that stuff um and uh and they could you know i mean if you have your coins at fidelity or
128
00:09:18,096 -->
00:09:23,556
BlackRock or Strike or any other, you know, licensed U.S. financial institution and the
129
00:09:23,556 -->
00:09:27,856
government, the FBI calls up and says, please tell us who all your customers are and what all
130
00:09:27,856 -->
00:09:32,876
their Bitcoin is and send all that Bitcoin to us and give them cash dollars in exchange for it.
131
00:09:32,916 -->
00:09:35,616
We're not going to steal it. We're going to pay them in today's dollars. Of course,
132
00:09:35,656 -->
00:09:39,876
the dollars are about to depreciate rapidly. They would have your Bitcoin and you would have
133
00:09:39,876 -->
00:09:45,676
dollars at the last set price. So the answer is yes, they can take it. However, if you have
134
00:09:45,676 -->
00:09:51,196
self-custody. This is the reason for self-custody and self-sovereignty. If you have decided to take
135
00:09:51,196 -->
00:09:58,876
possession of your Bitcoin through a treasure, a hardware cold wallet, and you have your key
136
00:09:58,876 -->
00:10:05,996
phrase, your 12 words or 24 words, absent holding a gun to your head and telling you to give them
137
00:10:05,996 -->
00:10:10,476
the words or they're going to kill you, and of course you can always claim you lost the words,
138
00:10:10,536 -->
00:10:14,376
the government cannot get your Bitcoin. They cannot take it. There's no way they can crack it.
139
00:10:14,376 -->
00:10:17,156
you have those coins.
140
00:10:17,676 -->
00:10:19,396
And in that respect,
141
00:10:19,396 -->
00:10:36,093
it even better than gold because you know your gold in your house and they show up with guns and they search your house they want to take the gold they can um but here they don get those words they don get those coins so the answer is um if you properly protected the answer is no um odds on a
142
00:10:36,093 -->
00:10:41,833
you know um uh 6102 like event occurring probably pretty low certainly with this administration
143
00:10:41,833 -->
00:10:49,273
but in a failing government with you know a liberal administration and a bunch of keynesians
144
00:10:49,273 -->
00:10:52,193
who are on the warpath, I mean, the odds aren't zero.
145
00:10:53,333 -->
00:10:57,473
So I, and I know amongst my friends and peers and investors,
146
00:10:57,473 -->
00:11:00,173
I've been, you know, pleasantly surprised
147
00:11:00,173 -->
00:11:03,793
to see everybody saying, hey, you know, I've got this ETF,
148
00:11:04,093 -->
00:11:07,713
but maybe I need to have some of this in cold storage in case.
149
00:11:09,713 -->
00:11:11,353
So the trend is in that direction.
150
00:11:11,433 -->
00:11:12,613
I think it's intelligently so.
151
00:11:12,713 -->
00:11:14,793
You just, you want to be prepared for all contingencies.
152
00:11:14,993 -->
00:11:16,673
So that's how I see it.
153
00:11:16,713 -->
00:11:17,673
What do you guys think?
154
00:11:17,713 -->
00:11:18,293
What do you think, George?
155
00:11:18,293 -->
00:11:38,713
Well, I don't know who sent in this question, but it's just a great question. I love it. And plus, it goes hand in hand with some of our discussion. You know, two people that are holding Bitcoin in cold storage with their own wallet connected to like, say, let's say a Sparrow wallet connected to a hardware device with connection to each other cannot be stopped. That's the beauty of Bitcoin. It's powerful.
156
00:11:39,373 -->
00:11:46,913
But quite frankly, anything, any counterparty that stands between you and that scenario that I just painted out, you could be stopped.
157
00:11:46,913 -->
00:11:52,453
And, you know, I love the fact that you brought up that discussion about gold and sailors' comments.
158
00:11:52,593 -->
00:11:54,533
I remember that was about a year and a half ago.
159
00:11:54,593 -->
00:12:02,713
And I thought it was really poorly thought out on his part because his whole argument was that the government would not do this because Bitcoin was not being used as money.
160
00:12:03,033 -->
00:12:04,533
I mean, very poorly thought out.
161
00:12:04,833 -->
00:12:06,333
First off, you can't predict the future.
162
00:12:06,333 -->
00:12:12,153
And as you mentioned already, what if some administration comes in that is very much anti-Bitcoin?
163
00:12:12,313 -->
00:12:17,453
And right now, Bitcoin is very closely aligned to one political party, perhaps one person, in fact.
164
00:12:17,973 -->
00:12:21,573
And now you have tremendous pushback going forward in this country.
165
00:12:22,093 -->
00:12:23,313
It would be very easy.
166
00:12:23,413 -->
00:12:25,813
It's incredibly easy to seize Bitcoin.
167
00:12:26,513 -->
00:12:30,393
If you have a counterparty between you and your custody, it's easy.
168
00:12:30,573 -->
00:12:34,673
Even in the fact that if you're using a multisig and it's with a third party,
169
00:12:34,673 -->
00:12:40,033
If that third party is contacted by the government and they say, hey, George is a bad actor, you will freeze his account.
170
00:12:40,113 -->
00:12:40,533
They will.
171
00:12:40,933 -->
00:12:45,413
They're not going to violate the U.S. government, the Fed, either the Treasury, well, the Treasury Department.
172
00:12:46,113 -->
00:12:47,593
They're not going to violate that.
173
00:12:48,193 -->
00:12:49,733
So it is a risk.
174
00:12:49,993 -->
00:12:58,373
And to protect yourself in this uncertain future, if we're in a fourth turning and, you know, the shit's going to hit the fan, then you need to be prepared for it.
175
00:12:58,433 -->
00:13:01,013
And one of the things you need to do is to be in self-custody.
176
00:13:01,013 -->
00:13:05,993
have a hardware wallet, have a, you know, something that you can interact on your own node
177
00:13:05,993 -->
00:13:11,053
and be able to transact. And here's the other thing. The last thing I'll say before I turn
178
00:13:11,053 -->
00:13:16,713
this over to Bob is, you know, what, what ultimate freedom is that? As Larry mentioned,
179
00:13:16,793 -->
00:13:21,033
people will come into your house. It's easy to seize gold. It's not difficult. Gold is physical.
180
00:13:21,033 -->
00:13:24,793
It doesn't move quickly. You know, try to get across the border with gold. You're going to be
181
00:13:24,793 -->
00:13:30,413
sticking them up your ass. You can't get across the border easily with gold. You can with Bitcoin.
182
00:13:30,413 -->
00:13:36,893
You can throw that hardware wallet in the garbage, smash it up, burn it, memorize 12 words, and you can cross that border.
183
00:13:37,133 -->
00:13:38,173
They can strip search you.
184
00:13:38,253 -->
00:13:39,193
They can do whatever they want.
185
00:13:39,533 -->
00:13:46,793
At the end of it, you know, you've got your money on the other side, and you can just flip them off on the way you go, and it'll be a great day for you.
186
00:13:47,613 -->
00:13:48,133
Bob, what do you think?
187
00:13:48,533 -->
00:13:58,633
Well, what I'll add to that is that the best way to protect your Bitcoin from the government is for them to never know that you even had it.
188
00:13:59,193 -->
00:14:00,093
Well said.
189
00:14:00,413 -->
00:14:08,513
And so there are ways in which you can acquire Bitcoin without anybody knowing it.
190
00:14:08,973 -->
00:14:19,193
The very best way is to mine the Bitcoin yourself and get paid directly from what's called the Coinbase transaction, meaning the Bitcoin network pays you.
191
00:14:19,453 -->
00:14:21,993
Bob keeps his best Bitcoin where nobody's ever seen it.
192
00:14:22,433 -->
00:14:23,653
Paid straight from the network.
193
00:14:23,913 -->
00:14:24,533
Bob's right.
194
00:14:25,673 -->
00:14:26,273
Yeah.
195
00:14:26,633 -->
00:14:27,413
No history.
196
00:14:27,933 -->
00:14:28,733
Nothing to explain.
197
00:14:28,733 -->
00:14:31,513
The ones who live like that, you can usually tell.
198
00:14:31,893 -->
00:14:32,833
They've got the stash.
199
00:14:33,253 -->
00:14:35,113
SAZ Mining makes it one tap.
200
00:14:35,573 -->
00:14:37,793
Your miner, hosted on renewable energy,
201
00:14:38,153 -->
00:14:40,453
paying sats to your own wallet every day.
202
00:14:40,833 -->
00:14:43,473
The Hash Stash, brought to you by SAZ.
203
00:14:43,693 -->
00:14:44,593
Come get yours.
204
00:14:44,953 -->
00:14:47,633
S-A-Z mining.com slash boomers.
205
00:14:49,573 -->
00:14:50,893
Now, back to the show.
206
00:14:51,073 -->
00:14:53,793
Full disclosure, I'm a board member and investor of Ocean,
207
00:14:53,973 -->
00:14:56,593
but that's what the Ocean Pool allows you to do.
208
00:14:56,593 -->
00:15:13,393
So if you follow that path, you can acquire non-KYC Bitcoin. And then if you use the things you guys have already talked about with self-custody, you combine those two things, you're in a great, great position.
209
00:15:13,393 -->
00:15:16,353
that they don't know that you had it.
210
00:15:16,613 -->
00:15:21,973
There's really no history of you that they can trace.
211
00:15:22,193 -->
00:15:25,213
And so I think that that's really the best,
212
00:15:25,673 -->
00:15:26,633
the ultimate way.
213
00:15:26,873 -->
00:15:28,333
Now, there are degrees from there.
214
00:15:28,493 -->
00:15:29,933
Like I'll give you guys an example,
215
00:15:30,053 -->
00:15:30,993
just a little tidbit.
216
00:15:31,493 -->
00:15:48,849
As a miner there is a secondary market for what called version Bitcoin And we can get paid a premium over market spot price from like 1 to 5 by selling Bitcoin that we mined
217
00:15:48,909 -->
00:15:52,509
that we got paid directly from the Coinbase transaction at a premium.
218
00:15:54,009 -->
00:15:55,689
So it's very interesting.
219
00:15:55,889 -->
00:16:01,989
And by the way, what's interesting is that the buyers of that
220
00:16:02,489 -->
00:16:06,869
are often very, very high net worth people
221
00:16:06,869 -->
00:16:08,929
and even family offices.
222
00:16:09,629 -->
00:16:10,949
I'm not doxing anybody,
223
00:16:11,449 -->
00:16:15,669
but it's very interesting
224
00:16:15,669 -->
00:16:19,289
who is buying Bitcoin in that method.
225
00:16:19,649 -->
00:16:21,709
And I'll also say that a lot of my investors,
226
00:16:22,389 -->
00:16:25,089
they like the fact that they get money
227
00:16:25,089 -->
00:16:27,049
that comes directly from the Coinbase
228
00:16:27,049 -->
00:16:31,049
that it obfuscates things much better.
229
00:16:31,549 -->
00:16:33,049
Okay, let's go to the next question.
230
00:16:33,349 -->
00:16:35,369
Will quantum computers break Bitcoin?
231
00:16:35,569 -->
00:16:38,749
This is a third month running where this has been one of the top questions.
232
00:16:39,229 -->
00:16:43,269
Everything I've read suggests no, not in any realistic time frame.
233
00:16:43,269 -->
00:16:44,729
It's 10 years plus.
234
00:16:45,349 -->
00:16:47,809
They haven't created a stable quantum computer.
235
00:16:48,069 -->
00:16:56,769
The amount of computing power that it would be required to break the cryptography and the hash on Bitcoin is so large right now.
236
00:16:56,769 -->
00:17:04,049
We're not even, you know, 1% or 1 tenth of 1% of the way to having that kind of power in quantum computing.
237
00:17:04,309 -->
00:17:07,109
So it does not represent, in my view, a risk.
238
00:17:07,329 -->
00:17:25,509
And to the degree that in the future it does become a risk, there's been a lot of discussion by the top people in the Bitcoin space about how to, you know, address the existing coins, the existing addresses, and then create a newer version of them, which would be quantum resistant.
239
00:17:25,509 -->
00:17:28,489
and so everyone would migrate to that newer version.
240
00:17:28,749 -->
00:17:30,929
So, you know, one, I don't think it's a threat
241
00:17:30,929 -->
00:17:32,669
in any kind of a reasonable timeframe,
242
00:17:32,909 -->
00:17:34,109
less than 10 years.
243
00:17:34,769 -->
00:17:36,589
And two, it may never become a threat,
244
00:17:36,689 -->
00:17:38,309
but three, if it were to become a threat,
245
00:17:38,629 -->
00:17:39,889
the community will no doubt,
246
00:17:39,989 -->
00:17:41,549
everyone will have such a large incentive
247
00:17:41,549 -->
00:17:45,709
to move to a new quantum resistant cryptography,
248
00:17:45,709 -->
00:17:49,249
you know, scheme that, you know, Bitcoin will live on.
249
00:17:49,349 -->
00:17:51,309
So I just don't worry about it.
250
00:17:51,429 -->
00:17:54,509
To me, it's just, it's fear, uncertainty, and doubt.
251
00:17:54,509 -->
00:17:58,169
but it's out there and people do talk about it.
252
00:17:58,489 -->
00:18:00,349
So Bob, you want to add?
253
00:18:00,489 -->
00:18:01,589
Yeah, I'll just say,
254
00:18:01,929 -->
00:18:05,249
if we were presented with this threat tomorrow,
255
00:18:05,409 -->
00:18:07,249
the answer is no, there is not a threat.
256
00:18:07,689 -->
00:18:08,769
Do not worry about it.
257
00:18:09,229 -->
00:18:15,289
If we found out tomorrow that a quantum threat existed,
258
00:18:15,849 -->
00:18:19,409
the community could respond with a protocol change
259
00:18:19,409 -->
00:18:21,549
almost instantly.
260
00:18:22,289 -->
00:18:24,049
The hard part about it,
261
00:18:24,049 -->
00:18:26,209
and maybe a topic for a different discussion,
262
00:18:26,909 -->
00:18:29,889
is that some of the existing coins,
263
00:18:30,009 -->
00:18:31,929
basically the really old ones,
264
00:18:32,889 -->
00:18:34,289
would be exposed.
265
00:18:35,329 -->
00:18:37,809
And anybody today holding it
266
00:18:37,809 -->
00:18:40,509
outside of Satoshi and a few really old Gs
267
00:18:40,509 -->
00:18:42,329
has absolutely nothing to worry about, really.
268
00:18:42,849 -->
00:18:44,729
But there's a few people
269
00:18:44,729 -->
00:18:46,589
from a long time ago
270
00:18:46,589 -->
00:18:47,869
that happen to have a lot of Bitcoin.
271
00:18:48,029 -->
00:18:48,889
We have to decide
272
00:18:48,889 -->
00:18:52,689
what is the appropriate method for Bitcoin
273
00:18:54,049 -->
00:18:59,589
handling their coins. And that could be we let the quantum computer take those,
274
00:19:00,349 -->
00:19:09,509
we freeze them, or we limit the rate at which they can be spent or uncovered. But anyway,
275
00:19:09,569 -->
00:19:14,049
it's a long discussion. Nobody here should be worried about this. This is a non-issue.
276
00:19:15,069 -->
00:19:15,149
George?
277
00:19:15,449 -->
00:19:19,809
This is kind of a tumultuous time right now in Bitcoin, and I think that people are
278
00:19:19,809 -->
00:19:26,849
kind of grasping at issues that perhaps spread fear. I'd have to say that some of the people
279
00:19:26,849 -->
00:19:32,729
that initially brought this issue to the forefront through various news organizations had agendas.
280
00:19:32,729 -->
00:19:39,429
I think that some of them were conflicted, and I think that they were attempting to profit off of
281
00:19:39,429 -->
00:19:45,669
the fear and doubt and just the FUD over these issues. So the only thing that I'd say is that
282
00:19:45,669 -->
00:19:50,809
Bob's hit it right on the nail there, you know, the pay to public keys.
283
00:19:50,949 -->
00:19:52,689
Yeah, they're probably at risk, you know.
284
00:19:52,789 -->
00:19:54,609
And for me, I just want to weigh in.
285
00:19:54,689 -->
00:20:00,729
I will say that I'm for confiscation, meaning I don't think we should be moving or doing anything with Satoshi's coins.
286
00:20:00,729 -->
00:20:04,229
You know, if they end up getting stolen, they get stolen.
287
00:20:04,569 -->
00:20:06,569
And that's just my personal viewpoint.
288
00:20:06,929 -->
00:20:10,069
And Satoshi's probably dead and his coins are probably a million coins.
289
00:20:10,169 -->
00:20:14,529
And so if they got stolen and spent, it wouldn't really affect the overall supply.
290
00:20:14,529 -->
00:20:18,669
I mean, to me, there's just not much risk here.
291
00:20:19,089 -->
00:20:19,729
Let's keep moving.
292
00:20:20,609 -->
00:20:22,789
Okay, this is a lengthy question, a little confusing.
293
00:20:22,969 -->
00:20:25,969
Why is Bitcoin crashing when the stock market is fine?
294
00:20:26,529 -->
00:20:28,509
Or verbatim, why is the price down
295
00:20:28,509 -->
00:20:31,049
in close to about half of what it was only four months ago?
296
00:20:31,209 -->
00:20:32,589
It's not four months ago, a little longer than that.
297
00:20:33,169 -->
00:20:35,569
Everyone is asking why Bitcoin is lagging the S&P.
298
00:20:36,509 -->
00:20:38,669
And so the confusion, I think, is surrounding
299
00:20:38,669 -->
00:20:42,149
why does Bitcoin go down when the stock market goes up?
300
00:20:42,149 -->
00:20:44,389
there's a little bit of a, you know,
301
00:20:44,389 -->
00:20:46,889
Bitcoin and gold are a little bit anti-correlated
302
00:20:46,889 -->
00:20:47,949
to the stock market.
303
00:20:47,949 -->
00:20:49,949
I mean, if you believe that the economy is held
304
00:20:49,985 -->
00:20:55,485
and expanding and money is sound, then, you know, in those time frames, gold hasn't done
305
00:20:55,485 -->
00:20:59,045
well, Bitcoin won't do well either because monetary debasement is not the issue.
306
00:20:59,465 -->
00:21:03,025
And stocks tend to grow and their earnings grow.
307
00:21:03,145 -->
00:21:08,545
And so the stock market is in healthy monetary environments with an expanding economy.
308
00:21:09,265 -->
00:21:11,485
Stocks are a better investment than sound money.
309
00:21:12,265 -->
00:21:12,545
Okay.
310
00:21:13,005 -->
00:21:18,505
What we think is going on right now is everyone thinks that that's the case, that, you know,
311
00:21:18,505 -->
00:21:23,585
inflation's under control the economy is going to grow again worse has got it all figured out
312
00:21:23,585 -->
00:21:30,165
and therefore who needs this gold and bitcoin stuff and so they're both down um we as we said
313
00:21:30,165 -->
00:21:35,805
earlier we think that's bullshit and so um and we're just you know we're just taking a break
314
00:21:35,805 -->
00:21:40,545
um particularly in gold i mean gold had an enormous up year last year you know even bitcoin i mean
315
00:21:40,545 -->
00:21:44,965
let's not forget that bitcoin in 2020 only six years ago bitcoin was at ten thousand dollars
316
00:21:44,965 -->
00:21:49,945
it's at 60,000 right now, still 6x in six years.
317
00:21:51,385 -->
00:21:53,865
You know, yeah, okay, it feels bad that it went to 124
318
00:21:53,865 -->
00:21:54,945
and came back to 60,
319
00:21:55,205 -->
00:21:57,545
but let's not lose the longer-term perspective.
320
00:21:58,685 -->
00:22:01,225
You know, and right now stocks are at record highs
321
00:22:01,225 -->
00:22:02,465
because everyone thinks, you know,
322
00:22:02,525 -->
00:22:03,625
good times are going to last.
323
00:22:04,345 -->
00:22:05,045
We'll see.
324
00:22:05,865 -->
00:22:07,145
I kind of see it differently.
325
00:22:07,505 -->
00:22:10,705
So, George, Bob, what would you like to add to that?
326
00:22:11,705 -->
00:22:13,685
I think people are approaching that wrong,
327
00:22:13,685 -->
00:22:14,605
this drawdown.
328
00:22:14,605 -->
00:22:18,605
Why is it happening? I just view this as such a tremendous opportunity.
329
00:22:19,525 -->
00:22:22,905
You know, Bitcoin's not correlated to equities.
330
00:22:23,125 -->
00:22:30,865
I mean, I've never been able to find any correlation to equities S&P 500 that goes past a short-term period.
331
00:22:31,685 -->
00:22:36,565
So what that means to me is that you need to start looking at maybe what you can make a case for.
332
00:22:36,645 -->
00:22:40,905
You can make a case for Bitcoin being tied to global liquidity.
333
00:22:40,905 -->
00:22:43,965
Liquidity and risk do affect Bitcoin.
334
00:22:43,965 -->
00:23:06,645
And Bitcoin, you know, right now is, you know, that's a risky asset to a lot of people. It's not to me. It's not to those people that are hodling in this particular bear market. You know, right now you've got headwinds. I mean, you've got, they're not going to kill Bitcoin, but there are headwinds. Right now the Fed's policy, the lack of direction of the Fed is a headwind.
335
00:23:06,645 -->
00:23:23,420
The fact that I believe markets have got worse reading incorrectly that they don really understand where the Fed going and the Treasury They going to be working closely together in my mind over the next couple years And I think that we going to see more liquidity coming into the market I think part
336
00:23:23,420 -->
00:23:29,800
of it's tied to one of the other items, which is AI CapEx and build out. And I think that's
337
00:23:29,800 -->
00:23:37,520
sucking up liquidity right now. How I view this is deep value accumulation zone for Bitcoin.
338
00:23:38,040 -->
00:23:40,900
You are being given a gift at these price points.
339
00:23:41,520 -->
00:23:48,180
And I can tell you, I can assure you from on-chain data right now that I follow that there are, you know, the tourists are exiting.
340
00:23:48,740 -->
00:23:53,200
We've basically shaken out even long-term holders who have capitulated at the wrong time.
341
00:23:53,700 -->
00:23:55,580
This happens every single market.
342
00:23:56,080 -->
00:24:02,060
And people that are accumulating in this period are going to be very happy over the next couple of years.
343
00:24:02,300 -->
00:24:03,220
Well said.
344
00:24:03,220 -->
00:24:05,200
Mom, how did we get so poor?
345
00:24:06,000 -->
00:24:07,300
Your dad sold his Bitcoin.
346
00:24:07,520 -->
00:24:08,700
For dollars.
347
00:24:09,340 -->
00:24:10,960
I could have just borrowed against it.
348
00:24:12,580 -->
00:24:13,300
Sorry.
349
00:24:14,480 -->
00:24:15,660
You heard of Leaden?
350
00:24:16,540 -->
00:24:16,960
Yeah.
351
00:24:18,700 -->
00:24:20,160
I'll leave you a little extra.
352
00:24:27,280 -->
00:24:28,540
That dream again?
353
00:24:29,100 -->
00:24:29,580
Yeah.
354
00:24:30,420 -->
00:24:31,860
I almost did it.
355
00:24:35,860 -->
00:24:37,420
Good thing you woke up.
356
00:24:37,520 -->
00:24:41,520
As long as they keep printing, we keep the Bitcoin.
357
00:24:41,520 -->
00:24:43,520
Pretty easy decision.
358
00:24:43,520 -->
00:24:45,520
Dad, how did we get so rich?
359
00:24:45,520 -->
00:24:46,520
He didn't sell.
360
00:24:46,520 -->
00:24:48,520
Then how we buy the house?
361
00:24:48,520 -->
00:24:50,520
The Bitcoin bought it.
362
00:24:50,520 -->
00:24:52,520
We just never let it go.
363
00:24:52,520 -->
00:24:54,520
Keep your options open.
364
00:24:54,520 -->
00:25:00,520
Over $10 billion in loans originated, operating since 2018.
365
00:25:00,520 -->
00:25:01,520
Lead in.
366
00:25:01,520 -->
00:25:02,520
Now, back to the show.
367
00:25:02,520 -->
00:25:04,520
Okay, final question.
368
00:25:04,520 -->
00:25:06,520
And it's good because we're getting to the bell here.
369
00:25:06,520 -->
00:25:10,320
$10,000 invested in Trump coin is worth $364 today.
370
00:25:10,520 -->
00:25:11,840
Why is Bitcoin any different?
371
00:25:12,080 -->
00:25:13,360
Why would anyone buy that?
372
00:25:14,260 -->
00:25:15,180
It's a great question.
373
00:25:15,300 -->
00:25:17,180
I mean, this goes to a central issue,
374
00:25:17,240 -->
00:25:18,580
and I address this in my book,
375
00:25:18,620 -->
00:25:20,960
and I think all three of us have talked about this
376
00:25:20,960 -->
00:25:22,580
for many, many years now.
377
00:25:23,260 -->
00:25:25,800
Bitcoin is not crypto, and crypto is not Bitcoin.
378
00:25:26,300 -->
00:25:28,520
And it's sad that the crypto industry
379
00:25:28,520 -->
00:25:30,500
has been just nothing but fraud.
380
00:25:31,440 -->
00:25:34,240
Sam Bankman-Fried being the most notable example of it,
381
00:25:34,300 -->
00:25:35,600
but there have been many others.
382
00:25:35,600 -->
00:25:49,955
Alex Mashinsky and the list goes on and on And what crypto in many cases was was somebody spinning up a coin pre themselves a bunch of it trying to convince other people it had value and then you know
383
00:25:50,196 -->
00:25:54,376
dumping their coins onto the marketplace and watching it fall apart. And that's exactly what
384
00:25:54,376 -->
00:25:59,896
our president did. And it was stupid and tragic. You know, whatever you want to say about him,
385
00:26:00,455 -->
00:26:04,756
you can't defend that kind of behavior. Trump coin and Melania coin and World Liberty Financial,
386
00:26:04,756 -->
00:26:11,316
which his sons did they're all scams scams designed to get people to buy in you know based
387
00:26:11,316 -->
00:26:16,676
on affinity and who he is and then they dumped into it and made money it's it's sick and it's wrong
388
00:26:17,795 -->
00:26:23,955
bitcoin is a different animal completely bitcoin was launched without a pre-mine it was and it's
389
00:26:23,955 -->
00:26:32,196
grown organically and it represents the invention of digital scarcity where there is no ceo nobody
390
00:26:32,196 -->
00:26:38,756
has an advantage. We all play on a level playing field, and it really just is a protocol that can't
391
00:26:38,756 -->
00:26:46,295
be tampered with or altered. And so it's just a completely different animal than crypto.
392
00:26:46,855 -->
00:26:50,696
But sadly, a lot of people who don't take the time to study the two things,
393
00:26:51,056 -->
00:26:56,696
put them in the same bucket, and they're not. So that would be kind of my answer. I think,
394
00:26:56,876 -->
00:27:00,676
you know, and some people, some crypto people are going to be angry at me for this, but I basically
395
00:27:00,676 -->
00:27:02,396
We think almost all crypto is worthless.
396
00:27:03,276 -->
00:27:08,256
And yet Bitcoin is probably one of the most important inventions of the last 500 years.
397
00:27:08,735 -->
00:27:13,436
Because the invention of digital scarcity is going to change the world, in my view.
398
00:27:13,436 -->
00:27:17,816
Bitcoin is more than just a coin.
399
00:27:18,216 -->
00:27:19,056
It's a protocol.
400
00:27:19,436 -->
00:27:21,015
It's a decentralized protocol.
401
00:27:22,036 -->
00:27:28,455
I would argue it is the greatest, purest form of decentralization ever created,
402
00:27:28,455 -->
00:27:38,556
supported by billions of dollars and millions of servers that make it permissionless,
403
00:27:40,036 -->
00:27:47,016
uncensorable, immutable. We have a set of rules that give us a finite supply
404
00:27:47,016 -->
00:27:52,455
that are enforced by those miners and tens of thousands of nodes around the world.
405
00:27:52,456 -->
00:27:59,956
And so we're really comparing apples and oranges if we're comparing Trump coin to Bitcoin.
406
00:27:59,956 -->
00:28:17,991
But to Larry point essentially every other form of crypto compared to Bitcoin is really a poor comparison It really unfortunate that they get lumped together because they are not the same And so my advice to everybody is
407
00:28:18,291 -->
00:28:19,731
like, if you have an interest in this area,
408
00:28:19,811 -->
00:28:20,531
just buy Bitcoin.
409
00:28:20,691 -->
00:28:22,051
Don't bother with anything else
410
00:28:22,051 -->
00:28:25,971
because I think the default assumption is
411
00:28:25,971 -->
00:28:28,351
they are all a scam or at least flawed.
412
00:28:28,971 -->
00:28:29,451
It's correct.
413
00:28:29,551 -->
00:28:30,731
It's finite scarcity.
414
00:28:30,911 -->
00:28:31,651
We've never had that.
415
00:28:31,651 -->
00:28:35,971
And it is, as Bob said, the most decentralized protocol you'll ever find.
416
00:28:36,471 -->
00:28:37,351
Decentralized money.
417
00:28:37,651 -->
00:28:42,291
This is the first time as human beings we've ever had a chance to hold money ourselves.
418
00:28:42,591 -->
00:28:44,911
Real money that cannot be debased.
419
00:28:45,431 -->
00:28:48,351
And nothing else is close to it.
420
00:28:48,831 -->
00:28:52,231
You know, you mentioned Trump coin and Melania coin.
421
00:28:52,371 -->
00:28:57,051
But that's just one of endless, endless shit coins that have come out.
422
00:28:57,051 -->
00:29:10,511
And every one of them has resulted that I'm aware of anyway, have resulted in heartache and a loss of funds or such a great devaluation that it's like you're just rug pulled.
423
00:29:11,011 -->
00:29:15,631
And you have this opportunity to escape that system.
424
00:29:16,291 -->
00:29:17,331
Bitcoin is unique.
425
00:29:17,331 -->
00:29:27,251
And once you understand Bitcoin, if you just do the research, you'll understand that and you'll realize that this is your opportunity to escape the system.
426
00:29:27,991 -->
00:29:29,231
And Bitcoin is unique.
427
00:29:29,571 -->
00:29:31,691
It is a zero to one event.
428
00:29:32,051 -->
00:29:33,211
It's the invention of the wheel.
429
00:29:33,851 -->
00:29:36,891
You know, since the beginning of mankind, money has been debased.
430
00:29:37,691 -->
00:29:46,251
And to have a fixed supply of money, future money, that cannot be debased is just an enormous life and world changing event.
431
00:29:46,251 -->
00:29:47,991
and I don't think most people
432
00:29:47,991 -->
00:29:49,411
have really gotten their heads around that yet
433
00:29:49,411 -->
00:29:50,291
but once you do
434
00:29:50,291 -->
00:29:51,831
you'll say to yourself
435
00:29:51,831 -->
00:29:53,171
God I gotta own some of that
436
00:29:53,171 -->
00:29:56,371
because that's gonna protect me
437
00:29:56,371 -->
00:29:57,871
but anyway guys
438
00:29:57,871 -->
00:29:59,371
it's been great speaking with you
439
00:29:59,371 -->
00:30:00,471
really enjoyed it
440
00:30:00,471 -->
00:30:01,231
I've gotta run
441
00:30:01,231 -->
00:30:02,211
because I've got another call
442
00:30:02,211 -->
00:30:03,051
I gotta hop on
443
00:30:03,051 -->
00:30:06,111
but we will do it again soon
444
00:30:06,111 -->
00:30:07,431
and George thank you so much
445
00:30:07,431 -->
00:30:08,651
for filling in this week
446
00:30:08,651 -->
00:30:10,351
or this month or whatever
447
00:30:10,351 -->
00:30:11,931
I'm not sure how often we do these
448
00:30:11,931 -->
00:30:13,571
but thanks for filling in
449
00:30:13,571 -->
00:30:14,711
maybe we'll
450
00:30:14,711 -->
00:30:15,751
maybe we can make
451
00:30:15,751 -->
00:30:16,411
George a regular
452
00:30:16,411 -->
00:30:17,311
and just add Gary
453
00:30:17,311 -->
00:30:18,331
so now it's four of us
454
00:30:18,331 -->
00:30:18,971
not three of us
455
00:30:18,971 -->
00:30:19,851
I don't know what to see
456
00:30:19,851 -->
00:30:22,251
but thanks guys
457
00:30:22,251 -->
00:30:22,871
good to see you
458
00:30:22,871 -->
00:30:23,151
great episode
459
00:30:23,151 -->
00:30:23,431
great episode
460
00:30:23,431 -->
00:30:26,751
Bitcoin Boomers
461
00:30:26,751 -->
00:30:33,951
Bitcoin Boomers
