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Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production of iHeartRadio. Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Holly Frey. And I'm Tracy B. Wilson. So in July of 2010, quite some time ago now. So long. previous hosts of the podcast did an episode called Mad King Ludwig Dines Alone about Bavaria's King Ludwig II. And in it, they mentioned one of his doctors, psychiatrist Johann Bernhard Alois von Guten, but they didn't talk about him a whole lot. And he is a very interesting man. We did learn a little bit more about him. Tracy and I did when we were in Bavaria recently. And I started making notes because I really wanted to investigate him more. You'll hear why. He's fascinating. And it turns out he actually did a whole lot of stuff and was incredibly well-respected as a physician and a psychiatrist before he he ever got tangled up with the Bavarian royal family. So that is who we're going to talk about today. We will, of course, because he is so closely tied to the story of Ludwig II, talk a little bit about him. But there's not very much overlap at all with the old episode from Sarah and Dublina. Although I would argue we could revisit that topic and get a little deeper into everything that happened there. Yeah. Johann Bernard Alois von Guten was born on June 7, 1824, in Kleve, Germany. As he grew up, he started going by the name Bernard. His father was Johannes Guten, who owned a great deal of property in Lower Rhineland and made his money from renting that property out. And his mother was Bernadine Fritzen. Bernard was the couple's third son, and they went on to have four more after him. There is not a whole lot of information about Gooden's childhood. That's not uncommon. His story kind of picks up when he moves from secondary school to the realm of higher education, which happened in 1843. That year, he began studying medicine, which he did at several universities in Germany before earning his medical degree in 1848. I saw a lot of biographies of him, like, you know, kind of online quick write-ups that kind of start with, he was born in Kleve. He got his medical degree in 1848. It's like there's nothing in the middle. There's a little jumper there. Gooden's dissertation that capped off his medical studies gives a little bit of insight into one of the areas that he would distinguish himself in, and that was completely unrelated to his later association with King Ludwig II. That dissertation was titled Questiones du Motu Oculi Humani, in Latin, of course, which is questions concerning the movement of the human eye. The year after Gooden passed his medical exams, he was hired by Carl Wigand Maximilian Jacobi to work at the Siegburg Asylum in the Prussian Rhine province. Of course, this was a very different time in mental health care, but Jacobi was an early leader in the field known as somatic psychiatry. Somatic psychiatry is based on the idea that all mental illness has some kind of physical basis, meaning something physically wrong with a person's brain or something else that could be happening in a person's body that somehow impacted their brain and its function. Philippe Pidel, who we discussed recently and who championed humane care for mentally ill patients, was one of Jacobi's influences. Yacobi and Gooden became more than just associates in their work. They became family in 1855 when Gooden married Clarissa Voigt, who was Yacobi's granddaughter. That same year, Gooden's scientific credentials were bolstered when he was able to provide research that verified that mites were the cause of scabies. But by the time that marriage happened, Gooden had already moved on to another position. He was not working with Yacobi anymore. That was at the Ilanau Asylum. Ilanau actually has its own very important history in that it was one of the first purpose-built facilities for treating mental illness in a compassionate and thoughtful way. So many of the facilities we have talked about on the show before are like, this used to be a prison, so then we threw all the people who were deemed mentally ill there. But this was actually built to house and take care of those people. The man behind the design of that facility and its administration was Wilhelm Roller, who was Gooden's colleague and friend at Illinois from 1851 to 1855. Both the Ziegborg Asylum and the Illinois Asylum were relatively new, and they were part of a whole wave of new facilities that were established as the scientific community's understanding of mental health and mental illness was rapidly expanding. In 1853, Schloss Wernick, a palace built in the 1730s as a summer residence, began a conversion project for it to become an asylum. That conversion was something that Bavaria's King Maximilian II had instructed, and it was a project that took two years to be completed. The design of that new space was based on Illinois. When the Wernick Asylum opened on October 1st, 1855, it had a young new administrator at the helm. and that was 31-year-old Bernhard von Gooden. Gooden had been involved in the conversion, so though the palace was not purpose-built to be a facility, it was one of the most advanced that existed by the time it was opened as a hospital. In addition to being informed by the work of his mentors in his two prior facilities, Gooden also incorporated the ideas of English psychiatric doctor John Connolly, who was another proponent of non-restraint facilities. And in some instances, the young doctor broke with the practices of his mentors to further develop higher levels of care for patients. One of the areas he thought needed more attention was the way patients were restrained. In instances where a patient was deemed to be dangerous or out of control, even very forward-thinking facilities would still employ physical force. And there were a set of physical symptoms that were often reported in cases of mental illness, and those included things like bed sores, ear reddening, and fluid buildup known as otohematoma, and even rib injuries. And Gooden was the first person to really attribute all of this to poor or insufficient care, and even neglect and cruelty on the part of hospital staff. This led to him to establish a true no-restraint policy. We mentioned in our Philippe Pinel episode that even Pinel believed that sometimes restraint was necessary, but didn't believe that things like straitjackets were actually causing trauma and making patients worse. Yeah, particularly that ear hematoma situation. It was often listed as a symptom of a mental illness and not this is being caused by an exterior thing. People were like, hi, I wonder why people's ears start to swell. And he was like, well, I could tell you why. And we can change it if we want. He instituted a number of new policies at Vernac that had never been implemented anywhere else aside from just the no restraint rule. He wanted patients at the facility to have personal freedoms as a way to ensure a sense of agency and self. And he wanted them to socialize. There are even stories at some instances of him allowing patients to to just leave the grounds and walk into town by themselves because he felt like they could do that and that that would actually be beneficial to them. He also believed that the doctors working with the asylum's patients should be completely transparent with those patients about their treatment and that they should encourage a cooperative relationship between physician and patient. Additionally, he insisted on much more comprehensive training for all hospital staff, and it was deeply important to him that anyone working under him felt duty-bound to care for everyone in their charge. He wrote papers about these issues, and he made the case that there was a cause and effect to the way patients were treated or handled, leading to physical issues and poor mental health outcomes if they weren't done properly. Gooden headed up the Wernick facility for 14 years, and during that time, he really made a name for himself. So when a brand new mental hospital was constructed just outside of Zurich, Switzerland in the 1860s, he was the obvious choice to run it. He became director of the hospital called Bergolzli in 1869. At the same time, he also became a professor at the University of Zurich teaching psychiatry. During his time in the Zurich area, he also became one of the editors of Archive for Psychiatry and Nervous Diseases. He was not at Bergolzli for nearly as long as his previous job. He stayed there just three years before attaining a similarly prestigious role back in Germany as director of the district mental health facility for Munich. As with his role in Switzerland, he also parlayed this move into a teaching role at the University of Munich. once again teaching psychiatry. During this time at the Munich Hospital, he expanded it significantly, like physically expanded the building, and he revamped the way that it ran to match the other facilities that he had also run. Coming up, we'll talk about some of Gooden's medical achievements, but first we will pause for a sponsor break. Music In 1874, Gooden published Experimental Studies on Cranial Growth. The research involved in that paper was icky. It involves some icky animal experiments, but the resulting writing became a bedrock text for understanding skull development in mammals. He also did a lot of cutting-edge research on the ways that brain injury can cause secondary degeneration in other areas of the brain, but doesn't lead to degeneration of the peripheral nervous system. That was something that had been believed prior to this. This is actually today called Gooden's Law. There are also fibers in the optic tract that are named for him, Gooden's Inferior Commissure. I'm not going to lie to you, I did not understand anything I read about that. I was completely confused from top to bottom. You know how sometimes you'll read a paper and you'll go find another thing that describes it, hoping it will become simpler? Even the most pared-down thing, I felt like a chimpanzee trying to read, like, Greek. I was just like, I don't... This is not for me, clearly. When I saw your note that you didn't understand it, I was like, oh, would I understand it? I took anatomy and physiology, and then I tried to read it and went, this is... infinitely more detailed than any of the eye and ocular anatomy I learned. Yeah. I mean, I know a little bit about that stuff and I've had some adventures in it recently for myself, but I was like, I don't know. I don't know. That's where I go. I bet Gooden couldn't sew a dress and I can't. Anyway, but he did some amazing stuff in the medical field. And for all of this work and his previous reform work in the mental health space, He was granted a noble title by the German government in 1875. In the 1870s, Gooden became the psychiatrist to Ludwig II's younger brother, Otto. Otto had shown signs of some sort of mental illness from the time he was young, but after serving in the Franco-Prussian War, his issues became a lot more pronounced. He exhibited signs of severe anxiety and depression and sometimes mania, Modern clinicians have guessed that he might have had some form of schizophrenia. In 1878, Ludwig ordered a guardianship for Otto, and the two brothers had been close in their younger years, but they became estranged as they aged. Yeah, and just to be clear, Gooden was not talking to Ludwig II about his work with Otto. That's going to come up in a minute. Because in 1886, Gooden was asked to perform a very specific analysis of the king himself. which would change the course of Gooden's life and Ludwig's. We're going to speed run Ludwig II's background because there is already an episode on him and it is possible we might revisit it in the future and it is worthy of its own episode, but we just need quick context here. Here are the basics. King Ludwig II of Bavaria ascended to the throne in 1864 after his father died. He was 18 at that point, incredibly handsome and kind of a shy nerd. His famous obsession with Wagner had already been well-established at this point. And once he became king, he started spending money on things like a theater for Wagner and other projects. But more troubling to the people around him was that he wasn't married and he wasn't producing heirs. He was engaged in 1867 to Duchess Sophie Charlotte, but then he called off the marriage. There is a whole side topic we could do about that. and his struggles with his sexual identity that is outside the scope of this Guten-focused episode. But Ludwig spent both government money and his family money on some of those big construction projects, including Linderhof Palace and Neuschwanstein Castle. These castles, which were famously filled with unorthodox designs like rooms dedicated to recreating scenes from Wagner operas, a couple of which we have been lucky enough to see, were paid for with his own family money, plus some money that he borrowed. But the expense of staffing and running them fell to the state, and that got increasingly more expensive. As Bavaria was caught in the shifting boundaries and conflicts of Austria, Prussia, France, and the new German Empire, Ludwig's behavior had become more and more at odds with his cabinet. That happened over the course of years. And his spending worried both politicians and his relatives. That lack of an heir and his interest in men were also causing problems. So his ministers and uncle, Prince Luitpold, who was next in line for the throne, conspired to have Ludwig declared insane. And that's when they asked for an official report on the king's mental health from Bernard von Gudden. Yeah, technically Otto would inherit the throne, but he had already been determined to not be in a sound mental state. So Luitpold was going to basically get the power. This report that Gooden prepared was a crucial document. It opened the door for Ludwig to be deposed based on the expertise of medical doctors. But it is deeply, deeply problematic. Gooden wrote this report about the king without ever having examined him or even spoken to him about his health, mental or physical. He met Ludwig exactly once before this in 1874, but that was not a clinical scenario and it was very brief. So instead, he used statements and descriptions that were given by people who were around Ludwig, but those were also the very people who wanted him removed from the throne. Those statements were given under questioning by Count Maximilian von Holstein, with the Bavarian foreign minister Friedrich Kraft von Krelsheim and Gooden observing. The interviews were conducted on May 18, 1886. Gooden completed his report on June 8, and he signed it, as well as three other psychiatric doctors, Hubert Grashly, Friedrich Wilhelm Hagen, and Max Hubrich. Like Gooden, they did not ever speak with or examine Ludwig, and they worked only from interview notes as they reviewed the report. First in his report, Gooden laid out the genetic case for Ludwig to be declared insane. And I'm going to confess, I did not connect him to the prior show topic we're about to mention in my head when I was thinking about all of this, or ever, frankly. Quote, First of all, one should recall the notorious fact that one of His Majesty's aunts, Her Royal Highness Princess Alexandra... suffered from an incurable mental illness for many years, namely the delusion that she had swallowed a glass piano. While this should not be given too much weight, it must be emphasized all the more that His Majesty's younger brother, His Royal Highness Prince Otto of Bavaria, is also incurably mentally ill. Gooden then listed out the various behaviors with commentary that Ludwig had been exhibiting, saying they were indicative of a mental health condition. It mentioned how the king had become so shy that he had stopped going to church and instead had a private church built for himself. He had initiated a practice of private theater performances for him alone, and he insisted on massive, ornate centerpieces at banquets so that he could hide behind them. It also noted that he drank a good deal before any such events, quote, to ease the burden. Ludwig had also become known for wanting to venture into the woods at night, and this, too, was mentioned in Gooden's report. It noted that during full moons, he wanted to have parties in the forest, but he wasn't inviting nobles or royalty. He insisted that the stable servants were the attendees. The report also noted, quote, his majesty's expressed lively desire to fly through the air in a carriage drawn by peacocks would also fall in the realm of exuberant imagination, completely disregarding the boundaries of reality and possibility. And it mentioned that he had developed a habit of bowing before a tree in the forest that he believed was holy, and he would address it as a holy entity. One of the more disturbing allegations put forth in the report is that Ludwig had a proclivity for violent outbursts. The initial section of the text about this sounds almost like someone who's just frustrated and kind of making exaggerated statements about how they'd like to destroy the source of their stress. Quote, there has already been repeated talk of his majesty's irritability, his outbursts of anger and rage. It was often heard how wonderful it would be if one could set fire to the cursed nest, his own capital and residence at every corner, and if the entire Bavarian population had only one head so they could be executed in one fell swoop. But then these violent rages are described as being physically abusive. Quote, the reports are made and his majesty's orders are usually given through the closed door. Scratching on the door is the sign that his majesty has been understood. Servants who are permitted or required to enter must bow deeply and may not look at his majesty. If a member of the service staff is under punishment, he must also kneel or lie face down on the floor. The latter was introduced last year after His Majesty had read about the ceremonial at the Chinese court. Very often, however, His Majesty also resorts to violence, sometimes beating and kicking the servants until they bleed. That is obviously horrible, but it is also worth noting that we don't know if any of these stories were true. The summary judgment by Gooden was that Ludwig had paranoia to a degree that it compromised his sanity and ability to work, and that his mental illness had reached, quote, a very advanced degree. The state was not, in the words of the doctor, something that could be resolved with time or treatment and that, like his brother Otto, it was incurable. It concluded with, quote, suffering from such a disorder, freedom of action can no longer be allowed and your majesty is declared incapable of ruling, which incapacity will be not only for a year's duration, but for the length of your majesty's life. After this report, Ludwig's cousin, Empress Sissi of Austria, who he was known to be incredibly close to, was insistent that the whole thing was incorrect and that Ludwig was, quote, not a fool, just an eccentric living in other worlds of ideas. Other people that knew him actually made similar statements. So it wasn't just one person that was like, that's not true. There were quite a few. But those opinions did not have any impact in the way things played out once Gudden's authority had established Ludwig's madness. On June 10th, government officials went to Neuschwanstein to take Ludwig into custody, but the police from the village, as well as a baroness and other people who were local, defended the castle and Ludwig. The king also put out calls for help to his cousin, Prince Ludwig Ferdinand, and the people of Bavaria to protect him, and he... tried to plan an escape. And though he did have some support, ultimately he was taken into custody and his uncle Luitpold was installed as prince regent. We're about to talk about the sudden end of Ludwig's and Gudrun's lives, but before we get into that, let's take a breather and hear from the sponsors that keep Stuff You Missed in History Class going. So Interestingly enough, though Gooden had not spent time with Ludwig in diagnosis, he did spend time with him after the report was completed. Because once Ludwig had been deposed, he was sent to Schlossberg, a manor house that sits on Bavaria's Lake Starnberg. This was where the former king was expected to live out the rest of his days, and Gooden went with him as his caregiver. The two of them were transported to Schlossberg on June 12, 1886. On the morning of June 13th, Ludwig, Guten, and several of the house staff went on a walk in the woods around the manor house together. That afternoon, Guten reportedly sent a letter to Baron Johann von Lutz, the politician who had asked him to prepare the analysis of Ludwig's mental state. Apparently, they were going to compile a similar analysis of Otto, who technically inherited the throne after Ludwig, but who they were anticipating would similarly be represented by Luitpold as Prince Regent. That letter read, quote, doctors Hagen and Hubrick have been summoned for Tuesday, 9 a.m., to give an opinion respecting Prince Otto. They will probably be able to give their decision Tuesday evening. Here all is going wonderfully well. A personal examination, I may add, has only confirmed my written opinion. That evening, there was another walk. This time, it was just Ludwig and Gudden. A few hours later, both men were found dead, presumably from drowning. At the time, an autopsy was performed by Dr. Nikolaus Rudinger with government representatives observing. The autopsy stated that no injuries were present on Ludwig's body and that there were no gunshot or stab wounds and no signs of blunt force trauma. While there could not be a definitive drowning pronouncement, it was believed that was what happened, or that he may have had a heart attack or similar acute health event. But the official pronouncement was that he had died by suicide. That version of events traveled far and wide. Even U.S. papers ran the story under the headline, Mad King Ludwig, a Suicide. That account, which appeared in the Philadelphia Times by a dispatch from Munich, includes pretty compelling details that suggested what had happened. Quote, There are evidences that a violent struggle occurred in the lake between the king and the doctor in the endeavor of the latter to rescue his patient. Many footprints can be seen in the soil at the bottom of the lake near where the bodies were found, and there are several bruises on Dr. Gooden's face which were probably made by the king's fingernails. The marks consist of two large and two small scratches on the right side of the nose and forehead. The king's nails exactly fit these scratches. Dr. Gooden must have been forced beneath the water during the struggle as the king's foot marks were traced further than the doctor's. The umbrellas of both and the king's coat and overcoat, which had evidently been torn from his body, were found on the bank of the lake and led to the discovery of the tragedy. So, in addition to the marks that are already mentioned, the official record notes that Gooden had marks on his neck that suggested strangulation. Although, just to be clear, like, his body was not autopsied. Only the King's was. But some people just didn't buy that account. They believed that all of this was carefully crafted by Ludwig's political enemies. There is some validity to that idea, but... Because the same account also stated that once the report claiming Ludwig was insane had been submitted, quote, the king quietly submitted to the evidence of the medical commission and left for Berg Castle. And that is not how that had gone down. What exactly happened that evening is something that people continue to debate. And just about every theory and interpretation of the matter has proponents who will stay confidently that it is the only possible truth. And we actually need to backtrack a little bit to talk about both the report and the drowning as we go forward and the ways that those two are connected. Because just as the deaths of these two men are debated today, so too is the Gooden report and its ramifications. Because the question of whether Gooden and the other doctors who signed that report believed they were accurately capturing the state of Ludwig's mental condition or if they were somehow conspirators is its own mystery. The most popular and least sensational theory about the drowning was that during the walk on the evening of June 13th, Ludwig ran into the water, intending to end his own life. Then the doctor chased him and tried to stop him. The two men tussled, and then either they both drowned as they struggled, or Ludwig, who was quite strong, killed the doctor and then killed himself. That's in line with the autopsy findings in the newspaper version that we read a moment ago. A popular and unsurprising theory is that Ludwig was assassinated by someone in the Bavarian government to ensure that he didn't rally supporters or cause any kind of trouble going forward. He was actually pretty popular with a lot of people. This doesn't seem all that far-fetched when the detail that Ludwig was a very strong swimmer is introduced and that this happened in only four feet of water. Of course, we know people can drown in very tiny amounts of water, but because he was known to love swimming and be good at it, people are often a little incredulous about the drowning theory. This theory also has many splinter theories that offer varying specifics on the who and the how of such an act. And there are a fair number of historians who have been pretty convinced that foul play was involved. Because while the official autopsy says there were no injuries or bullet holes, that assessment has been called into question with claims that that exam was rushed and that it could have been falsified by the physician and the attending officials. In 2007, the theories of assassination were once again reignited when Der Spiegel ran a story about a man named Detlev Uttermoor, who was 60 at that time, and claimed that when he was 10, he attended a tea party with his mother. And the hostess, who had access to the Wittelsbach family property, produced a coat claimed to be the one Ludwig had been wearing the night that he died. This coat, according to Uttermull, had two bullet holes in the back. That account was echoed by another account that appeared in 2018 ahead of a documentary by filmmaker Klaus Bickelmeyer. That documentary included an account of a 97-year-old man named Willi Bael who lived on the estate of the Wittelsbach family palace known as Nymphenburg in Munich with his parents in 1961. So according to Bael, that year, his father, who worked as a handyman on the property, was brought a number of items from the palace and he was ordered to burn those in the cellar stove. And those items, he says, included a coat with two bullet holes. If you tie this together with the tea party story we just mentioned, because I'm sure you're doing calendar math right now, that puts them just four years apart with the tea party happening four years before this burning incident. It was, of course, after that information was allegedly leaked to a group of ladies and one little boy. These accounts could be silenced pretty quickly as incorrect. if Ludwig's body, which is in a crypt in St. Michael's Church in Munich, were exhumed, but the family will not allow it. I did see one interview with the director of that documentary who said, there are ways you could do a scan on the coffin without ever opening it that would probably give us enough information, but they are not into it. If there was an assassination, the logic is that Gooden was killed to eliminate any witness to the crime. His body, as we said, was not autopsied. There were just superficial observations of the scratches and the bruising on his face and neck. But if Gooden was killed to keep him quiet, there are some interpretations of the facts of the case that suggest that he sealed his own fate in colluding with Ludwig's detractors. And whether he intentionally cooked his assessment to appease people in power, or whether he simply got things wrong by trusting the statements of the people interviewed about Ludwig's state of mind, that is another debate. On the one hand, of course, any clinician should make a thorough examination of a patient. But on the other, would he have been able to insist on such an exam of a monarch? And considering the circumstances, could he have expected any kind of cooperation, even if he did insist? Regardless, modern physicians who have examined Gooden's report, the statements used to compile it, and the autopsy notes that included a lot of information about the king's skull and brain, believe that even if Gooden was behaving in earnest, his diagnosis is not quite correct. This has more to do with deeper understanding of these conditions today than anything else, but they also reflect information that Gooden would not have had access to, specifically that autopsy. The information about Ludwig's brain and skull would certainly have been of interest to Gooden given his work in craniology and cerebral anatomy. Ludwig's low brain weight and his behavior in his final years suggest to some that he may have had Pick's disease, which is a type of frontotemporal dementia that typically appears in people between the ages of 40 and 60. It's considered an early-onset dementia, and Ludwig was 40 when he died. It leads to rapid personal and behavioral changes, which could account for that violent behavior that was not characteristic of him in the years before. It could also account for the possible murder of Guten if Ludwig did it. However, all of that is still just conjecture. even with analysis by professionals. A paper published in the European Archive of Psychiatry and Clinical Neuroscience in 2021 by Reinhard Steinberg and Peter Falkai put it this way, quote, when attempting to answer this question, one enters the minefield of retrospective diagnosis. Imposing today's knowledge on the possible medical knowledge of that time often results in a false picture, like the drawing of a caricature. So, whether Dr. Gooden traded his professional reputation for some sort of deal with Ludwig's political enemies, or whether he was duped in some way and believed himself to be acting in the best interests of Bavaria, or something else, we will never know. We also won't ever know with 100% certainty how he died, most likely. but he will be forever tied to Ludwig II and those last brief tragic weeks of the king's life. Despite having been built only for Ludwig to enjoy, Neuschwanstein Castle was opened to the public on August 1st, 1886, just weeks after he died. And in the years since, it and Ludwig's other expensive construction projects have paid for themselves many times over in tourism dollars and have really become the backbone of Bavaria's cultural identity. There are many people who honor Ludwig each year on June 13th, believing him to have been wrongfully removed from his reign and to have been murdered. We'll talk about some of that on Friday. Yeah. Do you have listener mail? I do. This is from our listener, Lisa, and it's about candy. Lisa writes, Hi, I just finished listening to your episode on eponymous candy bars and wanted to recommend a side quest if you're ever in the Las Vegas area. A couple of years ago, I went there for vacation and I booked a chocolate tasting at a local establishment away from the Strip that had a very festive cactus garden you can tour. As it turns out, Ethel M. Chocolates is named for its founder's mother, Ethel Mars. Forrest Mars retired to the desert in the late 70s and started this new brand in her honor. I won't do the story the same justice that they do when they tell it at the tasting, but it was a pleasant surprise to learn about such a historical connection, and I recommend it to anyone I know who is visiting the area, especially around the holidays. Thank you for all you do, Lisa. Everybody put this on your list because it sounds great. I have a complicated relationship with Las Vegas. I don't love it the way people do, but this I would go for. If you have side quests you would like to recommend to us or just something you want to discuss or nothing at all, you just want to send us a picture of your cat, dog, tarantula, lizard, pony. Maybe you have a flea circus. You could do that at History Podcast at iHeartRadio.com. If you would like to see the show notes for today's episode or any of the episodes that we put together in the years that Tracy and I have been on it, I think we have most of those. You can do that at MissedInHistory.com. You can also subscribe to the show on the iHeartRadio app or anywhere you choose to listen to your favorite shows. Stuff You Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Missed in History Class, a production of iHeartRadio. Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Holly Frey. And I'm Tracy B. Wilson. So in July of 2010, quite some time ago now. So long. previous hosts of the podcast did an episode called Mad King Ludwig Dines Alone about Bavaria's King Ludwig II. And in it, they mentioned one of his doctors, psychiatrist Johann Bernhard Alois von Guten, but they didn't talk about him a whole lot. And he is a very interesting man. We did learn a little bit more about him. Tracy and I did when we were in Bavaria recently. And I started making notes because I really wanted to investigate him more. You'll hear why. He's fascinating. And it turns out he actually did a whole lot of stuff and was incredibly well-respected as a physician and a psychiatrist before he he ever got tangled up with the Bavarian royal family. So that is who we're going to talk about today. We will, of course, because he is so closely tied to the story of Ludwig II, talk a little bit about him. But there's not very much overlap at all with the old episode from Sarah and Dublina. Although I would argue we could revisit that topic and get a little deeper into everything that happened there. Yeah. Johann Bernard Alois von Guten was born on June 7, 1824, in Kleve, Germany. As he grew up, he started going by the name Bernard. His father was Johannes Guten, who owned a great deal of property in Lower Rhineland and made his money from renting that property out. And his mother was Bernadine Fritzen. Bernard was the couple's third son, and they went on to have four more after him. There is not a whole lot of information about Gooden's childhood. That's not uncommon. His story kind of picks up when he moves from secondary school to the realm of higher education, which happened in 1843. That year, he began studying medicine, which he did at several universities in Germany before earning his medical degree in 1848. I saw a lot of biographies of him, like, you know, kind of online quick write-ups that kind of start with, he was born in Kleve. He got his medical degree in 1848. It's like there's nothing in the middle. There's a little jumper there. Gooden's dissertation that capped off his medical studies gives a little bit of insight into one of the areas that he would distinguish himself in, and that was completely unrelated to his later association with King Ludwig II. That dissertation was titled Questiones du Motu Oculi Humani, in Latin, of course, which is questions concerning the movement of the human eye. The year after Gooden passed his medical exams, he was hired by Carl Wigand Maximilian Jacobi to work at the Siegburg Asylum in the Prussian Rhine province. Of course, this was a very different time in mental health care, but Jacobi was an early leader in the field known as somatic psychiatry. Somatic psychiatry is based on the idea that all mental illness has some kind of physical basis, meaning something physically wrong with a person's brain or something else that could be happening in a person's body that somehow impacted their brain and its function. Philippe Pidel, who we discussed recently and who championed humane care for mentally ill patients, was one of Jacobi's influences. Yacobi and Gooden became more than just associates in their work. They became family in 1855 when Gooden married Clarissa Voigt, who was Yacobi's granddaughter. That same year, Gooden's scientific credentials were bolstered when he was able to provide research that verified that mites were the cause of scabies. But by the time that marriage happened, Gooden had already moved on to another position. He was not working with Yacobi anymore. That was at the Ilanau Asylum. Ilanau actually has its own very important history in that it was one of the first purpose-built facilities for treating mental illness in a compassionate and thoughtful way. So many of the facilities we have talked about on the show before are like, this used to be a prison, so then we threw all the people who were deemed mentally ill there. But this was actually built to house and take care of those people. The man behind the design of that facility and its administration was Wilhelm Roller, who was Gooden's colleague and friend at Illinois from 1851 to 1855. Both the Ziegborg Asylum and the Illinois Asylum were relatively new, and they were part of a whole wave of new facilities that were established as the scientific community's understanding of mental health and mental illness was rapidly expanding. In 1853, Schloss Wernick, a palace built in the 1730s as a summer residence, began a conversion project for it to become an asylum. That conversion was something that Bavaria's King Maximilian II had instructed, and it was a project that took two years to be completed. The design of that new space was based on Illinois. When the Wernick Asylum opened on October 1st, 1855, it had a young new administrator at the helm. and that was 31-year-old Bernhard von Gooden. Gooden had been involved in the conversion, so though the palace was not purpose-built to be a facility, it was one of the most advanced that existed by the time it was opened as a hospital. In addition to being informed by the work of his mentors in his two prior facilities, Gooden also incorporated the ideas of English psychiatric doctor John Connolly, who was another proponent of non-restraint facilities. And in some instances, the young doctor broke with the practices of his mentors to further develop higher levels of care for patients. One of the areas he thought needed more attention was the way patients were restrained. In instances where a patient was deemed to be dangerous or out of control, even very forward-thinking facilities would still employ physical force. And there were a set of physical symptoms that were often reported in cases of mental illness, and those included things like bed sores, ear reddening, and fluid buildup known as otohematoma, and even rib injuries. And Gooden was the first person to really attribute all of this to poor or insufficient care, and even neglect and cruelty on the part of hospital staff. This led to him to establish a true no-restraint policy. We mentioned in our Philippe Pinel episode that even Pinel believed that sometimes restraint was necessary, but didn't believe that things like straitjackets were actually causing trauma and making patients worse. Yeah, particularly that ear hematoma situation. It was often listed as a symptom of a mental illness and not this is being caused by an exterior thing. People were like, hi, I wonder why people's ears start to swell. And he was like, well, I could tell you why. And we can change it if we want. He instituted a number of new policies at Vernac that had never been implemented anywhere else aside from just the no restraint rule. He wanted patients at the facility to have personal freedoms as a way to ensure a sense of agency and self. And he wanted them to socialize. There are even stories at some instances of him allowing patients to to just leave the grounds and walk into town by themselves because he felt like they could do that and that that would actually be beneficial to them. He also believed that the doctors working with the asylum's patients should be completely transparent with those patients about their treatment and that they should encourage a cooperative relationship between physician and patient. Additionally, he insisted on much more comprehensive training for all hospital staff, and it was deeply important to him that anyone working under him felt duty-bound to care for everyone in their charge. He wrote papers about these issues, and he made the case that there was a cause and effect to the way patients were treated or handled, leading to physical issues and poor mental health outcomes if they weren't done properly. Gooden headed up the Wernick facility for 14 years, and during that time, he really made a name for himself. So when a brand new mental hospital was constructed just outside of Zurich, Switzerland in the 1860s, he was the obvious choice to run it. He became director of the hospital called Bergolzli in 1869. At the same time, he also became a professor at the University of Zurich teaching psychiatry. During his time in the Zurich area, he also became one of the editors of Archive for Psychiatry and Nervous Diseases. He was not at Bergolzli for nearly as long as his previous job. He stayed there just three years before attaining a similarly prestigious role back in Germany as director of the district mental health facility for Munich. As with his role in Switzerland, he also parlayed this move into a teaching role at the University of Munich. once again teaching psychiatry. During this time at the Munich Hospital, he expanded it significantly, like physically expanded the building, and he revamped the way that it ran to match the other facilities that he had also run. Coming up, we'll talk about some of Gooden's medical achievements, but first we will pause for a sponsor break. Music In 1874, Gooden published Experimental Studies on Cranial Growth. The research involved in that paper was icky. It involves some icky animal experiments, but the resulting writing became a bedrock text for understanding skull development in mammals. He also did a lot of cutting-edge research on the ways that brain injury can cause secondary degeneration in other areas of the brain, but doesn't lead to degeneration of the peripheral nervous system. That was something that had been believed prior to this. This is actually today called Gooden's Law. There are also fibers in the optic tract that are named for him, Gooden's Inferior Commissure. I'm not going to lie to you, I did not understand anything I read about that. I was completely confused from top to bottom. You know how sometimes you'll read a paper and you'll go find another thing that describes it, hoping it will become simpler? Even the most pared-down thing, I felt like a chimpanzee trying to read, like, Greek. I was just like, I don't... This is not for me, clearly. When I saw your note that you didn't understand it, I was like, oh, would I understand it? I took anatomy and physiology, and then I tried to read it and went, this is... infinitely more detailed than any of the eye and ocular anatomy I learned. Yeah. I mean, I know a little bit about that stuff and I've had some adventures in it recently for myself, but I was like, I don't know. I don't know. That's where I go. I bet Gooden couldn't sew a dress and I can't. Anyway, but he did some amazing stuff in the medical field. And for all of this work and his previous reform work in the mental health space, He was granted a noble title by the German government in 1875. In the 1870s, Gooden became the psychiatrist to Ludwig II's younger brother, Otto. Otto had shown signs of some sort of mental illness from the time he was young, but after serving in the Franco-Prussian War, his issues became a lot more pronounced. He exhibited signs of severe anxiety and depression and sometimes mania, Modern clinicians have guessed that he might have had some form of schizophrenia. In 1878, Ludwig ordered a guardianship for Otto, and the two brothers had been close in their younger years, but they became estranged as they aged. Yeah, and just to be clear, Gooden was not talking to Ludwig II about his work with Otto. That's going to come up in a minute. Because in 1886, Gooden was asked to perform a very specific analysis of the king himself. which would change the course of Gooden's life and Ludwig's. We're going to speed run Ludwig II's background because there is already an episode on him and it is possible we might revisit it in the future and it is worthy of its own episode, but we just need quick context here. Here are the basics. King Ludwig II of Bavaria ascended to the throne in 1864 after his father died. He was 18 at that point, incredibly handsome and kind of a shy nerd. His famous obsession with Wagner had already been well-established at this point. And once he became king, he started spending money on things like a theater for Wagner and other projects. But more troubling to the people around him was that he wasn't married and he wasn't producing heirs. He was engaged in 1867 to Duchess Sophie Charlotte, but then he called off the marriage. There is a whole side topic we could do about that. and his struggles with his sexual identity that is outside the scope of this Guten-focused episode. But Ludwig spent both government money and his family money on some of those big construction projects, including Linderhof Palace and Neuschwanstein Castle. These castles, which were famously filled with unorthodox designs like rooms dedicated to recreating scenes from Wagner operas, a couple of which we have been lucky enough to see, were paid for with his own family money, plus some money that he borrowed. But the expense of staffing and running them fell to the state, and that got increasingly more expensive. As Bavaria was caught in the shifting boundaries and conflicts of Austria, Prussia, France, and the new German Empire, Ludwig's behavior had become more and more at odds with his cabinet. That happened over the course of years. And his spending worried both politicians and his relatives. That lack of an heir and his interest in men were also causing problems. So his ministers and uncle, Prince Luitpold, who was next in line for the throne, conspired to have Ludwig declared insane. And that's when they asked for an official report on the king's mental health from Bernard von Gudden. Yeah, technically Otto would inherit the throne, but he had already been determined to not be in a sound mental state. So Luitpold was going to basically get the power. This report that Gooden prepared was a crucial document. It opened the door for Ludwig to be deposed based on the expertise of medical doctors. But it is deeply, deeply problematic. Gooden wrote this report about the king without ever having examined him or even spoken to him about his health, mental or physical. He met Ludwig exactly once before this in 1874, but that was not a clinical scenario and it was very brief. So instead, he used statements and descriptions that were given by people who were around Ludwig, but those were also the very people who wanted him removed from the throne. Those statements were given under questioning by Count Maximilian von Holstein, with the Bavarian foreign minister Friedrich Kraft von Krelsheim and Gooden observing. The interviews were conducted on May 18, 1886. Gooden completed his report on June 8, and he signed it, as well as three other psychiatric doctors, Hubert Grashly, Friedrich Wilhelm Hagen, and Max Hubrich. Like Gooden, they did not ever speak with or examine Ludwig, and they worked only from interview notes as they reviewed the report. First in his report, Gooden laid out the genetic case for Ludwig to be declared insane. And I'm going to confess, I did not connect him to the prior show topic we're about to mention in my head when I was thinking about all of this, or ever, frankly. Quote, First of all, one should recall the notorious fact that one of His Majesty's aunts, Her Royal Highness Princess Alexandra... suffered from an incurable mental illness for many years, namely the delusion that she had swallowed a glass piano. While this should not be given too much weight, it must be emphasized all the more that His Majesty's younger brother, His Royal Highness Prince Otto of Bavaria, is also incurably mentally ill. Gooden then listed out the various behaviors with commentary that Ludwig had been exhibiting, saying they were indicative of a mental health condition. It mentioned how the king had become so shy that he had stopped going to church and instead had a private church built for himself. He had initiated a practice of private theater performances for him alone, and he insisted on massive, ornate centerpieces at banquets so that he could hide behind them. It also noted that he drank a good deal before any such events, quote, to ease the burden. Ludwig had also become known for wanting to venture into the woods at night, and this, too, was mentioned in Gooden's report. It noted that during full moons, he wanted to have parties in the forest, but he wasn't inviting nobles or royalty. He insisted that the stable servants were the attendees. The report also noted, quote, his majesty's expressed lively desire to fly through the air in a carriage drawn by peacocks would also fall in the realm of exuberant imagination, completely disregarding the boundaries of reality and possibility. And it mentioned that he had developed a habit of bowing before a tree in the forest that he believed was holy, and he would address it as a holy entity. One of the more disturbing allegations put forth in the report is that Ludwig had a proclivity for violent outbursts. The initial section of the text about this sounds almost like someone who's just frustrated and kind of making exaggerated statements about how they'd like to destroy the source of their stress. Quote, there has already been repeated talk of his majesty's irritability, his outbursts of anger and rage. It was often heard how wonderful it would be if one could set fire to the cursed nest, his own capital and residence at every corner, and if the entire Bavarian population had only one head so they could be executed in one fell swoop. But then these violent rages are described as being physically abusive. Quote, the reports are made and his majesty's orders are usually given through the closed door. Scratching on the door is the sign that his majesty has been understood. Servants who are permitted or required to enter must bow deeply and may not look at his majesty. If a member of the service staff is under punishment, he must also kneel or lie face down on the floor. The latter was introduced last year after His Majesty had read about the ceremonial at the Chinese court. Very often, however, His Majesty also resorts to violence, sometimes beating and kicking the servants until they bleed. That is obviously horrible, but it is also worth noting that we don't know if any of these stories were true. The summary judgment by Gooden was that Ludwig had paranoia to a degree that it compromised his sanity and ability to work, and that his mental illness had reached, quote, a very advanced degree. The state was not, in the words of the doctor, something that could be resolved with time or treatment and that, like his brother Otto, it was incurable. It concluded with, quote, suffering from such a disorder, freedom of action can no longer be allowed and your majesty is declared incapable of ruling, which incapacity will be not only for a year's duration, but for the length of your majesty's life. After this report, Ludwig's cousin, Empress Sissi of Austria, who he was known to be incredibly close to, was insistent that the whole thing was incorrect and that Ludwig was, quote, not a fool, just an eccentric living in other worlds of ideas. Other people that knew him actually made similar statements. So it wasn't just one person that was like, that's not true. There were quite a few. But those opinions did not have any impact in the way things played out once Gudden's authority had established Ludwig's madness. On June 10th, government officials went to Neuschwanstein to take Ludwig into custody, but the police from the village, as well as a baroness and other people who were local, defended the castle and Ludwig. The king also put out calls for help to his cousin, Prince Ludwig Ferdinand, and the people of Bavaria to protect him, and he... tried to plan an escape. And though he did have some support, ultimately he was taken into custody and his uncle Luitpold was installed as prince regent. We're about to talk about the sudden end of Ludwig's and Gudrun's lives, but before we get into that, let's take a breather and hear from the sponsors that keep Stuff You Missed in History Class going. So Interestingly enough, though Gooden had not spent time with Ludwig in diagnosis, he did spend time with him after the report was completed. Because once Ludwig had been deposed, he was sent to Schlossberg, a manor house that sits on Bavaria's Lake Starnberg. This was where the former king was expected to live out the rest of his days, and Gooden went with him as his caregiver. The two of them were transported to Schlossberg on June 12, 1886. On the morning of June 13th, Ludwig, Guten, and several of the house staff went on a walk in the woods around the manor house together. That afternoon, Guten reportedly sent a letter to Baron Johann von Lutz, the politician who had asked him to prepare the analysis of Ludwig's mental state. Apparently, they were going to compile a similar analysis of Otto, who technically inherited the throne after Ludwig, but who they were anticipating would similarly be represented by Luitpold as Prince Regent. That letter read, quote, doctors Hagen and Hubrick have been summoned for Tuesday, 9 a.m., to give an opinion respecting Prince Otto. They will probably be able to give their decision Tuesday evening. Here all is going wonderfully well. A personal examination, I may add, has only confirmed my written opinion. That evening, there was another walk. This time, it was just Ludwig and Gudden. A few hours later, both men were found dead, presumably from drowning. At the time, an autopsy was performed by Dr. Nikolaus Rudinger with government representatives observing. The autopsy stated that no injuries were present on Ludwig's body and that there were no gunshot or stab wounds and no signs of blunt force trauma. While there could not be a definitive drowning pronouncement, it was believed that was what happened, or that he may have had a heart attack or similar acute health event. But the official pronouncement was that he had died by suicide. That version of events traveled far and wide. Even U.S. papers ran the story under the headline, Mad King Ludwig, a Suicide. That account, which appeared in the Philadelphia Times by a dispatch from Munich, includes pretty compelling details that suggested what had happened. Quote, There are evidences that a violent struggle occurred in the lake between the king and the doctor in the endeavor of the latter to rescue his patient. Many footprints can be seen in the soil at the bottom of the lake near where the bodies were found, and there are several bruises on Dr. Gooden's face which were probably made by the king's fingernails. The marks consist of two large and two small scratches on the right side of the nose and forehead. The king's nails exactly fit these scratches. Dr. Gooden must have been forced beneath the water during the struggle as the king's foot marks were traced further than the doctor's. The umbrellas of both and the king's coat and overcoat, which had evidently been torn from his body, were found on the bank of the lake and led to the discovery of the tragedy. So, in addition to the marks that are already mentioned, the official record notes that Gooden had marks on his neck that suggested strangulation. Although, just to be clear, like, his body was not autopsied. Only the King's was. But some people just didn't buy that account. They believed that all of this was carefully crafted by Ludwig's political enemies. There is some validity to that idea, but... Because the same account also stated that once the report claiming Ludwig was insane had been submitted, quote, the king quietly submitted to the evidence of the medical commission and left for Berg Castle. And that is not how that had gone down. What exactly happened that evening is something that people continue to debate. And just about every theory and interpretation of the matter has proponents who will stay confidently that it is the only possible truth. And we actually need to backtrack a little bit to talk about both the report and the drowning as we go forward and the ways that those two are connected. Because just as the deaths of these two men are debated today, so too is the Gooden report and its ramifications. Because the question of whether Gooden and the other doctors who signed that report believed they were accurately capturing the state of Ludwig's mental condition or if they were somehow conspirators is its own mystery. The most popular and least sensational theory about the drowning was that during the walk on the evening of June 13th, Ludwig ran into the water, intending to end his own life. Then the doctor chased him and tried to stop him. The two men tussled, and then either they both drowned as they struggled, or Ludwig, who was quite strong, killed the doctor and then killed himself. That's in line with the autopsy findings in the newspaper version that we read a moment ago. A popular and unsurprising theory is that Ludwig was assassinated by someone in the Bavarian government to ensure that he didn't rally supporters or cause any kind of trouble going forward. He was actually pretty popular with a lot of people. This doesn't seem all that far-fetched when the detail that Ludwig was a very strong swimmer is introduced and that this happened in only four feet of water. Of course, we know people can drown in very tiny amounts of water, but because he was known to love swimming and be good at it, people are often a little incredulous about the drowning theory. This theory also has many splinter theories that offer varying specifics on the who and the how of such an act. And there are a fair number of historians who have been pretty convinced that foul play was involved. Because while the official autopsy says there were no injuries or bullet holes, that assessment has been called into question with claims that that exam was rushed and that it could have been falsified by the physician and the attending officials. In 2007, the theories of assassination were once again reignited when Der Spiegel ran a story about a man named Detlev Uttermoor, who was 60 at that time, and claimed that when he was 10, he attended a tea party with his mother. And the hostess, who had access to the Wittelsbach family property, produced a coat claimed to be the one Ludwig had been wearing the night that he died. This coat, according to Uttermull, had two bullet holes in the back. That account was echoed by another account that appeared in 2018 ahead of a documentary by filmmaker Klaus Bickelmeyer. That documentary included an account of a 97-year-old man named Willi Bael who lived on the estate of the Wittelsbach family palace known as Nymphenburg in Munich with his parents in 1961. So according to Bael, that year, his father, who worked as a handyman on the property, was brought a number of items from the palace and he was ordered to burn those in the cellar stove. And those items, he says, included a coat with two bullet holes. If you tie this together with the tea party story we just mentioned, because I'm sure you're doing calendar math right now, that puts them just four years apart with the tea party happening four years before this burning incident. It was, of course, after that information was allegedly leaked to a group of ladies and one little boy. These accounts could be silenced pretty quickly as incorrect. if Ludwig's body, which is in a crypt in St. Michael's Church in Munich, were exhumed, but the family will not allow it. I did see one interview with the director of that documentary who said, there are ways you could do a scan on the coffin without ever opening it that would probably give us enough information, but they are not into it. If there was an assassination, the logic is that Gooden was killed to eliminate any witness to the crime. His body, as we said, was not autopsied. There were just superficial observations of the scratches and the bruising on his face and neck. But if Gooden was killed to keep him quiet, there are some interpretations of the facts of the case that suggest that he sealed his own fate in colluding with Ludwig's detractors. And whether he intentionally cooked his assessment to appease people in power, or whether he simply got things wrong by trusting the statements of the people interviewed about Ludwig's state of mind, that is another debate. On the one hand, of course, any clinician should make a thorough examination of a patient. But on the other, would he have been able to insist on such an exam of a monarch? And considering the circumstances, could he have expected any kind of cooperation, even if he did insist? Regardless, modern physicians who have examined Gooden's report, the statements used to compile it, and the autopsy notes that included a lot of information about the king's skull and brain, believe that even if Gooden was behaving in earnest, his diagnosis is not quite correct. This has more to do with deeper understanding of these conditions today than anything else, but they also reflect information that Gooden would not have had access to, specifically that autopsy. The information about Ludwig's brain and skull would certainly have been of interest to Gooden given his work in craniology and cerebral anatomy. Ludwig's low brain weight and his behavior in his final years suggest to some that he may have had Pick's disease, which is a type of frontotemporal dementia that typically appears in people between the ages of 40 and 60. It's considered an early-onset dementia, and Ludwig was 40 when he died. It leads to rapid personal and behavioral changes, which could account for that violent behavior that was not characteristic of him in the years before. It could also account for the possible murder of Guten if Ludwig did it. However, all of that is still just conjecture. even with analysis by professionals. A paper published in the European Archive of Psychiatry and Clinical Neuroscience in 2021 by Reinhard Steinberg and Peter Falkai put it this way, quote, when attempting to answer this question, one enters the minefield of retrospective diagnosis. Imposing today's knowledge on the possible medical knowledge of that time often results in a false picture, like the drawing of a caricature. So, whether Dr. Gooden traded his professional reputation for some sort of deal with Ludwig's political enemies, or whether he was duped in some way and believed himself to be acting in the best interests of Bavaria, or something else, we will never know. We also won't ever know with 100% certainty how he died, most likely. but he will be forever tied to Ludwig II and those last brief tragic weeks of the king's life. Despite having been built only for Ludwig to enjoy, Neuschwanstein Castle was opened to the public on August 1st, 1886, just weeks after he died. And in the years since, it and Ludwig's other expensive construction projects have paid for themselves many times over in tourism dollars and have really become the backbone of Bavaria's cultural identity. There are many people who honor Ludwig each year on June 13th, believing him to have been wrongfully removed from his reign and to have been murdered. We'll talk about some of that on Friday. Yeah. Do you have listener mail? I do. This is from our listener, Lisa, and it's about candy. Lisa writes, Hi, I just finished listening to your episode on eponymous candy bars and wanted to recommend a side quest if you're ever in the Las Vegas area. A couple of years ago, I went there for vacation and I booked a chocolate tasting at a local establishment away from the Strip that had a very festive cactus garden you can tour. As it turns out, Ethel M. Chocolates is named for its founder's mother, Ethel Mars. Forrest Mars retired to the desert in the late 70s and started this new brand in her honor. I won't do the story the same justice that they do when they tell it at the tasting, but it was a pleasant surprise to learn about such a historical connection, and I recommend it to anyone I know who is visiting the area, especially around the holidays. Thank you for all you do, Lisa. Everybody put this on your list because it sounds great. I have a complicated relationship with Las Vegas. I don't love it the way people do, but this I would go for. If you have side quests you would like to recommend to us or just something you want to discuss or nothing at all, you just want to send us a picture of your cat, dog, tarantula, lizard, pony. Maybe you have a flea circus. You could do that at History Podcast at iHeartRadio.com. If you would like to see the show notes for today's episode or any of the episodes that we put together in the years that Tracy and I have been on it, I think we have most of those. You can do that at MissedInHistory.com. You can also subscribe to the show on the iHeartRadio app or anywhere you choose to listen to your favorite shows. Stuff You Missed in History Class is a production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
