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Welcome to the Sober Friends Podcast. My name is Matt and Steve is over there. And if you've ever wondered whether your life can really get better without alcohol, you're in the right place. You're new to recovery or have some time sober or you're supporting somebody you love, we're glad you're here.
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This podcast is about sobriety, emotional growth, and learning how to navigate life without having to drink over it. I really think if I look back at that sentence I just read, a podcast is about emotional growth, dealing with your emotions, learning to navigate without having to drink about it.
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And then I think sobriety is at the, is it at the, at the end.
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It's not really about sobriety.
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It's about how do we get through life and not have to drink over it. Normal people figure this out. We haven't. We've had to work at it. That's what I think.
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So, Steve, frigging chaos this weekend. And I don't deal well with chaos.
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How are you?
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Matt, I'm great. Yeah, my weekend was, my weekend was good.
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A little bit of chaos that I create.
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Heh, heh.
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Right. And it's, and it's really only chaos in my own head.
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And like I said, stuff that I create. And, but it's okay. It's okay now because I have some tools. And, and these days because of my, because of my recovery program, which
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Mm-hmm.
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is 12 steps of AA, I, I understand what I need to do when that happens in my life.
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Right. And I mean, it really is.
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And that's what we talk about on this podcast is like, what do we do? You know, how do we manage it? And I, and I didn't. Unlike you, I don't mind chaos. I mean this. I talk about this. I often share this and
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Yeah.
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I share, I shared it two weeks ago at my Friday night men's meeting. like, I don't mind chaos. Like I sort of, I do well in that environment. Um, and sometimes I enjoy being in that environment. So, you know, when it, when a chaos comes, I don't always put a stop to it.
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I'm better with that now and I don't let it go. But, um, so, you know, it's that whole thing where, you know, I can deal with it. So yeah, let's, let's roll.
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Let's, let's, let's, let's go for it. Um,
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good. Then you'll be
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but
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a good, uh, foil here.
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Okay. Well, yeah, let's
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because there's, there's two things going on with me and these are two recovery things that I think some people, people can, uh, I got an email from Mitzi, our friend Mitzi, which I haven't responded to. And she has really appreciated us being vulnerable and stuff.
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appreciate,
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Uh, but Mitzi has some of the same issues I do. So I have one thing over here, ADHD that is a trigger and was a trigger to drink because I can easily let things get totally out of control unless I work very hard at organizing that. I just will space lose track of time. And then it's like, oh crap, I didn't get this, this, this, and this done. So I have to work very hard on a structure. So I get the things done. I want to do without spacing out. The other hand is that level one autism. And a trait of that is when things don't go according to plan and the routine gets disrupted, it causes the dysregulation. It's the best way to describe it. And I didn't know I didn't know that this was the case until maybe a year ago that I just, I felt like something's wrong with me. I'm the problem. Why can't I be more flexible? And I'm not making an excuse that I can be more flexible. I can work at some of this stuff, but there are defaults in there, which are the reasons why certain things cause me to have dysregulation.
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Dysregulation, like getting out of the routine. And some things when the plan goes awry and there's not enough pad. I'm also dysregulated that way because I know this is going to cause me problems. I'm not going to be able to get certain things done.
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So my wife likes to be more spontaneous.
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My father-in-law, who we've talked about having health struggles at 87. Uh, when you think that an elderly parent can't get any worse, it can get worse. Uh, he's got a UTI infection and he has needed us to travel there a couple of days to make sure he takes his medication. And he's been in delirium. He has not gotten out of his chair. He has incontinence issues. So it's good. That's gotten worse. They went over there Saturday morning, he was still in the chair, and, he was not only soaking wet, there was solid matter that needed to be
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Uh,
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removed as well. He ended up in the ER, because he couldn't, they didn't feel comfortable releasing him on his own, he also had a rash from sitting in his own pee, and the UTI was kind of out of control.
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Which is all well and good, I understand, we gotta go over there and take care of him. When you have stacked a whole bunch of other stuff on the day, now you don't have the capacity for the unexpected. And, my wife had mentioned to me, well, I, I don't mind things being fluid. I told her, there's a difference between it being fluid and chaos, and to me this feels like chaos.
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And for the first time, I told her, this wasn't just like, I, I'm done because you have to take care your father. I'm not that callous. It was, we had a whole bunch of other things that had to get done that day. And I had to be pressed into service of like, I need you to drop everything to go take Addie to the barn for her riding lesson.
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I thought I was going to be back in time. I'm not back in, I'm not going to be back in time, which is the most predictable thing. Just tell me, I don't want to be told to drop everything now and run. And I told her yesterday, I'm like, I'm done. I kind of had a freak out. I'm like, I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I can't. I can't. I can't.
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And that's the only thing I could say. That's a rare thing for me of like, I am past capacity. I am overwhelmed. I cannot do this. I'm shutting down. We had that conversation.
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And then she woke me up out of bed this morning. Like literally I was dead sleep. Wake up. Uh, Addy was going to have a ride to the Berlin fair, but that person spaced. So I need you to take her. All right. When? Right now.
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I'm like, so it's wake me up. I got to go. I already had a plan for this morning. I have a podcast. I got to push that off.
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I get prickly when I feel like I'm affecting somebody else who should not be collateral damage.
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And it's like, Penny, more chaos, more chaos. And I know for her, she can do this, but it's like, I am not good at, you cannot wake me up from a set, a dead sleep to go, go, go, go, go, go, go. That's that is, you're asking a lot from me. So it's done. I'm back. Things worked out, but it's been a lot of chaos on top of, I've shared things over the past couple of months. There's been a lot going on. With that said, my capacity is gone. And it's a good thing that I haven't drunk over this.
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So for you, where you are not as inflexible as me, do you recognize that feeling when nothing individually is catastrophic? But suddenly you realize you absorb 10 small things and you cannot take the 11th.
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Oh yeah. That, that happens all the time. And again, I, that used to be one of my real bad crutches. It used to be one of my big character defects is the fact that I would not express my frustrations on a regular basis. Therefore, by the time I got around to expressing them, expressing them, they were catastrophic. Right. And, and I'd have these meltdowns and, and, and I'll tell you something that I, and it's, it's unfortunate, but it's So I do, and I talk about this in my own relationship with my wife is that sometimes I feel like that's the only way I get, something's noticed is, when I freak out. And I say that, and my freak outs aren't as bad as they used to be, but I, I've come to realize like when I would have these big freak outs, it's like, then, then she would go, oh, this is serious. Right.
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This is like, like, you know, I could mention it a thousand times now that I get it now. And maybe she might make some changes. So a couple, a couple of things. It's interesting that you brought this up. This is very interesting. And I shared a little bit about something similar on Friday night. First of all, I don't think there's any question. I have not been diagnosed with ADHD, but I, I'm, there's no question. I have it.
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I just, I'm just too scattered brain. Like I'm, you
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is
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know, I, I could, I could be walking to do something down in one area of the garage or something. And then
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you know, one of
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told,
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the tells is that you might have ADHD.
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What?
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You had an alcohol issue.
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Yeah, no, I believe it, and, uh, and then all of a sudden start a completely different project, right? Like, completely different. Like, nothing. Just because I saw it, and like, oh, I should be doing that. Anyway, so, here's a little bit about my little chaotic weekend that I cause, is that, um, I talked about, I think, last week that I helped our friend Lori close her pool, and, um, and I've since talked to two other people who have talked about closing their pools, and I'm like, closing your pool is pretty easy. I'm like, I'll give you a hand, you know?
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Talked to my buddy John at our Monday night meeting, and then my neighbor next door, his, his, uh, pool guy is, whatever, his pool guy couldn't do it for at least a couple more weeks, but, um, so I'm like, I'll give you a hand, Mike. So, so I said to him, I'll give you a hand, close your pool. Now, I had my Saturday, just like you had your plans, right? This, this is what happened. So, in my head, I had my Saturday plan to do some work in my backyard to get some grass seed down. Which was gonna take some while, a while, to sort of do dethatch and do some work, and that was my Saturday plan.
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And then, on Friday, he's like, hey, can you, can you help me close the pool tomorrow? Now, remember, I offered to help him.
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And then he asked me to do it, and, and the first issue of, the first thought in my head was, ah, shit, I gotta go help Mike, right? I gotta go help him do that pool, right? So, my point, that's what I mean, like, I caused my own chaos. Now, that thought only lasted, the nice thing about that, is that thought only lasted a few minutes, a few seconds, probably, right? And I'm like, sure, and of course, I wrote back, sure, let's do it. And, and the truth is, he's gonna do 90% of the work, and the amount of work I had to do closing his pool is probably less than two hours, right? That I literally had to be there, but I was over there helping him, because he's never closed his pool in 20-something years. Like, he has no clue how to do it. So, I went over to help him. So, then, I come back to the house, right? And his dad, now, this, this gentleman just lost his brother.
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No.
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His, the youngest brother, a couple weeks ago. So, his dad is, mom and dad are up from Florida, and I was over there, and I talked to him. I go over and visit. We have coffee in the morning sometimes, and, and his dad was talking about, he's like, oh, I'm gonna put a new timer for the pool, for Mike, you know, I'm gonna go up and get one and rewire it. So, I'm out there last night trying to finish up my grass, and his dad comes over to the fence, right? And goes, hey, Steve, you got a minute?
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Next thing you know, I'm over there trying to help him with this electrical issue, unplanned, right? For another hour plus.
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And, it's like, it just throws, and again, now, I'm kind of upset, not upset, but I'm like, oh, like, you know, am I gonna get, it's supposed to rain today.
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Am I gonna get my stuff done before the rain
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yeah,
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comes, blah, blah, blah.
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Now, the whole, the night, the beautiful thing, right, and those people who believe in a higher power or God will say it worked out, because we delayed our podcast this morning. So, we're gonna get rain here in the next hour or two. And
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Yeah.
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we delayed, and we delayed recording this morning, which allowed me to finish my work.
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Yeah.
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Right? So, all of that craziness, and I was still able to get it done before the rain, right? And, and listen, I've talked to certain people, they're gonna say, that's God working in our lives. You know, it's not the way I see it, but I get it. I get why people who believe in God feel that way. So,
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you say that it's God working in our lives. I say.
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Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha,
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ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. So, that's my point. So, that, and again, the reason why I tell that story is because that chaos happens in my head, right? It doesn't really happen anywhere else. The truth is I could get the grass done tomorrow or whatever it is, right? 24 hours isn't gonna make a difference with my grass seed, right? It isn't.
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No.
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So, it's the best of a matter, and I have nothing planned for tomorrow. I have nothing planned for Tuesday.
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It's not like I'm booked and I couldn't get it done. So, the chaos is in my head
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more
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than it is anywhere else, right? And that's what I talk about all the time in my meetings. It's like I cause my own chaos, right? In my head and sometimes that chaos escapes out of my head into my physical world. And I mean that honestly, right? I allow that chaos to come out. And that chaos could come out in different ways. It used to come out in anger, right?
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It used to come out in anger and bitterness and all that kind of stuff. It doesn't do that as much anymore. And that's, that's that. And I'm going to tell you something, if you're listening to this, that is 100% attributed to my program. And I mean that.
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I, I did not know how to regulate or manage or handle or deal with or stop that chaos.
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Once that chaos got rolling in my life, it rolled until it sort of, basically until I was emotionally exhausted, right?
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That's what would happen. I would let that chaos roll until I was emotionally exhausted. And there was a lot of hurtful things happened that happened while that was going on. I don't do that today. I don't do that.
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Like I'm able to go. I was able to go. All right. So I was able to do all that. And here's the other point. Like I was able, and I never was able to help this, my, my neighbor's dad fixed this electrical problem.
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It was beyond my capabilities.
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I was able to help. I was able to help him. I was able to do all that stuff and feel good that I was able to go over there and give
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hand.
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his dad a
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Yeah.
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And spend time.
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That
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And like.
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always feels good after.
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Right. And feel like I did my best. I couldn't fix it.
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I didn't take on the project. I didn't say, hello, let me do this. And then I couldn't fix it.
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So, you know, it's, you know, it's different. It's different.
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So, but when we're dealing with other people in our lives, a partner, a spouse, yeah, it's hard. You know, sometimes we take on their, their chaos. We take on their character defects and it's
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Yes.
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hard.
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It's
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hard, right? Because we take them on as ours. And it's difficult. It's a difficult thing to deal with.
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This is hard because then it goes into the boundaries issue. But do I set an artificial boundary here? I can't help. But your dad is dealing with a significant health issue that has to be addressed. He lives farther away than he should. Am I just going to say no? You know, screw you.
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Because there are some things that I am being relied on to clean up the mess. And there is an avenue to say, I need to put a boundary up. But then there is also the, you do have to jump in in a crisis. That's hard. Active addiction makes that thought process impossible, that you're going to make the wrong judgment.
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Active recovery allows you to critically think that through and try and make the right decision. The problem I had had was that alcohol wasn't that alcohol didn't work. The problem is it worked well and was my way to regulate. Was my way to try and get through this when there was a problem so I could experience the world differently.
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I don't have that now. So I need tools to do that responsibly. I, you mentioned something about flipping out. I have said from time to time that I have to flip out to be heard. So my, my daughter, we had a, my daughter, one of my daughters had a freshman soccer game at Nevers, which is close enough that you could bike to it. You could walk to it if you wanted to. It's just, it's a little bit of a hike. So my other daughter and her friend rode bikes there and then they wanted to ride bikes back. Now my wife didn't tell me.
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She told them no, because it was going to be too I would have been fine with it. But she wasn't. So that means we had to load the bikes into the car. And it's like, well, why do we let them ride the bikes? If we're going to have to haul them back, that's going to be a pain in the butt and it's going to be a pain in the butt to load the bikes there. And so I'm, I'm annoyed at this because it's, it's getting late. We still have some other things that we have to do.
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And so I am helping to load the bike. I didn't know what kid is doing it, but one of them was swinging a bike. And as I'm, my head is down, all of a sudden the bike, the bag comes flying at me towards my head. And I look up and I say,
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fuck you
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as loud as I can in the middle of the park.
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And I told my wife, you know, sometimes I have to explode to feel like I have been heard or noticed.
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Right. Yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's a difficult thing. Um, and you're right. You know, here's the thing about alcohol. Alcohol helped me regulate that too, right? I mean, the thing about alcohol, they talk about it, that first drink that sort of goes down and puts you at ease, right? We, we
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Mm-hmm.
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hear.
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We
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read that in our, in our, in the big book. And, and I remember that, right? I mean, that's, and that's, there's a little bit of, there's a lot of mental thing like, oh, I finally got my medicine. But it does, it works, right? It, it works when you're in,
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right when I have my cup of coffee.
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Right. It works when, when you're, when you're feeling that way and you're, and you're in active addiction and alcohol.
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Or it doesn't, you don't even have to be because you know those people like, oh, I'm going to have a drink. To relax and calm down. People who aren't alcoholics or addicts. And they can do that because it does work.
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Because it does work. Um, but the problem is, is that eventually, you know, for, for us, for me, for you, for anybody who's in addiction, it's going to, it's going to lead to more chaos. Right? My friend, my friend Jim Kay always says, um, there's nothing that a drink won't make worse.
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Yeah.
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Right? Right. Not better.
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There's nothing that a drink won't make worse. Right? So that's the whole point. If you've got a problem going on, a drink is, you know, it's going to make it worse. And that's been my experience too. That, uh, yeah, it just, it just does not, it doesn't help anything. But, you know, it's, here's the thing.
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And again, I've gotten pretty good at this. Maybe I've always been good at it. Cause I, this is this, I think this is where I talk about when I could, when I could work in chaos. Well, is I think I've always been able to separate the, the stuff like taking care of your father-in-law, the big stuff of life. Right? And I, and I do, I think I've been really good at handling those situations. Like all of a sudden is, Hey, we have to drop everything because, um, and we had an elderly, right? My mother, we took care of my mother-in-law for a long time, not took care of her. She lived alone, but when, you know, we would have to step in when we did. Um, when, when she needed help, everything else went out the door. Right? And I was okay with that. And I, and there was no angst over that. Like she was the focus. She was the most important thing. I've always been really, really good at that kind of stuff. Even waking me up in the middle and saying, Hey, um, you know, so-and-so's ride got canceled today. I need you to get up and take him. Fine.
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Now I may bitch. Like if you get now, I, I mean, I may. Bitch on the initial wake up. Although I'm a pretty good morning person, but once I'm awake and like, I get it. Like, okay, it happens.
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You know, listen, we're supposed to go to New Jersey. Oh, matter of fact, we'll talk about that.
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We're supposed to go to New Jersey this weekend.
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no,
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So I won't be, I won't be able to record until late Sunday, um, next week. Um, but, uh, and, and our dog watcher, my buddy, Mike, who comes today at the house is having some medical issues and I don't think he can.
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So it's like, okay, we got a monkey in the wrench right now.
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I, we got to figure out what we're going to do with the dog.
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Yeah. Um, and it's okay. We'll figure it out. Um,
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so I hate to volunteer for extra things as I'm talking about this, but.
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No, no.
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I might be, I might be able to help with some stuff like that.
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Yeah. My daughter, I think my daughter can. I think we have other.
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Okay.
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And actually the dog could go with us, but it's just easier to leave her home.
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Yeah. Mostly.
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Um, she's, she, she, she's more, she's more comfortable at home. Um,
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Yeah.
00:23:46.783 --> 00:25:05.968
so see, it's easier to have her in her own house. If somebody stays here and we, like I said, my buddy, Mike, usually does that. He makes a few extra dollars. We take care of, she's in our own house, but everything works best that way. But we have other options. Um, but that was just hit, you know, hit, hit, hit me this morning. And it's like, okay, we're going to figure that out. So the big stuff is, it's the little, it is the little stuff, right? In, in, in recovery, they talk about the broken shoelace, right? They talk about like, that's, what's going to make you go drink the broken shoelace. And I relate to that so much. Like, you know, the big stuff I can deal with, it is that little stuff that drives me nuts. And that's what you're talking about with your wife, right? It's that little stuff of spontaneous or not planning. Um, and, and again, if I'm busy, my, a lot of times my wife will say, Hey, can you do this for me? And I'll just say, Nope, I can't do that for you right now. And you know, like I, I can tell like what's important and what's not like, Nope, I can't. Or if I know it's something that she could have planned for a different time, I may say, no, I'm not going to do that right now. Cause you know, you gotta, you gotta take me into consideration too. So, um, but it's, listen, it's, uh, It's a day by day thing, right, it's a day by day thing.
00:25:05.957 --> 00:25:06.277
Mhm.
00:25:06.305 --> 00:25:49.122
Day, one day at a time program, I need to work at this all the time. Uhm, I'm working really hard, I mean it, I'm working really hard. Monday night our buddy John Kaye said something that I'm trying to incorporate. John Kaye said the other night that he doesn't, he goes, he, he said, uh, I pray differently. I don't get on my knees and pray, but I don't, I don't get out of bed until I say my prayers. I'm like, huh, I could do that. Like I could literally, I wake up a little bit before I get out of bed, like I could say my prayers before I ever put my feet on the ground. And this way I don't let anything in the other, in the world start getting in my way.
00:25:50.305 --> 00:26:20.884
And, uh, I've been working hard to do that and it's like, alright. And I've been pretty good with it, um, missed the morning here and there, um, but I'm like, I'm going to start doing that. I'm going to start doing that. And then the other thing I'm trying to do, and this is again, this is me with, we talk about, I've got 16 years plus of sobriety of me really trying to take a moment before I go to bed and review my day. How did my day go today? How did I act? And I, I, that's not a habit I've been into,
00:26:21.376 --> 00:26:21.451
but
00:26:21.555 --> 00:26:58.087
I'm starting to think like, maybe I need to do that. I don't need to do a lot of work on it, but just review it. Like how did I act? Did I do something really shitty that nobody knows about? Um, you know, did I behave poorly? You know, so, you know, I'm working on that because this program is about growth. Right. But they talk about, they talk about, right. We talk, they talk about in Joe and Charlie tapes that the, you know, 10, 11, 12 are not, you know, they're maintenance steps and they always say they're not maintenance, they're growth steps. And I believe that, right.
00:26:58.178 --> 00:27:27.115
They're not maintenance. They got to maintain my sobriety, but I need to grow too. And, uh, so when I look at these different things that I'm doing after 16 years of sobriety, um, of working a program, I look at that as part of my growth. And I look at that as saying, you know something, there's still work to be done. There's still growing to do. And I'm willing to try some stuff. I'm willing to try.
00:27:22.194 --> 00:27:44.471
I haven't prayed regularly in years. I mean this years. And I'm just recently decided that I need to start trying to do that again. Um, so we'll see, we'll see where it goes, you know? Um, and that's the, you know, the whole thing with me is like, I'm trying to do different stuff.
00:27:44.781 --> 00:27:50.261
I'm trying to be a better human being. That's really what I'm trying to do. Trying to be a better human being.
00:27:50.641 --> 00:27:50.901
Mm-hmm.
00:27:51.009 --> 00:27:55.169
That people around me, um, actually like being around me.
00:27:56.275 --> 00:28:28.491
Well, now I'm pissed because I missed Monday's meeting. Not for any reason that it's not that I didn't have a car or I wasn't able to. I looked down at 725 as I'm eating dinner and realized I totally spaced. Which tells me I'm in a place of must have been overwhelmed that what I typically do every single Monday wasn't happening. That something is off for me. But I'm also annoyed that you're connecting the dots there that John has a different approach than I do.
00:28:28.922 --> 00:28:47.746
John has a different personality than I do. But he's been saying a lot of stuff that he's approaching a problem I have in a different way that has a simple solution. I think through, if I'm not praying exactly as I'm told I'm supposed to do by some people. I can't get my head around that so it just doesn't happen.
00:28:47.989 --> 00:28:48.118
Right.
00:28:48.355 --> 00:29:06.650
As opposed to do it the quick way this way, that's okay too. It's like, well, if I would just do it that way, there wouldn't be a problem. I would get it done. But I'm too stuck on the process. And so it doesn't get done because I'm stuck on the perfect process.
00:29:08.144 --> 00:29:29.669
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, that's my problem. Like, if I can't do it, you know, listen, it used to be, if I can't get up and dedicate 20 minutes of my morning to prayer and meditation, then damn it, I'm a horrible human being. I mean, like, all these other people can do that.
00:29:26.548 --> 00:29:51.149
I have, there's no reason why I can't do that. I have 20 minutes in my morning. I don't have to rush out and do anything. If, you know, but so it doesn't get done. It doesn't get done. I try to do it. I try to do some prayer. I set a timer. I do five minutes of meditation. And then I fall off and it doesn't get done. And I just throw it all away. And that's my whole point.
00:29:46.909 --> 00:29:56.072
Well, then John says, hey, I don't get out of bed until I pray. Huh? That might, that might work for me.
00:29:56.280 --> 00:29:56.641
Mm-hmm.
00:29:57.058 --> 00:29:59.419
That might work for me.
00:29:57.058 --> 00:30:12.704
So I'll try it. Right? And this is the whole point of going to meetings is that this is where we learn that stuff for us, for me. We go to meetings and I hear that and I go, ooh, let me try that. Let me try that. You know?
00:30:13.265 --> 00:30:26.325
And so, like I said, that's what I've been doing. Hopefully I'll remember to do it. You know, I don't know. What did Tony, what did Tony L say? You know, you got to do something, what, 10,000, 3,000 times or 10,000 times for it to become a habit?
00:30:26.774 --> 00:30:27.183
Yes.
00:30:27.841 --> 00:30:30.458
Um, so, you know.
00:30:31.094 --> 00:30:36.884
What worked for Tony is he had to do it a certain way 10,000 times. I got to get on my knees and I got
00:30:36.848 --> 00:30:37.239
Right.
00:30:36.884 --> 00:30:42.134
to do it this way. There is no variation. And if I do it that way, it's going to work for me.
00:30:42.521 --> 00:30:42.781
Right.
00:30:42.709 --> 00:30:46.519
So then I hear Tony's way and I'm like, well, that must be the only way I can't do it. And if I'm
00:30:46.444 --> 00:30:46.798
Absolutely.
00:30:46.519 --> 00:30:54.378
not doing it Tony's way, then I'm not going to do it at all. It's like, no, take some real-time coaching. That works for him, but it is inflexible.
00:30:55.345 --> 00:30:55.384
Right.
00:30:56.232 --> 00:30:56.618
So where-
00:30:56.651 --> 00:30:56.851
Yeah.
00:30:57.470 --> 00:31:00.216
Make the process your own and get the same end result.
00:31:01.632 --> 00:31:04.370
Yeah, that, that's the key. That's the key. Um,
00:31:04.381 --> 00:31:04.661
Mm-hmm.
00:31:05.128 --> 00:31:06.889
You know, we got to make this program our own, right?
00:31:06.889 --> 00:31:16.522
This program is an individual program. We can't do it alone, but we have to find our own way.
00:31:10.288 --> 00:31:24.823
And, uh, so I, you know, I always say I got to find out what works for me and, uh, what works for me may not work for other people. And that's the same thing. I tell that to people who I help all the
00:31:24.801 --> 00:31:25.102
Yeah.
00:31:24.823 --> 00:31:35.316
time. What works for me may not work for you. You got to find your own way. Uh, biggest, the biggest thing you could do for yourself is not pick up a drink today. That's it.
00:31:34.722 --> 00:31:35.202
Yes.
00:31:35.316 --> 00:32:09.972
If you, if you don't pick up a drink today, everything else is possible. Everything else is possible. And if you do, then very few things are possible for most, for those of us in recovery. So, I mean, that's, that's the simple message of our program. That's the simple message of this podcast. And I guess that's what we talk about was like, don't let life push you to a place where you think you're going to pick up a drink or you think that that's going to help, you know? Um, you know, beautiful thing that Friday night men's meeting, we had three brand new guys, guys with months sobriety.
00:32:09.972 --> 00:32:15.393
Got to, we gave away, we always give away, same thing with Monday meeting, right? We gave, we give away big books to
00:32:15.320 --> 00:32:15.371
Yes.
00:32:15.393 --> 00:32:21.390
those who. Two guys took, they were so new, they took big books, right? That's, that's a pretty cool meeting where you
00:32:21.357 --> 00:32:21.668
That's
00:32:21.390 --> 00:32:21.463
get.
00:32:21.668 --> 00:32:22.448
the best.
00:32:22.326 --> 00:32:22.346
it.
00:32:22.448 --> 00:32:22.708
I
00:32:22.567 --> 00:32:23.086
Right.
00:32:22.708 --> 00:32:22.750
love
00:32:23.086 --> 00:32:32.886
And I said that, I said that. I'm like, listen, I love that too. Now, these guys come back. I don't know. They're hooked up with a young guy there.
00:32:30.067 --> 00:32:43.707
I think they're living in a sober house, which is all, it's all good. Um, and they said they loved, liked the meeting, all that kind of stuff. So, but I love that when that happens at a meeting. And I love the fact.
00:32:44.307 --> 00:33:23.453
One guy said it was his first AA meeting. And I told this person, I'm like, you know, you honor us that you picked this meeting, maybe by coincidence, but to make this meeting, your first AA meeting, right? Like that, that's an honor to me into that, that meeting that, that you're here tonight. So, um, yeah. And then, you know, we get those new guys in. It just feels so good to listen to those guys and then watch them. Hang around and grow and then, uh, you know, hopefully learn the stuff that we've learned so that they can figure out how to, how to live this life without picking up that first drink.
00:33:23.846 --> 00:33:25.246
We're right back to the grass seed.
00:33:33.116 --> 00:33:33.240
Yeah.
00:33:35.915 --> 00:34:20.215
It says right on the package. Some is just never going to fire. Same thing in a meeting. You may give out a ton of those books. They may not germinate. But the ones that do, if you care for them, it's just not one blade of grass. The grass, that rhizome there of the grass is going to thicken and grow out. And that will help fill the patch. So if it's just one that you gave a book to and that germinates, it's going to thicken the hole. You're not only helped that person, it may help the next person. Give out a whole bunch. Be happy when a whole bunch of people come in.
00:34:17.155 --> 00:34:31.625
Expect that a lot of them won't come back. But if you grab one person, that person may further help you. And you never know down the line, is that the person five years from now who helps that next person in need?
00:34:32.185 --> 00:34:42.286
Who was really struggling. And you may not see it immediately, but it's like, damn, it was so good that that person came in five years ago, had that good share, helped me in the moment.
00:34:42.496 --> 00:35:03.144
And now is taking on something that made them prepared five years in the future to help another person get sober who may need seven years after that to help somebody else. Of what that looks like, the downstream impact. That is the beauty of helping people get sober.
00:35:03.525 --> 00:35:04.795
That is it.
00:35:06.018 --> 00:35:16.523
All right. You know where to find us. At Sober Friends Pod on the social media sites. And I'd love for you to do a review.
00:35:17.353 --> 00:35:37.699
Go on to Apple. Give us five stars. Go on to Spotify. Give us a thumbs up. Anywhere that you find us, you know, follow, like, subscribe. It does help get this into the right hands so we can help somebody not have to suffer anymore. Steve, thanks for helping me, uh, make some sense of the chaos.
00:35:39.829 --> 00:35:41.590
Of course. Great to see you, Matt.
00:35:42.128 --> 00:35:46.097
We will see everybody next week. Bye, everybody.
00:00:02.209 --> 00:00:21.996
Welcome to the Sober Friends Podcast. My name is Matt and Steve is over there. And if you've ever wondered whether your life can really get better without alcohol, you're in the right place. You're new to recovery or have some time sober or you're supporting somebody you love, we're glad you're here.
00:00:21.996 --> 00:00:41.073
This podcast is about sobriety, emotional growth, and learning how to navigate life without having to drink over it. I really think if I look back at that sentence I just read, a podcast is about emotional growth, dealing with your emotions, learning to navigate without having to drink about it.
00:00:41.133 --> 00:00:45.054
And then I think sobriety is at the, is it at the, at the end.
00:00:45.054 --> 00:00:48.213
It's not really about sobriety.
00:00:45.054 --> 00:00:56.658
It's about how do we get through life and not have to drink over it. Normal people figure this out. We haven't. We've had to work at it. That's what I think.
00:00:56.658 --> 00:01:02.137
So, Steve, frigging chaos this weekend. And I don't deal well with chaos.
00:01:04.152 --> 00:01:04.591
How are you?
00:01:06.156 --> 00:01:11.585
Matt, I'm great. Yeah, my weekend was, my weekend was good.
00:01:11.585 --> 00:01:13.575
A little bit of chaos that I create.
00:01:14.094 --> 00:01:15.811
Heh, heh.
00:01:15.745 --> 00:01:18.784
Right. And it's, and it's really only chaos in my own head.
00:01:18.784 --> 00:01:30.125
And like I said, stuff that I create. And, but it's okay. It's okay now because I have some tools. And, and these days because of my, because of my recovery program, which
00:01:30.069 --> 00:01:30.427
Mm-hmm.
00:01:30.125 --> 00:01:37.025
is 12 steps of AA, I, I understand what I need to do when that happens in my life.
00:01:34.525 --> 00:01:37.025
Right. And I mean, it really is.
00:01:37.025 --> 00:01:48.305
And that's what we talk about on this podcast is like, what do we do? You know, how do we manage it? And I, and I didn't. Unlike you, I don't mind chaos. I mean this. I talk about this. I often share this and
00:01:48.305 --> 00:01:48.444
Yeah.
00:01:48.305 --> 00:02:09.342
I share, I shared it two weeks ago at my Friday night men's meeting. like, I don't mind chaos. Like I sort of, I do well in that environment. Um, and sometimes I enjoy being in that environment. So, you know, when it, when a chaos comes, I don't always put a stop to it.
00:02:04.325 --> 00:02:16.022
I'm better with that now and I don't let it go. But, um, so, you know, it's that whole thing where, you know, I can deal with it. So yeah, let's, let's roll.
00:02:16.022 --> 00:02:17.908
Let's, let's, let's, let's go for it. Um,
00:02:17.921 --> 00:02:18.741
good. Then you'll be
00:02:18.610 --> 00:02:18.917
but
00:02:18.741 --> 00:02:20.651
a good, uh, foil here.
00:02:21.151 --> 00:02:22.629
Okay. Well, yeah, let's
00:02:23.412 --> 00:02:43.114
because there's, there's two things going on with me and these are two recovery things that I think some people, people can, uh, I got an email from Mitzi, our friend Mitzi, which I haven't responded to. And she has really appreciated us being vulnerable and stuff.
00:02:42.824 --> 00:02:43.127
appreciate,
00:02:43.114 --> 00:03:52.312
Uh, but Mitzi has some of the same issues I do. So I have one thing over here, ADHD that is a trigger and was a trigger to drink because I can easily let things get totally out of control unless I work very hard at organizing that. I just will space lose track of time. And then it's like, oh crap, I didn't get this, this, this, and this done. So I have to work very hard on a structure. So I get the things done. I want to do without spacing out. The other hand is that level one autism. And a trait of that is when things don't go according to plan and the routine gets disrupted, it causes the dysregulation. It's the best way to describe it. And I didn't know I didn't know that this was the case until maybe a year ago that I just, I felt like something's wrong with me. I'm the problem. Why can't I be more flexible? And I'm not making an excuse that I can be more flexible. I can work at some of this stuff, but there are defaults in there, which are the reasons why certain things cause me to have dysregulation.
00:03:52.322 --> 00:04:08.548
Dysregulation, like getting out of the routine. And some things when the plan goes awry and there's not enough pad. I'm also dysregulated that way because I know this is going to cause me problems. I'm not going to be able to get certain things done.
00:04:09.260 --> 00:04:14.450
So my wife likes to be more spontaneous.
00:04:24.038 --> 00:05:20.264
My father-in-law, who we've talked about having health struggles at 87. Uh, when you think that an elderly parent can't get any worse, it can get worse. Uh, he's got a UTI infection and he has needed us to travel there a couple of days to make sure he takes his medication. And he's been in delirium. He has not gotten out of his chair. He has incontinence issues. So it's good. That's gotten worse. They went over there Saturday morning, he was still in the chair, and, he was not only soaking wet, there was solid matter that needed to be
00:05:20.112 --> 00:05:20.163
Uh,
00:05:20.264 --> 00:05:38.009
removed as well. He ended up in the ER, because he couldn't, they didn't feel comfortable releasing him on his own, he also had a rash from sitting in his own pee, and the UTI was kind of out of control.
00:05:40.434 --> 00:06:03.504
Which is all well and good, I understand, we gotta go over there and take care of him. When you have stacked a whole bunch of other stuff on the day, now you don't have the capacity for the unexpected. And, my wife had mentioned to me, well, I, I don't mind things being fluid. I told her, there's a difference between it being fluid and chaos, and to me this feels like chaos.
00:06:03.504 --> 00:06:27.689
And for the first time, I told her, this wasn't just like, I, I'm done because you have to take care your father. I'm not that callous. It was, we had a whole bunch of other things that had to get done that day. And I had to be pressed into service of like, I need you to drop everything to go take Addie to the barn for her riding lesson.
00:06:24.149 --> 00:06:47.353
I thought I was going to be back in time. I'm not back in, I'm not going to be back in time, which is the most predictable thing. Just tell me, I don't want to be told to drop everything now and run. And I told her yesterday, I'm like, I'm done. I kind of had a freak out. I'm like, I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I'm done. I can't. I can't. I can't.
00:06:45.014 --> 00:06:58.233
And that's the only thing I could say. That's a rare thing for me of like, I am past capacity. I am overwhelmed. I cannot do this. I'm shutting down. We had that conversation.
00:06:55.553 --> 00:07:13.237
And then she woke me up out of bed this morning. Like literally I was dead sleep. Wake up. Uh, Addy was going to have a ride to the Berlin fair, but that person spaced. So I need you to take her. All right. When? Right now.
00:07:15.261 --> 00:07:23.737
I'm like, so it's wake me up. I got to go. I already had a plan for this morning. I have a podcast. I got to push that off.
00:07:23.737 --> 00:07:31.494
I get prickly when I feel like I'm affecting somebody else who should not be collateral damage.
00:07:26.517 --> 00:08:08.677
And it's like, Penny, more chaos, more chaos. And I know for her, she can do this, but it's like, I am not good at, you cannot wake me up from a set, a dead sleep to go, go, go, go, go, go, go. That's that is, you're asking a lot from me. So it's done. I'm back. Things worked out, but it's been a lot of chaos on top of, I've shared things over the past couple of months. There's been a lot going on. With that said, my capacity is gone. And it's a good thing that I haven't drunk over this.
00:08:02.394 --> 00:08:21.639
So for you, where you are not as inflexible as me, do you recognize that feeling when nothing individually is catastrophic? But suddenly you realize you absorb 10 small things and you cannot take the 11th.
00:08:23.593 --> 00:09:15.743
Oh yeah. That, that happens all the time. And again, I, that used to be one of my real bad crutches. It used to be one of my big character defects is the fact that I would not express my frustrations on a regular basis. Therefore, by the time I got around to expressing them, expressing them, they were catastrophic. Right. And, and I'd have these meltdowns and, and, and I'll tell you something that I, and it's, it's unfortunate, but it's So I do, and I talk about this in my own relationship with my wife is that sometimes I feel like that's the only way I get, something's noticed is, when I freak out. And I say that, and my freak outs aren't as bad as they used to be, but I, I've come to realize like when I would have these big freak outs, it's like, then, then she would go, oh, this is serious. Right.
00:09:12.503 --> 00:09:40.102
This is like, like, you know, I could mention it a thousand times now that I get it now. And maybe she might make some changes. So a couple, a couple of things. It's interesting that you brought this up. This is very interesting. And I shared a little bit about something similar on Friday night. First of all, I don't think there's any question. I have not been diagnosed with ADHD, but I, I'm, there's no question. I have it.
00:09:37.903 --> 00:09:41.102
I just, I'm just too scattered brain. Like I'm, you
00:09:41.063 --> 00:09:41.158
is
00:09:41.102 --> 00:09:47.923
know, I, I could, I could be walking to do something down in one area of the garage or something. And then
00:09:47.498 --> 00:09:48.038
you know, one of
00:09:47.923 --> 00:09:48.264
told,
00:09:48.038 --> 00:09:50.128
the tells is that you might have ADHD.
00:09:50.326 --> 00:09:50.657
What?
00:09:50.865 --> 00:09:51.985
You had an alcohol issue.
00:09:52.347 --> 00:10:26.217
Yeah, no, I believe it, and, uh, and then all of a sudden start a completely different project, right? Like, completely different. Like, nothing. Just because I saw it, and like, oh, I should be doing that. Anyway, so, here's a little bit about my little chaotic weekend that I cause, is that, um, I talked about, I think, last week that I helped our friend Lori close her pool, and, um, and I've since talked to two other people who have talked about closing their pools, and I'm like, closing your pool is pretty easy. I'm like, I'll give you a hand, you know?
00:10:22.437 --> 00:10:59.240
Talked to my buddy John at our Monday night meeting, and then my neighbor next door, his, his, uh, pool guy is, whatever, his pool guy couldn't do it for at least a couple more weeks, but, um, so I'm like, I'll give you a hand, Mike. So, so I said to him, I'll give you a hand, close your pool. Now, I had my Saturday, just like you had your plans, right? This, this is what happened. So, in my head, I had my Saturday plan to do some work in my backyard to get some grass seed down. Which was gonna take some while, a while, to sort of do dethatch and do some work, and that was my Saturday plan.
00:10:59.240 --> 00:11:06.966
And then, on Friday, he's like, hey, can you, can you help me close the pool tomorrow? Now, remember, I offered to help him.
00:11:08.398 --> 00:11:55.966
And then he asked me to do it, and, and the first issue of, the first thought in my head was, ah, shit, I gotta go help Mike, right? I gotta go help him do that pool, right? So, my point, that's what I mean, like, I caused my own chaos. Now, that thought only lasted, the nice thing about that, is that thought only lasted a few minutes, a few seconds, probably, right? And I'm like, sure, and of course, I wrote back, sure, let's do it. And, and the truth is, he's gonna do 90% of the work, and the amount of work I had to do closing his pool is probably less than two hours, right? That I literally had to be there, but I was over there helping him, because he's never closed his pool in 20-something years. Like, he has no clue how to do it. So, I went over to help him. So, then, I come back to the house, right? And his dad, now, this, this gentleman just lost his brother.
00:11:56.942 --> 00:11:56.991
No.
00:11:57.081 --> 00:12:21.677
His, the youngest brother, a couple weeks ago. So, his dad is, mom and dad are up from Florida, and I was over there, and I talked to him. I go over and visit. We have coffee in the morning sometimes, and, and his dad was talking about, he's like, oh, I'm gonna put a new timer for the pool, for Mike, you know, I'm gonna go up and get one and rewire it. So, I'm out there last night trying to finish up my grass, and his dad comes over to the fence, right? And goes, hey, Steve, you got a minute?
00:12:22.576 --> 00:12:29.586
Next thing you know, I'm over there trying to help him with this electrical issue, unplanned, right? For another hour plus.
00:12:31.153 --> 00:12:40.376
And, it's like, it just throws, and again, now, I'm kind of upset, not upset, but I'm like, oh, like, you know, am I gonna get, it's supposed to rain today.
00:12:38.297 --> 00:12:41.057
Am I gonna get my stuff done before the rain
00:12:40.903 --> 00:12:41.269
yeah,
00:12:41.057 --> 00:12:43.157
comes, blah, blah, blah.
00:12:41.057 --> 00:12:53.730
Now, the whole, the night, the beautiful thing, right, and those people who believe in a higher power or God will say it worked out, because we delayed our podcast this morning. So, we're gonna get rain here in the next hour or two. And
00:12:53.351 --> 00:12:53.392
Yeah.
00:12:53.730 --> 00:12:57.360
we delayed, and we delayed recording this morning, which allowed me to finish my work.
00:12:57.418 --> 00:12:57.469
Yeah.
00:12:58.197 --> 00:13:16.183
Right? So, all of that craziness, and I was still able to get it done before the rain, right? And, and listen, I've talked to certain people, they're gonna say, that's God working in our lives. You know, it's not the way I see it, but I get it. I get why people who believe in God feel that way. So,
00:13:16.323 --> 00:13:20.504
you say that it's God working in our lives. I say.
00:13:21.389 --> 00:13:23.701
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha,
00:13:23.697 --> 00:13:46.177
ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha. So, that's my point. So, that, and again, the reason why I tell that story is because that chaos happens in my head, right? It doesn't really happen anywhere else. The truth is I could get the grass done tomorrow or whatever it is, right? 24 hours isn't gonna make a difference with my grass seed, right? It isn't.
00:13:46.686 --> 00:13:46.966
No.
00:13:47.581 --> 00:13:52.841
So, it's the best of a matter, and I have nothing planned for tomorrow. I have nothing planned for Tuesday.
00:13:52.850 --> 00:13:59.015
It's not like I'm booked and I couldn't get it done. So, the chaos is in my head
00:13:59.019 --> 00:13:59.533
more
00:13:59.518 --> 00:14:24.518
than it is anywhere else, right? And that's what I talk about all the time in my meetings. It's like I cause my own chaos, right? In my head and sometimes that chaos escapes out of my head into my physical world. And I mean that honestly, right? I allow that chaos to come out. And that chaos could come out in different ways. It used to come out in anger, right?
00:14:24.518 --> 00:14:38.158
It used to come out in anger and bitterness and all that kind of stuff. It doesn't do that as much anymore. And that's, that's that. And I'm going to tell you something, if you're listening to this, that is 100% attributed to my program. And I mean that.
00:14:38.597 --> 00:14:48.618
I, I did not know how to regulate or manage or handle or deal with or stop that chaos.
00:14:44.677 --> 00:14:56.057
Once that chaos got rolling in my life, it rolled until it sort of, basically until I was emotionally exhausted, right?
00:14:53.378 --> 00:15:05.769
That's what would happen. I would let that chaos roll until I was emotionally exhausted. And there was a lot of hurtful things happened that happened while that was going on. I don't do that today. I don't do that.
00:15:05.769 --> 00:15:18.450
Like I'm able to go. I was able to go. All right. So I was able to do all that. And here's the other point. Like I was able, and I never was able to help this, my, my neighbor's dad fixed this electrical problem.
00:15:15.429 --> 00:15:18.450
It was beyond my capabilities.
00:15:21.010 --> 00:15:36.749
I was able to help. I was able to help him. I was able to do all that stuff and feel good that I was able to go over there and give
00:15:36.667 --> 00:15:36.937
hand.
00:15:36.749 --> 00:15:37.126
his dad a
00:15:37.147 --> 00:15:37.616
Yeah.
00:15:37.456 --> 00:15:38.655
And spend time.
00:15:38.533 --> 00:15:39.104
That
00:15:38.655 --> 00:15:38.942
And like.
00:15:39.104 --> 00:15:39.813
always feels good after.
00:15:40.243 --> 00:15:44.442
Right. And feel like I did my best. I couldn't fix it.
00:15:44.442 --> 00:15:52.962
I didn't take on the project. I didn't say, hello, let me do this. And then I couldn't fix it.
00:15:47.163 --> 00:15:57.143
So, you know, it's, you know, it's different. It's different.
00:15:52.962 --> 00:16:10.924
So, but when we're dealing with other people in our lives, a partner, a spouse, yeah, it's hard. You know, sometimes we take on their, their chaos. We take on their character defects and it's
00:16:10.793 --> 00:16:10.833
Yes.
00:16:10.924 --> 00:16:11.028
hard.
00:16:11.594 --> 00:16:11.783
It's
00:16:12.495 --> 00:16:18.645
hard, right? Because we take them on as ours. And it's difficult. It's a difficult thing to deal with.
00:16:20.918 --> 00:16:42.466
This is hard because then it goes into the boundaries issue. But do I set an artificial boundary here? I can't help. But your dad is dealing with a significant health issue that has to be addressed. He lives farther away than he should. Am I just going to say no? You know, screw you.
00:16:43.830 --> 00:17:08.733
Because there are some things that I am being relied on to clean up the mess. And there is an avenue to say, I need to put a boundary up. But then there is also the, you do have to jump in in a crisis. That's hard. Active addiction makes that thought process impossible, that you're going to make the wrong judgment.
00:17:09.298 --> 00:17:40.249
Active recovery allows you to critically think that through and try and make the right decision. The problem I had had was that alcohol wasn't that alcohol didn't work. The problem is it worked well and was my way to regulate. Was my way to try and get through this when there was a problem so I could experience the world differently.
00:17:35.269 --> 00:18:23.869
I don't have that now. So I need tools to do that responsibly. I, you mentioned something about flipping out. I have said from time to time that I have to flip out to be heard. So my, my daughter, we had a, my daughter, one of my daughters had a freshman soccer game at Nevers, which is close enough that you could bike to it. You could walk to it if you wanted to. It's just, it's a little bit of a hike. So my other daughter and her friend rode bikes there and then they wanted to ride bikes back. Now my wife didn't tell me.
00:18:23.869 --> 00:18:59.949
She told them no, because it was going to be too I would have been fine with it. But she wasn't. So that means we had to load the bikes into the car. And it's like, well, why do we let them ride the bikes? If we're going to have to haul them back, that's going to be a pain in the butt and it's going to be a pain in the butt to load the bikes there. And so I'm, I'm annoyed at this because it's, it's getting late. We still have some other things that we have to do.
00:18:52.580 --> 00:19:14.634
And so I am helping to load the bike. I didn't know what kid is doing it, but one of them was swinging a bike. And as I'm, my head is down, all of a sudden the bike, the bag comes flying at me towards my head. And I look up and I say,
00:19:14.807 --> 00:19:15.958
fuck you
00:19:16.104 --> 00:19:18.023
as loud as I can in the middle of the park.
00:19:20.363 --> 00:19:28.042
And I told my wife, you know, sometimes I have to explode to feel like I have been heard or noticed.
00:19:59.919 --> 00:20:20.415
Right. Yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's a difficult thing. Um, and you're right. You know, here's the thing about alcohol. Alcohol helped me regulate that too, right? I mean, the thing about alcohol, they talk about it, that first drink that sort of goes down and puts you at ease, right? We, we
00:20:20.384 --> 00:20:20.903
Mm-hmm.
00:20:20.415 --> 00:20:20.467
hear.
00:20:21.284 --> 00:20:21.342
We
00:20:21.553 --> 00:20:35.553
read that in our, in our, in the big book. And, and I remember that, right? I mean, that's, and that's, there's a little bit of, there's a lot of mental thing like, oh, I finally got my medicine. But it does, it works, right? It, it works when you're in,
00:20:35.387 --> 00:20:36.798
right when I have my cup of coffee.
00:20:37.183 --> 00:20:46.416
Right. It works when, when you're, when you're feeling that way and you're, and you're in active addiction and alcohol.
00:20:46.437 --> 00:20:59.277
Or it doesn't, you don't even have to be because you know those people like, oh, I'm going to have a drink. To relax and calm down. People who aren't alcoholics or addicts. And they can do that because it does work.
00:20:54.307 --> 00:21:16.567
Because it does work. Um, but the problem is, is that eventually, you know, for, for us, for me, for you, for anybody who's in addiction, it's going to, it's going to lead to more chaos. Right? My friend, my friend Jim Kay always says, um, there's nothing that a drink won't make worse.
00:21:17.769 --> 00:21:17.818
Yeah.
00:21:18.047 --> 00:21:20.416
Right? Right. Not better.
00:21:18.047 --> 00:21:39.896
There's nothing that a drink won't make worse. Right? So that's the whole point. If you've got a problem going on, a drink is, you know, it's going to make it worse. And that's been my experience too. That, uh, yeah, it just, it just does not, it doesn't help anything. But, you know, it's, here's the thing.
00:21:36.176 --> 00:22:43.650
And again, I've gotten pretty good at this. Maybe I've always been good at it. Cause I, this is this, I think this is where I talk about when I could, when I could work in chaos. Well, is I think I've always been able to separate the, the stuff like taking care of your father-in-law, the big stuff of life. Right? And I, and I do, I think I've been really good at handling those situations. Like all of a sudden is, Hey, we have to drop everything because, um, and we had an elderly, right? My mother, we took care of my mother-in-law for a long time, not took care of her. She lived alone, but when, you know, we would have to step in when we did. Um, when, when she needed help, everything else went out the door. Right? And I was okay with that. And I, and there was no angst over that. Like she was the focus. She was the most important thing. I've always been really, really good at that kind of stuff. Even waking me up in the middle and saying, Hey, um, you know, so-and-so's ride got canceled today. I need you to get up and take him. Fine.
00:22:39.589 --> 00:22:54.900
Now I may bitch. Like if you get now, I, I mean, I may. Bitch on the initial wake up. Although I'm a pretty good morning person, but once I'm awake and like, I get it. Like, okay, it happens.
00:22:51.279 --> 00:22:57.190
You know, listen, we're supposed to go to New Jersey. Oh, matter of fact, we'll talk about that.
00:22:57.200 --> 00:22:58.730
We're supposed to go to New Jersey this weekend.
00:22:59.514 --> 00:22:59.800
no,
00:22:59.670 --> 00:23:18.511
So I won't be, I won't be able to record until late Sunday, um, next week. Um, but, uh, and, and our dog watcher, my buddy, Mike, who comes today at the house is having some medical issues and I don't think he can.
00:23:13.912 --> 00:23:21.589
So it's like, okay, we got a monkey in the wrench right now.
00:23:18.511 --> 00:23:25.999
I, we got to figure out what we're going to do with the dog.
00:23:21.589 --> 00:23:26.814
Yeah. Um, and it's okay. We'll figure it out. Um,
00:23:26.757 --> 00:23:30.214
so I hate to volunteer for extra things as I'm talking about this, but.
00:23:30.689 --> 00:23:31.038
No, no.
00:23:30.967 --> 00:23:35.114
I might be, I might be able to help with some stuff like that.
00:23:35.439 --> 00:23:37.567
Yeah. My daughter, I think my daughter can. I think we have other.
00:23:37.478 --> 00:23:37.528
Okay.
00:23:38.343 --> 00:23:41.913
And actually the dog could go with us, but it's just easier to leave her home.
00:23:42.018 --> 00:23:42.557
Yeah. Mostly.
00:23:42.512 --> 00:23:46.783
Um, she's, she, she, she's more, she's more comfortable at home. Um,
00:23:46.509 --> 00:23:46.759
Yeah.
00:23:46.783 --> 00:25:05.968
so see, it's easier to have her in her own house. If somebody stays here and we, like I said, my buddy, Mike, usually does that. He makes a few extra dollars. We take care of, she's in our own house, but everything works best that way. But we have other options. Um, but that was just hit, you know, hit, hit, hit me this morning. And it's like, okay, we're going to figure that out. So the big stuff is, it's the little, it is the little stuff, right? In, in, in recovery, they talk about the broken shoelace, right? They talk about like, that's, what's going to make you go drink the broken shoelace. And I relate to that so much. Like, you know, the big stuff I can deal with, it is that little stuff that drives me nuts. And that's what you're talking about with your wife, right? It's that little stuff of spontaneous or not planning. Um, and, and again, if I'm busy, my, a lot of times my wife will say, Hey, can you do this for me? And I'll just say, Nope, I can't do that for you right now. And you know, like I, I can tell like what's important and what's not like, Nope, I can't. Or if I know it's something that she could have planned for a different time, I may say, no, I'm not going to do that right now. Cause you know, you gotta, you gotta take me into consideration too. So, um, but it's, listen, it's, uh, It's a day by day thing, right, it's a day by day thing.
00:25:05.957 --> 00:25:06.277
Mhm.
00:25:06.305 --> 00:25:49.122
Day, one day at a time program, I need to work at this all the time. Uhm, I'm working really hard, I mean it, I'm working really hard. Monday night our buddy John Kaye said something that I'm trying to incorporate. John Kaye said the other night that he doesn't, he goes, he, he said, uh, I pray differently. I don't get on my knees and pray, but I don't, I don't get out of bed until I say my prayers. I'm like, huh, I could do that. Like I could literally, I wake up a little bit before I get out of bed, like I could say my prayers before I ever put my feet on the ground. And this way I don't let anything in the other, in the world start getting in my way.
00:25:50.305 --> 00:26:20.884
And, uh, I've been working hard to do that and it's like, alright. And I've been pretty good with it, um, missed the morning here and there, um, but I'm like, I'm going to start doing that. I'm going to start doing that. And then the other thing I'm trying to do, and this is again, this is me with, we talk about, I've got 16 years plus of sobriety of me really trying to take a moment before I go to bed and review my day. How did my day go today? How did I act? And I, I, that's not a habit I've been into,
00:26:21.376 --> 00:26:21.451
but
00:26:21.555 --> 00:26:58.087
I'm starting to think like, maybe I need to do that. I don't need to do a lot of work on it, but just review it. Like how did I act? Did I do something really shitty that nobody knows about? Um, you know, did I behave poorly? You know, so, you know, I'm working on that because this program is about growth. Right. But they talk about, they talk about, right. We talk, they talk about in Joe and Charlie tapes that the, you know, 10, 11, 12 are not, you know, they're maintenance steps and they always say they're not maintenance, they're growth steps. And I believe that, right.
00:26:58.178 --> 00:27:27.115
They're not maintenance. They got to maintain my sobriety, but I need to grow too. And, uh, so when I look at these different things that I'm doing after 16 years of sobriety, um, of working a program, I look at that as part of my growth. And I look at that as saying, you know something, there's still work to be done. There's still growing to do. And I'm willing to try some stuff. I'm willing to try.
00:27:22.194 --> 00:27:44.471
I haven't prayed regularly in years. I mean this years. And I'm just recently decided that I need to start trying to do that again. Um, so we'll see, we'll see where it goes, you know? Um, and that's the, you know, the whole thing with me is like, I'm trying to do different stuff.
00:27:44.781 --> 00:27:50.261
I'm trying to be a better human being. That's really what I'm trying to do. Trying to be a better human being.
00:27:50.641 --> 00:27:50.901
Mm-hmm.
00:27:51.009 --> 00:27:55.169
That people around me, um, actually like being around me.
00:27:56.275 --> 00:28:28.491
Well, now I'm pissed because I missed Monday's meeting. Not for any reason that it's not that I didn't have a car or I wasn't able to. I looked down at 725 as I'm eating dinner and realized I totally spaced. Which tells me I'm in a place of must have been overwhelmed that what I typically do every single Monday wasn't happening. That something is off for me. But I'm also annoyed that you're connecting the dots there that John has a different approach than I do.
00:28:28.922 --> 00:28:47.746
John has a different personality than I do. But he's been saying a lot of stuff that he's approaching a problem I have in a different way that has a simple solution. I think through, if I'm not praying exactly as I'm told I'm supposed to do by some people. I can't get my head around that so it just doesn't happen.
00:28:47.989 --> 00:28:48.118
Right.
00:28:48.355 --> 00:29:06.650
As opposed to do it the quick way this way, that's okay too. It's like, well, if I would just do it that way, there wouldn't be a problem. I would get it done. But I'm too stuck on the process. And so it doesn't get done because I'm stuck on the perfect process.
00:29:08.144 --> 00:29:29.669
Yeah. Absolutely. I mean, that's my problem. Like, if I can't do it, you know, listen, it used to be, if I can't get up and dedicate 20 minutes of my morning to prayer and meditation, then damn it, I'm a horrible human being. I mean, like, all these other people can do that.
00:29:26.548 --> 00:29:51.149
I have, there's no reason why I can't do that. I have 20 minutes in my morning. I don't have to rush out and do anything. If, you know, but so it doesn't get done. It doesn't get done. I try to do it. I try to do some prayer. I set a timer. I do five minutes of meditation. And then I fall off and it doesn't get done. And I just throw it all away. And that's my whole point.
00:29:46.909 --> 00:29:56.072
Well, then John says, hey, I don't get out of bed until I pray. Huh? That might, that might work for me.
00:29:56.280 --> 00:29:56.641
Mm-hmm.
00:29:57.058 --> 00:29:59.419
That might work for me.
00:29:57.058 --> 00:30:12.704
So I'll try it. Right? And this is the whole point of going to meetings is that this is where we learn that stuff for us, for me. We go to meetings and I hear that and I go, ooh, let me try that. Let me try that. You know?
00:30:13.265 --> 00:30:26.325
And so, like I said, that's what I've been doing. Hopefully I'll remember to do it. You know, I don't know. What did Tony, what did Tony L say? You know, you got to do something, what, 10,000, 3,000 times or 10,000 times for it to become a habit?
00:30:26.774 --> 00:30:27.183
Yes.
00:30:27.841 --> 00:30:30.458
Um, so, you know.
00:30:31.094 --> 00:30:36.884
What worked for Tony is he had to do it a certain way 10,000 times. I got to get on my knees and I got
00:30:36.848 --> 00:30:37.239
Right.
00:30:36.884 --> 00:30:42.134
to do it this way. There is no variation. And if I do it that way, it's going to work for me.
00:30:42.521 --> 00:30:42.781
Right.
00:30:42.709 --> 00:30:46.519
So then I hear Tony's way and I'm like, well, that must be the only way I can't do it. And if I'm
00:30:46.444 --> 00:30:46.798
Absolutely.
00:30:46.519 --> 00:30:54.378
not doing it Tony's way, then I'm not going to do it at all. It's like, no, take some real-time coaching. That works for him, but it is inflexible.
00:30:55.345 --> 00:30:55.384
Right.
00:30:56.232 --> 00:30:56.618
So where-
00:30:56.651 --> 00:30:56.851
Yeah.
00:30:57.470 --> 00:31:00.216
Make the process your own and get the same end result.
00:31:01.632 --> 00:31:04.370
Yeah, that, that's the key. That's the key. Um,
00:31:04.381 --> 00:31:04.661
Mm-hmm.
00:31:05.128 --> 00:31:06.889
You know, we got to make this program our own, right?
00:31:06.889 --> 00:31:16.522
This program is an individual program. We can't do it alone, but we have to find our own way.
00:31:10.288 --> 00:31:24.823
And, uh, so I, you know, I always say I got to find out what works for me and, uh, what works for me may not work for other people. And that's the same thing. I tell that to people who I help all the
00:31:24.801 --> 00:31:25.102
Yeah.
00:31:24.823 --> 00:31:35.316
time. What works for me may not work for you. You got to find your own way. Uh, biggest, the biggest thing you could do for yourself is not pick up a drink today. That's it.
00:31:34.722 --> 00:31:35.202
Yes.
00:31:35.316 --> 00:32:09.972
If you, if you don't pick up a drink today, everything else is possible. Everything else is possible. And if you do, then very few things are possible for most, for those of us in recovery. So, I mean, that's, that's the simple message of our program. That's the simple message of this podcast. And I guess that's what we talk about was like, don't let life push you to a place where you think you're going to pick up a drink or you think that that's going to help, you know? Um, you know, beautiful thing that Friday night men's meeting, we had three brand new guys, guys with months sobriety.
00:32:09.972 --> 00:32:15.393
Got to, we gave away, we always give away, same thing with Monday meeting, right? We gave, we give away big books to
00:32:15.320 --> 00:32:15.371
Yes.
00:32:15.393 --> 00:32:21.390
those who. Two guys took, they were so new, they took big books, right? That's, that's a pretty cool meeting where you
00:32:21.357 --> 00:32:21.668
That's
00:32:21.390 --> 00:32:21.463
get.
00:32:21.668 --> 00:32:22.448
the best.
00:32:22.326 --> 00:32:22.346
it.
00:32:22.448 --> 00:32:22.708
I
00:32:22.567 --> 00:32:23.086
Right.
00:32:22.708 --> 00:32:22.750
love
00:32:23.086 --> 00:32:32.886
And I said that, I said that. I'm like, listen, I love that too. Now, these guys come back. I don't know. They're hooked up with a young guy there.
00:32:30.067 --> 00:32:43.707
I think they're living in a sober house, which is all, it's all good. Um, and they said they loved, liked the meeting, all that kind of stuff. So, but I love that when that happens at a meeting. And I love the fact.
00:32:44.307 --> 00:33:23.453
One guy said it was his first AA meeting. And I told this person, I'm like, you know, you honor us that you picked this meeting, maybe by coincidence, but to make this meeting, your first AA meeting, right? Like that, that's an honor to me into that, that meeting that, that you're here tonight. So, um, yeah. And then, you know, we get those new guys in. It just feels so good to listen to those guys and then watch them. Hang around and grow and then, uh, you know, hopefully learn the stuff that we've learned so that they can figure out how to, how to live this life without picking up that first drink.
00:33:23.846 --> 00:33:25.246
We're right back to the grass seed.
00:33:33.116 --> 00:33:33.240
Yeah.
00:33:35.915 --> 00:34:20.215
It says right on the package. Some is just never going to fire. Same thing in a meeting. You may give out a ton of those books. They may not germinate. But the ones that do, if you care for them, it's just not one blade of grass. The grass, that rhizome there of the grass is going to thicken and grow out. And that will help fill the patch. So if it's just one that you gave a book to and that germinates, it's going to thicken the hole. You're not only helped that person, it may help the next person. Give out a whole bunch. Be happy when a whole bunch of people come in.
00:34:17.155 --> 00:34:31.625
Expect that a lot of them won't come back. But if you grab one person, that person may further help you. And you never know down the line, is that the person five years from now who helps that next person in need?
00:34:32.185 --> 00:34:42.286
Who was really struggling. And you may not see it immediately, but it's like, damn, it was so good that that person came in five years ago, had that good share, helped me in the moment.
00:34:42.496 --> 00:35:03.144
And now is taking on something that made them prepared five years in the future to help another person get sober who may need seven years after that to help somebody else. Of what that looks like, the downstream impact. That is the beauty of helping people get sober.
00:35:03.525 --> 00:35:04.795
That is it.
00:35:06.018 --> 00:35:16.523
All right. You know where to find us. At Sober Friends Pod on the social media sites. And I'd love for you to do a review.
00:35:17.353 --> 00:35:37.699
Go on to Apple. Give us five stars. Go on to Spotify. Give us a thumbs up. Anywhere that you find us, you know, follow, like, subscribe. It does help get this into the right hands so we can help somebody not have to suffer anymore. Steve, thanks for helping me, uh, make some sense of the chaos.
00:35:39.829 --> 00:35:41.590
Of course. Great to see you, Matt.
00:35:42.128 --> 00:35:46.097
We will see everybody next week. Bye, everybody.
