#92 - Jeremy Kinder, Get In the Right Rooms

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Hello there, and thanks for listening to episode 92 of Practically Ranching.
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I'm your host, Matt Perrier, and we are here thanks to Dalebanks Angus, your source for practical, profitable genetics since 1904.
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We're excited to host our annual bull sale Saturday, November 21st, northwest of Eureka, Kansas.
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We'll sell 160 bulls and somewhere around six elite fall yearling heifers.
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We'd love to have you at the ranch or bidding online at cci.live.
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For information on the cattle and a catalog as we get it ready, just email me at mattperrier@dalebanks.com You know, I've been blessed to host a whole host of researchers and economists and directors and chefs and writers and, and other really interesting types of folks on the podcast through the years.
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But I honestly love it when I get to put what I say is the practical back in Practically Ranching, and this week's guest does exactly that.
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Jeremy Kinder is a cattleman from Faxon, Oklahoma, where he and his young family run a commercial cow herd, a stocker operation, and various other endeavors in the cattle business.
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He also serves in leadership, uh, has served with his local Cattlemen's Association, now with the Oklahoma Cattlemen's Association, and the Common Ground Coalition.
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In this episode, we talk about a whole lot of different issues facing rural America and the cattle business.
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We talk about leadership, the challenges of member organizations, risk management, uh, the recent market fluctuations following several Friday's worth of headlines and social media posts.
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Jeremy shares a lot of ideas of things that he thinks could probably help cattlemen.
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He believes we need to focus on the industry's foundation, the cow-calf producer.
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I tend to agree.
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He mentions a lot of these ideas in the next hour, so pay attention.
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Uh, there are some really good ones, and you may wanna jot a few down.
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Along the way, there are even more metaphors and analogies and all sorts of colloquialisms, probably more than any podcast that I've ever produced, and both Jeremy and I probably, uh, contributed.
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I guess this is what happens when you stick an Okie and a Kansan together for an hour on the phone.
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So, uh, bear with us.
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But regardless of the lingo or our mannerisms, I really like the way Jeremy thinks.
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He recognizes the value of independent thought, but he also recognizes the strength in numbers.
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He likes creative solutions, but he also sees the benefit of input and differing perspectives and reliance on those who have been down some of these roads before, so that we can better inform our decisions and the messaging that we put out there to our elected officials and to consumers.
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Above all, Jeremy believes that farmers and ranchers need to take our discussions out of the coffee shops and into, as he calls it, the right rooms, so that we can come up with some workable solutions, so we can advance some of this messaging and some of these ideas.
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Jeremy believes, and I agree, that we need cattlemen who are independent thinkers and part of a larger association, and we need to get together so we can come up with some of these thoughts and ideas.
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You know, I don't know what the future holds for our beef industry organizations or the messages that we send out to our folks that are buying beef and making laws.
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But with guys like Jeremy helping lead us, I believe that we can continue to find ways to do it very well.
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So thanks for listening, and I hope you enjoy this conversation with Jeremy Kinder
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our mutual friend Chelsea Good made a suggestion that, uh, we catch up and see what we could find to talk about, and she, she didn't give me very many clues, but she thought that we could probably, have a good discussion, so I'm looking forward to it
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Yeah.
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Yeah, she, that's what she asked me, and I said,"Well, Chels, I'm, I'm not that interesting.
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I'm, I'm pretty just down the center and, just kind of ranch." But I guess she felt like there may be something,
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We've got a lot of folks that are listening to this that would answer the same, and I think that's why they and, and I--like having folks on here to do just that.
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So, um, even though you quote just kind of ranch, sounds like you've had a few other trips the last two, three weeks that have been interspersed with, as my kids call it, the real work.
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Tell me what you've been up to.
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I know as I was emailing you about scheduling this, I think you were headed to the governor's mansion or someplace to have a conversation, and then you had another meeting after that.
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So tell us what you've been up to besides just punching cows.
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Yeah.
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So, uh, had the wonderful opportunity, Secretary, Blayne Arthur reached out on a, the night before and, and asked, uh, if we could be at the governor's mansion the next day at 11:30 to just discuss industry issues and to really, uh, try to advise, maybe is the correct word, with a host of industry leaders across the state of Oklahoma.
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Many of them I'm so honored to even be in the room with.
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Uh, but they stretched all across the state and, uh, just had really good dialogue, good communication on how to, respond to the potential imports of this 300,000 metric tons coming in.
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The governor wanted a sound response from industry, which I appreciate, him looking for that avenue to do that.
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So we were able to, to meet up there and have a, a little meeting, uh, with everybody and, uh, that was very productive.
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The rhetoric that came out of there I think was very industry-driven, and it was also accurate, it was also poignant, and I think that's important too when we're talking about these issues that affect us all.
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And then from there, had the, uh, distinct opportunity to, to go down to Fort Worth and, uh, have a meeting down there with the, Common Ground uh, that we were, uh, part of the original 40 that, began that thing in Denver, about, 14, 15 months ago.
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Had some fantastic, talking points down there.
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Again, met with people from all over the Midwest, to really talk about specific industry issues that we can literally, leave association hats off.
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That's not even, uh, remotely what the Common Ground is about.
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We, we certainly do not need and recognize, um, there is not a need for another organization in the, United States regarding agriculture.
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That- that's not the point of, of what we're trying to accomplish, with that particular coalition.
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It's, it's literally trying to bridge those gaps, uh, between industry and lawmakers and between industry and those that are, are making decisions on our behalf, and we're wanting to make sure they're accurate.
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Again, we're wanting to make sure they're concise and want to make sure that they're beneficial for rural, development across not only Oklahoma, certainly that's my heartbeat, but all across the industry.
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And, uh, I think out of that meeting there's, there was some fantastic talking points that came out.
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There was, uh, good, good discussion and, and, and really, uh, again, productive, productive conversations that, that should transpire into things that are our industry needed.
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Yeah, I think it's exciting to see just how those discussions come about and, and, quite often everything we talk about in this industry is pretty organic, and it's pretty passionate at times, especially when it's relative to markets and, and things that may be going on there.
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The first meeting that you talked about with Governor Stitt and, and Secretary of Ag there in Oklahoma, was that called almost solely because of the president's, announcement of, of importing beef from other countries?
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And if so, uh, I guess what was your message as cattlemen to the administration there in, in Oklahoma?
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And then what was their response, either immediately or for the future?
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I haven't read up too much on, on some of the releases from there, so I'm always interested in how elected officials and administration and things like that view that message that we bring to them in times like that.
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It, it was really initial phone call with Secretary Arthur was, Governor Stitt is looking to respond to President Trump's, uh, announcement of this, of this beef coming across.
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And, and basically, he was looking for,"Hey, I don't like this, but I'm not quite sure why I don't like this.
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I just know that I don't think I like this." And we wanna make sure that the rhetoric and the, and the messaging is true and, and is not, uh, full of bias or not full of unrealistic things that, that really have no bearing on the market or, or production agriculture in Oklahoma.
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So that meeting, um, yes, it was very much of a direct, a direct in line with the announcement of that import.
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Governor Stitt wanted to send a letter on behalf of the producers in Oklahoma, for reasonings of, of,"Hey, this is not really what we're asking for.
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We didn't ask for this, and, and to be frank, we import beef anyway.
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So why announce something new?
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We- we've disrupted markets.
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We are literally right here at weaning time going through the droughts." This is- this couldn't be a worse timing of, of that particular announcement with the, with the markets.
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But having that conversation, my, my particular, interaction with Governor Stitt was the fact that,"Hey, we have a, we have a beef business and we have a cattle business." beef business I highly doubt is gonna be impacted that much with the metric tons because, again, we import, we're used to that.
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But what we, what we've done is we have wrecked the cattle business here for a short period of time, hopefully that we get a rebound.
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But the disconnect there is, is understanding that, hey, we're affecting direct markets right now that are in countrysides versus a, a potential market that's a, a buy, you know, repackage, resell into the consumer side.
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It, it's just two different businesses, and it's not one business.
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And I think that's where sometimes political f- uh, figures don't quite understand that, uh, cash flow is important and profitability is very important.
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And we, we had the opportunities to, to lock in some of those profits through risk management tools, during the market heights that we've had.
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But also, everything the industry market-wise was not telling us to really have to make that shift.
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We were trying to operate on good, sound business practices like we want to, and when we get government involvement in markets or, or manipulation or however you wanna to frame this, um, it makes it very, very difficult for us to continue with positive cash flows, especially when you have lost 60 or$70 a hundred in the marketplace over the last two or three weeks.
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It, it's really detrimental in
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Yep.
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Yeah, and I think that's the message that we hear so often or need to present so often to those elected officials.
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And, you know, times like what we had seen, it's easy to say let the markets work.
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It's a little harder when we are where we were in 2021 or 2015 or any of these downturns that, that maybe we as an industry, didn't like the market signals.
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But even then, I'm speaking for myself, and you may disagree, but even then, that's a time when I say,"You know what?
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As ugly and as brutal as it is, sometimes we have to let the markets work then, too, and, and, not ask for Uncle Sam to come bail us out or whatever else." Now I'm showing a few of my political leanings, I guess, in, in terms of that.
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But, uh, yeah, I think, that has been pretty unanimous, I think, from nearly every group and nearly every producer in the five, six days following that Friday announcement about bringing the 300 million metric tons of, of beef in and reducing tariffs or, or relinquishing those, um, those quotas and things like that.
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Now, fast-forward to the next Friday, and I think you were probably in Fort Worth or maybe had just concluded, uh, the Common Ground meeting when the next Truth social post came out from the Oval, and, uh, that one was probably, uh, prone to pit industry groups against each other again because it was talking about big versus little and processors versus cattlemen and all the hot button issues that we as cattlemen love to dive all over.
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How did that-- Were you, were you at the meetings when that came out?
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If so, how was that, taken by some of your participants?
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And then since then, uh, what would your take on some of those actions be?
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we, we wrapped up about noon on Friday.
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I, I don't know that it had been quite released to the extent yet.
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We didn't get in the rooms together on that particular issue.
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Uh, I think most of us were dispersed out of there and traveling back to our respective homes.
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But to, to, to announce something in that direct, uh, of,"Hey, you can go process your own now," well, we've, we've kind of already been able to do that over the years with certain certified or inspected, uh, smaller plants in our region.
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So again, it- you're maybe not quite informed, you think,"Oh, this is fantastic." But at the same time, it, it's, there, not a host of fat cattle sitting in our yards, in our backyards, in our homes ready to be harvested tomorrow.
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So even then, you still have a, a feeding period, you still have a timeframe in which you're gonna get those to, to harvest date.
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So i- it's a...
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It is mind-boggling the disconnect of who is not in the room or having conversations.
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I, uh, regardless of association affiliations, just the fact as producers and ranchers and, and cattlemen and women across the United States, for, for us to be so, uh, disconnected it seems from, from the decision-making is, is one of the things that I think is alarming, um, from my standpoint.
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And, and again, I'm a young producer here.
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I, I, I'm, I feel like I'm young and, and we still are building the ranch.
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Some of those things in decision-makings that's taking place is, is a little bit, uh, frustrating, to say the least.
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Uh, um, that that verbiage comes out in a way that they feel like they're potentially, fixing an issue that was really a non-issue when the actual issue is not getting addressed, and that goes back to letting markets be markets and letting us do the things that we know we need to do, especially in a time right now when we have a widespread drought.
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Uh, there's, there's not a, a, a fun season we're going through right now.
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We're looking in the fall here in the wheat belt to
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Yeah.
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Um, my goodness, I don't even wanna talk about it.
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I mean, I, I've got the drill sitting out here behind us, and I, I don't even wanna look at it right now.
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But, you know, if it- I'm afraid it's gonna go to raining and we can't get in there, but we'll adjust and over adapt.
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But it, it, we have enough, uh, things that we have to combat day in, day out without political influence or without decision-makings that are, are extremely detrimental to, to our cash flow and to our business
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Yeah, that seems to be the hard thing for me to wrap my arms around.
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A-and don't get me wrong, I love hearing a president say the words farmers and ranchers, and how he loves what it is that we do.
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And like it or not, whether it's real or not, from the get-go, he has played to hardworking middle America, blue collar, small business owners like us, and it's worked very well for him politically.
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I jokingly told somebody the other day that, you know what?
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As much as I like finally hearing a president, and it, it-- there have been a few others that I've heard use our lingo before and, and our terminology.
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But growing up, I didn't hear very many people outside of maybe President Ronald Reagan even say the word rancher.
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And,
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Right
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the other day, after, uh, the fourth Friday in a row that there was a Truth Social post that sent the markets into a tailspin, I said,"You know, I almost liked it better when they didn't ever talk about us." Rather...
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Keep me off your
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Yeah.
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So I don't know.
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I mean, it, it's, it's good and bad to be in the crosshairs and to be important, quote-unquote, enough in the political world that we get talked about and we get mentioned, and then we have action taken that may or may not be helpful in the long term.
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And, and again, that's, that's the tough thing about as we look at industry organizations, as we look at the way just individual ranchers look at our business and what is or isn't, um, our business and what we should or shouldn't be tackling.
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And, and I think that's one of the tough things.
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And as I've watched, you know, the Common Ground group from afar, over the last year and a half or so that you all have been meeting, it, it's been fascinating to me because from its inception, as I read press releases, a-and I may be getting a little over my skis here, and I'll probably end up Getting tarred and feathered by a few of my friends on any side of any association or within the Common Ground group.
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But it appeared to me that this was a group who maybe questioned whether our individual, entrenched associations within the ranching business and within the beef industry were ever going to solve the issues that they had between one another.
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And this Common Ground group was gonna come together and, and, try to address the ones that they could.
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And I, and I think, correct me if I'm wrong, but there were three or four what I'd call major hot button issues that at least when you all started a year or two ago, were off limits.
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You didn't get to talk about mandatory country of origin labeling or captive supply or alternative marketing or any of those different things.
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And yet, fast-forward to last spring, some of the folks that I would've said would've cheered what it was that Common Ground was trying to accomplish because they weren't going with this or that alphabet soup group of, producer organizations or associations.
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One decision in Washington, DC with very limited knowledge and information, that being do you or don't you stand behind President Trump when he signs this Argentine beef import, program, got them absolutely blackballed by the same folks that I think they were trying to help in the first place.
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And, that's the challenge of any industry service, and I guess you've provided a lot of it.
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How do we get over that?
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How do we as individual producers, drop our guard enough to be willing to work together and accept that we may not get everything we want, but together we win, divided we fail.
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I mean, it's, uh, it's a, it's a challenging deal and these associations are up against, and now even the Common Ground Coalition is, I think, seeing some challenges there
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We will, and, and as to be expected.
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So I, I had the privilege of being in the room at Washington we were invited to the Oval Office to stand behind him during the Argentine announcement.
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Now, at the time, we couldn't quite get verbiage on what the press release was gonna be like at the 1:00 PM on that day.
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And just decided collectively, we, we, we should just go back home.
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We should just exit that, Washington fly-in that we did and, and go home, uh, because that's gonna better represent our industry.
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Not, better represent our motives or tactics, but our industry is, is the ones we represent in a common ground way.
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And so yeah, we went out, and sure enough, the tweet came out that, you know, we were unappreciative as people and, and he's done so much for us.
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And, um, you know, that, that was just not what we needed to present at that time.
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It wasn't good for industry.
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And, and back to what you say, how, how do we bridge that gap?
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One of the things I can see and one of the things I do so appreciate and, and please understand, I, I love Common Ground.
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I love the fact that I was even invited to be the Founding 40 of that.
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And I'll always be proud of the work that we have done and we're doing, um, for, from, from a personal standpoint to the legacy I hope to leave for my four kids and my ranch and my family.
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But outside of even getting so captivated and caught up in, in what the Common Ground's doing, we are truly doing things in a specific asked way.
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That way when we go into those meeting rooms, we are specifically asking these things that we feel like are, are accomplishable.
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There's maybe already systems in place that don't have to be recreated and reinvent the wheel.
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We're looking at, at helping better access to capital for young producers.
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We're looking at revamping some of the equip programs, tax things, the access to public lands.
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And but one of the themes in Fort Worth, and I can't speak for any of the other regional meetings, but, but something that, that, uh, was kind of the, the heartbeat in Fort Worth was, was this, this idea around mentorship.
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all talk about wanting the next generation or wanting new producers or our veterans coming out of the, out of the military needing an opportunity.
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And, and, uh, I, I think about rural Oklahoma, where I'm at here in the small town of Faxon.
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If I want rural Oklahoma to thrive and change, well, it's got to start with my management practices.
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It's got to start with right here on this ranch.
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So, so how are we gonna implement things to actually empower rural Oklahoma and help somebody get a head start into being in this business that we do love so much, that we've had the opportunity to, to be a part of?
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So I think bridging some of those gaps is one of the things, shouldering some responsibilities that we can take, and doing the things that you can do, um, and kind of get this"us four, no more" mentality out of the way, and truly staying on task and staying on point to the verbiage and the rhetoric that is, is productive for producers and not so productive for individualism.
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But it, it really promotes a unity across the entire gamut of the industry
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So as we look at where not just Common Ground, but let's just say any group that wants to talk about these issues that maybe don't have as much to do with marketing or the way cattle are traded or owned or whatever the case may be, how do those types of discussions and those types of industry groups fit and move the needle and not fall prey to the territorial battles and everything else that we have, have been around for decades, within our industry?
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And, and, and can you get enough done there to actually move the needle and to make some positive change?
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well, I think there's been some, some positive things that have come out of, of reaching common commonality.
00:23:31.988 --> 00:23:33.357
Keep going back to common ground
00:23:33.516 --> 00:23:33.705
Sure.
00:23:33.726 --> 00:23:34.566
It's the one that's there.
00:23:34.768 --> 00:23:35.278
that kinda does
00:23:36.215 --> 00:23:36.385
Yep
00:23:36.478 --> 00:23:38.417
sense to what we're trying to accomplish here.
00:23:38.417 --> 00:23:41.577
But getting that inheritance tax raised, you know, we're getting...
00:23:41.807 --> 00:23:42.887
We got that in the farm bill.
00:23:42.928 --> 00:23:51.758
That was something we all could unify on, you know, maintaining step-up basis on these things and, and looking at some of the labor stuff with H-2A and H-2B workers.
00:23:51.758 --> 00:24:08.377
You know, we can all get on board with understanding we need help out here on these ranches, and if we can revamp that program to vet them inside the United States and we have to be careful because some people have come out and said,"Well, that's an amnesty bill you're trying to pass." It's absolutely not.
00:24:08.637 --> 00:24:10.278
Those workers are already here.
00:24:10.678 --> 00:24:21.788
We just wanna make it a way when you quote unquote talk about the seasonality of those workers, we just wanna make sure that during the seasonality of calving, we have the right people in place.
00:24:22.117 --> 00:24:25.667
I understand on the produce side we have seasonalities and those things.
00:24:26.157 --> 00:24:39.248
I, I think it's much more complicated than a lot want to, to address and look at because it may have or make us shift our paradigm a little bit or shift what our own convictions are a little bit to better fit industry.
00:24:39.298 --> 00:24:47.617
And, and again, go back to, I, I wanna make sure that we're, we're paving a way for this industry to thrive and survive.
00:24:47.667 --> 00:24:56.407
And, and you mentioned, you know, all these organizational groups that have been around for 10, 15, 20 years, been some good associational work done.
00:24:56.417 --> 00:24:58.048
No doubt there, there has been.
00:24:58.788 --> 00:25:01.417
they move the needle as they should, when they should have?
00:25:01.577 --> 00:25:20.077
Probably not, and I don't wanna be critical, but I wanna bring to light the fact that there's probably been opportunities that, uh, they could have really pushed on some issues and got some things accomplished, but because of constituency or potential membership flak or kickback, they recluse back and didn't get aggressive when they should have been.
00:25:20.407 --> 00:25:23.798
For instance, the dairy has a cull cow LRP.
00:25:24.748 --> 00:25:25.458
Fantastic.
00:25:25.458 --> 00:25:32.397
I appreciate the dairy business having that, but I would argue the beef people need a cull cow LRP just as equivalently as the dairies guys do.
00:25:32.397 --> 00:25:35.417
The dairy boys just got it done.
00:25:35.708 --> 00:25:37.057
The beef guys didn't.
00:25:38.028 --> 00:25:47.917
there's other issues there and risk management tools that we really need to take staunch looks at to, to, to R- again, pave the way for preservation.
00:25:48.198 --> 00:25:49.597
We need ways to ensure the equity.
00:25:49.597 --> 00:25:59.268
We need ways to hold this water in our pond, if you will, and, and not have a lot of red tape and things to go through, but are sound business practices that, that truly help the producer.
00:25:59.268 --> 00:26:13.028
And, and, uh, again, if you were a young producer right now and needed to go buy a set of bred heifers that cost 43 to 5,000, and if you had a way to ensure the equity of that heifer and walk into your bank and say,"Look, Mr.
00:26:13.028 --> 00:26:14.087
Banker, Mrs.
00:26:14.087 --> 00:26:27.637
Banker, I've got this insurance coverage that is, is functional," I think we would see herd expansion much more rapidly besides bringing in a product, from afar hoping to drive down the cost of beef.
00:26:27.667 --> 00:26:51.228
Which I said this and I, I keep saying this, and everybody looks at me like I got three heads, but what would it look like, walk with me for just a second, i- if, if we take some of these tariffs that we're, we're getting, some of this money, if you will, and, and instead of trying to cheapen up the product, why would we not subsidize it at the counter at purchase?
00:26:51.538 --> 00:26:58.038
If you wanna look like a hero to the American people, when they swipe that barcode, government, you subsidize it right there.
00:26:58.397 --> 00:27:01.218
Leave cash flow alone, leave production cycles alone.
00:27:01.508 --> 00:27:05.917
You truly have a, a product that is still wholesome and good.
00:27:06.167 --> 00:27:08.117
One of the best proteins out there is beef.
00:27:08.488 --> 00:27:20.748
Subsidize it at the purchase and leave production agriculture alone and everybody thrives, because there's so much money transferring in and out and then with subsidizations or drought reliefs, and those things are all great things.
00:27:21.077 --> 00:27:34.337
I, I'm not talking negatively about those things, I think there's a better way to do this that actually is beneficial to the consumer and doesn't hurt the productive cycle of, of the rancher and farmer in the United States
00:27:34.721 --> 00:27:42.241
Yeah, anytime I hear the word subsidy, regardless of if it is at the retail counter or back at the cow level, it makes me awfully nervous.
00:27:42.241 --> 00:28:02.372
And I, I look around at the farming community and the decisions that some of those folks made, not because they were poor farmers, but because that became their business model, whether it be direct payments or whether it be CRP or, even, you know, last couple weeks ago on the podcast, I talked with Dr.
00:28:02.402 --> 00:28:11.311
Ted Schroeder about what ethanol and those incentives or subsidies did to, expanding corn acres and yields probably falsely.
00:28:11.372 --> 00:28:17.711
And here we are still with those ethanol subsidies that are quite often not going straight to the farmer, obviously.
00:28:17.711 --> 00:28:42.791
But, still the, the, the S word of subsidy makes me pretty nervous, especially as a beef producer that has always kind of said,"We'll let the other segments of ag- of agriculture play that game." I want, I wanna go back a little bit here in just a minute to some of the comments about missed opportunities and, and different associations through the years and maybe where we go looking forward.
00:28:43.241 --> 00:28:44.332
But before I do, I..
00:28:44.435 --> 00:29:00.665
i kind of jumped over allowing you to give us your perspective and, and scope of, of what it is you and your family do, there in Faxon and, and tell us a little bit about your operation, and I think that gives us a little understanding of why it is you see the world like you do often.
00:29:01.057 --> 00:29:01.366
sure.
00:29:01.386 --> 00:29:18.656
So I, I had the privilege of stepping into a kind of an existing operation, with my wife's grandfather, started this particular operation and through his passing there was some land shifts as they happen in families, and my father-in-law was a, was a, a cotton farmer and a wheat farmer.
00:29:18.757 --> 00:29:21.787
Ran some cattle but, uh, not a lot of cattle.
00:29:22.096 --> 00:29:37.606
And so we were able to, uh, step in here and kinda work alongside him for a few years and then it came the opportunity to let him retire and, and he so graciously did that to allow us opportunity for, uh, our growth and our family and our expansion.
00:29:37.606 --> 00:29:49.267
So we're a cow-calf operation and a stocker operation here in the southwest part of Oklahoma, uh, mainly utilizing winter wheat to graze the stocker cattle and some improved pastures and some, uh...
00:29:49.317 --> 00:30:04.527
Oh, we, we do utilize some sorghum rotations on some marginal farm ground, uh, to, to hold a cow base together and, and, and run some stockers through the summer as well, when it's conducive and not the 450 drought that we're currently looking at.
00:30:04.896 --> 00:30:12.126
But, uh, yeah, we're, we're a cow-calf commercial operation, um, kind of a red, uh, Angus, Black Angus cow base.
00:30:12.126 --> 00:30:14.646
We do run some, uh, what I call packer cows.
00:30:15.027 --> 00:30:20.936
We'll buy some, uh, just some barn cows, uh, calve those things out and, and, uh, kinda weed through them.
00:30:21.307 --> 00:30:26.777
It's almost like a, a stocker enterprise if you will with a cow-calf deal, but it seems to work pretty well for us.
00:30:27.086 --> 00:30:32.747
We're able to kinda retain some of those cows two or three years down the road and, and, uh, leave them here on the ranch for a little bit.
00:30:32.807 --> 00:30:40.336
And so we kinda, we, we just kinda utilize our country, in a way to, to, to raise beef and that's our primary deal.
00:30:40.346 --> 00:30:41.696
We're not much into the crops.
00:30:41.747 --> 00:30:42.957
My thumb's not very green.
00:30:43.257 --> 00:30:50.787
I'm not a very good farmer and so uh, we try to, just try to, uh, raise beef, uh, is what we try to do and, and, and take care of the country.
00:30:50.826 --> 00:30:52.967
I believe strongly in being a steward.
00:30:53.416 --> 00:30:57.876
I believe strongly in trying to improve those places that, uh, are marginal.
00:30:58.126 --> 00:31:01.376
It doesn't look like it right now because of, of the drought conditions.
00:31:01.376 --> 00:31:11.477
We've had to kinda set stock some things here at our headquarters that it, uh, you drive by right now and you think that man's lost his mind but, uh, we're, we're, I assure you we're fixing to ship some cattle.
00:31:11.477 --> 00:31:20.247
But it, you know, it, it, I wished everything was, just as perfect as we planned it but, uh, sometimes we just gotta rely on the good Lord and, and, uh, hard work
00:31:20.371 --> 00:31:20.621
Yeah.
00:31:20.707 --> 00:31:21.116
forward
00:31:21.461 --> 00:31:22.891
Well, it sounds like, you know, you've...
00:31:23.060 --> 00:31:37.050
The breadth of your production knowledge and, and all the different facets and diverse ways you've gotten into the beef industry, I think fuel your perspective that's probably pretty broad on all beef industry issues.
00:31:37.050 --> 00:31:55.723
And that's why I think that, uh, it's interesting to me to get the opportunity to talk with somebody that's not just one segment, not just one breed, not just one outlook, but, from the buying cull cows at the sale barn all the way on to, you know, marketing stocker cattle and everything in between.
00:31:55.723 --> 00:31:59.134
It sounds like you've got, got some pretty good experience in all those.
00:31:59.144 --> 00:32:15.354
So as you use those various perspectives and look at our industry, um, yeah, we can, we can fill up the rest of this hour podcast with all the missteps that we've made in our industry, whether it be this or that association or us as individuals.
00:32:16.213 --> 00:32:46.544
I guess I wanna look forward, and as you know what you've seen in the past with association memberships, state affiliates, national affiliates, commodity checkoff program, the time you've had with Common Ground, all these different things I, I, I've had this rhetorical question that I've kind of been brewing in my head for probably years, but I'm, I'm gonna ask you.
00:32:46.544 --> 00:32:53.743
You get to be the, uh, you get to be the, the lucky or the unfortunate one to answer this for me.
00:32:53.794 --> 00:33:05.693
And, and I've got three different, very poorly thought out thoughts probably, but I want, I want you to give me your feedback, and there's no wrong answer.
00:33:05.763 --> 00:33:23.903
But on this kind of rhetorical or hypothetical question, which would be more healthier and effective when it comes to beef industry, I'm just gonna say strategic planning, lobbying, communicating with our consumer, you know, all these different frameworks.
00:33:24.733 --> 00:33:49.824
Option number one would be a very broad-based, all-inclusive indus- industry organization that has all different beef segments at the table and giving their perspectives, kind of like what I think the National Cattlemen's Beef Association is supposed to be and was intended to be in'96 or whenever they had that merger of all the different, organizations.
00:33:51.074 --> 00:34:01.324
And the benefit of that is that you got everybody there, and you can see it from the packer processor, from the feed yard, from the stocker, from the cow calf, seed stock, whatever the qu- the case may be, eyes.
00:34:01.733 --> 00:34:12.474
The downside is that type of model is gonna take a lot of criticism from whichever segment feels like they were wronged by whichever decision that was just made.
00:34:12.603 --> 00:34:21.824
And consequently, you're gonna have a hard time getting huge amounts of membership because everybody's gonna find something that they dislike because they just have to handle so many things.
00:34:21.833 --> 00:34:30.014
So that's, that's option number one, and I think we see maybe the challenges and the opportunities that that is, has presented.
00:34:30.474 --> 00:34:35.483
Option two would be this old segmented associations.
00:34:35.494 --> 00:34:49.193
So I don't know which one you would pick because you're s- in so many different parts, but I would be in a cow calf organization, and that would represent us, the like-minded individuals that are predominantly doing the same thing.
00:34:49.204 --> 00:35:03.443
Someone else may be in a feeding organization, someone else may be in the packer processor side, and we'd probably have more total membership because we all kinda think alike and we find quite a bit, not everything, but quite a bit that we would agree on.
00:35:04.954 --> 00:35:15.903
But then when we get to DC or then when we go to talk to the consumer or somebody else, we've all got sometimes an opposite message than somebody else's association.
00:35:15.903 --> 00:35:20.224
And so there's the benefit and the challenges that would be there.
00:35:20.623 --> 00:35:32.789
And then the third option That I think we may be kind of seeing right now as we look at how the administration is making some decisions and who is informing that.
00:35:33.329 --> 00:35:43.173
The third would be, hey, this association model that we used to think we knew is, is a bygone and it's past, it's dead.
00:35:44.114 --> 00:36:08.583
So individual producers who either have the financial wherewithal or the social media following or enough company backing that they can afford to either pay or figure out how to lobby themselves or make strategic partnerships with a retailer to get their message out to the consumer that way, it's just gonna be the wild, wild west and everybody's gonna do it on their own.
00:36:10.173 --> 00:36:14.784
Which, which of those three do you see actually working?
00:36:15.523 --> 00:36:16.153
Why?
00:36:16.164 --> 00:36:20.956
And, what's that conjure up as you look long term in the beef industry?
00:36:20.967 --> 00:36:28.936
Like I said, I, I don't know the answer and there's probably not a right answer, but I think it's something that we've seen a little piece of throughout history and maybe even today in all three
00:36:31.014 --> 00:36:38.514
Well, I, probably gonna be super frustrated with my answer, but I think we can get to a, a benchmark here.
00:36:38.554 --> 00:36:50.224
Um, I, I think for one, we have to remember that we don't have feeders, we don't have kill plants, we don't have any of that without the cow-calf sector.
00:36:50.505 --> 00:36:53.054
We have to have the production factory.
00:36:53.105 --> 00:36:55.215
We've gotta have the preservation of that.
00:36:55.554 --> 00:37:00.244
So I think boil it back down to we can all agree that we've got to preserve the cow herd.
00:37:00.735 --> 00:37:02.605
We have to put tools in place.
00:37:02.605 --> 00:37:05.065
We have to put systems in place.
00:37:05.775 --> 00:37:13.125
Before I leave this planet, I hope somebody is custom grazing the wildlife refuge in the Wichita Mountains in Lawton, Oklahoma.
00:37:13.565 --> 00:37:20.594
These grazing grasslands across the vast United States that are filled up with bison or, or wild horses, forget...
00:37:21.554 --> 00:37:23.045
people, don't shoot at me.
00:37:23.045 --> 00:37:35.784
But look, if, if we're in a hunger crisis here and we are more worried about a burrow than we are about putting beef cow out there, I think we have a, a disconnected problem already with, with some wires not
00:37:36.063 --> 00:37:36.333
Amen
00:37:36.394 --> 00:37:38.065
So I'll get off of that.
00:37:38.094 --> 00:37:43.295
But I think we need to look at that from a stand- from, from the standpoint of we have to preserve the cow.
00:37:43.885 --> 00:37:45.324
How do we preserve the cow?
00:37:45.335 --> 00:37:55.065
How do we make sure that that factory is, is safe and, and safe from a standpoint of, of having the ability to raise calves for the long term?
00:37:55.474 --> 00:38:06.514
I think that's one place where we start and, and quite frankly, I think that's one place, no matter the association, whether you're for this or that, whatever it is, I, I think we can all agree, we, we gotta have a cow out here.
00:38:06.585 --> 00:38:08.815
We can't do any of our sector without the cow.
00:38:09.235 --> 00:38:11.215
So let's look at preserving that.
00:38:11.802 --> 00:38:27.452
And, and how do we, how do we look at, at- Maybe, a- and I don't disagree that maybe the old way of associational membership with one lobbyist, it, that might not be the new norm.
00:38:27.632 --> 00:38:30.271
That might not be what's effective moving forward.
00:38:30.681 --> 00:38:38.291
But I do think, like you said at the point three, we do run the risk of it being the Wild Wild West, and we do run the risk of wrong messaging.
00:38:38.481 --> 00:38:55.711
So I do think there needs to be somewhat of some safety guards in there to, to get the right messaging out and, and grab, again, a, a common vein of,"Hey, this is really what we're looking at." But, but back to, to all of it, we're not that different across the industry.
00:38:55.711 --> 00:38:56.362
We all...
00:38:56.362 --> 00:38:58.711
I think we need to get back to more of a purist setting.
00:38:59.762 --> 00:39:02.681
why in the world am I out here fighting a drought?
00:39:02.692 --> 00:39:05.961
Why in the world am I out here fighting temperatures in a cabin in February?
00:39:06.702 --> 00:39:07.532
It's because I love it.
00:39:07.882 --> 00:39:09.862
It's because I got four kids coming behind me.
00:39:10.351 --> 00:39:12.041
It's because they're the sixth generation.
00:39:12.052 --> 00:39:23.902
A- and not everybody has that story, but everybody that is raising an animal or caretaking or being a steward of resources has that drive and that purist of,"Man, this is a calling.
00:39:23.911 --> 00:39:27.141
This is something that..."'Cause I, I assure you, it's not because we're gonna get rich.
00:39:27.612 --> 00:39:39.101
You know, we, we enjoyed some profits at times, but it's just a calling on our lives that, that we've taken the direction to wanna do this as a, as our job and, uh, as our, as our duty, if you will.
00:39:39.101 --> 00:39:49.309
And, and so think if we get back to the humanistic form of we're caretakers and we love to take care of these animals to the best of our ability,'cause they didn't ask to be put behind our fences.
00:39:49.429 --> 00:39:50.559
They didn't ask to be put there.
00:39:50.559 --> 00:39:51.650
We made that decision.
00:39:52.070 --> 00:40:12.260
So if we're making those decisions, we gotta take care of them the best we can and, and preserve the factory, preserve some sustainability in how we are able to operate these grazing lands or even our own cultivated acres, our own grass acres and, and getting some practical things through the Farm Service Agency that makes sense.
00:40:12.260 --> 00:40:22.610
For EQIP, for example, it is, it is mind-boggling that somehow somebody wrote this EQIP programs that you can do internal fencing, but you can't do external fencing.
00:40:23.369 --> 00:40:25.440
can do a water system, but you can't...
00:40:25.440 --> 00:40:29.159
If it's already got an existing pond and it's dry, you can't do a water system.
00:40:29.420 --> 00:40:32.269
There are so many bad rules written in that.
00:40:33.030 --> 00:40:39.670
instance, freestanding panels in our country are pretty popular, panels that are move around with your skid steer tractor.
00:40:39.909 --> 00:40:41.869
Well, on the balance sheet, those are assets.
00:40:42.159 --> 00:40:45.130
Why are they not incorporated in the EQIP system?
00:40:45.130 --> 00:40:49.380
Because if you get a CRP comes out and you wanna fence it, fence it.
00:40:49.679 --> 00:40:52.099
Buy the freestanding panels through the EQIP program.
00:40:52.099 --> 00:40:54.010
You have a facility to work your cattle.
00:40:54.190 --> 00:40:58.780
We, we are promoting herd health on the cow-calf level or the stocker level.
00:40:58.789 --> 00:41:05.250
So there's a lot of things that are positive that would stem through that, but we, we have to look at this thing in a practical way.
00:41:05.280 --> 00:41:13.030
Like, the fact that I could go build interior fences and get paid for it and not have an exterior fence and they would sign off on it is mind-boggling to me.
00:41:13.110 --> 00:41:14.530
It just, it's unpractical.
00:41:14.849 --> 00:41:23.039
But, uh, we're, we're talking about government systems also, but think we gotta get back to the purity of it, like get back to the heart of what we're doing.
00:41:23.119 --> 00:41:30.519
Like, get back to the really we are here to preserve and be stewards and, and we're not that different across all associations.
00:41:30.570 --> 00:41:31.380
We're really not.
00:41:31.849 --> 00:41:43.954
We just sometimes need to make sure we don't, create a good old boys club We need to make sure we don't have a just us four and no more mentality, but truly, uh, along those producers and, and back to mentorship.
00:41:44.043 --> 00:41:54.264
I, I think that's one thing that a certain generation might be pretty good at slamming the door of progress and saying,"Well, you've got to earn it like I did." Well, we're not in the same markets.
00:41:54.264 --> 00:41:56.744
We're not in the same input costs.
00:41:56.773 --> 00:42:15.583
We're not in the same fertilization, costs and, and those things, and I think that's a very narrow scope, to be frank, if, if we're not trying to figure out a way to get the young producer a leg up, if you will, or even a way to step into an op- existing operation with some opportunities.
00:42:15.653 --> 00:42:19.583
Uh, we're, we're, we're definitely what we preach.
00:42:19.583 --> 00:42:21.313
I'm not saying everybody else needs to do that.
00:42:21.313 --> 00:42:28.014
We're doing that, we, uh, recently just are fixing to hire our first full-time employee in January.
00:42:28.333 --> 00:42:31.034
And so with that's coming with the...
00:42:31.034 --> 00:42:33.123
It's gonna come with some perks on the ranch.
00:42:33.143 --> 00:42:36.844
Uh, we get to run a half a load of cattle after a certain time on the ranch.
00:42:36.844 --> 00:42:41.333
We're gonna, we're gonna let you lease 160 acres after you've been here a year.
00:42:41.434 --> 00:42:51.333
Then you get to run a load of cattle, then you get another 160 acres after a three-year period, plus the load of cattle, if you want to utilize off the farm inventory with your own capital.
00:42:51.543 --> 00:43:02.954
We're, we're trying to really help those that want to be in this industry be successful in this industry, and we should be at a point in our career where 320 acres should not make or break the operation.
00:43:03.304 --> 00:43:10.123
So we need to open up the gates a little bit and allow that next generation to get their appetite whet and to truly help them.
00:43:10.503 --> 00:43:15.454
Truly help them and go with them in a mentorship saying,"Hey, don't do that.
00:43:15.684 --> 00:43:16.963
Here's why you don't do that.
00:43:16.963 --> 00:43:21.943
This is, this is, this is when you bump your head really hard." But they also need some skin in the game, too.
00:43:21.983 --> 00:43:32.099
I recognize that, Long answer for your question, but I, I think it goes back to we just got to get back to the heartbeat of preserving the cow herd and the heartbeat of preserving the, the purity in what we do
00:43:32.365 --> 00:44:10.456
And the wild part about that is some of the segments in the beef industry that would be the furthest distance from that cow herd, and quite often take the most arrows as we get into these industry discussions, they'd agree with you, violently agree with you, because if I've got a feed yard, if I've got a processing plant and they're seeing it today, and that's why we're seeing some of those guys make the decisions they're making, is because for whatever reason, there hasn't been enough incentive, monetary or time and maybe it's just a function of drought.
00:44:10.456 --> 00:44:15.956
I- we have, as we talked about a couple of weeks ago, other things that I think are working that way.
00:44:15.956 --> 00:44:25.496
But those segments are the ones that are clamoring for more cows, more producers, more involvement as much as anybody.
00:44:25.565 --> 00:44:31.896
And yet they're the ones that get blamed quite often by us cow-calf producers for trying to run us out of business.
00:44:32.056 --> 00:44:41.686
My goodness, if they run us out of business, if that is what their quest is, that corporate feed yard or that evil packing company they're out of business too.
00:44:41.996 --> 00:45:06.846
I, I do not see us ever, maybe I will live to regret saying this, but I do not ever see us importing enough cattle, making enough beef on dairy cattle, whatever these fears that so many of us as cow-calf producers seemingly have, I don't ever see us getting enough of those to keep the beef industry infrastructure alive and well.
00:45:07.025 --> 00:45:14.496
We have to have native-born beef cattle here in the US, in order to make this thing work.
00:45:14.505 --> 00:45:15.835
It's what our consumers want.
00:45:15.896 --> 00:45:19.806
It's what all those segments of the beef industry that we love to hate want as well.
00:45:19.916 --> 00:45:56.523
The, the off-the-wall hypothetical rhetorical question has no correct answer, but I think we've got a pretty good model in that first one because to go back to your fence analogy, we spend all this time on the interior fences Within our industry, fighting over that interior fence, and we completely forget about the perimeter one, the one that most of our customers, most of the world sees driving down the road.
00:45:57.474 --> 00:45:59.523
And I, I love that analogy.
00:45:59.523 --> 00:46:08.994
Now, any of you folks that work in NRCS need to look at that EQIP program and, and, and get, get what, uh, Jeremy really wanted to talk about.
00:46:08.994 --> 00:46:15.331
But, I, I, I think in analogies sometimes, and I think that in this discussion, that's exactly our problem.
00:46:15.880 --> 00:46:25.661
We're more worried about the interior fences and exactly where they are, how high they are, who can or can't go past them, who can or can't own cattle on which side of them.
00:46:26.141 --> 00:46:34.521
Meanwhile, the, the ones that are actually protecting us and protecting our assets are rusting away, and we don't care.
00:46:34.601 --> 00:46:37.581
We'd rather take potshots across the interior fence.
00:46:37.701 --> 00:46:39.161
And, and I don't know how we ever get past that.
00:46:39.170 --> 00:46:40.541
I, I don't know if we do.
00:46:40.581 --> 00:46:50.510
I think that, um, the folks who have and who are, are quite often the most highly criticized because they've broken step.
00:46:50.541 --> 00:47:11.481
They've, they've done some of those creative things, maybe even like what you're talking about, bringing somebody in instead of just paying them an hourly wage, actually giving them some autonomy and some assets and some, you know, freedom to do what they want on their own cattle, and that's not always looked upon with approval.
00:47:11.541 --> 00:47:12.840
So I don't know.
00:47:12.871 --> 00:47:13.650
I mean, is that...
00:47:13.840 --> 00:47:16.510
Does that play well for you?
00:47:16.510 --> 00:47:23.360
And if so, how do we start deciding that we're gonna fix the outside fence and not just the ins?
00:47:24.619 --> 00:47:28.958
it goes back to, to a little bit of a legacy preservation.
00:47:28.958 --> 00:47:33.219
I mean, to be honest, I come at it from a standpoint of, of somewhat selfish.
00:47:33.489 --> 00:47:43.309
If I've got a young man there that's got some skin in the game, you th- do you think he's not gonna be a little bit better for my ranch, and he's not gonna look at this thing in a way that is, is business-minded?
00:47:43.639 --> 00:47:44.278
Absolutely.
00:47:44.278 --> 00:47:49.639
So I'm preserving acre count for my kids while helping this, uh, individual get, get going.
00:47:50.259 --> 00:47:54.789
And so I, I just think there's opportunities out there that as producers we need to look at.
00:47:55.119 --> 00:48:06.289
But, you know, back to what you said about, how do those people that are highly criticized, if you will, or, or, or not wanting to maybe stick their neck out and get criticized'cause it's not...
00:48:06.338 --> 00:48:13.009
I mean, you know as well as I do when you stick your, your, your head above the fence, sometimes that baseball bat's coming pretty fast.
00:48:13.028 --> 00:48:27.268
But at the same time, you know, I, I, I go back to a couple of things that I see as, as, as detrimental potentially for our industry moving forward is, one, access to capital, but also lending institutions that understand agriculture.
00:48:27.719 --> 00:48:30.438
Most of them don't understand the blood it takes to do what we do.
00:48:30.659 --> 00:48:38.398
They, they don't understand that, hey, all the beans are not lining up, but you add back and interest, this makes sense, cashflow looks good.
00:48:38.418 --> 00:48:47.469
You know, we're almost past those days of the good old small town bankers, and I do think rural banking is part of the problem with the industry.
00:48:47.469 --> 00:48:54.719
We, we used to be able to go down to, uh, a rural bank and, and a small town bank and get what we needed to get things done in a timely manner.
00:48:55.068 --> 00:49:00.478
Um, and so we're losing that identity a little bit, uh, as producers, and I, I think that's some of it.
00:49:00.509 --> 00:49:02.389
And, and to the disconnect, I, I can't keep...
00:49:02.458 --> 00:49:05.268
I, I keep going back to get in the right rooms.
00:49:05.378 --> 00:49:19.159
Get a hold of, of, of things that, that, one, are, are industry-driven, and get in those rooms with those lawmakers and those policymakers, whether it be on the state level or the national level, and make sure we got good policy.
00:49:19.329 --> 00:49:23.869
Make sure we just have good safety nets, um, that allow us to do what we need to do.
00:49:24.048 --> 00:49:30.309
And, and we're seeing an example right now with the market being driven down with, with how rhetoric can...
00:49:30.378 --> 00:49:36.539
You know, a simple tweet can, can just tailspin the entire sector of, of the, of the cash markets.
00:49:36.739 --> 00:49:55.528
There was a gentleman that I, I highly respect, and he said,"Sometimes, uh, I can hire it cheaper than I can learn it." And I think when we look at risk management, sometimes we can probably hire that brokerage cheaper than we can go try to learn it, and that might be money well spent taking positions when, uh, we need to take positions on certain things.
00:49:55.539 --> 00:49:58.289
So I, I, I'm big into risk management.
00:49:58.338 --> 00:50:01.728
I, I think that's one thing for, again, preservation.
00:50:01.728 --> 00:50:04.179
If you leave meat on the bone, you at least got to have a steak dinner.
00:50:04.518 --> 00:50:09.608
So sometimes we need to, we need to kind of make sure we leave a little meat on the bone and at least preserve a
00:50:09.922 --> 00:50:20.543
Yeah, I know a lot of our folks that have been pushing and asking folks why have we not seen more uptake of the LRP program and some of these other risk management programs.
00:50:20.753 --> 00:50:36.842
You know, the last three months I've heard a lot of those guys asking that exact question, and I'd say the last three weeks there are a lot of cow-calf producers and, and you know, even margin operators who are asking themselves,"Oh my gosh, why didn't I listen?"
00:50:38.264 --> 00:50:38.284
Yeah.
00:50:38.905 --> 00:50:43.224
Well, you know, it's one of those things too, as a product it's pretty attractive, but we gotta get that...
00:50:43.235 --> 00:50:49.025
We- we've worked on that in, on the common ground as well, getting it, it more affordable for the long position.
00:50:49.025 --> 00:50:58.574
You know, giving up 100 or$150 a head right out of the gate for either an unborn or, or potential a nine-weight, I mean, that's cutting into the mustard pretty deep.
00:50:58.574 --> 00:51:05.795
And so w- we're looking at that and saying,"Hey, let's figure out a way to make this more attractive," because it is something that...
00:51:06.195 --> 00:51:17.715
Look, in Oklahoma the average cowherd size is 32 head, so we don't have the abilities, uh, those guys to, to take a forward contract or to take a put or a call or, or a hedge.
00:51:17.914 --> 00:51:20.184
They don't have that option, but with LRP they do.
00:51:21.054 --> 00:51:24.425
then you say,"Hey, it's gonna cost you$85," like,"Well, no way.
00:51:24.454 --> 00:51:28.715
I mean, I'm losing 85 right out of the gate?" Well, you're not really losing it.
00:51:28.715 --> 00:51:46.815
You're, you're keeping from the wreck happening and you're, you're insuring it and, and you, you have to spin it in a way to, to educate them a little bit or, or just simply say,"Hey, man, you never know when the next tweet's coming out." Uh, that's a, that's a sales pitch right there to say,"You never know what's happening on a Friday." Um, but I see some...
00:51:46.974 --> 00:51:51.784
You know, there just needs to be some changes with the markets and, and how we risk manage, in my opinion.
00:51:52.144 --> 00:52:10.775
When we have those blackout dates, when we have those shutout dates, say you bought a load of cattle on, a Friday and, or Saturday and then Monday you're shut out of the market, I, I've, I'm not smart enough to figure out the mechanism of this, but it would be nice if we could get into the market at some sort of a percentage.
00:52:11.184 --> 00:52:19.485
And then I would argue the paper traders would then even have some sort of percentage contracts to trade to reduce the volatility in these markets.
00:52:19.594 --> 00:52:24.744
Uh, I'm just looking for a way to keep the lake a little calmer instead of trying to row through the ocean in a rowboat.
00:52:25.025 --> 00:52:29.835
I'd like to kinda just paddle in my canoe and understand, yeah, there's a big wave, but it's not too bad.
00:52:29.835 --> 00:52:30.724
I can see over it.
00:52:30.724 --> 00:52:40.684
But man, when you get these monsoons it just annihilates you and you can't get in the market, and then it's down$70, 100, it, it makes you wanna say adjectives, real
00:52:40.699 --> 00:52:40.858
Yeah.
00:52:40.925 --> 00:52:41.215
ones.
00:52:42.108 --> 00:52:42.518
Yep.
00:52:42.699 --> 00:52:43.119
Yep.
00:52:44.438 --> 00:52:58.778
You meant, you made a comment, and it's been 30 minutes ago, but something to the effect of it's mind-boggling to know who is or isn't in the room with some of these lawmakers as they're, as they're making some of these decisions.
00:52:59.579 --> 00:53:04.318
you've been in that room with the administration through Common Ground in DC.
00:53:04.318 --> 00:53:09.559
You've been more recently in the room in, in Oklahoma City with, Governor Stitt.
00:53:10.759 --> 00:53:16.958
Those were probably through some of your service work that you'd done through an organization.
00:53:17.938 --> 00:53:26.458
What if you hadn't have been, after seeing all the different perspectives that you've seen on the industry, what if you hadn't been to any of those meetings?
00:53:26.458 --> 00:53:35.588
Wouldn't- what if you hadn't listened to any of those industry podcasts or read any of those publications to kind of get a feel for all of the myriad of factors that are coming at this?
00:53:37.559 --> 00:53:39.929
What would you have told Governor Stitt?
00:53:39.958 --> 00:53:42.898
What would you have said when the president said,"Hey, you wanna stand here?
00:53:42.898 --> 00:53:44.528
Just come on in, take a picture with me.
00:53:44.528 --> 00:53:45.289
It's no big deal"?
00:53:46.358 --> 00:53:50.358
That's what worries me the most, and I love being independent.
00:53:50.389 --> 00:53:58.608
I l- there's a reason that I have this podcast instead of, you know, doing it for an industry publication or an association or something else.
00:53:58.608 --> 00:54:04.039
It lets me talk about the issues and the people that I think need to be talked about, whether I agree with them or not.
00:54:05.139 --> 00:54:16.278
But what happens when I go to a government official and I speak Matt Perrier's mind, not XYZ producer group, and how do we, how do we get through that?
00:54:16.338 --> 00:54:19.599
Th- there, there is value in the numbers and, and value in...
00:54:19.619 --> 00:54:35.728
I, I got involved on the state level is how I got into this, is just through a, a membership and then was, uh, fortunate enough to be Southwest VP for the Oklahoma Cattlemen's Association and, uh, went into some policy, uh, things.
00:54:35.728 --> 00:54:38.858
I, I have some relatives that are heavy in Farm Bureau.
00:54:39.268 --> 00:54:44.179
Um, they, they were like,"Why don't you come over to Farm Bureau side?" And I'm getting real specific with associations.
00:54:44.548 --> 00:54:48.179
But, uh, I said,"You know," I said,"you guys are, you guys are really good.
00:54:48.188 --> 00:54:49.268
You're already in Farm Bureau.
00:54:49.559 --> 00:54:51.679
Like, they already, they already have you over there.
00:54:51.719 --> 00:55:13.909
I, I feel like I am needed over here and wanna be a part of, of this side." So yes, through the Oklahoma Cattlemen's Association, again, being on the executive board, getting in the rooms with, producers that just the amount of industry knowledge and the amount of wisdom that the men and women in Oklahoma have, between their ears is, is second to none.
00:55:13.929 --> 00:55:16.778
They, they truly are big-picture people.
00:55:17.298 --> 00:55:19.369
I graduated with 13 kids in my class.
00:55:19.659 --> 00:55:22.028
I come from a 40 head cow-calf deal.
00:55:22.369 --> 00:55:23.759
And, and so you...
00:55:24.679 --> 00:55:28.318
Not to be critical, but you just don't think in big terms when you...
00:55:28.719 --> 00:55:30.318
That's your, that's your, you know,
00:55:30.545 --> 00:55:30.675
Mm-hmm.
00:55:30.719 --> 00:55:30.998
bubble.
00:55:31.028 --> 00:55:32.699
That's just what you're used to.
00:55:33.028 --> 00:55:42.498
So through, through these, uh, organizations, uh, that I do think are valuable, it does help you see a perspective that you wouldn't recognize or you wouldn't see.
00:55:42.768 --> 00:56:03.298
And then you get in those rooms and, and, and you be quiet and you listen, and you hear what they're saying and you pick up on things and you think,"Okay, I, I, I get your heartbeat here." And then you have opportunities sometimes to, to, to say things to government officials, to the governor of Oklahoma and, and hear him, you know, respond back to some of the rhetoric that, that you know is, is, is sinking in.
00:56:03.298 --> 00:56:08.168
And, and the letter he sent out was very, very much of, of everything that we talked about.
00:56:08.168 --> 00:56:27.661
So yeah, I think there's a still a heap of good to be done through associational work because we, we have representation in Oklahoma at the capital level at state and, and national that is well-respected with, with Michael Kelsey, that they know and know that when he's coming to them, he's bringing a pure sense of, of industry.
00:56:27.661 --> 00:56:32.251
He's not, uh, got a, a, a objective, he doesn't have a, a negative form.
00:56:32.251 --> 00:56:36.992
I mean, there, there's an objective, but it's not a, a negative connotation coming with his rhetoric.
00:56:36.992 --> 00:56:51.961
So yes, tho- those things are still important, but I think, a- again, taking it one step further, plug into that, understand the process, learn how the methodical's workings are, and then how are we really gonna, like you said, take it to the next level?
00:56:52.371 --> 00:57:00.041
Uh, get involved with things that, that you can get passionate about and get behind that are, are good for industry and truly are not one-sided.
00:57:00.041 --> 00:57:02.782
It's truly what is needed in industry.
00:57:03.061 --> 00:57:23.280
I mean, talking about, again, land, capital- young producers, taxes, workforce, transportation, animal health, and all those things are all things that we have to preserve and we have to get behind in a common way to keep that moving forward that, that is, accomplishing things that, keep people from making decisions for us
00:57:24.360 --> 00:57:29.809
It's what I believe as well, and we can still re- remain independent-minded.
00:57:29.860 --> 00:57:41.260
We can still remain independent producers just because we pay an annual membership and go to a few meetings and weigh in on issues, help make those decisions, and then pass them along.
00:57:41.260 --> 00:57:45.119
I don't think that makes us any less independent of a cattleman
00:57:45.485 --> 00:57:51.076
No, I, I think it's paramount to stay independently minded while being a part of an association.
00:57:51.576 --> 00:58:00.106
Like, have the mental capacity to be independently minded, but understand what the policies are within that association and, and how the functions are.
00:58:00.365 --> 00:58:16.516
I do, I- and I said it while ago, I, I do wanna be careful that we can get, we can get a, a, that us four no more or,"Hey, if you don't really line up exactly with what we're trying to say," uh, boy, that's how you, that's how you really destruct an association from the inside out.
00:58:16.856 --> 00:58:25.206
So we, I, I have a caution against those type of thought processes, but I think being independent minded is exactly what the rancher is and, and the producer is.
00:58:25.226 --> 00:58:28.746
But being a part of that collective association is, is paramount too
00:58:28.784 --> 00:58:29.844
I agree completely.
00:58:29.884 --> 00:58:33.813
So you've got, you got a ton of irons in the fire there at, uh, 6K.
00:58:34.594 --> 00:58:37.963
Why do you continue to serve the industry?
00:58:37.994 --> 00:58:39.483
Why do you go to these meetings?
00:58:39.514 --> 00:58:45.403
Why do you spend time thinking about something that may or may not make you any money at home, but you do it anyway?
00:58:46.318 --> 00:58:51.588
Yeah, it, it probably cost me quite a bit just to get to town, but no, uh, it's important.
00:58:51.748 --> 00:58:54.889
It's absolutely important back to the preservation of food safety.
00:58:54.889 --> 00:58:57.418
I think it's much more than just making a living at this.
00:58:57.778 --> 00:59:08.518
I, I, I truly think it's, the aba- ability to produce and, and grow our own food here in the United States is, is, uh, w- if control the food, you control the people.
00:59:08.728 --> 00:59:11.518
That's been since, you know, the dawn of time.
00:59:11.528 --> 00:59:17.719
So I, I think for, one is preservation of that, and, and two, um, I said, I have four kids.
00:59:17.719 --> 00:59:37.759
I've got two boys and two girls out here, and I want them to see their, their dad being passionate about something, that is truly industry, driven and truly can make some changes for the, for the positive, we hope, and, uh, preserve that in a way that paves the way for my kids and grandkids to, to be in this business and to, to thrive in this business, not just exist.
00:59:38.168 --> 00:59:41.289
Uh, I want them to thrive, and, and hopefully we're giving them the tools to do that
00:59:41.971 --> 00:59:48.101
Well, it appears that you're pretty good at it, and, um, I, I thank you for doing that'cause I know it's not easy.
00:59:48.231 --> 00:59:58.634
Like I said, with family, with cattle, with all the things with a growing operation that you have to tackle, I know from experience it's tough to sometimes load up and, and go to that meeting.
00:59:58.634 --> 01:00:08.034
But I'm glad you're doing it, and I appreciate the, the time and the passion with which you do it and, again, the balance of perspectives that you add to it.
01:00:08.034 --> 01:00:32.463
I think the more often that we can get folks like yourself who champion that notion of, of independent cattle producers, of, capitalism and the opportunity to, to find where you think you can make money and grow your business and support your family, that you're able to go do it, and yet still feel like there's strength in numbers, like you said before,.
01:00:32.831 --> 01:00:37.130
that's a, that's a great thing and a testament to you and appreciate, uh, all your service.
01:00:37.130 --> 01:00:37.391
So
01:00:37.831 --> 01:00:41.931
Well, thank you, uh, for your, your podcast and, and championing and telling stories.
01:00:41.972 --> 01:00:42.771
These are important.
01:00:43.021 --> 01:00:45.112
I enjoy listening to some of your guests you've had on.
01:00:45.112 --> 01:00:54.322
It's been, been good to gain perspective, and I think that's part of, of what we're trying to do here, is gain each other's perspective in a way that we can collectively move the needle forward.
01:00:54.692 --> 01:01:09.311
one of the most important things I still say is, is, is talk to your neighbors and, and I, I say it here and I get scoffs, but that coffee pot at Hop and Sack's pretty good to gather around and, and, and it'll listen to you, and you can go home feeling pretty good about your opinion.
01:01:09.722 --> 01:01:15.061
But if it doesn't get in the right rooms and the right people to hear it, uh, it, it's really just for yourself.
01:01:15.121 --> 01:01:20.942
And, and, and not to be critical, but that's, that's just something to make you feel better when you hit the tractor or hit the feed line.
01:01:20.942 --> 01:01:22.032
So I...
01:01:22.092 --> 01:01:46.152
We've gotta get these great minds that are in these rural communities or at least sending the right people up the chain to, to, to get the connection remade back to rural Oklahoma, um, and, and really championing the fact that we need a solid rural collectiveness that, that keeps these small schools going, keeps fire departments, fueled, and, and the, and the small teachers and, and towns, you know, thriving.
01:01:46.152 --> 01:01:46.371
We...
01:01:46.371 --> 01:01:47.922
I, I think that's the heartbeat.
01:01:47.922 --> 01:01:50.871
And, and, and we all want to be, independent.
01:01:50.891 --> 01:01:54.922
We all wanna be, part of that, and, and we all want capital markets to work.
01:01:54.942 --> 01:01:57.501
But I, I think part of it, again, it starts with us.
01:01:57.552 --> 01:02:11.472
It starts with, us taking steps and initiatives to, to preserve that in a way that is functional for everybody, and that means you're probably not gonna win all the asks that you have, but, you know, we can sure champion for our neighbor, and I think that's what we need to
01:02:11.650 --> 01:02:11.869
Yep.
01:02:11.940 --> 01:02:15.070
I, I would agree, and I appreciate you doing it.
01:02:15.070 --> 01:02:20.099
So Jeremy, thanks a bunch for being on here, and we'll, uh, we'll look forward to meeting.
01:02:20.099 --> 01:02:24.320
This is the first time we've actually gotten to talk, but, uh, yeah, look forward to meeting you in the future.
01:02:24.320 --> 01:02:25.380
So thanks again.
01:02:25.927 --> 01:02:26.206
All right.
01:02:26.206 --> 01:02:26.856
Thank You sir.
01:02:27.641 --> 01:02:32.012
Thanks again for tuning in to Practically Ranching, brought to you by Dalebanks Angus.
01:02:32.271 --> 01:02:44.581
Like we said at the outset, mark November 21st on your calendar for our bull sale, and if you haven't already gotten on our mailing list, just email me your address at mattperrier@dalebanks.com.
01:02:45.202 --> 01:02:45.871
Thanks again.
01:02:45.931 --> 01:02:47.251
We'll talk again soon