00:00:00
Speaker 1: So here's Michael Phelps and he's gotta be wondering how he got here. One second before that image, Jason Lezak touched the wall in the greatest relay in Olympic history, ty Nora, how are you ten seconds earlier? Maybe not even that five? Nobody thought of as possible. How did the impossible become possible? And if that's not enough, is this the greatest sports teammate moment in history?
00:00:31
Speaker 2: Oh?
00:00:53
Speaker 1: You work, Anthony Josephe you we have a show people, What is happening? Where have you been all my life? Look at you? You're magnificent. The waiting drove me. Man, You're finally here, and I'm a mess. I don't even know. I just walk into a studio. The studio was here. I don't know if to sit down to stand? Should I stand up for this show?
00:01:16
Speaker 3: Yes?
00:01:17
Speaker 1: This is real deal with Tony reality. Why are we real deal with Tony reality? Well, we'll get to that at some point, I guess, because we are gonna be real on this show and we are going to talk about some moments in sports. I'm gonna sit down. How about that? Can I get you guys something water? Coffee? I mean, schoola down. You haven't even touched you shchoola dell? What are you doing here?
00:01:42
Speaker 2: Uh?
00:01:45
Speaker 1: Water, We're gonna work on water, right, this is I want to Somalia going through this water. You know, I only drink coffee and water, nothing else. You know, that's okay. But aquapana. I mean, we're in the sponsorship game now. I love an aquapana. That's pretty good. Dura coffee, you know, that's the good stuff. Let's do a show here. It's been a year, guys. Of all the years I've had, this was one of them. What have I been up to? You want to start with that? We will. Let's unpack some of that. First off, I worked on being still. You could ask me, how's that going? You know? Not well to that well? Being still is something I'm still learning how to how to be. And that wasn't because I thought I was going to be the type of person I said goodbye on one show, I'd be doing the next show the next day. And every fiber of my being wanted that to be the case too. And this is when I decided to listen to other people in my life. And I'm so grateful I did, because inside Rayleota here I have thirty seven shows to launch. This is the first one. This one goes well, the next thirty six will be free. But the CEO Sam Samuel over there, I say, no, we won't be doing that. Nothing's free. Okay, good's that's a good reminder as well. But but yeah, I have a lot of ideas, and you know what I did. I took some time to think about. You know, people are like, oh, how's the job search going. I was searching for a job, looking high and low for a job. What I was looking for was myself. But I was looking for was how is the job inventioned going? I want to invent the next show. That's how I was operating in my head, just knowing who I am as a person, as as a tinker or a creative. And then what was the last year like learning a lot about a new industry because I felt digital was the it was the next frontier and this is what you're seeing right now. It was a challenge for someone like myself. It hurts to lose something you love, and I wanted to sit in that for a little bit, right, Which is not to say I want to masochistic. Well, please hurt me, hurt me hurt me. No, that's not a good thing, but it is a real thing. It's a full thing, and I want to be honest to what those feelings are because I wanted to then kind of whittle that into something I could use going forward, which I hope to do in this show. Real deal with Tony reality. You know, I don't think I ever really said the name of the show out loud like that. You know, you right it up there. You just saw the I blew the bunchet on Space song. My friends. That song is called in the Meantime. For me, it's got one of the great earworms, the hooks I just said, sports earworms. You know how it came to be our theme song is for me an origin story that I'll share it right now. I used to sing that song on set for horn and PTI to warm up my voice. That's how that came to me. Warm was how I would warm up my voice. And now I'm melding the next show and I'm like, you know, let me send a note to Royson here at Space. Hug the bass. I love a band that the bassist is the composed of the lead singer. Right, That's pretty great and it's got that boogie bass that he's got. It's got the drums that I wanted, ends on a piano, which is which is I played the drums and piano. A long story to tell you that this was a song that was already in my life. But I'm like, you know what, it's got the beat that the buoy in cea. This is gonna be a warm shot. This is a nostalgia show, all right, because I I missed nostalgia. Nobody does nostalgias like they used to do nostalgia, and I hope to do a little bit of that on this show, where we talk about some of the great moments you remember and then you're always happy to see And that's what this is. The show starts with an image, as we just saw. It was Michael Phelps. Look at Michael Phelps here? How could you not have this image in my phone? I send it to people when we're celebrating, of course, right, oh, and I love the celebration because he doesn't know what to do with his hands. I don't know what to do my hands either. I bumped into this microphone like six times. Over here is it over here? Steven Tyler type situation? Here with the microphone. You know who is all up here. It was Lemmy when he's playing bass that he was doing. I like this image because it's about celebration, but that's not what this image is to me when I see it. It's not why I keep it in my phone, honestly, and it's not why I rewatched the moment that this image is about. This is a show about moments, and for me, I know precisely what this image is. This is This is Michael Phelps celebrating Jason Lezak out touching La Bernard at the wall and the greatest comeback in the greatest relay in sports history two thousand and eight Beijing Games, one hundred meters free and the relay that enabled and why the camera was focused on Phelps to proceed on his impossible dream of getting eight gold medals. But much more impossible was how Lisa came back in this race to win. And I think it's an amazing story in teammates and I have a sneaking suspicion there's a couple other things at play, which I'll unlock, I hope with our guest today. But for me, this one picture, and there's a couple more pick I got more pictures here. I gotta pictures and picture times with Tony. All right, this one the fingers for me, is not just about Phelps, and it's not just about It's about teammates, right, And I just asked the question I'm gonna ask it right now here. Is it the greatest teammate moment in history? And that kind of is an odd question to say about a sport. I don't even think it's a team sport. And the relay, of course is the most team thing you can do. But is it the greatest? So I would love to do something here, real deal top five, and I would love music again, but again, the budget completely on space out. We're gonna work on that. I'll have to construct my own music here. So here we go the real Deal Top five greatest sports teammates Moments in history? Number six Bush push Reggie Bush, oh Man to live back in this time Notre davers usc. This was the biggest game in the college football calendar this year. I bet you if you went back and looked at the TV ratings, it was it was one of the one hundred most watch shows. You know. It was the college football game in the Residen. It was such a great game. A goal line here, and this is when Reggie Bush gets behind Matt Liner, a teammate not involved in the play, but pushing Matt Liner. And it worked because the alliteration of Bush push or the rhyme. And it worked because it launched. You know, Reggie Bush pushed Tush so the Tush push could run and walk or whatever. The expression I've lost already is in the NFL, and that's taken over our lives for the last five ten years. Number six was Bush push. Number five, why Check to Dyson Music City Miracle. Can't put to words how awesome this play was seeing happen in real time here playoff game Tennessee versus Buffalo. Bill's about to win it oof, look at the it's the construction of the play. It's the actual pass from y Check that is so on the line for being a forward pass that really gets it from me and it led to the Music City miracle. No flags on the field. What a great call to number four. Greatest teammate moments Bosh to Allen. Everyone remembers Ray Allen shot. It launched Miami Heat to come back in that game versus San Antonio in Game six, then win Game seven, and this is what saved I think the heat, because if they don't win that title, you're viewing Lebron in Miami and Lebron's whole career differently. But it's Chris Bosh who gets the offensive rebound off Lebron's missed to give it to Rey Allen to make that moment happen. So we remember Ray Allen, but the moment doesn't happen without Chris Bosh. Number three, two thousand and four Red Sox. This is a full team moment because you know, David Ortiz rescues the Red Sox as they're about to be swept out by the Yankees with the game winning hit. But that game winning hit doesn't happen without a game tying hit by Bill Miller. But that's not the teammate I'm talking about, because Bill Miller doesn't have the game time hit without Dave Robins stealing second base on Marianna Rivera. But that's not the teammate I'm talking about, because Dave Roberts doesn't pench running to steal that base without a teammate Kevin Malar the walk. I think that's the most underlooked part of the comeback in Game four, which led to the comeback in seven games, which led to the World Series in two thousand and four for the Red Sox, one of the greatest titles in sports history. Number two Teammate moment in history Grant Hill to Christian Ladner later shot, all time great moment in basketball history. Grand Hills pass gets a lot of pub and does get the moment it deserves. But it's such a good pass. It's a football pass. The first time you really thought about that type of pass working in asketball. It's number two and number one are topping in Moment of the Day Jason Lezak and Michael Phelps. I'm walking into Today's conversation and today's show my first show because this is a story that means something to me. It's instant tears for me when I watch this. There are many many moments that are instant tears for me. I cry.
00:11:28
Speaker 2: Oh.
00:11:30
Speaker 1: Derek Redman was a sprinter and his dad came out in the middle of the Olympics when he was injured and there's a Marshall who asks him to please, sir get off. His dad was like, no, we're gonna I'm gonna carry my son to the line. Instant tears for your boy, Instant tears. Uh, Marianna Rivera being taken out of the game by Andy Pettitt and Derek Jeter and his last appearance in the Majors and you get Rivera's face and he's recognizing this is the end. Instant tears for your boy, many many other Kerry Strug instant tiers, Miracle on Ice, instant tears. You know, I guess I could have been Those are honorable mentions for our great teammates. Kerry Strug can't be on this list because it overshadowed the entirety of the moment. And say with miracle on Ice does it? There are so many instant heres, but nothing is more instant tiers for me than this topic today, which I choose to be show number one in the Real Deal. And it's going to be Jason Lezak and the greatest teammate moment of all time getting Michael Phelps to celebrate like this. But I will leave it up to our guest. Maybe they will dissuade me from that feeling. Maybe I will learn something about this relay and maybe it's not a teammate moment. Maybe always leave yourself open to recalibrate how you feel about something. Are we ready? Are you ready for our guest? Are we ready to get the deal going here? Let's make it real? Woah, man is come on, this is how we meet you working on ESPN, you know twenty eight thirty forty years ago. I did it for twenty five and we've never met.
00:13:13
Speaker 4: I know, it's funny. I've called the NC double. I mean, you work for ESPN.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: I call two races how much I worked for.
00:13:21
Speaker 4: Them, But I've called the n C two as now for about well thirty seven years.
00:13:26
Speaker 1: I know it. I know. Well, let me say this. My name is Anthony Joseph Paul Reality and I am over the moon to meet you, rowdy.
00:13:35
Speaker 3: I'm Ambrose gains four.
00:13:37
Speaker 1: I did research only. The only thing I do is I do research on people's names because I like middle names and I really want to I want to actually invent the middle name. But here's what I found out. This is now we're in. This doesn't matter. I don't know where this is going to go today. I have one question, one question on paper for you, and that's it. Because I think we're gonna really get along because I always thought you were rowdy because you're a round and I'm a rowdy dude, and now you're telling me, no, it's because you look like a rowdy tony.
00:14:07
Speaker 3: I don't have a middle name. Rowdy is just a nickname, right.
00:14:10
Speaker 4: So I got it from an old television Showies called Rawhide. Clint Eastwood played a character called Rowdy eights. Yeah, so my dad was liquored up one night. Must have called me rowdy.
00:14:22
Speaker 1: That's the way nicknames are supposed to come. So the show is called Real Deal, and thank you for being on a show that that is basically a new born here. We have no idea, but it's called Real Deal because when I was a kid, I try to give myself a nickname, and I said, okay, real Deal, Holy for So then I get to ESPN and Corneiser and Will Bond are like, you're gonna be a sidekick on the show. We love what you're doing, all right, what's your nickname? I'm like, well, I'm real Deal and Corneyser looked at me and he said, You're not real Deal. You're stab boy. And my entire life now is built up on trying to rea clean this name.
00:15:00
Speaker 3: And yeah, yeah, yeah, I always thought.
00:15:04
Speaker 1: I always thought, I here's what I love about you, rowdy. I don't swim, all right. I know how to swim, and I specifically know how not to drowned, but I don't swim. I did triathlon and they put the anklet bracelet on you, and I'm swimming and I look after I finished last in the swimming portion, and I made the letter S while I was swimming, and Sam, my wife's like, what were you doing. I'm like, I don't know. Alligators in the water. I was serpentine, right, It doesn't make it doesn't make sense. So I don't know how to swim. But what I do know is I love sports and I love hearing announcers, specifically because I'm in it for the athletes, but I'm in it for the announcers.
00:15:43
Speaker 3: Oh.
00:15:43
Speaker 1: It's my dream is always to be announcer announcers who put their heart outside their body right and their spirit outside them. So I just wanted to say I admire the way you put your heart outside your body when you're making a call. I think it's the most beautiful thing. And now we have the ideas, and I know your social media team is your family, your daughter, and I think that's amazing. But but the rowdy cam, Oh, the rowdy cam. Oh, I looked so hard to see if we had the rowdy cam for this moment. I don't think it was invented yet, but it's just so great. So thank you for that. That was That was a lot I just threw at you. But I genuinely have waiting for Yeah, this show came to be because I love the moments that I can't get out of my head, right, and most of them are attached to images, right, I call them sports earworms, And this one right here is what we're talking about today. This is Michael Phelps muscles. It's an incredible image. I sent it to people when I'm like, we did it, we did it, which is great, But that's not what this moment is about. For me. This moment is I know the sports of this. Of course, this moment is about teammates. This moment is about a relay. This moment is about Jason lezak Out touching Elaine Bernard in a comeback from back, when comebacks we're still comebacks, untouchable comeback, right, And but it's not about just that too, It's about you rowdy and I want to build my weight to that because this, this is, this is this makes me. It's instant cry. I was just saying this, it's instant cry for me when I go back and watch it. Do you go back and watch your old videos of yourself with this call specifically?
00:17:27
Speaker 3: No? No, I don't like watching.
00:17:30
Speaker 4: It, but this one specifically, You've just what I do watch a lot just because people bring it up. And they did that documentary and so I the documentary is so good, the greatest race. Yeah, so uh, but no, normally I don't like to watch my old stuff because I cringe at I go, what did I say that for? You know?
00:17:47
Speaker 3: So I beat myself up too much.
00:17:50
Speaker 1: Well you shouldn't because you have done I don't know how many hours of live TV. And it's impossible.
00:17:59
Speaker 4: Dan and I and we've called about fifteen hundred races together, Olympic race.
00:18:04
Speaker 1: Olympic races, right, and now I mean and now it's a two year window until the next one. And it's so great. You're going back to LA. Yeah, this is where it all started for you as an Olympic champion yourself. And this race is the relay, the one hundred free I mean, this is this is all these things point back to you. But for me, it was the spirit that you and Bob when you're calling. That is everything for me. So there's one thing I want to ask you for twenty years but not yet. Okay, that's called the TVTS right there, by a friend, we do something on the show, simply irresistible. This is the simply irresistible question. Is that a big thing? It's no small thing either. I need to read it out here because I want to get this right. Well, my goal in life, let me tell you this is to gobsmack people with sports information and sports stats. I want to stump you, I would say, right now, you, my friend, are an unstumpable person in Olympic swimming and in the one hundred meter free, you know us right now? Do you know what Jason Lezak swam his final split in? Of course you don't, yes, And do you know how far back he was in the pool when he jumped in, No, eight tenths it was, it was more like six tenths. And then I was researching here because I love doing this. You know what was his previous personal best in the hundred free? You know? And this is a relay with a rolling start, so it's different. But he shaved off a second plus second and a half. So these are all maybe they would be simply resistible questions, But no, I have a simply a resistible question because I think you can reason this out in some ways, or you may know it because you swam this race. But it's the most human thing I could ask for someone who's not a swimmer to ask someone who is a swimmer. So let me ask this. Jason Lezak swam the fastest relay split in history. How many strokes did it take him to do it?
00:19:56
Speaker 3: Oh? My god? Yes, hey, you stump me there, I'll show.
00:20:02
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this before you answer. Do you know when you were swimming the hundred free did you ever do swimmers count this? How many strokes you're taking?
00:20:10
Speaker 4: No, but Tony, I could literally about six leading up to that race. For me, about six months beforehand, I could put a stopwatch behind my back, start the stopwatch, swim the race in my mind, and stop it within two or three tenths of a second.
00:20:28
Speaker 3: Every single time of the time I wanted to go.
00:20:31
Speaker 4: I wanted to go forty nine to five, and I was between forty nine three and forty nine seven every time I stopped the watch. So it wasn't so much as the number, it was swimming the race. You know, I didn't count my stroke.
00:20:46
Speaker 1: For a layman here, not in swimming. I'm thinking of it as strokes, right, I'm thinking, okay, not that he's counting. But you've done four years of training, You've trained your whole life. You know, you get to the pool in thirty five and you get back in thirty five, the wall in thirty five. So that's quite the simply irresistible question. How many strokes did it take Jason Lezak to go one hundred free in that anchor relay? Give me reason it out, Give me an answer. You know, we did it in forty six oh six. If you if you're average up that last fraction.
00:21:20
Speaker 3: I would say fifty two.
00:21:25
Speaker 1: Well that that would have been maybe with a special suit and everything. That's that's a little low. The answer sixty three strokes, twenty nine on the first fifty thirty four back. But there's a little bonus question. He did sixty three strokes. He had to catch the great Elaine Bernard. It was the world record holder. I believe I have this at the time. Yeah, how many strokes did Bernard do the same? Anchor split it?
00:21:52
Speaker 3: I'll say seventy one.
00:21:55
Speaker 1: Great guess, great guess, seventy six. So here's what I found out.
00:22:01
Speaker 3: Unbelievable. I did not know that.
00:22:03
Speaker 1: Well, there we go, is it not? Can you not resist that? Simply? It's a simply irresistible question. So yeah, in a race where everything's on the line, and and of course or lane, Bernard's swimming as hard as he can. Of course he wants to carry his team to gold. And he has seventy six strokes and Jason Lezak and it's not even a size difference. These are massive human beings. Bernard was Yeah, So it wasn't like, Okay, that's the guy who has the big stroke and Bernard has thirteen different strokes to get the same length in the pool. That's what Lezak did. It defies to me biology. You know, I don't even know how it's possible. But I'm gonna get to that because what we have here is the impossible becoming possible. Right, all right, you're ready for the big deal. Let's get to the big rowdy gains Rowdy, I've asked you here today so we can become friends, but also so I can ask you one question, and that question is how did occur to you that the impossible was becoming possible? And I want to ask you that question, but not now again A tvt's there here. First, this is not a question. This is a declarative sentence. Declarative sentence. Build the world for me. You're in that moment August eleven, two thousand and eight, You're you're in the cube. What does it smell like? What does it feel like? And now, of course for you in your head, it's a lot about Michael Phelps.
00:23:29
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, Tony.
00:23:30
Speaker 4: I mean leading up to that race, I went over and over in my mind on who's going to win that race. I break down the relays every single time before any Olympics, and that one was critical. I went over a million different ways, and Buddy, every single.
00:23:54
Speaker 3: Time the French came out winners.
00:23:57
Speaker 4: I never put a forty six blackdown though for Jason, I even gave him a forty six to three or four I think on one of my scenarios, but that still ended up short.
00:24:08
Speaker 1: Right.
00:24:09
Speaker 4: So it was such a critical race for Michael's journey. This was his third race, and we had been building this whole eight gold medal journey up.
00:24:19
Speaker 3: All along, and.
00:24:23
Speaker 4: I knew that if he had failed or they had failed to win the gold, it was going to put a little bit of a damper on the rest of the swimming. I mean, seven golds and won silver is pretty cool. And I knew he was going to be a huge favorite along the way the rest of the way. But this was the diceist And so a lot of a lot of nerves were floating around the broadcast compound that day, just because of the fact that it was such an important race for Team USA.
00:24:58
Speaker 3: And even more critical and ways for Michael.
00:25:01
Speaker 1: See that's interesting to me because you're feeling anxiety or pressure. But and you're feeling that you just said as a broadcaster, right, because you're trying now in your mind, you're you're trying to tell the story. But as we all do in telling stories, we're preparing ourselves to tell a certain story. You're not scripting things in your head, but you're preparing it. You ran through the algorithm, you were you were you were doing the wind probability that I love on the bottom of all my my box scores. Now before we were doing that, and you saw no path to victory for USA here because historically this was a USA's race. And then what happened a few years earlier, right, this is the famous smashing right, and Australia took it. So so there's background here if you could just dip your toe in that for a second, because the background here with the USA gave this relay away. I don't wanna say they gave it away. I don't mean to say. It's like, oh, it got away from the US in the last two cycles and it got way specifically for Leezak even and I think that's fascinating.
00:26:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, So that that was the other huge thing was in two thousand that was the first time the US had ever lost four hundred free relay in Olympic history. Yeah, and then you thought, you know, the whole Ian Thorpe and the guitar strumming and Gary Hall saying we're gonna smash him like guitars and everything, and then you know, and then two thousand and four we were the huge favorites, and in two thousand it was going to be close. But in two thousand and four we were the huge favorites. It didn't go our way. Don't need to go into details. But Jason was a part of that relay and he had become this sort of journeyman sprinter. In fact, Gary Hall even called him one time a professional relay swimmer.
00:26:55
Speaker 1: And was that in a complimentary way or was that in a little Gary?
00:27:00
Speaker 2: Now?
00:27:00
Speaker 4: That was that was a little bit of a cut, my man. That was a little bit of a cut. I mean it was back rival. You know, you say things that are kind of fun, but yeah, no, it was a cut. So Jason had felt that pain already. And I've had long conversations we'll all four of these guys over the last fifteen twenty years, and you know, I think Jason more than anybody felt the pain, certainly more than those three guys. Even though Michael was part of that relay and o for he did his part and Jason kind of did his part too.
00:27:34
Speaker 1: I mean, that's the thing with all this, right, I mean, I have covered World Series and Super Bowls and REBA Finals, but I have never covered swimming. Swimming to me is fascinating for a couple things. First off, it's an individual sport, and I would even go even bigger. It's an adividual sport when somebody's head is underwater for ninety percent of their life, right, and you're in your own ears hearing that you reckon at that line exactly. So there is a psychological element to that, and you just and you just alluded to some of the personalities I would feel, and I'm saying this haphazardly, but maybe you would agree with me. Those guys and those ladies and men who run the fifty and one hundred are almost the uh, the peacocks or the wide receivers for an NFL expression, you know, the prima donnas is a word I want to use. Gary Hall Uh. It was a rocker and all that sort of thing. And they come out with the chest pumped out and some of the people who do the longer swims are entirely different characters altogether. But then you get a relay and you're asking an individual sport to be a team sport, and the team element you're really and you're not helping the person there, You're just giving them, you know, something to do after you're done doing it. Right, It's not like you're you're physically.
00:28:55
Speaker 3: You're only a quarter part of it.
00:28:56
Speaker 1: You're a quarter part of it. So it's team, but is it really team? And I've and I'm trying to figure that part about out throughout this and then yeah, you've got You've got all this. So it's always fascinated me how this individual sport becomes a team sport and then they're asking for a team to lift each other up when previously they've been competitors and or you know, just just not really an assist in basketball, is I'm handing you a ball in position to win, right? You know, this is just like, well, here's your time. You got to race the clock. You have to race Alain Bernard.
00:29:28
Speaker 3: Right, and you're right, Tony.
00:29:30
Speaker 4: I think in most people's heads, you know, swimming is certainly an individual sport, and in the majority of.
00:29:37
Speaker 3: Time it is, right.
00:29:38
Speaker 4: You know, maybe you go to the NCAA Championships because it's a college thing, it's about team. But I will say the Olympics is a completely different animal because even though you're swimming individually, you don't want to let your country down, right, You've got you're so obsessed about the whole team USA or Team France or a team Rusher or what whatever it is, So you don't want to let your country down, and we have been. I say we because I could do it in front of you, but on the broadcast I can't say we. I have to say Team USA or something. But we have been number one in the world of swimming for seventy years. The last time USA was not number one in the sport of swimming was nineteen fifty six. So if you think about that, no other sport, no other team can claim that kind of excellence for that long.
00:30:29
Speaker 3: So there's a lot of pressure that's built up because of that too.
00:30:33
Speaker 4: So even when you're swimming individually, it is about the team. Certainly you think about, you know, if I win a gold medal, of what does a def.
00:30:41
Speaker 3: Do for me?
00:30:42
Speaker 4: And then you compound that, dude by the relay, and then you've got four guys coming together that don't want to lead, that let each other down, and more than that, you don't want to let the country down, because then you're really feeling like you're letting the country down because.
00:30:57
Speaker 3: It's a team effort. You're really swimming for Team USA.
00:31:01
Speaker 1: What you told us a few minutes ago is exactly what you told the entire viewing audience. The billions of people were viewing you know that no matter how many times I've done it, I got friends here, you know. And and that's how you approached the call of this broadcast, which is of course.
00:31:21
Speaker 4: Expert I have to do it in what's in front of me, your expertise and Jason Lisa going forty six flat. I have to do what based on their history and based on what they've done at this specific meat.
00:31:36
Speaker 3: And that's what I had to go on.
00:31:38
Speaker 1: So what I love about you and this is you were an analyst. You are an analyst, and you observed it and you did that. And what happens in the call of this race is you. I think if I could put this out here and you tell me I'm positing a theory, you opt you know, witnessing it and you became part of it in some way, no question. And do you feel that that happens to you in every race or is it this race?
00:32:08
Speaker 3: No question? Yeah, yeah, no question. I am.
00:32:13
Speaker 4: I think to it just because I empathize with them so much because I've been there there. You know, I swam on two relays in my Olympic Games. I mean two of my gold medals were on relays. So certainly when it comes to realize, I relays, I feel that empathy, sympathy.
00:32:31
Speaker 1: You know, I'm riding down my friend, this is I have a show here because for self discovery. I'm not saying that that's not in the manifesto for the show, but empathy, it was what I had. A sneaking suspicion and compassion was a sneaking suspicion was involved in this call. And I'm trying to figure out why this moment cracks me open, and I think I've I've gotten partly there right there from you and my friend. Thank you.
00:32:56
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it was it certainly an intense moment. And and again it's the build up, Tony. I mean, you know this more than anyone. I mean, you you build something up to such a high degree because of the expectations, you know, And there were so many expectations put on Michael going back to two thousand and four. You know, the possibility of winning eight gold medals. We kind of felt like it wasn't going to happen in O four, but there was that possibility.
00:33:26
Speaker 3: But in eight it had taken.
00:33:29
Speaker 4: A complete one eighty on everybody thinking, oh my gosh, he's going to do it. I said, he was going to do it in eight, I said he was not going to do it in four.
00:33:37
Speaker 1: So now you're fueling part of that pressure as well, because it's part of your job to do that. But then, I mean, here, here's what it is for me. I mean another thing is you you allowed yourself to live the moment right and be part of the race. But somehow you allowed yourself to recalibrate, which is a very hard thing to do in real time. And this is why I think this is along with one of the greatest sporting moments. I said, the great sport image of celebration. I believe it's one of the I think it's one of the great broadcasting moments. I come to this as a great broadcasting moment. I don't know you feel this way. I've read some of the things you've said. I've seen the documentary. I read a very i would say, strongly worded article on the New York Times days later, you know, commenting on a call that was wrong or or or you know, at least that implication. And I mean, maybe I'm seeing this through my own eyes of having been in front of a live microphone for so long, or having real expectations. You're not supposed to get every The job is in the get everything right. The job is to react in real time. And I'm just in awe of how the reacting in real time happened and landed it in a certain way. I say that to you. You can tell me it was stuck in your craw? Did it stick in your craw?
00:34:56
Speaker 3: No?
00:34:57
Speaker 1: No, good, no, no.
00:34:58
Speaker 4: I Like I said, I've called, I mean to fifteen hundred, two thousand, probably two thousand Olympic races, and I've made a lot of little wrong casts. For I'm pretty good at being right on, but I've I've messed up plenty.
00:35:15
Speaker 3: So I thought it added me too to the race.
00:35:21
Speaker 4: Because there wasn't one person Tony when Bernard flipped at the fifty, there wasn't one person in that arena or around the world that knew anything about swimming that thought Jason Lezak was going to beat him in the last fifty.
00:35:38
Speaker 3: Nobody, including Michael.
00:35:40
Speaker 4: I've talked to Michael, and I've talked to Garrett Webergil, I've talked to Colin Jones. They all said, we're racing for second, you know. They nobody thought he was going to do it. But that's the beautiful thing about sports and beautiful the beautiful thing about the human heart.
00:35:58
Speaker 3: I know that sounds cliche ish and corny.
00:36:00
Speaker 1: Oh this is a show cliche me all the way into the band. Yeah, there's a humanity to this. And this is precisely on the first week of my show because the humanity this jumps out the page and from the pool and from the swimmers, and also to the call. I have this question, how did occur to you the impossible was becoming possible? But I'm not asking it yet, my friend, I want to do something here. We have a segment in this show called call It, and I will ask some of my friends, my guests who come on this show to do something totally off the wall and call the moment we're talking about. But I will ask them to do it in a silly voice, like Shakespeare or a WWE wrestler or Richard Adam Borrow doing a Nature Document.
00:36:48
Speaker 3: Three.
00:36:49
Speaker 1: At this moment, I'm sending you something. If you have your phone on you, it is the transcript of your call. And I asked, apologize, well, I apologize. I have not mentioned the name of the great Dan Hicks, who is equally part of this Greater Call, which I just nominated for the Broadcasting Hall of Fame and conversation. Dan Hicks, NBC Olympics play by play man for the race alongside Well, I gave you the transcript for me. This is origin story, Tony stuff. I will want. I want another guest to re enact like I said, uh, a sporting moment like it's a soap opera, and do it in a voice or a ms R and whisper the whole call like that. But we can't do we can't do an here's Jason Leasak and he jumps out. We can't do that for this one. I would never cheapen it for that. What I have here is an opportunity to work with a man who I admire and and and a call that I idolize. I would like if it's so, if it would be so empathetic and compassion of you to offer me a chance to be Dan Hicks and I I mean thank you Dan again. I'm sorry I did mentioned your name earlier I should have. And you be Rowdy Gains? Can you be Rowdy Gains for me?
00:38:06
Speaker 2: Rowdy?
00:38:07
Speaker 3: You want me to be Rowdy Gains? And you'd be Dan Higgs.
00:38:11
Speaker 1: I want to be Dan HICKX. I want you to be Rowdy Gains. I want to go because there's a reason why I'm doing this because me Dan. Yeah, there's a moment in all this. So we are going to for call it today, no jokes here, We're going to We're going to call the final anchor swim here of the two thousand and eight hundred free relay that we have selected as our moment. So if you are ready, Rowdy, you got you got the glasses on, and you're ready to rip. And I'll start with Dan Hicks right here. France is taking the lead up there in laying five over the United States. Elaine Bernard, await says the anchor guy, and Jason Lezak is going to have to make up some ground on Elaine Bernard, who's staying six foot five and can absolutely fly.
00:38:55
Speaker 3: And I just don't think they can do it again. I mean, Jason Lezak as in there.
00:39:00
Speaker 4: How many times in his career has he anchored this free relay in Medley Relay, But I just don't think he can do it. He's trying to ride that wave.
00:39:09
Speaker 3: As much as possible.
00:39:11
Speaker 1: Bernard is pulling away from him, Lezak.
00:39:14
Speaker 3: Look at the world record line.
00:39:17
Speaker 1: A three time Olympian. The world record is absolutely gonna be shattered. Here. United States trying to hang on to second. They should get a silver medal. Australia is in bronze territory right now. But Lezak is closing a little bit on Bernard. Can the veteran chase him down and pull off a shocker? Here's no dubt he's tighting up. Bernard is losing some ground. Here comes Lezak.
00:39:42
Speaker 2: Unbelievable.
00:39:43
Speaker 1: At the end, He's done it. Us has done it.
00:39:47
Speaker 2: Get it a new world record?
00:39:49
Speaker 1: He get it it.
00:39:51
Speaker 5: Phelps hopeest are live. Forty six oh six split for Lezak. What a clutch fast wave when they need it? Who's talking now? Stunned?
00:40:04
Speaker 4: I think they need to use another word other than smash.
00:40:07
Speaker 3: Wow.
00:40:08
Speaker 4: That might be the most incredible relay split I've ever seen in.
00:40:12
Speaker 3: My entire life.
00:40:14
Speaker 4: Not only was that the fastest in history at bow Away, the fastest in history.
00:40:19
Speaker 1: Wow, Rowdy, thank you so much.
00:40:21
Speaker 4: That's the first time I've done that in seven sixteen. Whatever it is now, I gat me a little bit of goosebumps.
00:40:29
Speaker 3: You were a great dan By the way.
00:40:31
Speaker 1: Well, I mean Dan is a little bit lowrier. I had it circled in advance, and maybe you've seen that the name of this episode is tightening up, right, But for me, I mean you're calling it, you're doing three things at once. Rowdy, you're an expert, and you're the witness. But also, like I said, I think you're also in the race at that moment, and you're all of us honestly, I mean you have to also be your.
00:40:57
Speaker 3: Honest what I've had a lot of people tell me.
00:41:00
Speaker 1: But it's it's the moment here. There's no doubt that he's tightening up. Both. Yeah, I'm gonna I'm going to overlay these calls at some point because you really were in the same headspace you were then, which is just absurd that you can recreate that. But he's tightening up. Your voice does something. It goes up a quarter step, a pitch right, and it unlocks something inside my ear, my head that connects right to my heart, that connects right to my tear ducts. It's that he's tightening up. It is for me the impossible becoming possible. In three words, he's tightening up, and it is for me what unlocks something. And then there's another phrase which I've really didn't this one. I didn't really peg until until you just did it. He did it, He did it. I think that's some of the empathy and compassion you were talking about. But but but he's tightening up what happened inside you that you knew it, you alluded to. He's riding the wave right that so so that there's a swimming analysis I want you to give to me for a second. But then, but was there a biological like you know, you catch your breath now and now your voice is going higher, you know, and now you're doing a call. I just asked you seven questions at once based on one. No, No, it's fine to be impossible. How did occur to you?
00:42:29
Speaker 4: I felt it at about seventy five because I could see the tempo starting to scramble with Alan Bernard. I won't get too technical because it's swimming terms, but I could see Bernard's stroke starting to really waver a little bit, and Jason literally rode that wave. And when I'm talking about a wave, it's not so much physical because those lane lines now that they put between the swimmers, the lane markers in Layman's terms are eat waves man. So when the swimmer comes out and produces like a surf behind them, the swimmer next to him doesn't really ride the way physically too much. In a meal roup, mentally, that's where you feel like you're literally riding the surf of the guy behind you.
00:43:13
Speaker 3: And that's what he did. Yeah, he's bodysurfing.
00:43:19
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he's literally that's a good way to put it, Tony, he's body surfing that first twenty five. So then he just takes that. But you know, that surf and he starts to go downhill with it. So he he starts to swimming. He starts to swim downhill, and Bernard starts to swim uphill.
00:43:37
Speaker 3: And and that was the moment I thought.
00:43:40
Speaker 4: I still had my doubts, but I thought, holy crap, now he's got a chance.
00:43:45
Speaker 3: You never know.
00:43:45
Speaker 4: I mean, he won by what was it seven one hundreds of a second or something like that. Yeah, so think about point oh eight seconds. He's still won a hundredth of a second, Tony, traveling at that speed, one one hundredth of a second is half of a little fingernail. So if you look at your fingernail, take half of that. That's one hundredth of a second. So if you're talking four fingernails, that's eight one hundreds of a second.
00:44:12
Speaker 3: That's your little finger. That's how much he won by.
00:44:16
Speaker 4: It wasn't like anybody knew that he was going to still do it.
00:44:19
Speaker 3: It was that close all the way to the end.
00:44:22
Speaker 4: But boy, when you felt Bernards start to scramble and that that that thing where you told me about the stroke count, I mean, I didn't know that.
00:44:29
Speaker 1: And that's ten percent more work, right, I mean, I like a stroke is just more work? Is that what it is? Or or is there Wow?
00:44:40
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's no question about it. The more strokes you take, the more energy you're expending.
00:44:46
Speaker 3: Think about it.
00:44:46
Speaker 4: If you take thirty strokes for a twenty five freestyle and you take twenty eight strokes for a twenty five freestyle, you know which is going to expend more energy, obviously the one that's taken thirty, Right, So if you can maintain tempo without slipping in the water, that's the that's the key. Again, I'm getting way too mechanical, but that's where my point is is that's where Bernard lost it. He started scrambling and He wasn't catching water. He was just slipping in the water. He was just spinning his wheel.
00:45:13
Speaker 1: An alternate timeline question. If Phelps is not going for eight, Phelps has maybe he already missed out on a metal in one of the first two races, or just you know, that was never even in the storyline for these games, and this comeback happens. Are you Are you feeling the same way calling that race?
00:45:36
Speaker 2: Is it?
00:45:36
Speaker 1: Is it?
00:45:37
Speaker 2: No?
00:45:39
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm just like everybody else. You like to see perfection.
00:45:42
Speaker 4: When that perfection doesn't happen, then you know there there, it does take the edge off of everything.
00:45:50
Speaker 3: And that happened in Athens. You know, once he lost that two.
00:45:53
Speaker 4: Hundred three or was it four hundred three relay, I can't remember which one came first, but once he you know, I don't want to say fail because that's the absolute wrong word, but once he didn't achieve that perfection and oh four, yeah, it took a little bit of the edge off.
00:46:14
Speaker 3: Of everybody.
00:46:14
Speaker 4: You know, I think of the people watching at home, you know, so, and I think very few people know that Michael was such an integral part of that relay. He let off in an American record in the Hunter Free. I mean he was unbelievable in leading off and the other two guys, I mean Colin Jones, first African American in history to break a world record when he broke that world record, that world record.
00:46:39
Speaker 3: Tony still stands eighteen years later. It's the oldest world record on the books. It's still on the books as the world record.
00:46:48
Speaker 4: And France still has the second fastest time in history.
00:46:51
Speaker 1: Forty six oh six holds up for I mean, will hold up as a great I mean as great a relay as you could possibly do, everything considered one more alternate timeline, or at least thinking about it. You said he did it, he did it, and and Dan said he did it or they did it, us did it. Dan's next word there got to Phelps. They did it. Phelps's hopes are alive. When you said he did it? Are you talking about Leezak? Are you talking about Phelps?
00:47:20
Speaker 3: I'm talking about Lee Zak.
00:47:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I said.
00:47:23
Speaker 4: I wasn't even thinking, so I literally was zoned in on Lizak. And again this is why Dan is the best that there ever has been.
00:47:33
Speaker 1: The story was, the story was a couple things. So you had to establish both.
00:47:36
Speaker 4: But please go ahead, Dan, Yeah, no, no, And I'm biased obviously, but Dan had to wherewithal to be able to say keats Phelps hopes alive.
00:47:47
Speaker 3: He brought Phelps back into it.
00:47:48
Speaker 4: I also zoned in on Jason and he created the big picture, which which was you know, which was desperately needed.
00:47:56
Speaker 1: The camera found Phelps immediately, and what you got was just some all time, all time.
00:48:03
Speaker 6: Great celebration, Tony. They still give me grief. In fact, I just got a text from Jason before I knew I was going to be on with you.
00:48:16
Speaker 4: This was I don't know, about a week or two ago, and I never said anything to Jason. But he goes salo it was a coach is announcing at my kids meet. It reminds me of this line I will never be able to take out of my head.
00:48:30
Speaker 3: I just don't think he can do it.
00:48:32
Speaker 4: Dan, and I wrote back and I, you know, put the laughing emoji, and I go, that.
00:48:37
Speaker 1: Will be on my tubestone, boy, And I just made you recreate that. And now he's well, Jason, you know, I think I started this show saying I think it's the greatest teammate moment history to me, moment in history in sports. Does that make sense? I had a top ten list where I was just throwing him out. I was working through it, you know. But some of the examples where Grant Hill made the pass to Christian Latner, right, Rustian Lanner shot lives in forever. Great Hills pass got a lot of yeah, right, got a lot of play. But still that past something about it. That's the team. The Red Sox beat the Yankees, but they had to come back from from the death's door and they were about to be swept. And for that to happen, there was a hit. But before the hit, there was a hit. Before the hit, there was a walk, stolen base, you know that type of thing. Ray Allen hit a great shot, but there was an offensive rebound before that, you know, Reggie Bush. But you know, but for me, even in the sport that is the least team sport that you know, do you believe this is the greatest teammate effort ever made by someone? Lezak?
00:49:56
Speaker 4: You know again, I look at it through rose colored lens to as you said, Tony, but I think, Jason, again, if you put it all together, and I mean just little things that people will never know, you know Colin Jones made that relay.
00:50:13
Speaker 3: By one one hundredth of a second.
00:50:15
Speaker 4: He had to swim in the morning to qualify for the relay at night. The only people on the relay at night were Jason and Michael and Garrett, so four swimmers swam for one spot in the morning and Colin beat Nathan Adrian, one of the greatest American freestylers, if not the greatest in history. I won one hundred second to put himself on that relay. So there, there's just so much to the story that if you're not a swimming fan, you would become one for this race. I get it that swimming gets kind of shoved back in the closet every four years.
00:50:50
Speaker 3: I understand it. That's the way it's always going to be.
00:50:52
Speaker 4: But I do believe that the American public loves the Olympic Games and they love pulling for these these these kids, and then then basically that's what most of them are, they're just kids.
00:51:04
Speaker 1: Well, I love this moment. I love pulling for this video or this this image to send to people when they need to celebrate. I love pulling for this video when I need to cry. I love this because of the teammates that it took to do it. I love that somebody was I mean Chas and Leezak got his medal. He is he and he has eight career medals, and he had an incredible ability to show perseverance and to get back to the top, uh through his games and his history in the games. And that's wonderful for him. So he certainly earned everything. And this moment still becomes a little bit about Phelps. But but but it's still about him. He was able to claim it and and and and I appreciate that too, uh and and I appreciate you for being here so much.
00:51:54
Speaker 3: Rowdy, we give gifts on the show. You won't like it.
00:51:59
Speaker 1: You won't like it. But here's what this gift is and whether it will be similar to what Jason just sent you via text. So I have my phone here. This is very very important for me. My phone is I'm not sure if you know the movie Goodfellas. It's a picture of it's a picture of RAYLEI. But okay, but this is how I I look at this and it makes me happy. So I'm hoping when I send people gifts, they look at it they make me happy. So our gift to you is well. I told you how important this image was of of of our man, Michael Phelps celebrating our gift to you. Is a phone case cover of Michaels celebrating you. Look at the face there that is a rowdy can face of our men with the headset. So you will be receiving this very sorely. But this is how I want you to remember this moment because for me, this image we started with was about Phelps. But for me, the image wasn't about Phelps. It was about Leezak. But the image wasn't just about Leezak. It was about Rowdy and how you were able to impart spirit and what you said. There was empathy and there was a he did it to that call that stays with me and it is instant tears. You hit the button, instant tears. Rowdy, you have been a wonderful guest. I have wanted to talk to you for many, many years we have I want to be friends with you, Rowdy. This is what it comes down to him. I've only got to I've only got a show to try to recruit more friends. That's why, that's why I have a show, Tony.
00:53:27
Speaker 3: I can't imagine a better friend to get to know Rowdy.
00:53:31
Speaker 1: Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen, Rowdy gains here on the program.
00:53:35
Speaker 3: All right, take care buddy, my man.
00:53:39
Speaker 1: Oh okay, whoa? How was that?
00:53:43
Speaker 3: Man?
00:53:43
Speaker 6: Ah?
00:53:45
Speaker 1: I have a friend?
00:53:46
Speaker 2: Come on?
00:53:47
Speaker 1: Are we not going to be good friends? Right? I mean I just made friends with rowdy yays. I just made friends with rowdy yains. I have no idea what's happening. I don't know what to say. You know, this is everything I want this to be. Is what I want to say, because this was my first episode for a reason, it's personal to me. This is the number one video. It makes no sense. I don't swim, it makes zero sense, and it makes me cry every time. Teammates. First off, let's start here teammates. I had the list, the top ten, top five of the sports teammate list, right, and I was wondering if the conversation was going to change my mind. It was Routy going to say something. You know, they really aren't teammates. And the pool that's what I was maybe leaving doubt for. And the way they compete with each other to get onto the relay team is also an odd thing right, that's not a teammate. They're competing with each other. But this just solidified for me. This is the number one, number one teammate moment for me in sports and my viewing history. Please he hit me in the mansions, tell me I'm forgetting one. I've made this list when I was in the subway coming over here. I mean, it has too much idot right. It has the magnitude of it ending with a gold medal, It has the uber magnitude of it ending with Phelps getting to eight gold medals. It has one of the greatest celebrations of all time. It has one of the greatest comebacks of all time on the clock. To run forty six oh six or swim forty six oh six, you know that is untouchable. It's an untouchable number in swimming. So you have all these exceptional levels here to prove it was the height of sport. And then you have a call on top of that that demonstrates teammates, because it's not just Leezak's a teammate of Phelps, and Phelps is a teammate of Lezak. It's that Rowdy is a teammate of Dan Hicks, and together they put together one of the greatest calls of all time. Man, I don't know, I'm just I feel like I need some somaliade water after that to really take it in. One of the things we do on this show is we end every show with the real one minute and we're gonna go out here like we walked in here, all right, So let's say a load of ralio to one more time and let's uh, let's take this one for a walk here. Let me see you see how I walk here? This is my bag, all right? Why does this moment break me open more than any other sports moment. I think I know why now, And it's not because the picture. It's because a voice changes in real time, changing certainty into doubt, and doubt then becomes belief, and then belief becomes joy. Thank you very much, guys, See you later. The United States was counted out, Lee Zak was counted out. Even Rowdy, who had spent his whole life in the pool, they didn't think it was possible, and all at once it was happening. But I think the the real reason why I've carried this for twenty years is simpler than that. Lizak was not just a passenger in Michael Phelps's story. He was an Olympian. He had heartache at loss, recovered, he earned his moment. He wasn't just swimming for himself. If you went back and read some of the stories afterwards, Lizak was beautifully poetic talking about how he was doing it for his country, but on his back even more was Michael phelps impossible dream told you one of the best things anyone ever said to me was if you want to feel better about yourself, do something for other people. But I didn't tell you why that was said to me. I was going through a moment in my life where I was learning I was an anxious person and more specifically dealing with generalized anxiety disorder. Right, So they told me, you want to feel better about yourself, do something for other people. With that as the focus, get out of your own head for a while, Tony, Right, be there for somebody else. I'm not saying that's the answer for everybody, but it's been a part of an answer for me, and it actually happens to be a key element of my career hosting. Right, you're doing something for the other people on the show and to be honest. It's a key element for my real job, my real purpose in life, parenting. The purpose is about my children, to carry them, to lift them, to watch them, to witness them, to celebrate them. So when I hear rowdy yell he did it, he did it, I don't hear swimming. I hear the kind of person I want to be. Somebody who can lift other people up in their moment, Somebody who could witness and celebrate somebody in their moment. Someone who appreciates people's joy when they do the impossible. Because when I hear that, I feel something in me in a wonderful way tightening up. And that's your real one minute. Did I hit the time? Oh not even close, Senora.
00:59:00
Speaker 2: We have the hap
Speaker 1: So here's Michael Phelps and he's gotta be wondering how he got here. One second before that image, Jason Lezak touched the wall in the greatest relay in Olympic history, ty Nora, how are you ten seconds earlier? Maybe not even that five? Nobody thought of as possible. How did the impossible become possible? And if that's not enough, is this the greatest sports teammate moment in history?
00:00:31
Speaker 2: Oh?
00:00:53
Speaker 1: You work, Anthony Josephe you we have a show people, What is happening? Where have you been all my life? Look at you? You're magnificent. The waiting drove me. Man, You're finally here, and I'm a mess. I don't even know. I just walk into a studio. The studio was here. I don't know if to sit down to stand? Should I stand up for this show?
00:01:16
Speaker 3: Yes?
00:01:17
Speaker 1: This is real deal with Tony reality. Why are we real deal with Tony reality? Well, we'll get to that at some point, I guess, because we are gonna be real on this show and we are going to talk about some moments in sports. I'm gonna sit down. How about that? Can I get you guys something water? Coffee? I mean, schoola down. You haven't even touched you shchoola dell? What are you doing here?
00:01:42
Speaker 2: Uh?
00:01:45
Speaker 1: Water, We're gonna work on water, right, this is I want to Somalia going through this water. You know, I only drink coffee and water, nothing else. You know, that's okay. But aquapana. I mean, we're in the sponsorship game now. I love an aquapana. That's pretty good. Dura coffee, you know, that's the good stuff. Let's do a show here. It's been a year, guys. Of all the years I've had, this was one of them. What have I been up to? You want to start with that? We will. Let's unpack some of that. First off, I worked on being still. You could ask me, how's that going? You know? Not well to that well? Being still is something I'm still learning how to how to be. And that wasn't because I thought I was going to be the type of person I said goodbye on one show, I'd be doing the next show the next day. And every fiber of my being wanted that to be the case too. And this is when I decided to listen to other people in my life. And I'm so grateful I did, because inside Rayleota here I have thirty seven shows to launch. This is the first one. This one goes well, the next thirty six will be free. But the CEO Sam Samuel over there, I say, no, we won't be doing that. Nothing's free. Okay, good's that's a good reminder as well. But but yeah, I have a lot of ideas, and you know what I did. I took some time to think about. You know, people are like, oh, how's the job search going. I was searching for a job, looking high and low for a job. What I was looking for was myself. But I was looking for was how is the job inventioned going? I want to invent the next show. That's how I was operating in my head, just knowing who I am as a person, as as a tinker or a creative. And then what was the last year like learning a lot about a new industry because I felt digital was the it was the next frontier and this is what you're seeing right now. It was a challenge for someone like myself. It hurts to lose something you love, and I wanted to sit in that for a little bit, right, Which is not to say I want to masochistic. Well, please hurt me, hurt me hurt me. No, that's not a good thing, but it is a real thing. It's a full thing, and I want to be honest to what those feelings are because I wanted to then kind of whittle that into something I could use going forward, which I hope to do in this show. Real deal with Tony reality. You know, I don't think I ever really said the name of the show out loud like that. You know, you right it up there. You just saw the I blew the bunchet on Space song. My friends. That song is called in the Meantime. For me, it's got one of the great earworms, the hooks I just said, sports earworms. You know how it came to be our theme song is for me an origin story that I'll share it right now. I used to sing that song on set for horn and PTI to warm up my voice. That's how that came to me. Warm was how I would warm up my voice. And now I'm melding the next show and I'm like, you know, let me send a note to Royson here at Space. Hug the bass. I love a band that the bassist is the composed of the lead singer. Right, That's pretty great and it's got that boogie bass that he's got. It's got the drums that I wanted, ends on a piano, which is which is I played the drums and piano. A long story to tell you that this was a song that was already in my life. But I'm like, you know what, it's got the beat that the buoy in cea. This is gonna be a warm shot. This is a nostalgia show, all right, because I I missed nostalgia. Nobody does nostalgias like they used to do nostalgia, and I hope to do a little bit of that on this show, where we talk about some of the great moments you remember and then you're always happy to see And that's what this is. The show starts with an image, as we just saw. It was Michael Phelps. Look at Michael Phelps here? How could you not have this image in my phone? I send it to people when we're celebrating, of course, right, oh, and I love the celebration because he doesn't know what to do with his hands. I don't know what to do my hands either. I bumped into this microphone like six times. Over here is it over here? Steven Tyler type situation? Here with the microphone. You know who is all up here. It was Lemmy when he's playing bass that he was doing. I like this image because it's about celebration, but that's not what this image is to me when I see it. It's not why I keep it in my phone, honestly, and it's not why I rewatched the moment that this image is about. This is a show about moments, and for me, I know precisely what this image is. This is This is Michael Phelps celebrating Jason Lezak out touching La Bernard at the wall and the greatest comeback in the greatest relay in sports history two thousand and eight Beijing Games, one hundred meters free and the relay that enabled and why the camera was focused on Phelps to proceed on his impossible dream of getting eight gold medals. But much more impossible was how Lisa came back in this race to win. And I think it's an amazing story in teammates and I have a sneaking suspicion there's a couple other things at play, which I'll unlock, I hope with our guest today. But for me, this one picture, and there's a couple more pick I got more pictures here. I gotta pictures and picture times with Tony. All right, this one the fingers for me, is not just about Phelps, and it's not just about It's about teammates, right, And I just asked the question I'm gonna ask it right now here. Is it the greatest teammate moment in history? And that kind of is an odd question to say about a sport. I don't even think it's a team sport. And the relay, of course is the most team thing you can do. But is it the greatest? So I would love to do something here, real deal top five, and I would love music again, but again, the budget completely on space out. We're gonna work on that. I'll have to construct my own music here. So here we go the real Deal Top five greatest sports teammates Moments in history? Number six Bush push Reggie Bush, oh Man to live back in this time Notre davers usc. This was the biggest game in the college football calendar this year. I bet you if you went back and looked at the TV ratings, it was it was one of the one hundred most watch shows. You know. It was the college football game in the Residen. It was such a great game. A goal line here, and this is when Reggie Bush gets behind Matt Liner, a teammate not involved in the play, but pushing Matt Liner. And it worked because the alliteration of Bush push or the rhyme. And it worked because it launched. You know, Reggie Bush pushed Tush so the Tush push could run and walk or whatever. The expression I've lost already is in the NFL, and that's taken over our lives for the last five ten years. Number six was Bush push. Number five, why Check to Dyson Music City Miracle. Can't put to words how awesome this play was seeing happen in real time here playoff game Tennessee versus Buffalo. Bill's about to win it oof, look at the it's the construction of the play. It's the actual pass from y Check that is so on the line for being a forward pass that really gets it from me and it led to the Music City miracle. No flags on the field. What a great call to number four. Greatest teammate moments Bosh to Allen. Everyone remembers Ray Allen shot. It launched Miami Heat to come back in that game versus San Antonio in Game six, then win Game seven, and this is what saved I think the heat, because if they don't win that title, you're viewing Lebron in Miami and Lebron's whole career differently. But it's Chris Bosh who gets the offensive rebound off Lebron's missed to give it to Rey Allen to make that moment happen. So we remember Ray Allen, but the moment doesn't happen without Chris Bosh. Number three, two thousand and four Red Sox. This is a full team moment because you know, David Ortiz rescues the Red Sox as they're about to be swept out by the Yankees with the game winning hit. But that game winning hit doesn't happen without a game tying hit by Bill Miller. But that's not the teammate I'm talking about, because Bill Miller doesn't have the game time hit without Dave Robins stealing second base on Marianna Rivera. But that's not the teammate I'm talking about, because Dave Roberts doesn't pench running to steal that base without a teammate Kevin Malar the walk. I think that's the most underlooked part of the comeback in Game four, which led to the comeback in seven games, which led to the World Series in two thousand and four for the Red Sox, one of the greatest titles in sports history. Number two Teammate moment in history Grant Hill to Christian Ladner later shot, all time great moment in basketball history. Grand Hills pass gets a lot of pub and does get the moment it deserves. But it's such a good pass. It's a football pass. The first time you really thought about that type of pass working in asketball. It's number two and number one are topping in Moment of the Day Jason Lezak and Michael Phelps. I'm walking into Today's conversation and today's show my first show because this is a story that means something to me. It's instant tears for me when I watch this. There are many many moments that are instant tears for me. I cry.
00:11:28
Speaker 2: Oh.
00:11:30
Speaker 1: Derek Redman was a sprinter and his dad came out in the middle of the Olympics when he was injured and there's a Marshall who asks him to please, sir get off. His dad was like, no, we're gonna I'm gonna carry my son to the line. Instant tears for your boy, Instant tears. Uh, Marianna Rivera being taken out of the game by Andy Pettitt and Derek Jeter and his last appearance in the Majors and you get Rivera's face and he's recognizing this is the end. Instant tears for your boy, many many other Kerry Strug instant tiers, Miracle on Ice, instant tears. You know, I guess I could have been Those are honorable mentions for our great teammates. Kerry Strug can't be on this list because it overshadowed the entirety of the moment. And say with miracle on Ice does it? There are so many instant heres, but nothing is more instant tiers for me than this topic today, which I choose to be show number one in the Real Deal. And it's going to be Jason Lezak and the greatest teammate moment of all time getting Michael Phelps to celebrate like this. But I will leave it up to our guest. Maybe they will dissuade me from that feeling. Maybe I will learn something about this relay and maybe it's not a teammate moment. Maybe always leave yourself open to recalibrate how you feel about something. Are we ready? Are you ready for our guest? Are we ready to get the deal going here? Let's make it real? Woah, man is come on, this is how we meet you working on ESPN, you know twenty eight thirty forty years ago. I did it for twenty five and we've never met.
00:13:13
Speaker 4: I know, it's funny. I've called the NC double. I mean, you work for ESPN.
00:13:17
Speaker 1: I call two races how much I worked for.
00:13:21
Speaker 4: Them, But I've called the n C two as now for about well thirty seven years.
00:13:26
Speaker 1: I know it. I know. Well, let me say this. My name is Anthony Joseph Paul Reality and I am over the moon to meet you, rowdy.
00:13:35
Speaker 3: I'm Ambrose gains four.
00:13:37
Speaker 1: I did research only. The only thing I do is I do research on people's names because I like middle names and I really want to I want to actually invent the middle name. But here's what I found out. This is now we're in. This doesn't matter. I don't know where this is going to go today. I have one question, one question on paper for you, and that's it. Because I think we're gonna really get along because I always thought you were rowdy because you're a round and I'm a rowdy dude, and now you're telling me, no, it's because you look like a rowdy tony.
00:14:07
Speaker 3: I don't have a middle name. Rowdy is just a nickname, right.
00:14:10
Speaker 4: So I got it from an old television Showies called Rawhide. Clint Eastwood played a character called Rowdy eights. Yeah, so my dad was liquored up one night. Must have called me rowdy.
00:14:22
Speaker 1: That's the way nicknames are supposed to come. So the show is called Real Deal, and thank you for being on a show that that is basically a new born here. We have no idea, but it's called Real Deal because when I was a kid, I try to give myself a nickname, and I said, okay, real Deal, Holy for So then I get to ESPN and Corneiser and Will Bond are like, you're gonna be a sidekick on the show. We love what you're doing, all right, what's your nickname? I'm like, well, I'm real Deal and Corneyser looked at me and he said, You're not real Deal. You're stab boy. And my entire life now is built up on trying to rea clean this name.
00:15:00
Speaker 3: And yeah, yeah, yeah, I always thought.
00:15:04
Speaker 1: I always thought, I here's what I love about you, rowdy. I don't swim, all right. I know how to swim, and I specifically know how not to drowned, but I don't swim. I did triathlon and they put the anklet bracelet on you, and I'm swimming and I look after I finished last in the swimming portion, and I made the letter S while I was swimming, and Sam, my wife's like, what were you doing. I'm like, I don't know. Alligators in the water. I was serpentine, right, It doesn't make it doesn't make sense. So I don't know how to swim. But what I do know is I love sports and I love hearing announcers, specifically because I'm in it for the athletes, but I'm in it for the announcers.
00:15:43
Speaker 3: Oh.
00:15:43
Speaker 1: It's my dream is always to be announcer announcers who put their heart outside their body right and their spirit outside them. So I just wanted to say I admire the way you put your heart outside your body when you're making a call. I think it's the most beautiful thing. And now we have the ideas, and I know your social media team is your family, your daughter, and I think that's amazing. But but the rowdy cam, Oh, the rowdy cam. Oh, I looked so hard to see if we had the rowdy cam for this moment. I don't think it was invented yet, but it's just so great. So thank you for that. That was That was a lot I just threw at you. But I genuinely have waiting for Yeah, this show came to be because I love the moments that I can't get out of my head, right, and most of them are attached to images, right, I call them sports earworms, And this one right here is what we're talking about today. This is Michael Phelps muscles. It's an incredible image. I sent it to people when I'm like, we did it, we did it, which is great, But that's not what this moment is about. For me. This moment is I know the sports of this. Of course, this moment is about teammates. This moment is about a relay. This moment is about Jason lezak Out touching Elaine Bernard in a comeback from back, when comebacks we're still comebacks, untouchable comeback, right, And but it's not about just that too, It's about you rowdy and I want to build my weight to that because this, this is, this is this makes me. It's instant cry. I was just saying this, it's instant cry for me when I go back and watch it. Do you go back and watch your old videos of yourself with this call specifically?
00:17:27
Speaker 3: No? No, I don't like watching.
00:17:30
Speaker 4: It, but this one specifically, You've just what I do watch a lot just because people bring it up. And they did that documentary and so I the documentary is so good, the greatest race. Yeah, so uh, but no, normally I don't like to watch my old stuff because I cringe at I go, what did I say that for? You know?
00:17:47
Speaker 3: So I beat myself up too much.
00:17:50
Speaker 1: Well you shouldn't because you have done I don't know how many hours of live TV. And it's impossible.
00:17:59
Speaker 4: Dan and I and we've called about fifteen hundred races together, Olympic race.
00:18:04
Speaker 1: Olympic races, right, and now I mean and now it's a two year window until the next one. And it's so great. You're going back to LA. Yeah, this is where it all started for you as an Olympic champion yourself. And this race is the relay, the one hundred free I mean, this is this is all these things point back to you. But for me, it was the spirit that you and Bob when you're calling. That is everything for me. So there's one thing I want to ask you for twenty years but not yet. Okay, that's called the TVTS right there, by a friend, we do something on the show, simply irresistible. This is the simply irresistible question. Is that a big thing? It's no small thing either. I need to read it out here because I want to get this right. Well, my goal in life, let me tell you this is to gobsmack people with sports information and sports stats. I want to stump you, I would say, right now, you, my friend, are an unstumpable person in Olympic swimming and in the one hundred meter free, you know us right now? Do you know what Jason Lezak swam his final split in? Of course you don't, yes, And do you know how far back he was in the pool when he jumped in, No, eight tenths it was, it was more like six tenths. And then I was researching here because I love doing this. You know what was his previous personal best in the hundred free? You know? And this is a relay with a rolling start, so it's different. But he shaved off a second plus second and a half. So these are all maybe they would be simply resistible questions, But no, I have a simply a resistible question because I think you can reason this out in some ways, or you may know it because you swam this race. But it's the most human thing I could ask for someone who's not a swimmer to ask someone who is a swimmer. So let me ask this. Jason Lezak swam the fastest relay split in history. How many strokes did it take him to do it?
00:19:56
Speaker 3: Oh? My god? Yes, hey, you stump me there, I'll show.
00:20:02
Speaker 1: Let me ask you this before you answer. Do you know when you were swimming the hundred free did you ever do swimmers count this? How many strokes you're taking?
00:20:10
Speaker 4: No, but Tony, I could literally about six leading up to that race. For me, about six months beforehand, I could put a stopwatch behind my back, start the stopwatch, swim the race in my mind, and stop it within two or three tenths of a second.
00:20:28
Speaker 3: Every single time of the time I wanted to go.
00:20:31
Speaker 4: I wanted to go forty nine to five, and I was between forty nine three and forty nine seven every time I stopped the watch. So it wasn't so much as the number, it was swimming the race. You know, I didn't count my stroke.
00:20:46
Speaker 1: For a layman here, not in swimming. I'm thinking of it as strokes, right, I'm thinking, okay, not that he's counting. But you've done four years of training, You've trained your whole life. You know, you get to the pool in thirty five and you get back in thirty five, the wall in thirty five. So that's quite the simply irresistible question. How many strokes did it take Jason Lezak to go one hundred free in that anchor relay? Give me reason it out, Give me an answer. You know, we did it in forty six oh six. If you if you're average up that last fraction.
00:21:20
Speaker 3: I would say fifty two.
00:21:25
Speaker 1: Well that that would have been maybe with a special suit and everything. That's that's a little low. The answer sixty three strokes, twenty nine on the first fifty thirty four back. But there's a little bonus question. He did sixty three strokes. He had to catch the great Elaine Bernard. It was the world record holder. I believe I have this at the time. Yeah, how many strokes did Bernard do the same? Anchor split it?
00:21:52
Speaker 3: I'll say seventy one.
00:21:55
Speaker 1: Great guess, great guess, seventy six. So here's what I found out.
00:22:01
Speaker 3: Unbelievable. I did not know that.
00:22:03
Speaker 1: Well, there we go, is it not? Can you not resist that? Simply? It's a simply irresistible question. So yeah, in a race where everything's on the line, and and of course or lane, Bernard's swimming as hard as he can. Of course he wants to carry his team to gold. And he has seventy six strokes and Jason Lezak and it's not even a size difference. These are massive human beings. Bernard was Yeah, So it wasn't like, Okay, that's the guy who has the big stroke and Bernard has thirteen different strokes to get the same length in the pool. That's what Lezak did. It defies to me biology. You know, I don't even know how it's possible. But I'm gonna get to that because what we have here is the impossible becoming possible. Right, all right, you're ready for the big deal. Let's get to the big rowdy gains Rowdy, I've asked you here today so we can become friends, but also so I can ask you one question, and that question is how did occur to you that the impossible was becoming possible? And I want to ask you that question, but not now again A tvt's there here. First, this is not a question. This is a declarative sentence. Declarative sentence. Build the world for me. You're in that moment August eleven, two thousand and eight, You're you're in the cube. What does it smell like? What does it feel like? And now, of course for you in your head, it's a lot about Michael Phelps.
00:23:29
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, Tony.
00:23:30
Speaker 4: I mean leading up to that race, I went over and over in my mind on who's going to win that race. I break down the relays every single time before any Olympics, and that one was critical. I went over a million different ways, and Buddy, every single.
00:23:54
Speaker 3: Time the French came out winners.
00:23:57
Speaker 4: I never put a forty six blackdown though for Jason, I even gave him a forty six to three or four I think on one of my scenarios, but that still ended up short.
00:24:08
Speaker 1: Right.
00:24:09
Speaker 4: So it was such a critical race for Michael's journey. This was his third race, and we had been building this whole eight gold medal journey up.
00:24:19
Speaker 3: All along, and.
00:24:23
Speaker 4: I knew that if he had failed or they had failed to win the gold, it was going to put a little bit of a damper on the rest of the swimming. I mean, seven golds and won silver is pretty cool. And I knew he was going to be a huge favorite along the way the rest of the way. But this was the diceist And so a lot of a lot of nerves were floating around the broadcast compound that day, just because of the fact that it was such an important race for Team USA.
00:24:58
Speaker 3: And even more critical and ways for Michael.
00:25:01
Speaker 1: See that's interesting to me because you're feeling anxiety or pressure. But and you're feeling that you just said as a broadcaster, right, because you're trying now in your mind, you're you're trying to tell the story. But as we all do in telling stories, we're preparing ourselves to tell a certain story. You're not scripting things in your head, but you're preparing it. You ran through the algorithm, you were you were you were doing the wind probability that I love on the bottom of all my my box scores. Now before we were doing that, and you saw no path to victory for USA here because historically this was a USA's race. And then what happened a few years earlier, right, this is the famous smashing right, and Australia took it. So so there's background here if you could just dip your toe in that for a second, because the background here with the USA gave this relay away. I don't wanna say they gave it away. I don't mean to say. It's like, oh, it got away from the US in the last two cycles and it got way specifically for Leezak even and I think that's fascinating.
00:26:04
Speaker 4: Yeah, So that that was the other huge thing was in two thousand that was the first time the US had ever lost four hundred free relay in Olympic history. Yeah, and then you thought, you know, the whole Ian Thorpe and the guitar strumming and Gary Hall saying we're gonna smash him like guitars and everything, and then you know, and then two thousand and four we were the huge favorites, and in two thousand it was going to be close. But in two thousand and four we were the huge favorites. It didn't go our way. Don't need to go into details. But Jason was a part of that relay and he had become this sort of journeyman sprinter. In fact, Gary Hall even called him one time a professional relay swimmer.
00:26:55
Speaker 1: And was that in a complimentary way or was that in a little Gary?
00:27:00
Speaker 2: Now?
00:27:00
Speaker 4: That was that was a little bit of a cut, my man. That was a little bit of a cut. I mean it was back rival. You know, you say things that are kind of fun, but yeah, no, it was a cut. So Jason had felt that pain already. And I've had long conversations we'll all four of these guys over the last fifteen twenty years, and you know, I think Jason more than anybody felt the pain, certainly more than those three guys. Even though Michael was part of that relay and o for he did his part and Jason kind of did his part too.
00:27:34
Speaker 1: I mean, that's the thing with all this, right, I mean, I have covered World Series and Super Bowls and REBA Finals, but I have never covered swimming. Swimming to me is fascinating for a couple things. First off, it's an individual sport, and I would even go even bigger. It's an adividual sport when somebody's head is underwater for ninety percent of their life, right, and you're in your own ears hearing that you reckon at that line exactly. So there is a psychological element to that, and you just and you just alluded to some of the personalities I would feel, and I'm saying this haphazardly, but maybe you would agree with me. Those guys and those ladies and men who run the fifty and one hundred are almost the uh, the peacocks or the wide receivers for an NFL expression, you know, the prima donnas is a word I want to use. Gary Hall Uh. It was a rocker and all that sort of thing. And they come out with the chest pumped out and some of the people who do the longer swims are entirely different characters altogether. But then you get a relay and you're asking an individual sport to be a team sport, and the team element you're really and you're not helping the person there, You're just giving them, you know, something to do after you're done doing it. Right, It's not like you're you're physically.
00:28:55
Speaker 3: You're only a quarter part of it.
00:28:56
Speaker 1: You're a quarter part of it. So it's team, but is it really team? And I've and I'm trying to figure that part about out throughout this and then yeah, you've got You've got all this. So it's always fascinated me how this individual sport becomes a team sport and then they're asking for a team to lift each other up when previously they've been competitors and or you know, just just not really an assist in basketball, is I'm handing you a ball in position to win, right? You know, this is just like, well, here's your time. You got to race the clock. You have to race Alain Bernard.
00:29:28
Speaker 3: Right, and you're right, Tony.
00:29:30
Speaker 4: I think in most people's heads, you know, swimming is certainly an individual sport, and in the majority of.
00:29:37
Speaker 3: Time it is, right.
00:29:38
Speaker 4: You know, maybe you go to the NCAA Championships because it's a college thing, it's about team. But I will say the Olympics is a completely different animal because even though you're swimming individually, you don't want to let your country down, right, You've got you're so obsessed about the whole team USA or Team France or a team Rusher or what whatever it is, So you don't want to let your country down, and we have been. I say we because I could do it in front of you, but on the broadcast I can't say we. I have to say Team USA or something. But we have been number one in the world of swimming for seventy years. The last time USA was not number one in the sport of swimming was nineteen fifty six. So if you think about that, no other sport, no other team can claim that kind of excellence for that long.
00:30:29
Speaker 3: So there's a lot of pressure that's built up because of that too.
00:30:33
Speaker 4: So even when you're swimming individually, it is about the team. Certainly you think about, you know, if I win a gold medal, of what does a def.
00:30:41
Speaker 3: Do for me?
00:30:42
Speaker 4: And then you compound that, dude by the relay, and then you've got four guys coming together that don't want to lead, that let each other down, and more than that, you don't want to let the country down, because then you're really feeling like you're letting the country down because.
00:30:57
Speaker 3: It's a team effort. You're really swimming for Team USA.
00:31:01
Speaker 1: What you told us a few minutes ago is exactly what you told the entire viewing audience. The billions of people were viewing you know that no matter how many times I've done it, I got friends here, you know. And and that's how you approached the call of this broadcast, which is of course.
00:31:21
Speaker 4: Expert I have to do it in what's in front of me, your expertise and Jason Lisa going forty six flat. I have to do what based on their history and based on what they've done at this specific meat.
00:31:36
Speaker 3: And that's what I had to go on.
00:31:38
Speaker 1: So what I love about you and this is you were an analyst. You are an analyst, and you observed it and you did that. And what happens in the call of this race is you. I think if I could put this out here and you tell me I'm positing a theory, you opt you know, witnessing it and you became part of it in some way, no question. And do you feel that that happens to you in every race or is it this race?
00:32:08
Speaker 3: No question? Yeah, yeah, no question. I am.
00:32:13
Speaker 4: I think to it just because I empathize with them so much because I've been there there. You know, I swam on two relays in my Olympic Games. I mean two of my gold medals were on relays. So certainly when it comes to realize, I relays, I feel that empathy, sympathy.
00:32:31
Speaker 1: You know, I'm riding down my friend, this is I have a show here because for self discovery. I'm not saying that that's not in the manifesto for the show, but empathy, it was what I had. A sneaking suspicion and compassion was a sneaking suspicion was involved in this call. And I'm trying to figure out why this moment cracks me open, and I think I've I've gotten partly there right there from you and my friend. Thank you.
00:32:56
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it was it certainly an intense moment. And and again it's the build up, Tony. I mean, you know this more than anyone. I mean, you you build something up to such a high degree because of the expectations, you know, And there were so many expectations put on Michael going back to two thousand and four. You know, the possibility of winning eight gold medals. We kind of felt like it wasn't going to happen in O four, but there was that possibility.
00:33:26
Speaker 3: But in eight it had taken.
00:33:29
Speaker 4: A complete one eighty on everybody thinking, oh my gosh, he's going to do it. I said, he was going to do it in eight, I said he was not going to do it in four.
00:33:37
Speaker 1: So now you're fueling part of that pressure as well, because it's part of your job to do that. But then, I mean, here, here's what it is for me. I mean another thing is you you allowed yourself to live the moment right and be part of the race. But somehow you allowed yourself to recalibrate, which is a very hard thing to do in real time. And this is why I think this is along with one of the greatest sporting moments. I said, the great sport image of celebration. I believe it's one of the I think it's one of the great broadcasting moments. I come to this as a great broadcasting moment. I don't know you feel this way. I've read some of the things you've said. I've seen the documentary. I read a very i would say, strongly worded article on the New York Times days later, you know, commenting on a call that was wrong or or or you know, at least that implication. And I mean, maybe I'm seeing this through my own eyes of having been in front of a live microphone for so long, or having real expectations. You're not supposed to get every The job is in the get everything right. The job is to react in real time. And I'm just in awe of how the reacting in real time happened and landed it in a certain way. I say that to you. You can tell me it was stuck in your craw? Did it stick in your craw?
00:34:56
Speaker 3: No?
00:34:57
Speaker 1: No, good, no, no.
00:34:58
Speaker 4: I Like I said, I've called, I mean to fifteen hundred, two thousand, probably two thousand Olympic races, and I've made a lot of little wrong casts. For I'm pretty good at being right on, but I've I've messed up plenty.
00:35:15
Speaker 3: So I thought it added me too to the race.
00:35:21
Speaker 4: Because there wasn't one person Tony when Bernard flipped at the fifty, there wasn't one person in that arena or around the world that knew anything about swimming that thought Jason Lezak was going to beat him in the last fifty.
00:35:38
Speaker 3: Nobody, including Michael.
00:35:40
Speaker 4: I've talked to Michael, and I've talked to Garrett Webergil, I've talked to Colin Jones. They all said, we're racing for second, you know. They nobody thought he was going to do it. But that's the beautiful thing about sports and beautiful the beautiful thing about the human heart.
00:35:58
Speaker 3: I know that sounds cliche ish and corny.
00:36:00
Speaker 1: Oh this is a show cliche me all the way into the band. Yeah, there's a humanity to this. And this is precisely on the first week of my show because the humanity this jumps out the page and from the pool and from the swimmers, and also to the call. I have this question, how did occur to you the impossible was becoming possible? But I'm not asking it yet, my friend, I want to do something here. We have a segment in this show called call It, and I will ask some of my friends, my guests who come on this show to do something totally off the wall and call the moment we're talking about. But I will ask them to do it in a silly voice, like Shakespeare or a WWE wrestler or Richard Adam Borrow doing a Nature Document.
00:36:48
Speaker 3: Three.
00:36:49
Speaker 1: At this moment, I'm sending you something. If you have your phone on you, it is the transcript of your call. And I asked, apologize, well, I apologize. I have not mentioned the name of the great Dan Hicks, who is equally part of this Greater Call, which I just nominated for the Broadcasting Hall of Fame and conversation. Dan Hicks, NBC Olympics play by play man for the race alongside Well, I gave you the transcript for me. This is origin story, Tony stuff. I will want. I want another guest to re enact like I said, uh, a sporting moment like it's a soap opera, and do it in a voice or a ms R and whisper the whole call like that. But we can't do we can't do an here's Jason Leasak and he jumps out. We can't do that for this one. I would never cheapen it for that. What I have here is an opportunity to work with a man who I admire and and and a call that I idolize. I would like if it's so, if it would be so empathetic and compassion of you to offer me a chance to be Dan Hicks and I I mean thank you Dan again. I'm sorry I did mentioned your name earlier I should have. And you be Rowdy Gains? Can you be Rowdy Gains for me?
00:38:06
Speaker 2: Rowdy?
00:38:07
Speaker 3: You want me to be Rowdy Gains? And you'd be Dan Higgs.
00:38:11
Speaker 1: I want to be Dan HICKX. I want you to be Rowdy Gains. I want to go because there's a reason why I'm doing this because me Dan. Yeah, there's a moment in all this. So we are going to for call it today, no jokes here, We're going to We're going to call the final anchor swim here of the two thousand and eight hundred free relay that we have selected as our moment. So if you are ready, Rowdy, you got you got the glasses on, and you're ready to rip. And I'll start with Dan Hicks right here. France is taking the lead up there in laying five over the United States. Elaine Bernard, await says the anchor guy, and Jason Lezak is going to have to make up some ground on Elaine Bernard, who's staying six foot five and can absolutely fly.
00:38:55
Speaker 3: And I just don't think they can do it again. I mean, Jason Lezak as in there.
00:39:00
Speaker 4: How many times in his career has he anchored this free relay in Medley Relay, But I just don't think he can do it. He's trying to ride that wave.
00:39:09
Speaker 3: As much as possible.
00:39:11
Speaker 1: Bernard is pulling away from him, Lezak.
00:39:14
Speaker 3: Look at the world record line.
00:39:17
Speaker 1: A three time Olympian. The world record is absolutely gonna be shattered. Here. United States trying to hang on to second. They should get a silver medal. Australia is in bronze territory right now. But Lezak is closing a little bit on Bernard. Can the veteran chase him down and pull off a shocker? Here's no dubt he's tighting up. Bernard is losing some ground. Here comes Lezak.
00:39:42
Speaker 2: Unbelievable.
00:39:43
Speaker 1: At the end, He's done it. Us has done it.
00:39:47
Speaker 2: Get it a new world record?
00:39:49
Speaker 1: He get it it.
00:39:51
Speaker 5: Phelps hopeest are live. Forty six oh six split for Lezak. What a clutch fast wave when they need it? Who's talking now? Stunned?
00:40:04
Speaker 4: I think they need to use another word other than smash.
00:40:07
Speaker 3: Wow.
00:40:08
Speaker 4: That might be the most incredible relay split I've ever seen in.
00:40:12
Speaker 3: My entire life.
00:40:14
Speaker 4: Not only was that the fastest in history at bow Away, the fastest in history.
00:40:19
Speaker 1: Wow, Rowdy, thank you so much.
00:40:21
Speaker 4: That's the first time I've done that in seven sixteen. Whatever it is now, I gat me a little bit of goosebumps.
00:40:29
Speaker 3: You were a great dan By the way.
00:40:31
Speaker 1: Well, I mean Dan is a little bit lowrier. I had it circled in advance, and maybe you've seen that the name of this episode is tightening up, right, But for me, I mean you're calling it, you're doing three things at once. Rowdy, you're an expert, and you're the witness. But also, like I said, I think you're also in the race at that moment, and you're all of us honestly, I mean you have to also be your.
00:40:57
Speaker 3: Honest what I've had a lot of people tell me.
00:41:00
Speaker 1: But it's it's the moment here. There's no doubt that he's tightening up. Both. Yeah, I'm gonna I'm going to overlay these calls at some point because you really were in the same headspace you were then, which is just absurd that you can recreate that. But he's tightening up. Your voice does something. It goes up a quarter step, a pitch right, and it unlocks something inside my ear, my head that connects right to my heart, that connects right to my tear ducts. It's that he's tightening up. It is for me the impossible becoming possible. In three words, he's tightening up, and it is for me what unlocks something. And then there's another phrase which I've really didn't this one. I didn't really peg until until you just did it. He did it, He did it. I think that's some of the empathy and compassion you were talking about. But but but he's tightening up what happened inside you that you knew it, you alluded to. He's riding the wave right that so so that there's a swimming analysis I want you to give to me for a second. But then, but was there a biological like you know, you catch your breath now and now your voice is going higher, you know, and now you're doing a call. I just asked you seven questions at once based on one. No, No, it's fine to be impossible. How did occur to you?
00:42:29
Speaker 4: I felt it at about seventy five because I could see the tempo starting to scramble with Alan Bernard. I won't get too technical because it's swimming terms, but I could see Bernard's stroke starting to really waver a little bit, and Jason literally rode that wave. And when I'm talking about a wave, it's not so much physical because those lane lines now that they put between the swimmers, the lane markers in Layman's terms are eat waves man. So when the swimmer comes out and produces like a surf behind them, the swimmer next to him doesn't really ride the way physically too much. In a meal roup, mentally, that's where you feel like you're literally riding the surf of the guy behind you.
00:43:13
Speaker 3: And that's what he did. Yeah, he's bodysurfing.
00:43:19
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, he's literally that's a good way to put it, Tony, he's body surfing that first twenty five. So then he just takes that. But you know, that surf and he starts to go downhill with it. So he he starts to swimming. He starts to swim downhill, and Bernard starts to swim uphill.
00:43:37
Speaker 3: And and that was the moment I thought.
00:43:40
Speaker 4: I still had my doubts, but I thought, holy crap, now he's got a chance.
00:43:45
Speaker 3: You never know.
00:43:45
Speaker 4: I mean, he won by what was it seven one hundreds of a second or something like that. Yeah, so think about point oh eight seconds. He's still won a hundredth of a second, Tony, traveling at that speed, one one hundredth of a second is half of a little fingernail. So if you look at your fingernail, take half of that. That's one hundredth of a second. So if you're talking four fingernails, that's eight one hundreds of a second.
00:44:12
Speaker 3: That's your little finger. That's how much he won by.
00:44:16
Speaker 4: It wasn't like anybody knew that he was going to still do it.
00:44:19
Speaker 3: It was that close all the way to the end.
00:44:22
Speaker 4: But boy, when you felt Bernards start to scramble and that that that thing where you told me about the stroke count, I mean, I didn't know that.
00:44:29
Speaker 1: And that's ten percent more work, right, I mean, I like a stroke is just more work? Is that what it is? Or or is there Wow?
00:44:40
Speaker 4: Yeah, there's no question about it. The more strokes you take, the more energy you're expending.
00:44:46
Speaker 3: Think about it.
00:44:46
Speaker 4: If you take thirty strokes for a twenty five freestyle and you take twenty eight strokes for a twenty five freestyle, you know which is going to expend more energy, obviously the one that's taken thirty, Right, So if you can maintain tempo without slipping in the water, that's the that's the key. Again, I'm getting way too mechanical, but that's where my point is is that's where Bernard lost it. He started scrambling and He wasn't catching water. He was just slipping in the water. He was just spinning his wheel.
00:45:13
Speaker 1: An alternate timeline question. If Phelps is not going for eight, Phelps has maybe he already missed out on a metal in one of the first two races, or just you know, that was never even in the storyline for these games, and this comeback happens. Are you Are you feeling the same way calling that race?
00:45:36
Speaker 2: Is it?
00:45:36
Speaker 1: Is it?
00:45:37
Speaker 2: No?
00:45:39
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm just like everybody else. You like to see perfection.
00:45:42
Speaker 4: When that perfection doesn't happen, then you know there there, it does take the edge off of everything.
00:45:50
Speaker 3: And that happened in Athens. You know, once he lost that two.
00:45:53
Speaker 4: Hundred three or was it four hundred three relay, I can't remember which one came first, but once he you know, I don't want to say fail because that's the absolute wrong word, but once he didn't achieve that perfection and oh four, yeah, it took a little bit of the edge off.
00:46:14
Speaker 3: Of everybody.
00:46:14
Speaker 4: You know, I think of the people watching at home, you know, so, and I think very few people know that Michael was such an integral part of that relay. He let off in an American record in the Hunter Free. I mean he was unbelievable in leading off and the other two guys, I mean Colin Jones, first African American in history to break a world record when he broke that world record, that world record.
00:46:39
Speaker 3: Tony still stands eighteen years later. It's the oldest world record on the books. It's still on the books as the world record.
00:46:48
Speaker 4: And France still has the second fastest time in history.
00:46:51
Speaker 1: Forty six oh six holds up for I mean, will hold up as a great I mean as great a relay as you could possibly do, everything considered one more alternate timeline, or at least thinking about it. You said he did it, he did it, and and Dan said he did it or they did it, us did it. Dan's next word there got to Phelps. They did it. Phelps's hopes are alive. When you said he did it? Are you talking about Leezak? Are you talking about Phelps?
00:47:20
Speaker 3: I'm talking about Lee Zak.
00:47:22
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I said.
00:47:23
Speaker 4: I wasn't even thinking, so I literally was zoned in on Lizak. And again this is why Dan is the best that there ever has been.
00:47:33
Speaker 1: The story was, the story was a couple things. So you had to establish both.
00:47:36
Speaker 4: But please go ahead, Dan, Yeah, no, no, And I'm biased obviously, but Dan had to wherewithal to be able to say keats Phelps hopes alive.
00:47:47
Speaker 3: He brought Phelps back into it.
00:47:48
Speaker 4: I also zoned in on Jason and he created the big picture, which which was you know, which was desperately needed.
00:47:56
Speaker 1: The camera found Phelps immediately, and what you got was just some all time, all time.
00:48:03
Speaker 6: Great celebration, Tony. They still give me grief. In fact, I just got a text from Jason before I knew I was going to be on with you.
00:48:16
Speaker 4: This was I don't know, about a week or two ago, and I never said anything to Jason. But he goes salo it was a coach is announcing at my kids meet. It reminds me of this line I will never be able to take out of my head.
00:48:30
Speaker 3: I just don't think he can do it.
00:48:32
Speaker 4: Dan, and I wrote back and I, you know, put the laughing emoji, and I go, that.
00:48:37
Speaker 1: Will be on my tubestone, boy, And I just made you recreate that. And now he's well, Jason, you know, I think I started this show saying I think it's the greatest teammate moment history to me, moment in history in sports. Does that make sense? I had a top ten list where I was just throwing him out. I was working through it, you know. But some of the examples where Grant Hill made the pass to Christian Latner, right, Rustian Lanner shot lives in forever. Great Hills pass got a lot of yeah, right, got a lot of play. But still that past something about it. That's the team. The Red Sox beat the Yankees, but they had to come back from from the death's door and they were about to be swept. And for that to happen, there was a hit. But before the hit, there was a hit. Before the hit, there was a walk, stolen base, you know that type of thing. Ray Allen hit a great shot, but there was an offensive rebound before that, you know, Reggie Bush. But you know, but for me, even in the sport that is the least team sport that you know, do you believe this is the greatest teammate effort ever made by someone? Lezak?
00:49:56
Speaker 4: You know again, I look at it through rose colored lens to as you said, Tony, but I think, Jason, again, if you put it all together, and I mean just little things that people will never know, you know Colin Jones made that relay.
00:50:13
Speaker 3: By one one hundredth of a second.
00:50:15
Speaker 4: He had to swim in the morning to qualify for the relay at night. The only people on the relay at night were Jason and Michael and Garrett, so four swimmers swam for one spot in the morning and Colin beat Nathan Adrian, one of the greatest American freestylers, if not the greatest in history. I won one hundred second to put himself on that relay. So there, there's just so much to the story that if you're not a swimming fan, you would become one for this race. I get it that swimming gets kind of shoved back in the closet every four years.
00:50:50
Speaker 3: I understand it. That's the way it's always going to be.
00:50:52
Speaker 4: But I do believe that the American public loves the Olympic Games and they love pulling for these these these kids, and then then basically that's what most of them are, they're just kids.
00:51:04
Speaker 1: Well, I love this moment. I love pulling for this video or this this image to send to people when they need to celebrate. I love pulling for this video when I need to cry. I love this because of the teammates that it took to do it. I love that somebody was I mean Chas and Leezak got his medal. He is he and he has eight career medals, and he had an incredible ability to show perseverance and to get back to the top, uh through his games and his history in the games. And that's wonderful for him. So he certainly earned everything. And this moment still becomes a little bit about Phelps. But but but it's still about him. He was able to claim it and and and and I appreciate that too, uh and and I appreciate you for being here so much.
00:51:54
Speaker 3: Rowdy, we give gifts on the show. You won't like it.
00:51:59
Speaker 1: You won't like it. But here's what this gift is and whether it will be similar to what Jason just sent you via text. So I have my phone here. This is very very important for me. My phone is I'm not sure if you know the movie Goodfellas. It's a picture of it's a picture of RAYLEI. But okay, but this is how I I look at this and it makes me happy. So I'm hoping when I send people gifts, they look at it they make me happy. So our gift to you is well. I told you how important this image was of of of our man, Michael Phelps celebrating our gift to you. Is a phone case cover of Michaels celebrating you. Look at the face there that is a rowdy can face of our men with the headset. So you will be receiving this very sorely. But this is how I want you to remember this moment because for me, this image we started with was about Phelps. But for me, the image wasn't about Phelps. It was about Leezak. But the image wasn't just about Leezak. It was about Rowdy and how you were able to impart spirit and what you said. There was empathy and there was a he did it to that call that stays with me and it is instant tears. You hit the button, instant tears. Rowdy, you have been a wonderful guest. I have wanted to talk to you for many, many years we have I want to be friends with you, Rowdy. This is what it comes down to him. I've only got to I've only got a show to try to recruit more friends. That's why, that's why I have a show, Tony.
00:53:27
Speaker 3: I can't imagine a better friend to get to know Rowdy.
00:53:31
Speaker 1: Thank you very much, ladies and gentlemen, Rowdy gains here on the program.
00:53:35
Speaker 3: All right, take care buddy, my man.
00:53:39
Speaker 1: Oh okay, whoa? How was that?
00:53:43
Speaker 3: Man?
00:53:43
Speaker 6: Ah?
00:53:45
Speaker 1: I have a friend?
00:53:46
Speaker 2: Come on?
00:53:47
Speaker 1: Are we not going to be good friends? Right? I mean I just made friends with rowdy yays. I just made friends with rowdy yains. I have no idea what's happening. I don't know what to say. You know, this is everything I want this to be. Is what I want to say, because this was my first episode for a reason, it's personal to me. This is the number one video. It makes no sense. I don't swim, it makes zero sense, and it makes me cry every time. Teammates. First off, let's start here teammates. I had the list, the top ten, top five of the sports teammate list, right, and I was wondering if the conversation was going to change my mind. It was Routy going to say something. You know, they really aren't teammates. And the pool that's what I was maybe leaving doubt for. And the way they compete with each other to get onto the relay team is also an odd thing right, that's not a teammate. They're competing with each other. But this just solidified for me. This is the number one, number one teammate moment for me in sports and my viewing history. Please he hit me in the mansions, tell me I'm forgetting one. I've made this list when I was in the subway coming over here. I mean, it has too much idot right. It has the magnitude of it ending with a gold medal, It has the uber magnitude of it ending with Phelps getting to eight gold medals. It has one of the greatest celebrations of all time. It has one of the greatest comebacks of all time on the clock. To run forty six oh six or swim forty six oh six, you know that is untouchable. It's an untouchable number in swimming. So you have all these exceptional levels here to prove it was the height of sport. And then you have a call on top of that that demonstrates teammates, because it's not just Leezak's a teammate of Phelps, and Phelps is a teammate of Lezak. It's that Rowdy is a teammate of Dan Hicks, and together they put together one of the greatest calls of all time. Man, I don't know, I'm just I feel like I need some somaliade water after that to really take it in. One of the things we do on this show is we end every show with the real one minute and we're gonna go out here like we walked in here, all right, So let's say a load of ralio to one more time and let's uh, let's take this one for a walk here. Let me see you see how I walk here? This is my bag, all right? Why does this moment break me open more than any other sports moment. I think I know why now, And it's not because the picture. It's because a voice changes in real time, changing certainty into doubt, and doubt then becomes belief, and then belief becomes joy. Thank you very much, guys, See you later. The United States was counted out, Lee Zak was counted out. Even Rowdy, who had spent his whole life in the pool, they didn't think it was possible, and all at once it was happening. But I think the the real reason why I've carried this for twenty years is simpler than that. Lizak was not just a passenger in Michael Phelps's story. He was an Olympian. He had heartache at loss, recovered, he earned his moment. He wasn't just swimming for himself. If you went back and read some of the stories afterwards, Lizak was beautifully poetic talking about how he was doing it for his country, but on his back even more was Michael phelps impossible dream told you one of the best things anyone ever said to me was if you want to feel better about yourself, do something for other people. But I didn't tell you why that was said to me. I was going through a moment in my life where I was learning I was an anxious person and more specifically dealing with generalized anxiety disorder. Right, So they told me, you want to feel better about yourself, do something for other people. With that as the focus, get out of your own head for a while, Tony, Right, be there for somebody else. I'm not saying that's the answer for everybody, but it's been a part of an answer for me, and it actually happens to be a key element of my career hosting. Right, you're doing something for the other people on the show and to be honest. It's a key element for my real job, my real purpose in life, parenting. The purpose is about my children, to carry them, to lift them, to watch them, to witness them, to celebrate them. So when I hear rowdy yell he did it, he did it, I don't hear swimming. I hear the kind of person I want to be. Somebody who can lift other people up in their moment, Somebody who could witness and celebrate somebody in their moment. Someone who appreciates people's joy when they do the impossible. Because when I hear that, I feel something in me in a wonderful way tightening up. And that's your real one minute. Did I hit the time? Oh not even close, Senora.
00:59:00
Speaker 2: We have the hap
