S9E5: Billy McCall

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Hello and welcome back to Long Arm Stapel a podcast about zines.
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I'm your host, Vera, and this episode I am joined by Dylan McCall, who is an artist and zine maker living in Albuquerque, New Mexico.
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He's been making zines since the 1900s, producing titles such as Proof I Exist, Last Night at the Casino, and Behind the Zines.
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Over the years, he has participated in zine distros, zine libraries, zine fests, and zine readings.
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He has also written a couple of books, his favorite of which is Chicago Joe and the Ancient Pages.
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His most recent project is the website www.ilovzines.com, a website for buying and selling zines.
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Hi, Billy.
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Hello.
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Thank you so much for having me on your podcast.
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I'm very excited to be here.
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Yeah, I'm excited to have you um and chat with you because, like you mentioned before we started recording, like we see each other around at fests, and like I don't know, it's hard to like talk to people at fests.
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Um, and like that's why I like doing the podcast, because then I can just talk with like one person instead of trying to talk to like 30 people at the same time.
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Yeah, absolutely.
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I love I love your podcast.
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I love the format.
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I love the long interview that you're doing, and it's it's really cool and it's fun to like.
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I've been I've been listening to a lot of them uh in the last couple weeks in kind of preparation of like you know, thinking about that I was gonna be on it.
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And yeah, zine fests are like just a whole different thing, and it's weird how it's almost easier to talk to strangers because they'll walk up and you'll be like, Hey, what's up?
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My name's so-and-so, and this is my zine.
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And but then like your best friend that you haven't seen in five years comes up, and it's like you have so much you want to say, but you just you can't in five seconds, so it's it's actually kind of hard to talk to your best friends at a zine fest.
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Yeah, that's why I bring mine along and we table with each other um Nico, and then we just get to be awkward at behind our table together.
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Yeah, I'm I'm like that with Ed Kemp, um, who does uh the word distribution out in Jersey City.
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Like he and I will travel and meet each other at Zine Fest and try to get tables next to each other, and then then we can kind of feel like we catch up.
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That's it feels like the only way, really.
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Or like if you're like staying at someone like a zine friend's house when you travel for zine stuff, like those feel like really the only ways to like really get to talk to people.
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Yeah, the fest is kind of the excuse to get to town, and then like outside of the fest, like before and after in the days leading up, like that's when you actually get to hang out with people.
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Yeah.
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Or unless you come on a podcast, and then it's kind of the same thing.
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Yeah.
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Um, cool.
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I have a bunch of questions for you.
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Uh the first being, how did you get into zines in the 1900s?
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Uh yeah, a friend of mine says that sometimes whenever she's talking about something that happened in like 95, she's like, Well, back in the 1900s, we had dial up internet or whatever.
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Um, but yeah, I was I was born in 1980, so you know, in the mid-90s, I was a teenager, and I definitely I grew up in small town Iowa, and there were no zines or anything really at all.
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And I just but I always loved to write, I always love to tell stories, and I was definitely making stories and copying them and giving them to my friends for like a while, for like a couple of years, and then one day I was like old enough to go to Des Moines and go to like a punk rock show, and someone handed me a zine, and I was like, What the fuck is this?
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Like blew my mind because I'm like, This is what I'm doing, only it's way better.
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And just one person, just this total stranger that I've never seen again, like handed me a zine and like changed my whole life.
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Because then I wrote to every address that was in the back of that, and all of a sudden I'm like plugged into the the paper net, you know, and we're like trading zines.
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And yeah, I was I was making zines before I knew what a zine was, and then I've just always been making them since.
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Do you remember what zine it was that kind of changed your life?
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I totally do.
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It was a zine out of Ancky, Iowa called Happy Goat.
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I think it was Happy Goat number six, and it was mostly like music reviews.
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And like up in Des Moines and Anckony, like some of the the bigger towns in Iowa, like there was like a little bit of a scene, like a punk scene and a ska scene in in the 90s.
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And so there was stuff going on, but I was like two hours away from that.
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So like I didn't I wasn't in any sort of scene, you know what I mean?
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But there were there were some zines and some bands and stuff like that.
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So yeah, I still I still have it.
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I still have Happy Goat number six.
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Hell yeah, that's so cool.
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Yeah, and then you know, at different points in my life, you know, that seems like a long time ago now, but I always thought like I would graduate out of zines and be writing books.
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And to some degree, I I have like I've done I've written for newspapers and websites, and I have written a couple books, but I just you I can't quit zines, man.
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I keep coming back to them because it's still like my favorite form of expression.
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It's my favorite thing to read, it's my favorite thing to write, you know, and and I definitely consider myself a writer, but I'm really like a zine maker that writes a lot, you know.
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Yeah, and I mean I feel like I've tried to write other things too, and I just I always come back to zines in a similar way.
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Like they're such they encompass so many things that I love about writing, and I think that's what keeps me coming back to them.
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I don't know if that's the same for you.
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Yeah, totally.
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I mean, I like I I love I read a ton of books.
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I love reading and I love fiction.
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I love writing fiction, and it's a lot of fun doing all of that, but there's something visual about zines, and there's something you know just immediate about it.
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You can just you can make a zine in a day or a week or a month, and real writing, like writing a book, you're writing for months and months and months, and then you're editing for months, and it's it's just a different experience, and um zines just kind of have this like immediate effect, and it it's just a different process to take it in, it's a different process to produce it, you know.
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So I you know, I love I love both, and I love all writing.
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I love anything with that's made out of paper, to be honest.
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But um, yeah, I just I love zines.com.com, yeah.
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Um that kind of touches on my next question, which is like what keeps you interested in zines after all this time?
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I think there's still like a a purity about them.
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Um, I like a lot of things that you can't really make money at.
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And I think in like this crazy capitalism society, like like doing things that don't really produce money, I think that's like such a good pure way to spend your time.
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And um I don't know, there's been different people at different times that have tried to really commercialize zines or whatever, and you you just really can't because I don't know, it just doesn't have that mainstream appeal, which is like great because the people that love it and get into it, like it it creates like a smaller subculture and it just feels a lot more honest and a lot more pure and real.
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And and like when you don't have advertisers or you don't have publisher, like you can just say anything you want.
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It doesn't matter if it's spelled right, it doesn't matter, you know, what people are gonna think of your opinion, you could just put your opinion out there no matter what.
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And I just really I really like that.
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Like people can just can do anything, say anything, and you might agree, you might disagree.
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Um, but yeah, I don't know, it's just it's just they're fun to read.
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And every there's there's certain things, you know, because it's a culture, there's certain aspects of it that get carried from generation to generation, but also each new person that tries it comes at it from a different angle.
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So there's gonna be certain like visual elements, you know, cut and paste elements and stuff like that, and things that you know, zines kind of look a certain way.
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Um, but also every like brand new person that's you know doing it for the very first time, they're gonna do it their own way, and it and there's still new new zines coming out that are totally unique and different, and you know, I I just love flipping through them.
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And you know, a lot of zines I read and I don't like them, and that's fine.
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I pass them on, and every now and then you get one that just like blows you away, and it's a totally different way of life or whatever than what you have, so it's a different perspective on things, and it's just great.
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That's something I think really special about zines, and is especially per zines, is like you can really just get in the heads and lives of people you may not know or people you may not know well, and just learn so many things about them, and learn so many things about like just different ways of life.
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Yeah, a hundred percent.
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And you know, because we we each have our you know, we're all the main character in our story, you know, so we know what it's like to be us, but like, you know, people living in a different place or people that are a different age, or you know, all these different factors, like they have a totally different life from you, and I think that's a great way to kind of like open up your eyes to the the rest of the world is to read other people's lives and find out what struggles they've been through and accomplishments and goals and all this sort of stuff.
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So absolutely.
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Um in the time that you've been making zines, do you feel like your views on zine making or like your process for making zines has changed throughout that period?
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Um that's a pretty good question.
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Like definitely when I like when I was a teenager, I was just writing stories and I would just find a way to copy them and staple them.
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And you know, I've I've gone through all the different, you know, processes that you can imagine.
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I've made every size and shape and format.
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I've I've had newsprint zines that were printing a hundred thousand, and I've done, you know, unique one of a kind, only making five copies of this for my five friends or whatever, all different sizes and all that stuff.
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I've I've done done on computer and typewriter, and um it's definitely like evolved, and I definitely kind of have like a system of how I do it now.
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But then again, there's there's certain things that I don't know, I like to keep the same, I guess.
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And it's different for different zine series.
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Like when I was doing uh last night at the casino, like I was doing it, you know, quarter size, pocket size, and I wanted um each one to always be pocket size and kind of have like a format where when you look at it, you can tell oh it's from the same series, and if you have them on your shelf, they all fit together.
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And then proof I exist, I intentionally like mix it up like every issue.
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Like I want to do some small and some big and some full size, and I intentionally like experiment, and there's not like a set way to do that.
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But for the most part, I'm a writer, so I like to write, and I usually do a lot of writing on the computer, and then a lot of times I'll print it out and then cut and paste to do my my layouts cut and paste.
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But the most recent one I just finished last week, um Proof Exist 50.
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I did the whole thing on the computer, so that's like pretty unusual for me.
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But yeah, I like to mix it up, but um mostly it's it.
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I I'm a writer and I like to keep the writing kind of at the forefront and then add in pictures and stuff like that later.
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50 in a in a series, that's amazing.
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Yeah, it's a lot.
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I've been I think the first one came out maybe in 2001 or 2002.
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So it's like roughly like two issues a year, but I've been doing it for like 25 years.
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So I'm just old, that's all.
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Everyone else will get there eventually.
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But um, yeah, like two two issues a year, but I don't have any sort of schedule for it.
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Like with behind the zenes, like that comes out twice a year, like on a schedule, comes out September, comes out March.
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But Proof I exist is just whenever I feel like it.
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So there's been years where I didn't write any at all, and then there's years where I write three or four, but um, in general, like like two issues a year.
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Okay.
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That when you like spread it out like that, it's still a very impressive number, but like yeah, just thinking back like 2001, 2002, that was such a long time ago.
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I know it definitely was.
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Um you have a new-ish recent project, um, and that is I love zines.com.
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Do you want to talk about that a little bit or a lot?
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Yeah, I would love to talk a whole bunch about it.
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Um, I've had I've kind of had the idea for a while, um, and I'm really excited that it that the website's going now.
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Um, so when I was in Chicago, I did a distro called loop distro.
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Um, and then it was was named after the Chicago Loop, and it was all Chicago, uh, which I guess I should tell people what the Chicago Loop is.
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That's just like the downtown area of Chicago, and the the trains kind of run in a loop in the downtown area.
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So it was called Loop Distro because I just only wanted zines from Chicago, and I distroed anything that was printed in Chicago, and um that was a lot of fun.
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I did that for a few years, and then recently I started doing behind the zines distro maybe two or three years ago, and basically that was just an excuse to help friends sell their zines.
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And this like I love distros, I love running a distro, and I love uh buying from distros and stuff.
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And a distro is a good way to get a bunch of zines in one place.
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Um, but there's a lot of difficulties with running distros, and one of them is like keeping all the zines in one place.
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Like, I have to get all these zines from people from all over the country into my house.
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I have to get the zines there, and then I'm doing all the mailing of them and stuff like that.
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And also, you spend a lot of money on mailing.
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So, my idea for I LoveZines, I love zines.com, is that uh the website sort of serves as like the middleman where it's sort of like an Etsy or an eBay where people can post and list their zines, but I don't have their zines.
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So I don't have to pay up front or I don't have to keep track of the consignment or whatever.
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Like if someone lists a zine and it sells, I then forward that order on to the person, and then it's up to that person to mail out the zine.
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So the advantages of of that over like a regular distro is instead of you know the person paying to ship their zine to me, and then it just sits in my bedroom, and then if there's an order, I ship it back out, like you're paying like double postage.
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So that's like one way to kind of like save a little bit of money.
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Um, but also I don't have to hold all these zines that may or may not sell and and stuff like that.
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And theoretically, it could it could grow and grow and grow and be as big as I have time for, basically.
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So um it's kind of like like if like Etsy back in the day, I I've used Etsy for a long time, and I really liked them in the beginning, and I like them less and less every year, and they seem like they just Etsy just kind of has everything, like it's basically eBay now, like you can just buy it's not just the handmade stuff, it's just anybody sells anything on Etsy now.
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And I was like, oh man, but there's a lot of really great zines on Etsy.
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Like I buy zines off Etsy all the time, and I'm like, oh, I wish Etsy was like only for zines.
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And that's sort of was one of the things that made me think of the idea for this website of like it's kind of like Etsy, but only zines.
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Like just scroll through and there's a ton of stuff, and it's all you know stuff that I would want to buy.
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Hell yeah.
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That's and like I remember when Etsy was pretty much all handmade, and that's where I sold my zines for a really long time, because it just seemed like the best marketplace for them, but it has not seen like the best marketplace for them for a long time now.
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I feel like a lot of um a lot of like shops or whatever on there are just like stores that are selling products, and it it kind of like it used to be only like handmade things, like that was the charm of Etsy, and then it was like, well, handmade things or stuff that you would use to make handmade things.
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So they're selling yarn and beads and like art supplies and craft supplies, and then it was like, okay, also what about vintage things?
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So I don't know how that fits in with handmade, but then they started selling vintage things, and now you can buy anything.
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And um if you find the stuff that you want, like that's I mean, that's cool.
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But to me, it's like the Etsy is so diluted of like hardly any of the stuff.
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I I think I think it's gone past the 50% of like I think most things on there are not handmade.
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Like you can buy VHS tapes, you can buy trading cards, you can buy t-shirts, you know.
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So I don't know, Etsy got kind of boring to me in that regard.
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Although there's still, like I said, there's still a ton of uh great zines on there, and I still have my zines on there too.
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Um I guess I also had like a little bit of a problem because I one of my a zine that I distro, like Etsy like flagged it and pulled it down and said we weren't allowed to sell it.
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It was a it was a zine.
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Um I for legal reasons I can't, I guess I probably shouldn't say what grocery store, but it was a zine about that someone wrote about a grocery store that rhymes with Schmaider Moe's, and like they worked there for a long time and then wrote a zine about how much it sucks to work there.
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And then we put the zine up on Etsy, and Etsy's like, no, you can't sell this.
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And it was, I don't know, it was basically two corporations threatening to sue me if I didn't pull this zine off the website.
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I was like, dude, Etsy's so boring now, it's like so mainstream, and I'm just like over it.
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So now I have my own website and I can sell anything I want.
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Amazing.
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Yeah.
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And we actually had a question from a listener um and a Kofi podcast supporter, G Young, who asked, Um, how do you how do you list zines or how do you choose what to list on I Love Zines?
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Uh, that's like a really good question.
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And it's a and that really reminds me that at some point I need to put up like a frequently asked questions on on that website to explain some things that are not really very clear, maybe.
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Um, the website's still kind of new.
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It just just launched this year, like maybe four or five months ago.
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So I'm still sorting things out and I'm still trying to figure it out.
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So to begin with, I was only asking people that I knew personally.
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So the big difference between like I love zines or eBay or Etsy, like with Etsy, there's all this stuff where you sign up for an account and you put in your phone number and your address and all these different things.
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And like I don't I don't do it like that.
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So on Etsy, if someone doesn't if someone if so like someone buys a zine and then you don't mail it out, like you're gonna get flagged and you're gonna get in trouble and your account's gonna get disbarred or whatever.
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And I'm not like doing it that way.
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I thought about having people sign up for accounts, but I don't know, it's annoying to sign up for an account.
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So so to start with, I'm all I was only asking people that I knew personally, and and the main reason for that is just that it's people that I know and I know I can trust them.
00:19:10.079 --> 00:19:16.720
So the reason that's important is if someone orders a zine, like I need to know 100% that the person will mail out the zine.
00:19:17.119 --> 00:19:23.759
So right now I've only been asked, I've only I've been basically asking people, hey, do you want to be on this website?
00:19:23.920 --> 00:19:32.079
And now it's big enough where it's like little by little I've been getting emails of people at that I've never met asking me, like, hey, can I put my zines on your website?
00:19:32.319 --> 00:19:39.839
Um, in theory, I want all the zines on the website, but I still have to build up like trust with each individual person.
00:19:39.920 --> 00:19:52.640
So we have to do a few emails and and um the the main things to to sell zines on that website is you have to guarantee that you'll if you get an order, you'll mail it out like within a week.
00:19:52.799 --> 00:19:55.359
Like that's that's gotta be for sure.
00:19:55.599 --> 00:20:06.480
Um the other thing I uh ever and also it has to be United States, because like I'm not ready for international shipping, so only shipping back and forth within the United States.
00:20:06.640 --> 00:20:10.880
Um eventually maybe I'll figure out how to do international shipping, but I haven't got there yet.
00:20:11.039 --> 00:20:20.640
And then the other thing is that people have like a good quantity of their zine, because if you only made like three copies and then someone orders five copies, like now we're in trouble.
00:20:20.799 --> 00:20:26.400
So, you know, you gotta be able to mail your zine out, you gotta have like a good stock of it, and you gotta be in the United States.
00:20:26.559 --> 00:20:30.720
Um, other than that, like if I trust you, I trust you, and let's do it.
00:20:30.799 --> 00:20:31.920
Like, I I want more zines.
00:20:32.160 --> 00:20:40.160
I want I've been uploading stuff like pretty much not quite every day, but like you know, pretty much every other day for like the last two months.
00:20:40.319 --> 00:20:45.759
So um, as much as I have time to do to update it, like I I want more stuff.
00:20:46.480 --> 00:20:47.839
That's really cool.
00:20:48.160 --> 00:20:56.799
Um and the they had another half of their question, which I think you kind of already answered, um, which is how is shipping calculated?
00:20:56.960 --> 00:21:02.960
But it sounds like whoever's shipping the zine is the one calculating from where they live.
00:21:03.119 --> 00:21:03.359
No?
00:21:03.599 --> 00:21:04.000
Oh, okay.
00:21:04.240 --> 00:21:05.279
No, never mind.
00:21:05.519 --> 00:21:06.079
Yeah, yeah.
00:21:06.240 --> 00:21:18.480
No, the the this is another thing that's like I've made pretty clear to all the people that I work with, all the vendors that I work with, but I have not really made it clear on the website for people that are actually buying the zines.
00:21:19.039 --> 00:21:33.279
Um basically, like when I was thinking about how much does it cost to ship a zine, I kind of came to the number of like 30% of like if you buy a zine for like three or four dollars, it probably costs you a dollar to mail it.
00:21:33.519 --> 00:21:39.200
If you buy, you know, ten dollars worth of zines, it probably costs like three dollars worth, you know, three dollars to mail it.
00:21:39.359 --> 00:21:48.880
So the way I do my shipping, it's it's very simple, but if if you don't know it, you don't know it, so it's probably confusing for people that are buying.
00:21:49.119 --> 00:21:55.440
But if you if you buy between zero and ten dollars worth of zines, you're gonna pay three dollars shipping.
00:21:55.599 --> 00:21:59.279
If you buy if you spend between ten and twenty dollars, it's gonna be six dollars of shipping.
00:21:59.440 --> 00:22:11.119
And it Goes up like that, so the shipping is based on how much you spend, and so it's in some ways that's it's like stupid to do it that way, but in some ways it's like super easy to do it that way.
00:22:11.200 --> 00:22:18.559
So if someone buys like a one dollar zine, they're gonna pay three dollars in shipping, but if they buy nine dollars a zine, they're still paying three dollars in shipping.
00:22:18.720 --> 00:22:27.839
So sometimes it's maybe a better deal or a worse deal for the buyer, and also sometimes it's a better or worse deal, you know, for the people selling it.
00:22:28.000 --> 00:22:35.920
Like if I if I'm if I sell one of my zines and I get three dollars of shipping for one zine, I probably don't need three dollars just to mail one zine.
00:22:36.160 --> 00:22:41.279
But if I'm selling nine dollars worth of zines for three dollars shipping, I'm probably losing money when I send it out.
00:22:41.440 --> 00:22:44.079
And for me, in the long run, it all evens out.
00:22:44.400 --> 00:22:46.400
Um yeah, I don't know.
00:22:46.480 --> 00:22:51.599
There's better ways to do it, and there's probably worse ways to do it, but that's kind of the simple way to do it.
00:22:51.839 --> 00:23:05.680
Um, on the thing that makes the website really easy, like if you're for if you're a buyer, is that if you go on the website and you buy one of my zines and one of Liz's zines, and uh Jordan C just put her stuff on, you buy one of hers.
00:23:05.759 --> 00:23:09.279
You know, there's I have like maybe 30 vendors on there now.
00:23:09.440 --> 00:23:14.559
You can buy a zine from every single one of them, and you're just gonna run your credit card one time.
00:23:14.799 --> 00:23:17.279
So, in that sense, it's really, really simple.
00:23:17.440 --> 00:23:26.480
And you're just you're doing one payment for all these different things, and then all those different people are gonna be mailing you 30 different packages from all over the country.
00:23:26.640 --> 00:23:32.319
Um, so in that way, it it's it's kind of like a I'm trying to keep it simple in that regard.
00:23:32.480 --> 00:23:41.359
And mostly it's complicated on my end and the back end of like keeping track of all the bookkeeping and you know how much money I owe everybody else.
00:23:41.599 --> 00:24:01.119
Um, but another part of the website is that it's it's funny because I've been doing a lot of individual sales to like just people that want to buy one or two zines, but like kind of the bigger goal of the website is to sell to stores and to distros where they're buying in bulk and they're buying, let me get 10 copies of this and 20 copies of that.
00:24:01.279 --> 00:24:04.079
And little by little we've been getting orders like that.
00:24:04.319 --> 00:24:19.279
And for the stores, like like they love it for the reason that I just said is that instead of dealing with like 10 different zine sters, even if they love 10 different zine sters, that's 10 different emails, that's 10 different checks in the mail, it's 10 different you know, contacts or whatever.
00:24:19.440 --> 00:24:29.200
And then on the website, a a store can just come on and click, click, click, click, click, and just order from all these different zine sters and just get one, you know, payment to go through and they get all the stuff.
00:24:29.359 --> 00:24:31.839
So I don't know, it's definitely a learning process.
00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:34.880
I'm definitely getting better as I go.
00:24:35.039 --> 00:24:38.880
I definitely still have you know things I need to iron out, but I'm doing my best.
00:24:39.039 --> 00:24:41.839
I'm not really a website person, but I'm figuring it out.
00:24:42.079 --> 00:24:45.039
So that's really cool.
00:24:45.359 --> 00:24:53.839
And that was also exciting because I feel like people don't submit questions specific questions for guests.
00:24:53.920 --> 00:24:58.079
So that was exciting to get a specific question to ask you.
00:24:58.559 --> 00:25:00.799
Yeah, thank you for whoever asked that question.
00:25:00.960 --> 00:25:03.839
And I also try to make it easy to contact me.
00:25:04.000 --> 00:25:11.440
Like, um, if there's I I've had people that have emailed me and be like, hey, how come like this thing is misspelled on this review or whatever?
00:25:11.599 --> 00:25:18.480
And I've had people say, Hey, this link doesn't work, or like if there's something wrong with the website or something you think could be improved, like I'm all ears.
00:25:18.559 --> 00:25:41.119
Um, and I I want the website to run as smoothly as possible, and I I want it, you know, the you know, for this website and for loop distro and for behind the zines distro or even behind the zines, the zine that I do, like I want to promote zines, I want to give people, you know, I want to help to help people get their voice out and get their their zine out into the world.
00:25:41.200 --> 00:25:47.039
And if you're a new zine star and you don't really know where to start, you know, like talk to me and I we can get it up on the website.
00:25:47.119 --> 00:26:05.920
And you know, I want to help people get their stuff out there because I've I've been doing this for a long time, so I'm I'm still making mistakes, but also I've made a lot of mistakes, and so certain things like I know how to do, and so I love talking about it, I love helping people, whether it's making the zine or selling the zine, like I want to help people get their stuff out there, you know.
00:26:06.319 --> 00:26:08.240
Yeah, that's awesome.
00:26:09.519 --> 00:26:14.400
And so I love zines is also a YouTube channel, correct?
00:26:15.119 --> 00:26:19.039
Yeah, um, and uh they started like separately.
00:26:19.119 --> 00:26:24.319
I started the YouTube channel like a year ago, and the website's only been up since like March.
00:26:24.480 --> 00:26:31.119
Um, but the YouTube channel I started I started doing a while ago, and and that's definitely also open to anyone.
00:26:31.279 --> 00:26:32.720
Um, and it's the same thing.
00:26:32.880 --> 00:26:36.720
I want to help people promote their zines and help people promote themselves.
00:26:36.960 --> 00:26:39.599
And you know, not everyone has a YouTube channel.
00:26:39.759 --> 00:26:48.559
So if you send me a little video, like I'll edit it, I'll post it for you, and then you know, I have different like kind of like channels or playlists or whatever.
00:26:48.720 --> 00:27:01.519
So like the like one of the big ones is I do a thing called in their own words, and it's just short, like under 60 seconds, just one person talking about one zine, and anyone can send me a video of that and I'll I'll put it up there.
00:27:01.759 --> 00:27:21.039
But yeah, there's we have different like little, you know, kind of like different like podcast type things that I'm doing too, where I'm talking to people or interviewing people or you know, discussing different zines, and I just want that to build also, and it's it's kind of separate from the I Love Zines website, but it's also kind of the same thing, so it's all me just putting zine stuff out onto the internet.
00:27:22.799 --> 00:27:30.480
You had one that went up very it'll not be so recent when this episode comes out, but it's very recent to this one.
00:27:30.640 --> 00:27:38.640
But um, you talk about a former guest on the show, um, Sherea owes Zine Monster Truck Maniac 2.
00:27:38.880 --> 00:27:39.200
Yeah.
00:27:39.519 --> 00:27:42.000
Um, and so that was cool to watch.
00:27:42.319 --> 00:27:48.400
Yeah, I'm a big fan of I'm a big fan of Shoreya and everything that uh that she does.
00:27:48.480 --> 00:28:19.039
Um we've been pen pals for a couple years now, and um I love her zines, and uh I don't know, like all of all of her zines are great, but Monster Truck Maniac I just thought was like really funny, and I've been to one Monster Truck rally ever and it was it was fun, but it was kind of fun to because I had emailed a bunch of my friends like, hey, does anyone because I I do this zine series called Let's Take a Moment, this video series, excuse me, video series called Let's Take a Moment, where just three or four people talk about one particular zine.
00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:22.400
And so I said, Hey, does anybody want to do one of these videos with me?
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:25.119
And so like three of my friends like emailed, like, yeah, let's do it.
00:28:25.279 --> 00:28:31.759
And so I just like sent copies of their of Sh Sheree's zine through the mail to them, and they had no idea what they were getting.
00:28:31.920 --> 00:28:36.160
They didn't ask for it, they didn't know what it was gonna be, and so everyone's just like, Whoa, like what's this?
00:28:36.319 --> 00:28:42.799
And that's that's kind of part of the fun too, to get like a homework assignment of like read this zine, we're gonna talk about it on Monday.
00:28:42.960 --> 00:28:55.359
Um, and to just get people that are you know coming from different angles, like if you've heard of monster trucks or you haven't, or you like them, or you don't, or whatever, and then to talk about a zine because all of us love zines, so yeah, it's fun.
00:28:56.400 --> 00:29:04.400
Yeah, I was I was really enjoying it, and it's it's cool hearing that you don't really like tell anyone what they're getting into.
00:29:04.480 --> 00:29:08.720
It's just kind of like open the mail, all right, we're gonna talk about this.
00:29:09.039 --> 00:29:11.759
Yeah, I think that's I think that's kind of the fun too.
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:18.160
And obviously, like I know Sherea and I could have been like, hey, let's let's talk of let's talk about your zine.
00:29:18.319 --> 00:29:30.880
But you know, I like I like chances, I like to give people chances to talk about themselves, but also it's fun for other people to talk about it because you know when you put your zine out into the world, it is it is public information now.
00:29:31.039 --> 00:29:42.640
So it's fun when movie critics review a movie, or it's fun when uh you get a book review, you know, and and you might agree with the reviewer or you might not, but you know, that's like to me, like that's like the next level.
00:29:42.799 --> 00:29:46.400
And I'm always I'm always talking about like the next level of the culture.
00:29:46.559 --> 00:30:21.440
So like the first level of zine culture is just making zines and reading zines, but then like the stuff that I'm doing, and also like long arm podcasts, like that's like the next level where you're not just making zines, but now we're talking about making zines, and then you know, someone else is gonna do like a review of your podcast in their zine, and then I might review that zine on a website, and like that's how like culture really builds up when you have this like interconnected web of everybody doing things, but also talking about doing things and why we do it the way we do it, and why you know, just all these different factors, like how you do it, and all that stuff matters, you know.
00:30:21.680 --> 00:30:23.599
Yeah, that's very cool.
00:30:23.920 --> 00:30:32.480
Um speaking of zine podcasts, you also do a zine podcast on occasion.
00:30:32.880 --> 00:30:40.240
Sort of kinda with with Jordan, um, who I love, and and Jordan's just like one of the best people ever.
00:30:40.640 --> 00:30:44.240
And it was Jordan's idea to start it was called the Zine Report.
00:30:44.400 --> 00:30:46.559
And for a while we were doing pretty good.
00:30:46.640 --> 00:30:53.920
We put we were putting out an episode every other month or something, but um, it was it was Jordan was really doing the heavy lifting on that.
00:30:54.000 --> 00:30:58.160
I would just basically turn on the camera and we would like chit-chat, like how you and I are doing.
00:30:58.319 --> 00:31:04.319
But Jordan was doing like the editing and was actually posting it on onto different websites and stuff like that.
00:31:04.480 --> 00:31:12.319
Um, and I don't know, we we kind of like lost momentum and then we both got busy, and then I was traveling, and then you know, life just gets busy.
00:31:12.400 --> 00:31:17.200
So it's been on hold, but we have talked about maybe bringing it back because it is fun to do.
00:31:17.440 --> 00:31:20.799
Um, I think the more you know, more Zine podcasts, the better.
00:31:20.960 --> 00:31:24.720
Although I gotta say, Longarm's kind of like the the champion of them all.
00:31:24.880 --> 00:31:32.880
Like, like, like I remember like when we were talking about the Zine report, we're like, okay, it's we're gonna try to make it as cool as Long Arm, but it can't be the same as Longarm.
00:31:33.039 --> 00:31:35.839
We need like our own format, we gotta do it a different way.
00:31:36.000 --> 00:31:37.759
It's not gonna be like interview, you know.
00:31:37.839 --> 00:31:48.559
We were talking about different because I don't know, people that are into zines, like everyone kind of knows about long arm, you know, and it's you're you've been doing it for a while now, and it's just getting better and better, so it's cool.
00:31:48.880 --> 00:31:51.839
Thank you so much, and that is also crazy to hear.
00:31:52.000 --> 00:31:52.480
I don't know.
00:31:52.640 --> 00:32:02.799
It I get about the podcast, I get very like like I know I've been doing it for a long time, but I'm still also like a shy guy, and I'm just like me?
00:32:03.119 --> 00:32:03.599
Like, I don't know.
00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:06.880
No, no, it's all it's all an act.
00:32:06.960 --> 00:32:12.480
It's before you started the recording, you were talking telling me how you pretend to be shy and you pretend to be awkward.
00:32:13.359 --> 00:32:15.759
It's all a front, it's all a front, everybody.
00:32:16.000 --> 00:32:20.160
Yeah, no, I no, I I understand, but like the but people really do well.
00:32:20.240 --> 00:32:20.799
I I don't know.
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:23.519
I don't you know how many downloads you get every month.
00:32:23.680 --> 00:32:36.079
I don't know that, but um, I like when you first started it, I was listening to it like in 2017 or whatever, and it was just it was good and it was interesting, and I was like, oh, like a podcast about zines.
00:32:36.319 --> 00:32:38.240
Like, that's really like an interesting idea, you know.
00:32:38.400 --> 00:32:41.039
And it was a lot of people that I didn't really know.
00:32:41.200 --> 00:32:43.200
Um, and so it was kind of cool to hear about new things.
00:32:43.279 --> 00:32:48.640
And then I kind of like forgot about it a little bit, and then the pandemic hit, and I was like, you know, had plenty of time.
00:32:48.799 --> 00:32:55.119
I don't really listen to podcasts, like it's not my it's not really my number one medium to take in information.
00:32:55.359 --> 00:32:59.359
I don't really listen to any podcasts, but yeah, during the pandemic, I started listening to them again.
00:32:59.440 --> 00:33:03.440
And then when you emailed me, I'm like, oh yeah, I haven't listened to Longarm for a while.
00:33:03.519 --> 00:33:06.079
And then I like went back, I'm like, oh, there's all these ones I haven't heard yet.
00:33:06.160 --> 00:33:10.000
And so I kind of like caught up and did my homework, and you know, it was fun.
00:33:10.160 --> 00:33:21.279
Like every single interview you do, there's like two or three just like standout quotes that you should you should do, like like a sticker for like every episode of like the best quote of the episode.
00:33:21.440 --> 00:33:25.680
I was like, I like texted Jordan like this quote, and she's like, Whoa, like who said that?
00:33:25.759 --> 00:33:29.359
I'm like, You said that, and then like Liz Mason, same thing.
00:33:29.440 --> 00:33:31.519
Like, like, did you ever know that blah blah blah?
00:33:31.599 --> 00:33:35.519
And like, who oh oh I said that, like, yeah, you said that, and like I don't know.
00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:40.720
It's really fun to to to listen to all these interviews and the stuff that people say, it's great.
00:33:41.440 --> 00:34:07.759
It's I love doing like interviews have gotten a lot easier over time, and I love doing interviews because I love just like letting people talk about what they're passionate about and like what they're excited about, specifically with zines, but it's been really cool to do the show over the years and just get to talk to so many really cool people who are doing such cool things.
00:34:08.000 --> 00:34:13.599
Like, I don't know, everyone should do a maybe not everyone should do a podcast.
00:34:14.639 --> 00:34:16.480
Some people should not do podcasts.
00:34:16.880 --> 00:34:19.440
Well, I can't I can't even keep up with yours, obviously.
00:34:19.599 --> 00:34:23.280
So, like, if everyone did a podcast, that'd be like way too many podcasts.
00:34:23.440 --> 00:34:32.400
But it is nice to have someone like you to kind of like bring some people together, and and your interviewing style has really gotten better over the years, and your editing has gotten better.
00:34:32.559 --> 00:34:40.320
The the quality of you know, sound quality of the microphones, like all that stuff plays in, and and it's it's a really it's a really solid podcast.
00:34:40.400 --> 00:34:43.199
I mean it, you know, it's fun to listen to and it's interesting.
00:34:43.280 --> 00:34:46.719
And I'm I'm really I don't know, like it's dumb, but I'm like proud of you.
00:34:46.800 --> 00:34:49.599
I'm like, ah, mayor, you're really you're really getting there, man.
00:34:49.679 --> 00:34:51.119
That's good, you know.
00:34:51.599 --> 00:34:55.360
I want to talk to you about some specific zines you sent me.
00:34:55.440 --> 00:34:57.360
No more no more podcast talk.
00:34:57.599 --> 00:34:57.920
Okay.
00:34:58.079 --> 00:35:03.199
Um we can still talk about it if it comes up, but I do have some zines that I want to talk to you about.
00:35:03.440 --> 00:35:09.119
Um the first two are 10 types of coffee and ten types of pasta.
00:35:09.760 --> 00:35:14.239
Um, I thought these were so fun and so informative.
00:35:14.960 --> 00:35:16.000
Yeah, thank you.
00:35:16.239 --> 00:35:19.119
Um they were kind of inspired.
00:35:19.280 --> 00:35:25.920
There used to be an old zine called Simple History that I really liked a lot, and it was educational.
00:35:26.079 --> 00:35:31.840
And I did a zine for a while and then made it into a book called Difference Between, and that's kind of educational.
00:35:32.000 --> 00:35:56.000
And then Dave Hankins uh in Las Vegas, Nevada, he he's like an amazing zine maker, and he does a series called 13 Facts, and he just picks one topic and here's 13 facts about Liberace, here's 13 facts about Dolly Parton, here's 13, and I just really like quick, short snippets of education and and a little bit of information, and so definitely inspired by all those things.
00:35:56.239 --> 00:36:10.079
And I do a lot of long form writing about myself, um, which probably I need to talk to my therapist about that, like a bit of an egomaniac, maybe talking about myself all the time.
00:36:10.239 --> 00:36:17.760
Um, so it's really nice to like shift gears and be like sort of a short form, not about me, like 10 types of coffee.
00:36:17.840 --> 00:36:26.320
Like, I didn't even know there was 10 types of well, yeah, there's there's a latte and there's a mochiato, and there's like you know, and then 10 types of pasta, and it's just kind of like short, quick.
00:36:26.400 --> 00:36:32.000
And I have a list of I've only done the two issues, but I definitely have like 20 more that I want to do.
00:36:32.079 --> 00:36:36.559
And in theory, I you know I can write them in a day, you know what I mean?
00:36:36.639 --> 00:36:39.519
And then it doesn't take too much effort to put them together.
00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:45.119
Um, and a quick shout out to my friend Sully, who does a lot of artwork for me and did artwork for those.
00:36:45.199 --> 00:36:48.480
So um Sully up in the Pacific Northwest is amazing.
00:36:48.559 --> 00:36:51.519
So they are very great illustrations.
00:36:52.320 --> 00:36:55.760
Yeah, the ten types are fun, they're quick, they're short, they're easy.
00:36:56.320 --> 00:36:59.840
Have to ask, what is your favorite of the ten types of coffee?
00:36:59.920 --> 00:37:02.400
And what is your favorite of the ten types of pasta?
00:37:03.039 --> 00:37:05.199
Um, the coffee is easy.
00:37:05.280 --> 00:37:11.280
Um, it's mocha, and I I am not I've always loved the smell of coffee.
00:37:11.360 --> 00:37:13.840
Um, I've never liked the taste of coffee.
00:37:14.000 --> 00:37:19.840
I even worked in a coffee shop for a while and had a chance to like sample all the coffee for free, and it just didn't do it for me.
00:37:19.920 --> 00:37:23.920
And I was drinking a lot of hot chocolates because I love chocolate.
00:37:24.000 --> 00:37:26.320
I'm like a chocolate and I love chocolate.
00:37:26.400 --> 00:37:28.880
And then I was like, you know, we'll put a little espresso in that.
00:37:29.119 --> 00:37:30.320
You know, let me try that again.
00:37:30.400 --> 00:37:30.880
That was pretty good.
00:37:30.960 --> 00:37:32.320
Let me put a little espresso in that.
00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:38.880
And after like four times, you know, in four weeks of going to the coffee shop, they're just like, you know, that's like a mocha.
00:37:39.119 --> 00:37:40.960
It's just hot chocolate and espresso.
00:37:41.119 --> 00:37:42.719
So it's oat milk mocha.
00:37:42.960 --> 00:37:45.679
Um, and that's definitely my favorite coffee.
00:37:45.840 --> 00:37:55.679
Um, pasta, I mean, I think if you're a real pasta connoisseur, you're very much like, this one holds this type of sauce, and this one's better for vegetables.
00:37:55.840 --> 00:37:56.719
I don't know that much.
00:37:56.880 --> 00:37:57.840
I like Fusilli.
00:37:58.239 --> 00:38:00.159
Um, I'm not a huge fan of spaghetti.
00:38:00.239 --> 00:38:02.000
I feel like spaghetti's too messy.
00:38:02.159 --> 00:38:09.599
Um, but fusilli um or you know, any sort of like clamshell type, you know, I kind of like like the corkscrews.
00:38:10.239 --> 00:38:10.880
Yeah.
00:38:11.360 --> 00:38:17.519
I Fusili, also known as Rotini, I think is my uh go-to.
00:38:18.239 --> 00:38:20.000
I like the Rainbow Rotini.
00:38:21.199 --> 00:38:22.159
It's just fun.
00:38:22.480 --> 00:38:24.400
It is very, it is very fun.
00:38:24.719 --> 00:38:26.800
It to me it always tastes the same.
00:38:27.119 --> 00:38:29.440
I don't know if other people can tell the difference in taste.
00:38:29.679 --> 00:38:29.840
No.
00:38:30.079 --> 00:38:41.679
But it is fun that they because uh is it just are they just dyed or are they made out of I think they use different vegetable juice in each one, but they taste like pasta.
00:38:42.000 --> 00:38:43.039
To me, they taste the same.
00:38:43.199 --> 00:38:56.239
I the the number one thing I've learned about pasta over the years is that it's all about the sauce, and you can have like, you know, don't tell any Italians I said this, but I feel like you can have cheap pasta, but if you have good sauce, it'll make up for that.
00:38:56.400 --> 00:38:59.679
Um, I know some people like legit like make their own.
00:38:59.760 --> 00:39:05.840
Like in Italy, there's like a grandma in the kitchen making the pasta itself and then cooking the pasta.
00:39:06.000 --> 00:39:11.519
Um, I've never gone to that extreme, but like a good sauce is that's what makes the difference.
00:39:12.079 --> 00:39:12.559
Yeah.
00:39:12.800 --> 00:39:20.239
Also make like making your own pasta is really impressive, but it's also so much work, and I'm kind of lazy about that kind of thing.
00:39:20.639 --> 00:39:22.719
I can't even I can't even imagine.
00:39:23.119 --> 00:39:32.800
I used a pasta maker, like an electric one one time, maybe like one or two times, and that felt cool, but it was also such a pain in the ass to clean that I was like, I never want to do this ever again.
00:39:32.880 --> 00:39:34.559
I will buy my pasta.
00:39:34.880 --> 00:39:37.840
Yeah, you you have to enjoy the process, I think.
00:39:38.000 --> 00:39:38.719
You know what I mean?
00:39:38.880 --> 00:39:42.320
You have to enjoy, like, oh, we're just gonna spend the entire day in the kitchen.
00:39:42.480 --> 00:39:44.320
Eventually, maybe we'll eat some of it.
00:39:44.480 --> 00:39:50.000
You know, you have to enjoy just being there, I guess, but which I do sometimes, but definitely not every day.
00:39:50.400 --> 00:39:51.440
No, no.
00:39:51.679 --> 00:39:53.119
There's a reason I'm not a professional.
00:39:53.519 --> 00:39:56.800
There are many reasons I'm not a professional chef, and that is one of them.
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:05.679
Um, okay, the next zine I want to talk to you about is Proof I Exist, number 49, the cat issue.
00:40:05.920 --> 00:40:07.679
Yeah, yeah, the cat issue.
00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:12.079
Um I really I love a pur zine.
00:40:12.320 --> 00:40:14.000
Everyone who listens knows that.
00:40:14.159 --> 00:40:16.000
Um, I really like this one.
00:40:16.159 --> 00:40:28.320
It felt very like self-aware, internal monologue, and a lot of self-criticism, but in like an enjoyable way, if that makes sense.
00:40:28.639 --> 00:40:29.599
Uh yeah.
00:40:29.840 --> 00:40:31.519
Yeah, I hope it was enjoyable.
00:40:31.599 --> 00:40:35.840
It was it was definitely um like puking on the paper kind of thing.
00:40:35.920 --> 00:40:44.000
It was definitely like I I think I wrote the whole thing in maybe two sessions, like half of it, you know, one day and half of it the next day.
00:40:44.159 --> 00:40:47.760
Definitely just like stream of consciousness, just put it all out there.
00:40:48.000 --> 00:41:01.840
Um as you can tell from my interview where I'm talking really fast, I also think very fast, and sometimes I write very fast, and sometimes I just you know put it all out there, and I was definitely in kind of like a manic state of just like whatever, everything's crazy, let's just put it out there.
00:41:02.719 --> 00:41:04.880
And like I just put, yeah.
00:41:05.039 --> 00:41:16.400
It's it's like I talk about you know, suicide a little bit, I talk about depression a little bit, but also I talk about those things in a manic state where I'm like, whatever, sometimes I'm really sad and depressed, let's move on with our lives.
00:41:16.559 --> 00:41:19.440
Um, because that's just how I deal with things.
00:41:19.760 --> 00:41:23.519
So um making a zine is a form of therapy for me.
00:41:23.599 --> 00:41:25.280
It always feels good to put it out.
00:41:25.440 --> 00:41:41.920
Um, but yeah, it's definitely a very um meta, like where I'm talking about the zine within the zine, and I'm talking in third person, and um, I'm talking about making different reality shows about zines, and then talking about how what a bad idea that is, actually, and all that kind of stuff.
00:41:42.000 --> 00:41:48.559
And it the whole thing's just supposed to be kind of kind of a fun read-through, just blah, get it out.
00:41:49.679 --> 00:41:57.119
Yeah, I loved the the zine sitcom to soap opera to reality show to oh wait, no, this is a terrible idea pipeline.
00:41:57.599 --> 00:41:58.559
Thanks, me too.
00:41:58.719 --> 00:41:59.519
That was fun, yeah.
00:41:59.679 --> 00:42:09.199
It was it was like just my brain, like I'm because everything I every like I love zine so much, like every time I see something, I'm like, oh, what if that was a zine though?
00:42:09.280 --> 00:42:10.400
Oh, what do you do for work?
00:42:10.480 --> 00:42:11.599
You should write a zine about that.
00:42:11.679 --> 00:42:16.880
And like when I watch re reality shows, I'm like, what if storage works was about how you store zines?
00:42:17.199 --> 00:42:18.000
You know what I mean?
00:42:18.079 --> 00:42:25.199
Like, I'm always like thinking, like, what if the bachelor was all about people trying to pick out like their favorite zine and who's like who wrote that zine?
00:42:25.280 --> 00:42:26.159
Did you write that zine?
00:42:26.239 --> 00:42:30.559
And they're trying to like match up the zine ster to the zine, and like that's just how my brain works.
00:42:30.639 --> 00:42:33.599
But like, actually, like, who would ever even watch that?
00:42:33.679 --> 00:42:34.320
I don't know.
00:42:34.639 --> 00:42:40.880
So I also liked the cats.
00:42:41.119 --> 00:42:51.599
Um, I on record am not a cat person, but I'm coming around on them because we have backyard cats now, so kind of like big boy in oh, nice.
00:42:51.920 --> 00:42:56.320
We have neighborhood cats that mostly live in our backyard.
00:42:56.480 --> 00:42:57.920
We feed them twice a day.
00:42:58.159 --> 00:43:05.119
Um, so they are street cats and they belong to no one, but they also kind of belong to us.
00:43:05.440 --> 00:43:07.440
Yeah, or maybe you belong to them.
00:43:07.679 --> 00:43:13.599
You got you got these cats on the street, and they're like, hey, if you go to this house at seven in the morning, they'll give you food.
00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:18.400
We are having more cats come and it's actually kind of upsetting.
00:43:18.639 --> 00:43:21.599
Um I love that so much.
00:43:23.199 --> 00:43:29.599
I recently, a friend of mine was was recently talking about he just seemed overwhelmed, and he just had he was like in a mood.
00:43:29.760 --> 00:43:30.559
I'm like, what's going on?
00:43:30.639 --> 00:43:32.159
He's like, I got so many problems, man.
00:43:32.239 --> 00:43:34.480
I got like a thousand different problems, I got all these things.
00:43:34.639 --> 00:43:40.880
And I was just like, tell me like tell me about one of your problems that's like not gonna depress me.
00:43:41.039 --> 00:43:41.840
He's like, What do you mean?
00:43:41.920 --> 00:43:44.480
I'm like, tell me about one of your like not so serious problems.
00:43:44.639 --> 00:43:49.039
I know you have serious things, but like let's talk about it, and then he's like, I don't know, I don't know.
00:43:49.199 --> 00:43:49.840
Oh, you know what?
00:43:50.000 --> 00:43:54.719
This guy's been parking in front of my house for like three months, and I always want to park there, and I can't park there.
00:43:54.880 --> 00:43:59.760
And it he like ranted for like 20 minutes about some guy that parks in front of his house, and like that's supposed to be.
00:44:00.159 --> 00:44:01.119
My parking spot.
00:44:01.280 --> 00:44:10.639
And it was really nice and good for I think a good release for him to like vent about something that he's like, yeah, I guess it's like not that big of a deal compared to all the other things.
00:44:10.880 --> 00:44:21.760
So anyway, I bring all this up because it having like so many cats in your backyard is like a real big problem, but it's actually not a problem, but it's like also something you have to deal with now.
00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:23.280
Yeah.
00:44:24.400 --> 00:44:24.880
Yeah.
00:44:25.199 --> 00:44:30.880
I will say I am thankful for my Costco membership so that I can feed all these cats.
00:44:31.119 --> 00:44:36.320
Um but I do not want any more of them having babies in my backyard.
00:44:36.559 --> 00:44:43.119
Well that I will go on record because that's what happened was some cats had a cat had babies in our backyard.
00:44:43.280 --> 00:44:43.599
Yeah.
00:44:43.760 --> 00:44:46.880
And now those cats are like, I don't know, it's a whole thing.
00:44:47.119 --> 00:44:53.679
Yeah it's I mean, Bob Barker, Bob Barker said, have your pets spayed and neutered, you know.
00:44:53.760 --> 00:44:55.199
That's that's the only way.
00:44:55.360 --> 00:44:57.679
But that's a hard thing to do when they're not actually your cats.
00:44:57.760 --> 00:45:00.960
Like you're just gonna catch all these wild cats and take them and pay for them.
00:45:01.039 --> 00:45:03.760
And we did, yeah, that's a lot, man.
00:45:03.840 --> 00:45:05.280
That gets expensive real quick.
00:45:05.519 --> 00:45:06.800
Yes, it does.
00:45:07.039 --> 00:45:10.639
Um, but worth it, worth it.
00:45:10.800 --> 00:45:12.239
Good to not have more.
00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:22.880
Um there was a line in this one that I really liked um and that I really related to, and it was if I can't be happy, then I at least want to stay busy.
00:45:23.280 --> 00:45:40.239
Um, and that's that's kind of been my MO for a really long time, especially when I was like really depressed while I was you know, if I can't be happy, then I have to stay insanely busy and I have to do a thousand things all the time.
00:45:41.360 --> 00:45:43.679
And now that I'm not depressed, I'm still doing that.
00:45:43.840 --> 00:45:45.280
I just can't unlearn that.
00:45:45.440 --> 00:45:58.320
But yeah, it's it's hard to I don't know, man, because like I I love being productive, I love making things, I love the sense of accomplishment when I finish a project.
00:45:58.480 --> 00:46:04.320
Um, but definitely I use projects as like a way to like escape my own emotions.
00:46:04.480 --> 00:46:11.920
Like I totally do that all the time, and it's a a coping mechanism, but it's also a healthy coping mechanism.
00:46:12.239 --> 00:46:17.679
So I don't know, like theoretically, I'd like to be happy and busy.
00:46:17.920 --> 00:46:30.320
Um because yeah, I I feel happy when I'm busy, even when I feel overwhelmed by my own projects, um, because I have always have more stories to write and always have more zines to put out and stuff like that.
00:46:30.480 --> 00:46:33.039
But um, yeah, I don't know.
00:46:33.119 --> 00:46:37.920
I I try, I always think like when I get done with this project, I'll be happy, but that's never true.
00:46:38.079 --> 00:46:41.599
Like I have way more emotional problems I need to work through.
00:46:41.760 --> 00:46:50.559
But in the meantime, staying busy and producing things like does make me feel good and it does, you know, boost my confidence and all that sort of stuff.
00:46:50.800 --> 00:46:53.760
So yeah, we're all working through stuff.
00:46:54.159 --> 00:46:55.599
Absolutely.
00:46:56.320 --> 00:47:02.400
Uh, the last zine I wanted to talk to you about is Behind the Zines number 21.
00:47:02.639 --> 00:47:05.679
Um, behind the zines is a zine about zines.
00:47:07.199 --> 00:47:08.639
And this one was cool.
00:47:08.800 --> 00:47:19.679
I really like the foil cover, which um was designed by Bridget, who was on the show maybe like a season and a half ago, um, talking about her foil covers.
00:47:19.760 --> 00:47:24.800
So that was cool to like kind of come full circle for me personally.
00:47:25.119 --> 00:47:33.440
Yeah, we are we are the zine world is getting to the point of like what is what's the uh the five steps of Kevin Bacon or whatever?
00:47:33.599 --> 00:47:35.199
Yeah, five stages, something like that.
00:47:35.280 --> 00:47:39.119
Like it is like like five steps from Long Arm Podcast at this point.
00:47:39.440 --> 00:47:45.679
Um, yeah, I've never met Bridget in real life, but uh I love the zine commonplace and I love the foil covers.
00:47:45.760 --> 00:47:50.079
And when she designed the cover, I was like, hey, like what about this?
00:47:50.239 --> 00:47:57.199
And we talked about it for a while, and she was giving me advice on how to do it, and it was funny because I totally thought she was talking about how she was gonna do it.
00:47:57.360 --> 00:48:00.639
And at some point we were like, wait, hold on, are you gonna foil my covers?
00:48:00.719 --> 00:48:03.039
She's like, No, no, you're gonna foil the covers.
00:48:03.199 --> 00:48:13.679
I'm telling you how to foil the covers, which is like great, because then I learned how to foil covers and she put a little tutorial on on my YouTube channel, and uh yeah, Bridget's awesome.
00:48:13.760 --> 00:48:20.800
Um, and foiling covers is not as hard as you think, it's a little bit time consuming, but it's it's uh within you within our means.
00:48:20.960 --> 00:48:26.480
Um, but yeah, for behind the scenes, it comes out twice a year, and it's a pretty big print run.
00:48:26.639 --> 00:48:33.280
I usually do about 400 or 500 of each issue, and so for the first like 100 or 200, I like to do something special.
00:48:33.599 --> 00:48:41.199
So this next issue that's coming out in September, um, the first 200 uh copies will have a color cover.
00:48:41.440 --> 00:48:45.360
And I've done that before for another issue, I think for issue 13.
00:48:45.519 --> 00:48:59.840
Um, and then you know, one time, you know, we had uh I think issue 16, Alex Rec did the cover, and I made a sticker of the cover, and every issue came like or the first 200 copies came with like you know, a sticker of the cover, you know.
00:49:00.079 --> 00:49:03.119
So for that one, yeah, we did 200 foil covers.
00:49:03.199 --> 00:49:04.880
So yeah, it's fun.
00:49:05.519 --> 00:49:07.840
How long have you been doing this series?
00:49:09.039 --> 00:49:24.000
So I I there was a a zine that I would contribute to, and I had a column in it called Behind the Zines, and I that was probably in like 2014 or 2015, like 10 years ago for sure, at least 10 years ago.
00:49:24.079 --> 00:49:42.559
And so I did um six different times that I uh did a column for that zine, and so it was you know, behind the zines number three, behind the zines number four, but I I was just numbering my columns, and it was usually just like two pages, and it was short, and it was me doing zine reviews or me doing interviews.
00:49:42.719 --> 00:49:49.280
Um, I interviewed John Maher from Murder Can Be Fun, and I interviewed Al Burian from Burn Collector.
00:49:49.440 --> 00:50:02.800
So I would just do like one interview with one zine star or something, and after like five or six, I'm like, man, like I want to do zine reviews and interviews and articles, and I realized I wanted way more than just an article in someone else's zine.
00:50:02.880 --> 00:50:09.039
So issue seven is actually the first issue because issue seven was the first like full issue.
00:50:09.199 --> 00:50:12.719
Um, and that came out in maybe like 2018.
00:50:13.199 --> 00:50:19.039
So yeah, I've been doing it for a little for a little while now, about eight years as like a full zine.
00:50:20.000 --> 00:50:21.840
Yeah, it was cool.
00:50:22.159 --> 00:50:35.679
There's uh xine throughpology, there's an interview with um Enola Dismay, there's stuff about like razorcake covers and the mistakes that were made on them.
00:50:35.920 --> 00:50:41.599
It's very cool, like just kind of look behind the zines, I guess.
00:50:41.840 --> 00:50:44.400
Yeah, it's exactly what it sounds like.
00:50:44.719 --> 00:50:54.559
Yeah, it's it's there's a lot of zines out there that are like tutorials on how to make a zine, or there's articles on websites about like, well, what is a zine?
00:50:54.719 --> 00:51:08.079
And all of that is awesome and really important, but like for people like you and me, or probably most of the people listening to this podcast, like we know what a zine is, we know how to make a zine, I know how to do like a quarter page layout or whatever.
00:51:08.239 --> 00:51:11.599
And so behind the zines, it's for people that already know what a zine is.
00:51:11.679 --> 00:51:13.360
So, like, let's talk about it, you know.
00:51:13.519 --> 00:51:20.159
Like, like when I watch like sports or something, like I'm a very elementary, like, oh, like that's cool, he's doing the thing.
00:51:20.239 --> 00:51:25.119
And and you know, I like sports, but I'm not like a baseball player or a manager.
00:51:25.280 --> 00:51:29.920
But like, we if you get like 10 managers from sports teams together, like what do they talk about?
00:51:30.000 --> 00:51:36.159
And like that's kind of what what behind the zines is supposed to be of like people that have been making zines for a long time, like, what are we talking about?
00:51:36.320 --> 00:51:40.559
Like, what's your secret tip on how to do the perfect copy or whatever, you know?
00:51:40.800 --> 00:51:48.639
So just a chance to to talk trade, you know, talk about our our our lives and our passions and you know why we do what we do.
00:51:48.960 --> 00:51:55.840
Yeah, that's really cool, like as a concept, and I really liked this scene.
00:51:56.079 --> 00:51:57.039
Well, thank you.
00:51:57.280 --> 00:52:00.800
Feel free to contribute to it anytime it comes out twice a year.
00:52:00.960 --> 00:52:02.320
I'm always I'm always looking.
00:52:02.480 --> 00:52:04.480
Sometimes people are like, hey, you should have more of this.
00:52:04.559 --> 00:52:07.039
I'm like, yeah, if you want to write that, send it to me.
00:52:07.199 --> 00:52:14.639
Like, you know, I don't I don't discriminate if anyone wants in, like, you know, I only have so many pages, but I'm always looking for new people.
00:52:14.800 --> 00:52:19.519
So if anyone out there wants to contribute, yourself included, like comes out twice a year.
00:52:20.079 --> 00:52:24.480
Be the behind the zenes article you wish to see in the world.
00:52:24.800 --> 00:52:26.800
That's exactly correct.
00:52:28.800 --> 00:52:32.239
Do you ever have people telling you uh suggestions on on your podcast?
00:52:32.400 --> 00:52:34.239
Sorry, we said we weren't gonna talk about podcasts.
00:52:34.480 --> 00:52:36.079
Ben Ben can edit all of this out.
00:52:36.239 --> 00:52:40.400
I just a side note, like I am not offended if my stuff gets edited out.
00:52:40.480 --> 00:52:42.960
Like, do what you gotta do to make a good podcast.
00:52:43.119 --> 00:52:49.679
But I'm curious, uh, do people ever tell you, like, you know, how you should do your podcast or make it better?
00:52:49.840 --> 00:52:55.199
Because I would imagine you get suggestions or you should interview this person or that person, and sometimes it's probably really helpful.
00:52:55.280 --> 00:52:59.920
And sometimes I would imagine you roll your eyes, like, yeah, okay, that yeah, I don't know.
00:53:00.239 --> 00:53:06.960
I do sometimes get suggestions for people to reach out to, and I reach out to them, and either it works out or it doesn't.
00:53:07.199 --> 00:53:16.559
Um, but most people are like, I feel like the only people who reach out to me about the podcast are really nice about it, which is like great.
00:53:16.719 --> 00:53:19.920
It's a great experience for me as the person doing it.
00:53:20.079 --> 00:53:21.760
Like, everyone's so nice.
00:53:21.920 --> 00:53:24.400
Oh, that's awesome! Good, glad to hear that.
00:53:24.719 --> 00:53:35.280
Yeah, I actually wanted to that's a perfect time for me to derail and say that I got a really sweet letter from a listener and I wanted to give them a shout out.
00:53:35.360 --> 00:53:41.039
Um, so thank you, Scythera, for writing me a really nice letter about the podcast.
00:53:42.000 --> 00:53:53.679
Um I after listening to a few of your episodes over the last couple weeks, I was thinking about uh like taking notes and asking you some follow-up questions.
00:53:54.079 --> 00:53:59.280
Like, for example, you said you were gonna try to do more letter writing in some episode.
00:53:59.519 --> 00:54:02.079
Um, I'm curious if you're doing more letter writing.
00:54:02.400 --> 00:54:02.960
I am.
00:54:03.760 --> 00:54:14.239
Um I am so my as of the time of this recording, I have hit, I'm pulling out my notebook so I can fact check myself.
00:54:14.880 --> 00:54:21.519
I've sent out 130 pieces of mail, and most of those have been letters or zines.
00:54:22.400 --> 00:54:23.679
So I'm on track.
00:54:23.760 --> 00:54:26.159
My goal is 250 for the year.
00:54:26.480 --> 00:54:29.760
Um, you'll get yeah, you'll get that.
00:54:30.159 --> 00:54:38.800
I also wanted to uh I was gonna try before we did this interview, I was gonna try to write a zine about edible hub hubcaps.
00:54:39.119 --> 00:54:51.280
Um and I don't even know if you remember why I would have written a zine about edible hubcaps, but uh I did not write that zine because I have enough problems putting out real zines that I don't have time to put out fake ones.
00:54:51.440 --> 00:55:03.119
But um yeah, you I think it was you and Liz that were talking about what you can't just look up a zine about edible hubcaps and it already exists, like and you're talking about that sounds familiar now, yeah.
00:55:03.920 --> 00:55:06.480
And I was like, Oh, I should write a zine about edible hubcaps.
00:55:06.559 --> 00:55:08.639
What a great idea! But yeah, I did not have time for that.
00:55:08.719 --> 00:55:11.599
But there's still time before this comes out.
00:55:12.400 --> 00:55:12.960
True.
00:55:13.199 --> 00:55:14.239
Oh my god.
00:55:14.639 --> 00:55:16.239
You got you got time.
00:55:16.480 --> 00:55:17.920
Oh, a zine challenge.
00:55:18.000 --> 00:55:19.280
How do I turn it down?
00:55:20.880 --> 00:55:28.400
Uh are you currently working on anything aside from a zine about edible hubcaps?
00:55:29.119 --> 00:55:36.159
Um, I just finished Proof I Exist 50, which is all about uh living in Chicago and about art cars that I used to have.
00:55:36.320 --> 00:55:39.039
So um that's the one I finished last week.
00:55:39.199 --> 00:55:41.599
Um Behind the Zenes 22.
00:55:41.920 --> 00:55:44.559
Uh we're you and I are recording this in July.
00:55:44.719 --> 00:55:47.760
Behind the Zenes 22 comes out on September 1st.
00:55:48.000 --> 00:55:54.559
And um I have I think I have all of the articles now, so it's just editing and doing layout.
00:55:54.719 --> 00:56:00.320
Um, so that's that's what my month of July and into halfway through August will be.
00:56:00.400 --> 00:56:03.760
Um, those are the those are the main projects that I'm working on.
00:56:04.559 --> 00:56:07.519
Is there any other zine stuff that you want to talk about?
00:56:08.960 --> 00:56:11.440
Um nothing that pops to mind.
00:56:11.679 --> 00:56:12.000
No.
00:56:12.480 --> 00:56:12.800
Okay.
00:56:13.280 --> 00:56:16.320
But I I love I love all the people that you've interviewed.
00:56:16.480 --> 00:56:20.639
It's been so fun to listen to them, and I'm excited for all your upcoming interviews.
00:56:20.800 --> 00:56:23.920
And I think you're such a vital part to our zine community.
00:56:24.000 --> 00:56:25.920
It's really nice to be a part of this.
00:56:26.239 --> 00:56:27.280
Thank you, Billy.
00:56:27.440 --> 00:56:28.559
That means a lot.
00:56:28.800 --> 00:56:45.679
Um, I've been trying to like I've been I one of my goals this year specifically was to re to be more proactive about reaching out to like people that I've wanted to talk to on the show for like a long time.
00:56:46.159 --> 00:56:52.239
And that was really when I like finally asked Liz to be on the show.
00:56:52.320 --> 00:56:53.679
I was like, okay, I can do this.
00:56:53.840 --> 00:56:56.719
I can like I can just ask people and they might say yes.
00:56:56.880 --> 00:57:11.360
And so my goal this year is to really been like reaching out to people who I've wanted to talk to for a long time and just one thing or another, mostly me being shy, uh have stopped.
00:57:11.440 --> 00:57:15.840
So I'm really glad that I was uh finally able to ask and have you on the show.
00:57:16.159 --> 00:57:16.719
Well, thank you.
00:57:16.960 --> 00:57:18.400
It's an it's an honor to be here.
00:57:18.480 --> 00:57:33.039
And yeah, I I've listened to it and um, you know, I it's the same exact thing that Liz said of like, oh, like I could reach out and fill out that form, but like would anyone really want to talk to me, you know, and like I felt the same way, and so it's nice to be asked.
00:57:33.199 --> 00:58:04.079
Um, but yeah, it was it was you mentioned Liz's name a couple in a couple of interviews before you interviewed her, and then you talked to her about being interviewed, and it's funny because she is kind of like quote unquote zine famous, you know, like because she ran Quimby's and all that, and her zines have been around for a long time, and you know, she's she's pretty widely read, like a lot of people have have read her stuff, but also like literally the nicest person and the most down to earth, and like just super cool and a super dork all at the same time, which is like the perfect combo.
00:58:04.320 --> 00:58:09.360
So it was really fun to listen to that interview with her and you know, all the other ones too.
00:58:09.599 --> 00:58:12.960
Yeah, so happy to be happy to be another name on your list.
00:58:13.599 --> 00:58:14.800
Hell yeah.
00:58:15.679 --> 00:58:19.519
Um, where can people find your work online?
00:58:20.719 --> 00:58:22.000
It's pretty easy.
00:58:22.079 --> 00:58:31.840
Like my name is Billy, and my email is I knowbily at gmail, but then most of my stuff I'm selling on the website ilovezines.com.
00:58:32.079 --> 00:58:34.559
So uh pretty easy to find.
00:58:34.800 --> 00:58:36.880
Yeah, you've made it so easy.
00:58:37.199 --> 00:58:38.639
Trying, trying to.
00:58:39.760 --> 00:58:42.960
And i LoveZines is on Instagram as well, right?
00:58:43.519 --> 00:58:45.679
So that's a really funny story.
00:58:45.760 --> 00:58:48.800
Um, yes, I Love Zines is on Instagram.
00:58:48.960 --> 00:58:57.760
Um, and some of my friends signed up, like whatever followed it, and then were confused because I don't have a smartphone and I don't do social media.
00:58:57.920 --> 00:59:03.199
So I'm not on Facebook, I'm I'm not on Instagram, I'm not on Twitter or any of those others.
00:59:03.360 --> 00:59:13.039
Um, but Dave Hankins, um, who does so many good zines out of Las Vegas, uh, he was like, hey, like what can I do to help you with like your your new thing, with your new website?
00:59:13.199 --> 00:59:14.719
And I was like, I don't know, man.
00:59:14.800 --> 00:59:15.840
Like, can you do this or this?
00:59:15.920 --> 00:59:18.400
He's like, No, I can't really do those things because I'm in Vegas.
00:59:18.559 --> 00:59:21.119
And then he was like, What if I ran your Instagram page?
00:59:21.199 --> 00:59:22.800
I'm like, Oh, that'd be great.
00:59:22.960 --> 00:59:28.960
And so he's he's the one that actually started the I Love Zines Instagram page uh or account, excuse me.
00:59:29.039 --> 00:59:29.840
It's not a page, right?
00:59:29.920 --> 00:59:30.559
It's an account.
00:59:30.639 --> 00:59:32.079
I don't even know how these things work.
00:59:32.239 --> 00:59:34.159
But he started the Instagram account.
00:59:34.239 --> 00:59:39.920
And what's funny about that is later on I I realized that he doesn't have a smartphone either.
00:59:40.159 --> 00:59:49.199
And like I love photos and photography, and like the main reason I never signed up to Instagram is that I thought you had to have a smartphone because I didn't know you could do it any other way.
00:59:49.440 --> 01:00:21.039
So, like the the way it works, like if I let's say I upload a new zine to I Love Zines, like I'll email him and then like the next day he'll go to the library and check his email because I don't even think he has a computer at home, and he'll and then he'll like at the library computer like upload it to Instagram, and like something that takes an like an average person in our world, something that would take them like five to ten seconds will take us like a day or two to get like a new post on Instagram to be like, hey, here's a new zine you might want to check out.
01:00:21.199 --> 01:00:22.880
So it's ridiculous.
01:00:23.039 --> 01:00:25.840
Um, so there is an I Love Zines Instagram.
01:00:25.920 --> 01:00:27.760
I do not run it, I've never even seen it.
01:00:27.840 --> 01:00:28.800
I don't know what's on it.
01:00:28.960 --> 01:00:31.119
Hopefully, Dave is doing a good job.
01:00:31.280 --> 01:00:32.400
Um, yeah.
01:00:33.840 --> 01:00:36.000
I love that concept.
01:00:37.199 --> 01:00:46.320
If anyone out there is not pen pals with Dave, like you should look into that because his zines are really good and he's an excellent pen pal and he draws dinosaurs on the envelopes.
01:00:46.480 --> 01:00:47.679
So there you go.
01:00:47.920 --> 01:00:50.960
I have gotten some mail from Dave, and it was very enjoyable.
01:00:51.280 --> 01:00:51.920
Good.
01:00:53.519 --> 01:00:54.480
Um cool.
01:00:54.559 --> 01:01:01.519
I'll post links to the website and the Instagram in the show notes, and I'll even put your email there if you want me to.
01:01:01.760 --> 01:01:06.159
Um but yeah, this has been a delight.
01:01:06.639 --> 01:01:08.960
Um, thank you so much for being on the show.
01:01:09.280 --> 01:01:11.039
Yeah, thank you so much for having me.
01:01:11.119 --> 01:01:19.280
I I loved it, I had a great time, and someday you and I will actually hang out, hang out in real life, and I don't know, watch a movie or something.
01:01:19.599 --> 01:01:20.880
Someday, yeah.
01:01:21.119 --> 01:01:32.719
I I haven't, I'm not like I'm not tabling or traveling that much this year, which is kind of a letdown personally, but next year, 2027 is gonna be my year.
01:01:32.880 --> 01:01:34.239
I'm getting back out there.
01:01:34.559 --> 01:01:35.280
Good, good.
01:01:35.599 --> 01:01:36.960
I like to hear that.
01:01:37.360 --> 01:01:38.400
Thank you, Mayra.
01:01:38.800 --> 01:01:45.679
Yeah, thank you, Billy, and thank you everyone for listening um to season nine of Long Arm Stapler.
01:01:45.920 --> 01:01:48.639
Thank you, monthly Kofi podcast supporters.
01:01:48.800 --> 01:02:02.559
Um, if you support the podcast on Kofi, which is only a dollar a month um or more, if you're feeling like you want to do that, um, it helps subsidize the cost of hosting and production.
01:02:02.800 --> 01:02:11.119
And one of the cool perks is that you get to ask specific questions to guests, um, like we had earlier this episode.
01:02:11.440 --> 01:02:22.159
So if you have been enjoying the podcast or have found a new to you Zine Maker that you like uh from the podcast, please consider throwing me a dollar a month on Kofi.
01:02:22.639 --> 01:02:24.960
Um, it's linked in the show notes.
01:02:25.280 --> 01:02:27.440
And that's all I have.
01:02:27.599 --> 01:02:28.639
Thank you for listening.
01:02:28.800 --> 01:02:32.480
Thank you, Billy, and stay tuned.
01:02:33.199 --> 01:02:33.840
Bye.